| 04:25.16 | *** join/#byumug drewbono (~andrew@c-24-2-90-131.client.comcast.net) |
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| 13:03.36 | *** join/#byumug wps (~wps@208.186.134.102) |
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| 15:20.11 | *** join/#byumug wps (~wps@166.70.209.92) |
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| 15:21.54 | *** join/#byumug feutetejsd (~ned@charon.thna.net) |
| 16:39.30 | wps | man! |
| 16:40.02 | feutetejsd | ?? |
| 16:40.05 | wps | what makes people think that they can just completely ignore copyright laws??? |
| 16:40.11 | wps | and just rip-off anyone's work??? |
| 16:40.21 | wps | I just got another one of my sites copied |
| 16:40.26 | feutetejsd | really? |
| 16:40.30 | feutetejsd | crappy |
| 16:40.41 | feutetejsd | if you would quit doing such good work, wps.... |
| 16:41.09 | wps | it's always the same thing too... getto, girly little piece-of-crap "web developers" that don't know anything more about design and art then to rip off someone else's |
| 16:41.25 | feutetejsd | that sux |
| 16:41.44 | wps | and the thing that absolutely blows my mind is that it's always people that are close! |
| 16:41.47 | wps | sheeesh |
| 16:42.06 | wps | if I was going to do that I would at least make sure that they artist was as far from me as they could be... like in Russia or something |
| 16:42.31 | wps | both of the last two latest occurances have been by people in BYU MUG!!! people that live within 50 miles of me!!! |
| 16:42.40 | wps | come on! |
| 16:43.02 | feutetejsd | d00d |
| 16:43.06 | feutetejsd | that's crappy |
| 16:43.54 | wps | man, nothing like starting off the having to send out cease-and-decisist notices |
| 16:44.01 | wps | desist |
| 16:44.25 | feutetejsd | d'oh...sorry man |
| 16:44.38 | wps | thanks... it just blows my mind |
| 16:44.46 | wps | i just... honestly... I just don't understand what they are thinking |
| 16:45.05 | feutetejsd | yeah |
| 17:24.27 | macnewbold | so wps, what are you going to do about it? This is a real problem, and could happen to any of us. |
| 17:25.33 | wps | it is a big problem... and happens all of the time, all over the world |
| 17:26.01 | wps | the thing that just blows my mind though is that the past two times have both been LDS, BYU students, living thirty miles from me in Provo! |
| 17:26.11 | wps | ...who belong to my same user group! |
| 17:26.18 | macnewbold | if it's people you know, we can do something about it |
| 17:26.39 | wps | I sent a cease and desist letter to him this morning |
| 17:26.45 | macnewbold | got some URLs? (yours and theirs) I'm curious now |
| 17:26.48 | wps | he responded quickly and has taken the site down |
| 17:26.57 | macnewbold | so they copied the design? |
| 17:27.09 | macnewbold | that's a lot more obvious that copying someone's code |
| 17:27.14 | wps | http://temp.wade.wfrmls.com/copy.png |
| 17:27.21 | wps | oh yeah... the design |
| 17:27.40 | feutetejsd | wow...yeah, that's pretty blatant |
| 17:27.47 | wps | yeah, very blatant |
| 17:27.56 | macnewbold | well, at least he didn't steal your images, and bothered to make his own... |
| 17:28.03 | wps | very true |
| 17:28.09 | wps | most pirates steal the whole package |
| 17:28.15 | wps | and then just teak some of the images |
| 17:29.12 | wps | I am glad that I screen-shot his site before he took it down |
| 17:29.36 | feutetejsd | ya |
| 17:33.56 | macnewbold | totally |
| 17:37.35 | wps | here's the other site that was ripped off: |
| 17:37.40 | wps | http://temp.wade.wfrmls.com/copy2.png |
| 18:39.51 | macnewbold | also ripped by someone who knows you? that stinks. |
| 18:40.31 | macnewbold | If it weren't for the matching whitespace between the different sections, I'd say it wasn't copied, but the way it is, it appears to be a ripoff |
| 18:40.54 | macnewbold | that layout is pretty common everywhere, but the way you use whitespace makes yours unique, IMO |
| 18:43.09 | wps | I actually know that he ripped it... in this case, he took the codde |
| 18:43.10 | wps | code |
| 18:43.34 | wps | it was my code (XHTML and CSS) verbatim |
| 18:43.54 | wps | this command... |
| 18:43.55 | wps | <!-- <ul> --> |
| 18:43.57 | wps | ooops |
| 18:44.07 | wps | (changing topics) |
| 18:44.09 | wps | this command: fgrep -r "<\!-- <ul> -->" * |
| 18:44.22 | wps | dang... still typed it wrong |
| 18:44.24 | wps | sorry, guys |
| 18:44.35 | wps | this command: fgrep -r "<!-- <ul> -->" * |
| 18:44.47 | wps | returned an error ("-bash: !--: event not found") |
| 18:44.53 | wps | I assume that I need to escape the ! ? |
| 18:44.58 | wps | the "!" |
| 18:50.21 | macnewbold | yeah, copying comments verbatim is a really good indicator it was copied... :) |
| 18:50.31 | macnewbold | there's a thing called MOSS (don't know what it stands for) |
| 18:50.40 | macnewbold | that a bunch of UofU cs classes use |
| 18:51.00 | macnewbold | to detect cheating and copying/sharing of source code, or too much "cooperation" between students |
| 18:51.04 | macnewbold | it's really sweet |
| 18:51.29 | wps | cool |
| 18:52.07 | macnewbold | it detects variable renaming, some line reordering, etc |
| 18:52.18 | macnewbold | basically, anything that produces the same program gets detected |
| 18:52.41 | macnewbold | but at the same time, things that produce something that does almost the same thing, but in a different way, doesn't get detected |
| 18:52.49 | macnewbold | it's kinda useless though on trivial things |
| 18:52.59 | macnewbold | or where there's an example in the book that everyone started from :) |
| 18:53.05 | macnewbold | I think it's from Berkeley |
| 18:54.11 | macnewbold | so both the copiers were/are BYU students? do they know you personally? friends? |
| 18:54.24 | wps | yes, BYU students |
| 18:54.26 | wps | no, not personally |
| 18:54.27 | macnewbold | doesn't BYU honor code prohibit this kind of thing? |
| 18:54.32 | wps | yup |
| 18:54.44 | wps | I am aquanted with them through BYU MUG, but don't know them personally |
| 18:55.02 | macnewbold | well, there's a little something you could throw in your cease-and-desist letter... :) "I'll report you to the Honor Code office" |
| 18:55.09 | wps | yeah |
| 18:55.21 | wps | luckily he took it straight down and it didn't have to get ugly |
| 18:56.19 | macnewbold | yeah. What happened with copy2 guy? or is it the same person? |
| 18:56.29 | macnewbold | what did he say when you busted him? "oh, sorry"? |
| 18:57.22 | wps | that situation was really lame |
| 18:58.02 | wps | I had been helping him... for free... teaching him... and then he finally send me a URL showing me what he had put together and it was a total rip off of a site that I had done |
| 18:58.18 | macnewbold | so wps, how did you find out about copy.png guy's copying? |
| 18:58.52 | wps | I called him on it and he said that he "was... uh... just tinkering... and learning... but that he would take it down... and would be redoing the entire site with something of his own... for the real site" |
| 18:59.03 | wps | yeah, well, that was at least four months ago |
| 18:59.07 | wps | and the sites still up |
| 18:59.14 | wps | I sent him another message today |
| 18:59.34 | wps | I found his site because I just happened to be looking at his profile on the website and followed a link to his site |
| 19:03.09 | macnewbold | yeah, I had a client who joined some "affiliate" program (www.affiliatecrew.com) for their treadmill/fitness stuff, and was forced to pay them $5000 for a redesign (graphic design only, they had to implement the new design still) |
| 19:03.22 | macnewbold | and then later, I was talking to a guy about it, and he had worked with those guys before |
| 19:04.00 | macnewbold | and pointed out that the $5K design job they sold them (wasn't that great anyway, worth more like $500) was an almost identical copy of the main site of the guys running the group |
| 19:05.46 | wps | what'd he say/do? |
| 19:19.43 | macnewbold | nothing really... I don't remember if I even told our clients about it. But I lost what little confidence I had in the "crew" thing, and they later got rid of them. |
| 19:20.34 | macnewbold | apparently in the fine print was that referring affiliates got to set _6_month_ cookies, so they'd lose $100 for the affiliate referral if they'd been to any affiliate site in the last 6 months |
| 19:20.34 | macnewbold | it was really lame |
| 19:20.49 | macnewbold | cause they thought they were only paying for affiliates who send someone to our page (directly) that causes a sale |
| 19:21.05 | macnewbold | so they quit as soon as they could |
| 19:41.51 | *** join/#byumug drewbono (~andrew@byu176783wks.rn.byu.edu) |
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| 20:05.18 | wps | drewbono: you around? |
| 20:09.00 | drewbono | Hey. |
| 20:09.19 | wps | got a minute |
| 20:09.20 | drewbono | wps: hey |
| 20:09.20 | wps | ? |
| 20:09.30 | drewbono | sure |
| 20:09.51 | wps | I am trying to fix something on the website |
| 20:10.17 | wps | view the source on the home page |
| 20:10.38 | wps | see the commented out tag, "<!-- <ul> -->" on line 132? |
| 20:11.10 | wps | I have been fgrep-ing the crap out of the web tree but cannot find that code anywhere! |
| 20:11.29 | wps | Would you mind doing a search and to see if you can find what file that is in? |
| 20:11.37 | wps | (perhaps I am not searching correctly) |
| 20:12.53 | drewbono | I'll look. |
| 20:12.59 | drewbono | the right nav looks messed up today. |
| 20:13.01 | wps | thanks |
| 20:13.03 | drewbono | did something change? |
| 20:13.12 | drewbono | Not right nav, but the right-hand side. |
| 20:13.34 | wps | yes, I am trying to clean up the code there |
| 20:16.36 | drewbono | It's in the db |
| 20:16.41 | drewbono | gl_block |
| 20:16.45 | drewbono | gl_blocks |
| 20:16.48 | drewbono | not sure what inputs it yet though |
| 20:16.57 | wps | it's in the database? |
| 20:17.07 | wps | yuck |
| 20:20.31 | wps | I probably can't do what I was trying to do then... if GL is writing those tags into the database |
| 20:20.51 | wps | because, even if we changed the code so that it stopped writing them, we would have to go and edit the entries that already existed |
| 20:21.26 | wps | that explains why I couldn't find the string though |
| 20:22.11 | drewbono | Yep. |
| 20:22.23 | wps | never mind then |
| 20:22.27 | wps | thanks for taking a few minutes |
| 20:23.50 | wps | site is back to normal |
| 20:26.12 | wps | man, the server dragging |
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| 20:59.44 | feutetejsd | yeah, wps...what's up with the pokey server? |
| 20:59.55 | feutetejsd | you want me to get out and push? |
| 21:00.00 | wps | :) |
| 21:00.04 | wps | don't know... but it's really slow |
| 21:00.11 | wps | taking forever to just serve pages |
| 21:00.29 | feutetejsd | d'oh |
| 21:02.03 | drewbono | No kiddin. |
| 21:02.03 | drewbono | I was noticing that earlier. |
| 21:02.03 | drewbono | Sooooooo slow. |
| 21:02.46 | feutetejsd | weird...a traceroute to it shows the last 4 hops as the same machine--128.187.112.183, which appears to be the server itself....not sure what to make of that |
| 21:03.38 | drewbono | Hmmm... |
| 21:09.53 | drewbono | The server's under a super heavy load right now. |
| 21:10.08 | wps | what's it working on? |
| 21:10.23 | drewbono | The admin just got put his notice in at BYU (got a new job) and is probably copying things to/fro it. |
| 21:10.44 | drewbono | *just put his notice in at... |
| 21:11.12 | feutetejsd | is it a wimpy server? |
| 21:11.22 | drewbono | Yeah. |
| 21:11.31 | drewbono | It's an old g4. |
