| 00:00.10 | fadden | Making really precise phone calls? |
| 00:00.10 | cmonex | as ive yet to see one with it |
| 00:00.11 | cmonex | and i've had more than just qc phones |
| 00:00.18 | ttuttle | fcrick: no problem |
| 00:00.19 | jbq | I've worked on many phones and I've never seen one that had an FPU. |
| 00:00.28 | cmonex | fadden: hahaha... no but if you want to run some neat apps.. |
| 00:00.41 | jbq | The biggest use case for an FPU on the phone is to run javascript, because it doesn't have a notion of integers. |
| 00:00.49 | Chainfire | how about multimedia? :) |
| 00:00.55 | fadden | cmonex: I can certainly see uses for it with something like Android, but for most phones it doesn't seem useful. |
| 00:01.01 | ttuttle | hates JavaScript. |
| 00:01.13 | ttuttle | And Flash. |
| 00:01.18 | Chainfire | graphics stuff is much nicer when floating point is fast, rather than slow. |
| 00:01.57 | cmonex | fadden: i think my problem is ive not used a dumbphone since 2005 :) |
| 00:02.08 | Chainfire | same here |
| 00:02.12 | cmonex | Chainfire |
| 00:02.14 | cmonex | which ones had fpu? |
| 00:02.22 | Chainfire | some of the omap do |
| 00:02.30 | cmonex | really, "some" |
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| 00:02.32 | cmonex | :) |
| 00:02.37 | cmonex | my pdaphones all lacked fpu =( |
| 00:02.41 | cmonex | or if it was there nobody used it |
| 00:02.42 | Chainfire | (n95 does too, as does iPhone) |
| 00:03.01 | cmonex | yeah, i dont have n95 or iphone, but good point, i wanted to ask if iphone has it (and uses it?) |
| 00:03.12 | Chainfire | well i assume it uses it... |
| 00:03.17 | spikebike | wow, viewing google doc spreadsheets on the g1 sucks |
| 00:03.19 | spikebike | can't edit |
| 00:03.20 | Chainfire | then again... I'm used to HTC so |
| 00:03.28 | spikebike | can't even scroll to see all columns |
| 00:03.32 | ttuttle | We should make a list of the Google services we want ported to Android, and vote on them. |
| 00:05.36 | cmonex | spikebike: does that work on your n800 |
| 00:05.39 | ttuttle | jasta: I've installed musicbrainz-3.0.1 (it includes /usr/lib/libmusicbrainz3.so) but autogen.sh for five-server won't find it. |
| 00:06.04 | spikebike | cmonex pretty sure it does |
| 00:06.14 | spikebike | I'd have to check for this particular spreadsheet |
| 00:06.19 | cmonex | spikebike: i read that it works, yes,.. except i think excel editing? |
| 00:06.28 | cmonex | no, wait it must have been something else :P |
| 00:06.34 | spikebike | well I don't care about the editing as much as the seeing |
| 00:06.40 | cmonex | by "it" i meant the whole google docs |
| 00:06.59 | spikebike | I'd have to check, think so |
| 00:07.08 | spikebike | rather few things work in firefox and not the n800 |
| 00:07.25 | spikebike | I kinda expected a google doc to work on the g1 though... at least read only |
| 00:08.46 | cmonex | lol |
| 00:08.54 | cmonex | the 480x320 isnt big enough for it i think.. |
| 00:08.56 | cmonex | :P |
| 00:09.16 | ttuttle | Oh, and PDF READER! |
| 00:09.57 | andyross | Yeah, a poppler-based thing would be really useful. The G1 as a whole is really lacking in document-friendly apps. |
| 00:10.05 | waldo_ | has anyone set up a project "sign up board" where people can write app proposals or group together to write them |
| 00:10.05 | spikebike | cmonex there's these things called scroll bars ;-) |
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| 00:10.55 | spikebike | I was just hoping for property number, description, and serial number not something with 100 columns or anything |
| 00:11.11 | cmonex | spikebike: horizontal scroll bars can get annoying |
| 00:11.22 | spikebike | the funny thing is that it has horizontal scroll bars |
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| 00:11.28 | andyross | Why bother with scrollbars when you have touch scrolling and a trackball? |
| 00:11.28 | spikebike | but that only gets you one more column |
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| 00:11.46 | spikebike | andy so you know where you are |
| 00:11.50 | andyross | (I guess the browser does technically have them, but they're tiny 2-pixel transparent things on the screen edges) |
| 00:12.19 | andyross | spikebike: Look at the way the browser represents big scrollable areas. I think scrollbars are the wrong metaphor. |
| 00:13.27 | spikebike | heh, well philosophical arguments aside, I'd like to see small spreadsheets on my g1 |
| 00:14.11 | cmonex | andyross: touch scrolling is even more tiresome. |
| 00:14.29 | cmonex | i dont like iphone for that reason |
| 00:14.35 | cmonex | spikebike: port gnumeric :) |
| 00:14.42 | cmonex | i've yet to try it on my n810 though |
| 00:14.46 | spikebike | expecially when those documents are in a web browser and represent probably 5-10% of the nyt or slashdot home pages |
| 00:14.48 | cmonex | (it's ported to it) |
| 00:14.56 | andyross | You've tried the zoom feature? I'll be honest, I have an *easier* time navigating big pages on the G1 than in Firefox. |
| 00:15.09 | cmonex | andyross: i guess this is subjective. a PC for me will always win |
| 00:15.17 | cmonex | due to the 1280x1024 and faster cpu |
| 00:15.25 | ttuttle | jasta: "The plugin 'org.jvending.masa.plugins:maven-dx-plugin' does not exist or no valid version could be found |
| 00:15.30 | andyross | I said navigating, not reading. But getting from one side of the page to another is faster on the phone. |
| 00:15.42 | cmonex | andyross: i meant navigating |
| 00:15.54 | andyross | Then why bring up resolution? |
| 00:15.59 | Chainfire | really? i press the end button |
| 00:16.01 | cmonex | reading is the same as long as the screen is not VERY small |
| 00:16.02 | Chainfire | instant satisfaction. |
| 00:16.17 | cmonex | well, navigating for me is ... the bigger the screen res is the better nav will be for me |
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| 00:17.31 | andyross | Apples and oranges, though. I'm talking about UI metahors for navigating in a page (any page) that is much larger horizontally than the display (any display) size. The actual size of the display isn't the issue -- of *course* it's easier to read a web page on a 1920x1200 monit.r |
| 00:17.47 | cworth | andyross: A poppler-based PDF viewer would be quite nice. |
| 00:18.03 | andyross | But given a page that is 4x wider than the screen, the G1 is better than the browser at reading it. It just is. |
| 00:18.57 | Chainfire | i must say ive never encountered a web page thats 4x wider than my PC desktop. |
| 00:19.55 | andyross | The use case was google docs spreadsheets. Those are routinely enormous. In a similar vein, I wrote a html report generator here at work with 200 columns. |
| 00:20.51 | andyross | Wide pages are, obviously, "bad design". But they happen, and especially on small devices you need a UI for dealing with them. Desktop browsers use horizontal scrollbars. The G1 has a zoom gadget. My point was that the latter is just plain better. |
| 00:21.02 | ttuttle | jasta: Lemme know when you're around so you can help me get it set up. ;-) |
| 00:22.04 | cworth | andyross: You mentioned bionic integration earlier. I'm using jimps sugested recipe successfully (with an emdebian toolchain) just great for native builds with -static. What would it take to get from here to a dynamic build? |
| 00:22.16 | cworth | "jimp's" |
| 00:23.55 | andyross | What I did was log a dalvikvm build and snip out the compiler arguments from that. The prebuilt toolchain works well, but isn't terribly well integrated. You have to specify -nostdlib and some custom crt.o objects, plus a bunch of other options I forget. |
| 00:24.33 | cworth | andyross: "standard toolchain" meaning what comes with the "android sdk"? |
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| 00:25.08 | cworth | andyross: I'm not willing to click through the license agreement there. I do like this clause: |
| 00:25.10 | cworth | 3.4 Use, reproduction and distribution of components of the SDK licensed under an open source software license are governed solely by the terms of that open source software license and not this License Agreement. |
| 00:25.24 | cworth | So I'd be glad to get access only to those components. |
| 00:25.51 | cworth | andyross: Anyway, if you happen to run across the details again and care to share them, that would be great. |
| 00:25.56 | andyross | No, in the source tree. There's a prebuilt toolchain in there. It's just built GNU software, so it's GPL. |
| 00:26.05 | cworth | Oh, much better. |
| 00:26.10 | cworth | I'll go look there. |
| 00:26.21 | cworth | naively expected the source tree to just have source... |
| 00:26.48 | andyross | I don't think there's much special about it. It's a little endian arm-eabi target. |
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| 00:27.49 | andyross | I have a perl script that wraps the mess into something that looks like a normal gcc. I got started packing it up into a demo with a little JNI library and application, but got distracted with other toys. |
| 00:28.09 | cworth | Right. So what I have from emdebian is probably fine, (and was easier to get at). I just need a recipe for doing a build against bionic. |
| 00:28.35 | cworth | andyross: Hehe. I understand distractions. But do let me know if you've got that script for me to look at somewhere. |
| 00:28.43 | andyross | Sure, hold on... |
| 00:30.23 | andyross | Here: http://plausible.org/andy/agcc -- YMMV, obviously. But basically, you need a source checkout with a successful bionic build, and the arm-eabi-* tools from the prebuilt toolchain on your path. |
| 00:31.05 | cworth | andyross: Thanks. |
| 00:31.35 | RyeBrye | Ugh - I have to sign a paper contribuor license agreement? |
| 00:32.07 | RyeBrye | you guys have heard of UETA right? |
| 00:32.22 | danfuzz | i believe it can be done electronically |
| 00:33.02 | RyeBrye | scanning a paper that I sign and emailing a PDF is hardly esigning |
| 00:33.04 | danfuzz | (btw, i had to look up UETA) |
| 00:33.15 | danfuzz | i thought there was a completely electronic way |
| 00:33.21 | danfuzz | my apologies if i was mistaken |
| 00:33.22 | RyeBrye | I worked for a startup that did e-signing for medical stuff... |
| 00:33.23 | RyeBrye | It's ok |
| 00:34.17 | RyeBrye | my patch isn't crucial anyway - it just fixes the htc/dream build so it works |
| 00:34.30 | cworth | has never read UETA but seems to be lately running across things of the form "Typing your intials in the text entry below will be considered your signature" which seems specious. |
| 00:34.48 | RyeBrye | The typing-your-initials woudln't hold up |
| 00:35.02 | RyeBrye | I'd say more, but I've got screaming kids I must tame |
| 00:35.03 | cworth | RyeBrye: I would hope and assume not. |
| 00:35.12 | cworth | RyeBrye: Hehe. Good luck. |
| 00:35.15 | danfuzz | i hear sugar water helps |
| 00:35.21 | cworth | (And we're off topic anyway...) |
| 00:35.23 | danfuzz | also coffee ice cream |
| 00:35.24 | RyeBrye | it has to be captured in context, basically... we recorded images on a pdf and stored it and it's 100% the same as wet signature |
| 00:35.36 | RyeBrye | :) |
| 00:35.38 | cworth | danfuzz: Sugar always helps, (but only for a very short-term fix). |
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| 00:38.53 | tweakt | does anyone know if it's possible to sample audio directly into a memory buffer? or does it have to go to a file first? Wondering how Shazam works... |
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| 00:39.24 | tweakt | MediaRecorder doesn't seem to offer many options, unless there's some mock File class I can use |
| 00:39.54 | danfuzz | tweakt: not 100% sure, but i think you have to save to a file. this is probably a good question for one of the mailing lists |
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| 01:05.22 | ITechJunkie | is busybox the most complete method to get a shell on android? |
| 01:09.52 | Acsia | shell? |
| 01:10.03 | Acsia | it s an addon ot the current shell |
| 01:10.16 | Acsia | missing binaries |
| 01:10.20 | jasta | well, its a shell too |
| 01:10.38 | Acsia | hey jasta, have you tried five on the G1 yet? |
| 01:11.27 | cworth | ITechJunkie: What does "complete" mean? |
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| 01:12.25 | cworth | ITechJunkie: I don't see a noticeable difference between the busybox shell and the original shell. But busybox certainly adds a lot of other useful utilities, (cp for starters). |
| 01:12.28 | ITechJunkie | right. i understand what is. I was just wanting to know if there is a better or more complete method to get a shell on the g1 |
| 01:12.43 | zhobbs | ITechJunkie: never got the Term app to work? |
| 01:13.17 | ITechJunkie | zhobbs: yeah i did. adb worked thanks |
| 01:13.28 | zhobbs | ITechJunkie: cool |
| 01:14.35 | jasta | Acsia: yeah, i use it every day to and from work |
| 01:14.54 | zhobbs | jasta: does it work on edge? |
| 01:15.03 | jasta | well...... |
| 01:15.05 | jasta | currently, no. |
| 01:15.12 | ITechJunkie | i'm trying to get the most complete set of binaries for cli |
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| 01:15.36 | jasta | although ive been doing some speed tests and i think i can make it work if i use a feature to transcode to 128kbps mp3s |
| 01:15.51 | jasta | because in my tests i get about 130-140kbps over EDGE |
| 01:16.08 | jasta | but meh, over 3G it doesnt matter. T-Mobile's 3G network is really fast. |
| 01:16.16 | jasta | i test 700kbps+ |
| 01:16.40 | Acsia | I might give it a go when I have a minute |
| 01:16.46 | zhobbs | wow, that is pretty fast |
| 01:17.35 | jasta | most of my music is 192kbps, so without reencoding on the server i need 3G to work |
| 01:17.43 | jasta | which is fine, i seem to get 3G everywhere that matters around seattle |
| 01:18.02 | jasta | and it does enough prefetching that losing 3G for a shor twhile isnt a big deal |
| 01:18.18 | unix_infidel | not as bad as I thought it would be here in dallas either... |
| 01:18.23 | unix_infidel | regularly get 700+ |
| 01:18.33 | jasta | Acsia: there's one big bug im fixing this week :) |
| 01:18.58 | jasta | Acsia: when downloads fail (which as it turns out is a LOT when youre on the freeway), the retry policy is too broken to work right |
| 01:19.08 | jasta | so you end up with decent signal but the download stalls |
| 01:19.34 | jasta | the fix is not as simple as it seems, i'm basically absorbing some of the sophistication found in the DownloadProvider to make it work optimally |
| 01:19.50 | Acsia | hum k |
| 01:20.12 | jasta | it'll be fixed probably tonight :) |
| 01:20.25 | Acsia | well I ll wait then |
| 01:20.31 | jasta | otherwise yeah it works great |
| 01:20.35 | jasta | i functionally use it all the time |
| 01:20.57 | Acsia | that s really nice |
| 01:21.05 | Acsia | it s a very good idea |
| 01:21.34 | ITechJunkie | what app are you guys talking about? |
| 01:21.47 | Acsia | five |
| 01:21.54 | zhobbs | hmm...I need to know if a service is running, and can't bind or do anything asynchronously |
| 01:22.02 | ITechJunkie | what does it do? |
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| 01:23.30 | zhobbs | because you can't do anything asyncronously in a BroadcastReceiver's onReceive(), because the process is considered done when onReceive() is finished... |
| 01:24.35 | zhobbs | ITechJunkie: Five streams your library from your desktop to your phone |
| 01:24.51 | zhobbs | ITechJunkie: http://code.google.com/p/five/ |
| 01:25.04 | ITechJunkie | cool.is it on the market yet? |
| 01:25.26 | zhobbs | no, don't think it's ready yet |
| 01:25.46 | jasta | zhobbs: you're asking for the impossible. you need IPC to see if a service is up, and anytime you communicate with another process there will be delay |
| 01:26.11 | jasta | the better strategy would be to start the service with a particular intent and let the service work out what to do in onStart() |
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| 01:26.30 | zhobbs | jasta: yeah...I know. That's what I normally do |
| 01:26.39 | jasta | ITechJunkie: no, it's still in alpha/beta status. |
| 01:27.03 | zhobbs | jasta: but in this case I may or may not want to abort the intent broadcast based on what the service is doing |
| 01:27.04 | ITechJunkie | jasta: i see. |
| 01:27.19 | `vip | any way to see the battery percentage left ? |
| 01:27.28 | `vip | instead of just the color indicator ? |
| 01:27.31 | jasta | `vip: burried in the settings app, yes. |
| 01:27.39 | jasta | buried* |
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| 01:28.06 | satadru | quick question: what are the standard perms of /system/bin/sh ? |
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| 01:28.45 | `vip | ah thanks jasta found it |
| 01:28.55 | zhobbs | $ ls -l /system/bin/sh |
| 01:28.55 | zhobbs | -rwxr-xr-x root shell 86936 2008-08-01 08:00 sh |
| 01:29.30 | KNY | hey guys, I need some help signing my applications. I followed the instructions on the site exactly (AFAIK), and I get "package file was not signed correctly" when installing. `jarsigner -verify App.apk` says "jar verified." |
| 01:29.57 | zhobbs | KNY: uninstall the previous installed one, will give that error if keys don't match |
| 01:30.10 | zhobbs | or certs don't match I should say |
| 01:30.21 | KNY | uninstall the previous app? |
| 01:30.23 | satadru | thanks zhobbs |
| 01:30.54 | zhobbs | KNY: well, if eclipse installed your app while you were developing it then it signed it with a debug key |
| 01:31.08 | KNY | yeah, I've tried uninstalling the debug one |
| 01:31.21 | zhobbs | ok |
| 01:32.39 | KNY | also, I can't get `adb devices` to see my phone; I've tried killing adb and restarting and all that (x86_64, linux) |
| 01:32.43 | KNY | but that's another issue |
| 01:33.18 | zhobbs | KNY: http://code.google.com/android/intro/develop-and-debug.html#developingondevicehardware |
| 01:33.48 | KNY | ahh |
| 01:33.56 | KNY | I'll look into that |
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| 01:34.30 | KNY | so, I've uninstalled the debug version, but when I go to install the new version (from HTTP) it says "the application will replace another application" |
| 01:34.35 | KNY | why would it still say that? |
| 01:34.58 | zhobbs | KNY: goes by package name |
| 01:35.01 | zhobbs | I think |
| 01:35.14 | KNY | zhobbs, but I've totally (or so I thought) removed the old app |
| 01:35.15 | xavd | KNY how did you uninstall? |
| 01:35.25 | KNY | xavd, through settings > applications |
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| 01:40.03 | KNY | there we go, I got it installed through adb |
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| 01:48.12 | `vip | question, do i have to install trak via my PC ? |
| 01:48.16 | `vip | www.trak.fr |
| 01:48.57 | zhobbs | `vip: if it's not on the Market |
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| 01:53.16 | KNY | "The certificate that signed this apk must is not valid until the future." Holy crap, Google |
| 01:53.22 | KNY | that's quite the Engrish |
| 01:54.00 | danfuzz | what the your is with problem that? |
| 01:54.18 | KNY | must is not valid until the future? |
| 01:54.23 | Disconnect | put his intellishield on tonight, yay |
| 01:54.38 | xavd | KNY: where did you see that? |
| 01:54.49 | KNY | xavd, when uploading my signed app to the market :-/ |
| 01:54.52 | danfuzz | fine perfectly to is that seeming me |
| 01:55.01 | KNY | I guess I messed something up ... |
| 01:55.17 | cbeust_ | KNY: I'll pass this on to the Market people |
| 01:55.36 | KNY | cbeust_, thanks. Tell them they can just cut me a check ;) |
| 01:56.03 | KNY | cbeust_, also, you could pass on that I don't see a way to delete uploaded applications--just unpublish them |
| 01:58.15 | cbeust_ | KNY: bug filed |
| 01:58.24 | KNY | cbeust_, excellent. Thanks! |
| 01:58.44 | cworth | danfuzz: You channel Yoda well. |
| 02:01.07 | Disconnect | ok its creepy to watch tivo'd simpsons from before the election. |
| 02:02.34 | tweakt | y is that? |
| 02:03.00 | Disconnect | the constant barrage of attack ads is a lot weirder when you know who wins |
| 02:03.09 | tweakt | oooh the ads, yeah, gotcha |
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| 02:09.19 | KNY | hey so here's a question: why would the md5sum of a .apk change when downloaded via HTTP? |
| 02:09.44 | KNY | if I md5sum it on the live server, it's different than on the SD card |
| 02:09.55 | cbeust_ | gzip-compressed maybe? |
| 02:10.06 | spikebike | same zie on both ends? |
| 02:10.11 | spikebike | I've heard comcast playing strange games |
| 02:10.25 | languish | t-mobile caching server? |
| 02:11.03 | KNY | languish, possibly |
| 02:11.05 | poetic_folly|G5 | i see zodttd |
| 02:11.20 | zodttd | :) |
| 02:11.25 | zodttd | hi pf |
| 02:11.27 | poetic_folly|G5 | hey guess what |
| 02:11.29 | zodttd | wha? |
| 02:11.31 | poetic_folly|G5 | your phone shipped out today |
| 02:11.32 | poetic_folly|G5 | :D |
| 02:11.36 | zodttd | YAYS! :) |
| 02:11.40 | zodttd | bows |
| 02:11.40 | poetic_folly|G5 | yessir |
| 02:11.48 | poetic_folly|G5 | courtseys |
| 02:11.50 | poetic_folly|G5 | wait wtf |
| 02:11.55 | zodttd | hehe |
| 02:11.56 | KNY | but I think that is what was causing my problem--if I download it, mount the SD card, swap the .APK with the one from the server, then disconnect the phone, and select the .apk from the browser download list, it installs perfectly |
| 02:12.52 | languish | KNY OOOOH that problem |
| 02:12.56 | languish | I know how to fix that |
| 02:13.07 | languish | it's not downloading as the correct mime type |
| 02:13.13 | languish | it's an issue with the browser |
| 02:13.15 | languish | on the g1 |
| 02:13.28 | languish | there are a few steps to try, one of them *will* work |
| 02:14.06 | KNY | languish, interesting |
| 02:14.26 | KNY | it just had me worried that I had borked something with the signing procedure |
| 02:14.53 | *** join/#android macboz (n=kozen@n058152051224.netvigator.com) |
| 02:14.59 | languish | 1) set the correct mime encoding for apk's in the server settings 2) use the www. of the domain, not just domain.tld if it has a non www. hostname well, try another 3) on the server, change the name of the ,apk, that's all just change the name if it's samhain.apk make it samhain007.apk |
| 02:15.33 | languish | there was one other step, i forget what it was, but.. one or a combo of those will work |
| 02:15.45 | languish | try the last first |
| 02:15.52 | languish | and don't ask for explainations, I have none. |
| 02:16.10 | KNY | languish, haha |
| 02:16.19 | KNY | I'll change it on the server-side |
| 02:16.23 | KNY | do you know what the proper one is? |
| 02:16.43 | languish | you'll also notice.. that the same urls that this occurs with, are the ones that the g1 browser doesn't remember in history or autocomplete dropdown |
| 02:17.22 | *** join/#android BHSPitMonkey (n=stephen@unaffiliated/bhspitmonkey) |
| 02:17.38 | languish | KNY it's application/vnd.android.package-archive |
| 02:17.50 | KNY | languish, thanks |
| 02:17.55 | languish | np |
| 02:18.28 | languish | and yeah, google knows about this |
| 02:19.07 | languish | KNY, btw, what version are you running? rc 19, 29? |
| 02:19.21 | languish | or that incomplete bastardization from the uk |
| 02:19.23 | languish | rc7 or something |
| 02:19.28 | KNY | uh |
| 02:19.36 | KNY | whatever shipped with the G1...? |
| 02:19.38 | languish | setting, about phone |
| 02:19.41 | KNY | ah |
| 02:19.42 | KNY | hold |
| 02:20.08 | languish | at the bottom, build number |
| 02:20.18 | KNY | RC 28 |
| 02:20.28 | languish | 'k thanks |
| 02:20.37 | *** join/#android jbq (n=jbq@nat/google/x-bc6b80edb9afacfe) |
| 02:20.45 | languish | jbq |
| 02:20.52 | jbq | hey |
| 02:22.24 | languish | G1's came in handy tonight while shopping with my wife |
| 02:22.31 | KNY | definitely |
| 02:22.35 | KNY | shopsavvy ftw |
| 02:22.41 | languish | that too |
| 02:22.43 | KNY | I keep scanning everything in my hours |
| 02:22.44 | languish | :) |
| 02:22.51 | KNY | languish, haha, well played |
| 02:22.59 | KNY | in my house, too |
| 02:23.22 | languish | :) |
| 02:23.42 | *** join/#android netcoffee (n=netcoffe@61.141.152.23) |
| 02:24.01 | *** join/#android macboz_ (n=kozen@n058152114174.netvigator.com) |
| 02:24.23 | languish | i'm resisting becomming that guy that sticks hidden clear-lable bar codes on everything in the house to catalog |
| 02:24.25 | KNY | one thing the G1 is missing (and maybe someone should write it...?) is that there's no setting to vibrate and then ring after 30 seconds or so |
| 02:24.47 | languish | that's prolly coming down the road |
| 02:25.05 | KNY | languish, it could just be an app, no? |
| 02:25.06 | languish | but you can list it as a feature request |
| 02:25.12 | languish | i guess it could |
| 02:25.34 | KNY | my #1 feature request is a charting API |
| 02:25.38 | *** join/#android jbq_ (n=jbq@72.14.224.1) |
| 02:26.07 | cbeust_ | KNY: sounds like a good opportunity for a third part, more so than something that would part of the platform |
| 02:26.15 | cbeust_ | Ok I can't type tonight |
| 02:26.46 | KNY | cbeust_, yeah. I tried jfreechart and eclipse would die (outofmemoryexception) every time as long as the .jar was on the build path |
| 02:27.02 | cbeust_ | KNY: increase the heap used by Eclipse |
| 02:27.26 | xavd | KNY: we use jfreechart in the android tools (ddms and eclipse plugin) |
| 02:27.35 | KNY | xavd, hmm |
| 02:27.43 | KNY | I might have to revisit it, then... |
| 02:28.53 | languish | cbeust_, know if there's a google-developed or sanctioned blogger app in the pipeline? |
| 02:29.03 | languish | aside from 3rd party |
| 02:29.24 | wastrel | what's a charting api? |
| 02:29.25 | cbeust_ | Can't comment, sorry. |
| 02:29.31 | wastrel | for like pie charts? |
| 02:29.34 | languish | cbeust_, nod |
| 02:29.46 | languish | now has hope :) |
| 02:29.59 | *** join/#android mfrnc (n=mfrnc@210-84-32-12.dyn.iinet.net.au) |
| 02:30.05 | KNY | wastrel, yeah, and bar charts and line graphs |
| 02:30.11 | cbeust_ | wonders if there is a way to not comment that won't get anyone to think in any direction... |
| 02:30.19 | KNY | wastrel, http://www.jfree.org/jfreechart/samples.html |
| 02:30.19 | languish | never |
| 02:30.51 | KNY | cbeust_, I'm going to take that as an admission of guilt |
| 02:30.56 | languish | cbeust_ "i couldn't tell you offhand" |
| 02:31.31 | *** join/#android ITechJunkie (n=trevor@ip72-198-61-100.ok.ok.cox.net) |
| 02:31.50 | languish | if you're asked to check "if we do or don't it's unlikely i would even be allowed" |
| 02:32.06 | languish | that leaves little room for assumption |
| 02:32.08 | *** join/#android shackan (n=frob@host66-137-dynamic.6-87-r.retail.telecomitalia.it) |
| 02:32.21 | cworth | admires the following message: |
| 02:32.23 | cworth | make: *** No rule to make target `Please-install-JDK-5.0,-update-12-or-higher,-which-you-can-download-from-java.sun.com' |
| 02:32.39 | Cedric2_ | There, this way nobody will recognize me |
| 02:32.40 | KNY | impressive, cworth |
| 02:32.40 | cworth | I'm a big fan of subverting tools to give users better error messages. |
| 02:32.52 | KNY | hey guys, where did Cedric_ go? |
| 02:33.04 | languish | i think he lept out the window |
| 02:33.08 | KNY | good riddance |
| 02:33.22 | Cedric2_ | Watch it, I still have the power |
| 02:34.51 | languish | but you're not here to use it, remember? |
| 02:34.53 | languish | :/ |
| 02:35.27 | KNY | Cedric2_, nice, reaching out from beyond the grave |
| 02:36.13 | KNY | hey, is there a built-in control to do the "default" text input things that are used in like, the Google Search box on the main page? |
| 02:36.17 | *** join/#android dglazkov (n=dglazkov@c-24-130-144-56.hsd1.ca.comcast.net) |
| 02:36.27 | KNY | where the text is grayed out and disappears once you start typing? |
| 02:37.23 | meoblast001 | languish: i fixed up my site.... www.meoblast001.mysticgalaxies.com/ms |
| 02:37.54 | Cedric2_ | KNY: it's called a text hint |
| 02:37.59 | Cedric2_ | you can configure it in your layout file |
| 02:38.11 | KNY | oh man |
| 02:38.15 | KNY | how did I not see that? |
| 02:38.25 | languish | meoblast001, that's sorta inappropriate |
| 02:38.30 | meoblast001 | lol |
| 02:38.36 | languish | while I don't disagree |
| 02:38.38 | KNY | and I put in all this work with focus listeners... |
| 02:38.41 | languish | it's still inappropriate |
| 02:39.02 | meoblast001 | actually thats on my personal page i made on my server with a different subdomain.... i made it cuz a friend of mine hates macs |
| 02:39.40 | languish | just be aware that google's a non-discriminatory company |
| 02:39.51 | languish | you could say macs suck :) |
| 02:40.03 | meoblast001 | i could... but that only requres 2 Macs |
| 02:40.04 | meoblast001 | i made 3 |
| 02:40.05 | KNY | languish, how do you know he didn't mean it as a compliment? |
| 02:40.10 | meoblast001 | dragged them onto my canvas |
| 02:40.22 | languish | KNY, true, they sure did look like they were having a party |
| 02:40.25 | Chainfire | languish> how about discrimination on location? :) I still cant make a Google Checkout Merchant account... |
| 02:40.49 | *** join/#android jasonparekh__ (n=jasonpar@69.36.227.135) |
| 02:40.58 | languish | Chainfire, ohh I'd say that sucks, but it's regional business policy, not discrimination :) |
| 02:41.08 | languish | or just "not there, yet." |
| 02:42.01 | *** join/#android poetic_folly|G5 (n=poetic_f@97.103.39.213) |
| 02:42.22 | Chainfire | or just unfair competition, or just bla. discrimination is not an easy word to use and usually to say one does or does not use discriminatory tactics is a folly in itself |
| 02:43.07 | cworth | The make error is similar to what I convinced gcc to spit out for cairo: |
| 02:43.07 | cworth | cairo-text.c:(.text+0x1f): undefined reference to `cairo_current_path_DEPRECATED_BY_cairo_copy_path |
| 02:43.07 | languish | usually regional law is what holds such things up |
| 02:43.31 | languish | i'm sure google would love to have checkout evailable everywhere there's commerce |
| 02:43.35 | Chainfire | for two years... for a company the size of Google? :) |
| 02:43.53 | languish | sure, look at the problems microsoft has with europe |
| 02:44.22 | Chainfire | like ? |
| 02:45.08 | Chainfire | I don't see PayPal having any trouble |
| 02:45.17 | languish | paypals been around a bit longer |
| 02:45.19 | Cedric2_ | You don't? :) |
| 02:45.22 | Chainfire | and they're scammers.. |
| 02:45.44 | languish | Chainfire, just note.. I had a bad experience with google checkout |
| 02:45.51 | Chainfire | no doubt |
| 02:46.03 | Chainfire | but I wonder if they took $15k from you like PayPal did from me |
| 02:46.18 | languish | the one time I needed them to interact with a vendor that was blaming an issue ON google checkout |
| 02:46.49 | languish | they just kept telling me "go deal with the vendor" because the rep that was handling the issue for google didn't comprehend the issue at all |
| 02:46.58 | jasta | god, spell checking in Eclipse is so irritating |
| 02:47.03 | *** part/#android Dougie187 (n=doug@68.35.245.156) |
| 02:47.05 | jasta | disables |
| 02:47.11 | Cedric2_ | jasta: agree, I just turn it off |
| 02:47.54 | Chainfire | heh, PayPal just completely ignored the issue :) held my cash for almost a year and cost me about $8k in lawyering to eventually get it back. Don't you doubt, all the horror stories you read about them are true. And yet, there is no alternative. |
| 02:48.35 | Chainfire | Once, long ago, when Google Checkout came out I thought change may come... guess I'll be hoping that for the next 4 or 5 years to come. |
| 02:48.35 | languish | Chainfire, and yeah, there's a reason i use paypal as minimally as possible, don't link them to a bank account that will allow an overdraft request, and don't keep money in that account for paypal to suck |
| 02:49.20 | languish | and even then, they're the last option |
| 02:49.55 | languish | i mostly use them to get some small items sold on ebay, then use that money to donate to projects |
| 02:49.56 | Chainfire | yep, but in the meantime, I have the #4 ranked safest CC processor in the world, and people still continuously ask me about PayPal support |
| 02:50.06 | ITechJunkie | hey guys, why doesn't ifconfig have any output on the system? |
| 02:50.08 | *** join/#android dglazkov_ (n=dglazkov@72.14.224.1) |
| 02:50.19 | Chainfire | ITechJunkie suffix it with the interface name |
| 02:50.27 | Chainfire | its not 'normal' ifconfig |
| 02:51.04 | ITechJunkie | Chainfire: Is there something similar on the system? And can the normal version be ported over? |
| 02:51.26 | Chainfire | ITechJunkie no clue, still waiting for my G1. That's just something I picked up playing with emulator :) |
| 02:51.51 | ITechJunkie | Chainfire: Bummer bro, you live outside the states? |
| 02:51.57 | Chainfire | yeah |
| 02:52.02 | ITechJunkie | UK? |
| 02:52.09 | Chainfire | im importing one though... its already been sent... just waiting for it to arrive |
| 02:52.18 | Chainfire | no Netherlands |
| 02:52.30 | Chainfire | if I was in the UK I would suddenly have a lot less issues... :) |
| 02:52.40 | ITechJunkie | right on. I bet the wait is killing ya |
| 02:52.49 | Chainfire | mwah |
| 02:53.23 | Chainfire | It was... since I know my direct competitors in the US are working on the same thing I am |
| 02:53.46 | Chainfire | But before I didn't release the G1 is just a glorified Java-phone, I actually thought it would be open. |
| 02:53.53 | ITechJunkie | What are you working on? |
| 02:53.57 | KNY | I take what I said about my #1 feature being a charting API |
| 02:54.03 | KNY | there should be a google docs API |
| 02:54.21 | KNY | so I don't have to try and use POI or something |
| 02:56.30 | Hiro2 | anybody know how i can get the ringtone files that comes in G1? |
| 02:56.47 | Hiro2 | is it on some website? or anyway to grab the file? |
| 02:56.55 | Chainfire | ITechJunkie> now if I told you that, everybody would be doing it :) |
| 02:57.41 | *** join/#android Slackwise (n=Lance@c-24-13-177-123.hsd1.il.comcast.net) |
| 02:57.45 | ITechJunkie | Chainfire: I understand bro. Good luck with it, and I'll be keeping an eye out for your name in the Market |
| 02:57.54 | jasta | Chainfire: you must be one of those annoying "precious snowflake" kids. |
| 02:58.11 | Chainfire | "precious snowflake" ? |
| 02:58.27 | Chainfire | ill concede I can be horribly annoying though. |
| 02:58.33 | jasta | if your idea is trivial enough that anyone could do it, and good enough that anyone would, then it's already been done. |
| 02:58.40 | ITechJunkie | Chainfire: lol |
| 02:58.51 | jasta | if not, then you might as well publicly discuss it :) |
| 02:58.55 | Cedric2_ | jasta: ideas alone don't make good products |
| 02:59.03 | Cedric2_ | lot of people might have tried your idea and failed for different reasons |
| 02:59.08 | Cedric2_ | certainly doesn't mean you shouldn't try |
| 02:59.18 | Chainfire | jasta> right :) |
| 02:59.28 | jasta | Cedric2_: i dont think you and i are reading the same conversation :) |
| 02:59.30 | Chainfire | guess that's why I make one of the top-5 selling WM apps and you don't |
| 02:59.56 | Chainfire | and on that, i shall say goodnight. |
| 03:00.49 | wastrel | winmob apps eh |
| 03:00.56 | jasta | incidentally, i have been a WM user for years and have yet to encounter a single app worth money |
| 03:01.07 | jasta | the only reason any apps sell is because the builtins are _SO_ terrible |
| 03:01.34 | jasta | and there's no decent community behind the entire platform to build all the trivial apps |
| 03:01.56 | *** join/#android romainguy__ (n=gfx@69.36.227.135) |
| 03:05.32 | *** join/#android PoohbaLT (n=Poohba@c-98-235-52-97.hsd1.nj.comcast.net) |
| 03:08.50 | poetic_folly|G5 | http://wmwifirouter.com/ heh |
| 03:12.58 | jasta | hehe, i can't wait until he delivers something for Android that lets us pay to use netfilter :) |
| 03:14.49 | poetic_folly|G5 | yah doesn't http://graha.ms/androidproxy/ already do that |
| 03:15.10 | Damm | the only thing I shudder at... is the that someone fixes up email really nice and charges 29.99 for |
| 03:15.14 | romainguy__ | it requires USB tethering |
| 03:15.25 | poetic_folly|G5 | right |
| 03:15.32 | Damm | something about the winmo developers scare me |
| 03:15.39 | Damm | they charge 9.99 for the flashlight type apps |
| 03:15.41 | romainguy__ | why? |
| 03:15.51 | romainguy__ | because they want to make money? :) |
| 03:16.05 | Damm | romainguy__, making money for crap is still crap |
| 03:16.13 | poetic_folly|G5 | silly dev's wanting to make money for their work |
| 03:16.25 | Damm | all that happens is people crack/pirate/steal/whatever their work |
| 03:16.26 | poetic_folly|G5 | although $10 for a flashlight app is a bit ridiculous. ;) |
| 03:16.38 | romainguy__ | which is not much better |
| 03:16.40 | Damm | poetic_folly|G5, there is such a thing. |
| 03:16.50 | poetic_folly|G5 | i paid $5 for the entire Thriller album the other day in iTunes. |
| 03:16.54 | languish | perceived value is the issue |
| 03:17.03 | Hiro2 | apps cost money now? |
| 03:17.11 | Damm | I remember back in the day (DOS 3.2) I found a nice 'cls' alternative |
| 03:17.13 | Damm | it cost 10$ |
| 03:17.24 | languish | Hiro2, there are app stores not the android market, that yes, are charging |
| 03:17.27 | Damm | I mean it was written in ASM, but all it did was a fancy way of clearing your screen |
| 03:17.42 | Hiro2 | languish: how do you install it? |
| 03:17.44 | languish | Hiro2, and there are apps, that forward you to their own websites to pay as well |
| 03:17.47 | Damm | Hiro2, trials |
| 03:17.51 | languish | Hiro2, off the web |
| 03:17.56 | Hiro2 | i see |
| 03:18.04 | Hiro2 | are you guys making your own softwares also? |
| 03:18.04 | Damm | you install it, it works a few times, it forwards you to a paypal page saying pay up sucker |
| 03:18.22 | languish | or you pay the app store itself |
| 03:18.38 | languish | then download it, and they foward you a code |
| 03:18.46 | Hiro2 | it sucks how i have lots of ideas for apps, but i can't code at all :( |
| 03:18.51 | languish | or authenticate over the net |
| 03:18.58 | Hiro2 | ic |
| 03:19.24 | Damm | i'm waiting for the one that reads your contact information and spams you to pay for it |
| 03:19.53 | Hiro2 | are there any virus out there for G1 already? |
| 03:20.02 | Hiro2 | or I guess I should say android |
| 03:20.07 | Cedric2_ | Nope |
| 03:20.24 | Damm | I doubt a "virus" would do much |
| 03:20.30 | Damm | as it is now you'd have to install it manually |
| 03:20.33 | Damm | so it's not much of a virus |
| 03:20.49 | Hiro2 | if it could get all your pw you enter, gmail, etc |
| 03:20.52 | Hiro2 | that's big risk |
| 03:21.14 | elad | well the g1 has been rooted |
| 03:21.26 | Damm | elad, but that's not exactly getting your passwords |
| 03:21.44 | romainguy__ | elad: and it requires user intervention |
| 03:21.51 | elad | nope, but root does help if an app can take advantage of that |
| 03:21.55 | romainguy__ | it's not remotely rooted |
| 03:22.00 | elad | not yet :O |
| 03:22.10 | Cedric2_ | The user has to allow this, I don't see how an antivirus would even work |
| 03:22.16 | Damm | T-Mobile firewalls your device |
| 03:22.18 | ITechJunkie | hey guys, I know that the Android Team is supposed to be releasing a virtual keyboard sometime next year. Do you know if anyone else has started developing one that might be out sooner? |
| 03:22.30 | Damm | no one can connect to any port of your G1 on the 3G network |
| 03:22.32 | Damm | only via wifi |
| 03:22.40 | Damm | so realistically someone rooting your G1 remotely is slim |
| 03:22.45 | romainguy__ | ITechJunkie: you can't do it correctly without modifying the framework |
| 03:23.24 | ITechJunkie | romainguy__: I'm no programmer, but i'm assuming that it can be done? With a lot of work i'm assuming. |
| 03:23.34 | Damm | ITechJunkie, not decently |
| 03:23.46 | Hiro2 | oh btw, what apps do you guys like? |
| 03:23.52 | romainguy__ | ITechJunkie: to do it right you need to modify the core libraries, which means you need to update the phone |
| 03:23.59 | romainguy__ | and it's not simple |
| 03:24.01 | *** join/#android duey (n=duey@203.96.223.40) |
| 03:24.08 | ITechJunkie | romainguy__: Ah |
| 03:24.12 | romainguy__ | anyway it's coming for Q1 2009 |
| 03:24.14 | Damm | android.kernel.org unreliable? |
| 03:24.18 | romainguy__ | (early Q1 possibly) |
| 03:24.25 | ITechJunkie | Damn: romainguy__ : thanks for clearing that up |
| 03:24.34 | romainguy__ | np |
| 03:26.19 | Hiro2 | so, anybody with their favorite app? |
| 03:26.41 | ITechJunkie | Hiro2: I really like weatherbug |
| 03:27.09 | Damm | ditto |
| 03:27.12 | *** join/#android alexzhang (n=alex@218.17.227.162) |
| 03:27.15 | Hiro2 | ItechJunkie: It's always sunny here in miami... :( I dont think I can enjoy it much |
| 03:27.15 | ITechJunkie | Hiro2: and LightRacer is a blast |
| 03:27.19 | wastrel | Hiro2: i like the doodle one |
| 03:27.29 | Hiro2 | ItechJunkie: yeah lightracer is pretty good |
| 03:27.41 | Hiro2 | wastrel: what'd doodle? the bluebrush? |
| 03:27.45 | wastrel | yeah |
| 03:28.04 | ITechJunkie | Hiro2: I'm in oklahoma, I never know whats gonna happen here. Example, yesterday high 80's. Today low 60's and I'm currently under a tornado watch |
| 03:28.23 | Hiro2 | wow |
| 03:28.31 | *** join/#android ugarit (n=chatzill@c-24-0-135-125.hsd1.nj.comcast.net) |
| 03:28.34 | ITechJunkie | Hiro2: no kiddin |
| 03:29.37 | Hiro2 | btw do we have an app that listens what your listening to and tells you what song it is? |
| 03:29.41 | ITechJunkie | Hiro2: Shazam is pretty cool too, I have no idea how that even works. |
| 03:29.50 | wastrel | what's shazam |
| 03:29.53 | ITechJunkie | Hiro2: thats what Shazam is |
| 03:29.55 | wastrel | ah |
| 03:29.56 | Cedric2_ | +! for shazam |
| 03:29.58 | Hiro2 | lol |
| 03:30.00 | Cedric2_ | +1 I mean |
| 03:30.02 | wastrel | i don't listen to music |
| 03:30.08 | ITechJunkie | Freakin awsome app though |
| 03:31.01 | ITechJunkie | I also like imeem, but will be replaced whenever the guys at Pandora stop dragging their ass about making an app for android |
| 03:31.20 | *** join/#android yxz97 (n=unknow@201.194.46.86) |
| 03:31.21 | Hiro2 | oh, yeah i wanted to contact them, pandora |
| 03:31.34 | Hiro2 | they took pretty long to come up for iphone, how long do you think they'll take for android? |
| 03:32.14 | yxz97 | Can be so kind to shared with me the latest Android features? |
| 03:32.20 | ITechJunkie | Hiro2: I doubt it'll be as long as the iphone. But the main guy over there doesn't want to devote any of his developers on it just yet. |
| 03:32.51 | Hiro2 | ItechJunkie: how do you know all this? |
| 03:34.04 | ITechJunkie | Hiro2: I asked the oracle. |
| 03:35.15 | Hiro2 | ItechJunkie: oracle the software? |
| 03:35.27 | ITechJunkie | Hiro2: Oracle=Google |
| 03:35.42 | ITechJunkie | :) |
| 03:35.59 | Hiro2 | ItechJunkie: oh, haha ok |
| 03:36.53 | Hiro2 | WOW |
| 03:36.55 | Hiro2 | shazam, awesome |
| 03:37.00 | Hiro2 | it detected the song pretty good |
| 03:37.15 | jasta | that technology needs to go away ;) |
| 03:37.17 | ITechJunkie | Hiro2: I'm telling you bro, it's magic |
| 03:37.48 | Hiro2 | ItechJunkie: let's see if it can detect japanese music ;) |
| 03:37.49 | ITechJunkie | I dont understand how it does it so quick |
| 03:38.03 | ITechJunkie | Hiro2: suhweet |
| 03:38.53 | *** join/#android mowgli (n=mviswana@c-66-176-235-132.hsd1.fl.comcast.net) |
| 03:39.07 | ITechJunkie | crosses fingers |
| 03:39.13 | Hiro2 | first test, tokyo drift theme song |
| 03:39.21 | Hiro2 | not really japanese but, yeah it got it |
| 03:39.26 | ITechJunkie | hah nice |
| 03:39.33 | ITechJunkie | nice |
| 03:39.38 | ITechJunkie | do'h |
| 03:40.03 | *** part/#android ITechJunkie (n=trevor@ip72-198-61-100.ok.ok.cox.net) |
| 03:40.07 | *** join/#android ITechJunkie (n=trevor@ip72-198-61-100.ok.ok.cox.net) |
| 03:40.17 | Hiro2 | ok, next test pure japanese |
| 03:40.24 | Hiro2 | 1st try, fail |
| 03:40.31 | Hiro2 | 2nd try |
| 03:40.49 | Hiro2 | fail |
| 03:40.51 | Hiro2 | ok, another song |
| 03:41.01 | ITechJunkie | bummer |
| 03:41.31 | Hiro2 | next song, songs that some of ppl in US know, from japan |
| 03:41.42 | ITechJunkie | oky guys i'm outta here |
| 03:41.58 | Hiro2 | alrighty |
| 03:42.11 | *** part/#android ITechJunkie (n=trevor@ip72-198-61-100.ok.ok.cox.net) |
| 03:46.24 | *** join/#android jbq (n=jbq@c-24-5-185-88.hsd1.ca.comcast.net) |
| 03:47.56 | *** join/#android jbq_ (n=jbq@72.14.224.1) |
| 03:51.45 | zhobbs | jasta: is it safe to call RemoteCallBackList.beginBroadCast() just to get the number of listeners? (ie, just beginBroadcast() and finishBroadcast() without calling each getBroadcastItem(int)) |
| 03:52.59 | zhobbs | hmm, looks like it's probably ok |
| 03:53.34 | zhobbs | maybe not efficient, but ok |
| 03:54.59 | jasta | yeah, very ineficient tho |
| 03:55.23 | jasta | especially if you're just testing it for emptiness |
| 03:55.35 | zhobbs | that's all I want to do |
| 03:55.53 | zhobbs | might just have to track that in my addListener/removeListener methods |
| 03:56.09 | yxz97 | heyyyy |
| 03:56.39 | jasta | zhobbs: you could extend it and track that |
| 03:56.57 | yxz97 | any smart phone commercially that comes with Android for common use in routine (I'm software engineer)? |
| 03:57.02 | jasta | just make sure to synchronize :) |
| 03:57.13 | yxz97 | :( can anyone see me ? |
| 03:57.16 | Hiro2 | anybody know who takes streetview images? |
| 03:57.31 | Disconnect | Hiro2: its this guy named john |
| 03:57.40 | zhobbs | jasta: that's true, maybe I should just extend it |
| 03:57.45 | Hiro2 | Disconnect: does his last name happen to be smith? |
| 03:57.55 | Disconnect | i'm pretty sure its not |
| 03:58.04 | jasta | zhobbs: they dont let you have access to mCallbacks, but thats how they synchronize, so you'd basically have to wrap the entire thing in order to preserve thread safety |
| 03:58.15 | Hiro2 | Disconnect: isn't it some company partnered up with google that's taking all those images? |
| 03:58.19 | jasta | and you'd lose a lot of efficiency that way |
| 03:58.24 | jasta | since there would be two monitor locks instead of 1 |
| 03:58.40 | jasta | on that note, i'm often frustrated by the fields that google chooses to keep private instead of protected. |
| 03:59.14 | zhobbs | jasta: I agree...I find myself cursing some private fields |
| 03:59.29 | jasta | in a lot of cases you have to inefficiently work around it |
| 03:59.53 | jasta | which is not a win for a mobile platform, even to promote a simpler stable interface |
| 04:00.35 | *** join/#android netcoffee_ (n=netcoffe@61.141.156.237) |
| 04:00.46 | jasta | in the case of RemoteCalbackList, though, i wonder why they synchronize on mCallbacks and not this |
| 04:01.01 | jasta | if they synchronized on this, then you could wrap it easily. |
| 04:01.31 | dgilmore | my G1 has in the last 20 minutes having home stoping responding |
| 04:01.49 | jasta | dgilmore: the browser seems to do this. |
| 04:02.41 | dgilmore | im getting a message that says "Sorry! Activity Home (in process android.process.acore) is not responding." witha force close or wait button that doesnt work |
| 04:03.29 | RyeBrye | dgilmore - pull the battery and reboot? |
| 04:03.41 | dgilmore | RyeBrye: done that three times |
| 04:04.39 | RyeBrye | dgilmore - did you try booting into safe mode? |
| 04:04.51 | *** join/#android Gary|tp (n=Gary1357@c-66-41-234-235.hsd1.mn.comcast.net) |
| 04:04.52 | dgilmore | RyeBrye: how do i do that? |
| 04:05.45 | RyeBrye | hold down menu when you turn it on |
| 04:12.29 | *** join/#android scarabx (n=scarabx@c-98-216-52-33.hsd1.ma.comcast.net) |
| 04:12.33 | *** join/#android joel (n=joel@adsl-153-211-161.mia.bellsouth.net) |
| 04:13.56 | Disconnect | anyone have dropbear builds? |
| 04:14.07 | RyeBrye | I do for dropbear client |
| 04:14.12 | RyeBrye | and for scp |
| 04:14.18 | RyeBrye | ... they are part of the normal android build :) |
| 04:14.22 | Disconnect | looking for server |
| 04:14.23 | RyeBrye | (not installed, but in the SDK build) |
| 04:14.49 | *** join/#android alexzhang (n=alex@218.17.227.162) |
| 04:15.35 | Disconnect | or notes on doing cross-builds with teh platform code |
| 04:16.11 | *** join/#android Elijah (n=Eli@173.100.208.177) |
| 04:16.13 | RyeBrye | I know people say they've installed sshd or whatever - but I wonder how they configure it |
| 04:16.25 | RyeBrye | it's not like password-based auth would work with a system with no passwords |
| 04:16.50 | Elijah | I cannot believe Sprint! They give new customers a prorated ETF but not their exisiting customers!!! |
| 04:16.52 | SplasPood | key auth maybe? |
| 04:17.03 | RyeBrye | yeah, key auth would likely work |
| 04:17.13 | *** join/#android PINguAR_ (n=PINguAR_@88.235.146.65) |
| 04:17.15 | *** join/#android summatusmentis (n=summatus@keymaster.tproa.net) |
| 04:17.19 | Disconnect | nevermind, was missing a thread |
| 04:18.02 | RyeBrye | dgilmore - did that fix it? |
| 04:18.19 | Disconnect | RyeBrye: http://forum.xda-developers.com/showpost.php?p=2868643&postcount=43 with a crypted password (dropbear doesn't allow passwordless auth) |
| 04:18.21 | dgilmore | RyeBrye: its not booting into safe mode |
| 04:18.44 | RyeBrye | dgilmore - have you done anything funky to the phone/ |
| 04:19.01 | dgilmore | RyeBrye: nope |
| 04:19.27 | dgilmore | i was looking at a photo i took, and it went wonky |
| 04:20.16 | RyeBrye | mount -o remount,rw /dev/block/mtdblock3 /system in your post can be trimmed down... "mount -o remount rw /system" works too |
| 04:20.30 | Disconnect | only with busybox. w/ default you need the long one |
| 04:20.40 | RyeBrye | dgilmore - one thing you can try that is relatively safe is to do the SDcard update |
| 04:20.53 | RyeBrye | dgilmore - it doesn't delete any data but would purge your /system directory |
| 04:21.09 | RyeBrye | dgilmore - do you have an SD Card that didn't come with the phone in there? the ones that came with the phone are sometimes funky |
| 04:21.21 | dgilmore | RyeBrye: is it documented somewhere? |
| 04:21.28 | dgilmore | i have the one it came with |
| 04:21.42 | RyeBrye | Disconnect - no, I'm positive I've used the shorter one every time |
| 04:21.59 | RyeBrye | Disconnect, and I don't have mount pointing to busybox on my machine and I use the shorter one every time for all the filesystems |
| 04:22.07 | spikebike | pretty sure I'd used dropbear with a cert on the n800 |
| 04:22.15 | spikebike | hrm, maybe I installed osshd |
| 04:22.55 | Disconnect | n800 is a totally different animal |
| 04:23.06 | spikebike | well I figure dropbear = dropbear |
| 04:23.27 | Disconnect | yah but n800 has standard auth |
| 04:23.43 | cmonex | dgilmore what happpened? |
| 04:23.52 | cmonex | ah i see |
| 04:24.08 | Damm | it would be nice if the kernel supported ext2/3 or we could format the SD Card to be usable for apps |
| 04:24.15 | Damm | then we should shove apps onto it |
| 04:24.49 | cmonex | i'd try a hard reset first, before reflash.. |
| 04:25.27 | spikebike | ioerror mentioned getting that to work |
| 04:25.35 | *** join/#android lethalcode (n=walker@pennmush.org) |
| 04:25.37 | spikebike | I think he just made a link |
| 04:25.39 | ioerror | spikebike, what? |
| 04:25.49 | ioerror | The kernel does support yaffs2 |
| 04:25.55 | spikebike | didn't you mention extending the application storage with making a link to the sd card? |
| 04:25.57 | Damm | spikebike, i got an error about cross-device symlink |
| 04:25.57 | ioerror | So you could format an sdcard with that non vfast file system |
| 04:26.04 | ioerror | or try a loop device on a file |
| 04:26.16 | Damm | ioerror, right... but how do you make a yaffs2 filesystem? wikipedia says there is no 'formatting'? |
| 04:26.20 | lethalcode | Howdy folks - I can use requestWindowFeature to turn off the title. But how do I turn off the notification window shade? |
| 04:26.39 | spikebike | hard links can't cross filesystems, did you try a soft link? |
| 04:26.44 | ioerror | Damm, mkfs? |
| 04:27.25 | dgilmore | cmonex: ive pulled the battery at least 5 times now |
| 04:27.35 | zhobbs | lethalcode: getWindow().setFlags(WindowManager.LayoutParams.FLAG_FULLSCREEN, WindowManager.LayoutParams.FLAG_FULLSCREEN); |
| 04:27.37 | romainguy_ | lethalcode: you need to use the theme Theme.NoTitleBar.Fullscreen |
| 04:27.43 | romainguy_ | zhobbs: it's better to use a theme |
| 04:27.44 | Damm | ioerror, hrmph i seemed to have missed that :) |
| 04:27.49 | romainguy_ | this avoids the window to be launched not fullscreen |
| 04:27.51 | *** join/#android jrsky (n=jrsky@user-12ld54d.cable.mindspring.com) |
| 04:27.52 | cmonex | dgilmore: i mean hard reset from recovery mode. |
| 04:27.53 | romainguy_ | and therefore avoids the "flicker" |
| 04:27.58 | romainguy_ | same goes for removing the titlebar |
| 04:28.03 | Disconnect | RyeBrye: pastebin hang on |
| 04:28.09 | cmonex | there is an option in there for clearing data |
| 04:28.22 | Disconnect | RyeBrye: http://pastebin.ca/1246506 |
| 04:28.51 | dgilmore | cmonex: i cant get to recovery mode |
| 04:28.55 | RyeBrye | Disconnect - oh, did you point to busybox for your mount? |
| 04:29.01 | lethalcode | zhobbs, romainguy_ - Thanks! |
| 04:29.07 | ioerror | Has anyone managed to hack their boot screen? |
| 04:29.11 | zhobbs | romainguy_: hmm, never noticed the flicker |
| 04:29.20 | romainguy_ | well if you don't use a theme |
| 04:29.21 | *** join/#android jrsky (n=jrsky@user-12ld54d.cable.mindspring.com) |
| 04:29.26 | romainguy_ | the window will start with a title bar and not fullscreen |
| 04:29.33 | romainguy_ | and then will switch to title bar + fullscreen |
| 04:29.42 | romainguy_ | it's especially noticeable when you turn on window animations |
| 04:29.52 | romainguy_ | so, use a theme :) |
| 04:29.57 | romainguy_ | (and it's easier) |
| 04:29.59 | Disconnect | RyeBrye: no check the pastebin. system mount rejects anything that doesn't have "source target" |
| 04:30.14 | RyeBrye | Disconnect - you put in a comma... DONT |
| 04:30.15 | RyeBrye | :P |
| 04:30.19 | RyeBrye | # mount -o remount rw /system |
| 04:30.20 | zhobbs | romainguy_: do you know the line to add to an existing theme for fullscreen? |
| 04:30.30 | zhobbs | romainguy_: <item name="android:windowNoTitle">true</item> is the titlebar |
| 04:30.33 | Disconnect | RyeBrye: right. because that says "mount with options 'rewrite' rw on /system" |
| 04:30.41 | Disconnect | RyeBrye: the comma is important |
| 04:30.45 | zhobbs | I guess I can find it now that I have the source |
| 04:30.55 | romainguy_ | zhobbs: I don't remember, look at common/res/values/themes.xml in the git tree |
| 04:31.03 | zhobbs | romainguy_: thanks |
| 04:31.07 | RyeBrye | Disconnect, I know - it's normally important - but their build is weird. I promise you the command I just pasted is what i use every single time and it works every single time |
| 04:31.10 | Damm | ioerror, hrm, permission denied in terminal |
| 04:31.13 | Damm | can't find it in the shell? |
| 04:32.14 | ioerror | Damm, get a real linux box |
| 04:32.20 | ioerror | Damm, mount your sdcard |
| 04:32.29 | ioerror | determine the raw device, say like /dev/sda1 |
| 04:32.33 | ioerror | and then mkfs |
| 04:32.34 | Damm | ioerror, uh I run linux... It doesn't have yaffs2 |
| 04:32.42 | Damm | format it ext3? |
| 04:33.03 | ioerror | Damm, custom kernel? |
| 04:33.07 | ioerror | Or a distro? |
| 04:33.11 | Damm | custom kernel |
| 04:33.33 | *** part/#android Elijah (n=Eli@173.100.208.177) |
| 04:33.41 | zhobbs | lethalcode: it's <item name="android:windowFullscreen">true</item> in case you want it in an existing theme |
| 04:33.43 | ioerror | I imagine two things are relevant, you may want to look at the kernel sources that android ships with |
| 04:33.48 | ioerror | the second is http://www.yaffs.net/ |
| 04:33.59 | ioerror | Specifically, http://www.yaffs.net/node/346 |
| 04:34.46 | cmonex | dgilmore: are you sure? did you properly follow the streps? what happens? |
| 04:34.56 | ioerror | http://groups.google.com/group/android-developers/msg/13235642ebccd249?pli=1 |
| 04:35.29 | ioerror | I don't have my phone attached to my laptop, so i haven't even looked to see if there's a mkfs anywhere on the device |
| 04:35.39 | ioerror | danfuzz, are you around? |
| 04:36.14 | lethalcode | zhobbs: Thanks! |
| 04:36.23 | Damm | ioerror, ah this should be a load of fun. |
| 04:37.15 | ioerror | Damm, If you check out the full android source, you should see : ./external/yaffs2 |
| 04:37.32 | romainguy_ | stupid Mac OS X |
| 04:37.40 | Damm | ioerror, i've had a very painful time doing repo sync |
| 04:37.42 | ioerror | Or ./kernel/fs/yaffs2 |
| 04:37.54 | *** join/#android unix_infidel (n=blue@unaffiliated/unixinfidel/x-8383745) |
| 04:38.13 | Damm | i've yet to be able to get a full repo sync... last time i tried (a few hours ago) android.kernel.org failed me |
| 04:39.07 | ioerror | Damm, in ./external/yaffs2/yaffs2/utils/ - you should see 'mkyaffs2image.c' and 'mkyaffsimage.c' |
| 04:39.13 | ioerror | Those might be useful, I have no real idea |
| 04:39.22 | ioerror | is compiling them now |
| 04:39.22 | Damm | ioerror, creates an image... i guess I can dd it |
| 04:39.36 | Damm | yeah I already compiled them, snagged it from aleph one's cvs |
| 04:39.42 | ioerror | aleph one |
| 04:39.45 | ioerror | huh? |
| 04:39.47 | ioerror | Elias? |
| 04:40.03 | Damm | export CVSROOT=:pserver:anonymous@cvs.aleph1.co.uk:/home/aleph1/cvs cvs logon |
| 04:40.09 | Damm | cvs login, no password... cvs co yaffs2 |
| 04:40.16 | dgilmore | cmonex: i held down menu then pressed power. it started then i get nothing other than keyboard backlight |
| 04:40.17 | Damm | from yaffs.net :) |
| 04:40.32 | *** join/#android vinse_ (n=vinse_@208.253.223.146) |
| 04:40.39 | Damm | and theirs compiles |
| 04:40.44 | Damm | where as clearly i'm 64bit |
| 04:40.46 | ioerror | ah, not the guy that wrote smashing the stack for fun and profit |
| 04:40.47 | ioerror | heh |
| 04:40.47 | Damm | twitches |
| 04:41.06 | ioerror | Damm, |
| 04:41.07 | ioerror | cgi-bin/viewcvs.cgi/ |
| 04:41.09 | ioerror | err |
| 04:41.17 | Damm | ? |
| 04:41.25 | ioerror | mkyaffsimage is the tool you want |
| 04:41.37 | Damm | yep |
| 04:41.37 | ioerror | it takes a directory and it makes an image of that directory |
| 04:41.47 | ioerror | it also can deal with big endian v little endian |
| 04:41.50 | cmonex | dgilmore: you have to press alt something too, iirc |
| 04:42.11 | Damm | image: VMS Alpha executable |
| 04:42.14 | Damm | that's disturbing |
| 04:42.30 | Damm | that'll let you mount -o loop an image |
| 04:42.37 | dgilmore | cmonex: is there some documentation i can read somewhere? |
| 04:42.39 | Damm | not exactly my goal but eh it's close |
| 04:43.09 | *** join/#android jasonparekh__ (n=jasonpar@c-98-234-84-237.hsd1.ca.comcast.net) |
| 04:43.13 | ioerror | Damm, i assume that once you have such an image, you should be able to mount it, modify it, etc and eventually put it into your sd card |
| 04:43.15 | ioerror | I hope that helps |
| 04:43.16 | cmonex | dgilmore: http://forum.xda-developers.com/showpost.php?p=2847622&postcount=77 |
| 04:43.27 | Damm | ioerror, it does. |
| 04:43.34 | cmonex | apparently Alt+W is the hard reset |
| 04:43.41 | cmonex | after you get the menu options.. |
| 04:43.41 | cmonex | :) |
| 04:44.00 | ioerror | so what's this about an unsigned bootloader? |
| 04:44.50 | RyeBrye | ioerror - not at the HTC bootloader level, but easily done in the anroid recovery mode |
| 04:45.02 | ioerror | RyeBrye, so single user mode? |
| 04:45.21 | *** join/#android eggy (i=eggy@i.am.theeggman.info) [NETSPLIT VICTIM] |
| 04:45.37 | ioerror | Any idea what the format of this file name is? |
| 04:45.39 | RyeBrye | No, not really single user mode - but using the existing recovery mode but modifying what it checks for |
| 04:45.40 | ioerror | signed-kila-ota-115247-prereq.TC4-RC19+RC28.zip |
| 04:46.08 | ioerror | I'd like to see what other releases are on the site but I don't understand what the 115247 number means, i assume a build id |
| 04:46.12 | RyeBrye | Yeah |
| 04:46.23 | RyeBrye | I think RC19 was released on there somewhere |
| 04:46.31 | RyeBrye | I have RC19 and RC29 |
| 04:46.35 | romainguy_ | well |
| 04:46.41 | romainguy_ | RC19 is the one that the phone shipped with |
| 04:46.51 | RyeBrye | Right |
| 04:47.02 | RyeBrye | but for some reason an OTA update exists for it |
| 04:47.08 | romainguy_ | yaeh |
| 04:47.12 | romainguy_ | that was for us |
| 04:47.15 | RyeBrye | Oh :) |
| 04:47.20 | DarkriftX | well, my site survived a day of /. but my analytics didnt :( |
| 04:47.30 | DarkriftX | my analytics shut down after 10k visits |
| 04:47.40 | ioerror | what's the url of that? |
| 04:47.45 | DarkriftX | of what |
| 04:47.50 | ioerror | of the first image? |
| 04:47.51 | DarkriftX | ota? |
| 04:47.59 | DarkriftX | gimme a min, i got em both on my site |
| 04:48.01 | RyeBrye | there is a link in the xda forums somewhere |
| 04:48.04 | romainguy_ | you can't downgrade btw |
| 04:48.05 | RyeBrye | or DarkriftX has them |
| 04:48.11 | ioerror | I've never upgraded |
| 04:48.24 | DarkriftX | you want google link or rapidshare? |
| 04:48.30 | ioerror | I just want to unpack them and see what's in the sqllite databases without having to use a debugger on an airplane |
| 04:48.34 | ioerror | google |
| 04:48.44 | RyeBrye | I've accomplished everything I think I wanted to with root on the phone... now I'm going to focus on building apps :) |
| 04:48.46 | DarkriftX | and do you want the first ota (rc19) or the second (rc29) |
| 04:49.05 | *** join/#android Hiro2 (i=Hiro@unaffiliated/hiro2) [NETSPLIT VICTIM] |
| 04:49.06 | ioerror | RyeBrye, did you find a way to keep root through upgrades? |
| 04:49.17 | ioerror | DarkriftX, the first |
| 04:49.21 | ioerror | i think i have the second |
| 04:49.25 | RyeBrye | ioerror - yeah, my recovery mode only accepts things signed with a key I hold now :) |
| 04:49.38 | ioerror | RyeBrye, did you document it? |
| 04:49.49 | DarkriftX | erm.... i dont have the google link |
| 04:49.51 | ioerror | RyeBrye, you created your own ca then? |
| 04:50.00 | ioerror | DarkriftX, what's the file name? |
| 04:50.01 | DarkriftX | i have it hosted on my site, but not the orig link |
| 04:50.14 | DarkriftX | signed-kila-ota-114235-prereq.TC4-RC19.zip |
| 04:50.21 | RyeBrye | ioerror - not yet - right now I'm just using the default testing one in the open source build |
| 04:50.46 | ioerror | RyeBrye, so you've flashed your own imag?E |
| 04:50.51 | RyeBrye | althouh ioerror - it is theoretically possible that I could be dumb enough to unpack and resign an OTA update without ensuring that I maintained root I suppose |
| 04:50.52 | ioerror | (awesome, if so) |
| 04:51.15 | RyeBrye | ioerror - I didn't but I was working with dream_kill today and he did his |
| 04:51.26 | RyeBrye | he had more balls than me I guess :) |
| 04:51.26 | DarkriftX | ioerror, try to add the google url to the front of that one |
| 04:51.37 | ioerror | DarkriftX, no go |
| 04:51.39 | ioerror | oh well |
| 04:51.42 | ioerror | i got what i wanted |
| 04:51.44 | DarkriftX | its hosted on my site |
| 04:51.45 | DarkriftX | but |
| 04:51.50 | DarkriftX | you have to reg to click the link |
| 04:51.50 | ioerror | RyeBrye, that's awesome |
| 04:51.56 | RyeBrye | http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?p=2869725&posted=1#post2869725 that guy talks about flashing too |
| 04:52.00 | ioerror | RyeBrye, i really want to unlock my phone in the next week |
| 04:52.02 | DarkriftX | http://android-dls.com/forum/index.php?f=20&t=147&rb_v=viewtopic |
| 04:52.56 | RyeBrye | There is one thing left that I'm considering, which is to backup everything to the SDcard - and then blow out /cache and /data and and resize /cache to 10 megs and /data to much bigger |
| 04:53.03 | RyeBrye | then restore all from the SD card |
| 04:53.08 | RyeBrye | (all the /data) |
| 04:53.10 | *** join/#android grim (n=grim@guifications.org) [NETSPLIT VICTIM] |
| 04:53.13 | cworth | is delighted with andyross's agcc script |
| 04:53.32 | ioerror | hrm, it appears that there are some interesting things in that .zip |
| 04:53.35 | DarkriftX | RyeBrye, have you tried moving an installed android app to sd and symlinking it? |
| 04:53.42 | RyeBrye | DarkriftX - I haven't |
| 04:53.45 | RyeBrye | DarkriftX - does that work? |
| 04:53.51 | DarkriftX | or even moving the internet cache to card and symlinking that? |
| 04:53.52 | ioerror | Did you guys read the isec paper? |
| 04:53.52 | DarkriftX | im sure it would |
| 04:54.09 | RyeBrye | DarkriftX - Moving /cache to SDCard would be cool :) |
| 04:54.10 | ioerror | http://isecpartners.com/files/iSEC_Securing_Android_Apps.pdf |
| 04:54.18 | ioerror | If you guys haven't read that, I really really suggestit |
| 04:54.21 | ioerror | isec++ |
| 04:55.24 | RyeBrye | that looks like a good read |
| 04:55.33 | ioerror | Has anyone unpacked radio.img? |
| 04:55.38 | ioerror | It looks like a job for Ida Pro |
| 04:55.45 | RyeBrye | Yeah, I think some people are working on it |
| 04:56.03 | ioerror | interesting |
| 04:56.14 | RyeBrye | I'm mostly interested in the OS layer stuff... I'm a developer not a radio hacker |
| 04:56.24 | ioerror | take a look at META-INF/com/google/android/update-script |
| 04:56.37 | ioerror | specifically, set_perm for ping |
| 04:56.41 | RyeBrye | Yep, that's what does the updating - the commands there are interpreted by some stuff |
| 04:56.51 | RyeBrye | is very specific with "some stuff" |
| 04:57.08 | RyeBrye | This platform is really pretty sweet |
| 04:57.19 | RyeBrye | It's absolutely the best phone platform out there if you can get ownership of your device |
| 04:57.20 | ioerror | yes, I agree |
| 04:57.25 | ioerror | Yes, it really is |
| 04:57.42 | cworth | RyeBrye: I tried the shorter command when I first did a remount (I didn't have any instructions in front of me), and I'm sure it failed and I created by giving it device and path. |
| 04:57.53 | ioerror | Google had some of the best people in the world on this project (people from the sidekick team + other googlers) |
| 04:57.58 | RyeBrye | cworth - did you have a comma in it? |
| 04:58.11 | RyeBrye | cworth - if you have a comma in it, it will fail |
| 04:58.19 | RyeBrye | (the short version) |
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| 04:58.31 | ioerror | these images are just mtd block device images, no? |
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| 04:58.41 | cworth | RyeBrye: Yes, I had a comma. |
| 04:58.52 | RyeBrye | cworth - try the short version again without a comma |
| 04:58.58 | cworth | RyeBrye: But I had the comma in both the short and long versions. |
| 04:59.00 | RyeBrye | cworth - someone has a bug in their mount command :) |
| 04:59.08 | RyeBrye | cworth - yes, in the LONG version, the comma works |
| 04:59.09 | cworth | RyeBrye: Heh. Will try next time. |
| 04:59.16 | cworth | RyeBrye: Bizarre. |
| 04:59.20 | RyeBrye | maybe we should patch it so it works properly :) |
| 04:59.25 | cworth | is still catching up on backlog |
| 04:59.45 | cworth | Anyone replace the kernel yet? |
| 05:00.12 | RyeBrye | I've not heard of anyone doing it |
| 05:00.20 | spikebike | it's not possible is it? |
| 05:00.29 | RyeBrye | the OTA updates do, don't they? |
| 05:00.32 | RyeBrye | oh wait |
| 05:00.46 | RyeBrye | maybe they don't |
| 05:00.47 | spikebike | I thought the kernel was signed |
| 05:01.02 | RyeBrye | Yeah, I think replacing the kernel could be a bad idea |
| 05:01.14 | spikebike | actually I was curious if the initrd could be replaced, it overwrites / |
| 05:01.30 | RyeBrye | is it in the OTA update? |
| 05:01.31 | spikebike | well it shouldn't brick, might have to do a factory restore though |
| 05:01.42 | spikebike | dunno |
| 05:01.51 | RyeBrye | the factory restore sits on top of linux |
| 05:02.10 | RyeBrye | if you are flashing the underbelly out from under it, then you remove the restore and the OS at the same time |
| 05:02.16 | Disconnect | RyeBrye: seriously, it doesn't work. http://pastebin.ca/1246538 |
| 05:02.46 | cworth | RyeBrye: Ah, your own signing key for recovery mode. Nice! |
| 05:03.17 | Disconnect | RyeBrye: it only does that because it defaults to rw mounts. so "-o remount screwthisnoise /system" would have the same effect |
| 05:03.27 | Disconnect | but -o remount ro doesn't work |
| 05:03.36 | RyeBrye | Ah, gotcha :) |
| 05:03.39 | RyeBrye | stands corrected |
| 05:03.59 | RyeBrye | I've only ever wanted to mount rw - so I guess that's why |
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| 05:06.15 | Disconnect | awesome. just gotta convince dropbear the root user exists (it doesn't like the faked-up /etc/passwd) [7728] Nov 06 05:05:39 login attempt for nonexistent user from 192.168.0.121:51525 |
| 05:07.02 | ioerror | hrm, there aren't any sqlite databases in this .zip? |
| 05:07.14 | cworth | RyeBrye: I'll agree with "best phone platform" after I see if I can actually take ownership of my own device. :-) |
| 05:07.22 | ioerror | RyeBrye, have you unpacked the recovery.img? |
| 05:07.36 | RyeBrye | ioerror - no... but I've built one |
| 05:07.56 | DarkriftX | romainguy, you got any ideas about users? |
| 05:07.58 | romainguy_ | ioerror: what sqlite databases do you want to look at? |
| 05:08.02 | ioerror | romainguy, all of them |
| 05:08.03 | romainguy_ | there's no database in the system image |
| 05:08.07 | romainguy_ | they are created in your data partition |
| 05:08.30 | ioerror | romainguy_, I'm trying to figure out the mystery of this telnetd weirdness |
| 05:08.34 | spikebike | I bought 2 g1's |
| 05:08.39 | ioerror | spikebike++ |
| 05:08.48 | ioerror | spikebike, want to meet at the hacklab tomorrow? |
| 05:08.49 | spikebike | same store, same minute, off adjacent spots on the shelf |
| 05:09.07 | spikebike | I got an update last night, wife has no update 8-( |
| 05:09.13 | DarkriftX | they are random |
| 05:09.17 | DarkriftX | completely random |
| 05:09.19 | spikebike | knows not of the hacklab |
| 05:09.22 | romainguy_ | not really random :) |
| 05:09.28 | DarkriftX | shush! |
| 05:09.29 | romainguy_ | but they're not pushed to everybody at the same time |
| 05:09.30 | spikebike | oh maybe by IMEI or something |
| 05:09.38 | DarkriftX | its random madness! random i tell you! |
| 05:09.44 | ioerror | spikebike, https://www.noisebridge.net/wiki/Getting_Here |
| 05:09.46 | DarkriftX | settles down |
| 05:09.51 | RyeBrye | spikebike - I heard it's based on the Android ID |
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| 05:10.09 | ioerror | romainguy_, do you have all of the files hosted somewhere? |
| 05:10.17 | romainguy_ | what files? |
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| 05:10.24 | DarkriftX | so romainguy do you have any ideas on what to do about ssh not working because no users? is there a way to create users, or any other idas? |
| 05:10.32 | romainguy_ | DarkriftX: no idea |
| 05:10.47 | romainguy_ | to be honest, I don't give a shit about the low layers of the platform :) |
| 05:11.26 | spikebike | ioerror ah, interesting, is something in particular going on? |
| 05:11.28 | ioerror | romainguy, the files in / on the g1 ;-) |
| 05:11.32 | spikebike | that would be 3 ish hours in a car |
| 05:11.37 | ioerror | spikebike, not unless we're hacking on android all night |
| 05:11.43 | romainguy_ | ioerror: they're on the phone |
| 05:11.47 | spikebike | heh |
| 05:11.48 | romainguy_ | or if you want easier access, in the emualtor |
| 05:11.50 | ioerror | romainguy, well, yes |
| 05:11.56 | ioerror | romainguy, actually, perhaps you know |
| 05:11.59 | romainguy_ | so I still don't get what you want |
| 05:12.02 | cworth | RyeBrye: But if kernel updates are not possible, then the hardware's pretty boring to me. |
| 05:12.06 | ioerror | well, I have neither in front of me |
| 05:12.17 | romainguy_ | then download the SDK :) |
| 05:12.29 | spikebike | not ready for anything like that, need to review that modile auth url you sent and decide if I should use/help with that or do something completely different |
| 05:12.29 | ioerror | romainguy, Perhaps you know this? Why does telnetd have uid/gid of root when launched as a normal user? |
| 05:12.45 | romainguy_ | ioerror: no I don't know |
| 05:12.49 | spikebike | ioerror that's quite a good puzzle |
| 05:12.53 | ioerror | it's pretty wacky |
| 05:13.03 | RyeBrye | cworth - we need to hack the HTC bootloader to give us a safety net |
| 05:13.48 | Disconnect | hmm. i've convinced 'id' and such that i'm legit. but not dropbear. |
| 05:14.20 | DarkriftX | RyeBrye, someone is working on that already |
| 05:14.24 | DarkriftX | and getting close |
| 05:14.45 | RyeBrye | If we can get fastboot on the HTC bootloader, I'm so going to pee myself |
| 05:14.59 | gdsx | RyeBrye: TMI |
| 05:15.08 | RyeBrye | :) |
| 05:16.35 | muthu | how to run activitycreator, from android source? |
| 05:16.41 | muthu | don |
| 05:16.45 | muthu | oops |
| 05:16.50 | gambler | muthu, are you having problems with eclipse? |
| 05:17.03 | muthu | gambler: am not using eclipse |
| 05:17.09 | gambler | ok.. |
| 05:17.11 | muthu | checked out the source.. did make |
| 05:17.14 | gdsx | muthu: it's a java app now |
| 05:17.25 | muthu | oh |
| 05:17.27 | gdsx | muthu: so if you run it, it should just DTRT |
| 05:17.29 | spikebike | ioerror my theory is the binary is signed and there's a sql table that has signature <-> auth |
| 05:17.39 | muthu | gdsx: its not setting the path right.. |
| 05:17.50 | romainguy_ | muthu: it works only with the SDK |
| 05:17.53 | ioerror | spikebike, yes, that's why i'd like to see the sql table! |
| 05:17.55 | gambler | gdsx, does the eclipse android auto-update? all of a sudden im having tons of problems with android on eclipse. |
| 05:18.06 | muthu | romainguy_: hmmm.. |
| 05:18.12 | gdsx | gambler: dunno; I've never used eclipse |
| 05:18.19 | gambler | :/ lucky you |
| 05:18.22 | romainguy_ | muthu: what are you trying to do? |
| 05:18.32 | gdsx | gambler: yeah, sorry |
| 05:18.34 | muthu | add some improvements to activitycreator |
| 05:18.40 | muthu | like running tests etc., |
| 05:19.08 | gdsx | muthu: tests in what sense? |
| 05:19.11 | muthu | want to generate a test folder and a test build.xml which can run your tests |
| 05:19.18 | muthu | instrumentation |
| 05:19.51 | muthu | just like the apidemos |
| 05:20.04 | Hiro2 | do you guys know where i can download the default ringtones from android? or how i can grab it myself? |
| 05:20.22 | romainguy_ | they're probably in the open source tree |
| 05:20.47 | Hiro2 | romainguy: where? |
| 05:20.52 | romainguy_ | source.android.com |
| 05:20.53 | gdsx | muthu: if you do `find -i 'activitycreator*'`, do you find anything? |
| 05:20.59 | romainguy_ | it's in tools/ |
| 05:21.02 | muthu | gdsx: yes, it in out |
| 05:21.26 | muthu | i can run them, except.. the template directory needs to be set right |
| 05:21.46 | gdsx | muthu: well, where's the source for it? |
| 05:21.46 | muthu | which is what the script used to do, before |
| 05:21.55 | muthu | gdsx: the source is in development/tools |
| 05:22.19 | Hiro2 | romainguy: i cant find tools |
| 05:22.26 | gdsx | muthu: is the template directory not where it should be? can you not find it at all? If not, can you just borrow it from the SDK? |
| 05:22.31 | romainguy_ | Hiro2: I wasn't talking to you :) |
| 05:22.32 | gdsx | (and file a bug) |
| 05:22.35 | Hiro2 | oh oops |
| 05:22.38 | romainguy_ | Hiro2: the ringtones are in the common resources |
| 05:22.42 | muthu | gdsx: yeah, the templates cannot be found.. its a bug |
| 05:22.46 | romainguy_ | no |
| 05:22.54 | romainguy_ | activitycreator is meant to be run from the SDK |
| 05:22.58 | romainguy_ | you need to build the SDK |
| 05:23.02 | romainguy_ | as in make sdk |
| 05:23.05 | Hiro2 | romainguy: im sorry, can you read me? |
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| 05:23.14 | Hiro2 | romainguy: im sorry, can you link me* |
| 05:23.15 | muthu | romainguy_: make sdk, doesn' generate the sdk |
| 05:23.23 | romainguy_ | weird |
| 05:23.24 | muthu | all it does is generate sdk docs |
| 05:23.37 | romainguy_ | it doesn't generate the SDK zip in out/? |
| 05:23.43 | muthu | nope |
| 05:24.04 | muthu | which is frustrating.. since we don't know how you guys do it |
| 05:24.14 | romainguy_ | as I said several times |
| 05:24.20 | romainguy_ | the git tree is totally different from our internal tree |
| 05:24.24 | romainguy_ | so things are a bit flaky |
| 05:24.27 | romainguy_ | we're working on it |
| 05:24.32 | muthu | ohhhh ok |
| 05:24.55 | gambler | romainguy, regarding out discussion the other day, I was able to get beanshell running on android no problem, but not groovy. |
| 05:24.58 | Damm | kinda weird. |
| 05:24.59 | romainguy_ | you've seen the size of the tree, that can give you an idea on how complex it is to switch to a new tree layout on a new version control system :)) |
| 05:25.02 | gambler | romainguy, anyone inside google using groovy on android? |
| 05:25.05 | Damm | i'd expect them to be similar if not exact |
| 05:25.11 | romainguy_ | gambler: yeah I'm not surprised, Groovy relies a lot on dynamic stuff |
| 05:25.15 | muthu | should be fairly straightforward to generate tests and instrumentaton et al |
| 05:25.17 | romainguy_ | gambler: not that I know of |
| 05:25.20 | Disconnect | romainguy: any hints on abusing the cross-compile toolchain? |
| 05:25.21 | Disconnect | :) |
| 05:25.22 | romainguy_ | Damm: well they're not |
| 05:25.24 | gdsx | Damm: "surprise!" |
| 05:25.32 | romainguy_ | Disconnect: why abuse it? can't you just use it? |
| 05:25.36 | Damm | clearly |
| 05:26.27 | Disconnect | well any use is 'abuse' since its not supported. |
| 05:26.38 | gdsx | muthu: anyway, let me know how this stuff goes. Instrumentation is at least partly my baby now |
| 05:27.04 | muthu | gdsx: i can't work on it, since would not be able to test it right |
| 05:27.20 | muthu | but here's what needs to be done: |
| 05:27.26 | romainguy_ | muthu: did you sourced envsetup.sh? |
| 05:27.33 | muthu | yep |
| 05:27.38 | romainguy_ | -d |
| 05:27.48 | muthu | ? |
| 05:28.14 | muthu | create tests folder, and do almost the same as that of main |
| 05:28.22 | muthu | instead of activity, create activityinstrumentationtest |
| 05:28.30 | muthu | that's it |
| 05:28.50 | muthu | and include a target that can do 'adb shell...' |
| 05:29.44 | lethalcode | Another Q: When switching apps (by pressing the 'Home' button), my app quits, then restarts when home'd back to. |
| 05:29.54 | gdsx | muthu: unfortunately, I have other highish-priority stuff to work on |
| 05:30.11 | romainguy_ | muthu: when I make sdk, it build everything, not just the docs |
| 05:30.22 | romainguy_ | lethalcode: define "quits" |
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| 05:30.28 | lethalcode | What I'd like to do is have it running until it's explicitly quit by the user: Most notably because it generally takes a long time to finish it, and I want them to feel free to check e-mail, reply to SMS, etc. |
| 05:30.34 | lethalcode | romainguy: Presses back instead of home. |
| 05:30.35 | cworth | romainguy_: Is that the same as just "make" or different? |
| 05:30.44 | alexzhang | Is all of the software of G1 compiled from google's release source codes? |
| 05:30.47 | gdsx | lethalcode: have you read the docs about how Android apps work? |
| 05:31.04 | gdsx | lethalcode: The android app lifecycle, I believe it's called |
| 05:31.08 | lethalcode | gdsx: Aye. I *could* use savedStateBundle to fake it, but that still costs a lot in preload time. |
| 05:31.09 | muthu | romainguy_: yeah, our env is different |
| 05:31.17 | romainguy_ | lethalcode: that's how it works |
| 05:31.18 | muthu | as you said, not everything is in there in source |
| 05:31.27 | romainguy_ | muthu: I'm talgkin about the public tree |
| 05:31.31 | romainguy_ | that's what I'm building right now |
| 05:31.50 | JairunCaloth | how would you go about installing an app you copied over to the SD card over usb? |
| 05:31.51 | romainguy_ | lethalcode: all the core apps work this way, surely your app can do the same :)) |
| 05:32.05 | muthu | romainguy_: make sdk |
| 05:32.10 | muthu | that's what i run in public tree |
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| 05:32.33 | muthu | may be i'll clean and run |
| 05:32.41 | romainguy_ | lemme check |
| 05:33.28 | lethalcode | romainguy_: That's what I thought. I must be doing something wrong. |
| 05:33.30 | lethalcode | Thanks! |
| 05:33.45 | lethalcode | Oh wait - Yeah - Do sensors run on acitivies in the background? |
| 05:34.19 | gdsx | lethalcode: activities, no |
| 05:34.24 | gdsx | lethalcode: services, yes |
| 05:34.26 | romainguy_ | your app is supposed to stop them when it goes in the background |
| 05:34.35 | gdsx | err... what he said :o) |
| 05:34.47 | romainguy_ | (unless you want to drain the battery and be mean to the user :) |
| 05:34.47 | lethalcode | Gotcha. |
| 05:35.13 | lethalcode | Heh. |
| 05:35.44 | lethalcode | Ciao again, back to code. |
| 05:35.55 | lethalcode | And thanks. |
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| 05:38.43 | cworth | JairunCaloth: I first did that over telnet with something like: |
| 05:40.04 | cworth | dd if=/sdcard/binary of=/system/bin/binary bs=1 count=[actual_size_of_file_here] |
| 05:40.09 | JairunCaloth | I'm not trying to install the app over usb, I copied the app over useb to the SD card. I just want to get it installed |
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| 05:40.20 | cworth | But maybe it "should" go to /data not /system. |
| 05:40.36 | cworth | JairunCaloth: Yes, same here. |
| 05:40.50 | jimp | cworth: "cat /sdcard/binary > /system/bin/binary" is easier to type :) |
| 05:41.09 | JairunCaloth | or just busybox cp /sdcard/blah /system/bin/blash |
| 05:41.09 | cworth | After I used that same trick to get busybox in place, I could use "cp" which is simpler. |
| 05:41.20 | cworth | jimp: Yeah, fair point. :-) |
| 05:41.34 | gdsx | cworth: uhh... why not just use cp? |
| 05:41.42 | jimp | gdsx: because toolbox doesn't have cp |
| 05:41.42 | cworth | tries to avoid cat abuse |
| 05:41.43 | JairunCaloth | anywho, does that work for .apk files? |
| 05:41.50 | gdsx | ok, point :o) |
| 05:41.51 | cworth | gdsx: Eerily doesn't exist. |
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| 05:42.50 | cworth | JairunCaloth: Oh, presumably those will need to be fed to some installer. No idea how to do that on the command line, (or if it's possible). Or if one can point some GUI installer to /sdcard. |
| 05:43.31 | JairunCaloth | so you can do it from the browser but not from the phone... lol |
| 05:43.31 | RyeBrye | I'd recommend installing stuff to /data/local/bin |
| 05:43.33 | RyeBrye | instead of /system/bi |
| 05:43.36 | RyeBrye | err /system/bin |
| 05:44.23 | JairunCaloth | Well, for cli apps, I'm thinking about setting up a dir on the SD card, then simlinking to it |
| 05:44.32 | cworth | RyeBrye: We really need a good single place to collect best-known practices for things like this. |
| 05:44.33 | RyeBrye | yeah, that woudl work too |
| 05:44.38 | RyeBrye | Yeah, a wiki would be good |
| 05:44.46 | cworth | Stuff is spread all over various fora right now. |
| 05:45.03 | romainguy_ | muthu: when I run make sdk on the git tree, I get: ./out/host/darwin-x86/sdk/ |
| 05:45.24 | romainguy_ | in this directory you'll have a dir named android-sdk_eng.USERNAME_ARCH |
| 05:45.26 | DarkriftX | i have a forum specifically for this if you want to take a stab at posting soem of it cworth |
| 05:45.33 | romainguy_ | and in there you can find the compiled version of activitycreator |
| 05:45.34 | cworth | romainguy_: For me, "make" completed, but "make sdk" aborts with some javadoc error. |
| 05:45.41 | DarkriftX | xda-devs is a great place but its really full of junk right now |
| 05:45.56 | romainguy_ | cworth: did you change anything in the tree? |
| 05:46.04 | romainguy_ | it's a tree I synced a few days ago |
| 05:46.14 | romainguy_ | muthu: and when you want to compile only activitycreator for your tests, run mmm development/tools/activitycreator/ |
| 05:46.15 | cworth | DarkriftX: I'm not interested in a forum format I don't think. I just want a single page that can be updated I think. |
| 05:46.21 | cworth | romainguy: Nope. |
| 05:46.36 | cworth | romainguy: But it could be I've not got a sufficient javadoc installation on my end or something. |
| 05:46.41 | romainguy_ | (mmm in general is used to compile a specific sub-project, like mmm packages/apps/Launcher/ to build Home) |
| 05:46.51 | romainguy_ | cworth: if you have a Sun's JDK you should be good |
| 05:47.09 | cworth | romainguy_: I probably don't. |
| 05:47.10 | JairunCaloth | Forums are great and all, but wikis truely rule for some things |
| 05:47.16 | cworth | I installed something from Debian main. |
| 05:47.55 | cworth | "openjdk-6-jdk", (but I have no idea what that actually is) |
| 05:48.36 | cworth | Before I installed that, "make" wouldn't do anything, but afterwards it seemed quite happy, (gave the appearance of running to completion without fatal errors anyway). |
| 05:49.13 | JairunCaloth | screw it... |
| 05:49.23 | JairunCaloth | points his browser at the app on his G1 and installs it that way |
| 05:49.32 | cworth | JairunCaloth: Heh. |
| 05:49.46 | jimp | cworth: not to contribute to the huge proliferation of sites, but I could certainly set up a wiki if you'd like |
| 05:50.01 | JairunCaloth | I'm amazed that it is the only known way to install those apps right now |
| 05:50.22 | cworth | jimp: I haven't seen any other wiki yet, so that might not be bad proliferation. |
| 05:50.47 | RyeBrye | DarkriftX might be setting one up |
| 05:51.12 | DarkriftX | yeah, ill set it up if you guys will use it |
| 05:51.13 | romainguy_ | JairunCaloth: you can use adb install |
| 05:51.30 | JairunCaloth | romainguy_: ahhh awsome thanks :) |
| 05:51.41 | JairunCaloth | I just discovered adb tonight |
| 05:51.46 | RyeBrye | adb rules |
| 05:52.06 | JairunCaloth | I've been battleing my G1 to get it on my wifi for the past week and a half. I have barely even gotten to play with it |
| 05:52.06 | cworth | adb seems totally bizarre to me |
| 05:52.20 | gdsx | cworth: how so? |
| 05:52.24 | romainguy_ | cworth: how so? |
| 05:52.25 | cworth | Why require a custom binary on the remote end? |
| 05:52.31 | DarkriftX | RyeBrye, you want to be in charge of the wiki? |
| 05:52.33 | gdsx | cworth: as opposed to... |
| 05:52.35 | JairunCaloth | It's up and working on wifi now thought, just in time to really dig into it |
| 05:52.41 | RyeBrye | I can be - but I'd like another admin or two |
| 05:52.55 | cworth | Things like USB file transfer, ssh, and real shells are so much comfortable, (for someone like me at least). |
| 05:52.57 | RyeBrye | someone with mediawiki experience would be good |
| 05:53.11 | romainguy_ | cworth: adb stands for Android Debug Bridge |
| 05:53.11 | RyeBrye | not that it's that hard |
| 05:53.25 | RyeBrye | will every phone that ships Android meet certain minimum requirements |
| 05:53.27 | romainguy_ | cworth: it's mainly used to hook up debuggers to apps running on the phone |
| 05:54.08 | RyeBrye | like... allowing ADB and such? |
| 05:55.50 | cmonex | RyeBrye: PM |
| 05:55.51 | cmonex | :) |
| 06:00.18 | JairunCaloth | interesting... |
| 06:00.34 | JairunCaloth | I can't get root on the terminal app |
| 06:01.15 | JairunCaloth | ah nevermind, I just had to type in the full path |
| 06:01.55 | cworth | romainguy_: Yeah, I can see wanting a program on the other end for things like that. I guess it's just odd to me that the default shell environment on the device itself is so limited. |
| 06:02.15 | romainguy_ | why? it's just a phone |
| 06:02.25 | romainguy_ | there's no reason to pack more |
| 06:02.53 | RyeBrye | Yeah, I agree that packing more by default is a waste of space for others |
| 06:03.12 | romainguy_ | in more than 18 months of work on Android I've rarely used the shell on the device |
| 06:03.18 | romainguy_ | I just sometimes delete a file from a cache |
| 06:03.23 | romainguy_ | or inspect a sqlite3 database |
| 06:03.27 | romainguy_ | and that's pretty much it |
| 06:04.09 | RyeBrye | but... then again... setting up a 60 meg cache directory that is only used once every couple of months is a bit wacky too |
| 06:04.29 | gdsx | RyeBrye: cache is used for other things |
| 06:04.32 | Cedric2_ | And most of the shell operations are easier to do from a real shell with adb shell |
| 06:04.44 | romainguy_ | the cache is used not just for OTA |
| 06:04.48 | RyeBrye | gdsx - so far all I've seen in it are a couple of jpgs and the OTA updates |
| 06:04.53 | romainguy_ | and OTA are much much more important than saving a few megs :) |
| 06:05.17 | cworth | romainguy: I suppose if I were happy with Eclipse+Android SDK then I wouldn't have much need for the shell. |
| 06:05.19 | RyeBrye | "In order to update, you must insert an SD card into your phone." |
| 06:05.21 | RyeBrye | How hard is that? |
| 06:05.29 | gdsx | RyeBrye: that's not really acceptable |
| 06:05.30 | romainguy_ | cworth: what do you want to do in the shell anyway? |
| 06:05.46 | romainguy_ | RyeBrye: nope :) |
| 06:06.16 | romainguy_ | cworth: when you develop an app I mean |
| 06:06.17 | JairunCaloth | romainguy_: get root :-p |
| 06:06.18 | RyeBrye | <PROTECTED> |
| 06:06.19 | cworth | romainguy_: So far I'm just exploring the device and looking at native development. |
| 06:06.26 | romainguy_ | ah |
| 06:06.32 | romainguy_ | but native development is not supported :) |
| 06:06.43 | cworth | romainguy_: I didn't say I expected support. ;-) |
| 06:06.48 | gdsx | RyeBrye: most folks don't have a spare microSD card handy if they lose it. |
| 06:06.56 | RyeBrye | how would they lose it? |
| 06:06.56 | romainguy_ | really we should buy you guys very small Linux laptops |
| 06:07.03 | gdsx | RyeBrye: take it out and drop it |
| 06:07.04 | romainguy_ | cause apparently all you care about is being root and writing C code :) |
| 06:07.07 | gdsx | RyeBrye: those things are _tiny_ |
| 06:07.12 | cworth | But not supporting that is just as goofy to me too. ;-) |
| 06:07.16 | RyeBrye | yes, and they are impossible to remove unless you are a jedi |
| 06:07.20 | RyeBrye | ) |
| 06:07.28 | cworth | romainguy_: I've got plenty of very small Linux laptops. |
| 06:07.29 | gdsx | RyeBrye: what if you have a curious kid playing with it? |
| 06:07.32 | RyeBrye | and the only reason someone would remove one... is if they have another one :) |
| 06:07.33 | romainguy_ | RyeBrye: and also you could remove the sdcard during the OTA :) and they could fail, or they could be running out of space, etc. |
| 06:07.33 | cworth | But thanks. ;-) |
| 06:07.41 | RyeBrye | Ok, fair enough |
| 06:07.46 | romainguy_ | cworth: native code is nice... but brings a shitload of issue |
| 06:07.59 | romainguy_ | a big one being that the binaries won't run across all sort of CPUs :p |
| 06:08.02 | RyeBrye | "In order to run this update - I must delete 10 of your apps. Pick which ones, or I will start deleting them at random. You have 10 seconds." |
| 06:08.02 | romainguy_ | not cool for the users |
| 06:08.08 | RyeBrye | That's user friendly :) |
| 06:08.11 | cworth | romainguy: Total non-issue for open source. |
| 06:08.14 | JairunCaloth | for me, it's more about haveing power over the device |
| 06:08.27 | JairunCaloth | I hate being locked out of stuff |
| 06:09.16 | romainguy_ | cworth: open source has *nothing* to do with this |
| 06:09.16 | cworth | romainguy: Sure it does. It's the only thing I plan on writing. |
| 06:09.16 | gdsx | cworth: .apk files aren't delivered in source form |
| 06:09.16 | gdsx | cworth: that's the point |
| 06:09.16 | cworth | romainguy: So for my code, the non-CPU-portability is a non-issue. |
| 06:09.16 | gdsx | cworth: what's on the device, as it is today, won't run on multiple devices |
| 06:09.16 | romainguy_ | that doesn't make any sense |
| 06:09.17 | RyeBrye | if the browser starts to use /cache - I'll totally agree that it's fine to have it there |
| 06:09.17 | cworth | gdsx: Sure. I understand that. |
| 06:09.17 | Cedric2_ | JairunCaloth: I suggest you get a phone that's more free than |
| 06:09.17 | Cedric2_ | Android |
| 06:09.20 | romainguy_ | open source has nothing to do with CPU architectures |
| 06:09.40 | *** join/#android dueynz (n=duey@203.96.223.40) |
| 06:09.54 | fadden0 | Apparently it's running on OpenMoko devices. Get one of those and put Android on it. Problem(s) solved. |
| 06:09.59 | cworth | romainguy: With open source programs, "binaries won't run across all sort of CPUs" is not significant. Just recompile. |
| 06:10.13 | romainguy_ | cworth: you totally don't get my point then :) |
| 06:10.18 | spikebike | fadden as long as you don't want 3g, keyboard, or even quad band |
| 06:10.23 | fadden0 | cworth: only if your target market consists entirely of people with cross-compilers. |
| 06:10.24 | cworth | romainguy_: Maybe I don't. |
| 06:10.41 | fadden0 | spikebike: you're guaranteed to have root; why do those other things even matter? |
| 06:11.06 | JairunCaloth | fadden0: we've got root on the G1 :-p |
| 06:11.07 | spikebike | I'm guaranteed to have root on my g1. |
| 06:11.39 | cworth | fadden0: Not really. Package upload could do server-side compilation for many targets. But really that kind of thing isn't at all what I'm interested in. |
| 06:12.24 | cworth | romainguy_: There's plenty of native code running on the device already, and I'm interested in exploring things in that layer. |
| 06:12.56 | JairunCaloth | starts wondering if there is an irssi port |
| 06:12.57 | romainguy_ | cworth: except that native code is part of the platform, it's not part of apps that are distributed to end users through external channels |
| 06:12.59 | fadden0 | The native code on the device is part of the system, not an app. |
| 06:13.15 | fadden0 | loses to romainguy_ |
| 06:13.18 | cworth | romainguy_: Fine. |
| 06:13.32 | cworth | romainguy_: Then I'm interested in hacking on the platform. |
| 06:13.41 | ttuttle | just met another G1 user in the wild! |
| 06:13.45 | ttuttle | =D |
| 06:14.01 | spikebike | jairun I was pondering an irc client (writing one), not sure I'd do an irssi port |
| 06:14.04 | cworth | When did I ever say I wanted to write an app? |
| 06:14.13 | unix_infidel | ttuttle: you mean another geek? |
| 06:14.13 | RyeBrye | romainguy_ - but one thing I have been thinking of where native code would be worthwhile is if I could get one of the OSS OCR platforms to work and then tie it into the platform |
| 06:14.15 | spikebike | but if I have net then I can use ssh + remote screen + remote irssi |
| 06:14.17 | romainguy_ | cworth: well since you cannot flash the device, that's pretty much all you can do |
| 06:14.22 | spikebike | not sure I see a good reason for local irssi |
| 06:14.34 | RyeBrye | since when can we not flash the device? |
| 06:14.42 | ttuttle | unix_infidel: materials science + biomedical engineering. decide for yourself. |
| 06:14.50 | romainguy_ | cworth: anyway, I was just telling you why native code is not (yet) supported |
| 06:14.52 | unix_infidel | ttuttle: my kind of geek ;-) |
| 06:14.53 | cworth | romainguy_: Well, some background on my involvement here: |
| 06:14.53 | JairunCaloth | spikebike: true.. but if you're away from home it might not be the most optimal setup |
| 06:14.53 | ttuttle | spikebike: irssi over ssh is very nice |
| 06:14.54 | swetland | rye: I'm pretty positive the app backup method described in that xda-developers thread will not actually preserve the entire partition (unless I'm totally wrong about the mtd block interface, I don't think you'll get the extra data) |
| 06:15.18 | RyeBrye | Ok, you're probably right |
| 06:15.28 | swetland | also restore is a little more complicated, depending on the if the bad blocks are identical or not |
| 06:15.39 | cworth | I've been waiting for devices to get into hands of people I knew so I could find out if things like native development and redlashing were possible. Without that, I'm not interested in the device at all, (as you've noted). |
| 06:15.40 | JairunCaloth | I don't leave my computer at home running 24/7 |
| 06:15.53 | romainguy_ | RyeBrye: yeah that'd be nice, but we can't start importing tons of random things in the platform either |
| 06:15.54 | ttuttle | swetland: people in real life bought G1s! |
| 06:16.01 | swetland | ttuttle: what? no! |
| 06:16.18 | romainguy_ | cworth: then the G1 is probably not what you want |
| 06:16.29 | cworth | And then, quite independently, my wife happened to buy one, so I got a closer look sooner than expected, and I'm seeing that some of this stuff *is* possible, (even if not well supported). |
| 06:17.01 | cworth | romainguy_: Yeah, probably not. But it's funny that it might let me do everything I want, (if accidentally). |
| 06:17.52 | *** join/#android bao^ (n=girtsf@92.240.68.183) |
| 06:18.18 | xorl | what does it mean on the G1 when the music logo is crossed out? |
| 06:18.53 | JairunCaloth | me is going crazy without tab completion |
| 06:19.08 | JairunCaloth | my memory isn't that good :-p |
| 06:19.22 | RyeBrye | JairunCaloth - install an arm-compiled bash on your /data/local/bin and then use it if you want |
| 06:19.48 | cworth | romainguy_: But one reason I would really like a phone like this is to give my laptop network connectivity from anywhere I've got cell-phone coverage. And that looks like an obvious enough thing to do with native code. |
| 06:20.44 | ttuttle | cworth: you can do that with bluetooth and almost any phone. |
| 06:20.50 | DarkriftX | who all was asking for the wiki? |
| 06:20.53 | cworth | Most everything else I want to do is actually closer to "application" level things, but with a different software stack than what Android uses. |
| 06:21.45 | romainguy_ | cworth: it's already possible |
| 06:21.50 | romainguy_ | cworth: without native code :) |
| 06:21.50 | cworth | ttuttle: Yeah, but I also want something I can put my own Linux software on. |
| 06:22.08 | cworth | romainguy_: Ah, even better. That can save me some work. :-) |
| 06:22.18 | romainguy_ | just adb + a proxy app |
| 06:22.25 | romainguy_ | since adb can forward local port to the device |
| 06:22.34 | romainguy_ | cworth: http://graha.ms/androidproxy/ |
| 06:23.07 | fadden0 | If you really want to go open-source, port glibc and then work up an X11/GTK port. Maybe give it a name like "taxi". Or "limo". |
| 06:23.35 | ttuttle | swetland: people in real life bought G1s!/win 2 |
| 06:23.39 | ttuttle | er |
| 06:23.40 | ttuttle | whoops |
| 06:23.43 | spikebike | looks like ipchains is in the kernel |
| 06:23.55 | spikebike | so with a userspace iptables compiled I suspect it would work |
| 06:24.04 | cworth | I've been playing with various little Linux devices for several years, (since Compaq iPAQ), but have only ever found myself carrying a phone consistently, so I've been waiting for a device to combine phone with tiny Linux device. |
| 06:24.13 | xorl | no driver for 64bit yet for android? |
| 06:24.15 | xorl | forshame. |
| 06:24.19 | xorl | (for windows) |
| 06:24.32 | RyeBrye | windows = shame :P |
| 06:24.40 | xorl | no OS war crap :P |
| 06:24.40 | fadden0 | xorl: have at it |
| 06:24.43 | xorl | bias == shame |
| 06:24.44 | *** join/#android rami (n=rami@77.31.149.147) |
| 06:25.10 | xorl | fadden0: I can't find the sources for the USB driver. |
| 06:25.17 | cworth | (So things like n800 go unused in a drawer here. The neo1973 I was given had a lot of promise, but the "functional phone" part still seems to be lacking.) |
| 06:25.21 | xorl | they have a 32bit build but no sources for said driver |
| 06:25.39 | spikebike | cworth sadly I agree |
| 06:25.55 | spikebike | neo has been a long sad story |
| 06:26.06 | cworth | spikebike: Yeah. |
| 06:26.16 | JairunCaloth | interesting... |
| 06:26.19 | JairunCaloth | any ideas on this? |
| 06:26.19 | JairunCaloth | mv /system/bin/busybox /sdcard/userapps/ |
| 06:26.20 | xorl | i have the Neo as well. |
| 06:26.20 | JairunCaloth | failed on '/system/bin/busybox' - Cross-device link |
| 06:26.23 | xorl | It's still sad. |
| 06:26.29 | fadden0 | xorl: what's in development/host/windows/usb/driver/ ? (I'm not a Windows driver guy) |
| 06:26.35 | spikebike | speaking of which I'm hoping that HTC realizes they could just sell direct |
| 06:26.37 | jimp | cworth, RyeBrye, DarkriftX: I went away to set it up and missed where darkriftx offered to do it... but I set up a wiki at http://android.jim.sh/ |
| 06:26.46 | jimp | if anyone wants to use it, go ahead, or ignore it, whatever :) |
| 06:26.47 | spikebike | especially if they were unlocked/unencrypted |
| 06:26.50 | cworth | So Android people shouldn't be too surprised that there are people like me with a lot of interest in the device, (even if not a lot of interest in the higher-level parts of Android as far as coding). |
| 06:27.16 | fadden0 | JairunCaloth: "mv" can only rename files |
| 06:27.22 | DarkriftX | i put one up on android-dls.com/wiki and RyeBrye is registering for it |
| 06:27.24 | jimp | JairunCaloth: It probably makes a hard link then deletes the original. Just copy instead (cat old > new; rm old) |
| 06:27.24 | swetland | cworth: not at all surprising |
| 06:27.31 | DarkriftX | but im not worried about who uses what |
| 06:27.32 | fadden0 | The fancy version of "mv" renames or copies as needed. |
| 06:27.34 | JairunCaloth | ah gotcha |
| 06:27.37 | DarkriftX | just care about what gets put on it :) |
| 06:27.42 | jimp | DarkriftX: agreed :) |
| 06:27.57 | jimp | but, I did put a cool logo up :) |
| 06:28.00 | DarkriftX | lol |
| 06:28.24 | DarkriftX | im lazy, i put up my avatar as the logo lol |
| 06:28.34 | DarkriftX | someone made me avatar, logos and more on a forum |
| 06:28.36 | DarkriftX | so i just used those lol |
| 06:28.46 | DarkriftX | sucks with graphics, so i outsource that stuff |
| 06:29.16 | romainguy_ | cworth: we're not surprised :) |
| 06:29.32 | swetland | http://android.git.kernel.org/?p=platform/development.git;a=tree;f=host/windows/usb;h=e77e55d7f226120b9cd33b35e2ed796bf57c12b8;hb=master |
| 06:29.37 | cworth | jimp: I'll throw some text in. |
| 06:29.39 | swetland | win32 driver source for adb |
| 06:29.40 | swetland | enjoy |
| 06:30.00 | cworth | DarkriftX: Feel free to copy liberally of course. Obviously getting the content is more important than where it lives. |
| 06:30.01 | RyeBrye | speaking of surprised... I was surprised when I went to launch an app in the emulator the other day and nothing happened... but a few minutes later my phone was saying "Hello Android! You are my bitch!" |
| 06:30.19 | RyeBrye | had it install his modified hello-world to the phone - which was cool... but totally surprised him :) |
| 06:30.22 | romainguy_ | RyeBrye: well now that you raped your phone with a root shell, who knows? :)) |
| 06:30.27 | RyeBrye | LOL |
| 06:30.34 | RyeBrye | I didn't rape it - she was begging for it |
| 06:30.40 | swetland | honestly the thing that surprises me the most |
| 06:30.55 | swetland | is people valiantly reverse-engineering everything when source code to the whole platform is available |
| 06:31.09 | RyeBrye | Just making sure it's the same stuff :) |
| 06:31.19 | spikebike | swet like? |
| 06:31.30 | fadden0 | There are no "head fakes" in the device binaries. :-) |
| 06:31.45 | RyeBrye | I'LL BE THE JUDGE OF THAT ;) |
| 06:31.54 | fadden0 | By all means. :-) |
| 06:31.59 | romainguy_ | RyeBrye: you guys should learn to stop distrusting someday :)) |
| 06:32.13 | RyeBrye | I'm just kidding |
| 06:32.18 | romainguy_ | #paranoid-control-freaks :))) |
| 06:32.27 | RyeBrye | I was there, but the channel was monitored |
| 06:32.27 | RyeBrye | I think |
| 06:32.46 | DarkriftX | ok RyeBrye symlinking apk files i /data/app does NOT work |
| 06:32.54 | romainguy_ | RyeBrye: I'm surprised you accept to be on an IRC channel without being op ^^ |
| 06:32.55 | DarkriftX | they dissapear from androids list |
| 06:32.56 | JairunCaloth | hrm... the sdcard is mounted by default as noexec |
| 06:32.58 | romainguy_ | you're locked down! |
| 06:33.00 | DarkriftX | but when you put it back, it re-appears |
| 06:33.08 | romainguy_ | ok, I'll stop being annoying :) |
| 06:33.11 | RyeBrye | romainguy - I can accept it on freenode since I trust teh powers that be :) |
| 06:33.25 | RyeBrye | romainguy - but on EFnet I have to roll about 10 deep with bots :P |
| 06:33.39 | JairunCaloth | DarkriftX: did you remount the SD card without noexec? |
| 06:33.46 | DarkriftX | ooooh |
| 06:33.48 | DarkriftX | no |
| 06:34.02 | *** join/#android muthu (n=mobeegal@218.248.24.81) |
| 06:34.07 | JairunCaloth | yeah I was just trying to figure out how come I couldn't run busybox from the sdcard |
| 06:34.13 | *** join/#android tweakt (n=mark@xpc.tweakt.net) |
| 06:34.20 | DarkriftX | whats the command for that? |
| 06:34.21 | JairunCaloth | I'm like... I'm root bioch, don't tell me permission denied |
| 06:34.25 | DarkriftX | LOL |
| 06:34.38 | DarkriftX | "I'm root bioch" |
| 06:34.38 | JairunCaloth | did a mount and noticed the sd card had noexec |
| 06:34.40 | DarkriftX | thats great |
| 06:35.13 | DarkriftX | RyeBrye, you know mediawiki enough to know how to give users admin? |
| 06:35.17 | RyeBrye | yeah |
| 06:35.41 | JairunCaloth | so you'll need something along the lines of mount -o remount,blahblah |
| 06:36.15 | cworth | romainguy_: Funny, I see paranoia on the other side with all the signatures and lockdown. ;-) ;-) |
| 06:36.25 | romainguy_ | cworth: except you guys proved us right so far :)) |
| 06:36.34 | cworth | romainguy_: What?! |
| 06:36.51 | RyeBrye | I don't see anyone passing malware around |
| 06:36.54 | cworth | romainguy_: I just want to run my own code for my own entertainment. |
| 06:37.00 | fadden0 | RyeBrye: and we hope to keep it that way |
| 06:37.05 | RyeBrye | I do too |
| 06:37.19 | fadden0 | Not too many viruses on Linux. |
| 06:37.39 | RyeBrye | It's in the best interest of anyone who plans to code for this device that it has a reputation of being secure and kickass |
| 06:37.50 | cworth | And if the paranoia is about carriers' control of their network, then what about my control of my home network where my wife is bringing this device? |
| 06:38.18 | JairunCaloth | RyeBrye: the PSP has been hacked here and back again and you don't see people panicking in the streets about zomb psp viruses. |
| 06:38.43 | RyeBrye | JairunCaloth - I'm not saying there will be android viruses |
| 06:38.45 | *** join/#android KenSentMe (n=jeroen@213-132-206-101.adsl.nlhosting.nl) |
| 06:38.52 | romainguy_ | JairunCaloth: except the PSP is not used as a cell phone :)) |
| 06:39.01 | RyeBrye | Well... if you hack it... oh... wait |
| 06:39.03 | jimp | Latest PSP hardware finally fixes the biggest holes.. but one big thing about the PSP is that it's rarely online. |
| 06:39.04 | JairunCaloth | it's still got wifi |
| 06:39.19 | JairunCaloth | mine was online all the time till I got my G1 |
| 06:39.20 | swetland | I am totally behind the times on psp fun |
| 06:39.21 | romainguy_ | JairunCaloth: last time I checked I never called 911 with my PSP :p |
| 06:39.27 | swetland | fun device to code for |
| 06:39.27 | romainguy_ | yeah me too |
| 06:39.36 | romainguy_ | it got too annoying to keep up with the exploits |
| 06:39.43 | romainguy_ | last time I checked you needed to hack the battery |
| 06:39.43 | swetland | but I haven't followed the whole pspdev thing for a year or two now |
| 06:39.52 | romainguy_ | stupid PSP slim |
| 06:40.00 | KenSentMe | Im running Android on the Openmoko Neo Freerunner using Sean McNeils images. Installing and running works, but the phone doesnt accept my PIN code for my sim card. Is that a know problem? |
| 06:40.00 | swetland | romain: I have a handful of older PSPs |
| 06:40.14 | swetland | romain: from the days of the old tiff exploit |
| 06:40.24 | cworth | has a linux server in his closet with a phone-line connection---no mysterious 911 calls from that one either |
| 06:40.28 | romainguy_ | swetland: I had a phat but I sold it :( |
| 06:40.58 | jimp | The battery hack is great. |
| 06:41.01 | swetland | ken: you'll have to ask the openmoko folks, I think. I don't think anyone here knows anything about their radio or how they've integrated it with android |
| 06:41.04 | romainguy_ | cworth: so obviously you can generalize this experience to an entire nationwide cellular network :) |
| 06:41.06 | languish | My wife uses her psp to skype japan almost every night :| |
| 06:41.18 | languish | it's cheaper than tmo's LD rates |
| 06:41.25 | KenSentMe | swetland, doing that too, but it was worth a shot trying over here :) |
| 06:41.48 | romainguy_ | swetland: well they removed some code in their patches, so they might have removed something that causes trouble with PIN codes |
| 06:42.01 | romainguy_ | I'm most notably worried about the auto-provisioning |
| 06:42.03 | *** join/#android rami_ (n=rami@77.31.180.160) |
| 06:42.13 | RyeBrye | I think it should go without saying that most of the people in this room who are busy hacking away probably hold a large circle of influence over what their less technically savy friends do |
| 06:42.16 | languish | I'd like to see skype on the G1, not blocked by tmo, and not using minutes |
| 06:42.29 | JairunCaloth | anywho... my point is, you release a device and people are going to try to make it do things it was never intended to do. Somtimes with great results. |
| 06:42.46 | romainguy_ | RyeBrye: I would more describe people in this room as the annoying guys who always try to push their own choice of tech to their friends :) |
| 06:43.01 | RyeBrye | Nah, my friends always ask me :) - but yes, that category also works |
| 06:43.23 | languish | doesn't like making technology recommendations to friends |
| 06:43.37 | RyeBrye | I don't usually - but I'm sure I've gotten 5 people to buy a G1 now |
| 06:43.48 | languish | poor them |
| 06:43.48 | romainguy_ | JairunCaloth: sure, but you have to admit that out of the box the G1 lets you do a lot; so sure probably not enough for some of you, but still a lot |
| 06:44.17 | JairunCaloth | romainguy_: Absolutely, I wouldn't have bought one if it didn't. |
| 06:44.19 | RyeBrye | Hell - ADB? The Eclipse plugin? That crap would cost some serious $$$ if you wanted to develop on Symbian |
| 06:44.43 | romainguy_ | surprisingly, J2ME phones have very decent dev environments |
| 06:44.52 | jimp | Hackers can really influence things though. The majority of PSP features were introduced by hackers first and Sony later. |
| 06:44.56 | romainguy_ | my last Sony Ericsson phone coupled with the Sony SDK and NetBeans was pretyt awesome to play with |
| 06:45.03 | RyeBrye | Really? that's cool |
| 06:45.15 | RyeBrye | The C++ side of the Symbian OS was a bear |
| 06:45.19 | swetland | jimp: pretty sure sony still doesn't let approved devs do a lot of stuff the psp homebrew tools do |
| 06:45.26 | romainguy_ | NetBeans J2ME module is really really good |
| 06:45.29 | jimp | swetland: definitely, they don't get kernel mode :) |
| 06:45.33 | romainguy_ | and the Sony emulators were not too shabby :) |
| 06:45.36 | swetland | jimp: of course sony is trying to ensure compatibility across future hardware revs, etc |
| 06:45.47 | romainguy_ | (and they supported debugging over USB, with the USB cable in the box) |
| 06:45.54 | swetland | jimp: or direct access to the second cpu, which is presented as a blackbox media accel unit |
| 06:46.15 | jimp | swetland: true, the ME is still off limits, although they do provide libs for just about everything you'd reasonably want to use it for |
| 06:46.18 | *** join/#android duey (n=duey@203.96.223.40) |
| 06:46.19 | romainguy_ | swetland: the only thing I want from Sony is a reliable Remote Play from the PSP to the PS3 :) |
| 06:46.40 | swetland | I'm happy with just using the ps3 with the ps3 controllers myself |
| 06:47.03 | jimp | I hear Resistance 2 will have (or has) a mode where you can do that, use the PS3 controller to play on the PSP. |
| 06:47.13 | romainguy_ | swetland: I once managed to watch an episode of a TV Show streamed from my mac to my ps3 then to my ps3 to my psp... in the google shuttle :) |
| 06:48.36 | languish | and now you'll be able to do it from your mac to your G1 without the ps3 |
| 06:48.45 | languish | :| |
| 06:48.55 | romainguy_ | yeah but that's not as fun :) |
| 06:49.30 | RyeBrye | Wait, G1 has a streaming solutoin? |
| 06:49.46 | languish | yeah, but it'd more convenient than carrying multiple devices |
| 06:49.53 | languish | *it's |
| 06:52.52 | Cedric2_ | romainguy: I disagree, the J2ME environment developments are still pretty lame |
| 06:53.08 | Cedric2_ | emulators are still blackboxes, can barely inspect stuff in the middle of midlets running |
| 06:53.26 | Cedric2_ | Sun finally calling quits on WTK (5 years overdue) |
| 06:53.33 | romainguy_ | WTK :) |
| 06:53.34 | xorl | damnit so close, the G1 is seen as a drive by Vista 64 but just doesn't let me access it at all |
| 06:54.02 | ttuttle | xorl: Have you opened the "USB connected" dialog on the phone and clicked "Mount"? |
| 06:54.41 | offby1 | xorl: I couldn't get that working on Vista 32 either |
| 06:54.52 | offby1 | worked fine on Linux |
| 06:54.53 | ttuttle | It's just a @#$% USB mass storage device. How can Vista screw that up? |
| 06:55.21 | xorl | hah |
| 06:55.26 | offby1 | "security" |
| 06:55.36 | trissmo | What turtle said about the dialog box. |
| 06:55.46 | offby1 | Vista has disabled this device, which is suspected of harboring ``Open Source'', for your protection |
| 06:57.21 | spikebike | rc29 broke mountain for me with ubuntu |
| 06:57.22 | JairunCaloth | when specifying uid and guid in mount, does that override the uid and gid set on a file? |
| 06:57.25 | spikebike | er mounting |
| 06:57.27 | cworth | jimp: OK. I added some notes on cross-compiling with the android prebuilt toolchain, (and andyross's agcc script). |
| 06:57.38 | spikebike | and yes I click on mount from the dialog |
| 06:57.44 | spikebike | I have to manually mount |
| 06:58.59 | romainguy_ | http://www.news.com.au/technology/story/0,25642,24611100-5014239,00.html |
| 06:59.01 | romainguy_ | awesome |
| 07:01.00 | swetland | ballmer is always a riot |
| 07:01.14 | romainguy_ | I like this argument "I don't get it, therefore it's dumb" |
| 07:01.20 | ttuttle | romainguy_: That's a great argument. |
| 07:01.26 | ttuttle | romainguy_: See: most reviews in Market. |
| 07:01.36 | romainguy_ | oh yeah |
| 07:01.42 | romainguy_ | you should see the emails I get for Shutter Speed :) |
| 07:01.53 | ttuttle | romainguy_: noobs |
| 07:02.00 | romainguy_ | eh |
| 07:02.09 | romainguy_ | bah :) |
| 07:02.38 | RyeBrye | ... how soon until quake is in the git repo? :) |
| 07:03.52 | RyeBrye | Hmm... would ZeroConf have any place in the android platform? I.e. you log onto wifi and you are able to discover other stuff on there? If it was in the OS level and APIs were exposed, it would be easy to make something that would connect to a DAAP server I would imagine |
| 07:03.58 | ttuttle | jasta: you around? |
| 07:04.16 | romainguy_ | RyeBrye: you can just include the lib in your app |
| 07:04.21 | romainguy_ | that's what umdk1d3 did for Tunes Remotes |
| 07:04.22 | romainguy_ | -s |
| 07:04.37 | *** join/#android tweakt (n=mark@xpc.tweakt.net) |
| 07:04.57 | RyeBrye | Well hell... You guys are so smart - you even think like me! |
| 07:05.05 | RyeBrye | jokes |
| 07:05.38 | RyeBrye | I'm wanting a Growl -> Android notification bridge... just because it would be cool to get Growl notifications when I'm walking around the house |
| 07:05.42 | ttuttle | romainguy_: Heh. |
| 07:05.44 | ttuttle | romainguy_: er |
| 07:05.46 | ttuttle | RyeBrye: Heh. |
| 07:07.34 | *** join/#android trigatch4 (n=robjacks@c-68-48-9-210.hsd1.md.comcast.net) |
| 07:09.19 | *** join/#android PhasesEvilTwin (n=robjacks@c-68-48-9-210.hsd1.md.comcast.net) |
| 07:14.48 | tmzt | RyeBrye: what do you mean by OS level? |
| 07:15.50 | RyeBrye | tmzt - just saying if it was implemented at a low level with high-level APIs... |
| 07:16.06 | tmzt | oh, yeah I figured it out, you meant in the platform |
| 07:16.55 | muthu | romainguy_: back after a power shutdown.. |
| 07:17.09 | tmzt | I can't see why you can't bring up a virtual interface :1 and use avahi though? |
| 07:17.11 | muthu | did you say something about sdk generated in out? |
| 07:17.48 | muthu | afaik, it generates only docs under out |
| 07:18.32 | ttuttle | jasta: ping |
| 07:18.37 | ttuttle | trissmo: Did you call me "turtle"? |
| 07:18.44 | *** join/#android macboz (n=kozen@n058152114174.netvigator.com) |
| 07:19.08 | muthu | partner_setup function sets up a 'generic' product which results in host/linux-x86 |
| 07:19.22 | muthu | should this be changed, to get the sdk generated? |
| 07:19.44 | muthu | ttuttle: lol, yeah i guess he mispronounced ;) |
| 07:19.50 | ttuttle | muthu: heh |
| 07:19.53 | muthu | or misspelled, rather |
| 07:20.03 | DarkriftX | RyeBrye, any ideas on what to replace the wiki background image with that isnt too tacky? http://android-dls.com/wiki/skins/monobook/headbg.jpg |
| 07:20.18 | DarkriftX | that image is kinda ugly |
| 07:20.44 | RyeBrye | yeah, it's ugly |
| 07:21.46 | trissmo | ttuttle: haha sorry im not with it today. |
| 07:21.52 | ttuttle | trissmo: oh it's okay |
| 07:22.36 | muthu | ttuttle: any idea, on how to generate the sdk from source? |
| 07:22.43 | ttuttle | muthu: no clue |
| 07:22.56 | muthu | romainguy_: claims, he can |
| 07:24.44 | *** join/#android Hai-Fai (n=jarmo@hoasnet-fe35dd00-42.dhcp.inet.fi) |
| 07:26.29 | DarkriftX | there RyeBrye, replaced it with the striped background from my main sites header for now |
| 07:27.03 | RyeBrye | cool |
| 07:27.20 | *** join/#android holymoo (n=biteme@S01060016b6b53675.vf.shawcable.net) |
| 07:27.50 | cworth | romainguy_: So the AndroidProxy thing there is really short of what I want. I definitely want something more along the lines of this on the phone: |
| 07:27.51 | cworth | iptables -t nat -A POSTROUTING -j MASQUERADE |
| 07:28.26 | cworth | And then just a standard network connection between laptop and phone, (over bluetooth or USB). |
| 07:28.30 | gdsx | cworth: that command just burned my retinas |
| 07:28.37 | gdsx | cworth: (I hate NAT) |
| 07:28.48 | cworth | Really basic stuff given two linux boxes. |
| 07:29.15 | gdsx | cworth: you should go ahead and ignore me, though, because I'm not saying anything useful right now :o) |
| 07:29.42 | cworth | gdsx: Well, me neither to tell the truth. :-) Time to sleep now. |
| 07:30.04 | gdsx | g'night |
| 07:30.28 | tmzt | ok, I read the technical explaination earlier, but I don't get how it's hiding the -s- status? |
| 07:32.14 | *** join/#android tweakt_ (n=mark@xpc.tweakt.net) |
| 07:32.14 | JairunCaloth | you know... something I thought about earlier. It bothers me that the root password is apparently blank |
| 07:32.44 | languish | so change it to something, you can now |
| 07:33.28 | JairunCaloth | I wonder if it will break things though |
| 07:34.02 | languish | yeah, i haven't messed with it yet so not sure |
| 07:35.02 | jimp | tmzt: which explanation are you talking about? It's also very suspicious to me, seems almost like an intentional backdoor ! |
| 07:35.31 | swetland | I can confirm that it most definitely is not intentional |
| 07:35.37 | jimp | (ok, conspiracy theories aside, it's definitely strange) |
| 07:35.59 | jimp | I have no clue how uid=euid=suid=10040 can turn into euid=0. |
| 07:36.21 | languish | jimp, easy.. "oshi..oops!" |
| 07:36.35 | ttuttle | installs Five, to see what all the fuss is about. |
| 07:36.36 | languish | Google.. "We shipped what?" |
| 07:36.43 | tmzt | I had only looked in the kernel source at the release and saw all the strange dependencies on uid, I even asked swetland what was going on, so I'm guessing this was in the userspace only??? but telnetd has to launch something, and it has to get port 23 from somewhere?? is "shell" special |
| 07:36.56 | languish | just be glad it came that way |
| 07:37.10 | tmzt | sorry, telnetd has to launch something, if not /bin/login something else |
| 07:37.24 | DarkriftX | cworth, i copied your cross compiling page since you said you didnt mind |
| 07:37.59 | cworth | DarkriftX: Sure. No problem. |
| 07:38.09 | jimp | You copied my part too, what's the license on your wiki? >:) |
| 07:38.11 | tmzt | oh well, change root debian while you still can :) |
| 07:38.15 | tmzt | chroot |
| 07:39.11 | DarkriftX | free for all license |
| 07:39.13 | DarkriftX | lol |
| 07:39.21 | tmzt | jimp: have you looked at the kernel source, search for rlove |
| 07:39.27 | cworth | jimp: Interested in CC-BY-SA instead of GFDL? ;-) |
| 07:39.49 | jimp | It was contributed past nov 1, you can't do that :) |
| 07:40.32 | cworth | jimp: You've got a new wiki with no content here. You can do any license rule you want. |
| 07:40.42 | tmzt | motorola went with NSA tecnology for a reason, but I guess they messed it up to |
| 07:40.55 | jimp | cworth: I thought you were trying to relicense my GFDL content as CC-BY-SA by that strange new clause in GFDL 1.3. |
| 07:41.00 | cworth | (Though yes, I'd need to grant you permission for my piece, which I do gladly do.) |
| 07:41.20 | DarkriftX | which piece is whose |
| 07:41.22 | JairunCaloth | brb, I need to reboot into linux and grab a cig |
| 07:41.41 | cworth | jimp: Hehe. No. But I was referring to the strange new clause, (and that it perhaps points out some infelicities in GFDL usage). |
| 07:41.58 | jimp | http://lwn.net/SubscriberLink/305892/cf24bd015c0a89ac/ |
| 07:42.39 | cworth | <PROTECTED> |
| 07:42.46 | cworth | :-) |
| 07:42.54 | jimp | cworth: Well, it's more the problem with "or any later version" than with any particular license |
| 07:43.05 | jimp | cworth: :) |
| 07:43.17 | cworth | jimp: Oh, I don't see that as a problem though. |
| 07:43.34 | cworth | I just mean the general problems of the GFDL, (possibilities of invariant sections, etc.). |
| 07:44.05 | jimp | Aah true. The "any later version" sure puts a lot of trust in the future-FSF though. |
| 07:44.06 | cworth | Though I really don't think the license for an Android Hackers wiki will ever be a significant issue. |
| 07:44.13 | *** join/#android Tauno__ (n=tauntz@118.192.50.195.sta.estpak.ee) |
| 07:44.20 | jimp | of course |
| 07:44.39 | jimp | tmzt: I searched for rlove, didn't find much.. are you referring to something in particular? |
| 07:47.00 | *** join/#android tweakt_ (n=mark@xpc.tweakt.net) |
| 07:48.36 | tmzt | http://android.git.kernel.org/?p=kernel/msm.git;a=commit;h=25b172dbdb0075a24647 |
| 07:48.54 | jimp | yeah, I see that, that looks fine to me. |
| 07:48.58 | *** join/#android JairunCaloth (n=dbrowne@c-76-20-219-18.hsd1.ga.comcast.net) |
| 07:49.17 | languish | so what's the timeline on my android enabled fridge noticing I'm low on vodka, checking local stores along my most traveled paths for the best price on my favorite brand, deciding on a few best cost suggestions, and notifying my android handset? |
| 07:49.47 | languish | then dumping the whole shebang on a google map with all the info |
| 07:49.55 | JairunCaloth | 2 weeks :-p |
| 07:50.02 | languish | AWESOME DUDE |
| 07:50.08 | jimp | tmzt: Unless they had a truly monumentally fatheaded bug like using "current->euid = 0" instead of "current->euid == 0" in one of their builds. |
| 07:50.12 | tmzt | well, that's why I'm asking? it can't be suid it has to be something else |
| 07:50.14 | languish | holy cow |
| 07:50.20 | ttuttle | jimp: But that would be false. |
| 07:50.21 | languish | I just thought of the BEST APP EVER |
| 07:50.27 | languish | ttuttle get this |
| 07:50.35 | ttuttle | gets ready to get. |
| 07:50.37 | languish | a period tracker |
| 07:50.44 | ttuttle | languish: I'm sure it's been done. |
| 07:50.45 | JairunCaloth | 0.o |
| 07:50.46 | jimp | ttuttle: Sure, but: (current->euid = 0 || current->egid == AF_INET) |
| 07:50.47 | jimp | etc |
| 07:50.49 | holymoo | lol |
| 07:50.49 | languish | yes, that kinda period |
| 07:50.59 | languish | so you know when to get frisky, and when to aboid |
| 07:51.01 | languish | *avoid |
| 07:51.06 | languish | it also can work as a business app |
| 07:51.10 | jimp | I mean, that's what it is now: |
| 07:51.10 | ttuttle | considers condoms a better idea. |
| 07:51.10 | jimp | return (!current->euid || current->egid == AID_INET || |
| 07:51.11 | holymoo | i can just imagine the sound effects on this one |
| 07:51.18 | languish | knowing when not to put too much on your secretary/receptionist |
| 07:51.52 | languish | they randomly mention it, so when they do, just note it in the app |
| 07:52.00 | languish | after awhile it can generate a profile of her cycle |
| 07:52.16 | languish | then update your personal google calendar with warning..err alerts |
| 07:52.27 | languish | :D |
| 07:52.57 | languish | the app should allow for tracking of multiple women |
| 07:53.05 | languish | not just the ones you bed |
| 07:53.21 | languish | that way we know when to be most considerate :D |
| 07:53.39 | languish | or when to notice she's low on tampons/pads |
| 07:53.49 | languish | and not be around to get sent to the store for more |
| 07:53.52 | languish | :| |
| 07:53.59 | jimp | Where's the kernel source that matches the binary I was given on my G1? Anyone know? |
| 07:54.11 | languish | (btw, I'm adding humor, but yeah.. it might make for a decent app anyway) |
| 07:54.43 | ttuttle | jasta: ping |
| 07:54.46 | swetland | jimp: http://android.git.kernel.org/?p=kernel/msm.git;a=commit;h=c092738e01ab845dc7406dc1b53589b1f9edebbc |
| 07:55.27 | cworth | I see 18ac882 in "uname -a" on mine. |
| 07:55.52 | tmzt | let's see, you have an /init process that has root, it could fork and give caps to certain processes, but it doesn't so that apparently didn't work. |
| 07:55.53 | jimp | cworth: Yeah, and "git show 18ac882" shows me nothing |
| 07:55.57 | cworth | But no such object in kernel/.git |
| 07:56.05 | cworth | jimp: Right. |
| 07:56.08 | jimp | swetland: That's just making the configs match.. |
| 07:56.36 | swetland | we did not publish the internal git tree -- patches were collapsed / combined / etc |
| 07:56.49 | cworth | chalks up another point for wanting to build and install his own kernel |
| 07:56.50 | swetland | source lines up but the commit is, for obvious reasons, not the same hash |
| 07:56.55 | ttuttle | is going to bed. |
| 07:57.41 | swetland | the external tree matches up, but the internal tree had some chunks of history which could not be published |
| 07:57.52 | jimp | OK, as long as it lines up I'm happy |
| 07:58.13 | RyeBrye | as long as jimp is happy, I'm happy |
| 07:58.18 | jimp | I'm happy |
| 07:58.18 | cworth | doesn't seem to have c092738e01ab8 either |
| 07:58.24 | swetland | if you build from that commit, you should have a kernel that is identical to what shipped on g1 |
| 07:58.49 | swetland | in particular, make distclean && make msm_defconfig && make |
| 07:59.01 | jimp | swetland: thanks |
| 08:00.12 | JairunCaloth | bah... adb isn't seeing my phone in linux |
| 08:00.34 | jimp | check permissions? |
| 08:02.13 | *** join/#android netcoffee (n=netcoffe@61.141.156.172) |
| 08:02.26 | RyeBrye | jimp - you had a toolchain working, right? |
| 08:02.57 | jimp | yeah, I don't have a phone handy at the moment |
| 08:03.08 | jimp | (to respond to your privmsg) -- can't you just dd /dev/mem? |
| 08:03.50 | RyeBrye | Oh, ok |
| 08:04.24 | *** join/#android rami__ (n=rami@77.31.153.95) |
| 08:04.38 | RyeBrye | ls /dev | grep mem only shows pmem_camera pmem_gpu1 pmem_gpu0 pmem_adsp pmem ashmem |
| 08:04.53 | RyeBrye | and if I dd any of them, I get nothing it seems |
| 08:05.30 | DarkriftX | jimp, was there something you wanted removed? |
| 08:05.42 | jimp | maybe: mknod /dev/mem c 1 1 |
| 08:05.48 | jimp | DarkriftX: nah, I was just being a pain :) |
| 08:05.52 | DarkriftX | oh lol |
| 08:06.09 | DarkriftX | i got lost in your guys license convo and gave up trying to figure it out |
| 08:06.14 | jimp | heh |
| 08:09.52 | holymoo | is the email client imap capable? |
| 08:10.10 | *** join/#android Dialekt (n=Carter@cpe-98-148-99-126.socal.res.rr.com) |
| 08:10.19 | cworth | DarkriftX: Oh, you were taking jimp too seriously. |
| 08:10.34 | *** join/#android rami_ (n=rami@77.31.163.229) |
| 08:10.34 | cworth | DarkriftX: I guessed that was the case, but couldn't speak for jimp. ;-) |
| 08:10.49 | DarkriftX | im always careful abotu copying other ppls stuff |
| 08:10.59 | cworth | holymoo: Yes. It seems to work. |
| 08:11.07 | holymoo | wow |
| 08:11.09 | DarkriftX | i always hated my stuff getting copied so thats one of my pet peevs |
| 08:11.14 | holymoo | that alone kills blackberries for us |
| 08:11.16 | holymoo | sweet |
| 08:11.53 | cworth | (Though "ssl only" was failing for my self-signed certificate while "TLS if available" works---with my server talking only SSL as far as I know.) |
| 08:12.23 | holymoo | so some debugging required, not bad |
| 08:12.54 | holymoo | another question ... does the applicatio nframework have any sort of security/lockdown mechanism in place for applying security via policies? |
| 08:13.23 | cworth | really does sleep this time |
| 08:13.39 | holymoo | k. thx for your answer btw :) |
| 08:17.49 | DarkriftX | its funny how many mac and apple related sites are covering the g1 root story |
| 08:18.13 | DarkriftX | i have 28 mac blogs linking to my forum since yesterday |
| 08:19.12 | holymoo | mac community technical ignorance isn't exactly a surprise |
| 08:20.38 | RyeBrye | ? |
| 08:20.58 | RyeBrye | Developers often love macs |
| 08:21.35 | spikebike | ya |
| 08:21.45 | spikebike | even linux hackers often have a mac laptop |
| 08:22.13 | JairunCaloth | is dual booting linux/osx |
| 08:22.13 | summatusmentis | I <3 my mac |
| 08:22.27 | JairunCaloth | I wouldn't call myself a linux hacker though |
| 08:22.37 | JairunCaloth | or a developer for that matter |
| 08:23.49 | spikebike | after the 2nd or 3rd time it gets old trying to get linux laptop to do everything right |
| 08:23.55 | RyeBrye | yeah |
| 08:24.02 | spikebike | flash, movies, dvds, sleep, wifi, etc. |
| 08:24.28 | RyeBrye | speeking of sleep.... :) |
| 08:24.39 | JairunCaloth | yeah... I've been fighting it |
| 08:24.42 | RyeBrye | goes to sleep... possibly hibernate |
| 08:25.03 | JairunCaloth | gotta work tomorrow and stuff too |
| 08:25.40 | DarkriftX | my linux laptop does everything :( |
| 08:25.53 | DarkriftX | flash, movies, games, dvds, sleep, wifi, etc |
| 08:25.55 | spikebike | all the keys work? |
| 08:25.59 | DarkriftX | yeah |
| 08:26.03 | JairunCaloth | runs pretty damn well on macbook pro |
| 08:26.08 | spikebike | you can just shut the lid? |
| 08:26.16 | DarkriftX | my wifi takes a long ass time to get working, but thats because im a n00b |
| 08:26.18 | DarkriftX | yes |
| 08:26.24 | spikebike | wifi works after opening th e lid? |
| 08:26.32 | DarkriftX | yes |
| 08:26.33 | spikebike | ah so there are a few warts ;-) |
| 08:26.52 | DarkriftX | the default drivers work, but dont give any options |
| 08:27.07 | DarkriftX | i like to change settings and so i use different drivers |
| 08:27.07 | spikebike | alas sometimes everything works |
| 08:27.12 | spikebike | but it's hard to be sure ahead of time |
| 08:27.17 | DarkriftX | yeah |
| 08:27.19 | spikebike | especially with all the options |
| 08:27.42 | spikebike | I was looking at a thinkpad x200 there's one "ibm" option for wifi |
| 08:27.44 | spikebike | and 2-3 intel |
| 08:27.50 | *** part/#android CVirus (n=Satan@41.196.214.175) |
| 08:28.18 | spikebike | it was rather hard to find any comments on which to get and what if any would work well, had good/stable drivers, would wake up after sleep, etc. |
| 08:28.44 | spikebike | and that's of course with a thinkpad which I believe is the number 1 laptop for linux users |
| 08:29.00 | spikebike | god forbid you get some random toshiba, asus, dell, hp, whatever |
| 08:29.10 | swetland | [ 17.373089] ath_pci: wifi0: Atheros 5424/2424: mem=0xf2500000, irq=21 |
| 08:29.13 | swetland | is what's on my x200 |
| 08:29.27 | swetland | it's a little cranky. I should move to the latest driver and see if it's happier |
| 08:29.34 | JairunCaloth | atheros roxxors |
| 08:29.37 | swetland | suspend/resume isn't perfect either |
| 08:29.38 | spikebike | how do you like the x200? |
| 08:29.44 | spikebike | heh |
| 08:29.56 | swetland | love the machine. it's the perfect successor to x40/x60 |
| 08:29.59 | spikebike | I'm very close to getting one... of course the x200s is tempting as well |
| 08:30.13 | JairunCaloth | I've got that same chip on my old laptop. it makes a great wireless router now >.> |
| 08:30.24 | swetland | just a little bit wider, so keyboard is slightly larger, larger display, but still pretty damn small and light |
| 08:30.52 | RyeBrye | wants Apple to announce 17" MBP's with a mobile quad core |
| 08:30.54 | swetland | I'm running ubuntu 8.04.1 |
| 08:31.08 | swetland | had to download the wifi driver and build it myself to get it to work |
| 08:31.08 | spikebike | that's what I'd run |
| 08:31.35 | swetland | and sometimes it gets cranky and X won't restart coming out of suspend |
| 08:31.44 | JairunCaloth | yeah, you do have to build the 3rd party atheros drivers if you want to use them. but it's not bad |
| 08:31.50 | spikebike | kinda burns me that it doesn't have digital video out (display port or dvi) |
| 08:31.53 | swetland | but generally works well |
| 08:31.57 | spikebike | especially in this day and age |
| 08:31.59 | swetland | spike: yeah that's my main gripe really |
| 08:32.04 | JairunCaloth | and in the newer ubuntu |
| 08:32.08 | swetland | I almost never use an external monitor with a laptop |
| 08:32.12 | swetland | so it wasn't a dealkiller |
| 08:32.12 | JairunCaloth | you can just install linux-restricted-modules |
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| 08:32.22 | swetland | but dvi/hdmo would have been nicer than vga |
| 08:32.24 | swetland | er hdmi |
| 08:32.31 | JairunCaloth | anywho....... |
| 08:32.32 | spikebike | not sure how I"d use it, but I am planning a nice new LCD soonish |
| 08:32.34 | JairunCaloth | I'm going to bed |
| 08:33.29 | umdk1d3 | oh interesting people were talking about thinkpads |
| 08:33.42 | umdk1d3 | im having issues with mine :/ |
| 08:34.00 | Death_Syn | i miss my thinkpad |
| 08:34.06 | Death_Syn | thankfully, next job is going to give me a new one |
| 08:34.07 | Death_Syn | :D |
| 08:34.19 | umdk1d3 | i can kill it hard with glxgears in under a minute |
| 08:34.31 | *** join/#android lethalcode (n=walker@pennmush.org) |
| 08:34.39 | umdk1d3 | i think its an nvidia issue, because non-graphics-intensive stuff will run for days |
| 08:34.41 | Death_Syn | sounds like toasted video chip |
| 08:34.51 | Death_Syn | or bad driver |
| 08:34.58 | Death_Syn | i used to beat the crap out of mine with 3d all the tie |
| 08:34.59 | Death_Syn | er time |
| 08:35.02 | umdk1d3 | i just got off the phone with some wonderful guy in georgia who didnt have a clue what i was telling him |
| 08:35.14 | umdk1d3 | im running the latest nvidia linux driver |
| 08:35.31 | Death_Syn | hmm |
| 08:35.37 | umdk1d3 | it did last longer when i forced the fan to run at fullspeed, but still died in under 5 mins |
| 08:35.50 | umdk1d3 | he was telling me i needed more RAM |
| 08:35.50 | spikebike | umk1d3 there is a known issue with nvidia graphics ships in laptops |
| 08:35.52 | Death_Syn | how long you had this thinkpad? |
| 08:35.54 | spikebike | they are basically all defective |
| 08:35.59 | DarkriftX | can someone cat me this to pastebin? /system/core/include/private/android_filesystem_config.h. |
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| 08:36.11 | spikebike | if that ona g1? |
| 08:36.17 | spikebike | or the source tree? |
| 08:36.18 | Death_Syn | spikebike: lenovo puts quadro 570s in their's |
| 08:36.28 | umdk1d3 | spikebike: yea ive been reading that on forums, mostly hoping that it wasnt true in my case |
| 08:36.30 | Death_Syn | not the consumer-grade geforce |
| 08:36.41 | spikebike | I believe it's all the chip |
| 08:36.46 | DarkriftX | spikebike, its not on the emu but im not sure |
| 08:36.48 | DarkriftX | maybe in the source |
| 08:36.50 | spikebike | they made a poor decision for the mechanical aspects of the chip |
| 08:36.52 | umdk1d3 | ive got a t61 with an nvidia m140 iirc |
| 08:37.05 | Death_Syn | ahh, that's older |
| 08:37.06 | DarkriftX | someone posted on my forums that all guids and uids are listed in there |
| 08:37.12 | DarkriftX | i want to see if there are more then what we have listed |
| 08:37.20 | spikebike | basically the heat cycling causes physical stress which is too much for the pin/pad interface |
| 08:38.04 | spikebike | theinquirer.net had a 3 article series (each pretty long) on all the mechanical engineering issues with what they did |
| 08:38.20 | umdk1d3 | im going to call lenovo back in the morning and hope for a better tech |
| 08:38.45 | umdk1d3 | DarkriftX: im not seeing anything /system/core/* on my g1, did you look in the git tree? |
| 08:38.53 | DarkriftX | nope |
| 08:38.57 | DarkriftX | wouldnt know how |
| 08:39.14 | umdk1d3 | you do know that git is browsable online? |
| 08:39.39 | lethalcode | Hi again folks: I'm using startActivityForResult(). In the child, any way I can hook when they press the back button so I can call setResult()? |
| 08:40.00 | lethalcode | onPause, onStop, etc are all called after the calling activity has received the results. |
| 08:40.17 | DarkriftX | i searched it for "android_filesystem_config" and nothing |
| 08:40.42 | umdk1d3 | DarkriftX: where did that person come up with that path i wonder? |
| 08:40.58 | DarkriftX | full post is: All UIDs and GIDs are defined in system/core/include/private/android_filesystem_config.h. |
| 08:41.48 | DarkriftX | found this: Add the user id and group id used by android on the NFS server. |
| 08:41.48 | DarkriftX | <PROTECTED> |
| 08:41.48 | DarkriftX | <PROTECTED> |
| 08:41.53 | DarkriftX | oh crap, sorry |
| 08:41.56 | DarkriftX | thought it was one line |
| 08:43.52 | kRutOn | http://git.source.android.com/?p=platform/system/core.git;a=blob;f=include/private/android_filesystem_config.h;h=13e134bba98535031d2168e180744d4a3eff268b;hb=HEAD |
| 08:44.12 | umdk1d3 | kRutOn: good find :) |
| 08:44.35 | umdk1d3 | and man, your up early :P |
| 08:44.50 | kRutOn | my son woke me up crying about nothing |
| 08:45.24 | spikebike | kRutOn how old is your kid? |
| 08:45.42 | *** join/#android Yar1 (n=nick@c-76-126-245-95.hsd1.ca.comcast.net) |
| 08:45.53 | kRutOn | the one that woke me up is almost 3 |
| 08:45.58 | spikebike | ah |
| 08:46.02 | spikebike | mine is 4 |
| 08:47.42 | RyeBrye | on edge: 200 Kbit/sec down, 42 Kbit/sec up |
| 08:48.04 | spikebike | tested how? |
| 08:48.13 | RyeBrye | Xtremelabs app |
| 08:48.26 | spikebike | from the market? |
| 08:48.29 | RyeBrye | yeah |
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| 09:13.39 | kIDDAI | has anyone seen mobile ip support for android |
| 09:13.47 | kIDDAI | google search isnt giving many clues |
| 09:20.45 | spikebike | mobile ip? |
| 09:20.49 | DarkriftX | whoa :S |
| 09:20.59 | DarkriftX | spikebike, did you read about executing commands in dialer? |
| 09:21.07 | spikebike | no |
| 09:21.24 | DarkriftX | reboot your phone and open dialer, type "reboot" instead of a phone number and hit enter |
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| 09:21.45 | spikebike | k |
| 09:21.53 | spikebike | aand it reboots? |
| 09:22.00 | cutmasta | nice |
| 09:22.01 | *** join/#android cmonex (n=xy6091@qig0qvxl2f.adsl.datanet.hu) |
| 09:22.21 | DarkriftX | supposedly |
| 09:22.47 | kRutOn | There is a bug report on ConnectBot that rebooting a remote computer with it reboots the phone as well. |
| 09:22.59 | DarkriftX | http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=442857 |
| 09:23.06 | DarkriftX | seems this works with sending texts ect |
| 09:23.10 | kRutOn | And it's been confirmed by 2 different people. |
| 09:23.20 | DarkriftX | sending a text "reboot" would reboot your pjhone lol |
| 09:25.38 | kRutOn | http://code.google.com/p/connectbot/issues/detail?id=64 |
| 09:25.53 | DarkriftX | yeah, ive heard of that one |
| 09:26.05 | DarkriftX | not a huge issue i wouldnt think |
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| 09:26.10 | DarkriftX | vice versa would suck |
| 09:26.29 | DarkriftX | spikebike, did it work? |
| 09:26.40 | kRutOn | look at his entry here, though: |
| 09:26.41 | kRutOn | http://code.google.com/p/android/issues/detail?id=1207 |
| 09:26.41 | DarkriftX | damnit, i want one of these buggy g1s |
| 09:26.49 | DarkriftX | if they patch all this shit i wont buy one |
| 09:26.58 | kRutOn | The next thing I tried was (on the remote server) symlinking /sbin/reboot |
| 09:27.01 | kRutOn | to /sbin/clk |
| 09:27.09 | kRutOn | When I then typed "clk" on the command line of the remote server via |
| 09:27.09 | kRutOn | connectbot, the remote server rebooted as expected, and the gphone did not |
| 09:27.09 | kRutOn | reboot (also as expected). |
| 09:27.21 | kRutOn | that's hilarious |
| 09:28.11 | spikebike | heh |
| 09:28.23 | DarkriftX | lol |
| 09:28.30 | spikebike | I can imagine the admin that replaced kruton going WTF, why would anyone link clk to reboot |
| 09:28.42 | DarkriftX | good thing is its not a connectbot issue |
| 09:28.46 | DarkriftX | rofl |
| 09:29.10 | DarkriftX | ok, i need sleep |
| 09:29.13 | DarkriftX | work tomorrow |
| 09:29.20 | DarkriftX | gn and have fun everyone :) |
| 09:29.39 | kRutOn | spikebike: That wasn't me. I would have symlinked "ls" to "reboot" |
| 09:29.41 | DarkriftX | i should add that info to the wiki tomorrow btw |
| 09:29.50 | DarkriftX | lol |
| 09:30.18 | spikebike | btw I get 130kbit and 40 kbit |
| 09:31.35 | spikebike | oh cool |
| 09:31.43 | spikebike | in the dialer you can spell a phone number |
| 09:31.43 | kRutOn | I'm sed to getting around 900/600 on Sprint |
| 09:31.59 | spikebike | so you can type 1-800-gotmilk or whatever |
| 09:32.12 | kRutOn | luckily reboot doesn't match a 7 digit number |
| 09:32.53 | kRutOn | . o O ( Give me a call at 732668 ) |
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| 09:49.03 | digitalspaghetti | Does anyone know if there is a application that uploads to Picasa and supports the phone's geolocation support? I can only find Pixelpipe and it doesn't seem to take the geolocation stuff, just the photo |
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| 10:02.29 | *** join/#android pandzilla (n=jamu@mail.muenther.de) |
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| 10:07.52 | P2E | I am now cradling my new tmo g1 |
| 10:09.23 | P2E | does anyone know anything about how the album/music thumbnail voodoo works? |
| 10:10.35 | *** join/#android mfrnc (n=mfrnc@210-84-32-12.dyn.iinet.net.au) |
| 10:10.58 | umdk1d3 | P2E: i assume it extracts it from embedded id3v2 tags? |
| 10:11.28 | P2E | yes, but then it's stored on the card |
| 10:11.35 | P2E | in thumbnails/ or whatever |
| 10:12.50 | P2E | so, for example, we have thumbnails/1225404254133 which is just a jpeg cover and Brett Dennen - Ain't No Reason.mp3 in music/ |
| 10:12.53 | umdk1d3 | P2E: it looks liek MediaStore keeps all of it organized, along with the MediaScanner service that you can connect with |
| 10:13.23 | P2E | what I'm wondering is, how did we come up with 1225404254133 |
| 10:13.36 | P2E | because if we can figure that out, we don't need to embed art (which I can't do, because I don't use mp3s) |
| 10:14.09 | umdk1d3 | that looks slightly like a unix timestamp |
| 10:14.41 | umdk1d3 | along with maybe a 3-digit unique identifier |
| 10:15.02 | P2E | well, the thumbs for the bundled music on the phone are unique to the last 5 digits |
| 10:15.12 | P2E | that is, all are 12254042xxxxx |
| 10:15.42 | umdk1d3 | what is the file modified time in unix time? (does the time differ between the mp3s?) |
| 10:15.49 | P2E | hold on, let me find out |
| 10:16.01 | P2E | the datestamp definitely doesn't |
| 10:16.21 | umdk1d3 | i wonder if you touch them all before mediascanner gets to them |
| 10:16.21 | kRutOn | 1225404254 => "Thu Oct 30 15:04:14 2008 PDT" |
| 10:16.51 | umdk1d3 | well lol we have the source now, /me goes to dig for it |
| 10:16.58 | P2E | ok, so yeah, that's good |
| 10:17.04 | P2E | but now, 133 |
| 10:17.21 | kRutOn | that's just the MHz rating of your Pentium II |
| 10:17.28 | umdk1d3 | :P lol |
| 10:17.46 | P2E | lose =] I used a k5 back then |
| 10:18.12 | kRutOn | You so poor you used a Cyrix |
| 10:18.20 | P2E | lose again =] amd made the k5 |
| 10:18.39 | kRutOn | I know, but Cyrix were the cheapest |
| 10:18.51 | P2E | and worst |
| 10:19.23 | P2E | looks for other information.... md5 is 39b740f1522ff33a92dce558da72f07d filesize is 5275165 |
| 10:20.20 | P2E | ripped with iTunes =[ |
| 10:20.33 | umdk1d3 | aww, eac ftw |
| 10:23.13 | digitalspaghetti | Does anyone know if there is a application that uploads to Picasa and supports the phone's geolocation support? I can only find Pixelpipe and it doesn't seem to take the geolocation stuff, just the photo |
| 10:23.24 | digitalspaghetti | (sorry the channel didn't look active until now :) |
| 10:24.14 | digitalspaghetti | hey kRutOn, umdk1d3 :) |
| 10:24.21 | P2E | all album thumbnail files are 1225404254133, 1225404255145, 1225404258383, 1225404259392, 1225404259873, 1225404260043, 1225404260728, 1225404260952, 1225404261155, 1225404261598, 1225404262271 |
| 10:24.47 | P2E | maybe I'll copy the same song on again as another filename and see if 133 stays the same |
| 10:25.04 | umdk1d3 | aha |
| 10:26.08 | kRutOn | P2E: maybe it's just the row id that SQLite picked |
| 10:26.27 | umdk1d3 | yea its the sqlite "_data" column looks like |
| 10:26.33 | umdk1d3 | tryign to find where its generated tho |
| 10:27.55 | P2E | and more importantly |
| 10:28.01 | P2E | how to get it for whatever file |
| 10:28.20 | kRutOn | String name = String.valueOf(System.currentTimeMillis()); |
| 10:28.44 | P2E | ok, with the new file, it didn't regenerate art. |
| 10:28.51 | umdk1d3 | well P2E to get info you should use the normal contentresolver approach |
| 10:28.53 | P2E | even though it was a different name |
| 10:29.07 | umdk1d3 | kRutOn: aha thats what those extra three digits are ;) milliseconds |
| 10:29.25 | kRutOn | umdk1d3: yeah, duh.. should have thought of it |
| 10:29.33 | P2E | I'm trying to take this from an enduser approach |
| 10:29.35 | umdk1d3 | its late ;) |
| 10:29.51 | P2E | I don't want to write anything on the phone, just figure out what I need to name a file for an app to get stuff onto it |
| 10:30.01 | kRutOn | umdk1d3: Do you think I should extend ArrayAdapter or create a new Cursor... |
| 10:30.08 | umdk1d3 | P2E: what does the end user want to do with thte thumbnails? |
| 10:30.17 | umdk1d3 | kRutOn: for ssh hosts not in the db? |
| 10:30.22 | P2E | uh, you mean other than see them when they're playing their music? =] |
| 10:30.29 | kRutOn | umdk1d3: This is actually for the port forwards |
| 10:30.49 | umdk1d3 | P2E: to see them on their desktop, or on the phone? |
| 10:30.53 | P2E | on the phone. |
| 10:31.26 | kRutOn | umdk1d3: ArrayAdapter doesn't offer a view binder |
| 10:31.39 | umdk1d3 | well, like i said, the MediaStore provides a nice ContentProvider that you could query |
| 10:31.49 | kRutOn | umdk1d3: Which I guess makes sense |
| 10:31.54 | P2E | the media store does not catalog videogame soundtracks =] |
| 10:31.58 | umdk1d3 | kRutOn: SimpleAdapter also provides a binder? |
| 10:32.49 | umdk1d3 | well, thats the issue i suppose, its looking for indexes to bind from |
| 10:33.05 | umdk1d3 | its pretty easy to write your own adapter |
| 10:33.22 | umdk1d3 | sometimes ArrayAdapter can get in the way |
| 10:33.46 | umdk1d3 | instead of repackaging stuff into arrays for it to use, a custom adapter could easily iterate over the List of tunnels |
| 10:34.19 | kRutOn | umdk1d3: I think I'll just make a small extension of ArrayAdapter that has a custom getView |
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| 10:36.35 | umdk1d3 | oops we ignored digitalspaghetti |
| 10:36.51 | digitalspaghetti | :p |
| 10:37.04 | digitalspaghetti | thats ok, you seem to be in a groove :) |
| 10:37.06 | umdk1d3 | digitalspaghetti: i havent really dug into all the apps, so not sure |
| 10:37.10 | kRutOn | digitalspaghetti: sorry, I must admit I prefer analog spaghetti |
| 10:37.55 | digitalspaghetti | umdk1d3: yea it seems to no apps use the option to add geocoding to a photo |
| 10:38.34 | umdk1d3 | digitalspaghetti: have you emailed the pixelpipe devs and asked if its an upcoming feature? |
| 10:38.49 | umdk1d3 | has done horrible job of ignoring all market emails ;) |
| 10:38.51 | digitalspaghetti | no, but i was going to |
| 10:39.13 | digitalspaghetti | brb |
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| 10:50.20 | P2E | whoops, locked up my phone |
| 10:50.53 | P2E | oh, no I didn't |
| 10:51.54 | Tauno | ..used the BRICK permission? :P |
| 10:52.15 | P2E | I don't need permission to lay bricks |
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| 10:53.50 | nesoi | any new phones coming out that run android? or any new ports? |
| 10:59.30 | cmonex | heh cant believe the locking down had such a big hole (mtd) |
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| 11:02.41 | pandzilla | cmonex: mhm, which one? |
| 11:04.43 | pandzilla | cmonex: do you mean the telnetd thingy? |
| 11:05.40 | P2E | hmm, naming a jpeg as the unix timestamp didn't seem to wkr |
| 11:05.42 | P2E | er, work |
| 11:05.58 | P2E | I added 000 to the end of it just for the sake of matching |
| 11:06.44 | cmonex | pandzilla: |
| 11:06.46 | cmonex | no, mtd. |
| 11:07.03 | cmonex | http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?p=2870558#post2870558 |
| 11:07.28 | cmonex | well mtd to read the partitions.. then that flash image tool.. |
| 11:08.02 | cmonex | this would never happen on the unsecure WM .. that htc would leave a tool that calls the nand driver to flash the bootloader at will :) |
| 11:08.16 | cmonex | of course the recovery is not bootloader, but it has the ability to flash that too.. |
| 11:08.27 | pandzilla | hah |
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| 11:09.20 | pandzilla | I see, I see |
| 11:09.24 | cmonex | yeah, i'm speechless. what a big hole |
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| 11:10.25 | cmonex | it being open source certainly helped too... recompiling recovery is easier than patching an existing one ;) |
| 11:11.37 | pandzilla | for sure :) |
| 11:12.23 | rwhitby | how long ago was the hole found? |
| 11:18.25 | *** join/#android oavdeev (n=oavdeev@79.120.41.39) |
| 11:18.36 | cmonex | rwhitby: today.. (my time) |
| 11:18.58 | rwhitby | adds the links to android-internals.org |
| 11:19.23 | cmonex | but i'm saying the hack is not complete until a patched hboot.img is flashed via this custom recovery.. so if something goes wrong you can easily fall back to SPL. also the recovery should just accept any key, not just that test cert |
| 11:19.51 | cmonex | ofcourse the problem is getting the hboot.img, but i have ideas about dumping it |
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| 11:34.18 | digitalspaghetti | oh i just read abut the jailbreaking via telnet :) |
| 11:34.43 | *** join/#android Laz (n=Laz1@28.184.119.70.cfl.res.rr.com) |
| 11:50.35 | umdk1d3 | ohwow i just realised its been a year since the public android announcement |
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| 12:01.38 | rwhitby | umdk1d3: http://logs.nslu2-linux.org/livelogs/android/android.20071106.txt :-) |
| 12:04.01 | rwhitby | "Nov 12 16:21:10 <rangen> downloads available. |
| 12:04.01 | rwhitby | " |
| 12:05.25 | umdk1d3 | rwhitby: awesome |
| 12:05.47 | umdk1d3 | goes to look at logs |
| 12:06.52 | umdk1d3 | doh i only have logs going back to february |
| 12:09.01 | *** join/#android bloo (n=blau@c-68-37-236-163.hsd1.nj.comcast.net) |
| 12:09.04 | bloo | hey guys |
| 12:09.12 | bloo | any bugs with the market and number of downloads? |
| 12:09.20 | nesoi | so what device should I get to run android? |
| 12:09.31 | bloo | I'm still showing < 50 downloads and now up to 24 reviews |
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| 12:09.39 | dream_kill_offic | hi |
| 12:09.43 | umdk1d3 | bloo: yea i think there is some funky stuff happening |
| 12:09.53 | bloo | I can't imagine any market application has > %50 review to download ratio |
| 12:09.53 | umdk1d3 | like there are some apps with <50 downloads at the top of the popular list |
| 12:09.54 | dream_kill_offic | managed to get root in adb :D |
| 12:09.57 | dream_kill_offic | (no su) |
| 12:10.15 | dream_kill_offic | just adb -d shell and got root now :D |
| 12:10.20 | dream_kill_offic | full jailbreak ;) |
| 12:10.33 | bloo | and previously i was getting like 1000 downloads a day with other versions, but this has been at like < 50 since saturday |
| 12:13.05 | bloo | thanks umdk1d3 |
| 12:13.29 | bloo | anyone have an opinion on whether essential functions should be in context menus only on mobile devices |
| 12:14.04 | bloo | with desktop apps, its usually a nono, but on mobile platforms i feel that the scarcity of screen space makes it acceptable |
| 12:14.26 | umdk1d3 | you mean the general menus? |
| 12:14.33 | bloo | but of course, i get a bunch of people who cant figure out how to delete something in my program |
| 12:14.37 | umdk1d3 | (context menus still hold their place with longpress on items) |
| 12:14.58 | umdk1d3 | imho people will get used to it |
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| 12:15.16 | umdk1d3 | as long as you follow the pattern in other packaged apps that come with the platform |
| 12:17.47 | tweakt_ | dream_kill_offic, ?? |
| 12:17.50 | bloo | umdk: i feel like I do, and I still get people leaving reviews like the screen is blank, I cant figure out what to do, or please let us delete items |
| 12:18.08 | dream_kill_offic | simple :D |
| 12:18.13 | dream_kill_offic | flashed my recovery |
| 12:18.22 | dream_kill_offic | then made my own update.zip |
| 12:18.22 | tweakt_ | ahh |
| 12:18.23 | umdk1d3 | bloo: are you showing an @android:id/empty if using a listactivity? |
| 12:18.31 | bloo | and then on the other hand, when people email me to offer suggestions and I ask them, "why do you use my software" |
| 12:18.38 | bloo | they say its because of the interface |
| 12:18.40 | dream_kill_offic | which removed the jailbrak :D |
| 12:19.08 | dream_kill_offic | si now when i adb -d shell now is drect root |
| 12:19.11 | bloo | umdk: no, I'm just showing a textview when it's empty and hiding it when its full, didnt realise that android:empty existed |
| 12:19.23 | bloo | im assuming that displays some text when a list view has nothing in it? |
| 12:19.53 | umdk1d3 | bloo: yea sounds like you already have that tho |
| 12:20.26 | umdk1d3 | there isnt anything super special about android:id/empty |
| 12:20.47 | bloo | its just simpler than checking, oh is the list empty and setting my textview to display |
| 12:20.52 | umdk1d3 | when used along with a android:id/list in a ListActivity, it takes care of showing hiding as needed based on the Adapter having items/empty |
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| 12:21.24 | umdk1d3 | so if you have empty helper text there, people are still complaining? lol |
| 12:21.35 | umdk1d3 | longpress to edit/delete is all over the place |
| 12:22.01 | umdk1d3 | its probably them just not "getting it" yet |
| 12:22.09 | bloo | umdk: yeh i dont know how these people even got into the market |
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| 12:22.22 | umdk1d3 | haha |
| 12:22.37 | umdk1d3 | ive gotten the most odd emails from people |
| 12:22.42 | tomgibara | I wish you could meta moderate the app market comments |
| 12:22.57 | umdk1d3 | i wish you could get external access to the market content/comments |
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| 12:23.23 | tomgibara | external as in website or webservice? |
| 12:23.26 | umdk1d3 | tomgibara: agreed, all those wallpaper spam adverts and political stuff |
| 12:23.34 | andatche | anyone having trouble downloading apps off the market right now? (in the UK at least) |
| 12:23.39 | bloo | i concur |
| 12:23.46 | bloo | i had problems browsing the market this morning |
| 12:23.47 | umdk1d3 | well, i would be very interested in getting an rss feed of new market apps at least |
| 12:23.48 | tomgibara | andatche: No (and am in UK) |
| 12:24.10 | andatche | everything else seems to work, and I can browse it fine, it just never downloads anything |
| 12:24.22 | tomgibara | I was thinking more of people who don't understand what an app does, so give it 1* |
| 12:24.38 | bloo | i wish theyd have an auto updater |
| 12:24.51 | bloo | i have wayyy too many people emailing me with feature requests that ive already implemented |
| 12:25.32 | umdk1d3 | bloo: do you have an update checker of your own written in yet? |
| 12:25.48 | dream_kill_offic | market works here too (uk using t-mobile 3g) |
| 12:25.48 | umdk1d3 | bloo: might take a peek at http://www.tomgibara.com/android/veecheck/ |
| 12:26.13 | tomgibara | bloo: Yeah, I fixed a bad puppy of a bug in that a couple of days ago |
| 12:26.25 | andatche | will reboot and see if that fixes it |
| 12:26.43 | umdk1d3 | bloo: or something like this if your looking for something a bit lighter --> http://code.google.com/p/connectbot/source/browse/trunk/connectbot/src/org/connectbot/util/UpdateHelper.java |
| 12:27.04 | umdk1d3 | actually, that versoin is a bit bloated |
| 12:27.09 | umdk1d3 | with frequency checks |
| 12:27.14 | bloo | my plan was to automatically download updated apps |
| 12:27.29 | umdk1d3 | http://code.google.com/p/connectbot/source/browse/trunk/connectbot/src/org/connectbot/util/UpdateHelper.java?r=82 <-- that one is simpler and more general |
| 12:27.34 | bloo | but i cant because the installer crashes if i install my app through downloading it by the browser |
| 12:27.48 | umdk1d3 | bloo: all you can really do is launch an intent over to market |
| 12:27.50 | bloo | something about INSTALL_SHORTCUT permission |
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| 12:28.07 | bloo | ohhh didnt realise the market has intents |
| 12:28.14 | bloo | thanks guys |
| 12:28.35 | umdk1d3 | bloo: yea take a peek at that second link there, its some simple code that gets the job done |
| 12:28.54 | umdk1d3 | and if you need something more flexible, check out veecheck |
| 12:29.21 | Ez-DvD | i have this error when i try to compile, help please...build/core/product_config.mk:229: WARNING: adding test OTA key |
| 12:29.21 | Ez-DvD | build/core/main.mk:177: implicitly installing apns-conf_sdk.xml |
| 12:29.21 | Ez-DvD | make: *** No rule to make target `/lib/tools.jar', needed by `out/target/common/docs/framework-timestamp'. Stop. |
| 12:31.05 | bloo | grrr this stupid thing doesnt work on my g1 but does in emulator |
| 12:31.13 | eldenz | are mac fonts .ttf as well? |
| 12:35.04 | bloo | anyone have wakelock experience? |
| 12:36.34 | pandzilla | don't even know what that is...?! |
| 12:36.39 | umdk1d3 | bloo: connectbot is using it in ConsoleActivity |
| 12:36.49 | umdk1d3 | pandzilla: it can keep your device from falling alseep |
| 12:37.07 | bloo | it seems to work fine in the emulator |
| 12:37.14 | bloo | but on my g1 i cant get the screen to flick on |
| 12:37.32 | umdk1d3 | oh you want to force wake up the device? |
| 12:38.07 | bloo | i have an sms receiver |
| 12:38.18 | bloo | i want to turn the screen on when an sms is received |
| 12:38.41 | bloo | i got it working on the emulator |
| 12:38.48 | bloo | but doesnt seem to wanna turn on in my g1 |
| 12:39.42 | pandzilla | gotcha |
| 12:42.15 | bloo | hmm seems like as soon as you release the wake lock, the screen goes to sleep maybe on the g1? |
| 12:42.19 | bloo | but not on the emulator? |
| 12:42.58 | bloo | i basically amd doing wakelock.acquire;wakelock.release |
| 12:43.07 | bloo | if i comment out release it turns the screen on |
| 12:43.31 | bloo | on my g1 but obviously doesnt let it turn off |
| 12:44.04 | bloo | grrr |
| 12:48.33 | Dialekt | man |
| 12:48.35 | Dialekt | turn me on |
| 12:48.43 | Dialekt | TURN ME ON with this g1 |
| 12:48.54 | Dialekt | all these fix this fix that crap |
| 12:48.55 | Dialekt | lol sheesh |
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| 12:49.27 | bloo | on_after_release doesnt seem to be working for me |
| 12:49.27 | bloo | grrr |
| 12:52.19 | bloo | yeah thats it, i just noticed the screen flickers on for like a 5th of a second |
| 12:52.28 | bloo | final PowerManager.WakeLockwakelock = pm.newWakeLock(PowerManager.SCREEN_BRIGHT_WAKE_LOCK | PowerManager.ACQUIRE_CAUSES_WAKEUP | PowerManager.ON_AFTER_RELEASE, "power lock"); |
| 12:52.28 | bloo | |
| 12:52.32 | bloo | anything look wrong with that? |
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| 13:10.05 | Tauno | If I use canvas.drawText(...) then it draws it base don the baseline of the font.. can I somehow change it so that it draws the top/bottom/center (whatever else) at the coordinates that I specify? |
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| 13:12.03 | dream_kill_offic | re |
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| 13:14.42 | tomgibara | Anyone know if android resource URIs can be supplied directly to a WebView? - doesn't seem to work. |
| 13:18.51 | Tauno | the dox say that: "The origin is interpreted based on the Align setting in the paint. " but I can only set the horizontal alignment for the paint with paint.setTextAlign() is there a possibility to set the vertical one too? Or at least determine where the baseline is compared to absolute top/bottom ? |
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| 13:25.40 | Tauno | come on.. somebody has surely cried over the same problem as I'm facing :P |
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| 13:26.38 | Tauno | ..textPaint.baselineShift is also 0.. so this one is not helping either :/ |
| 13:29.16 | Tauno | ok, found it :) paint.getFontMetrics().bottom |
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| 13:46.49 | tweakt_ | Does video recording work? It's not in the public docs, but it's in the java api... |
| 13:47.02 | tweakt_ | android.media.MediaRecorder |
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| 13:48.19 | jbq_ | There's no video recording on the G1 at this point. I'm not sure whether that's because of hardware restrictions, driver restrictions or android framework restrictions. |
| 13:48.50 | thoraxe | jbq_: hopefully it'll get sorted |
| 13:48.58 | thoraxe | is there a picture -> flickr app yet? |
| 13:49.31 | tweakt_ | MediaRecorder mr = new MediaRecorder(); mr.setVideoSource(VideoSource.CAMERA); |
| 13:50.05 | digitalspaghetti | thoraxe: yes, PixelPipe |
| 13:50.08 | tweakt_ | mr.setVideoEncoder(VideoEncoder.H264) |
| 13:50.20 | digitalspaghetti | however it doesn't support geoencoding photo's yet :( |
| 13:50.32 | tweakt_ | its in the java API I pulled from git at least, in 1.0 release |
| 13:50.36 | thoraxe | digitalspaghetti: is it in the marketplace? |
| 13:50.40 | digitalspaghetti | thoraxe: yes |
| 13:51.01 | digitalspaghetti | the app can upload to several targets including flickr, picasa, facebook, twitter, etv |
| 13:51.02 | thoraxe | no matches for pixel |
| 13:51.05 | thoraxe | ghetto |
| 13:51.09 | thoraxe | the app search is really poor |
| 13:51.35 | digitalspaghetti | just search by date, there was a recent update to it |
| 13:51.38 | thoraxe | you'd think a company founded on SEARCH could make their app SEARCH work |
| 13:51.42 | thoraxe | i had to search for pixelpipe |
| 13:51.43 | digitalspaghetti | you also need to sign up a pixelpipe account |
| 13:51.50 | thoraxe | 1.03 |
| 13:51.54 | iDialekt_____ | Sorry digital |
| 13:51.55 | Chainfire | hey digitalspaghetti... didn't you use to hang out in #jquery? |
| 13:52.01 | jbq_ | tweakt_: if it's not in the SDK, you shouldn't assume that it's gonna stay there. |
| 13:52.01 | digitalspaghetti | thoraxe: yea, google have missed some tricks on the phone |
| 13:52.02 | iDialekt_____ | iPhone typo |
| 13:52.03 | digitalspaghetti | Chainfire: still do :) |
| 13:52.15 | Chainfire | heh i knew I knew that nick from somewhere :) |
| 13:52.20 | thoraxe | i spent some time in jquery not too long ago |
| 13:52.25 | thoraxe | then i abandoned the project i wanted to do with it |
| 13:52.26 | dream_kill_offic | video recording not working on G1? |
| 13:52.26 | tweakt_ | jbq_: blah, yeah it's not in the official jar file from the SDK |
| 13:53.29 | digitalspaghetti | thoraxe: you would think Google would have a Picasa app that tied into the Geocoding for photo's on launch :| |
| 13:53.33 | thoraxe | digitalspaghetti: i wonder when pixelpipe is going to start charging |
| 13:53.35 | iDialekt_____ | Man Im scared to purchase a g1 |
| 13:53.40 | thoraxe | digitalspaghetti: dude that would make sense right? |
| 13:53.48 | thoraxe | maybe google realizes picasa is a pile of poo |
| 13:56.16 | Chainfire | is that app name request form for use of the Android name up yet? |
| 13:56.28 | digitalspaghetti | yea, but at least you get 2g space as opposed to Picasa's 200 picture limit |
| 13:56.48 | thoraxe | picasa has a 200 picture limit? |
| 13:57.00 | digitalspaghetti | Flickr's 200 picture limit even |
| 13:57.08 | thoraxe | flickr is 200 pics *per month* |
| 13:57.10 | thoraxe | not 200 pics total |
| 13:57.36 | digitalspaghetti | really? oh! that would make sense then |
| 13:57.47 | thoraxe | digitalspaghetti: i thought the same as you at first too, then i re-read |
| 13:59.03 | digitalspaghetti | still only have the 3 album limit though :( |
| 13:59.13 | Dougie187 | with picasa you only get 1 gig |
| 13:59.22 | thoraxe | albums or sets? |
| 13:59.53 | thoraxe | can you use pixelpipe with a wordpress.org blog? |
| 13:59.59 | digitalspaghetti | sets |
| 14:00.01 | digitalspaghetti | thoraxe: yes |
| 14:00.24 | thoraxe | digitalspaghetti: hmm... do you have to supply the login url or the root blog url |
| 14:00.51 | digitalspaghetti | probally the xml-rpc url |
| 14:01.01 | digitalspaghetti | http://yourblog.com/xmlrpc.php |
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| 14:06.53 | thoraxe | o |
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| 14:08.03 | digitalspaghetti | did it work? |
| 14:08.25 | thoraxe | didn't trty |
| 14:09.49 | thoraxe | i'm more interested in just finding a lifestream plugin/mod for wordpress that puts the twitter/flickr/etc. in the wordpress loop |
| 14:09.50 | thoraxe | all the lifestream plugins i'm finding put the lifestream in like a sidebar or something |
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| 14:16.28 | bloo | published my second app to the market yay |
| 14:17.19 | KenSentMe | bloo, what kind of app? |
| 14:17.29 | bloo | more of a utility |
| 14:17.38 | bloo | it turns the screen on when you get a sms |
| 14:17.52 | bloo | useful for when you have it sitting on your desk |
| 14:18.02 | digitalspaghetti | checking it out now |
| 14:18.07 | bloo | it got annoying real quick having to grab phone unlock it and check |
| 14:18.41 | digitalspaghetti | hello Mike DiGiovanni ;) |
| 14:18.58 | bloo | hello digital spaghetti |
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| 14:20.17 | digitalspaghetti | i'll need to wait and get a text now :) |
| 14:20.39 | bloo | thats why you need 2 phones now |
| 14:21.55 | digitalspaghetti | i already asked t-mobile :) |
| 14:21.57 | bloo | my other app isnt showing up now when searching by date grrr |
| 14:22.09 | digitalspaghetti | they said no, as i'm a new customer, i have to wait at least 3 months |
| 14:22.31 | bloo | i still have my old sprint account |
| 14:22.38 | bloo | hoping sprint gets a android phone soon |
| 14:22.42 | digitalspaghetti | UK T-Mobile |
| 14:22.57 | bloo | ooh yeah i forgot they launched in uk already |
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| 14:28.26 | ionstorm | where is a good place for allot of src code for android apps |
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| 14:30.09 | bloo | hey is robert stevens here? |
| 14:31.07 | Disconnect | morning all |
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| 14:31.21 | ionstorm | good morning Disconnect |
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| 14:32.18 | Disconnect | sees no 'light-up sms' app in the marketplace btw :/ |
| 14:32.20 | ionstorm | yea, what is the issue w/video recording? Is it possible to drop resolution? |
| 14:32.43 | Disconnect | scratch that, found it. stupid cache :/ |
| 14:32.50 | bloo | disconnect, dg Screen On |
| 14:32.59 | bloo | i need a better name and icon |
| 14:33.15 | vol | Clever android fellows using gdb, what version are you using? http://www.billrocks.org/ideas/index.php?/archives/20-Debugging-Android-Native-C-Applications-with-gdb.html#extended ? Or are you compiling your own? |
| 14:33.34 | Disconnect | and fyi you can always sms google to get incoming sms's :) or i think there's a tmob service that msgs you your minutes or something, good for a quick (free) response |
| 14:34.05 | Disconnect | bloo: nobody will use it cuz it doesn't ask for gps and net access or the ability to read my contacts or anything. |
| 14:34.06 | ionstorm | bloo, sms screen alert |
| 14:34.06 | Disconnect | :) |
| 14:34.21 | Disconnect | also "timeout" text is truncated |
| 14:35.01 | Disconnect | donation should indicate where it goes (amazon it looks like?) eg "Donate via my Amazon donation page" or something in the text |
| 14:35.06 | ionstorm | bloo, can u make the screen blink different ways? |
| 14:35.22 | digitalspaghetti | thats a new one - my gf phoned there and my PC just picked up the call and routed it through the speakers! |
| 14:35.29 | bloo | ionstorm, i had originally tried to drop the keyguard |
| 14:35.42 | bloo | but for some reason it turned into a complete mess and wasn reliable |
| 14:35.56 | bloo | so i fell back to this which works good enough for me |
| 14:36.12 | bloo | but if theres a lot of requests for the original way id look into it |
| 14:36.33 | bloo | my original plan was to display a screen showing the entire text message for some period of time |
| 14:37.13 | ionstorm | yea, a popup of some sort, maybe a little bubble |
| 14:37.27 | ionstorm | a fade away alert |
| 14:38.05 | ionstorm | dude, what about a app update notification app |
| 14:38.50 | ionstorm | that would be tight because you'll never know if the app you got updated unless u constantly check the app market |
| 14:38.57 | ionstorm | like apt-get update |
| 14:39.41 | Disconnect | ionstorm: they're working on that on the lists right now |
| 14:40.04 | digitalspaghetti | so is the marketplace open source too? |
| 14:40.11 | bloo | but i couldnt figure out how to relock the screen, even though the api seemed to indicate it was easy |
| 14:40.44 | Disconnect | nope |
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| 14:43.38 | bloo | since i put the screen on app up, ive gotten like 5 emails from it |
| 14:44.10 | bloo | did anyone try it? i got one email saying it didnt work, and |
| 14:44.11 | ionstorm | Disconnect, which lists |
| 14:45.45 | bloo | grr it doesnt work |
| 14:45.51 | bloo | i swear i tested it |
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| 14:47.29 | Disconnect | lol |
| 14:47.44 | Disconnect | ionstorm: i'll dig it out in a bit but its one of the main android-* ones |
| 14:48.48 | bloo | ugh wtf did i do |
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| 14:52.22 | *** join/#android joakime (n=joakim@ip68-228-239-45.ph.ph.cox.net) |
| 14:53.09 | *** join/#android wastrel (n=wastrel@nylug/member/wastrel) |
| 14:54.28 | bloo | i broke it how the fuck did i break it |
| 14:54.55 | bloo | sigh |
| 14:55.24 | Disconnect | lol |
| 14:55.39 | bloo | it still works in the emulator of course grrr |
| 14:55.41 | *** part/#android an_dev (n=fih\paya@host-208-68-238-61.biznesshosting.net) |
| 14:57.22 | Disconnect | lol |
| 14:57.34 | *** join/#android mowgli (n=mviswana@host-208-68-238-61.biznesshosting.net) |
| 14:57.44 | bloo | i swear i tested it on the phone |
| 14:58.19 | bloo | and now i cant get the debugger to attach to my phone |
| 14:59.28 | *** join/#android dims (n=dims@c-76-24-122-109.hsd1.ma.comcast.net) |
| 14:59.35 | *** join/#android dysinger_ (n=tim@cpe-75-80-200-182.hawaii.res.rr.com) |
| 14:59.53 | dysinger_ | Is it possible to try the android market and download stuff to the android emulator ? |
| 15:00.12 | dysinger_ | I can't figure it out |
| 15:00.26 | offby1 | I'd have thought so |
| 15:00.29 | offby1 | lemme try |
| 15:00.59 | bloo | this is the most frustrating thing ive ever witnessed |
| 15:01.08 | thoraxe | my screen just died |
| 15:01.09 | bloo | i know i had it working because i remember not being able to get the screen to go off |
| 15:01.11 | thoraxe | it won't come on |
| 15:01.39 | thoraxe | it's like poewred up |
| 15:01.44 | thoraxe | but it's not showing anything |
| 15:01.45 | thoraxe | great. |
| 15:01.57 | *** join/#android Payal (n=fkp021@host-208-68-238-61.biznesshosting.net) |
| 15:02.09 | offby1 | dysinger_: ah, now I see your dilemma. I have no "Market" icon. |
| 15:02.19 | ionstorm | found the app updater http://openintents.googlecode.com/files/UpdateChecker.apk |
| 15:02.29 | offby1 | so is there any kind of support for the Android, besides this channel? |
| 15:02.59 | ionstorm | offby1, the android developer group |
| 15:03.05 | bloo | ok so i found the problem out and its lame |
| 15:03.13 | mikez5 | mailing lists: http://source.android.com/discuss |
| 15:03.16 | jimp | < DarkriftX> reboot your phone and open dialer, type "reboot" instead of a phone number and hit enter |
| 15:03.21 | thoraxe | offby1: t-mobile if you have a g1 |
| 15:03.23 | jimp | wow, that's ... |
| 15:03.24 | offby1 | ionstorm: what is that? A mailing list? |
| 15:03.27 | offby1 | thoraxe: ugh :) |
| 15:03.41 | offby1 | thoraxe: I've already got a couple of requests in to them; they're idiots |
| 15:03.43 | jimp | How did they manage to fsck up Linux so badly?! |
| 15:04.05 | jimp | Did they just leave a spawned shell listening to the keyboard in the background by accident? |
| 15:04.07 | jbq_ | offby1: the official mailing lists. |
| 15:04.28 | jimp | That could explain how the telnetd root hack works (if it's running telnetd in some background root shell, rather than in pterminal, because it's listening to the keyboard) |
| 15:04.35 | ionstorm | offby1, http://groups.google.com/group/android-developers?hl=en |
| 15:04.51 | *** join/#android borism (n=boris@195-50-211-94-dsl.krw.estpak.ee) |
| 15:04.54 | Disconnect | jimp: 'reboot' is a shortcut just like all the various *#min#* and such |
| 15:05.11 | wastrel | does it work in the emulator? |
| 15:05.12 | offby1 | ionstorm: thanks |
| 15:05.17 | ionstorm | offby1, np |
| 15:05.26 | Disconnect | (why do people always leap to such -entertaining- assumptions??) |
| 15:05.34 | jimp | Disconnect: the xda post suggested that it works outside the dialer (like in SMS) |
| 15:05.40 | jimp | and that other apps like telnetd also can be run through the dialer |
| 15:05.52 | jimp | So shortcut makes no sense. |
| 15:06.01 | thoraxe | let's see how t-mobile handles my broken g1 |
| 15:06.09 | Disconnect | ..and did you try it? |
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| 15:06.27 | offby1 | thoraxe: I suspect: they won't :-| |
| 15:06.29 | jimp | Disconnect: No, I'm waiting for a phone call and don't want to keep rebooting my phone. |
| 15:06.29 | bloo | im so confused |
| 15:06.36 | offby1 | thoraxe: well, maybe if you nag them constantly. |
| 15:06.40 | joakime | thoraxe, saw another customer have your blank screen problem while I was purchasing my g-1, yanking the battery and replacing it worked for her. might help you too. |
| 15:06.41 | bloo | i had a final PowerManager.wakelock used in an innerclass. |
| 15:06.48 | Disconnect | reboot in the 'to' field makes perfect sense - same handler as dialer. |
| 15:06.48 | thoraxe | joakime: already tried that twice |
| 15:06.57 | jimp | The post clearly says that you must do it shortly after rebooting and that you can't cut-and-paste, you must type. |
| 15:07.04 | jimp | Shortcuts dont' fit that description. Have you read the post? |
| 15:07.07 | thoraxe | well, not only do i have insurance i also have had the phone less than a month |
| 15:07.15 | thoraxe | so they BETTER do something about it. |
| 15:07.23 | offby1 | thoraxe: I hope they do! |
| 15:07.28 | offby1 | and I hope they get back to me, too :-| |
| 15:07.32 | Disconnect | thoraxe: ask them to make sure you don't lose all your sent/received sms's. |
| 15:07.42 | thoraxe | Disconnect: i couldnt' care less about them |
| 15:07.45 | offby1 | Disconnect: where are those stored? |
| 15:07.54 | offby1 | knows but little of cell phones |
| 15:07.57 | thoraxe | there is really nothing in the phone i am concerned about besides a few pics and mp3s, but those are on the SD card |
| 15:08.14 | `vip | is there an app to let me save youtube vids to my phone ? |
| 15:08.19 | Disconnect | thoraxe: yah but its a standard replacing-a-phone feature to move the data over. i'd love to hear them explain why you can't be trusted with your backups. |
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| 15:09.11 | *** join/#android jbq (n=jbq@nat/google/x-d3827489bea429c6) |
| 15:09.18 | thoraxe | i'm surprised i've had to hold this long for a rep |
| 15:09.41 | thoraxe | which leads me to believe there are bigger issues afoot |
| 15:09.58 | bloo | a local wakelock appears to release as soon as the method ends |
| 15:10.10 | bloo | even if its final and used in an anonymous class |
| 15:11.18 | bloo | i dont get it sigh |
| 15:11.23 | jimp | Disconnect: I've searched through the source for the dialer and related apps and can't find this "reboot" shortcut that you insist exists. Can you point to the file? |
| 15:11.25 | d0nets | any word of a sirius/sm player? |
| 15:11.52 | d0nets | when they do make a sirius/xm* player, it would be nice to have a "tivo" option |
| 15:12.17 | d0nets | where it has a buffer of like 10 mins |
| 15:12.23 | d0nets | and you can hit record |
| 15:12.59 | thoraxe | "let me try one more time for you. it seems like no one is picking up [in the android service department]" |
| 15:13.29 | thoraxe | well, good to know that there are people there to assist |
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| 15:14.07 | Disconnect | jimp: did you find the IMEI display from *#06#? cuz if not, you're in the wrong place |
| 15:14.44 | jimp | Disconnect: Yeah, of course. |
| 15:15.03 | jimp | ./Contacts/src/com/android/contacts/SpecialCharSequenceMgr.java |
| 15:15.08 | jimp | And there's nothing in there about reboot. |
| 15:15.24 | Disconnect | also, did you type "ps" on the console and see if there is a getty or something listening? |
| 15:16.10 | Disconnect | (and i just dialed reboot. nada.) |
| 15:16.17 | jimp | You're thick. |
| 15:16.24 | jimp | Did you forget the part about how you need to do this soon after reboot? |
| 15:17.34 | Disconnect | isn't the one making wild (illogical -and- untested) assumptions about the phone. |
| 15:17.43 | Disconnect | i did reboot first dumbass |
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| 15:17.56 | digitalspaghetti | http://www.flickr.com/photos/84656963@N00/3007435817/ |
| 15:18.11 | jimp | Disconnect: so you turn around and make equally illogical counterarguments. Useful! |
| 15:18.18 | *** part/#android DubLo7 (n=DubLo7@70.238.110.130) |
| 15:18.23 | jimp | It's clearly not a shortcut, so don't act like you know what's going on. |
| 15:18.39 | Disconnect | right. its not a shortcut because it -doesn't work-.. |
| 15:18.40 | jimp | I was speculating and admitting that I was speculating, not stating things as fact. |
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| 15:18.56 | jimp | 10:04 < Disconnect> jimp: 'reboot' is a shortcut just like all the various *#min#* and such |
| 15:19.03 | jimp | ^^ clearly untrue from the source. |
| 15:19.24 | *** join/#android streeter (n=streeter@12.68.228.100) |
| 15:19.33 | jimp | Also, for the record, I did just try it -- and shortly after powering on the phone, yes, typing "reboot" into the dialer with the keyboard reboots the phone. |
| 15:20.15 | *** join/#android Dougie187 (n=doug@wg-d232088.dsl.fsu.edu) |
| 15:20.55 | bloo | ok fixed my screen turn onner i think |
| 15:21.26 | Disconnect | also, 'telnetd' works even long after a reboot. |
| 15:21.39 | jimp | Not in my tests. |
| 15:21.42 | jimp | Are you making things up again? |
| 15:21.57 | jimp | You'll notice that posts like: |
| 15:21.59 | jimp | http://www.android-unleashed.com/2008/11/howto-get-root-on-your-android-g1-and.html |
| 15:22.03 | jimp | Include the phrase: |
| 15:22.10 | jimp | "reboot your phone, open pterminal quickly" |
| 15:22.44 | SplasPood | Well |
| 15:22.52 | SplasPood | when I originally discovered the telnetd thing |
| 15:22.56 | SplasPood | my phone had been on for a couple days.. |
| 15:23.01 | Disconnect | i've never had to reboot to run it. only rebooted once because it wasn't working (the broken shell won't parse /system/bin/telnetd properly - rebooting didn't fix that but cd system ; cd bin did..) |
| 15:23.10 | SplasPood | but yea |
| 15:23.18 | SplasPood | I found I needed to actually be *in* bin to do it |
| 15:23.26 | Disconnect | it also says "type telnetd 2 or 3 times" .. that post is hardly a font of good advice |
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| 15:23.49 | thoraxe | tried to do a reset, didn't work |
| 15:23.58 | thoraxe | it's under 14 days so they will exchange it in the store |
| 15:26.53 | Ez-DvD | Can anyone help? I get this error when I try to compile android from source: build/core/product_config.mk:229: WARNING: adding test OTA key |
| 15:26.54 | Ez-DvD | build/core/main.mk:177: implicitly installing apns-conf_sdk.xml |
| 15:26.54 | Ez-DvD | make: *** No rule to make target `/lib/tools.jar', needed by `out/target/common/docs/framework-timestamp'. Stop. |
| 15:28.46 | Ez-DvD | slackware 12.1 if that makes any difference |
| 15:28.58 | Ez-DvD | jdk 6.0 |
| 15:30.55 | jimp | Ez-DvD: I don't know, but "/lib/tools.jar" seems to be missing something important before it |
| 15:31.08 | jimp | maybe check the makefile and see what variable should have been expanded there, then figure out why it's empty |
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| 15:33.38 | bloo | published the new and working dg SMS Screen Alert |
| 15:34.55 | jimp | HAHAHA |
| 15:35.06 | jimp | ## Daemon processes to be run by init. |
| 15:35.06 | jimp | ## |
| 15:35.06 | jimp | service console /system/bin/sh console |
| 15:35.21 | jimp | It's almost certainly my suspicion. |
| 15:35.33 | jimp | /system/bin/sh is spawned on the console by /init.rc !!! |
| 15:35.48 | jimp | That's awesome. |
| 15:36.03 | jimp | (Also, disconnect, you can suck it.) |
| 15:39.05 | jimp | Yes, that is certainly the cause of both the dialer bug and the telnetd bug. |
| 15:39.15 | jimp | "cat /dev/console" on the device clearly shows everything that you type on the keyboard. |
| 15:39.55 | jimp | And init.c opens /dev/console and uses it if the open succeeds. |
| 15:39.57 | wastrel | so test in the dialer, touch a file on the file system |
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| 15:40.31 | jimp | wastrel: It's a little tricky because the keyboard mapping isn't right |
| 15:40.45 | jimp | so things like alt don't work, and I can't type a slash |
| 15:41.14 | jimp | HAHA |
| 15:41.22 | jimp | you can even type "reboot" at the lock screen, and it still reboots the phone. |
| 15:42.46 | wastrel | ok that is fun |
| 15:42.59 | *** part/#android Dougie187 (n=doug@wg-d232088.dsl.fsu.edu) |
| 15:43.05 | marcone | Finally someone figured it out. Too bad really. All that talk about the "magic telnetd" was quite entertaining. :) |
| 15:45.32 | wastrel | ok works for me in the dialer, not at the lock screen |
| 15:46.08 | jimp | Well, it's going to be finicky because you have multiple apps trying to read the keyboard at once, I suppose. |
| 15:46.12 | mattgyver83 | can you set a hostname for an android device? |
| 15:47.56 | jimp | mattgyver83: not that I'm aware |
| 15:48.57 | Tauno | sorry to disturb but but how can I change the divider color in ListView? setting android:divider= to something removes the divider completely |
| 15:49.09 | *** join/#android matt_c (n=mcroydon@gozur.sunflowerbroadband.com) |
| 15:49.14 | mattgyver83 | I tried creating a hostname file to put in /etc/ however the folder is read only, can i change that as root temporarily? |
| 15:49.52 | an_dev | can somebody explain me the steps to put my own application in the source code |
| 15:50.08 | Disconnect | mattgyver83: you'll still need to put the infrastructure in place (in the libc) to set/read the hostname |
| 15:50.12 | marcone | mattgyver83: what are you trying to achieve? Even if you could make your phone think it had a hostname that way (which I doubt), you still wouldn't be able to reach it by that name, because no DNS would know about it. |
| 15:50.15 | bloo | wakelocks r horrible and make me wanna cry |
| 15:54.06 | neekers | does tmobile assign the g1 some kind of dynamic ip behind thier proxy? |
| 15:54.11 | Disconnect | yes |
| 15:54.42 | offby1 | mine is usually 10.something |
| 15:54.57 | neekers | can you use a dynamic ip service to resolve the phone name? |
| 15:55.10 | Disconnect | its internal |
| 15:55.26 | jimp | wastrel: Aah, I know the reason for the unreliability: if you type a command like "cat" or anything else that doesn't return, the shell will just hang waiting for the process |
| 15:55.29 | jimp | so future input gets ignored. |
| 15:55.43 | jimp | That's why you need to do this stuff after reboot, in some cases. |
| 15:56.11 | pawalls | jimp, You're kinda barking up the wrong tree. |
| 15:56.27 | jimp | pawalls: explain |
| 15:56.29 | pawalls | jimp, The stuff in init.rc gets started through the "service" binary, which drops privs (among other things) |
| 15:56.53 | pawalls | At least.. presumably. So just because those services are started via init doesn't mean they continue running as root. |
| 15:56.53 | jimp | No, it's getting executed by the "init" binary. |
| 15:57.01 | pawalls | jimp, I'm aware of what "init.rc" does. |
| 15:57.14 | pawalls | jimp, I'm saying that they run "service" which is a separate (android specific) binary. |
| 15:57.17 | Disconnect | pawalls: there is a root shell running with uid 0 |
| 15:57.23 | Disconnect | and no children |
| 15:57.39 | jimp | pawalls: Check the source. The console command is not run through service or anything else. |
| 15:57.51 | Disconnect | (er, duh, root shell == uid 0 from the redundancy department of redundancy" but anyway..) root 26 1 724 208 c0049a2c afe0c4cc S /system/bin/sh |
| 15:57.55 | pawalls | Disconnect, I see that. |
| 15:58.03 | jimp | <PROTECTED> |
| 15:58.03 | jimp | <PROTECTED> |
| 15:58.04 | pawalls | I'm simply saying that because something is run by init doesn't mean it continues to run as init. |
| 15:58.10 | jimp | Clearly this shell was started before the service manager |
| 15:58.36 | pawalls | Also.. a process can fork() and exec() to reparent the process to init. |
| 15:58.46 | jimp | I should just stop arguing and find a channel with people willing to check the source. |
| 15:59.10 | jimp | pawalls: Here's the proof. |
| 15:59.15 | jimp | Load up your phone, get a shell. |
| 15:59.22 | jimp | Look at process list, notice /system/bin/sh running with UID=0. |
| 15:59.29 | mikez5 | some people think it is more fun to read objdump output than to use git to check out the source :-) |
| 15:59.31 | jimp | Now check /proc/26/fd and notice how its stdin is mapped to /dev/console. |
| 15:59.43 | jimp | Then use a root shell to verify that "cat /dev/console" shows all keyboard input. |
| 15:59.46 | jimp | Viola, I win. |
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| 16:00.34 | jbq | http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Viola |
| 16:00.43 | jimp | haha |
| 16:00.49 | pawalls | jimp, And what leads you to believe that the telnetd "exploit" has anything to do w/ that running sh binary? |
| 16:01.07 | jimp | pawalls: Damn, everyone's a critic today. Think about it. Any time you type any command, it gets executed as root by this shell. |
| 16:01.08 | jbq | jimp: (you actually meant "voila") |
| 16:01.12 | jimp | jbq: clearly :) |
| 16:01.32 | jimp | pawalls: It should be obvious that "pterminal" should not have access to even listen to a socket, let alone spawn a root sh. |
| 16:01.58 | *** join/#android eton (n=eton@ppp-58-8-6-142.revip2.asianet.co.th) |
| 16:04.41 | Disconnect | s/socket/reserved socket/ but yah. something there is weird. easy test though - does it work w/o pterminal or term? (can you just reboot, type it in and then connect or use pterminal to run ps.) |
| 16:04.58 | Disconnect | is more interested in hacking a working dropbear server right now |
| 16:05.06 | jimp | Disconnect: No, s/socket/socket/. Dammit, fuck, read the fucking kernel source and the Android-specific additions that prevent sockets from being opened without AID_INET capability. |
| 16:05.59 | Disconnect | so you're saying they gave that capability to "sh"? |
| 16:06.15 | jimp | No, they gave that capability to uid==0 or gid==AID_INET |
| 16:06.19 | jimp | And clearly, a root shell has uid==0. |
| 16:07.14 | Chainfire | jimp> I'm still confused about why telnetd would be executed by this running root sh when started from pTerminal, though |
| 16:07.54 | jimp | Chainfire: It's not related to pterminal. The running root sh picks up everything you type, so it just happens to pick up the same command (if you type it right) |
| 16:08.49 | blount | five points for gryffindor |
| 16:08.51 | jimp | Chainfire: That's why typing "/system/bin/telnetd" doesn't actually work -- the root terminal sees ".system.bin.telnetd" (no Alt mapping) so it fails to run it |
| 16:09.29 | Chainfire | so you can actually run any command as root without starting telnetd if you 'phrase' it correctly? |
| 16:09.29 | jimp | Chainfire: hence SplasPood's slightly incorrect conclusion that he needed to type "cd /system/bin" and "telnetd" as two separate commands |
| 16:10.07 | jimp | yeah! you're just a little limited by the lack of slash, so you can't (for example) just type "sh /sdcard/myscript" and have it execute |
| 16:11.06 | Chainfire | that is nifty |
| 16:11.27 | Chainfire | though they'll prolly fix it :( |
| 16:12.03 | jimp | Sure, but it's too late now, now that I have root access I won't let them patch my phone without inserting my own backdoor first. |
| 16:12.31 | bloo | i give eup i cant get my sms alert app working right |
| 16:12.31 | bloo | sigh |
| 16:13.05 | Chainfire | jimp> yeah but it'll suck for people who get a new device with a new update :D |
| 16:13.10 | Tauno | I'll give up.. can't change the color of dividers in a plain simple ListView |
| 16:13.15 | Ez-DvD | ffs...now it's complaining about finding java 2 runtime enviroment |
| 16:13.18 | jimp | Chainfire: Sure |
| 16:13.37 | Chainfire | so now... how do we fix it up to support the / ? |
| 16:13.43 | offby1 | Ez-DvD: I think the developers recommend Debian, not gentoo |
| 16:13.57 | *** part/#android an_dev (n=fkp021@host-208-68-238-61.biznesshosting.net) |
| 16:13.57 | marcone | Tauno: how did you try to change it? |
| 16:14.41 | Tauno | marcone, <Tauno>sorry to disturb but but how can I change the divider color in ListView? setting android:divider= to something removes the divider completely |
| 16:14.42 | Ez-DvD | ubuntu, and i'm on slackware |
| 16:14.46 | Chainfire | thx for all the info, btw, jimp :) |
| 16:14.50 | Ez-DvD | gives up and installs ubuntu |
| 16:14.58 | Ez-DvD | quad boot for the win! |
| 16:14.59 | *** join/#android ralpht (n=ralpht@c-71-198-176-227.hsd1.ca.comcast.net) |
| 16:15.17 | Tauno | android:divider="#FF00FF00" for example.. |
| 16:15.25 | *** join/#android Poohba (n=rcampbel@63.215.212.243) |
| 16:15.46 | marcone | the divider is a drawable. I don't know if simply putting a color should work |
| 16:15.57 | ralpht | yes, colors are drawables in the XML |
| 16:16.22 | ralpht | but not in some styles iirc |
| 16:16.37 | Tauno | android:divider - Drawable or color to draw between list items. May be a reference to another resource, in the form "@[+][package:]type:name" or to a theme attribute in the form "?[package:][type:]name". May be a color value, in the form of "#rgb", "#argb", "#rrggbb", or "#aarrggbb". |
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| 16:17.31 | Tauno | "May be a color value" <-- I understand that I can just use a color value there.. "#xxx".. |
| 16:17.43 | *** join/#android Jagger_7 (n=swiecki@193.142.125.1) |
| 16:17.44 | marcone | did you try setting it in code? (ListView.setDivider) |
| 16:17.50 | Tauno | will try |
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| 16:18.22 | trigatch4 | whats up people |
| 16:18.28 | trigatch4 | now logged on the web i see |
| 16:18.47 | trigatch4 | anything i say or do can be used against me in the robot law |
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| 16:24.55 | Tauno | btw android:divider="@drawable/solid_blue" and ... <drawable name="solid_blue">#0000ff</drawable> is not wokring also |
| 16:26.06 | *** join/#android lresende (n=luckbr19@63.85.187.2) |
| 16:26.28 | Tauno | setting it from code is also not working (((ListView)findViewById(R.id.listView)).setDivider(getResources().getDrawable(R.drawable.solid_blue));) |
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| 16:28.20 | Tauno | there has to be some simple thing that I miss.. |
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| 16:28.42 | Tauno | setting the divider height (((ListView)findViewById(R.id.listView)).setDividerHeight(20);) is also not helping |
| 16:29.44 | romainguy_ | you need to do both |
| 16:29.49 | romainguy_ | set the divider's drawable and set its height |
| 16:30.26 | marcone | weird. When I set the divider to a red drawable, and set the divider height to 2, I get a listview with a completely red background. |
| 16:30.56 | Tauno | romainguy_ I do.. 1st line sets height, 2nd one sets drawable |
| 16:31.03 | *** join/#android LordMetroid (n=lordmetr@90-224-91-70-no108.tbcn.telia.com) |
| 16:31.08 | romainguy_ | the other way around |
| 16:31.17 | Tauno | it .. matters? :) |
| 16:31.21 | romainguy_ | yes it does |
| 16:31.50 | LordMetroid | Android is a linux-distribution, I haven't really understood what it is... |
| 16:31.51 | LordMetroid | ? |
| 16:32.12 | Tauno | it worked.. kinda.. all the listview is blue now.. but it's 20px if i scroll it and then returns to all-blue |
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| 16:32.45 | Tauno | let me see if I can get it working from xml too.. |
| 16:34.04 | Tauno | nope.. android:divider="@drawable/solid_blue" android:dividerHeight="20px" is not working.. |
| 16:34.52 | LordMetroid | Is there any compilers for C or C++ to android? |
| 16:35.01 | wastrel | no |
| 16:35.11 | LordMetroid | So Java it is than? |
| 16:35.24 | SanMehat | yesh |
| 16:35.34 | wastrel | supposedly JNI works but you'd have to have a java shim to load your native code |
| 16:35.37 | LordMetroid | Alright, cool, I can live with that |
| 16:35.41 | Tauno | romainguy_ the order of color/height calls should be documented I guess... otherwise there will be more guys like me with tears in their eyes because they just spent 1 hour figuring the right order :) |
| 16:35.41 | plusminus_ | anyone knows a RemoteDesktop-Host sowtware ? |
| 16:35.50 | wastrel | but jni isn't supported and may break in upgrades |
| 16:35.57 | joakime | LordMetroid, http://mantrid.wordpress.com/2008/04/28/do-android-dream-of-something-more-than-java/ |
| 16:36.18 | Tauno | ..and I still can't get it working from XML :/ |
| 16:36.47 | wastrel | joakime: good link thx |
| 16:37.21 | joakime | wastrel, it's a bit dated, but still relevant to the question. |
| 16:37.33 | LordMetroid | Is there any figures on how many android phones that has been sold? |
| 16:37.41 | ahaberlacho | Yes. |
| 16:37.44 | DannyB | yes |
| 16:37.47 | DannyB | we have sold at least 1 phone |
| 16:37.54 | DannyB | san bought it |
| 16:37.58 | Chainfire | last number I saw was 2.5M |
| 16:38.19 | wastrel | damn |
| 16:38.19 | sgrabham | has anyone found an easy GUI tool for creating layouts for a GUI windows. is any thing for eclipse IDE. |
| 16:38.35 | joakime | wastrel, i found that link on the one about JNI (from 2007!!) - http://davanum.wordpress.com/2007/12/09/android-invoke-jni-based-methods-bridging-cc-and-java/ |
| 16:39.51 | RyeBrye | I don't think 2.5M is correct - I thought I saw T-mobile was expected to sell 600k by the end of 2008 |
| 16:39.54 | *** join/#android sjschultze (n=sjschult@dhcp-0000016245-96-bc.client.student.harvard.edu) |
| 16:39.56 | DannyB | i cried when i discovered how hard it is to make the UI seriously inconsistent |
| 16:40.00 | DannyB | WHY WOULD THEY DO THIS TO ME |
| 16:40.16 | RyeBrye | Yeah, didn't they learn a thing from swing's PLAF? |
| 16:40.46 | cbeust_ | As in: nobody uses the PLAF? |
| 16:40.50 | RyeBrye | :) |
| 16:41.00 | RyeBrye | Yeah, pretty much :) |
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| 16:41.56 | sjschultze | has anybody worked on making changes to the root filesystem on the phone and having them preserved on reboot? |
| 16:42.19 | Tauno | DannyB yeah, it's damn hard if you HAVE to do it but you can't just figure out how.. |
| 16:42.23 | LordMetroid | Alright, not as many units on the market as the iPhone yet... But will it be possible to make money off android software even though? |
| 16:42.35 | DannyB | why do you *have* to do it? |
| 16:42.46 | Tauno | I'm only a code monkey ;) |
| 16:42.57 | jimp | sjschultze: site seems down right now, but I think http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=442831 had some info on it |
| 16:43.12 | sgrabham | does anyone know if the USB interface can be used on the HTC G1, if so can someone give the url for source code. |
| 16:43.44 | jimp | sgrabham: used by what, for what? |
| 16:43.50 | sjschultze | did it involve editing a ramdisk stored somewhere in special memory or something along those lines? It seems like the root fs is being overwritten from an undisclosed location upon boot. |
| 16:44.08 | jimp | sgrabham: certainly it can be used as mass storage pretty easily, that's a built-in feature. as well as the adb stuff. |
| 16:44.21 | Disconnect | sjschultze: root is wiped during reboot. /system and /data are better. |
| 16:44.23 | jimp | sjschultze: Yeah, / itself should be an initramfs in the kernel image. |
| 16:44.42 | sgrabham | would like to use like a RS232 with hyperterm type of data input |
| 16:44.52 | sjschultze | Disconnect: right, but you have to change / if you want to change certain things like init.rc |
| 16:45.11 | ahaberlacho | Bluetooth Serial? |
| 16:45.12 | jimp | sgrabham: Hook a USB->serial gadget up to the G1? I'm not sure that's possible, does G1 have OTG? |
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| 16:45.18 | jimp | Bluetooth serial is a good idea. |
| 16:45.24 | Disconnect | yah :( the image is available tho iirc |
| 16:45.48 | Tauno | DannyB, there's not much room for me to say "hey, the app is all-green/yellow but I really can't change the divider color to match the overall design of the app.. and by the way the overall design is seriously inconsistent.." |
| 16:45.56 | sjschultze | Disconnect: available, like you can somehow access it on the device? |
| 16:46.01 | Disconnect | i believe so |
| 16:46.11 | sjschultze | hm, well that would be cool |
| 16:46.13 | sgrabham | I don't have a G1 yet so unsure, still using the SDK app |
| 16:46.38 | jimp | sjschultze: The initramfs is typically just a gzipped cpio archive tacked onto the end of the kernel. |
| 16:46.48 | jimp | You could pull the kernel out of flash, change that image, and flash it back. |
| 16:47.10 | sjschultze | ah, I haven't accessed flash at all, do tools exist? |
| 16:47.26 | jimp | Sure, cat /dev/mtdblock1 :) |
| 16:47.51 | sjschultze | heh |
| 16:47.52 | jimp | The post at xda-developers gives useful info, too bad the site's down at the moment |
| 16:48.18 | ralpht | so does anyone have mtdtools compiled against bionic? |
| 16:48.31 | jimp | Basically you can zero out a partition then use /system/bin/flash_image to write to it. |
| 16:48.56 | jimp | "cat /proc/mtd" to get partition names |
| 16:49.01 | Disconnect | jimp: there was a statement from google at one point that the bootloader checked kernel sig when booting (although that could be misinformation of course) .. anyone actually tried flashing a non-htc kernel yet? |
| 16:49.34 | jimp | Then, "cat /dev/zero > /dev/mtd2 ; flash_image boot mykernel.img" might do the trick |
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| 16:49.53 | jimp | Disconnect: I think that guy at the link successfully changed his recovery kernel |
| 16:50.00 | Disconnect | cool |
| 16:51.57 | Disconnect | oh and nail in the coffin for the "its not pid 26" people: look at the ppid of telnetd. (oops, its 26) (and yes, i just tried from the dialer successfully. cd system<CR>cd bin<CR>telnetd worked) |
| 16:52.59 | Disconnect | so there are two huge wtf's here.. first is wtf did they ship telnetd to begin with.. should have caught it in the rootfs audit. second is wtf did they allow it to run a root console? should have caught it in the process audit. both of which should have happened a long time before it went gold.. |
| 16:53.00 | d0nets | hey im looking at this guitar tuner source |
| 16:53.08 | d0nets | what do i do if theres stuff that isnt in the android library |
| 16:53.10 | cworth | jimp: Nice work. |
| 16:53.16 | cworth | jimp: One whopper of a bug here. |
| 16:53.36 | jimp | cworth: thanks, yeah, I'm still laughing about it |
| 16:53.42 | andyross | Is there a writeup for how that works? I'm still not clear on how telnetd gets its privilege elevation. (And to be fair, this still doesn't work for me, although I didn't spend any time on it last night) |
| 16:53.53 | Disconnect | d0nets: port it |
| 16:54.02 | d0nets | like in "MicrophoneAudioSource.java" , it has a bunch of "import.javax.sound.*'s |
| 16:54.04 | jimp | andyross: I figured it out before you joined |
| 16:54.06 | jimp | andyross: http://android.jim.sh/index.php/ConsoleShell |
| 16:54.14 | d0nets | like javax.sound.samplesd.AudoFormat; |
| 16:54.30 | Disconnect | andyross: i sum up. init spawns pid 26 /system/bin/sh as root. it listens to console (so it reads kb input but not alt/shift/etc). |
| 16:54.34 | d0nets | " ".AudioInputStream; |
| 16:54.44 | d0nets | " ". AudioSystem; |
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| 16:55.28 | Disconnect | andyross: so when you type "/system/bin/telnetd" it reads ".system.bin.telnetd" and nothing happens. but "cd system" "cd bin" "telnetd" all work. so even though the one int he terminal exits (its not forking, its exiting, no priv elevation) the one @ pid26 runs it. |
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| 16:55.55 | cworth | andyross: No real escalation at all. It's just getting launched by a root shell, (not by pterminal). |
| 16:55.57 | Disconnect | do it without terminal, too. try "cd .." a few times, then "cd system" "cd bin" "telnetd" from (eg) dialer. or a notepad app. |
| 16:56.04 | andyross | Oh, wait wait. You type it on the *phone* keyboard. I'd completely misunderstood this and was trying it from an adb shell |
| 16:56.12 | jimp | andyross: Yep |
| 16:56.26 | cworth | andyross: Right. Will never work from the adb shell. |
| 16:56.39 | cworth | (Which does explain how some people couldn't get the telnet thing to work.) |
| 16:56.51 | jimp | Also, for what it's worth, it's not possible for a rogue Android app to root your phone automatically (which was one of my concerns) |
| 16:57.05 | andyross | Yeah. I heard "just run /system/bin/telnetd" and figured I'd run it the only way I knew how. |
| 16:57.05 | cworth | jimp: Yeah. This is ideal, really. |
| 16:57.21 | cworth | A way for people with physical access to get root, but nobody else. |
| 16:57.32 | andyross | Which, frankly, is exactly what we want anyway. |
| 16:57.37 | cworth | (Barring social-engineering hacks to get people to type in funny things on the keyboard...) |
| 16:57.52 | wastrel | heh |
| 16:57.53 | andyross | And of course now I'm not on a wifi network so I can't test. Does telnetd listen on 127.0.0.1 by any chance? |
| 16:58.00 | wastrel | a typing tutor game |
| 16:58.35 | cworth | andyross: I heard someone say it does, but I haven't tested. |
| 16:58.39 | jimp | andryross - INADDR_ANY i presume |
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| 16:58.52 | cworth | wastrel: Ooh. You're evil. Think of the children learning to type! ;-) |
| 16:58.54 | andyross | There's an adb port forward, isn't there? |
| 16:59.04 | Disconnect | yes tcp 0 0 0.0.0.0:23 0.0.0.0:* LISTEN |
| 16:59.22 | DannyB | sigh |
| 16:59.25 | jimp | andyross: although you don't need telnetd. Make a shell script somewhere, then just type "cd .." "cd .." "cd data" "cd local" "sh script" |
| 16:59.38 | jimp | should work if all those keypresses make it to /dev/console cleanly |
| 16:59.47 | Disconnect | yah |
| 16:59.58 | Disconnect | explains reboot, too. you were prolly in /system/bin already. |
| 17:00.31 | pawalls | I imagine someone is already busy cross-compiling 'su' and dropping it (setuid 0) onto the system image. Having telnet running on an open network isn't exactly what I'd call "ideal". :-) |
| 17:00.59 | Disconnect | i'm working the other way - hacking the auth bits out of dropbear |
| 17:01.00 | andyross | bingo: "adb forward tcp:9988 tcp:23", "telnet localhost 9988" |
| 17:01.06 | andyross | I'm in :) |
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| 17:02.20 | *** join/#android mehulved (n=mehul@202.88.177.211) |
| 17:02.50 | Disconnect | cool |
| 17:03.17 | *** join/#android raidfive (n=adam@c-24-20-93-157.hsd1.wa.comcast.net) |
| 17:03.19 | cworth | jimp: So has anyone documented the simplest way to ensure root access doesn't magically disappear some day? |
| 17:03.37 | cworth | Say, like just disabling the auto-update or so. |
| 17:03.46 | Disconnect | cworth: move otakeys.zip out of /etc/security |
| 17:03.51 | Disconnect | and don't do manual flashing |
| 17:03.53 | andyross | Hard to ensure without a reflash of the boot loader. For a start, how about a setuid shell binary somewhere in /data |
| 17:03.54 | sjschultze | pawalls: busybox has sh |
| 17:04.05 | Disconnect | there might be another backdoor somewhere but thats the easy ones |
| 17:04.19 | Disconnect | andyross: /data is mounted nosuid |
| 17:04.27 | andyross | Ah, that's harder then :) |
| 17:04.41 | trigatch4 | anyone have an opinion on the "Anti-Virus" application that was announced? |
| 17:05.13 | d0nets | disconnect |
| 17:05.18 | d0nets | they are saying no java sound api |
| 17:05.24 | Disconnect | trigatch4: lol |
| 17:05.27 | Disconnect | d0nets: i'm not writing your app for you, go away. |
| 17:05.41 | d0nets | im not asking you to |
| 17:05.49 | cbeust_ | trigatch4: ask them what viruses they protect you from... |
| 17:05.53 | sjschultze | pwalls: also http://android-dls.com/forum/index.php?f=20&t=158&rb_v=viewtopic |
| 17:05.56 | d0nets | http://code.google.com/p/android/issues/detail?id=60#makechanges |
| 17:07.03 | wastrel | sweet |
| 17:07.20 | jimp | anyway, i'm heading out, later guys |
| 17:07.28 | raidfive | Does anyone know if you can embed GPS info in pictures taken using the Camera API ? |
| 17:07.57 | danfuzz | fwiw, the shipping camera app does just that, i'm pretty sure |
| 17:08.41 | raidfive | yea I noticed that |
| 17:08.49 | Disconnect | raidfive: it can i believe, but it doesn't seem to have as much success as i'd like (nokia betalabs had an app to do that that spoiled me - better about remembering locations, lit up for a gps fix as soon as you open the camera, etc) |
| 17:08.50 | raidfive | that is why I am asking about the API |
| 17:08.56 | danfuzz | recommends you refer to the source |
| 17:10.18 | danfuzz | two possible outcomes: (a) you will discover it uses something in the public API, in which case you can just use it. (b) you will discover that it uses non-public API in which case you would be advised to file a bug to get it finalized for public consumption |
| 17:10.28 | SplasPood | win goto 2 |
| 17:11.49 | streeter | I figured out why I couldn't get any internet access. tmob forgot to put the data plan on my phone |
| 17:11.55 | danfuzz | oops |
| 17:12.10 | wastrel | streeter: were you able to get gmail/calendar? |
| 17:12.11 | danfuzz | didn't leave the store until he verified data was working |
| 17:12.14 | SplasPood | wow so *thats* why it runs as root |
| 17:12.16 | SplasPood | lolz! |
| 17:12.57 | cworth | 1. "boot phone" 2. open keyboard 3. type "telnetd" |
| 17:13.08 | streeter | wastrel: I'm not sure. I think that was only working when I was WiFi connected |
| 17:13.09 | cworth | That really is the funniest thing. |
| 17:13.39 | cworth | And much easier than installing pterminal, etc. |
| 17:14.03 | streeter | danfuzz: ordered mine online. they don't show up in the stores here til the 15th (that's when we're supposed to get 3G) |
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| 17:14.15 | danfuzz | ah righto |
| 17:14.31 | SplasPood | yea |
| 17:14.32 | SplasPood | this is a riot |
| 17:14.47 | andyross | So who's crawled around the root environment so far? Is the /system device reflashable, for example? There are device files for two flash partitions that aren't mounted. What's in them? Are they reflashable? etc... I have more questions than I have time to investigate myself. |
| 17:14.49 | raidfive | Can I browse the source code online or do I have to download it? |
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| 17:14.55 | RyeBrye | andyross - yes, it is |
| 17:15.23 | danfuzz | browse source: <http://git.source.android.com> |
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| 17:15.30 | Chainfire | andyross> http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=442831 |
| 17:15.36 | cworth | andyross: There's a forum post with flashing instructions and a brief mention of each partition. That should get put into the wiki. |
| 17:15.38 | raidfive | thanks danfuzz |
| 17:15.40 | Chainfire | documents the flashing... |
| 17:15.43 | Chainfire | but xda is down right now. |
| 17:15.51 | danfuzz | though it's so easy to download that i'd recommend going that route |
| 17:15.54 | andyross | Which explains why that link you posted doesn't work :) |
| 17:16.06 | danfuzz | then you can use all your happy local tools. (grep is my friend) |
| 17:16.15 | trigatch4 | jasta: you around? |
| 17:16.20 | jasta | yes |
| 17:16.28 | trigatch4 | k gonna MSG you |
| 17:17.15 | Chainfire | andyross> xda is not normally down for more than an hour when it goes down... so just save the link somewhere and try later :) |
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| 17:18.09 | chx | hello world. anyone tried running a LAMP stack on the G1? |
| 17:18.10 | RyeBrye | Chainfire - there is a caveat emptor about the dumping of the partitions via mtd - we need to made damn sure that it dumps everything you'd need to recover it... and if you are trying to recover that it actually works... (i.e. no problems if there are bad blocks that don't line up... etc) |
| 17:18.36 | RyeBrye | I wont run MySQL on my phone any time soon |
| 17:18.45 | Disconnect | chx: you should do it, it'll rock. first you have to port apache to java. then you have to port over php. and finally, you need to port mysql.. |
| 17:19.15 | Chainfire | chx> waiting for your download :D |
| 17:19.15 | joelone | Did anybody build an hello-world using prebuilt toolchain successfully? Got some issue with the PATH setting:http://fpaste.org/paste/8625 |
| 17:19.35 | chx | uh oh |
| 17:19.36 | Chainfire | RyeBrye true that... but give it a bit of time... :) |
| 17:19.50 | RyeBrye | Right |
| 17:20.21 | RyeBrye | Anyone know how to dump the ram out of the pmem /dev devices? dd if=/dev/pmem of=/sdcard/dump fails... |
| 17:22.23 | cworth | joelone: printf hello, world? Yes. |
| 17:22.31 | mikez5 | wonders who will be first to brick their phone |
| 17:22.49 | cworth | joelone: I put notes on that here: |
| 17:22.52 | cworth | http://android.jim.sh/index.php/Cross_Compilation |
| 17:23.00 | andyross | joelone: it's much more complicated than that. The prebuilt tools don't integrate with bionic, you need to specify a ton of custom include and linker options to make them work. There's a wrapper script I wrote at http://plausible.org/andy/agcc which works for me. Not terribly easy though. |
| 17:23.04 | cworth | (Thanks to anyross for the agcc script that does the hard stuff.) |
| 17:23.10 | joelone | Thanks cworth. |
| 17:23.16 | cworth | andyross even |
| 17:23.20 | andyross | Oh, heh. Apparently it's already linked :) Never mind. |
| 17:23.29 | cworth | andyross: We try! ;-) |
| 17:23.30 | joelone | thx andross 2 ;/ |
| 17:24.37 | andyross | Note that this is a hack: the right solution is to build a toolchain for a new "arm-eabi-bionic" target that understands all of this stuff. No doubt that's on google's plate for the upcoming native SDK... |
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| 17:25.06 | *** part/#android chx (n=chx@drupal.org/user/9446/view) |
| 17:25.36 | andyross | And I didn't spend much time figuring out what's important. Lots of those options are probably chaff (like special warning flags -- if they don't complain for the bionic headers, they can be dropped). |
| 17:26.22 | joelone | Yes, try to build a NDK before, but the hello-world compiled with my NDK didn't work on emulator. |
| 17:26.55 | joelone | So I try to compile it with prebuilt one |
| 17:27.21 | andyross | That's because the C library for Android isn't glibc, or even uclibc. It doesn't even use the standard ld-linux runtime linker. |
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| 17:28.19 | cworth | rewrites that wiki page for a bit more clarity |
| 17:28.36 | cworth | andyross: Feel free to add your ideas for an arm-eabi-bionic target there |
| 17:28.45 | joelone | In the prebuilt toolchain folder, it said The objects in this prebuilt directory can be rebuilt using the source archive android-toolchain-20081019.tar.bz2 |
| 17:28.51 | joelone | The objects in this prebuilt directory can be rebuilt |
| 17:28.52 | joelone | using the source archive |
| 17:28.52 | joelone | android-toolchain-20081019.tar.bz2 |
| 17:29.09 | joelone | hosted at <http://android.kernel.org/pub/> |
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| 17:30.16 | bloo | so who wants to hire me? |
| 17:30.31 | ionstorm | what is the key combo to reboot |
| 17:30.34 | joelone | If we don't have the toolchain with bionic libc, how can we write JNI? |
| 17:30.45 | marcone | bloo: depends. What do you do? |
| 17:30.46 | andyross | You can't |
| 17:30.53 | joelone | Does JNI work without bionic libc? |
| 17:30.57 | andyross | No |
| 17:30.57 | bloo | engineer software! |
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| 17:31.46 | marcone | me too! |
| 17:31.55 | Chainfire | what a coincidence! |
| 17:32.05 | fadden0 | So much in common. |
| 17:33.16 | ahaberlacho | Amazing! |
| 17:33.47 | *** join/#android yacoob (n=yacoob@hell.pl) |
| 17:36.21 | *** join/#android charlesnw (n=charlesn@12.46.70.2) |
| 17:37.21 | kRutOn | I engineer new planets. |
| 17:37.53 | kRutOn | Anyone have a terraforming project they want to hire me for? |
| 17:38.12 | marcone | no, but you can tile my living room floor for me |
| 17:38.27 | *** join/#android jerkface03 (n=jerkface@S0106000d3a2c0806.vc.shawcable.net) |
| 17:38.29 | kRutOn | close enough |
| 17:38.41 | marcone | come to think of it, my front yard could use some terraforming |
| 17:38.47 | cworth | backs up each flash partition, sets otacerts.zip aside, and goes out for the day |
| 17:38.49 | cworth | Thanks all. |
| 17:39.11 | Disconnect | joelone: look at the mandelbrot zoomer app, it uses jni and works on the device |
| 17:39.17 | kRutOn | marcone: If we place a volcano in the back, we can save energy since you won't need to mow the lawn or clean the house. |
| 17:43.00 | bloo | i cant figure out how the api demo for a non full screen activity works |
| 17:43.01 | marcone | kRutOn: I'd appreciate it if you could put the volcano in my neighbor's yard. As close to their house as possible. |
| 17:43.38 | SanMehat | is glad he doesnt live near marcone |
| 17:44.04 | marcone | bloo: what do you mean? |
| 17:44.45 | bloo | like i dont see whats making it not full screen |
| 17:45.07 | bloo | the layout is one textview |
| 17:45.45 | bloo | <PROTECTED> |
| 17:45.45 | bloo | <PROTECTED> |
| 17:45.47 | bloo | but somehow its a default theme and not fullscreen |
| 17:45.49 | *** join/#android vbabiy (n=vbabiy@rrcs-24-97-148-190.nys.biz.rr.com) |
| 17:45.57 | *** join/#android mattgyver83 (n=wurd_pla@pool-71-252-27-32.washdc.east.verizon.net) |
| 17:45.58 | mattgyver83 | #ubuntu |
| 17:46.39 | thoraxe | ok got my phone replaced |
| 17:46.43 | thoraxe | screen was definitely dead |
| 17:47.02 | Disconnect | cool |
| 17:47.15 | unix_lappy | how long is the warranty on the G1's, a year? |
| 17:47.46 | thoraxe | i guess, i was still within t-mobile's 14-day "buyer's remorse" window |
| 17:47.48 | marcone | bloo: it's because the Activity's theme is set to look like a dialog. That makes it not fullscreen. Look in the AndroidManifest.xml for android:theme="@style/Theme.CustomDialog" |
| 17:47.50 | thoraxe | so they just did an exchange |
| 17:47.56 | andyross | bloo: I'm not an expert on the UI-level stuff, but fullscreenness is a property of the window object, not the activity or view. |
| 17:48.20 | marcone | actually, it *is* a property of the Activity in this case |
| 17:48.43 | unix_lappy | thoraxe: hmm. |
| 17:48.53 | *** join/#android bszabo (n=bszabo@ip72-208-41-138.ph.ph.cox.net) |
| 17:49.00 | bloo | oh marcone thanks you are a genius |
| 17:49.15 | *** join/#android aquarist_2006 (n=zy@host-208-68-238-61.biznesshosting.net) |
| 17:49.17 | andyross | No, I mean in code. The Activity contains a Window, which has flags that control size. I'm sure there's a way to do it in the resource XML, I'm just talking about where I'd start looking if I had to answer the question. |
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| 17:54.02 | Disconnect | yay! most of the way to working dropbear. connections work, auth works. just gotta clean up the session creation. |
| 17:54.07 | Disconnect | exit after auth (root): couldn'tchange user as non-root |
| 17:55.22 | *** join/#android LordMetroid (n=lordmetr@90-224-93-243-no108.tbcn.telia.com) |
| 17:55.28 | bloo | someone wants my sms screen alert to have the option to stay on indefinately |
| 17:56.35 | bloo | i dont understand the reasoning behind it |
| 17:56.38 | Disconnect | thats not a terrible idea if it also beeps/notifies periodically |
| 17:56.54 | Disconnect | bloo: its 3am, your pager just went off. you wake up and the screen is off so you go back to sleep... |
| 17:56.59 | *** join/#android mocsrox (n=wliu@user-64-9-236-176.googlewifi.com) |
| 17:57.05 | bloo | indefinately means goodbye battery |
| 17:57.16 | RyeBrye | indefinitely if plugged in? |
| 17:57.17 | bloo | you can set it to 99 seconds awake though |
| 17:57.29 | bloo | maybe if plugged in is a good idea |
| 17:57.32 | bloo | rye, thanks! |
| 17:59.13 | bloo | i thought there was an option to do that though in settings, maybe just flick that on or off? |
| 17:59.34 | Disconnect | wooooohooo working ssh! |
| 17:59.35 | dgilmore | is there anyway on a G1 to get a serial console from the bootloader? |
| 17:59.47 | sjschultze | Disconnect: nice, tunnel time |
| 17:59.49 | Disconnect | passwd is hardcoded and it drops you to uid2000 (but thats what suid shell is for..) |
| 18:00.13 | mikez5 | dgilmore: yes with a special cable. But it is probably disabled in the production bootloader. |
| 18:00.34 | *** part/#android mwester (n=mwester@nslu2-linux/mwester) |
| 18:00.49 | sjschultze | so can someone help me with this one... feeling stupid but can't figure out what I'm doing wrong: |
| 18:00.51 | sjschultze | # busybox mount /dev/block/mtdblock1 /system/flashmount |
| 18:00.51 | dgilmore | mikez5: :( ok. mine is dead. |
| 18:00.51 | sjschultze | mount: mounting /dev/block/mtdblock1 on /system/flashmount failed: Invalid argument |
| 18:01.13 | dgilmore | i was hoping to see if i could get some debug info before it goes back |
| 18:01.22 | LordMetroid | $25 to get on the android market... yeewww |
| 18:01.33 | P2E | LordMetroid: how so? |
| 18:01.33 | LordMetroid | Does it costs to get on to the iPhone market as well? |
| 18:01.44 | RyeBrye | It costs your soul, from what I remember |
| 18:01.52 | P2E | oh, do you mean to get your application onto? |
| 18:01.53 | Disconnect | sjschultze: fs type? |
| 18:01.57 | LordMetroid | I see, than $25 don't seem so bad all of a sudden |
| 18:02.11 | Disconnect | sjschultze: if you have busybox installed run 'dmesg' |
| 18:02.12 | andyross | I hear Windows Mobile takes your first born child. |
| 18:02.20 | RyeBrye | Yeah. The soul thing is burried under page 103,387,989 of the NDA Apple has to develop on the iPhone |
| 18:02.46 | andyross | To be fair: the iPhone mess has apparently cleaned up a lot in the wake of the G1 release. Competition is a good thing. |
| 18:02.53 | mikez5 | dgilmore: did it die from natural causes, or doing fun stuff as root? |
| 18:03.05 | andyross | Disconnect: there's a dmesg on the phone already, no need for busybox for that |
| 18:03.19 | sjschultze | [ 4682.710289] msm_nand_read_oob: unsupported ops->len, 512 |
| 18:03.19 | sjschultze | [ 4682.710900] end_request: I/O error, dev mtdblock1, sector 0 |
| 18:03.19 | sjschultze | [ 4682.713606] FAT: unable to read boot sector |
| 18:03.19 | sjschultze | [ 4682.715223] yaffs: dev is 32505857 name is "mtdblock1" |
| 18:03.20 | sjschultze | [ 4682.715773] yaffs: passed flags "" |
| 18:03.20 | sjschultze | [ 4682.716597] yaffs: Attempting MTD mount on 31.1, "mtdblock1" |
| 18:03.21 | sjschultze | [ 4682.717115] yaffs: auto selecting yaffs2 |
| 18:03.23 | sjschultze | [ 4682.742507] yaffs: dev is 32505857 name is "mtdblock1" |
| 18:03.25 | sjschultze | [ 4682.742507] yaffs: passed flags "" |
| 18:03.27 | sjschultze | [ 4682.742507] yaffs: Attempting MTD mount on 31.1, "mtdblock1" |
| 18:03.29 | sjschultze | sorry for the flood |
| 18:03.31 | Disconnect | sjschultze: no no no no nono no no nono no |
| 18:03.36 | Disconnect | www.pastebin.ca |
| 18:03.46 | sjschultze | check |
| 18:03.55 | Disconnect | and mtdblock1 might not be a fat or yaffs partition |
| 18:03.59 | dgilmore | mikez5: it died while i was viewing a photo id taken |
| 18:04.30 | LordMetroid | Hmm, maybe one should develop some software for Android... |
| 18:04.31 | dgilmore | mikez5: right after that the home app locked up. |
| 18:04.33 | bloo | anyone interested in a quick launcher like quicksilver on the pc/osx |
| 18:04.47 | andyross | The "unsupported ops->len, 512" error kinda sounds to me like a driver configuration issue. Trying a hard drive block size on a flash device maybe doesn't work? Is there a mount option that specifies block size? |
| 18:04.56 | dgilmore | mikez5: then on reboot home locked up. now i get just the backlight on |
| 18:05.06 | dgilmore | mikez5: im guessing the nand failed |
| 18:05.36 | P2E | so, speaking of all of this fun terminal business |
| 18:05.51 | ahaberlacho | LordMetroid++ |
| 18:05.53 | P2E | all I have is pterminal, is there a better option without being a developer |
| 18:06.02 | sjschultze | yes, Term.apk |
| 18:06.08 | *** join/#android schmylan (n=schmylan@38.114.107.1) |
| 18:06.26 | P2E | ok. where can I get it? |
| 18:06.33 | sjschultze | http://android-dls.com/forum/index.php?p=431&rb_v=viewtopic#p431 |
| 18:06.40 | dgilmore | wants to be able to run the phone as a wifi ap. and share out the net connection with the laptop |
| 18:06.43 | P2E | enable unknown apps, drag and drop it anywhere special? |
| 18:06.54 | neerhaj | Disconnect: ssh working ? |
| 18:06.58 | Disconnect | yep |
| 18:06.59 | sjschultze | nope, it should just work |
| 18:07.16 | sjschultze | *(reply to P2E) |
| 18:07.22 | neerhaj | where do u blog ? |
| 18:07.27 | Disconnect | i don't |
| 18:07.31 | P2E | ok. but in terms of getting it onto the phone, just the root of the sdcard, or? |
| 18:07.50 | neerhaj | Disconnect: mind sharing the steps ? |
| 18:07.53 | sjschultze | you can go to the url on the phone, download the apk, and then click on it from the downloads and tell it to install |
| 18:08.00 | andyross | Or just "adb install" |
| 18:08.02 | sjschultze | but yes, probably save to root of sdcard first |
| 18:08.13 | Disconnect | just had to hack auth to death. i'll post a bin later today prolly. |
| 18:08.40 | sjschultze | so anyone have any other clues for filesystem types I should try for mounting mtdblock1? |
| 18:08.54 | sjschultze | I'm using busybox mount... dunno what all it supports |
| 18:08.55 | Disconnect | its probably a data area, or the kenrel. |
| 18:09.01 | Disconnect | in fact, its almost certainly the kenrnel |
| 18:09.03 | Disconnect | kernel |
| 18:10.06 | Disconnect | and its not about what mount supports, its about what the kernel supports (cat /proc/filesystems) |
| 18:10.06 | sjschultze | ah, so trying to mount that is like trying to mount lilo? Am I getting the analogy correct? |
| 18:11.17 | *** join/#android jexe_ (n=jesseboy@static-64-115-213-78.isp.broadviewnet.net) |
| 18:11.24 | Disconnect | close enough |
| 18:11.30 | Disconnect | more like /boot/vmlinuz but sure |
| 18:11.34 | sjschultze | right |
| 18:12.04 | sjschultze | and we don't have a lilo-like tool for updating the partition, I'm assuming |
| 18:12.19 | *** join/#android Laz (n=Laz1@28.184.119.70.cfl.res.rr.com) |
| 18:13.02 | Disconnect | its not a partition. if you want an analogy to normal linux, its /boot/vmlinuz (a file) and /boot/init.rd (a file) smooshed together. the bootloader (mtdblock0 most likely) loads it and runs the kernel. |
| 18:13.10 | spikebike | heh |
| 18:13.29 | spikebike | I just tested my g1 bandwidth on wifi |
| 18:13.32 | spikebike | 6mbit ;-) |
| 18:13.34 | *** join/#android Yeggstry (n=mind@cpc1-rdng14-0-0-cust946.winn.cable.ntl.com) |
| 18:13.38 | RyeBrye | the bootloader isn't mtdblock0 - the bootloader config is in mtdblock0 but we can't see the bootloader |
| 18:13.42 | *** join/#android neerhaj (i=chatzill@203.115.94.253) |
| 18:13.49 | RyeBrye | it's in it's own little world |
| 18:14.14 | andyross | FWIW, it's entirely possible that the first-stage bootloader runs on the baseband core. |
| 18:15.29 | sjschultze | I see, so we could potentially flash mtdblock1 and when xda-developers comes back up maybe that thread will have the instructions |
| 18:15.57 | Disconnect | except chances are at least decent that bootloader will look for signed kernel |
| 18:16.16 | spikebike | maybe |
| 18:16.28 | spikebike | I'd be happy to be able to have an unsigned initrd ;-) |
| 18:16.55 | andyross | Although if we can reflash /system, all that needs to happen is (1) never accept an OTA update, (2) someone caches the update file and repacks a "with root" /system image, (3) the hacker public reflashes with that instead. |
| 18:17.29 | spikebike | that would be cool |
| 18:17.30 | sjschultze | spikebike: yes, agreed |
| 18:17.37 | andyross | So it might not be possible to recover a phone that's been updated to a fixed version, but features *in* those updates should still be accessible. At least as long as the update files continue to be unencrypted zips -- they could change that too, of course. |
| 18:17.50 | Disconnect | ..maybe we shouldn't give them ideas? |
| 18:17.54 | spikebike | heh |
| 18:17.57 | Disconnect | no matter how badly they need them. |
| 18:18.04 | andyross | They're smart enough to figure that out on their own. Google, remember? :) |
| 18:18.11 | spikebike | well I don't think google wants to lock it down more than necessary, after all the source is open |
| 18:18.19 | spikebike | tmo on the other hand |
| 18:18.19 | Disconnect | i've got a semi-private channel here and i'll set up an invite-only forum later if needed |
| 18:18.45 | Disconnect | andyross: erm. they made 4 -huge- unforgivable security errors on this thing. lets not do their security consulting for them... |
| 18:18.47 | spikebike | denying update checks should be relatively eas |
| 18:19.21 | andyross | Some very smart people have made "unforgivable" security errors. It just happens. All the time, in fact. Whole-system security is insanely hard. |
| 18:19.25 | spikebike | the kernel has iptables |
| 18:19.34 | spikebike | heh, yeah, not to mention they were kinda rushed |
| 18:19.41 | mikez5 | My personal opinion is: 1) we don't want remote exploits that could be used by malicious apps or web sites, and 2) a lot of people bricking their phones and trying to return them at the TMo store. |
| 18:19.56 | RyeBrye | I agree |
| 18:19.58 | spikebike | ya |
| 18:20.01 | RyeBrye | If I brick my phone, I'd not return it |
| 18:20.04 | Disconnect | "What files should we include?" "What daemons are running?" .. super core things that should have been done -months- before the release. probably even before any engineering devices went out to non-google employees.. |
| 18:20.07 | RyeBrye | I'd have my wife do it |
| 18:20.09 | RyeBrye | jokes |
| 18:20.16 | spikebike | on the other hand a few risks to allow reflashing /system would be worth it |
| 18:20.18 | Disconnect | "Does this security policy allow for basic use cases?" (such as backups) |
| 18:21.23 | bloo | apps should support a backup_intent maybe |
| 18:21.34 | bloo | and restore |
| 18:21.37 | ahaberlacho | My wife would get annoyed pretty quick if I asked her to take my device back to T-Mo to get it fixed. :) |
| 18:21.38 | andyross | Disconnect: the bug here was almost unavoidable. The system starts with a shell, and that shell reads from the console. Duh. Someone else wired up the console code, and figured that it should read from the keyboard. Again, duh. Those are no brainers in most circumstances -- it's actually hard to imagine a security audit that *would* catch this.l |
| 18:21.39 | RyeBrye | Isn't is already confirmed that the telnetd thing is not an exploit that can be exploited remotely? |
| 18:22.12 | Disconnect | andyross: a simple list of what is running after boot should have caught that. "whats this shell doing running as root? it has no children." |
| 18:22.40 | joelone | I'm back, thanks Disconnect |
| 18:22.46 | RyeBrye | It's not a bug, it's a feature! |
| 18:23.02 | andyross | Isn't that shell the init process? Maybe not, I haven't checked. |
| 18:23.05 | RyeBrye | I like being able to type "reboot" while android is pulsing :) |
| 18:23.16 | *** part/#android andreaf (n=andrea@82.112.213.98) |
| 18:23.37 | wastrel | you like to play with your pulsing android |
| 18:23.43 | brocktice | oi |
| 18:23.48 | *** part/#android bszabo (n=bszabo@ip72-208-41-138.ph.ph.cox.net) |
| 18:24.00 | *** join/#android jexe_ (n=jesseboy@static-64-115-213-78.isp.broadviewnet.net) |
| 18:24.05 | andyross | But again: this exact problem (i.e. boot your linux box to single user mode) isn't considered a "security" flaw on desktop computers because no one looks at the person sitting at the console as a threat. That model changes in the mobile world, and this just slipped through. |
| 18:24.12 | Disconnect | has done embedded-linux security audits before. The basics like that don't take any time at all and prevent a LOT of problems later. |
| 18:24.25 | *** join/#android malcolm_ (n=malcom@151.65.89.133) |
| 18:24.44 | RyeBrye | Most embedded devices have some kind of exploit on the first revision |
| 18:24.48 | Disconnect | andyross: that shell is parented by init (regardless of how its started, although pid 27 or 26 means its probably started by init..) and has no children |
| 18:25.24 | Disconnect | either way. i'm just suggesting that if you want to -keep- root on your devices, perhaps its not the best idea to be pointing out all the things google/tmob could do to close it out. |
| 18:25.27 | SplasPood | this ACTION blah stuff is... BLAH |
| 18:25.57 | RyeBrye | Agreed. No more trying to prove you are smarter than google by saying how you would mess with us all |
| 18:26.06 | Chainfire | well one could argue that reminding them again and again may eventually allow them to just do it out-of-the-box? |
| 18:26.10 | andyross | Again, google engineers are plenty smart enough to figure this out on their own. Exploit engineering that relies on stupid upstream developers is fragile. :) |
| 18:26.31 | RyeBrye | True |
| 18:26.37 | Disconnect | woohoo my dbclient works also |
| 18:26.46 | SplasPood | I agree with andy here.. |
| 18:26.57 | Disconnect | andyross: sure. but why help? |
| 18:27.10 | RyeBrye | dbclient is part of the normal android build - they just rename it "ssh" - but it sits in the external directory |
| 18:27.18 | RyeBrye | (not on the phone, but in the open source build) |
| 18:27.32 | Chainfire | where's the phone build, btw? |
| 18:27.38 | Disconnect | there are a bunch of simple ways to prevent this from happening (and even close off the hole thats there) but i'm not planning on giving them a roadmap. (at least not w/o an eng device to play with myself..) |
| 18:27.51 | *** part/#android an_dev (n=fih\paya@host-208-68-238-61.biznesshosting.net) |
| 18:28.04 | Disconnect | RyeBrye: yah but i was concerned that this one would be broken since i had to hack on dropbear to get sshd working. its not broken, so i'm happy. |
| 18:28.06 | *** join/#android BBHoss (n=bbhoss@c-68-62-170-33.hsd1.al.comcast.net) |
| 18:28.18 | RyeBrye | Disconnect - that's good |
| 18:30.11 | Disconnect | should prolly see if public key auth can be used in any reasonable way. but first, lunch |
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| 18:38.20 | anno^da_ | Godód evening |
| 18:38.22 | anno^da_ | Good |
| 18:38.24 | anno^da_ | :-) |
| 18:38.28 | anno^da_ | Could someone extend the email app with a possibility to use GnuPG for email encryption? :-) |
| 18:40.09 | bloo | ok so i have a slight problem and it probably comes from a lack of knowledge about how activities work |
| 18:40.25 | bloo | im doing startactivity, and i run the activity |
| 18:40.36 | bloo | but now whenever i hit the keyboard shortcut to my software |
| 18:40.43 | bloo | the activity i ran pops up |
| 18:40.51 | bloo | instead of my program |
| 18:41.19 | digitalspaghetti | so guys, i'm trying to still understand some stuff about android |
| 18:41.55 | digitalspaghetti | for example, can i write a app that ties into the browser, and when you hold your finger on the page, it can bring up a Share menu (i.e. delicious, magnolia, reddit, etc) |
| 18:42.03 | digitalspaghetti | would that be an intent? |
| 18:43.27 | *** join/#android ionstorm (n=ion@75-171-7-42.phnx.qwest.net) |
| 18:43.45 | ionstorm | what wifi chipset is used on the g1 |
| 18:44.00 | *** join/#android andyross (n=andy@static-71-245-107-194.ptldor.fios.verizon.net) |
| 18:45.27 | digitalspaghetti | ionstorm: http://androidcommunity.com/t-mobile-g1-gets-dissected-20081031/ |
| 18:45.39 | digitalspaghetti | doesn't say there, but the link might have more info |
| 18:45.41 | joelone | Hi andyross, could take a look at this? http://fpaste.org/paste/8629 |
| 18:46.02 | joelone | I got some error msg by using agcc |
| 18:48.00 | thoraxe | is there an ipsec vpn client yet? :) |
| 18:48.17 | andyross | Your input source file seems to be named "hello", not "hello.o" or "hello.c". |
| 18:48.34 | LordMetroid | Hmm, google only produced the OS and not the phone itself, how's that going to play out in the future, I fear the OS will not have as good levy as the iPhone has |
| 18:48.50 | thoraxe | LordMetroid: how does Windows play out? |
| 18:48.55 | Disconnect | thoraxe: i'll prolly do openvpn once i get a cross toolchain that talks to bionic instead of just building everything static |
| 18:49.00 | Disconnect | thoraxe: ..poorly |
| 18:49.13 | thoraxe | Disconnect: yes, but you're overlooking the point |
| 18:49.21 | P2E | random non-development question, does anyone have any good leads on getting my vcards in from my other phone? |
| 18:49.21 | thoraxe | the operating system is just the standard around which hardware can be produced |
| 18:49.38 | thoraxe | linux, windows, macos (to some degree) -- they don't relaly have anything to do with the hardware |
| 18:49.47 | thoraxe | that hasn't stopped awesome hardware from coming out |
| 18:49.49 | LordMetroid | thoraxe: Of course that OS is going strong but it is another kind of market, users decide on that and not the mobile phone producers |
| 18:50.02 | thoraxe | LordMetroid: and users don't decide on mobile phones now? |
| 18:50.02 | ionstorm | damn that link has nothing about the g1 wifi chipset |
| 18:50.13 | LordMetroid | Of course they do |
| 18:50.25 | thoraxe | so what's your point? |
| 18:50.51 | LordMetroid | But from a user perspective the phone and OS is not seperate like it is in windows and the PC-system |
| 18:50.54 | thoraxe | think about it this way -- android allows mobilephone manufacturers to concentrate on hardware development instead of hardware AND software development, so it saves them a ton of money |
| 18:51.13 | thoraxe | LordMetroid: from the user perpective for 90+% of computer users the OS is not separate |
| 18:51.53 | digitalspaghetti | plus you don't need to write games and apps that target variations in the java vm for mobile |
| 18:51.56 | jimp | ionstorm: It's a TI 1251. Check the source. |
| 18:52.04 | digitalspaghetti | you have one, standard, java platform that you can sell on |
| 18:52.23 | LordMetroid | digitalspaghetti: that is indeed a beneficial aspect of it all |
| 18:52.38 | digitalspaghetti | so the choice in device actually becomes the primary focus for a customer |
| 18:52.50 | digitalspaghetti | because it'll be the choice of asthetics and comfort |
| 18:53.35 | *** join/#android Dougie187 (n=doug@wg-d232088.dsl.fsu.edu) |
| 18:53.56 | *** join/#android macboz (n=kozen@n058152114174.netvigator.com) |
| 18:54.07 | digitalspaghetti | for me it was a simple choice - I am not a mac user, I am open source and use google applications to handle my main email - so the google OS swung me |
| 18:54.21 | LordMetroid | mmm |
| 18:54.48 | digitalspaghetti | the hardware i didn't care about so much, but having touch screen and gps are nice |
| 18:54.56 | LordMetroid | Do complex games have a market for mobile phone markets or is it mainly puzzleish games that sell? |
| 18:55.16 | bloo | mainly puzzlish and rpgs |
| 18:55.17 | digitalspaghetti | but in the end, most customers won't care except if it can take photos and play music, as well as act as a phone |
| 18:55.18 | bloo | i think |
| 18:55.40 | digitalspaghetti | LordMetroid: Nokia tried with the nGage - that didn't work out well for them |
| 18:55.52 | bloo | anyway to disable home key or absorb it? |
| 18:56.00 | LordMetroid | nGage was a total flop |
| 18:56.01 | RyeBrye | bloo - toddler lock does |
| 18:56.10 | digitalspaghetti | but i think the power wasn't there - moore's law dictates that the g1 should probably be as good as the PSP now, though |
| 18:56.13 | RyeBrye | bloo - toddler lock disables everything but the power key, so there has to be a way |
| 18:56.29 | bloo | ooooo that sounds awesome |
| 18:57.13 | bloo | how to figure it out though ,.... |
| 18:57.26 | andyross | The nGage was Series 60. 'nuff said. |
| 18:57.50 | bloo | no special permissions modify global settings, change wifi, prevent phone from sleeping, |
| 18:58.07 | thoraxe | look at the iphone / ipod touch games though |
| 18:58.10 | thoraxe | they are fairly advanced |
| 18:58.26 | thoraxe | i think you will see more of a market for mobile device games as the power of mobile devices comes up |
| 18:58.40 | thoraxe | android is also still very new, it will take time for people to exploit its features |
| 18:58.46 | thoraxe | the first iphone games were probably crappy too |
| 18:58.50 | andyross | Yeah, some games along those lines would be really nice for android. It's hardware 3D is comparable. |
| 18:58.52 | digitalspaghetti | so glad i didn't buy an openmoko in the end :) |
| 18:59.26 | andyross | I have the OpenGL experience and a native build environment. But no art or game design skills. :( |
| 19:00.07 | LordMetroid | So how do one access the 3d? is JOGL available in Android's Java? |
| 19:00.11 | digitalspaghetti | i have the design skill, but no java experience (although I code Python & Actionscript 3 so I have an idea of whats goign on, just not where to start) |
| 19:00.38 | Disconnect | digitalspaghetti: the problem is (reading back) that its going into walmart without the ability to take decent photos or play music :/ |
| 19:01.23 | Disconnect | and fyi scripting isn't gonna help much learning java :( it won't hurt (much) but.. |
| 19:01.37 | digitalspaghetti | i'd like my first app to either utlilise the GPS + Fire Eagle or Brightkite in some way, or adding delicious sharing the browser - probably the first will be easier |
| 19:01.53 | joelone | andyross, you caught me,thanks |
| 19:02.14 | digitalspaghetti | Disconnect: i have some c/c++ experience from back in the day, plus PHP, JavaScript and HaXe |
| 19:02.24 | Disconnect | that'll help a lot more :) |
| 19:03.10 | digitalspaghetti | i've looked at the app source for some things and i can see what it's doing, it's just learning the syntax and semantics of java and getting time to do it in the context of learning android's API too |
| 19:03.14 | andyross | LordMetroid: yes, check out the DemoApi's code. There is an OpenGL ES 1.0 core (an ATI Imageon, AFAICT) on the phone. |
| 19:03.26 | Disconnect | digitalspaghetti: head first java is an awesome learning book |
| 19:03.45 | digitalspaghetti | i#ve got one java book... |
| 19:04.02 | andyross | FWIW, if you're just coming up to speed as a developer, games and graphics programming are probably a poor place to start. |
| 19:04.25 | digitalspaghetti | Dietel & Dietel Java: How To Program, but i think it's a bit old |
| 19:05.01 | digitalspaghetti | yea, only covers java 2, 1.2 (about 1999) |
| 19:06.02 | digitalspaghetti | although it'll probably cover the basic's well enough (OO, control structures, etc) |
| 19:06.05 | Disconnect | yah mine were that old also :) so get head first java, its really nice |
| 19:06.30 | Disconnect | you'll find its not so useful. -lots- has changed. |
| 19:06.36 | andyross | My Java fu was 7 years old, so I picked up a copy of Bloch's "Effective Java" to come up to speed on the new stuff. It didn't make me dislike the environment any less, but it's a good book, with dense (!) and insightful content. Recommended. |
| 19:06.41 | Disconnect | (think wfw3.11 programming vs vista) |
| 19:06.45 | Disconnect | heh |
| 19:06.45 | digitalspaghetti | O'Reilly one? |
| 19:07.30 | Disconnect | head first uses the same modern teaching methods as 'dummies' and all that, only with actual content instead of entire chapters devoted to why power strips should not be plugged into themselves. |
| 19:07.32 | digitalspaghetti | you all using Eclipse as well? I see there is a plugin for IntelliJ, but I don't know if it's for 1.0 sdk |
| 19:07.34 | Disconnect | it moves pretty fast |
| 19:08.15 | andyross | wouldn't be caught dead using one of those I.D.E things all these young'uns are talking about. |
| 19:08.41 | digitalspaghetti | Disconnect: 2nd Edition (2005) ? |
| 19:08.47 | Disconnect | yah |
| 19:08.56 | digitalspaghetti | andyross is oldskool command line ;) |
| 19:09.25 | digitalspaghetti | you code in Vi, don't you ;) |
| 19:09.36 | Disconnect | pico |
| 19:09.39 | andyross | Emacs. Although I've been known to switch hit on occasion. |
| 19:09.39 | fadden | uses vi |
| 19:09.39 | thoraxe | andyross: my ide is vim :) |
| 19:09.46 | digitalspaghetti | nano |
| 19:09.56 | *** join/#android sjschultze (n=sjschult@dhcp-0000016245-96-bc.client.student.harvard.edu) |
| 19:10.00 | fadden | doesn't write Java apps though |
| 19:10.07 | Disconnect | uses vi except for android-java-stuff (eclipse) |
| 19:10.27 | digitalspaghetti | as much as my work have seen the phone and love it, they won't let me take time at work to do anything :) |
| 19:10.30 | digitalspaghetti | :( |
| 19:10.38 | andyross | Any statement of the form "I use this text editor except for ..." just fails to parse. What's the point of having an editor if it's not what you use to edit stuff? |
| 19:10.45 | bloo | is there a way to make like an email receiver? |
| 19:10.50 | bloo | like sms receiver but for email? |
| 19:10.58 | fadden | andyross: using the right tool for the job |
| 19:11.02 | Disconnect | andyross: welcome to the 1990s, we have enough memory to load more than one app at a time now. its amazing. |
| 19:11.14 | digitalspaghetti | bloo: well there is an email notification, so maybe? |
| 19:11.45 | andyross | The point is more subtle though: learning new tools for old tasks makes all those tasks slower. I'm completely crippled in a CUA-style editor. |
| 19:11.50 | Disconnect | uses xm for music except when he's listening to the radio (because xm is the wrong tool for the morning show i like) or the g1 (because xm is the wrong tool when i want to hear a particular album or artist) |
| 19:11.56 | *** join/#android F4t (n=noyb@89-139-101-249.bb.netvision.net.il) |
| 19:12.23 | Disconnect | thats just an unwillingness to learn |
| 19:12.34 | andyross | Flawed analogy: You don't use the UI of a music player constantly. If you had to train your ears for each player, you might be a little more assertive about your preferneces. |
| 19:13.12 | Disconnect | maybe you don't but i do. less so with radio (since its basically task-specific) but both mp3 playback and xm radio are very interactive. and wildly different interfaces. |
| 19:13.56 | Disconnect | it took less than a week (maybe 3 evenings - about a week i guess, but thats cuz i have a lot of otehr crap interfering) to get used to the core features of eclipse (jump to line, search/replace, etc) and get up to speed with coding |
| 19:14.03 | Disconnect | rather, up to speed with editing |
| 19:14.27 | andyross | Again: if those players *sounded* different, you might care. Everything about a different editor feels different to your fingers. If you're not bothered by that, it probably means that you are still using stuff like the arrow keys and haven't really internalized your editor choice. That's fine, but for those of us who *have*, there are huge advantages. |
| 19:14.37 | fadden | The Eclipse debugger is also far more useful than the command-line equivalent (jdb). |
| 19:14.58 | Disconnect | hahahaha wow. because you can't adapt everyone who can must not be as good as you? thats pretty funny. |
| 19:15.06 | danfuzz | is a fan of jswat for the occasional debug session |
| 19:15.24 | Disconnect | maybe some of us just stay more adaptable.. |
| 19:15.37 | andyross | Disconnect: chill. When did I say you aren't as good as me? I said I use emacs and like it, and am much more productive there than I am with a CUA editor, and tried to explain why. Leave the flaming at the door please. |
| 19:16.22 | Disconnect | "it probably means you are still using stuff like the arrow keys" .. that whole thing was an incredibly condescending and fairly hostile statement. |
| 19:16.30 | Disconnect | so .. how about right there? |
| 19:16.35 | *** join/#android oyeoj (i=joey@starscream.plik.net) |
| 19:16.45 | andyross | Then I apologize. It certainly wasn't meant as incredibly condescending. |
| 19:16.51 | oyeoj | anyone else having wifi issues since rc29? |
| 19:16.52 | *** join/#android oavdeev (n=oavdeev@79.120.41.39) |
| 19:17.03 | Disconnect | oyeoj: my wifi seems to have gotten a little better |
| 19:17.27 | Disconnect | not a lot (it still -hates- one of the APs at home, and that 2-minute-disconnect-even-on-AC is ridiculous.. but its better.) |
| 19:17.37 | oyeoj | huh |
| 19:17.44 | oyeoj | i cant connect to ANY APs anymore |
| 19:18.06 | oyeoj | when i select one it immediately drops it to the bottom of the list as "out of range" |
| 19:18.21 | Disconnect | uninstall the tmobile hotspot finder and remove the AP it inserted |
| 19:18.40 | oyeoj | ok. known issue? |
| 19:18.49 | Disconnect | really crappy app |
| 19:19.15 | Disconnect | i'd suspect its doing something non-kosher with that AP it inserts, because even with the app gone i still had that problem |
| 19:19.38 | Disconnect | hey .. so how do i get repo to feed me a diff of changes without prettyprinting? I just want to have a standard patchfile i can edit.. |
| 19:20.09 | Disconnect | (and i'm betting no.. but does anyone @ google want a patch to dropbear to allow root logins over ssh with a fixed passwd? ..didn't think so. :) ..) |
| 19:20.25 | oyeoj | ah tmohs? is the tmobile hotspot one? |
| 19:20.33 | Disconnect | ya |
| 19:20.51 | digitalspaghetti | I dunno if this is a bug or not - I ported my number to T-Mobile from my old provider, but when i go into status it shows my old number (although my new number is working) |
| 19:21.01 | *** join/#android jexe_ (n=jesseboy@static-64-115-213-78.isp.broadviewnet.net) |
| 19:21.05 | Disconnect | digitalspaghetti: reboot? |
| 19:21.08 | digitalspaghetti | the number isn't hard-coded on the SIM, right? |
| 19:21.16 | Disconnect | the # is on the sim but its changable |
| 19:21.17 | digitalspaghetti | Disconnect: several times since then |
| 19:21.35 | SanMehat | digitalspaghetti: you're probably just in the wierd 'inbetween' porting state |
| 19:21.36 | Disconnect | christ. i am getting -really- -really- tired of the thing randomly unsilencing |
| 19:21.40 | Disconnect | at work no less |
| 19:22.01 | SanMehat | Disconnect: hitting the speaker buttons on the side unintentionally? |
| 19:22.02 | digitalspaghetti | Disconnect: do you have Locale/Locations installed? |
| 19:22.11 | Disconnect | SanMehat: its sitting on the desk untouched |
| 19:22.23 | SanMehat | haunted? |
| 19:22.24 | Disconnect | digitalspaghetti: its set to mute @ work and then i toggled it off entirely and muted again |
| 19:22.26 | Disconnect | yah :( |
| 19:22.53 | Disconnect | only thing i'm doing is usb mount, remove/replug usb, test, repeat.. (test is via adb - no touching the device) and the mount/umount i've been doing w/o picking up the phone |
| 19:22.57 | digitalspaghetti | the problem with locale is in my office and house, i don't get a good enough GPS |
| 19:23.16 | digitalspaghetti | so at home it woudl switch off my Wifi and turn on GPS |
| 19:24.16 | oyeoj | Disconnect: still not working. thoughts? |
| 19:24.16 | digitalspaghetti | and today, my phone was bluetooth teathed to my PC, and my call got routed through my PC! |
| 19:24.46 | Disconnect | oyeoj: reboot |
| 19:24.56 | Disconnect | digitalspaghetti: bluetooth tethered? |
| 19:25.20 | digitalspaghetti | yea, if you pair your pc and phone, you can set the PC to be a headset |
| 19:25.39 | digitalspaghetti | so your call comes through, and goes through the PC speaker/mic |
| 19:25.42 | *** part/#android F4t (n=noyb@89-139-101-249.bb.netvision.net.il) |
| 19:26.14 | Disconnect | ah ok |
| 19:26.37 | Disconnect | pairing no tethering and pc as headset/mic is a little different than call routing :) |
| 19:26.40 | Disconnect | was confused |
| 19:27.16 | oyeoj | still no |
| 19:27.17 | oyeoj | :( |
| 19:27.29 | Disconnect | dunno then |
| 19:27.38 | Disconnect | wifi on these things is rather a mess |
| 19:27.55 | oyeoj | is it worth trying a hard reset? |
| 19:28.18 | *** join/#android orci (n=orci@isom-310.dhcp.umass.edu) |
| 19:28.46 | orci | hi how can I install a latest version of android platform on my htc g1 telephone? |
| 19:28.46 | *** join/#android osmosis (n=steven@63.139.86.3) |
| 19:28.58 | spikebike | you can't |
| 19:29.30 | Disconnect | orci: start by getting a large rock. it should preferably be dark in color but not covered in tar or anything. |
| 19:29.37 | osmosis | yah you can, but you shouldnt. thats nerdy. |
| 19:29.38 | Disconnect | lemme know when you have that. |
| 19:29.46 | spikebike | you can? |
| 19:30.07 | osmosis | yah, i saw a manual process for it on some blog. |
| 19:30.19 | osmosis | but the updates should get pushed to you over the air automatically, so dont bother |
| 19:30.25 | osmosis | there are no good updates yet anyways |
| 19:30.27 | *** join/#android tweakt (n=root@xpc.tweakt.net) |
| 19:30.44 | Disconnect | osmosis: ..thats not the latest platform. thats the release that tmob is pushing OTA. different animal entirely. |
| 19:31.03 | osmosis | what is 'latest platform' then? like a alpha build ? |
| 19:31.06 | spikebike | osmosis oh umm |
| 19:31.15 | spikebike | you are talking about tmo's distribution not android |
| 19:31.18 | orci | osmosis, I see sound recorder in applications list but it has 0 size and is not in the launchers list what may be the problem? |
| 19:31.19 | Disconnect | latest platform is what you get from 'repo sync' |
| 19:31.22 | bloo | anyone play with keyguardlock? |
| 19:31.25 | spikebike | yes you can manually do update |
| 19:31.32 | osmosis | spikebike: i didnt realize there was anything other then tmobs |
| 19:31.36 | bloo | orci, its not launchable |
| 19:31.50 | orci | bloo, why would that be? |
| 19:31.50 | spikebike | osmosis google has some 100 ish repos for android |
| 19:31.52 | osmosis | spikebike: should I flash over to the 'generic android' ?? |
| 19:31.59 | spikebike | you can't |
| 19:32.00 | Disconnect | osmosis: ..how? |
| 19:32.08 | orci | bloo, any other sound recorder apps you might suggest? |
| 19:32.12 | osmosis | can I store apps on my sdcard? I ran out of space for apps on the interal memory. |
| 19:32.20 | bloo | ringdroid is kinda good |
| 19:32.20 | spikebike | that's the issue, currently tmo's shipping a pretty closed phone |
| 19:32.23 | tweakt | w00t. connectBot + irssi FTW |
| 19:32.25 | osmosis | spikebike: 100 different versions??! |
| 19:32.29 | Disconnect | bloo: ringdroid is slick |
| 19:32.30 | orci | bloo, oh does it do that? |
| 19:32.53 | osmosis | spikebike: whats the benefits ? |
| 19:33.50 | orci | where can I see the android platform version I am running? |
| 19:33.56 | orci | if there is such thing |
| 19:34.20 | romainguy | Menu > Settings > About phone |
| 19:34.27 | languish | osmosis, different devices/carriers/branding/manufacturers |
| 19:34.29 | spikebike | no 100 different repos for pieces of android |
| 19:34.49 | spikebike | osmosis ability to control your phone, to do anything you want with it |
| 19:35.03 | spikebike | like say turn it into a firewall, router, gateway, etc. |
| 19:36.21 | osmosis | that would be cooL! |
| 19:36.23 | osmosis | apache |
| 19:37.22 | spikebike | tweak kernels, run the latest apps, etc. |
| 19:39.24 | *** join/#android haavi (n=blahhah@c83-254-67-155.bredband.comhem.se) |
| 19:39.39 | *** join/#android Dralspire (n=dral@81-196.126-70.tampabay.res.rr.com) |
| 19:42.44 | Disconnect | ..you can run the latest apps |
| 19:42.58 | *** join/#android tethridge (n=tale@cpe-075-177-151-223.nc.res.rr.com) |
| 19:43.36 | oyeoj | hm |
| 19:43.38 | *** join/#android taaz (n=dlehn@pool-71-171-27-191.nwrknj.east.verizon.net) |
| 19:43.40 | oyeoj | still no luck with wifi |
| 19:43.43 | oyeoj | suucks :( |
| 19:43.56 | Disconnect | reboot the AP, just for S&G |
| 19:44.00 | oyeoj | k |
| 19:44.26 | Disconnect | its not an actual fix but i've got one that it won't talk to unless i reboot it occasionally. (its a g1 problem tho, other devices - from phones to desktops and most things in between) have no issues.. |
| 19:44.55 | SplasPood | tweakt: yea connectbot is the shit |
| 19:45.26 | tweakt | how do I hit Ctrl in connect bot? |
| 19:45.32 | oyeoj | trackball |
| 19:45.34 | *** join/#android herriojr (n=Miranda@65.173.101.2) |
| 19:45.35 | SplasPood | the .. yea |
| 19:45.45 | herriojr | hey, is the android eclipse plugin open source? |
| 19:45.50 | *** join/#android lresende (n=luckbr19@63.85.187.2) |
| 19:45.55 | tweakt | sorry, meant alt |
| 19:45.57 | herriojr | I want to modify it |
| 19:46.25 | oyeoj | well wtf that did it |
| 19:46.33 | Disconnect | tweakt: hit 'about' it'll show the stupid non-clickthrough clickthrough and then the help |
| 19:46.33 | oyeoj | Disconnect: thx for being patient |
| 19:46.35 | jasta | yes it is open |
| 19:46.52 | herriojr | where do I find the source? |
| 19:47.07 | jasta | look at the downloads section of the google code page |
| 19:50.32 | unix_lappy | android coming to ATT next month! |
| 19:50.32 | Disconnect | bloo: timeout is in seconds? and it should prolly be a picker rather than a textbox. so no keyboard needed. |
| 19:51.04 | bloo | disconnect, good idea |
| 19:51.17 | unix_lappy | prays to cieling cat for a better device ;-) |
| 19:51.26 | bmunger_ | android coming to sprint.....never |
| 19:51.34 | umdk1d3 | unix_lappy: source? |
| 19:51.39 | Ramblurr | I've got a service running, and when i go away from the activity that created it the service dies with an IllegalStateException |
| 19:52.38 | zhobbs | Ramblurr: do you start the service or just bind to id? |
| 19:52.43 | zhobbs | to it* |
| 19:53.19 | Ramblurr | zhobbs: I use bindService(aIntent, mConnection, Context.BIND_AUTO_CREATE); |
| 19:53.29 | unix_lappy | umdk1d3: AT&T CEO @ Web2.0 Summit. |
| 19:53.58 | zhobbs | Ramblurr: if you want a service to live after your activity is gone it's best to start it before you bind it |
| 19:54.28 | umdk1d3 | unix_lappy: ah interesting. i wonder how they balance that with their iphone investment |
| 19:54.45 | umdk1d3 | and if we was pressured to make that statement, or how he mentioned it |
| 19:54.48 | unix_lappy | umdk1d3: make iPhone tethering supported. |
| 19:55.31 | bloo | zomg stupid sms thing went back to not working |
| 19:55.40 | *** join/#android pedro_mg (n=pedromg@92.250.120.213) |
| 19:55.47 | bloo | wait nm i dont know |
| 19:55.53 | Ramblurr | zhobbs: what should the Context be in the Intent i use to start the service? |
| 19:56.15 | zhobbs | Ramblurr: your activity inherits Context |
| 19:56.24 | zhobbs | Ramblurr: so in an activity just use "this" |
| 19:56.27 | Ramblurr | so the current activity is ok? |
| 19:56.28 | unix_lappy | and maybe put android on another (or the same) sub-par device...it's still a nascent platform no need to let all the cats out of the bag. |
| 19:56.33 | zhobbs | Ramblurr: yes |
| 19:56.51 | Ramblurr | yea, that's what im doing in my binderService() intent, i wasnt sure if it held for startService too |
| 19:56.52 | Ramblurr | cool |
| 19:57.13 | *** part/#android pedro_mg (n=pedromg@92.250.120.213) |
| 19:57.57 | tweakt | hmm still can't seem to send alt-2 (switch windows in irssi) |
| 19:58.47 | Ramblurr | zhobbs: that worked, thanks |
| 19:59.53 | *** part/#android PINguAR_ (n=PINguAR_@88.235.146.65) |
| 19:59.53 | Disconnect | make dropbear work on android (building it is up to you, as is setting the password - hint: debug.h. provided without support. in fact, i'll prolly ridicule you if i don't like the question. :) ..) http://link.sigkill.net/dropbear-v1.patch |
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| 20:13.30 | sjschultze | Disconnect, is the idea that we apply this to the dropbear project that's in git? |
| 20:13.45 | *** join/#android dream_kill (n=nospam@87-194-186-187.bethere.co.uk) |
| 20:13.46 | Disconnect | yah and do a native static build. |
| 20:13.54 | dream_kill | re |
| 20:17.00 | Disconnect | haven't gotten key auth working but i didn't look that hard at it |
| 20:17.33 | *** join/#android samgrab (n=chatzill@mail.sam-grabham.co.uk) |
| 20:17.43 | Disconnect | in theory since it gets homedir as /data ...oooh. thats where i broke it. cool |
| 20:19.36 | Ramblurr | is there a way the service can tell the OS it is ready to be killed ? |
| 20:19.57 | Ramblurr | sort of like the mediaplayback service |
| 20:20.04 | jasta | Ramblurr: stopSelf() |
| 20:20.07 | Ramblurr | when a track is paused.. the backend service can be killed |
| 20:20.08 | romainguy | a service can stop itself |
| 20:20.20 | Ramblurr | but i dont necessarily want to stop the service |
| 20:20.27 | Ramblurr | only if the OS wants/needs to |
| 20:20.30 | Ramblurr | does that make sense? |
| 20:20.34 | digitalspaghetti | hey - no one answered this before, i'm trying to still understand some stuff about android |
| 20:20.41 | jasta | Ramblurr: not really. but the OS will kill you if it wants to no matter what you say. |
| 20:20.49 | digitalspaghetti | for example, can i write a app that ties into the browser, and when you hold your finger on the page, it can bring up a Share menu (i.e. delicious, magnolia, reddit, etc) |
| 20:20.53 | jasta | i would setForeground(false), though. |
| 20:21.12 | digitalspaghetti | would that be an intent, and can i hook it into the browser? |
| 20:21.58 | Ramblurr | jasta: ah, that's exactly what i need.. can i toggle that on and off? |
| 20:22.37 | Ramblurr | cause ive got a problem where if a user starts a track, then pauses it |
| 20:22.44 | Ramblurr | the service wont die |
| 20:23.06 | jasta | you're not thinking clearly :) |
| 20:23.24 | *** part/#android yacoob (n=yacoob@hell.pl) |
| 20:24.02 | jasta | my music playing service uses a deferral pattern to die. it waits 2 minutes after pause/stop before it calls stopSelf() and releases its wake lock |
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| 20:24.14 | jasta | then when it dies, it saves the playlist/player state to disk |
| 20:24.16 | jasta | and recovers it in onCreate |
| 20:24.21 | jasta | so the user doesn't know what happened |
| 20:24.36 | jasta | but you definitely want it to die. |
| 20:25.09 | jasta | also, you want to use setForeground(true) |
| 20:25.17 | jasta | because while you are alive, you should be playing |
| 20:25.42 | jasta | oh, and make sure to use a WakeLock else the CPU will sleep and your audio will stop. the MediaPlayer object has a convenience method for this |
| 20:25.44 | Ramblurr | hm cool |
| 20:26.31 | jasta | Ramblurr: http://code.google.com/p/five/source/browse/trunk/five-music/src/org/devtcg/five/music/service/PlaylistService.java |
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| 20:26.53 | jasta | that is the service i designed, although im sure my requirements are much greater than yours so there is a lot of complexity you could eliminate |
| 20:27.42 | Ramblurr | ah :) i've seen your app when looking for some examples before |
| 20:27.53 | jasta | excellent, that's why i published it after all :) |
| 20:28.01 | Ramblurr | it's been very helpful |
| 20:31.43 | jasta | what app are you working on btw? |
| 20:32.58 | Ramblurr | just curious why do the low level wakelock as opposed to setting MediaPlayer.setScreenOnWhilePlaying(true) ? |
| 20:33.14 | Ramblurr | jasta: a last.fm application |
| 20:33.25 | zhobbs | Ramblurr: official or unofficial? |
| 20:33.33 | jasta | because at the time, i didn't have the source code to the MediaPlayer and have come to distrust everything it does |
| 20:34.13 | Ramblurr | hm |
| 20:35.05 | jasta | in particular, i wasnt sure that the wakelock would persist until i release it, or if it would automatically release when the mediaplayer stopped |
| 20:35.21 | jasta | which is not what i want, because i want my service to still be awake if the user pauses |
| 20:35.43 | jasta | and i wanted to use the deferred stop so that if the user pauses quickly, exits the application, and returns, that the service would not have died yet |
| 20:36.02 | jasta | if the CPU were to fall asleep during this time, then my service would live much longer than i want. |
| 20:36.36 | Ramblurr | what's with the CacheService? |
| 20:36.51 | Ramblurr | is that another service you use to download tracks? |
| 20:36.53 | jasta | you must realize that non-realtime timers like Thread.sleep, Handler.sendMessageDelayed, etc guarantee only a MINIMUM amount of time |
| 20:37.14 | jasta | no, actually the PlaylistService manages downloading tracks (through the DownloadManager class, but in the PlaylistService thread) |
| 20:37.18 | Ramblurr | heh yea i've figured that one out already |
| 20:37.36 | Ramblurr | hm |
| 20:37.43 | jasta | the CacheService is just a simple service that abstracts the mechanics of the cache |
| 20:38.02 | jasta | it could have been just a class and not a service, or a shared thread even, but i felt it was tidier to expose as a service |
| 20:38.34 | jasta | its main job is to manage the cache policy that five uses, so that the playlistservice can simply request storage and "commit" objects to cache without fussing with disk space |
| 20:40.07 | jasta | Ramblurr: is this last.fm client official or unofficial? |
| 20:40.32 | jasta | because i do want to point out that Five integrates with Last.fm, and numerous features using that integration are coming soon |
| 20:40.33 | dipen | where can i find source code for this: D/VolumePanel( 48): onShowVolumeChanged(streamType: 2, flags: 17), index: 0 |
| 20:40.33 | dipen | D/VolumePanel( 48): setRingerIcon(index: 0), ringerMode: 1 |
| 20:40.35 | jasta | including radio |
| 20:40.45 | dipen | it is the volume down key |
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| 20:40.56 | jasta | so collaboration would certainly be appreciated :) |
| 20:41.39 | Ramblurr | jasta (and zhobbs) : it's an unofficial client |
| 20:41.55 | jasta | dipen: it's in frameworks/base/core/java/android/view |
| 20:42.09 | jasta | Ramblurr: is it the one on the market already? |
| 20:42.18 | Ramblurr | i'm aimed at having feature parity with the iphone app |
| 20:42.22 | jasta | i had heard that one was very buggy :) |
| 20:42.23 | Ramblurr | jasta: heh, no |
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| 20:42.36 | Ramblurr | yea, it's a good attempt |
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| 20:42.57 | Ramblurr | jasta: there is a java lastfm library |
| 20:43.13 | jasta | yeah, i dont intend to use that though |
| 20:43.20 | Ramblurr | but it's not really designed for a mobile platform |
| 20:43.33 | Ramblurr | i've started stripping it down |
| 20:43.36 | jasta | it's very inefficient. i looked at the source already |
| 20:43.37 | jmob | anyone have good advice for squeezing more life out of the g1 battery? |
| 20:43.39 | Ramblurr | and optimizing it http://github.com/Ramblurr/last.fm-java/ |
| 20:43.45 | Ramblurr | jasta: uber inefficient |
| 20:43.47 | dipen | wow, thanks jasta |
| 20:44.01 | jmob | should i just return my device? |
| 20:44.33 | jasta | jmob: if you want. |
| 20:44.47 | RyeBrye | jmob - have you actually run the battery downto zero? The calibration on it really sucks... It takes a lot longer to go from 10% -> 0 than it does to go from 100% -> 50% in my experience |
| 20:44.50 | jasta | you could try a number of small tweaks/optimizations like turning off push sync support |
| 20:44.59 | jasta | or you could try not playing with it quite so much :) |
| 20:45.04 | andyross | jmob: turn off the radios you arent using (wifi, bluetooth, gps). Turn down the screen brightness. Reboot to make sure no third party apps are spinning in the background. Standard stuff. The G1 has a weak battery, but not a useless one. I'm still in the "new toy" mode with mine, and get 24 hours at a time out of it. |
| 20:45.23 | jmob | don't /reallt/ want to, just want some hope that i'm not gonna be totally burned by a first gen device |
| 20:45.24 | jasta | but truthfully, the battery is small and the platform sucks it dry. |
| 20:45.26 | RyeBrye | you get 24 hours? I'm jealous |
| 20:45.28 | zhobbs | Ramblurr: what's the license on that library? |
| 20:45.29 | Disconnect | calibration makes a -huge- difference |
| 20:46.03 | RyeBrye | Yeah, running it down to zero does help it a lot - but it's still not perfect even once it gets itself calibrated |
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| 20:46.03 | Disconnect | run it down until it absolutely will not power on, then charge it -uninterrupted- for as long as you can (24 hours is good, 8 hours is ok, prolly more than 24 is a waste) |
| 20:46.05 | Ramblurr | zhobbs: the original was BSD |
| 20:46.09 | jasta | RyeBrye: ive noticed the calibration is off as well. |
| 20:46.11 | jmob | Disconnect: yeah i've seen it getting better |
| 20:46.32 | andyross | I lied about 24 hours. I have it charging overnight, so it's more like 16-18. And obviously not all that time is surfing or playing -- maybe 6 hours total. |
| 20:46.36 | jasta | uses Five on his drive home every night, so that charges my phone in the car |
| 20:46.42 | jasta | which is owrking really well for me so far |
| 20:46.59 | RyeBrye | I just plug it into USB whenever I'm near a computer |
| 20:47.06 | RyeBrye | and for me, that's like... 20 hours a day :P |
| 20:47.36 | jmob | RyeBrye: a lot of the comps i'm near don't put out enough juice from the usb port |
| 20:47.51 | Ramblurr | zhobbs: oops i havent uploaded the license for mine |
| 20:48.23 | RyeBrye | because I'm near my computer so much, I was actually thinking of some cool ways to use the G1 as a little status monitor for my computer - or a place to dump notices about what my various systems are doing... the easiest way to do that woudl be to somehow make a growl client I think |
| 20:48.44 | Disconnect | RyeBrye: the uninterrupted bit is important for calibration |
| 20:48.56 | Disconnect | yah growl can talk to tcp ports. so should be prety easy |
| 20:49.03 | Disconnect | just turn it into a notification |
| 20:49.04 | RyeBrye | Yeah, just a matter of time |
| 20:49.13 | RyeBrye | Well - I was thinking of using the full screen of the G1 |
| 20:49.25 | zhobbs | Ramblurr: what's last.fm's policy on radio clients? I don't think radio is in the last.fm v2.0 API right, and they might cut people off at any time? |
| 20:49.28 | RyeBrye | so it would be like a little LCD panel kind of thing - only with a much nicer screen |
| 20:49.36 | jasta | zhobbs: have you looked at all these properties that the MediaPlaybackActivity specifies? |
| 20:49.53 | jasta | taskAffinity="", launchMode=singleTask, clearTaskOnLaunch=true, excludeFromRecents=true? |
| 20:49.57 | Ramblurr | zhobbs: Radio is in the 2.0 api |
| 20:50.00 | jasta | do you do similar in your app? |
| 20:50.03 | ionstorm | Is the G1 video record capable, any src code on it or api dox |
| 20:50.14 | Ramblurr | zhobbs: however usage is restricted by your API key, your api key needs to get permissions to use the radio |
| 20:50.25 | zhobbs | jasta: I do singleTask |
| 20:50.36 | jasta | where is the documentation for this? |
| 20:50.38 | Ramblurr | zhobbs: and yes the pre 2.0 radio api could be disabled at any moment |
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| 20:51.06 | jasta | zhobbs: nm i found it |
| 20:51.17 | jasta | they have improved this it seems ;) |
| 20:51.38 | zhobbs | jasta: I use launchMode="singleTask" for my main activity also |
| 20:52.15 | jasta | i gotta read about this, i just didnt even think about it but i hate the way my activity history/stack works implicitly in five |
| 20:52.18 | jasta | drives me bonkers |
| 20:54.03 | zhobbs | clearTaskOnLaunch=true and excludeFromRecents=true are interesting, I'll have to research those |
| 20:54.34 | jasta | is it just me or does taskAffinity="" and launchMode="singleTask" seem to imply launchMode="singleInstance"? |
| 20:55.15 | Gary|tp | for some reason |
| 20:55.19 | Gary|tp | either |
| 20:55.42 | Gary|tp | pTerminal, telnetd, the proxy/tethering application, or leaving USB debugging seriously drains the battery |
| 20:55.55 | jasta | zhobbs: ive never even seen thi appmodel documentation |
| 20:56.00 | vol | jasta: Have you gotten gdb working? |
| 20:56.03 | vol | If so, did you use |
| 20:56.07 | Gary|tp | my battery went from 100% to dead, while in my pocket, in a single hour |
| 20:56.09 | vol | http://www.billrocks.org/ideas/index.php?/archives/20-Debugging-Android-Native-C-Applications-with-gdb.html#extended |
| 20:56.18 | vol | the gdbserver linked from there? |
| 20:56.29 | Disconnect | proxy/tethering prolly since it keeps it awake |
| 20:56.39 | Gary|tp | thats what my guess was |
| 20:56.49 | zhobbs | jasta: yeah, the term "Task" isn't used much anywhere else |
| 20:57.16 | fadden | vol: FWIW, "adb forward tcp:1234 tcp:1234" will do the job of the "telnet"+"redir" line |
| 20:57.17 | Gary|tp | Why does it keep it awake, and what does it mean if it's "asleep"? it just stops processing all non-essential programs? |
| 20:57.38 | fadden | vol: and it works for the real device too |
| 20:57.49 | vol | fadden: right, the issue is that gdbserver didn't seem to stop for breakpoints last time we tried |
| 20:57.56 | Gary|tp | how does stuff like maverick stay connected while asleep then |
| 20:57.56 | vol | though I haven't had the change to try that yet |
| 20:58.02 | vol | (that was another dev) |
| 21:00.16 | ionstorm | anyone notice that gtalk disconnects while asleep too? |
| 21:00.23 | zhobbs | Ramblurr: when you apply for an API key that will allow radio did you just do "non-commercial"? Or "Bespoke"? |
| 21:00.24 | ionstorm | any way to prevent that? |
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| 21:00.56 | Ramblurr | zhobbs: last.fm isnt handing out API keys with radio access |
| 21:01.28 | zhobbs | ahh |
| 21:01.43 | Ramblurr | it's a big debacle, heh |
| 21:01.59 | Ramblurr | all third-party clients are to use the old radio apis |
| 21:02.20 | zhobbs | ahh, so you are using the old radio api's? |
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| 21:09.24 | Ramblurr | zhobbs: im pretty much forced to :( |
| 21:09.45 | Ramblurr | if i ever get a key with sufficient perms, i've got the code ready to drop in |
| 21:10.11 | Disconnect | coooool [1335] Nov 06 21:07:57 pubkey auth succeeded for 'root' with key md5 |
| 21:11.45 | jasta | zhobbs: the source code has revealed so much magic its ridiculous :) |
| 21:12.12 | jasta | like, who knew about setVolumeControlStream, sheesh :0 |
| 21:12.27 | zhobbs | jasta: it's nice though...I grep the source all the time to find out wtf is going on |
| 21:12.33 | jasta | yeah, me too |
| 21:12.35 | vol | fadden: in any event, is that an acceptable gdbserver ot use, or do you compile your own via the toolchain? |
| 21:12.36 | jasta | very, very helpful |
| 21:13.23 | zhobbs | I actually figured out how to zip up the source and have eclipse pick it up...so now I can step right into the framework classes |
| 21:13.35 | Disconnect | ok i put up link.sigkill.net/dropbear-v1.1.patch with some tweaks and a little bit of advice |
| 21:13.49 | Disconnect | (building/using it advice) |
| 21:13.59 | romainguy | zhobbs: you don't need to zip the source |
| 21:13.59 | bl0rpl3 | Has anyone had success installing Term.apk on the G1? (this one - http://www.helloandroid.com/files/Term.apk). It always fails when I try. |
| 21:14.17 | zhobbs | bl0rpl3: I have |
| 21:14.24 | zhobbs | romainguy: where do you put it? |
| 21:14.36 | romainguy | you can just point Eclipse to a directory with the source inside |
| 21:14.51 | romainguy | I just sync the git repositories and target platform/base/core/java |
| 21:15.11 | zhobbs | romainguy: the eclipse plugin hard codes the source location, and it's "non modifiable" |
| 21:15.22 | romainguy | aah |
| 21:15.24 | zhobbs | "$SDK/sources" |
| 21:15.25 | romainguy | stupid plugin :) |
| 21:15.25 | bl0rpl3 | zhobbs: did you have to do anything special? I even tried restoring everything to the original state. |
| 21:15.31 | romainguy | well, if you were not using the plugin, it'd work :p |
| 21:15.36 | zhobbs | hehe |
| 21:15.57 | zhobbs | yeah, should probably change it to be "modifiable" |
| 21:16.10 | zhobbs | bl0rpl3: I've done it via the browser and via adb |
| 21:16.36 | zhobbs | bl0rpl3: but there was someone in here who couldn't get it to work via the browser yesterday, but did get adb to install it |
| 21:17.09 | bl0rpl3 | zhobbs: ok thanks. i will definitely try that. |
| 21:17.28 | fadden | vol: we have a prebuilt one in the source tree. Let me see how it compares. |
| 21:17.57 | fadden | (source tree == old internal one; I don't see it in the open-source one) |
| 21:20.01 | vol | fadden: ah. That might be why other people are having more success with gdb than we have been. |
| 21:20.31 | Ramblurr | how does the activity stack behave if the user goes back to an activity that changed it's contentview with setContentView more than once? |
| 21:20.42 | Ramblurr | does it just show the last state of the activity |
| 21:20.53 | Ramblurr | i suppose so, if it doesnt have to recreate it |
| 21:21.22 | bl0rpl3 | zhobbs: yep that did it. thank you so much. |
| 21:21.40 | zhobbs | bl0rpl3: cool...not sure why it doesn't work in the browser for some people |
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| 21:23.30 | fadden | vol: I replaced the one on my device with the one from the web site |
| 21:23.42 | fadden | It seemed to work -- I could attach to a process and get a stack trace. |
| 21:23.55 | fadden | Wasn't so happy with a breakpoint -- process terminated with a SIGTRAP. |
| 21:24.04 | fadden | Let me retry the experiment with our gdbserver. |
| 21:25.16 | vol | fadden: yeah, we can't get breakpoints to work with that one. |
| 21:25.32 | vol | Is there a version we SHOULD be using, or is there a version that you can provide? |
| 21:25.54 | fadden | Breakpoint worked with my version. |
| 21:27.01 | vol | hmm |
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| 21:27.16 | vol | alright, I have yet to actually try this version myself, lets see what happens |
| 21:27.40 | fadden | vol: let me figure out where this copy of gdbserver came from |
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| 21:28.02 | vol | fadden: tjamls |
| 21:28.02 | fadden | Looks like you may need our version. |
| 21:28.04 | vol | er |
| 21:28.07 | vol | thanks |
| 21:28.08 | xp_prg | hi all, I am quite new to android, I am curious is there an api to see where you are in 3 dimensional space with android? |
| 21:28.19 | xp_prg | with gps? |
| 21:29.21 | *** join/#android `vip (n=denied@m605e36d0.tmodns.net) |
| 21:29.47 | vol | xp_prg: the geolocation utils have getAltitude methods iirc |
| 21:30.05 | xp_prg | so that is z, what about x and y? |
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| 21:31.35 | sjschultze | xda-developers appears to be back |
| 21:31.46 | Gigawatts | indeed |
| 21:31.50 | xp_prg | hello anyone know the answer to that, it is important to me |
| 21:31.51 | Disconnect | cool |
| 21:32.28 | vol | xp_prg: look at the geolocation libraries |
| 21:32.32 | vol | they'll provide you lat/long |
| 21:32.42 | vol | remember, the earth is not a perfect sphere |
| 21:32.46 | spikebike | gps is a lousy source of z |
| 21:33.06 | xp_prg | so your saying I can determine where I am in 3d space then? |
| 21:33.17 | vol | xp_prg: you won't get exactly x/y |
| 21:33.21 | vol | but you will get lat/long |
| 21:33.29 | vol | and if you have an alt fix you'll get altitude as well |
| 21:33.31 | xp_prg | well how close can I get? |
| 21:33.32 | spikebike | yes, with varying degrees of accuracy |
| 21:33.36 | `vip | questions, where are tones stored that are used for notifications |
| 21:33.42 | vol | that's as best as you can do |
| 21:33.48 | `vip | i want to use the mario warp pipe sound for SMS but i dunno where to place it |
| 21:33.48 | `vip | :l |
| 21:33.49 | vol | you can always do your own great circle calculations |
| 21:34.06 | spikebike | yeah coordinate conversion isn't very tough |
| 21:34.07 | xp_prg | vol what are you talking about? |
| 21:34.40 | zhobbs | how can I build an unsigned apk in the android-git tree? |
| 21:34.57 | xp_prg | does the tmobile that runs android have blue thing wireless communication? |
| 21:35.24 | spikebike | bluetooth? |
| 21:35.26 | xp_prg | ya |
| 21:35.29 | Gigawatts | `vip /system/media/audio/notifications/ |
| 21:35.38 | spikebike | ya, but not exposed to programmers yet |
| 21:35.39 | `vip | ok thanks |
| 21:35.40 | vol | xp_prg: the geolocation libraries won't provide x/y/z |
| 21:35.45 | Disconnect | fyi SanMehat et al, xp is just a troll that wandered in from somewhere else. |
| 21:35.45 | vol | they'll provide lat/long/alt |
| 21:35.46 | spikebike | so headset if fine |
| 21:36.00 | xp_prg | vol but you can convert that to x/xy/z right? |
| 21:36.03 | spikebike | is |
| 21:36.05 | vol | the earth isn't a perfect sphere, so you can't do that and get x/y/z locs without doing specific calculations |
| 21:36.16 | vol | you can get approximate locations |
| 21:36.18 | xp_prg | right but the calculations are trivial |
| 21:36.24 | vol | yeah |
| 21:36.28 | vol | it's pretty CLOSE to a sphere |
| 21:36.36 | xp_prg | how approximate are they do you think, like += 3 feet or something? |
| 21:36.40 | vol | but if you're in alaska you may be off by a hundred miles. |
| 21:36.42 | xp_prg | += |
| 21:36.45 | xp_prg | +- |
| 21:36.48 | Chainfire | its more like a circle, I heard in church. |
| 21:36.52 | vol | xp_prg: look it up |
| 21:36.52 | spikebike | vol er, no not 100 miles |
| 21:37.00 | vol | 10 or even 1 |
| 21:37.06 | vol | is still a good amount if you're trying to be exact |
| 21:37.09 | spikebike | not even 1 |
| 21:37.16 | vol | eh. |
| 21:37.17 | spikebike | anyways |
| 21:37.21 | vol | not perfect |
| 21:37.23 | vol | more than 3 feet |
| 21:37.27 | spikebike | gps is 90% within 10 meters |
| 21:37.30 | xp_prg | when is the bluethood api going to be released? |
| 21:37.42 | spikebike | assuming a good view of the sky, enough sats, and enough time |
| 21:37.42 | Gigawatts | i belive civilan spec gps's are 3m |
| 21:37.49 | Gigawatts | so yeah, 9ft ish |
| 21:38.07 | spikebike | pretty sure it's 10m |
| 21:38.09 | spikebike | was 100m |
| 21:38.19 | spikebike | then they stopped adding the error |
| 21:38.21 | Gigawatts | no, definatly not |
| 21:38.24 | `vip | well that sucks when i try to paste using glance, i get an error ... The application Glance (process com.androidnerds.utilities.Glance) has stopped unexpectedly. Please try again. :( |
| 21:38.29 | xp_prg | when is the bluethood api going to be released? |
| 21:38.31 | Gigawatts | right, in like 04 |
| 21:38.32 | spikebike | the 3m is just a fake where they time average |
| 21:39.08 | spikebike | or maybe it's 50% with 3m and 90% within 10m or something |
| 21:39.12 | vol | spikebike: hey, whatever, I guess the earth is a perfect sphere after all, good luck on your x/y/z calcs. |
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| 21:39.41 | xp_prg | what about a reference tmobile phone, would that correct the error and give you exact xyz? |
| 21:39.50 | xp_prg | so you would have 2 phones |
| 21:40.09 | xp_prg | if you know for sure where the first phone is, you can know exactly where the 2nd phone is yes? |
| 21:40.09 | Gigawatts | nothing about gps is 'exact' |
| 21:40.21 | xp_prg | but you can get greater access with that approach yes? |
| 21:40.40 | elad | any advances towards tethering? |
| 21:40.50 | xp_prg | I mean accuracy |
| 21:40.50 | vol | xp_prg: it will give you very precise lat/long/altitude |
| 21:41.05 | xp_prg | more preceise then 3 meters right? |
| 21:41.10 | vol | that does not necessarily translate to x/y/z without taking into account the fact that the earth is more a donut than a sphere |
| 21:41.12 | Gigawatts | they are still both going to experience inacturaccies, and when you multiply accuracies together, they get worse |
| 21:41.28 | vol | if you just want to show approximate locations, that's absolutely fine |
| 21:41.36 | vol | you're off by 100 feet, yeah, whatever. |
| 21:41.53 | xp_prg | ok when is the bluetooth api going to be released? |
| 21:41.55 | Gigawatts | 90% approx * 90% approx = 81% approx location |
| 21:41.58 | vol | but if you want to be precise, you'll need to do more accurate calculations from lat/long to x/y/z |
| 21:42.11 | xp_prg | but a reference phone would help right? |
| 21:42.39 | Gigawatts | no, not really |
| 21:42.47 | xp_prg | why not Gigawatts? |
| 21:42.48 | Gigawatts | and it would be way more trouble than its worth |
| 21:42.52 | *** join/#android jlapenna (n=jlapenna@nat/google/x-b404285be7e0304e) |
| 21:42.58 | xp_prg | is anyone going to answer my bluethooth api question? |
| 21:43.08 | gdsx | Gigawatts: uhh... I'm not sure that's how it works (the .9*.9=.81 thing) |
| 21:43.18 | Gigawatts | because then your just multiplying approximations, and coming up with worse approximations |
| 21:43.49 | *** join/#android `vip_ (n=denied@m345e36d0.tmodns.net) |
| 21:44.36 | xp_prg | hello bluetooth anyone? |
| 21:45.09 | `vip_ | is there a way to view the system folder when i have it plugged in via USB ? |
| 21:46.06 | zhobbs | `vip_: adb shell |
| 21:46.18 | zhobbs | `vip_: or ddms has a file browser I think |
| 21:46.26 | *** join/#android PoohbaLT1 (n=Poohba@c-98-235-52-97.hsd1.nj.comcast.net) |
| 21:50.22 | gdsx | Gigawatts: for instance, if you've got 100 phones, you have 100 estimates. Your accuracy is certainly going to be higher than .9^100 |
| 21:51.00 | gdsx | Gigawatts: and, generally, averaging gives you a low-pass filter effect, which tends to attenuate noise |
| 21:51.22 | tweakt | zhobbs: yes |
| 21:51.34 | xp_prg | there is only one bluetooth phone currently right? |
| 21:51.35 | tweakt | it's nice and allows upload and download |
| 21:52.46 | *** join/#android TimRiker (n=timr@bzflag/projectlead/TimRiker) |
| 21:53.51 | TimRiker | can the G1 handle wpa2 enterprise? ie: is there a way to load a cert using the gui? |
| 21:54.06 | *** join/#android wastrel (n=wastrel@nylug/member/wastrel) |
| 21:54.44 | Disconnect | no |
| 21:54.47 | TimRiker | notices the topic... "may now be logged" is not nearly as useful as pointing to the logs. |
| 21:54.51 | TimRiker | ~logs |
| 21:54.52 | infobot | All conversations are logged to http://ibot.rikers.org/channel, where "channel" is replaced by the URL-encoded channel name, such as %23freenode for #freenode. Lines starting with spaces are not logged. |
| 21:55.22 | TimRiker | Disconnect: what about using dev tools? ie: not the gui. |
| 21:55.36 | spikebike | vol gotta run to a meeting, but the radium varies by 21km |
| 21:55.40 | Disconnect | g1 is locked (well, supposedly) |
| 21:55.44 | spikebike | (polar vs equator) |
| 21:55.44 | TimRiker | I can get my iPhone on the corporate net, but not the G1. :( |
| 21:55.57 | spikebike | but the GPS reference takes that into account |
| 21:56.10 | Disconnect | welcome to cutting edge. istr original iphone w/ original load couldn't even do wpa2-personal. so.. it'll happen |
| 21:56.12 | Disconnect | file a bug |
| 21:56.44 | TimRiker | the iPhone needs a profile config to do it, but it does handle it. |
| 21:56.55 | *** join/#android vbabiy (n=vbabiy@rrcs-24-97-148-190.nys.biz.rr.com) |
| 21:56.56 | TimRiker | where should I file the bug? :) |
| 21:57.25 | gdsx | TimRiker: oh, hey. I recognize you from somewhere |
| 21:57.40 | *** join/#android bloo (n=blau@c-68-39-243-76.hsd1.nj.comcast.net) |
| 21:57.47 | Disconnect | TimRiker: it does now, but it didn't when it was new. and there's an issue tracker |
| 21:57.48 | TimRiker | well, I run the abused^Wpopular infobot here. |
| 21:58.08 | Disconnect | its not that popular here |
| 21:58.29 | Chainfire | <PROTECTED> |
| 21:58.33 | gdsx | TimRiker: no, I recognize you from elsewhere (probably another channel or something) |
| 21:58.37 | TimRiker | gdsx: but I'm involved in many other open source projects. including many embedded Linux projects. |
| 21:58.44 | gdsx | aah! |
| 21:59.09 | gdsx | TimRiker: handhelds.org, no? |
| 21:59.10 | TimRiker | BZFlag, elinux, tuxscreen, infobot, debian, busybox, uclibc, ... |
| 21:59.18 | TimRiker | yeah, handhelds.org too. |
| 21:59.22 | gdsx | yeah, that's where |
| 21:59.48 | gdsx | I used to run familiar/intimate on my iPaqs |
| 21:59.56 | TimRiker | nods |
| 22:01.31 | LordMetroid | Is there any emulator and debugger available for developers to ease the production of android software? |
| 22:01.46 | TimRiker | LordMetroid: the SDK includes an emulator. |
| 22:01.49 | pandzilla | of course |
| 22:01.57 | LordMetroid | nice |
| 22:02.09 | Disconnect | we need this. http://feedproxy.google.com/~r/weblogsinc/tuaw/~3/op2UaxBJteQ/ |
| 22:03.01 | TimRiker | Disconnect: got that back when it was still free. |
| 22:03.43 | d0nets | anyone know if it is possible to stream m3u, asx, or pls files? |
| 22:03.52 | *** join/#android theCarpenter (n=virtualm@c-98-243-171-119.hsd1.mi.comcast.net) |
| 22:04.01 | TimRiker | need a better labyrinth game too. with 3d effects, sound, user editable levels, network speed competitions, non-flat floors, etc. :) |
| 22:04.46 | thoraxe | Disconnect: i don't get how you know you want to get out of something in advance? |
| 22:04.53 | thoraxe | Disconnect: do you like go to th ebathroom and then set up your fake call ? |
| 22:05.19 | vol | fadden: know where it came from? |
| 22:05.22 | TimRiker | thoraxe: just pop your phone under the table, and hit the shortcut. "oops! I gotta get that call..." |
| 22:05.25 | vol | or still looking? |
| 22:05.30 | Disconnect | you could. or just set it up as an escape - just beaouse it goes off odesn' tmean you have to bail |
| 22:05.31 | thoraxe | d0nets: why would you stream a playlist? |
| 22:05.39 | d0nets | music |
| 22:05.39 | fadden | vol: we built it internally |
| 22:05.43 | d0nets | i use jinzora |
| 22:05.46 | Disconnect | so set it for 15-30 mins and "oh its not important" or "damn i gotta go" |
| 22:05.48 | thoraxe | m3u and pls are playlists |
| 22:05.52 | d0nets | right |
| 22:05.53 | fadden | vol: the question is whether the difference is in the configuration or the sources |
| 22:05.56 | wastrel | hi |
| 22:05.58 | thoraxe | playlist != music |
| 22:06.02 | d0nets | well |
| 22:06.03 | d0nets | ok |
| 22:06.05 | vol | fadden: bleh. |
| 22:06.09 | d0nets | i dont know how jinzora works |
| 22:06.10 | fadden | vol: if the sources are different, then I need to make sure we're making the changed sources available to satisfy GPL requirements |
| 22:06.11 | thoraxe | and stream from where to where? |
| 22:06.12 | wastrel | opera mini was running on the sdk before release |
| 22:06.14 | d0nets | but you can choose between those |
| 22:06.16 | theCarpenter | is Marketplace just some website somewhere? |
| 22:06.17 | wastrel | anyone heard about current status? |
| 22:06.21 | d0nets | jinzora is kinda like Orb |
| 22:06.26 | d0nets | for music on linux |
| 22:06.35 | vol | fadden: "we built it internally" meaning "we grabbed the gdbserver source and compiled it via toolchain" |
| 22:06.46 | vol | or "we made our own very spcial customizations |
| 22:07.00 | fadden | vol: right -- I'm not sure which of those is the case. |
| 22:07.03 | Gigawatts | so, you want to stream an internet radio broadcast to the g1? |
| 22:07.09 | d0nets | i guess |
| 22:07.09 | thoraxe | d0nets: so what you're really asking is if android supports playing streamed media |
| 22:07.15 | d0nets | right |
| 22:07.16 | Disconnect | decides to be kind (ish) and release dropbear bins |
| 22:07.19 | d0nets | i know it does |
| 22:07.19 | Gigawatts | yeah, id like to know that too |
| 22:07.32 | thoraxe | i don't have an answer to that, bu ti'd like to know it too |
| 22:07.39 | d0nets | but when i click the files, it looks like its downloading something in the browser, but doesnt do anything past that |
| 22:07.42 | thoraxe | i know there is an imeem and last.fm client, so my assumption is yes |
| 22:07.55 | d0nets | thoraxe right, but i want to stream personal media |
| 22:08.03 | thoraxe | d0nets: an m3u or pls is just a playlist, it has instructions on what server to connect to |
| 22:08.13 | thoraxe | my guess is that the media player doesn't understand those files to begin with |
| 22:08.24 | Gigawatts | right, so can the g1 open streamed music from a playlist file? |
| 22:08.43 | thoraxe | i don't think out of the box it can, and i don't think there are apps for tha tyet |
| 22:08.46 | d0nets | the .ask files worked in wm6 |
| 22:08.49 | marcone | the music app understands .m3u and .pls, but only insofar as they refer to local files. |
| 22:08.59 | thoraxe | that's because .asx is a windows media playlist file |
| 22:09.03 | marcone | playlist files that reference streams are not supported |
| 22:09.19 | d0nets | well we need that |
| 22:09.23 | d0nets | and we need sirius/xm |
| 22:09.25 | thoraxe | marcone: i wonder if it'd be possible to hack the media player app and allow it to do that |
| 22:09.37 | d0nets | and i need to get my guitar tuner ported, but the java source uses javax.sound |
| 22:09.39 | Gigawatts | is there an ability to type in a url in the g1's media player? |
| 22:09.41 | d0nets | but that was removed from the sdk |
| 22:09.45 | marcone | there is no reason why you couldn't write your own app that handles playlist files and then streams the URLs they reference |
| 22:10.44 | elad | man its so strange everytime i turn off my phone and back on it always come up with an exclamation and phone icon |
| 22:10.44 | *** join/#android oavdeev_ (n=oavdeev@79.120.41.39) |
| 22:10.44 | d0nets | elad |
| 22:10.44 | d0nets | unplug the battery |
| 22:10.44 | d0nets | and then try |
| 22:10.44 | elad | battery reset didnt help this time |
| 22:10.45 | elad | i tried |
| 22:10.45 | d0nets | hold power and home |
| 22:10.45 | Cedric2 | elad: can you drag the exclamation point down? |
| 22:10.45 | d0nets | after you do batt reset |
| 22:10.45 | Cedric2 | I suspect there is a password problem |
| 22:10.45 | thoraxe | marcone: well, that assumes that android has support for playing streaming formats |
| 22:11.03 | *** join/#android rginaCrewBaen_ (n=rginaCre@drms-590ca4fc.pool.einsundeins.de) |
| 22:11.11 | marcone | thoraxe: it does |
| 22:11.20 | marcone | well, some of them at least |
| 22:11.39 | thoraxe | marcone: i'm surprised then that no one has yet written an app to access that crap then |
| 22:11.43 | thoraxe | what's taking so long!!! |
| 22:11.44 | thoraxe | haha |
| 22:11.55 | thoraxe | how much java do you need to know to write android apps? |
| 22:12.00 | elad | still no luck |
| 22:12.23 | d0nets | thoraxe i dont know any |
| 22:12.25 | elad | guess ill go to the tmobile store |
| 22:12.27 | d0nets | and i dont know wtf im doing |
| 22:12.35 | d0nets | lol |
| 22:12.43 | thoraxe | d0nets: so does that mean you have not written any apps yet? :P |
| 22:12.52 | d0nets | right |
| 22:12.56 | LordMetroid | Java isn't hard to learn |
| 22:12.57 | d0nets | but im working on porting one |
| 22:13.05 | d0nets | but they dont have some things i need in the library |
| 22:13.09 | d0nets | so im at a block |
| 22:13.12 | thoraxe | LordMetroid: i work quite often in ruby on rails and i've done a fair bit of php |
| 22:13.20 | thoraxe | LordMetroid: i guess i should look into it |
| 22:13.34 | d0nets | my buddy does ruby on rails |
| 22:13.36 | thoraxe | i can't think of an app i'd want to write though |
| 22:13.45 | d0nets | help me port my guitar tuner lol |
| 22:13.50 | d0nets | or we need a sirius/xm app |
| 22:13.51 | LordMetroid | There is excellent although a little bit hard to understand at first documentation for Java |
| 22:13.53 | d0nets | or the streaming app |
| 22:14.07 | LordMetroid | I am sure you will get a hang of it quickly |
| 22:14.19 | thoraxe | d0nets: yeah but i don't need any of that stuff - no incentive for me :P |
| 22:14.20 | *** join/#android lresende (n=luckbr19@198.80.6.3) |
| 22:14.36 | Gigawatts | how do you plan on using a xm app? |
| 22:14.46 | thoraxe | Gigawatts: to play the xm web audio |
| 22:14.47 | d0nets | gigawatts what do you mean |
| 22:14.50 | d0nets | right |
| 22:14.54 | d0nets | internet |
| 22:14.59 | thoraxe | Gigawatts: if you have an xm subscription you can also listen over the web |
| 22:15.02 | d0nets | i loved having sirius on my htc wizard |
| 22:15.06 | Gigawatts | ah, didnt know that |
| 22:15.08 | Gigawatts | ok |
| 22:15.15 | thoraxe | yup yup |
| 22:15.16 | Gigawatts | well, that fits right in with our streaming media problem |
| 22:15.18 | thoraxe | yup yup |
| 22:15.19 | d0nets | and like i said earlier, it would be AWSOME to have a "tivo" like functionality with it |
| 22:19.08 | RyeBrye | speaking of TIVO - how about a UPNP video player :P |
| 22:22.02 | thoraxe | hah |
| 22:25.00 | *** join/#android plusminus_ (i=4421a620@gateway/web/ajax/mibbit.com/x-c69c6c287e755c33) |
| 22:26.21 | *** join/#android mfrnc_ (n=mfrnc@210-84-32-12.dyn.iinet.net.au) |
| 22:26.23 | wastrel | i require opera mini |
| 22:29.58 | xp_prg | bluetooth api? |
| 22:31.39 | vol | xp_prg: whatever is available at code.google.com/android is what we know. |
| 22:31.53 | vol | afaik bluetooth is not directly available as an api? |
| 22:32.06 | *** join/#android dglazkov (n=dglazkov@nat/google/x-82212ccb4880b5e4) |
| 22:32.51 | *** join/#android jmo (n=joeo@74.125.60.1) |
| 22:32.52 | xp_prg | I hate that :( |
| 22:33.02 | xp_prg | how can I communicate easily with my arduino board then :( |
| 22:33.10 | KNY | it's coming (soon?) |
| 22:33.39 | theCarpenter | so how many packages are in marketplace right now? |
| 22:33.49 | xp_prg | there is only one android phone right now right? |
| 22:34.02 | KNY | xp_prg, yes, though people have it running on the N810 |
| 22:34.07 | KNY | theCarpenter, quite a few |
| 22:34.40 | theCarpenter | numberwise? |
| 22:34.46 | theCarpenter | is there any way of finding out? |
| 22:35.10 | theCarpenter | i'm trying to write up something for my boss |
| 22:35.16 | KNY | do you have a phone? |
| 22:35.20 | theCarpenter | and a good ballpark figure woudl be nice |
| 22:35.21 | theCarpenter | no lol |
| 22:35.23 | KNY | ah |
| 22:35.30 | theCarpenter | this is to convince the company to spring for phones ;) |
| 22:35.31 | KNY | let me see if I can make an estimate |
| 22:35.32 | KNY | :) |
| 22:35.33 | xp_prg | when are more phones coming out? |
| 22:35.37 | theCarpenter | alright, thank you :) |
| 22:35.47 | KNY | xp_prg, I believe kyocera announced that they are working on one |
| 22:35.58 | xp_prg | how long will it be? |
| 22:36.30 | KNY | xp_prg, you'll have to ask Kyocera |
| 22:37.31 | *** join/#android Laz (n=Laz1@28.184.119.70.cfl.res.rr.com) |
| 22:38.37 | KNY | theCarpenter, man, I thought I'd be able to look at the All Applications list and guess, but it stops after a certain number |
| 22:38.59 | theCarpenter | KNY: what number? |
| 22:39.05 | KNY | theCarpenter, I'm not sure :) |
| 22:39.08 | theCarpenter | k |
| 22:39.15 | KNY | I would guess ~200? |
| 22:39.36 | KNY | it's ordered by date and where it stopped, they aren't even that recent |
| 22:39.49 | KNY | and that doesn't count games |
| 22:40.07 | KNY | just pulling a number from you-know-where, maybe 500? |
| 22:40.28 | KNY | with an uncertainty of +/- 1000 ;) |
| 22:41.10 | *** join/#android BHSPitWeb (i=817834c5@gateway/web/ajax/mibbit.com/x-208cef0b6f264fca) |
| 22:41.55 | anno^da_ | Why does the main screen doesnt support the accelerometer? Every review on YouTube mentions now that the G1 hasnt got accelerometer which is wrong. :P |
| 22:42.13 | oyeoj | yeh it's annoying |
| 22:42.20 | KNY | I'll third that |
| 22:42.58 | romainguy | I would hate my G1 to change the orientation based on the accelerometers |
| 22:43.12 | anno^da_ | romainguy: ok thats true. :-) |
| 22:43.24 | anno^da_ | It just leads to some wrong statements in the reviews. |
| 22:43.26 | romainguy | I hated it on my iPhone |
| 22:43.30 | romainguy | and I hate it on my iPod nano |
| 22:43.35 | romainguy | yes, that's unfortunate |
| 22:43.36 | anno^da_ | Nearly every review mentions that :) |
| 22:43.45 | romainguy | meh |
| 22:43.49 | *** join/#android orci (n=orci@isom-310.dhcp.umass.edu) |
| 22:43.55 | romainguy | good for them if they like getting stuck in the stupid CoverFlow mode :) |
| 22:44.05 | anno^da_ | Yeah just wanted to know I understand the reason for that. :-) |
| 22:44.20 | oyeoj | well a configurable option would make everyone happy then yes? |
| 22:44.31 | anno^da_ | looks at his old gen 1 nano :D |
| 22:44.40 | zhobbs | I noticed PicSay changes orientation based on the accelerometer |
| 22:44.42 | Gigawatts | rockbox, ftw |
| 22:44.48 | romainguy | an app can request it in the manifest |
| 22:44.54 | anno^da_ | Gigawatts: only rockbox :-) |
| 22:45.07 | digitalspaghetti | heh, whats the terminal emulator that's shown up in the marketplace? |
| 22:45.10 | Gigawatts | :) thats the only reason i have a 1st gen nano |
| 22:45.18 | Laz | Accelerometer is there, The default Movie player changes position when you move it :) |
| 22:45.22 | BHSPitWeb | it's cool, when you're not trying to listen to music lying down or in bed |
| 22:45.26 | oyeoj | pterminal |
| 22:45.26 | zhobbs | digitalspaghetti: I stuck that up there :) |
| 22:45.42 | Laz | term.apk is better and its from google |
| 22:45.49 | oyeoj | noted |
| 22:45.54 | zhobbs | Laz: I stuck Term.apk on the Market |
| 22:45.58 | Laz | cool |
| 22:46.24 | KNY | that pTerminal or whatever is complete garbage |
| 22:46.26 | KNY | do not install |
| 22:46.30 | Laz | lol why |
| 22:46.38 | BHSPitWeb | I heard good things about it |
| 22:46.39 | KNY | it's totally worthless |
| 22:46.41 | anno^da_ | Gigawatts: yeah me too. I just hate the battery life of my nano after years of usage. :D |
| 22:47.14 | Laz | KNY: actual reasons please |
| 22:47.38 | KNY | Laz, maybe I'm not using it right, but the only thing that works is ls |
| 22:47.41 | Gigawatts | yeah, mine hasnt seen much use from its prev owner, so mines still pretty good |
| 22:47.41 | BHSPitWeb | KNY: I guess it's worthless if you don't use ssh |
| 22:47.42 | theCarpenter | does anyone have any idea what IP address the marketplace is at? |
| 22:47.44 | zhobbs | I'm going to regret putting it on there, I've already gotten a few emails like "what is this application for and why should I install it?" |
| 22:47.45 | theCarpenter | or URL? |
| 22:47.50 | theCarpenter | the one that android accesses via phone i mean |
| 22:47.54 | BHSPitWeb | Isn't pTerminal a ssh client? |
| 22:47.57 | KNY | BHSPitWeb, no |
| 22:48.05 | Laz | KNY: something is wrong |
| 22:48.07 | zhobbs | BHSPitWeb: that's ConnectBot |
| 22:48.08 | Gigawatts | very much know |
| 22:48.12 | Gigawatts | no* |
| 22:48.12 | KNY | ConnectBot is the best |
| 22:48.35 | BHSPitWeb | zhobbs: oh, right |
| 22:48.43 | KNY | Laz, I see it's been updated since I installed it last |
| 22:49.05 | KNY | at least the description has been updated, anyway |
| 22:49.14 | Laz | dropbear with root is the best |
| 22:49.24 | cworth | TimRiker: Hi there! |
| 22:49.26 | *** join/#android ErikT (n=erik@c-76-104-164-156.hsd1.wa.comcast.net) |
| 22:50.23 | gdsx | cworth: wait... you're a handhelds.org person also, aren't you? |
| 22:50.34 | cworth | gdsx: I was long ago, yes. |
| 22:50.38 | digitalspaghetti | nice, you can ping from terminal |
| 22:50.41 | gdsx | cworth: awesome |
| 22:50.55 | gdsx | cworth: I've asked you various questions before, I think |
| 22:51.03 | digitalspaghetti | ave 600ms ping to google.com on my phone data |
| 22:51.10 | gdsx | cworth: possibly as xsdg, or possibly as yossarian |
| 22:51.13 | cworth | gdsx: I can't refute that. :-) |
| 22:51.24 | cworth | Ah, yes, xsdg does seem more familiar. |
| 22:51.48 | Laz | irssi is finally working on the g1 :) |
| 22:52.25 | KNY | Laz, ConnectBot + screen = irssi :) |
| 22:52.49 | Laz | native irssi ftw |
| 22:53.01 | KNY | if I'm creating my own list of stuff (but not a ListActivity), is there a way I can get that nice gradient divider that ListActivity gets? |
| 22:53.05 | digitalspaghetti | yea, and set up a session and then connect using -x from android, you can see yourself typing :) |
| 22:54.09 | jimp | Any way to make connectbot send ^^ (control-^, \x1e)? I use that as my screen key since I actually use ^A all the time for other things. |
| 22:54.22 | unix_lappy | Laz: nice, how'd you get that working? |
| 22:54.38 | Laz | compiled it for the g1 |
| 22:55.06 | unix_lappy | using? |
| 22:55.21 | zhobbs | Laz, share the binary |
| 22:55.25 | Laz | cross compiler |
| 22:55.54 | Laz | ill get the script for you |
| 22:56.27 | P2E | is there any way to poke the g1 into opening a file off sd |
| 22:56.32 | P2E | just like, a random file |
| 22:56.41 | *** join/#android mpagano (n=mpagano@gentoo/developer/mpagano) |
| 22:56.52 | jimp | What do you mean, opening? I can look at pictures on my SD card, no problem. |
| 22:57.31 | P2E | I want it to use whatever the default application is to open a file I specify |
| 22:58.03 | herriojr | does anyone have experience setting up the eclipse environment for editing the android eclipse plugin? |
| 22:58.04 | marcone | KNY: look at ListView.setDivider() |
| 22:58.11 | P2E | I can't use file:///sdcard/somefile.ext can I? |
| 22:58.29 | jimp | I dunno, give it a go and let us know :) |
| 22:58.38 | zhobbs | herriojr: there are docs in the source that give pretty good instructions on getting it setup |
| 22:58.47 | KNY | marcone, I'll look into that |
| 22:58.51 | KNY | thanks |
| 22:58.56 | herriojr | yeah, I've been reading those |
| 22:58.57 | *** join/#android Dougie187 (n=doug@68.35.245.156) |
| 22:59.25 | zhobbs | herriojr: I haven't done it, just stumbled upon that doc |
| 22:59.38 | herriojr | ok |
| 22:59.42 | herriojr | the doc is missing things |
| 23:00.33 | digitalspaghetti | haha, idea ping - a android MUD client :) |
| 23:01.10 | blount | step 3: profit! |
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| 23:04.35 | jeld | digitalspaghetti, and while we are at it an android z-code machine |
| 23:05.29 | digitalspaghetti | oh yea, zorking it on the bus :) |
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| 23:05.48 | danfuzz | jeld, digitalspaghetti: <http://www.androidfreeware.org/download/twisty-0.03> |
| 23:05.51 | herriojr | I think I should make a script for them to do all this instead of having to do it manually |
| 23:05.55 | P2E | argh I would kill to be able to change my trackball sensitivity |
| 23:06.01 | jeld | YES!!! |
| 23:06.55 | digitalspaghetti | danfuzz: <3 |
| 23:07.08 | gdsx | hehe :o) |
| 23:08.02 | digitalspaghetti | why are these apps not in the marketplace yet? I suppose the developers haven't paid the $25 yet |
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| 23:09.23 | digitalspaghetti | where is the source code for terminal? I found a simple telnet client example, and I'd like to try port it to do MUD connections |
| 23:10.06 | wasabi | So you guys have root now eh/ |
| 23:10.18 | wasabi | have you taken a look to figure out exactly what closed source pieces are present? |
| 23:10.29 | wasabi | I'm curious to know whether there are many closed source drivers in it. |
| 23:11.25 | jeld | danfuzz, Failure [INSTALL_PARSE_FAILED_MANIFEST_MALFORMED] :( :( :( |
| 23:11.44 | danfuzz | durn, must still be built against a pre-1.0 sdk |
| 23:12.09 | danfuzz | actual priject page: <http://code.google.com/p/twisty/> |
| 23:12.19 | danfuzz | s/priject/project/ |
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| 23:12.20 | jeld | danfuzz, great, I can build my own |
| 23:17.23 | digitalspaghetti | where is the guide to complile and upload to the phone via USB? |
| 23:17.59 | danfuzz | start here: <http://source.android.com/documentation> |
| 23:18.32 | danfuzz | actually, here is better: <http://code.google.com/android/documentation.html> |
| 23:19.05 | danfuzz | esp: <http://code.google.com/android/intro/index.html> |
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| 23:26.29 | P2E | argh, so if the thumbnails are unix timestamp+ms, is that first play or filespec, and isn't ms *not* stored in fat? |
| 23:27.16 | BHSPitWeb | unix_lappy: a cross-compiler? |
| 23:27.24 | BHSPitWeb | unix_lappy: ignore |
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| 23:31.16 | unix_lappy | all depends on whether he can post a viable make script or a binary |
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| 23:37.45 | theCarpenter | anyone knwo the IP address the phone hits to pull Android Market information? |
| 23:38.39 | KNY | theCarpenter, still trying to get that number? :P |
| 23:38.47 | theCarpenter | yeah :P |
| 23:38.54 | theCarpenter | this is kinda driving me insane |
| 23:38.57 | KNY | heh |
| 23:39.14 | KNY | some Google employees hang around here--they might be able to help you |
| 23:40.02 | cworth | wasabi: I haven't heard what parts might be proprietary. |
| 23:40.15 | summatusmentis | are there not basic cli apps available? |
| 23:41.04 | cworth | wasabi: A great way of finding out is creating and flashing new images created from source. But I haven't heard yet that it's not risky to do that, (eg. if the bootloader refuses to boot a kernel if not signed with a particular signature). |
| 23:41.12 | ttuttle | jasta: ping |
| 23:41.21 | cworth | summatusmentis: Define "basic". ;-) |
| 23:41.40 | cworth | summatusmentis: The default install is extremely limited, but you can install busybox to get a fairly complete set. |
| 23:41.48 | KNY | hey guys, layout question: how can I get the following to happen? [[this is one LinearLayout]---------[smaller]] They're both dynamic sizes, and I want them to stay as far apart as they can |
| 23:41.57 | summatusmentis | cworth: well, shouldn't there be a way to watch net traffic from the cli? |
| 23:42.03 | KNY | in CSS, it'd be like float: right and float: left |
| 23:42.20 | theCarpenter | Indeed... although i think i've been whining enough about this that they may have heard me by now and chosen simply not to respond ;) |
| 23:42.21 | jasta | ttuttle: pong |
| 23:42.36 | KNY | theCarpenter, haha |
| 23:42.45 | ttuttle | jasta: can you help me with five later tonight? |
| 23:42.57 | d0nets | anyone know wtf to do if an app im trying to port uses javax.sound? |
| 23:43.00 | ttuttle | jasta: i'm having trouble getting it to play stuff. |
| 23:43.15 | jasta | sure. do you have some general idea what's going on? |
| 23:43.25 | d0nets | me or tuttle? |
| 23:43.32 | ttuttle | jasta: it crashes when i tap a song. |
| 23:43.33 | cworth | summatusmentis: I'd like a lot of things along those lines. But apparently the people who assembled the default images didn't expect users to want to do that kind of thing. |
| 23:43.38 | andyross | cworth: The bootloader can restore from the sdcard, so hopefully you'd be able to recover a bricked phone with an official image. Obviously not tested by me yet. |
| 23:43.41 | d0nets | tuttle i have the same prob with five |
| 23:43.49 | wasabi | cworth: Probably easy enough to just get root access adn look around. |
| 23:43.57 | ttuttle | jasta: also, one of the mbid updates fails in the server. |
| 23:43.57 | d0nets | jasta i got a log cat last night but its in my windblows partition |
| 23:44.03 | umdk1d3 | KNY: you could have the right layout in a relative layout and android:layout_alignParentRight |
| 23:44.06 | jasta | ttuttle: hmm, interesting. |
| 23:44.19 | jbq | andyross: actually, the recovery code can read a system update from the SD card (not the bootloader). |
| 23:44.23 | KNY | umdk1d3, thanks, I'll look into it |
| 23:44.26 | cworth | andyross: Hmm.. So "restore from sdcard" should be easy enough to attempt without needing to do the bricking part first. :-) |
| 23:44.30 | jasta | ttuttle: how do you mean re the mbid update? |
| 23:44.49 | digitalspaghetti | nice, i just compiled and installed my first android app (not my app, but first time i've installed this way) |
| 23:44.57 | cworth | jbq: Oh, if that's "recovery code" running under Linux, then yeah, that would make things less safe. |
| 23:45.09 | ttuttle | jasta: one of the sqlite queries (the one that saves an mbid) fails. i can get you more details later |
| 23:45.19 | jasta | that's pretty bizarre |
| 23:45.23 | andyross | Oh, yeah, clearly that's not going to work if it's not in the bootloader. |
| 23:45.30 | umdk1d3 | KNY: or you might have the layout_weight of the left object=1, havent tried that approach though |
| 23:45.42 | KNY | umdk1d3, hmm, that sounds right |
| 23:45.42 | cworth | andyross: It actually would be surprising for the bootloader to be able to read from an SD card. |
| 23:45.46 | jbq | if you screw up the system to the point recovery doesn't work, you have a permanent brick. |
| 23:45.50 | jasta | ttuttle: ok, well, the crash in the music player is probably much more critical. send me an e-mail with the logcat or something and i will definitely take a look |
| 23:46.02 | ttuttle | jasta: okay. |
| 23:46.08 | andyross | wonders if TMO has a setup for factory-reflashing phones... |
| 23:46.28 | KNY | andyross, yeah, but they probably charge you ~$399.00 :) |
| 23:46.29 | jbq | also, if all you have is recovery and an update image, that image will only install if it can still recognize the prerequisite version. |
| 23:46.33 | vol | somehow I suspect it involves sending it to HTC's factory in taiwan |
| 23:46.50 | theCarpenter | okay, new, unrelated question! |
| 23:46.50 | d0nets | jasta any idea about my question about javax.sound ? |
| 23:46.51 | theCarpenter | can i update repo from repo? |
| 23:47.00 | KNY | umdk1d3, weight="1" was exactly what I wanted it |
| 23:47.07 | KNY | theCarpenter, eh? |
| 23:47.12 | andyross | Isn't repo just a single shell script? |
| 23:47.18 | d0nets | http://groups.google.com/group/tunedroid/browse_thread/thread/264c210ddfe3f16c |
| 23:47.21 | jasta | d0nets: there is no equivalent to that package space in Android. only very limited media capabilities exist in Android. |
| 23:47.29 | theCarpenter | it says ... A new repo command ( 1.7) is available. |
| 23:47.30 | theCarpenter | ... You should upgrade soon: |
| 23:47.33 | jasta | d0nets: see MediaPlayer. if it cannot do what you need, then you're sol. |
| 23:47.45 | jbq | theCarpenter: in fact it almost auto-updates itself - when it finds there's a new version of itself it'll ask you to install the new version in the right place. |
| 23:47.50 | fadden | jasta: dalvik/libcore-disabled/sound/src/main/java/javax/sound |
| 23:47.53 | andyross | Right, but the instructions for installing repo are just fetching a single script of a web server. |
| 23:48.07 | d0nets | shiese |
| 23:48.07 | andyross | Heh, even simpler :) |
| 23:48.34 | danfuzz | what fadden said. the code isn't yet done enough to be part of a stable API, but we did make a go at it |
| 23:48.36 | d0nets | fadden whats that mean? |
| 23:48.58 | danfuzz | you are welcome to contribute high quality patches towards making it a real, usable part of the platform |
| 23:49.10 | fadden | d0nets: see danfuzz ^^ |
| 23:49.17 | jasta | fadden: do you know that this actually works? it's undocumented/private. |
| 23:49.37 | danfuzz | it most assuredly *doesn't* work, at least not completely |
| 23:49.44 | romainguy | jasta: this API is part of Java SE so you can lookup docs and examples for Java SE |
| 23:49.53 | danfuzz | and it isn't included on any device builds YET |
| 23:49.58 | romainguy | that too :) |
| 23:50.10 | spikebike | anyone compiled the iptables userspace for the g1 yet? |
| 23:50.10 | danfuzz | should it mature, it almost certainly will be included |
| 23:50.20 | d0nets | http://pastebin.com/f1165ec83 |
| 23:50.31 | d0nets | theres the code that uses it |
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| 23:50.41 | danfuzz | it's not a particularly high priority inside the android team, but again we will happily accept good patches |
| 23:50.51 | d0nets | any idears if it is possible to do at this point? |
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| 23:51.17 | andyross | There's a AudioTrack/AudioRecord C++ API in there which does callback-based mixing of streams. I haven't gotten around to trying it yet. |
| 23:51.20 | cworth | spikebike: It's next on my list. Let me know if you find a binary before I create one. |
| 23:51.29 | spikebike | will do |
| 23:52.23 | danfuzz | d0nets: there's no javax.sound.* in the 1.0 API, so no that code won't work |
| 23:52.52 | d0nets | well right |
| 23:53.02 | d0nets | but is there a way to do what the app needs to , with what is available? |
| 23:53.24 | danfuzz | sorry, i don't know off-hand. |
| 23:53.42 | danfuzz | mail the android-development list maybe? |
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| 23:54.20 | andyross | d0nets: what are the requirements again? Like I said, the native libraries seem to have a reasonably streaming interface (it does a copy over IPC instead of mapping shared buffers, I think, so not perfect, but not bad either) |
| 23:54.24 | tweakt_ | andyross, I was just wondering about that... no way to do that from java is there? |
| 23:54.46 | andyross | Not that I found, no. |
| 23:55.16 | tweakt_ | I have two different ideas that involve being able to process sampled audio in real time, and another generating audio.... in both cases it looks like I have to write to a file first :-( |
| 23:55.31 | andyross | Or do JNI. It's really not so hard. |
| 23:56.08 | andyross | Assuming, that is, that AudioTrack works the way I think it does and doesn't have bugs. Again, I haven't done anything but read source code. |
| 23:56.31 | d0nets | andyross im nto sure |
| 23:56.36 | d0nets | im still learning java |
| 23:56.37 | d0nets | lol |
| 23:56.54 | d0nets | im just trying to port and it was throwing errors about the javax.sound |
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| 23:58.08 | tweakt_ | andyross, yeah... something like that would be necessary for more advanced games too, rather than just playing samples |
| 23:58.18 | tweakt_ | it sounds like AudioTrack is what MediaPlayer uses, cause you can play multiple audio files concurrently right now |
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| 23:59.47 | andyross | Yeah, the architecture seems to be a fairly typical sound server. You make binder calls into it to register your AudioTrack object, then it calls back into your process periodically to fill buffers. AFAICT, the buffer is actually copied over the IPC though, which is unfortunate. But I'm hardly an expert here. |
