irclog2html for #bzflag on 20050622

`00:00.18`	`JeffM2501`	`he did a number of rewrites`
`00:00.29`	`JeffM2501`	`it should not be hard to port the python to php`
`00:00.41`	`JeffM2501`	`it's got the pack and unpack stuff right there`
`00:01.21`	`blast007`	`I'll have to check my laptop, cuz I'm sure I have a script on there`
`00:01.30`	`blast007`	`PHP script*`
`00:02.37`	`JeffM2501`	`yeah I think there was one SOMEWHERE`
`00:02.51`	`JeffM2501`	`since I recall somone asking the exact same things RPG is asking :)`
`00:02.57`	`blast007`	`:)`
`00:03.22`	`JeffM2501`	`TimRiker, do you know if anyone ever did a pure php bzfsquery thingy?`
`00:05.44`	`S1gn`	`can anybody connect to my server and confirm -synctime is broken?`
`00:17.46`	`*** join/#bzflag ElectricElf (~david@ElectricElf.developer.debian)`
`00:18.33`	`*** join/#bzflag SC (~SportChic@ca-redbch-cuda1-c3b-b-183.stmnca.adelphia.net)`
`00:27.34`	`*** join/#bzflag ds (~ds@dsl081-053-082.sfo1.dsl.speakeasy.net)`
`00:43.00`	`*** join/#bzflag CIA-1 (~CIA@flapjack.navi.cx) [NETSPLIT VICTIM]`
`01:07.12`	`*** join/#bzflag spldart (~vircuser@cpe-67-10-221-4.houston.res.rr.com)`
`01:25.49`	`*** join/#bzflag Grumbler (~Grumbler@grumbler.bronze.supporter.pdpc)`
`01:33.47`	`*** join/#bzflag bryjen (~bryjen@2002:45a6:86ae:0:0:0:0:1)`
`01:34.11`	`SportChick`	`wow! a former co-worker of mine was murdered - they think it was a hit`
`01:37.38`	`spldart`	`Sounds like they were into something... Or their spouse was like my ex 8-0`
`01:40.42`	`*** join/#bzflag tankdriver (~aussie@dialup-192.86.221.203.acc50-stge-pth.comindico.com.au)`
`01:50.57`	`Grumbler`	`SportChick< ouch.....`
`01:51.34`	`SportChick`	`it's not good whatever it was - it happened a couple of months ago, but I just found out`
`01:51.58`	`*** join/#bzflag RPG_ (~G-bus@c-24-15-87-171.hsd1.il.comcast.net)`
`01:52.17`	`RPG_`	`who still remembers me?`
`01:52.24`	`SportChick`	`me`
`01:52.31`	`RPG_`	`:)`
`01:52.37`	`RPG_`	`i mean from the socket discussion earliers`
`01:53.06`	`RPG_`	`i got the script to query the server, but all I get back is "BZFS0026"`
`01:54.13`	`RPG_`	`sportchick: how do people get those yellow triangles next to their name (meaning Voiced)`
`01:54.57`	`tankdriver`	`special magic required. :)`
`01:54.59`	`*** join/#bzflag blast007 (~blast007@24-196-92-143.jvl.wi.charter.com)`
`01:55.18`	`RPG_`	`do you think i'm querying on the wrong port?`
`01:56.33`	`purple_cow`	`RPG_: what are you trying to do?`
`01:56.45`	`RPG_`	`query a bzfs server and get back player information`
`01:57.08`	`RPG_`	`i'm currently querying the server's advertized IP address with the advertized port with the message "qc";`
`01:57.09`	`*** join/#bzflag SC (~SportChic@ca-redbch-cuda1-c3b-b-183.stmnca.adelphia.net)`
`01:58.29`	`blast007`	`RPG_: that should be right`
`01:58.48`	`RPG_`	`but all i get back is " BZFS0026"`
`01:59.06`	`blast007`	`are you sending the query packets?`
`01:59.23`	`RPG_`	`i'm using sockets with PHP`
`01:59.34`	`RPG_`	`socket_write($socket, 'qc', 2);`
`02:02.04`	`blast007`	`I used fsockopen`
`02:02.22`	`blast007`	`and fwrite and fread`
`02:03.04`	`blast007`	`but anyways, I used pack("n2", 0, 0x7167); to generate the packet that needed to be sent`
`02:03.13`	`RPG_`	`i'll try`
`02:03.23`	`blast007`	`the response is 46 bytes, iirc`
`02:03.42`	`blast007`	`and I unpacked it with:`
`02:03.44`	`blast007`	`unpack("nlen/ncode/nstyle/nmaxPlayers/nmaxShots/nrogueSize/nredSize/ngreenSize/nblueSize/npurpleSize/nobserverSize/nrogueMax/nredMax/ngreenMax/nblueMax/npurpleMax/nobserverMax/nshakeWins/nshakeTimeout/nmaxPlayerScore/nmaxTeamScore/nmaxTime/ntimeElapsed", $buffer)`
`02:03.56`	`blast007`	`where $buffer was the response from the query`
`02:04.26`	`blast007`	`that's for MsgQueryGame`
`02:05.43`	`RPG_`	`do you run the query on the port the server list advertises?`
`02:05.53`	`blast007`	`yup`
`02:06.07`	`blast007`	`you'll connect like a regular client, except you won't send a MsgEnter`
`02:06.14`	`RPG_`	`snippet:`
`02:06.14`	`RPG_`	`$out=pack("n2", 0, 0x7167);`
`02:06.14`	`RPG_`	`fwrite($fp, $out);`
`02:06.14`	`RPG_`	`while (!feof($fp)) {`
`02:06.14`	`RPG_`	`echo fgets($fp, 128);`
`02:06.14`	`RPG_`	`}`
`02:06.27`	`RPG_`	`doesn't work`
`02:07.09`	`RPG_`	`and here's the line before that: $fp=fsockopen($address, $port, $errno, $errstr, 30);`
`02:07.09`	`blast007`	`<PROTECTED>`
`02:07.09`	`blast007`	`<PROTECTED>`
`02:07.23`	`blast007`	`(mine is in a class, so you'll need to change some stuff`
`02:07.25`	`blast007`	`)`
`02:07.35`	`blast007`	`the array_merge can be removed`
`02:08.00`	`RPG_`	`can i see your entire file?`
`02:09.50`	`RPG_`	`wait... unpack("nlen/ncode/nstyle/nmaxPlayers/nmaxShots/nrogueSize/nredSize/ngreenSize/nblueSize/npurpleSize/nobserverSize/nrogueMax/nredMax/ngreenMax/nblueMax/npurpleMax/nobserverMax/nshakeWins/nshakeTimeout/nmaxPlayerScore/nmaxTeamScore/nmaxTime/ntimeElapsed", $buffer) just gets a hex string, right?`
`02:10.09`	`blast007`	`1 sec`
`02:10.27`	`blast007`	`that will decode all the data into readable values`
`02:10.46`	`RPG_`	`i already have all that`
`02:10.55`	`RPG_`	`from the list server's hex string`
`02:11.18`	`RPG_`	`http://www.garrettsites.net/php-bin/phpbzlistserver.php`
`02:11.35`	`RPG_`	`what i'm looking for is the player info`
`02:11.46`	`RPG_`	`the callsigns/player scores/team scores`
`02:11.47`	`blast007`	`ah, bzflist.php _is_ the bzfquery thing`
`02:11.48`	`blast007`	`http://cvs.sourceforge.net/viewcvs.py/bzflag/bzflag/misc/bzlist.php?rev=2.1&view=markup`
`02:12.08`	`blast007`	`that should be renamed`
`02:13.12`	`tankdriver`	`Hey I have an idea, what about adding landmines, seems kind of natural for a tank game. :)`
`02:13.34`	`blast007`	`RPG_: in that bzflist.php script, it also does players`
`02:13.39`	`blast007`	`that should give ya a good start`
`02:13.44`	`RPG_`	`i tried that, it doesn't work right`
`02:14.06`	`blast007`	`oh yeah...that's right`
`02:14.13`	`blast007`	`wasn't updated for 2.0`
`02:14.21`	`RPG_`	`<PROTECTED>`
`02:14.26`	`RPG_`	`<PROTECTED>`
`02:14.50`	`blast007`	`um...doesn't appear to be a hostname in there...`
`02:16.27`	`RPG_`	`http://garrettp.homeip.net/phpscripts/bzlist.php?hostport=bzflag.secretplace.us:5255`
`02:16.35`	`RPG_`	`access denied?`
`02:16.43`	`blast007`	`yeah`
`02:16.51`	`RPG_`	`go again`
`02:17.03`	`blast007`	`http://blast.game-host.org:84/bzfs/bzflist.php?hostport=bzflag.secretplace.us:5255`
`02:17.04`	`RPG_`	`i fixed the hostname and port`
`02:17.19`	`blast007`	`same`
`02:17.25`	`RPG_`	`magic...`
`02:17.30`	`RPG_`	`can you send me your file?`
`02:17.34`	`blast007`	`sure`
`02:17.41`	`RPG_`	`can you do that over IRC?`
`02:17.53`	`blast007`	`I can throw a .phps on here`
`02:18.06`	`RPG_`	`well i can see the source if i have the file`
`02:18.17`	`blast007`	`http://blast.game-host.org:84/bzfs/bzflist.phps`
`02:18.26`	`RPG_`	`or... tha tworks too :)`
`02:18.40`	`blast007`	`I mean, you'll be able to see the source this way, as opposed to the script executing ;)`
`02:19.50`	`blast007`	`I should make a patch for that file, and submit it`
`02:19.58`	`RPG_`	`yep :)`
`02:20.06`	`RPG_`	`that would have stopped my hunt hours ago ;)`
`02:20.18`	`blast007`	`I forgot I had done any work on it ;)`
`02:20.53`	`blast007`	`last modified March 30`
`02:21.02`	`RPG_`	`lol`
`02:21.32`	`RPG_`	`i'm adding to http://www.garrettsites.net/php-bin/phpbzlistserver.php`
`02:22.06`	`blast007`	`:)`
`02:47.03`	`blast007`	`there we go, submit bzfquery.php to SF :)`
`02:47.12`	`RPG_`	`cool`
`02:47.20`	`RPG_`	`i'm working on stripping it down for my needs`
`02:47.32`	`blast007`	`hehe`
`02:48.34`	`RPG_`	`took out BZFS1910 compatibility, stripping the server list part, knocked out server "style info"`
`02:49.19`	`blast007`	`yeah, figured this script would be better for you than my more complex one`
`02:49.28`	`RPG_`	`you have a more complex one?`
`02:49.38`	`RPG_`	`that does the same thing?`
`02:49.51`	`blast007`	`it does more, but nothing useful for getting stats`
`02:49.58`	`blast007`	`it's acts more like a real client`
`02:50.06`	`RPG_`	`writtin in PHP?`
`02:50.09`	`blast007`	`yup`
`02:50.14`	`RPG_`	`is it hosted?`
`02:50.29`	`blast007`	`it's CLI`
`02:50.32`	`RPG_`	`oh`
`02:50.41`	`RPG_`	`graphical?`
`02:50.44`	`blast007`	`nope`
`02:50.53`	`RPG_`	`lol a textual BZFlag client?`
`02:50.57`	`blast007`	`:)`
`02:51.04`	`blast007`	`doesn't spawn yet or anything`
`02:51.07`	`RPG_`	`does it <i>play</>`
`02:51.28`	`RPG_`	`can it watch?`
`02:51.32`	`blast007`	`not yet`
`02:51.38`	`RPG_`	`lol what can it do?`
`02:51.43`	`blast007`	`still need to figure out how to unpack a vector in PHP`
`02:51.55`	`purple_cow`	`why would you write anything but web stuff in php?`
`02:52.01`	`purple_cow`	`in fact, why would you write web stuff in php? :)`
`02:52.07`	`blast007`	`:P ;)`
`02:52.16`	`RPG_`	`it's a forgiving language`
`02:52.18`	`blast007`	`I have fun with PHP`
`02:53.32`	`blast007`	`someone wrote an OpenGL app in PHP...`
`02:53.38`	`RPG_`	`?????`
`02:53.44`	`blast007`	`only worked in Windows though, due to how the extension worked`
`02:54.03`	`blast007`	`http://dotgeek.org/highfive/display.php?snippet=75`
`02:54.16`	`blast007`	`it's a PHP5 script too`
`02:54.44`	`blast007`	`http://iridium.dotgeek.org/phpwindows.png`
`02:55.26`	`RPG_`	`wow`
`02:55.40`	`blast007`	`yeah, it's crazy`
`02:56.31`	`blast007`	`oh yeah: http://images.randomphp.net/phpopengl/18.png`
`02:56.38`	`blast007`	`I could do bzflag in PHP ;D jk`
`02:56.59`	`RPG_`	`you are :)`
`02:57.07`	`blast007`	`well, with graphics I mean`
`02:57.37`	`blast007`	`hmm...cia.navi.cx is still down`
`02:57.56`	`RPG_`	`can you commit?`
`02:58.05`	`blast007`	`not on bzflag`
`02:58.36`	`RPG_`	`...which means you're a dev on something else?`
`02:58.43`	`blast007`	`yeah`
`02:58.54`	`blast007`	`a php blog :)`
`02:59.19`	`blast007`	`well, eventually a full CMS`
`02:59.37`	`RPG_`	`what's the name?`
`02:59.42`	`blast007`	`php2press`
`02:59.48`	`RPG_`	`and what's CMS stand for?`
`03:00.05`	`blast007`	`content management system, like postNuke and PHPNuke`
`03:00.09`	`RPG_`	`ahhh`
`03:00.11`	`RPG_`	`i made one of those`
`03:00.16`	`RPG_`	`for personal use`
`03:00.28`	`blast007`	`:)`
`03:00.46`	`RPG_`	`i was wanting to have an exectutable program so you could update it/check on it without using a browser`
`03:00.53`	`RPG_`	`never got to that part`
`03:01.16`	`blast007`	`that would be cool`
`03:01.23`	`RPG_`	`but my website, http://www.garrettsites.net , is running on it`
`03:01.30`	`RPG_`	`it's called phpSite Manager`
`03:02.23`	`blast007`	`cool`
`03:02.25`	`RPG_`	`biggest achievment: photo gallery and visitor tracking`
`03:02.31`	`RPG_`	`it took me like 4 months`
`03:03.03`	`RPG_`	`it resizes your photos for you to fit onscreen~`
`03:03.04`	`RPG_`	`!`
`03:03.12`	`blast007`	`cool`
`03:03.28`	`RPG_`	`for some reason that' smy favorite feature`
`03:03.43`	`RPG_`	`because then i don' thave to resize them myself`
`03:03.43`	`blast007`	`:)`
`03:03.49`	`*** join/#bzflag Quol (~QS@modemcable131.110-70-69.mc.videotron.ca)`
`03:08.55`	`*** join/#bzflag PUA1 (PUA1@cpe-24-170-104-248.sport.res.rr.com)`
`03:15.21`	`*** join/#bzflag bz6297 (~cc53de8d@webchat.bzflag.bz)`
`03:38.18`	`*** part/#bzflag RPG_ (~G-bus@c-24-15-87-171.hsd1.il.comcast.net)`
`03:53.40`	`*** join/#bzflag ibot (ibot@apt.bot.TimRiker.active.supporter.pdpc)`
`03:53.40`	`*** topic/#bzflag is http://BZFlag.org/ \|\| http://my.BZFlag.org/bb/ \|\| http://my.BZFlag.org/ \|\| http://cia.navi.cx/stats/project/BZFlag \|\| http://BZFlag.org/wiki/GettingHelp \|\| http://BZFlag.org/wiki/Download \|\| http://bzflag.org/wiki/MapMaking`
`03:53.40`	`*** mode/#bzflag [+o ibot] by ChanServ`
`04:04.38`	`*** join/#bzflag SportChick (~SportChic@ca-redbch-cuda1-c3b-b-183.stmnca.adelphia.net)`
`04:10.43`	`*** join/#bzflag bz5135 (~456fb7c4@webchat.bzflag.bz)`
`04:11.22`	`*** join/#bzflag Pimpinella (~frank@p54819261.dip0.t-ipconnect.de)`
`04:11.30`	`*** part/#bzflag ds (~ds@dsl081-053-082.sfo1.dsl.speakeasy.net)`
`04:13.23`	`*** join/#bzflag SC (~SportChic@ca-redbch-cuda1-c3b-b-183.stmnca.adelphia.net)`
`04:29.52`	`*** join/#bzflag jomojo (~jomojo@c-24-17-68-130.hsd1.wa.comcast.net)`
`04:31.32`	`*** join/#bzflag Legoguy (~Legoguy@adsl-68-77-5-191.dsl.emhril.ameritech.net)`
`04:44.02`	`*** join/#bzflag bz5135 (~456fb7c4@webchat.bzflag.bz)`
`04:45.30`	`*** join/#bzflag Tegan (~lyra@eacb02-00-cmmgga-70-34-176-23.atlaga.adelphia.net)`
`05:25.50`	`Pimpinella`	`nickserv help`
`05:26.18`	`Tegan`	`Pimpinella: try /msg nickserv help`
`05:27.11`	`Pimpinella`	`yeah, nickserv doesn't require /msg though /nickserv will do. just forgot the slash`
`05:27.34`	`Tegan`	`oh, I didn't know that, thanks`
`05:35.27`	`*** part/#bzflag Tegan (~lyra@eacb02-00-cmmgga-70-34-176-23.atlaga.adelphia.net)`
`05:36.58`	`TimRiker`	`Pimpinella: and /ns works too.`
`05:37.22`	`*** join/#bzflag Tupone (~Tupone@host-84-222-139-232.cust-adsl.tiscali.it)`
`05:37.23`	`*** mode/#bzflag [+v Tupone] by ChanServ`
`05:37.25`	`TimRiker`	`as do /ms and /cs etc.`
`05:37.51`	`Aribeth`	`hi SportChick`
`05:37.54`	`SportChick`	`hi ari`
`05:38.22`	`*** join/#bzflag bzflagwiz_ (~wiz@12-217-171-34.client.mchsi.com)`
`05:38.25`	`SportChick`	`there's a load of people playing on sp right now, ari`
`05:38.44`	`Aribeth`	`ahh, Giza is hoppin too`
`05:38.55`	`Aribeth`	`hi wiz`
`05:50.15`	`*** join/#bzflag Legoguy (~Legoguy@adsl-68-77-17-18.dsl.emhril.ameritech.net)`
`06:24.48`	`*** join/#bzflag _Manu_ (~jujibo@98.Red-80-36-59.pooles.rima-tde.net)`
`06:26.46`	`hardwire`	`hehe`
`06:38.14`	`creeperz`	`Chocolate Lucky Charms > j00r face`
`06:50.23`	`*** join/#bzflag creeperz (Meatwad@host-57-142-230-24.midco.net)`
`07:15.20`	`*** join/#bzflag LePoulpe303 (~LePoulpe3@AMontpellier-251-1-46-200.w81-251.abo.wanadoo.fr)`
`07:17.33`	`TimRiker`	`~bzflist17`
`07:17.38`	`TimRiker`	`hmm`
`07:21.15`	`LePoulpe303`	`Hi all !`
`07:24.45`	`TimRiker`	`~bzflist17`
`07:36.51`	`LePoulpe303`	`anyone knows what is the number between square brackets after player name on bzflag Hud ?`
`07:38.07`	`TimRiker`	`LePoulpe303: not sure I recall. but I expect it's the "slot number"`
`07:38.37`	`TimRiker`	`more or less the order in which you connected. (on an empty server)`
`07:39.07`	`TimRiker`	`it's just important that all players see you with the same number. the value is not important.`
`07:39.08`	`rkr`	`I thought that was the number of TK's you've done...`
`07:39.26`	`TimRiker`	`oh. perhaps the one I see is only with debug. =)`
`07:39.38`	`TimRiker`	`~pi`
`07:39.38`	`ibot`	`somebody said pi was 3.141592653589793238462643383279502884197169399375105820974944592307816406286208998628034825342117067982148086513282306647093844609550582231725359408128481117450284102701938521105559644622948954930381964428810975665933446128475648233786783165271201909145648566923460348610454326648213393607260249141273724587006606315588174881520920962829254091`
`07:40.17`	`rkr`	`That's not right. You either need a trailing ... to show that it keeps on going, or else you need to keep on going...forever. (^&`
`07:44.02`	`_Manu_`	`LePoulpe303, you mean the number after the email string?`
`07:44.43`	`_Manu_`	`after it.. is a ratio and depends the sort order you selected`
`07:45.12`	`_Manu_`	`if is before... [number] that's the teammates you killed (tks)`
`07:45.26`	`TimRiker`	`=)`
`07:45.43`	`creeperz`	`:-P`
`07:46.00`	`TimRiker`	`LePoulpe303: you mean after the score? LePoulpe303 where do you see the [] ?`
`07:46.05`	`_Manu_`	`if the number is after the cyan sign (+ - @) this is the slot number, only visible for players with kick/ban rights`
`07:46.09`	`creeperz`	`now i dont have to worry about being banned >.<`
`07:51.39`	`_Manu_`	`LePoulpe303, actually score lis is composed by: score wins-loses [tks] kills against the player sign slot - callsign emailstring ratio`
`07:51.45`	`_Manu_`	`s/lis/list`
`07:52.33`	`_Manu_`	`where ratio is only visible sorting by some options, and slot number only visible for admins/cops...`
`07:52.51`	`_Manu_`	`and of course this is only valid for CVS version`
`07:54.14`	`_Manu_`	`/unmute LePoulpe303 kk`
`08:00.21`	`rkr`	`Why not make slot number always visible?`
`08:00.42`	*** join/#bzflag kyelewis` (~kyelewis@kyelewis.staff.freematrix)
`08:02.30`	`rkr`	`Hm...`
`08:03.00`	`rkr`	`....`
`08:03.52`	`rkr`	`What is the normal directory for bzflag data? (It seems that when I ran a test build from CVS, and had to supply "-directory ../../data", it messed with my config file and now bzflag can't find the installed data on my system...)`
`08:06.07`	`rkr`	`(That is, relative to --prefix, where does bzflag normally install stuff...)`
`08:06.58`	`_Manu_`	`rkr, because useless... only usefull for admins`
`08:07.26`	`_Manu_`	`but I can add slots also to common users commands like /msg`
`08:08.04`	`_Manu_`	`then you can do /msg #number the message text`
`08:08.37`	`_Manu_`	`easy when callsign is long or using symbols and chars mixed`
`08:11.13`	`GvzEvxre`	`rkr: it varies. /usr/share/bzflag on debian.`
`08:11.22`	`_Manu_`	`your data dir depends from your distro`
`08:11.41`	`_Manu_`	`in sourcemage is /usr/share/games/bzflag`
`08:11.52`	`_Manu_`	`but you can put it everywhere`
`08:12.01`	`GvzEvxre`	`yeah, that's it. everywhere.`
`08:12.28`	`_Manu_`	`GvzEvxre, yes.. still not sleeping ;-p`
`08:12.43`	`_Manu_`	`my english is not very good.. heh`
`08:12.47`	`purple_cow`	`GvzEvxre: if you put it everywhere, it's bound to work!`
`08:13.03`	`_Manu_`	`purple_cow, lol :)`
`08:14.38`	`LePoulpe303`	`GvzEvxre, : thnaks for your previous reply :)`
`08:17.03`	`_Manu_`	`LePoulpe303, you mean after or before the callsign? ;)`
`08:19.29`	`LePoulpe303`	`_Manu_, something like _manu_ 8/0 [2] <--- this one`
`08:19.48`	`_Manu_`	`yes i knew.. but that's before... ;)`
`08:20.25`	`_Manu_`	`and means.. the teammates you killed :)`
`08:20.28`	`LePoulpe303`	`ok apologize ; that's before i just checked it :)`
`08:20.37`	`LePoulpe303`	`that's before score`
`08:21.11`	`LePoulpe303`	`Huh ... ok leave it ; see what i men`
`08:21.13`	`LePoulpe303`	`:)`
`08:22.14`	`_Manu_`	`and 8/0 [2] is invalid... must be 8/2 [2] ;)`
`08:22.50`	`_Manu_`	`because every teamkill is a lose`
`08:22.51`	`LePoulpe303`	`i never said i was the player`
`08:23.00`	`LePoulpe303`	`lmao`
`08:23.23`	`_Manu_`	`you should write: Manu 8/0 [0] ;-p`
`08:24.16`	`LePoulpe303`	`you're right`
`08:24.23`	`_Manu_`	`or: Manu 0/8 [2] ... one more and kicked :/`
`08:24.35`	`rkr`	`_Manu_: pkgsrc puts it wherever the build system prefers, unless there's a compelling conflict. so it's up to bzflag.`
`08:24.47`	`rkr`	`I found it, in $(PREFIX)/share/bzflag`
`08:25.02`	`_Manu_`	`yes default.. but every distro change it`
`08:25.45`	`*** part/#bzflag LePoulpe303 (~LePoulpe3@AMontpellier-251-1-46-200.w81-251.abo.wanadoo.fr)`
`08:25.47`	`*** join/#bzflag LePoulpe303 (~LePoulpe3@AMontpellier-251-1-46-200.w81-251.abo.wanadoo.fr)`
`08:26.28`	`rkr`	`The default is what I was asking after, though.`
`08:26.54`	`rkr`	`(And I'm not using a "distro". No LINUX here, these days. (^&)`
`08:27.10`	`_Manu_`	`what OS are you using?`
`08:27.24`	`rkr`	`NetBSD. (^&`
`08:27.39`	`*** join/#bzflag ChipX86 (~chipx86@ChipX86.galago)`
`08:27.45`	`rkr`	`(hm. I wonder if others would find it nice to be able to specify that flags only appear on the groudn, but can be dropped anywhere?)`
`08:27.47`	`_Manu_`	`ah.. yes`
`08:29.15`	`rkr`	`(On a map I'm fooling with, there's lots of areas that are "difficult" (i.e., slow) to get to from the ground, but you can always get to the ground quickly. Over time, by selection, flags wind up on top of "buildings" (boxes). I don't mind if players stash flags up there, but having the server drop them there can be a problem...)`
`08:31.27`	`trepan`	`you using -fb ?`
`08:31.40`	`rkr`	`Yes.`
`08:31.43`	`trepan`	`why?`
`08:31.50`	`rkr`	`If I didn't, players couldn't leave flags on top of buildings, could they?`
`08:32.05`	`rkr`	`(E.g., team flags...(^&)`
`08:32.11`	`trepan`	`ah, there is that... thought Tup changed it`
`08:32.35`	`trepan`	`you could specify zones on the ground`
`08:32.40`	`rkr`	`Changed which? Maybe it works the way I'd like and I just didn't know...`
`08:32.41`	`trepan`	`(that didn't encompass buildings)`
`08:32.44`	`rkr`	`Hm.`
`08:33.18`	`rkr`	`By not encompassing buildings...you mean not under any floating platforms and not under any boxes on the ground? Or just the latter?`
`08:33.38`	`rkr`	`(I have lots of boxes at various degrees of rotation.)`
`08:35.00`	`purple_cow`	`not over floating platforms`
`08:35.31`	`purple_cow`	`if the logic is at all similar to the way mac & i originally designed it, it will choose a random height and then search downward for obstacles, so if it's above a platform, it could land on it`
`08:36.56`	`rkr`	`That seems to be what is happening right now.`
`08:37.30`	`*** join/#bzflag Birdie (~birdie@d51A465C1.access.telenet.be)`
`08:38.26`	`rkr`	`I guess there's really only one big anulus where I really don't want flags to spawn. Probably won't be any more areas like that...`
`08:42.05`	`rkr`	`Hm. Another way to go might be some kind of tag to say whether a particular box can have a flag spawn on it...`
`08:42.53`	`rkr`	`If the tag says "no", then pass it by...dunno how much complication that would add to flag spawning...`
`08:43.27`	`Pimpinella`	`not much i think`
`08:44.52`	`trepan`	`if you're going to do it, might as well throw player spawns in too`
`08:45.15`	`rkr`	`(^&`
`08:49.46`	`Pimpinella`	`_Manu_: how about your anjuta2 tests?`
`08:49.59`	`_Manu_`	`bad, really bad :/`
`08:50.04`	`Pimpinella`	`:(`
`08:50.31`	`_Manu_`	`I'll wait for the next version`
`08:51.07`	`_Manu_`	`because in this version: lot's of changes... lot's of bugs`
`08:51.22`	`Pimpinella`	`yeah, it's marked unstable`
`08:51.41`	`_Manu_`	`oh!.. didn't noticed :/`
`08:51.58`	`Pimpinella`	`they call it unstable and alpha`
`08:52.07`	`_Manu_`	`heh.. that's explains all`
`08:53.12`	`_Manu_`	`yes.. i'm reading it.. and may not be suitable for production use...`
`08:53.34`	`*** part/#bzflag ChipX86 (~chipx86@ChipX86.galago)`
`08:53.47`	`_Manu_`	`I wonder why is named anjuta 2.0.0 ...should be pre.. or alpha`
`08:54.39`	`Pimpinella`	`they probably had not enough testers, so they made it 2.0 to attract more ppl`
`08:54.50`	`_Manu_`	`yes... more victims like me :/`
`08:54.58`	`Pimpinella`	`hehe`
`08:55.05`	`_Manu_`	`I spent many time making it working`
`08:55.21`	`_Manu_`	`now it works.. but still sometimes bad behaviour`
`08:55.43`	`Pimpinella`	`is it already in sourcemage or did you build from source?`
`08:56.06`	`_Manu_`	`it's in sourcemage.. but had to change lot's of things for making it run`
`08:56.53`	`_Manu_`	`but not because sourcemage.. was because anjuta..`
`08:57.34`	`Pimpinella`	`ack, thats why i use debian. it sometimes takes a while until new stuff makes it into unstable, but when it's in there you can expect it working`
`08:57.34`	`_Manu_`	`failing when tried to compile, because not resolved some dependencies`
`08:58.14`	`_Manu_`	`yes... i remember.... in woody.. bzflag 1.7e4... enought stable (irony)`
`08:58.23`	`_Manu_`	`:)`
`08:58.39`	`Pimpinella`	`hey, woody is oldstable`
`08:58.42`	`Pimpinella`	`;)`
`08:58.50`	`_Manu_`	`I hope Sid will become stable for the 2010 ;-p`
`08:59.03`	`Pimpinella`	`surely not`
`08:59.18`	`_Manu_`	`well.. perhaps 2030?`
`08:59.20`	`Pimpinella`	`sid never becomes stable`
`08:59.37`	`_Manu_`	`ic heh`
`09:00.24`	`Pimpinella`	`sid is always unstable, the new version will start from testing`
`09:01.54`	`Pimpinella`	`testing is actually 'etch'`
`09:02.20`	`_Manu_`	`well.. then replace sid for etch ;)`
`09:02.33`	`_Manu_`	`in my last sentences..`
`09:03.49`	`Pimpinella`	`the new debian project leader will try to shorten release cycles`
`09:04.13`	`Pimpinella`	`at least thats what he said`
`09:04.59`	`_Manu_`	`yes, yes... i heard it earlier :) but they also says.. they weren't afraid about it...`
`09:05.43`	`Pimpinella`	`no, the former wasn't really pressing it...`
`09:06.02`	`_Manu_`	`and I found sourcemage very stable.. never had a problem.. and using the most recents programs versions`
`09:06.33`	`_Manu_`	`and kernel`
`09:15.40`	`ruskie`	`O.o`
`09:17.10`	`ruskie`	`nothing wrong with those... imho...`
`09:17.33`	`_Manu_`	`less new devices support is not less?`
`09:17.48`	`purple_cow`	`there's lots wrong with them, but depending on your config you may not care ;)`
`09:17.48`	`_Manu_`	`errrr wrong..`
`09:18.03`	`Pimpinella`	`frank@lulu:~$ uname -r`
`09:18.04`	`Pimpinella`	`2.4.31-frank`
`09:18.28`	`Pimpinella`	`no need to upgrade yet`
`09:18.30`	`ruskie`	`I wonder if anyone is still runing a 2.0.x kernel`
`09:18.30`	`_Manu_`	`mine is 2.6.11.11`
`09:18.33`	`Chestal`	`2.4.18 here :-)`
`09:18.44`	`ruskie`	`2.6.12-rc6-loki`
`09:18.55`	`purple_cow`	`in particular, 2.4's usb support is flaky at best`
`09:19.01`	`_Manu_`	`ruskie, heh.. i had no time for compiling yet :)`
`09:19.12`	`ruskie`	`well the normal .12 is out`
`09:19.16`	`ruskie`	`I really should upgrade...`
`09:19.41`	`ruskie`	`since it has some via fixes it seems...`
`09:19.58`	`ruskie`	`but I was on .6 for ages then on .10 now I might be on .12 for a while...`
`09:20.24`	`Pimpinella`	`there had been significant improvements since 2.4.18`
`09:20.30`	`ruskie`	`only reason I updated was due to agpgart being improved but I didn't notice much improvement on my box...`
`09:20.33`	`Pimpinella`	`i still had problems on it`
`09:20.38`	`_Manu_`	`Pimpinella, you have a Frank kernel ;)`
`09:20.47`	`Pimpinella`	`yep ;)`
`09:20.47`	`Chestal`	`running 2.6.10 at home. Only thing that bugs me is the half-baked SATA support, and I am too lazy to install a patch. As far as I can see, it hasn't changed in .11 and .12`
`09:20.52`	`ruskie`	`still thinking of switching back to .6`
`09:21.17`	`purple_cow`	`Chestal: not really surprising - the sata stuff is pretty new`
`09:21.42`	`_Manu_`	`well.. 2.4 series still working with cdrtools without patches`
`09:21.47`	`Chestal`	`well, it works. It is now done via SCSI layer`
`09:21.56`	`ruskie`	`and 2.6 up to .6 or .7`
`09:22.06`	`Chestal`	`but this also seems to mean that it doesn't support direct ATA commands`
`09:22.12`	`ruskie`	`hmmm does 2.4.31 support nptl?`
`09:22.13`	`Chestal`	`needed to do SMART`
`09:22.26`	`purple_cow`	`Chestal: anything worth anything goes through the scsi layer nowadays`
`09:22.27`	`Chestal`	`there is a patch, no idea why it does not make its way into the main branch`
`09:23.00`	`ruskie`	`Chestal?`
`09:23.15`	`ruskie`	`patch for?`
`09:23.26`	`Chestal`	`talkign about SMART suppoort for SATA`
`09:23.30`	`ruskie`	`ahhh`
`09:23.53`	`Chestal`	`well, not only smart,other ATA commands as well`
`09:24.38`	`Chestal`	`well, at least I was able to install Debian onmy SATA disk withotu any glitch, unlike XP...`
`09:24.45`	`ruskie`	`lol`
`09:25.10`	`Chestal`	`for XP I needed to install trusty old floppy disc`
`09:25.49`	`ruskie`	`floppy seems to be the only constant anywhere`
`09:25.49`	`Chestal`	`(and that was a SP2 level XP)`
`09:26.23`	`Pimpinella`	`XP is for experimental, no? ;)`
`09:26.34`	`ruskie`	`nooo`
`09:26.43`	`ruskie`	`xtreme performance :)`
`09:27.07`	`*** join/#bzflag Sporty (~SportChic@ca-redbch-cuda1-c3b-b-183.stmnca.adelphia.net)`
`09:40.42`	`*** join/#bzflag WolverineJrDUB (~Alex@host197-238.pool8290.interbusiness.it)`
`09:41.50`	`*** part/#bzflag _Manu_ (~jujibo@98.Red-80-36-59.pooles.rima-tde.net)`
`09:41.51`	`rkr`	`(apropos of about 50 lines back...)`
`09:42.05`	`ruskie`	`lol`
`09:45.28`	`jpa-`	`one comp with 2.2 still`
`09:46.20`	`rkr`	`What's the proper term for a transform that, say, sets: {x = x + z; y = y + z; z = z}.`
`09:46.28`	`rkr`	`I keep wanting to say "skew", but that's not right.`
`09:46.59`	`rkr`	`(Basically, slants objects according to their distance along some given vector, such as along the z axis.)`
`09:47.22`	*** join/#bzflag kyelewis` (~kyelewis@kyelewis.staff.freematrix)
`09:47.44`	`rkr`	`jpa-: I have a system with 3.99.3 kernel...(^&`
`09:49.22`	`purple_cow`	`rkr: shear?`
`09:49.42`	`rkr`	`Shear. Yes. (^&`
`09:50.13`	`rkr`	`Thanks, purple_cow. The term was hiding in my brain.`
`09:51.01`	`purple_cow`	`not an oft-used transformation`
`09:51.15`	`rkr`	`No. That makes a good excuse for my forgetting the term...`
`09:51.43`	`rkr`	`(I'm not using it as a matrix form, here, but shearing is the term I was looking for to describe something.)`
`09:52.12`	`jpa-`	`rkr: http://www.kapsi.fi/~jpa/stuff/bzw/`
`09:52.19`	`purple_cow`	`if you're just using it as a general description, skew is just as good a term`
`09:52.21`	`jpa-`	`(advertising again x)`
`09:52.40`	`rkr`	`To me, skew is a bit non-technical. Shearing, I thought, was better defined.`
`09:53.48`	`rkr`	`Hm. Thanks, jpa-. That might have come in handy if I'd known about it a few days ago...(^&`
`09:54.57`	`rkr`	`(LOoking at the "shift" keyword. I must have missed that in bzw(5), so my world-building script places objects explicitly...)`
`09:54.58`	`*** join/#bzflag Teppic (~Teppic@cpc1-cbly2-5-0-cust239.glfd.cable.ntl.com)`
`09:55.59`	`rkr`	`Oh, wait...spin/shift only work with meshboxes?`
`09:56.18`	`rkr`	`(I needed boxes. (^&)`
`09:56.41`	`rkr`	`However, it looks like some good docs...thanks.`
`09:56.59`	`trepan`	`works with boxes/pyrs, within limits`
`09:57.25`	`rkr`	`You can rotate boxes (not just meshboxes) around arbitrary axes?`
`09:57.38`	`trepan`	`try it`
`09:57.45`	`rkr`	`(^&`
`09:58.16`	`rkr`	`Writing some documentation at the moment, but I'll give it a try. Thanks.`
`10:42.24`	`*** join/#bzflag tango_ (~nome@adsl-ull-223-208.42-151.net24.it)`
`10:44.43`	`*** join/#bzflag jolie (~alex@jolie.active.supporter.pdpc)`
`10:44.43`	`*** mode/#bzflag [+v jolie] by ChanServ`
`10:45.39`	`jolie`	`wah morning`
`10:47.50`	`meacan`	`morning`
`10:53.38`	`rkr`	`Boo, jolie.`
`10:54.21`	`jolie`	`hmmmrrr`
`10:54.27`	`jolie`	`ich versteh nichts.`
`10:55.10`	`*** join/#bzflag zaph (~d98017d4@webchat.bzflag.bz)`
`10:55.27`	`zaph`	`hi!`
`10:55.44`	`jolie`	`i think.. theres was a flaw somewhere.. and some private pics of me were shown...`
`10:55.53`	`jolie`	`wich doesnt make me very happy about it...`
`10:56.16`	`zaph`	`where`
`10:56.48`	`rkr`	`The only pics I've seen which I suppose include you are the ones you pointed out with your son...`
`10:56.58`	`zaph`	`its a pitty though that we all have "no" faces!!!!`
`10:57.15`	`jolie`	`well this ones points a lot more of me...`
`10:57.16`	`jolie`	`hmrmmrr`
`10:57.22`	`jolie`	`<- NOT HAPPY`
`10:57.24`	`jpa-`	`link?`
`10:57.42`	`rkr`	`I suspect that jolie is not going to give that link...`
`10:57.49`	`zaph`	`anultimatearena by zaphod`
`10:58.09`	`zaph`	`sty...got it ;-)`
`10:58.31`	`zaph`	`so...link jolie!`
`10:58.36`	`jolie`	`oh i can`
`10:58.43`	`jolie`	`i though was something worse...`
`10:58.44`	`jolie`	`heh`
`10:59.18`	`zaph`	`link?`
`10:59.39`	`jolie`	`i dont think this is the right chan for it.`
`10:59.41`	`jolie`	`:D`
`10:59.51`	`zaph`	`he must look very bad ;-)`
`10:59.56`	`jpa-`	`*she`
`11:00.00`	`jolie`	`thx jpa-`
`11:00.10`	`zaph`	`sorry!!!`
`11:00.15`	`jpa-`	`and no, no she doesn't :)`
`11:00.22`	`jolie`	`heh`
`11:00.31`	`jolie`	`sheesh freaking out cause you can see my tattoo`
`11:00.33`	`jolie`	`bah.`
`11:00.36`	`zaph`	`i speak french)`
`11:00.45`	`jolie`	`je nes comprend pas.`
`11:00.46`	`zaph`	`with that name!`
`11:00.49`	`jpa-`	`aah, i've seen that tattoo pic`
`11:00.59`	`zaph`	`you know what it means?`
`11:04.22`	`zaph`	`i need a little help: lag problem on my server....`
`11:04.43`	`zaph`	`but only the admin ...`
`11:05.13`	`zaph`	`get between 200-8000ms lag...anybody knows why?`
`11:05.46`	`jpa-`	`bzadmin?`
`11:06.23`	`jpa-`	`bzadmin doesn't track lag correctly, and it doesn't matter anything if it has big lag`
`11:06.44`	`zaph`	`ok..thks!`
`11:07.14`	`zaph`	`but why have some players big lag others don't? ISP or my server?`
`11:07.39`	`jpa-`	`their isp`
`11:07.54`	`jpa-`	`if everybody except you have big lag on your server, it is your connection`
`11:08.44`	`zaph`	`what is the minimum bandwith in/out to run a good server?`
`11:09.56`	`jpa-`	`5KByte/s/player`
`11:10.12`	`jpa-`	`so for 10 players, you need 50KByte upstream`
`11:10.25`	`*** join/#bzflag mmu_man (~revol@ALyon-253-1-25-207.w83-205.abo.wanadoo.fr)`
`11:10.25`	`jpa-`	`that is for example 1M/512 ADSL`
`11:10.56`	`zaph`	`ok...THX jpa-!!!!`
`11:11.12`	`zaph`	`and what is with the jolie link???`
`11:11.18`	`jolie`	`hmrrrrr`
`11:11.34`	`jpa-`	`she is too hot for you`
`11:11.43`	`zaph`	`sorry ;-)`
`11:11.57`	`zaph`	`and angry too...`
`11:12.06`	`jolie`	`bwahaha`
`11:12.08`	`jolie`	`blondie`
`11:12.10`	`jolie`	`nah`
`11:12.16`	`jolie`	`check the other chan`
`11:12.21`	`jolie`	`for the link`
`11:12.38`	`zaph`	`try to shoot some tanks...might help to feel better`
`11:15.00`	`jpa-`	`i'm no blonde!`
`11:20.50`	`zaph`	`ok alexandra ... i can understand why you are not happy!`
`11:21.08`	`zaph`	`that is tooooo much that pic`
`11:22.01`	`rkr`	`Ah, breakfast is about ready.`
`11:22.19`	`rkr`	`Other channel?`
`11:22.37`	`jpa-`	`bunny-huggers private channel`
`11:22.40`	`jpa-`	`only for the cutest`
`11:22.50`	`rkr`	`I'm cute, for a pumpkin.`
`11:23.16`	`jpa-`	`you need to hug the bunny too`
`11:23.30`	`jolie`	`are you making advtising blondie?`
`11:23.32`	`jolie`	`hmmm`
`11:23.36`	`jolie`	`no hugs!`
`11:23.41`	`jolie`	`come on.`
`11:23.54`	`zaph`	`later ....`
`11:24.00`	`rkr`	`Ah well, I tried.`
`11:24.26`	`rkr`	`You mentioned tatoos a while back...reminds me of a big formal wedding I went to when my friend Wendy remarried her ex...`
`11:24.46`	`rkr`	`(They hadn't had a formal wedding the first time around.)`
`11:25.22`	`rkr`	`At the reception, I wound up sitting at a kind of "misc." table. There I was, with about 4 or 5 others, including the priest and the stripper...`
`11:26.31`	`zaph`	`gtg...bye!`
`11:26.36`	`*** part/#bzflag zaph (~d98017d4@webchat.bzflag.bz)`
`11:40.46`	`*** join/#bzflag Tupone (~atupone@host-84-222-139-232.cust-adsl.tiscali.it)`
`11:42.01`	`jolie`	`bye guys and girlies`
`11:45.59`	`*** join/#bzflag _Manu_ (~jujibo@98.Red-80-36-59.pooles.rima-tde.net)`
`11:48.47`	`*** mode/#bzflag [+v Tupone] by ChanServ`
`11:51.18`	`rkr`	`On some maps, a world weapon shockwave clears basecampers from a team's base when their flag is captured.`
`11:51.43`	`rkr`	`Is that going to be in the next release, is it a custom hack/patch, or is it something that's already in there, somewhere?`
`11:52.20`	`*** join/#bzflag brad2901 (brad2901@cm-84.118.229.169.chello.no)`
`11:53.07`	`brad2901`	`test`
`11:53.23`	`*** part/#bzflag brad2901 (brad2901@cm-84.118.229.169.chello.no)`
`11:54.45`	`Tupone`	`it is already here`
`11:55.15`	`Tupone`	`a little change to world file, dunno the detail though`
`11:56.04`	`*** join/#bzflag [brad] (brad2901@cm-84.118.229.169.chello.no)`
`11:59.13`	`*** join/#bzflag Tupone (~atupone@host-84-222-139-232.cust-adsl.tiscali.it)`
`11:59.32`	`*** mode/#bzflag [+v Tupone] by ChanServ`
`12:00.39`	`rkr`	`Ah, thanks, Tupone.`
`12:00.46`	`*** join/#bzflag Mayhem (~Mayhem@dsl-202-173-156-152.vic.westnet.com.au)`
`12:05.02`	`*** join/#bzflag [brad] (brad2901@cm-84.118.229.169.chello.no)`
`12:05.50`	`rkr`	`'trigger oncap', it looks like.`
`12:05.51`	`*** part/#bzflag [brad] (brad2901@cm-84.118.229.169.chello.no)`
`12:08.32`	`Tupone`	`you can download their world and see, i suppose`
`12:13.22`	`rkr`	`It doesn't seem to be there in the release, actually. Unrecognized option.`
`12:13.35`	`rkr`	`So, "next release" was the answer, methinks...(^&`
`12:14.08`	`rkr`	`(Trying to get my hands on their world file seemed harder than a quick check on the sources...)`
`12:15.06`	`Tupone`	`hei orchid. Ciao`
`12:15.34`	`orchid`	`ciao Tupone`
`12:16.00`	`Tupone`	`you're attached now? To what ?`
`12:16.25`	`orchid`	`my terminal`
`12:17.11`	`Tupone`	`:)`
`12:19.31`	`orchid`	`time for some breakfast`
`12:47.12`	`*** join/#bzflag Mikk (~Mikk@c-24-60-204-79.hsd1.ma.comcast.net)`
`12:59.17`	`rkr`	`Don't put the solvent on your breakfast.`
`13:30.10`	`*** join/#bzflag brad2901_ (brad2901@cl-45.sto-01.se.sixxs.net)`
`13:37.02`	`*** join/#bzflag Blue_Eyes (~d55c2010@genesis.concept69.de)`
`13:40.23`	`Grumbler`	`pain and sorrow in the air, people dying everywhere, but happy birthday, ugh, happy birthday, ugh ....welcome to old age. :)`
`13:42.42`	`*** part/#bzflag Blue_Eyes (~d55c2010@genesis.concept69.de)`
`13:45.37`	`Grumbler`	`http://www.galkire.net/pre_BBQ/images/DSCN1833_edited-1.jpg not a bad photo really.....`
`13:54.47`	`*** join/#bzflag DeathBarrel (~Death@adsl-70-247-47-30.dsl.hstntx.swbell.net)`
`14:01.57`	`rkr`	`Who's old, Grumbler?`
`14:02.26`	`Grumbler`	`we all are.....its all relative`
`14:02.44`	`rkr`	`Only in Arkansas is it all relative.`
`14:06.52`	`Grumbler`	`heh`
`14:16.37`	`*** join/#bzflag Tupone (~atupone@host-84-222-139-232.cust-adsl.tiscali.it)`
`14:17.17`	`*** mode/#bzflag [+v Tupone] by ChanServ`
`14:46.01`	`*** join/#bzflag blast007 (~blast007@24-196-92-143.jvl.wi.charter.com)`
`14:54.56`	`*** join/#bzflag bryjen (~bryjen@63.147.94.151)`
`15:03.09`	`*** join/#bzflag bob37 (aussie@dialup-219.86.221.203.acc50-stge-pth.comindico.com.au)`
`15:05.34`	`bob37`	`hi all`
`15:06.04`	`bob37`	`anyone here using gentoo for bzflag?`
`15:09.21`	`bob37`	`darth_mall does it run well under gentoo?`
`15:11.04`	`darth_mall`	`yeah`
`15:11.15`	`darth_mall`	`the distro shouldn't affect the performance of the game`
`15:11.31`	`darth_mall`	`s/shouldn't/doesn't/`
`15:12.51`	`*** join/#bzflag bob27 (aussie@dialup-234.86.221.203.acc50-stge-pth.comindico.com.au)`
`15:13.52`	`bob27`	`am i here`
`15:14.11`	`darth_mall`	`yes`
`15:14.13`	`darth_mall`	`twice`
`15:14.24`	`bob27`	`Oh good, yeah something not right`
`15:14.56`	`bob27`	`I'm using this old 486 33mhz computer with virus 95 and its not easy to use`
`15:15.14`	`bob27`	`Its a very old laptop, trying to get gentoo to behave :(`
`15:16.12`	`Pimpinella`	`umount /mnt`
`15:18.21`	`jpa-`	`Pimpinella: according to /proc/mtab /mnt is not mounted`
`15:18.26`	`darth_mall`	`bob37: if you're trying to play bzflag on that machine, that could explain any performance problems you're seeing`
`15:19.18`	`bob27`	`Nooooooo way, I have a athlon, but I"m in the process of trying to get X to install in the right place so I can run bzflag, :)`
`15:20.16`	`darth_mall`	`so... emerge xorg-x11?`
`15:20.51`	`bob27`	`what happens is it ends up in /usr/X11R6/X11R6 not /usr/X11R6`
`15:21.02`	`*** join/#bzflag Birdie (~birdie@d51A465C1.access.telenet.be)`
`15:22.45`	`jpa-`	`bob27: umm.. you notice /usr/X11R6/X11R6 is a symlink?`
`15:23.28`	`bob27`	`yeah but why`
`15:23.47`	`jpa-`	`actually /usr/X11R6 is a symlink too`
`15:24.24`	`bob27`	`Well I guess its ok, just looks messy.`
`15:24.30`	`darth_mall`	`bob37: does it work?`
`15:24.41`	`bob27`	`yeah kind of`
`15:25.19`	`bob27`	`I want to run bzflag with xfce4`
`15:25.50`	`jpa-`	`it is not really about that at all`
`15:26.11`	`jpa-`	`just run "emerge bzflag" ?`
`15:26.59`	`darth_mall`	`bob27: the distro, and window manager have no effect on the game`
`15:27.40`	`bob27`	`net is not setup on the machine, yet, but I might do it now. I found gnome, and kde to tend to slow game performance`
`15:27.54`	`jpa-`	`erm`
`15:28.05`	`jpa-`	`well why xfce4 then?`
`15:28.13`	`jpa-`	`plain xwindows would be the fastest`
`15:28.19`	`bob27`	`It just runs better.`
`15:28.31`	`*** join/#bzflag JeffM2501 (~JeffM@JeffM2501.sustaining.supporter.pdpc)`
`15:28.31`	`*** mode/#bzflag [+o JeffM2501] by ChanServ`
`15:28.35`	`darth_mall`	`bob27: that's not so much because of the desktop environment in particular, it's because the desktop environment is using resources`
`15:28.38`	`bob27`	`that is true :)`
`15:28.55`	`bob27`	`that's right`
`15:29.00`	`jpa-`	`should be fine anyway, as long as you have your 3d card drivers working`
`15:29.47`	`bob27`	`They did. in fc3, and I"m sure they will in gentoo as well. I better get too. thanks everyone.`
`15:40.31`	`darth_mall`	`jpa-: heh`
`15:43.24`	`Birdie`	`no more jpa in the bunny channel?`
`15:45.15`	`jpa-`	`nope`
`15:45.33`	`Birdie`	`reason?`
`15:45.53`	`jpa-`	`codacola`
`15:46.07`	`Birdie`	`lol`
`15:46.11`	`Birdie`	`is he asking to much,:)`
`15:46.18`	`jpa-`	`way too much`
`15:47.11`	`*** join/#bzflag menotume (~meno@menotume.active.supporter.pdpc)`
`15:47.44`	`darth_mall`	`oooh grapes`
`15:47.50`	`menotume`	`yummy <3`
`15:48.18`	`darth_mall`	`lol`
`15:48.24`	`darth_mall`	`good thing, too, I'd imagine`
`15:48.36`	`blast007`	`:)`
`15:48.41`	`darth_mall`	`heh`
`15:55.27`	`blast007`	`menotume: http://health.allrefer.com/health/heimlich-maneuver-on-self-info.html`
`15:55.31`	`blast007`	`hehe`
`15:56.46`	`menotume`	`whew, thanks`
`15:56.51`	`*** join/#bzflag CBG (~Matthew@cpc3-stme1-5-0-cust91.cdif.cable.ntl.com)`
`15:59.57`	`orchid`	`menotume: I can no longer tell new posts from old on the league forum, none are red anymore, even with removing all the my.bzflag.org cookies`
`16:00.17`	`menotume`	`hmmmm`
`16:00.25`	`menotume`	`ok, thx - i'll look`
`16:00.49`	`menotume`	`another dmp-bug probably :)`
`16:02.50`	`orchid`	`feature you mean`
`16:04.51`	`Birdie`	`!praise orchid`
`16:05.29`	`orchid`	`hi Birdie`
`16:05.45`	`Birdie`	`good...hm afternoon for you`
`16:09.37`	`*** join/#bzflag SportyGal (sportygali@67-21-174-30.stmnca.adelphia.net)`
`16:09.37`	`menotume`	`orchid: topics are only 'red' if new since your last login, it doesn't keep track if you read them`
`16:10.04`	`orchid`	`menotume: yes, but if I dont look for a week, still none are red`
`16:10.12`	`*** join/#bzflag CIA-1 (~CIA@flapjack.navi.cx) [NETSPLIT VICTIM]`
`16:11.24`	`*** join/#bzflag S1gn (~corwin@bzq-218-118-205.red.bezeqint.net)`
`16:15.15`	`*** join/#bzflag _Manu_ (~jujibo@98.Red-80-36-59.pooles.rima-tde.net)`
`16:18.44`	`JeffM2501`	`anyone know XML?`
`16:19.21`	`Chestal`	`<not really/>`
`16:19.42`	`JeffM2501`	`heh`
`16:20.22`	`Chestal`	`certainly the latter`
`16:22.07`	`JeffM2501`	`is this done right?`
`16:22.08`	`JeffM2501`	`http://pastebin.com/302547`
`16:23.37`	`*** join/#bzflag Blue_Eyes (~Blue_Eyes@62.123.2.79)`
`16:24.26`	`*** join/#bzflag SportyGal (sportygali@67-21-174-30.stmnca.adelphia.net)`
`16:24.42`	`Chestal`	`uhm, what is line 7 and 10?`
`16:24.54`	`Chestal`	`eh, forget 10`
`16:25.10`	`Chestal`	`is it allowed to have line breaks within a tag?`
`16:25.17`	`JeffM2501`	`I don't know :)`
`16:25.40`	`JeffM2501`	`I'm trying to infer from there samples`
`16:28.23`	`JeffM2501`	`ohh, bah, that first part is from there sample C code :)`
`16:28.42`	`meacan`	`:)`
`16:30.51`	`BearPerson`	`when you type a message and another one is sent while you're typing, the other message sets the message target for the one you're typing too`
`16:30.59`	`BearPerson`	`because both use the same messageMessage space`
`16:32.21`	`BearPerson`	`e.g. <z> "foo " <ctrl-F2> "bar" <enter>`
`16:32.31`	`BearPerson`	`"foo bar" gets sent to team instead of admin`
`16:35.08`	`JeffM2501`	`I was just going to say "fix it " :)`
`16:35.53`	`bryjen`	`so you're trying to send two messages at once?`
`16:36.04`	`JeffM2501`	`no he sends one, but one comes in while he's typing`
`16:36.14`	`JeffM2501`	`and the one that comes in, changes the target of the one he's typing`
`16:36.30`	`bryjen`	`no, he's using the quickkeys to send one whilest in the middle of typing one`
`16:36.31`	`CBG`	`Jeff: http://my.bzflag.org/bb/viewtopic.php?t=4253 ...`
`16:36.47`	`BearPerson`	`I'm quickfixing my version to just make the manual typing version use "messageMessageMessage" instead ;-)`
`16:36.51`	`BearPerson`	`bryjen, basically`
`16:36.56`	`JeffM2501`	`CBG, thanks`
`16:37.04`	`BearPerson`	`but there could be other automated bg stuff sending messages too`
`16:37.06`	`CBG`	`no promlem :)`
`16:37.29`	`JeffM2501`	`I do not know why china insists on that`
`16:37.49`	`bryjen`	`more pr0n from the far east?`
`16:37.55`	`JeffM2501`	`just adds`
`16:38.07`	`JeffM2501`	`they post in the plubic non reg sections`
`16:38.20`	`JeffM2501`	`this was for dvds`
`16:40.46`	`blast007`	`JeffM2501: I wonder if there's a phpbb hack to make guests have to type a verification code from an image before posting`
`16:41.03`	`blast007`	`that would weed out the auto-posting from spam bots`
`16:41.11`	`JeffM2501`	`I'm sure there is`
`16:41.15`	`JeffM2501`	`it happens like once a week`
`16:41.19`	`JeffM2501`	`I'm not worried about it`
`16:41.25`	`blast007`	`ah, ok`
`16:41.42`	`JeffM2501`	`if it gets too bad, we'd just close the reg forums and make it where they'd have to fill in a web form that sends a mail`
`16:41.58`	`CBG`	`good idea`
`16:42.09`	`JeffM2501`	`it's not like reg issues needs to be publicly viewable`
`16:42.14`	`CBG`	`yeah.`
`16:42.21`	`JeffM2501`	`it's actualy worse that it is`
`16:42.47`	`JeffM2501`	`but at that point I'd think it would be popular enough where there would have to be a dedicated support site`
`16:42.50`	`JeffM2501`	`for all issues`
`16:42.54`	`JeffM2501`	`like support.bzflag.org`
`16:43.12`	`JeffM2501`	`and have a group of people who are responsible for helping people`
`16:43.20`	`JeffM2501`	`probably split the boards at that time too`
`16:43.41`	`JeffM2501`	`into a user board, a team board, a dev board, and a support board.`
`16:43.58`	`JeffM2501`	`all pulling from the same userbase`
`16:44.46`	`JeffM2501`	`or at least that's how I'd split it if I had to deal with 20-30 thousand users`
`16:45.19`	`CBG`	`Well, we only have 3283 members so far. :P`
`16:45.23`	`JeffM2501`	`yeah`
`16:45.27`	`JeffM2501`	`so not really there yet :)`
`16:46.28`	`CBG`	`Hmm.. I'm only the 17th biggest poster... Lots more work to do. :P`
`16:48.41`	`BearPerson`	`hmm... my local cvs stuff has 10 files modified now...`
`16:50.19`	`CBG`	`that means you have chnaged AT LEAST 10 characters in total. Wow. :P`
`16:53.06`	`blast007`	`lol`
`17:00.07`	`*** join/#bzflag newbie_dont (~a@fw.newitech.pl)`
`17:01.08`	`BearPerson`	`heh`
`17:01.45`	`*** join/#bzflag Tupone (~Tupone@Tupone.active.supporter.pdpc)`
`17:01.45`	`*** mode/#bzflag [+v Tupone] by ChanServ`
`17:24.06`	`*** join/#bzflag Teppic (~Teppic@cpc1-cbly2-5-0-cust239.glfd.cable.ntl.com)`
`17:36.16`	`*** join/#bzflag Electric1lf (~david@a956ae43ce20f3cf.session.tor)`
`17:37.38`	`*** join/#bzflag Bagheera (~Grumbler@grumbler.bronze.supporter.pdpc)`
`17:47.36`	`Pimpinella`	`JeffM2501: how would i place an outside point qnd what beneits do i get from it?`
`17:47.54`	`Pimpinella`	`*benefits`
`17:49.43`	`JeffM2501`	`OO and colisions work better`
`17:49.53`	`JeffM2501`	`just make a point that is outside the object`
`17:50.03`	`JeffM2501`	`inside points help too`
`17:50.56`	`rkr`	`s/qnd/and/, as long as you're correcting your typos. (^&`
`17:51.02`	`Pimpinella`	`can i have several insides and outsides?`
`17:51.07`	`trepan`	`they can also wreak havoc, especially outside points`
`17:51.08`	`JeffM2501`	`ja`
`17:51.15`	`Pimpinella`	`klasse`
`17:51.19`	`trepan`	`i'd advise against using them, unless absolutely necessary`
`17:52.30`	`Pimpinella`	`i have boxes that allow shooting with OO while the tank should be sealed`
`17:52.39`	`Aribeth_away`	`trepan's the man`
`17:53.27`	`trepan`	`... who deleted the better version =)`
`17:53.42`	`Pimpinella`	`rkr: yep, i know that syntax, ty for being extraordinary helpful...`
`17:54.00`	`Pimpinella`	`~trepan`
`17:55.02`	`Pimpinella`	`~x en de havoc`
`17:55.27`	`Pimpinella`	`~dict havoc`
`17:55.41`	`JeffM2501`	`havoc == poopy`
`17:56.16`	`trepan`	`if it's just a box, then place an inside point at its center`
`17:56.46`	`trepan`	`you can see that meshboxes are built that way, if you save with 'set saveAsMeshes 1'`
`17:58.12`	`Pimpinella`	`actually it's a mesh, a simple box replacement with only 6 faces`
`17:58.32`	`bryjen`	`hmm, poopy ~= waste, but havoc implies more chaos and destruction`
`17:59.41`	`JeffM2501`	`poop isn't waste, plants LOVE it`
`18:00.15`	`bryjen`	`one man's poop is another plant's pleasure ;)`
`18:00.48`	`Pimpinella`	`hey, i have 300 square meters of poop here, want some?`
`18:04.10`	`rkr`	`Pimpinella: Re. the 'syntax', it wasn't the syntax I was pointing out. you had corrected one typo, but left the other uncorrected. That was the point. Neither correction was strictly required. But if one was 'extraordinarily helpful', then so was the other. (^& (I.e., relax, dude...)`
`18:07.08`	`*** join/#bzflag CBG (~Matthew@cpc3-stme1-5-0-cust91.cdif.cable.ntl.com)`
`18:09.48`	`*** join/#bzflag Newb (~184a5350@webchat.bzflag.bz)`
`18:10.17`	`Newb`	`What ports do I need to forward to serve a BZFlag game behind a router?`
`18:11.06`	`jpa-`	`a single port will be enough, but it has to be tcp/udp`
`18:11.18`	`Bagheera`	`bryjen< so by your statements you are not a man.......since you have implied that by using "another", had you used "a" then no implication would have been made......we can assume that since Pimpinella and rkr didnt correct your statement, then they to believe that plants are people and as such the invasion is taking hold and soon we will all become plants and live in the sewers.`
`18:11.18`	`jpa-`	`you can have server on any port, but 5154 is the default`
`18:11.38`	`Newb`	`only that one port? I don't need to forward any other ports?`
`18:11.44`	`rkr`	`Plants are people.`
`18:11.48`	`jpa-`	`yup, one port.`
`18:12.15`	`rkr`	`As a member of the invasion, however, I cannot comment upon it until after next Tuesday.`
`18:18.06`	`bryjen`	`err, uhm, o-k`
`18:29.17`	`*** join/#bzflag Baroness_ (~d8ada652@genesis.concept69.de)`
`18:33.06`	`*** join/#bzflag CBG (~Matthew@cpc3-stme1-5-0-cust91.cdif.cable.ntl.com)`
`18:33.25`	`Baroness_`	`howdy`
`18:40.25`	`*** join/#bzflag DTRemenak_ (~DTRemenak@DHCP-170-84.caltech.edu)`
`18:40.56`	`Tupone`	`rkr: I understand that you can provide a not huge file world that can break bzflag. I'm interested on it`
`18:41.48`	`*** mode/#bzflag [+v DTRemenak] by ChanServ`
`18:41.56`	`JeffM2501`	`Tupone, only on low ram systems`
`18:42.11`	`blast007`	`the main reason that it breaks bzflag is because his system runs out of virtual memory`
`18:42.13`	`Tupone`	`ok, trying to lower my ram`
`18:42.29`	`JeffM2501`	`basicly he has a new that returns NULL`
`18:42.53`	`Tupone`	`probably is just the one when loading the world`
`18:43.00`	`Tupone`	`one of the many :)`
`18:43.13`	`JeffM2501`	`trepan thought it would be in the octree stuff`
`18:46.08`	`S1gn`	`anybody wants to help me figure out why -synctime is not working properly?`
`18:48.26`	`Pimpinella`	`Bagheera: also plants have feelings sniff`
`18:48.48`	`trepan`	`S1gn: you also using -synclocation, and have lat and long setup?`
`18:49.32`	`rkr`	`Tupone: I think that you misunderstood. The only way I can break bzflag on a map is to cause it to run out of memory.`
`18:49.40`	`S1gn`	`trepan: nope, only -synctime. should I ?`
`18:49.54`	`Tupone`	`you're wrong :) I understood`
`18:50.17`	`rkr`	`JeffM: On any finite memory system. Unless you're using a Turing Machine, I can blow you out of the water too. Just let me shift a few decimal points...(^&`
`18:50.38`	`rkr`	`JeffM: If your new cannot return NULL, you have a broken system.`
`18:50.53`	`bryjen`	`here we go again...`
`18:51.05`	`blast007`	`:/`
`18:51.10`	`Tupone`	`rkr, with your memory I cannot start the audio thread, so I think audio not working at you is related to your VM space`
`18:51.16`	`rkr`	`(There's a simple way to catch this by a feature of new. Just define a handler...unless your new is non-compliant.)`
`18:51.34`	`rkr`	`Tupone: Um, audio is working.`
`18:51.49`	`Tupone`	`ahh you had to use -mute . No ?`
`18:52.08`	`rkr`	`Tupone Oh, you mean fur the custom build. Yeah. Normal build works fine with audio. (^&`
`18:52.32`	`Tupone`	`can you try your custom build with more VM space ... just to know`
`18:52.35`	`rkr`	`("custom build" is typo; meant build from latest CVS, manual)`
`18:52.49`	`Tupone`	`whatever ... I understood`
`18:52.55`	`rkr`	`Um, why would 128MB not be enough to load the opening screen and play a "click" for a menu item?`
`18:53.20`	`rkr`	`(I misunderstood which crash you were talking about. Sorry.)`
`18:53.21`	`Tupone`	`a thread starting ? dunno`
`18:54.44`	`Tupone`	`stop/Master-clear/start :) I was testing using ulimit, I saw that with low limit my audio thread does not start. COuld be that the audio not working with the CVS built bzflag is for too much low limit on you OS`
`18:54.51`	`Bagheera`	`Pimpinella< heh`
`18:55.10`	`rkr`	`Well, certainly threading generally works. (^& Is there a particular thing about bzflag's threading that makes it need a quarter gig or more of memory to play sounds?`
`18:55.29`	`rkr`	`It's possible, though...`
`18:55.48`	`JeffM2501`	`threading?`
`18:55.51`	`JeffM2501`	`what threading?`
`18:56.13`	`*** join/#bzflag BenUrban (~benurban@68.32.118.193)`
`18:56.24`	`Tupone`	`audio thread or process, depend on how SDL manage it`
`18:56.40`	`JeffM2501`	`well that's SDL, not bzflag :)`
`18:57.05`	`rkr`	`Hm. sysctl -a \ grep ^proc.currproc.rlimt.memoryuse.(hard\|soft): 5049956840 (i.e., about haltf a gig).`
`18:57.21`	`rkr`	`I'm not 100% sure that that's the limit I need to look at, though...`
`18:57.25`	`Tupone`	`I read about 128 M ?`
`18:57.32`	`rkr`	`Yes. I know.`
`18:57.42`	`Tupone`	`in the irc log. What was it ?`
`18:57.44`	`rkr`	`In the past, 128MB was the per-process limit for traditional NetBSD.`
`18:57.55`	`rkr`	`But they might have upped it for either the AMD64 or for NetBSD 3.x...`
`18:58.21`	`Tupone`	`so your virtual memory space is bigger now ?`
`18:58.23`	`rkr`	`I'm looking for another sysctl variable...I don't muck with these normally, so I may be looking at the wrong variable...but that one looks like a good candiate.`
`18:58.37`	`JeffM2501`	`wow my debug version only uses 25 meg when siting at the menu screen`
`18:59.08`	`rkr`	`It may be bigger than 6 months ago. I'm not 100% sure. I remember a thread about changing the default, but don't remember that being actually done.`
`18:59.40`	`Tupone`	`okay, if that is too much, just for a test, no problem ... don't do it`
`19:00.25`	`rkr`	`No, it's not. But it takes a little while to scan 313 sysctl variables.`
`19:00.45`	`Tupone`	`ulimit ?`
`19:01.11`	`Bagheera`	`is there anyone adverse to a KillAllRogues flag?........a rogue version of genocide`
`19:01.21`	`DTRemenak`	`yes`
`19:01.26`	`rkr`	`Well, that's one way...(^& But you can't change the ulimit upwards without kernel permission.`
`19:01.36`	`DTRemenak`	`rogues are not a team`
`19:01.37`	`rkr`	`(Not above the kernel hard limit, anyway...)`
`19:01.51`	`Bagheera`	`DTRemenak< yeah, and your point is what`
`19:01.54`	`Tupone`	`mine is unlimited by default`
`19:02.04`	`BenUrban`	`Bagheera: do you get points for killing rogues that way?`
`19:02.05`	`DTRemenak`	`they get an advantage from not being killable by genocide, and they lose it again because all their "teammates" can kill them`
`19:02.07`	`JeffM2501`	`Bagheera, it's been vetoed many times before`
`19:02.15`	`BenUrban`	`Bagheera: suicide would cash in`
`19:02.26`	`*** join/#bzflag Rusure (~1815d19e@webchat.bzflag.bz)`
`19:02.42`	`Bagheera`	`BenUrban< that could be prevents`
`19:02.46`	`Bagheera`	`err, prevented`
`19:02.46`	`BenUrban`	`how so?`
`19:02.55`	`JeffM2501`	`what does it add to the game?`
`19:03.02`	`JeffM2501`	`just a 5th team?`
`19:03.05`	`Bagheera`	`another dimension`
`19:03.19`	`rkr`	`(I also don't use ulimit normally. Here are the values i get:`
`19:03.19`	`Bagheera`	`no, your thinking is limited`
`19:03.26`	`rkr`	`data(kbytes) 262144`
`19:03.26`	`rkr`	`stack(kbytes) 2048`
`19:03.26`	`rkr`	`lockedmem(kbytes) 164386`
`19:03.26`	`rkr`	`memory(kbytes) 493160`
`19:03.31`	`JeffM2501`	`Bagheera, no, I think yours is :)`
`19:03.35`	`DTRemenak`	`Bagheera: rogues are different, let them stay that way.`
`19:03.37`	`JeffM2501`	`they are not linked in any way`
`19:03.40`	`BenUrban`	`Bagheera: you're right, but watch your tone`
`19:03.41`	`BenUrban`	`lol`
`19:03.41`	`JeffM2501`	`they are indepenendet`
`19:03.48`	`rkr`	`I'm not sure if data (about 256MB) or memory is the right one.`
`19:03.48`	`Bagheera`	`heh, i dont think it makes rogue a team, and i find that argument very flawed`
`19:03.54`	`JeffM2501`	`if you could geno them then they would be linked in some way`
`19:03.59`	`BenUrban`	`Bagheera: it makes it half a team`
`19:04.04`	`JeffM2501`	`so if they are linked, why don't they have a base?`
`19:04.07`	`DTRemenak`	`it does, because if you have geno then you rely on your teammates not to get killed`
`19:04.11`	`BenUrban`	`well`
`19:04.11`	`BenUrban`	`1/3`
`19:04.19`	`BenUrban`	`oh wait`
`19:04.20`	`BenUrban`	`bases`
`19:04.20`	`BenUrban`	`1/4`
`19:04.20`	`BenUrban`	`lol`
`19:04.20`	`*** join/#bzflag DarthValou (~none@lsn-boi-catv-c126-p081.vtx.ch)`
`19:04.29`	`Bagheera`	`JeffM2501< use the argument, if the server owner doesnt want it, he doesnt have to have it`
`19:04.53`	`Bagheera`	`its much like rogues who team up to take out a powerful laser or GM`
`19:04.58`	`JeffM2501`	`Bagheera, if the server owner wanted another team he would have used green or blue`
`19:05.09`	`DTRemenak`	`no, it's not like rogues teaming up on someone, because it's INVOLUNTARY`
`19:05.14`	`Bagheera`	`yeah, but green and blue cant kill each other`
`19:05.17`	`DTRemenak`	`you're FORCED to rely on the other rogues`
`19:05.23`	`BenUrban`	`4 elements that make up a team in bzflag: the team flag, genocide, tk penalty, and shared base`
`19:05.27`	`*** part/#bzflag DarthValou (~none@lsn-boi-catv-c126-p081.vtx.ch)`
`19:05.27`	`Bagheera`	`DTRemenak< why do they have to team up?`
`19:05.27`	`DTRemenak`	`you lose your independence`
`19:05.39`	`JeffM2501`	`Bagheera, out of nesesity`
`19:05.40`	`Bagheera`	`BenUrban< i dont agree`
`19:05.41`	`BenUrban`	`because if they don't they die`
`19:05.51`	`BenUrban`	`Bagheera: is there some element i missed?`
`19:05.58`	`DTRemenak`	`yeah..if someone's going after someone on your team with geno, you have to kill the dude with geno`
`19:05.58`	`JeffM2501`	`same could happen with blue and green teaming up to kill a powerfull red GM`
`19:06.08`	`DTRemenak`	`and the guy you just saved will likely turn around and kill you`
`19:06.33`	`JeffM2501`	`the only reason for the flag would be players who are bitter about geting killed by a rouge`
`19:06.33`	`Bagheera`	`so, why is this option bad, some server owners would like this flag`
`19:06.35`	`orange`	`if you use 'team chat' when rogue, does it send to other rogues?`
`19:06.45`	`BenUrban`	`btw i'm ignoring the scoring aspects because scoring is mostly irrelevant (at least to me)`
`19:06.45`	`Bagheera`	`you seem to be thinking of only your limited play`
`19:06.54`	`BenUrban`	`orange: yes`
`19:07.02`	`orange`	`there's another dimension of 'team'-ness`
`19:07.04`	`JeffM2501`	`Bagheera, and you don't seem to be thinking of what a rouge means`
`19:07.10`	`Bagheera`	`i do`
`19:07.14`	`JeffM2501`	`sure anything can be done`
`19:07.15`	`Bagheera`	`like a mercenary`
`19:07.22`	`Bagheera`	`and i would do it`
`19:07.23`	`JeffM2501`	`how are mercs linked then?`
`19:07.25`	`BenUrban`	`orange: lol chatting doesn't actually affect the game without a shared base or a team flag`
`19:07.34`	`blast007`	`rogue: "a deceitful and unreliable scoundrel"`
`19:07.35`	`JeffM2501`	`just because they dress in black?`
`19:07.36`	`orange`	`BenUrban: I strongly disagree`
`19:07.42`	`JeffM2501`	`dude thats racist! ;)`
`19:08.01`	`bryjen`	`ugh. the kill all rogues thing is usually asked for in response to a rogue running with geno for a while. and usualy so you (the vitimized team player) can use the cheap tactic of hunting the weakest rogue to get back at them.`
`19:08.21`	`JeffM2501`	`bryjen, bingo, well put :)`
`19:08.26`	`BenUrban`	`orange: how so?`
`19:08.35`	`*** join/#bzflag TimRiker (~timr@proxyle01.ext.ti.com)`
`19:08.35`	`*** mode/#bzflag [+o TimRiker] by ChanServ`
`19:08.36`	`JeffM2501`	`bitter players`
`19:08.38`	`Bagheera`	`....except when the situation is reversed`
`19:08.49`	`orange`	`as someone said, rogues forming alliances using team chat are somewhat of a team`
`19:08.52`	`JeffM2501`	`Bagheera, so your mad you can't kill rouges in mass?`
`19:08.54`	`orange`	`it's just another dimension, imho`
`19:09.11`	`blast007`	`if you don't like rogues, play on servers that don't have them....`
`19:09.25`	`JeffM2501`	`or make a change to let a team be on a serve with no base, then call them "rouge"`
`19:09.26`	`blast007`	`"let the server owners decide"`
`19:09.27`	`Bagheera`	`i think its a logical extension, and if the server owner doesnt want it, he doesnt have to use it`
`19:09.34`	`DTRemenak`	`Bagheera: not being able to defend yourself is a Bad Thing...like invisible land mines. Geno is only there because it strengthens teamwork. Since rogues have no teamwork by definition, there is no positive aspect to geno to rogues.`
`19:09.46`	`rkr`	`I can't find the kernel config variable in options(4).`
`19:10.09`	`JeffM2501`	`blast007 there are limints to what the game means, so not all things can be server options`
`19:10.20`	`JeffM2501`	`like core game concepts`
`19:10.24`	`JeffM2501`	`and rouge is one of those core things`
`19:10.35`	`blast007`	`I'm refering to allowing rogues, not allowing the KillAllRogue flag`
`19:10.36`	`Tupone`	`rkr :( don't worry go like I said nothing`
`19:10.41`	`*** join/#bzflag SportyGal (sportygali@67-21-174-30.stmnca.adelphia.net)`
`19:10.44`	`JeffM2501`	`Bagheera, now on the flipside, you could make a plugin that woudl do it :)`
`19:10.57`	`Bagheera`	`protocal change`
`19:10.58`	`BenUrban`	`if you run a server and you hate rogues that much, you'll be content to turn rogues off`
`19:11.00`	`JeffM2501`	`nope`
`19:11.03`	`JeffM2501`	`no proto change`
`19:11.05`	`JeffM2501`	`just a plugin`
`19:11.08`	`Bagheera`	`since client and server would both need to be on the same page`
`19:11.09`	`JeffM2501`	`use regular geno flag`
`19:11.18`	`JeffM2501`	`Bagheera, no, your thinking too limited :)`
`19:11.22`	`BenUrban`	`lol`
`19:11.24`	`rkr`	`(^& Well, if you think that memory could be an issue for the sound thread, I am willing to explore that. Unless you are sure that it's not an issue, now.`
`19:11.37`	`JeffM2501`	`plugin checks for all hits by geno, if the target is a rouge, kill all other rouges`
`19:11.42`	`JeffM2501`	`you could do this today`
`19:11.44`	`Tupone`	`I'm not sure of anything`
`19:11.44`	`bryjen`	`the server could /kill all the rogues when one is hit by a geno bullet`
`19:11.48`	`BenUrban`	`heh, i like how a few people in the channel are actually having a real conversation`
`19:11.55`	`rkr`	`(nod)`
`19:11.55`	`JeffM2501`	`exactly what bryjen said`
`19:11.57`	`Bagheera`	`look, the fact that this topic has been around and argued so much ..........with no real resolve, implies that it should be added as a premanent options`
`19:12.03`	`BenUrban`	`and everybody else who is talking is talking about this rogue thing`
`19:12.18`	`JeffM2501`	`Bagheera, or it could be that people like to beat a dead horse.`
`19:12.24`	`bryjen`	`its been resolved as many times as argued. always "no"`
`19:12.24`	`rkr`	`Well, if I can set a higher memory limit, I'll test and let you know...`
`19:12.27`	`JeffM2501`	`tilting tanks has "been around so much"`
`19:12.43`	`JeffM2501`	`Bagheera, make a plugin, see how many people like it`
`19:12.44`	`Bagheera`	`yeah, but wings(the cheat) jsut jumped right in`
`19:12.45`	`JeffM2501`	`playtest it`
`19:13.07`	`JeffM2501`	`Bagheera, because people liked it, and it didn't change core rules`
`19:13.08`	`bryjen`	`Bagheera: and on wings, I agree with you more`
`19:13.10`	`BenUrban`	`Bagheera: wings is a flag, not a cheat`
`19:13.18`	`bryjen`	`BenUrban: blasphemy!`
`19:13.19`	`DTRemenak`	`Bagheera: nobody objected to wings at the time of its introduction`
`19:13.20`	`bryjen`	`;P`
`19:13.22`	`BenUrban`	`and anyone can get it`
`19:13.26`	`JeffM2501`	`BenUrban, know your history :)`
`19:13.31`	`BenUrban`	`and it did change the game dramatically`
`19:13.31`	`rkr`	`Oh...one thing that might have caused the crash: I have XMMS running. Older bzflag would just say audio unavailable...I wonder if it now is crashing when it can't open an audio channel?`
`19:13.34`	`DTRemenak`	`and by the time they did, more people liked it than disliked it :)`
`19:13.36`	`Bagheera`	`DTRemenak< because not enough people were in on the discussioin`
`19:13.40`	`BenUrban`	`i realize that it used to be a cheat`
`19:13.45`	`JeffM2501`	`Bagheera, and wings was heavaly discussed and moded into the way it works now`
`19:13.46`	`DTRemenak`	`Bagheera: it was right here in this channel`
`19:13.56`	`BenUrban`	`and that there is a cheat where non-WG can fly`
`19:13.58`	`DTRemenak`	`I'll get the IRC logs for it if you want`
`19:14.02`	`Tupone`	`rkr: it should not, but that is how SDL is implemented on netbsd`
`19:14.05`	`BenUrban`	`but that's hardly intentional on the developers' parts`
`19:14.13`	`JeffM2501`	`there were like 3 months of wings tweaks`
`19:14.25`	`JeffM2501`	`Bagheera, you want me to write your plugin for you?`
`19:14.29`	`Bagheera`	`it needs 3 more months of tweaks`
`19:14.38`	`Bagheera`	`JeffM2501< no`
`19:14.42`	`JeffM2501`	`Bagheera, many people are happy with it`
`19:14.47`	`rkr`	`It works fine with the older (2.0.2) bzflag client, and bzflag just reports that the audio isn't available.`
`19:14.48`	`Bagheera`	`all the lagers`
`19:14.49`	`rkr`	`No problem.`
`19:14.50`	`DTRemenak`	`Bagheera: what would you change?`
`19:14.55`	`JeffM2501`	`just beacuse you like or don't like a feature dosn't mean it's evil`
`19:14.59`	`JeffM2501`	`some work and go in, some don't`
`19:15.08`	`JeffM2501`	`you don't see my GM mods in game do you?`
`19:15.13`	`Bagheera`	`default gravity fall and rise need work`
`19:15.18`	`bryjen`	`JeffM2501: don't use the popularity angle. many would probly like the kill-all-rogues`
`19:15.21`	`BenUrban`	`lagging has been around since long before bzflag`
`19:15.21`	`BenUrban`	`and afaik (not that i would know) lagging has always been a problem in bzflag`
`19:15.31`	`JeffM2501`	`bryjen, then it would make a fine plugin`
`19:15.35`	`rkr`	`Yep. That was it.`
`19:15.39`	`DTRemenak`	`bryjen: I doubt many people would like it`
`19:15.43`	`Bagheera`	`JeffM2501< and why not a flag like wings`
`19:15.43`	`rkr`	`It does not crash if it can get the audio channel.`
`19:15.52`	`JeffM2501`	`Bagheera, because that takes more work`
`19:15.54`	`rkr`	`(2.0.3 from CVS, anyway. 2.0.2 works fine either way.)`
`19:15.56`	`JeffM2501`	`and "endorces" it`
`19:15.58`	`blast007`	`BenUrban: it was initially designed for LAN play, so it wasn't as efficient when played over the internet`
`19:15.59`	`JeffM2501`	`this way you can test it`
`19:16.05`	`Tupone`	`rkr: I remember I change something lately on audio, but don't remember when and why`
`19:16.09`	`BenUrban`	`ah, so not quite always`
`19:16.17`	`JeffM2501`	`then if it DOES work, move it in later on a proto change`
`19:16.34`	`JeffM2501`	`Bagheera, think in a more general form, not all things have to be built into the core game`
`19:16.38`	`JeffM2501`	`test it`
`19:16.42`	`JeffM2501`	`see if servers will run it`
`19:16.47`	`JeffM2501`	`see how it affects play`
`19:16.57`	`JeffM2501`	`I belive the term is "playtesting"`
`19:17.06`	`Bagheera`	`yep`
`19:17.38`	`JeffM2501`	`to me it seems like a violation of the core rules, I belive this is why it's been vetoed before.`
`19:17.45`	`JeffM2501`	`but as a modification, you can do what ever youwant`
`19:17.45`	`bryjen`	`this requires active server admins, and attracting enough active players to the "test" server`
`19:18.10`	`JeffM2501`	`bryjen, true, but if he really beileves in the feature, he'd be willing to do the work`
`19:18.25`	`bryjen`	`meh`
`19:18.40`	`BenUrban`	`of course nobody would dare join the rogue "team" on that server`
`19:18.48`	`BenUrban`	`it would be stpid`
`19:18.50`	`BenUrban`	`*stupid`
`19:18.51`	`Bagheera`	`BearPerson< why?`
`19:18.52`	`JeffM2501`	`if not, then all he's trying to do now is prod somone else into do ing the work`
`19:19.00`	`JeffM2501`	`BenUrban, you can't speak for everyone`
`19:19.00`	`BenUrban`	`heh, because they would die :P`
`19:19.26`	`Bagheera`	`BearPerson< sry, wrong complete :)`
`19:19.30`	`BearPerson`	`:)`
`19:19.31`	`bryjen`	`tab-completion mis-fire, BearPerson. go back to sleep`
`19:19.45`	`BenUrban`	`oh, true`
`19:19.46`	`_Manu_`	`:)`
`19:19.51`	`BenUrban`	`there are indeed a lot of stpid people out there`
`19:19.51`	`BenUrban`	`lmao`
`19:19.54`	`JeffM2501`	`BenUrban, again, you can't speak for everyone`
`19:19.59`	`BenUrban`	`true`
`19:20.17`	`JeffM2501`	`a plugin test would see`
`19:20.25`	`BenUrban`	`of course if the server is all-rogue...`
`19:20.30`	`JeffM2501`	`all any of us can do in the end is guess how it would work`
`19:20.34`	`BenUrban`	`that might provide a decent enough test`
`19:20.40`	`JeffM2501`	`a plugin would let a test be run`
`19:20.44`	`bryjen`	`it'd just make rogue more like a team, less advantagous, not than worse`
`19:20.46`	`BenUrban`	`enough to get people to join rogue over real teams`
`19:20.47`	`JeffM2501`	`to be fair to his idea`
`19:20.55`	`bryjen`	`~spell advantagous`
`19:21.09`	`JeffM2501`	`we've all listened to it, and given him our options, next would be a playtest if he wants to proceed`
`19:21.13`	`bryjen`	`s/than worse/worse off than a team`
`19:21.26`	`BenUrban`	`well next would be writing the plugin :P`
`19:22.19`	`JeffM2501`	`and I ofered to do that for him`
`19:22.24`	`*** part/#bzflag _Manu_ (~jujibo@98.Red-80-36-59.pooles.rima-tde.net)`
`19:22.24`	`JeffM2501`	`but he declined`
`19:22.37`	`JeffM2501`	`it would not be a hard plugin to make ether`
`19:22.41`	`Bagheera`	`JeffM2501< you think you can do it faster......well, ok, that should be taken for granted`
`19:23.07`	`JeffM2501`	`Bagheera, I offerd`
`19:23.14`	`JeffM2501`	`tho it's simple, you could bust it out too :)`
`19:23.32`	`JeffM2501`	`tho I don't know if I could get to it today`
`19:23.41`	`DTRemenak`	`JeffM2501: is there a way for a client to list the plugins loaded in a server? better yet, can the list be dumped on join?`
`19:23.48`	`JeffM2501`	`DTRemenak, yes`
`19:23.56`	`DTRemenak`	`cool`
`19:23.59`	`JeffM2501`	`there is a /listplugins`
`19:24.16`	`JeffM2501`	`it's part of the /load and /unload stuff`
`19:24.29`	`DTRemenak`	`'cause I'd really like to know when I'm playing on a server with modded rules :)`
`19:24.36`	`BenUrban`	`out of curiosity, is there a schedule for 2.1?`
`19:24.45`	`BenUrban`	`or what must happen bfore it comes out?`
`19:24.54`	`JeffM2501`	`BenUrban, there is never a schedule`
`19:24.58`	`BenUrban`	`i figured`
`19:25.01`	`DTRemenak`	`BenUrban: 2.0 has to be branched off first. probably shortly after 2.0.4`
`19:25.08`	`BenUrban`	`branched off?`
`19:25.23`	`DTRemenak`	`right, so we can release 2.0.6 etc while working on 2.1 on HEAD`
`19:25.24`	`JeffM2501`	`well 2.1.x will never "ship"`
`19:25.36`	`JeffM2501`	`it would ship as 2.2.0`
`19:26.02`	`BenUrban`	`ah`
`19:26.19`	`JeffM2501`	`you chagne the shot stuff?`
`19:26.21`	`BenUrban`	`oh, so it follows the linux kernel-style thing?`
`19:26.23`	`JeffM2501`	`or is it good enough`
`19:26.28`	`bryjen`	`DTR: perhaps if you shouted more ;)`
`19:26.32`	`JeffM2501`	`I'm not doing shockwave till later`
`19:26.33`	`BenUrban`	`lol`
`19:26.38`	`DTRemenak`	`JeffM2501: didn't change it, I think it works fine`
`19:26.39`	`JeffM2501`	`BenUrban, kernel does that too?`
`19:26.55`	`JeffM2501`	`DTRemenak, what about the fact that it ends as a TP reson?`
`19:27.03`	`BenUrban`	`afaik the kernel has even minors as "stable" and odd minors as "unstable"`
`19:27.16`	`DTRemenak`	`JeffM2501: it's an odd quirk, it is :)`
`19:27.33`	`BenUrban`	`which is why not much was heard about 2.5`
`19:27.34`	`DTRemenak`	`doesn't have any other side effects though afaik`
`19:27.48`	`JeffM2501`	`BenUrban, ok, many others do as well, I got the version sysem from my work.`
`19:28.00`	`JeffM2501`	`we used to have a crap system`
`19:28.00`	`BenUrban`	`ah`
`19:28.01`	`DTRemenak`	`it's a fairly standard versioning setup`
`19:28.04`	`JeffM2501`	`DTRemenak, no it dosn't`
`19:28.08`	`JeffM2501`	`yeah`
`19:28.14`	`JeffM2501`	`much better then the "G4" crap`
`19:28.32`	`BenUrban`	`G4?`
`19:28.34`	`JeffM2501`	`1.7 the version that would not die`
`19:28.35`	`BenUrban`	`you mean the cpu?`
`19:28.38`	`JeffM2501`	`no`
`19:28.42`	`DTRemenak`	`heh`
`19:28.46`	`JeffM2501`	`BenUrban, learn your histroy`
`19:28.49`	`BenUrban`	`meh`
`19:28.56`	`BenUrban`	`not that interested :P`
`19:28.59`	`JeffM2501`	`bzflag used to be 1.7b1, b2, etc...`
`19:29.10`	`BenUrban`	`lmao`
`19:29.17`	`DTRemenak`	`then odd ones became development, so you had 1.7e4, 1.7e6`
`19:29.22`	`JeffM2501`	`all te way up to like g4 or g6 before we changed dev to 1.9 to become 1.10`
`19:29.34`	`BenUrban`	`lol that's horrible`
`19:29.35`	`JeffM2501`	`yeah it was wierd`
`19:29.46`	`DTRemenak`	`then there was the little tiff about 1.7f and it got skipped, so the successor to 1.7e6 was 1.7g0`
`19:29.49`	`hardwire`	`so bzflag and xinrama`
`19:29.52`	`hardwire`	`say three screens`
`19:29.57`	`hardwire`	`would it just muck with my FOV?`
`19:30.11`	`hardwire`	`or are all the tanks gonna be fat.`
`19:30.11`	`BenUrban`	`you gotta cross your eyese to see it in 3d :P`
`19:30.17`	`BenUrban`	`*eyes`
`19:31.28`	`bryjen`	`hardware GL across all three?`
`19:32.09`	`DTRemenak`	`if you end up with GL across three displays you can always go for -view three :)`
`19:32.19`	`Tupone`	`rkr: Error I saw is not bzflag using bad pointer .... new, when out of memory, throw a bad_alloc exception. I remember SDL being able to cleanly exit`
`19:32.19`	`Bagheera`	`orange< good points about team chat, i missed those in the flurry`
`19:32.54`	`BenUrban`	`i have yet to encounter a team chat in rogue that wasn't a typo`
`19:33.54`	`Bagheera`	`BenUrban< and? it is already a core element of bzflag that implies rouge is a team.......it should be removed otherwise and made a plugin :)`
`19:34.03`	`rkr`	`Tupone: I don't recall any indication of memory problems when it crashed trying to play a sound.`
`19:34.17`	`rkr`	`SDL didn't catch it, or at least didn't restore the video mode.`
`19:34.20`	`DTRemenak`	`I'd have no objection to that other than code complexity`
`19:34.24`	`Tupone`	`not sound, testing low of memory`
`19:34.28`	`BenUrban`	`actually it doesn't even need to be a plugin`
`19:34.35`	`BenUrban`	`it can just be left out`
`19:34.45`	`*** join/#bzflag bz5404 (~1815d19e@webchat.bzflag.bz)`
`19:34.49`	`rkr`	`Oh, we're back to that. I thought we were talking about the crash when I built from CVS.`
`19:34.56`	`bryjen`	`it would be a special case added, not a removal`
`19:34.59`	`Tupone`	`:) testing 2 things :)`
`19:35.06`	`BenUrban`	`yeah that's what i meant`
`19:35.07`	`DTRemenak`	`you'd have to make sure hunters in rabbit mode would still be able to teamchat`
`19:35.08`	`rkr`	`(^&`
`19:35.16`	`Bagheera`	`....on a side note, it would be nice to have a shotgun flag and drops the flags of all tanks that have wings........like dropping dead ducks`
`19:35.21`	`BenUrban`	`oh, they're "rogue" too?`
`19:35.28`	`BenUrban`	`lol`
`19:35.30`	`DTRemenak`	`BenUrban: not really :)`
`19:35.34`	`BenUrban`	`~pw`
`19:35.34`	`ibot`	`patches welcome is, like, a common response by maintainers of Open Source products. It's roughly means "We don't have much time on our hands, so if you write that feature and send it to us we will likely roll it in. If you don't have the time to write it, we don't either. Stop asking for it."`
`19:35.46`	`BenUrban`	`it would be interesting`
`19:35.47`	`bryjen`	`yeah, sorta. maybe it should've been another team`
`19:35.50`	`BenUrban`	`but pointless`
`19:35.50`	`DTRemenak`	`at one point they were, and there's some code that still applies to both`
`19:36.01`	`bryjen`	`oh? is it now?`
`19:36.02`	`BenUrban`	`since it can't aim up or down`
`19:36.04`	`DTRemenak`	`bryjen: in 2.0 I believe hunters are team 251 or something`
`19:36.14`	`bryjen`	`ah. I did not know that.`
`19:36.36`	`DTRemenak`	`I might be wrong though...I know it was planned to change`
`19:36.39`	`Tupone`	`rkr: sound you know how to fix. now memory ... have to understand why SDL does not catch that. But I can do later`
`19:36.49`	`*** join/#bzflag CBG (~Matthew@cpc3-stme1-5-0-cust91.cdif.cable.ntl.com)`
`19:37.18`	`rkr`	`Hm. Possibly there's a problem with exceptions...I know that maybe a year ago, I ran into problems using exceptions due to an os bug in NetBSD. That bug was closed, but maybe some of the libraries were not compiled with proper support for exceptions.`
`19:37.19`	`BenUrban`	`Tupone: it forgot, of course`
`19:37.36`	`bryjen`	`hmm, global.h has ObserverTeam and RabbitTeam in the TeamColor enum...`
`19:38.01`	`DTRemenak`	`hm, maybe hunters never were split`
`19:38.04`	`Tupone`	`we cannot use exception :(`
`19:38.33`	`DTRemenak`	`they really should be though`
`19:38.42`	`rkr`	`There's a non-exception mechanism to catch new failures.`
`19:38.45`	`BenUrban`	`hunters are indeed a team`
`19:39.01`	`rkr`	`More of a traditional C style callback, as I gathered. Just register a function pointer...`
`19:39.06`	`Tupone`	`<PROTECTED>`
`19:39.06`	`bryjen`	`include/bzfsAPI.h enum's them differently, though`
`19:39.07`	`BenUrban`	`so they should use more team code than rogue code`
`19:39.09`	`BenUrban`	`i'd think`
`19:39.15`	`rkr`	`(nod)`
`19:39.15`	`rkr`	`That's the one.`
`19:39.32`	`rkr`	`Though I thought it returned the old handler and you supplied the new new_handler.`
`19:39.44`	`DTRemenak`	`<PROTECTED>`
`19:39.50`	`BenUrban`	`lol`
`19:39.56`	`Tupone`	`but I need to know why SDL does not work, it should catch even sigsegv, and others, so better a general recovery`
`19:40.16`	`DTRemenak`	`ugh, it's all client-side too`
`19:40.36`	`*** join/#bzflag Rusure (~1815d19e@webchat.bzflag.bz)`
`19:41.27`	`DTRemenak`	`ugh. ugly ugly hacks on the server side to handle hunter-hunter teamkills :S`
`19:41.33`	`BenUrban`	`lol`
`19:41.56`	`bryjen`	`playing.cxx, everyone favorite mountain of bytes! :)`
`19:42.05`	`BenUrban`	`heh`
`19:43.25`	`bryjen`	`whoops, and Player.cxx`
`19:43.40`	`DTRemenak`	`hrm`
`19:43.42`	`bryjen`	`I know there's some server side stuffs too`
`19:43.47`	`DTRemenak`	`sf.net is not responding`
`19:43.59`	`Bagheera`	`nothing new there`
`19:44.43`	`rkr`	`Hm.`
`19:47.29`	`DTRemenak`	`Bagheera: making code harder to modify is not my thing :)`
`19:47.52`	`BenUrban`	`lol`
`19:48.12`	`DTRemenak`	`I think the idea is stupid and I will object to it being in the bzflag codebase, but I'm not gonna try to stop you from implementing it ;)`
`19:50.28`	`bryjen`	`the teamkill logic still uses the player's teaminfo instead of the shot's info :(`
`19:50.54`	`BenUrban`	`hmm`
`19:51.18`	`BenUrban`	`so a hunter that has just become a rabbit can kill another hunter with a prior shot without penalty?`
`19:51.23`	`bryjen`	`as a hunter you can spray into a crowd, as long as you hit the rabbit first are thereby become rabbit, any fellow hunters hit afterware are +++`
`19:51.35`	`BenUrban`	`that's what i just said`
`19:51.47`	`BenUrban`	`thogh mine was much harder to figure out :P`
`19:51.50`	`Bagheera`	`err, i/he`
`19:51.53`	`bryjen`	`yes, but i was more verbose and slower ;)`
`19:51.59`	`BenUrban`	`lol`
`19:52.24`	`*** join/#bzflag brad2901 (brad2901@brad2901.user)`
`19:52.24`	`Bagheera`	`bryjen< i think that was actually done on purpose`
`19:52.54`	`bryjen`	`Bagheera: eh, maybe. doesn't mean I have to like it ;)`
`19:53.06`	`orange`	`that was a pretty sticky thing with rabbit hunt, as I recall`
`19:53.07`	`Bagheera`	`heh, i remember it used to be the other way`
`19:53.08`	`DTRemenak`	`Bagheera: if stuff you need is not available through the plugin API I'm sure JeffM2501 will be happy to add it for you`
`19:53.45`	`Bagheera`	`danke`
`19:58.27`	`JeffM2501`	`yeah add ing API stuff is prety easy`
`19:58.47`	`JeffM2501`	`and making plugins is a good way to see what the API needs`
`19:59.05`	`JeffM2501`	`I am prety sure you can do what you would need tho`
`19:59.13`	`JeffM2501`	`add an onDeath handaler`
`20:00.42`	`JeffM2501`	`check the vicims team, the shot with flag, and then just call bz_killPlayer on all the other roges`
`20:00.49`	`Bagheera`	`its only crashed 15 times today because the software was flagging one error, when it was actually an unrelated error`
`20:02.05`	`Bagheera`	`have to brush up on the scoring as well`
`20:02.23`	`Bagheera`	`maybe not`
`20:02.26`	`JeffM2501`	`DTRemenak, the list command is /listplugins`
`20:03.12`	`Bagheera`	`yeah, no crash`
`20:08.00`	`JeffM2501`	`hmmm I "guess" 10.3 billion pixels per second is "enough" :)`
`20:08.04`	`Birdie`	`jpa- ping`
`20:08.59`	`*** part/#bzflag iain_mac (~iain_mac@81-178-67-244.dsl.pipex.com)`
`20:09.16`	`jpa-`	`pong`
`20:09.18`	`jpa-`	`Birdie: pong`
`20:11.59`	`Bagheera`	`pull!`
`20:13.01`	`JeffM2501`	`DTRemenak, how hard would it be to send in "extra" info to the list server, have it keep it, and then have newer clients get that info?`
`20:13.02`	`Bagheera`	`no`
`20:13.12`	`JeffM2501`	`like a plugin list?`
`20:13.28`	`JeffM2501`	`so you could see the moded ones in the list server`
`20:13.56`	`Birdie`	`doh`
`20:16.20`	`Pimpinella`	`DTRemenak: and a "don't list me" remark for match servers`
`20:16.47`	`Pimpinella`	`so they could use global login`
`20:17.09`	`JeffM2501`	`that's probably prety easy`
`20:17.39`	`JeffM2501`	`now what would be REALY cool is if you could limit the list to people in groups :)`
`20:17.47`	`JeffM2501`	`say "only show me to people in these groups"`
`20:17.56`	`JeffM2501`	`since the clients send in there auth when they list too :)`
`20:18.00`	`Bagheera`	`nice idea`
`20:18.05`	`JeffM2501`	`so only people in your leauge would see the server`
`20:18.17`	`Bagheera`	`so a server could be reserved for a match`
`20:18.22`	`JeffM2501`	`yeah`
`20:18.31`	`JeffM2501`	`you could say "only let these 2 groups see me "`
`20:18.40`	`JeffM2501`	`tho people could still type in the addy`
`20:19.04`	`Bagheera`	`typing is SO over rated :)`
`20:19.09`	`JeffM2501`	`you could also make it so that reg only servers show only for people who are reged`
`20:19.32`	`*** join/#bzflag tavla (~spreker@ip51cfa1ef.direct-adsl.nl)`
`20:19.40`	`JeffM2501`	`and have a thing on the list page that says " you arn't registed, go HERE to reg on up"`
`20:20.03`	`meacan`	`/ping Birdie`
`20:22.17`	`Bagheera`	`only silly if you use exchange to reserve the server....`
`20:22.50`	`JeffM2501`	`exchange?`
`20:23.27`	`Bagheera`	`the micrsoft thingy that all the managers are sold on to setup meetings`
`20:23.33`	`JeffM2501`	`oh`
`20:23.35`	`JeffM2501`	`eww`
`20:23.42`	`JeffM2501`	`we don't use exchange here :)`
`20:24.07`	`JeffM2501`	`tho a web page that could do it could be cool`
`20:24.38`	`JeffM2501`	`I could add a hook so the game server could send the list server update URL to a plugin, then a plugin could dyamicly change options`
`20:24.39`	`Bagheera`	`maybe bzfs should have a web i/f to control everything`
`20:24.43`	`JeffM2501`	`and go into "lockdown" mode`
`20:24.54`	`JeffM2501`	`Bagheera, purple_cow started a plugin for web admin`
`20:25.17`	`JeffM2501`	`so the plugin could link to a web page and pull who should have access to the server`
`20:25.47`	`JeffM2501`	`would not be that hard to make`
`20:25.56`	`Bagheera`	`and then exe the commands into the server to change the settings`
`20:26.00`	`Bagheera`	`nice`
`20:26.04`	`JeffM2501`	`no, no exe`
`20:26.12`	`JeffM2501`	`the plugin does it realtime`
`20:26.15`	`JeffM2501`	`no restart of the server`
`20:26.30`	`JeffM2501`	`don't think so limited :)`
`20:26.32`	`bryjen`	`some things aren't run-time changable`
`20:26.38`	`Bagheera`	`sry, that was the idea, my mind handles software labels funny`
`20:26.47`	`JeffM2501`	`bryjen, the groups sent to the list server could be`
`20:27.01`	`JeffM2501`	`remember a plugin has access to the guts of bzfs, so it can do more then a / command`
`20:27.21`	`JeffM2501`	`in the purple cow case, the plugin IS a web server`
`20:28.08`	`JeffM2501`	`basicly just have the plugin able to set all the options sent to the list server, on each update, and even trigger updates and it would work`
`20:28.23`	`JeffM2501`	`when the time came for a match, it could even kick off non team players :)`
`20:28.29`	`JeffM2501`	`then go into list lockdown`
`20:28.35`	`purple_cow`	`"started" is a bit strong of a word ;)`
`20:28.42`	`JeffM2501`	`where it tells the list server to not list it`
`20:29.21`	`JeffM2501`	`as it stits right now a plugin can aprove or deny any login request based on it's own logic`
`20:29.32`	`JeffM2501`	`well true`
`20:29.47`	`JeffM2501`	`but you showed it could be done ( conceptualy )`
`20:30.57`	`JeffM2501`	`basicly with a couple mods to the list server and the API you could do a plugin that would let your server be reserved for matchs, at certan times, and it would make sure that only the right people are spawned`
`20:33.05`	`JeffM2501`	`and it would prevent any non team players from spawning`
`20:33.13`	`JeffM2501`	`it could even limit teams to sizes`
`20:34.01`	`JeffM2501`	`and send out emails or update web pages when the match is over :)`
`20:34.07`	`JeffM2501`	`somone just has to make it`
`20:34.29`	`*** join/#bzflag Cuntx0r (~3e83f186@genesis.concept69.de)`
`20:34.32`	`*** join/#bzflag blast007 (~blast007@24-196-92-143.jvl.wi.charter.com)`
`20:34.41`	`JeffM2501`	`and then give it a cool logo`
`20:34.50`	`*** part/#bzflag Cuntx0r (~3e83f186@genesis.concept69.de)`
`20:35.04`	`purple_cow`	`cool logos do count for a lot...`
`20:35.10`	`JeffM2501`	`they do`
`20:35.21`	`JeffM2501`	`those blender ones you all made for wasabi were the best`
`20:36.22`	*** join/#bzflag kyelewis` (~kyelewis@kyelewis.staff.freematrix)
`20:37.22`	`JeffM2501`	`they were very slick and nice`
`20:40.59`	`Tupone`	`~seen jolie`
`20:40.59`	`ibot`	`jolie <~alex@jolie.active.supporter.pdpc> was last seen on IRC in channel #bzflag, 14d 23h 53m 41s ago, saying: 'well i got enought of chassing bloddy rabbit in jumpnbump'.`
`20:41.39`	`Tupone`	`? :/`
`20:42.51`	`JeffM2501`	`she's gone to sleep`
`20:43.35`	`Tupone`	`14 days ago ?`
`20:43.54`	`Tupone`	`like whitesnow`
`20:43.58`	`JeffM2501`	`he has been on here as other names`
`20:44.16`	`JeffM2501`	`!seen fabiane`
`20:44.17`	`TheLastSpartan`	`JeffM2501: I have not seen fabiane.`
`20:44.22`	`JeffM2501`	`~seen fabiane`
`20:44.23`	`ibot`	`JeffM2501: i haven't seen 'fabiane'`
`20:44.31`	`Tupone`	`!seen fabianne`
`20:44.31`	`TheLastSpartan`	`Tupone: fabianne was last seen here 1 day, 2 hours, 24 minutes, and 0 seconds ago saying: <fabianne> q`
`20:44.32`	`JeffM2501`	`well would help if I could spell :)`
`20:44.34`	`BenUrban`	`!seen jolie`
`20:44.35`	`TheLastSpartan`	`BenUrban: jolie was last seen here 9 hours, 2 minutes, and 32 seconds ago saying: <jolie> bye guys and girlies`
`20:44.41`	`BenUrban`	`ibot lies`
`20:44.41`	`ibot`	`of course I do`
`20:44.42`	`BenUrban`	`remember?`
`20:44.47`	`*** join/#bzflag Hamburger (~3e83f186@genesis.concept69.de)`
`20:44.48`	`JeffM2501`	`it does`
`20:44.50`	`*** part/#bzflag Hamburger (~3e83f186@genesis.concept69.de)`
`20:45.04`	`JeffM2501`	`wonder what concept69.de keeps looking for`
`20:45.53`	`bryjen`	`looks like its another cgi:irc`
`20:46.10`	`blast007`	`think it's the one from strayer.de`
`20:46.47`	`*** join/#bzflag test (~18c45c8f@genesis.concept69.de)`
`20:46.54`	`test`	`yup..`
`20:47.01`	`blast007`	`:)`
`20:48.19`	`BenUrban`	`wtf lol`
`20:48.29`	`blast007`	`SendQ?`
`20:48.42`	`BenUrban`	`q = queue`
`20:48.47`	`BenUrban`	`send = send`
`20:50.44`	`blast007`	`"the sendq is the queue of data waiting to be sent from the ircd to the user"`
`20:51.01`	`blast007`	`it can happen on large channels where a /who returns too many lines`
`20:51.07`	`BenUrban`	`lol`
`20:56.50`	`purple_cow`	`JeffM2501: so i'm more than a little underwhelmed by tnl's setup`
`20:57.00`	`JeffM2501`	`ok`
`20:57.04`	`JeffM2501`	`back to enet?`
`20:57.20`	`JeffM2501`	`I have a map parser working`
`20:57.28`	`JeffM2501`	`all in XML ironicly`
`20:57.51`	`purple_cow`	`well, i'm not quite ready to give up on it, but i think i might have to import the sources, completely replace the build system and then hack it to compile with gcc 3.4 :P`
`20:58.15`	`JeffM2501`	`I remember looking at TNL once, saying "yilch" at the sample and moving on, but didn't take a serious look at it.`
`20:58.38`	`JeffM2501`	`what does it's build system use now?`
`20:59.35`	`purple_cow`	`for linux, a makefile`
`21:00.13`	`JeffM2501`	`hmmmmm, if I know you, that's a personal challenge and affront to all you belive in :)`
`21:00.29`	`purple_cow`	`well, no, but it's a fragile makefile :P`
`21:00.30`	`JeffM2501`	`oh and any rason I can't get to the navi?`
`21:00.41`	`JeffM2501`	`I'd like to commit`
`21:00.43`	`purple_cow`	`get to in what way?`
`21:00.52`	`purple_cow`	`oh, svn?`
`21:00.52`	`JeffM2501`	`like to check in`
`21:00.54`	`JeffM2501`	`yeah`
`21:00.57`	`purple_cow`	`probably apache being retarded again`
`21:00.59`	`JeffM2501`	`has timed out all day`
`21:01.09`	`JeffM2501`	`over svn and web`
`21:02.11`	`*** join/#bzflag _Manu_ (~jujibo@98.Red-80-36-59.pooles.rima-tde.net)`
`21:02.30`	`purple_cow`	`ok, try now`
`21:04.33`	`JeffM2501`	`there it goes :)`
`21:04.59`	`*** join/#bzflag supertanker (~45139237@webchat.bzflag.bz)`
`21:06.02`	`*** join/#bzflag supertanker_ (~chatzilla@o1-dialup-69-19-146-55.rev.o1.com)`
`21:06.53`	`JeffM2501`	`world is just stubbed for now. made it so the same class could be used on both sides`
`21:06.59`	`*** part/#bzflag supertanker_ (~chatzilla@o1-dialup-69-19-146-55.rev.o1.com)`
`21:07.40`	`*** join/#bzflag supertanker_ (~chatzilla@o1-dialup-69-19-146-55.rev.o1.com)`
`21:07.53`	`blast007`	`...`
`21:09.37`	`*** join/#bzflag Thumper_ (~bernt@CPE000102d0fe75-CM0012256ecbde.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com)`
`21:09.51`	`Thumper_`	`hi - is there a difference between setting _endShotDetection to 0 or -1?`
`21:10.05`	`jpa-`	`hi thumpie`
`21:10.10`	`Thumper_`	`hi jpa`
`21:10.24`	`*** join/#bzflag supertanker (~chatzilla@o1-dialup-69-19-146-55.rev.o1.com)`
`21:10.27`	`jpa-`	`read the source luke`
`21:10.34`	`Thumper_`	`:) okay`
`21:10.35`	`Thumper_`	`bye`
`21:11.13`	`supertanker`	`Hi guys`
`21:11.16`	`blast007`	`hi`
`21:11.19`	`jpa-`	`hi`
`21:11.32`	`supertanker`	`im 343_Guilty_Spark, but I think thats too long of a name for IRC`
`21:11.43`	`supertanker`	`wow, this is the first time ive used Chatzilla`
`21:11.49`	`supertanker`	`wierd`
`21:12.25`	`supertanker`	`I had a bzflga match today...26 to -14`
`21:12.36`	`supertanker`	`i lost`
`21:12.55`	`purple_cow`	`JeffM2501: what's this "addPrim" thing?`
`21:13.30`	`*** part/#bzflag Tupone (~Tupone@Tupone.active.supporter.pdpc)`
`21:13.42`	`*** join/#bzflag Thumper_ (~bernt@CPE000102d0fe75-CM0012256ecbde.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com)`
`21:13.49`	`Thumper_`	`jpa-: and the answer is 'no'`
`21:16.50`	`JeffM2501`	`ohh I just did a simple box thingy first`
`21:16.57`	`JeffM2501`	`plan to remove it when I do meshes`
`21:17.07`	`JeffM2501`	`mostly to make sure the parser worked`
`21:17.34`	`purple_cow`	`k`
`21:17.45`	`JeffM2501`	`since I don't have any mesh files yet :)`
`21:18.08`	`JeffM2501`	`tinyXML is kinda cool`
`21:18.33`	`jpa-`	`Thumper_: well that is nice`
`21:32.41`	`BenUrban`	`lmao`
`21:32.45`	`BenUrban`	`what are you, the narrator?`
`21:32.52`	`DTRemenak`	`no, just excited`
`21:32.56`	`DTRemenak`	`I rarely get packages`
`21:32.56`	`BenUrban`	`lol`
`21:32.58`	`bryjen`	`rpm or UPS ?`
`21:33.02`	`BenUrban`	`it's a bomb`
`21:33.04`	`DTRemenak`	`usps`
`21:33.16`	`DTRemenak`	`ooh, video card`
`21:33.27`	`BenUrban`	`now you need an rpm`
`21:33.35`	`BenUrban`	`:P`
`21:34.00`	`JeffM2501`	`it could be a dpkg too`
`21:34.11`	`BenUrban`	`true`
`21:34.15`	`BenUrban`	`but more likely an rpm`
`21:34.26`	`BenUrban`	`assuming it's an ati or nvidia card`
`21:34.58`	`BenUrban`	`noooooooo`
`21:35.00`	`DTRemenak`	`that is a freaking big box for a video card though`
`21:35.08`	`BenUrban`	`give me bzip2 or give me liberty!`
`21:35.08`	`DTRemenak`	`larger than some motherboard boxes I've seen`
`21:35.16`	`BenUrban`	`DTRemenak: heat sinc`
`21:35.23`	`BenUrban`	`s/c/k/`
`21:35.28`	`BenUrban`	`NOOOOOOOOO`
`21:35.29`	`BenUrban`	`wait`
`21:35.29`	`JeffM2501`	`what game did it come with?`
`21:35.31`	`BenUrban`	`hmm`
`21:35.33`	`bryjen`	`packing peanuts?`
`21:35.33`	`BenUrban`	`lol`
`21:35.49`	`DTRemenak`	`JeffM2501: "Arx Fatalis" apparently. never heard of it`
`21:36.00`	`BenUrban`	`"arx"?`
`21:36.03`	`JeffM2501`	`odd`
`21:36.05`	`DTRemenak`	`bryjen: just cardboard...lots of cardboard`
`21:36.06`	`BenUrban`	`odd indeefd`
`21:36.08`	`BenUrban`	`*indeed`
`21:36.17`	`jpa-`	`stuffit was it?`
`21:36.18`	`JeffM2501`	`we got ground controll 2`
`21:36.21`	`BenUrban`	`dmg`
`21:36.23`	`JeffM2501`	`with our last one`
`21:36.26`	`BenUrban`	`or .sitx`
`21:36.35`	`BenUrban`	`HAHA`
`21:36.39`	`BenUrban`	`arcHives`
`21:36.40`	`DTRemenak`	`it's a mite heavier than the old one`
`21:36.42`	`bryjen`	`offline him to tape!`
`21:36.48`	`BenUrban`	`nooooo`
`21:36.59`	`BenUrban`	`ROFLMFAO`
`21:36.59`	`DTRemenak`	`and has twice as many fans`
`21:37.30`	`BenUrban`	`oh crap`
`21:37.31`	`BenUrban`	`lol`
`21:37.33`	`blast007`	`jpa-: you forgot .cab`
`21:37.47`	`jpa-`	`blast007: oh true, but it is really a zip isn't it?`
`21:37.54`	`BenUrban`	`so is jar...`
`21:38.00`	`blast007`	`not sure ;)`
`21:38.05`	`DTRemenak`	`cabs != zips`
`21:38.10`	`bryjen`	`DTR: weren't you out of power connectors?`
`21:38.18`	`DTRemenak`	`bryjen: I was until I got a new power supply :)`
`21:38.21`	`S1gn`	`what udp portrange I need to allow for bzflag server?`
`21:38.28`	`BenUrban`	`you BASTARD`
`21:38.33`	`bryjen`	`Ah`
`21:38.34`	`BenUrban`	`you killed benny!`
`21:38.43`	`jpa-`	`decompression algorithm isn't working yet..`
`21:38.48`	`BenUrban`	`lmao`
`21:38.54`	`DTRemenak`	`now I have enough even without all the y's I had in there ;)`
`21:39.10`	`bryjen`	`Enough watts too?`
`21:39.14`	`DTRemenak`	`450`
`21:39.23`	`Aribeth`	`DTR nice`
`21:40.02`	`bryjen`	`S1gn: modern bzfs uses one tcp and one udp port, both the same number`
`21:40.35`	`*** join/#bzflag wizart (~wizart@dsl-084-058-129-237.arcor-ip.net)`
`21:40.45`	`DTRemenak`	`seems to be a first-person rpg`
`21:40.46`	`bryjen`	`is that supposed to be latin or something?`
`21:41.10`	`DTRemenak`	`destroying a demon cult, oh yay`
`21:41.29`	`bryjen`	`BSD?`
`21:43.17`	`Thumper_`	`DTRemenak: The large box is just so they can justify the huge price you paid for the video card ;)`
`21:43.44`	`DTRemenak`	`Thumper_: I only paid $70 for it...I think it's to justify the price the previous owner paid for it :)`
`21:44.30`	`DTRemenak`	`yeah, probably. I'd guess $300 range, it's a non-ultra Gainward 5900 GS`
`21:44.37`	`JeffM2501`	`less`
`21:44.43`	`JeffM2501`	`street price`
`21:44.45`	`Thumper_`	`fans = noise = bad`
`21:44.59`	`DTRemenak`	`JeffM2501: gainward marks everything up excessively though :S`
`21:45.44`	`S1gn`	`bryjen: sometimes I see dropped udp from players IPs with different ports, like SPT=4200 DPT=43744, and my server is :5679`
`21:45.49`	`JeffM2501`	`not that much`
`21:45.57`	`DTRemenak`	`then again, I dunno when the guy bought it...since the 6000 series came out they're much cheaper`
`21:46.20`	`DTRemenak`	`still seems like an excessively large box :)`
`21:46.34`	`DTRemenak`	`the video card fills maybe 1/3 of it`
`21:46.46`	`Thumper_`	`by volume or area?`
`21:46.50`	`DTRemenak`	`area`
`21:47.09`	`DTRemenak`	`less than that by volume, it's about 3 inches deep and the card's single-slot`
`21:47.24`	`JeffM2501`	`7800's are now now`
`21:47.32`	`DTRemenak`	`JeffM2501: available?`
`21:47.33`	`Thumper_`	`huh?`
`21:47.33`	`JeffM2501`	`6x00's are gonna go to the floor`
`21:47.45`	`DTRemenak`	`I thought they were just announced`
`21:47.46`	`JeffM2501`	`yeah a couple places have them`
`21:47.54`	`JeffM2501`	`our resleler lists them`
`21:47.56`	`JeffM2501`	`for purchase`
`21:47.57`	`JeffM2501`	`now`
`21:48.02`	`Thumper_`	`s/now now/new now/ ?`
`21:48.10`	`DTRemenak`	`crazy...with the 6x00s it took them for ever to get parts on shelves`
`21:48.26`	`JeffM2501`	`well people can LEARN from mistakes :)`
`21:48.29`	`DTRemenak`	`hehe`
`21:51.00`	`DTRemenak`	`Heh... Q. How can I stop Arx Fatalis crashing all the time? A. Download the latest patch from the official site. This should improve the game's stability.`
`21:51.16`	`DTRemenak`	`"crashing all the time"..."should improve"`
`21:53.56`	`purple_cow`	`ok, back`
`21:54.02`	`purple_cow`	`now to make this thing build again`
`21:54.36`	`purple_cow`	`JeffM2501: huh. what'd you pull in textUtils for?`
`21:56.40`	`JeffM2501`	`purple_cow, tolower`
`21:56.52`	`JeffM2501`	`I was waiting for you to comment on it :)`
`21:57.05`	`purple_cow`	`mwahaha`
`21:57.46`	`JeffM2501`	`it was just fast and easy`
`21:57.56`	`JeffM2501`	`I am not tied to the code, just wanted the feature`
`22:01.04`	`purple_cow`	`well, at least your ws is consisiten`
`22:01.18`	`JeffM2501`	`not really :)`
`22:02.51`	`purple_cow`	`is it a space or a tab? the world may never know!`
`22:03.02`	`JeffM2501`	`I like to keep people guessing`
`22:03.25`	`JeffM2501`	`I'm fighting to stop myself from doing trThingy`
`22:03.32`	`JeffM2501`	`you should be happy about that :)`
`22:04.04`	`purple_cow`	`yeah, i only see a little bit of it`
`22:06.59`	`purple_cow`	`huh`
`22:07.11`	`purple_cow`	`any reason why you're doing your own material stuff instead of using ogre's material scripts?`
`22:07.25`	`JeffM2501`	`because you don't have current code :)`
`22:07.40`	`JeffM2501`	`I haven't commited it yet`
`22:07.53`	`JeffM2501`	`again it was to just see if I could parse it all out`
`22:08.12`	`purple_cow`	`ooh sweet. we get to race to commit! loser has to merge!`
`22:09.00`	`Pimpinella`	`~seen RPG`
`22:09.00`	`ibot`	`rpg <~knoppix@c-24-15-87-171.client.comcast.net> was last seen on IRC in channel #bzflag, 143d 18h 43m 1s ago, saying: ':sigh: i'll go get a FAT32 drive'.`
`22:09.18`	`Bagheera`	`next time i talk a walk, i going to check the weather first....sheesh`
`22:09.46`	`Aribeth`	`to hot Grumbler?`
`22:10.03`	`Bagheera`	`t-storm....manga type`
`22:10.18`	`Aribeth`	`ahh`
`22:10.29`	`Bagheera`	`err, mega`
`22:32.53`	`*** join/#bzflag Pimpi (~frank@p5481A4BD.dip0.t-ipconnect.de)`
`22:34.25`	`purple_cow`	`hehe, manga thunderstorm!`
`22:36.20`	`JeffM2501`	`I think I have some books by them`
`22:36.26`	`Bagheera`	`champloos falling from the sky]`
`22:37.05`	`Bagheera`	`JeffM2501< playerhistory tracker looks like it is not registering the JoinEvent ? am i missing something?`
`22:37.22`	`Bagheera`	`it registers DieEvent twice`
`22:37.49`	`JeffM2501`	`Bagheera, yeah, join is when somone just joins in, not when they spawn`
`22:37.57`	`JeffM2501`	`aka it dosn't care about observers`
`22:38.11`	`JeffM2501`	`it does?`
`22:38.34`	`Bagheera`	`but, since it is used in the switch, doesnt it need it to ......well work`
`22:41.10`	`JeffM2501`	`that second die was suposed to be a join`
`22:42.44`	`Bagheera`	`figured`
`22:43.00`	`Bagheera`	`but then again, a blind man will find a ....etc, etc`
`22:46.21`	`JeffM2501`	`not like anyone ever tested it after I remade it :)`
`22:47.54`	`CIA-1`	`BZFlag: 03galkire * 10bzflag/plugins/playHistoryTracker/playHistoryTracker.cpp: typo fixing`
`22:48.14`	`Bagheera`	`heh`
`23:30.30`	`*** join/#bzflag triclops (~triclops@c211-31-49-112.rivrw7.nsw.optusnet.com.au)`
`23:30.47`	`*** join/#bzflag rabbit25 (~rabbit25@pcp03852369pcs.martnz01.ga.comcast.net)`
`23:37.09`	`*** join/#bzflag wizart (~wizart@dsl-084-058-129-237.arcor-ip.net)`

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