irclog2html for #wowwiki on 20061228

00:00.40Patrigan-SyldraWho cares, as long as we can get thottwiki to run I'm happy
00:00.45Patrigan-Syldraon a side note
00:00.56Patrigan-Syldrathe thingy from the thingy int he thingy works with javascripts
00:01.04Patrigan-Syldrasry ^^ it's late ^^
00:01.41Patrigan-SyldraThe Realm Status page, from works with javascripts
00:01.45Patrigan-Syldraand I have not enough knowledge of javascripts >.>
00:01.51Patrigan-Syldra(I actually expected that XD)
00:02.30Patrigan-Syldraanyways logging gn!
00:04.36KirkburnBtw, edit up this page!
00:04.49KirkburnStop leaving, dammit
00:12.20[Zeal]done some tweaking.
00:14.31foxlitPerhaps __NOTOC__ is in order?
00:15.47foxlitit's is short for it is, you mean its several places
00:17.47[Zeal]didn't understand a word of that. i've moved the toc so it's an appropriate place for it's length to not effect content, only off-linking which after you've read, will be near the bottom, or the toc can be hidden for.
00:17.54[Zeal]*in an
00:19.32foxlitIs this the intended render: ?
00:24.48[Zeal]was dreading you pulling out an IE6 rendered page then :P
00:46.42[Zeal]do beta and ptr realms use only one battlegroup and does it ever share the same name as a live battlegroup? :s
00:49.38*** join/#wowwiki Kirkburn (
00:49.44*** mode/#wowwiki [+o Kirkburn] by ChanServ
00:57.08[Zeal]wb :p
01:03.08Kirkburnfoxlit, what name do you go by on the wiki again?
01:07.52*** join/#wowwiki iKo (
01:09.46iKoy helo thar
01:13.06KirkburnAh of course
01:13.13KirkburniKo, hello
01:13.28KirkburnWow, I just noticed -
01:13.32KirkburnI'm number 15 =)
01:13.38iKoHello there
01:14.48foxlitPosition of ThreatMeter on those lists is just plain sad.
01:15.12Kirkburneek, 9th
01:17.39iKoSo are any and all players of wow in here?
01:18.00KirkburnMost here are
01:18.26KirkburnSome people are just big fans of the books and the 'old' games
01:18.48iKoI just recently re-installed wow
01:19.08iKoAfter noticing the monumental failure of PSU to entertain me for more than a week and a half.
01:19.21Kirkburnnice :)
01:19.55iKoYeah, it'll be nice when I can start playing the thing again.
01:20.37iKoRight now I'm limited to just the books for entertainment.
01:21.05iKoThat, and reading Lore on wowwiki
01:23.22KirkburnThe books are cool :)
01:23.34KirkburnBought and read them all about a month ago
01:23.44iKoI only bought them these past few days
01:23.53iKoWhat I've read so far I've liked.
01:24.03iKoThough I'm rather confused as to how I'm supposed to read them
01:24.16KirkburnDay of the Dragon first
01:24.21KirkburnThen War of the Ancients
01:24.23iKoBut i'm going with Day of the Dragon > The War of the Ancients > Everything else
01:24.36[Zeal]thats what i did
01:24.37KirkburnGlad we agree :P
01:24.59iKoI wish I'd been around to enjoy Warcraft III and II when they were in their prime.
01:25.15iKoI would've been a fan then, no doubt
01:25.17[Zeal]DotD>WotA>Last Guardisn>Lord of the Clans is how far i've gotten atm.
01:26.29iKoThough I got back into Warcraft at a good time, I think, with the release of the expansion
01:26.34KirkburnI still need Rise of the Horde
01:26.39iKoWhich I'm excited and skeptical of
01:26.48iKoexcited for.
01:27.03KirkburnI got the complication book, so I read DotD>LotC>LG>WotA>Cycle of Hatred
01:27.18Kirkburn(lol, complication)
01:27.22iKoThat's what I bought.
01:27.32iKoWhich, I really like the way that was put together
01:27.48KirkburnYeah, nice collection  - haven't read Metzen's bit yet
01:28.32KirkburnI'm off to bed now ... g'night, and hope to see you all on here when I return =)
01:28.38KirkburnOh and one last evil act:
01:28.43*** mode/#wowwiki [+o Cairenn] by Kirkburn
01:28.59[Zeal]yea,h i'm pissed off, i bought mine before the release of that
01:29.08[Zeal]no way i'm buying it just of metzen's book : /
01:29.11iKoI don't have the Sundering yet.
01:29.13KirkburnYou get all the cool colours :P
01:29.29iKoI like the compilation's cover
01:29.40[Zeal]rise of the horde i've ordered, but it probably wont be here until late jan : /
01:29.50[Zeal]was too late ordering
01:29.55KirkburnWhat's the publication date again?
01:30.01[Zeal]17th i think
01:30.09KirkburnOh, that early?
01:30.15iKoI fear for the 16th, Blood Elves will reign supreme
01:30.26[Zeal]i'm mainyl going off when ragestorm starting making edits based on it :P
01:30.33Kirkburn[Zeal], heh
01:31.06KirkburnRaunchy! (Kirkburn, is, of course, interpreting Cairenn's comments in the very British sense =)
01:31.32KirkburnSee ya'll 2moro, sleep well!
01:31.59[Zeal]nn Kirkburn
01:32.04Cairennnight Kirkburn, sweet dreams
01:32.48iKoSo is it sad that I've never been past level 20 on wow?
01:33.09[Zeal]lol, not really. took me over a year
01:33.32iKoI have trouble deciding what to play as
01:34.07[Zeal]i've played every class for atleast 10 levels between the time i hit 60 and open beta.
01:34.35[Zeal]help me decide my fav classes.
01:35.00iKoWell so far, the one that I've tried again and again, the one of the two I've made to 18 and up is Warlock
01:35.08iKoThe other being rogue.
01:36.12iKoI'd have to say Warlock would be my favorite, though before I went on vacation I ran a tauren druid to 10 and enjoyed every minute of it
01:36.35iKoWhat was your level 60?
01:36.50[Zeal]i didn't like warlock, was the second class i ever tried. got to lvl 12 and stopped. mage i sucked at, rogue was ok but not really enjoyable. druid was my first class, i enjoyed that, hunter i've always enjoyed. priest wasn't for me, paladin i enjoy. warrior wasn't for me either. shaman i didn't like.
01:37.07iKoHunter's popular.
01:37.23iKoI also have trouble deciding what server to play on.
01:37.37iKoSince my friends that used to play have quit and refuse to return to wow
01:38.22[Zeal]while hunter is my fav, it's the class i want to see changed and completely revamped the most (well except for the idea to completely remove warlock)
01:38.40[Zeal]aye, i had hell with friends and servers from day one..
01:39.06iKoPlus, the populace differs from server to server
01:39.12[Zeal]friend of a friend screwed me over, so i ended up on a diff server to all my friends, so i jsut went alliance against them, lol. main reason i took so long.
01:39.48iKoI don't want to play either RP, and I don't have reason to play PvE, so I've always sought out a PVP server
01:40.15iKoPvE servers, according to the wowcensus site, are usually chock full of alliance most of the time anyways.
01:40.29iKoand when I say alliance, I mean night elves and humans.
01:40.46[Zeal]i did eventually end up on a server with them, hit 60, ended up running a guild, one quit, others went inactive, i quit (for the 3rd time), inactives start playing casually and have their own guild, and i've started playing casually again.
01:41.12iKoWhat server do you play on?
01:41.14[Zeal]i favour PvE, i've played PvP or RP all my time.
01:41.22[Zeal]Lightning's Blade (EU)
01:41.45[Zeal]plan to switch to Darkspear (EU) once it's open to transfer.
01:42.10iKoThe two I've chosen are Ysondre and Maiev, both American?
01:42.27[Zeal]if you're american, then sure :p
01:42.29iKoMaiev, because it's new, which it seems may or may not be a good choice
01:43.13[Zeal]well i planned to move to PvE, but my friend's guild decided on what server without much research, i'm not too happy about it, but it's not a bad server.
01:43.40iKowell I'd only have trouble because of the lack of newcomers my level
01:44.17iKoWhich is why maiev appealed, and I've seperate both of them to have an Alliance PvP and a Horde PvP...
01:44.21[Zeal]i'm sure there will be cronic rerollers on there, no worries :p
01:44.34iKoWhich I've only really kept Alliance open for Draenei
01:45.00[Zeal]i hate how twinks have screwed over the economy for alts or new players. : /
01:45.20iKoI wouldn't know.
01:48.13iKoI'm only worried for the new races
01:48.18iKowell, not only
01:48.22[Zeal]how so?
01:48.46iKoblood elves will be like the horde's night elf
01:48.51iKoit'll be overrun
01:49.27iKoWhich is to be expected, but it still bothers me.
01:49.55iKoJust without doubt populated by some lovely people
01:50.22[Zeal]dunno, theres so much negativity surrounding the new races i'm not sure.
01:50.24iKoTHen again, I haven't personally known wow to attract some of the best people I've met on the net
01:50.57[Zeal]i plan to roll a belf pala after release
01:51.08iKoI plan on making a warlock
01:51.46iKoBlood elf, that is.
01:52.00[Zeal]theres the whole "let's make a no belves and palas guild" attitude going round with some guilds :/
01:52.39iKoI don't see a problem with them perosnally, though their racials seem a bit over powered
01:53.06iKoand their blood knights make a bit more sense than the draenei shamans, to me
01:53.27[Zeal]draenei probably need a bit mroe work really, racial and graphic wise
01:53.38iKoI like the visually, at least
01:53.43iKofrom what I saw on stage6 them.
01:54.49iKoI'd roll a warrior were I to play one.
01:54.51[Zeal]my main gripe is shoulder armor placement. too far down the shoulder, shoulders like priest's make it obvious when the cloth bits that drop down cover the arm, isntead of falling betweenthe arm and chest.
01:55.55iKoAt least they're a bit more inventive of a race in terms of looks, comapred to dwarves and gnomes
01:55.59iKoWhich are just modified humans
01:56.27[Zeal]lol true
01:56.40iKoKinda wish they were horde.
01:56.48iKobut that won't stop me from trying one.
01:57.37iKoThough the Draenei and Belfs both got a lot more attention when it came to females, it looks like
01:58.52[Zeal]well i love that they removed the obviously over sexual emotes for draenei females :p
01:59.03[Zeal]the gnome vibrator and sexodar ones, hehe.
01:59.12iKoGnome vibrator and sexodar?
02:00.21[Zeal]yuup. they had one that said "Do gnomes have a vibrate setting? I-I'm just curious" and the other "You've heard of the Exodar? Let me show you the Sexodar!"
02:00.31iKoLol, flirting?
02:00.48[Zeal]ones a flirt, the other is a joke, forgot which
02:01.08iKoWas there a beta for the the BC?
02:01.18[Zeal]there still is :P
02:01.46iKoHow did I joined beta
02:01.58[Zeal]did or do? :P
02:02.12iKowell were it possible I would LOVE to try out the burning crusade
02:02.35[Zeal]some fansites still have beta key comptetions running i think
02:02.43[Zeal]i won mine from
02:02.52iKoI could've tried it all along!
02:02.57[Zeal]yuup, lol
02:03.02iKoSo you beta'd it?
02:03.09iKoor still are?
02:03.14[Zeal]i'm in beta, yes.
02:03.27[Zeal]though i haven't been playing much wow lately, beta or otherwise.
02:03.42iKoI wish I'd known about that.
02:03.57iKo20 days from release
02:04.36[Zeal]we have to wait longer here >_<
02:04.45[Zeal]19th i beleive
02:05.06[Zeal]i've had my CE version on pre-order for a while now though.
02:05.23iKoI would've adored trying out my own blood elf or draenei even if I knew it was going to be deleted
02:05.59[Zeal]aye, i've got a 23 belf pala and 20 draenei hunter :P
02:06.56iKoThat's higher than what I've done
02:06.59iKoin wow
02:07.04iKoJust for a beta.
02:07.25[Zeal]well i was going along, trying to soak up all the lore as i went
02:08.00iKoI can't beta even if I wanted to.
02:08.07iKoMy account was active before October
02:08.24iKoThough I've had the thing since.. january 05
02:08.28iKoI think
02:08.52iKoer, wasn't active
02:09.39iKoSo you've actually had the them both in game, I've only seen through a video
02:11.26[Zeal]yeah, heh.
02:11.33iKoYou prefer belf?
02:12.15[Zeal]depends greatly on what aspect of the races you're talking about :P
02:12.37iKoThen give me your thoughts on what aspects you would divide both the races into?
02:13.09iKoIf you wouldn't mind comparing and contrasting
02:13.40[Zeal]er.. lore, quests, areas, appearance, racials
02:14.13iKoIgnore quests, I would like to know your thoughts on the rest?
02:15.29[Zeal]lore, atm, both have their ups and downs. quests, belf. areas, belf. appearance.. draenei, barely, both need improvement on animations and soem graphical issues. racials.. depends on class really, but goes to belf as draenei need some ui fixing.
02:21.17iKoI wonder @ a wowwiki guild
02:22.58[Zeal]unlikely due the vast amount of realms users span :P
02:23.45iKobut even then
02:23.51iKoit'd be interesting
02:24.03iKowiki vote on what should be the official Wowwiki server
02:24.14iKobut that'd be too much dedication
02:24.15iKoJust a thought
02:24.22iKoIt'd be an interesting guild to see running around
02:24.38*** join/#wowwiki Hobinheim (
02:24.52Hobinheimpaging an admin
02:26.49[Zeal]probably need an alarm clock to page them :P
02:28.44Hobinheimehh just some policy busting, i'm good
02:28.47iKoAre most of the.. community
02:28.52Hobinheimwhat's up, bucket man
02:29.16Hobinheimi'm not sure, iko
02:29.47iKoJust wondering
02:30.05iKomaybe that can be answered later
02:30.31[Zeal]dunno the numbers, but there is certainly more people talking on eu time :P
02:30.41ilkwhat time is it?
02:30.51ilkIf you are EUROPAN yourself
02:30.52[Zeal]2:30am here in the uk.
02:31.49Hobinheimeast coast jersey, baby 9:30 PM
02:31.57Hobinheimamerica, america, america!
02:32.02ilkATM, new mexico, 730
02:32.15ilkUSUALLY, aka, 99.6 % of the year, CST in TN
02:32.35ilkwhich would be 830
02:32.38ilkIf the care arose
02:37.31[Zeal]i hate how, especially on sites, lists are always GMT +/-<hours> and then calculate DST seperately.. GMT = UTC+DST already :/ and list GMT is not fair for timezones that don't use DST. : /
02:37.31Hobinheiminfobot, dance
02:37.43infobotACTION <("<)  <('_')>   (>")> Dance Kirby Dance!
02:37.43Hobinheimdammit infobot
02:37.46Hobinheiminfobot, drink
02:37.57[Zeal]*listing GMT
02:38.10[Zeal]infobot, lag
02:38.12infoboti heard lag is very bad here :(
02:38.16ilk#wow fails
02:38.24ilk#wowwiki has more than #wow
02:38.52Hobinheimwhat is wow?
02:39.07Hobinheiminfobot, dictionary
02:39.08infobotEnglish-Russian and Russian-English dictionary. URL:
02:39.15Hobinheimwhere can i find a dictionary of infobot's commands
02:39.18Hobinheiminfobot, naked
02:39.20infobotLets play hide and go seek
02:39.23[Zeal]why is this chan on this irc network? surprised it's not on quakenet or even wowirc
02:39.54[Zeal]infobot, help
02:39.56Hobinheimi don't know anything about irc
02:41.08[Zeal]Hobinheim, just do "infobot, help" pm's you his instructions and stuff.
02:41.40[Zeal]hm.. lets test this..
02:41.43[Zeal]wow is shit
02:42.04[Zeal]infobot, what is wow?
02:42.07infobotI think you lost me on that one, [Zeal]
02:42.14[Zeal]fail : /
02:42.21[Zeal]infobot, wow
02:42.23infobothmm... wow is the best game ever!
02:42.36ilkinfobot, sleep
02:42.37infobotit has been said that sleep is overrated, and a poor substitute for caffeine.
02:42.41Hobinheiminfobot, help
02:42.45ilkinfobot, die
02:42.46infobotACTION takes two shots to the head and crumples to the ground, lifeless.
02:42.58ilkinfobot, live
02:42.59infobotACTION rises from the dead and starts eating people.
02:43.00[Zeal]think onyl the owners can do sleep
02:43.01Hobinheimno infobot, no!!!
02:43.10ilkinfobot, cry
02:43.11infobotACTION cries and sobs until he nearly drowns in his own tears
02:43.19ilkinfobot, kill Hobinheim
02:43.20infobotACTION shoots a super-inverse pseudomeson gun at Hobinheim
02:43.30Hobinheimwho owns infobot?
02:43.32ilkinfobot, kill yourself
02:43.33infobotACTION shoots a hyper-charged anti-photon gun at yourself
02:43.33Hobinheiminfobot, owner
02:43.34infobotTimRiker is my owner
02:43.46ilkinfobot, eat Hobinheim
02:43.47infobotACTION eats Hobinheim and falls over dead
02:43.52ilkinfobot, off
02:43.53infobotsomebody said off was the opposite of on
02:44.02ilkinfobot, sex
02:44.03infobotupdatedb; locate; talk; date; cd; strip; look; touch; finger; unzip; uptime; gawk; head; apt-get install condom; mount; fsck; gasp; more; yes; yes; yes; more; umount; apt-get remove --purge condom; make clean; sleep, or super extractor,
02:44.20Hobinheiminfobot, unzip
02:44.21infobotUnpacks .zip files such as those made by pkzip under DOS. URL:, or an zip decompression utility that guys like asterboy need cause they run lfs and don't have it by default, so go here to get it
02:44.21ilkinfobot, finger
02:44.24infoboti heard finger is a insecure service that lets people find valid accounts to crack.  SUPPOSED TO DO THAT, remove it immediatly
02:44.46ilkinfobot, apt-get remove --purge condom
02:45.02ilkinfobot, install condom
02:45.10ilkinfobot, apt-get install condom
02:45.26ilkinfobot fsck
02:45.27infobotNo devices specified to be checked!
03:07.30ilkI'll definitely be back
03:19.12[Zeal]so far i've done an item, server and battlegroup in the new format i'm porposing :)
03:20.08[Zeal]hm.. next up, an npc i think
03:36.16Hobinheimpaging tekkub
03:39.38*** join/#wowwiki Adys (
03:40.42Hobinheimcan an add-on switch inventory w/o a hardware event
03:40.52Hobinheimlike... in the middle of combat?
03:40.59Adysswitch inventory?
03:41.05Hobinheimswap items
03:41.23AdysNot without player reaction, I think
03:41.26Hobinheimi'm trying to find add-ons that do this now in wow 2.0 so i can just copy the code
03:46.12Tekkubyou can move items yes just not use them
03:46.21Tekkubbut you can only equip weapons in combat
03:47.08Hobinheimso trinkets can't be swapped?
03:47.22Hobinheimi'm not even talking about trinkets now i'm just curious
03:47.32Hobinheimwhat i'm really after is managing the ranged slot, which i guess is a weapon
03:48.09Tekkubno, trinkets are armor, armor can't be swapped in combat
03:48.26Hobinheimoo you're right
03:48.29Hobinheimi'm trying right now
03:48.32Hobinheimbut i can switch my wands
03:48.50Tekkubit's been that way for a long time
03:50.21Hobinheimdid you hear what i wanted from before?
03:50.31Hobinheimto queue up different warlock stones automatically based on cooldown?
03:50.41Hobinheimspellstone else firestone; fail wand
03:50.56Hobinheimhow feasible is that now that warlock stones are considered ranged/wands?
03:51.00Hobinheim"relics" actually
03:53.20Hobinheimugh i wish i had the answer somewhere
03:53.23Hobinheimi'm too lazy to code up a test
03:59.30[Zeal]oh, you returned Adys :P
04:00.52[Zeal]Adys, ;)
04:03.22Adysthat's just sick
04:03.41Adysand waaay too heavy :P
04:04.25AdysI like the princip
04:05.58[Zeal]too heavy?
04:06.09AdysYeah it's not really readable
04:06.36[Zeal]is to me.
04:06.54AdysWhen I search for an item on the wiki I'm looking for a specific kind of informations
04:07.04[Zeal]which would be?
04:07.08AdysIf I was looking for accurate stats etc i'd search on allakhazam
04:07.24Adysbut I'm looking for lore behind it, various infos and real drops
04:07.59AdysWhat you're taking up is about a whole page on 1024x768 and half a page on 1280x1024 to describe the stats
04:08.50[Zeal]well i'm fine with stats going, but apparently many don't agree with you. i'd put it up to vote tbh.
04:09.35AdysVery honestly, I like the tooltip we have right now, I don't like the way its handled but graphically it's perfect imo
04:09.39Hobinheimhey anyone know what ... does in lua?
04:09.48Adysyou mean .. hob?
04:10.08[Zeal]it's it like glue for strings
04:10.13[Zeal]combining them
04:10.26Hobinheimno, three
04:10.29Tekkub... are args
04:10.39Hobinheimin real code though? not documentation?
04:10.44Hobinheimframe:SetScript("OnEvent", function(self, event, ...) omaTrinketryOnEvent(event, ...); end);
04:10.57Hobinheimis it just passing on the set of args from one function to another?
04:10.57Tekkubyes, added in 5.1 because the old args sucked
04:11.12Hobinheimlike shell(...) actual(...) ?
04:11.26Hobinheimor shell(wasted, ...) actual(...) where actual gets the same call as shell, minus wasted?
04:11.39Tekkubyes, if you passed (1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6) the func would receive (2, 3, 4, 5, 6)
04:12.02Hobinheimso just a really quick alias to all the args...
04:12.14Tekkubbefore you had to do actual(unpack(args)) which made a table and wasted memory
04:12.15Hobinheimeven though this author is just throwing them away (func actual(onething) {} )
04:12.23Hobinheimright right...
04:12.37Adyssee ya
04:13.04[Zeal]but yeah, i'm generally in agreement with you adys. but if stats stay, i'm completely against the tooltip. it's not easiyl udnerstandable by non-wow players, and it doesn't allow for obvious linking of wow terms used in the stats. it either goes, or it gets wikified imo.
04:13.19TekkubAdys, I'm working on a template to make tooltips and quest pages and such from WDB-parsed data
04:13.36[Zeal]^ and that i don't see the point in : /
04:13.47AdysWhat would non wow players do in wowwiki, particularly in item pages?:p
04:13.48TekkubI vote that tooltips should look exactly how they do in game :P
04:13.58Tekkubwikified shit can go in the item page
04:14.08Tekkuband all the details like price
04:14.12[Zeal]i vote, very strongly, against that tekkub. this is a wiki, not a game.
04:14.24Tekkubit is a wiki... for a game...
04:14.27AdysNo need to fight :P
04:14.50AdysWe want something that is easy to read
04:14.53[Zeal]and as yourself adys, they would be looking for information about the item. by using tooltips, you're preventing thme from learning, which is the purpose of the wiki.
04:15.03Tekkubthe thing people want when they look up info on an item are 1) the item's stats in an easy to read format and 2) extra info not provided in game
04:15.11Tekkubthe tooltip everyone enderstands
04:15.14Hobinheimi second tekkub's movement
04:15.23[Zeal]the tooltip only wow players understand ;)
04:15.29AdysYes, and? :P
04:15.35Tekkubyes but... be honest
04:15.46Hobinheiman in-universe wiki largely about a game that caters to... game players?
04:15.54Tekkubnon wow plears are going to understand what +25 agility means?
04:15.55[Zeal]i am being honest, it's completely in conflict of what a wiki is for.
04:16.06Tekkubit's useless data to the non-wower
04:16.13Hobinheimand if we consider the fractional percentage of people willing to go out of their way to look it up on the internet... are more likely to be competent players...
04:16.17AdysWhat tekkub said
04:16.18[Zeal]yes, if agility is linked to an article about what agility is.
04:16.32Tekkubwhy would a non wower be even looking at an item page and seeing something they understand?
04:16.52[Zeal]thne they learn.
04:16.52Tekkub*need to understand
04:16.52Adysthere is data for non wow players in the wiki
04:16.52Adysplenty of it
04:16.54Adysbut they have nothing to do in item pages if they dont know what an item is
04:17.01Tekkubyea Adys, but we're talking item pages here...
04:17.04[Zeal]but you're excluding people from learning information the wiki is supposed to be providing.
04:17.22Tekkubthere's a few items like Sword of a thousand truths that warrent extra info
04:17.26[Zeal]it's essentially elitist.
04:17.27Tekkuband a nice detailed page
04:17.35Tekkubbut what about [Large Bear Bone]
04:17.36Hobinheimmy addon is so ghetto. on event, echo event
04:17.39[Zeal]many items warrent alot of info.
04:17.45Adys ?
04:17.54Tekkubit's not elitist....
04:17.56AdysCategories: Gameplay | Newbies
04:18.01Tekkubgo up to someone at work
04:18.14Tekkubthrow a Tier 4 item in front of em...
04:18.27TekkubI but they go "yea.. so?"
04:18.36Tekkub"what's this crap" :)
04:18.43[Zeal]yeah nad i'll get a question soemthing like "whatdoes agility do? does it make you run faster?"
04:19.10Tekkuband you point at the page that was just pointed out
04:19.16[Zeal]"what's this crap" exactly my point :P
04:19.32TekkubYes, we're a wiki.. no, we are not wikipedia
04:19.41[Zeal]yes you're not providing the links to answer those questions when you use a tooltip.
04:19.42Tekkubwe have a very specific audience here
04:19.58AdysWhat tekkub said, again
04:20.20Hobinheimyeah we're catering to an already-elite audience
04:20.22Tekkubwe don't have to make the wiki super easy for every person that might stumble into it
04:20.26Hobinheimit's not good to babysit everyone all the time
04:20.31[Zeal]and as kirkburn has said before, its a warcraft wiki with a wow focus.
04:20.38Tekkubnew players come to the wiki for info, yes
04:20.39[Zeal]not a wow wiki.
04:20.50Tekkuband they should find it easily...
04:20.51Hobinheimi see what you're saying
04:21.13Hobinheimi've always thought of it as a wow wiki with warcraft as a secondary concern
04:21.18Hobinheimi mean, that's the state we're in now
04:21.29Tekkubbut tooltips are little infoboxes, they don't need links all over the place for every new player that doesn't know what a stat does...
04:21.31Adysyeah more like that tbh
04:22.02Tekkubtooltips/infoboxes should be a nice summary of the pertinant info on the item/page
04:22.12AdysOk Zeal another example
04:22.16Adyslook up that page:
04:22.27[Zeal]well i disagree, very much so. being elitist is never a good thing, and if a wiki isn't going to help people of all levels learn, then i don't see the point in it.
04:22.39AdysSomeone who sees the quest C'Thun's Legacy
04:22.48AdysWhat does he do if he doesnt know what Reputation is?
04:22.51Hobinheimi disagree. being... "elitist" is catering to a targeted audience
04:23.02Hobinheimyou reach more people by not aiming for the lowest
04:23.16Tekkubdoes the quest box need links to "what is experionce"?
04:23.55[Zeal]he would have to manually search adys. what i'm saying is he should be able to jsut click reputation and learn what it is, then he can coem back and understand what that value means to him.
04:23.57Tekkubokey, here's my view, and I don't think it's elitist.....
04:24.09Tekkubwiki users are being given a flood of data
04:24.18Tekkubthey come to the wiki for this mass amount of data
04:24.29Tekkubthey need to be able to find their own answers
04:24.42Tekkubthey don't need their hand held through the whole site
04:24.58Tekkubpages should be obvious and easy to find if you need
04:25.01[Zeal]hobinheim, thing is, in this case, reaching for only a few levels of experience is only laziness and bad planning, you don't loose anything by doing it except users and reputation.
04:25.10Tekkubbut they don't need to be shoved in their face everywhere they go
04:25.27Tekkubif you make a reference to [[Thrall]], the first one should be a link
04:25.40Tekkubevery other time in that page you refer to him, you don't need to relink it
04:25.51[Zeal]shoved in the face? you don't think thats what a tooltip does? "here take this, i don't care if you know what it is or does, just take it"
04:26.04Adysit helps having a clear page
04:26.17TekkubI think if every single tooltip linked every single line in it, yes, that's shoving too much info at the user
04:26.21[Zeal]Tekkub, thats just sensiable and already in the policies :P
04:26.30[Zeal]onyl linking the first instance of a term.
04:26.35Hobinheimzomg i can't take this discussion...
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04:26.53Tekkubthe basic underlying game mechanics don't need to be linked from every damn item page :P
04:27.03*** mode/#wowwiki [+o Adys] by ChanServ
04:27.03[Zeal]yes, they do.
04:27.12*** mode/#wowwiki [+o infobot] by ChanServ
04:27.22[Zeal]and not evne atthe expense of time considering it would be doen via a template.
04:27.25Tekkubthere's a front page with big links for a reason
04:27.39[Zeal]yeah, that lead off to no where.
04:28.12[Zeal]can't rely on contributers to create a logical heirarchy of pages in the wiki, that's already clear, and fails even on wikipedia.
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04:29.28[Zeal]anyways, as adys said, if he wants stats, he goes to other websites, not the wiki.
04:29.49AdysYes zeal thats why I want stats in a small table..
04:29.55Adysnot taking up half a page
04:30.00Tekkubso what you're saying is that trying to provide data that's available on other sites is a big waste of time?
04:30.10Tekkubthanks, that makes me feel great
04:30.55[Zeal]no, i'm saying trying to display in the same method as the game (and other sites), not wikifying it for users, is a waste of time.
04:31.04AdysWhat I meant is we want anyways a page thats easy to read with informations where you expect them to be
04:31.51[Zeal]yeah, imo my page managed that.
04:32.21AdysWhat an item page should look like ..
04:32.52AdysIs taking up maximum a page and half on a 1024 comp (most used reso)
04:33.06AdysLook up that page
04:33.53Adysits totally unreadable
04:34.04AdysThe item page should be separated from all the tips to do the quest etc etc
04:34.06[Zeal]hell even if you removed the stats, as i listed, easier jsut to use an image of the tooltip than parsing databases to get information and prensenting it with the same effectiveness as an image.
04:34.24Adysbecause you cant really update it
04:34.33[Zeal]the hell you can't
04:34.40[Zeal]two second job to update it.
04:34.46AdysIf a stat is changed you need to go back in game and screen it again
04:34.51Adysand upload it again
04:34.56Adysand thats assuming you got the item
04:35.35[Zeal]and if a stat changes in a database, you have to upload the data/uploade the database file and parse it again just to produce results for a few items, and yet display it with the same effectiveness as an image.
04:36.33Adys{{tooltip|Agi=15|Spi=10|Int=5|Lvl=60|ilvl=65|txt=The Blood of Drakkisath Flows Within...}}
04:36.36Adyseasy to update
04:37.03[Zeal]go to image page>upload>done.
04:37.28AdysUploading log?
04:37.47AdysWhich page:p
04:37.50TekkubWDB data can be parsed and mass updates applied a million times easier than getting new clean screenshots
04:38.06[Zeal]all images are linked, so that's simple.
04:38.18Tekkubif users can zip and submit their WDB folder easy they will
04:38.34AdysOk zeal the point is..
04:38.39Tekkuba lot more would do that to contribute than sit around making screen shots of every item they've seen...
04:38.48AdysWhat we're trying to do rigth now is make a very solid item database on the wiki
04:39.03[Zeal]thats not true Tekkub. larger database, takes longer. and the point was displaying as a tooltip has next to no advantage over displaying as an image.
04:39.38AdysTo make it solid we need to provide at least what Thottbot/Allakhazam is providing, in more accurate, without errors, editable and with more infos
04:39.44Tekkubzeal... I'm in my itemcache.wdb right now...
04:39.51Tekkubthere's 3661 items in here
04:40.02Tekkubdo YOU want to get those screenies for me?
04:40.23Tekkubleave a bot running overnigtht and all that data could be on the wiki
04:40.30[Zeal]if you want to make an item database from parsing the WDBs fine, but do not display is as a tooltip is what i'm saying.
04:40.39Tekkub.... ask people to submit screenies and see how long it takes to get that
04:40.45Adys.. why not?
04:41.00[Zeal]argh.. already exaplined why not 3 times.
04:41.10Adysit doesnt make sense
04:41.45Adysyou dont need to precise "This item has a chance on every hit with a proc that has been estimated to 5% to send a shadow bolt doing 50-75 dmgs"
04:41.50AdysChance on Hit: Sends ..
04:42.17[Zeal]who in the what?
04:42.42AdysOn your page, you're describing every single information about the statistics
04:42.46AdysWe dont need that
04:43.00AdysIn the worst case, its colspan=2 | +15 [[Agility]]
04:43.09Adys(which Im still against tbh)
04:43.19[Zeal]you do it in a table, you could simplfy my list even. but not a tooltip.
04:43.31AdysAnd why not ><
04:43.32[Zeal]*could do
04:43.54Tekkubthe tooltip is a table!
04:44.05[Zeal]the existing tooltip is a misused of a table, it's not a table.
04:44.26[Zeal]the existing tooltip tempalte should be using a div.
04:45.17AdysNevermind zeal :)
04:45.26[Zeal]terms need to be linked, otherwise, in terms of display, it's as effective as an image.
04:45.39AdysYes but easier to update
04:45.55AdysWe don't want more than what an image provides
04:46.04AdysExcept that we want to be able to easily update it
04:46.07[Zeal]for a wiki, you should.
04:46.30Adysand trust us on that, text is more easily updated than a screenshot
04:47.03[Zeal]not easier, quicker and more likely.
04:47.17AdysYes, easier
04:47.23[Zeal]no :p
04:47.54Tekkubquick == easy
04:48.04AdysIn short yes :P
04:48.10[Zeal]anyways, even if you maintain on using tooltips, i will get round to chaning it to a div.
04:48.30[Zeal]quick != easy ;) short matters, lol.
04:49.28[Zeal]well once i get done with this npc, i shall do a nice item table and replace that list.
04:50.43[Zeal]fairly sure it will end up crap though due to multiples of certain stats.
04:52.06AdysIm off for breakfast, its almost 6am here
05:08.28[Zeal]or BW and AW i guess
05:11.53Adys|AFK lol
05:11.54[Zeal]considering it's bare accuratly Before (First) War(craft), Anno (First) War(craft)
05:12.17[Zeal]*more accuratly. - bare wtf? :S
05:12.58Adys|AFKAnyways, afk again
05:13.04[Zeal]lol ragestorm jumped on it quick
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05:13.42Hobinheimis it safe
05:23.29[Zeal]lol Hobinheim, it died off :P
05:38.45Hobinheimpaging programmers
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06:26.48[Zeal]do we have large race icons? :S (not the large ones listed, as they are medium, if not small themselves)
06:27.06AdysLarge as in 64x64?
06:28.11Adysmm dont think we have that on the wiki, but can find them yeah
06:28.29[Zeal]for now i'll jsut use a head icon :P
06:28.44AdysTemp.png ftw
06:29.56[Zeal]gunna be using that for <no icon specified> :P
06:30.09[Zeal]for NPCs that is
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06:33.00Apollozeusthat's too cluttered
06:33.05Apollozeusmore templates than necessary IMO
06:33.15AdysI'm not gonna say anything =P
06:33.29[Zeal]not mroe than needed
06:33.33[Zeal]and please, do :P
06:33.39AdysNo I wont :P
06:33.41Apollozeusyes, noone is going to be bothered to use that template
06:33.48Apollozeus:/ too much workl
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06:33.59[Zeal]there is next to no work..
06:34.17[Zeal]its cut&paste job and the templates cut down on a huge amount of code.
06:35.21Apollozeusbut still, too many tables
06:35.24Apollozeusthey are not needed
06:35.30Apollozeus...and they stretch the page
06:35.33[Zeal]the isn't a single table on that page ;)
06:35.45Apollozeuswhatever those boxes are then
06:35.56[Zeal]and the template is deisgned to do that at lower resolutions. blame the wiki's lack of a min-width.
06:36.24[Zeal]beleive i've been setting it to 70em or 60em.
06:36.28AdysFound the race files
06:41.32[Zeal]nice :)
06:41.32Apollozeusrofl @ female blood elf
06:41.32AdysIts the one from BC alpha btw, dont pay attention to the blood elf one =P
06:41.32[Zeal]yeah.. wtf
06:41.32Adyswasnt done yet lol
06:41.32Adysblizzard official files :)
06:41.32Apollozeuslol, where are humans
06:41.32Apollozeusand draenei
06:41.32Adysit was a test file from blizz i guess
06:41.32ApollozeusI see
06:41.33Adysgonna find you the official one, gimme a few mins
06:41.33Apollozeusblizzard has got some sense of humor though
06:41.33Apollozeusthe blood elf female one... hilarious XD
06:41.33AdysSpeak of sense of humor
06:41.33TekkubBE's are so fucking gay, I hate them
06:41.33Apollozeusno, they're "feminine" according to blizz
06:43.44Tekkubyea blizz won't say it.. .but I will
06:44.07Tekkub... girlfriend
06:44.07[Zeal]anyways, if there opposition to the page's styling it's always changable. it's mroe the structure i'm proposing.
06:53.22AdysHere you go Zeal
06:53.36AdysShould do the trick
06:54.10[Zeal]you're implying i should cut thme up and upload? :P
06:54.20AdysEnjoy =P
06:54.41[Zeal]considering you merged thme into one, wouldn't it be easier for you to do so rather than me having to split them up again? ;)
06:54.41AdysIm not risking myself into the icon sh!t anymore :P
06:54.48AdysI didn't merge them
06:55.03Adysblizzard splits blps into parts
06:55.24[Zeal]i see, they're used as textures instead of icons..
06:55.29Adysthats also why you can see only one plain blp file for a bigger model
06:55.59[Zeal]bah, wasn planning on going to bed shortly :P
06:56.05[Zeal]have to do it tomorrow.
06:56.08[Zeal]but ty
06:56.26Adys8am now here \o
06:56.31Adys\o/ even, bah
06:56.51[Zeal]almost 7am, heh.
06:57.14Apollozeus8 am
06:57.19Apollozeuswhere are you located?
06:57.30Adysfrance here
06:57.37Apollozeus<-- netherlands
06:57.37AdysApollo =P
06:57.43Adysif the icon doesnt exist in png, use the jpg
06:57.46Apollozeusjust finished doing my paper round D:
06:57.50Apollozeusjpgs are fugly
06:57.57Adysyeah but Im converting em :)
06:58.12AdysSo gotta go through them one by one etc
06:58.43[Zeal]tbh, artwork, screenshots etc. those should be jpegs. all icons need to be pngs.
06:58.58Adysyes its what we're doing atm
06:59.05[Zeal]gd gd :p
07:00.25Apollozeuswhat is going to happen to the {{BC}} template after january 16?
07:00.29Apollozeusare we removing it?
07:01.49[Zeal]yes, but becaise of the template namespace, all pages will jsut change to {{bc}} automatically ;)
07:02.06[Zeal]i think..
07:02.22[Zeal]actually i don't think
07:03.55[Zeal] odd border :S
07:04.11Adysblizzard isnt regular with their borders
07:08.26AdysThottbot \o/
07:08.32AdysEquip: Improves your chance to get a critical strike by 1%.
07:08.44AdysSpell 7597 : Increased Critical 14
07:08.44AdysIncreases your critical strike rating by 14.
07:08.44AdysUse: Set
07:11.49AdysIts messed up ><
07:15.12[Zeal]do script events work on the wiki? eg. onMouseOver="some script" ? i'm guessing they don't : /
07:23.21[Zeal]well think i've gunna call it a night.
07:23.23[Zeal]nn all
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12:36.42Patrigan-SyldraKirkburn you here?
12:36.44Patrigan-Syldraor anyone else
12:37.12Patrigan-SyldraFandyllic said to make a voting change to the policy
12:37.36Patrigan-Syldrawhich is what I want to do, but it's my first time, and I can't get through the article about it ^^
12:37.42Patrigan-Syldraso a little assistance would be cool ^^
12:38.51Adysthats what you're searching?
12:39.15Patrigan-Syldrahey, that's another page XD
12:39.34Patrigan-Syldragonna read that one
12:40.27Patrigan-SyldraGah >.> that wasn't much help XD
12:40.56Patrigan-SyldraFor Policy votes see: >.> which happens to be the page that I read...
12:45.04Patrigan-SyldraK... Let's take it step by step
12:47.48Patrigan-SyldraFor making a change to Should I do it in the Talk part, or Shall I make a seperate page for it? something like:
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12:52.07KirkburnThat should explain it
12:52.36KirkburnI'd say do it on the talk part of
12:54.49Patrigan-Syldrabut that's already overflowed with stuff...
12:55.00Patrigan-Syldrajust add it down there somewhere?
12:55.09Patrigan-Syldraor on top?
13:02.08KirkburnAs if you were making a new discussion
13:03.00Patrigan-Syldrawho actually create the word dismbiguation? ><
13:03.08Patrigan-Syldradisambiguation* ><
13:03.51Tekkubthe same guy that coin instanciation
13:04.04TekkubI'd just have called it a clearification page
13:12.34Apollozeusthat's quite unlike a beautification
13:12.48Apollozeussod it, I'm taking a vacation
13:13.17Apollozeuscause vacation is THE time for relaxation
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13:34.33Patrigan-SyldraEgg bacons and Spam:
13:35.59Patrigan-Syldrathe faster it is approved the better
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14:07.44KirkburnHaha, Alamo returns!
14:08.02Adyshaha awesome
14:08.14Kirkburn :D
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15:07.20Patrigan ... (also selling Eggs, bacon and spamm)
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15:52.34Patriganseems like we don't follow that rule anymore...
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16:10.37KirkburnHey, who gave infobot op status!?
16:10.44KirkburnPatrigan, made a comment on the vote
16:11.31Hobinheiminfobot, destroy
16:19.11KirkburnScary :P
16:22.26Patriganinfobot Sit!
16:22.32infobotACTION sits
16:22.33Patrigangood boy
16:22.47Patriganthat was scary >.>
16:23.01Patriganhe actually did what I told him to..
16:28.44PatriganKirkburn your remark was completely justified and I quickly altered it, it actually did sound better...
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17:06.18KirkburnCool, Patrigan
17:06.38Adystyping slowly!
17:06.40KirkburnUm, at the top of the article, though
17:06.56KirkburnAll disambigs are at the top of articles :)
17:07.02KirkburnI went out, okay!? :P
17:07.15AdysThats... not an excuse
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17:46.05[Zeal]lo all
17:46.34Hobinheimhel was too much i guess
17:49.36KirkburnI do love a good wiki discussion, y'know
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17:52.53[Zeal]Arcance Grammar for?
17:53.06[Zeal]Patrigan, commented on your proposal ;)
18:00.56Hobinheimpaging a vegetarian
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18:41.33KirkburnI am interested in thoughts on the 'mission statement': WoWWiki:About
18:54.57Kirkburn[Zeal], you probably notice by now I was the major proponent of the race names thing, so I am very unlikely to be swayed. I can't imagine others being swayed either, but if you wish to have further discussion of it on the vote page, go ahead :) Always good to discuss stuff!
18:56.01[Zeal]i did guess, and that fact that you won't be swayed doesn't surprise me, not bothered. :p
19:04.03KirkburnCan I be annoying though and mention not to use h1 (=Blah=) titles :P
19:04.15Hobinheimthat should be policy
19:04.25Hobinheimi wanted to write a bot that would keep clicking random and constnatly demote headings
19:04.31Hobinheimor at least tell me where pages still have them
19:04.38Hobinheimand what's this about race/
19:04.56KirkburnHobinheim, yeah, it should be policy
19:06.11Hobinheimumm yeah lowercase
19:08.01[Zeal]indeed, sorry, i need to replace that header with some styling is all. left it as h1 until i do.
19:08.36[Zeal]switched my user page to use the new format i want :)
19:12.15KirkburnArgh, I hate 3 digit colour codes >:)
19:14.04KirkburnDinner, bbl
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19:14.40[Zeal]lol why Kirkburn|afk? :p
19:14.45[Zeal]wb Patrigan-Syldra
19:14.57Adysbwl pug here
19:15.01Adysthis is awesome
19:15.36Adysrazorgore down first try
19:15.37Patrigan-Syldraon SH we do AQ40 PUGs
19:15.49AdysI wanna see vael tho
19:16.08Adysdouuubt we wont wipe tbh :P
19:16.16Patrigan-SyldraEverything to us is a lesser realm except for Magtheridon (Magtheridon is the best server in the world, as you might know)
19:16.28AdysI remember the thread
19:16.31Adyswhere they posted the movie
19:17.14Patrigan-Syldrathat thread was gold ^^
19:17.20Patrigan-Syldrapeople actually bought it ^^
19:17.52Patrigan-Syldrawe should make a wiki page about magtheridon, take interviews of randoms about being on a lesser realm
19:22.49[Zeal]i'd be interested to hear Kirkburn's take on that tooltip discussion :P
19:25.51Patrigan-SyldraI found that tooltip interesting
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19:30.39Adyslol zeal
19:31.42Patrigan-SyldraSay, guys...
19:31.52Patrigan-SyldraI'm currently doing this contest to decide a server logo
19:32.01Patrigan-Syldrais it allowed to upload all proposals to the wiki server?
19:35.10Patrigan-Syldra[Zeal] I commented your comment
19:41.14[Zeal]noticed. i still think a constant should be user, and server only if needed. plus, i'm already intending to propose the change to server names to use (<regioncode>) so you'd end up with either (<server>(<regioncode>)) or (<server>)(<regioncode>) anyways.
19:41.43Patrigan-Syldrawell that's alrdy existing in a sense that it's currently:
19:41.56Patrigan-SyldraShattered_Hand_Europe or Doomhammer_US
19:42.11Patrigan-Syldra(though Europe could have been EU)
19:42.12[Zeal]<server> <region/regioncode> is how it is atm.. which is retarded.
19:42.49Patrigan-SyldraYou want all to be EU or US right?
19:42.56[Zeal]appending to the tile without clearly showing disambiguation is stupid imo.
19:42.57Patrigan-Syldraand Not Europe and America?
19:43.15[Zeal]CN, KR too.
19:43.23Patrigan-Syldra(CN and KR are? >.>)
19:43.28[Zeal]china korea
19:43.31Patrigan-Syldraow ^^
19:43.41Patrigan-Syldraindeed that would be a good change
19:43.52Patrigan-Syldranot for a guildpage
19:44.21Patrigan-Syldrait'll be better if it is <guildname> <Servername> <RegionCode>
19:44.31Patrigan-Syldraor even better, in case of shortening
19:44.47Patrigan-Syldra<guildname> (<Servercode> <Regioncode>)
19:45.02[Zeal]it's why i'm suggesting, <guild> (<regioncode>)(<server>)(<state>) state being test/beta
19:45.14Patrigan-SyldraRandom Guild on Shattered Hand Europe would become
19:45.19[Zeal]only using them when needed.
19:45.26Patrigan-Syldranot only when needed
19:45.28Patrigan-Syldrabut ALWAYS
19:45.33[Zeal]thats stupid
19:45.37Patrigan-Syldrano it's not
19:45.44Patrigan-Syldranow we would create let's say
19:45.51Patrigan-SyldraRandom_Guild (EU)
19:45.56Patrigan-Syldralater on on another server
19:46.02Patrigan-SyldraRandom Guild would also start
19:46.03[Zeal]you can't have full disambiguation always
19:46.33Patrigan-Syldrathat means you would have to change the first Random_Guild (EU) to Random_Guild (EU)(Server1)
19:46.46Patrigan-Syldrain order to create Random_Guild (EU) (Server2)
19:46.47[Zeal]otherwise we would end up with soemthing stupid like Azeroth (Zone)(World)(WoW)(Blah...)
19:46.54[Zeal]on every single article
19:46.57Patrigan-Syldrayou don't have to overdo it
19:47.05Patrigan-Syldrajust for guilds
19:47.10Patrigan-Syldraadd region and server
19:47.30Patrigan-Syldraor you will have to move the first page each time the problem occurs
19:47.33[Zeal]no, disambiguation ruels should apply across all pages, there is no reason on any article types to ever change the rules.
19:47.37Patrigan-Syldraand that is just creating extra work
19:47.58Patrigan-Syldrawell then friggin change all pages
19:48.06Patrigan-Syldraotherwise things will ebcome 1 big pile of chaos
19:48.15foxlitShould really be Random_Guild (Server2 EU)
19:48.33Patrigan-Syldraand what will hapen to Random Guild on server1?
19:48.42Patrigan-Syldrajust stay Random_Guild (EU)?
19:48.51foxlitShouldn't be (EU) in the first place.
19:49.05Patrigan-Syldrathat's the whole point
19:49.07Patrigan-Syldrawhat it currently is
19:49.11Patrigan-Syldrais just making it a mess
19:49.33Patrigan-Syldrabecause imagine if blizzard decides to use Random_Guild for a new Orc Clan
19:49.40Patrigan-Syldrathen we would have to move the first guild as well
19:49.46Patrigan-Syldrabecause logically
19:49.52Patrigan-Syldralore has prio over guilds
19:49.56*** join/#wowwiki Kirkburn (
19:49.59Patrigan-Syldraso we're creating extra work
19:50.05foxlitLike 5 seconds of it.
19:50.15Patrigan-Syldra5 seconds which can be prevented
19:50.19[Zeal]no they don't, they becoem an organized and logcal disambiguation. if no other guild name exists, then jsut do Guild:<name> if soemone comes along, and they have a guild, then make the apporpraite disambiguation. Move Guild:<name> to Guild:<name> (<disambig1>) and make the new one at Guild:<name2> (<disambig1>). if you need to go furthe,r thne add (<disambig2>) and so on.
19:50.23Patrigan-Syldra5 seconds of moving that aren't needed in first place
19:50.44[Zeal]Patrigan-Syldra, this is why i'm proposing new namespaces
19:50.47Patrigan-Syldrabut then you're creating 1 big pile of chaos
19:50.50[Zeal]that will never happen
19:50.55Patrigan-Syldranamespaces are BAD
19:50.59[Zeal]no, they aren't
19:51.01Patrigan-Syldrabecause it fucks up categories
19:51.06[Zeal]no, it doesn;t
19:51.13[Zeal]i suggest you read my proposal
19:51.15Patrigan-Syldrayes it does, you can still order it the wxay you want
19:51.18*** mode/#wowwiki [+o Kirkburn] by ChanServ
19:51.19Patrigan-Syldrabut it looks like crap
19:51.28[Zeal]no, it doesn't
19:51.29Patrigan-Syldrajust go look at the server list
19:51.33Patrigan-Syldraeverywhere server:
19:51.39[Zeal]the server list is a pile of wank right now
19:51.47foxlit"This article is about The Argent Dawn faction. See also Argent Dawn (US RP server) and Argent Dawn (EU RP server)." I really don't see a problem.
19:52.02[Zeal]thats a psuedo namespace, and you can change the order. real namespaces don't suffer from that.
19:52.07foxlitYou could do the same for guilds, eventually moving off original content as it becomes superceeded.
19:52.39Patrigan-Syldrayou know how annoying things will become?
19:52.40foxlitAnd, honestly, convinience now > prospect of 5 seconds of work later.
19:52.51[Zeal]they won't be annoying at all
19:52.53Patrigan-Syldraimagine I have a completely dismabiged guild
19:52.57Patrigan-Syldrawith server too
19:53.00Patrigan-Syldrain your system
19:53.14Patrigan-SyldraBAH HATE THE WORD!
19:53.14foxlitgive up :)
19:53.20Patrigan-Syldrayou knwo
19:53.32Patrigan-Syldradissed up untill sever
19:53.35Patrigan-Syldraargh >.>
19:53.42Adyswhat hour is it :)
19:53.45[Zeal]completly, is relative Patrigan-Syldra, explain ;)
19:53.54Patrigan-Syldrayour system
19:54.03Patrigan-Syldramyguild (EU) (server1)
19:54.12Patrigan-Syldraand I want to go look at a friends guild
19:54.14Patrigan-Syldraso I go
19:54.16foxlit(EU) should be in server1, not the other way around :)
19:54.24Patrigan-Syldrafriendsguidl (EU) (Server2)
19:54.32Patrigan-Syldra(talking [Zeal] his system)
19:54.38Patrigan-Syldrait does not exist!
19:54.48Patrigan-Syldrabecause it can be also friendsguild (EU)
19:54.49[Zeal]no, you would do just friendsguild
19:54.54Patrigan-Syldraor hell even just friendsguild
19:54.57Patrigan-Syldrano I wouldn't
19:55.02Patrigan-SyldraI would use the system my page has
19:55.10Patrigan-Syldrabecaus ein normal minds, that's order...
19:55.32Patrigan-SyldraI won't go and try every single possibility
19:55.36[Zeal]disambiguation is never complete, always relative, so your stance on proposing that the server name is reliable isn't true.
19:55.44Patrigan-Syldrait is
19:55.53Patrigan-Syldrabecause there can't be 2 guilds on the same server with the same name
19:55.56Patrigan-Syldrawe've tried it
19:56.06[Zeal]well duh
19:56.07Patrigan-Syldradisambiguation is limited to the limits the game set upon us
19:56.20Patrigan-Syldraso using server and region should ALWAYS be enough
19:56.22[Zeal]but there can be more than two of the same server
19:56.32Patrigan-Syldratried it
19:56.35[Zeal]yes, ptr's, betas.
19:56.48Patrigan-Syldrawho would make a guildpage about ptrs and beta? >.>
19:57.04[Zeal]i would have done in the tbc beta if i got in earlier
19:57.11Patrigan-Syldraimo those should never exist
19:57.17Patrigan-Syldrabecause those need deletion afterwards
19:57.18Adysagree with patrigan
19:57.29Adysuseless guild articles like that would get deleted eventually
19:57.44Patrigan-SyldraPTRs never last longer than 3-4 weeks
19:57.53[Zeal]i don't see why they should never exist, especially i nthe case of betas or long running ptr's, as they tend to have consistant server names
19:58.19Patrigan-Syldrasec need to trace up what you say is true (concerning the server names)
19:58.23[Zeal]the ptr may not be up, but when it returns each time, server names are usually the same.
19:58.34Adysand imo, more generally all guild pages not about an important guild or not really well filled should be deleted end of the line.
19:58.58Adystheres many websites to promote your guild or anything
19:58.58Adys"Hi join our guild we got a tabard more infos at"
19:59.06Patrigan-SyldraDoommyst server from EU beta doesn't even exist on the wiki XD
19:59.07AdysGimme one min...
19:59.13[Zeal]if that was the case i would say remove player and guild articles completely.
19:59.28Adysplayer articles are fine if they are under User:../
19:59.35Adyssame for any article
19:59.41Patrigan-Syldrawhich reminds me btw
19:59.46[Zeal]yeah, i don't see why they should ever be under user
19:59.49Patrigan-Syldrathat isn't a set rule
20:00.14Patrigan-Syldrathe writing/player_pages does not say that you have to put it under user
20:01.25[Zeal]all i've seen is the poor implementation of player articles, which has sparked up a negative view of them.
20:01.25Patrigan-Syldra can anyone delete that btw >.>
20:01.25Patrigan-Syldrabad naming from my side
20:01.26AdysCompare these two to..
20:01.26AdysHonestly, wth
20:01.32Adysthe rule says 3 lines
20:01.40Adysbut very honestly Im going for a whole page tbh.
20:02.07Patrigan-Syldrawell on my screen they don't even reach 3 lines XD
20:02.14Patrigan-Syldraallow me to be very honest
20:02.19Patrigan-Syldrabut the BEST way to solve this
20:02.30Patrigan-Syldrais to put everything under a subdomain
20:02.51[Zeal]not at all
20:03.05Patrigan-SyldraKirkburn: OLD!
20:03.06AdysI dont agree either, its not needed
20:03.07KirkburnPatrigan-Syldra, Icon1.png deleted
20:03.25Patrigan-Syldrawell, it would solve all the naming problems
20:03.28[Zeal]it's what namespaces should be used for, and your onyl complaint is "they look silly in categories" which isn't even a real namespace.
20:03.38Patrigan-Syldranah, read my reasoning
20:03.39AdysYes I agree with Zeal here
20:04.03Patrigan-Syldrabut afaik
20:04.12Patrigan-SyldraServer: isn't a real namespace either
20:04.17KirkburnIndeed no
20:04.18[Zeal]no, it's not.
20:04.21Patrigan-Syldraeven though it' sone of the most important things...
20:04.32KirkburnThe only real ones are the default wiki ones
20:04.45Patrigan-Syldraso, do you honestly expect me that guild would become a real namespace? oO
20:04.48[Zeal]as i said, that simple costmetic issue is hardly of concern over the benefits it creates.
20:05.01KirkburnNo idea how this will come out, but here are the namespaces:
20:05.03Kirkburn(Main) Talk User User talk WoWWiki WoWWiki talk Image Image talk MediaWiki MediaWiki talk Template Template talk Help Help talk Category Category talk
20:05.19Kirkburnphew, no lines breaks
20:05.22Patrigan-Syldrait came out bad XD
20:05.41Patrigan-Syldrabut is it possible to add extra to those?
20:05.43[Zeal]its fine, just confusing with talk
20:05.58[Zeal]it is, if rustak was around.
20:06.10Patrigan-Syldrasend him a mail?
20:06.20KirkburnYou think we don't? ^^
20:06.22[Zeal]that's acheived a great deal so far ;)
20:06.32Patrigan-Syldrahis user page is one big lie :(
20:06.51Patrigan-Syldraand I quote:
20:07.01Patrigan-Syldra"I respond to every email sent!"
20:07.31*** join/#wowwiki Apollozeus (
20:07.38Adysheya apo
20:07.48Patrigan-Syldrahi Apollozeus
20:07.58Patrigan-Syldrathink he still plays his shaman on the burning legion server?
20:07.59Apollozeushey guys
20:08.12Patrigan-Syldraperhaps we should station a person there who constantly keeps /whoing rustak
20:08.19Apollozeuswowinsider makes fun of us
20:08.54Patrigan-Syldrasend a hatemail? oO
20:09.11Patrigan-SyldraI have never heard of that website before...
20:09.15Patrigan-Syldrawowinsider oO
20:09.21Apollozeusit's a pretty good blod
20:09.40Patrigan-Syldrablog? oO
20:09.46Patrigan-Syldrawho reads blogs in these days?
20:09.56Apollozeusa lot of people
20:09.58Patrigan-Syldraif I was to read every friggin blog on the internet concerning wow...
20:10.08Patrigan-Syldradarn my social life...
20:10.11Apollozeusjust see how many responses those posts get
20:10.30Patrigan-Syldra79 oO
20:10.32KirkburnApollozeus, I'm sad now :(
20:10.40Apollozeuswhat? D:
20:10.43KirkburnWoWInsider is v popular
20:10.47AdysOi, we are reliable
20:10.51KirkburnWe should get them to post about us
20:10.56AdysAnd Rustak responds to every email sent
20:11.00Patrigan-Syldramake a blog on it?
20:11.06Patrigan-Syldrahe does, oO
20:11.09KirkburnWe are as reliable as we make it :P
20:11.25Patrigan-SyldraWe are as reliable as People make it
20:11.25ApollozeusI doubt they would let us use them for advertisement purposes
20:11.27Kirkburn"we" as in everyone
20:11.36Apollozeusthey link to articles in wowwiki every so often
20:11.56Patrigan-Syldrapeople want datamined facts...
20:12.00Patrigan-Syldrathat's a harsh truth
20:12.12KirkburnArgh, that screenshot ... who still uses Titan!?
20:12.44Patrigan-SyldraI actually still have it installed... >.>
20:13.03Patrigan-Syldrayeah, have that too
20:13.23Kirkburnweirdo :P
20:13.23Patrigan-Syldrait's not because it's installed, that it's enabled XD
20:13.35Adysim not gonna comment:p
20:13.59Patrigan-SyldraI once created a new character and per accident enabled all my addons >.>
20:14.05Patrigan-Syldragod I couldn't see my character...
20:14.13Adysby accident eh
20:14.15Patrigan-Syldrashould clean it up one day actually oO
20:14.33Patrigan-Syldra<= dutch, live with it! (rather Belgian but meh...)
20:15.03Patrigan-Syldraso, what's the deal with rustak btw?
20:15.20KirkburnOne wonders, should I not be on a community team? :P
20:15.57AdysI dont get the community team thing, besides RC/NP patrol and bookkeepers:p
20:16.22Patrigan-SyldraCommunity team is good
20:16.22AdysIm in the cat team since ages and ive never been doing anything more specific than before
20:16.34Patrigan-Syldraif it is handled good
20:16.46Patrigan-Syldrabut, I honestly doubt the handling of some teams...
20:18.12Patrigan-SyldraI'm gonna quickly finish up the page regarding the choosing of the SH Logo (the wiki leans itself perfect to community like this)
20:19.57*** join/#wowwiki Kirkburn (
20:20.08*** mode/#wowwiki [+o Kirkburn] by ChanServ
20:20.11KirkburnI scream. Mmm.
20:20.17KirkburnLast msg: <Kirkburn> Adys, guess who made it?
20:20.53KirkburnTwas SilverSide, and it something I think we should really sort out (and cut down) at some point
20:21.17[Zeal]applied to bookeepers Kirkburn? :P
20:21.18AdysLast msg?
20:21.27KirkburnThat was the last thing I typed :P
20:21.48Kirkburn[Zeal], well, I've spent a long enough time pretending to be everything
20:21.58KirkburnSo I should at leats join *something*
20:22.14Patrigan-Syldracreate your own team?
20:22.34[Zeal]Kirkburnites :S
20:22.34Patrigan-Syldra"Pret Team"
20:22.39KirkburnPower Rangers: The Kirkburns!
20:22.39Patrigan-SyldraWe pretend to do everything!
20:23.01AdysIm gonna make my own team too
20:23.05Adys"Icon team"
20:23.33Patrigan-SyldraHey, I want a team aswell!
20:24.12Patrigan-Syldrais it a problem that a picture exceeds the recommended size?
20:24.46Adysunless its extremely big
20:24.46Adyspictures like 1500x2000 can screws up the wiki
20:24.46Patrigan-Syldranah, not THAT big XD
20:24.49[Zeal]thumb didly dumb
20:24.53Patrigan-Syldrameaning filesize
20:25.02Patrigan-Syldranah, it's not meant to be thumbed
20:25.06Patrigan-Syldranot at this point at least
20:25.12Patrigan-Syldrawe're deciding a logo for our server
20:25.24Patrigan-Syldraso that we can show it off everywhere as proud members of our communtiy
20:25.40[Zeal]ah, file size
20:25.42Apollozeus<@Adys> pictures like 1500x2000 can screws up the wiki <-- just put them in a thumb
20:26.03Apollozeusor adjust their size by |<number>px|
20:26.15Apollozeusit's not that big of a problem IMO
20:26.17Patrigan-Syldrayeah, but it was filesize I was referring to
20:26.26Apollozeuswell, as far as I know
20:26.29Patrigan-Syldrajust slightly though >.>
20:26.30Apollozeusthere's plenty of space
20:26.32[Zeal]or use template:img ;)
20:26.52Patrigan-Syldrain the end, we'll be fixing the chosen one to be perfect
20:26.55[Zeal]i hate the default thumb/caption/frame
20:26.56Patrigan-Syldraatm it's just proposals
20:27.38[Zeal]i dunno, if it's exceeding file size, compress or link ot externally.
20:28.01Apollozeus<gallery> needs fixing for the main skin
20:28.07Kirkburn1280x1024 is a good maximum
20:28.07Apollozeusit's still wikipedia-white
20:28.11Adyspreferences too
20:28.23[Zeal]prefrences need fixing for the main skin >_>
20:28.36Apollozeusis enable besides rustak capable of fixing that
20:28.49Adyshe's been warned about all the bugs
20:28.56KirkburnYou can set the wiki to show 10,000 x 10,000, but I think that's off by default and it won't show anything bigger than 1280x1024
20:29.01Adysand i believe mikk sent him a corrected css for most of it too
20:29.06KirkburnHe has
20:29.08Apollozeuswe should backup wowwiki's database and start all over again somewhere else
20:29.29Apollozeusif he doesn't show up for much longer we'll have to consider it
20:29.32[Zeal]well no one has replied to the points i've brought up on the styling page
20:29.44Patrigan-Syldralike I said
20:29.56Patrigan-Syldrasomeone go camp on Burning Legion Server to see if he arises
20:30.11Apollozeuswhat does he play
20:30.12[Zeal]ul indentation and and min-width.
20:31.00Patrigan-Syldraso I take it he's horde
20:32.18Apollozeushmm... let's see
20:32.21Apollozeus53 of them
20:32.58Patrigan-SyldraWho take sit upon him?
20:33.06Patrigan-SyldraAw crap... I need to go walk with my dogs...
20:34.46KirkburnUseful links, btw:
20:35.51Patrigan-Syldra(I bet he has a counter to see how many persons visit hisUser page or any of the pages beneath it >.>)
20:36.11Patrigan-Syldrawe need more people on the voting thingy
20:37.28Apollozeuselection time!
20:39.21Patrigan-SyldraDarn my server is stupid
20:40.00Patrigan-Syldrathey don't know the difference between a logo (a square thingy) and a banner (a long thing most of the time containing the logo nearly always on top of the page)
20:40.17Patrigan-Syldraafaik, it's only the swedes that lack the intellect of keeping both apart...
20:40.30Apollozeusdamn, damn swedes...
20:40.40Apollozeusmany a-group has fallen apart in the middle of the instance
20:40.58Apollozeusbecause of the swedish! D:
20:41.28KirkburnYay, nicer coloured vandals:
20:42.16Patrigan-Syldratrue dat Apollozeus
20:43.16Patrigan-SyldraBLOCKED Wowgold  contribs (if bot), moves  talk  Added gold site Fansites. 1 month for WoW TOS violation.
20:43.20Patrigan-Syldraonly 1 month? oO
20:43.44Patrigan-Syldrapermaban imo
20:43.49Patrigan-Syldrasame with Blizzard banning...
20:44.33Apollozeus <-- are those things really necessary?
20:45.15Patrigan-Syldrapeople expected me to do it yes >.>
20:45.15Patrigan-Syldraknowing people of myserver oO
20:46.13Apollozeushmm well
20:46.23ApollozeusI still intend on finalizing that
20:46.30Apollozeusperhaps those images could be contained in that template
20:47.21Patrigan-Syldra1 image must be chosen in the end
20:47.30foxlitWeren't we speedydeleting pages like that a while ago?
20:47.51Patrigan-Syldrawhy delete nexrosis?
20:48.00Patrigan-Syldrait's been my warlock addon since start
20:48.12Patrigan-SyldraI actually found it thanks to the wowwiki, now that I think of it...
20:48.15Apollozeusdoes it still work?
20:48.30Apollozeusi.e; has it been updated for patch 2.0.1?
20:48.35foxlitAs far as I remember, we aren't actually an addon database
20:48.59Apollozeussome addons are indeniably part of wow-culture, foxlit
20:49.25Patrigan-Syldrathat addon
20:49.32Patrigan-Syldrahas been used by other addon crafters
20:49.40Patrigan-Syldrabecause it just looks so cool
20:50.00Patrigan-Syldrathere came a priest version, a mage version, a hunter version, and some other versdion
20:50.02Patrigan-Syldradruids as well
20:50.08foxlitNotability is rather lacking; wiki page is poor, author website is better documentation.
20:50.17Patrigan-Syldrathat's a true fact
20:50.24Patrigan-Syldrais there a page linking to it?
20:50.26Apollozeusthere are NPC pages with nothing but {{Stub/NPC}} on it
20:50.31Apollozeuswe're not going to delete them either
20:50.34Patrigan-Syldra(there used to be a warlock addon page with a list of good addons)
20:50.36Apollozeusits quality is not an argument
20:50.50Apollozeusjust stick {{cleanup}} on it
20:50.53foxlit2 and 3 fail, 1 is perhaps suitable
20:51.44foxlitAs far as I can see, it's actually a feature description rather than a review.
20:52.35Apollozeusnowhere on the page it says that when it doesn't meet the goals it should be deleted
20:52.47Apollozeusthere's plenty of room for improvement - yes
20:52.52Patrigan-Syldraow the horror of poorly written policies
20:52.58Apollozeusbut to downright delete the article...? o.O
20:53.04foxlitIt's a guideline, not a policy.
20:53.29foxlitApollozeus: yes. It's happened with quite a lot of addon pages not too long ago.
20:53.51Patrigan-Syldracheck this one out for your rampage:
20:55.18foxlitThat's even more a candidate for deletion than necrosis.
20:55.22Apollozeusnominate for deletion
20:55.26Apollozeussee what the community thinks
20:55.32Apollozeusrather than just Patrigan-Syldra and me
20:57.07*** join/#wowwiki Patrigan-Syldra (
20:57.19Patrigan-SyldraHey, my oppinion is important
20:57.31Apollozeusyes, but this bickering is essentially pointless
20:57.44Apollozeusthe three of us cannot decide for the entire wiki
20:58.18foxlitI see {{deletemod}} in its past.
20:58.38foxlitCuriously, Mikk cancelled that one
20:58.49AdysKirk you thereN
21:00.53[Zeal]fixed my double redirects, heh.
21:01.24Adyswth ?
21:01.48Apollozeusfan fiction in gif
21:02.50Apollozeusdelete >_> delete >_>
21:04.47Patrigan-Syldrahey, why can't I decide for the whole wiki? XD would be kind of cool (sry short AFK, someone posted a link to a hawt Alize movie... For alizee I would even wait with dieing a few seconds...)
21:07.19Apollozeuswowwiki dictator
21:07.32Apollozeuskinda goes against anything wiki's stand for, but alright...
21:07.41Apollozeuswhat's wrong with this
21:07.53[Zeal]my policy, is democracy, but people shouldn't be forced to follow rules they don't agree with. thus those people, can leave and do it there way without people saying soemthing stupid like "they're just whining because they didn't get their wa, so the left".
21:08.13ApollozeusI'm trying to vote in foxlit's poll
21:08.15Apollozeus{{vote|Keep|~~~~|This appears to be a commonly used addon; [ it gets quite a few google hits]. Would be a shame if we let this potential go to waste.}}
21:08.22Apollozeusit comes out like this:
21:08.31Apollozeus1.  Keep {{{2}}} - ({{{3}}})
21:08.34Apollozeuswhat am I doing wrong?
21:09.03ApollozeusI need to take out the =?
21:09.26[Zeal]its basically saying vote, keep, sig, necrosis+%22world+of+warcraft%22 it gets quite a few google hits]. Would be a shame if we let this potential go to waste.
21:09.52foxlitJust {{vote|Keep|See comments}} and edit comments.
21:09.55[Zeal]indeed, need to replace the =
21:10.02[Zeal]or that
21:10.08ApollozeusI'll subst: the template
21:11.03foxlitIt's curious, it's only linked from in the main namespace
21:11.19Adys can I know why the f..
21:13.11Apollozeusturns out random people have found wowwiki and are using it like an image host
21:13.37[Zeal]well it's not easily, and heavily, watched.
21:14.20foxlitand [sic]
21:14.36Apollozeuswwe need to crack down on guild pages ;x
21:14.38[Zeal]basically, if you had something that checks to see if the iamge is linked, and after 5 days it gets auto deleted due to lack of use, would be handy.
21:14.53Adysnah zeal
21:14.56Apollozeusevery random guy and his mom creates these pages about their 6 man level 10 guilds
21:15.26Apollozeuszeal, who's going to program that?
21:15.31[Zeal]yeah, i'm talking about a script to handly that automatically :P
21:15.58[Zeal]anyone with two braincells worth of coding knowledge? :P
21:16.17ApollozeusD: I now some BASIC
21:16.23Apollozeusnot that that comes in handy
21:16.27[Zeal]well in this case, PHP
21:16.37Adysthese images bug out the wiki software
21:17.06[Zeal]that so needs to go..
21:17.13foxlitLikely make GD hit a memory limit during the resize
21:18.01Adysthey need to be replaced before we can do anything
21:18.12Adysif anyone can be arsed to upload two small images bearing the same name as these
21:18.14[Zeal]they're used?
21:18.17Adysand speedydelete it, it'd be nice
21:18.38AdysJust upload any random image bearing the name TQStabard01.jpg
21:18.44Adysand TQStabardv02.png
21:18.51[Zeal]who can actually delete? :S
21:19.10[Zeal]then why not just delete?
21:19.21Adysclick me
21:19.42Patrigan-Syldradoesn't work
21:19.50Adysyes because the image is too big
21:19.55[Zeal]yeah.. but does a delete url work?
21:20.08[Zeal]fair enough, thought it would :P
21:22.36Apollozeusbooty at the sea
21:22.47Adysit's a cool screenshot
21:23.10Apollozeusyeah.. where was it taken?
21:23.20Patrigan-Syldrauhm sec lemme see
21:23.24AdysId say westfall/elwynn
21:23.33Adyserr no sorry
21:23.50Adysthe area behind stormwind
21:23.50Patrigan-SyldraGah, stupid me >.>
21:23.51Apollozeusnot westfall either
21:23.55Adysbeetween sw and if
21:23.56Apollozeuswestfall has a beach
21:23.58Patrigan-Syldraleft side
21:24.05Adysyeah maybe sili
21:24.24Patrigan-SyldraSili but you can only get there from swimming from Feralas
21:24.35Patrigan-Syldraby swimming from*
21:24.38Apollozeuslol, waste of time
21:24.39*** join/#wowwiki Kirkburn (
21:24.42Patrigan-Syldranever is
21:24.47*** mode/#wowwiki [+o Kirkburn] by ChanServ
21:24.58AdysKirk <pokes>
21:25.39Adysgo empty me
21:25.50Adysim going through unused images
21:26.07ApollozeusVarghedin is a machine
21:26.13Apollozeushe uploads so many images in one day
21:27.05Apollozeusblizz stated they are working on another addon
21:27.10ApollozeusI wonder what they'd add this time
21:27.14Patrigan-Syldrabliiz on an addon? oO
21:27.27Patrigan-Syldraah expansion
21:27.32Patrigan-Syldrathat's actually rather OLD news
21:27.40ApollozeusI keep my fingers crossed for the emerald dream
21:27.42Patrigan-SyldraNorthrend won't be here before lvl 100
21:27.44AdysI think Northrend will be the third expansion
21:28.09Adyson an interesting point
21:28.18Adysif you look at the cosmic map there is a funny thing
21:28.25Adysthey added northrend, but..
21:28.30Adysthey didn't update quel thalas/azuremyst
21:28.31KirkburnAdys, lo
21:28.38Adyslo kirk
21:28.48ApollozeusI noticed that
21:28.50KirkburnBloomin' router jammed again :)
21:29.05foxlitSomebody stop them.
21:29.27foxlitHm, that's strange.
21:29.36Apollozeusthat just links to
21:29.51foxlitBut no redirect tag :/
21:30.00foxlitWonder what %3F is
21:30.07Adyscomma i think
21:30.14Adysnot sure at all
21:30.14Apollozeusthe ?
21:30.26Apollozeusthis should work
21:30.56foxlitAh, question mark
21:32.42KirkburnIndeed Apollo
21:32.59KirkburnFor odd addresses you need the index.php bit
21:33.45KirkburnDeleted it now
21:34.45[Zeal]someone link an item, preferably a weapon
21:34.58foxlit[Slavedriver Cane]
21:35.07foxlit[Slavedriver's Cane]
21:35.11[Zeal]meant wiki link but nvm :P
21:35.30[Zeal]not on the wiki? : /
21:35.50[Zeal]that works, ty
21:40.38[Zeal]why the hell are we even display item level..
21:41.04KirkburnBecause it's important info
21:41.08[Zeal]i'm unhappy with the chosen item, lol
21:41.35KirkburnItem level is the best way of determing the relative power of an item
21:42.09[Zeal]it's not important info. it's not displayed in the game, and the only benefit to showing it on sites is to sort by it (though the value is inaccurate anyways so not even helpful), which we can't do in the the wiki.
21:42.39[Zeal]its not the best way, possibly the worst way..
21:43.18Teomyrcould you have a look at and tell me what you think about the tooltips?
21:44.05[Zeal]they're tables, i hate them. ;)
21:44.15[Zeal]but nice graphically
21:44.27Teomyri know, i hate tables too ;)
21:44.48Teomyri tried to use img and position them using stylesheets, but... well
21:45.08Teomyrfirefox does it very nicely, IE doesn't
21:46.08[Zeal]odd.. i'm working on a div version of the tooltips right now, ie behaves fine ;)
21:46.31Teomyrmaybe you're using a different approach then :D
21:47.13[Zeal]i'm using a list inside a div.
21:47.24Teomyrmine doesn't render the right and left border
21:47.30Teomyrif i don't use tables
21:47.47Kirkburn[Zeal], just because you don't think it's important, doesn't make it so
21:47.51[Zeal]oh, granted i'm not using images for the borders, yet.
21:47.52KirkburnMany people use item level
21:47.57Teomyrbut i'll try it again, i hate tables anyway
21:48.14KirkburnWhy is it 'inaccurate'?
21:48.41KirkburnWow, I really want that icon now!
21:48.50[Zeal]because often if you d the calculations, you see it contradicts the item level.
21:49.01[Zeal]lol, yeah nice test bed teomyr
21:49.27Teomyrthanks ;)
21:49.28*** join/#wowwiki b1f30_w0rk (
21:49.32Apollozeusword from the canadian bacon guy
21:49.33Apollozeus" Moved comment
21:49.33ApollozeusHey there, not sure if im doing anything right. I added a page to describe my guild but then its not there so i added it again but its gone again. Would you be able to help me out? I didnt want to create mess.
21:49.33Apollozeuspete -- Nozzub "
21:49.57KirkburnIt's there now =)
21:50.08Adyslink him the correct version
21:51.40Kirkburn[[Canadian Bacon Eh]]
21:51.50KirkburnThe wiki doesn't like punctuation in titles
21:52.09Adyscry, why does it allow it then
21:52.13KirkburnI've made it that the one with the ? redirects to the normal one though
21:52.27KirkburnIt does allow it, but it's ... complicated
21:53.18KirkburnYou would have to use the code version of the symbols
21:53.34KirkburnBecause internet addresses don't allow them (normally)
21:54.52*** join/#wowwiki Kirkburn (
21:54.58*** mode/#wowwiki [+o Kirkburn] by ChanServ
21:55.06KirkburnOh router, why do you treat me so
21:55.17AdysOh router, oh router router blue..
21:55.35AdysBWL pug at flamegor atm
21:55.37Adysits going great
21:55.42Adys3 wipes on vael and thats all
21:56.15Adystho im really burnt out of raiding
21:56.29Adysi think ill host saturday's mc pug and that will be it till bc
21:56.52Teomyrbwl pug? nice
21:57.06Adys81 signups lol
21:58.46Adysi wonder if we will be able to do chromaggus
21:59.21Apollozeusyou can do several pugs :p
21:59.34KirkburnVarg, picture machine. At least he's spending his time IN WoW doing it :P
21:59.36Adyswe got a great raid setup
22:00.19Apollozeusthat's what I called him earlier this night
22:00.43Adyswe need to get him in here :)
22:00.56AdysFlamegor down btw
22:01.44Apollozeuslet's teach him the details of IRC
22:01.47[Zeal]are effect types actually underlined in tooltips? :S
22:02.01[Zeal]didn't think so..
22:02.04Adysnothing is
22:02.28Adys{{effect}} reproduces exactly whats ingame
22:05.14[Zeal]i see. msot people don't appear to be using that : /
22:05.25Adysthats very normal
22:05.29[Zeal]i ofc won't be because i'm not using a table.
22:05.42Adysits a new template, that requires a page to be created for the text to appear
22:06.12[Zeal]i see
22:06.14Teomyr[Zeal]: have a look at my test site again, i changed the tooltips
22:06.39Apollozeusbedtime guys
22:06.44Adysgn ap
22:06.45Teomyr[Zeal]: strangely enough, IE7 now renders them just fine. they still need a bit of tweaking (padding etc)
22:06.50Teomyrgood night
22:07.08[Zeal]kk, look in a sec
22:07.12AdysZeal: - there are multiple thousands of spells in wow, including about 4000-5000 used by items
22:07.18Adysso far, 141 have been uploaded
22:07.46[Zeal]erm.. ok? what's that got to do with what i was talking about? :s
22:07.57Adysim a slowtyper =)
22:08.00Adysfighting chrom atm
22:08.52[Zeal]nice Teomyr, though what happened to the last example?
22:09.32Teomyrthe picture extended beyond the frame
22:09.58Teomyrdon't know why, probably because of |left
22:10.29KirkburnYes, we need Varg, Ragestorm and Baggins on here!
22:11.34[Zeal] it's not in template form yet, but here we go, wikified too.
22:11.53[Zeal]one on the left is mine, on the right is the current one
22:14.01[Zeal]hopefully cromie will give Adys a break so he can point out what he doesn/doesn't like about it :P
22:14.17AdysI know I'm gonna be a whiner but I'm going to insist on using templates to explain the spells
22:14.24Adysand yeah Im a mage, I can be afk =P
22:14.53[Zeal]well i'm not sure i follow what you want to do tbh
22:15.15Adysuse the spell templates for the Equip/Set/Chance on Hit/ etc
22:15.36Adysits so much easier once we got most uploaded
22:15.51Teomyr[Zeal]: added the last example in back in, but i needed to specify the height :/
22:16.10[Zeal]what, so every different effect will receive an template to pull it's decription in?
22:16.26[Zeal]i'll take a look teomyr, one sec.
22:16.48AdysCheck how this page is formed:
22:16.53Adysthe tooltip
22:16.55[Zeal]ouch, it's screwed in ie7 >_o
22:17.12Teomyris it?
22:17.19Teomyroh yes, it is -_-
22:17.30Teomyrprobably need to specify the width as well
22:18.32[Zeal]Template:Spell:13388 ?
22:19.05[Zeal]hm.. i'll need to think that through, bu't i'm thinking it's not worth it.
22:19.20AdysIt really makes things much easier when changing something
22:19.27[Zeal]yeah i know that template.
22:20.18[Zeal]well i guess it fits in fine given that my proposal for Skill: was to include, abilities, spells, effects, all of it.
22:20.34AdysChrommie dead <3
22:20.50[Zeal]but i wouldn't have them in the template namespace
22:21.01Adysme neither
22:21.02[Zeal]as it's a transclusion rather than a template.
22:21.08AdysI know
22:21.12AdysI couldnt do otherwise
22:21.14[Zeal]kk then, i'm with ya :P
22:21.50Adysthe template: was autoadded when the template didnt exist
22:21.52[Zeal]but i'm not going to support it until the wdb parser is done.
22:22.02Adysdont worry about it
22:22.05[Zeal]if ever, lol
22:22.20[Zeal]opinion of the template then?
22:22.27[Zeal]er.. the tooltip
22:22.50[Zeal]i added in what was in your sandbox about the icon.
22:23.14AdysNefarian in pug :)
22:23.22Adystime to have a good laugh
22:24.46[Zeal]Teomyr, i dunno what impact it has due to the javascript, but you're never going to know the width and heights, you'r gunna need to float them. god i hate css lately.. fails at being helpful in most cases.
22:25.59Teomyri know, that's a problem :/
22:26.17[Zeal]i can't really acheive an image based border in the wiki due to the background-image being usless.
22:26.21Teomyryou can specify styles in the wiki markup, though
22:26.48[Zeal]i know, but getting those proposed and implemented is futile really ;)
22:27.27Teomyrie and firefox both have very different opinions about how padding and margins are to be interpreted
22:27.44Teomyrand seeing what opera is doing with my nice little tooltips is making me cry
22:28.36[Zeal]actually , think i was on a different page there, lol. i mean like in the wow skin css, .wow_tooltip { background-image: url(blahlblah); }
22:28.44[Zeal]what version of ie are you using? cos ie7 does it right now, no difference afaik :S
22:29.00[Zeal]well opera can blow me.
22:29.08[Zeal]as can ie6 and below.
22:29.14[Zeal]and safari.
22:29.32Teomyri'm using ie 7 and i barely managed to find values for padding that look almost the same
22:29.38Teomyras in ff
22:29.40[Zeal]odd :s
22:29.56Teomyrthat's the ie box model bug probably :/
22:30.15[Zeal]nope, that was removed in ie7
22:30.23Teomyrwas it?
22:30.27Teomyrwould be nice :D
22:30.29[Zeal]wait.. it might still be in quirks mode
22:31.03[Zeal]in which case, you're missing the dtd from your page, as the wiki is using xhtml 1 trans
22:31.52Teomyrxhtml? oh shit, sure as hell this won't validate :P
22:31.52[Zeal]my tooltip looks exactly the same between ie7 and ff, where as the old one, using tables, looks different (worse) in ff.
22:32.13Teomyrgood that browsers are forgiving
22:32.15[Zeal]i doubt much of the wiki validate ;)
22:32.27[Zeal]plus the fact ie7 doesn't evne know xhtml
22:32.53foxlit"know" in this context is odd :P
22:33.17[Zeal]jsut that the correct dtd is needed to put it into 'standards' mode, and not 'quirks' mode.
22:33.54foxlitActually, we're pretty good with passing XHTML validation
22:34.05[Zeal]surprising :p
22:34.06foxlitThere are some minor issues in the template, but things generally work
22:36.02[Zeal]though the software was already handling <br>--><br /> must be a hard coded one.
22:36.39foxlitMost of the errors are in the admin-customizable navigation menu.
22:38.16[Zeal]Teomyr, the padding looks the name between ff and ie7 for me, but i should point out i'm not using ff 2.0, but
22:40.04Teomyr2.0 here, that might be the issue
22:40.22Teomyranyways, i'll have to work that out ;)
22:40.34Teomyrspeaking of "not knowing xml"...
22:40.43Teomyrthat reminds me of an old cartoon:
22:40.56foxlitmm, hackles
22:44.23AdysBWL cleared =)
22:44.24Adysin a pug
22:44.46Adys3 wipes at vael
22:44.48Adysand thats all
22:50.40[Zeal]lol@ragestorm's reply to your application Kirkburn :P
22:51.08KirkburnYou're new, I'm an admin :P
22:51.21[Zeal]so i don't deserve a reply? lol
22:52.18KirkburnHahaha! There were some AWFUL spelling mistakes on
22:52.35Kirkburn- *"you'll faild to abuse me" + *"You fail to amuse me"
22:52.55Kirkburn- *"What trickly is this?" + *"What trickery is this?"
22:53.24Patrigan-SyldraI want to bet 100g that that is done by a Swe!
22:53.56[Zeal]were they corrected for spelling or corrected for accuracy? really shouldn't be correcting quotes, defeats the point of a quote.
22:57.24[Zeal]Teomyr, another thing i'd like to see on those tooltips btw, make a.. i dunno 60% ? opacity black background to tile.
22:59.24Teomyri think too much of the underlying text becomes visible at 60%, making the tooltip unreadable
22:59.25[Zeal]probably mean using something like 8 divs however.. but hey, thats 1 less table cell, and 1 less table :P
22:59.32[Zeal]80% then?
22:59.39Teomyri think it's 85% atm
23:00.11[Zeal]oh.. it is transparent.. hm
23:00.18[Zeal]well it needs to be mroe imo
23:01.35Patrigan-Syldragive tooltip example PLIX!
23:02.09KirkburnInteresting discussion:
23:02.10Teomyra code example?
23:02.53Teomyr[Zeal]: 70% is too much
23:03.07Teomyr[Zeal]: look at it
23:03.30[Zeal]hm.. i see took the easy root and applied the background to the whole div.. can see the background behind the borders sticking out. :p
23:03.30Patrigan-Syldrawhere does the quote come from >.>
23:03.33Patrigan-Syldratoo lazy to think ><
23:03.43KirkburnSeen the TBC cinematic?
23:03.48KirkburnThink to the end of it
23:03.52Patrigan-Syldrayes ofc
23:03.58KirkburnWhat is he holding
23:04.03Patrigan-Syldra"YOU ARE NOT PREPARED!"?
23:04.17Patrigan-Syldraisn't that the skull of guldan?
23:04.20[Zeal]though i don't think that looks horrible as it is, still readable, but correct, too much.
23:04.21KirkburnYes, it is
23:04.33Patrigan-Syldrathe thingy that he ninjad right in front of Maiev her eyes...
23:04.53[Zeal]did i miss that? the skull? :s
23:05.07Patrigan-Syldraif I was Maiev, I would've made a forum post saying Illidan ninjad my epic :(
23:05.19KirkburnWould be quite a twist :P
23:06.17[Zeal]yeah.. very unlikely its the skull of guldan..
23:06.22Patrigan-SyldraI gotta do that...
23:06.31Patrigan-Syldradidn't he eat the skull or something?
23:06.39Teomyr[Zeal]: - 75% atm
23:06.43[Zeal]consumed its power, yeah
23:06.57*** join/#wowwiki RickJames (
23:06.58[Zeal]80% it is then ;)
23:07.08[Zeal]bitch? :p
23:07.13Patrigan-Syldraso the skull is gone now?...
23:07.21Patrigan-Syldraso how can he still hold it oO
23:07.26Patrigan-Syldragah >.> lack of logic!
23:07.42KirkburnRickJames, hello
23:07.52RickJamesthis is a pretty cool website
23:07.56RickJamesi just found it for the first time
23:08.06KirkburnWell, nothing ever goes away in Warcraft, you should know that [Zeal], Patrigan-Syldra :P
23:08.07[Zeal]hes not Patrigan-Syldra, notice how he jsut discards it.. it's soem random useless skull.
23:08.18[Zeal]i know Kirkburn :p
23:08.25Patrigan-Syldragood point
23:08.42Patrigan-SyldraI'm alrdy a bit confused with the whole kill Kael'thas and Blood Elf plotline
23:08.46Patrigan-SyldraI mean...
23:08.46KirkburnIn any case, that wouldn't affect the idea
23:08.49Patrigan-Syldrathe Blood Elves
23:08.53KirkburnRickJames, glad to hear it :D
23:09.15Teomyr[Zeal]: 80% now. personally, i prefer 85%. i think what we had in the beginning was 90%
23:09.20[Zeal]well nobunaga @ wcradio covered that recently in the lore forums
23:09.22RickJamesi just heard that Peter jackson and Steven speilberg  have signed on to do a warcraft film in 2008!
23:09.25KirkburnEven if that skull is not the skull of Gul'dan, Gul'dan is quite possibly now a part of Illidan
23:09.38KirkburnFrom where??
23:09.47RickJamesAccess Hollywood
23:10.13RickJamesthats a national syndicated tv show in the US
23:10.17[Zeal]ok.. i must have seen a 90% version toemyr, cos 80% 85% looks a huge step
23:10.27Adysbedtime here, bwl is exhausting when you done it for months... gn all
23:10.33Kirkburn"In October 2006, Peter Jackson was confirmed to be the director"
23:10.40KirkburnWoah, how did I miss that!
23:10.56Teomyr[Zeal]: just uploaded 85%, check again
23:11.05RickJamesthis is all new news to me dude, i dont know they just talked about it on tv
23:11.09Patrigan-Syldraboth jackson AND Spielberg?
23:11.21RickJamesi didint even know there was going to be a warcraft movie
23:11.30Patrigan-Syldranah warcraft movie is old
23:11.30RickJamesyeah jackson and speilberg
23:11.38[Zeal]that's an oddly large step.. wtf :s
23:11.43Patrigan-Syldrahope they do it together ^^
23:11.50RickJamesthat would be nuts!
23:11.56RickJamesi havent seen speilberg fuck anything up yet
23:11.59Patrigan-SyldraI remember Metzen say: "Getting Jackson is just a dream"
23:12.04[Zeal]oh well jsut leave it at 85% i guess then, sorry for wasting your time :P
23:12.31Teomyr[Zeal]: xD
23:12.39RickJamesso since you guys know about this for so long, what is the story supposed to be based on?
23:12.49[Zeal]we don't know
23:12.50Patrigan-Syldranothing much is given out
23:12.51KirkburnNot announced yet
23:13.06Patrigan-SyldraBut I bet it will NOT feature gnomes!
23:13.12Patrigan-Syldraexcept for an occasional laugh
23:13.15[Zeal]all we really know is that it will be live action, much to everyone's disapointment i'm sure.
23:13.26RickJamesits on right now if anyone is in central time zones in the us
23:13.30Patrigan-Syldrawould've loved the movie to be like the cinematics
23:13.40RickJameson E!
23:13.46[Zeal]same Patrigan-Syldra
23:13.46Teomyrrender movie would be godlike
23:13.51Teomyrbut too expensive i think
23:14.02[Zeal]hardly :p
23:14.08[Zeal]live action is more costly
23:14.17Patrigan-Syldrabut then again
23:14.21[Zeal]plus blizz have the ability to do it in-house
23:14.22Patrigan-Syldraif Jackson is on it
23:14.37Patrigan-SyldraLoTR isn't bad...
23:14.41RickJamessot his is going to be a cgi film?
23:14.43Patrigan-Syldraif Spielberg is on it...
23:14.44RickJamesthat would be so gay
23:14.49Patrigan-Syldranah it won't
23:14.56Patrigan-Syldra(hell what is cgi? >.>)
23:15.03Patrigan-SyldraI only know cgi script XD
23:15.05RickJamesthey just said James Horner is going to do the score
23:15.07KirkburnComputer Generated
23:15.10Patrigan-Syldraah k
23:15.11[Zeal]computer generated image
23:15.15Patrigan-Syldrasame as CGI script :p
23:15.27KirkburnRickJames, this is incredible news if true
23:15.29RickJamesanyone watching this?
23:15.34Patrigan-Syldragonna look it up
23:15.38[Zeal]well i can't : /
23:15.42KirkburnCan't, EU :P
23:15.42Patrigan-Syldrathis looks as to be too hot
23:15.47RickJamesfuk i wish i would of recorded it
23:15.53Patrigan-Syldraname of the program?
23:15.59RickJamesAccess Hollywood
23:15.59Patrigan-Syldraand channel?
23:16.24[Zeal]i beleive i have e! on sky... dunno though
23:16.40Patrigan-Syldralooking things up
23:16.46Patrigan-Syldrahoping their website is fast with information
23:17.00RickJamesThey said that the cast is still in negotion but that many A list actors have expressed interest in roles
23:17.22RickJamesdamn that gives me goosebumps
23:17.33Patrigan-Syldraa cast similar to that of Lotr
23:17.33*** join/#wowwiki bleetah (n=bleeter@guifications/developer/bleeter)
23:17.42Patrigan-Syldraor just a movie similar to that of lotr
23:17.42RickJamesthis is going to kick so much ass
23:17.44Patrigan-Syldrahell atm...
23:17.45Teomyr"me want dress as orc! wuaaah"
23:17.50Patrigan-Syldrait would be kickass
23:17.57[Zeal]Access Hollywood is the name of the show? :s
23:18.23RickJamesdude peter jackson took fantasy to the next level and speilberg defenatly brings the best fx to movies
23:18.26RickJamesthats a lethal combination
23:18.35*** join/#wowwiki phreaky (
23:18.39Patrigan-Syldrapress release from the warcraft movie
23:19.14[Zeal]bah.. no access hollywood in the uk it seems : /
23:19.29KirkburnCairenn, this is a pacifist channel! :P
23:19.53Cairennhey, I poked him, I didn't beat him over the head with a chair :p
23:20.30CairennMikk ever show up to get the stuff automated?
23:20.42KirkburnNope, not been back yet
23:20.44Kirkburn~seen Mikk
23:21.12infobotmikk <> was last seen on IRC in channel #wowwiki, 5d 22h 42m 30s ago, saying: 'i mean.. it's just error handling'.
23:21.12RickJamesthats so rad!
23:21.16RickJamesdude i home brian singer dosent come onboard
23:21.22RickJameshe would so tank this movie
23:21.23*** join/#wowwiki MentalPower|AFK (
23:22.40RickJamesi wonder how come they havent put the jackson&speilberg are the directors on the site
23:22.55RickJamesor maybe its a movie leek?
23:23.00Patrigan-Syldranot on the legendary Pictures website
23:23.06Patrigan-Syldrabut will it be both together?
23:23.13Patrigan-Syldraor have they both showed interest to do it?
23:23.22Patrigan-Syldralike 1of 2
23:23.29Patrigan-Syldraimagine them both working together O_O
23:23.36Patrigan-Syldrasick O_O
23:23.42RickJamesno the show stated that Peter Jackson and Steven Speilberg have signed on to Direct and produce Warcraft
23:23.56RickJamesim not sure what that means
23:24.02RickJamesbut i asume they both are working together
23:24.15RickJamesbut yeah that is going to make a major event out of this picture
23:24.24KirkburnIt certainly would!
23:24.55KirkburnThis kind of stuff isn't announced until it's really set in stone
23:25.00[Zeal]produce too.. hmm
23:25.10RickJamesi think the fact that there is 7+million subscribers to wow have motivated them to put allot into this project lol
23:25.31[Zeal]i dunno, i remain skeptical
23:25.35Patrigan-Syldrano no
23:25.35RickJamesthis could def turn into a LOTR franchise
23:25.41Patrigan-Syldrait's nopt because of us 7 million
23:26.05Patrigan-Syldrait's because of those 6.5Miliard - 7million out there that they still want to attract
23:26.18RickJamesyeah! very true!
23:26.19Patrigan-Syldraif they can get these 2 together...
23:26.23Patrigan-Syldrathat would mean
23:26.26Patrigan-Syldrathey can like...
23:26.27RickJamesthis is such a way to market the hell out of the game lol
23:26.33Patrigan-Syldraget MILLIONS of people to go nsee it....
23:26.59RickJameswhat are they going to base the story on though?
23:27.11RickJameshave any of you read the novels?
23:27.12RickJamesi havent
23:27.59Patrigan-Syldraremember seeing that aswell
23:28.02[Zeal]well i'm confused on how any film set during or after wow can be made possible, especially for 2008.
23:28.03Patrigan-Syldrabut then again...
23:28.10[Zeal]so, i'm for it being an event in the past.
23:28.18Patrigan-Syldrathrall's live? oO
23:28.22Patrigan-Syldraor perhaps a story
23:28.33Patrigan-Syldrawhich will run together with those stories... b
23:28.50KirkburnThrall's life is certainly a good possibility
23:28.50[Zeal]perhaps one of the books or wc2-wc3
23:28.56KirkburnRickJames, I've read all the books
23:29.12RickJameskirkburn? really?
23:29.13bleetahwell, put it this way.. if they wanna make movies 2 & 3 and so forth, they've prolly learned by Lucas' mistake.. it's damned hard to start at the middle (or end)
23:29.15RickJamesare they worth the read?
23:29.22Patrigan-SyldraI expect it to be something like the story from some character like tyrande or something
23:29.22KirkburnThere's certainly some good stuff to base movies on
23:29.25[Zeal]rofl bleetah
23:29.26Patrigan-Syldraor perhaps Kael'thas
23:29.29Patrigan-Syldrawho knows...
23:29.32[Zeal]yes, they are RickJames.
23:29.40RickJamesdo they enhance the game ?
23:29.50KirkburnYes, certainly
23:29.55Patrigan-Syldrathere's one thing you forget
23:29.56[Zeal]Kirkburn, you've roth already? thought't you were still waiting to get it?
23:29.58RickJamesso what book should i buy first?
23:30.02Patrigan-SyldraStar Wars
23:30.04[Zeal]*read RotH
23:30.11KirkburnOkay, not aaaallll :P
23:30.11Patrigan-Syldrahad only 1 story line
23:30.14RickJamesstar wars? lol
23:30.16Patrigan-SyldraWarcraft has 1000000000000000
23:30.27Patrigan-Syldraand if they can't find anything
23:30.32KirkburnHah, true
23:30.34Patrigan-Syldrathey can still put something new in it
23:30.43Patrigan-SyldraI mean
23:30.48Patrigan-Syldrawhy not make a whole new storyline
23:30.50RickJamesso whats the name of the book?
23:30.56Patrigan-Syldraintertwined in the other...
23:31.05Kirkburn"he's my enemy!" ... no he's not, he just swapped, no damn, yes he is again. Nope, now he;s neutral.
23:31.18[Zeal]i would love to see WotA as a film, there's your triligoy right there :P
23:31.31[Zeal]or go right back Titans vs Old Gods ;)
23:31.31KirkburnWotA would be awesome
23:31.44KirkburnWotA has lots of familiar faces, importantly
23:32.14KirkburnAnd massive battles
23:32.20KirkburnJackson likey the battles
23:32.38[Zeal]indeed, lol
23:32.47Patrigan-Syldra concerning that. Back then it were indeed rumours. But things change they never said that Spielberg will never consider doing it
23:33.00[Zeal]and plenty of palces to focus on character relationships for spielberg
23:33.02MentalPower|AFKAt this writing, these projects are all actual, honest-to-goodness reality. There's no indication that Spielberg is developing "War of Worldcraft," "Angels and Demons" "Goonies II," "Jaws 5" or any other dream project that some fans spend days and nights talking about on film forums or chat rooms.
23:33.07KirkburnMore impressive battles than LotR, too
23:33.09RickJamesdude your right
23:33.22RickJameson speilbergs site it dosent say antying about warcraft on future projets
23:33.25Patrigan-SyldraAt this writing
23:33.34Patrigan-Syldraif the news is coming from yesterday
23:33.34RickJameswhy woud this tv show say that though?
23:33.37Patrigan-Syldrait might be possible
23:33.49RickJamesoh i see
23:34.10MentalPower|AFKPatrigan-Syldra: did you read the entire post?
23:34.12[Zeal]E! = Entertainment, Access Hollywood = Rumors & gossip ;)
23:34.18Patrigan-SyldraI read everything
23:34.31MentalPower|AFKit outlines the origins of the rumor, and its path to the media
23:34.31Patrigan-SyldraI mean...
23:34.42RickJamesnah access hollywood is not gossip dude
23:34.45RickJamesits real news
23:34.49Patrigan-SyldraEither way
23:34.53Patrigan-Syldrawe can't say anything for sure
23:35.03Patrigan-Syldraif anyone can find a tape of that Acces Hollywood
23:35.04RickJamesthey are the ones that said that that guy from the 70's show would be in spider man 3
23:35.24RickJamesmonths before there was even word about it
23:36.00Patrigan-Syldrawell I'm currently scavenging multiple sources
23:36.03RickJamesyou should check youtube in the next following days
23:36.14RickJamesim sure someone will post it on there
23:36.18RickJamesas it is major news
23:36.37RickJamesor speilbers site in the next few days
23:36.41KirkburnMentalPower|AFK, remember that that post is from June 20
23:36.46KirkburnHowever, I am also sceptical
23:37.37RickJamesahhh... i just read over and found out that that is a FAN SITE
23:37.41MentalPower|AFKbetter to be skeptical, than to be let down
23:37.46RickJamesi thought it was his real site lol
23:37.56RickJamesi have no doubt that it is real now
23:38.03Patrigan-Syldrawhat is his fan site?
23:38.05[Zeal]it is gossip, just some turn out to be true.
23:38.14RickJamesthat link you posted
23:38.35RickJamesfor a sec i thought it was speilbers official site
23:38.54[Zeal]E! news, when i've watched it, is gossip too : /
23:38.55RickJamesthat just gave me hope :D
23:39.12RickJamesit was not on E! news dude
23:39.15RickJamesthat show is gossip
23:39.23RickJamesit was on Access Hollywood
23:39.36RickJamesthat show is syndicated on nbc and E!
23:39.46[Zeal]on E!. the whole channel is about gossip of the entertainment industry.
23:40.18[Zeal]hm.. i could probably say that applies to all american tv too, heh.
23:40.18Patrigan-SyldraGuys guys
23:40.18Patrigan-Syldraquit it
23:40.19KirkburnWe must find out more!
23:40.32Patrigan-Syldrainstead of discussing wether or not it's gossip shows
23:40.33RickJameshaha its funny
23:40.37Patrigan-Syldrastart scavenging the internet
23:40.41Patrigan-Syldrafor information
23:40.49[Zeal]point is there isn't any info
23:40.59[Zeal]thats why that fan site has said what they have
23:41.15Patrigan-Syldraif it actually aired on hollywood thingy
23:41.18[Zeal]it's a lie that spiraled out of control.
23:41.26Patrigan-SyldraI'm 100% sure it will pop up somewhere again
23:41.30RickJamesdude i seriously doubt they would go on national tv and anounce such a major project if it wasent confirmed man
23:41.33Patrigan-Syldra[Zeal] it's from June >.>
23:41.51RickJamesi have never heard of a national tv show doing that and not being true
23:41.52RickJameshave you?
23:41.53Patrigan-Syldrathat message on spielbergs site is from June >.>
23:41.58Patrigan-Syldraeasy now
23:42.00Patrigan-Syldraall of you
23:42.01[Zeal]yes RickJames
23:42.04Patrigan-Syldrabunch of children...
23:42.12Patrigan-Syldrathe discussion is not wether or not it's true
23:42.18[Zeal]and yeah ,it is from june
23:42.46Patrigan-Syldrawe can only say that if eitherr Legendary pictures or Blizzard announces it
23:42.46Patrigan-Syldrathe discussion should be, has it actually aired and what exactly has been said
23:42.46RickJameswell instead of taking it with such negativity, i take this news in a postive way
23:42.50Patrigan-SyldraI want the exact wordings
23:43.11Kirkburni.e. we need a recording
23:43.13Patrigan-Syldrathe truth can only be confirmed by blizzard and or Legendary Pictures...
23:43.30[Zeal]if you go by thinking they will only say facts, then there would have been a press release to confirm it before they said. from either blizzard of spielberg. neither of which has happened it would appear.
23:43.56Patrigan-SyldraI knew that Blood elves were the first race weeks before blizz  announced it
23:43.59Patrigan-Syldraor the Draenei
23:44.06Patrigan-Syldraold news aswell when blizz announced it
23:44.13Patrigan-SyldraPatchnotes have leaked each and every time
23:44.23Patrigan-Syldraso a leak is not that uncommon
23:44.40RickJameswell i cant remember it word by word lol, but the lady said Two of the worlds most respected and sought after directors have signed on to direct and prouduce the a video game based movie warcraft
23:44.46[Zeal]despite that msot patch note leaks have been fake, it was obvious and rumoured for a long time.
23:45.03Patrigan-Syldrawell, not if you have the right sources [Zeal] ;)
23:45.16RickJamesthen the news focused on the online game sensation with over 7 million members world wide
23:45.34RickJamesand that it has become one of the top icons of 2006
23:45.53Patrigan-SyldraRickJames easy now
23:46.01Patrigan-SyldraI believe you, don't worry
23:46.07RickJamesand that peter jackson and speilberg would be directing and producing
23:46.13Patrigan-Syldrawe're all just skeptical to wether or not the message they delivered is true
23:46.19RickJameswell you said you wanted to know word for word lol
23:46.23Patrigan-Syldralet's be honest here
23:46.24RickJamesim trying to remember how she said it lol
23:46.34Patrigan-Syldrayeah, but I need a tape recording :p
23:46.37Patrigan-Syldraand a movie XD
23:46.41Patrigan-Syldraand a secondary source
23:46.48Patrigan-Syldrapreferably an insider source
23:46.59RickJameswell i searched world of warcraft movie while she was talking
23:47.03RickJamesand found wikipedia
23:47.04Patrigan-Syldrabut can't grab any of my GM friends online atm (but in general they don't know this either)
23:47.13RickJamesand came in here with the intentions to find out if anyone knew about this project
23:47.21Patrigan-Syldrawell, we know about it
23:47.25Patrigan-Syldrabut those details...
23:47.33Patrigan-Syldrawell let's say, it's a dream idea
23:47.42Patrigan-Syldraand if someone announces a dream to be true
23:47.45Patrigan-Syldrayou're always skeptical
23:47.55RickJamesi guess your right
23:48.04RickJameswe wont ever know until its an official press release
23:48.09KirkburnRickJames, you a WoW player?
23:48.29RickJamesbut that would be a dream come true speilberg and jackson
23:48.34KirkburnCool, I hope the wiki can be helpful for you =)
23:48.35RickJamesit makes you only imagine what they both could create
23:48.44RickJamesthis site is awesome
23:48.45KirkburnIt would be incredible
23:48.59RickJamesi have never found anything like this before
23:49.06RickJamesyou guys did a great job!
23:49.10KirkburnI've been working on the wiki for about 6 months, amazes me how much more there is still to add!
23:49.35RickJamesyou have come a super long way in 6 months
23:49.42Hobinheimpaging mod authors
23:49.42Patrigan-Syldra6 months?
23:49.47KirkburnSeriously, I have no idea how new pages are still being made :P
23:49.50[Zeal] and this expresses my concerns well
23:49.58KirkburnYeah, 6 months
23:50.08RickJameswell its a great service you have provided, and its an honor to meet you
23:50.11RickJamesthanks for the hard work
23:50.17[Zeal]imo, access hollywood were probably jsut reporting on this story as they saw it around everywhere.
23:50.22Patrigan-Syldra"June 21"
23:50.29KirkburnThe wiki is older than my visits :P
23:50.43KirkburnStarted back in Nov 2004, really took off at the start of 2006
23:50.48Patrigan-Syldrawait till we get an official announcement
23:50.57Patrigan-SyldraBlizzard has quite some money they can cough up you know
23:51.03Patrigan-Syldraand money ALWAYS attracts
23:51.18Patrigan-Syldraa mind changes fast when he sees the bling bling
23:51.38[Zeal]Patrigan-Syldra, the date is not of concern in what i'm talking about, stop pointing it out.
23:51.58RickJameswell for what its worth it was also said that dreamworks was going to do transformers and they denied all rumors that speilberg was working on indiana jones 4 and transformers
23:52.06RickJamesand we all know that transformers is now a reality
23:52.23Patrigan-Syldraand indiana jones too
23:52.24KirkburnAs is Indy 4
23:52.30Patrigan-Syldragah, actually can't wait to see that one XD
23:52.35Patrigan-Syldraeven with the old cast...
23:52.38Patrigan-Syldrameh >.>
23:52.44bleetahyeah, well people will deny anything if they have the letters NDA stamped on their forehead
23:52.49RickJamesthe transformers trailor looks insane!
23:52.52KirkburnIf Sylvester can do Rocky at his age, Ford can do Indy :P
23:53.06Patrigan-SyldraFord can always do indy!
23:53.24[Zeal]i thought transformers looks awful. how many version of transformers story do we need, and spin off etc. it's in double digits..
23:53.26RickJamesyeah hes just going to have to take is walker with him on those hill hikes
23:53.29Patrigan-Syldrayou have a wow account right?
23:53.44Patrigan-Syldraamerican I presume?
23:54.00bleetahi wish they'd do another evil dead
23:54.05Patrigan-Syldragood trolling alt?
23:54.37Patrigan-Syldra Gogo, make a post (under an alts nickname or sumething) regarding the news from Acces hollywood
23:54.43RickJamesi would really like to see a remake of close encounters of the third kind
23:55.04Patrigan-Syldrawant to see how fast it gets locked / deleted / commented on
23:55.27RickJameswhy would it?
23:55.49RickJamesyou think they might ban me for puting that information on there?
23:55.50Patrigan-Syldrainformation unrelesased by blizzard but the truth in general gets deleted fast
23:56.03RickJamesyou post it lol
23:56.08KirkburnNo, you can't get banned for it
23:56.13bleetahI will
23:56.16Patrigan-SyldraDepends on your wording, if you point at "I've seen at acces hollywood that:... Is it true?"
23:56.24Patrigan-SyldraI'm europe
23:56.27KirkburnIf you say it was announced on Access Hollywood, anyway
23:56.30Patrigan-Syldraso I can't post on american forums
23:56.39RickJamesif they are keeping it hush hush is probably for financial reasons
23:56.39Patrigan-SyldraKnowing blizzard
23:57.03Patrigan-Syldrathey have a {{SpeedyDelete}} for such topics
23:57.04KirkburnThey might warn you if they're really bothered, but they wouldn't ban you for asking a reasonable question
23:57.17Patrigan-SyldraI've seen many posts get deleted
23:57.24Patrigan-Syldraregarding unreleased information
23:57.26RickJamesim going to check my tivo to see if they are going to reschedule that show on another network so ic an record it
23:57.55Patrigan-SyldraSeriously >.> how can the americans even survive their forums
23:57.58KirkburnPatrigan-Syldra, talked about on national TV is unreleased :P
23:58.13Patrigan-Syldrabut still
23:58.24Patrigan-Syldradepending on how they got the word
23:58.32Patrigan-Syldradid they say anything bout that
23:58.38Patrigan-Syldrafrom where they got the information?
23:58.49RickJamesits scheduled to come on again at 12:00 AM today
23:58.58RickJamesi will record it
23:59.14Patrigan-Syldrado it, but make sure you can put it on your computer >.>
23:59.22RickJamesthey didint
23:59.27RickJamesi have an ALl in wonder card
23:59.29RickJamesill record it on here
23:59.39Patrigan-SyldraI remember asking another american to recrd something for me
23:59.40Patrigan-Syldrahe did
23:59.42bleetahsearching AH's website for warcraft returns no results
23:59.48Patrigan-Syldrabut he couldn't get his VHC tape on the internet >.>

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