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| 01:46.11 | H-var | hello guys, is ufw's log accessible only by a root? |
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| 01:54.55 | sney | H-var: most system administration stuff is root-only by default, though you may be able to add your user to a group that allows it. for instance, 'systemd-journal' is the group for being able to read system journalctl stuff as a regular user. there might be one for ufw too. |
| 01:58.04 | H-var | is it okay to run the output with tail -f of this file in a terminal continuously? |
| 01:58.18 | petn-randall | H-var: I'll allow it ;) |
| 01:58.26 | H-var | it's safe I mean? |
| 01:58.29 | sney | typically that's fine yeah |
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| 01:59.21 | sney | if it's logging a lot constantly you might see some resource usage issues, but lots of tools parse logs a similar way |
| 01:59.58 | H-var | the graphical interface is gufw right? |
| 02:00.38 | sney | what does 'apt show gufw' tell you |
| 02:00.55 | H-var | yeah, that's the one |
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| 02:18.39 | scruloose | In case anyone's curious about the Docker filesystem-access-as-root thing I was freaking out about a day or two ago, I was indeed missing something fundamental: Docker does indeed allow containers to access the filesystem, as root on the host, but only to paths you "explicitly" share with that container. |
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| 02:19.20 | sney | aha |
| 02:19.37 | scruloose | I put "explicitly" in scare-quotes because if you use docker-compose, it'll cheerfully accept paths defined in .yml files in your pwd as being "explicitly" shared. |
| 02:21.11 | petn-randall | scruloose: docker is not meant to be used as isolation feature security-wise. A normal docker user has not only root on all containers, but also on the host itself. |
| 02:21.39 | petn-randall | IIRC root in the container also mean root on the host. |
| 02:21.44 | petn-randall | *means |
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| 02:22.14 | scruloose | So adding a user to the docker group effectively gives that user full root powers (they can trivially get a root shell with host system's root dir mounted read/write), without even sudo's password prompt. |
| 02:22.38 | scruloose | petn-randall: yeah, I'm getting that... ;-) |
| 02:24.12 | scruloose | New question: is there a way to delete a group on Debian and prevent it getting recreated by later package installs/upgrades? |
| 02:25.34 | petn-randall | yes; no |
| 02:25.36 | petn-randall | !xy |
| 02:25.36 | dpkg | Slow down for a bit! Are you sure that you need to jump through that particular hoop to achieve your goal? We suspect you don't, so why don't you back up a bit and tell us about the overall objective... We know that people often falsely diagnose problems because they are too close to them -- it's easy to miss that there is a better way to proceed. See http://mywiki.wooledge.org/XyProblem |
| 02:26.43 | scruloose | I gather that docker does offer *some* meaningful degree of security isolation in terms of controlling what the thing *inside* the container can do on the host, but only to the extent chosen by the user setting up/running the container... yes? |
| 02:26.52 | scruloose | Haha! A fair point. |
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| 02:27.47 | petn-randall | scruloose: https://docs.docker.com/engine/security/ |
| 02:28.19 | petn-randall | scruloose: unprivileged users inside the container are isolated from the rest of the system. Everything else not so. |
| 02:28.32 | petn-randall | Might have changed since I read up on it a few years ago. |
| 02:34.08 | scruloose | From my not-very-deep reading in the last couple of days, I believe there has been some progress on that front in the meantime, but yeah, it sure isn't security-first design. |
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| 02:40.45 | petn-randall | Their goal is to provide a stable, reproducible environment, that is easily transferable, to run binaries in. Security is not on their list. |
| 02:41.41 | pasiz | firewall is firewall, application server is application server... |
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| 03:05.53 | noisemaker | I just installed the package `webkit2gtk-driver` but compiling some Vala code I get: fatal error: webkit2/webkit2.h: No such file or directory |
| 03:06.17 | sney | !headers |
| 03:06.17 | dpkg | Trying to compile something from source, and the build script says it can't find a dependency you are sure you have installed? You need header packages, which have the -dev suffix. For instance, if it thinks python3 is missing, install 'python3-dev'. See <build-essential>. |
| 03:06.56 | sney | you can also use apt-file to find out what package owns a specific file. |
| 03:08.49 | noisemaker | sney: hum, there is no -dev package for me, could be part of the non-free ? |
| 03:09.03 | sney | you can also use apt-file to find out what package owns a specific file. |
| 03:10.28 | sney | !apt-file |
| 03:10.29 | dpkg | apt-file is a utility used to find which package owns a given file - or list files in a package - even if it is not installed: "aptitude install apt-file && apt-file update" ; then "apt-file search filename" to see a list of packages containing filename (can also use a regular expression; see man apt-file). You can also search online, ask me about <pdo>. See also <judd-file>, <auto-apt>, <dlocate>. |
| 03:12.17 | oxek | can apt-file search for things in buster-backports too though? |
| 03:13.01 | sney | it uses the Contents file on the mirror, so as long as the mirror has one, it'll work normally |
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| 03:13.23 | sney | this should apply for any mirror operated by debian but some 3rd party stuff might not. |
| 03:13.57 | noisemaker | Ty |
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| 03:49.20 | EdePopede | seems i found out the identity of the bad guy on my buster install. it is a "give me everything you have" install (still DVD1 only, nice), then i logged in to xfce, made my changes, logged out. which left me back with TWENTY-EIGHT processes running as that user. |
| 03:50.39 | EdePopede | there was a systemd --user which had a gfvsd subtree and some individual processes. started killing them one by one, when i reached the last one finally everything including the whole systemd army disappeared |
| 03:50.57 | EdePopede | ,file tracker/tracker-miner-apps |
| 03:51.01 | judd | Search for tracker/tracker-miner-apps in buster/amd64: tracker-miner-fs: usr/lib/tracker/tracker-miner-apps |
| 03:51.18 | EdePopede | ,info tracker-miner-fs |
| 03:51.20 | judd | Package tracker-miner-fs (utils, optional) in buster/amd64: metadata database, indexer and search tool - filesystem indexer. Version: 2.1.6-1; Size: 464.1k; Installed: 656k; Homepage: https://wiki.gnome.org/Projects/Tracker |
| 03:51.35 | sney | unfortunately named, that one |
| 03:51.49 | EdePopede | gnome. should i be surprised? |
| 03:51.53 | EdePopede | and yes, definitely :D |
| 03:52.11 | EdePopede | the thing keeping my pressure low was that PC being air-gapped |
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| 03:53.30 | EdePopede | the next thing is, returning to the desktop didn't bring back the panel. but i'll look for this one later. for now i'll see if i can reproduce this one. |
| 03:54.46 | EdePopede | and the keypad wasn't working at all in mc's subshell on tty. looked into the settings dialogs, even checked the keypad keys in the one, didn't save, but when i returned they were there. another mystery. |
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| 03:59.58 | EdePopede | ,v tracker-miner-fs |
| 03:59.59 | judd | Package: tracker-miner-fs on amd64 -- jessie: 1.2.4-2; stretch: 1.10.5-1; buster: 2.1.6-1; bullseye: 2.3.5-2; sid: 2.3.5-2 |
| 04:00.16 | EdePopede | i'm surprised ,info didn't return a pdo url. |
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| 04:06.06 | EdePopede | gnome, seriously. the project channel is on irc.gnome.org which i have no idea if that's freenode or not, if it is, there's only 2 people sitting there and it doesn't even have a topic. then i wanted to check their hp for that info, only the gnome logo top left corner only points to the discourse start page. discourse, which is nothing but phpbb in shiny modern colors. |
| 04:07.18 | EdePopede | they have a really poor idea of usability and interface design for folks who have the idea of building the linux desktop of the future. |
| 04:09.15 | EdePopede | > GNOME IRC channels can be found on the irc.gnome.org server, also known as GIMPNet. |
| 04:09.42 | EdePopede | iirc one of them tricked me already years ago by not even mentioning what network they really were using. |
| 04:10.12 | sney | I think every time I've skimmed this list in the past decade, it's been the same: https://wiki.gnome.org/Community/GettingInTouch/IRC |
| 04:10.20 | sney | timestamp at the bottom from this year, though |
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| 04:12.51 | kline\0 | EdePopede: irc.gnome.org isnt chat.freenode.net |
| 04:14.51 | EdePopede | kline\0: yep, gimpnet. i remember i've been there years ago. but that's info that really could be given when they tell people to connect to irc://whatever since using different domains on the same network isn't that uncommon. |
| 04:14.51 | kline\0 | gnome sucks for a lot of reasons but i dont think this is one of them |
| 04:17.44 | EdePopede | back then i was refused to connect to the network. took me some time to find out that i was already on it using my default nick. there was no hint at all that it was that one. yes, this sucks if you're trying to reach someone helping you out of a problem and all you get is "you stay out." |
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| 08:38.01 | AimHere | Grrrr. When did debian decide to switch on unattended upgrades by default? |
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| 08:43.15 | AimHere | Stealth upgrade decided to upgrade a library to a shiny new version while I was actually using it. One minute my application works, next minute it's broken |
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| 08:43.55 | AimHere | And because it's a brand shiny new regression bug, it's not like there's a bug report for it |
| 08:43.58 | AimHere | /vent |
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| 08:49.44 | oxek | AimHere: unattended upgrades are not default |
| 08:50.09 | AimHere | I don't recall switching them on, ever |
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| 08:55.28 | oxek | do you have python3-software-properties package installed? |
| 08:55.42 | oxek | that package lists unattended-upgrades as recommends |
| 08:56.21 | AimHere | I do |
| 08:57.04 | oxek | did you pick gnome during installation? |
| 08:57.31 | oxek | I suspect you may be correct, gnome possibly pulls unattended-upgrades as a dependency of software-properties-gtk |
| 08:58.18 | oxek | this may possibly be an oversight and unintended behavior, so I'd hope someone else would comment on it here |
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| 08:59.12 | AimHere | I don't think it was gnome, and it certainly wasn't during an install |
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| 09:02.01 | oxek | I'm just following reverse dependencies, where I see that unattended-upgrades is recommended by python3-software-properties, which is a dependency of software-properties-common/software-properties-kde/software-properties-gtk |
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| 09:02.36 | oxek | and those packages are unlikely to be installed outside of initial installation, and very unlikely to be installed manually by the user |
| 09:03.07 | AimHere | Yeah, the dpkg log shows it being installed at about the same time as a bunch of curl-related packages + python3-software-properties + apt-transport-https and related stuff |
| 09:03.19 | oxek | I know for a fact that unattended-upgrades does not get installed on a minimal installation without a desktop environment, and not as part of xfce either |
| 09:03.45 | oxek | apt-transport-https? What debian version are you on? That package should no longer exist. |
| 09:03.51 | AimHere | sid |
| 09:04.07 | AimHere | This update happened in November |
| 09:04.14 | AimHere | I haven't noticed until now! |
| 09:04.23 | oxek | yeah, sid is not supported in this channel, and all sorts of crazy things can happen in sid |
| 09:04.28 | oxek | !debian-next |
| 09:04.28 | dpkg | #debian-next is the channel for testing/unstable support on the OFTC network (irc.oftc.net), *not* on freenode. If you get "Cannot join #debian-next (Channel is invite only)." it means you did not read it's on irc.oftc.net. See also https://wiki.debian.org/IRC and https://wiki.debian.org/GettingHelpOnIrc |
| 09:04.42 | AimHere | I'm not asking for support |
| 09:04.45 | AimHere | Just venting |
| 09:05.11 | oxek | probably no point venting about sid, it might be configured to use unattended-upgrades so that you always get upgrades asap |
| 09:05.36 | oxek | and "One minute my application works, next minute it's broken" is behavior I'd expect on sid |
| 09:06.17 | AimHere | My proximate problem is that this rotten library is broke, and not only is it so new nobody's filed a bug report, I'm not qualified to file one. It's a library called by a library called by an app I'm using and I don't have a clue what the hell it even is |
| 09:07.00 | oxek | last week gnutls library broke on sid, breaking everything. That's typical behavior of sid. |
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| 09:07.18 | AimHere | All the more reason why you don't want unattended-upgrades on by default |
| 09:07.39 | oxek | sid comes with enough warning labels to not use it for anything that's not related to testing or developing debian |
| 09:07.49 | AimHere | If you do it manually, at least you can pick a time when breaking shit is less annoying |
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| 09:09.11 | AimHere | Yeah, I know. My main reason for using sid was that a) Ubuntu wouldn't install when I tried and b) stable's software was out of date. And sid isn't terrible, most of the time |
| 09:10.05 | oxek | there's debian-testing (currently bullseye), and backports to debian-stable. |
| 09:10.17 | oxek | I'd definitely try both of those before trying sid. |
| 09:10.41 | AimHere | I've found myself needing to use experimental repos on a couple of occasion :) |
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| 09:11.17 | Lope | how can I find the ipv6 default gateway currently being used on a system? |
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| 09:11.48 | oxek | all I'm saying is I definitely would not expect stable behavior (stable = not changing at random times, as happened to you) from non-stable versions of debian. |
| 09:13.14 | oxek | Lope: 'ip route show' |
| 09:13.20 | AimHere | Oh yeah, I know about sid, and unstable. It's just that until now 'unstable' has meant a bit more stable than 'app suddenly stops working between successive invocations' |
| 09:13.25 | Lope | oxek, that's not ipv6?? |
| 09:13.49 | Lope | nevermind: ip -6 route show |
| 09:14.02 | oxek | Lope: yeah, that one |
| 09:14.31 | oxek | AimHere: on debian, "stable" does not mean "does not crash" it means "does not change" |
| 09:14.51 | oxek | hence "unstable" means "changes all the time" |
| 09:14.57 | oxek | which is the behavior you observed |
| 09:15.42 | AimHere | Yeah. There's still a big difference between 'changes, sometimes for the worse, when you ask to upgrade' and 'changes in the middle of the night for no obvious reasons' |
| 09:16.01 | AimHere | The latter is new to me! |
| 09:16.43 | oxek | it's a fair point that debian does a poor job of managing people's expectations. |
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| 09:19.05 | AimHere | Yeah, but I've been using sid for at least 15 years. I thought I had reasonable expectations. I'm not fazed by upgrading into unbootability or the like |
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| 09:20.20 | carloratm | novice question here, in firefox I see some random font without antialiasing, what could cause the problem? https://paste.pics/B9H9J |
| 09:20.36 | carloratm | Just installed Debian btw |
| 09:20.49 | oxek | yeah and I would not be surprised if sid woke me up at 3am, spit on me and call me a dirty girl, and right after that start crying and say sorry. It really is unstable. |
| 09:21.45 | oxek | carloratm: I'm so sorry if this is your first impression of #debian |
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| 09:27.19 | carloratm | umm they are working fine in epiphany, I'd ask in #firefox |
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| 09:49.58 | Lope | how can I install lsusb? |
| 09:50.04 | Lope | how can I install fsck.fat ? |
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| 09:51.49 | shtrb | Lobe , you need usbutils and dostools |
| 09:53.11 | aminvakil | Lope: ^ |
| 09:53.32 | Lope | dosfstools ? |
| 09:53.42 | Lope | looks like that's what it was |
| 09:53.49 | shtrb | yes, sorry for the typos |
| 09:54.01 | Lope | shtrb, thanks bud! |
| 09:54.59 | shtrb | np |
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| 10:32.01 | Lope | shtrb, aminvakil: I'm inside initramfs, can't seem to mount my EFI partition... :/ |
| 10:32.12 | Lope | mount -t vfat /dev/md127 /tmp/md127/ -o noatime |
| 10:32.25 | Lope | mount: mounting /dev/md127 on /tmp/md127/ failed: No such device |
| 10:32.37 | Lope | there is a /tmp/md127 dir, I've just created it. |
| 10:33.10 | Lope | cat /proc/mdstat shows: md127 : active (auto-read-only) raid1 nvme1n1p2[1] nvme0n1p2[0] 203776 blocks super 1.2 [2/2] [UU] |
| 10:33.32 | Lope | what's this auto-read-only story? |
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| 10:34.17 | Lope | if I try to mount it with `-o ro` it still says no such device. |
| 10:34.37 | Lope | So I don't think the issue is related to that "auto-read-only" text. |
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| 10:36.04 | rue_mohr | debian-10.7.0-amd64-netinst.iso is apparently not a boootable CD |
| 10:36.06 | tomreyn | does /dev/md127 exist, which file type is it? probably a symlink? does the target exist? |
| 10:36.20 | rue_mohr | can anyone direct me to a booootable cd image! |
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| 10:36.57 | azeem | rue_mohr: why do you think it's not? |
| 10:36.57 | Lope | tomreyn, the target exists, as I said I've just created the /tmp/md127 directory |
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| 10:37.03 | tomreyn | rue_mohr: maybe the copy you downloaded isn't, or it's not bootable in the way you tried to boot it |
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| 10:37.17 | rue_mohr | casue I wasted 2 blanks on it and it didn't boot |
| 10:37.20 | Lope | tomreyn, `ls /dev/md127` it shows up |
| 10:37.25 | rue_mohr | other cd's boot, not that one |
| 10:37.26 | tomreyn | Lope: i didn'T ask about the mount target, though |
| 10:37.38 | Lope | brw------- 1 root root 9, 127 Jan 10 10:19 /dev/md127 |
| 10:37.50 | rue_mohr | debian-6.0.5-i386-netinst.iso boots fine |
| 10:37.58 | Lope | tomreyn, oh, you mean target in terms of it being a symlink |
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| 10:38.08 | tomreyn | Lope: okay a block device |
| 10:38.19 | tomreyn | not a symlink then |
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| 10:38.45 | quadrathoch2 | rue_mohr do you have an only i386 system? because you downloaded the amd64 version |
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| 10:38.49 | Lope | tomreyn, fdisk -l shows it: Disk /dev/md127: 199 MiB, 208666624 bytes, 407552 sectors |
| 10:38.58 | rue_mohr | its a xeon |
| 10:39.13 | Lope | Disklabel type: dos |
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| 10:39.42 | rue_mohr | is xeon not 64 bit which is amd64 cause apparently intel didn't invent a 64bit processor? |
| 10:40.17 | quadrathoch2 | rue_mohr if you have a xeon from 20 years ago, no it's not an amd64 version |
| 10:40.20 | quadrathoch2 | but otherwise yes |
| 10:40.27 | Lope | tomreyn, `dd if=/dev/md127 of=/dev/null bs=1M` completes without error. |
| 10:40.39 | rue_mohr | and it shouldnt be called i386 if an i386 cant boot it (it cant, you guys put instructions in that kernel that are not 386) |
| 10:40.49 | azeem | rue_mohr: are you trolling? |
| 10:41.06 | rue_mohr | no I'm trying to install debian on the cool new dell server I was just given |
| 10:41.18 | azeem | did you try a usb stick? |
| 10:41.19 | rue_mohr | 24G of ram :) |
| 10:41.28 | azeem | that doesn't sound like a new server |
| 10:41.34 | azeem | unless you meant 24T |
| 10:41.35 | rue_mohr | I do not think it can boot from a stick |
| 10:41.35 | tomreyn | Lope: file -s /dev/md127 |
| 10:41.41 | quadrathoch2 | rue_mohr so make sure that the downloaded amd64 iso is fine per SHA512SUM, and verify that the way you burn the disk is also good |
| 10:41.41 | rue_mohr | its only option seems to be cdrom |
| 10:41.48 | rue_mohr | stupid thing doesn't even have pxe |
| 10:42.04 | quadrathoch2 | so sounds like a very old system |
| 10:42.08 | quadrathoch2 | so maybe it's not amd64 |
| 10:42.23 | quadrathoch2 | rue_mohr could you verify which cpus you got in that device? (or which dell server) |
| 10:42.40 | rue_mohr | Dell poweredge T610 |
| 10:42.46 | rue_mohr | anyone know? |
| 10:43.55 | Lope | tomreyn, unfortunately I didn't include file in my initramfs |
| 10:44.11 | azeem | looks like it's from 2012 |
| 10:44.15 | azeem | but should be amd64 |
| 10:44.19 | Lope | tomreyn, I'll try chroot |
| 10:44.25 | tomreyn | Lope: lsblk? |
| 10:44.34 | quadrathoch2 | rue_mohr so, as the cpu does have amd64 instructions, it's still on your end, why the disc doesn't boot |
| 10:44.34 | tomreyn | i mean blkid |
| 10:44.45 | Lope | tomreyn, `dd if=/dev/md127 of=/dev/null bs=1M` completes without error. |
| 10:44.48 | azeem | rue_mohr: that's the error you get when trying to boot that? |
| 10:44.58 | Lope | tomreyn, sorry, bad clipboard. |
| 10:45.01 | Lope | tomreyn, /dev/md127: block special (9/127) |
| 10:45.07 | Lope | that's the output of file |
| 10:45.08 | rue_mohr | no bootable disk found |
| 10:45.17 | rue_mohr | press F1 to retry |
| 10:45.19 | rue_mohr | :) |
| 10:45.37 | quadrathoch2 | rue_mohr sounds like the cd was burned wrong |
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| 10:45.58 | azeem | rue_mohr: maybe try a previous point release then |
| 10:46.01 | tomreyn | Lope: so file doesn't see a vfat file system there. what about blkid /dev/md127 |
| 10:46.05 | rue_mohr | wodim -v -data debian-10.7.0-amd64-netinst.iso |
| 10:46.21 | azeem | like debian-10.6.0-amd64-netinst.iso |
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| 10:46.50 | Lope | /dev/md127: SEC_TYPE="msdos" LABEL_FATBOOT="EFI" LABEL="EFI" UUID="0E0B-537A" BLOCK_SIZE="512" TYPE="vfat" |
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| 10:46.54 | muffindrake | Heyas. I have a fresh debian sid, and have run into a problem with the current obs-studio package. The UI appears corrupted, with text and elements not rendering correctly. |
| 10:47.00 | rue_mohr | I'm not using up the last writable cd's in the world am I? |
| 10:47.12 | rue_mohr | hmm |
| 10:47.33 | quadrathoch2 | honestly, rue_mohr, it's really weird, that that server can't boot off of usb :/ |
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| 10:47.55 | Lope | tomreyn, ^ |
| 10:48.04 | tomreyn | Lope: hmm, this looks much bettzer, maybe the 'file' command just didnt have a proper magic bytes DB at hand. |
| 10:48.14 | jmcnaught | Lope: are you trying to put your ESP on an mdadm array? |
| 10:48.31 | rue_mohr | its too bad it cant do pxe, I'm set up! |
| 10:48.31 | Lope | jmcnaught, EFI on mdadm raid 1 |
| 10:48.38 | Lope | jmcnaught, is that a no go? |
| 10:48.43 | tomreyn | that makes not much sense |
| 10:48.55 | jmcnaught | Lope: I do not see why that would work. |
| 10:49.07 | Lope | Well, it's just a fat filesystem on mdadm |
| 10:49.46 | Lope | so should I do the EFI naked, no mdadm? |
| 10:49.58 | Lope | I'm trying to set it up so that either SSD can fail, and it'll boot. |
| 10:50.15 | jmcnaught | I would not expect the computer's firmware to be able to understand an mdadm array. |
| 10:50.17 | rue_mohr | I'll try the 386 image, |
| 10:50.18 | tomreyn | well, it can work, metadata resides at the end of the device, so firmware might just see the vfat file system. but it's a recipe for breaking things, especially if you let the firmware write to it. |
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| 10:50.48 | rue_mohr | then maybe dig around for a stick large enough for the full install and try that |
| 10:50.49 | Lope | tomreyn, jmcnaught okay thanks. I'll nuke the efi filesystem and then do it naked. no mdadm. |
| 10:51.23 | tomreyn | you better have plain vfat on a partition and then mirror the contents to another partition on another storage. |
| 10:54.49 | Lope | tomreyn, ok thanks |
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| 11:16.12 | rue_mohr | hmm, bad disk? I seem to now have one booting with read errors |
| 11:16.20 | rue_mohr | *sigh* thanks anyhow |
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| 11:17.55 | sfx2496 | Does anyone known how to spoof custom/enhanced build of ffmpeg in the linux(Debian/Mint20)package manager, so it won't install the default compiled ffmpeg when other programs want to install ffmpeg as req. dependency? |
| 11:18.50 | tomreyn | there is no "linux(Debian/Mint20)package manager" |
| 11:19.13 | sfx2496 | I just tried to make a deb package, it installed, but does not show up as installed in the package manager (synaptic show gray i icon before it, and the software manager of Mint does not show it as proper installed either) |
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| 11:37.39 | shtrb | sfx2496, after building the deb file , did you run dpkg -i filename.deb ? |
| 11:37.43 | noisemaker | When I install some packages in one machine, can I make that machine a local mirror for other debian machines but only with the packages installed ? |
| 11:37.50 | shtrb | Lope, sorry I was out |
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| 11:39.23 | shtrb | Lope, are you sure that you are booted in an EFI enabled mode ? [ -d /sys/firmware/efi ] && echo uefi || echo oldschool |
| 11:44.06 | deq2496 | shtrb: I just did, makes no difference for the installation state, is it because of conflict with default package?(I named it the same with same version in "contol" file) |
| 11:45.37 | shtrb | give us please the output of dpkg -i yourpackaname.deb , also you should have a higher version than the regular one so your version would not be overwritten |
| 11:46.44 | shtrb | also dpkg -s yourpackagename |
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| 11:50.48 | deq2496 | sudo dpkg -s Ffmpeg.deb => dpkg-query: package 'ffmpeg.deb' is not installed and no information is available |
| 11:51.24 | shtrb | I didn't write the .deb in my command |
| 11:51.36 | deq2496 | lol, sorry |
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| 11:52.09 | deq2496 | Package: ffmpeg |
| 11:52.09 | deq2496 | Status: install ok installed |
| 11:52.09 | deq2496 | Priority: optional |
| 11:52.09 | deq2496 | Section: custom |
| 11:52.09 | deq2496 | Installed-Size: 2048 |
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| 11:53.06 | shtrb | deq2496, sorry I had assumed you know about paste.debian.net , but based on your output that package is installed |
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| 11:54.54 | deq2496 | This is the state I am looking at https://i.imgur.com/z04URKC.jpeg |
| 11:55.57 | shtrb | And what is your state ? |
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| 12:00.48 | deq2496 | Installed after increasing deb package version with major. Version: 7:4.2.4-1ubuntu0.1 => Version: 8:4.2.4-1ubuntu0.1 |
| 12:01.05 | deq2496 | thanks a lot shtrb |
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| 12:01.55 | shtrb | np , also !ubuntu |
| 12:02.03 | shtrb | !ubuntu |
| 12:02.03 | dpkg | Ubuntu is based on Debian, but it is not Debian. Only Debian is supported on #debian. Use #ubuntu on chat.freenode.net instead. Even if the channel happens to be less helpful, support for distributions other than Debian is offtopic on #debian. See also <based on debian> and <ubuntuirc>. |
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| 12:25.36 | ratrace | noisemaker: I think you need the apt cacher thingy: https://wiki.debian.org/AptCacherNg |
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| 12:45.54 | Lope | shtrb, thanks, I'll check that |
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| 13:30.54 | ratrace | So I'm reading the Debian New Maintainer's Guide, cover to cover. I wonder, why does it say the package "should not" be a daemon? Who is supposed to pacakge up daemons then? |
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| 13:35.38 | themill | Someone who is not a new maintainer. |
| 13:37.29 | themill | It's just substantially harder and adding all that is required to the new maintainer guide would unnecessarily complicate the guide. The guide is about making a simple package. |
| 13:38.24 | themill | (the very next sentence even says as much) |
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| 13:46.29 | ratrace | themill: hmm right. I misread the title. "(new maintainer) guide" I read that as "new (maintainer guide)" |
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| 13:51.12 | abrotman | you mean despite the opening sections that explain the purpose? |
| 13:55.00 | shtrb | new mainter guide is actually written very good, even outsiders (like me ) found it easy to package and almost no lintian warnings , getting stuff into debian later might be a problem |
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| 13:55.56 | shtrb | *New Maintainer Guide |
| 13:56.01 | shtrb | also it's little bit outdated |
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| 14:15.40 | gorillapatch | Hello everyone, I am experiencing strange things with my Samba installation on Debian Buster. I have added a usershare and even if I login with another username, I cannot access and see this in my logfile "session closed for user nobody" |
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| 14:41.29 | pasiz | gorillapatch: so your client is trying to authenticate as nobody |
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| 15:19.55 | lf94 | Hey, I'm trying to install debian on a HP EliteDesk 800. What I've done is dd the iso onto an external SSD, but I cannot boot from it. |
| 15:20.17 | lf94 | ...I'm out of ideas. I've gone into bios and turned off secure boot, enabled legacy boot, tried a combination of things. |
| 15:20.34 | dvs | lf94: Do you intend to install Debian on that same SSD? |
| 15:20.41 | lf94 | yeah |
| 15:20.47 | dvs | that won't work. |
| 15:20.50 | robobox | that doesn't work |
| 15:20.56 | lf94 | yeah, just realizing as you say it |
| 15:20.59 | lf94 | :D |
| 15:21.08 | robobox | try a USB drive |
| 15:21.15 | lf94 | I've also tried dd'ing my current install |
| 15:21.27 | lf94 | dd if=/dev/mmc0blk of=/dev/sda |
| 15:21.28 | dvs | current install of what? |
| 15:21.31 | lf94 | debian |
| 15:21.45 | dvs | get clonezilla for that |
| 15:21.57 | lf94 | ok |
| 15:23.19 | lf94 | So how come I can't boot from the SSD into the live image? |
| 15:25.08 | dvs | Because an SSD isn't a USB drive? |
| 15:26.01 | ratrace | does clonezilla take care of randomizing UUIDs? |
| 15:26.13 | lf94 | I'm using a USB<->SATA interface |
| 15:26.16 | lf94 | @dvs |
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| 15:26.35 | ratrace | if not, one should be very careful when working with both copies on the same system. if yes, one should be careful to update the clone's fstab and other configs for the new UUIDs, if they were used. |
| 15:26.38 | lf94 | So for example, when I plug it into my laptop (which I'm talking to you with), it appears as /dev/sda |
| 15:27.01 | lf94 | So technically it's been seen a usb drive. |
| 15:27.09 | lf94 | So why can't it boot? |
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| 15:27.32 | Mister00X | lf94: could be that the bios doesn't detect it |
| 15:27.45 | lf94 | It shows up as "Seagate USB: ..." |
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| 15:28.29 | dvs | it still isn't a USB drive, it's a SATA drive. |
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| 15:28.57 | lf94 | dvs okie dokie |
| 15:29.01 | ratrace | it's a mixture actually. you can't use it fully as you would a purely SATA interfaced one |
| 15:29.10 | lf94 | Suggestions? |
| 15:29.23 | Mister00X | lf94: get an usb stic |
| 15:29.37 | Mister00X | s/stic/stick |
| 15:29.49 | ratrace | but I wonder why wouldn't it boot if you dd'd the ISO. does the iso not contain a gpt layout? |
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| 15:29.56 | lf94 | So boot from the USB, install on the external SSD? |
| 15:30.03 | Mister00X | yes |
| 15:30.05 | lf94 | ratrace: let me check |
| 15:30.13 | lf94 | Mister00X: why wouldn't the live image boot? |
| 15:30.17 | lf94 | (as ratrace is saying) |
| 15:30.20 | dvs | lf94: yes put the ISO on the USB stick. |
| 15:30.40 | lf94 | ah ha, interesting |
| 15:30.42 | lf94 | > GPT PMBR size mismatch (244277247 != 468862126) will be corrected by write. |
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| 15:30.46 | lf94 | you're onto something ratrace. |
| 15:31.08 | lf94 | writing; will try to boot now |
| 15:31.14 | ratrace | lf94: now that you mention it, I think those are so called "hybrid" ISOs that can work both with USB sticks and CD/DVD media |
| 15:31.14 | lf94 | oh, the write failed |
| 15:31.25 | lf94 | ratrace: yeah I think the netinst image is fine for this. |
| 15:32.05 | lf94 | alright, lemme try booting now... |
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| 15:34.11 | lf94 | nope, no boot. |
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| 15:34.29 | lf94 | > EFI |
| 15:34.31 | Mister00X | lf94: Try another port |
| 15:34.35 | lf94 | I have |
| 15:34.40 | lf94 | maybe I do need to enable secure boot |
| 15:34.53 | Mister00X | hmmmm and your bios can't detect the stick? |
| 15:35.00 | lf94 | it does |
| 15:35.14 | Mister00X | then wenn is it failing |
| 15:35.36 | Mister00X | do you see grub? |
| 15:35.40 | lf94 | nope |
| 15:35.47 | lf94 | i boot into bios menu |
| 15:35.53 | lf94 | select specifically the device i want to boot from |
| 15:36.05 | lf94 | and it just goes back to the menu |
| 15:36.17 | lf94 | when I select the internal storage, it boots windows |
| 15:36.55 | Mister00X | which menu, the bios one? |
| 15:37.35 | lf94 | yep |
| 15:37.51 | Mister00X | are you sure the iso is ok? |
| 15:38.03 | lf94 | not sure. how can I verify the write? |
| 15:38.16 | lf94 | dd what I wrote back to my laptop? |
| 15:38.26 | lf94 | the partition table looks ok |
| 15:38.29 | Mister00X | lf94: that's a bit difficult |
| 15:38.37 | lf94 | 3 partitions: EFI, Linux fs, Linux swap |
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| 15:38.57 | Mister00X | but I meant the original iso, did you comared it against a hash |
| 15:39.03 | lf94 | ahhh |
| 15:39.09 | lf94 | no, lemme do it |
| 15:39.16 | ratrace | should be possible to md5sum the ISO and then md5sum from the USB disk, from byte 0 to exactly the number of bytes the ISO is |
| 15:39.19 | gorillapatch | pasiz: Sounds strange, as my client is presented a login dialog |
| 15:39.37 | jhutchins | lf94: The purpos of secure boot is to prevent you from installing linux, so you want that disabled. Any quick/fast boot feature should also be disabled. |
| 15:40.02 | lf94 | jhutchins: that's what I thought too, and I"m just trying anything at this point. |
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| 15:41.03 | lf94 | "Enable MS UEFI CA key" |
| 15:41.10 | lf94 | Why would I disable the CA key |
| 15:41.20 | lf94 | shouldnt matter if secure boot is off right |
| 15:41.47 | dvs | lf94: I'd turn secure boot off. It was designed to thwart Linux |
| 15:42.21 | lf94 | hm |
| 15:42.41 | lf94 | same issue. I'm going to determine if it's the machine or the storage by trying to boot off it on this laptop. |
| 15:42.43 | lf94 | brb |
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| 16:31.16 | lf94 | So the issue is the usb/sata interface. |
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| 16:31.26 | lf94 | Just ordered a new one off amazon, should be in Friday |
| 16:31.50 | ratrace | I shucked mine from external USB disk enclosures :) |
| 16:32.09 | lf94 | Yes, that's the exact thing I did too |
| 16:32.11 | lf94 | X) |
| 16:32.19 | lf94 | It's been dying from what I can tell for ahile |
| 16:32.30 | lf94 | This is not the first time it's been hard to read/write things with it |
| 16:32.39 | lf94 | well thanks guys! |
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| 16:33.02 | Mister00X | !next |
| 16:33.02 | dpkg | Another happy customer leaves the building. |
| 16:33.47 | wsky | that's me |
| 16:34.04 | wsky | bubbles the bubble |
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| 16:39.06 | dob1 | ,v taskwarrior |
| 16:39.07 | judd | Package: taskwarrior on amd64 -- jessie: 2.3.0+dfsg-3; stretch: 2.5.1+dfsg-3; stretch-backports: 2.5.1+dfsg-5~bpo9+1; buster: 2.5.1+dfsg-7; bullseye: 2.5.3+dfsg-1; sid: 2.5.3+dfsg-1 |
| 16:39.44 | dob1 | nice :) |
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| 17:09.27 | cole_phelps | i have a problem with python3_numpy can someone help me? |
| 17:09.46 | sney | !anyone |
| 17:09.47 | dpkg | Please do not ask if anyone can help you, knows 'something' or uses 'some_program'. Instead, ask your real question. (If the real question _was_ "does anyone use 'some_program'?" ask me about <popcon> instead.) See <ask> <ask to ask> <polls> <search> <sicco> <smart questions>. |
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| 17:10.07 | alexrelis[m] | Is there a way to view a changelog of every updated package? |
| 17:10.19 | shtrb | alexxander, yes |
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| 17:10.41 | Mister00X | alexrelis[m]: yes apt-listchanges I think |
| 17:11.40 | alexrelis[m] | Mister00X: `apt-listchanges` doesn't have a changelog for every package, so I'm guessing it's only for some packages then right? |
| 17:12.37 | Mister00X | alexrelis[m]: It should display the changelog of every package right before it's upgraded |
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| 17:15.19 | shtrb | alexrelis[m], apt-get changelog firefox-esr for example |
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| 17:15.52 | cole_phelps | s me an error of input i try to apt-get upgrade on kali and python3_numpy is not installing because of\some input/output error which i think causes a dependency problem and causes the packages to not upgrade i've been stuck w/ it for two weeks now |
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| 17:16.49 | alexrelis[m] | shtrb: This is epic! You learn something new every day. Thanks guys! |
| 17:16.49 | sney | why do kali noobs all think #debian will support them |
| 17:16.50 | ratrace | cole_phelps: nothing we can help with in #debian, tho. |
| 17:16.55 | sney | !kali-magic |
| 17:16.56 | dpkg | Kali Linux is just an operating system. It does not magically turn you into a hacker. It is also offtopic in #debian. Please fulfill your fantasies in #kali-linux on chat.freenode.net. See also <based on debian> and <they don't know>. |
| 17:16.58 | cole_phelps | fuck you |
| 17:17.12 | azeem | cole_phelps: please keep it on topic |
| 17:17.14 | cole_phelps | at least answer with something usefull |
| 17:17.15 | alexrelis[m] | cole_phelps: Don't be mean |
| 17:17.34 | ratrace | !tell cole_phelps about kali |
| 17:17.38 | shtrb | sney, because kali is in fact a rebardning of unstable |
| 17:17.43 | alexrelis[m] | You can ask your question in the #kali-linux chat. |
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| 17:17.55 | cole_phelps | yeah sorry mr tardi pants thinks he's funny |
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| 17:18.11 | ratrace | cole_phelps: kali is offtopic here. please respect channel rules. |
| 17:18.18 | cole_phelps | okay sorry |
| 17:18.32 | alexrelis[m] | cole_phelps: It's like having a Windows PC and asking for help at a Genius Bar. |
| 17:18.39 | shtrb | cole_phelps, you shouldn't be using Kali if that's your first linux experience either |
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| 17:21.40 | sney | shtrb: it's not a rebrand, it's a derivative like all of the other derivatives. Mint isn't a rebrand, neither is parrot, mxlinux, etc. And Kali's website has a *lot* of documentation on it including links to community support. |
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| 17:23.42 | shtrb | sney, kali is advertised^(tm) as a pure bland of debian, while in fact there are some differences. Mint on the other hand is not a pure bland |
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| 17:24.45 | azeem | (it's blend) |
| 17:25.16 | sney | there is no mention of that on https://www.kali.org/docs/ |
| 17:25.38 | EdePopede | that's how it *looks* like > https://graphcommons.com/graphs/5a382f83-758e-465c-b8c0-85f9f6cc9d95 |
| 17:25.52 | shtrb | azeem, thanks for the correction |
| 17:26.18 | EdePopede | found it 2 days ago. and btw i'd really like to have this kind of dependency graphs instead just dot ;) |
| 17:26.18 | cole_phelps | back from the kali chan...nobody answered |
| 17:26.24 | sney | !they don't know |
| 17:26.24 | dpkg | We're sorry your distro's channel isn't being helpful, but that doesn't make it appropriate to use #debian for non-Debian questions. Please go back to your channel and wait patiently for better help, or install Debian and party with us. |
| 17:27.19 | shtrb | sney, thanks , perhas I got the wrong impression all toghther , I sure remembering such a claim somewhere , thank you for correcting me |
| 17:27.37 | azeem | huh, so kali linux is a knoppix fork? |
| 17:27.41 | sney | regardless, #debian has never supported those pentesting distros and we aren't about to start now |
| 17:27.49 | azeem | I guess they rebased it since |
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| 17:28.41 | EdePopede | azeem: would be nice if distrowatch was up-to-date and they'd autocreate such graphs :) |
| 17:28.43 | sney | one of kali's core developers is a debian developer, he also co-authored the debian administrator's handbook. the connection is there. and they *could* have made a blend, but they didn't. |
| 17:28.59 | sney | I suspect bundling non-DFSG stuff is part of that. |
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| 17:29.09 | shtrb | azeem, testing (https://www.kali.org/docs/policy/kali-linux-relationship-with-debian/ ) but not pure blend , they are like ubuntu :-( |
| 17:29.52 | shtrb | And on a different note, I expect us to get our good old iceweasel back |
| 17:30.00 | ratrace | why? |
| 17:30.01 | EdePopede | ah thanks, i was about to ask if such a paper exists |
| 17:31.10 | shtrb | ratrace, based on latest mozilla announcement, I expect them to have an actual anti DFSG patches not take too much time. |
| 17:31.28 | ratrace | shtrb: hit me with a link, what announcement? |
| 17:31.39 | sney | I can hear Mike Homney's ulcer growing from here |
| 17:32.41 | shtrb | ratrace, https://blog.mozilla.org/blog/2021/01/08/we-need-more-than-deplatforming/ they didn't break DFSG yet , but if they would to implement what they say it would be against the DFSG |
| 17:34.03 | shtrb | sney, was he the iceweasel maint ? |
| 17:34.06 | ratrace | shtrb: what specifically? that article is very vague |
| 17:34.35 | sney | shtrb: he's the current firefox maintainer. he always seems very stressed in mailing list discussions |
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| 17:36.23 | shtrb | ratrace, they didn't do anything yet, but if they put their code where their words are we should expect mozilla products, I would expect them to enable kinds of censership and to prevent some people from using their tools (which would be a DFSG problem ) |
| 17:36.34 | EdePopede | wouldn't this be just the newsstream on the new tabs? |
| 17:36.57 | ratrace | shtrb: that's a very vague and nonspecific and speculative super-maybe-someday-something-something :) |
| 17:37.03 | shtrb | EdePopede, first they need to commit, and push, now that is just too vauge |
| 17:37.07 | EdePopede | or do you expect sth like apple/google/.... did these days? |
| 17:37.08 | azeem | yeah, can we get back to topic |
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| 17:38.22 | shtrb | DFSG is no longer on-topic :-( |
| 17:38.54 | sney | wild speculation about what mozilla might do is definitely more suited to an offtopic channel |
| 17:38.59 | azeem | yeah |
| 17:39.16 | shtrb | moved |
| 17:39.22 | azeem | thanks |
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| 18:57.42 | Lope | ratrace, have you got a snippet for me to easily fire up a qemu-kvm VM without dealing with libvirt etc? |
| 18:58.15 | Lope | ratrace, still can't get the bastars to boot. the initramfs works great. No idea what happens after that. |
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| 19:08.40 | Lope | ratrace, haha, I installed libvirtd and now controlling it remotely via virt-manager |
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| 19:56.00 | Lope | ratrace, lol, it boots perfectly fine in a VM |
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| 20:10.24 | alexrelis[m] | sent a long message: < https://matrix.org/_matrix/media/r0/download/matrix.org/VmPQRjvFZOdYdnhWvfIgrEII/message.txt > |
| 20:10.39 | alexrelis[m] | What package should I report the bug to in that case? |
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| 20:40.57 | gholinbrown | hello. why is the clock applet using 300 megabyte of memory |
| 20:41.39 | azeem | is it? |
| 20:42.02 | gholinbrown | do right-click properties. the virtual memory shows a high number like that |
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| 20:44.34 | gholinbrown | a clock shouldn't need that kind of memory. it's also questionable why the non-virtual memory is 32mb for a clock makes no sense either. it's a clock. |
| 20:45.56 | gholinbrown | but let's focus on the 300+MB. as virtual memory my understanding is that's how much got DMA'd? |
| 20:46.37 | AimHere | Are you taking into account that most memory-reading tools in Linux count every shared library as part of the memory total, even if they're used by something else? |
| 20:47.39 | gholinbrown | shared memory says 25 MB. that accounts for the non-virtual memory i guess. but not the virtual |
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| 20:51.29 | gholinbrown | 606 MB for calculator virtual memory? what the |
| 20:52.33 | EdePopede | that's virt/res/shr for my xfce DateTime: 335M 5168 2948 # also 300+M for virt, but shared <3MB |
| 20:52.51 | EdePopede | may one of the libraries used by these tools run amok? |
| 20:55.41 | ratrace | gholinbrown: what clock applet.... surely there's no single "clock applet" in the linux world... |
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| 20:56.28 | gholinbrown | ratrace one that came standard with mate debian |
| 20:56.34 | freem | which tool was used to measure that? |
| 20:56.53 | ratrace | gholinbrown: so that's somethign specific to the MATE desktop? and how are you measuring that "applet's" specific memory usage? |
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| 20:57.03 | shtrb | gholinbrown, can you try to use pamp on that app ? |
| 20:57.28 | shtrb | gholinbrown, *pmap pid |
| 20:58.18 | gholinbrown | one sec |
| 20:59.11 | gholinbrown | ok i got a huge output |
| 20:59.12 | shtrb | !paste |
| 20:59.13 | dpkg | Do not paste more than 2 lines to this channel. Instead, use for text: https://paste.debian.net | pics/screenshots: https://imgbb.com/ or https://imgur.com/upload | large files up to 100MB (think tar.gz): https://filebin.net or https://wikisend.com | Remember to tell us the URL of your paste! Cannot cut and paste? Ask me about <pastebinit>, <nopaste>, <termbin>. |
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| 20:59.26 | shtrb | That would explain to you what is used and how it is used |
| 20:59.56 | freem | (ty for that pmap tool btw) |
| 21:00.34 | gholinbrown | https://paste.debian.net/hidden/624c6d7a/ as much as i can paste |
| 21:01.38 | shtrb | Almost all there are the shared libraries that use the data |
| 21:02.07 | gholinbrown | clock applet 349.6 MB is exact virt memory reported by the system monitor btw |
| 21:02.20 | ratrace | gholinbrown: do you know what virtual memory includes here? |
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| 21:02.34 | rander2 | hello |
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| 21:02.41 | freem | I'm curious... what would give `ps -orss,vsz,comm $pid`? |
| 21:03.34 | gholinbrown | @ratrace idk everything? why is a clock linking so much |
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| 21:04.29 | ratrace | gholinbrown: yeah it's pretty much all memory, including shared libs |
| 21:04.57 | gholinbrown | is it literally using that memory? |
| 21:05.06 | ratrace | so that's not memory exclusive to it. large desktop environments use tons of libs that interlink and you only have to link with one of them to get the whole tree into your virtual memory |
| 21:06.56 | gholinbrown | it's giving me totals like these are statically linked |
| 21:07.31 | shtrb | gholinbrown, lot's and lot's of fancy libs to do fancy animations ICU is used for internationalization (globalization) , ibexpat is travel set , libXext is actually X related , libpng you get what it does |
| 21:07.33 | ratrace | wait until you learn about electron apps carrying an entire copy of chromium.... each :) |
| 21:07.46 | EdePopede | what are these anon entries at the end? in my case 2 of them are at 65M and some at 8M which is a big part already of the 300 total. |
| 21:08.23 | shtrb | EdePopede, this could be a mmapped file or true malloc |
| 21:08.30 | ratrace | EdePopede: memory without a file backing it |
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| 21:08.49 | ratrace | so, yeah, mmaped or malloc'd |
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| 21:13.22 | EdePopede | deependencies |
| 21:14.02 | EdePopede | libthai? |
| 21:14.55 | gholinbrown | why would crypto be linked |
| 21:15.54 | shtrb | EdePopede, If he has some app or config that need Thai , or if the applet support the Thai language it would be understanble to have it |
| 21:16.28 | EdePopede | ,info ibus-libthai |
| 21:16.31 | judd | Package ibus-libthai (utils, optional) in buster/amd64: Thai input method engine for IBus based on LibThai. Version: 0.1.4-4; Size: 19.2k; Installed: 75k; Homepage: https://linux.thai.net/projects/libthai |
| 21:16.39 | sney | sometimes thai gets pulled in with multi-language font support for emoji purposes |
| 21:16.55 | EdePopede | i had ibus installed, removed it since. didn't check further. who knows. |
| 21:17.03 | EdePopede | oh. ah. |
| 21:17.32 | sney | pango has some thai dependencies as well, at least here on bullseye |
| 21:17.57 | EdePopede | yep, i've seen pango. one of the names i recognized at least. |
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| 21:21.38 | gholinbrown | for clarity, is the OS actually duplicating these for each executable that uses them? |
| 21:21.51 | freem | no. |
| 21:21.59 | freem | they are _shared libraries_ |
| 21:22.15 | freem | (.so means, IIRC, shared object) |
| 21:22.29 | gholinbrown | thank goodness. so it's just an implied minimum of need libraries (once) but also the app. |
| 21:22.57 | freem | so basically, kernel only have one copy of each in memory, and only duplicates the data sections (I think) when they are writen into |
| 21:24.43 | shtrb | freem, and then we have guix |
| 21:24.59 | freem | well... yeah |
| 21:25.12 | shtrb | I wonder if we will have guix in debian |
| 21:25.47 | shtrb | I'm talking about the multi versioning option for packages |
| 21:26.05 | freem | I wonder how hard it would be to write a dpkg that would install things into $HOME instead of $ROOTFS |
| 21:26.25 | shtrb | not that it would be fun to have packages written in scheme |
| 21:26.54 | freem | I know guix/fooix/whateveuix offers other guarantees, ofc, but this clearly seems their main sell point |
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| 21:33.32 | jhutchins | alexrelis[m]: The problem is that we rely on the packagers and developers - which are often different teams to include proper changelogs, and a lot of times they don't. |
| 21:34.07 | shtrb | jhutchins, apt-get changelog give some data (*) not the best one but some |
| 21:34.59 | freem | each time I looked at this, I had only packaging changes, I think |
| 21:35.38 | shtrb | well yes, that's the idea |
| 21:35.55 | shtrb | bugfixes, solutions , new options etc |
| 21:36.38 | freem | well, this is my point, actually. Only _packaging_ changes. Like, "bump version", "new maintainer", etc |
| 21:37.20 | freem | but I admit I don't look at it often, maybe I didn't paid enough attention, especially since debian normally does not add new features while in stable |
| 21:38.14 | shtrb | So what kind of a changelog would you expect to have ? the actual software changelog ? |
| 21:39.04 | jmcnaught | A package's /usr/share/doc/PACKAGE/ directory will have a changelog.Debian.gz (packaging changes) and a changelog.gz from upstream. |
| 21:39.07 | freem | yes, but I presume it's simply in /usr/share/doc/$package when it exists? |
| 21:39.28 | freem | but that imply installing/upgrading before reading it |
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| 21:39.52 | black_13 | can packages be installed with debug symbols |
| 21:40.02 | sney | !dbgsym |
| 21:40.03 | dpkg | Packages that end in '*-dbgsym' contain the symbols required for debugging executables and libraries. The dbgsym packages are automatically generated packages that are in a separate archive; add a line like "deb http://deb.debian.org/debian-debug/ buster-debug main" to your sources.list. See also https://wiki.debian.org/HowToGetABacktrace |
| 21:40.10 | shtrb | black_13, you have special packages for that called dbgsym ones |
| 21:40.22 | black_13 | is this for some packages |
| 21:40.50 | black_13 | for instance any of the opencv packages |
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| 21:42.12 | sney | black_13: add the repo and search it |
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| 21:45.19 | rander2 | http://paste.debian.net/1180531/ |
| 21:45.40 | sney | !kali |
| 21:45.40 | dpkg | Kali Linux https://www.kali.org/ is a security/penetration testing distribution from the creators of <backtrack>. It is based on Debian, but it is different enough that we can't provide accurate support in #debian. Seek help in #kali-linux on chat.freenode.net or https://forums.kali.org/ . Also ask me about <based on debian> and read https://www.chiark.greenend.org.uk/~sgtatham/bugs.html |
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| 21:47.07 | shtrb | poor soul only named his laptop wrong :D |
| 21:47.56 | sney | he is welcome to clarify that by actually asking a question |
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| 21:48.34 | shtrb | I'm just joking |
| 21:49.10 | sney | :) |
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| 21:49.22 | unixbsd | With Libreoffice or similar for ODT document (writer/opensource doc), how to export FONTs into the exported PDF document? there is no infos about that. |
| 21:50.19 | sney | some "no infos" from the first google result: https://ask.libreoffice.org/en/question/242309/libreoffice-writer-export-pdf-does-not-embed-fonts/ |
| 21:51.55 | ratrace | sney: OMG! you used a search engine! :) |
| 21:52.14 | sney | gasp! my secret revealed! ;) |
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| 22:08.58 | seanthegeek | Hello, |
| 22:08.58 | seanthegeek | The mirrors at debian.org appear to be down. |
| 22:08.59 | seanthegeek | E: Failed to fetch http://security.debian.org/debian-security/dists/buster/updates/InRelease Clearsigned file isn't valid, got 'NOSPLIT' (does the network require authentication?) |
| 22:08.59 | seanthegeek | E: Failed to fetch http://deb.debian.org/debian/dists/buster-updates/InRelease Clearsigned file isn't valid, got 'NOSPLIT' (does the network require authentication? |
| 22:09.00 | seanthegeek | E: Failed to fetch http://ftp.debian.org/debian/dists/buster-backports/InRelease Clearsigned file isn't valid, got 'NOSPLIT' (does the network require authentication?) |
| 22:09.00 | *** kick/#debian [seanthegeek!~debhelper@unaffiliated/debhelper] by debhelper (flood) |
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| 22:09.40 | EdePopede | getting 404 |
| 22:10.25 | tomreyn | getting 200 on all three links |
| 22:10.35 | EdePopede | seem to be back |
| 22:11.01 | EdePopede | curl: 404, firefox (the dir): ok; firefox (file): ok; curl: 200 |
| 22:11.08 | sney | deb.debian.org and ftp.debian.org are both served by the fastly cdn, which can behave strangely sometimes |
| 22:11.12 | dvs | Hit:4 http://deb.debian.org/debian buster-updates InRelease |
| 22:11.23 | *** part/#debian emptylica (~pi@2a02:2f09:d108:8900:1a1a:d818:2d70:f378) |
| 22:12.03 | EdePopede | maybe one of them is down |
| 22:12.09 | tomreyn | security.debian.org resolves to 12 ipv5/6 addresses |
| 22:12.19 | tomreyn | *ipv4/6 :) |
| 22:13.03 | sney | if you want to use a mirror that is *a* mirror instead of a cdn, try ftp.(country code).debian.org, or see the 'secondary' entries at https://www.debian.org/mirror/list |
| 22:15.05 | tomreyn | seanthegeek is ignoring us anyway, though. |
| 22:15.38 | unixbsd | how to send to 30 persons with thunderbird an email? We need to add it one after one into the 30 fields: TO ??? |
| 22:16.05 | *** join/#debian format_c (~format_c@unaffiliated/format-c/x-8927423) |
| 22:18.33 | tomreyn | unixbsd: copy addresses to clipboard, separated by '; ', write new e-mail in thunderbird, paste into 'to' field, press enter. |
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| 22:18.52 | sney | (or bcc field so they can't all reply to all and cause a mess) |
| 22:19.10 | tomreyn | yes that'd be much better indeed |
| 22:19.30 | ratrace | unixbsd: are you sure you want to do that? that would be terrible. use BCC instead |
| 22:19.54 | dvs | or you can create a group if you are going to use the list more than once. |
| 22:19.55 | tomreyn | and no need for the blank space in '; ', just ';' is suffient as a field seperator. |
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| 22:20.12 | ratrace | had to termporarily block clients email accounts because the jokers would put hundreds of addresses into a single TO field ..... |
| 22:20.49 | ratrace | (during xmass, because all the greetings and nonsense) |
| 22:23.07 | EdePopede | no way to do such a thing with some addon at least? thunderbird is gui, so it should be normal workflow to open a dialog with a list and just click the names |
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| 22:25.29 | frazzydee | ddsys: I got it working! I followed the instructions from https://wiki.debian.org/GrubEFIReinstall#Using_the_rEFInd_rescue_media Thank you again for your help :) |
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| 22:27.16 | dvs | booting from EFI? |
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| 22:29.02 | ddsys | frazzydee: cool. i wish i was able to help better though |
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| 22:30.29 | ddsys | so it seems grub didnt install properly during install |
| 22:30.41 | frazzydee | you helped fine :) |
| 22:31.14 | frazzydee | I guess not. I really don't know why. |
| 22:31.55 | ddsys | yeah it should have |
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| 22:33.08 | sney | I've seen the grub step fail on install a few times over the years, though it usually has the courtesy to display a big error message about it. maybe it was accidentally installed to the wrong volume. |
| 22:33.54 | dvs | maybe the MBR version was installed instead of EFI? |
| 22:34.37 | ddsys | he installed to the EFI partition |
| 22:35.06 | dvs | but did he use the EFI install option? |
| 22:35.21 | ddsys | hmm |
| 22:35.25 | ddsys | not sure |
| 22:35.31 | frazzydee | dvs: I remember checking for that, and thought it was the EFI version. Where would that option be? |
| 22:36.01 | dvs | frazzydee: right at the beginning with the menu that selects the different install opptions |
| 22:37.52 | frazzydee | dvs: where? https://debian-handbook.info/browse/stable/sect.installation-steps.html |
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| 22:39.58 | dvs | frazzydee: the first picture on that web page. That one says "BIOS mode" which is not EFI. |
| 22:40.49 | frazzydee | ah, I don't remember unfortunately |
| 22:41.10 | frazzydee | Let me recreate my boot media and see what comes up./ |
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| 22:44.16 | ddsys | frazzydee: is dual-booting windows. It already had an EFI partition. doesnt an EFI partion mean its in uefi mode and the installer should pick up on that? |
| 22:44.59 | ddsys | dvs ^ ? |
| 22:45.12 | sponix | ddsys: only if it is continued to be booted that way. If you are EFI in Windows, and don't choose EFI boot in Linux, it will just do Legacy and not see the Windows (and Grub will not either) |
| 22:45.46 | ddsys | ok |
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| 22:46.14 | dvs | ddsys: No, it depends on how the USB installer was booted. On my machine if I have an install ISO, I have two boot options for it: one with just the name and another with "UEFI:" in front of the name. |
| 22:46.18 | sponix | These messes are hard to straighten out |
| 22:47.09 | frazzydee | I recreated the install media and booted with it. it shows "UEFI installer menu" |
| 22:47.47 | ddsys | dvs: i could swear my installer usb only shows uefi if my disk is gpt |
| 22:48.00 | ddsys | no choice for me |
| 22:48.07 | frazzydee | I think I checked to make sure it was in UEFI mode and not BIOS mode previously. I've been trying to get this working for a few days and have been on this channel before, someone else asked me to check that |
| 22:48.19 | frazzydee | Yes, there isn't a choice of BIOS or UEFI mode for me either |
| 22:48.37 | frazzydee | Anyways I'm glad it works now, and if someone else has the same issue they can try refind also |
| 22:49.03 | sponix | frazzydee: you got it working ? |
| 22:49.22 | frazzydee | sponix: Yes! You were the someone else haha ;) |
| 22:49.25 | dvs | ddsys: it totally depends on how you boot the USB installer. It will show either BIOS or UEFI, but not both. |
| 22:49.36 | sponix | frazzydee: I have memory loss :( |
| 22:49.40 | ddsys | right |
| 22:49.49 | sponix | Glad if I helped though |
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| 22:53.28 | frazzydee | Thank you :) |
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| 23:06.28 | sponix | is there an easily established method to backport from "experimental".. Or do I need to give it a bit until it makes it into Sid ? |
| 23:06.46 | sponix | I'd like to run kernel 5.10 with zfs, and Nvidia 450 if possible |
| 23:07.19 | sney | experimental packages will generally install on sid or testing, provided they aren't completely broken |
| 23:07.31 | sney | (there is no guarantee of any quality wrt experimental) |
| 23:07.34 | dvs | !v linux-kernel-amd64 |
| 23:07.41 | dvs | ,v linux-kernel-amd64 |
| 23:07.42 | judd | No package named 'linux-kernel-amd64' was found in amd64. |
| 23:08.00 | sponix | dvs: I know 5.9 is the latest in backports for buster |
| 23:08.00 | dvs | ,v linux-image-amd64 |
| 23:08.01 | judd | Package: linux-image-amd64 on amd64 -- jessie: 3.16+63+deb8u2; jessie-security: 3.16+63+deb8u7; stretch-security: 4.9+80+deb9u6; stretch: 4.9+80+deb9u11; stretch-backports: 4.19+105+deb10u4~bpo9+1; buster-security: 4.19+105+deb10u7; buster: 4.19+105+deb10u8; buster-backports: 5.9.6-1~bpo10+1; bullseye: 5.10.4-1; sid: 5.10.5-1 |
| 23:08.01 | *** mode/#debian [+l 1209] by debhelper |
| 23:08.11 | sney | there are some patches for zfs to compile on 5.10 but you should know that openzfs does not consider it supported at all, yet |
| 23:08.24 | sney | this includes 2.0.0 |
| 23:08.36 | sney | and finally, |
| 23:08.39 | sney | !debian-next |
| 23:08.39 | dpkg | #debian-next is the channel for testing/unstable support on the OFTC network (irc.oftc.net), *not* on freenode. If you get "Cannot join #debian-next (Channel is invite only)." it means you did not read it's on irc.oftc.net. See also https://wiki.debian.org/IRC and https://wiki.debian.org/GettingHelpOnIrc |
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| 23:08.52 | sponix | odd zfsonlinux.org list 2.0.1 as being 5.10 compatible on the website |
| 23:09.08 | sney | 2.0.1, yes, which is not in debian yet |
| 23:09.25 | sponix | ,v zfs-dkms |
| 23:09.26 | judd | Package: zfs-dkms on amd64 -- stretch/contrib: 0.6.5.9-5; stretch-backports/contrib: 0.7.12-2+deb10u1~bpo9+1; buster/contrib: 0.7.12-2+deb10u2; stretch-backports-sloppy/contrib: 0.7.13-1~bpo9+1; buster-backports/contrib: 0.8.6-1~bpo10+1; bullseye/contrib: 0.8.6-1; sid/contrib: 0.8.6-1; experimental/contrib: 2.0.1-1~exp1 |
| 23:09.34 | sponix | experimental/contrib |
| 23:09.42 | sney | ah, neat. the bug thread I read yesterday didn't mention this |
| 23:09.47 | sponix | I'm looking to backport from there, if that is possible |
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| 23:11.17 | sponix | I should probably just wait for zfs, nvidia, and kernel backports all to support 5.10 before I make the jump. Got a bit excited and went to early :) |
| 23:11.20 | sponix | !sns |
| 23:11.21 | dpkg | Shiny New Shit Syndrome is a serious disorder, which usually breaks out into an epidemic every time something new is released. If you have SNS, ask me about <backports> and <ssb>; these are better options than upgrading to <testing> because it is a <moving target>. |
| 23:11.26 | sney | backporting from experimental to stable is basically the same procedure as backporting from sid to stable. (again with the caveat that there is no guarantee of any quality in experimental.) OR you could use bullseye and just install the packages. |
| 23:14.29 | sney | uses bullseye, with zfs and nvidia, and is still on 5.9 for the moment |
| 23:17.07 | sponix | I'm perfectly fine on 5.4 and will just stay there for a while longer while things catch up :) |
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| 23:17.36 | sponix | Just started acting like I was running Arch/Manjaro - And that isn't the way Debian works |
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| 23:19.56 | ratrace | wait, bullseye got 5.10 kernel? so it broke zfs? |
| 23:20.07 | CommunistWolf | that'd be funny |
| 23:20.17 | ratrace | but it looks like it |
| 23:20.22 | ratrace | ,v linux-image-amd64 |
| 23:20.23 | judd | Package: linux-image-amd64 on amd64 -- jessie: 3.16+63+deb8u2; jessie-security: 3.16+63+deb8u7; stretch-security: 4.9+80+deb9u6; stretch: 4.9+80+deb9u11; stretch-backports: 4.19+105+deb10u4~bpo9+1; buster-security: 4.19+105+deb10u7; buster: 4.19+105+deb10u8; buster-backports: 5.9.6-1~bpo10+1; bullseye: 5.10.4-1; sid: 5.10.5-1 |
| 23:20.25 | ratrace | ,v zfs-dkms |
| 23:20.26 | judd | Package: zfs-dkms on amd64 -- stretch/contrib: 0.6.5.9-5; stretch-backports/contrib: 0.7.12-2+deb10u1~bpo9+1; buster/contrib: 0.7.12-2+deb10u2; stretch-backports-sloppy/contrib: 0.7.13-1~bpo9+1; buster-backports/contrib: 0.8.6-1~bpo10+1; bullseye/contrib: 0.8.6-1; sid/contrib: 0.8.6-1; experimental/contrib: 2.0.1-1~exp1 |
| 23:20.34 | CommunistWolf | yes, now I think about it I did get a 5.10 kernel on my pinephone |
| 23:20.34 | ratrace | there, broken |
| 23:20.52 | ratrace | zfs 0.8.6 doens't work with 5.10 kernel |
| 23:21.01 | CommunistWolf | ah well |
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| 23:22.12 | sponix | not a huge deal for me |
| 23:22.21 | sponix | I just sometimes get the SNS :) |
| 23:22.38 | dvs | cures sponix |
| 23:22.54 | ratrace | hmm look at this... it even says that 5.10 is blocked because it breaks, among other things, zfs ... https://tracker.debian.org/pkg/linux-signed-amd64 |
| 23:22.59 | sney | out-of-tree module breakage is a pretty normal thing to deal with on testing anyway. this is why we have apt-listchanges and apt-listbugs and the ability to pay attention |
| 23:23.00 | ratrace | so how did bullseye get 5.10 then. |
| 23:23.47 | ratrace | sney: bah |
| 23:23.54 | sney | probably the same way it did when 5.9 broke nvidia and virtualbox |
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| 23:25.39 | \\Mr_C\\ | i keep getting an error with a clean install of debian -bash: mkdiskimage: command not found |
| 23:25.42 | ratrace | I used to have the bpo'd kernel on stable until recently, but I've switched to tracking kernel.org's 4.19 instead as 5.9 EOL'd. 5.10 has a nasty btrfs regression. |
| 23:25.47 | \\Mr_C\\ | i installed the latest syslinux |
| 23:25.52 | \\Mr_C\\ | any ideas? |
| 23:25.53 | sney | ,file mkdiskimage |
| 23:25.58 | judd | Search for mkdiskimage in buster/amd64: syslinux-utils: usr/bin/mkdiskimage |
| 23:26.20 | sney | either you don't have that specific package installed, or your PATH is messed up |
| 23:26.24 | sponix | ... look what I got started P |
| 23:28.04 | \\Mr_C\\ | its not there |
| 23:28.14 | ratrace | sponix: will teach you to ask questions on irc! :) |
| 23:28.47 | ratrace | \\Mr_C\\: $1M question ... is this debian :) |
| 23:29.05 | \\Mr_C\\ | yes 10.7 or something |
| 23:29.53 | ratrace | \\Mr_C\\: and dpkg -L syslinux-utils shows /usr/bin/mkdiskimage ? |
| 23:30.20 | sney | syslinux-utils is a different package from syslinux, and the latter does not depend on the former |
| 23:30.32 | \\Mr_C\\ | oh |
| 23:30.47 | ratrace | oh look at that, good catch sney |
| 23:31.17 | \\Mr_C\\ | thank you , it works now |
| 23:32.10 | sponix | ratrace: Yeah -- Never AGAIN |
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| 23:46.23 | mehwork | why is bash installed in both /bin/bash and /usr/bin/bash? (not symlinked)? |
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| 23:46.44 | mehwork | oh wait same inode |
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| 23:52.09 | themill | mehwork: sounds like you have /bin symlinked to /usr/bin |
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