| 00:00.09 | brlcad | at best, you could have an iterator function that is given an iteration state object |
| 00:00.12 | Malyce | I never realised this |
| 00:00.21 | mafm | you can create roughly the same functionality with C structs, but sometimes it's not as clean and usually ppl doesn't work with those idioms in C language |
| 00:00.36 | brlcad | sort of like strsep() .. it's not nearly as clean as just iterator++; |
| 00:00.49 | Malyce | Ease of use. yes, classes are nice |
| 00:01.02 | brlcad | with strsep(), you keep calling strsep and keep feeding it a new (state) pointer |
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| 00:01.10 | Malyce | Which is why you want the CoreInterfaces in C++ |
| 00:01.18 | brlcad | we have a C api |
| 00:01.28 | brlcad | the entire point is to provide a new/clean OO C++ API |
| 00:01.37 | Malyce | But, for the unified API, youd rather use C++ |
| 00:01.40 | Malyce | ok |
| 00:01.42 | brlcad | hm? |
| 00:01.47 | Malyce | same thing |
| 00:01.50 | brlcad | there is no 'unified' api |
| 00:02.02 | brlcad | there are the C libs, and this new C++ library |
| 00:02.12 | Malyce | the merging of Coreinterfaces with GeomEngine |
| 00:02.14 | brlcad | the C++ one sits on top of the C ones |
| 00:02.54 | brlcad | well, that's more just a "current state of affairs" .. there are two things that have the exact same goals, but were simply designed by two different devs mostly in isolation |
| 00:03.11 | brlcad | they need to merge simply because they are the same thing -- the differences have to be reconciled |
| 00:04.03 | Malyce | The Tree walker example, is that hypothetical ? |
| 00:04.13 | brlcad | no, we do that sort of thing all the time |
| 00:04.26 | brlcad | you can find dozens of examples of it throughout the brl-cad code |
| 00:04.30 | Malyce | Or, if it works, then don't you already have traversal support ? |
| 00:04.54 | brlcad | we have traversal support in C -- that's the db_walk_tree() function (and there are about 6 others too) |
| 00:05.09 | brlcad | that one in C++ was just implemented like last week |
| 00:05.28 | Malyce | so, you do have traversal support in C++ now ? |
| 00:05.43 | brlcad | the one you just saw... |
| 00:05.58 | Malyce | k, is there anything I can add ? |
| 00:06.13 | brlcad | undoubtedly |
| 00:06.24 | brlcad | again, that code is brand new, hasn't even been reviewed by anyone really |
| 00:06.34 | brlcad | and it's actually longer than the C example |
| 00:06.43 | Malyce | Yes, funnily |
| 00:06.44 | brlcad | that's not right -- something could be improved there I'm sure |
| 00:07.09 | Malyce | I'll add that to my list |
| 00:07.16 | Malyce | anything else that comes to mind ? |
| 00:07.23 | brlcad | to say you're going to work on that would be missing the boat a little bit though -- there's hundreds of pieces of functionality like that in LIBRT that need to be translated to OO C++ API form |
| 00:07.43 | brlcad | you're obviously not going to implement everything |
| 00:08.00 | brlcad | mafm: here!, I can't keep toggling |
| 00:08.08 | brlcad | and it shouldn't be private |
| 00:08.21 | brlcad | doesn't matter if there's something else also being discussed |
| 00:08.36 | mafm | ah ok, sorry :D |
| 00:08.39 | Malyce | But, you need a specific list of goals |
| 00:08.45 | brlcad | Malyce: yes |
| 00:08.53 | Malyce | Saying that I wish to extend Coreinterfaces won't be enough |
| 00:09.06 | Malyce | I'll need more specifics ? |
| 00:09.21 | brlcad | so you could work on cleaning up tree traversal -- to do that I'd suggest looking at those two examples as well as the other iterators in librt .. see how they could be defined best as c++ |
| 00:11.15 | mafm | brlcad: so do I repeat the questions here? |
| 00:11.25 | brlcad | Malyce: probably best is to peruse what librt presently does, what coreInterface presently does, and what the other GS/GE-defined engine does .. then describe those categorical areas of the API -- those categories of API in LIBRT very likely correspond to objects in C++ |
| 00:11.27 | mafm | the 1st one was already posted in this channel |
| 00:11.42 | brlcad | the basic structs in C mostly correspond to C++ classes nearly 1-1 |
| 00:12.02 | brlcad | mafm: yes, the discussion log would be useless for others otherwise |
| 00:12.17 | brlcad | what was the first question? |
| 00:12.26 | mafm | brlcad, from your ideas list: Create a 3D geometry browser graphical interface using a common graphics engine (e.g. OGRE, Open Scene Graph, Crystal Space) -- isn't this the GUI that we've been making? |
| 00:12.34 | brlcad | that is the gui |
| 00:12.47 | brlcad | more specifically, that would ideally be a plugin in the new gui infrastructure |
| 00:13.45 | brlcad | more interestingly, it becomes a plugin in the gui infrastructure that talks to the geometry service for getting geometry |
| 00:14.10 | brlcad | this is a great article by a friend on the drupal dev team: http://webchick.net/embrace-the-chaos |
| 00:14.20 | mafm | I don't understand, isn't "browser" the view? |
| 00:15.06 | Malyce | You mentioned support for primitives |
| 00:15.20 | Malyce | a quick look reveals revolves, bsplines etc |
| 00:15.26 | Malyce | I can move this to C++ |
| 00:15.39 | Malyce | And I have worked with these before in SW |
| 00:15.51 | Malyce | So I have an idea of what to do |
| 00:16.04 | brlcad | Malyce: there's no moving |
| 00:16.20 | brlcad | you're creating a library that sits on top of libbu, libbn, librt, libwdb, libged :) |
| 00:16.32 | Malyce | that is what I meant. Sorry, my lingo sucks |
| 00:16.47 | Malyce | but, I can do that |
| 00:16.53 | brlcad | if working with entites is more familiar, then start there |
| 00:17.05 | Malyce | It seems like a big chunk of work |
| 00:17.17 | brlcad | absolutely |
| 00:17.23 | Malyce | coupled with hierarchy transversal, I think it will keep me occupied |
| 00:17.30 | Malyce | big enough objective ? |
| 00:17.43 | brlcad | you should post whatever you come up with onto the brlcad-devel mailing list, see if you can get rossberg to comment on your goals |
| 00:18.06 | brlcad | he'd likely be the mentor or d-lo if you worked on that project |
| 00:18.06 | Malyce | I think that covering all the primitives would be hard |
| 00:18.15 | brlcad | then maybe focus on just that |
| 00:18.29 | mafm | 2nd question: Create a ray-trace service daemon with a simple tcp communications interface (similar to remrt, but more of a persistent daemon) -- do you think that is it doable as gsoc project? I don't think that this raytracing is covered by geometry service |
| 00:18.37 | brlcad | traversal was just an easily demonstrateable point since there are already demos of both in both APIs |
| 00:18.58 | brlcad | mafm: ray-tracing is covered by the GS |
| 00:19.07 | brlcad | it's actually one of its critical requirements |
| 00:19.39 | brlcad | it's being developed specifically to callers to shoot rays at geometry and get back the results :) |
| 00:19.59 | brlcad | s/to callers to/so callers can/ |
| 00:20.34 | mafm | good, so scrap that one too :) |
| 00:20.52 | brlcad | so the task there, mafm, could be to work on the GS directly and work on the class(es) that get hooked into by the job manager that will issue rays |
| 00:21.03 | brlcad | that'd be a pretty hot topic |
| 00:21.10 | brlcad | why scrap it? |
| 00:21.15 | mafm | the 3rd one was a curiosity -- Implement or integrate a RenderMan-compliant interface (e.g. Pixie) to BRL-CAD's ray-trace library -- my gsoc of 2007 was with Aqsis, rival of Pixie :) but it was not about rendering, but multithreading |
| 00:21.41 | mafm | oh, I meant, if dlo or daniel are already working on it... |
| 00:21.49 | brlcad | pixie is all lgpl, aqsis has nasty gpl portions ;) |
| 00:21.55 | brlcad | otherwise, yeah, same thing |
| 00:21.57 | Malyce | devs@brlcad.org ? i think it might take too long for him to respond. Maybe I should proceed with writing this stuff down and submitting ? |
| 00:22.06 | brlcad | mafm: they're huge tasks |
| 00:22.18 | brlcad | collaborative efforts would be way cooler than independent efforts |
| 00:22.23 | brlcad | Malyce: no |
| 00:22.28 | brlcad | see the wiki |
| 00:22.32 | mafm | Malyce: you should submit the application nevertheless, otherwise you'll miss the deadline |
| 00:22.36 | brlcad | it has instructions in the gsoc pages on getting there |
| 00:22.53 | brlcad | yeah, you should submit asap just so you're in -- you can tweak and update afterwards |
| 00:23.01 | mafm | Malyce: you can edit the proposal later. also the address is wrong. |
| 00:23.11 | brlcad | I'd suggest submitting it as soon as you have it done, then post to the list for feedback |
| 00:23.21 | brlcad | and/or to a user wiki page |
| 00:23.35 | Malyce | I have more than 12 hrs, right ? |
| 00:23.50 | Malyce | just to be sure |
| 00:23.52 | Malyce | ? |
| 00:23.57 | brlcad | Malyce: *you* do.. but it would be nice if we could have some time to review and discuss it :) |
| 00:24.02 | Malyce | yes |
| 00:24.04 | Malyce | certainly |
| 00:24.06 | Malyce | I will do that |
| 00:24.31 | mafm | about rendermans: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pixie_(renderer) says GPL and LGPL, anyway BRL-CAD would not use them (but the other way around), so I don't kow why that would matter :) |
| 00:24.37 | brlcad | i mean we'll have the upcoming week, but its only going to get harder as the deadline approaches and there are a dozen half-discussed applications |
| 00:24.45 | brlcad | I expect a little bit of a flurry of discussion tomorrow |
| 00:24.48 | mafm | anyway, I didn't touch any renderman-specific part, so nevermind :) |
| 00:24.53 | brlcad | seems to be accellerating as the deadline approaches |
| 00:25.03 | brlcad | agree that it should have been a monday deadline instead of a friday one :) |
| 00:25.08 | brlcad | but therein is the planning |
| 00:25.20 | brlcad | mafm: okay |
| 00:25.48 | brlcad | it's not actually implementing renderman spec (though that is an option) .. as that is indeed a project in itself |
| 00:26.39 | brlcad | it's hooking into something like aqsis/pixie as either a lighting model or shader .. and making their code use librt to shoot at the geometry (instead of whatever they implemented) |
| 00:27.03 | mafm | I mean, I don't know how to map their operations to brlcad's :) |
| 00:27.11 | brlcad | so using their code to parse the renderman scripts, manage textures, etc, but use our ray-tracing |
| 00:27.16 | brlcad | fair enough |
| 00:27.35 | brlcad | it's a bit of a project to say the least -- would probably require modifying pixie to call our tracer |
| 00:27.45 | brlcad | unless they really made it that cleanly modular |
| 00:27.56 | brlcad | would definitely require hooks on our end, probably a new shader |
| 00:28.03 | mafm | I think that I'll settle in something between GUI and the GS, or some part of the GS |
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| 00:29.34 | brlcad | getting the GUI talking to the GS and/or working directly on the GS are both pretty high-priority/valuable/cool projects |
| 00:29.43 | brlcad | pretty well-defined too |
| 00:30.14 | brlcad | I kinda like the goal of making the GS shoot rays for you |
| 00:32.25 | mafm | the GS would be a kind of remote daemon accepting commands via TCP, to perform operations on an open geometry |
| 00:32.41 | mafm | and sending data back and forth for visualization in the GUI |
| 00:32.42 | mafm | right? |
| 00:33.37 | mafm | so what we need is a wrapper in the thin client that it's the gui, a kind of couterpart of GS for the client (or clients) |
| 00:33.48 | brlcad | the GS has an example daemon already (gs0) |
| 00:34.24 | brlcad | you could hook it into the gui, or just make your own little daemon that just issues commands and demonstrates capability |
| 00:34.41 | brlcad | once you had it working, could then work on hooking it up |
| 00:34.49 | brlcad | and ripping out the libged components in the gui |
| 00:35.13 | brlcad | it already has enough hooks to open geometry and list objects |
| 00:35.41 | mafm | gs0 is the server/-ice part, right? or an example of how a client should call the GS? |
| 00:39.32 | mafm | I don't know if the client component talking to the GS would be better modelled as a separate process, as an object instantiable by the gui with mostly hardcoded API (functions), or with an interpreter that would validate commands before sending them over to the GS |
| 00:39.42 | mafm | reading the wiki, searching for that info |
| 00:40.11 | brlcad | it might be the server part, I forget |
| 00:40.18 | brlcad | either way, writing a client is trivial |
| 00:41.16 | brlcad | the point of the service is to not have to hard-code a list of commands in various places -- so you'd either just pass the command to the GS and have it tell you if it's valid or not, or have a routine on the GS that reports a manifest of valid commands |
| 00:41.30 | brlcad | probably better served reading the sources |
| 00:42.12 | mafm | imagine a db like mysql |
| 00:43.15 | mafm | notes: db, not proper rdbms :P ;) |
| 00:43.15 | Malyce | what are 'nmg's ? |
| 00:43.16 | brlcad | the GS is only accessible over a socket |
| 00:43.16 | brlcad | whether local or remote |
| 00:43.19 | brlcad | Malyce: nmgs are n-manifold geometry |
| 00:43.25 | Malyce | k |
| 00:43.38 | brlcad | for all intensive purposes, they're boundary representation geometry |
| 00:43.39 | mafm | the GS could provide kind of libmysql libraries, so the clients can use those libraries to talk directly to the rdbms, abstracting network operations and all that |
| 00:43.58 | brlcad | technically, they are an implementation of the radial edge data structure for representing boundary representation geometry |
| 00:44.17 | brlcad | there are links on wikipedia for all of those terms I used if you don't know what they are :) |
| 00:44.33 | Malyce | For some reason, the b-spline primitive seems to be quite big, compared to others. I assume, this is because other primitives build on it ? |
| 00:44.50 | brlcad | mafm: possibly, but for simplicity, only care right now about getting the socket communication working |
| 00:45.03 | brlcad | the geometry engine is the compiled library interface |
| 00:45.17 | brlcad | the service is a true service, you'll connect to a port and chatter |
| 00:45.18 | yukonbob | hello, cadheads, GSOC'rs |
| 00:45.22 | brlcad | howdy yukonbob |
| 00:45.28 | brlcad | yukonbob: are you signed up? |
| 00:45.28 | pacman87 | hi yukonbob |
| 00:45.31 | brlcad | someone's not signed up |
| 00:45.52 | yukonbob | what's the signup drlil? |
| 00:45.54 | yukonbob | *drill |
| 00:46.01 | brlcad | Malyce: don't bother looking at the bspline primitive |
| 00:46.05 | brlcad | it's going away |
| 00:46.13 | brlcad | sochop.appspot.com |
| 00:46.31 | Malyce | what about n-manifolds ? |
| 00:46.33 | brlcad | create a profile, request to be added to brl-cad, I confirm, you reconfirm, and we're good |
| 00:46.35 | yukonbob | "sochop": cute. |
| 00:46.43 | brlcad | er, socghop |
| 00:46.51 | brlcad | sochop would have been better |
| 00:47.24 | brlcad | Malyce: what about them? |
| 00:47.54 | brlcad | n-manifolds are topological structure -- you'll end up needing most of that |
| 00:48.04 | brlcad | look at how primitives are already being supported by the core interface |
| 00:48.23 | brlcad | leaves for a bit |
| 00:48.31 | Malyce | theay are still going to be needed ? |
| 00:48.55 | poolio | howdy all, brlcad |
| 00:49.11 | brlcad | Malyce: yes, everything except bsplines |
| 00:49.15 | brlcad | howdy poolio |
| 00:50.04 | Malyce | where exactly is core interface in src ? |
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| 00:53.10 | yukonbob | Malyce: core interface to what? |
| 00:54.23 | Malyce | Core C++ Interfaces |
| 00:55.20 | mafm | yukonbob: I think that it's daniel's project |
| 00:57.03 | poolio | If anyone is interested in knowing more about brep/needs help understanding what's currently there, I can lend a hand...maybe :) |
| 00:58.39 | yukonbob | fsck... that sign-in keeps crashing my browser |
| 00:58.57 | mafm | yukonbob: konqueror? |
| 00:59.14 | yukonbob | ffox |
| 00:59.34 | poolio | yukonbob: is this on linux? I've had a ton of stability issues with ffox lately |
| 01:00.20 | mafm | I had to do stuff with ffox, konqueror sometimes crashed |
| 01:00.38 | yukonbob | poolio: NetBSD |
| 01:00.46 | mafm | yay for foss-unfriendly google gsoc stuff :D |
| 01:01.35 | Malyce | so, does anyone know, where the actual code for Core C++ Interfaces is in the src directory ? |
| 01:03.11 | mafm | Malyce: it's in rt^3 module, src/coreInterface |
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| 01:08.50 | Malyce | thanks |
| 01:12.17 | Malyce | Is this all ? |
| 01:12.29 | Malyce | Seems there is no support as of yet for any primitive support |
| 01:12.47 | Malyce | scratch the second 'support' |
| 01:13.05 | mafm | there's no private development AFAIK, so all that it's developed should be there |
| 01:13.49 | Malyce | except for arb8 |
| 01:14.16 | Malyce | so, arb8 is the only primitive so far supported by Core C++ Interfaces |
| 01:14.42 | mafm | shrugs |
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| 01:17.13 | Malyce | ok |
| 01:17.38 | Malyce | I had thought, it would be possible to include support for a single primitive within 5-15 hours |
| 01:17.52 | Malyce | but I guess that was far too optimistic |
| 01:24.30 | CIA-40 | BRL-CAD: 03Suryajith 07http://brlcad.org * r1337 10/wiki/User:Hippieindamakin87: |
| 01:30.26 | CIA-40 | BRL-CAD: 03Suryajith 07http://brlcad.org * r1338 10/wiki/User:Hippieindamakin87: /* Timeline */ |
| 01:38.49 | AlexandreGuedes | How many students will be accepted for brl-CAD in gsoc 2009 ? |
| 01:39.02 | AlexandreGuedes | two ? |
| 01:39.35 | mafm | brlcad: back? |
| 01:39.47 | mafm | AlexandreGuedes: for brl-cad? up to 4, I think |
| 01:41.01 | AlexandreGuedes | mafm: You are trying to ? |
| 01:44.22 | mafm | AlexandreGuedes: yes |
| 01:57.36 | AlexandreGuedes | mafm: Will it be Sean sleeping now? |
| 01:57.39 | AlexandreGuedes | incredible |
| 01:57.56 | mafm | maybe 8| |
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| 01:59.48 | *** mode/#brlcad [+o brlcad] by ChanServ |
| 02:01.36 | CIA-40 | BRL-CAD: 03Suryajith 07http://brlcad.org * r1339 10/wiki/User:Hippieindamakin87: |
| 02:02.34 | brlcad | probably somewhere between 2 and 5 slots, depends on a lot of factors |
| 02:02.56 | brlcad | like the fact that many of you haven't posted your applications yet, which may result in us getting fewer slots regardless of what we request :) |
| 02:03.14 | brlcad | Malyce: core interfaces is in the rt^3 module |
| 02:03.24 | brlcad | http://brlcad.svn.sourceforge.net/viewvc/brlcad/ |
| 02:04.07 | brlcad | poolio: you're also welcome to be a mentor if you're interested (a backup mentor) .. and all you'd have to do at a minimum is be willing to sign up and accept a free t-shirt ;) |
| 02:05.13 | brlcad | Malyce: http://brlcad.svn.sourceforge.net/viewvc/brlcad/rt%5E3/trunk/src/coreInterface/ .. there are two primitives at a glance |
| 02:05.23 | brlcad | arb8 and halfspace |
| 02:05.53 | brlcad | AlexandreGuedes: sleepiwhat? |
| 02:06.16 | Malyce | I have completed my proposal |
| 02:06.20 | Malyce | I will post it soon |
| 02:06.22 | brlcad | awesome |
| 02:06.30 | AlexandreGuedes | brlcad: heuehue |
| 02:06.33 | brlcad | yukonbob: no account yet? |
| 02:06.43 | Malyce | I have a question. How do I attach my cover letter and Resume ? |
| 02:07.13 | brlcad | not really necessary, but you're welcome to include/link to it if you like -- basic background information about yourself can sometimes be interesting |
| 02:07.33 | brlcad | more interesting is usually how you work and interact, how quickly you learn, how much a pain in the ass you can be, etc ;) |
| 02:08.14 | Malyce | Then I guess no need for resume |
| 02:08.24 | Malyce | But I'd like to put in a short cover letter |
| 02:08.29 | brlcad | link it if you think it'll help ;) |
| 02:08.40 | brlcad | if it'll be a waste of time, don't link it ;) |
| 02:08.56 | Malyce | Can I create a new document in the GSOC toolbar, and add it ? |
| 02:09.07 | Malyce | Just a short letter |
| 02:09.49 | brlcad | time is often well spent adding more detail to the proposal, or working on a second backup proposal, or working on a patch |
| 02:09.53 | brlcad | i dunno really, give it a try |
| 02:13.43 | mafm | Malyce: this is not applying for a job, cover letters are not needed. a link to your CV might come in handy, though |
| 02:14.53 | Malyce | I wanted to give my background in working with Solidworks API |
| 02:15.58 | mafm | you can add that in the "Content" section of the application too, as past experience for instance |
| 02:17.53 | Malyce | allright |
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| 02:21.58 | mafm | brlcad: coreInterface is in a very early stage of development it seems, and what's about iBME? it appears to include some plan for GUI too... |
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| 02:25.29 | brlcad | Malyce: be sure to read this if you haven't yet: http://brlcad.org/wiki/Google_Summer_of_Code/Application_Guidelines |
| 02:26.05 | brlcad | also worth including in your proposal is what you hope to gain out of participating in GSoC and what plans for your project (if any) do you have after GSoC is over |
| 02:29.43 | Malyce | ok |
| 02:29.49 | Malyce | I will edit my proposal |
| 02:29.57 | Malyce | but I have already posted it |
| 02:30.02 | Malyce | iamtanmay |
| 02:37.00 | mafm | brlcad: you tell me to talk in the channel, but then ignore when I talk :P |
| 02:41.33 | yukonbob | brlcad: my browser crashes trying to register :P !!! |
| 02:45.13 | mafm | well, going to sleep |
| 02:45.15 | mafm | night |
| 02:47.48 | brlcad | wasn't ignoring him, wouldn't have answered pm either :P |
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| 02:55.49 | Malyce | So, how to I get feedback from d_rossberg ? |
| 02:56.52 | brlcad | AlexandreGuedes: so you know, I generally don't answer "hello" messages in PMs -- but I'm more than happy to talk once you say something more than hello |
| 02:57.03 | brlcad | if it's a dev or gsoc question, though, it probably shouldn't be in private |
| 02:57.45 | brlcad | Malyce: post to the brlcad-devel mailing list, and ask for feedback from him or others (or leave it open-ended) |
| 02:58.17 | Malyce | can you give me the mailing list ? The one on the GSOC website was wrong |
| 02:58.25 | AlexandreGuedes | brlcad: I have a question about patch to gsoc acceptance.. |
| 02:59.00 | AlexandreGuedes | As sample patch I could implement an alteration that allows users to visualize the exported model. |
| 02:59.27 | AlexandreGuedes | That would be interesting and acceptable? |
| 02:59.41 | brlcad | Malyce: wrong how so? it shouldn't be |
| 02:59.45 | AlexandreGuedes | I should use glut and opengl functions. |
| 03:00.02 | brlcad | Malyce: it's also on our wiki under the submission guidelines |
| 03:00.30 | brlcad | AlexandreGuedes: we have a modeler and ray-tracing system for visualizing models.. :) |
| 03:01.02 | Malyce | where can I find info on the patch that we have to do ? |
| 03:01.11 | brlcad | plus, how are you going to visualize a boolean operation between an implicit ellipsoid and a torus? |
| 03:01.11 | AlexandreGuedes | brlcad: but is to visualizing exported models... |
| 03:01.44 | brlcad | Malyce: what do you mean? |
| 03:02.38 | Malyce | Do we have to write a patch as a prerequisite to GSOC ? |
| 03:02.39 | brlcad | you do whatever patch you want to do |
| 03:02.53 | Malyce | Is it necessary ? |
| 03:02.58 | AlexandreGuedes | brlcad: it is just to modes that were already exported |
| 03:03.02 | Malyce | Or is it complementary ? |
| 03:03.12 | brlcad | technically, no you don't *have* to .. but your chances will be massively hindered if you don't at least do something |
| 03:03.21 | brlcad | if you can do something impressive, that can *greatly* increase your chances |
| 03:03.54 | brlcad | AlexandreGuedes: native tounge portuguese or spanish? |
| 03:04.46 | AlexandreGuedes | portuguese |
| 03:05.11 | yukonbob | brlcad: "linkid" can be arbitrary string? |
| 03:05.20 | brlcad | basically you'll be considered whether you make a patch or not -- but most have submitted a patch and that *really* helps get a feel for how you code and where we're starting |
| 03:05.28 | brlcad | yukonbob: whatever you want it to be |
| 03:05.46 | brlcad | AlexandreGuedes: ah, okay .. I can only read that and not very well, fluent in spanish |
| 03:06.04 | Malyce | I could work on the Hierarchy Transversal Support |
| 03:06.18 | brlcad | so AlexandreGuedes -- I wouldn't suggest an exported model viewer, it's more important for us to import than export :) |
| 03:06.48 | AlexandreGuedes | ok.. |
| 03:07.04 | Malyce | would that be something acceptable ? |
| 03:07.17 | Malyce | if I could work on it and improve it somewhat ? |
| 03:08.18 | brlcad | AlexandreGuedes: how much time do you think you have for a patch? |
| 03:08.39 | brlcad | that can kinda steer how big of an idea you might be able to handle -- a couple hours, couple days? |
| 03:08.44 | yukonbob | brlcad: submitted |
| 03:08.48 | brlcad | ok |
| 03:09.14 | AlexandreGuedes | brlcad: i can submit my patch after 3 april ? |
| 03:09.20 | brlcad | AlexandreGuedes: yes |
| 03:09.35 | Malyce | Oh, that would be great |
| 03:09.35 | brlcad | just should let someone know if that's the plan, maybe state it in your proposal |
| 03:09.51 | brlcad | you have all the way up until we do final rankings and select |
| 03:09.56 | brlcad | but obviously the sooner the better |
| 03:10.11 | AlexandreGuedes | i have enough time |
| 03:10.11 | Malyce | Or maybe if you could suggest another idea, I could work on it faster |
| 03:10.16 | brlcad | as we'll be less inclined to bump you much higher/lower the closer we are to the deadline |
| 03:11.11 | brlcad | fixing bugs is always a great way to show your skill as it involves comprehending and navigating code more than writing it |
| 03:11.15 | brlcad | writing code is pretty easy |
| 03:11.35 | brlcad | reading it is hard |
| 03:12.07 | Malyce | where can I see the bug list ? |
| 03:12.07 | brlcad | yet with open source, unlike school work and short-lived commercial products, you usually end up reading code WAY more than you write code |
| 03:12.28 | brlcad | there's a BUGS file in the source checkout as well as a bugs tracker on sourceforge |
| 03:12.44 | brlcad | Malyce: I'm really getting the feeling that you've not read everything that you're supposed to read on the wiki |
| 03:12.54 | brlcad | most of this is even itemized there :) |
| 03:13.03 | Malyce | I've tried, sorry. |
| 03:13.08 | brlcad | the brl-cad wiki, not the gsoc wiki |
| 03:14.55 | AlexandreGuedes | brlcad: ok... |
| 03:15.06 | brlcad | so there's this: http://brlcad.org/wiki/Google_Summer_of_Code/Checklist as well as http://brlcad.svn.sourceforge.net/svnroot/brlcad/brlcad/trunk/HACKING |
| 03:15.11 | brlcad | both good reading to get started |
| 03:15.19 | brlcad | the latter describes where the trackers are |
| 03:15.30 | brlcad | http://brlcad.svn.sourceforge.net/svnroot/brlcad/brlcad/trunk/BUGS is the venerable bugs file |
| 03:15.39 | brlcad | https://sourceforge.net/projects/brlcad has the trackers |
| 03:15.46 | AlexandreGuedes | i'll try fix a bug |
| 03:15.56 | brlcad | difference is basically internally reported bugs vs externally reported bugs |
| 03:16.38 | Malyce | You are right, I hadn't seen this page |
| 03:17.38 | brlcad | if you want to try a new code project, I suggest a simple importer that we don't have like obj-g, x3d-g, or vrml-g (but should still follow our HACKING guidelines) |
| 03:18.28 | AlexandreGuedes | brlcad: it is just i would propouse |
| 03:19.26 | CIA-40 | BRL-CAD: 03Sean 07http://brlcad.org * r1340 10/wiki/Google_Summer_of_Code/Application_Guidelines: link to the checklist in a few more places |
| 03:19.48 | CIA-40 | BRL-CAD: 03Sean 07http://brlcad.org * r1341 10/wiki/Google_Summer_of_Code/Application_Guidelines: silly preview |
| 03:20.08 | AlexandreGuedes | i'm writing my document ... |
| 03:20.33 | brlcad | Malyce: http://brlcad.org/wiki/Google_Summer_of_Code/2009 is where the checklist was principally mentioned |
| 03:22.21 | CIA-40 | BRL-CAD: 03Sean 07http://brlcad.org * r1342 10/wiki/Google_Summer_of_Code: /* Getting Started */ |
| 03:23.07 | Malyce | The first bug: "Windows MSVC build files seem to have the project dependencies all |
| 03:23.08 | Malyce | <PROTECTED> |
| 03:23.33 | Malyce | It would be easier for me to fix. But, will it count as a good patch ? |
| 03:25.05 | CIA-40 | BRL-CAD: 03Sean 07http://brlcad.org * r1343 10/wiki/Google_Summer_of_Code/Checklist: er, wtf.. send them to the subscribe page, not the archives |
| 03:25.29 | brlcad | Malyce: better than nothing, but would certainly prefer code over build system |
| 03:25.43 | brlcad | and that task is WAY more tedious than you are aware |
| 03:26.36 | brlcad | we have 400+ applications in BRL-CAD, about two-dozen libraries |
| 03:27.02 | brlcad | specifying dependencies for 400+ items is rather grueling :) |
| 03:28.07 | Malyce | I see |
| 03:28.09 | Malyce | * bot-bldxf fails in db_walk_tree(), interface may have changed |
| 03:28.10 | Malyce | ? |
| 03:28.18 | Malyce | too trivial ? |
| 03:29.39 | brlcad | m, I don't recall what that bug entailed |
| 03:29.48 | brlcad | so no, not too trivial if you figure that out and fix it ;) |
| 03:30.12 | Malyce | allright |
| 03:30.13 | brlcad | not too exciting a bug to fix, but certainly more useful than build system |
| 03:31.09 | jonored | Is there another branch that the brep primitive is being worked on in, or is trunk it? |
| 03:33.35 | brlcad | trunk is it |
| 03:34.24 | *** join/#brlcad jdoliner (n=jdoliner@c-68-51-76-57.hsd1.il.comcast.net) |
| 03:34.30 | brlcad | and I just verified, the lists are not incorrect |
| 03:35.05 | Malyce | Thanks a lot brlcad. I will get some sleep now, and then work on the patch. |
| 03:35.08 | Malyce | Goodnight |
| 03:35.22 | brlcad | cool, cya |
| 03:40.10 | jonored | So writing rt_brep_norm and maybe rt_brep_curve would be a good patch? they seem to not be there in trunk. |
| 03:50.57 | brlcad | jonored: wow, and would be impressive if you actually did.. |
| 03:51.15 | brlcad | you know what is involved there? :) |
| 03:58.20 | jonored | The first one looks like it's not that bad... it looks like the uv coordinates are stored and passed back, and for the normal it seems like that should be either calling EvNormal or taking the cross product of the u and v derivatives... am I missing something entirely? Curvature would take thinking about calc, though. |
| 03:59.18 | brlcad | it'll hard to implement and verify without brep ray tracing being complete |
| 03:59.25 | brlcad | it only works on some basic shapes at the moment |
| 03:59.38 | brlcad | though I suppose you could use one of the test cases we already have that render correctly |
| 03:59.43 | brlcad | and get uv working right there |
| 03:59.57 | brlcad | hey, no -- that's cool -- go for it :) |
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| 04:15.36 | andrecastelo | nice mail, brlcad |
| 04:15.57 | andrecastelo | just finished reading the tale of two developers ;) |
| 04:16.58 | bjorkintosh | tail of two developers? |
| 04:17.03 | bjorkintosh | was a bikeshed involved? |
| 04:17.58 | andrecastelo | bjorkintosh: the dreaded bike shed ;) |
| 04:18.08 | andrecastelo | bjorkintosh: http://webchick.net/embrace-the-chaos |
| 04:18.35 | brlcad | thanks andrecastelo |
| 04:18.53 | *** join/#brlcad elite01 (n=omg@unaffiliated/elite01) |
| 04:19.58 | brlcad | love it, particularly relevant for some of the devs on brl-cad and new devs in general |
| 04:20.03 | brlcad | one of the hardest tendencies to break |
| 04:20.30 | brlcad | but one that almost *invariably* happens with impassioned open source devs |
| 04:22.06 | andrecastelo | i was never much of a pat person ;) i remember last year, someone said he/she (don't remember now) liked big commits |
| 04:23.10 | bjorkintosh | Pat works in isolation |
| 04:23.20 | bjorkintosh | pat is just a skunk-works kinda guy. |
| 04:23.42 | bjorkintosh | probably should be working for said organization. |
| 04:24.37 | bjorkintosh | hah. |
| 04:37.48 | starseeker | fixes archer icon colors |
| 04:40.18 | yukonbob | heads for home... maybe a coffee on the way.. |
| 05:01.44 | brlcad | plays with the concept, still far from done: http://brlcad.org/tmp/arb8faces.png |
| 05:10.34 | *** join/#brlcad Ralith|trip (i=482b4af3@gateway/web/ajax/mibbit.com/x-93b0bfd208df83dd) |
| 05:10.42 | Ralith|trip | checks in again |
| 05:37.07 | *** join/#brlcad dreeves (n=IceChat7@67.130.253.14) |
| 06:04.25 | AlexandreGuedes | brlcad: hi |
| 06:04.44 | AlexandreGuedes | file formats like obj vrml and x3d |
| 06:05.14 | AlexandreGuedes | are not CGS system |
| 06:06.09 | AlexandreGuedes | i should convert these in a BOT |
| 06:07.24 | AlexandreGuedes | (Bag of Triangles) |
| 07:42.25 | AlexandreGuedes | brlcad: are you on ? |
| 07:43.07 | alex_joni | AlexandreGuedes: it's night over there |
| 07:43.11 | alex_joni | wait a couple hours |
| 07:43.24 | AlexandreGuedes | hum.. |
| 07:43.48 | AlexandreGuedes | alex_joni: where are you from ? |
| 07:50.14 | pacman87 | ~ask |
| 07:50.14 | ibot | Questions in the channel should be specific, informative, complete, concise, and on-topic. Don't ask if you can ask a question first. Don't ask if a person is there; just ask what you intended to ask them. Better questions more frequently yield better answers. We are all here voluntarily or against our will. |
| 07:50.55 | pacman87 | AlexandreGuedes: ^^ |
| 07:51.33 | *** part/#brlcad jdoliner (n=jdoliner@c-68-51-76-57.hsd1.il.comcast.net) |
| 07:51.46 | b0ef | was any work started on the new interactive gui? |
| 08:12.17 | *** join/#brlcad d_rossberg (n=rossberg@bz.bzflag.bz) |
| 08:20.10 | alex_joni | AlexandreGuedes: .ro |
| 08:23.18 | *** join/#brlcad _sushi_ (n=_sushi_@84-72-93-63.dclient.hispeed.ch) |
| 08:43.36 | brlcad | AlexandreGuedes: yes, they are non-csg, so you convert to a non-csg during export (there are plenty of examples of other converters), or pick another converter that does support csg (like pov-g) |
| 08:44.23 | brlcad | b0ef: yes, but discussion for later |
| 09:46.19 | CIA-40 | BRL-CAD: 03202.3.77.143 07http://brlcad.org * r1344 10/wiki/User:Hippieindamakin87: /* Deliverables */ |
| 09:58.24 | *** join/#brlcad mafm (n=mafm@223.Red-83-49-86.dynamicIP.rima-tde.net) |
| 09:59.37 | CIA-40 | BRL-CAD: 03202.3.77.143 07http://brlcad.org * r1345 10/wiki/User:Hippieindamakin87: |
| 10:05.05 | hippieindamakin8 | brlcad, any comments ? |
| 10:06.38 | hippieindamakin8 | on the wiki |
| 10:09.51 | mafm | hallo |
| 10:11.23 | hippieindamakin8 | hey mafm |
| 10:11.30 | hippieindamakin8 | good morning |
| 10:22.58 | CIA-40 | BRL-CAD: 03Suryajith 07http://brlcad.org * r1346 10/wiki/User:Hippieindamakin87: |
| 10:46.04 | CIA-40 | BRL-CAD: 03Suryajith 07http://brlcad.org * r1347 10/wiki/User:Hippieindamakin87: |
| 10:51.10 | CIA-40 | BRL-CAD: 03Suryajith 07http://brlcad.org * r1348 10/wiki/User:Hippieindamakin87: |
| 10:56.37 | *** join/#brlcad elite01 (n=omg@unaffiliated/elite01) |
| 11:36.56 | AlexandreGuedes | my plan is use simple shapes like triangles to represent a model |
| 11:37.39 | mafm | AlexandreGuedes: did you submit them? |
| 11:38.20 | AlexandreGuedes | not yet |
| 11:41.39 | *** join/#brlcad madant (n=d@117.196.128.52) |
| 11:47.42 | *** join/#brlcad hippieindamakin8 (n=hippiein@210.212.55.3) |
| 11:49.33 | mafm | AlexandreGuedes: you only have a few hours left |
| 11:49.48 | mafm | madant: hippieindamakin8: welcome back |
| 11:49.57 | AlexandreGuedes | i'm finishing |
| 11:50.13 | mafm | nice :) |
| 11:50.25 | AlexandreGuedes | thanks |
| 11:50.28 | hippieindamakin8 | mafm, hey :) |
| 11:50.41 | hippieindamakin8 | mafm, making a presentation on NOx emmisions :P |
| 11:50.43 | AlexandreGuedes | this week i had many dead lines.. |
| 11:52.06 | mafm | AlexandreGuedes: be sure to submit to google first to not have problems later, then try to follow the specific brlcad deadlines: submitting it to the mailing list, creating pages in the wiki, starting to think about a patch if you haven't yet, etc :) |
| 11:52.31 | mafm | hippieindamakin8: I hope that you're not making a hands-on NOx emission! |
| 11:52.49 | mafm | or rather, live methane emission |
| 11:52.50 | mafm | :P |
| 11:53.37 | hippieindamakin8 | :P mafm nope .my term paper for the energy systems course was on NOx emmisions and HCCI technology |
| 11:57.26 | mafm | nice |
| 11:57.52 | mafm | maybe you should apply for tata instead of brlcad! ;) |
| 12:02.47 | brlcad | AlexandreGuedes: our format is very generalized and flexible, so you will be able to import their geometry into our container with pretty much 1-1 faithful preservation |
| 12:02.59 | brlcad | if they have polygons, you import as nmg |
| 12:03.06 | brlcad | if they have triangles, you import as bot |
| 12:03.13 | brlcad | if they have primitives, you import as primitives, etc |
| 12:03.47 | brlcad | hippieindamakin8: not yet -- said submitting near the deadline would make things more tough! several need a review |
| 12:04.31 | hippieindamakin8 | brlcad, i do understand :) u did tell us that u would be extremely busy at this point of time |
| 12:07.26 | *** join/#brlcad BigAToo (n=BigAToo@pool-96-230-124-155.sbndin.btas.verizon.net) |
| 12:08.04 | mafm | wants a percentage of google stipends for herding gsoc students into brlcad trap :P |
| 12:21.36 | hippieindamakin8 | mafm, how abt keep mafm happy fund :P |
| 12:25.40 | mafm | yay, that'll make it :D |
| 12:26.30 | mafm | I'll donate 1 or 2 pennies to brlcad too, for his patience |
| 12:26.42 | mafm | brlcad-the-man, I mean |
| 12:27.57 | mafm | bbiab |
| 12:32.31 | *** join/#brlcad madant (n=d@117.196.133.97) |
| 12:42.28 | starseeker | brlcad: nice sketch! |
| 12:42.55 | starseeker | I'd suggest that it might be better to have the green faces non-transparent, and leave the center cube transparent |
| 12:44.50 | starseeker | but a VERY nice job - I take it you did that in BRL-CAD itself? |
| 12:45.24 | hippieindamakin8 | hey starseeker |
| 12:47.00 | starseeker | howdy |
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| 12:50.35 | *** join/#brlcad madant (n=d@117.196.135.227) |
| 12:56.54 | starseeker | hippieindamakin8: I notice you suggest the use of LiDIA, which would in turn involve LAPACK. That's a pretty hefty set of requirements |
| 12:56.55 | *** join/#brlcad madant_ (n=d@117.196.135.227) |
| 12:59.05 | hippieindamakin8 | starseeker, yeah but re-implementing the multi-precision floating point libs takes way too much of time |
| 12:59.25 | starseeker | Hmm. Need brlcad to weigh in on this |
| 12:59.42 | starseeker | LiDIA's license is a little funky |
| 13:00.20 | hippieindamakin8 | aah is it ? |
| 13:00.31 | starseeker | it MIGHT be ok, but it needs studying |
| 13:00.32 | hippieindamakin8 | looks at the documentation of LiDIA |
| 13:00.50 | starseeker | their statement that it's "OK for noncommerical use" on the website is worrisome |
| 13:01.21 | hippieindamakin8 | aah :| that is not very good |
| 13:02.48 | hippieindamakin8 | starseeker, i planned on tweaking arnd with the BOOLE system which already uses the package LiDIA. |
| 13:03.21 | starseeker | the actual license text isn't standard, at a quick read |
| 13:03.24 | starseeker | checks BOOLE |
| 13:03.37 | hippieindamakin8 | starseeker, :| |
| 13:03.50 | hippieindamakin8 | Copyright 1997 The University of North Carolina at Chapel Hill. |
| 13:03.50 | hippieindamakin8 | <PROTECTED> |
| 13:03.50 | hippieindamakin8 | <PROTECTED> |
| 13:03.50 | hippieindamakin8 | <PROTECTED> |
| 13:03.50 | hippieindamakin8 | <PROTECTED> |
| 13:03.53 | hippieindamakin8 | <PROTECTED> |
| 13:03.54 | hippieindamakin8 | <PROTECTED> |
| 13:04.05 | starseeker | ow |
| 13:04.33 | starseeker | yeah, that makes it sound like commercial use could be a problem |
| 13:04.34 | hippieindamakin8 | starseeker, that shouldnt be a problem ! |
| 13:04.54 | starseeker | they specify educational, research and non-profit purposes |
| 13:05.05 | starseeker | that means other purposes do NOT have permission |
| 13:05.06 | hippieindamakin8 | :| |
| 13:05.25 | hippieindamakin8 | so i need to re write the proposal |
| 13:06.41 | hippieindamakin8 | starseeker, will get back to u in 5 mins. going to another lab in the next building |
| 13:07.13 | starseeker | I've got to get going myself |
| 13:07.21 | starseeker | just thought I'd point out the potential issue there |
| 13:09.21 | hippieindamakin8 | starseeker, any suggestions on how i should proceed ? |
| 13:10.08 | starseeker | are there any similar libs with clearer licensing? |
| 13:10.34 | starseeker | You might check with brlcad when he gets in - he has a broader knowledge of this sort of software than I do |
| 13:10.43 | hippieindamakin8 | yeah nlt starseeker |
| 13:11.18 | hippieindamakin8 | i have checked nlt too . but planned on using liDIA as it was already implemented in BOOLE |
| 13:11.53 | hippieindamakin8 | *ntl |
| 13:12.49 | starseeker | hippieindamakin8: do you have a link to BOOLE handy? |
| 13:12.55 | hippieindamakin8 | yeah |
| 13:13.04 | hippieindamakin8 | http://www.cs.unc.edu/~geom/CSG/boole.html |
| 13:14.06 | hippieindamakin8 | starseeker, if LiDIA cant be used then ntl(http://www.shoup.net/ntl/) can be used along with GMP |
| 13:15.15 | starseeker | NTL is GPL, not LGPL |
| 13:15.22 | hippieindamakin8 | http://www.cs.unc.edu/~geom/CSG/BOOLE-DOCS/copyright |
| 13:15.39 | starseeker | yeah, saw that |
| 13:16.06 | starseeker | you should ask brlcad about those license questions and whether they make using those in the project a non-starter |
| 13:16.31 | hippieindamakin8 | yeah :| |
| 13:16.55 | starseeker | ok, I gotta run |
| 13:17.11 | hippieindamakin8 | starseeker, thanks and cya |
| 13:35.58 | ``Erik | *readreadread* |
| 13:36.41 | ``Erik | a patch lets us know you are able to a) use subversion and b) build the system. I wouldn't sweat the patch phase too much :) |
| 13:37.07 | ``Erik | dependancies ... all that info is defined in the makefile.am, so it could be a reasonably simple translation issue (though tedious, yes) |
| 13:37.31 | ``Erik | all heil the bikeshed! |
| 13:38.12 | ``Erik | brlcad: perhaps we should generate a list of pre-acceptance patch ideas next time around? |
| 13:39.51 | ``Erik | musta picked up a stomach virus or something, was bugging me yesterday, now it's messing with me bad 'nuff that I can't drive far :( had to call into work |
| 13:40.26 | ``Erik | stopped by the shop, got an updated estimate, gonna be another month to repair :( and close to the $ for a total :( sucks |
| 13:40.40 | ``Erik | a lot of the pieces are 3x the price of a normal component for a 3 series |
| 13:40.44 | ``Erik | sucks. |
| 13:43.38 | mafm | 3 series? |
| 13:49.55 | bjorkintosh | bmw. |
| 13:50.17 | bjorkintosh | what's wrong with your vehicle, ``Erik ? |
| 13:51.13 | *** join/#brlcad hippieindamakin8 (n=hippiein@210.212.55.3) |
| 13:56.52 | *** join/#brlcad samrose (n=samrose@adsl-99-147-180-206.dsl.lgtpmi.sbcglobal.net) |
| 14:01.07 | ``Erik | bumped a curb |
| 14:01.25 | ``Erik | http://brlcad.org/~erik/m3-2/ |
| 14:02.13 | ``Erik | (looks bad there, they'd pulled the bumper cover out and removed the plastic cover from teh wheelwell) |
| 14:03.19 | ``Erik | and for some reason, brlcad refuses to loan me his brand new lotus O.o :D *duck* |
| 14:04.02 | *** join/#brlcad typ0 (n=coder@um-sd06-125-2.uni-mb.si) |
| 14:13.04 | brlcad | still isn't satisfied.. http://brlcad.org/tmp/edit_arb8_1024.png |
| 14:13.10 | brlcad | but better |
| 14:13.51 | AlexandreGuedes | i should link papers ? |
| 14:14.09 | AlexandreGuedes | in my project ... |
| 14:14.15 | brlcad | starseeker: yeah, the sketch was all done in brl-cad, that latter had a little compositing done to it to get the right emphasis |
| 14:14.26 | ``Erik | if you want, alexandre |
| 14:15.09 | brlcad | we have permission from the boole authors to do what we want with boole |
| 14:15.35 | ``Erik | boole project? O.o |
| 14:15.46 | brlcad | has/had that in e-mail somewhere -- could probably talk to manocha again and get another okay if it became critical issue |
| 14:15.48 | ``Erik | google isn't helpful, it gives me george boole plus some lithp stuff |
| 14:16.54 | ``Erik | has spent the morning on the phone in legal and contractual type things, so may be apt to go all pointy-haired retarded at any moment, btw... like requesting signed approval via fax for boole, whatever that is :D *duck* *run* *hide* |
| 14:17.16 | brlcad | ``Erik: possibly (re patch ideas) .. I was thinking of identifying TODO/BUGS items with a "QUICKIE" label of some sort for the ones that should be pretty simple (less than a full day's effort) |
| 14:17.51 | ``Erik | we have to fight the notion of a 'veteran' grabbing a quickie just to get it knocked off, though |
| 14:18.01 | brlcad | AlexandreGuedes: you can link papers if it helps clarify |
| 14:18.09 | ``Erik | the "just do it" vs training opportunity is a beeyotch |
| 14:18.27 | brlcad | more interesting is to usually link to a portfolio / profile if you have one, but if not that's fine too |
| 14:18.42 | brlcad | ``Erik: search for "boole csg" |
| 14:18.48 | brlcad | work done at UNC |
| 14:18.56 | ``Erik | unc? |
| 14:19.05 | ``Erik | I think I've seen this before |
| 14:19.08 | brlcad | university of north carolina at chapen hill |
| 14:19.12 | brlcad | you have |
| 14:19.17 | brlcad | that's our bradley |
| 14:19.17 | ``Erik | was this one of the utah rt posters? |
| 14:19.36 | brlcad | the only folks (in academia) that I know of that got an actual vehicle .g transfer |
| 14:19.51 | brlcad | no, boole/esolid are older research |
| 14:19.56 | ``Erik | wants to arl1 the hilux |
| 14:20.17 | AlexandreGuedes | brlcad: papers tha had wirte, but they aren't strongly related with brl-cad... |
| 14:20.39 | ``Erik | alexandre: we're looking for competency and utility, not necessarily relation |
| 14:20.54 | brlcad | dinesh and john keyser are the guys behind those works, you may have met/remember them from siggraph |
| 14:21.32 | AlexandreGuedes | ok thanks |
| 14:21.38 | ``Erik | someone who did mad awesome code in say firefox would be a big bump up when we try to select :) |
| 14:21.50 | brlcad | AlexandreGuedes: that wasn't for you, that was for ``Erik ;) |
| 14:22.09 | brlcad | AlexandreGuedes: it's your judgement to determine whether it's worth linking them or not |
| 14:22.47 | ``Erik | uh, someone said something about gsoc not being about applying for a job... I'd argue that's incorrect, but it's a short term contract job, so the focus is different |
| 14:22.56 | AlexandreGuedes | brlcad: I was thanking eriki by the information |
| 14:23.07 | ``Erik | it's about saying "I can do awesome things that you want", not "I'll be an awesome team member for the next 20 years" |
| 14:23.31 | hippieindamakin8 | hey brlcad |
| 14:23.45 | hippieindamakin8 | starseeker, and i had a discussion on the licences |
| 14:23.58 | brlcad | typ0: I don't generally answer "hellos" via PM -- if you have something to say or ask, I'd be more than happy to talk but it's not the "IRC-way" to do a "hi ..[wait].. hi ..[wait].. are you there? .. [wait] .. " just say what you were going to say |
| 14:24.19 | ``Erik | happy people get paid to do what what love, hopefully we attract folk who are happy doing stuff in open source BRL-CAD land and they continue to contribute :) |
| 14:24.48 | ``Erik | oh, uh, uhhhhh esr has something about that |
| 14:24.51 | ``Erik | "don't ask to ask" |
| 14:24.51 | hippieindamakin8 | brlcad, wat do u say about it |
| 14:25.07 | brlcad | ``Erik: actually i'd rather them sell the latter :P |
| 14:25.13 | jonored | Is it known (off the top of people's heads) to not be valid to translate a spline between two surfaces (with a not-unreasonable error formula) by translating its control points?... |
| 14:25.21 | brlcad | and the point is to acquire new devs, not just get some code out of folks |
| 14:25.40 | ``Erik | we want the 20 year folk, yes. But we don't need the full grilling that those guys recieve... |
| 14:25.42 | brlcad | the short-term contract is just the mechanism to help kick things off and keep bills paid |
| 14:25.56 | hippieindamakin8 | as in LiDIA and boole's licences arent straightforward. if instead of LidIA ,ntl(which is just GPL and not LGPL) is used along with GMP how bt it |
| 14:26.27 | ``Erik | and I like to imagine that it's an important and fun project with nice and fun people, so there's a lot of imputus to stick around |
| 14:26.35 | hippieindamakin8 | brlcad, ``Erik ^ |
| 14:26.45 | ``Erik | but it's definitely not a "bust out the cv and wear a tie" deal |
| 14:27.47 | ``Erik | perhaps I'd be better in phrasing it that the goal is to impress the geeks, not a pointy haired mgmt type :) |
| 14:28.54 | brlcad | yeah, thats pretty much what I said to folks last night too .. don't really care who you are or what school you go to -- care about what you want to do, your ability to do that work, and your short/long term interests |
| 14:29.49 | ``Erik | *nod* sage |
| 14:29.52 | brlcad | thinks http://brlcad.org/tmp/edit_arb8_1024.png makes for a decent BREP image too |
| 14:30.07 | brlcad | hmm |
| 14:30.32 | ``Erik | heh, mensa is a fistful of 'smart' useless people, people who really matter dont' join mensa, they go do something real :D |
| 14:30.45 | brlcad | has a little problem that I made the numbers too small to scale it down to 128x128 |
| 14:30.51 | ``Erik | it's what ya do, not what ya have |
| 14:30.55 | brlcad | not really readable under 512x512 |
| 14:31.24 | brlcad | thinks ``Erik is gazing a little to deeply into his mensa navel now :) |
| 14:31.35 | ``Erik | declined the invite |
| 14:31.50 | ``Erik | had better things to do than pay for a circlejerk |
| 14:32.18 | brlcad | and no way, you can borrow Elle .. she's seen what you do to your babies |
| 14:32.34 | brlcad | heh, s/,// |
| 14:32.34 | ``Erik | this morning, for example, I'm figuring out the relationship between REST and continuation based web frameworks |
| 14:32.53 | ``Erik | heh, wow, that erroneous grammer could be... fatal :D |
| 14:33.27 | ``Erik | they're digging to look for mechanical failure :/ |
| 14:33.49 | ``Erik | I doubt they'd be able to identify any with legal sureness, though |
| 14:33.51 | ``Erik | sucks |
| 14:34.10 | *** join/#brlcad AlexandreGuedes_ (n=chatzill@187-24-10-94.3g.claro.net.br) |
| 14:34.19 | poolio | brlcad: was that around when I was working on brep code? |
| 14:34.26 | brlcad | doesn't even want to know how you happened to hit a curb |
| 14:34.31 | brlcad | poolio: no, I just did that this morning |
| 14:34.31 | ``Erik | <-- would be willing to swap cars on a drive to lunch some day, just to see what it's about, though :) |
| 14:34.32 | ``Erik | well |
| 14:34.34 | ``Erik | I stopped |
| 14:34.38 | ``Erik | I started moving and turned left |
| 14:34.54 | ``Erik | and then the car quit turning and went straight a bit |
| 14:34.57 | ``Erik | and there was a curb in the way |
| 14:35.23 | ``Erik | tha'ts my best recollection, of course your brain goes all sorts of nutty when you're in an accident like that, so *shrug* who knows |
| 14:35.50 | brlcad | sure, blame it on the curb |
| 14:35.58 | ``Erik | it jumped outta nowhere, honest |
| 14:36.06 | brlcad | they do that |
| 14:36.20 | ``Erik | almost got rear-ended by a truck this morning, tailgating me and a squirrel when whacko on the road |
| 14:37.46 | ``Erik | how's release coming? saw a couple commits last night |
| 14:40.47 | CIA-40 | BRL-CAD: 03202.3.77.11 07http://brlcad.org * r1349 10/wiki/User:Hippieindamakin87: /* Proposed approach */ |
| 14:42.27 | typ0 | BRL-CAD 7.10.4 isn't launching on my PPC Mac |
| 14:43.13 | typ0 | it complains about using CoreFoundation functionality after fork() without an exec() |
| 14:43.30 | typ0 | when i try to launch mged |
| 14:53.35 | ``Erik | which version of osX? |
| 14:53.41 | typ0 | Leopard |
| 14:53.43 | typ0 | 10.5.6 |
| 14:54.09 | ``Erik | hrm, we have 10.4 on ppc, but only intel for 10.5 |
| 14:54.35 | ``Erik | can you paste the full error log to http://pastebin.bzflag.bz/ ? |
| 14:54.39 | typ0 | sure |
| 14:55.50 | typ0 | http://pastebin.bzflag.bz/m5dfb3330 |
| 14:56.37 | ``Erik | thanks... *guru meditation* |
| 14:57.00 | ``Erik | smells like forkbomb prevention gone awry |
| 14:57.03 | typ0 | if i follow those instructions and with gdb I break on that symbol, i can't even do much |
| 14:57.13 | typ0 | because the program exits with interrupted syscall |
| 14:57.32 | typ0 | i've seen this error before, i think in a php lib |
| 14:57.42 | ``Erik | is it acceptable to suggest grabbing 7.14.4 from the site and compiling yourself? |
| 14:57.43 | typ0 | probably a leopard restriction |
| 14:57.49 | typ0 | of course |
| 14:58.00 | ``Erik | 7.10.4 is very outdated :) |
| 14:58.22 | typ0 | i want to write an application to improve IGES importer/exporter |
| 14:58.31 | typ0 | any useful tips ? |
| 14:58.38 | ``Erik | oh, then you don't want 7.14.4, you want the svn 'trunk' checkout |
| 14:59.48 | hippieindamakin8 | brlcad, help |
| 15:00.05 | ``Erik | (which should be named "7.14.6" real soon now, if hippie would quit bugging brlcad) |
| 15:00.05 | ``Erik | :D |
| 15:00.11 | ``Erik | 'sup, hippie? |
| 15:00.45 | hippieindamakin8 | ``Erik, the problem is that the packages i intended to use are MAPC and LiDIA initially |
| 15:00.54 | ``Erik | license issues? |
| 15:01.14 | hippieindamakin8 | yeah |
| 15:01.33 | hippieindamakin8 | ``Erik, the licence issues are like this both MAPC and LiDIA are copywrit. |
| 15:01.41 | hippieindamakin8 | or copyrighted |
| 15:02.12 | ``Erik | hm, sit on it. we'll think. if it's just gpl, and we don't want to further infect the primary repo, it may be doable as a new module |
| 15:02.31 | hippieindamakin8 | ``Erik, neither of them is gpl either |
| 15:02.40 | ``Erik | oh, uh, url's for licenses? |
| 15:02.51 | ``Erik | dreads having to summon a legal team :( |
| 15:02.52 | hippieindamakin8 | i actually couldnt find any exact arithmetic packages which are LGPL |
| 15:03.02 | ``Erik | isn't gmp lgpl? |
| 15:03.10 | hippieindamakin8 | ``Erik, it is |
| 15:03.38 | hippieindamakin8 | ``Erik, http://brlcad.org/wiki/User:Hippieindamakin87#Proposed_approach |
| 15:03.42 | hippieindamakin8 | this is my approach |
| 15:03.49 | ``Erik | gmp is an exact precision package, no? do I fail to see something? |
| 15:04.22 | hippieindamakin8 | ``Erik, ftp://ftp.informatik.tu-darmstadt.de/pub/TI/systems/LiDIA/current/COPYING |
| 15:04.35 | ``Erik | exact arithmetic, lazy evaluation... talkin' haskell here? :D |
| 15:06.46 | hippieindamakin8 | ``Erik, their implementation in c++ |
| 15:07.19 | hippieindamakin8 | ``Erik, i had a plan of spawning a functional programming language from C++ to do this processes |
| 15:07.55 | hippieindamakin8 | ``Erik, how abt that ? |
| 15:08.08 | hippieindamakin8 | prefers python for that |
| 15:08.49 | ``Erik | in theory, we intend to introduce python, common lisp, and something else as basic scripting langauges to BRL-CAD |
| 15:09.32 | ``Erik | so, personally, the notion of python is not a showstopper in my mind... but I may be wrong, I defer to brlcad for an official stance |
| 15:09.37 | hippieindamakin8 | ``Erik, ur comments on the procedure ? |
| 15:10.13 | ``Erik | I've made all the comments I'm comfortable making :) my brain isn't 100% today... called in sick to work, etc |
| 15:11.03 | hippieindamakin8 | ``Erik, i am very comfortable with python so that is the reason i wanted to implement it with python |
| 15:11.16 | ``Erik | also; my proxy is farting on the ftp notion, so'z I can't view all the relevant data :( |
| 15:11.27 | hippieindamakin8 | ohh |
| 15:11.33 | ``Erik | <-- far more of a ruby fan than python :) |
| 15:12.00 | ``Erik | guido has something rollin', but I think he misses a few critical points |
| 15:12.15 | ``Erik | I think the next ruby is gonna remove some important stuff that I don't think matz groks :( |
| 15:12.26 | hippieindamakin8 | ``Erik, for the gsoc i ll code in python and then port it to ruby once i get more familiar with ruby by the end of summers |
| 15:12.58 | ``Erik | make sure that plan is in your proposal |
| 15:13.03 | jonored | seems to remember something about someone doing a test and python coming out 400 times slower than C++, and 100 times slower than common lisp, on some basic numerical stuff... |
| 15:13.24 | ``Erik | micro-benchmarks tend to produce stupid numbers like that :( |
| 15:13.53 | ``Erik | I've seen some where common lisp blows c++ out of the water... |
| 15:14.13 | ``Erik | the caveats are critical :) |
| 15:14.55 | jonored | The only ones I've seen on that are where it's testing stuff that gets essentially compiled out... that one was (I think) just matrix multiplication. |
| 15:15.29 | hippieindamakin8 | jonored, for matrix multiplications fortran is much faster than anything else |
| 15:15.31 | ``Erik | fortran stomps C on naive matrix mults on modern hardware... |
| 15:15.35 | ``Erik | aint' sayin' much, yo |
| 15:16.50 | ``Erik | (and the ONLY reason fortan wins is because their multidimensional arrays are column major instead of row major, so it just happens to tweak the cache lines a little better) |
| 15:19.56 | ``Erik | is doing cl stuff in personal time due to the faster "time to market" aspect :) |
| 15:20.52 | jonored | is in general very keen on common lisp. The only irritation is that it doesn't have first-class continutions and scheme does... |
| 15:22.40 | brlcad | no python for gsoc with only a few exceptions (ged/ge/gs scripting and web stuffs) |
| 15:22.48 | hippieindamakin8 | ``Erik, listen so technically openNURBs library which is being used shouldnt be used is it ? |
| 15:23.00 | brlcad | there's not enough time to be productive and integrate something well with the code base |
| 15:23.16 | *** join/#brlcad madant (n=d@117.196.128.181) |
| 15:23.22 | hippieindamakin8 | brlcad, so the implementation shall purely be in C++ |
| 15:23.37 | brlcad | it's one thing for an existing core dev to pick up a python project, entirely different for someone new just picking something familiar without regard to what we have or the impact |
| 15:23.57 | ``Erik | jonored: there're a couple addons that provide zomfg call/cc, I'm a scheme head myself :) #ucw is the channel for the framework I'm using, it provides call/cc |
| 15:24.06 | *** join/#brlcad madant (n=madant@117.196.128.181) |
| 15:24.34 | ``Erik | aight, there's your answer, python ain't cool for a gsoc, it's down teh road for the gurus |
| 15:24.43 | *** join/#brlcad devilsadvocate (n=devilsad@202.3.77.11) |
| 15:25.12 | ``Erik | note all the cya I threw down in that avenue :D |
| 15:25.36 | hippieindamakin8 | brlcad, i was just proposing tht python shall be used only in the library( away from the core code) |
| 15:26.13 | hippieindamakin8 | brlcad, if that is wat you say, i shall implement the said routines in c++ itself |
| 15:26.21 | ``Erik | is, um, what's its name... swag? is that gsoc purvue? |
| 15:27.00 | ``Erik | we had a summer student try&fail on it |
| 15:27.42 | ``Erik | (unified interface between a large set of languages) |
| 15:31.17 | brlcad | tick tock on the applications for any still remaining |
| 15:32.33 | brlcad | mentors, feel free to start commenting on them if you haven't already |
| 15:32.45 | brlcad | I won't be commenting for at least an hour still |
| 15:33.01 | ``Erik | hm |
| 15:33.14 | brlcad | hippieindamakin8: you didn't upset me in the least, it was a valid question |
| 15:33.15 | ``Erik | *look* 10 in the queue |
| 15:33.40 | hippieindamakin8 | brlcad, yeah thats very true that python all of a sudden :) |
| 15:34.01 | ``Erik | imagines that the only ways to piss brlcad off is to either key his car or shit on his rug |
| 15:34.06 | ``Erik | (sorry 'bout the rug) |
| 15:34.10 | brlcad | if you'd brought it up two weeks ago, we could have discussed in better detail ;) |
| 15:34.27 | hippieindamakin8 | brlcad, :| yeah |
| 15:34.47 | ``Erik | y'know if d'lo is gonna log on and say hi when he gets to his families place? |
| 15:35.03 | brlcad | doesn't care about his rug, now crap on my plasma, I might care .. but then I'd wonder how you got it up that high |
| 15:35.04 | hippieindamakin8 | but still with respect to the proposal my proposal submitted , i dint intend to use anything other than C/C++ |
| 15:35.36 | ``Erik | note it in your proposal. |
| 15:35.47 | ``Erik | or if it is noted, sorry for making noise :) |
| 15:36.13 | ``Erik | looks at the proposals... |
| 15:36.56 | typ0 | brlcad: is there a description of the new features in IGES 5.3 comparing to 5.0 |
| 15:37.11 | typ0 | that i can use to create a task list with a schedule |
| 15:38.45 | jonored | is going to have a sadly rushed proposal, but will have something in before the deadline... and hopes that a good patch afterwards could help a bit with a somewhat technically weaker proposal write-up. |
| 15:38.57 | CIA-40 | BRL-CAD: 03202.3.77.11 07http://brlcad.org * r1350 10/wiki/User:Hippieindamakin87: /* Timeline */ |
| 15:38.58 | ``Erik | ugh. too much marketspeak |
| 15:40.12 | *** join/#brlcad lifeeth (n=praneeth@unaffiliated/lifeeth) |
| 15:41.16 | brlcad | typ0: that's part of the leg work for that project |
| 15:41.26 | typ0 | ok |
| 15:41.27 | brlcad | I'm sure someone, somewhere, has that information |
| 15:41.30 | brlcad | I certainly don't :) |
| 15:41.33 | typ0 | eheh |
| 15:41.38 | ``Erik | naturally, dawn is incredibly verbose, but quite high level |
| 15:41.40 | typ0 | i searched around and didn't find much |
| 15:41.46 | brlcad | iirc, you can get at least comment drafts for iges online now |
| 15:41.59 | typ0 | i can do it during the community bonding period |
| 15:42.02 | typ0 | should i get accepted |
| 15:42.03 | brlcad | the 6.0 draft for example |
| 15:42.08 | typ0 | cool |
| 15:42.15 | brlcad | that was a couple years ago though |
| 15:42.30 | brlcad | i might have it stashed away, can check .. should you get accepted |
| 15:42.58 | typ0 | ok i'll work on the application |
| 15:43.45 | ``Erik | o.O |
| 15:44.21 | ``Erik | well, typ0... would you be interested in being part of our community even if you weren't accepted to our gsoc presense? |
| 15:45.23 | *** join/#brlcad madant (n=madant@117.196.146.192) |
| 15:46.52 | typ0 | well i find the IGES idea quite doable and interesting |
| 15:47.15 | typ0 | and always had an interest in CAD systems, even if i don't know a lot about them |
| 15:47.45 | typ0 | so i can do the project , and even continue working on it post-gsoc |
| 15:47.55 | typ0 | and take it from there |
| 15:48.05 | typ0 | btw, latest svn is not compiling on my mac |
| 15:48.07 | typ0 | http://pastebin.bzflag.bz/m7085cb13 |
| 15:48.07 | ``Erik | I'm not grilling you, I'm just trying to learn more of your interests and abilities :) |
| 15:48.37 | ``Erik | up's on his mac |
| 15:48.51 | typ0 | ;) |
| 15:49.11 | ``Erik | effin' configure.ac change :( *wait* |
| 15:49.53 | ``Erik | the paste looks like you're missing X headers |
| 15:50.12 | ``Erik | both the X package and the X developer package need to be installed :/ |
| 15:50.34 | ``Erik | ooh, automake error |
| 15:50.42 | ``Erik | error, not warning, a full-up error |
| 15:51.13 | typ0 | i think i have all the latest X11 stuff |
| 15:51.18 | CIA-40 | BRL-CAD: 03d_rossberg * r34145 10/rt^3/trunk/ (4 files in 2 dirs): added the ellipsoid (ID_ELL) primitive |
| 15:52.12 | brlcad | libtkhtml apparently isn't listing it's deps, needs Xlib |
| 15:52.41 | brlcad | probably something their build file is doing |
| 15:52.59 | brlcad | try going to that directory (src/other/tkhtml) and manually building |
| 15:53.29 | brlcad | add -lX11 |
| 15:53.52 | *** join/#brlcad samrose (n=samrose@adsl-99-147-180-206.dsl.lgtpmi.sbcglobal.net) |
| 15:57.10 | typ0 | rm -f libTkhtml3.0.dylib |
| 15:57.10 | typ0 | gcc (...) -L/usr/lib -L/usr/local/lib -L/System/Library/Frameworks/Tcl.framework/Versions/8.4 -ltclstub8.4 -L/System/Library/Frameworks/Tk.framework/Versions/8.4 -ltkstub8.4 -lX11 |
| 15:57.11 | typ0 | ld: library not found for -lX11 |
| 15:57.11 | typ0 | collect2: ld returned 1 exit status |
| 15:57.11 | typ0 | make: *** [libTkhtml3.0.dylib] Error 1 |
| 15:57.53 | brlcad | so you either need a library search path (-L...), or you don't have it |
| 15:58.06 | ``Erik | wow, qt as an indicator for platform popularity, lame :) |
| 15:58.23 | AlexandreGuedes_ | I submitted my project |
| 16:00.48 | ``Erik | hah, wow, whining about homework being a timekiller, uncool |
| 16:01.07 | brlcad | AlexandreGuedes_: great! |
| 16:01.07 | typ0 | yeah -L/usr/X11/lib did it |
| 16:01.17 | CIA-40 | BRL-CAD: 03202.3.77.11 07http://brlcad.org * r1351 10/wiki/User:Hippieindamakin87: /* Abstract */ |
| 16:01.52 | AlexandreGuedes_ | Someone can confirm.. ? |
| 16:02.30 | ``Erik | most systems have /usr/X /usr/X11 and /usr/X11R6 pointing to the same real directory |
| 16:02.51 | typ0 | yeah |
| 16:02.58 | ``Erik | fbsd recenty moved /usr/X11R6 to /usr/locla |
| 16:03.01 | ``Erik | local, even |
| 16:03.10 | typ0 | but in this case the Makefile only made reference to /usr/lib and /usr/local/lib |
| 16:03.19 | ``Erik | *shrug* ./configure LDFLAGS=-L/usr/X11/lib |
| 16:03.20 | ``Erik | :) |
| 16:03.42 | brlcad | either way, the autoconf/automake tests should have found it since we just let their tests do their thing during configure .. so something awry there |
| 16:04.10 | ``Erik | ok, mediafire for a resume sucks goat balls. get a real effin' homepage to post that. |
| 16:04.25 | typ0 | i have the latest X11 package from apple (xquartz.macosforge.org) |
| 16:04.30 | ``Erik | sucks, cuz I like the idea, but the presentation blew :( |
| 16:04.51 | *** part/#brlcad devilsadvocate (n=devilsad@202.3.77.11) |
| 16:12.17 | AlexandreGuedes_ | It is possible confirm if my submission were successfully? |
| 16:13.47 | ``Erik | dude, alexandre, wtf is with all the xml explosion that came through as text? |
| 16:14.25 | ``Erik | divs and font types and stuff, and there's like 5 lines of content in that 3 page monstrosity |
| 16:15.05 | ``Erik | I created src/conv/Formats.cvs a while back, d'no if you saw that |
| 16:20.25 | ``Erik | wow, chinese place says 25 minutes |
| 16:25.22 | AlexandreGuedes_ | ``Erik: i can erase it ? |
| 16:25.40 | ``Erik | erase what, the csv? |
| 16:26.45 | ``Erik | bbaib, heading to pick up lunch |
| 16:28.19 | AlexandreGuedes_ | the lines with div and font types |
| 16:31.11 | andrecastelo | ``Erik: that's melange making us crazy :( |
| 16:31.32 | andrecastelo | i had those appear more than once when I submitted |
| 16:32.43 | typ0 | the iges converter works as a separate binary, ie, can i implement command line parameters to specify the desired version to export/import ? |
| 16:32.50 | *** join/#brlcad devilsadvocate (n=devilsad@202.3.77.11) |
| 16:34.20 | typ0 | (i assume so since there is command line options parsing in the source) |
| 16:53.43 | jonored | ...And submitted. Short, but submitted. |
| 17:01.29 | ``Erik | needs to learn how to say "thank you" and "chopsticks" in chinese O.o |
| 17:02.44 | AlexandreGuedes_ | hard |
| 17:08.55 | andrecastelo | ``Erik: easy, domo arigato for thank you |
| 17:09.02 | andrecastelo | joking ;) |
| 17:17.30 | ``Erik | mr robato? what? |
| 17:26.43 | CIA-40 | BRL-CAD: 03Suryajith 07http://brlcad.org * r1352 10/wiki/User:Hippieindamakin87: |
| 17:28.16 | CIA-40 | BRL-CAD: 03Suryajith 07http://brlcad.org * r1353 10/wiki/User:Hippieindamakin87: |
| 17:57.56 | pacman87 | is it possible to create a degenerate NURBS that's a line instead of a surface? |
| 17:58.19 | *** part/#brlcad lifeeth (n=praneeth@unaffiliated/lifeeth) |
| 18:15.17 | *** join/#brlcad Malyce (n=iamtanma@wlanaccess-ext.jacobs-university.de) |
| 18:15.36 | Malyce | Hi. I was trying to make a patch to fix one of the bugs |
| 18:15.46 | Malyce | * bot-bldxf fails in db_walk_tree(), interface may have changed |
| 18:15.57 | Malyce | What is bot-bldxf ? |
| 18:17.30 | *** join/#brlcad elite01 (n=omg@unaffiliated/elite01) |
| 18:24.22 | typ0 | hmm, i finished building svn and mged launched, printed out a line about using Tcl scripts from a directory, and then gave a bus error |
| 18:24.26 | typ0 | Thread 0 Crashed: |
| 18:24.26 | typ0 | 0 libdm.19.dylib 0x001447d8 X_open_dm + 1644 (dm-X.c:343) |
| 18:28.38 | *** part/#brlcad devilsadvocate (n=devilsad@202.3.77.11) |
| 18:34.56 | typ0 | btw, i just submitted my application |
| 18:35.21 | typ0 | if there's anything i should clarify or improve, i'd appreciate the feedback :) |
| 18:35.40 | pacman87 | typ0: do you have a wiki page yet? |
| 18:35.51 | typ0 | no |
| 18:38.09 | typ0 | i will create it |
| 18:39.56 | Malyce | hints ? |
| 18:40.25 | Malyce | The tracker has no mention of it |
| 18:40.34 | Malyce | its in the BUGS list only |
| 18:42.39 | Malyce | Do all applicants need a wiki page ? |
| 18:43.00 | pacman87 | not required, but useful to bounce ideas around |
| 18:43.17 | pacman87 | how many applicants are here now? |
| 18:44.15 | Malyce | as admin, shouldn't you be able to tell ? |
| 18:44.29 | pacman87 | i'm not admin |
| 18:44.40 | Malyce | is brlcad still around ? |
| 18:44.49 | Malyce | or mafm ? |
| 18:44.49 | pacman87 | and i meant 'here' as in 'this channel' |
| 18:47.25 | Malyce | how do I find out, what bot-bldxf means ? |
| 18:59.28 | CIA-40 | BRL-CAD: 03Carlosvsilva 07http://brlcad.org * r1354 10/wiki/User:Carlosvsilva: Initial creation |
| 19:03.47 | *** join/#brlcad AlexandreGuedes (n=chatzill@189-92-153-219.3g.claro.net.br) |
| 19:15.11 | *** join/#brlcad hippieindamakin8 (n=hippiein@202.3.77.38) |
| 19:19.35 | madant | is now moderately un-sick :) |
| 19:20.35 | hippieindamakin8 | hey madant |
| 19:21.30 | madant | hey hippieindamakin8 |
| 19:24.45 | Malyce | hi madant. Can you tell me how I can find out what 'bot-bldxf' means. It was in the BUGS file, as in "* bot-bldxf fails in db_walk_tree(), interface may have changed" |
| 19:24.51 | Malyce | ? |
| 19:26.50 | brlcad | Malyce: by asking -- bots are "bags of triangles" -- bldxf is "build a dxf" |
| 19:26.57 | brlcad | it's a horrible name, but it means make a dxf from a bot |
| 19:27.13 | brlcad | if you're just getting started on that one, try for another bug |
| 19:27.34 | brlcad | there's another tool that technically makes bot-bldxf deprecated |
| 19:27.42 | Malyce | rats |
| 19:27.52 | Malyce | I was already in the middle of it |
| 19:27.56 | madant | Malyce, bot-bldxf and other dxf conversion tools are there in src/conv/dxf directory |
| 19:28.00 | brlcad | well, you are welcome to fix it |
| 19:28.00 | Malyce | I had read and understood the code |
| 19:28.05 | madant | oops.. brlcad beat me to it :D |
| 19:28.26 | brlcad | it's not going away right away, and still perfectly serves the purpose of the patch |
| 19:29.13 | brlcad | but the fact that it's missing a manual page means it was an unpublished/unfinished tool that never turned into a production tool |
| 19:29.50 | brlcad | and since then, there is now a bot_dump command that will export obj, dxf, vrml |
| 19:31.23 | brlcad | Malyce: what is your project? |
| 19:32.20 | Malyce | Extension of Core C++ Interfaces |
| 19:32.34 | Malyce | I said I would add primitive support |
| 19:32.46 | brlcad | so add another primitive to the core interface |
| 19:33.01 | brlcad | daniel just added another one today, you could use that as an example |
| 19:33.12 | Malyce | how much time did it take him ? |
| 19:33.19 | brlcad | ask him |
| 19:33.45 | Malyce | I am worried that it might take too long for the purpose of the patch. |
| 19:33.52 | brlcad | so ask him :) |
| 19:34.04 | Malyce | how ? The mailing list ? |
| 19:34.10 | brlcad | the code isn't that horribly complex, I can't imagine it was more than a day or two |
| 19:34.13 | brlcad | sure |
| 19:34.24 | brlcad | probably just a couple hours |
| 19:34.28 | Malyce | allright |
| 19:34.30 | brlcad | if even that |
| 19:34.50 | Malyce | I should probably alter my proposal then |
| 19:35.02 | Malyce | Because I estimated 10-15 hours per primitive |
| 19:35.03 | brlcad | you could implement the torus -- that should be fairly easy |
| 19:35.06 | Malyce | I wasn't sure |
| 19:35.15 | brlcad | why would you alter it now |
| 19:35.29 | brlcad | I don't know how long it'll take -- ASK HIM :) |
| 19:35.37 | Malyce | yes |
| 19:35.37 | Malyce | I am on it |
| 19:36.03 | brlcad | mine is just a guess, but I'm also very familiar with that code |
| 19:36.37 | brlcad | your first one would probably take a bit longer, but you'd be pretty familiar after a couple |
| 19:39.20 | Malyce | he added ellipsoid i see |
| 19:39.44 | *** join/#brlcad elite01 (n=omg@unaffiliated/elite01) |
| 19:40.32 | brlcad | yeah, I would have too |
| 19:40.40 | brlcad | he's probably working on tgc or torus next ;) |
| 19:40.50 | brlcad | you'll certainly get his attention with that patch ;) |
| 19:41.02 | brlcad | and he'd likely be the mentor for your project, so good to talk to him |
| 19:41.37 | brlcad | (though we do group mentoring, you can call on anyone -- he's just the lead on that area) |
| 19:42.14 | Malyce | Is it ok, if I send it to the mailing list ? Won't it spam everyone ? |
| 19:42.28 | brlcad | the dev list is pretty small |
| 19:42.45 | brlcad | the news and user mailing lists are the big ones |
| 19:43.11 | *** join/#brlcad andrecastelo (n=andrecas@150.165.134.157) |
| 19:43.18 | andrecastelo | hi guys |
| 19:44.17 | brlcad | howdy andrecastelo |
| 19:44.25 | andrecastelo | howdy brlcad |
| 19:44.27 | brlcad | how'd the applications go? |
| 19:44.35 | andrecastelo | i've sent only one, to blender |
| 19:44.45 | brlcad | cool, what for? |
| 19:45.15 | andrecastelo | blender's interface is being refactored and the way the inner data is accessed is changing |
| 19:45.29 | andrecastelo | and the big refactor will happen on version 2.5 |
| 19:45.55 | andrecastelo | with the refactoring, the python scripts will become incompatible |
| 19:46.08 | andrecastelo | so the application was to port some import/export scripts to the new system :) |
| 19:47.17 | andrecastelo | brlcad, how were the proposals this year? |
| 19:47.37 | andrecastelo | everyone was talking about a low number of proposals, i wonder why |
| 19:47.50 | madant | andrecastelo, blender sounds kewl :) how is school ? |
| 19:47.52 | brlcad | andrecastelo: curious actually |
| 19:48.02 | brlcad | our applications were down about 25% from last year |
| 19:48.19 | madant | is always reminded of "Catelo's Castle" whenever he sees the surname castelo :) |
| 19:48.34 | brlcad | bz's applications are actually up about 40% from last year |
| 19:48.37 | madant | brlcad: and quality-wise ;) ? |
| 19:48.45 | brlcad | quality is better for both |
| 19:48.50 | andrecastelo | madant, i'm currently in between semesters |
| 19:49.05 | andrecastelo | so, i'm free of them :) |
| 19:49.08 | madant | hmm.. bz beat us ( brl-cad - brlcad) :P |
| 19:49.10 | andrecastelo | and thus i'm a happy man |
| 19:49.32 | andrecastelo | madant, castelo = castle :) |
| 19:49.45 | brlcad | madant: the game has an quite an appealing advantage :) |
| 19:49.48 | madant | andrecastelo, i used to love both :) bunking classes and doing work in between semesters :P |
| 19:50.30 | madant | is not at all a gamer :D == feels stupid about pushing keys and moving the mouse imagining you are in a different world |
| 19:50.30 | andrecastelo | i felt demotivated this last semester, had some really bad teachers |
| 19:50.57 | hippieindamakin8 | madant, but u should try playing bzflag dude |
| 19:51.06 | madant | andrecastelo, aah.. nice :) well Dawn = dawn, Thomas = twin .. :P |
| 19:51.08 | andrecastelo | i tried bzflag but i do not have good reflexes |
| 19:51.36 | madant | is pretty sure he would suck at games too ;) |
| 19:51.37 | hippieindamakin8 | andrecastelo, neither do i . but it is fun with that arena and those options :) |
| 19:51.40 | CIA-40 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r34146 10/brlcad/trunk/ (8 files in 7 dirs): peanut butter release time, peanut butter release 7.14.6 with a baseball bat |
| 19:52.00 | madant | ah what the hell :) |
| 19:52.10 | madant | is installing bz |
| 19:52.15 | hippieindamakin8 | the only games i play are "frets on fire" and "bzflag" |
| 19:52.21 | starseeker | blinks - peanut butter with baseball bats? |
| 19:52.32 | hippieindamakin8 | madant, put the server as bzf.bzflag.net |
| 19:52.56 | madant | ok :) |
| 19:52.59 | hippieindamakin8 | madant, the lag from there was minimal when i was playing bzflag in bangalore |
| 19:53.58 | madant | hippieindamakin8, thanks :) hope i don't get addicted |
| 19:54.12 | CIA-40 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r34147 10/brlcad/trunk/misc/win32-msvc8/g_diff/g_diff.vcproj: g_diff needs libtclcad, oops on r34146 |
| 19:54.23 | brlcad | notes that starseeker definitely needs some peanut butter jelly time |
| 19:54.25 | hippieindamakin8 | madant, it is very rarely that some one joins tht game |
| 19:54.29 | pacman87 | you all up for a bzflag game? |
| 19:54.45 | brlcad | pacman87: hah, wish I could |
| 19:54.52 | brlcad | later today, sure |
| 19:55.00 | brlcad | pacman87: who all'd you apply to? |
| 19:55.06 | pacman87 | just here |
| 19:55.15 | madant | pacman87, hehe .. break from 6811 ;) |
| 19:55.20 | brlcad | ah, okay, cool |
| 19:55.39 | pacman87 | i realized the bzflag cheat prevention really needs the modularization of game logic |
| 19:55.46 | pacman87 | so the server can use the same code as the client |
| 19:56.25 | brlcad | it doesn't "really" need it, but it would greatly help it |
| 19:56.44 | brlcad | i had started more in-depth cheat preventions years ago with server-side dr and shot tracking |
| 19:56.57 | brlcad | but my goal was a networking optimization so I never committed it |
| 19:57.20 | pacman87 | unfortunate |
| 19:57.28 | brlcad | as there was a net problem with players teleporting across the server (it was a packet culling technique based on how close the other players were from you) |
| 19:57.41 | brlcad | made network use nearly linear |
| 19:58.11 | brlcad | would have allowed bzflag servers to support something like 100 players on a server that today can only support about 12 playesr |
| 19:58.20 | pacman87 | impressive |
| 19:58.26 | brlcad | if it wasn't for those damn teleporters :) |
| 19:58.36 | brlcad | then I got sidetracked before I finished implementing waypoints |
| 19:58.43 | pacman87 | you'd have to do something like Portal |
| 19:58.47 | brlcad | but the basic logic for server-side cheat checking was easily doable |
| 19:58.48 | hippieindamakin8 | brlcad, but the teleporters add much more fun to that game ;) |
| 19:58.57 | madant | grr... what is a good bzflag approach on TwinView :) windowed mode |
| 19:59.11 | pacman87 | madant: use top/bottom |
| 19:59.19 | pacman87 | and you can get the radar to fill the second screen |
| 19:59.21 | brlcad | madant: code up something better |
| 19:59.29 | pacman87 | set opacity to full |
| 19:59.35 | pacman87 | and size to max |
| 19:59.48 | madant | pacman87, :) seems like u ar sitting at a battlestation ;) |
| 20:00.06 | pacman87 | you may need to set the radar size in your conf file |
| 20:00.19 | madant | yeah i need to do some tinkering :) |
| 20:00.32 | madant | brlcad: :) hopefully when i get addicted to the game :D |
| 20:00.44 | pacman87 | if you want to play, let me know |
| 20:01.02 | madant | pacman87, sure :) brlcad plays a lot too ? |
| 20:01.16 | pacman87 | not that i know of |
| 20:02.18 | poolio | brlcad: do none of your supervisors read the commit messages? :P |
| 20:03.09 | pacman87 | madant: my.inexplicably.org:5156 |
| 20:03.10 | starseeker | brlcad: dunno what that means and maybe I'm better off that way ;-) |
| 20:08.17 | CIA-40 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r34148 10/brlcad/trunk/doc/docbook/BRL-CAD_db_format.xml: Add content for spec up to tables in Padding and Length Rounding - need to check those more carefully before redoing. |
| 20:14.00 | brlcad | madant: used to play a lot (one of the best, actually), but not in a long time |
| 20:14.46 | brlcad | poolio: it's an open source project, meritocracy rules the code, devs do as devs do |
| 20:15.49 | madant | :) i got quicked out for jitter |
| 20:15.54 | madant | just now |
| 20:16.11 | brlcad | shakes head at starseeker .. next you'll be telling me that you don't know what "badger, badger, badger" means too |
| 20:16.33 | starseeker | eh? |
| 20:16.39 | brlcad | slaps forehead |
| 20:16.55 | madant | pacman87, unable to connect :) |
| 20:17.15 | pacman87 | madant: in bzflag? |
| 20:17.34 | starseeker | has the distinct sensation of being back in high school listening without comprehension to the slang of his peers ;-) |
| 20:17.36 | brlcad | you have some google homework, your lady will probably find it funny :) |
| 20:17.40 | madant | i mean i connected to bzf.bzflag.. |
| 20:18.00 | pacman87 | sorry, it's port 5161 |
| 20:18.08 | madant | ah ok :) |
| 20:18.56 | starseeker | I dunno... her sense of humor is not to be trifled with |
| 20:20.43 | Malyce | BRL, I can't seem to be able to post on the 'brlcad-devel@lists.sourceforge.net' list |
| 20:20.48 | Malyce | although I subscribed |
| 20:21.48 | Malyce | ah no, I see |
| 20:21.50 | Malyce | its ok |
| 20:25.08 | starseeker | Hmm - BNF description of VRML 2.0 - cool http://graphcomp.com/info/specs/sgi/vrml/spec/part1/grammar.html |
| 20:26.02 | starseeker | idly contemplates the creation of a BNF definition for .g files, wonders if the spec has enough info to make one... |
| 20:33.18 | brlcad | starseeker: sure does, but wouldn't likely be efficient in the least |
| 20:33.27 | brlcad | have thought about it before too, though |
| 20:33.32 | brlcad | would be neat in itself |
| 20:33.48 | brlcad | just not too incredibly practical for binary files |
| 20:35.02 | madant | pacman87, :) i guess my brain has to get used to watching 3d rendered motion :D ( last game i played was probably 5 years ago :P) |
| 20:35.12 | pacman87 | ah |
| 20:35.17 | starseeker | formality might be useful as a framework though |
| 20:35.18 | pacman87 | it's a good start |
| 20:35.25 | pacman87 | there's hope for you yet :P |
| 20:35.40 | madant | :P |
| 20:35.48 | pacman87 | madant: you could always just make your radar really big |
| 20:35.53 | pacman87 | and ignore the rest of the screen |
| 20:35.59 | pacman87 | then it's back to 2d motion |
| 20:37.55 | starseeker | distcheck good on the mac |
| 20:39.04 | madant | pacman87, yeah.. i feel like that is the best approach for me :d |
| 20:39.58 | pacman87 | try some of the big/popular maps at the top of the list |
| 20:40.03 | pacman87 | and don't get discouraged |
| 20:44.12 | *** join/#brlcad PrezKennedy (i=Matthew@whitecalf.net) |
| 20:44.13 | brlcad | starseeker: cool, thanks |
| 20:44.29 | Malyce | hey BRL, I am having a problem compiling on Cygwin |
| 20:44.36 | Malyce | I ran the configure script |
| 20:44.49 | Malyce | And the first time, it told me that X11 wasn't installed |
| 20:45.22 | Malyce | Installed X11, reran script. It now says X11 is enabled, but Xi library was not found |
| 20:45.58 | Malyce | I followed the guide at: http://gears.aset.psu.edu/hpc/guides/cygwin/ |
| 20:46.50 | Malyce | Couldn't do the last step, since for some reason Cygwin setup didn't install the startxwin.bat file |
| 20:47.05 | Malyce | Workarounds ? |
| 20:47.10 | brlcad | install it by hand? |
| 20:47.28 | Malyce | The Xi library ? |
| 20:47.34 | brlcad | you can disable all X11 stuff if you don't mind not having a gui |
| 20:47.52 | Malyce | yes |
| 20:47.55 | Malyce | that would be great |
| 20:47.59 | Malyce | how ? |
| 20:48.06 | brlcad | --without-x11 |
| 20:53.23 | Malyce | ./configuration --witout-x11 ? |
| 20:53.25 | Malyce | without |
| 20:54.10 | pacman87 | ./configure --without-x11 |
| 20:57.16 | pacman87 | and you'll probably have to run 'mged -c' |
| 20:58.53 | Malyce | no, won't be running mged |
| 21:01.11 | *** join/#brlcad dreeves (n=IceChat7@67.130.253.14) |
| 21:01.13 | starseeker | brlcad: OK, Good on 64 bit linux too |
| 21:05.13 | Malyce | "Warning: Neither YACC parser nor LEX scanner was found." Will this affect Core C++ Interfaces or librt stuff ? |
| 21:06.28 | Malyce | Also "Floating point implementation is not IEEE754 compliant. htond and htonf may be incorrect" |
| 21:06.53 | brlcad | Malyce: no |
| 21:10.04 | CIA-40 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r34149 10/brlcad/trunk/BUGS: keep with a lot of objects in mged isn't working right. just prints out a usage statement. I haz test case. reported by lee and verified. |
| 21:13.13 | CIA-40 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r34150 10/brlcad/trunk/BUGS: |
| 21:13.13 | CIA-40 | BRL-CAD: verified another bug in the facetize -n commmand with lee where it is giving |
| 21:13.13 | CIA-40 | BRL-CAD: spurious 'color index out of range' errors on (at least) some 3-manifold |
| 21:13.13 | CIA-40 | BRL-CAD: surfaces. the painting algorithm in nmg_manif.c seems incomplete/flawed. |
| 21:14.44 | CIA-40 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r34151 10/brlcad/trunk/ChangeLog: last thing, update Changelog with items since 2009-03-06, ready to tag. |
| 21:19.52 | Malyce | Warning: Can't figure out how to do Dynamic loading or shared libraries on this system |
| 21:19.54 | Malyce | Bad ? |
| 21:27.22 | brlcad | pretty bad, but not fatal -- did you run autogen.sh ? |
| 21:29.37 | Malyce | before ./configure ? |
| 21:29.39 | brlcad | yes |
| 21:29.41 | Malyce | I think I tried |
| 21:29.45 | brlcad | heh |
| 21:29.51 | Malyce | didn't work for some reason |
| 21:30.09 | Malyce | I am 'make'ing right now |
| 21:30.09 | brlcad | given you're on a relatively obscure configuration, that's probably why you're getting that message |
| 21:30.23 | brlcad | you need a set of the gnu autotools that has been made for cygwin |
| 21:30.36 | Malyce | should I stop, and restart ? |
| 21:30.48 | brlcad | plus, you should be working from svn, not a source tarball ;) |
| 21:30.51 | brlcad | I would |
| 21:31.01 | brlcad | you can keep struggling if you like |
| 21:31.11 | brlcad | see if you get enough built to test a patch |
| 21:31.22 | Malyce | right, so first I should get the autotools |
| 21:31.28 | Malyce | second, checkout svn |
| 21:31.31 | Malyce | and then retry |
| 21:31.33 | Malyce | ? |
| 21:32.24 | brlcad | yeah, ideally |
| 21:35.08 | Malyce | Autoconf, Automake and libtools, all three ? |
| 21:35.50 | brlcad | yes |
| 21:36.08 | brlcad | and they in turn will want m4 and perl, maybe other minor deps |
| 21:44.19 | Malyce | no pain, no gain |
| 21:46.24 | CIA-40 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r34152 10/brlcad/branches/STABLE/ (2511 files in 220 dirs): merge trunk to STABLE from r33968 through HEAD r34151 for release 7.14.6 |
| 22:00.32 | *** join/#brlcad BigAToo (n=BigAToo@pool-96-230-124-155.sbndin.btas.verizon.net) |
| 22:14.20 | CIA-40 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r34153 10/brlcad/tags/rel-7-14-6/: |
| 22:14.20 | CIA-40 | BRL-CAD: tag release 7.14.6 |
| 22:14.20 | CIA-40 | BRL-CAD: tested: source build, binary mac 32-bit intel, binary linux 32-bit intel, binary linux 64-bit amd, binary linux 64-bit ia64/altix |
| 22:24.52 | poolio | brlcad: sweet :) |
| 22:25.27 | madant | yay :) |
| 22:25.39 | madant | is off to sleep after a very weird day and night |
| 22:36.46 | *** join/#brlcad ``Erik (i=erik@c-76-111-12-116.hsd1.md.comcast.net) |
| 22:39.20 | *** join/#brlcad jonored (n=jonored@LAZARUS2.WIFI.WPI.EDU) |
| 22:54.09 | CIA-40 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r34154 10/brlcad/trunk/ (NEWS README include/conf/PATCH): update post tagging to dev version 7.14.7 (haha). this may still end up being a 7.16 release.. |
| 22:55.41 | brlcad | thinks this has been an exhausting day |
| 22:56.13 | brlcad | some of you that didn't include nearly enough detail are going to have to make edits up on the wiki.. :P |
| 22:56.24 | brlcad | didn't post early enough to get a good review |
| 22:56.47 | brlcad | stupid that the app prevents edits, but we'll deal |
| 22:57.30 | madant | we shall overcome :D |
| 23:08.14 | brlcad | so it looks like we get a preliminary slot count on the 7th |
| 23:09.25 | *** topic/#brlcad by brlcad -> BRL-CAD Open Source Solid Modeling || http://brlcad.org || http://sf.net/projects/brlcad || Release 7.14.6 posted (20090403) || GSoC2009 Next Step: we're reviewing applications, preliminary slot count on 7th, selections announced on the 15th |
| 23:09.54 | madant | 11 action-packed days |
| 23:11.59 | madant | is sleep-deprived and high on orange juice |
| 23:13.23 | madant | brlcad: what is the maximum possible number of slots ? the total number of registered mentors ? |
| 23:31.14 | *** join/#brlcad jonored (n=jonored@LAZARUS2.WIFI.WPI.EDU) |
