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| 03:31.02 | Zero_Chaos | does Lars Wirzenius hang out here? I have no idea his handle |
| 03:33.02 | Zero_Chaos | so my reasoning isn't lost for my odd manhunt, I read his blog and just wanted to express solidarity :-) |
| 03:34.54 | pucko | since his website is 'liw', my guess is that his irc nick is the same. |
| 03:35.39 | Zero_Chaos | pucko: thanks, good call, you appear to be right |
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| 03:40.26 | hanasaki | on current stretch... any idea why the default install leads to this and how to fix? kernel: [51865.316142] audit: type=1400 audit(1519270782.274:1146): apparmor="DENIED" operation="ptrace" profile="/usr/sbin/libvirtd" pid=733 comm="libvirtd" requested_mask="trace" denied_mask="trace" peer="libvirt-654a2de1-6dbf-458b-ab54-15841da4fe53" |
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| 03:59.53 | hanasaki | https://bugs.launchpad.net/mos/+bug/1473421 |
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| 04:11.00 | somiaj | hanasaki: since apparmor is not default, unsure why a default install leads to that. Did you enable apparmor? |
| 04:11.52 | themill | the backports kernel and testing/unstable kernel bring in apparmor |
| 04:12.14 | somiaj | oh yea, forgot the backport kernel would include it. |
| 04:12.24 | somiaj | stil I wouldn't call that a 'default install' |
| 04:12.43 | hanasaki | somiaj: nope. it is a fresh stretch install from iso |
| 04:12.56 | themill | ,recommends linux-image-4.14.0-0.bpo.3-amd64 --release stretch-backports |
| 04:12.57 | judd | Package linux-image-4.14.0-0.bpo.3-amd64 in stretch-backports/amd64 -- recommends: firmware-linux-free, irqbalance, apparmor. |
| 04:12.59 | themill | yeah |
| 04:13.02 | hanasaki | ok. my bad... yes.. it is a backport kernel |
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| 04:13.27 | hanasaki | what's value does firmware free and irqbalance bring? |
| 04:13.32 | somiaj | hanasaki: partly mine, I know that apprmor is being tested in buster at the momement, didn't realize it would affect the backports kernel though. |
| 04:13.34 | hanasaki | I thought selinux was the standard? |
| 04:14.03 | somiaj | debian is only recentally trying to change from no tool to apparmor as default. |
| 04:14.13 | hanasaki | somiaj: you are the backport builder? |
| 04:14.34 | somiaj | hanasaki: not in debian. Anyways, there are kernel parameters you can use to turn apparmor off, or you can try to figure out how to write policy files for it. |
| 04:14.38 | hanasaki | selinux is a pain to config :( RH has it on by default |
| 04:14.39 | somiaj | hanasaki: I am not, only a hobbiest |
| 04:14.56 | hanasaki | tried kernel 4.15.x? |
| 04:15.52 | somiaj | In this case it seems to me it is either an issue with fixing the apparmor rules to meet your needs, or just disable it. |
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| 04:16.46 | somiaj | apparmor is available in stretch, but is not default. They are testing to make it default in buster, but so far it is only testing, I don't think any decisions has been made if it will be included by default in buster yet or not. |
| 04:16.48 | hanasaki | true. however it should work as installed and not block an install of another package from debian |
| 04:17.08 | somiaj | hanasaki: and I think the backport kernels which come from buster include this recommended package of apparmor because of that. |
| 04:17.22 | hanasaki | built 4.15.x ... fails to boot.. cannot find the boot partition :) |
| 04:17.40 | somiaj | hanasaki: well it does need to be tested. You can disable/remove apparmor to go back to how stretch is by 'default' |
| 04:18.15 | hanasaki | thanks |
| 04:18.32 | hanasaki | the 4.15 issue is diff than appamor |
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| 04:22.02 | metalbat97 | i try to use selenium but have a problem configuring the PATH variable, what the right configuration to do? and here https://paste.ubuntu.com/p/GsJNNDCDvR/ my code, PATH settings and the result thanks |
| 04:23.33 | toruvinn | 50 |
| 04:23.36 | toruvinn | oops. |
| 04:23.47 | somiaj | does echo $PATH return you something on the outsdie. Are those two lines of code all that you are using in your .py file, and the rest is just output? |
| 04:24.50 | awal1 | tools for debug scripts? |
| 04:25.22 | awal1 | right now I want to debug 'obamenu', an openbox script menu |
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| 05:42.34 | JackK | Why does the Debian wiki return a 403 forbidden error when you try to read it while connected to PIA? |
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| 05:51.58 | themill | quite probably because it has received a lot of abuse from that vpn |
| 05:52.15 | themill | (that is the normal reason) |
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| 06:42.29 | sleepingforest | I updated my debian machine (outdated for 2 months) and i cant find out why my iprouting doesnt work anymore. Notable packages that updated are iproute2 and linux-image. Im kinda confused on how to debug this. |
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| 06:43.10 | sleepingforest | is there a way i can inspect IPTABLES rules to see where/why its failing? |
| 06:43.54 | somiaj | iptables -L will list the rules, or iptables -t nat -L for other tables. |
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| 06:46.46 | sleepingforest | im aware of those |
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| 06:52.27 | somiaj | unsure of any other way, expcet look through the rules. |
| 06:52.36 | somiaj | looks like there is a way to trace rules, https://serverfault.com/questions/78240/debugging-rules-in-iptables |
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| 06:58.07 | sleepingforest | ah yeah |
| 06:58.10 | sleepingforest | thanks for that |
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| 07:03.15 | xtore | Why do we no longer hear any news about spectre and meltdown; I thought they were a clear and present danger and hackers were working fulltime to develop exploits around them ¯\_(ã)_/¯ |
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| 07:05.52 | petn-randall | xtore: There's still news, it just doesn't hit mainstream anymore, just the tech news sites. |
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| 07:06.56 | Zyferus | as far as Mainstream seems concerned there were software patches tossed out, and new hardware that you buy 'isn't effected'. So they are lead to believe. |
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| 07:16.22 | Robby | I have an issue where postfix doesn't seem to start and systemctl output is useless (simply states it started, nothing useful) and /var/log/mail.log /var/log/mail.info do not get written to at all, makes it hard to troubleshoot this |
| 07:17.42 | Robby | I wanted to start this manually from the shell, to see if I can see more, but /lib/systemd/system/postfix.service contains ExecStart=/bin/true so that doesn't help :P |
| 07:18.31 | Robby | I need a verbose-mode |
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| 07:40.19 | fightthewalrus | so, today I learned that virtualbox is not completely free, and therefore not included in the default debian repos. I never tried another virtualization solution before, and I'm mostly a n00b in the field. What does debian recommend? |
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| 07:41.11 | fightthewalrus | I want to mostly use it as a way to try out different distros, attempt LFS, and have 8GB on the host. |
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| 07:41.55 | alkisg | fightthewalrus: http://packages.debian.org/virtualbox => it's available |
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| 07:42.58 | fightthewalrus | alkisg: ehi? I couldn't find it in Stretch :( |
| 07:43.16 | fightthewalrus | do I have to enable nonfree or contrib? |
| 07:43.16 | somiaj | fightthewalrus: it is in stretch-backports and the contrib repo |
| 07:43.27 | fightthewalrus | ah, so that's that |
| 07:43.31 | somiaj | it isn't in stretch, only stretch-backports |
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| 07:43.52 | fightthewalrus | got it, that was the charade then |
| 07:43.55 | somiaj | there is qemu-kvm as an altenrative, that is in stretch. |
| 07:44.02 | somiaj | but both work just fine |
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| 07:44.37 | fightthewalrus | ok, maybe I should give it a go before installing virtualbox then. Try new things and stuff |
| 07:44.40 | fightthewalrus | thanks guys |
| 07:45.12 | alkisg | Many virtualbox drivers are in the process of being mainlined upstream in the kernel, so it's quite better that it used to be |
| 07:45.17 | alkisg | *then |
| 07:45.19 | alkisg | *than, meh |
| 07:47.15 | somiaj | fightthewalrus: if you install virt-manager and qemu-kvm, that should pull in the rest. virt-manager is a gui to manage virtual machines with libvirt. |
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| 07:48.43 | somiaj | fightthewalrus: https://wiki.debian.org/KVM, though the virtualbox packages in stretch-backports work just fine if you are use to virtualbox. |
| 07:50.24 | fightthewalrus | somiaj: that sounds like a sweet deal. I'll give it a try. Sounds more unix-like too, having the business and GUI layers provided by different packages and all |
| 07:50.35 | fightthewalrus | I will definitely take a look |
| 07:51.34 | fightthewalrus | wonders if he should up his game a little and venture into docker someday |
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| 07:53.22 | fightthewalrus | btw, I don't know if here's the best place to report this, but all pages of the debian wiki are showing me a 403 - Forbidden page. Maybe it's just me? |
| 07:54.22 | somiaj | are you behind a vpn? |
| 07:54.54 | somiaj | I heard mention that some vpns are blocked due to abuse on the wiki. But it works for me. |
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| 07:56.19 | fightthewalrus | somiaj: right again. |
| 07:56.54 | fightthewalrus | sad to hear that, though. Using VPN / Tor for abuse is a reversal of the values they once stood for |
| 07:57.52 | pingfloyd | yeah, the idea with those was to protect one's self more from being abused |
| 07:58.07 | xtore | Zyferus, are you of the opinion that spectre's current vulns are being brushed under the carpet? |
| 07:58.21 | pingfloyd | xtore: seems like they are to me |
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| 08:02.05 | xtore | I'd like to blog about this subject and see if I can get a following. |
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| 08:05.24 | pucko | what ever did walruses do wrong to that guy... |
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| 08:07.02 | somiaj | xtore: any paticular info you are looking for? There are a combination of software and firmware fixes avaiable for both meltdown and spectre. |
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| 08:08.46 | xtore | somiaj, I guess my goal is to go through a crash course in how it all works and then cook up a 5,000 word article with a few cheesy infographs on how it works and how a future app or JS script on a site can pwn the reader's box. And get tons of reblogs of course. |
| 08:09.36 | xtore | so the particular info I would be looking for is something easily translatable into layman's terms so the aveage joe can grasp it and choke on their coffee while reading my entry |
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| 08:28.13 | nwe | how can I change bond-xmit-hash-policy to layer2+3 while bond0 is up and running ? |
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| 09:02.19 | teatime | somiaj: iptables-save to *really* list rules |
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| 09:59.05 | kale | hi i am installing 9.3 on a dell poweredge 1950, but it cannot find my disks, would you happen to know which driver i need here? |
| 09:59.23 | BanHammor | your disks? as in, HDD? |
| 09:59.58 | kale | yes |
| 10:00.19 | kale | i tried megaraid_sas and mptsas |
| 10:01.04 | jelly | kale: did you create an array in controller bios? |
| 10:01.23 | kale | nope, i wanted to use linux software raid |
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| 10:01.41 | jelly | does the controller have a separate HBA mode for that? |
| 10:01.50 | kale | i do not know |
| 10:02.21 | jelly | if you haven't exposed the disks somehow, either by creating arrays, or switching to dumb HBA mode, there won't be any visible for the OS |
| 10:02.52 | kale | jelly: ok, thanks, i'll look into that |
| 10:02.56 | jelly | I'm assuming you have a hw raid controller in there. |
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| 10:04.25 | jelly | (and assuming it's LSI based and that LSI still needs arrays configured to actually show anything on scsi bus) |
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| 10:05.07 | RoyK | kale: what sort of controller does it have? |
| 10:05.08 | jelly | if there's no other option you can create a single raid0 array from each disk separately |
| 10:05.31 | RoyK | jelly: not all controllers have an HBA mode, though |
| 10:05.48 | jelly | RoyK: which is why I asked. |
| 10:06.31 | jelly | but really why would one suffer with md if there's a decent hw raid |
| 10:06.55 | jelly | perhaps to avoid MegaCLI or some of its descendants |
| 10:07.36 | kale | we are settup up the hardware raid now |
| 10:08.31 | kale | later i just have to figure out how debian detects a raid failure. |
| 10:08.55 | jelly | typically there's a vendor-specific tool |
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| 10:10.25 | pingfloyd | probably using perc5i |
| 10:10.31 | RoyK | kale: Optional PERC 5/i integrated SAS/SATA daughtercard controller |
| 10:10.32 | RoyK | with 256MB cache, PERC4e/DC, PERC 5/e adapter |
| 10:10.48 | RoyK | probably like pingfloyd says, but possibly other |
| 10:11.11 | pingfloyd | there should be a key you hit when you startup the system to get into its bios |
| 10:11.19 | kale | pingfloyd: ok, thanks, i'll look into that once it has been installed |
| 10:11.40 | pingfloyd | its a separate bios than the system bios |
| 10:11.48 | pingfloyd | if it's perc |
| 10:11.57 | RoyK | iirc perc 5i doesn't support JBOD/HBA mode |
| 10:12.04 | RoyK | it's a dedicated raid controller |
| 10:12.09 | pingfloyd | just go into the bios and check |
| 10:12.15 | RoyK | that is, you could setup each drive as r0 |
| 10:12.39 | RoyK | it's a prompt after the system bios is done with its stuff |
| 10:13.30 | RoyK | 1950 seems to be from 2006 |
| 10:13.50 | RoyK | I beleive we've thrown all our such machines out years ago ;) |
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| 10:22.23 | kale | ok, have 4 disks now, thanks, next networking ... i do not have drivers on netinst iso, will i have more drivers on a bigger installation iso? |
| 10:22.49 | jelly | you ought to have all the drivers for that old a machine |
| 10:23.11 | jelly | unless you put a recent card into the system for some reason or a wifi one |
| 10:23.40 | kale | hmm... might be my network expert now patching it up correctly then. will check that. |
| 10:24.30 | jelly | what you don't have in the installer is 802.1q VLAN support, put the port(s) into access mode during installation |
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| 10:25.09 | kale | is that done in bios as well? |
| 10:26.49 | jelly | that's done on the switch side |
| 10:27.00 | jelly | by your networking peoples |
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| 10:27.17 | kale | arg, i'll fetch them |
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| 10:30.28 | jelly | you probably don't have to if they haven't told you already you'd have a funny network setup |
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| 10:42.16 | kale | jelly, RoyK and pingfloyd, thank you very much for your help. This hardware is new to me, and boss wants the system up soon, so helped me a lot here. |
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| 10:44.40 | RoyK | kale: no problem - if you want it fast and easy, just use hwraid on that - should work well |
| 10:45.11 | RoyK | kale: iirc you need to press CTRL+C when the perc's BIOS prompt appears |
| 10:45.28 | RoyK | kale: how many and what sort of drives? |
| 10:46.12 | kale | 4 drives, sas, i have them as linux software raid now, then i know what i am doing :-) |
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| 10:53.18 | RoyK | kale: nice :) |
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| 11:10.10 | BluesKaj | 'Morning |
| 11:11.17 | gpunk | :) |
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| 11:18.20 | BanHammor | hihi |
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| 11:55.17 | pragomer | any help how I could install "xfdashboard" in stretch? |
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| 11:58.15 | Unit193 | pragomer: It's not in stretch (or Debian at all), so you'll have to build it. |
| 11:59.02 | pragomer | ok. thanks |
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| 12:00.06 | Unit193 | Build-depends: libclutter-1.0-dev, libdbus-glib-1-dev, libgarcon-1-0-dev, libglib2.0-dev, libwnck-3-dev, libxcomposite-dev, libxdamage-dev, libxfce4ui-2-dev, libxfce4util-dev, libxfconf-0-dev, pkg-config |
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| 12:01.19 | jelly | those build deps look suspiciously dpkgish |
| 12:01.33 | pragomer | when trying to build xfdashboard under stretch I get this when configuring: configure: error: Your intltool is too old. You need intltool 0.35 or later. |
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| 12:02.12 | jelly | ,v intltool |
| 12:02.13 | judd | Package: intltool on amd64 -- jessie: 0.50.2-2; wheezy: 0.50.2-2; stretch: 0.51.0-3; buster: 0.51.0-5; sid: 0.51.0-5 |
| 12:02.25 | pragomer | and this: |
| 12:02.25 | pragomer | X Window system libraries and header files are required |
| 12:02.39 | jelly | pragomer: so install some more -dev packages |
| 12:03.17 | jelly | that last one sounds vaguely like libx11-dev |
| 12:03.55 | jelly | but things like libxcomposite-dev, libxdamage-dev would probably at some point pull libx11-dev in so it's weird |
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| 12:04.03 | jelly | ,depends libxcomposite-dev |
| 12:04.04 | pragomer | it was libx11-dev |
| 12:04.04 | judd | Package libxcomposite-dev in stretch/amd64 -- depends: libxcomposite1 (= 1:0.4.4-2), libx11-dev, libxfixes-dev, x11proto-composite-dev (>= 1:0.4), x11proto-core-dev, libxext-dev. |
| 12:04.08 | jelly | right |
| 12:04.11 | pragomer | but now it goes on and on... OMG |
| 12:04.36 | jelly | pragomer: did you install Unit193's mystically obtained list of build deps |
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| 12:05.52 | pragomer | which list? |
| 12:06.07 | jelly | [12:00] <Unit193> Build-depends: libclutter-1.0-dev, libdbus-glib-1-dev, libgarcon-1-0-dev, libglib2.0-dev, libwnck-3-dev, libxcomposite-dev, libxdamage-dev, libxfce4ui-2-dev, libxfce4util-dev, libxfconf-0-dev, pkg-config |
| 12:06.15 | pragomer | just a second |
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| 12:12.54 | Unit193 | Xinerama, XDamage, and XComposite are "optional" |
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| 12:25.04 | Unit193 | However yes, jelly is right. https://anonscm.debian.org/viewvc/pkg-xfce/goodies/trunk/xfdashboard/debian/control?view=markup was (basically) the list I pulled. |
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| 12:25.25 | sadtaco | How should I go about install php5 on debian 9? The repo seems to just have php7. |
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| 12:28.31 | jelly | !deb.sury.org |
| 12:28.31 | dpkg | Short instructions for sury's php deb builds can be found at https://packages.sury.org/php/README.txt |
| 12:28.42 | jelly | sadtaco: ^^ probably the sanest option |
| 12:29.07 | jelly | Unit193: didn't you say it was not in debian |
| 12:29.25 | Unit193 | jelly: That's still accurate, it's not a package in Debian's repos. |
| 12:29.28 | fakefur | hi guys i just got this warning when ssh'ing into my server after an absence of maybe 4 days - i have changed nothing in the meantime |
| 12:29.31 | fakefur | The authenticity of host 'XXX.XXX.XXX.XXX (XXX.XXX.XXX.XXX)' can't be established. |
| 12:29.37 | fakefur | what does this actually mean? |
| 12:29.40 | sadtaco | Ah sury's. I think I used this before |
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| 12:29.44 | fakefur | should i be freaking out? |
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| 12:29.57 | deadrom | hey guys |
| 12:30.07 | sadtaco | I guess I should actually see if my stuff runs on php7 to start with, but I'm doubting it |
| 12:30.22 | sadtaco | I hate setting up servers. Making me feel so sleepy. I should nap first. :( Thanks for the help. |
| 12:30.32 | jelly | fakefur: have you ever logged in to this remote system IP address from this client? If not, this message is expected and normal |
| 12:30.47 | fakefur | i have regularly logged in for the past 2 years |
| 12:31.00 | fakefur | usually every day or so |
| 12:31.20 | jelly | fakefur: and the IP address did not change? |
| 12:31.27 | fakefur | no |
| 12:31.36 | fakefur | i run debian buster on my desktop |
| 12:31.41 | fakefur | and it is running debain stable |
| 12:31.42 | jelly | fakefur: and you used the same user (ie. you're not accidentally running ssh as root now)? |
| 12:31.47 | fakefur | *debian |
| 12:32.00 | fakefur | no just my regular user account |
| 12:32.09 | fakefur | ssh me@xxx |
| 12:32.11 | jelly | then you have cause to worry. :-) |
| 12:32.16 | fakefur | christ |
| 12:32.20 | jelly | I mean the local account |
| 12:32.38 | Unit193 | Try with '-v' |
| 12:32.38 | fakefur | i log in to a local user account then elevate to root |
| 12:32.50 | fakefur | root has no remote login ability |
| 12:33.04 | jelly | fakefur: which local user is running ssh |
| 12:33.30 | jelly | are you starting it from normal user's shell or from root shell |
| 12:33.40 | fakefur | on the server normal user shell |
| 12:34.00 | fakefur | i have a completely normal unprivileged user account that i log into |
| 12:34.06 | jelly | where are you running the "ssh me@xxx" command? |
| 12:34.07 | fakefur | then i elevate to root on the server |
| 12:34.14 | fakefur | that is from my laptop |
| 12:34.32 | jelly | when I ask about local user I'm talking about THAT laptop. |
| 12:34.39 | fakefur | ahhhh no normal user |
| 12:34.39 | jelly | which is LOCAL to you |
| 12:34.41 | fakefur | always |
| 12:34.50 | fakefur | sorry |
| 12:35.11 | jelly | well it seems your laptop has forgotten you've ever connected to that particular remote ip |
| 12:35.25 | fakefur | is that possible from an update? |
| 12:35.26 | jelly | did you change anything on it recently |
| 12:35.35 | fakefur | just regular apt update |
| 12:35.50 | jelly | like change username, or have a power failure that might result in files lost |
| 12:36.10 | fakefur | hmmmmmm some files were corrupted |
| 12:36.22 | fakefur | if the known_hosts was one this could happen? |
| 12:36.27 | jelly | yes, precisely |
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| 12:36.38 | fakefur | ahhhh let me check - thanks so much - i was panicing |
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| 12:37.06 | fakefur | ahhhhhh that was it |
| 12:37.15 | fakefur | jeez that scared me - thanks so much |
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| 12:37.23 | fakefur | i should have figured that out myself |
| 12:37.24 | fakefur | sorry |
| 12:38.26 | deadrom | upgraded deb8 in a VirtualBox to deb9, upgraded vbox tools, now I cannot Xfwd certain programs anymore. thunar works, gwenview works, gThumb for example won't: Gdk-ERROR: "GLXBadContext" |
| 12:38.54 | deadrom | so what's off here, X, gtk3, VBox, my client? |
| 12:39.24 | fakefur | jelly, thanks muchly :) |
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| 13:12.46 | jak2000 | hi all good morning, how to get the actual date - 1 day in this format yyyy/mm/dd ? |
| 13:14.41 | jelly | jak2000: man date, something like date -d '1 day ago' +%Y/%m/%d |
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| 13:23.41 | Iridos | uh |
| 13:23.55 | Iridos | use date --iso and get a date like yyyy-mm-dd |
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| 13:24.16 | Iridos | it's the same order, only everyone recognizes it as an iso date |
| 13:27.42 | jelly | Iridos: this one is nicer because you can't put it in a filename? |
| 13:28.13 | jelly | maybe they need to mkdir -p |
| 13:28.23 | jelly | who knows |
| 13:28.28 | Iridos | ^^ |
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| 13:29.02 | Iridos | where'd we get if you could just put dates in a filename |
| 13:29.19 | Iridos | da horror |
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| 13:30.46 | Iridos | mkdir -p would of course be a possible application, although I'd still hate the outcome and want something that contains the full date on the last level |
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| 13:43.27 | tw | meh, mkdir -p $(date +'%Yâ%mâ%d') |
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| 13:43.42 | tw | Yes, I am a bad man. |
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| 13:45.35 | jelly | except they want yesterday |
| 13:46.22 | Unit193 | -d yesterday |
| 13:47.04 | tw | my bad, still will have awful bytecodes in the filename. |
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| 13:50.11 | soulz | Indeed. :) |
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| 14:51.24 | edmont | hi, what DHCPv6 client do you recommend? |
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| 14:52.51 | r2tw | dhclinet -6 ? (not sure) |
| 14:53.29 | Tenkawa | yeah dhclient or dhcpcd |
| 14:54.38 | edmont | not wide-dhcpv6-client? |
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| 14:55.34 | edmont | what I need is the client to be able to request Prefix Delegation and read the obtained prefix with a Python script |
| 14:56.05 | g0zzy | Is it true that you can't blacklist modules built into the kernel? |
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| 14:57.35 | metastable | g0zzy: Because they're not modules if they're built in to the kernel. |
| 14:57.39 | jhutchins_wk | g0zzy: Yes. |
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| 14:58.58 | g0zzy | I need to disable a wireless nic, as it's broken and flooding the log with error messages |
| 15:00.43 | g0zzy | If i can't remove it physically, is the only way to use a custom kernel? |
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| 15:04.00 | metastable | Or you could use udev to disable the device. |
| 15:04.33 | g0zzy | Ah OK |
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| 15:05.38 | g0zzy | The odd thing is that it's on the usb bus and yet i've no idea where it is physically |
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| 15:17.53 | jhutchins_wk | Network drivers are rarely built into the kernel. |
| 15:18.20 | rant | unless its an embedded system |
| 15:18.23 | jelly | !blacklist |
| 15:18.24 | dpkg | To blacklist a Linux kernel module, create/edit /etc/modprobe.d/blacklist.local.conf and add a line similar to this (without quotes): "blacklist module_name". If this doesn't work, do 'echo "install modulename /bin/true" >> /etc/modprobe.d/blacklist.local.conf'. IMPORTANT: ask about <blacklist-initramfs>. To blacklist a module at installation time, ask me about <installer blacklist>. http://wiki.debian.org/KernelModuleBlacklisting |
| 15:18.37 | NEOalquimista | My screen suddenly starts to flicker on/off only when on Debian GNOME. I tried switching to another TTY, and the console there flickers too. I need guidance on which package to report the bug for. |
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| 15:19.16 | jelly | g0zzy: if you have access to kernel command line, you can try modulename.disabled=1 |
| 15:19.39 | jhutchins_wk | NEOalquimista: Check your cable. |
| 15:20.48 | g0zzy | I could possibly put that in grub.cfg? |
| 15:21.13 | NEOalquimista | jhutchins_wk: it doesn't happen on other distros, so it couldn't be because of loose cables on this laptop. I just came from Arch. This issue only starts on Debian. Never elsewhere. I'm sure of it. |
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| 15:21.39 | NEOalquimista | and only on GNOME, |
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| 15:21.57 | NEOalquimista | I've used Xfce on Debian for a long time after I noticed the problem with GNOME |
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| 15:22.45 | rant | NEOalquimista: I'd check dmesg and Xorg.0.log.. but given all the information my best guess would be a compositing manager or something and I dont know what if any GNOME might be using these days |
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| 15:24.26 | g0zzy | OK. In theory it should load r8712u.ko for this adapter, so that'd be blacklistable |
| 15:24.48 | darxmurf | just found a folder on a server with windows 3.11 and DOS 6.22 installation files... interested ? |
| 15:25.14 | jelly | g0zzy: without .ko |
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| 15:25.59 | jelly | NEOalquimista: intel gpu? |
| 15:26.09 | NEOalquimista | jelly: yes, intel |
| 15:27.13 | jelly | NEOalquimista: there are various issues that can cause flickering, some related to power management issues in some (older) versions of drivers. Amusingly a nice resource for workarounds is arch linux wiki |
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| 15:28.33 | jelly | NEOalquimista: could be the kernel part of the driver, but it could be somewhere else in the stack (xorg / dri / mesa) that triggers it |
| 15:29.01 | jelly | NEOalquimista: you can try a newer kernel and see if it accidentally fixes it |
| 15:29.05 | jelly | !bdo kernel |
| 15:29.05 | dpkg | Newer kernels for Debian stable releases are available from the <stretch-backports> repository. After modifying your sources.list, run «aptitude update». To install the current backported kernel: «aptitude -t stretch-backports install linux-image-`uname -r|sed 's,[^-]*-[^-]*-,,'`». To list available backported kernel image packages: «aptitude search '?narrow(~nlinux-image,?origin(Debian Backports))'». |
| 15:29.18 | NEOalquimista | okay, i'll take a look |
| 15:29.43 | NEOalquimista | Maybe because it's only on GNOME, it could be something related to it, like its compositing or something..? |
| 15:30.33 | NEOalquimista | Oh, right, i'll see the logs |
| 15:31.32 | jelly | obviously gnome does something that triggers it. Does it continue if you log off gnome and log in something without a default compositor like xfce |
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| 15:33.06 | NEOalquimista | I haven't tried it. Initially, it only triggered it when I used gnome-terminal. I would open it and type something. At the first keystroke, bang! SCREEN moving out of place, flickering and all hell breaks loose. Now it's worse. Out of nowhere. |
| 15:33.26 | NEOalquimista | but I can't reproduce it reliably |
| 15:33.29 | bitess | i had a problem with a broadwell cpu, where the screen went crazy after waking up from power savings. flickered like a broken movie projector. i removed xserver-xorg-video-intel and installed a newer kernel. |
| 15:33.44 | NEOalquimista | mine is broadwell |
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| 15:33.51 | jelly | I think xserver-xorg-video-intel isn't there by default any more |
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| 15:34.10 | NEOalquimista | my screen looks like it moves sideways |
| 15:34.13 | jelly | or at least isn't used |
| 15:34.28 | NEOalquimista | it just happened again when i opened the terminal |
| 15:34.39 | NEOalquimista | like a VHS movie |
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| 15:35.35 | NEOalquimista | the xserver-xorg-video-intel is installed here. |
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| 15:46.47 | edmont | is there a way to configure dhclient to obtain a prefix via Prefix Delegation? |
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| 15:49.58 | NEOalquimista | I have this error: [drm:gen8_irq_handler [i915]] *ERROR* CPU pipe A FIFO underrun |
| 15:50.14 | metastable | edmont: Yes. |
| 15:50.22 | metastable | edmont: A brief Google query turned up a bunch of documentation on how to do so. |
| 15:50.54 | edmont | metastable: I tried with the -P option and it works, but not able to configure it in dhclient.conf |
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| 15:52.48 | edmont | metastable: I am confused with this: https://www.isc.org/wp-content/uploads/2017/08/dhcp43options.html "The ia-pd option is manufactured by clients and servers to create a Prefix Delegation binding - to delegate an IPv6 prefix to the client. It is not directly edited in dhcpd.conf(5) or dhclient.conf(5), but rather is manufactured and consumed by the software." |
| 15:53.06 | edmont | what does that mean? |
| 15:53.11 | metastable | No idea. |
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| 15:55.25 | jelly | NEOalquimista: when is that, at boot time or recently |
| 15:56.09 | jelly | NEOalquimista: /var/log/kern.log or dmesg -T |
| 15:56.14 | jelly | or dmesg -t I guess |
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| 16:06.20 | g0zzy | "blacklistr8712u" is the content of /lib/modprobe.d/onboard-wireless-adapter AND /etc/modprobe.d/onboard-wireless-adapter. The module is still getting loaded. Why? |
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| 16:08.42 | alkisg | Try renaming it to .conf |
| 16:09.31 | greycat | The recent trend of "your files only get processed if they have the right extension" is super annoying, especially when there's no obvious way to find out this rule, or what the magic extension is. |
| 16:09.32 | g0zzy | Ah. So it's been debian-apache-ised? ;) |
| 16:10.32 | greycat | don't even get me STARTED on apache... |
| 16:10.53 | g0zzy | Very Windowsish. The file extension is so important and defining that it's hidden from you by default |
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| 16:11.51 | greycat | No, not Windows-ish. Near as I can tell, it's because some idiot left an emacs foo~ backup file in place and it caused a problem, then someone decided "let's exclude *~" which is fine, but then someone else decided "nah, let's only INCLUDE *.conf or *.list or *.squeegee". |
| 16:12.27 | g0zzy | doesn't know which is worse |
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| 16:14.11 | greycat | so in /etc/apt/sources.list.d/ it has to be *.list and in /etc/systemd/system/*.d/ it has to be *.conf and ... |
| 16:15.20 | g0zzy | wonders what the bsds do |
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| 16:18.03 | g0zzy | Thanks. .conf did it |
| 16:18.06 | rant | I suppose it'd be sane for such things to log warnings or notices if it finds files in that dir that are not the right extension |
| 16:18.18 | g0zzy | Yes |
| 16:18.37 | greycat | No, because then you get log-spammed by the *.dpkg-orig files which were one of the original reasons for the change. |
| 16:19.01 | pkutzner | greycat: However, apt still complains about files that are named *.conf.* You have to use *.conf.bak to get it to not complain about them. |
| 16:19.37 | pkutzner | If you want to temporarily disable a ppa or the like. |
| 16:20.12 | g0zzy | The mentality is: we'll cater for the moronic by kludge f |
| 16:21.07 | g0zzy | and not cater to traditions/standard practice, breaking software |
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| 16:33.41 | AE-35 | is there an equivalent to osx "log stream --syslog"? |
| 16:34.59 | metastable | AE-35: Given that this is #debian, not sure if we're expected to know what osx does. What does that command do, and maybe we'll have a better idea. |
| 16:35.11 | AE-35 | mac os |
| 16:35.26 | AE-35 | streams logs to stdout |
| 16:35.26 | metastable | AE-35: I know what osx is. That doesn't help or answer the question. |
| 16:35.50 | metastable | AE-35: Check out the journalctl command manual. |
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| 16:38.39 | jhutchins_wk | I think limiting the extension has the valid function of making a human-readable way to have non-active files in the directory. |
| 16:39.21 | jhutchins_wk | Supposedly linux only cares about the "magic word", but that doesn't apply to text config files. |
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| 17:02.40 | _0x5eb_ | hi, is there any way (even brutal) to shrink a (R/O-)mounted root FS? (context: VPS configured with Debian 9 with 100% HDD taken by /, no other partition nor even swap) |
| 17:03.34 | rant | _0x5eb_: do you NEED another partition that badly? |
| 17:03.37 | greycat | That is not unusual for a VPS. What *kind* of VPS is it, exactly? Some of them cannot use swap, period. |
| 17:03.41 | _0x5eb_ | (I was thinking of a custom initramfs with a dropbear service as a last resort) |
| 17:04.12 | _0x5eb_ | VPS provided by OVH (very strange default configuration indeed) |
| 17:04.32 | greycat | But what kind? What does "uname -a" say? |
| 17:06.28 | _0x5eb_ | rant, actually my goal is to inject my own installation through a second root; in such cases I usually use the swap partition that I disable, format as ext4, and use for deploying a temp install but here just a single partition |
| 17:07.32 | _0x5eb_ | greycat, Linux hostname 4.9.0-5-amd64 #1 SMP Debian 4.9.65-3+deb9u2 (2018-01-04) x86_64 GNU/Linux |
| 17:07.33 | jelly | _0x5eb_: no, mount from a different device |
| 17:08.27 | _0x5eb_ | jelly, there is just a single HDD with a single partition using 100% of the space, no other device available |
| 17:08.28 | greycat | Not OpenVZ, then. So maybe swap is an option? I don't know. |
| 17:09.23 | jelly | _0x5eb_: you need to fsck -f first, shrink fs, then shrink the block dev, and first two will refuse to work on a mounted fs or spew scary warnings |
| 17:09.23 | _0x5eb_ | I was thinking of deploying a debootstrap'd root in a tmpfs and pivot_root on it but it does not seem to be allowed |
| 17:09.57 | jelly | that's a theory but I've never managed to successfully pivot_root to tmpfs and umount the old one |
| 17:10.09 | jelly | tbh I tried twice and a long time ago |
| 17:11.12 | jelly | _0x5eb_: what kind of second installation? |
| 17:11.31 | jelly | which OS (or which distro and version) |
| 17:11.34 | _0x5eb_ | well else maybe an initramfs not pivoting to the actual / and simply starting a dropbear |
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| 17:12.35 | _0x5eb_ | jelly any, maybe even simply a clean, minimal Debian 9 |
| 17:12.36 | jelly | with a careful application of a static shell, you might replace the whole distro on the existing fs |
| 17:13.00 | jelly | test it on your own VM first before doing it remote |
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| 17:13.23 | jelly | _0x5eb_: which VM solution are they using? |
| 17:13.28 | _0x5eb_ | jelly, sure, I only test on a Xen mirror of the VPS before even loging into the VPS :) |
| 17:13.34 | jelly | (what does imvirt say) |
| 17:13.39 | _0x5eb_ | jelly, KVM |
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| 17:13.55 | jelly | good, that might have a chance of working |
| 17:14.14 | *** join/#debian ChmEarl (~chmearl@unaffiliated/prymar56) |
| 17:14.26 | _0x5eb_ | is that dependant on the hypervisor? |
| 17:14.36 | *** join/#debian rpifan (~rpifan@2600:1:d11e:f9a2:c35d:2326:92b0:faad) |
| 17:14.46 | jelly | well for starters it's not a container with no kernel access |
| 17:14.59 | _0x5eb_ | ah yes sure, full access to the kernel :) |
| 17:15.19 | jelly | and it's not a weird xen setup that does unusual things to figure out the right kernel to boot at power on time |
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| 17:15.43 | _0x5eb_ | I was used to deploy OpenVZ kernels on such kind of VPS (a long, long time ago) |
| 17:16.22 | _0x5eb_ | jelly, would you mean some kind of pygrub? ;) |
| 17:16.39 | jelly | possible strategy: install busybox-static or sash or whatever, debootstrap into a separate /new dir, and VERY CAREFULLY move all /* dirs to /old/ and move or copy /new/* to / |
| 17:16.55 | jelly | thus, no fs shrinking |
| 17:17.41 | jelly | all the dynamically linked commands WILL break at "move all /* dirs to /old/" step :-) |
| 17:18.45 | _0x5eb_ | well I don't care of keeping anything from the current install but really need separate partitions (actually a single LVM partition) |
| 17:19.35 | jelly | safer to have a separate /boot and then one for LVM PV but yeah |
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| 17:20.36 | jelly | I guess guess you could try to fsck -f and shrink fs online, then force reboot the machine right after and see if it boots |
| 17:20.37 | _0x5eb_ | yes sure that's what I mean |
| 17:21.12 | jelly | if it works, you can shrink the partition safely |
| 17:22.00 | _0x5eb_ | jelly, "resize2fs: On-line shrinking not supported" :( |
| 17:22.19 | tw | Newp, only online-grow is supported. |
| 17:23.34 | tw | It's a KVM and they don't offer CD booting with vnc or spice remote console? |
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| 17:23.52 | frostschutz | they should have a rescue system |
| 17:24.11 | jelly | _0x5eb_: --please-do-it-offline-and-pretend-the-device-is-not-mounted |
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| 17:24.40 | tw | Wow. |
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| 17:25.13 | jelly | _0x5eb_: stupid workaround: remove it from /etc/mtab, if your mtab is a symlink remove it, copy /proc/mounts in its place and then remove it :-) |
| 17:25.39 | jelly | tw: it might just be _that_ cheap |
| 17:25.57 | metastable | It's OVH. They're a giant, nasty garbage fire. |
| 17:26.16 | _0x5eb_ | tw: remote console yes (great for rescue mode w/o network), but no other boot option |
| 17:26.22 | jelly | _0x5eb_: congrats, you now don't have a / mountpoint! |
| 17:27.01 | *** mode/#debian [+l 1479] by debhelper |
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| 17:29.39 | _0x5eb_ | jelly, "resize2fs: Device or resource busy while trying to open /dev/sda1" |
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| 17:30.10 | frostschutz | _0x5eb_, so this is not available somehow? https://www.ovh.com/world/g920.rescue_mode#ii_rescue_pro_mode_3_rescue_in_ssh |
| 17:30.10 | areyouloco | _0x5eb_: unmount? |
| 17:30.11 | _0x5eb_ | I think I will have no choice but to go with the initramfs w/dropbear option |
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| 17:31.23 | jhutchins_wk | I wonder why you're working so hard to do something that's not supported by your Provider. Is it really that good a deal? |
| 17:31.43 | rant | especially when you already seem to have Debian stable installed |
| 17:31.45 | jelly | curses! |
| 17:31.53 | jelly | areyouloco: it's the root fs |
| 17:32.04 | brw | Has anyone seen any major performance impacts yet with these new Spectre/Meltdown patches? |
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| 17:32.10 | _0x5eb_ | the idea is just to move a currently working OS (hosted by another provider) to this one |
| 17:32.10 | tw | yes. |
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| 17:32.34 | tw | brw: it's non-trivial on a number of the systems I manage. |
| 17:32.43 | jelly | _0x5eb_: er, you could use device-mapper to make a /dev/mapper/sda1 pointing at exactly the same slice of sda :-) |
| 17:33.16 | jelly | so.. different device |
| 17:33.17 | brw | tw: uugh. |
| 17:33.39 | brw | Mine are virtual instances too, so this could be a double whammy |
| 17:33.53 | tw | They're older E5s though, so maybe on the skylake stuff it's better? |
| 17:34.07 | jelly | _0x5eb_: but you'd need kpartx installed to do it easily |
| 17:34.28 | _0x5eb_ | jelly, yes it's there, I'll try that (on my sandbox mirror of course) :) |
| 17:35.07 | jelly | which means force reboot (because you fsck -f), install kpartx, remount ro, fsck -f again, create parallel device, try resize2fs |
| 17:36.03 | jelly | _0x5eb_: everything about this idea is horrible. |
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| 17:37.42 | tw | There's a recovery CD option in the ovh console for handling exactly this kind of problem. You're going about this in a very complex way. |
| 17:37.43 | _0x5eb_ | ... and reboot very quickly hoping for the best (I of course already killed all the non strictly essential daemons) ;) |
| 17:38.06 | tw | _0x5eb_: if you booted with `single` nothing should be running besides init and maybe your shell |
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| 17:40.56 | jelly | I wonder if grml iso can be booted from grub |
| 17:41.22 | jelly | or any debian live |
| 17:42.29 | _0x5eb_ | frostschutz, tw: thanks for the tips on the "rescue mode" (I initially thought it was only booting the OS in single user mode), seems indeed almost too easy, investigating this now |
| 17:42.46 | jelly | <mika> yes <mika> I recommend grml-rescueboot :) |
| 17:42.50 | jelly | says #grml |
| 17:44.12 | jelly | so if you have console access, booting grml (it's a debian based live) with toram option would be a workable way to nuke disk contents and reformat everything to your liking |
| 17:45.00 | _0x5eb_ | jelly, hmm great idea too! I keep that in mind & will investigate that |
| 17:47.11 | jelly | ,i grml-rescueboot |
| 17:47.12 | judd | Package grml-rescueboot (admin, extra) in stretch/amd64: Integrates Grml ISO booting into GRUB. Version: 0.4.7; Size: 6.4k; Installed: 29k; Homepage: http://git.grml.org/?p=grml-rescueboot.git |
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| 17:49.10 | brw | I wish |
| 17:49.36 | Urangst | hello. could anyone point/link me somewhere a begginer could start? Im planning to switch from win10 to either debian or fedora but dont know which one yet. Thanks |
| 17:50.04 | jelly | try both. |
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| 17:50.51 | wigums | Urangst, https://wiki.debian.org/ |
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| 17:51.16 | jelly | Urangst: live images might be nice to try things out, just keep in mind perfomance will be lower on a live usb than an installation on hdd or ssd |
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| 17:52.03 | rant | Urangst: yeah you could try both, but what got me was http://www.debian.org/intro/why_debian and http://www.debian.org/social_contract |
| 17:53.39 | wigums | another issue imo is fedora is too bleeding edge. bleeding edge tends not to be that great for new users but absolutely try both |
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| 17:54.48 | aispark[m] | Fedora took a long time booting than debian |
| 17:55.36 | *** join/#debian warai_otoko (~warai_oto@185.156.174.171) |
| 17:55.54 | aispark[m] | Had a lot of systemd services I couldn't understand |
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| 17:57.52 | wigums | truth is on fedora youre the bug tester for rhel. its really not good imo |
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| 17:59.08 | annadane | Urangst, i can certainly recommend debian stable, no surprises, quite reliable |
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| 18:00.37 | jelly | Urangst: is your hw platform a laptop or a machine with wifi or a really new graphic card (say, model less than 2 years old)? |
| 18:00.47 | Urangst | <annadane> i downloaded the version 9 and installed on a VM but the thing is, after i install it i dont really know what to do. last time a spent a little time with linux was on ubuntu and got really frustated because i was struggling to install programs and couldnt use the things i use daily in my win10 |
| 18:01.16 | *** join/#debian arCABAL (~mpr@ip565b06f2.direct-adsl.nl) |
| 18:01.40 | annadane | yeah, i mean, it depends on what programs you're trying to use |
| 18:01.52 | jhutchins_wk | !handbook |
| 18:01.52 | dpkg | The Debian Administrator's Handbook is at http://debian-handbook.info/ and can be browsed, bought and downloaded. From Debian 7 "Wheezy" onwards, it can also be installed from the debian-handbook package. Also ask me about <books> <docs>. PDF at https://debian-handbook.info/download/stable/debian-handbook.pdf |
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| 18:02.58 | jhutchins_wk | Urangst: There are some online databases like equivalent.to that list equivalent programs. Sometimes the process of accomplishing your goal is different in Linux than in Windows. |
| 18:03.06 | wigums | Urangst, you will have that issue with any linux. its gonna take time for you to learn |
| 18:03.08 | Urangst | <jelly> its a lenovo ideapad 310, i5-6200U @ 2.30GHz, bought a Samsumg SSD 850 EVO and use it as the main storage, DDR4 ram, GeForce 920MX |
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| 18:04.00 | Urangst | <annadane> i remember i struggled to install python and keepass, and some cloud services to download files i use daily |
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| 18:04.12 | jhutchins_wk | Urangst: There's also the fact that rather than find a program from a third party then download and install it, Debian maintains a library of over 50,000 programs that are packaged for Debian and tested to work with the stable release. |
| 18:04.19 | Urangst | <dpkg> thanks |
| 18:04.34 | greycat | Python is probably already installed. |
| 18:04.46 | somiaj | Urangst: part of what makes debian stable great is all the software that debian provides is well tested to work with debian. The drawback is, you should stcik only to software provided in the debian repos, which means finding alternative software and sometimes using older well tested versions of software. |
| 18:04.54 | Urangst | <jhutchins_wk> i tried to install using the terminal, but could get past some things i dont remember now |
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| 18:05.23 | jhutchins_wk | Urangst: Hopefully we'll be able to help you get through it this time. |
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| 18:05.36 | Urangst | <somiaj> if there are substitutes to things i can find on win10 im ok with it |
| 18:06.13 | jhutchins_wk | Urangst: The important thing is to focus on your goal, not what you think the process or program should be. |
| 18:06.15 | Urangst | what are big downsides from someone coming from windows? |
| 18:06.27 | somiaj | Urangst: depends on what you are willing to use as substitutes, but there are plenty who use debian as their desktop and software that can work. But you won't get everything, there will be things that win10 can do you won't be able to. On the other hand, there are things you can do in linux that win10 can't. |
| 18:06.35 | jhutchins_wk | Urangst: You'll need to get used to the command line. |
| 18:07.00 | Urangst | <somiaj> yes, one things that im keen on linux |
| 18:07.02 | somiaj | Urangst: biggest downside is thinking about being an admin to your machine, not jsut being able to click and things 'just work', stuff usually requires a bit of research and sometimes configuration. |
| 18:07.42 | wigums | even very experienced linux users have to look shit up |
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| 18:07.55 | Urangst | <somiaj> thing is, my classes just started and i really need some stuff working and thats my main concern |
| 18:08.09 | jhutchins_wk | "Click and things just work" doesn't happen in Windows unless you're supported by a very competent IT department. |
| 18:08.14 | greycat | What stuff specifically? |
| 18:08.52 | Urangst | ill probably just try to learn on an VM for now and when i get the semester break i can back up my music on the HD im waiting to arrive and i can format and install linux as main OS |
| 18:09.04 | wigums | Urangst, get a live usb OR simply install linux to a usb just as if it were a hard drive or sdd. plug it in and boot from the usb whenever you want and you get to keep your windows on the main drive |
| 18:09.11 | jelly | if you choose to run Debian on hardware instead of a VM you'll probably want to use "unofficial" installation images with firmware |
| 18:09.12 | wigums | yea or a vm |
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| 18:09.39 | jelly | or live images with firmware if trying live |
| 18:09.43 | jelly | !firmware live |
| 18:09.44 | dpkg | Unofficial <live> images - containing non-free Debian <firmware> packages - for Debian 9 "Stretch" as a live OS are available at http://cdimage.debian.org/cdimage/unofficial/non-free/cd-including-firmware/current-live/amd64/iso-hybrid/ . See also <firmware images>. |
| 18:09.49 | Urangst | another thing that im afraid of is making a dual boot so i can have the possibility to have 2 OS installed, i tried before but didnt felt confident about it |
| 18:09.59 | wigums | Urangst, get a live usb OR simply install linux to a usb just as if it were a hard drive or sdd. plug it in and boot from the usb whenever you want and you get to keep your windows on the main drive |
| 18:10.09 | wigums | so no need to dual boot |
| 18:10.09 | jelly | Urangst: nah, just keep using a VM then |
| 18:10.18 | greycat | If you already have the knowledge and infrastructure for the VM option, you can do that. |
| 18:10.22 | jhutchins_wk | Urangst: Dual boot has been working almost since Linux released the first kernel, it's very reliable. |
| 18:10.25 | wigums | your best bet is vm |
| 18:10.29 | jelly | I run windows in a VM because dual booting is a pain |
| 18:10.31 | Urangst | <wigums> in a USB doesnt it get sluggish? |
| 18:10.42 | jair | hello all I am seeing a server crashing because of memory usage... http://paste.debian.net/1011521 |
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| 18:11.07 | wigums | Urangst, yes it can be but its one option to keep windows on your machine and be able to play with a fullly installed system |
| 18:11.09 | jair | there is nothing special in the system just the linux kernel a few iptables packages and nothing else |
| 18:11.13 | Urangst | <jelly> yeah, that is a better option. but what about dual boot linux. still bad idea? |
| 18:11.14 | *** join/#debian areyouloco (~areyouloc@5.79.86.129) |
| 18:11.15 | somiaj | Urangst: live systems don't run off the usb, they run off of memeory, so they load from the usb (this makes them run okay even with slower usb read speeds) |
| 18:11.19 | jhutchins_wk | Urangst: You're not going to get great performance, but Live images have been optimized to work better with a USB or disc. |
| 18:11.38 | Urangst | <wigums> on a usb is it less painful to run on a VM? |
| 18:11.42 | somiaj | Urangst: dual boot is fine, but many don't actually want to reboot just to testout another os. |
| 18:11.51 | jhutchins_wk | Actually running off of a normal install on a USB is pretty slow and not enjoyable. |
| 18:11.54 | wigums | Urangst, your easiest way to learn will be a vm |
| 18:12.05 | jair | I wonder if I can run something to stop the server from crashing >> screenshot > https://ibb.co/dmrfvx |
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| 18:12.07 | jelly | Urangst: deal with that later if you decide to switch to a different primary OS |
| 18:12.15 | Urangst | <somiaj> so it would run like a old HD, but with new DDR4 memmory |
| 18:12.43 | Urangst | <somiaj> yeah |
| 18:13.01 | jair | I read something about the > DirectMap1G: 12582912 kB |
| 18:13.07 | somiaj | Urangst: mostly, a live system takes a bit to load, but once things are in memeory it works okay. |
| 18:13.07 | jelly | also, avoid putting < > around people's names when addressing them. That's irc way to quote people not address them |
| 18:13.11 | Urangst | <jhutchins_wk> so between a USB and a VM, VM is still better/faster? |
| 18:13.25 | jair | jelly: sorry |
| 18:13.33 | jair | https://stackoverflow.com/questions/42525327/what-are-side-effects-cons-of-disabling-transparent-huge-pagesthp/42540006 |
| 18:13.33 | somiaj | jair: what makes you think it is memeory problems, I dno't see any issue with your meminfo output, and you aren't even using swap. |
| 18:13.38 | jelly | jair: that was for Urangst, not you |
| 18:13.50 | jair | jelly: Ok sorry |
| 18:14.07 | Urangst | jelly: theres any way i can copy ppl in a easier way? |
| 18:14.16 | Urangst | jelly: theres any way i can copy ppl names in a easier way? |
| 18:14.21 | greycat | most IRC clients will tab-complete a name |
| 18:14.23 | jelly | Urangst: jsut start typing their nick and press TAB |
| 18:14.29 | jair | somiaj: the server is using 12G or ram and keeps growing after approx 19 hours the server crash |
| 18:14.30 | jelly | jel<TAB> |
| 18:14.39 | Urangst | jelly, ah ok didnt tought about that |
| 18:14.43 | jair | somiaj: did you see the htop screenshot? |
| 18:14.48 | somiaj | !free memory |
| 18:14.48 | dpkg | Unlike information, your computer's memory does *not* want to be free. Free RAM is wasted RAM! Linux tries to use free physical memory for caching files from disk which speeds up disk access considerably. Linux releases RAM from these caches if programs need it. If you want to know how much physical memory the free(1) tool says you have left for program use, it's 'free' + 'buffers' + 'cache'. Also ask me about <swapwake>. |
| 18:14.54 | somiaj | jair: using all your memeory is common in linux. |
| 18:14.59 | Urangst | used to names appearing on screen on the phone |
| 18:15.24 | jelly | jair: what kind of workload are you running |
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| 18:15.37 | Urangst | somiaj, so which is better USB or VM? |
| 18:15.39 | jair | somiaj: come on! the server crash every 19 hours, there is nothing running on the server other than ip tables is a machine use as router |
| 18:16.00 | jair | jelly: just linux, a few gnu tools ip tables that's it |
| 18:16.05 | jhutchins_wk | Urangst: Most IRC clients will auto-complete a name if you hit tab. |
| 18:16.05 | jair | jelly: routing |
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| 18:16.49 | jhutchins_wk | jair: So reboot the server every 18 hours. Problem solved. |
| 18:16.52 | Urangst | jhutchins_wk, yeah, i just forgot that was a thing since i got used to seeing the person name when you type it some android apps |
| 18:16.53 | jelly | jair: what's iscsid there for? |
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| 18:17.23 | jair | jhutchins_wk: haha |
| 18:17.32 | *** join/#debian Urangst (~LvmhmGVJo@191.250.220.60) |
| 18:18.02 | jair | actually I am sorry all this server I just noticed is running ubuntu 17.10 kernel 4.13.0-36-generic |
| 18:18.04 | jhutchins_wk | jair: Seriously, that's a valid solution. Probably want to do it every 12 for ease of scheduling. |
| 18:18.07 | jair | wrong chat :( |
| 18:18.08 | jelly | jair: did you capture the output of "free" at boot and a couple hours after boot? |
| 18:18.10 | jair | so sorry |
| 18:18.29 | somiaj | jair: you may want to actually test your memory with memtest86, and see if you actually have bad memory. I would expect the cahced meemory to be higher than in your paste, but your system is not switching to swap, which is another 16gigs of memeory that it is not using. I just wouldn't think a memeory leak or using to much memeory is the culprit causing your system to crash. |
| 18:18.32 | Urangst | jhutchins_wk, theres any way to quote old texts? so i can comment on them? |
| 18:18.54 | jelly | jair: alright then. #ubuntu-server is that way, and I'd advise against running non-LTS versions on servers... |
| 18:19.09 | jair | jelly: thank you! |
| 18:19.10 | jhutchins_wk | Urangst: Cut&Paste |
| 18:19.19 | jair | thank you all! |
| 18:19.30 | Urangst | oh, another thing i wanted to know is if theres some website that points you to similar or alternative programs you find on windows |
| 18:20.03 | somiaj | Urangst: probably not a single one, but google can help on a per case basis, 'linux alternative to office' for example might be a good search. |
| 18:21.02 | Urangst | <rant> Urangst: yeah you could try both, but what got me was http://www.debian.org/intro/why_debian and http://www.debian.org/social_contract. Very good points, really keen on the social contract |
| 18:22.11 | Urangst | somiaj, theres any site where you can find some kind of guide to like "things you should when you begin" or something of the sort, just so i dont get lost not knowing what to do |
| 18:22.37 | Urangst | normally i like to mess around with the system right when i get it but i really dont know how to mess with linux to begin with |
| 18:22.43 | somiaj | Urangst: there are lots, but they sometimes get outdated or only cover what that paticular user thought someone would need. |
| 18:23.07 | somiaj | Urangst: vague questions will get vague answers, but if you had a more specific question, what is an alternative to foo, you would get a more specific answer. |
| 18:23.20 | Urangst | somiaj, thats good enough for me, from there i can get ideas to what i want to do/search for |
| 18:23.27 | greycat | On a desktop system, the critical early things are usually "Do I have all the firmware installed that I need", "Does my video card work properly" |
| 18:23.41 | somiaj | I mean to me, most users need a browser, but both firefox and chromium are in debian, and office, which can be done with libreoffice. After that I'm unsure what people would want. |
| 18:23.42 | aispark[m] | Urangst: Arch wiki list of applications page is wonderful |
| 18:23.45 | greycat | On a laptop, add "Does my wireless interface work properly" to that. |
| 18:24.46 | Urangst | greycat, yes, how could i verify if the drivers are working fine? because on my laptop manufacturer driver page theres only win10 drivers, where would i find the drivers? |
| 18:24.58 | greycat | Oh god, you have a laptop? Ugh... |
| 18:24.58 | Urangst | aispark[m], gonna look for that |
| 18:25.06 | greycat | But you said you would be installing in a VM, so that doesn't matter. |
| 18:25.20 | Urangst | greycat, notebook, dont know if theres much difference |
| 18:25.37 | Urangst | greycat, im planning to leave win10 |
| 18:25.44 | greycat | If you're installing in a VM, it shouldn't matter, other than possibly installing "guest extensions" or whatever they call that thing. |
| 18:25.58 | greycat | If you're installing natively, use the netinst CD with nonfree firmware included. |
| 18:26.00 | *** join/#debian pvoigt (~Linux@unaffiliated/pvoigt) |
| 18:26.01 | greycat | !firmware install |
| 18:26.05 | greycat | !firmware image |
| 18:26.05 | dpkg | Unofficial <netinst> and DVD installer images containing non-free Debian firmware packages are available for installing Debian 9 "Stretch". See http://cdimage.debian.org/cdimage/unofficial/non-free/cd-including-firmware/current/ and ask me about <install guide>. |
| 18:26.31 | Urangst | greycat, my goal is to use linux as main OS |
| 18:26.44 | aispark[m] | Urangst: good thought |
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| 18:27.11 | Urangst | at this time is not feasible to ditch windows yet, not confident yet |
| 18:27.45 | Urangst | greycat, so it works like the automatic win10 driver install? |
| 18:28.09 | greycat | I have absolutely no idea how a win10 install works. |
| 18:28.25 | _0x5eb_ | frostschutz, tw: FYI, OVH "rescue mode" := "please crash my VPS now" ;) |
| 18:28.27 | _0x5eb_ | (estimated time to boot in rescue mode: 2mn, the web interface gave up after 30mn, connection to KVM lost, impossible to reboot nor even reinstall the VPS) |
| 18:28.54 | tw | _0x5eb_: ticket your provider. |
| 18:29.23 | tw | sucky outcome when their tools are broke =( |
| 18:29.31 | Urangst | greycat, if im not mistaken it searchs for generic drivers online if youre missing some |
| 18:29.32 | _0x5eb_ | sure, first I will wait a few hours, lots of customer report this kind of issues |
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| 18:29.44 | annadane | i long for the day when we have free hardware and don't need to deal with non-free firmware stuff |
| 18:29.51 | _0x5eb_ | and indicate it gets fixed "automatically" after a few hours |
| 18:29.55 | annadane | if nothing else because it's confusing |
| 18:30.26 | greycat | When has anything in the computer industry ever become *simpler* instead of more complex? |
| 18:30.28 | *** join/#debian OtakuSenpai (~OtakuSenp@117.194.194.12) |
| 18:30.45 | jelly | greycat: smartphones UI with iphone. |
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| 18:31.13 | jelly | some vendors are great at hiding complexity |
| 18:31.35 | somiaj | Urangst: almost all drivers are contained inside the linux kernel. In a laptop this most likely means you just need non-free firmware and will have all drivers installed by default. I noticed you had a nvidia card, you can optionally install the nvidia non-free drivers, though the nouveau ones that are included by default will work for most things. |
| 18:31.38 | tw | Most OS control panels. Security and privacy settings in web browsers have a tendancy to go away. |
| 18:31.44 | tw | simpler ;) |
| 18:33.02 | annadane | most things aka probably not kde plasma |
| 18:33.10 | Urangst | somiaj, so i shouldnt worry too much about crucial drivers missing when i install it as main OS |
| 18:34.19 | jelly | Urangst: you should worry about missing firmware _and_ missing drivers depending on your actual hardware |
| 18:34.24 | *** join/#debian aiki-lord (~aikilord@77.74.194.239) |
| 18:35.00 | Urangst | another thing i noticed is when youre installing debian you can select different UI (i guess, dont remember the name) i think there are 4, KDE, xfce and the other ones i dont remember. i was wondering where i can find info on those |
| 18:35.05 | greycat | Urangst: if you are installing natively on a laptop, use the nonfree firmware netinst image. |
| 18:35.17 | jelly | Urangst: linux hardware supports lags a year or two behind windows. If you plan to use Linux, the safest option is to investigate linux compatibilty BEFORE buying |
| 18:35.32 | annadane | https://wiki.debian.org/DesktopEnvironment - which doesn't provide _too_ much information, really |
| 18:35.44 | annadane | people tend to like xfce, fairly intuitive |
| 18:36.00 | Urangst | jelly, where can i find info on compatibility? |
| 18:36.01 | jelly | if you've already bought a laptop the damage is done |
| 18:36.03 | annadane | but you can look up all of those and see what features you want and which DEs support them |
| 18:36.27 | aispark[m] | Xfce is wonderful been using it for long |
| 18:36.37 | Urangst | jelly, what you mean by damage is done? |
| 18:36.57 | jelly | you don't have an option to change hardware if it's not supported well |
| 18:37.04 | Urangst | annadane, aispark[m]: thanks gonna look more into it |
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| 18:37.47 | Urangst | jelly, on this one i bought i can easily change hard drive and memmory, but the ones i got are just fine |
| 18:37.49 | annadane | i'm actually on MATE now and quite like it |
| 18:37.59 | aispark[m] | Urangst: https://wiki.archlinux.org/index.php/Desktop_Environment |
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| 18:38.08 | stoned | jelly: the problem with chrome-html-dropdown doesn't happen in buster, but only in 9.3! |
| 18:38.09 | *** join/#debian brouette (~para_free@ks3373811.kimsufi.com) |
| 18:38.09 | Urangst | aispark[m], thanks |
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| 18:38.14 | jelly | Urangst: I didn't say "find" but "investigate". This usually includes looking for reviews by people who're running linux on the same hardware. Looking for specific components pci-id and usb-id numbers and googling compatibility of each. |
| 18:38.16 | stoned | jelly: configs are all the same, I just reinstalled OS |
| 18:38.21 | aispark[m] | There's comparison there |
| 18:38.35 | stoned | jelly: it's not seemingly to do with Xmonad or window drawing. It's gotta be something else. |
| 18:38.40 | jelly | stoned: I don't remember what you're talking about, sorry |
| 18:38.44 | stoned | np. |
| 18:38.58 | jelly | or wait, that was you?? |
| 18:38.58 | stoned | Well, all is hunky dory now. |
| 18:39.00 | jelly | lol |
| 18:39.00 | Urangst | jelly, ill try to look if theres ppl with the same notebook running some linux distro |
| 18:39.04 | stoned | Wait, what was me? |
| 18:39.13 | stoned | I'm always me. stoned on psychedelics as always. |
| 18:39.16 | stoned | \o/ |
| 18:39.23 | jelly | some other nickname with xmonad and chromium issues |
| 18:39.30 | stoned | Enchanter Tim? |
| 18:39.31 | stoned | Me too. |
| 18:39.33 | jelly | yes |
| 18:39.38 | jelly | pfft |
| 18:39.39 | stoned | I love Monty Python |
| 18:39.48 | aispark[m] | Urangst out of your firmware most issue could be your wireless interface |
| 18:40.03 | stoned | hehe, have a good one bud. Time to code. |
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| 18:41.28 | Urangst | aispark[m], how would i find info on my firmware? look for the name of it? for example mine is: Qualcomm Atheros QCA9377... |
| 18:41.49 | aispark[m] | Urangst: BTW check here too https://wiki.debian.org/InstallingDebianOn |
| 18:42.35 | High | ,v smplayer |
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| 18:42.36 | judd | Package: smplayer on amd64 -- wheezy: 0.8.0-1+deb7u1; jessie: 14.9.0~ds0-1; stretch: 16.11.0~ds0-1+deb9u1; buster: 17.11.2~ds0-1; sid: 17.11.2~ds0-1 |
| 18:42.57 | High | Hunh. That's goofy. I trid apt-get install smplayer and it say sno package found. |
| 18:43.14 | jelly | High: which debian release are you using |
| 18:43.18 | High | buster for now. |
| 18:43.21 | High | testing |
| 18:43.26 | jelly | !debian-next |
| 18:43.26 | dpkg | #debian-next is the channel for testing/unstable support on the OFTC network (irc.oftc.net), *not* on Freenode. If you get "Cannot join #debian-next (Channel is invite only)." it means you did not read it's on irc.oftc.net. |
| 18:43.30 | High | oh |
| 18:43.35 | High | ya'll changed a lot. |
| 18:43.43 | High | now I gotta get on oftic. |
| 18:43.45 | High | ugh. |
| 18:43.54 | High | alright. see you then |
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| 18:44.00 | jelly | oftc won't eat your kittens |
| 18:44.12 | jelly | oh it's STILL you! lol |
| 18:44.14 | High | not a cat person. dogs are always cool. |
| 18:44.20 | High | <3 |
| 18:44.39 | aispark[m] | Urangst if you have system up you can install lshw and run its the best description for all hardware |
| 18:44.44 | *** join/#debian fstd_ (~fstd@unaffiliated/fisted) |
| 18:45.02 | jelly | I don't track nick changes, it's all new people to me all the time. |
| 18:45.05 | *** join/#debian bryceml (~bryceml@45.56.62.10) |
| 18:45.09 | High | Oh. |
| 18:45.39 | High | Neither do I actually. I ginroe NICKS, JOINs, PARTS, QUITS, MODES, CLIENT CRAP, CLIENT NOTICES, ejust about evrythign other than chat |
| 18:45.44 | Urangst | aispark[m], theres one thats similar to mine |
| 18:45.45 | High | The only thing I ever see is people chat. That's it. |
| 18:45.55 | High | if anyone wants, I can shre my irssi ignore filters |
| 18:46.53 | Urangst | aispark[m], someone said on reddit "The raid controller isn't detected properly. You have to disable it." and "No, you won't have an issue after that except losing a drive cache for raid that doesn't work." |
| 18:46.57 | *** join/#debian wilbert (~wilbert@unaffiliated/wilbert) |
| 18:47.02 | *** mode/#debian [+l 1471] by debhelper |
| 18:47.05 | High | jelly: https://i.imgur.com/lxtTqhc.png prety clean, eh? |
| 18:47.32 | aispark[m] | Urangst: then its possible that you won't have much trouble with firmwarr |
| 18:47.35 | apollo13 | horribly annoying with that background^^ |
| 18:47.47 | High | choose your own background! :) |
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| 18:48.28 | Urangst | aispark[m], found another topic of someone trying ubuntu on it and they said is quite fine, just not good to install alongside windows |
| 18:48.47 | *** join/#debian diniwed (~gavron@ool-944c262b.dyn.optonline.net) |
| 18:48.48 | High | apollo13: know any good debian walls? |
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| 18:49.09 | High | Back in 2003/2004 I did some |
| 18:49.09 | apollo13 | for what? I generally do not see my background anyways |
| 18:49.38 | High | https://photos.app.goo.gl/Jfr9RszAHNEd0dfV2 <- first one I did |
| 18:50.00 | High | https://photos.app.goo.gl/rPxZuBKl1g28ceFg1 <- 2nd ever, messing around w/ gimp years ago |
| 18:50.16 | High | https://photos.app.goo.gl/Se0WU6j2hs66Rsdu2 <- his is my favorite one, Sunkist Orange |
| 18:50.26 | High | I love this one. Orange is the color of awsome trippy things. |
| 18:50.41 | apollo13 | I hate it, to much read, screams of danger |
| 18:50.46 | High | https://photos.app.goo.gl/QHHyItVY3CImJAlr1 <- my last piece, fractal stuff, debian rosey pink |
| 18:50.54 | High | you suck! :D |
| 18:51.06 | apollo13 | seriously, when red in a monitoring system means danger you don't want to see that on your desktop |
| 18:51.07 | aispark[m] | Urangst: yeah its OK |
| 18:51.17 | greycat | High: please take it to #debian-offtopic |
| 18:51.18 | High | haha, makes sense. |
| 18:51.43 | aispark[m] | Problem installing with windows would be just showing your Debian partition to windows boot manager |
| 18:52.26 | aispark[m] | You can use bcdedit command in cmd and fix it nothing else I know |
| 18:52.50 | annadane | Urangst, also you don't even need a full desktop environment if you want; some people use window managers |
| 18:52.59 | annadane | like i3 which is very keyboard driven and productivity focused |
| 18:53.00 | Urangst | aispark[m], ill try to test thing out and get used to the system in the VM and start to prepare the switch. probably will do it in 5-6 months or in the end of the year, or just when i have a good space of time to do it and can have time to setup my things up |
| 18:53.01 | *** join/#debian HarveyPwca (~HarveyPwc@ip-64-134-172-117.public.wayport.net) |
| 18:53.11 | annadane | it's less to install, if you really care about having a minimal system |
| 18:53.48 | Urangst | annadane, for the beggining i would like less trouble and not complicate too much, get used to terminal and the system before |
| 18:54.06 | Urangst | them i can test things around and personalize |
| 18:54.09 | Urangst | then* |
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| 18:55.26 | aispark[m] | annadane: i3wm has steep learning curve its a new world |
| 18:55.52 | aispark[m] | Great efficiency |
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| 18:56.32 | Urangst | found a topic with a wifi problem and the solution, im bookmarking them for later reading |
| 18:56.44 | *** join/#debian JohnML (~john1@ip-84-118-209-57.unity-media.net) |
| 18:56.50 | High | Xmonad is easy peasy. |
| 18:56.52 | aispark[m] | Urangst: good luck and BTW 5-6 months is long enough for full switch |
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| 18:57.16 | High | Just apt-get install Xmonad, set that as your default if you have more than one, and then just default setup is fine. |
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| 18:57.37 | High | Don't have to do anything but learn a few keys |
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| 18:58.07 | Urangst | aispark[m], yeah, the thing that is keeping me the most is that i have around 60-70GB of music in my main drive and my external HD is full, but i bought a 2TB one but probably will take 2 months to arrive. so i have to wait either way |
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| 19:00.09 | Urangst | aispark[m], oh, nice i just found a github page dedicated to linux on my notebook |
| 19:00.15 | annadane | that's a lot of music |
| 19:01.02 | Urangst | annadane, its because i like to keep lossless of my favorite things or the albums i think are really good. but most of the time i use spotify |
| 19:01.17 | jhutchins_wk | Urangst: One thing about Linux: don't go pasting commands you find on line or on IRC without at least having some idea what the command does. |
| 19:01.23 | annadane | ^^^^^^ |
| 19:01.31 | annadane | lot of bad information out there |
| 19:01.40 | Urangst | jhutchins_wk, yeah, im very careful about these things |
| 19:01.43 | annadane | !don't break debian |
| 19:01.44 | High | a good mp3 souns exactly the same subjectively to most people on average as does a lossless compression |
| 19:01.44 | dpkg | rumour has it, dont break debian is https://wiki.debian.org/DontBreakDebian |
| 19:02.27 | High | unless you have a soudn system or amplification that touches higher harmonics and clipping threshold, lossless won't matter. |
| 19:02.42 | jhutchins_wk | One of the biggest problems is that online docs often lack date/version information and old advice never gets cleaned up. |
| 19:02.43 | High | Only on audiphile professiona hardwre can you even tell a differnce, and only when the scale is large. |
| 19:03.09 | greycat | unless they compressed it with a stupidly low bitrate |
| 19:03.13 | High | On regular pc home theater stuff, yo ucant' tell. |
| 19:03.15 | High | unless that, sure. |
| 19:03.25 | Urangst | High, yes, for a daily routine thing when the music is just playing theres nothing much you can notice to justify the space lossless takes. but when youre home really just listening it there can be a huge difference |
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| 19:03.25 | High | but a good mp3 (by good I mean aressonable bitrate) |
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| 19:03.37 | High | hm. |
| 19:03.42 | greycat | is an Ogg Vorbis fan anyway |
| 19:03.46 | High | Perhaps. Perhaps not. |
| 19:04.08 | Urangst | High, i mean, i notice between lossless and spotify 320 kbps |
| 19:04.23 | Urangst | some are not day/night thing but some are |
| 19:04.28 | High | *nod* |
| 19:05.05 | rant | you certainly notice the bitrate difference even in headphones on a portable player |
| 19:05.32 | High | I've not noticed much a difference in many of my home theater setups between lossless and lossy. |
| 19:05.42 | *** join/#debian msantana (~darkstar@unaffiliated/darkstar) |
| 19:05.53 | High | Given the similr/same bitrate, they sound almost identical. I an't tell a diff. I've only been able to when I take it to concert level |
| 19:05.55 | Urangst | when youre rushing i really dont notice too much. but when its quite quiet you can hear things that got cut off on lossy |
| 19:05.58 | tw | codec comparison is drifting into debian-offtopic territory. |
| 19:06.05 | High | I used to work as sound engineer for a production company |
| 19:06.10 | High | stage sound stuff. |
| 19:06.29 | Urangst | tw: yeah, sorry |
| 19:06.31 | High | unless you have high end audiophile equipment, it's very difficult to tell the diff. |
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| 19:07.34 | Urangst | High, i got a pretty nice headphone but that just why i only keep lossless of things i really like to hear, the other stuff i dont care too much so i just use spotify |
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| 19:09.16 | Urangst | oh, other thing i remembered that i got stuck on ubuntu when i tried using it was that text editor or something like that. it opened when i was installing a package or something and i had to type some commands, add info, but i tried pressing the keys but nothing workded |
| 19:09.52 | Urangst | i think its called vim or im mistaking for something else |
| 19:10.04 | greycat | vim is a text editor, yes. Probably not the one you want to start with. |
| 19:10.05 | Urangst | theres like 2 years that happened |
| 19:10.19 | greycat | nano is easier for newbies, and is the default. |
| 19:10.25 | Urangst | greycat, i was the one that popped up |
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| 19:10.31 | Urangst | greycat, it** was the one that popped up |
| 19:10.36 | tw | If you want to change it, you can `sudo update-alternatives --config editor` |
| 19:10.40 | Urangst | i didnt install |
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| 19:10.57 | Urangst | probably was this nano one |
| 19:11.09 | tw | if keys didn't work, it was more likely vi or vim. |
| 19:11.09 | Urangst | opened inside the terminal |
| 19:11.23 | greycat | Stop agonizing over an Ubuntu install you did 2 years ago. |
| 19:11.36 | High | ugh. ubuntu. |
| 19:11.41 | High | cringes |
| 19:11.43 | greycat | We don't know what's different in Ubuntu. Just try a Debian 9 install. |
| 19:12.02 | Urangst | greycat, i mean its linux, it probably has this text editor thing in debian too |
| 19:12.19 | greycat | vim is AVAILABLE in Debian, but it's not the DEFAULT. The default is nano. |
| 19:12.23 | Urangst | if i had trouble with it in ubuntu ill probably have on debian too |
| 19:12.30 | greycat | No. Stop thinking that. |
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| 19:12.35 | High | vim isn't easy to learn. |
| 19:12.43 | High | It has a learning curve, but it's no different than any other language. |
| 19:12.52 | High | vim is basically a programming language for an editor |
| 19:12.53 | greycat | Whether it's easy to learn or not is irrelevant because you won't be exposed to it by default. |
| 19:12.57 | High | or editing text. |
| 19:13.02 | High | it's a language for editing text. |
| 19:13.04 | Urangst | so this nano, is like notepad++? |
| 19:13.06 | High | you can easily learn it. |
| 19:13.15 | High | notingl ike notepad++ |
| 19:13.21 | greycat | nano uses arrow keys and has a menu of control-keys for saving/exiting/etc. on the screen |
| 19:13.25 | rant | nano is like emac without any feaures :P |
| 19:13.26 | High | the way to learn vi is every day, little bits at a time. |
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| 19:13.33 | tw | Urangst: If you're having problems with ubuntu, there's #ubuntu, but you can't expect to have the same issues with a 2 years newer OS install, much less one from an entirely different group. |
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| 19:14.29 | Urangst | rant: im really new to linux i really dont know this stuff |
| 19:14.50 | greycat | Then try the Debian install in a VM and see how it goes. |
| 19:14.52 | annadane | everyone has to start somewhere. the important thing is just to be realistic about what you do and don't know |
| 19:14.57 | somiaj | Urangst: no need to worry about things that could happen. Until you actually install debian on your hardware and see what sort of things need to be configured/tweak. You learn by using, not by talking about stuff that may not even be an issue. |
| 19:15.00 | annadane | you don't need to be an overnight expert |
| 19:15.03 | High | vim is pretty dumb sometimes. |
| 19:15.13 | High | I'm on desktop, as most poeple have access to a mouse. |
| 19:15.15 | *** join/#debian Sansar (~Sansar@unaffiliated/sansar) |
| 19:15.20 | High | Drag cursor, click place cursor wher eyou want |
| 19:15.29 | somiaj | Urangst: the best way is to deal with the issues as you run into them, and here and google can be of great help for specific issues. |
| 19:15.31 | *** join/#debian luckman212 (~luckman21@unaffiliated/luckman212) |
| 19:15.32 | High | or ... you can lern vim and tpye som goofy commands to move 3 words ahead |
| 19:15.37 | Urangst | somiaj, good advice, thanks |
| 19:15.37 | High | it's the dumbest editor I've personally heard of |
| 19:15.48 | High | vim is, imho, moronic at best. |
| 19:15.51 | greycat | High: please take it to /dev/null |
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| 19:16.10 | *** join/#debian anoki (8eb193c6@gateway/web/freenode/ip.142.177.147.198) |
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| 19:16.30 | greycat | P.S. the command to move 3 words ahead in vi(m) is 3w |
| 19:16.48 | anoki | has anyone completed there LXO-103 - LXO-104 ? |
| 19:16.49 | High | 14 years, and you've not learned a damn thing, old man. I will happily get banned, but I will not be controlled or policed. |
| 19:16.55 | High | Have a grand day. |
| 19:17.02 | *** mode/#debian [+l 1481] by debhelper |
| 19:17.05 | *** mode/#debian [+o greycat] by ChanServ |
| 19:17.11 | *** mode/#debian [+q *!*@thestonedapes.com] by greycat |
| 19:17.14 | greycat | As you wish. |
| 19:17.23 | *** mode/#debian [-o greycat] by greycat |
| 19:17.25 | *** part/#debian High (~stoned@thestonedapes.com) |
| 19:17.52 | annadane | ,v lxo |
| 19:17.53 | judd | No package named 'lxo' was found in amd64. |
| 19:17.59 | annadane | anoki, is that a debian package? |
| 19:18.06 | tw | comptia certification or something. |
| 19:18.16 | annadane | so off topic for #debian, then |
| 19:18.38 | anoki | I'm looking for the newest linux+ PDF, my college bought crappy trios books that wont help me complete my certifications. |
| 19:18.58 | greycat | sounds more like a ##linux question, then |
| 19:19.27 | rant | anoki: last time I took it, it was based on Suse Enterprise |
| 19:19.34 | anoki | @annadane no it is the code name for 2 exams |
| 19:20.08 | anoki | okay ill try ##linux |
| 19:20.16 | anoki | thanks anyway |
| 19:21.50 | *** join/#debian saedelaere (~saedelaer@unaffiliated/saedelaere) |
| 19:22.57 | anoki | @rant now they touch on Suse, but its mainly fedora and ubuntu (ew) |
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| 19:25.57 | metastable | anoki: Unless it's been updated since I took those exams, it's very distro agnostic in most respects, aside from discussing yum vs. apt. |
| 19:26.08 | metastable | And from the current exam codes, they haven't been updated since I took them. |
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| 19:27.33 | Urangst | can you guys give me a hand with debian on a VM? or is this the wrong channel for that? |
| 19:27.54 | greycat | It's the right channel. |
| 19:27.58 | tw | Urangst: you're free to ask questions. This is the right place for that. |
| 19:28.04 | Mathisen | Urangst, ask away |
| 19:28.23 | anoki | @metasterable, thank you! I have been using linux for 10+ years but I want to do well on this certification |
| 19:28.51 | anoki | its just i go to a compucollege and the books they buy are garbage |
| 19:28.58 | Urangst | ok, im using virtualbox, debian 9 64bit. but the screen resolution is only available in 4:3 proportion |
| 19:29.06 | *** join/#debian naos62 (~naos62@unaffiliated/naos62) |
| 19:29.22 | metastable | anoki: Bear in mind that this IS off-topic for #debian. Also, it's not Twitter. Don't prefix names with @. |
| 19:29.24 | greycat | sounds like one of those things you need guest extensions for |
| 19:29.28 | Urangst | on the fedora VM the porportion works fine |
| 19:29.31 | Mathisen | Urangst, you probably missing guest addition in your debian install |
| 19:29.59 | anoki | okay sorry ill keep on topic |
| 19:30.07 | Urangst | greycat, Mathisen how do i install that? its using the terminal? |
| 19:30.40 | greycat | !vbox guest |
| 19:30.41 | dpkg | For Debian virtual machines ("guests") running under VirtualBox, install the virtualbox-guest-utils package inside the guest to provide Guest Additions; dependent Linux kernel modules are automatically built using <DKMS>. For Microsoft Windows guests, install the virtualbox-guest-additions-iso package on the host (ask me about <non-free sources>) and see https://virtualbox.org/manual/ch04.html for installation instructions. |
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| 19:31.09 | greycat | doesn't see a package named virtualbox-guest-utils :( |
| 19:31.20 | Mathisen | ,v virtualbox-guest-dkms |
| 19:31.21 | judd | Package: virtualbox-guest-dkms on amd64 -- wheezy: 4.1.42-dfsg-1+deb7u1; wheezy-security: 4.1.42-dfsg-1+deb7u1; wheezy-backports/contrib: 4.3.36-dfsg-1+deb8u1~bpo70+1; jessie/contrib: 4.3.36-dfsg-1+deb8u1; jessie-security/contrib: 4.3.36-dfsg-1+deb8u1; jessie-backports/contrib: 5.1.8-dfsg-6~bpo8+2; stretch-backports/contrib: 5.1.30-dfsg-1~bpo9+1; buster/contrib: 5.2.6-dfsg-2; |
| 19:31.22 | judd | sid/contrib: 5.2.6-dfsg-5 |
| 19:31.51 | greycat | dpkg, vbox guest =~ s/virtualbox-guest-utils/virtualbox-guest-dkms/ |
| 19:31.51 | dpkg | OK, greycat |
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| 19:32.04 | Urangst | i really dont understand what to do |
| 19:32.34 | greycat | Urangst: get to a terminal, get root, and then run "apt-get install virtualbox-guest-dkms linux-headers-$(uname -r)" |
| 19:33.04 | Urangst | where did you get all that info from? |
| 19:33.17 | Mathisen | there was one in here yesterday i belive with same issue, he ended upp installing the guest addition from the virtualbox-guest-iso that virtualbox provides. |
| 19:33.27 | bitess | virtualbox-guest-utils is there |
| 19:33.30 | greycat | From the bot's factoid, from Mathisen's correction of the package name, and from knowing how dkms works in general. |
| 19:33.34 | Urangst | how do get root? |
| 19:33.34 | bitess | ,v virtualbox-guest-utils |
| 19:33.35 | judd | Package: virtualbox-guest-utils on amd64 -- wheezy: 4.1.42-dfsg-1+deb7u1; wheezy-security: 4.1.42-dfsg-1+deb7u1; wheezy-backports/contrib: 4.3.36-dfsg-1+deb8u1~bpo70+1; jessie/contrib: 4.3.36-dfsg-1+deb8u1; jessie-security/contrib: 4.3.36-dfsg-1+deb8u1; jessie-backports/contrib: 5.1.8-dfsg-6~bpo8+2; stretch-backports/contrib: 5.1.30-dfsg-1~bpo9+1; buster/contrib: 5.2.6-dfsg-2; |
| 19:33.36 | judd | sid/contrib: 5.2.6-dfsg-5 |
| 19:33.56 | greycat | bitess: not in stretch apparently |
| 19:34.16 | tw | Urangst: either log in with the root password, use `su` and provide the root password, or use `sudo -i` with your user password (assuming it is configured for sudo) |
| 19:34.29 | bitess | because virtualbox is not in stretch. |
| 19:34.31 | Urangst | ok, ill try. tw |
| 19:34.47 | Urangst | writing su worked |
| 19:35.23 | bitess | it got removed together with virtualbox because it's built from the same source. |
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| 19:36.46 | Urangst | greycat, it returned the error: impossible to find the package virtualbox-guest-dkms |
| 19:37.01 | greycat | you need to add contrib and non-free to your sources, then |
| 19:37.02 | *** mode/#debian [+l 1473] by debhelper |
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| 19:37.23 | Urangst | how do i do that, greycat? |
| 19:37.29 | jelly | !non-free sources |
| 19:37.29 | dpkg | Edit /etc/apt/sources.list, ensure that the two main Debian mirror lines end with "main contrib non-free" rather than just "main", then «apt-get update». But bear in mind that you'll be installing <non-free> software. These may have onerous terms; check the licenses. See also <sources.list>. |
| 19:37.36 | greycat | run "nano /etc/apt/sources.list" and change the ending of each line from "main" to "main contrib non-free" and then save the file; then run apt-get update |
| 19:38.01 | Urangst | let me see if i can do that |
| 19:38.16 | bitess | if that's stretch you will also need to add stretch-backports |
| 19:38.27 | greycat | not for the -dkms package, he doesn't |
| 19:38.31 | greycat | that's why I changed the factoid |
| 19:38.32 | Urangst | opened a text editor |
| 19:38.54 | bitess | i don't see it in stretch |
| 19:38.54 | greycat | uh... I think? |
| 19:38.57 | greycat | shit |
| 19:39.05 | bitess | :D |
| 19:39.07 | greycat | ,v virtualbox-guest-dkms |
| 19:39.08 | judd | Package: virtualbox-guest-dkms on amd64 -- wheezy: 4.1.42-dfsg-1+deb7u1; wheezy-security: 4.1.42-dfsg-1+deb7u1; wheezy-backports/contrib: 4.3.36-dfsg-1+deb8u1~bpo70+1; jessie/contrib: 4.3.36-dfsg-1+deb8u1; jessie-security/contrib: 4.3.36-dfsg-1+deb8u1; jessie-backports/contrib: 5.1.8-dfsg-6~bpo8+2; stretch-backports/contrib: 5.1.30-dfsg-1~bpo9+1; buster/contrib: 5.2.6-dfsg-2; |
| 19:39.09 | judd | sid/contrib: 5.2.6-dfsg-5 |
| 19:39.20 | greycat | jesus, what... |
| 19:39.24 | Urangst | theres strecht written in those lines, greycat and bitess |
| 19:39.38 | Urangst | just before main |
| 19:40.36 | greycat | dpkg, vbox guest =~ s/virtualbox-guest-dkms package/virtualbox-guest-utils package (from stretch-backports)/ |
| 19:40.37 | dpkg | that's too long, greycat |
| 19:40.44 | Urangst | how do i paste in this thing? control-v doesnt work |
| 19:40.52 | greycat | stabs the bot with a stabbing thing |
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| 19:41.04 | Mathisen | Urangst, just write dont paste |
| 19:41.16 | Urangst | but can it be pasted? |
| 19:41.19 | Mathisen | Urangst, middle mouse button works otherwise |
| 19:41.21 | Urangst | theres some commands there |
| 19:41.35 | Urangst | i dont think i copied, lol |
| 19:41.40 | bitess | Urangst: ctrl + shift + v usually |
| 19:41.48 | Mathisen | if laptop press left and right mouse button same time |
| 19:42.00 | rant | greycat: wouldnt the dkms fail to work if the host wasnt running the same version of VB as the guest? |
| 19:42.26 | rant | and IIRC virtualbox was not in stretch due to some bugs.. |
| 19:42.41 | Mathisen | what bugs ? |
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| 19:43.05 | metastable | rant: Host not running the same version of VirtualBox as the guest? The guest doesn't run VB at all. |
| 19:43.05 | rant | I dont recall now off hand but I vaguely remember looking into it months ago |
| 19:43.07 | Urangst | bitess ctrL+shift+c dont seems to copy |
| 19:43.17 | greycat | dpkg, no, vbox guest is <reply>For Debian VMs (guests) under VirtualBox, install the virtualbox-guest-utils package (from <stretch-backports>) inside the guest to provide Guest Additions; Linux kernel modules are built automatically by <dkms>. For MS Windows guests, install the virtualbox-guest-additions-iso package on the host (see <non-free sources>) and see https://virtualbox.org/manual/ch04.html for |
| 19:43.19 | dpkg | okay, greycat |
| 19:43.23 | greycat | installation instructions. |
| 19:43.29 | rant | metastable: the guest runs the drivers for the virtualized hw |
| 19:44.04 | greycat | dpkg, vbox guest =~ s/html for/html for installation instructions./ |
| 19:44.04 | dpkg | OK, greycat |
| 19:44.06 | Urangst | greycat, how do i save this document? |
| 19:44.16 | greycat | nano puts a menu of control keys on the screen |
| 19:44.17 | metastable | rant: And? That doesn't require that the guest modules match the host's VB version. |
| 19:44.58 | rant | metastable: thats what I was asking.. I've had issues in the past where they didnt work.. I didnt know if that was still the case or not |
| 19:45.44 | _0x5eb_ | jelly, I managed to shrink my root FS by installing dropbear-initramfs cryptsetup and corrupting the root= argument of the kernel cmdline, dropping me a dropbear shell from initramfs ;) |
| 19:45.46 | rant | just wondering because I'm the one who handled the issue the other day that was mentioned.. where we ultimately used the iso |
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| 19:46.01 | Urangst | greycat, oh yes!!! i got it |
| 19:46.13 | Urangst | i saved the nano thingy |
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| 19:46.17 | Urangst | whohoo |
| 19:46.53 | greycat | While you were learning nano, I was informed that installing the vbox guest stuff is actually MUCH harder than originally expected. |
| 19:47.09 | greycat | Because for some reason the package was removed from stretch. |
| 19:47.36 | Mathisen | as i said before.. install it from the virtualbox-guest-iso that virtualbox host provides |
| 19:47.41 | Urangst | greycat, what do i do after apt-get update is finished? |
| 19:47.54 | *** join/#debian tempate (~alpha@unaffiliated/tempate) |
| 19:48.08 | greycat | Mathisen: feel free to take over here; I have no idea what you just said. |
| 19:48.45 | Urangst | i was having problems with 4:3 screen resolution |
| 19:48.50 | Mathisen | insert the guest-addition cd image in your virtualbox host from the " devices " menu in virtualbox |
| 19:48.52 | tempate | Hello. What is the best way to manage virtual machines in debian? I've been using Virtual Box for a long time now but I'm not to satisfied. My RAM use jumps when using it and the PC slows down a lot. Is there a better solution? |
| 19:49.41 | jelly | tempate: if you run active VMs you'll need that much more RAM, no way around that in any VM solution |
| 19:49.41 | Mathisen | step 2: apt-get install build-essential module-assistant |
| 19:49.55 | jhutchins_wk | tempate: vbox is pretty good, the nature of what you're doing means there's going to be a load. I've found vbox better than VMWare Player. |
| 19:50.00 | Mathisen | step 3: run the .sh file the virtualbox guest addition iso providies |
| 19:50.03 | Mathisen | and that is it |
| 19:50.08 | jelly | Mathisen: you think they don't have dkms support |
| 19:50.11 | jelly | ? |
| 19:50.12 | Urangst | Mathisen, that doesnt show up in the devices menu |
| 19:50.51 | tempate | jhutchins: I see. A friend of mine told me that it wasn't very good for some reason. I guess I made the wrong assumption. |
| 19:51.12 | Mathisen | Urangst, ? dont you have this " https://www.packtpub.com/sites/default/files/Article-Images/9140_04_06.png " |
| 19:51.25 | Mathisen | Urangst, you should have that option |
| 19:51.40 | rant | well vmware player is also only just that. .a player.. virtualbox actually lets you build vms |
| 19:51.52 | Urangst | Mathisen, oh yes, i tought it was in the optical disk option |
| 19:52.09 | Urangst | Mathisen, but i get a error on that option |
| 19:52.17 | Mathisen | Urangst, what error |
| 19:52.22 | *** join/#debian nic_ (~nic@190.175.59.51) |
| 19:52.26 | Urangst | Could not mount the media/drive 'C:\Program Files\Oracle\VirtualBox/VBoxGuestAdditions.iso' (VERR_PDM_MEDIA_LOCKED). |
| 19:52.32 | Urangst | E_FAIL (0x80004005) |
| 19:52.36 | Mathisen | yeah ignore that |
| 19:52.43 | Mathisen | run the the apt command |
| 19:53.00 | Mathisen | the show your output from " lsblk " |
| 19:54.35 | Urangst | Mathisen, it installed a bunch of things. now it finished |
| 19:55.02 | Mathisen | ok does " lsblk " show /dev/sr0 |
| 19:55.18 | Urangst | Mathisen, but i dont know what do in the step 3 you said |
| 19:55.55 | rant | step 3 depended on success of step 1 :P |
| 19:56.10 | Mathisen | yeah :) |
| 19:56.25 | Mathisen | but " lsblk " should show if it is mounted |
| 19:56.27 | greycat | So... back to trying for the -dkms package from stretch-backports now? |
| 19:56.39 | greycat | not yet, ok |
| 19:57.16 | Mathisen | Urangst, so look at the command output and say what it says to the right of sr0 |
| 19:57.35 | Urangst | i did apt-get install virtualbox-guest-dkms ..., what do i do after that? |
| 19:57.41 | rant | the dkms is a better option, I just recommended the iso yesterday or whenever that was because I was concerned about version incompatibilities with the host. but idk if thats still an issue or not |
| 19:58.16 | Urangst | im really lost now |
| 19:58.39 | Mathisen | Urangst, run " lsblk " |
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| 19:59.20 | Urangst | sr0 11:0 1 55,2M 0 rom /media/cdrom0 |
| 19:59.41 | Mathisen | Urangst, nice, so run " cd /media/cdrom0 " |
| 19:59.57 | Mathisen | and look what is in there run " ls " |
| 20:00.25 | Urangst | Mathisen, autorun.sh? |
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| 20:00.38 | tw | tempate: might be able to get some better memory resource efficiency by playing with autoballooning https://www.virtualbox.org/manual/ch09.html#vboxwatchdog |
| 20:01.08 | Mathisen | Urangst, is that all ? |
| 20:01.32 | Urangst | Mathisen, no theres other things. but you mentioned a .sh before i tought it was that |
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| 20:02.14 | Urangst | theres: 32bit, 64bit, autorun.inf, autorun.sh, cert |
| 20:02.41 | Mathisen | yeah run it " ./autorun.sh " |
| 20:02.50 | somiaj | Urangst: you shouldn't need to do that. I would not run that script. |
| 20:03.14 | somiaj | Urangst: dpkg -l | grep linux-headers (do you have the linux headers for your kernel installed), if not install them, apt install linux-headers-amd64 |
| 20:03.23 | Urangst | hhow can i see whats inside these things |
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| 20:06.02 | Mathisen | you can see what it does by opening the .sh with nano for example |
| 20:06.07 | Urangst | nano autorun.sh works |
| 20:06.35 | greycat | if you just want to read a file, less is better than nano |
| 20:07.14 | Urangst | greycat, whats is this less? a text reader? |
| 20:07.21 | greycat | it's called a "pager" |
| 20:07.27 | *** join/#debian deadrom (~Pauly@p5091EC24.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) |
| 20:07.31 | deadrom | hi |
| 20:07.32 | greycat | but sure, text reader is a good description |
| 20:08.18 | Mathisen | hello deadrom |
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| 20:08.33 | Urangst | greycat, how do i close this less? i wrote less --help now i cant exit |
| 20:08.39 | greycat | q |
| 20:08.43 | deadrom | when I ssh -X from 64b ubuntu to a 32b deb9 and run an GL program, it says "cannot find swrast", does it need swrast from the ubuntu or the debian machine? |
| 20:08.43 | *** join/#debian Evol (~no@191.190.201.227) |
| 20:08.46 | Urangst | thanks |
| 20:09.51 | tw | deadrom: on the machine running the GL program, so the deb9 machine. |
| 20:10.09 | Urangst | Mathisen, i cant run ./autorun.sh. i get a permssion denied |
| 20:10.13 | greycat | I kinda doubt running an OpenGL program over ssh -X is going to work very well |
| 20:10.45 | Mathisen | Urangst, sh autorun.sh |
| 20:10.51 | rant | deadrom: also, consider xpra for running single programs remotely.. it can work with ssh and allows deatching from the program without terminating among other things |
| 20:11.06 | Mathisen | deadrom, swrast is used for opengl to render in headless |
| 20:11.38 | deadrom | Mathisen, strange, the machine is not headless. has xfce. |
| 20:11.47 | rant | heh |
| 20:12.04 | Urangst | Mathisen, Error constructing proxy for org.gnome.Terminal:/org/gnome/Terminal/Factory0 |
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| 20:12.54 | Mathisen | Urangst, never seen that error..... |
| 20:13.35 | greycat | Time to try -dkms from stretch-backports yet? |
| 20:13.41 | Urangst | Mathisen, what else can i do? |
| 20:13.49 | tw | deadrom: generally speaking, you cannot use gpu hardware without connecting to the attached display server. There are exceptions to this rule, but it's pretty hard and fast in the most common cases. |
| 20:13.51 | Urangst | greycat, its that for me to try? |
| 20:14.06 | Mathisen | Urangst, please double chekced you dont got any other things "mounted" in the virtualbox host, any other isos for example |
| 20:15.24 | Urangst | Mathisen, in the devices thres only the guest image thing |
| 20:15.56 | Mathisen | Urangst, listen to greycat then. il just go and stand in a dark corner now a feel ashamed |
| 20:16.13 | annadane | another casuality of the grey cat |
| 20:16.21 | Urangst | Mathisen, ohh :(. Thanks for the help |
| 20:16.23 | greycat | I barely know anything about VMs. |
| 20:16.35 | greycat | !stretch-backports |
| 20:16.35 | dpkg | Some packages intended for Buster (Debian 10) but recompiled for use with Stretch (Debian 9) can be found in the stretch-backports repository. See http://backports.debian.org/Instructions/ . Ask me about <bdo>, <backports>. |
| 20:16.40 | Urangst | so what do i do greycat? |
| 20:16.51 | greycat | Urangst: start with http://backports.debian.org/Instructions/ |
| 20:17.02 | Urangst | inside the vm, greycat? |
| 20:17.06 | greycat | yes |
| 20:17.18 | greycat | I mean, you can read the web page on any computer, but perform the steps on the Debian install. |
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| 20:23.09 | Urangst | greycat, which package should i install on apt-get -t stretch-backports install "package" |
| 20:23.25 | Urangst | theres any way to list them in the terminal? |
| 20:23.41 | *** join/#debian pos (~pos@gateway/tor-sasl/pos) |
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| 20:24.01 | greycat | Let's start by trying "apt-get install -t stretch-backports virtualbox-guest-utils" |
| 20:24.11 | greycat | if that doesn't work, you may have to make still *another* change... |
| 20:24.52 | greycat | 'cause it looks like it's in contrib under backports, and the instruction page doesn't tell you to add contrib ... |
| 20:25.24 | Urangst | greycat, couldnt find the package |
| 20:25.34 | *** join/#debian nzhuk98 (nzhuk98@gateway/vpn/privateinternetaccess/nzhuk98) |
| 20:25.48 | greycat | OK, you'll need to edit your sources.list again, and on the stretch-backports line, change "main" to "main contrib non-free", then apt-get update again |
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| 20:29.14 | Urangst | greycat, worked now. its installed |
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| 20:30.06 | Urangst | do i restart the vm now? |
| 20:30.28 | greycat | This is the part I don't know. I don't use VMs. |
| 20:30.36 | Urangst | ok ill restart |
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| 20:31.34 | Urangst | greycat, how do find programs on the terminal? |
| 20:31.47 | Urangst | to install them |
| 20:32.30 | greycat | Partly you can just guess if you know the name. Or you can use "apt-cache search". Or you can search on http://packages.debian.org/ . Or google. Or you can ask here. |
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| 20:33.58 | Urangst | greycat, it worked, now it shows other resolutions |
| 20:34.05 | Urangst | let me see about this apt-cache |
| 20:34.41 | greycat | Might be a good time for you to learn about man pages, too. "man man" is one possible starting point. |
| 20:34.56 | Urangst | whats that? |
| 20:35.07 | annadane | type in your terminal, "man man" |
| 20:35.11 | annadane | man stands for "manual page" |
| 20:35.50 | greycat | man uses "less" to show the manual pages, which is another reason why it was important for you to learn about how to use less (and how to get out of it) |
| 20:36.05 | Urangst | oh tahnks |
| 20:36.23 | Urangst | i dont haeve much time now, so ill probably leave that for later today or tomorrow |
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| 20:37.55 | deadrom | rant, could use a hand with xpra |
| 20:38.56 | deadrom | installed both sides, ran xpra start ssh:user@host --start=program, returned... unknown format for display name: S11948 |
| 20:39.34 | deadrom | target log: Xorg did not provide a display number using -displayfd |
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| 20:45.14 | rant | deadrom: all I do is xpra start :100 --startchild=program then xpra attach ssh/user@host:port/:100 |
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| 20:46.22 | rant | it bitches at you isf you use a number less than 100 for the display number |
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| 20:51.36 | contrapumpkin | is sources.debian.org (or .net) expected to be down? |
| 20:51.51 | greycat | is it supposed to be up? what is it? |
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| 20:53.07 | contrapumpkin | hosts a bunch of debian-related source code (patches, etc.) as far as I can tell |
| 20:53.15 | contrapumpkin | or did until recently |
| 20:53.29 | contrapumpkin | not sure if there was an announcement I missed about it going down or being moved somewhere else |
| 20:54.14 | contrapumpkin | e.g., https://web.archive.org/web/20180216171524/https://sources.debian.org/ |
| 20:54.32 | jhutchins | !mirrorstatus |
| 20:54.38 | jhutchins | !mirror status |
| 20:54.39 | dpkg | Debian mirrors have timestamp files we use to determine how recently they have been updated. Here are some statistics the mirror maintainers provide: http://mirror.debian.org/status.html and http://ftp.de.debian.org/dmc/today/ Ask me about <mirrors>. #debian-mirrors on irc.oftc.net. |
| 20:56.19 | somiaj | contrapumpkin: might just have to wait until it comes back up. There might be a mailing list with info about the site. |
| 20:57.48 | contrapumpkin | looks like it's qa-debsources@lists.alioth.debian.org, which seems pretty dead |
| 20:58.00 | contrapumpkin | I'll see if I can find out who runs it |
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| 20:59.28 | deadrom | rant, you run xpra start on the target machine first? |
| 20:59.31 | somiaj | you can use deb-src lines to get access to the source packages, or download them from the tracker for the time. |
| 21:00.16 | rant | deadrom: usually, when I want it to work.. yeah.. heh |
| 21:01.02 | contrapumpkin | somiaj: ah yeah, not so concerned about losing the content. I just have an automated build process that tries to hit that server and it broke, so I was wondering :) |
| 21:01.05 | contrapumpkin | thanks though |
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| 21:01.13 | rant | deadrom: winswitch is a neat lookin app that seems to be an all around all-os kinda app for this kinda stuff, wraps nx, xpra, vnc, etc.. but despite being rather graphical I cant really figure it out. |
| 21:02.08 | deadrom | no windows here |
| 21:02.55 | deadrom | sorry I cant make this work, I started xpra now in daemon mode and connected from here, does not work, says "connection lost". ill lookk once more at the daemon log... |
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| 21:04.35 | rant | idk I havent used it extensively, but it does have GUI setup tools as welll the way I've used it is just as I described. I ssh in and xpra start :100 --startchild=program then axpra attach ssh/huser@host:port/:display |
| 21:05.07 | deadrom | startchild s wrong to begin with, does not work |
| 21:05.33 | rant | --start-child= |
| 21:05.43 | somiaj | contrapumpkin: I would just wait, but if it is down for a while, then might be worth sending an admin a ping. |
| 21:07.24 | rant | deadrom: all I know is this program blew me away.. I was running Windows 7 in Virtualbox on an orange pi lite over a shotty hotspot .. and it was smooth |
| 21:07.33 | deadrom | could not connect to X server on display ':100' after 3 seconds |
| 21:07.40 | *** join/#debian matu (~matu@2a02:aa13:8202:6880:f2de:f1ff:fe20:b14e) |
| 21:07.42 | matu | Hi |
| 21:07.52 | annadane | hi, matu |
| 21:07.59 | rant | deadrom: are you starting one on ":100 |
| 21:08.07 | deadrom | <PROTECTED> |
| 21:08.31 | matu | The developpers of the open source are wonderful, i was unable to use my 3440x1440 minotir on my Lenovo X201 (an old laptop that was supposed to be able to support 2560x1440 max) |
| 21:08.40 | greycat | sounds like jessie or earlier... |
| 21:08.48 | matu | i updated my debian and plugged the monitor, and my monotir works completely |
| 21:09.02 | toli | Today I had a strange feeling using Debian, where I was always expecting to do whatever I want with it. |
| 21:09.38 | matu | This is completely crazy, on the lenovo website and forum they all say it has 2560x1440 capability max |
| 21:09.43 | matu | because the laptop is old |
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| 21:10.00 | matu | but with Debian it works !!!!!!!!!! |
| 21:10.08 | matu | this is wonderful |
| 21:10.30 | deadrom | matu, could be it sacrifices max frame rate. Raspis can well do 4K for example but only at 30fps max |
| 21:10.50 | deadrom | matu, but keep up the cheers for open src ;) |
| 21:11.05 | matu | i have 60fps, on the 100hz monitor but i dont care i just want to use my fanless and light laptop on this screen |
| 21:11.18 | deadrom | matu, 3440x1440 - LG 21:9? |
| 21:11.23 | matu | with |
| 21:11.31 | matu | no aoc agon |
| 21:11.57 | matu | it was on sale my old and still working monitor was a Iiyama 1920x1080¬60hz |
| 21:12.11 | matu | It still works but it gave me some headaches when i was playing |
| 21:12.21 | matu | but it is ok if you work with the monitor |
| 21:12.22 | toli | A guy was somehow converted his harddrive of 6TB to MBR from Win10, he use to install Win10 on his SSD, where the installation created its boot partition table to the 6TB drive. No way to convert it GPT or what ever. I took the disk connected it to my USB sata interface, and the system only saw 1 partition of 2TB, no way to convert it or do what ever with Debian, fdisk and gparted. I had to use Windows VM to convert the disk to GPT and fix it:) |
| 21:12.28 | toli | strange isnt it |
| 21:12.56 | matu | Iiyama E2403WS |
| 21:13.14 | toli | what is the biggest HDD debian can read out of the box? |
| 21:13.31 | matu | but this is just wonderful i can use it on this screen, if anyone can bring me an information about it would be very appreciated |
| 21:13.40 | JustASlacker | debian is not limiting disc size in any way |
| 21:13.42 | matu | any |
| 21:14.06 | JustASlacker | you run out of money before debian runs out of manageable disks |
| 21:14.09 | matu | did they hack the driver ? |
| 21:14.11 | matu | wtf ? |
| 21:14.18 | toli | JustASlacker, then how do you explain that I wasnt able to identify the partition |
| 21:14.25 | JustASlacker | gremlins |
| 21:14.49 | toli | JustASlacker, love it :) |
| 21:14.52 | deadrom | matu, enjoy your hardware, if you need to know, read the driver src code. it's less mystery than you think. |
| 21:14.54 | JustASlacker | ^_^ |
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| 21:15.39 | deadrom | toli, no limit, but if linux thinks it is MBR not GPT because the disk announces it it will run with what it can calc from the data. |
| 21:16.46 | matu | i did not practice C for a very long time and i did not have the skill at that time |
| 21:17.02 | deadrom | toli, I think win10 uses this weird system partition as a stub and then loads all drivers from there and just ignores what the disks thinks or the uefi or whoever. sounds like classic "we are MS and assume we are all there is" stunt |
| 21:17.10 | matu | but the dev that corrected it is just excellent |
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| 21:20.44 | deadrom | matu, X201, so Intel GMA HD 5700MHD, so #intel-gfx will appreciate your praise and might give you the insight |
| 21:20.46 | tw | toli: You could always do it again and dump the MBR, then math-out the partition size (hint, max partition for MBR with 512-byte sectors is 2TB) |
| 21:21.05 | deadrom | it's not like they got *that* lot of that :D |
| 21:21.18 | metastable | That's not how Windows 10 functions at all, but okay. |
| 21:21.18 | *** mode/#debian [+o eir] by ChanServ |
| 21:21.19 | JustASlacker | when is the disk heavier |
| 21:21.19 | *** mode/#debian [-qo *!*@thestonedapes.com eir] by eir |
| 21:21.26 | JustASlacker | when the disk is full or when its empty |
| 21:21.45 | daemon | blinks |
| 21:21.50 | NEOalquimista | jelly: regarding that error, I see it through dmesg. |
| 21:22.02 | Mathisen | toli, mbr can only use 2TB max partition size , win or linux dont mather |
| 21:22.20 | Mathisen | toli, also win10 has now days the " convert gpt " command to easly convert without data los |
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| 21:23.10 | deadrom | JustASlacker, well, as ordering magnetic patterns means destroying local entrophy which can me calculated into energy, thus into mass we can establish that a full magnetic disk is actually lighter than one on the full state of entropy - unless it was bought as a certified media enterprise disk from the beginning, of course |
| 21:23.19 | metastable | Mathisen: That's only correct for disks with 512-byte sectors. |
| 21:23.41 | JustASlacker | deadrom: thanks |
| 21:24.13 | NEOalquimista | jelly: this Arch user saw the same error and they had screen flickering too: https://bbs.archlinux.org/viewtopic.php?id=211399 |
| 21:26.26 | Mathisen | metastable, so how would you make a bigger parition ? |
| 21:26.38 | Mathisen | partition* |
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| 21:27.28 | bitess | NEOalquimista: did you try the fix they suggest? |
| 21:27.39 | Mathisen | metastable, without using gtp,lvm that is |
| 21:27.46 | contrapumpkin | somiaj: up again :) thanks again |
| 21:27.51 | Mathisen | gpt* |
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| 21:28.46 | metastable | Mathisen: If the disk uses 4k sectors, you can simply make it. In theory, MBR supports 16TiB partitions using 4k sectors. Whether that's supported by your BIOS, etc., is another question entirely. |
| 21:29.32 | Mathisen | metastable, i never heard of this.. or seen it used.. would it not just be easyer to use gpt as intended |
| 21:29.45 | metastable | Mathisen: Oh, definitely. I use GPT regardless of disk size. |
| 21:29.55 | NEOalquimista | bitess: i will do it now. Just for the record, their symptoms are not exactly like mine. But whatever. Breaking is fun. |
| 21:30.06 | Mathisen | metastable, anyway new info for me, thanks for the lesson |
| 21:30.58 | metastable | Mathisen: The underlying reason is that MBR deals with sector allocations, and is limited to 2^32 sectors. If those seconds are 512b in size, you get 2TiB. 4K sectors yields eight times as much. |
| 21:31.06 | metastable | s/seconds/sectors/ |
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| 21:33.41 | toli | Mathisen, Then I would have to calculate the size manually in order to be able eventually to repair this kind of disks then? |
| 21:33.59 | toli | Mathisen, on Linux I mean |
| 21:35.18 | Mathisen | toli, what is you exact problem with the disk? |
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| 21:37.26 | Mathisen | that you only seeing 2tb of the 6 that it should ? do i understand it correct ? |
| 21:40.03 | toli | Mathisen, the disk was converted to MBR from windows. we couldnt convert it from windows back to GPT, as windows installation created the boot part on that disk, so I said OK, bring it on. I plugged it to my debian, and then I saw that disk had only 1 partition, and I cannot convert the MBR to GPT. I had to do this with a Windows machine |
| 21:41.10 | Mathisen | so... you have solved the issue then |
| 21:41.43 | toli | Mathisen, yes, but I was frustrated from the fact that I wasn't able to fix it with my Debi |
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| 21:43.57 | Mathisen | im sure there is ways to convert in linux also without data loss, but i would have done it win also if win had its boot partition on it.. would have used diskparted there and convert gpt |
| 21:44.14 | Mathisen | windows dont play along well with the other kids as we all know |
| 21:44.26 | metastable | Converting a bootable MBR disk to GPT? |
| 21:45.32 | Mathisen | metastable, yes |
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| 21:46.06 | metastable | Mathisen: It gets hairy because there's no post-MBR cap for GRUB on GPT. It would require reducing a partition and moving it over to make room for a BIOS boot parittion. |
| 21:48.14 | toli | guys, I didn't wanted to keep any data on it, I had just to initialize it, thats it, Gparted didn't gave me the option |
| 21:48.46 | Mathisen | metastable, yeah and the win commands does this automaticly |
| 21:49.26 | Mathisen | toli, ohh then it is totaly diffrent. gparted has option for this |
| 21:49.53 | toli | what option? I didn't found any |
| 21:50.56 | Mathisen | toli, under devices create partiton table |
| 21:51.25 | toli | I did it :) and it stayed as 2TB |
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| 21:53.06 | Mathisen | im not a computer now with multiple hd.s but if you would have removed the old partition table and created a new one you could have made it gpt and used bigger then 2TB |
| 21:53.27 | toli | hmm |
| 21:53.29 | jhutchins_wk | toli: Microsoft plays fast and loose with standards. It's one of the dangers of NTFS, and I believe they have a new filesystem as of W10. |
| 21:53.41 | metastable | Nope. Still NTFS. |
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| 21:53.54 | jhutchins_wk | toli: I know for a while you couldn't use Linux tools to resize the Windows partitions, you had to use the Windows Disk Manager. |
| 21:54.03 | toli | yeah still ntfs |
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| 21:54.13 | jhutchins_wk | Yes, but WHICH ntfs? |
| 21:54.20 | *** join/#debian rflec028 (~rflec028@142.118.122.40) |
| 21:54.32 | jhutchins_wk | There's more than one variant. |
| 21:55.10 | Mathisen | jhutchins_wk, version 3.1 to be specific |
| 21:55.16 | Mathisen | and that has been used sense XPP |
| 21:55.18 | Mathisen | XP* |
| 21:55.27 | Mathisen | anyway maybe offtopic in here |
| 21:55.32 | toli | :) |
| 21:56.43 | jhutchins_wk | If it were possible to identify the variant reliably we wouldn't have had problems with NTFS drivers. MS obfuscates the differences. |
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| 21:57.34 | rflec028 | ...are there any reeeally important channels on Freenode that I should join, as a newcomer, for important announcements and junk? |
| 21:57.49 | rflec028 | (Sorry, not totally on topic.) |
| 21:57.53 | annadane | debian related? not really |
| 21:58.02 | annadane | there's a few mailing lists |
| 21:58.43 | annadane | debian-security-announce@lists.debian.org being a good one |
| 21:58.52 | jhutchins_wk | rflec028: The important announcements go to the lists. IRC doesn't reach people who are off-line. |
| 21:59.42 | toli | But on NTFS you can more easily recover formated partitions, and recover the files and folder structures, where on EXT you cant |
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| 21:59.57 | rflec028 | jhutchins_wk: annadane: thanks. |
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| 22:01.03 | Mathisen | toli, testdisk/photorec does support ext |
| 22:01.26 | toli | Yes, yes, I have recovered all my files, but not the folder structure :) |
| 22:02.21 | toli | this is the worst, I have all my pictures, and video since ages that I have, but they are all in 1 folder |
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| 22:02.31 | toli | no names., nothing |
| 22:02.40 | toli | just 123123871238.jpeg |
| 22:02.49 | toli | numers, and numbers |
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| 22:03.11 | annadane | and also email is permanent |
| 22:03.18 | annadane | irc depends on whether you're in the channel |
| 22:03.23 | annadane | and paying attention |
| 22:04.09 | annadane | there's also the point releases but for important security stuff you wouldn't want to just wait until 9.x |
| 22:04.32 | Mathisen | annadane, well there is way to keep track lick notices and highlight can be saved and showed for later if you use a bnc and irccloud works greate on your phone to keep track of channles |
| 22:05.26 | annadane | yeah but... why |
| 22:05.35 | jhutchins_wk | toli: Most digital photos have metadata that a good graphics program can read. It's a lot of work, but you can do it. It could probably be scripted to pull dates or geolocations. |
| 22:06.27 | toli | jhutchins_wk, Yes, I know, I already separated the pictures in folders by year |
| 22:06.41 | toli | but 30% have no meta |
| 22:13.35 | jhutchins_wk | The dificulty of recovering files on EXT is in one way a positive thing: It encourages you to have backups. |
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| 22:22.47 | Mathisen | speaking of backups, what do you people use for that? i use borg |
| 22:24.03 | annadane | i do it manually but other options in the oss world include rsync and ansible |
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| 22:28.00 | toli | Mathisen, Is borg just taking your system image? or is sort of file backup? |
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| 22:29.18 | Mathisen | more like a file backup. it compress the files and encrypts them, ofc it is incremental so it dont copy files that has not been changed or added |
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| 22:40.56 | Mathisen | https://github.com/npm/npm/issues/19883 |
| 22:41.22 | Mathisen | "Critical Linux filesystem permissions are being changed by latest version" |
| 22:43.09 | syrius | it's a feature |
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| 22:47.50 | RoyK | syrius: looks like a strange feature |
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| 23:00.49 | Bliepo32 | Hello everyone, I have a network card (HP NC375T PCI Express Quad Port Gigabit Server Adapter) that uses the netxen firmware package, but it doesn't work |
| 23:01.14 | Bliepo32 | There are official HP drivers for RHEL and SUSE, will those work on Debian? |
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| 23:17.58 | somiaj | Bliepo32: I would try the firmware-netxen package from non-free, that might be enough. |
| 23:18.09 | somiaj | I would first try to solve the issue using software from inside of debian |
| 23:18.22 | Bliepo32 | somiaj I tried, and even tried backports, but no luck |
| 23:19.01 | somiaj | How does hp provide the drivers, are they a module you ahve to compile against a kernel? |
| 23:19.19 | Bliepo32 | Binary |
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| 23:20.02 | somiaj | usually the binary needs to be compiled against the kernel, you can install build-essential and linux-headers-amd64 (or the relvenant kernel) |
| 23:21.29 | Bliepo32 | I feared as much - so trying to match the binary that was compiled to a kernel close in terms of version numbers won't do the trick then? |
| 23:23.01 | somiaj | usually not. When you used the firmware, what sort of errors do you get with the card? |
| 23:23.33 | Bliepo32 | error getting board config info |
| 23:24.35 | somiaj | only hits I'm getting about that chipset seem to be older, so unsure what to suggest. |
| 23:25.19 | Bliepo32 | Yeah, I pretty much scoured the net, but no luck |
| 23:25.23 | Bliepo32 | Thanks for the help |
| 23:25.45 | Bliepo32 | I just looked into it and the binaries are only for 3.x kernels and I'm on 4.x |
| 23:25.57 | Bliepo32 | So that's not gonna work |
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