00:20.28 | *** join/#devuan attos (~nix@x4db54028.dyn.telefonica.de) |
00:22.52 | *** join/#devuan attos (~nix@x4db54028.dyn.telefonica.de) |
00:25.12 | *** join/#devuan IoFran2 (~Thunderbi@189.154.19.116) |
00:35.47 | *** join/#devuan xcm (~xcm@ipa210.225.tellas.gr) |
00:37.05 | *** join/#devuan targz (~Thunderbi@unaffiliated/targz) |
00:46.54 | *** join/#devuan IoFran2 (~Thunderbi@189.154.19.116) |
00:58.29 | *** join/#devuan Centurion_Dan (~Thunderbi@devuan/developer/centuriondan) |
00:59.29 | *** join/#devuan unixman_home (~unixman2@144-224-4-64.mtawireless.com) |
00:59.29 | *** join/#devuan unixman_home (~unixman2@unaffiliated/eracc) |
01:08.31 | *** join/#devuan xcm (~xcm@ipa210.225.tellas.gr) |
01:15.35 | *** join/#devuan xrogaan (~xrogaan@unaffiliated/xrogaan) |
01:21.19 | *** join/#devuan cynicfm (~filip@public-gprs394587.centertel.pl) |
01:59.27 | *** join/#devuan xrogaan (~xrogaan@unaffiliated/xrogaan) |
02:17.32 | *** join/#devuan Xenguy (~Xenguy@devuan/community/Xenguy) |
02:17.38 | *** join/#devuan Peregrinus_ (~peregrinu@195.181.173.201) |
02:31.05 | *** join/#devuan attos1 (~nix@x4db4539f.dyn.telefonica.de) |
02:35.51 | *** join/#devuan IoFran (~Thunderbi@189.154.19.116) |
02:44.31 | *** join/#devuan tuxd3v (~tuxd3v@78-130-62-250.net.novis.pt) |
02:46.24 | *** join/#devuan nyov (~nyov@unaffiliated/nyov) |
03:06.14 | *** join/#devuan debdog (~debdog@2a00:79c0:639:6d00:7a24:afff:fe8a:d04d) |
03:30.57 | *** join/#devuan Stacker- (~stacker@gateway/tor-sasl/b616) |
03:42.19 | *** join/#devuan markizano (markizano@2600:3c00::f03c:91ff:fec8:382d) |
03:50.07 | *** join/#devuan hufdufhv (~Thunderbi@123.234.229.29) |
03:53.23 | *** join/#devuan hufdufhv1 (~Thunderbi@123.234.229.29) |
04:03.54 | *** join/#devuan debdog (~debdog@2a00:79c0:643:4500:7a24:afff:fe8a:d04d) |
04:07.13 | *** join/#devuan markizano (markizano@2600:3c00::f03c:91ff:fec8:382d) |
04:48.47 | *** join/#devuan obeardly (~obeardly@2603:3011:1661:0:9657:a5ff:feae:1552) |
04:54.17 | *** join/#devuan markizano (markizano@2600:3c00::f03c:91ff:fec8:382d) |
04:58.53 | *** join/#devuan IoFran (~Thunderbi@189.154.19.116) |
06:06.49 | *** join/#devuan infobot (ibot@c-174-52-60-165.hsd1.ut.comcast.net) |
06:06.49 | *** topic/#devuan is Welcome to Devuan! https://devuan.org | Releases: https://files.devuan.org (Jessie 1.0 old-stable, ASCII 2.1 stable) | | Conference (2019) https://www.dyne.org/the-first-devuan-conference/ | Forum https://dev1galaxy.org | Chanlogs http://maemo.cloud-7.de/irclogs/freenode/_devuan/ |
06:06.49 | *** mode/#devuan [+v infobot] by ChanServ |
06:16.52 | *** join/#devuan hufdufhv (~Thunderbi@123.234.229.29) |
06:34.17 | *** join/#devuan pandakekok9 (~pandakeko@gateway/tor-sasl/pandakekok9) |
06:37.51 | *** join/#devuan retak (~ite@2a01:c23:7844:b500:f2de:f1ff:feb2:f9aa) |
21:02.45 | *** join/#devuan infobot (ibot@c-174-52-60-165.hsd1.ut.comcast.net) |
21:02.45 | *** topic/#devuan is Welcome to Devuan! https://devuan.org | Releases: https://files.devuan.org (Jessie 1.0 old-stable, ASCII 2.1 stable) | | Conference (2019) https://www.dyne.org/the-first-devuan-conference/ | Forum https://dev1galaxy.org | Chanlogs http://maemo.cloud-7.de/irclogs/freenode/_devuan/ |
21:02.45 | *** mode/#devuan [+v infobot] by ChanServ |
21:03.52 | surrealpie | failed to fetch: http://auto.mirror.devuan.org/merged/dists/jessie/main/binary-armhf/Packages 404 Not Found [IP: 185.38.15.91 80] |
21:04.37 | surrealpie | when i look on the repo there is no file named "Packages", although there is "Packages.gz" and "Packages.xz" but i don't know if that's the problem |
21:06.24 | onefang | That IP is a little odd. Are you sure it's 185.38.15.91 and not 185.38.15.81? |
21:06.59 | onefang | You should be using deb.devuan.org instead of auto.mirror.devuan.org. |
21:07.44 | onefang | And most, if not all, Packages fil/es are present on the mirrors as the Packages.gz and Packages.xz files you saw. |
21:09.36 | onefang | In this particular case, it is indeed the .gz and .xz versions in that directory. |
21:11.50 | surrealpie | oops yeah, its 81, not 91 |
21:12.28 | onefang | .81 is my mirror, .91 isn't a Devuan mirror. |
21:12.45 | surrealpie | yeah the error i get says 81, i just typo'd |
21:13.42 | surrealpie | i will try deb.devuan.org |
21:14.30 | onefang | merged/dists/jessie/main/binary-armhf/Packages should not exist on any mirror, only the .gz and .xz versions. |
21:15.53 | surrealpie | alright, so apt is just not showing the .gz in message |
21:16.12 | surrealpie | i changed the /etc/apt/sources.list |
21:16.16 | surrealpie | to lines like |
21:16.19 | surrealpie | deb http://deb.devuan.org/merged jessie-security main |
21:16.21 | *** join/#devuan Uberius (~Uberius@gateway/tor-sasl/uberius) |
21:16.28 | surrealpie | instead of auto.mirror.devuan.org |
21:18.56 | *** join/#devuan morruth (~quassel@77.244.126.23) |
21:19.27 | surrealpie | i still get similar messages |
21:19.30 | surrealpie | https://pastebin.com/ggqZ9qLj |
21:20.17 | surrealpie | but now GPG error |
21:21.35 | surrealpie | with auto.mirror.devuan.org i don't have the GPG error |
21:21.49 | onefang | Ah, jessie-updates doesn't exist anymore. |
21:22.56 | onefang | I think that's coz Beowulf hos become, or is about to become, stable, so ASCII is old stable, and only jessie-security gets updates. |
21:23.27 | onefang | Or maybe not just yet. |
21:23.40 | onefang | Try removing jessie-updates. |
21:32.30 | golinux | auto.mirror has been deprecated for a long time. |
21:45.14 | fsmithred | surrealpie, when was the last time you did update/upgrade? |
21:46.51 | fsmithred | make sure you have the newest devuan-keyring |
21:47.15 | surrealpie | yeah, i installed an image but i just realized its from 2017 |
21:47.24 | surrealpie | https://files.devuan.org/devuan_jessie/embedded/ |
21:47.30 | *** join/#devuan IoFran2 (~Thunderbi@189.154.19.116) |
21:47.32 | surrealpie | lol |
21:48.01 | fsmithred | yeah, latest devuan-keyring is 2017.10.03 |
21:48.08 | fsmithred | newer than those images |
21:48.18 | fsmithred | is there some reason you must use jessie? |
21:48.20 | onefang | That'll be why you have deprecated sources and outdated keyring. |
21:48.39 | gnarface | i think they did remove jessie-backports, jessie-security, and jessie-updates |
21:48.42 | surrealpie | there seems to be a more recent one, i will try that |
21:49.00 | onefang | jessie-security is still there. |
21:49.07 | gnarface | surrealpie: yes, you'll want to try ascii first unless you're in a weird situation |
21:50.02 | surrealpie | weird link from another site got me this old image and i didn't look if it was new |
21:50.28 | surrealpie | although the newest one is still from 2018 but with newer version |
21:50.38 | gnarface | https://files.devuan.org/ |
21:51.27 | gnarface | poke around in here a bit, this one is official |
21:51.31 | fsmithred | ascii will work better |
21:51.36 | surrealpie | yeah that's what i got |
21:51.47 | surrealpie | i mean the link |
21:51.53 | surrealpie | gonna go with ascii |
21:52.56 | surrealpie | thx guys |
21:53.07 | onefang | You are welcome. |
21:53.09 | gnarface | good luck. we'll be here if you need us. |
22:02.07 | DanielTheFox | hi there guys |
22:03.01 | DanielTheFox | what desktop environment and/or window manager do you recommend me for lightweight (disk and/or RAM) portable (USB HDD) Devuan usage? |
22:03.59 | fsmithred | xfce is the default and is pretty light |
22:04.25 | DanielTheFox | has anyone used i3wm btw? (just out of curiosity) |
22:04.54 | fsmithred | yes, there are at least a couple of derivative distros that have offered live-isos with i3 |
22:05.10 | DanielTheFox | how it feels like? |
22:05.20 | DanielTheFox | can it display VLC, for instance? |
22:05.26 | DanielTheFox | or just terminals? |
22:05.43 | fsmithred | I assume it can display any graphical apps. |
22:05.59 | fsmithred | I only tried i3 once for a few minutes. |
22:06.21 | fsmithred | It's not clicky enough for my tastes, even though I always have at least one terminal open. |
22:06.48 | DanielTheFox | I'm very terminal-ish |
22:07.12 | DanielTheFox | although sometimes (rather rarely) I fire a GUI up in my main computer |
22:07.53 | DanielTheFox | just to browse stuff that requires JavaScript (normally I use links2) or whenever I want to test stuff like VLC |
22:08.00 | fsmithred | check out Star Linux or Miyolinux: https://dev1galaxy.org/viewforum.php?id=9 |
22:08.11 | *** join/#devuan voker57 (~quassel@kvirc/developer/Voker57) |
22:09.36 | DanielTheFox | also, what is recommended in case I'm not always online on that Devuan install? there appears to be only one DVD |
22:09.56 | fsmithred | correct |
22:10.15 | DanielTheFox | how can I host a local package mirror? (I only need i686) |
22:10.49 | DanielTheFox | that is, having set beforehand a size limit |
22:10.51 | fsmithred | I think someone posted instructions for that on the forum |
22:11.12 | DanielTheFox | like "I want to host a local mirror that is 8 GB" |
22:11.13 | fsmithred | I think someone said 14GB recently |
22:11.20 | DanielTheFox | oh |
22:11.21 | *** join/#devuan Shentino (~shentino@unaffiliated/shentino) |
22:11.31 | fsmithred | but that probably holds all arches |
22:11.46 | DanielTheFox | ok |
22:11.52 | DanielTheFox | I thought Devuan was larger |
22:11.59 | gnarface | DanielTheFox: how light do you need it to be? twm is still in the repos... |
22:12.19 | DanielTheFox | gnarface, if it fits in 192 MB RAM, it'll do |
22:12.32 | fsmithred | https://pkgmaster.devuan.org/devuan_mirror_walkthrough.txt |
22:12.39 | DanielTheFox | otherwise, I think I'm fine with xfce, or screen for pure tty1 guys like me |
22:12.47 | fsmithred | jwm and icewm use less than 192 |
22:12.56 | DanielTheFox | oh, like |
22:13.00 | DanielTheFox | the entire OS |
22:13.01 | fsmithred | xfce will if you make sure no extra stuff is running |
22:13.05 | DanielTheFox | including kernel, stuff, junk |
22:13.09 | DanielTheFox | but not cache |
22:14.05 | DanielTheFox | but I start believing I'm asking for either too minimalistic window managers, or for miracles |
22:14.27 | DanielTheFox | so I'll just stick with screen for low-RAM and non-GUI environments |
22:14.34 | onefang | The mirrors usually redirect packages we share with Debian to Debian mirrors, so your local mirror could be small if you are happy doing that to. |
22:14.49 | DanielTheFox | heh |
22:15.00 | DanielTheFox | ok, I'll read the walkthrough |
22:15.11 | rrq | the sum of all beowulf/main/i386 package sizes is 69,546,192,646 bytes |
22:15.11 | DanielTheFox | maybe I can make it fit within 10 GB |
22:15.25 | DanielTheFox | (installing only the most popular packages and their depends) |
22:15.48 | fsmithred | you might like the minimal-live iso |
22:16.10 | DanielTheFox | well |
22:16.14 | DanielTheFox | I'm sure I can do this tradeoff |
22:16.33 | DanielTheFox | a working install on said USB HDD should use as little space as possible |
22:16.55 | fsmithred | ok, minimal-live might be too bloated for your taste |
22:17.00 | DanielTheFox | however, I can afford to use some few GB (but not 50!) on my main HDD |
22:17.05 | rrq | all "required", "important" and "standard" packages fit within 4G |
22:17.53 | DanielTheFox | fsmithred, I'm happy if an installed and ready-to-work Devuan fits below 1.5 GB |
22:18.31 | fsmithred | that might be possible with gui. Not sure. |
22:18.46 | fsmithred | not a lot of apps, though |
22:19.02 | fsmithred | just cli system it's certainly possible (and pretty easy) |
22:19.16 | DanielTheFox | Debian without GUI does about 800 MB, but as soon as I decide to install screen, htop, wireless stuff, ffmpeg, mplayer, it gets dangerously close to that |
22:19.26 | DanielTheFox | that was, Debian 9 |
22:19.34 | fsmithred | 10 is bigger |
22:19.44 | fsmithred | that's always the case |
22:19.56 | DanielTheFox | yeah |
22:20.11 | DanielTheFox | but again |
22:20.16 | DanielTheFox | I think I'm asking for miracles |
22:20.37 | fsmithred | why 1.5GB? |
22:20.56 | DanielTheFox | because I want to keep the ext3 partition Devuan uses to a minimum |
22:21.10 | DanielTheFox | which I currently consider to be 3.5 GB |
22:21.14 | onefang | If I recall, my server OS is about 1.5 GB for the OS itself. |
22:21.16 | DanielTheFox | (the size of a 4 GB USB) |
22:21.30 | DanielTheFox | 3.5 - 1.5 = 2.0 |
22:21.32 | specing | DanielTheFox: why don't you use a filesystem with compression? |
22:21.45 | DanielTheFox | specing, the same system is expected to work on low-power machines |
22:21.53 | fsmithred | does the OS need to be rw, or would you be ok with read-only on the OS? |
22:21.55 | DanielTheFox | not just i7's all around the place |
22:22.00 | DanielTheFox | and, it needs to be RW |
22:22.02 | specing | DanielTheFox: de-compression is not that expensive compared to GUI |
22:22.18 | DanielTheFox | specing, what about compression? (writing to disk) :) |
22:22.23 | DanielTheFox | maybe that's all I need |
22:23.03 | specing | maybe |
22:23.05 | DanielTheFox | although I expect it to work on a Pentium III or a 2004 Celeron (the earliest systems that support USB booting) |
22:23.25 | onefang | Oh, under 1GB. B-) |
22:23.32 | specing | DanielTheFox: is that i686 even? |
22:23.38 | DanielTheFox | it is :P |
22:23.39 | fsmithred | lol, yes |
22:23.49 | specing | ah ok, Linux dropped <i586 support iirc |
22:23.52 | DanielTheFox | 586 is Pentium (right after 486) |
22:23.55 | fsmithred | 686 began with pentium-pro |
22:23.58 | DanielTheFox | 686 is probab-- |
22:24.04 | DanielTheFox | I was gonna say Pentium II or MMX |
22:24.12 | DanielTheFox | but I wasn't sure |
22:24.42 | *** join/#devuan gmaster (~gmaster@91.149.182.134) |
22:25.03 | fsmithred | another solution might be to use a bigger usb stick. |
22:25.17 | onefang | We still have Devuan ASCII for i386. |
22:25.26 | DanielTheFox | but oh well |
22:25.43 | DanielTheFox | I don't know anymore what exactly I want |
22:25.44 | fsmithred | i386 in name only. It's 686. |
22:26.02 | fsmithred | what's the goal? |
22:26.20 | DanielTheFox | other than replicating the 3-DVD Debian trick into a (faster and better) computer with spare HDD |
22:26.34 | DanielTheFox | we all know a DVD is 4.3 GiB |
22:26.55 | *** join/#devuan Shentino (~shentino@unaffiliated/shentino) |
22:27.08 | DanielTheFox | (a KB and a KiB are both 2^10 to my eyes, so I may use them inconsistently) |
22:27.32 | DanielTheFox | Debian currently allows downloading three DVDs (the first one being 3.5 GiB) |
22:27.51 | DanielTheFox | 4.3 + 4.3 + 3.5 = 8.6 + 3.5 = 12.1 (?) |
22:27.54 | fsmithred | and I'll let you slide 'cause I always get confused by that math |
22:28.06 | DanielTheFox | I'm not sure either |
22:28.16 | DanielTheFox | so that's roughly 12 GiB |
22:28.40 | DanielTheFox | and I do have spare 12 GiB on my netbook |
22:28.57 | onefang | The math is simple, if you are a marketing person, use the bigger sounding numbers, if you are a programmer use powers of 2. B-) |
22:29.58 | DanielTheFox | onefang, I was born in 2001, but my favorite computers are all back when Microsoft's name was in every machine a regular household human could ever use |
22:29.59 | onefang | Everyone else has ten fingers, use powers of ten, unless you are from USA. |
22:30.33 | DanielTheFox | namely, C64 and no-brand 486-based computers are my favorites, despite not owning either |
22:31.07 | DanielTheFox | either Microsoft or IBM introduced the idea of 1 KB = 1024 bytes |
22:31.07 | onefang | I have a couple of 486 PCs here. |
22:31.41 | DanielTheFox | which was great in low-power CPUs in the 70s and 80s because it's easier to shift left 10 bits than to actually MUL by 1000 |
22:32.11 | onefang | And I'm three times your age. |
22:32.34 | DanielTheFox | namely, the 65XX CPUs (C64, NES, Apple II, Atari 2600) didn't have MUL (nor DIV) opcode, so a MUL requires dozens of cycles |
22:33.21 | DanielTheFox | a left shift uses 1 or 2 cycles per shifted bit (unless it was on RAM, which then becomes 7 cycles) |
22:35.00 | onefang | No need to give me a lesson in these sorts of things. I was programming them professionally back in the day. |
22:36.01 | *** join/#devuan mrpfilser (clort@gateway/shell/ircnow/x-cobuntjheplxxzzg) |
22:36.06 | DanielTheFox | great |
22:36.07 | mrpfilser | devuan beowulf: ibgtkmm-3.0-dev : Depends: libgtkmm-3.0-1v5 (= 3.24.0-2) but 3.24.2-1 is to be installed |
22:36.09 | DanielTheFox | so you know the drill |
22:36.14 | mrpfilser | can i force install libgtkmm-3.0-dev? |
22:36.50 | mrpfilser | or is this something that package maintainer should be informed-of? |
22:37.02 | mrpfilser | why is the depends "=" and not ">=" |
22:37.22 | mrpfilser | "your dependency is too new for me" i do not understand |
22:37.42 | fsmithred | 3.24.2-1 is in ceres, not beowulf |
22:38.09 | mrpfilser | i reupdate and retry |
22:38.15 | onefang | Sometimes newer versions deprecate then remove features, often coz they got replaced by a "better" way. |
22:38.15 | fsmithred | check sources.list |
22:38.53 | mrpfilser | all beowulf in sources.list all packages up-to-date. |
22:39.12 | onefang | Sometimes configuration options get changed gratuitously for each version, I'm looking at you tmux. |
22:40.12 | mrpfilser | can i force install apt install libgtkmm-3.0-1v5:3.24.0-2 |
22:40.15 | onefang | And sometimes package maintainers screw up. |
22:40.23 | mrpfilser | ? |
22:40.26 | fsmithred | mrpfilser, remove 'testing' from sources.list and replace it with 'beowulf' |
22:40.45 | mrpfilser | here is /etc/apt/sources.list http://0x0.st/zCSj.list |
22:42.11 | fsmithred | ok, then I don't know why apt wants to install a package from ceres |
22:42.32 | fsmithred | maybe try 'apt install libgtkmm-3.0-1v5=3.24.0-2' |
22:42.33 | mrpfilser | ah i am silly apt install libgtkmm-3.0-1v5=3.24.0-2 |
22:42.38 | mrpfilser | thank you fsmithred |
22:43.08 | fsmithred | I glad it works, but it still bugs me that apt wanted to do that |
22:43.56 | mrpfilser | who is the proper person to inform of this? |
22:44.25 | fsmithred | probably debian |
22:44.47 | golinux | mrpfilser: Please do not use "testing" in Devuan sources. It can put you into a world of hurt |
22:44.52 | fsmithred | he's not |
22:45.18 | mrpfilser | i send email to pkg-gnome-maintainers@lists.alioth.debian.org |
22:45.32 | fsmithred | I would try to figure out why it's doing that first |
22:45.53 | fsmithred | examine dependencies of the packages involved |
22:46.00 | fsmithred | something might be screwed up there |
22:48.28 | mrpfilser | this is a subbranch problem of a subbranch problem of my real goal so i have to prune it |
22:48.31 | mrpfilser | thanks again |
22:58.47 | *** join/#devuan IoFran2 (~Thunderbi@189.154.19.116) |
23:11.39 | *** join/#devuan xcm (~xcm@ipa210.225.tellas.gr) |
23:17.59 | *** join/#devuan IoFran2 (~Thunderbi@189.154.19.116) |
23:26.12 | *** join/#devuan ndo- (~ndo@unaffiliated/ndo-) |
23:26.17 | ndo- | hello |
23:38.04 | *** join/#devuan IoFran2 (~Thunderbi@189.154.19.116) |
23:38.45 | *** part/#devuan ndo- (~ndo@unaffiliated/ndo-) |
23:46.34 | *** join/#devuan ukine (~ukine@70.127.84.4) |
23:59.09 | *** join/#devuan IoFran2 (~Thunderbi@189.154.19.116) |