| 00:00.58 | DPA | I've enabled backports on my main PC. I'm sometimes using it to debootstrap things, but i got the wrong debootstrap at some point somehow. |
| 00:12.43 | *** join/#devuan Jjp137 (~Jjp137@cpe-75-83-16-81.socal.res.rr.com) |
| 00:14.23 | *** join/#devuan flrn_ (~flrn@unaffiliated/flrn) |
| 00:15.20 | *** join/#devuan targz (~Thunderbi@unaffiliated/targz) |
| 00:16.13 | *** join/#devuan flrn_ (~flrn@unaffiliated/flrn) |
| 00:16.27 | *** part/#devuan flrn_ (~flrn@unaffiliated/flrn) |
| 00:16.30 | *** join/#devuan theLambda (~theLambda@mue-88-130-62-118.dsl.tropolys.de) |
| 00:20.47 | DPA | I've just pinned another version for now. And I've to leave for today, it's already really late where I life, bye. |
| 00:22.39 | *** join/#devuan msiism (~msiism@mue-88-130-48-108.dsl.tropolys.de) |
| 00:27.40 | msiism | on my devuan jessie system, you will not be able to execute "ifconfig" by simply typing "ifconfig" as a normal user. i always wondered why that is and thought it might be for security reasons. now i've found that i can execute it using the absolute path "/sbin/ifconfig". so the problem is that /sbin is just not in my normal user's PATH. but then, it seems, /sbin should not be in a normal user's PATH. |
| 00:29.06 | msiism | i might be wrong, but i think that in earlier versions of Debian (including wheezy, i think), it was normally possible to run ifconfig as a normal user. |
| 00:29.49 | phogg | msiism: No, Debian stopped putting ifconfig in the default non-root PATH many releases ago. |
| 00:30.06 | msiism | phogg: ok, i see. but why? |
| 00:30.09 | phogg | I recall that it was there for potato, but gone by wheezy. I don't remember exactly when it changed. |
| 00:30.45 | phogg | msiism: I don't know. I expect because the assumption is that only root needs it. Perhaps it was done to encourage the adoption of ip, which is not in /sbin. |
| 00:31.21 | msiism | phogg: ok, i always used it as a handy way to get an overview of my network devices' state. |
| 00:32.11 | phogg | msiism: me too. I keep planning to write a trivial ip wrapper called "ifconfig" that mimics the output of ifconfig if run with zero or a single net device name arg so I don't have to retrain my reflexes |
| 00:32.28 | phogg | maybe one day I'll actually do it |
| 00:32.29 | msiism | would there be any harm in creating a symbolic link to /sbin/ifconfig in /bin of /usr/local/bin. |
| 00:32.47 | phogg | msiism: no |
| 00:32.58 | phogg | but definitely use /usr/local/bin for that |
| 00:33.02 | msiism | and wouldn't that also solve the whole problem? |
| 00:33.10 | msiism | phogg: ok, i was just gonna ask that |
| 00:33.53 | phogg | msiism: the idea is to eventually stop using ifconfig entirely. I am on board with the theory but my reflexes do not agree. |
| 00:34.12 | msiism | phogg: ok, because there is sth better? |
| 00:34.28 | phogg | msiism: ifconfig has been deprecated for years in favor of ip |
| 00:34.44 | msiism | phogg: ok, i haven't noticed... |
| 00:35.00 | phogg | msiism: that's normal. Try this and see if you can live with it instead: ip a |
| 00:35.14 | msiism | i've just used ip for mac spoofing from time to time... |
| 00:36.04 | msiism | phogg: well, the layout is definitely better with ifconfig, i'd say. |
| 00:36.41 | *** join/#devuan bozonius (~bozonius@c-73-90-84-55.hsd1.ca.comcast.net) |
| 00:37.00 | phogg | msiism: I doubt it. It's all in what you're used to. That said, I find it faster to locate the information I need in ifconfig's output... which is why I was going to write that wrapper. |
| 00:38.07 | msiism | phogg: ok, well i find it a lot easier to locate the different devices in the more table-like layout if ifconfig. |
| 00:38.37 | msiism | there's a nice blank line after each of them. |
| 00:39.22 | bozonius | Just ran across this site (sysdfree.wordpress.com) for the first time (I used to look at systemd-free.org). Anyway, I read this article there: https://sysdfree.wordpress.com/2018/01/27/171/ |
| 00:40.50 | bozonius | From it -- and I realize this is just one person's analysis -- I get the impression that Debian devs are working harder and harder to make it difficult for downstream distros to keep up with diversions away from systemd. The article indicates this is some kind of tit-for-tat, which if true would fit. |
| 00:41.28 | bozonius | Wondering what people here think, and how it will play out for future releases (post-ascii?) for Devuan. |
| 00:42.05 | bozonius | (I mean, it WAS just one person's analysis, not mine!) |
| 00:42.24 | phogg | he lost me at "Arch is just as stable as Debian is." |
| 00:42.25 | bozonius | this is something I've worried about from day 1. |
| 00:43.00 | bozonius | well, phogg, remember, devuan is a fixed release, artix is not. And that is because arch is not fixed release. So you are always looking at a moving target. |
| 00:43.21 | phogg | bozonius: in other words inherently unstable. That's arch. |
| 00:43.28 | bozonius | yes |
| 00:43.49 | bozonius | and for people who are "into that sort of thing," they are happy. |
| 00:43.56 | bozonius | (I do like pacman, though!) |
| 00:43.58 | phogg | indeed |
| 00:44.49 | *** join/#devuan jhv (~jhv@server.rfc968.net) |
| 00:45.45 | bozonius | from the article: "Devuan is sentenced to be running out of breath trying to catch up to a stable Debian that is already old news by upstream standards." |
| 00:46.04 | msiism | bozonius: maybe you should also read this: https://sysdfree.wordpress.com/about/ |
| 00:46.34 | bozonius | I asked here in IRC some time back if maybe at some point devuan would possibly go indy entirely |
| 00:49.49 | golinux | Has anyone asked miyo if he really wrote that? |
| 00:50.09 | bozonius | msiim: :) |
| 00:50.25 | golinux | Remember that fungus has an axe to grind with Devuan |
| 00:51.07 | golinux | And this conversation should be moved to #debianfork |
| 00:51.20 | bozonius | true, golinux. Sorry... |
| 00:53.38 | *** part/#devuan jhv (~jhv@server.rfc968.net) |
| 00:53.47 | msiism | bozonius: i think that "going indy" would not be a good idea or even possible for devuan. |
| 00:54.11 | bozonius | msiim, phogg: Please join us on debianfork! |
| 00:58.16 | *** join/#devuan jhv (~jhv@server.rfc968.net) |
| 00:58.26 | *** part/#devuan jhv (~jhv@server.rfc968.net) |
| 01:06.19 | *** join/#devuan Sammy8806 (~sammy@vps5.dark-it.net) |
| 01:10.58 | *** join/#devuan Humpelstilzchen (erik@p2E5B2D9A.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) |
| 01:22.48 | *** join/#devuan NewGnuGuy (~NewGnuGuy@72.34.178.34) |
| 01:39.56 | *** join/#devuan FriendlyMan (~IceChat9@71-35-109-144.tukw.qwest.net) |
| 01:53.36 | *** join/#devuan Uberius (~Uberius@gateway/tor-sasl/uberius) |
| 01:56.14 | *** join/#devuan Hoshpak (~Hoshpak@200116b800f3210045f254987d8d9f73.dip.versatel-1u1.de) |
| 02:08.36 | *** join/#devuan msiism (~msiism@200116b845803f00ee086bfffe1ced28.dip.versatel-1u1.de) |
| 02:29.08 | *** join/#devuan holycow (~holycow@pdpc/supporter/bronze/holycow) |
| 02:35.25 | *** join/#devuan Tom-_ (~tomg@64-7-154-56.agas2a-dynamic.dsl.sentex.ca) |
| 02:38.52 | *** join/#devuan Uberius (~Uberius@gateway/tor-sasl/uberius) |
| 03:06.23 | *** join/#devuan hellvis_ (~dflmg@dslb-188-109-099-122.188.109.pools.vodafone-ip.de) |
| 03:16.24 | *** part/#devuan msiism (~msiism@200116b845803f00ee086bfffe1ced28.dip.versatel-1u1.de) |
| 03:25.18 | *** join/#devuan tarbz2 (~Thunderbi@unaffiliated/targz) |
| 03:57.08 | Xenguy | Folks, do any of the README files in Devuan actually say 'Debian' when you open them up? |
| 03:57.21 | Xenguy | Like maybe they haven't been updated yet? |
| 03:58.15 | Xenguy | I d/l'd a torrent that was supposed to be Devuan Jessie, but I'm seeing as described above, after burning the ISO to a USB key |
| 04:01.11 | *** join/#devuan sedrosken__ (~sedrosken@static-204-62-58-150.ptr.shelbybb.com) |
| 04:03.40 | Xenguy | OK I see reference to Devuan in directory pool, good |
| 04:09.22 | *** join/#devuan mcr (~mcr@2607:f0b0:f:b:a11:96ff:fe01:81e0) |
| 04:40.40 | *** join/#devuan sedrosken_ (~sedrosken@static-204-62-58-150.ptr.shelbybb.com) |
| 04:41.16 | KatolaZ | Xenguy: known |
| 04:41.33 | KatolaZ | Xenguy: dunno if there is a bug open on the BTS though |
| 04:41.48 | KatolaZ | that's probably why it has not been solved yet |
| 04:41.49 | KatolaZ | :) |
| 04:42.29 | KatolaZ | https://bugs.devuan.org/db/19/193.html |
| 04:42.52 | KatolaZ | (I guess the BTS should uudecode multiparts...) |
| 04:56.07 | *** join/#devuan Uberius (~Uberius@gateway/tor-sasl/uberius) |
| 05:09.04 | *** join/#devuan guru----- (~guru@c-73-126-175-90.hsd1.ma.comcast.net) |
| 05:51.05 | *** join/#devuan Irrwahn_pi__ (~Irrwahn@p549A7ECA.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) |
| 06:33.13 | *** join/#devuan sedrosken__ (~sedrosken@static-204-62-58-150.ptr.shelbybb.com) |
| 06:33.20 | *** join/#devuan furrywolf (~furrywolf@172.58.35.78) |
| 06:43.32 | *** join/#devuan inhetep (~inhetep@gateway/tor-sasl/inhetep) |
| 07:32.05 | *** join/#devuan pillepalle (~Thunderbi@ip-109-90-187-181.hsi11.unitymediagroup.de) |
| 08:01.25 | enyc | ascii dist-upgrade -> insserv: script eudev: service udev already provided! |
| 08:02.42 | *** join/#devuan flrn_ (~flrn@unaffiliated/flrn) |
| 08:06.25 | enyc | aah found mailing list mail |
| 08:10.43 | enyc | hrrm, doesn't help |
| 08:11.37 | *** join/#devuan Centurion_Dan (~Thunderbi@devuan/developer/centuriondan) |
| 08:11.45 | KatolaZ | enyc: just move /etc/init.d/udev out of the way |
| 08:12.12 | enyc | KatolaZ: yes im just realizing this much, thinking 'why does transitionary package have that file' |
| 08:12.20 | KatolaZ | uh? |
| 08:12.32 | KatolaZ | the transisional package has no files |
| 08:12.44 | *** join/#devuan amarsh04 (~amarsh04@ppp118-210-175-207.bras2.adl6.internode.on.net) |
| 08:12.44 | KatolaZ | those files were left there from the original udev package |
| 08:12.50 | enyc | ii udev 1:3.2.2+devuan2.10 amd64 Transitional package for eudev |
| 08:12.53 | KatolaZ | and had to be removed by the new eudev |
| 08:12.55 | enyc | dpkg -L udev |
| 08:13.00 | enyc | /etc/init.d/udev |
| 08:13.04 | KatolaZ | enyc: you had udev |
| 08:13.06 | enyc | amongst others |
| 08:13.10 | KatolaZ | at a certain point |
| 08:13.24 | KatolaZ | the real one |
| 08:13.25 | enyc | yes, and i've now got the *Transitional* 'udev' package |
| 08:13.33 | KatolaZ | enyc: please read above |
| 08:13.39 | enyc | and the 'transitional' package still has those files |
| 08:13.50 | KatolaZ | enyc: the transitional package has no files |
| 08:13.52 | KatolaZ | -_- |
| 08:13.59 | enyc | KatolaZ: dpkg -l and dpkg -L says otherwise, see above |
| 08:14.02 | KatolaZ | those files needed to be removed, but were not |
| 08:14.04 | KatolaZ | ok enyc |
| 08:14.06 | KatolaZ | HND |
| 08:14.06 | KatolaZ | o |
| 08:14.08 | KatolaZ | o/ |
| 08:15.52 | enyc | right |
| 08:15.57 | enyc | ok looking at the deb |
| 08:16.06 | enyc | it DOES have files |
| 08:16.17 | enyc | but only /usr/share/doc/udev/* |
| 08:16.28 | enyc | what's happening is that *config* files are being left, creating the conflict |
| 08:16.54 | enyc | so, the transitionary package needs some kind of postinst/preinst/whatever-it-is script fixed, to deal with this |
| 08:16.56 | KatolaZ | enyc: it's exactly what I wrote above |
| 08:17.00 | KatolaZ | we know |
| 08:17.04 | KatolaZ | and we have the fix already |
| 08:17.05 | KatolaZ | :) |
| 08:17.05 | enyc | "09:13 < KatolaZ> enyc: the transitional package has no files" |
| 08:17.14 | enyc | inconsistency detected |
| 08:17.23 | KatolaZ | 09:12 < KatolaZ> those files were left there from the original udev package |
| 08:17.29 | KatolaZ | 09:12 < KatolaZ> and had to be removed by the new eudev |
| 08:18.04 | KatolaZ | 09:14 < KatolaZ> those files needed to be removed, but were not |
| 08:18.08 | *** join/#devuan Besnik_b (~Besnik@ppp-94-66-221-17.home.otenet.gr) |
| 08:18.29 | *** join/#devuan ssbb (~eafaef@S0106602ad06acd48.vc.shawcable.net) |
| 08:19.16 | enyc | KatolaZ: this is inconsistent in 2 ways, firstlsy you're telling me there are no files in the package, which is wron, secondly, when I point out dpkg -L, you're not pointing out the word **config** (registered config files) which is where the confusion coming from |
| 08:20.57 | enyc | Hrrm, seems worth of note to, its' then possible to '--purge' remove libudev-dev libudev1 udev entirely, stopping dpkg keeping the unwanted config files. |
| 08:21.32 | enyc | [they can always reinstall if some other package wants the 'dependency'] |
| 08:22.03 | enyc | KatolaZ: thankyou for pointer, and ack its' being fixed! =) |
| 08:23.12 | KatolaZ | they won't install, since the dep is provided by eudev... |
| 08:23.23 | KatolaZ | they are transitional packages... |
| 08:23.40 | *** join/#devuan andyxator (~andyx@ppp85-140-235-64.pppoe.mtu-net.ru) |
| 08:24.45 | enyc | KatolaZ: right, but this depends both on ''other packages'' AND on ''eudev''s "provides" [e.g. if something else depends explicitly on 'udev' ONLY].... will 'eudev' be set to 'provide' this "udev" explicitly...? |
| 08:25.06 | KatolaZ | enyc: apt-cache show eudev |
| 08:25.09 | enyc | otherwise, the "something else" dependiny ONLY on 'udev' will, when installed, cause 'udev' *Transitional-package* to be installed, again. |
| 08:25.13 | *** part/#devuan andyxator (~andyx@ppp85-140-235-64.pppoe.mtu-net.ru) |
| 08:25.14 | KatolaZ | enyc: ^^^ |
| 08:25.29 | KatolaZ | apt-cache show eudev |
| 08:25.38 | KatolaZ | it's much faster :) |
| 08:25.41 | enyc | KatolaZ: OK I can see, so thats' down to the NEW package, **NOT** the 'transitional package' [eudev, etc.] |
| 08:25.53 | KatolaZ | eudev is not a transitional package... |
| 08:26.04 | KatolaZ | eudev is the actual package providing udev |
| 08:26.05 | enyc | exactly |
| 08:26.08 | enyc | yes |
| 08:26.11 | enyc | I agree |
| 08:26.43 | KatolaZ | there is nothing to agree upon |
| 08:26.44 | KatolaZ | :) |
| 08:26.49 | KatolaZ | it is like it is |
| 08:27.18 | enyc | hrrm some confusion over "09:23 < KatolaZ> they are transitional packages..." |
| 08:27.39 | KatolaZ | -_- |
| 08:27.46 | enyc | bleurgh need to wakeup here =) |
| 08:27.52 | enyc | meows |
| 08:29.26 | *** join/#devuan clemens3 (~clemens@80-218-38-71.dclient.hispeed.ch) |
| 08:29.36 | enyc | orr tradnisoitanl package [udev, etc] i can see i meant |
| 08:29.37 | enyc | bleurgh |
| 08:34.12 | *** join/#devuan Fervi (~fervi@2a02:a317:e144:d900:baac:6fff:fe99:7804) |
| 08:35.59 | *** join/#devuan andyxator (~andyx@ppp85-140-235-64.pppoe.mtu-net.ru) |
| 08:55.18 | *** join/#devuan Ltem (~ltem@91-113-62-221.adsl.highway.telekom.at) |
| 08:59.19 | *** join/#devuan Oldmoss (~Oldmoss@anon-35-110.vpn.ipredator.se) |
| 09:07.00 | *** join/#devuan flrn_ (~flrn@unaffiliated/flrn) |
| 09:07.33 | *** join/#devuan thaller (~thaller@2001:a61:425:9200:8d6b:90d0:9cf4:1a41) |
| 09:16.40 | *** join/#devuan _abc_ (~usre@unaffiliated/ccbbaa) |
| 09:17.09 | _abc_ | Good day. I have trouble with daylight "savings" time on devuan jessie. Tried various things, per book moves, no relief. |
| 09:17.40 | *** join/#devuan Tom-_ (~tomg@64-7-154-56.agas2a-dynamic.dsl.sentex.ca) |
| 09:18.28 | _abc_ | Description: This morning dst kicked in here. Cue setting lots of not-online clocks. devuan jessie: I tried to pass LOCAL to hwclock etc in /etc/adjtime, is ignored by hwclock. Tried to pass --localtime in /etc/default/hwclock HWCLOCKPARS=" --localtime" ;; no joy. This includes a reboot between each try |
| 09:19.25 | _abc_ | I understand that the dark side (systemd side) uses something called timedatectl which appears to "do the right thing" but probably works around the back of hwclock(8) |
| 09:19.44 | _abc_ | I took the source of hwclock(8) which is a pile of cruft and analyzed it. |
| 09:20.09 | _abc_ | Has anyone seen/solved this problem yet, before I commit to some changes to hwclock for myself, later to be published? |
| 09:21.25 | KatolaZ | _abc_: which timezone have you set? |
| 09:22.06 | _abc_ | Not relevant. If I set UTC date(1) displays correct local time but with tz displayed as UTC. When I set my own it shows the wrong date and the right local tz |
| 09:22.24 | _abc_ | Again: my rtc runs on local time |
| 09:22.30 | KatolaZ | asking because I never had this problem in jessie |
| 09:22.32 | _abc_ | Kernel time is set wrong at boot time from it |
| 09:22.35 | KatolaZ | or in ascii, for that matter |
| 09:22.42 | _abc_ | Did you run your rtc on local time? |
| 09:22.49 | KatolaZ | and if the problem was real, you should have had tons of bug reports about it |
| 09:22.53 | _abc_ | Anyone not running the rtc on local time DOES NOT have this problem |
| 09:23.00 | _abc_ | And most people seem to not notice this |
| 09:23.03 | KatolaZ | and it should have been solved and fixed already |
| 09:23.12 | _abc_ | Please read what I wrote? |
| 09:23.20 | KatolaZ | since daylight saving is somethig everybody uses |
| 09:23.29 | KatolaZ | uh? |
| 09:23.37 | _abc_ | Does boot=live kernel parameter do anything to the boot scripts in the context of time and tz setting |
| 09:23.48 | KatolaZ | don't think so |
| 09:24.27 | _abc_ | I don't think so either but after a few hours reading source it has become obvious there are serious things wrong with hwclock and boot scripts in that context. |
| 09:24.46 | KatolaZ | again _abc_ |
| 09:24.54 | _abc_ | hwclock.c source is the daddy of cruft, this is a key unix program which tries to do at least 4 different things all badly |
| 09:24.58 | KatolaZ | it's used by *anyone* in a debian-based distro |
| 09:25.06 | KatolaZ | so by 40-60% of all linux users... |
| 09:25.09 | _abc_ | Right, so care to explain what I did wrong. |
| 09:25.21 | _abc_ | /etc/timezone is linked to the correct file |
| 09:25.31 | _abc_ | /etc/adjtimex contains LOCAL |
| 09:25.31 | KatolaZ | have you looked at --hctosys |
| 09:25.48 | KatolaZ | (option of hwclock) |
| 09:25.54 | _abc_ | TZ is set or unset when setting the hwclock -w , is ignored by hwclock ?! |
| 09:26.07 | KatolaZ | _abc_: ^^^^ |
| 09:26.13 | _abc_ | KatolaZ: you seem to be a devuan developer, surely you must know I looked at all those things, right? |
| 09:26.22 | KatolaZ | _abc_: you should read please |
| 09:26.28 | KatolaZ | if your hw clock is set to localtime |
| 09:26.33 | _abc_ | -w is --systohc, -w is --hctosys , and yes |
| 09:26.35 | KatolaZ | you must use hctosys |
| 09:26.44 | KatolaZ | it's set in /etc/default/hwclock |
| 09:26.49 | KatolaZ | it's commented by default |
| 09:27.09 | KatolaZ | among other options |
| 09:27.19 | KatolaZ | you can also define which rtc device to use |
| 09:27.33 | _abc_ | there is no --hctosys in /etc/default/hwclock commented or otherwise in jessie |
| 09:27.49 | _abc_ | --hctosys is used in /etc/init.d/hwclock.sh |
| 09:27.51 | _abc_ | properly |
| 09:28.00 | _abc_ | And using it on cli in the same way has the same result |
| 09:28.08 | KatolaZ | --hctosys is "-s" not "-w: |
| 09:28.39 | _abc_ | I said -r you said -s I say potato you say tomato |
| 09:29.01 | _abc_ | I apologize for being a little jaded by now, been doing this since 9AM it's 1130AM now |
| 09:29.30 | _abc_ | Also I always used the long form --hctosys --systohc so no confusion |
| 09:29.35 | KatolaZ | _abc_: --hctosys is a synonym for -s not for -r or -w |
| 09:29.39 | _abc_ | ^^^ |
| 09:29.41 | KatolaZ | ok |
| 09:30.13 | KatolaZ | what does dmesg say about setting the hw clock? |
| 09:30.22 | _abc_ | Has anything changed in the kernel source to accommodate timedatectl since systemd is "on"? |
| 09:30.23 | KatolaZ | does it manage to read from the device? |
| 09:30.51 | _abc_ | Yes, this is an ordinary laptop, asus |
| 09:31.05 | KatolaZ | 10:30 < KatolaZ> what does dmesg say about setting the hw clock? |
| 09:32.28 | _abc_ | [ 1.914971] rtc_cmos 00:00: setting system clock to 2018-03-25 11:11:01 UTC (1521976261) |
| 09:32.34 | _abc_ | which is wrong. |
| 09:32.52 | KatolaZ | why it's wrong? |
| 09:33.22 | _abc_ | That is the local time and it's not UTC, nor does it say UTC in adjtime or in /etc/default/hwclock |
| 09:33.22 | KatolaZ | (because your HW clock is not on UTC, I guess) |
| 09:34.09 | KatolaZ | so what does hwclock -r say? |
| 09:34.23 | _abc_ | Again: hwclock --hctosys --localtime and hwclock --systohc --localtime IGNORE localtime parameter in every case, even if I set TZ="Europe/Bucharest" while I run it |
| 09:34.46 | _abc_ | Sun Mar 25 11:34:49 2018 .927513 seconds ; which is correct local time |
| 09:35.26 | KatolaZ | _abc_: have you read the section "LOCAL vs UTC" in man hwclock? |
| 09:36.01 | KatolaZ | DST adjustment work differently if your hw clock is set to local |
| 09:37.00 | _abc_ | yes |
| 09:37.30 | KatolaZ | it does not asjust the localtime if RTC is set to local |
| 09:37.32 | _abc_ | Yes. No DST adjustment is involved in the problem, the clock jump wrt UTC is 2 or 3 hours, not 1 hour (dst related) |
| 09:37.42 | KatolaZ | _abc_: ^^^ |
| 09:38.03 | KatolaZ | if you say that the hw clock is set to localtime, the system will do *nothing* |
| 09:38.12 | _abc_ | I don't care about dst now, dst seems to work correctly, selecting 2h offset now vs 3h w/o dst |
| 09:38.15 | KatolaZ | and assume the time it reads is the correct time |
| 09:38.20 | _abc_ | Yes |
| 09:38.33 | _abc_ | And yet if I set the TZ the readout becomes incorrect |
| 09:38.33 | KatolaZ | so it reads 11:something |
| 09:38.38 | *** join/#devuan Oldmoss (~Oldmoss@46.19.140.18) |
| 09:38.41 | _abc_ | that is the problem. |
| 09:40.21 | _abc_ | Again: rtc on local time; LOCAL in adjtime; TZ unset; /etc/timezone linked to correct timezone: outcome: local time is printed correctly with UTC tz name. Setting TZ anv var to real local TZ as in link /etc/timezone: wrong date printout (offset +2h from utc), correct tz name printout |
| 09:40.40 | _abc_ | Iow hwclock ignores --localtime |
| 09:40.52 | KatolaZ | The System Clock must be kept in the UTC timescale for date-time applications to work correctly in conjunction with the timezone configured for the system. If the Hardware Clock is kept in local time then the time read from it must be shifted to the UTC timescale before using it to set the System Clock. The --hctosys function does this based |
| 09:40.57 | KatolaZ | <PROTECTED> |
| 09:41.25 | KatolaZ | so it seems that timezones are off if you hw clock is set to local |
| 09:41.52 | _abc_ | worse: TZ="Europe/Bucharest" hwclock -r --localtime -> correct output; TZ="Europe/Bucharest" hwclock -r --utc -> time displayed in the future! (should be set in the past!) |
| 09:42.02 | _abc_ | So someone made a snafu involving a sign somewhere? |
| 09:42.38 | _abc_ | KatolaZ: I have read not just the manual page but the hwclock.c source, crufty as it is |
| 09:43.04 | _abc_ | Could this be related to recent fixes involving year 2032 problem mitigation? |
| 09:43.06 | KatolaZ | _abc_: my impression is that "we" must be missing something |
| 09:43.11 | _abc_ | KatolaZ: yes, but what. |
| 09:43.15 | KatolaZ | I don't think that's related |
| 09:43.30 | KatolaZ | because there are hundred thousands users which use hw clock to local |
| 09:43.42 | _abc_ | I am open to suggestions. Suggest a set of steps to follow, maybe you can duplicate them on your system, the printout ones which involve no config changes |
| 09:43.43 | KatolaZ | so if this were a genuine bug, you would have found it |
| 09:44.03 | _abc_ | KatolaZ: are there hundreds of thousands of *devuan jessie* users? |
| 09:44.08 | KatolaZ | it's not a rare package used by three people around the globe |
| 09:44.12 | _abc_ | ^^^ |
| 09:44.15 | KatolaZ | there are about 40.000 |
| 09:44.21 | KatolaZ | maybe more |
| 09:44.23 | KatolaZ | maybe less |
| 09:44.27 | _abc_ | Most of them would be advanced or expert level users. |
| 09:44.32 | KatolaZ | uh? |
| 09:44.44 | _abc_ | That is my impression of devuan users for now. |
| 09:44.46 | KatolaZ | actually, a very large fraction is "normal" users |
| 09:45.07 | _abc_ | Redux: are you on jessie now? Do you run rtc on local time? |
| 09:45.11 | KatolaZ | if Devuan were to cater only for "expert" users it would be much easier |
| 09:45.23 | _abc_ | Let's cut the theories out, we can discuss that later over tea. |
| 09:46.00 | KatolaZ | _abc_: my impression is that you are missing something, but I don't know what it is exactly |
| 09:46.12 | KatolaZ | sorry for not being more helpful :( |
| 09:46.28 | _abc_ | Facts: there are the following settings in use: rtc on localtime; /etc/adjtimex contains LOCAL; /etc/timezone linked to Europe/Bucharest and validated (link target); TZ env var is unset. Outcome: |
| 09:46.47 | _abc_ | kernel thinks it runs in UTC and reports UTC times. hwclock thinks likewise. |
| 09:47.03 | _abc_ | Setting TZ in env for hwclock or date causes the wrong time to be printed. |
| 09:47.22 | _abc_ | This means that: a) several things ignore /etc/timezone AND /etc/adjtimex |
| 09:48.35 | KatolaZ | _abc_: timezones are ignored if you say that your rtc is set to loca |
| 09:48.37 | KatolaZ | local |
| 09:48.52 | KatolaZ | that's what the manpage seems to say |
| 09:50.24 | *** join/#devuan inhetep (~inhetep@gateway/tor-sasl/inhetep) |
| 09:51.22 | _abc_ | And yet when the timezone IS set the local time is displayed wrong |
| 09:51.56 | KatolaZ | _abc_: read above |
| 09:52.01 | *** join/#devuan rann (sid175221@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-tidphhmjntwaqnaa) |
| 09:52.06 | KatolaZ | timezones are ignored when rtc is set to local |
| 09:52.18 | KatolaZ | (or they should be, IIUC) |
| 09:52.33 | KatolaZ | having said that, I don't know more |
| 09:52.36 | _abc_ | Yes, should but are not |
| 09:52.43 | KatolaZ | shrugs |
| 09:52.58 | _abc_ | strings date 2>strings-date.out -> no reading of adjtimex |
| 09:54.43 | _abc_ | So hwclock is broken twice over imo. Will be tested more. |
| 09:54.43 | KatolaZ | _abc_: why should date read adjtimex? |
| 09:55.00 | _abc_ | To find out if LOCAL is set or UTC |
| 09:55.04 | KatolaZ | nopoe |
| 09:55.12 | _abc_ | and yes that would not be desirable but is one way to fix it |
| 09:55.13 | KatolaZ | this is not for the applications to solve |
| 09:55.25 | KatolaZ | at all |
| 09:55.35 | _abc_ | I agree, hwclock seems to behave differently from what it used to. |
| 09:55.51 | _abc_ | I checked an older system with slackware, same setup, rtc on local, works flawlessly. |
| 09:55.53 | KatolaZ | have you looked for bug reports about that? |
| 09:56.00 | _abc_ | Not yet. |
| 09:56.13 | KatolaZ | maybe it's a good idea before looking at the source? |
| 09:56.18 | _abc_ | It seems people simply accept that they need to set rtc to utc to "make things work" |
| 09:56.26 | _abc_ | I do not belong to that group of people |
| 09:56.36 | KatolaZ | _abc_: have you checked for bug report? |
| 09:56.50 | KatolaZ | how can you come to a conclusion like that ?!? o_O |
| 09:56.53 | _abc_ | It appears someone declared it not to be a bug and it's just the way you quoted the manpage |
| 09:57.04 | KatolaZ | please link |
| 09:57.16 | _abc_ | Meanwhile I checked timedatectl which is indeed completely working around hwclock |
| 09:57.26 | _abc_ | KatolaZ: you quoted the manpage above |
| 09:57.29 | _abc_ | bbl |
| 09:59.02 | KatolaZ | _abc_: please look for relevant bugreports |
| 09:59.05 | KatolaZ | I was trying to help |
| 09:59.15 | KatolaZ | and I don't maintain or develop hwclock |
| 09:59.16 | KatolaZ | :( |
| 10:01.35 | KatolaZ | https://bugs.debian.org/cgi-bin/bugreport.cgi?bug=855203 _abc_ |
| 10:21.45 | *** join/#devuan Pali (~pali@Maemo/community/contributor/Pali) |
| 10:28.28 | *** join/#devuan mubarak (~mubarak@197.252.1.187) |
| 10:35.36 | *** join/#devuan amarsh04 (~amarsh04@ppp118-210-175-207.bras2.adl6.internode.on.net) |
| 10:37.57 | *** join/#devuan chomwitt (~chomwitt@2a02:587:dc0a:4d00:65db:d392:e7c4:6958) |
| 10:47.13 | *** join/#devuan mubarak (~mubarak@197.252.1.187) |
| 10:48.13 | *** join/#devuan mubarak (~mubarak@197.252.1.187) |
| 10:56.51 | *** join/#devuan DarkUranium (~DarkUrani@77.38.34.248) |
| 11:00.43 | *** join/#devuan inhetep (~inhetep@gateway/tor-sasl/inhetep) |
| 11:16.38 | _abc_ | KatolaZ: thanks for the link, it is relevant |
| 11:17.03 | _abc_ | So, as we surmised, poettering's pottering caontaminated hwclock |
| 11:20.37 | _abc_ | I so effing hate these things, take a perfectly good thing, rip it out, reassemble a worse product breaking 12 other things in the process. |
| 11:24.00 | *** join/#devuan ltem_ (~ltem@178-190-56-133.adsl.highway.telekom.at) |
| 11:28.04 | _abc_ | What a clusterf* systemd really is as a whole, instead of fitting into the existing framework, making up new things and breaking everything else, expecting it to change to accommodate it. Crazy. I really wonder what was in Linus's head when he went along with this way of doing things. |
| 11:28.48 | *** join/#devuan markong (~marco@98.143.158.50) |
| 11:29.02 | specing | he didn't? |
| 11:29.49 | gnarface | _abc_: i don't think Linus had anything to do with it |
| 11:30.07 | _abc_ | And yes in jessie /etc/init.d/hwclock.sh at start) yields to udevd if udevd is present and running. So I was barking up the wrong tree editing /etc/init.d/hwclock.sh |
| 11:30.28 | _abc_ | if [ -d /run/udev ] || [ -d /dev/.udev ]; then return0; fi |
| 11:32.36 | *** join/#devuan rigelk (~acentau@unaffiliated/rigelk) |
| 11:32.37 | _abc_ | aand /lib/udev/hwclock-set locks itself out after one run, using > /run/udev/hwclock-set in lieu of touch(1) |
| 11:33.19 | _abc_ | gnarface: someone had to tolerate the mayhem. And he did, after a number of sparks flew in the beginning. |
| 11:33.58 | gnarface | _abc_: i think we should all be blaming RedHat |
| 11:34.26 | gnarface | Linus isn't the one who paid for that shit |
| 11:35.36 | *** join/#devuan aitor (~aitor@90.85-84-168.dynamic.clientes.euskaltel.es) |
| 11:37.41 | *** join/#devuan Uberius (~Uberius@gateway/tor-sasl/uberius) |
| 11:39.11 | _abc_ | With time zone set, clock set, etc, hwclock running on localtime: /sbin/hwclock --show --utc -> shows a utc time in the future (should be in the past) delta local timezone; |
| 11:39.32 | _abc_ | this is a bug. No idea where, probably in hwclock. |
| 11:39.49 | _abc_ | Can someone please try this? Someone who runs rtc in localtime pleaese. |
| 11:40.01 | _abc_ | TZ="Europe/Bucharest" /sbin/hwclock --show --utc |
| 11:40.22 | _abc_ | set your TZ to your local one, EAST of Greenwich, i.e. delta will be negative |
| 11:40.47 | _abc_ | I assume the code was written and debugged by people at or West of Greenwich, requiring just addition. Sign gotcha. |
| 11:40.56 | _abc_ | Can someone please confirm this? |
| 11:40.59 | _abc_ | gnarface: KatolaZ ? |
| 11:41.42 | _abc_ | Aside: for the reasons in the thread linked by KatolaZ, it appears hwclock is deprecated and or no longer maintained since "they" use the equivalent systemd tool? |
| 11:43.13 | gnarface | i believe you, _abc_ |
| 11:43.32 | gnarface | not gonna test it right now |
| 11:44.00 | _abc_ | Okay, the temporary fix: in /etc/default/hwclock add the line: TZ="Europe/Bucharest" or as approrpiate. |
| 11:44.03 | _abc_ | This is important |
| 11:46.56 | _abc_ | Just TZ=... does not work directly, use: export TZ="Europe/Bucharest" |
| 11:47.46 | _abc_ | This works because neither /etc/init.d/hwclock.sh nor /lib/udev/hwclock-set sanitize the input from /etc/default/hwclock in any way |
| 11:48.01 | _abc_ | You are enjoying the outcome of a fortunate variable injection exploit. |
| 11:48.08 | _abc_ | bbl rebooting to check all is well |
| 11:53.58 | *** join/#devuan AntoFox (~Thunderbi@dynamic-adsl-78-12-42-93.clienti.tiscali.it) |
| 12:04.17 | *** join/#devuan _abc_ (~usre@unaffiliated/ccbbaa) |
| 12:25.57 | *** join/#devuan Obri (daniel@sonne.alt-f4.ch) |
| 12:44.24 | _abc_ | Please see http://188.26.90.203:8888/w/devuan-jessie-local-rtc-howto-v1.txt u:none p:none |
| 12:44.37 | _abc_ | KatolaZ: gnarface fsmithred |
| 12:45.12 | _abc_ | Feedback wanted |
| 12:49.36 | fsmithred | sudo ln -s /usr/share/zoneinfo/Europe/Bucharest |
| 12:49.44 | fsmithred | missing link name |
| 12:50.11 | fsmithred | probably /etc/timezone? |
| 12:50.42 | *** join/#devuan riotjones (~riotjones@unaffiliated/riotjones) |
| 12:52.37 | fsmithred | _abc_, I got as far as 2.7 and my head started to spin. I'm not going to test it, but it looks pretty good. My easier solution to that problem was to wipe windows from the system. |
| 12:53.48 | _abc_ | fsmithred: the problem is not windows, there are others. 2.7 is by the end ;) |
| 12:54.12 | _abc_ | just put the export TZ= into /etc/default/hwclock and all will be well, the rest is details |
| 12:54.37 | _abc_ | fsmithred: yes the link is to the timezone |
| 12:56.10 | fsmithred | nice work. I gave up on that task years ago. |
| 13:00.57 | _abc_ | Updated to 1.1 with your suggestions, more terse |
| 13:01.07 | _abc_ | Please see http://188.26.90.203:8888/w/devuan-jessie-local-rtc-howto-v1.1.txt u:none p:none |
| 13:01.54 | _stephen_ | Shouldn't 2.2 have /etc/localtime for the second argument? |
| 13:01.55 | _abc_ | fsmithred: it's fun how we need to hack our own systems with an env variable injection exploit to fix them. Thanks poettering & co. Keep up the good work. Maybe not? |
| 13:02.02 | _stephen_ | to the ln command? |
| 13:02.04 | _abc_ | _stephen_: yes, see v1.1. updated |
| 13:02.35 | _stephen_ | But if you did 1.1 was 2.2 even needed? |
| 13:03.16 | _abc_ | 2.2 is no longer in 1.1 ;) |
| 13:03.43 | _abc_ | minor edit updated v1.1 to v1.1 |
| 13:03.46 | _abc_ | (reload) |
| 13:04.30 | fsmithred | when you're done with it, this should get posted in a few places (dng, forum, wiki) |
| 13:06.12 | _abc_ | Do it. I think I'm done. Tested on my system, works fine |
| 13:06.47 | _abc_ | Only wrench I could see thrown in that could break things would be kernel command line passed in TZ, which would revert to the old behavior, i.e. brokn |
| 13:06.50 | _abc_ | +e |
| 13:06.59 | _abc_ | dng is what please? |
| 13:07.06 | _abc_ | takes a break reading some headlines |
| 13:07.29 | fsmithred | mailing list (Debian's Not Gnome) |
| 13:07.45 | fsmithred | pre-dated devuan, but it's now the de facto devuan mailing list |
| 13:11.07 | _abc_ | Cleaned up v1.1 tail, I consider it final now. Pending more edit proposals. |
| 13:11.41 | _abc_ | Please reload (final v1.1 edit) http://188.26.90.203:8888/w/devuan-jessie-local-rtc-howto-v1.1.txt u:none p:none |
| 13:12.15 | *** join/#devuan snk77 (~Thunderbi@98.red-81-36-180.dynamicip.rima-tde.net) |
| 13:12.20 | _abc_ | Until further notice, I consider this task done. Ping me if there is anything to add/edit, please feel free to copy and publish the above wherever. |
| 13:12.44 | fsmithred | saved |
| 13:12.56 | _abc_ | I am not on the mailing list(s), maybe will join in the future. Too many things to deal with at the moment, like taming bugs in avr-gcc so I can make my embedded project yield and get paid a bit |
| 13:14.19 | _abc_ | Is it even possible to pass a TZ= argument on the kernel cli at boot time? And if that is done, is it picked up later by some script or the kernel? |
| 13:14.27 | _abc_ | I vaguely remember something like this but I may be wrong? |
| 13:15.26 | _abc_ | https://www.kernel.org/doc/html/v4.14/admin-guide/kernel-parameters.html has nothing on it |
| 13:15.47 | fsmithred | I think there is. |
| 13:15.51 | _abc_ | Which does not mean we are safe, since people abuse the kernel cli a lot all the time and it is parsed later by anyone who wants to |
| 13:16.21 | fsmithred | I know you can set lang, locale and keyboard at boot in live systems. |
| 13:16.47 | fsmithred | but I'm not sure how to do it with installed system. |
| 13:20.20 | debdog | dpkg-reconfigure locales or something, probably |
| 13:22.21 | _abc_ | fsmithred: simply: put params on boot cli, kernel interprets what it can, complete cli ends up in /proc/cmdline in the running system. CLI="`cat /proc/cmdline`" and parse for CAPITALS="foo" (carefully) and you can pass anything to the booting system |
| 13:22.46 | _abc_ | The boot cli is stored as-is or after edit in the bootloader persistent data area |
| 13:23.03 | fsmithred | yeah, but not everything you can put there will do anything |
| 13:23.11 | _abc_ | note that none of the kernel real params is capitalized. This is a key insight. |
| 13:23.33 | _abc_ | fsmithred: you have to do something with it in the boot scripts or later! But there is no way to tell what people run nowadays. |
| 13:23.59 | _abc_ | So caonsidering this is hedging for use on other systems. That's why I only set TZ if it is not already set in the profile scripts |
| 13:24.00 | fsmithred | yeah, live-config scripts are made to handle stuff like that |
| 13:24.12 | fsmithred | including upper-case characters for some things |
| 13:24.30 | _abc_ | And on the same idea, the same conditional TZ should be used in the /etc/default/hwclock for the exact same reason, but we'll see |
| 13:24.47 | _abc_ | I mean in my mini howto from today. |
| 13:26.55 | _abc_ | Anyway, I am happy there is one thing less to rake my brains about while using linux. |
| 13:27.16 | _abc_ | Pretty sure some time in the future someone will pick up the idea and do the right thing to make this hack go away |
| 13:27.24 | fsmithred | lol, I can sympathize with that one. |
| 13:27.44 | _abc_ | Like putting a kerneltz=foo in the proper kernel cli and a way to read it at runtime in sysfs |
| 13:27.49 | _abc_ | (and set it?) |
| 13:28.41 | _abc_ | I am not current with arm booting on rpi etc, are they using uboot or what? uboot can store a proper text cli in nvram and causes no problems |
| 13:29.19 | gnarface | i think they're using uboot |
| 13:29.31 | gnarface | or a fork of it |
| 13:34.48 | *** join/#devuan justinsm (~justinsm@82-69-63-196.dsl.in-addr.zen.co.uk) |
| 13:36.27 | _abc_ | Pretty sure today's predicament was caused by transition to systemd which does not really use hwclock(8) itself |
| 13:37.33 | _abc_ | At some time the need to have TZ set in the env of the 1st 2 calls after boot to settimeofday(2) was "neglected" in the hwclock related use and no doubt not neglected in the systemd centric equivalent timedatectl |
| 13:38.05 | _abc_ | Which is why we, devuan users, have to monitor EACH AND EVERY PACKAGE their changes touch even in a passing-by movement. |
| 13:39.06 | _abc_ | Such as hwclock, everything in util-linux should be audited soon, on a hunch imo, and likewise everything udev related, including the scripts. Note that today's hack ended up patching a udev script while trying to patch a sysvinit hwclock script. |
| 13:39.24 | _abc_ | There is no way to tell what other side effects the crap foisted upon us has had and will have |
| 13:42.56 | gnarface | verily! |
| 13:48.57 | *** join/#devuan inhetep (~inhetep@gateway/tor-sasl/inhetep) |
| 13:56.54 | fsmithred | this 30-second delay on shutting down an encrypted system is getting really annoying. |
| 14:12.51 | *** join/#devuan ar3itrary (~hacker@2a03:4000:6:8177:2::1) |
| 14:15.26 | *** join/#devuan notfalco (uid276764@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-edssisulbjaxjjzm) |
| 14:26.47 | *** join/#devuan Tom-_ (~tomg@64-7-154-56.agas2a-dynamic.dsl.sentex.ca) |
| 14:27.19 | *** join/#devuan targz (~Thunderbi@unaffiliated/targz) |
| 14:29.54 | _abc_ | fsmithred: ah yes ;) And starting it too. |
| 14:30.07 | fsmithred | starting seems to be ok |
| 14:30.08 | _abc_ | Maybe someone should not rely on kernel based dns or such? >;) |
| 14:30.32 | _abc_ | I have tuned tcp stacks before to change the socket timeout to very short? Maybe-related? Tried lsof on the process? |
| 14:30.56 | _abc_ | fsmithred: is that a live devuan's encrypted persistence or something else? |
| 14:31.17 | fsmithred | no, luks encrypted partition on hard drive |
| 14:31.22 | fsmithred | installed system |
| 14:31.40 | fsmithred | it's a known problem, there are bug reports on a few packages related to it |
| 14:32.35 | *** join/#devuan g4570n (~g4570n@unaffiliated/g4570n) |
| 14:33.54 | fsmithred | ok, I just learned something new - you can't get to grub command line or grub menu with full-disk encryption. It goes right from asking for password to loading the kernel. |
| 14:34.18 | fsmithred | I'll try changing the timeout |
| 14:36.09 | _abc_ | Without lsof telling you what it is waiting on it is hard |
| 14:36.26 | fsmithred | running lsof when it's shutting down is hard |
| 14:36.45 | fsmithred | it hangs at the point where it wants to unmount filesystems |
| 14:42.56 | _abc_ | instrument the commands with lsof or strace and then issue a shutdown. Probably logging to another volume which is not auto umounted. |
| 14:43.17 | _abc_ | fsmithred: does it perhaps issue the umount command from the mounted fs itself? |
| 14:43.32 | _abc_ | If so you should sync and them remount -o ro first |
| 14:43.42 | _abc_ | That works with -f normally |
| 14:44.12 | _abc_ | You can try to mount -o remount,ro manually before issuing the shutdown (in the shutdown script). |
| 14:44.31 | _abc_ | Before that close all apps and drop to a shell, gui closed. Too many things try to write configs otherwise |
| 14:45.31 | _abc_ | Even so things may go badly. Imo one needs to work a bit more on the pivot-root issue when booting (already done) and when shutting down (not done) |
| 14:46.02 | _abc_ | But hey without this we'd have a perfect system which needs no work and we'd be occupied with other things instead of making it work. |
| 14:48.26 | fsmithred | I'll try that. I just booted it again and will be shutting down in a minute. |
| 14:48.44 | fsmithred | it would be nice to fix this before I move my real system to ascii. |
| 14:50.24 | fsmithred | oops. no, I disconnected the encrypted drive. will test later. |
| 14:50.35 | fsmithred | testing installer at the moment |
| 14:52.05 | DocScrutinizer05 | https://twitter.com/buyvpnservice/status/977910770859200512 https://www.privateinternetaccess.com/blog/2018/03/dear-president-trump-dont-sign-sesta-fosta-let-internet-haveavoice/ |
| 14:54.24 | _abc_ | oh noes is this not a politics free channel? At least trump free? |
| 14:54.39 | _abc_ | We are not all American. And not all anti Trump. |
| 14:59.04 | golinux | Doc please take it to #debianfork. |
| 15:00.57 | _abc_ | (I think DocScrutinizer05 isn't American either btw) |
| 15:01.50 | DocScrutinizer05 | don't worry, soon ot will come as freenode global notice |
| 15:06.38 | _abc_ | DocScrutinizer05: I'm connected to an European freenode server. I don't mind netsplits ;) Would make it hard to talk to people who contribute, though, I mean those who are in trump-land |
| 15:07.06 | _abc_ | cross linked to ##electronics, maybe-relevant: http://ars.userfriendly.org/cartoons/?id=20180325 |
| 15:07.15 | specing | fsmithred: what kind of FDE are you using? |
| 15:07.29 | fsmithred | what is FDE? |
| 15:07.57 | *** join/#devuan zjason (~user@111-250-151-203.dynamic-ip.hinet.net) |
| 15:09.10 | _abc_ | DocScrutinizer05: to finish up, you're in Germany, and your wonderful country's applied laws just caused Project Gutenberg to block all German users at firewall level as a result of it. Fix it before talking about other nations? ref: https://cand.pglaf.org/germany/index.html |
| 15:09.11 | specing | full-disk encryption |
| 15:09.21 | _abc_ | specing: he said LUKS |
| 15:09.49 | specing | that is odd then, as I normally get a grub menu and I have FDE |
| 15:10.16 | fsmithred | I extended the timeout in /etc/default/grub to 15 seconds, and now I get the menu |
| 15:10.50 | fsmithred | could probably do it with 10, but it needs more than 5 seconds to figure out what to do with the password. |
| 15:15.30 | *** join/#devuan Akuli (~Akuli@mobile-access-bceeb6-95.dhcp.inet.fi) |
| 15:15.36 | *** join/#devuan _0bitcount (~Big_Byte@2a01:c50e:8821:4200:ad9d:2c40:4cf5:612f) |
| 15:23.13 | DocScrutinizer05 | _abc_: fix it yourself |
| 15:23.35 | *** join/#devuan divansantana (~divansant@156.0.193.126) |
| 15:24.56 | DocScrutinizer05 | I don't have to fix anything before saying something, and I didn't talk about "other nations" either |
| 15:33.02 | DocScrutinizer05 | also fix WHAT? international fucked up state of Copyright laws? I guess we had to start in USA with that, once more |
| 15:33.25 | specing | isolating USA could fix the planet |
| 15:33.31 | DocScrutinizer05 | ack |
| 15:33.41 | specing | Trump is actually excellent |
| 15:33.44 | specing | #MEGA |
| 15:41.06 | *** join/#devuan pillepalle (~Thunderbi@ip-109-90-187-181.hsi11.unitymediagroup.de) |
| 15:41.18 | *** join/#devuan aslan8649 (~niemand@birnbaum.blauedonau.com) |
| 15:43.07 | aslan8649 | hello, i have install devuan on a laptop. the install went well. the X greeting comes up and I attempt to log in . It accepts my login but does not bring up the desktop just returns to the login screen |
| 15:43.46 | furrywolf | you may need to check /var/log/Xorg.0.log for errors |
| 15:44.05 | fsmithred | how did you install? Which iso did you use? |
| 15:44.40 | furrywolf | switch to a terminal (ctrl-alt-F1), log in as root, then look at that file with 'less /var/log/Xorg.0.log' |
| 15:45.00 | aslan8649 | i downloaded the entire torrent and used devuan jessie 1.0.0 amd64 |
| 15:45.26 | fsmithred | netinstall? DVD? CD? desktop-live? |
| 15:46.04 | aslan8649 | right now I am using devuan live. I used the DVD image to install. |
| 15:46.47 | fsmithred | ok, check the log on the installed system |
| 15:47.02 | aslan8649 | i have to reboot to do that. |
| 15:47.07 | fsmithred | no |
| 15:47.18 | fsmithred | mount /dev/sd?? /mnt |
| 15:47.22 | fsmithred | then |
| 15:47.37 | fsmithred | less /mnt/var/log/Xorg.0.log |
| 15:48.05 | aslan8649 | i have one other issue. I have two identical external WD USB 3.0 drives. both 4TB. the two drives are not partitioned the same. |
| 15:48.30 | aslan8649 | the os is seeing the drives as the same drive. |
| 15:48.46 | fsmithred | wtf? |
| 15:49.01 | fsmithred | is there hardware raid? |
| 15:49.14 | aslan8649 | no. two separate drives |
| 15:49.27 | fsmithred | fdisk shows one or two drives? |
| 15:49.43 | fsmithred | fdisk -l |
| 15:49.45 | furrywolf | do you mean they randomly get assigned to the same device (/dev/sdb, /dev/sdc), but you don't know which is which each time you boot? |
| 15:50.18 | aslan8649 | the os is treating the sdb drive as the sdc drive |
| 15:50.32 | fsmithred | oh, you're running the live from a usb |
| 15:50.41 | aslan8649 | basically i cannot use the actual dev sdb |
| 15:50.45 | fsmithred | and the boot drive (usb) is sda |
| 15:50.50 | fsmithred | am I right? |
| 15:51.28 | fsmithred | no. I need glasses. |
| 15:51.31 | furrywolf | are you mounting them manually with "mount", or is something else auto-mounting them? |
| 15:51.46 | aslan8649 | i have a dvd with the devuan live image in the dvd drive in the laptop. i have sdb sdc plugged into the USB 3 ports. sda is windows |
| 15:52.54 | fsmithred | that should work, but sometimes there is disagreement between grub and the kernel on which drive is which device. |
| 15:53.01 | *** join/#devuan menip (~menip@c-73-83-2-241.hsd1.wa.comcast.net) |
| 15:53.19 | aslan8649 | sdc has 8 partitions sdb has 7 partitions. sdc is devuan sdb is debian stretch |
| 15:54.04 | fsmithred | fdisk agrees with that? |
| 15:54.12 | aslan8649 | is slash dev there should be only 7 entries for sdb. there are 8 entries |
| 15:54.46 | aslan8649 | tune2fs -l sdc3 & tune2fs -l sdb3 are identical |
| 15:55.09 | aslan8649 | the same UUID |
| 15:55.16 | fsmithred | ??? |
| 15:55.40 | aslan8649 | brb going to look at xorg log |
| 15:55.46 | fsmithred | ok |
| 15:55.56 | fsmithred | I'd still like to know what fdisk says |
| 15:57.47 | *** join/#devuan cocoadaemon (~foo@2a01:e35:8a99:e90:1202:b5ff:fe91:e4ca) |
| 15:59.25 | aslan8649 | the problem with the x-login is that the X is wanting to use FB and there is no dev fs0 |
| 15:59.30 | aslan8649 | the problem with the x-login is that the X is wanting to use FB and there is no dev fb0 |
| 16:01.26 | aslan8649 | where do you want me to paste the output of fdisk -l |
| 16:01.46 | aslan8649 | fdisk -l shows sdb and sdc as the same drive |
| 16:02.08 | furrywolf | X should fall back to VESA in that case... are there any other errors? (lines with EE) |
| 16:02.36 | fsmithred | telling me that is good enough |
| 16:02.44 | fsmithred | that's really weird |
| 16:02.50 | aslan8649 | xorg.log shows looking to open fb0 cannot find it so it closes. |
| 16:04.15 | fsmithred | I suck at diagnosing xorg problems. Do you have the right driver installed? |
| 16:04.23 | fsmithred | (full desktop should have done that) |
| 16:06.00 | aslan8649 | http://wien.blauedonau.com/~terrylr/fdisk.txt |
| 16:07.04 | aslan8649 | is there a backport for devuan? |
| 16:07.23 | aslan8649 | is ASCII available for testing? |
| 16:08.00 | fsmithred | yes |
| 16:08.28 | fsmithred | check /dev/disk/by-id and by-uuid |
| 16:09.43 | fsmithred | https://files.devuan.org/devuan_ascii_beta/ |
| 16:09.51 | furrywolf | what does dmesg | grep sd show? |
| 16:10.23 | fsmithred | 1+ |
| 16:11.00 | furrywolf | or upload the whole dmesg output somehwere, it may be interesting. |
| 16:11.14 | furrywolf | I've never seen a problem like that, ever. heh. |
| 16:11.16 | fsmithred | something very odd is going on |
| 16:13.16 | aslan8649 | http://wien.blauedonau.com/~terrylr/Xorg.0.log |
| 16:13.44 | *** join/#devuan ToffeeYogurtPots (~ToffeeYog@gateway/tor-sasl/toffeeyogurtpots) |
| 16:14.48 | furrywolf | X is starting successfully, but your window manager/desktop environment is failing, I think. |
| 16:14.57 | furrywolf | could you upload dmesg too? |
| 16:15.10 | aslan8649 | all of dmesg |
| 16:15.24 | furrywolf | yes |
| 16:15.37 | furrywolf | unless you think it would contain sensitive information. (it usually does not) |
| 16:15.56 | furrywolf | that log shows X was running for a while |
| 16:16.32 | aslan8649 | http://wien.blauedonau.com/~terrylr/dmesg-all |
| 16:17.14 | furrywolf | it also shows it couldn't load the proper video driver, but it fell back to VESA and started correctly. |
| 16:17.35 | aslan8649 | x greeter runs I just cannot loging to a desktop. any desktop. kde, xfce4, etc |
| 16:18.29 | furrywolf | dmesg shows that it is indeed the kernel screwing up the hard drives... congratuations! you may have found a kernel bug. :) |
| 16:19.06 | aslan8649 | lucky me |
| 16:19.40 | furrywolf | it first correctly identifies them as two different drives, with two different serial numbers... then seems to create both devices pointing at the same drive. |
| 16:19.51 | aslan8649 | so basically i can only have one drive plugged in at a time. |
| 16:21.04 | furrywolf | I'm afraid I'm not familiar enough with that part of linux to diagnose it further.. |
| 16:21.16 | aslan8649 | <PROTECTED> |
| 16:21.19 | furrywolf | does it do the same thing if you boot with one drive attached, then attach the other after it's done booting? |
| 16:21.30 | furrywolf | also, does it do this from any other linux distros? |
| 16:21.36 | aslan8649 | furrywolf, yes it does. |
| 16:22.08 | fsmithred | "new high-speed USB device number 4 using xhci_hcd" comes up twice; once for each of the big drives |
| 16:22.23 | aslan8649 | yes |
| 16:23.10 | aslan8649 | the debian install has a newer kernel installed. it does not have the issue. |
| 16:23.12 | fsmithred | I don't know what to make of that |
| 16:23.44 | fsmithred | you could try 4.9 kernel from jessie-backports |
| 16:23.52 | furrywolf | fsmithred: they're on different controllers. the two drives are recognized correctly, separately by the usb subsystem. |
| 16:24.04 | furrywolf | I would suggest installing Ascii. that kernel is pretty old. |
| 16:24.07 | aslan8649 | it is assigning the same usb id to the drives |
| 16:24.22 | furrywolf | no, the usb part is working correctly. |
| 16:24.24 | furrywolf | [Sun Mar 25 15:30:46 2018] usb 2-2.1: new SuperSpeed USB device number 3 using xhci_hcd |
| 16:24.32 | furrywolf | [Sun Mar 25 15:30:46 2018] usb 2-2.1: SerialNumber: 5758383144313733344E3844 |
| 16:24.39 | furrywolf | [Sun Mar 25 15:30:46 2018] usb 2-2.4: new SuperSpeed USB device number 4 using xhci_hcd |
| 16:24.48 | furrywolf | [Sun Mar 25 15:30:46 2018] usb 2-2.4: SerialNumber: 57584D314539373744553632 |
| 16:25.10 | furrywolf | it's assigning them different usb IDs correctly, and correctly reading the different drive serial numbers at that point. |
| 16:25.22 | aslan8649 | furrywolf, okay |
| 16:25.54 | furrywolf | [Sun Mar 25 15:30:46 2018] scsi2 : usb-storage 2-2.1:1.0 |
| 16:25.54 | aslan8649 | fdisk cfdisk parted see them as the same drive. |
| 16:26.00 | furrywolf | [Sun Mar 25 15:30:46 2018] scsi3 : usb-storage 2-2.4:1.0 |
| 16:26.11 | furrywolf | and it's correctly assigning them different scsi layers |
| 16:26.14 | fsmithred | USB device number 4 gets read twice - first time for one disk, second time for the repeat disk |
| 16:26.48 | furrywolf | but, when it sets up the scsi devices, it seems to be pointing them both at the same drive |
| 16:26.53 | fsmithred | as if that drive got connected twice |
| 16:27.07 | aslan8649 | yes |
| 16:27.30 | fsmithred | ascii is mostly ready. You could try that. |
| 16:27.45 | furrywolf | fsmithred: no, it's not... the usb device numbers are not system-wide unique. they're on different controllers. |
| 16:27.57 | aslan8649 | be back later , insulin and morphine time. |
| 16:28.23 | *** join/#devuan pillepalle (~Thunderbi@ip-109-90-187-181.hsi11.unitymediagroup.de) |
| 16:28.29 | furrywolf | one is a crappy webcam on a different controller, the other is one of the drives. |
| 16:28.30 | MinceR | mighty morphine power rangers |
| 16:28.39 | fsmithred | where does it say which controller it's on? |
| 16:29.04 | furrywolf | device numbers are only unique per controller; he has multiple controllers. |
| 16:30.29 | furrywolf | my best guess would be the bug is in the scsi emulation layer |
| 16:30.37 | furrywolf | first thing to do is try ascii with the 4.14 bpo kernel. |
| 16:30.50 | furrywolf | tracking down already-fixed bugs is most annoying. :) |
| 16:32.17 | *** join/#devuan Tom-_ (~tomg@64-7-154-56.agas2a-dynamic.dsl.sentex.ca) |
| 16:33.26 | fsmithred | oh, I have a live-iso with that kernel |
| 16:35.58 | aslan8649 | to the person who asked why i take morphine http://wien.blauedonau.com/~terrylr/accident-pictures.dir/ridder_accident_pictures_021-equalized.jpg |
| 16:36.23 | aslan8649 | so basically change |
| 16:36.38 | aslan8649 | jessie to ascii on etc apt sources.list |
| 16:37.55 | furrywolf | I asked in ##linux about your issue, and someone would like to see the output of lsblk and lsscsi, if you could upload them. |
| 16:41.37 | aslan8649 | http://wien.blauedonau.com/~terrylr/lsblk.out |
| 16:42.01 | aslan8649 | http://wien.blauedonau.com/~terrylr/lsscsi.out |
| 16:47.40 | furrywolf | do you mind if I paste those log urls in ##linux? |
| 16:48.27 | furrywolf | he uploaded the files to his hosting. I messaged you the URLs. |
| 16:48.30 | furrywolf | grr, wrong window |
| 16:48.50 | furrywolf | is talking to too many people at once |
| 16:58.50 | aslan8649 | furrywolf, please do |
| 16:58.59 | furrywolf | aslan8649: do you want to join ##linux, so I don't have to relay messages back and forth? User ananke is trying to figure it out. |
| 16:59.52 | *** join/#devuan andyxator (~andyx@ppp85-140-239-198.pppoe.mtu-net.ru) |
| 17:02.37 | *** join/#devuan snk77 (~Thunderbi@98.red-81-36-180.dynamicip.rima-tde.net) |
| 17:04.03 | aslan8649 | furrywolf, i cannot send to ##linux. |
| 17:04.12 | aslan8649 | furrywolf, very odd |
| 17:05.55 | furrywolf | you need to register and identify to your nick |
| 17:06.04 | furrywolf | did you at some point clone one drive off the other one? |
| 17:07.17 | furrywolf | heh, every time I see "aslan" I think of the leather goods company... I just bought an aslan jaguar two weeks ago. :) |
| 17:07.19 | aslan8649 | furrywolf, no |
| 17:11.32 | furrywolf | aslan8649: as he says, unplug both, reboot, plug in just one, run fdisk -l again, unplug, reboot, plug in just the other one, run fdisk -l again, upload both. |
| 17:11.47 | *** join/#devuan snk77 (~Thunderbi@98.red-81-36-180.dynamicip.rima-tde.net) |
| 17:11.58 | furrywolf | I'd prefer reboots to waiting, just to make sure it gets re-done. |
| 17:14.18 | *** join/#devuan menip (~menip@c-73-83-2-241.hsd1.wa.comcast.net) |
| 17:19.23 | *** join/#devuan msiism (~msiism@200116b845803f00ee086bfffe1ced28.dip.versatel-1u1.de) |
| 17:22.47 | *** join/#devuan n4dir (~user@200116b868aee000021a4bfffe4896d9.dip.versatel-1u1.de) |
| 17:34.11 | *** join/#devuan menip (~menip@c-73-83-2-241.hsd1.wa.comcast.net) |
| 17:34.40 | *** join/#devuan snk77 (~Thunderbi@98.red-81-36-180.dynamicip.rima-tde.net) |
| 17:34.47 | *** join/#devuan ssbb (~eafaef@S0106602ad06acd48.vc.shawcable.net) |
| 17:36.03 | *** join/#devuan namix (~namix@bla.netunix.de) |
| 17:36.03 | *** join/#devuan namix (~namix@unaffiliated/namix) |
| 17:50.52 | *** join/#devuan NewGnuGuy (~NewGnuGuy@72.34.178.34) |
| 17:52.16 | *** join/#devuan Levure (~quassel@91.180.45.182) |
| 18:07.34 | *** join/#devuan Oldmoss (~Oldmoss@anon-42-159.vpn.ipredator.se) |
| 18:14.46 | *** join/#devuan msiism (~msiism@200116b845803f00ee086bfffe1ced28.dip.versatel-1u1.de) |
| 18:15.00 | *** join/#devuan s_kunk (~s_kunk@unaffiliated/s-kunk/x-5139101) |
| 18:20.31 | *** join/#devuan Gup (~Gup@jh3.jhodges.co.uk) |
| 18:20.59 | *** join/#devuan jhv (~jhv@server.rfc968.net) |
| 18:33.18 | *** join/#devuan fleeky__ (~fleeky@75-101-60-65.dsl.static.fusionbroadband.com) |
| 18:36.52 | *** join/#devuan telst4r (~telst4r@fsf/member/telst4r) |
| 18:38.22 | _abc_ | So, any more takers, take my howto on how to run devuan with RTC clock on localtime, and proper timezones: http://188.26.90.203:8888/w/devuan-jessie-local-rtc-howto-v1.1.txt feedback wanted |
| 18:39.31 | msiism | _abc_: server says "Authorization Required" |
| 18:39.52 | fsmithred | none:none |
| 18:40.03 | msiism | fsmithred: ok. thanks |
| 18:40.04 | _abc_ | yeah sorry, none:none |
| 18:40.23 | fsmithred | I've got that password memorized! |
| 18:40.31 | _abc_ | hehe, time to change it, then ;) |
| 18:40.39 | _abc_ | It just keeps idiot scripts out |
| 18:41.18 | _abc_ | Pasting a link on irc nowadays invites at least 12 different lurker bots to come and sniff my socks. I don't like that. the none:none business is a Turing test of sorts. |
| 18:41.43 | msiism | ok, i see. |
| 18:42.04 | _abc_ | Du siehst ? |
| 18:42.10 | *** join/#devuan jhv (~jhv@server.rfc968.net) |
| 18:42.46 | msiism | _abc_: yes, that too. |
| 18:45.55 | msiism | _abc_: do you have an account on the fod wiki? |
| 18:46.25 | _abc_ | no, no time. I tinker with devuan only on Sundays. I use it for the rest of the week ;) |
| 18:47.29 | msiism | _abc_: ok. no problem. well i was thinking that your howto could be included into the Howtos, Tips & Tricks section there. |
| 18:47.55 | msiism | i'm not qualified to really evaluate the technical side of it, though. |
| 18:47.57 | _abc_ | Yes, I think fsmithred said he'll put it there? If we ask nicely? |
| 18:48.19 | _abc_ | msiism: just use it if you need it. Need rtc in localtime for legacy and dual boot? Use the howto. |
| 18:48.43 | fsmithred | I will post to the forum. |
| 18:49.12 | fsmithred | just haven't done it yet. Still deep in live installer. |
| 18:49.17 | msiism | fsmithred: ok. |
| 18:50.05 | fsmithred | msiism, if you feel like doing it now, go ahead. Otherwise, I will get to it later. |
| 18:50.40 | msiism | fsmithred: hm...let me thing about that for a second. |
| 18:50.41 | fsmithred | or dng |
| 18:50.47 | fsmithred | np |
| 18:55.08 | msiism | _abc_: i'm just trying to really get the problem you're adressing. how would i find out if the rtc is set to local time on my system? |
| 18:56.29 | msiism | ok, i'll have to use the hwclock command...getting there |
| 18:57.39 | _abc_ | hwclock --show in theory, except that always prints it in local TZ |
| 18:58.04 | _abc_ | So what you do is: TZ= ; export TZ; sudo hwlock --show |
| 18:58.11 | msiism | _abc_: yes, hwclock --show --utc wrongly displays loca time as you state in the howto. |
| 18:58.12 | _abc_ | which in theory, shows the unchanged hw clock |
| 18:58.38 | _abc_ | So don't use --utc |
| 18:58.40 | _abc_ | see above |
| 18:58.54 | msiism | ok |
| 18:58.59 | _abc_ | unset TZ; export TZ; hwclock --localtime --show |
| 18:59.02 | fsmithred | other way to check is to go into the bios and look at the time |
| 18:59.08 | _abc_ | yeah that requires a reboot |
| 18:59.16 | msiism | fsmithred: i thought that, yes. |
| 18:59.43 | fsmithred | rebooting at least a couple times per hour here today |
| 18:59.54 | _abc_ | In theory you can read out /dev/rtc and look at it with od -tax1 and decode it by hand, it is packed BCD. But that is too hardcore for milennials ;) |
| 19:00.29 | _abc_ | fsmithred: I get uptimes of weeks on devuan usually, and reboot for technical reasons, such as fixing something that poettering & co broke, like today. |
| 19:00.52 | fsmithred | same here. just rebooting VMs to test installer. |
| 19:01.54 | *** join/#devuan xes (~xes@unaffiliated/xes) |
| 19:02.50 | *** join/#devuan Drugo (~Drugo@62-11-1-95.dialup.tiscali.it) |
| 19:03.39 | msiism | fsmithred: ok, i can post that in the documentation section of the forum. |
| 19:03.48 | fsmithred | thanks |
| 19:04.10 | fsmithred | helps me keep my post count down |
| 19:04.23 | msiism | _abc_: would you mind making some minor changes (not technical ones) before? |
| 19:04.37 | *** join/#devuan Tom-_ (~tomg@64-7-154-56.agas2a-dynamic.dsl.sentex.ca) |
| 19:04.59 | drawkula | we need a disk uptime cache :-P |
| 19:05.07 | msiism | _abc_: I'd change the heading to "HOW TO RUN DEVUAN JESSIE WITH /dev/rtc ON LOCALTIME" (so, leave out "linux"). |
| 19:07.33 | msiism | _abc_: also, you use TZ and tz interchangably as an abbreviation for "timezone" and as a variable name, if i understand it right. could you maybe always say "TZ". i think that would be clearer. |
| 19:08.06 | _abc_ | I would not like to leave out Linux on purpose. |
| 19:08.16 | _abc_ | The divorce has not yet been pronounced ;) |
| 19:08.41 | _abc_ | msiism: TZ is always used as var name and tz is always used as abbreviation for timezone. |
| 19:09.00 | _abc_ | I can add a line that says that to the howto. WOuld that be okay msiism |
| 19:09.14 | msiism | _abc_: yes that would be nice. |
| 19:09.22 | fsmithred | or don't abbreviate timezone |
| 19:09.33 | *** part/#devuan andyxator (~andyx@ppp85-140-239-198.pppoe.mtu-net.ru) |
| 19:10.54 | msiism | _abc_: about the heading. ok, i understand that. but why not say "How to run Devuan GNU/Linux 1.x (Jessie)...". "Linux Devuan Jessie" just sounded a bit odd to me. but if you insist on keeping it that way, so be it. |
| 19:11.29 | *** join/#devuan jhv (~jhv@server.rfc968.net) |
| 19:11.39 | _abc_ | It's less confusing I think. |
| 19:11.50 | _abc_ | Who is jessie, who is devuan? Ah, linux, okay |
| 19:12.01 | _abc_ | http://188.26.90.203:8888/w/devuan-jessie-local-rtc-howto-v1.1.txt updated user:pass none:none |
| 19:12.48 | msiism | _abc_: ok. thanks. i'll post that. |
| 19:13.36 | msiism | fsmithred: would you have reformetted that with all the nice formatting option on the foum or pasted it as pre-formatted text? |
| 19:14.04 | fsmithred | oh, I hadn't thought about that |
| 19:14.13 | _abc_ | msiism: thanks. Please post as text, will probably need an edit or two |
| 19:14.20 | fsmithred | was thinking of just copy/paste the whole thing |
| 19:14.25 | _abc_ | I'll join the forum some time next week after the 1st. Other priorities. |
| 19:14.43 | msiism | fsmithred: that would probably break the layout. |
| 19:14.56 | msiism | _abc_: ok, so i'll post it as a "code block" then. |
| 19:15.23 | _abc_ | Your choice. I assume code block is nice. Later there may be some additions I have in mind, with links and so on to other howtos and references. |
| 19:15.25 | fsmithred | quote box should work, otherwise code box |
| 19:15.28 | msiism | or...is there another tag for pre-formatted text? |
| 19:15.29 | msiism | ok |
| 19:17.46 | NewGnuGuy | _abc_: Wouldn't a better solution be to set the other OS (I'm guessing we're talking about Redmond-flavored OSs in this dual-boot scenario) to read the hardware clock as UTC? |
| 19:17.56 | *** join/#devuan mubarak (~mubarak@197.252.3.99) |
| 19:18.03 | NewGnuGuy | https://askubuntu.com/a/232452 |
| 19:18.09 | _abc_ | NewGnuGuy: no |
| 19:18.30 | _abc_ | And it is not redmond flavored. There are other things out there which want your time and your soul. |
| 19:18.34 | *** join/#devuan okf (~Thunderbi@62-11-129-229.dialup.tiscali.it) |
| 19:19.03 | *** join/#devuan mansaxel_ (mansaxel@jaja.besserwisser.org) |
| 19:19.40 | fsmithred | BeOS? |
| 19:20.10 | okf | Ciao. Can I ask you how to change OS name in grub entries? |
| 19:20.29 | fsmithred | what name are you getting? |
| 19:21.13 | okf | Devuan and I would like to change it? May I ask it here? |
| 19:21.21 | fsmithred | yes, you already did ask |
| 19:21.29 | fsmithred | create /etc/lsb-release file |
| 19:21.43 | fsmithred | or easier... |
| 19:21.49 | fsmithred | edit /etc/default/grub |
| 19:22.19 | msiism | _abc_: i'll post the howto in a second. just one thing to keep in mind: you won't be able to edit my post. so, if you post an updated version of the howto, then i should best delete my first post after that. i'll check for this to happen. |
| 19:22.40 | msiism | (may that's why i was thinking of the wiki first...) |
| 19:22.47 | _abc_ | Sure, I'll pester you here when the time comes. Expect it to take a while |
| 19:22.56 | msiism | _abc_: ok |
| 19:23.01 | _abc_ | Thanks. |
| 19:23.28 | okf | '/etc/default/grub/' wouldn't be override to kernel updates? (sorry for my english) |
| 19:23.29 | msiism | so, i hope this is ok: https://dev1galaxy.org/viewtopic.php?pid=8095#p8095 |
| 19:23.48 | msiism | _abc_: i had to use a code block, since quote blocks don't allow [*] inside of them. |
| 19:24.00 | fsmithred | okf, I don't have a plain devuan to test with... |
| 19:24.11 | fsmithred | what does 'lsb_release -i -s' give you? |
| 19:24.38 | *** join/#devuan minnesotags (~herbgarci@c-24-118-22-254.hsd1.mn.comcast.net) |
| 19:24.42 | fsmithred | Devuan or Debian? |
| 19:25.35 | okf | devuan |
| 19:25.50 | fsmithred | ok, make a file |
| 19:25.58 | fsmithred | hang on a sec |
| 19:26.51 | _abc_ | I get Devuan on jessie fsmithred |
| 19:27.02 | _abc_ | capitalized like that |
| 19:27.08 | fsmithred | yeah, I'm going to tell you how to fix it |
| 19:27.55 | fsmithred | here's an example /etc/lsb-release. Change it as needed. http://termbin.com/po9r |
| 19:28.01 | _abc_ | msiism: okay, bookmarked. You could have modded * to whatever. Like @ |
| 19:28.02 | fsmithred | then run update-grub |
| 19:28.17 | _abc_ | fsmithred: who needs to fix this? |
| 19:28.22 | mansaxel_ | good evening (at least here in europe.) Is it expected for the installer to choke on IPv6 mirrors? I'm getting a repeated problem to connect to a mirror using IPv6, even though I can reach the site just fine from other computers using the same network.. |
| 19:28.43 | _abc_ | msiism: are you behind any nat? |
| 19:28.44 | fsmithred | _abc_, I was telling okf how to change the distro name in the boot menu. |
| 19:28.51 | _abc_ | oh ok fsmithred |
| 19:29.43 | msiism | _abc_: tbh, i don't know. |
| 19:30.00 | msiism | _abc_: why are you asking? |
| 19:30.32 | fsmithred | okf, DISTRIB_DESCRIPTION will be used in the boot menu. |
| 19:31.56 | okf | thank you, it works :D |
| 19:32.12 | fsmithred | great |
| 19:32.30 | _abc_ | msiism: re: 'can't put *' in whatever form you tried to post in before |
| 19:33.07 | msiism | _abc_: sry, i don't get it. |
| 19:39.22 | msiism | _abc_: the reason i used code block and not quote block tags on the forum is that, in quote blocks, [*] will be interpreted as a list item and also the code block has better readability, imo. |
| 19:40.29 | _abc_ | okay |
| 19:40.53 | _abc_ | I mean s/\*/@/ on the text would have rendered it quote block ready. Anyway, it's nice as is, leave it |
| 19:41.08 | _abc_ | I just object usually to style, white on black is out of place most of the time. |
| 19:41.46 | msiism | _abc_: ok. i use it all the time (well white/color on dark gray, to be exact. |
| 19:41.50 | *** join/#devuan _0bitcount (~Big_Byte@2a01:c50e:8821:4200:ad9d:2c40:4cf5:612f) |
| 19:43.47 | msiism | _abc_: but ok, it's a bit of a stark contrast with the rest of the forum's color scheme. |
| 19:44.39 | msiism | bbl |
| 19:45.42 | *** join/#devuan wolfen[w] (~quassel@163.47.129.250) |
| 19:46.43 | _abc_ | Anyway that objection is just formal, ignore it. |
| 19:47.05 | _abc_ | My eyes are used too much for text, I got choosy about fonts and contrast as I need more and more glasses ;) |
| 19:51.47 | *** join/#devuan pillepalle (~Thunderbi@ip-109-90-187-181.hsi11.unitymediagroup.de) |
| 19:54.09 | *** join/#devuan xes (~xes@unaffiliated/xes) |
| 20:13.50 | *** join/#devuan jhv (~jhv@server.rfc968.net) |
| 20:22.36 | *** join/#devuan Hoshpak (~Hoshpak@200116b80064e70045f254987d8d9f73.dip.versatel-1u1.de) |
| 20:25.59 | *** join/#devuan wolfen[w] (~quassel@163.47.129.250) |
| 20:41.03 | *** join/#devuan telst4r (~telst4r@fsf/member/telst4r) |
| 20:42.49 | *** join/#devuan Hoshpak (~Hoshpak@200116b8006aa20045f254987d8d9f73.dip.versatel-1u1.de) |
| 20:47.44 | mansaxel_ | Never mind, the solution is to install nonfree firmware and upgrade to the deferred kernel that somehow was the only patch not installed. Good, that. |
| 20:48.56 | *** join/#devuan jhv (~jhv@server.rfc968.net) |
| 20:55.18 | *** part/#devuan NewGnuGuy (~NewGnuGuy@72.34.178.34) |
| 21:00.52 | *** join/#devuan agl (~ag@ipb21bb023.dynamic.kabel-deutschland.de) |
| 21:16.57 | *** join/#devuan armin (~armin@p5DD03755.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) |
| 21:18.39 | *** join/#devuan jhv (~jhv@server.rfc968.net) |
| 21:21.43 | golinux | msiism: Should _abc return, please inform that there is a purpy theme for this forum with black text on light gray. |
| 21:23.24 | golinux | It's called Purpylite and can be chosen in the Profile Display settings |
| 21:25.27 | msiism | golinux: ok. will do. i'll maybe check it out myself. thanks. |
| 21:25.47 | *** join/#devuan Schallaven (~Schallave@grad338-038.resnet.yorku.ca) |
| 21:31.57 | *** join/#devuan snk77 (~Thunderbi@98.red-81-36-180.dynamicip.rima-tde.net) |
| 21:53.16 | *** join/#devuan jhv (~jhv@server.rfc968.net) |
| 22:13.08 | *** join/#devuan n4dir (~user@200116b868aee000021a4bfffe4896d9.dip.versatel-1u1.de) |
| 22:21.21 | *** part/#devuan snk77 (~Thunderbi@98.red-81-36-180.dynamicip.rima-tde.net) |
| 22:23.38 | *** join/#devuan jhv (~jhv@server.rfc968.net) |
| 22:39.14 | *** join/#devuan Human_G33k (~HumanG33k@62.147.242.8) |
| 22:41.48 | *** join/#devuan devil (~quassel@mail.g7y.de) |
| 22:55.53 | *** join/#devuan Tom-_ (~tomg@64-7-154-56.agas2a-dynamic.dsl.sentex.ca) |
| 22:59.58 | *** join/#devuan jhv (~jhv@server.rfc968.net) |
| 23:11.03 | *** join/#devuan Drugo (~Drugo@62-11-1-95.dialup.tiscali.it) |
| 23:19.08 | *** join/#devuan HumanG33k (~HumanG33k@62.147.242.8) |
| 23:19.20 | *** join/#devuan ToffeeYogurtPots (~ToffeeYog@gateway/tor-sasl/toffeeyogurtpots) |
| 23:19.29 | *** join/#devuan jhv (~jhv@server.rfc968.net) |
| 23:25.16 | *** join/#devuan HumanG33k (~HumanG33k@62.147.242.8) |
| 23:26.56 | *** join/#devuan HumanG33k (~HumanG33k@62.147.242.8) |
| 23:30.41 | *** join/#devuan Achylles (~Achylles@2804:431:d725:5ef8:ba86:87ff:fe53:d811) |
| 23:31.17 | *** join/#devuan telst4r (~telst4r@fsf/member/telst4r) |
| 23:31.42 | *** join/#devuan ffernand (~ffernand@devworker.com) |
| 23:32.51 | *** join/#devuan exio4 (~exio4@unaffiliated/hacker) |
| 23:34.44 | *** join/#devuan HumanG33k (~HumanG33k@62.147.242.8) |
