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| 00:30.20 | Gumboot | What the world clearly needs is a CPU on a board with a wee bit of flash and half a dozen properly-powered USB ports. No display. No audio. No GPIO. Just attach what you need via USB at extra cost. |
| 00:31.06 | xenoxaos | until you run out of bandwidth |
| 00:31.23 | Gumboot | Attach more bandwidth! |
| 00:32.22 | xenoxaos | with duct tape and hot glue |
| 00:32.24 | Gumboot | Actually, you probably could. You could daisy-chain them so that you get more CPUs with more bandwidth communicating back just the essentials. |
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| 00:32.46 | xenoxaos | the programming logistics on that would be hell |
| 00:32.55 | Gumboot | It's for education! |
| 00:33.17 | xenoxaos | But I don't want to go to sodomy school. |
| 00:34.05 | Gumboot | You could even connect them in a ring. |
| 00:34.25 | Gumboot | I would like to disassociate that last comment from the sodomy reference, if possible. |
| 00:34.41 | xenoxaos | nope |
| 00:35.20 | Gumboot | Fine. I think there's a word for it, but I'm not going to google it. |
| 00:36.21 | xenoxaos | !g ring of sodomy |
| 00:36.38 | xenoxaos | oh...there's a picture.... |
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| 01:22.53 | hno | will likely to token ring/bus networking in the near future. Thought that was dead. |
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| 01:34.39 | Marex | hno: token ring is splendid ... one ring to rule them all (tm) ;-) |
| 01:34.46 | Marex | btw. mail.google.com is down? nice ;-) |
| 01:36.03 | Marex | not anymore ... weird |
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| 02:25.41 | Mehhh | Does anyone here have a lapdock? |
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| 02:44.37 | xxiao | how can I avoid the fxxx windows all together |
| 02:45.04 | xxiao | can't recall how to get its env variable, echo $VAR1? |
| 02:51.35 | xxiao | uses windows 10 hours per year |
| 03:25.01 | Marex | xxiao: to do taxes ? ;-) |
| 03:25.15 | Marex | wasnt it %VAR ? |
| 03:42.01 | xxiao | Marex: that's right |
| 03:42.45 | xxiao | it's something like %VAR%? anyway i managed to get it working, JAVA_HOME and PATH both need to be set manually |
| 03:56.54 | HACKhalo2 | heh |
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| 07:01.15 | hno | xxiao, boot Linux in a full screen VM and forget there is a Windows bootloader. |
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| 07:24.24 | hno | Updated mainlining wiki page with a little more realistic order. |
| 07:25.33 | libv | let me add to the mali bit. |
| 07:32.07 | libv | hno: so the nand situation really is that bad huh? |
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| 07:39.36 | Turl | libv: ping |
| 07:40.52 | libv | pong |
| 07:43.43 | Turl | libv: any idea what might be causing this error? http://pastie.org/5441726 |
| 07:43.53 | Turl | esp. the EGL-ERROR |
| 07:44.20 | Turl | libv: we're hitting that on android 4.2 |
| 07:44.26 | Turl | libv: it's interesting because the only affected platform is Mali GPU |
| 07:45.00 | Turl | PowerVR, Adreno work without issues |
| 07:45.52 | libv | why 720x1280? |
| 07:45.59 | libv | what device are you using? |
| 07:46.05 | libv | while being rotated |
| 07:46.33 | libv | printf your way out of this one, check where that calloc return -ENOMEM is |
| 07:47.27 | Turl | that log is not from an A10 but from some samsung device |
| 07:47.38 | Turl | I don't have my A10 log handy but it's the same problem |
| 07:49.16 | libv | still, printf your way out of it |
| 07:49.58 | libv | this smells like allocating an intermediate buffer failing |
| 07:51.49 | Turl | libv: this is the code that prints that btw https://github.com/CyanogenMod/android_frameworks_native/blob/jellybean/libs/ui/GraphicBufferAllocator.cpp |
| 07:54.08 | Turl | err, sorry, https://github.com/CyanogenMod/android_frameworks_native/blob/mr1-staging/libs/ui/GraphicBufferAllocator.cpp |
| 07:55.06 | libv | mAllocDev->alloc(mAllocDev, w, h, format, usage, handle, stride); |
| 07:55.18 | libv | that's probably from the libhw gralloc module |
| 07:55.37 | Turl | yeah that's the gralloc module |
| 07:55.52 | Turl | which is unchanged from android 4.1 |
| 07:55.57 | libv | where is the code for that? |
| 07:56.02 | libv | for mali |
| 07:56.09 | Turl | malideveloper |
| 07:56.31 | libv | ok |
| 07:56.36 | Turl | libv: https://github.com/allwinner-dev-team/android_device_allwinner_common/tree/master/gralloc too |
| 07:56.50 | Turl | it's mostly the same source |
| 07:56.50 | libv | so the currently public mali gralloc code is broken for jelly bean |
| 07:57.24 | Turl | 4.2 jellybean |
| 07:57.30 | Turl | it works fine on 4.1 jellybean |
| 07:57.47 | Turl | all other vendors have no issues on either version with the same graphic stack |
| 07:58.53 | libv | ? |
| 07:59.04 | libv | your last statement makes no sense to me |
| 07:59.35 | libv | do you mean that pvr/adreno/etc are ok with the changes to surface flinger and gralloc for jelly bean? |
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| 08:01.11 | Turl | libv: http://paste.debian.net/hidden/e299bc47/ |
| 08:01.18 | Turl | hope the ascii table cleans up any confusion |
| 08:01.47 | Turl | gralloc didn't change 4.1 JB -> 4.2 JB |
| 08:02.56 | libv | different drivers == different graphics stacks imho |
| 08:03.10 | libv | but that's probably my pov |
| 08:03.29 | libv | it could be that you ran out of buffers. |
| 08:04.14 | Turl | the same libMali, libEGL*Mali*, libUMP, gralloc* were used on both android versions |
| 08:04.34 | Turl | same applies to pvr & adreno, using their corresponding libs, daemons and stuffs |
| 08:04.40 | libv | yes, i would think that you just ran out of buffers |
| 08:05.35 | libv | sprinkle some LOGE's in gralloc_alloc_framebuffer_locked in https://github.com/allwinner-dev-team/android_device_allwinner_common/blob/master/gralloc/alloc_device.cpp |
| 08:05.58 | libv | you have a -ENOMEM there |
| 08:06.37 | libv | init_frame_buffer_locked is unlikely to return -ENOMEM |
| 08:08.39 | Turl | buffermask is an uint32, so we have 32 buffers I'm guessing? |
| 08:08.57 | libv | 1 << (1 << 32) is a rather big number |
| 08:09.48 | Turl | m->bufferMask |= (1LU<<i); |
| 08:10.02 | libv | ah, yes, you are right |
| 08:10.37 | libv | so yes, only up to 32 framebuffers available apparently |
| 08:10.57 | libv | again though, LOGE your way out of it, make sure that this codepath is actually hit |
| 08:11.06 | libv | and where it is actually throwing back -ENOMEM |
| 08:14.32 | Turl | E/ ( 6888): void __egl_platform_dequeue_buffer(egl_surface*):1188 [EGL-ERROR] failed to dequeue buffer from native window (0x40421990); err = -12, buf = 0x40819ff0 |
| 08:14.32 | Turl | E/gralloc ( 6888): ENOMEM OVER HERE static int gralloc_alloc_framebuffer_locked |
| 08:14.33 | Turl | W/GraphicBufferAllocator( 6888): alloc(1024, 768, 5, 00001e02, ...) failed -12 (Out of memory) |
| 08:14.34 | Turl | yup |
| 08:17.38 | Turl | wohoo it works libv :D |
| 08:17.48 | Turl | I killed the buffer limit checker |
| 08:17.48 | libv | well, check what numBuffers and bufferMask are doing |
| 08:17.57 | libv | erm, you do want to fix things properly |
| 08:18.03 | Turl | yeah I know |
| 08:18.07 | Turl | was just a PoC :) |
| 08:20.42 | Turl | libv: numBuffers is 2 |
| 08:21.14 | libv | something has changed |
| 08:21.22 | libv | in surfaceflinger or gralloc |
| 08:22.31 | libv | but do review the life of numBuffers and bufferMask |
| 08:22.40 | libv | through logging |
| 08:22.50 | Turl | other platforms have supported triple buffering for a while I think |
| 08:23.37 | libv | well, it could be a bug in the handling of numBuffers/bufferMask between allocs and frees |
| 08:23.44 | libv | or it could be an actual shortage of memory |
| 08:23.51 | libv | memory assigned to the mali |
| 08:24.07 | hno | libv, the Allwinner logical nand driver is not submittable without anyone understanding the logical layer and stepping up to document it and accept being a maintainer. |
| 08:24.12 | Turl | hardcoding numBuffers to 3 on gralloc seems to work |
| 08:24.23 | hno | libv, but we will likely have a well functioning MTD driver. |
| 08:24.25 | Turl | I need to check where does numBuffers come from |
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| 08:25.37 | libv | #define NUM_BUFFERS 2 |
| 08:25.46 | libv | framebuffer_device.cpp |
| 08:26.42 | libv | but the fb driver might not give back more |
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| 08:27.38 | Turl | <PROTECTED> |
| 08:27.41 | libv | so find out why we need a third |
| 08:28.21 | libv | but we only requested 2 |
| 08:29.45 | Turl | http://sprunge.us/LQHI I think this is it |
| 08:30.35 | libv | smells like it |
| 08:30.50 | libv | first bump the define up to 3 |
| 08:31.00 | libv | i do not know how fb responds to that though |
| 08:31.07 | libv | might be driver dependant |
| 08:31.28 | libv | if both the samsung and your allwinner return that, then you might get away with it |
| 08:32.01 | libv | the change to services/surfaceflinger/Layer.cpp is rather scary |
| 08:32.31 | Turl | if they made a makefile define switch to change it it must be not that scary |
| 08:33.00 | libv | you would expect the hw framebuffer module to feed that back |
| 08:33.18 | libv | and not be hardcoded somewhere up top |
| 08:34.03 | libv | it's clearly dynamic for surfaceflinger, but these defines make it semi-hardcoded |
| 08:34.09 | libv | and the hw has no say in it |
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| 08:36.06 | Turl | they also have a NUM_FRAMEBUFFER_SURFACE_BUFFERS |
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| 09:33.33 | Gumboot | It really is tempting to set up an rpi hate site and fill it full of adverts and a couple of unkind remarks. Can you make money on adverts just being displayed, or do they have to be clicked? |
| 09:34.24 | mnemoc | at least google ads pays for both, obviusly differently |
| 09:34.45 | Gumboot | Maybe I really should, then. I wonder how much I can make. |
| 09:35.02 | Gumboot | And if I did, what should I do with the money? |
| 09:35.27 | mnemoc | buy rpis |
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| 09:35.43 | Gumboot | If the DSP toolchain makes any progress I'd be tempted. |
| 09:35.57 | Gumboot | It's only the ARM which is completely useless. |
| 09:39.49 | Gumboot | Without bothering to read the actual changes, the commit messages seem promising: https://github.com/mm120/binutils-vc4/commits/vc4 |
| 09:42.31 | RaYmAn | useful commit messages there ;) |
| 09:44.13 | libv | yeah :( |
| 09:44.24 | Gumboot | Nevermind the commit messages.... does it work? |
| 09:45.44 | Gumboot | I probably shouldn't look. It'll drive me mental knowing that they've got little mistakes here and there which I can't correct. |
| 09:47.11 | Gumboot | Does the bootloader include the GPU driver, or is that uploaded at a later stage? |
| 09:47.11 | mnemoc | i've seen commit messages about needing to go for coffee or to the grocery store :| |
| 09:48.42 | libv | Gumboot: the 2mb blob which is later contains that i guess |
| 09:48.48 | libv | loaded later even |
| 09:51.33 | Gumboot | Well that's only the same size as the startup elf file. |
| 09:54.45 | Gumboot | I hope these binutils use the same elf metadata as is already used in the existing elfs. It would be easy to just start from scratch and forget about compatibility. |
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| 14:24.18 | slapin | do anybody knows how I can link custom section to .rodata without using linker script? this is userspace program, so I don't want to mess with linker scripts for it |
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| 14:48.55 | oliv3r | if i have a 4 Byte variable, and i do 3 << 30; that can't be right, correct? |
| 14:50.38 | mnemoc | it's fine |
| 14:50.48 | oliv3r | won't it overflow? |
| 14:50.54 | oliv3r | oh wait, no |
| 14:50.56 | oliv3r | i'm stupid |
| 14:50.58 | mnemoc | 3 is 0b11 |
| 14:51.10 | oliv3r | yeah |
| 14:51.11 | oliv3r | i'm stupid :) |
| 14:51.15 | mnemoc | yes :) |
| 14:51.44 | oliv3r | ... thanks :p |
| 14:51.54 | oliv3r | i was thinking of 3 being 0b111 |
| 14:52.18 | oliv3r | i had that still in my calculator, from an earlier 7 << 0 |
| 14:52.19 | oliv3r | :p |
| 14:54.03 | mnemoc | anyhow, unsigneds don't overflow in C |
| 14:54.45 | mnemoc | 7<<30 == 3<<30 |
| 14:55.10 | oliv3r | what about chip registers :p |
| 14:57.22 | mnemoc | should be the same |
| 14:57.53 | oliv3r | still, it COULD cause bugs! |
| 14:58.13 | oliv3r | crashes, fires, skynet's self awareness! |
| 14:58.22 | mnemoc | take the ref guide and see the shift instruction you are using |
| 14:58.44 | mnemoc | the excess could be sent to another register |
| 14:58.53 | mnemoc | but i'm not an asm guy |
| 14:59.25 | oliv3r | oh, nah, i just thought i found a bug in a header file :p |
| 14:59.32 | mnemoc | nope :) |
| 14:59.33 | oliv3r | i'm wikiing things :p |
| 14:59.41 | mnemoc | which controller? |
| 14:59.43 | oliv3r | yeah, cause I was being stupid |
| 14:59.48 | oliv3r | sec, i'll save my intermediate work |
| 15:02.08 | oliv3r | htt://linux-sunxi.org/A10/NFC |
| 15:04.41 | mnemoc | afaik the NFC is identical in all sunxi socs |
| 15:05.04 | oliv3r | then we need a better naming convention, since we started with A10/registers |
| 15:05.07 | oliv3r | i just went from there! |
| 15:05.28 | mnemoc | that's fine, but I believe A10/NFC should redirect to just NFC |
| 15:05.46 | mnemoc | but it can be moved later |
| 15:06.31 | oliv3r | yep |
| 15:06.51 | oliv3r | I think a lof of devices and controllers are identical |
| 15:07.06 | mnemoc | do you want to learn SVG? :) |
| 15:07.16 | mnemoc | tables to describe registers suck badly :< |
| 15:07.21 | oliv3r | er, not really :( why |
| 15:07.30 | oliv3r | ok, NOW you say this? |
| 15:07.46 | oliv3r | you have any clue how much time i've spent writing register tables? |
| 15:07.54 | mnemoc | a lot |
| 15:07.58 | mnemoc | :) |
| 15:07.58 | oliv3r | :p |
| 15:08.02 | oliv3r | what did you have in mind? |
| 15:08.50 | mnemoc | an image :) |
| 15:09.07 | oliv3r | obviously :p how much would it be different though? |
| 15:09.11 | oliv3r | I know a table isn't ideal |
| 15:09.19 | oliv3r | I wonder how an image would be more usefull |
| 15:09.28 | mnemoc | adds visual meaning to the bit ranges |
| 15:09.48 | oliv3r | do you have an example of such an image? |
| 15:10.20 | oliv3r | 'interactive' memory map would be way cooler :p |
| 15:11.38 | mnemoc | http://infocenter.arm.com/help/index.jsp?topic=/com.arm.doc.ddi0304c/Chdifhjd.html |
| 15:13.52 | mnemoc | slapin's .tex document about the NFC has such diagrams |
| 15:14.42 | mnemoc | http://infocenter.arm.com/help/index.jsp?topic=/com.arm.doc.dui0331c/BABEFEJE.html |
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| 15:17.59 | oliv3r | slapin has a document? where is that at? |
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| 15:18.20 | oliv3r | speaking of slaping and hno it would be awesome if they could fill in their knowlege into http:/linux-sunxi.org/A10/NFC |
| 15:18.33 | oliv3r | i'm done for today :) and put in the registers/bits I could find so far |
| 15:19.05 | mnemoc | learning svg would let use make a wiki template to generate the diagrams |
| 15:20.46 | oliv3r | you do realize I wanna strangle you right now |
| 15:20.54 | oliv3r | I talked about templates when I started doing this |
| 15:20.57 | oliv3r | you where opposed! |
| 15:21.05 | oliv3r | so i went with a table, as you thought that was best |
| 15:21.27 | oliv3r | I guess there could be an easy way to 'transform' the code from wiki to svg |
| 15:21.35 | oliv3r | i tried to be consistent with the tables :) |
| 15:21.46 | mnemoc | oliv3r: i opposed full page templates, not diagram templates or infoboxes :) |
| 15:22.21 | mnemoc | the tables are good.... they just miss a diagram on top :) |
| 15:22.33 | oliv3r | those grahpics do look nice |
| 15:22.56 | oliv3r | if the tables where a template, like i suggested! we could have generated the diagrams from that |
| 15:23.31 | mnemoc | +1 to per-register template :) |
| 15:23.39 | mnemoc | not per-controller |
| 15:23.42 | oliv3r | yeah yeah yeah, you say all this now! |
| 15:23.48 | mnemoc | *g* |
| 15:23.49 | oliv3r | i ment per register template! |
| 15:23.58 | oliv3r | back then |
| 15:24.02 | mnemoc | i understood full-page templates :< |
| 15:24.18 | oliv3r | miss communication fail! |
| 15:24.23 | oliv3r | well |
| 15:24.32 | oliv3r | how many days would it take to get it from a table to a template |
| 15:24.42 | oliv3r | I guess it can be automated with some bash/perl magic |
| 15:24.50 | oliv3r | but that's beyond my skills! |
| 15:24.53 | oliv3r | or desires :p |
| 15:24.58 | bfree | you mean the images like http://infocenter.arm.com/help/topic/com.arm.doc.ddi0304c/graphics/iecdpccr_register_bit_assignments.png ? |
| 15:25.04 | oliv3r | I can try to do it for the next controller |
| 15:25.21 | oliv3r | yes |
| 15:25.27 | oliv3r | bfree: exactly that |
| 15:25.59 | oliv3r | mnemoc: in either case, we'd need a good template for the registers to begin with |
| 15:27.49 | mnemoc | hopefully a bit larger so the text can be read :p |
| 15:28.36 | mnemoc | oliv3r: yes, next controller, always forward |
| 15:28.52 | oliv3r | well the older stuff will have to be adapted at some point |
| 15:28.56 | bfree | that could be doable on the fly in javascript from the html tables in the wiki output ;) but if you have a lot of bits in there where is all the text going to go and is it really going to be much of an improvement? |
| 15:29.04 | oliv3r | if you can whip up a template + example, i'll use it on the next controller :) |
| 15:29.19 | oliv3r | you'd only have bit + name |
| 15:30.04 | oliv3r | or even just bitnumber, as you can look up the bit number in the table (from template) below |
| 15:30.20 | slapin | oliv3r: http://ossfans.org/nand_registers.ps is postscript version |
| 15:30.35 | oliv3r | i'll hope to find that page tomorrow :p |
| 15:30.45 | oliv3r | i'll try to work in your findings into the draft wiki page |
| 15:30.49 | oliv3r | but gotta go home now :) |
| 15:30.50 | slapin | wants to put that somewhere on public with source, where it can be edited |
| 15:30.51 | oliv3r | bb :) |
| 15:31.03 | oliv3r | slapin: well i just put up http://linux-sunxi.org/A10/NFC |
| 15:31.17 | oliv3r | try to look at that and see :D |
| 15:31.22 | oliv3r | *poof* |
| 15:31.22 | slapin | oliv3r: no nice pictures there |
| 15:31.27 | oliv3r | :p |
| 15:31.34 | oliv3r | i'll put some boobies pics up :p |
| 15:31.42 | slapin | oliv3r: ok |
| 15:31.54 | slapin | oliv3r: I will check then |
| 15:32.21 | slapin | there is no such thing as too many boobs |
| 15:32.35 | mnemoc | mripard: hi, did you already start with the pinctrl stuff? |
| 15:34.41 | mripard | mnemoc: yep, a bit |
| 15:36.27 | mnemoc | mripard: i pushed some stuff to https://github.com/amery/linux-allwinner/commits/wip/sunxi-next/pinctrl ... but still kind of lost |
| 15:37.56 | mnemoc | there is a wip/sunxi-next/i2c there too, but cleanup only, no porting yet |
| 15:38.14 | mripard | yes, I'm having a hard time too to get how to map those completely random pins supported in A10, A10s and A13, and how to map them usefuly to pinctrl |
| 15:40.23 | mripard | ah |
| 15:41.09 | mripard | the Pio IPs are different from A10 to A13 ? |
| 15:41.40 | mnemoc | no, they are the same |
| 15:41.51 | mnemoc | i have separated .c for the statics |
| 15:42.16 | mnemoc | because groups and features difer between socs... obviusly |
| 15:42.45 | mripard | but what about the aw1626 and aw1623 |
| 15:42.48 | mripard | ? |
| 15:43.00 | mnemoc | aw1623 is the so called A10 |
| 15:43.06 | mnemoc | aw1626 is A13 |
| 15:43.09 | mripard | aaah, I see |
| 15:43.22 | mnemoc | "chip-id" vs. marketing name |
| 15:43.53 | mnemoc | the chip-id lives inside the header of the BROM |
| 15:44.46 | mnemoc | I was doing it detection based in 3.4... until I realized modern arm-linux hates detection, and everything needs to be hardcoded in the .dts |
| 15:45.35 | xxiao | hopefully u-boot etc will be able to generate dts automatically |
| 15:46.11 | mnemoc | eventually we will be able to turn an script.bin into dts |
| 15:46.20 | xxiao | actually for usb, pci or most probe-able bus it's still detected dynamically |
| 15:46.22 | mnemoc | but we need to model it manually first :p |
| 15:46.51 | xxiao | dts just assign interrupts and some basic resources for those buses |
| 15:47.17 | xxiao | but for misc bus/interfaces you have to hand-code them |
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| 16:22.43 | slapin | hno: ping |
| 16:23.10 | slapin | hno: hi! |
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| 16:36.02 | L84Supper | who was looking for the PCB breakout for the a10 bga? |
| 16:41.53 | L84Supper | http://imagebin.org/237442 |
| 16:42.03 | L84Supper | http://imagebin.org/237441 |
| 16:42.12 | L84Supper | http://imagebin.org/237440 |
| 16:42.22 | L84Supper | http://imagebin.org/237439 |
| 16:42.33 | L84Supper | http://imagebin.org/237438 |
| 16:43.12 | mnemoc | those are from the hackberry, right? can you upload them to the wiki? |
| 16:43.26 | L84Supper | no |
| 16:43.38 | L84Supper | from some other board |
| 16:44.51 | L84Supper | I don't post to that old wiki anymore |
| 16:46.05 | mnemoc | http://linux-sunxi.org ? |
| 16:46.16 | L84Supper | then again if you really need help with the BGA breakout I highly doubt you'll be able to design a board that works well |
| 16:46.41 | focus_well | L84Supper: yum yum! that be me looking for those bga tracks!!! |
| 16:46.52 | mnemoc | i have zero intention in designing a board, ever |
| 16:47.27 | mnemoc | just want to be sure no sunxi related knowledge gets lost |
| 16:50.32 | focus_well | L84Supper: a couple of questions |
| 16:51.05 | focus_well | 1. The inner BGA pads and some of the other bga pads have thick tracks. |
| 16:51.05 | focus_well | <PROTECTED> |
| 16:51.05 | focus_well | <PROTECTED> |
| 16:51.05 | focus_well | 2. What is the bga pad size? |
| 16:51.05 | focus_well | 3. What is the min track width used in the design between the bga pads? |
| 16:51.06 | focus_well | 4. What is the hole size for vias used in the design between bga rows of |
| 16:51.08 | focus_well | pads? |
| 16:51.10 | focus_well | 5. What is the overall via size used in the design for vias between the |
| 16:51.12 | focus_well | bga rows of pads? |
| 16:51.14 | focus_well | From some other conversation I remember |
| 16:51.16 | focus_well | the tracks the engineers used were 5 mils with 5 mil clearance. |
| 16:51.18 | focus_well | The vias are 16 mils. |
| 16:51.20 | focus_well | The drills were around 5 or 6 mils. |
| 16:51.22 | focus_well | The companies I know makes PCB with these limits |
| 16:51.26 | focus_well | min track width 0.075mm |
| 16:51.28 | focus_well | min hole size 0.15mm. |
| 16:52.42 | L84Supper | I'd suggest that you spend a few more years learning high speed PCB design |
| 16:52.59 | L84Supper | there is no way around it |
| 16:53.26 | L84Supper | or you end up with the usual junk |
| 16:53.26 | focus_well | L84Supper: I design lots of PCBs these days |
| 16:53.37 | focus_well | All working :) |
| 16:54.04 | L84Supper | then you should be able to answer this yourself :) |
| 16:54.04 | focus_well | The info request is specific to the A10 bga |
| 16:54.37 | focus_well | L84Supper: those diagrams were very good - thanks! |
| 16:54.44 | slapin | looks at working board, and smiles, very, very evilly, and puts it into junk bin for parts |
| 16:56.44 | slapin | wants to learn BGA PCB design a cheap way - any pointers? |
| 16:56.53 | focus_well | L84Supper: I have info here and there, but rather I use 100% certain data. But I have allow 2-3 redesigns to get it right - so I'm not in a hurry to get it right first time. |
| 16:57.42 | L84Supper | those pics are from a magic board, that just happens to work due to good luck |
| 16:57.43 | focus_well | The board i want is ideally torture tested and still working |
| 16:58.44 | drachensun | my last bga design had to be 4 mil clearance, there was no way to route it at 5 mils, the pads had something close to 12 mils between them, so 4 on each side and 4 for the track and that was it |
| 16:59.06 | drachensun | there are places that can do tighter design clearances, you just have to find them |
| 16:59.27 | focus_well | dranchensun: keep talking I pick up conversation in a few hours.. bye |
| 17:00.22 | drachensun | heh I think that was all I had to say about it. I ran into the same thing, I wanted to keep it at 5 mil because I can get cheap prototypes at that size |
| 17:00.59 | drachensun | but it just wasn't possible and that was an Atmel with a lot fewer pins than an A10 |
| 17:02.16 | slapin | drachensun: any pointers on cheap BGA prototypes (6-8 layers)> |
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| 17:02.23 | slapin | ? |
| 17:08.06 | L84Supper | sometimes you can use 5/5mil for most of the board and only go down to 4/4 or even 3 just between BGA pads |
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| 17:14.31 | jquip | is the cdc-acm driver a part of the kernel defconfig?? |
| 17:41.20 | drachensun | slapin: not really, we found one place with good pricing for tight tolerances but I think they are gone now |
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| 18:38.39 | slapin | which safe resistor nominals should be for 3.3 SPI pull-ups? |
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| 19:34.15 | techn | drachensun: how did you enabled ft5x_ts on linaro? |
| 19:34.41 | techn | ts works but x.org log says that: |
| 19:35.15 | techn | [ 1366.144] (II) No input driver specified, ignoring this device. |
| 19:35.15 | techn | [ 1366.144] (II) This device may have been added with another device file. |
| 19:35.30 | techn | and I apt-get'd utouch |
| 19:36.29 | techn | on other tabled (with gt811) everything worked without hasle.. even without utouch |
| 19:39.41 | drachensun | let me check my Xorg log |
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| 19:41.13 | drachensun | My Xorg log says that too |
| 19:41.15 | drachensun | but it works |
| 19:42.26 | drachensun | well let me check another system real quick |
| 19:42.45 | drachensun | I've got a bunch of these running under different rootfs |
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| 19:49.34 | mnemoc | maybe ranting about a different input device? |
| 19:51.44 | drachensun | ok, I got a little mixed up, on my system with the mali drivers and my screwed up xorg conf from trying to get xrandr to rotate the screen, I have the same message and currently the touch doesn't work |
| 19:51.56 | drachensun | on my other system it works |
| 19:52.25 | drachensun | and the Xorg.0.log looks like you would expect "using input driver 'evdev' for 'ft5x_ts' |
| 19:53.49 | techn | drachensun: thanks.. now to track why that doesn't happen :p |
| 19:54.12 | drachensun | give me a sec and I'll post what logs and conf files I can from the working system |
| 19:56.13 | drachensun | Ok, the only difference in the conf files seems to be that 99-mali400.conf from the mali driver and my additions to it |
| 20:02.39 | drachensun | there is my xorg.0.log file http://pastebin.com/euu7MUMy |
| 20:03.16 | drachensun | and the xorg.conf files are just the stock linaro ones in this case |
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| 20:04.28 | techn | ft5x_ts: Applying InputClass "evdev touchscreen catchall", thats seems to be first missing print |
| 20:06.49 | drachensun | thats coming from /usr/share/X11/xorg.conf.d/10-evdev.conf |
| 20:07.13 | drachensun | off for a bit |
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| 21:16.31 | atari2600a | so |
| 21:16.32 | atari2600a | um |
| 21:17.00 | atari2600a | when do you guys think you'll get to that whole unified bootloader standard thing |
| 21:17.09 | atari2600a | it has to be one of the biggest setbacks with ARM |
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| 21:19.40 | Turl | isn't uboot that? |
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| 21:29.56 | hno | oliv3r & mnemoc, I am not pouring any original material into linux-sunxi.org wiki until the data can be managed reasonably and there is backups. |
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| 21:46.09 | CaCtus491 | ...this talk about qty 100 for a small A10 board with WiFi, 3G, Ethernet... |
| 21:46.44 | CaCtus491 | I'm also looking for something very similar (qty 100, 3G, Ethernet), WiFi may be handy, but not required |
| 21:47.42 | focus_it | CaCtus491: http://cubieboard.org/ for you? |
| 21:47.52 | CaCtus491 | I also need 3 or 4 uarts, but can easily add that via USB via an FTDI chip or similar |
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| 21:52.34 | libv | CaCtus491: or olinuxino |
| 21:56.17 | CaCtus491 | hmm, re: cubieboard, I don't see any obvious pins on the 48 pin 2mm headers that would allow me to connect a 3G module to a base board |
| 21:56.35 | CaCtus491 | (ie, I'd need to use the USB connector to the edge of the board |
| 21:56.37 | CaCtus491 | ) |
| 21:58.23 | focus_it | CaCtus491: 3G you can use a MyFi or similar device http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/MiFi ? |
| 21:59.13 | focus_it | Use the wifi to connect to the MiFi. |
| 22:01.17 | libv | CaCtus491: look at the olinuxino |
| 22:01.36 | libv | CaCtus491: if you get the ones without wifi, you can use that usb connection to connect a 3g module |
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| 22:06.34 | libv | CaCtus491: feel free to contact olimex or tom cubie to find out how much they charge for adapting their designs to your needs and for providing the limited run you need |
| 22:08.21 | focus_it | CaCtus491: olimex IRC channel is #olimex on freenode |
| 22:08.54 | libv | but i personally consider them quite on-topic in here too :) |
| 22:09.08 | libv | in as far as linux-sunxi is on-topic in the eoma channel ;) |
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| 22:10.22 | libv | olinuxino has two uarts exposed directly |
| 22:11.05 | libv | olimex will not be adverse to designing a 3g submodule if the revenue is there |
| 22:15.07 | CaCtus491 | excellent |
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| 22:15.41 | CaCtus491 | the A13 OLinuXino looks pretty close to what I need |
| 22:16.24 | CaCtus491 | ...the 3G stuff will need to be 'integrated' in that I need to have the solution in a single extruded aluminium case |
| 22:17.15 | CaCtus491 | hmm, Olimex... |
| 22:17.44 | CaCtus491 | interesting, this project is to replace an older LPC2148 based design from a few years back |
| 22:18.02 | CaCtus491 | I seem to remember purchasing some LPC2148 stuff from them :) |
| 22:23.36 | libv | like this one? https://www.olimex.com/Products/ARM/NXP/LPC-H2148/ |
| 22:24.32 | libv | is a cortex a8 really what you need for your project? |
| 22:26.15 | CaCtus491 | heh, yeah, new revision will have many new additional features that simply aren't possible witht the existing hardware, including a LCD for UI |
| 22:29.10 | Turl | CaCtus491: btw, Ethernet is 100Mbit |
| 22:31.41 | CaCtus491 | yeah, 100Mbit is heaps, even 10Mbit would do ;) |
| 22:32.26 | CaCtus491 | I wonder when the Olimex A13 mini board will be ready |
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