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| 01:30.45 | *** topic/#devuan is This is the Devuan https://devuan.org/ discussion channel | **You need to auth to nickserv to talk!** | Latest (2018-06-09): ASCII 2.0.0 https://devuan.org/os/debian-fork/ascii-stable-announce-060818 || Stable (2017-05-25): Jessie 1.0.0 LTS release | Devuan Forum: https://dev1galaxy.org/ | Chanlogs: http://maemo.cloud-7.de/irclogs/freenode/_devuan/ https://botbot.me/freenode/devuan |
| 01:30.46 | *** mode/#devuan [+v infobot] by ChanServ |
| 01:31.03 | furrywolf | the only thing I can find about it being dropped is "use pulseaudio". |
| 01:31.59 | gnarface | i agree with you that there's clearly an agenda |
| 01:32.26 | gnarface | i'm just saying they won't have left it at that. they'd have made sure to cram jam a monkey wrench in there somewhere to keep people from proving them wrong. |
| 01:33.01 | golinux | furrywolf: Try apulse |
| 01:33.32 | golinux | I haven't needed it yet hut many people have to get around PA |
| 01:33.36 | gnarface | will that work with bluetooth audio? i didn't think apulse was that fancy. |
| 01:33.53 | golinux | Dunno. Do some searches on the lists and forum |
| 01:33.55 | furrywolf | it sounds like there was a period where bluez-alsa did not work with bluez5, so they used that as justification for removing it, and never re-packaged it when it was as expectedly promptly fixed. |
| 01:34.22 | furrywolf | golinux: the topic is making bluetooth audio hardware work without pulse, not making applications work without pulse. :) |
| 01:34.39 | furrywolf | and how, as is getting increasingly typical, debian "accidentally" killed a way to not use pulse. |
| 01:35.00 | Centurion_Dan | furrywolf: do we need to build bluez-alsa for devuan? |
| 01:35.22 | Centurion_Dan | can somebody build it and prove it works?? |
| 01:35.55 | gnarface | my bluetooth dongle stopped working even earlier, so i can't |
| 01:36.07 | furrywolf | also, it looks like bluez dropped normal communications methods and started only talking over dbus, which was why bluez-alsa originally broke. |
| 01:36.25 | furrywolf | Centurion_Dan: I don't have any bluetooth hardware to test with. |
| 01:36.52 | gnarface | i have this one bluetooth dongle that worked in kernel 3.1 |
| 01:36.59 | gnarface | not a version before or after |
| 01:38.07 | gnarface | i tried to file a bug report and the maintainer told me if i could find the bug myself and point it out to him he'd fix it, but only if i also mailed him the hardware (which he could only say he would almost certainly not bother returning) |
| 01:39.06 | gnarface | so i went to radio shack and bought a 12' headphone cable |
| 01:39.11 | gnarface | problem solved |
| 01:39.15 | furrywolf | https://www.raspberrypi.org/blog/raspbian-stretch/ raspbian packages and uses bluez-alsa themselves to make bluetooth work from rpis without pulse. |
| 01:40.06 | furrywolf | "From a user point of view, everything should still work exactly as before â the only change is that if you still wish to use PulseAudio for some other reason, you will need to install it yourself." I like these people! |
| 01:40.30 | gnarface | interesting |
| 01:40.39 | gnarface | i wonder if pulse finally proved too heavy for the rpi cpu |
| 01:41.00 | gnarface | well if they made it work with raspbian it might still require systemd somehow though |
| 01:41.01 | gnarface | right? |
| 01:41.03 | furrywolf | and/or too utter shit. |
| 01:41.22 | gnarface | no, raspbian doesn't give a crap about reliability |
| 01:41.36 | furrywolf | lol |
| 01:41.50 | gnarface | they break their own kernel firmware almost 4 of every 5 updates |
| 01:42.22 | gnarface | they would have had to pull it because it literally cripples performance |
| 01:43.02 | gnarface | and not just a little |
| 01:43.13 | gnarface | they'd be handwaving the problem away otherwise |
| 01:43.14 | furrywolf | https://archive.raspberrypi.org/debian/pool/main/b/bluealsa/ looks like they're packaging it for all archs... some of them updated this month. |
| 01:43.37 | gnarface | interesting... |
| 01:43.50 | furrywolf | bluealsa_0.9_amd64.deb2018-10-11 11:08 |
| 01:43.56 | gnarface | there was something else needed |
| 01:43.58 | gnarface | a simple pairing app |
| 01:44.08 | gnarface | also absorbed by systemd |
| 01:44.33 | gnarface | i was under the impression it could be replicated with a simple python script though |
| 01:44.37 | furrywolf | anyone here have bluetooth hardware and working (i.e. pulse-free) audio and want to try that package out? |
| 01:45.51 | furrywolf | also, do the raspbian people have other packages we should be distributing? lol |
| 01:48.39 | gnarface | omxplayer |
| 01:49.17 | gnarface | but that's more arm-specific |
| 01:49.27 | gnarface | well, rpi specific |
| 01:49.33 | gnarface | at least |
| 01:49.41 | gnarface | not sure if the bananna pis use the same video chip or not |
| 01:50.21 | gnarface | even with patches for the video decoding hardware though, vlc is too cpu hungry for a rpi1 if you don't overclock it |
| 01:50.37 | gnarface | so omxplayer is the only really viable player for rpi1 |
| 01:51.31 | furrywolf | I can't imagine ever wanting to play video on a pi in the first place. |
| 01:54.10 | gnarface | it works really well at 1080p@60 |
| 01:54.33 | gnarface | ... if you're using omxplayer and the video is in a supported encoding and pixel format |
| 01:54.57 | gnarface | it actually makes a nice video player for how low power it is |
| 01:55.13 | furrywolf | I have no desire for a video player. lol |
| 01:55.34 | gnarface | oh, heh, well then it would be an exercise in futility for you |
| 01:57.37 | gnarface | the video decoder supports h264 as long as it's yuv420p |
| 01:57.55 | gnarface | and also mpeg2 if you pay like $2.50 extra for the key |
| 01:58.39 | gnarface | (but it's easy to exceed the bandwidth capabilities of the poor little thing with a mpeg2 stream so i can't imagine how useful that would be) |
| 02:00.21 | furrywolf | I've been thinking of getting an rpi to log data from my weather station and solar system, to replace a failed nslu2... no video. :P |
| 02:01.00 | gnarface | i still think you're better off with something from pine64.org |
| 02:01.04 | furrywolf | I'm not sure what's wrong with the nslu2... lights do things, but it's not talking to anything. |
| 02:08.17 | furrywolf | that pine64 website really sucks. |
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| 02:11.20 | gnarface | their website sucks and their ordering process is a mess |
| 02:11.24 | gnarface | frankly they're just a bunch of kids |
| 02:11.48 | gnarface | but they don't exhibit the overt greed i see from Broadcom |
| 02:12.14 | gnarface | their hardware is carefully designed and generously priced |
| 02:12.37 | gnarface | if mainline software support is lagging well... it's a sideffect of youthful ambition |
| 02:12.53 | gnarface | i'm confident the mainline kernel support will catch up |
| 02:13.20 | gnarface | for a headless server though, the mainline kernel already does all that fine |
| 02:13.43 | gnarface | where the support is lagging is on stuff mobile users would want... camera, audio, bluetooth, hdmi output, gpu acceleration, etc |
| 02:14.07 | furrywolf | "The Pine A64 board supports SD, SDHC, and SDXC format microSD card â this means the largest capacity is 256GB. Please note that if a microSD card is formatted as an FAT32 file format, the maximum capacity is 32GB." seriously, they fucking listen to microsoft's force-people-to-use-exfat crap? I do not like these people. |
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| 02:17.32 | gnarface | hmmm |
| 02:17.45 | gnarface | i think they just get a lot of android users who don't know shit so they have to warn them about that stuff |
| 02:18.07 | gnarface | keep in mind that 3.11-BSwhatever kernel is the android kernel |
| 02:18.12 | gnarface | so these things boot android too |
| 02:18.51 | furrywolf | the only thing they're warning you about is that they intentionally crippled it to comply with microsoft's corruption of the sd card standard. |
| 02:19.12 | gnarface | oh, i see what you're saying |
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| 02:19.16 | gnarface | i'm not sure that's actually the case though |
| 02:20.05 | furrywolf | normal linux doesn't care in the slightest what filesystem you put on the card... the 32gb-fat32-on-sd limit is, however, required for official licensing of the sd card spec. |
| 02:20.08 | gnarface | i'm reading that as a warning about the limitation of fat32 not the hardware |
| 02:20.32 | furrywolf | no, there's no technical reason for it. |
| 02:20.34 | furrywolf | it's a legal reason. |
| 02:21.00 | gnarface | but it's only a problem if you're using fat32 to being with... |
| 02:21.13 | gnarface | what would you be doing with fat32 on a headless linux logging server? |
| 02:21.16 | furrywolf | if you officially license the sd spec, you're required to reject sd cards over 32gb with fat32 filesystems on them. |
| 02:21.31 | gnarface | really? |
| 02:21.33 | furrywolf | yep |
| 02:21.48 | gnarface | and that's not a limit of fat32 |
| 02:21.53 | furrywolf | yep |
| 02:22.04 | gnarface | i thought the natural limit for fat32 was lower than 32GB actually |
| 02:22.21 | gnarface | anyway |
| 02:22.32 | gnarface | i'm assuming the sd card license was already tied to the boards by the manufacturer |
| 02:22.39 | gnarface | keep in mind these guys aren't manufacturing this stuff either |
| 02:22.52 | gnarface | it's just rebranded android hardware |
| 02:22.59 | furrywolf | most devices made before >32gb cards were a thing will happily use 64gb or 128gb cards with fat32 systems on them anyway... then when the big cards come out, devices that wanted to officially use them had to intentionally add checks to reject them. |
| 02:23.15 | gnarface | so it may have been a choice the manufacturer made that they had to keep with in order to keep the cheap hardware |
| 02:23.33 | gnarface | (in order to re-use an existing design as the base instead of having to design something from scratch like they're sopine boards) |
| 02:23.39 | gnarface | *their |
| 02:24.23 | furrywolf | it was due to microsoft's influence on the sd spec... they wanted to discourage use of non-microsoft operating systems, by making devices use filesystems that linux etc couldn't read. |
| 02:24.49 | gnarface | heh, seems like they wasted a lot of effort on that. someone should have told them fat32 was already supported |
| 02:24.58 | furrywolf | there is still no legal-in-the-US support for >32gb sd cards on linux. |
| 02:25.13 | gnarface | i'm gonna have to test that |
| 02:25.19 | furrywolf | oh, it works fine. |
| 02:25.28 | furrywolf | it's just moved to a non-US-based FUSE module, not the kernel. |
| 02:26.54 | gnarface | i am actually not sure i have any sd or microsd cards larger than 32GB here |
| 02:27.01 | gnarface | but i've never put fat32 on them anyway |
| 02:27.50 | furrywolf | you must not own any consumer electronics? :P |
| 02:28.01 | furrywolf | for example, a digital camera, a mp3 player,... |
| 02:28.29 | gnarface | i guess not |
| 02:28.39 | gnarface | i mean i have several smaller cards just none above 32GB |
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| 02:32.39 | furrywolf | I mean, that all consumer electronics only work with fat32... |
| 02:33.27 | furrywolf | if you never put fat32 on them, you must not be using any of them in consumer electronics. |
| 02:42.52 | gnarface | hmmm |
| 02:43.06 | gnarface | you're right, i think the wii does use encrypted files on fat32 |
| 02:43.43 | gnarface | i'm pretty sure the wii-u reformats the entire thing though once you put it in |
| 02:47.23 | gnarface | what i meant is that, as a general rule, i don't use fat32 on them in linux |
| 02:48.14 | gnarface | i've not tested fat32's limits in this context |
| 02:48.28 | furrywolf | I do, because I add or remove files from these devices from linux. heh. |
| 02:48.38 | furrywolf | i.e. put mp3s on the mp3 player, or download images from my camera. |
| 02:52.12 | golinux | (Some people just don't get that this is a devuan help channel) |
| 02:53.00 | furrywolf | I add and remove files from my fat32-formatted cards from devuan. :P |
| 02:53.02 | gnarface | sorry |
| 02:55.26 | nacelle | its all washing out anyways now that MS has released the patents around that to OIN |
| 02:58.19 | golinux | #debianfork |
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| 07:08.34 | man_in_shack | flails |
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| 10:13.34 | blerg | How can I get my laptop to suspend when I close the lid? Debian wiki says a systemd service replaced pm-utils. Do pm-utils still work? |
| 10:14.03 | djph | in devuan, they should |
| 10:14.30 | blerg | djph: Cool. (I am using Devuan) |
| 10:15.00 | blerg | Now to figure out how to get a display manager to play nice with Stumpwm. |
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| 10:29.18 | ejr | wew lads, after about half a year of not using devuan, i am back now, and more happy with it than ever :) |
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| 11:41.28 | jyri | hi |
| 11:42.32 | pilgrimm | Pardon if this is a stupid question, does anyone know if the Wacom digitizer on Lenovo's Yoga 720s work with Devuan? |
| 11:45.23 | pilgrimm | Using my other casual drawing pc that has plain deb on it because my main workhorse crapped out, but I want to go back to devuan :< |
| 11:46.08 | jyri | anyone aware that ceres has totally broken GTK support on applications? I mean that even $ reportbug |
| 11:46.11 | jyri | zsh: segmentation fault reportbug |
| 11:46.48 | jyri | strace points to GTK problems and any program that uses GTK refuses to launch |
| 11:47.21 | jyri | pilgrim: don't know without trying :) |
| 11:49.10 | gnarface | pilgrimm: the kernel is the same |
| 11:49.40 | gnarface | hardware support shouldn't be different unless it somehow requires systemd |
| 11:50.31 | gnarface | jyri: has this been happening for a long time? |
| 11:50.58 | pilgrimm | gnarface: ah so it's a kernel thing then. i thought it was a package thing but then again that actually checks out from my experiences |
| 11:52.11 | pilgrimm | I'm using sysvinit on debian and it works fine with my pen so I highly doubt it's dependent on systemd. Thank you for the response, now I'm confident enough to put devuan on here :) |
| 11:53.16 | jyri | gnarface: I just noticed it today |
| 11:53.35 | gnarface | pilgrimm: it probably does also need some or another xorg package and maybe some config snippet, but that usually comes along with a standard xorg install |
| 11:54.38 | gnarface | at least these, i'm guessing: xserver-xorg-input-wacom, libwacom-bin, libwacom-common, libwacom2 |
| 11:55.05 | gnarface | except where systemd was removed, the packages and dependences are all the same as on debian |
| 11:55.21 | gnarface | jyri: i care, but i can't do anything about it. i'll avoid updating today. thanks for the warning :) |
| 11:56.04 | gnarface | jyri: (i do assume this type of thing will get fixed upstream) |
| 11:56.14 | jyri | gnarface: ok :) I do apt update ; apt -y upgrade ; apt -y autoremove ; apt clean every morning when I come to the office (this is my workstation) |
| 11:56.25 | gnarface | oh boy |
| 11:56.33 | gnarface | ceres on a workstation |
| 11:56.39 | jyri | :D |
| 11:56.46 | gnarface | that takes a special type of bravery |
| 11:56.46 | jyri | I like to live on the edge |
| 11:57.55 | jyri | it has only once bitten me in the ass before (then it was worse since it removed Xorg) |
| 11:59.19 | jyri | but that one was easy to downgrade, now I'm not sure which package caused this since it wasn't any that has gtk on the name of it |
| 12:00.12 | gnarface | well, it's worth checking the debian bug tracker to see if anyone else has noticed it |
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| 15:13.49 | sickness | hi all |
| 15:15.01 | sickness | what is the best/fastest way to install ceres? install devuan ascii then change sources.list then do a dist-upgrade? (that is the advice I've found on the forums) |
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| 15:16.23 | jyri | sickness: that's it |
| 15:17.04 | jyri | but, don't install today, I think that I run in an bug that messes up gtk |
| 15:22.04 | sickness | jyri: ah, I was just curious to test it, nothing production, so even if it explodes it's ok :) |
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| 15:33.32 | golinux | jyri: https://igurublog.wordpress.com/2012/11/05/gnome-et-al-rotting-in-threes/ |
| 15:34.02 | golinux | The gnome/GTK thing has been coming for a long time |
| 15:35.12 | golinux | sickness et al: Be aware that there are some packages that are newer in ascii than in beowulf or ceres. |
| 15:36.14 | golinux | Our workflow is changing to now modify packages in ceres and let them move down to older releases. |
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| 15:37.15 | pankerini | Wow, I didn't imagine the GTK/gnome problem lasted this long |
| 15:40.17 | sickness | ah, ok |
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| 15:49.28 | golinux | Yeah, it's been a long time coming . . . |
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| 15:50.47 | golinux | Bottom line is that the gnome sickness goes hand in hand with the systemd sickness |
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| 16:01.46 | premoboss | hi |
| 16:02.36 | premoboss | devuan ascii 64 bit. already did update/upgrade. Amule is quite instable, it crash often (at least 4 times today). |
| 16:03.14 | premoboss | PC with 4GiB Ram ,a nd 200G of free space, fs is ext4. |
| 16:06.43 | enyc | premoboss: hrrrm silyl question, does the machine memtest86+ ok? i'd then look in kernel log (dmesg) to see what sort of crashes... |
| 16:07.22 | premoboss | ok, i go for kernel log. |
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| 16:08.51 | fsmithred | premoboss, did you see this bug report? https://bugs.debian.org/cgi-bin/bugreport.cgi?bug=846061 |
| 16:09.17 | premoboss | fsmithred, no i go to read now. |
| 16:09.29 | premoboss | ah... then is that. |
| 16:10.04 | fsmithred | looks like it didn't get fixed. Last post says use the jessie version |
| 16:11.30 | premoboss | 2 time ago when he drashed, i got a pop ul windows wint error similar to that bug... it was like a "debug" window, you can do "close" or "continue" but if i choose "continue", it iterate in endless loop so i was forced to chose "close" |
| 16:12.55 | premoboss | so, we must wait for bugfix, ok. |
| 16:15.16 | fsmithred | maybe it's fixed in sid/ceres. That report is 18 months old. Check the changelog. |
| 16:18.36 | nemo | golinux: heh. Redhat GnomeOS (in comments on that link) - yeah prettymuch |
| 16:18.49 | nemo | golinux: I wonder when we'll get SystemDKernel |
| 16:19.02 | nemo | they kinda already tried to inject themselves in there once already and were beaten back |
| 16:19.10 | nemo | but that was when Linus was not busy removing himself from power |
| 16:26.02 | MinceR | gkh already has write access to Linus' branch |
| 16:26.09 | MinceR | so it's not long until systemd-kerneld |
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| 16:27.16 | nemo | sighs |
| 16:27.30 | nemo | welp. BSD is still an option |
| 16:28.47 | pankerini | Year of the Hurd Desktop soon |
| 16:29.14 | golinux | So is forking the kernel |
| 16:29.41 | KatolaZ | yeah, sure.... |
| 16:29.48 | KatolaZ | :D |
| 16:29.55 | MinceR | hurd is dead |
| 16:30.02 | MinceR | and who will maintain the kernel fork? |
| 16:30.14 | MinceR | https://www.gnu.org/software/hurd/open_issues/systemd.html |
| 16:30.17 | nemo | problem with forking is the ever growing burden of integrating useful stuff from the other side of fork, and maintaining enough people. it's about the community vote, and so far at least the community is unfortunately like... maybe 5% anti-systemd to 95% "I have a desktop, who cares" |
| 16:30.20 | KatolaZ | MinceR: the hobbits |
| 16:30.40 | nemo | I kinda wonder what the % is amongst active linux/FOSS contributors |
| 16:30.50 | MinceR | it seems to me that the "modern" side isn't interested in implementing useful stuff anyway |
| 16:30.55 | MinceR | so i wouldn't worry about that |
| 16:31.25 | nemo | MinceR: well... the corporate coders will presumably implement anything they are assigned to do. |
| 16:32.31 | nemo | MinceR: heh '<pochu> let's create our own init system, make it better than anyone else<pochu> let's create our own init system, make it better than anyone else' |
| 16:32.40 | nemo | MinceR: «With hookers, and blackjack» |
| 16:32.46 | KatolaZ | nemo: the percentage of what? |
| 16:33.24 | nemo | https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=e35AQK014tI |
| 16:34.26 | nemo | KatolaZ: I was just wondering if literally everything in the entire linux ecosystem could become systemd dependent, or if the % of those who actually help build stuff under linux in userspace regular apps, desktops or system might push back |
| 16:34.50 | nemo | if anti-systemd sentiment is stronger in that group, it'd be harder for that to happen |
| 16:35.53 | KatolaZ | still don't get the point, but I guess it's OK |
| 16:35.54 | KatolaZ | :) |
| 16:36.07 | KatolaZ | there is no reason why everything at the application leve should depend on systemd |
| 16:36.35 | KatolaZ | there are some applications which might need some of the facilities made available by systemd |
| 16:36.38 | KatolaZ | e.g., session management |
| 16:36.53 | KatolaZ | but none of those is *necessary* |
| 16:37.21 | KatolaZ | (meaning that there are always other ways of obtaining the same result without using the facility made available by systemd) |
| 16:37.23 | MinceR | it's kind of like that most mono applications don't need the "non-core" parts not covered in microsoft's useless "promise" |
| 16:37.32 | MinceR | and yet all major mono applications use them anyway |
| 16:37.43 | KatolaZ | it's a bit different MinceR |
| 16:37.44 | MinceR | in the "modern" world, necessity is not a factor |
| 16:38.04 | KatolaZ | why would an editor need to know what init system is currently running? |
| 16:38.22 | MinceR | so that it can depend on systemd |
| 16:38.34 | KatolaZ | non sequitur |
| 16:38.41 | MinceR | business as usual |
| 16:38.49 | KatolaZ | but which business? |
| 16:39.39 | MinceR | red hat's |
| 16:39.57 | KatolaZ | MinceR: red hat does not develop everything in the FOSS world... |
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| 16:40.20 | MinceR | indeed, they just aim to destroy everything in the FOSS world |
| 16:43.36 | nemo | KatolaZ: there's no reason why it *has* to - but it could be harder and harder to avoid, what if gtk3 did *everything* over dbus and relied on a systemd specific implementation |
| 16:43.52 | KatolaZ | nemo: it's already like that :) |
| 16:43.55 | nemo | KatolaZ: can't predict the future but what it *feels* like is an all consuming glob trying to shove everything into process 0 or the kernel |
| 16:43.59 | KatolaZ | welcome to 2018 |
| 16:44.06 | nemo | KatolaZ: can't be totally like that since you guys are still able to shim it out |
| 16:44.12 | KatolaZ | uh? |
| 16:44.19 | KatolaZ | gnome is not installable cleanly in devuan |
| 16:44.22 | nemo | KatolaZ: hm? devuan has gtk3 apps |
| 16:44.27 | nemo | and ones using dbus even |
| 16:44.30 | fsmithred | nemo, I have a no-dbus build with most of the apps that normally are included in Refracta |
| 16:44.43 | nemo | KatolaZ: but yes gnome3 is not installable |
| 16:44.51 | KatolaZ | I know nemo |
| 16:44.52 | KatolaZ | :) |
| 16:44.52 | nemo | I was just trying to imagine rot spreading |
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| 16:45.22 | KatolaZ | even if in principle it's just a matter of a wrong dep on the debian package |
| 16:45.34 | KatolaZ | since it should be possible for GNOME to work with libpam-systemd |
| 16:45.38 | nemo | It's like someone looked at Microsoft Windows with its HTML parsing and font rendering and widget drawing in ring 0 and though "man, that's a damn good idea. |
| 16:45.38 | KatolaZ | which is provided by elogind |
| 16:45.41 | nemo | " |
| 16:46.03 | nemo | linux kernel - now with wayland |
| 16:46.17 | nemo | blazing fast UIs! |
| 16:46.30 | KatolaZ | that's not gonna happen nemo |
| 16:46.31 | nemo | Did you guys ever read the MS justification for why they did that? I thought it was pretty funny |
| 16:47.00 | nemo | it boiled down to - we aren't fast enough to compete w/ OS with real security measures otherwise, and, we're gonna be super careful |
| 16:47.10 | nemo | last year there was a priv escalation in the UI code... |
| 16:47.29 | KatolaZ | nemo: I stopped caring about M$ more or less at the same time I got the first PC |
| 16:47.31 | KatolaZ | :) |
| 16:47.58 | nemo | still need to use it for work unfortunately |
| 16:48.11 | nemo | but major win on my part, just last month I got our first *OFFICIAL* linux server at the office |
| 16:48.21 | nemo | until that point they were adamant that they could only support Windows |
| 16:48.30 | nemo | this allows for a possible transition once Win 7 is EOL'd |
| 16:48.38 | KatolaZ | the few times I had to use windoes, I just used cygwin under it |
| 16:49.06 | nemo | only issue is Oracle which irritatingly charges more for the Linux builds even though the performance is better - I think the logic is if you're using linux you must be a big operation and therefore they can extract more from you |
| 16:49.31 | nemo | so convincing them to relicense the db and other oracle junk under linux might be a sticking point |
| 16:49.34 | nemo | but who knows |
| 16:53.47 | nemo | BTW, that linux server is Ubuntu 14.04 - I am hoping to convince them to allow me to transition it to Devuan Ascii before next spring EOL of ubuntu 14.04 but they might just force me to upgrade to 16.04 instead |
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| 17:03.18 | UsL | hello vuans! So, my system changes sometimes and the values in /etc/fancontrol settings becomes outdated. hwmon02 is suddenly hwmon01 and so on. Is there a way to solve that or make the fans go 100% when settings are outdated? |
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| 17:48.05 | KatolaZ | UsL: what do you mean by "my system changes sometimes"? |
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| 17:56.13 | UsL | Device path of hwmon2 has changed |
| 17:56.13 | UsL | Device name of hwmon2 has changed |
| 17:56.14 | UsL | Configuration appears to be outdated, please run pwmconfig again |
| 17:57.01 | UsL | so in this instance hwmon0 is acpitz |
| 17:57.01 | UsL | <PROTECTED> |
| 17:57.02 | UsL | <PROTECTED> |
| 17:58.27 | UsL | it can happen now and then.. Have not pin pointed the reason |
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| 20:11.28 | *** topic/#devuan is This is the Devuan https://devuan.org/ discussion channel | **You need to auth to nickserv to talk!** | Latest (2018-06-09): ASCII 2.0.0 https://devuan.org/os/debian-fork/ascii-stable-announce-060818 || Stable (2017-05-25): Jessie 1.0.0 LTS release | Devuan Forum: https://dev1galaxy.org/ | Chanlogs: http://maemo.cloud-7.de/irclogs/freenode/_devuan/ https://botbot.me/freenode/devuan |
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| 20:23.28 | negev | hi |
| 20:24.06 | negev | running beowulf i'm seeing consistently high cpu usage indicated in top, with no apparent processes listed using anywhere near what the total is indicated as |
| 20:24.10 | negev | anyone else seeing this? |
| 20:24.23 | negev | 4.18.0-2-amd64 on a xen vps |
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| 20:25.35 | golinux | terra: Yeah, misread your question |
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| 21:04.11 | leo | negev: try atop instead of top |
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| 23:13.44 | fsmithred | negev, I was in beowulf earlier today, and top was showing all cores (4 cores, 8 threads) running at around 20% while I was in a video conference in chromium. When I closed the tab with the video, cpu use dropped to around 1%. |
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| 23:37.31 | gnarface | negev: xen vps might be your culprit. virtualization usually relies on hiding guests' processes and memory space but it does a worse job at hiding what gets subtracted from load/capacity. usually you'd use a top program that is aware of your specific virtualization solution (also usually you'd run it from the host not the guest) |