| 00:25.49 | *** join/#brlcad docelic_ (n=docelic@77.237.104.12) |
| 00:39.40 | *** join/#brlcad louipc (n=louipc@bas8-toronto63-1096667871.dsl.bell.ca) |
| 00:40.45 | *** join/#brlcad louipc (n=louipc@bas8-toronto63-1096670121.dsl.bell.ca) |
| 00:40.58 | *** join/#brlcad louipc_ (n=louipc@bas8-toronto63-1096667871.dsl.bell.ca) |
| 00:56.02 | IriX64 | heheh change .a to .dll.a in tclm4 and it finds x now :) |
| 01:01.06 | IriX64 | http://www3.sympatico.ca/mario.dulisse2/desktop.png |
| 01:01.10 | IriX64 | :) |
| 02:23.24 | *** join/#brlcad dtidrow (n=dtidrow@c-69-255-182-248.hsd1.va.comcast.net) |
| 02:43.59 | yukonbob | louipc: /me didn't know you were a Torontonian... |
| 02:44.44 | louipc | yukonbob: are you? |
| 02:45.09 | yukonbob | I was -- and just got back from two weeks in TO -- was in Roncesvales... |
| 02:47.46 | louipc | cool, where are you now? |
| 02:47.55 | yukonbob | Whitehorse, YT. |
| 02:48.01 | louipc | mofo! |
| 02:48.07 | louipc | what's up there? |
| 02:48.11 | yukonbob | snow? |
| 02:48.25 | louipc | what brings a person there other than caribou? |
| 02:48.41 | yukonbob | my gf is a cultural anthropology grad student, doing her research... |
| 02:49.04 | louipc | ah |
| 02:49.13 | yukonbob | where abouts in TO are you? |
| 02:49.32 | louipc | watch out for invading russians, I might go up and help some time |
| 02:49.45 | louipc | yukonbob: Mississauga, heheh |
| 02:50.35 | yukonbob | ah -- re: russians -- are you in military? |
| 02:51.23 | louipc | nope |
| 03:13.00 | ``Erik | damn canucks |
| 03:17.41 | louipc | ``Erik: too late |
| 03:23.50 | *** join/#brlcad Twingy (n=justin@74.92.144.217) |
| 11:48.31 | *** join/#brlcad elite01 (n=elite01@dslc-082-082-089-177.pools.arcor-ip.net) |
| 12:49.47 | *** join/#brlcad bobbmt (n=graceind@static-71-240-124-130.pitbpa.east.verizon.net) |
| 12:50.38 | *** join/#brlcad Elperion (n=Bary@p54877509.dip.t-dialin.net) |
| 13:22.07 | *** join/#brlcad Z80-Boy (n=clock@zux221-122-143.adsl.green.ch) |
| 13:38.54 | *** join/#brlcad Z80-Boy (n=clock@zux221-122-143.adsl.green.ch) |
| 14:19.08 | ``Erik | *yawn*. |
| 17:25.20 | ``Erik | blargh |
| 17:31.30 | *** join/#brlcad MinuteElectron (n=MinuteEl@silentflame/member/pdpc.base.minuteelectron) |
| 17:50.56 | *** join/#brlcad minute-ssh (n=MinuteEl@silentflame/member/pdpc.base.minuteelectron) [NETSPLIT VICTIM] |
| 17:50.56 | *** join/#brlcad yukonbob (n=yukonbob@198.235.198.234) [NETSPLIT VICTIM] |
| 17:51.41 | *** join/#brlcad CIA-27 (i=cia@208.69.182.149) [NETSPLIT VICTIM] |
| 17:51.41 | *** join/#brlcad ``Erik (i=erik@c-68-54-174-162.hsd1.md.comcast.net) [NETSPLIT VICTIM] |
| 17:51.41 | *** join/#brlcad Maloeran (n=maloeran@glvortex.net) [NETSPLIT VICTIM] |
| 18:06.43 | *** join/#brlcad dtidrow_work (n=dtidrow@host169.objectsciences.com) |
| 18:14.38 | *** join/#brlcad elite01 (n=elite01@dslb-088-070-030-155.pools.arcor-ip.net) |
| 18:20.07 | *** join/#brlcad SWPadnos_ (n=Me@dsl245.esjtvtli.sover.net) |
| 18:30.19 | ``Erik | heh, nice, EDOOFUS :) |
| 18:31.25 | *** join/#brlcad elite01 (n=elite01@dslb-088-070-030-155.pools.arcor-ip.net) |
| 18:32.00 | ``Erik | ./errno.h:#define EDOOFUS 88 /* Programming error */ |
| 18:32.12 | ``Erik | and people say the fbsd community isn't very friendly :D |
| 18:45.19 | *** join/#brlcad Z80-Boy (i=clock@217-162-110-242.dclient.hispeed.ch) |
| 18:52.30 | brlcad | http://lists.freebsd.org/pipermail/freebsd-hackers/2003-May/000791.html |
| 18:53.29 | brlcad | opportunity doesn't get much better than that! |
| 18:54.37 | Z80-Boy | brlcad: I have just removed my e-mail |
| 18:54.55 | brlcad | ? |
| 18:55.02 | Z80-Boy | Cause I had to check the spams that got through the filter |
| 18:55.18 | Z80-Boy | And when I was absent for couple of days, my friend's e-mail server where it was hosted got overloade |
| 18:55.56 | Z80-Boy | wohoo, freedom! |
| 18:56.29 | Z80-Boy | brlcad: so I won't get any bugreport notifications regarding brl-cad |
| 18:56.38 | brlcad | ah, okay |
| 18:57.44 | Z80-Boy | Now I'll try to use IRC instead |
| 18:58.38 | brlcad | would be cool if cia could relay sf.net tracker changes |
| 18:59.58 | Z80-Boy | Once I had a folder with 70,000 spams taking 650MB |
| 19:00.08 | brlcad | wouldn't be too tricky to set up a hierarchical file-based tracker dump with a cron job that committed updates to svn |
| 19:00.31 | Z80-Boy | and the friend who hosted my e-mail already killed my IMAP connection several times when I was downloading a much smaller chunk of e-mails, just from 1 week of absence |
| 19:00.57 | Z80-Boy | I'll change the Ronja pages to say that people should ask for support on IRC |
| 19:02.57 | MinuteElectron | Gmail == No SPAM |
| 19:03.19 | Z80-Boy | I don't want to submit my private communication to Google |
| 19:03.27 | Z80-Boy | MinuteElectron: do they have a good spam filtering system? |
| 19:03.37 | MinuteElectron | hell yes |
| 19:04.07 | MinuteElectron | I have recieved about two pieces of spam on my gmail account ever, everything else goes to the spam bin which I check occasionally. |
| 19:04.23 | Z80-Boy | I don't want to need to check any spam bin |
| 19:04.43 | MinuteElectron | well, i've never had any real e-mail go to the spam bin |
| 19:04.50 | MinuteElectron | I'm just paranoid |
| 19:04.58 | Z80-Boy | brlcad: I have created two new models after the arbn issue was fixed, which was preventing them from being finished correctly |
| 19:05.29 | Z80-Boy | http://ronja.twibright.com/3d/plazmatron_s0.png |
| 19:05.32 | ``Erik | no spam, and still 98% of legitimate message! |
| 19:05.33 | ``Erik | s |
| 19:06.07 | ``Erik | spamassassin with a little training is solid, and you can retain the spam folder to look for false positives |
| 19:06.18 | Z80-Boy | http://ronja.twibright.com/3d/ronja_new_2.png |
| 19:06.28 | ``Erik | combined with mutts ability to sort by 'spamminess' (spam score)... :) |
| 19:07.03 | Z80-Boy | ``Erik: I had spamassassin, but the Perl segfaulted in some database library |
| 19:07.57 | Z80-Boy | brlcad: I can even post you .avi links if you want to see it as a rotating video |
| 19:08.32 | Z80-Boy | brlcad: now it seems that the arbn has no problem with unnormalized vectors anymore - I intentionally kept unnormalized vectors there, so that possible problems with brl-cad would be discovered |
| 19:09.02 | Z80-Boy | ``Erik: There is also an aspect called "Information overload" and "Information explosion", see Wikipedia on these terms |
| 19:09.41 | ``Erik | erm, why would I need to look at wikipedia for those? O.o |
| 19:09.55 | Z80-Boy | hehe |
| 19:10.03 | ``Erik | and, erm, the comment about mutts spam score sorting is to alleviate that issue... :D |
| 19:10.56 | Z80-Boy | Then the SMTP system got screwed by artificial, non-functional hurdles attempting to stop spammers |
| 19:11.22 | Z80-Boy | like sender verify, banning open relays and blacklisting dynamic IP addresses |
| 19:11.25 | ``Erik | heh, and I use my own mua for reading e-mail, to further reduce cognative load (breaks each mailing list into a seperate "mail box", etc) |
| 19:11.38 | Z80-Boy | From these three, every single one annoyed me when I tried to set up my legitimate e-mail system. |
| 19:12.08 | Z80-Boy | ``Erik: did you write it yourself? |
| 19:12.12 | ``Erik | the mua? yeah |
| 19:12.16 | Z80-Boy | In C? |
| 19:12.23 | ``Erik | yup |
| 19:12.50 | ``Erik | was also exploring some ideas at the time... it's got some neat ideas, but I'm not really proud of the execution *shrug* |
| 19:15.53 | Z80-Boy | I replaced spamassassin by bogofilter which is much faster and hasn't segfaulted, but it allows more spam through and still needs to be feeded like some kind of Tamagochi |
| 19:16.49 | ``Erik | add in that it can be trained to futher improve the result, ... *shrug* I'm happy for now |
| 19:17.10 | ``Erik | though paul graham has an article about simplified spam detection |
| 19:17.49 | ``Erik | 'cept I'd want to push that idea further, and have automatic mailbox selection, and an mua where if you drag a mail from one folder to another, it 'learns' that in place |
| 19:18.19 | ``Erik | of course, those were issues when I was on 30+ mailing lists, many fairly high traffic :D I don't do that anymore |
| 19:21.25 | Z80-Boy | <PROTECTED> |
| 19:21.34 | Z80-Boy | and especially openbsd misc has low S/N ration |
| 19:21.41 | Z80-Boy | It's all "you're an idiot |
| 19:21.46 | ``Erik | heh |
| 19:21.49 | Z80-Boy | <PROTECTED> |
| 19:21.53 | ``Erik | so they're moderated and only theo posts? |
| 19:21.53 | ``Erik | ;D |
| 19:22.03 | Z80-Boy | ;-) |
| 19:22.13 | ``Erik | the fbsd ones were usually pretty civil |
| 19:22.19 | Z80-Boy | Once they told me I am a troll and I just politely asked about some technical issues |
| 19:22.27 | ``Erik | unlike the irc channels *cough* :D |
| 19:24.37 | Z80-Boy | irch channels of the #OS.country type are surprisingly hostile |
| 19:24.50 | ``Erik | established ones are |
| 19:24.58 | ``Erik | very new os's seem very friendly *shrug* |
| 19:25.41 | ``Erik | they're kinda still in the "holy shit, people are looking at this???" phase |
| 19:51.05 | brlcad | mm. sun fire x4500 are even cheaper with massive diskage |
| 19:52.05 | brlcad | Z80-Boy: those are really nice |
| 19:52.17 | brlcad | really close to machining quality |
| 20:01.29 | CIA-27 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * 10brlcad/NEWS: |
| 20:01.31 | CIA-27 | BRL-CAD: Mr. Anderson fixed various non-normalized vector bugs with the ARBN primitive |
| 20:01.33 | CIA-27 | BRL-CAD: that was causing all sorts of problems with rotations, shading, mirroring, and |
| 20:01.35 | CIA-27 | BRL-CAD: more. the primitive was assuming the vectors were normalized, thus causing the |
| 20:01.40 | CIA-27 | BRL-CAD: problems. Johns fixes take care of sf bugs 1800148 and 1800161 reported by |
| 20:01.44 | CIA-27 | BRL-CAD: clock3/karel that specifically reported the mirroring and shading problems. |
| 20:15.22 | Z80-Boy | brlcad: thanks |
| 20:27.46 | *** join/#brlcad Z80-Boy (i=clock@217-162-110-242.dclient.hispeed.ch) |
| 20:28.38 | CIA-27 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * 10brlcad/src/libfb/if_wgl.c: We don't need to check for Windows in this file ;-). |
| 20:38.11 | CIA-27 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * 10brlcad/src/libfb/if_remote.c: Fixed call to strncpy so as not to overwrite buf. |
| 20:42.25 | CIA-27 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * 10brlcad/src/libfb/fbserv_obj.c: Check fbsl_fd before closing. |
| 20:44.41 | CIA-27 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * 10brlcad/src/other/incrTcl/itcl/generic/itclInt.h: Looks like Sean's earlier fix got lost. Putting it back. |
| 20:44.56 | ``Erik | hehehe as I'm about to clobber that file :D |
| 20:47.00 | ``Erik | oh, just a config.h dealie |
| 20:48.17 | ``Erik | er |
| 20:48.30 | ``Erik | s/why we/if we should/ |
| 20:52.55 | brlcad | now that it's working for tcl/tk, yeah I'd think so |
| 20:53.11 | brlcad | the less to tweak/maintain in other, the better |
| 20:53.31 | ``Erik | assuming people can stomach the configure time :) |
| 20:53.57 | brlcad | our default cacheing is at least enabled by default :) |
| 20:54.21 | brlcad | we could recover that time by doing better caching of our own compilation tests |
| 20:54.38 | brlcad | breaking out each functionality test into an m4 with cache support would be good |
| 20:55.05 | ``Erik | there's still a fair bit that wouldn't be covered by caching, I think... the same grunt from a 'trivial' autoconf project, plus all those cache checks |
| 20:55.12 | brlcad | either way, I dont' care if they think it's long :) |
| 20:55.47 | brlcad | the time is recovered by not maintaining their build |
| 20:55.57 | brlcad | the bigger question is whether their autocruft is up to snuff |
| 20:56.20 | brlcad | tcl's is *barely* usable now .. |
| 20:56.56 | brlcad | wasn't pre 8.4.6 or therebouts |
| 21:01.54 | ``Erik | blehhhhhhhhhh, change to configure.ac |
| 21:01.59 | ``Erik | *grouse* |
| 21:19.40 | *** part/#brlcad bobbmt (n=graceind@static-71-240-124-130.pitbpa.east.verizon.net) |
| 21:35.58 | CIA-27 | BRL-CAD: 03erikgreenwald * 10brlcad/src/other/tcl/ (698 files in 28 dirs): tcl 8.5a6->8.5b1 |
| 21:39.22 | CIA-27 | BRL-CAD: 03erikgreenwald * 10brlcad/src/other/tk/ (716 files in 20 dirs): tk 8.5a6->8.5b1 |
| 21:41.51 | CIA-27 | BRL-CAD: 03erikgreenwald * 10brlcad/src/other/incrTcl/itcl/generic/ (17 files): update a good bit out of itcl development version, to cope with changes in tcl85b1 |
| 21:43.34 | CIA-27 | BRL-CAD: 03erikgreenwald * 10brlcad/src/other/incrTcl/itk/ (12 files in 2 dirs): update a good bit out of itk development version, to keep in sync with itcl |
| 21:44.15 | *** join/#brlcad bpoole (n=bpoole@UNIX31.andrew.cmu.edu) |
| 21:44.16 | CIA-27 | BRL-CAD: 03erikgreenwald * 10brlcad/configure.ac: note that we use (and search for) itcl/itk 3.4 |
| 22:17.46 | ``Erik | hum, mged seems to behave, rt works fine, ... O.o |
| 22:18.17 | ``Erik | AAH, I'm blind#!~ |
| 22:19.35 | ``Erik | archer seems to come up, not sure what I'm looking at, though |
| 22:20.06 | brlcad | if you run into funky cursors with remote-to-mac, that's a X11 bug on OS X afaik |
| 22:20.17 | ``Erik | no, cursers looked all good |
| 22:20.27 | ``Erik | I'm running it on a fbsd opteron |
| 22:20.28 | brlcad | yeah, I got archer all working a couple months ago -- turn on "advanced" mode for a lil more familiarity |
| 22:21.09 | ``Erik | well, it's dark in my office, my screens are all black... I ran it, and all three instantly turned white |
| 22:21.12 | ``Erik | I'm done with that program. |
| 22:22.53 | ``Erik | and a leenewx |
| 22:23.58 | ``Erik | ya know, 85b1 has some dtrace stuff in it O.o |
| 22:31.01 | ``Erik | huh |
| 22:31.12 | ``Erik | the cursor issue showed up from linux, not bsd... |
| 22:31.46 | brlcad | it's a byte ordering issue, depends on endian |
| 22:31.57 | ``Erik | same arch |
| 22:32.06 | brlcad | then it's a tcl issue |
| 22:32.17 | ``Erik | both using internally build tcl 85b1 |
| 22:32.20 | brlcad | the issue I'm thinking of is a byte order endian problem |
| 22:32.52 | brlcad | and mac x11 specific) |
| 22:33.21 | ``Erik | um, same source tree, same arch, both displaying to the same mac x86 workstation |
| 22:35.33 | ``Erik | um, the last of the linux opterons in /usr/tmp/brlcad vs the opteron fbsd in /usr/tmp/<myusername>/brlcadbuild |
| 22:35.38 | ``Erik | if you want to compare and contrast |
| 22:35.52 | ``Erik | the 'massive icon with a fuzzy yellow look'? |
| 22:37.28 | brlcad | yeah |
| 22:37.48 | brlcad | maybe still the same issue, but related to 64-bit client to 32-bit server |
| 22:38.12 | brlcad | mac is 32-bit even on the new boxen |
| 22:38.51 | brlcad | which is causing me grief at the moment for making one universal mac build .. |
| 22:39.18 | ``Erik | mged: ELF 64-bit LSB executable, AMD x86-64, version 1 (FreeBSD), dynamically linked (uses shared libs), not stripped |
| 22:39.19 | ``Erik | bin/mged: ELF 64-bit LSB executable, AMD x86-64, version 1 (SYSV), for GNU/Linux 2.4.0, dynamically linked (uses shared libs), not stripped |
| 22:39.58 | ``Erik | oh, and my bad, on the fbsd, it's not /usr/tmp/blah/brlcadbuild, it's /usr/brlcad/HEAD |
| 22:40.00 | brlcad | yup |
| 22:40.32 | ``Erik | ok |
| 22:40.48 | ``Erik | just a datapoint, bsd does not exhibit the issue, linux does... for me |
| 22:41.27 | brlcad | yeah, makes sense |
| 22:41.43 | brlcad | linux x11 client sends the cursor back as an image instead of a bitmap iirc |
| 22:41.58 | brlcad | there was a mac hint write-up on this somewhere |
| 22:42.01 | CIA-27 | BRL-CAD: 03erikgreenwald * 10brlcad/NEWS: mention version bumps on contrib stuff |
| 22:42.19 | ``Erik | hum, I thought both did what Xorg or X11R6 told 'em to, fbsd doesn't twiddle bits like openbsd does |
| 22:42.25 | brlcad | http://www.macosxhints.com/article.php?story=20060316124704289 |
| 22:42.41 | ``Erik | unless redhat is getting their fingers where they don't belong (yet again) |
| 22:43.03 | ``Erik | oohhh, 'blue facet', huh |
| 22:43.26 | brlcad | either way, the 'bug' is in the X11 apple's using or in something tcl 8.5's doing since that's when it starts |
| 22:44.45 | ``Erik | hum, the 'dedication' pic comes up fine |
| 22:45.09 | ``Erik | as do the logos on the archer splash screen, from both boxen |
| 22:45.14 | ``Erik | *shrug* |
| 22:45.27 | ``Erik | something for another day :D |
| 22:45.37 | ``Erik | <-- starts packing up to go grocery shopping |
| 22:46.55 | brlcad | yeah, given the dates of that report, I'm betting tcl 8.5 has the same bug where it's packing its own cursor for some widgets |
| 23:59.00 | CIA-27 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * 10brlcad/ (src/tclscripts/helplib.tcl src/librt/wdb_obj.c NEWS): |
| 23:59.02 | CIA-27 | BRL-CAD: the mged 'tol' command now accepts multiple tolerance arguments so that users |
| 23:59.04 | CIA-27 | BRL-CAD: can set multiple tolerances with just one command invocation. this change makes |
| 23:59.06 | CIA-27 | BRL-CAD: the tol command interatively accept pairs of tolerance types with the |
| 23:59.08 | CIA-27 | BRL-CAD: corresponding value. |
