| 00:01.25 | DocScrutinizer05 | fsmithred: "Devuan is about >>Init F______<< -> instr($check, "reedom") |
| 00:02.30 | DocScrutinizer05 | who cares about the color of the default desktop? who's even supposed to know that before they join the forum? |
| 00:03.13 | *** join/#devuan zjason (~user@59-115-99-218.dynamic-ip.hinet.net) |
| 00:05.15 | DocScrutinizer05 | also check first hit from https://www.ixquick.com/do/search?q=What+is+the+color+of+the+default+theme+for+the+Devuan+desktop --> https://talk.devuan.org/t/how-do-i-change-my-desktop-and-cursor-theme/354 |
| 00:06.08 | golinux | DocScrutinizer05: Your monitor is defective if the desktop looks gray to you. Either that or you're color blind! |
| 00:06.25 | DocScrutinizer05 | http://wstaw.org/m/2017/04/24/plasma-desktopV22054.png |
| 00:07.23 | golinux | Those are gawd awful colors. More fuchsia than purple. |
| 00:07.35 | golinux | That hurt my eyes. |
| 00:07.35 | DocScrutinizer05 | to start with, are only people allowed on the forum who installed a desktop Devuan Jessie (and have a non-broken monitor and eye sight)? |
| 00:08.16 | DocScrutinizer05 | I mean, that's a bot fence question, not trivial pursuit |
| 00:08.16 | golinux | What have you been drinking (or smoking) |
| 00:08.46 | golinux | There are a few questions. Try again and you'll get a different one. |
| 00:09.44 | DocScrutinizer05 | yeah, I got "what means SSD?" - I honestly don't know many users who might want to use Devuan who actually know to answer that question |
| 00:10.04 | DocScrutinizer05 | know personally, that is |
| 00:10.32 | golinux | Well come up with some questions then that will fool the bots |
| 00:10.42 | golinux | Email them to me. |
| 00:10.50 | DocScrutinizer05 | I think there are like 15 friends of mine who might be interested and only a 4 of them could answer that question |
| 00:11.03 | golinux | It's not as easy as it sounds. |
| 00:11.21 | Xenguy | I hear that SSDs really improve boot time |
| 00:11.43 | Xenguy | Don't own one yet myself |
| 00:11.52 | golinux | Bots have figured out numbers |
| 00:12.07 | DocScrutinizer05 | [2017-04-24 Mon 02:01:25] <DocScrutinizer05> fsmithred: "Devuan is about >>Init F______<< -> instr($check, "reedom") |
| 00:12.23 | golinux | So we made the questions Linux/Devuan specific |
| 00:12.35 | golinux | Yeah I read the scrollback |
| 00:13.02 | fsmithred | I missed a couple of them, too |
| 00:13.12 | golinux | We can add that one |
| 00:13.45 | DocScrutinizer05 | I asked in gere "what's the dang color?" - answer been "purpy", go figure! |
| 00:13.52 | DocScrutinizer05 | here* |
| 00:15.03 | golinux | But somwon who doesn't hang out here would see it as purple. |
| 00:15.35 | golinux | I need to red the entire back log. Give me a sec to catch up. |
| 00:19.01 | *** join/#devuan infobot (ibot@rikers.org) |
| 00:19.01 | *** topic/#devuan is Recent (2017-04-21 - for real now): Jessie 1.0 RC ** https://devuan.org/ discussion channel (logged at https://botbot.me/freenode/devuan - with useful 'search') | Please take off-topic conversation to #debianfork | /msg chanserv info #devuan | !listkeys #devuan <foo> | Devuan Forum: https://dev1galaxy.org/ |
| 00:21.53 | DocScrutinizer05 | http://wstaw.org/m/2017/04/24/plasma-desktoph22054.png 122,118,145 - well, this qualifies as pretty much gray |
| 00:23.23 | DocScrutinizer05 | as opposed to e.g. http://wstaw.org/m/2017/04/24/plasma-desktoph22054.png |
| 00:25.43 | DocScrutinizer05 | 122,118,145. 4 more on Green and it would be a blueish gray, not a purpy |
| 00:26.11 | golinux | Those pngs are identical |
| 00:26.23 | DocScrutinizer05 | are they? |
| 00:26.32 | DocScrutinizer05 | oops |
| 00:26.44 | DocScrutinizer05 | the heck |
| 00:26.48 | golinux | Yeah oops. |
| 00:27.21 | DocScrutinizer05 | http://wstaw.org/m/2017/04/24/plasma-desktopn22054.png |
| 00:27.35 | golinux | I really don't have time for this and neither does the channel. As you said . . . silly questions. |
| 00:27.48 | DocScrutinizer05 | sorry, was too fast for my pastebin applet |
| 00:28.01 | golinux | That's a disgusting cvolor a fichsia not purple. |
| 00:28.16 | golinux | Jeesh . . .typos |
| 00:28.35 | DocScrutinizer05 | whatever it is, it's what "google" gives you, searching for "purple" pictures |
| 00:29.28 | golinux | I've been doing artwork my entire life and never have heard 'that' color called purple. |
| 00:29.41 | DocScrutinizer05 | enough bikeshedding, I think the question is pretty hard to answer |
| 00:30.22 | golinux | Not even close. Now please lets stop spamming this channel with silliness |
| 00:30.39 | DocScrutinizer05 | and most people never did artwork in their life and would refer to google for definition of a color, if anything |
| 00:31.10 | golinux | Don't believe everything you read on the internet! |
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| 00:31.32 | DocScrutinizer05 | this is a poll |
| 00:32.00 | DocScrutinizer05 | and I believe that poll shows an accurate result of what others call that color |
| 00:33.04 | DocScrutinizer05 | https://www.ixquick.com/do/search?q=purple&nj=0&cat=pics |
| 00:35.06 | DocScrutinizer05 | they might all be wrong. My friend tells me everybody except offset print professionals are wrong in calling "magenta" incorrectly "red" |
| 00:35.59 | DocScrutinizer05 | <ETX-ot> |
| 00:36.18 | Leander_ | you can bring that conversation on debianfork instead |
| 00:36.24 | Leander_ | #debianfork |
| 00:36.26 | DocScrutinizer05 | not worth it |
| 00:37.05 | Leander_ | then stop it |
| 00:37.16 | DocScrutinizer05 | ^^^ <ETX-ot> |
| 00:37.26 | golinux | Good grief PLEASE stop. It's inappropriate to go on and on in this channel and more than annoying. |
| 00:38.55 | DocScrutinizer05 | do we start pleading each other to stop pleading each other now? ;-P |
| 00:39.41 | golinux | I really don't want to have to put you on ignore Doc. |
| 00:40.09 | DocScrutinizer05 | but you can't stop without having the final comment, right? |
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| 00:41.59 | Leander_ | "oh look I'm trolling, that's so funny" |
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| 02:24.10 | zono50 | First of all, thanks to everyone for your hard work on continuing the proud traditions of Free Linux |
| 02:24.54 | zono50 | I am having issues installing nvidia drivers tho after installing devuan. When I go through the installer, it says, "Unable to find the kernel source tree for the currently running kernel" |
| 02:28.33 | nikitis | He wants to know what the kernel-source package is called in Devuan |
| 02:43.05 | fsmithred | too late: apt-get install linux-headers-`uname -r` |
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| 03:06.19 | Xenguy | No patience, 12 minutes |
| 03:07.11 | Xenguy | good solution too |
| 03:44.29 | golinux | The distrowatch numbers keep getting better and better. Look at this! 1 week: 11 (775) #11. How cool is that!! |
| 03:45.24 | fsmithred | up from 50 yesterday |
| 03:46.19 | Centurion_Dan | that will be from us all looking to see if Devuans stats are going up ;-) |
| 03:46.19 | *** join/#devuan Mr (5bcf3983@gateway/web/freenode/ip.91.207.57.131) |
| 03:46.22 | fsmithred | been there and done that with the nvidia drivers |
| 03:46.32 | fsmithred | lol |
| 03:47.01 | Mr | Ello all. second time here since getting educated on this subject. |
| 03:47.36 | AlexLikeRock | nvidia drivers (firmaware ) head-braker ! |
| 03:48.04 | AlexLikeRock | yeah , |
| 03:48.28 | AlexLikeRock | <PROTECTED> |
| 03:48.38 | AlexLikeRock | a mount ago i see at 23 place |
| 03:52.15 | Xenguy | hello Mr , what's up? |
| 03:52.28 | Xenguy | Great to see the interest |
| 03:53.37 | Xenguy | Best to get ssl certificate redundancy going too |
| 03:53.45 | Xenguy | Admin redundancy in general |
| 03:53.52 | Xenguy | Buddy system or w/e |
| 03:53.58 | Xenguy | Just typing out loud |
| 03:54.56 | Mr | Hello Xen, it is an interesting topic. I finally put in the time to dig a bit deeper into details of both sides and seems the mission of devuan is somthing I align with more. |
| 03:56.48 | Xenguy | This is a decent starter site for researching systemd issues: http://without-systemd.org/wiki/index.php/Main_Page |
| 03:57.13 | Xenguy | It's where I usually point people who are asking, what's the deal with systemd |
| 03:58.10 | Xenguy | Mr: Had you tried installing? |
| 03:58.17 | Xenguy | *Have |
| 04:00.56 | Mr | Ironicly not yet. I need to dl the iso and migrate. I'm on a systemd disto now, was thinking arch for a while then heard of parabola which forked into discovering devuan |
| 04:01.32 | Xenguy | For me it's like the Debian I used to know and love... |
| 04:01.49 | Xenguy | If you have spent time with Debian, you'll feel right at home |
| 04:01.57 | Mr | good to know. |
| 04:02.10 | Xenguy | What DE do you prefer? |
| 04:03.15 | Xenguy | e.g. gnome, kde, xfce |
| 04:03.33 | Xenguy | lxde |
| 04:03.45 | Mr | I like xfce or mate |
| 04:03.58 | golinux | just sent an email to distrowatch asking them to remove GNOME as a desktop option |
| 04:04.09 | Xenguy | Both of those work fine I hear, tho I run MATE so I know from experience that works great |
| 04:04.13 | Mr | did openbox for a bit but a little too minimal to be practical |
| 04:04.30 | Xenguy | good idea golinux , so as to manage expectations |
| 04:05.08 | Xenguy | Openbox is great, and I've used more minimal than that, but I tend to DE instead of WM these days, cos I'm spoiled a bit :-) |
| 04:05.18 | golinux | There hasn't been a demand. No surprise there. Want GNOME? Use Debian. Simple. |
| 04:05.27 | Xenguy | Exactly |
| 04:06.09 | Xenguy | And from my personal vindictive point of view, GNOME deserves to be cut loose, for a variety of reasons pertaining to systemd, debian, RH, etc. |
| 04:08.32 | Xenguy | I won't say FG, but you get the idea = ) |
| 04:09.08 | Mr | I was a bid intrugued by Manjaro, but seems to be picking up steam |
| 04:09.39 | Xenguy | Is that the RPM based distro that has changed names a thousand times? |
| 04:13.38 | Xenguy | A. No, you're thinking of a completely different distro |
| 04:14.54 | Xenguy | Based on Arch, so it is non-deb based |
| 04:15.13 | Xenguy | Arch tends to be more bleeding edge (in both good and bad ways) |
| 04:15.35 | Xenguy | They cut loose 32-bit for example (or are going to) |
| 04:16.32 | Mr | yes that is the one. I might ruffle feathers but the more i looked into it the more it seemed like the ubunto of arch. not that that is good or nescessarily bad.. |
| 04:16.57 | Xenguy | This is the bounty of gnu/linux: choice |
| 04:17.10 | Xenguy | Pay your money, take your chance :-) |
| 04:17.25 | Mr | cheers to that~ |
| 04:17.29 | Xenguy | Of course Debian/Devuan has always been the sane choice :p |
| 04:17.36 | Xenguy | ;-) |
| 04:20.47 | Mr | true:o) |
| 04:21.14 | Mr | on that note, I must run. till next time.. |
| 04:21.20 | Xenguy | ttyl |
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| 04:32.35 | bluemarlin | with Arch the only thing bleeding was me, usually... |
| 04:37.27 | bluemarlin | i had to pray for good fortune before each pacman -Syu :] |
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| 07:32.59 | AntoFox | morning!! |
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| 07:44.33 | AntoFox | the problems with xapps are now fixed |
| 07:44.47 | AntoFox | happy desktop |
| 07:44.53 | AntoFox | bbl |
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| 08:07.13 | Enrico_Menotti | Good morning. I have debootstrapped Devuan for an arm architecture. Now at boot it tries to mount selinux on /sys/fs/selinux. But this path does not exist. I think selinux is disabled in the kernel. How to avoid it to be mounted? |
| 08:09.55 | unpleased | Good morning Enrico ! |
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| 08:10.23 | unpleased | Can you tell me the libselinux version ? |
| 08:10.36 | Enrico_Menotti | A minute... |
| 08:14.42 | Enrico_Menotti | I have some difficulties. I am currently running Debian on that device. With the Devuan file system mounted. I tried to chroot into the Devuan file system and run dpkg-query -s libselinux, but that says libselinux is not installed. |
| 08:15.20 | Enrico_Menotti | I will boot Devuan and try from there. But since I have the keyboard not properly set, first I have to create auxiliary scripts. |
| 08:17.46 | unpleased | Uhm well, that may be the issue ... |
| 08:19.42 | unpleased | the proper way to mount a |
| 08:19.42 | unpleased | selinuxfs in a chroot is to bind mount it from the host, not mount a new |
| 08:19.42 | unpleased | fs. |
| 08:20.30 | unpleased | mount --bind /sys/fs/selinux /target/sys/fs/selinux |
| 08:20.46 | unpleased | mount -o remount,ro,bind /target/sys/fs/selinux |
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| 08:22.41 | Enrico_Menotti | Ok, I have booted Devuan and asked about libselinux. It is not installed. |
| 08:24.04 | unpleased | It's weird because libselinux is a (hard-)dependency of coreutils, mount and util-linux |
| 08:25.52 | Enrico_Menotti | So now should I install it? |
| 08:31.40 | unpleased | I would say so |
| 08:33.13 | Enrico_Menotti | But isn't there a way to get completely rid of selinux? |
| 08:35.44 | Enrico_Menotti | E: unable to locate package libselinux |
| 08:35.59 | Enrico_Menotti | (After apt-get install libselinux in the chroot jail.) |
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| 08:38.57 | unpleased | this should be a network issue |
| 08:40.17 | Enrico_Menotti | Yesterday I have been able to install packages in this way. So I think the network is ok. |
| 08:40.58 | DocScrutinizer05 | did somebody try the vagrant box? |
| 08:41.29 | jaromil | yes me, works like a charm |
| 08:42.04 | jaromil | hi everyone. re: torrent - the best way to have it is to help us squash the last urgent bugs if any, then we'll rename or reroll new isos and label it final and make a torrent |
| 08:42.22 | jaromil | the RC is not supposed to stay up for long. i'd go for 3 weeks max |
| 08:44.44 | Enrico_Menotti | unpleased It's libselinux1. Version 2.3-2. |
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| 08:46.35 | DocScrutinizer05 | maybe my vagrant tooling is too old then |
| 08:47.18 | DocScrutinizer05 | ssh doesn't establish an auth dialog |
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| 10:53.54 | DocScrutinizer05 | logging in to beta vagrantbox I get this: http://paste.ubuntu.com/24447209. Trying to log in to RC vagrantbox ssh stalls in line#17 like this http://paste.ubuntu.com/24446607/ (to sessions in sequence, to root and $user). Any ideas? |
| 10:54.23 | DocScrutinizer05 | two sessions* |
| 10:57.53 | DocScrutinizer05 | there's a maybe 60s timeout before "ssh_exchange_identification: read: Connection reset by peer" |
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| 11:40.44 | jaromil | http://www.linux-magazin.de/NEWS/Devuan-1.0-auf-der-Zielgeraden |
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| 11:54.02 | KatolaZ | https://www.developpez.com/actu/131896/L-equipe-Devuan-annonce-la-sortie-de-la-release-candidate-de-Jessie-1-0-0-la-premiere-version-du-fork-de-Debian-sans-systemd/ |
| 11:54.35 | KatolaZ | https://www.nixp.ru/news/14005.html |
| 11:54.42 | KatolaZ | http://webwereld.nl/open-source/98379-systemd-vrije-debian-fork-komt-eindelijk-uit-beta |
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| 14:38.12 | telmich | what's the best place to report bugs for the installer? I.e. when it cannot install the boot loader into a raid6 setup? |
| 14:38.21 | telmich | somewhere at devuan or better at debian? |
| 14:43.00 | KatolaZ | telmich: use reportbug |
| 14:43.08 | KatolaZ | just be sure that you have the last version from the repos |
| 14:43.20 | KatolaZ | 6.6.3+devuan1.3 |
| 14:43.33 | KatolaZ | and then use "devuan-installer" as package name |
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| 14:43.49 | KatolaZ | telmich: the bug will be filed to bugs.devuan.org |
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| 14:46.15 | DocScrutinizer05 | !bug |
| 14:46.15 | infobot | somebody said #devuan bugtracker was https://bugs.devuan.org/Reporting.html, or "make sure the destination email address in reportbug is submit@bugs.devuan.org ! " |
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| 14:47.42 | telmich | KatolaZ: ok, thanks! |
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| 14:50.07 | RilloBiley | hello #devuan |
| 14:50.31 | RilloBiley | I have a problem with apt-get update fetching i386 packages: https://pastebin.com/rSivxwPL |
| 14:51.04 | RilloBiley | I deleted the files from /var/, but apt-get update puts them back there |
| 14:51.18 | parazyd | RilloBiley: you should edit your e/tc/apt/sources.list |
| 14:51.35 | RilloBiley | it's not in sources.list |
| 14:51.37 | parazyd | remove dupes, and the amd64 mentions if you're not using amd64 |
| 14:51.42 | parazyd | oh? |
| 14:51.50 | RilloBiley | I want amd64 |
| 14:51.56 | parazyd | can you check |
| 14:52.01 | RilloBiley | I don't need i386 anymore |
| 14:52.07 | parazyd | it's what the error says: duplicate sources.list entry |
| 14:52.11 | parazyd | that file is in /etc/apt |
| 14:52.24 | parazyd | there is also sources.list.d which can hold more files |
| 14:54.04 | RilloBiley | sources.list https://pastebin.com/aqjAR8NK |
| 14:55.38 | RilloBiley | in sources.list.d devuan.list is commented out & keybase.list only has deb http://prerelease.keybase.io/deb stable main |
| 14:58.43 | RilloBiley | I meant to ask golinux about this yesterday, but my laptop switches off at random (hurray) |
| 14:59.27 | golinux | Maybe a hardware problem? |
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| 15:02.12 | parazyd | thatt is strange then, indeed |
| 15:03.41 | DocScrutinizer05 | use grep? |
| 15:03.43 | golinux | Other than that, I haven't a clue. I've never had a lappy. ;) Or done wifi for that matter. |
| 15:04.30 | RilloBiley | the laptop has a flexing issue |
| 15:04.48 | RilloBiley | which is located around the northbridge I think |
| 15:05.37 | RilloBiley | which is compounded by the high temps I'm reaching in the gpu, because the embedded controller doesnt work properly and cpu fan speed isnt controllable |
| 15:06.24 | RilloBiley | tl;dr I'll be switching the components out of this laptop with a new mainboard, just as soon as I've finished playing with the os |
| 15:07.04 | RilloBiley | right now, how do I remove i386? |
| 15:07.50 | RilloBiley | then switch to unstable, then install firmwarelinux-nonfree if it still isn't fixed |
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| 15:09.46 | gnu_srs | dpkg --remove-architecture i386? |
| 15:10.42 | AntoFox | O/ |
| 15:11.04 | golinux | AntoFox: \o |
| 15:11.13 | gnu_srs | you also have; dpkg --print-architecture |
| 15:11.28 | AntoFox | guys someone work on logind problem??? |
| 15:11.50 | AntoFox | golinux: \o |
| 15:12.15 | gnu_srs | and dpkg --print-foreign-architectures |
| 15:17.07 | RilloBiley | I get dpkg: error: cannot remove architecture 'i386' currently in use by the database |
| 15:18.00 | gnu_srs | RilloBiley: dpkg -l | grep i386. You still have i386 packages installed? |
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| 15:18.31 | RilloBiley | yes, probably have opengli386 |
| 15:19.00 | RilloBiley | I don't want any more i386 packages, though |
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| 15:22.27 | gnu_srs | dpkg -r --purge or apt-get remove --purge the i386 package, and then dpkg --remove-architecture i386? |
| 15:23.36 | RilloBiley | this was the output https://pastebin.com/ZRC32nKq |
| 15:24.57 | RilloBiley | I would like to be able to keep and use what I've got. I just don't want to fetch anything more |
| 15:25.17 | gnu_srs | I think you need to remove all these packages, e.g. apt-get remove --purge libelf1:i386 |
| 15:25.47 | gnu_srs | Aha, then I don't know, sorry ;( |
| 15:25.57 | gnu_srs | :( |
| 15:26.12 | gnu_srs | Pinning? |
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| 15:32.52 | RilloBiley | I can just remove them if I have to |
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| 15:56.36 | gnarface | infobot: hello |
| 15:56.36 | infobot | Howdy Bub |
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| 16:13.56 | ciaobello | I'm looking for a howto to install devuan from the minimal live iso in to a virtualbox as a persisten installation. Where do i find something like this? |
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| 16:15.00 | KatolaZ | ciaobello: use can use refractainstaller |
| 16:15.21 | KatolaZ | but be careful since minimal-live has backprots enabled |
| 16:15.29 | KatolaZ | by mistaek |
| 16:15.32 | KatolaZ | ~mistake |
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| 16:15.58 | mchasard | yesterday i reported a sound trouble with midori |
| 16:15.59 | ciaobello | ok, i give a try |
| 16:16.25 | mchasard | i don't know if someone has find something about it |
| 16:16.43 | KatolaZ | ciaobello: please consider that installation fomr minimal-live has not been tested thoroughly |
| 16:17.31 | KatolaZ | but please report any problems/issues :) |
| 16:18.49 | freemangordon | parazyd: seems I can;t find git/svn repo for gtk2, the link on the bottom of https://packages.debian.org/source/jessie/gtk+2.0 does not point to the same code. any hint? |
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| 16:31.58 | ciaobello | KatolaZ, i give a try ... |
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| 16:34.19 | parazyd | freemangordon: it's not this? https://anonscm.debian.org/viewvc/pkg-gnome/desktop/jessie/gtk%2B2.0/ |
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| 16:48.37 | freemangordon | parazyd: no, there is one more patch applied on top, see https://github.com/fremantle-gtk2/gtk/tree/2.24.25-3+deb8u1 |
| 16:50.09 | freemangordon | and this patch can be found only on debian bugtracker (and in the source package ofc) |
| 16:50.27 | parazyd | svn://anonscm.debian.org/pkg-gnome/desktop/unstable/gtk+2.0/ |
| 16:50.37 | parazyd | my devuan pulled this with apt-get souce |
| 16:50.54 | parazyd | Get:2 http://packages.devuan.org/merged/ jessie/main gtk+2.0 2.24.25-3+deb8u1 (tar) [13.3 MB] |
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| 16:51.07 | freemangordon | yes, but 099_CVE-2013-7447.patch is missing on svn repo |
| 16:52.23 | freemangordon | parazyd: look at https://anonscm.debian.org/viewvc/pkg-gnome/desktop/unstable/gtk%2B2.0/debian/changelog?view=markup&pathrev=44128 |
| 16:52.58 | freemangordon | or if you wish, take a look at debian/changelog in trunk (or whatever svn term for HEAD is) |
| 16:53.17 | freemangordon | there is no "gtk+2.0 (2.24.25-3+deb8u1) jessie; urgency=medium" entrie |
| 16:53.20 | parazyd | this is weird indeed |
| 16:53.29 | freemangordon | *entry |
| 16:53.31 | parazyd | yeah i see your point now |
| 16:54.26 | freemangordon | anyway, I merged that missing patch and hopefully the sources I work with now are correct |
| 16:54.50 | parazyd | they should be |
| 16:55.02 | parazyd | that's also the patch that got applied when i did apt-get source |
| 16:55.15 | parazyd | (the CVE) |
| 16:55.21 | freemangordon | mhm |
| 16:56.02 | parazyd | i'd say keep going with that. everything else looks fine |
| 16:57.07 | freemangordon | ok, according to meld everything is the same when comparing git version with apt-get source version :) |
| 16:57.43 | freemangordon | but still, it is weird that svn repo does not match what is in the debian repo |
| 16:57.49 | freemangordon | anyway |
| 16:57.51 | parazyd | it is indeed |
| 16:58.04 | parazyd | we could for it and apply it ourselves |
| 16:58.33 | parazyd | then have a devuan gtk2 package. i believe not much will change, unless a new CVE is assigned |
| 16:58.53 | freemangordon | https://github.com/fremantle-gtk2/gtk/tree/2.24.25-3+deb8u1 is 100% match to what is in the repo, I am basing maemo fork on top of it |
| 16:59.02 | parazyd | good! |
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| 17:04.20 | RilloBiley | hello |
| 17:04.26 | RilloBiley | I have removed i386 |
| 17:04.56 | RilloBiley | I still have one conflict though, between sources.list & /var/lib/apt/lists/ |
| 17:05.28 | RilloBiley | wat do? |
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| 17:12.56 | gnu_srs | RilloBiley: What kind of conflict? |
| 17:13.33 | RilloBiley | this: W: Duplicate sources.list entry http://gb.mirror.devuan.org/merged/ jessie/main amd64 Packages (/var/lib/apt/lists/gb.mirror.devuan.org_merged_dists_jessie_main_binary-amd64_Packages) |
| 17:14.21 | RilloBiley | I say "conflict", I'm not sure it matters. I just want it clean & tidy for when I switch the repos over to unstable |
| 17:14.45 | RilloBiley | I need to try a newer kernel, otherwise I'd be avoiding unstable |
| 17:15.27 | RilloBiley | what do I need to do to tidy it up? |
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| 17:16.30 | gnu_srs | Is that warning (W:...) coming from apt-get update? |
| 17:16.43 | RilloBiley | yeah |
| 17:17.17 | gnu_srs | can you paste your sources.list somewhere? |
| 17:20.13 | RilloBiley | yup |
| 17:21.31 | RilloBiley | https://pastebin.com/s38frWV6 |
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| 17:23.53 | gnu_srs | You have two entries of jessie/main: deb http://gb.mirror.devuan.org/merged/ jessie main and deb http://gb.mirror.devuan.org/merged/ jessie main contrib non-free |
| 17:24.21 | lowee[m] | remove 'main' from your non-free line or add the nonfree stuff to the first entry (i'd gues that hes complaining about double main :) ) |
| 17:24.22 | gnu_srs | same for deb-src lines |
| 17:24.44 | RilloBiley | what are you telling me, exactly? |
| 17:25.19 | RilloBiley | ohh so, "main" isn't necessary on the nonfree line? |
| 17:26.22 | lowee[m] | yes, since it is already defined elsewhere (afaik) |
| 17:27.10 | RilloBiley | I changed it from 'main contrib non free' to 'contrib main non free' like the cdrom line... |
| 17:27.13 | RilloBiley | lets see what happens |
| 17:28.28 | RilloBiley | nope, don't think that's the problem |
| 17:28.41 | RilloBiley | apt-get update isn't complaining about the non-free part |
| 17:29.38 | lowee[m] | i'd gues it is only complaining about the string 'main' in that line |
| 17:29.44 | lowee[m] | try only removing that |
| 17:29.50 | RilloBiley | it's complaining that sources.list's jessie main amd64 packages is the same as /var/lib/apt/lists' jessie main binary amd64 packages |
| 17:30.07 | RilloBiley | I'll try it anyway |
| 17:30.54 | RilloBiley | ohh.. you were right :) |
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| 17:34.37 | RilloBiley | and non-free stuff still works too |
| 17:36.57 | lowee[m] | glad to be helping |
| 17:37.23 | RilloBiley | I'm not brave enough atm to switch to unstable |
| 17:37.33 | RilloBiley | but hopefully sometime this week I will try it |
| 17:37.48 | RilloBiley | if the kernel update works, I won't need linux firmware nonfree |
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| 18:41.39 | armin | does devuan have stickers and shirts already? |
| 18:42.31 | KatolaZ | armin: https://devuan.org/os/outreach |
| 18:42.58 | armin | nice. ;) |
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| 18:44.02 | armin | so i've been using ascii a.k.a. testing on my work notebook for some while. i was not able to use a bunch of applications because of broken dependencies (dbus). what's the current state so far? should i try again anytime soon? |
| 18:44.36 | armin | i'm asking because in order to use that notebook with 2 external monitors attached to my docking station i need a newer kernel than stable offers. |
| 18:44.54 | KatolaZ | armin: I am using ascii on an old laptop |
| 18:44.58 | KatolaZ | it works |
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| 18:45.06 | KatolaZ | dunno if it is good for your use case |
| 18:45.10 | armin | KatolaZ: of course it does. |
| 18:45.18 | KatolaZ | since I am not heavily dependent on desktop applications |
| 18:45.21 | armin | KatolaZ: what about dbus? |
| 18:45.48 | armin | KatolaZ: i was able to do my work on it on an everyday basis, i'm just asking if that issue is resolved already. :) |
| 18:46.14 | KatolaZ | armin: ascii has not received much attention so far... |
| 18:46.15 | KatolaZ | :) |
| 18:46.50 | armin | KatolaZ: fair enough. |
| 18:46.52 | malinas` | I've got some machines runnign on ascii, but using i3wm, and only had minor issues |
| 18:47.01 | KatolaZ | I can tell you that I have dbus installed |
| 18:47.09 | KatolaZ | on ascii |
| 18:47.14 | KatolaZ | and no systemd :) |
| 18:47.16 | armin | malinas`: i was even able to use KDE on it. :) |
| 18:47.36 | KatolaZ | (there is still libsystemd, though) |
| 18:47.36 | armin | KatolaZ: ok, maybe i should just give it another try soon. |
| 18:47.45 | malinas` | if you're keen on reinstalling, I suggest trying jessie with backports for a recent kernel |
| 18:47.50 | KatolaZ | beware: I upgraded from jessie |
| 18:47.59 | KatolaZ | since there are still problems with rsyslogd |
| 18:48.05 | KatolaZ | (it's kept back) |
| 18:48.55 | armin | :) |
| 18:49.20 | malinas` | I wrote about it here: https://dev1galaxy.org/viewtopic.php?id=542 |
| 18:50.09 | KatolaZ | armin: I know that parazyd was able to run KDE on ascii |
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| 18:54.13 | newdevuan | Meep. Nice, devuan live running on older laptop, all is well. Thanks. now, just a few details... I have no beep from console. Is there a setting in the system settings? |
| 18:58.56 | armin | KatolaZ: so was i |
| 18:59.02 | armin | KatolaZ: ran quite well |
| 18:59.14 | armin | KatolaZ: i was unable to install virt-manager, though |
| 18:59.26 | armin | KatolaZ: so had to run virt-manager from within a docker container, which obviously was annoying |
| 18:59.47 | armin | newdevuan: you complain that you DON'T have a beep? wow. |
| 18:59.49 | KatolaZ | armin: there are some issues though |
| 19:00.05 | KatolaZ | e.g., screen lock is *permanent* :D |
| 19:00.16 | newdevuan | No beep, no visual notification, nothing. |
| 19:00.26 | armin | newdevuan: https://debian-administration.org/article/110/Removing_annoying_console_beeps |
| 19:00.28 | newdevuan | Looking for settings |
| 19:00.35 | KatolaZ | newdevuan: alsamixer |
| 19:00.39 | armin | newdevuan: try to follow these steps entirely inversed. |
| 19:00.41 | KatolaZ | it might have been muted |
| 19:00.47 | newdevuan | tried that, did not help. Just a minute |
| 19:00.49 | KatolaZ | newdevuan: which live, BTW? |
| 19:00.59 | armin | disabling beepage is the first thing i do on any computer... |
| 19:01.04 | KatolaZ | is it the regular live-iso or the minimal-live? |
| 19:01.32 | newdevuan | regular |
| 19:01.54 | KatolaZ | newdevuan: are you sure all snd_ modules have been loaded correctly? |
| 19:04.46 | newdevuan | sure, youtube plays fine in ff |
| 19:04.57 | newdevuan | xset b on nada |
| 19:05.03 | newdevuan | in an xterm |
| 19:05.09 | newdevuan | trying console |
| 19:05.45 | newdevuan | same outcome |
| 19:06.30 | newdevuan | setter -blength 200 same |
| 19:08.17 | MinceR | does the pc speaker of that laptop work at all? |
| 19:08.39 | newdevuan | ok enabling the control for Beep and pulling it up in the audio mixer (gui) enabled the console beep, no beep in the xterm |
| 19:09.07 | newdevuan | MinceR: again, it was playing firefox html5 sound on youtube... |
| 19:09.23 | MinceR | sure, but that's some sort of more advanced waveform, equivalent of a sound card |
| 19:09.33 | newdevuan | ? |
| 19:09.40 | MinceR | i thought some manufacturers might skimp on the basic beeper function |
| 19:09.46 | newdevuan | no |
| 19:09.56 | MinceR | (which has its own square wave generator and on non-laptops, its own speaker) |
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| 19:10.23 | abcdevuan | MinceR: yes but that is moot, all the stuff is inside a jungle fpga like asic, there is no point. |
| 19:10.58 | MinceR | :) |
| 19:11.23 | abcdevuan | Saving $0.05 is not worth the discussions later. |
| 19:11.26 | abcdevuan | brb |
| 19:12.12 | abcdevuan | Installing devuan allows later desktop change right? |
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| 19:12.56 | abcdevuan | Is there not some special system notification setting in xfce4-terminal? |
| 19:16.45 | MinceR | 24 211123 < abcdevuan> Saving $0.05 is not worth the discussions later. |
| 19:16.50 | MinceR | if only more people understood that. |
| 19:18.20 | abcdevuan | I have never seen a chipset that did not support beep. The bad old nasty timer routed through gate to speaker beep. |
| 19:18.49 | abcdevuan | Not even nasty Compaq and Dellium 1990s laptops which took liberties with printer ports and worse. |
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| 19:25.14 | fsmithred | <PROTECTED> |
| 19:25.29 | fsmithred | got it installed on a toshiba laptop here |
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| 19:30.01 | MinceR | :) |
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| 19:53.17 | abcdevuan | fsmithred: Ctrl-Alt-F2 into console, echo -e "\a" -> beep |
| 19:53.54 | abcdevuan | fsmithred: Ctrl-Alt-F7 in gui, xfce4-terminal, xset b on, echo -e "\a" -> nothing |
| 19:53.59 | *** join/#devuan amphi (~amphi@81.32.135.167) |
| 19:54.11 | abcdevuan | note sound plays fine in firefox html5 youtube etc. |
| 19:54.56 | *** join/#devuan AntoFox (~Thunderbi@dynamic-adsl-78-12-47-7.clienti.tiscali.it) |
| 19:54.58 | abcdevuan | Note also there is a setting in kterm which reroutes bell events to one of: ignore, beep in sound system, beep in system beep, flash terminal tab |
| 19:55.10 | abcdevuan | fsmithred: |
| 19:55.26 | abcdevuan | I can find no equivalent setting in xfce4-term |
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| 19:58.16 | fsmithred | ok, gonna test now |
| 20:01.11 | fsmithred | tested both on laptop and desktop. Only one that beeped was desktop in console. |
| 20:01.37 | fsmithred | I know of no sound system settings in xfce like there is in kde |
| 20:03.40 | fsmithred | have to go. back in half hour. |
| 20:04.07 | *** join/#devuan enoch (~enoch@unaffiliated/enoch) |
| 20:10.29 | MinceR | kde3 also had a system-level hack to change all bell events like that |
| 20:18.04 | gnarface | abcdevuan: tried rxvt-unicode-256color? |
| 20:18.13 | gnarface | abcdevuan: (aka "urxvt") |
| 20:20.04 | *** join/#devuan boson (~boson@cpe-174-100-64-46.neo.res.rr.com) |
| 20:20.47 | abcdevuan | no. Should I_ |
| 20:20.49 | abcdevuan | ? |
| 20:21.15 | abcdevuan | gnarface: ? |
| 20:22.13 | gnarface | abcdevuan: well it has a command-line flag for visual/audio bell, and it has real unicode support. |
| 20:22.43 | gnarface | i can't speak about xfce4-term, haven't used it much. |
| 20:24.27 | gnarface | if it doesn't have a command-line flag for it, maybe it obeys some ~/.Xresources setting, but i'm not sure it's worth figuring that out if urxvt does what you want and is also superior for character support |
| 20:25.38 | KatolaZ | abcdevuan: did you solve the issue with beep? |
| 20:29.19 | GrimKriegor | this is prolly a derp question, but is Devuan 100%, or does it host non-free repositories such as Debian? The FAQ doesn't seem to be working for me |
| 20:29.28 | GrimKriegor | 100% free software < |
| 20:29.30 | KatolaZ | https://www.ghacks.net/2017/04/24/devuan-1-0-0-rc-released/ |
| 20:29.37 | KatolaZ | GrimKriegor: devuan has non-free as well |
| 20:29.49 | GrimKriegor | ty KatolaZ |
| 20:30.02 | KatolaZ | derivatives (like gnuinos) ensure a full libre experience |
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| 20:34.07 | fsmithred | and I was just working on making the desktop-live as un-free as I can with wireless firmware. |
| 20:38.49 | abcdevuan | KatolaZ: not solved. Not urgent. Pretty sure it will come up eventually. It is non essential for now. |
| 20:39.42 | abcdevuan | My guess is, there is some special signalling path used by xfce4-terminal for bell in console. Will try a plain xterm now |
| 20:40.26 | gnarface | somehow suspects it has something to do with audio hardware/driver differences |
| 20:40.57 | abcdevuan | plain xterm beeps. The problem is in xfce4-terminal, no doubt some compilation option_ |
| 20:41.00 | abcdevuan | ? |
| 20:41.17 | abcdevuan | gnarface: no, that was eliminated step by step |
| 20:41.59 | gnarface | abcdevuan: sorry, must have missed that part of the conversation. usually i'm working in the opposite direction though on this; trying to *eliminate* the audio bell from all contexts, not re-enable it. |
| 20:42.05 | abcdevuan | Neither root nor user shells beep in xfce4-term |
| 20:42.37 | abcdevuan | gnarface: yes well you can set bell volume separately so just pull down the slider. |
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| 20:42.40 | KatolaZ | abcdevuan: might just be some conf in xfce4-terminal |
| 20:42.51 | abcdevuan | I looked quite hard. Nothing in the gui sets it |
| 20:42.52 | KatolaZ | it used to be the case in the past for Konsole |
| 20:43.00 | KatolaZ | (but I am talking about eons ago) |
| 20:43.09 | fsmithred | xterm beeps on desktop but not on laptop |
| 20:43.16 | KatolaZ | abcdevuan: maybe in xfce4 settings? |
| 20:43.55 | fsmithred | KatolaZ, kde has (or had) controls for everything. Nobody else does that. |
| 20:44.35 | KatolaZ | ok fsmithred |
| 20:44.35 | abcdevuan | the word bell does not appear in xfce4-terminal manpage |
| 20:44.52 | KatolaZ | (last version of KDE I used was 2.1, remember... :D) |
| 20:45.01 | fsmithred | lol |
| 20:45.12 | abcdevuan | Maybe it's an "integration" leftover... |
| 20:45.17 | fsmithred | you missed kde3. It was better than 2. |
| 20:45.29 | fsmithred | integration? |
| 20:45.33 | abcdevuan | hey I still use kde3 etch because it is *usable* |
| 20:45.34 | Centurion_Dan | abcdevuan: the bell only ever worked (as far as I remember) on the real console. |
| 20:45.47 | abcdevuan | fsmithred: integration with the borg |
| 20:46.14 | KatolaZ | I think KDE 1.2 was actually better than 2.0... :P |
| 20:46.16 | Centurion_Dan | never in a terminal |
| 20:46.25 | fsmithred | nope, I've been using xfce since squeeze was in testing, and one of the things I like about it is that I don't have to turn off the bell. |
| 20:46.29 | abcdevuan | Centurion_Dan: on what? On kde? kterm permits bell selection between none/beep/wav/notification(visual) |
| 20:46.49 | fsmithred | they didn't add sms? |
| 20:46.53 | abcdevuan | Also one can use xterm to have bell |
| 20:47.03 | abcdevuan | fsmithred: no, but there was a midi jingle hack |
| 20:47.04 | abcdevuan | >( |
| 20:47.23 | gnarface | in urxvt i use the visual bell. much nicer. doesn't interfere with music listening experience |
| 20:47.24 | KatolaZ | normally keeps the Master muted.... |
| 20:47.35 | Centurion_Dan | KatolaZ: I started in linux around the time of gnome 1.3 and it was great... then they started removing the features I used most and adding bloat... |
| 20:47.55 | KatolaZ | Centurion_Dan: I beat you just by a couple oy years then |
| 20:47.56 | Lydia_K | What year was that abouts Centurion_Dan? |
| 20:48.10 | abcdevuan | Ok, thanks for the great experience, checking sleep and resume now, might be gone for today if that does not work out. Very likely. Bye, will be back. |
| 20:48.18 | KatolaZ | Centurion_Dan: I remember the preview of GNOME 0.9x in RH... |
| 20:48.45 | KatolaZ | and used GNOME (and KDE) up to 2001 |
| 20:50.09 | KatolaZ | Lydia_K: GNOME 0.9x was in RH 5.1, IIRC |
| 20:50.13 | KatolaZ | (1997 or 1998) |
| 20:50.44 | Lydia_K | That's around when I started |
| 20:50.46 | KatolaZ | but the first usable thing was GNOME 1.0 in RH 6.0 (1999) |
| 20:50.54 | Lydia_K | though I didn't really know what I was doing back then, trying to use it like a wintendo. |
| 20:51.10 | gnarface | hah |
| 20:51.14 | KatolaZ | neither I :D |
| 20:51.30 | gnarface | redhat 5 "finally a Linux installer i don't have to ask for help with!" |
| 20:51.33 | KatolaZ | I had fvwm.... |
| 20:51.56 | Lydia_K | Redhat, Mandrake, and Slackware were the distros I used most back then. |
| 20:52.00 | gnarface | simpler times |
| 20:52.15 | KatolaZ | this is getting OT I suppose |
| 20:52.39 | KatolaZ | looks around to see whether golinux has already got the Holy Mace.... |
| 20:52.44 | Lydia_K | It took till I met my husband who took X away from me for me to come to understand that I had been approaching it (and computers in general) entirely backwards (thanks to a windows 95 box being my first computer) |
| 20:52.55 | KatolaZ | :D |
| 20:53.13 | KatolaZ | that's the true mean of *educational* *experience* |
| 20:53.40 | KatolaZ | :D |
| 20:53.46 | Lydia_K | Literally leaned over me, hit ctrl+alt+backspace and told me I wasn't allowed to use X anymore :D |
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| 20:59.48 | Artemis3 | Lydia_K, interestingly windows 95 ran on top of dos, unlike the more modern ones xD |
| 21:00.34 | Artemis3 | you could still "exit" it and let you dump back to the good old cli to run your games properly... |
| 21:03.25 | unixman | You young whipper snappers and your GNOME. I started working with Unix on SCO Xenix in 1988 with a serial connected WY50 amber terminal. None of that GUI crap. ;) |
| 21:05.59 | unixman | wanders off to find a slime mold to eat |
| 21:07.06 | Artemis3 | No one remembers Microsoft *nix os :3 |
| 21:07.39 | Lydia_K | Artemis3: Xenix |
| 21:07.48 | Lydia_K | Oh, unixman already said that |
| 21:07.53 | Lydia_K | sorry, catching up here. |
| 21:08.06 | unixman | :) |
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| 21:08.31 | Lydia_K | Also, yeah, I know now that win 95 had dos under it, but that was my *first* computer, I knew nothing ya'know? I had to teach myself everything (no one else in my family is even a *little* technical) |
| 21:08.44 | Lydia_K | I got a late start. |
| 21:09.02 | Artemis3 | i actually started with a serial terminal console (they were actual 386s pcs running terminal emulation) connected to Irix 5.2 in 92 or so |
| 21:09.37 | Lydia_K | I missed all the cool stuff :/ |
| 21:09.38 | Artemis3 | ok started *nix style os, i had a bit of pre 8bit era experience and pc/msdos ofc |
| 21:09.38 | unixman | The first PC I built for myself I installed IBM OS/2 on. Upgraded to OS/3 then OS/4 on that system. |
| 21:10.16 | Artemis3 | lol |
| 21:10.27 | Lydia_K | The first PC I built for myself was like an AMD K6-2 300 Mhz running win '95 |
| 21:11.10 | Artemis3 | no i started much earlier bulding my pcs... after my little experience in apple ][ land and went to pcxt clone |
| 21:11.29 | Artemis3 | then the whole way up to this day |
| 21:11.55 | unixman | Yeah I multibooted IBM PC-DOS, OS/4 Warp, Caldera Linux and Windows 95 on my next personal build for a while. |
| 21:11.56 | Artemis3 | my first linux contact was with redhat 4.1 or so |
| 21:12.06 | Lydia_K | I was probably around 13/14 at that time. |
| 21:13.51 | Artemis3 | i still have some of those pcs lying around, oldest would be 286 |
| 21:14.08 | Artemis3 | not mine but others leftovers |
| 21:14.23 | Artemis3 | well they are all mine now but still xD |
| 21:14.48 | Lydia_K | I finally cleared out a lot of my old junk computers a few years ago |
| 21:14.49 | unixman | was 35 years old when Windows 95 debuted. |
| 21:14.53 | golinux | Can you guys please take the nostalgia to #debianfork. |
| 21:15.03 | *** join/#devuan aitor (~aitor@229.85-84-19.dynamic.clientes.euskaltel.es) |
| 21:15.07 | aitor | hi |
| 21:15.10 | Artemis3 | get off my lawn? |
| 21:15.11 | golinux | wafts the holy mace |
| 21:15.22 | Lydia_K | gets maced! x.x |
| 21:15.36 | Lydia_K | runs to #debianfork! |
| 21:16.59 | aitor | Lydia_K: Mandrake once again :) |
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| 21:21.58 | KatolaZ | wathes munching pop-corn... |
| 21:22.00 | aitor | https://images.search.yahoo.com/yhs/search;_ylt=A0LEVr9sa_5YZBIAZjcnnIlQ;_ylu=X3oDMTEya2hrdXM4BGNvbG8DYmYxBHBvcwMyBHZ0aWQDQjM4OTBfMQRzZWMDc2M-?p=El+Mago+Mandrake&fr=yhs-mozilla-004&hspart=mozilla&hsimp=yhs-004#id=1&iurl=http%3A%2F%2Fimg.lagaceta.com.ar%2Ffotos%2Fnotas%2F2012%2F12%2F11%2F524400_20121211152406.jpg&action=close |
| 21:22.18 | KatolaZ | knew golinuz was looking for thw Holy Mace... |
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| 23:00.17 | greenjeans | Is there a package list for the RC somewhere? |
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| 23:06.58 | KatolaZ | greenjeans: ? |
| 23:07.14 | KatolaZ | the RC has some 42000 packages available.... |
| 23:07.50 | greenjeans | no I mean the installed packages on the iso itself |
| 23:09.54 | KatolaZ | greenjeans: files.devuan.org |
| 23:10.19 | KatolaZ | https://files.devuan.org/devuan_jessie_rc/ |
| 23:10.32 | KatolaZ | each image has its own accompanying .list file |
| 23:11.19 | greenjeans | perfect, thanks! |
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| 23:32.36 | greenjeans | So is wi-fi firmware that's not considered free, not going to be on the final release? Speaking specifically about things like firmware-realtek, firmware-ralink etc. |
| 23:40.25 | gnarface | that's a good question |
| 23:40.41 | gnarface | the installers included the non-free firmware for your convenience though |
| 23:43.35 | greenjeans | well I understand if it's not, with policy about free software and all, but that will be a turn-off for some folks if wi-fi won't work out of the box. |
| 23:44.20 | greenjeans | For me it's not a biggie as I can roll one up and include them on it, just asking out of curiousity |
| 23:44.59 | greenjeans | those two pieces of firmware I mentioned cover a LOT of laptops made in the last 5 years |
| 23:46.17 | gnarface | i hadn't heard there was a plan to remove them from the installer |
| 23:49.35 | NewGnuGuy | I plan to install a fully libre Devuan. If blobs are included in the installer, it should be very explicit about that and allow installing a blobless OS if desired. |
| 23:49.54 | greenjeans | clarification: when you said non-free firmware did you specifically mean the "firmware-linux-free" package or did you mean that other firmware like the ralink stuff is included on the installer? |
| 23:58.07 | gnarface | firmware-linux-free is free |
| 23:58.57 | gnarface | firmware-realtek is non-free |
