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| 11:21.46 | aitor | fsmithred, are you there? |
| 11:23.17 | aitor | alsa doesn't work with vdev in my computer, have you experienced the same with refracta-vdev2? |
| 11:23.42 | aitor | or maybe my sound card is not detected |
| 11:24.06 | aitor | Realtek ALC268 |
| 11:24.22 | aitor | aitor@devuan:~$ aplay -l |
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| 11:24.31 | aitor | card 0: Intel [HDA Intel], device 0: ALC268 Analog [ALC268 Analog] |
| 11:25.17 | aitor | it works with udev :( |
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| 11:27.11 | aitor | AntoFox: do not play the coward, appearing and disappearing |
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| 11:31.43 | aitor | hightower2 is doing the same role |
| 11:32.46 | aitor | Guest5120: did you test the iso? |
| 11:34.27 | aitor | in my right panel, in the list of users, there is only a hightower3 |
| 11:34.54 | hightower3 | aitor, Yes I did, my feedback was: |
| 11:35.17 | hightower3 | " with CD.iso I get the same error, but for 2 packages missing (instead of previously 3 reported missing). With CD.iso it reports devuan-baseconf and devuan-keyring are missing. |
| 11:35.25 | hightower3 | Also if I look into the CD.iso, there are some folders with files in there, named .Trashes and .Trash-1000" |
| 11:36.51 | aitor | are you using a usb stick |
| 11:37.31 | aitor | are you using unetbootin, instead of dd? |
| 11:38.38 | aitor | when you remove something, a hidden trash is generated in the pendrive |
| 11:39.44 | aitor | unetbootin doesn't format the pendrive |
| 11:40.29 | aitor | it preserves the content |
| 11:41.19 | aitor | using dd, the usb will be formatted and protected |
| 11:41.29 | aitor | unetbootin uses FAT32 |
| 11:42.46 | aitor | all debian/devuan isos have only one hidden file, that is: .disk |
| 11:43.26 | hightower3 | Oh right, you may be right about the .Trash* thing, I did this via the graphical file manager, which I usually don't do |
| 11:44.04 | aitor | did you download my iso? i think that it will work |
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| 11:45.07 | fsmithred | aitor? |
| 11:45.17 | aitor | fsmithred :) |
| 11:45.19 | fsmithred | give me a minute to catch up |
| 11:45.49 | fsmithred | I had to do something to one of the action files with Ralph's vdev to get sound working |
| 11:46.33 | aitor | i'll read his manpages this weekend |
| 11:46.57 | aitor | the action files sound interesting |
| 11:47.00 | fsmithred | oh, I forgot about those. I should read them, too. |
| 11:48.03 | fsmithred | ok, change subject for a second - is anyone else having trouble with command history? I type a command, like 'ls build/vdev' |
| 11:48.17 | fsmithred | then I want to look at 'ls build/vdev/action_files' |
| 11:48.21 | fsmithred | so I hit the up arrow |
| 11:48.29 | fsmithred | once |
| 11:48.45 | fsmithred | and I see a command I used yesterday, not the one I just ran. |
| 11:48.48 | fsmithred | wtf? |
| 11:50.46 | fsmithred | aitor, do you have a vdev system runnning right now? |
| 11:50.56 | aitor | which platform are you using? once i installed JaroMail, but just installed... |
| 11:51.07 | aitor | yes, i'm with vdev |
| 11:52.19 | fsmithred | platform? |
| 11:52.33 | fsmithred | I'm running devuan |
| 11:52.38 | fsmithred | jessie |
| 11:52.43 | aitor | Xchat, etc...? |
| 11:52.50 | fsmithred | hexchat |
| 11:53.01 | fsmithred | but the history thing is in terminal |
| 11:53.08 | fsmithred | xfce4_terminal |
| 11:53.15 | aitor | i did't use the right term |
| 11:53.20 | fsmithred | not sure if it happens in console - the problem is intermittent |
| 11:53.46 | fsmithred | anyway, I'm booting a vdev iso |
| 11:54.01 | fsmithred | there are a couple of action files that deal with sound |
| 11:55.15 | aitor | yes: sound-audio, sond-alsa-control... |
| 11:55.54 | fsmithred | sound-alsa-control.act is the one I edited |
| 11:56.39 | fsmithred | I'll post it here, only about 7 or 8 lines |
| 11:56.52 | fsmithred | no, I won't |
| 11:57.06 | fsmithred | can't copy/past it |
| 11:57.50 | aitor | i'll do, save... |
| 11:58.00 | aitor | [vdev-action] |
| 11:58.09 | aitor | event=any |
| 11:58.16 | aitor | path=^snd/.+$ |
| 11:58.24 | aitor | OS_SUBSYSTEM=sound |
| 11:58.31 | aitor | helper=sound.sh |
| 11:58.39 | aitor | VAR_SOUND_OWNER=root |
| 11:58.47 | aitor | VAR_SOUND_GROUP=audio |
| 11:58.56 | aitor | VAR_SOUND_MODE=0660 |
| 11:59.03 | aitor | if_exists=run |
| 11:59.13 | aitor | daemonlet=true |
| 11:59.21 | aitor | END |
| 11:59.45 | fsmithred | yeah, that's the modified one |
| 11:59.53 | fsmithred | ok, that's not the problem, then. |
| 12:00.22 | fsmithred | lemme boot the laptop with your vdev and try sound |
| 12:02.18 | aitor | ok |
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| 12:05.16 | fsmithred | sound works |
| 12:06.44 | aitor | better |
| 12:07.52 | fsmithred | un-mute something, maybe? |
| 12:08.02 | aitor | i have a libudev.so.0 pointing to a libudev.so.0.1.3.0, because it's an upgrade from debian wheezy |
| 12:08.48 | aitor | but libudev.so points to libudev.so.1 |
| 12:09.25 | aitor | fsmithred: if i install udev and reboot the system, alsa works |
| 12:09.28 | fsmithred | I have no libudev.so.0 |
| 12:10.00 | aitor | i updated fro debian wheezy |
| 12:10.25 | aitor | but that's not the problem |
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| 12:12.15 | fsmithred | ls -l /dev/snd/ and make sure everything is owned by root:audio |
| 12:13.35 | fsmithred | did you use a custom asoundrc file in wheezy? |
| 12:13.44 | aitor | the owner is root: |
| 12:13.55 | aitor | drwxr-xr-x 2 root root 60 Nov 11 12:14 by-path |
| 12:14.04 | aitor | crw-rw---- 1 root audio 116, 2 Nov 11 12:14 controlC0 |
| 12:14.13 | aitor | crw-rw---- 1 root audio 116, 5 Nov 11 12:14 hwC0D0 |
| 12:14.24 | aitor | crw-rw---- 1 root audio 116, 6 Nov 11 12:14 hwC0D1 |
| 12:14.37 | aitor | crw-rw---- 1 root audio 116, 4 Nov 11 12:14 pcmC0D0c |
| 12:14.46 | aitor | crw-rw---- 1 root audio 116, 3 Nov 11 12:14 pcmC0D0p |
| 12:14.55 | aitor | crw-rw---- 1 root audio 116, 1 Nov 11 12:14 seq |
| 12:15.10 | aitor | crw-rw---- 1 root audio 116, 33 Nov 11 12:14 timer |
| 12:15.15 | aitor | that's all |
| 12:15.23 | fsmithred | that looks ok |
| 12:16.14 | aitor | by-path/controlC0 points to ../../snd/controlC0 |
| 12:17.31 | fsmithred | same here |
| 12:17.56 | aitor | i didn't use a custom asoundrc in wheezy |
| 12:18.56 | aitor | i have audio:x:29:aitor,pulse in /etc/group |
| 12:20.39 | fsmithred | alsamixer shows channels un-muted? |
| 12:20.50 | aitor | no |
| 12:21.25 | fsmithred | no = not muted? |
| 12:21.26 | aitor | i'm using volti, but they are not un-muted |
| 12:21.42 | aitor | they are not muted, i mean |
| 12:21.48 | fsmithred | ok |
| 12:23.06 | aitor | i'm working in the same circumstances both with udev and vdev |
| 12:23.43 | aitor | fsmithred: thanks for your help, i will try at home with headphones |
| 12:23.54 | fsmithred | does 'aplay -l' give same output in both? |
| 12:24.07 | fsmithred | both udev and vdev, I mean |
| 12:24.53 | aitor | i don't know, i have to reboot for that |
| 12:25.18 | aitor | fsmithred: thanks for your help, i will try at home again |
| 12:25.20 | aitor | need to go |
| 12:25.21 | fsmithred | yw |
| 12:25.24 | fsmithred | me too |
| 12:25.27 | fsmithred | see you later |
| 12:25.33 | aitor | i will try with headphones at home |
| 12:25.40 | aitor | see you, and thanks |
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| 13:18.23 | wulllst | if i got that right, selecting "use backported software" during the installation of devuan will not only make the backports repos available for use on occasion, but automatically use software versions from backports if they are newer than in the stable release. if so, is that sane? |
| 13:21.39 | wulllst | i'm asking that, since on debian, i would normally use two or three packages from packports an therefore need the repo n the sources list. then, during the installation devuan (jessie) i saw that quite some packages were being fetched from the backports repo. |
| 13:22.44 | fsmithred | wulllst, you are correct - backports has the same pin-priority as stable |
| 13:23.08 | fsmithred | you can manually pin it to a lower priority |
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| 13:25.00 | fsmithred | make /etc/apt/preferences.d/backports |
| 13:25.06 | fsmithred | Package: * |
| 13:25.06 | fsmithred | Pin: release a=jessie-backports |
| 13:25.06 | fsmithred | Pin-Priority: 200 |
| 13:25.20 | fsmithred | or 100 if you want it the same as in debian |
| 13:26.04 | fsmithred | I don't know if there's a way to do that during installation |
| 13:26.24 | wulllst | fsmithred: thanks. well yes, that was kind of my next question. |
| 13:26.57 | wulllst | fsmithred: i mean, you can alsways switch to a shell. |
| 13:27.14 | fsmithred | yeah, that might work |
| 13:27.30 | wulllst | fsmithred: easiest way is probably to add the backports repo later and then pin it. |
| 13:27.43 | fsmithred | I usually start with just a standard system install (no gui) and then add stuff |
| 13:28.08 | wulllst | fsmithred: me too. but i have developed a habit of using the expert install and there you got the option. |
| 13:28.37 | fsmithred | yeah, you also get options to install ascii (testing) or ceres (unstable) |
| 13:28.43 | fsmithred | but they don't work right now |
| 13:29.14 | fsmithred | we're all looking forward to the next release - bunch of stuff with the install media should be fixed. |
| 13:30.06 | wulllst | fsmithred: glad to hear that. i there a potential release date? |
| 13:30.37 | fsmithred | devs are hoping to get it out before end of this year |
| 13:30.40 | fsmithred | so... |
| 13:30.44 | fsmithred | a month or so? |
| 13:30.47 | wulllst | fsmithred: great. |
| 13:31.10 | Pali | hi! is there any support for raspberry pi 1? |
| 13:31.21 | wulllst | fsmithred: then i'll wait for that on and make the transition from debian when it is out. |
| 13:32.21 | fsmithred | you want to upgrade a debian or devuan, or you want a fresh install? |
| 13:33.01 | fsmithred | debian TO devuan |
| 13:33.08 | wulllst | fsmithred: i'm going to try a fresh installation, but keep my home partition untouched. |
| 13:33.46 | fsmithred | that should work. I would just put the whole thing in one partition and then mess with the old home afterward |
| 13:34.29 | wulllst | fsmithred: i usually go with a boot, root, swap and home partition. |
| 13:36.20 | fsmithred | in that case, I'd not mark the home partition on install but set it up manually afterward. |
| 13:36.52 | wulllst | fsmithred: ok |
| 13:36.57 | fsmithred | in case there are any conflicts between old and new user configs |
| 13:37.17 | wulllst | fsmithred: but concerning the backports priority during instalation again: is that the way it's supposed to be? |
| 13:37.29 | fsmithred | no |
| 13:37.39 | fsmithred | it's a problem, but the cause is unknown |
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| 13:37.55 | fsmithred | I'm hoping it gets sorted out when amprolla2 is done |
| 13:38.15 | wulllst | fsmithred: so potentially on the nexte release? |
| 13:38.22 | fsmithred | yeah, I hope |
| 13:38.30 | wulllst | good |
| 13:38.58 | wulllst | Pali: did you consult the rapsberry pi forums alraedy? |
| 13:39.31 | Pali | wulllst: no, I'm just asking if devuan has sume support or if is planned... |
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| 13:40.02 | wulllst | Pali: i don't know, but there seem to be some talk to be going on in those forums: https://www.raspberrypi.org/forums/viewtopic.php?f=66&t=133078 |
| 13:41.29 | fsmithred | people have talked about it in here, too. You can search irc archive at https://botbot.me/freenode/devuan/ |
| 13:43.33 | wulllst | ok. heading out. thanks for your help. |
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| 13:43.38 | fsmithred | yw |
| 13:45.23 | Pali | hm.... in oct 15 parazyd wrote "in due time i will provide rpi1 builds as well" |
| 13:45.38 | fsmithred | Pali, here's a quote from May 2015: nextime |
| 13:45.38 | fsmithred | you can anyway get kernel and rpi specific packages from raspbian, and then use devuan packages for the rest |
| 13:45.39 | Pali | parazyd: are there rpi1 builds? |
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| 13:46.59 | Pali | rpi1 is IIRC armv6 |
| 13:47.06 | Pali | and rpi1 armv7-a |
| 13:47.33 | Pali | fsmithred: so I doubt that devuan packages built for rpi2 will work properly on rpi1... |
| 13:47.53 | Pali | s/and rpi1 armv7-a/and rpi2 armv7-a/ |
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| 14:17.51 | parazyd | Pali: we don't have packages that support pi 0/1 |
| 14:17.52 | parazyd | yet |
| 14:18.09 | Pali | parazyd: ok, and it is planned? |
| 14:18.32 | parazyd | not really. i've mentioned it lots of times but nobody shows any actual interest |
| 14:18.50 | parazyd | what's needed is to setup an amprolla that will use raspbian as upstream |
| 14:19.12 | parazyd | and then we should use devuan's package sources do do the same thing devuan is doing to debian |
| 14:19.39 | parazyd | this is my plan for having ready binary packages for n900, rpi0/1 |
| 14:19.59 | Pali | hm... can you describe what is doing that amprolla and how are managed upstream debian packages in devuan? |
| 14:20.15 | parazyd | also got ARM build hardware ready to partially setup the infra |
| 14:20.17 | Pali | maybe I could help with n900 or rpi1 |
| 14:20.19 | parazyd | ~amprolla |
| 14:20.19 | infobot | nextime gave an excellent explanation how amprolla works, at https://botbot.me/freenode/devuan/2016-05-07/?msg=65646427&page=4, or https://git.devuan.org/devuan-infrastructure/amprolla |
| 14:20.50 | parazyd | Pali: yes, it would be most appreciated. it's not a big issue to do it, we just have to gather the people |
| 14:21.14 | parazyd | Pali: do you know if raspbian's packages work on the n900? |
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| 14:22.11 | Pali | no idea about raspbian and n900, but n900 is armv7 |
| 14:22.27 | Pali | so standard debian's armfh armv7 packages should work |
| 14:23.00 | Pali | https://www.debian.org/releases/jessie/armhf/ --> "32-bit hard-float ARMv7 (âarmhfâ) architecture" |
| 14:23.43 | Pali | so debian jessie armhf packages should work on n900... |
| 14:24.31 | muep | AFAIK raspbian's armv6 binaries should be runnable also in the armv7 CPU of n900 |
| 14:25.12 | parazyd | cool, two birds with one stone |
| 14:25.39 | parazyd | Pali: i was thinking armel rather than armhf |
| 14:25.42 | muep | also usual debian armv7 packages should hardware-wise be OK |
| 14:26.34 | Pali | I used some N800 binaries which are armv6 on N900 and they worked fine |
| 14:27.07 | Pali | not only executables, but also SO libs which are loaded by native armv7 executables |
| 14:27.14 | Pali | that is working too... |
| 14:27.40 | muep | Pali: do you wish mix raspbian packages and the stock n900 OS? |
| 14:28.03 | parazyd | anyway, keep in mind that debian's armel packages don't work on rpi0/1 |
| 14:28.16 | parazyd | so i would like to use raspbian for both n900 and the pis |
| 14:28.35 | parazyd | again, this requires a separate infra probably |
| 14:28.39 | muep | if maemo uses the armel ABI (calling convention), it will not work right with armhf packages even if the hardware is OK with those |
| 14:29.02 | Pali | Maemo packages are armel (soft-float) |
| 14:29.06 | parazyd | muep: yep |
| 14:29.30 | Pali | and it is really incomaptible with armfh... |
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| 14:30.16 | muep | ok, then raspbian packages would not be useful for maemo |
| 14:30.19 | Pali | but... for n900 we would like to compile all binaries in thumb2 mode, to reduce size of binaries |
| 14:30.57 | parazyd | Pali: wouldn't that mean recompiling all packages in existence? |
| 14:30.59 | Pali | armel non-thumb2 and armel thumb2 binaries are compatible and in CSSU we already mix them |
| 14:31.45 | Pali | parazyd: if there are not armel armv7 DEB packages, then recompiling is needed (if we want compatibility with Maemo) |
| 14:33.17 | Pali | so at least upstream Debian provides armhf binaries which can be used for N900 in case we lost compatibility for Maemo |
| 14:33.52 | parazyd | fwiw devuan does run on n900 |
| 14:33.56 | parazyd | armhf |
| 14:34.15 | parazyd | debian documentation is scarce though, i don't know what's the arch for their armel pkgs |
| 14:34.30 | muep | armv4 or armv5 |
| 14:34.59 | Pali | parazyd: so devuan armhf is ready for n900? thats good starting point |
| 14:35.11 | parazyd | muep: are you sure? they didn't work on my rpi |
| 14:35.21 | parazyd | Pali: yes, i already provide a dd-able image |
| 14:35.36 | parazyd | https://files.devuan.org/devuan_jessie_beta/testing/devuan_jessie_1.0.0-beta2.rc1_armhf_n900.img.xz |
| 14:35.42 | Pali | ok |
| 14:35.51 | Pali | so now we need to find out what is debian armel... |
| 14:36.31 | muep | parazyd: did you try to mix debian's armel packages with raspbian's armhf packages? |
| 14:36.42 | parazyd | muep: segfaults all around |
| 14:37.28 | muep | parazyd: when I got my rpi 1 device, debian armel + rpi firmware + kernel was basically the primary recommended OS for it |
| 14:37.42 | muep | raspbian had not yet caught on |
| 14:38.20 | parazyd | Raspbian - Uses the hard-float version of the "new" ABI (EABI) like Debian armhf but targets v6 rather than v7. Currently tracks Debian wheezy and jessie. Primarily but not exclusively targeted at the Raspberry Pi. GNU Triplet: arm-linux-gnueabihf |
| 14:39.24 | muep | parazyd: what exactly caused you segfaults? |
| 14:39.52 | parazyd | muep: doing a dist-upgrade to devuan from raspbian |
| 14:40.11 | parazyd | it went through, but then rendered it unbootable |
| 14:41.26 | muep | is there an armel devuan? |
| 14:42.33 | parazyd | in theory yes, but on ci.devuan.org the qemu-armel machine has been offline whenever i look |
| 14:42.40 | parazyd | so i am not really sure |
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| 14:43.27 | muep | ok, just saying that I'd not expect cross-grade from armhf raspbian to armel devuan to work |
| 14:46.54 | parazyd | i'll try to build a fresh armel image with arm-sdk |
| 14:46.57 | parazyd | see where it leads to |
| 14:49.20 | parazyd | need to bake a new toolchain |
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| 15:13.29 | Pali | parazyd: iirc for cssu (community updates for maemo system packages) we use gcc flags -march=armv7-a -mcpu=cortex-a8 -mtune=cortex-a8 -mfpu=neon -mfloat-abi=softfp -ftree-vectorize -mthumb -mno-thumb-interwork |
| 15:13.56 | parazyd | this is just for the kernel |
| 15:14.07 | Pali | this is for userspace binaries |
| 15:14.13 | parazyd | ack |
| 15:14.15 | parazyd | will take note |
| 15:14.44 | Pali | and we use updated gcc-4.7 toolchain, because old gcc (default in maemo) was not able to handle hw errata |
| 15:15.08 | Pali | and thumb binaries randomly crashed |
| 15:16.05 | parazyd | i'm on 4.9 |
| 15:16.27 | parazyd | didn't try out thumb though |
| 15:17.16 | Pali | we recompiled qt4 with thumb and saved 20mb! |
| 15:17.33 | Pali | on n900 which has only 256mb nand, it is really nice |
| 15:19.23 | Pali | ... and about Amprolla and packaing ... I have question: how are handled modified packages in devuan? |
| 15:19.43 | Pali | if new version of modified package is pushed into debian archive, what will Amprolla do? |
| 15:20.30 | Pali | you need to manually take diff between previous and new debian version and apply it to devuan package? |
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| 15:20.52 | parazyd | i think devuan takes priority (probably something to do with pinning) |
| 15:21.07 | parazyd | is not very well-versed in debian packaging schematics |
| 15:21.08 | Pali | or devuan modifications are automatically applied on top of debian package and automatically built? |
| 15:21.18 | parazyd | could be the latter also |
| 15:21.25 | parazyd | makes sense |
| 15:22.04 | Pali | so how are currenly modified devuan packages handled? |
| 15:23.35 | parazyd | automagically :D |
| 15:23.39 | parazyd | Pali: what do you have in mind? |
| 15:24.29 | Pali | I would like to know what is devuan infrastructure doing when upstream debian project release new version of some package which is already modified in devuan repository... |
| 15:25.02 | Pali | if you need to manually do some merging, or if it is somehow fully automatic without any work... |
| 15:27.11 | parazyd | i believe it's automatic |
| 15:28.14 | parazyd | yes: https://git.devuan.org/devuan-infrastructure/amprolla2 |
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| 15:33.06 | Pali | great! |
| 15:43.16 | Pali | n900... it looks like that for targetting Devuan userspace to be compatible with Maemo it is needed to recompile everything :-( |
| 15:43.37 | Pali | with -march=armv7-a -mcpu=cortex-a8 -mtune=cortex-a8 -mfpu=neon -mfloat-abi=softfp |
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| 15:46.23 | parazyd | Pali: that is why i'm wondering about armel |
| 15:46.30 | parazyd | perhaps it's niot needed to recompile |
| 15:46.37 | parazyd | s/niot/not |
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| 15:47.34 | Pali | if you mean debian's upstream armel it is without hw fpu... which is really not ideal for n900 |
| 15:49.12 | parazyd | could be a good starting point, to see what's actually needed to be done |
| 15:49.17 | parazyd | but ok, i see your point |
| 15:49.34 | Pali | #debian-arm on oftc confirmed that armel is for older arm cpus like v4t |
| 15:49.52 | Pali | so it should be compatible with n900's cortex processor |
| 15:50.08 | Pali | but I guess binaries will be larger (no thumb2) and slower (no fpu) |
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| 15:51.07 | Pali | but providing packages should be easy, it should be exactly same as for i386/amd64/armhf |
| 15:51.09 | parazyd | now i get crazy ideas about on-the-fly compiling of packages |
| 15:51.32 | Pali | just configure Amprolla to include armel into list of upstream architectures... |
| 15:53.02 | Pali | and for rpi1: using upstream raspbian archives should works similary |
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| 19:05.17 | aitor | hi |
| 19:05.56 | aitor | parazyd: you said... |
| 19:06.03 | aitor | muep: doing a dist-upgrade to devuan from raspbian |
| 19:06.45 | aitor | are you building the armhf images upgrading from debian? |
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| 20:11.19 | DanMc | Is this because I built it from a netinstall, or is this an actual bug? Audacious is installed as the music player. Catfish is installed afterward. When clicking on a file (in Catfish) to show in the file manager (pcmanfm), it opens Audacious. |
| 20:22.53 | DanMc | Sorry: not enough information. Desktop - Openbox. 64bit on a Toshiba Laptop - AMD Turion II Dual-Core Mobile M520 @ 2.3GHz - GPU: AMD/ATI RS880M [Mobility Radeon HD 4225/4250]. I also apologize for having to leave after leaving a question...I'm at work and must attend to that. |
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