| 00:16.53 | JeffM | so MsgKilled includes the shot ID, is it safe to ignore any endshots from players that don't have shield, or the shot isn't thief? |
| 00:17.48 | JeffM | I can send the endshot with the killed message in all other cases. |
| 00:18.00 | JeffM | if you aren't killed, the shot doesn't end :) |
| 00:23.15 | blast007 | GM sends endshot as well |
| 00:23.38 | JeffM | ok, so that one too |
| 00:29.04 | JeffM | still the idea is to have the server only send endshots when it knows it's valid. |
| 01:00.55 | JeffM | I'm going to give flags, API events, pickup, drop, shooting, hit with, and dropped |
| 01:01.19 | JeffM | and shield can just set the hit immunity property of the server player. |
| 01:01.52 | JeffM | then I'll accept an end shot only if they had sheid, or a valid shot type |
| 01:20.04 | *** join/#bzflag infobot (ibot@rikers.org) |
| 01:20.04 | *** topic/#bzflag is https://BZFlag.org || http://ohloh.net/p/bzflag || https://bzflag.org/help || Channel Logs: http://infobot.rikers.org/%23bzflag/ || 2.4.12 released! https://forums.bzflag.org/viewtopic.php?f=62&t=19720 |
| 01:20.04 | *** mode/#bzflag [+v infobot] by ChanServ |
| 01:49.40 | *** join/#bzflag rodgort (~rodgort@68.ip-149-56-14.net) |
| 02:36.32 | *** join/#bzflag a_meteorite (~a_meteori@unaffiliated/ameteorite/x-000000001) |
| 03:52.38 | *** mode/#bzflag [-v Foo_man_choo] by ChanServ |
| 05:04.09 | *** join/#bzflag a_meteor_ (~a_meteori@unaffiliated/ameteorite/x-000000001) |
| 05:46.23 | JeffM | when you geno someone, do you get a point for each team member? |
| 10:15.20 | *** join/#bzflag brlcad (~sean@104.225.5.10) |
| 13:13.22 | blast007 | JeffM: yeah, for each that's alive |
| 15:50.38 | *** join/#bzflag spldart (~spldart@bzflag/contributor/spldart) |
| 15:50.38 | *** mode/#bzflag [+v spldart] by ChanServ |
| 16:20.09 | JeffM | There has to be more to scoring than this, it feels like I'm missing something https://www.irccloud.com/pastebin/K3nn5a45/ |
| 16:29.16 | *** join/#bzflag TimRiker (~TimRiker@bzflag/projectlead/TimRiker) |
| 16:29.16 | *** mode/#bzflag [+o TimRiker] by ChanServ |
| 16:38.09 | allejo | what about /kill |
| 16:38.24 | JeffM | does that grant score? |
| 16:38.33 | allejo | or WW (destroyed by server) or death physics |
| 16:38.38 | JeffM | that is not all the ways to die, all the ways to score!. |
| 16:38.49 | JeffM | death and score are seperate |
| 16:39.01 | JeffM | WW has a killer of null |
| 16:39.08 | *** join/#bzflag nadir (uid134094@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-zigivelbzapweipo) |
| 16:39.17 | JeffM | same for physics and all that |
| 16:39.36 | JeffM | physics and water are there own BlowedUpReason |
| 16:39.43 | allejo | ohhhh |
| 16:39.48 | JeffM | this is JUST score |
| 16:39.52 | JeffM | the death is done elsewhere |
| 16:40.18 | JeffM | and it's just player score not team score |
| 16:41.32 | JeffM | that is a delegate inside BZFS.StandardRuleset that gets installed into the player manager to do whatever needs to happen for scoring when someone dies. |
| 16:41.41 | JeffM | think of it like a function pointer |
| 16:41.59 | allejo | does GotRunOver apply to steamroller or just BU? |
| 16:42.10 | JeffM | both I belive |
| 16:42.18 | JeffM | death by touch, with no shot |
| 16:42.50 | JeffM | does the person killing the BU player still get the point? |
| 16:50.00 | JeffM | The death code is a bit more complicated. https://www.irccloud.com/pastebin/IC9LYszk/ |
| 16:51.07 | blast007 | yes, the person killing a burrowed player gets the point (and you can kill a player even if they drop the burrow flag if they haven't completely unburrowed yet) |
| 16:51.34 | JeffM | cool, then they wil still have the run over death reason |
| 16:51.46 | blast007 | yup |
| 16:52.43 | JeffM | I have shot tracking events, you can tell how many shots expired vs how many hit, and build up accuracy info for people :) |
| 17:02.58 | JeffM | blast007: did you figure out where you want me to write up protocol notes? |
| 17:03.19 | blast007 | not yet |
| 17:03.33 | JeffM | hopes he does not forget them |
| 17:03.45 | blast007 | you could throw them into a google doc for now, if you want |
| 17:04.20 | blast007 | they'll end up either being a one or more github issues, or at least notes/cards on a github project |
| 17:13.05 | allejo | we could start them off as a monolithic github issue and then split things up from there, no? |
| 17:39.01 | blast007 | sure |
| 17:41.02 | JeffM | wherever you want me to put them |
| 17:41.22 | JeffM | could do one general issue, then add comments for each specific thing |
| 18:48.36 | JeffM | blast007: did you know there are 6 different ways that strings are packed in BZFLag? |
| 18:51.15 | JeffM | https://docs.google.com/document/d/151M1NGDo6ubqr6WY6Vo_vARAS7bopSCWb_TOAoK9hLw/edit?usp=sharing |
| 18:53.52 | *** join/#bzflag dngor (abuse@p3m/dngor) |
| 19:03.05 | JeffM | those are the ones I can remember off the top of my head. |
| 19:16.44 | JeffM | someone should probably search the last month of logs for the term "proto" |
| 21:12.12 | *** join/#bzflag bertman (~bert@unaffiliated/bertman) |
| 21:29.03 | JeffM | allejo: what admin is is there for /kill? |
| 21:29.10 | JeffM | admin use I mean |
| 21:29.54 | allejo | players stuck in map objects and don't know about self-destruct? |
| 21:30.17 | allejo | kill a player who cares a lot about their rampage/score? |
| 21:30.24 | JeffM | so crappy maps with dumb people :) |
| 21:30.30 | allejo | no *real* admin use imo |
| 21:30.34 | spldart | A win win |
| 21:30.40 | JeffM | well the last one is mean, so no need for that |
| 21:30.50 | JeffM | ok, I'll leave it out for now, it can be a plugin if anyone needs it. |
| 21:31.23 | allejo | sounds fair to me |
| 21:31.36 | JeffM | I think I'm up to a whopping 4 / commands :) |
| 21:42.46 | allejo | :O |
| 21:46.18 | JeffM | got /date /time /kick and /ban |
| 21:46.22 | JeffM | what else do you need? |
| 21:52.22 | JeffM | well I gueess /me as well, but that's a special case. |
| 21:52.34 | JeffM | it should have never been a server handled /command in the first place |
| 21:58.54 | allejo | what about /mute and /set or /shutdownserver |
| 21:59.00 | allejo | or /poll |
| 21:59.29 | allejo | though, i'd love to see a bzfs with only /date and /time available :p |
| 22:03.33 | JeffM | plugins :) |
| 22:03.44 | JeffM | well modules that I'll write later |
| 22:04.10 | JeffM | the player has data for if it can talk, command, or play |
| 22:04.18 | JeffM | so something just needs to set them |
| 22:04.32 | JeffM | and I'm not so sure how much I like the idea of /set |
| 22:04.45 | JeffM | as a raw command it is very overpowered |
| 22:05.03 | JeffM | I may implement something that lets you swap between var sets with a single command |
| 22:05.09 | JeffM | but the values are predefined. |
| 22:05.22 | JeffM | what is the most common use of /set? |
| 22:07.45 | blast007 | JeffM: I use /kill when someone is running their team flag to the enemy |
| 22:08.07 | JeffM | so for social problems |
| 22:08.14 | JeffM | not techincal prroblems |
| 22:08.29 | blast007 | mostly |
| 22:08.39 | JeffM | then it can be an optional module. |
| 22:08.49 | JeffM | CrapPlayerTools.DLL |
| 22:08.56 | allejo | /flag take |
| 22:09.08 | JeffM | sounds like the same thing |
| 22:09.18 | blast007 | allejo: then they're still near the flag |
| 22:09.30 | allejo | ah true |
| 22:10.04 | allejo | so when you say modules, jeffm. are /date /time /kick and /ban already modules? and the rest of the commands just need to be added in as modules too? |
| 22:10.18 | allejo | or are those commands "hard coded" into your server? |
| 22:10.46 | JeffM | so there are modules and plugins |
| 22:10.54 | JeffM | modules are loaded from a folder |
| 22:11.00 | JeffM | every module in there is always loaded |
| 22:11.11 | JeffM | plugins are individualy defined in the config |
| 22:11.15 | JeffM | like current bzflag |
| 22:11.28 | JeffM | modules implment major portions of the server |
| 22:11.35 | *** join/#bzflag spldart (~spldart@bzflag/contributor/spldart) |
| 22:11.35 | *** mode/#bzflag [+v spldart] by ChanServ |
| 22:11.38 | JeffM | specificly things that are not part of the raw network protocol |
| 22:12.00 | JeffM | slash commans are built on top of MsgMessage, so they are not inhernetly part of the bzfs protocl |
| 22:12.13 | JeffM | so one module is SlashCommands. |
| 22:12.22 | JeffM | that module implements /date and /time |
| 22:12.34 | blast007 | so if modules are always loaded, what would an "optional module" mean? a compile-time option? |
| 22:12.34 | JeffM | but it also provides the slash command registration system to other modules |
| 22:12.58 | JeffM | something someone threw in the folder, or loaded as a plugin, basicly not provided by the base install |
| 22:13.09 | JeffM | remember, this does NOT need to be built on the target system tor un |
| 22:13.34 | JeffM | you can turn a plugin into a module just by throwing it in the folder |
| 22:13.45 | JeffM | the distinction is mostly conceptual |
| 22:13.58 | JeffM | some modules are pretty much required |
| 22:14.10 | JeffM | like the one that does scoring, otherwise nobody gets a score on a kill. |
| 22:14.24 | JeffM | the protcol allows that, but it would not be a fun game :) |
| 22:14.44 | JeffM | so there is another module, PlayerAdministration |
| 22:14.53 | JeffM | that one registers the /kick and /ban commands |
| 22:15.02 | JeffM | beause it is the thing that handles the permission system |
| 22:15.17 | JeffM | and you need permissions to do /kick and ban |
| 22:15.30 | JeffM | permissions are not part of the protocol so they go into modules |
| 22:15.36 | blast007 | can modules/plugins depend on other modules/plugins? |
| 22:15.40 | JeffM | yeah |
| 22:16.02 | JeffM | PlayerAdmin has a reference to the SlashCommand module |
| 22:16.28 | JeffM | I have an assembly resolver and scan the folder before I load them to handle any dependency issues. |
| 22:16.58 | JeffM | modules exist mostly to make maintenance of the system simpler |
| 22:17.09 | JeffM | so all the stuff relating to permisions is in one project |
| 22:17.28 | JeffM | all the stuff for random flag spawning will be in one module, etc.. |
| 22:17.34 | JeffM | same for random worlds |
| 22:18.04 | JeffM | pllugins are expected to work in concert with the modules, not replace them |
| 22:18.35 | JeffM | there are events that are triggered for different things that happen, and plugins can hook into those events to modify the results of the module logic. |
| 22:20.02 | JeffM | but for instance if you did want a totaly custom scoring mechanism, you could replace the score delegate with one in a plugin, serverInstance.State.Players.ComputeScores = ComputeMyStupidScores |
| 22:21.13 | JeffM | there is a StandardRuleset module that is always built that does the BZFlag "stuff", scores, default BZDB values, what happens when you are hit wile carying a shield flag, etc... |
| 22:22.34 | JeffM | BadWords is probably the module that would get overriden/extended most |
| 22:22.54 | JeffM | it's just doing a super dumb search right now |
| 22:24.54 | JeffM | /me is the only slash command I directly check for |
| 22:45.14 | allejo | is /me handled by the server? does that mean I can override it in a plugin in current bzfs? |
| 22:46.29 | allejo | so would a plugin essentially be a module that isn't loaded by default but instead needs to be explicitly loaded? |
| 22:46.50 | allejo | so I could toss a plugin in to the module folder and it'll always be loaded? |
| 22:47.03 | JeffM | /me is a mess |
| 22:47.24 | JeffM | I mention this in my proto docs :) |
| 22:47.40 | allejo | needs to read that tonight |
| 22:47.44 | JeffM | yes plugins must be specially loaded, |
| 22:47.50 | JeffM | they are also always loaded after modules. |
| 22:47.58 | JeffM | and modules can't be unloaded. |
| 22:48.17 | JeffM | yeah throw it in modules and it'll always load up before any other plugin |
| 22:48.45 | JeffM | so /me is sent as chat to the server as /me does something stupid |
| 22:48.58 | JeffM | server detects /me REALY fast |
| 22:49.08 | JeffM | lops off the " /me " |
| 22:49.31 | JeffM | then sets the "is action" boolean that is part of the MsgMessage that is sent out |
| 22:49.48 | JeffM | inbound MsgMessages are packed differently than outbound MsgMessages |
| 22:50.18 | JeffM | so there is an "this message should be displayed as an action" bool on messages |
| 22:50.25 | JeffM | but it's NOT sent by the client, only the server |
| 22:51.16 | JeffM | yet all the other message data is required to be pre-processed by the client, like destination, or team etc.. |
| 22:51.19 | JeffM | but no... not /me |
| 22:52.04 | JeffM | I think the v2.4 protocol half-ass upgraded the old /me |
| 22:52.16 | JeffM | IIRC it was entirely processed by the server, but people wanted special display on the client |
| 22:52.25 | JeffM | so the display bit was added to the outbound |
| 22:53.13 | allejo | i can help but feel that the design decisions here were questionable |
| 22:59.04 | BulletCatcher | It seems like it would be simpler to process /me in the client, allowing the server to simply pass it through unmodified and without any special case in the network protocol. |
| 22:59.44 | blast007 | we certainly don't need a separate ActionMessage permission like we have now |
| 23:03.34 | JeffM | BulletCatcher: that is my suggestion, just have the client set the 'isAction' bit on the inbound message. that way the client could later decide a better interface for setting it than /me |
| 23:04.40 | JeffM | allejo: this is why I ask questions and implement what is actually needed, not just what the old code did :) |
| 23:05.26 | JeffM | really the concept of using / as an escape character for server commands is arbitrary |
| 23:05.40 | JeffM | I could have implemented it all as * commands, or ~commands. |
| 23:05.53 | JeffM | it's just a prefix check ontop of the inbound chat |
| 23:06.49 | blast007 | using a slash is a reasonably common practice though |
| 23:07.22 | JeffM | yes |
| 23:07.28 | JeffM | most humans are used to it |
| 23:07.37 | JeffM | at least the ones that play video games or use IRC :) |
| 23:07.59 | blast007 | twitch and discord also use /me, I believe |
| 23:08.07 | JeffM | yeah it's common in chats |
| 23:08.16 | JeffM | skype does too |
| 23:08.17 | blast007 | (though twitch also uses IRCv3 as their backend for their chat) |
| 23:08.59 | JeffM | heh |
| 23:09.34 | blast007 | makes it easy to write bots that interface with twitch |
| 23:10.16 | JeffM | my list has 15 suggested proto changes, chat is only one of them :) |
| 23:10.50 | blast007 | string encoding is definitely silly in our proto |
| 23:10.54 | JeffM | I checked the logs and I think I got everythign I had mentioned here. |
| 23:11.01 | JeffM | what one? there are 6 ways :) |
| 23:11.09 | blast007 | for some of them we pad the value |
| 23:11.18 | JeffM | fixed size strings |
| 23:11.22 | blast007 | yeah |
| 23:11.32 | blast007 | iirc, MsgMessage does that |
| 23:11.39 | JeffM | there are 4 of those :) |
| 23:11.43 | blast007 | so it always sends a full-sized message, even for "lol" |
| 23:11.43 | JeffM | yuuuuup |
| 23:11.46 | JeffM | found that out last week |
| 23:12.08 | JeffM | "why the hell is there a ton of /0 at the end of this text!" |
| 23:12.10 | blast007 | I learned that when I was writing my Wireshare dissector |
| 23:12.37 | JeffM | I sugest UShortPascal in UTF8 as the one to go with. |
| 23:13.05 | BulletCatcher | My suggestion includes completely removing the isAction bit from the protocol. |
| 23:13.17 | JeffM | that would work too :) |
| 23:13.37 | blast007 | BulletCatcher: it's a byte, actually :) |
| 23:13.41 | blast007 | a message type byte |
| 23:14.06 | JeffM | and there is only one type :) |
| 23:14.11 | blast007 | well, two |
| 23:14.15 | JeffM | sure |
| 23:14.17 | blast007 | normal and action |
| 23:14.43 | JeffM | MsgMessage is one of the ones I have to use my "isServer" flag for when packing |
| 23:15.01 | JeffM | there are a few messages that have different packings on client vs server |
| 23:15.05 | JeffM | it's anoying |
| 23:15.15 | blast007 | pre-2.4, the server received the raw /me, and then it converted that into "*\t" + message + " *" or something like that, and the client then displayed that differently |
| 23:15.52 | blast007 | (but it was also possible for the client to send a message with that format) |
| 23:17.17 | JeffM | all my chat stuff is all wrapped up a single class so it's together. |
| 23:18.11 | JeffM | and all the messages are always broken down, I never resend a raw packet to other players. |
| 23:18.36 | JeffM | chat is broken down, packed into an event argument, processed trhough the API and the filter thread, then sent out. |
| 23:18.59 | JeffM | so plugins and players all use the same sending funcitons, the input just comes from different plances |
| 23:20.51 | JeffM | plugins/modules can send messages before or after the filter if they want to |
| 23:32.35 | JeffM | I'm trying to find things now that prevent the server from hosting an empty world game. |