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00:10.13 | jhoward | wow. that worked :) |
00:15.11 | knebel | hi |
00:15.35 | knebel | Think it's safe to compile three things simultaniously? |
00:17.59 | jhoward | knebel: what three things? |
00:18.22 | knebel | gimp, zinf and sys-tools/eject |
00:18.26 | knebel | heh. |
00:18.27 | jhoward | The only problem I have ever seen when doing something like that is when I run out of memory (and have no swap) |
00:18.32 | knebel | I'm sure it's fine. |
00:18.38 | jhoward | It should be |
00:57.20 | knebel | ~time est |
00:57.25 | knebel | ~Date |
00:57.26 | purl | Tue Feb 8 00:57:26 2005 |
00:57.32 | knebel | ~Date est |
00:59.27 | Laid | knebel: As long as you're not using package management and/or they don't have overlaping dependancies |
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01:05.03 | knebel | heh |
01:05.09 | knebel | huh |
01:05.11 | knebel | uhuh |
01:05.15 | knebel | duh |
01:05.26 | Laid | <PROTECTED> |
01:05.39 | knebel | nice uptime. |
01:05.50 | knebel | I shutdown each night. |
01:05.58 | Laid | I need to upgrade soon though |
01:06.07 | knebel | 03:05:10 up 21:31, 4 users, load average: 2.00, 1.67, 1.00 |
01:06.18 | knebel | oOh that time is way wrong. |
01:06.36 | Laid | what OS are you running? |
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01:22.18 | knebel | Gentoo, Linux |
01:22.37 | Laid | netbsd i386 1.5.2 |
01:25.54 | knebel | Is there much of a difference? |
01:26.57 | Laid | from which to where? |
01:27.10 | knebel | Lin to BSD |
01:29.03 | Laid | Well, BSD has updated manpages and follows more of the POSIX standards. The generic kernel usually supports everything and it doesn't really use loadable kernel modules, rather you uncomment lines in the config file for obscure things. |
01:29.57 | knebel | I prefer POSIX but the modules I use alot. |
01:29.58 | Laid | Most of the tools are BSD, not gnu. BSD doesn't come with software installed; you use package management for that(X may or may not be intalled as part of the installation) |
01:30.27 | knebel | Yah, I won't use a distro that does that. |
01:31.07 | Laid | ie, you install BSD, you don't boot the computer the next time and come to a crapped up gnome desktop asking for your login. You come to a text login prompt that loads csh. If you want to open X, you run startx |
01:31.33 | knebel | I like gentoo for that reason. |
01:31.44 | knebel | I used to use Slackware for that reason. |
01:31.46 | Laid | the package management is pretty painless. cd /usr/ports/chat/xchat ; make install will install xchat |
01:32.06 | knebel | The most minimalistic I've seen was Slackware. |
01:33.27 | Laid | BSD is nice and lean, and if you're not afraid of man and vi, then you'll get along fine with it |
01:34.02 | knebel | I'm afraid of info. |
01:34.10 | knebel | I use joe... |
01:34.12 | Laid | I've never used info |
01:34.39 | knebel | Bare in mind that you need to put the full path to the file. |
01:34.46 | Laid | WHAT? |
01:34.48 | knebel | or you get info's info |
01:35.03 | Laid | hey, do you need any slashdot karma? |
01:35.14 | knebel | I dun know what that is. |
01:35.25 | Laid | http://slashdot.org |
01:35.51 | knebel | I read the articles all the time, but I'm unaware of karma. |
01:36.17 | Laid | if you have an account and you post . . . if you get modded you gain/lose karma |
01:36.18 | knebel | I got lost along the way. |
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01:39.50 | njan | Laid, all of the points you make are distinctions between freebsd and specific linux distributions, not differences between linux and bsd as a whole. |
01:40.13 | njan | Laid, if you want to distinguish between BSD and Linux, you need to look at the limits of what both operating system kernels (because that's all they are really, kernels; they share most of the same userspace tools) accomplish. |
01:40.25 | Laid | njan: no, not all of them |
01:40.26 | njan | Otherwise you're comparing distributions or releases, not the base products. |
01:40.35 | Laid | I did talk about kernels |
01:40.45 | Laid | I realize that all distros of linux are different |
01:40.49 | njan | Laid, exactly, not all of them. So you can't pick features which are only the case in a subset of linux distributions (eg. old manpages) and imply that they're common to *all* linux, which you did :) |
01:41.15 | Laid | You cannot change the fact that the GNU project does not believe in manpages, no matter how much you try |
01:41.24 | njan | GNU != linux |
01:41.30 | njan | GNU == GNU |
01:41.33 | njan | Linux == Linux |
01:41.41 | Laid | Gnu/Linux |
01:42.05 | njan | bullshit. GNU/Linux == violation of the GPL |
01:42.25 | njan | <PROTECTED> |
01:42.26 | njan | <PROTECTED> |
01:42.26 | njan | <PROTECTED> |
01:42.26 | njan | <PROTECTED> |
01:42.26 | njan | <PROTECTED> |
01:42.28 | njan | <PROTECTED> |
01:42.30 | njan | <PROTECTED> |
01:42.48 | njan | insisting on calling someone else's software GNU/Linux - as RMS does - specifically breaches that clause of the GPL |
01:42.55 | Laid | Why does RMS insist on that designation then? |
01:42.59 | njan | because he's an idiot. |
01:43.05 | Laid | Yes, I know this |
01:43.13 | Laid | but what distro of linux doesn't come with gnu tools? |
01:43.17 | njan | He's well intentioned, he's intelligent, and he's significant, but that doesn't negate the fact that he's a pompous ass. |
01:43.35 | njan | Laid, none that I know of. But that doesn't mean that the OS is GNU/Linux |
01:43.42 | njan | there are virtually no linux distros which come without X |
01:43.45 | njan | that doesn't mean it's X/Linux |
01:43.55 | Laid | I realize this too |
01:44.03 | njan | tools are *userspace*, they're part of the distribution, not the operating system. |
01:44.21 | njan | if a distribution therefore wants to adopt the GNU/Linux nomenclature (as debian sort of does), they're welcome to |
01:44.34 | njan | but RMS can't universalise the GNU/Linux definition |
01:44.41 | Laid | Fine. But what you're saying is that you cannot compare linux and bsd |
01:44.46 | njan | Nope |
01:44.48 | Laid | Ok |
01:44.59 | njan | I said that the way you compared it wasn't comparing Linux and BSD, it was comparing (most linux distros) and freebsd |
01:45.07 | njan | which isn't the same thing. |
01:45.58 | Laid | so I guess the answer would be, knebel, is there is no comparison, because linux is just a free kernel which people have built an environment around, whereas BSD is a whole operating system |
01:46.18 | njan | well, technically you're wrong there too. |
01:46.24 | njan | BSD = Berkeley Systems Distribution |
01:46.29 | njan | BSD is a distribution.. |
01:46.35 | njan | so FreeBSD is a distribution of a distribution. |
01:46.41 | knebel | hey I forget, a standard Music cd, what do I use as it's type when mounting. |
01:46.49 | njan | comparing linux and bsd is like comparing mach and windows. |
01:46.54 | knebel | Hey by the way, You were informative.. |
01:46.59 | njan | That is, if you want to be really snarky :) |
01:47.12 | Laid | heh |
01:47.16 | knebel | The posix argument and the native tools was strong enough. |
01:47.30 | njan | knebel, in my opinion, linux has better hardware support, bsd has more posix support, linux can be securer, bsd is usually securer out of the box |
01:47.48 | njan | knebel, linux has better scheduling (in 2.6, not in 2.4) and multiprocessor support, and is therefore a better choice in an enterprise environment |
01:47.56 | njan | knebel, linux also has a far wider range of available software. |
01:47.57 | Laid | security is relative |
01:48.02 | njan | Laid, correct. |
01:48.15 | njan | Laid, freebsd, relatively, is securer than a default install of debian; marginally. |
01:48.23 | njan | Laid, but linux can be setup far far far more securely than freebsd can. |
01:49.05 | Laid | What can't be secured on fbsd that can on linux? |
01:52.45 | njan | All kinds of things, actually. |
01:52.58 | njan | Propolice, pax, pie, grsecurity, and selinux all go above and beyond what freebsd is capable of. |
01:53.20 | njan | And that's before you even start to play around with UML |
01:53.47 | knebel | So it's about the core of the system, not the applications. |
01:54.10 | njan | knebel, most applications people use a lot run on bsd and linux. |
01:54.22 | knebel | The kernels are designed speciflcally for different things, then? |
01:54.29 | njan | knebel, the kernels are totally different :) |
01:54.36 | njan | bsd is very old and based on a lot of code written by a lot of different people |
01:54.39 | knebel | Who maintains the BSD kernel? |
01:54.42 | njan | linux was totally written from scratch circa 1991 |
01:54.57 | njan | knebel, http://www.levenez.com/unix/ |
01:55.01 | njan | take a look at that :p |
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02:00.59 | ahernan | Mexico |
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02:09.05 | njan | that was random. |
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02:11.27 | knebel | lol |
02:11.30 | knebel | ~mexico |
02:11.31 | purl | mexico is probably a dirty dirty place, or where the gnomes come from |
02:11.44 | knebel | oOH... That's wrong. |
02:11.51 | knebel | ~bad purl |
02:11.53 | purl | Bad purl, bad! No cookie for you! |
02:11.53 | Leonardo_Lopes | purl, where you from? |
02:12.05 | knebel | ~0wn |
02:12.06 | purl | OWN OWN GRRRRRRRRRRRRRRR! |
02:12.17 | Leonardo_Lopes | ~USA? |
02:12.18 | purl | i guess usa is a degraded toilet roll that has been laying on the piss soking toilet matt for 10years, or a continent with a large amount of crack addicts |
02:12.19 | Leonardo_Lopes | ~USA |
02:12.20 | purl | i guess usa is a degraded toilet roll that has been laying on the piss soking toilet matt for 10years, or a continent with a large amount of crack addicts |
02:12.36 | knebel | ~creator |
02:12.36 | purl | well, creator is the guy who made it |
02:12.42 | knebel | ~creator purl |
02:13.18 | Leonardo_Lopes | ~brazil |
02:13.19 | purl | [brazil] a very beautiful country! He has a project called debian-br, with open discusions at #debian-br, or at debian-br.sourceforge.net, or the name of an extremely cool and surreal movie that is worth watching. |
02:14.02 | knebel | ~norway |
02:14.03 | purl | methinks norway is a country in Scandinavia. A beer costs EUR 1,80 there. The capital of Norway is Oslo. And yes norway isn't a member of the EU, or a great skiing nation, or actually it is a great skiing nation, or make sure you know where your towel is before you go |
02:14.22 | Leonardo_Lopes | ~cristiania |
02:14.29 | Leonardo_Lopes | ~russia |
02:14.29 | purl | somebody said russia was red, or cold |
02:14.31 | knebel | ~afgan |
02:14.34 | knebel | ~afganastan |
02:14.40 | Leonardo_Lopes | ~china |
02:14.41 | purl | china is probably a country, or what you eat from on holidays |
02:14.45 | knebel | ~spell afganastan |
02:14.46 | purl | possible spellings for afganastan: Afghanistan Afghanistan's Arkansan Augustan Evanston Afghans afghans against Afghan's Afghanis Ugandan afghan's Agustin organists |
02:14.53 | Leonardo_Lopes | ~cuba |
02:14.56 | knebel | ~afganistan |
02:15.05 | knebel | ~afghanistan |
02:15.15 | Leonardo_Lopes | ~spell cristiania |
02:15.16 | purl | possible spellings for cristiania: Cristiano Cristian Cristionna Christiana Cristina Cristian's Kristian Cristiano's |
02:15.40 | knebel | ~x en br Cristiania is where Leonardo wants to be. |
02:15.41 | Leonardo_Lopes | ~LEonardo |
02:15.55 | knebel | ~x en sp Cristiania is where Leonardo wants to be. |
02:16.05 | knebel | ~knebel |
02:16.06 | purl | you are probably sucking wind in the evolutionary race. |
02:16.12 | knebel | hah |
02:16.39 | knebel | TimRicker, created purl. He's usually around. |
02:16.53 | knebel | I like my entry. |
02:16.56 | knebel | I added it. |
02:17.20 | knebel | ~no knebel is dragging one end of the bell curve way down.. |
02:17.21 | purl | okay, knebel |
02:17.25 | knebel | ~knebel |
02:17.26 | purl | you are probably dragging one end of the bell curve way down.. |
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02:19.29 | krh | wow |
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02:19.50 | knebel | ~random |
02:20.15 | knebel | ~quote |
02:20.40 | knebel | ~quote IBM |
02:20.57 | knebel | ~quote Microsoft |
02:21.04 | knebel | ~quote Sun |
02:21.20 | knebel | ~quote Linux |
02:21.25 | knebel | heh |
02:21.34 | knebel | ~quote Google |
02:24.31 | knebel | ~quote ati |
02:24.55 | knebel | ~quote Acer |
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17:09.20 | LANcaster | :> |
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18:15.29 | Karma0187 | hey whats up |
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18:16.38 | Karma0187 | does ne one got an old dos game called solar wind |
18:16.42 | Karma0187 | the 2nd one? |
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18:35.18 | coral | sorry, wrong network |
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18:35.47 | wrongun | :-) |
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