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| 07:48.26 | Torhal | I need to start uninstalling Blizzard games that I'm not actively playing. When I want to launch a goddamn game and I can't because three others need updates? |
| 07:48.28 | Torhal | Rage. |
| 07:49.00 | Torhal | Go ahead - update. But let me launch what I want to launch when I want to launch it if it isn't the game being updated FFS. |
| 07:52.47 | Torhal | If Steam operated that way, I'd only ever have one game installed. |
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| 08:34.34 | foxlit | You can turn off automatic updates, Torhal. |
| 08:34.57 | foxlit | (which might be less extreme than uninstalling everything) |
| 08:36.32 | Torhal | Yeah, true. But then when I launch WoW I'll get the whole "Requires update" after WoW has gone through the loading process, and then I have to start over. I'd rather have "Hey, WoW is updating. I need to wait for that." instead of "Hey, HotS, SC2, and Overwatch are updating. I need to wait for those before I can do a damn thing in WoW." |
| 08:37.14 | Torhal | I have no idea why that was deemed a good idea. |
| 08:38.27 | Torhal | Either that, or I keep BNet loaded at all times, which has its own set of problems. |
| 08:38.53 | Torhal | It's gotten much better; at one point I actually killed it when launching WoW because it was eating CPU. |
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| 13:10.13 | Gnarfoz | huh? must be a mac issue |
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| 13:10.32 | Gnarfoz | launching a game that is up to date takes precendence over updates of other games for me |
| 13:11.03 | Gnarfoz | do you have "pause updates when I launch a game" enabled? |
| 13:13.07 | VIad | Torhal: if I don't specify a package name field in the pkgmeta file, will curse package the folder as-is and deploy the files as a "root folder"? |
| 13:13.45 | Torhal | VIad: Yes. But your wording was fuck-all understanding-wise. |
| 13:14.00 | Torhal | I almost answered with .git is ignored. |
| 13:14.00 | VIad | I've always used a package-as in the pkgmeta so I thought that controls the name of the root folder inside the zip, but now I wanna build it so I have several root folders in the zip |
| 13:14.41 | VIad | modular addon with different sub-addons in the addon list to help the user control what databases to load |
| 13:14.53 | Torhal | VIad: move-folders ala https://www.curseforge.com/knowledge-base/world-of-warcraft/527-preparing-the-packagemeta-file |
| 13:15.19 | Torhal | You could also do something like cloning the repos for BigWigs and DBM and seeing what they do. |
| 13:16.34 | VIad | hmm, that example you made |
| 13:16.56 | VIad | I assume it would create zip\Monkey zip\Monkey_Suit zip\Monkey_Hat |
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| 13:17.07 | Torhal | Yes. |
| 13:17.07 | VIad | so when curse installs it you get 3 addons |
| 13:17.13 | Torhal | Yes. |
| 13:17.14 | VIad | neato thats exactly how I wanted it :) |
| 13:17.32 | VIad | was first thinking to omit package-as field but unsure if its the best approach, move-folders is better |
| 13:18.54 | VIad | a weird performance questions as well, Torhal. if I had a lua table with 200k entries with unique string keys, would it be best optimized just keeping it 1 level as described, or, should I split up the data in several sub-tables (grouped up somehow) |
| 13:20.05 | VIad | like looking up using t[guid] returns the profile, or I could also struct it like t[region][realm][name] to return profile, but the last one looks nicer structured, but memory wise I wonder if it takes noticable more memory, or if looking up is going to be too slow |
| 13:20.50 | Torhal | I have no idea, from the wording, what you'r actually asking. |
| 13:21.18 | VIad | lookup performance and memory usage, I'll test more at home, just curious if you had encountered some situations like this |
| 13:21.54 | VIad | I was thinking the best way to plan a huge table with a lot of data, if I should keep it one lookup level with like a guid string key, or add several levels and group data |
| 13:22.47 | Torhal | No. |
| 13:22.58 | VIad | like I could lookup someone using t["realm-name"] or t[realm][name] or even t[region][realm][name] but it would depend on the type of structure I'd use in my table |
| 13:23.19 | Torhal | You do what makes sense. And then you re-evaluate to make _sure_ it makes sense. |
| 13:23.34 | VIad | one level, or 2-3 levels, and I dunno if it really matters if I lookup once in a while, not like I do hundreds of lookups at once :p |
| 13:23.36 | Gnarfoz | also, do something, then figure out if it needs performance improvement :p |
| 13:23.38 | Torhal | You don't just "think" of the best way. |
| 13:24.34 | Torhal | Sometimes, actually laying it out in code and then thinking of all the ways you'd want to access that particular data will really show you where you went wrong. |
| 13:24.38 | Gnarfoz | (and strings are interned anyway, so... the table approach might use less memory? I don't know. Make a test case? :P) |
| 13:24.55 | VIad | hmm yeah, I'll do that |
| 13:25.25 | Torhal | Even fake data will do the trick if you're going for an iterative approach rather than a real design. |
| 13:25.50 | VIad | I only wanted to ask as it could have been a situation others have seen before, share some tips. :p |
| 13:25.59 | Torhal | It is, yes. |
| 13:26.18 | Torhal | Is it the best? Totally dependant on WHAT the data is, and HOW you'll access it in most cases. |
| 13:26.39 | Torhal | Always aim for simplicity. |
| 13:26.54 | Torhal | Not what is the most "elegant-looking" |
| 13:27.18 | VIad | I am working with the guys at raiderio for a m+ score type addon, so we're talking about huge region wide database addons the user checks what region they want to load, then next step is like a user option if they care about the other faction or not, I could then wipe the other faction right after load to ease off the memory use, but in the end it would use like 40 mb of static table struct for lookup purposes |
| 13:27.51 | Torhal | If it looks "good" it may just fuck you over because your code is if tableName.ermaGHERD.whoops.[variable] then |
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| 13:28.30 | Torhal | When it could be if specificDataSet[variable] then |
| 13:29.34 | Torhal | Functions cost the most. Table lookups cost less, but only if you aren't doing a fucton of them. |
| 13:29.42 | Torhal | fuckton* |
| 13:29.51 | Torhal | I need to throw this keyboard away. |
| 13:29.56 | VIad | yeah in this case it would only lookup when you mouseover someone more or less :p |
| 13:30.06 | Torhal | How many lookups? :P |
| 13:30.16 | VIad | mouseover a unit so 1 person at a time |
| 13:30.37 | Torhal | Data structure "looking" what you perceive as "elegant" can be a performance hit. |
| 13:30.38 | VIad | if I ever add it to /who then like 50 max at once or something :p |
| 13:31.10 | Gnarfoz | or... |
| 13:31.13 | Torhal | If, instead, you have several separate tables with only the relevant data, which is looked up only as needed... |
| 13:31.16 | Gnarfoz | you could realize you're working on GearScore 3.0 |
| 13:31.18 | Gnarfoz | and stop doing this |
| 13:31.19 | Gnarfoz | :P |
| 13:31.44 | Gnarfoz | just a thought |
| 13:31.52 | Torhal | stabs Gnarfoz with a Dragon Aspect. |
| 13:32.04 | VIad | sadly people already wowprogs/raiderio people for a score when pugging a 15 or pushing keys |
| 13:32.30 | Torhal | Gnarfoz: The funny thing is, I completely ignored what he was saying so far as WHAT the data was. |
| 13:32.34 | VIad | this only moves it into the game for easier access of the data and it doesnt try rank you good or bad |
| 13:32.41 | Torhal | He asked about code efficiency... |
| 13:32.49 | Gnarfoz | higher score = good, lower score = bad |
| 13:32.50 | VIad | yeah I did ask about code efficiency |
| 13:32.54 | Gnarfoz | pretty unavoidable :P |
| 13:33.13 | Torhal | So I answered in that regard, ignoring what I thought was pseudocode. |
| 13:33.25 | Torhal | Otherwise? I would have given Gnarfoz's answer. |
| 13:33.45 | VIad | I'm sorry |
| 13:33.50 | Torhal | Nah. |
| 13:34.01 | Torhal | Just advice: Fuck all that. |
| 13:34.02 | VIad | I wasn't trying to hide what I was working with |
| 13:34.21 | Torhal | I didn't say you were - I just ignored it as pseudocode. |
| 13:35.08 | VIad | I am going to try work on this and present data the most fair way I can |
| 13:36.04 | VIad | like ideally if you have last season score, can simply rely on it until you get a better one for this season, stuff like that. maybe even group up the scores into tiers to avoid 2938 vs 2887 type comparisons |
| 13:36.35 | Torhal | Good luck, but know this; with this particular endeavor you're either going to piss people off by not accounting for everything, or you're going to piss people off by trivializing them for not being hardcore. |
| 13:38.38 | VIad | perhaps the addon can tell you that this person relative to you is on your level, like to avoid showing the real numbers |
| 13:39.13 | VIad | if I got 500 score and someone queues with 450 it could simply say they are a safe pick for me :p |
| 13:39.48 | VIad | these are the things that are good to talk about tbh, see what the best course would be to try be most fair for all cases |
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| 14:39.40 | Thunder_Child | "<Torhal> I need to throw this keyboard away." That's because at this point it's more cat hair than plastic. |
| 14:40.54 | Torhal | Thunder_Child: No, at this point it's more shit and buggy firmware than a reason to debunk your clearly clever and witty retort. |
| 14:41.02 | Torhal | >.> |
| 14:41.06 | Torhal | <.< |
| 14:42.50 | Thunder_Child | Well, someone is having a less than stellar day. |
| 14:43.20 | Torhal | Thunder_Child: WAT? I was making an observation. |
| 14:43.50 | Torhal | Seriously - I say things as they are, so far as I can perceive them. |
| 14:44.36 | Thunder_Child | Well today you seem to have foxlit levels of response, and it's not your norm, so I assumed a bad day. |
| 14:44.41 | Thunder_Child | If not, then ignore me. |
| 14:47.24 | Torhal | I know for a goddamn fact that bshelden can back me up on this, because he decided he'd had enough of me bitching about Legion Dalaran's underworld, and the fact that I had no idea about the class halls, before he decided that I was nothing more than a whiny fucker that needed spanked. |
| 14:48.17 | Torhal | But yeah, Thunder_Child - I do apologize if I'm being terse. |
| 14:48.53 | Thunder_Child | I'm hardly offended, I act like a dick. I was just noting it's not normal for you. |
| 14:48.54 | Torhal | I am having a bad day/week/month/year/existence. |
| 14:49.57 | Torhal | The only reason I saw fit to respond to you, Thunder_Child, is because your normal mode of operation is "I'm a dick" |
| 14:50.40 | Torhal | So yeah - you saw something circumspect. Thanks for that, at least. :) |
| 14:51.23 | Torhal | Actually, I was just unfairly harsh. |
| 14:51.59 | Torhal | You _can_ be a dick whereas foxlit _takes pride_ in being a dick. |
| 14:52.10 | Torhal | Sorry, Thunder_Child. |
| 14:53.31 | Thunder_Child | Again, not bothered/offended. That being said, I'm not sure foxlit sees it that way. He just has no patience for people that are not willing to put in at least a modicum of effort. |
| 14:56.10 | Torhal | Meh. Not going to debate observation. |
| 14:57.07 | Torhal | Anywho - Thunder_Child - are you hitting up BlizzCon? Somehow, I missed you last year. |
| 14:57.42 | Torhal | Also, sofar as foxlit being a dick? I've seen him a three (four?) BlizzCons. He's polite in person. |
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| 14:59.15 | Thunder_Child | I have come to realize that I don't like conventions, so I don't go to them. As far as the dinner, I did sign up last year, but I had to bail. |
| 15:00.14 | Thunder_Child | You already seem to be bringing a small troop of people. |
| 15:00.54 | Torhal | Thunder_Child: Fair enough. I honestly haven't wanted to go for a few years. |
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| 15:01.17 | Torhal | The already-established personal connections, though. |
| 15:01.58 | Torhal | And yeah - this year, I signed up more people. They were all there last year. |
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| 15:05.23 | Torhal | Thunder_Child: I was really afraid that I'd somehow overlooked you, last year. Good to know that wasn't the case. |
| 15:06.09 | Thunder_Child | Torhal: Always possible. How many people were at the dinner? |
| 15:06.24 | Torhal | Thunder_Child: Way goddamn more than ever. |
| 15:08.06 | Torhal | Honestly, I'd go without a BlizzCon ticket just to be able to hang out with my once-per-year friends. |
| 15:08.30 | Torhal | Other than that, Thunder_Child, I'm in your boat - I don't care for cons. |
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| 16:10.53 | pompy | ~lart Torhal |
| 16:10.53 | purl | nabs the moon and broadsides Torhal with the sea of tranquility |
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| 16:45.39 | VIad | Torhal: can I have a curse project be private/unlisted until I flag it as release? |
| 16:45.57 | VIad | I assume experimental option means just that so I can test as much as I want :p |
| 17:06.45 | znf | yes |
| 17:06.49 | znf | that's what that does |
| 17:20.18 | Torhal | VIad: We have no notion of "private" but Experimental won't list it on mods.curse and the App. |
| 17:20.30 | Torhal | On CurseForge? You're totally open. |
| 17:20.55 | VIad | Torhal: I hope packager still works :d |
| 17:21.14 | VIad | experimental doesn't like hide it, or you need like link to access it? |
| 17:22.16 | Torhal | I have no idea what you just asked. |
| 17:22.50 | Torhal | Everything works, save for synchronization to mods.curse or to the APp. |
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| 17:49.21 | bshelden | I'm mildly curious who you intended to highlight. |
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| 23:58.27 | Semlar | is there anything you can do if someone steals everything out of your guild bank and then leaves |
| 23:59.26 | Semlar | or is it one of those "tough luck, you shouldn't have given them permission to do that" type things |
| 23:59.44 | bshelden | Sadly, I think that depends on the GM who picks up your ticket. |