| 00:09.37 | RPG_ | This is the longest I've ever seen JeffM absent... |
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| 02:35.45 | I_Died_Once | DTR are you there? |
| 02:38.24 | DTRemenak | surprisingly, yes |
| 02:38.37 | I_Died_Once | can you delete a group for me? |
| 02:39.17 | I_Died_Once | I need my mofo.stfu group deleted (I am the moderator/owner of said group) |
| 02:39.41 | I_Died_Once | can that be done? |
| 02:41.35 | I_Died_Once | oh go to hell learner |
| 02:41.53 | brlcad | excuse me? |
| 02:42.28 | I_Died_Once | scroll up |
| 02:45.02 | brlcad | I fail to see the animosity connection |
| 02:45.42 | I_Died_Once | who sai danyhting about animosity? |
| 02:45.50 | I_Died_Once | I was just asking DTR a question |
| 02:46.14 | I_Died_Once | can you delete a group? |
| 02:47.09 | brlcad | telling someone to go to hell isn't very nice, I don't see the connection to anything you've said |
| 02:47.31 | brlcad | my response about being suprised was to DTRemenak, not to you |
| 02:47.53 | I_Died_Once | gah |
| 02:48.00 | I_Died_Once | I refer to my original statement |
| 02:48.52 | I_Died_Once | I'm not always a very nice person |
| 02:49.03 | I_Died_Once | but I'm trying dammit |
| 02:49.07 | I_Died_Once | I just need a group deleted |
| 02:49.34 | brlcad | you're a short shake of a stick from getting the boot is all you're likely to get from me at this point |
| 02:50.42 | I_Died_Once | go fuck yourself, thanks for the help |
| 02:51.02 | brlcad | *sigh* |
| 02:51.42 | *** mode/#bzflag [+b *!*@pcp0010382004pcs.savana01.ga.comcast.net] by brlcad |
| 02:56.29 | sgk284 | wow... |
| 02:56.40 | sgk284 | that was something else |
| 02:57.47 | brlcad | I think I made a friend |
| 02:57.59 | sgk284 | heh |
| 03:04.42 | Grumbler | wow brlcad, what did you do to that guy/gal :) |
| 03:05.11 | brlcad | a budding sbsp maybe? :) |
| 03:05.27 | bryjen | i think he was trying to be funny |
| 03:05.31 | brlcad | what was that german guys name.. mantis or something? |
| 03:05.57 | bryjen | re the previous discussion about language rules on the bb |
| 03:06.20 | bryjen | or maybe he's just an idiot |
| 03:06.25 | bryjen | ;) |
| 03:07.29 | brlcad | isn't it just great how tone and attitude is mostly lost over text |
| 03:07.43 | brlcad | at least until you meet the people in person and can connect the dots ;) |
| 03:07.57 | Grumbler | yep |
| 03:08.23 | Grumbler | its worse with language differences |
| 03:08.43 | bryjen | even then, one person's funny is not always shared |
| 03:09.05 | bryjen | err, or somethinglike that. did that make any sense? |
| 03:09.35 | Grumbler | once i got my mind out of the gutter, i got it :) |
| 03:11.21 | Mr_Molez | is the new plugin system for server-side only ? |
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| 03:34.45 | bryjen | and a new PC to put it in ;) |
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| 03:59.26 | trepan | why not? |
| 03:59.39 | JeffM2501 | speed not worth the money |
| 03:59.47 | JeffM2501 | unless it's an ultra or GT |
| 03:59.49 | trepan | ... and shouldn't SLI speed it up? (ref. yesterday) |
| 04:00.16 | JeffM2501 | depends on the app |
| 04:00.49 | JeffM2501 | for real games what I mostly see is, SLI just lets you hold decent frame rates as the scene gets more complex |
| 04:00.55 | JeffM2501 | it dosnt' make simple scenes run any fastaer |
| 04:01.01 | JeffM2501 | probably bus overhead |
| 04:01.22 | JeffM2501 | and BZ runs like ass in SLI |
| 04:01.27 | JeffM2501 | since we don't have an SLI profile |
| 04:01.35 | JeffM2501 | so all we get is alternate frame rendering |
| 04:01.39 | JeffM2501 | and that does not work well |
| 04:01.41 | trepan | wonder how they split the work |
| 04:01.54 | JeffM2501 | there are 2 modes with nvidia |
| 04:01.56 | JeffM2501 | alternate frame |
| 04:02.07 | JeffM2501 | basicly each frame goes to an alternating card |
| 04:02.10 | JeffM2501 | or split frame |
| 04:02.13 | JeffM2501 | where one does the top |
| 04:02.16 | JeffM2501 | another does the bottom |
| 04:02.45 | JeffM2501 | but you have to set a profile to tell it to use one or the other, and the app has to call some extensions |
| 04:03.20 | JeffM2501 | it's still in it's infancy |
| 04:03.28 | JeffM2501 | I give it a year before it gets rock solid |
| 04:05.31 | trepan | http://download.nvidia.com/developer/presentations/2005/GDC/OpenGL_Day/OpenGL_SLI.pdf |
| 04:07.35 | trepan | might want to try that map again without the glFinish() calls in playing.cxx |
| 04:07.43 | trepan | i'd be interested to know the diff |
| 04:08.43 | JeffM2501 | when I was running with the "generic" profile, it would like get the frames out of order |
| 04:08.49 | JeffM2501 | and seem to "bounce" back and forth |
| 04:10.05 | trepan | wsa that with vsync ? |
| 04:10.06 | JeffM2501 | they also mention a PFD option |
| 04:10.13 | JeffM2501 | vsync off |
| 04:10.53 | JeffM2501 | heh "never call glFinish" :) |
| 04:11.05 | JeffM2501 | let me reboot in SLI mode |
| 04:11.07 | trepan | w.r.t. that particular map, i'd think it would help |
| 04:11.30 | trepan | it's all display list calls, so little data gets moved around |
| 04:11.48 | JeffM2501 | now with SLI off, I get like 6 displays tho, and it all shows as one divice :) |
| 04:13.25 | JeffM2501 | oh, and my frame rates from yesterday was from debug code |
| 04:13.33 | JeffM2501 | release would be faster |
| 04:13.45 | trepan | about 2X faster? ;) |
| 04:14.01 | JeffM2501 | I only notice about 20% more in release |
| 04:14.03 | JeffM2501 | in most apps |
| 04:19.43 | JeffM2501 | probably should make the map download sise into K too |
| 04:19.46 | JeffM2501 | to be consistent |
| 04:20.05 | JeffM2501 | and say "downloading" instead of "trying" |
| 04:20.26 | CIA-3 | BZFlag: 03trepan * 10bzflag/ (11 files in 5 dirs): |
| 04:20.26 | CIA-3 | BZFlag: - use the visual extents from the scene database |
| 04:20.26 | CIA-3 | BZFlag: - tally the effective drawInfo triangle counts |
| 04:20.26 | CIA-3 | BZFlag: - clean up some of the MeshSceneNode material code |
| 04:20.58 | trepan | twice bitten, thrice shy (getVisualExtents()) |
| 04:21.57 | JeffM2501 | I'm able to hold like 131 frames near things now |
| 04:22.18 | JeffM2501 | and adding the PFD, and taking out the finish helps a lot |
| 04:22.27 | JeffM2501 | don't get the stutter in SLI mode |
| 04:22.33 | JeffM2501 | checking dual GPU usage now |
| 04:23.10 | trepan | pfd? |
| 04:23.19 | JeffM2501 | Pixel Format Descriptor |
| 04:23.55 | JeffM2501 | now turnin on "the stuff" |
| 04:24.12 | trepan | got that from google, but thought it was a coding struct in windows |
| 04:24.23 | JeffM2501 | it is |
| 04:24.41 | JeffM2501 | the pdf you sent said to ask for PFD_SWAP_EXCHANGE to help with SLI |
| 04:24.59 | JeffM2501 | bout 90 fps |
| 04:25.08 | JeffM2501 | @1280 |
| 04:25.23 | JeffM2501 | with AA, AF, and Trilinar mips :) |
| 04:25.30 | JeffM2501 | in dual GPU mode |
| 04:25.40 | trepan | approx. 70 vs. 131 close-up as compared with yesterday? |
| 04:26.01 | JeffM2501 | gonna turn of AA and AF and stuff now |
| 04:27.23 | JeffM2501 | not much diff from single GPU |
| 04:27.46 | JeffM2501 | fluctuates less |
| 04:27.52 | JeffM2501 | but dosnt' realy spike anymore |
| 04:28.57 | JeffM2501 | lowest it goes to is 60 when in a corner looking at the entire field |
| 04:29.38 | trepan | and close to the corner object? |
| 04:30.12 | trepan | the highest lod is 128Ktri, jumps from 32K |
| 04:30.29 | JeffM2501 | same fps in single GPU mode in the corner |
| 04:30.53 | JeffM2501 | think it's ok to take out the finishes? |
| 04:31.07 | JeffM2501 | or like not do them in "experiemental" ? |
| 04:31.35 | trepan | they're only in DEBUG_RENDERER anyways |
| 04:31.40 | JeffM2501 | true |
| 04:31.44 | trepan | at that time test bit |
| 04:31.52 | JeffM2501 | I'll comit the pfd change then |
| 04:31.59 | JeffM2501 | that helps with the "jumping" I was having |
| 04:32.19 | trepan | would it affect non-SLI winnies? |
| 04:32.30 | JeffM2501 | naw |
| 04:32.40 | JeffM2501 | since we don't ever read from the backbuffer we are cool |
| 04:32.58 | JeffM2501 | basicly it just tells GL that it can sawp, not copy |
| 04:33.09 | JeffM2501 | on the flip |
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| 04:33.46 | JeffM2501 | gonna update, build release and try it with full blown quality settings :) |
| 04:33.53 | JeffM2501 | see how far it goes down too |
| 04:34.38 | trepan | except for the most excellent 'zoom' feature (glCopyPixels) |
| 04:34.51 | JeffM2501 | yeah |
| 04:34.56 | JeffM2501 | hmm |
| 04:35.05 | JeffM2501 | let me try that |
| 04:35.17 | JeffM2501 | the copy is the worst thing we can do |
| 04:35.59 | trepan | ah, that shouldn't affect it either |
| 04:36.08 | JeffM2501 | yeah since it's for THIS frame |
| 04:36.11 | JeffM2501 | not last frame |
| 04:36.14 | JeffM2501 | it will cause a stall |
| 04:52.28 | CIA-3 | BZFlag: 03jeffm2501 * 10bzflag/src/platform/WinVisual.cxx: PFD Mode that may help SLI |
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| 06:02.18 | trepan | ack, i broke da BSP, with no simple remedy |
| 06:02.38 | Aribeth | BSP??? |
| 06:03.09 | trepan | used when depth buffer isn't |
| 06:03.15 | Aribeth | ahh |
| 06:03.30 | JeffM2501 | I say force em to software z buffer |
| 06:04.21 | trepan | i can do a workaround (allowing static nodes in without planes) |
| 06:04.47 | trepan | (not that I disagree with you, but others may) |
| 06:05.03 | JeffM2501 | even the software people are faster with soft Z |
| 06:05.22 | trepan | not sure that that's true |
| 06:06.06 | JeffM2501 | it may not be but it's not like I care THAT much about those few peeople |
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| 07:07.53 | LePoulpe303 | Hia ll! |
| 07:45.43 | CIA-3 | BZFlag: 03trepan * 10bzflag/ (include/BSPSceneDatabase.h src/scene/BSPSceneDatabase.cxx): delayed BSP insertion for static nodes without planes |
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| 08:34.31 | CIA-3 | BZFlag: 03trepan * 10bzflag/ (9 files in 5 dirs): cleanup for delayed BSP insertion |
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| 09:20.14 | meacan | bzbb admins: mlm/spam: http://my.bzflag.org/bb/viewtopic.php?p=53031 |
| 09:23.12 | SportChick | sheesh |
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| 13:01.36 | den | hmmm |
| 13:14.00 | LePoulpe303 | are Sourceforge user operations slow for everybody or just for me ? |
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| 13:50.19 | Grumbler | cd ulp |
| 13:50.24 | Grumbler | grrr |
| 13:51.07 | jpa- | Grumbler: Input current UNIX password: |
| 13:51.56 | Grumbler | whats even worse, it was still the wrong directory |
| 13:58.54 | Pimpinella | grumble, grumble.. |
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| 14:34.43 | CBG | Is this allowed? http://my.bzflag.org/bb/viewtopic.php?t=5364 |
| 14:37.22 | Grumbler | yeah, that should get ripped |
| 14:37.31 | Grumbler | out |
| 14:38.21 | CBG | :) |
| 14:38.38 | CBG | Aren't I just the perfect forum member? ;) |
| 14:38.45 | jpa- | and the ipods should be given to jpa- |
| 14:38.56 | CBG | I need one!... |
| 14:39.02 | CBG | preferably a nano. ;) |
| 14:39.22 | Grumbler | ...after they fix the screen |
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| 14:40.42 | Mr_Molez | he even shows his pic.. what a weirdo :P |
| 14:41.08 | Grumbler | you assume that is really his pic |
| 14:41.13 | bryjen | we were getting asian pr0n spam when the reg issues forum was open to guest posting... this is the second I've seen were someone created an account to spam :/ |
| 14:41.30 | Mr_Molez | judging by the way he wrote. It looks gormless enough to be him |
| 14:41.33 | Grumbler | ...the bots are getting smarter |
| 14:42.02 | Mr_Molez | lol |
| 14:42.18 | CBG | Grumbler: screen? :( |
| 14:42.42 | Grumbler | CBG, the ipod nano screens are apparently realllllllllly scratch prone |
| 14:42.56 | Mr_Molez | oo what about the 1's that message back when they get a message. A continuous loop of spam between the 2 bots :O |
| 14:43.14 | CBG | Grumbler: hmm... http://arstechnica.com/reviews/hardware/nano.ars/3 |
| 14:44.39 | Grumbler | http://www.vnunet.com/vnunet/news/2142775/apple-users-less-impressed-nano |
| 14:45.09 | ibunnysCBG | well, thanks. :/ |
| 14:46.14 | Grumbler | dont worry, they make some invis-shields for it that can prevent the scratching and its disposable so that if it gets scratched, you can throw it away and get another shield |
| 14:46.31 | bryjen | http://www.theregister.co.uk/2005/09/23/ipod_nano_scratching/ |
| 14:48.25 | ibunnysCBG | Grumbler: these 'shields' will be easy to get hold of, and cheap? |
| 14:48.44 | Grumbler | honestly, i dont know, i have never looked for them... |
| 14:49.22 | ibunnysCBG | ok. thanks bryjen too. |
| 14:49.30 | ibunnysCBG | thanks both for shattering my dreams. ;) |
| 14:49.44 | Grumbler | http://www.rainydaymagazine.com/RDM2005/GearNGadgets/September2005/RDMGG_InvisibleShieldFirstLook.ht |
| 14:49.53 | Grumbler | ...add an m to the end of that |
| 14:50.53 | Grumbler | fyi, i was using digg.com to find those |
| 14:53.07 | Pimpinella | byr |
| 15:06.38 | ibunnysCBG | ~CBG |
| 15:06.40 | ibot | methinks cbg is an ass, a prat and a retard, or stupid, or a failure, or lives in a dumpster |
| 15:06.49 | ibunnysCBG | :) |
| 15:08.19 | CBG | :( |
| 15:09.34 | BenUrban | lol |
| 15:09.36 | jpa- | thx, you ruined it :( |
| 15:09.46 | BenUrban | you're welcome |
| 15:09.48 | ibunnysCBG | bah. I was bout to ghost you.. |
| 15:09.54 | ibunnysCBG | I was typing it in... |
| 15:09.57 | BenUrban | lmao |
| 15:10.02 | BenUrban | slow typist |
| 15:10.11 | ibunnysCBG | heh, I only just started. |
| 15:10.16 | ibunnysCBG | I stopped when he said my name here. |
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| 16:53.55 | snick | info snick |
| 16:54.08 | SportyGal | !weather 90277 |
| 16:54.11 | TheLastSpartan | SportyGal: The current temperature in Redondo Beach, California (90277) is 68°F. |
| 16:54.48 | gsnedders | anybody know where i can get a manual for a lex bn780 pro motherboard? |
| 16:56.35 | JeffM2501 | probably from the manufactureer |
| 16:57.19 | brlcad | JeffM2501: I banned him last night |
| 16:57.34 | JeffM2501 | brlcad, you baned I_died? |
| 16:57.48 | brlcad | yes |
| 16:57.55 | JeffM2501 | what did he do? |
| 16:57.58 | brlcad | was being quite a potty mouth for some reason |
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| 16:58.10 | brlcad | was warned, he continued |
| 16:58.16 | JeffM2501 | fair enough |
| 16:58.30 | _Manu_ | brlcad, he always continues :) |
| 16:58.33 | JeffM2501 | for some reason he's now making me out to be the bad guy in his forum problems |
| 16:58.52 | JeffM2501 | when all I ever did to him was tell him what's going on, never blame him for others actions |
| 16:59.23 | TimRiker | JeffM2501: you're always the bad guy. ;-) |
| 16:59.24 | JeffM2501 | they can all thank phalanx for the latest thing |
| 16:59.27 | JeffM2501 | I know |
| 16:59.30 | JeffM2501 | sometimes it sucks |
| 17:00.15 | JeffM2501 | they are looking at other forum hosting solutions... it's probably for the best |
| 17:01.04 | TimRiker | I used to DJ dances. I learned that there are always people complaining. the goal is not to avoid it, it's to get an even mix of complaints from each end. in the DJ case, that's things like "too loud" balanced with "too soft". |
| 17:01.06 | JeffM2501 | I don't care how funny it is to some, but hitler-jesus isn't gonna cut it on the boards. |
| 17:01.22 | JeffM2501 | heh |
| 17:01.26 | JeffM2501 | I should keep a score sheet |
| 17:01.32 | TimRiker | =) |
| 17:02.19 | JeffM2501 | tim, I'd like to run an idea by you for 2.2.0 to see what you think, got a sec? |
| 17:02.58 | brlcad | TimRiker: better than most then.. usually it's "this music sucks" balanced with "this much REALLY sucks" ;) |
| 17:03.24 | JeffM2501 | or smurf techno |
| 17:03.29 | JeffM2501 | that can cause blood from the nose |
| 17:06.04 | JeffM2501 | dang noone is doing a Serenity midnight showing around here. |
| 17:06.57 | *** join/#bzflag bz8524 (n=502aba08@webchat.bzflag.bz) |
| 17:07.02 | *** join/#bzflag Birdie (n=Birdie__@d54C34DE9.access.telenet.be) |
| 17:07.17 | bz8524 | hi |
| 17:07.24 | JeffM2501 | hello |
| 17:07.28 | bz8524 | any developers kicking around? |
| 17:08.12 | JeffM2501 | you could say so |
| 17:08.24 | JeffM2501 | ow |
| 17:08.56 | JeffM2501 | what is up bz8524? |
| 17:10.07 | JeffM2501 | or not |
| 17:10.47 | brlcad | maybe that was what he feared :) |
| 17:11.09 | JeffM2501 | posible |
| 17:16.55 | JeffM2501 | so I am thinking about a system where we provide a preset group of tank "parts" |
| 17:17.01 | JeffM2501 | and let users build there own tanks just for looks |
| 17:17.09 | JeffM2501 | treads, body, barrel, turrent, etc.. |
| 17:17.14 | JeffM2501 | and various accesories |
| 17:17.20 | JeffM2501 | give them some controll over the color of some bits, but we control the color of the main parts so teams still work |
| 17:17.28 | JeffM2501 | and when you get any of the 'mind affecting' flags, everyone reverts to the base model |
| 17:17.34 | JeffM2501 | tho don' how masqerade will work |
| 17:17.39 | JeffM2501 | that flag may make us unable to ever do difrent models |
| 17:17.48 | TimRiker | it'd be nice just to start with admin approved tank designs that players can select from. |
| 17:18.05 | JeffM2501 | have to solve the masq problem for that as well |
| 17:18.17 | TimRiker | why not just look like the masq tank? |
| 17:18.35 | JeffM2501 | simplest would be models that are just in the base distro and not even downloaded, that woudl be the start |
| 17:18.55 | JeffM2501 | masq means that you look like the team that is looking at you right? |
| 17:19.09 | TimRiker | I mean one of the tanks on the masq team. |
| 17:19.37 | JeffM2501 | if everyone on the team is using a difrent tank, then they know that somone with a dupe tank 'does not belong" |
| 17:20.19 | JeffM2501 | like if you make the tank model look like the tank that the viewer is in, and they know noone else has that tank.. kapow :) |
| 17:20.20 | TimRiker | each client would pick a model for a masq tank from the set of teammates. |
| 17:20.38 | TimRiker | only pick the same model as the viewer if there are no other teamates. |
| 17:20.56 | JeffM2501 | hmmm |
| 17:21.07 | JeffM2501 | then if you see a dupe, you know something is up, but you don't know who the real one is |
| 17:21.10 | JeffM2501 | changes the flag somewhat |
| 17:21.27 | JeffM2501 | have to do the same for CB |
| 17:21.33 | TimRiker | chances are you won't often see the dupes togther, so there's not much change. |
| 17:21.37 | JeffM2501 | those flags screw with most of my ideas |
| 17:21.53 | TimRiker | =) |
| 17:22.04 | TimRiker | re CB: nod. |
| 17:22.07 | JeffM2501 | tho the work dif in doing a part based system and a fixed model system is minimal |
| 17:22.14 | JeffM2501 | since bz uses "parts" anyway |
| 17:23.27 | JeffM2501 | then if I could get difrent tank chasis in there, and have difrent classes of tanks, with difrent abilitys :) |
| 17:23.56 | JeffM2501 | mini tanks, faster, can jump higher, but can't use all flags. |
| 17:24.04 | JeffM2501 | medium tanks ( what we have now ). |
| 17:24.17 | JeffM2501 | heavy tanks , slower can't jump, but come with shield :) |
| 17:24.51 | TimRiker | well, since there is no "damage" different sized tanks would be a bit strange. the smallest can still frag the largest with one shot. |
| 17:25.04 | JeffM2501 | that's easy to take care of ;) |
| 17:25.08 | TimRiker | =) |
| 17:25.21 | JeffM2501 | add dammage, make the base game have all shots do 100% damage :) |
| 17:25.21 | TimRiker | I still want a fatman style game. |
| 17:25.25 | JeffM2501 | I know you do |
| 17:25.30 | TimRiker | =) |
| 17:25.34 | JeffM2501 | sadly the scale system dosnt' support it |
| 17:33.15 | JeffM2501 | tho a default tank that looked like this could be fun :) |
| 17:33.16 | JeffM2501 | http://www.btinternet.com/~chunglist2/Images/Gallery-Personal/Tank-Views.jpg |
| 17:36.34 | JeffM2501 | well probably time to squeep out a RC5 |
| 17:43.07 | JeffM2501 | meacan, ping |
| 17:47.07 | meacan | JeffM2501: pong |
| 17:47.30 | JeffM2501 | you want to commit your api changes? |
| 17:47.38 | JeffM2501 | the ones you make a patch for |
| 17:47.42 | JeffM2501 | or do you want me to ? |
| 17:48.04 | JeffM2501 | I have to do an RC5 and I'd like them to be included |
| 17:48.36 | meacan | Im not sure they diff will work, but i can look at it in 30mins and see |
| 17:48.46 | JeffM2501 | ok |
| 17:48.50 | JeffM2501 | then I'm doing it by hand now anyway |
| 17:48.54 | JeffM2501 | so don't worry about it |
| 17:49.00 | JeffM2501 | since I don't have patch :) |
| 17:49.06 | JeffM2501 | you have commit access right? |
| 17:49.10 | meacan | yep |
| 17:49.19 | JeffM2501 | why didn't you just commit it in the first place? |
| 17:50.31 | meacan | 'cause the only reason i got commit right, was so i could edit the league webpages. So i didnt want to use the commit (Except for danish translation) without an explicit okay |
| 17:51.02 | JeffM2501 | oh, dude you've done enough now, for Api stuff, just commit away :) |
| 17:51.21 | JeffM2501 | we can allways revert it if it's bad :) |
| 17:51.26 | meacan | :) |
| 17:51.38 | JeffM2501 | I mean don't go breaking anything or changing mass gameplay stuff |
| 17:52.10 | JeffM2501 | if your unsure, just pop us a message or somethign here and ask if it's appropriate, but don't patch, it' just makes more work :) |
| 17:52.28 | JeffM2501 | your code is good |
| 17:52.32 | JeffM2501 | it has stronk kei |
| 17:54.19 | meacan | Well, using common sense never hurt anyone. I just belived it would be a administrative nightmare if all devs just began commiting small bits'n'pieces |
| 17:54.39 | JeffM2501 | umm |
| 17:54.41 | meacan | But Ill commit directly, if i make something useful :) |
| 17:54.42 | JeffM2501 | dude that's what we do |
| 17:54.53 | JeffM2501 | that's what made bzflag what it is today :) |
| 17:55.06 | JeffM2501 | do you have a patched commands.h and commands.cxx? |
| 17:55.18 | JeffM2501 | and what is this "administration" thing you speak of? |
| 17:57.09 | meacan | i mean, keeping track of what is getting done, what direction people are taking bzflag to. |
| 17:57.17 | JeffM2501 | yeah |
| 17:57.18 | JeffM2501 | what is that? |
| 17:57.36 | JeffM2501 | surely you don't think this project has something like that :) |
| 17:57.52 | JeffM2501 | we are somewhat self regulating |
| 17:58.27 | JeffM2501 | tho if we wanted stronger administration and delegation I'd be all for it |
| 17:58.31 | JeffM2501 | I think we need it greatly |
| 17:59.50 | meacan | hmm seems like my changed files is gone (had a diskcrash some time ago) |
| 17:59.57 | JeffM2501 | ok |
| 18:00.03 | meacan | so i only got what i submitted to sf |
| 18:00.04 | JeffM2501 | trying to figure out what you did in the commands |
| 18:00.20 | JeffM2501 | got the rest merged in |
| 18:00.55 | JeffM2501 | looks like you moved the class defs to the header |
| 18:01.00 | JeffM2501 | that make sense? |
| 18:01.40 | meacan | it sounds familiar |
| 18:04.55 | JeffM2501 | and it looks like you made it so you can call the commands with out player data right? |
| 18:05.06 | JeffM2501 | so the API is allways asumed to have the perms |
| 18:05.38 | meacan | yeah |
| 18:06.07 | JeffM2501 | makes sense |
| 18:06.34 | TimRiker | you mean someone knows what everyone else is doing? |
| 18:06.50 | JeffM2501 | that's what he was thinking :) |
| 18:07.01 | TimRiker | wow. that would be novel. |
| 18:07.06 | bryjen | only The Shadow knows! |
| 18:07.11 | TimRiker | =) |
| 18:07.12 | JeffM2501 | we try to keep track of it best we can |
| 18:07.18 | JeffM2501 | it could help a lot |
| 18:07.26 | JeffM2501 | if somone could do that for the project |
| 18:07.39 | TimRiker | seriously... I used to read all the cvs commit logs and keep track of what was happening. |
| 18:07.47 | JeffM2501 | I know you did |
| 18:07.54 | TimRiker | I've gotten way behind with the move and the new baby. |
| 18:08.29 | JeffM2501 | understandably so |
| 18:08.32 | TimRiker | I did get my debian unstable boxes up last night and test current code. the x86 works fine, the ppc has world decompression issues. |
| 18:08.33 | JeffM2501 | times change |
| 18:08.47 | JeffM2501 | there are people who would be more then willing do help you if you wish to delegate |
| 18:09.06 | JeffM2501 | take more of an advisor position, instead of an in the trenches thing |
| 18:09.50 | TimRiker | I need a to get a better feel for where we are at present. I'm getting there. |
| 18:09.52 | JeffM2501 | you could asign a person or people to be the day to day "goto" person, then all you have to do is work it out whent hem |
| 18:10.02 | TimRiker | the new effects are awesome. ;-) |
| 18:10.07 | JeffM2501 | thank you |
| 18:10.16 | JeffM2501 | I like the rico the best |
| 18:10.23 | TimRiker | =) |
| 18:10.39 | TimRiker | I don't see a rico effect on the outside walls. is that intentional? |
| 18:10.43 | JeffM2501 | brlcad or myself would be glad to help you in keeping up if you wish. |
| 18:11.05 | JeffM2501 | no, it should rico effect when ever it ricos |
| 18:11.18 | JeffM2501 | there were some issues with outside walls tho |
| 18:11.27 | TimRiker | hmm. might be my vid card or something. see if you see one. |
| 18:11.39 | JeffM2501 | shots were ending with IDL for a while wen they went out of the world |
| 18:11.41 | JeffM2501 | I 'll look into it |
| 18:11.43 | TimRiker | then spawn and jump effects are very cool too. ;-) |
| 18:11.51 | JeffM2501 | they can be a little distracting |
| 18:11.56 | JeffM2501 | but I like them as well |
| 18:12.04 | TimRiker | that's what menu options are for. ;-) |
| 18:12.08 | JeffM2501 | yuo |
| 18:12.13 | JeffM2501 | and we have a lot of them |
| 18:12.22 | TimRiker | anyone tried sw mesa lately? |
| 18:12.29 | JeffM2501 | not that I know of |
| 18:13.29 | TimRiker | I'll check that sometime if nobody else gets to it. |
| 18:13.29 | JeffM2501 | is it even that much of a priority anymore? |
| 18:13.29 | JeffM2501 | even DRI has some GL now |
| 18:13.29 | TimRiker | need to change the low end detect so that depth buffer and blending are left on. |
| 18:13.29 | JeffM2501 | can we remove the depth buffer flag now? |
| 18:13.32 | JeffM2501 | and jsut allways z buffer? |
| 18:13.39 | JeffM2501 | it would be a lot easyer to get rid of that bsp thing |
| 18:13.59 | JeffM2501 | software z buffer seems fast enough for even low end systems these days |
| 18:14.49 | TimRiker | well, I'm fine with removing depth buffer from the menu, but no till it stays set on new install with sw mesa. right now it still gets turned off sometimes. |
| 18:15.19 | JeffM2501 | we can pull the entire set for it, and allways just init the z buffer |
| 18:15.23 | TimRiker | I'd rather leave it in the config, cause there are still some broken drivers that need it off. =( |
| 18:15.24 | JeffM2501 | not just the menu part |
| 18:15.40 | JeffM2501 | I don't belive there are viable systems with busted z buffer anymore |
| 18:15.43 | JeffM2501 | what systems do you know of? |
| 18:16.03 | TimRiker | seems to me I saw some ati boards a year or so ago. |
| 18:16.24 | JeffM2501 | I've run on the lowest end ATI I could find ( rage 128 ) and you HAVE to se the z buffer |
| 18:16.38 | JeffM2501 | and that is a 8 year old chipset |
| 18:16.42 | TimRiker | the udp setting can probably die now. I don't know anyone that sets it off on purpose anymore. |
| 18:17.36 | JeffM2501 | I'll make depth buffer stay on, and only go off if it's loaded int he config, and have DTR pull the menu items |
| 18:17.42 | JeffM2501 | he's the menu master |
| 18:18.05 | TimRiker | sounds like a plan. opinions on udp? |
| 18:18.17 | CIA-3 | BZFlag: 03jeffm2501 * 10bzflag/src/ (bzflag/WorldBuilder.cxx geometry/OccluderSceneNode.cxx): warnings |
| 18:18.19 | JeffM2501 | is TCP only a viable way to play? |
| 18:18.40 | TimRiker | depends on what you mean by viable. |
| 18:19.01 | JeffM2501 | playable |
| 18:19.14 | TimRiker | but the point is that afaik, it gets detected correctly now in all cases, so having a menu item should not be required. |
| 18:19.21 | JeffM2501 | ok |
| 18:19.26 | JeffM2501 | then I'll have him pull it |
| 18:19.29 | CIA-3 | BZFlag: 03jeffm2501 * 10bzflag/ (5 files in 3 dirs): add in bz_shutdown, bz_superkill, bz_gameOver to the API |
| 18:20.01 | TimRiker | so is there a 2.0.4 plan yet? I say you and trepan talking about it. |
| 18:20.11 | JeffM2501 | yes we have a definate plan |
| 18:20.15 | JeffM2501 | we were going to release sunday |
| 18:20.20 | TimRiker | still need to get a working debian package out. |
| 18:20.20 | JeffM2501 | but trepan checked in |
| 18:20.33 | JeffM2501 | I'm making these changes then building an RC5 |
| 18:20.34 | TimRiker | darn that trepan. |
| 18:20.39 | JeffM2501 | it was a good change he made |
| 18:20.52 | TimRiker | making cool changes we all want. what is he thinking? |
| 18:21.13 | TimRiker | =) |
| 18:21.20 | JeffM2501 | he can run a map with 8million triangles now at 70fps on a GF3 |
| 18:21.36 | bryjen | its been "test this weekend, release early next week" for a few weeks now ;) |
| 18:21.37 | JeffM2501 | I can get over 100 now on my system full AA, AF, and dual GPU |
| 18:21.42 | JeffM2501 | yeah |
| 18:21.48 | TimRiker | yeah. I saw it last night using gf4 |
| 18:21.48 | JeffM2501 | and sadly it's the same this week |
| 18:21.59 | JeffM2501 | I am geting it all set up |
| 18:22.01 | brlcad | his level of detail stuff will be sweet |
| 18:22.11 | Grumbler | dang, i just moved from rc2 to rc4 |
| 18:22.14 | JeffM2501 | I'd like the RC5 to sit for 2 days then rlease on wednedsay |
| 18:22.15 | brlcad | that should jack up those numbers 10x |
| 18:22.42 | JeffM2501 | I have one other bug to look at |
| 18:22.54 | JeffM2501 | I also need brlcad to bust out a OSX RC :) |
| 18:23.00 | JeffM2501 | to make sure that platform is working |
| 18:23.04 | JeffM2501 | since it is #3 now |
| 18:23.05 | TimRiker | anyone testing on mac? I'm worried about my non-working ppc linux box. |
| 18:23.17 | JeffM2501 | TimRiker, yes we test on the mac all the time |
| 18:23.20 | brlcad | i've tested |
| 18:23.21 | JeffM2501 | I got a mini just for that |
| 18:23.32 | JeffM2501 | we just need to verify the package system works |
| 18:23.44 | TimRiker | hmm. any ideas why linux-ppc would have decompression issues? |
| 18:23.57 | brlcad | I have new build files that will auto-generate the mac dmg's that I need to commit here soon |
| 18:24.10 | JeffM2501 | it thinks it's not PPC and is doing it's packing wrong :) |
| 18:24.16 | JeffM2501 | brlcad, cool |
| 18:24.27 | JeffM2501 | I'd like to be able to post mac DMGs with the betas |
| 18:24.40 | JeffM2501 | TimRiker, how old is the code |
| 18:25.13 | TimRiker | cvs up'd last night. |
| 18:25.17 | JeffM2501 | wierd |
| 18:25.25 | JeffM2501 | well it works fine on OSX |
| 18:25.28 | brlcad | I'm not a big fan of making "beta/alpha/release candidate" releases if you noticed ;) |
| 18:25.35 | JeffM2501 | brlcad, I know |
| 18:25.38 | brlcad | but I can help making them easier :) |
| 18:25.52 | JeffM2501 | but they help with testing ( since we don't have a testing plan ) |
| 18:26.07 | JeffM2501 | I'm willing to do the builds |
| 18:26.46 | JeffM2501 | I should even build debians and post them too |
| 18:26.52 | TimRiker | would be nice to get some auto-builds going again. I could setup an x86 debian cvs apt repository easily enough. |
| 18:26.56 | brlcad | i'm more inclined to just make them real releases and just release that much more frequently, incrementing the patch number just as frequent |
| 18:27.08 | brlcad | e.g. release at least once a month, if not every other week |
| 18:27.08 | JeffM2501 | that is another way |
| 18:27.15 | brlcad | automate the process even |
| 18:27.31 | JeffM2501 | with our compatability issues on majors I don't know if that would work |
| 18:27.33 | JeffM2501 | it's a game |
| 18:27.36 | brlcad | if it builds and passes smokescreen tests, it could pack em up |
| 18:27.38 | JeffM2501 | not like a word proce4ssor |
| 18:27.56 | TimRiker | Image not found or unloadable: mountain4 |
| 18:28.23 | bryjen | brlcad: numbering them evenly as "stable" releases or alot of odd numbered development releases |
| 18:28.26 | bryjen | ? |
| 18:29.11 | TimRiker | running GLX remotely is very slow. ;-) |
| 18:29.31 | bryjen | remote direct rendering is an oxymoron, TimRiker |
| 18:29.39 | TimRiker | =) |
| 18:30.01 | TimRiker | I'm running my ppc binary from home to get the error message. |
| 18:30.12 | TimRiker | or rather, waiting to run it. |
| 18:30.20 | TimRiker | I just got the motd. |
| 18:31.32 | Silent_Swan | oh my god i hate my job |
| 18:31.50 | Silent_Swan | someone please just kill me and get it overwith |
| 18:32.00 | TimRiker | ibot: kill Silent_Swan |
| 18:32.02 | ibot | ACTION shoots a ionized neutron gun at Silent_Swan |
| 18:32.19 | TimRiker | ibot: bzfrag Silent_Swan |
| 18:32.20 | ibot | ACTION skewers Silent_Swan with a super bullet |
| 18:32.23 | Silent_Swan | thanks, but i'm still here |
| 18:32.32 | bryjen | he can fix that too... |
| 18:32.36 | Silent_Swan | :) |
| 18:33.46 | brlcad | bryjen: all 'releases' are stable, so a lot more even number increments |
| 18:34.23 | brlcad | for protocol breakers, you'd end up with a lot of patch number increments that can be whatever since the minor would be odd |
| 18:35.24 | brlcad | you need that to be able to respond to bugs and issues more quickly.. they will always be there no matter how much it's tested |
| 18:35.51 | brlcad | if you start from a relatively tested base, and keep releasing frequently, you don't end up with the huge disconnect you eventually get wheen you haven't released in months |
| 18:36.49 | Grumbler | huge disconnect => bad != true |
| 18:37.42 | JeffM2501 | brlcad, it makes sense, but as bryjen has shown it's not easy to explain to the common person :) |
| 18:37.54 | JeffM2501 | I'd rather go to a feature roadmap |
| 18:38.00 | bryjen | ;P JeffM2501 |
| 18:38.04 | brlcad | to the common person, we're just releasing very frequently |
| 18:38.53 | TimRiker | more binary releases available for wider testing == a Good Thing |
| 18:39.04 | TimRiker | regaurdless of the numbering scheme. |
| 18:39.13 | TimRiker | and spelling. |
| 18:39.48 | brlcad | which is the point, I believe, that I'm trying to make too :) |
| 18:40.09 | TimRiker | we are in violent agreement. |
| 18:40.55 | bryjen | eh. maybe smaller incremental updates would go over OK. just worried by the slow migration observed at the previous protocol-breakers. |
| 18:42.02 | brlcad | bryjen: protocol management does become the big kicker in frequent releases, you end up having two release lines |
| 18:43.03 | brlcad | which isn't necessarily a problem, it's just more work -- hence the need for some automated (even if only partially assisted) building/tagging/releasing |
| 18:44.46 | bryjen | are there any numbers showing the client versions people are running? be interesting to know it they're more comfortable keeping up-to-date in the labeled "stable" series |
| 18:46.43 | *** join/#bzflag CBG (n=CBG@cpc2-stme1-5-1-cust130.cdif.cable.ntl.com) |
| 18:48.01 | Grumbler | from my SP CLIENTQUERYS, average people are using the 2.0.2 client.....very few run the beta builds, and few are still in the 2.0.0 client |
| 18:48.37 | *** join/#bzflag bz8899 (n=502aba08@webchat.bzflag.bz) |
| 18:49.15 | bryjen | did the client get fixed to set the user agent on its connections like bzfs does? |
| 18:49.24 | DTRemenak | hm, I dunno |
| 18:49.26 | bz8899 | hello |
| 18:49.37 | CBG | hi bz8899 |
| 18:49.46 | bz8899 | could i ask you a question plz dtremenak? |
| 18:49.52 | DTRemenak | sure |
| 18:50.15 | DTRemenak | no guarantee I can answer it though |
| 18:50.18 | bz8899 | is bzflag 2.0.2 known to compile properly with g 4.0.1? |
| 18:50.22 | bz8899 | g |
| 18:50.27 | bz8899 | hmm... no plus signs |
| 18:50.28 | DTRemenak | no, it does not |
| 18:50.34 | bz8899 | ic |
| 18:50.36 | DTRemenak | cvs does |
| 18:51.00 | DTRemenak | 2.0.4 will be released "soon", or such is the plan |
| 18:51.22 | bz8899 | i had problems and had to use the -fpermissive flag |
| 18:51.25 | CBG | hah. last week it was "this weekend hopefully". |
| 18:51.30 | CBG | now "soon"/ |
| 18:51.31 | bz8899 | but didn't feel very happen about it |
| 18:51.38 | bz8899 | *happy |
| 18:51.39 | CBG | next week "this year sometime" :) |
| 18:52.07 | bz8899 | without the flag i got a huge number of warnings about templates |
| 18:52.27 | bz8899 | and the resulting code was 10x bigger than before will all sorts of stuff being compiled inline |
| 18:53.01 | bz8899 | also: the dreaded -<big number> jitter problem has surfaced |
| 18:53.11 | bz8899 | do you know what causes that? |
| 18:53.26 | DTRemenak | compiling 2.0.2 with gcc 4 will cause that ;) |
| 18:53.30 | bz8899 | some sort of typing issue? |
| 18:53.47 | Chestal | bz8899: most of the stuff will be gone after stripping. Adding -fvisibility-inlines-hidden makes it even smaller |
| 18:54.06 | bz8899 | stripping? |
| 18:54.18 | bz8899 | plz, can i leave my clothes on? :) |
| 18:54.27 | CBG | awww... |
| 18:54.38 | CBG | Chestal almost had you then. ;) |
| 18:55.02 | SportyGal | it depends on the server and timing, but I've seen as much as 1/3 of the folks running the beta builds. |
| 18:55.19 | bz8899 | bzflag does seem to work when compiled with g plus plus 4.0.1 and CXXFLAGS=-fpermissive |
| 18:55.46 | Chestal | bz8899: 2.02 code can still have the jitter issue or other strange effects |
| 18:55.56 | bz8899 | ic |
| 18:56.15 | CIA-3 | BZFlag: 03dtremenak * 10bzflag/src/bzflag/DisplayMenu.cxx: |
| 18:56.15 | CIA-3 | BZFlag: Kill the depth buffer menu item |
| 18:56.15 | CIA-3 | BZFlag: <JeffM2501> "I'll make depth buffer stay on, and only go off if it's loaded in the config, and have DTR pull the menu items" |
| 18:56.27 | JeffM2501 | heh |
| 18:56.30 | DTRemenak | heh |
| 18:56.44 | JeffM2501 | did you do the udp one too? |
| 18:57.48 | bz8899 | is there a 2.0.3 out there? |
| 18:57.53 | CIA-3 | BZFlag: 03dtremenak * 10bzflag/src/bzflag/OptionsMenu.cxx: |
| 18:57.53 | CIA-3 | BZFlag: Kill the udp menu item |
| 18:57.53 | CIA-3 | BZFlag: <TimRiker> "the udp setting can probably die now. I don't know anyone that sets it off on purpose anymore." |
| 18:58.03 | JeffM2501 | bz8899, there is a 2.0.4rc4 out there right now |
| 18:58.09 | JeffM2501 | danke DTRemenak |
| 18:58.14 | JeffM2501 | you continue to be the man |
| 18:58.20 | bz8899 | i've tried it but it has some horrible features |
| 18:58.28 | JeffM2501 | like? |
| 18:58.32 | DTRemenak | then you should complain! :) |
| 18:58.48 | JeffM2501 | 2.0.3 is 2.0.4 before we named it 2.0.4 :) |
| 18:58.53 | bz8899 | e.g., the ghastly tank cursor on the main menu :) |
| 18:59.02 | JeffM2501 | that's a feature? |
| 18:59.06 | bz8899 | aesthetically unpleasant |
| 18:59.12 | JeffM2501 | replace the image with the one from 2.0.2 |
| 18:59.17 | bz8899 | also loads of effects that i can't use anywa\y |
| 18:59.22 | JeffM2501 | turn them off |
| 18:59.28 | JeffM2501 | there is a menu for it |
| 18:59.29 | bz8899 | and... ME limiter |
| 18:59.30 | CBG | Heh, my current icon is the caution.png :) |
| 18:59.40 | JeffM2501 | suck it up buttecup |
| 18:59.56 | JeffM2501 | stay with 2.0.2 then |
| 19:00.20 | ibunnyCBG | or change the icon??? :| |
| 19:00.32 | bz8899 | i'll use my buggy 2.0.2 version until the ME straightjacket is imposed from above |
| 19:00.33 | JeffM2501 | what ever floats your boat |
| 19:01.04 | JeffM2501 | why in the name of all that his holey would we force a 16 bit depth buffer? |
| 19:01.14 | DTRemenak | JeffM2501: heh |
| 19:01.15 | bz8899 | Mouse Enhancement |
| 19:01.26 | ibunnyCBG | :/ |
| 19:01.36 | bz8899 | a load of noobs have complained that other people are better than them and want to handicap them |
| 19:01.54 | ibunnyCBG | errr.... so? |
| 19:01.59 | Chestal | I know what you mean by ME, but I have no idea what 2.0.3. feature you are talking about |
| 19:02.02 | ibunnyCBG | how does that stop you using the latest release? |
| 19:02.05 | JeffM2501 | anyone have any problemw tih 32bit depth on "high" qaulity or better? |
| 19:02.07 | bz8899 | so... everyone has to be brought down to their level |
| 19:02.27 | ibunnyCBG | SportyGal: I don;t think so. I'm waiting too. :) |
| 19:02.37 | bz8899 | the new release (it is rumoured) has inertia added to the tanks |
| 19:02.45 | Chestal | JeffM2501: would have to try it out to see whether it's a problem :-) |
| 19:02.50 | bz8899 | e.g., no infinite accel anymore |
| 19:02.55 | DTRemenak | bz8899: ME clamping was introduced because it causes the server network problems, not because of player complaints. It was later pulled because no satisfactory backward-compatible solution could be found. |
| 19:02.58 | Chestal | bz8899: the rumours are wrong, or at least inaccurate |
| 19:02.58 | SportyGal | unfortunately, much of what I'm waiting for requires a protocol break |
| 19:03.00 | JeffM2501 | Chestal, what setting do you play on? |
| 19:03.05 | JeffM2501 | high? |
| 19:03.07 | ibunnyCBG | bz8899: who are you, where did you hear this? :) |
| 19:03.09 | Chestal | experimental I think |
| 19:03.11 | JeffM2501 | I can have it go on at experimental |
| 19:03.17 | bryjen | I seriously doubt any of the devs that play are trying to rig the game by taking away non-devs Mouse Enhancement |
| 19:03.20 | JeffM2501 | you have hardware GL right? |
| 19:03.32 | Chestal | yep, Linux, ATI |
| 19:03.39 | JeffM2501 | then you WANT 32 bit |
| 19:04.01 | Chestal | bz8899: current bzflag client code has no new accel limiting at all |
| 19:04.02 | JeffM2501 | modern cards want 32 bit depth |
| 19:04.05 | JeffM2501 | matches the frame |
| 19:04.11 | JeffM2501 | and fits there packing |
| 19:04.27 | SportyGal | jeffm2501, timriker, brlcad: any idea when the next break in protocol will be released? Several more at this level first or will it be in a near-future (after 2.0.4) release? |
| 19:04.33 | bz8899 | there has been such a big fuss about ME and some admins have claimed it is about to be eliminated |
| 19:05.03 | JeffM2501 | SportyGal, as allways there is little plan |
| 19:05.06 | bz8899 | but if it isn't, that's fine with me. i just saw a note in the cvs repository though |
| 19:05.09 | JeffM2501 | did you need a break? |
| 19:05.09 | DTRemenak | SportyGal: sooner is more likely than later |
| 19:05.22 | Chestal | bz8899: there always has been a server option to have some inertia, with the default having none. The new server code suggests to specify the values explicitly and suggests a tiny amount of inertia |
| 19:05.22 | JeffM2501 | I don't expect there to be a 2.0.6 |
| 19:05.26 | DTRemenak | bz8899: you should have seen the reversion note also |
| 19:05.33 | ibunnyCBG | :O |
| 19:05.40 | Chestal | bz8899: several servers have been running with these values for some time already |
| 19:05.46 | SportyGal | JeffM2501: unfortunately, many of the features/fixes I am awaiting seem to require protocol break |
| 19:05.59 | JeffM2501 | yeah |
| 19:06.02 | SportyGal | I'd have to go back to figure out what they all work, but iirc, there were 3 or 4 in that category |
| 19:06.03 | bz8899 | is there a way a player can know what values are in force? |
| 19:06.10 | JeffM2501 | 2.1.x will be started after 2.0.4 |
| 19:06.17 | bz8899 | i presume yo mean the -a options |
| 19:06.20 | JeffM2501 | that will be proto breaking |
| 19:06.24 | SportyGal | JeffM2501: okay, thanks for that |
| 19:06.28 | DTRemenak | bz8899: not directly. if you save the map it will put -a in the options block, I think. |
| 19:06.37 | JeffM2501 | noone realy has plans for a 2.0.6 unless something BIG is busted |
| 19:06.39 | SportyGal | I'll keep a close watch after 2.0.4 to see when I need to start chiming in |
| 19:06.51 | JeffM2501 | what features are you looking for? |
| 19:07.04 | SportyGal | one was the multi-hunt to return |
| 19:07.12 | SportyGal | it was fixed as a bug, but we liked it as a feature |
| 19:07.14 | bz8899 | thanks a lot for you info. good to hear from people who actually appear to know what they're talking about |
| 19:07.26 | SportyGal | there were several others - I'll have to look through my notes when I get home |
| 19:07.38 | brlcad | hmm.. some folks in dtr's alma will be here this week |
| 19:07.46 | JeffM2501 | if it was a bug, why would it need a proto break? |
| 19:07.51 | SportyGal | dunno |
| 19:07.53 | JeffM2501 | has it allways been in 2.0.x ? |
| 19:07.56 | SportyGal | that's just what I was told |
| 19:08.01 | JeffM2501 | by whom? |
| 19:08.04 | SportyGal | it was fixed in the betas |
| 19:08.14 | SportyGal | think it was scanline or purplecow |
| 19:08.15 | Chestal | the hunting thign is debatable |
| 19:08.18 | DTRemenak | multi-hunt is not proto specific |
| 19:08.21 | SportyGal | but nt sure |
| 19:08.22 | JeffM2501 | so it was in 2.0.0 and 2.0.2 ? |
| 19:08.24 | SportyGal | yes |
| 19:08.37 | JeffM2501 | make it a bloddy feature and call it a day |
| 19:08.39 | SportyGal | it was just tricky to get it to work but it worked great |
| 19:08.57 | Grumbler | SportyGal, you always play as rogue....you should be hunting everybody :) |
| 19:08.57 | SportyGal | (once you knew how) |
| 19:09.08 | ibunnyCBG | JeffM2501: someone told me that if it was to become a feature it would have to be coded properly because it was just a bug before....... |
| 19:09.12 | SportyGal | Grumbler: I always hunt YOU, but now i have to pick which ONE admin I hunt - no fun! |
| 19:09.32 | DTRemenak | SportyGal: the whole scoreboard was recoded. before there was a bug, now there is not. if it is going to be added it will have to be done deliberately this time :) |
| 19:10.22 | DTRemenak | SportyGal: problem is that "deliberate change" implies "effort" :P |
| 19:10.29 | ibunnyCBG | See? It must have been DTRemenak who told me :) |
| 19:10.44 | JeffM2501 | anyone willing to add it as a feature for her? |
| 19:10.49 | JeffM2501 | like NOW? |
| 19:10.59 | SportyGal | awww, thanks Jeff |
| 19:11.10 | ibunnyCBG | I would if I could. :) |
| 19:11.19 | DTRemenak | hm...math homework, multihunt. math homework, multihunt. math homework, multihunt.... |
| 19:11.23 | JeffM2501 | cus we are like at the "forever hold your peace" time |
| 19:11.32 | ibunnyCBG | DTRemenak: is it any contest? |
| 19:11.46 | DTRemenak | ibunnyCBG: math homework is more fun :) |
| 19:11.47 | ibunnyCBG | SportyGal: gmail filters? lol |
| 19:11.49 | SportyGal | someone give me the link to ibots logs? |
| 19:11.58 | ibunnyCBG | DTRemenak: naww. you know that ain't so. |
| 19:11.59 | Birdie | ~logs |
| 19:12.01 | ibot | logs is probably http://ibot.rikers.org/%23bzflag/, or stats http://ibot.rikers.org/stats/bzflag.html.gz |
| 19:12.05 | SportyGal | ibunnyCBG: yeah, you know - if it's from JeffM, code it bzflag |
| 19:12.19 | Birdie | sportygal wants to check some persons?:) |
| 19:12.31 | ibunnyCBG | but you "code" such things? |
| 19:12.47 | SportyGal | Birdie: no, actually, I wanted the irc logs to see what else I am forgetting. I know there was more |
| 19:13.01 | SportyGal | ibunnyCBG: no, it was a joke, explaining my severe lack of coding ability |
| 19:13.04 | Birdie | i have the forgetting desease to:( |
| 19:13.27 | ibunnyCBG | SportyGal: gotcha. ;) Can you do IF statements in Excel? That counts as coding. ;) |
| 19:13.49 | SportyGal | ibunnyCBG: hehe, not sure if I've tried that - at least not recently. |
| 19:16.51 | brlcad | i think some would consider that anti-coding |
| 19:17.30 | SportyGal | brlcad: hehe |
| 19:18.50 | JeffM2501 | bloddy hell , sf is refusing connections again |
| 19:18.57 | SportyGal | brlcad: hehe, you guys are funny - that would be sssccccccccaaaaaaaaaarrrrrrrrrrrrrryyyyyyyyyyyy |
| 19:19.24 | JeffM2501 | I have the depth buffer changes done |
| 19:19.31 | brlcad | if hell were bloody, would it actually be any worse? |
| 19:19.42 | brlcad | deep thoughts, by jack handy |
| 19:19.44 | JeffM2501 | as well as adding a real depth buffer for high and better |
| 19:19.47 | SportyGal | bloody or bloddy? |
| 19:19.48 | ibunnyCBG | lol brlcad |
| 19:20.00 | JeffM2501 | it should help with distance z fighting |
| 19:20.16 | JeffM2501 | 16bit, what do they think this is, 1994? |
| 19:21.03 | JeffM2501 | it wasn't a feature before |
| 19:21.08 | JeffM2501 | so it wasn't realy broken |
| 19:21.15 | JeffM2501 | the scoreboard was just rewriten |
| 19:21.23 | menotume | someone decide how it *should* work :) |
| 19:21.25 | JeffM2501 | and since it wasn't a known feature at that time, it wasn' added |
| 19:21.29 | JeffM2501 | exacly |
| 19:21.36 | JeffM2501 | make it a real feature |
| 19:21.37 | DTRemenak | I would offer to write it but I don't use it, so I don't know what the "best" interface for it would be. |
| 19:21.38 | JeffM2501 | define it |
| 19:21.38 | menotume | scoreboard was rewritten, and i didn't recreate the bug |
| 19:21.55 | JeffM2501 | SportyGal, how do you use it? |
| 19:22.02 | JeffM2501 | what would the best interface for it to be? |
| 19:22.06 | menotume | the only way i could figure, was by using another key |
| 19:22.17 | SportyGal | another key would be fine |
| 19:22.19 | JeffM2501 | like an 'add to hunt" key? |
| 19:22.21 | ToughShooter | the hunted tank (and the arrow in scorelist) wasn't reset when hitting u when scoreboard was hidden |
| 19:22.28 | JeffM2501 | probalbys hould do add and remove |
| 19:22.32 | menotume | yes, 'X' instead of 'U' |
| 19:22.34 | SportyGal | previously, you put someone on hunt, pressed s and then u twice |
| 19:22.38 | menotume | well, not 'X' |
| 19:22.41 | SportyGal | or was it s twice and then u |
| 19:22.42 | brlcad | DTRemenak: I'd like to right-click select the remote tank, have it drop down a menu where one of the options is "hunt".. k? thx. |
| 19:22.48 | SportyGal | make it user-defined if possible |
| 19:22.58 | JeffM2501 | brlcad, add "follow" while your add it |
| 19:23.00 | menotume | yes, user-defind key |
| 19:23.04 | brlcad | heh |
| 19:23.11 | JeffM2501 | menotume, I'd think you'd want 2 keys |
| 19:23.12 | menotume | would work the same as 'U', but would ADD a tank |
| 19:23.19 | JeffM2501 | one to add to the hunt, and one to remove from the hunt |
| 19:23.30 | Grumbler | add to hunt -> makes more sense....because at some point someone is going to ask for the ability to hunt 3 people |
| 19:23.31 | DTRemenak | ~lart brlcad |
| 19:23.35 | JeffM2501 | or would you readd the same one, to remove it? |
| 19:23.43 | ToughShooter | would be nice if I could highlight all again |
| 19:23.56 | DTRemenak | maybe a "hunt mode" then add, delete, etc, keys |
| 19:23.56 | ibunnyCBG | It was: Hunt 1 person, Hide list, press HUNT Twice. |
| 19:24.11 | menotume | JeffM2501: could do that if the selection didn't skip selected tanks |
| 19:24.15 | JeffM2501 | well you have till 3ish, my time to figure it out :) |
| 19:24.25 | JeffM2501 | menotume, then maybe just a clear |
| 19:24.30 | JeffM2501 | and make em readd em all |
| 19:24.34 | ToughShooter | was a pretty good pointer to look which tanks have not been checked for callsign for example |
| 19:24.46 | menotume | yes, 'U' 'U' clears now |
| 19:24.50 | JeffM2501 | ok |
| 19:24.56 | SportyGal | menotume: what was the hostban issue we talked about? I don't remember why it required protocol break |
| 19:24.57 | JeffM2501 | you gonna hook it up? |
| 19:25.17 | menotume | i don't recall either, but tupone found a way without breaking proto |
| 19:25.25 | *** join/#bzflag |zongo| (n=zongo@84-72-45-91.dclient.hispeed.ch) |
| 19:25.31 | JeffM2501 | SportyGal, now is not the best time to be going thru your feature list, I mean we are looking to release |
| 19:25.39 | menotume | so, we just need another key that will add ? |
| 19:25.46 | JeffM2501 | it should have been brought up like at RC1 |
| 19:26.01 | JeffM2501 | hunt is ok, cus it's small and it useds to "work" in many users minds |
| 19:26.13 | JeffM2501 | menotume, sounds like it |
| 19:26.16 | SportyGal | JeffM2501: I did bring stuff up a while back, I'm just trying to figure out what happened to the things I raised. You may have already dealt with them |
| 19:26.22 | ibunnyCBG | can't this be brought back up the day after release? ;) |
| 19:26.22 | menotume | ok, i'll do it |
| 19:26.31 | JeffM2501 | SportyGal, you have to push push push :) |
| 19:26.58 | ibunnyCBG | ok? :) or must it be SportyGal |
| 19:27.00 | JeffM2501 | ibunnyCBG, any work we do after the release, will be in 2.1.x and be on a proto break |
| 19:27.00 | SportyGal | JeffM2501: yeah, but I kind of had some other stuff to focus on for a while. What do you want, a lion tamer standing over you? |
| 19:27.01 | Grumbler | without sounding like a 7 yearold trying to stay up late |
| 19:27.17 | JeffM2501 | SportyGal, squaky wheel gets the oil |
| 19:27.27 | SportyGal | JeffM2501: yeah, alright |
| 19:27.31 | JeffM2501 | and I'm not the person in charge, so I need no whip :0 |
| 19:27.32 | SportyGal | SQUEAK SQUEAK |
| 19:27.39 | ibunnyCBG | JeffM2501: obviously. but you seem to not want us coming up with things just BEFORE release, so just AFTER (in a week or so, hopefully) is better.... right? |
| 19:28.05 | JeffM2501 | ibunnyCBG, the problem would be, that it would be in an incompatable version |
| 19:28.09 | ibunnyCBG | lol SportyGal . |
| 19:28.24 | ibunnyCBG | the what with what what now? :( |
| 19:28.35 | JeffM2501 | what I want is these feature requests done during development, or at least pushed nearer the RC time, not nearer the final |
| 19:28.54 | ibunnyCBG | Well, we cant go back in time... can we? |
| 19:29.00 | JeffM2501 | again this is reason for roadmap |
| 19:29.11 | JeffM2501 | so we know what features "make" a version |
| 19:29.13 | ibunnyCBG | so if it is painful to do it now, we must do it in the future....? |
| 19:29.30 | JeffM2501 | well duh |
| 19:29.34 | *** join/#bzflag Tupone (n=Tupone@pdpc/supporter/active/Tupone) |
| 19:29.34 | *** mode/#bzflag [+v Tupone] by ChanServ |
| 19:29.39 | JeffM2501 | but if it's small we can do it now |
| 19:29.43 | JeffM2501 | since we know we have to reubild anyway |
| 19:29.46 | ibunnyCBG | unless DTRemenak has built a time machine in his back yard in his spare time... |
| 19:29.55 | JeffM2501 | I'm willing to wait 3 hours for stuff |
| 19:29.58 | JeffM2501 | minor things |
| 19:30.01 | JeffM2501 | then I'm doing RC5 |
| 19:30.08 | DTRemenak | ibunnyCBG: if I had any spare time I might consider that :) |
| 19:30.37 | CIA-3 | BZFlag: 03jeffm2501 * 10bzflag/src/bzflag/ (SceneRenderer.cxx bzflag.cxx playing.cxx): depth buffers for EVERYONE |
| 19:31.03 | ibunnyCBG | DTRemenak: have you been to the year 3000? did you see that they live under water? and how was my great granddaughter? |
| 19:31.11 | ibunnyCBG | was she pretty fine? ;) |
| 19:31.28 | DTRemenak | ibunnyCBG: you never married :P |
| 19:32.01 | ibunnyCBG | DTRemenak: bummer. well, thats cause I couldn't bring myself to choose, right? ;) |
| 19:32.17 | *** part/#bzflag |zongo| (n=zongo@84-72-45-91.dclient.hispeed.ch) |
| 19:33.55 | ibunnyCBG | bye mr timetraveler DTRemenak . :) |
| 19:38.02 | brlcad | he's a rocketman? |
| 19:42.15 | SportyGal | ~Tupone++ |
| 19:42.25 | *** join/#bzflag brad2901 (i=brad@unaffiliated/brad2901) |
| 20:01.41 | menotume | anyone know what this is: Could not set Video Mode: Couldn't find matching GLX visual. |
| 20:01.59 | menotume | i'm running bzflag cvs for the first time in a week or tow |
| 20:02.57 | Grumbler | menotume, scroll back to a conversation between JeffM2501 and trepan......may give you a clue |
| 20:03.21 | menotume | okies , thx |
| 20:03.22 | bryjen | getting the same here. worked as of yesterday. |
| 20:03.30 | menotume | oh, k |
| 20:03.50 | menotume | i'm gonna have a prblem implementing multiple-hunt, then :) |
| 20:04.01 | Grumbler | yeah, trepan was trying to make things cool again.....i imagine its something there |
| 20:04.02 | bryjen | err. that was poorly worded. it _did_ work _yesterday_. _Now_ it does _not_. |
| 20:05.01 | Grumbler | ....then again, JeffM2501 has been trying to make things cool as well......so it could be his baby |
| 20:09.50 | trepan | Grumbler: huh? |
| 20:12.07 | *** join/#bzflag brad2901` (i=brad@unaffiliated/brad2901) |
| 20:15.07 | menotume | bryjen: how recent is your build? (I'm trying to figure out how far back to go ) |
| 20:16.19 | bryjen | menotume: minutes ago. I'm betting it's JeffM2501's last commit. he was going on about "'why is the depth buffer being 16 bits". i think we just found out why ;) |
| 20:16.27 | menotume | okies :) |
| 20:16.38 | menotume | i'm doing co -D "2 hours ago" |
| 20:16.50 | menotume | of course, JeffM2501 breaks it, and goes to lunch |
| 20:17.51 | menotume | :) |
| 20:19.15 | Tupone | menotume: you could be happy :) I got the same problem |
| 20:20.21 | Grumbler | anybody looking into why fast/jittery tanks can fly through walls and such |
| 20:20.33 | trepan | ditto |
| 20:21.00 | bryjen | that's it. i backdated just before that commit and it works again |
| 20:21.30 | Tupone | Grumbler: it was from the beginning of time ... for lagged or fast-one |
| 20:21.31 | trepan | Grumbler: we know why, would take a fair amount of change to fix it right now |
| 20:21.56 | Grumbler | ok, just wanted to make sure its not undocumented |
| 20:21.58 | Tupone | I fixed sometime ago the falling through elevated platform |
| 20:22.39 | Grumbler | yeah, loumans map is showing the problem quite frequently....and somehow it allows the tanks to shot through the walls, making quite the camping spot |
| 20:22.41 | *** join/#bzflag Silent_Swan (n=pepper@adsl-66-73-166-47.dsl.chcgil.ameritech.net) |
| 20:22.50 | menotume | bryjen: how do you 'backdate' and build so fast? :) |
| 20:23.02 | trepan | Grumbler: the second problem can be rectified with the current map format |
| 20:23.09 | bryjen | cvs update -D "14:15 CDT" |
| 20:23.10 | trepan | Louman's sent me an update last night for it |
| 20:23.14 | Grumbler | ah |
| 20:23.30 | menotume | ahhh, it will 'undo' revs ? |
| 20:23.34 | menotume | kewl :) |
| 20:23.49 | Grumbler | i figured it was an attribute not attatched to a face......guess i will have to see what it is now |
| 20:24.50 | *** join/#bzflag Silent_Swan (n=pepper@adsl-66-73-166-47.dsl.chcgil.ameritech.net) |
| 20:25.02 | SportyGal | hiya SilentSwan |
| 20:25.05 | Silent_Swan | hi |
| 20:25.39 | Silent_Swan | hey brlcad |
| 20:25.54 | brlcad | how's the server holding up? |
| 20:25.59 | Silent_Swan | doing very well, thanks |
| 20:27.05 | menotume | bryjen: yes, much better, thx :) |
| 20:27.07 | Silent_Swan | thanks, it was one of my first, too |
| 20:27.18 | brlcad | which reminds me.. trepan, that high usage is from all the laser calcs.. :) |
| 20:27.24 | menotume | ~JeffM2501-=200 hehe |
| 20:27.50 | SportyGal | ~karma JeffM2501 |
| 20:27.50 | ibot | jeffm2501 has karma of 68 |
| 20:27.55 | SportyGal | thief! |
| 20:28.08 | bryjen | ~karma Patlabor221 |
| 20:28.08 | ibot | patlabor221 has karma of 238 |
| 20:28.19 | SportyGal | yeah but he never uses that one anymore |
| 20:28.27 | bryjen | you can't take it with you |
| 20:28.30 | SportyGal | hey, whatever happened to MAC? I NEVER see him anymore |
| 20:28.36 | trepan | brlcad: laser calcs on the server? |
| 20:28.51 | brlcad | trepan: yeah, the cpu usage is from all the laser shots |
| 20:28.58 | brlcad | server computes all the segments |
| 20:28.59 | trepan | for spawn positions? |
| 20:29.16 | brlcad | inefficient ray/intersection code ;) |
| 20:29.30 | bryjen | i thought the server was fairly ignorant of shots |
| 20:29.38 | trepan | brlcad: where? |
| 20:29.48 | brlcad | it used to be much worse when it computed a lot more segments |
| 20:29.54 | brlcad | i'd forgotten all about it |
| 20:30.29 | trepan | there's only 1 line in all of bzfs/ with 'Laser' in it |
| 20:32.02 | brlcad | hmm |
| 20:33.03 | SportyGal | silverfox: that bad? |
| 20:33.07 | SportyGal | oops |
| 20:33.10 | SportyGal | Silent_Swan: that bad |
| 20:33.18 | brlcad | trepan: maybe I'm misremembering the issue, but it was related to laser segments chewing up the server's cputime |
| 20:33.35 | brlcad | though all I see is DropGeometry doing some ray stuff |
| 20:33.36 | Silent_Swan | yep... still working, but i've officially had it with this place |
| 20:33.39 | Silent_Swan | after 2 months |
| 20:33.54 | Silent_Swan | will probably get fired anyway |
| 20:34.36 | trepan | brlcad: yup, but it has nothing to do with shots |
| 20:35.14 | brlcad | wouldn't happen to be a profiled build of bzfs would it? :) |
| 20:35.26 | trepan | nope ;) |
| 20:36.18 | brlcad | fun map, though |
| 20:36.30 | *** join/#bzflag mmu_man (i=revol@ALyon-253-1-59-1.w86-193.abo.wanadoo.fr) |
| 20:36.49 | brlcad | ~bzflist |
| 20:38.09 | brlcad | Silent_Swan: the server had at least 17 players last night for several hours at one point |
| 20:38.31 | Silent_Swan | yeah, it was busy :) |
| 20:38.50 | SportyGal | people like the classic maps :) |
| 20:38.54 | brlcad | what was the most it got up to? |
| 20:40.44 | Silent_Swan | not sure, brlcad |
| 20:45.49 | JeffM2501 | ohhhyyy too much food |
| 20:46.10 | JeffM2501 | -200? why |
| 20:46.13 | JeffM2501 | what'd I' do now? |
| 20:46.43 | JeffM2501 | what's wrong with the depth buffer? |
| 20:46.50 | Tupone | too big |
| 20:46.51 | JeffM2501 | does it not work for you guys? |
| 20:46.52 | Tupone | 32 bit |
| 20:47.00 | JeffM2501 | what's wrong with a 32? |
| 20:47.11 | Tupone | nvidia ... 24 |
| 20:47.18 | JeffM2501 | under linux maybe |
| 20:47.22 | JeffM2501 | not underwindows |
| 20:47.33 | Tupone | nvidia did the driver |
| 20:47.34 | JeffM2501 | what does it do? |
| 20:47.43 | Tupone | does not finf a visual for it |
| 20:47.54 | JeffM2501 | hmm odd |
| 20:47.55 | JeffM2501 | did for me |
| 20:48.05 | JeffM2501 | well let me make it 24 for non windows then |
| 20:48.42 | *** join/#bzflag RPG_ (n=G-bus@c-24-15-87-171.hsd1.il.comcast.net) |
| 20:48.45 | Tupone | hmm, I wonder what to do for the guys with poor hardware |
| 20:49.09 | JeffM2501 | Tupone, if it's set to bellow "high" quality it goes to what it used to do |
| 20:49.18 | trepan | JeffM2501: the prob is that it's considered to be a 'min' value, 24 will kack for those that only have 16 |
| 20:49.22 | Tupone | problem is that it crash when is not good |
| 20:49.27 | trepan | it's a poor setup |
| 20:49.29 | JeffM2501 | hmm |
| 20:49.42 | JeffM2501 | ok |
| 20:49.46 | JeffM2501 | then I'll change it to plan b |
| 20:49.58 | JeffM2501 | ask for 32 in the pfd, and set to whatever we get |
| 20:50.05 | JeffM2501 | Tupone, didn't crash for me |
| 20:50.08 | JeffM2501 | worked fine |
| 20:50.14 | Tupone | windows .. or linux? |
| 20:50.18 | JeffM2501 | windows |
| 20:50.37 | JeffM2501 | all I have to test here |
| 20:50.39 | Tupone | Dunno what to say. Nvidia does the driver |
| 20:50.50 | Tupone | and they are closed source |
| 20:50.57 | JeffM2501 | I'll bet they don't let you do a depth buffer over the frame buffer |
| 20:51.07 | JeffM2501 | Tupone, dosnt' matter, there are other ways to do it |
| 20:52.10 | Tupone | depth size on nvidia-linux are 0, 16 or 24 |
| 20:52.18 | JeffM2501 | or 32 for us here |
| 20:52.29 | Tupone | not nvidia-linux I bet |
| 20:52.37 | JeffM2501 | dude you know I odn't use linux |
| 20:52.41 | JeffM2501 | so why do you keep saying linux? |
| 20:52.54 | Tupone | lol, and you know I removed everything except linux :) |
| 20:53.09 | JeffM2501 | I'm going to change it to ask for the max possible, and set it to what we get |
| 20:53.10 | Tupone | GNU/Linux has to say |
| 20:54.02 | JeffM2501 | actualy I'm going to cheese out :) |
| 20:55.52 | JeffM2501 | can fix it for real later |
| 20:57.06 | CIA-3 | BZFlag: 03jeffm2501 * 10bzflag/src/bzflag/bzflag.cxx: use a 16 bit depth buffer unless the config has forceDepthBits |
| 20:57.09 | JeffM2501 | like you've never busted windows :) |
| 20:57.25 | JeffM2501 | that sould work for you |
| 20:57.33 | Tupone | I did, but consciously :) |
| 20:57.43 | JeffM2501 | gonna have to call BS on that one |
| 20:58.29 | trepan | JeffM2501: so can the user still config for BSP in this release? |
| 20:58.39 | JeffM2501 | trepan, yeah they have to set it in the config |
| 20:58.46 | JeffM2501 | if it's set in the config it'll use it |
| 20:58.55 | JeffM2501 | I wanted to pull the entire thing |
| 20:59.21 | JeffM2501 | but there may be a ficticious ATI card out there that can't do depth buffer |
| 20:59.39 | JeffM2501 | we just won't ever turn off depth by default now, and there isn't any way to turn it off in the interface |
| 21:00.57 | JeffM2501 | how much work would it save you if we pulled bsp? |
| 21:01.04 | trepan | works for me, might want to emit a warning (as there is no way to turn it on either) |
| 21:01.21 | JeffM2501 | yeah a startup warning would not hurt |
| 21:01.34 | trepan | JeffM2501: it would have saved plenty earlier, but none now |
| 21:01.40 | JeffM2501 | ok |
| 21:01.50 | JeffM2501 | well at least we are on the path to removing it |
| 21:01.53 | JeffM2501 | better then nothing |
| 21:02.00 | JeffM2501 | only took 4 years |
| 21:03.24 | Birdie | i formatted pc -> reinstalled bz...but the reaction of my tank when i want to turn is very very very slow...mouseboxsize is little...what can be the option i have to change? |
| 21:03.42 | Birdie | (mouse is putted on the max speed + acceleration) |
| 21:06.23 | JeffM2501 | Tupone, does that fix your crash? |
| 21:06.38 | Tupone | our crash? yes |
| 21:06.48 | JeffM2501 | we really should do more caps testing before we pick a context |
| 21:07.11 | *** join/#bzflag CBG (n=CBG@cpc2-stme1-5-1-cust130.cdif.cable.ntl.com) |
| 21:07.16 | JeffM2501 | and get rid of the glCopyPixels |
| 21:07.32 | JeffM2501 | Tupone, do you have any more changes? |
| 21:07.32 | CBG | bb admins: http://community.the-underdogs.org/smiley/flipoff.gif is inappropriate for the bb, no? |
| 21:07.54 | JeffM2501 | and menotume did you get the hunt thing in? |
| 21:08.02 | JeffM2501 | CBG, with those fingers |
| 21:08.03 | JeffM2501 | yes |
| 21:08.13 | Tupone | I have ... but I can delay . Don't want to put more instability there |
| 21:08.22 | CBG | JeffM2501: Chat Forum, the Smily topic.... last post but one, iirc. |
| 21:08.23 | JeffM2501 | what is it Tupone? |
| 21:08.32 | CBG | (is where it was used....) |
| 21:09.07 | Tupone | nothing important ... and I need to test. I don't want to delay release |
| 21:09.17 | JeffM2501 | what is it tho? |
| 21:09.22 | JeffM2501 | comunication is good :) |
| 21:09.41 | CBG | mmmm, communication... |
| 21:09.54 | CBG | best with ketchup. :) |
| 21:10.01 | JeffM2501 | and halflings |
| 21:10.14 | bryjen | *meaningful* comunication is good |
| 21:10.17 | CBG | ~dict halflings |
| 21:10.22 | Tupone | I just read RTP, and I wanted to test their method to compute jitter. That is just a measurement, so it does affect only the lag statistic |
| 21:10.22 | CBG | bryjen: heh |
| 21:10.41 | CBG | Guys: how accurate is the jitter reading on lagstats? |
| 21:10.44 | JeffM2501 | ok, so not really a big thing |
| 21:10.54 | JeffM2501 | CBG, I don't trust it at all |
| 21:11.01 | CBG | JeffM2501: I might have guessed... |
| 21:11.12 | CBG | I ahve noticed inaccuracies in it lately. |
| 21:11.32 | CBG | Such as someone all over the map/radar but lagstats says something like 80 +- 5ms .... |
| 21:12.08 | JeffM2501 | I don't trust any of that |
| 21:12.15 | CBG | not even the lag reading? |
| 21:12.22 | JeffM2501 | not really |
| 21:12.24 | CBG | packet loss? |
| 21:12.35 | JeffM2501 | we don't have great tools |
| 21:12.39 | CBG | so, can't anything be done? |
| 21:12.44 | JeffM2501 | sure |
| 21:12.53 | CBG | but? |
| 21:12.53 | JeffM2501 | and that's a research project that has been started |
| 21:13.01 | JeffM2501 | can't change all things in one day :) |
| 21:13.08 | JeffM2501 | 2.0.4 has to be compatable |
| 21:13.15 | CBG | sure. :) |
| 21:13.16 | JeffM2501 | so changes to networking are limited |
| 21:13.55 | CBG | no problem, just bringing it up at the worst possible moment. ;) |
| 21:13.58 | JeffM2501 | well then I'll be starting rc5 in about 45 min |
| 21:14.08 | CBG | rc *5* ? |
| 21:14.12 | CBG | :( pfff. |
| 21:14.15 | JeffM2501 | yes |
| 21:14.18 | JeffM2501 | we had changes |
| 21:14.21 | JeffM2501 | means another RC |
| 21:14.28 | CBG | I think rc2 should have been 2.0.2. ;) :P |
| 21:14.42 | JeffM2501 | I think RC2 should have been b20 |
| 21:14.52 | CBG | pf. |
| 21:14.54 | CBG | but, anyway, enough time-wasting. Business Studies homework does not do itself. :) |
| 21:15.04 | JeffM2501 | the joy of not having a roadmap :) |
| 21:15.06 | Tupone | Birdie, the Mouse Enhanced things, like you are doing, causes problem to the other guys, especially if you are a lagged/jittered player. So I had to remove some lag compensation it was in the code. When you guy, return back to the normal way of handling the mouse, I could put it back. Now compensation of position due to jitter are not done (removed in the upcoming version). Blame on you all :) |
| 21:15.07 | CBG | wait. I meant 2.0.4 :$ |
| 21:15.29 | JeffM2501 | CBG, rc2 did not have trepans changes, and it had bugs |
| 21:15.33 | JeffM2501 | you WANT trepans changes |
| 21:15.45 | CBG | graphics? |
| 21:16.01 | CBG | more polys? |
| 21:16.02 | JeffM2501 | 8million triangles, full quality settings, AF and AA, 130fps |
| 21:16.14 | JeffM2501 | yes more polys |
| 21:16.17 | Birdie | tupone: hmm... |
| 21:16.29 | JeffM2501 | lets the map makers do what they should be able to do |
| 21:16.29 | CBG | anyway. cheerio chaps. :) |
| 21:16.34 | CBG | cool. |
| 21:16.47 | CBG | Id'e get back into that if I had less homework. byeeeee |
| 21:16.52 | Tupone | Birdie: but I did not change anything for your setting not to work |
| 21:16.55 | JeffM2501 | gets the graphic "engine" at least up to the year 2000 |
| 21:16.59 | CBG | lol |
| 21:17.09 | Birdie | like i move my mouse to the left...and after 0.5 seconds it will react |
| 21:17.26 | trepan | JeffM2501: except for the lighting, shadows, and multitex ;) |
| 21:18.01 | Tupone | Birdie: well, I just commenting some part of the question. But I don't know how to fix your problem |
| 21:19.04 | Tupone | Birdie: have you tried to remove/move your config file |
| 21:19.13 | Birdie | its just a new one |
| 21:19.18 | Birdie | by default |
| 21:19.22 | Birdie | didnt changed anything |
| 21:19.23 | JeffM2501 | trepan, that's why I said 2000 :) |
| 21:19.30 | JeffM2501 | at least you have vbos |
| 21:19.43 | Tupone | Windows or a true OS ? |
| 21:20.00 | Birdie | windows xp |
| 21:20.01 | trepan | JeffM2501: nope, took those out... just display lists right now |
| 21:20.15 | Tupone | how many FPS you get ? |
| 21:20.27 | Birdie | it worked before(other releases, never troubles), maybe i got a to far release with some bugs in |
| 21:20.31 | Birdie | let me check |
| 21:20.34 | trepan | (inefficient for LODs, but didn't have to deal with glext.h junk across OSes) |
| 21:21.14 | Birdie | 20 fps..boo |
| 21:21.22 | Birdie | normally i have 40 50 |
| 21:21.47 | Tupone | I think that is, better you get the new source |
| 21:22.06 | Tupone | JeffM2501: can we release the rc5 ? |
| 21:22.09 | Birdie | http://my.bzflag.org/builds/2.0.x/bzflag-2.0.4-rc4.exe |
| 21:22.13 | Birdie | its this release |
| 21:22.20 | RPG_ | how 'bout you just make a 2.0.4? |
| 21:22.24 | Birdie | well a beta snap.. |
| 21:22.55 | Pimpinella | Birdie: no, it's already a release candidate (rc) |
| 21:22.57 | Tupone | hmm you formatted the hard disk. did you install the video driver? |
| 21:23.08 | Pimpinella | ;) |
| 21:23.16 | Birdie | i didnt formatted it..my dad did..so i have no idea |
| 21:23.41 | Tupone | do you have old version there ? |
| 21:24.20 | Tupone | well, I suppose Jeff/DTR are better at helping you on windows |
| 21:25.12 | JeffM2501 | Tupone, I'd like some testing with the changes trepan has made |
| 21:25.14 | JeffM2501 | jsut to be sure |
| 21:25.41 | Tupone | k |
| 21:26.33 | JeffM2501 | I have evaluted the other reported bug ( the minimise maximise thing), and I can't dupe it, so it's not a common problem |
| 21:26.38 | JeffM2501 | so I'm not worried about that |
| 21:27.03 | Tupone | Birdie: if you go to option/input what you read in Active Input Device ? |
| 21:27.04 | JeffM2501 | mostly I just want to make sure that noone steams "rc5 is way slow" or "rc5 has problems" after his change |
| 21:27.46 | JeffM2501 | I know you want to push, but rushing it to make a crap release will hurt more then a day or 2 of still busted debians |
| 21:28.16 | JeffM2501 | there may be GL implementations out there that have problems that trepan may not have foresaw |
| 21:29.02 | Tupone | I don't want to push :) , mostly because I don't have anyone to push |
| 21:30.14 | Birdie | tupone: auto |
| 21:30.23 | Tupone | try to put mouse |
| 21:30.30 | Tupone | TimRiker: lol |
| 21:30.42 | trepan | worst comes to worst, there's alway 'set useDrawInfo 0' |
| 21:30.47 | JeffM2501 | that there is |
| 21:30.54 | JeffM2501 | allways a good safty net |
| 21:31.04 | JeffM2501 | is there an interface for that? |
| 21:31.14 | TimRiker | not last I looked. |
| 21:31.15 | Birdie | tupone: didnt really helped:( |
| 21:31.17 | trepan | nope |
| 21:31.21 | JeffM2501 | like "have crapy card... yes" |
| 21:31.26 | TimRiker | hehe |
| 21:31.32 | trepan | nor is there an interface for the LOD scaling vars |
| 21:31.41 | JeffM2501 | well we'll see how it works for rc5 |
| 21:31.43 | Tupone | JeffM2501: could you help Birdie |
| 21:31.47 | JeffM2501 | it'll just be a day or 2 |
| 21:31.51 | JeffM2501 | Tupone, what is his problem? |
| 21:32.04 | Tupone | mouse is responding with delay |
| 21:32.17 | JeffM2501 | umm ok |
| 21:32.19 | JeffM2501 | why? |
| 21:32.27 | Tupone | I saw someone else on bzbb experiencing the same IIRC |
| 21:32.28 | JeffM2501 | and when did it start? |
| 21:32.38 | Birdie | after i formatted my c part |
| 21:32.43 | JeffM2501 | what OS? |
| 21:32.44 | Birdie | every program gone -> downing bzflag |
| 21:32.48 | Birdie | xp |
| 21:32.55 | JeffM2501 | did you reinstall directX 9c? |
| 21:33.03 | JeffM2501 | and video drivers and stuff? |
| 21:33.23 | Birdie | i think so(i havent formatted it but propably thats the first people do after formatting) |
| 21:33.35 | JeffM2501 | sometimes it is, sometimes it isn't |
| 21:33.40 | Tupone | I think there is a way to check it |
| 21:33.43 | Birdie | how? |
| 21:33.54 | Birdie | configuration screan -> hardware was my first guess |
| 21:34.10 | Birdie | but i need some kidn of cd rom wich i cant find for the moment |
| 21:34.15 | Tupone | there is a system utility to check for directx capability |
| 21:34.29 | JeffM2501 | dxdiag |
| 21:34.35 | JeffM2501 | XP ships with DX8 |
| 21:35.03 | JeffM2501 | what kind of mouse is it? |
| 21:35.06 | Birdie | how to check if i have that? |
| 21:35.08 | Birdie | logitech |
| 21:35.14 | JeffM2501 | and is there any intelepoint software installed |
| 21:35.19 | Birdie | sure |
| 21:35.21 | Birdie | putted on fast |
| 21:35.22 | JeffM2501 | go to windows update, see if it wants to give you a new DX |
| 21:35.24 | Birdie | max acceleration |
| 21:35.41 | JeffM2501 | and check your video drivers |
| 21:35.54 | JeffM2501 | with "hardware cursor" these days the drivers have a lot to do with input |
| 21:36.16 | JeffM2501 | and what RC are you on? |
| 21:36.28 | Birdie | RC? |
| 21:36.30 | menotume | a problem with bzfs, i think |
| 21:36.34 | JeffM2501 | version |
| 21:36.40 | JeffM2501 | RC 5? |
| 21:36.46 | menotume | i did a /countdown pause with about 2 mins left |
| 21:36.58 | menotume | ohh, i'll check version in a sec |
| 21:37.07 | Birdie | jeff: no idea.. |
| 21:37.10 | menotume | nit said paused, and the timer stopped |
| 21:37.18 | menotume | nbut 2 mins later - game ended :) |
| 21:37.45 | JeffM2501 | Birdie, where did you get the bzflag version you are using? |
| 21:37.57 | Birdie | <PROTECTED> |
| 21:38.01 | Birdie | but tupone told it was a good one |
| 21:38.04 | JeffM2501 | that would be RC4 :) |
| 21:38.10 | JeffM2501 | yeah it should be fine |
| 21:38.13 | Birdie | see i knew that;) *rolling eyes* |
| 21:38.13 | menotume | 2.0.2 8/02 |
| 21:38.19 | menotume | i doubt that it's changed |
| 21:38.45 | menotume | err, server version 2.0.3.20050802 |
| 21:38.58 | JeffM2501 | fix it menotume :) |
| 21:39.18 | Tupone | menotume: the crash you experienced om cvs client has been fixed |
| 21:40.53 | menotume | okies, thx tupone |
| 21:41.02 | menotume | JeffM2501: i got to get back to multi-hunt |
| 21:41.16 | menotume | ni got slowed down due to someone breaking cvs, then going to lunch :) |
| 21:41.30 | menotume | and, a match, of course :) |
| 21:43.07 | JeffM2501 | it's cool |
| 21:43.12 | JeffM2501 | cvs worked for me |
| 21:43.24 | JeffM2501 | can't help it if linux/sdl can't hack it ;) |
| 21:44.18 | trepan | in this particular case, i'd blame bz's code for lack of checking ;) |
| 21:44.23 | JeffM2501 | that too |
| 21:44.31 | JeffM2501 | there are many reasons |
| 21:44.33 | Birdie | ~tupone++ |
| 21:44.38 | Birdie | ~JeffM2501++ |
| 21:44.40 | JeffM2501 | one woudl think it wouldn't crash tho, just return an error |
| 21:44.44 | Birdie | i like helping developers! |
| 21:44.50 | JeffM2501 | SportyGal, yeah |
| 21:44.53 | JeffM2501 | I'll wait for meno |
| 21:44.56 | Tupone | Birdie: you fixed that ? |
| 21:44.59 | *** part/#bzflag RPG_ (n=G-bus@c-24-15-87-171.hsd1.il.comcast.net) |
| 21:45.01 | SportyGal | cool, thanks |
| 21:45.02 | Birdie | you can wait long than if you have to wait for meno:) |
| 21:45.02 | JeffM2501 | plan on RC5 tomorow |
| 21:45.08 | Birdie | tupone: not yet |
| 21:45.09 | SportyGal | ~jeffm2501++ |
| 21:45.13 | SportyGal | ~menotume++ |
| 21:45.18 | menotume | good, then i can test more |
| 21:45.20 | trepan | JeffM2501: it does return an error, and doesn't really crash :) |
| 21:45.26 | JeffM2501 | ahh |
| 21:45.31 | Birdie | but at least i know my direct X version is ok:) |
| 21:45.34 | SportyGal | JeffM2501: someone stole all your karma when cvs crashed |
| 21:45.38 | *** join/#bzflag bryjen (n=bryjen@63.147.94.151) |
| 21:45.41 | menotume | i have a prob with the default key not being defined (the new key) |
| 21:45.41 | JeffM2501 | yeah we should do a lot more checking and be smarter about the context we ask for |
| 21:45.56 | JeffM2501 | SportyGal, ehh it ebbs and flows |
| 21:46.07 | JeffM2501 | maybe it's because I'm evil |
| 21:50.47 | SportyGal | JeffM2501: well, I thought a 200 point deduction was a bit much - you were only at LUNCH, not on VACATION |
| 21:54.09 | JeffM2501 | heh |
| 21:54.18 | JeffM2501 | I was on vacation a while ago |
| 21:54.43 | JeffM2501 | but they say I'm the bad guy now |
| 21:54.47 | JeffM2501 | and bad guys can't have karma |
| 21:55.14 | JeffM2501 | ibot, karma patlabor221 |
| 21:55.15 | ibot | patlabor221 has karma of 238 |
| 21:55.22 | JeffM2501 | at least I have my reserve karma |
| 21:55.40 | CIA-3 | BZFlag: 03trepan * 10bzflag/src/bzflag/playing.cxx: something for the SLI guy |
| 21:55.56 | JeffM2501 | am I the only person with SLI? |
| 21:56.19 | silverfox | ~SLI |
| 21:56.20 | ibot | hmm... sli is Scan Line Interleaving, a technique for using 2 or more 3D processors in parallel. Each processor renders a little part of the scanlines in the final image. Gives you more fps :) |
| 21:56.28 | trepan | dunno, just liked the rhyme |
| 21:56.38 | JeffM2501 | I have 2 video cards silverfox |
| 21:56.48 | JeffM2501 | that work together |
| 21:57.16 | trepan | google 'nvidia sli' |
| 22:00.49 | *** part/#bzflag bryjen (n=bryjen@63.147.94.151) |
| 22:01.29 | JeffM2501 | ahh glfinish |
| 22:02.33 | JeffM2501 | wonder if crossfire would work in my nforce4 mobo |
| 22:04.09 | Tupone | if (!(timespec >> countdownDelay)) I wonder if Chestal really meant that :/ |
| 22:05.17 | Tupone | ahh that is a read from stream :) |
| 22:08.06 | *** join/#bzflag Silent_Swan (n=pepper@adsl-66-73-166-47.dsl.chcgil.ameritech.net) |
| 22:21.50 | *** join/#bzflag wizart (n=wizart@dsl-084-058-146-030.arcor-ip.net) |
| 22:22.36 | *** part/#bzflag Tupone (n=Tupone@pdpc/supporter/active/Tupone) |
| 22:26.43 | Aribeth | anon cvs broken? |
| 22:26.50 | JeffM2501 | in what way? |
| 22:27.00 | Aribeth | cvs [login aborted]: end of file from server (consult above messages if any) |
| 22:27.07 | JeffM2501 | ohh that can happen |
| 22:27.27 | JeffM2501 | just give it a couple min and it will go |
| 22:27.36 | Aribeth | ok :) |
| 22:27.36 | JeffM2501 | I think that happens when it gets too full |
| 22:27.44 | JeffM2501 | too many connections |
| 22:27.46 | Aribeth | ahh. makes sence |
| 22:27.58 | Aribeth | coffee time then |
| 22:40.16 | jomojo | someone remind me how to do a hostban |
| 22:52.40 | SportChick | <PROTECTED> |
| 22:52.53 | SportChick | *.*.* is the portion of the host you want to ban |
| 22:55.27 | silverfox | menotume, did you help orange w/the -ctfratio patch? |
| 22:56.09 | menotume | err, never heard of it |
| 22:56.28 | menotume | ~JeffM2501+=250 |
| 23:08.34 | *** join/#bzflag _bubbles_ (n=nadic666@toronto-HSE-ppp4002157.sympatico.ca) |
| 23:12.24 | *** join/#bzflag Silent_Swan (n=silent@adsl-66-73-166-47.dsl.chcgil.ameritech.net) |
| 23:16.15 | *** join/#bzflag brad2901` (i=brad@unaffiliated/brad2901) |
| 23:19.19 | *** join/#bzflag triclops (n=triclops@203-206-249-42.dyn.iinet.net.au) |
| 23:23.03 | *** join/#bzflag blast007 (n=blast007@24-196-92-143.dhcp.mdsn.wi.charter.com) |
| 23:39.11 | *** join/#bzflag Chestal (i=thilo@vmax.unix-ag.uni-siegen.de) |
| 23:39.11 | *** mode/#bzflag [+o Chestal] by ChanServ |
| 23:42.14 | *** join/#bzflag Tegan (n=lyra@eacb02-00-cmmgga-70-34-176-23.atlaga.adelphia.net) |
| 23:42.40 | Tegan | hey |
| 23:47.29 | Grumbler | hey |
| 23:47.36 | Tegan | :) |
| 23:50.46 | *** join/#bzflag blast007 (n=blast007@24-196-92-143.dhcp.mdsn.wi.charter.com) |
