irclog2html for #bzflag on 20060413

`00:00.12`	`JeffM2501`	`I've seen 3500's in a nforce 4 mobo for usualy around 200$`
`00:00.25`	`DTRemenak`	`I'd buy that`
`00:00.28`	`JeffM2501`	`or 3800's with a mobo for 300-350`
`00:01.41`	`JeffM2501`	`just make sure you get socket 939`
`00:01.44`	`JeffM2501`	`:)`
`00:01.46`	`DTRemenak`	`yeah`
`00:01.47`	`JeffM2501`	`and 2 dimms`
`00:01.50`	`JeffM2501`	`dual channel rocks`
`00:02.09`	`DTRemenak`	`yup`
`00:02.11`	`JeffM2501`	`usualy you can get a gig of ram in 2 dimms for 100$`
`00:03.56`	`JeffM2501`	`if you do find a good deal on an ATI X800, you may think about it, it's not a bad card`
`00:03.58`	`JeffM2501`	`for an ATI`
`00:04.10`	`CIA-6`	`BZFlag: 03dtremenak * 10bzflag/src/common/cURLManager.cxx: use CURLOPT_FORBID_REUSE to avoid stale waiting connections`
`00:04.33`	`JeffM2501`	`X800's an higher get the nod of "they suck a lot less"`
`00:05.02`	`DTRemenak`	`linux drivers still suck`
`00:05.08`	`CIA-6`	`BZFlag: 03dtremenak 07v2_0branch * 10bzflag/src/common/cURLManager.cxx: use CURLOPT_FORBID_REUSE to avoid stale waiting connections`
`00:05.10`	`JeffM2501`	`that is possible`
`00:05.31`	`JeffM2501`	`the windows drivers are a lot better on the X800 and better`
`00:05.35`	`DTRemenak`	`I buy nvidia for the drivers. Both windows and linux are better.`
`00:05.41`	`JeffM2501`	`true`
`00:05.50`	`JeffM2501`	`wonder if they have a PCI-E 6200`
`00:05.54`	`JeffM2501`	`those suckers are cheap`
`00:05.57`	`JeffM2501`	`and not bad at all`
`00:06.17`	`JeffM2501`	`AGP ones are like 70$`
`00:06.42`	`DTRemenak`	`they probably want people who are looking at that range to go 7300 anyway.`
`00:07.47`	`JeffM2501`	`6800GS is the bang for buck card`
`00:07.51`	`JeffM2501`	`in the PCI-E range`
`00:16.04`	`*** join/#bzflag JBdiGriz (n=jbdigriz@12.147.16.2)`
`00:16.04`	`*** mode/#bzflag [+o JBdiGriz] by ChanServ`
`00:17.23`	`lan56`	`where is the avatar selection on bzbb?`
`00:17.41`	`JeffM2501`	`in your profile`
`00:17.50`	`JeffM2501`	`there is a "view gallery" option`
`00:18.27`	`lan56`	`I don't seem to see it, maybe I am just not looking hard enough tho`
`00:18.51`	`lan56`	`on the edit profile page correct?`
`00:18.59`	`JeffM2501`	`yeah`
`00:19.01`	`JeffM2501`	`near the bottom`
`00:19.05`	`brlcad`	`DTRemenak: i might have the problem, but I don't see them as CLOSE_WAIT`
`00:19.29`	`JeffM2501`	`it's riight above the "submit" button, says "Show gallery"`
`00:19.35`	`JeffM2501`	`it's like the very LAST item`
`00:19.46`	`lan56`	`the last item for me is Date Format`
`00:19.56`	`lan56`	`then Submit\|Reset`
`00:20.02`	`JeffM2501`	`what username?`
`00:20.08`	`DTRemenak`	`brlcad: it looks like it closes them all once it's done downloading the map and all files`
`00:20.09`	`lan56`	`"Lan"`
`00:20.17`	`DTRemenak`	`just leaves motd and list server open`
`00:20.34`	`JeffM2501`	`wierd, for some reason your avatar perms were revoked`
`00:20.39`	`JeffM2501`	`I turned them back on`
`00:20.43`	`DTRemenak`	`heh`
`00:20.44`	`lan56`	`k thx`
`00:20.52`	`*** part/#bzflag Carnage (n=d808afc9@webchat.bzflag.bz)`
`00:21.15`	`lan56`	`all I had was a dog as my avatar anyway, so it wasn't too big of a deal if I didn't have em`
`00:30.23`	`JeffM2501`	`well you can set it to whatever now`
`00:30.57`	`lan56`	`right the dog is fine tho, I was more curious than anything. thanks for fixing it for me`
`00:31.19`	`JeffM2501`	`sure`
`00:34.11`	`*** join/#bzflag a-delusion (n=a-delusi@pool-141-158-70-194.pitt.east.verizon.net)`
`00:40.55`	`*** join/#bzflag mmu_man (i=revol@vaf26-2-82-244-111-82.fbx.proxad.net)`
`00:45.37`	`A_Meteorite`	`I thought of a good 2.0.8 codename: "the really good enough for now this time" :P`
`00:46.17`	`CBG`	`how about "this time it's _really_ good enough - sorry about the confusion last time" too long? :P`
`00:46.29`	`blast007`	`"are we there yet?"`
`00:46.38`	`CBG`	`sweet`
`00:46.48`	`shorty114`	`"no"`
`00:47.47`	`purple_cow`	`2.0.8?`
`00:47.57`	`Thumper_`	`"Slightly Better"`
`00:47.57`	`purple_cow`	`i didn't think there was going to be a .8`
`00:48.03`	`A_Meteorite`	`yes, to fix a problem`
`00:48.07`	`A_Meteorite`	`a big one`
`00:48.19`	`A_Meteorite`	`it happens that curl doesn't close the motd connection`
`00:48.22`	`A_Meteorite`	`so it bogs down apache`
`00:48.35`	`A_Meteorite`	`that's why the list server and the bzbb has been slow lately`
`00:49.39`	`blast007`	`and spawns are borked in 2.0.6`
`00:53.05`	`trepan`	`jeff's "it sucks less" is a contender`
`00:53.45`	`blast007`	`:)`
`00:53.50`	`CBG`	`true enough.`
`01:03.49`	`*** join/#bzflag Gnurdux (n=gnurdux@c-69-251-233-242.hsd1.md.comcast.net)`
`01:06.16`	`a-delusion`	`good enough to ----`
`01:06.53`	`*** join/#bzflag [shorty114] (n=shorty11@unaffiliated/shorty114)`
`01:32.22`	`menotume`	`we will wait a bit before a 2.0.8 release i hope`
`01:32.47`	`menotume`	`since all 'probalems' are in the server so far, and we don't want a 2..10 :)`
`01:33.21`	`Aribeth`	`lol`
`01:37.41`	`*** join/#bzflag bryjen (n=chatzill@2002:45a6:86ae:0:0:0:0:1)`
`01:37.41`	`*** mode/#bzflag [+v bryjen] by ChanServ`
`01:39.00`	`*** join/#bzflag hoopyFrood (n=tmm@cpe-66-75-151-220.san.res.rr.com)`
`01:59.16`	`Thumper_`	`trepan: map cache files (created with -cacheout): does geometry only go in those?`
`01:59.57`	`Thumper_`	`trepan: or do I need to generate a new cached file if I edit an option like -public ?`
`02:00.54`	`*** join/#bzflag lan56 (i=lan56@user-vcauudu.dsl.mindspring.com)`
`02:06.47`	`*** join/#bzflag TimRiker (n=timr@pdpc/supporter/bronze/TimRiker)`
`02:06.47`	`*** mode/#bzflag [+o TimRiker] by ChanServ`
`02:21.16`	`*** join/#bzflag amcnabb (n=amcnabb@c-67-169-251-185.hsd1.ut.comcast.net)`
`02:21.31`	`*** join/#bzflag Theme97 (n=437d9ddd@webchat.bzflag.bz)`
`02:22.11`	`CIA-6`	`BZFlag: 03lan56 * 10bzflag/Dev-C++/ (bzflag.dev bzfs.dev): readd the second ..\Dev-C++, its worth a few extra characters to stop any future problems`
`02:25.54`	`trepan`	`Thumper_: depends on the option, try 'cmp' if there's doubt`
`02:29.43`	`Thumper_`	`trepan: thx`
`02:53.06`	`*** join/#bzflag L4m3r (n=Chris@s122-55.resnet.ucla.edu)`
`03:52.09`	`CIA-6`	`BZFlag: 03bryjen * 10bzflag/ (3 files in 3 dirs): /jitterdrop server command for in-game changing the -jitterdrop command line option`
`04:00.33`	`*** join/#bzflag WonderMop (n=clickies@user-11fb6uj.dsl.mindspring.com)`
`04:01.05`	`WonderMop`	`is anyone getting weird jitter w/ 2.0.6?`
`04:04.08`	`lan56`	`what do you mean by weird>`
`04:04.37`	`WonderMop`	`in 2.0.2 my jitter was about 5ms and in 2.0.6 it's almost 50`
`04:04.40`	`WonderMop`	`i ran both again to check`
`04:04.50`	`WonderMop`	`on the same network and got the different jitters`
`04:12.55`	`*** part/#bzflag bryjen (n=chatzill@2002:45a6:86ae:0:0:0:0:1)`
`04:54.04`	`*** join/#bzflag PrezKennedy (n=Apathy@c-68-33-243-45.hsd1.md.comcast.net)`
`04:56.53`	`*** join/#bzflag PuMpErNiCkLe (n=PuMpErNi@CPE000d8802a749-CM0012c9a9a6dc.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com)`
`05:05.18`	`*** join/#bzflag JeffM2501 (n=JeffM@pdpc/supporter/sustaining/JeffM2501)`
`05:05.18`	`*** mode/#bzflag [+o JeffM2501] by ChanServ`
`06:00.37`	`*** join/#bzflag lan56 (i=lan56@user-vcauudu.dsl.mindspring.com)`
`06:19.00`	`L4m3r`	`does bzfs now load plugins with an older API? or was it not bumped for 2.0.6?`
`06:19.31`	`JeffM2501`	`it only bumps when an existing function changes`
`06:19.36`	`JeffM2501`	`or a data structure`
`06:19.43`	`JeffM2501`	`so it hasn't changed in a while`
`06:20.00`	`JeffM2501`	`2.1.x will have some backwards compataiblity for older API verisons`
`06:20.08`	`JeffM2501`	`( but not back to 2.0`
`06:20.16`	`L4m3r`	`so, what happens if I use the new flag give thing, compile, and try to run it in a later 2.0.5?`
`06:20.39`	`JeffM2501`	`if the bzfs dosn't have the function it will not load`
`06:20.54`	`L4m3r`	`ok, that's fine then`
`06:21.06`	`JeffM2501`	`yeah it's a clean error ether way`
`06:21.16`	`L4m3r`	`good. just checking. :)`
`06:21.39`	`JeffM2501`	`the API version prevents a plugin that expects a function to structure to be a certan way, but bzfs does it another way`
`06:21.42`	`JeffM2501`	`that would make a crash`
`06:21.44`	`JeffM2501`	`or other bad things`
`06:22.06`	`L4m3r`	`yes, I would think so.`
`06:22.51`	`L4m3r`	`I'm preparing a beta release of a "kill limit" plugin, so I'm getting all my API stuff in order and up to date.`
`06:23.05`	`JeffM2501`	`ahh`
`06:23.13`	`JeffM2501`	`I was gonna add that as a feature in 2.2`
`06:23.18`	`L4m3r`	`heh`
`06:23.24`	`JeffM2501`	`and fix game resets so they don't kill the server`
`06:23.24`	`L4m3r`	`go ahead, that's always cleaner :P`
`06:23.28`	`JeffM2501`	`but force everyone to limbo`
`06:23.33`	`JeffM2501`	`and then respawn`
`06:23.41`	`L4m3r`	`oh, no, this is flag kill limits`
`06:23.56`	`L4m3r`	`like shot limits, only they count kills instead.`
`06:24.07`	`JeffM2501`	`oh`
`06:24.08`	`JeffM2501`	`ok`
`06:24.13`	`JeffM2501`	`so misses don't count off the total`
`06:24.14`	`JeffM2501`	`nice`
`06:24.14`	`L4m3r`	`help prevent whoring, but less restrictively. :)`
`06:24.22`	`JeffM2501`	`that's a good plugin`
`06:24.36`	`L4m3r`	`first of mine to use a conf. gonna release a beta first`
`06:24.43`	`L4m3r`	`theme97 has been testing it for a while too`
`06:24.45`	`JeffM2501`	`well to prevent whoring I want to do ammo`
`06:24.50`	`JeffM2501`	`but we'll see how that goes :)`
`06:24.57`	`L4m3r`	`eh... lol`
`06:25.31`	`L4m3r`	`(this plugin was why I was griping about API inconsistencies the other day)`
`06:25.37`	`*** join/#bzflag Blue_Eyes (n=Blue@treebupf.inet.it)`
`06:25.50`	`JeffM2501`	`yeah I'm trying to clean it up for 2.2`
`06:26.04`	`JeffM2501`	`this was the first version with it so it's kinda iffy`
`06:26.12`	`L4m3r`	`BTW, you know that kills by steamrolling and indirect geno show as flagless kills, right?`
`06:26.23`	`JeffM2501`	`nope`
`06:26.39`	`JeffM2501`	`they are handled difrently in the code`
`06:26.42`	`L4m3r`	`well, now you do :)`
`06:26.46`	`JeffM2501`	`probably don' t have a shot record`
`06:26.47`	`L4m3r`	`I figured as much`
`06:26.58`	`JeffM2501`	`superkill probably does too`
`06:27.10`	`L4m3r`	`the SR thing is annoying but the geno thing isn't all bad`
`06:27.28`	`L4m3r`	`the plugin has an option to count geno kill cumulatively, or by direct hits only`
`06:27.46`	`JeffM2501`	`the event for kill is probably put too low in the real bzfs functions`
`06:28.15`	`L4m3r`	`oh, and something I did that you may like to add to shot limits...`
`06:28.21`	`L4m3r`	`"relative" limits`
`06:28.44`	`JeffM2501`	`relitive to what?`
`06:28.57`	`L4m3r`	`I've got it set up so that if you put "n" after the limit, it will set the limit to the number times how many players are on the server`
`06:29.11`	`L4m3r`	`set at the first kill`
`06:30.04`	`JeffM2501`	`shot limits are a band-aid for a larger problem`
`06:30.13`	`JeffM2501`	`I'd rather see the larger problem addressed`
`06:30.17`	`L4m3r`	`heh`
`06:30.28`	`L4m3r`	`we'd have to close the game to new players, or something :P`
`06:30.50`	`JeffM2501`	`or change the base rules`
`06:30.53`	`L4m3r`	`the ultimate cure is flagless play, or assigned superflags (as I have tried)`
`06:31.09`	`L4m3r`	`unfortunately the latter proved rather unpopular`
`06:31.20`	`JeffM2501`	`or change flags into a more generic powerup system`
`06:31.28`	`JeffM2501`	`where you get weapons and charges`
`06:31.33`	`JeffM2501`	`and they arn't allways the same thing`
`06:31.51`	`JeffM2501`	`more quake like`
`06:31.55`	`L4m3r`	`possibly. but couldn't that conflict with the "no multiple flags" bit?`
`06:31.57`	`JeffM2501`	`but then that would catch some flak too`
`06:32.07`	`JeffM2501`	`limit them to one weapon at a time`
`06:32.08`	`JeffM2501`	`:)`
`06:32.27`	`JeffM2501`	`and if the rules are changing, who says we can't allow multiple power ups`
`06:32.34`	`JeffM2501`	`just limit them to one per class`
`06:32.43`	`JeffM2501`	`or something`
`06:32.45`	`L4m3r`	`I've found bad flags are an effective shopping deterrent also`
`06:32.47`	`JeffM2501`	`there are many ways it can be done`
`06:33.16`	`L4m3r`	`a few people hated it, but when I set bad flags to last forever on my server, shopping pretty much ceased`
`06:33.29`	`a-delusion`	`yes, making powerups progressive opens up worlds of opportunity.`
`06:33.42`	`JeffM2501`	`this game will never change it's use of flags tho`
`06:34.07`	`*** join/#bzflag yummy (n=m28@blueice4n2.uk.ibm.com)`
`06:34.17`	`L4m3r`	`yeah. I think quantitative powerups could overcomplicate things.`
`06:34.51`	`JeffM2501`	`they worked in subspace`
`06:34.56`	`L4m3r`	`sometimes I think this game needs to split into two :P`
`06:35.05`	`JeffM2501`	`it does`
`06:35.07`	`trepan`	`any of the Descent games have a team mode?`
`06:35.23`	`JeffM2501`	`the last one may have`
`06:35.24`	`L4m3r`	`one side, that silly, simple arcade-like game, and one complex, sophisticated, "tank sim"`
`06:35.28`	`JeffM2501`	`or freespace may have`
`06:35.46`	`JeffM2501`	`L4m3r, I want something inbetween`
`06:35.50`	`JeffM2501`	`and action tank game`
`06:36.03`	`JeffM2501`	`but not super mario kart simple`
`06:36.11`	`L4m3r`	`heh`
`06:36.41`	`L4m3r`	`personally I love the fact that the game can be as intense as an FPS, but there's this excellent "art of driving" aspect to it`
`06:36.44`	`JeffM2501`	`play subspace ( continum ) and you'll see what I want`
`06:38.57`	`L4m3r`	`I'll look into it.`
`06:39.32`	`L4m3r`	`BTW, I don't know if I mentioned it already but the new laser is awesome :D`
`06:40.35`	`JeffM2501`	`it still needs some work`
`06:41.03`	`L4m3r`	`yes, but the concept is very good`
`06:41.16`	`L4m3r`	`actual 3D is a great idea`
`06:41.33`	`JeffM2501`	`it makes the onboard video on this machine cry like a little girl`
`06:41.36`	`L4m3r`	`make sure you add a BZDB variable for the laser radius... >:)`
`06:41.50`	`JeffM2501`	`the old one didn't have one`
`06:41.51`	`L4m3r`	`well, that's why it's called "expirimental"`
`06:46.19`	`JeffM2501`	`actualy it's called that cus noone liked "super"`
`06:46.19`	`L4m3r`	`lol!`
`06:46.19`	`L4m3r`	`maybe "ridiculous"? "superflous"?`
`06:46.19`	`L4m3r`	`"show-off"?`
`06:46.19`	`L4m3r`	`or perhaps "rich jerk" :P`
`06:46.48`	`JeffM2501`	`it's not that bad`
`06:46.55`	`JeffM2501`	`should run fine on the low end cards of the day`
`06:47.12`	`JeffM2501`	`I mean even a 5200 should run it fine`
`06:47.19`	`L4m3r`	`yeah, I know, but I'm sure it'll get that why when someone (trepan) gets bored enough`
`06:47.42`	`JeffM2501`	`I don't think it'll ever top any current game`
`06:47.55`	`L4m3r`	`I've got a 5200 in the linux box, but that computer hates the client unfortunately`
`06:48.02`	`JeffM2501`	`everyone is just used to bzflag being 10 years behind, when we just want to make it 3 years behind`
`06:48.07`	`L4m3r`	`lol`
`06:48.40`	`JeffM2501`	`I mean hell the onboard SIS video on this 180$ computer runs the thing at HIGH`
`06:48.59`	`L4m3r`	`but my 5200 was capable of running everything maxed at 1024x768 at 60fps under windows when it was my main rig`
`06:49.11`	`JeffM2501`	`yeah`
`06:49.15`	`L4m3r`	`but that was... 2.0.4ish?`
`06:49.15`	`JeffM2501`	`and that is a cheap ass card`
`06:49.27`	`L4m3r`	`I know, my Ti4200 was better, until it died`
`06:49.35`	`JeffM2501`	`in 2.1 what was experimental is now high`
`06:49.41`	`L4m3r`	`I was just lucky to have the 5200 as a spare`
`06:49.44`	`JeffM2501`	`geta 6200, they are cheap`
`06:49.53`	`L4m3r`	`don't need it anymore, that box is a server`
`06:50.08`	`L4m3r`	`got a 6600GT in my main box, more than enough`
`06:50.20`	`JeffM2501`	`660`
`06:50.29`	`JeffM2501`	`6600's are ok for BZ`
`06:50.33`	`JeffM2501`	`not so much for other games`
`06:50.35`	`JeffM2501`	`but ok for bz`
`06:50.42`	`JeffM2501`	`eq2 eats it alive`
`06:50.47`	`L4m3r`	`to lag it I have to run 8xAA, and even then it only happens when someone dies`
`06:51.03`	`L4m3r`	`I know, I am a bit disappointed with it as far as other games go`
`06:51.12`	`L4m3r`	`but I splurged on the mobo instead`
`06:51.17`	`JeffM2501`	`ahh`
`06:51.32`	`JeffM2501`	`6800GS seems to be a good bang/buck card`
`06:51.37`	`L4m3r`	`they call the 6600GT "poor man's SLI"`
`06:51.39`	`JeffM2501`	`haven't looked into the new 7x00s`
`06:51.44`	`JeffM2501`	`it is`
`06:52.13`	`L4m3r`	`so eventually I'll have to decide whether to just get another 6600GT or spend more for a 7000 series`
`06:52.34`	`JeffM2501`	`what games do you play mostly?`
`06:52.39`	`L4m3r`	`lol`
`06:52.53`	`L4m3r`	`GTA:SA... even that gets choppy at times`
`06:53.06`	`JeffM2501`	`does it have an SLI profile?`
`06:53.17`	`L4m3r`	`games come and go, but this card will get old quick`
`06:53.17`	`L4m3r`	`no idea`
`06:53.17`	`JeffM2501`	`not all games work faster with SLI`
`06:53.24`	`JeffM2501`	`you have to pick the SLI profile for the game`
`06:53.31`	`JeffM2501`	`it's not a flat out speedup to all things`
`06:53.40`	`L4m3r`	`well, newer games will, and that's what I'm more concerned with`
`06:53.52`	`JeffM2501`	`a 6800GS was WAY faster then 2 6600 GTs`
`06:54.01`	`L4m3r`	`oh, I know, and that will go under consideration depending on what I play at the time`
`06:54.02`	`JeffM2501`	`not not all new games will`
`06:54.06`	`L4m3r`	`oh really? how much?`
`06:54.09`	`JeffM2501`	`not all things are speed up by SLI`
`06:54.25`	`JeffM2501`	`30-40% in EQ2`
`06:54.32`	`JeffM2501`	`how much ram is on your 6600's?`
`06:54.42`	`L4m3r`	`128`
`06:54.45`	`L4m3r`	`and I only have one :P`
`06:54.46`	`JeffM2501`	`oh yeah`
`06:54.57`	`JeffM2501`	`don't waste money on another 6600`
`06:55.00`	`L4m3r`	`how much for a 6600SE?`
`06:55.08`	`JeffM2501`	`get something with 256 megs`
`06:55.12`	`JeffM2501`	`you cant' mix em`
`06:55.16`	`L4m3r`	`yeah`
`06:55.16`	`JeffM2501`	`has to be the same chip`
`06:55.24`	`L4m3r`	`oh, I know that, but I'm just curious`
`06:56.00`	`JeffM2501`	`never heard of an SE`
`06:56.21`	`L4m3r`	`oh, oops, meant GS`
`06:56.40`	`JeffM2501`	`I got mine for 200`
`06:56.42`	`L4m3r`	`hm... $190-ish, not bad`
`06:56.46`	`JeffM2501`	`when I had it`
`06:57.27`	`L4m3r`	`yeah, as for the 128 megs of ram on my card... I figured it wasn't worth the extra cost, considering it was just a 6600GT`
`06:57.48`	`L4m3r`	`I intended it more as a hold-over (that I'll probably never replace)`
`06:57.49`	`*** part/#bzflag a-delusion (n=a-delusi@pool-141-158-70-194.pitt.east.verizon.net)`
`06:57.54`	`JeffM2501`	`newer games are going to expect 256`
`06:57.58`	`JeffM2501`	`it's a big speed increase`
`06:58.06`	`JeffM2501`	`since it dosn't have to tag system ram as much`
`06:58.11`	`JeffM2501`	`even on the slower GPU`
`06:58.24`	`L4m3r`	`hm`
`06:58.26`	`JeffM2501`	`with less ram, your GPU will stall and not be feed as fast as it can draw`
`06:58.37`	`L4m3r`	`well, I have an excuse to upgrade then :D`
`06:58.50`	`JeffM2501`	`I'm going to replace my current card with a 512er as soon as they are reasonable`
`06:59.07`	`L4m3r`	`the other reason I didn't splurge on video was that they evolve the fastest... ugh`
`06:59.37`	`JeffM2501`	`that's why you get them based on the games you play`
`06:59.41`	`L4m3r`	`yeah`
`06:59.43`	`JeffM2501`	`not what is the current top end`
`06:59.52`	`JeffM2501`	`the 6800GS runs a lot of current games well`
`06:59.53`	`L4m3r`	`I guess I'll just wait for the next awesome game`
`06:59.59`	`JeffM2501`	`you can run quake 4 at high`
`07:01.32`	`JeffM2501`	`my propblem is that even a 7900GT isn't gonna speed me up much more now`
`07:01.51`	`L4m3r`	`it figures, too, I got a nice mobo only to see a revision come out like a month later`
`07:04.56`	`L4m3r`	`DFI makes some nice products, this mobo is a good one, but layout is not the best, and the revision fixed some of those issues and added a third PCI slot :\`
`07:05.14`	`JeffM2501`	`will you actualy use that slot?`
`07:05.23`	`L4m3r`	`maybe`
`07:05.26`	`JeffM2501`	`there arn't many aplications for PCI cards these days :)`
`07:05.33`	`L4m3r`	`but it's more like two more, also`
`07:05.40`	`JeffM2501`	`one for sound`
`07:05.45`	`JeffM2501`	`the rest is on the mobo`
`07:05.54`	`JeffM2501`	`maybe a nic`
`07:06.14`	`L4m3r`	`see, mine has four PCIe, with the lower right up against the top PCI slot`
`07:06.46`	`L4m3r`	`the revision added another one AND put the x4 or whatever in between the second x16 and the first PCI`
`07:07.06`	`L4m3r`	`so running SLi won't block one of them either ;)`
`07:07.12`	`JeffM2501`	`and how many of the non 16x slots are you using now?`
`07:07.35`	`L4m3r`	`well, none. but the point is, it separates the lower x16 from the old-school PCIs`
`07:07.57`	`JeffM2501`	`and my point is, your probably never gonna have a problem with it ;)`
`07:08.15`	`L4m3r`	`plus, the NB is in a smarter spot, in between the two cards instead of under one >_<`
`07:08.41`	`L4m3r`	`I cant' change that stupid cooler because the video card is right over it`
`07:08.57`	`JeffM2501`	`yeah that I do hate`
`07:09.05`	`JeffM2501`	`tho I don't see my NB get that hot`
`07:09.12`	`JeffM2501`	`my entire system runs cooler n' hell`
`07:09.22`	`JeffM2501`	`but then I have airflow up the wazzo`
`07:09.22`	`L4m3r`	`nah, but I'd like to change it to a bigger, passive cooler`
`07:09.32`	`JeffM2501`	`mine is pasive`
`07:09.34`	`JeffM2501`	`no fan`
`07:09.34`	`L4m3r`	`lol, me too... 7 case fans running low voltage`
`07:09.45`	`L4m3r`	`yeah, mine's low-profile with a fan`
`07:10.09`	`JeffM2501`	`I think mine has 8 or 9 120's I forget`
`07:10.18`	`L4m3r`	`jesus >_>`
`07:10.34`	`L4m3r`	`only two of mine are 120... chieftec 601, you know, a lot of spots for 80s`
`07:10.39`	`JeffM2501`	`it only had slots for 120's`
`07:10.50`	`JeffM2501`	`the thing dosn't take any 80's at all`
`07:10.54`	`L4m3r`	`wow`
`07:11.02`	`L4m3r`	`what case? a UFO? :P`
`07:11.13`	`JeffM2501`	`coolermaster stacker 830`
`07:11.22`	`L4m3r`	`oh, I think I've seen that one`
`07:11.39`	`JeffM2501`	`all aluminum`
`07:11.43`	`JeffM2501`	`fully reversable`
`07:11.47`	`JeffM2501`	`convertable to btx`
`07:12.03`	`L4m3r`	`wow, nice`
`07:12.27`	`purple_cow`	`BTX?`
`07:12.35`	`JeffM2501`	`yeah`
`07:12.40`	`L4m3r`	`I'm gonna hang on to ATX as long as I can just because the UCLA desks have drawers on the right, forcing one to put the case on the right side of the desk`
`07:12.45`	`JeffM2501`	`intel's new format`
`07:12.48`	`JeffM2501`	`moves stuff around`
`07:12.56`	`JeffM2501`	`flips the slots and the backplane`
`07:13.00`	`JeffM2501`	`and some stuff like that`
`07:13.04`	`L4m3r`	`upside-down, except for the drives, basically`
`07:13.09`	`JeffM2501`	`yeah`
`07:13.19`	`L4m3r`	`good for airflow at least`
`07:13.28`	`JeffM2501`	`and the heatsink connetcs to the mobo baseplane`
`07:13.31`	`JeffM2501`	`for better cooling`
`07:13.46`	`L4m3r`	`interesting, didn't know that`
`07:14.02`	`JeffM2501`	`yeah it's part of the spec`
`07:14.09`	`JeffM2501`	`bracket thing that goes thru the mobo`
`07:14.21`	`JeffM2501`	`your shuttle is probalby the oposet of my case :)`
`07:14.32`	`purple_cow`	`looks like`
`07:14.48`	`JeffM2501`	`my mac mini fits in the top fan bay`
`07:14.54`	`L4m3r`	`mine's pretty big too... I might add a few inches in height over the summer too`
`07:14.56`	`purple_cow`	`though you can actually fit 3 3.5" and 1 5" drive in it`
`07:15.15`	`JeffM2501`	`I can have 12 3.5's`
`07:15.35`	`JeffM2501`	`or 3 5's for every 4 3.5's your remove from that number :)`
`07:15.56`	`L4m3r`	`but if I had room (and money) I'd grab one of these mofos:http://xoxide.com/xulalcucu.html`
`07:15.57`	`JeffM2501`	`or I guess 9 5s`
`07:16.11`	`purple_cow`	`of course, i can also carry it under one arm ;)`
`07:16.30`	`L4m3r`	`it'd make watercooling a breeze... I could do a nice, quiet server`
`07:16.34`	`JeffM2501`	`http://www.coolermaster-usa.com/Products.aspx?pid=1083`
`07:17.17`	`JeffM2501`	`wow that's ugly`
`07:17.22`	`L4m3r`	`lol`
`07:17.32`	`L4m3r`	`it just has a lot of room`
`07:17.59`	`JeffM2501`	`so does a stacker 810`
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`07:18.04`	`L4m3r`	`heh`
`07:18.06`	`JeffM2501`	`and even room for 2 power supplys`
`07:18.11`	`L4m3r`	`and I'd paint it and stuff, of course`
`07:18.15`	`JeffM2501`	`and the cables to work both of em`
`07:18.20`	`L4m3r`	`damn, is that thing wider than 8 inches?`
`07:18.34`	`JeffM2501`	`it's like a foot wide I think`
`07:18.40`	`L4m3r`	`jesus`
`07:18.55`	`L4m3r`	`see, at first glance it looks about the size of mine, but mine is standard width :P`
`07:19.22`	`L4m3r`	`not sure I could fit that, my monitor, and speakers on this desk >_>`
`07:19.39`	`JeffM2501`	`ahh it's just under 10`
`07:19.40`	`JeffM2501`	`5.12 x 21.10 x 9.84`
`07:19.49`	`JeffM2501`	`sorry 25.2`
`07:20.07`	`JeffM2501`	`this case does not go ON a desk`
`07:20.10`	`JeffM2501`	`it goes under`
`07:20.13`	`JeffM2501`	`full tower`
`07:20.28`	`L4m3r`	`I figured`
`07:20.44`	`L4m3r`	`thing is, desks in this sardine can go wall-to-wall with the fridge`
`07:21.20`	`L4m3r`	`Jeff, do you use fan filters?`
`07:21.30`	`JeffM2501`	`the case comes with them`
`07:21.34`	`L4m3r`	`ah`
`07:21.45`	`JeffM2501`	`all the vents are filtered`
`07:21.53`	`JeffM2501`	`even all the front panel bay covers are`
`07:21.58`	`L4m3r`	`over spring break I rigged some out of pantyhose.. except now I need to figure out how to clean them`
`07:22.10`	`JeffM2501`	`throw them away.. get new ones`
`07:22.13`	`L4m3r`	`lol`
`07:22.23`	`JeffM2501`	`and why did you happen to have pantyhoes laying around?`
`07:22.28`	`purple_cow`	`12.8 x 8.6 x 8.2 :)`
`07:22.34`	`JeffM2501`	`nice`
`07:22.34`	`L4m3r`	`I didn't... I was at home`
`07:22.55`	`JeffM2501`	`purple_cow, I think I could fit about 6 of those in my case`
`07:23.05`	`JeffM2501`	`it's like a shuttle mothership`
`07:23.08`	`purple_cow`	`hehe`
`07:23.21`	`L4m3r`	`lol have you seen that PC that someone built into a large-ish whiskey bottle?`
`07:23.33`	`JeffM2501`	`if I wanted the case with max room inside I'd get the stacker T01`
`07:23.38`	`JeffM2501`	`yeah I saw that`
`07:23.45`	`JeffM2501`	`people will put an ITX system in anything`
`07:24.10`	`L4m3r`	`I saw the mobo for that thing for sale somewhere... insanely small, think it was a p3`
`07:24.27`	`JeffM2501`	`my friend has the t01, with dual power supplys and room for the full water cooler inside`
`07:24.38`	`L4m3r`	`I almost want to get one and hide it in my case with an LCD in three bays, for chatware`
`07:24.46`	`JeffM2501`	`many ITXes are small low power CPUS`
`07:24.52`	`JeffM2501`	`like P3's and low end P4s`
`07:24.54`	`L4m3r`	`yeah`
`07:25.12`	`L4m3r`	`since you can't cool well in most cases anyway`
`07:25.25`	`JeffM2501`	`this one is fine`
`07:25.37`	`L4m3r`	`heh`
`07:25.37`	`JeffM2501`	`at the lowest power setting it's at like 34c`
`07:25.49`	`JeffM2501`	`and I can't hear it`
`07:25.56`	`L4m3r`	`yeah, but for the people who build systems into router cases and shit...`
`07:26.09`	`L4m3r`	`SFF is usually harder for cooling`
`07:26.10`	`JeffM2501`	`well they are just wierd`
`07:26.31`	`JeffM2501`	`that's what 1RU systems are for`
`07:26.54`	`JeffM2501`	`I got this case so I'd never have to buy another case for 5-6 years`
`07:27.01`	`L4m3r`	`lol`
`07:27.27`	`L4m3r`	`I'll probably use my chieftec until I break it or until the matching monitor dies, whichever happens first`
`07:27.30`	`JeffM2501`	`it'll hold anything I'll need to put in it`
`07:27.47`	`JeffM2501`	`and that will mostly be the second 7800GTX`
`07:27.54`	`JeffM2501`	`they are down under 450 now`
`07:27.56`	`L4m3r`	`yeesh`
`07:28.17`	`L4m3r`	`or you could wait for the dual ones to come out, they're what a grand apiece?`
`07:28.20`	`JeffM2501`	`I was hoping the 512meg 7900's were going to come down faster, but dosn't look like it`
`07:28.32`	`JeffM2501`	`I don't need that much`
`07:28.35`	`L4m3r`	`lol`
`07:28.41`	`JeffM2501`	`I didn't pay anything for this card`
`07:28.55`	`JeffM2501`	`so I can justify spending 430 on it's SLI brother`
`07:29.04`	`L4m3r`	`nice.`
`07:29.18`	`L4m3r`	`what do you cool the current one with?`
`07:29.25`	`JeffM2501`	`air`
`07:29.29`	`JeffM2501`	`and it's fan`
`07:29.34`	`L4m3r`	`well, yeah, but a stock cooler?`
`07:29.43`	`JeffM2501`	`yeah`
`07:29.53`	`JeffM2501`	`never gets over 35-38`
`07:30.19`	`L4m3r`	`yeah, I SLi always looks like a cooling problem though, for the top card anyway :P`
`07:30.39`	`L4m3r`	`or the bottom card, depending on which way you've configured your case`
`07:30.40`	`JeffM2501`	`the mobo leaves a double slot beteen them`
`07:30.45`	`JeffM2501`	`and it's a single wide card`
`07:30.48`	`L4m3r`	`ah, well, that's nice`
`07:30.51`	`JeffM2501`	`so there is a full slot between em`
`07:31.15`	`L4m3r`	`I saw a nice-looking cooler the other day, it was like a laptop CPU cooler`
`07:31.35`	`L4m3r`	`uses a blower to draw air into a duct, through a heatsink, and out of the case, all enclosed`
`07:31.35`	`JeffM2501`	`there are many wacky coolers out there`
`07:31.42`	`JeffM2501`	`most are made to just get people to buy them`
`07:31.49`	`L4m3r`	`lol true`
`07:31.50`	`JeffM2501`	`and just make your case REALY messy`
`07:32.12`	`JeffM2501`	`adding cooling is only a problem if you are runing too hot in the first place`
`07:32.31`	`L4m3r`	`I could use a new GPU cooler because my one card runs at 50 or so`
`07:32.43`	`JeffM2501`	`that's not that horible`
`07:32.45`	`L4m3r`	`because I was an idiot when I cut the holes and didn't ventilate that part of the case right`
`07:32.46`	`JeffM2501`	`and within specs`
`07:32.55`	`JeffM2501`	`ATI cards run near 100`
`07:32.59`	`JeffM2501`	`for the newer ones`
`07:33.07`	`L4m3r`	`100C? holy shit!`
`07:33.13`	`JeffM2501`	`yeah`
`07:33.18`	`JeffM2501`	`and language please`
`07:33.24`	`L4m3r`	`oh, my bad`
`07:33.55`	`JeffM2501`	`yeah they run realy hot`
`07:34.00`	`JeffM2501`	`compared to others`
`07:34.10`	`JeffM2501`	`with water cooling you get them down in the 60s`
`07:34.23`	`JeffM2501`	`but then add another in crossfire mode...`
`07:34.29`	`L4m3r`	`jeeze, if your watercooler stalls you could pop the block by boiling the water!`
`07:34.42`	`JeffM2501`	`then don't fill it with water :)`
`07:34.47`	`L4m3r`	`lol`
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`07:35.27`	`JeffM2501`	`why are all serial ATA cables red?`
`07:35.32`	`JeffM2501`	`or that UV reactive crap?`
`07:35.42`	`L4m3r`	`lol`
`07:35.52`	`L4m3r`	`mine are green... but they're UV reactive :P`
`07:36.16`	`JeffM2501`	`I just want a nice blue one`
`07:36.18`	`L4m3r`	`my mobo came with some opaque yellow ones`
`07:36.26`	`L4m3r`	`but they turn pale under UV`
`07:36.53`	`L4m3r`	`why not just get a UV reactive one?`
`07:37.05`	`L4m3r`	`it won't make a difference unless you actually use UV`
`07:37.14`	`JeffM2501`	`exactly`
`07:37.23`	`JeffM2501`	`I want clean blue`
`07:37.33`	`L4m3r`	`how long?`
`07:37.50`	`JeffM2501`	`prolly 2-3 feet`
`07:38.14`	`L4m3r`	`http://svc.com/asatabu-75.html`
`07:38.37`	`JeffM2501`	`yeah those look to be externals`
`07:38.39`	`L4m3r`	`no UV`
`07:38.45`	`JeffM2501`	`they may work`
`07:38.53`	`JeffM2501`	`dono if internal sata is the same as external`
`07:38.59`	`L4m3r`	`nah, the pic is just magnified`
`07:39.09`	`L4m3r`	`they look just like mine and mine work fine inside`
`07:39.35`	`JeffM2501`	`I should get rid of the ide cables too`
`07:39.39`	`JeffM2501`	`oh well`
`07:39.42`	`JeffM2501`	`time for sleep`
`07:39.44`	`L4m3r`	`AFAIK the only variance is whether or not there's a locking mechanism, and those don't really matter`
`07:39.57`	`JeffM2501`	`ahh`
`07:40.05`	`JeffM2501`	`see ya`
`07:40.06`	`L4m3r`	`'night. :)`
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`08:01.05`	`*** join/#bzflag rtyler (i=tyler@sand.geekisp.com)`
`08:01.20`	`rtyler`	`any of you built 2.06 correctly on Mac OS X?`
`08:01.30`	`rtyler`	`2.04 constantly segfaults`
`08:12.11`	`*** join/#bzflag lan56 (i=lan56@user-vcauudu.dsl.mindspring.com)`
`08:13.15`	`*** join/#bzflag DTRemenak (n=DTRemena@c-67-187-164-66.hsd1.ca.comcast.net)`
`08:13.15`	`*** mode/#bzflag [+v DTRemenak] by ChanServ`
`08:13.41`	`rtyler`	`DTRemenak: you wouldn't happen to have built 2.06 on OS X would you of? :)`
`08:14.17`	`DTRemenak`	`rtyler: not a mac guy here, sorry`
`08:14.19`	`DTRemenak`	`last time I used a mac was in gradeschool`
`08:14.31`	`rtyler`	`heh, unix at all? :)`
`08:14.36`	`rtyler`	`oh bloody hell`
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`08:15.35`	`lan56`	`rtyler, brlcad/learner is the one that does much of the os x bzflag stuff. JeffM2501 also does a little IIRC`
`08:15.54`	`lan56`	`you should contact either for os x builds/help`
`08:15.57`	`rtyler`	`lan56: there's a slight problem for some reason running the autogen script too`
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`08:16.10`	`lan56`	`as for linux?`
`08:16.17`	`rtyler`	`as per *nix yeah`
`08:16.47`	`lan56`	`well, I don't know much about that but as for the os x stuff those are the people to look out for, since they aren't here (clearly), or pm on bzbb in the mean time`
`08:17.36`	`rtyler`	`http://pastebin.com/657177`
`08:47.26`	`lan56`	`Agent Dero, ping`
`08:47.44`	`rtyler`	`yo`
`08:47.46`	`rtyler`	`heh`
`08:47.55`	`lan56`	`oh its YOU! :) jk`
`08:48.09`	`rtyler`	`there has to be some bloody way to get this autogen script to work`
`08:48.24`	`lan56`	`there is, but that I don't know, so false alarm :)`
`08:48.36`	`rtyler`	`lan56: the problem is that the script won;t run, so I cant run configure, so I can't build my intel version >={`
`08:48.54`	`rtyler`	`lan56: that's a fun game, btw, wish I could join you guys longer for 25 seconds >:(`
`08:49.16`	`lan56`	`the prebuilt binaries don't work?`
`08:49.44`	`rtyler`	`lan56: the prebuilt OS X stuff is PPC specific, so BZFlag runs, but under Rosetta on my intel iMac`
`08:49.57`	`rtyler`	`(Apple's PPC emulation runtime, which does a decent job I guess)`
`08:50.06`	`lan56`	`ahh`
`08:50.39`	`lan56`	`I wish I had updated Mac knowledge, used a Performa with classic mac os for 10+ years, then moved onto the powermacs`
`08:50.39`	`lan56`	`from ebay`
`08:50.41`	`lan56`	`trashed that`
`08:50.45`	`lan56`	`well I am getting ot`
`08:51.25`	`rtyler`	`I just need somebody that's built this stuff on *nix who's confident in their leet unix skills :)`
`08:51.36`	`lan56`	`don't worry this place is usually more alive during daytime United States time`
`08:51.40`	`lan56`	`much more alive`
`08:52.02`	`lan56`	`if its inconvenient for you you can also post a msg on bzbb`
`08:52.24`	`rtyler`	`lan56: i've got to pretend I'm "working" during the day ;)`
`08:52.39`	`lan56`	`ahh`
`08:52.44`	`rtyler`	`lan56: besides that, is there any way to limit this damned keyboard lock`
`08:52.52`	`lan56`	`keyboard lock?`
`08:53.05`	`rtyler`	`keyboard input is locked into BZFlag while it's running, but mouse input is not`
`08:53.25`	`lan56`	`ahh, that I also don't know :(`
`08:54.03`	`lan56`	`well I am sorry I haven't been much of a help`
`08:54.11`	`rtyler`	`get back to your game, no worries :)`
`08:54.23`	`lan56`	`ahh the game can wait`
`08:54.34`	`lan56`	`well okay I'm out of things to say :)`
`08:54.54`	`lan56`	`back to the game! :) (but if you msg, I will still hear it)`
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`08:57.13`	`rtyler`	`lan56: I think I found 2.0.4 version for MacOS X (intel), hopefully i'll be back in there shortly ;)`
`08:57.26`	`lan56`	`does it work?`
`08:58.24`	`lan56`	`oh have you read http://my.bzflag.org/bb/viewtopic.php?t=7614?`
`09:02.26`	`rtyler`	`lan56: yep, seems too`
`09:02.30`	`rtyler`	`too bad I suck :)`
`09:02.37`	`lan56`	`how long have you played for?`
`09:02.49`	`rtyler`	`about an hour, in between these crashes ;)`
`09:02.58`	`lan56`	`ahh`
`09:03.09`	`lan56`	`now I feel even worse that your experience so far has been bad`
`09:03.10`	`lan56`	`:(`
`09:03.29`	`rtyler`	`heh, no worries, I'm a developer, I understand that "these things happen" ;)`
`09:03.36`	`lan56`	`phew`
`09:03.50`	`rtyler`	`I struggled once or twice a few years ago getting it to agree with SDL on my FreeBSD workstation`
`09:04.01`	`lan56`	`did it work after all?`
`09:04.21`	`rtyler`	`on my FreeBSD box, I could never get it, it's working fine on this mac now`
`09:04.38`	`rtyler`	`lan56: are you still playing?`
`09:04.41`	`lan56`	`yeah freebsd seems to have stopped being maintained`
`09:04.43`	`lan56`	`no`
`09:04.48`	`rtyler`	`bummer :)`
`09:04.58`	`lan56`	`well I might come out shortly again :)`
`09:05.27`	`rtyler`	`well, for some unexplained reason, this keeps locking my keyboard, so I can't type in IRC and play at the same time; thanks for your help, i'll mirror this DMG on my server as well`
`09:05.43`	`lan56`	`my help? I didnt do anything`
`09:05.54`	`rtyler`	`a valiant attempt none the less ;)`
`09:06.19`	`lan56`	`I suppose, but the joy is just knowing you got it work, even tho it is 2.0.4 and not the latest, at least its still something`
`09:06.23`	`lan56`	`I remember my first time`
`09:06.33`	`lan56`	`I knew how exciting it was`
`09:06.35`	`rtyler`	`heh`
`09:06.45`	`rtyler`	`I'm not a gamer mind you, this is pretty extreme for me ;)`
`09:06.45`	`lan56`	`it was more smooth than yours tho :(`
`09:06.49`	`lan56`	`ahh`
`09:06.59`	`rtyler`	`tired of debugging (it's 4am)`
`09:07.10`	`lan56`	`well rule 1: don't let people get you down if they ever call you a "n00b"`
`09:07.12`	`lan56`	`as you may know`
`09:07.39`	`rtyler`	`lan56: I played a reasonable bit of couter strike when friends would invite me to lan parties a few years back; I'm accustomed to 'n00b' comments`
`09:07.42`	`lan56`	`you probably will encounter it, tho bzflag is more friendly than some other games (or at least I think so)`
`09:07.48`	`lan56`	`ahh`
`09:08.00`	`lan56`	`you're prepared, a good relief :)`
`09:08.23`	`rtyler`	`heh, just switched computers for IRC, w00t for screen :D`
`09:08.37`	`lan56`	`hah`
`09:08.54`	`rtyler`	`this iMac is a powerful machine, might as well use it`
`09:09.07`	`lan56`	`what year is it from?`
`09:09.20`	`rtyler`	`lan56: I bought it about 2 weeks ago ;)`
`09:09.28`	`rtyler`	`developing on my Powerbook was getting to be a pain`
`09:09.32`	`lan56`	`ahh a new one, those are always the best :)`
`09:09.41`	`lan56`	`I see`
`09:10.17`	`rtyler`	`had to get my first _top_ of the line machine ;)`
`09:10.27`	`rtyler`	`2Ghz/2GB 20" intel iMac :)`
`09:10.32`	`lan56`	`with technology today, already its old news :)`
`09:10.52`	`lan56`	`nice specs`
`09:10.56`	`lan56`	`how come only 2 gb tho?`
`09:11.04`	`lan56`	`hard disk space you mean?`
`09:11.36`	`rtyler`	`RAM`
`09:11.55`	`lan56`	`ahh now THAT is impressive`
`09:12.04`	`lan56`	`I didnt even know they made that much`
`09:12.11`	`rtyler`	`heh`
`09:12.22`	`rtyler`	`the Powermac G5's are truly impressive`
`09:12.30`	`rtyler`	`quad core Powermac G5, with 16GB of RAM`
`09:12.36`	`rtyler`	`under your _desk_`
`09:12.39`	`rtyler`	`in a TOWER`
`09:12.50`	`lan56`	`oh yeah, I don't have one but I have spent soem time on them`
`09:12.53`	`lan56`	`they are works of art`
`09:13.15`	`lan56`	`well mac os x is at least :)`
`09:13.46`	`rtyler`	`except recently, hit a bug that's been killing me for days`
`09:14.07`	`lan56`	`what is the "in" ide for macs nowadays?`
`09:14.16`	`lan56`	`I rememeber it was MPW on classics`
`09:14.30`	`lan56`	`the groovy ide to use, that type of thing`
`09:14.55`	`rtyler`	`lan56: XCode, it's a fantastic IDE`
`09:15.07`	`rtyler`	`I work in .NET by day, with VS.NET 2005`
`09:15.14`	`rtyler`	`and XCode is still the best IDE i've ever used`
`09:15.39`	`lan56`	`ahh I oughta look into that`
`09:15.43`	`lan56`	`I've only heard of the name but not much more`
`09:16.45`	`rtyler`	`check it out ;)`
`09:16.53`	`brlcad`	`rtyler: looks like you downloaded the zip`
`09:17.03`	`lan56`	`checking :)`
`09:17.19`	`brlcad`	`download the .tar.gz or .tar.bz2 instead`
`09:18.27`	`rtyler`	`brlcad: you mean the source?`
`09:18.37`	`brlcad`	`yes`
`09:18.44`	`rtyler`	`ok, let me see here`
`09:18.57`	`rtyler`	`this is gross, ssh from powerbook to iMac, to build on the imac ;)`
`09:19.58`	`rtyler`	`brlcad: what's the different?`
`09:21.36`	`rtyler`	`difference* even`
`09:24.30`	`rtyler`	`whoa, what the hell`
`09:24.35`	`rtyler`	`autogen is working now`
`09:28.50`	`rtyler`	`lan56: to give you an idea of how fast this machine is, i'm building bzflag, and running it, without lag :)`
`09:29.22`	`lan56`	`wow I wish I could do that, my computer is quite sluggish when I try that`
`09:31.26`	`ruskie`	`:)`
`09:31.42`	`rtyler`	`but damn, this takes a while to build! :)`
`09:32.02`	`lan56`	`bzflag? to say the least`
`09:32.13`	`lan56`	`after a while you get used to it tho IMHO`
`09:32.42`	`rtyler`	`i'll be sure to post this 2.0.6 build as soon as I'm done ;)`
`09:32.51`	`lan56`	`k`
`09:34.03`	`rtyler`	`lan56: you should come back in, this game is insane`
`09:34.15`	`lan56`	`ok this sounds fun`
`09:34.16`	`lan56`	`coming`
`09:39.08`	`brlcad`	`rtyler: the zip has file line endings for windows, the others have unix line endings`
`09:39.33`	`brlcad`	`hence why ./autogen.sh didn't work originally necessitating a sh autogen.sh`
`09:40.04`	`rtyler`	`is that documented anywhere? :-o`
`09:40.11`	`brlcad`	`somewhere`
`09:40.18`	`brlcad`	`not sure where :)`
`09:40.22`	`brlcad`	`but somewhere`
`09:40.34`	`rtyler`	`somebody shoudl...`
`09:42.07`	`Pimpinella`	`however, it makes sense, i'd expect unix folks to d/l tar.gz instead of zip`
`09:43.00`	`rtyler`	`Pimpinella: I'm mac ;)`
`09:43.03`	`rtyler`	`middle of the road really`
`09:43.14`	`Pimpinella`	`mac is unix`
`09:43.18`	`Pimpinella`	`100%`
`09:43.42`	`lan56`	`what happened to the .sit/.hqx ending?`
`09:43.45`	`rtyler`	`Pimpinella: but most files for mac aren't distributed as .tar.gz, since that takes two unzippings really`
`09:43.45`	`lan56`	`is that still around?`
`09:43.49`	`rtyler`	`lan56: yeah, meh ;)`
`09:43.56`	`lan56`	`outdated huh?`
`09:44.41`	`Pimpinella`	`rtyler: 2 unzippings?`
`09:45.41`	`rtyler`	`Pimpinella: by default, it unzips to .tar`
`09:45.44`	`rtyler`	`then to what you "want"`
`09:46.42`	`Pimpinella`	`ic`
`09:47.13`	`rtyler`	`fuck, i really suck ::P`
`09:47.21`	`Pimpinella`	`?`
`09:47.33`	`rtyler`	`Pimpinella: i'm playing right now ;)`
`09:49.55`	`_Manu_`	`hallo Pimpinella`
`09:54.39`	`lan56`	`rtyler, cya later`
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`11:30.01`	`ruskie`	`[12:23:10] <cbv> hell has finally frozen over ... not only does bheron agree with Deek, but todays headline apparently is ... drumroll`
`11:30.04`	`ruskie`	`[12:23:16] <cbv> Duke Nukem Forever In Final Stages`
`11:30.07`	`ruskie`	`[12:23:45] <cbv> http://www.gamasutra.com/php-bin/news_index.php?story=8878`
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`12:07.53`	`CIA-6`	`BZFlag: 03brlcad * 10bzflag/src/bzflag/playing.cxx: M-x indent-region`
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`16:18.46`	`menotume`	`YAY for Windows !`
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`16:19.20`	`kierra`	`ah, they're all sleeping`
`16:19.27`	`kierra`	`or maybe they agree`
`16:19.34`	`CBG`	`Windows is da bezt.`
`16:19.41`	`CBG`	`da shnizzle.`
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`16:20.47`	`menotume`	`they're dropping like flies`
`16:21.33`	`CBG`	`:(`
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`16:27.17`	`menotume`	`you better leave !`
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`18:19.39`	`blast007`	`http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,191593,00.html`
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`18:26.00`	`JeffM2501`	`they make the magic disk`
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`21:46.59`	`lan56`	`are the plugins for bzfs a vc++ only thing or is it also on gcc builds?`
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`21:51.05`	`JeffM2501`	`linux and mac can build them using libtool`
`21:51.46`	`JeffM2501`	`and that builds them with GCC`
`21:52.03`	`JeffM2501`	`mingw suposedly can build DLLs`
`21:52.03`	`lan56`	`libtool, okay I'll look into that`
`21:52.15`	`lan56`	`it can build dlls, sure`
`21:52.21`	`JeffM2501`	`but I odn't know if it can generate an export lib from bzfs`
`21:52.28`	`JeffM2501`	`can it use a VC export lib?`
`21:52.33`	`JeffM2501`	`when building a dll?`
`21:52.39`	`lan56`	`.lib? I don't believe so`
`21:53.01`	`JeffM2501`	`then it would need it's own export lib from devC++ bzfs`
`21:53.04`	`JeffM2501`	`and link to that`
`21:53.12`	`lan56`	`and libtool makes one?`
`21:54.27`	`JeffM2501`	`no`
`21:54.33`	`JeffM2501`	`libtool makes linux dynamic libs`
`21:54.37`	`JeffM2501`	`or mac dynamic libs`
`21:54.51`	`JeffM2501`	`I don't know if your devC++ can make VC compatable DLLs`
`21:54.58`	`JeffM2501`	`if it can't use our export lib`
`21:55.40`	`lan56`	`no I don't think so, but then again I might not know enough on the topic`
`21:55.51`	`JeffM2501`	`I don't know what devC++ can do`
`21:56.00`	`JeffM2501`	`can they do sub projects yet?`
`21:56.03`	`lan56`	`whatever gcc can do`
`21:56.10`	`JeffM2501`	`gcc can do a lot`
`21:56.26`	`JeffM2501`	`I'm not sure devC++ exposes every gcc function`
`21:56.41`	`JeffM2501`	`I'm also not so sure how important devC++ is, now that there is a free VC++`
`21:56.47`	`lan56`	`true true`
`21:56.57`	`lan56`	`well I'll look into it, thanks for your help`
`21:56.57`	`JeffM2501`	`have you tried the free VC++?`
`21:57.09`	`lan56`	`vc++ 2005 express? I have it but not really done much with it`
`21:57.15`	`JeffM2501`	`ahh`
`21:57.17`	`JeffM2501`	`I haven't used it yet`
`21:57.29`	`lan56`	`it doesn't seem to come with the platform sdk`
`21:57.32`	`JeffM2501`	`I've heard people are making plugins with it tho`
`21:57.35`	`JeffM2501`	`no it dosn't`
`21:57.39`	`JeffM2501`	`you have to get that and direct X`
`21:57.42`	`JeffM2501`	`to build BZ`
`21:58.10`	`L4m3r`	`hookup*`
`21:58.10`	`JeffM2501`	`yeah students get it easy`
`21:58.14`	`L4m3r`	`college rules`
`21:58.16`	`L4m3r`	`lol`
`21:58.22`	`lan56`	`ucla? thats a nice school`
`21:58.36`	`JeffM2501`	`MS has a very agress ive student discount program`
`21:58.39`	`L4m3r`	`yeah, it has its nice points`
`21:58.46`	`lan56`	`I like their cafeterias, all you can eat is nice`
`21:58.51`	`JeffM2501`	`you can get the full visual studio for like 18$`
`21:58.58`	`L4m3r`	`you've been down here? heh`
`21:59.09`	`JeffM2501`	`he lives in glendale IIRC`
`21:59.12`	`L4m3r`	`we get it free for comp sci classes, thankfully`
`21:59.12`	`lan56`	`well 3rd parties can walk in a get a bite to eat`
`21:59.15`	`lan56`	`true`
`21:59.21`	`lan56`	`well this is ot and I started it, so I will end it`
`21:59.22`	`L4m3r`	`ah, cool`
`21:59.33`	`TD-Linux`	`vc2005 express works for me`
`21:59.51`	`L4m3r`	`does vc++ 05 have any newer features I should be aware of?`
`22:00.19`	`TD-Linux`	`it needs .net 2.0`
`22:00.23`	`TD-Linux`	`that's all`
`22:00.36`	`L4m3r`	`hm`
`22:01.57`	`JeffM2501`	`yes`
`22:02.00`	`JeffM2501`	`it has more stuff`
`22:02.41`	`JeffM2501`	`DTRemenak says the debuger is nice`
`22:03.01`	`JeffM2501`	`tho he never used 7.1 so he may just be comparing it to 6`
`22:03.15`	`L4m3r`	`I'll remember that next time I get stuck :)`
`22:03.24`	`JeffM2501`	`express is a very viable solution now that we have VC8 projects`
`22:03.38`	`JeffM2501`	`the debuger is your friend`
`22:03.44`	`JeffM2501`	`use it often`
`22:03.53`	`L4m3r`	`heh`
`22:03.55`	`JeffM2501`	`I allmost never build or run in release now`
`22:04.24`	`L4m3r`	`I don't either, generally, unless I'm packing a plugin binary for release`
`22:05.58`	`JeffM2501`	`I'm still trying to see why it seems many *nixie kids fear the debuger`
`22:06.47`	`purple_cow`	`because gdb is hard to learn`
`22:07.01`	`JeffM2501`	`isn't there a graphic shell for it?`
`22:07.10`	`L4m3r`	`I don't use it that often, just because I mostly deal with smaller projects and can fix things just by knowing what line a problem is on`
`22:07.27`	`L4m3r`	`but it has saved my arse a couple times, definitely`
`22:07.47`	`purple_cow`	`there are a few`
`22:07.48`	`JeffM2501`	`you should allways step thru your code at least onece to make sure it'd doin what you want it to do :)`
`22:08.01`	`purple_cow`	`pff`
`22:08.02`	`JeffM2501`	`kdev had a prety cool debuger`
`22:08.16`	`purple_cow`	`you and your crazy ideas`
`22:08.33`	`purple_cow`	`no, i just enjoy surprises`
`22:08.35`	`JeffM2501`	`you know me, alloways on the edge`
`22:08.48`	`JeffM2501`	`me and my silly "logic"`
`22:09.29`	`bryjen`	`you don't know what code you wrote is going to do? ;)`
`22:09.48`	`JeffM2501`	`sometimes it dosn't get writen the same way you think you wrote it :)`
`22:10.06`	`JeffM2501`	`get drunk.. write some code.`
`22:10.12`	`JeffM2501`	`then come back and look at it the next day`
`22:10.16`	`JeffM2501`	`that's always fun :)`
`22:10.21`	`purple_cow`	`:)`
`22:10.22`	`JeffM2501`	`"who wrote this crap"`
`22:10.36`	`bryjen`	`hehe. harder to debug the wetware ;)`
`22:10.42`	`purple_cow`	`and the night before it was beautiful and perfect`
`22:10.59`	`JeffM2501`	`and now it involves 14 goto statements`
`22:11.42`	`JeffM2501`	`tho I did find the line of code that is the VC debuger's nemisis`
`22:11.48`	`bryjen`	`gremlins hacked in through your dsl and rewrote all your .cpp files! :)`
`22:12.02`	`JeffM2501`	`for (ting;thing<thing;thing++)if (thing) setthing();`
`22:12.14`	`JeffM2501`	`all on one line`
`22:12.32`	`*** join/#bzflag awelux_ (n=wizart@dslb-084-058-160-173.pools.arcor-ip.net)`
`22:14.25`	`menotume`	`ahhh, fork it`
`22:14.36`	`JeffM2501`	`well I'd fork it after the libcurl thing was fixed`
`22:14.57`	`JeffM2501`	`and if I fork it do I stick it in bz cvs under a branch? or something else like a svn project`
`22:15.17`	`L4m3r`	`I think a fork could be disastrous to this game :\ not enough players yet`
`22:15.24`	`JeffM2501`	`I think I'd do health and splash damage first, just to make it difrent enough`
`22:15.51`	`JeffM2501`	`then turn the superflags into powerup boxes that are picked up`
`22:16.29`	`TheRedBaron`	`like mario kart?`
`22:16.36`	`JeffM2501`	`heh`
`22:16.42`	`JeffM2501`	`like subspace had`
`22:16.53`	`JeffM2501`	`not like "super speed" for 10 seconds`
`22:17.01`	`TheRedBaron`	`ah, you were a big subspace fan?`
`22:17.07`	`JeffM2501`	`hell yeah`
`22:17.13`	`JeffM2501`	`that was a great game, just before it's time`
`22:17.23`	`JeffM2501`	`the net wasn't ready for people to pay to play a game yet`
`22:17.32`	`JeffM2501`	`or for games to have that many people`
`22:17.43`	`purple_cow`	`some of us still aren't ready ;)`
`22:17.48`	`JeffM2501`	`but the game mechanics were solid and would work great in a 3d tank game`
`22:18.04`	`JeffM2501`	`well also bandwith is cheaper now where it can be hosted for free`
`22:18.20`	`JeffM2501`	`It just died as a comerical one cus it was trying to do the EQ thing before it's time`
`22:18.28`	`JeffM2501`	`the game is still played free`
`22:18.52`	`purple_cow`	`you just need to have portal based servers!`
`22:19.02`	`JeffM2501`	`?`
`22:19.11`	`JeffM2501`	`like the servers that link to others?`
`22:19.15`	`TheRedBaron`	`I think they made a sequel`
`22:19.19`	`purple_cow`	`tap into the infinite resource that is 13-year-olds who want to run servers`
`22:19.33`	`JeffM2501`	`infinate monkeys :)`
`22:19.43`	`JeffM2501`	`TheRedBaron, well yes and no`
`22:19.55`	`JeffM2501`	`the game was remade for free as continum (sp)`
`22:20.09`	`JeffM2501`	`the author of the origonal went to work for sony`
`22:20.17`	`JeffM2501`	`they made there own called Cosmic Rift`
`22:20.49`	`JeffM2501`	`none of them are diectly related to the origonal as in like a "subspace 2" but they both play nearly the same`
`22:21.20`	`TheRedBaron`	`it wasn't called freespace 2?`
`22:21.27`	`JeffM2501`	`no`
`22:21.35`	`JeffM2501`	`that's from the "desent line"`
`22:21.44`	`JeffM2501`	`that is more of a full blown 3d space sim`
`22:21.56`	`JeffM2501`	`yet a fun game`
`22:22.05`	`JeffM2501`	`but not realy multiplayer on the level of subspace`
`22:22.06`	`TheRedBaron`	`I can't do 3dspace sims`
`22:22.16`	`TheRedBaron`	`I lose track of up and down :)`
`22:22.17`	`JeffM2501`	`yeah they are hard to do right`
`22:22.27`	`JeffM2501`	`subspace was totaly 2d`
`22:22.29`	`blast007`	`TheRedBaron: then don't play the Descent series ;)`
`22:22.45`	`blast007`	`and I saw a reference to Descent earlier, wondering about team play`
`22:22.47`	`JeffM2501`	`I want to take the flags that change shot types, and turn them into weapon pickups`
`22:22.54`	`JeffM2501`	`but let you only have one weapon at a time`
`22:22.58`	`blast007`	`even Descent 2 (maybe even the first Descent) had CTF`
`22:23.01`	`JeffM2501`	`then make there be ammo packs for those weapons`
`22:23.18`	`JeffM2501`	`and turn the other good flags into accesories that you can pick up and activate`
`22:23.34`	`JeffM2501`	`and the bad flags are just what happen sometimes when you pick up a "busted" pickup`
`22:23.40`	`JeffM2501`	`like a trap`
`22:24.00`	`L4m3r`	`Like the exploding crates in Red Alert :P`
`22:24.07`	`JeffM2501`	`yeah`
`22:24.19`	`JeffM2501`	`then it's obvious what you are geting when you get it`
`22:24.20`	`L4m3r`	`man those things ruin your day`
`22:24.30`	`JeffM2501`	`except when it's a bad goodie :)`
`22:24.37`	`L4m3r`	`heh`
`22:24.38`	`JeffM2501`	`and you can trick yourself out how ever you want`
`22:24.39`	`TheRedBaron`	`right off to home with me`
`22:24.47`	`JeffM2501`	`you want lazer and sealth, have at it`
`22:24.53`	`JeffM2501`	`your just gonna have no power for your shields`
`22:24.58`	`JeffM2501`	`and be an easy shot`
`22:25.20`	`JeffM2501`	`you wanna give up your accessory slot for double ammo capacity.. have at it`
`22:25.22`	`TheRedBaron`	`Jeffm2501: promise me a radar, a beautiful radar, and I"m all over it :-D`
`22:25.29`	`JeffM2501`	`a nice round one`
`22:25.36`	`TheRedBaron`	`can I make it big?`
`22:25.37`	`JeffM2501`	`with bings and boops`
`22:25.49`	`L4m3r`	`with blips that indicate the direction tanks are facing :D`
`22:25.53`	`JeffM2501`	`if you want a 2d client, just ask for a 2d client`
`22:26.04`	`TheRedBaron`	`Jeffm2501: can I have a 2d client?`
`22:26.08`	`JeffM2501`	`no`
`22:26.10`	`JeffM2501`	`;)`
`22:26.10`	`blast007`	`lol`
`22:26.12`	`TheRedBaron`	`damn...`
`22:26.17`	`TheRedBaron`	`:)`
`22:26.17`	`L4m3r`	`hahaha'`
`22:26.21`	`JeffM2501`	`cus radar is affectd by jamming`
`22:26.31`	`JeffM2501`	`TheRedBaron, you ReaLY should play subspace`
`22:26.32`	`TheRedBaron`	`ew, you'd put jamming in?`
`22:26.33`	`JeffM2501`	`it's all 2d`
`22:26.35`	`JeffM2501`	`you'd love it`
`22:26.39`	`JeffM2501`	`yeah`
`22:26.52`	`JeffM2501`	`I'd make it be an accesory a tank could run to jam the people around him :)`
`22:26.56`	`JeffM2501`	`at the cost of power :)`
`22:27.15`	`L4m3r`	`one of the pickups should be a busted alternator. Man that would suck.`
`22:27.28`	`TheRedBaron`	`will I need 3 hands to play this game?`
`22:27.34`	`JeffM2501`	`yeah you could have a bad thing be lowerr recharge rate`
`22:27.38`	`JeffM2501`	`no`
`22:27.42`	`JeffM2501`	`why would you?`
`22:28.02`	`TheRedBaron`	`if you've played Free-space, you need at least 4 hands`
`22:28.11`	`TheRedBaron`	`I gave up on that game`
`22:28.26`	`blast007`	`I think I still have that`
`22:28.30`	`blast007`	`haven't played it in a while`
`22:28.35`	`TheRedBaron`	`they should have made it a RTS, not FPS`
`22:28.42`	`blast007`	`ick`
`22:28.50`	`blast007`	`if it was, I would not have bought it :)`
`22:28.54`	`TheRedBaron`	`because of the commands you have to give to your wingmates`
`22:29.16`	`TheRedBaron`	`if you memorize the controls and can hit them while dog-fighting, its really cool`
`22:29.20`	`TheRedBaron`	`but that wasn't me`
`22:30.11`	`TheRedBaron`	`I'm getting blasted into the 4th dimension while looking up commands to get my wingmates to bail my sorry rear out of trouble`
`22:32.21`	`*** join/#bzflag QuantumBeep (n=QB@adsl-33-216-37.lft.bellsouth.net)`
`22:34.18`	`JeffM2501`	`I'm talking about the same movements of bzflag`
`22:34.32`	`JeffM2501`	`just change the way the weapons work`
`22:34.36`	`JeffM2501`	`and do damage`
`22:34.54`	`JeffM2501`	`give everyone the big slow gun and it'd play a lot like normal shots now :)`
`22:35.41`	`JeffM2501`	`I don't expect everyone to like the idea tho`
`22:35.54`	`JeffM2501`	`the players who play bzflag more like chess then quake will not like it`
`22:36.27`	`JeffM2501`	`or I should say more like pool`
`22:36.43`	`JeffM2501`	`"red tank, off the corner box"`
`22:37.01`	`L4m3r`	`lol`
`22:37.13`	`JeffM2501`	`that is one way people play`
`22:37.17`	`JeffM2501`	`and one reason people like it`
`22:37.28`	`L4m3r`	`yeah`
`22:37.29`	`JeffM2501`	`it's slower and more of a thinking game then just a quake fragfest`
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`22:37.58`	`ruskie`	`freespace was nice...`
`22:38.03`	`L4m3r`	`there are a lot of people who just add "jump" to the newbish "spray n' pray" technique :\`
`22:38.25`	`JeffM2501`	`those are the players I think would like this new way better`
`22:38.32`	`JeffM2501`	`where you can spary`
`22:38.36`	`ruskie`	`no clue what redbaron is talking about... all I needed was a joystinck with 2 buttons...`
`22:38.45`	`JeffM2501`	`but that dosn't mean you'll kill evryone you hit in one shot :)`
`22:38.57`	`JeffM2501`	`ruskie, he likes 2 games`
`22:39.00`	`JeffM2501`	`2d games`
`22:39.05`	`ruskie`	`lol`
`22:39.07`	`ruskie`	`I do as well :)`
`22:39.07`	`JeffM2501`	`that's why he plays with full screen radar`
`22:39.13`	`ruskie`	`ohhh`
`22:39.17`	`JeffM2501`	`it's the pool mentality thing`
`22:39.30`	`JeffM2501`	`where it's more about the long shot and trick driving then about agression`
`22:39.58`	`ruskie`	`I prefer such games anyway :)`
`22:40.09`	`JeffM2501`	`many who play bzflag do`
`22:40.10`	`ruskie`	`where you need to think atleast a bit`
`22:40.19`	`JeffM2501`	`that's why I don't think a fork on those lines will hurt bz`
`22:40.21`	`ruskie`	`keeps me from falling asleep`
`22:40.22`	`JeffM2501`	`cus they would be difrent`
`22:40.32`	`JeffM2501`	`people would be able to play ether or, based on there mood`
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`22:40.55`	`JeffM2501`	`sometimes you just want to frag some punkbitches`
`22:41.00`	`ruskie`	`yup`
`22:41.02`	`ruskie`	`that's true`
`22:41.02`	`bryjen`	`but would there tank change color....`
`22:41.22`	`JeffM2501`	`change color?`
`22:41.29`	`bryjen`	`based on there mood`
`22:41.38`	`JeffM2501`	`heh`
`22:41.41`	`JeffM2501`	`mood dank`
`22:41.46`	`JeffM2501`	`"I think your angry today"`
`22:42.16`	`QuantumBeep`	`"You wouldn't like me when I'm angry"`
`22:42.27`	`ruskie`	`that would be mine 99% of the time`
`22:42.39`	`ruskie`	`and the "Mad as hell" the other 1%`
`22:44.04`	`*** part/#bzflag bryjen (n=bryjen@63.147.94.149)`
`22:44.07`	`ruskie`	`hmm so would this be a mixed in game thing? or would it be use a diff client way?`
`22:44.17`	`JeffM2501`	`that is why I said FORK :)`
`22:44.21`	`ruskie`	`ahh`
`22:44.21`	`JeffM2501`	`I don't think they can be mixed`
`22:44.23`	`JeffM2501`	`at all`
`22:44.26`	`ruskie`	`true`
`22:44.32`	`ruskie`	`sorry missed the fork...`
`22:44.32`	`JeffM2501`	`I think they can share code and technology`
`22:44.41`	`JeffM2501`	`but I don't think they could be the same game`
`22:45.14`	`JeffM2501`	`or I could just be talkin out my butt again`
`22:45.31`	`ruskie`	`hmm`
`22:45.43`	`ruskie`	`well it could be incorporated into tho game I guess...`
`22:46.14`	`ruskie`	`but the ployers using it should be nitcabely different diff color tone and lighter`
`22:46.33`	`ruskie`	`would make an interesting tactic`
`22:46.52`	`ruskie`	`or simply a flag that does it...`
`22:48.55`	`ruskie`	`hmm`
`22:49.13`	`ruskie`	`but scrolling up having pickups and so on would be nice...`
`22:49.38`	`ruskie`	`though I'd add you need to return to base/safe zone to have it installed`
`22:49.43`	`JeffM2501`	`I would not want to do it as a "mode" in the main line`
`22:49.46`	`JeffM2501`	`too much would change`
`22:49.58`	`JeffM2501`	`and would make the simple bzflag way too complex`
`22:50.11`	`ruskie`	`and the base should have a spherical area around it in which you can't shoot nor bo shoot at... same for safe zones`
`22:50.13`	`Pimpinella`	`where is bzflag's config file on windows sysrems?`
`22:50.50`	`DTRemenak`	`my documents\my bzflag files\2.0`
`22:51.20`	`Pimpinella`	`ty again`
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`22:55.03`	`Pimpinella`	`i need somebody who can speak french on #bzchat please`
`22:55.26`	`Pimpinella`	`trepan probably?`
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`22:59.38`	`blast007`	`:)`
`22:59.38`	`JeffM2501`	`ride the split!`
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`23:02.59`	`A_Meteorite`	`hehe`
`23:03.00`	`A_Meteorite`	`second time this week`
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`23:06.15`	`JeffM2501`	`poor level3`
`23:08.00`	`menotume`	`weeeeeeeeee`
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`23:08.01`	`L4m3r`	`b0rk!`
`23:08.21`	`QuantumBeep`	`sweet merciful lord and saviour, is IRC undergoing The Blessed Hope?`
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`23:12.50`	`DTRemenak`	`it's like a roller coaster in here :)`
`23:13.29`	`A_Meteorite`	`heh`
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`23:18.57`	`menotume`	`ahh, the 'T's are coming back now`
`23:21.09`	`L4m3r`	`(16:12:45) lilo: (notice) [Global Notice] We are told that a huge asteroid just hit the atlantic. In addition to a loss in connectivity between America and Europe, you are all going to die in a few minutes. Sorry for the inconvenience.`
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`23:23.28`	`menotume`	`lol @ L4m3r`
`23:23.53`	`menotume`	`did you send that to lilo ?`
`23:24.08`	`L4m3r`	`no`
`23:24.13`	`menotume`	`auuu`
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`23:24.30`	`L4m3r`	`just making fun of lilo`
`23:24.34`	`menotume`	`hehe`
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`23:34.11`	`kooseefoo`	`Hello... is anyone on here?`
`23:34.34`	`L4m3r`	`for the moment.`
`23:34.34`	`kooseefoo`	`Hmmm...`
`23:34.36`	`kooseefoo`	`oh`
`23:34.38`	`kooseefoo`	`cool!`
`23:35.29`	`kooseefoo`	`Do you know anything about the problem with GCC v4.0.x? Basically, when you fire, the shot doesn't show up on anyone else's client, so they don't die... I've been trying to fix it without any luck`
`23:35.52`	`blast007`	`kooseefoo: have you tried compiling yourself?`
`23:36.02`	`kooseefoo`	`Yes, that's what i've been doing`
`23:36.14`	`blast007`	`which version of the game?`
`23:36.16`	`kooseefoo`	`I added in the CXXFLAGS=-O1, but that doesn't seem to help`
`23:36.18`	`kooseefoo`	`2.0.6`
`23:36.21`	`blast007`	`hmm`
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`23:37.06`	`blast007`	`I was thinking that was supposed to fix the issue`
`23:38.18`	`kooseefoo`	`Yea... I added that option in and rebuilt it from scratch, but to no avail`
`23:38.28`	`kooseefoo`	`(I can always WINE it though)`
`23:39.21`	`blast007`	`I mean just building form source was supposed to fix it`
`23:39.27`	`blast007`	`from*`
`23:39.53`	`blast007`	`but I'm more of a Windows guy, so I don't know if anything else was discovered to cause an issue`
`23:40.04`	`kooseefoo`	`ohhh`
`23:40.14`	`Chestal`	`kooseefoo: bz has been working with gcc 4.x for some time`
`23:40.16`	`brlcad_`	`yay subspace`
`23:40.29`	`brlcad_`	`they were way before their time`
`23:40.42`	`Chestal`	`kooseefoo: is this AMD64 or something?`
`23:40.46`	`kooseefoo`	`Yes, it is`
`23:41.25`	`Chestal`	`don't really know somethign about that specific issue, thought it was fixed, too, whatever it was`
`23:42.11`	`brlcad_`	`hmm`
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`23:42.33`	`Chestal`	`kooseefoo: do you kno wwhether somethign shows up about your shots in server logs?`
`23:44.30`	`kooseefoo`	`Yea, I've been looking for the updated version of GCC for my distro, but that also seems to evade me`
`23:45.18`	`kooseefoo`	`Nope, I don't know about that`
`23:46.09`	`Chestal`	`should start there, then maybe do some tst output in server to print what values are received wrong. Cannot do this tonight, bed time here. cu`
`23:46.25`	`kooseefoo`	`alrighty`
`23:46.28`	`kooseefoo`	`thx though`
`23:47.13`	`blast007`	`kooseefoo: I have a server running at bz.sh.nu:8000 if you want to test`
`23:47.27`	`blast007`	`I can see if the logs here show anything strange`
`23:48.17`	`kooseefoo`	`okay`
`23:48.42`	`kooseefoo`	`which logs would you be looking at? (I'm just interested because i've set up a server of my own)... i wasn't aware that you could log with that sort of detail`
`23:49.39`	`kooseefoo`	`alrighty, i'll jump on there for a second`
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`23:50.31`	`blast007`	`I'll just look at the bzfs server logs`
`23:50.39`	`kooseefoo`	`okay`
`23:50.50`	`blast007`	`with -ddd (level 3 debugging)`
`23:53.21`	`kooseefoo`	`ohh, gotcha`
`23:58.02`	`kooseefoo`	`hmm`
`23:58.05`	`kooseefoo`	`it won't even launch anymore`
`23:58.17`	`blast007`	`:(`
`23:58.17`	`kooseefoo`	`I'm gonna try to sort that out first... thanks for the help anyways`
`23:58.20`	`kooseefoo`	`haha yea`
`23:58.22`	`blast007`	`k`
`23:58.26`	`kooseefoo`	`c you later`
`23:58.30`	`blast007`	`bye`
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