| 00:06.42 | *** join/#android chomchom (n=chomchom@78.32.95.81) |
| 00:08.19 | chomchom | hooray an iphone update! 2.0.1 is out. Thank frig because the 2.0.0 release managed to really slow everything down to an unenjoyable lag fest. Pretty hefty at 250meg. |
| 00:09.10 | michaelnovakjr__ | hm, i think you're in the wrong room :0 |
| 00:09.14 | michaelnovakjr__ | :) |
| 00:10.30 | jasta | i do too :) |
| 00:11.37 | chomchom | Great artists steal guys. You're doing yourselfs a disfavour if you're not keeping an eagle eye on iphone apps |
| 00:11.55 | michaelnovakjr__ | why? |
| 00:12.36 | michaelnovakjr__ | i don't need to steal ideas to create good apps |
| 00:12.40 | chomchom | because they are modern smart phone apps that are carefully engineered and tested. |
| 00:12.43 | michaelnovakjr__ | at least i'd like to think so :) |
| 00:12.43 | jasta | chomchom: i agree, but still, why would we care about an update that improves performance? |
| 00:12.58 | chomchom | because you might have a laggy iphone |
| 00:13.03 | michaelnovakjr__ | i don't even care to own one :) |
| 00:13.19 | michaelnovakjr__ | i like to have a few apps running in the background :) |
| 00:13.19 | jasta | chomchom: it was just a joke anyway. lots of folks here use iPhones |
| 00:13.25 | michaelnovakjr__ | :) |
| 00:13.26 | jasta | and lots of folks talk about the SDK< and bla bla apple |
| 00:13.43 | chomchom | yeah they're excellent. |
| 00:13.53 | chomchom | How are you doing anyway Jasta? Haven' been lurking around in here much lately |
| 00:14.01 | chomchom | hows your app coming along? |
| 00:14.19 | jasta | i haven't worked on it for quite a few months now |
| 00:14.40 | chomchom | still building that raging frustration? |
| 00:14.56 | jasta | why are you trolling? |
| 00:15.08 | chomchom | I'm not trolling man :) |
| 00:15.11 | chomchom | just chatting |
| 00:15.56 | jasta | could have fooled me. |
| 00:16.34 | chomchom | So have you been leasing your valuable skills out to others recently? Fives got a lot of potential, I hope you'll get some momentum back maybe in time for the next ADC. |
| 00:17.00 | michaelnovakjr__ | why submit in another ADC? |
| 00:17.15 | michaelnovakjr__ | you'll only be competing with large teams of full time developers |
| 00:17.30 | chomchom | well whats wrong with that then? |
| 00:17.33 | jasta | Your sincerity could use some work, chomchom. I'm going to keep my business to myself, thank you. |
| 00:18.32 | chomchom | :0 hey man, I'm not prying! Just bantering, I haven't been hanging around in here for a while and I've missed you guys! |
| 00:19.40 | michaelnovakjr__ | your interest in android is obvious from the iphone comments :) |
| 00:19.43 | chomchom | michaelnovakjr__: you could team up with some buddies then for the next ADC |
| 00:19.58 | michaelnovakjr__ | not interested |
| 00:20.10 | michaelnovakjr__ | i'm doing just fine writing open source apps |
| 00:20.35 | chomchom | thats a shame man, I'm looking forward to it. I loved the dead line looming and everyone slaving away over their secret apps |
| 00:20.55 | chomchom | you can still make it open source and free man |
| 00:20.56 | jasta | michaelnovakjr__: i'm probably going to participate. |
| 00:20.57 | michaelnovakjr__ | i don't really, not a fan of secret projects |
| 00:21.06 | chomchom | nah me neither |
| 00:21.22 | jasta | michaelnovakjr__: but only as a side effect, just as before. my app is getting developed either way. |
| 00:21.41 | chomchom | I didn't like the secret element, but I did like how devoted and excited everyone was |
| 00:21.47 | chomchom | it felt like a real community |
| 00:21.57 | michaelnovakjr__ | makes sense.... i comparing developing now as to during the ADC, i much prefer now :) |
| 00:22.11 | chomchom | jasta: exactly, we may as well submit since we are developing anyway |
| 00:22.15 | jasta | michaelnovakjr__: well, sure, but again my app is going to get developed either way. |
| 00:22.42 | jasta | but i'd rather not make a big production out of this conversation. |
| 00:22.53 | jasta | all things concerning Google's behaviour of the last 6 months should be taboo conversation in here :) |
| 00:22.59 | michaelnovakjr__ | haha :0 |
| 00:23.28 | chomchom | :) their working on a great kit for us, I'm sure of it |
| 00:24.04 | chomchom | And we'll all get the next sdk and be like "waaaaah! Theres so much great stuff for us to play with!!" |
| 00:33.23 | chomchom | Besides I'm sure the google guys all have their reasons. There are a lot of partners in the open handset alliance, I can imagine with that much corporate bureaucracy things could get messy before they get good. I bet all the google guys are mega frustrated too. Especially poor romainguy who has to watch us whine. |
| 00:33.44 | romainguy_ | that you do :) |
| 00:33.47 | romainguy_ | (whine :) |
| 00:33.53 | chomchom | wahh |
| 00:34.28 | chomchom | romainguy: I don't suppose you will be at the London developer day will you? |
| 00:34.41 | romainguy_ | unfortunately no |
| 00:34.45 | chomchom | shame |
| 00:34.48 | romainguy_ | I'll probably be busy taming ListView |
| 00:35.43 | chomchom | I hope for a significant Android presence |
| 00:36.06 | michaelnovakjr__ | why? |
| 00:36.16 | chomchom | ascia tells me that there hasn't been much in the way of a hitech attendance at the London meetup groups |
| 00:36.29 | chomchom | well I'd like to discuss the platform in depth |
| 00:37.00 | michaelnovakjr__ | what's your interest in android? |
| 00:37.44 | chomchom | Well I've been developing on it for neigh on 8 months so its development concerns me a lot |
| 00:37.56 | chomchom | plus I'm hyped to it's potentiol! |
| 00:38.17 | michaelnovakjr__ | so why the turn to the iphone? |
| 00:38.30 | chomchom | ...because its a great product |
| 00:39.02 | chomchom | michaelnovakjr__:its not an either or competition |
| 00:40.10 | chomchom | we would do both platforms an injustice to fall into a silly fanboy macs vs window argument |
| 00:41.11 | michaelnovakjr__ | i don't see it that way, i just don't have use for a platform that only allows one way to get apps and no background processes, and not to mention no linux support |
| 00:42.15 | chomchom | well thats cool you don't have to. :) |
| 00:42.29 | chomchom | But its on a very different path to android |
| 00:42.39 | chomchom | so there is no fear of direct competition |
| 00:42.40 | michaelnovakjr__ | how so? |
| 00:42.49 | chomchom | Iphone is on the corporate path |
| 00:43.02 | chomchom | Got its sights on mr blackberry |
| 00:43.12 | chomchom | since windows mobile is laaame |
| 00:43.26 | michaelnovakjr__ | its better than the iphone in terms of development freedoms |
| 00:43.39 | chomchom | ofcourse absolutely |
| 00:43.43 | michaelnovakjr__ | i can do more on my win mo phone than you could on an iphone |
| 00:44.09 | chomchom | Maybe you could |
| 00:44.21 | michaelnovakjr__ | its a fact you can :) |
| 00:44.48 | chomchom | But I very much doubt you experience the same rich client that makes it a pleasure to use. |
| 00:45.58 | michaelnovakjr__ | eh, i wasn't blown away by the iphone UI experience |
| 00:46.12 | michaelnovakjr__ | and I have been an apple developer for quite some time |
| 00:46.14 | chomchom | Its great man, I'd really recommend it |
| 00:46.30 | michaelnovakjr__ | i have no use for it |
| 00:48.28 | chomchom | android on the other hand is going for the 'open market'. low -> high spec phones. I'm sure they will very soon have equivalent phones as well as much more affordable ones. Then undoubtedly I'll switch so I can play with it! :) |
| 00:49.26 | chomchom | I can't wait to see what hardware manufacturers do with this new little linux distro |
| 00:50.14 | michaelnovakjr__ | little? |
| 00:50.59 | chomchom | well android might not be the smallest but its not huge |
| 00:53.46 | romainguy_ | I also would not call it a Linux distro |
| 00:55.22 | chomchom | Do you not see it being used as an alternative free, light weight file system on new hardware coming to market? |
| 00:56.58 | michaelnovakjr__ | file system? |
| 00:57.00 | chomchom | Android strikes me as an ideal mobile platform since so much work has went into developing its integration with the JVM bundled with it. |
| 00:57.15 | michaelnovakjr__ | you said you have 8 months programming it? |
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| 00:57.29 | michaelnovakjr__ | and all you got out of it is a light weight file system? |
| 00:57.38 | chomchom | yes, |
| 00:57.51 | michaelnovakjr__ | did you fire up the emulator? |
| 00:58.01 | chomchom | :) I've been learning how to cd up and down directories |
| 00:58.02 | michaelnovakjr__ | last time i checked file systems don't come with a dialer |
| 00:59.08 | chomchom | now whos trolling? :) You know what I mean, its an operating system + bespoke JVM |
| 00:59.31 | michaelnovakjr__ | what are you talking about? |
| 01:00.41 | chomchom | never mind. I was just trying to excite some interest in it potential outside just phone to phone communication. |
| 01:00.58 | michaelnovakjr__ | there is |
| 01:01.06 | michaelnovakjr__ | have you not seen any of the top 50 apps |
| 01:01.15 | michaelnovakjr__ | they aren't phone to phone communication apps |
| 01:01.34 | michaelnovakjr__ | i don't see why you belittle android next to the iphone |
| 01:02.49 | chomchom | micaelnovakjr__: yes of course I have, I'm not belittling anything! I'm developing three apps for Android! Why would I belittle it? I'm just trying to get some chatter :) |
| 01:03.07 | michaelnovakjr__ | you called it a light weight file system |
| 01:03.54 | chomchom | Yes, part of the android package is a variant on a linux distro |
| 01:04.19 | michaelnovakjr__ | its a complete stack |
| 01:04.44 | chomchom | yes it is |
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| 01:30.24 | michaelnovakjr__ | jasta: ping |
| 01:31.01 | chomchom | michaelnovakjr__:pong |
| 01:31.26 | chomchom | you'd need a traceroute to find where that got tangled |
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| 03:09.38 | michaelnovakjr_ | jasta ping |
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| 03:24.57 | michaelnovakjr__ | quiet tonight |
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| 03:45.35 | yakischloba | heh |
| 03:46.07 | yakischloba | i spent all afternoon writing a bunch of shit for the job im applying for, so I'm still at work wrapping up. |
| 03:46.17 | yakischloba | I'll probably be home asking dumb questions again soon ;) |
| 03:46.59 | michaelnovakjr__ | :) |
| 03:49.20 | yakischloba | interview on thursday |
| 03:49.38 | yakischloba | so excited to get out of here. I can't stand it anymore :/ |
| 03:52.36 | yakischloba | where is jasta anyway |
| 03:52.38 | yakischloba | this is unusual |
| 03:53.05 | michaelnovakjr__ | not sure... havent seen him in a bit |
| 03:54.19 | yakischloba | ok time to go home. be back soon. |
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| 04:23.34 | michaelnovakjr__ | back huh? |
| 04:23.43 | michaelnovakjr__ | didn't miss much |
| 04:24.03 | yakischloba | didnt' figure I would |
| 04:24.33 | michaelnovakjr__ | :) |
| 04:24.42 | michaelnovakjr__ | i'm wrapping up the sms app finally |
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| 04:27.05 | yakischloba | nice |
| 04:28.09 | michaelnovakjr__ | putting together the wiki page, i'll probably post the download tomorrow afternoon |
| 04:29.11 | yakischloba | well I got whatever I was working on all fucked up before I went to bed last night, so its time to straighten that out. |
| 04:29.24 | michaelnovakjr__ | what were you working on? |
| 04:29.53 | yakischloba | just redesigning a bunch of parts of my app after discussing some lifecycle stuff with jasta |
| 04:30.01 | michaelnovakjr__ | cool |
| 04:30.15 | yakischloba | but I slipped up somewhere and I was really tired..had to call it quits before I fixed it |
| 04:30.38 | michaelnovakjr__ | it happens |
| 04:30.52 | michaelnovakjr__ | i had a nullpointer the other night that was clearly an overtired mistake |
| 04:31.03 | jasta | yawn |
| 04:31.09 | michaelnovakjr__ | howdy |
| 04:31.09 | jasta | pong ;) |
| 04:31.10 | yakischloba | there he is. |
| 04:31.20 | jasta | my gf unexpectedly came over today |
| 04:31.33 | jasta | so i played tennis instead of going to the sprint store :) |
| 04:31.38 | yakischloba | i was guessing that was the case |
| 04:31.40 | yakischloba | ah jeez |
| 04:31.43 | michaelnovakjr__ | haha fun :) |
| 04:31.44 | yakischloba | you could have convinced her to swing by ;) |
| 04:31.52 | jasta | no, i could not have :) |
| 04:31.55 | yakischloba | haha |
| 04:34.59 | michaelnovakjr__ | jasta, added the focus to the message boxes when replying or coming from the contacts. |
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| 04:40.53 | yakischloba | hmm. at least i'm getting faster at finding my retarded mistakes. |
| 04:48.33 | michaelnovakjr__ | screenshots of Messages: http://code.google.com/p/android-random/wiki/Messages |
| 04:49.02 | yakischloba | nice |
| 04:49.05 | yakischloba | looks good |
| 04:49.18 | michaelnovakjr__ | thanks |
| 05:01.14 | michaelnovakjr__ | i'm out, enjoy the evening |
| 05:01.47 | yakischloba | good night |
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| 05:25.30 | jasta | michaelnovakjr__: i think you should invert the order of messages in a conversation |
| 05:25.33 | jasta | should show newest at the bottom |
| 05:25.39 | jasta | also, you should timestamp. |
| 05:25.45 | jasta | use the right hand side for that or something |
| 05:29.03 | jasta | michaelnovakjr__: also, you should add a way to pick a contact in the craete new message activity |
| 05:29.09 | jasta | as in, more than just the autocmplete |
| 05:31.31 | jasta | hey folks: http://www.clubgphone.com/2008/08/04/htcs-android-phones-still-on-track-for-q4-2008/ |
| 05:32.05 | Darkeye11547 | Oh man, I can't wait. |
| 05:32.51 | jasta | (that post actually indicates that *WE* might not see android devices in Q4) |
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| 06:23.19 | jerkface03 | poo |
| 06:23.22 | jerkface03 | i gotta start work tmrw :( |
| 06:23.28 | jerkface03 | no more being a bum |
| 06:25.57 | muthu | one more day.. |
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| 07:05.07 | alex2308 | morning |
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| 07:53.38 | chomchom | michaelnovakjr__: yeah I agree with jasta. Your messaging looks really cool but I'd invert the ordering. |
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| 09:01.24 | alex2308 | http://englishrussia.com/?p=2008 |
| 09:04.49 | Darkeye11547 | ... |
| 09:04.57 | Darkeye11547 | That's hillarious. |
| 09:07.20 | alex2308 | its awesome |
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| 10:00.18 | anno^da_ | Could someone tell me with which XML parser included in Android I am able to parse a XML document that sits in a simple String |
| 10:00.53 | anno^da_ | every parser I found needs InputStreams or othe things like that and I cant manage it get my String into the DOM parser or SAX parser |
| 10:01.07 | anno^da_ | the xml consists just of two elements |
| 10:05.28 | anno^da_ | got iz |
| 10:05.30 | anno^da_ | it |
| 10:08.52 | tric | hmm, is there any way to access the current context from a class which is neither an activity nor view nor anything else? |
| 10:09.11 | tric | something like Application.getContext()? ;) |
| 10:09.33 | anno^da_ | Why dont you submit him the context in the constructor ? |
| 10:09.38 | anno^da_ | in the parameter set |
| 10:10.00 | anno^da_ | myClass(Context cont)() |
| 10:10.21 | anno^da_ | then you should be able to use it |
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| 10:11.10 | tric | yes, thats what im currently doing, but i dont like it. |
| 10:18.32 | tric | this should be accessible in a static way imho. you need it to access R.string.*, or i have to add an adaptor to R.*, which would be kinda stupid. |
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| 12:12.39 | rainabba | At current, is there a way to insert pauses when using the dialer? I have a Vouge and can't bring up the dialpad when calling voicemail so I need to include the pin when I dial. |
| 12:13.24 | rainabba | I see in android.telephony.PhoneNumberUtils that PAUSE is defined as int 44 |
| 12:13.59 | rainabba | I don't see how I'd enter it using the dialer. |
| 12:16.14 | rainabba | Ahh well. Sleep time. If anyone knows and would be kind enough to pm me, I'd appriciate it. Take care. |
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| 13:28.12 | michaelnovakjr | howdy |
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| 14:58.49 | michaelnovakjr | howdy AttractiveApe |
| 14:59.06 | AttractiveApe | mornin' michaelnovakjr |
| 14:59.11 | AttractiveApe | Have a good weekend? |
| 14:59.19 | michaelnovakjr | not too bad, how about you? |
| 14:59.23 | AttractiveApe | was excellent |
| 14:59.38 | AttractiveApe | yesterday was a stat holiday, so was wonderful :P |
| 14:59.46 | michaelnovakjr | nice |
| 15:00.15 | michaelnovakjr | check this out: http://code.google.com/p/android-random/wiki/Messages |
| 15:00.24 | michaelnovakjr | some early screenshots of the sms app |
| 15:00.37 | michaelnovakjr | making a few modifications and then its ready to be used |
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| 15:02.50 | AttractiveApe | looks nice :) |
| 15:02.53 | AttractiveApe | When do I get to use it? |
| 15:03.06 | AttractiveApe | I played with Glance on the weekend, was great :) |
| 15:03.15 | michaelnovakjr | thanks |
| 15:03.24 | michaelnovakjr | i'll mostly likely have it up in a few hours |
| 15:04.33 | michaelnovakjr | you can send an sms through the contacts and dialer apps too |
| 15:11.11 | AttractiveApe | cool, looking forward to it :) |
| 15:13.18 | zhobbs_ | michaelnovakjr: nice! |
| 15:13.28 | michaelnovakjr | thanks |
| 15:13.49 | michaelnovakjr | putting a few finishing touches on it |
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| 15:27.04 | jasta | yawn |
| 15:27.23 | jasta | michaelnovakjr: i like seeing the intent system come together and actually work neatly |
| 15:27.33 | michaelnovakjr | yea |
| 15:27.44 | michaelnovakjr | i'm working on using the intent system to pull the contact picker |
| 15:28.02 | jasta | excellent |
| 15:28.13 | michaelnovakjr | how can i get the focus of a list view to the bottom? |
| 15:28.19 | ligi | anyone knows whats happened to the ADCI Galery - Delayed or Canceled ? |
| 15:29.12 | michaelnovakjr | i was searching for a way to pull it down to the bottom of the list view... |
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| 15:29.58 | jasta | nah, that would be weird i think |
| 15:30.12 | jasta | ligi: or perhaps it was just a lie? :) |
| 15:30.51 | ligi | jasta: ^^ |
| 15:33.53 | zhobbs_ | ligi: what gallery? |
| 15:36.21 | ligi | zhobbs_: google anounced that there will be a galery of ADC I Participants which want to be in souch an galery |
| 15:36.24 | michaelnovakjr | jasta, any idea on how get the bottom of the list view to display by default? |
| 15:38.11 | ligi | zhobbs_: from the ADC I loosers email: "2. In the near future, we\u2019ll be creating an Android Developer Challenge Gallery where you can showcase your application. We\u2019ll be providing more details shortly on how you can participate in this gallery." |
| 15:38.59 | michaelnovakjr | ligi, nothing more has been said about it |
| 15:39.48 | ligi | michaelnovakjr: i noticed - but i dont know if it is canceled or just delayed |
| 15:39.53 | ligi | both is very possible |
| 15:41.28 | tethridge | A loser gallery, where do I sign up? |
| 15:41.40 | zhobbs_ | helloandroid.com/apps |
| 15:42.03 | michaelnovakjr | :) |
| 15:42.26 | zhobbs_ | I got a couple emails asking if helloandroid.com was dead |
| 15:42.41 | muthu | haha |
| 15:42.45 | zhobbs_ | it's alive, I'm just brain dead from ADC |
| 15:42.47 | muthu | is HA dead? |
| 15:43.08 | zhobbs_ | nah, I'll try to get it going again |
| 15:43.09 | tethridge | is ADC over now? |
| 15:43.13 | jasta | i must say signing the NDA has been an improvement for muthu |
| 15:43.22 | muthu | werd |
| 15:43.23 | zhobbs_ | work on some more tutorials and news...the nda is a pain though |
| 15:43.33 | zhobbs_ | tethridge: yeah, in a couple hours |
| 15:43.35 | jasta | now he isn't even allowed to speculate wildly. |
| 15:43.44 | muthu | lol |
| 15:43.58 | muthu | waiting for the public release.. so we can all be set free |
| 15:43.59 | zhobbs_ | yeah, it's hard for me to post news because I'm NDA'd out in every direction |
| 15:44.03 | michaelnovakjr | haha thank god! |
| 15:44.04 | tethridge | so muthu signed the NDA? |
| 15:44.13 | muthu | all team members sign |
| 15:44.17 | tethridge | ah |
| 15:44.19 | michaelnovakjr | muthu you should sign an NDA for the public one too :) |
| 15:44.25 | jasta | hehe ;) |
| 15:44.28 | zhobbs_ | lol |
| 15:44.40 | ligi | NDA's suxx |
| 15:44.49 | jasta | normally yes, but not in muthu's case :) |
| 15:44.59 | ligi | ;-) |
| 15:45.07 | muthu | :)) |
| 15:45.14 | michaelnovakjr | :) |
| 15:45.23 | muthu | android is the best mobile development platform |
| 15:45.56 | tethridge | the best one that you can't use on real hardware... |
| 15:46.26 | tethridge | wait, android is the only platform that has no hardware available with it on there for the public. :-( |
| 15:46.54 | jasta | quite true, there's even the Neo Freerunner now ;0 |
| 15:47.11 | muthu | hope the devices come out soon |
| 15:47.37 | jasta | there is renewed doubt that the consumer market will see them by Q4 2008 |
| 15:47.50 | muthu | is there a delay news anywhere? |
| 15:47.57 | jasta | in a sense... |
| 15:48.00 | muthu | Q4 has been the target for a while.. |
| 15:48.04 | jasta | http://gizmodo.com/5032966/htcs-android-phones-still-on-track-for-q4-2008 |
| 15:48.10 | jasta | read more than just the headline. |
| 15:48.18 | muthu | reading.. |
| 15:49.16 | jasta | i hadn't thought about that particular nuance of the industry. |
| 15:49.21 | tethridge | I'm only waiting until February, then I'm going to be an iPhone owner. |
| 15:49.47 | muthu | by feb, adc2 will start |
| 15:50.01 | muthu | jasta: can't wait to see your app for adc2 |
| 15:50.03 | michaelnovakjr | muthu ... |
| 15:50.08 | michaelnovakjr | again with the speculating |
| 15:50.09 | jasta | the NDA isn't perfect, unfortunately. it still lets him spew nonsense about the ADC2. |
| 15:50.15 | muthu | lol |
| 15:50.25 | muthu | this channel is going to come back alive ;) |
| 15:50.29 | jasta | but i guess we can't be too picky. |
| 15:50.47 | jasta | muthu: why do you assume my app will be part of adc2? |
| 15:50.50 | michaelnovakjr | muthu, you are too touchy feely for me |
| 15:51.03 | muthu | jasta: you can't stay away from android |
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| 16:11.41 | michaelnovakjr | muthu, that method doesn't exist |
| 16:11.41 | muthu | michaelnovakjr: something like that |
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| 16:11.46 | jasta | whoa, i was on the wrong side of that netsplit :) |
| 16:11.46 | michaelnovakjr | :) |
| 16:11.46 | michaelnovakjr | jasta, how can i get focus to the bottom of the list view? |
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| 16:11.47 | jasta | michaelnovakjr: set the last item to be the selected one |
| 16:14.01 | michaelnovakjr | got it :) |
| 16:14.01 | michaelnovakjr | stupid easy things :) |
| 16:15.29 | yakischloba | waiting for common sense boot up again? |
| 16:15.59 | yakischloba | :) |
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| 16:18.49 | michaelnovakjr | unfortunately yes yakischloba :) |
| 16:18.55 | muthu | why isn't there a ListView#displayLastItem() to make it easier |
| 16:19.04 | michaelnovakjr | because it is easy :) |
| 16:19.10 | romainguy__ | why would there be such a method? |
| 16:19.13 | michaelnovakjr | setSelection( position ) |
| 16:19.35 | michaelnovakjr | setSelection( listAdapter.count ); |
| 16:19.43 | muthu | setting last item seems to be like a common use case |
| 16:19.44 | romainguy__ | count - 1 michaelnovakjr :) |
| 16:19.49 | michaelnovakjr | :) yes... |
| 16:19.55 | romainguy__ | muthu: I really don't see how it's a **common** use case |
| 16:19.58 | michaelnovakjr | still i type it wrong when its right in my code :) |
| 16:20.09 | michaelnovakjr | its really not... |
| 16:20.14 | muthu | romainguy_: its common, when you add items to a list |
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| 16:20.20 | michaelnovakjr | ? |
| 16:20.31 | jasta | romainguy__: is the engineering team even bothering with the issue list any more? |
| 16:20.39 | romainguy__ | jasta: yes why? |
| 16:21.24 | jasta | Just curious if it was a waste of time to post something there. I'd like to post my HttpClient example and ask that some engineer confirms the bug is indeed gone from the latest builds. Or at least, confirm it's gone from whatever will be final. |
| 16:21.58 | romainguy__ | I doubt anybody will have time just to confirm that a bug is gone |
| 16:21.59 | f00f- | jasta: are you sure it's not an isue for the Apache HttpComponents people? |
| 16:22.31 | jasta | It is. But romain claims many patches both by Google and upstream have been provided. |
| 16:22.39 | jasta | And also, a new upstream version exists. |
| 16:23.03 | jasta | I could not discover the source of the bug by decompiling Android's included code, so I'd like confirmation directly that the bug is gone. |
| 16:23.21 | jasta | romainguy__: So then it is pointless to post bugs? |
| 16:23.27 | romainguy__ | no |
| 16:23.35 | romainguy__ | you can post bugs if you need a fix |
| 16:23.48 | jasta | Well I do need a fix in M5. I have no idea if that fix is in the current build. |
| 16:23.56 | jasta | how could I? |
| 16:26.17 | jasta | How could anyone posting a bug know if it's been fixed in a newer version or not? Any bug post would require an Android developer to either fix the bug, or confirm that it was already fixed. |
| 16:26.40 | jasta | So, it's either pointless to post bugs, or somebody must have time to look at them. Right? |
| 16:28.28 | muthu | any news on public sdk? |
| 16:28.34 | romainguy__ | muthu: non |
| 16:28.35 | romainguy__ | none |
| 16:28.45 | muthu | too bad |
| 16:29.02 | jasta | Uhm? |
| 16:29.04 | muthu | now that i don't have anything to do ;) |
| 16:29.08 | f00f- | hahah |
| 16:29.11 | f00f- | done already eh |
| 16:29.20 | muthu | yup |
| 16:29.56 | michaelnovakjr | muthu, let's not start speculating :) |
| 16:30.43 | jasta | romainguy__: You're not filling me with confidence here... |
| 16:31.01 | romainguy__ | jasta: what are you talking about? |
| 16:31.37 | jasta | I need to confirm that this issue is gone in the latest builds. If it isn't, then someone needs to fix the bug. |
| 16:31.43 | romainguy__ | then file your bug |
| 16:31.46 | jasta | I did all I can do with the version I have, and no access to source code. |
| 16:32.00 | jasta | romainguy__: So engineers are looking at them, for sure? |
| 16:32.14 | romainguy__ | engineers are looking at the bugs |
| 16:32.21 | romainguy__ | but I cannot promise you yours will be looked at |
| 16:32.34 | romainguy__ | or that if it is looked at that someone will take the time to test your code against a newer build |
| 16:32.51 | romainguy__ | especially if you describe your bug like you did to me |
| 16:33.00 | jasta | How did I describe it to you? |
| 16:33.20 | romainguy__ | just file your bug |
| 16:34.34 | romainguy__ | f00f-: did you submit your app btw? |
| 16:34.55 | f00f- | we're doing a final submnit in a few minutes |
| 16:35.02 | romainguy__ | :) |
| 16:35.09 | f00f- | just doing doc fixes :) |
| 16:35.17 | muthu | how many mins left? |
| 16:35.23 | f00f- | 24 |
| 16:37.08 | yakischloba | down to the wire eh |
| 16:38.12 | jasta | i thought you guys had to the 8th? |
| 16:38.31 | f00f- | funny, so did one of our teammates |
| 16:38.51 | jasta | is it due today? |
| 16:39.31 | jasta | it's incredible how high your odds are of winning. |
| 16:40.47 | yakischloba | what is f00f-'s app? |
| 16:41.00 | yakischloba | i've forgotten |
| 16:41.09 | f00f- | i think jasta meant you as in 'the 50' |
| 16:41.12 | f00f- | yakischloba: PedNav |
| 16:41.15 | yakischloba | ohh yeah |
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| 16:47.56 | yakischloba | Have the majority of the '50' been working on their project full time? |
| 16:49.15 | romainguy_ | re |
| 16:49.26 | f00f- | it feels like full-time |
| 16:49.46 | yakischloba | Do you all have day jobs too? |
| 16:50.09 | f00f- | most of us do |
| 16:50.35 | yakischloba | so you have been busy eh |
| 16:51.07 | f00f- | .. let's just say in another 9 minutes i'll be relieved :D |
| 16:51.11 | yakischloba | hah |
| 16:51.23 | f00f- | still need to do another build with new icon |
| 16:51.33 | yakischloba | better hurry. |
| 16:51.41 | f00f- | i have my guy in photoshop as we speak. |
| 16:51.53 | yakischloba | hah |
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| 17:00.58 | f00f- | all done. |
| 17:01.00 | f00f- | whew |
| 17:01.05 | f00f- | ^_^ |
| 17:01.06 | f00f- | & |
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| 17:11.04 | jasta | f00f-: so it is due today? |
| 17:11.42 | michaelnovakjr | jasta, yep :) |
| 17:11.51 | jasta | are you concerned by the way that the judges will be comparing your app against Google Maps (now with public transit info from the very same database you use)? |
| 17:12.06 | jasta | or is it actually dissimilar? |
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| 17:18.51 | jasta | hello san : |
| 17:19.48 | SanMehat | hey man |
| 17:19.49 | SanMehat | whats up |
| 17:22.32 | jasta | pretty good :) |
| 17:23.17 | jasta | going out to my mom's to shoot pool tonight. which is fun, because i'm way better than her :) |
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| 17:26.02 | SanMehat | good stuff |
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| 17:38.08 | jasta | romainguy_: so, is the next SDK drop expected to be 1.0? |
| 17:38.20 | jasta | as in, very close if not identical to the shipped release? |
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| 17:47.41 | michaelnovakjr | jasta, makes sense, why do an non-NDA before a public release? |
| 17:48.23 | anno^da_ | whats up ? :) something new about a SDK ? |
| 17:49.01 | michaelnovakjr | nope |
| 17:49.09 | anno^da_ | :) |
| 17:49.25 | anno^da_ | have done the flickr api now and it works perfectly :D |
| 17:49.31 | michaelnovakjr | nice |
| 17:50.06 | anno^da_ | Now I have to do some UI :-) |
| 17:50.59 | michaelnovakjr | will you have to choose files from the device? |
| 17:51.19 | romainguy_ | jasta: I can't comment on that |
| 17:51.30 | romainguy_ | anno^da_: nothing new :) |
| 17:52.02 | anno^da_ | Mmh well I'm just recording a image/video and uploading it directly to the media services. So not really choosing. |
| 17:52.10 | michaelnovakjr | cool |
| 17:52.26 | anno^da_ | and adding geo codings to them. |
| 17:52.35 | michaelnovakjr | romainguy_ http://code.google.com/p/android-random/wiki/Messages ... some early screenshots of the sms app i wrote |
| 17:52.44 | anno^da_ | At the moment it integrates Twittr, Flickr, Tumblr and Technorati for some Blog Pings |
| 17:52.46 | romainguy_ | I saw that :) |
| 17:53.15 | anno^da_ | michaelnovakjr: nice ui. Not overloaded :) |
| 17:53.40 | michaelnovakjr | thanks, i try to keep it simple |
| 17:53.46 | anno^da_ | Yeah |
| 17:54.02 | anno^da_ | It's the best you can do. |
| 17:54.23 | romainguy_ | michaelnovakjr: why are you writing an SMS app btw? :) |
| 17:54.47 | michaelnovakjr | i wrote it for the htc, really, the sms on there was terrible |
| 17:55.38 | jasta | romainguy_: i'm just concerned that there's gonna be a ton of bugs in the 1.0 release due to a lack of community involvement for so long... |
| 17:56.01 | jasta | can you comment on any sort of software upgrade policy or release schedules post handset launch? |
| 17:56.06 | anno^da_ | Now I got a small question regarding my service. At the moment I'm using it just starting the service and it gets killed by him self after doing his job. Now I need some interaction with the service in my UI. Is it right that I have to start the service and then bind to it from the actvity calling methods. (I already did the AIDL files) |
| 17:56.10 | romainguy_ | no I can't jasta |
| 17:56.23 | jasta | hmm. *frustrated* |
| 17:57.21 | jasta | anno^da_: The practice that I have adopted is to reinterpret what the service's onStart() call really means. |
| 17:57.24 | michaelnovakjr | jasta, i'm a bit nervous as well. if you didn't deal with android on a regular basis you'd think it was dead |
| 17:57.45 | jasta | onStart() can be thought of as onConnected(), and then through your service interface (defined in AIDL) you should add some type of doWork, stopWork methods. |
| 17:58.00 | jasta | So you can happily bind to the service, "starting" it, but the service will just sit idly until you instruct it to do real work. |
| 17:58.52 | jasta | michaelnovakjr: well it just seems highly likely that these private SDKs will have lots of problems in areas not well covered by google apps or ADC participants. and if it is basically 1.0 final, then we're hosed to get fixes in place for handset launch. |
| 17:58.57 | anno^da_ | OK great thanks jast. |
| 17:59.00 | anno^da_ | jasta |
| 17:59.01 | jasta | and then we don't know what it looks like to get those fixes incrementally applied? |
| 17:59.05 | jasta | yikes, i saw. |
| 17:59.07 | jasta | i say* |
| 17:59.43 | jasta | anno^da_: This approach has lots of advantages as well. Activities can connect to the service and just simply ask it what it's doing, which they can then decide whether to start it doing something else or observe progress. Whatever you define in your AIDL. |
| 18:00.08 | jasta | anno^da_: Do note as well that you can use asynchronous callbacks so your activity can get meaningful status change notifications as they occur (without polling). |
| 18:00.17 | michaelnovakjr | jasta, i'm not so sure the adc guys are much better off though |
| 18:00.30 | jasta | michaelnovakjr: Well, they at least have a voice where we have none. |
| 18:00.35 | michaelnovakjr | true |
| 18:00.51 | jasta | They could at least say "hey, what the hell, bug XYZ still isn't fixed?" |
| 18:01.45 | anno^da_ | thanks again jasta. |
| 18:02.05 | jasta | anno^da_: By the way, the service stops itself via stopSelf() when it is truly done and ready to die. But it won't die until all connected activities disconnect. |
| 18:02.19 | jasta | Which is fine, because remember your service is organized to "live" but happily be idle. |
| 18:02.45 | jasta | stopSelf() is more like a flag than an action. It informs the manager that it's done, and can be killed whenever. |
| 18:03.04 | jasta | If you don't call stopSelf(), however, it will never die. Not even after the actvities disconnect. |
| 18:03.15 | anno^da_ | Yeah I recognized that. |
| 18:03.28 | anno^da_ | At the moment the service is killing its self |
| 18:03.40 | jasta | One more thing, to note that your service must be thread-safe. Multiple connecting activities issuing commands against it will all run in separate threads. |
| 18:03.40 | anno^da_ | after doing the API interaction stuff |
| 18:03.51 | jasta | err, do note* |
| 18:03.58 | michaelnovakjr | jasta, getting a device today? |
| 18:04.06 | jasta | michaelnovakjr: Maybe not still, going to my mom's tonight. |
| 18:04.11 | anno^da_ | mhhh ok I'm not doing multiple connections at the moment. :) |
| 18:04.22 | anno^da_ | (too complicated for me atm :) ) |
| 18:05.10 | jasta | anno^da_: Well, anyone can access your service... |
| 18:05.19 | jasta | so if you hope for your code to be reusable, be thread-safe. |
| 18:05.36 | jasta | Thread-safety is very simple in Java, and in fact designing the code to be such will likely improve your design in general. |
| 18:05.45 | anno^da_ | Yeah that's right. I will note that down. |
| 18:05.53 | jasta | One approach is to use a Handler and pass messages to the main thread from the method invocations. |
| 18:05.59 | jasta | Just like in activities. |
| 18:06.07 | anno^da_ | At the moment I'm improving in java while writting some things :) |
| 18:06.21 | jasta | another approach is to use the concurrent classes in Java and sychronize appropriately when accessing resources. |
| 18:06.36 | jasta | and/or*, i mean |
| 18:06.54 | anno^da_ | is copying all the stuff into my notes :) |
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| 18:07.06 | anno^da_ | into his notes :P |
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| 18:08.40 | anno^da_ | But I can't wait testing the things on a real device. :) |
| 18:09.46 | jasta | real devices are likely to expose numerous thread safety issues with most peoples applications. |
| 18:10.01 | jasta | changing timing and introducing more obscure error conditions usually does that ;) |
| 18:10.37 | jasta | a good portion of my code even needs to be rewritten with some faulty assumptions i made in my haste to submit for the ADC. |
| 18:10.52 | jasta | assumptions removed* |
| 18:11.45 | anno^da_ | :-). The thing is while learning the whole stuff I'm doing so much errors in design. But that's ok I have to get better. :) |
| 18:12.22 | jasta | If you have the time, I do recommend picking up a book on some of these topics more generally |
| 18:12.55 | jasta | Java in general if you are largely unfamiliar with the language and runtime, and also on concurrency in Java. |
| 18:13.30 | jasta | O'Reilly is usually a reliable publisher. |
| 18:15.05 | anno^da_ | Yeah I will do that. At the moment it is just having fun with all the APIs I can get and playing around connecting the services and mashing them up in the mobile area. |
| 18:15.48 | anno^da_ | I got some OReilly books already but hadnt the time to dive into them. |
| 18:15.56 | jasta | well just remember, chasing obscure bugs you don't understand is when software engineering stops being fun. ;) |
| 18:16.03 | anno^da_ | :D |
| 18:16.17 | michaelnovakjr | oh yea :) |
| 18:16.20 | romainguy_ | jasta: well just remember, chasing obscure bugs you don't understand is when software engineering stops being fun << sounds like my job description some days :) |
| 18:16.45 | anno^da_ | romainguy: *laughing* |
| 18:17.12 | anno^da_ | btw loves the adam ezra group |
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| 18:39.40 | michaelnovakjr | jasta, your logcat formatting has inspired the conversation view in Messages |
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| 19:20.44 | jasta | michaelnovakjr: glad i helped :) |
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| 19:29.29 | michaelnovakjr | I made the conversation one TextView |
| 19:29.51 | jasta | i like to produce a lot of example code... |
| 19:29.52 | michaelnovakjr | line wraps are much nicer now jasta :) |
| 19:31.25 | michaelnovakjr | i added the timestamp to the conversation view as well |
| 19:31.36 | jasta | i wish you would commit more atomically :) |
| 19:31.49 | michaelnovakjr | yea, i'm going to do a commit now |
| 19:32.04 | jasta | i try to commit every change independent of the others when possible |
| 19:34.07 | sayers | jasta: I got into another java game, I guess you were right |
| 19:34.22 | jasta | right about what? i don't remember what i said? :) |
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| 19:35.04 | sayers | I said I'm only going to be game programming for 2 more days, and then you said "we'll see" or something like that |
| 19:35.14 | sayers | well now I'm working on a huge project :z |
| 19:35.28 | michaelnovakjr | committed a new revision jasta |
| 19:35.43 | michaelnovakjr | i still have to setup the contacts picker.... shouldn't be hard at all |
| 19:35.57 | jasta_ | nice, i'll take a look tonight. |
| 19:36.48 | michaelnovakjr | cool, i should have the contacts thing done then too |
| 19:38.28 | anno^da_ | Got a question am I able to set Toasts from my Service ? |
| 19:39.27 | michaelnovakjr | you have to do it on the UI Thread i believe |
| 19:41.22 | jasta_ | anno: yes, in fact the main thread of a service is in the ui context. |
| 19:41.52 | jasta_ | but only the main thread can do it. the implemented aidl interface runs on separate binder thread.s |
| 19:41.53 | anno^da_ | So the only notification I can do (when my activity is not active) is a status bar notification right ? |
| 19:42.08 | jasta_ | this is where a handler would come in very handy. |
| 19:42.32 | jasta_ | no, as i said, a services main thread is in the ui context. |
| 19:42.59 | michaelnovakjr | i like the handler method |
| 19:44.14 | jasta_ | ditto. |
| 19:44.52 | jasta_ | check out uithreadutils if you'd prefer a simplr abstraction. |
| 19:47.37 | jasta | UIThreadUtilities is the proper class name :) |
| 19:47.40 | jasta | i was just on my phone hehe |
| 19:48.12 | michaelnovakjr | :) what client do you use? |
| 19:48.24 | anno^da_ | Its working now |
| 19:48.34 | anno^da_ | just a little bug in my Handler :) |
| 19:48.41 | anno^da_ | great |
| 19:48.47 | anno^da_ | thanks guys. |
| 19:55.44 | jasta | michaelnovakjr: some non-free windows mobile program. it's not great, and when i get android i hope to use ssh instead of a separte instance |
| 19:56.36 | sayers | go non-free windows! |
| 19:56.38 | sayers | woo111 |
| 19:56.50 | michaelnovakjr | boo |
| 19:57.01 | jasta | michaelnovakjr: i wonder if you could find an irc client for android :) |
| 19:57.11 | jasta | well, it would be poitnless, since that osk sucks so bad :) |
| 19:57.53 | michaelnovakjr | yea |
| 19:58.00 | michaelnovakjr | an idea would be to write another :) |
| 19:58.12 | jasta | let's not get carried away :) |
| 19:59.42 | michaelnovakjr | :) |
| 20:03.26 | jasta | i'm sure plenty of goons will write crummy IRC clients, we don't need to be one of them |
| 20:07.33 | sayers | :P\ |
| 20:08.23 | jasta | that said i am writing a solitaire (freecell) game. |
| 20:09.02 | jasta | just to get some familiarity with a different sort of project |
| 20:09.32 | michaelnovakjr | :) |
| 20:09.41 | michaelnovakjr | i'm doing a game next |
| 20:10.19 | AttractiveApe | michaelnovakjr: wow, what's your day job? |
| 20:10.28 | michaelnovakjr | programming |
| 20:10.33 | AttractiveApe | For Android? |
| 20:10.56 | michaelnovakjr | no |
| 20:11.05 | michaelnovakjr | web programming :( |
| 20:11.14 | AttractiveApe | nods. |
| 20:12.12 | f00f- | jasta: gmaps is definitely a competitor. but we think we have a unique thing or two. ;) |
| 20:12.38 | michaelnovakjr | hopefully a good unique thing or two ;) |
| 20:12.44 | f00f- | trying to solve a problem that's very common amongst all LBS apps |
| 20:12.47 | f00f- | trying to connect disparities |
| 20:12.52 | f00f- | yeah i hope so michael |
| 20:13.17 | michaelnovakjr | :) |
| 20:13.42 | michaelnovakjr | as someone who takes the subway to work everyday, i appreciate non-network applications :) |
| 20:14.17 | f00f- | current operation needs network, but it's designed to work in disconnected mode |
| 20:14.27 | michaelnovakjr | cool |
| 20:14.42 | jasta | f00f-: it'll be interesting to see if google tries to shut you out. |
| 20:14.50 | jasta | to avoid confusing consumers, that is. |
| 20:15.19 | jasta | actually, i bet your biggest challenge will come from "unbiased" carriers who will not want to distribute an app over Google's own, unless it's also their own. |
| 20:16.00 | michaelnovakjr | that could very well be true |
| 20:16.12 | zhobbs_ | wonders when/how his adc nda expires |
| 20:16.27 | jasta | zhobbs_: In 3 years, didn't you read it? :) |
| 20:17.05 | jasta | michaelnovakjr: i bet carriers will still try to lock down the "default" experience very tightly. |
| 20:17.59 | f00f- | jasta: well if our app offers more functionality/features, then google must play catchup :) |
| 20:18.21 | jasta | f00f-: and they might, or they might just throw their weight at you and nobody will care to use your app? |
| 20:18.32 | f00f- | throw their weight, how |
| 20:18.34 | jasta | google, afterall, is going to control the app "market". |
| 20:18.59 | f00f- | i doubt they'll try any tricks |
| 20:19.00 | jasta | also, carriers and oems control what goes on the phones in the US. |
| 20:19.13 | f00f- | yeah, unless you have a cozy relationship with them! |
| 20:19.19 | jasta | f00f-: Maybe they don't have to? If they don't intentionally guide traffic away from their own apps, it's unlikely anyone will find/want them |
| 20:19.34 | jasta | f00f-: Are you partnering with OEMs? |
| 20:19.51 | f00f- | not yet |
| 20:19.59 | jasta | Competing with Google on one of its flagship accomplishments is seemingly impossible. |
| 20:20.13 | michaelnovakjr | escpecially when they power your engine :) |
| 20:20.17 | jasta | They are a juggernaut, even if everyone wants to see them as the little guy :) |
| 20:21.04 | f00f- | yes, it'll be interesting to see what happens |
| 20:21.33 | jasta | I'm especially curious. I don't want this platform to have all the same hidden agenda crap that Apple has with the iPhone |
| 20:21.37 | jasta | but it might just. |
| 20:21.38 | f00f- | i'd like symbian, blackberry, and iphone ports too |
| 20:21.56 | jasta | f00f-: The iPhone? Oh jeez. You're still competing with Google, and now you've got Apple to answer to ;) |
| 20:22.02 | f00f- | i think ultimately the operators will have the final say |
| 20:22.10 | f00f- | well iphone waiting until the licensing becomes more friendly |
| 20:22.20 | f00f- | not going to sign an NDA to develop and restrict myself |
| 20:22.29 | jasta | you're not? really? :) |
| 20:22.45 | f00f- | well iphone is public right? ;) |
| 20:22.49 | f00f- | or is the sdk still considered private |
| 20:22.57 | f00f- | it has some legal trings attached to it i thought |
| 20:23.05 | jasta | more public than android, i'd say. |
| 20:23.14 | f00f- | true |
| 20:23.19 | jasta | f00f-: i was just jabbing at you. you already signed an NDA to develop :) |
| 20:23.26 | jasta | if one, why not another? :) |
| 20:23.58 | f00f- | niceness(GOOG) > niceness(APPL) == true |
| 20:24.20 | jasta | you have nothing to base that opinion on, however. |
| 20:24.27 | jasta | You haven't competed with either of them yet :) |
| 20:24.35 | f00f- | yeah, it's a shot in the dark |
| 20:24.38 | jasta | I'm pretty sure both are quite ruthless when you do. |
| 20:24.42 | f00f- | at the very minimum an iphone web app (LBS) would be nice |
| 20:24.47 | f00f- | yeah probably |
| 20:25.28 | michaelnovakjr | f00f-: the google NDA doesn't expire? |
| 20:25.37 | jasta | michaelnovakjr: it expires in 3 years, according to its text. |
| 20:25.56 | f00f- | 3 years after the termination of it, i think |
| 20:26.13 | michaelnovakjr | interesting |
| 20:26.16 | f00f- | but it's to specifics only |
| 20:26.21 | f00f- | so should be a non-issue for most |
| 20:26.47 | zhobbs_ | yeah, will be once a new public build is released |
| 20:27.11 | zhobbs_ | will be a non-issue that is |
| 20:27.14 | jasta | zhobbs_: you're lucky that google has no interest in holding you to that 3 year clause. |
| 20:27.15 | michaelnovakjr | still not holding my breath :) |
| 20:27.23 | jasta | because if they did, you are legally required to. |
| 20:27.36 | jasta | i think you all are crazy for signing that unammended. |
| 20:27.52 | michaelnovakjr | yea, it kind of defeats the purpose of the ADC i think |
| 20:28.05 | michaelnovakjr | it kinda why i have no interest in the apparent ADC2 |
| 20:28.11 | michaelnovakjr | its* |
| 20:29.38 | f00f- | personally, i think it was a bait and switch |
| 20:29.40 | f00f- | to require a contract |
| 20:29.56 | zhobbs_ | f00f-: what do you mean? |
| 20:30.09 | f00f- | well, i didnt know upfront that round 2 was going to be closed |
| 20:30.14 | jasta | f00f-: i agree completely. i even had dan confirm at one point open source projects would be eligible to compete. that statement turned out to be outright false. |
| 20:30.17 | michaelnovakjr | was it as much fun as round 1? |
| 20:30.31 | jasta | in fact, i treasure his exact quote. |
| 20:30.38 | jasta | When asked about the eligibility of open source projects he said |
| 20:30.50 | jasta | "I'm sure we won't go and do something stupid like bar open source projects from competing." |
| 20:30.55 | jasta | But they did go and do something stupid like that ;) |
| 20:31.00 | michaelnovakjr | that is also part of my reason for steering clear of adc2 |
| 20:31.23 | michaelnovakjr | well, they just forced open source projects to be closed source :) |
| 20:31.28 | chomchom | open projects aren't allowed to compete in ADC 2? |
| 20:31.32 | michaelnovakjr | for an undisclosed amount of time :) |
| 20:31.42 | jasta | chomchom: How can they? They can't release source. |
| 20:31.48 | jasta | michaelnovakjr: You can't be an open source project and be closed source :) |
| 20:31.55 | michaelnovakjr | true |
| 20:31.56 | zhobbs_ | jasta: adc2 will probably be different |
| 20:32.15 | michaelnovakjr | zhobbs_: i'm sure, but it still doesn't seem appealing |
| 20:32.31 | jasta | zhobbs_: I'm not holding my breath. |
| 20:32.51 | chomchom | You can be open with your source but still monetize your binary builds using licensing agreements |
| 20:32.56 | jasta | chomchom: I meant ADC 1, and I didn't quite read your "ADC 2" part :) |
| 20:33.13 | jasta | chomchom: ADC 1 bars open source projects, by way of an NDA preventing source disclosure. |
| 20:33.24 | chomchom | ah |
| 20:33.41 | michaelnovakjr | jasta, don't forget for an undisclosed amount of time :) |
| 20:33.42 | f00f- | jasta: yeah i remember. it totally sucks for OSS projects in round 2. kinda forces everyone to be closed for a siginifcant amount of time. |
| 20:33.54 | f00f- | michaelnovakjr: fun, yeah i guess, smaller crowd :P |
| 20:34.11 | f00f- | i think they know they poorly executed ADC I, so perhaps things will chnage |
| 20:34.14 | f00f- | have faith :P |
| 20:34.16 | zhobbs_ | yeah, less fun because our irc room and mailing list had less people |
| 20:34.54 | michaelnovakjr | i just figured i'm happy programming now, and i don't have to worry about google or anyone telling me what i can do with my code |
| 20:35.37 | zhobbs_ | I love open source...but that's not to say $$ is a big motivator for me |
| 20:35.49 | michaelnovakjr | true, money has a funny way of doing that :) |
| 20:35.58 | f00f- | i mean clearly for round 2, they want profitable apps |
| 20:36.01 | f00f- | it's all about the money |
| 20:36.10 | f00f- | well even for round 1, they wanted a monetary angle |
| 20:36.32 | f00f- | "how can sell/embed ads in this app to increase roi?" |
| 20:36.33 | michaelnovakjr | yea, i'm not really all about that.... for me it takes away the fun feeling |
| 20:36.52 | zhobbs_ | michaelnovakjr: there's room for both...I think we'll see a nice open source community |
| 20:37.14 | michaelnovakjr | i end up using the apps i write, so for me to release the source and give it away free its all good because i still see benefits of getting to use my app |
| 20:37.19 | f00f- | yeah i guess money is an initial motivator, but the end result, if you're successful, is that you'll have an app with millions of users, which is the 'high' many people look for in the end. |
| 20:38.45 | michaelnovakjr | i kind of laughed when romainguy asked why i was writing an sms app |
| 20:38.45 | zhobbs_ | I'm looking forward to the results of round 2, I feel like we made a pretty good app and I want to see what other people are up to |
| 20:38.45 | michaelnovakjr | i was thinking, there isn't one now...... and there's no signs of when one will be available... so why wait? |
| 20:39.31 | zhobbs_ | michaelnovakjr: I think it's awesomw |
| 20:39.32 | michaelnovakjr | zhobbs_: there will definitely be room for both, i just hope the open source community is bigger, and more than that of better quality |
| 20:39.39 | f00f- | screens michael? |
| 20:39.51 | michaelnovakjr | http://code.google.com/p/android-random/wiki/Messages |
| 20:39.57 | zhobbs_ | I just like seeing open source projects emerging of any kind |
| 20:40.00 | michaelnovakjr | i'll be putting updated ones up tonight |
| 20:41.48 | michaelnovakjr | i modified the conversation view slightly |
| 20:43.30 | michaelnovakjr | thanks zhobbs_ |
| 20:43.53 | f00f- | okay, yeah it's a start |
| 20:44.00 | f00f- | i'm looking for bubbles :D |
| 20:44.10 | michaelnovakjr | bubbles? |
| 20:44.12 | f00f- | i think text needs to be bigger too |
| 20:44.18 | f00f- | for readability on a real device |
| 20:44.26 | f00f- | yeah like iPhone |
| 20:44.28 | f00f- | so you know who is who |
| 20:44.40 | michaelnovakjr | did you forget who me is? |
| 20:44.45 | *** join/#android davidw_ (n=davidw@213.47.186.146) |
| 20:44.46 | michaelnovakjr | :) |
| 20:44.53 | f00f- | ok how about |
| 20:44.55 | f00f- | like google talk |
| 20:45.00 | f00f- | if you send many things in a row |
| 20:45.03 | f00f- | dont have a new entry for it |
| 20:46.05 | zhobbs_ | I think I'd want separate entries |
| 20:46.15 | zhobbs_ | to know time frame |
| 20:46.44 | f00f- | customizability ! |
| 20:46.45 | michaelnovakjr | yea, i didn't want to get fancy with bubbles and all that because it seems a bit overkill |
| 20:47.10 | f00f- | i think it's needed though |
| 20:47.29 | michaelnovakjr | you and the other person are different colors as well |
| 20:47.44 | f00f- | well how about |
| 20:47.47 | f00f- | you justified on left |
| 20:47.50 | f00f- | other on right |
| 20:48.05 | f00f- | so you can kinda see a 'back and forth' convo |
| 20:49.09 | michaelnovakjr | to me i do see a back and forth convo.... i see Me: and then the other person :) |
| 20:50.38 | michaelnovakjr | i guess you could jazz up text messaging.... but i am not sure the extra baggage is necessar |
| 20:50.41 | michaelnovakjr | y |
| 20:50.59 | michaelnovakjr | i think the only reason the iPhone has it is because of iChat |
| 20:51.00 | *** join/#android soulreaper (n=soul@HSI-KBW-091-089-002-023.hsi2.kabelbw.de) |
| 20:51.21 | michaelnovakjr | and with Android, I don't have an iChat like program i need to mimic |
| 20:52.28 | michaelnovakjr | and f00f- by the way.... i'm using it on a real device :) |
| 20:52.40 | f00f- | oh? |
| 20:52.44 | chomchom | really? |
| 20:52.52 | chomchom | thats hardcore |
| 20:52.52 | michaelnovakjr | the vogue android port |
| 20:53.00 | michaelnovakjr | the only reason i wrote it :) |
| 20:55.50 | michaelnovakjr | so getting the UI to work on a device was important :) |
| 20:56.54 | f00f- | what? |
| 20:56.55 | f00f- | device? |
| 20:57.05 | f00f- | someone pre'd a handset for you? |
| 20:57.05 | michaelnovakjr | the vogue |
| 20:57.12 | f00f- | never heard of it |
| 20:57.16 | f00f- | who makes it? |
| 20:57.17 | michaelnovakjr | the htc touch |
| 20:57.24 | f00f- | oh |
| 20:57.26 | f00f- | same thing |
| 20:57.31 | michaelnovakjr | a guy has android booting off of win mo |
| 20:57.36 | f00f- | ltns |
| 20:57.45 | michaelnovakjr | with the data connection, calling, and text messaging working |
| 20:57.56 | f00f- | nice |
| 20:58.00 | f00f- | that is awesome |
| 20:58.01 | michaelnovakjr | as well as obviously the browser and maps applications |
| 20:58.02 | f00f- | is it fast? |
| 20:58.11 | michaelnovakjr | definitely faster than the emulator |
| 20:58.13 | AttractiveApe | pretty fast and smooth. |
| 20:58.18 | michaelnovakjr | i like it |
| 20:58.37 | michaelnovakjr | its pleasant to use |
| 20:58.41 | f00f- | nice |
| 20:58.46 | f00f- | flicking list views up and down must be nice |
| 20:59.00 | michaelnovakjr | and the notification manager is much easier too :) |
| 21:00.06 | f00f- | ya |
| 21:00.06 | michaelnovakjr | AttractiveApe: in a few hours i'm going to be posting the apk on the downloads page |
| 21:00.17 | michaelnovakjr | just have one more item to add |
| 21:00.20 | f00f- | will the apk run on my emulator ;p |
| 21:00.22 | *** part/#android zhobbs_ (n=zach@mail.guardianmfg.com) |
| 21:00.25 | michaelnovakjr | yes f00f- |
| 21:00.36 | michaelnovakjr | although it doesn't complete the sms send |
| 21:00.43 | michaelnovakjr | the app just acts like it does |
| 21:01.30 | f00f- | hax into HTC labs to get launch handset |
| 21:02.21 | *** join/#android romainguy__ (n=gfx@nat/google/x-6c2db6691c6b12e7) |
| 21:07.59 | *** join/#android AstainZZZZZZ (n=Administ@unaffiliated/astainhellbring) |
| 21:09.46 | *** join/#android romainguy__ (n=gfx@nat/google/x-39e5eeef17b18fd4) |
| 21:26.57 | *** join/#android yakischloba (n=jake@rnkfoods.com) |
| 21:39.02 | jasta | [13:39] <zhobbs_> I just like seeing open source projects emerging of any kind |
| 21:39.09 | jasta | <-- then maybe you should create one :) |
| 21:39.19 | jasta | stupid linebreak ;) |
| 21:40.16 | michaelnovakjr | jasta, created a menu option to call the sender in the messages app |
| 21:40.25 | jasta | very nice |
| 21:40.31 | *** join/#android AstainHellbring (n=Administ@unaffiliated/astainhellbring) |
| 21:40.41 | michaelnovakjr | figured it would be easy.... and it was :) |
| 21:40.49 | michaelnovakjr | it makes sense too |
| 21:40.55 | jasta | definitely |
| 21:43.34 | michaelnovakjr | i'll be back later... i'm going to post the apk later once i add the contact picker |
| 21:43.51 | *** join/#android ligi (n=ligi@p54B9DEB7.dip.t-dialin.net) |
| 21:55.09 | rainabba | Still trying to get the hang of Android as a project (primary systems, compiling, etc...); I've got a Vouge and a couple working copies of Android for it (with a few bugs of course) and I am hearing about "newer" versions. I can't grab just any initrd.gz because each would have drivers appropriate for a given device, right? |
| 21:55.45 | jasta | rainabba: software isn't magic. |
| 21:55.52 | rainabba | Really! |
| 21:56.01 | rainabba | Damn, there goes my bubble :) |
| 21:56.35 | rainabba | Sorry if my question wasn't worded so well. Likely a reflection of my ignorance on the subject. |
| 21:57.24 | rainabba | Worded another way: initrd.gz is device specific for releases of Android correct? |
| 21:57.53 | rainabba | IOW, I couldn't just grab one from the SDK and drop it on my HTC VOuge and expect it to run. |
| 21:57.58 | f00f- | i love when people are humble |
| 21:57.58 | rainabba | ? |
| 21:59.00 | rainabba | dodges the oncomming sarcasm |
| 21:59.21 | rainabba | I'm not humble, I'm honest. |
| 21:59.39 | rainabba | I'm quite arrogant actually, but only where I can justfy my right to be. |
| 21:59.56 | rainabba | s/justfy/justify |
| 21:59.58 | f00f- | i was being honest :) |
| 22:00.11 | rainabba | In that case, thank you. My point stands still :) |
| 22:00.20 | f00f- | well it's great that there are adventurous people running the SDK on real devices |
| 22:00.24 | f00f- | i'd love to do that |
| 22:00.43 | f00f- | as far as your question, i think every device needs customizzation no? |
| 22:00.50 | f00f- | not sure how the initrd is organized |
| 22:00.57 | f00f- | and what modules you need for your arch |
| 22:01.08 | rainabba | With haret it appears to be pretty harmless. I couldn't do it on my own either. A gentleman at Massey University is responsible for my fun I think. |
| 22:01.21 | f00f- | tax dollars at work! |
| 22:01.39 | rainabba | Isn't that a "private" school? |
| 22:02.23 | rainabba | I know there are some patches he released that must be applied to an older version of the SDK, but I'm thinking someone figured out his underlying logic and applied them to a newer version. Just dunno where to get the latest, or how to do it myself. |
| 22:02.39 | rainabba | Getting nearly all my info from: http://forum.ppcgeeks.com/showthread.php?t=23244&goto=newpost |
| 22:03.09 | *** join/#android brunokbcao (n=brunokbc@150.161.2.248) |
| 22:03.26 | brunokbcao | Is this channel about "Google Android"? |
| 22:03.50 | rainabba | Do you want it to be? |
| 22:03.58 | rainabba | Life is what you make of it. |
| 22:04.00 | f00f- | depends on the objective |
| 22:04.10 | f00f- | we talk about a vast range of topics |
| 22:04.14 | f00f- | :) |
| 22:06.58 | rainabba | So I still say the idea that we have a massive black hole in the middle of the milkyway, but it's lying dormant, completely contradicts the general idea of a black hole. |
| 22:07.39 | f00f- | depends on the extent of event horizon |
| 22:08.03 | *** part/#android brunokbcao (n=brunokbc@150.161.2.248) |
| 22:08.43 | rainabba | In any case, it diminishes the fear-factor that they had before this 'discovery'. If the galaxy is in balance with it or expanding, it's not really a threat. |
| 22:09.18 | rainabba | goes to edit his default.txt |
| 22:11.47 | f00f- | grep -v O_BLACKHOLE /dev/universe0 > /tmp/univ2 ; mknod c 6 23 /dev/universe1 ; mv /tmp/univ2 /dev/universe1 ; cat /dev/null > /dev/universe0 |
| 22:13.05 | rainabba | Eeek. In that case, I want to exist in /dev/universe1. Do I have a choice? Also, do all realities exist in /dev/universe0, or is there only one reality with count(/dev/universe*) > 0? |
| 22:13.46 | f00f- | universe0 becomes invalid the moment you null it, but the UniverseManager shifts the context to /dev/universe1 so you get everything but the black hole |
| 22:13.59 | rainabba | Nice |
| 22:14.02 | rainabba | Good thinking |
| 22:14.36 | rainabba | SOmeones goes to run across this on Google from IRC logs some day and seriously scratch their head. |
| 22:14.50 | romainguy_ | I am scratching my head right now |
| 22:15.29 | f00f- | he's gonna patent that s***, better run for your lives! |
| 22:15.58 | rainabba | :P |
| 22:16.02 | yakischloba | Sorry I already hold an ambiguous patent that covers such a concept. |
| 22:16.36 | rainabba | Yah, and who's going to help you enforce that patent; God? |
| 22:17.14 | f00f- | whoever manages multiple unvierses |
| 22:17.16 | f00f- | could be null |
| 22:17.20 | f00f- | in which case you're in big trouble |
| 22:17.26 | rainabba | I WILL NULL YOUR UNIVERSE and pass the UniverseManager a parameter so that O_BLACKHOLE shifts with your context. |
| 22:17.44 | chomchom | hardcore |
| 22:17.55 | rainabba | can no longer stand the geekyness of this joke |
| 22:18.05 | rainabba | geekyness? Hmm. |
| 22:18.40 | rainabba | Just realized we have a crowd. |
| 22:19.08 | chomchom | Theres always a lurking few. |
| 22:20.47 | jasta | rainabba: i did not have the opportunity to finish my thoughts...sorry |
| 22:21.02 | jasta | rainabba: but the kernel is not modular with Android, so the zImage contains all the driver code |
| 22:21.22 | jasta | the initrd is just the ramdisk image that boots android, it contains significant code to power Android, system libraries, init scripts, etc. |
| 22:21.47 | jasta | the system and data images are just a more formal structure for Android to lay onto, and to store its runtime/framework stuffs. |
| 22:22.01 | rainabba | considers "system libraries" |
| 22:22.19 | rainabba | So which of those two files are device specific? |
| 22:22.25 | rainabba | ... or both? |
| 22:27.37 | *** join/#android ChanServ (ChanServ@services.) |
| 22:27.38 | *** mode/#android [+o ChanServ] by irc.freenode.net |
| 22:32.10 | jasta | rainabba: both of them, potentially. |
| 22:32.19 | rainabba | rgr. ty |
| 22:32.20 | jasta | for example, there are dev entries in the initrd |
| 22:32.27 | jasta | for devices that the kernel implements |
| 22:32.35 | jasta | but mostly the kernel in this case, being that iti s not modular |
| 22:32.46 | jasta | the Android release, however, depends heavily on both for obvious reasons |
| 22:33.06 | jasta | userspace must communicate with kernel space, so given al the voodoo going on with Android in the linux kernel there is quite a lot of that communication |
| 22:33.26 | rainabba | Of course :) |
| 22:33.33 | rainabba | smiles like he really understands |
| 22:33.36 | jasta | still, i woudln't go around just randomly plugging in files and try to boot them without knowing what the hell you're working with |
| 22:33.48 | rainabba | That's what I'm taking from this. |
| 22:33.55 | jasta | what? |
| 22:34.10 | rainabba | Have to rely on others for now. I'm not even remotely capable of such wizardry. |
| 22:34.30 | rainabba | Err, That's what I'm coming to understand now from what you're saying. |
| 22:35.45 | jasta | whatever |
| 22:35.58 | jasta | so what brings you here, then? |
| 22:36.59 | rainabba | Interest. I've got the SDK, I've got the emulator, I've got enough experience with C languages and varies IDEs, and I've got a phone capable of and currently running Android. Just trying to learn and explore. |
| 22:37.42 | rainabba | In large, I'm trying to determine if and how I can maintain an up-2-date zKernel and initrd on my own. |
| 22:38.01 | rainabba | zImage I mean |
| 22:38.15 | jasta | you mean keeping up with the changes that the google developers are making? |
| 22:38.15 | *** join/#android ChanServ (ChanServ@services.) |
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| 22:38.25 | rainabba | Daunting, but I'm not feeling hopeless just yet. |
| 22:38.34 | *** join/#android Dougie187 (n=doug@c-69-244-215-210.hsd1.fl.comcast.net) |
| 22:40.49 | jasta | actually, i don't think you even know what the hell you want. |
| 22:40.55 | rainabba | jasta: Not really. I think I'm too far behind the curve to absorb that yet. |
| 22:41.14 | jasta | you don't even know what initrd does or contains, or what a zImage is, do you? |
| 22:41.42 | rainabba | Got a vauge idea and wikipedia. |
| 22:42.04 | jasta | then i highly recommend that you give up. |
| 22:42.25 | rainabba | You're right! I just better then. Lord knows I'm not up for a challange. |
| 22:42.26 | jasta | you don't even know what you want to do or why you want to do it. so don't do it. |
| 22:42.35 | rainabba | rolls his eyes |
| 22:43.17 | jasta | rainabba: let me explain something to you. no new Android release has been made in 6 months. The kernel changes being made by the Google employees are not especially helpful to your Vogue. |
| 22:43.28 | rainabba | jasta: Please don't talk to yourself too long. I'm not up to arguing with idiot and nay-sayers and thus use /ignore freely. |
| 22:44.12 | rainabba | resumes listening and learning |
| 22:44.29 | sayers | jasta: I don't know where that came from, but... ouch :) |
| 22:44.49 | chomchom | yeah man a bit harsh |
| 22:45.09 | rainabba | " then i highly recommend that you give up." " you don't even know what you want to do or why you want to do it." |
| 22:45.28 | rainabba | I'd say the attitude behind that comments far exceeds mine. |
| 22:45.33 | rainabba | s/that/those |
| 22:45.55 | rainabba | Let me quote myself as well: "Interest. I've got the SDK, I've got the emulator, I've got enough experience with C languages and varies IDEs, and I've got a phone capable of and currently running Android. Just trying to learn and explore." |
| 22:46.12 | jasta | rainabba: If you aren't interested in talking to me, I'd ask that you not talk about me as well. |
| 22:46.18 | Dougie187 | hows it going jasta |
| 22:46.24 | rainabba | Not looking to start a fight though so if an appology will keep the peace, jasta has it. |
| 22:46.29 | jasta | By the way, I also have experimented heavily with the Vogue. |
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| 22:47.12 | jasta | Dougie187: good, you? |
| 22:47.16 | Dougie187 | pretty good |
| 22:47.20 | Dougie187 | trying to get wireless n working. |
| 22:47.22 | jasta | Dougie187: i still haven't gone to the Sprint store hehe |
| 22:47.40 | Dougie187 | lol |
| 22:47.45 | Dougie187 | i thought you were going to go there yesterday |
| 22:47.57 | jasta | i was, but it's hard to get away from the gf. |
| 22:47.58 | Dougie187 | i just imagined you driving there peeing your pants the whole way. |
| 22:47.59 | Dougie187 | lol |
| 22:48.04 | jasta | yeah, i would have |
| 22:48.17 | jasta | i tried to even convince her that i would go there, pick it up, and i wouldn't play with it at all that night |
| 22:48.24 | Dougie187 | hah |
| 22:48.25 | jasta | but she's smarter than that hehe |
| 22:48.28 | Dougie187 | you should have taken her with you. |
| 22:48.32 | Dougie187 | made it a date. |
| 22:48.35 | Dougie187 | thats what i would od. |
| 22:48.37 | Dougie187 | do* |
| 22:48.47 | Dougie187 | then go to the mall with her or something |
| 22:48.48 | jasta | hehe, i did take her with me to the apple store when i played with the iPhone for like 2 hours getting interface ideas for Five |
| 22:48.57 | Dougie187 | haha |
| 22:49.05 | jasta | i think she thought it was going to take 5 minutes :) |
| 22:49.55 | jasta | i told her that Romain was poking fun at how much Five looked like the iPhone/iPod, and she was like "well i should hope so after two hours at the apple store." |
| 22:49.56 | Dougie187 | ok.. well lets see if this works.. |
| 22:50.04 | Dougie187 | haha |
| 22:50.09 | Dougie187 | sounds like shes a little bitter |
| 22:50.17 | jasta | she's just happy the ADC is over :) |
| 22:50.28 | Dougie187 | well its going to start back up again soon....ish.... |
| 22:50.31 | *** join/#android michaelnovakjr__ (n=mnovak@96.56.111.166) |
| 22:50.40 | Dougie187 | good evening michaelnovakjr__ |
| 22:50.45 | jasta | Dougie187: yeah but that should meet me a bit differently, since my app already has a substantial base. |
| 22:50.56 | Dougie187 | and following by that point. |
| 22:50.56 | Dougie187 | lol |
| 22:50.57 | michaelnovakjr__ | hey what's up? |
| 22:51.10 | Dougie187 | not much. how bout you? |
| 22:51.18 | Dougie187 | i hope this doesnt break my laptop! |
| 22:51.19 | Dougie187 | lol |
| 22:51.24 | michaelnovakjr__ | eh, not too much... just got home a little while ago |
| 22:51.32 | Dougie187 | sounds cool. |
| 22:51.44 | Dougie187 | i got home about an hour and a half ago. |
| 22:51.45 | jasta | michaelnovakjr__: not much, i was looking over Messages... |
| 22:51.55 | michaelnovakjr__ | what do you think? |
| 22:52.03 | Dougie187 | jasta: are you going to get the thing today? |
| 22:52.04 | jasta | I like it, but there are still some UI tweaks i would do |
| 22:52.16 | michaelnovakjr__ | what did you have in mind? |
| 22:52.16 | jasta | Dougie187: no, today i'm busy. shooting pool with my mom tonight |
| 22:52.22 | Dougie187 | heh |
| 22:52.23 | Dougie187 | ok |
| 22:52.29 | Dougie187 | ill brb one sec. have to reboot. |
| 22:52.30 | *** part/#android Dougie187 (n=doug@c-69-244-215-210.hsd1.fl.comcast.net) |
| 22:53.07 | jasta | michaelnovakjr__: hey, did you not commit your .project? |
| 22:53.13 | jasta | or is this not an eclipse project? |
| 22:53.33 | michaelnovakjr__ | i'm not using eclipse.... but i should start generating the projects anyway :) |
| 22:54.05 | michaelnovakjr__ | make it a little easier for people unfamiliar with ant |
| 22:54.11 | michaelnovakjr__ | or that don't like it :) |
| 22:54.42 | jasta | i prefer maven to ant |
| 22:54.47 | jasta | i put a pom.xml there too :) |
| 22:54.53 | michaelnovakjr__ | cool |
| 22:55.07 | romainguy_ | Maven is not quite the same thing as ant |
| 22:55.10 | jasta | it's nice because it resolves dependencies from a remote repository |
| 22:55.11 | jasta | like CPAN |
| 22:55.15 | michaelnovakjr__ | what UI tweaks did you have in mind? |
| 22:55.25 | *** join/#android Dougie187 (n=doug@c-69-244-215-210.hsd1.fl.comcast.net) |
| 22:55.29 | Dougie187 | sad panda. |
| 22:55.31 | jasta | romainguy_: well, they're analogous as build tools. |
| 22:55.39 | jasta | Dougie187: hehe |
| 22:55.40 | romainguy_ | not really |
| 22:55.53 | jasta | *AS* build tools, not analogous build tools :) |
| 22:56.28 | jasta | Dougie187: latest commit fails to build |
| 22:56.39 | Dougie187 | lol |
| 22:56.43 | jasta | err, michaelnovakjr__ |
| 22:56.53 | Dougie187 | i just installed a new kernel which was supposed to have n in it. and it doesnt.. :( |
| 22:56.56 | michaelnovakjr__ | i haven't done the 1.5 thing |
| 22:56.58 | jasta | michaelnovakjr__: You're missing an import in Conversations.java |
| 22:57.19 | romainguy_ | michaelnovakjr: and that's why IDEs are nice :) |
| 22:57.26 | michaelnovakjr__ | :) |
| 22:57.33 | Dougie187 | IDEs are for pansys. |
| 22:58.25 | michaelnovakjr__ | jasta, that was a change I made as I was leaving |
| 22:59.00 | jasta | am i seeing the latest feature set or no? |
| 22:59.18 | michaelnovakjr__ | yep |
| 22:59.28 | michaelnovakjr__ | fixed Conversation class |
| 22:59.45 | michaelnovakjr__ | i still have stuff I'm working on.... but that is my copy of the project |
| 22:59.53 | *** join/#android AhtiK (n=ahti@88-196-185-130-dsl.rgu.estpak.ee) |
| 22:59.59 | michaelnovakjr__ | that is i am at a clean r87 |
| 23:00.13 | jasta | k, building |
| 23:00.34 | jasta | the more i look at the M5 UI the more i like it |
| 23:00.37 | jasta | soft buttons and everything |
| 23:00.42 | michaelnovakjr__ | its nice |
| 23:00.55 | michaelnovakjr__ | i'm a fan of it |
| 23:01.17 | michaelnovakjr__ | i am curious to see the UI changes romainguy_ says were made |
| 23:01.31 | michaelnovakjr__ | m3 to m5 was a significant improvement :) |
| 23:01.40 | romainguy_ | well |
| 23:01.46 | romainguy_ | have you seen the autocompletetextview in M5? |
| 23:01.59 | michaelnovakjr__ | i use it in my app |
| 23:02.07 | jasta | i think the timestamp should float on the right side |
| 23:02.10 | jasta | and be a darker color |
| 23:02.13 | jasta | maybe a gray |
| 23:02.16 | romainguy_ | well that guy is still using the M3 style |
| 23:02.39 | michaelnovakjr__ | i noticed that, i wasn't sure if that was intentional/meant to be that way |
| 23:02.53 | jasta | what guy? |
| 23:02.58 | romainguy_ | autocompletetextview |
| 23:03.20 | jasta | oh. |
| 23:04.02 | michaelnovakjr__ | jasta, i was thinking in terms of information processing, you see the time and person first and then read the message. |
| 23:04.53 | jasta | i'm not sure I agree. also, i would organize the sender on a line by themselves |
| 23:04.57 | jasta | on the top line |
| 23:05.09 | jasta | i can mock it up how i think it should look if you're interested |
| 23:05.58 | michaelnovakjr__ | sure, that sounds good |
| 23:06.07 | michaelnovakjr__ | it would be nice to see them side by side |
| 23:06.28 | michaelnovakjr__ | i was going more the IM route with this layout |
| 23:06.34 | jasta | ok, but i won't be able to now |
| 23:06.40 | michaelnovakjr__ | ok |
| 23:07.31 | michaelnovakjr__ | i still want to put the contact picker intent in there, so i'll be working with that |
| 23:08.05 | jasta | my change shouldn't mess with that too much |
| 23:08.12 | jasta | if it does i'll resolve conflicts |
| 23:08.42 | michaelnovakjr__ | cool, it should be a separate piece... it will deal with the CreateMessage class |
| 23:18.49 | *** join/#android ahti_ (n=ahti@88-196-185-130-dsl.rgu.estpak.ee) |
| 23:20.30 | michaelnovakjr__ | hey romainguy_ is there a way to get the resource for the dialer icon? |
| 23:20.52 | ttuttle | michaelnovakjr__: it's not your icon! |
| 23:21.03 | michaelnovakjr__ | obviously |
| 23:21.11 | ttuttle | michaelnovakjr__: why would there be a way to get it then? |
| 23:21.19 | Dougie187 | ... |
| 23:21.23 | michaelnovakjr__ | because its a resource |
| 23:21.30 | ttuttle | michaelnovakjr__: yeah, but it's specific to the dialer app. |
| 23:21.47 | Dougie187 | do you know if the dialer app is open sourced? |
| 23:21.53 | michaelnovakjr__ | if i am going to give users access to the dialer i feel it would be appropriate that the icon associated with that menu item be the dialers. |
| 23:22.01 | ttuttle | michaelnovakjr__: oh |
| 23:22.03 | ttuttle | michaelnovakjr__: hmm... |
| 23:22.09 | ttuttle | michaelnovakjr__: maybe there's a way to get the icon of an application. |
| 23:22.21 | ttuttle | michaelnovakjr__: I don't think you can just grab the dialer's icon directly though. |
| 23:22.29 | ttuttle | hmm |
| 23:25.00 | ttuttle | downloads SDK. |
| 23:25.19 | romainguy_ | you can access the dialer's icon through the PackageManager |
| 23:25.24 | ttuttle | romainguy_: ah! |
| 23:25.30 | ttuttle | romainguy_: yeah, I figured there was something like that. |
| 23:25.34 | romainguy_ | however, if we ever change the file name or remove it... |
| 23:25.35 | ttuttle | romainguy_: also, boo, I didn't get any cupcakes! |
| 23:25.49 | romainguy_ | ttuttle: it's because you didn't fix enough bugs :p |
| 23:26.14 | ttuttle | romainguy_: no, it's 'cause I'm too busy fixing bugs to eat cupcakes. |
| 23:26.24 | romainguy_ | I saw you on video |
| 23:26.29 | romainguy_ | you were playing with your phone |
| 23:26.34 | ttuttle | romainguy_: I was stress-testing the graphics engine! |
| 23:26.40 | ttuttle | romainguy_: Also I was paying attention! |
| 23:27.11 | ttuttle | romainguy_: I'd prove it to you, but it's all conf :-( |
| 23:28.12 | ttuttle | romainguy_: Does the PackageManager let you retrieve the icon for a particular activity? |
| 23:28.19 | michaelnovakjr__ | yes |
| 23:28.49 | jasta | michaelnovakjr__: you could also just copy it out, but the PackageManager is a better approach for sure |
| 23:28.51 | ttuttle | michaelnovakjr__: Do you need to know the name of the icon, or just the activity? |
| 23:29.04 | michaelnovakjr__ | the package |
| 23:29.19 | michaelnovakjr__ | the package name to be more exact |
| 23:32.12 | ttuttle | romainguy_: ping |
| 23:33.15 | romainguy_ | ? |
| 23:33.56 | ttuttle | romainguy_: /me thinks we should bring real cake next time. |
| 23:34.14 | romainguy_ | at Sun in the Swing team we used to have the chocolate cake Friday |
| 23:34.19 | romainguy_ | that was good |
| 23:34.34 | ttuttle | romainguy_: cam had mango mousse cake yesterday at lunch :-) |
| 23:35.18 | ttuttle | brb, The Simpsons are on. |
| 23:35.55 | *** join/#android umdk1d3 (n=umdk1d3@adsl-dynamic-64-79-45-15.bridgeband.net) |
| 23:36.22 | f00f- | oh my |
| 23:36.25 | f00f- | i need a cushy job like that |
| 23:36.39 | f00f- | eveyrone thinks google employees drink while working |
| 23:36.49 | f00f- | and of course romain sneaks in a chocolate cake or two |
| 23:37.06 | jasta | i bet there are a lot of unlikely jobs out there cushier than google |
| 23:37.22 | michaelnovakjr__ | we drink on friday afternoons at work |
| 23:37.27 | michaelnovakjr__ | its a bit overrated |
| 23:37.49 | chomchom | I don't think working at google would be 'cushy', working for the coucli is weeellll cushy |
| 23:38.11 | chomchom | loads of fat types sitting around eating, drinking and reading the paper |
| 23:38.11 | jasta | i dream for a government job in a forgotten agency |
| 23:38.27 | jasta | dream of* |
| 23:38.35 | chomchom | honestly its a joke |
| 23:39.01 | f00f- | heh |
| 23:39.34 | chomchom | Sometimes I think to myself, "Why the hell don't I just get a job where I'm presumed to be useless" |
| 23:40.25 | jasta | i have a job where i'm presumed to be so important that no one can fathom asking me to do any additional work. |
| 23:40.38 | chomchom | yes, thats the alternative |
| 23:40.40 | jasta | which is far better than being presumed to be useless :) |
| 23:40.46 | jasta | since i keep getting raises and stuff |
| 23:41.08 | chomchom | although you probably shouldn't state it on a public forum if you want it to stay that way :) |
| 23:41.25 | jasta | probably not :) |
| 23:41.41 | jasta | perhaps i'd be more careful if i were in the industry, as it were. |
| 23:41.45 | f00f- | as long as you do the work prescribed. nobody can question. |
| 23:42.26 | jasta | Yes, sometimes you just get lucky and have managers who have unusually low expectations |
| 23:42.44 | chomchom | They exist? |
| 23:42.50 | jasta | Apparently, I have one. |
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| 23:47.30 | romainguy_ | f00f-: and of course romain sneaks in a chocolate cake or two << no, that was Sun |
| 23:48.20 | f00f- | ha, i bet you still do it :P |
| 23:48.31 | romainguy_ | no need to, food is provided for us here |
| 23:48.53 | romainguy_ | my favorite part is the fridge stocked with Mexican coke in the office next to mine :) |
| 23:50.07 | *** join/#android AttractiveApe (n=phil@office.gossamer-threads.com) |
| 23:51.20 | f00f- | :D |
| 23:53.15 | michaelnovakjr__ | icon lookup worked |
| 23:54.54 | jasta | yawn |
| 23:57.05 | jasta | My Android blog is at http://devtcg.org if anyone is interested to see |
| 23:57.08 | jasta | err |
| 23:57.11 | jasta | damnit |
| 23:57.16 | jasta | i didnt mean to paste that |