irclog2html for #wowwiki on 20070301

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00:42.13ZealAddOn or Addon?
00:42.29Finalthough I think AddOn is more Correct
00:45.45Karrionwell the directory name is Interface/AddOns, with capital
00:46.57Zealthough as much, lol
00:47.40Finexactly... but.. "AddOns"? i swear hardly anyone actually uses htat
00:48.02Zealanyone more familiar with creating them, know the names the community use for each type of thing. just wanna check Commands, Functions, Events and Widgets are correct.
00:48.55Fincorrect in what sense?
00:49.43Zealwell are those the terms used in the addon dev community?
00:49.53Zealgot most (if not all) from wowwiki.
00:54.38Karrionthey're all valid terms... link some context and I'll tell you if they're being used right
00:55.11Zealknow how they're used
00:55.25Zealjust wasn't sure if they are the most accurate/popular terms
00:55.49Zealsetting up namespaces on my wiki is all.
00:56.50Karrionwell... best answer I can give would be yes
00:57.30ZealCommand or Macro is the only one i'm questioning now :s
00:57.38Zealsoemthing previously made me use Command..
00:57.48Zealno idea what
01:00.12KarrionA command is a single /command.. a macro is made up of one or more commands
01:00.38Karrion(well zero or more I guess, including the trivial case)
01:01.20Karrionand these days macros can have pragmas, to (#show)
01:01.30Zealover my head, but ok
01:01.46Zealafter thinking about it, just merging all into API.
01:05.20FinSlash command
01:07.55KarrionFunction is ambigous, does it mean user/addon defined function? Game API function? Widget method? FrameXML-defined function?
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01:08.11FinFunction has a specific meaning
01:08.31Karrionwell, yes, and all of those are functions
01:08.33Finit's a function in Lua (which is also a Game API functio nand a FrameXML-defined function)
01:09.22Karrionbut in terms of the wiki, widget methods are documented separately to base API functions
01:09.28Karrionfor example
01:09.41Finright, so "Function" is just a superset
01:10.23Zealthe widgets are objects, not functions as far as i'm seeing. you apply API functions (in lua) to a widget.
01:10.28Zealif i'm wrong, let me know
01:10.59Fin"apply" isn't exactly correct, but I reckon you mean the right thing
01:11.03Zeal*defined in lua
01:11.32Karrionehhhh... widgtes are objects, which have specific functions associated with them; when functions are associated in this way, they become what we call "methods" of the object
01:12.43Fin"A subprogram which returns a value of a specified type which is invoked as part of an expression."
01:12.50Finis sort of OK
01:13.46Finit's something that takes some values normally and does something then returns something, sometimes to something else or itself - but not necessarily
01:14.31Karrionso for example the Frame widget has a method Show(), which you call like frame:Show(). The wiki documents the Show() method in the widget section, because widgets are useless without their methods, and because other widgets might also have a Show() method which does something different. So all I'm saying is that it's useful to distinguish between the two kinds of function.
01:15.09Finsure, distinguish away!
01:15.43Finbut "function" is still a term when you're listing stuff like Widget, Event, AddOn, etc.
01:18.11FinI mean, I think so anyway
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01:20.35Karrionoh for sure, I just got the impression that Zeal was listing them in terms of caterogisation, where the more specific terms would be more useful
01:21.25Zealthat is true Karrion
01:21.51Zealbut ultimately, i dropped thme all, and just put them under API
01:22.01Finfair enough - but, "AddOn"?
01:22.09ZealAddOn is on it's own
01:22.32Zeali've considered libraries too, but though they may as well go under AddOn as well.
01:22.55FinI don't normally correct people on that!
01:23.10Zealthose little ' like to slip in ;)
01:23.13Finonly because you're on a Correct thing!
01:23.32Finoh those little 's, eh... yeah... the "slip" in
01:23.45Finsounds dirty
01:23.54Zealso that's 47 new namespaces all together, lol.
01:24.22Karrionfair enough ;-)
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01:37.46Zealodd, didn't set off my notify :s
01:37.51Zealwhat Fin?
01:41.57Finfirst day of the monht!
01:42.47Zealoh, yes, lol
01:42.59Zealer.. no hit backs or w/e lol
01:43.09Finyou have to do it to someone else then
01:43.23Zealnah, cos you didn't say it :p
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01:43.46Zealplus, busy ;)
01:44.52Fingod fucking dammit
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01:53.33KarrionHmm, was looking at Zeal's Template:BC_Itempage_Placeholder; it and several things it links/included use "depreciated" when they mean "deprecated"
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01:53.55KarrionIncluding Category:Pages_using_depreciated_templates
01:55.27KarrionI could fix Template:BC_Itempage_Placeholder and move Template:Depreciated, but can categories be moved/renamed?
01:55.44Zealit's not mine in thee slightest, and it's intentional
01:56.12Karrionwell, yours as in your deprecation of it
01:56.41ZealTekkub actually
01:56.44Karrionthe Template:Depriciated is Tekkub's
01:56.47Zeali set it ot speedydelete ;)
01:57.04Karrionah sorry must have looked at wrong history line
01:57.54Zealand it's depreciated, not deprecated. Tekkub has spelt it correctly.
01:58.18FinI think actually it is "deprecated"...
01:58.20Karrion"depreciated" means, decreasing in value over time
01:58.24Fin"depreciated" is "reduced in value"
01:58.34Zealwhich is what it is
01:58.37Karrion"deprecated" means, to be considered harmful or no longer to be used
01:58.49Zealdeprecated doesn't mean that exactly.
01:58.57Zealbut either way, it is depreciated
01:59.48Finoh, hah, yeah, well I guess it would've helped if I'd read the IRC log and not just tried to be all clever
02:00.54Zealyes Karrion, wikipedia can be wrong
02:01.23Zealand in this context it is. I've never even seen the word deprecated used in that way. Even wikipedia uses depciated.
02:01.38Karrionand wikipedia can be wrong ;-)
02:01.56Zealshould also note one of the meaning of deprecated according to dictionaries, is depreciated
02:02.37Zealdeprecated seems a rather deprecated word itself tbh
02:03.18Zealonly other meaning i've seen to protest and disagree with strongly
02:03.22Zeal*is to
02:04.32Zealhas little relvence.
02:04.32Zeallet's also not forget programmers like to make up special words..
02:04.42Karrionhmm, food sounds like a good idea... bbl
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02:42.48KirkburnMethinks it's time for bed
02:42.55KirkburnTrashy TV ftw :)
02:44.09KirkburnOh and CSI ftss   (translation: for the sheer stupidity)
02:46.10Kirkburn"Well I found this blue thread on his jacket and I traced it via my contact in .... then looked at webcams in .... after travelling to the Mariana Trench .... with petals .... up a tree in the Amazon ... so I went jogging ... hated "Friends" .... with a branch. It's from your jumper, Gil."
02:48.08KirkburnFirst day of the month! And no returns!
02:51.16Zealdamn you! :p
02:55.35Finyes! yes!
02:56.20KirkburnFin, you sound like you're ... enjoying yourself
02:57.33Finpunch! pinch!
03:02.03KirkburnHey, heard about the new armory page?
03:02.53Finrenchap's already screen scraping it to extract data about players
03:03.22KirkburnThe EU one -
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03:13.08KirkburnThey're arguing whether 0.9999999999999999... = 1 on #wowi-lounge
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03:15.18Karrionso much fun
03:15.45KarrionI mean, it's not like professional mathematicians haven't proved it a dozen times
03:32.35Zealinteresting how he's scraping that fin.. all characters showed up with a broken empty page for me.
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03:35.02bleetahof course, they're glossing over the fact that there's no such thing as absolute certainty or proof... but.. no.. i'm starting it in here
03:53.58Finproof is for a the weak
04:01.12bleetahWoW Winer news: The WoW Wine 'crew' are migrating their HowTo onto's Linux/Wine page. Once that's done, they'll be pointing their appdb entry page to :)
04:02.56bleetahonly main problem at the moment, is it's under the 'Linux/Wine' section, and I'd like to see it split off to indicate more than just linux. However, I can't think of a brief phrase that means 'Running WoW on an OS that's not officially supported by Blizz but is tolerated'
04:03.18Zealrofl bleetah
04:03.27Zealhow about just Wine?
04:03.33Zeallet it explain itself.
04:03.45bleetahthen we'd have to disambiguate from Booze:Wine ;)
04:04.09bleetahor at least, set it up in such a way that a Booze:Wine or similar could exist
04:04.11ZealWoW on Wine?
04:04.35bleetahyeah, we'll get it together over the next week or so
04:05.07bleetah << WoW Wine appDB maintainer :)
04:07.12Zeali just turned the xml parser on for my wiki
04:07.22Zealstraight away, line 1, error
04:07.30Zealand this is default install, no changes to the page.
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04:07.57Zealgotta love them standards huh mediawiki? >_>
04:20.02Zealhm.. Tekkub, dunno what version they started doing it, but 1.6.9 (which i beleive i'm using) doesn't do wiki accessed css : /
04:20.05Zealor js..
04:26.04Zealscratch that, i typo'd
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06:26.55Zealerm.. Tekkub, i'm confused.. O_o
06:27.22Tekkubthis should help you with that confusion
06:29.58Zeallol, not it didn't :p
06:30.13Zeali take it those links no longer work now?
06:31.42Zealwell anyways, i'm tired. nn all
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07:06.37BagginswwInteresting, Monster guide mentions that the glowing green eyes are sign of evolution from high elves, and in time they may evolve even further from high elves.
07:06.47Bagginsww*in blood elves
07:07.43Laraulhow do you monitor addon performance?
07:11.23Laraulzeal still using that script?
07:15.20LaraulDoes weather have any effect on anything?
07:20.19Bagginswwno it doesn't effect anything
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08:14.19bleetahLaraul: when 2.1.0 (not 2.0.10) comes out, there'll be much better built in tools for monitoring addon performance
08:14.32bleetahLaraul: there's a thread in the UI/Macro forum on the wow site about it
08:15.46LaraulI was reading the suggestion forum... and came accross a post asking to allow faction change...
08:15.56LaraulI think it would be a good idea
08:16.36LaraulBut it would be very tough to accomplish the goal needed
08:16.57LaraulI guess no one is listening...
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08:40.09vlad_I need to take down the wiki briefly so I can do some stuff for testing
08:40.16vlad_if all goes well, it'll be down for only a few minutes
08:41.34vlad_do de doo
08:45.45vlad_.. doo da dee ...
08:46.05vlad_that ther shure is a lot o' datars!
08:52.14Larauli guess i'm gonna watch lost
08:53.45vlad_... and done.
08:54.00bleetahLaraul: I recall seeing a blue post stating that there'd be far too much recoding and testing involved to allow faction change
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11:18.42LaraulMan... I really don't feel like learning lua
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12:52.06HJT_aka_Eylenahi everybody
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13:05.26HJT_aka_Eylenacan any1 tell me the racial talents of alliance mages?
13:05.57HJT_aka_Eylenanot talents i ment, spells :s
13:14.17HJT_aka_Eylenais there any channel for general wow discussion?
13:18.52HJT_aka_Eylenaplease not all at once :s
13:19.16amroalright then, I won't say anything =P
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13:36.00HJT_aka_Eylenaur mean :s
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13:57.54Kirk_UniAnd now I depart once again
13:57.55TepetkhetHave fun.
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15:23.49HJT_aka_Eylenanext try: do mages have race-specific spells, like priests?
15:24.24equiraptorPriests are pretty much the only class like that.
15:24.51equiraptorHorde paladins have different names for a few of their spells than alliance, but I *think* the spells have the same function.
15:24.56equiraptorI *think*. Not entirely sure.
15:25.30HJT_aka_Eylenafor that i dont care, coz my second char will be mage ;)
15:26.52Tuqui-tuquiyou know mages are a dying breed :<
15:32.49HJT_aka_Eylenaand i wanna counter that
15:33.02TepetkhetHealers are a dying breed.
15:33.15TepetkhetActually, they've been rare for a while.
15:33.18HJT_aka_Eylenai already didi my part against that
15:33.54TepetkhetI have 2 level 60+ healers in my guild.
15:34.04TepetkhetNeither are online much.
15:34.55HJT_aka_Eylenawe have 2 that r nearly every evening online, 1 we dont see often and me, lvl59
15:35.18Tuqui-tuquiwell, are you priests shadow or holy?
15:35.27Tuqui-tuquiwe have a druid in our guild
15:35.31Tuqui-tuquiawesome players :D
15:35.38TepetkhetWho mentioned priests?
15:35.43HJT_aka_Eylenaim shadow due levelup, the rest is holy od holy/disc
15:35.46Tuqui-tuquibut she is usually stuck healing =\
15:35.50Tuqui-tuqui\which makes me feel bad :<
15:35.56TepetkhetOh, wait.
15:36.15Tuqui-tuquibecause I know some druids/priests also wanna dish out damage
15:36.56TepetkhetEncounters tend to fail when the tank dies, though.
15:37.18Tuqui-tuquibut Im thinking thats the reason priests are rare
15:37.23Tuqui-tuquior at least holy specced\
15:37.26HJT_aka_Eylenaif ur holy, u can nearly forget soloing
15:37.41TepetkhetOh.  Just put on DnD then.
15:37.43Tuqui-tuquiwho wants to sit back and heal for the duration of a raid XD
15:37.48TepetkhetAnd tell people you're busy.
15:38.04TepetkhetTuqui-tuqui: Healers, apparently.
15:38.09HJT_aka_Eylenado less, get more
15:38.17TepetkhetPeople who like the thrill of having the raid's life in their hands.  ;)
15:38.28Tuqui-tuquitrue... hmm... good point
15:38.41TepetkhetWho wants to stand up and sunder sunder sunder and get hit for the duration of a raid?
15:38.54TepetkhetWho wants to hang back and autoshot and AFK for the duration of a raid?
15:39.05TepetkhetHow about sinister strike sinister strike sinister strike?
15:39.55Tuqui-tuquiI can never go AFK with my squishie :p
15:40.09Tuqui-tuquithat reminds me
15:40.12TepetkhetEvery class can be as boring or as exciting as you want it to be.
15:40.25Tuqui-tuquilast night I truly saw the effects of ice CC in my mage :D
15:40.44Tuqui-tuquiIm level 52 and I aggroed about 4 50-51 mobs
15:40.54Tuqui-tuquiit was 5
15:40.58Tuqui-tuquione joined the party -.-
15:41.20Tuqui-tuquitook them all down with no damage! \o/
15:41.27Tuqui-tuquiI was jumping with joy
15:41.57Tuqui-tuquifrom then on it was taking multiple mobs at once :D
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16:56.36TepetkhetI hate writing stuff up...
16:56.42TepetkhetI fret over all the little things.
16:57.02TepetkhetLike right now, I'm trying to update our "About Us" thing for my guild to be more informative.
16:58.07Tuqui-tuquican we get a previw? :)
16:58.30TepetkhetRight now it's at under About Us
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17:01.07TepetkhetNew page is here:
17:10.29Tuqui-tuquithats your language? :D
17:10.43TepetkhetWhat do you mean?
17:10.59Tuqui-tuquilanguage refers to scripts
17:11.12Tuqui-tuquihmm... is that the entire thing?
17:11.14Tuqui-tuquithere we go
17:11.18Tuqui-tuquiis that it?
17:11.41Tuqui-tuquiok ^_^
17:11.52Tuqui-tuquia bit of advise if you do not mind
17:11.52TepetkhetI'm not sure what you mean.
17:12.01TepetkhetBy "is that it?"
17:12.13Tuqui-tuquiwell its 4 lines... and I mean no disrespect
17:12.45TepetkhetThere should be a left panel, a right panel, a banner and a box that says "Test About Us" with 3 paragraphs, a short phrase, and a signature.
17:13.13Tuqui-tuquiwhat I meant was... is that it for your About Us description
17:13.43TepetkhetOh, the regular About Us here?
17:13.53Tuqui-tuquiyeah :D
17:14.04TepetkhetThere should be 2 paragraphs and a line at the bottom that says, "For the Horde!"
17:14.21Kirkburn|afkAww, you're mature?
17:14.33Tuqui-tuquiI blame the schools
17:14.50TepetkhetI'm 36 years old and don't use "lol" every other word.
17:14.56Tuqui-tuquiI do!
17:15.25TepetkhetWho was that in my IRC?
17:15.40Kirkburn|afkLooks cool, but I would say maybe increase the font size a little? =)
17:15.48TepetkhetI don't know how to get Trillian to show hostmasks on join/part.
17:16.01TepetkhetKirkburn|afk: You certainly may.
17:16.20Bagginswwso kirkburn I put up a a list of "monsters" from the monster guide
17:16.20TepetkhetI am not satisfied with the overall readability of the site.
17:16.26Bagginswwand the one from the supplements
17:16.26TepetkhetAnd there are some problems I have with the layout.
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17:16.41Tuqui-tuquiI just think you should fill it a bit more
17:16.41BagginswwI might pick up the supplment at some point out of morbid curiosity :p
17:16.51TepetkhetI'm not a designer, though, so coming up with something different is hard.
17:17.01Kirkburn|afkBagginsww, \o/
17:17.24TepetkhetTuqui-tuqui: You think the original is better, or the Test one?
17:17.51Kirkburn|afkMy thoughts on the design - increase the header and main text size a little, move the name into the picture box?
17:18.06Kirkburn|afk(I'm commenting on )
17:18.11Tuqui-tuquithat one is better
17:18.15Tuqui-tuquibecause it gives you more to read
17:18.19TepetkhetHm.  if I make it too long, people may hit the "Too Long Didn't Read" stage, though.
17:18.25Tuqui-tuquiusually About Us are lengthy
17:18.32Tuqui-tuquithough the majority lean on boring -.-
17:18.43Kirkburn|afkGood idea putting a name on the about us
17:18.48Kirkburn|afkMore personal :)
17:18.59Tuqui-tuquiyeah Tepetkhet, people lose interst quickly
17:19.16Kirkburn|afkBagginsww, Weasel?!
17:19.24Kirkburn|afkOh my god, it's going to bite me!
17:19.27BagginswwLOL, ya...
17:19.40Bagginswwooh its a snake
17:19.53Bagginswwooh its a snake, Graham
17:20.04TepetkhetKirkburn|afk: I have struggled with the banner.  I kind of want to move the guildname more up into the banner area, but I don't want to cover my cute little Voidwalkers.
17:20.44Kirkburn|afkOoh, I'd like to see squid in WoW
17:20.59Tuqui-tuquiwe have crab people
17:21.00Kirkburn|afkTepetkhet, I see them :)
17:21.02Bagginswwya, and some of those "animals and vermin" are ones mentioned in "appendix III" :p
17:21.22Bagginswwsquid would be cool
17:21.31Bagginswwsame with octopi
17:21.42Tuqui-tuquisame difference?
17:21.54Kirkburn|afkTepetkhet, if it's reduced slightly, it could just cover the lightning things, staying above the VWs?
17:21.57Bagginswwnah they are different physically
17:22.08Tuqui-tuquiwell because of the head area...
17:22.08Bagginswwsquid have like 10 tentacles
17:22.18Bagginswwand the heads are different
17:22.20Tuqui-tuquibut it would be cool to have squid/octopus area
17:22.22TepetkhetI think my text boxes need padding.
17:22.28Tuqui-tuquilike squids could be minions
17:22.31BagginswwI think they are said to live in maelstrom
17:22.33Tuqui-tuquiand octopus could be bosses
17:22.37Kirkburn|afkIf the text is bright enough (bright yellow, so yes), you don't need a huge title :)
17:22.38Bagginswwin Lands of Mystery
17:22.57Kirkburn|afkAye, a few px of padding would help
17:23.00TepetkhetKirkburn|afk: That's kind of what I was thinking for the positioning.
17:23.07BagginswwI'm guessing the refrence to "african rhino" must be in the article itself not hte title
17:23.24Bagginswwmaybe its a "comparison" thing
17:23.41BagginswwLike, they are similar to "african rhinos"
17:24.11Bagginswwyou know Monster Guide actually uses the term "Neanderthal" to describe troggs?
17:24.29BagginswwThat's such an earth description, :p
17:25.54Tuqui-tuquithose earthlings...
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17:26.51BagginswwAlthough Kirk brought up a good point the other day, "Swiss"
17:26.57TepetkhetIt's time.
17:27.00TepetkhetIt's time.
17:27.06TepetkhetIt's time to hate the Swiss.
17:27.07Tuqui-tuquidont do it Tepetkhet!
17:28.30TepetkhetI wish I knew why my purple and gold horizontal bars on my sote on top of menus and stuff all had EXTRA PADDING.
17:29.55BagginswwI finally got around to playing Call of Duty 3. I was amused that it has Canadians in it... There was always this running injoke with COD fans complaining on message boards about how there was "never any canadian campaigns"
17:30.18BagginswwI hear that upcoming PSP game has a Canadian campaign too
17:30.38Tuqui-tuquiIt's called "We're here to clean up after you guys did all the work!"
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17:30.54Tuqui-tuqui<3 Canadians
17:30.58Tuqui-tuqui<3 Canadia
17:31.32BagginswwCanadians are interesting though, from the standpoint they feel like a cross between americans, brits, and french all rolled up into one unit
17:31.57Bagginswwgusn are british, some of the characters have "american accents", and some have "french accents"
17:33.05BagginswwAlthough, having not know much about the involvement of Canadians during the war, I was also a bit surprised that their helmets and uniforms looked quite a bit different than either american or british uniforms., especiall the helmets.
17:33.58Tuqui-tuquiits weird with Canada
17:34.07Tuqui-tuquitheyre a semi independant entity
17:34.43Tuqui-tuquigood thing about them, their great healthcare system!
17:34.46Tuqui-tuquigo Canadia!
17:34.48BagginswwI thought they were independent at this point? Although at least the west still has a fascination with the queen.
17:35.27Tuqui-tuquiI believe theyre part of England
17:35.29Tuqui-tuquiare they not?
17:35.30BagginswwIn recent times though most of their coins have removed more and more symbols of British rule
17:35.37Tuqui-tuquiits not like anyone follows Cnadian news or history
17:35.52BagginswwI thought they broke away from England in last 15 years or so
17:36.21Bagginswwthat is they no longer have to pay taxes or such to England, from what I remember reading
17:36.44Tuqui-tuquiI think thats been going on for a while
17:36.55Bagginswwand that was one reason why they wanted to change their money to include pictures of animals and leaves and other things that mean "Canada" rather than the old "empire"
17:37.09Tuqui-tuquiCanada gained independence from the United Kingdom in an incremental process that began in 1867 and ended in 1982; it remains a Commonwealth Realm.
17:37.19Tuqui-tuquithat explains it
17:37.21Bagginswwso its basically an ally
17:37.28Tuqui-tuquiforced ally :p
17:37.40Tuqui-tuquicanadian: meh... gotta help those turkey brits again
17:38.24BagginswwWhere does Australia fit in nowadays?
17:38.41Bagginswwindependent, partial independent?
17:38.45Tuqui-tuquiin the anals of the world...
17:39.17Tuqui-tuquiits completely independant of the UK
17:39.26BagginswwThat's what I though
17:40.24Bagginswwthe canada money change has been occurring over hte last 10 years or so
17:41.29BagginswwWoah, canada has a new territory, LOL. Somehow I missed that
17:41.50BagginswwNunavut, in 1999
17:42.08Bagginswwbut as early as 1993
17:42.24BagginswwI guess it wasn't "big news" LOL
17:43.35BagginswwI wonder if east and west still discuss breaking away into seperate countries still?
17:43.47Tuqui-tuquiyou mean in Canada?
17:43.59Tuqui-tuquithat rumour of certain areas wanting to belong to the US?
17:44.33BagginswwThere was always a history of antagonish between the more french controlled territories and the more british controlled territories
17:45.27Bagginswwa few times throughout history there were discusses of having some kind of split in the nation
17:45.46Tuqui-tuquiI doubt its ever going to happen
17:45.52BagginswwI don't think so either
17:46.56BagginswwI hink discussion is mostly scholarly if anything, or at least canadian version of a filibuster, LOL.
17:47.58sancuslol @ you guys
17:52.29BagginswwOh and chaos orcs get a refrence again in Monster Guide as another name or type of fel orc
17:53.17Bagginswwand refrence to raid on the "Black Citadel" to attack magtheridon.
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17:57.58Zeallo all
17:59.15Zealweren't a load of the french territories wanting indepence recently? Canada put a stop to it iirc.
18:00.44Bagginswwya, I believe so
18:03.00BagginswwI remember reading or hearing it in the news.
18:03.49Bagginswwalthough can't always trust the news LOL
18:07.03BagginswwSo you gotta love how all ungoro creatures are now classified as "dinosaurs" LOL
18:08.48Tuqui-tuquiIm still to go to UnGoro :<
18:08.50BagginswwEternals gets used again in the book.
18:09.17Bagginswwwell all the reptilian creatures, not hte plants, golems etc of course
18:09.40Tuqui-tuquiare there rare herbs in unGoro?
18:09.45Tuqui-tuquiI need to farm herbs -.-
18:09.51BagginswwI'm not an herbalist no idea
18:09.55Tuqui-tuquioh =\
18:09.58Tuqui-tuquiyou turkey -.-
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18:12.46BagginswwI don't see what the problem is with "Eternals" really...
18:12.58Bagginswwall other terms redirect to that thread anyways...
18:20.43Bagginswwadding in the listed varients to the monster guide monster list
18:28.10BagginswwIt turns out grell are natural fey creatures, and not demonic in origin
18:28.21Bagginswwalthough some have been corrupted
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18:32.48Zealffs.. useless wiki info..
18:39.24Tuqui-tuquiwhat s pat?
18:39.31Tuqui-tuquiwhat's a pat...
18:41.29MatthewSor 'pather'
18:41.30Tuqui-tuquidid not know that
18:42.30Bagginswwalright all varients should be complete
18:42.58BagginswwAs for the "Ice Troll" section its not saying Sandfury trolls or Zandalar trolls are "ice trolls"
18:43.09Bagginswwjust how to convert ice trolls into those types of trolls
18:48.40ZealBagginsww, could you link to the supplement article from that article please. :p
18:49.07Zealsupplement, web enchancement, rip off. whatever you want to call it ;)
18:49.18Bagginswwsorry, was too busy working with contents :p
18:49.26Zeallol, np at all
18:49.28Zealit's nice
18:49.44BagginswwTar beasts, are an elemental conglomerate btw
18:49.48Bagginswwof earth and water
18:57.26Zealnice to have some better evidence of the different elementals getting along.
18:57.50Zealsick of people assuming each elemental fights the other and they're pure evil because they served th old gods..
19:04.56Bagginswwwell, doesn't meant they get along actually
19:05.06Bagginswwits more of an "evolutionary" path
19:05.17Bagginswwand I exaggerate the meaning of evolution :p
19:05.35Bagginswwbut they are adapations to existing in unique environments
19:06.47BagginswwTBH according to the book take for example lava elementals they don't really get along with fire elments nor earth elementals, except for the few under ragnaros
19:07.03Bagginswwearth elementals themselves would never get along with either
19:12.22Zealbut Bagginsww, that's seemingly just factions (even the lore seems to make gross sterotyping)
19:12.55Bagginswwwell take ice elementals for example
19:13.04Bagginswwthey have their own world in the elemental plane
19:13.23Bagginswwwhich neither touches air, or water domains entirely
19:14.08Zealworld of land?
19:17.31BagginswwLava elementals apparently have a portion of area int he elemental planes between deephome, and firelands
19:17.39Tuqui-tuquito the World of Land
19:17.51Tuqui-tuquisounds like a cool expansion pack
19:18.06ZealWelcome, to the Woooorld of Tomorrow!
19:27.25*** join/#wowwiki Arthur_ (
19:31.21BagginswwAlright got the supplment, now we can laugh at its editing job as I copy and past material from it ;)
19:33.14BagginswwOh I love the bit on the cat;
19:33.24BagginswwCats prefer to sneak up on their prey.
19:33.31Bagginswwlike I didn't know that already heh heh
19:34.00BagginswwCrocodiles are aggressive predators 11 to 12 feet long.
19:34.00BagginswwThey lie mostly submerged in rivers or marshes, with
19:34.01Bagginswwonly their eyes and nostrils showing, waiting for prey to
19:34.01Bagginswwcome within reach.
19:34.07Zealtelling you tha lost a line of lore..
19:35.40BagginswwIt will be fun though to copy and paste these sentences to Wowwiki heh heh
19:36.07Zealsorry for slow down :p
19:36.22Zealjust had to add 30 new currencies to {{cost}} lol.
19:37.00BagginswwThese birds of prey inhabit nearly every terrain and
19:37.00Bagginswwclimate, though they all prefer high, secluded nesting
19:37.00BagginswwA typical eagle is about 3 feet long and has a wingspan
19:37.01Bagginswwof about 7 feet.
19:37.37BagginswwLawl, descrip for "frenzies"
19:37.39BagginswwFrenzies are voracious, toothy fish.
19:38.00BagginswwGiraffes are graceful herbivores with long necks. They
19:38.01Bagginswweat the leaves from the tops of trees.
19:38.36Zealno way i'm buying this
19:38.45Zealeven doubting buying the monster guide..
19:39.03Tuqui-tuquiyay monster guide!
19:39.05Bagginswwya I warn you not to, if there is anything you want to know just ask me
19:39.08Tuqui-tuquiboo bad descriptions
19:39.10BagginswwThe statistics presented here describe a male African
19:39.10Bagginswwlion, which is 5 to 8 feet long and weighs 330 to 550
19:39.44BagginswwMonitor lizards can be aggressive, using their powerful
19:39.44Bagginswwjaws to tear at prey or enemies.
19:39.46Zealit sounds more like "RL: The RPG
19:40.00BagginswwI'd say, Discovery Channel: The RPG
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19:40.25BagginswwMammoths are shaggy beasts that resemble elephants.
19:40.25BagginswwThey live in Northrend and are capable of dealing
19:40.25Bagginswwfrightening damage. In addition to their long tusks, a
19:40.25Bagginswwhorny protrusion of bone juts from their foreheads, and
19:40.25Bagginswwanother protrudes from their backs.
19:40.41Bagginswwok that's at least a bit more interesting since it actually adds to something we knew very little about
19:40.58Bagginswwfrom a obscure creep in TFT
19:41.47Zeali throw my doubts on that, but sure.
19:41.59BagginswwThe rhinoceros is infamous for its bad temper and
19:42.00Bagginswwwillingness to charge intruders.
19:42.00BagginswwThe statistics presented here are based on the African
19:42.00Bagginswwblack rhino, which is 6 to 14 feet long, 3 to 6 feet high
19:42.00Bagginswwat the shoulder, and weighs up to 6,000 pounds.
19:42.37BagginswwWell ya zeal they could have been more wordy and added even more details rather than just describing what htey look like
19:43.01Bagginswwand how they "fight" :p
19:43.09Bagginswwbut at least they bothered to say they are from Northrend LOL
19:43.54BagginswwSheep are docile herbivores. Both black and white varieties
19:43.54Bagginswwexist, and they are prized for their wool. Some mages are
19:43.54Bagginswwinfamous for polymorphing their opponents into sheep.
19:44.11BagginswwSheep flee rather than attack. Rumors of them
19:44.11Bagginswwexploding spontaneously are unsubstantiated.
19:44.30Tuqui-tuquiroflsaurus rex
19:44.39Tuqui-tuquiwhere are you getting this stuff from?
19:45.02BagginswwMonster Guide supplement
19:45.07Zealit jsut seems the proccess for the monsters was this.. "1) find RL version as basis or steal from an existing RPG 2) insert random mentions of Warcraft so it looks like we adapted it 3) make sure remove all RL or other RPG refrences (oh shit, we forgot this step :O )"
19:45.16Zeal*sure to
19:45.52Bagginswwya I know
19:46.00Bagginswwthe mammoth btw, was in TFT though
19:46.39Zealaye i know
19:46.58Zealbut i'm fairly sure that was not the basis for that entry :P
19:47.36Bagginswwwell they got the horn coming out of the middle of its head right
19:47.42Bagginswwand the fact they are from northrend
19:47.54Bagginswwplus the Icetusk mammothn was one of the varietns in TFT
19:48.34Zeali know
19:48.48Zealboth things that can be (and have been) added in what equates to barely a sentence.
19:49.18BagginswwI'm thinking I'd better post this info under another account LOL, so that WW doesn't come after me for stealing their guide LOL
19:49.35Bagginswwyep, and that's basically what you get in most entries in mosnter guide LOL
19:49.50BagginswwThis one is for Kirk;
19:50.19BagginswwThese little mammals are aggressive predators
19:50.19Bagginswwbut usually confine themselves to smaller prey. They include ferrets and similar mustelids.
19:51.47Tuqui-tuquior Richard Gear
19:54.25BagginswwBut ya zeal some of these things were things either mentioned in appendix 3, or in core rule book LOL
19:54.48Bagginswwyou might remember in the core rule book it would say, "go to this source" to find out the stats for the creature.
19:55.09BagginswwThis is there way so people don't have to go out and buy the book they refrenced previously LOL
19:55.14Zealhaven't read it yet, only 3/4 through S&L
19:55.26Bagginswwbut knowing them they probalby would like people to buy both
19:55.36Bagginswwdo you like S&L?
19:55.44Zealyeah, pretty good.
19:55.55BagginswwCore rulebook isn't really a strong lore book, its more pure gaming
19:56.01Zealwould have been nice to have ti hard backed and coloured, but meh.
19:56.12BagginswwOh I agree.
19:56.23Bagginswwat least you can find some of the artwork in color if you go thte artists website
19:57.15Zeali liked the short stories and accompanying artwork, and the explanation for each entry was nicely done.
19:57.36Zealexplaining how certain skills work, how they come about, why they're used.
19:57.48Zealthats the sorta stuff i expect in terms of quality.
20:01.21BagginswwM&M has one or more short stories as I recall so its worth it for those.
20:01.29Bagginswwthe sequel didn't
20:01.55Bagginswwalthough the sequel has some neat lore for WoW weapons and items if you read between the lines of gameplay
20:02.20Bagginswwbut its not up to the quality of brann books, or S&L
20:02.35Zealwell S&L, the stores introduced new sections, which i liked, though a bit more relevence between the story and the section would have been prefered.
20:03.21Zealit's a good way to introduce the things in the the section, and help RPers build up a imagination of the sort of things they could play out using it's content.
20:04.26BagginswwOh I agree
20:04.56BagginswwPlus give us lore fans, something to enjoy between the stupid statistical information
20:05.22BagginswwI think its the reason why the brought back stories in the "Player's Guides" line
20:05.31Bagginswwthey should be in Dark Factions too
20:09.10Zeali tell you who they should get to write the flavour text for the entires. the guy who did CoH. he may not have the best writing style for story telling, but hes good at capturing the details and presenting facts in a clear way (which is the main reason why he isn't a good story writer, as he breaks flow or jumps around too much)
20:11.12Bagginswwgood idea
20:22.06Zealgod.. i cba to reply
20:22.11ZealDeeper i a fucking fool
20:23.05Bagginswwalright updated
20:25.01BagginswwTime to update "housecat", with the one sentence discription heh heh.
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21:44.44Bagginswwadded info up to housecat now
21:53.59bleetahCairenn: you'll love this.. the guifications devel mail list just got a request to implement..... popup notifications :/
21:54.33bleetah(for the uninitiated, that'd be like suggesting to blizz the produce an MMORPG version of Warcraft)
21:55.58amrowhy don't they make a warcraft mmorpg? you know, one where the alliance actually fights the horde
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22:08.23Cairennbleetah: rofl
22:09.29TepetkhetGotta run.
22:11.10Zealwhen i type, do people assume i'm angry or having a go at them? sometimes i hate chat.. people always misinterpret and assume : /
22:14.18bleetah'net chat is heavily reliant on both the sender and recipient realising that a lot of tone and inflection that we receive either in a voice, or face to face communication, are missing. it's a very frequent 'issue'. in my experience, it's more often than not both side which are at fault (to various degrees)
22:14.18equiraptorThat's the bad part about it. :/
22:14.42equiraptorI don't know if it's really fair to say anyone is at fault.
22:15.13equiraptorMore like "The medium lacks subtlety," than "someone did something wrong."
22:15.38bleetahthat the medium lacks subtlety is obvious, thus both sender and recipient should take this into account
22:16.02equiraptorAnd yet it's not obvious to many.
22:16.12equiraptorIt's obvious to people like us who think about it.
22:16.17bleetahI'm not being specific to you zeal, just my feeling after being online for...more than 25 years
22:16.39bleetahas a wild generalisation, etc., and we all know wild generalisations should be avoided online ;)
22:16.50equiraptorAll generalizations are false!
22:17.11bleetahequiraptor: most people don't think. half the population have a below average IQ , etc. etc.
22:17.14amroincluding the generalisation of F= ma ?
22:17.31Zeali dunno, i know it, i don't take it into account, but i give people the benefit of the doubt all the time.
22:17.36equiraptoramro: "All generalizations are false" is a generalization. That's kinda the point. ;)
22:18.03equiraptorbleetah: Well, of course half the population has a belowe average IQ. :-P
22:18.07Zealso sure, i could misinterpret, but i won't asume they ment to sound angry, i'd probably ask them something after to guage.
22:19.11equiraptorI don't have enough work to do today.
22:19.18equiraptorI wanna just go driving around in my car.
22:19.26bleetahequiraptor: it's depressing when you realise the number of people in 'the other half' don't realise that fact ;)
22:19.36bleetahie, the above avg IQ folks
22:20.15equiraptorAnd another random thing - I was one question away from a perfect score on the math section of the SAT. :(
22:20.31Psyker7damn maths
22:20.32equiraptor(I'm not one of those people who thinks your IQ or your SAT score determines your worth, though)
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23:43.30Bagginswwzeal now the map in warcraft 3 roughly looks like the outside of hte black temple in WoW
23:43.51Bagginswwa so called "ziggurat" formation
23:44.15Zealmeans precious little, but add it to the speculation article if you want.
23:44.16Bagginswwif you haven't noticed that similiarty
23:44.39Zeali haveseen it, but i've sen plenty say it
23:44.51ZealBc that is.
23:45.08Zealunless you mean the icon on the map..
23:45.20Zealin which case i alugh and restate what i said :p
23:45.54Zeali'm rewritting the HFc page atm..
23:46.15Zealjust removed all the junk from BT, move all that stuff to BC (WC3)
23:46.24Zealfor lack of a better name
23:47.48Zeal" The [[Shattered Hand]] and [[Shadowmoon]] Clans manned the fortress after the Orc's crossing into Azeroth." i don't recall that?
23:48.03Zeal*throws too
23:48.32BagginswwI don't know about that
23:48.32Bagginswwnot something I added
23:50.12BagginswwThe black citadel ingame map, that you have to take over with the help of the draenei. basically has two sidees with a raod running up the middle from what I remember
23:50.38Bagginswwthere are ceries of walls with forces set up inside of the walls
23:50.51Bagginswwsimilar to the walls you see in BC around the black temple
23:51.04Bagginswwthen you have to fightyour way towards the center where a platform exists
23:51.10Bagginswwwhere magtheridan was located
23:51.50Bagginswwart style is different in BC, but TFT is closer to it, than "orcish" design seen in hellfire citadel
23:52.09BagginswwI'll see if I can get you some screenshots

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