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| 00:13.56 | askiw | hi, i have a problem. when i plug in headphones, my laptop microphone stops working. where could be a problem? |
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| 00:22.52 | gnarface | askiw: try disabling auto-mute mode in alsamixer and pavucontrol |
| 00:23.13 | gnarface | askiw: the side effect is the speakers will stay on unless you mute them then |
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| 00:24.33 | askiw | gnarface, you mean the sound will go through both speakers and headphones? |
| 00:25.26 | gnarface | askiw: yea, no volumes will change anymore as a result of analog jack hotplug detection events. you'll have to manage them manually |
| 00:26.24 | gnarface | askiw: it's definitely a problem with your driver, but this might be a realistic way to work around it (getting it actually fixed is probably not realistic, and definitely will take much longer, so you'll want to try this first either way as a temporary solution) |
| 00:28.49 | gnarface | askiw: if you're not using pulseaudio, you won't need to mess around with pavucontrol, but if you are using it, you will have to stop it before launching alsamixer |
| 00:29.25 | askiw | gonna try that, thanks |
| 00:30.01 | gnarface | no problem, good luck |
| 00:30.13 | askiw | getting it actually fixed would need to edit the driver? |
| 00:30.36 | gnarface | yea, if you want to explore that route, register for the alsa-devel mailing list and start hanging out in #alsa |
| 00:31.32 | gnarface | just properly filing a bug report they could conceivably take action upon will require you to do some work on your own first, too, including but not limited to compiling a fresh copy of the latest kernel with debugging on |
| 00:31.56 | askiw | sounds fun:) |
| 00:33.01 | gnarface | if it's the snd_hda_intel driver though, sometimes you can improve behavior by overriding hardware model auto-detection with a module parameter |
| 00:33.16 | gnarface | that's more likely in cases where it never worked |
| 00:33.31 | gnarface | if it used to work and this is a regression, the matter is probably stickier |
| 00:33.56 | gnarface | in that case though if you have the previous kernel installed still, you can usually reboot to it to verify |
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| 03:37.29 | Wafficus | hey there, can anyone help me figure out how to make my Focusrite Solo Interface (gen 2) audio interface work via the alsa config in ~/.asoundrc? |
| 03:37.44 | Wafficus | I had it before, but my previous dot file got overwritten since.. I'm an idiot |
| 03:37.55 | Wafficus | anyway, I know it involves aplay -l for starters though |
| 03:39.19 | gnarface | defaults.pcm.!card |
| 03:39.24 | gnarface | defaults.ctl.!card |
| 03:39.28 | gnarface | defaults.pcm.!device |
| 03:39.49 | gnarface | if this is just about changing the default, just just define those 3 lines ^ |
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| 03:40.41 | gnarface | my example has a string for the first two (the same string, the short version of the card name) and a integer for the device # |
| 03:40.55 | gnarface | numbers probably work for both |
| 03:41.10 | gnarface | but the string is less likely to change |
| 03:45.28 | Wafficus | yeah its just to change the defaults |
| 03:46.15 | Wafficus | my default card is 1 |
| 03:46.32 | Wafficus | rather |
| 03:46.35 | Wafficus | whoops, its card 2 |
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| 03:46.59 | gnarface | the numbers start at 0 |
| 03:47.11 | gnarface | usb stuff is rarely in a predictable order though |
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| 03:50.36 | Wafficus | yeah its in card 2 though |
| 03:53.41 | Wafficus | so I just need: defaults.pcm 2 |
| 03:53.45 | Wafficus | defaults.ctl 2 |
| 03:53.49 | Wafficus | defaults.pcm 2 |
| 03:53.57 | Wafficus | is that correct? |
| 03:54.41 | gnarface | the "!" is important |
| 03:54.44 | gnarface | oh |
| 03:54.57 | gnarface | you're missing the whole last part |
| 03:55.30 | gnarface | defaults.pcm.!card |
| 03:55.36 | gnarface | defaults.ctl.!card |
| 03:55.41 | gnarface | defaults.pcm.!device |
| 03:57.06 | gnarface | so maybe !card 2 and !device 0 |
| 03:57.07 | gnarface | ? |
| 03:57.15 | gnarface | i usually use the name for !card |
| 03:57.24 | gnarface | usually it's something like SB or Intel or PCM |
| 03:57.29 | gnarface | or maybe HDMI |
| 03:57.46 | gnarface | you should be able to get the info from aplay -l |
| 03:58.00 | gnarface | but what you need to understand is that every card has one or more devices on it |
| 03:58.23 | gnarface | and while you usually use the first device on the first card (0,0) you'll need to set both here, probably to something different |
| 03:58.55 | gnarface | sigh |
| 03:59.05 | gnarface | ...and you don't have to reboot for changes to take effect |
| 03:59.27 | sauron- | gnarface Wafficus is gone |
| 03:59.52 | gnarface | yea it was sarcasm |
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| 03:59.57 | sauron- | lol |
| 03:59.58 | Wafficus | back sorry, my powerstrip got disconnected |
| 04:00.08 | gnarface | oh, i thought you rebooted |
| 04:00.10 | gnarface | on purpose |
| 04:00.20 | Wafficus | nah, by accident sorry |
| 04:00.44 | gnarface | https://paste.debian.net/1184476/ |
| 04:01.19 | gnarface | that example uses "Inte" as the card name, here, the card name would just be "SB": card 0: SB [HDA ATI SB], device 0: ALC892 Analog [ALC892 Analog] |
| 04:01.26 | gnarface | er, "Intel" |
| 04:01.28 | gnarface | follow me? |
| 04:01.41 | Wafficus | gotcha |
| 04:01.50 | Wafficus | I'll have to look at the aplay -l output and see if I can modify it |
| 04:01.51 | Wafficus | one sec |
| 04:04.00 | gnarface | aplay -l|grep card\ 1|cut -d ' ' -f 3 |
| 04:04.25 | gnarface | er, actually: aplay -l|grep card\ 2|cut -d ' ' -f 3 |
| 04:04.28 | gnarface | you said card 2 |
| 04:05.04 | Wafficus | yep |
| 04:05.26 | gnarface | you won't have to restart the computer, but you will have to restart pulseaudio if you're using it, and possibly the window manager and login manager too |
| 04:06.32 | Wafficus | card 2: USB [Scarlett Solo USB], device: 0: USB Audio [USB Audio] Subdevices: 1/1 Subdevice #0: subdevice #0 |
| 04:07.19 | Wafficus | so with that in mind, is it: |
| 04:07.20 | Wafficus | defaults.pcm.!card Scarlett |
| 04:07.20 | Wafficus | defaults.ctl.!card Scarlett |
| 04:07.21 | Wafficus | defaults.pcm.!device 2 |
| 04:14.47 | sauron- | worked? |
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| 04:20.19 | gnarface | Wafficus: no, it's defaults.pcm.!card USB |
| 04:20.31 | gnarface | seems dumb, but that's the way i do it |
| 04:20.47 | gnarface | and device 0 i guess |
| 04:21.00 | gnarface | 0 should be the default |
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| 04:23.25 | Xenguy | likes the dumb way too |
| 04:24.00 | Wafficus | so it would be: |
| 04:24.08 | Xenguy | tada! |
| 04:24.23 | Wafficus | defaults.pcm.!card USB |
| 04:24.23 | Wafficus | defaults.ctl.!card USB |
| 04:24.23 | Wafficus | defaults.pcm.!device 0 |
| 04:24.25 | Wafficus | right? |
| 04:24.34 | gnarface | yea, that should work |
| 04:24.46 | gnarface | if the driver is behaving itself, anyway |
| 04:24.48 | Wafficus | ok cool I'll try that thanks |
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| 16:32.40 | danuan | doing src builds with 100k - 500k of files over nfs is 5 -10 times slower then localy , isci can be faster but cannot be shared to multiple clients, anyone have any other ideas ? |
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| 17:54.07 | mason | danuan: distcc? |
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| 17:59.38 | danuan | compiling is not the problem , its access for 100k - 500k small files |
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| 18:02.35 | r3boot | mostly read? If so, you might be better off with some shared filesystem (ocfs, gluster etc) over iscsi |
| 18:02.51 | DHE | maybe we don't understand the problem. are you trying to do clustered compiling? |
| 18:03.02 | r3boot | If you also write a lot, distcc might be a better option tho |
| 18:03.42 | danuan | compile over a shared network filesystem that has too many small files |
| 18:05.07 | DHE | you're compiling with `make -jX` or equivalent for your toolset? maybe increase X? |
| 18:05.22 | DHE | it's not a great solution, but it's probably low effort |
| 18:05.39 | r3boot | Another option would be to separate reads from writes, and have your iscsi share ro-mounted on all boxen |
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| 18:06.48 | danuan | again isci is not an option since it is not a shared filesystem , and nfs has trouble with a shitload off small files |
| 18:08.28 | r3boot | If you mount the iscsi share readonly, you can get past the requirement for the single target |
| 18:08.36 | danuan | problem is not with compilation but accesss over netwrok to load of small files , zfs with sync=disabled is the best so far |
| 18:09.00 | r3boot | That way, you dont need a shared filesystem on it, and you're limited to the speed of passing packets to/from your SAN |
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| 18:10.11 | danuan | but then again only one client can write |
| 18:10.20 | r3boot | You can two-tier it |
| 18:10.46 | r3boot | Have one iscsi share for reading, with (eg) ext4 on it, and another one with some shared filesystem on it for the writes |
| 18:11.35 | r3boot | That will mean that you would need to patch the build process tho |
| 18:14.54 | r3boot | The biggest issue with shares is the global lock which needs to be acquired on all servers participating in the (write) share before you can write. But, you only need that lock for writes, not for reads (assuming you dont rewrite the sourcecode during build) |
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| 18:58.00 | gnarface | why not just set the build directory to be local so the nfs share is only doing reads during the compilation process? |
| 18:58.52 | gnarface | also i suspect that the problem nfs has with a flurry of small files would evaporate if it was backed by xfs instead |
| 19:07.02 | mns` | Guys, do we have any wallpaper for devuan chimaera? |
| 19:07.38 | gnarface | golinux: there's wallpaper already, isn't there? |
| 19:08.10 | gnarface | mns`: i know they have colors already. i doubt a wallpaper could be far behind |
| 19:13.47 | mns` | gnarface: oh, thx |
| 19:14.33 | mns` | kde is flying here :D |
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| 19:25.51 | fsmithred | yeah we have wallpaper for chimaera. I'll see if I can find it. |
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| 19:45.01 | mns` | fsmithred: please!!!! |
| 19:47.24 | fsmithred | working on it |
| 19:47.26 | golinux | https://git.devuan.org/devuan/documentation/src/branch/master/art/graphics |
| 19:47.49 | golinux | WM theme is also completed too. |
| 19:47.50 | mns` | fsmithred: nice! |
| 19:48.02 | mns` | golinux: thx! |
| 19:48.29 | golinux | Look for "deepsea" for Chimaera theme |
| 19:48.56 | fsmithred | https://git.devuan.org/devuan/documentation/src/branch/master/art/graphics/chimaera-deepsea/backgrounds |
| 19:49.13 | fsmithred | colors are final on the theme? |
| 19:49.40 | golinux | Except for openbox. |
| 19:50.00 | golinux | I keep fogetting because it is such a pain to do. |
| 19:50.02 | fsmithred | ok, I won't build it yet |
| 19:51.03 | golinux | I need to go down the hex rabbit hole later today |
| 19:51.09 | mns` | \o/ |
| 19:51.15 | mns` | brb |
| 19:51.20 | golinux | And who knows how many more |
| 19:51.38 | danuan | mns: if your major concern is wallpaper vs actual functionality of the distro then i would recommend you try ubuntu |
| 19:52.04 | gnarface | don't be mean |
| 19:52.20 | fsmithred | damn, one of the first things I do after an install is change the wallpaper |
| 19:52.25 | fsmithred | (don't tell golinux) |
| 19:52.27 | mns` | danuan: as i said already. My devuan chimaera with kde is flying ... |
| 19:53.07 | golinux | is insulted that the hours of work aren't appreciated by danuan |
| 19:53.43 | golinux | If I don't like the way it looks, I won't use it. Period. |
| 19:54.11 | mns` | danuan: also, i guess you are not a very good contribute right? cuz you have time to talk silly things with me |
| 19:54.17 | mns` | bbl |
| 19:54.52 | fsmithred | other way to look at it: If all we have to worry about is the background image, devuan must be working pretty well. |
| 19:58.51 | gnarface | well that's my take on it |
| 19:59.07 | gnarface | it's pretty quiet this morning, so i think there was room for volunteers to help test the theme on testing |
| 19:59.43 | gnarface | it's not the highest priority, but it needs to get done and nothing else apparently is broken at the moment so i'd say the timing is appropriate |
| 20:00.32 | gnarface | also, i'm pretty sure Ubuntu ships all the same exact wallpapers except for this one |
| 20:00.35 | mason | My background image is always a parchment map of Middle Earth. Doesn't matter if I'm using Devuan, FreeBSD, RHEL, Slackware, MacOS. It's weird how it just follows me around. |
| 20:01.03 | danuan | gnarface: is there particular areas where help is needed ? |
| 20:01.29 | mason | heads off to the post office. |
| 20:01.48 | gnarface | danuan: like i said, other than this theme at the moment nothing comes to mind, but i don't claim to be an authority on the matter, either. maybe ask around. |
| 20:06.07 | *** join/#devuan lurker (~user@shpd-95-53-172-249.vologda.ru) |
| 20:07.33 | gnarface | danuan> i can give you multiple backgrounds , but i do not think it is what devuan needs , its actual oldscool unix administrators support that matters |
| 20:08.06 | gnarface | ^ i don't disagree, but trying to pick a fight with me in private isn't going to convince me that you're being honest with me or yourself about your stated goal here |
| 20:08.24 | gnarface | you straight up told someone to install Ubuntu |
| 20:08.32 | gnarface | screw your head on straight |
| 20:11.11 | danuan | then what does devuan need ? |
| 20:12.00 | gnarface | right now? probably what we need most is more testing of ARM images |
| 20:12.37 | gnarface | but if you wanted to test chimera instead of just bagging on other people for your disapproval of their testing, i'm sure that would not be entirely wasted effort, either |
| 20:13.22 | gnarface | in general, the forumla should be "Am I helping, or am I stopping someone else from helping?" |
| 20:13.49 | gnarface | if you should ever come up with the latter as an answer, redirect your focus |
| 20:14.10 | danuan | then if it takes you only a second to respond does it mean you actually thinking about the response ? |
| 20:14.51 | gnarface | are you trying to test if i have op privileges to ban you? because i would have already if i did. |
| 20:15.01 | danuan | go ahead ! |
| 20:15.07 | *** part/#devuan leitz (~LeamHall@c-174-56-144-2.hsd1.sc.comcast.net) |
| 20:15.23 | gnarface | your reading comprehension is pretty low, too, is my analysis. re-read my last sentence. |
| 20:16.42 | gnarface | in fact, considering how badly wrong you got that one, i think you should re-read EVERYTHING i said this morning, and then spend a few hours thinking about your actions and what motivated you to behave this way. chances are you're projecting. |
| 20:17.15 | danuan | geesz , egoos flyin |
| 20:17.43 | *** join/#devuan IoFran (~Thunderbi@200.95.170.72) |
| 20:17.54 | gnarface | you're beneath me |
| 20:17.56 | danuan | please ban me |
| 20:24.45 | *** join/#devuan GNUmoon (~GNUmoon@gateway/tor-sasl/gnumoon) |
| 20:26.49 | *** join/#devuan n4dir (~n4dir@88.130.152.223) |
| 20:30.05 | gnarface | <danuan> just showed yourself for a kiddies that you are , didnt you ? |
| 20:30.11 | gnarface | ^ danuan stop harassing me |
| 20:30.55 | gnarface | you didn't win an argument, what you're doing is burning through the quiet good will of the people watching this channel who actually are in charge |
| 20:31.16 | gnarface | and it's not relevant to support, so no, i'm not going to keep engaging you about it |
| 20:31.32 | gnarface | and fix your fucking grammer |
| 20:31.36 | gnarface | grammar* |
| 20:33.06 | debdog | are these irc-bash thingies still a thing? |
| 20:41.09 | gnarface | danuan: stop whispering me, i mean ti |
| 20:41.33 | gnarface | danuan: you're proving that you know you lost the argument by trying to continue to provoke me in private, and frankly it's pretty stupid |
| 20:41.48 | danuan | :) |
| 20:42.33 | danuan | go call you parents about your abusing you ! |
| 20:43.37 | fsmithred | done now? If not, take it to OT |
| 20:55.37 | *** join/#devuan Chakpapa (~chakpapa@49.37.3.99) |
| 20:56.00 | Chakpapa | How usable is chimaera? |
| 20:56.12 | Chakpapa | bullseye is reaching Freeze. |
| 20:56.38 | danuan | like a hooker you pay up front |
| 20:57.05 | mns` | Chakpapa: I have a full working kde desktop |
| 20:57.10 | mns` | So far so good |
| 20:57.25 | gnarface | Chakpapa: everything is done except for the wallpaper :) |
| 20:57.48 | mns` | So ... there's no op here? |
| 20:57.51 | gnarface | Chakpapa: (no, i don't know, but a bunch of people are using it already) |
| 20:57.54 | Chakpapa | Lol @ wallpaper. Well I got mine. |
| 20:58.13 | Chakpapa | Well, will openrc-init be functional this time around? |
| 20:58.24 | fsmithred | a lot of stuff is already devuanized, so chimaera is in pretty good shape |
| 20:58.46 | gnarface | wasn't openrc functional last time around? or do you mean without depending on sysvinit parts? |
| 20:59.00 | Chakpapa | I am talking about openrc-init as PID0 |
| 20:59.09 | Chakpapa | OpenRC+openrc-init combination |
| 20:59.11 | Chakpapa | works in Gentoo |
| 20:59.17 | fsmithred | I think that's what it does when you install openrc |
| 20:59.27 | Chakpapa | in Devuan buster it was not compiled with the necessary scripts |
| 20:59.59 | Chakpapa | I am talking about this https://wiki.gentoo.org/wiki/OpenRC#openrc-init |
| 21:00.04 | Chakpapa | https://wiki.gentoo.org/wiki/OpenRC/openrc-init |
| 21:00.27 | gnarface | Chakpapa: in buster people were just replacing the debian one with the gentoo one, i dunno if the work to switch over to it ever got done. there was talk of it then there wasn't... |
| 21:00.32 | Chakpapa | This completely replaces and bypasses sysvinit |
| 21:01.30 | Chakpapa | This was the only thing I would like to see in Devuan. I mean of course "optionally" when someone selects the openrc option during installation |
| 21:01.33 | gnarface | Chakpapa: anyway i know that unofficial packages were built and floating around, building it yourself wasn't known to be a hard task, and i think someone demonstrated a simple file move or rename fix to the existing package to make it do the same |
| 21:01.37 | fsmithred | yeah, I just booted a beowulf openrc live-iso and /proc/1/comm is init |
| 21:01.48 | fsmithred | if you install runit, you get runit as pid 1 |
| 21:02.05 | fsmithred | but it still uses the sysvinit scripts |
| 21:02.10 | Chakpapa | is talking about /sbin/openrc-init as PID1 :P |
| 21:02.47 | Chakpapa | I mean its not a critical thing as such. Was just wondering if anyone looked into it |
| 21:03.03 | Chakpapa | Although in the long run I would definitely like to see s6 getting adapted more |
| 21:03.07 | Chakpapa | Seems promising |
| 21:03.11 | fsmithred | I'm not aware of anyone doing much work on openrc in devuan |
| 21:03.37 | fsmithred | I know parazyd did some work on it, but that was probably two years ago |
| 21:03.50 | Chakpapa | So most people just stick to sysvinit? |
| 21:03.55 | gnarface | people definitely looked into it, just nothing officially got done. people did build and install the gentoo implementation though. i think not just in beowulf, also in ascii |
| 21:04.09 | gnarface | most people do just stick to sysvinit, or the openrc+sysvinit combo which debian did have good reasons for |
| 21:04.46 | gnarface | and we do provide support for sysvinit here, it's not a complex beast |
| 21:04.47 | fsmithred | I know there are some people using openrc and there are some using runit |
| 21:05.19 | fsmithred | and there's some work being done on s6 |
| 21:05.45 | Chakpapa | I mean the sysvinit+OpenRC (As the helper) is definitely the predominant even in Gentoo. OpenRC+openrc-init is relatively new |
| 21:05.46 | fsmithred | if you have an itch, scratch it |
| 21:06.35 | gnarface | Chakpapa: if you want to test someone else's openrc-init build, hang around and someone usually will present theirs eventually |
| 21:06.43 | fsmithred | does it need something to replace the init scripts? |
| 21:07.47 | gnarface | doesn't it just use some sort of condensed start list like BSD rc? |
| 21:07.49 | fsmithred | I haven't played with openrc at all, despite the fact that I've made live-isos that use it. I didn't have to do anything different. |
| 21:08.02 | gnarface | i don't remember how it works anymore, i used it for a little on gentoo in 2006 |
| 21:08.45 | fsmithred | with runit, each service gets a directory with run files |
| 21:09.05 | fsmithred | and I've only seen the ones for the gettys. They are short. |
| 21:09.25 | gnarface | i also really thought someone had simple hack to make the native openrc build behave like the gentoo one just by replacing the init binary with a symlink or something like that. anyone remember? |
| 21:09.29 | Chakpapa | openrc-init Doesn't exactly "replaces" init scripts. It expects them to be in /etc/init.d ... It just replaces sysvinit as PID0 and takes over completely. shutdown / reboot is handled by openrc-shutdown in that case |
| 21:13.30 | gnarface | <danuan> if you need an ego boost go an jog or something , but misinforming people about few command you looked up on google is not it |
| 21:13.37 | Chakpapa | Debian should have made systemd as "optional" instead of the other way around. Similar to Gentoo. : / |
| 21:13.42 | gnarface | ^ danuan. i mean it. stop whispering me. you lost the fucking argument now deal with it |
| 21:17.48 | *** join/#devuan jathan (~jathan@69.61.93.38) |
| 21:22.44 | mns` | cmd: Distributor ID:Devuan |
| 21:22.45 | mns` | cmd: Description:Devuan GNU/Linux 4 (chimaera/ceres) |
| 21:22.47 | mns` | cmd: Release:testing/unstable |
| 21:22.48 | mns` | cmd: Codename:n/a |
| 21:22.51 | mns` | for the jealous |
| 21:23.00 | mns` | screams! |
| 21:25.14 | *** join/#devuan giricz81 (~giricz81@ip4-83-240-38-90.cust.nbox.cz) |
| 21:26.52 | *** join/#devuan o01eg (~o01eg@2a02:2698:82a:2335:76:b4a3:7633:32ed) |
| 21:29.28 | Chakpapa | mns`, use "SID" + "Experimental" :P |
| 21:29.30 | Chakpapa | lmao |
| 21:31.07 | mns` | Chakpapa: sure, in a vm :D |
| 21:31.24 | Chakpapa | lol |
| 21:31.28 | *** join/#devuan IoFran2 (~Thunderbi@200.95.170.72) |
| 21:32.10 | xinomilo | experimental isn't a real dist |
| 21:32.23 | Chakpapa | I know. Was just joking |
| 21:32.27 | xinomilo | :) |
| 21:32.33 | Chakpapa | Its more like a staging area before SID |
| 21:33.39 | n4dir | experimental can be interesting if the freeze is so cold that even Sid feels static. But i don't recall ever installed anything from it |
| 21:34.09 | gnarface | i needed it once for a couple weeks for nvidia drivers that World of Warcraft required that were crashing everything else |
| 21:34.22 | n4dir | yeah, like that. it can happen |
| 21:34.28 | gnarface | (discovered the hard way why they were not in unstable yet) |
| 21:35.29 | n4dir | if it wouldn't have been mentioned here right now, i probably would not even think of it. You hear of it like twice a year, if at all |
| 21:36.36 | *** join/#devuan cd (~cd@unaffiliated/cd) |
| 21:36.57 | tuxd3v | hello all, I need the plugin for geany, to debug software |
| 21:37.38 | tuxd3v | I installed packages: geany geany-common geany-plugin-addons geany-plugins-common |
| 21:37.43 | systemdlete | https://support.mozilla.org/en-US/questions/982480 |
| 21:38.20 | tuxd3v | but when i go to tools > plugin Manager, I on't find the debugger :/ |
| 21:38.37 | systemdlete | This makes me want to scream! The mozilla person seems to refuse to acknowledge that the bug is in firefox code. Just admit it, then proceed to fix it. The poor reporter has to reiterate the same info at least 3 times. |
| 21:39.05 | systemdlete | I am so ready for a different browser that is not firefox/mozilla based. I just might switch to chromium, but that also has its own issues... |
| 21:39.46 | systemdlete | I have to wonder if mozilla devs understand the concept of test-before-release. |
| 21:40.07 | systemdlete | (this problem did not exist before the latest firefox upgrade) |
| 21:40.13 | systemdlete | fix one, break two |
| 21:40.52 | nemo | systemdlete: yeah, their whole new DoH system was specifically designed to avoid ISPs snooping on DNS requests. buuut it's supposed to detect when one is on "corporate" and disable itself |
| 21:41.13 | nemo | systemdlete: I guess the issue is sometimes corporate not being detected |
| 21:41.22 | nemo | in any case fix is simple, just turn off DoH |
| 21:42.15 | nemo | similar to my corporation deliberately MitMing everything on enter on their land. Firefox detects this, you get a brief error hitting an external site then it immediately turns off cert protections with an "enterprise mitm" flag |
| 21:42.23 | systemdlete | DNS over http is not enabled. |
| 21:43.08 | *** join/#devuan ac_laptop (~ac_laptop@186.2.247.129) |
| 21:43.22 | systemdlete | ie, it seems to already be disabled |
| 21:43.24 | systemdlete | ?? |
| 21:43.25 | nemo | systemdlete: ah. I should've read https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=408669 |
| 21:43.29 | nemo | I understand the issue better now |
| 21:43.55 | nemo | I haven't used anything but VPNs and such in years. |
| 21:44.12 | nemo | I see |
| 21:44.12 | nemo | "this is by design - there is not one unified view of DNS, and when you are using a proxy you are proxying the DNS to that view. |
| 21:44.16 | nemo | You can however use DNS explicitly within a .PAC script" |
| 21:44.23 | nemo | I have no idea if that is a legitimate thing to say or not |
| 21:44.42 | nemo | I'm totally unfamiliar with this subject area, so no idea if you're right or if Patrick is |
| 21:45.06 | nemo | I do know "works in other browsers" does have some weight with them sometimes. maybe file a new bug with this angle? |
| 21:45.08 | systemdlete | I'm not on a VPN. |
| 21:45.20 | systemdlete | This is my own home desktop PC. |
| 21:45.25 | systemdlete | It was working yesterday. |
| 21:45.27 | nemo | systemdlete: but using SOCKS or somesuch right? |
| 21:45.37 | systemdlete | not sure |
| 21:45.41 | nemo | that seems to be what that bug is all about |
| 21:45.50 | systemdlete | I am using dnsmasq on openwrt router |
| 21:46.01 | nemo | that's not a problem |
| 21:46.07 | systemdlete | shouldn't be, no |
| 21:46.20 | systemdlete | how to check if I'm using socks? |
| 21:46.32 | systemdlete | presence of library? |
| 21:46.45 | nemo | heh. if you aren't sure, you almost certainly aren't |
| 21:47.06 | systemdlete | I do not recall doing anything specifically when I installed this machine. |
| 21:47.19 | gnarface | tuxd3v: did you try installing package "geany-plugin-debugger" or running "apt-cache search ^geany-" ...? |
| 21:47.23 | nemo | systemdlete: â¡âPreferencesâGeneralâNetwork Settings |
| 21:47.31 | nemo | systemdlete: same place you'd go to make sure DoH is turned off |
| 21:47.51 | systemdlete | yeah. Like I said, DoH is disabled (not checked) |
| 21:47.54 | nemo | systemdlete: interesting. there's even a "proxy dns" flag in there, so that bug is probably way out of date |
| 21:48.02 | tuxd3v | gnarface, doesn't exist at least with that name :/ |
| 21:48.04 | nemo | systemdlete: and "no proxy" set? |
| 21:48.09 | systemdlete | right |
| 21:48.19 | systemdlete | lol |
| 21:48.23 | gnarface | tuxd3v: oh. i see it on ceres. maybe check backports? |
| 21:48.49 | systemdlete | hey nemo, thanks for responding. Appreciate it. |
| 21:48.51 | nemo | systemdlete: and, this is a bit silly, but if you just do "dig" or "ping" everything is fine right? and your dnsmasq doesn't have any bugs w/ AAAA requests? |
| 21:49.07 | systemdlete | oh yeah. Works from command line, chromium browser, etc |
| 21:49.22 | systemdlete | and I can enter the IP explicitly and it works |
| 21:49.22 | nemo | systemdlete: I had issues years ago in firefox due to defaulting to IPv6 plus severely buggy corporate DNS |
| 21:49.24 | tuxd3v | nope, not it backports |
| 21:49.27 | tuxd3v | :( |
| 21:49.54 | nemo | systemdlete: network.dns.disableIPv6;true would take care of that |
| 21:50.39 | systemdlete | Are you saying you believe that I am running into a ipv6 problem? Or is that to correct a different problem? |
| 21:51.06 | gnarface | tuxd3v: i'm not seeing it at pkginfo.devuan.org either, but i don't know if that's a bug with pkginfo.devuan.org or not, because i see it here in my local package cache for ceres. |
| 21:51.24 | gnarface | tuxd3v: either way, you might end up having to build it yourself |
| 21:51.51 | nemo | systemdlete: I do not know... maybe test with dig, and with that flag set |
| 21:52.05 | nemo | systemdlete: I'm trying to think of anything that could explain differing behaviour w/ proxy and DoH disabled |
| 21:52.23 | nemo | systemdlete: at that point it really should just be using system DNS - IPv4 vs IPv6 is typically the only variation |
| 21:52.32 | systemdlete | I'm trying to think of anything that could explain differing behavior from yesterday! |
| 21:52.44 | nemo | systemdlete: firefox version update? ⺠|
| 21:52.48 | systemdlete | The only thing I can think of is the upgrade. |
| 21:52.50 | systemdlete | (yes) |
| 21:53.02 | nemo | systemdlete: ok. well that's easy enough to test, just try an older firefox zip |
| 21:53.07 | nemo | systemdlete: there's tons of them on the firefox website |
| 21:53.13 | systemdlete | ugh. |
| 21:53.25 | nemo | systemdlete: http://ftp.mozilla.org/pub/firefox/nightly/ grab one from a year ago, unzip it |
| 21:53.33 | nemo | no need to even bisect at least at first |
| 21:53.33 | systemdlete | nah |
| 21:53.43 | systemdlete | I am certain that is the issue. |
| 21:53.45 | tuxd3v | its a problem in pkginfo.devuan.org |
| 21:53.48 | systemdlete | They "fixed" something. |
| 21:53.54 | tuxd3v | it exists in amd64 |
| 21:54.00 | tuxd3v | but not in i386 |
| 21:54.01 | tuxd3v | https://pkginfo.devuan.org/cgi-bin/policy-query.html?c=package&q=geany-plugin-debugger |
| 21:54.05 | nemo | systemdlete: ok, well, only flag I can think to try is that IPv6 thing. and maybe check the changelog |
| 21:54.32 | nemo | systemdlete: I *have* gotten things fixed in past by reporting a problem after having bisected. it's a little tedious to do, but they have a tool for it |
| 21:54.54 | nemo | https://github.com/mozilla/mozregression |
| 21:55.11 | nemo | usually just takes like a dozen tries even with a broad range |
| 21:55.15 | nemo | yay binary searches |
| 21:55.28 | systemdlete | Yeah, it looks like the mozilla tech has filed a bug already |
| 21:55.36 | nemo | systemdlete: oh? link? now I'm curious |
| 21:55.39 | systemdlete | and there will be yay more no doubt |
| 21:55.47 | systemdlete | look at the end of the link I gave above |
| 21:55.51 | nemo | I did |
| 21:55.59 | nemo | that's the one I was referencing |
| 21:56.02 | nemo | that's an old ticket |
| 21:56.03 | systemdlete | did you see where the tech offered to file a bug for it? |
| 21:56.07 | nemo | closed WONTFIX |
| 21:56.07 | systemdlete | not that old |
| 21:56.12 | nemo | ok. then wrong reference |
| 21:56.14 | nemo | link me to right one? |
| 21:56.42 | systemdlete | Oh you are right -- I was looking at the january part -- didn't notice the year (7 years ago) |
| 21:56.59 | nemo | yeah. and that is probably addressed by that "Proxy DNS requests" checkbox in the dialog you were in |
| 21:57.00 | systemdlete | but still, the bug was fixed... and now re-appears |
| 21:57.10 | nemo | might be something totally and wildly different. |
| 21:57.18 | nemo | for one thing you aren't using proxy |
| 21:57.25 | systemdlete | nemo: What I want to do is get away from constant buggy releases. |
| 21:58.00 | nemo | nature of software dev... I can't get too upset about it. they broke all my internet at work due to the MitM they were doing corrupting SSL |
| 21:58.02 | systemdlete | It seems like every time they release a new version, it introduces new problems. I wish I could just get security updates and experiment with new features at my own discretion. |
| 21:58.05 | nemo | that's hardly Firefox' fault |
| 21:58.14 | systemdlete | no it's not the nature of software dev |
| 21:58.15 | nemo | then there was the browser crashing because Cylance was injecting itself into the process |
| 21:58.25 | systemdlete | I've worked in environments where such releases would never be allowed. |
| 21:58.38 | nemo | systemdlete: the problem (for you) is that it works for absolutely everyone else ð |
| 21:58.47 | nemo | systemdlete: mozilla has one of the largest test systems out there. |
| 21:58.49 | systemdlete | But this is going to be a philosophical, not technical, disagreement. |
| 21:59.02 | systemdlete | (yeah, right) |
| 21:59.22 | nemo | yes. right. |
| 21:59.43 | tuxd3v | gnarface, ouch... its not in beowulf |
| 21:59.54 | nemo | systemdlete: $ unzip -l mozilla_try-2021-01-08.zip | wc -l |
| 21:59.54 | nemo | 286555 |
| 22:00.08 | tuxd3v | I can't find it also on debian-buster |
| 22:00.11 | nemo | a quarter of a million tests run each time they push something. not counting the tests run on nightly users |
| 22:00.11 | systemdlete | no, thanks. |
| 22:00.43 | systemdlete | so if they do all this testing, how did this (old!) bug creep back in? |
| 22:00.46 | tuxd3v | How can this guys compile a tool suite, for compiling code, and forget about the most important thing in the hole process... yeah the debugger :/ |
| 22:00.50 | nemo | systemdlete: because it's a different bug |
| 22:00.52 | systemdlete | not impressed here... sorry |
| 22:00.54 | nemo | systemdlete: with similar symptoms |
| 22:01.12 | nemo | systemdlete: have you tried the IPv6 thing yet? |
| 22:01.35 | nemo | systemdlete: file a new bug. do a quick bisect to give them a regression range. test in a clean profile, test with alternate DNS servers |
| 22:01.36 | systemdlete | it's the symptoms that are tested normally. At least that is how the regression testing I've worked with. |
| 22:01.42 | nemo | systemdlete: give them all of this, I bet you'll get a quick fix |
| 22:01.47 | nemo | systemdlete: problem for you is it is fine for rest of us |
| 22:02.01 | nemo | systemdlete: my local DNS using gentoo + tinydns + dnscachex works just fine |
| 22:02.03 | nemo | local and remote |
| 22:02.12 | systemdlete | You are able to access local systems in firefox 78.7.0? |
| 22:02.14 | nemo | yes |
| 22:02.17 | nemo | systemdlete: both at work and home |
| 22:02.20 | nemo | all versions of firefox |
| 22:02.26 | systemdlete | why is it that chromium works then? |
| 22:02.32 | gnarface | tuxd3v: i gotta assume debian maintainers operating independently of the upstream project pulled it for whatever support related reason. |
| 22:02.36 | nemo | systemdlete: well. test clean profile. test different browser versions. |
| 22:02.44 | nemo | systemdlete: chrome could be doing DNS through google for all you know ð |
| 22:02.48 | gnarface | tuxd3v: try to build it yourself and maybe you'll run into the same problem, maybe not |
| 22:03.12 | systemdlete | how would google know the IP addresses of my local systems? |
| 22:03.24 | tuxd3v | gnarface, humm, I don't really have much options here , I will try to build it.. |
| 22:03.29 | systemdlete | No, chromium is using the same dns resolver as firefox ever has. |
| 22:03.34 | systemdlete | it has to be. |
| 22:03.35 | tuxd3v | many thanks for the heal, as usual :) |
| 22:04.06 | nemo | systemdlete: yeah, I just retested in a nightly firefox. hit internal unpublished no problem |
| 22:04.09 | nemo | HTTP, HTTPS |
| 22:04.14 | nemo | worked same, apart from HTTPS erroring ofc |
| 22:04.19 | systemdlete | and if it doesn't work for ipv4 or ipv6, it wouldn't likely work for the other. Also, I only have ipv4 addresses defined in my openwrt. |
| 22:04.39 | nemo | systemdlete: yeah. I just use IPv4 too |
| 22:04.45 | systemdlete | I'll just use the ip addresses for now. |
| 22:04.51 | nemo | systemdlete: on the other hand firefox does do IPv6 by default |
| 22:04.51 | systemdlete | Or maybe I'll switch to chromium. |
| 22:04.55 | nemo | systemdlete: have you tested in a clean profile yet? |
| 22:05.02 | nemo | systemdlete: have you tried turning off that IPv6 yet? |
| 22:05.08 | systemdlete | ^ |
| 22:05.25 | *** join/#devuan mns` (~mns@191.253.156.197) |
| 22:06.07 | systemdlete | Or maybe I should just power down the computer and read a book instead... ! |
| 22:06.45 | systemdlete | sorry nemo. I'm just tired of chasing down bugs for the moment. I'll just wait until ff fixes it. It shouldnt' be very long |
| 22:07.14 | nemo | systemdlete: it'll get fixed a lot faster if you help. 'cause, yeah, it's fine for rest of us ð |
| 22:07.20 | nemo | oh well. whatev |
| 22:07.48 | systemdlete | are you using 78.7.0esr? |
| 22:08.01 | nemo | systemdlete: yes. and *I* unlike you, used a clean profile ð |
| 22:08.06 | nemo | well in part 'cause I usually don't use ESR |
| 22:09.59 | systemdlete | yes, a new profile works |
| 22:10.10 | systemdlete | I'd rather not have to reset it all though |
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| 22:11.09 | systemdlete | is there a way to sort of "export/import" the settings from one profile to another? |
| 22:11.15 | systemdlete | (I doubt it ofc) |
| 22:11.23 | nemo | systemdlete: there's a few ways |
| 22:11.27 | nemo | systemdlete: there's the profile sync feature |
| 22:11.39 | nemo | systemdlete: there's copying over key files (like prefs.js) |
| 22:11.55 | systemdlete | actually, prefs.js should be enough right? |
| 22:11.58 | nemo | systemdlete: but really, if one works and the other doesn't, usual suspect is extensions or config settings |
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| 22:12.04 | nemo | I'd definitely start with prefs.js |
| 22:12.15 | nemo | bonus if it breaks new one, it gives you a reduced set to check |
| 22:12.42 | nemo | systemdlete: depends what you want in the new profile really |
| 22:13.01 | systemdlete | ah, thank you nemo! I forgot all about those extensions |
| 22:13.06 | nemo | O_o |
| 22:13.13 | systemdlete | I have a few, and they might even be conflicting with each other! |
| 22:13.21 | systemdlete | hits himself, hard! |
| 22:13.28 | nemo | that's why first step in #firefox support is "test in clean profile" |
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| 22:13.39 | nemo | avoids extension and pref config issues due to years of customisation |
| 22:13.45 | nemo | which isn't to say they didn't break something in a new release |
| 22:13.52 | nemo | but usually explains why no one else ran into it |
| 22:14.00 | systemdlete | I have decentraleyes, privacybadger, ublock origin, AND ddg privacy |
| 22:14.05 | nemo | hmmm |
| 22:14.07 | nemo | I use those too |
| 22:14.12 | systemdlete | all 4? |
| 22:14.15 | nemo | well... haven't used privacybadger in a while |
| 22:14.23 | systemdlete | OK, I'll disable that |
| 22:14.23 | nemo | I use decentraleyes, umatrix, and noscript. |
| 22:14.26 | nemo | I've never used ublock origin |
| 22:14.33 | nemo | ok. I don't use *all* of them ⺠|
| 22:14.40 | nemo | but also they are pretty major projects.. |
| 22:15.11 | nemo | systemdlete: you mean https://addons.mozilla.org/fr/firefox/addon/duckduckgo-for-firefox/ right? |
| 22:15.24 | nemo | I do have that one in a profile, but obv not in an ESR one. hm. |
| 22:15.31 | systemdlete | "duckduckgo privacy essentials" |
| 22:15.35 | nemo | umm sorry for the /fr/ link |
| 22:16.09 | systemdlete | yep. privacy badger |
| 22:16.22 | nemo | systemdlete: interesting. I haven't used privacybadger in a while |
| 22:16.24 | systemdlete | now it works. ty again for your patience with this old pita |
| 22:16.41 | nemo | shrugs |
| 22:16.43 | systemdlete | I think the others will provide enough protection for my tastes |
| 22:17.07 | nemo | systemdlete: maybe report bug against privacy badger? |
| 22:17.21 | systemdlete | or maybe I just need to do an update for it? |
| 22:17.32 | tuxd3v | heal-> help |
| 22:18.20 | systemdlete | (tuxd3v: Help *is* healing!) |
| 22:18.25 | systemdlete | (so it's ok) |
| 22:18.30 | nemo | systemdlete: I'd been kinda relying on firefox built-in tracking protection and noscript/umatrix these days. |
| 22:18.39 | systemdlete | and nemo: Thank you for helping me "heal" MY system. |
| 22:18.42 | tuxd3v | systemdlete, indeed hehe :) |
| 22:21.30 | systemdlete | nemo: So I disabled the addon, enabled auto updates, re-enabled the addon, restarted browser, and now all is working like yesterday! |
| 22:21.50 | nemo | systemdlete: oh. you had auto updates of addons turned off too? |
| 22:22.13 | systemdlete | so it seems more likely that there was a problem with the update of privacy badger from Feb 2 (last update) |
| 22:22.13 | nemo | I guess that's a good paranoia measure, but I mean... mozilla *does* do review of extensions at least... ⺠|
| 22:22.57 | systemdlete | but it is still showing feb 2 last update |
| 22:22.59 | systemdlete | hmmm. |
| 22:23.22 | systemdlete | maybe when I did all that disabling and re-enabling, it updated some data? |
| 22:23.37 | systemdlete | or otherwise reset itself |
| 22:23.59 | nemo | orrr they did a bugfix release same day.. |
| 22:24.33 | nemo | "Remove pixel cookie sharing detection for now " |
| 22:24.41 | nemo | no idea what that was, but "remove for now" is never a good sign ⺠|
| 22:24.59 | systemdlete | what is pixel cookie sharing? |
| 22:25.10 | systemdlete | where is that? |
| 22:25.13 | nemo | systemdlete: I guess they mean tracking pixels + cookies |
| 22:25.15 | nemo | https://github.com/EFForg/privacybadger/commits/master |
| 22:25.22 | nemo | systemdlete: I was just looking for commits same day as the release |
| 22:25.25 | systemdlete | oh, I see. |
| 22:25.29 | systemdlete | in the source, right. |
| 22:26.13 | systemdlete | again, thank you so much for pointing me to a solution, whatever crazy thing it ends up being. |
| 22:26.24 | systemdlete | and sorry for being such a crab about it all |
| 22:26.36 | systemdlete | you don't deserve that. You are trying to help. |
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