irclog2html for #elinux on 20050610

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00:23.20*** topic/#elinux is Embedded Linux || http://eLinux.org/ || cross compile, uClibc, busybox, tinylogin, handhelds, post-sale linux installs ;-), etc. || free embedded linux training at http://free-electrons.com/news/news.2004-09-28/en || see prpplague about custom holly-gates jtag dongles
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01:08.57jamieI have a question about GCC and ARM-pt110... anyone available to help?
01:09.54[g2]jamie, usually ppl just ask their questions
01:10.12jamiejust checking if anyone's around...
01:10.24jamieMy "hello world!" program compiles and runs.
01:10.33jamieBut anything more complex crashes with Illegal Instruction.
01:10.44jamieThat includes programs linked with some more code, even though it's not called.
01:10.48jamieA familiar problem?
01:11.01jamie(I don't have any debugging tools on this system)
01:11.24[g2]well that's not a specific question
01:11.24jamie(And I'm guessing the gcc configuration etc.)
01:11.33[g2]like which gcc ?
01:11.38[g2]which binutils ?
01:11.44jamieI guess it's not that common then.  So more specifically:
01:11.56[g2]which toolchain or how was it build ?
01:12.13[g2]are you running gcc 4 ?
01:12.18jamiebinutils-2.16, gcc-3.4.4, straight plain gnu sources
01:12.19[g2]2.95 ?
01:12.40jamiearm-unknown-linux configuration in both cases, compiling with -march=armv4t
01:12.43[g2]we use gcc-3.4.4 with OpenSlug
01:13.09[g2]how are you building the toolchain or which one are you using ?
01:13.20jamieAnd dietlibc-0.28
01:13.36jamieI'm literally ./configure; make (with a few options to configure)
01:13.57jamieNot using a "packaged" toolchain
01:14.00cbrake_awayjamie: what is a ARM-pt110?
01:14.14[g2]have you tried glibc or uClibc at all ?
01:14.47jamieGoogle for "pt110 ARM", it's a clone by PicoTurbo.  And it happens to be in the Sigma Designs chip.
01:14.53jamieNo, I haven't tried either of those libcs.
01:15.22[g2]have you ever run crosstool ?
01:15.40jamieI watched ptxdist explode once while it failed to run crosstool, does that count ;-)
01:15.47jamieno
01:15.57[g2]crosstool is quite nice
01:16.17jamieIn the past I just built binutils, gcc and a libc...  that's so straightforward I've not seen the point in another tool to call those
01:16.44cbrake_awayjamie: hmm, about all I get is stuff about lawsuits -- is PicoTurbo still in business?
01:16.49[g2]well crosstool builds that stuff, it's the important patches that matter
01:17.38[g2]jamie, do you run open-embedded at all ?
01:17.41jamiecbrake_away: I don't know, but Sigma Designs certainly are in business, and their kernel reports "ARM pt110" while booting.
01:18.31jamieHaving put a bit of time into ptxdist (which never really worked for me), and a lot into gentoo-embedded (which worked, after a lot of time), I'm weary of trying yet another distro.  When in the past, just building binutils+gcc+libc has always worked in the most simple way
01:19.18jamieI guess a key question is: should I be avoiding any particular GCC versions?
01:19.25jamie(For ARM development)
01:19.48[g2]we use gcc 3.4.3 and 3.4.4 recently but that's armv5t
01:19.55[g2]big endian
01:20.13[g2]so I dunno that state of the v4 stuff
01:20.42[g2]I've also built some 920T stuff
01:21.49jamieIs there an easy way to ask if the CPU is big or little endian from the command prompt?
01:21.55[g2]so 3.4.4 and armv4t ?
01:22.11[g2]I think mostly everything is LE
01:22.25[g2]BE is the exception from my understanding
01:22.37jamieI'm assuming it's armv4t because of a note discovered by Goggle.  I don't have any actual docs
01:22.39[g2]but the Intel IXP4xx with the NPEs usually run BE
01:23.04[g2]what do cat /proc/cpuinfo say or dmesg ?
01:23.17jamieProcessor       : ARM pt110 rev 0 (v4l)
01:23.17jamieBogoMIPS        : 82.94
01:23.17jamieHardware        : EM86XX
01:23.17jamieRevision        : 0000
01:23.17jamieSerial          : 0000000000000000
01:26.31[g2]how is floating point setup ?
01:27.04jamieWell, I have no idea.  But my program is _really_ small, it shouldn't be touching floating point anything.
01:27.35jamieWhat's puzzling is that linking in an extra .o file, which isn't called, causes the program to crash.
01:27.47jamie(There's no init sections or anything in that .o file)
01:28.10[g2]well the extra .o probably causes extra libc stuff to be pulled in
01:28.20jamieIt could conceivably by that me elf2flt is broken.  It didn't compile out of the box; I had to update it for current binutils
01:28.29[g2]and it sounds like that dies during initialization
01:28.35jamieYes, you're undoubtedly right.
01:28.51jamieIt's impossible to tell when it dies, without some basic debugging
01:29.08[g2]actually it's probably pretty simple
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01:29.43[g2]you can use objdump to see the external symbols for that extra .o that's linked in
01:29.57jamieyeah, but that doesn't tell me when or why it's dying.
01:30.13[g2]I'd stub out half of those symbols
01:30.49[g2]then you determine which symbol(s) cause it to die
01:31.09jamieWell, right now I have a 6 line program that crashes with no extra .o so I think the problem is more basic than that.
01:31.26jamieI'm calling open() and printf().  But printf() by itself works!
01:31.55[g2]ok so open dies
01:32.09jamieNo, open is fine without the printf :)
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01:33.17[g2]if open works alone and printf works alone but they don't work together then it sounds like somethings funny
01:33.30jamieyeah, verily
01:34.00[g2]so... once again... I'd use different more widely used tool chain like glibc or uClibc
01:34.11jamieit could well be that.
01:34.28[g2]secondly, I might look at the assembler output
01:34.48[g2]although... 1.5 I'd probably try to run strace on the program
01:34.59[g2]and see which function is dieing
01:35.20[g2]also... running under the debugger isn't a bad idea
01:36.40jamieNow if only I had a working strace or debugger...
01:37.16[g2]well clearly you are tool chain challenged atm
01:37.21jamieyup
01:37.42[g2]http://kegel.com/crosstool/crosstool-0.35/buildlogs/
01:37.42jamieI'm waiting for the hardware supplier to provide tools... but I don't want to wait until their official delivery date
01:38.01jamieYeah, I'm reading the crosstool howto.  It says uclibc isn't natively supported yet
01:38.35[g2]if you want uClibc then buildroot2 is your friend
01:40.43[g2]are you fixed on 3.4.4 or will 3.4.3 work ?
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01:47.21*** topic/#elinux is Embedded Linux || http://eLinux.org/ || cross compile, uClibc, busybox, tinylogin, handhelds, post-sale linux installs ;-), etc. || free embedded linux training at http://free-electrons.com/news/news.2004-09-28/en || see prpplague about custom holly-gates jtag dongles
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02:41.58[g2]jamie, Ok... my build just finished for the armv5b croostool
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11:44.58*** topic/#elinux is Embedded Linux || http://eLinux.org/ || cross compile, uClibc, busybox, tinylogin, handhelds, post-sale linux installs ;-), etc. || free embedded linux training at http://free-electrons.com/news/news.2004-09-28/en || see prpplague about custom holly-gates jtag dongles
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13:21.26prpplagueho ho ho
13:21.28prpplaguemerry freakin friday
13:21.32prpplaguekergoth: ping
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13:39.29jamieIs it my imagination or is www.uclinux.org down today?
13:40.11prpplaguejamie: morning
13:40.18prpplaguejamie: not getting it here either
13:40.19jamiehello!
13:40.33jamie'twas down 12 hours ago too
13:41.30prpplaguejamie: bummer
13:41.34jamieI'm having weird crashingness on my sigma designs device that I thought I'd try some pre-built tools and libc.
13:43.08prpplague~lart jamie for using sigma devices and their attitude towards the GPL
13:43.55prpplaguejamie: http://testing.lkml.org/slashdot.php?mid=331690
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13:45.26jamieibot: I'm with you on that.  I *hate* the lack of info I'm getting from sigma, not to mention that I'm firmly on the free software side philosophically.
13:46.17prpplaguejamie: hehe, CosmicPenguin did some work with one of their ref boards when he was working at censoft
13:46.19jamieIt's even worse because I'm not dealing with sigma, I'm dealing with a taiwanese intermediary who are writing an SDK around sigma's SDK for me.
13:46.34jamieAnd *they* say they're having trouble due to lack of information!
13:46.34prpplaguejamie: ug
13:46.46jamie(sigma didn't return our calls, see....)
13:47.25jamieThe sad thing is, it's easily the best chip we've found for a video player that'll do what we want.
13:47.53jamieWe haven't found realistic alternatives, in fact.
13:48.22jamieSo I'm very happy with the electronics as such.  But the sw support does indeed suck.
13:49.12prpplaguejamie: yea, i heard good things about the hardware
13:49.19prpplaguejamie: almost ordered a board myself
13:49.33prpplaguejamie: wanted to do a nice little custom vid player
13:49.55jamieIn HDTV tests it exceeds their stated specifications.  Looks nice :)
13:50.05prpplaguejamie: cool
13:50.25prpplaguejamie: might want to ping CosmicPenguin, he might be able to help you since he worked directly with sigma
13:50.54jamieCosmicPenguin: are you there?   ping CosmicPenguin...
13:51.22prpplaguejamie: he's in CO, USA, so i don't suspect he will be in for another hour or so
13:51.47jamieExcellent, one of the few USA places I spent a while in.
13:59.05kergothprpplague: pong
13:59.22prpplaguekergoth: are you alive?
13:59.30prpplaguekergoth: haven't heard from you in awhile
13:59.50prpplaguekergoth: was wondering if you shaved your head and join the hara krishnas
14:07.24kergothprpplague: hehe. finally got the furniture from the movers.  getting unpacked.  settled in at the townhouse.  now need to find some cash flow
14:08.49prpplaguekergoth: ahh
14:09.10prpplaguekergoth: you can always infect some local companies with viri and then charge to clean it up
14:11.55kergothprpplague: who needs to infect them? just wait for their windows networks to get infected on their own :P
14:12.17prpplaguekergoth: hehe
14:12.30prpplaguekergoth: how things overall, everything ok?
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14:12.56prpplaguekergoth: seems like leaving TI would be a little rough
14:35.16CosmicPenguinyo?
14:37.42jamiehello CosmicPenguin
14:37.44jamiegood morning
14:38.46jamieprpplague tells me you may be able to help.  I'm working with a Sigma Designs EM8621L, and I'm watching my programs sometimes work, sometimes crash oddly.
14:39.05jamieIT doesn't help that I have no SD SDK, no documentation, etc.  so all based on guesswork.
14:39.14jamieWhich is where I'm wondering if you might be able to help :)
14:41.36CosmicPenguinI can definately tell you that working with Sigma code sucks rocks
14:42.32jamieDoes it use standard uclinux tools (gcc, binutils, elf2flt, which libc?) or do they patch them?
14:43.14jamieBecause I'm using standard gcc, binutils, elf2flt and dietlibc, and very simple programs run on it, but more complex ones crash.
14:43.50CosmicPenguinI'm not sure - I never used the newer DSP cores
14:43.58CosmicPenguinthe last one I used was a 74 something something
14:44.07CosmicPenguinIts been a couple of years
14:44.23jamieAh, that is quite a long time ago.  Was it an ARM back than?
14:45.30CosmicPenguinOh, no
14:45.33CosmicPenguinjust a little ol' asic
14:45.45jamieok, looks like I'm on my own then.
14:46.19CosmicPenguinsoryr
14:52.06CosmicPenguinDon't you hate it when you go out of your way and create something really nice, and people don't care
14:52.21CosmicPenguinbut you get all sorts of praise when you just do your job?
14:53.57jamieI hate it when what I create doesn't make me any money, too.  The trick is to create something other people want in both cases :)
14:54.36prpplagueCosmicPenguin: yea,  i had that problem at abcs
14:54.42jamie(Actually i don't really hate that... else I wouldn't spend 90% of my time doing it!)
14:55.21CosmicPenguinLast year, I basically dragged this company into the 21st century and introduced them to the concept of build systems
14:55.34CosmicPenguinSo now, all of our products are built internally on the opterons - thats a huge deal for these guys
14:55.42jamieI found it's worse when you create something that people do care about, you get praise for it, then you get made redundant anyway...
14:55.48CosmicPenguinSo, I get my performance review, and it says "did build system - meets expectations"
14:55.59CosmicPenguinYet, I got a exceeds expetations on "driver development"
14:56.09jamieThe word is "expectation management" :)
14:56.33CosmicPenguinI say, you should *never* get more then meets exceptations on anything having to do with your announced job requirements
14:57.15CosmicPenguinOf course I wrote a driver- thats my fsckin' job!
14:57.22CosmicPenguinbah
14:57.32CosmicPenguinspeaking of which - MMC awaits
14:57.57jamieI guess you were better at writing drivers than they expected :)
14:58.11prpplagueCosmicPenguin: mmc?
14:58.13CosmicPenguinMaybe its just me, but thats insulting
14:58.17prpplagueCosmicPenguin: what are doing with mmc?
14:58.25CosmicPenguinprpplague: MMC/SD/SDIO
14:58.31CosmicPenguinprpplague: alchemy
14:58.34jamieSome people "write a driver in 2 weeks" instead of the 6 months that the other guy quoted.
14:58.43prpplagueCosmicPenguin: hmm what type of controler?
14:58.52CosmicPenguinprpplague: its on silicon
14:59.01jamieAMD alchemy?
14:59.06prpplagueCosmicPenguin: custom?
15:03.34CosmicPenguinprpplague: standard operating procedure - its a SOC, so everything is in the core
15:04.14CosmicPenguinIt may or may not be our IP, but it still needs its own driver
15:04.53prpplagueCosmicPenguin: hehe, yea was just wondering if it was a module similiar to primecell's for arm
15:05.52CosmicPenguinnah
15:07.24CosmicPenguinagain, /me hugs the dma engine
15:07.36CosmicPenguinI love this thing - I don't want to go back to x86 - you can't make me!
15:07.44prpplaguehehe
15:17.47CosmicPenguinThe au1200 dma engine has 31 individual descriptors available to it
15:19.15prpplaguewow
15:23.55chouimatmorning
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15:44.26*** topic/#elinux is Embedded Linux || http://eLinux.org/ || cross compile, uClibc, busybox, tinylogin, handhelds, post-sale linux installs ;-), etc. || free embedded linux training at http://free-electrons.com/news/news.2004-09-28/en || see prpplague about custom holly-gates jtag dongles
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18:38.42CosmicPenguinheh - these mmc drivers have been very crossbred
18:39.05CosmicPenguinMy driver has no less then 5 different copyright notices
18:40.07prpplagueCosmicPenguin: how ya coming with that?
18:40.18prpplagueCosmicPenguin: you working with 2.6?
18:40.48prpplagueCosmicPenguin: i've got to add fat support to my mmc/sd code in blob
18:40.54prpplagueCosmicPenguin: haven't had time
18:41.56CosmicPenguinYeah, I'm doing 2.6
18:42.19CosmicPenguinI've had to pull lots of these values straight out of my ass
18:43.26CosmicPenguinBut hey, its either this or code coverage
18:43.33CosmicPenguinAnd i would much rather do this
18:44.23prpplaguehehe yea
18:44.37prpplagueCosmicPenguin: so you got permission to do some alchemy work?
18:44.53CosmicPenguinyeah, they needed a hand
18:45.39sorphinlooks like the penguin is still in the game ;)
18:45.49prpplaguesorphin: ?
18:46.04sorphinprpplague: that he's not gonna get axed
18:46.09prpplagueoh
18:46.20CosmicPenguinheh - no, I fixed that fubar - now they think I'm a genius
18:46.26sorphinprpplague: www.churchsigngenerator.com
18:46.26prpplaguenaw, they'll use him and through him away
18:46.37sorphinCosmicPenguin: ah
18:48.20prpplaguesorphin: i wondered where they got those from
18:50.20prpplagueCosmicPenguin: so you fixed the big customer issue?
18:51.45CosmicPenguinyeah
18:51.50prpplaguecool
18:52.07prpplagueCosmicPenguin: bet the boss lady was happy
18:52.37CosmicPenguinmeh - she doesn't understand when I do good things or bad things at work
18:52.51prpplagueCosmicPenguin: yea i have that problem as well
18:53.19prpplagueCosmicPenguin: when i try to talk about such things mine and her family just get this glossy eyed look
18:54.11prpplaguei didn't sleep well last night
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19:13.40Genesisbonsoir
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19:27.03sorphinGPSFan_: re
19:27.19sorphinprpplague: and here's one especially for you... george.says-it.com
19:30.26T0mWwhat a bunch of losers
19:30.50T0mWprpplague: the Sicom people had me give them SSH access through the firewall so they can admin the POS registers.
19:31.07CosmicPenguinI can't believe I'm going camping today
19:31.11T0mWprpplague: now they want to me to give them access to port 80 of the registers throught the firewall.
19:31.13CosmicPenguinhttp://www.crh.noaa.gov/radar/latest/DS.p19r0/si.kftg.shtml
19:31.26T0mWprpplague: not port 443, port 80!
19:31.33prpplagueT0mW: jeeze
19:31.53prpplagueCosmicPenguin: hehe
19:31.54T0mWprpplague: at the very least, they can port forward via ssh
19:32.34prpplaguesorphin: i much pref this one http://john.says-it.com/
19:32.35T0mWprpplague: if, if they setup their webpages with relative address, and if, they put a "listen 127.0.0.1:80" statement into httpd.conf
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19:43.13cbrake_awayany opinions on the best bootloader for the au1550?
19:45.34Georgesorphin: george.says-it.com?
19:46.37CosmicPenguincbrake: yamon not doin' it for you?
19:47.14prpplagueCosmicPenguin: you like yamon?
19:47.31CosmicPenguinprpplague: meh - I've been spoiled with blob and the Ipaq loader
19:47.37CosmicPenguineverything else seems strange to me now
19:48.05CosmicPenguinBut there's notthing really wrong with yamon - I like that it can tftp - much faster
19:48.11CosmicPenguinbut I don't like that serial transfer is only ascii
19:48.33CosmicPenguinAnd it would be nice if it understood MTD partitions
19:49.29prpplagueCosmicPenguin: yea, blob rocks
19:49.52prpplagueCosmicPenguin: apex is coming along, but i really like blob
19:50.00prpplagueCosmicPenguin: although its suffering from bitrot
19:50.42CosmicPenguinI wish I could get kgdb working on this alchemy board
19:51.03prpplagueCosmicPenguin: yea, that helps
19:51.30cbrakeCosmicPenguin: have not looked at yamon yet -- is that what AMD supplies?
19:51.41CosmicPenguincbrake: I believe so
19:51.51CosmicPenguincbrake: its on all of my dev platforms, so
19:52.02sorphinGeorge: as in our "president"
19:52.13sorphinanother sign generator type page
19:52.37Georgesorphin: flooble
19:53.44CosmicPenguinOk - lets watch this baby explode
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19:57.08CosmicPenguinwow - nothing happened
19:57.09CosmicPenguinthats scary
19:57.23CosmicPenguinI always screw up drivers on the first shot
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19:59.11*** topic/#elinux is Embedded Linux || http://eLinux.org/ || cross compile, uClibc, busybox, tinylogin, handhelds, post-sale linux installs ;-), etc. || free embedded linux training at http://free-electrons.com/news/news.2004-09-28/en || see prpplague about custom holly-gates jtag dongles
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20:13.13*** topic/#elinux is Embedded Linux || http://eLinux.org/ || cross compile, uClibc, busybox, tinylogin, handhelds, post-sale linux installs ;-), etc. || free embedded linux training at http://free-electrons.com/news/news.2004-09-28/en || see prpplague about custom holly-gates jtag dongles
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20:30.43*** topic/#elinux is Embedded Linux || http://eLinux.org/ || cross compile, uClibc, busybox, tinylogin, handhelds, post-sale linux installs ;-), etc. || free embedded linux training at http://free-electrons.com/news/news.2004-09-28/en || see prpplague about custom holly-gates jtag dongles
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21:01.16Genesisbonne nuit
21:02.54prpplagueCP|Weekend: later
21:03.05chouimathi prpplague
21:03.37prpplaguelo
21:08.28T0mWprpplague: now that you've done all the work...
21:08.51T0mWprpplague: I was thinking of getting the LCD runing on the LH79520 I have here
21:13.39prpplagueT0mW: hehe
21:14.19chouimat|pub+s
21:14.46prpplagueT0mW: yea, i was just looking for some cheap lcd's to try with the lh79520
21:15.51prpplagueT0mW: i was thinking about trying my juicebox lcd
21:21.47T0mWprpplague: I've a 640x480 color STN, with touch screen, that I got from EarthLCD.com for $100 a while ago
21:22.31T0mWI think it is 4K color or something like that
21:23.34T0mWprpplague: I've got the interface wired, the only thing I need is the VCON + PWR_ENABLE circuit and it should work, I hope.  :P
21:24.19T0mWfirst things first, get a dev box configured, then work on the JTAG BSDL for the openwince JTAG tool
21:25.24prpplagueT0mW: which one?
21:25.50prpplagueT0mW: which lcd from earth i mean
21:26.14prpplagueT0mW: that the one they were selling for interfacing to the marmalade?
21:30.49prpplagueT0mW: i was thinking about getting a couple of these http://www.allelectronics.com/cgi-bin/category.cgi?category=365&item=LCD-92&type=store
21:31.12prpplagueT0mW: based on the spec i've read, shouldn't be a problem using it with the pl110 controler
21:36.48T0mWprpplague: it shouldn't be a problem, I guess if you done one Monochrome STN, then you've done them all? heh
21:40.17prpplagueT0mW: yea
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22:58.55*** topic/#elinux is Embedded Linux || http://eLinux.org/ || cross compile, uClibc, busybox, tinylogin, handhelds, post-sale linux installs ;-), etc. || free embedded linux training at http://free-electrons.com/news/news.2004-09-28/en || see prpplague about custom holly-gates jtag dongles
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