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| 00:49.55 | imMute | !frankendebian |
| 00:49.55 | dpkg | When you get random packages from random repositories, mix multiple releases of Debian, or mix Debian and derived distributions, you have a mess. There's no way anyone can support this "distribution of Frankenstein" and #debian certainly doesn't want to even try. Ask me about <reinstall> |
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| 02:38.17 | WillPittenger | I just tried to boot https://cdimage.debian.org/debian-cd/current/amd64/iso-dvd/debian-10.6.0-amd64-DVD-1.iso on a vBox machine as virtual DVD. It then can't find the disk. See this error. |
| 02:38.39 | WillPittenger | uploaded an image: VirtualBox_Debian_04_11_2020_20_35_04.png (22KiB) < https://matrix.org/_matrix/media/r0/download/matrix.org/EHlgmzXYAGfRMUseWJFNObMI/VirtualBox_Debian_04_11_2020_20_35_04.png > |
| 02:39.44 | WillPittenger | Any ideas? It shouldn't have troubles with a virtual disk unless the file was corrupt. I'm using vBox 6.1.16 r140961. |
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| 02:40.49 | WillPittenger | I also posted that in #vbox. |
| 02:40.50 | addedman8 | hi |
| 02:41.00 | addedman8 | is collab.debian.net archived anywhere? |
| 02:41.04 | addedman8 | wayback machine doesnt work with it |
| 02:41.12 | addedman8 | i am looking for old artwork |
| 02:41.15 | addedman8 | that is debian related |
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| 02:44.10 | zerocool | .wib |
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| 02:54.21 | addedman8 | well where should i ask |
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| 03:02.22 | alex11 | addedman8, here's fine, but i know nothing about collab.debian.net |
| 03:03.00 | alex11 | i think .net is things splintered off the debian community by individual devs so maybe ask #debian-devel or #alioth both on OFTC |
| 03:03.49 | addedman8 | okay |
| 03:04.13 | addedman8 | thanks ill check it out |
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| 03:07.55 | WillPittenger | Seems I had a corrupt download. Redownloaed it worked. |
| 03:11.11 | addedman8 | well |
| 03:11.23 | addedman8 | guess collabn was killed off in favour of some burgerkin outreach program |
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| 03:11.49 | WillPittenger | Nope. Still didn't get a valid copy. |
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| 03:31.03 | WillPittenger | Maybe since BluRay writers are common, you should offer a BluRay image that has everything. |
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| 04:07.22 | unixbsd | Hello, an xdg link over http, what is it actually? can it launched with browser. |
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| 04:18.16 | Aurora_v_kosmose | https://www.debian.org/distrib/netinst I don't suppose there is some way to get a signature for the "tiny armhf" images? |
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| 04:21.34 | themill | sure, signatures are in the same directory on the cd mirror |
| 04:21.58 | Aurora_v_kosmose | For the ISOs, yeah, I meant for these: http://ftp.nl.debian.org/debian/dists/buster/main/installer-armhf/current/images/ |
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| 04:36.29 | themill | Aurora_v_kosmose: I *think* your trust path is back to the Release file for the distribution http://ftp.nl.debian.org/debian/dists/buster/InRelease (but this is not something I've done for ages) |
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| 04:44.33 | themill | Aurora_v_kosmose: indeed... http://ftp.nl.debian.org/debian/dists/buster/InRelease contains an entry for main/installer-armhf/current/images/SHA256SUMS |
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| 04:49.23 | kingsley | Is there a package that vets hardware peripherals, like video cards, for insecurities, without needing to know their firmware, but rather by treating them as so called "black boxes" and just checks for safe responses to various, possibly randomized and/or fuzzed, inputs? |
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| 04:49.50 | kingsley | It seems to me that with the rise of built in controllers and the internet of things, being able to test if new peripherals are safe or not would be cool. |
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| 04:50.43 | Aurora_v_kosmose | themill: Oh wow. Good find. |
| 04:51.14 | Aurora_v_kosmose | Thanks for that. |
| 04:56.34 | themill | np |
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| 05:00.54 | Aurora_v_kosmose | Yeah, full chain from there. Thanks a lot. |
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| 06:13.43 | StarOnD | hello, I wish to remove a user's write permission from his home directory. Can I do that ? Looks like it won't let me login as that user if I do that |
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| 06:25.12 | WillPittenger | http://mirrors.bloomu.edu/debian-cd/10.6.0/amd64/iso-dvd/debian-10.6.0-amd64-DVD-2.iso fails the SHA1 checksum. I tried several mirrors. |
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| 06:38.52 | cluelessperson | Warning: apt-key output should not be parsed (stdout is not a terminal) |
| 06:39.01 | cluelessperson | how do I handle this warning? nothing's working |
| 06:39.27 | Lope | Is this official? https://flathub.org/apps/details/com.obsproject.Studio it's not linked from the official site: https://obsproject.com/download |
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| 06:52.33 | themill | cluelessperson: what are you trying to do? what particular nothing is not working? |
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| 06:57.42 | cluelessperson | APT_KEY_DONT_WARN_ON_DANGEROUS_USAGE=DontWarn |
| 06:57.50 | cluelessperson | curl -s https://bazel.build/bazel-release.pub.gpg | apt-key add - |
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| 06:59.12 | themill | Note that apt-key is deprecated and you should just copy to /etc/apt/trusted.gpg.d/ ... assuming you trust the key |
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| 07:13.44 | themill | WillPittenger: looks fine here. Is the file the right size (what filesystem are you working on) |
| 07:14.17 | WillPittenger | I'm downloading with DownloadStudio on Windows 10 64-bit. |
| 07:14.49 | WillPittenger | MD5SUMS passed the same file. |
| 07:15.44 | themill | What size file have you downloaded? |
| 07:16.20 | themill | (exact size in bytes) |
| 07:16.25 | WillPittenger | 4,686,921,728 bytes |
| 07:16.58 | themill | that's a good start -- it means it's not just a > 4GB file size problem |
| 07:17.12 | themill | http://paste.debian.net/1170015/ |
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| 07:18.01 | WillPittenger | It was DownloadStudio running both tests. |
| 07:18.17 | themill | oh, it's calculating the hash too? |
| 07:18.27 | themill | does it tell you the hash it calculates? |
| 07:18.33 | WillPittenger | Or calling something. |
| 07:19.05 | themill | (unrelated to your actual problem, but there is probably no need to actually have DVD-2) |
| 07:19.34 | WillPittenger | Well, I downloaded it just in case. |
| 07:20.12 | WillPittenger | I don't see any evidence it tells you that. Just it failed and which test failed. |
| 07:21.34 | WillPittenger | Though when it failed, I either deleted the download or restarted it. |
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| 07:26.06 | WillPittenger | As I thought, the log that's left after that is very brief. |
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| 07:52.28 | WillPittenger | themill: Just finished another attempt at it. I get back "X 11-5-2020 1:45:28 amSHA1 Check failed [SHA1=1EDC3E1C5DDDE0F72619A98B5224CD4C3D88053F]" |
| 07:52.49 | WillPittenger | http://mirrors.bloomu.edu/debian-cd/10.6.0/amd64/iso-dvd/debian-10.6.0-amd64-DVD-2.iso was what I downloaded. |
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| 07:54.05 | themill | That is the wrong hash, but if you've tried multiple mirrors then it sounds like the downloader is at fault |
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| 11:46.02 | Akuw | i am trying to change filesystem type using fdisk in a USB stick but FAT32 or FAT16 are not there when i list types using "L" |
| 11:47.33 | Akuw | https://paste.debian.net/1170031/ |
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| 11:55.23 | ratrace | Akuw: are you talking about partition type identifiers, not filesystem? |
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| 12:43.12 | ychaouche | hello #debian |
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| 12:43.28 | ychaouche | What's the proper way to customize the dynamic part of motd ? |
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| 12:43.47 | ychaouche | Should I manually change /etc/init.d/motd ? |
| 12:44.16 | ychaouche | which could cause conflict if package has to be updated, maybe ? |
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| 12:46.51 | ratrace | ychaouche: what package does that? |
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| 12:47.09 | ychaouche | ratrace, I mean the motd package |
| 12:47.22 | ychaouche | if motd gets updated maybe /etc/init.d/motd gets overwritten |
| 12:47.29 | ychaouche | I guess ? |
| 12:47.34 | Akuw | i need a tool to create linux booteable usb from debian |
| 12:47.36 | ratrace | ,motd |
| 12:47.45 | ratrace | ,v motd |
| 12:47.46 | judd | No package named 'motd' was found in amd64. |
| 12:47.48 | ratrace | what package is that, again? |
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| 12:47.57 | ychaouche | apparently motd has changed since debian 7 ^^' |
| 12:47.57 | tachikomas | motd is a part of ssh server. |
| 12:47.59 | tachikomas | i guess. |
| 12:48.24 | ratrace | you guess wrong |
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| 12:48.36 | ratrace | dynamic motd is an Ubuntu invention, so I'm really curious here what package is that in Debian |
| 12:48.44 | ychaouche | thinks there should be a bot to also do apt-file searches |
| 12:49.17 | ratrace | there is |
| 12:49.20 | ratrace | ,file /etc/motd |
| 12:49.25 | judd | No packages in buster/amd64 were found with that file. |
| 12:49.31 | ychaouche | oh, nice :) |
| 12:49.52 | ratrace | so you're really running ubuntu, aren't you? |
| 12:50.07 | ychaouche | Description: Debian GNU/Linux 7.9 (wheezy) |
| 12:50.21 | ychaouche | On Debian GNU/Linux, the content of /run/motd.dynamic is also disâ |
| 12:50.22 | ychaouche | <PROTECTED> |
| 12:50.34 | ychaouche | from man motd |
| 12:50.47 | ratrace | ,file /etc/init.d/motd |
| 12:50.52 | judd | No packages in buster/amd64 were found with that file. |
| 12:51.09 | ychaouche | well, debian 7 so I guess things have changed since. |
| 12:52.06 | ychaouche | Akuw, use dd |
| 12:52.34 | Akuw | i used "sudo dd bs=4M if=/home/kenny/Desktop/ISOs/debian-10.6.0-i386-netinst.iso of=/dev/sdc status=progress oflag=sync" |
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| 12:52.40 | ratrace | I doubt that ever existed in Wheezy |
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| 12:53.09 | Akuw | done |
| 12:53.41 | Akuw | thkz |
| 12:53.50 | ychaouche | Good :) or you can download a 100Mb javascript electron based app to do the same, only slower and worst. |
| 12:54.04 | ychaouche | worse* |
| 12:54.39 | ychaouche | ok, this will either go to debian forums or linuxquestions |
| 12:55.05 | ychaouche | ratrace, see also : https://wiki.debian.org/motd |
| 12:57.34 | ratrace | so that's pam_motd obtained from ubuntu and according to that wiki, availalbe from jessie? you still need the whole update shebang mechanism which afaik isn't packaged in debian. that's why I was curious to know what package is doing that. |
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| 12:57.41 | Akuw | i got some problem when start installing debian in Lenovo Ideapad3 https://www.picpasteplus.com/v.php?i=8c9010116c |
| 12:58.37 | ratrace | ychaouche: you even sure you have pam_motd in wheezy? |
| 12:58.52 | ychaouche | Akuw, can you paste on a non-trolling website ? |
| 12:59.04 | ychaouche | Akuw, also, is that a display problem ? |
| 12:59.08 | Akuw | give me the address |
| 12:59.11 | ratrace | Akuw: yeah, an imgur link would be better |
| 12:59.30 | ychaouche | Akuw, gist is fine I guess, or dpaste ? |
| 12:59.31 | Akuw | ychaouche: no, the laptop is working fine |
| 13:00.32 | ychaouche | ratrace, this is from /etc/pam.d/login : session optional pam_motd.so motd=/run/motd.dynamic |
| 13:01.48 | ratrace | ychaouche: in wheezy?! |
| 13:02.07 | ychaouche | well, what's wrong with that ? |
| 13:04.30 | ratrace | still wondering what was packaging /etc/init.d/motd . and how come you're still using wheezy. that's like, not even LTS supported any more |
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| 13:05.14 | Akuw | i test the usb stick in another laptop and is working ok |
| 13:05.33 | Akuw | so the problme could be related to video driver ? |
| 13:06.06 | ratrace | at any rate, there's no such service in debian stable, and if you have that pam module then it doesn't matter how you construct /run/motd. Ubuntu has a package that does it, so take a peek how they do it, copy to your machine |
| 13:06.27 | Akuw | i can see grub menu, but when press enter to start the next screens appear like that |
| 13:06.29 | ratrace | Akuw: what problem tho? that pic is inaccessible to me |
| 13:06.35 | Akuw | wait |
| 13:07.39 | Akuw | https://imgur.com/a/KBVig50 |
| 13:09.48 | ratrace | Akuw: yeah, something-something gpu. |
| 13:10.46 | Akuw | retrace: hi man, how are you |
| 13:10.54 | Akuw | retrace: what can i do |
| 13:12.18 | Akuw | recumode show same |
| 13:12.24 | ratrace | who is retrace? anyway, you can try adding nomodeset to your kernel command line via grub, see if that helps |
| 13:12.26 | Akuw | rescue mode |
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| 13:13.18 | fireba11 | re-trace? :-D |
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| 13:16.47 | ychaouche | ratrace, according to apt-file, it's initscripts's fault |
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| 13:18.32 | ychaouche | Akuw, nvidia ? |
| 13:18.41 | mindlessmiss | try to update now i get errors in synaptic or apt-get update |
| 13:18.43 | mindlessmiss | W: An error occurred during the signature verification. The repository is not updated and the previous index files will be used. GPG error: http://repository.spotify.com stable InRelease: The following signatures couldn't be verified because the public key is not available: NO_PUBKEY D1742AD60D811D58 |
| 13:18.43 | mindlessmiss | E: The repository 'http://deb.debian.org/debian buster/updates Release' does not have a Release file. |
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| 13:19.38 | ratrace | ychaouche: wheezy is long dead so if you want support you better upgrade to a supported debian version. |
| 13:20.20 | Akuw | radeon |
| 13:20.42 | ratrace | Akuw: so, did nomodeset help? |
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| 13:23.55 | Akuw | solved |
| 13:24.08 | Akuw | i select special parameter to start |
| 13:25.00 | ratrace | what special parameter |
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| 13:27.20 | Akuw | Help -> F6 - -> install vga=771 noapic nolapic |
| 13:27.44 | ratrace | nice. |
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| 13:51.07 | ychaouche | on debian 10, it is even less clear what's responsible of generating the /var/run/motd.dynamic file |
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| 13:51.22 | ychaouche | man page only says pamd displays it, not generate it |
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| 13:54.31 | ychaouche | I ended up changing /etc/init.d/motd and putting run-parts /etc/update-mot.d/ > /var/run/motd.dynamic inside it's start function. |
| 13:54.37 | ychaouche | Which seems to have worked |
| 13:54.46 | ychaouche | I'll leave it like this for the moment. |
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| 14:05.05 | ratrace | <PROTECTED> |
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| 14:21.22 | ratrace | !cve lookup CVE-2020-27347 |
| 14:21.22 | dpkg | Information about the security advisory CVE-2020-27347 may be found at https://security-tracker.debian.org/tracker/CVE-2020-27347 |
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| 14:22.31 | halabund | How can I update all packages (apt update && apt upgrade) *except* one? This is actually a Raspberry Pi question, but my understanding is that "Raspbian" is effectively identical to Debian, therefore the answer should be the same. |
| 14:23.11 | nkuttler | !raspbian |
| 14:23.12 | dpkg | Raspberry Pi OS (previously called Raspbian) is a distribution <based on Debian> made specifically for the <Raspberry Pi>. Raspbian is not Debian and it is not supported in #debian. Please use #raspbian (or #raspberrypi) on irc.freenode.net for support. https://www.raspbian.org/ |
| 14:25.21 | halabund | nkuttler: Do you mean that "apt-get" on one is not the same on the other one? |
| 14:25.52 | nkuttler | halabund: how would we know? |
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| 14:26.16 | halabund | OK, how would I do this on Debian then? |
| 14:27.22 | nkuttler | why don't you just ask in the correct channel? |
| 14:27.34 | ratrace | on debian you could apt-mark hold certain packages |
| 14:28.21 | ratrace | it's very likely unwise to do so, though. |
| 14:28.52 | halabund | ratrace: Thanks! |
| 14:29.15 | halabund | nkuttler: Because I want to know the answer for Debian. |
| 14:29.30 | halabund | Which I also deal with, not on a Raspberry Pi. |
| 14:30.18 | ratrace | nkuttler is right tho, this answer is valid for Debian. no idea what or how raspbian does package management |
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| 14:30.59 | halabund | Yes, I understand. The only way I can find out if it's different is if I _also_ get the answer for Debian. Thanks for providing it. |
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| 14:42.45 | Streusel | Is extending an existing disk (I had sda & now newly sdb) as simple as fdisk /dev/sda n + e & defaults, or there more to it? I don't want to create a new partition for the new disk sdb. |
| 14:43.41 | hop | Streusel: sorry, can you rephrase that? |
| 14:43.52 | hop | Streusel: what do you mean by "extending"? |
| 14:44.48 | Streusel | :thinking: I have a 40gb (mounted) disk that is /sda and a new 100gb /sdb (unmounted) disk |
| 14:45.13 | Streusel | So I want to 'extend' the size of the 40gb by the new 100gb that I have available through the unmounted sdb disk |
| 14:45.15 | hop | you don't have a mounted disk, you have a mounted partition |
| 14:45.28 | hop | or maybe logical volume |
| 14:45.34 | Streusel | probably the latter |
| 14:45.44 | hop | that would be important info |
| 14:46.37 | hop | where do you even _get_ 100gb disks anymore? :-D |
| 14:46.58 | absinthe | hello, when running `update-alternative --config editor` nano gets listed twice (on multiple machines, running buster). why ? |
| 14:47.31 | absinthe | (if someone knows...) |
| 14:47.45 | ratrace | listed once here tho |
| 14:47.53 | Streusel | It's a vps hop >_< |
| 14:48.02 | ndegruchy | I have it listed twice, but one is 'auto' mode |
| 14:48.11 | absinthe | ndegruchy: yes, same |
| 14:48.20 | Streusel | I just went and added the 100 since it was an option and not overly expensive |
| 14:48.23 | absinthe | sorry, perhaps i should have told it before |
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| 14:48.50 | Streusel | and it's a test for me to get used to adding new things, in this case tho I already populated sda with too much stuff to 'just' play with it and fuck up. |
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| 14:49.05 | kgfgdf | something strange happened with my apt/dpkg |
| 14:49.08 | ndegruchy | absinthe: might just be a fallback listing (hence: auto) |
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| 14:49.45 | kgfgdf | it became very very slow and I have a feeling that some packages I install are not actually installed |
| 14:50.03 | kgfgdf | is there some corrupt database to be rebuilt? |
| 14:50.19 | absinthe | ndegruchy: might make sense |
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| 14:50.34 | ratrace | kgfgdf: who knows. you'll have to back the symptoms you're seeing with some logs or tangible metrics |
| 14:50.36 | absinthe | ratrace: sorry, but which editer is set as default ? |
| 14:50.55 | ratrace | absinthe: I think nano is by default. I've got vim tho |
| 14:51.07 | absinthe | mh okay. |
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| 14:52.03 | absinthe | (ty) |
| 14:52.04 | hop | Streusel: next time, please describe the actual situation instead of some imagined scenario |
| 14:52.26 | Piraty | i found that debian's docker images >10 (i.e. testing and unstable) don't define VERSION_ID="10" in /etc/os-release, which is set in debian 10 and below. |
| 14:52.34 | Streusel | It is an actual situation though :\ |
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| 14:53.03 | Streusel | My /sda 40gb is at 35gb, and I need the additional space of the /sdb which is new. |
| 14:53.18 | ratrace | Streusel: no LVM? |
| 14:53.52 | hop | who knows what "vps" means for sd?⦠there's not even a real "disk" involved |
| 14:54.08 | Streusel | Never used one, and the instructions that came with it were 'use mkdir -p /mnt/vdb and go from there' |
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| 14:54.24 | ratrace | doesn't matter for the kernel though |
| 14:54.44 | ratrace | you can't "extend" one disk with another, virtual or otherwise, without something like LVM under your filesystems |
| 14:55.21 | ratrace | you _can_ enlarge the virtual disk, then enlarge the (last) partition on it, then enlarge the filesystem on that partition |
| 14:55.24 | Streusel | Ok, that's good to know. So I can just create a new partition and make it ext4. |
| 14:55.28 | hop | like, for example, a "extend my drive space" button in the control panel, for all we know⦠|
| 14:55.58 | ratrace | Streusel: again, if that's virtual disks, you can enlarge the existing disk image |
| 14:55.59 | Streusel | There's no such control panel. |
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| 14:56.12 | hop | my point is that we don't know what _is_ there |
| 14:56.20 | Streusel | Righto, ugh :| |
| 14:56.35 | ratrace | that's irrelevant as the options in the guest are very much limited |
| 14:56.52 | hop | uh? |
| 14:57.34 | ratrace | it doesn't matter what actually provides the /dev/sda and /dev/sdb. how to enlarge _filesystem_ available space is agnostic to that |
| 14:57.54 | hop | they weren't even talking about /dev/sda, strictly speaking |
| 14:58.04 | ratrace | if you had LVM, you could add another (virtual) disk as a new PV in linear expansion |
| 14:58.32 | hop | if you had wheels you were a bus |
| 14:58.36 | ratrace | if you don't, then you could (now this part depends on how exactly are virtual disks created) enalrge the virtual disk image, then enlarge the (last) partition on it, then enlarge the filesystem on that partition |
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| 14:59.06 | jelly | ratrace: I've done LVM-ization of existing VMs, it's fun... FSVO fun |
| 14:59.24 | Streusel | It was bike, not bus! |
| 14:59.27 | jelly | also, it's worth it for future management |
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| 15:00.01 | ratrace | and also, I'm referring to this crucial problem description: "15:53 < Streusel> My /sda 40gb is at 35gb, and I need the additional space of the /sdb which is new." |
| 15:00.11 | jelly | each time I find a VM done with VMware P2V tool (which replicates disks and partitions exactly) I gnash my teeth |
| 15:00.38 | jelly | Streusel: care to pastebin the outpot of "lsblk" and "df" |
| 15:00.45 | ratrace | and for THAT problem descrption what I said stands. it's irelevant what provides sda and sdb. the linux kernel in the guest can't automagically concat sdb onto sda and provide 100GB+ more, without something like LVM |
| 15:00.54 | hop | the solved their problem. give it a rest |
| 15:00.59 | hop | *they |
| 15:01.11 | ratrace | it's also very common to just enlarge the disk image on the host side, most if not all hypervisors would allow that |
| 15:01.22 | ratrace | Solved how? |
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| 15:01.33 | Streusel | https://upaste.me/072320 |
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| 15:01.36 | jelly | hop: that was not my reading |
| 15:01.42 | ratrace | mine either |
| 15:02.16 | hop | "i just went ahead" seemed final to me |
| 15:02.30 | hop | but, yeah, languageâ¦Â who cares |
| 15:03.18 | hop | Streusel: do you not see a difference between "/sda" and "/dev/sda1"? |
| 15:03.24 | jelly | Streusel: so you got a new 100GB disk. you could leave the 40GB one for the OS, and format this one with lvm going from this point on |
| 15:03.45 | Streusel | yeah one is a part the other a disk |
| 15:03.58 | ratrace | since there's just one partition, why not enlarge the virtual disk image |
| 15:03.59 | hop | no, one is completely wrong, the other describes reality |
| 15:04.07 | jelly | ratrace: there are two disks. |
| 15:04.21 | ratrace | jelly: sdb was added to "solve" the running out of space with sda |
| 15:04.36 | hop | which leads to the question: why?? |
| 15:04.38 | jelly | and it's added now. |
| 15:05.10 | Streusel | hop there was no option to enlarge/extend the primary disk, only add a new one |
| 15:05.10 | hop | Streusel: what are you using the space for? is it all in your home directory, for example? |
| 15:05.18 | ratrace | jelly: we don't know how the virtual disks are managed on the host side. if the user has no option, then yeh, turn sda into sys disk, sdb into lvm for user data |
| 15:05.28 | Streusel | pictures, it's an image server |
| 15:05.31 | ratrace | if the user has option, just enlarge sda's virtual disk image, if possible. |
| 15:05.50 | hop | Streusel: so, most data is in one directory? |
| 15:05.59 | Streusel | exactly all /var/www/ |
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| 15:06.33 | Streusel | and then thousands of subdirectories as it is dynamically generated should new content be added, or removed. |
| 15:06.45 | hop | Streusel: create a partition on sdb, create a logical volume - or not, copy your data, mount the partiton or lv to /var/www |
| 15:06.56 | ratrace | Streusel: so do what jelly suggested, tread sda for system, sdb for your data, but use it as a pv for LVM, to prepare for future such issues |
| 15:07.00 | hop | ask for specifics on any of those steps |
| 15:07.08 | ratrace | *treat |
| 15:07.59 | Streusel | How do I mount the partition to a specific directory? The entire reason I wanted to 'extend'/'enlarge' was because I didn't know how to solve that issue. |
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| 15:09.17 | ratrace | Streusel: mount /path/to/dev/ice /path/to/directory in simplest terms, but you need a filesystem on that dev/ice first |
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| 15:09.33 | Streusel | right |
| 15:09.37 | hanson7754 | C10wn |
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| 15:10.21 | hop | Streusel: manually mount it to /mnt for copying, permanently mount it to /var/www by editing /etc/fstab later |
| 15:10.24 | jelly | Streusel: first you format and mount in a temporary place (using the mount command), then migrate/copy the data, then rename the old original directory, then create a new empty one named the same, edit /etc/fstab to add the new entry for /dev/where/ever/fs on /var/www), umount from temporary place, mount on right place |
| 15:10.28 | Streusel | How do I go about moving them from /var/www which is still on sda1 to /var/www which will then be on sdb? Or should I rename /var/www temporarily and the move the files over? |
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| 15:10.42 | Streusel | ahh ok! that solves my question hop |
| 15:10.43 | jelly | you don't move. You COPY |
| 15:10.49 | ratrace | answers preceded the question. time loops ftw! |
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| 15:11.15 | jelly | until you're 100% sure the original is not needed any more, don't delete anything |
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| 15:11.32 | hop | Streusel: the best way to move the data is `cd /var/www; find . -print0 | cpio -pmV0a /mnt` |
| 15:11.39 | Streusel | Oh yeah, at this point I was even considering download it, except.. it would take half a day to do so. |
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| 15:12.08 | ratrace | find + cpio the "best" way? lolno. just use rsync |
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| 15:12.18 | jelly | hop: does that command take care of sparse files, hard links, acl, xattrs? |
| 15:12.18 | hop | yeah, except no |
| 15:12.26 | ratrace | howdja reckon |
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| 15:12.51 | jelly | rsync has a nice feature in that it's restartable |
| 15:13.13 | ratrace | rsync -aAX and I'd do -x which is probably unnecessary here, -v for mesmerising text scroll |
| 15:13.37 | jelly | (but there's a zillion ways to clone full trees, some better than others) |
| 15:14.01 | jelly | ratrace: you're missing hard links and sparse files. |
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| 15:14.17 | jelly | and -x is always safe |
| 15:14.26 | Freneticks | Hi, is this site is related to debian ? https://haproxy.debian.net |
| 15:14.27 | hop | you are funny |
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| 15:14.44 | ratrace | jelly: it's safe yes, but might miss things. something to be aware of, 'sall |
| 15:14.56 | jelly | Freneticks: debian.net domains are for unofficial projects of debian developers |
| 15:15.25 | Freneticks | jelly: is there a git or something where I can follow project ? |
| 15:16.01 | roycroft | without getting involved in the copy war, i'll mention that it's a good idea to do the copy in a screen, or other detatchable terminal, session |
| 15:16.17 | roycroft | it's nice that rsync has a resume mode, but it shouldn't be necessary |
| 15:16.29 | hop | "resume mode"? |
| 15:16.44 | roycroft | rsync can resume a transfer if it's interrupted |
| 15:16.50 | hop | that is not a mode |
| 15:16.59 | jelly | Freneticks: so it's done by someone or a in Debian team, probably the haproxy team. https://salsa.debian.org/haproxy-team/haproxy |
| 15:17.04 | roycroft | but just make sure that it doesn't get interrupted |
| 15:17.12 | roycroft | that's my only point here |
| 15:17.24 | roycroft | use screen or whatever detachable terminal utility you prefer |
| 15:17.25 | Freneticks | oh yeah probably better to stick to stable or buster-backports |
| 15:17.27 | Deyaa | Does anyone has a copy of maxmimd enterprise?? |
| 15:17.30 | Freneticks | bu ti miss some feature |
| 15:17.31 | roycroft | and if you get disconnected the session does not |
| 15:17.47 | hop | Streusel: can you take the service offline for a comfortable amount of time? |
| 15:18.00 | jelly | Deyaa: don't you need a commercial licence for that these days |
| 15:18.04 | roycroft | a quiescent filesystem is a good idea, yes |
| 15:18.05 | ratrace | Deyaa: a "copy"? |
| 15:18.31 | nkuttler | ah, i see, cross-posting about warez |
| 15:19.35 | jelly | hop: so, does that cpio invocation take care of all the edge cases or not? |
| 15:19.53 | Deyaa | ratrace: yes please |
| 15:20.03 | ratrace | Deyaa: a "copy" of what |
| 15:20.08 | roycroft | if it were me i'd schedule a maintenance window, shut down the web server, then mv /var/www/ var/www.save && mkdir /var/www && mount /dev/mapper/lv--data--var.www /var/www |
| 15:20.11 | roycroft | and then do the copy |
| 15:20.17 | hop | jelly: it's a freakin' collection of images |
| 15:20.18 | Deyaa | jelly: well not of you use it offline |
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| 15:20.23 | hop | jelly: bother somebody else |
| 15:20.40 | ratrace | roycroft: really no need for downtime here |
| 15:20.43 | Deyaa | ratrace: maxmimd geoip2 enterprise |
| 15:21.08 | jelly | hop: I'm not bothering for nothing -- other people read the channel and benefit from best practices |
| 15:21.12 | ratrace | Deyaa: the one we're paying for heftily? |
| 15:21.34 | roycroft | and without really inserting myself deeply in the copy war,r i'll say that cpio can handle those cases, and is my preferred tool |
| 15:21.40 | hop | jelly: in that case. there is no best practice. rsync has its drawbacks as well |
| 15:22.07 | ratrace | pretty sure rsync is the best practice |
| 15:22.17 | roycroft | i'm pretty sure you're wrong, ratrace |
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| 15:22.30 | ratrace | roycroft: about which part? downtime? |
| 15:22.31 | roycroft | i'm pretty sure there is no single "best practice" |
| 15:22.34 | Deyaa | ratrace: ya |
| 15:22.47 | roycroft | i would have no idea about downtime needs |
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| 15:22.51 | roycroft | so i can't comment on that |
| 15:22.52 | ratrace | roycroft: best practice != absolute |
| 15:23.08 | hop | "best practice" is a useless buzzword, anyway |
| 15:23.17 | roycroft | rsync works fine |
| 15:23.23 | roycroft | find | cpio works fine |
| 15:23.24 | ratrace | rsync covers pretty much the vast majority of filesystem situatios. it's its WHOLE job to do that |
| 15:23.48 | roycroft | dump | restore works fine in the right circumstances |
| 15:24.02 | ratrace | does cpio deal with xattrs and acls? srs questions, don't see it mentioned in the manpage |
| 15:24.21 | roycroft | in fact, if there is any "best practice", dump | restore would be a good candidate where it would work |
| 15:24.40 | roycroft | because it deals with the raw filesystem, and is much faster than other tools |
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| 15:24.58 | roycroft | but it would probably not be appropriate in this case |
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| 15:25.57 | jak2000 | hi all anyone here can give me a hand whit this error: https://paste.debian.net/1170055/ |
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| 15:26.34 | roycroft | for anyone who was around yesterday, btw, i have a brief update on the touchscreen issue |
| 15:27.11 | roycroft | what i've found is that the axial direction is reversed as well as the absolute position being way off |
| 15:28.07 | roycroft | and that for whatever reason, the calibration file that i put in /usr/share/X11/xorg.conf.d is being ignored |
| 15:28.09 | Streusel | hop yeah I can take it offline for a while |
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| 15:29.19 | jelly | Streusel: here's the thing. if you use LVM, you can extend the existing filesystem on top of that, if need be, by resizing the disk, or by adding a new disk. |
| 15:29.49 | Streusel | I do need to use LVM, but at the moment, because it's a vps I doubt it's the necessary thing to do. |
| 15:29.49 | jelly | if you don't use LVM but partitions instead, you'll have some extra steps if disks can be resized |
| 15:30.10 | Streusel | If I say.. need to update the thing to a dedi so I can upgrade to a 1tb or 2tb drive, I'll have to redo everything. |
| 15:30.13 | roycroft | i've found lvm to be really solid these days, and i use it on all systems i build |
| 15:30.18 | ratrace | Streusel: one would thinkn that this problem would've taught a lesson and made you pre-empt it in the future by using LVM now |
| 15:30.20 | jelly | if disks can only be added, you won't be able to have a single filesystem spanning more than one disk |
| 15:31.27 | Streusel | That's the thing, at the moment I can only add disk, but in 100-500gb increments, that's not worth it in the long term, I can add 1 more before price to storage becomes a question, might as well then switch to a dedi with similar storage options and go the proper way there. |
| 15:31.56 | jelly | Streusel: if the provider can only add new disks, use lvm right now. |
| 15:32.07 | Streusel | Any good resource on how to make an lvm? so I can read up on it beforehand |
| 15:32.30 | roycroft | which is kind of funny, because i was hired in 2000 as director of data network services at a telco, who operated an isp, and the first thing i did was have all the linux machines rebuilt without lvm, because it was really flaky back then and staff were rebuilding filesystems almost weekly due to corruption |
| 15:32.38 | roycroft | i was sour on lvm for a long, long time after that |
| 15:32.46 | roycroft | but it works brilliantly these days |
| 15:33.23 | jelly | Streusel: pvcreate /dev/sdb; vgcreate vg1 /dev/sdb; lvcreate -L 90G -n www vg1; Now you have a 90GiB /dev/mapper/vg1-www |
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| 15:33.42 | jelly | do NOT partition the disk |
| 15:34.34 | jelly | (why 90G useful and not 100? Because you can play with snapshots and consistent backups if you leave some space) |
| 15:35.52 | jelly | and later, after you free space on /dev/sda1, you might even reduce that filesystem size from a livecd and add more space for LVM to use |
| 15:36.01 | roycroft | a good practice is to only create the logical volume with as much disk as you need including anticipated growth over the next year, with a little bit more, and leave part of storage unallocated |
| 15:36.09 | jelly | yes |
| 15:36.12 | Streusel | sda1 might stay for my sql server |
| 15:36.23 | roycroft | then you can create a new lv if you need to with the reserved space, or extend the existing logical volume |
| 15:36.25 | Streusel | unless I offload that at some point |
| 15:36.47 | roycroft | some filesystems let you shrink them, but some do not |
| 15:37.29 | roycroft | it's easier to be conservative about your sizing and reserve as much unallocated storage as possible, rather than to overallocate and come up short if you need more storage for something else |
| 15:37.57 | roycroft | even those filesystem types that can be shrunk are easier to expand than to shrink |
| 15:38.51 | jelly | ext4 and xfs can be expanded online without reboot |
| 15:39.03 | jelly | ext4 can only be shrunk offline. xfs... can't |
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| 15:41.42 | roycroft | coming from a bsd world, i like xfs a lot |
| 15:42.01 | roycroft | and i don't care that it can't be shrunk |
| 15:42.44 | roycroft | but there are a number of filesystems for linux that work just fine |
| 15:43.56 | hop | Streusel: take it offline, copy the data, check it, delete the old data before mounting the new partition to /var/www, in that case |
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| 15:44.41 | Streusel | take it offline web wise nginx/apache or some other meaning behind it? |
| 15:45.05 | hop | Streusel: yes, like that. just to make sure the data doesn't get modified while you are copying it |
| 15:45.15 | Streusel | Ahh yes |
| 15:45.16 | roycroft | usually just kill the web server |
| 15:45.18 | roycroft | however |
| 15:45.23 | Streusel | Already turned off cronjobs and other things |
| 15:45.26 | roycroft | if you have cron jobs that update the data you need to disable them |
| 15:45.44 | hop | Streusel: i lost track. have you decided on lvm? |
| 15:45.51 | roycroft | if you have ~ websites you have to disable ftp or whatever your users use to update their websites |
| 15:46.33 | Streusel | I have to for the dedicated, which'll likely be in February. hop |
| 15:46.50 | roycroft | renaming your web root up front helps ensure that nothing unanticipated will be able to write to it while you're copying |
| 15:47.42 | hop | Streusel: if i had to learn how to use lvm on top of everything else, i wouldn't bother with it, either. at least not for a couple gig of pure data |
| 15:48.09 | Streusel | roycroft a simple mv /var/www/ to /var/www-saved/ ? for the rename |
| 15:48.09 | hop | Streusel: but play around with on the new machine before going into production |
| 15:48.16 | roycroft | yes |
| 15:48.17 | roycroft | however |
| 15:48.19 | Streusel | Yeah that for sure hop |
| 15:48.40 | Streusel | This taught me a lesson to think ahead :| |
| 15:48.46 | roycroft | if there are any files open in /var/www while you do the move, whatever has them open may still be able to write to them |
| 15:49.03 | Streusel | right, take offline first then move |
| 15:49.05 | hop | that's why i didn't mention that (: false sense of security |
| 15:49.20 | roycroft | if you want to be really safe, and if you can, do the mv, then reboot before you do anything else |
| 15:49.38 | roycroft | that will ensure there are no open files writing to /var/www |
| 15:49.43 | roycroft | er |
| 15:49.50 | roycroft | <PROTECTED> |
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| 15:50.52 | roycroft | that's why you have to send SIGHUP to your web server after you do log rotation - it has all the log files open, and will keep writing to the renamed logs until you reload |
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| 15:57.04 | wrksx | hello there |
| 15:57.49 | Streusel | let's see how long the transfer takes, running 5minutes now. |
| 15:58.14 | hop | o.o? |
| 15:58.20 | wrksx | some time ago I found a way to use a fixed package list based on a date, and that was usable in a apt sourcelist, but I can't find it anymore |
| 15:58.52 | imMute | wrksx: snapshot.debian.org |
| 15:58.56 | wrksx | specially usefull in docker since it alows for replayable builds |
| 15:59.06 | wrksx | imMute oh ty I'll check it out |
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| 16:07.03 | hop | Streusel: still copying? |
| 16:07.12 | Streusel | yep |
| 16:07.35 | hop | Streusel: i'd ask for my money back, except this sounds like the free plan :-D |
| 16:07.55 | Streusel | I mean.. considering roughly 100k folders, and ~500 subfolders in total ea subfolder containing between 5 and 50 files |
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| 16:09.25 | hop | Streusel: directories, not folders |
| 16:09.32 | Streusel | yes |
| 16:09.39 | hop | Streusel: are those 100k all in one directory?? |
| 16:09.55 | hop | like, on one level |
| 16:09.56 | Streusel | all under /var/www/ |
| 16:10.02 | Streusel | yes |
| 16:10.32 | hop | i'm not sure about that nowadays, but that used to be a big problem |
| 16:10.36 | hop | performance-wise |
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| 16:10.59 | Streusel | can't think of a different way of doing it at the moment |
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| 16:12.36 | hop | some kind of hashing scheme, usually |
| 16:13.06 | hop | split it into subdirectories based on the first two letters of the name, for example |
| 16:14.19 | Streusel | 1 -> +100k dir ea dir has the potential for 0 - +1000 subdirs (no dirs after, just images) |
| 16:15.06 | Streusel | I'd draw a picture but I suck at that, and don't have an editor or mouse at hand |
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| 16:16.14 | Streusel | copying done |
| 16:16.31 | imMute | the git object store works like that. seems to work well for very large repos like the linux source tree |
| 16:17.19 | hop | imMute: works like what? |
| 16:18.10 | imMute | file are named by the sha1 digest of the contents. the filesystem is .git/objects/XX/YYYYYYYYYYYY where XX is the first two hex digits of the digest, and YYYY... is the rest. |
| 16:18.23 | hop | imMute: well, i didn't come up with the idea myself⦠|
| 16:18.37 | hop | seems like someone with cs knowledge worked on git >< |
| 16:18.57 | imMute | Torvalds himself did that, but I'm guessing he drew inspiration from somewhere else too |
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| 16:19.27 | hop | ... |
| 16:19.56 | hop | we are so deep in the dark ages, it isn't even funny |
| 16:22.10 | imMute | ??? |
| 16:22.44 | hop | so that i'm not _just_ snarky: it works because sha hashes are evenly distributed. any two-letter combination is equally likely for XX and so the objects themselves are about evenly distributed |
| 16:23.12 | hop | if you were to use dates as names, just for example, this system would not work at all |
| 16:23.12 | imMute | ah, yeah, that's why it works |
| 16:23.34 | imMute | if you used the least significant digits of the decimal unix timestamp, it could work |
| 16:23.35 | hop | if you were to use unix time, for example, you could use the _last_ bits |
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| 16:24.31 | hop | my comment about the dark ages was in regards to this not being alchemy. we _know_ why and how such things work, no need for cargo culting |
| 16:24.33 | jelly | we hash users' home dirs by computing... I think crc16 of the username |
| 16:24.56 | imMute | halabund: aha |
| 16:25.02 | hop | jelly: OO. oh noes! the humanity! crc16 is not cryptographically safe!!!!1eleven |
| 16:25.22 | halabund | ? |
| 16:25.36 | hop | i can't tell you how often i get flac for still using md5 in on project |
| 16:25.38 | hop | *one |
| 16:25.47 | hop | halabund: i think that was meant for me |
| 16:25.52 | jelly | md5sum is nice and even too |
| 16:25.52 | halabund | :-) |
| 16:27.41 | hop | yes, and it's fast. completely demonizing it is just as much cargo culting |
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| 16:31.50 | ratrace | nginx uses last N chars of the URL md5 for caching, for example |
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| 16:32.57 | hop | valid, but it seems an unnecessary step |
| 16:33.07 | hop | also, i /could/ see where this is security relevant |
| 16:33.37 | Streusel | unmounting/remounting was successful! \o/ |
| 16:33.39 | jelly | I usually eyeball first 4 and last 4 hex chars if I'm too lazy to copy/paste in the same terminal |
| 16:33.59 | hop | jelly: shush! |
| 16:34.10 | hop | jelly: we all do it, but if it gets out, we are screwed |
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| 16:34.49 | jelly | very-fast-switching-tmux/screen-to-and-fro is better |
| 16:35.17 | jelly | if you can manage to put the checksum in the exact same place in the terminal |
| 16:35.37 | roycroft | or just do a diff on the outputs if you really want to be lazy but accurate |
| 16:35.44 | hop | Streusel: do you care about file modification/access times at all? |
| 16:35.59 | Streusel | nope |
| 16:36.00 | jelly | roycroft: but then you have to put them on the same system somehow |
| 16:36.18 | hop | Streusel: you could mount it with noatime,nodiratime |
| 16:36.19 | roycroft | ssh can help with that |
| 16:36.45 | jelly | roycroft: well okay. I've done diff -bdu <(ssh server1 cat /etc/some/config) <(ssh server2 cat /the/same/thing) |
| 16:37.41 | jelly | crosses the line of "too silly" for me |
| 16:37.56 | roycroft | i like lazy but accurate |
| 16:38.12 | Streusel | Interesting, didn't know that existed. hop |
| 16:38.28 | roycroft | noatime will improve performance |
| 16:38.50 | Streusel | already added |
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| 16:39.23 | Streusel | going to test out fstab as well to see if it's probably configured, no idea what the last 2 digits are, suggestions were 0 0 |
| 16:39.35 | roycroft | i personally like to preserve as much metadata as possible unless there's a compelling reason not to |
| 16:39.52 | jelly | 0 2 for a non-root filesystem that you'd still like to get checked regularly |
| 16:40.28 | ratrace | no, what nginx does for caching, is convert URL to md5, then that hash becomes the filename, and then if you defined N levels of directories, it uses N last chars to name directory hiearchy. eg if you md5 ends in abcde, then nginx will store it in /path/to/cache/e/d/c/....abcde |
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| 16:40.55 | jelly | I don't remember, does one have to "systemctl daemon-reload" after editing fstab these days |
| 16:41.15 | jelly | because fstab is just a source file for some systemd generator |
| 16:41.16 | hop | auto fsck on boot kicks in when you can't afford it right now. without fail |
| 16:41.21 | imMute | jelly: if you care about the .mount units getting modified, yes. |
| 16:41.22 | ratrace | jelly: nope |
| 16:41.48 | ratrace | daemon-reload retriggers generators? |
| 16:41.52 | imMute | ratrace: yes. |
| 16:42.02 | jelly | ratrace: I've found a situation where _something_ unmounted my fs under my feet without that, but I can't remember the details |
| 16:42.20 | hop | ratrace: i very much understood that. what is the "no" referring to? |
| 16:42.43 | jelly | may have involved changing UUIDs or LABELS on existent fs |
| 16:42.56 | roycroft | or you can do mount -o remount /mount/point |
| 16:43.22 | roycroft | and you can change mount options on the fly |
| 16:43.36 | jelly | so "mount -a" worked, but then something would umount the thing in a couple seconds |
| 16:43.38 | ratrace | imMute: but surely calling daemon reload won't remount things if fstab changed? that'd be very much new to me |
| 16:43.39 | roycroft | i said earlier that i like to rename a hierarchy before copying it |
| 16:44.00 | roycroft | so if /var/www is already its own filesyste, you can do mount -o remount,ro /var/www |
| 16:44.06 | jelly | ratrace: systemd would keep unmounting a changed fs or a changed mountpoint, don't remmebe |
| 16:44.12 | ratrace | jelly: oof, rings a bell but I can't remember right now what in systemd did that |
| 16:44.13 | roycroft | and then you don't have to rename it before copying |
| 16:45.08 | roycroft | but consult the mount man page for your particular filesystem type to ensure that the mount options you wish are supported and work as you expect |
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| 16:47.51 | ratrace | jelly: iirc, there used to be a problem if you manually mounted something to a mountpoint defined in fstab but for something else. |
| 16:48.09 | jelly | could be |
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| 16:48.26 | ratrace | like, you define in fstab that /dev/a mounts to /mnt/a, but later manually mount something else to /mnt/a (assuming of course /dev/a is umounted) |
| 16:48.45 | ratrace | can't remember the details but I think systemd had or still has that very annyoing habit |
| 16:49.09 | jelly | I think I umounted old fs, changed the definition to a different source, mounted it with "mount -a" and then systemd unmounted it |
| 16:49.29 | imMute | ratrace: no, I wouldn't think that would happen |
| 16:49.43 | ratrace | maybe in that case daemon-reload IS needed then. |
| 16:49.45 | jelly | it was basically gaslighting me for a bit |
| 16:50.05 | jelly | thought I was going crazy, etc |
| 16:50.09 | ratrace | but it'd be news to me if daemon-reload ran remounts |
| 16:50.17 | imMute | ratrace: if you change any of the config files, you need daemon-reload for systemd to notice them |
| 16:50.26 | jelly | it did not do remounts, but lack of it did umounts. |
| 16:50.35 | ratrace | yes I know that. I'm talking about actually doing RE-mounts via daemon-reload |
| 16:51.04 | ratrace | jelly: that's it then, the .mount units actively "protecting" the mountpoints |
| 16:51.10 | jelly | would that be an equivalent of reloading the unit |
| 16:51.44 | jelly | protecting against admin |
| 16:52.26 | ratrace | now add ZFS to the mix and you have a recipe for a ruined weekend, as I once had the unpleasure of .... having :) |
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| 16:56.18 | iliv | is the jessie-backports APT repo no longer avaialbe? |
| 16:59.27 | iliv | oh okay |
| 16:59.32 | iliv | they were moved to the archive |
| 16:59.35 | iliv | never mind |
| 17:02.48 | alex11 | jessie is long extinct and you shouldn't be running it on the internet anyway |
| 17:03.03 | iliv | oh, the IRC :) |
| 17:03.10 | iliv | thank you for the reminder, sir |
| 17:05.00 | ratrace | it's great, innit! |
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| 17:38.16 | invizus | is it possible in preseed/d-i to copy all files to target dir, using wildcard? i.e. cp /extras/* /target/root/ |
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| 18:01.29 | wikan | i have pavucontrol issue. It hangs system. |
| 18:01.48 | wikan | it hangs system always but not just after it is launched |
| 18:02.14 | wikan | it may be running for 20 minutes or 4 hourse... and bam system hung |
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| 18:02.31 | wikan | it is happening only when pavucontrol is running |
| 18:02.51 | wikan | no logs, can't find anything |
| 18:03.12 | wikan | did anyone heard about this? |
| 18:06.06 | jmcnaught | wikan: does "journalctl --user-unit pulseaudio.service" show any clues. Or have you tried running pavucontrol from a terminal to see its stdout/stderr output? |
| 18:06.21 | wikan | nothing |
| 18:06.42 | wikan | i didnt |
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| 18:08.04 | wikan | i am going to remove pulse anyway so... ;) hope it is possible |
| 18:08.19 | wikan | it is annoying |
| 18:08.49 | wikan | it can't detect if headphones are plugged or not |
| 18:08.51 | jmcnaught | Which release of Debian? |
| 18:08.59 | wikan | but it will detect it when I kill pulse |
| 18:09.23 | wikan | then it will work for few days but will stop detecting anyway |
| 18:09.56 | wikan | 10 |
| 18:10.01 | wikan | debian 10 |
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| 18:13.37 | wikan | and btw, something is wrong with pulse because sometimes it losts settings |
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| 18:14.18 | wikan | i have set right/left to 100% 50% because of temporary issue with my ear |
| 18:14.33 | wikan | it worked for 4 days and pulse lost settings |
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| 18:15.09 | wikan | so it is hard to say why and what was happen ;) |
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| 18:42.22 | jmcnaught | wikan: maybe try a different user account on your computer for a bit, see if it happens there too. |
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| 19:33.04 | codedmart | I am curious how many in here run sid and why? |
| 19:33.27 | sney | #debian-next on OFTC will typically have more sid users than here |
| 19:34.31 | sney | broadly, experienced debian users who don't mind tinkering with their systems to keep things working, will use testing or sid and get newer software and other features that may not be available in stable |
| 19:35.03 | sney | !moving target |
| 19:35.03 | dpkg | Sure, testing might be shinier than stable, but are you prepared to be continually updating your system? Things that worked today will break tomorrow. Configuration file formats will change and you'll have to fold your changes in yet again. Testing is a moving target and if you'd rather work *with* your computer than working *on* your computer, you might not want that. See <testing security>. |
| 19:35.17 | greycat | *really* experienced users just run stable, because we outgrew the SNS crap long ago |
| 19:35.31 | sney | depending on the use case, of course. |
| 19:36.00 | sney | is a testing on the desktop, stable everywhere else, kind of debian user |
| 19:36.29 | ratrace | actually, we all really want !sns, it's just those of us using Stable are too lazy to Sid :) |
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| 19:37.27 | sney | codedmart: you will probably never get a clear "how many" answer, though. |
| 19:37.42 | codedmart | Yeah I ran arch for a long time and moved to debian because I was tired of updating. Arch didn't break all that often to be honest. |
| 19:38.19 | codedmart | I would like a newer version of gnome, but it isn't that big of a deal really. I just keep trying to talk myself into trying sid for some reason. |
| 19:38.39 | sney | I've been using bullseye for over a year now and it hasn't broken "often" either. but there were a couple times that my experience came in handy to untangle something. and I've plenty of support queries about stuff I don't personally use. |
| 19:38.50 | sney | *seen |
| 19:39.00 | ratrace | codedmart: you can try gnome via snap maybe. Ubuntu is installing it that way |
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| 19:39.17 | n4dir | codedmart: use an emulator or old hardware from the basement to give Sid a try |
| 19:39.38 | n4dir | the people you ask will give different answers. Only you can decide |
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| 19:39.43 | codedmart | ratrace Yeah no interest in snap really. |
| 19:39.46 | n4dir | or dual-boot or such. Many options |
| 19:40.06 | sney | yep, any reasonably modern PC can virtualize a whole nother debian for you to try out. |
| 19:40.18 | codedmart | Yeah I know there are options |
| 19:40.57 | n4dir | but if one is looking for such, newest version, then debian is probably not the right distribution. Even Sid has a cold now and then (the freeze) |
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| 19:41.56 | n4dir | i mainly gave Sid a try to check how long it takes to break it. Didn't break for years and years. So i just kept it. |
| 19:43.21 | n4dir | that is not an argument for Sid not breaking though. Just the reason why i ran it |
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| 19:50.15 | codedmart | n4dir Ran it as in you don't anymore? |
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| 19:50.58 | n4dir | no, not anymore. I didn't use debian(based) for a while, and now stick to stable. |
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| 19:52.15 | n4dir | a) i don't care for versions, hardly know them and b) i sometimes don't start the PC for months, so don't upgrade that often |
| 19:52.55 | ratrace | you don't start the PC for months, I don't reboot it for months :) |
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| 20:01.29 | zeroed | Hello Folks. I found many things on CPU frequency control between `cpufreq-info` and `/proc/cpuinfo`, adding the temperature details of `sensors`. What I did not find is what I would like to ask you: Where I can see (if possible) the "target" temperature that triggers the fans? Thanks |
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| 20:10.16 | diogenes_ | zeroed, maybe BIOS contains that info. |
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| 20:12.58 | bla | Hi. |
| 20:13.43 | bla | My pidgin suddently stopped connecting to ejabberd with "handshake failed" and it's a bit too vague to pinpoint the issue. Other collegue can connect with his pidgin (windows) still. |
| 20:13.49 | bla | Any idea how to debug it? |
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| 20:14.20 | sney | start pidgin from a terminal, it may print more useful errors |
| 20:14.32 | bla | That handshake failed is terminal with -d -d -d -d -d -d |
| 20:14.32 | zeroed | diogenes_: Thanks. I see; I was wishfully thinking of get away with my curiosity reading from a file, but surely is worth trying. |
| 20:15.20 | sney | maybe it's a ssl issue, check the clock, cert age, usual ssl stuff |
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| 20:16.00 | bla | sney: I did; it checks out, although it's a self-signed. But pidgin allowed to remember it just fine. |
| 20:16.16 | bla | It's certainly SOME ssl/tls issue. |
| 20:16.40 | ratrace | maybe the self signed cert expired |
| 20:16.46 | bla | It's ok until 2040. |
| 20:16.55 | ratrace | blasphemy! |
| 20:16.57 | bla | Also - collegue still can connect. Didn't even get a prompt about new certificate |
| 20:17.15 | bla | Since 2040 I have time to configure let's encrypt. ;-) |
| 20:17.23 | bla | Still it's really fine. |
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| 20:19.03 | bla | I've googled also: nss: Handshake failed (-12251) - the number. But I can't seem to find anything. |
| 20:19.07 | bla | But it might tell you something? |
| 20:19.21 | bla | Currently I'm trying to catch the function failing with gdb... but that's a bit harsh. |
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| 20:26.25 | bla | And I can only tell that purple_connection_ssl_error is called. Meh. Would have to compile it probably. |
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| 20:37.55 | eth01 | hi, looking for some help, getting this error: https://www.irccloud.com/pastebin/v15NnoBH/ |
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| 20:38.59 | isapgswell | hi |
| 20:39.27 | isapgswell | how can i enable touchpad click right click on debian? |
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| 20:41.59 | overlisted | what desktop environment do you have? |
| 20:42.03 | overlisted | isapgswell: |
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| 20:44.40 | otisolsen70_ | Is oilshell packaged for debian? Cannot seem to find it. |
| 20:47.33 | overlisted | what is the package's name in other distros? |
| 20:47.41 | overlisted | i will try to find it on pkgs.org |
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| 20:48.11 | greycat | or, what is the (path)name of one of the files you expect to be in the package? |
| 20:49.30 | hop | it's written in python, use pipx to install it |
| 20:49.46 | lusrx | windows 10 thinks debian-testing-amd64-netinst.iso is Trojan:Win32/Zpevdo.B. is this a false positive? |
| 20:49.57 | lusrx | i got it from https://gemmei.ftp.acc.umu.se/cdimage/daily-builds/daily/arch-latest/amd64/iso-cd/debian-testing-amd64-netinst.iso |
| 20:50.27 | hop | lusrx: https://www.debian.org/CD/verify |
| 20:50.34 | overlisted | it can't be a win32 trojan lol |
| 20:51.10 | greycat | since it's not a stable image, #debian-next or #debian-boot on the other network might know more about these images |
| 20:51.12 | overlisted | (it can mount the windows drive and do stuff but nobody wants to develop this) |
| 20:51.18 | hop | ah, testing |
| 20:51.57 | overlisted | #debian-next is invite-only, how can i join then? |
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| 20:52.07 | nkuttler | !oftc |
| 20:52.07 | dpkg | OFTC is the Open and Free Technology Community, a support/collaboration service. They have an IRC network: irc.oftc.net. You may (or may not) be connected to OFTC's network. http://www.oftc.net/ See also <freenode>, <oftc move> and <fact sharing>. |
| 20:52.12 | nkuttler | overlisted: ^^ |
| 20:52.13 | greycat | On. The. Other. Network. |
| 20:52.18 | overlisted | oh |
| 20:52.20 | overlisted | ... |
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| 20:53.37 | ratrace | never fails :) |
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| 20:55.37 | lusrx | so how do i verify? the file has sha256: 69CD7A03E4A344D8487B1E2B08F80C6E4C5FA9E5D4D622662D05504BDD4BB9BF |
| 20:56.04 | greycat | sha256sum yourfile.iso |
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| 20:56.31 | overlisted | on windows there's a powershell command for sha'ing |
| 20:56.41 | ratrace | https://www.shellhacks.com/windows-md5-sha256-checksum-built-in-utility/ |
| 20:56.55 | hop | that's the less interesting part. you need pgp to verify the sums file |
| 20:57.30 | ratrace | https conn to the debian.org checksums suffices |
| 20:57.50 | overlisted | ...and to verify something else and finally be sure you need to ask your irl friend that has a verified debian cd image... |
| 20:57.58 | overlisted | finally be safe* |
| 21:04.16 | ChiLLabiS | Hi! Does Huawei laptops run good on Debian out of the box? |
| 21:05.37 | lusrx | i used a tool called hashTab |
| 21:05.58 | lusrx | in powershell: certUtil -hashfile .\debian-testing-amd64-netinst.iso SHA256 |
| 21:06.10 | lusrx | output: 3cd36d739ca8a26711129ac9e960956fae384ee29748d00443b1357d1e6cb9b4 |
| 21:06.41 | lusrx | not same as previous... not sure what to make of it. can you point me to a tutorial or something how this is done? on windows... |
| 21:08.12 | ratrace | that doesn't seem to be the correct hash.... https://cdimage.debian.org/cdimage/weekly-builds/amd64/iso-cd/SHA256SUMS |
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| 21:10.15 | hop | hence the pgp-part |
| 21:10.20 | hop | who knows from when this image is |
| 21:10.34 | ratrace | right |
| 21:10.53 | ratrace | lusrx: just redownload it from here: https://cdimage.debian.org/cdimage/weekly-builds/amd64/iso-cd/ |
| 21:11.14 | hop | recommend torrent, at least |
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| 21:12.28 | lusrx | 457M vs. 353M they are not even the same size. just same name. |
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| 21:14.33 | lusrx | powershell was right: https://ftp.acc.umu.se/cdimage/daily-builds/daily/arch-latest/amd64/iso-cd/SHA256SUMS |
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| 21:14.52 | lusrx | i got a match at source i downloaded from |
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| 21:15.26 | lusrx | so all should be good then i guess. unless someone has spoofed the number |
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| 21:16.32 | hop | wellâ¦Â if somebody put a trojan in the iso image, they /probably/ also spoofed the hash on the same site⦠|
| 21:16.47 | hop | like, the bible is true because the bible said so |
| 21:17.28 | ratrace | right, I wouldn't trust the shasums file from the _same_ mirror |
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| 21:17.54 | another | unless they're signed |
| 21:17.59 | ratrace | ideally gpg verification is best, using the key you already own in some debian installation, but that's a catch 22 there, so.... closest is to check against shasums from other places |
| 21:18.08 | hop | sheesh |
| 21:18.56 | lusrx | sha3-256 is a thing? wow. i see why my number from the other tool didn't add up |
| 21:19.55 | lusrx | i will make a leap of faith and "just do it". |
| 21:20.14 | lusrx | thanks! |
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| 21:21.14 | hop | i think they were comparing against the wrong hash fileâ¦Â the 3cdâ¦Â is correct, but not for the weekley netinst isp |
| 21:21.17 | hop | iso |
| 21:21.45 | hop | short attention span is a drag |
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| 21:58.33 | azubieta | Hi, is there any apt-get expert around ? I need some help with this issue https://github.com/AppImageCrafters/appimage-builder/issues/55 |
| 21:59.03 | azubieta | it's about making apt-get ignoring the configuration parts files |
| 22:00.15 | sney | apt-get update only synchronizes mirror data with the local cache, it does not download any icons or desktop files |
| 22:00.33 | sney | those are in packages, usually with the -common suffix |
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| 22:03.28 | sney | see the man page for apt.conf for a list of other Apt:: options that can be used to control the other behavior |
| 22:03.33 | azubieta | Hi sney, when apt-get update runs it retrieves several listings, besides the Packages one, depending on the system configuration |
| 22:04.09 | another | apt-get update downloads the package lists |
| 22:04.27 | azubieta | By example in my system apt-get update downloads `DEP-11 Metadata`, `DEP-11 48x48 Icons` and `amd64 Contents` |
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| 22:05.29 | azubieta | the instructions to download such listings are in /etc/apt/apt.conf.d/ |
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| 22:06.04 | azubieta | what I want to do is avoid apt-get reading such files without change the files or the names |
| 22:06.40 | azubieta | I tired setting Dir::Etc::SourceParts in the apt.conf but it didn't worked as I expected |
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| 22:09.18 | sney | ah, dep-11 stuff, which aiui is for graphical package managers mainly. looks like it is configured in /etc/apt/apt.conf.d/50appstream |
| 22:09.47 | sney | I haven't tried it, but deleting/moving that file should stop those downloads |
| 22:10.56 | sney | or purge the appstream package itself, actually. (purge is needed in this case since it's a conffile.) |
| 22:10.59 | azubieta | sney, that's correct, notice that my use case for apt-get is downloading only the packages that will be later deployed inside an AppImage, therefore I only need the package |
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| 22:11.28 | sney | yeah so if you exclude the appstream package from your build chroot that should take care of it |
| 22:11.33 | another | sney: which package pulled appstream to your system? |
| 22:11.46 | sney | on my desktop, plasma-discover |
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| 22:12.34 | azubieta | same here, what I'm trying to do is a sort of chroot using apt-get |
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| 22:12.53 | lnxslck | evening programs |
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| 22:13.33 | sney | yes, if you're building software that should be done in an isolated chroot so you don't get gunk from your personal system. debian has tools for this for creating .deb packages, I'd be surprised if there isn't something similar for appimage |
| 22:13.40 | lnxslck | is there a channel more appropriate to talk about debian packages? |
| 22:13.57 | sney | lnxslck: #packaging or #debian-mentors, on OFTC (note, right now you are on freenode) |
| 22:14.13 | lnxslck | ok, different server then |
| 22:14.24 | sney | #debian-mentors is for packages that will be submitted to debian, and #packaging is for everything else |
| 22:14.41 | lnxslck | thank you sney |
| 22:14.44 | sney | np |
| 22:14.46 | azubieta | so I could get help there? |
| 22:14.59 | sney | azubieta: neither channel is for appimage help |
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| 22:15.26 | lnxslck | azubieta: hey man ! |
| 22:15.39 | sney | azubieta: if you make sure appstream is not installed in your build chroot, that will resolve your issue. how you accomplish that is up to you, since appimage isn't really a debian thing |
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| 22:15.48 | azubieta | Oh, I'm an AppImage developer, I need help configuring this bit of apt-get |
| 22:15.53 | azubieta | hello lnxslck ! |
| 22:16.14 | azubieta | sney, with appimage-builder I'm not creating a chroot :( |
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| 22:16.56 | sney | azubieta: for best results, don't build software for public distribution on your personal system. if appimage doesn't have tools for this, use a VM or lxc |
| 22:17.39 | azubieta | sney that's correct, maybe I'm just being to picky and trying to optimize too much |
| 22:17.45 | azubieta | this is not a critical issue |
| 22:17.49 | sney | azubieta: check if someone made an equivalent to "pbuilder" for appimage. this is how debian packages are made, clean from anything on the package maintainer's pc |
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| 22:18.35 | azubieta | I'll indeed take a look to pbuilder itself :), thanks for you help sney |
| 22:18.40 | sney | np |
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| 23:16.36 | maxrazer | How do I look up the command after installing a package? For some reason it isn't working. |
| 23:17.01 | nkuttler | maxrazer: dpkg -L <package> | grep bin ? |
| 23:17.02 | maxrazer | I don't see anything in /bin/ either. |
| 23:17.28 | nkuttler | /bin is for system stuff |
| 23:17.30 | sney | !buster su |
| 23:17.31 | dpkg | In buster, su no longer overrides PATH by default, requiring that you use "su -" or "su -l" for login shells (which is not really a new thing at all...). See https://wiki.debian.org/NewInBuster#Changes for details. |
| 23:17.53 | sney | if it's in /sbin or /usr/sbin, and you're getting command not found, this is the likely reason |
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| 23:18.45 | maxrazer | nkuttler, can I run dpkg -L on a third party package I download and install locally? It isn't working. |
| 23:19.20 | maxrazer | oh ok. I see wait |
| 23:20.11 | maxrazer | nkuttler, ok, the package put it in /opt/, which isn't in my path |
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| 23:22.33 | maxrazer | I run the command on the apt argument of the package name too, not the actual package file. |
| 23:23.02 | maxrazer | I thought I couldn't run it on the package name argument stored within dpkg/apt because I didn't know the name. But, it does follow the convention of the package file name. |
| 23:23.32 | maxrazer | I just put a script in ~/scrips to execute the /opt/program/bin/executable |
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| 23:54.04 | Kaedenn | How can I determine why "The following packages have been kept back:" when I run "apt upgrade" or "apt-get upgrade"? |
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| 23:54.33 | astronavt | Kaedenn, i was dealing with this recently. i dont think there is a good way to tell, other than looking for version conflicts in deps |
| 23:54.47 | astronavt | apparently the `aptitude safe-upgrade` command has better dependency resolution |
| 23:55.06 | astronavt | ive come to accept that on testing i will always have a few of those packages |
| 23:55.50 | sney | on testing, it's often caused by transitions |
| 23:56.36 | sney | for instance if you have a testing system where 'libllvm10:i386' is held back, that's mostly due to the ocaml transition |
| 23:56.54 | sney | tracker is a good resource for finding this out. |
| 23:56.55 | sney | !tracker |
| 23:56.56 | dpkg | The Debian package tracker can be found at https://tracker.debian.org (or go directly to https://tracker.debian.org/packagename) and has loads of information about a given package, including: available versions, security alerts, bugs, maintainer info, upload history, and upstream info. Take a look! |
| 23:57.13 | Kaedenn | For me, it's virtualbox (and two other virtualbox-related packages) |
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| 23:58.04 | sney | testing/sid questions are more appropriate in #debian-next on OFTC, also. (note, you are currently on freenode.) virtualbox is only in sid and unlikely to ever be in a debian stable release again |
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