| 00:09.16 | Amarande | foxlit: any word on what the next expansion's centerpiece will be? |
| 00:09.30 | *** join/#wowuidev Hazal (~Mikkel@0x5e910d43.adsl.cybercity.dk) |
| 00:09.43 | Amarande | hopefully they implement the annual pass better than they did last time though. I remember lots of people having issues related to unforeseeable billing glitches and the like |
| 00:09.52 | foxlit | Neffi_! |
| 00:09.59 | Amarande | I still think they should just charge for the whole year up front when you buy the pass, like when LOTRO does the 12 months for $99 deals |
| 00:10.00 | Neffi_ | foxlit! |
| 00:10.06 | foxlit | Do you like my addon? :) |
| 00:10.12 | Neffi_ | Which one? |
| 00:10.19 | foxlit | <PROTECTED> |
| 00:10.26 | Neffi_ | I like the name |
| 00:11.35 | foxlit | that's an excellent start! |
| 00:11.40 | Neffi_ | I'm calling shenanigans |
| 00:12.20 | Semlar | oh foxlit you know better than to upload obfuscated code |
| 00:12.33 | foxlit | It's the original source code, Semlar. |
| 00:12.39 | Semlar | it's a violation |
| 00:12.40 | foxlit | I honestly have no other versions :) |
| 00:12.57 | Neffi_ | It's not obfuscated, foxlit is just an alien for whom short variable names are actually menaingful |
| 00:13.38 | Semlar | cairenn! foxlit's writing unreadable stuff! |
| 00:13.49 | Semlar | make him stop |
| 00:13.52 | Neffi_ | Oh Windows |
| 00:13.54 | kd3 | not that that's at all unusual for him |
| 00:14.04 | Neffi_ | How is the default behavior for .pdf files to open them as a Windows shell command? |
| 00:14.18 | foxlit | maybe the shell command is supposed to find you a pdf reader? |
| 00:14.38 | Neffi_ | But that never actually works at all |
| 00:14.42 | Neffi_ | Ever |
| 00:15.26 | Gnarfoz | that's certainly not the default, ever |
| 00:15.28 | foxlit | "kd3: not that that's at all unusual for him" << it's true; foxlit ships non-utf8 binary in .lua files. |
| 00:18.10 | foxlit | [in his defense, nobody wants a 500kb plain-text dictionary in the middle of a file] |
| 00:19.30 | Neffi_ | Fear not. I've alerted the proper authorities. Never again will foxlit's code be able to harm us. |
| 00:19.58 | foxlit | I hope the birds are kind. |
| 00:23.38 | *** join/#wowuidev VIad (~Vlad@151.117.45.31.customer.cdi.no) |
| 00:25.22 | VIad | Neffi_: the purpleness? |
| 00:25.39 | Neffi_ | The CGI? |
| 00:25.43 | Neffi_ | I think it looks accurate |
| 00:25.54 | VIad | dunno if it's cgi or not tbh |
| 00:26.00 | Torhal | foxlit: I wonder if it'll take 'em two weeks to lock it down. Did you intentionally do this right before BlizzCon? :D |
| 00:26.02 | VIad | probably is cgi |
| 00:26.12 | VIad | what Torhal? :o |
| 00:26.18 | Neffi_ | I mean, the water looks pretty perfect, right? Maybe too much |
| 00:26.29 | Gnarfoz | Torhal: haha, that was my question, too ;D |
| 00:26.35 | Torhal | VIad: He made an AddOn that can make decisions with a macro during combat |
| 00:26.46 | VIad | ehm |
| 00:26.51 | VIad | how is the macro changed during combat? :p |
| 00:27.06 | foxlit | Torhal: the timing is mostly random. I think it really depends on how widely known the existence of this thing becomes. |
| 00:27.21 | Torhal | VIad: Read the source. |
| 00:27.22 | foxlit | It'd make very little sense to rush out client patches for an audience of three. |
| 00:27.22 | VIad | there was an exploit a while ago with the slash command secure handler |
| 00:27.40 | VIad | http://paste2.org/CKjb2vNZ ? |
| 00:27.45 | VIad | not sure what it is |
| 00:27.58 | Neffi_ | foxlit: If I were you, I'd submit this to the team and claim it's a proof-of-concept |
| 00:28.16 | Torhal | VIad: [17:06:53] foxlit: http://www.wowinterface.com/downloads/info22599-Purrmetheus.html , http://wow.curseforge.com/addons/purrmetheus/ , and http://townlong-yak.com/purrmetheus/ . Your move, addon sites :) |
| 00:28.19 | Neffi_ | Because if you have some idea that this SHOULD be against the ToU, and fail to notify them, you can come out as the wrongdoer |
| 00:28.24 | foxlit | I've complained about this to Iriel like in 3.x. |
| 00:28.42 | VIad | aah |
| 00:28.43 | Neffi_ | Well now you have a working proof-of-concept. |
| 00:29.34 | Neffi_ | VIad: By the way it's not CGI |
| 00:29.54 | foxlit | That didn't take four years to write :) |
| 00:30.04 | Neffi_ | I chose too good of a picture. But I think a lot of the reason we find fault with CGI is because we go in knowing it's CGI. |
| 00:30.44 | Neffi_ | I've come across CGI that's so good, I have to argue with myself if I believe it's CGI. I'll find lighting on surfaces that look off, but I can't even remember if they would actually look like that in a real image. |
| 00:30.49 | VIad | foxlit: that dice code looks lol :P |
| 00:31.59 | VIad | well you do use the secure template and something about random rolling, lol? |
| 00:32.00 | Neffi_ | If I went into this thinking it's CGI, I might find fault that the landscape is fading to blue too closely, or that the water looks too perfect and too blue |
| 00:32.14 | foxlit | besides, I'm not even sure what "submit this to the team" means in this case. Do I make a post on the forums saying "hey, I broke your game, and you can get this terrible, terrible thing over there"? |
| 00:32.27 | Iriel | No, you have me email the UI devs |
| 00:32.33 | Iriel | And say "you really should fix this" |
| 00:32.37 | Iriel | "again" |
| 00:32.40 | Gnarfoz | they should "really fix" a lot of things |
| 00:32.40 | Neffi_ | The UI devs have public emails? |
| 00:32.42 | Gnarfoz | but they don't |
| 00:32.52 | Gnarfoz | :D |
| 00:32.53 | kd3 | they don't. a bunch of us know them, though |
| 00:32.53 | Stanzilla | ui devs are lazy and bad fucks |
| 00:32.55 | Stanzilla | :) |
| 00:32.56 | Semlar | or just let it sort itself out |
| 00:33.06 | Xinhuan | someone found a new exploit? |
| 00:33.16 | kd3 | go look at foxlit's new addon |
| 00:33.17 | Neffi_ | blame foxlit |
| 00:33.27 | Xinhuan | just summarize heh |
| 00:33.29 | Gnarfoz | seems to be not that new, or regression |
| 00:33.39 | Neffi_ | Xinhuan: He created an auto-rotation addon |
| 00:33.42 | kd3 | http://townlong-yak.com/purrmetheus/ |
| 00:33.57 | Gnarfoz | should have called it AutoMacro (Fan Update) |
| 00:33.58 | Neffi_ | One that definitely shouldn't be possible |
| 00:33.59 | Gnarfoz | :D |
| 00:34.21 | Xinhuan | heh |
| 00:34.29 | Xinhuan | so how does the exploit work |
| 00:34.32 | Neffi_ | I can't help but feel guilty. I told him he couldn't do it. I guess he took that as a challenge. |
| 00:34.48 | Semlar | you'll have to ask foxlit since he obfuscated his script |
| 00:35.03 | Neffi_ | He didn't obfuscate his script. He just didn't make it very readable. |
| 00:35.10 | Semlar | THAT IS WHAT FUCKING OBFUSCATION MEANS |
| 00:35.19 | *** join/#wowuidev Gragagrogog (~Gragagrog@ip-89-177-116-251.net.upcbroadband.cz) |
| 00:35.34 | Neffi_ | Using bad names for variables isn't really obfuscation. It's more like, assholery. |
| 00:35.34 | Semlar | it has nothing to do with running it through something to obfuscate it |
| 00:35.44 | Xinhuan | i don't see whats the big deal even if its public knowledge heh |
| 00:35.52 | Semlar | he's just a dick |
| 00:35.56 | Neffi_ | lol |
| 00:37.07 | Xinhuan | i'll just assume its being very sneaky with the state drivers :P |
| 00:37.14 | Xinhuan | and now remove this from my mind hehe |
| 00:37.19 | foxlit | it's like 3x50 lines of code. |
| 00:37.46 | Cairenn | Torhal: ping? |
| 00:40.08 | foxlit | It really shouldn't require c'thulu-like levels of madness to read through them :) |
| 00:43.20 | Semlar | because the number of lines matters |
| 00:43.59 | foxlit | Well, yes, it does. They're humanely-sized lines, so it really puts a bound on the total amount of code you'd have to hold in your head. |
| 00:44.24 | Semlar | doesn't matter to me, i'm not the one trying to decipher it |
| 00:45.28 | Semlar | i'm just pointing out it's against the tos to upload an addon in this format |
| 00:46.34 | Semlar | presumably they should take it down |
| 00:47.43 | Neffi | Vague variables name is not really obscurity |
| 00:48.03 | Neffi | If the terms were that tight, I'd probably have to delete half the addons I use |
| 00:48.07 | Semlar | neffi, it's intentionally written to obscure what it does |
| 00:48.19 | Semlar | that's EXACTLY what they say you can't do in the ToS |
| 00:48.22 | Amarande | I think we're ending up with an argument that's pretty much semantic, but also relevant due to the ToS |
| 00:48.26 | Neffi | The author is claiming it's not, so no, it's not intentional |
| 00:48.34 | Semlar | oh okay |
| 00:48.43 | Amarande | namely, whether the obfuscation rule means that you're required to actively take a certain level of pains to make the code readable |
| 00:48.51 | Neffi | It's also MIT licensed, so you can fork it and make it more readable if you wish |
| 00:48.52 | Amarande | or whether you're simply required NOT to take pains to make it UNreadable |
| 00:49.10 | Neffi | I'm gonna go with the 2nd one |
| 00:49.31 | foxlit | Personally, I view the obfuscation clause of the addon development policy (not connected to the tos?) to mean that I can't write some code, then run it through some program that'd spit out some derived code that looks like crap, and then ship only that code. |
| 00:49.32 | Amarande | yeah, I'm presuming it's the latter, too |
| 00:49.40 | VIad | btw foxlit if it really works it's bannable even if you only use an addon to exploit the secure handler :P |
| 00:49.41 | Amarande | the former would basically make it actionable to simply be poor at coding well |
| 00:49.46 | Semlar | no foxlit, that's not what it means |
| 00:50.04 | Semlar | if you hand-wrote exactly what would come out of an obfuscation script that doesn't make it okay |
| 00:50.04 | Neffi | I'm gonna agree with VIad here too |
| 00:50.06 | VIad | just saying, I was banned a while ago for using a similar secure handler bug to cast spells with lua code and many got banned |
| 00:50.08 | *** join/#wowuidev MysticalOS (~Myst@h41.59.186.173.dynamic.ip.windstream.net) |
| 00:50.12 | VIad | including myself, and it was "just" an addon :P |
| 00:50.24 | Neffi | The method you use to circumvent the restrictions doesn't matter. This seems to be an oversight in the design of the secure system. |
| 00:50.41 | Amarande | And the last time I remember it being an offence to suck at something in a game, at least, was back in the days of the level-down era with Draconian rules about "training mobs" heh |
| 00:51.04 | Neffi | Training mobs? |
| 00:51.09 | foxlit | "VIad: just saying, I was banned a while ago for using a similar secure handler bug to cast spells with lua code and many got banned" << that sounds really weird. How would anyone even know? |
| 00:51.10 | Semlar | like pokemon |
| 00:51.20 | VIad | no clue foxlit |
| 00:51.32 | Amarande | Neffi: "training" referred to leading mobs to other players without their consent |
| 00:51.34 | VIad | maybe they have some tools at their disposal that we aren't told about |
| 00:51.39 | Amarande | it was a big offence in the level-down era |
| 00:51.47 | Neffi | Maybe a dev or GM got their hands on the code? It's not that out of the question that they keep an eye on the state of affairs |
| 00:51.48 | VIad | warden can update regardless of the users consent so :P |
| 00:52.05 | VIad | he wonders how blizzard can track down who uses an addon and not |
| 00:52.07 | Neffi | I don't know what level-down era means |
| 00:52.19 | Amarande | which also though led to undue punishment for less skilled players, because if you ran from a mob (and in those days they didn't leash unless you zoned) you would be considered to have trained them to all players at zone's edge |
| 00:52.20 | VIad | but they do have the addon ban system so they could probably find specific addons running on clients too |
| 00:52.25 | Neffi | But I do know people used to do that back in vanilla, and it was somewhat exploitable |
| 00:52.34 | Amarande | Neffi: in the earlier days of MMORPGs, mostly prior to WoW (FFXI was the last major game I know of to have it) |
| 00:52.37 | Neffi | Kill people from your own faction, or on a PvE server |
| 00:52.51 | Gnarfoz | used what to do that |
| 00:52.52 | Amarande | when you died, you'd lose experience ... kinda like in Diablo 2, except that you could actually lose your current level as well |
| 00:52.54 | Neffi | It used to be doable in WoW, but it never seemed to be a big problem |
| 00:53.08 | Amarande | hence why training mobs was a particularly grave offence back then |
| 00:53.10 | Gnarfoz | how? |
| 00:53.47 | Neffi | In fact I'm pretty sure that was never against the WoW terms, because it was pretty common for people to kite world bosses to towns/cities and watch them wreak havox |
| 00:53.57 | Semlar | people got banned for that |
| 00:53.59 | Neffi | I've done it more than a few times |
| 00:54.13 | foxlit | Semlar: I wrote what made sense to me, not what would come out of any script. If you somehow think it makes no sense, that's a problem in your head, not mine. |
| 00:54.18 | Neffi | I had a GM contact me once, and join in for a good laugh as people rage-quit |
| 00:54.21 | Semlar | no, you didn't fox |
| 00:54.27 | VIad | foxlit: do you exploit overflows or something? :P |
| 00:54.32 | VIad | by overflowing* |
| 00:54.35 | *** join/#wowuidev kd3|hate`net (~Kaydeethr@unaffiliated/kd3) |
| 00:54.48 | Semlar | but i like that you're persistent |
| 00:56.08 | Semlar | look, i enjoy writing difficult to read code as much as the next guy, but admit that it's intentional |
| 00:56.50 | VIad | hard to read code won't do much if one sits down to try and figure it out, it's not too much code, but still annoying hehe :P |
| 00:57.11 | Iriel | I think foxlit's code would survive the "Could simply be someone who likes short variables, and wants to bind commonly used stuff to locals" test |
| 00:57.28 | Gnarfoz | it's certainly not unreadable |
| 00:57.29 | VIad | hehe, yeah :P |
| 00:57.35 | Gnarfoz | which is what the rule was about |
| 00:57.49 | VIad | maybe incomprehensible is a better word? |
| 00:57.51 | Iriel | It's also not trying to hide its true purpose |
| 00:57.53 | Gnarfoz | it was against the stuff for example Carbonite did |
| 00:57.58 | Iriel | How about "Cryptic"? |
| 00:58.10 | Gnarfoz | (i.e. having the entire addon be a big loadstring blob ;P) |
| 00:58.41 | VIad | what if someone has the long variables syndrome and likes to create variables with 20+ random characters |
| 00:58.43 | Semlar | i honestly don't know what you guys think obfuscation for a language like this is supposed to look like |
| 00:59.01 | VIad | obfuscating lua Semlar? |
| 00:59.04 | Gnarfoz | I just named an example |
| 00:59.05 | Semlar | aside from removing whitespace, there is very little more you could do |
| 00:59.08 | Neffi | They just gave you a shining example, Semlar. Carbonite |
| 00:59.09 | foxlit | I like "Cryptic" |
| 00:59.26 | VIad | oh the old carbonite :D |
| 00:59.33 | VIad | it used loadstring in recursion |
| 01:00.05 | foxlit | but it's just that I have no particular attachment to providing non-short to variables that live for like 3 lines. |
| 01:00.10 | foxlit | ^names. |
| 01:00.45 | VIad | damn can't find carbonite pre version 3 :( |
| 01:00.56 | Amarande | speaking of obfuscated code |
| 01:01.04 | Amarande | whatever happened to the International Obfuscated C Code Contest? |
| 01:01.08 | Amarande | you don't hear about that anymore, either :S |
| 01:01.12 | VIad | still is there Amarande! |
| 01:01.13 | kd3|hate`net | it's still around |
| 01:01.22 | kd3 | the underhanded code contest is more interesting, though |
| 01:01.23 | Iriel | http://www.ioccc.org/ |
| 01:01.56 | Amarande | also, is blizzard trying to hate on budding alchemists these days, heh |
| 01:02.28 | Amarande | I don't think the minor healing potion -> lesser healing potion recipe used to use briarthorn :| |
| 01:02.42 | Amarande | *and* there's barely any briarthorn in silverpine anymore |
| 01:02.56 | Amarande | *and* half the nodes you find in hillsbrad are guarded by those ever-irritating stun-on-aggro worgen :P |
| 01:02.57 | VIad | http://www.ioccc.org/2011/goren/goren.c :D |
| 01:03.18 | Neffi | hahaha |
| 01:03.35 | Amarande | goren ... with a name like that I'd expect it to play bridge LOL |
| 01:04.00 | VIad | we should write our lua addons like that |
| 01:04.04 | VIad | make art out of the code |
| 01:04.46 | Arrowmaster | well thats not good, my phone just said "Process system not responding" |
| 01:04.50 | Neffi | Well, that would be against the terms |
| 01:04.53 | Semlar | "it's not obfuscated, he's just expressing himself" |
| 01:04.57 | VIad | :P |
| 01:05.10 | Shirik | now there's an interesting statement |
| 01:05.16 | Shirik | is encryption protected by the first amendment? |
| 01:05.32 | VIad | ask what the FBI thinks about what snowden did |
| 01:05.40 | Neffi | define "protected" |
| 01:05.42 | foxlit | unless you shout encrypted fire in a crowded theater, shirik? |
| 01:05.45 | Neffi | That's still a debate in the US |
| 01:05.52 | Shirik | so VIad, that kinda doesn't matter |
| 01:05.54 | Neffi | Some judges have decided it is, others have decided it's not |
| 01:06.05 | Shirik | because you sign a document waving your right to release those documents |
| 01:06.15 | Neffi | You MAY get away with encrypting stuff, but chances are you'll be compelled to provide the password |
| 01:06.24 | VIad | ah ok, I just figured they just wanted to read his mail regardless of contents :P |
| 01:06.45 | kd3 | which breaks the 5th, neffi |
| 01:06.53 | Neffi | I agree, kd3 |
| 01:06.58 | Neffi | But some judges don't |
| 01:07.00 | Shirik | VIad: http://www.wrc.noaa.gov/wrso/forms/SF312.PDF |
| 01:07.18 | Neffi | Only the courts have the power to decide if that sentiment should hold, and more disagree with it than agree |
| 01:07.49 | Neffi | So if your primary problem is a legal one, you might be better off depending on obscurity than security |
| 01:10.01 | Neffi | How it seems to hold is, if it can be shown beyond a reasonable doubt that you DO own the encrypted device/file/etc, and it was involved in a crime, then you will be compelled to provide the password to unlock it. The only defense you can make against that is to try to claim you don't own it. |
| 01:10.34 | Neffi | I believe failing to comply with providing the password is probably indefinite contempt |
| 01:10.42 | Semlar | better not forget your password |
| 01:10.46 | Neffi | haha |
| 01:10.53 | Neffi | I too wondered what would happen |
| 01:11.06 | Neffi | "Then you'll rot in jail 'til you remember it!" |
| 01:11.15 | Shirik | lost his PGP key the other day :( |
| 01:11.21 | Neffi | =( |
| 01:11.24 | Shirik | basically just as bad |
| 01:11.31 | Neffi | Basically? |
| 01:11.32 | Amarande | Then you get held in contempt till neurophysicians learn to interpret EEG waves precisely enough to be able to read the password from your brain directly :) |
| 01:11.38 | Neffi | It's practically the same thing as losing the PW |
| 01:11.53 | Neffi | Amarande: Ah, not necessarily |
| 01:12.23 | Shirik | fortunately I had another proof of identity |
| 01:12.29 | VIad | yourself? |
| 01:12.30 | Neffi | It's been well held that pieces of your body belong to you. There are situations where you can be compelled to provide, say a tissue sample. But it seems to be harder to get by than being compelled to provide a password. |
| 01:12.30 | Shirik | so I can convince people to sign my new key |
| 01:12.32 | Shirik | but still |
| 01:12.51 | Neffi | You may have a valid defense that your brainwaves are your property, and they have no right to compel you to allow their reading |
| 01:13.18 | Shirik | that's ok |
| 01:13.24 | Shirik | we'll just inject you with that talky stuff from the matrix |
| 01:13.31 | Neffi | heh |
| 01:13.47 | Neffi | I'm glad truth serum is a myth |
| 01:13.50 | Amarande | though, from what I've gathered on ars anyway (not that I'm anything close to resembling a lawyerish type) |
| 01:13.51 | Semlar | estrogen? |
| 01:14.02 | Neffi | It's scary to think something like that exists to the extent that movies claim it does |
| 01:14.15 | Amarande | is that the litmus seems to be that if they are reasonably sure there's something specific related to a specific crime on your computer, then it's permitted for them to demand the password |
| 01:14.24 | Amarande | but they can't demand it based on "you look suspicious, we want to go fishing" |
| 01:14.29 | Neffi | That's true |
| 01:14.35 | Neffi | But it's a grey area |
| 01:14.59 | Amarande | Semlar: oh, we get dosed with that several times a day |
| 01:15.04 | Neffi | Say, if you commit a crime and they get a warrant to seize your computer, than they can very well say "it's part of an ongoing investigation" and claim it has relevance to the crime, whether or not it actually does |
| 01:15.08 | Amarande | you know that thermal receipt paper you probably got from starbucks this morning? |
| 01:15.16 | Semlar | that was a lil joke |
| 01:15.22 | Amarande | it's brimming with bisphenol A, which is basically an estrogen clone :D |
| 01:15.24 | Neffi | So if you had encrypted documents that would incriminate you on something entirely different, you might end up being forced to do so |
| 01:15.33 | Semlar | i don't touch receipts |
| 01:15.50 | Neffi | Amarande: That doesn't sound reasonable. I'm gonna ask for a source on that. |
| 01:16.14 | Neffi | But it's also irrelevant, because most of what you eat contains soy in some form, and some compounds in soy are an estrogen analogue |
| 01:16.19 | Neffi | So you get estrogen regardless |
| 01:16.22 | Amarande | https://www.sciencenews.org/blog/science-public/concerned-about-bpa-check-your-receipts |
| 01:16.40 | Amarande | yeah, perhaps more irritating in that light is the sexist nature of such things |
| 01:16.45 | Amarande | since it mimics female hormones, it's okay |
| 01:16.55 | Amarande | if it were to mimic male hormones though it would be "your product contains steroids gtfo" before you could blink |
| 01:17.04 | Neffi | Whereas if it mimiced male hormones it might be a stronger topic. I agree. |
| 01:17.25 | Semlar | testosterone is a p srs drug |
| 01:17.38 | Neffi | I'm jonesing for some right now |
| 01:17.51 | Amarande | also for some reason testosterone seems to be regarded as more dangerous than female stuff |
| 01:18.07 | Amarande | like ... a guy handles receipts all day and thus comes in contact with loads of BPA? that's nothing to even blink about generally |
| 01:18.12 | Neffi | Of course, we all know men are naturally evil, violent and aggressive things! |
| 01:18.20 | Semlar | because of testosterone |
| 01:18.29 | Semlar | it's also why we die younger and go bald |
| 01:18.35 | Semlar | oh well |
| 01:18.38 | Amarande | otoh, things like androgel, based on the ads, are all labeled with dire warnings like "if you are a woman and so much as come in contact with this, seek medical attention" |
| 01:19.05 | Neffi | Well it's not good to be giving yourself hormones no matter which way you slice it |
| 01:19.17 | Neffi | Just a matter of whether or not soy products should carry the warning for men |
| 01:19.25 | Neffi | Which won't happen |
| 01:19.40 | *** join/#wowuidev Droolio (~drool@host109-158-208-103.range109-158.btcentralplus.com) |
| 01:19.41 | VIad | is it true that in North Dakota it's illegal to serve pretzels with beer (at the same time)? |
| 01:19.53 | Semlar | who the hell knows what goes on in north dakota |
| 01:19.59 | Neffi | VIad: wtf? |
| 01:20.04 | VIad | it's supposedly an outdated law :p |
| 01:20.24 | Neffi | I'm not surprised |
| 01:20.30 | kd3 | http://lmgtfy.com/?q=north+dakota+pretzel+beer+law |
| 01:20.35 | kd3 | not that hard |
| 01:20.38 | Neffi | In NY, if you sell primarily beer, it's illegal to server any other alcohol product |
| 01:20.51 | Amarande | VIad: technically in Connecticut if you take the Christian God's name in vain it's supposed to be a capital offence, too heh |
| 01:20.56 | VIad | hehe |
| 01:21.00 | Amarande | oh, and there's one town, I forget where, that it's illegal for bees to fly through |
| 01:21.02 | Neffi | But if beer just makes up a small percentage of what you sell (even if you have aisles and aisles of beer), you can have wine right next to it |
| 01:21.12 | VIad | so technically if you dislike someone you can report them for breaking these laws I guess? |
| 01:21.19 | VIad | get them jailed/fined |
| 01:21.30 | Neffi | It's all up to the district attorney to prosecute or not, really |
| 01:21.37 | Semlar | what if beer makes up a small percentage of what you sell because of all of the other alcohol you're serving |
| 01:21.44 | Neffi | And they usually need to play the politics |
| 01:21.47 | Amarande | it's basically to ensure that the powers that be get to play calvinball |
| 01:21.56 | Neffi | So it wouldn't be in their best interest to be jailing people for saying "god-damn" |
| 01:22.00 | Amarande | you know, so if they want to hunt someone down, they have something however obscure to tag them for :P |
| 01:22.12 | Neffi | Semlar: I mean in terms of things like food |
| 01:22.21 | Amarande | like those various major federal cases, like the Swartz case and the like pretty much boil down to |
| 01:22.30 | Neffi | Semlar: Licquor stores do not carry beer at all, and can't. Beer stores do not carry licquor, and can't. |
| 01:22.34 | Amarande | the *real* crime was rarely if ever really what they were being prosecuted for |
| 01:22.41 | Amarande | the real crime was daring to stick it to the powers that be :P |
| 01:22.43 | Neffi | Whereas my local supermarket carries both |
| 01:23.09 | Semlar | my publix sure as hell does not sell liquor |
| 01:23.11 | *** join/#wowuidev Funkeh` (~Funkeh`@WoWUIDev/WoWAce/Ace3/BigWigs/funkeh) |
| 01:23.23 | Neffi | Wine is considered liquor |
| 01:23.27 | Semlar | they have wine |
| 01:23.29 | Neffi | they don't sell Jack or anything |
| 01:23.42 | Neffi | Although I wish I could get some nice Jonnie Walker from Pathmark |
| 01:23.46 | Amarande | here in Connecticut, grocery stores can sell beer only; liquor stores can sell all alcoholic beverages |
| 01:24.08 | Neffi | It seems so arbitrary |
| 01:24.26 | Neffi | "But this objectively reduces drunk driving!" <- so does better enforcement and more stringent laws |
| 01:24.29 | Semlar | what's arbitrary is that whiskey can be produced in a dry county but can't be sold there |
| 01:24.34 | Neffi | I wish I could redo all these absurdities in the legal system |
| 01:24.36 | kd3 | beer laws are fun. thank prohibition |
| 01:25.16 | kd3 | dry counties are fun too. oh, we can't buy hard alcohol here? good thing there's ~5 liquor stores 5 feet from the county line |
| 01:25.55 | VIad | movie where someone threw themselves through a window from the 20th floor |
| 01:26.05 | VIad | skyscraper windows are thick as fuck aren't they? |
| 01:26.10 | Neffi | Yes |
| 01:26.21 | kd3 | though it's happened in the past |
| 01:26.40 | Neffi | Unless it was faulty or installed improperly, you're not breaking through it |
| 01:26.55 | Neffi | I doubt if a baseball bat could break through those windows. Though a gun could. |
| 01:27.12 | Torhal | Cairenn: pong |
| 01:28.17 | Neffi | In fact I'm curious how these windows would respond to bullets |
| 01:28.30 | VIad | go test it out Neffi |
| 01:28.39 | Neffi | I'm inclined to think it's be more like a clean hole through the window, not a wide crack that would allow you to easily break the rest |
| 01:28.52 | Neffi | This isn't exactly the same glass that's in your 1-story condo |
| 01:29.28 | Neffi | VIad: You try getting a gun permit in NY |
| 01:29.41 | VIad | probably easier back in the 1990s |
| 01:29.52 | Neffi | You'd have better luck checkign random trashcans for a disposed-of murder weapon |
| 01:30.09 | VIad | underground probably much easier Neffi |
| 01:30.20 | Neffi | Oh, it definitely is |
| 01:30.35 | Neffi | Not to incriminate myself or others, but I could probably have a gun delivered to me in a few hours |
| 01:31.31 | VIad | "If we don't deliver your gun within 24 hours you get to keep it for free!" |
| 01:31.43 | Neffi | lol |
| 01:31.47 | VIad | was trying to do one of those pizza delivery deals |
| 01:32.10 | Neffi | Those don't exist here |
| 01:32.29 | Neffi | Dominos can't compete with the vast amounts of local pizzerias that offer better quality food for cheaper |
| 01:32.35 | Amarande | Window faults have happened in the past |
| 01:32.39 | Amarande | like that infamous Darwin Award |
| 01:32.42 | Neffi | The only business they get is from stoners, really |
| 01:33.11 | Amarande | there was this lawyer who was teaching a group of law students about how safe skyscraper glass is by throwing himself into it a couple of times around the ... 20-something floor I think it was |
| 01:33.24 | Amarande | ... and of course that would be the day the glass would give out and send him going splat |
| 01:33.41 | VIad | then his family sued the glass provider for 10 billion dollars and won? |
| 01:33.51 | Amarande | the tale doesn't seem to go further than that |
| 01:33.59 | Amarande | mostly because it generally focuses on what an idiot he was |
| 01:34.02 | Neffi | Well this is a tale |
| 01:34.16 | Neffi | Anyway a lawsuit would have been likely here in the states |
| 01:34.21 | VIad | I figure it's common to sue in US, sorry about my expectations being too high. :( |
| 01:34.29 | Neffi | Oh it definitely is |
| 01:34.48 | Neffi | If somebody gets hurt, and you can even vaguely suggest that another is at fault, then some lawyer will take the case, and probably win |
| 01:34.48 | kd3 | snopes said the lawyer window death is true. http://www.snopes.com/horrors/freakish/window.asp |
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| 01:37.22 | VIad | c&c cancelled |
| 01:37.24 | VIad | damn you EA! |
| 01:37.30 | VIad | I was looking forward for generals |
| 01:37.52 | VIad | I couldn't mp with zero hour due to horrible slow motion type lag. |
| 01:39.10 | Neffi | stop having high expectations for EA |
| 01:39.15 | VIad | :( |
| 01:39.21 | Neffi | you'll save yourself a lot of disappointment |
| 01:39.23 | kd3 | s/high// |
| 01:39.40 | Neffi | No, I have expectations |
| 01:39.44 | Neffi | I expect them to botch things |
| 01:39.49 | Neffi | I expect them to alienate gamers |
| 01:39.56 | Neffi | I expect them to be a scar on the industry |
| 01:40.16 | VIad | I loved generals humoristic portrayal of the various factions :D |
| 01:40.30 | VIad | the gla units were awesome |
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| 01:41.57 | VIad | time for bed in a moment! |
| 01:48.24 | Amarande | SW:TOR is still quite an awesome offering, though, as long as the installer works now |
| 01:48.43 | Amarande | last time I had to cancel because the installer got in such a snarl that eventually it told me the program couldn't run because it wasn't written for Windows |
| 02:18.11 | Neffi | SW:TOR didn't impress me |
| 02:18.20 | Neffi | It lacks the heart and direction that makes WoW good |
| 02:19.01 | *** join/#wowuidev Aeger73 (~quassel@ip70-176-63-123.ph.ph.cox.net) |
| 02:19.34 | Neffi | good: http://arstechnica.com/science/2013/11/scientists-nuclear-power-can-prevent-use-of-the-atmosphere-as-a-waste-dump/ |
| 02:19.39 | Neffi | Hopefully they take it seriously |
| 02:19.55 | *** join/#wowuidev kd3|hate`net (~Kaydeethr@unaffiliated/kd3) |
| 02:20.10 | Neffi | Nuclear is such an obviously good route to take right now, especially liquid flouride thorium reactors |
| 02:20.57 | Neffi | There are reactor desgins that are literally safer than coal and natural gas stations, complete with inherent passive safety mechanisms |
| 02:21.22 | Neffi | In a good modern thorium reactor, the worst that can really happen is the plant is taken offline |
| 02:23.10 | Neffi | (I meanl of course there's risks like fire and all, but there are several solution to designing thorium reactors that nullify the risk of meltdown altogether) |
| 02:24.09 | ccox | there are also uranium and plutonium designs that nullify the risk of meltdown -- they just haven't been allowed to build and test them... |
| 02:24.28 | ccox | (of course, their power output per volume, area, and cost becomes debatable) |
| 02:25.55 | ccox | and I do wish politicians would allow more modern nuclear plants - but they still think 3 mile island, Fukushima, and Godzilla instead of learning about actual design improvements made since the 1970s |
| 02:26.21 | kd3|hate`net | s/politicians/people/ |
| 02:26.29 | kd3|hate`net | nimby overrides everything |
| 02:26.59 | Neffi | Thorium's being successfully tested in China. It does remarkably well. |
| 02:27.11 | Neffi | It's not being used here primarily because the stigma surrounding "nuclear" |
| 02:27.27 | Neffi | Let me rephase. It's being successfully USED in China |
| 02:27.46 | kd3 | how much do you think the chinese government listened to the people in the area surrounding where the plant was built? |
| 02:28.00 | Neffi | Not to mention that the fuel is incredibly abundant. We produce tons of it as a natural byproduct of mining aluminum, and we pretty much throw it out because we don't have the power plants to make use of it. |
| 02:28.12 | ccox | none - because the people around it had almost no education to even know what the words meant... |
| 02:28.19 | Neffi | Probably not much, but that doesn't mean the plant is dangerous |
| 02:28.30 | kd3 | I didn't claim that |
| 02:28.37 | Neffi | Fair enough |
| 02:29.47 | Neffi | We should start a pro-thorium campaign: good enough for Azeroth, good enough for America! |
| 02:29.54 | ccox | lol! |
| 02:30.07 | Cairenn | hah! |
| 02:30.08 | ccox | "it's already in your lantern mantles" |
| 02:31.00 | ccox | Hello, Amazon, I'd like 10,000 cases of lantern mantles... |
| 02:31.07 | Neffi | lol |
| 02:31.17 | Neffi | AFAIK thorium can't be readily weaponised |
| 02:31.38 | Neffi | Besides, you can buy uranium on Amazon |
| 02:31.42 | ccox | no, I just want to ditch PG&E, and can't do solar on my roof! |
| 02:31.56 | Neffi | So build your own reactor |
| 02:32.02 | Neffi | Warning: you'll probably die |
| 02:32.13 | Semlar | it's also illegal |
| 02:32.20 | ccox | (apparently Neffi doesn't know what my degree is in) |
| 02:32.35 | Neffi | Semlar the buzzkill, always saying "but that's illegal!" and "THAT DOESNT GO THERE" |
| 02:32.51 | Neffi | ccox: Nuclear engineer? |
| 02:32.55 | Semlar | no means no neffi |
| 02:33.20 | ccox | Physicist, with quite a bit of Nuclear and Medium energy work |
| 02:33.33 | Neffi | awesome |
| 02:33.49 | ccox | (among other little things I do) |
| 02:34.07 | Semlar | table tennis? |
| 02:34.17 | Neffi | ping pong? |
| 02:34.42 | Neffi | ccox is secretly the President of the United States |
| 02:34.55 | ccox | (Cairenn is laughing right now) |
| 02:35.06 | Cairenn | *innocent look* |
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| 02:37.13 | Neffi | lol http://i.imgur.com/ZMopIhJ.jpg |
| 02:53.10 | *** join/#wowuidev Ackis (Ackis@WoWUIDev/WoWAce/ARL/Troll/Ackis) |
| 02:53.22 | Neffi | Ackis: You're evil |
| 02:54.10 | *** join/#wowuidev Kaelten (Kaelten@WoWUIDev/WoWAce/WoWIFA/CurseStaff/kaelten) |
| 02:54.10 | *** mode/#wowuidev [+o Kaelten] by ChanServ |
| 02:54.40 | *** join/#wowuidev Sunshine (Sunshine@unaffiliated/sunshine/x-2691069) |
| 02:55.40 | *** join/#wowuidev Torhal (Torhal@2600:3c00::f03c:91ff:fedb:9160) |
| 02:56.59 | Kaelten | is this thing working? |
| 02:57.14 | Seerah | nope ;) |
| 02:57.19 | Cairenn | newp |
| 03:00.39 | Thunder_Child | And people say the men of this channel have issues.... |
| 03:00.55 | Seerah | they do :P |
| 03:01.11 | Amarande | Windows has encountered a serious error and your computer has been halted to prevent further damage, please press any key to restart your computer |
| 03:02.10 | *** join/#wowuidev ShadniX| (shadnix@p5DDFF126.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) |
| 03:02.14 | Thunder_Child | Yea, can't argue that. |
| 03:02.47 | Kaelten | those hopes are the first time in a few days people have been able to see me talk on this... |
| 03:02.50 | Kaelten | I'll take it |
| 03:03.19 | Seerah | was the word "hopes" a Freudian slip in some way? |
| 03:04.10 | Neffi | Have you been able to see other people talking? |
| 03:04.27 | Amarande | At least it means you didn't put *!*@* on ignore by mistake |
| 03:04.36 | Amarande | That happened to someone on Dalnet I think it was many years ago |
| 03:04.47 | Amarande | the poor guy was asking for someone to /msg him on how to remove it |
| 03:19.23 | Neffi | Video peeps: I'm trying to test "full floating point output" in MPC's EVR-custom renderer to get rid of color banding, but all I get it a black screen. Any ideas on why? |
| 03:20.22 | Neffi | Internal LAV is at the default settings, using the software decoder |
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| 03:52.06 | *** join/#wowuidev [Wobin] (~quassel@203-214-77-140.dyn.iinet.net.au) |
| 03:52.35 | karl_w_w | omg foxlit is going to break the world |
| 03:52.38 | karl_w_w | of warcraft |
| 03:58.28 | Neffi | ugh |
| 03:59.17 | Neffi | Color banding with MPC's renderer, or a 100°C GPU with madVR that requires a loud fan to keep from throttling the GPU |
| 03:59.40 | *** join/#wowuidev ShadniX| (shadnix@p5481D8C4.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) |
| 04:00.11 | Neffi | MPC's renderer spikes to ~70% GPU usage with float processing enabled, so even if I could get it to work, I think I'm hitting up against a thermal wall |
| 04:00.15 | Neffi | I hate laptops |
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| 04:07.57 | karl_w_w | Neffi, what do you mean MPC's renderer? EVR custom pres? |
| 04:10.44 | karl_w_w | !api getspellcooldown |
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| 04:14.29 | Neffi | yes, karl_w_w |
| 04:14.37 | Neffi | That being the default renderer in mpc |
| 04:15.07 | Neffi | I can't even get EVR to use floats. I just get a black screen. Google gives me nothing |
| 04:15.41 | karl_w_w | tried something else? |
| 04:15.43 | karl_w_w | haali? |
| 04:15.49 | Neffi | I have not |
| 04:16.20 | Neffi | I tried madVR at least, as you can see |
| 04:16.33 | Neffi | madVR with even bicubic uses too much GPU power |
| 04:17.11 | Arrowmaster | what does CCCP default it to? |
| 04:17.14 | Neffi | EVR at least can handle bicubic on my GPU, and it can even do half-float without using too much GPU -- if I could get it to actually output the results |
| 04:17.34 | Neffi | I wouldn't know, unless you're asking somebody else |
| 04:18.09 | Arrowmaster | they tend to use good defaults in cccp |
| 04:18.24 | Neffi | I can't see it being wildly different |
| 04:18.46 | Neffi | The defaults in MPC are "good". I want them to be better, notably I want something better than bilinear and I want to get rid of banding |
| 04:21.12 | karl_w_w | cccp uses evr custom pres |
| 04:21.36 | Neffi | Yeah that seems to be the case |
| 04:21.55 | Neffi | The only real issue I'm facing is the black screen when switching to a float pipeline with EVR |
| 04:22.05 | Neffi | The quality with it is otherwise good if I ignore the banding |
| 04:22.17 | Arrowmaster | are you sure its not the source? |
| 04:22.22 | Neffi | Positive |
| 04:22.26 | Neffi | Does it on every source |
| 04:22.32 | Arrowmaster | i didnt know the renderer could cause noticable banding |
| 04:22.34 | Neffi | And no banding with madVR at all |
| 04:23.16 | Neffi | It's not a huge amount of banding, but on certain scenes where it's very pronounced, there's a big gap between EVR and madVR because of it |
| 04:23.29 | Neffi | Like the higher-contrast scenes in GoT |
| 04:24.22 | Neffi | Well the point of the floating-point-processing option is to get rid of the banding, so it must be in there for a reason |
| 04:24.37 | Neffi | I think madVR uses floats by default |
| 04:26.02 | Neffi | Bah. nevcairiel: ping |
| 04:26.22 | Neffi | I hate to ping you every time I have a video issue, but I really cannot find the answer on my own, and I think you probably know |
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| 04:44.00 | karl_w_w | lol purrmetheus lags the hell out of me |
| 04:44.19 | karl_w_w | much optimization necessary |
| 04:47.38 | Amarande | karl: don't worry, it'll probably be busted by then |
| 04:47.43 | Amarande | or put in baddons, or people banned for using it |
| 05:01.09 | karl_w_w | dammit, it does better dps than me |
| 05:01.14 | karl_w_w | I was afraid of that :P |
| 05:20.15 | karl_w_w | foxlit, I've taught purrmetheus to do the entire frost mage single target rotation, want it? |
| 05:20.43 | karl_w_w | msg me |
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| 05:42.38 | znf | karl_w_w, just whisper him the snippet of code |
| 05:42.50 | znf | I'm improving the shadow priest one, last night I made a rudimentary one |
| 05:43.12 | Amarande | good thing this will be broken soon |
| 05:43.17 | znf | karl_w_w, also, how bad are you that it does better than you? :D |
| 05:43.33 | Amarande | can you imagine if it didn't? purrmetheus would probably be a mandatory addon to even get in a raid guild if blizz didn't break it :S |
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| 05:44.07 | znf | Amarande, I doubt it. |
| 05:45.22 | znf | Would take too much time to make it better than a human on multi-target fights, for example ^^ |
| 05:45.50 | Neffi | No it wouldn't |
| 05:45.57 | *** part/#wowuidev Seerah (~RyanNL@adsl-74-226-65-115.mem.bellsouth.net) |
| 05:46.02 | Neffi | It only takes one theorycrafter to sit down and work out the code |
| 05:46.24 | Neffi | Used to be that raiders worked a lot harder than that to get the numbers up, before we had automated tools to do it |
| 05:46.43 | Neffi | If this doesn't break, I'm siding with Amarande on this, it will becomes mandatory in due time |
| 05:47.07 | Amarande | Neffi: at which point we basically hope the next expansion breaks it or go back to SW:TOR, I guess |
| 05:47.25 | Amarande | or LOTRO |
| 05:47.34 | Neffi | And what if some clever coder develops a tool to automatically feed a rotation parser's results into code for it? Then every patch, we will have auto-rotations the very first hour |
| 05:47.39 | Amarande | although I'm still a little worried about whether LOTRO raiding has developed a severe pay to win aspect |
| 05:48.01 | Neffi | Or if it's forked and redeveloped to compile its own macros from templates fed to it by auto-theorycrafters |
| 05:48.17 | Neffi | It's not hard to ruin raiding altogether, if this isn't fixed or outlawed |
| 05:49.47 | Neffi | Amarande: That's why I inherently distrust the F2P model |
| 05:50.07 | Neffi | A game may start out good, but it's built upon a certain premise, one that you cannot trust to maintain the integrity of the game |
| 05:51.42 | Neffi | A F2P model built such that it cannot compromise the quality of gameplay must pretty much be restricted to vanity items, unlocking new content, or similar. The former isn't a strong monetization model, and the latter is a fine line before the game is no longer really F2P |
| 05:52.12 | Amarande | SW:TOR's F2P model is pretty much un-corrupt |
| 05:52.13 | znf | works out pretty well for LOl? |
| 05:52.26 | Amarande | well, you do have to pay to win basically if you're not a subscriber, but subscribing deals with that nicely |
| 05:52.43 | Amarande | actually LOTRO's is *mostly* non-corrupt except for a couple of things |
| 05:52.53 | Neffi | I consider giving player's the option to pay-to-win, to be against the intregrity of the game, when you have competition in place |
| 05:52.54 | Amarande | the impact of which I'm completely unsure about |
| 05:53.17 | Amarande | a) the fact that you can buy a DPS boost consumable item in the store |
| 05:53.20 | Neffi | MMOs nowadays are also largely a min-maxing, race-to-the-top system. I don't agree with that model. |
| 05:53.30 | Neffi | I don't believe in a game where the leveling process is nothing but a trial period |
| 05:53.46 | Amarande | which may be the only way to get it now, because it used to be available through the destiny point system but it seems like they nerfed that into oblivion |
| 05:53.53 | Neffi | So if I were to develop a game where the level process IS the game, not corrupting that would mean I cannot monetize easy leveling |
| 05:54.06 | Amarande | b) the star-lit crystals are the ones I'm really more concerned about |
| 05:54.41 | Amarande | basically, lotro has this nifty upgradable weapon system. legendary weapons level up & you get points to invest as you see fit in various aspects of the weapon |
| 05:55.05 | Amarande | a nice deal. but now they have these things called star-lit crystals that you can install up to 3 of in a weapon and it basically gives you extra dps tiers |
| 05:55.11 | Neffi | I'm still drafting an MMO that I probably won't be able to seriously develop for a long time, but one of its core tenets is that there are no player levels. In a F2P landscape, how does that compete? |
| 05:55.38 | Neffi | Paying for upgrades that make a difference in combat I think is a terrible model |
| 05:55.40 | Amarande | the problem is this: star-lits give a particularly strong boost to Second Age weapons, and not so much to First Age weapons |
| 05:56.13 | Amarande | however, the only real way to get either First Age weapons *or* Star-lits at any frequency in-game is to do Tier 2 (basically heroic) raids |
| 05:56.38 | Neffi | which I'm guessing you need First Age to do? |
| 05:56.41 | Amarande | otherwise, you have to get them from the auction house (at insane prices) or from the store at 5 bucks a pop |
| 05:56.47 | Amarande | not necessarily, but it *really really helps* |
| 05:56.58 | Amarande | especially since, here's the real kicker as to the direction they were going |
| 05:57.02 | Neffi | I was really, really happy to learn that ESO is going with WoW's subscription model |
| 05:57.11 | Amarande | Star-lits were introduced when Orthanc was the current endgame |
| 05:57.21 | Amarande | Orthanc is like, ENTIRELY based around DPS race, especially at Tier 2 |
| 05:57.35 | Amarande | on top of that, they made the DPS difference between Second and First Age weapons a lot wider |
| 05:57.41 | Neffi | Exceptions aside, I cannot see a great game that's developed at a large scale, with exceptional quality throughout, to be able to hinge on an F2P model |
| 05:57.52 | Neffi | There's a reason that WoW stands out in the MMO field in terms of balance and polish |
| 05:58.01 | Neffi | It doesn't have to give up integrity to monetize |
| 05:58.03 | Amarande | (at earlier level caps, they were a lot closer, such that a fully upgraded Second actually might beat out a non-upgraded First) |
| 05:58.11 | Neffi | Even if it's given up integrity for other reasons |
| 05:58.33 | Amarande | SW:TOR has no such controversial items on the other hand |
| 05:58.59 | Amarande | except for tier 7 starship upgrades, and those are of limited worth anyway because starship battles are exclusively a single player affair and are basically glorified dailies really |
| 05:58.59 | Neffi | SW:TOR receives a lot of criticism for failing to deliver quality content |
| 05:59.09 | Neffi | IME it also feels soulless |
| 05:59.10 | znf | I tried playing SW:ToR |
| 05:59.13 | znf | It felt horrible |
| 05:59.16 | znf | the character moving... oh $deity :( |
| 05:59.17 | Neffi | Yup |
| 05:59.24 | Amarande | Neffi: if you're Sith, you're really not supposed to have a soul to begin with are you? :) |
| 05:59.24 | Neffi | It doesn't feel like a great game |
| 05:59.55 | Amarande | I liked SW:TOR, I only went on hiatus because they had a huge tech snafu a bit over a month ago |
| 05:59.56 | Neffi | And I don't know that they can afford to turn that around |
| 06:00.04 | Amarande | and I didn't feel like repeatedly downloading 25GB trying to get it to work :P |
| 06:00.24 | Neffi | Maybe they can't afford a team worthy of making a real WoW competitor? |
| 06:00.26 | Neffi | I wonder why |
| 06:01.03 | Amarande | the only other items I remember seeing in the SW:TOR cash shop that are real improvements for characters, meanwhile |
| 06:01.35 | Amarande | are some leveling gear, top tier lightsaber crystals that can be used at 10 or 35 (but which don't give any better stats than the regular top tier ones at top level, so it's just a bonus while leveling) |
| 06:02.03 | Neffi | SW:ToR has its pitfalls, but even those aside, I still consider gimping the leveling system to be ugly |
| 06:02.07 | Neffi | I hate that WoW did it |
| 06:02.17 | Amarande | and a few various unlocks that are, for the most part (the race unlocks are the main exception) for F2P players only, subs get pretty much all those benefits inherently |
| 06:02.22 | Neffi | Turning leveling into a sham contributed a lot to WoW losing its charm |
| 06:02.26 | znf | Why doesn't this work? UnitDebuff("target", "Vampiric Touch","PLAYER") |
| 06:02.41 | Amarande | Yeah, WoW does have balance issues with the progression of a new character |
| 06:02.49 | Neffi | It's not just a matter of that |
| 06:02.53 | Amarande | I think you get to top level too quickly, and progress through gear at top level too slowly |
| 06:03.09 | Amarande | so you don't really get to stop and smell the roses enough while leveling |
| 06:03.34 | Neffi | Leveling in WoW is not designed to be challenging, even vaguely so. It's not designed to provide compelling gameplay. It's designed to get you to play until you hit the level cap, with just enough quirkiness in quest dialogs to make it seem like it actually has some depth |
| 06:03.36 | Amarande | and then you get to $LEVEL_CAP and get thrown into the ultra-competitive endgame pool where you're just WAY too behind the people who've been at that level for months |
| 06:03.39 | karl_w_w | <znf> karl_w_w, also, how bad are you that it does better than you? :D <- it does the exact same rotation as me except it responds to procs much faster |
| 06:03.53 | Neffi | I can't compare WoW's leveling to other MMOs, because it's still better than most of them -- that's sad |
| 06:03.55 | karl_w_w | frost mage is very proc based |
| 06:04.01 | Amarande | oh what, you don't have 540+ ilvl already? YOU ARE NOT WORTHY AS A LEVEL 90 |
| 06:04.16 | Neffi | Min-maxing takes away the appeal of being an RPG in the first place |
| 06:04.28 | Amarande | in something like LOTRO or SW:TOR, you level at a relatively sedate rate that lets you enjoy a lot more of the content more |
| 06:04.46 | Neffi | Compelling design revolves around tactics, in-the-moment decisions, situational awareness; good application of skill |
| 06:04.47 | Amarande | and you're also not made to be so incredibly far behind when you do hit the cap |
| 06:04.52 | Amarande | I think it is a better balance |
| 06:04.57 | Neffi | Not grinding out gear to be the strongest because it's a nicer color |
| 06:05.04 | Neffi | (as in, purple and not blue) |
| 06:05.32 | Amarande | in SW:TOR, you can get full crafted gear that is the highest tier but one, and the only thing you miss from that compared to raided-for 72 is the tier bonus |
| 06:05.45 | Amarande | in LOTRO, you can potentially get First Age legendaries as soon as you hit cap |
| 06:05.54 | Amarande | although it will be soul-crushingly expensive to do so |
| 06:05.57 | Neffi | When I came up witht he decision to sacrifice leveling altogether, my vision for my own game sort of fell into place beautifully |
| 06:06.02 | Neffi | Why have levels at all? |
| 06:06.06 | Amarande | (ALL First and Second Age legendaries are crafted, and none are BoP) |
| 06:06.16 | karl_w_w | .:znf:. Why doesn't this work? UnitDebuff("target", "Vampiric Touch","PLAYER") <- because UnitDebuff("target", "Vampiric Touch", nil, "PLAYER") |
| 06:06.22 | Neffi | Nothing about progression needs to depend upon levels existing |
| 06:06.31 | Neffi | It certainly doesn't once you're level-capped anyway |
| 06:06.51 | Neffi | And the idea that a level 20 can one-shot a level 1 isn't compelling design either |
| 06:07.05 | Amarande | the limiting factor for LOTRO in terms of "not everyone ends up with first agers" is instead based on two things |
| 06:08.02 | Amarande | a) every First Age legendary needs a special Symbol among the crafting materials, which only regularly drops in Tier 2 raids and is extremely rare to see otherwise (the freelottos they run can give you one, as can some of the rare item lockboxes, but lockboxes basically need you to buy a key from the store to open) |
| 06:08.38 | Amarande | b) First Age legendaries are on a seven day cooldown for crafting, and not only that, but they use mats that are also on a seven day cooldown and which are BoP |
| 06:08.57 | Neffi | So grindiness galore |
| 06:09.34 | Amarande | not really, the cooldown mats are easy enough to craft that most people get to craft them every CD |
| 06:10.55 | Amarande | but the point is that any one crafter can basically only craft *one* First Age weapon a week, no matter how many Symbols they have access to |
| 06:12.05 | Amarande | And, on top of that, you need top tier rep with your crafting guild to be able to use the recipes |
| 06:12.25 | *** join/#wowuidev bluspacecow (~bluspacec@121.99.20.19) |
| 06:12.25 | *** mode/#wowuidev [+v bluspacecow] by ChanServ |
| 06:12.29 | *** join/#wowuidev Antiarc (~Instantbi@ip68-109-131-126.ph.ph.cox.net) |
| 06:12.43 | Amarande | which doesn't really at least *feel* like that much of a grind (since it's just "craft your cooldown mats every CD and use them as rep items until you're maxed") |
| 06:13.20 | Neffi | Still doesn't sound like a fun system |
| 06:13.24 | Amarande | but more to the point, to get higher than the lowest tiers of rep with the guild requires you to either be a sub or buy an unlock from the store |
| 06:13.30 | Amarande | so there's a limited number of crafters |
| 06:13.59 | Amarande | (if your sub lapses, you keep the level of guild rep that you have, but you can't increase it till you resub or buy the unlock) |
| 06:15.26 | karl_w_w | if anyone wants to see how I did frost mage http://codepad.org/YxPojZZg |
| 06:17.57 | Neffi | http://imgur.com/gallery/b1n2o |
| 06:18.41 | Neffi | tl;dr: Owner who cannot keep his two cats and refused to give them to a kill shelter will "pay you $200 + cat food for life to adopt these 2 brothers." |
| 06:19.17 | Neffi | It looks like he has some offers, just giving a tip here for any cat lovers |
| 06:19.30 | Neffi | I'd take them for free if I could, but I can't take them at all |
| 06:26.46 | bluspacecow | ha ha ha ha |
| 06:26.47 | bluspacecow | http://us.battle.net/wow/en/forum/topic/10433523643 |
| 06:26.54 | bluspacecow | "lol" |
| 06:29.03 | Fisker | hey bluspacecow |
| 06:29.12 | bluspacecow | oh hai |
| 06:29.51 | Fisker | I got it |
| 06:30.17 | bluspacecow | got wat |
| 06:30.19 | bluspacecow | herpes ? |
| 06:31.01 | Neffi | chuckles. |
| 06:31.18 | Fisker | :( |
| 06:31.26 | Fisker | mean |
| 06:31.42 | Fisker | I got the lols |
| 06:31.45 | Amarande | blah. only got one paragraph done on my nano novel tonight :( |
| 06:32.21 | Neffi | nano novel? |
| 06:32.28 | Amarande | nanowrimo |
| 06:33.00 | bluspacecow | it's a really really really small novel Neffi |
| 06:33.05 | bluspacecow | it's 10 characters long |
| 06:33.06 | bluspacecow | :P |
| 06:33.12 | Neffi | what is this, a novel for ants? |
| 06:33.29 | bluspacecow | ha ha no |
| 06:33.33 | bluspacecow | just kidding :P |
| 06:33.40 | bluspacecow | it's a writing contest |
| 06:33.55 | bluspacecow | not sure what the N A N O stands for but i've heard it from fanctions |
| 06:33.57 | Neffi | Do they hodl this all the time? |
| 06:33.59 | Fisker | is it about your mother? |
| 06:34.24 | bluspacecow | hodl? |
| 06:34.34 | Fisker | hold |
| 06:34.47 | Neffi | NAtional NOvel WRIting MOnth, appears to be the acryonym |
| 06:34.57 | Fisker | bluspacecow can't even English |
| 06:35.07 | Neffi | nor can I so it's alrgiht |
| 06:35.15 | Neffi | It's hard when it's cold ad your fingers are numb |
| 06:35.18 | bluspacecow | Yeah it's a regular thing neffi |
| 06:35.23 | Fisker | :D |
| 06:35.31 | bluspacecow | then type with your nose Neffi |
| 06:35.35 | Fisker | a monthly thing bluspacecow |
| 06:35.37 | Fisker | ? |
| 06:35.39 | Neffi | Maybe I'll join it someday soon |
| 06:36.08 | *** join/#wowuidev Gragagrogog (~Gragagrog@ip-89-177-116-251.net.upcbroadband.cz) |
| 06:36.09 | bluspacecow | Well the novels need to be better "Hello I am Neffi. I am epic" |
| 06:36.18 | bluspacecow | ^ then |
| 06:36.23 | Neffi | than* |
| 06:36.29 | Neffi | Shows who's the better writer |
| 06:37.02 | Neffi | Nah, my novels are good |
| 06:37.03 | *** join/#wowuidev tharper (~tomh@unaffiliated/sioraiocht) |
| 06:37.04 | Fisker | I'm crazy bluspacecow |
| 06:37.25 | Fisker | morning tharper |
| 06:37.29 | tharper | hi fisker! |
| 06:37.29 | Neffi | Not a single novel I've written has gotten any negative reviews or criticism |
| 06:37.39 | Fisker | going to blizzcon? |
| 06:37.54 | karl_w_w | .:+bluspacecow:. http://us.battle.net/wow/en/forum/topic/10433523643 <- are we laughing at the retard who quoted the entire huge OP so he could write "Best thing to do is email them WoWUI@blizzard.com."? |
| 06:38.08 | bluspacecow | *giggle* |
| 06:38.27 | bluspacecow | more of the OP's post |
| 06:38.38 | Fisker | oil |
| 06:38.41 | bluspacecow | I got to the thing about the user code being hidden and was like |
| 06:38.42 | Fisker | lol |
| 06:38.43 | bluspacecow | wat |
| 06:38.50 | Fisker | almost crashed |
| 06:39.03 | Fisker | would've sucked |
| 06:40.12 | Fisker | I lold about blizzard not giving a shit by omegal |
| 06:42.43 | Fisker | no? |
| 06:48.59 | bluspacecow | that too |
| 06:59.14 | Fisker | meeting :( |
| 06:59.17 | Fisker | bye cruel world |
| 07:02.56 | *** join/#wowuidev Rythal (~Rythal@rrcs-76-79-219-203.west.biz.rr.com) |
| 07:03.35 | Rythal | Ok.... after one day in california.. I never want to go back to canada :( |
| 07:05.22 | Neffi | It's alright. I'm sure your feelings can be healed with all that healthcare. |
| 07:11.42 | *** join/#wowuidev cbreak-work (~cbreak@drz-wizzer.drz.ethz.ch) |
| 07:11.43 | Cairenn | pokes Rythal. Sent you a PM on WoWI |
| 07:18.41 | *** join/#wowuidev wereHamster (~tomc@azeroth.caurea.org) |
| 07:19.36 | *** join/#wowuidev Esamynn|Away (~chatzilla@WoWUIDev/WoWI/Featured/Esamynn) |
| 07:19.36 | *** mode/#wowuidev [+v Esamynn|Away] by ChanServ |
| 07:20.07 | Rythal | aye... I just bought a new laptop the moment I stepped off the train lol still trying to get things setup so I can reply |
| 07:21.52 | Cairenn | Heh, no worries, can do it here |
| 07:22.52 | Cairenn | Also, I know how you feel about not wanting to come back to the cold after spending time in CA |
| 07:24.01 | Rythal | I found it kinda funny seeing everyone in jackets and sweatshirts... and my neices and myself were in t-shirts wanting to go swimming cuz it was to hot |
| 07:27.59 | Cairenn | Heh, yeah, I know that one. It's amazing how fast you acclimatized, though. By the end of the weekend you will probably find that it's cool in the evenings there. It only takes a couple days for me to want to be wearing a jacket at night. Not a winter coat or anything, but something more than short sleeves |
| 07:28.15 | Cairenn | s/you/you get/ |
| 07:28.27 | Cairenn | Not a winter coat or anything, but something more than short sleeves |
| 07:31.10 | Rythal | The convention center sign is wrong by a year... when I walked by it today it was saying Blizzcon 2014 :P |
| 07:31.20 | Cairenn | ooops! |
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| 07:40.21 | Fisker | actions do not work that way Cairenn |
| 07:40.33 | Cairenn | ? |
| 07:41.56 | Fisker | you can't just use text in an action man |
| 07:42.12 | Fisker | also I wanna be in california too :( |
| 07:42.13 | Cairenn | heh |
| 07:43.10 | Fisker | oh well back to working |
| 08:01.54 | *** join/#wowuidev VIad (~Vlad@151.117.45.31.customer.cdi.no) |
| 08:25.28 | karl_w_w | http://imgur.com/Jjv8PxW I don't want to choose one of these! |
| 08:31.15 | Shirik | why not? |
| 08:33.48 | *** join/#wowuidev galaris (~galaris@91.120.23.150) |
| 08:35.33 | karl_w_w | because they are all complete shit |
| 08:35.56 | Shirik | I mean |
| 08:36.00 | Shirik | a 3/3 for 3 isn't really that bad |
| 08:36.05 | Shirik | it's pretty average |
| 08:36.30 | *** join/#wowuidev Gragagrogog (~Gragagrog@ip-89-177-116-251.net.upcbroadband.cz) |
| 08:41.50 | karl_w_w | it's worse than an ironfur grizzly and that's a pretty bad card |
| 08:43.25 | karl_w_w | and ironfure grizzly is common, not epic |
| 09:10.56 | Sintacks | Message: Error: AddOn WeakAuras attempted to call a forbidden function (TurnRightStop()) from a tainted execution path. |
| 09:10.58 | Sintacks | wat |
| 09:11.02 | Sintacks | now i'm spinning in circles |
| 09:12.57 | Semlar | ha |
| 09:13.26 | Semlar | can't stop |
| 09:15.28 | Neffi | how? |
| 09:15.41 | Neffi | TurnRightStop() shouldn't appear anywhere in the frameXML. How did it even taint that? |
| 09:15.49 | Sintacks | i have no idea |
| 09:16.10 | Sintacks | I was buying 8 seeds from the vendor while turning when it went off. |
| 09:16.27 | Neffi | foxlit has brought this upon us |
| 09:16.40 | Neffi | he has upset the Secure Gods and their wrath will come down upon us like plague |
| 09:16.49 | Neffi | functions breaking, widgets going haywire |
| 09:16.56 | Neffi | This is the end of the world |
| 09:16.59 | Neffi | of warcraft |
| 09:17.17 | Sintacks | http://pastebin.com/8yMyECXE |
| 09:17.55 | Neffi | Probably taint propegated because variables were set on its behalf |
| 09:19.01 | Neffi | Bah, I kinda feel like playing again |
| 09:20.28 | Sintacks | my druid has 6 cooking bags |
| 09:20.35 | Sintacks | just to store all the cooking mats i have ... |
| 09:20.43 | airtonix | is your druid a meth cook? |
| 09:20.54 | Sintacks | i cook meth for my guild, yes |
| 09:20.55 | Sintacks | http://i.imgur.com/2Th6Msm.png |
| 09:21.51 | Neffi | I feel like I should have gotten into cooking |
| 09:21.53 | Neffi | Never have |
| 09:22.15 | Sintacks | i had never leveled cooking before Mists |
| 09:22.23 | Sintacks | and I didn't start in mists for a month or two |
| 09:22.41 | Maldivia | well, power levelling cooking is easy in mist though |
| 09:22.46 | Sintacks | true |
| 09:22.55 | Sintacks | but that wasn't why i just finally said "oh sure i'll do it" |
| 09:22.58 | Maldivia | if only the same could be said for the other secondary professions |
| 09:23.09 | Sintacks | it was cuz the best food is easier to make yourself than buy |
| 09:23.13 | Neffi | or the main professions |
| 09:23.30 | Sintacks | you can power level fishing now (as long as one of them is max level) |
| 09:23.34 | Sintacks | and it's really not power leveling |
| 09:23.36 | Sintacks | and it costs 12k |
| 09:23.37 | Neffi | I still don't care if min-maxing dictates two crafting professions. It's madness to level. |
| 09:23.50 | Neffi | I like being able to consistently gather what i need |
| 09:24.58 | nevcairiel | unless you play on the hardcore end of the spectrum, it doesnt matter |
| 09:25.13 | Neffi | I'm not convinced it matters there |
| 09:25.15 | Sintacks | I leveled cooking on two toons to master of the ways |
| 09:25.18 | Sintacks | just to have two nomi's |
| 09:25.27 | Neffi | Margin of error is larger than any individual difference |
| 09:25.45 | Neffi | If I run a tigher rotation than somebody who stringently min-maxes, I'll push better DPS |
| 09:25.56 | nevcairiel | and what if someone does both? :P |
| 09:26.33 | Neffi | If every single raider had perfect stats AND rotation, it'd make just enough of a difference (compared to a team that's already good) to even notice |
| 09:26.46 | Sintacks | goes back to the whole, theroy crafters are great at the numbers... but shit at the play |
| 09:27.12 | Neffi | Oh nevcairiel, I had another question for you |
| 09:27.34 | Neffi | What would cause MPC-HC's EVR custom pres renderer to output a black screen when enabling floating point processing? |
| 09:27.51 | nevcairiel | a bad gpu |
| 09:28.01 | Neffi | Bah |
| 09:28.12 | Neffi | madVR uses a float pipeline, doesn't it? |
| 09:29.01 | Neffi | EVR has noticeable banding, and madVR pushes my GPU harder than my fans can compensate. I guess I'm stuck with banding. |
| 09:30.42 | Neffi | Sintacks: Never heard that one |
| 09:31.19 | Neffi | Last time I cared about PvE, it seemed like if you were a raider, you were also a theorycrafter, or you were a casual |
| 09:32.47 | Sintacks | all the good theory crafters there are now, are mediocure at actual play |
| 09:32.53 | Sintacks | fuck spelling an words |
| 09:34.24 | airtonix | ok |
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| 09:37.48 | nevcairiel | Neffi: intel gpus dont like evrs floating point for some reason, in fact they dont like anything but 8-bit from evr |
| 09:38.06 | nevcairiel | you can try reducing quality in madvr, using dxva scaling options, for example |
| 09:39.02 | Neffi | madVR's bicubic uses ~70% GPU. EVR's uses just under 20%. |
| 09:39.11 | nevcairiel | use dxva scaling then |
| 09:39.25 | Neffi | Wouldn't that be a considerable downgrade? |
| 09:39.39 | nevcairiel | and try some of the tweaks on the trade quality for performance section |
| 09:39.41 | nevcairiel | no |
| 09:40.01 | nevcairiel | it just means it'll ask the gpu to scale, they usually dont have that bad of a quality |
| 09:40.06 | Neffi | I don't remember where, but I read some material that suggested DXVA should be avoided for quality |
| 09:40.17 | nevcairiel | dont trust weird articles |
| 09:40.34 | nevcairiel | but yes, there are things with better quality, but obviously your laptop is too weak |
| 09:40.47 | Neffi | I'll try more then and see what I can squeeze out of madVR |
| 09:41.30 | Neffi | I can manage Lanczos 4-tip w/ anti-ringing and no performance trade-offs while keeping around 90% GPU usage and no apparent framedrops, but the GPU's temps skyrocket and it requires an external fan to keep cool -- a loud one |
| 09:42.21 | Neffi | But I'll test out some more options and find a tradeoff somewhere |
| 09:48.10 | Neffi | Intel's DXVA scaler is bilinear |
| 09:49.56 | nevcairiel | depends on your gpu generation, on recent gpus its lanczos |
| 09:51.11 | nevcairiel | http://www.avsforum.com/t/1477339/so-youve-built-your-htpc-now-what-is-next-how-to-get-the-ultimate-picture-and-sound-quality-from-your-htpc-madvr-svp-xbmc-mediabrowser-jriver#post_23430419 |
| 09:51.24 | Neffi | I'm looking at it manually |
| 09:51.45 | Neffi | small checkerboard pixel image opened in MPC-HC, scaled way up, and comparing the different options in madVR |
| 09:51.55 | Neffi | DXVA2 and bilinear produce identical results |
| 09:52.29 | *** join/#wowuidev harl (harl@dslb-178-001-219-158.pools.arcor-ip.net) |
| 09:52.56 | Semlar | upscales neffi |
| 09:53.16 | Neffi | you know what I like |
| 09:55.47 | karl_w_w | anal? |
| 09:56.24 | Neffi | woah |
| 09:57.22 | Neffi | "identical throughout all models of Intel SNB, IVB and Haswell iGPU" |
| 09:57.31 | Neffi | I've got a Sandy Bridge, and my results don't agree with his |
| 09:59.16 | karl_w_w | so... not anal? |
| 09:59.50 | nevcairiel | are you sure you're changing the right settings? :P |
| 10:00.07 | Neffi | >_> |
| 10:00.09 | Neffi | positive |
| 10:00.16 | Neffi | I'll get you a screenshot if you like |
| 10:00.19 | nevcairiel | most of the time its just user failure |
| 10:01.24 | Semlar | ain't that the truf |
| 10:03.54 | Neffi | nevcairiel: https://www.dropbox.com/s/9rtzskqmgkufucq/Untitled-1.png |
| 10:03.58 | Neffi | It's definitely bilinear |
| 10:05.02 | nevcairiel | it may use different scaling for extremely low resolution content, its not a conclusive evidence what would happen with real video |
| 10:05.20 | Neffi | true enough |
| 10:05.52 | Neffi | I'm updating my GPU driver. Afterwards I'll do some tests at better sizes |
| 10:06.27 | Neffi | brb while I update net drivers too, and my connection cycles |
| 10:08.07 | *** join/#wowuidev Neffi_ (~Neffi@pool-98-116-157-170.nycmny.fios.verizon.net) |
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| 10:14.34 | *** join/#wowuidev Neffi (~Neffi@pool-98-116-157-170.nycmny.fios.verizon.net) |
| 10:18.53 | *** join/#wowuidev galaris (~galaris@91.120.23.150) |
| 10:25.01 | Neffi | nevcairiel: The results using the same mkv he tested on the latest GPU driver, it does seem to be most similar to Lanczos, but using its own AR filter |
| 10:25.26 | Neffi | I'm doing exactly what he did. 300% zoom on the crosshair in the center. |
| 10:26.08 | Neffi | But Intel's scaling seems to have a strange effect on the gamma |
| 10:26.31 | Neffi | The shade of grey on the background is changing noticeably |
| 10:26.54 | nevcairiel | you should double check that you have no video processing active in intels control panel |
| 10:26.59 | nevcairiel | iirc, it has some active by default |
| 10:27.27 | Neffi | I will |
| 10:27.36 | Neffi | and Jinc 8 tap just made the driver go batshit |
| 10:27.40 | Neffi | lol |
| 10:27.46 | nevcairiel | dont use 8, its bad for quality |
| 10:28.05 | Neffi | Broke my wallpaper, MPC's output, and Chrome |
| 10:28.10 | nevcairiel | going above 3 is really questionable already |
| 10:29.47 | Neffi | Crashing the GPU driver with Photoshop up was a terrible idea |
| 10:31.24 | *** join/#wowuidev JTF195 (~JTF195@static-173-75-39-6.pitbpa.fios.verizon.net) |
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| 12:50.46 | JTF195 | Humbedooh: grapple rez inc? |
| 12:51.03 | Humbedooh | JTF195: mebbe, I'm trying to see if I can get it working sort of easily |
| 12:51.51 | JTF195 | yay! |
| 12:53.36 | JTF195 | i always thought it was really cool, despite the fact that i couldn't for the life of me figure out what exactly it did :P |
| 12:54.10 | Humbedooh | it did...stuff! |
| 12:59.27 | JTF195 | i like stuff |
| 13:01.45 | JTF195 | so, i'll start testing it |
| 13:04.04 | Humbedooh | I gotta work out how the new combat log works first :3 |
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| 13:11.30 | JTF195 | i just noticed gnomexcel and pocketgnome too. yay! |
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| 13:19.43 | Humbedooh | yeah, those two just work when you update the TOC ;) |
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| 14:03.54 | foxlit | karl_w_w: .:znf:. Why doesn't this work? UnitDebuff("target", "Vampiric Touch","PLAYER") <- because UnitDebuff("target", "Vampiric Touch", nil, "PLAYER") << neither does what you actually want, though. |
| 14:04.14 | foxlit | PLAYER is actually something more like CASTABLE_BY_PLAYER, so it doesn't check if it's actually *your* vampiric touch. |
| 14:05.58 | karl_w_w | oh? |
| 14:06.05 | karl_w_w | so how do you check? |
| 14:07.32 | foxlit | there's a return value which tells you who cast the aura. I'm not sure if you can get away with just querying with a PLAYER filter and checking that, or if you need to iterate. |
| 14:08.04 | foxlit | I have the same bug in my feral resource tracking addon -- it happily reports other players' rakes/rips as my own. Still haven't fixed it. |
| 14:11.46 | karl_w_w | I feel like it's a problem I've solved before |
| 14:12.31 | karl_w_w | but it's not because I did the same "PLAYER" thing there |
| 14:12.35 | karl_w_w | greeeeat |
| 14:13.08 | karl_w_w | but nobody has complained about it being bugged |
| 14:13.30 | karl_w_w | are you sure foxlit? |
| 14:13.53 | foxlit | no, it's merely a recollection. |
| 14:13.54 | karl_w_w | http://wowprogramming.com/docs/api/UnitDebuff suggests you might be confusing PLAYER with RAID |
| 14:15.44 | Neffi | Yes and no |
| 14:15.54 | bluipodcow | Lol excel |
| 14:16.04 | bluipodcow | Why you bug out so often ? |
| 14:16.26 | Neffi | The PLAYER filter should return auras cast by you only. I use it in my own (de)buff display to show only auras I cast on myself and on others. But it's not 100% reliable. |
| 14:16.38 | Neffi | There are times when it returns all auras, not just mine |
| 14:16.48 | Neffi | And there are times when it behaves erratically |
| 14:16.51 | foxlit | karl_w_w: you're right. I don't actually apply the filter in the case I was thinking of. |
| 14:16.55 | bluipodcow | I keep pressing a key combo while entering stud in that takes me to A1048576elrvebtybilliob |
| 14:17.43 | Neffi | It's mostly reliable. The only time it's not reliable, is when it's blatantly obvious that it's not: like, your target is well out of range and it's showing all their buffs |
| 14:17.50 | Neffi | For targets that are in range, it's reliable |
| 14:18.42 | Neffi | So if you were to target a group member that's not in range, you can't really know if it's going to return the correct information |
| 14:19.04 | Neffi | It also bugs in CRZ, and sometimes when crossing zone boundaries and you get target lag -- the target unloads but doesn't de-target |
| 14:19.48 | Neffi | but I've never seen it display only certain areas which were not mine. It's either definitely bugging out, or it's perfectly reliable. |
| 14:19.59 | Neffi | I've never had an issue where I confused my Rake with somebody else's |
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| 14:25.39 | phelps | foxlit: how goes your little hacky thing |
| 14:25.48 | phelps | any beef about it yet ? |
| 14:28.09 | karl_w_w | mmmm, beef |
| 14:28.21 | phelps | yeah, im pretty hungry too |
| 14:29.02 | Neffi | So many tauren jokes to be had, but karl_w_w's empty stomach got in the way |
| 14:31.12 | karl_w_w | if you can't produce one of said jokes within 2 minutes, that's not my fault :P |
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| 14:50.47 | pompy | Ackis: http://gamerant.com/pokemon-x-y-event-volcanion-diancie-hoopa/ |
| 15:17.00 | nicoli_s | its so not fair kotaku and those other site got to talk about the leak, our pokemon site wasnt allowed to talk about it :( |
| 15:17.06 | *** mode/#wowuidev [+v nicoli_s] by ChanServ |
| 15:19.54 | pompy | Really? |
| 15:20.02 | pompy | curse corp said not to? |
| 15:23.00 | mikma | http://www.break.com/video/an-accurate-depiction-of-mobile-first-person-shooter-games-2535446 |
| 15:23.39 | *** join/#wowuidev TC-Work (TC@2600:3c01::f03c:91ff:feae:2e8b) |
| 15:27.03 | nicoli_s | pompy:we own marriland.com and we have to work with nintendo on stuff like that |
| 15:27.18 | nicoli_s | if we news stuff that is "leaked" then we risk not being an official fan site |
| 15:31.23 | *** join/#wowuidev Unkle (~mconverse@50-0-113-124.dedicated.static.sonic.net) |
| 15:31.40 | Unkle | Station! |
| 15:31.57 | Cairenn | train |
| 15:34.20 | Unkle | Choooooooo chooooooo |
| 15:37.09 | VIad | foxlit: hows your addon doing? :D |
| 15:42.12 | *** join/#wowuidev Mihau (~Mihau@76.164.170.2) |
| 15:44.26 | nicoli_s | man there is nothing like the jitters of deploying new software to millions of people |
| 15:44.52 | TC-Work | I think there is |
| 15:45.28 | foxlit | VIad: quietly, it seems. |
| 15:45.42 | VIad | :D |
| 15:46.12 | nicoli_s | TC-Work:what? |
| 15:47.25 | Unkle | nicoli_s: Even worse when someone forgets a decimal place and you've discovered you've sent the english language version to 300,000 german speaking users... |
| 15:47.35 | Amarande | So, you'd rather be 'ofish' than actually provide the stuff that, well, fans are actually looking for :S |
| 15:48.08 | Amarande | let's put it this way ... the average Pokemon fan (probably *especially* the average Pokemon fan, since so many are children who really don't care about things like contracts and rules :P) |
| 15:48.20 | nicoli_s | Amarande:i dont make that call |
| 15:48.23 | Amarande | probably doesn't really care so much about whether your site has "official" status as whether it's, well, giving them the latest scoop on Pokemon :) |
| 15:48.26 | nicoli_s | i dont run the sites i just make them |
| 15:49.07 | nicoli_s | Unkle: that sounds pretty bad, but will those people bitch as annoyingly as lol players? |
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| 15:49.17 | Unkle | LOL - "@ManMadeMoon: Goood morning all! BlizzCon run up week! Hope you have your costumes ready. I'll be going as "forsaken" if I can lose this last 120 lbs!" (He's the director on the WoW movie). |
| 15:50.49 | TC-Work | nicoli_s: I think there are other things that cause the same jitters |
| 15:51.16 | Amarande | VIad, they'll probably shoot foxlit in a special ceremony at the end of blizzcon :) |
| 15:51.19 | Unkle | nicoli_s: Actually, I don't recall if they bitched or not. It was 1197. |
| 15:51.24 | Unkle | gah 1997 |
| 15:51.24 | VIad | :D |
| 15:51.36 | TC-Work | yea, party like 1197 |
| 15:51.40 | Unkle | drinks more caffeine. |
| 15:51.47 | VIad | public recognition just like foxlit likes it |
| 15:52.20 | Amarande | heh, what happened in 1197 anyway |
| 15:52.24 | Amarande | a failed Crusade, looks like |
| 15:53.21 | Unkle | http://xkcd.com/1286/ |
| 15:53.33 | Amarande | well mostly failed. they got Sidon and Beirut, then the Holy Roman Emperor died and the nobles all went home so they wouldn't miss out on a chance at getting elected the next one |
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| 16:09.11 | karl_w_w | bluipodcow, I have an important question |
| 16:09.21 | bluipodcow | Hnnnnnnmm |
| 16:09.23 | karl_w_w | is this the best pop song of all time? http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9wfpXI5PKlw |
| 16:10.13 | bluipodcow | Wat |
| 16:11.10 | VIad | "better than bieber" but I realize that's like saying it's better than nothing, kind of being insensitive to spice girls. |
| 16:12.09 | Unkle | I'll see your Spice Girls and raise you Hansen. |
| 16:13.18 | VIad | http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xat1GVnl8-k bloodhound gang :P |
| 16:13.35 | VIad | showed up on the similar songs list |
| 16:13.59 | Amarande | heh Bieber ... what have I named him last in |
| 16:14.06 | Amarande | oh, right, explaining the Hope and Dread system from LOTRO to someone |
| 16:14.30 | karl_w_w | god Unkle |
| 16:14.37 | karl_w_w | hansen's songs are just annoying |
| 16:15.01 | Amarande | something on the lines of "hope and dread go on a sliding scale of 15 levels in each direction, so basically at one end it's 'the gods themselves shelter you in their embrace' and the other end is 'You think Justin Bieber may be in your party. You cower in dread.'" |
| 16:24.07 | TC-Work | bows to god Unkle |
| 16:24.32 | TC-Work | actually, that should be prostrate. |
| 16:24.51 | TC-Work | maybe genuflect. |
| 16:27.07 | Amarande | also, it's "causing you to cower" not "you cower in dread", now that I checked the actual LOTRO tooltips :P |
| 16:29.10 | Unkle | genuflect will do nicely. |
| 16:30.00 | Unkle | Did anyone ever see that really bad Dudley Moore movie "Holy Moses" ? |
| 16:30.48 | Unkle | Oh, it's "Wholly Moses!" |
| 16:31.02 | Unkle | http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0081751/ |
| 16:35.10 | TC-Work | Now I need to watch that |
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| 16:38.17 | Unkle | It's pretty weak, but it was the 80s. There are some good jokes scattered in the film. |
| 16:48.58 | *** join/#wowuidev stolenlegacy (~stolenleg@unaffiliated/stolenlegacy) |
| 16:51.07 | Lopeppeppy | No disassemble Johnny 5. < Will remain the best 80's movie ever. |
| 16:51.52 | airtonix | there were good movies in the 80s? |
| 16:51.57 | airtonix | what heresy is this? |
| 16:52.14 | karl_w_w | hey, laser lips, your momma was a snowblower! |
| 16:52.15 | *** join/#wowuidev nevcairiel (nev@WoWUIDev/WoWAce/Ace3/nevcairiel) |
| 16:52.58 | *** join/#wowuidev pompy (~Mike@c-50-166-85-212.hsd1.nj.comcast.net) |
| 16:53.12 | airtonix | i'm pretty sure all the monty python movies were made in the 70s |
| 16:53.14 | Fisker | slaps Lopeppeppy around a bit with a large trout |
| 16:53.41 | Lopeppeppy | Heya, Fisker-boo. Can I have breakfast yet? Or really I should just skip to lunch now. |
| 16:53.52 | nevcairiel | lunch sounds good |
| 16:54.16 | Fisker | Brunch it is |
| 16:54.22 | Fisker | and there's fish for it |
| 16:54.30 | Lopeppeppy | I wicked hate Monday mornings. Ugh. |
| 16:54.52 | airtonix | good thing it's tuesday then |
| 16:55.33 | Fisker | I hate days |
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| 16:58.29 | fewyn | 4 more days... http://isitblizzconyet.com/ |
| 17:00.15 | Fisker | so Lopeppeppy when are you shipping out to blizzcon? |
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| 17:07.29 | Lopeppeppy | They didn't make me a box, Fisker. I will be at work while all y'all are partying down. |
| 17:07.37 | Fisker | awww |
| 17:07.44 | Fisker | I can ship you in a box if you need one |
| 17:07.53 | Fisker | I'm not partying down either :O |
| 17:08.44 | Lopeppeppy | Those of us who are boxless will gnaw our joysticks in envy and try to get by, I guess. |
| 17:13.19 | karl_w_w | or, you know, virtual pass |
| 17:13.59 | nevcairiel | i got myself a virtual pass, and i'll probably just watch the keynote and 2 other panels like every year :P |
| 17:14.41 | Dagmar | You should set up a GOogle hangout so you can at least get hammered with the other virtual attendees |
| 17:15.00 | Dagmar | It's not a proper con unless you wind up blind drunk at some point |
| 17:15.16 | Fisker | Drunk is bad |
| 17:15.33 | Dagmar | Drunk is fine. Blackouts and projectile vomiting is bad. |
| 17:15.48 | Lopeppeppy | I have family comittments all weekend. As in, I should be committed for spending time with family. |
| 17:16.09 | airtonix | sell tickets to that Lopeppeppy |
| 17:16.15 | airtonix | call them virtual tickets |
| 17:17.03 | Lopeppeppy | I should, because it may wind up in punching The Boyfriend's mother. She doesn't understand yet that I am not She Who Came Before Me. |
| 17:17.13 | Lopeppeppy | Punchfest is worth a virtual ticket, nu? |
| 17:17.51 | airtonix | she has alzheimers? |
| 17:17.54 | Dagmar | Well, if you need a place to hide, I can be very discreet |
| 17:18.23 | Lopeppeppy | I think she must, airtonix. But if she did, I couldn't punch her, so then again, I think she does not. :) |
| 17:18.31 | Fisker | You want a virtual ticket Lopeppeppy? |
| 17:19.23 | Lopeppeppy | I wouldn't enjoy it, Fisker. If I ain't huggin', it's no fun. |
| 17:19.33 | Fisker | :( |
| 17:20.19 | airtonix | Dagmar: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Xvt7W_RKoSU |
| 17:20.42 | Lopeppeppy | I go to cons for the people, not the stuffs. |
| 17:21.13 | Fisker | virtual ticket isn't going to a con :D |
| 17:21.28 | Lopeppeppy | Exactly. No hugs, no fun. |
| 17:23.09 | Dagmar | airtonix: I fail to see the relevance |
| 17:23.20 | Dagmar | You sure that's the right URL? |
| 17:23.30 | airtonix | it's family guy, there doesn't need to be any relevance |
| 17:23.38 | airtonix | but anyway |
| 17:23.42 | airtonix | projectile vomit |
| 17:23.48 | Lopeppeppy | for the lose |
| 17:27.20 | karl_w_w | hugs Lopeppeppy |
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| 17:51.00 | Unkle | I has a sad. A good friend has had this wonderful dog for years. A loving, sweet, crazy dog that I used to watch. The dog passed away this morning. |
| 17:51.21 | Kaylin | :( |
| 17:52.40 | bluipodcow | :( |
| 17:53.28 | znf | hey foxlit |
| 17:53.44 | foxlit | hey znf |
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| 18:03.50 | TC-Work | so at work they use TC for Timecard and it always makes me pause when I read it. |
| 18:04.53 | Kaylin | So, my girlfriend wants a short-medium term relationship and I want a long-term relationship and there's no like, time limit, I mean w/e it ends up being, but I just feel sad about the whole thing. |
| 18:05.31 | Unkle | Different levels of commitment is a valid thing to feel sad about. |
| 18:07.00 | Kaylin | *nods* |
| 18:15.00 | Amarande | TC: heh, where I work, they have the "T & A log" related to time cards |
| 18:15.08 | Torhal | ... |
| 18:15.16 | Amarande | "Time & Attendance" |
| 18:15.44 | kd3 | there's no way that's not intentional |
| 18:15.51 | Amarande | any time you fail to punch the clock when you were supposed to and management has to put it in manually, you have to go sign the list (of shame) to acknowledge that the adjustment (because you forgot to punch, generally) is correct |
| 18:16.52 | Amarande | well ... occasionally it's because your department manager forgot to put your shift in the system, but usually it means you forgot to punch :) |
| 18:17.29 | Amarande | kd3: it also reminds us that we're entitled to be paid "accurattely", LOL |
| 18:22.00 | Amarande | and yay, a zone in old world that actually feels like old times! :D |
| 18:24.35 | Amarande | hillsbrad, horde side |
| 18:24.47 | Amarande | you actually get lots of quests to decide the order of doing, eventually |
| 18:24.55 | Amarande | you ... barely ever get to do that anymore in old world :( |
| 18:26.52 | nevcairiel | true story; http://asset-0.soup.io/asset/6043/1283_07c8_500.jpeg |
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| 18:27.51 | zenzelezz | indeed |
| 18:28.27 | Kaylin | estrogen is a hell of a drug. |
| 18:29.06 | Kaylin | in b4 it's not a drug, I have it in syringes and inject it into my body, what now. |
| 18:29.06 | Unkle | To is testosterone |
| 18:29.14 | nicoli_s | yer telling me, i have a 6 month preggo woman in my house |
| 18:29.35 | Kaylin | yeah but that just makes you muscular, a bit hostile, and horny as fuck @ T |
| 18:29.36 | kd3 | how many 0300 fast food runs have you made yet? |
| 18:29.50 | nicoli_s | none, its not my baby :P |
| 18:30.50 | kd3 | and? I've been sent out on runs before when it wasn't my kid either. just helping out the dad who was laid up and I didn't want the mother killing all of us in our sleep |
| 18:31.04 | kd3 | because she probably would've |
| 18:31.18 | nicoli_s | lol should have clarified, preggo woman and the daddy are just crashing at my place |
| 18:31.21 | Unkle | Kaylin: it changes body shape and sexual characteristics dramitcally. |
| 18:31.37 | Kaylin | Unkle: I've been on both, very aware. |
| 18:31.40 | Torhal | nicoli_s: I was about to say "You didn't tell us you were expecting...dafuq?" |
| 18:32.05 | nicoli_s | Torhal: its hippy girl from mellow mushroom |
| 18:32.13 | Torhal | Aaah |
| 18:32.37 | Primer | what, no NPCScan update today? |
| 18:32.45 | Primer | someone's slacking |
| 18:32.45 | Torhal | I'm at the office. |
| 18:32.56 | Torhal | Pretty sure they wouldn't like me working on my own code. |
| 18:33.05 | Primer | I won't tell |
| 18:33.09 | Kaylin | how will they know? |
| 18:33.17 | Kaylin | do they read it behind your back? |
| 18:33.23 | Primer | And if it wasn't for me slacking off and writing my first addon at work, it would never have gotten done |
| 18:33.26 | nicoli_s | ill tell on him |
| 18:33.36 | Torhal | I'm supposed to be doing other stuff, and if THAT doesn't get done, it won't matter what I've actually been doing. |
| 18:35.09 | Ackis | nicoli_s: http://25.media.tumblr.com/dc0648e2d436e5cdb89bef8c015bcc28/tumblr_muobmtuz2U1sewz1yo1_400.gif |
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| 18:39.02 | nicoli_s | lol |
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| 19:01.00 | *** join/#wowuidev Guillotine (~Guillotin@WoWUIDev/Blizzard/Guillotine) |
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| 19:01.07 | Guillotine | ~lart foxlit |
| 19:01.07 | purl | beats foxlit over the head with a microkernel |
| 19:01.12 | *** part/#wowuidev Guillotine (~Guillotin@WoWUIDev/Blizzard/Guillotine) |
| 19:01.17 | kd3 | I'm shocked it took that long |
| 19:01.18 | *** join/#wowuidev bluipodcow (~bluspacec@121.99.20.19) |
| 19:01.18 | *** mode/#wowuidev [+v bluipodcow] by ChanServ |
| 19:01.45 | *** join/#wowuidev Unkle (~mconverse@50-0-113-123.dedicated.static.sonic.net) |
| 19:01.51 | *** join/#wowuidev galaris (~galaris@catv-80-99-58-135.catv.broadband.hu) |
| 19:06.43 | Amarande | ah crap I just dinged 26, didn't I |
| 19:06.55 | Amarande | yay for the levels you can't queue for randoms unless you have all day LOL |
| 19:07.55 | *** join/#wowuidev galaris (~galaris@catv-80-99-58-135.catv.broadband.hu) |
| 19:15.52 | Mr_Rabies | oh godddd the oqueue guy is a freeper, that explains so much |
| 19:16.37 | nevcairiel | whats a freeper |
| 19:17.28 | znf | what he asked ^ |
| 19:17.51 | Mr_Rabies | a fan of the freerepublic forums, which are some of the most vile garbage ever conceived |
| 19:18.17 | Mr_Rabies | http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Free_Republic |
| 19:19.00 | nevcairiel | sounds like a place the government secretly runs to keep an eye on the wackjobs |
| 19:19.08 | foxlit | kd3: I'm shocked it took that long << I'm shocked it was that fast. |
| 19:19.22 | Fisker | that's what she said |
| 19:19.25 | Mr_Rabies | totally explains his behavior regarding getting taken off of curse |
| 19:19.42 | nevcairiel | if they break all secure addons, i'm going to hunt you down foxlit, just so that you are warned :P |
| 19:20.03 | foxlit | There is a rather obvious fix for this that does not involve breaking anything. |
| 19:20.20 | Fisker | banning you from the game fixes nothing foxlit |
| 19:20.21 | Fisker | :3 |
| 19:20.22 | Cairenn | Blizz said "message received" and they are fixing it. |
| 19:20.23 | nevcairiel | they have interns at control now |
| 19:20.32 | nevcairiel | it'll break everything |
| 19:20.40 | Fisker | aww and foxlit spent all that time on the page |
| 19:20.47 | TC-Work | foxlit: if they do break things you can have someone slap Guill around at the blizzcon dinner. |
| 19:20.56 | Fisker | Remember when slouken used to run the join nevcairiel? |
| 19:21.08 | nevcairiel | yeah with slouken in control this wouldnt have happened! |
| 19:21.31 | znf | bah |
| 19:21.40 | Fisker | joint* btw |
| 19:21.57 | nevcairiel | slouken send a patch to libav last week or so, i found a flaw in it but he didnt respond back yet =( |
| 19:23.04 | foxlit | Total time expended was like six hours, so this was a fun diversion from the usual drudgery of writing opie code. |
| 19:23.21 | nevcairiel | how much more opie code can you actually write |
| 19:23.23 | foxlit | Maybe after they actually patch it I could tell you what it did. |
| 19:24.17 | znf | I was actually enjoying writing this snippet :( |
| 19:24.39 | foxlit | A horrendous amount, nevcairiel. I want restricted-side macro parsing, for example. |
| 19:25.16 | foxlit | Pluggable slice configuration UI. Drag-and-drop support for AB actions. |
| 19:25.27 | nevcairiel | i had plans once |
| 19:25.41 | nevcairiel | i noticed i would never use them myself |
| 19:25.45 | nevcairiel | so i gave up |
| 19:25.59 | foxlit | this is ever so slowly approaching an actual action bar. |
| 19:26.21 | nevcairiel | i have all the tech in place for most of my plans |
| 19:26.22 | *** join/#wowuidev MoonWitch (~moonwitch@158.55-242-81.adsl-dyn.isp.belgacom.be) |
| 19:26.27 | nevcairiel | just damn UI was missing to actually use the shit |
| 19:26.30 | nevcairiel | i cba with UI |
| 19:26.33 | nevcairiel | i despise UI |
| 19:26.35 | *** join/#wowuidev Joshua__ (~Joshua@cpe-204-210-240-179.columbus.res.rr.com) |
| 19:26.42 | znf | implement a way to stick the slices full-time on screen, and you will get clickers to improve their gameplay |
| 19:26.54 | foxlit | Restricted-side action rewriting, too -- they have like a bazillion ways to change your main action bar into something else. |
| 19:27.04 | foxlit | (I recently found out that Nef's cat call forces you into [form:6].) |
| 19:27.12 | karl_w_w | I can't stop chuckling every time I pick this deck I made |
| 19:27.21 | nevcairiel | form numbers are all over the place |
| 19:27.32 | karl_w_w | it's based around lorewalker cho |
| 19:27.37 | foxlit | nah, this is just the first out-of-range form index. |
| 19:27.41 | karl_w_w | and I named the deck "Cho'd" |
| 19:27.45 | *** join/#wowuidev ShaunDreclin (~ShaunDrec@70.50.223.38) |
| 19:27.47 | Joshua__ | lol |
| 19:27.56 | nevcairiel | but its not the only time they use the out of range index |
| 19:28.39 | nevcairiel | shadowdance and tree incarnation use them too, iirc |
| 19:28.48 | karl_w_w | I didn't even notice the implications until way after I was done making it |
| 19:37.39 | *** join/#wowuidev Telshin (~textual@2001:408:0:100:9ce8:39d6:d444:b30b) |
| 19:37.46 | *** join/#wowuidev _10leej (~10leej@cpe-204-210-240-179.columbus.res.rr.com) |
| 19:37.55 | *** join/#wowuidev MentalPower|Work (~MentalPow@WoWUIDev/Norganna/Administrator/MentalPower) |
| 19:37.55 | *** mode/#wowuidev [+v MentalPower|Work] by ChanServ |
| 19:44.28 | kd3 | 6tb drives? color me intrigued |
| 19:44.44 | Fisker | colors kd3 |
| 19:45.03 | Fisker | Only about time they start "recovering" from their "mishap" |
| 19:46.19 | Stanzilla | yo |
| 19:46.32 | Semlar | what up G |
| 19:46.41 | Stanzilla | imovie on the mac is apparantly not capable of making a movie that only has 1 picture |
| 19:46.57 | Stanzilla | sad story |
| 19:47.12 | znf | color me surprised |
| 19:47.14 | Fisker | why would you do this Stanzilla? |
| 19:47.28 | Stanzilla | Fisker: my brother wants to upload his mixes to youtube |
| 19:47.34 | Stanzilla | so it's like 1hour music |
| 19:47.38 | Stanzilla | and one pic |
| 19:47.41 | Stanzilla | (his logo or whatever) |
| 19:48.08 | Stanzilla | and imovie can't do that |
| 19:48.30 | Semlar | pictures with sound?? |
| 19:48.47 | Stanzilla | one picture with sound |
| 19:48.53 | Stanzilla | it can do several pictures with sound |
| 19:49.00 | Stanzilla | but one picture can only hold 30min of music |
| 19:49.03 | Stanzilla | (YES THAT FUCKED UP) |
| 19:49.54 | kd3 | so, copy the image a few times, then have imovie use each "different" image for 30 minutes? |
| 19:50.09 | Stanzilla | that would require me splitting the audio file |
| 19:50.10 | Semlar | just how long are his songs |
| 19:50.12 | Amarande | 6TB drives ... for people who felt 4TB wasn't already putting too many eggs in one basket :) |
| 19:50.31 | Stanzilla | Semlar: this session is 1 hour 1 minute |
| 19:50.37 | haste | raids tend to help with this Amarande |
| 19:51.09 | Stanzilla | even windows movie maker could do that |
| 19:51.19 | Stanzilla | can, infact |
| 19:51.42 | Amarande | haste: yeah RAIDs will start to be pretty much mandatory at this rate for even casual home video hounds |
| 19:52.17 | Amarande | because sooner or later we're going to get to the point where drives are so gigantic that the time window between "DANGER WILL ROBINSON YOUR DRIVE WILL FAIL SOON" and "oh, sorry bud, your data's gone" is not large enough to back up an entire drive, heh |
| 19:52.19 | kd3 | start to? |
| 19:52.23 | kd3 | built his first raid in 2007 |
| 19:52.33 | Amarande | kd3: I mean in terms of standing a chance of saving your data when a drive fails |
| 19:52.58 | Amarande | at this rate we're going to just get to the point where there isn't time to copy everything between imminent fail warning and actual failure |
| 19:53.09 | kd3 | just get to? that's already a problem |
| 19:53.11 | Semlar | no problem there, just start using SSD |
| 19:53.39 | Amarande | Semlar: well, yeah, then you don't have to worry about it at all, since usually with SSD you don't get any warnings apparently, it's just "Good morning ... BTW dude, your data's gone" :D |
| 19:53.45 | kd3 | let a raid run too long where you start hitting the far side of the bathtub curve and things go south quickly |
| 19:53.55 | *** join/#wowuidev JTF195 (~JTF195@static-173-75-39-6.pitbpa.fios.verizon.net) |
| 19:54.27 | Amarande | but, also, yeah you don't really have to worry about it with SSD, since you can always back up a full SSD to an HDD easily |
| 19:54.39 | Amarande | given that you can't actually *afford* SSDs in sizes that are large enough for this to be an issue :) |
| 19:55.15 | Amarande | with these super gigantic HDDs, there's also the issue that there's no other viable backup media but another of same |
| 19:55.27 | kd3 | tape |
| 19:55.31 | Semlar | ha |
| 19:55.32 | Amarande | kd3: you can't afford tape backup |
| 19:55.34 | Amarande | not in that size :D |
| 19:55.51 | Amarande | even the couple hundred gigs tape backup drives cost in the thousand bucks range :P |
| 19:55.59 | Mr_Rabies | nor do you have enough time for it to write 2 terabytes |
| 19:56.13 | Mr_Rabies | holy hell that must take forever |
| 19:57.00 | Semlar | long enough that the new drive starts failing too |
| 19:57.23 | Semlar | it's a vicious cycle |
| 20:01.54 | Fisker | hey haste |
| 20:02.29 | haste | hey Fisker |
| 20:02.34 | Fisker | do you hate me? |
| 20:02.53 | haste | no |
| 20:03.17 | Fisker | I don't hate me either |
| 20:03.21 | Fisker | we have so much in common |
| 20:05.30 | Lopeppeppy | If only I could convince my clients that their last site was crap, and that their new site was nicer, we'd all get along better. |
| 20:07.21 | Mr_Rabies | tell them their old site looks like this http://www.microsoft.com/games/monster/whatsnew.htm |
| 20:07.36 | TC-Work | Or if you stopped caring, that would work as well. |
| 20:07.39 | kd3 | oh gods |
| 20:08.41 | TC-Work | the sysreq page is amusing as well/ |
| 20:12.14 | bleeter | Lopeppeppy: just show them http://www.kibo.com/webtv/webtv.html and *tell* them it's their old site |
| 20:12.22 | Fisker | slap them with fish Lopeppeppy |
| 20:12.36 | Fisker | oh god bleeter |
| 20:12.54 | Fisker | I hope there's a special place in death for you |
| 20:13.00 | TC-Work | hah "PLEASE SEND ME FEEDBACK ABOUT MY SUPER-KQQL WEB PAGE !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!AND PLEASE DONT SEND ME MAIL IN LOWERCASE IT LOOKS LIKE YOUR WISPORING !!!" |
| 20:13.00 | bleeter | damn I miss Kibo |
| 20:13.08 | Fisker | Which you won't get to experience anyway since you're dead |
| 20:13.08 | kd3 | oh god. already getting a headache |
| 20:13.24 | bleeter | not that he's dead, just not around much any more |
| 20:13.26 | bleeter | https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/James_Parry |
| 20:13.45 | bleeter | (one of the more original original usenet trolls) |
| 20:14.37 | Mr_Rabies | bleeter |
| 20:14.41 | Mr_Rabies | i miss when i could see |
| 20:14.47 | Mr_Rabies | before that website killed my eyes forever |
| 20:15.04 | bleeter | it's even better with the speakers on |
| 20:15.12 | bleeter | though you may need some MIDI plugin type support |
| 20:15.28 | Stanzilla | http://git.chromium.org/gitweb/?p=git/chromium.git;a=commitdiff;h=462fe62f02c750d68a99c0c94ffca8f0aed79948 |
| 20:15.35 | Stanzilla | dem rel eng. cosmetics |
| 20:18.48 | Amarande | bleeter, don't forget B1FF |
| 20:20.27 | bleeter | heh https://twitter.com/B1FF |
| 20:21.05 | TC-Work | "nvidia: module license 'NVIDIA' taints kernel." Uh, wait what? |
| 20:21.44 | kd3 | if the kernel's tainted due to the inclusion of proprietary kmods, kernel devs won't look at bug reports about the kernel |
| 20:21.51 | bleeter | TC-Work: it sets a 'you're running closed/blobbed software in the kernel' flag, thus any crashes etc. get marked 'tainted' for dbugging purposes (ie, can't really know) |
| 20:22.22 | TC-Work | Interesting |
| 20:22.47 | bleeter | of course, if you're working for nVidia (or AMD for that matter), one can hack around these things ;) |
| 20:23.20 | Lopeppeppy | I like that, bleeter. It's actually a bit worse than the worst I've converted! |
| 20:23.24 | Fisker | And here I was hoping that Linus had put in some fuck you to nvidia |
| 20:26.12 | bleeter | Lopeppeppy: for quite a number of years, before testing became more standardised, it was a very useful site... https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=27650 |
| 20:27.08 | bleeter | (back from the dark days when seriously non-confirming HTML foo would take out your browser...) |
| 20:27.25 | *** join/#wowuidev Kodiack (~Colton@97-86-234-157.dhcp.roch.mn.charter.com) |
| 20:30.34 | Fisker | My eye hurts Lopeppeppy :( |
| 20:30.43 | TC-Work | Stop using it. |
| 20:31.36 | Fisker | That hurts even more |
| 20:32.10 | Esamynn|work | which site is this? |
| 20:32.26 | karl_w_w | http://images.4chan.org/b/src/1383596978763.jpg hehehe |
| 20:32.28 | Fisker | Which one? |
| 20:33.10 | kd3 | Esamynn|work: http://www.kibo.com/webtv/webtv.html |
| 20:33.11 | Esamynn|work | oh, nvm |
| 20:33.16 | kd3 | (eyebleed warning) |
| 20:33.21 | Esamynn|work | yes, too late |
| 20:33.43 | Esamynn|work | I was able to CTRL+W fast enough to avoid blindness |
| 20:34.06 | Torhal | kd3: Eardrum rupture, as well, if you're wearing headphones. |
| 20:34.55 | Esamynn|work | I didn't get any sound |
| 20:35.10 | karl_w_w | http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xM7tg0J06ok I fucking love this |
| 20:35.50 | karl_w_w | except for the verticalness, of course |
| 20:40.52 | bleeter | Esamynn|work: your browser is borken, then ;) |
| 20:41.45 | pompy | http://twitter.com/BlizzconCD/status/397372895212470272/photo/1 lol |
| 20:41.54 | pompy | you got that Torhal!? |
| 20:42.43 | Esamynn|work | bleeter: or maybe it acted to protect me :) |
| 20:42.47 | Torhal | pompy: I'm glad, really. Not everyone should be naked. |
| 20:42.59 | pompy | lol |
| 20:43.54 | bleeter | Esamynn|work: are you suggesting that there is a web browser out there that has been so amazing it's become self aware? |
| 20:43.58 | bleeter | doubts Esamynn|work |
| 20:44.15 | Esamynn|work | doubter |
| 20:44.25 | Fisker | good night cruel world |
| 20:44.30 | Fisker | and Lopeppeppy |
| 20:45.35 | Amarande | oh gee thanks Duskingdawn, your "empowered" deer almost kablooied me to bits :P |
| 20:55.45 | TC-Work | ugh, perforce is a pita/ |
| 20:55.48 | TC-Work | -/ |
| 20:55.49 | Lopeppeppy | Sleep well, Fisker-din. |
| 20:57.06 | bleeter | typically, how long does a coast-to-coast flight take in the US? |
| 20:57.18 | bleeter | rest well Fisker |
| 20:57.35 | TC-Work | I want to say ~5 hours |
| 20:57.37 | Esamynn|work | 5ish, hours |
| 20:57.43 | kd3 | ~5 hours heading west, 4-4:30ish heading east |
| 20:58.34 | bleeter | thx |
| 20:59.02 | bleeter | just trying to convince a mate that a 7 hour flight (a) isn't really 7 hours (b) isn't actually longer than they have in the US |
| 20:59.52 | nevcairiel | a 7 hour flight is usually 6 hours plus taxi :p |
| 21:01.15 | kd3 | for example, my ATL->LAX flight is from 9:50 to 14:53, the return flight is 14:45 to 18:53 |
| 21:01.23 | Esamynn|work | but yes, a 7 hour flight really would be longer than the majority of NA flights |
| 21:01.37 | Amarande | yeah if I count time from home to destination, that would be ... flight time plus about 30 mins to get to the bus station, another 30 mins usually waiting for the bus, then 1.5 hours or so to go to New York on the bus |
| 21:01.51 | kd3 | unless you're going from key west to to anchorage, but I doubt there's a direct flight that does that |
| 21:01.55 | Amarande | then about an hour on the subway and AirTrain to get from 42 St PABT over to the airport |
| 21:02.16 | Amarande | then security time ... so about 3.5 hours plus security time plus flight time |
| 21:02.49 | Esamynn|work | how about we just define it as scheduled departure -> schedule arrival for consistency? |
| 21:03.16 | kd3 | we can't have that, that'd make too much sense |
| 21:03.18 | nevcairiel | you mean just how they define it? how dare they! |
| 21:03.37 | Esamynn|work | I know, I know, I'm being far too reasonable |
| 21:03.43 | Esamynn|work | I'll go have lunch now |
| 21:04.16 | Semlar | stop making sense |
| 21:04.44 | kd3 | hm, I can only find at best 2-stop flights from EYW to ANC, they're mostly 3-stops |
| 21:05.45 | nevcairiel | 3 stops for a national flight? you must try to go from one hill-billy airport to another :p |
| 21:06.02 | Amarande | heh, that is one thing I like about living in this general neck of the woods |
| 21:06.09 | Amarande | I get to fly out of JFK, which means nonstop flights most places |
| 21:08.15 | Amarande | which is not just convenient, but almost absolutely essential if you want to get back east from a cross-country trip in a single day :S |
| 21:19.45 | karl_w_w | http://images.4chan.org/b/src/1383597169287.gif lolwhat |
| 21:20.49 | kullervo | karl_w_w: how I imagine the usual work day for the more interesting security jobs is |
| 21:21.11 | karl_w_w | http://images.4chan.org/b/src/1383597570402.gif and that's why cats are smarter |
| 21:21.20 | Mr_Rabies | >linking to /b/ |
| 21:21.46 | kullervo | Mr_Rabies: always a gamble to click those links, isn't it? |
| 21:21.54 | Semlar | but why is there a surfboard in a pool |
| 21:22.34 | Mr_Rabies | for cat surfing |
| 21:22.36 | Mr_Rabies | obviously |
| 21:22.47 | Semlar | cat crossing? |
| 21:25.30 | Amarande | dagnabbit |
| 21:25.39 | Amarande | whatever happened to skillet's orange/yellow/green/grey bar? :( |
| 21:25.57 | Amarande | the bar's still there but it always shows full grey with all the thresholds as zero |
| 21:28.05 | Amarande | it's the bar below the blue skill level bar |
| 21:28.23 | Mr_Rabies | kd3 can i stow away in your luggage to blizzcon |
| 21:28.24 | Amarande | it used to have orange, yellow, green and grey sections and when you moused over it it would tell you when the current recipe turned each colour |
| 21:28.27 | Amarande | but now it doesn't work :( |
| 21:28.33 | kd3 | lol |
| 21:28.37 | VIad | the endless ' or " |
| 21:28.44 | Mr_Rabies | i'll put on a lead suit and they'll just think you're carrying a skull with you |
| 21:28.46 | VIad | I use " because it's easiest to write with my keyboard :D |
| 21:28.46 | Mr_Rabies | that should be fine |
| 21:37.16 | *** join/#wowuidev MoonWitch (~moonwitch@158.55-242-81.adsl-dyn.isp.belgacom.be) |
| 21:41.58 | Mr_Rabies | why the HECK do people on openraid want to do all 4 wings in sequence as a single event |
| 21:42.09 | Mr_Rabies | even in lfr that's way too long, but this is flex |
| 21:42.51 | kullervo | Mr_Rabies: it can be done in two hours |
| 21:43.27 | Mr_Rabies | i don't even think you could clear SoO with no bosses in it in two hours |
| 21:43.28 | Semlar | maybe 3 |
| 21:43.46 | Mr_Rabies | especially a pug group |
| 21:43.55 | kullervo | Mr_Rabies: on week 2, my guild cleared 11/14 on the first night of raiding, in 3 hours |
| 21:43.58 | Semlar | depends on how competent your group is |
| 21:44.13 | Mr_Rabies | well yeah, that's your guild, though, and they're probably really well geared to pull that off |
| 21:44.41 | Mr_Rabies | we're talking undergeared, underorganized players in a pug |
| 21:44.49 | bleeter | why |
| 21:44.52 | bleeter | do birds |
| 21:44.57 | bleeter | suddenly appear... |
| 21:45.02 | Mr_Rabies | i could see that easily taking 8 or more hours, or more likely just falling apart after wing 2 |
| 21:45.12 | Semlar | 8 hours? |
| 21:45.23 | kd3 | after washing your car, bleeter? |
| 21:45.47 | bleeter | kd3: more like someone spiked the water supply ;) |
| 21:46.14 | Mr_Rabies | yeah, semlar |
| 21:46.23 | Mr_Rabies | i don't think i've ever been in a single flex wing that took less than 2-3 hours |
| 21:46.26 | Semlar | if you don't wipe you can certainly clear it in under 3 |
| 21:46.58 | Semlar | the bosses themselves only take between 5 and 10 minutes to down and the rest is just moving through the trash |
| 21:48.07 | Mr_Rabies | the trash for dark shamans takes like half an hour by itself usually |
| 21:48.15 | Semlar | oO |
| 21:48.16 | Mr_Rabies | worst ever :( |
| 21:48.25 | Mr_Rabies | even in our 10 man it does |
| 21:48.36 | Semlar | uh my 10 man clears that room in like 5 minutes |
| 21:48.41 | Mr_Rabies | how the hell? |
| 21:48.48 | Semlar | i don't know how it takes you that long |
| 21:48.50 | Mr_Rabies | we overpull and we die horribly |
| 21:48.58 | Mr_Rabies | we underpull and it takes FOREVER |
| 21:49.07 | Mr_Rabies | what kind of gear is your raid in? |
| 21:49.13 | Semlar | there are what, like 5 packs with mages maybe |
| 21:49.28 | Mr_Rabies | our best geared player is...558 i think? which is me |
| 21:49.35 | Mr_Rabies | maybe our tank is 559 |
| 21:49.42 | kullervo | Mr_Rabies: it was week 2 of the content! And... Yeah we might have been quite geared, seeing how we all had previous tier's heroic items |
| 21:49.43 | Semlar | my item level is 563 and that's the highest in our raid |
| 21:50.07 | Mr_Rabies | do you just pull everything to the center or something? |
| 21:50.14 | Mr_Rabies | we even 3 tank it sometimes and it still takes FOREVER |
| 21:50.19 | Semlar | no, pulling 2 packs would probably wipe you |
| 21:50.21 | Esamynn|work | Semlar: I'd believe 10 minutes |
| 21:50.24 | Esamynn|work | but not 5 |
| 21:50.40 | Esamynn|work | my guild, which is progressing in 25man heroics, doesn't clear that trash in 5 minutes on FLEX :P |
| 21:50.49 | Mr_Rabies | (i go ahead and go tank in preparation for dark shamans usually before the trash in there) |
| 21:50.54 | Semlar | i have time to use one stampede after iron jugs, maybe 2 and it has a 3 minute cooldown |
| 21:51.21 | Mr_Rabies | maybe you don't clear it as fully as us or something |
| 21:51.23 | *** join/#wowuidev tharper (~tomh@c83-250-204-217.bredband.comhem.se) |
| 21:51.23 | *** join/#wowuidev tharper (~tomh@unaffiliated/sioraiocht) |
| 21:51.38 | Mr_Rabies | we go ahead and clear the whole area because it's better to be safe than sorry |
| 21:51.45 | Esamynn|work | ^ |
| 21:51.46 | Semlar | we don't usually bother clearing up the path to nazgrim |
| 21:51.55 | Semlar | everything else has to be pulled because it's linked to the boss |
| 21:51.55 | Mr_Rabies | oh, we do because we're gonna have to anyway |
| 21:52.01 | Mr_Rabies | after the boss |
| 21:52.07 | Semlar | well, most of it anyway is in the way |
| 21:52.20 | Semlar | i don't think it actually pulls with the boss |
| 21:52.20 | mikma | http://steamcommunity.com/groups/steamuniverse#announcements/detail/1966113289566972393 |
| 21:52.32 | Semlar | hard to say since most of it has to be killed before you can even get to the boss |
| 21:52.49 | Semlar | and i usually pop in and reset him before we finish clearing the room |
| 21:53.42 | Semlar | i think one of the groups towards nazgrim gets pulled sometimes and we just kill it with the boss |
| 21:54.06 | Mr_Rabies | wonder what the steam machine's MSRP will be |
| 21:55.21 | Mr_Rabies | what the heck look at some of those controllers: http://cdn2.sbnation.com/entry_photo_images/9243875/2013-10-23_05-13-32_verge_super_wide.jpg |
| 21:56.45 | Mihau | Mr_Rabies: Looks like, "I bet we can get everyone to love track balls!" Then quickly abandoned that idea. |
| 21:57.08 | Mr_Rabies | probably just a standin for the touchpads before they were able to get any actually made, honestly |
| 21:57.13 | Mr_Rabies | http://cdn0.sbnation.com/entry_photo_images/9243831/2013-10-23_05-17-43_verge_super_wide.jpg |
| 21:57.17 | Mr_Rabies | 3d printed buttons, neat |
| 21:58.05 | Mihau | The cases too. |
| 21:58.53 | Mr_Rabies | oh yeah, i see the layering now |
| 21:58.59 | Mihau | The date on that circuit board: 2013-04-01 |
| 21:59.03 | Mr_Rabies | rapid prototyping is neat and perfect for valve |
| 21:59.42 | Mr_Rabies | i'm not sold on the controller yet |
| 21:59.55 | Mr_Rabies | i think having the actual buttons be so far towards the center isn't gonna work so great but we'll see |
| 22:00.09 | Mihau | The controller looks like it is upside down to me. O_o |
| 22:00.36 | Mr_Rabies | i'll definitely play with one at best buy or whatever |
| 22:02.17 | Mr_Rabies | the mega man test is the real test of it, though |
| 22:03.22 | Mihau | Huh. O_o |
| 22:07.44 | Mr_Rabies | if a controller can equally play mega man (we'll say mega man x) and tf2, it's a good controller |
| 22:07.47 | *** join/#wowuidev NuSuey (uid3556@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-qykyukhqrkilfbwa) |
| 22:09.20 | *** join/#wowuidev Kodiack (~Colton@97-86-234-157.dhcp.roch.mn.charter.com) |
| 22:09.27 | Mr_Rabies | lack of dpad leads me to believe it won't play mega man very well, though |
| 22:09.47 | Mr_Rabies | and button placement |
| 22:11.39 | nevcairiel | these touch things are supposed to replace and surpass silly dpads |
| 22:12.02 | nevcairiel | better fine-grained control, etc |
| 22:12.50 | *** join/#wowuidev krixxkraxx (~galaris@catv-80-99-58-135.catv.broadband.hu) |
| 22:17.59 | Mr_Rabies | we'll see |
| 22:18.04 | Mr_Rabies | i don't believe it, honestly |
| 22:18.25 | Mr_Rabies | i think trying to play a 2d platformer with a trackpad is gonna be awkward |
| 22:18.48 | kd3 | if the super meat boy dev thinks it'll work, eh, I'm inclined to believe him |
| 22:19.01 | Mr_Rabies | i'm skeptical, but we'll see |
| 22:19.32 | Mr_Rabies | i really hope the xbox one controller has as nice of a dpad as it looks |
| 22:19.45 | *** join/#wowuidev silv3rwind (uid14256@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-bsedyrldjhfzvjiq) |
| 22:19.48 | Mr_Rabies | i'll more likely get that than the steam one |
| 22:26.04 | Mr_Rabies | i just can't wrap my head around casters anymore, urgh |
| 22:27.00 | Mr_Rabies | i do almost as much dps on my 86 unholy dk as on my 90 warlock with a 512 ilvl :| |
| 22:34.12 | Amarande | Mr_Rabies: heh, enjoy it while it lasts |
| 22:34.17 | Amarande | from what I'm reading on Noxxic of DK scaling |
| 22:34.35 | Amarande | when you're a 90 unholy dk with 512 ilvl, you'll probably be ... still about the same as you are now :P |
| 22:34.42 | Amarande | since apparently unholy DK is like, bottom of the barrel ATM |
| 22:34.55 | Mr_Rabies | i'm doing like 60kish at 86, i'm that bad on my lock |
| 22:35.10 | Amarande | actually, ALL the DPS DK specs seem to be deficient atm, at least in "ideal" simcraft situations |
| 22:35.26 | Amarande | which is interesting since they started the expansion basically at the top of the heap |
| 22:35.39 | Mr_Rabies | honestly though, a 20% swing between best and worst dps is not that bad |
| 22:35.56 | Mr_Rabies | that's more balanced than the game's been for a long while |
| 22:36.27 | Mr_Rabies | all dps specs but 2 are around 10% of the top dps, which is a good number |
| 22:37.06 | Mr_Rabies | shadow and unholy could use a bit of work to get within 10% of frost and they'd be set |
| 22:37.52 | tzarc | don't bother looking at sims for shadow |
| 22:37.55 | Mr_Rabies | also the numbers are theorycrafted and may be entirely different from blizzard's numbers |
| 22:38.56 | *** join/#wowuidev Kodiack (~Colton@97-86-234-157.dhcp.roch.mn.charter.com) |
| 22:39.50 | Semlar | shadow does quite well on a fight like the protectors |
| 22:40.57 | Semlar | i don't think their single target damage is that great though |
| 22:42.01 | Semlar | all i know about DKs is that ours used to be our top damage in ToT and can't compete with me any more |
| 22:42.09 | tzarc | it's not spectacular, but nowhere near as low as the sims say |
| 22:42.50 | tzarc | although apparently my auto sim generation stuff is segfaulting again |
| 22:42.51 | tzarc | ugh |
| 22:43.17 | *** join/#wowuidev MoonWitch (~moonwitch@158.55-242-81.adsl-dyn.isp.belgacom.be) |
| 22:45.05 | Amarande | tzarc: apparently the problem with shadow is it basically just stopped scaling a tier or so ago, isn't it? |
| 22:45.14 | Amarande | (due to mostly scaling with haste and mind flay hitting GCD already) |
| 22:47.38 | tzarc | fair enough |
| 22:47.57 | tzarc | looking at logs, our spriest is about 40k behind my lock with similar ilvl |
| 22:48.06 | tzarc | single-target wise |
| 22:48.09 | tzarc | on juggernaut |
| 22:48.19 | tzarc | seeing as it's the closest to a patchwerk we have this tier |
| 22:49.32 | Semlar | and locks are more or less the highest dpsers right now |
| 22:49.54 | tzarc | oh I can fuck that up for sure |
| 22:50.28 | Semlar | i can beat our lock on juggernaut but he complains about getting interrupted |
| 22:50.52 | Primer | by... |
| 22:50.59 | Semlar | having to move |
| 22:51.03 | Primer | and you don't? |
| 22:51.06 | Semlar | i'm a hunter |
| 22:51.09 | Primer | doh |
| 22:51.20 | Semlar | nothing can stop me! |
| 22:51.22 | Semlar | NOTHING! |
| 22:51.27 | Neffi | stops Semlar. |
| 22:51.32 | Amarande | yeah, hunters have always had it kind of unfair over virtually every other class |
| 22:51.33 | Primer | I got beat by our new mage on juggernaut |
| 22:51.35 | Semlar | well, nothing except pathing and killing my pet |
| 22:51.36 | Primer | <-- SP |
| 22:51.45 | Amarande | mostly because they get the benefits both of being ranged and of being physical |
| 22:51.58 | Primer | I actually am still mostly top DPS |
| 22:52.05 | Semlar | hunters may be able to do all their damage all the time but don't do as much damage as other classes |
| 22:52.15 | Primer | I guess that means the rest of my guild are just bad |
| 22:52.22 | Semlar | and movement is not usually that much of an issue if you're good |
| 22:52.37 | tzarc | the hunter in my guild is usually top, mainly because I'm a dumbarse and can't play properly |
| 22:53.30 | tzarc | fails at immolate uptime, amongst other things |
| 22:53.37 | Amarande | Semlar: there's also the fact that you only have to dedicate half as many stat points towards ensuring strikes land as any other class |
| 22:53.39 | Semlar | it also kinda depends on how long the fight is and what spec they are |
| 22:53.56 | Primer | Let's see...I'm #1 on Immerseus, Protectors, Norushen, Sha, (Would have been #1 on Galakras if our other tower dude didn't miss raid and I had to sit there for close to 1 minute holding my dick) |
| 22:53.59 | Amarande | casters get the double hit requirement, and the other physical classes are melee, so they get the lower hit requirement but they need expertise |
| 22:54.20 | Primer | oh wait, I was also #1 on juggernaut |
| 22:54.26 | Semlar | ouch |
| 22:54.30 | Primer | #2 on shaman |
| 22:54.42 | Semlar | shaman i can see because of multidotting |
| 22:54.59 | Primer | #1 on general, Malk, spoils |
| 22:55.02 | Primer | then it drops off |
| 22:55.07 | Semlar | there is no way i would lose to a shadow priest on juggernaut though |
| 22:55.10 | Primer | so yeah, my guild mates suck :( |
| 22:55.30 | Semlar | do you outgear them? |
| 22:55.34 | *** join/#wowuidev foxlit (N@2a01:7e00::f03c:91ff:feae:d316) |
| 22:55.40 | Primer | http://worldoflogs.com/reports/gohzdxx0r1yfmrvn/ |
| 22:55.42 | Primer | the parses |
| 22:55.47 | Primer | I'm 560 |
| 22:55.56 | Primer | http://us.battle.net/wow/en/character/frostmourne/Ihavenoidea/advanced |
| 22:56.16 | Primer | If I outgear them, it's by no more than 5 item levels |
| 22:56.22 | Mr_Rabies | i really should run logs next week |
| 22:56.23 | tzarc | hmmm |
| 22:56.25 | Primer | My guess is that I just try harder |
| 22:56.41 | Mr_Rabies | we haven't really run logs since our raid leader up and left randomly mid-5.2 |
| 22:57.06 | Primer | I recently discovered raidbots.com: http://raidbots.com/epeenbot/us/frostmourne/ihavenoidea/ |
| 22:57.20 | tzarc | http://www.worldoflogs.com/reports/c2y0v9r86b01qh44/sum/damageDone/?s=6495&e=6713 <== that's our jugg for comparison :S |
| 22:57.26 | Semlar | your hunter's only doing 165k dps on juggernaut |
| 22:57.34 | Semlar | and they're in 554 gear |
| 22:57.42 | Gnarfoz | hm |
| 22:58.15 | Semlar | <PROTECTED> |
| 22:58.20 | Primer | again, that's the "trying harder" part |
| 22:58.24 | Mr_Rabies | i'm somehow registered as having done norushen and iron juggernaut on normal 25 |
| 22:58.24 | Mr_Rabies | what |
| 22:58.36 | Gnarfoz | so, that mmoui/wowinsider/zam party is basically at the same time as the community dinner? :D |
| 22:59.22 | Mr_Rabies | must have been flex raid breaking or something lol |
| 22:59.54 | Primer | Semlar: what's your item level? |
| 23:00.01 | Semlar | mine is 563 |
| 23:00.06 | Semlar | fatau's is lower |
| 23:00.21 | Semlar | i'm pretty sure his is 555 |
| 23:00.29 | Semlar | which is basically the same as your hunter's |
| 23:00.49 | *** join/#wowuidev cbreak (~cbreak@84-73-28-38.dclient.hispeed.ch) |
| 23:01.19 | Semlar | fatau did 244k dps on that fight |
| 23:01.42 | Semlar | so i would say your hunter is not playing quite as well as they could |
| 23:01.56 | Semlar | and i'm not qualified to talk about any other classes |
| 23:02.36 | Primer | man, our DPS is horrible on that fight compared to yours |
| 23:02.52 | Primer | Seems our saving grace is the disc priest that likes to DPS |
| 23:02.54 | *** join/#wowuidev foxlit (~N@pluto.42d6.com) |
| 23:03.01 | Primer | he beat out the monk tank |
| 23:03.04 | kullervo | that's pretty good dps |
| 23:03.08 | kullervo | why aren't you doing heroic, Semlar? |
| 23:03.19 | Primer | not to mention the resto druid apparently DPSing too |
| 23:03.31 | Semlar | we haven't killed garrosh and we're pretty casual with our raiding |
| 23:03.31 | kullervo | http://www.worldoflogs.com/reports/rt-fme541kq0yoyjc49/sum/damageDone/?s=1439&e=1882 |
| 23:03.43 | kullervo | we're pretty casual too |
| 23:03.50 | Primer | 30m damage between the 2 healers |
| 23:04.00 | Semlar | some of our core players were missing for like a month |
| 23:04.18 | Semlar | and.. are missing again! |
| 23:04.19 | kullervo | Primer: our disc did 24 by himself |
| 23:04.22 | Semlar | so that's not helping |
| 23:04.22 | kullervo | on that kill |
| 23:04.32 | Primer | yeah |
| 23:04.46 | Primer | That fight really is a joke |
| 23:04.58 | kullervo | Primer: mind you my log is HC his is Normal :P |
| 23:05.05 | Semlar | we also only raid 2 nights a week |
| 23:05.10 | Ackis | http://www.reddit.com/r/networking/comments/1pw8db/has_anyone_used_quickcertcom_courses_for/cd6tk2o |
| 23:05.13 | Ackis | I am so amused |
| 23:05.20 | tzarc | we're 2 nights too |
| 23:05.31 | Primer | Semlar: we're _supposed_ to raid only 2 nights a week, but lately it's only been 1 |
| 23:05.38 | tzarc | bad nights really fucks us in the arse |
| 23:05.39 | Primer | every week there's always someone who can't make the SECOND night |
| 23:05.42 | tzarc | like last night :S |
| 23:05.48 | kullervo | Semlar: Oh. We upped our raids from 3 to 4 so we could get competitive rankings. |
| 23:05.48 | Primer | making it that much harder to pug |
| 23:06.12 | tzarc | afk's suck. |
| 23:06.32 | Primer | I'm basically resigned to the fact that, while I do well in our raid, my class is one of the lowest DPS classes nowadays |
| 23:06.53 | tzarc | mmm, 13 raiders, 4 afk's tomorrow... gg |
| 23:08.27 | Primer | our second night we simply decided to do flex...then we had a pug leave on the third Garrosh pull (none of us had ever done it...flex, normal, or LFR) |
| 23:08.38 | Primer | and it fell apart |
| 23:09.00 | tzarc | bummer |
| 23:09.28 | Primer | Mostly people are finding social lives |
| 23:09.44 | tzarc | yeah I'm going the other direction, lol |
| 23:09.52 | Primer | same here, but I'm old, so it's OK |
| 23:10.17 | tzarc | I'm just angry at the world after a breakup, no biggie :P |
| 23:10.48 | Primer | ahh...I've been married over 17 years |
| 23:11.03 | tzarc | kullervo: don't suppose you remember the heroic kill order you did? or what you think is easiest progression-wise? |
| 23:11.05 | *** join/#wowuidev Dridzt (~Miranda@athedsl-27626.home.otenet.gr) |
| 23:11.11 | tzarc | ah, lucky you :) |
| 23:11.32 | kullervo | Trela: we did them in order. |
| 23:11.37 | kullervo | More points that way and looks better. |
| 23:11.47 | tzarc | fair enough |
| 23:12.10 | tzarc | we're just having to manage what we think is doable in 2 nights a week, so efficiency is better for us |
| 23:12.19 | Amarande | and yay my unit frames just got tainted again |
| 23:12.24 | Amarande | I'm not exactly sure what by, though :S |
| 23:12.34 | kullervo | easiest ones are, imo, immerseus, protectors, norushen, galakras, nazgrim - in no particular order |
| 23:12.45 | tzarc | yeah, all done so far :P |
| 23:12.48 | kullervo | (well, order of appereance) |
| 23:12.55 | *** join/#wowuidev Semlar-Laptop (~Semlar@142.196.185.93) |
| 23:13.08 | kullervo | on HC? You're doing well for 2 nights a week then |
| 23:13.13 | Amarande | but yeah, I've come to learn it pretty well that when BugSack says SUF tried to perform a protected function, generally SUF isn't actually the addon at fault |
| 23:13.20 | Amarande | as usual though I'm not sure what *is* at fault :| |
| 23:13.22 | *** join/#wowuidev MentalPower|Work (~MentalPow@WoWUIDev/Norganna/Administrator/MentalPower) |
| 23:13.22 | *** mode/#wowuidev [+v MentalPower|Work] by ChanServ |
| 23:13.27 | tzarc | we're 6/14 atm, skipped jugg/shamans, did naz |
| 23:13.35 | kullervo | Shamans is pretty easy too |
| 23:13.43 | kullervo | and juggernaut just requires good healers |
| 23:13.50 | tzarc | we got them to ~30% last night on the first night of attempts |
| 23:14.04 | Amarande | I wonder if pet battles have something to do with it |
| 23:14.05 | tzarc | but afk's are fucking us :S |
| 23:14.07 | kullervo | what's your strategy for dark shamans? Split? |
| 23:14.10 | tzarc | yeah |
| 23:14.14 | kullervo | super easy |
| 23:14.29 | kullervo | if only our healers could stay alive |
| 23:14.34 | tzarc | bingo |
| 23:14.48 | Primer | So earlier people were talking about their SPs, and I'd like to talk about mine! I recently switched from PI to ToF, but...I really don't like coming from behind to top DPS |
| 23:14.54 | tzarc | our best attempt last night was when both the healers up the ramp got tombed because they're blind |
| 23:14.58 | Primer | with PI I would usually start at the top and stay there |
| 23:15.00 | tzarc | grumbles |
| 23:15.08 | Primer | Thoughts on PI vs. ToF? |
| 23:15.41 | kullervo | tzarc: our last week's issue was probably that we put a mistweaver and resto druid at earthbreaker |
| 23:15.48 | Amarande | oh, yay, logging out doesn't take you out of queue anymore |
| 23:15.52 | *** join/#wowuidev foxlit (~N@pluto.42d6.com) |
| 23:15.58 | kullervo | Amarande: been that way for ages |
| 23:16.09 | kullervo | I often relog on my other characters to post auctions etc if it's a longer queue |
| 23:16.14 | tzarc | we had restosham/restodruid for the start, then disc/restodruid |
| 23:16.21 | Amarande | but yeah, something is tainting my unit frames, and I'm not 100% sure what, when, and how |
| 23:16.27 | tzarc | resto being offspec with lower gear, so I dunno if that had anything to do with it |
| 23:16.35 | tzarc | certainly had nothing to do with tombs, at least |
| 23:16.47 | kullervo | yeah our resto was offspec too, no issue with THAT in particular |
| 23:17.01 | Amarande | I don't even know it's happened until I cross to another instance or continent and then I get greeted with an annoy-o-box about how SUF has performed an action only available to the Blizzard UI yadda |
| 23:17.11 | Amarande | and BugSack says it did the infamous ParentalControls function |
| 23:17.18 | Amarande | that we've all been wrassling with since 4.1 |
| 23:17.35 | Amarande | as usual for it it doesn't seem to actually impede any actual functions and I'm still not at all sure what triggers it |
| 23:17.36 | tzarc | fair enough |
| 23:17.45 | bleeter | kd3: hey, you play a mage thus must know stuff. So, how come mages are so stuck up they don't bother naming their elemental? Is it because it's meant to be a different elemental each summons? |
| 23:17.52 | tzarc | was just curious if you'd had suggestions for kill order is all |
| 23:18.11 | tzarc | looks as if we're a little lower on dps for shamans than your logs, not that surprising due to unfamiliarity I guess |
| 23:18.18 | Amarande | bleeter: probably. it probably is all influenced by D&D and the like |
| 23:18.25 | Amarande | elementals have always been extremely generic creatures |
| 23:18.25 | bleeter | kd3: (from a lore type point of view) |
| 23:18.34 | Amarande | whereas demons have always had true names as a tradition for fantasy RPGs |
| 23:18.35 | kd3 | it's like locks. we're nowhere nearly in tune with the earth that shaman are. individual summons are based on whatever's in the area |
| 23:18.47 | kd3 | s/that shaman/like shaman/ |
| 23:20.59 | bleeter | heh, ok. just after coming back have only now realised how annoying being in a big group and I can't see which one is mine. if it were proper RP, I'd probably paint it flouro orange each summons, just so I can tell.. |
| 23:21.49 | foxlit | glyph it. |
| 23:21.57 | kd3 | we got new glyphs that can be used for that |
| 23:22.01 | kd3 | or just hit shift+f1 |
| 23:22.39 | Arrowmaster | silly mages, your not a pet class |
| 23:22.48 | tzarc | you're* |
| 23:22.51 | tzarc | runs |
| 23:24.16 | bleeter | these days, hunters are barely pet classes :P |
| 23:24.31 | tzarc | should make MM petless, tbh |
| 23:24.42 | tzarc | might give me a reason to play hunter |
| 23:24.44 | Semlar-Laptop | well, my pet is like half my damage |
| 23:24.55 | Semlar-Laptop | i hate the stupid pet though |
| 23:24.59 | tzarc | ^this |
| 23:25.02 | Semlar-Laptop | it's literally just a dot in raids |
| 23:25.10 | Semlar-Laptop | a dot that can get stuck and die |
| 23:25.17 | tzarc | it's why I run with sacrifice on my lock, cbf'd dealing with pets |
| 23:25.20 | Semlar-Laptop | and has to run back and forth between things |
| 23:25.27 | Semlar-Laptop | oh man that travel time really kills its damage |
| 23:25.49 | Semlar-Laptop | you do NOT want to switch targets with stampede up |
| 23:26.03 | tzarc | heh |
| 23:27.55 | *** join/#wowuidev Motig (~Woho@31-151-161-87.dynamic.upc.nl) |
| 23:28.05 | Semlar-Laptop | the pet is seriously retarded when it comes to multiple targets if it's set to assist |
| 23:28.49 | Semlar-Laptop | i might have to get used to leaving it on passive and manually sticking it on everything |
| 23:28.54 | Amarande | okay seriously WTF this is just retarded now |
| 23:28.58 | Amarande | scarlet monastery pops |
| 23:29.02 | Amarande | loading bar fills, CRASH |
| 23:29.14 | Amarande | relog, get back on and my character is shown as zoneless, try to log back in, loading bar mostly fills, CRASH |
| 23:29.35 | Amarande | well, not crash, but freezes until I get DC'd |
| 23:30.39 | Semlar-Laptop | maybe the instance didn't get created |
| 23:30.54 | Amarande | Semlar: any way out of it that's not going to ultimately involve backing up and redoing my UI? |
| 23:31.08 | Amarande | i.e., do you need GM aid (which means you have to go to the trouble to reset first or they won't help)? |
| 23:31.21 | Semlar-Laptop | if that's the problem it's because of the server and you'd best just wait for a while |
| 23:31.23 | Amarande | not to mention having to go to the trouble of making an alt on the server to put in the ticket, and wait for the ticket :| |
| 23:31.24 | Neffi | If the instance didn't get created, then it's not a UI issue |
| 23:31.38 | Amarande | Neffi: yeah, but GMs won't help you with jack unless you nuke your whole UI :S |
| 23:31.41 | Neffi | If you can't login within the next couple minutes, try a WTF backup/reset |
| 23:32.06 | Neffi | Maybe it IS a UI issue |
| 23:32.12 | Neffi | Unresolved bug hanging the thread |
| 23:32.25 | Semlar-Laptop | could be |
| 23:32.39 | Neffi | They need to exhaust all possibilities, because you've always got people that refuse to believe the issue could be on their end |
| 23:32.49 | tzarc | I put my WTF on bitbucket....SAFETY FIRST |
| 23:32.51 | Amarande | Neffi: yeah, that's true |
| 23:32.57 | Semlar-Laptop | i had a bug with my map where it would get stuck in a while loop trying to zoom out and going to the darkmoon faire just caused it to lock up |
| 23:33.10 | Amarande | what's more frustrating is some cases where it is obviously not and they still force you to go through the motions anyway, no matter how much trouble it is to do so |
| 23:33.14 | Semlar-Laptop | because it thought it could zoom out and couldn't |
| 23:33.52 | Neffi | I was pretty god-damned positive that constant disconnects and poor latency had nothing to do with the new updates that were available. How could the client work fine 24/7 right up until a new Windows update is available. They recommended I run the update anyway, to exhaust all possibilities. Fixed my issue. |
| 23:33.58 | Neffi | You never really know |
| 23:34.59 | Neffi | I still have no idea what the hell caused that, but I learned to really exhaust all updates |
| 23:35.07 | Amarande | I'm just bloody glad Curse Client actually bases your presently installed addons off the actual addon folder and NOT off some internal app-specific database |
| 23:35.16 | Neffi | updates wasn't the right word, but you catch my drift |
| 23:35.23 | Amarande | otherwise it'd be a case of wtf now I have to write down all the addons I use so I can find the precise set again, if needing to do a reset |
| 23:35.28 | Amarande | that or actually suck it up and pay for curse premium :p |
| 23:35.46 | Neffi | Yeah, that's a major issue with Nexus Mod Manager |
| 23:35.56 | tzarc | ...I wrote a script to download them from curseforge/wowace/wowi |
| 23:36.02 | tzarc | sick of manually updating |
| 23:36.14 | Amarande | tzarc: heh, surprised curse hasn't made a policy of IP banning people for doing that |
| 23:36.21 | Amarande | since you're evading the need to buy curse premium |
| 23:36.23 | xyphoid_ | clearly the answer is a puppet manifest for your WoW folder |
| 23:36.25 | Neffi | They use an internal database to keep track of what's installed, what version, etc. It will randomly remove very particular addons from that list for no reason, forcing you to uninstall and reinstall the mod to even check if there's an update available |
| 23:36.57 | tzarc | I suppose they could just match against the user-agent, but other than that, it just looks like a webpage request |
| 23:37.17 | tzarc | and besides, it's not like the script is public, if a lot of people were using it they'd probably be annoyed I guess |
| 23:37.40 | Amarande | heh, and maybe worse |
| 23:37.48 | Amarande | next thing you know you get a precedent that wget is a violation of the DMCA :) |
| 23:37.58 | tzarc | who said it was wget? :P |
| 23:38.08 | *** join/#wowuidev Ressy (~Ressy@WoWUIDev/WoWAce/ARL/Ressy) |
| 23:38.09 | Amarande | well, wget or wget-like tools |
| 23:38.46 | Amarande | or worse a precedent that all HTTP user agents legally have to support javascript, in order to respect websites' wishes :) |
| 23:38.56 | tzarc | it's LWP::Simple, but eh |
| 23:39.09 | Amarande | (unfortunately that does have a precedent of sorts to make it not totally implausible, remember how VCRs are required to support Macrovision or they're considered pirate boxes heh) |
| 23:39.40 | Amarande | bleh. let's see if repairing game data works, first |
| 23:39.48 | tzarc | there are always ways around it - if they decide to deploy via json or something, you download the json instead.... you can't really stop that sort determined individuals :P |
| 23:40.12 | tzarc | besides... I like a challenge ;) |
| 23:41.16 | Arrowmaster | Fisker: applying system update! |
| 23:41.29 | Amarande | ever notice how since MMORPGs have gone to streaming launchers, it hasn't really decreased download times but it sure as hell *has* increased the frequency of corrupted game data? :| |
| 23:42.47 | tzarc | mine's only ever been corrupted pre-streaming-launcher |
| 23:43.09 | Amarande | tzarc: guild wars (which always had a streaming launcher) corrupted on me all the time |
| 23:43.20 | Amarande | SW:TOR has had notorious cases of corrupted data which seem to occur more often since it went streaming, too |
| 23:43.40 | Amarande | LOTRO only has corrupted data problems with the installer. but I don't think LOTRO *has* a streaming launcher |
| 23:43.58 | tzarc | hmmm |
| 23:44.01 | Amarande | yay ... I can't seem to log in |
| 23:44.17 | Amarande | log on, character is zoneless, click on character, loading bar gets almost full, long long pause and then "you've been DC'd" |
| 23:44.32 | tzarc | other characters? |
| 23:44.32 | Amarande | hm let's see if other characters work |
| 23:44.57 | tzarc | log a GM ticket from one of the others if it persists |
| 23:45.05 | Primer | thing is, that corruption is easy to fix most of the time, since the smart game distributors are using torrent-like tech |
| 23:45.07 | Amarande | also I should probably head over to scarlet monastery with this character and see if it screws her up too |
| 23:45.16 | Amarande | as in, whether perhaps I have corrupted SM-related data files :S |
| 23:45.17 | Primer | i.e. only replacing the corrupted blocks, not the whole file |
| 23:45.34 | Amarande | because basically it was "try to zone into SM, load bar finishes, stuck, DC" |
| 23:45.48 | Amarande | okay, now I can't seem to log onto my warlock either |
| 23:45.54 | Amarande | who's been in Orgrimmar for weeks |
| 23:45.57 | Amarande | this is bad :| |
| 23:46.04 | Primer | This might be a repeat of what happened last week |
| 23:46.09 | Primer | where tons of people were locked out |
| 23:46.18 | Amarande | Primer: did it resolve itself after maint? |
| 23:46.25 | Amarande | (and do we have maint this week? I hope so :|) |
| 23:46.37 | Primer | No, I think Blizz had to take a proactive approach to fixing it |
| 23:46.53 | Amarande | aright, let's try my mage, who's in Dalaran atm |
| 23:47.07 | Amarande | also where will my monk be when I can log back in? default graveyard? |
| 23:47.13 | Amarande | (since she actually IS listed as zoneless) |
| 23:47.18 | tzarc | well, my loading bar is at the end and not logging on |
| 23:47.23 | tzarc | so perhaps it's not just you |
| 23:47.25 | Amarande | loading bar almost at end, no logon |
| 23:47.40 | Amarande | let's see if cache/UI reset helps |
| 23:49.00 | tzarc | well the main thread has stalled |
| 23:49.16 | tzarc | so I'd guess addon hardlooping |
| 23:49.18 | Amarande | guessing it will not, though, since the characters have been in three different places, surely corrupted cache would affect only one |
| 23:49.19 | Ressy | BlizzardCS @BlizzardCS 3m |
| 23:49.19 | Ressy | We're aware & looking into an issue causing some players to get stuck or disconnected while 'loading' into the game or instances. |
| 23:49.22 | tzarc | should be protected from that shit |
| 23:49.43 | Amarande | btw, speaking of needing to reset UIs |
| 23:49.53 | Amarande | are they ever going to fix the "newbie realm" niggle that came out with MOP? |
| 23:50.14 | tzarc | can't logon without addons either |
| 23:50.16 | tzarc | yay |
| 23:50.37 | Amarande | as in, if you reset your UI and then log in |
| 23:50.52 | Amarande | instead of being, as before MOP, taken automatically to a realm where you already have characters |
| 23:51.06 | Amarande | you're asked what realm type you like and sent to character creation at the "new players" realm of that sort, as if you were new |
| 23:51.12 | Amarande | I'm still not sure why that was even changed |
| 23:51.16 | Semlar-Laptop | never gonna happen |
| 23:51.26 | Amarande | Semlar: intended change I presume? |
| 23:51.35 | Amarande | but for what purpose? most people usually want to get back to their existing toons :S |
| 23:51.36 | Semlar-Laptop | they're lazy |
| 23:51.50 | Semlar-Laptop | and that's probably not very high on their priority list |
| 23:51.57 | Amarande | the behaviour is different from pre-MOP so obviously they made a conscious decision to change it |
| 23:51.59 | Amarande | I'm just not sure why :S |
| 23:52.16 | Amarande | also: why are ENTIRE ACCOUNTS locked out when this glitch happens :| |
| 23:52.24 | Amarande | usually when you have a character lockout glitch it's just that particular character |
| 23:52.24 | Semlar-Laptop | they probably added it when they completely redid the character creation screen |
| 23:52.51 | Semlar-Laptop | because it's probably an instance problem on the server |
| 23:52.52 | Amarande | or is it like, doing some kind of duplicate login check and treating it as an attempt to logon twice simultaneously on the account? |
| 23:52.53 | kullervo | default realm no longer stored server side, possibly due to a technical limitation |
| 23:53.56 | Amarande | kinda like Failed to Join Game in D2, which happened apparently because server side you were still logged onto that character in a game, so you weren't able to put them in a game *again* meanwhile |
| 23:54.08 | *** join/#wowuidev alestane (~nevin@c-174-63-97-69.hsd1.ma.comcast.net) |
| 23:54.08 | *** mode/#wowuidev [+v alestane] by ChanServ |
| 23:54.34 | Amarande | Ressy: any word on whether it's going to be a "we can get in anytime soon" thing or whether we're going to be looking into other gaming options for several days? |
| 23:55.05 | Ressy | What are you talking about |
| 23:55.16 | Amarande | Ressy: the getting stuck issue |
| 23:55.27 | Ressy | Check their twitter? |
| 23:55.36 | Amarande | are we going to be able to log on reasonably soon, or should I be glad I'm not raiding actively atm :) |
| 23:55.48 | Semlar-Laptop | stop trying to log on for 30 minutes |
| 23:56.24 | Amarande | (The last big MMO login snafu I was witness to was September's SW:TOR screwup, and an entire week of raids was basically disrupted completely for many guilds because members were locked out for days before it settled down sufficiently to let them fix their installs) |
| 23:57.10 | Amarande | Semlar: bleh. so basically glitch like this = timered temporary ban as a stability measure? :| |
| 23:57.23 | Amarande | like Diablo 2 was notorious for? |
| 23:58.17 | Amarande | yay, and no encouraging word or ETA or anything from twitter, just "we're looking into it" |
| 23:58.59 | Amarande | seeing that it's an account wide error, I'm going to guess there's a fair chance I won't be able to log into D3 either :| |
