irclog2html for #bzflag on 20070128

`00:01.53`	`*** join/#bzflag tannerld (n=tanner@adsl-068-209-251-067.sip.asm.bellsouth.net)`
`00:08.42`	`linuxclub`	`:(`
`00:09.52`	`JeffM2501`	`what was busted?`
`00:12.09`	`CBG`	`I have no clue.`
`00:12.18`	`JeffM2501`	`what command are you talking about?`
`00:12.25`	`CBG`	`I changed so little, I dunno what could be wrong.`
`00:12.45`	`CBG`	`the /mapsearch stuff in http://rafb.net/p/nDBrrD35.html`
`00:13.06`	`CBG`	`The 7 indented lines are the changes I made. They don't work, the rest still does.`
`00:13.27`	`CIA-3`	`BZFlag: 03jeffm2501 * 10bzflag/src/ (bzfs/bzfs.cxx common/ShotUpdate.cxx):`
`00:13.27`	`CIA-3`	`BZFlag: when you pack up a FiringInfo, set the length to be correct so it actualy gets sent`
`00:13.27`	`CIA-3`	`BZFlag: and read.`
`00:14.03`	`JeffM2501`	`looks like it should work`
`00:14.08`	`JeffM2501`	`it's just an if test on the string`
`00:14.44`	`JeffM2501`	`but you'll never get past that`
`00:14.52`	`CBG`	`Yeah, I stole each part from elsewhere in the code, it looks logical...`
`00:14.54`	`JeffM2501`	`cus all your testing is the string, if it's that string you boof`
`00:15.11`	`CBG`	`never get past what?`
`00:15.23`	`JeffM2501`	`so anyttime you put mapchange in there it'll return the usage`
`00:15.30`	`JeffM2501`	`don't you also want to check for no params?`
`00:15.33`	`CBG`	`That's all I want for now.`
`00:15.37`	`CBG`	`Yes, I do.`
`00:15.40`	`JeffM2501`	`and it dosn't get in there?`
`00:15.48`	`blast007`	`JeffM2501: he's just trying to get it to hit that part at all`
`00:15.49`	`JeffM2501`	`does it just say invalid command or somethinhg?`
`00:15.51`	`JeffM2501`	`ahh`
`00:15.58`	`blast007`	`invalid command, yeah`
`00:16.12`	`CBG`	`But I didn't want to go jumping in the deep end.`
`00:16.14`	`CBG`	`I cant even get it to display the usage. How the heck would I get it to do anymore?`
`00:16.32`	`CBG`	`I suck at C++. And to think that's what I'm applying for at uni. Hah.`
`00:16.34`	`JeffM2501`	`if it does that it's not reging`
`00:16.49`	`[NP]Tangent`	`CBG, hey, I'm applying for that, too!`
`00:16.50`	`*** join/#bzflag Legoguy_ (n=Legoguy@adsl-70-131-34-168.dsl.emhril.sbcglobal.net)`
`00:17.02`	`JeffM2501`	`you sure your runing the same plugin you built? not the one before your changes?`
`00:17.07`	`CBG`	`I have "bz_registerCustomSlashCommand ( "mapsearch", &mapChanger );" and stuff.`
`00:17.20`	`CBG`	`I'll check _again_.`
`00:17.25`	`brad`	`when I tried it I couldn't get any commands to work`
`00:17.25`	`JeffM2501`	`have it dump a debug message out after you do that to make sure it's running the code you think it is`
`00:18.31`	`JeffM2501`	`blast007 that last commit will make the shots show for everyone`
`00:18.43`	`JeffM2501`	`have to fix the remote sounds, but you'll see em now`
`00:18.57`	`blast007`	`JeffM2501: k`
`00:19.14`	`CBG`	`Ya know what? I think I was symlinking to a symlink and only changed one symlink to point to the new symlink, which was probably still pointing to the old one.`
`00:19.20`	`CBG`	`Bah, I don't even know anymore. I changed it - testing again.`
`00:19.47`	`*** join/#bzflag Legoguy (n=Legoguy@adsl-71-143-235-53.dsl.emhril.sbcglobal.net)`
`00:19.53`	`CBG`	`Hah. Now it works.`
`00:20.05`	`CBG`	`Yeah, symlinking a symlink was a bad idea. :\|`
`00:20.32`	`CBG`	`But, then, having the .so built in /mapchange/.libs/ is a PITA too, imho.`
`00:20.47`	`CBG`	`Thanks everyone, for dealing with my stupidity.`
`00:21.01`	`[NP]Tangent`	`it's a daily task for me, CBG. dealing with stupidity.`
`00:21.10`	`JeffM2501`	`cool`
`00:21.13`	`[NP]Tangent`	`yours was minor compared to what I have at work.`
`00:21.14`	`JeffM2501`	`at least it works :)`
`00:21.18`	`CBG`	`You get it easy, [NP]Tangent`
`00:21.29`	`[NP]Tangent`	`oh yeah`
`00:21.31`	`[NP]Tangent`	`you're in the UK`
`00:21.38`	`[NP]Tangent`	`I do have it easy :-x`
`00:21.42`	`CBG`	`JeffM2501: Well, now I just need to work out how to call data from a php script.`
`00:21.51`	`CBG`	`~lart [NP]Tangent`
`00:22.09`	`spldart`	`heh`
`00:23.12`	`spldart`	`Is Dadder really and admin at h2o as is in his 'email' on bzflag client?`
`00:23.49`	`JeffM2501`	`CBG the URL job api is what you need`
`00:23.53`	`JeffM2501`	`it's prety simple`
`00:24.04`	`JeffM2501`	`you need to call a URL and get data back? or just send?`
`00:24.14`	`CBG`	`both.`
`00:24.27`	`JeffM2501`	`ok then you'll need to add your own derived handler class`
`00:24.33`	`JeffM2501`	`then you'll get the data back in it`
`00:24.43`	`CBG`	`Heh.. ok, thanks. I'll take a shot at it.`
`00:25.14`	`JeffM2501`	`you'll derive from the bz_BaseURLHandler`
`00:25.15`	`CBG`	`:P`
`00:25.21`	`JeffM2501`	`and add your own "done" method`
`00:25.28`	`JeffM2501`	`that will give you back the data in the data var`
`00:25.41`	`JeffM2501`	`just copy it to a string and parse it however you want`
`00:25.52`	`JeffM2501`	`you can look at the torblock plugin, it parses a webpage`
`00:25.58`	`a_meteorite`	`parsing that probably won't be too fun`
`00:26.12`	`CBG`	`ah, great. thanks.`
`00:26.39`	`JeffM2501`	`I assume you need to send fields to the URL as post data? or you just going to build it up in the URL?`
`00:27.45`	`CBG`	`I can edit the script to take POST or GET data. Though it uses GET atm.`
`00:28.17`	`JeffM2501`	`get would be in the URL, that's easy. we do suport post too, just build up the post fields and send them in as the last param in the job call`
`00:29.58`	`CIA-3`	`BZFlag: 03jeffm2501 * 10bzflag/src/bzflag/playing.cxx: use the shot type for remote shot sounds, not the flag type.`
`00:30.05`	`JeffM2501`	`now to fix the SR issue`
`00:30.13`	`*** join/#bzflag Pimpi (n=frank@gondolin.pimpi.org)`
`00:30.18`	`CBG`	`No occurance of "BaseURL" in my plugins dir. :/ :(`
`00:30.42`	`JeffM2501`	`you have torblock?`
`00:30.57`	`CBG`	`Yep.`
`00:31.02`	`JeffM2501`	`open it's cxx file`
`00:31.17`	`JeffM2501`	`bahh sorry`
`00:31.18`	`CBG`	`.cpp ?`
`00:31.23`	`JeffM2501`	`yeah`
`00:31.30`	`JeffM2501`	`it's not baseURL in 2.0.x`
`00:31.34`	`JeffM2501`	`I forgot I renamed it`
`00:31.38`	`CBG`	`Ahh :)`
`00:31.40`	`JeffM2501`	`it's just bz_URLHandler`
`00:31.53`	`JeffM2501`	`it's about 1/2 way in the file`
`00:31.59`	`JeffM2501`	`class MyURLHandler`
`00:32.08`	`[NP]Tangent`	`woot`
`00:32.14`	`[NP]Tangent`	`my new plugin is ready to test`
`00:32.23`	`CBG`	`thanks JeffM2501 :)`
`00:32.28`	`JeffM2501`	`CBG sure`
`00:32.33`	`JeffM2501`	`[NP]Tangent what's it do?`
`00:32.39`	`CBG`	`[NP]Tangent: don't synlink a symlink to the .so ;)`
`00:32.59`	`CBG`	`Or, if you do, update both symlinks when you make any changes...`
`00:35.45`	`JeffM2501`	`I can't even see how SR can even KILL someone`
`00:42.11`	`*** join/#bzflag shorty114 (n=shorty11@unaffiliated/shorty114)`
`00:42.24`	`JeffM2501`	`the code for SR kills is only run AFTER we detect that we got shot`
`00:42.34`	`[NP]Tangent`	`JeffM2501, my plugin is for 4-team CTF. It simply makes it so that 3 teams attack 1, no other team flags but that one defender flag can be picked up.`
`00:42.34`	`JeffM2501`	`but we never get shot`
`00:42.44`	`JeffM2501`	`[NP]Tangent fun`
`00:42.58`	`[NP]Tangent`	`if the defender goes 5 minutes without getting capped, then they get a bonus team point for each active team that was attacking`
`00:43.20`	`*** join/#bzflag Legoguy_ (n=Legoguy@adsl-76-213-166-199.dsl.emhril.sbcglobal.net)`
`00:45.53`	`[NP]Tangent`	`hey Jeff`
`00:45.55`	`[NP]Tangent`	`bz_PlayerJoinPartEventData`
`00:46.02`	`JeffM2501`	`?`
`00:46.16`	`[NP]Tangent`	`is that what I should use when getting data for a join/quit event?`
`00:46.21`	`JeffM2501`	`yeah`
`00:46.38`	`[NP]Tangent`	`if (eventData->eventType == bz_ePlayerJoinEvent) {`
`00:46.38`	`[NP]Tangent`	`bz_PlayerJoinPartEventData *jped;`
`00:46.40`	`[NP]Tangent`	`not working`
`00:47.00`	`JeffM2501`	`what error does it give?`
`00:47.08`	`[NP]Tangent`	`and.cpp:76: error: ‘bz_PlayerJoinPartData’ was not declared in this scope`
`00:47.19`	`JeffM2501`	`sure that's a C++ thing`
`00:47.28`	`JeffM2501`	`your in a switch statement right?`
`00:47.29`	`[NP]Tangent`	`oh wow Im stupid`
`00:47.44`	`JeffM2501`	`scope is fun ;)`
`00:47.44`	`[NP]Tangent`	`I was looking at two line numbers between error and editor`
`00:49.41`	`CIA-3`	`BZFlag: 03jeffm2501 * 10bzflag/src/bzflag/playing.cxx: fix busted SR death, we test for SR, water, and PD death when we arn't shot.`
`00:50.16`	`brad`	`has a 2.1 windows client been published anywhere?`
`00:50.34`	`JeffM2501`	`yeah I have to do another one right now`
`00:50.54`	`*** join/#bzflag Theme97 (n=Theme97@about/essy/phpwriter/Theme97)`
`00:51.07`	`[NP]Tangent`	`what does it mean when I get this? and.cpp:79: error: invalid use of void expression`
`00:51.27`	`JeffM2501`	`the last one won't do shots right, or SR, phyDriv, or water deaths`
`00:51.34`	`JeffM2501`	`what line is the error on?`
`00:51.53`	`[NP]Tangent`	`switchDefender(getBestTeam(eObservers));`
`00:51.54`	`[NP]Tangent`	`79`
`00:52.02`	`JeffM2501`	`that is the entire line?`
`00:52.05`	`[NP]Tangent`	`yes`
`00:52.15`	`JeffM2501`	`what does getBestTeam Return?`
`00:52.19`	`[NP]Tangent`	`switchDefender is a void, it simply changes who the defender is`
`00:52.28`	`JeffM2501`	`what does it take as a paramater?`
`00:52.30`	`[NP]Tangent`	`getBestTeam returns something of type e_bzTeamType`
`00:52.39`	`[NP]Tangent`	`it takes a team to exclude as a parameter`
`00:52.42`	`JeffM2501`	`what is the prototype for switchDefender look like?`
`00:52.44`	`JeffM2501`	`show me`
`00:52.58`	`[NP]Tangent`	`virtual voidswitchDefender ( bz_eTeamType switchTeam );`
`00:52.58`	`[NP]Tangent`	`virtual voidgetBestTeam ( bz_eTeamType excludeTeam );`
`00:53.08`	`JeffM2501`	`they are part of a class?`
`00:53.18`	`JeffM2501`	`oh there's your problem`
`00:53.24`	`JeffM2501`	`getBestTeam dosn't return a team`
`00:53.25`	`[NP]Tangent`	`do I need the *?`
`00:53.28`	`JeffM2501`	`it returns a void`
`00:53.33`	`[NP]Tangent`	`oops`
`00:53.34`	`JeffM2501`	`it needs to return a teamType`
`00:53.56`	`[NP]Tangent`	`well, that solves that`
`00:58.40`	`[NP]Tangent`	`another thing that helps is using the right variable name... hah`
`00:58.56`	`[NP]Tangent`	`woot`
`00:58.57`	`[NP]Tangent`	`runs now`
`00:59.00`	`[NP]Tangent`	`er`
`00:59.03`	`[NP]Tangent`	`compiles anyways`
`00:59.05`	`[NP]Tangent`	`time to test`
`01:00.02`	`*** join/#bzflag [dmp] (n=dennis@koderen.dk)`
`01:00.55`	`[NP]Tangent`	`ugh`
`01:01.01`	`[NP]Tangent`	`bzfs segfaulted on join`
`01:01.08`	`tannerld`	`:O`
`01:02.56`	`[NP]Tangent`	`http://pastebin.ca/330564`
`01:08.38`	`[NP]Tangent`	`any thoughts?`
`01:08.43`	`blast007`	`" "`
`01:08.51`	`JeffM2501`	`run it in a debuger :)`
`01:09.09`	`[NP]Tangent`	`ugh`
`01:09.14`	`[NP]Tangent`	`that means I need to use google :P`
`01:09.21`	`JeffM2501`	`and check your pointers for null`
`01:09.29`	`mbfg`	`hmmm google has a debugger?`
`01:09.31`	`JeffM2501`	`thats the most common cause for poof`
`01:09.55`	`JeffM2501`	`if you use the development platform of choice you get an integrated debuger :)`
`01:10.07`	`[NP]Tangent`	`what's the devel platform of choice?`
`01:10.09`	`[NP]Tangent`	`g++?`
`01:10.14`	`JeffM2501`	`god no :)`
`01:10.19`	`JeffM2501`	`mbfg know`
`01:10.43`	`JeffM2501`	`dude`
`01:10.48`	`JeffM2501`	`you never init your pointer`
`01:10.58`	`JeffM2501`	`jped = nothing`
`01:11.02`	`JeffM2501`	`set it to be eventData`
`01:11.07`	`JeffM2501`	`and cast it to the right type`
`01:11.15`	`JeffM2501`	`of course that will crash`
`01:11.50`	`JeffM2501`	`bz_PlayerJoinPartEventData jped = (bz_PlayerJoinPartEventData) eventData;`
`01:12.16`	`JeffM2501`	`take a look at the other plugins, see how they do it.`
`01:13.06`	`JeffM2501`	`should weaponArena ship with the windows package?`
`01:14.00`	`[NP]Tangent`	`Program received signal SIGSEGV, Segmentation fault.`
`01:14.00`	`[NP]Tangent`	`0xb7b5aeb3 in strlen () from /lib/libc.so.6`
`01:14.34`	`JeffM2501`	`did you init your pointer?`
`01:14.44`	`JeffM2501`	`ahh you have an uninited string`
`01:15.09`	`JeffM2501`	`you don't init any of your pointers`
`01:15.20`	`JeffM2501`	`you have to set them to be event data with the right type for each event`
`01:15.24`	`mbfg`	`do you have to do that now?`
`01:15.34`	`mbfg`	`sheesh, awefully cranky of it`
`01:15.37`	`JeffM2501`	`heh`
`01:15.48`	`JeffM2501`	`the cast?`
`01:16.00`	`mbfg`	`no assigning the pointers`
`01:16.07`	`mbfg`	`;)`
`01:16.15`	`JeffM2501`	`how you been old man? ;)`
`01:16.23`	`mbfg`	`been old, mostly`
`01:16.38`	`JeffM2501`	`tell me about it`
`01:16.46`	`[NP]Tangent`	`Jeff, explain?`
`01:17.00`	`JeffM2501`	`for each of your cases where you check the event type`
`01:17.05`	`Flash`	`JeffM2501: I just noticed your new rank insignia; looks awesome`
`01:17.15`	`JeffM2501`	`you have a pointer to one of the event specific data types`
`01:17.22`	`JeffM2501`	`you never set those to anything`
`01:17.24`	`mbfg`	`bz_PlayerJoinPartEventData *jped;`
`01:17.24`	`mbfg`	`<PROTECTED>`
`01:17.28`	`mbfg`	`doesn't make sense`
`01:17.29`	`JeffM2501`	`yeah that part`
`01:17.34`	`mbfg`	`jped doesn't point to anything`
`01:17.41`	`mbfg`	`well... anything good, that is`
`01:17.53`	`JeffM2501`	`you have to asign it to the eventData pointer that is passed into the callback`
`01:18.03`	`JeffM2501`	`for each one of those event specific ones`
`01:18.10`	`JeffM2501`	`Flash, I was bored at work one day`
`01:18.23`	`Flash`	`I wish for boring days at work`
`01:18.32`	`*** join/#bzflag Pimpi_ (n=frank@gondolin.pimpi.org)`
`01:18.58`	`[NP]Tangent`	`JeffM2501, so I only have to add what you had said there?`
`01:19.01`	`[NP]Tangent`	`bz_PlayerJoinPartEventData jped = (bz_PlayerJoinPartEventData) eventData;`
`01:19.06`	`[NP]Tangent`	`for each of my events?`
`01:19.18`	`[NP]Tangent`	`or is there something else?`
`01:19.19`	`JeffM2501`	`yeah, changing the data type for each one`
`01:19.26`	`JeffM2501`	`you don't know C do you?`
`01:19.34`	`CBG`	`if params->get(0) will give the first param after the /command, what will give the last? params->get(-1) ?`
`01:19.39`	`[NP]Tangent`	`not very well`
`01:20.01`	`JeffM2501`	`CBG params->get(params->size()-1);`
`01:20.14`	`CBG`	`aha, figures. thanks.`
`01:20.17`	`JeffM2501`	`[NP]Tangent it may benifit you to learn more about pointers`
`01:20.30`	`JeffM2501`	`but yes you have to init each one`
`01:20.33`	`JeffM2501`	`or it'll just crash`
`01:20.59`	`*** join/#bzflag panzer (n=randompa@88-104-246-224.dynamic.dsl.as9105.com)`
`01:21.05`	`[NP]Tangent`	`well, I changed it as you said, now`
`01:21.07`	`[NP]Tangent`	`still segfaults`
`01:21.08`	`panzer`	`hi`
`01:21.12`	`*** part/#bzflag panzer (n=randompa@88-104-246-224.dynamic.dsl.as9105.com)`
`01:21.13`	`JeffM2501`	`did you do it for each event?`
`01:21.37`	`[NP]Tangent`	`yes`
`01:21.53`	`[NP]Tangent`	`there were 3 events, plus a fourth which was tick`
`01:22.01`	`*** join/#bzflag randomparticle (n=randompa@about/essy/snick/randomparticle)`
`01:22.03`	`randomparticle`	`hi`
`01:22.11`	`[NP]Tangent`	`the 3 (part, join, and flag cap) all have that change`
`01:22.18`	`*** join/#bzflag Soraya_ (i=40df9904@gateway/web/cgi-irc/zeebrothers.net/x-05321338d402a01f)`
`01:22.25`	`[NP]Tangent`	`the fourth doesn't have any specifics that look like they would require init`
`01:22.26`	`*** part/#bzflag Soraya_ (i=40df9904@gateway/web/cgi-irc/zeebrothers.net/x-05321338d402a01f)`
`01:22.30`	`[NP]Tangent`	`lemme paste it again`
`01:22.36`	`randomparticle`	`erm.. suppose i have GLEW but i don't want a bzflag build to use it, what do i do please?`
`01:22.41`	`CBG`	`hey snick`
`01:22.44`	`JeffM2501`	`run it in a debuger and see what line it pukes on`
`01:22.48`	`[NP]Tangent`	`http://pastebin.ca/330585`
`01:22.53`	`[NP]Tangent`	`gdb isn't saying`
`01:23.05`	`JeffM2501`	`randomparticle there is a #def in your config.h that you can remove`
`01:23.09`	`[NP]Tangent`	`Program received signal SIGSEGV, Segmentation fault.`
`01:23.09`	`[NP]Tangent`	`0xb7c18eb3 in strlen () from /lib/libc.so.6`
`01:23.15`	`JeffM2501`	`[NP]Tangent build with debug info`
`01:23.15`	`blast007`	`[NP]Tangent: debug build?`
`01:23.21`	`randomparticle`	`will check. one moment please`
`01:23.30`	`[NP]Tangent`	`I built this separate from bzfs`
`01:23.32`	`Flash`	`stack trace?`
`01:23.33`	`[NP]Tangent`	`one sec, I can do that`
`01:23.39`	`[NP]Tangent`	`but it'll have to be after dinner`
`01:23.44`	`JeffM2501`	`randomparticle HAVE_GLEW`
`01:23.48`	`[NP]Tangent`	`but I'll work on it some more`
`01:23.53`	`[NP]Tangent`	`thanks for the help so far`
`01:23.57`	`JeffM2501`	`find that, set it to 0`
`01:24.04`	`JeffM2501`	`that bz won't even try to use it`
`01:24.19`	`randomparticle`	`will 'HAVE_GLEW=0 ./configure' do it?`
`01:24.26`	`JeffM2501`	`I don't know`
`01:24.46`	`randomparticle`	`ok, i'll try it and see`
`01:24.59`	`JeffM2501`	`ok new build up for those that want it`
`01:25.02`	`JeffM2501`	`http://beta.bzflag.bz/builds/2.1.x/bzflag-2.1.11.3.exe`
`01:25.10`	`JeffM2501`	`has good shots`
`01:25.23`	`JeffM2501`	`the gl extension library`
`01:25.28`	`JeffM2501`	`helps manage aniso`
`01:26.08`	`spldart`	`"Give me HEAD or give me death... via superflag"`
`01:26.13`	`randomparticle`	`uses absolute pathnames unfortunately`
`01:26.26`	`randomparticle`	`move the glew libs and bzflag won't work`
`01:27.52`	`randomparticle`	`are there any universal builds online?`
`01:28.09`	`randomparticle`	`or are ppc/intel done separately?>`
`01:29.19`	`spldart`	`works`
`01:29.21`	`JeffM2501`	`nope`
`01:29.34`	`randomparticle`	`what i'd like to do is bundle glew inside the bzflag app`
`01:29.52`	`*** join/#bzflag bz51 (n=44ab5f36@bz.bzflag.bz)`
`01:29.53`	`randomparticle`	`i.e., as it is done for SDL`
`01:30.14`	`JeffM2501`	`hook it up`
`01:30.14`	`bz51`	`hi`
`01:30.21`	`blast007`	`bz51: hello`
`01:30.27`	`randomparticle`	`these configure scripts are a mystery to me`
`01:30.27`	`bz51`	`wahts up`
`01:30.35`	`blast007`	`bz51: not much`
`01:30.44`	`bz51`	`so...`
`01:30.57`	`Flash`	`I scrolled up (not wanting to restate the obvious), but configure doesn't work off HEAD for me right now`
`01:31.06`	`Flash`	`config.status: error: cannot find input file: thiefControl/Makefile.in`
`01:31.07`	`bz51`	`:)`
`01:31.25`	`bz51`	`gay`
`01:31.33`	`spldart`	`was it intentional to remove the ability to map shots to mouse wheel?`
`01:31.47`	`CBG`	`bz51: eh?`
`01:31.58`	`randomparticle`	`that would be simply criminal, spldart :)`
`01:31.58`	`bz51`	`this is gay im gion to play bzflag`
`01:32.17`	`CBG`	`How can IRC be gay?`
`01:32.29`	`spldart`	`It can't... it a vicious lie`
`01:32.30`	`JBdiGriz`	`Stop feeding the trolls.`
`01:32.31`	`JeffM2501`	`bz51 please watch your language`
`01:32.35`	`bz51`	`IRC?`
`01:32.37`	`blast007`	`bz51: this is the development channel`
`01:32.43`	`spldart`	`hehe`
`01:32.50`	`CBG`	`Flash: sure, nobody else spoke to them.`
`01:32.52`	`bz51`	`whats that?`
`01:32.56`	`blast007`	`so there is going to be develipment discussion`
`01:33.00`	`blast007`	`development*`
`01:33.02`	`CBG`	`_This_ is IRC.`
`01:33.12`	`tannerld`	`eheh`
`01:33.13`	`blast007`	`IRC stands for Internet Relay Chat`
`01:33.13`	`spldart`	`In James Earl Jones voice`
`01:33.20`	`Flash`	`blast007: right, like why does my configure not work anymore?`
`01:33.25`	`bz51`	`so......`
`01:33.34`	`bz51`	`i cant be here?`
`01:33.41`	`blast007`	`Flash: because theifControl doesn't have a Makefile.in?`
`01:33.49`	`blast007`	`bz51: I'm not saying that`
`01:33.54`	`bz51`	`oh`
`01:33.54`	`Flash`	`right... that's the obvious symptom`
`01:33.57`	`blast007`	`it's for support and development discussion`
`01:33.59`	`CBG`	`You can be here, just don't be anti-homosexuals.`
`01:34.02`	`JBdiGriz`	`If you cause trouble here, you will be asked to leave quickly.`
`01:34.10`	`bz51`	`oh ok`
`01:34.12`	`Flash`	`but WHY doesn't thiefControl not have a Makefile.in ??`
`01:34.16`	`blast007`	`so you can expect discussion about such topics`
`01:34.17`	`bz51`	`no trouble at all`
`01:34.27`	`bz51`	`ok`
`01:34.34`	`JBdiGriz`	`Along with anyone else who is trying to cause trouble.`
`01:34.51`	`bz51`	`what do u talk about?`
`01:35.01`	`blast007`	`bzflag development and support issues`
`01:35.09`	`JBdiGriz`	`Read the topic, and listen`
`01:35.11`	`randomparticle`	`philosophical matters that wouldn't interest your shallow intellect, bz51`
`01:35.18`	`spldart`	`eek`
`01:35.41`	`bz51`	`im 12 i have no idea what ur talking about!`
`01:35.45`	`JeffM2501`	`randomparticle be nice`
`01:36.09`	`bz51`	`14**`
`01:36.13`	`JeffM2501`	`bz51 this place is for more people then you, if you don't get it just read, you don't have to respond do everything`
`01:36.17`	`JBdiGriz`	`~ask`
`01:36.18`	`ibot`	`rumour has it, ask is Questions in the channel should be specific, informative, complete, concise, and on-topic. Don't ask if you can ask a question first. Don't ask if a person is there, just ask what you intended to ask them. Better questions more frequently yield better answers. We are all here voluntarily. See also ...`
`01:36.19`	`spldart`	`I moved head code to another deb machine with same kernel and roughly all the same packages and boom it builds or seems to be.... WT happened to my server that it can no longer build 8-)`
`01:36.57`	`JeffM2501`	`then one you soldered to?`
`01:37.02`	`bz51`	`so i should read the big paragrah above and talk about it?`
`01:37.10`	`JeffM2501`	`you don't have to talk about anything`
`01:37.14`	`CBG`	`You don't have to talk at all.`
`01:37.18`	`blast007`	`spldart: have you tried a clean checkout on your server?`
`01:37.18`	`spldart`	`meh.. sry to those I was asking help from for, apparently, no good reason...`
`01:37.20`	`JeffM2501`	`do you have a question to ask us? or just came here to see what was up?`
`01:37.35`	`CBG`	`Often, people will read for a long time before they say anything.`
`01:37.38`	`spldart`	`Yes I have blast... I just dont get it`
`01:37.47`	`randomparticle`	`ah, swine. i changed it to #define HAVE_GLEW 0' in 'config.h' and i still have GLEW`
`01:37.50`	`spldart`	`after a few updates I had to try fresh code`
`01:37.53`	`bz51`	`this is my first time i just wanted to check it out`
`01:38.05`	`spldart`	`and btw... I didn't checkout fresh on the other machine...`
`01:38.19`	`spldart`	`I'm building the tarball I made on serve from it's checkout`
`01:38.21`	`JeffM2501`	`randomparticle take the define out`
`01:38.24`	`blast007`	`randomparticle: did you run ./configure after you changed it? can't recall if config.h is autogenerated`
`01:38.25`	`JeffM2501`	`it does a #ifdef`
`01:38.29`	`randomparticle`	`ok`
`01:38.35`	`spldart`	`confirming that server rig had a legit copy of head`
`01:38.40`	`blast007`	`might have blown over your change if you did`
`01:39.33`	`bz51`	`so...`
`01:39.57`	`spldart`	`UP!~!!!!! NM.. second machine failed to build bzfs too`
`01:39.59`	`*** join/#bzflag randomparticle (n=randompa@about/essy/snick/randomparticle)`
`01:40.07`	`spldart`	`I'm building plugins fine though hehe`
`01:40.15`	`bz51`	`do u guys play bzflag?`
`01:40.22`	`Flash`	`even thiefControl??`
`01:40.30`	`spldart`	`something has changed.. I'mma update my packages and try again`
`01:40.36`	`CBG`	`bz51: not 24/7.`
`01:40.51`	`*** join/#bzflag Bobert (n=4a6396e4@bz.bzflag.bz)`
`01:40.57`	`blast007`	`oh boy`
`01:40.57`	`bz51`	`oh cause ive never seen u ojn`
`01:41.06`	`bz51`	`on*`
`01:41.17`	`CBG`	`What callsign do you play by?`
`01:41.22`	`bz51`	`me?`
`01:41.26`	`randomparticle`	`no, god`
`01:41.29`	`blast007`	`yes u`
`01:41.35`	`bz51`	`billis95`
`01:41.36`	`JBdiGriz`	`Please take it to #bzchat`
`01:41.38`	`JeffM2501`	`randomparticle second warning, be nice`
`01:41.43`	`JeffM2501`	`and yes take it to chat`
`01:41.48`	`randomparticle`	`sorry, thought i was being nice :)`
`01:42.03`	`randomparticle`	`i am senile and confused`
`01:42.09`	`JeffM2501`	`doubtfull`
`01:42.26`	`bz51`	`so use billis95 instead of bz51?`
`01:42.55`	`blast007`	`/nick billis95`
`01:43.04`	`bz51`	`nick???`
`01:43.11`	`blast007`	`type that`
`01:43.21`	`bz51`	`ok`
`01:43.26`	`bz51`	`brb`
`01:43.29`	`blast007`	`and then, /join #bzchat`
`01:43.48`	`blast007`	`brb?`
`01:43.52`	`spldart`	`Ok... this is infuriating... <sp> I've tried to k6 machines with 2.4 kernel deb stable... even updated one and I can't build a fairly fresh head cvs checkout to get bzfs and bzadmin... I just don't get it :(`
`01:43.59`	`blast007`	`oh, thought you were gonna reconnect ;)`
`01:43.59`	`billis95`	`sweet`
`01:44.15`	`blast007`	`/join #bzchat`
`01:44.18`	`JeffM2501`	`spldart you have current autotools and all that`
`01:44.24`	`blast007`	`you can talk more in #bzchat then`
`01:44.26`	`spldart`	`current stable deb`
`01:44.29`	`spldart`	`all tools`
`01:44.38`	`JeffM2501`	`wierdness`
`01:44.38`	`spldart`	`up to date on second machine`
`01:44.41`	`spldart`	`right`
`01:44.42`	`JeffM2501`	`you on a clean dir?`
`01:44.49`	`spldart`	`3 times`
`01:44.53`	`billis95`	`got it`
`01:45.06`	`spldart`	`2 checkoust from cvs and one was a distclean and try again`
`01:45.13`	`billis95`	`whats flash?`
`01:45.25`	`spldart`	`~bzcvs21`
`01:45.40`	`JeffM2501`	`DTRemenak was able to build ok`
`01:45.49`	`JeffM2501`	`don't know what OS brad built on`
`01:46.06`	`DTRemenak`	`spldart: what errors?`
`01:46.09`	`brad`	`linux`
`01:46.20`	`DTRemenak`	`built fine for me on dragonfly`
`01:46.35`	`spldart`	`poo.. was gonna recheckout on new machine`
`01:46.52`	`billis95`	`i g2g bye`
`01:47.05`	`spldart`	`meh.. didn't dump make output into log this time...`
`01:47.36`	`spldart`	`I'm goin to recheck cvs code on second rig and try that instead of tarball from last righ`
`01:47.38`	`*** join/#bzflag CBG (n=CBG@cpc4-stme1-0-0-cust103.cdif.cable.ntl.com)`
`01:47.49`	`Flash`	`once again CBG leaves with the troll....`
`01:48.16`	`spldart`	`is ibot alive?`
`01:48.25`	`Flash`	`~lart spldart`
`01:48.26`	`spldart`	`right flash? heh`
`01:48.32`	`JBdiGriz`	`ibot: are you alive?`
`01:48.34`	`ibot`	`The dead cannot live`
`01:48.34`	`spldart`	`lol`
`01:48.44`	`Flash`	`~bzcvs`
`01:48.46`	`ibot`	`cvs -d :pserver:anonymous@cvs.bzflag.org:/cvsroot/bzflag co -P bzflag (this is for HEAD ie: 2.1 see also bz20cvs)`
`01:48.53`	`spldart`	`thankies`
`01:49.38`	`spldart`	`okies`
`01:50.25`	`spldart`	`after autogen I'll >output configure and >output make and then put it all in one file for you guys to peek at`
`01:51.00`	`spldart`	`It's probably some stupid crap that will make me feel like an E-tard when it's pointed out to me :(`
`01:51.01`	`[NP]Tangent`	`alright`
`01:51.03`	`[NP]Tangent`	`I'm back`
`01:52.01`	`spldart`	`heck.... I'll output autogen too hehe`
`01:52.38`	`JeffM2501`	`what is the code for Trigger Happy?`
`01:52.59`	`Flash`	`TR?`
`01:53.05`	`JeffM2501`	`thanks`
`01:53.35`	`JeffM2501`	`I may have made some wierd combos :(`
`01:53.39`	`JeffM2501`	`theif shockwaves`
`01:53.51`	`CBG`	`o.O`
`01:53.52`	`Flash`	`grab all the flags in a radius?`
`01:54.16`	`JeffM2501`	`TR with laserArea is FUNNY`
`01:54.16`	`spldart`	`I wish somebody liked my flag ideas...`
`01:54.37`	`tannerld`	`laserArea?`
`01:54.55`	`JeffM2501`	`LaserArena sorry`
`01:55.06`	`spldart`	`Jeff.. What do you think of XR flag... xmen rogue.. You pick up XR and inherit all superflag abilities that your within the range of or closest one of the ones in range`
`01:55.06`	`JeffM2501`	`10 shots`
`01:55.16`	`JeffM2501`	`spldart too complex`
`01:55.19`	`tannerld`	`which is...?`
`01:55.37`	`JeffM2501`	`weaponArena plugin configed to make all shots laser`
`01:55.39`	`spldart`	`or CS flag Clockstoppers.... pick up and world slows or stops for some seconds in which you are the only one that moves nad shooots`
`01:55.49`	`JeffM2501`	`spldart that would be anoying`
`01:55.54`	`spldart`	`okies`
`01:55.55`	`JeffM2501`	`I'm allready somewhat regreting this change`
`01:56.00`	`spldart`	`lol`
`01:56.01`	`JeffM2501`	`as it can make some wierd combos`
`01:56.03`	`spldart`	`NM then`
`01:56.03`	`tannerld`	`neat`
`01:56.09`	`JeffM2501`	`but it can also make some fun modes`
`01:56.09`	`spldart`	`one other dev said 'nah`
`01:56.24`	`JeffM2501`	`spldart rule of thumb, if it's based on a move, it's lame`
`01:56.25`	`JeffM2501`	`;)`
`01:56.26`	`spldart`	`Couple players loved XR though... but complex is complex`
`01:56.37`	`spldart`	`Nah...`
`01:56.47`	`spldart`	`shield is based on a moive`
`01:56.49`	`spldart`	`movie`
`01:56.56`	`tannerld`	`so if you have weaponArena and pick up MG, you have a MG L?`
`01:56.58`	`JeffM2501`	`it's a concept`
`01:56.58`	`spldart`	`Disney's The Lost Planet`
`01:57.05`	`JeffM2501`	`MG is a shot type, so no`
`01:57.09`	`spldart`	`1950's`
`01:57.15`	`JeffM2501`	`it overides all shot type flags`
`01:57.33`	`JeffM2501`	`but not effects that check flag type, like CL, or MQ, etc..`
`01:57.33`	`tannerld`	`err...`
`01:57.41`	`randomparticle`	`i still can't get rid of anisotropic filtering`
`01:57.47`	`*** join/#bzflag Tupone (n=Tupone@pdpc/supporter/active/Tupone)`
`01:57.47`	`*** mode/#bzflag [+v Tupone] by ChanServ`
`01:57.56`	`randomparticle`	`have removed the #define, but it still has it`
`01:58.00`	`JeffM2501`	`MG, RS, LZ, GM, SW, SB, IB, and standard shot are the shot types`
`01:58.03`	`CBG`	`so, CL + L..? :)`
`01:58.10`	`JeffM2501`	`if you wanted to yea`
`01:58.19`	`JeffM2501`	`the plugin would have to set the shot type`
`01:58.30`	`[NP]Tangent`	`Jeff, any thoughts as to what is causing tis segfault?`
`01:58.32`	`tannerld`	`hmm`
`01:58.33`	`tannerld`	`nifty`
`01:58.41`	`CBG`	`ST+SW lol`
`01:58.42`	`JeffM2501`	`[NP]Tangent bad code`
`01:58.51`	`[NP]Tangent`	`well of course`
`01:58.58`	`[NP]Tangent`	`but I'm not getting a whole lot out of debugging`
`01:59.00`	`[NP]Tangent`	`one second`
`01:59.02`	`JeffM2501`	`burrow + SW means invinvibility`
`01:59.21`	`Flash`	`GM ??`
`01:59.38`	`JeffM2501`	`thats the only thing that can get ya`
`01:59.42`	`spldart`	`it's still a touch to invincible`
`01:59.51`	`Flash`	`G`
`01:59.54`	`randomparticle`	`is no good building with GLEW if i want to distribute to people who don't have it`
`01:59.57`	`[NP]Tangent`	`its crashing in strlen`
`02:00.06`	`CBG`	`G+GM or G+SW ..`
`02:00.13`	`Flash`	`[NP]Tangent: more complete stack trace`
`02:00.14`	`JeffM2501`	`yeah well I think my mistake is not making G a shot type`
`02:00.22`	`CBG`	`heh`
`02:00.24`	`JeffM2501`	`so yeah, geno shockwaves`
`02:00.44`	`JeffM2501`	`you can also set the shot type of someone who dosn't have a flag`
`02:00.52`	`JeffM2501`	`there is even a "no shot" type`
`02:01.00`	`randomparticle`	`there's a bit of a problem with geno. is a great flag for tkers`
`02:01.09`	`JeffM2501`	`tho that overlaps with the noshoot message`
`02:01.11`	`randomparticle`	`they just have to shoot themselves`
`02:01.22`	`randomparticle`	`and all their teammates die too`
`02:01.24`	`Flash`	`I do that as rogue in FFA`
`02:01.32`	`JeffM2501`	`run OpenFFA`
`02:01.37`	`JeffM2501`	`no teams ;)`
`02:01.42`	`spldart`	`c-ares can cause no build of bzfs and bzadmin? and did c-ares change recently that would cause all my machines to all of a sudden fail to build head?`
`02:01.55`	`JeffM2501`	`ares is the same IIRC`
`02:02.02`	`randomparticle`	`would be better if self-kill just killed self, maybe`
`02:02.17`	`[NP]Tangent`	`this is my backtrace`
`02:02.17`	`[NP]Tangent`	`http://pastebin.ca/330608`
`02:02.20`	`spldart`	`BTW.. I came up with flag names in Latin for both of my idea superflags :) in case movies are to lame`
`02:02.23`	`JeffM2501`	`I added options to also take out TKs for team games too, shot just goes thru`
`02:02.33`	`randomparticle`	`sounds good`
`02:02.51`	`spldart`	`very..`
`02:02.55`	`randomparticle`	`can that be restricted to just geno?`
`02:03.00`	`spldart`	`could really change gameplay in a cluster`
`02:03.03`	`spldart`	`happy food getting`
`02:03.07`	`JeffM2501`	`yeah, don't put geno in the flag list ;)`
`02:03.38`	`spldart`	`I HATE geno`
`02:04.03`	`JeffM2501`	`I'm gonna make it so the client has to ask the server "can I die" at that point we can have a hook for it and let a plugin decide`
`02:04.11`	`spldart`	`I don't include geno in any of my maps or any maps I host from others... tis a bad superflag`
`02:04.27`	`spldart`	`ooOOoo`
`02:04.38`	`spldart`	`that's leaves neat possibilities`
`02:04.38`	`randomparticle`	`good policy, spldart`
`02:04.45`	`JeffM2501`	`that is at least partway to just the server can tell you "you dead man"`
`02:05.06`	`randomparticle`	`a whole team dying repeatedly because one of their players is a beginner is not good really`
`02:05.22`	`spldart`	`exactly... it can kill a game fast`
`02:06.54`	`Flash`	`[NP]Tangent: without any more context, it looks like you are comparing a string to a not string (operator !=)`
`02:08.51`	`JeffM2501`	`you could make it so no reged users can't kill with geno ;)`
`02:10.05`	`JeffM2501`	`we can also move the geno kill to the server now, if it isn't already`
`02:10.53`	`brad`	`JeffM2501: with the new client you just built I get "can't talk to list server"`
`02:11.28`	`spldart`	`the .exe one brad?`
`02:11.31`	`brad`	`ya`
`02:11.31`	`spldart`	`Mine is working`
`02:11.39`	`spldart`	`I played and everthing`
`02:11.42`	`spldart`	`odd`
`02:11.47`	`brad`	`i can join servers`
`02:11.54`	`brad`	`just cant get auth or list server`
`02:12.05`	`spldart`	`oh.. I"m getting a +`
`02:12.15`	`JeffM2501`	`works for me`
`02:12.15`	`spldart`	`lemme try list`
`02:19.04`	`*** join/#bzflag randomparticle_ (n=randompa@88-104-246-224.dynamic.dsl.as9105.com)`
`02:20.21`	`*** join/#bzflag randomparticle (n=randompa@about/essy/snick/randomparticle)`
`02:20.59`	`spldart`	`ehh ehhh help me make a map pweese`
`02:21.00`	`spldart`	`heheh\`
`02:22.42`	`brad`	`hmm weird`
`02:22.48`	`brad`	`deleting the config fixed it`
`02:24.32`	`[NP]Tangent`	`Flash, might you be able to see where my problem is?`
`02:24.44`	`spldart`	`my config dumped something about c-ares as I mentioned so I grabbed a recent one and am building it now... but that is a change from what worked only a week ago`
`02:25.03`	`[NP]Tangent`	`http://pastebin.ca/330624 is what I have right now`
`02:27.44`	`spldart`	`ummmmmm....`
`02:28.34`	`spldart`	`is it possible to checkout code.... and do ./autogen and do ./configure this is the fresh machine... and then do make and only have permission as user to do some of the build but fail to have permission to do toehr parts of the build?`
`02:28.52`	`spldart`	`I mean... I could be grasping at straws here`
`02:29.15`	`[NP]Tangent`	`spldart, that happens on my ssh account`
`02:29.42`	`spldart`	`interesting.... I'm trying an experiment on my failed bzfs bzadmin builds of the last 2 days`
`02:30.01`	`brlcad`	`that's certainly possible, but fairly indicative of an account set up improperly, bad umask or groups or somesuch`
`02:30.31`	`spldart`	`on to machines? with no changes recently? on the same head code?`
`02:30.43`	`spldart`	`it's wierd.. I'll let you know how my experiment goes`
`02:31.17`	`brlcad`	`need a more specific error/warning/output to comment otherwise, but "it is possible"`
`02:32.07`	`spldart`	`yeah... I'm still tinkering to much to just give a dump of my failed build... I guess i'm to embarrassed to find out I'm an E-tard ;-p`
`02:32.27`	`brlcad`	`heh`
`02:33.49`	`spldart`	`NM.... still didn't build bzfs`
`02:34.31`	`spldart`	`through a nab of latest c-ares tarball and build and through using root to build.... Now... I'mma distclean and dump my entire build into file and share... gah and a half`
`02:35.16`	`brlcad`	`what's wrong with bz's c-ares?`
`02:35.20`	`Tupone`	`spldart: you can paste the build log. no?`
`02:35.43`	`spldart`	`yes..well now I can... I've tried most everything my drunk arse can think of`
`02:36.21`	`[NP]Tangent`	`man`
`02:36.28`	`[NP]Tangent`	`I cannot figure out why this segfaults`
`02:38.23`	`Flash`	`[NP]Tangent: did you build with debug?`
`02:38.25`	`spldart`	`I'm not blaming anything for fear of looking even more impotent behind a keyboard before linux and the rest of the world`
`02:38.48`	`Flash`	`it's most helpful to either run in the debug and catch the exact line of code, or debug the corefile after the fact`
`02:38.49`	`spldart`	`hehe... say that 3 times real fast as drunk as I am`
`02:39.20`	`Flash`	`that ... that ... that`
`02:39.25`	`[NP]Tangent`	`haven't built with debug`
`02:39.26`	`[NP]Tangent`	`one sec`
`02:39.53`	`spldart`	`Imma build without debug on my prob since it's not goin to be able to help and slows me down`
`02:42.55`	`Flash`	`JeffM2501: how do I drop TR?`
`02:49.06`	`Flash`	`SVN?`
`02:49.38`	`Tupone`	`subversion`
`02:49.49`	`[NP]Tangent`	`CVS is easier, IMO, than SVN`
`02:50.47`	`CBG`	`I like CVS, dunno anything about SVN.`
`02:52.00`	`Flash`	`I'd REALLY like to be able to get rid of this TR-laser`
`02:53.00`	`[NP]Tangent`	`TR + laser = almost as good as having normal TR right next to a wall?`
`02:53.28`	`Flash`	`it's not infinite distance and no rico, so just annoying`
`02:53.40`	`[NP]Tangent`	`oh`
`02:53.44`	`[NP]Tangent`	`that's disappointing`
`02:54.10`	`*** join/#bzflag H0ley (n=H0ley@adsl-69-228-210-78.dsl.pltn13.pacbell.net)`
`02:54.11`	`Flash`	`but there's no timer and no antidote flags`
`02:57.13`	`H0ley`	`JeffM2501: The link for the 2.1.x beta builds are located at "beta.bzflag.bz" not "beta.bzflag.org," right?`
`02:57.32`	`H0ley`	`Your link on the forums is 404'd`
`02:58.12`	`purple_cow`	`CVS is easier?!`
`02:58.46`	`H0ley`	`I was looking for the windows installer`
`03:00.52`	`spldart`	`oh?`
`03:02.58`	`JeffM2501`	`bahh`
`03:03.01`	`JeffM2501`	`I'll fix that :)`
`03:03.34`	`spldart`	`beta.bzflag.bz hehehe`
`03:03.37`	`JeffM2501`	`the link to the file was right :)`
`03:03.45`	`JeffM2501`	`I realy should get a .org done for that`
`03:05.11`	`randomparticle`	`ok. i've built a GLEW framework to embed in a mac bzflag.app`
`03:05.22`	`randomparticle`	`but..`
`03:05.27`	`JeffM2501`	`what changes did you have to make to the projects?`
`03:05.37`	`randomparticle`	`now i need to include/use it in some way`
`03:05.55`	`randomparticle`	`it is done for SDL, so it should be possible, but i haven't the faintest idea how to go about it`
`03:06.15`	`JeffM2501`	`should be done the same way I'd imagine`
`03:06.21`	`purple_cow`	`they keep assigning bugs to me at work :(`
`03:06.33`	`randomparticle`	`if only i knew what that way was :)`
`03:06.46`	`randomparticle`	`ok, time to rummage around the bzflag project`
`03:06.50`	`JeffM2501`	`find it, track it down`
`03:09.02`	`randomparticle`	`it may be that the bzflag configure files produce the necessary "-framework xyz" compiler flags`
`03:09.21`	`randomparticle`	`if so, i need to add something for my GLEW framework`
`03:10.05`	`randomparticle`	`are the base-level files that are needed to change how the configure script works included in the bzflag source?`
`03:10.59`	`randomparticle`	`likely candidates, as it seems to me, are Makefile.am, Makefile.in and autogen.sh`
`03:11.49`	`randomparticle`	`i don't want to change something that is automatically generated, but i don't really know what feeds into what`
`03:12.06`	`JeffM2501`	`there is a config one too`
`03:12.50`	`randomparticle`	`is someone using some special program to produce these files?`
`03:12.59`	`randomparticle`	`or is one of those handcrafted?`
`03:13.02`	`*** join/#bzflag Goodbye2U (n=4165febe@bz.bzflag.bz)`
`03:13.27`	`JeffM2501`	`config.ac is the controll file`
`03:13.35`	`JeffM2501`	`basicly the files that are IN cvs are ours`
`03:13.39`	`randomparticle`	`ok. autogenerated by something or handmade?`
`03:13.42`	`JeffM2501`	`the others are auto generated`
`03:13.46`	`JeffM2501`	`hand made`
`03:14.11`	`JeffM2501`	`we don't check in auto generated files`
`03:14.19`	`JeffM2501`	`cus they are well automaticly generated`
`03:14.59`	`randomparticle`	`configure.ac has some -framework stuff`
`03:15.30`	`inchworm`	`SmurfThemeMixed.mp3... all i can say is wow`
`03:16.17`	`randomparticle`	`configure.ac is handwritten?`
`03:16.27`	`randomparticle`	`looks absolutely horrendous`
`03:17.53`	`*** join/#bzflag Quol (n=Quol@modemcable177.75-202-24.mc.videotron.ca)`
`03:19.45`	`JeffM2501`	`probably was started with some template`
`03:22.04`	`spldart`	`didn't know "./configure --whatever-switches >>file to save" would cause ./configure to no do what it needs to allowing make to follow it`
`03:30.47`	`CBG`	`~seen L4m3r`
`03:30.50`	`ibot`	`l4m3r <n=l4m3r@s122-99.resnet.ucla.edu> was last seen on IRC in channel ##essy, 20h 53m 14s ago, saying: '~lart ##essy'.`
`03:33.40`	`*** join/#bzflag randomparticle (n=randompa@about/essy/snick/randomparticle)`
`03:34.25`	`randomparticle`	`ok, in an attempt to stop configure using the already installed GLEW, i made /usr/local non-readable. (note: /usr/local doesn't exist in clean OS X installations).`
`03:34.36`	`randomparticle`	`and now configure doesn't work`
`03:34.45`	`randomparticle`	`it just bombs out`
`03:37.38`	`randomparticle`	`"checking for C compiler default output file name... configure: error: C compiler cannot create executables"`
`03:37.42`	`Flash`	`so change the permissions`
`03:37.43`	`randomparticle`	`which is nonsense, basically`
`03:37.48`	`[NP]Tangent`	`alright`
`03:37.51`	`[NP]Tangent`	`this is odd Flash`
`03:37.58`	`[NP]Tangent`	`I can't compile with debug on`
`03:38.05`	`randomparticle`	`because bzflag will compile fine when /usr/local doesn't exist`
`03:38.24`	`Flash`	`[NP]Tangent: what is your error?`
`03:38.25`	`*** join/#bzflag Goodbye2U (n=4165febe@bz.bzflag.bz)`
`03:39.06`	`[NP]Tangent`	`http://pastebin.ca/330672`
`03:40.29`	`brlcad`	`heh, template... riight ;)`
`03:40.42`	`JeffM2501`	`I said "maybe"`
`03:41.21`	`[NP]Tangent`	`Flash, that pastebin link was the errors`
`03:41.29`	`brlcad`	`configure.ac files usually have some basic structure, but are pretty much entirely written by hand`
`03:41.35`	`JeffM2501`	`fun`
`03:42.00`	`Flash`	`those errors don't match HEAD`
`03:42.09`	`Flash`	`is this 2.1?`
`03:42.20`	`*** part/#bzflag donny_baker (n=donny_ba@c-71-229-86-135.hsd1.in.comcast.net)`
`03:42.24`	`brlcad`	`basically just a list of things to do, along with some basic shell scripting`
`03:42.50`	`brlcad`	`the shell scripting makes it look more complicated than it really is`
`03:42.56`	`[NP]Tangent`	`no, 2.0`
`03:43.21`	`JeffM2501`	`brlcad have you tried a universal build yet?`
`03:43.26`	`brlcad`	`nope`
`03:43.52`	`[NP]Tangent`	`~bz20cvs`
`03:44.00`	`ibot`	`cvs -d :pserver:anonymous@cvs.bzflag.org:/cvsroot/bzflag co -P -r v2_0branch bzflag`
`03:44.26`	`Flash`	`ok, those errors don't match 2.0 either`
`03:44.48`	`Flash`	`there is no switch in bzfsAPI anywhere near line 791`
`03:45.10`	`[NP]Tangent`	`I'll re-checkout`
`03:45.24`	`brad`	`bug -> theif shots show as bullets to other players`
`03:46.12`	`JeffM2501`	`how old of a client and server?`
`03:46.37`	`[NP]Tangent`	`the client was cvs from about a week ago`
`03:46.40`	`[NP]Tangent`	`maybe a little less`
`03:46.46`	`[NP]Tangent`	`but between 5 and 7 days`
`03:46.50`	`JeffM2501`	`no, for brad`
`03:46.53`	`brad`	`JeffM2501: your latest one`
`03:47.00`	`brad`	`server built an hour ago`
`03:47.08`	`[NP]Tangent`	`oh`
`03:47.08`	`Flash`	`brad, it's inconsistent`
`03:47.09`	`JeffM2501`	`k`
`03:47.09`	`[NP]Tangent`	`he`
`03:47.17`	`brad`	`well maybe a few hours :)`
`03:47.30`	`JeffM2501`	`you running any of the shot change plugins?`
`03:47.38`	`Flash`	`well.... it always looked like bullets when I was shot AT`
`03:47.45`	`Flash`	`but it looked normal when I shot`
`03:47.46`	`brad`	`no, no plugins`
`03:47.50`	`JeffM2501`	`k`
`03:47.59`	`brad`	`sometimes you cant even see your own theif shots`
`03:48.18`	`Flash`	`I just built my client this evening`
`03:48.53`	`Flash`	`[NP]Tangent: maybe break down and pastebin the entire build output?`
`03:48.59`	`Flash`	`or just get a clean CVS?`
`03:50.13`	`*** join/#bzflag FusionDude (n=43ae6521@bz.bzflag.bz)`
`03:50.15`	`[NP]Tangent`	`clean CVS is what Im doing now`
`03:50.42`	`*** join/#bzflag Goodbye2U (n=4165febe@bz.bzflag.bz)`
`03:54.57`	`[NP]Tangent`	`sigh`
`03:55.05`	`[NP]Tangent`	`hopefully Im off to college soon`
`03:55.14`	`[NP]Tangent`	`my internet would assuredly be better there`
`03:55.24`	`[NP]Tangent`	`Im at dads house now, where it's not too bad`
`03:55.28`	`[NP]Tangent`	`but I'm rarely here`
`03:55.38`	`[NP]Tangent`	`our "high speed" internet at mom's house is... welll...`
`03:55.39`	`[NP]Tangent`	`not.`
`03:55.48`	`blast007`	`thanks for sharing`
`03:58.11`	`spldart`	`eep`
`03:58.47`	`spldart`	`:-)`
`03:58.56`	`Goodbye2U`	`lol`
`03:59.24`	`[NP]Tangent`	`...`
`03:59.39`	`[NP]Tangent`	`rebuilding now`
`04:02.32`	`spldart`	`didn't work like I had wanted http://spldart.opencombat.net:92/wheredidifugup.terminaloutput`
`04:02.46`	`spldart`	`dunno if that says anything as to why bzfs didn't build`
`04:05.34`	`[NP]Tangent`	`weird`
`04:05.39`	`[NP]Tangent`	`fresh CVS does it, too`
`04:07.09`	`[NP]Tangent`	`by the way flash`
`04:07.20`	`[NP]Tangent`	`there most certainly IS a switch, in bzfsAPI.cxx`
`04:07.21`	`[NP]Tangent`	`on 792`
`04:07.25`	`[NP]Tangent`	`er 793`
`04:08.07`	`[NP]Tangent`	`its complaining because the switch does NOT handle some team types`
`04:08.27`	`[NP]Tangent`	`eNoTeam, eRabbitTeam, eHunterTeam, and eAdministrators`
`04:08.30`	`[NP]Tangent`	`are not in the switch`
`04:09.42`	`spldart`	`lots of code issues the last couple of days :(`
`04:11.10`	`[NP]Tangent`	`I note that they are in the API`
`04:12.16`	`*** join/#bzflag Pimpinella (n=frank@gondolin.pimpi.org)`
`04:13.46`	`[NP]Tangent`	`bzfsAPI.cxx: In function ‘bool bz_restart()’:`
`04:13.46`	`[NP]Tangent`	`bzfsAPI.cxx:2313: warning: unused variable ‘flag’`
`04:13.47`	`[NP]Tangent`	`now I get that`
`04:14.19`	`[NP]Tangent`	`note that this only happens when I compile with debug`
`04:15.25`	`brad`	`<PROTECTED>`
`04:16.20`	`brad`	`nvm, just read bzfsAPI.h`
`04:21.23`	`brad`	`wow this is cool`
`04:21.39`	`brad`	`come to brad.bz 1337 .... invisible bots!`
`04:22.29`	`brad`	`or maybe not invisble`
`04:22.36`	`brad`	`they seem to be shooting without spawning`
`04:29.46`	`[NP]Tangent`	`ugh`
`04:29.53`	`[NP]Tangent`	`recompile has not helped me at all`
`04:44.49`	`tannerld`	`brad: lol`
`04:57.24`	`mbfg`	`that warning isn't critical, unless you intended to use that variable`
`05:08.02`	`Flash`	`[NP]Tangent: the warning is for line 2310 where 'flag' is assigned by not read`
`05:08.37`	`[NP]Tangent`	`well, with debug, that's killing te compile`
`05:08.38`	`Flash`	`however, the FlagInfo::get() method might have side effects, so it shouldn't be optimized away`
`05:08.49`	`Flash`	`that seems unusual`
`05:09.14`	`mbfg`	`bz_shotFiredEventData stops the build right?`
`05:09.18`	`mbfg`	`that's a link error, i take it?`
`05:14.11`	`mbfg`	`or did you forget to include bzfsAPI.h`
`05:14.59`	`Flash`	`sorry... I swear I checked that right, but I also re-checked out.`
`05:15.16`	`Flash`	`The problem is that the switch statement doesn't have a "default:" label`
`05:15.23`	`Flash`	`it should only be a warning though`
`05:16.53`	`Flash`	`someone with CVS access should fix that... hardly seems worth making a patch of it`
`05:17.10`	`mbfg`	`hmm`
`05:17.16`	`mbfg`	`what ide are u using`
`05:18.12`	`Flash`	`[NP]Tangent: can you pastebin your entire build output?`
`05:24.20`	`[NP]Tangent`	`Flash, one moment`
`06:07.01`	`*** join/#bzflag Hannibal_bzf (n=chatzill@pool-71-113-211-10.herntx.dsl-w.verizon.net)`
`06:09.17`	`Flash`	`spldart: ping`
`06:14.09`	`*** part/#bzflag H0ley (n=H0ley@adsl-69-228-210-78.dsl.pltn13.pacbell.net)`
`06:15.24`	`*** part/#bzflag A-Delusion (n=A-Delusi@pool-141-158-104-202.pitt.east.verizon.net)`
`06:31.33`	`*** join/#bzflag Soraya_ (i=40df9904@gateway/web/cgi-irc/zeebrothers.net/x-b4f73e3891901353)`
`06:31.53`	`*** part/#bzflag Soraya_ (i=40df9904@gateway/web/cgi-irc/zeebrothers.net/x-b4f73e3891901353)`
`06:45.03`	`*** join/#bzflag mbfg (n=dave@38.118.53.165)`
`07:04.04`	`*** join/#bzflag JeffMmini (n=jeffm@pool-71-109-230-219.lsanca.dsl-w.verizon.net)`
`07:04.42`	`spldart`	`Flash: pong`
`07:04.57`	`Flash`	`all clean now?`
`07:05.27`	`spldart`	`clean.... tinkered with some stuff..trying to decide what to do next`
`07:05.31`	`Flash`	`I just wanted to know how many margueritas you had before trying to compile`
`07:05.50`	`Flash`	`what to do next? It's 0100... go to bed!`
`07:06.47`	`spldart`	`umm`
`07:06.48`	`spldart`	`well..`
`07:06.57`	`spldart`	`the glass holds like32 oz`
`07:07.01`	`spldart`	`I had 1 and a half`
`07:07.05`	`spldart`	`with not enough ice`
`07:07.05`	`spldart`	`hehe`
`07:08.35`	`spldart`	`Oh... and she does 1 lime 1 triple and 3 tequila... on her recipe`
`07:09.20`	`Flash`	`I figured that between the margueritas and the shower that your next step was already planned`
`07:09.34`	`spldart`	`hehe`
`07:09.37`	`spldart`	`In a bit`
`07:09.49`	`spldart`	`not quite now... she gotta clean up extra special too :)`
`07:10.04`	`Flash`	`better get her away from the keyboard then`
`07:10.25`	`spldart`	`We got plenty of night left :)`
`07:10.29`	`spldart`	`but yeah`
`07:13.18`	`*** join/#bzflag short_circuit (n=short_ci@cpe-24-28-107-184.houston.res.rr.com)`
`07:17.48`	`*** join/#bzflag codergeek42 (n=peter@fedora/codergeek42)`
`07:24.06`	`*** join/#bzflag mbfg (n=dave@38.118.53.165)`
`07:24.32`	`mbfg`	`city map on bzexcess is really quite good`
`07:26.06`	`spldart`	`Louman is quite the map builder`
`08:21.30`	`CIA-3`	`BZFlag: 03brlcad * 10bzflag/src/bzfs/bzfs.cxx: windows won't throw a setvbuf assertion if you provide a buffer size (Expression: ((2 <=size) && (size <= INT_MAX)) error)`
`08:30.58`	`CIA-3`	`BZFlag: 03brlcad * 10bzflag/src/bzfs/bzfs.cxx: er, define BUFSIZE for setvbuf`
`09:10.52`	`CIA-3`	`BZFlag: 03blast007 * 10bzflag/src/bzfs/commands.cxx: Use sendGrabFlagMessage for "/flag give" so that the shot type is set`
`09:45.19`	`*** join/#bzflag Tupone (n=Tupone@pdpc/supporter/active/Tupone)`
`09:45.19`	`*** mode/#bzflag [+v Tupone] by ChanServ`
`09:47.24`	`*** part/#bzflag JeffMmini (n=jeffm@pool-71-109-230-219.lsanca.dsl-w.verizon.net)`
`10:03.55`	`*** join/#bzflag ts (n=ts@p54B017AD.dip0.t-ipconnect.de)`
`10:37.39`	`*** join/#bzflag lan56 (i=lan56@adsl-75-5-15-212.dsl.irvnca.sbcglobal.net)`
`10:50.59`	`lan56`	`boooo a myspace for bzflag? how childish, and abusive to the game`
`11:20.33`	`lan56`	`I hope I summed up why myspace is bad for bzflag on bzbb`
`11:37.50`	`*** join/#bzflag donny_baker (n=donny_ba@c-71-229-86-135.hsd1.mi.comcast.net)`
`12:20.37`	`spldart`	`riiiiiigghhtt`
`12:38.42`	`*** join/#bzflag CBG (n=CBG@cpc4-stme1-0-0-cust103.cdif.cable.ntl.com)`
`13:23.59`	`*** join/#bzflag rocknroll (n=58fe7217@vs189182.vserver.de)`
`13:24.17`	`rocknroll`	`hallo`
`13:25.14`	`*** join/#bzflag rocknroll (n=58fe7217@vs189182.vserver.de)`
`13:25.29`	`rocknroll`	`hallo an alle`
`13:25.36`	`rocknroll`	`huhu`
`14:05.40`	`*** join/#bzflag Destroyer1313 (n=4165febe@bz.bzflag.bz)`
`15:05.26`	`*** join/#bzflag A-Delusion (n=A-Delusi@pool-141-158-104-202.pitt.east.verizon.net)`
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`15:29.59`	`*** join/#bzflag spldart (n=troublem@cpe-24-28-107-184.houston.res.rr.com)`
`15:34.33`	`Goodbye2U`	`umm... can I register my IRC nick here?`
`15:34.46`	`CBG`	`/msg nickserv help`
`15:35.03`	`Goodbye2U`	`ty`
`15:37.30`	`*** join/#bzflag zee494 (i=3e4de48a@gateway/web/cgi-irc/zeebrothers.net/x-11a103aec84c6cd1)`
`16:18.50`	`[NP]Tangent`	`Flash, I have that paste whenever you're ready`
`16:40.43`	`*** join/#bzflag Goodbye2U (n=4165febe@bz.bzflag.bz)`
`16:45.42`	`*** join/#bzflag tannerld (n=tanner@adsl-068-209-251-067.sip.asm.bellsouth.net)`
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`17:05.33`	`*** join/#bzflag Gnurdux (n=gnurdux@c-69-251-233-242.hsd1.md.comcast.net)`
`17:08.03`	`*** join/#bzflag DTRemenak\|RDP (i=DTRemena@about/essy/CrazyCoder/DTRemenak)`
`17:08.04`	`*** mode/#bzflag [+v DTRemenak\|RDP] by ChanServ`
`17:09.12`	`*** join/#bzflag \|zongo\| (n=zongo@int-32-75.mobile.unibas.ch)`
`17:10.39`	`tannerld`	`anybody got anomaly's bBZAdmin to compile?`
`17:10.49`	`*** join/#bzflag Blue_Eyes (n=Blue@host246-200-dynamic.0-87-r.retail.telecomitalia.it)`
`17:27.30`	`[NP]Tangent`	`gBZadmin?`
`17:28.37`	`tannerld`	`http://my.bzflag.org/bb/viewtopic.php?t=9361\`
`17:29.02`	`[NP]Tangent`	`I have the source, yes`
`17:29.14`	`[NP]Tangent`	`it's easy to get, just gotta know how`
`17:29.32`	`tannerld`	`I got it; just missing some packages`
`17:32.05`	`brlcad`	`interesting app`
`17:33.23`	`*** join/#bzflag ts (n=ts@p54B005A1.dip0.t-ipconnect.de)`
`17:42.37`	`*** join/#bzflag DTRemenak\|RDP (i=DTRemena@about/essy/CrazyCoder/DTRemenak)`
`17:42.37`	`*** mode/#bzflag [+v DTRemenak\|RDP] by ChanServ`
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`17:54.14`	`*** join/#bzflag JeffM2501 (n=jeffm@pool-71-109-230-219.lsanca.dsl-w.verizon.net)`
`17:54.14`	`*** mode/#bzflag [+o JeffM2501] by ChanServ`
`17:55.49`	`CBG`	`Hey JeffM2501. Can you explain what the torblock plugin does and how the user interacts with it?`
`17:56.09`	`JeffM2501`	`there is no interaction`
`17:56.10`	`CBG`	`I looked at the code last night, didn't see any URLs or whatever. :/`
`17:56.24`	`tannerld`	`eheh`
`17:56.25`	`JeffM2501`	`it goes and gets the page from the site`
`17:56.39`	`JeffM2501`	`and then dosn't let anyone from those IPs join`
`17:56.46`	`JeffM2501`	`URL is hardcoded in there IIRC`
`17:56.48`	`JeffM2501`	`let me look`
`17:57.50`	`CBG`	`You're right, it is. :\|`
`17:57.56`	`CBG`	`I have no clue how I missed it before...`
`17:57.58`	`JeffM2501`	`the URL is in the torMasterList variable`
`17:58.00`	`tannerld`	`:D`
`17:58.10`	`JeffM2501`	`but it dosn't have any / commands or anything`
`17:58.12`	`CBG`	`It _was_ 3am... :/`
`17:58.15`	`JeffM2501`	`it's all automatic`
`17:58.19`	`CBG`	`Ok, I'll look again. Thanks.`
`17:59.18`	`*** join/#bzflag randomparticle (n=randompa@about/essy/snick/randomparticle)`
`17:59.40`	`randomparticle`	`i've put a cvs universal binary client online`
`17:59.45`	`randomparticle`	`tankzilla has just tried it`
`17:59.57`	`randomparticle`	`everything seems to work fine on his PPC machine but..`
`18:00.23`	`randomparticle`	`when he adds 'set showVelocites 3' to his config file, he doesn't see the velocities`
`18:00.48`	`randomparticle`	`can't think of a reason why that wouldn't work if he is using the correct config`
`18:01.09`	`randomparticle`	`any ideas?`
`18:01.10`	`CBG`	`Why can't he set it in the options menu?`
`18:01.12`	`JeffM2501`	`head or 2.0.x ?`
`18:01.31`	`randomparticle`	`2.0.9 CVS from last night. i see the velocities`
`18:01.39`	`JeffM2501`	`wierd`
`18:01.49`	`JeffM2501`	`did you have to mod the build system at all?`
`18:02.11`	`randomparticle`	`i added GLEW for the anisotropic filtering and FSAA`
`18:02.51`	`randomparticle`	`oh, and i removed that glGetBooleanv call from FontManager.cxx`
`18:02.56`	`JeffM2501`	`we don't have FSAA`
`18:03.07`	`randomparticle`	`i know, it's my addition`
`18:03.19`	`JeffM2501`	`legaly you have to provide your moded source too`
`18:03.24`	`JeffM2501`	`if it's not the standard build`
`18:03.33`	`JeffM2501`	`did you have to mod the project?`
`18:03.42`	`randomparticle`	`it's about 8 lines of code`
`18:03.46`	`randomparticle`	`in total`
`18:03.52`	`JeffM2501`	`dosn't mater`
`18:03.56`	`randomparticle`	`yes, i did mod it`
`18:04.01`	`JeffM2501`	`the license says you have to provide source`
`18:04.12`	`randomparticle`	`the whole source or just the changes?`
`18:04.27`	`randomparticle`	`will some patch files be sufficient?`
`18:04.29`	`JeffM2501`	`legaly the entire source`
`18:05.08`	`randomparticle`	`well, i could i suppose. but if it's going to end up as a long involved thing, i'd rather not bother`
`18:05.56`	`randomparticle`	`there is, actually, FSAA code in the original source, but it doesn't get used it seems`
`18:06.14`	`randomparticle`	`or was that something else? lemme check`
`18:06.15`	`JeffM2501`	`if you don't your violating the lgpl`
`18:08.31`	`JeffM2501`	`where did you put it online?`
`18:08.50`	`randomparticle`	`can't tell you. that would encourage violation of the lgpl :)`
`18:09.03`	`JeffM2501`	`then I guess your not helping`
`18:09.15`	`JeffM2501`	`I'd like to see the mods to make it universal`
`18:09.27`	`randomparticle`	`it's just compiled twice and lipo-ed`
`18:09.37`	`randomparticle`	`nothing fancy`
`18:09.58`	`JeffM2501`	`ahh so no mods for the uni part to the project`
`18:10.02`	`randomparticle`	`no`
`18:11.34`	`randomparticle`	`i'll pastebin those mods. one moment`
`18:11.57`	`JeffM2501`	`can you just submit them as a patch?`
`18:12.15`	`randomparticle`	`i already sent something similar to brlcad`
`18:12.34`	`JeffM2501`	`sending it to a single person isn't the same as puting a patch on SF`
`18:12.48`	`JeffM2501`	`it's possible more then one person could apply it`
`18:13.04`	`JeffM2501`	`that's why the SF patch system lets any of us grab it and track who's doing it`
`18:13.09`	`randomparticle`	`i imagine that requires registration blah blah blah`
`18:13.41`	`randomparticle`	`really, i do get fed up of registering on all these occasions when i just want to post 1 thing`
`18:13.56`	`JeffM2501`	`it's how we work`
`18:14.07`	`JeffM2501`	`but if you just want your work ignored, be my guest`
`18:14.42`	`randomparticle`	`no, it's just i have every expectation of it being ignored even if i do go through with all that palaver`
`18:15.14`	`JeffM2501`	`we have a number of mac developers, heck even I have a mac now`
`18:15.16`	`*** join/#bzflag [dmp] (n=dennis@koderen.dk)`
`18:16.14`	`randomparticle`	`http://pastebin.ca/raw/331239`
`18:17.11`	`JeffM2501`	`that only take effect at startup?`
`18:17.21`	`randomparticle`	`yes`
`18:17.51`	`brlcad`	`randomparticle: if it's the mods that I'm thinking of, several of the changes could not be applied`
`18:18.08`	`randomparticle`	`ok, fair enough`
`18:18.37`	`brlcad`	`that latest sdl patch is different, you didn't send me that one fwiw`
`18:18.38`	`randomparticle`	`but on intel macs with radeon cards there is no way of getting FSAA (that i know of)without`
`18:18.43`	`JeffM2501`	`wonder how hard it would be to rebuild the context on the changes.`
`18:18.44`	`randomparticle`	`adding new code to bzflag`
`18:19.19`	`randomparticle`	`the expectation on OS X is that the application will apply FSAA settings`
`18:20.25`	`randomparticle`	`i.e., it is not expected that they will be tweaked externally, though some people can do that if they have older macs and ati displays`
`18:20.34`	`tannerld`	`[NP]Tangent: did you get gbzadmin compiled yet?`
`18:21.15`	`randomparticle`	`brlcad: yep, i added a small number of lines to take the setting from the config`
`18:21.40`	`brlcad`	`one of the problems with the prior changes were that they were mac-specific directly applied in the middle of source files (they would break other platforms)`
`18:21.53`	`brlcad`	`like a mac-specific option in the sdl platform file`
`18:22.01`	`randomparticle`	`indeed`
`18:22.13`	`brlcad`	`but i see you're using sdl routines now?`
`18:22.21`	`brlcad`	`or is that in addition to the other mod`
`18:22.34`	`randomparticle`	`the other two are mac-specific`
`18:23.12`	`randomparticle`	`it was just a convenient place to throw them in quickly for testing`
`18:23.17`	`CBG`	`This wont work: "bz_sendTextMessage(BZ_SERVER,playerID,params->get(0));"... Am I doing something stupid?`
`18:23.29`	`randomparticle`	`of course, in a proper implementation i'd expect it to be done differently`
`18:23.59`	`JeffM2501`	`CBG the text message probalby wants a const char* for the text, get returns an APIString, you want to use the .c_str() after the get`
`18:24.13`	`CBG`	`ahha, ok, thanks`
`18:24.18`	`randomparticle`	`i noticed before that some of the issues are already addressed in the mac bzflag code`
`18:24.44`	`randomparticle`	`but for whatever reason vsync etc do not occur`
`18:25.04`	`randomparticle`	`i'm not sure that code is even reached. SDL may take its place`
`18:25.10`	`brlcad`	`ah, yes.. here's the other`
`18:25.25`	`brlcad`	`+ /* NEW: multi-threaded opengl */`
`18:25.25`	`brlcad`	`+ CGLContextObj ctx = CGLGetCurrentContext();`
`18:25.25`	`brlcad`	`+ CGLEnable(ctx, (CGLContextEnable) 313);`
`18:25.25`	`brlcad`	`+`
`18:25.25`	`brlcad`	`+ /* NEW: vsync */`
`18:25.26`	`Guu`	`Wish I knew!`
`18:25.27`	`Guu`	`Wish I knew.`
`18:25.27`	`brlcad`	`+ long sync = 1;`
`18:25.28`	`Guu`	`Bugger all, I dunno.`
`18:25.29`	`Guu`	`Wish I knew.`
`18:25.30`	`brlcad`	`+ CGLSetParameter (ctx, kCGLCPSwapInterval, &sync);`
`18:25.31`	`Guu`	`I don't have a clue, brlcad.`
`18:25.37`	`brlcad`	`heh`
`18:25.38`	`blast007`	`heh..`
`18:25.39`	`randomparticle`	`yep, those are the two`
`18:25.48`	`JeffM2501`	`she uses + ;)`
`18:26.16`	`randomparticle`	`can BZFlag be fully compiled on OS X now without SDL?`
`18:26.30`	`brlcad`	`randomparticle: huh?`
`18:26.37`	`brlcad`	`that used to work`
`18:26.57`	`randomparticle`	`didn't work for me when i last tried it`
`18:26.59`	`brlcad`	`last I checked a couple weeks ago, still does`
`18:27.18`	`randomparticle`	`which was, admittedly, some time ago now`
`18:27.52`	`randomparticle`	`i'll give it another go`
`18:28.11`	`brlcad`	`the CGL mods would be entirely proper for the non-sdl interface`
`18:28.23`	`randomparticle`	`some of that may already be in there`
`18:28.24`	`brlcad`	`there's currently no platform-specific code in the sdl interface`
`18:28.57`	`randomparticle`	`what about the anti-aliasing. is that worth having?`
`18:29.22`	`brlcad`	`with the bzdb wrapper (and ideally a menu option), sure`
`18:29.44`	`JeffM2501`	`I am prety shure I can do the fsaa as a real menu item`
`18:29.53`	`randomparticle`	`would be nice`
`18:29.54`	`JeffM2501`	`and make it go on and off at run time`
`18:30.17`	`randomparticle`	`also: the anisotropic filtering`
`18:30.27`	`JeffM2501`	`did you use glew?`
`18:30.30`	`randomparticle`	`yes`
`18:30.42`	`JeffM2501`	`so that's just get ing glew into the normal mac build`
`18:30.53`	`JeffM2501`	`no code changes for that`
`18:30.59`	`randomparticle`	`yep. i just linked in a static library in the end`
`18:31.27`	`JeffM2501`	`good enough`
`18:31.32`	`randomparticle`	`makes me wonder why the official builds don't have glew in them. it's an incredibly simple from a building perspective`
`18:31.41`	`randomparticle`	`s/an//`
`18:32.17`	`*** join/#bzflag cosmol (n=dave@71.86.125.165)`
`18:32.19`	`*** join/#bzflag brad (n=brad@bzflag.b33r.net)`
`18:32.39`	`randomparticle`	`i thought it might be more complex, but the glew library can be build from just one .c file`
`18:32.49`	`randomparticle`	`*built`
`18:33.11`	`CIA-3`	`BZFlag: 03brlcad * 10bzflag/src/platform/SDLDisplay.cxx: add anti-aliasing capacity wrapped around bzdb 'multisamples' setting. mod from randomparticle/snick, thx.`
`18:33.34`	`randomparticle`	`wow :)`
`18:33.53`	`randomparticle`	`i feel honoured, brclad`
`18:34.00`	`randomparticle`	`thank you`
`18:34.43`	`randomparticle`	`does that mean i don't have to distribute the n-thousand lines of source now?`
`18:34.55`	`JeffM2501`	`your build still has changes`
`18:34.56`	`randomparticle`	`to be in accordance with the lgpl`
`18:35.03`	`JeffM2501`	`and your build is 2.0`
`18:35.07`	`JeffM2501`	`so yes`
`18:35.21`	`JeffM2501`	`if your build isn't from the plain vanila sources, you have to distro source code`
`18:36.02`	`randomparticle`	`that may be the correct way to do it, but it's hardly convenient is it? i mean, it doesn't really encourage people to make small changes, does it?`
`18:36.20`	`JeffM2501`	`the lGPL isn't there for your personal conviennce`
`18:36.27`	`randomparticle`	`in other words, it's not in keeping with the spirit of the lgpl`
`18:36.28`	`brlcad`	`technically, you just have to make them available upon request`
`18:36.36`	`JeffM2501`	`that is true`
`18:36.44`	`randomparticle`	`well, i'm happy to do that`
`18:36.57`	`randomparticle`	`can i just provide the changes, though?`
`18:37.11`	`JeffM2501`	`IIRC you have to provide them with everything they need to build`
`18:37.16`	`brlcad`	`you can just post your patches, doesn't have to be "everything", but the legality compliance is still probably arguable that you'd have to provide everything upon request as a derivative work`
`18:37.19`	`randomparticle`	`for goodness sake, we're not talking about hundreds of lines of new code here. just 8 lines or so`
`18:37.33`	`JeffM2501`	`size maters not`
`18:37.48`	`randomparticle`	`it hardly seems in keeping with the spirit of the lgpl`
`18:38.00`	`JeffM2501`	`spirit != law`
`18:38.24`	`JeffM2501`	`but realy, we need the soruce so we can make derivives off your work`
`18:38.40`	`JeffM2501`	`that's the true spirit`
`18:39.05`	`randomparticle`	`you have most of the source. it's in CVS :)`
`18:39.10`	`CIA-3`	`BZFlag: 03brlcad * 10bzflag/ (NEWS AUTHORS): credit randomparticle for the anti-aliasing option, first new 2007 contributor`
`18:39.21`	`JeffM2501`	`most is not all`
`18:39.32`	`JeffM2501`	`we also don't know what specific date of CVS you pulled from`
`18:39.36`	`randomparticle`	`so i can just provide 8 lines and the cvs revision number?`
`18:39.40`	`JeffM2501`	`so redoing your merge may be hard`
`18:39.52`	`SportChick`	`hi randomparticle`
`18:39.53`	`JeffM2501`	`acording to the leter of the license that could be iffy`
`18:40.06`	`JeffM2501`	`it all depends how badly Tim woudl want to go after you`
`18:40.17`	`randomparticle`	`i'm not trying to be awkward here. all i want to do is give a client that has anisotropic filtering etc to a couple of friends who have trouble compiling their own`
`18:40.33`	`randomparticle`	`i'm not in the massive bzflag mod and distribution business :)`
`18:40.41`	`JeffM2501`	`at least post the mods`
`18:40.48`	`brlcad`	`randomparticle: depends how risk-averse you are -- in good faith would be to at least post your patches and perhaps instructions how you applied/apply them`
`18:40.54`	`JeffM2501`	`or have them submited as patches`
`18:41.23`	`randomparticle`	`there are only two patches. one is that anti-aliasing patch`
`18:41.35`	`brlcad`	`the risk is practically non-existent given the nature of these changes`
`18:41.43`	`brlcad`	`only relevant as you've posted binaries`
`18:42.10`	`randomparticle`	`the other where i comment out a glGetBooleanv call`
`18:42.17`	`randomparticle`	`we discussed that before`
`18:42.27`	`JeffM2501`	`didn't we remove that from the main code?`
`18:42.54`	`randomparticle`	`still in 2.0.9 cvs it would appear`
`18:43.01`	`JeffM2501`	`I mean head`
`18:43.04`	`brlcad`	`yay snow`
`18:44.14`	`brlcad`	`randomparticle: from everything I looked up, the multi-threaded opengl mod isn't guaranteed to work even on all macs`
`18:44.24`	`donny_baker`	`brclad: if you don't get enough, you can have the 10" or so we got last night`
`18:44.25`	`randomparticle`	`indeed`
`18:44.38`	`randomparticle`	`not on ppc i think`
`18:44.41`	`randomparticle`	`or older OS X`
`18:45.02`	`JeffM2501`	`does it provide any benifit?`
`18:45.13`	`brlcad`	`randomparticle: point being, there's no easy way to test whether it's supported or whether it'll cause "bad things" to happen`
`18:45.31`	`brlcad`	`it either works or doesn't .. and only visually testable`
`18:46.18`	`brlcad`	`the vsync option is better, but there should be an sdl facility for that (or it should be pushed as an sdl mod if it isn't)`
`18:47.05`	`randomparticle`	`curiously, i found the ppc version i compiled actually runs quite well under rosetta`
`18:47.31`	`randomparticle`	`didn't test it long enough to see if it crashes, but in the past ppc bzfag would crash quite quickly on intel`
`18:47.49`	`randomparticle`	`*bzflag :)`
`18:48.00`	`brlcad`	`that was due to a networking issue, iirc`
`18:48.29`	`brlcad`	`which has been fixed`
`18:48.33`	`randomparticle`	`i had 160fps at one point, which isn't bad`
`18:48.38`	`JeffM2501`	`floatpack`
`18:49.42`	`brlcad`	`randomparticle: forwarding your message to the list in case anyone else wants to investigate improving the mac-specific mods so they can be applied`
`18:49.43`	`ts`	`brlcad: Umm, you forgot to include the header and where is multisamples expected to be set?`
`18:49.52`	`randomparticle`	`ok, thanks`
`18:50.08`	`brlcad`	`ts: presumably as a local var right now`
`18:53.10`	`ts`	`brlcad: Without an entry in defaultBZDB.cxx it will not survive a restart of BZFlag`
`18:53.21`	`ts`	`Want me to do these changes?`
`18:58.32`	`brlcad`	`ts: sure, go for it`
`18:58.56`	`brlcad`	`would be appreciated`
`18:59.06`	`brlcad`	`one less thing for JeffM2501 to do when he works on the menu option :)`
`18:59.22`	`donny_baker`	`so do you guys want to do that wiki idea we talked about friday?`
`18:59.24`	`brlcad`	`and if you did the menu option too, even less ;)`
`19:00.06`	`brlcad`	`donny_baker: you're volunteering, I presume`
`19:00.11`	`donny_baker`	`yes`
`19:00.51`	`brlcad`	`heh`
`19:00.52`	`donny_baker`	`i am in the process of setting one up on my srever at home to play with the permissions`
`19:01.49`	`donny_baker`	`so would you want to limit editing on all pages only to those who have been granted/requested edit permissions?`
`19:01.58`	`brlcad`	`do you have an sf.net account?`
`19:02.00`	`blast007`	`and I'd be willing to host the wiki on my server`
`19:02.32`	`donny_baker`	`brlcad: I do but have to dig it up...`
`19:02.33`	`brlcad`	`might as well host it up on the main site`
`19:02.44`	`blast007`	`brlcad: meaing SF.net, or bzflag.bz?`
`19:02.55`	`brlcad`	`blast007: sf.net, reason not to?`
`19:02.55`	`blast007`	`meaning*`
`19:03.04`	`blast007`	`brlcad: well, you can't run the latest version at SF`
`19:03.07`	`blast007`	`it needs PHP5`
`19:03.25`	`blast007`	`(for mediawiki)`
`19:03.44`	`CIA-3`	`BZFlag: 03t-s * 10bzflag/src/ (bzflag/defaultBZDB.cxx platform/SDLDisplay.cxx): Fix anti-aliasing option`
`19:04.43`	`brlcad`	`blast007: hmm.. that's odd`
`19:04.56`	`brlcad`	`i mean, mediawiki is hosted by sourceforge :)`
`19:05.43`	`brlcad`	`i can't imagine the mods/errors being drastic to get it to work -- what makes it php5 specific?`
`19:05.43`	`randomparticle`	`is any work being done on allowing mouse sensitivity to be controlled/set through the bzflag client?`
`19:07.40`	`donny_baker`	`from mediawiki:PHP 5 support has been required since MediaWiki 1.7 - if you are using an older version of PHP and cannot upgrade then you should use MediaWiki 1.6.9`
`19:08.34`	`donny_baker`	`and they recommend PHP 5.1`
`19:09.22`	`*** join/#bzflag A_Heart_Attack (n=bzhearta@ool-44c75115.dyn.optonline.net)`
`19:11.05`	`brlcad`	`donny_baker: getting php5 isn't a problem (it's what .bz runs for m.b.o), but finding a way to get on sf.net would be ideal if possible`
`19:11.21`	`brlcad`	`asked the mediawiki folks just a sec ago, see what they say`
`19:14.52`	`brlcad`	`then the next probably more pertinent question is whether there is anything significantly interesting added between 1.6.9 and 1.9.0 that would potentially make the decision easier -- anyone find a changelog?`
`19:15.33`	`donny_baker`	`http://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/Important_Release_Notes`
`19:16.44`	`*** part/#bzflag randomparticle (n=randompa@about/essy/snick/randomparticle)`
`19:16.55`	`donny_baker`	`those are real ugly though`
`19:19.10`	`donny_baker`	`I found why they required PHP 5 with 1.7+:A potential HTML/JavaScript-injection vulnerability in a debugging script has been fixed. Only versions and configurations of PHP vulnerable to the $GLOBALS overwrite vulnerability are affected.`
`19:20.55`	`donny_baker`	`also iirc the control over who has rights to edit pages was not as detailed or configurable back then`
`19:28.02`	`brlcad`	`that shouldn't be a php5 issue, but I did get some details from a mediawiki dev`
`19:28.25`	`brlcad`	`"php5 specific language features used: implicite pass-by-ref for objects; exceptions; probably some api functions. some more stuff"`
`19:28.53`	`brlcad`	`which does make it a pita to put it on sf.net`
`19:33.41`	`*** join/#bzflag shorty114 (n=shorty11@unaffiliated/shorty114)`
`19:37.36`	`SportChick`	`hi brlcad`
`19:37.52`	`brlcad`	`hi SportChicky`
`19:37.56`	`CIA-3`	`BZFlag: 03brlcad * 10bzflag/AUTHORS: Matthew Sachs of Apple provided 10.4 build fixes back in May 2005 for 1.10.6, credit him accordingly.`
`19:40.13`	`SportChick`	`donny_baker: how about a timemachine instead?`
`19:40.32`	`donny_baker`	`lol...`
`19:41.13`	`a_meteorite`	`wow, crediting someone that's nearly two years later? heh`
`19:41.35`	`SportChick`	`a_meteorite ?`
`19:41.45`	`a_meteorite`	`BZFlag: brlcad * bzflag/AUTHORS: Matthew Sachs of Apple provided 10.4 build fixes back in May 2005 for 1.10.6, credit him accordingly.`
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`19:43.37`	`Theme97`	`rofl`
`19:49.16`	`JeffM2501`	`oh it didn't have a default?`
`19:53.14`	`*** join/#bzflag Quol (n=Quol@modemcable177.75-202-24.mc.videotron.ca)`
`19:54.38`	`A_Heart_Attack`	`Quol!!`
`19:56.38`	`[NP]Tangent`	`oh no! not him!`
`19:57.35`	`A_Heart_Attack`	`lol [NP]Tangent`
`19:59.31`	`Quol`	`hello A_Heart_Attack :)`
`20:05.05`	`brlcad`	`a_meteorite: I credit them as I find them -- no reason to not credit people for work they contribute, regardless of when it occurred`
`20:05.38`	`brlcad`	`in this case, I ran across an old e-mail from mike while searching for something else`
`20:05.41`	`a_meteorite`	`true`
`20:05.52`	`a_meteorite`	`just unusual to find something so much later :D`
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`20:32.26`	`JeffM2501`	`how big is "too big" for a bzflag install download?`
`20:33.21`	`ts`	`depends on the audience`
`20:33.28`	`JeffM2501`	`ours`
`20:33.33`	`JeffM2501`	`we are at about 10 megs`
`20:33.36`	`JeffM2501`	`right now`
`20:33.44`	`CBG`	`10MB is nothing...`
`20:33.54`	`JeffM2501`	`wonder if I can go up to like 15-20 ( asuming it's justified ) with out major complaints`
`20:33.56`	`CBG`	`And that's coming from a dude with only 30GB.`
`20:34.03`	`ts`	`We have 56k users, too..`
`20:34.04`	`CBG`	`You could, imo.`
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`20:34.27`	`JeffM2501`	`yes we do`
`20:34.31`	`JeffM2501`	`but how many of them do we have?`
`20:34.54`	`JeffM2501`	`is it enough to make a smaller installer for those few 56kers`
`20:35.27`	`ts`	`If the textures use more resources, then we could do an extra high quality release`
`20:36.04`	`[NP]Tangent`	`I'd say that if not already done, bzadmin and bzfs could be left out of a smaller release for Windows users`
`20:36.07`	`JeffM2501`	`well I'm thinking of making a low quality release :)`
`20:36.22`	`JeffM2501`	`those are not the major files in the release`
`20:36.24`	`ts`	`but for 56k users 10MB is already some stuff`
`20:36.25`	`JeffM2501`	`that may save 200k`
`20:36.36`	`JeffM2501`	`how many dialup users do you think we have?`
`20:36.45`	`[NP]Tangent`	`not that many`
`20:36.52`	`[NP]Tangent`	`I downloaded BZflag on dialup`
`20:36.56`	`ts`	`Perhaps you could do a poll at the forums :)`
`20:37.00`	`[NP]Tangent`	`never tried playing it on dialup though :D`
`20:37.53`	`JeffM2501`	`basicly I want to ship 2 sets of textures, high and low, and make a low only release for those few uers on dialup`
`20:38.12`	`CBG`	`10MB takes, what, 20 mins to download with dialup?`
`20:38.14`	`JeffM2501`	`or I work on my autopatcher`
`20:38.21`	`CBG`	`What does it matter if that goes up to 30 minutes?`
`20:38.55`	`ts`	`Why should the game get 10MB bigger than now?`
`20:40.10`	`JeffM2501`	`so that it can look better on the average modern hardware`
`20:40.30`	`JeffM2501`	`so we can have more sounds, etc...`
`20:40.55`	`ts`	`well, you could leave all those out for the ones with low bandwidth`
`20:41.03`	`JeffM2501`	`that's what I was saying ;)`
`20:41.20`	`JeffM2501`	`or I make the system automaticly download them on first run`
`20:41.30`	`JeffM2501`	`and dialup users can disable that`
`20:42.12`	`ts`	`So the game would have some kind of installer capability? heh, I hate apps that do like this`
`20:42.24`	`JeffM2501`	`not realy`
`20:42.32`	`JeffM2501`	`it would be the same thing that downloads textures now`
`20:43.48`	`ts`	`I'm rather voting for two releases`
`20:44.07`	`JeffM2501`	`could do that too`
`20:44.16`	`JeffM2501`	`big release would have it all installed`
`20:44.33`	`JeffM2501`	`then we could add more stuff that is pushed to the clients later ;)`
`20:44.45`	`ts`	`Imagine 3 childs using one computer and bz is installed globally`
`20:44.55`	`ts`	`It would download all the stuff 3 times..`
`20:45.01`	`JeffM2501`	`depends how we do it`
`20:45.27`	`JeffM2501`	`but dual releases would not be a too hard thing`
`20:46.10`	`JeffM2501`	`should work on the resource manager more one of these days`
`20:46.49`	`ts`	`on the low quality one you should keep middle quality the same, high = high and experimental = experimantal in comparison to 2.0.x`
`20:47.20`	`JeffM2501`	`why?`
`20:47.26`	`ts`	`The game always delivered playability even when you're not on cutting edge hardware`
`20:47.27`	`JeffM2501`	`I mean keep the same binary`
`20:47.43`	`JeffM2501`	`the system will detect the fastest mode for the system and use that quality level in the app`
`20:47.57`	`JeffM2501`	`that fact would not change`
`20:48.02`	`ts`	`1 quality level is "gone", IIRC`
`20:48.15`	`JeffM2501`	`medium`
`20:48.20`	`JeffM2501`	`low is now mediumish`
`20:48.28`	`ts`	`yeah, lots of players use medium`
`20:48.43`	`JeffM2501`	`yeah they use medum now`
`20:48.46`	`ts`	`low is like 2D..`
`20:48.50`	`JeffM2501`	`and low is medium with texture soff`
`20:48.58`	`JeffM2501`	`no it's not "2d"`
`20:49.01`	`JeffM2501`	`it's just no textures`
`20:49.10`	`JeffM2501`	`quality and textures are now seperate`
`20:49.18`	`ts`	`oh`
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`20:49.31`	`JeffM2501`	`we are now basicly at the point where you need some level of hardware`
`20:49.39`	`JeffM2501`	`it was gonna have to happen sooner or later`
`20:50.37`	`ts`	`I don't mind bz using "animated fish" in experimental mode`
`20:50.59`	`ts`	`but it should remain playable for those with lower specs`
`20:51.20`	`ts`	`That's my opinion on that topic.`
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`20:52.19`	`brlcad`	`JeffM2501: I don't think download size is really a concern -- so they have to wait a little longer, big deal -- they only do it a couple times a year at best`
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`20:52.41`	`brlcad`	`the bigger issue is how much video ram they might need, min graphics specs, etc`
`20:54.05`	`brlcad`	`the mac download has been way bigger than 10MB since we went SDL .. aside from just being bloated even without debug symbols, with debug symbols we're almost at a 40MB download now`
`20:54.20`	`Quol`	`ya - the current bzflag is starting to get real slow on my ancient PC (PIII 500Mhz, ATI 64MB 7200 DDR) :)`
`20:54.21`	`*** join/#bzflag Goodbye2U (n=4165febe@bz.bzflag.bz)`
`20:55.35`	`mbfg`	`prolly the 64m vidmem mostly`
`20:55.42`	`Quol`	`with all the nice animations/maps around, my poor CPU goes nuts...`
`20:55.54`	`brlcad`	`fwiw, nobody complained about the gradual mac binary size increase (was 3, then 5, then 8, then 10, then 15, then 30, now 40MB)`
`20:55.58`	`JeffM2501`	`brlcad exactly, that's why I want to do 2 sets, and check the card ram before we run to pick the texture setting`
`20:56.10`	`JeffM2501`	`basicly add a new texture mode ( liniar mipmpap linear (high )`
`20:56.22`	`brlcad`	`sounds reasonable .. doing the test without crashing will be nifty ;)`
`20:56.25`	`JeffM2501`	`that way we don't blow out there cards`
`20:56.27`	`JeffM2501`	`yeah`
`20:56.28`	`JeffM2501`	`it's easy`
`20:56.32`	`JeffM2501`	`we do it at work :)`
`20:56.40`	`brlcad`	`i just mean, i don't think the download size should be a concern at all`
`20:56.44`	`JeffM2501`	`if we can't see like 128megs of ram we use the old stuff`
`20:56.48`	`brlcad`	`at least until we're larger than a CD`
`20:56.52`	`JeffM2501`	`unless they turn it on`
`20:57.03`	`JeffM2501`	`ok, so 40-50 isn't bad in your mind?`
`20:57.07`	`brlcad`	`nope`
`20:57.22`	`brlcad`	`most games with decent graphics are way more than that`
`20:57.48`	`JeffM2501`	`or at least get that big after content updates`
`20:57.55`	`JeffM2501`	`like guildwars`
`21:02.21`	`brlcad`	`yeah.. saying the app is only "20MB" and then requiring you sit there and wait while it downloads 100MB textures, levels, and other junk is BS :)`
`21:03.16`	`JeffM2501`	`GW does a decen job, it downloads in the background while you play :)`
`21:03.19`	`JeffM2501`	`but yes`
`21:03.53`	`brlcad`	`i mean from a marketing-of-size perspective. downloading resources is fine ;)`
`21:04.51`	`blast007`	`NSIS could download an extra texture pack if the user wanted`
`21:05.15`	`blast007`	`but I figure a lot of people on 56k use some form of download manager anyway, so I don't think a bigger installer is bad`
`21:06.36`	`JeffM2501`	`right now I'm thinking of just making the big installer, and if we get complatints about size, we make the call to make a smaller installer`
`21:06.45`	`JeffM2501`	`and I just make the code smart that if the high res dosn't exist we use the low`
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`21:27.27`	`gsnedders`	`brlcad: pm?`
`21:41.24`	`CBG`	`Will bz_URLHandler work with a local path?`
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`22:29.17`	`Flash`	`DTRemenak: what is RDP?`
`22:29.47`	`DTRemenak`	`Flash: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Remote_Desktop_Protocol`
`22:30.08`	`DTRemenak`	`I was not actually using it, it's just my second nick from this machine`
`22:30.26`	`DTRemenak`	`so when I connect remotely while I'm still connected locally, local is DTRemenak and remote is DTRemenak\|RDP`
`22:30.55`	`DTRemenak`	`'course if freenode decides to reset my connection the same thing happens, just with two local clients, like today.`
`22:36.07`	`blast007\|SSH`	`;)`
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`22:39.32`	`A_Heart_Attack`	`:o`
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`23:41.25`	`brlcad`	`gsnedders: huh?`
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