| 00:02.08 | fewyn | which one of you broke the alpha servers |
| 00:02.10 | fewyn | cough it up! |
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| 00:08.53 | Mr_Rabies | i really, really hope they fix some of the social issues of lfr with 6.0 |
| 00:09.08 | Mr_Rabies | there's some jokester who keeps pulling bosses as soon as they get to them, regardless of who's there |
| 00:09.46 | Mr_Rabies | i think pulling bosses in flex should require 5 people initiating combat, then it announcing the 5 that started it |
| 00:10.38 | Gnarfoz | tanks are automatically marked in LFR anyway, let only them pull :D |
| 00:11.19 | Mr_Rabies | that too |
| 00:11.39 | Amarande | Mr_Rabies: and priests using the grip of life to pull people *into* fire? |
| 00:11.51 | Mr_Rabies | basically they need to super minimize griefing ability in lfr |
| 00:11.55 | plaw | it's not like there are encounters that HAVE to start with (eg) a hunter misdirect etc. |
| 00:11.58 | Mr_Rabies | it's clear the community isn't capable of handling itself |
| 00:11.59 | Amarande | and you mean lfr, not flex :) |
| 00:12.13 | Amarande | flex groups are generally built from trade chat, so they ARE a community matter |
| 00:12.22 | Amarande | lfr groupings are forced upon people :S |
| 00:12.23 | Mr_Rabies | er yeah |
| 00:12.28 | Mr_Rabies | i said lfr at first |
| 00:12.42 | Mr_Rabies | i'm literally not playing my alts because i have to do lfr to progress on them at this point |
| 00:12.46 | Mr_Rabies | and i really don't want to |
| 00:12.57 | Amarande | griefing and bad play seem to be staples of LFR sadly, though |
| 00:13.01 | Mr_Rabies | the community is too bad to put up with for the like, 8 hours it takes to run lfr per week |
| 00:13.12 | Amarande | even if there are no griefers, there's still groups being about as competent as last decade's New Jersey Nets |
| 00:13.56 | Amarande | as for the pulling itself, gogogogogogogo mentality is far too ingrained in random groups :( |
| 00:14.03 | Mr_Rabies | it's because if half the group is griefing |
| 00:14.05 | Amarande | it's the same with 5's :S |
| 00:14.06 | Mr_Rabies | why even bother trying |
| 00:14.09 | Mr_Rabies | i'm talking in irc during a boss fight |
| 00:14.12 | Mr_Rabies | becuase i no longer care |
| 00:14.33 | Amarande | at least mop 5's aren't too hostile to gogogogo style though |
| 00:14.46 | Mr_Rabies | also a good 30% of the group doesn't know english in this lfr sooooo |
| 00:14.54 | Amarande | it was a real problem back in the day for healers, because you were forced to pop your mana cooldowns simply to have mana for the next trash encounter because of the leeroy happy tank |
| 00:15.02 | Mr_Rabies | we couldn't explain the fights if they didn't know them |
| 00:15.13 | Amarande | and if it was something like early cata heroics where the bosses were straining enough on healer mana as it was ... :S |
| 00:15.33 | Amarande | but e.g., if you were a resto druid? no food for you, use your innervate :P |
| 00:15.53 | Mr_Rabies | i yearn for the day that innervate is permanently gone |
| 00:16.02 | Mr_Rabies | it's a garbage spell |
| 00:16.11 | Mr_Rabies | my raid always asks me to put it on our healers when it's literally 5k mana |
| 00:16.19 | Amarande | I think it's restricted to the druid only or some such for 6.0, if I recall my hazy recollection of druid patch notes |
| 00:16.22 | Mr_Rabies | i've explained it a billion times |
| 00:16.31 | Mr_Rabies | that it's less than worthless for me to do it |
| 00:16.39 | Mr_Rabies | it's actually hurting us for me to do it |
| 00:16.41 | Amarande | and the mop mana changes may have made it useless this xpack, yeah |
| 00:16.51 | Mr_Rabies | since it costs two global cooldowns i could be using for dps |
| 00:16.54 | Mr_Rabies | as well as wasting energy |
| 00:17.11 | Amarande | in cata, wrath, and bc, it was an important cooldown, and people were too stupidly insistent on fast dungeons to let druids drink so they wouldn't have to blow it |
| 00:17.31 | Simca | innervate is gone in 6.0 as of last notes |
| 00:17.56 | Amarande | I'm not sure why wow players are more insistent on fast dungeons than in other mmos |
| 00:18.07 | Amarande | I'm guessing it's something to do with how the rewards are structured, though |
| 00:18.36 | Amarande | e.g. in SW:TOR, there are plenty of ways to get commendations, you don't necessarily *have to* run instance after instance |
| 00:19.12 | Amarande | in LOTRO, the same Marks and Medallions are found practically whatever instance (even solo ones) you feel like doing, Seals are only from raids (but that includes Raid Skirmishes) and don't seem as important as raid points in most other MMOs |
| 00:19.22 | Amarande | (plus in LOTRO the best weapons are not dropped in raids at all) |
| 00:20.18 | Amarande | whereas in WoW I suppose you get burned out enough to want everything to just go as fast as possible because only the end reward points for the dungeon are any worth and EVERYTHING pretty much depends on them till you start to raid :S |
| 00:20.59 | Amarande | and it seems to be an awfully common thing among the average wow player to not really care about the content itself, just the rewards :| |
| 00:21.19 | Amarande | I don't get that ... if you don't care about the actual game you're playing why are you playing the game LOL :) |
| 00:22.46 | Amarande | but it seems common. e.g. scholo and strath have always been two of the most atmospheric dungeons in the game, but till their level was lowered in cata, basically nobody wanted to run them, they only cared about dungeons that actually gave character-improving rewards (which at that level you got from hellfire quests instead) |
| 00:26.23 | Amarande | actually mog has been changing that mentality somewhat, but it still seems to remain a common thread ... in other MMOs it's the norm to do instances for fun, in WoW it seems the exception and that all time should be put as efficiently into character improvement as possible |
| 00:27.01 | Amarande | there are, of course, people who stop and smell the roses (I certainly do), but I'm not sure why WoW tends to have that serious business thing about it for so many :p |
| 00:28.14 | Amarande | (or for that matter, why people ever take a video game that seriously to begin with *shrug* ... we play these things for fun, don't we? :) |
| 00:28.18 | nevcairiel | mostly because people have done it 50 times, there is only so many roses to smell |
| 00:28.43 | Mr_Rabies | Amarande: because dungeons are required to some extent even when you're in heroic gear |
| 00:28.49 | nevcairiel | you can appreciate the instance the first and the second time, after its just a run |
| 00:29.00 | Mr_Rabies | by that point you've already cleared every instance so many times you just want to be done with them |
| 00:29.17 | Mr_Rabies | thankfully valor will be gone in 6.0 |
| 00:29.25 | Mr_Rabies | then it will come back when queue times for 5 mans go >1hr |
| 00:29.32 | Amarande | yeah, it could be that the solution is to expand the number of ways to get justice (which MoP started out with valor from dailies) |
| 00:29.47 | Amarande | so that you don't *have to* do 5-mans to get meaningful rewards |
| 00:29.55 | Mr_Rabies | they're removing valor and justice entirely in 6.0 so |
| 00:30.08 | Amarande | ahhh, so it's going to be old school style then |
| 00:30.13 | Mr_Rabies | it'll be back in 6.1 i'm sure |
| 00:30.14 | Amarande | gear up from dungeon, go raid |
| 00:30.20 | Mr_Rabies | when lfr and dungeon queues explode |
| 00:30.43 | Amarande | yeah, that's the one drawback of the old school format |
| 00:30.51 | Amarande | eventually, people who get in too late in the cycle have nowhere to go |
| 00:30.54 | Amarande | happened to me in BC |
| 00:31.27 | Amarande | then again, BC had kara guilds right up till the very end, so it probably isn't quite that apocalyptically bad |
| 00:31.29 | Mr_Rabies | i think they've forgotten why certain mechanics were implemented in the first place, but we'll see |
| 00:31.39 | Amarande | like, gods forbid people have to make friends in a social game! |
| 00:31.56 | Mr_Rabies | i hate that you have to run stuff you've run a million times just to make the game playable for lower-progressed people |
| 00:32.00 | Mr_Rabies | but that's currently part of the design |
| 00:32.07 | Mr_Rabies | maybe once it goes away they'll find another way |
| 00:32.12 | Amarande | (main reason I didn't get in a kara guild was because not only did I hit 70 so late, but back then I worked evenings a lot more often and couldn't find a guild that matched my availability) |
| 00:32.21 | Mr_Rabies | (like stop doing 5 mans and make all the low-tier stuff scenarios) |
| 00:32.43 | Amarande | or even further extend the scalable instance idea, like Turbine does |
| 00:33.06 | Mr_Rabies | do what? |
| 00:33.10 | Amarande | in LOTRO, skirmishes can be played with 1, 2, 3, 6, or 12 (normal party size there is 6 and raids are 12/24, though there are only a couple of 24-mans) |
| 00:33.30 | Amarande | the dungeon scales (and not only that, but scales to any character level pretty much, down to a minimum level that differs per instance) |
| 00:33.36 | Mr_Rabies | honestly i'd rather they just not have 5 man dungeons anymore, i think they're antiquated |
| 00:33.47 | nevcairiel | i like 5 mans |
| 00:34.20 | nevcairiel | i also like that they are bringing back max level normal dungeons, which also allows them to make max level heroics a bit more challenging |
| 00:34.22 | jleclanche | http://tonsky.me/blog/reinventing-git-interface/ |
| 00:34.32 | jleclanche | the guy talks about grow-only repos like hes never heard of mercurial |
| 00:34.40 | Amarande | yeah, I like that idea |
| 00:34.45 | Amarande | and you have to prove you have a clue before you can do heroics, too |
| 00:34.59 | Amarande | at least with strangers |
| 00:35.25 | Amarande | that could backfire, but not in the worst of ways |
| 00:35.39 | Mr_Rabies | nevcairiel: will you like them when the queues are an hour? |
| 00:36.04 | nevcairiel | well, they are not :p |
| 00:36.28 | Amarande | (backfire scenario: people, especially on alts since doing gateway content over and over can get tedious, especially if you have to do it on two roles per character, will simply decide eventually to skip the proving grounds and just stick to guild groups, taking people who might otherwise queue randoms out of the pool and extending queues) |
| 00:36.52 | Amarande | I'm not saying passing silver would be HARD |
| 00:37.05 | Amarande | I'm saying that presumably you would have to do it on every alt, and for both roles on every alt dual specced for two roles |
| 00:37.14 | nevcairiel | jleclanche: no idea how mercurial factors in there, but fact is you can actually delete stuff in git, just unreference it and run git gc, and it will disappear eventually :p |
| 00:37.14 | Amarande | which is probably going to seem like tedious busywork to many folks |
| 00:37.22 | Amarande | especially when they can just ask four guildies to go with them and bypass it |
| 00:37.23 | jleclanche | nevcairiel: I'm aware |
| 00:37.35 | jleclanche | nevcairiel: mercurial factors in because you *cant* do that in mercurial |
| 00:38.34 | Amarande | actually sometimes I kinda get the impression Blizzard is trying to discourage alts, but that might be going a little too far as yet |
| 00:38.45 | jleclanche | yes |
| 00:38.49 | jleclanche | they dont want you to play their game |
| 00:39.01 | Amarande | jleclanche: as opposed to focusing on a single main character |
| 00:39.14 | jleclanche | you're completely right and I'm agreeing with you |
| 00:39.17 | nevcairiel | the wild ramblings of Amarande are really getting boring, its the same story every other day |
| 00:39.23 | jleclanche | blizzard wants you to spend your entire life on one character |
| 00:39.27 | nevcairiel | cant you invent new stuff to ramble about |
| 00:39.28 | jleclanche | get so bored |
| 00:39.30 | nevcairiel | we need entertainment |
| 00:39.47 | jleclanche | so bored that you'll actually play something like pacman just for fun |
| 00:40.49 | jleclanche | Amarande: I would think this would not need to be said but apparently it does: Game developers (who are in it for the money) have no vested interest in forcing their players to play one specific way over another |
| 00:40.56 | Mr_Rabies | they probably will be over an hour when all the tanks/healers are done running them, nevcairiel |
| 00:41.13 | nevcairiel | Mr_Rabies: i'm a healer, i'll be fine |
| 00:41.17 | Mr_Rabies | one adjustment could be making them 6 man or making them require a tank OR a healer |
| 00:41.35 | Mr_Rabies | not both |
| 00:41.49 | nevcairiel | in any case, why would that be different to any previous expansion, never had real problems there before |
| 00:42.27 | Mr_Rabies | because secondary gear points are going away |
| 00:42.29 | Amarande | Mr_Rabies: hey, the counterbalance to that is when people level dps, realise the queues are terrible and decide to start a tank or healer |
| 00:42.29 | jleclanche | i'd like to see l4d2 style healbots/tankbots when one cant be found |
| 00:42.32 | jleclanche | but they'd have to be good |
| 00:42.51 | Amarande | I'd like to see a switch to a SW:TOR type mainstat paradigm |
| 00:42.55 | nevcairiel | you could probably drag around dps bots, and maybe even heal bots, but tanks seem complicated |
| 00:42.59 | Amarande | it would help encourage people to use multiple specs a lot more |
| 00:43.06 | jleclanche | nevcairiel: nah you can cheat |
| 00:43.20 | nevcairiel | .. since tanks usually lead the group |
| 00:43.25 | jleclanche | so? |
| 00:43.32 | jleclanche | put it on a path, regularly cast a mass taunt |
| 00:43.39 | jleclanche | can easily script ready checks |
| 00:43.41 | Amarande | in SW:TOR, your main stat is always the same for a class, regardless of spec, so you never need 2 completely different mainstat gear loadouts to be able to offspec (except maybe in raids) |
| 00:43.58 | nevcairiel | Amarande: you do realize you no longer need that in WoD? |
| 00:44.07 | nevcairiel | gear automatically switches stats |
| 00:44.25 | nevcairiel | like i said the other day, read the fucking patch notes :P |
| 00:44.29 | jleclanche | wow does seem to play catch up a lot the past few expansions |
| 00:44.35 | Amarande | in WoW, let's say you're an enhancement shaman ... you have a huge disincentive to dual spec, because your agi gear is useless for ele or resto (you need int gear) |
| 00:44.43 | kd3 | ... |
| 00:45.08 | Amarande | or say you're a non-holy pally and the group needs a healer ... gonna have to hunt down a whole other set of plate because now you need int not str |
| 00:45.11 | nevcairiel | jleclanche: well it goes in both directions, wow develops some things that others take, and the other way around |
| 00:45.17 | jleclanche | Amarande: Dude, stuff it. |
| 00:45.22 | Amarande | nevcairiel: huh I didn't see that one in the patch notes |
| 00:45.38 | Amarande | I did see that stats not worthful to your class are greyed out on gear and the game doesn't even bother adding them anymore |
| 00:45.42 | jleclanche | its been talked about for several months |
| 00:45.44 | kd3 | http://wowpedia.org/Patch_6.0.1#Itemization_changes |
| 00:45.46 | Amarande | but I didn't see anything about stats altering themselves on spec change |
| 00:45.59 | kd3 | read the entire section there |
| 00:46.18 | Amarande | ah, everything is double statted, it doesn't "switch" as such |
| 00:46.24 | jleclanche | nevcairiel: what original things did wow develop since, say, wlk? |
| 00:46.28 | Simca | they added 3 new stats |
| 00:46.40 | Simca | Agility/Intellect, Strength/Agility, and Strength/Intellect |
| 00:47.10 | Simca | for Leather/Mail, Tank/DPS 1-handers, and Plate (in that order) |
| 00:47.14 | Amarande | iiiiiinteresting |
| 00:47.16 | nevcairiel | Amarande: its not "double statted", it 1:1 converts the primary stat to match your spec, from agi to int, from int to str, or whatever you need |
| 00:47.49 | nevcairiel | secondarys stay the same, so if you want 100% out of both specs, you might still need alternate choices, but you are not forced to |
| 00:48.24 | Simca | well, it kind of is double statted, and they got around that by making it so that agi/int does literally nothing for strength users now (and vice versa) |
| 00:48.38 | Simca | character sheet value doesn't even increase for agility ever |
| 00:48.48 | Simca | if you're warrior, for example |
| 00:49.16 | nevcairiel | i wonder which stat it would show to a warrior, agi or int |
| 00:49.30 | Semlar | why not neither? |
| 00:49.39 | kd3 | they'd both be greyed out? |
| 00:49.47 | Simca | that's actually a good question |
| 00:49.50 | nevcairiel | isnt it supposed to only show one |
| 00:49.56 | nevcairiel | and greyed out at that |
| 00:50.10 | Simca | it'd probably pick agility because it was first and show it greyed out but i'm not sure |
| 00:51.00 | nevcairiel | which class is even strength/agi? |
| 00:51.26 | nevcairiel | somehow all the hybrids strike me as int classes |
| 00:51.35 | Semlar | feral druids? |
| 00:51.36 | Simca | none - it's currently on weapons only, like 1-hand maces |
| 00:51.46 | Simca | so rogues can the same weapons as fury warriors or whatever |
| 00:51.47 | nevcairiel | Semlar: nah all agi since a few expansions |
| 00:51.49 | Simca | can use* |
| 00:51.53 | nevcairiel | Simca: ah that makes sense |
| 00:52.18 | Semlar | i'm moderately sure ferals got attack power from strength |
| 00:52.21 | Amarande | yeah, used to be hunters and feral druids were strength/agi hybrids |
| 00:52.38 | Amarande | though I'm pretty sure strength plate got SOME benefit from agi back in the day |
| 00:52.47 | nevcairiel | Semlar: they do, but not more then from agi, so you use agi since it also gives you crit |
| 00:52.54 | Amarande | thank the gods, because Wrath had absolutely zero in the way of strength dps 1-handers for frost DKs |
| 00:52.56 | Simca | yeah, agi --> crit conversion got nerfed a lot in one of the later expansions |
| 00:52.58 | Semlar | agility used to add crit for things like ret paladins |
| 00:52.58 | Amarande | you had to settle for agi ones |
| 00:53.00 | nevcairiel | in effect, ferals are agi classes |
| 00:53.12 | kd3 | agi/int->crit is gone in 6.0 |
| 00:53.13 | Amarande | (all of the str 1-handers in wrath were for tanks, IIRC, every single one) |
| 00:53.18 | Semlar | well, yes, ferals are agility classes but they still benefited from strength |
| 00:53.19 | Simca | yeah, that too kd3 |
| 00:53.20 | nevcairiel | they used to be strength classes back in the day |
| 00:53.25 | nevcairiel | but that was aeons ago |
| 00:53.38 | nevcairiel | like, vanilla times |
| 00:53.48 | nevcairiel | not sure when exactly it changed |
| 00:53.57 | nevcairiel | (back then strength gave 2 ap and agi only 1) |
| 00:54.04 | Amarande | I suppose the next step is to simply do away with the triad of main stats altogether and just unify them into one, obviating the need for grey-outs or anything |
| 00:54.06 | Semlar | i know they still got attack power from strength in cata |
| 00:54.10 | Semlar | i don't know about MoP |
| 00:54.12 | Amarande | not sure what it would be called though. "power" maybe? |
| 00:54.20 | nevcairiel | Semlar: they did, but no longer 2 |
| 00:54.34 | jleclanche | http://0pointer.de/blog/projects/stateless.html I really like the sysusers bit. excellent stuff for packagers. this is fascinating |
| 00:54.56 | Amarande | since it sounds like the trend is for mainstat to have an identical benefit in all cases, whatever the class and stat actually are |
| 00:55.00 | Amarande | might as well just merge them into one and call it Power |
| 00:55.04 | nevcairiel | Semlar: so ferals could use strength if they wanted to, it just wasn't the best stat ever |
| 00:55.24 | jleclanche | We want to enable new kinds of OS installers that simply deserialize a vendor OS /usr snapshot into a new file system, install a boot loader and reboot, leaving all first-time configuration to the next boot. |
| 00:55.26 | jleclanche | this is so sexy |
| 00:55.33 | Simca | wasn't like TBC where greens "of the Bear" were good for tanking |
| 00:55.58 | nevcairiel | something primitive like that sounds more like vanilla |
| 00:56.38 | Amarande | heh, an ever increasing number of greens become useless as time goes by thanks to stat specialisation changes |
| 00:56.46 | Simca | tank gearing was weird until wrath if you weren't a warrior |
| 00:56.53 | Amarande | like almost anything with spirit + str or spirit + agi |
| 00:57.03 | Amarande | or with two mainstats on it |
| 00:57.12 | Amarande | but hey, that's a nice thing, I'm an enchanter, more worry free dust for me :) |
| 00:57.32 | Amarande | Simca: heh yeah didn't prot pallies use caster weapons in bc? |
| 00:57.43 | Simca | paladins got a weird level of benefit from usign spellpower 1handers even though the white damage was godawful, and the bears' 2 AP from strength made them hoard gear that shouldn't have appealed to them |
| 00:59.02 | Amarande | it had to do with the fact that as a tank, your responsibility was threat, especially aoe threat, more than it was damage of any sort then for the most part |
| 00:59.30 | Amarande | as a pally, you basically NEEDED a few hundred spellpower in order for consecrate to be beefy enough to hold aggro, by comparison your white damage contributed barely anything to tanking ability |
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| 01:01.28 | Amarande | I'm trying to think if there were even any fights in vanilla or BC where the tank's single target damage per se was a big thing |
| 01:01.40 | Amarande | (besides things like Brutallus with ridiculously tight enrage timers where EVERYONE'S single target damage was a big thing) |
| 01:02.05 | Amarande | the first such fight I can think of off the top of my head is Festergut in ICC at the end of Wrath |
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| 01:42.27 | Cairenn | Ressy: sorry, was out - still okay here right now, hasn't been storming all that long yet though |
| 01:51.02 | Amarande | "Undead can now breathe underwater indefinitely." |
| 01:51.16 | Amarande | To balance this, there should be extra murlocs added to all water areas in Tirisfal Glades. *backs away slowly* :) |
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| 03:12.26 | Neffi | http://youtu.be/OeG3dwk8D6w ha |
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| 03:58.13 | Neffi | You guys might be able to help. What's a good resource for learning German? Never really learned a 2nd language before |
| 03:58.28 | Iriel | Neffi: move to germany |
| 03:58.45 | Stanzilla | Neffi: irc |
| 03:58.46 | Stanzilla | :D |
| 03:58.51 | Neffi | heh. I figured maybe 10 years down the line I will, Iriel |
| 03:59.17 | Stanzilla | german is very weird |
| 03:59.18 | Thunder_Child | Free or Pay? |
| 03:59.44 | Thunder_Child | My cousin learned German and for part of it she used Rosetta Stone. |
| 03:59.50 | Neffi | Thunder_Child: Preferably free, if it's doable to self-teach. I wouldn't be averse to paying for teaching, but I would have to hold off |
| 03:59.55 | Torhal | Neffi: Stanzilla isn't the first German I've encountered who said German is weird. |
| 03:59.57 | Thunder_Child | But yea, it is a hard language to learn. |
| 04:00.12 | Neffi | Torhal: Every German I've encountered said German is weird |
| 04:01.03 | Stanzilla | it just has way to many special cases to be easily learned |
| 04:01.29 | Thunder_Child | I listened to an hour long conversation between two people about the weird parts of German, and they could have gone longer. |
| 04:01.31 | Torhal | You mean, like the grammar structure? |
| 04:01.32 | Neffi | I'm not opposed to a challenge. I don't expect to be fluent in the short term |
| 04:01.46 | Stanzilla | Torhal: yes and how many words breaks the rules |
| 04:01.51 | Thunder_Child | or like participle |
| 04:02.10 | Thunder_Child | or rather, I should say tense. |
| 04:02.17 | Stanzilla | -s |
| 04:02.57 | Neffi | Alternately, I'd like to learn Norwegian as well and I dont really care which I tackle first |
| 04:03.12 | Torhal | Just learn Gerwegian. |
| 04:03.18 | Neffi | o.o |
| 04:03.23 | Stanzilla | chine is probably more useful |
| 04:03.25 | Stanzilla | *chinese |
| 04:03.50 | Neffi | Probably. Spanish probably is too, being an American. Meh |
| 04:03.51 | Thunder_Child | for when they take over the world |
| 04:04.02 | Stanzilla | spanis is easy, too |
| 04:04.09 | Torhal | Spenis? |
| 04:04.15 | Stanzilla | my keyboard hates me today |
| 04:04.16 | Stanzilla | SPANISH |
| 04:04.53 | *** part/#wowuidev Seerah (~RyanNL@adsl-98-66-2-156.mem.bellsouth.net) |
| 04:05.36 | Stanzilla | an no, it was not because I took latin, too |
| 04:05.39 | Stanzilla | I fucking sucked at that |
| 04:06.24 | Torhal | How do you know? Nobody speaks it. |
| 04:06.35 | Stanzilla | we had to :p |
| 04:06.41 | Torhal | o.O |
| 04:07.03 | Torhal | How do you speak something when there are no living speakers around to say how badly you fucked it up? :D |
| 04:07.25 | Stanzilla | latin has a certain melody in which you have to speak |
| 04:07.27 | Stanzilla | it's super weird |
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| 04:07.57 | Neffi | Well I'm sure investigation into its derivatives help academic types figure out pronounciation |
| 04:08.19 | Stanzilla | there are written down rules on that |
| 04:11.20 | Stanzilla | they made us sing that |
| 04:11.24 | Stanzilla | that was so terrible |
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| 08:20.41 | airtonix | jleclanche: man... there's a lot of words in that blog post |
| 08:28.06 | karl_w_w | why airtonix |
| 08:34.11 | airtonix | because reasons |
| 08:41.17 | airtonix | karl_w_w: also firstworldproblems |
| 09:40.54 | jleclanche | AMD Reportedly Plans To Bring Mantle To Linux, Calls Mantle An Open-Source API |
| 09:40.55 | jleclanche | hmm |
| 09:45.57 | Mr_Rabies | really hope mantle takes off if it's as good as its marketing leads the internet to believe |
| 09:46.26 | Mr_Rabies | if the xbox one and ps4 support it, then it probably will take off |
| 09:46.30 | Workfoz | it already failed, good luck |
| 09:46.42 | Mr_Rabies | this coming from a huge nvidia fan |
| 09:47.21 | Mr_Rabies | i like their cards and software, but since they have no real competition, they can get away with a lot of shit, just like intel |
| 09:47.33 | Mr_Rabies | fractional increases per generation, etc |
| 09:48.01 | Workfoz | except that they looked at Mantle, thought "wait, we can reduce directx overhead, too" and then did so like 3 weeks later, by quite a bit, and without breaking compatibility/inventing a new API |
| 09:50.46 | Workfoz | (and at the highest end, how do they not have competition? AMD's R290X is neck-and-neck with nvidia's GTX 780Ti) |
| 09:51.03 | Workfoz | (don't have time to look at all market segments right now :D) |
| 09:53.24 | Mr_Rabies | i'm not 100% up on the market but does it compare in real testing or just in benchmarking stuff? |
| 09:53.52 | Mr_Rabies | for the longest time, amd cards would look great on paper but not really perform better in many games |
| 09:56.05 | Mr_Rabies | urgh i hate how my session expires on undermine journal so often :( |
| 09:56.15 | Mr_Rabies | gotta relogin to let ketarin update it for me |
| 09:57.37 | Workfoz | (I didn't even say "better", just "neck-and-neck" - and I don't see how you could get comparable numbers from something that is not at least scripted game run-throughs; synthetic benchmarks are quite useless, I agree) |
| 09:58.17 | Mr_Rabies | yeah, i also said "does it compare" when talking about the latest gen |
| 09:58.34 | Mr_Rabies | but then started talking about doing "better" so it got confusing |
| 10:23.23 | karl_w_w | there was a period last year when AMD had far and away the better card in some price brackets |
| 10:23.46 | karl_w_w | so I wouldn't call it no real competition |
| 10:32.27 | jleclanche | kd3: http://alexanderbrazie.blogspot.co.uk/2014/06/postmortem-5-ghazan-and-swamplord.html |
| 10:32.30 | jleclanche | i hope you follow those |
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| 10:46.29 | Simca | http://us.battle.net/wow/en/forum/topic/13087818929?page=6#114 super exciting |
| 10:49.33 | Mr_Rabies | that explains why you'd suddenly just die even if you saw a heal effect land on you |
| 10:49.42 | Mr_Rabies | the actual heal itself hadn't landed yet |
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| 11:39.15 | nevcairiel | That sounds neat simca |
| 11:44.44 | nevcairiel | the inconsistency between predicted healing and players dying anyway was always quite annoying |
| 11:46.08 | jleclanche | http://www.theonion.com/articles/shocking-game-of-thrones-finale-concludes-with-arr,36286/ |
| 11:46.40 | nevcairiel | old jerome |
| 11:46.46 | jleclanche | your face is so old |
| 11:47.04 | nevcairiel | nonsense, I just got a new one |
| 11:49.32 | zenzelezz | or you're really a faceless one |
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| 12:57.03 | *** topic/#wowuidev is http://pastebin.com || 5.4.x ToC: 50400 || #WoWUIDev-commits: CIA & JIRA bots reporting || Battletags: http://goo.gl/2bm7n || This channel is logged, via purl || my biggest concern was its width, but I think I can get used to that - Shirik |
| 12:58.59 | jleclanche | http://uncrunched.com/2014/06/17/microsoft-paying-bloggers-to-write-about-internet-explorer/ |
| 12:59.03 | jleclanche | that sure backfired quickly |
| 12:59.09 | jleclanche | https://twitter.com/search?q=%23IEbloggers |
| 12:59.45 | jleclanche | Id like to be a fly on the wall of that third party when they next talk to MS. |
| 13:07.23 | Maldivia | it's not like it's something new to pay bloggers to write about their product... |
| 13:09.13 | jleclanche | Maldivia: no, but its immensely stupid to do that when you're microsoft, your product is universally hated, and on top of that to use a twitter hashtag |
| 13:09.17 | jleclanche | the recipe to go viral the wrong way |
| 13:09.38 | jleclanche | go techcrunch. |
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| 14:03.28 | Fisker | hey Lopeppeppy |
| 14:07.26 | Lopeppeppy | Dance party, Fisker wins! |
| 14:07.35 | Lopeppeppy | does a disco groove around the room. |
| 14:08.05 | Fisker | O_o |
| 14:10.00 | zenzelezz | peppy: http://media-cache-ec0.pinimg.com/736x/ff/2c/3c/ff2c3ca4eb6b5052a420b3ccc605bacf.jpg |
| 14:25.51 | Lopeppeppy | ... I am not doing the disco in the kitchen, that would just be humiliating. :) |
| 14:27.18 | zenzelezz | fine, then kitty must dance alone |
| 14:28.32 | Fisker | Why are you discoing Lopeppeppy ? |
| 14:29.31 | Lopeppeppy | Why would I not disco, Fiskerboo? |
| 14:30.00 | Fisker | idk |
| 14:34.06 | Lopeppeppy | Enter the Haggis! https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RLzdwbFs7oQ |
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| 15:28.59 | kd3 | whee. another exciting half-day in the jury assembly room |
| 15:29.54 | nevcairiel | you're on jury duty, eh |
| 15:30.01 | kd3 | ayup |
| 15:30.55 | kd3 | jleclanche: https://twitter.com/Wowpedia/status/479285057396690944 |
| 15:32.02 | jleclanche | kd3: =) |
| 15:53.41 | pompy | "Apple makes new low-end 1.4GHz iMac official with $1,099 starting price" |
| 15:53.44 | pompy | lol ok Apple |
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| 15:54.31 | nevcairiel | that device is hilarious |
| 15:54.40 | nevcairiel | its practically spare ipad air parts cobled together |
| 15:54.55 | pompy | haha |
| 15:54.56 | nevcairiel | you could probably make it cheaper actually using desktop parts |
| 15:55.03 | nevcairiel | but hey, that would mean new parts! |
| 15:55.17 | nevcairiel | s/ipad/macbook/ |
| 16:11.57 | karl_w_w | if there is a weak wifi signal on channel 1 and a moderate on 6 and a bunch above that what channel should I use? |
| 16:12.09 | karl_w_w | 1, 2, 3? |
| 16:12.12 | kd3 | 11 |
| 16:12.25 | nevcairiel | he said there is a bunch above |
| 16:12.25 | karl_w_w | 11 is chokers |
| 16:12.43 | karl_w_w | chokkers |
| 16:12.46 | kd3 | whatever's got the least abuse happening. 1? |
| 16:13.12 | kd3 | I've got an app on my phone, WiFi analyzer, that shows me what's happening channel-wise |
| 16:13.16 | nevcairiel | if you're really strict, there is only 1, 6 and 11 |
| 16:13.34 | nevcairiel | so if between 1 and 6 its pretty empty and there is only one weak channel at 1, then use 1 |
| 16:14.13 | Unkle | Kaelten your tweeted picture hast Torhal clearly visible on the right-hand side. I saw that before I saw who had tweeted the image. |
| 16:14.16 | karl_w_w | why not use like channel 3? is overlapping with several just worse than only contending with 1? |
| 16:14.24 | kd3 | yes |
| 16:14.37 | nevcairiel | 3 overlaps with 6 already |
| 16:14.44 | nevcairiel | somehow the band designs are terrible |
| 16:14.47 | nevcairiel | with all the overlap |
| 16:14.55 | kd3 | a problem they solved in the 5GHz band |
| 16:15.03 | nevcairiel | but that has other issues instead |
| 16:15.10 | kd3 | yup |
| 16:15.26 | nevcairiel | 5ghz works really worse pretty close to the AP |
| 16:15.32 | nevcairiel | so in small places, its kinda annoying |
| 16:15.54 | nevcairiel | luckily if you're that close to your AP, it can usually drown out most other wifi signals .p |
| 16:16.30 | karl_w_w | if you're that close to your AP you can completely block out other wifi signals |
| 16:16.41 | karl_w_w | by using a cable :P |
| 16:17.26 | nevcairiel | still dont want a cable dangling through the middle of my living room :P |
| 16:26.23 | Shirik | TIL my phone can alert me about nearby wildfires |
| 16:26.37 | Shirik | also TIL after being woken up by a wildfire alert, it is very difficult to go back to sleep |
| 16:27.24 | nevcairiel | lol |
| 16:30.49 | kd3 | well, would you rather be woken up by your phone or a wildfire? |
| 16:41.23 | kd3 | yay summer pop-up thunderstorms. a cell popped up a few miles away from my house and all it's doing is sitting there dropping lightning strikes |
| 16:44.44 | Dagmar | It'll run out of mana. Just give it time. |
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| 17:15.03 | Gnarfoz | [18:14:12] <Unkle> Kaelten your tweeted picture hast Torhal clearly visible on the right-hand side. I saw that before I saw who had tweeted the image. <-- hahaha, same here! |
| 17:15.08 | kd3 | wow |
| 17:15.14 | kd3 | the game of back-to-back goals |
| 17:22.52 | Unkle | Gnarfoz: :D |
| 17:35.37 | Neffi_ | Semlar: https://i.imgur.com/OM4syht.gif |
| 17:36.28 | nevcairiel | so jury duty good for watching the world cup kd3? |
| 17:36.55 | kd3 | nah, I got sent home 2 hours ago because they didn't call my name after waiting for 4 hours |
| 17:37.08 | kd3 | I get to call back after 6 to see if I need to repeat the process again tomorrow |
| 17:38.58 | nevcairiel | i think the jury duty thing is an interesting concept to get a bit more involved in the justice system, we don't really have something similar here anymore |
| 17:40.14 | Neffi_ | Most people hate doing it. But it's pretty deeply ingrained in our system |
| 17:40.51 | Neffi_ | Luckily my experiences were about as eventful as kd3's. I didnt even have to go back a 2nd day |
| 17:41.30 | Gnarfoz | it's been 90 years, nevcairiel :o |
| 17:41.41 | Dagmar | I think so... automatically exempt |
| 17:41.44 | kd3 | eh, they said it may be all week for me. I went on mon and today |
| 17:41.50 | Dagmar | Lawyers just hate people who think |
| 17:41.59 | nevcairiel | Gnarfoz: that doesn't invalidate my statement! |
| 17:42.15 | kd3 | I'm curious how quickly I'll get removed, being an atheist in the bible belt and all |
| 17:42.17 | Gnarfoz | it just puts it into perspective :D |
| 17:42.25 | Neffi_ | kd3: If you discuss the details of the case with me, you might be able to get off! |
| 17:42.26 | Gnarfoz | might I add that was 2 countries ago, too |
| 17:42.27 | Gnarfoz | :D |
| 17:42.48 | Dagmar | kd3: Pretty instantaneously if you immediately start asking careful technical questions or demonstrate a familiarity with rules of evidence collection |
| 17:42.53 | Gnarfoz | (I guess technically 1 country ago, hm) |
| 17:43.29 | nevcairiel | the closest you can get is a schöffengericht, a co-worker at previous-job was doing that, but you have to actually apply for that, you don't get simply called up |
| 17:43.37 | Dagmar | ...or, and this is really a last-ditch thing but it will work... if you even dare mention a thing called "jury nullification". |
| 17:43.52 | kd3 | that'd probably get me a contempt of court charge, knowing my county |
| 17:43.59 | Dagmar | Nope |
| 17:44.01 | Neffi_ | say you think Satan was the real good-guy of the Bible |
| 17:44.23 | Neffi_ | but that might get you burned at the stake |
| 17:44.25 | Dagmar | Jury nullifcation is legal, but it basically never ever happens because lawyers *and* judges hate it |
| 17:44.35 | Gnarfoz | German Wikipedia actually lists "jury nullification" as the most important power of a jury |
| 17:44.54 | Dagmar | If all 12 people decide the charges are bullshit, they can declare the entire process crap and turn the defendant loose immediately. |
| 17:45.20 | Gnarfoz | or they can decide whatever the hell they want, ignoring evidence AND laws |
| 17:45.29 | Gnarfoz | (which sounds a bit over the top o_O) |
| 17:45.31 | Dagmar | No one gets to insist that they have to consider that the defendant is male or whateevr |
| 17:45.39 | nevcairiel | Gnarfoz: well if you can get all of them to agree :p |
| 17:46.17 | Gnarfoz | nevcairiel: it doesn't say that here, but I trust the Americans to know their own funky legal system :P |
| 17:46.39 | Dagmar | Like, if someone killled an intruder who was raping their wife, even if they did it by beating the person into a pimk froth using a small ball-peen hammer, jury nullification could make the _entire_ thing go away |
| 17:46.59 | Dagmar | Not just "justifiable manslaughter with time served and a stern warning" but expungeable |
| 17:47.00 | Neffi_ | I trust the Americans to know their own funky legal system :P <- don't |
| 17:47.20 | Dagmar | So, lawyers don't want that shit mentioned to other members of a jurt |
| 17:47.23 | Dagmar | er jury |
| 17:47.33 | Neffi_ | Most educated Americans don't even know their own legal system |
| 17:47.33 | Dagmar | If they think you're liable to mention it to the other members, they'll send you home |
| 17:48.03 | Gnarfoz | Neffi_: well, that's sad, but I didn't want to be all "lulz Americans!" for no reason :D |
| 17:48.04 | nevcairiel | sounds like a good way to avoid being stuck there for hours |
| 17:49.08 | Neffi_ | I don't know if it's necessary the fault of the citizens, or the fact that our school systems don't necessarily teach a lot of practical things |
| 17:49.51 | Neffi_ | We learn all sorts of stuff about early American history and how our government was intended to function, but comparatively little about contemporary politics and laws |
| 17:53.43 | Unkle | Neffi_: Moving target and all that. |
| 17:54.02 | nevcairiel | thats a bit of a common problem with schools, they don't really seem to have a good balance between practice knowledge and other things. Its certainly important to know about the history of your own country and how everything came to be, but to a point i suppose. |
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| 18:11.41 | Lopeppeppy | "What are the possible consequences of scratched surfaces during an ultra centrifuge run?" |
| 18:12.28 | kd3 | big-$$ kabooms! |
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| 18:17.23 | Fisker | I ate food Lopeppeppy |
| 18:17.26 | Lopeppeppy | Big ba-da-boom. |
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| 18:23.46 | zenzelezz | I really wish TV series would stop being good up until the last episode, then failing |
| 18:24.17 | nevcairiel | but if they were good up until the last episode, whats your problem |
| 18:24.30 | nevcairiel | or you mean the last was bad? |
| 18:24.41 | zenzelezz | that the last one is bad, yes |
| 18:24.51 | zenzelezz | well, "bad" as in "I didn't like" |
| 18:24.57 | nevcairiel | which show are we talking about? |
| 18:25.09 | zenzelezz | in this case, Fargo |
| 18:30.37 | Dagmar | Well, if people would stop going and paying money to see these stupid hipster movies where everyone dies at the end just so it can be "edgy", no matter how much of a fuckup festival it makes the last two hours of plotline, we'd have less of that |
| 18:31.38 | Dagmar | ...or are you complaining they should all just gradually cut back on quality until you stop caring like Heroes did? |
| 18:37.54 | jleclanche | zenzelezz: Woh, shut up - I forgot about fargo. is the finale bad? |
| 18:40.57 | zenzelezz | I don't think I'd objectively call it bad; I was merely unhappy with it considering my hopes |
| 18:42.08 | Gnarfoz | Quassel users... how many unique colours can Quassel assign to different users? |
| 18:42.27 | jleclanche | Gnarfoz: 17 if you count black |
| 18:42.37 | jleclanche | (the 17th is always yours) |
| 18:42.38 | Gnarfoz | so, no better than hexchat? bleh |
| 18:42.47 | jleclanche | i believe its for compat with mirc |
| 18:43.00 | Gnarfoz | fuck mirc |
| 18:43.04 | Gnarfoz | right in the fucking face |
| 18:43.05 | Gnarfoz | :| |
| 18:43.37 | jleclanche | i think too many colors gets a bit unreadable tbh |
| 18:44.46 | Gnarfoz | I think I can easily discern at least double of that |
| 18:44.54 | Gnarfoz | need more unique colour shades :\ |
| 18:45.07 | jleclanche | theres probably a way if you mess with the settings |
| 18:45.17 | jleclanche | but the basic gui gives you 16+1 |
| 18:45.46 | Gnarfoz | for example, Nef_fi, Un_kle, you, dol_by, tek_kub, Al_ram and ~5-10 more all share the same colour: blue |
| 18:46.20 | jleclanche | uh |
| 18:46.24 | jleclanche | thats a retarded algorithm then |
| 18:46.28 | Gnarfoz | it certainly is |
| 18:46.30 | jleclanche | not a specific issue with colors |
| 18:46.32 | Gnarfoz | true |
| 18:46.46 | Gnarfoz | but there's 132 people in here, even the smartes algorithm will have to share colours among people :P |
| 18:47.13 | Gnarfoz | maybe a script/plugin can do it |
| 18:47.16 | jleclanche | you quoted me 16 people with the same color |
| 18:47.23 | Gnarfoz | well, yes. |
| 18:47.31 | Gnarfoz | it does seem to be more than necessary |
| 18:47.37 | Gnarfoz | but I'm using hexchat, not Quassel! |
| 18:47.40 | jleclanche | out of 132 people with 16 colors thats a lot, especially if you count the fact you gave me the active users |
| 18:47.42 | Gnarfoz | it might not use all 16 colours |
| 18:49.14 | Gnarfoz | yeah, it certainly doesn't use orange, neither of the two grays, mh. |
| 18:49.39 | jleclanche | bad algorithm distribution then yeah |
| 18:50.06 | nevcairiel | usually you base that on some kind of hash function based on the name, not for ideal distribution in a channel |
| 18:50.10 | nevcairiel | ie. you want stable colors |
| 18:50.30 | jleclanche | one doesn't exclude the other |
| 18:50.47 | jleclanche | xchat has an excellent hashing algorithm when it comes to coloring names |
| 18:50.58 | nevcairiel | apaprently not |
| 18:51.02 | nevcairiel | or Gnarfoz wouldn't complain |
| 18:51.06 | jleclanche | hexchat is not xchat |
| 18:51.13 | jleclanche | and im guessing they have a different coloring algorithm |
| 18:51.37 | Gnarfoz | no, the colours behaved exactly identical with xchat-wdk, ychat and xchat before that |
| 18:52.05 | zenzelezz | isn't hexchat a fork of xchat? |
| 18:52.09 | Gnarfoz | it is |
| 18:52.19 | Gnarfoz | doesn't mean they can't have replaced the nick colouring algo ;) |
| 18:52.21 | jleclanche | hexchat is a very old fork of xchat, they changed a lot |
| 18:52.28 | Gnarfoz | huh? |
| 18:52.30 | Gnarfoz | very old? no |
| 18:52.37 | Gnarfoz | xchat had no new versions since 2009? |
| 18:52.41 | jleclanche | yes |
| 18:52.49 | jleclanche | and hexchat precedes that by several years |
| 18:52.49 | Gnarfoz | so what's to miss if the fork is 5 years old |
| 18:52.52 | Gnarfoz | what? no |
| 18:52.57 | Gnarfoz | hexchat was xchat-wdk before |
| 18:53.08 | nevcairiel | even if the fork started earlier, you can still take all the upstream changes :p |
| 18:53.19 | Gnarfoz | I certainly don't remember it like that, at least |
| 18:53.21 | jleclanche | nvm |
| 18:53.24 | jleclanche | im thinking of xchat-gnome |
| 18:53.29 | Gnarfoz | phew |
| 18:53.38 | jleclanche | hexchat is apparently from 2012 |
| 18:53.40 | Gnarfoz | disaster avoided |
| 18:53.53 | Gnarfoz | which makes it all the more sad they still only have 16 colours! |
| 18:53.53 | Gnarfoz | :D |
| 18:54.15 | jleclanche | in my day, we had, they called it, "millions of colors"! |
| 18:54.50 | Gnarfoz | hehe |
| 18:54.50 | zenzelezz | Gnarfoz: out of curiosity, if you go to Preferences > Colors and change the second row, do the assigned nick colors change too? |
| 18:54.59 | zenzelezz | don't know if those are part of the selection or not |
| 18:55.04 | nevcairiel | honestly i think its hard enough to find 16 distinct colors that are properly readable in my color scheme |
| 18:55.22 | Gnarfoz | well, they do have different numbers than the upper row, zenzelezz, I shall try |
| 18:55.53 | nevcairiel | you could of course go and sacrifice clear distinction to get more colors, or sacrifice readability... |
| 18:56.07 | Gnarfoz | zenzelezz: they do |
| 18:56.20 | Gnarfoz | neat, I might have 32 usable colours |
| 18:56.32 | Gnarfoz | well, at least more than 16, possibly, seeing that orange was in that list before but wasn't used |
| 18:56.44 | Gnarfoz | time for some Kuler |
| 18:57.10 | Gnarfoz | wasn't there another site that did something similar to Kuler |
| 18:58.02 | jleclanche | http://www.colourlovers.com/ |
| 18:58.02 | jleclanche | http://paletton.com/ |
| 18:58.25 | Gnarfoz | neither of them are the one I was thinking of, but great nonetheless :D |
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| 19:02.53 | Lopeppeppy | When a coworker says loftily, "I'm not aware of any reason for XYZ," it would be rude to reply, "You're not aware because you're an ignorant fuckstick. The reason is ABC." Right? |
| 19:03.13 | zenzelezz | not too rude |
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| 19:21.29 | TC-Work | Lopeppeppy: Yes. But not wrong. |
| 19:21.54 | Lopeppeppy | HR rarely cares about correctness of insults. *tragic sigh* |
| 19:22.09 | TC-Work | Lopeppeppy: Also, I think we found a new contender for your list of shit movies. http://www.imdb.com/title/tt3417334/ |
| 19:22.11 | Shirik | so I had to request a new card from american express because the strip on it was not working anymore |
| 19:22.31 | Shirik | they offer me "US Mail, Jun 21 - Free of charge" or "UPS, Jun 19 - Free of charge" |
| 19:22.39 | Shirik | what is the point of this option? |
| 19:22.48 | TC-Work | You don't trust UPS? |
| 19:22.55 | Lopeppeppy | "must learn to work together" - what, are we teaching the teenagers to fly the plane? Dude, this movie ends when they run out of fuel, how is that a movie? |
| 19:23.00 | TC-Work | or it's a location that UPS can not or will not ship to. |
| 19:23.06 | kd3 | the fast option isn't free for people without your financial outlay? |
| 19:23.19 | Shirik | I don't think amex considers me one of their big spenders |
| 19:23.32 | Lopeppeppy | UPS sometimes has a wicked problem with addresses in apartment complexes. In my last complex I would have chosen US Mail for the option. |
| 19:23.38 | TC-Work | Says the guy who wore out his magnetic strip. |
| 19:23.50 | Shirik | :( |
| 19:23.52 | Shirik | it's a crappy card |
| 19:23.57 | kd3 | eh, he's probably got enough crap in his wallet that'll demagentize a disk drive |
| 19:24.07 | Shirik | heh |
| 19:24.12 | Shirik | yeah that's probably true |
| 19:24.20 | Shirik | but basically I just use the card for groceries and gas |
| 19:26.32 | nevcairiel | spilled some gas on it recently? |
| 19:27.11 | Gnarfoz | or some groceries? |
| 19:28.47 | nevcairiel | wowheads announcement regarding their ad-mishap is great .. "we try to keep our ads clean, but we know we won't succeed, so better run some antivirus when visiting our site", or thats how i read it anyway :p |
| 19:29.49 | A-KO | ^ |
| 19:30.09 | zenzelezz | nevcairiel: what happened? |
| 19:30.18 | kd3 | because they can't say "use adblock to keep yourself safe, just like we do" |
| 19:30.32 | kd3 | http://www.wowhead.com/news=241266/reported-adware-program-on-wowhead |
| 19:30.37 | nevcairiel | apparently one of their ads went a bit malicious trying to install adware or something |
| 19:31.01 | Gnarfoz | just the usual |
| 19:31.11 | Gnarfoz | has happened before, will happen again :D |
| 19:31.15 | foxlit | annoying: ads that redirect to app store on iOS without user interaction. |
| 19:31.21 | foxlit | looking at you, wowinterface. |
| 19:31.32 | nevcairiel | this time they got a warning post on the official wow forums for it :p |
| 19:31.49 | g0urra | retarded: ads that pops up a login prompt because the linked site requires a login. |
| 19:31.49 | foxlit | (also apple, because wtf is it even possible to do that?) |
| 19:32.08 | Stanzilla | foxlit: fixed in iOS 8 beta 2 |
| 19:32.28 | foxlit | “Mythical Unicorn”? |
| 19:32.36 | Stanzilla | I'm serious |
| 19:32.40 | Stanzilla | it was in the changelog |
| 19:32.56 | foxlit | hurray! |
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| 20:21.54 | zenzelezz | "Code Spaces [a code hosting service] has been under DDOS attacks since the beginning of the week, but a few hours ago, the attacker managed to delete all their hosted customer data and most of the backups. They have announced that they are shutting down business." |
| 20:22.08 | zenzelezz | I wonder how that worked with the DDoS |
| 20:24.08 | Amarande | zenzelezz: and for that matter why they resorted to DDoS when they were apparently able to hack the thing to begin with |
| 20:24.26 | Amarande | usually DDoS is the malicious actor's petty frustrated resort when they cannot get an in |
| 20:24.32 | Amarande | hence why IRC is such a magnet for it |
| 20:25.40 | Fisker | Hi Lopeppeppy |
| 20:25.42 | Amarande | of course, the sad thing to wonder is if DDoS ultimately results in there being more actual hackings in the long run :| |
| 20:27.18 | Amarande | as in, if companies will start to feel obligated to leave a small level of vulnerability simply in order to head off such attacks :S |
| 20:27.59 | Amarande | kinda like how you give up the till money and move to damage control so the robber doesn't perforate your staff :P |
| 20:41.27 | Amarande | but yeah, DDoS and THEN hacking seems weird, unless maybe they thought Heartbleed still worked |
| 20:41.53 | Amarande | (I've heard that it was a popular tactic to DoS machines during heartbleed in order to cause them to have to be restarted, putting more important data in the applicable memory) |
| 20:43.32 | relaxok | what is VideoOptionsFrameCategoryFrame? it's referred to in VideoOptionsPanels.lua but is never created |
| 20:44.30 | Amarande | good question ... there's a number of google results referring to it but none seem to explain what it is or does |
| 20:44.45 | Dashkal | Could be as simple as starting the DDoS then while it's running discover/learn how to do a deeper compromise |
| 20:44.47 | Amarande | if it's never created, it might have been a variable created for some purpose at some point that was never used *shrug* |
| 20:45.41 | Amarande | like how in vanilla there were all those items put in that seemed like they were pointing towards a quest to cleanse Ashbringer, but said quest never actually was implemented |
| 20:46.39 | Amarande | but enough to get the impression that they had at some point originally planned to do so, unless Blizzard was REALLY being a bunch of magnificent bastards :) |
| 20:48.05 | Amarande | or the chat gem in Diablo 2 :) |
| 20:48.50 | Amarande | ohhhhhhh yes the chat gem. I don't think it's even countable how many minds were dicked around with by that thing :D |
| 20:50.30 | Simca | relaxok: I'm pretty sure it is created at some point |
| 20:56.07 | relaxok | how would i define a placeholder for table.wipe() if it doesn't exist? |
| 20:56.11 | relaxok | in lua |
| 20:56.40 | Simca | what do you mean a placeholder? |
| 20:56.42 | relaxok | Simca: probably but it's rare to not have every frame created in the lua itself |
| 20:56.49 | relaxok | or to be an xml |
| 20:56.55 | relaxok | created from that |
| 20:57.47 | Simca | the 'categoryframe' ending is appended somewhere |
| 20:58.07 | Simca | ah, yeah |
| 20:58.24 | Simca | there it is, creation of the frame is line 195 in OptionsFrameTemplates.lua in FrameXML |
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| 20:58.51 | Simca | no, that's not creation, that's assignment |
| 20:58.52 | relaxok | ah |
| 20:58.53 | Simca | derp |
| 20:59.06 | Amarande | yay, another remote code execution flash vulnerability |
| 20:59.09 | Simca | self.categoryFrame = _G[name.."CategoryFrame"]; but yeah it's definitely just appended |
| 20:59.10 | Amarande | *sigh* |
| 20:59.44 | relaxok | regarding table wipe.. so, table.wipe doesn't exist in lua, that's a blizzard hack into lua |
| 20:59.53 | relaxok | but i'm wondering how i can define it myself |
| 21:00.03 | relaxok | i dont want to change any lua code |
| 21:00.12 | relaxok | as in lua c code |
| 21:00.23 | Simca | load a lua file with the function before you load anything else |
| 21:00.37 | nevcairiel | table.wipe = function(t) for k in pairs(t) do t[k] = nil end end? |
| 21:00.41 | Simca | function table.wipe(...) print("hi i wipe things") return wiped_table end |
| 21:00.47 | relaxok | ahhhhh |
| 21:00.59 | relaxok | i tried to just register it as a cfunction with the global name table.wipe |
| 21:01.21 | Simca | relaxok: i think i know why're you're having an issue |
| 21:01.49 | Simca | here's the real definition for it - line 379 of OptionsFrameTemplates.xml. it's a virtual template that uses the $parent variable |
| 21:01.50 | Simca | <Frame name="$parentCategoryFrame" inherits="OptionsFrameListTemplate"> |
| 21:02.01 | relaxok | good call, i'm not replacing $parent yet |
| 21:02.06 | relaxok | thanks |
| 21:02.10 | Simca | yup |
| 21:06.25 | relaxok | im so close now |
| 21:10.40 | relaxok | YES |
| 21:10.41 | relaxok | no errors!!! |
| 21:11.30 | relaxok | http://pastie.org/private/qqgjres9wpn4emdczkqaqq |
| 21:13.43 | Dagmar | s/no/no catastrophic/; |
| 21:16.25 | Ackis | aahhahahha my brother is starting his mid-life crisis! muhahhahaha |
| 21:23.28 | Dagmar | So, in other words, he has a much better car than you? |
| 21:25.44 | Ackis | no, he's getting a tattoo |
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| 21:28.27 | *** join/#wowuidev A-KO (as@unaffiliated/a-ko) |
| 21:35.18 | Amarande | hmm, jessie also has the latest 1.6 wine atm, too. dammit. "which distro?" may take an evening *blink* |
| 21:42.30 | kd3 | git clone //some-wine-repo.git ;cd wine; ./configure; make -j6 && make install |
| 21:42.47 | kd3 | or use fedora? |
| 21:43.50 | Amarande | yeah, I'm thinking fedora, then I noticed wine is new enough in jessie as well, so now I'm still pondering |
| 21:44.05 | Amarande | I also have an ubuntu disc burnt, but I don't think I'm going to use that since Canonical sucks :p |
| 21:44.23 | Amarande | heh, I wonder if that's the real reason people are getting pissed over the whole systemd argument |
| 21:44.49 | Amarande | as in, it's not systemd itself people have a problem with, it's that systemd is apparently Canonical's baby and people hate Canonical since the whole "amazon search integration" stunt |
| 21:45.06 | kd3 | systemd is not canonical's baby. upstart is canonical's baby |
| 21:45.16 | Amarande | ah, right |
| 21:45.29 | Amarande | I knew canonical had something to do with the row though, from what I had recalled reading of it |
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| 21:47.49 | Arrowmaster | canonical has people in leadership positions in debian and those people were pushing for upstart as the new default init system while everybody else viewed upstart as worse than sysvinit due to the problems that still persist in it, that was their involvement with the debate |
| 21:48.12 | Kraps | ~ping |
| 21:48.12 | purl | ~pong |
| 21:49.28 | Arrowmaster | first world problems, the audiobook on my phone starts playing everytime i turn on my new car |
| 21:50.00 | Arrowmaster | i should get some NFC tags |
| 21:50.02 | Amarande | Arrowmaster, what's the matter ... you're afraid you'll have to turn in your man card if someone hears you listening to Pride and Prejudice on audiobook? :) |
| 21:50.20 | Gnarfoz | I put one of mine on our office door |
| 21:50.22 | Gnarfoz | today |
| 21:50.35 | Gnarfoz | with an URI to a 10 hour rickroll on it |
| 21:50.47 | Arrowmaster | lol |
| 21:50.59 | Cairenn | Happy Birthday alestane! |
| 21:51.17 | Gnarfoz | (I actually stuck it in one of the corners of an A3 sized QR code I taped to the door at the same time... that one links to 10 hours epic sax guy.) |
| 21:51.32 | Gnarfoz | alestane: happy age increment! |
| 21:51.46 | kd3 | yay, a year closer to death! |
| 21:55.16 | jleclanche | alestane: happy ~n(3.15569e7*9192631770) |
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| 21:57.42 | Amarande | hrm. how similar is fedora's package grabber system to debian's? been a long long while since I've used anything RPM based |
| 21:58.08 | kd3 | it works just as sanely, but without the interactive setup prompts that .debs like to do |
| 21:59.16 | Arrowmaster | that rarely gets used |
| 22:01.13 | Ackis | Amarande: he's not listening to PRide and Prejudice, he has the audio book of Gilbert Godfrey (sp?) reading 50 shades of Grey |
| 22:12.46 | foxlit | Gr, I actually don’t like the idea of having to write a compiler :( |
| 22:13.01 | foxlit | too… much… work. :( |
| 22:17.56 | Amarande | foxlit: custom language? |
| 22:18.16 | Amarande | foxlit: the easy way out is to make the language interpreted, I s'pose :) |
| 22:18.41 | foxlit | no, custom architecture. |
| 22:23.21 | Amarande | heh. this is probably another reason so many things have moved to x64 :) |
| 22:23.36 | Amarande | because, you know, *screw* that having to write a compiler for custom arch step |
| 22:24.13 | Amarande | the folks at sony and microsoft responsible for producing console SDKs have probably died of shock at the lightening of their load |
| 22:27.03 | Amarande | especially the poor sod who had to make the SDK for the PS3, I'd imagine |
| 22:29.35 | Amarande | didn't that thing have some sort of insane amalgamation of processors of a level of horror that Japan probably only otherwise sees in bad tentacle anime? LOL |
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| 23:10.51 | kd3 | grr at running a badblocks test on my pi's sd card |
| 23:12.51 | tz | throughput is wonderfully fast, huh |
| 23:14.34 | kd3 | 25% done, 7:15 elapsed. not /horrible/, but meh |
| 23:17.28 | jleclanche | "On the other hand, you could move to Copenhagen and experience the cheapest Scandinavian capital. ;-) Burgers only $20! Nice flats only $1500-2000/mo!" |
| 23:17.53 | jleclanche | the guy is trying to use sarcasm when those are clearly cambridge prices |
| 23:18.51 | kd3 | and more insult to injury in this game. eesh |
| 23:19.03 | TC-Work | Is 'flat' generic in this case or is it akin to 'studio'? |
| 23:19.14 | jleclanche | Im not quite sure |
| 23:19.24 | jleclanche | in cambridge though thats a small 2 bedroom |
| 23:19.25 | Amarande | jleclanche: lemme guess, flats cost a lot more than 2000 USD a month in Copenhagen |
| 23:19.35 | jleclanche | i doubt it |
| 23:19.43 | TC-Work | That's a 1 bedroom around here |
| 23:19.44 | Amarande | TC-Work: 'flat' tends to refer to an apartment in general in Queen's English |
| 23:19.49 | TC-Work | Depending on the area |
| 23:20.01 | jleclanche | stockholm is supposedly one of the most expensive cities on earth and I'm moving there for a cheaper appartment |
| 23:20.08 | Amarande | mind you, in Manhattan or San Francisco, 2000 USD a month will practically make you be sleeping in drugtown or the streets |
| 23:20.10 | jleclanche | so clearly, fml |
| 23:20.36 | Amarande | the housing market is just effed up in the USA, though |
| 23:20.54 | TC-Work | Sounds like it |
| 23:20.57 | Amarande | seriously, it's cheaper to eat a healthy diet and sleep behind the dumpster than it is to starve to death in the comfort of your own flat |
| 23:21.37 | jleclanche | Amarande: so you're realizing now that housing costs more than food? |
| 23:21.49 | jleclanche | how long ago were you born exactly? |
| 23:21.59 | Amarande | jleclanche: oh, I've known that for a while |
| 23:22.08 | Amarande | however, it is a symptom that the economy is not well :p |
| 23:22.13 | jleclanche | ... no? |
| 23:22.28 | Amarande | or so it would seem on the surface ... apparently a lot of people believe quite the opposite LOL |
| 23:22.41 | jleclanche | its like this everywhere on earth |
| 23:22.47 | Amarande | which is that housing apparently needs to actually be unaffordably expensive for an economy to be considered doing well |
| 23:23.06 | Amarande | if people can actually afford flats, that's seen as "oh no, the real estate market is in a depression and the rest of the economy will follow" |
| 23:23.45 | jleclanche | err |
| 23:24.10 | Amarande | ... which would seem would only follow inasmuch as everything would drop in sticker value because if housing wasn't so damn expensive, practically everything else would be able to cost less as well because people wouldn't need so much money for the landlord, no? |
| 23:24.22 | jleclanche | even in cities with a very high cost of life and low rent (eg. eastern europe/asia), *housing* a single person is a lot more expensive than *feeding* a single person at the same standard of care |
| 23:24.33 | jleclanche | why am i explaining this to you |
| 23:24.50 | Amarande | anyway, yeah, housing will always cost more than food. it's just to make the point of how *insanely* expensive housing is getting these days. |
| 23:25.03 | Amarande | and yet, like I said, people seem to think that the harder it is to afford housing, the *better* the economy is |
| 23:25.23 | jleclanche | you say "people" like that's a metric |
| 23:25.26 | Amarande | when places to live get cheap, it's regarded as a "declining real estate market" and a marker of misery |
| 23:25.30 | TC-Work | jleclanche: Bcause masochism. |
| 23:25.36 | TC-Work | Because* |
| 23:25.42 | jleclanche | you're people (by some standards), yet you dont think that |
| 23:25.45 | Amarande | jleclanche: the kind of people who make actual media commentary on the economy seem to think this, anyway |
| 23:26.17 | jleclanche | the people you're talking about are barely human |
| 23:26.23 | Amarande | mind you, then again, we're talking the USA where where the media is generally far right enough that the Australian government probably loves our newspapers :P |
| 23:26.45 | Amarande | (but hey, why is this surprising ... a lot of it is Murdoch media, and where's Murdoch from? LOL) |
| 23:27.23 | Amarande | heh. the laugh is that the right-wing commentators constantly natter on about "the liberal media" |
| 23:27.42 | jleclanche | I really wonder why people would move to australia |
| 23:28.01 | jleclanche | i dont know if its an exercise in darwinism or it has to be something |
| 23:28.16 | Amarande | jleclanche: good question |
| 23:28.29 | jleclanche | no offense, plaw. |
| 23:28.45 | jleclanche | (and a couple of others i forget) |
| 23:30.20 | plaw | jleclanche: this is one of those exceptions to the rule of my disowning my home state. 'I'm Tasmanian, not Australian' |
| 23:30.27 | Amarande | Let's see, what does Australia have, pretty much ... a horribly thin internet pipe to the rest of the world last I'd heard, Mother Nature trying to kill you at every turn, a government that makes the Tea Party seem as fair and balanced as Fox News implies (and speaking of Fox ...) a coal industry that makes the USA's Koch Bros seem eco-friendly, 110 degrees in the shade in summertime (wait, that comes under mother nature |
| 23:30.27 | Amarande | trying to kill you I think) |
| 23:30.33 | plaw | jleclanche: also, people move to australia to get away from people like you and Amarande :P |
| 23:31.18 | jleclanche | plaw: zing |
| 23:31.24 | Amarande | plaw: any inaccuracies there? :) |
| 23:31.41 | jleclanche | also I forgot airtonix! |
| 23:31.49 | Amarande | (that's 110 American degrees, btw, so 45ish on celsius) |
| 23:31.50 | plaw | we don't have people shooting us and we (vast majority) don't have to deal with snow |
| 23:32.01 | plaw | jleclanche: karl_w_w, Wobin |
| 23:32.38 | jleclanche | plaw: instead of snow, you deal with some of the worst heat on the globe |
| 23:33.03 | plaw | jleclanche: eh go to the beach |
| 23:33.04 | jleclanche | id take snow. fuck, I'd take neptune |
| 23:33.18 | jleclanche | plaw: why, so I can cook better? |
| 23:33.50 | jleclanche | plaw: maybe take a swim to boil into, give the vultures some variety? |
| 23:34.04 | Amarande | yeah, I think I'd rather take snow over overly burning summers too |
| 23:34.06 | jleclanche | do you even have vultures, or are they mutant giant carnivorous deathbirds? |
| 23:34.19 | Amarande | and that's despite the fact that I usually miss at least two or three days of work a winter due to snow or ice |
| 23:34.47 | Amarande | (lots of hills here making it especially hard to travel in winter weather, and also near a lake so salting is forbidden) |
| 23:35.38 | Amarande | jleclanche: besides the jellyfish and sea snakes might just have you as a snack anyway |
| 23:35.44 | jleclanche | plaw: also, outside of the US and a few backwards countries, gun laws are very decent worldwide |
| 23:35.48 | Amarande | or worse you'll bump into an irukandji and WISH the vultures were taking you |
| 23:36.06 | jleclanche | s/the US and // |
| 23:36.11 | Amarande | plaw: also in australia if someone really wants to kill someone they can probably just leave them in the outback without water :p |
| 23:36.24 | Amarande | kinda like vegas, heh |
| 23:36.59 | plaw | dunno about the big island to the north, but https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Australian_Raven#Diet seem to be the carrion bird here (from my observations of roadkill) |
| 23:37.35 | Amarande | from what I understand, they have these really fun jellyfish off of australia whose venom is not normally fatal but you wish it is |
| 23:37.38 | plaw | jleclanche: I s'pose I should add population density |
| 23:37.42 | Amarande | because it's also like the most painful venom known to man :p |
| 23:38.12 | Amarande | this is of course in addition to the various sea life that basically is fatal. |
| 23:38.20 | plaw | Amarande: Physalia physalis, I believe |
| 23:38.25 | plaw | 'Portugues man o' war' |
| 23:38.30 | kullervo | does someone know of an addon that allows me to write notes about players and guilds? |
| 23:38.30 | plaw | *Portuguese |
| 23:38.34 | Wobin | I mean we spin it up, sure |
| 23:38.42 | Wobin | but I wouldn't want to live anywhere else |
| 23:38.54 | Amarande | kullervo: huh, that's an interesting idea |
| 23:38.57 | kullervo | would love to see "bunch of trolls" in my tooltip to avoid carrying them in pugs etc |
| 23:39.09 | Amarande | come to think of it, I've seen exactly that feature in sw:tor, at least for players, but I'm not sure whether there's a wow addon for it or not |
| 23:39.12 | nevcairiel | i'm sure it exists |
| 23:39.28 | nevcairiel | i remember something like that, but not the name |
| 23:39.31 | jleclanche | yes |
| 23:39.35 | TC-Work | I would move to Aussieland. |
| 23:39.37 | nevcairiel | tried intuitive names, like, PlayerNotes? :P |
| 23:39.39 | plaw | yeah it kinda rings bells for me, kullervo. maybe an old addon that never got updated after an XPAC or something |
| 23:39.47 | jleclanche | it existed so much that blizzard mostly integrated it into the default UI for friends |
| 23:39.50 | kullervo | PlayerNotes does not work |
| 23:40.00 | nevcairiel | hey my name guess hit one that exists |
| 23:40.10 | jleclanche | yes on wildstar. |
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| 23:41.12 | kullervo | and I don't want to friend people just so I remember they're nuisances |
| 23:41.18 | kullervo | the ignore list should be unlimited in size |
| 23:41.27 | plaw | Amarande: also box jellyfish |
| 23:41.29 | kullervo | and accountwide |
| 23:41.33 | plaw | also also https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Marinesting1.jpg |
| 23:41.49 | kd3|hate`net | huzzah |
| 23:42.12 | nevcairiel | http://www.curse.com/addons/wow/character-notes maybe? |
| 23:42.13 | plaw | kullervo: Blizzard don't want you to remember who the idiots are because then you'll drop out of PUGs and LFR more often ;) |
| 23:42.15 | nevcairiel | seem up to date enough |
| 23:42.32 | kullervo | plaw: actually if I ignored them I wouldn't be placed in the same PUGs and LFR with them |
| 23:42.54 | kullervo | so they'd get to deal with their stupidity without me |
| 23:52.04 | znf | Gonna ask here, too: anyone knows if iPod Touch can use AirPlay? |
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| 23:59.02 | TC-Work | znf: afaik yes |
| 23:59.11 | TC-Work | oh, touch. Hmm..dunno |
| 23:59.25 | znf | well, the touch seems to be the only one running iOS |
| 23:59.35 | TC-Work | http://support.apple.com/kb/ht4437 Looks like 4th gen or later |
| 23:59.54 | Amarande | good god, are we that many generations into iPod touch already? |
