IRC log for #devuan on 20180424

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00:21.51*** topic/#devuan is Recent (2017-05-25): Jessie 1.0.0 stable release http://ur1.ca/qxaa5 || This is the Devuan https://devuan.org/ discussion channel (logged at https://botbot.me/freenode/devuan - with useful 'search') | Please take off-topic conversation to #debianfork | /msg chanserv info #devuan | !listkeys #devuan <foo> | Devuan Forum: https://dev1galaxy.org/
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16:10.50TCH_hello
16:11.36TCH_i managed to build firefox 52.7.3esr with gtk2 and alsa, how can i make a debian package out of it?
16:13.12KatolaZTCH_: if you have no previous experience in packaging, firefox is probably not the best primer...
16:14.14furrywolfKatolaZ:  or, if he managed to build firefox, maybe packaging would be considered trivial?  :P
16:14.53TCH_KatolaZ: i know how to make a deb package with checkinstall, but that does not work with firefox
16:15.17TCH_also, i need firefox 52 with alsa/gtk2, so it does not matter, if it's good for a start, or not
16:15.55TCH_furrywolf: it's not trivial, i could not find any info on the net about it
16:16.02gnarfaceTCH_: you tried building from the source package with dpkg-buildpackage and it didn't work, i take it?
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16:16.16gnarfaceTCH_: it's trivial these assholes just like to pull up the ladder
16:16.42TCH_dpkg-buildpackage works with it?
16:16.50TCH_i did not try that
16:16.57gnarfaceTCH_: apt-get build-dep [package name] && apt-get source [package name] && cd [package name] && dpkg-buildpackage -us -uc
16:17.44gnarfaceTCH_: note that `apt-get build-dep` may miss some actual dependencies but since you built firefox already successfully that probably won't be a roadblock to you
16:18.09gnarfaceTCH_: (now, if that doesn't work then the source package is broken and i can't help)
16:18.54TCH_i did not used apt-get source, i downloaded the archive from here: https://archive.mozilla.org/pub/firefox/releases/52.7.3esr/
16:19.07TCH_is that a problem? will dpkg-buldpackage still work?
16:19.52TCH_root@Csabi:/media/SOFTDISK/firefox-52.7.3esr# dpkg-buildpackage -us -uc
16:19.52TCH_tail: 'debian/changelog' nem nyitható meg olvasásra: Nincs ilyen fájl vagy könyvtár
16:19.52TCH_dpkg-buildpackage: error: tail of debian/changelog gave error exit status 1
16:20.02TCH_it seems, dpkg-buildpackage does not work
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16:21.22gnarfaceTCH_: that's a problem, dpkg-buildpackage is debian-specific and will only work on the debian source packages
16:21.38gnarface(using debian/devuan interchangeably here despite it being technically inaccurate)
16:22.13TCH_but both debian and devuan ship firefox-esr with gtk3 and pulse
16:22.38TCH_is there a devuan package which ships firefox with alsa and gtk2?
16:23.00gnarfaceTCH_: no, but it should be as easy to change in the source package as the upstream build.  in general, for a good experience *don't* use upstream sources except when there's no other option
16:25.21gnarfaceare you sure the firefox-esr package requires pulse though?  the one i have here in ceres still does not...
16:25.32gnarfacethey did switch to gtk3 though observably
16:26.05gnarfacethere's a good chance you can still switch it back in your build with a simple change to the ./configure line
16:33.07TCH_maybe only the debian package uses the pulse
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16:33.21TCH_but i don't want gtk3 either
16:33.44TCH_as for the ./configure, firefox refuses to work that way
16:33.50TCH_i need to create a mozconfig file
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16:34.28TCH_also, if i try to download and rebuild the firefox shipped with debian
16:34.32TCH_then i broke iceweasel
16:34.41gnarfaceyou're telling me that debian source package doesn't have a ./debian directory, that the ./debian directory doesn't have a control file, or just that you gave up without even looking for it because you're still looking at the upstream source?
16:35.22gnarfacei'm showing iceweasel as just an empty transitional package here on ceres now.  what devuan are you actually running?
16:35.23TCH_no
16:35.35TCH_i say, i pinned firefox-esr from the repo
16:35.44TCH_because it conflicts with my iceweasel package
16:36.02gnarfacewell that would be expected behavior since they're the same program
16:36.08TCH_debian team bombed iceweasel and they made a dummy package
16:36.15TCH_they're not entirely the same
16:36.27TCH_iceweasel don't have the telemetry stuff
16:36.31gnarfacewell they use the same paths for a lot of stuff, so you'd have to differentiate them manually
16:36.44gnarfacethat's more than just a trivial rebuild now
16:37.05TCH_i already managed to get rid of the telemetry in my upstream build
16:38.35TCH_also, if i will do "apt-get build-dep firefox-esr", then it'll install gtk3-dev and along with that: gtk3
16:39.07gnarfaceyea, probably
16:39.12gnarfacealso expected behavior you know
16:39.33TCH_yeah, i know
16:39.42gnarfacebut if you were planning on editing the dependencies, you are also capable of figuring out how to install them without build-dep to help
16:39.43TCH_this is why i built it from scratch
16:40.09gnarfacei'm not questioning your judgement about building it, just telling you that using the upstream source is a mistake
16:40.29TCH_i see
16:40.37TCH_well, then i now downloaded the debian one
16:40.46TCH_it downloaded dozens of tar.bz2
16:41.01gnarfacedependencies, patches, etc
16:41.07TCH_yep
16:41.11TCH_got the dir
16:42.09gnarfaceincidentally, you should know that i don't really know anything about this process that isn't in the debian new maintainer's guide
16:42.40TCH_no prob, i will use the same mozconfig as before
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16:43.44gnarfacei would recommend you only use mozconfig on the debian source package if that's what it would use by default (which i doubt, but admit i don't know and am not going to bother to look for you)
16:44.38TCH_why, you think, the debian source package don't use the "mach" builder, as the upstream source?
16:45.42TCH_it's there...
16:45.57TCH_./configure does not work
16:46.02TCH_clearly i need to use "mach"
16:46.05gnarfaceis there a ./debian/ directory?
16:46.07TCH_and mozconfig
16:46.15TCH_yes
16:46.19gnarfaceyou jump to that conclusion "clearly" when i don't see anything clear about it so far
16:46.35gnarfaceyou seem really fixated on what seems to be an arbitrary idea to me
16:46.40TCH_if configure does not work, then what else i could do?
16:47.36gnarfaceTCH_: https://www.debian.org/doc/manuals/maint-guide/build.en.html
16:48.17gnarfaceif it does something different than what this outlines, i can't help
16:48.25gnarfacesorry
16:48.35TCH_no prob, thanks anyway
16:48.43TCH_i'm reading the manual
16:49.08gnarfacemy assumption is that there's vestigial remains of the upstream build system laying around that are confusing you
16:49.27gnarfacebut that the normal ./debian/control procedures will work
16:50.16gnarfacethough i admit i know that this isn't strictly enforced by Debian, it's strongly encouraged and so far I haven't actually seen a package that did not at least attempt to use this build system (occasionally it's clear the maintainer fudged something to make the binary packages work but it's more and more rare these days)
16:51.17gnarfacein no situation should you have to call ./configure yourself, there should be a file in there you can edit the build options that dpkg-buildpackage runs for you
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16:52.22gnarfaceit's all outlined clearly in chapters 6-8 of the NMG.  you can just ignore the first 5 chapters of religion
16:52.58gnarfaceit's the only authoritative document on the subject but it's no secret that it was designed as a deterrent
16:54.00TCH_why, is it that terrible?
16:56.06golinuxTCH_: You might want to have a look at this https://dev1galaxy.org/viewtopic.php?id=549
16:56.10gnarfacewell they spend a lot of effort padding it with stuff that's only meaningful as a litmus test to separate the serious from the casual
16:57.01gnarfacea lot of this information is purely ideological
16:57.32gnarfacelike stuff they want people applying to be an official debian maintainer to know, but that will frighten away anyone who wants to just build a debian package the right way
16:58.05gnarfacepresumably because the latter waste too much of the real maintainer's time
16:58.13TCH_i see...i never tried this way, i always used ./configure and checkinstall
16:58.24gnarfacebut whether that's true or not, hiding information this way violates my ideology
16:58.31TCH_golinux: thanks for the link, i'll need it, when i'll switch to ascii
17:01.35golinuxWhy wait for ascii?
17:03.16TCH_i have debian jessie now and i got rid of shitsteamd and pulseaudio
17:03.44TCH_currently i have no urgent reasons to switch to devuan
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17:04.10crimson_kingThe release day is a symbolic thing, no?
17:04.25TCH_gnarface: this build manual says nothing about where i can specify the parameters i want to pass to configure
17:04.42TCH_crimson_king: nope, i want to switch, when the devs says it's stable
17:04.47golinuxTCH_: Then why aren't you seeking help over at debian?
17:05.12TCH_why would i seek for help at there?
17:05.22TCH_they accepted systemd and pulseaudio as default
17:05.25gnarfaceTCH_: it's in there somewhere
17:05.36TCH_i doubt they would help me in avoiding them
17:05.41KatolaZTCH_: build parameters will go in debian/rules
17:06.08KatolaZTCH_: I didn't mean to discourage you
17:06.40KatolaZI think I don't have enough experience with .debs to give it a try
17:06.47KatolaZso I can't recommend you to do that
17:07.03KatolaZI know that many things can go wrong in the process
17:07.11KatolaZand since the building is not immediate,
17:07.16KatolaZthe process can be quite tiring
17:07.44TCH_yeah, i suspect
17:07.58KatolaZhaving said that, nothing can stop a motivated person
17:07.59KatolaZ:)
17:08.22TCH_exactly :)
17:08.40TCH_which part of debian/rules?
17:08.42golinuxTCH_:  This might help you also http://forums.debian.net/viewtopic.php?f=16&t=38976
17:09.54golinuxEven I have built a package following that!
17:10.11KatolaZTCH_: where are you with the debian maintainer manual?
17:10.12TCH_thanks, bookmarked
17:10.20KatolaZhttps://www.debian.org/doc/manuals/maint-guide/index.en.html
17:10.47KatolaZsorry, maybe they have already suggested that
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17:11.23TCH_they did
17:11.31KatolaZok
17:11.34gnarfaceKatolaZ: i suggested he skip to chapter 6
17:11.36TCH_this: https://www.debian.org/doc/manuals/maint-guide/build.en.html
17:11.44TCH_i finished reading this
17:11.58KatolaZgnarface: I don't think it's a good idea, but that's just my take on that :)
17:12.45gnarfaceTCH_: that second form link from golinux seems to be a good summary of the information, i hadn't seen it before.  it might help you fill in the blanks.  remember that the package maintainers themselves are free to ... improvise
17:13.07gnarface*forum link
17:15.19TCH_i'm still looking in debian/rules
17:15.25TCH_where i can inject my parameters?
17:15.47gnarfacewell you're gonna have to read it and figure out where it's pulling the default parameters from
17:15.57gnarfaceoften, they're in that file directly
17:16.02gnarfacesometimes it sources other scripts
17:16.10KatolaZTCH_: rules honours a set of "override_"s
17:16.22KatolaZwhich govern the different phases of the build
17:16.24KatolaZgotta go
17:16.25KatolaZbbl
17:16.29KatolaZTCH_: read :)
17:17.10TCH_i see
17:17.17TCH_then i think i'll have to dig deeper
17:20.48TCH_okay guys, i have to depart now, thanks for the help
17:20.56TCH_bye all
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22:08.55*** topic/#devuan is Recent (2017-05-25): Jessie 1.0.0 stable release http://ur1.ca/qxaa5 || This is the Devuan https://devuan.org/ discussion channel (logged at https://botbot.me/freenode/devuan - with useful 'search') | Please take off-topic conversation to #debianfork | /msg chanserv info #devuan | !listkeys #devuan <foo> | Devuan Forum: https://dev1galaxy.org/
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