| 00:02.38 | chomchom | Is it in the proper location in relation to the package declaration at the top of the manifest entry? It could be android:name=".package.Radar" |
| 00:03.02 | d03boy | will byou guys be getting a phone oct 22 |
| 00:03.46 | donomo | chomchom: yes, Radar is in the main package that is specified in the <manifest> tag, not in a sub-package |
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| 00:35.29 | donomo | solution: <uses-library> should be inside <application> (i had it outside). sheesh! |
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| 00:37.25 | donomo | does every activity need a onCreateOptionsMenu? is it common to use a superclass so that activities show the same menu? |
| 00:37.42 | jasta | each activity. apps do not share menus |
| 00:38.41 | donomo | activities could share menus if they both inherited from a class that implements onCreateOptionsMenu, right? |
| 00:39.41 | donomo | seems wrong to copy/paste this code to build the menu into each activity |
| 00:40.52 | gdsx | donomo: I don't actually know, but the "resources can reference other resources" thing comes to mind |
| 00:43.29 | donomo | takes the easy way out with copy/paste |
| 00:46.42 | donomo | whee. i can bounce between two activities. |
| 00:47.05 | wastrel | whee |
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| 01:06.37 | Dougie187 | Looks like sprints phone is going to be htc as well. |
| 01:07.50 | jasta | how do you know? |
| 01:07.56 | Dougie187 | well. |
| 01:08.05 | Dougie187 | its just speculation. but one sec. |
| 01:08.30 | Dougie187 | So, the four manufacturers are LG, Motorola, HTC, and Samsung (in the oha at least) |
| 01:08.31 | Dougie187 | http://www.engadget.com/2008/09/29/samsung-lg-said-to-be-releasing-android-phones-in-q3-09-at-th/ |
| 01:08.46 | Dougie187 | http://www.google.com/reader/view/?tab=my#search/motorola%20android/0 |
| 01:08.50 | Dougie187 | oops. |
| 01:08.54 | Dougie187 | http://www.engadget.com/2008/09/29/motorola-getting-friendly-with-android/ |
| 01:09.19 | Dougie187 | those cause me to believe that the sprint handset will be HTC as well. |
| 01:10.14 | Dougie187 | probably some version of the G1.. |
| 01:10.23 | Dougie187 | but ionno about that |
| 01:10.37 | zhobbs | touch hd!!! |
| 01:10.49 | Dougie187 | heh |
| 01:10.50 | Dougie187 | hopefully.. |
| 01:10.53 | Dougie187 | though it doesnt have wifi. |
| 01:11.05 | Dougie187 | if it was between the touch hd and the touch pro, i think id go for the pro |
| 01:11.39 | zhobbs | oh yeah, gotta have wifi |
| 01:11.45 | Dougie187 | yeah |
| 01:11.52 | Dougie187 | wifi is the thing most people forget with the hd. |
| 01:12.06 | Dougie187 | its so hard to imagine it lacking it, since it has such an awesome display. |
| 01:12.07 | Dougie187 | lol |
| 01:13.10 | wastrel | wifi |
| 01:13.22 | Dougie187 | wifi |
| 01:13.54 | zhobbs | yeah, that's weak |
| 01:14.18 | zhobbs | some sites say it has wifi |
| 01:14.25 | Dougie187 | hmm. |
| 01:14.29 | Dougie187 | ive only heard it doesnt. |
| 01:14.37 | Dougie187 | but if it does then it will probably be awesome. |
| 01:14.42 | Dougie187 | the only thing its missing then is the keyboard |
| 01:14.56 | zhobbs | yeah, but most say it doesn't have wifi |
| 01:17.12 | Dougie187 | yeah, i think the touch pro is pretty sweet looking though |
| 01:17.15 | Dougie187 | keyboard and wifi |
| 01:17.17 | Dougie187 | but its smaller. |
| 01:17.23 | Dougie187 | and chunkier |
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| 01:30.17 | wastrel | i like the g1 |
| 01:30.39 | wastrel | couple problems but nothing too serious |
| 01:32.47 | ttuttle | wastrel: Yeah. It's pretty good for a version 1. |
| 01:33.34 | wastrel | and in a year when version 2 comes out i can give it to my wife and get the new one :] |
| 01:33.43 | ttuttle | wastrel: clever |
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| 01:48.37 | *** part/#android Dougie187 (n=doug@68.35.245.156) |
| 01:48.52 | donomo | is there a way to have an activity stay out of the 'stack', ie when it hands off to another activity, the back-arrow button skips over it |
| 01:49.48 | donomo | perhaps im misusing Activity |
| 01:50.33 | wastrel | you could destroy it when it gets paused |
| 01:50.51 | wastrel | er, stopped |
| 01:50.58 | wastrel | but yeah maybe you want a service |
| 01:51.11 | donomo | hmm |
| 01:51.48 | donomo | i was bouncing between two activities to be the first activity for the application. |
| 01:52.02 | donomo | the startup code that starts the service had to move between these two activities |
| 01:52.24 | donomo | so i thought id make a 'Start' activity that started a service, read preferences, etc, then handed off to one of the 'real' activities |
| 01:52.39 | donomo | the problem is that Back goes back to the start activity which has no UI |
| 01:54.34 | donomo | i wonder if code inside onPause can destroy itself |
| 01:56.21 | donomo | finds Activity.finish() |
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| 01:57.01 | wastrel | i was just going to suggest that :] |
| 01:57.13 | donomo | ha. that seems to do what i want. |
| 01:57.36 | donomo | props to goog for a featureful API :) |
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| 02:02.00 | Benddd | wonders when the second android phone will be released... hmmm |
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| 02:07.02 | donomo | maybe Apple has one in the works :) |
| 02:07.42 | ttuttle | donomo: I doubt it. |
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| 02:33.39 | d03boy | why cant g1 have the multitouch screen? thast so lame :( |
| 02:33.48 | ttuttle | d03boy: patents? |
| 02:33.50 | f00f- | no need |
| 02:33.54 | ttuttle | d03boy: Also it works fine. |
| 02:34.02 | ttuttle | d03boy: Multitouch often requires two hands. |
| 02:37.57 | wastrel | i'll take a keyboard over multitouch |
| 02:38.10 | wastrel | but i would like landscape without having to open the keyboard |
| 02:40.28 | d03boy | wastrel, why cant you have both? |
| 02:40.35 | d03boy | multitouch + keyboard |
| 02:40.42 | d03boy | i just like the zoom thing in teh brwoser |
| 02:41.18 | wastrel | d03boy: because the g1 doesn't have multitouch :] |
| 02:41.29 | wastrel | and the iphone doesn't have a keyboard |
| 02:41.59 | d03boy | i hope it is nice |
| 02:42.01 | d03boy | becausei want to ge tit |
| 02:42.17 | d03boy | but I just am not sure how it will compare to the iPhone |
| 02:42.28 | d03boy | any idea how much the voice plan + data plan will be? |
| 02:43.07 | wastrel | i believe it's $25/mo for limited sms and $35/mo for unlimited |
| 02:43.39 | ttuttle | wastrel: limited = 400 SMS |
| 02:43.42 | ttuttle | wastrel: correct |
| 02:43.57 | d03boy | do you think it will be possible to tether? |
| 02:43.59 | d03boy | eventually |
| 02:44.14 | d03boy | is tehre an easy way for tmobile to know whether you're tethered or not? |
| 02:44.49 | ttuttle | d03boy: yeah, they can look at your traffic. |
| 02:45.08 | wastrel | your pr0n torrents will give you away |
| 02:45.11 | ttuttle | d03boy: it's harder to tell the difference between android and a linux laptop than it would be to tell the difference between a plain old phone and a windows laptop, but they could do it. |
| 02:45.15 | ttuttle | == wastrel |
| 02:47.16 | d03boy | well I wouldnt use torrents.. I have a landline connection for that |
| 02:47.41 | d03boy | i just think its easier and quicker to use a laptop |
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| 03:04.52 | Adamant | d03boy: if you do typical web surfing, use a browser with the right user-agent, and keep the amount of browsing well below the 1G limit |
| 03:05.12 | Adamant | it's doubtful they would catch you, or even care particularly much |
| 03:06.37 | d03boy | there's a 1G limit? oh sheesh... |
| 03:06.44 | Adamant | ttuttle: I still don't see how Apple got so many patents. working multi-touch was done in research labs back in the 80's |
| 03:07.08 | ttuttle | Adamant: I'm not sure how much of multitouch they have patented, and how much is legitimately patented. |
| 03:13.38 | wastrel | i wonder if they're going to care about the 1g limit at first |
| 03:14.00 | wastrel | later on when there's more people on the network sure but in the beginning i'd bet not |
| 03:15.36 | wastrel | then again, i wonder how quickly youtube watching would eat 1GB, i'm looking at 2 100MB flv's on my system right now |
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| 03:16.50 | d03boy | i dont think it would be good business to give people bandwidth and then take it away |
| 03:18.02 | ttuttle | wastrel: The Youtube videos on Android are smaller mobile versions. |
| 03:18.16 | *** join/#android muthu (n=saraneya@218.248.24.81) |
| 03:18.38 | *** join/#android pcjjman (n=pcjjman@75-175-185-199.blng.qwest.net) |
| 03:21.53 | wastrel | ah yes that makes sense |
| 03:26.01 | ttuttle | wastrel: I mean, T-Mo doesn't want to pay for eztra network usage either. |
| 03:27.16 | f00f- | operators make boatloads of money on data revenue |
| 03:27.21 | f00f- | wastrel: it's not 1 GB anymore |
| 03:27.24 | f00f- | they retracted it |
| 03:27.49 | d03boy | im really sad that we're stuck wtih tmo |
| 03:29.03 | muthu | G1 needs to find another operator quickly |
| 03:29.16 | muthu | carrier |
| 03:29.28 | d03boy | ya.. if they are stuck with just tmo... i'll be very sad |
| 03:29.37 | muthu | v.v.sad |
| 03:29.52 | muthu | i'm more for G1 coming to india quickly |
| 03:30.04 | muthu | atleast you folks have something to play with |
| 03:31.22 | wastrel | you're not paying $1k/mo for rent :] |
| 03:31.34 | d03boy | 1195 here |
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| 03:33.22 | muthu | not sure what we'll pay |
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| 03:45.56 | *** part/#android muthu (n=saraneya@218.248.24.81) |
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| 04:11.24 | gdsx | Adamant: I was under the impression that they had silently backed off on the 1GB...err... what f00f said |
| 04:11.46 | Adamant | good, if they did back off |
| 04:14.16 | *** join/#android muthu (n=saraneya@218.248.24.81) |
| 04:14.31 | muthu | where to get jdk for ubuntu? |
| 04:14.47 | muthu | the default repos don't have jdk |
| 04:15.14 | muthu | jasta: where you download jdk for ubuntu? |
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| 04:19.18 | muthu | looks like its hidden in synaptic |
| 04:19.30 | wastrel | multiverse |
| 04:19.39 | wastrel | sun-java6-jdk |
| 04:19.44 | muthu | thx |
| 04:19.54 | *** part/#android gnusosa (n=lockonst@adsl-75-33-13-143.dsl.sndg02.sbcglobal.net) |
| 04:19.56 | wastrel | hrm i have java5 jdk on my system |
| 04:20.16 | muthu | yeah, its all java 5 anyways ;) |
| 04:21.48 | muthu | openjdk might be better |
| 04:23.24 | muthu | what does goog use? |
| 04:23.26 | muthu | open or sun? |
| 04:27.03 | swetland | sun |
| 04:27.05 | swetland | java5 |
| 04:27.30 | swetland | at least on ubuntu that's what I install for the system build |
| 04:27.43 | muthu | cool |
| 04:37.42 | jasta | me too |
| 04:37.52 | jasta | java6 will work, but you can't rely on java6 semantics/features on android |
| 04:38.04 | muthu | ok |
| 04:38.38 | swetland | ms |
| 04:38.40 | swetland | oops |
| 04:43.22 | jasta | god i love android ;P |
| 04:43.49 | jasta | quickly hacks up a fancy looking seek bar |
| 04:43.58 | SanMehat | you're winking with your tongue sticking out? |
| 04:44.08 | SanMehat | wierdo |
| 04:44.10 | jasta | i'm putting together some demonstration/test code for the basis of Five now |
| 04:44.21 | jasta | unshackling myself from the evils of the MediaPlayer finally :) |
| 04:44.41 | Kruton_Nebulon | i wonder if there will be an IRC client for Android |
| 04:44.44 | Kruton_Nebulon | does anyone know? |
| 04:44.56 | umdk1d3 | Kruton_Nebulon: there were a few google code projects out there |
| 04:44.57 | jasta | actually, i have my StreamMediaPlayer class working now, so I can invoke setDataSource(InputStream ...) and it "just works" |
| 04:44.57 | Adamant | Kruton_Nebulon: there will be if you write one |
| 04:45.06 | umdk1d3 | not sure if theyve been upgraded to 1.0 |
| 04:45.07 | jasta | although it turns out the MediaPlayer can't actually stream content (seriously!?) |
| 04:45.24 | jasta | MediaPlayer can only play from HTTP URLs where Content-Length is set. |
| 04:46.19 | SanMehat | umdk1d3: yo |
| 04:46.24 | umdk1d3 | SanMehat: hey there :) |
| 04:46.34 | SanMehat | umdk1d3: whats going on? |
| 04:46.51 | umdk1d3 | finished 5 'views today and have a few more tomorrow |
| 04:47.12 | *** join/#android Tinyboom (n=nahh@ti131310a340-1463.bb.online.no) |
| 04:47.18 | SanMehat | nice, i saw you being paraded about |
| 04:47.24 | umdk1d3 | orly? lol |
| 04:47.34 | umdk1d3 | thats not fair, because i dont think ive met you :P |
| 04:47.48 | SanMehat | no you havent :) |
| 04:48.05 | umdk1d3 | i think im in another building all day tomorrow tho :/ |
| 04:48.13 | jasta | umdk1d3: well, you've seen him paraded about. |
| 04:48.18 | jasta | ;) |
| 04:48.22 | ttuttle | SanMehat: hey, how's it going? (no I'm not asking) |
| 04:48.35 | SanMehat | umdk1d3: well you should have someone call me for lunch |
| 04:48.44 | SanMehat | ttuttle: its cool |
| 04:48.45 | umdk1d3 | jason wanted me to do a video interview thing at some point, so maybe ill be back tomorrow/weds at some point |
| 04:48.47 | ttuttle | SanMehat: cool |
| 04:48.49 | SanMehat | watching tv with the fiance |
| 04:48.58 | ttuttle | SanMehat: yay |
| 04:49.07 | swetland | what we're letting developers in the building now? madness |
| 04:49.20 | ttuttle | swetland: developers? |
| 04:49.32 | ttuttle | swetland: jeez, next thing you'll be letting *interns* in, and we all know how that'll foul things up... |
| 04:49.44 | ttuttle | umdk1d3: Are you in MTV? |
| 04:49.44 | umdk1d3 | i got to walk past the big "employees only past this point" sign ^.^ |
| 04:49.51 | umdk1d3 | ttuttle: yea |
| 04:50.04 | ttuttle | umdk1d3: You *must* try Pintxo 47 (in Building 47, hence the name). |
| 04:50.08 | ttuttle | umdk1d3: It is extremely yummy. |
| 04:50.11 | umdk1d3 | hmm |
| 04:50.17 | umdk1d3 | wonders what building i went to today |
| 04:50.22 | umdk1d3 | it was across street to east |
| 04:50.26 | umdk1d3 | *for lunch |
| 04:50.39 | ttuttle | What place? |
| 04:51.27 | umdk1d3 | went to 45 today looks like |
| 04:51.43 | SanMehat | umdk1d3: Pintxo is bollocs |
| 04:51.47 | SanMehat | ks |
| 04:54.20 | ttuttle | SanMehat: What? |
| 04:55.28 | ttuttle | SanMehat: You're clearly mistaken :-P |
| 04:56.12 | muthu | umdk1d3: heard goog cafes are the best |
| 04:56.19 | muthu | and its free! |
| 04:56.52 | umdk1d3 | muthu: the free is the best part imho, not because its freefood, but because then you dont have cachiers and a checkout line |
| 04:57.01 | umdk1d3 | *best part of their cafes |
| 04:57.01 | f00f- | buffet style? |
| 04:57.16 | umdk1d3 | f00f-: yea kinda |
| 04:57.29 | muthu | agree, the checkout lines are the worst |
| 04:57.35 | umdk1d3 | its like they optimized the lunch experience to remove any performance bottlenecks ;) |
| 04:57.38 | umdk1d3 | lool |
| 04:57.46 | muthu | hehe |
| 04:57.56 | f00f- | O(1) Lunch |
| 04:58.03 | umdk1d3 | exactly ;) |
| 04:59.11 | jasta | I'd say it's more like O(log n), where n is proportionate to BMI :) |
| 04:59.37 | f00f- | hahahaa |
| 04:59.40 | f00f- | a true reality |
| 04:59.51 | jasta | and a worst case of O(n^2) maybe ;) |
| 05:00.01 | umdk1d3 | =O |
| 05:00.27 | d03boy | O(0) |
| 05:00.32 | d03boy | my fav |
| 05:03.27 | muthu | love how nokia is changing tunes |
| 05:03.36 | muthu | nokia loves android now |
| 05:04.02 | muthu | to be fair, they said we'll wait and watch |
| 05:04.19 | muthu | now that android is kickin ass.. they are paying attention |
| 05:05.02 | SanMehat | umdk1d3: well hit me up tomorrow |
| 05:06.04 | muthu | motorola hiring anroid devs is THE news today |
| 05:06.09 | f00f- | muthu: you applied? |
| 05:06.16 | f00f- | see i told you they were hiring :D |
| 05:06.16 | muthu | naa |
| 05:06.27 | muthu | yeah |
| 05:06.46 | muthu | i'm stuck in chennai |
| 05:06.49 | f00f- | "We are a new start-up division within Motorola with strong executive level sponsorship, a 50M+ budget for our Android platform. Our new CEO, Sanjay Jha, has been in the forefront of the formation of the Android Open Handset Alliance!" |
| 05:07.05 | muthu | gr8 |
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| 05:07.27 | f00f- | damn, dns is very slow here today |
| 05:07.43 | muthu | i'm sure nokia, verizon everyone follows suit |
| 05:07.54 | f00f- | you mean switch to android? |
| 05:08.04 | muthu | not switch |
| 05:08.10 | muthu | but start |
| 05:08.18 | muthu | in parallel |
| 05:08.26 | Adamant | Motorola was in bad shit. The move to Android makes great sense for them |
| 05:08.33 | muthu | yup |
| 05:08.33 | Adamant | not sure it makes sense for everyone else yet |
| 05:08.42 | muthu | and if motorola turns around.. man! |
| 05:08.48 | f00f- | android is like their only card left |
| 05:08.50 | muthu | that's the kind of success story android needs |
| 05:08.55 | f00f- | they were looking for a buyer of their mobile unit |
| 05:09.00 | f00f- | or were rumored to have |
| 05:09.07 | muthu | if motorola hires me |
| 05:09.13 | muthu | i can turn it around in 3 yrs |
| 05:09.16 | muthu | with android |
| 05:09.25 | f00f- | pats muthu |
| 05:09.26 | f00f- | for sure |
| 05:10.08 | muthu | 700B bailout is blocked, heh? |
| 05:10.14 | f00f- | yeah |
| 05:10.19 | muthu | SHIT |
| 05:10.20 | f00f- | $1.2T lost in market this fnie day |
| 05:10.54 | muthu | android is released when the economy is in bad shit |
| 05:11.00 | muthu | this will be a good test |
| 05:11.12 | f00f- | aye |
| 05:11.16 | f00f- | google down 9.5% too today |
| 05:11.21 | muthu | yeah |
| 05:11.25 | muthu | its only the beginning |
| 05:11.34 | f00f- | yeah |
| 05:11.43 | f00f- | hopefully the next bill will give economy a little boost |
| 05:11.54 | f00f- | inflation out of control almost |
| 05:11.59 | f00f- | err |
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| 05:12.00 | f00f- | *fears* |
| 05:12.01 | f00f- | i mean |
| 05:12.13 | f00f- | it's great not to be jobless right now |
| 05:12.18 | d03boy | im watching cspan |
| 05:13.27 | muthu | what were the congress thinking? |
| 05:13.55 | summatusmentis | in not passing the bailout? |
| 05:14.03 | muthu | yeah |
| 05:14.10 | Adamant | "my constitutents will crucify me if I vote in favor of giving Wall Street taxpayer money" |
| 05:14.19 | Adamant | I think that is what they were thinking |
| 05:14.32 | summatusmentis | maybe that bailing out banks that put themselves in the position to fail in the first place seems counter-intuitive? |
| 05:14.47 | d03boy | why would you want them to pass a 700b$ bailout? |
| 05:15.03 | d03boy | you might as well ask them to take away %5 of your income |
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| 05:17.05 | snadge | i dont understand this economic situation.. its bizarre |
| 05:17.18 | d03boy | why is it bizarre? |
| 05:17.26 | snadge | republicans wanting to use tax payer money to bail out companies |
| 05:17.41 | f00f- | $700 billion will be nothing compared to what wall street is going to lose |
| 05:17.46 | f00f- | if this doesn't get passed |
| 05:17.50 | dmoffett | snadge: I think you mean Democrats. :-) |
| 05:18.01 | f00f- | dmoffett: did you see the news today? |
| 05:18.03 | summatusmentis | I hate the fact that our stock market is so dependent on things that don't immediately affect it |
| 05:18.07 | snadge | george bush was almost in tears about it.. please please pass this bill |
| 05:18.08 | dmoffett | Republican voted it down. |
| 05:18.28 | summatusmentis | well, yeah, because their constituency was up in arms over |
| 05:18.30 | summatusmentis | it |
| 05:18.47 | swetland | neither party likes it much and neither wants to pass it themselves. long term I think it's likely to cause plenty of grief |
| 05:18.50 | dmoffett | Really it is a bi-partisan screw up. |
| 05:18.54 | snadge | they should have just let wall street collapse |
| 05:19.01 | dmoffett | I agree. |
| 05:19.05 | d03boy | snadge |
| 05:19.19 | d03boy | democrats voted it up |
| 05:19.21 | f00f- | emotions over country |
| 05:19.32 | dmoffett | The last thing I want to is to fund some CEO's golden parachute. |
| 05:19.35 | d03boy | only about 60 reps voted for it |
| 05:19.38 | swetland | I do think they ought to do something rather than just let everything implode, but what I've heard so far is not particularly encouraging |
| 05:19.52 | summatusmentis | swetland: agreed |
| 05:20.41 | swetland | I'd rather it drag out longer in hopes of a less braindamaged solution than rush to pass something nobody likes with limited accountability/improvements |
| 05:20.58 | snadge | i heard on our aussie news today.. this whole problem is caused by the lack of regulation in that segment of the market place anyway |
| 05:21.12 | snadge | and that banks and other areas of the market are already havily regulated.. and have been for a long time |
| 05:21.18 | d03boy | swetland, propping up the gambling game isnt going to help |
| 05:21.25 | snadge | that the assumption that the free market should sort itself out.. was wrong |
| 05:21.37 | d03boy | there are problems with the fundamental idea of how our economy works |
| 05:21.45 | d03boy | snadge, thats because its not free |
| 05:21.55 | d03boy | its highly regulated with little oversight |
| 05:21.58 | snadge | well in australia.. only 1% of our market is futures or whatever they're called |
| 05:22.08 | snadge | in the usa its more like 15% .. which is apparently much more of a problem |
| 05:22.10 | d03boy | snadge, its a global economy |
| 05:22.36 | snadge | d03boy: kind of.. another comment was that whilst the usa suffers, others will potentially benefit |
| 05:23.04 | d03boy | some will |
| 05:23.06 | snadge | the global economy and the us economy whilst they're interlinked.. are seperate concepts |
| 05:23.08 | d03boy | but not very much |
| 05:23.46 | ismell | if you guys want a detailed explination of whats going on check out the first question |
| 05:23.47 | ismell | http://www.themoneymasters.com/faqs.htm |
| 05:25.00 | snadge | nice :) |
| 05:25.31 | f00f- | ``To pay for them it creates the $40 billion out of nothing, merely with keystrokes on a computer.`` |
| 05:25.37 | f00f- | i like that. |
| 05:26.02 | f00f- | literally it's an increment |
| 05:26.06 | f00f- | they're the only ones allowed to do it! |
| 05:26.08 | d03boy | uh huh |
| 05:26.17 | d03boy | ben bernanke is a piece of poop |
| 05:26.48 | *** join/#android eton_ (n=eton@ppp-58-8-215-118.revip2.asianet.co.th) |
| 05:26.52 | snadge | its all just wrong.. when can we riot against the system? |
| 05:27.00 | snadge | and replace it with something fair etc |
| 05:27.03 | f00f- | now is as good a time as ever |
| 05:27.07 | f00f- | energize the populace |
| 05:27.36 | ismell | its starting to happn |
| 05:27.44 | snadge | how can these dickwads play with peoples lives like that .. pull money from thin air.. create panic, then calm etc |
| 05:27.46 | ismell | americans are finally waking up to whats been going on |
| 05:28.02 | d03boy | ismell, most are clueless |
| 05:28.28 | ismell | most are, true. But theres a small majority thats atleast starting to go out and do some research |
| 05:28.40 | f00f- | actually creating it out of thin air is fine, but keep a cap on it |
| 05:28.50 | d03boy | f00f-, why is that fine? |
| 05:29.08 | snadge | my mind is exploding trying to comprehend this |
| 05:29.08 | f00f- | you don't always need the capital on hand |
| 05:29.13 | f00f- | you want to be able to stimulate the economy |
| 05:29.17 | snadge | how do you create 360 billion out of nothing |
| 05:29.21 | f00f- | but only up t oa certain point |
| 05:29.29 | d03boy | f00f-, what should that point be? |
| 05:29.38 | d03boy | until our economy collapses? |
| 05:29.40 | snadge | this whole 10% then reloan 10% thing.. is not only confusing.. it just seems wrong |
| 05:30.04 | f00f- | i guess that's what the whole bailout plan is trying to consider |
| 05:30.05 | snadge | it seems to violate the laws of thermodynamics or something |
| 05:30.10 | f00f- | to control that |
| 05:30.16 | snadge | its like the laws of physics and the laws of the economy contradict each other |
| 05:30.26 | d03boy | f00f-, did you know that this is like.. the first time congress has actually been given a vote for this plan? |
| 05:30.34 | d03boy | the fed was just bailing them out on their own before |
| 05:30.52 | f00f- | i was not aware |
| 05:30.58 | jasta | scratches his head why suddenly gravity doesn't behave like it used to |
| 05:31.02 | f00f- | peoplein congress don't even read the bills mostly |
| 05:31.04 | snadge | another thing i dont get.. this $700 billion.. is this tax payers money.. like. your taxes are being diverted towards this |
| 05:31.11 | snadge | or is this money that just gets pulled out of "thin air" |
| 05:31.18 | wastrel | it's added to the deficit |
| 05:31.23 | ismell | no its not tax payer money |
| 05:31.27 | f00f- | remember it's $700bn in loans |
| 05:31.32 | f00f- | idea is that tax payers eventually will get a return |
| 05:31.40 | f00f- | loans being 11% or so interest |
| 05:31.48 | ismell | we are technically paying for it by inflation tax |
| 05:31.49 | snadge | right.. so let me get this straight.. the government is borrowing money that doesnt exist.. to bail out companies which are going broke, because they loaned out too much non existant money? |
| 05:31.50 | snadge | :P |
| 05:32.28 | ismell | yep, does the great depression sound familiar ? ;) |
| 05:32.28 | f00f- | well, the laws allowed banks to create 90% out of thin air, if i'm reading this article correctly |
| 05:32.28 | d03boy | its inflation |
| 05:32.28 | f00f- | i better fact check |
| 05:32.28 | wastrel | republicans are bad for the economy |
| 05:32.36 | f00f- | politicians are bad for the economy |
| 05:32.40 | snadge | all i know is.. if things go to crap like this.. i will remove myself from the economy |
| 05:32.45 | ismell | f00f, imagine what 700billion will do with the same logic |
| 05:32.53 | snadge | go live out on a farm with my parents.. and grow my own food etc |
| 05:33.04 | snadge | and have several shotguns to defend myself :p |
| 05:33.05 | f00f- | better say bye bye to android dev ;) |
| 05:33.11 | ismell | haha |
| 05:33.27 | ismell | if the bailout doesn't pass, everything should stabilize within the year |
| 05:33.38 | f00f- | heh |
| 05:33.44 | ismell | if it does pass, then we will be ok for a year and then get hit even harder and longer |
| 05:33.54 | d03boy | wastrel, saying its just the republicans is probably one of the most naive things you could've said |
| 05:34.07 | d03boy | +1 ismell |
| 05:34.19 | wastrel | it's the republicans who dismantled the regulatory apparatus |
| 05:34.24 | wastrel | and allowed this to happen |
| 05:34.32 | ismell | its not just repubs, its the whole fiat currency |
| 05:34.37 | wastrel | it's the republicans who have put the nation into debt |
| 05:34.40 | muthu | if the bill passes, you can hope the economy gets back to normal |
| 05:34.49 | wastrel | the bill is dead |
| 05:35.11 | ismell | the whole pointing of fingers doesn't help |
| 05:35.21 | ismell | With one socialist bailout bill apparently on the way to passage by Congress, two more are pending¯both of them sponsored by Senator Barack Obama. One is the Jubilee Act, which would cancel as much as $75 billion worth of Third World debt, and the Global Poverty Act, which would cost an estimated $845 billion. Total potential cost: $920 billion. |
| 05:35.22 | d03boy | wastrel, democrast have held the congress for the past couple years buddy |
| 05:35.28 | ismell | if you want something againt the demos |
| 05:35.43 | snadge | nice |
| 05:35.49 | wastrel | d03boy: a year and change, yes |
| 05:36.07 | wastrel | 50/50 split in the senate |
| 05:36.08 | muthu | good, the nuclear bill got passed |
| 05:36.14 | wastrel | with joe lieberman the tiebreaker |
| 05:36.19 | f00f- | nuclear bill? |
| 05:36.19 | summatusmentis | nuclear bill? |
| 05:36.24 | muthu | for india |
| 05:36.26 | wastrel | joe lieberman who is currently campaigning for mccain |
| 05:36.39 | wastrel | it's not a democrat problem |
| 05:36.42 | wastrel | the republicnas did this |
| 05:36.51 | summatusmentis | muthu: oh, thought I'd missed something big in the US :) |
| 05:36.51 | wastrel | clinton left office with a surplus |
| 05:37.02 | d03boy | wastrel, you're retarded I think |
| 05:37.11 | f00f- | muthu: i think we need nuclear here, though |
| 05:37.12 | muthu | summatusmentis: no, it helps india's quest of nuclear energy |
| 05:37.19 | wastrel | no i am just sick and angry at what the republicans have done to this country |
| 05:37.25 | ismell | wastrel, clinton was the one that orderd fannie and freddy to lower the morgage standards |
| 05:37.34 | summatusmentis | f00f-: we need a place to put the waste first |
| 05:37.43 | f00f- | ismell: in times of economic boom and surplus... why shouldn't they? |
| 05:37.49 | wastrel | fannie and freddy have nothing to do with subprime. |
| 05:37.52 | d03boy | wastrel, you're just another idiot that is completely ignoratn to the fact that dems and reps are the same damn thing |
| 05:38.12 | summatusmentis | d03boy: I suppose you have a candidate that will change things up |
| 05:38.14 | wastrel | d03boy: would a democratic administation have invaded iraq? no. |
| 05:38.15 | ismell | sure it does, that $$ circulates in a big circle |
| 05:38.25 | d03boy | wastrel, obama wants to attack iran |
| 05:38.33 | ismell | and afganistan |
| 05:38.48 | wastrel | d03boy: where do you live? |
| 05:38.50 | ismell | its not a want to, its going to happen |
| 05:38.54 | f00f- | get your facts straight. no one wants to attack anyone. |
| 05:39.21 | muthu | i dont think US can afford to attach anyone now |
| 05:39.26 | muthu | attack |
| 05:39.26 | ismell | the banks do, they the ones that make all the $$ durring war |
| 05:39.39 | muthu | the banks are gone! |
| 05:39.59 | wastrel | WI, ok safe blue state |
| 05:40.03 | wastrel | vote for who you want |
| 05:40.03 | ismell | not really, they have all just merged into larger banks |
| 05:40.30 | muthu | and we all know what happens to large |
| 05:40.31 | f00f- | defense spending is also out of control |
| 05:40.40 | d03boy | wastrel, i'm voting 3rd party |
| 05:40.51 | summatusmentis | d03boy: green? |
| 05:40.53 | d03boy | f00f-, defense is probably the only thing that should be out of control |
| 05:40.59 | wastrel | donomo: http://www.barackobama.com/issues/foreignpolicy/#iran |
| 05:41.07 | wastrel | donomo: sorry. d03boy ^^^ |
| 05:41.09 | ismell | vote chuck baldwin |
| 05:41.30 | d03boy | wastrel, they dont have any weapons |
| 05:42.13 | muthu | paul kruger writes wonderful columns |
| 05:42.18 | muthu | guess he's with NYT |
| 05:42.19 | wastrel | krugman? |
| 05:42.27 | muthu | yeah |
| 05:42.38 | wastrel | yeah he's good |
| 05:42.56 | muthu | very insightful |
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| 05:45.33 | muthu | hope goog has a long time strategy for android given the bad economy |
| 05:45.41 | wastrel | heh |
| 05:45.55 | muthu | hehe |
| 05:46.05 | umdk1d3 | hmm |
| 05:46.08 | jasta | default pixmaps for the seek bar are ugly :) |
| 05:46.17 | umdk1d3 | http://www.barackobama.com/issues/endorsingronpaul/ |
| 05:46.19 | jasta | the bar should be smaller, and the "knob" a circle ;) |
| 05:46.20 | romainguy_ | always complaining :) |
| 05:46.22 | umdk1d3 | doesnt seem to have a position on that |
| 05:46.24 | umdk1d3 | :P |
| 05:46.39 | f00f- | lol |
| 05:46.47 | d03boy | didnt NYT endorse barack? |
| 05:46.48 | umdk1d3 | would kinda like a vertical seekbar ;) |
| 05:47.07 | romainguy_ | umdk1d3: create a RotateLayout that rotates the canvas & motion events :) |
| 05:47.12 | f00f- | ron paul? he's a bit old. |
| 05:47.12 | f00f- | i wonder who google is endorsing :) |
| 05:47.12 | f00f- | take 51% of employee opinion, and endorse that |
| 05:47.13 | muthu | d03boy: not sure, but krugman support obama |
| 05:47.29 | umdk1d3 | romainguy_: is it really that easy? =D /me peeks at docs |
| 05:47.29 | d03boy | f00f-, younger than mccain |
| 05:47.42 | muthu | f00f-: most tech support dems |
| 05:47.49 | romainguy_ | umdk1d3: I'm sure it's doable, that's how I wrote the rotating MapView in the ApiDemos |
| 05:47.49 | f00f- | both frail, next plz |
| 05:47.50 | f00f- | yeah |
| 05:47.52 | d03boy | muthu, did you do a poll? |
| 05:47.54 | umdk1d3 | umm romainguy_ no suck thing as RotateLayout :/ |
| 05:48.02 | romainguy_ | umdk1d3: I meant, write a RotateLayout :)) |
| 05:48.17 | muthu | d03boy: poll on what? |
| 05:48.26 | d03boy | muthu, you say most tech support dems..... |
| 05:48.31 | d03boy | thats a statistic |
| 05:48.32 | umdk1d3 | oh lol |
| 05:48.40 | d03boy | just wondering where you came up with that |
| 05:48.42 | umdk1d3 | adds to the neverending todo list |
| 05:49.03 | muthu | d03boy: that's my guess |
| 05:49.21 | jasta | damn, i just realized a big hole in my StreamMediaPlayer hack :( |
| 05:49.51 | jasta | eww, i have to do cleanup in finalize() i think :( |
| 05:51.20 | muthu | svn |
| 05:51.20 | muthu | The program 'svn' is currently not installed. You can install it by typing: |
| 05:51.20 | muthu | sudo apt-get install subversion |
| 05:51.20 | muthu | bash: svn: command not found |
| 05:51.26 | muthu | ubuntu is fantastic! |
| 05:51.32 | d03boy | muthu, sudo |
| 05:51.43 | d03boy | oh |
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| 05:51.50 | muthu | yeah, like the fact that ubuntu tells you what to do |
| 05:53.57 | umdk1d3 | hmm /me wonders if there is a permission for a java app to get full dump of logcat |
| 05:55.33 | romainguy_ | there's a DUMP permission |
| 05:55.44 | romainguy_ | but I don't think it's for logcat |
| 05:56.02 | romainguy_ | jasta: eww, i have to do cleanup in finalize() i think << you shouldn't rely on finalize() being called though |
| 05:58.21 | umdk1d3 | romainguy_: so someone had asked about getting crashdumps from their apps |
| 05:58.26 | umdk1d3 | thu/friday |
| 05:58.38 | umdk1d3 | and we thought about creating a single watch service that sits aroud watching for crashes |
| 05:58.51 | umdk1d3 | and feeds back the crash through a specific intent if that app was interested |
| 05:58.56 | muthu | wow, another holiday |
| 05:58.59 | muthu | love india! |
| 05:59.07 | muthu | oct 2 |
| 05:59.26 | Adamant | what's this one for? |
| 05:59.59 | muthu | Oct 02 - Gandhi Jayanthi - Birthday of Mahatma Gandhi - Father of India |
| 06:00.16 | Adamant | ah |
| 06:00.22 | Adamant | rather like President's Day here |
| 06:00.23 | muthu | the public ban on smoking comes to effect oct 02 |
| 06:00.36 | Adamant | muthu: they're banning it in India? |
| 06:00.41 | muthu | yeah |
| 06:00.48 | Adamant | I thought you guys smoked like chimneys |
| 06:00.55 | muthu | the current health minister is really health conscious ;) |
| 06:00.58 | Adamant | ah |
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| 06:01.17 | muthu | he wants to smoke tobacco, alcohol et al |
| 06:01.22 | muthu | arghhhh |
| 06:01.27 | muthu | s/smoke/ban |
| 06:01.29 | muthu | lol |
| 06:01.34 | Adamant | the bans were easier here because a lot of people had already quit smoking |
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| 06:01.44 | Adamant | banning alcohol isn't gonna work |
| 06:01.45 | muthu | Adamant: really? |
| 06:01.45 | Pradalvr | can i save my text messages on my gmail account ? |
| 06:01.53 | muthu | thought there's a lot of smokers in US |
| 06:02.05 | Adamant | muthu: yeah, the US rate of smokers is one of the world's lowest now |
| 06:02.17 | muthu | gr8 |
| 06:02.17 | Adamant | part of the reason we got so fat |
| 06:02.26 | muthu | hehe |
| 06:02.39 | Adamant | oh well, there's always meth |
| 06:02.54 | Adamant | no, that's going out of the frying pan and into the fire. |
| 06:03.04 | muthu | the health minister wants to convert wineshops into ration shops |
| 06:03.29 | Adamant | moderate alcohol intake is good for you |
| 06:03.32 | muthu | he's vehemantly against smoking and drinking |
| 06:03.55 | muthu | yup, beer is gooood |
| 06:03.58 | Pradalvr | you can not even smoke in hardly in Los aAgeles or California for that matter, muthu |
| 06:04.05 | Adamant | I can understanding smoking but he's wrong about moderate drinking and health studies have proven that. |
| 06:04.27 | Adamant | now working with alchoholics and binge drinkers would be a good idea. |
| 06:04.44 | muthu | yeah, alcohol banning in india is a bad idea |
| 06:04.57 | Adamant | muthu: we tried it in the US too, it doesn't work |
| 06:05.01 | Adamant | Prohibition |
| 06:05.03 | Pradalvr | HELLLLOOOOOOOOOOO |
| 06:05.07 | Adamant | ? |
| 06:05.08 | muthu | yup, that never works |
| 06:05.21 | muthu | Pradalvr: everyone was smoking in SF |
| 06:05.30 | Adamant | yeah, but they smoke outside |
| 06:05.34 | Adamant | not in buildings |
| 06:05.39 | muthu | right |
| 06:05.45 | romainguy_ | umdk1d3: and feeds back the crash through a specific intent if that app was interested << Shift-Menu :) |
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| 06:06.01 | Pradalvr | can anyone tell me if i can save my text messages on my gmail account ? |
| 06:08.10 | swetland | you need to be in group "log" to read from the logs, which appears to be associated with android.permission.READ_LOGS |
| 06:08.24 | umdk1d3 | romainguy_: is that for developers though? they were looking for something to get those crashes from any random users out in the real world |
| 06:08.36 | romainguy_ | ah yes, that won't help you |
| 06:08.36 | umdk1d3 | diane had talked that this wasnt implemented yet because of privacy concerns |
| 06:08.54 | Pradalvr | I am assuming a person can not |
| 06:09.06 | Adamant | yeah, there would be serious issues with crashdumps |
| 06:09.36 | umdk1d3 | well there is a difference between hard crashdump and just unhandled exceptions |
| 06:09.43 | Pradalvr | that is F****** stupid if you can not |
| 06:09.45 | swetland | probably would want something where the user is given the option to submit a crashlog (and the ability to review the log first) |
| 06:10.03 | umdk1d3 | this might just handle exceptions, which should be a harmless stack trace |
| 06:10.09 | romainguy_ | swetland: you mean the dialog box you always reply no to on Windows and Mac OS X? :)) |
| 06:10.18 | swetland | exactly ^^ |
| 06:10.36 | umdk1d3 | usually (from a dev perspective) if you know the rough neighborhood of a bug you can usually find it, even if you cant replicate it entirely |
| 06:10.47 | swetland | though if the crashlog were going to the actual developer and not the system vendor |
| 06:11.00 | swetland | I might sometimes say yes, if I thought the developer would actually do something with it |
| 06:11.43 | umdk1d3 | romainguy_: oh awesome @ MapViewCompassDemo |
| 06:11.57 | umdk1d3 | useless in the emulator tho, so not sure how many people "get" whjat it does right now |
| 06:12.13 | umdk1d3 | but your right about having to translate the touch events |
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| 06:35.01 | ttuttle | Oh, wow. |
| 06:35.17 | ttuttle | Randy's Last Lecture has made WP:List_of_Internet_phenomena, just a few list items up from 2girls1cup. |
| 06:36.27 | Adamant | we need more internet phenomena like the former and fewer of the latter. minus the dying part. |
| 06:37.33 | ttuttle | == Adamant |
| 06:37.38 | Adamant | ? |
| 06:38.04 | ttuttle | "== Adamant" roughly means "I agree with Adamant." |
| 06:38.09 | Adamant | ah |
| 06:38.19 | ttuttle | I didn't realize irssi rearranged my channels ... this was supposed to go to a CMU channel. |
| 06:38.31 | Adamant | I've only seen != used. |
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| 07:19.58 | hamdroid | romainguy_: Did you release new sample code? |
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| 07:30.44 | hamdroid | notices that people have filed bugs in the apps-for-android project with patches to get things compiling in the 1.0 SDK. Cool. |
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| 07:48.23 | cutmasta | mornin |
| 07:50.56 | hamdroid | howdy |
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| 07:57.26 | jasta_ | hmmm.... |
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| 08:16.42 | zenob | hello :), is there any way to install apk file from net (browser) ? I get error - "For security reason, your phone is set to block installation of applications not sourced in Android Market " |
| 08:22.11 | gambler | are you using an actual handset? |
| 08:24.24 | zenob | emulator |
| 08:25.12 | zenob | and i can't access settings activity |
| 08:25.47 | gambler | try reinstall? the one apk i downloaded (connectbot) worked fine for me. |
| 08:27.47 | zenob | but how can i reinstall apk ? |
| 08:28.09 | gambler | emulator -wipe-data |
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| 13:16.50 | snadge | i read somewhere $399 unlocked |
| 13:17.07 | snadge | or you could bail after 90 days or something |
| 13:17.43 | snadge | i want to take mine back to australia |
| 13:17.47 | km- | is there PAYG data on AT&T? |
| 13:17.53 | tethridge | supposedly t-mobile will unlock any of their phones if your account is in good standing after 90 days |
| 13:17.54 | snadge | thats if i can even get it.. hopefully |
| 13:18.19 | Dougie187 | km-: i heard it was already sold out. |
| 13:18.28 | snadge | i've heard that if you're american.. theres not much point unlocking it because pretty much t-mobile is the only carrier that will take it? |
| 13:18.30 | Dougie187 | and tethridge thats only for non-contract |
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| 13:18.56 | Dougie187 | snadge: thats what ive heard too. i heard the frequencies for data are only supported by tmobile |
| 13:19.31 | snadge | but in australia, i have no choice but to somehow get one unlocked or unlock it.. im presuming it will work with the 3g providers we have here |
| 13:19.45 | snadge | like three (orange telecom) and telstra, and vodafone |
| 13:19.55 | Dougie187 | whens it even coming out in australia? |
| 13:20.05 | snadge | i dont know, but i will be in the usa in november |
| 13:20.22 | snadge | there is zero information with regards to australia and android based phones |
| 13:20.27 | Dougie187 | do any of the carriers in australia support the data frequency? |
| 13:20.34 | snadge | none of the providers have made any announcements whatsoever |
| 13:20.49 | Dougie187 | i would look into that before you buy one. |
| 13:20.58 | snadge | well i know you can use the 3g iphone here |
| 13:21.03 | Dougie187 | you might want to wait and get a different phone. |
| 13:21.08 | snadge | my friend has a htc tytn ii with windows mobile 6.1 on it |
| 13:21.33 | Dougie187 | yeah but thats a different freq range (for the iphone) and i dont know abou the tytn |
| 13:21.46 | snadge | so i cant really see why dream wouldn't work.. unless it uses some magical 3g standard thats incompatible with every other 3g standard |
| 13:22.00 | snadge | :P |
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| 13:22.44 | Dougie187 | well, from what i hear its not going to work on att 3g. |
| 13:22.47 | Dougie187 | only tmobile 3g |
| 13:24.23 | km- | snadge, fyi, australia's wifi frequencies are different than america I think |
| 13:24.30 | km- | the wifi may not work. |
| 13:25.07 | snadge | you mean the 802.11 part or the 3g part? |
| 13:25.50 | Dougie187 | here are the specs snadge |
| 13:25.51 | Dougie187 | http://www.htc.com/www/product/g1/specification.html |
| 13:25.54 | snadge | ok.. so t-mobile is using 2100/1700 MHz |
| 13:25.57 | km- | 802.11 part |
| 13:26.19 | snadge | km: no.. they're the same (mostly) |
| 13:26.24 | snadge | at the very least, they overlap |
| 13:26.26 | Dougie187 | in us its using 1700/2100 |
| 13:26.57 | km- | wow, 7.2mbps? That's pretty sweet. |
| 13:27.18 | snadge | umm.. hangon, according to the htc specs |
| 13:27.20 | snadge | its supports everything |
| 13:27.31 | snadge | ahh.. operator dependant |
| 13:27.42 | Benddd | my iphone is having some issues, so I'm hoping to a) fix the issues for free or b) get a new android-based phone soon |
| 13:27.52 | Benddd | anyone have a clue when the next phone might hit? |
| 13:28.08 | Benddd | the g1 looks okay, but I bet there will be some nice hardware that comes out... |
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| 13:28.56 | Dougie187 | Benddd: sprint will have a phone by the end of the year |
| 13:29.19 | Dougie187 | but its probably going to be another htc |
| 13:29.21 | Benddd | ewww sprint... I want gsm.. love my sim card |
| 13:29.22 | Benddd | heh |
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| 13:31.02 | snadge | is the standard g1 uses called umts? |
| 13:31.30 | snadge | because apparently its at 2100mhz in australia.. jointly owned by three and telstra.. telstra also have one at 850mhz |
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| 13:32.01 | snadge | so if i can unlock it.. doesnt that mean i can use it at 2100mhz on three or telstra? |
| 13:32.34 | pardom | anyone know of a good example for sqlite db stuff in 1.0? |
| 13:32.37 | snadge | or does it require the 1700mhz part as well? |
| 13:32.47 | snadge | because theres no mention of that anywhere |
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| 13:57.19 | tethridge | Dougie187, can you give me the details on the sprint version? |
| 13:57.29 | tethridge | I thought that it wasn't going to be available until next year |
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| 14:04.31 | tethridge | Dougie187, must be getting some coffee |
| 14:04.54 | Dougie187 | sprint version doesn't have any details out yet |
| 14:05.08 | Dougie187 | im just speculating that htc will release the first sprint phone |
| 14:05.10 | tethridge | what are you basing your info on? |
| 14:05.19 | tethridge | the timeframe? |
| 14:05.21 | Dougie187 | but sprint has said that they will release a phone by the end of the year with android on it before |
| 14:05.26 | Dougie187 | yeah, time frames |
| 14:05.34 | Dougie187 | and the OHA members |
| 14:05.45 | Dougie187 | OHA members are LG Motorola Samsung and HTC |
| 14:05.58 | Dougie187 | LG and Samsung are not releasing android phones until Q3 09 |
| 14:06.08 | Dougie187 | Motorola reportedly just started working with android |
| 14:06.11 | Dougie187 | so that leaves HTC |
| 14:06.19 | tethridge | I could have sworn I heard that Sprint wouldn't have a phone out until q1 2009. I hope you are right though |
| 14:06.30 | Dougie187 | i heard sprint will have a phone out by 09 |
| 14:06.39 | Dougie187 | one sec ill get the report in a minute |
| 14:07.12 | Disconnect | heard rumours that sounded like 4q08/1q09 - more likely later than earlier. fwiw. :) |
| 14:08.44 | Dougie187 | http://www.engadget.com/2008/09/17/t-mobile-g1-said-to-be-landing-october-17th-sprint-android-phon/ |
| 14:09.55 | km- | dougie: that article is pre-announcement |
| 14:10.18 | Dougie187 | yeah |
| 14:10.19 | km- | ahh |
| 14:10.23 | Dougie187 | pre- tmobile announcement |
| 14:10.23 | km- | you're talking about the sprint rollout |
| 14:10.25 | km- | STFU's |
| 14:10.29 | Dougie187 | yeah |
| 14:11.08 | tethridge | Dougie187, I hope that is right |
| 14:11.21 | tethridge | Otherwise I have to wait until Feb when my Sprint contract is up |
| 14:11.24 | Dougie187 | i don't see why it wouldnt be. |
| 14:11.28 | Dougie187 | yeah |
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| 14:14.48 | summatusmentis | I'm really excited about sprint's android phone assuming it's touch screen |
| 14:16.00 | Dougie187 | im assuming its going to be some modification of the g1 |
| 14:16.26 | summatusmentis | I don't know, early android videos were using a device without a touchscreen... |
| 14:16.35 | Benddd | i'm kind of amazed that htc didn't put a 3.5mm headphone jack on the phone... i mean, really... in this day and age... |
| 14:16.58 | Dougie187 | well the give the usb adapter. |
| 14:17.05 | Benddd | adapters suck |
| 14:17.07 | Dougie187 | they* |
| 14:17.11 | Dougie187 | true |
| 14:17.44 | Benddd | what's the storage/expansion situation like on the g1? |
| 14:17.45 | Disconnect | Dougie187: they give it unless you preorder |
| 14:17.52 | Disconnect | Benddd: sdhc microsd |
| 14:17.57 | Dougie187 | Disconnect: true |
| 14:17.58 | Benddd | cool |
| 14:18.10 | Miek | the adapter really isn't that bad |
| 14:18.22 | Disconnect | even nokia (eventually) learned not to use the adapter. |
| 14:18.39 | Disconnect | but i was expecting it, friend was a long-time htc fanboy (until he got the iphone 3g) |
| 14:18.47 | Benddd | i hope the price of an unlocked g1 is reasonable in a month or so |
| 14:19.07 | Benddd | htc does make nice hardware |
| 14:19.11 | Dougie187 | i don't think 400 is that bad. |
| 14:19.34 | Disconnect | Benddd: it won't be reasonable for at least 90 days, at which point unlocked used units will start turning up |
| 14:19.42 | Disconnect | (90 days from release) |
| 14:25.08 | Benddd | gotcha |
| 14:25.43 | Benddd | i'm interesting in doing some app development for the phone... i know that you can publish an app to their store, but is there a way to distribute your application w/o using the store? |
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| 14:28.47 | espanico81 | buonasera |
| 14:28.54 | espanico81 | \addone |
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| 14:46.42 | rwhitby | snadge: going by the specs on http://www.htc.com/www/product/g1/specification.html, it won't work on Telstra Next-G |
| 14:47.34 | snadge | thats okay.. next-g is mainly for rural areas, the capital cities all have 2100 |
| 14:48.13 | rwhitby | km-: wifi in Australia is just a superset of the channels in the US. The freqs for the common channels are the same and fully compatible. |
| 14:48.59 | rwhitby | snadge: yep, 2100 should be fine for non-next-g 3g stuff here in .au |
| 14:49.54 | snadge | what do you mean non-next-g .. you still get reasonable internet i take it? |
| 14:51.26 | gambler | hi rwhitby suprised to see you in here |
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| 14:51.41 | rwhitby | gambler: why surprised? |
| 14:52.45 | gambler | rwhitby, I thought you were mostly working on OM...you maintain MokoMakeFile right? |
| 14:53.27 | rwhitby | gambler: I do, but I keep an eye on all "open" (to various levels) phone technology |
| 14:55.13 | km- | rwhitby: anyone working to put android on the freerunner? |
| 14:55.35 | rwhitby | km-: bit difficult without the source code, since FR is armv4 |
| 14:55.58 | gambler | that makes sense ....well I hope I can get a G1 soon. Some friends are visiting from Cali in 6 weeks so hopefully they will bring with |
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| 14:58.53 | Disconnect | gambler: and then what, mug them? :) |
| 14:59.41 | muthu_ | we need a charlie rose for G1 ;) |
| 15:02.50 | Disconnect | ? |
| 15:03.02 | gambler | Disconnect, no :) |
| 15:03.14 | Disconnect | just checking |
| 15:05.00 | gambler | np...I couldnt really think of a clever response. Its 1am and my build files are driving me crazy |
| 15:05.48 | gambler | time to wrap it up soon and go watch an episode of Terminator the Sarah Connor Chronicles |
| 15:06.09 | tethridge | it was a strange episode last night |
| 15:06.16 | tethridge | good though |
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| 15:07.01 | gambler | ding |
| 15:07.10 | gambler | leaves evil computer |
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| 15:24.56 | Disconnect | anyone here actually have one yet? |
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| 15:25.09 | jasta | quite a few people. googlers, for instance. |
| 15:26.01 | Disconnect | thats why i said 'here' :) |
| 15:26.18 | jasta | there are googlers here :) |
| 15:26.27 | jeffb | what's a google? |
| 15:26.51 | zer0her0 | a unit of measure? |
| 15:26.57 | Disconnect | fair enough. anyone try google reader with it yet? (or will we be reduced to the iphone theme?) |
| 15:27.23 | jeffb | i dont personally use reader, so, no :P |
| 15:27.46 | jasta | google reader sucks, frankly ;) |
| 15:28.02 | jasta | way better RSS aggregators out there |
| 15:28.04 | Disconnect | hmm. without having to get too neck-deep in relearning java ;) is there an emulator/sdk edition for testing webapps? |
| 15:28.20 | jasta | Disconnect: there is no special "editions" of the SDK |
| 15:28.22 | cbeust_ | jasta: web based? |
| 15:28.24 | jasta | there are* |
| 15:28.33 | jasta | cbeust_: no, web based aggregation is stupid :) |
| 15:28.34 | Disconnect | jasta: i was a big fan of ttrss but converted for the iphone/javascript-enabled mobile version of google reader. |
| 15:29.01 | jasta | especially for mobile devices. you want passive synchronization, although i guess now with gears you can have that |
| 15:29.03 | cbeust_ | jasta: over the week, I use about four different computers. Online rss readers are a necessity |
| 15:29.14 | jasta | cbeust_: i just use my cell phone for RSS |
| 15:29.16 | Disconnect | jasta: web-based (or at least servre-side) aggregation is great depending on your use-case. (I want to read it once, from multiple places,m without missing stories because my latop was turned off overnight) |
| 15:30.41 | Disconnect | jasta: and (backtracking a bit) I know there aren't special editions. i'm just asking if there is a suggested (or even workable) way to test webapps and sites for the device before we -have- the device. (partially for me, mostly for work - we're adding a mobile view and it'd be nice if it worked on something other than the half-dozen iphones floating around) |
| 15:31.25 | cbeust_ | Disconnect: the emulator should give you a very good idea of what the pages will look like on the browser |
| 15:31.54 | Disconnect | if i could show s60 emulator, nokia web tablet and android using the same backend view then chances are good i could convince the powers that be that an iphone app is the wrong way and a js-enabled mobile view gains us more (and i've got the s60 emu, 2 s60 phones and the tablets already..) |
| 15:32.01 | jasta | the emulator includes a web browser, so, uhh, yeah. |
| 15:32.20 | Disconnect | cool. diving waist-deep into the docs to get the emulator+browser working is much more doable :) |
| 15:32.22 | Disconnect | ok wasn't sure |
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| 15:32.49 | Disconnect | lots of times the sdks don't include any proprietary apps (so even if there is a bare-bones browser it won't have flash, for example) so i thought i'd ask before i got deep into it |
| 15:33.15 | cbeust_ | Disconnect: it's indeed the case for the sdk, but the browser is part of it |
| 15:35.19 | Disconnect | lol. for the record, it looks like google reader is sent in the iphone flavor (at least using the sdk browser) |
| 15:35.41 | Disconnect | and our site @ work renders pretty well without modification, so (sigh) taht might hurt my case |
| 15:35.43 | cbeust_ | How does it look? (never tried) |
| 15:36.04 | Disconnect | http://googlereader.blogspot.com/2008/05/brand-new-google-reader-for-iphone.html basically |
| 15:36.12 | Disconnect | rounded and touchable |
| 15:36.16 | Disconnect | its pretty nice actually |
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| 15:37.03 | Disconnect | and its interactive 'enough' with ajax |
| 15:38.04 | Disconnect | shows headlines, then stories expand in-place (and you can click out to the full page in a new window) |
| 15:40.37 | cbeust_ | Actually I just tried Reader on the device and indeed, it works well. Nice. |
| 15:44.58 | benley | the iphone reader interface works great on the android browser |
| 15:45.03 | benley | I use it a _lot_ |
| 15:45.14 | jasta | does it use gears? |
| 15:45.22 | benley | it doesn't seem to |
| 15:45.30 | jasta | boo :) |
| 15:45.51 | jeffb | a *wicked* lot |
| 15:46.01 | benley | well, there's no gears for iphone and afaik they didn't make any changes for android |
| 15:46.08 | Disconnect | yah it looks identical |
| 15:46.11 | benley | that sort of stuff is coming, I'm sure |
| 15:46.34 | jasta | i dont like active rss...i dont want to wait for my phone to download my stories, i just want to go read them |
| 15:46.36 | Disconnect | (which, for the record, also works on nokia's new phones - i use it on e90 all the time. the standard mobile site is a basic html-forms mess, totally annoying) |
| 15:47.00 | benley | oh cool, I wonder if the fancy ajaxy reader works on my e61 now too |
| 15:47.19 | Disconnect | just use the same url (google.com/reader/i) |
| 15:47.20 | cbeust_ | jasta: agree, but I still think that fully in sync whatever the computer I'm using is more important than instant access |
| 15:48.08 | benley | same here |
| 15:48.19 | benley | I don't mind loading rss articles as I read them |
| 15:48.32 | benley | the benefit of the reading list being in sync with my desktop machine's is more than worth it |
| 15:48.45 | cbeust_ | Particularly fast especially with the newly deployed 3G TMobile network in the Bay Area |
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| 15:51.32 | jeffb | yawn |
| 15:51.35 | benley | yizzle |
| 15:51.38 | jasta | how fast is their 3G network? has anyone benchmarked? |
| 15:51.42 | jeffb | its too early for work :( |
| 15:51.53 | benley | in boston it seems to be 'fast enough that I don't bother with wifi' generally |
| 15:51.53 | cbeust_ | It varies a lot |
| 15:51.54 | jasta | AT&T's in Seattle is typically around 400-600kbps. |
| 15:52.00 | cbeust_ | from 300 to 1200k |
| 15:52.08 | jeffb | is there a benchmark site i can test on? |
| 15:52.09 | cbeust_ | probably because it's in the early stages and has very few users |
| 15:52.13 | jasta | jeffb: yes, there's mobile speed test |
| 15:52.20 | cbeust_ | jeffb: yes, hold on |
| 15:52.22 | jeffb | whats the url |
| 15:52.26 | jeffb | ill test in boston |
| 15:52.27 | jasta | http://www.dslreports.com/mspeed |
| 15:52.30 | benley | heh, yeah ... I wonder how bogged-down the network will be when it's full of users |
| 15:52.43 | cbeust_ | Here is one: http://i.dslr.net/iphone_speedtest.html |
| 15:52.57 | benley | was about to bust that out but sees that jeffb is already doing it |
| 15:53.43 | jasta | my app needs anything over 128kbps ;) |
| 15:54.01 | jasta | although i bet my app will get throttled/shut down by T-Mobile. what a bunch of ass hats. |
| 15:54.07 | benley | I've been streaming 128k mp3s via http with the phone in my pocket, if that means anything useful |
| 15:54.08 | jeffb | lol |
| 15:54.28 | jasta | benley: well i do that currently on my AT&T phone all the time |
| 15:54.32 | cbeust_ | jasta: yes, streaming is frowned upon |
| 15:54.37 | jasta | in fact, i wrote a test app that is basically a trimmed down Five client for Windows Mobile |
| 15:54.43 | benley | jasta: yeah, in theory that should work with EDGE too |
| 15:54.56 | jasta | benley: yeah, but with EDGE the connection is too unstable. |
| 15:54.59 | benley | right |
| 15:54.59 | jasta | i tested that too |
| 15:55.48 | jasta | cbeust_: i'd be happy to develop an app that intentionally uses right up to their limits every single month ;) |
| 15:56.43 | jasta | bbl, off to work |
| 15:56.44 | jasta | later folks |
| 15:57.26 | jeffb | my device measured 460kbps on cbeust's test |
| 15:57.36 | cbeust_ | Sounds right |
| 15:57.47 | jeffb | tried again and it got 497kbps |
| 15:58.16 | jeffb | lets try the other one |
| 15:58.54 | Disconnect | hey the opened-in-new-window animation is pretty slick |
| 15:59.16 | cbeust_ | Yup, tab browsing ftw |
| 15:59.21 | benley | yeah, I'm sure people will be all "AAAA NOT AS SHINY AS IPHONE" though |
| 16:00.30 | jeffb | the other one is 435kbit on a 1mb file |
| 16:00.31 | Disconnect | i haven't seen anything with the apparent crispness of the iphone display yet (although i don't have a g1 so...) except maybe the new psp. |
| 16:01.56 | benley | jeffb: you have an iphone and a g1 on your desk, compare :) |
| 16:02.03 | jeffb | which is funny because apple blurs the shit out of their text |
| 16:02.07 | jeffb | annoys the shit out of me |
| 16:02.09 | Disconnect | yah i know |
| 16:02.28 | Disconnect | people talk about using it as an ebook reader (i've got a cybook, fyi don't get one, they are -way- too fragile for release into the world..) but ugh |
| 16:03.11 | benley | shrugs |
| 16:03.22 | cyrus__ | quit |
| 16:03.31 | ttuttle | jeffb, benley: morning |
| 16:05.25 | Disconnect | ..unclear on the concept. "Requires: Win 2K/03/XP/Vista" - http://androidcommunity.com/forums/androidmarket_view.php?catid=12&linkid=54 |
| 16:05.33 | jeffb | TUTTLES |
| 16:05.34 | benley | I dunno, both displays are nice and sharp |
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| 16:05.59 | jeffb | benley and i just compared iphone vs g1 head to head, you really cant tell the difference except for the size difference |
| 16:06.04 | benley | the iphone's is a lot more yellow (they set the color temperature somewhere around 6500k, whereas the android one is more blue) |
| 16:06.15 | benley | the iphone's screen is bigger, which I didn't realize until just now |
| 16:06.19 | benley | but they're both nice and sharp :) |
| 16:06.21 | ttuttle | JEFFBEEEEEEEEEEEE |
| 16:07.08 | Disconnect | every time i've seen them close they looked like the same size screen. i should go dig out dimensions. |
| 16:07.18 | ttuttle | jeffb: how are you? |
| 16:07.34 | *** join/#android romainguy (n=gfx@72.14.224.1) |
| 16:07.43 | ttuttle | romainguy: hey |
| 16:07.54 | romainguy | yo |
| 16:08.10 | ttuttle | romainguy: how's it going? |
| 16:08.37 | gdsx | just got 1099kbps on i.dslr.net |
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| 16:10.52 | Disconnect | damn. esato has a great phone comparitor (including sizes and such) but its not updated for g1 yet |
| 16:13.19 | Cedric2 | gdsx: I've made a few measurements at 1200 as well, but it's not going to last I bet |
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| 16:22.34 | Disconnect | is in DC - no 3g love here :( |
| 16:23.46 | gdsx | Cedric2: yeah, probably not |
| 16:23.57 | zhobbs | anyone notice SAX acting differently in 1.0? |
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| 17:01.39 | jasta | jeffb: those benchmarks are just about what i et with AT&T... |
| 17:01.45 | jasta | maybe a hair worse |
| 17:02.23 | jasta | i was secretly hoping since T-Mobile's network was new they might have some augmented bandwidth :( |
| 17:02.45 | lesceil | Disconnect: what about verizon 3G? |
| 17:03.12 | Disconnect | verizon is pretty fast out here yah |
| 17:03.22 | jasta | Sprint devices I've seen get up to 1mbps. |
| 17:03.25 | fearphage | are their detailed hardware specs for the g1 anywhere? |
| 17:03.34 | jasta | fearphage: what level of detail are you after? |
| 17:03.47 | fearphage | the chipset that it uses for wifi connectivity |
| 17:04.38 | fearphage | or perhaps my question has been asked numerous times already, does the g1 support monitor/promiscuous mode? |
| 17:05.07 | Disconnect | anyone gotten a shell running yet? (and for that matter, is tmob/google really gonna be -that- hands-off in their marketplace approval? shell tools, sim unlockers, etc...) |
| 17:06.08 | jasonlee | the t-mobile network is kind of annoying.. they do some tricks on port 80 |
| 17:06.18 | *** join/#android romainguy (n=romaingu@nat/google/x-fb431c545f697bb6) |
| 17:09.23 | benley | yeah they have fancy transparent caching proxies and such |
| 17:10.30 | jasonlee | benley: yep, we were trying to pull down a chunked response for ShopSavvy, and their proxy was buffering everything up and wouldn't flush the pipe until the remote connection closed. |
| 17:11.39 | benley | yuck |
| 17:12.12 | hagna | I bet it seemed like a good idea at the time |
| 17:14.07 | *** part/#android romero (n=user@mail.nfq.ktc.lt) |
| 17:15.26 | Disconnect | anything public yet about shopsavvy's expected pricing? (i'm hoping for "free but sponsored" of course :) ..) |
| 17:15.58 | jasta | umdk1d3 originally said his AndroidScan (now renamed) was going to be open source |
| 17:16.05 | jasta | we'll see how his good fortune has corrupted him :) |
| 17:16.36 | Disconnect | heh |
| 17:16.56 | pjv | anyone here have a standard reusable about dialog lying around? |
| 17:18.42 | jasonlee | shopsavvy will be free, but not opensource afaik |
| 17:20.15 | pjv | I take it the silence means "no", Ill develop one myself then |
| 17:21.11 | pjv | I think we should start to collect some standard components, dialogs and apps though, I find I'm developing them myself far too often |
| 17:21.45 | pjv | anyone agree or know about such an effort? |
| 17:22.17 | Disconnect | pjv: don't most other dev kits start with a simple "here's an app, here's a main window, fill in the about page, here's the menu" etc..? maybe a new "new app" template for eclipse is needed with all that stuff covered. |
| 17:22.34 | fearphage | jasta: ? |
| 17:23.02 | pjv | Disconnect, yep, an app that has the most-used components already |
| 17:23.18 | jeffb | jasta: it may be because im sitting in an area with crappy reception (5th floor of a 15 story building) |
| 17:23.24 | jeffb | surrounded by other buildings |
| 17:23.26 | pjv | like a menu, a texview and an edittext in a linearlayout, a preferences window, etc |
| 17:23.37 | Disconnect | istr the palm sdk (back in 98/99) pretty much started as a "hello world" app with the event loop and such all stubbed out |
| 17:25.31 | pjv | an about dialog that is reusable would be useful for lots of people for starters I believe |
| 17:25.47 | pjv | as gnome/gtk has too |
| 17:25.51 | Disconnect | yah |
| 17:26.26 | pjv | a main window on the project/app, a list of people who contributed, license info, etc |
| 17:27.13 | *** join/#android muthu_ (n=chatzill@59.92.77.32) |
| 17:28.05 | Disconnect | hmmmm http://software.jessies.org/terminator/ wonder if thats a decent place to start relearning java (and learning android) |
| 17:29.53 | pjv | Disconnect, I'm not sure what you mean, are you looking to start/translate a project in/into Android? |
| 17:30.04 | Disconnect | pondering porting that over |
| 17:30.27 | muthu_ | javapassion.com is the best java learning resource |
| 17:30.34 | Disconnect | cuz once a decent terminal is available its -really- open |
| 17:30.53 | pjv | I'm not sure if a terminal is the app you want on a phone |
| 17:31.38 | pjv | I might be proven wrong very soon but in my phone-universe there is no place for a terminal currently |
| 17:32.38 | pjv | Disconnect, I think there are lots of (atomically) small but very useful projects possible though for Android |
| 17:33.00 | Disconnect | esp with a keyboard, terminal turns it from a shiny phone into a small linux laptop. |
| 17:33.46 | pjv | the nice thing about Android is that the about dialog in itself could be an app for example |
| 17:33.50 | Disconnect | instead of porting a bunch of preexisting apps (think ssh) the commandline versions work and the ports and new app 'effort' can go into the gui |
| 17:33.55 | pjv | I was just thinking about that |
| 17:34.23 | pjv | isn't ssh written in C? |
| 17:35.08 | Disconnect | yep |
| 17:35.26 | ulmen | there are several ssh clients written in java |
| 17:35.29 | Disconnect | (there are java ssh apps but effectively yes, there iare a couple of nice fast arm-friendly ssh apps in C) |
| 17:35.34 | Disconnect | including sshd |
| 17:36.12 | *** join/#android thinair (n=thinair@verdelho.ccs.neu.edu) |
| 17:37.00 | thinair | with SDK 1.0, is it actually possible to communicate with tcp between two emulators (one should be the server, the other the client) ? |
| 17:40.41 | *** join/#android thinair (n=thinair@verdelho.ccs.neu.edu) |
| 17:41.58 | tric | ha, finally someone reviewed the -qemu bug/issue |
| 17:42.37 | tric | thinair: telnet to your emu and use redir or somthing, so you can forward the ports |
| 17:44.09 | thinair | ok, i will try.. |
| 17:44.10 | thinair | real device should support it ? communication between two devices.. and one as a server ? |
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| 17:46.12 | tric | i hope so ;) |
| 17:48.01 | thinair | tric : thanks it help me a lot ! I was not sure to go in a bad direction.. |
| 17:52.27 | *** join/#android Dougie187 (n=doug@wg-d232039.dsl.fsu.edu) |
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| 17:59.23 | Disconnect | not to ask a stupid question, btu does chris haseman hang out here? |
| 18:00.01 | Disconnect | wants to find out if 'pro android' will have an index or if it'll go the road of 'pulling strings with puppet' (diff't author, same pub) and be effectively worthless after the first read :/ |
| 18:01.06 | Cedric2 | Is that a book? |
| 18:01.14 | Disconnect | ya |
| 18:01.31 | Cedric2 | would stay away of any book coming up too quickly after 1.0 |
| 18:02.16 | Disconnect | apress is famous for having fast, reasonably good books that on cutting-edge tech. but (according to auth of the puppet book) they cut corners if they don't expect huge sales. |
| 18:02.32 | Disconnect | (wanna buy a puppet book? cheap? great intro, then useless cuz of lack of index :( ..) |
| 18:02.41 | Cedric2 | We've changed so many API's in the past months that I would make sure the book is at least covering 0.9 |
| 18:02.50 | Cedric2 | which is reasonably close to 1.0 |
| 18:03.16 | dipen | $35 Annual Subscription for Commosware Mark Murphy's book. |
| 18:03.40 | Disconnect | http://apress.com/book/view/9781430210641 not sure which sdk ver it covers. |
| 18:03.42 | ttuttle | Greetings. |
| 18:03.44 | Disconnect | obviously not 1.0 :) |
| 18:04.08 | muthu_ | Mark Murphy is the best |
| 18:04.26 | Disconnect | doesn't pay "subscription fees" for books |
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| 18:06.32 | muthu_ | murphy keeps the forums alive |
| 18:06.36 | dipen | Android Essential is M5 base |
| 18:06.52 | Cedric2 | Yuck |
| 18:08.49 | Acsia | what would be the best way to wait a couple of seconds during functional instrumentation? |
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| 18:09.38 | dipen | i followed jasta's advise ......using only Mark Murphy's Busy Coder Guide, Anddev.org and developerlife.com |
| 18:10.24 | pjv | why do you need books when the docs are great? (afaik these books just somewhat copy the docs) |
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| 18:10.52 | herriojr | how come we can only declare two applications to have the same user id? |
| 18:12.41 | DD94300 | agree pjv, i don;t know about others but as beginner I am finding docs difficult to understand...... |
| 18:13.05 | DD94300 | or i should say difficult to follow |
| 18:14.35 | pjv | read most of the links on the lefthand side of the android site and you'll probably know as much or more as from the books |
| 18:15.23 | pjv | if you've done the Notepad tutorials (and the api demos version) and can explain why everything is done that way, then that's it basically |
| 18:18.34 | tric | well, i would have loved some books covering the internals, like dalvik vs sun vm. background of jni and stuff. |
| 18:19.09 | fadden | There's a 1-hour talk on the android site for Dalvik vs. JVM |
| 18:19.30 | fadden | JNI is generic (and not officially supported as a mode of development in the 1.0 release). |
| 18:20.59 | tric | i know this talk. and well, not only jni, but discovering the c api to logcat earlier would have helped me alot |
| 18:22.19 | tric | and btw, jni is not supported. but in those talks developer are adviced to actually use jni for cpu intensive tasks |
| 18:23.02 | fadden | I believe it states that JNI *is* used for CPU-intensive tasks, reducing the need for a JIT for common apps. |
| 18:23.40 | fadden | I don't think they actually recommend that you plan on using it. |
| 18:24.47 | romainguy | JNI is not supported in 1.0, wait for the official support |
| 18:25.32 | tric | romainguy: what are the reasons for the missing support. cause it seems to work in sdk just fine |
| 18:26.01 | romainguy | where do you put your .so? |
| 18:26.27 | tric | into the apk and local app paths. |
| 18:26.36 | tric | working really great |
| 18:26.39 | romainguy | anyway |
| 18:26.45 | romainguy | compatibility is not guaranteed |
| 18:26.51 | romainguy | your app will probably break with the next update |
| 18:26.55 | romainguy | which sucks both for you and the users |
| 18:27.23 | tric | yeah, i first thought that is a showstopper, im putting it as a raw resource into the apk and "extract" it into the app writable directory. |
| 18:28.05 | tric | romainguy: well, my app is for research only. and i needed jni. its just for my interested why you didnt include it. |
| 18:28.46 | fadden | tric: using System.load() to pull it in manually from an absolute path? |
| 18:29.03 | romainguy | tric: because we didn't have time to get a native SDK ready for 1.0 and it wasn't a priority |
| 18:29.11 | romainguy | again, compatibility is not guaranteed |
| 18:29.13 | tric | romainguy: ah ok. ;) |
| 18:29.58 | tric | fadden: lamme check, i wrote it months ago ;) |
| 18:30.11 | tric | ok, weeks |
| 18:31.54 | tric | fadden: yeah, exactly System.load(context.getFileStreamPath(jniLibName).getAbsolutePath()) |
| 18:33.16 | jasta | pawalls: yo, you around? |
| 18:33.42 | tric | one disadvantage using this method, the lib exists twice on your device, in the apk and in the filesystem. but mine is small anyway |
| 18:33.56 | romainguy | tric: that's a nice way to quickly run out of internal storage :) |
| 18:34.15 | jasta | tric: you could design a system to download the library from somewhere else |
| 18:34.26 | jasta | but your approach is possibly better. |
| 18:34.43 | jasta | romainguy: how much internal storage is there btw? i've heard some conflicting answers... |
| 18:34.55 | jasta | i thought it was 192MB + 1GB SD included? |
| 18:35.22 | tric | jasta: my lib isnt public, so loading it from somewhere is no choice, and it extends needed bw aswell |
| 18:35.46 | romainguy | my device tells me I have 76 MB in /data |
| 18:35.52 | romainguy | 25 MB of which are free |
| 18:36.24 | herriojr | is it possible to display an activity inside another activity? |
| 18:36.31 | tric | romainguy: yes, sadly. i used adb push to /system/lib before, but that sucked for my dev process ;) |
| 18:36.43 | romainguy | besides, you can't do that on an actual phone |
| 18:36.51 | tric | yes. |
| 18:37.17 | tric | but unless you send me one, i dont think ill "ever" get one. |
| 18:37.29 | romainguy | buy one on October 22nd :) |
| 18:38.13 | tric | hehe, im not in the us. i dont have 400$ for spare, and my android work will prolly be over December 27th ;) |
| 18:39.14 | tric | but actually in my dreams my company buys me one end of october, we will see |
| 18:41.01 | Acsia | is it possible to start an Activity instrumentation with an Intent? |
| 18:42.34 | *** join/#android pjv (n=pjv@91.178.43.51) |
| 18:44.22 | Acsia | the Acticity seems to be initialized within the constructor so there isn't any way to do append an intent directly from ActicityInstrumentationTestCase |
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| 19:25.06 | tethridge | now that you guys have had a chance to really get to know android, is it possible to intercept calls before the phone starts ringing and have some business logic run to determine whether or not to send the call straight to voice mail? |
| 19:25.29 | tethridge | maybe one of you google guys will have to answer that? |
| 19:25.52 | *** part/#android Dougie187 (n=doug@wg-d232039.dsl.fsu.edu) |
| 19:29.00 | tethridge | maybe locale will have some of this functionality? |
| 19:30.46 | pardom | you can listen on a call... i don't know about hanging up on it |
| 19:30.57 | pardom | for* |
| 19:31.29 | tethridge | I don't want to hang up on it, just block the phone from ringing by sending it to voicemail |
| 19:31.57 | tethridge | say it's after midnight and unless it is an emergency I want all calls to go to voicemail so it doesn't wake me up |
| 19:32.02 | pardom | that feature is in the contacts |
| 19:32.20 | tethridge | really? |
| 19:32.32 | hagna | pardom: what about procedurally generating a ring tone based on who is calling? |
| 19:32.32 | tethridge | how does it determine if it is an emergency? |
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| 19:33.08 | pardom | ah... didn't see your "emergency" scenario |
| 19:33.25 | pardom | how would you determine an "emergency" anyway? |
| 19:33.48 | tethridge | romainguy, can you answer my question? You seem to have a good grasp on the capabilities of android |
| 19:33.58 | fadden | I have an extremely urgent need to sell you an auto warranty! |
| 19:33.58 | hagna | pardom: that's what he just asked :) |
| 19:35.06 | tethridge | one other question I have is about "visual voicemail" |
| 19:35.18 | tethridge | does android have that capability with the g1? |
| 19:35.30 | tethridge | I know it's possible, I just don't know if it is implemented |
| 19:37.06 | hagna | tethridge: idk what is visual voice mail? |
| 19:37.19 | hagna | <-- not a google |
| 19:37.20 | tethridge | it's a feature of the iphone |
| 19:37.30 | hagna | that narrows it down |
| 19:37.35 | illuminum | is anyone developing any social games for android |
| 19:37.36 | illuminum | like tag |
| 19:37.37 | pardom | tethridge: tmob would have to implement that on their end |
| 19:37.43 | tethridge | you can see a listing of all your voicemail and listen to them in whatever order you wish |
| 19:37.50 | tethridge | not necessarily |
| 19:37.50 | summatusmentis | gives you a list of all voicemail messages, so you can decide which to listen to |
| 19:37.53 | summatusmentis | oh |
| 19:37.54 | hagna | tethridge: ahh ok cool |
| 19:37.54 | pardom | or you could develop an app, but it wouldn't be reliable |
| 19:38.20 | tethridge | if you phone implemented an answering machine it could do it |
| 19:38.26 | tethridge | s/you/your/ |
| 19:38.28 | pardom | yep |
| 19:38.47 | pardom | it would take up storage on your phone |
| 19:39.17 | tethridge | yeah, but not much. I think the bigger problem would be when you are without service |
| 19:39.36 | pardom | yea for the 1 - 5 minutes they leave a message ha |
| 19:40.11 | pardom | i dunno if tmob does call forwarding, but it could be forwarded to a service that handles that |
| 19:42.23 | Disconnect | tmob does forwarding but charges minutes (might be 2x minutes, i don't recall) |
| 19:42.43 | pardom | i figured. my carrier does the same |
| 19:43.41 | pardom | one ghetto way of doing it is: |
| 19:44.00 | pardom | store all missed calls in a sqlite db and show them in the list |
| 19:44.18 | pardom | click on the 3rd one in the list i calls your vm and dials 1-7-7-7 |
| 19:44.29 | pardom | or whatever keys it needs to get to the message |
| 19:44.57 | Disconnect | that makes the pretty strong assumption that not only did everyone leave a message but you don't mind blindly deleting the ones in your way :) |
| 19:45.30 | pardom | well... you should get a notification of a vm |
| 19:45.47 | pardom | dunno if you can listen for that but maybe |
| 19:46.05 | Disconnect | right but htat just says "there is a message waiting" it never says "now there are 2" |
| 19:46.16 | pardom | LISTEN_MESSAGE_WAITING_INDICATOR |
| 19:46.41 | pardom | so clear it when a message comes in and show a custom Notification |
| 19:46.46 | tethridge | I guess the google guys are still at lunch |
| 19:46.53 | pardom | that way you get a count |
| 19:46.59 | pardom | meh, i said it was ghetto |
| 19:47.12 | Disconnect | can you clear it from the phone? i thought the network would reassert it periodically |
| 19:47.48 | pardom | i dont see why not... i can manually clear it on my crappy LG flip |
| 19:50.00 | *** join/#android romainguy__ (n=gfx@216.239.45.19) |
| 19:51.39 | Disconnect | i could also, 'way back when' but istr that tmob resent it every 6-24 hours regardless of message count |
| 19:52.24 | Disconnect | (a few times it resulted in the 'new message' alert in the dark hours while i was on call :( ..) |
| 19:53.34 | pardom | eh, well i guess the idea of visual voicemail is non-existent on android until carriers provide it then |
| 19:56.08 | tethridge | I was thinking earlier that to have a an equal amount of space as an iPhone for your music you are going to have buy another microSD card which makes the g1 more expensive |
| 19:56.29 | tethridge | at least for the 8gb iPhone |
| 19:56.48 | pardom | 8gb micro sd is less than $30 online |
| 19:56.48 | tethridge | most 8gb cards are about $30 - $40 I think |
| 19:56.57 | pardom | froogle that shit |
| 19:56.58 | romainguy | I bought an 8 GB micro sd for about 25$ |
| 19:57.02 | tethridge | less than 20? |
| 19:57.18 | tethridge | romainguy, hey |
| 19:57.26 | zhobbs | is 8GB the biggest? |
| 19:57.34 | pardom | on the g1 yes |
| 19:57.34 | benley | you can get 16gb ones now. |
| 19:57.35 | tethridge | can you answer my question about the ability to intercept calls? |
| 19:57.36 | romainguy | and the plan is still cheaper than iPhone's |
| 19:57.36 | pardom | you can get 16 |
| 19:57.39 | romainguy | so on the long run... |
| 19:57.51 | tethridge | long run the g1 is better |
| 19:57.55 | zhobbs | pardom: 16's don't work on the G1? |
| 19:57.57 | benley | and 16gb sandisk cards do indeed work in the g1 |
| 19:58.06 | benley | (others probably do too, but I haven't seen any of them) |
| 19:58.14 | pardom | i dunno... tmob said you can expand it up to 8 |
| 19:58.46 | zhobbs | benley: 16gb does work? |
| 19:58.47 | benley | pardom: they said that probably because they thought >8 didn't exist :-P |
| 19:58.51 | Disconnect | pardom: thats cuz nobody is official with 16 yet |
| 19:58.58 | benley | zhobbs: yeah, I've heard directly from someone who tested a 16gb card. |
| 19:58.58 | pardom | gotcha |
| 19:59.17 | Disconnect | and afaik if it supports 8 then it will support 16, the sdhc spec is kinda all-or-nothing |
| 19:59.23 | benley | yeah, pretty much |
| 19:59.26 | romainguy | tethridge: what do you want to do with phone calls? |
| 19:59.42 | Disconnect | (supposedly if it supports 4g but there are some non-sdhc 4g that work in things like the nokia 770, a non-sdhc platform..) |
| 19:59.45 | tethridge | a good use case is preventing drunk dialing. :-) |
| 20:00.06 | Disconnect | lol |
| 20:00.09 | tethridge | lets say that I want to send all calls that aren't from members of my "family" contact list to voicemail if it is after 10:00 PM |
| 20:00.18 | romainguy | ok |
| 20:00.24 | romainguy | I have no idea whether you can do this :) |
| 20:00.30 | romainguy | ask on the mailing list ^^ |
| 20:00.33 | tethridge | ok |
| 20:00.57 | pardom | tethridge: i assume you can |
| 20:01.24 | tethridge | you would have to be able to hook into the software that accepts the call |
| 20:01.28 | pardom | you can listen for calls, and if you can set contacts to go straight to voice mail through the contacts i assume you can do that programatically too |
| 20:02.00 | zhobbs | tethridge: neat idea btw |
| 20:02.36 | tethridge | thanks |
| 20:03.18 | Disconnect | should be able to invert it also - these people cannot call while i'm out drinking and bitching about work :) |
| 20:03.31 | tethridge | true |
| 20:04.18 | zhobbs | tethridge: you might be able to do that without worrying about intercepting calls |
| 20:04.33 | zhobbs | in the contacts list there is a flag for each contact for "go straight to voicemail" |
| 20:04.45 | zhobbs | might just set/unset those flags with an alarm manager |
| 20:05.31 | tethridge | I was just thinking something similar |
| 20:05.44 | tethridge | this functionality would be good to add into the contact list |
| 20:06.06 | tethridge | so when that setting is requested from the contacts app, it could run the business logic to determine the state |
| 20:06.44 | pardom | no tethridge: the alarm manager would set it at 10:00 to go to vm |
| 20:07.49 | tethridge | sure |
| 20:08.03 | tethridge | I guess I'll need to play with that some |
| 20:08.48 | hagna | so what's the path to get my app on a G1? do I upload it to google's market place and then ppl are free to dl or can it go straight to the phone over usb or something? |
| 20:09.06 | romainguy | both |
| 20:09.24 | pardom | i have the same question about getting it on the market place |
| 20:09.29 | pardom | what's the procedure |
| 20:09.41 | Cedric2 | It will be explained in time |
| 20:09.46 | hagna | ahh ok |
| 20:09.48 | Cedric2 | You can also make the app available on a web site |
| 20:10.26 | romainguy | I was about to say that |
| 20:10.44 | hagna | romainguy: both nice |
| 20:11.31 | hagna | one thing I don't like about cel phones is that they don't work so great when everyone is calling 911 at once |
| 20:11.53 | Disconnect | hagna: yah but neither do land-lines |
| 20:11.57 | tomgibara | Are there any google engineers here who know about the battery apis/intents? |
| 20:11.58 | hagna | Disconnect: ham radios |
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| 20:12.28 | keny | hello |
| 20:13.07 | Disconnect | zhobbs: (kinda late comment) the only issue with automatically "manually" changing that flag is you need to intercept user changes and alter one fo the profiles ('no-work' or 'last state') |
| 20:13.50 | Disconnect | hagna: ham radios only work better because of the limited number of operators vs number of available freqs/channels. |
| 20:14.27 | hagna | Disconnect: and there is also the not tied to a repeater/cel tower aspect |
| 20:14.34 | Disconnect | true |
| 20:15.11 | zhobbs | Disconnect: not sure I follow |
| 20:15.26 | Disconnect | so when will you have an android app for controlling a radio via g1? :) |
| 20:16.40 | Disconnect | zhobbs: say i activate profile "no-work" to drop calls from my boss and coworkers. it goes in, saves the prev state of the flag for those accounts and then sets it to "drop". then I say "oh but james might call" and uncheck it on james - does it get saved permanently, on the "no-work" profile or just ignored? |
| 20:17.57 | Disconnect | or go the other way - say i check a new account while that profile is active. if you ignore my actions completely it'll never uncheck -- thats suboptimal, I may expect "when i turn off the no-work profile it lets people call again".. |
| 20:18.46 | zhobbs | I would assume it's a one time exception I guess, and if you wanted to change it permanently you'd do it in the profile settings |
| 20:19.44 | Disconnect | there's a couple of use-cases there though, one of which is just a user who migrates from profile to profile and never "turns it off".. but even with the temporary case, unless you record the flag for each contact entry (and that could be thousands) you need to watch for the state change somehow instead. |
| 20:20.25 | Disconnect | thinks its a cool idea |
| 20:21.05 | zhobbs | yeah, but for when I'm ignoring some calls I don't want it to go straight to voicemail, I want it to ring for a while |
| 20:21.12 | zhobbs | then go to voicemail |
| 20:21.37 | Disconnect | thats something i had wondered about. although "my phone was off" (or out of range) works for that case |
| 20:21.44 | Disconnect | so long as you never ever tell anyone you are the developer of that app :) |
| 20:21.57 | Disconnect | cuz as soon as you do, anytime you miss a call people are gonna take it personally :) |
| 20:23.29 | Disconnect | ooooh and it'd need an (optional) override mode - "if a number calls more than x times, allow it through" |
| 20:23.55 | zhobbs | ahh...then you have to monitor incoming calls...and we're not sure if that's possible |
| 20:24.13 | Disconnect | if you flip that flag you don't get a missed-call notification? |
| 20:24.31 | Disconnect | hasn't gotten particularly far into the sdk yet, still just reading the intro docs |
| 20:24.31 | zhobbs | hmm, don't know |
| 20:25.33 | pardom | you could listen for calls and just count them from that number, then when you reach your max change the flag |
| 20:27.05 | tethridge | then that crazy girl would still get through after calling you 15 times |
| 20:27.07 | tethridge | :-) |
| 20:27.36 | keny | i missed the important part, but this sounds like a very interesting application :) |
| 20:27.45 | pardom | crazy girl / booty call |
| 20:28.17 | keny | is this some kind of application that sits on top of the core system managing calls or a replacement for it ? |
| 20:28.31 | zhobbs | on the same kind of lines, I was thinking that an app called "DumbPhone" would be good...it makes it so you can just dial/recieve calls |
| 20:28.45 | tethridge | imagines custom pbx like messages. "If this is a booty call, press 1..." |
| 20:28.55 | zhobbs | cause sometimes you're out with people and you get a notification about an email, etc |
| 20:29.06 | pardom | ha |
| 20:30.50 | pardom | you would need crazy girl CAPTCHA tho |
| 20:31.02 | anno^da | http://gizmodo.com/5056476/why-android-will-soon-kick-ass# <- the press is getting better and better |
| 20:31.22 | Disconnect | pardom: "If you want some of {bob}'s hair in a locket, press 3" "I'm sorry, this call is too insane for this caller. Please try your call again saner." |
| 20:31.48 | pardom | lol |
| 20:34.43 | Disconnect | likes "I'm sorry, your call could not be completed while psycho. Please try your call again saner." but couldn't find the wording in time :) |
| 20:35.34 | Disconnect | ooooh someone needs to start porting asterisk and flite :) |
| 20:35.46 | Disconnect | course, there is already a nice fast flite for arm but its in native C |
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| 20:39.20 | ezak | hi anyone using android on zaurus? |
| 20:40.38 | tethridge | man, that's a product from the past. I haven't heard mention of it in a long time |
| 20:40.46 | ezak | :( |
| 20:40.53 | ezak | it was a nice product back then |
| 20:41.05 | tethridge | yeah, I remember reading about it |
| 20:41.07 | ezak | been playing with the an old beta of android on it |
| 20:41.09 | Disconnect | afair its been done but not in any reasonable/useful way |
| 20:41.14 | Disconnect | ah maybe that was you i was reading |
| 20:41.21 | ezak | nope |
| 20:41.35 | ezak | but I bet we read the same stuff |
| 20:41.39 | Disconnect | heh |
| 20:41.49 | ezak | got a fully patched kernel |
| 20:41.59 | ezak | but on init > seg fault |
| 20:42.00 | ezak | :( |
| 20:42.01 | Disconnect | has a c760 he wouldn't mind charging up again |
| 20:42.06 | ezak | :) |
| 20:42.10 | ezak | I have c750 |
| 20:42.29 | ezak | I can provide working kernel with modules if you care |
| 20:42.43 | ezak | I installed a base angstrom |
| 20:42.58 | ezak | newer patched kernel on top of it |
| 20:43.31 | ezak | and found a slc3200 android root that I unpacked to sd |
| 20:43.33 | Disconnect | gonna hold off on the biggest efforts until i have my g1 |
| 20:43.38 | ezak | 0.9 beta |
| 20:43.47 | ezak | oh |
| 20:43.48 | Disconnect | is prolly gonna focus on a terminal app first. |
| 20:43.49 | ezak | I'm in france |
| 20:43.54 | Disconnect | :( |
| 20:43.57 | ezak | so no g1 for quite some long ass time |
| 20:44.00 | nizox | un français ! :) |
| 20:44.05 | ezak | yup |
| 20:44.10 | Cedric2 | There are a few of us on this channel already |
| 20:44.39 | Disconnect | might be able to swing an import deal if you get enough people. freqs are prolly wrong (at least for 3g) but.. |
| 20:44.55 | ezak | that's true that zaurus are things of the past it still hasn't finished dding a 80 megs ext2 image since I'm talking there |
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| 20:47.24 | ambi | salve |
| 20:56.36 | ambi | !list |
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| 21:02.51 | DD94300 | quick question, why android.view.Menu has setIcon() method is not available? where android.view.SubMenu does...... |
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| 21:11.52 | AttractiveApe | tethridge: not really an iphone feature, blackberries have it as well. |
| 21:12.08 | tethridge | what feature is that? |
| 21:12.08 | AttractiveApe | yikes, my scroll bar was waaay up. |
| 21:12.11 | AttractiveApe | disregard. |
| 21:12.15 | tethridge | :-) |
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| 21:14.25 | mazzen | does anyone knows if androids calendar has sync support for evolution? |
| 21:14.42 | tethridge | not yet |
| 21:14.56 | tethridge | that should be android does not have support yet |
| 21:15.17 | mazzen | so, there is already a project for that? |
| 21:15.23 | tethridge | it only syncs to gmail at the moment |
| 21:15.28 | tethridge | nope |
| 21:16.19 | mazzen | k, thanks tethridge |
| 21:16.47 | tethridge | np |
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| 22:01.14 | jasta | wonders if it will be a commercial exchange solution or an open source one that wins out on Android... |
| 22:01.25 | jasta | now that M$ has all the docs open, i can't imagine the latter being that hard |
| 22:03.16 | unix_lappy | they could obviously release their own client as they'd make more money on server, exchange, etc licensing than WindowsMobile. |
| 22:03.19 | unix_lappy | but they wont. |
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| 22:30.14 | *** join/#android gary| (n=gary@93-96-140-104.zone4.bethere.co.uk) |
| 22:30.50 | gary| | wandering if anyone can help, i'm trying to find out when you should use @+ in the manifest. I read about it before briefly but didnt save the link. |
| 22:31.08 | gary| | manifest/xml layout files |
| 22:33.40 | jasta | @+ creates an id |
| 22:33.56 | jasta | it's like of like a directive to the parser |
| 22:34.01 | jasta | it's kind of like* |
| 22:34.45 | gary| | do you have a link where ii can read more about it? |
| 22:34.53 | jasta | nope, i just know that to be true :) |
| 22:35.06 | sialivi | anyone knows who's taken over the development of undroid? |
| 22:35.31 | Dougie187 | undroid? |
| 22:35.42 | sialivi | android netbeans plugin |
| 22:35.50 | Dougie187 | hmm. |
| 22:37.25 | unix_lappy | interesting...wonder what netbeans offers that eclipse or jedit doesnt. |
| 22:37.49 | sialivi | for android development or in general? |
| 22:39.35 | sialivi | undroid hasn't been updated since january so it doesn't work with the current android release, the website says they've passed it on to a new developer but doesn't mention any details |
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| 22:53.19 | ttuttle | hey |
| 22:58.09 | jasta | sweet, masa was updated |
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| 23:14.01 | jasta | does anyone know if MediaPlayer#getCurrentPosition or getDuration are expensive? |
| 23:14.19 | jasta | as in, should i just call them every second to update playing progress or rely on a timer myself? |
| 23:14.53 | jasta | actually nevermind, i have to do that since i can't detect choking |
| 23:14.53 | Dougie187 | couldn't you time them? |
| 23:15.26 | jasta | Dougie187: i just realized i can't, because if the MediaPlayer playing from a stream chokes then each second will not necessarily represent a change in playback position |
| 23:15.53 | Dougie187 | true |
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| 23:37.53 | jasta | looks at re-styling the seek bar to be much sexier |
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| 23:41.48 | jasta | wait, i'm no good at this :) |
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