| 00:03.38 | *** join/#wowuidev Droolio (~drool@host81-129-9-246.range81-129.btcentralplus.com) |
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| 01:20.21 | Ackis | anyone know of a program that lets me edit file names in a excel type spreadsheet? |
| 01:21.22 | Stanzilla | you mean bulk renaming? |
| 01:23.56 | Ackis | yeah |
| 01:26.48 | Stanzilla | I use "Bulk Rename Utility" |
| 01:29.39 | kd3 | `thunar -B` for me |
| 01:31.56 | VIad | http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9KK7RnsZvs8&t=2m44s#t=2m44s - balls deep |
| 01:40.57 | Mr_Rabies | i wanna learn how to fistweaver my monk but i don't get it :( |
| 01:43.57 | Shirik | Ackis: It's called xargs |
| 01:44.00 | Shirik | come on now |
| 01:44.33 | Ackis | Shirik: I can rename with regexp's but I haven't been able to find something that lets me increase a number :( |
| 01:47.06 | Stanzilla | Ackis: I gave you one |
| 01:48.26 | Shirik | Ackis: save it in the spreadsheet, save as CSV, cat | sed | xargs |
| 01:50.41 | *** join/#wowuidev zenzelezz (~Lasse@cm-84.212.85.55.getinternet.no) |
| 01:52.43 | jleclanche | karl_w_w: ending the game with a 40/40 on the field never gets old |
| 01:57.38 | *** join/#wowuidev tekkub (~tekkub@WoWUIDev/WoWI/Featured/Dongle/GitHub/Tekkub) |
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| 02:13.14 | jleclanche | man |
| 02:13.21 | jleclanche | i am pulling some serious RNG bullshit |
| 02:13.28 | jleclanche | two mind visions = two ironbarks |
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| 04:20.38 | Neffi | Does anyone know the name of this phenomenon? http://i.imgur.com/vAEQ4nd.gif |
| 04:20.48 | Neffi | The illusion that you can hear or feel the bounce |
| 04:21.34 | Dagmar | Schizophrenia? ;) |
| 04:21.52 | Neffi | lol you |
| 04:23.52 | Thunder_Child | hallucination technically |
| 04:34.56 | Stanzilla | kd3: happy bday! |
| 04:35.07 | Stanzilla | maybe, timezones etc |
| 04:35.09 | kd3 | thanks! |
| 04:36.57 | karl_w_w | jleclanche: dude dropped a 16/15 vancleef and a 5/1 novice engineer and stealthed them on me earlier |
| 04:37.02 | karl_w_w | 16/16* |
| 04:41.00 | Dagmar | That sounds painful |
| 04:41.19 | karl_w_w | constructed is just broken right now |
| 04:41.23 | Dagmar | ...and a little disgusting. |
| 04:42.34 | karl_w_w | there's basically 2 ways to play, pure rush where you ignore almost everything and just mindlessly hit their face, or pure control where every game takes half an hour and you need to have 4+ quality legendaries |
| 04:50.00 | Dagmar | You forget the third way to play. |
| 04:50.08 | kd3 | not? |
| 04:50.17 | Dagmar | You get real drink and stare at the screen going "Wow this shit looks cool." |
| 04:50.18 | kd3 | it is the only winning move, after all |
| 04:50.23 | Dagmar | s/drink/drunk/ |
| 05:00.33 | Neffi | Alright I believe you sintacks |
| 05:00.41 | Neffi | The client really does hang by itself |
| 05:02.56 | karl_w_w | the wow client? how did you not already know that? :P |
| 05:13.46 | Neffi | Haven't been playing for a while |
| 05:19.24 | karl_w_w | I don't know of a point in history where the client hasn't hung |
| 05:24.11 | Neffi | I can't remember the last time I did have issues with it |
| 05:24.19 | Neffi | except just now |
| 05:25.09 | Shirik | who do I stab to make up for the fact that Random Access Memories got album of the year? |
| 05:28.14 | Dagmar | Hey now |
| 05:28.23 | Dagmar | It wasn't "the usual" Daft Punk, but it was a good album |
| 05:32.04 | *** topic/#wowuidev by Cairenn -> http://pastebin.com || 5.4.x ToC: 50400 || #WoWUIDev-commits: CIA & JIRA bots reporting || Battletags: http://goo.gl/2bm7n || This channel is logged, via purl || Happy Birthday KD3! |
| 05:32.14 | Cairenn | Happy birthday kd3 :) |
| 05:33.31 | kd3 | thanks! |
| 05:34.02 | kd3 | ...I should probably turn off email notifications tonight |
| 05:40.18 | Stanzilla | Dagmar: it was shit |
| 05:40.34 | Stanzilla | pharrel on every song that sounded the same |
| 05:40.34 | Stanzilla | etc |
| 05:40.36 | Stanzilla | shiiiit |
| 05:41.18 | *** part/#wowuidev Seerah (~RyanNL@adsl-74-226-66-154.mem.bellsouth.net) |
| 05:47.35 | Mr_Rabies | Happy Birthday from the [vbulletin forums you signed up for in 1998 that are somehow still around], kd3 |
| 05:47.45 | kd3 | got 6 of those already >.> |
| 05:48.15 | kd3 | back when I was young and naive and actually put in my dob |
| 05:49.50 | kd3 | ugh. for some reason, today's xkcd just makes me wince uncontrollably |
| 05:50.33 | kd3 | (maybe I've already had too much to drink. good thing I'm off today!) |
| 05:52.38 | karl_w_w | hahahah i had a board full of minions, he equality avenging wrathed and every single one died |
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| 07:17.44 | Shirik | wtf |
| 07:18.10 | Shirik | OrganĀ²/ASLSP (As SLow aS Possible) is a musical piece by John Cage and the subject of one of the longest-lasting musical performances yet undertaken.... The performance of the organ version at St. Burchardi church in Halberstadt, Germany, began in 2001 and is scheduled to have a duration of 639 years, ending in 2640. |
| 07:20.10 | Shirik | "The last note changed occurred on October 5, 2013. The next change will not occur until 2020." |
| 07:23.04 | nevcairiel | so does that mean the same note can be heard for 7 years, or does it just play nothing in that time? :p |
| 07:23.38 | Shirik | same note for 7 years |
| 07:23.51 | Shirik | there was a 2 year rest at one point |
| 07:24.00 | nevcairiel | must be horrible to go there |
| 07:26.08 | Shirik | oh god |
| 07:26.27 | Shirik | it's a 7th chord too |
| 07:26.29 | Shirik | that's terrible |
| 07:26.44 | Shirik | you can hear the current note here: http://www.aslsp.org/ |
| 07:27.32 | Shirik | so basically it takes 7 years to resolve that chord, lol |
| 07:27.39 | nevcairiel | sounds like the background noise in an evil laboratory |
| 07:30.18 | Shirik | I'm sure there's someone there at all times, too |
| 07:30.31 | Shirik | I would have to wear noise cancelling earphones or something |
| 07:30.34 | Shirik | that would drive me mad |
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| 08:02.01 | *** join/#wowuidev VIad (~Vlad@151.117.45.31.customer.cdi.no) |
| 08:12.33 | karl_w_w | what if the organ breaks down? :o |
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| 08:31.12 | ccox | Cairenn: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_AtP7au_Q9w |
| 08:40.27 | zenzio | email: "android app to locate your phone", from "service@apple.no". Sounds about right... |
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| 08:55.10 | amro | perfectly legit zenzio |
| 09:00.46 | *** join/#wowuidev rot (~mrmr@host13-110-dynamic.4-87-r.retail.telecomitalia.it) |
| 09:00.49 | rot | morning |
| 09:01.07 | rot | is there a way to know the resting status of party members? |
| 09:01.34 | rot | something like IsResting(unitID)? |
| 09:09.01 | Neffi | I'm pretty sure there's no, rot |
| 09:09.43 | Neffi | I mean, it's always possible by making a database of known resting areas, and check when they're in these locations |
| 09:09.48 | Neffi | But that's not exactly trivial |
| 09:10.20 | rot | so...the easiest way, would be sync it through SendAddonMessage() ? |
| 09:10.27 | Maldivia | knowing if they are in an inn in a certain area is not easy :P |
| 09:10.40 | Neffi | rot: that would also be a way yes |
| 09:10.54 | rot | but...every party member would need the addon, that way |
| 09:11.18 | Neffi | And I didnt even consider the issues with trying to figure out what building they are actually inside, so yeah that database technique is not gonna be reliable |
| 09:12.07 | Neffi | Yeah rot. So it's possible, but it seems more work than it's worth tbh |
| 09:12.10 | Maldivia | what do you need the infor for? |
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| 10:11.02 | zenzio | hm, SOE shutting down Free Realms and Vanguard. I thought they just started dedicating a little time to Vanguard this autumn |
| 10:11.19 | Mr_Rabies | ughhhh low level mats are too expensive on my realm |
| 10:11.30 | Mr_Rabies | i can't get jewelcrafting leveled for less than like 8 gold per level :/ |
| 10:11.52 | Mr_Rabies | reasonably cheap in the grand scheme of things but inflated due to scarcity |
| 10:12.11 | Mr_Rabies | this is at the copper-tin-bronze level |
| 10:13.21 | *** join/#wowuidev Stanzilla (~Stan@WoWUIDev/WowAce/Stanzilla) |
| 10:14.16 | Maldivia | buy copper ore and prospect it? |
| 10:14.27 | Maldivia | oh way, you need the copper to make all the settings etc |
| 10:15.51 | zenzio | I don't suppose you have a character with mining? I find most of the common ores are easily farmed with a little patience |
| 10:16.20 | Mr_Rabies | copper ore's more expensive per than bars |
| 10:16.36 | Neffi | that's because of the demand for prospecting it |
| 10:16.45 | Mr_Rabies | and all the gems are crazy expensive |
| 10:16.48 | *** join/#wowuidev Xandr (~Xandr@89.101.75.36) |
| 10:16.54 | Neffi | I sell most of my stuff as ore now because it goes quick and sells well |
| 10:16.56 | Mr_Rabies | low supply, too, neffi |
| 10:17.15 | Neffi | Most people just smelt it before listing. Few people list the ore, so yes |
| 10:17.16 | Mr_Rabies | i'm just eating about 10g per level |
| 10:17.21 | Neffi | :| |
| 10:17.27 | Mr_Rabies | hopefully i can hit a point that's in a post-scarcity economy |
| 10:17.48 | Neffi | That's why I'd rather go with one gathering profession, than mix-max with two crafting profs |
| 10:17.55 | Mr_Rabies | i have a gathering one |
| 10:18.06 | Mr_Rabies | but our crossrealm stuff is shared with stormrage, so competition's high |
| 10:18.23 | Mr_Rabies | also i'm lazy :p |
| 10:18.41 | Mr_Rabies | i have a char with mining, one with herbing, and one with skinning |
| 10:18.50 | Mr_Rabies | the only prof i don't have a 600 of is blacksmithing |
| 10:19.03 | Mr_Rabies | i'm gonna be dropping jc on my dk for blacksmithing and picking up jc on my monk instead |
| 10:19.15 | Neffi | Look at the Wowhead maps for copper veins. You can probably find a relatively remote location with reasonable amounts of ore to yourself |
| 10:19.36 | Mr_Rabies | stormrage is crazy, crazy overpopulated but yeah, it might be managable |
| 10:20.08 | Mr_Rabies | i can't wait for global AH :/ |
| 10:21.15 | Neffi | Global AH? |
| 10:21.30 | nevcairiel | as if thats ever going to happen |
| 10:21.34 | Mr_Rabies | it's gonna happen |
| 10:21.54 | Mr_Rabies | maybe not global, but grouped at the very least |
| 10:22.04 | Mr_Rabies | further than the connected realms |
| 10:22.23 | Mr_Rabies | we've already been connected to another realm and our AH is still pretty dead |
| 10:22.26 | Neffi | I don't see a benefit |
| 10:22.40 | Neffi | Oversaturation isn't good |
| 10:22.50 | Mr_Rabies | neither is scarcity |
| 10:23.34 | Mr_Rabies | it kinda sucks to have resources sapped away from your small realm via a CRZ with a huge realm |
| 10:23.45 | Mr_Rabies | but you can't share the AH at all |
| 10:24.16 | Mr_Rabies | i think a healthy supply of materials is key for a real economy |
| 10:24.44 | Neffi | I like having the option to choose my economy by switching realms |
| 10:25.08 | Mr_Rabies | that'd be a valid argument if they were free |
| 10:25.25 | Mr_Rabies | seeing as they're $25, that doesn't hold much ground |
| 10:53.59 | zenzio | Mr_Rabies: that's rather a personal opinion kind of thing. I can definitely see your point, but not everyone cares much about spending $25 |
| 10:54.46 | *** join/#wowuidev stolenlegacy (~stolenleg@unaffiliated/stolenlegacy) |
| 10:55.14 | Mr_Rabies | i'd rather them make the game better than further incentivizing further transactions beyond the game and subscription via poor design |
| 10:56.15 | Mr_Rabies | a good chunk of people would just stop playing before they'd ever transfer, and i'm glad they're working on making transfers feel less of a racket via connected realms, etc |
| 10:57.04 | zenzio | I'm not arguing that; only that you seemed to say there was one single answer to a point that people have different opinions about |
| 10:57.10 | Xuerian | Mr_Rabies: What? Flipping bits isn't cheap, man. You've gotta pay all the hamsters overtime |
| 10:57.36 | Mr_Rabies | sure, there's plenty of solutions, but they're not really viable for me and lots of other people |
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| 10:58.06 | Xuerian | (Joking about the artificial valuation of "realm transfers") |
| 10:58.25 | Mr_Rabies | i could just buy a pile of gold from some shady chinese website as a solution too, doesn't really mean it's a viable one |
| 10:59.17 | Mr_Rabies | what if the server you transfer to dies in a while too? transfer again? keep riding the transfer train until you find a server with a working economy? |
| 10:59.42 | zenzio | yup |
| 11:00.10 | Mr_Rabies | that's a terrible solution and if it were viable, would actually mean wow was a worse game than it is |
| 11:00.14 | zenzio | sometimes game economies suck; especially so when the playerbase is divided in a lot of segments |
| 11:00.46 | Mr_Rabies | you're 'fixing' blizzard's problem by paying blizzard money |
| 11:00.57 | Mr_Rabies | broken server economies are their problem, not the players' |
| 11:02.03 | zenzio | I'm not saying I'm fixing anything |
| 11:02.28 | Mr_Rabies | i'm just tired of having absolutely zero of so, so many items when trying to work on professions |
| 11:02.54 | Mr_Rabies | it's a compounded issue of broken profession design and broken server design |
| 11:03.07 | Mr_Rabies | (both of which are being fixed down the line here hopefully) |
| 11:05.25 | Mr_Rabies | i just can't wait until they get them fixed |
| 11:06.19 | Mr_Rabies | fixing professions is gonna be a rough effort on at least one front |
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| 11:06.43 | Mr_Rabies | they really shouldn't have made mining levelable in pandaria before fixing the professions that rely on it but bleh |
| 11:06.51 | Mr_Rabies | well, levelable from 1 |
| 11:07.20 | Mr_Rabies | er, gathering professions, man i can't type |
| 11:07.20 | zenzio | crafting often seems to be a rough spot in MMOs |
| 11:07.25 | Mr_Rabies | i should be sleeping |
| 11:07.53 | zenzio | "here's 100 things you can craft, 5 of which will ever be used for anything" |
| 11:08.01 | Mr_Rabies | yeah, i've got some ideas for professions but i'm not really 100% sure of what to do with crafting |
| 11:08.09 | Mr_Rabies | materials are too complex and rare in way too many cases |
| 11:09.06 | Mr_Rabies | a fix to gathering professions would be to remove them and let anyone gather anything gathered via profession, which also would put more materials on the auction house |
| 11:09.31 | Mr_Rabies | helping fix some of the issues with leveling crafting profs, but certainly not all the issues of crafting profs |
| 11:13.00 | Mr_Rabies | streamlining crafting professions to only require materials such as ore, bars, leather, cloth, enchanting dust, herbs, etc and only maybe 1-2 types of mat per item for most individual items would help too, if only for old content |
| 11:13.57 | Mr_Rabies | it's kind of insane for a shitty low level ring to require like 6 individual materials, some of which are insanely rare |
| 11:14.37 | nevcairiel | the thing is, you used to craft these things back in the day when everyone was playing this content, and the stuff wasn't rare then, or not as much at least |
| 11:15.34 | nevcairiel | I dont think it hurts a profession if it has old recipes that used to be doable, but because noone gathers this stuff anymore, are not anymore .. as long as there is a clear path to level it without needing them |
| 11:16.18 | Mr_Rabies | i guess, but that's a ton of clutter |
| 11:16.34 | Mr_Rabies | the profession UI needs a major overhaul if they're gonna keep those hundreds of patterns in the system |
| 11:16.39 | nevcairiel | As a veteran, having experienced the entire lifetime of this profession, i would feel kinda cheated if all t hese old recipes suddenly vanished because someone wanted to clean house |
| 11:16.49 | Mr_Rabies | with insane levels of mats |
| 11:17.00 | Mr_Rabies | yeah, i'd partially agree, but at the same time, something's gotta give |
| 11:17.20 | Mr_Rabies | the profession UI and the overcomplexity of what you do inside of it are wholly incompatible |
| 11:17.38 | nevcairiel | it is true that classic had the most complex recipes, with like 4 tiers of elemental ingredients and whatnot |
| 11:17.56 | Mr_Rabies | trying to find even on-level enchants is a nightmare for me |
| 11:18.04 | Mr_Rabies | on my main |
| 11:18.11 | nevcairiel | on the top of the list? :p |
| 11:18.16 | Mr_Rabies | not at all |
| 11:18.23 | Mr_Rabies | there's a million subcategories |
| 11:18.33 | Mr_Rabies | and all the names are cryptic |
| 11:18.36 | nevcairiel | grouped by slot, i think thats actually useful |
| 11:18.49 | Mr_Rabies | some higher stat items are lower in the list than lower ones |
| 11:19.01 | Mr_Rabies | since they were added later, etc |
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| 12:32.44 | *** join/#wowuidev Icicle (~Icicle@212.121.131.8) |
| 12:33.50 | Icicle | Morning Guys |
| 12:33.55 | Icicle | and girls |
| 12:34.10 | Icicle | and any others I mised |
| 12:34.17 | zenzio | ahoy |
| 12:36.12 | Icicle | another day another drupal |
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| 13:44.14 | Dagmar | No, I used to use the one the Nova Launcher people make tho |
| 13:48.31 | zenzio | ..? |
| 13:50.07 | karl_w_w | seems like a wrong channel |
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| 14:19.54 | zenzio | ohaithar peppy, Cairenn |
| 14:20.14 | Fisker | slaps Lopeppeppy around a bit with a large trout |
| 14:23.03 | Lopeppeppy | Good morning, Fiskerboo. |
| 14:23.06 | Lopeppeppy | glomps zenzio. |
| 14:23.16 | zenzio | \o/ |
| 14:50.39 | Lopeppeppy | Gosh, I love me some web statistics in the morning. *sigh* |
| 14:51.36 | zenzio | tried so hard to come up with a witty "smells like..." joke, but couldn't find any funny ones |
| 14:51.55 | Icicle | ugh |
| 14:52.17 | Icicle | so it begins, Welcome to Amazon CloudFront Services... |
| 14:52.37 | Icicle | time to learn new things I dont understand but now must be perceived as an expert within 5 mins ago |
| 14:59.00 | Workfoz | have fun |
| 15:12.23 | Icicle | always do |
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| 15:46.00 | Fisker | I gave you free food Lopeppeppy and I can't even get a glomp? :O |
| 15:50.33 | Lopeppeppy | I glomp that which I do not see every weekday. If you were scarce-er-er, I would attack you more. |
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| 16:14.06 | Fisker | :( |
| 16:14.08 | Fisker | I want to be scary |
| 16:15.37 | Lopeppeppy | SCARCE, not scary. :) |
| 16:17.52 | Fisker | oh |
| 16:17.59 | Fisker | well ok then |
| 16:18.12 | Fisker | bye forever Lopeppeppy! |
| 16:18.21 | Lopeppeppy | Ooops. |
| 16:18.23 | Fisker | I also want to be scarier though |
| 16:19.25 | Lopeppeppy | Get some fangs. |
| 16:20.18 | Fisker | I'm super scarce now |
| 16:20.33 | Lopeppeppy | http://teethbydnash.com/roguesgallery/ |
| 16:21.20 | Fisker | Didn't know nicholas cage was into vampirism |
| 16:22.40 | Lopeppeppy | Why not? He's crazy enough. |
| 16:23.44 | Fisker | This scarcity isn't working out |
| 16:24.01 | karl_w_w | reminded me of this http://www.collegehumor.com/video/6797424/batman-meets-two-face |
| 16:32.07 | Ressy | You guys see this: http://www.cnn.com/video/data/2.0/video/us/2014/01/26/dnt-canadian-pipeline-explosion.cbc.html |
| 16:51.31 | karl_w_w | because the woman couldn't pronounce kilometres? |
| 16:51.53 | Gethe | if anyone is planning on playing Wildstar http://wildstarnasa.com/ |
| 16:52.50 | *** join/#wowuidev Dennls (~dennis@s55973038.adsl.online.nl) |
| 16:53.08 | jleclanche | Gethe: yeah, probably |
| 17:07.54 | *** join/#wowuidev Amarande (amarande@24-151-100-63.dhcp.nwtn.ct.charter.com) |
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| 17:47.13 | *** mode/#wowuidev [+v Lopeppeppy] by ChanServ |
| 17:47.43 | Lopeppeppy | Please join me in despising Java. A lot. |
| 17:48.35 | Amarande | hm |
| 17:48.40 | Amarande | I don't think I even have java installed on this machine |
| 17:48.53 | Amarande | it sounds like a good way to get cryptolocker or the like these days :p |
| 17:48.57 | jleclanche | http://www.thinkbroadband.com/news/6261-sky-parental-controls-break-jquery-website.html |
| 17:50.02 | Amarande | jleclanche: heh, my instinctive response there is "what do we expect from a Murdoch company" |
| 17:50.50 | Shirik | Lopeppeppy: we all despise Java |
| 17:51.13 | Amarande | I suppose Java would be okay if they could actually manage to get the security right |
| 17:51.35 | Shirik | they can't even make their library right |
| 17:51.38 | Amarande | however, it's more like "OMG STOP WHAT YOU'RE DOING! CRITICAL UPDATE! CRITICAL UPDATE! YOUR JAVA HAS MORE HOLES THAN LORRAINE CHEESE!" |
| 17:51.47 | Shirik | Java is supposed to be an OO language |
| 17:51.50 | Amarande | so you install the critical update that's supposed to fix your stuff |
| 17:51.54 | Shirik | some people say it even defines OOP |
| 17:52.11 | Amarande | then a few days later you see yet another post on tech sites saying the new version has more holes than Lorraine cheese TOO |
| 17:52.15 | Shirik | but it's like OOP for kids. And everyone's trashing on everyone else in the same sandbox. |
| 17:53.17 | Amarande | eventually I just disabled all my browser plugins |
| 17:53.19 | Lopeppeppy | Java update last week. Which broke the image uploader for my web system. Which they send out an update for. Which doesn't work still, days later. Driving me batshit crazy. |
| 17:53.24 | Amarande | and then eventually I stopped even having java installed at all |
| 17:53.35 | Amarande | er, all my java browser plugins, that is |
| 17:53.40 | Lopeppeppy | "Coming Fall 2014: a non Java image editor" << Give me this NOW. |
| 17:53.56 | Amarande | since really the only stuff I was using in java without the browser plugin was ... well ... let's see ... Solo Whist and Skat games |
| 17:54.05 | Amarande | and I can play the same version of Skat on my tablet |
| 17:54.12 | Amarande | and I really wasn't playing THAT much Solo Whist |
| 17:54.21 | nevcairiel | all these issues are just from java applets, and those were a bad idea before they were invented |
| 17:54.38 | Amarande | Lopeppeppy: oh, it could be worse |
| 17:54.55 | Amarande | it could be like Gallery 3, which I used when I still had my own website before I decided I was wasting money hosting my own domain |
| 17:55.05 | Lopeppeppy | The whole website could be down. At least it's just NEW stuff that's borked, not old stuff. |
| 17:55.06 | Amarande | the gallery3 image uploader doesn't require java ... instead it uses FLASH |
| 17:55.18 | Amarande | which sucks just about as equally much as java :p |
| 17:55.44 | Shirik | no nevcairiel, I'm talking about the very core of Java |
| 17:56.12 | Amarande | though, sadly, these days in a way we're pretty much dependent on java anyways :( |
| 17:56.25 | Amarande | unless you like walled garden mobiles :( |
| 17:56.39 | Shirik | it's because schools have decided that Java is the way to teach OOP |
| 17:56.42 | Shirik | which is totally wrong |
| 17:57.04 | nevcairiel | there is no clean OOP language shirik, every language is ugly to some degree |
| 17:57.11 | Amarande | since either you use android (which is java based), or you use apple or windows phone (both of which are tightly controlled walled gardens where you get to do pretty much only what Apple or MS say you get to do) |
| 17:57.11 | Shirik | because you tell people things like "we can build class hierarchies, where Shape is derived from Object, and Rectangle is derived from Shape, and Square is derived from Rectangle" |
| 17:57.22 | Shirik | because that's what Java does |
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| 17:57.38 | *** join/#wowuidev Yoshimo (~Miranda@unaffiliated/yoshimo) |
| 17:57.50 | Amarande | well, we could just go back to using plain procedural-oriented languages |
| 17:57.53 | Amarande | ... except, Windows :( |
| 17:57.58 | Shirik | no |
| 17:57.59 | Fisker | yay Lopeppeppy |
| 17:58.01 | Shirik | OOP is good |
| 17:58.01 | Fisker | we have something in common |
| 17:58.09 | Shirik | In fact, I would rather go the other direction, to AOP |
| 17:58.10 | Fisker | Never update java |
| 17:58.12 | Fisker | NEVER |
| 17:58.13 | Amarande | basically the whole damn Windows API seems to be based around the expectation that basically all applications will be coded mostly or entirely as OO |
| 17:58.13 | Shirik | but we can stay at OOP |
| 17:58.21 | Shirik | that's good |
| 17:58.24 | Shirik | because it's the only way to stay sane |
| 17:58.34 | Shirik | however, the fact that Java is dictating what OOP "is" is a problem. |
| 17:58.57 | Amarande | like, can you even code a purely function/procedure oriented Windows app and even have it work? |
| 17:59.08 | Shirik | yes |
| 17:59.10 | nevcairiel | Amarande: the base win32 api is mostly C, not even class based |
| 17:59.17 | Amarande | it seems like you'd need to make a big OO "blanket" for it simply in order to allow it to properly interact with most APIs |
| 17:59.41 | Amarande | hm, interesting |
| 17:59.46 | Shirik | .NET has a functionality in it that allows you to make a call direct to the CRT |
| 17:59.54 | Amarande | but, say, you're coding gaming or such ... I at least *thought* DirectX was purely OO based |
| 18:00.04 | zenzelezz | if you want OO for Windows, there's MFC, ATL, COM, .NET - but the base API is just plain C |
| 18:00.38 | Shirik | Also, let me teach you about the C API |
| 18:00.50 | Shirik | First, you instantiate a structure that has 50 fields in it. |
| 18:01.02 | zenzelezz | in before Shirik goes on about double-Ex functions |
| 18:01.03 | Shirik | Then you fill in the 1 that matters, and leave the rest as zeroes because they're "reserved" |
| 18:01.07 | Shirik | damn it zenzelezz |
| 18:01.45 | nevcairiel | I'm still not sure whats better, extending the API that way, or simply breaking old apps every couple years |
| 18:02.28 | nevcairiel | microsoft tends to keep their api absolutely stable, while apple likes to carry no baggage at all |
| 18:02.30 | zenzelezz | I liked the story about how at least in some earlier versions of Windows, the fastest way to draw a solid rectangle was not using functions like FillRect, but TextOut (or whatever exactly it was called) |
| 18:02.34 | Shirik | This has always been my favorite: http://msdn.microsoft.com/en-us/library/windows/desktop/aa363214(v=vs.85).aspx |
| 18:02.41 | Shirik | fBinary: If this member is TRUE, binary mode is enabled. Windows does not support nonbinary mode transfers, so this member must be TRUE. |
| 18:03.07 | zenzelezz | lol |
| 18:03.15 | nevcairiel | so they leave room for future changes |
| 18:03.24 | zenzelezz | yup |
| 18:03.32 | Shirik | but they already do that another way |
| 18:03.36 | zenzelezz | same reason they pack struct-size in everywhere |
| 18:03.38 | Shirik | every time you pass a structure, you also pass its size |
| 18:03.59 | Shirik | so the CRT can tell what "version" you're calling |
| 18:05.29 | nevcairiel | they tend to only add stuff to the end, rarely shuffle stuff around at the start |
| 18:05.38 | Amarande | "I'm sorry, Microsoft, you have too much baggage." "Windows ... I'm sorry, but it's time for you to pack up and go." |
| 18:06.25 | Shirik | ref the start: DCBlength: Specifies the DCB structure length, in bytes. |
| 18:06.32 | Shirik | they do that with pretty much every structure they use |
| 18:07.34 | Shirik | Amarande: For all the crap I give them about their API |
| 18:07.45 | Shirik | you have to admit it's a very difficult problem to solve, and they've done it very well |
| 18:07.55 | Shirik | keeping a backwards-compatible API for literally decades is no trivial task |
| 18:08.03 | zenzelezz | it's a common-ish mistake when you're learning Win32 to not set the struct size |
| 18:09.15 | nevcairiel | i have been developing on win32 for the last couple years, and in daily business its usually not bad at all, you occasionally find a weird API that is horrible to use, but what can you do |
| 18:09.39 | nevcairiel | (even worse, if that API has a replacement which looks really nice, but its only available as of vista or 7, and you cant go there yet) |
| 18:09.55 | Shirik | the #1 thing I hate |
| 18:10.01 | Shirik | condition variables are only available in Vista |
| 18:10.09 | Shirik | (and up) |
| 18:10.17 | zenzelezz | people hate Win32 because they 1) don't like Microsoft, and 2) don't know the API |
| 18:10.22 | nevcairiel | more mutexes and signals to emulate them! |
| 18:10.27 | Shirik | coding multithreaded programs without condition variables is incredibly painful |
| 18:10.29 | zenzelezz | then they go and try to code for Mac, and come back crying |
| 18:14.00 | nevcairiel | i've recently been looking into implementing a SSL/TLS socket using win32 api, and that is one crazy looking API |
| 18:14.07 | nevcairiel | and the crypto-ng api to replace it is vista+ only :p |
| 18:14.28 | Stanzilla | should stop coding for xp! |
| 18:17.14 | nevcairiel | was windows on a hdd always this slow or is this particular system just crazy |
| 18:17.45 | nevcairiel | also, i installed IE11 on a fresh win7, and windows update still offers me 9 and 10 :D |
| 18:21.05 | Fisker | silly nevcairiel |
| 18:27.03 | *** join/#wowuidev Gnarfoz (smallbrain@geektour.de) |
| 18:29.27 | pompy | nevcairiel: did you restart after the ie11 install? :P |
| 18:30.00 | Gnarfoz | wish I could get into Wildstar beta to know if I'm likely to play it |
| 18:30.13 | Gnarfoz | doubt anything can draw me away from WoW, though |
| 18:30.57 | Stanzilla | it's ok |
| 18:31.01 | Stanzilla | but not as fun as I imagined |
| 18:31.34 | nevcairiel | i would probably play it for a month or so to fill the boredom of current wow |
| 18:32.07 | nevcairiel | WoD can't come soon enough |
| 18:32.56 | *** join/#wowuidev MentalPower|Work (~MentalPow@WoWUIDev/Norganna/Administrator/MentalPower) |
| 18:32.56 | *** mode/#wowuidev [+v MentalPower|Work] by ChanServ |
| 18:34.29 | Amarande | I've been playing LOTRO lately |
| 18:34.46 | Amarande | btw, what is that weird bluish gray stuff I've started seeing in the sky since I exited the First Hall of Moria to the east? |
| 18:35.34 | Stanzilla | nobody plays that crap, no use in asking here :p |
| 18:36.19 | Amarande | heh |
| 18:36.24 | Amarande | it's the sky. I've been in Moria too long apparently :) |
| 18:36.34 | Gnarfoz | which crap? |
| 18:37.27 | Stanzilla | LOTRO |
| 18:40.29 | jnwhiteh | my wowi password is apparently 92 days old |
| 18:40.30 | jnwhiteh | good to know |
| 18:40.33 | jnwhiteh | quick, hack mes! |
| 18:41.07 | Semlar | neffiii |
| 18:41.53 | Gnarfoz | who said anything about lotro :o |
| 18:42.22 | Neffi | Semlar: |
| 18:42.27 | Semlar | hi neffi |
| 18:42.33 | Neffi | hi |
| 18:42.46 | Semlar | i got a box from london |
| 18:42.48 | Stanzilla | Gnarfoz: guess someone on your ignore list |
| 18:43.00 | Amarande | Stanzilla: heh, this is exactly why I barely ever use my ignore list |
| 18:43.04 | Amarande | it makes conversations look strange |
| 18:43.38 | Amarande | generally, this is more jarring than whatever the ignored person was spouting anyways :S |
| 18:43.39 | Neffi | Semlar: I wonder what that could be |
| 18:43.46 | Semlar | guess! |
| 18:43.59 | Neffi | blah. too tired |
| 18:44.01 | Gnarfoz | Stanzilla: unpossible! |
| 18:44.13 | Semlar | it's tea! |
| 18:44.36 | Neffi | Not coffee? |
| 18:44.50 | Semlar | why would i get coffee from england |
| 18:45.06 | Neffi | I don't know |
| 18:52.21 | karl_w_w | why would you get tea from england? |
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| 18:57.29 | karl_w_w | http://www.theinquirer.net/inquirer/news/2325246/chess-champion-beats-bill-gates-in-just-over-a-minute <- "Carlsen, who we understand is the Justin Bieber of the chess world" sick burn? |
| 18:59.37 | Amarande | someone compared Magnus Carlsen to Justin Bieber? |
| 18:59.53 | Amarande | this is the sort of person who should be bopped over the head with a tournament king |
| 19:00.04 | Amarande | (remember, tournament pieces are weighted with lead, they hurt more) |
| 19:01.56 | *** join/#wowuidev tharper (~tomh@unaffiliated/sioraiocht) |
| 19:05.31 | Maldivia | Amarande: alternatively, wizard chess king, from harry potter and the philosopher's stone |
| 19:26.40 | *** join/#wowuidev Kaylin (~Kaylin@aruba-master.seattlecentral.edu) |
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| 20:24.43 | VIad | isn't magnus carlsen a chess player? |
| 20:29.09 | *** join/#wowuidev oafkad (~oafkad@gamblitgaming.com) |
| 20:30.04 | oafkad | http://pastebin.com/Vmacj39E ~ Anyone have an idea why this has a syntax error on line 9? |
| 20:30.21 | oafkad | Or can give me general guidance to what I'm doing wrong with tables + loops in wow :( |
| 20:31.16 | nevcairiel | i'm confused by what you are even trying to do there |
| 20:31.29 | Ermad | first off, you probably meant to end with a semicolon instead of comma. |
| 20:31.35 | nevcairiel | whats with the (i) in the variable names |
| 20:31.53 | nevcairiel | also (i) is for calling functions, [i] is for table index |
| 20:31.55 | oafkad | lemme fix the semicolon thing real quick. |
| 20:31.58 | oafkad | Ah ok |
| 20:32.01 | oafkad | when I use [i] |
| 20:32.03 | oafkad | wow has a fit |
| 20:32.10 | oafkad | so I thought it used (i) for some reason |
| 20:32.21 | nevcairiel | in your variable names its still illegal |
| 20:32.56 | oafkad | This is like my 3rd day with LUA so I'm coming off of GML which isn't the best background I imagine. |
| 20:33.40 | oafkad | So what exactly am I missing for pulling from a table with a while loop? |
| 20:33.51 | nevcairiel | the pulling isnt the problem |
| 20:33.54 | nevcairiel | the line after is |
| 20:34.35 | oafkad | the print line? |
| 20:34.48 | oafkad | http://pastebin.com/JvBSkpXn ~ updated with [i] and semicolon instead of comma. |
| 20:35.12 | nevcairiel | you need to get rid of the [i] in the local variables in the loop |
| 20:35.18 | nevcairiel | its illegal syntax |
| 20:35.35 | nevcairiel | simply do something like this; http://pastebin.com/c2zizt1z |
| 20:36.14 | oafkad | Whoa |
| 20:36.16 | oafkad | That works? :o |
| 20:36.20 | oafkad | LUA is breaking my head |
| 20:37.02 | nevcairiel | why wouldnt it work |
| 20:37.13 | oafkad | No I believe you |
| 20:37.20 | oafkad | This is my third ish day of LUA so I'm just trying to wrap my head around it. |
| 20:37.27 | nevcairiel | Also, its Lua |
| 20:37.29 | oafkad | Holy hell |
| 20:37.38 | oafkad | You are my hero. (also ok on the capitalization) |
| 20:38.20 | oafkad | Man all of sunday this was killing me and you solve it in seconds. |
| 20:39.08 | nevcairiel | ~pil |
| 20:39.08 | purl | Programming in Lua, a book written by the authors of the Lua programming language. The first edition is available free online at http://www.lua.org/pil and covers Lua 5.0. The second edition is available in print from most online bookstores, and covers Lua 5.1. |
| 20:39.15 | nevcairiel | read the PiL :p |
| 20:39.29 | oafkad | Yeah I've been reading that one. I apparently just don't have my brain around it yet. |
| 20:39.42 | oafkad | There is a german "For dummies" style site that got me this far at least. I find blocks really fascinating. |
| 20:39.55 | oafkad | Back when I used to script things it was just top down, whatever is before it is what matters kinda stuff. |
| 20:41.07 | Amarande | VIad: "a" chess player ... Magnus Carlsen is the present reigning World Chess Champion |
| 20:41.09 | Amarande | well, at least among us meatbags |
| 20:41.15 | Amarande | the computers took the *real* chess throne years ago |
| 20:43.06 | VIad | only living things can take a physical throne |
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| 20:48.32 | Amarande | Heh VIad, we'll be lucky if that idea lasts much longer either, did you read the news that they're working on the next step up from unmanned drones? All hail the Computer :S |
| 20:48.51 | VIad | that's called skynet |
| 20:49.04 | Amarande | yeah, it pretty much does resemble skynet pretty damn well |
| 20:49.20 | Amarande | right now, drones require someone to be sitting in a command centre somewhere to hit the button for someone to die |
| 20:49.22 | VIad | function ShouldTerminate() return true end |
| 20:49.45 | Amarande | recent /. and such indicates that now they're working on the next step though, which of course is allowing the computers to determine targets on their own |
| 20:49.56 | Amarande | because, you know, this *totally* always turns out well |
| 20:50.07 | VIad | there is nothing like false positives |
| 20:50.16 | Dagmar | Well, the military's drones require it |
| 20:50.21 | Dagmar | Mine sure as fuck won't |
| 20:50.55 | Dagmar | Firing nerf darts means never having to say you're sorry |
| 20:51.05 | Amarande | "we're sorry, we regret to report that" *inter-recordings pause* "College Laser Printer" *inter-recordings pause* "has been reduced to a smoking crater per request from the RIAA, who has found said target to be engaged in media piracy ..." |
| 20:55.51 | oafkad | Thanks again Nev. |
| 20:56.15 | oafkad | After a bit I get why it wasn't necessary also. |
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| 21:32.09 | Mr_Rabies | hmm, they're throttling bnet chat and adding an addon communication framework to it |
| 21:32.18 | Mr_Rabies | interesting http://us.battle.net/wow/en/forum/topic/11437004031 |
| 21:36.00 | Gethe | it's for oQueue |
| 21:36.22 | Gethe | or thats what propted it most likely |
| 22:28.17 | jleclanche | karl_w_w: tough druid choice... cairne vs cenarius vs gruul |
| 22:28.18 | jleclanche | any idea? |
| 22:31.20 | Icicle_ | Cenarius |
| 22:31.21 | Icicle_ | imo |
| 22:31.52 | jleclanche | yeah its the one i picked |
| 22:34.15 | Icicle_ | good man :) |
| 22:37.23 | jleclanche | wow this is a really weird draft |
| 22:38.11 | jleclanche | Icicle_: https://mediacru.sh/x5FO2gkutjRy |
| 22:38.48 | Icicle_ | really weak on card draw too |
| 22:38.58 | Icicle_ | only 3 cards that'll give you one card |
| 22:39.09 | Icicle_ | illidan + cenarius though |
| 22:39.12 | Icicle_ | nice man |
| 22:39.31 | Icicle_ | lol and 3 innervate? |
| 22:39.32 | Icicle_ | holy hell |
| 22:43.41 | Maldivia | uhh... drama in Eve online... again :) |
| 22:45.19 | Arrowmaster | what now |
| 22:45.46 | jleclanche | Icicle_: yeah double legendary in arena |
| 22:45.46 | jleclanche | ftw |
| 22:46.03 | Icicle_ | for real :) |
| 22:46.04 | Maldivia | Arrowmaster: http://kotaku.com/gigantic-space-battle-breaks-out-in-eve-online-thanks-1510023302 |
| 22:46.17 | Icicle_ | speaking of drama.... 100k Intel Extreme Masters prize purse |
| 22:46.21 | Icicle_ | Winner Take All... |
| 22:46.31 | Icicle_ | people are not happy its not evenly distributed |
| 22:48.32 | Arrowmaster | lol at the live video |
| 22:49.14 | Arrowmaster | i cant believe thats now much stuff is slowed down in big battles |
| 22:49.55 | Dagmar | Two trillion ISK "gone". |
| 22:50.14 | Dagmar | Well, not exactly gone, but now basically owned again by the company running the servers. :) |
| 22:50.21 | Dagmar | What better way to make money off customers |
| 22:51.05 | Arrowmaster | theres 120 titans in that area right now |
| 22:52.30 | Amarande | Dagmar: ISK isn't purchased for money, though, is it? That's the other currency, dammit, what was it called |
| 22:53.03 | Amarande | It'd be like a bunch of credits in SW:TOR being taken back by EA, it's Cartel Coins that go with cash |
| 22:53.15 | Arrowmaster | you can purchase PLEX for money which is an in game item that gives you 1 month of playtime |
| 22:53.23 | Arrowmaster | you can sell that PLEX then |
| 22:53.23 | Amarande | yeah, that I know |
| 22:53.47 | Amarande | but Dagmar was implying a certain amount of ISK vanishing from the game meant that the EVE operators actually got raw money out of the deal |
| 22:54.02 | Maldivia | Arrowmaster: battles that size are basically just spreadsheet with colorful background :P |
| 22:54.05 | Amarande | however, as I understand it, ISK is basically like gold or credits, it isn't *direct* money like PLEX or Aurum or whatever that other stuff was |
| 22:54.39 | Amarande | (well, unless the EVE operators are covertly selling ISK on the side through the RMT markets ...) |
| 23:02.17 | Dagmar | By now they almost certainly are |
| 23:03.07 | Dagmar | I doubt it's huge volumes |
| 23:03.32 | Dagmar | Sell a small amount and you can basically buy your way into the edges of who is fucking with your economy |
| 23:05.38 | jleclanche | Icicle: oh i am so liking this draw. |
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| 23:07.44 | jleclanche | Icicle: https://mediacru.sh/ZBsGLCbetj_5 |
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