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| 02:59.05 | T0mW`gone | prpplague: Normally, I would have that enabled, "CONFIG_USE_NOR_CFI", but that time I sent the config file, I had disabled it to try to see if that was the problem. |
| 02:59.41 | T0mW | prpplague: I think I am only seeing 1/2 of the Flash that I should have, it might be a BSWCON problem. |
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| 12:31.42 | chouimat | morning |
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| 14:00.26 | sjhill | $!#@$# |
| 14:00.32 | sjhill | this makes no sense |
| 14:00.45 | sjhill | i'm out of ideas on why i can't get console output |
| 14:03.38 | prpplague | sjhill: holy cow |
| 14:03.46 | prpplague | sjhill: you still having console problems? |
| 14:04.12 | prpplague | sjhill: you able to get a getty running on the serial port? |
| 14:05.07 | *** mode/#edev [+o prpplague] by ChanServ |
| 14:05.18 | prpplague | oh #@$%@#$%@#$% |
| 14:05.27 | prpplague | i forgot to bring my s3c2410 board to the office |
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| 14:16.05 | sjhill | prpplague: no |
| 14:17.07 | prpplague | sjhill: hmm |
| 14:17.29 | sjhill | i'm working backwards now |
| 14:17.34 | sjhill | i'm doing a 2.4 to 2.6 port |
| 14:17.38 | sjhill | works great under 2.4 |
| 14:17.41 | prpplague | sjhill: ahh |
| 14:17.54 | prpplague | sjhill: i need to get a good mips board to learn with |
| 14:18.04 | sjhill | i've got six of them |
| 14:18.10 | prpplague | sjhill: seems their is a number of differences in technique of board bringup |
| 14:18.12 | sjhill | i should send you one of my alchemy boards |
| 14:18.27 | sjhill | prpplague: but i'm doing ppc right now for my 2.4 to 2.6 |
| 14:18.30 | prpplague | sjhill: hehe, i was thinking of something that wasn't a dead product |
| 14:18.35 | prpplague | sjhill: ahh |
| 14:19.06 | prpplague | sjhill: yea i should have gotten one of those walnut boards when they were available |
| 14:19.28 | prpplague | sjhill: i assume you are getting good serial output from the bootloader |
| 14:19.50 | prpplague | sjhill: wonder what broken between 2.4 and 2.6 |
| 14:23.30 | jbevren | sjhill: I'd take one |
| 14:30.42 | chouimat | hi guys |
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| 14:32.03 | prpplague | morning folks |
| 14:33.09 | T0mW | prpplague: it's ok dave, I'm focusing on building a romfs today. I don't want to focus on the NOR problem and get bogged down. I need to make some mileage on right now. |
| 14:33.50 | prpplague | T0mW: np, i'm taking the afternoon off, but i'll be tinkering with the littlechips board this weekend to work on the kinks with apex |
| 14:34.10 | T0mW | prpplague: BTW, it is not an AM29LV320D on that board, it is a Spansion S29AL016M |
| 14:34.34 | T0mW | It does claim to be CFI compliant |
| 14:34.46 | prpplague | T0mW: AHHH |
| 14:35.14 | prpplague | T0mW: iirc the S29AL016M is the same as the AM29LV160 |
| 14:35.33 | prpplague | T0mW: spansion was spun off from amd |
| 14:35.43 | T0mW | Their schematic shows the 4Meg device, while the board is the 2Meg device. |
| 14:35.45 | prpplague | T0mW: or something like that |
| 14:35.52 | T0mW | ~lart AMD |
| 14:36.20 | T0mW | prolly what happened too when they dropped their Flash division, heh |
| 14:36.52 | prpplague | hehe, well whats left seems to be hemoraging other products as well |
| 14:37.08 | CosmicPenguin | Oh, yeah? |
| 14:37.08 | T0mW | prpplague: today, the goal is to get rid of the "TARGETS" variable |
| 14:37.34 | T0mW | in the Makefile |
| 14:37.59 | T0mW | split it into TARGETS_NOR and TARGETS_NAND |
| 14:38.09 | prpplague | T0mW: yea, those appear to be the same chip |
| 14:38.17 | prpplague | CosmicPenguin: alchemy, geode, pic |
| 14:38.20 | T0mW | prpplague: yeah, they do |
| 14:38.47 | prpplague | CosmicPenguin: hehe, maybe its like cutting off your arm to get from dying, hehe |
| 14:38.54 | T0mW | CosmicPenguin: sounds like somebody is specializing their product lineup |
| 14:39.30 | prpplague | still doesn't explain why your erase isn't working |
| 14:39.49 | prpplague | i'll tinker with it tomorrow afternoon |
| 14:40.01 | prpplague | T0mW: you using the latest version of apex? |
| 14:40.06 | T0mW | 1.4.4 |
| 14:40.10 | prpplague | yea |
| 14:40.29 | T0mW | what did you develop M7200 under? |
| 14:40.43 | prpplague | T0mW: sorry i'm not sure i understand your question |
| 14:41.03 | T0mW | what version of apex did you develop the M7200 under? |
| 14:41.10 | prpplague | oh, 1.3.23 |
| 14:41.34 | T0mW | it might be that the CFI is broken somehow in the latest version, it may not work for the M7200 board as well. |
| 14:41.34 | prpplague | but we'll be moving to 1.4 series soon |
| 14:41.42 | prpplague | i've got a ton of patches to submit |
| 14:41.56 | prpplague | T0mW: no it works |
| 14:42.00 | T0mW | ok |
| 14:42.54 | CosmicPenguin | stupid dell |
| 14:43.00 | prpplague | T0mW: i'll have it ironed out by monday |
| 14:43.09 | prpplague | T0mW: and get some patches sent into marc |
| 14:43.15 | prpplague | CosmicPenguin: ? |
| 14:43.24 | prpplague | CosmicPenguin: i thought they were gonna use amd now? |
| 14:43.33 | T0mW | prpplague: now, to get a rootfs + kernel < 1.8Meg |
| 14:43.47 | prpplague | T0mW: plenty easy |
| 14:43.53 | T0mW | heh |
| 14:44.02 | sjhill | CosmicPenguin: what, buying a bunch of AMD chips? |
| 14:44.18 | CosmicPenguin | announced poor earnings |
| 14:44.33 | CosmicPenguin | "The good news is we're buying AMD chips. The bad news, is we're not selling any computers" |
| 14:44.35 | prpplague | T0mW: my pixter-mm test with kernel and initrd is just 1200k |
| 14:44.56 | prpplague | CosmicPenguin: oh |
| 14:45.10 | prpplague | CosmicPenguin: they blaming amd for the slow sells? |
| 14:45.29 | T0mW | for some reason, I cannot get the 2.6.17 kernel below 894K |
| 14:46.07 | CosmicPenguin | you know how stupid wall street is |
| 14:46.10 | T0mW | I took everything out that I could |
| 14:46.16 | prpplague | T0mW: you enabled compilier optimization? |
| 14:46.24 | T0mW | prpplague: ah, no |
| 14:46.31 | CosmicPenguin | anyway, w're down a buck and two bits |
| 14:46.40 | T0mW | prpplague: I'm usaully afraid to do that |
| 14:46.46 | prpplague | T0mW: i assume you aren't using any swap space? |
| 14:46.52 | T0mW | none |
| 14:46.57 | prpplague | T0mW: pretty safe with the uclibc cross tools |
| 14:47.08 | prpplague | T0mW: then there are some options for the swap that can help as well |
| 14:47.15 | prpplague | T0mW: check out the embedded kernel options |
| 14:47.38 | T0mW | CONFIG_CC_OPTIMIZE_FOR_SIZE, got it |
| 14:49.08 | prpplague | T0mW: depending on how far you are along in your kernel dev, you can turn off some of the debugging stuff in the embedded kernel options |
| 14:49.21 | T0mW | that's all off |
| 14:49.46 | prpplague | T0mW: bugon() is turned off? |
| 14:49.56 | prpplague | sorry bug() |
| 14:50.03 | prpplague | disabled? |
| 14:50.33 | T0mW | well, CONFIG_CC_OPTIMIZE_FOR_SIZE is 'y' |
| 14:50.41 | prpplague | hehe, not the only one |
| 14:51.55 | T0mW | CONFIG_FRAME_POINTER ? |
| 14:52.09 | prpplague | T0mW: do a make menuconfig, and go to general options |
| 14:52.23 | prpplague | T0mW: general setup |
| 14:52.52 | prpplague | T0mW: then at the bottom you should see "configure standard kernel features" |
| 14:53.09 | T0mW | yeah |
| 14:53.09 | prpplague | T0mW: enable that, and then select it |
| 14:53.14 | T0mW | it is |
| 14:53.16 | prpplague | T0mW: should get a list of a bunch of stuff |
| 14:53.27 | T0mW | oh! |
| 14:53.33 | prpplague | T0mW: in that list some options you can turn off for embedded systems |
| 14:53.36 | T0mW | Load all symbols for debugging! |
| 14:53.42 | prpplague | T0mW: exactly |
| 14:54.01 | prpplague | T0mW: other ones that are ok to turn off for the s3c2410 is the full slab and shmem |
| 14:54.42 | prpplague | T0mW: the bug() can be disabled as well as the elf dumps |
| 14:55.10 | prpplague | T0mW: event polling can be disabled if you aren't using any hotplug style devices |
| 14:55.15 | T0mW | what is CONFIG_EPOLL? |
| 14:55.25 | prpplague | T0mW: hehe the event polling |
| 14:55.46 | T0mW | for like input devices on the motherboard or something? |
| 14:56.08 | prpplague | T0mW: or insertion removable of stuff, i.e. pcmcia or cf hotplugging |
| 14:56.28 | T0mW | well, we certainly won't need that |
| 14:56.32 | T0mW | :) |
| 14:56.41 | prpplague | T0mW: yea i think you'd get by without that |
| 14:57.03 | T0mW | compiling kernel now, thanks |
| 14:57.16 | prpplague | np |
| 14:57.28 | prpplague | T0mW: glad to share some embedded black magic |
| 14:57.29 | T0mW | heh |
| 14:57.58 | prpplague | T0mW: tomorrow we learn how to properly kill chickens for use in crosscompiling applications |
| 14:58.48 | prpplague | T0mW: there are some additional patches out there on the net, "tiny-kernel" stuff, but most of those have kinda got folded into the main tree |
| 14:58.58 | prpplague | T0mW: not sure if those are even being maintained any mroe |
| 14:58.59 | prpplague | more |
| 15:00.06 | T0mW | prpplague: since I'm going to have a NAND device anyway, I just need to build a minimal system so that it can pivot_root (or switch_root if I can ever get that working). |
| 15:00.26 | T0mW | busybox switch_root seems to be broken right now. |
| 15:00.33 | prpplague | T0mW: yea, you can use either initramfs or initrd |
| 15:00.48 | prpplague | T0mW: initramfs might be a better choice for your design |
| 15:01.23 | T0mW | considering that there will be 32/64Meg of SDRAM on the board anyway, what is 4/8Meg wasted by a ramfs |
| 15:01.44 | T0mW | 796K |
| 15:01.56 | T0mW | saved 20K |
| 15:02.00 | prpplague | T0mW: well once the ramfs is no longer needed you can free that |
| 15:02.08 | T0mW | nod |
| 15:02.18 | prpplague | T0mW: still sounds kind of large |
| 15:02.25 | T0mW | it does |
| 15:02.32 | prpplague | T0mW: you get a chance, email me your .config |
| 15:04.23 | prpplague | jbevren: check out this puppy - http://www.surpluscomputers.com/store/main.aspx?p=ItemDetail&item=NET10346 |
| 15:05.52 | jbevren | I saw that |
| 15:06.01 | T0mW | turned off "aniticpatory scheduler" and used the "deadline scheduler" and saved another 18K |
| 15:06.11 | jbevren | prpplague: the antenna likes to break off (as reviews were saying) |
| 15:06.13 | T0mW | 10K |
| 15:06.23 | prpplague | jbevren: oh didn't see that |
| 15:06.44 | jbevren | prpplague: if youre careful with it, it shouldnt be a problem |
| 15:06.58 | prpplague | jbevren: hmm, i was thinking pixter stuff |
| 15:07.06 | jbevren | http://www.surpluscomputers.com/store/main.aspx?p=ItemDetail&item=NET10262 <- I have three |
| 15:07.07 | jbevren | :D |
| 15:07.09 | prpplague | jbevren: those blueradios are pretty expensive |
| 15:07.12 | jbevren | works ok in linux too |
| 15:07.34 | prpplague | jbevren: yea i've heard the range isn't that good |
| 15:07.46 | prpplague | jbevren: didn't you get some of those blueradios from sfe? |
| 15:07.49 | jbevren | its much better if you pull the shell off ;-) |
| 15:07.54 | jbevren | I plan to, but havent yet |
| 15:07.59 | prpplague | ahh |
| 15:08.08 | prpplague | they seem expensive at $60 |
| 15:09.04 | jbevren | prpplague: I can get from my system upstairs (win2k) to my laptop (winxp) using bluetooth networking if I sit on my porch |
| 15:09.14 | jbevren | the laptop has an internal broadcom BT |
| 15:09.23 | jbevren | the win2k testbox was using one of those |
| 15:09.41 | T0mW | prpplague: do I need SCSI support for anything? |
| 15:10.05 | T0mW | prpplague: I don't think I do... |
| 15:10.26 | T0mW | mtd or sd or anything use it? |
| 15:17.40 | jbevren | mtd has its own blockdev |
| 15:17.50 | jbevren | (doesnt sd work through mtd?) |
| 15:18.10 | jbevren | usb blockdev will need it if youre using that |
| 15:18.27 | T0mW | jbevren: ok |
| 15:22.23 | jbevren | T0mW: I'm unsure about sd media needing scsi, I dont -think- it does ;_) |
| 15:28.46 | prpplague | T0mW: scsi only if you are using some of the usb thumb drives as mass storage |
| 15:29.00 | prpplague | T0mW: mtd needs to be in there to access the nand flash |
| 15:29.54 | prpplague | jbevren: ahh cool, that would be good enough for the pixter |
| 15:30.13 | prpplague | jbevren: just cant decide on whether i should do usb or one of those blueradios |
| 15:31.46 | jbevren | prpplague: the range isnt extraordinary, but it's decent |
| 15:32.06 | jbevren | I plan to put one on a usb extension cable and hang it in a fairly central location in the house ;-) |
| 15:32.15 | jbevren | I can get 10' extensions at 3/$.50 |
| 15:34.47 | jbevren | hehe |
| 15:34.55 | prpplague | jbevren: yea, from what i can tell the blueradio units have much better range |
| 15:35.04 | jbevren | Ping: 00:12:5A:10:AA:D7 from 11:11:11:11:11:11 (data size 20) ... |
| 15:35.04 | jbevren | 0 bytes from 00:12:5A:10:AA:D7 id 0 time 35.64ms |
| 15:35.31 | jbevren | the only thing that bugs me is that all of these have the same mac addr |
| 15:35.32 | prpplague | jbevren: with the blueradio i could connect the pcm to the TI dac and stream some audio |
| 15:36.24 | jbevren | prpplague: indeed |
| 15:37.08 | prpplague | jbevren: thoughts on the usb vs. blueradio? |
| 15:38.25 | jbevren | prpplague: usb would be far more universal |
| 15:38.34 | prpplague | jbevren: yea |
| 15:38.43 | prpplague | jbevren: thats what i'm thinking |
| 15:38.45 | jbevren | imho it'd be better to do usb+bt dongle |
| 15:38.51 | prpplague | yea |
| 15:38.55 | jbevren | I just wanted to use a blueradio to attach to the console |
| 15:38.59 | prpplague | thats where i keep going |
| 15:39.01 | jbevren | not for any 'real' bt networking |
| 15:39.57 | jbevren | root@wrok:~# hcitool name 00:12:5A:10:AA:D7 |
| 15:39.57 | jbevren | Microsoft Mouse |
| 15:39.58 | prpplague | hmm, anyone else wondering why there is no news of the deal with the liquids that tested for explosives yesterday? |
| 15:40.00 | jbevren | wee |
| 15:41.35 | CosmicPenguin | prpplague: ummm... |
| 15:41.39 | CosmicPenguin | prpplague: they turned out to be nothing |
| 15:41.50 | CosmicPenguin | prpplague: I heard it on the Today show |
| 15:42.06 | prpplague | CosmicPenguin: oh |
| 15:42.12 | prpplague | CosmicPenguin: so why the false alarm? |
| 15:42.21 | prpplague | CosmicPenguin: they say? |
| 15:42.23 | jbevren | connected. yay |
| 15:42.25 | CosmicPenguin | because the sniffer caught explosive residue on the outside |
| 15:42.31 | CosmicPenguin | that happens |
| 15:42.37 | prpplague | ahh |
| 15:42.39 | jbevren | prpplague: btw, as much as we like to whine about MS, |
| 15:42.41 | CosmicPenguin | farmers, for example |
| 15:42.50 | jbevren | Ive had this mouse since may and am still using the original batteries |
| 15:42.52 | prpplague | CosmicPenguin: yea amonium nitrate |
| 15:42.52 | jbevren | heh |
| 15:43.08 | jbevren | now if only I could get the scroll wheel to work |
| 15:43.24 | CosmicPenguin | If they got effective walk through sniffers, I bet it would be hard to travel if you were a crops farmer |
| 15:43.32 | prpplague | hehe |
| 15:44.08 | prpplague | personally i think these security methods are worthless |
| 15:44.32 | CosmicPenguin | better explosives sniffing would be effective, I think |
| 15:45.10 | prpplague | and more screening of passengers, and less intrusive searches/restrictions |
| 15:45.29 | CosmicPenguin | Hell, the real fear remains the cargo |
| 15:45.40 | prpplague | CosmicPenguin: yea |
| 15:47.23 | prpplague | CosmicPenguin: personally, radical muslims are the cause of this, why not those are muslim be more effectively screened at the ticket counter |
| 15:47.53 | CosmicPenguin | Well, I'll bet the next massive attack will come from a non-Muslim |
| 15:48.25 | prpplague | CosmicPenguin: i seriously doubt that |
| 15:49.49 | prpplague | i'm not pro-israel or pro-lebabnesse, but i find serious problems on both sides, more so on the lebanesse side |
| 15:50.52 | prpplague | here it is that hezballoh has been killing civillians left and right, and when israel reponds, and occasional a few civillians get killed the lebanese get all pissy like israel is a mass murderer |
| 15:51.45 | prpplague | and the lebanesse gov complains, "oh our country is in ruins" , my reponse is, "Don't whine about it, get hezballoh out of your country and you don't have to worry about such things" |
| 15:54.04 | prpplague | personally, i have nothing against any religion, thats their choice, but when the muslims start doing "jihads" on everyone, i think their religion becomes fair game |
| 15:54.35 | prpplague | i'd issue to the military, large water guns filled with distilled pork fat |
| 15:55.07 | prpplague | just squirt a couple of times and you've given them a fate worse than death, condemnation to hell |
| 15:56.02 | jbevren | unfortunately, thats illegal |
| 15:56.05 | jbevren | dont ask me how or why |
| 15:56.13 | jbevren | well why is becuase you cant attack the religion |
| 15:56.22 | jbevren | but somehow killing people isnt |
| 15:56.44 | jbevren | but I say we just bury terrorists and dead in pig carcasses |
| 15:57.06 | prpplague | jbevren: yea, thats why i said, if they are bringing their religion into the battle by calling it a jihad, i consider that far game |
| 15:57.19 | prpplague | jbevren: hehe yea |
| 15:57.29 | jbevren | you can wash pork fat off and beg forgiveness |
| 15:57.37 | jbevren | but if youre buried inside a carcass youre screwed |
| 15:58.05 | prpplague | jbevren: hehe, the british used that technique in india during their colonial occupation |
| 15:58.11 | jbevren | maybe I'm a bit shortsighted, but if the arabs have proclaimed war on the rest of the world, maybe we should just perform genocide |
| 15:58.13 | prpplague | jbevren: they used fat on their bullets |
| 15:58.28 | prpplague | jbevren: and also poured fat on the train tracks to keep people off them |
| 15:58.48 | prpplague | jbevren: well i think thats going over board |
| 15:58.56 | prpplague | jbevren: you can't group people like that |
| 15:59.06 | prpplague | jbevren: "arabs" |
| 15:59.21 | prpplague | jbevren: i know many hard working people from the middle east |
| 16:00.07 | jbevren | prpplague: Why not? our president does |
| 16:00.08 | prpplague | jbevren: just saying that they people who are doing these types of things should be shown no earthly or heavenly mercy |
| 16:00.20 | jbevren | prpplague: (I agree tho) |
| 16:00.30 | prpplague | jbevren: with me or bush? |
| 16:01.01 | jbevren | with you |
| 16:01.05 | prpplague | ahh |
| 16:01.12 | jbevren | I know a handful of 'arabs' |
| 16:01.17 | jbevren | one of which is openly muslim |
| 16:01.25 | jbevren | one of my best friends in fact :) |
| 16:02.09 | prpplague | for me, growing up, the respect and protection of religious freedom was of utmost importance |
| 16:03.52 | prpplague | but i find it hard to understand how someone can get from the Koran that its ok to kill those who don't believe as you do |
| 16:05.28 | *** join/#edev samrobb_ (n=samrobb_@65-117-135-105.dia.static.qwest.net) |
| 16:07.52 | prpplague | for everyone here, i normally keeps politics and such off this channel, i owe you guys an apology for rambling on about such things |
| 16:13.38 | agaffney | doesn't bother me |
| 16:14.06 | agaffney | anyway, it's the same way that someone can get from the Bible that it's okay to kill those who don't believe as you do |
| 16:15.06 | agaffney | isn't the Christian, Jewish, and Muslim "God" all the same entity? |
| 16:15.24 | prpplague | yea, i.e. david coresh(sp?_ |
| 16:15.55 | agaffney | the waco guy? |
| 16:16.12 | agaffney | Koresh |
| 16:17.02 | prpplague | yea |
| 16:17.40 | samrobb_ | agaffney: Not according to the Jews, Christians, and Muslims :-) |
| 16:17.47 | prpplague | i guess its soooooo far out of my nature to hate someone because of their religion that it just very very hard to understand |
| 16:18.14 | agaffney | samrobb_: well, the Christian and Jewish "God" *is* the same one |
| 16:18.41 | agaffney | Judiasm is just Christianity without Jesus |
| 16:18.53 | agaffney | well, really, Christianty is Judiasm with Jesus :P |
| 16:19.03 | samrobb_ | agaffney: Christians see it that way, I'm not sure Jews would |
| 16:19.25 | samrobb_ | "Christianty is Judiasm with Jesus". Heh. More accurate than I think most people realize. |
| 16:19.37 | agaffney | that's exactly what it is |
| 16:20.04 | agaffney | and I'm pretty sure Allah is the same as Judiasm's Yahweh(sp?) and Christianity's God |
| 16:20.11 | prpplague | well, hasn't christianty lost most of the unique culture associated with judiasm? |
| 16:20.25 | samrobb_ | It's the "with Jesus" part that's the point of contention |
| 16:20.25 | agaffney | prpplague: yes, but the "God" is still the same |
| 16:20.36 | prpplague | samrobb_: ahh |
| 16:21.08 | prpplague | interesting, geeks discussing politics much like a design project, hehe |
| 16:21.26 | agaffney | hahahahaha |
| 16:22.00 | samrobb_ | "No, no - the interface is all wrong! Allah 1.0 won't interoperate with Christianity 1.0!" |
| 16:22.13 | prpplague | ha |
| 16:22.17 | samrobb_ | Backwards compatiability is everything... |
| 16:22.29 | T0mW | Judiasm is Christianity with Jews |
| 16:22.34 | agaffney | o_O |
| 16:22.52 | agaffney | neither Islam or Christianity is backwards compatible with Judaism |
| 16:23.13 | T0mW | yeah |
| 16:23.41 | agaffney | it's like running OSX, Windows, and Linux all on the same processor :P |
| 16:23.56 | T0mW | LOL |
| 16:24.07 | T0mW | at the same time |
| 16:24.07 | agaffney | think about it :P |
| 16:24.26 | samrobb_ | agaffney: heh... oh, wait, you can do that now. |
| 16:24.44 | samrobb_ | Religious virtualization? |
| 16:24.55 | agaffney | samrobb_: see T0mW's addition: "at the same time"...that wouldn't work so well :) |
| 16:25.08 | samrobb_ | VMWare :-) |
| 16:25.15 | agaffney | heh, religious Xen :P |
| 16:25.18 | T0mW | naw, middle east |
| 16:26.41 | T0mW | amazing how many people have died in the name of a loving God |
| 16:26.53 | prpplague | T0mW: agreed |
| 16:27.20 | T0mW | AFAIAC, the "word of God" is "love" |
| 16:27.32 | agaffney | unless you don't believe in Him |
| 16:27.40 | T0mW | yeah, :( |
| 16:27.51 | agaffney | even though it's the *same* Him with a different name |
| 16:28.17 | agaffney | religion-- |
| 16:28.23 | agaffney | I work for a religious company |
| 16:28.27 | *** part/#edev ohsix (i=ohsix@bc111222.bendcable.com) |
| 16:28.34 | agaffney | and it's amazing how many people around here are completely cynical about religion |
| 16:28.38 | prpplague | hehe, think i got an email once that said something like, "the bible says to love your neighbor, and the kama sutra tells you how" |
| 16:28.44 | agaffney | hahahahaha |
| 16:28.47 | T0mW | I took a taxi ride last night from dropping my car off for some work today, the driver and I found that we both had a faith in God and talked about what we felt. |
| 16:28.59 | T0mW | prpplague: ROTFL |
| 16:29.13 | agaffney | I have some very interesting religious discussions here at work |
| 16:29.16 | agaffney | usually at lunch |
| 16:29.44 | T0mW | agaffney: and that is fine, as long as nobody's belief is "wrong" |
| 16:29.54 | prpplague | exactly |
| 16:30.11 | agaffney | T0mW: everyone is open minded here. I don't get looked down on for my beliefs |
| 16:30.18 | prpplague | T0mW: or you feel compelled to kill the person for not being the same |
| 16:30.35 | agaffney | my belief is that there is no heaven or hell, no satan, and no *single* "god" |
| 16:30.42 | T0mW | what is a rather staggering concept for me, I still don't accept it, is that there is no "evil" or "devil", that it is all "God" |
| 16:30.46 | agaffney | I believe that there is a "soul" |
| 16:30.54 | agaffney | and that there are more powerful entities |
| 16:31.00 | prpplague | agaffney: sounds more like a panthian |
| 16:31.09 | agaffney | a what? |
| 16:31.24 | agaffney | I prefer to call myself agnostic with atheistic tendencies |
| 16:31.49 | T0mW | agaffney: that may be true, God may have a God, but the God that touches my life is what that which I know |
| 16:31.51 | prpplague | http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pantheism |
| 16:32.21 | T0mW | sort of like the Boss's Boss, heh |
| 16:33.35 | agaffney | the religious discussions here at work usually steer into theoretical physics, quantum mechanics, and M theory |
| 16:33.38 | agaffney | quite fun |
| 16:34.12 | prpplague | hehe |
| 16:34.21 | prpplague | agaffney: m theory and religion, that would be interesting |
| 16:34.27 | agaffney | indeed |
| 16:34.57 | prpplague | agaffney: i think i would be hard pressed to find another person on the island who even knows what m theory is much less discuss it |
| 16:35.02 | agaffney | heh |
| 16:35.07 | agaffney | that's what the internet is for :P |
| 16:35.35 | prpplague | agaffney: yea well, live interaction is sometimes a good thing |
| 16:35.36 | agaffney | was that a M theory joke? ;) |
| 16:35.48 | prpplague | samrobb_: HA |
| 16:36.07 | samrobb_ | Um... sure. Yeah. |
| 16:36.11 | agaffney | heh |
| 16:36.14 | prpplague | samrobb_: hehe |
| 16:36.26 | prpplague | me too |
| 16:36.32 | agaffney | samrobb_: the latest incarnation of string theory |
| 16:36.37 | prpplague | was funny |
| 16:36.47 | samrobb_ | Heh. Serendipity strikes. |
| 16:38.13 | prpplague | samrobb_: hehe, we normally don't discuss politics and religion here, but i started rambling earlier |
| 16:41.28 | samrobb_ | prpplague: I'm generally pleasantly surprised at the number of "religious" folks in IT |
| 16:41.59 | samrobb_ | I've got co-workers who do music for prison ministries, stuff like that. |
| 16:42.43 | prpplague | samrobb_: yea, i find alot of computer people are looking for "answers" |
| 16:42.51 | agaffney | 42 |
| 16:42.55 | agaffney | the only answer you ever need |
| 16:42.59 | prpplague | now the question |
| 16:43.13 | agaffney | heh |
| 16:43.16 | samrobb_ | I'm studying for the ministry myself, and in general, I've gotten encouragement from most of my work friends |
| 16:43.31 | prpplague | samrobb_: ahh cool |
| 16:43.42 | samrobb_ | Questions, too, as the "really religious guy" in the office :-) |
| 16:43.51 | prpplague | samrobb_: so i guess you get alot of theology classes |
| 16:44.06 | samrobb_ | Yep. |
| 16:44.33 | samrobb_ | Fundamentalist Christian whacko, that's me. |
| 16:44.38 | prpplague | hehe |
| 16:53.20 | CosmicPenguin | I love it when I have co-workers that I can have knock down drag out yelling matches with and still respect each other |
| 16:53.47 | CosmicPenguin | Especially when they are as stubbor and I am |
| 16:53.52 | CosmicPenguin | errr |
| 16:53.56 | CosmicPenguin | stubborn as I am |
| 16:54.22 | CosmicPenguin | Boeing Scraps In-flight Internet Access |
| 16:54.24 | CosmicPenguin | doh |
| 16:54.26 | CosmicPenguin | I loved that |
| 16:54.44 | CosmicPenguin | Last time I went to Germany, I was drunk posting at 30,000 |
| 16:54.51 | prpplague | CosmicPenguin: who needs it when all you will have on the plane is your paper smock |
| 16:54.57 | prpplague | CosmicPenguin: HA |
| 16:55.30 | CosmicPenguin | I logged on here, but you guys were gone |
| 16:56.16 | prpplague | hehe |
| 16:56.52 | *** join/#edev [g2] (n=g2@nslu2-linux/g2) |
| 16:58.21 | sjhill | that would have been a lot of fun |
| 17:03.11 | prpplague | ho ho hum |
| 17:11.49 | jbevren | http://www.surpluscomputers.com/store/main.aspx?p=ItemDetail&item=CBL10193 |
| 17:13.12 | prpplague | CosmicPenguin: hehe we were talking about using one of those usb docking stations |
| 17:13.33 | jbevren | CosmicPenguin: my biggest usb dev |
| 17:13.35 | jbevren | the computer |
| 17:13.38 | prpplague | CosmicPenguin: that provide ps/2, parport, rs-232 and a couple additional usbs |
| 17:14.04 | jbevren | put the whirring noises in the closet f/e |
| 17:14.13 | prpplague | jbevren: hehe only thing you'd need is a usb display |
| 17:14.28 | CosmicPenguin | usb display? |
| 17:14.31 | CosmicPenguin | heh |
| 17:14.31 | jbevren | prpplague: not really |
| 17:14.38 | jbevren | prpplague: my dvi/openLDI cables are 6 feet long |
| 17:14.43 | prpplague | jbevren: why not just use a thin client with a remote x session? |
| 17:14.46 | jbevren | the 1600SW builtin openLDI cable is 10' long |
| 17:14.58 | jbevren | prpplague: opengl acceleration, video, need I name more? |
| 17:15.07 | jbevren | oh, and I have three heads |
| 17:15.21 | jbevren | anyway, I have 16' of cable on my displays already |
| 17:15.29 | CosmicPenguin | I doubt you could get more then 320x200 out of a USB cable |
| 17:15.33 | jbevren | that active extension just puts a port as far away as my displays can get |
| 17:15.36 | prpplague | CosmicPenguin: http://www.trittontechnologies.com/products/TRIUV100.htm |
| 17:15.38 | jbevren | CosmicPenguin: there's a vga adapter |
| 17:15.48 | jbevren | dont bet on doing video on it, but it'd be ok otherwise |
| 17:15.57 | jbevren | 2D acceleration requires much less bandwidth than you think |
| 17:19.31 | jbevren | a good example is my 10bT xterminal ;-) |
| 17:19.31 | jbevren | it only gets 10Mbit, but is still very usable |
| 17:19.41 | jbevren | a 280Mbit usb vga adapter should be able to do fairly well |
| 17:19.49 | jbevren | s/2/4/ |
| 17:20.13 | prpplague | i wonder what chip that thing uses |
| 17:20.25 | jbevren | prpplague: did you see http://www.surpluscomputers.com/store/main.aspx?p=ItemDetail&item=CPM10396 ? |
| 17:20.29 | jbevren | what chip .. uses? |
| 17:20.39 | prpplague | the usb->vga |
| 17:21.03 | prpplague | jbevren: hehe yea |
| 17:21.08 | jbevren | ah |
| 17:21.11 | jbevren | SiS iirc |
| 17:21.15 | jbevren | linux kernel supports it |
| 17:21.34 | jbevren | no acceleration though :X |
| 17:21.43 | prpplague | hard to believe, something the size of a postage stamp, has the capacity of my first hard drive and costs $1 |
| 17:21.56 | jbevren | heh |
| 17:21.59 | jbevren | my first hdd was 20M |
| 17:22.07 | jbevren | I remember getting a 107M drive |
| 17:22.11 | jbevren | I thought I was a king |
| 17:22.18 | prpplague | jbevren: yea i had a segate rll drive |
| 17:22.28 | CosmicPenguin | but still, you need video data for each pixel |
| 17:22.33 | jbevren | I started with IDE, but I knew enough people with RLL's |
| 17:22.42 | CosmicPenguin | but I suppose you might be able to do handle it |
| 17:22.43 | jbevren | CosmicPenguin: compressed block transfers |
| 17:22.46 | CosmicPenguin | yeah |
| 17:22.52 | jbevren | you need the same on X, which isnt compressed |
| 17:23.00 | jbevren | <- uses 10bT xterms, remember? |
| 17:23.01 | CosmicPenguin | But your statement that 2D acceleration helps is not true |
| 17:23.08 | jbevren | how does it not help? |
| 17:23.19 | jbevren | you blit a 640x480 window instead of having to retransfer it |
| 17:23.32 | CosmicPenguin | Thats true when you're talking about your system bus |
| 17:23.42 | jbevren | hello? X11 over 10baseT? |
| 17:23.44 | CosmicPenguin | but the video data remains the same size regardless |
| 17:23.51 | jbevren | not when you dont retransfer it |
| 17:24.06 | CosmicPenguin | But that has nothing to do with 2D acceleration |
| 17:24.07 | jbevren | most graphics operations are moves |
| 17:24.10 | jbevren | yes, yes it does |
| 17:24.17 | CosmicPenguin | that has everything to do with compressing the video information that you send to the controller |
| 17:24.23 | jbevren | blitting an area of the screen from one location to another IS 2D acceleration |
| 17:24.53 | jbevren | so instead of having to redraw my entire firefox rendering pane, it blits 90% of it upward and redraws the lower 10% |
| 17:24.57 | CosmicPenguin | fine |
| 17:25.02 | jbevren | that'd be accelerated :) |
| 17:25.04 | CosmicPenguin | but you still have to send each frame to the display |
| 17:25.09 | jbevren | no |
| 17:25.10 | CosmicPenguin | yes |
| 17:25.17 | jbevren | its stored in the framebuffer on the device |
| 17:25.17 | CosmicPenguin | your monitor requires data every sync |
| 17:25.27 | CosmicPenguin | But we're not talking about the framebuffer |
| 17:25.29 | jbevren | I think youre misunderstanding the device :) |
| 17:25.30 | CosmicPenguin | we're talking about the monitor |
| 17:25.39 | jbevren | this device has a vga card in it |
| 17:25.47 | jbevren | its connected via usb rather than pci/isa/etc |
| 17:25.47 | CosmicPenguin | Well, then its nothing like what I said, is it? |
| 17:26.10 | prpplague | hehe |
| 17:26.28 | jbevren | I have no idea why you'd stream vga signals over usb :P |
| 17:26.29 | CosmicPenguin | my point remains absolutely valid then - a USB cable doesn't have enough bandwidth to carry video data to a monitor |
| 17:26.58 | jbevren | so these usb vga adapters either dont exist or don't work |
| 17:27.05 | jbevren | because they obviously do it |
| 17:27.16 | CosmicPenguin | ok - so they either do one of two things |
| 17:27.21 | CosmicPenguin | they either carry the raw video data |
| 17:27.31 | CosmicPenguin | or they carry the framebuffer data which gets processed on the client side before going to VGA |
| 17:27.43 | CosmicPenguin | in the first case, I don't believe the cable has enough bandwidth |
| 17:27.49 | jbevren | agreed |
| 17:27.59 | CosmicPenguin | in the second case, it probably does, but then you're really not talking about a USB attached monitor |
| 17:28.06 | CosmicPenguin | you're talking about a USB attached video card |
| 17:28.08 | CosmicPenguin | not the same thing |
| 17:28.15 | jbevren | that's what I'd been saying during this whole discussion |
| 17:28.16 | prpplague | CosmicPenguin: yea, that was my wording |
| 17:28.18 | jbevren | usb vga adapter |
| 17:28.24 | jbevren | :) |
| 17:28.31 | jbevren | that said, you -can- get optical extensions |
| 17:28.34 | jbevren | but those are $$$$ |
| 17:28.41 | CosmicPenguin | <prpplague> jbevren: hehe only thing you'd need is a usb display |
| 17:28.59 | jbevren | CosmicPenguin: Does that specifically exclude usb vga adapters? :) |
| 17:29.02 | prpplague | CosmicPenguin: yea, that was my improper wording |
| 17:29.02 | jbevren | lets not argue semantics |
| 17:29.07 | CosmicPenguin | Its not an adapter |
| 17:29.15 | CosmicPenguin | lets argue semantics, because otherwise you look foolish |
| 17:29.21 | prpplague | hehe |
| 17:29.23 | CosmicPenguin | its a USB attached video card |
| 17:29.47 | jbevren | so if I put the usb attached video card inside my display, it becomes a usb-attached display |
| 17:29.56 | CosmicPenguin | heh - ok |
| 17:30.01 | CosmicPenguin | still a vga cable to your monitor |
| 17:30.08 | jbevren | prpplague's wording was vague but does not exclude the use of intelligent adapters |
| 17:30.09 | CosmicPenguin | s/vga cable/!usb cable/ |
| 17:30.23 | CosmicPenguin | In fact, prpplague's working mandates intellgent adapaters |
| 17:30.40 | jbevren | right, enough time and bits wasted |
| 17:30.48 | prpplague | hehe |
| 17:30.55 | jbevren | sjhill agrees :) |
| 17:30.58 | prpplague | still it would be interesting as a thin client |
| 17:31.08 | jbevren | the pixter or ? |
| 17:31.25 | prpplague | i know maxspeed and a couple other companies made some pc multipliers , but those were pci based |
| 17:31.57 | prpplague | basically a pci card that has keyboard, mouse and video on it |
| 17:32.09 | prpplague | turned 1 pc into 2 pc, hehe |
| 17:32.21 | prpplague | you could put up to 3 in one pc |
| 17:32.33 | prpplague | it worked pretty well for basic stuff |
| 17:32.37 | jbevren | heh |
| 17:32.43 | jbevren | they did that with a patched kernel and X tree too |
| 17:32.46 | jbevren | using usb devices |
| 17:32.51 | prpplague | but if you had this all done with usb, it would be pretty easy to do |
| 17:33.03 | jbevren | the trick there, of course, is mapping dynamically assigned keyboards to the heads they should control |
| 17:33.20 | prpplague | jbevren: yea |
| 17:33.38 | prpplague | jbevren: but imagin one of those docking stations with vga as well |
| 17:33.44 | jbevren | prpplague: nod |
| 17:33.57 | jbevren | if the 2D acceleration were supported in linux, it'd be pretty keen |
| 17:34.01 | jbevren | sadly, it's not |
| 17:34.12 | prpplague | actually what would be interesting to me is tft lcd support with a usb connection |
| 17:35.33 | prpplague | jbevren: hehe, you could use a lnode40 with one of those docking stations and almost have an entire desktop |
| 17:35.46 | prpplague | jbevren: add the usb->vga adapter and you would |
| 17:36.08 | prpplague | hmm, i wonder if that tritton vga adapter is supported in linux |
| 17:37.08 | prpplague | hmm looks like they only work with usb2 |
| 17:38.42 | prpplague | bumme |
| 17:39.09 | prpplague | that would rock if it support usb1.1 |
| 17:39.11 | jbevren | nod |
| 17:39.24 | jbevren | theyre not exactly usb2 compliant |
| 17:40.42 | prpplague | i'd like to talk my boss into doing a 48pin instead of 40 and bring out the other control lines for the tft display |
| 17:40.48 | prpplague | as it is now, we can only support stn |
| 17:43.39 | jbevren | hm |
| 17:46.20 | prpplague | jbevren: i'd really prefer 64 pins |
| 17:46.35 | prpplague | jbevren: that would give us just about everything a person could dream of |
| 17:46.54 | prpplague | jbevren: which would include the tft control lines as well as the i2s stuff |
| 17:47.08 | jbevren | cool |
| 17:47.12 | prpplague | jbevren: massive arm9 dev board with just 64 .1" pins |
| 17:47.25 | jbevren | ah, its an arm9? |
| 17:53.18 | jbevren | hm |
| 17:53.28 | jbevren | is transflash SPI-capable like SD? |
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| 18:00.10 | prpplague | jbevren: did i miss anything |
| 18:00.13 | prpplague | jbevren: ?? |
| 18:00.27 | jbevren | hm |
| 18:00.43 | jbevren | I only asked if the lnode is arm9, and then if transflash operates just like sd cards |
| 18:01.07 | prpplague | yea the lnode40 is s3c2410 based, arm920t |
| 18:01.25 | prpplague | yea tflash is basically just a sd card in a small package |
| 18:02.13 | prpplague | jbevren: our board will be pretty close to this one - http://www.olimex.com/dev/index.html |
| 18:02.23 | prpplague | jbevren: just with our cpu board, and not the lpc |
| 18:02.33 | prpplague | sorry not the SAM |
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| 18:05.05 | jbevren | that was BS. |
| 18:05.11 | jbevren | -every- freenode server but this one is closing my connection |
| 18:05.25 | *** join/#edev [g2] (n=g2@nslu2-linux/g2) |
| 18:05.37 | prpplague | wtf |
| 18:05.39 | *** mode/#edev [+o prpplague] by ChanServ |
| 18:05.41 | prpplague | jbevren: same here |
| 18:05.53 | jbevren | prpplague: so as I was saying |
| 18:05.54 | jbevren | I only asked if the lnode is arm9, and then if transflash operates just like sd cards |
| 18:06.00 | prpplague | yea the lnode40 is s3c2410 based, arm920t |
| 18:06.06 | prpplague | yea tflash is basically just a sd card in a small package |
| 18:06.13 | prpplague | jbevren: our board will be pretty close to this one - http://www.olimex.com/dev/index.html |
| 18:06.21 | prpplague | jbevren: the carrier board that is |
| 18:06.21 | jbevren | prpplague: Nod, got the link |
| 18:06.25 | jbevren | anyway |
| 18:06.35 | jbevren | I wasnt sure if transflash was more like XD due to its size |
| 18:06.37 | jbevren | thats pretty cool then |
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| 18:06.51 | prpplague | T0mW: hey hey |
| 18:07.01 | prpplague | [g2]: re |
| 18:07.01 | jbevren | prpplague: btw, you'll want to give me the link for the frame, not for the browser :) |
| 18:07.17 | prpplague | doh |
| 18:07.18 | prpplague | sorry |
| 18:07.19 | prpplague | one sec |
| 18:07.27 | jbevren | right click -> this frame -> show only this frame |
| 18:07.36 | prpplague | http://www.olimex.com/dev/sam7-ex256.html |
| 18:07.42 | prpplague | jbevren: yea i know, just forgot |
| 18:07.49 | prpplague | i hate frames |
| 18:07.59 | T0mW | :P |
| 18:08.09 | jbevren | just need a copy frame location option in the context menu |
| 18:08.40 | prpplague | jbevren: we use a enc28j60 for the nic |
| 18:08.51 | prpplague | jbevren: and we have a bigger 160x160 greyscale lcd |
| 18:09.05 | prpplague | jbevren: and usb host and slave |
| 18:11.29 | prpplague | jbevren: shameless plug - http://www.elinux.org/wiki/M5900 |
| 18:11.33 | *** join/#edev Redhatter (n=beast@gentoo/developer/redhatter) [NETSPLIT VICTIM] |
| 18:11.46 | prpplague | Redhatter: greetings |
| 18:12.46 | prpplague | jbevren: what i'd like to see is a sodim connector to .1" headers for our sodim cpu board |
| 18:13.00 | jbevren | yeah, sodimm breakout |
| 18:13.26 | jbevren | one without any notches for the name of being universal |
| 18:13.32 | jbevren | er, for the sake of |
| 18:13.46 | prpplague | yea, well i doubt aml would ever sell their sodim board |
| 18:14.00 | jbevren | I realise this |
| 18:14.03 | jbevren | but other companies do ;-) |
| 18:14.12 | prpplague | yea |
| 18:14.16 | jbevren | hm |
| 18:14.25 | prpplague | hehe, for $700 you can get one, hehe |
| 18:15.10 | jbevren | I see them on ebya for sub-$200 from time to time |
| 18:15.13 | jbevren | or do you mean the berakout |
| 18:15.16 | jbevren | =breakout |
| 18:15.22 | prpplague | hehe, no i mean the M5900 |
| 18:15.27 | jbevren | ohh |
| 18:15.32 | jbevren | does that come with a support contract? :D |
| 18:15.39 | prpplague | jbevren: uh no |
| 18:15.42 | jbevren | hehe |
| 18:15.43 | jbevren | doh! |
| 18:15.45 | jbevren | I tried |
| 18:15.49 | prpplague | jbevren: there is a pricing list for that |
| 18:16.24 | prpplague | http://www.barcodepower.com/m5900.asp |
| 18:16.32 | prpplague | doh thats $795 for the base model |
| 18:18.03 | prpplague | of course you'll have to wait for 45 days as the first 5k units are already sold |
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| 18:18.28 | prpplague | youam: re |
| 18:20.14 | jbevren | prpplague: sok |
| 18:20.21 | jbevren | I'd like somethign mroe akin to the littlechips board |
| 18:20.29 | prpplague | jbevren: hehe |
| 18:20.31 | prpplague | jbevren: yea |
| 18:20.51 | prpplague | jbevren: the lnode40 with the devboard, usb jtag and everything will be less than $200 |
| 18:21.33 | prpplague | i need to talk my boss in to doing something with our unused dev boards |
| 18:22.03 | T0mW | EBAY |
| 18:22.07 | T0mW | YAY! |
| 18:22.09 | T0mW | heh |
| 18:22.15 | prpplague | more like donate it to devrs |
| 18:22.33 | prpplague | we will have a ton of sa-1110 boards soon |
| 18:22.44 | jbevren | I'll take one hehe |
| 18:22.46 | prpplague | as well as some lh79520 and a few s3c2410 boards |
| 18:22.52 | T0mW | prpplague: I have two that I won't need: LPD-LH79520 + LPD-LH7A400 |
| 18:23.24 | prpplague | yea, well, i wouldn't take those if you paid me |
| 18:23.37 | T0mW | :( snif |
| 18:23.44 | prpplague | T0mW: well i could salvage the ram and flash off them |
| 18:23.57 | T0mW | heh |
| 18:24.13 | T0mW | I was thinking of putting them on ebay with a $150 minimum |
| 18:25.25 | prpplague | reminds me of selling a used car with a cracked head, one person buys it and discovers its broken, turns around and sells it to some unsuspecting person who then does the same thing |
| 18:25.58 | prpplague | it totally amazes me that companies like sharp deal with LogicPD |
| 18:26.04 | jbevren | I dunno |
| 18:26.07 | jbevren | I can replace a cracked head |
| 18:26.22 | T0mW | prpplague: ah, but then you sell it to a mechanic that knows where he can get a head for it cheap |
| 18:26.24 | prpplague | jbevren: yea well, not your average joe |
| 18:26.31 | T0mW | jbevren: exactly |
| 18:26.31 | jbevren | prpplague: nod |
| 18:26.40 | jbevren | we did that to a $25 car when I was in PA |
| 18:26.48 | prpplague | T0mW: yea well, a yugo with a cracked head is still a yugo when fixed |
| 18:26.49 | jbevren | bought it knowing the head was cracked heh |
| 18:26.54 | jbevren | replaced it for $50 in parts |
| 18:26.58 | T0mW | those boards may not suit us, but there are people looking for ARM dev boards to play with |
| 18:27.02 | jbevren | gave it to some girl that needed a new car to get to work |
| 18:27.20 | T0mW | prpplague: I didn't get the car I wanted when I first started to drive... |
| 18:27.22 | prpplague | hehe |
| 18:27.26 | T0mW | jbevren: :P |
| 18:27.37 | jbevren | I was happy to have -something- to drive |
| 18:27.43 | jbevren | even though it was a 16 year old chevy van |
| 18:27.52 | prpplague | T0mW: hehe true, but atleast it had the normal parts on it |
| 18:28.06 | T0mW | yeah, or a 15year old Nova w/195K on it |
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| 18:28.36 | prpplague | T0mW: the logicpd is like getting a used car with a breath analyzer still attached to the ignition |
| 18:28.52 | T0mW | heh |
| 18:29.32 | prpplague | hehe, or getting a book that is done in rot13 |
| 18:29.33 | T0mW | prpplague: heh, then you have to pay them to disable it for a year |
| 18:30.20 | prpplague | do you know the only reference design for a lh79524 is done for logicpd |
| 18:30.33 | prpplague | and sharp wonders why their sales of the chip are non existant? |
| 18:32.00 | jbevren | so who/what are logicpd? |
| 18:32.16 | prpplague | i just don't understand why companies like sharp,samsung, TI have such a problem with understanding their market |
| 18:32.24 | prpplague | http://www.logicpd.com |
| 18:33.23 | prpplague | ha their product line up reads like a list of "do not use" list |
| 18:35.52 | prpplague | sharp LH series, Renesas SH series , freescale MCF, and amd geode(sorry CosmicPenguin) |
| 18:36.54 | prpplague | with the exception of the geode, all of those have horrible vendor support |
| 18:37.15 | prpplague | and thanks to CosmicPenguin amd past tense HAD a good direction for the geode |
| 18:38.38 | jbevren | heh |
| 18:38.42 | jbevren | I never expect support anyway |
| 18:38.47 | jbevren | or do you mean that its impossible to purchase them |
| 18:39.28 | prpplague | jbevren: well when i say support its a wide range of things, reference designs, documentation, ability to purchase small qty for dev, OSS friendlness |
| 18:39.39 | jbevren | gotcha |
| 18:39.46 | jbevren | brb |
| 18:40.23 | prpplague | its like breaking into a red lobster restaurant and setting the lobsters free and saying "run freee!!!" |
| 18:40.59 | prpplague | these companies make a chip and just kinda throw it in the air and say "fly away to your customer" |
| 18:41.53 | prpplague | then when it hits the ground the blame the customer, "well we didn't get much interest in the product" |
| 18:42.03 | prpplague | s/the/they |
| 18:49.46 | T0mW | like littlechips support, non-existant, they don't even monitor their company forum |
| 18:51.14 | prpplague | T0mW: thats different though |
| 18:51.51 | prpplague | T0mW: you don't like the s3c2410 board from littlechips or its support, you have a dozen other places you can buy a design from |
| 18:52.15 | prpplague | T0mW: not only that, but samsung provides code examples and their own reference design for the s3c2410 |
| 18:52.50 | prpplague | T0mW: when you have companies like sharp where there isn't a single free reference design for the LH79524 |
| 18:53.01 | prpplague | T0mW: what incentive does someone have to use it? |
| 18:53.48 | T0mW | prpplague: I like the board, I just wish that I'd checked out their support / lack of, esp a more current BSP |
| 18:54.32 | prpplague | T0mW: most of the time, i'm only concerned with documentation on the chip, as long as i have a schematic for the board, i'm good |
| 18:55.24 | T0mW | prpplague: yeah, one thing good about this is that I'm gaining more experience on bringing a board up under linux |
| 18:55.27 | prpplague | T0mW: yp |
| 18:55.28 | prpplague | yep |
| 18:55.44 | prpplague | T0mW: imho which is a very good skill to have |
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| 18:57.27 | prpplague | hehe - http://www.barbadosadvocate.com/NewViewNewsleft.cfm?Record=27426 |
| 18:59.08 | prpplague | oh what a stinking flop this is gonna be - http://www.barbadosadvocate.com/NewViewNewsleft.cfm?Record=27343 |
| 19:01.21 | jbevren | hmm |
| 19:01.42 | prpplague | scc? |
| 19:02.08 | prpplague | sh@# cr@# and Company? |
| 19:04.12 | jbevren | naw |
| 19:04.14 | jbevren | surpluscomptuers.com |
| 19:04.29 | jbevren | s/tuer/uter/ |
| 19:08.08 | jbevren | hm $50 imacs |
| 19:08.14 | jbevren | why are they so strangely attractive |
| 19:08.24 | jbevren | maybe cause theyre compact, quiet, and would make a nice xterm |
| 19:08.26 | jbevren | hehe |
| 19:10.44 | jbevren | prpplague: hah |
| 19:10.51 | jbevren | barbados doesnt allow liquor to be imported |
| 19:11.09 | jbevren | I think the US shouldnt allow it until barbados allows liquor to be exported there |
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| 19:18.45 | prpplague | jbevren: funny, i always think of them as softwareandstuff.com |
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| 20:07.39 | CosmicPenguin | ~quote amd |
| 20:07.49 | CosmicPenguin | well, at least we recovered mostly |
| 20:43.30 | *** join/#edev purl (i=ibot@pdpc/supporter/active/TimRiker/bot/apt) |
| 20:43.30 | *** topic/#edev is #edev discussion for small embedded device development and hacking || http://www.elinux.org/wiki/ || http://www.hackaday.com || http://www.linux-hacker.net || buildroot now has a mailing list, please subscribe at http://buildroot.busybox.net |
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| 23:26.42 | *** join/#edev ohsix (i=ohsix@bc111222.bendcable.com) |
| 23:39.41 | sunrunner20 | my school |
| 23:39.57 | sunrunner20 | has over 300 svideo cords o.0 |