| 00:03.51 | Zeal | i know what it looks like inside. |
| 00:03.57 | Zeal | rather vividly, heh. |
| 00:10.38 | Bagginsww | ya it has a sewer section |
| 00:10.42 | Bagginsww | on the rightside |
| 00:11.24 | Zeal | aye |
| 00:11.31 | Zeal | that's the bit you do with the naga :) |
| 00:11.54 | Zeal | they're good at sewer infiltration ;) |
| 00:12.29 | Zeal | if naga ever becoem playable that has to be a spell.. |
| 00:14.08 | Zeal | Sewer Infiltration: Stealths you and increases swim speed by 100% |
| 00:15.26 | Zeal | have naga vs aquatic form races . Druid: "haha, i'm winning, he's so far behind i can't even see him anymore!" :p |
| 00:15.45 | Bagginsww | lol |
| 00:16.43 | Zeal | Now i need to gather all that BC info about WC3.. |
| 00:18.41 | nemppu | if naga ever became playable i'd reroll naga quite very fast ;___; |
| 00:19.04 | Zeal | indeed |
| 00:19.19 | Zeal | male for female? XD |
| 00:19.21 | Zeal | *or |
| 00:19.42 | nemppu | male warrior. yeah, i know that their society is patriarchic :P |
| 00:19.48 | nemppu | nonono |
| 00:19.51 | nemppu | matriarchic |
| 00:20.10 | nemppu | i've no idea im too tired to think |
| 00:20.16 | nemppu | female pwned anyhow |
| 00:21.07 | nemppu | but think about this: how would the naga sit on a gryphon/wyvern?:P |
| 00:21.21 | nemppu | or what would their mount look like |
| 00:22.24 | Zeal | pussy whipped? ;) |
| 00:22.38 | Zeal | matriarchic, yeah. |
| 00:23.09 | nemppu | yes |
| 00:23.12 | Zeal | well, i'd want them to not be in horde alliance, so new mounts would be ok. |
| 00:23.18 | Zeal | *or alliance |
| 00:23.22 | nemppu | yes |
| 00:23.30 | Zeal | *taxi mounts |
| 00:23.45 | nemppu | if only blizzard had made an illidan -faction :/ |
| 00:23.51 | Zeal | their mount.. snapdragon or er.. coatil or w/e |
| 00:24.09 | nemppu | yeah but how do they attach to it? :D |
| 00:24.21 | nemppu | snap dragon is actually pretty good, except that its a turtle :X |
| 00:24.25 | nemppu | tortoise actually |
| 00:24.33 | Zeal | bah |
| 00:24.37 | Zeal | w/e they are called in wc3 |
| 00:24.42 | Zeal | the aligators. |
| 00:24.58 | nemppu | mm? |
| 00:25.01 | nemppu | cant remember any alligators |
| 00:25.15 | Zeal | nope, i was right |
| 00:25.18 | Zeal | it is snap dragon |
| 00:25.28 | nemppu | snap dragon was a red tortoise, no? |
| 00:25.31 | Zeal | you're thinking og dragon turtle |
| 00:25.34 | Zeal | *of |
| 00:25.52 | nemppu | aah |
| 00:25.54 | nemppu | true! |
| 00:25.57 | nemppu | http://www.wowwiki.com/Snap_Dragon |
| 00:26.19 | Zeal | http://www.wowwiki.com/Couatl their taxi perhaps |
| 00:26.28 | Zeal | flying mount too possibly. |
| 00:26.33 | nemppu | yeah |
| 00:26.49 | nemppu | on top of that, with a pair of reins coming from the mouth |
| 00:27.02 | Zeal | but yeah.. i forsee laying over the mount, wrapping the end of their tail around ther waist of the mount. |
| 00:27.14 | Zeal | *the |
| 00:27.16 | nemppu | that did cross my mind |
| 00:28.49 | Bagginsww | http://www.wowwiki.com/Black_Citadel_%28WC3%29 |
| 00:29.52 | Zeal | lol.. |
| 00:30.00 | Zeal | gunna get na edit conflict now :P |
| 00:31.07 | Bagginsww | I know... The black steps that that you come out of when you first reach hellfire pennsinsula |
| 00:31.14 | Bagginsww | that's Black Citadel, LOL |
| 00:31.22 | Bagginsww | they roughly look similar heh heh, ;) |
| 00:31.43 | Bagginsww | and it is a ziggurat in form LOL |
| 00:34.31 | Bagginsww | wowwiki is down :p |
| 00:34.46 | Bagginsww | ok its loading now :p |
| 00:49.54 | Zeal | Bagginsww, mind giving it a once over for me? |
| 00:50.04 | Bagginsww | what I could see isn't bad |
| 00:50.21 | Bagginsww | although fix the second quoation, the blockquote looks bad |
| 00:50.32 | Bagginsww | too much tabing |
| 00:50.52 | Zeal | looks fine to me :s |
| 00:51.15 | Bagginsww | its fixed you must have edited |
| 00:51.16 | Zeal | supposed to be out of order with normal text. |
| 00:51.20 | Zeal | nope :s |
| 00:51.27 | Zeal | oh |
| 00:51.31 | Bagginsww | although context of the second sentence should be explained |
| 00:52.56 | Zeal | well i didn't want to use what you wrote, as that's not really applicable for the main article, as it's anaylzing it really. |
| 00:53.20 | Zeal | one sec |
| 00:53.28 | Zeal | gunna move it into the body of the history. |
| 00:54.34 | Bagginsww | k |
| 00:54.39 | Bagginsww | work better there |
| 00:57.33 | *** join/#wowwiki dok3Dal (n=dok@AStrasbourg-251-1-29-55.w82-126.abo.wanadoo.fr) |
| 01:01.47 | Zeal | okay.. now to incorperate everything from HFC.. |
| 01:08.37 | Zeal | bah, wasn't much |
| 01:08.56 | Bagginsww | :( |
| 01:09.13 | Bagginsww | I wonder if Dark Factions will delve deeper into it |
| 01:09.26 | Zeal | now to add the speculation link up.. heh. |
| 01:12.51 | bleetah | I *must* learn to stop misreading NPC profession 'Fletcher' :/ |
| 01:13.16 | Bagginsww | almost halfway compiling info from monster guide supplment into wowwiki |
| 01:15.40 | bleetah | if you need to ask that question, you don't wanna know |
| 01:15.52 | Zeal | lol, i know |
| 01:15.57 | Zeal | though i did have to remind myself |
| 01:16.27 | bleetah | someone infected me with that thought in the first week of playing.. i've never got it out of my head since :( |
| 01:19.18 | Zeal | haha |
| 01:20.00 | Fin | You don't have permission to access /Image:Bcattunement.jpg on this server. |
| 01:20.05 | Fin | Apache/2.0.52 (CentOS) Server at www.wowwiki.com Port 80 |
| 01:20.09 | Fin | hohoo |
| 01:21.00 | Zeal | fine for me :s |
| 01:21.53 | Fin | have I been naughty? |
| 01:22.59 | Zeal | dunno |
| 01:23.23 | Zeal | but i noticed the previous revision link is lacking an image on the end of it, so just gives 403 |
| 01:23.44 | Zeal | that's possibly what's going on |
| 01:24.02 | Zeal | refresh without cache, should fix |
| 01:24.26 | Zeal | cos your cache is probably still trying to use that old revision |
| 01:40.45 | Zeal | ok, gunna play that TFT mission quickly |
| 01:42.53 | Bagginsww | zeal |
| 01:42.54 | Bagginsww | Joined: 17 Jan 2007 |
| 01:42.54 | Bagginsww | Posts: 6 |
| 01:42.54 | Bagginsww | <PROTECTED> |
| 01:42.54 | Bagginsww | -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- |
| 01:42.54 | Bagginsww | <PROTECTED> |
| 01:42.56 | Bagginsww | http://forums.white-wolf.com/use.php |
| 01:42.58 | Bagginsww | Edited due to suggestion that people commit illegal acts. |
| 01:43.00 | Bagginsww | Please do not continue to violate the forum use terms that you agreed to follow. |
| 01:43.02 | Bagginsww | <PROTECTED> |
| 01:43.04 | Bagginsww | LOL |
| 01:47.21 | Zeal | gg WW |
| 01:47.48 | *** join/#wowwiki dok3Dal (n=dok@AStrasbourg-251-1-29-55.w82-126.abo.wanadoo.fr) |
| 01:47.57 | Zeal | i haven't once suggest someone do anything. i've said those who did, i'm pleased, and that i think they are justified to. |
| 01:48.26 | Zeal | and i never agreed to the ToU, that was never once presented to be during or before signing up and using the forums. |
| 01:48.32 | Zeal | *to mwe |
| 01:48.35 | Zeal | *me |
| 01:52.04 | Bagginsww | added weasel LOL |
| 01:52.45 | Bagginsww | well I think the admins are poor editors, all they had to do was remove the offending paragraph |
| 01:52.54 | Bagginsww | they don't even bother to edit people who copy from you LOL |
| 01:53.10 | Bagginsww | those people should get warnings for spreading your quotes LOL |
| 01:53.28 | Bagginsww | maybe its a bot |
| 01:53.42 | Bagginsww | looks for things in your posts and just removes the entire post |
| 01:53.58 | Bagginsww | but then again that would affect peopl;e who copy you |
| 01:54.03 | *** join/#wowwiki dok3Dal (n=dok@AStrasbourg-251-1-29-55.w82-126.abo.wanadoo.fr) |
| 01:56.11 | Zeal | aye, heh. |
| 01:57.37 | Bagginsww | Special Thanks |
| 01:57.37 | Bagginsww | To cows and chickens, because I eat them. |
| 01:57.37 | Bagginsww | – Luke Johnson |
| 02:03.40 | *** join/#wowwiki cladhaire (n=jnwhiteh@WoWUIDev/WoWI/Featured/Dongle/cladhaire) |
| 02:07.29 | Bagginsww | yep the portals are int eh wrong spot in TFT LOL |
| 02:07.42 | Bagginsww | don't even match up with other sources that state they are elsewhere :p |
| 02:08.37 | Zeal | haha, immolation can kill dranei despite being allies, gg. |
| 02:09.03 | Zeal | it matches WC2 Bagginsww |
| 02:09.16 | Zeal | guess you didn't read what i sent you earlier |
| 02:09.30 | Bagginsww | Its later osurces that moved ner'zhul's portals |
| 02:09.42 | Bagginsww | I suppose |
| 02:18.19 | Zeal | well it got it from the transcript of the mission |
| 02:18.26 | Zeal | and it seemed father particular about it |
| 02:19.26 | *** join/#wowwiki Psyker7 (n=Psyker7@203.28.246.152) |
| 02:21.58 | *** join/#wowwiki Gryphen (n=masked@c-71-227-151-230.hsd1.or.comcast.net) |
| 02:21.58 | *** mode/#wowwiki [+o Gryphen] by ChanServ |
| 02:22.40 | Bagginsww | It would make more sense if they made black citadel something else that was destroyeed before BC. That is if they went back to the portals being opened around hellfire |
| 02:23.05 | Bagginsww | It doesn't fit hellfire citadel, that's int he wrong location |
| 02:23.21 | Bagginsww | and construction isn't even close |
| 02:23.50 | Bagginsww | if you have time zeal you should take some more screenshots of the black citadel |
| 02:24.01 | Bagginsww | aquaduct sections, magtheridon's throne section, etc |
| 02:32.00 | Zeal | it's in the right location for HFC tbh. |
| 02:32.20 | Zeal | and don't forget to take into consideration the w3c maps sucked. |
| 02:33.17 | Bagginsww | actually its in the location of old dark portal, not HFC |
| 02:33.37 | Bagginsww | note the shape of the mountains |
| 02:33.43 | Bagginsww | and compare with the map of old draenor |
| 02:34.03 | Bagginsww | although I agree warcraft 3 maps suck |
| 02:34.10 | *** join/#wowwiki Bejitt- (n=Bejitt@adsl-251-12-61.jan.bellsouth.net) |
| 02:35.23 | Bagginsww | actually in some ways the location of the black citadel is kind of closer to where the "hand of gul'dan" is located in NW hellfire |
| 02:36.00 | Bagginsww | http://www.wowwiki.com/Image:Outlandtft.jpg anycase keep track of where that penninsula of a mountain is located |
| 02:36.11 | Bagginsww | The one between the two Draenei Villages |
| 02:36.29 | Bagginsww | http://www.wowwiki.com/Image:Draenor_map.jpg |
| 02:36.41 | Bagginsww | look at where that pensinula of mountains is located in the warcraft II map |
| 02:36.58 | Bagginsww | also note where hellfire citadel was located |
| 02:40.37 | Bagginsww | brb |
| 03:08.26 | Kirkburn|afk | Good morning! |
| 03:08.48 | Kirkburn|afk | I slept for most of the evening :) |
| 03:08.54 | Zeal | lol i noticed |
| 03:08.56 | Zeal | hey Kirkburn|afk |
| 03:09.27 | Kirkburn|afk | Time for some food :) |
| 03:10.55 | Bagginsww | hey kirkburn I've slowly been adding material from the Monster Guide supplement for your perusal LOL |
| 03:11.35 | Zeal | Tekkub, i've known some blizz employee's to visit some more.. unsavoury sites ;) |
| 03:11.49 | Zeal | but they've never announced their presence ofc :p |
| 03:12.08 | Zeal | *-'s |
| 03:12.09 | Tekkub | yea we all know the Tauren design team are furries |
| 03:12.13 | Tekkub | what's your point? |
| 03:12.17 | Zeal | rofl |
| 03:12.33 | Zeal | just commenting on your post on the village pump is all :P |
| 03:13.16 | Kirkburn|afk | Bagginsww, cool |
| 03:13.37 | Kirkburn|afk | I'm in the middle of a 2 day design exercise atm |
| 03:13.39 | Bagginsww | You missed the laughs from when I was posting up exact quotes earlier LOL |
| 03:14.47 | Kirkburn|afk | What's that bit zeal got slapped for?! |
| 03:15.04 | Bagginsww | I don't know what to think of mention of the breed of horse, "Arabians" but then again Palomino and Pintos are kind of ripped from earth as well... |
| 03:15.09 | Zeal | huh? :S |
| 03:15.37 | Bagginsww | oh zeal was saying he agreed with people who thought it was ok to still the supplement |
| 03:15.42 | Bagginsww | and they removed everything in his post |
| 03:15.50 | Bagginsww | most of it had nothing to do with stealing material |
| 03:16.30 | Kirkburn|afk | Btw, just so people know England =/= UK :) |
| 03:17.19 | Kirkburn|afk | Was he saying how to steal it? |
| 03:17.27 | Kirkburn|afk | Or just saying that he agrees? |
| 03:17.28 | Zeal | nope |
| 03:17.39 | Zeal | nor did i say "hey everyone, go steal it!" |
| 03:17.44 | Bagginsww | Sure England is only one small part of the UK |
| 03:18.01 | Kirkburn|afk | Silly OTT admining |
| 03:18.03 | Bagginsww | He just said he understood while some people do it |
| 03:18.27 | Zeal | did even say i would do it |
| 03:18.41 | Kirkburn|afk | "Oh my god, he has an opinion I disapprove of, but is justifiable! We must do something drastic!" |
| 03:18.44 | Zeal | just that i understand it, and i think they're justified in doing so. |
| 03:21.50 | Zeal | hm.. |
| 03:22.11 | Zeal | dammit, gotta stop trying to use mouse gestures on all windows x_X; |
| 03:22.25 | Kirkburn|afk | Lol - our Prime Minister - http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/shared/spl/hi/pop_ups/07/uk_politics_enl_1172779548/html/1.stm |
| 03:22.34 | Kirkburn|afk | Note what he's doing with his hand ^^ |
| 03:25.41 | Fin | well guys |
| 03:25.46 | Fin | I'm sorry but I have to leave you for now |
| 03:26.02 | Bagginsww | LOL |
| 03:26.18 | Fin | it was real |
| 03:26.28 | Bagginsww | They look like the entire cast that played DR. Who over the years, ;) |
| 03:26.30 | Fin | sorry for all the mistells and irrelevance and er stuff |
| 03:26.40 | *** part/#wowwiki Fin (n=Fin@migi.instinct.org) |
| 03:26.57 | Zeal | Bagginsww, does anything say what happens between the Black Temple being called Fortress Shadowmoon (When Ner'zhul takes over) and back to Black Temple (When Illidan takes over) again? |
| 03:27.17 | Zeal | ie, why someone would think Ruins of Shadowmoon where the ruins of it. |
| 03:27.19 | Zeal | *were |
| 03:27.35 | Bagginsww | to be honest besides warcraft II< nothing mentionst he term fotress shadowmoon again. |
| 03:27.44 | Bagginsww | and black temple was never mentioned before |
| 03:27.50 | Bagginsww | not unto ROTH and BC |
| 03:27.52 | Zeal | any info about the ruins though? |
| 03:28.11 | Zeal | Kirkburn|afk, which ones's tony? |
| 03:28.12 | Bagginsww | I don't even think they get refrtenced in quests in TFT |
| 03:28.21 | Bagginsww | its jsut a really strange existence on hte map |
| 03:28.41 | Kirkburn|afk | Yeah, I think so too, Zeal :P |
| 03:28.46 | Bagginsww | made even stranger since Hellfire isn't really known for being shadowmoon lands |
| 03:29.06 | Zeal | lol @ hand |
| 03:29.15 | Zeal | aye |
| 03:29.35 | Zeal | jsut trying to summerize this so people cna start forming the speculation page in full and get a discussion going |
| 03:33.39 | Zeal | Kirkburn|afk, is Daz a white supremacist group? ;) |
| 03:34.10 | Kirkburn|afk | lol |
| 03:34.30 | Kirkburn|afk | ("It washes whiter than white"_ |
| 03:35.12 | Kirkburn|afk | Forgot my dinner, brb |
| 03:35.24 | Zeal | lol |
| 03:39.24 | Kirkburn|afk | "Support for Steam on Windows 98 and Windows ME operating systems will end on June 30th 2007. This means you will no longer be able to run Steam." |
| 03:39.39 | cladhaire | i like steam, its hot. |
| 03:39.59 | Kirkburn|afk | hawtness |
| 03:40.16 | Bagginsww | ahh zeal all refrences to "fel orcs" should state chaos orcs to be be accurate with warcraft 3 setting |
| 03:40.24 | Bagginsww | btw monster guide confirms chaos orc as a valid definition |
| 03:40.38 | Zeal | is there a difference, or just alternative names? |
| 03:40.55 | Bagginsww | the terms are interchangeable definition essentially. Though fel orcs tend to be even more mutated |
| 03:40.59 | Zeal | if the latter, doesn't matter, no need to stikc with WC3 context |
| 03:41.07 | Zeal | *stick |
| 03:41.16 | Zeal | hence why i changed Draenei to Broken. |
| 03:41.39 | Bagginsww | well its that these articles link back to warcraft 3 unit pages too |
| 03:42.04 | Bagginsww | and the term "broken" is something that's developed recently. |
| 03:42.32 | Bagginsww | at the time they were still calling themselves draenei |
| 03:43.06 | Kirkburn|afk | More accurately, Blizz were still calling them the draenei :P |
| 03:43.23 | Bagginsww | In BC you get refrences to how they are all "draenei" |
| 03:43.36 | Bagginsww | though it depends on the character, some see them as draenei |
| 03:43.41 | Bagginsww | other seem them as being something else |
| 03:43.52 | Bagginsww | bigotry and such |
| 03:44.04 | Kirkburn|afk | "Actually, Malfurion isn't a night elf, he's actually an avatar of a demon god. Oh yes, he's been fooling you all this time. Oh and he's a shaman." |
| 03:44.17 | Bagginsww | wha? |
| 03:44.22 | Kirkburn|afk | Retcons :) |
| 03:44.27 | Zeal | http://www.wowwiki.com/Talk:Citadel_Vs._Temple#Summary <-- Bagginsww, give that a once over/comment for me :p |
| 03:44.53 | Kirkburn|afk | I'm just being silly ... the Broken are indeed draenei |
| 03:45.00 | Bagginsww | well you mispelled Karabor |
| 03:45.25 | Kirkburn|afk | Zeal, you fule! You fulish fule! |
| 03:46.27 | Zeal | Bagginsww, i've written the article from a source neutral PoV, it doesn't matter if the information is from WC3 or from WC, it's gunna be written with the most up to date terminology to user's can follow it, except in cases where there is an unresolved issue. |
| 03:48.58 | Zeal | *so user's |
| 03:49.27 | Bagginsww | does it say that the portals were opene dup on hellfire in BC? |
| 03:49.28 | Zeal | lol Kirkburn|afk |
| 03:49.40 | Bagginsww | I thought BC implied they were opened up in shadowmoon valley :p |
| 03:49.57 | Zeal | no? |
| 03:49.58 | Kirkburn|afk | Portals? |
| 03:50.00 | Zeal | never |
| 03:50.04 | Bagginsww | one of those conversations with Danith Trollbane |
| 03:50.12 | Kirkburn|afk | What portals? |
| 03:50.14 | Bagginsww | Ner'zhul opens new portals in Hellfire Peninsula and throughout Deanor, tearing Draenor appart. (WC2, WoW:BC) |
| 03:50.21 | Zeal | and you mentioend the first part of the sentence |
| 03:50.24 | Kirkburn|afk | Ah that |
| 03:50.43 | Kirkburn|afk | All over the place afaik |
| 03:50.46 | Bagginsww | First apperance of Black Citadel, located roughly* where Hellfire Citadel is, no mention of it's past, ruled by Magtheridon (WC3:TFT) |
| 03:50.53 | Kirkburn|afk | There are 4 dead portals around Outland |
| 03:50.54 | Bagginsww | actually its east of the mountains where hellfire citadel was located |
| 03:51.03 | Bagginsww | ya |
| 03:51.04 | Bagginsww | true |
| 03:51.15 | Bagginsww | isntead of being in one place they are all over hte place |
| 03:51.17 | Kirkburn|afk | It's kinda around where the Throne of Kil'jaeden is now |
| 03:51.25 | Zeal | WC2 says they were in HP, right next to the Dark Portal. It also says they opened up in the skies and all over draenor. BC shows that they are open in random places throughout Outland, and the whole sky is now ofc twisting nether. |
| 03:51.25 | Bagginsww | ya kirkburn |
| 03:51.32 | Kirkburn|afk | Which confuses the issue futher still |
| 03:51.51 | Bagginsww | ya kirkburn the "dark citadel" is closer to where throne of kil'jaeden is |
| 03:52.10 | Bagginsww | in warcraft 3 map I mean |
| 03:52.12 | Kirkburn|afk | I think most were opened in HFP, hence the massive destruction around there, but due to the destruction, they no longer exist |
| 03:52.13 | Zeal | dark? lol |
| 03:52.36 | Zeal | i should ad Illidan shut down all the ones around BC. |
| 03:52.49 | Kirkburn|afk | aye |
| 03:53.50 | Bagginsww | http://www.wowwiki.com/Image:Draenoractiv.jpg |
| 03:54.07 | Bagginsww | hellfire citadel was always left of that northern island of mountains |
| 03:54.10 | Bagginsww | int he warcraft II Map |
| 03:54.21 | Bagginsww | that little island shows up in the warcraft 3 map as well |
| 03:54.35 | Bagginsww | although we don't really see much of the land west of that mountain range |
| 03:54.39 | Bagginsww | in the warcraft 3 map |
| 03:54.48 | Zeal | baggins |
| 03:54.50 | Bagginsww | black citadel is decidedly east of that range |
| 03:55.11 | Zeal | rotate WC3 make of HFP 90 degress anti-clock wise |
| 03:55.19 | Zeal | it matches WC2 fine. |
| 03:55.22 | Bagginsww | closer to where "throne of kil'jaiden" |
| 03:55.28 | Zeal | *map |
| 03:55.43 | Bagginsww | bah I have ot show you with a bad paint cirlces... |
| 03:55.49 | Bagginsww | you don't even have a clue what I'm talking about |
| 03:55.52 | Kirkburn|afk | Ooh, this seems somewhat awesomely political - http://darklegacycomics.com/69.html |
| 03:56.40 | Kirkburn|afk | WC2 and WC3 treated Dreanor much like Middle Earth - just showed one side so it /could/ be expanded later :P |
| 03:57.02 | Zeal | lmao @ comic |
| 03:57.37 | Zeal | i shall wack up my photoshop skills for ya baggins :P |
| 03:57.53 | Zeal | a map of HFP in WoW would also be handy.. think i have that somewhere |
| 03:58.33 | Bagginsww | http://www.wowwiki.com/Image:Correspondmountainrange.JPG |
| 03:58.49 | Bagginsww | can you make out hte circles? |
| 03:59.34 | Bagginsww | If you look at those corresponding mountain ranges you can see that Black Citadel is roughtly where Dark Portal is located |
| 03:59.43 | Bagginsww | or at least near throne of kiljaiden |
| 03:59.45 | Bagginsww | in current map |
| 03:59.50 | Zeal | rotate it Bagginsww |
| 03:59.59 | Zeal | and you'll see why that doesn't need to be the case |
| 04:00.34 | Bagginsww | if I rotate it then its not even close to the warcraft II map at all |
| 04:02.32 | Zeal | the mounstains change shape |
| 04:02.34 | Zeal | that's all |
| 04:02.50 | Zeal | WC2 is hardly accurate, and we know wc3 certainly isn't |
| 04:02.58 | Zeal | but rotated, it matches layout |
| 04:03.06 | Zeal | which is the only thing that is consistant |
| 04:03.08 | Bagginsww | no it doesnt |
| 04:03.56 | Bagginsww | the warcraft 3 map is only rotated approximatley 30 degrees off the warcraft II map |
| 04:04.19 | Bagginsww | the peninsual of mountain is in the norht, and the strip of mountain is still int he south |
| 04:04.31 | Bagginsww | but the line going between them is off by 30 degrees |
| 04:04.56 | Kirkburn|afk | There's also the large lack of gap between HFP and SMV |
| 04:05.49 | Kirkburn|afk | Essentially, the pre BC maps are crap :) |
| 04:06.00 | Bagginsww | ya, thats if we assume the "shadowmoon ruins" is supposed to be the old shadowmoon lands |
| 04:06.30 | Bagginsww | http://www.wowwiki.com/Image:Draenor_map.jpg |
| 04:06.45 | Bagginsww | in that map the hellifre citadel is still west of the peninsula mountains like in the other map I showed you |
| 04:07.54 | Kirkburn|afk | When they made the maps for WC3, they never really paid much attention to consistency |
| 04:08.04 | Kirkburn|afk | It was much more about the style |
| 04:08.17 | Kirkburn|afk | Plus it only had to vaguely fit with the game map |
| 04:08.45 | Kirkburn|afk | The WC3 stuff for Quel'thalas is also somewhat messed up |
| 04:09.54 | Kirkburn|afk | The WC3 map /could/ work if you assume that more damage occured between then and now |
| 04:10.08 | Kirkburn|afk | And say that the two mountain ranges have basically gone boom |
| 04:10.27 | Kirkburn|afk | Leaving the HFP/SMV gap |
| 04:10.35 | *** join/#wowwiki dok3Dal (n=dok@AStrasbourg-251-1-29-55.w82-126.abo.wanadoo.fr) |
| 04:10.57 | Kirkburn|afk | Say that North point bottom left on the WC3 map |
| 04:11.39 | Kirkburn|afk | However, if we go with that ... that retcons the WC2 map which we know to be accurate |
| 04:11.50 | Bagginsww | http://www.wowwiki.com/Image:Blackcitadelhuh.JPG |
| 04:12.06 | Bagginsww | actually warcraft II map isn't entirelya ccurate anymore |
| 04:12.13 | Bagginsww | Achindoun is a completley different spot |
| 04:12.18 | Kirkburn|afk | A damn sight more accurate than the WC3 one! |
| 04:12.52 | Kirkburn|afk | Was meaning the shape of the land though, mostly :P |
| 04:12.55 | Kirkburn|afk | Do you see what I mean about how to make the WC3 map fit? |
| 04:13.02 | Kirkburn|afk | I think I was saying the same as Zeal |
| 04:13.28 | Bagginsww | now http://www.wowwiki.com/Image:Hellfirepeninsulamapbeta.jpg |
| 04:13.32 | Bagginsww | now let's looka t the new map |
| 04:13.46 | Bagginsww | pools of aggonar are right aorund where the "peninsula mountain" range is |
| 04:13.54 | Bagginsww | that I circled earlier |
| 04:13.57 | Bagginsww | but what's this? |
| 04:14.05 | Bagginsww | hellfire citadel moved south of it |
| 04:14.24 | Kirkburn|afk | Tiny retcon, but yeah |
| 04:14.36 | Bagginsww | basically none of the maps can be trusted |
| 04:15.05 | Kirkburn|afk | We need a Q&A session with Metzen :) |
| 04:15.07 | Bagginsww | if we assume hellfire citadel is black citadel we have to assume it moved around like the beuty mark on prince john... |
| 04:15.13 | Kirkburn|afk | haha |
| 04:18.42 | Bagginsww | http://www.wowwiki.com/images/f/fd/Blackcitadelhuh.JPG |
| 04:18.45 | Bagginsww | so let's look at version 2 |
| 04:18.57 | Bagginsww | Ode to prince joh |
| 04:19.00 | Bagginsww | *john |
| 04:19.45 | Kirkburn|afk | Basically stuff move to where it suits Blizz :) |
| 04:20.01 | Kirkburn|afk | I'm more interested in whether Deathwing's island makes an appearence |
| 04:20.07 | Kirkburn|afk | Or perhaps the Warsong island |
| 04:20.09 | *** join/#wowwiki Psyker7_ (n=Psyker7@203.28.246.152) |
| 04:20.19 | Bagginsww | warsong island? |
| 04:20.20 | Kirkburn|afk | Definate content patch updates, those could be |
| 04:20.30 | Bagginsww | good point |
| 04:20.54 | Bagginsww | I'd like to know what used to exist west of draenor though heh he. |
| 04:20.58 | Kirkburn|afk | :) |
| 04:21.15 | Kirkburn|afk | It would make a nice change to actually get new areas as part of a patch |
| 04:21.22 | Bagginsww | btw kirkburn nagrand was supposed to be as damaged as hellfire |
| 04:21.27 | Bagginsww | its just regrown |
| 04:21.31 | Zeal | uploading now |
| 04:21.33 | Kirkburn|afk | Oh yes? |
| 04:21.40 | Zeal | http://www.wowwiki.com/Image:Hellfiremapcomparison.jpg |
| 04:21.59 | Bagginsww | sure ignore the direction of the words |
| 04:22.10 | Bagginsww | and that's horrible ugly |
| 04:22.47 | Bagginsww | and you ignored shape of the moutanin ranges :p |
| 04:23.05 | Bagginsww | there were certain things that sorta matched up if you leave north and south alone |
| 04:23.12 | Zeal | ofc i ignored them |
| 04:23.14 | Bagginsww | instead of turning it upside down :p |
| 04:23.22 | Zeal | none of them match |
| 04:23.25 | Bagginsww | I doubt that's what the designers had in mind |
| 04:23.38 | Zeal | WC£ changes mountains to suit the game, WoW changes mountains to suit the game |
| 04:23.49 | Zeal | and not lal maps point norther baggins |
| 04:23.53 | Zeal | *north |
| 04:23.59 | Bagginsww | if I could transparify one or both of the maps I could show you how they fit on top of each other |
| 04:24.06 | Bagginsww | but not as much as you did |
| 04:24.43 | Zeal | well i just looked at you recent map |
| 04:24.50 | Zeal | which makes no sense at all |
| 04:25.03 | Bagginsww | because you just aren't seeing what I'm asying |
| 04:25.21 | Zeal | because you're seeing things that aren't there ;) |
| 04:25.39 | Bagginsww | or you missed what we were discussing |
| 04:25.44 | Zeal | you'e mataching agaisnt mountain ranges that have changed since the destructions and have changed for gameplay reasons. |
| 04:25.46 | Bagginsww | while you ere doing that graphics |
| 04:26.06 | Bagginsww | there are certain aspects of warcraft 3 and warcraft ii maps that are similar |
| 04:26.26 | Bagginsww | the peninsula of mountains was one of them |
| 04:27.15 | Zeal | hardly |
| 04:28.29 | Zeal | and nothing you disccussed changed anything |
| 04:28.41 | Zeal | if anything, Kirkburn|afk was supporting a different idea :P |
| 04:29.17 | Zeal | anyways, wanna update with that better wc2 map |
| 04:30.23 | Kirkburn|afk | Wow, Zeal, totally different to my idea |
| 04:30.33 | Zeal | aye, i thought so |
| 04:30.46 | Bagginsww | http://www.wowwiki.com/Image:Hellfiremountanins.JPG |
| 04:30.50 | Kirkburn|afk | I was trying to put the Black Citadel where the Black Temple is :P |
| 04:30.56 | Bagginsww | can you see the lines? |
| 04:31.02 | Zeal | either way, the point is, none of the maps match exactly, and shouldn't be used as evidence considering that fact. |
| 04:31.04 | *** join/#wowwiki Laraul (n=bohpig@ip72-200-90-128.tc.ph.cox.net) |
| 04:31.33 | Laraul | WoW really really really needs controller support! |
| 04:31.47 | Kirkburn|afk | That's true - it's evident the maps do not show a 'correct' solution |
| 04:32.01 | Kirkburn|afk | Laraul, it has that! Mouse and keyboard :P |
| 04:32.07 | Zeal | as i said Bagginsww, you're comparising (very loosly) to mountain ranges thaat have been torn apart, and have gone through two game itterations of change. |
| 04:32.22 | Kirkburn|afk | So are you, remember :P |
| 04:32.23 | Zeal | *comparing |
| 04:32.36 | Laraul | No a controller! A joypad! Like the PSX or Obox360 controller |
| 04:32.39 | Bagginsww | and Im' not turnign maps unside... |
| 04:32.44 | Bagginsww | and inside out |
| 04:32.47 | Zeal | no, i compared between all 3 and identified similarities that have stayed consistant. |
| 04:32.50 | Bagginsww | only comparing artists renditions |
| 04:33.09 | Kirkburn|afk | The fact all 3 of us have come up with different solutions says something ... |
| 04:33.14 | Zeal | indeed Kirkburn|afk |
| 04:33.35 | Kirkburn|afk | Laraul, you'd only be able to use a tiny number of spells then :P |
| 04:34.37 | Laraul | you'd be able to access every spell, macro, ability, etc easily |
| 04:34.46 | Laraul | easily and quickly |
| 04:34.58 | Bagginsww | http://www.wowwiki.com/Image:Blackcitadelhuh2.JPG |
| 04:36.06 | Laraul | using the keyboard/mouse for such long periods of times makes me sore |
| 04:37.33 | Laraul | my wrists get sore... my back gets sore |
| 04:41.10 | Kirkburn|afk | This news story si just stupid - http://www.neowin.net/index.php?act=view&id=38485 |
| 04:41.35 | Zeal | Bagginsww, just a thought, upload new versions over old ones :p |
| 04:41.36 | Kirkburn|afk | "A "critical" vulnerability in Microsoft's Xbox 360 video game console could let an attacker run unauthorized software on machines that haven't been fixed, assuming the individual has physical access to the machine." |
| 04:41.49 | Zeal | rofl Kirkburn|afk |
| 04:41.49 | Kirkburn|afk | Read that sentence, and concentrate on the last clause. |
| 04:42.28 | Kirkburn|afk | Laraul, would be cool, I do agree |
| 04:43.16 | Zeal | Whats next, there's a curitical vulnerdability that allows an attacker to smash it to bits, assuming they have physicall access to it? :p |
| 04:43.21 | Kirkburn|afk | lol |
| 04:43.30 | Laraul | blizz needs to add the ability to mimic keypresses, mouse clicks and mouse positions thru lua |
| 04:43.38 | Bagginsww | I did uplaod new versions over old ones zeal |
| 04:43.42 | Zeal | curitical? crutons! |
| 04:43.48 | Zeal | *critical |
| 04:43.55 | Kirkburn|afk | Mmm, crutons |
| 04:44.11 | Zeal | i've sen like 5 different links from you Bagginsww :P |
| 04:44.20 | Zeal | they've all been new uploads |
| 04:44.22 | Bagginsww | I had 4 seperate picutures total |
| 04:44.23 | Zeal | *seen |
| 04:44.28 | Bagginsww | and they are intended to be different |
| 04:44.34 | Zeal | 4 is like 5 -1 so that's ok ;) |
| 04:44.42 | Bagginsww | there isn't a 5th one |
| 04:44.47 | Bagginsww | except the one I copied over |
| 04:44.49 | Kirkburn|afk | I know people have managed to use Wiimotes on a PC :) |
| 04:44.57 | Kirkburn|afk | ~coconuts |
| 04:45.00 | infobot | I've got a lovely bunch of coconuts, there they are all standing in a row. Big ones, small ones, some as big as your head, give them a twist, a flick of the wrist, that's what the showman said! |
| 04:45.06 | Zeal | lol |
| 04:45.14 | Zeal | Bagginsww, the 5 thing was a joke.. |
| 04:48.00 | Bagginsww | ok |
| 04:48.44 | Bagginsww | What is that castle symbole on the throne of kil'jaiden? |
| 04:49.03 | Kirkburn|afk | Soyn amazes me, day after day - http://kotaku.com/gaming/top/sony-blackballs-kotaku-240860.php |
| 04:49.05 | Zeal | so baggins, according to http://www.wowwiki.com/Image:Blackcitadelhuh.JPG BC is located at the Throne of Ki'Jaeden and the mountain range you're so eager to match up is that small hill side with a draenei village on it? |
| 04:49.08 | Kirkburn|afk | *Sony |
| 04:50.00 | Bagginsww | that hillside that has two draenei villages one on each side |
| 04:50.25 | Kirkburn|afk | The Temple of Telhamat could count as one |
| 04:51.20 | Kirkburn|afk | There's the SW abandoned draenei town in HFP now too (I forget the name, near the Cenarion Outpost) |
| 04:51.34 | Kirkburn|afk | Nothing around Thrallmar afaik |
| 04:51.58 | Bagginsww | although both of these villages get destroyed I think |
| 04:52.02 | Bagginsww | in the campaign |
| 04:52.09 | Bagginsww | they are just the broken style huts |
| 04:52.09 | Kirkburn|afk | Ah okay |
| 04:52.37 | Bagginsww | well "lost ones" technically |
| 04:52.50 | Bagginsww | if we want to go into how blizzard has decided to change architecture around a bit |
| 04:53.21 | Kirkburn|afk | The whole draenei backstory wasn't written at the time anyway, at least not how we know it today |
| 04:53.53 | Zeal | i'm talking in how you've placed Hellfire Citadel (BC). |
| 04:54.15 | Zeal | *about how |
| 04:54.25 | Zeal | Kirkburn|afk, so they made up the rumour themselves? :S |
| 04:54.32 | Bagginsww | hellfire citadel is south of pools of aggonar |
| 04:54.36 | Bagginsww | in BC |
| 04:54.51 | Bagginsww | which is the closest equivalant outcropping of land |
| 04:55.05 | Bagginsww | that resembles the "hillside" as you put it |
| 04:55.31 | Kirkburn|afk | Zeal, Sony PR just acted like idiots. You can't control the press, especially regarding rumours, so don't try |
| 04:55.42 | Bagginsww | http://www.wowwiki.com/Image:Hellfirepeninsulamapbeta.jpg |
| 04:55.55 | Bagginsww | sony? |
| 04:55.59 | Zeal | no Kirkburn|afk.. i'm trying to grasp an overlooked fact here which rips Kotaku's stance apart |
| 04:56.09 | Kirkburn|afk | What's that? |
| 04:56.12 | Zeal | it said they created the rumour, they were not reporting it |
| 04:56.19 | Bagginsww | rumor about what? |
| 04:56.19 | Kirkburn|afk | Bagginsww, I linked a story earlier |
| 04:56.24 | Bagginsww | oh |
| 04:56.24 | Kirkburn|afk | http://kotaku.com/gaming/top/sony-blackballs-kotaku-240860.php |
| 04:56.52 | Zeal | that is not a journalist, that is anti-sony RP doen of purpose. Thus Sony were right. |
| 04:57.05 | Bagginsww | xbox 360 has avatars not as interesting as mii but similar |
| 04:57.29 | Zeal | ok, i misread, they didn't make it. |
| 04:57.33 | Zeal | so that's fine. |
| 04:57.39 | Kirkburn|afk | Indeed :) |
| 04:57.46 | Bagginsww | wow |
| 04:57.55 | Bagginsww | sony threats? |
| 04:58.03 | Kirkburn|afk | Sony's reaction was way over the line |
| 04:58.13 | Zeal | Bagginsww, how does the Throne of Ki'jaeden not apply to the out cropping? |
| 04:58.27 | Kirkburn|afk | I can't understand their frustration, but ... "eek" :P |
| 04:58.37 | Bagginsww | ya kirkburn |
| 04:58.58 | Zeal | you've shifted the BC version to a smaller range of hills, when it's quite clear HFC is west of a large range, which thus matches the Throne of Ki'jaden perfectly. |
| 04:59.07 | Bagginsww | first off Throne of Kil'Jaeden didn't even exist in earlier history. So can't really incorporate it well |
| 04:59.18 | Zeal | but the mountains did |
| 04:59.32 | Bagginsww | nah the throne of kil'jaeden is farter east |
| 04:59.34 | Zeal | that there was a place in those mountains, no. |
| 04:59.46 | Zeal | Baggins, you're forgetting scaling here |
| 04:59.54 | Zeal | the distances aren't going to match of a ruler |
| 05:00.05 | Kirkburn|afk | It's all guesses, c'mon |
| 05:00.17 | Zeal | yet you completely ignore that and go the other way, and say BC has it directly shouth, not ast |
| 05:00.32 | Zeal | so clearly you're being rather biased there and ignoring the facts right in front of you. |
| 05:00.45 | Zeal | *east |
| 05:00.59 | Laraul | Apple and Nintendo really should make a partnership... they are so much a like |
| 05:01.17 | Kirkburn|afk | God no, Apple is way more up itself :P |
| 05:01.26 | Kirkburn|afk | Apple and Sony maybe ;) |
| 05:02.07 | Laraul | Apple and Nintendo are both the inovators in their industries. They are the ones who think outside the box and make it work |
| 05:02.07 | Kirkburn|afk | Zeal, this is all guesses, and what the WC2 and WC3 maps show means relatively little |
| 05:02.21 | Bagginsww | Ok let's looka t your way let's say the hill is throne of kil'jaeen |
| 05:02.36 | Kirkburn|afk | No, I don't agree Apple are particularly innovators |
| 05:02.42 | Bagginsww | that makes hellfire citadel west of the throne of kil'jaeden |
| 05:02.45 | Kirkburn|afk | Refiners, perhaps |
| 05:02.45 | Zeal | i know Kirkburn|afk, but i don't want to see it being twisted to be use ad evidence against. |
| 05:02.50 | Bagginsww | ok that's in line with wc2 map sure |
| 05:02.58 | Zeal | *as |
| 05:03.05 | Bagginsww | but black citadel was "east" of the "throne" in WC# |
| 05:03.15 | Bagginsww | in an area that is twistin nether |
| 05:03.18 | Bagginsww | in BC |
| 05:03.29 | Bagginsww | http://www.wowwiki.com/Image:Hellfirepeninsulamapbeta.jpg |
| 05:03.33 | Bagginsww | nothing east of hill |
| 05:03.57 | Bagginsww | the problem zeal is you saying my pictures are twistin evidence against you |
| 05:04.02 | Bagginsww | that's not my intent |
| 05:04.02 | Kirkburn|afk | Omg, the Citadel fell off Outland?!?! \o/ |
| 05:04.08 | Bagginsww | I'm only putting up one possibility |
| 05:04.13 | Bagginsww | ya kirburn that's possible heh heh |
| 05:04.24 | Bagginsww | why else did illidan move from it? |
| 05:04.27 | Kirkburn|afk | No wonder Magtheridon is pissed off ;) |
| 05:04.42 | Bagginsww | cause illidan was living in it not long before WoW |
| 05:04.56 | Bagginsww | according to S$L |
| 05:05.00 | Bagginsww | shadows and light |
| 05:05.05 | Bagginsww | but its gone now |
| 05:05.12 | Bagginsww | heh heh |
| 05:05.16 | Bagginsww | and he's living in black temple instead ;) |
| 05:05.52 | Bagginsww | in warcraft 2 map there was a mountain range just north of the dark portal |
| 05:05.56 | Bagginsww | that cleary doesn't exist now |
| 05:06.33 | Laraul | Let me see... Apple introduced the first PC, the floppy drive, the first mouse driven ui... they also introduced the modern laptop design, the first standardized 3D api, etc etc |
| 05:07.05 | Laraul | i really don't see much inovation from the PC side of the industry |
| 05:07.06 | Kirkburn|afk | I could spend a while disproving many of those, y'know |
| 05:07.40 | Bagginsww | uh zeal the southern dark portal you circled as red in the warcraft 3 map |
| 05:07.52 | Bagginsww | that's the portal that blood elves open from center of |
| 05:07.59 | Bagginsww | lordaeron |
| 05:08.00 | Bagginsww | when they escape |
| 05:08.23 | Kirkburn|afk | What was the first PC - http://www.blinkenlights.com/pc.shtml :P |
| 05:08.24 | Bagginsww | I mean the southern one you moved to the "east" :p |
| 05:08.29 | Bagginsww | http://www.wowwiki.com/Image:Hellfiremapcomparison.jpg |
| 05:08.38 | Bagginsww | it was a new portal :p |
| 05:08.47 | *** join/#wowwiki dok3Dal (n=dok@AStrasbourg-251-1-29-55.w82-126.abo.wanadoo.fr) |
| 05:09.15 | Laraul | The apple II was a huge huge step forward |
| 05:09.18 | Laraul | as was the disk II |
| 05:09.28 | Kirkburn|afk | Doesn't make it the first PC though, does it? |
| 05:09.56 | Laraul | no not the first pc... the first pc that could be used in practicle applications |
| 05:10.02 | Kirkburn|afk | I'm not denying Apple has innovated, but so has Micrsoft and many others |
| 05:10.19 | Laraul | what has MS innovated? |
| 05:10.27 | Zeal | sorry, lagging behind, sorting tooltip stuff out.. |
| 05:10.28 | Kirkburn|afk | Are you really asking that question? |
| 05:10.46 | Laraul | Yeah... i can think of some things... I just wanna know what you think they innovated |
| 05:11.07 | Laraul | they're innovations really pale compared to apple |
| 05:11.17 | Bagginsww | I meant dalaran not lordaeron city |
| 05:11.51 | Bagginsww | the southern portal was the portal between outland and dalaran |
| 05:12.11 | Bagginsww | that hte blood elves created to escape from the alliance |
| 05:12.43 | Zeal | er.. ok catch up. Baggins no where is the BC east of the mountain range (Throne), not in any game, so no it hasn't fallen off Outland into the Twisting Nether. Where you're getting your idea for this, i don't know, but i know its where you wnat to place it. |
| 05:13.20 | Bagginsww | no its east of the "hillside" in WC3 |
| 05:13.29 | Zeal | Bagginsww |
| 05:13.32 | Zeal | the map is flipped |
| 05:13.37 | Bagginsww | you flipped it |
| 05:13.39 | Bagginsww | not I |
| 05:13.40 | Zeal | you were talking about my method! |
| 05:13.48 | Zeal | so yes, it's flipped |
| 05:13.50 | Bagginsww | I'mg going by not touching the map |
| 05:13.55 | Bagginsww | you can't claim its flipped |
| 05:13.59 | Zeal | thne don't flip it |
| 05:14.02 | Laraul | Kirkburn|afk? |
| 05:14.04 | Bagginsww | I didn't flip it |
| 05:14.10 | Zeal | otherwise don't evne bother to analyze it. |
| 05:14.15 | Kirkburn|afk | Laraul, I'm researching |
| 05:14.17 | Bagginsww | I left it as is as blizzard painted it |
| 05:14.21 | Zeal | *then dont, flip |
| 05:14.26 | Bagginsww | you are the one trying to flip it |
| 05:14.46 | Zeal | omg, Bagginsww, you were talking about "my way", so analyze it my way or not at all. |
| 05:14.50 | Bagginsww | if we go by the map as blizzard painted it, Black Citadel is to the "east" of the hillside |
| 05:14.51 | Kirkburn|afk | Apple didn't make the first PC, they didn't introduce the floppy drive, they didn't make the first laptops, they didn't create the first mouse-driven UI |
| 05:15.04 | Bagginsww | zeal you are the one confusing yourself |
| 05:15.13 | Zeal | no, i'm perfectly clear thanks. |
| 05:15.23 | Bagginsww | no you are confused on what I was discussing |
| 05:15.38 | Bagginsww | kirkburn noticed what we were discussing |
| 05:15.42 | Zeal | "Ok let's looka t your way let's say the hill is throne of kil'jaeen" <-- then do that, cos atm, you're not. |
| 05:15.42 | Bagginsww | he caught it from the get go |
| 05:15.43 | Kirkburn|afk | The iPod is not an innovation, the iPhone isn't either, many of the 'innovations' in OSX were found elsewhere first |
| 05:15.58 | Bagginsww | I was speaking of hill in an unflipped version of the map |
| 05:16.06 | Zeal | which is not my way |
| 05:16.12 | Zeal | it's not anyones way |
| 05:16.13 | Bagginsww | well I don't have to agree with your way |
| 05:16.21 | Zeal | no you don't |
| 05:16.26 | Bagginsww | there is a hill in the unflipped version of the map |
| 05:16.41 | Zeal | but you can't start criticizing it when you're not even looking at it that way. |
| 05:16.51 | Zeal | anyways.. moving on cos this is silly. |
| 05:17.00 | Bagginsww | figuring out what that hill coresposnds too, the mountains around aggonar, or the throne that makes for two posisbilties |
| 05:17.14 | Bagginsww | now if the hill is where aggonar is now |
| 05:17.23 | Bagginsww | then hellfire citadel is south of aggonar |
| 05:17.31 | Zeal | The portal, yes it's the one they come through, so that is a flaw and i know it. |
| 05:17.35 | Laraul | the iPod was innovative in it's design |
| 05:17.49 | Kirkburn|afk | What, that it used a touchpad? |
| 05:17.55 | Bagginsww | now if that hill is say the "throne" |
| 05:18.00 | Laraul | it made actually navigating your library simple and painless |
| 05:18.06 | Zeal | which we know doesn't match Bagginsww, so why are you saying "let's take this mount as fact" "but let's ignore this part because it fits my theory" |
| 05:18.10 | Bagginsww | then that would make black citadel east of the mountain. an area that no longer exists |
| 05:18.15 | Zeal | *mountain |
| 05:18.25 | Zeal | urgh |
| 05:18.27 | Laraul | the original didn't have a touch pad... it had an actual wheel |
| 05:18.28 | Bagginsww | dude, I have never said anything as fact |
| 05:18.38 | Bagginsww | its always been "possibilties" |
| 05:18.43 | Zeal | *let's take this as a basis for my theory |
| 05:18.44 | Zeal | better? |
| 05:18.47 | Bagginsww | your the only one getting defensive |
| 05:18.57 | Zeal | not defensive, offensive. |
| 05:19.18 | Kirkburn|afk | Laraul, so it did |
| 05:19.29 | Laraul | also the way it was intorgrated into itunes was a major improvement over previous mp3 players |
| 05:19.38 | Kirkburn|afk | We're talking about innovation, I thought |
| 05:19.45 | Bagginsww | GG... |
| 05:19.47 | Laraul | this is innovation |
| 05:19.59 | Kirkburn|afk | No it isn't, Creative already did that stuff |
| 05:20.15 | Kirkburn|afk | I had an MP3 player before the iPod came out |
| 05:21.05 | Bagginsww | First MP3 player was not by apple |
| 05:21.12 | Bagginsww | it was riva or something like that |
| 05:21.20 | Kirkburn|afk | The Office 2007 UI is a good example of MS innovation |
| 05:21.28 | Laraul | how did you put music on it? |
| 05:21.42 | Kirkburn|afk | Using one of Creative's progs |
| 05:22.10 | Bagginsww | I always thought the whole drag and drop through a USB cable was super easy |
| 05:22.14 | Bagginsww | create my own folders |
| 05:22.23 | Bagginsww | drag all my music manually |
| 05:22.31 | Bagginsww | no need for software to do it for me :p |
| 05:22.31 | Laraul | but it's not as convienient |
| 05:22.38 | Bagginsww | I hate itunes |
| 05:22.42 | Bagginsww | it takes over my computer |
| 05:22.45 | Kirkburn|afk | Creative's prog acted like iTunes does |
| 05:22.50 | Bagginsww | won't let me do what I want to do |
| 05:22.57 | Laraul | so does wmp |
| 05:22.59 | Kirkburn|afk | Organised the music, naming, played it back |
| 05:23.18 | Bagginsww | I do all my organization manually |
| 05:23.25 | Kirkburn|afk | WMP takes over your PC? Eh? |
| 05:23.26 | Bagginsww | I don't let software do it for me |
| 05:23.39 | Laraul | well that's your choice |
| 05:23.45 | Laraul | i rather let the software do it |
| 05:24.02 | Kirkburn|afk | Back onto the topic of discussion |
| 05:24.03 | Bagginsww | I'm still someone that uses dos commands, LOL |
| 05:24.06 | Kirkburn|afk | Apple innovation |
| 05:24.45 | Bagginsww | well that is I use them occasionally |
| 05:25.11 | Kirkburn|afk | The only one I've let go so far is the standardized 3D API, and that's only because I don't know what it is/was |
| 05:25.12 | Bagginsww | sometimes some good ways of testing the system through dos. |
| 05:25.26 | Laraul | testing the system? |
| 05:25.49 | Kirkburn|afk | Testing IPs, etc, that kind of stuff? |
| 05:26.09 | Bagginsww | and WMP well I'd rather it take over the system as its tied into windows system a bit better. It also doesn't try to install google... |
| 05:26.15 | Kirkburn|afk | Tracert ftw :P |
| 05:26.24 | Kirkburn|afk | And quicktime |
| 05:26.29 | Laraul | itunes tries to install google? |
| 05:26.30 | Bagginsww | I hate google taskbar |
| 05:26.35 | Bagginsww | some of the new versions ya |
| 05:27.11 | Bagginsww | and I found itunes ujnless you pay for it, has alot of pop up mail :p |
| 05:27.23 | Laraul | are these itunes installers from someone other than apple? |
| 05:27.32 | Bagginsww | I only go to apple |
| 05:27.40 | Laraul | you don't pay for itunes wtf |
| 05:27.45 | Bagginsww | the few times I had to get it for something :p |
| 05:27.50 | Laraul | you don't even use the program obviously |
| 05:28.22 | Bagginsww | actually my copy is through quicktime installation |
| 05:28.25 | Kirkburn|afk | Anyhoo, the fact that iTunes includes Quicktime essentially makes it a no-go zone for me |
| 05:28.27 | Bagginsww | which I do use |
| 05:28.44 | Bagginsww | its probably quicktime that's trying to add that other stuff :p |
| 05:28.52 | Bagginsww | which I don't want :p |
| 05:29.04 | Laraul | itunes is a mac port |
| 05:29.27 | Kirkburn|afk | Regarding QT - there is no way in hell I am paying money to be able to play my videos full screen, or in a badly ported player |
| 05:29.56 | Laraul | yeah paying for QT Pro is so lame... pisses me off |
| 05:30.39 | Laraul | Windows doesn't include an incoder like quicktime though |
| 05:30.39 | isildor | the thing that gets me about itunes, is if all i want to do is copy my mp3s to the ipod |
| 05:30.45 | isildor | why do i have to install quicktime |
| 05:31.00 | Kirkburn|afk | Laraul, but you see my point. Apple is not some uber company that invented the world. It innovates as much as anyone else, no more. |
| 05:31.12 | Bagginsww | cause of video ipods? |
| 05:31.18 | Bagginsww | see what you are going to copy before you do it :p |
| 05:31.30 | Kirkburn|afk | And MS is not some company that steals everyone else's ideas, whatever you'd like to believe |
| 05:31.34 | isildor | mp3 <> video |
| 05:31.46 | Laraul | everyone takes ideas from others |
| 05:31.51 | Kirkburn|afk | Exactly |
| 05:31.55 | Bagginsww | sure we know mp3 is not video |
| 05:32.07 | Laraul | MS just has the strange habbit of taking a good idea and turning it into a bad one |
| 05:32.17 | Kirkburn|afk | Whatever. |
| 05:32.17 | Bagginsww | just some people do get their ipods to watch videos :p |
| 05:32.46 | Kirkburn|afk | I would love to see all these bad ideas MS had ... |
| 05:33.05 | Kirkburn|afk | Is backwards compatability one? |
| 05:33.28 | isildor | IE |
| 05:33.44 | Kirkburn|afk | ... uh, what? |
| 05:34.00 | Bagginsww | IE has an exploit once, and its a bad product |
| 05:34.01 | Laraul | okay... you know in Windows XP.... there is an option in the search window to enable "indexing"? |
| 05:34.09 | Kirkburn|afk | Yes |
| 05:34.23 | Kirkburn|afk | You know when XP came out? |
| 05:34.33 | Laraul | yes |
| 05:34.36 | Kirkburn|afk | Good. |
| 05:34.38 | isildor | im not talking about exploits im talking about confirming to rfc2616 |
| 05:34.52 | Laraul | but the windows xp search never really used the index |
| 05:34.58 | Kirkburn|afk | So you're not going to tell me they stole indexing from OSX then? |
| 05:35.04 | Laraul | No |
| 05:35.22 | Bagginsww | I'd take PC over mac, simply for gaming... Sure the system has its flaws. |
| 05:35.27 | Bagginsww | but it has more games |
| 05:35.41 | Laraul | Console for games |
| 05:35.42 | Bagginsww | in a perfect world, I'd have enough money to own both :p |
| 05:35.55 | Bagginsww | I'm a gamer, I get games on consoles, and pc |
| 05:36.05 | Bagginsww | there are exclusives on each |
| 05:36.14 | Laraul | do you know how to search the index in windows xp? |
| 05:36.16 | isildor | so does blizzard oftenly delete topics? |
| 05:36.26 | Kirkburn|afk | isildor, yes, if they go against the guidelines |
| 05:36.44 | isildor | I was reading one of the druid qq posts, on like page 5, i try to goto 6 and it was deleted. |
| 05:36.45 | Kirkburn|afk | The forums are in no way a democracy |
| 05:37.18 | Laraul | heh kirk you don't do you |
| 05:37.19 | Bagginsww | MagusRogue |
| 05:37.19 | Bagginsww | Joined: 20 Aug 2004 |
| 05:37.19 | Bagginsww | Posts: 1626 |
| 05:37.19 | Bagginsww | <PROTECTED> |
| 05:37.19 | Bagginsww | -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- |
| 05:37.19 | Bagginsww | <PROTECTED> |
| 05:37.21 | Bagginsww | That was mostly directed at Zeal and Gandymede, who both mentioned severe dissappointment at the quality of our products, and Zeal went so far as to say that he's gonna steal our stuff, because they're not worth purchasing. |
| 05:37.24 | Bagginsww | <PROTECTED> |
| 05:37.27 | Kirkburn|afk | Laraul, what? |
| 05:37.37 | Bagginsww | http://forum.white-wolf.com/viewtopic.php?p=954982 |
| 05:37.41 | Kirkburn|afk | Bagginsww, don't spam copied text please |
| 05:37.42 | Laraul | how do you search the content index windows xp builds? |
| 05:37.56 | Kirkburn|afk | Er, I turn indexing on, then I ... search. |
| 05:38.15 | Kirkburn|afk | I have no idea what you're getting at |
| 05:38.21 | Laraul | it doesn't use the index from the windows explorer search |
| 05:38.50 | Kirkburn|afk | Still don't understand |
| 05:39.04 | Laraul | you using xp? |
| 05:39.09 | Kirkburn|afk | yes |
| 05:39.50 | Kirkburn|afk | I have absolutely no clue what you're telling me |
| 05:39.54 | Laraul | k go to computer management in administrative tools |
| 05:41.07 | Kirkburn|afk | yup? |
| 05:42.28 | Laraul | go to services... then there should be something labeled like indexing or something below that |
| 05:42.57 | Kirkburn|afk | You won't like me saying this, but I should mention Vista's search is better then OSX atm |
| 05:43.05 | Kirkburn|afk | Aye, seen it |
| 05:43.30 | Laraul | er vista's search doesn't scan the entire computer |
| 05:44.10 | Laraul | under indexing you'll see "query catalog" pr something |
| 05:44.44 | Kirkburn|afk | Yes |
| 05:45.39 | Laraul | k you should see an input box |
| 05:45.58 | Kirkburn|afk | Yes |
| 05:46.22 | Laraul | well anyhow that's how you search the content index in xp |
| 05:46.31 | Kirkburn|afk | By default Vista doesn't search the entire PC, yes, because that's not what most people want. However, it's the work of one or two clicks to change that |
| 05:47.44 | Laraul | more than one or two clicks |
| 05:48.15 | Kirkburn|afk | I'm talking about changing it to search the entire PC, not to add the entire PC to the index |
| 05:48.33 | Laraul | well that's another thing |
| 05:48.56 | Laraul | when i want to search my computer... i want to search EVERYTHING. Not just what's in the index |
| 05:49.03 | Kirkburn|afk | You aren't most people |
| 05:49.34 | Kirkburn|afk | If you want to change to search the entire PC, by all means. But don't complain the MS caters for the majority |
| 05:50.07 | Laraul | Um... it's ALWAYS searched the entire PC in the past |
| 05:50.12 | Kirkburn|afk | People want stuff that's in their Documents, Music, etc ... not all the crap in Program Files |
| 05:50.18 | Kirkburn|afk | So what?! |
| 05:50.43 | Kirkburn|afk | I don't care what the hell it did in the past |
| 05:50.54 | Kirkburn|afk | What it did in the past was stupid |
| 05:51.18 | Laraul | I agree... but when I bring up the explorer search dialog and tell it to search "Computer" I don't want it just to search thru the index by default |
| 05:52.59 | Kirkburn|afk | Note I am talking about Vista here, as that's the only fair comparison to OSX |
| 05:54.49 | Kirkburn|afk | When search for something, it takes two clicks to change it from searching Indexed Locations to ... "Everywhere" or "Computer" or "C:" or "D:", etc |
| 05:54.49 | Laraul | microsoft... of course... would like the user to never ever see the contents of there harddrive |
| 05:54.49 | Kirkburn|afk | Laraul, are you really this much of a fanboy? |
| 05:54.49 | Laraul | When you first open the Root directory what do you see? |
| 05:54.49 | Kirkburn|afk | That was possibly the /stupidest/ comment I have ever seen on here |
| 05:55.04 | Laraul | Or the Programs Directory? Or the Windows? |
| 05:55.18 | Kirkburn|afk | You tell me! YOU said it |
| 05:55.40 | Kirkburn|afk | Wait, what |
| 05:55.53 | Kirkburn|afk | "When you first open the Root directory" |
| 05:55.58 | Laraul | THe C drive |
| 05:56.07 | Kirkburn|afk | Er, I see ... the C: |
| 05:56.31 | Kirkburn|afk | Vista does not hide anything |
| 05:57.08 | Kirkburn|afk | It sounding like you don't know how a Windows PC works :/ |
| 05:57.32 | Laraul | No it discourages though. Instead of seeing the files and such you see a big message saying browsing these directorys is not a good idea |
| 05:57.37 | Laraul | or something like that |
| 05:57.45 | Kirkburn|afk | Btw, I'm going to get into the habit of calling them a Windows PC and an Apple PC. Just so you know. |
| 05:57.53 | Kirkburn|afk | No, you don't |
| 05:58.05 | Kirkburn|afk | You might have in XP, but I don't get that in Vista |
| 05:58.18 | Kirkburn|afk | Probably if you were on a guest account it might say something, exactly as it should |
| 05:59.26 | Kirkburn|afk | I should also mention that on XP it only ever says that once, and once you say "Show me the files", it doesn't show again |
| 05:59.56 | Laraul | yeah only once |
| 06:00.00 | Laraul | but once is too many |
| 06:00.15 | Laraul | why don't they want you knowing what is installed on your computer? |
| 06:00.16 | Kirkburn|afk | ... |
| 06:00.32 | Kirkburn|afk | What? |
| 06:00.39 | Kirkburn|afk | Seriously, listen to yourself |
| 06:00.46 | Laraul | what is the PURPOSE of such a message? |
| 06:01.03 | Kirkburn|afk | To tell people that editing those files is a BAAAD idea if you don't know what you're doing |
| 06:01.20 | Kirkburn|afk | It's a warning! |
| 06:01.51 | Kirkburn|afk | It's more sensible than a popup box, and is uninstrusive |
| 06:02.01 | Laraul | why is modifying those files a bad idea? |
| 06:02.03 | Kirkburn|afk | *unintrusive |
| 06:02.08 | Kirkburn|afk | wtf |
| 06:02.09 | Laraul | cuz they'll break the os |
| 06:02.17 | Kirkburn|afk | er, yes |
| 06:02.35 | Laraul | But why would an os make it so easy to break? |
| 06:02.38 | Kirkburn|afk | Oh, can you not do that on an Apple PC ... |
| 06:02.47 | Kirkburn|afk | I'm sorry, I forgot an Apple PC is God. |
| 06:02.55 | Kirkburn|afk | Please forgive me. |
| 06:03.34 | Laraul | If Apple can do it, why not Microsoft? |
| 06:03.41 | Kirkburn|afk | Can do WHAT? |
| 06:04.37 | Kirkburn|afk | If you remove important OSX files IT WILL BREAK. Shockingly. |
| 06:04.58 | Laraul | it makes it rather difficult to remove them |
| 06:05.17 | Laraul | Even if they are removed the computer still will probably boot |
| 06:05.29 | Kirkburn|afk | Oh, does Apple not want you editing system files? |
| 06:05.33 | Kirkburn|afk | Odd, that. |
| 06:05.59 | Laraul | no they make editing system files rather easy |
| 06:06.06 | Kirkburn|afk | yeah, sure, the PC will boot just fine without important system files. Just like a man can walk when he has no legs. |
| 06:06.10 | Laraul | it's just they make breaking them difficult |
| 06:06.17 | Laraul | They is reduncy |
| 06:06.25 | Laraul | er there is |
| 06:06.56 | *** join/#wowwiki Tekkub (n=tekkub@WoWUIDev/WoWI/Featured/Dongle/Tekkub) |
| 06:06.56 | *** mode/#wowwiki [+o Tekkub] by ChanServ |
| 06:07.38 | Kirkburn|afk | Sorry, but OSX is not that different to Vista |
| 06:08.04 | Kirkburn|afk | One does not magically work in an entirely different way to the other |
| 06:08.04 | Tekkub | fluffy |
| 06:08.11 | Kirkburn|afk | Heya Tek |
| 06:08.20 | Tekkub | <PROTECTED> |
| 06:08.27 | Laraul | you better cite specifics if your gonna say that |
| 06:08.36 | Kirkburn|afk | No, you had. |
| 06:08.41 | Laraul | otherwise it's just hogwash |
| 06:08.42 | Kirkburn|afk | I'm not the one talking crap about Windows |
| 06:08.51 | Tekkub | oh oh oh lets take our file, rar it into 40 lieces, then rar those together into one rar, and then put that in the fucking torrent |
| 06:08.59 | Kirkburn|afk | Tekkub, I hate that :P |
| 06:09.13 | Tekkub | instead of spending that processing time UNRaRing the file |
| 06:09.30 | Tekkub | I mean, it's a DivX, I'm sure we can squeeze more compression out of it |
| 06:09.48 | Kirkburn|afk | Laraul, you're the one telling me OSX will boot without important system files, and I want you to prove that to me. |
| 06:09.48 | Tekkub | inbreeding FTL |
| 06:10.08 | Kirkburn|afk | Just like you proved that Apple is an innovator. |
| 06:10.19 | Tekkub | isn't the definition of "system file" something the system needs to, like, boot |
| 06:10.20 | Tekkub | :P |
| 06:10.50 | Kirkburn|afk | :) |
| 06:10.50 | Laraul | you want me to move the "CoreServices" folder to the trash and reboot? |
| 06:11.09 | Kirkburn|afk | No. Surely there's documentation of this somewhere? |
| 06:11.36 | Tekkub | trash? be brave, permadelete |
| 06:11.55 | Tekkub | we don't need no stinking "second chance" delete folder |
| 06:12.08 | Kirkburn|afk | It's not a second chance if it doesn't boot. |
| 06:12.15 | Tekkub | first thing to go on any computer I use, the recycle bin |
| 06:12.28 | Tekkub | thankfully I don't need TweakUI in Wista |
| 06:12.29 | Kirkburn|afk | Tekkub, you're just weird :P |
| 06:12.44 | isildor | tell that to your mom, who always says, I didn't know if I deleted something, I could not get it back. |
| 06:12.46 | Tekkub | no, I just want things to do what I tell them |
| 06:12.58 | Tekkub | I say delete, they better fucking dissappear for good |
| 06:13.19 | Tekkub | I don't tell my mom computer things |
| 06:13.27 | Tekkub | I learned to avoid that mess years ago |
| 06:13.33 | isildor | i try not to |
| 06:13.36 | Tekkub | I just tell her I don't use that program |
| 06:13.42 | Laraul | you do know holding the shift key while pressing delete does delete the file |
| 06:14.06 | Tekkub | you do know that removing the recycle bin make shift-delete the default action? |
| 06:14.37 | Laraul | actually the files are still there... just marked as deleted |
| 06:14.37 | Tekkub | AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAARRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! |
| 06:14.47 | Tekkub | there's RaR in the Multipart RaR! |
| 06:14.55 | Kirkburn|afk | lol |
| 06:15.01 | Tekkub | <PROTECTED> |
| 06:15.32 | Tekkub | if I wasn't getting free stuff from these people they'd be getting a strongly worded email |
| 06:16.48 | Kirkburn|afk | haha |
| 06:17.13 | Laraul | the point in breaking a torrent into lots and lots of files if for some reason there is a problem while downloading... the torrent info is lost and... |
| 06:17.21 | Tekkub | I will, however, get another glass of wine and some homemade cheesecake |
| 06:17.35 | Tekkub | Laraul |
| 06:17.38 | Tekkub | just stop |
| 06:17.48 | Kirkburn|afk | Modern BT programs don't need it |
| 06:17.48 | Laraul | well when you download again you don't have to download the entire thing but rather the peices you don't have |
| 06:18.02 | Laraul | WELL THAT'S THE REASON! I agree it's annoying |
| 06:18.08 | Tekkub | it's lazy people that download off a newsgroup and make a torrent without processing the files they got |
| 06:18.39 | Kirkburn|afk | BT programs do not need the files to be split up for it to be 'safe' |
| 06:18.41 | Tekkub | any good bittorrent program can resume bad pieces, and does quite frequently |
| 06:18.50 | Laraul | of course not |
| 06:19.12 | Tekkub | the *other* effect is people that think compressing many time gains extra space savings |
| 06:19.28 | Kirkburn|afk | :) |
| 06:19.47 | Tekkub | which is not the case, simply using a higher compression scheme with a 1-time compress will work much better |
| 06:19.57 | Tekkub | and not was compressing/decompressing time |
| 06:20.14 | Kirkburn|afk | To summarize, Laraul, you have so far listed no innovations of Apple's, and a complete misunderstanding of Windows. Oh, and a blatant bias towards OSX. |
| 06:20.31 | Tekkub | I've been decompressing this thing for 13min now |
| 06:20.31 | Laraul | kirk just shut up |
| 06:20.35 | Kirkburn|afk | No. |
| 06:20.51 | Kirkburn|afk | You come in here and talk shit about stuff, you get what's coming. |
| 06:20.56 | Tekkub | but OSX is purdy |
| 06:21.04 | Laraul | hell how is it i knew how to search the xp index and you didn't? |
| 06:21.13 | Tekkub | look at Vista, it took MS how many years to master "purdy"? |
| 06:21.13 | Laraul | you don't know anything |
| 06:21.17 | Kirkburn|afk | And yeah, OSX is nice :) |
| 06:21.18 | Laraul | just shutup |
| 06:21.33 | Kirkburn|afk | Wow, you sure showed me. |
| 06:21.44 | Tekkub | damn hippies |
| 06:21.57 | Tekkub | go smoke an iPod! |
| 06:22.41 | Tekkub | now, as I was saying... wine and cheesecake |
| 06:30.12 | Tekkub | mmmmmmm |
| 06:30.18 | Tekkub | cheesecake...... |
| 06:30.38 | Kirkburn|afk | Chocolate cake is better, but I can do cheesecake if I must |
| 06:31.03 | Tekkub | I hate cack |
| 06:31.06 | Tekkub | *cake |
| 06:31.09 | Tekkub | ^^ |
| 06:32.22 | Kirkburn|afk | I am not anti-Apple, but I am anti-Apple fanboy :) Well and slightly anti-Apple when certain famous employees pretend like it created the Heaven and Earth. ^^ |
| 06:32.37 | Tekkub | fappl anboy? |
| 06:32.47 | Kirkburn|afk | Tekkub, I hate cack too! Wow! |
| 06:33.06 | isildor | besides we all know the amiga was better ;) |
| 06:33.14 | Tekkub | Aplle is all about facades |
| 06:33.24 | Tekkub | god I can't type... MORE WINE! |
| 06:33.29 | Tekkub | I'll correct this! |
| 06:34.24 | Tekkub | anyone that says apple's software is stable, I have many a frowney-face mac to show you |
| 06:34.33 | Kirkburn|afk | Well I'm getting the feeling people are getting increasingly pissed off at Apple, kinda like Sony's PS3 effect |
| 06:34.50 | Tekkub | there were some damn creative apple fixes back in the day |
| 06:35.12 | Kirkburn|afk | Whatcha mean? |
| 06:35.13 | Tekkub | I can fix damn near any Mac Classic issue, except bursting into flames |
| 06:35.21 | Tekkub | which I have seen happen, *twice* |
| 06:35.31 | Kirkburn|afk | Ouch |
| 06:35.40 | Tekkub | well there was one where the HDD would "stick" in a classic |
| 06:35.45 | Tekkub | the solution... |
| 06:35.51 | Tekkub | pick up by handle |
| 06:36.12 | Tekkub | find "sweet spot" on back about 1/3 of the way up (where the HDD is at) |
| 06:36.26 | Tekkub | smake hard, let chasis twist in your hand |
| 06:36.39 | Tekkub | worked too |
| 06:37.03 | Tekkub | tho often took a few smacks |
| 06:37.16 | Kirkburn|afk | lol |
| 06:37.52 | Tekkub | the librarian thought I was breaking shit, till the typing teacher, who had a lab full of classics, told her it worked |
| 06:41.30 | Kirkburn|afk | haha |
| 06:43.06 | Bagginsww | felboar and helboar are different, I've split the pages |
| 06:44.32 | Tekkub | fhelboar |
| 06:48.21 | Kirkburn|afk | hfelboar ... the welsh version :P |
| 06:50.23 | *** join/#wowwiki Tekkub (n=tekkub@WoWUIDev/WoWI/Featured/Dongle/Tekkub) |
| 06:50.23 | *** mode/#wowwiki [+o Tekkub] by ChanServ |
| 06:53.51 | Bagginsww | lol |
| 07:03.09 | Zeal | Bagginsww, replied |
| 07:03.17 | Zeal | @ WW |
| 07:03.46 | Zeal | Kirkburn|afk, i rarely have to use it, but Laraul as been on my ignore list now :p |
| 07:04.09 | Zeal | er.. *twice now |
| 07:04.24 | Kirkburn|afk | I have no plans to start using one, but each to their own :) |
| 07:04.47 | Zeal | i onyl have two people across 3 networks and 5 chans, heh. |
| 07:05.17 | *** join/#wowwiki dok3Dal (n=dok@AStrasbourg-251-1-29-55.w82-126.abo.wanadoo.fr) |
| 07:05.37 | Zeal | i need to make food.. |
| 07:05.43 | Zeal | and turn off sky travel >_< |
| 07:05.46 | Kirkburn|afk | Off to watch Family Guy |
| 07:05.48 | Kirkburn|afk | bbl |
| 07:05.49 | Zeal | btw Kirkburn|afk, you use sky? |
| 07:05.51 | Zeal | bah |
| 07:05.58 | Kirkburn|afk | Sky? |
| 07:06.01 | Kirkburn|afk | As in TV? |
| 07:06.01 | Zeal | for tv |
| 07:06.03 | Zeal | yes |
| 07:06.05 | Kirkburn|afk | Nope |
| 07:06.15 | Zeal | freeview? ntl? telewest? |
| 07:06.17 | Tekkub | better'n the lib |
| 07:06.26 | Kirkburn|afk | Virgin Media, I guess |
| 07:06.33 | Zeal | well yeah. |
| 07:06.47 | Zeal | saddend by the loss of sky channels? |
| 07:06.55 | Kirkburn|afk | Don't watch it anyway ^^ |
| 07:07.27 | Kirkburn|afk | One of my housemates watches Sky Sports, so he's probably annoyed :P |
| 07:08.06 | Kirkburn|afk | Anyway, toodles |
| 07:08.40 | Zeal | kk, ttyl :p |
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| 07:27.33 | Zeal | i'm, gunna go sort food out then. |
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| 10:24.29 | pakoz | yo any chanters on? |
| 10:39.43 | zeal | uuuummmmm |
| 10:39.54 | zeal | that'd be a no :P |
| 10:39.59 | zeal | anyways, i'm all. nn all |
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| 16:21.29 | Adys | Helloes |
| 16:21.39 | equiraptor | Hello. |
| 16:21.53 | *** mode/#wowwiki [+o Adys] by ChanServ |
| 16:21.55 | Tepetkhet | Hi. |
| 16:21.56 | Adys | there |
| 16:22.26 | Adys | Sorry for the inactivity recently, Im in greece until the 11th |
| 16:22.32 | Tepetkhet | Ah |
| 16:22.34 | Adys | infobot, beer |
| 16:22.35 | infobot | ACTION has disconnected (Read error: 99 (Connection reset by beer)) |
| 16:24.02 | Adys | So no one finished up the vote? Bah |
| 16:24.04 | Adys | http://www.wowwiki.com/WoWWiki:Templates/Elinks_Templates_Standardization |
| 16:24.42 | equiraptor | A friend of mine wrote a beerbot. |
| 16:24.49 | equiraptor | Say you need a beer, it gives you one. |
| 16:24.56 | equiraptor | Unless you're me. It only gives me Dr Peep. |
| 16:25.00 | equiraptor | Er, dr pepper. |
| 16:25.03 | equiraptor | Typing issues today. |
| 16:35.05 | Adys | http://www.wowwiki.com/Template_talk:Icon |
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| 17:23.39 | Kirkburn|afk | Morning |
| 17:23.54 | Tepetkhet | Hi. |
| 17:24.16 | Kirkburn|afk | Remind me not to go in 4 1/2 hours late to a two day project session at Uni. Especially on hand-in day. :P |
| 17:24.26 | Tepetkhet | oops |
| 17:24.35 | Kirkburn|afk | I'm so lazy! |
| 17:24.44 | Kirkburn|afk | But then again, I managed to finish it :) |
| 17:25.00 | Adys | Ello kirk |
| 17:25.31 | Kirkburn|afk | Any Autrailian Uni students around - AWESOME truly INCREDIBLE offer for you. Office Ultimate for AU$75 - http://www.istartedsomething.com/20070302/office-ultimate-75/ |
| 17:25.33 | Kirkburn|afk | Hey Adys |
| 17:25.36 | Kirkburn|afk | How's the weather? |
| 17:25.45 | Kirkburn|afk | *Australian, sorry |
| 17:25.53 | Adys | Im in greece :P |
| 17:26.04 | Adys | Oh doh |
| 17:26.05 | Adys | misread |
| 17:26.25 | Adys | and cant wait to come back home :/ |
| 17:27.08 | Adys | any news about server upgrade? |
| 17:29.05 | Kirkburn|afk | Not liking Greece?! |
| 17:29.09 | Adys | Nah |
| 17:29.10 | Kirkburn|afk | Coming, it's coming |
| 17:29.16 | Adys | Boring :P |
| 17:29.20 | Adys | want my place? hehe |
| 17:29.23 | Kirkburn|afk | Likely this weekend. vlad says he's tested it |
| 17:29.37 | Kirkburn|afk | Not likely, I had enough for being abroad in Italy last year =) |
| 17:29.45 | Adys | =) |
| 17:29.55 | amro | Adys: touring or work? |
| 17:30.10 | Tepetkhet | Do any of you guys know anything about itemstats tooltip thingies for websites? |
| 17:30.11 | Adys | Family |
| 17:30.39 | amro | Tepetkhet: be more specific |
| 17:31.10 | Kirkburn|afk | The rollover stuff Tep? |
| 17:31.26 | Kirkburn|afk | No idea where to get them, unfortunately |
| 17:31.35 | Tepetkhet | Well, I was trying to get a thing for my website so you could do [item]Dagger of Stabbing[/item] and it would pop up with the stats from Allakhazam or whatever. |
| 17:31.45 | Tepetkhet | I found an addon that's supposed to do that. |
| 17:31.54 | amro | doesn't allakhazam have some sort of API? |
| 17:32.10 | Tepetkhet | But all it seems to do is convert my thing into a link to the item and not pop up. |
| 17:32.13 | Tepetkhet | API? |
| 17:32.34 | amro | well not exactly an API but a way to get data from allakhazam in your site |
| 17:32.38 | Adys | Kirkburn btw |
| 17:32.49 | Adys | http://www.wowwiki.com/index.php?title=MediaWiki:Pagemovedtext&action=history |
| 17:32.50 | Tepetkhet | I guess so. The addon's supposed to do that. |
| 17:32.51 | Adys | Check that out |
| 17:32.59 | Tepetkhet | But it doesn't pop up. |
| 17:33.09 | Tepetkhet | It just converts it to a link. |
| 17:33.13 | Adys | I thought there would be a possibility with URLEncode maybe but dunno |
| 17:36.01 | Kirkburn|afk | Adys, what about it? |
| 17:36.09 | Adys | check the changes i made |
| 17:36.19 | Kirkburn|afk | Preventing the redirect? |
| 17:36.19 | Adys | they dont work |
| 17:36.22 | Adys | aye |
| 17:36.30 | Adys | because there are still spaces in the url |
| 17:36.33 | Adys | so it fucks up the link |
| 17:36.41 | Kirkburn|afk | :( |
| 17:36.47 | Adys | but urlencode transforms it into %20 and not _ iirc |
| 17:36.51 | Kirkburn|afk | Maybe with 1.9.2 it might act more sensibly |
| 17:37.53 | Adys | mebbe |
| 17:39.06 | Adys | irc + msn + wow on a comp that I almost never touched before as healing class i never play with a qwerty keyboard and different keybinds and without addons FTW |
| 17:42.39 | amro | qwerty > azerty |
| 17:42.59 | Adys | Depends if you worked four years with an azerty :P |
| 17:43.19 | amro | i have |
| 17:43.38 | amro | but i was like 5-10 at the time |
| 17:43.51 | Kirkburn|afk | Qwerty ftw :) |
| 17:44.03 | Adys | meh :p |
| 17:44.04 | *** join/#wowwiki Gankutsuou (n=jirc@208.190.93.67) |
| 17:44.24 | amro | I mean, what common use could I possibly have for micro (u)? |
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| 17:44.59 | amro | by u I mean µ |
| 17:45.15 | Adys | hehe well Im on a greek setup atm |
| 17:45.40 | Adys | É ãïôô; ;äßô ôç;ô éôó íïô ðïóóéâëõ ôçå âåóô óåôèð ôï èóå çåñå |
| 17:45.48 | Adys | I mean.. |
| 17:45.58 | Adys | I gotta admit that its not possibly the best setup to use here |
| 17:46.01 | Kirkburn|afk | ooherr |
| 17:46.25 | Kirkburn|afk | Yay for english's lack of any remotely interesting letters! |
| 17:46.32 | Adys | lmao |
| 17:48.15 | amro | that's a good thing, I hate accents in french |
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| 17:53.33 | Adys | Well Im off, have fun guys, Ill try and reconnect at some point before the 11th but not sure |
| 18:02.26 | Kirkburn|afk | My sister's cat got run over last night :( |
| 18:02.55 | Kirkburn|afk | No fair :/ |
| 18:10.19 | Tepetkhet | Noooo |
| 18:10.22 | Tepetkhet | Poor kitty! |
| 18:11.42 | Kirkburn|afk | I have lots of piccies to remember him by at least :) |
| 18:11.57 | Gankutsuou | Anyone from the template crew around |
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| 18:12.22 | Kirkburn|afk | I'll volunteer :P Gankutsuou how can I help? |
| 18:13.58 | Gankutsuou | I just wanted some feedback on a new talent table I'm working on for the class pages |
| 18:14.06 | Gankutsuou | Cause the current ones are butt ugly |
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| 18:15.21 | winkiller | show em, although I'm not from the template crew |
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| 18:15.55 | Kirkburn|afk | (wow, I didn't know this had actually continued - http://www.whorecraft.net/ ... NSFW obviously) |
| 18:17.55 | Gankutsuou | http://www.wowwiki.com/User:Gankutsuou#Rogue_Talents_WiP |
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| 18:20.08 | Gankutsuou | I was updating all the Rogue abilities/talents with their BC changes and missing icons and had to update the talent table as well, so I thought I might redesign it in the process. |
| 18:21.50 | Kirkburn|afk | Much better, yeah |
| 18:22.26 | Kirkburn|afk | There's too much contrast on the current tables |
| 18:22.32 | Gankutsuou | Yeah |
| 18:23.05 | Gankutsuou | and you don't have to scroll your wheel twice to view one table |
| 18:23.36 | Kirkburn|afk | Aye, good change |
| 18:23.42 | Gankutsuou | Removed the rank column because it's irrelevant when you add 1/2/3/4/5% in the description |
| 18:24.11 | Kirkburn|afk | True |
| 18:25.00 | Gankutsuou | and then I removed prerequirements, which should be prerequisites, and seperated each talent tier with horizontal borders |
| 18:26.05 | Kirkburn|afk | Lol, it said prerequirements? |
| 18:26.09 | Gankutsuou | Yeah |
| 18:26.53 | Gankutsuou | I think the original creator was CrazyJack, I asked for feedback on his talk page but haven't recieved a response yet |
| 18:27.18 | Kirkburn|afk | Aye, some people aren't around that often. CJ visits occasionally |
| 18:27.46 | Kirkburn|afk | I'm not seeing the horizontal borders |
| 18:27.49 | Gankutsuou | Hmm |
| 18:28.00 | Kirkburn|afk | (IE7) |
| 18:28.12 | Gankutsuou | They're dotted styles |
| 18:28.30 | Kirkburn|afk | I see it in FF |
| 18:28.49 | Gankutsuou | Odd |
| 18:28.53 | Gankutsuou | The left border works |
| 18:28.56 | Gankutsuou | But not the bottom one |
| 18:29.22 | Gankutsuou | Ah |
| 18:29.27 | Gankutsuou | It's because it's an empty cell |
| 18:29.33 | Gankutsuou | It won't display in IE |
| 18:30.13 | Kirkburn|afk | Oh I see your method |
| 18:30.16 | Gankutsuou | I'll just have to apply the style to the bottom talent (or top) in each tier |
| 18:30.17 | Kirkburn|afk | It's an extra line |
| 18:30.20 | Kirkburn|afk | Yeah |
| 18:32.28 | Kirkburn|afk | (Btw, STALKER has gone gold) |
| 18:34.37 | Gankutsuou | Never heard of it |
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| 18:53.23 | winkiller | Gankutsuou: looks nice |
| 18:54.30 | Kirkburn|afk | An interesting little snippet: |
| 18:54.32 | Kirkburn|afk | After the first Warcraft and when we were talking about Warcraft II, there was an idea for about a week where we'd open another portal open and have the Orcs invade the modern-day world. We had this whole cut-scene we were talking about where it was going to be dragons and F-16s and firefights and stuff. And we were like, "Man, that's going to be weird. That's going to suck. That's not going to be Warcraft." |
| 18:54.50 | Kirkburn|afk | (from an interview regarding Hellgate: London) |
| 18:57.19 | Gankutsuou | Thanks, winkiller |
| 18:57.53 | winkiller | oh btw, is there an "automatically watch pages I edited for edits afterwards"? instead of manually watching.. |
| 18:58.27 | Gankutsuou | Not that I know of |
| 18:59.41 | Kirkburn|afk | yea |
| 18:59.45 | Kirkburn|afk | In preferences |
| 18:59.53 | Kirkburn|afk | Probably hidden by the whiteness |
| 19:00.13 | Kirkburn|afk | Shall look for it |
| 19:00.51 | Kirkburn|afk | Under EDITING about halfway down there are two options to tick - |
| 19:00.53 | Kirkburn|afk | Add pages I create to my watchlist |
| 19:00.53 | Kirkburn|afk | <PROTECTED> |
| 19:01.56 | winkiller | ah thanks |
| 19:02.00 | Gankutsuou | Awesome, |
| 19:02.06 | Kirkburn|afk | :) |
| 19:03.01 | winkiller | it is hidden by the whiteness, btw |
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| 20:13.40 | Tepetkhet | It's working! |
| 20:13.43 | Tepetkhet | Itemstats is working! |
| 20:13.44 | Tepetkhet | YAY |
| 20:13.47 | Tepetkhet | I hacked it. |
| 20:14.16 | equiraptor | Glad you got it working. :) |
| 20:14.44 | Tepetkhet | equiraptor: You should check it out on the forums. |
| 20:16.37 | amro | got a link? could be useful for my guild website |
| 20:17.26 | Tepetkhet | amro: I used files from itemstats.free.fr |
| 20:18.04 | Tepetkhet | The problem with using it with the CMS software I'm using is that he modified core files. |
| 20:18.35 | Tepetkhet | So every time there's an upgrade, you have to put his changes into the new versions of the core files. |
| 20:18.45 | Tepetkhet | But he clearly commented all of his changes. |
| 20:18.55 | Tepetkhet | So I just copied and pasted them into the new versions of the files. |
| 20:18.56 | amro | page is taking forever to load. is it dependant on that CMS? |
| 20:19.05 | equiraptor | Have I registered on that site yet, tep? |
| 20:19.11 | Tepetkhet | equiraptor: Let me check. |
| 20:19.33 | Tepetkhet | equiraptor: No. |
| 20:19.45 | equiraptor | Ok. |
| 20:19.46 | Tepetkhet | amro: http://itemstats.free.fr |
| 20:19.50 | amro | im there |
| 20:20.10 | amro | the french is giving me a headache |
| 20:20.14 | Tepetkhet | It looks like there used to be itemstats bbcode in the beginning. |
| 20:20.19 | Tepetkhet | Oh, you can change to Engrish on the right. |
| 20:20.21 | amro | and high blood pressure too |
| 20:20.28 | Tepetkhet | heh |
| 20:20.46 | amro | ah much better |
| 20:20.46 | Tepetkhet | So people started porting itemstats to various other forum and CMS software. |
| 20:21.12 | Tepetkhet | This guy did the hard work of converting it to work with many different kinds of sites. |
| 20:21.16 | equiraptor | done. :) |
| 20:21.17 | Tepetkhet | But he's stopped maintaining it. |
| 20:21.57 | Tepetkhet | equiraptor: You have guildie access now. |
| 20:22.15 | Tepetkhet | I'm not really very good at programming. |
| 20:22.17 | Kirkburn|afk | Maybe, given the Armory, we'll one day have the opportunity of getting the info from Blizz themselves |
| 20:22.27 | amro | erm is there a generic version? I use a custom system on my site |
| 20:22.40 | equiraptor | Woot. :) |
| 20:22.51 | Tepetkhet | amro: yeah, I think there is. It says it works with html/php sites, too. |
| 20:22.58 | Tepetkhet | So sorta generic. |
| 20:23.33 | Tepetkhet | amro: It looks like what you do is get the Core files and then... |
| 20:23.34 | Tepetkhet | http://itemstats.free.fr/e107_plugins/content/content.php?content.24 |
| 20:24.10 | amro | oh i see, thanks |
| 20:24.29 | Tepetkhet | A lot of this doesn't make sense to me. |
| 20:25.02 | Tepetkhet | But I can kind of look at the files and look at the way it's implemented on different systems and do a diff between his version of the files and my version. |
| 20:25.04 | amro | php inside html is ugly |
| 20:25.11 | amro | why people wont just use print statements is beyond me |
| 20:25.44 | Tepetkhet | Compare and make fit. |
| 20:26.33 | amro | improvising - the most important skill |
| 20:27.03 | amro | going to reboot into linux to work on the site again |
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| 21:17.50 | Tekkub | A thought on the Elinks template.... |
| 21:18.21 | Tekkub | if the thott variable hasn't been defined, why not show a "search on thott" link that uses {{PAGENAME}} as the search arg |
| 21:18.39 | Tekkub | it'll help people find the thott ID to put in even :) |
| 21:33.51 | Tekkub | alright, all coded let me know |
| 21:33.51 | Tekkub | http://www.wowwiki.com/User:Tekkub/ElinksitemTest |
| 21:39.15 | amro | looks good to me |
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| 23:13.02 | bleetah | woot, bbc and youtube have reached an agreement |
| 23:22.21 | nemppu | o.O |
| 23:22.23 | nemppu | what sort? |
| 23:23.56 | bleetah | http://www.reuters.com/article/internetNews/idUSL0216508120070302 |
| 23:24.45 | bleetah | IIRC, they're also sponsoring Azureus to get it to a stage where they can release backcatalog stuff, too |
| 23:24.57 | bleetah | I guess they didn't sell as many Dr Who DVDs as they thought they would ;) |
| 23:25.45 | bleetah | here's the bbc news story about the youtube deal, tho http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/business/6411017.stm |
| 23:26.51 | bleetah | http://www.youtube.com/profile?user=bbcworldwide and http://www.youtube.com/BBC |
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