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| 00:17.30 | *** topic/#wowuidev is WoW Classic Beta Addon Cat: https://www.wowinterface.com/downloads/cat160.html || 8.1.x ToC: 80100 || http://pastebin.com || Battletags: http://bit.ly/2MAEFxk || This channel is logged, via purl || Currently mode +r due to spam until a better solution is found. |
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| 06:18.34 | Funkeh`` | man, i'm such a greedy asshole always attacking people: https://github.com/BigWigsMods/Capping/pull/38 |
| 06:18.43 | Funkeh`` | give up on humanity sometimes |
| 06:20.29 | AcidWeb | Internet ¯_(ã)_/¯ |
| 06:22.07 | AcidWeb | What competitor? |
| 06:23.14 | AcidWeb | ah DBM-PvP |
| 06:23.51 | Mr_Rabies | honestly Funkeh`` as much as i love your addons i could definitely see the ARR license being a good reason for fragmentation/competition, mostly just because i've seen so many ARR addons just die and never have an alternative |
| 06:24.19 | Funkeh`` | if an addon dies and someone creates a new one, that's not fragmentation |
| 06:24.28 | Mr_Rabies | and i know this sounds weird because i'm also the type of person that believes pretty much any kinda open source code, unless you're getting paid for it means you're just doing free labor for other people |
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| 06:25.37 | Mr_Rabies | so like i totally respect your intent to own your code, but expect it to be stolen so long as it's open source as mandated by blizzard at the same time |
| 06:26.15 | Funkeh`` | I have my code stolen all the time - by people who ask to steal it |
| 06:27.01 | Funkeh`` | It's usually not to jsut create a copycat addon |
| 06:27.44 | Mr_Rabies | my opinion means very little because i'm terrible at coding anything and have never made a functioning addon and i have no dog in the fight nor do i know what addon the other guy is doing work for, but ARR mostly means "this code is mine and i don't want any help" or at least that's how i take it |
| 06:27.53 | Mr_Rabies | which is totally fine |
| 06:28.02 | Mr_Rabies | you put in the work, you deserve the benefits of that |
| 06:28.32 | Funkeh`` | I've never heard of anyone assuming "ARR" means "i don't want help" O.o |
| 06:29.04 | Mr_Rabies | it's about as limited of a license you can give open source code, yeah? |
| 06:29.36 | Mr_Rabies | that means you retain all rights to the code, even code other people contribute to the project, unless you make them an official rightsholder too or something along those lines |
| 06:29.53 | Funkeh`` | But that's not a "i don't want help" advertisement |
| 06:30.16 | Mr_Rabies | i think it is, but again see my caveats up ahead |
| 06:31.32 | Mr_Rabies | i would take "all rights reserved" as "okay this is this guy's pet project i should make my own instead with whatever license and whatever i want, because anything i contibute to his is going to be claimed by him anyway" |
| 06:31.53 | Mr_Rabies | but i would also probably steal code unless i knew the other guy could take me to court so |
| 06:31.54 | Mr_Rabies | lol |
| 06:32.34 | Funkeh`` | That's a shame. I consider asking as good manners |
| 06:32.54 | Mr_Rabies | like i said i could be way off but i sorta see "all rights reserved" as "the door's shut but i'm not locking it" |
| 06:33.01 | Mr_Rabies | whereas closed source is "the door's locked" |
| 06:33.55 | Mr_Rabies | that might also be a function of not knowing enough about coding to pull it off myself, though |
| 06:34.12 | Mr_Rabies | likely |
| 06:34.17 | Mr_Rabies | which is also possibly this guy's deal |
| 06:35.10 | Mr_Rabies | because stealing code can certainly run the risk of people accusing you of being a hack/bad at coding |
| 06:35.49 | Mr_Rabies | i know i'm a hack and bad at coding because i think the most complicated code i've been able to get to work is editing qbasic gorilla game code and irc scripts |
| 06:35.54 | Funkeh`` | I've never had issues with people contributing code to my projects, BigWigs is a great example. I think you're reading too much into it. |
| 06:36.03 | Mr_Rabies | i read too much into everything |
| 06:36.06 | Mr_Rabies | so probably |
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| 06:37.56 | Mr_Rabies | but me, a novice at best, would see a license restriction as a closed door unless i could gain something from my contributions |
| 06:38.25 | Funkeh`` | You do gain something, a better addon |
| 06:38.49 | Funkeh`` | This isn't an industrial for profit project |
| 06:39.13 | Mr_Rabies | but if i was confident enough in my own coding ability i'd probably just make my own thing instead |
| 06:39.39 | Funkeh`` | I think we can safely say that's not what's ahppening here |
| 06:40.14 | Mr_Rabies | he's either doing that or he's not confident in his own coding ability so he's stealing stuff, that's i guess the crux of what i'm saying |
| 06:41.05 | Funkeh`` | the latter mat be true but not in the context you presented, he ain't making his own thing |
| 06:49.03 | Mr_Rabies | oh yeah i sorta assumed it was a small addon no one had heard of but lol |
| 06:49.10 | Mr_Rabies | seems like probably the latter then |
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| 06:57.19 | MooreaTv | ARR does mean that there is good chance that whatever help you give may end up wasted so yes it's a bad license for collaboration/improving the state of wow addons |
| 06:58.09 | MooreaTv | (as in dead addon because the "owner" rage quits or, god forbid, gets hit by a bus) |
| 06:58.22 | Mr_Rabies | but i'm totally fine with that, just expect competition in that case |
| 06:58.27 | Funkeh`` | The license of a project has literally nothing to do with assurance that your code won't go to waste. |
| 06:58.55 | Funkeh`` | But the debate is pretty moot, since that's not the excuse being cited |
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| 06:59.25 | Mr_Rabies | also they can't sue you if they're dead and coding is voodoo magic to people who can't code, so it holds no meaning to family, so don't expect an estate suing you unless they think they could make money from it |
| 06:59.42 | MooreaTv | clearly that's why we have so many ARR dead addons that have to be reivented or are just lost; so yeah; must have nothing to do at all with it |
| 06:59.43 | Mr_Rabies | (using the hit by a bus idea) |
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| 07:00.11 | Funkeh`` | addons dieing and being replaced is the natural life cycle of literally all software projects |
| 07:00.53 | Funkeh`` | nothing lasts forever |
| 07:01.03 | Mr_Rabies | i think competition is the natural order of all of humanity's creations |
| 07:01.12 | Funkeh`` | so is collaboration |
| 07:01.21 | Mr_Rabies | cooperation happens under specific circumstances and the more barriers you put up will decrease that |
| 07:01.49 | MooreaTv | well don't complain you don't get help (from people who actually understand a tiny bit the implications) if you're project is ARR |
| 07:02.03 | Funkeh`` | that's literally not waht the complain was about |
| 07:02.54 | Mr_Rabies | yeah i kinda backed you into a corner with a hypothetical because i'm mostly just sad about how many addons died because wowmatrix made everyone go ARR |
| 07:03.12 | Mr_Rabies | (even though they stole the addons anyway and haven't gotten sued yet) |
| 07:03.55 | Mr_Rabies | i would at least appreciate wowmatrix updating sooner because two of my guildies use it and their dbm is always ancient |
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| 11:07.49 | VIad | Funkeh`: I like how the drama unfolded from a pull request that moved one line `local type = type` :omegalul: |
| 11:12.12 | haste | `local _G_type = _G.type` |
| 11:12.14 | haste | ð |
| 11:14.49 | VIad | I stopped localing from _G unless I do it in a OnUpdate or similar, the performance gain is small and having 20 lines of localing on top of your file is ugly ,_, |
| 11:23.29 | haste | I wouldn't bother either these days |
| 11:24.02 | haste | but it's not like I write a lot of Lua these days anyway :D |
| 11:25.26 | VIad | how come? lack of motivation or not playing wow? |
| 11:29.55 | haste | stopped playing |
| 11:30.15 | haste | and now I'm deep into other projects instead, so don't feel I have the time to start again |
| 11:31.44 | VIad | I hear you. maybe you'll say hello to try classic on a casual level? |
| 11:38.35 | haste | Maybe, I'm not really super nostalgic about classic |
| 11:38.40 | haste | Played waaaay too much :D |
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| 18:47.14 | znf | https://pastie.dev/VBjO6S.makefile weird |
| 18:55.28 | Crosshash | Did you find a shadow priest video? |
| 19:00.38 | znf | Crosshash, sadly no |
| 19:01.17 | Crosshash | Could you make one? |
| 19:03.20 | Semlar | how does an addon whose functionality consists of adding a number to a tooltip have that many lines of code |
| 19:07.36 | znf | Crosshash, well, I run with a lot of addons, and I can't really play without them, got too used to them; plus... it's happening on Zaq, which I'd need a pug for |
| 19:08.09 | Crosshash | Are you talking about solo, or in raids? |
| 19:19.29 | znf | raids |
| 19:19.52 | znf | I mean, fight type is irrelevant, but you just need a lot of haste to reproduce the issue |
| 19:36.56 | MooreaTv | semlar-? |
| 19:38.03 | Semlar | ?? |
| 19:40.27 | MooreaTv | which addon/what does it do/what do the lines do/does it matter |
| 19:41.55 | Semlar | the error znf linked was thrown by line 2333 of raider io |
| 19:43.41 | MooreaTv | ohhhhh |
| 19:43.54 | MooreaTv | funny |
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| 19:51.30 | znf | Semlar: literally no idea |
| 20:33.44 | znf | Weapons from Weekly Cache can go up to 450, right? 430 base + 10 "warforged" guaranteed + another hope for it to "titanforge", yes? |
| 20:45.46 | nevcairiel | didnt they limit the titanforging on weapons or something |
| 20:46.07 | Gnarfoz | wasn't it limited to just warforging? idk |
| 20:50.14 | nebula | yea weapons can only warforge, i assume that remains true with the chest, so it'll cap at 450 |
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| 21:25.54 | znf | yes, but the tooltip will say Mythic 10 Titanforge |
| 21:26.08 | znf | Even if it's technically just another Warforge on top |
| 21:26.30 | znf | Unless they changed it from 8.0 where I noticed that the first time. We talked about it back then :P |
| 21:27.09 | nebula | yea, the label gets weird because how they do it, i ment to say i assume they calculate the bonus properly (max of +10) then just jam into bonus ids |
| 21:28.16 | znf | I just recall it could "Titanforge" 10 more ilvls |
| 21:28.27 | znf | but it could be 5... |
| 21:29.20 | znf | tough I guess +10 would make more sense, so they can be on par with Mythic Raid |
| 21:31.04 | znf | Due to TF/WF stuff and Sockets being a proc, it's so disappointing when you get a drop in the raid that hasn't rolled anything special |
| 21:33.00 | znf | I had a WF weapon from M+10, 440, and the mythic one from 1st boss being only 445 is... "meh" |
| 21:33.45 | znf | It was more like an inconvenience that I had to buy another weapon enchant for +150 dps or something like that |
| 21:35.07 | nevcairiel | you're just a spoiled entitled brat, 5 ilvl on a weapon are pretty good :p |
| 21:35.52 | znf | literally +150 dps |
| 21:36.04 | znf | something like 0.2% I think |
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| 23:41.13 | znf | Did anyone actually get any of those new troops for their missions? |
| 23:41.22 | znf | I've been training for a few days now, none of those new ones |
| 23:55.32 | Mr_Rabies | would be nice if you could dismiss troops |
| 23:56.18 | Mr_Rabies | because no i barely ever use troops and don't know what the new ones do |
| 23:56.31 | Mr_Rabies | it's just ankoan/whatever the horde equiv is right? |