| 00:07.59 | foxlit | C_Garrison.GetFollowerInfo(fid).followerTypeID |
| 00:08.00 | foxlit | whee. |
| 00:36.32 | *** join/#wowuidev Seerah (~RyanNL@104-180-66-29.lightspeed.mmphtn.sbcglobal.net) |
| 00:36.32 | *** mode/#wowuidev [+o Seerah] by ChanServ |
| 00:38.53 | Mr_Rabies | wat |
| 00:38.57 | Mr_Rabies | randomly got removed from lfr |
| 00:42.10 | Mr_Rabies | after a 40 minute queue |
| 00:42.14 | Mr_Rabies | damnit |
| 00:42.15 | Mr_Rabies | :( |
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| 03:41.04 | Mr_Rabies | jeez, they need to replace the pet and arena weekly things |
| 04:27.27 | Fisker | sleepingly hugs Cairenn |
| 04:27.31 | Fisker | also hey Seerah |
| 04:27.40 | Seerah | hey, Fisker |
| 04:28.29 | Fisker | tired |
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| 04:39.15 | kd3 | any alliance need poundfist? |
| 04:39.49 | kullervo | eu? |
| 04:40.06 | kd3 | us |
| 04:40.08 | kullervo | I need one just to trade it to players in stormwind |
| 04:40.10 | kullervo | damn |
| 04:49.01 | Fisker | nah kd3 I don't need "poundfist" |
| 04:49.04 | Fisker | thanks for the offer though |
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| 06:21.54 | airtonix | busting all kinds |
| 06:22.09 | Primer | My game starts to get super laggy over time while in Ashran. I'm wondering if perhaps some addon is leaking frames or something. Does anyone have any code for looking at things like that? Like, a quick and dirty count of frames? |
| 06:26.18 | Mr_Rabies | it's your computer telling you ashran is awful |
| 06:26.19 | Mr_Rabies | :( |
| 06:30.49 | [TOM_RUS] | isn't lag in mass pvp has been a thing for a years? |
| 06:32.18 | Primer | no |
| 06:32.21 | Primer | it starts off fine |
| 06:32.32 | Primer | after about an hour it lags, I /rl, and it's fine |
| 06:39.31 | Primer | It seems to be tied to some event |
| 06:39.34 | Primer | and the lag spikes |
| 06:54.36 | Primer | Are there no scripts for iterating over frames and seeing if some addon is leaking frames or something? |
| 07:04.24 | mckenziemc1 | hugs Cairenn. |
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| 07:52.34 | nevcairiel | Primer: you can count with EnumerateFrames |
| 07:53.09 | nevcairiel | easy enough to put in a simple macro http://wow.gamepedia.com/API_EnumerateFrames |
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| 07:54.59 | FireSiku | Leaking frames? |
| 07:56.46 | Semlar | i'm assuming he's asking about addons creating new frames |
| 07:57.35 | Semlar | which you could track by hooking CreateFrame and using debugstack to identify the file that called it |
| 07:58.25 | nevcairiel | i feel like there should be a debug addon that stores this during frame creation of all and any frames, so you can check after-the-fact |
| 07:59.01 | Semlar | i actually did this to identify what addon created the frame i was mousing over |
| 07:59.33 | Semlar | it mostly works, except in the case where the file path is too long for it to display the addon directory and then you can't really identify it |
| 08:00.01 | Semlar | can still point to the file though |
| 08:00.20 | nevcairiel | cant you ask the game which addon tainted the frame |
| 08:00.29 | Semlar | i don't know, can you? |
| 08:00.38 | Semlar | i was just using debugstack and matching the string |
| 08:01.07 | Semlar | it was kind of useful to see the file and line number where it was created too |
| 08:01.21 | nevcairiel | sure, but in absence of that knowing the addon itself might be nce |
| 08:02.18 | Semlar | is there some method to identify what addon tainted something? |
| 08:02.28 | nevcairiel | http://wow.gamepedia.com/API_issecurevariable |
| 08:02.50 | nevcairiel | although it seems to only work on global variables with a name |
| 08:03.52 | Semlar | i know if you turn up the taint log it shows pretty much everything, but i don't know if you can access the same information in game |
| 08:06.14 | Primer | nevcairiel: I love you |
| 08:12.02 | Semlar | well, issecurevariable also appears to return "true" for any random string you put in there |
| 08:12.17 | nevcairiel | Semlar: any variable that doesnt exist is by definition still secure =p |
| 08:12.22 | Semlar | :| |
| 08:15.25 | Semlar | sets _G's metatable |
| 08:27.38 | basehead | nhow the hell do atlases work? what is atlas="foo" referencing? |
| 08:29.19 | basehead | something will say atlas="foo" but foo doesn't appear anywhere in UI code |
| 08:29.29 | nevcairiel | i forget where the atlases are stored, but its a reference to a texture atlas, ie. a big texture which contains a lot of smaller symbols or whatnot, and lets you reference them individually |
| 08:29.36 | nevcairiel | they are not in UI, they are art assets |
| 08:30.42 | nevcairiel | so instead of fudging with texcoords for every icon, that information is hard-coded somewhere in a dbc file, and you just reference the named symbol |
| 08:31.35 | basehead | e.g. for the login screen, for Legion the expansion logo is atlas="Glues-WoW-LegionLogo" but i don't see any file called that anywhere either. |
| 08:31.45 | Semlar | it's all internal |
| 08:31.49 | basehead | oh, maybe a dbc somewhere |
| 08:31.55 | Semlar | i don't think it's a dbc |
| 08:32.01 | Semlar | i don't know how the atlases are stored |
| 08:32.03 | basehead | D= |
| 08:32.34 | basehead | uitextureatlas.db2 |
| 08:32.35 | basehead | =D |
| 08:32.55 | nevcairiel | i keep forgetting the URL to foxlits online dbc/db2 browser |
| 08:32.59 | nevcairiel | and his main page doesnt link to it |
| 08:33.01 | nevcairiel | damnit |
| 08:33.30 | basehead | i found it in uitextureatlasmember.db2 |
| 08:33.37 | basehead | okay |
| 08:33.38 | basehead | phew |
| 08:34.10 | basehead | they make much more sense now |
| 08:34.16 | basehead | i didn't see how there was enough info in the ui files |
| 08:34.43 | Semlar | why do you need the atlas data |
| 08:34.51 | nevcairiel | he is re-implementing the UI |
| 08:35.27 | Semlar | i see |
| 08:35.42 | nevcairiel | although i think he changed his name |
| 08:35.50 | nevcairiel | i thought it was different |
| 08:36.02 | basehead | oops |
| 08:36.35 | nevcairiel | oh right that was it |
| 08:37.31 | relaxok | i was fooling with MoP data for so long, it was getting ancient |
| 08:37.35 | relaxok | im using legion now |
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| 08:41.17 | Guest26703 | gz on the template inheritance of onload thingy |
| 08:41.34 | Guest26703 | hmm... why did it make me a guest if I use SASL to login? |
| 08:42.36 | VIad | I don't like that |
| 08:45.14 | relaxok | i didnt actually do the inheritance yet |
| 08:45.18 | relaxok | D= |
| 08:46.57 | VIad | I just noticed some happy messages about it |
| 08:47.08 | VIad | strickly speaking not sure what exactly it does : |
| 08:47.25 | VIad | like if you make a template inherit some other template, then you can easier inherit stuff? |
| 08:47.47 | relaxok | if you had an inheritance chain of virtual elements, you could only have a single OnLoad handler.. one would eventually override any others that were defined |
| 08:47.58 | relaxok | they made it so that you can prepend one with the other, etc. |
| 08:48.05 | relaxok | when inheriting |
| 08:48.07 | VIad | aha |
| 08:48.58 | VIad | I guess this happened because blizzard needs to use this themselves for legion :p |
| 08:50.24 | nevcairiel | you could manually do it before by simply making the OnLoads functions and calling them in the OnLoads further down the chain, but its a bit clunky |
| 08:51.59 | VIad | does the new xml related features added, make it beneficial to use templates? I know some prefer pure lua solutions, but personally xml is a bit easier to read and write while lua can get messy - also no templating in lua, you need to make factory functions, I guess it basically does the same. |
| 08:52.30 | nevcairiel | if you think xml is easier to read and write than lua, you should go t o some lua classes |
| 08:53.23 | VIad | its easier to see what the xml is/does than lua since you can write the lua widgets infinitely more obfuscated to read for others :p |
| 08:53.40 | nevcairiel | its your own fault if you do that |
| 08:54.25 | VIad | I can quickly at a glance make out the gist of most xml templates, while reading some lua code can sometimes get confusing, as the various parts can be spread out, not always in one factory function |
| 08:54.51 | VIad | though I dislike xml with lua code. horrors... |
| 08:55.06 | VIad | blizz does that sometimes, in some older xml files there is a lot of it |
| 08:55.24 | VIad | I guess issue with xml is it needs globals if you want to pass it functions |
| 08:55.33 | VIad | did legion do changes to that or? |
| 09:06.05 | VIad | I assume that if I you create a frame and use the mixin feature, that frame will contain your mixing methods. |
| 09:06.42 | VIad | like the GarrisonFollowerPortraitMixin has a SetPortrait method, so when used in the definition of a frame I guess you can frame:SetPortrait |
| 09:07.11 | VIad | back in the day I'd expand the frame widget by adding my methods on it, but with mixins seems like code can get a bit more structured :p |
| 09:09.32 | VIad | interesting, mapcanvas is like a way to add map icons now... you got AddDataProvider |
| 09:09.45 | VIad | if we can add our own data providers we can reuse the default map canvas to draw out shit |
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| 11:25.13 | foxlit | <PROTECTED> |
| 11:25.48 | nevcairiel | hopefully i remember the url for next time! |
| 11:25.48 | foxlit | <PROTECTED> |
| 11:26.36 | Gnarfoz | my sneaky logging bot ignores prepended spaces! |
| 11:26.49 | nevcairiel | thats probably why he does them |
| 11:26.49 | nevcairiel | :P |
| 11:28.22 | karl_w_w | damn |
| 11:28.38 | karl_w_w | alan rickman never did a reading of the raven and now he's dead |
| 11:34.10 | Gnarfoz | nevcairiel: I meant: it ignores the spaces. not messages that have them. :P |
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| 11:57.21 | VIad | tbh the dbc files, I think it's totally fine to host such content, it is very addon related as well, helps greatly with a ton of things. not sure if there is much stigma left, some years ago the dbc and private servers were a thing, but is it really a issue these days? |
| 12:03.12 | foxlit | taking a negation of everything you said wouldn't be too far off the mark. |
| 12:04.20 | VIad | what harm can possibly hosting dbc files do? |
| 12:04.34 | VIad | or the talk about them, their structs, usage, e.g. |
| 12:04.36 | VIad | etc.* |
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| 12:09.07 | VIad | reverse engineering is legal for instance for the purpose of learning how something works |
| 12:10.52 | Kalroth | legal in some countries* |
| 12:11.53 | VIad | I think it's legal even in the US |
| 12:12.30 | VIad | for instance addons in this case, reverse engineering the executable or the dbc files helps us make addons, so interoperability |
| 12:12.53 | VIad | the process itself isn't what makes it illegal, more like what the results are used for |
| 12:14.53 | Shirik | if you enter into a contract that says you won't reverse engineer something |
| 12:14.58 | Shirik | and then you reverse engineer it |
| 12:15.04 | Shirik | you're in a breach of contract |
| 12:15.29 | VIad | foxlit never had a contract with blizzard to not reverse engineer their dbc file format |
| 12:15.56 | Shirik | you sure about that? |
| 12:16.18 | VIad | depends |
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| 12:16.28 | Shirik | You agree that you will not, in whole or in part or under any circumstances, do the following: |
| 12:16.28 | Shirik | Derivative Works: Copy or reproduce (except as provided in Section 1(B)), translate, reverse engineer, derive source code from, modify, disassemble, decompile, or create derivative works based on or related to the Battle.net Client or Games. |
| 12:16.40 | Shirik | that's from the bnet client but it was the easiest one to find |
| 12:16.48 | Shirik | you can be reasonably sure the same is in the wow client |
| 12:17.10 | VIad | thats saying more about intent |
| 12:17.27 | VIad | if foxlit reverse engineered and made his own wow server, its not okay :p |
| 12:17.28 | Shirik | what are you smoking |
| 12:17.39 | Shirik | it literally says you may not reverse engineer |
| 12:17.40 | VIad | it said copy or reproduce |
| 12:17.54 | nevcairiel | Shirik: idk about the US, but a contract cant forbid me from doing that in germany =p |
| 12:17.58 | VIad | mm |
| 12:18.16 | VIad | even in the US |
| 12:18.46 | VIad | companies try to put in legal stuff about reverse engineering |
| 12:18.51 | VIad | but doesnt mean that is law |
| 12:18.57 | Shirik | that's because you don't know what law is |
| 12:19.08 | Shirik | it is totally irrelevant whether or not it's law |
| 12:19.25 | VIad | its illegal only if its law that is broken |
| 12:19.41 | Shirik | ffs dude you are dense |
| 12:19.44 | Shirik | I signed an agreement with my credit card company. I can choose not to pay my bills. That is not illegal. |
| 12:19.52 | VIad | a contract isnt law, just a contract between two entities |
| 12:19.54 | Shirik | that doesn't make it a good idea |
| 12:19.59 | nevcairiel | Shirik: the thing is that contracts are not all powerful, some things in contracts just cant be enforced, even if companies would want to |
| 12:19.59 | Shirik | or that it will be without consequences |
| 12:20.00 | VIad | if broken it also states what happens :p |
| 12:20.32 | Shirik | It doesn't have to say what happens. What happens can be as simple as you get into a civil suit for damages |
| 12:21.03 | Shirik | like you are totally ignoring that 90% of our legal system isn't in law |
| 12:21.07 | Shirik | the US is a common law system |
| 12:21.32 | Shirik | that's pretty important when you're in the non-criminal space |
| 12:22.25 | VIad | the company only cares that they have something to go by if there is a court case between entities so they can claim why someone broke their contract and should pay them money or what ever - but it wouldn't happen unless foxlit did something with the blizzard sources, like, make money off it |
| 12:22.37 | VIad | as long it's education, or documentation, doubt anything bad will happen |
| 12:22.48 | VIad | in the case of wow addons and dbc files :p |
| 12:23.00 | Shirik | I don't think you understand how highly companies value proprietary IP |
| 12:23.14 | Shirik | entire companies have been sold over IP |
| 12:24.02 | Shirik | arguing this is pointless though because at the end of the day it doesn't matter what you or I think. What matters is that you don't get to decide whether or not there is a consequence |
| 12:24.13 | Shirik | if you want to take that risk, feel free. But don't act like "I CAN DO THIS AND YOU CAN'T TOUCH ME" |
| 12:24.26 | Shirik | and sure as hell don't tell other people that |
| 12:24.29 | VIad | there are laws to enable reverse engineering |
| 12:24.33 | Shirik | dude |
| 12:24.42 | Shirik | what you are doing right now is as dangerous as anti-vaxxers |
| 12:24.49 | VIad | lol |
| 12:24.50 | Shirik | you are telling people things you don't understand anything about |
| 12:24.57 | Shirik | and potentially getting them into trouble |
| 12:25.01 | Shirik | let them make their own decision |
| 12:25.40 | VIad | I am certain foxlit chose to do what is smartes for him, I dont doubt that :p |
| 12:25.48 | VIad | and I doubt he takes me seriously to reconsider his stance |
| 12:26.12 | VIad | was more curious what he was afraid of maybe for not having a public link to his dbc page |
| 12:26.59 | Shirik | there are 120 other people in this channel looking on while you say things like "it's totally fine to host such content" |
| 12:27.38 | VIad | I can link to this so they can make up their own minds: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Reverse_engineering#United_States |
| 12:27.54 | VIad | also I hope people dont take legal advice from random net people, I am not even a mod at wowuidev |
| 12:28.17 | VIad | doesnt mean I will stop spewing smog in case someone might believe something stupid I say and ruin their lives |
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| 13:27.38 | foxlit | I generally don't think dbc access is all that useful for addon development; majority of those files are just junk, and the minority that are not are useful to a minority of addons. |
| 13:28.34 | foxlit | (the last minority should be a majority) |
| 13:31.55 | nevcairiel | yeah most addons dont need any of that info |
| 13:32.43 | VIad | I myself use it for lookup, see what possibitilities there are, maybe some of the data is useful to convert to a lua table if there is no api for it. thats about it on my end. |
| 13:33.46 | nevcairiel | one dbc i use to export the data to one of my addons to uncover hidden map areas, and another I just use as a reference to verify my ingame data gathering using the API matches what I would think it should |
| 13:36.59 | foxlit | heh, that correction was wrong. |
| 13:38.02 | foxlit | "are not are" just looks so weird. |
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| 14:32.22 | karl_w_w | https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kMfggshW7bg |
| 14:32.24 | karl_w_w | fan |
| 14:32.26 | karl_w_w | tastic |
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| 14:58.20 | mckenziemc | hugs Cairenn. |
| 14:58.38 | Cairenn | hugs mckenziemc |
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| 16:12.15 | VIad | karl_w_w: rule 63 |
| 16:22.22 | karl_w_w | VIad, day 2! https://www.twitch.tv/siractionslacks/ |
| 16:22.34 | VIad | I love siractionslacks. thanks |
| 16:23.18 | VIad | karl_w_w: it's the call of duty mw2 music in the background |
| 16:23.29 | VIad | my hans zimmer |
| 16:25.04 | karl_w_w | ooooooh |
| 16:25.11 | VIad | by* |
| 16:25.15 | VIad | might be a remix |
| 16:25.15 | karl_w_w | rise of the tomb raider directx 12 support is out |
| 16:25.28 | VIad | the water effects gon be fps dropping |
| 16:25.34 | Fisker | tacklehugs Lopeppeppy into space for free |
| 16:26.29 | karl_w_w | I was kinda half not playing the game cos i was waiting for it |
| 16:26.59 | nevcairiel | waiting for something that doesnt change the game itself |
| 16:27.59 | karl_w_w | how the game runs is part of the game itself |
| 16:28.12 | nevcairiel | dx12 doesnt help on potatos |
| 16:28.32 | karl_w_w | ** SysInfo ** Client: HexChat 2.10.2 (x64) ** OS: Microsoft Windows 10 Home ** CPU: Intel(R) Core(TM) i5-6600K CPU @ 3.50GHz (3.00 GHz) ** RAM: 16331 MB Total (13085 MB Free) ** VGA: NVIDIA GeForce GTX 980 Ti ** Uptime: 3.40 Hours ** |
| 16:34.54 | nevcairiel | dont think performance changed much for me, still high profile if i want to get consistent 60fps+ |
| 16:35.10 | nevcairiel | probably more beneficial for people with slower cpus |
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| 16:40.07 | karl_w_w | huh, I ran the new benchmark on each, and the average frame rate is very close but the lowest frame rate is much better in dx12 |
| 16:40.14 | Lopeppeppy | Good morning, Fisker-boo. Happy freakin' Friday! |
| 16:40.20 | Fisker | yes |
| 16:40.25 | Fisker | fridays are the best |
| 16:40.48 | nevcairiel | karl_w_w: make sure to run it twice for each config at least to allow it to cache resources |
| 16:41.01 | nevcairiel | that benefits the min framerate most |
| 16:41.26 | karl_w_w | yeah |
| 16:42.27 | karl_w_w | new ambient occlusion setting wont stick though |
| 16:45.18 | karl_w_w | ah it doesnt work in dx12 yet |
| 16:45.50 | nevcairiel | you mean HBAO+? |
| 16:46.08 | Gethe | 2 |
| 16:46.23 | nevcairiel | oh, VXAO |
| 16:46.23 | karl_w_w | VXAO |
| 17:15.36 | karl_w_w | yeah im getting like 20% better minimum fps in dx12 |
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| 18:24.33 | *** join/#wowuidev Sajaki (~Sajaki@153.96-64-87.adsl-dyn.isp.belgacom.be) |
| 18:36.42 | VIad | hmm... does anyone remember the deletion shortcut for the run history? I remember there was an easy way to do this like, control+delete while having the line in the history selected, but for the love of god cant get it to work :/ |
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| 19:10.42 | karl_w_w | dont think there is one VIad |
| 19:10.47 | karl_w_w | you're going crazy |
| 19:11.12 | karl_w_w | unless you created a shortcut to delete the registry entries, that is possible |
| 19:12.52 | VIad | :( |
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| 20:08.04 | karl_w_w | I'm kinda sad that I never saw hale-bopp, or if I did I don't remember it |
| 20:10.25 | Mr_Rabies | it wasn't anything too special, tbh |
| 20:11.22 | Mr_Rabies | it had a huge vapor cloud or whatever, but that's about it |
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| 20:20.06 | karl_w_w | nevcairiel, VXAO wasn't working, they released a new patch. it is actually really gorgeous. bit more demanding than HBAO+ though |
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| 21:31.30 | relaxok | VIad: "<VIad> I guess issue with xml is it needs globals if you want to pass it functions" -- not sure if this is what you're getting at, but event handlers no longer need globally defined functions.. they can have a "method" handler, so like you call BlahFrame.OnLoad(...) rather than BlahFrame_OnLoad(...).. its defined with "method" instead of "function" in Scripts |
| 21:33.47 | nevcairiel | that doesnt really work with OnLoad, since you dont have a chance to define the method before OnLoad executes |
| 21:40.39 | VIad | nevcairiel: even if you use xml to include a lua file? |
| 21:40.53 | VIad | like prepend the include on top of the xml before using the lua code in the xml below |
| 21:40.54 | nevcairiel | think about it some more |
| 21:40.54 | relaxok | nevcairiel: sorry bad example |
| 21:41.07 | relaxok | OnUpdate |
| 21:41.14 | VIad | I dont really use much xml and loading lua from there, just assumed if it read from top to bottom :p |
| 21:41.21 | nevcairiel | yeah it works iwth all other scripts |
| 21:41.50 | Shirik | so EQ Next got canceled |
| 21:50.15 | zenzelezz | Shirik: source? |
| 21:50.52 | Shirik | just search "eq next" on google news and take your pick :P |
| 21:51.01 | Shirik | I don't know which sources you trust and which you don't |
| 21:51.11 | Gnarfoz | the game developer itself is quite trustworthy. |
| 21:51.11 | MiRai | https://www.daybreakgames.com/news/daybreak-president-community-letter-everquest-next-2016 |
| 21:51.19 | Shirik | I guess this is a pretty good source yes |
| 21:51.20 | Shirik | lol |
| 21:52.48 | zenzelezz | I'd say I'm surprised, but it would be a lie |
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| 22:55.33 | foxlit | on a mildly related topic, mixins are annoying. |
| 22:57.30 | foxlit | (because they make hooking default behaviour annoying, as you now have to look at every instantiation instead of replacing a single global) |
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