| 00:00.58 | Amarande | whereas those who hold the highest levels of knowledge during high civilisation ... well, consider a computer geek. what are we going to do after the solar flare with our knowledge of what are now basically rectangular pieces of plastic-like material with odd arrangements of metal wires embedded in them :) |
| 00:01.15 | Amarande | suddenly, we become at a major *disadvantage* in natural selection, don't we? |
| 00:01.58 | Amarande | thus, it seems logical that the geeky types are likely to disproportionately die out during the early generations after a civilisation falls, leaving the farming and working folks who never acquired that knowledge that we wish got saved through a period of "dark ages" :| |
| 00:02.00 | Shadowed | Use them to bash people in the heads with |
| 00:02.03 | Shadowed | and steal their weapons |
| 00:02.06 | Shadowed | thus, coming out on top |
| 00:02.08 | *** join/#wowuidev Funkeh` (~funk@5ada2baf.bb.sky.com) |
| 00:02.08 | *** join/#wowuidev Funkeh` (~funk@WoWUIDev/WoWAce/Ace3/BigWigs/funkeh) |
| 00:04.31 | bleeter | fwiw, US Customer Service Forum posts by customers suggest realms are returning |
| 00:05.24 | Amarande | bleeter: they were down? |
| 00:05.42 | Amarande | that's news to me, I've been doing Dread Wastes quests and just did a Sha group earlier |
| 00:06.36 | bleeter | Amarande: some were down for emergency maintenance, then from what I understand they came back but took other realms out. SOme CRZ screw up, it seemed. http://us.battle.net/wow/en/forum/topic/7592400517?page=1 |
| 00:07.24 | bleeter | Amarande: it wasn't all realms ;) |
| 00:08.32 | bleeter | continues to chuckle at 'ook the servers in the dooker' |
| 00:08.51 | Semlar|Laptop | um, computer geeks aren't going to just start dying off without computers |
| 00:10.11 | bleeter | i dunno, my gaming laptop's died and I saw the repair cost and felt like killing myself |
| 00:10.46 | Arrowmaster | my desktops been dead for 6 months :( |
| 00:10.47 | Amarande | Semlar: no, but what I mean is that the knowledge becomes mostly useless when the technology no longer functions |
| 00:10.52 | Mr_Rabies | what happened to it, bleeter? :o |
| 00:10.56 | *** join/#wowuidev Mihau (~Mihau@76.164.170.2) |
| 00:10.56 | Amarande | especially in such a sudden apocalypse scenario |
| 00:11.18 | Semlar|Laptop | except their knowledge isn't static |
| 00:11.51 | Semlar|Laptop | they can learn to adapt.. |
| 00:12.05 | bleeter | Mr_Rabies: put it this way, the last time it was working was the hottest day ever recorded here. Ain't booted since :( |
| 00:12.29 | Amarande | yup. not saying they'd suddenly die off, just that it seems like they'd be at a disadvantage compared to people whose entire lives have been about nose to the grindstone bare basics survival |
| 00:12.41 | Mr_Rabies | what brand/model, bleeter? :o |
| 00:12.46 | Amarande | and generally, statistically over time, the group with a disadvantage starts to evolve out |
| 00:12.49 | kd3 | if anyone was watching tv a few minutes ago... did your EAS go off? got something about an amber alert in south carolina |
| 00:13.16 | Mr_Rabies | i don't think our EAS works since we've got directv :( |
| 00:13.33 | Semlar|Laptop | survival experts would be better at surviving, but an intelligent person is going to be well ahead of much of the population |
| 00:13.37 | bleeter | Mr_Rabies: it's an 'old' asus pro-gaming g73j |
| 00:13.53 | kd3 | mr_rabies, which is what I thought too, since I was watching on directv |
| 00:13.56 | kd3 | huh |
| 00:13.59 | Mr_Rabies | hm |
| 00:14.00 | Mr_Rabies | i dunno |
| 00:14.21 | Mr_Rabies | i pretty much let cartoon network drown out the fans i have running down here |
| 00:14.26 | Mr_Rabies | and don't really pay attention |
| 00:15.14 | *** join/#wowuidev Sintacks (Syntax@173-80-112-167-swby.atw.dyn.suddenlink.net) |
| 00:15.15 | bleeter | the thing's 3-4 years old. has been pretty heavily played over that time, smokey rooms too. surprised it's lasted this long :) |
| 00:15.17 | Mr_Rabies | does it seriously have these, bleeter? http://blog.laptopmag.com/wpress/wp-content/uploads/2010/01/ASUS-G73jh04.jpg |
| 00:15.39 | Amarande | I haven't really watched actual TV in weeks |
| 00:15.44 | bleeter | Mr_Rabies: yes |
| 00:15.48 | Mr_Rabies | well i have some good news and some bad news |
| 00:15.53 | kd3 | but thinking back, I think that's the first EAS I've ever heard that wasn't a test or coming over the weather radio |
| 00:15.56 | Mr_Rabies | the good news is your laptop's probably a gundam |
| 00:15.59 | Amarande | I think it's still tuned to the Music Choice 80s station or something like that if I were to turn the TV and cable box on |
| 00:16.03 | Mr_Rabies | the bad news is, you killed it |
| 00:16.37 | Amarande | for one, I've been busy WoWing and such ... for two, I don't have the cable box remote in here because the family's cable box remote has been on the fritz lately and they keep borrowing mine so I can't actually change channels conveniently ROFL |
| 00:16.39 | kd3 | and enwiki says dish/directv are required to participate |
| 00:17.02 | *** join/#wowuidev MentalPower (~textual@WoWUIDev/Norganna/Administrator/MentalPower) |
| 00:17.04 | *** mode/#wowuidev [+v MentalPower] by ChanServ |
| 00:17.27 | Mr_Rabies | hmm |
| 00:17.34 | Mr_Rabies | how easy is it to open the bottom, bleeter? |
| 00:18.03 | Amarande | Arrow: you didn't try to upgrade a Sandy Bridge Intel machine to a 4-DIMM configuration by any chance, did you? |
| 00:18.27 | Mr_Rabies | if it's easy enough you could prop the laptop on its side, pop off all the covers you can, put the strongest fan you've got blowing directly into the case, and see if you get -anything- that way |
| 00:19.01 | bleeter | Mr_Rabies: yeah my next personal step is to open it up and use the freeze spray stuffs to see what happens |
| 00:19.24 | Mr_Rabies | i'd check thermal paste, etc first |
| 00:19.36 | Mr_Rabies | before playing with stuff that causes condensation :p |
| 00:20.06 | bleeter | point |
| 00:20.17 | Mr_Rabies | points at bleeter |
| 00:20.34 | Mr_Rabies | do the fans not even spin up? |
| 00:20.40 | bleeter | still, think I'd rather just replace the bloody thing. 3-4 years ain't bad life for a laptop, particularly a gaming one |
| 00:20.47 | Mr_Rabies | pfft |
| 00:20.53 | Mr_Rabies | i'm still using a laptop i got in late 2005 |
| 00:20.56 | Amarande | I got to be without useful use of my desktop for most of October and November thanks to Intel's finickiness. :| |
| 00:20.57 | bleeter | Mr_Rabies: it *sounds* like maybe only one or two are spinning up |
| 00:21.02 | Mr_Rabies | got windows 7 on it and everything |
| 00:21.03 | Amarande | AMD FTW. |
| 00:21.17 | bleeter | Mr_Rabies: yeah but you're insane! I'm just crazy ;) |
| 00:21.21 | Mr_Rabies | amds are great and multifunctional |
| 00:21.51 | Mr_Rabies | pop off the side door on your desktop and use the heatsink as a makeshift stove |
| 00:22.18 | Mr_Rabies | it runs windows 7 better than it ever ran xp |
| 00:22.25 | Mr_Rabies | except....the video drivers aren't perfect |
| 00:22.30 | Mr_Rabies | it won't ever go into standby |
| 00:22.38 | Amarande | Heh. I'm actually getting the impression that AMD's fiscal woes are actually because they're doing things *too* well, when I think about it. |
| 00:22.49 | Mr_Rabies | microsoft wrote their own ATI drivers for it, apparently |
| 00:23.08 | Mr_Rabies | because dell cba to update their own 3 months into the laptop's life |
| 00:23.44 | Amarande | I mean, what do you get when you buy AMD? You get a processor that's got good enough performance for most practical tasks, as well as for gaming (especially these days now that the system demand curve for gaming seems to be flattening out compared to the olden days where you had to constantly buy the best in order to run the latest games well *cough* Crysis *cough*) |
| 00:23.50 | Amarande | and which runs ROCK stable and reliable. |
| 00:24.36 | bleeter | Mr_Rabies: that's the other thing about this lappy, it'll ONLY work with the video drivers it shipped with. Yes, ATI. |
| 00:24.40 | Amarande | What do you get with Intel? You might get a performance edge at the top end for the few absolutely most demanding tasks, you also get a more finicky device, and things are designed so you usually (excepting a few cases like SB->IB in some cases) have to make much larger upgrades each time you do. |
| 00:25.09 | Amarande | Basically, the impression I get is that Intel is good at getting people to feel the need for new hardware more frequently, while AMD is good at giving you a system where you get the warm fuzzies of stability :) |
| 00:25.27 | Arrowmaster | i went with intel for this laptop because fuck ATI |
| 00:25.29 | Amarande | Of course, the latter is great for the customer and terrible for the company. :| |
| 00:25.46 | Amarande | ah. not much experience with the laptop side of things |
| 00:26.28 | Arrowmaster | im tempted to throw 16gigs of ram in it |
| 00:26.43 | Amarande | Arrow: careful how you configure 16GB on an Intel machine |
| 00:27.02 | Amarande | basically, make sure you buy all the RAM at once, seems to be one of the big things. never try to go 8GB and then add 8 more GB. |
| 00:27.04 | bleeter | Mr_Rabies: so, despite the price and my desire to try and fix the thing myself, the ATI driver from 2009 thing makes me kinda all 'meh' about it |
| 00:27.34 | Mr_Rabies | sounds like someone needs an excuse to buy a new gaming laptop |
| 00:27.35 | Amarande | what I ended up spending October and November doing was spending about $600 or so on hardware and diagnostics which ultimately gave me this portrait of things with Sandy Bridge |
| 00:28.15 | Mr_Rabies | i've had the exact opposite experience with intel/amd amarande |
| 00:28.17 | Amarande | I had ultimately three pairs of 4GB DIMMs. All the same spec and timings, same brand, but each pair bought separately rather than a four-DIMM set |
| 00:28.19 | Arrowmaster | Amarande: thats kinda always been the case with multi-channel ram, dont ever try to mix |
| 00:28.39 | Amarande | Install any one pair, and things worked fine. |
| 00:29.07 | Amarande | Install any two pairs, and you were 1) lucky to POST (even on an ASUS board with the MemoryOK feature ...), and 2) if you did POST, you would hard crash and shut off the moment you put the RAM under any serious load |
| 00:29.18 | bleeter | there's always been chicken waiving involved in getting multiple ram sticks working together. |
| 00:29.22 | Mr_Rabies | amd seems to avoid proper standardization, their cost/performance ratio stinks compared to intel's, they're unstable as heck |
| 00:29.48 | Amarande | Keep in mind that each individual pair is a matched pair kit, and all three kits have the same timings, voltage, and speed |
| 00:29.58 | bleeter | a few times I've bought multiple sticks... that have come straight from the manufactuer out of the carton - and none will work with each other... |
| 00:30.07 | Mr_Rabies | Asus boards are notorious for having memory compatibility issues |
| 00:30.09 | Amarande | Ultimately, what tipped me off in the end was that the shop when I had it diagnosed pulled a pair of RAM out and said "you have bad RAM" |
| 00:30.25 | Amarande | So I did the logical thing and ordered a new pair from TigerDirect. The moment I installed the new pair, I got the SAME issues |
| 00:30.29 | bleeter | my favourite though is when the manufacturer puts a label on stick type A saying it's stick type B |
| 00:30.40 | bleeter | then gets put in a box labelled stick type C |
| 00:30.43 | Amarande | and I figure, the chance that ALL this RAM is bad is quite slim, not impossible, but slim |
| 00:30.52 | Mr_Rabies | i highly don't recommend boards from ASUS or MSI, for that reason |
| 00:30.54 | Mr_Rabies | their support sucks |
| 00:31.00 | Mr_Rabies | and you will almost ALWAYS have to talk to them |
| 00:31.08 | Mr_Rabies | even if you buy ram on their compatibility list, often times |
| 00:31.16 | Mr_Rabies | which is a laughable concept in 2012 |
| 00:31.19 | Amarande | Mr_Rabies: my old AMD 939 board that I had before the 2011 snowstorm power surged it was an ASUS and it never had problems with being finicky on RAM |
| 00:31.28 | Arrowmaster | but i like asus |
| 00:31.40 | Mr_Rabies | i've seen literally 20+ computers have the exact issues you're experiencing |
| 00:31.46 | Amarande | Anyway, on the Intel, it literally got to the point where I thought the only thing that could be bad was the RAM controller on the CPU itself |
| 00:31.46 | Mr_Rabies | the solution is keep buying ram until you get some that works |
| 00:31.53 | Amarande | And for that to go out is still very rare |
| 00:31.55 | Arrowmaster | my asus board was fine till the heat fucked everything up |
| 00:31.56 | Mr_Rabies | or buy a new motherboard |
| 00:32.06 | Mr_Rabies | asus breaks standards entirely too much |
| 00:32.16 | Amarande | So when I tried my other Sandy Bridge CPU in the same board with the same RAM and saw it fuck up too, I knew it couldn't be that |
| 00:32.17 | bleeter | isn't the solution 'get a mac'? |
| 00:32.20 | Mr_Rabies | as does MSI |
| 00:32.29 | bleeter | ducks |
| 00:32.35 | Mr_Rabies | gooses |
| 00:32.52 | Amarande | Mr_Rabies: the Intel branded mobo I had had before that had issues with the 4-DIMM setup as well, except not as severe (it would just have Windows boot issues and go to Startup Repair almost every cold boot because it couldn't verify ntfs.sys etc.) |
| 00:33.05 | Mr_Rabies | what brand RAM is it, by chance? |
| 00:33.09 | Amarande | Corsair. |
| 00:33.14 | Amarande | Well ... let's put the cap on the tale |
| 00:33.25 | Mr_Rabies | yeah, you shouldn't be having those problems with an intel board and corsair O_o |
| 00:33.34 | Mr_Rabies | unless the voltages are straight-up wrong |
| 00:33.37 | Amarande | I finally decided to switch back to AMD and got a Phenom II X6 1045T and a Gigabyte 970A-DS3 board for it |
| 00:33.45 | Amarande | plugged in the VERY SAME RAM |
| 00:33.48 | Mr_Rabies | what voltage is the RAM? |
| 00:34.08 | Amarande | let memtest run for 24h+, no errors, still runs rock steady now (except the time Windows managed to corrupt the registry the other day, but that's Windows for you :P) |
| 00:34.13 | Amarande | 1.5V |
| 00:34.28 | Mr_Rabies | corrupt registry... i dunno man |
| 00:34.35 | bleeter | mate of mine, professional graphic artist, bought a new mac with one of those 2 year extended warranties. over 2 years, it kept getting sent back for service. to the point the only thing 'original' about it was the case |
| 00:34.40 | Amarande | basically, the Sandy Bridge puked and threw baby fits with the same RAM that works just fine with the AMD |
| 00:34.52 | Amarande | and this is why I now dislike Intel CPUs |
| 00:34.52 | Arrowmaster | ive been holding off on fixing my desktop since the only thing i can think of it to replace it all except the harddrives |
| 00:34.53 | bleeter | it was still faulty, but the shop refused to fix it because the two years had expired |
| 00:34.56 | bleeter | lolmacs |
| 00:35.02 | Mr_Rabies | i've never had one corrupt on me, personally, and i ran a system with windows xp from 2001 to 2008 or so |
| 00:35.03 | Arrowmaster | whens intel releasing their next chipset? |
| 00:35.16 | Amarande | well, I'm running 8, so it's possible that some bugs weren't worked out |
| 00:35.19 | Mr_Rabies | and this current one's been running vista since 2008 or so |
| 00:35.39 | Amarande | what I do know is the night the registry corrupted, when I tried to reboot the computer, it said an app was preventing the system from restarting |
| 00:35.43 | Mr_Rabies | never had anything even close to a registry corruption |
| 00:35.55 | Mr_Rabies | that could very, very well still be faulty RAM |
| 00:35.57 | Amarande | this flashed on and off about three times quickly, then it finally rebooted, and then it went to "Repairing your PC ..." and only a System Refresh worked |
| 00:36.24 | Amarande | I dunno, if it runs memtest86+ for over a day straight without error and is *still* faulty, demonic possession may be the issue there |
| 00:36.41 | Amarande | and so far, that's been a one-off anyway, whereas the corruption related issues on the Intel processors were near constant |
| 00:36.55 | *** join/#wowuidev Therzok (~Therzok@p16.eregie.pub.ro) |
| 00:36.59 | Amarande | i.e., basically every cold boot on the Intel was a startup repair because it couldn't verify ntfs.sys or ntoskrnl.exe |
| 00:37.28 | Amarande | As the haiku goes, "Yesterday it worked / Today it is not working / Windows is like that" |
| 00:37.29 | bleeter | demonic possession is usually cured by waiving a rubber chicken over the machine. though if it's a gaming machine you may need a rubber chicken with a pulley |
| 00:37.35 | Mr_Rabies | what voltage is the ram, if you can recall? |
| 00:37.41 | Amarande | 1.5V. |
| 00:37.45 | xyphoid | nono, you bleed on it. the blood protects against evil. |
| 00:37.47 | Amarande | I'm actually thinking that may be part of the issue |
| 00:37.49 | Mr_Rabies | oh |
| 00:37.50 | Mr_Rabies | you said that |
| 00:37.50 | Mr_Rabies | derp |
| 00:37.52 | Mr_Rabies | sorry |
| 00:37.59 | Mr_Rabies | i missed it |
| 00:38.00 | Arrowmaster | everything is 1.5V now |
| 00:38.06 | Mr_Rabies | yeah, more or less |
| 00:38.07 | Amarande | It *says* 1.5V, but a little poking around on Corsair's site suggested it might be 1.65V |
| 00:38.23 | Amarande | which ... could be a problem, especially with 4 DIMMs |
| 00:38.26 | Arrowmaster | 1.5V with a max of 1.65V probably |
| 00:38.39 | Amarande | since Intel processors are much more picky about RAM voltage than AMDs, it appears |
| 00:39.05 | Amarande | (probably because Intel has been gearing up increasingly aggressively for the mobile market, where designing CPU architectures around as low a voltage as possible is at a premium) |
| 00:39.36 | Arrowmaster | no its because the memory controller is on the cpu that they restricted the ram voltage |
| 00:39.51 | Arrowmaster | you could damage it otherwise |
| 00:39.53 | Amarande | Also, there's the matter that the Phenom II Thuban was particularly tolerant in terms of RAM voltage, since as a Socket AM3 (not AM3+) CPU, it had to be able to handle both DDR3 and DDR2 |
| 00:40.03 | Amarande | and DDR2 had much higher standard voltages than DDR3 |
| 00:40.54 | Arrowmaster | im glad i skipped over that time of using ddr2 |
| 00:41.15 | Mr_Rabies | on the ix processors, the memory controller's on the cpu, so it is voltage-finicky sometimes |
| 00:41.56 | Amarande | yeah I never used DDR2 either, my old 939 setup was DDR1 |
| 00:41.59 | Mr_Rabies | man |
| 00:42.08 | Mr_Rabies | i gotta start reading up before typing |
| 00:42.10 | Mr_Rabies | lol |
| 00:42.16 | Mr_Rabies | Arrowmaster just said that |
| 00:42.30 | Amarande | *however*, on the *other* hand, I'm not sure if the voltage really was an issue anyway |
| 00:42.48 | Amarande | since I looked at the RAM info screen in the BIOS on one of the occasions I could get it to POST and I recall it saying 1.5V, not 1.65V |
| 00:43.07 | Arrowmaster | it was probably more of a 'lets just limit this because otherwise the overclockers are going to go crazy and keep blowing their shit up' |
| 00:43.18 | Amarande | It could be that the Sandy RAM controller is just a hell of a lot more picky about dual channel setups than the AMD ones |
| 00:43.19 | bleeter | ^^ |
| 00:43.37 | bleeter | yar, people blowing shit up and sending it back to manufacturers trying to claim warranty... |
| 00:44.30 | Amarande | heh, "sorry physical damage, no go" |
| 00:44.33 | bleeter | sure, the manufactuerers just say 'no fuck off' but it takes time and effort etc. just easier to make the device not work when it thinks you're trying to blow it up |
| 00:44.49 | Amarande | bleeter: they make a nice racket on that with the LGA sockets, too |
| 00:45.03 | Amarande | LGA sockets are a mobo manufacturer's dream if you want to avoid warranty claims |
| 00:45.35 | Mr_Rabies | i love LGA sockets compared to the old socket A/socket 1 style |
| 00:45.37 | Arrowmaster | yet there was rummors of moving away from LGA |
| 00:45.48 | Amarande | Given that the only time I've ever damaged a CPU socket was the time I tried to put the shield back on an LGA socket in order to put that mobo into storage/possibly send it back? |
| 00:45.58 | Amarande | And that you HAVE TO put the shield back on in order to be able to send it back, anyway? |
| 00:46.21 | Rythal | DDR2 was the devil in it's infantcy, anytime I did a system build using it I had to try 6-8 sticks before I found a pair that would work |
| 00:46.30 | Amarande | And that the shield is so clumsy to get back in without damaging things that there's a pretty good chance that you will (I'm pretty careful with hardware and still managed to bend pins on the DZ68DB doing that ...) |
| 00:46.44 | Mr_Rabies | i've never damaged a cpu socket on an lga board and i've built dozens of boards using the design |
| 00:46.50 | Mr_Rabies | again, asus, i guess |
| 00:47.01 | bleeter | Arrowmaster: http://www.extremetech.com/computing/141443-leaked-intel-roadmap-shows-the-end-of-socketed-cpus-the-end-of-upgradable-pc |
| 00:47.09 | Amarande | It's lovely for the manufacturers, because then they can reject a lot of warranty claims on even legitimately crappy boards because the user lucklessly bends pins while packing it up for shipment |
| 00:47.11 | Mr_Rabies | we mostly use gigabyte and ive never had a single issue |
| 00:47.16 | Amarande | bleeter: that was debunked, apparently |
| 00:47.17 | Mr_Rabies | honestly that's the logical jump, bleeter |
| 00:47.20 | Mr_Rabies | maybe not now |
| 00:47.23 | Mr_Rabies | but within a decade |
| 00:47.34 | Amarande | it's one of those FUD rumours like that AMD is going to fold within a year |
| 00:47.37 | Mr_Rabies | they're already basically doing that by changing pin packages so often |
| 00:47.37 | Rythal | The only time I damaged a cpu socket it was an intel board, and during the same time... putting the cover back on it.... built thousands of asus systems no damage >< |
| 00:47.42 | Amarande | (which is something people have been claiming ever since like, Conroe heh) |
| 00:48.11 | Amarande | Mr_Rabies: actually, no, it's not the logical jump |
| 00:48.20 | Amarande | if you think about it, going away from socketed CPUs would absolutely murder the i7 |
| 00:48.32 | Benalish | http://forums.wowace.com/showthread.php?t=20399 who can help me? |
| 00:48.34 | Mr_Rabies | no one really upgrades their cpus anymore because by the time they can, there's a new pin package out |
| 00:48.40 | Rythal | not really.... anytime you wanna upgrade you need to buy a new motherboard anyways |
| 00:48.40 | Mr_Rabies | and the old cpus are rare as heck |
| 00:48.45 | Mr_Rabies | or by the time it's worth upgrading |
| 00:48.57 | Amarande | no, the problem is that with the BGA idea, you have to buy your CPU from the *mobo* manufacturer |
| 00:49.02 | Amarande | because you automatically buy a mobo/CPU combo |
| 00:49.06 | Arrowmaster | so march-june for haswell, guess i can wait on rebuilding my desktop |
| 00:49.27 | Mr_Rabies | foxconn makes most of the mobos anyway :p |
| 00:49.28 | Amarande | the mobo manufacturers would quickly realise they have us by the balls and spike the prices on the "luxury CPUs" (i7 maybe even i5) stratospherically |
| 00:49.53 | Amarande | so Intel would start seeing i7 and possibly i5 sales tank as everyone can only afford an i3 due to "luxury margin" pricing imposed by mobo manufacturers on boards equipped with better CPUs |
| 00:50.00 | Mr_Rabies | they make intel's and foxconn's boards (obviously) |
| 00:50.06 | Mr_Rabies | eh, i doubt it |
| 00:50.14 | Rythal | doubtful... they still have competition, and if the price did spike like that they'd be investigated pretty quick for price fixing |
| 00:50.15 | Arrowmaster | yeah i cant see that happening |
| 00:50.18 | Mr_Rabies | intel could easily set limits |
| 00:50.20 | Amarande | imagine if even the basic i7's cost as much as the extreme edition does today :P |
| 00:50.53 | Mr_Rabies | it's not really happening with the htpc market |
| 00:51.09 | Arrowmaster | they couldnt dare touch the OEMs prices, so if there was a drastic difference in OEM vs DIY builds it would cause price fixing investigations and people would just start buying OEM shit and modding it |
| 00:51.09 | Amarande | Mr_Rabies: actually, with the prebuilt PC market, you see it the most |
| 00:51.31 | Amarande | look at what OEMs equip PCs with these days, even full desktops, look at the Best Buy ad |
| 00:51.55 | Amarande | I don't think I've ever seen an i7, and AMD-side, I've seen them use A4 and A6, but barely ever A8 and I don't think I've EVER seen the A10 |
| 00:52.11 | Mr_Rabies | most people that buy pcs from brick and mortar stores have no idea what a cpu socket is, though |
| 00:52.13 | Rythal | Amarande: dunno about that, half the time people brought me flyers for i7 systems from best buy I couldn't even buy the parts for what they were selling it for. |
| 00:52.18 | *** join/#wowuidev Cairenn (~Owner@MMOI/Administratrix/Cairenn) |
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| 00:52.19 | Amarande | to get those higher-end CPUs in a prebuilt, you usually have to buy the brutally expensive "premium gamer" boxes |
| 00:52.38 | Arrowmaster | i got a nice i3 laptop for $399, for 150-200 more i could have probably found a good i5 but it wasnt really worth it to me |
| 00:52.47 | Amarande | Arrow: there's also the matter that the i5 is a silly thing indeed |
| 00:52.48 | Mr_Rabies | most people dont want to spend more than $300 on a desktop nowadays out here |
| 00:52.54 | Amarande | might as well use a Xeon E3-1230, really |
| 00:52.56 | Mr_Rabies | and $300's towards the high-end |
| 00:53.18 | Amarande | It's about the same price as the i5, except it has quad-core with HT instead of an IGPU that you're never going to use :) |
| 00:53.28 | Rythal | yeah $300 is about the limit most households are willing to spend on a computer.... not realizing $300 will get them shit that breaks in 6 months |
| 00:53.37 | Mr_Rabies | yup |
| 00:53.39 | Amarande | well, no wonder |
| 00:53.43 | Amarande | especially if it's an Intel processor |
| 00:53.49 | Semlar | ? |
| 00:54.09 | Semlar | care to elaborate that |
| 00:54.16 | Amarande | let's see. i3. mobo. |
| 00:54.27 | Amarande | you've probably got about $50-60 left for the whole rest of the system build now. :) |
| 00:54.37 | Semlar | ah |
| 00:54.42 | Mr_Rabies | most of them use older than i3s |
| 00:54.43 | Rythal | $300 computer wouldn't even get an i3 ... more like G650 |
| 00:54.43 | Amarande | i5+mobo and you're already over $300. |
| 00:55.01 | Mr_Rabies | they use celerons and sometimes even old pentium 4s in the more recent pin packages |
| 00:55.16 | Mr_Rabies | and often older amd processors |
| 00:55.36 | Amarande | yeah, I never see the flagship APU in any machines I see advertised |
| 00:55.41 | Rythal | but at the same time, even the dual core sandy bridge G series is more powerful then most households need for checking email/the web |
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| 00:55.47 | Amarande | even though the A10-5800K is actually not all that expensive, I think it's only about the price of an i3 if I remember |
| 00:55.55 | Mr_Rabies | they're there, but they're marketed towards gamers |
| 00:56.11 | Mr_Rabies | the public doesn't like to spend money on electronics unless there's a fancy apple on there somewhere |
| 00:56.25 | Mr_Rabies | and then they're like OMG THIS IS SO MUCH BETTER THAN MY OLD COMPUTER |
| 00:56.51 | Amarande | anyway, the only rationale I can see for the whole BGA thing actually going through instead of being FUD |
| 00:56.54 | Neffi | random(-42,-136) -> interval is empty |
| 00:56.56 | Amarande | might be, someday, heat management |
| 00:56.56 | Neffi | lulz |
| 00:56.59 | Semlar | well, most people don't need more than a $3-400 computer |
| 00:57.00 | Arrowmaster | did you see the report that an iPad4 was stolen from microsoft |
| 00:57.05 | Amarande | Neffi: random(-136,-42) |
| 00:57.10 | Neffi | lol wow |
| 00:57.20 | Neffi | fuck dyslexia |
| 00:57.22 | Semlar | most smart phones have more power than most people need |
| 00:57.33 | Neffi | anyway -(random(42,136)) works |
| 00:57.34 | Mr_Rabies | still though |
| 00:57.37 | Mr_Rabies | it's not about power |
| 00:57.50 | Amarande | and by heat management, I'm thinking of the possibility that someday, in the later generations (as we get up towards Broadwell or Skylake or Skymont) |
| 00:57.56 | Mr_Rabies | at that price, with old components, there are always huge downfalls in the hardware |
| 00:58.03 | Mr_Rabies | that tend to make it last a year or two at most |
| 00:58.10 | Mr_Rabies | mostly skimping on the power supply, i've seen |
| 00:58.33 | Amarande | the CPUs might have such a high heat density (due to component size on the die being so small) that you need a heatsink interface of such precision that only a professional factory setup will do |
| 00:58.57 | Amarande | in which case then they'd have to make all CPUs built into mobos so they could build in the heatsink |
| 00:59.04 | Amarande | but I'm not sure how likely that is to happen anytime soon |
| 00:59.51 | durcyn | don't worry, if they get too hot, intel can just redefine wattage again |
| 01:00.10 | Amarande | maybe at 10nm, but that more as a public safety issue, due to the intense toxicity of the materials needed to achieve 10nm meaning that if a CPU were to start to smoulder due to thermal failure, dangerous fumes could be released |
| 01:00.23 | Amarande | 14nm is apparently the lowest silicon can go |
| 01:00.28 | Rythal | when you think about it, the motherboard doesn't do much besides give you the ports anymore anyways since intel keeps moving more and more into the cpu itself, I can see them integrating lan soon into the cpu |
| 01:01.05 | Amarande | after that, you gotta use III-V semiconductors, which basically all contain fun stuff like arsenic and antimony in very large quantities and most of them have a "4" in the blue box of their NFPA 704 hazard diamonds :) |
| 01:01.31 | Amarande | I don't just mean "the chips are made with deadly toxic chemicals" at that point, I mean the chips have to be made OF deadly toxic chemicals at that point heh |
| 01:02.23 | Amarande | 10nm won't work with silicon because at that scale, quantum tunnelling effects become an issue, the electrons don't stay in their nicely organised lanes like they're supposed to :) |
| 01:03.32 | Amarande | Mind you, I'm not sure what they're going to do after 10nm even then, though. It's not long after that before you hit the atomic scale, and on top of that you've had to switch to *larger* atoms. :) |
| 01:04.08 | Amarande | Atoms themselves tend to be about 1-2nm or so big as I recall |
| 01:05.03 | Amarande | are we actually to see computers reach the limit of their potential within our own lifetimes? :) |
| 01:08.09 | Rythal | I hope so... so they can move onto better things like teleporters, flying cars and holosuites! |
| 01:08.58 | Amarande | teleportation of macro-scale matter is still an iffy thing |
| 01:10.06 | Amarande | keep in mind that, as I understand it, as a rule even the smallest amount of tachyons in a physics problem tends to indicate that either a) you made a mistake or b) what you want to achieve just won't work |
| 01:10.17 | Amarande | and instant teleportation is going to involve a *lot* of tachyons |
| 01:11.16 | Amarande | I'm not sure if holosuites are possible, at least in the Star Trek sense of being able to project objects that function as solid like that. :| |
| 01:11.46 | Amarande | Flying cars we actually probably have the tech for, it's just that if we actually created one, it would be a horrendously uphill battle to get the government to let you sell any to non-government customers |
| 01:12.01 | Semlar | we've already made flying cars |
| 01:12.14 | Semlar | and jet packs |
| 01:12.36 | Semlar | it's a matter of the public not ever using those as standard transportatino |
| 01:12.45 | Amarande | (and probably that's for the best, seeing that I used to read That Will Buff Out when it was still around, and people seemed to be pretty good at crashing their cars into upper floor windows as it *is*, imagine if their cars actually could go off the ground NORMALLY :P) |
| 01:13.00 | Semlar | can you imagine a flying car running out of gas |
| 01:13.27 | Amarande | heh, yeah |
| 01:13.28 | Jammer | surely you could make safety feature that doesn't happen in air :) |
| 01:13.32 | Amarande | chain collision crashes *IN 3D!* |
| 01:13.59 | Semlar | how could you possibly make that a feature, force them to land? |
| 01:14.05 | Jammer | pretty much |
| 01:14.16 | Semlar | where |
| 01:14.18 | Amarande | other things that we have the tech for that would be really useful but safety issues hold back heavily ... nuclear batteries |
| 01:14.57 | Amarande | seriously. you could make nuclear batteries that could last DECADES without a recharge and are utterly safe for normal use (they've even used plutonium cells in pacemakers, *inside* the body, the tech is definitely mature) |
| 01:15.08 | Semlar | every house or city block could be run on tiny nuclear generators right now but they aren't because of so many reasons |
| 01:15.13 | Amarande | but ... good luck getting the government to let you sell them to non-government customers |
| 01:15.46 | Jammer | Semlar: well if it's totally controlled by AI (ie. google car) then you could just have it always make sure it has enough fuel to drive to nearest parking spot |
| 01:16.10 | Jammer | not to say it would be easy, but I don't see that being a huge problem |
| 01:16.18 | Amarande | Semlar: yeah, the main one seems to be that the isotopes of greatest value to RTG generators (only a fairly small number are viable, as there are many bounding conditions) are also sadly the ones that you absolutely really most *don't* want to get dispersed into the environment |
| 01:16.25 | Rythal | google needs to speed up, 2 other companies show cased self-driving cars at CES this year. |
| 01:16.57 | Jammer | Rythal: they going to start selling to consumers? |
| 01:17.02 | Amarande | From what I recall reading, atomic energy watchdogs are already not quite happy with the former USSR over that, because they've lost track of some old lighthouse RTGs that use said stuff :| |
| 01:17.24 | Semlar | if i wanted a self driving car i'd take the bus |
| 01:17.28 | Rythal | not yet, since nevada and california are the only 2 places that have legalized self-driving cars on the road. |
| 01:17.51 | Amarande | (It was a common thing in the USSR to use nuclear batteries to run lighthouses that were too remote to run utilities to conveniently. Given that we're talking about Russia here, quite a LOT of it is "too remote to run utilities to conveniently." heh) |
| 01:17.57 | Thunder_Child | bus != car |
| 01:19.33 | Adys | Semlar: fyi i updated python-mpq |
| 01:19.36 | Adys | to get rid of the declaration |
| 01:19.45 | Semlar | alright |
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| 01:19.48 | Adys | im waiting for zezula's email back to fix patch() / extract() |
| 01:19.52 | Adys | but they'll work right now np |
| 01:20.00 | Adys | the patched argument just wont do shit |
| 01:20.15 | Semlar | yeah they just open patched |
| 01:22.03 | Adys | i asked him to update the docs |
| 01:22.10 | Adys | anyway im off to bed, ping me if you hit something else |
| 01:22.17 | Semlar | okay |
| 01:23.30 | Amarande | Rythal: do you still need a licence to operate a car that you don't have to drive? :) |
| 01:24.07 | Benalish | http://forums.wowace.com/showthread.php?t=20399 who can help me? |
| 01:24.24 | Rythal | I would imagine so, since for now all the self-driving cars expect human interaction to take over if something goes wrong. |
| 01:32.05 | Shirik | going to Jacksonville tomorrow :D |
| 01:33.42 | Semlar | :\ |
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| 01:34.02 | Semlar | are you being punished for something |
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| 01:46.23 | Shirik | no |
| 01:46.26 | Shirik | I am going to a RL DMF |
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| 02:15.55 | Thunder_Child | do SIM cards hold data anymore with smartphones? |
| 02:24.07 | Dagmar | Yeah they're still used to store contacts, as far as I know |
| 02:26.06 | Amarande | I'm not entirely sure what Android uses the SIM for besides subscriber identification |
| 02:26.37 | Amarande | (and I'm not 100% sure if iPhones even have swappable SIMs or if they're all activated as a full phone unit, like non-GSM based phones are) |
| 02:26.55 | Dagmar | It has a context for local phone storage of contexts, so it probably still stores them in the SIM when requested |
| 02:27.06 | Dagmar | er storage of contacts |
| 02:27.52 | Dagmar | I had to poke at mine a bit before it started keeping both sets of contacts in sync |
| 02:32.00 | Arrowmaster | all my contacts are on google accounts except for one, ive never even checked to see if its on the sim |
| 02:33.02 | Arrowmaster | and no i dont have some super secret reason for keeping one contact off of google, its just a contact to dial *DATA# to get my data usage from AT&T |
| 02:34.14 | Arrowmaster | Amarande: iphones have sims, when one of the models switched from sim to microsim people were posting youtube videos on how to cut the old sim to make it fit |
| 02:35.25 | Dagmar | ...because we all need more media that can get lost in deep pile carpet. |
| 02:35.56 | durcyn | because pulling your sim out with any kind of regularity is sane |
| 02:36.16 | durcyn | you're just the champion of edge cases, aren't you |
| 02:36.21 | Dagmar | If it only has one chance in a year to escape, it'll take it. |
| 02:36.45 | Dagmar | MicroSD card slots have light-sensitive springs in them. |
| 02:37.07 | Dagmar | In a well-lit office, it'll just unlatch and stick halfway out. |
| 02:37.30 | Dagmar | In the middle of the night in your car, it'll fly out like it was fired from a gun and go straight into the CD player. |
| 02:37.37 | Arrowmaster | lol |
| 02:38.23 | Arrowmaster | this is why i like removable batteries, you put the sim behind the battery and never have this problem |
| 02:38.57 | Amarande | Heh, I still remember the (perhaps apocryphal) tale in an old 80s-vintage computer book I had once that talked about a hard drive platter deciding it wanted to be a Frisbee and somehow got ejected from the drive, destroying vital accounting data from the business it belonged to and resulting in said business's rapid failure |
| 02:39.28 | Arrowmaster | there much better old harddrive stories than that |
| 02:39.29 | Dagmar | Dude the ancient MFM drives could be dangerous if they had a mechanical failure |
| 02:40.03 | Arrowmaster | like the one where the old harddrive was the size of a washing machine, and they walked across the floor when accessed just right |
| 02:40.15 | Arrowmaster | and one walked across the floor and blocked the only door into the room |
| 02:40.31 | Dagmar | First attempt at Skynet to take over the lab |
| 02:40.44 | Amarande | And apparently back in the day it was said that server hard drives got hot enough during constant use (especially things like USENET servers) that the surface of the platters would soften somewhat |
| 02:40.59 | Amarande | and a power failure could literally result in the heads getting permanently stuck in the platters, game over |
| 02:41.22 | Dagmar | Yes it took awhile for manufs to adopt the bernoulli effect in their designs. |
| 02:41.33 | Amarande | I'm not entirely sure if that was true though, especially since I've read also that hard drive heads never actually touch the platter in the first place |
| 02:41.46 | Amarande | (they can't, when they're spinning that quickly, that's why contact is catastrophic) |
| 02:41.52 | Dagmar | They don't now due to the Bernoulli effect. |
| 02:42.15 | Arrowmaster | part of the reason the head never touches the platter is because of the air going between them |
| 02:42.22 | Amarande | Then there's the infamous "exploding CD" problem which is why even the most modern of optical drives can't go faster than a certain speed |
| 02:42.31 | Dagmar | Yep. The head has to be *designed* to take advantage of that, tho |
| 02:42.37 | Arrowmaster | if everything stops theres no air movement so i can see it happening |
| 02:42.57 | Dagmar | Storage density went up after they started utilizing it because they could keep the heads closer to the platters without risking them hitting and grinding down |
| 02:43.10 | Dagmar | Before that it was more like tape heads. |
| 02:43.15 | Amarande | where above a certain speed, the CD spins fast enough that the plastic softens, then it resolidifies afterwards, and after enough such cycles the disc becomes brittle and can easily shatter during use |
| 02:43.33 | Arrowmaster | ive never heard of that |
| 02:43.43 | Arrowmaster | but i know if they go fast enough the plastic isnt strong enough |
| 02:44.05 | Dagmar | Oh wow. LONG URL but... http://books.google.com/books?id=szsEAAAAMBAJ&pg=PT67&lpg=PT67&dq=bernoulli+effect+hard+drive&source=bl&ots=APvr8YBO2I&sig=uOBBGQSqW8nBRN_DKfwFRlltgP0&hl=en&sa=X&ei=0yruUNGCGZTO8wSGyIGwCw&ved=0CD0Q6AEwAg |
| 02:44.29 | Amarande | I still will only use the Micro SD cards in my phone or my SanDisk Sansa |
| 02:44.32 | pompy | Dagmar: tinyurl |
| 02:44.43 | Amarande | otherwise, regular SD cards are used |
| 02:44.44 | Arrowmaster | and ive seen idiots put a broken cd into a drive on a work bench and then during another class telnet in (yes that long ago) and mount the cd drive so it walked across the bench in the middle of an unsuspecting class |
| 02:45.02 | Dagmar | pompy: http://tinyurl.com/arzt5n3 |
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| 02:45.17 | Amarande | which are my preferred means of data backup since I have cats and large external SSD are horribly expensive |
| 02:45.51 | pompy | if it hasnt been said already, android uses a sim for the 4g (at least on my razr maxx) |
| 02:46.19 | Dagmar | That's not necessarily 4g. |
| 02:46.25 | Amarande | my old external HDD (which was already failing according to SMART though) finally got its last straw from the cat bumping into the wires and knocking it off the desk |
| 02:46.32 | Amarande | so now it's solid-state storage for me, preferably SD or CF cards |
| 02:46.46 | Dagmar | If your cellular provider uses sims to distribute the subscriber information, that's one thing |
| 02:46.52 | Amarande | pompy: yeah, the SIM is used for authentication so you can connect to the cell network |
| 02:47.05 | Amarande | I'm not sure what else Android uses it for though e.g. if it actually saves anything to it like old school feature phones did |
| 02:47.36 | Dagmar | Amarande: Yeah so before manufs started actually trying to use the Bernoulli effect so that the heads floated on a cushion of air, heads were basically manually set into position so they just barely touched the platter. |
| 02:47.47 | Amarande | And I've never used an iOS device. I have no good reason to. |
| 02:47.59 | Dagmar | ...but this did mean that the storage couldnt' be on anything bouncy or it would slowly demolish the thing |
| 02:48.13 | Amarande | Being that I have an Android phone and a Windows 8 PC, why would I want to get a third platform, for which I'd have to buy all kinds of separate apps for. :P |
| 02:48.34 | Dagmar | Bigger drives needed to spin faster and use larger platters, so when you get a ten inch metal plate spinning at 2-4k rpms, it could get iffy |
| 02:48.38 | Arrowmaster | id replace that win8 pc |
| 02:48.57 | Amarande | If I get an Android tablet I can use the same apps that are on my Google account already for my phone. If I get a Windows RT device, any apps I get on it pretty much I can get on the PC too. |
| 02:49.22 | Amarande | Arrow: heh, I've already threatened it with a permanent switch to Linux if it barfs on its registry again anytime soon :P |
| 02:49.31 | Amarande | of course, though, that's yet another reason not to get an Apple device |
| 02:49.40 | Amarande | seeing as iOS devices are pretty much useless with a Linux machine |
| 02:49.46 | Arrowmaster | did they put some kinda arm emulator in win8? |
| 02:50.17 | Dagmar | probably |
| 02:50.31 | Amarande | Arrow: I *think* the Metro stuff uses some sort of managed code thing |
| 02:50.33 | Amarande | not quite sure |
| 02:50.43 | Arrowmaster | if not, any thoughts of using an app you purchased on win8rt on your desktop are gone |
| 02:50.59 | Amarande | I do know Win8/RT tablets and PC's share the same app store, the only one that's separate is the Windows Phone 8 store |
| 02:51.20 | Dagmar | They could be taking a page from Java's book for all I know |
| 02:51.32 | Dagmar | ...but an ARM emulator isnt' a huge problem, either. |
| 02:51.40 | Amarande | but yeah, can't use iDevices properly with Linux |
| 02:51.44 | Arrowmaster | did you earn you achievements in microsoft solitaire yet? |
| 02:51.57 | Dagmar | Amarande: Blame Apple refusing to talk much about protocols |
| 02:52.18 | Amarande | You can actually run iTunes perfectly in Wine, AFAIK ... however, because Wine doesn't give applications direct access to the USB, it can't communicate with your portable devices |
| 02:52.45 | Amarande | Regular MP3 players work just fine with Wine based tools though, since USB devices that mount as drives are simply seen as part of the filesystem |
| 02:52.54 | Amarande | however, Apple refuses to use this system :P |
| 02:53.25 | Dagmar | THey want a closed ecosystem. |
| 02:53.26 | Amarande | Dagmar: oh, it gets worse, they actively seek to force vendor lock-in |
| 02:53.32 | Dagmar | ...and "secure" communications to the devices. |
| 02:53.49 | Dagmar | libmtp mostly works okay |
| 02:53.59 | Amarande | They've used one of the most Machiavellian applications of copyright law I've ever seen |
| 02:54.45 | Arrowmaster | libmtp works fine but there still isnt a great way to mount it like a filesystem |
| 02:54.45 | Amarande | iPods have always had a database file in addition to the actual music files. The database file must be updated whenever the music library on the device changes or the iPod won't know about the changes to the actual files. |
| 02:55.13 | Amarande | This itself doesn't seem like too bad of a thing, although it's the first step to vendor lock-in. There's stuff, after all, that music files don't contain that are useful on a device like an iPod (album art, for instance). |
| 02:55.32 | Amarande | However, the open sourcers figured out how the database worked, and things like gtkPod got to use iPods without issue. |
| 02:55.40 | Dagmar | Since when do music files not contain album art. |
| 02:55.58 | Amarande | Dagmar: basic .mp3 files have no way of containing it, AFAIK |
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| 02:56.11 | Arrowmaster | its an id3 tag |
| 02:56.18 | Dagmar | Yes. Everything reads them now. |
| 02:56.23 | Amarande | Apple didn't like this, so they added a hash sum system to the database. If the hash is not correctly updated upon each change, the iPod won't recognise the changes. |
| 02:56.31 | Arrowmaster | id3v2.x where x should fucking be 4 or your device sucks |
| 02:56.40 | Dagmar | yep |
| 02:56.43 | Amarande | This first hash system is called "hash58" - and no, I'm not sure how it got that number. The open sourcers quickly cracked that one. |
| 02:56.50 | Amarande | Apple didn't like this. Here's how they got Machiavellian. |
| 02:57.04 | Amarande | They added a new hash system into newer iPods. This one is called "hash72" by open sourcers. Again, I don't know why it's got that particular number. |
| 02:57.16 | Amarande | The open sourcers proceeded to crack away at this one as they had at hash58. |
| 02:57.25 | Amarande | They were then served, out of the blue, with a DMCA CIRCUMVENTION C&D. |
| 02:57.55 | Amarande | Turns out that what Apple did was make hash72 use some of the same mathematical algorithms as their FairPlay DRM system (the one they use on the stuff from iTunes that ISN'T music, now that there's no DRM on the music). |
| 02:57.56 | Neffi | fair use |
| 02:58.32 | Amarande | The purpose of this was exactly that - to make a C&D under the argument that attacking hash72 (which no law could attack per se, AFAIK, though IANAL) was to attack FairPlay as well |
| 02:59.04 | Arrowmaster | this is why you use a webhost outside the US |
| 02:59.06 | Amarande | and thus not make the claim against the actual purpose, but against the fact that the open sourcers' work was also steps towards cracking their DRM (which *is* prohibited) |
| 03:00.23 | Amarande | And as far as I know, while there's some limping support for hash72 (I'm guessing the FOSS code figures out something based upon the existing data and what's changed. Not sure just how ...), nobody's really had the courage to disregard Apple there. |
| 03:00.50 | Amarande | Probably because from what I read, creating and publishing circumvention stuff is the Big Felony part of the DMCA. |
| 03:01.15 | Amarande | Nobody seems to be willing to risk a ten-year Club Fed Vacation for defying Apple. |
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| 03:01.39 | Arrowmaster | just dont live in the US and dont use a webhost in the US and you will be fine |
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| 03:01.44 | Neffi | bluespacecow, go hack apple |
| 03:01.51 | bluspacecow | y |
| 03:01.56 | Neffi | bcuz |
| 03:02.14 | bluspacecow | y |
| 03:02.25 | iShirik | No plz |
| 03:02.34 | iShirik | I needs App Store |
| 03:02.40 | bluspacecow | <PROTECTED> |
| 03:02.49 | bluspacecow | who said anything about hacking Apple computer ? |
| 03:03.01 | Amarande | Of course, given the Samsung case, I'm not entirely sure they're entirely in the wrong to be that cautious. I'm still not entirely convinced the judge in the Samsung case wasn't secretly instructed by Washington to ensure a ruling in favour of Apple occurred. :P |
| 03:03.05 | bluspacecow | i have an apple here on my desk (the fruit) that I can apply a hatchet to |
| 03:03.33 | Amarande | Allowing Apple to lose a major case is probably seen as a clear and present danger to the future of the United States. :| |
| 03:03.58 | Neffi | so is allows IP legislation to continue as-is |
| 03:04.07 | Neffi | but judges don't seem to be that smart |
| 03:04.15 | Amarande | I suppose considering their company size and all, one would wonder just how badly the economy would have been damaged if they'd tanked due to a Samsung-favouring ruling. :S |
| 03:04.39 | Neffi | tanked? |
| 03:04.51 | Amarande | Neffi: tanked. fallen badly. gone into the toilet. etc. |
| 03:05.04 | Neffi | that wouldn't really happen |
| 03:05.16 | Neffi | $1 bill was unprecented and even that wouldnt hurt Apple |
| 03:05.27 | Amarande | Given that Galaxies seem to actually be the better phones, I can imagine Apple being seen as a distinctly poorer investment if they'd lost their case. |
| 03:05.31 | Neffi | they're too fucking large |
| 03:06.04 | Neffi | i dont think it'd have that bad of an impact really |
| 03:06.04 | Amarande | It's kind of a scary thing though. There's a list of the 175 or so largest world economies that this one site makes every year |
| 03:06.18 | *** join/#wowuidev AckisTablet (~Ackis@207.145.153.202) |
| 03:06.18 | Amarande | The majority of them ... aren't sovereign states of any sort |
| 03:06.32 | pompy | I blame Fisker https://dl.dropbox.com/u/35894760/WoWScrnShot_010913_220130.jpg |
| 03:07.02 | AckisTablet | Anyone here use flex auth from antiarc on their phone? |
| 03:07.07 | Neffi | i'd blame Motess |
| 03:07.54 | Amarande | Dang, pompy. |
| 03:08.22 | pompy | Neffi: truth. |
| 03:08.25 | Arrowmaster | AckisTablet: i think Fisker does, he was yelling at antiarc when 4.2 came out |
| 03:08.27 | Amarande | BTW, you know, I'm actually surprised that that's an epic item |
| 03:09.12 | Amarande | as a general rule, battle pets are acquired at the same level of rarity as the item that gave rise to them |
| 03:09.36 | Amarande | which would suggest that existing epic pets like the hyacinth macaw should be re-graded to rare, and no more purple pet items :S |
| 03:10.02 | Amarande | as Epic is not an available quality level for player-held Battle Pets |
| 03:12.29 | tzarc | ...yet |
| 03:13.32 | Amarande | tzarc: I think it would cause untold issues to add epic quality at this point as a player obtainable thing :S |
| 03:13.42 | Neffi | wtf man |
| 03:13.51 | Amarande | where would these epic quality pets come from? |
| 03:14.22 | tzarc | well considering the proliferation of epic quality items over the last few xpacs, it stands to reason that the same progression will happen over time? |
| 03:14.27 | Neffi | I tried this new energy drink that says "caution" on the front. Downed 2 of them in a row. I feel like I just blew am 8-ball. |
| 03:14.40 | Amarande | if the wild, players would start to get irritated at having to capture everything again (especially those pesky level 1 pets where you have to keep swapping in a crappy pet in order to be able to catch them without killing them) |
| 03:15.11 | Amarande | if via raid, people would complain that raiders have an unfair advantage in pet battles |
| 03:15.20 | Amarande | if via PvP, people would complain that arena greats have an unfair advantage in pet battles |
| 03:15.43 | Amarande | if via the Pet Store, it would start raising the spectre of WoW shifting from just pay-to-play to pay-to-win as well |
| 03:16.18 | Amarande | unless you start putting all kinds of complex Byzantine tier restrictions on what pets people can use, anyway, like Pokemon duelists have heh |
| 03:16.47 | AckisTablet | Wth does secret mean for flex auth? I thought we only had a serial number and restore code |
| 03:17.17 | Primer | it's a secret |
| 03:17.23 | AckisTablet | Ass |
| 03:17.39 | bluspacecow | wipe |
| 03:17.43 | bluspacecow | XD |
| 03:17.58 | Amarande | tzarc: actually, it still remains to be seen whether the epic item policy of wrath and cata will continue into MoP |
| 03:18.20 | tzarc | time will tell |
| 03:18.27 | Amarande | I'm actually not sure anyone's looked at the valor or justice vendors in 5.2, given that apparently 5.2 PTR's chief bug is that you can't interact with anything. :) |
| 03:19.47 | Amarande | I'm still waiting to see if it's going to be like Wrath and Cata, or if it's going to be like BC where the valor and justice items stay fixed mostly throughout the expansion and it becomes increasingly difficult for new players or alts to get up to speed as the patches wear on |
| 03:19.53 | Arrowmaster | AckisTablet: did you read http://www.coffeepowered.net/2010/06/10/flexauth-portable-authentication-for-battle-net/ |
| 03:20.07 | foreplay | whats the best way to determine what spec you're in, using the api? |
| 03:20.25 | AckisTablet | Yeah was just reading it |
| 03:22.11 | Arrowmaster | AckisTablet: comments make it seem like secret needs to be 40 characters |
| 03:22.27 | Arrowmaster | check the options for a restore option maybe |
| 03:23.40 | AckisTablet | Yeah a 49 char number isn't popping |
| 03:39.41 | foreplay | is there a way to determine if a rame is shown or not? |
| 03:40.16 | Semlar | frame:IsShown() |
| 03:40.39 | Arrowmaster | frame:IsVisable() |
| 03:40.40 | Semlar | or frame:IsVisible() kind of depends on what you need |
| 03:42.43 | foreplay | what can i read to find out more about the frame thats shown |
| 03:42.57 | foreplay | like texture, if any. |
| 03:43.07 | Semlar | well a texture is a region |
| 03:43.16 | Semlar | which is a little different from a frame |
| 03:43.49 | foreplay | yeah but dont you set a texture for the frame tho? |
| 03:44.12 | Semlar | a texture is independent of the frame |
| 03:44.43 | Semlar | what are you trying to do |
| 03:45.17 | Semlar | what texture are you after |
| 03:45.18 | foreplay | k the script checks player regen disabled for mage armor/frost armor/molten armor depending on which spec you're in |
| 03:46.06 | Semlar | so when you get into combat it checks if you have one of these buffs |
| 03:46.12 | foreplay | it puts a icon of the armor in the middle of the screen |
| 03:46.24 | foreplay | but i need to hide the frame when the armor is applied |
| 03:47.11 | foreplay | thats what im doing now, trying to determine the best way to hide the frame |
| 03:47.29 | Semlar | well, you could watch for the unit_aura event to check if you have the buff and show/hide the frame based on that |
| 03:47.54 | foreplay | i suppose i could set a var in the statement that checks if the armor is inactive and look for that in unit_spellcast_suceeded? |
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| 03:48.04 | *** mode/#wowuidev [+o iShirik] by ChanServ |
| 03:48.56 | foreplay | unit_aura doesn't show any detail tho, wouldn't that fire on trinket procs and all that too? |
| 03:49.13 | Semlar | it fires any time you gain or lose an aura |
| 03:49.18 | foreplay | right |
| 03:49.24 | Semlar | or really anyone in your raid and stuff too |
| 03:49.53 | Semlar | but you can just have it do nothing if the unit isn't the player |
| 03:50.34 | Semlar | if you watch the event it will tell you whether you've gained or lost a buff, then you check if you have the armor or not and hide or show the frame based on that |
| 03:51.14 | *** join/#wowuidev [1]Archarodim (HydraIRC@78.203.114.95) |
| 03:52.46 | Semlar | you can use http://wowprogramming.com/docs/api/UnitBuff to check for the buff |
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| 04:08.23 | Arrowmaster | http://www.amazon.com/DCI-Inflatable-Moose-Head-Hangers/dp/B000ODAIHI |
| 04:08.28 | Arrowmaster | why does this exist |
| 04:11.33 | foreplay | i used UnitAura to check for the buff when player_regen_disabled was fired |
| 04:12.32 | foreplay | so i registered the unit_spellcast_succeeded event, checkd if the frame was shown then checked arg5 for the 2 armor spell ids, and if arg1 was player |
| 04:12.39 | foreplay | then hid frame there |
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| 04:21.22 | kd3 | gah. I get absorbed into a new game right as a (huge) ptr build hits the mirrors |
| 04:21.49 | bluspacecow | 850 MB and its live right now |
| 04:21.55 | kd3 | ! |
| 04:22.00 | kd3 | that's quick |
| 04:25.13 | kd3 | whuh at blazing speed/blink |
| 04:29.04 | foreplay | im confused now |
| 04:29.27 | foreplay | armorFrame:SetWidth(50) armorFrame:SetHeight(50) |
| 04:29.37 | foreplay | shouldn't that make the icon pretty small? |
| 04:29.50 | foreplay | it's covering my entire screen lol |
| 04:30.54 | Neffi | is armorFrame the icon or its parent? |
| 04:31.09 | Neffi | <PROTECTED> |
| 04:31.45 | foreplay | not sure lol |
| 04:31.46 | foreplay | http://pastebin.com/R8y9dwJh |
| 04:31.52 | foreplay | thats where i create the frame |
| 04:32.23 | Neffi | t:SetAllPoints(true) |
| 04:32.29 | Neffi | will make t occupy the entire armorFrame |
| 04:32.41 | Neffi | also i sincerely hope that's not all global |
| 04:33.01 | foreplay | it is, atm |
| 04:34.07 | foreplay | so what oyu posted will make the icon not take up my entire screen? |
| 04:34.45 | foreplay | http://i48.tinypic.com/2ur8j6c.jpg |
| 04:34.46 | foreplay | lol |
| 04:35.13 | foreplay | idk whats wrong there, cos in fire spec, i have the exact thing that pops up an icon when i get a heating up proc |
| 04:35.32 | foreplay | but the inferno blast icon it uses, is really small |
| 04:35.33 | Neffi | post more of your code |
| 04:35.35 | Neffi | all of it |
| 04:36.16 | foreplay | http://pastebin.com/raw.php?i=dCcms5GW |
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| 04:38.02 | Neffi | armorFrame isn't being used by anything |
| 04:38.08 | Neffi | you're declaring it out of scope |
| 04:38.27 | Neffi | before the first if, do: "local armorFrame" |
| 04:38.32 | Neffi | drop the local on the creation line |
| 04:38.43 | Neffi | and use armorFrame.t= for the texture |
| 04:39.25 | Neffi | :SetAllPoints when you first make the texture |
| 04:39.28 | Neffi | once |
| 04:39.46 | Neffi | and there are other problems, but I'm not sitting here and refactoring it |
| 04:41.06 | foreplay | i think i found why it was so huge |
| 04:41.20 | foreplay | i had t:SetAllPoints(armorFrameFrame) |
| 04:41.24 | foreplay | instead of t:SetAllPoints(armorFrame) |
| 04:42.20 | *** join/#wowuidev Kaylin (~Kaylin@c-67-201-226-127.reshall.wwu.edu) |
| 04:42.44 | foreplay | yeah, works right now |
| 04:43.39 | *** join/#wowuidev Semlar (~chatzilla@72.188.127.100) |
| 04:46.01 | karl_w_w | http://ptr.wowdb.com/spells/108843-blazing-speed#16408-16446 so how is this new version of blazing speed any better than the blink it's replacing? |
| 04:46.43 | karl_w_w | well I guess it's not on the gcd |
| 04:47.00 | karl_w_w | not having to use a gcd is a pretty weak reason to pick a talent |
| 04:48.30 | *** join/#wowuidev kurapica (~kurapica@58.247.109.243) |
| 04:49.47 | Jammer | but simcraft shows using blink is a dps loss so might as well take that! |
| 04:50.10 | kd3 | I'm not sure I can roll my eyes hard enough |
| 04:50.54 | *** join/#wowuidev d87 (~x@l49-96-195.cn.ru) |
| 04:51.27 | Jammer | but if they don't boost that talent any further... nobody probably will take it :p |
| 04:51.55 | karl_w_w | nobody takes it anyway :P |
| 04:52.35 | karl_w_w | they keep trying to make it slightly better |
| 04:53.03 | karl_w_w | it's as if they think if it becomes better than the other 2 on that tier it'll instantly make mages insanely op |
| 04:53.38 | karl_w_w | we'll be in alterac valley soloing 20 enemy players at a time |
| 04:55.38 | foreplay | i do that now |
| 04:55.40 | foreplay | :p |
| 04:55.43 | foreplay | jk lol |
| 05:03.05 | *** join/#wowuidev ShadniX (shadow1st@b045.apm.etc.tu-bs.de) |
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| 05:59.21 | kd3 | whee; nearly done downloading the new build |
| 06:01.19 | Stanzilla | you must have an awesome connection |
| 06:10.01 | *** part/#wowuidev kurapica (~kurapica@58.247.109.243) |
| 06:12.55 | durcyn | i'm just sitting here with my arms folded because the shitbird PTR installer won't drop that godamned directory from the end of the install path, and the launcher explodes when you rename it to something sane |
| 06:13.07 | bluspacecow | lol |
| 06:13.12 | bluspacecow | shitbird |
| 06:18.42 | durcyn | seriously, forcibly appending "WORLD OF WARCRAFT PUBLIC TEST" to the path is absurd. |
| 06:22.02 | jnwhiteh | bah |
| 06:22.17 | jnwhiteh | The Resistance is using cars in Stockholm, making it tough to compete with them |
| 06:24.55 | kd3 | emails out |
| 06:24.57 | Neffi | ugh |
| 06:25.07 | jnwhiteh | kd3: i dont get them anymore |
| 06:25.09 | jnwhiteh | do you hate me? |
| 06:25.13 | Neffi | the LOSS_OF_CONTROL events put in recently loop on themselves |
| 06:25.20 | kd3 | no? sec |
| 06:25.22 | Neffi | they can get fired while they're already being fired |
| 06:25.33 | Neffi | i have a feeling they let interns do some of the new stuff |
| 06:25.42 | jnwhiteh | kd3: last one i got was feb 28, 2012 |
| 06:25.54 | kd3 | ! |
| 06:26.11 | Stanzilla | I hope the new pvp ui is a copy of the dungeon finder ui |
| 06:26.17 | Stanzilla | about time those look the same |
| 06:26.46 | kd3 | huh. apparently you're not in my interface diffs group. wonder what happened there? |
| 06:26.56 | jnwhiteh | see, you hate me! =( |
| 06:27.47 | kd3 | how about now? |
| 06:27.52 | Neffi | haha. and the info wasn't available until the inner loop for that one |
| 06:28.07 | jnwhiteh | kd3: thank you! |
| 06:28.27 | kd3 | you're welcome |
| 06:28.56 | kd3 | ...I think that's when I did my big dup contact merge? that's the only reason I can think of |
| 06:28.59 | kd3 | ponders |
| 06:29.06 | jnwhiteh | hrm |
| 06:29.09 | jnwhiteh | do i need PTR |
| 06:29.13 | jnwhiteh | or can I use the beta build to connect |
| 06:29.21 | *** join/#wowuidev Kodiack (~Colton@96-42-240-206.dhcp.roch.mn.charter.com) |
| 06:30.02 | kd3 | there's no upgrade path from beta -> ptr. if you've got the live client up-to-date, install the ptr client fresh, let it chug along for a few minutes until the launcher starts the actual download, exit out and copy the mpqs over from live |
| 06:30.10 | jnwhiteh | ah k |
| 06:30.10 | kd3 | 22GB->2GB download |
| 06:30.23 | jnwhiteh | my poor SSD |
| 06:30.23 | jnwhiteh | <PROTECTED> |
| 06:31.21 | jnwhiteh | why does the PTR installer require admin privs on mac |
| 06:32.39 | Fisker | i'm not Ackis |
| 06:32.42 | *** join/#wowuidev karl_w_w (~karl@61.116.96.58.static.exetel.com.au) |
| 06:32.49 | Fisker | owned pompy |
| 06:32.58 | Fisker | i did a raid on the bunny once |
| 06:32.59 | Fisker | rolled 100 |
| 06:33.01 | Fisker | mad? |
| 06:33.47 | pompy | Fisker: crazy man. |
| 06:37.35 | pompy | http://www.facebook.com/photo.php?v=4060075429353 lol |
| 07:02.50 | *** join/#wowuidev bluspacecow (~bluspacec@60-234-165-167.bitstream.orcon.net.nz) |
| 07:02.50 | *** mode/#wowuidev [+v bluspacecow] by ChanServ |
| 07:15.22 | *** join/#wowuidev kd3 (~Kaydeethr@wowwiki/Kaydeethree) |
| 07:21.56 | jnwhiteh | kd3: scan: http://pastebin.ca/2300926 |
| 07:21.58 | jnwhiteh | might br wrong |
| 07:21.59 | jnwhiteh | but its a start |
| 07:22.08 | jnwhiteh | off to work |
| 08:00.06 | karl_w_w | ribena says no artificial sweeteners on it |
| 08:00.13 | karl_w_w | but it has sugar in it |
| 08:00.57 | karl_w_w | it also says no added preservatives, but it has citric acid in it |
| 08:03.23 | mitch0 | sugar is not artificial |
| 08:03.48 | *** join/#wowuidev Krapsy (~chatzilla@ool-4572cb11.dyn.optonline.net) |
| 08:03.57 | karl_w_w | that's arguable, but that's not the point |
| 08:04.11 | bluspacecow | does that |
| 08:04.13 | bluspacecow | make you |
| 08:04.16 | bluspacecow | mad? |
| 08:04.23 | karl_w_w | no |
| 08:04.35 | karl_w_w | it's a blackcurrant juice drink |
| 08:04.50 | karl_w_w | you add sugar to it, you're artificially sweetening it |
| 08:05.08 | *** join/#wowuidev Kalroth (~md@mail1.retailplanit.com) |
| 08:10.32 | zenzio | "Yep, I just realized 4K indicates 3840x2160, because apparently 2160p just doesn't sound cool.. Blech." |
| 08:13.50 | karl_w_w | http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MIgavNuBRRA yep, totes not artificial |
| 08:15.56 | Fisker | jnwhiteh |
| 08:30.08 | End_ | huh what is UnitStagger I wonder |
| 08:30.35 | End_ | oh for monks |
| 08:30.38 | End_ | nevermind then |
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| 09:00.51 | Mr_Rabies | `````````````````````````````````````````````````````````````````` |
| 09:00.55 | Mr_Rabies | ep |
| 09:01.02 | Mr_Rabies | sorry :| |
| 09:01.16 | Mr_Rabies | teamspeak binds done exploded |
| 09:17.31 | karl_w_w | that's what you get for using teamspeak! |
| 09:36.36 | Mr_Rabies | teamspeak owns |
| 09:36.53 | Mr_Rabies | ventrilo sounds awful, mumble's pretty buggy |
| 09:37.03 | mikma | mumble ftw... |
| 09:37.23 | mikma | does work fine with us |
| 09:37.58 | zenzio | Mr_Rabies: Ventrilo sounded fine for me, I'm guessing it depends a lot on codec settings |
| 09:38.01 | mikma | altho i use the latest server always. |
| 09:38.14 | Mr_Rabies | mumble's really buggy in my experience |
| 09:38.15 | zenzio | but there is something novel about sounding like you're raiding with robots |
| 09:38.40 | zenzio | Mr_Rabies: could you give some examples of what you mean by "buggy"? |
| 09:38.41 | Mr_Rabies | you can't set any of the TTS stuff or non-voice stuff to output to anything other than the primary audio device |
| 09:38.46 | mikma | kraftwerk |
| 09:39.05 | Mr_Rabies | the audio test option doesn't work....the test volume is nowhere near the real volume |
| 09:39.31 | mikma | oh hey... razer is looking for betatesters on their voip |
| 09:40.13 | Mr_Rabies | also setting up a mumble server is a nightmare |
| 09:40.28 | mikma | lol what |
| 09:40.40 | mikma | easy as pie |
| 09:40.55 | Mr_Rabies | never managed to get it working last time i tried |
| 09:41.07 | Mr_Rabies | editing a text file to configure a server is pretty crap |
| 09:41.55 | mikma | change password and codec. done. |
| 09:42.08 | Mr_Rabies | mumble sounds great, but it's lacking a lot of features and many of them don't work as designed |
| 09:42.22 | Mr_Rabies | the codecs it uses are fantastic sounding |
| 09:42.29 | Mr_Rabies | but that's really all it's got going for it for me |
| 09:42.37 | mikma | ./murmur.x86 -supl adminpassword |
| 09:43.04 | Mr_Rabies | that's already way the hell harder than setting up a teamspeak server |
| 09:43.15 | Mr_Rabies | a good chunk of the teamspeak stuff can be done via a web UI |
| 09:43.47 | mikma | murmur has webui |
| 09:44.03 | mikma | you jusr need to start it |
| 09:44.04 | Mr_Rabies | never got it working when i tried |
| 09:44.15 | Mr_Rabies | spent a few hours on it, gave up |
| 09:44.40 | mikma | so... you base your facts on these things? |
| 09:45.04 | Mr_Rabies | i'm comparing it to its competition |
| 09:45.11 | Mr_Rabies | it's got a long way to go to really compete |
| 09:45.17 | mikma | is cool tho. works fine with my usage |
| 09:45.50 | mikma | i can modify the config with text editor |
| 09:46.29 | mikma | i use murmur cause its free.. |
| 09:48.29 | Mr_Rabies | i have a mumble server through mumbleboxes (friend of mine runs mumbleboxes) but i'd never try to get my guildies to use it or try to set up my own server unless it got about 99x more user-friendly |
| 09:48.52 | Mr_Rabies | i like the sound quality but the broken features are annoying |
| 09:49.37 | mikma | whats broken? |
| 09:50.13 | Mr_Rabies | oh, and a free ios app is pretty fantastic |
| 09:50.20 | Mr_Rabies | i like the ios app more than the windows version |
| 09:50.35 | cbreak | as long as you can use it via voice synthesizer... |
| 09:50.48 | Mr_Rabies | <Mr_Rabies> you can't set any of the TTS stuff or non-voice stuff to output to anything other than the primary audio device |
| 09:50.54 | Mr_Rabies | <Mr_Rabies> the audio test option doesn't work....the test volume is nowhere near the real volume |
| 09:51.13 | mikma | you mean srnold soundboard? |
| 09:51.17 | Mr_Rabies | among others that i'm too lazy to remember |
| 09:51.23 | mikma | arnold* |
| 09:51.33 | cbreak | I use "say" |
| 09:51.37 | cbreak | the command line program |
| 09:51.53 | cbreak | combined with "Soundflower" I was able to "talk" through ventrilo and mumbles |
| 09:52.07 | Mr_Rabies | i'm talking the like |
| 09:52.09 | cbreak | and team speak too I think... not sure |
| 09:52.12 | Mr_Rabies | "user entered channel" etc |
| 09:52.20 | Mr_Rabies | that blasts through my speakers instead of my headset |
| 09:52.28 | cbreak | that sounds dumb. |
| 09:52.46 | mikma | ummm |
| 09:53.16 | Mr_Rabies | also the audio test is so loud i think it may have permanently damaged my hearing, no matter what i set the volume too |
| 09:53.18 | Mr_Rabies | to* |
| 09:53.28 | mikma | i have pointed all mumble sounds into headphones |
| 09:53.28 | Mr_Rabies | it's like a siren in my brain |
| 09:53.47 | Mr_Rabies | i don't see an option for that anywhere, mikma |
| 09:54.08 | mikma | put advanced mode on |
| 09:54.13 | Mr_Rabies | it just plays them through windows' default device |
| 09:54.13 | Mr_Rabies | it's on |
| 09:54.31 | cbreak | oh, I am not on windows |
| 09:54.50 | cbreak | non-default audio out seems to have worked for me in the past |
| 09:55.06 | Mr_Rabies | it works fine for voice |
| 09:55.11 | Mr_Rabies | just not any program messages |
| 09:55.21 | Mr_Rabies | like "disconnected from server" etc |
| 09:55.52 | Mr_Rabies | the settings are really barebones and a few of them either don't work like they should, or dont work at all |
| 09:55.56 | Mr_Rabies | for years, now |
| 09:56.12 | Mr_Rabies | the overlay's nice and works whereas teamspeak's doesn't |
| 09:56.28 | Mr_Rabies | but so much of it feels to amateurish |
| 09:56.36 | Mr_Rabies | so amateurish* |
| 10:00.17 | Mr_Rabies | i really want to like it though |
| 10:01.23 | Mr_Rabies | it just never quite works as expected :( |
| 10:06.07 | Mr_Rabies | aha, i figured that issue out, finally, after years |
| 10:06.31 | Mr_Rabies | it obeys the system's TTS settings, so you can set the TTS options to output to a different device |
| 10:06.42 | Mr_Rabies | while less than optimal if i used anything else with TTS, it's an okay workaround |
| 10:09.07 | *** join/#wowuidev EthanCentaurai (~EthanCent@host-92-24-136-39.ppp.as43234.net) |
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| 10:31.19 | tharper | anyone here use an SSD on OS X? |
| 10:39.26 | Fisker | s/an SSD on// |
| 10:39.32 | Fisker | btw well played expert sexchange |
| 10:39.53 | Fisker | you added a - to not be confused with sexchanges AND avoid my blocklist |
| 10:44.23 | Kalroth | you dont shop penisland much? |
| 10:47.01 | tharper | is baffled by this exchange |
| 10:51.54 | Kalroth | http://www.penisland.net/ |
| 10:52.46 | Humbedooh | they have good pens :) |
| 10:52.56 | tharper | mayhaps |
| 10:52.57 | Kalroth | "We Specialize In Wood" |
| 10:53.09 | tharper | their website is rather early 2000's |
| 10:53.12 | tharper | late 90's even |
| 10:53.14 | Humbedooh | flumps an R upon tharper |
| 10:53.24 | tharper | nei, tak |
| 10:53.30 | Humbedooh | ;( |
| 10:53.41 | tharper | Which, as far as I am concerned, means "No, roof" |
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| 11:01.17 | tharper | Humbedooh: too many people in #haskell confused me with Robert Harper |
| 11:01.28 | Humbedooh | ah |
| 11:02.02 | tharper | who is a Haskell-hater and writes inflammatory blog posts |
| 11:02.27 | tharper | also my tilltalsnamn is my second name and I try to include it in life as little as possible =p |
| 11:02.47 | Humbedooh | I have one of those as well - a real mr. negative |
| 11:03.23 | Humbedooh | what's your smeknamn? ;) |
| 11:03.54 | Humbedooh | you can't be a real swede without one! |
| 11:05.19 | Humbedooh | invents one for tharper... |
| 11:05.32 | tharper | hahaha |
| 11:05.40 | tharper | I don't have one in Swedish |
| 11:05.46 | tharper | Tompa is common |
| 11:06.46 | Humbedooh | but that sounds a lot like dumhuvud in danish :\ |
| 11:07.22 | tharper | hahaha |
| 11:07.26 | tharper | Tomme? |
| 11:07.35 | Humbedooh | means 'empty' :\ |
| 11:07.44 | tharper | hahah |
| 11:07.56 | tharper | not my fault you assimilate ALL THE CONSONANTS |
| 11:08.01 | tharper | Tomte på svenska |
| 11:08.33 | Humbedooh | all your consonants are belong to us |
| 11:08.36 | tharper | lol |
| 11:08.58 | tharper | why do you guys spell so many ll as ld, btw? |
| 11:09.03 | tharper | they were ll in Old Danish anyway =p |
| 11:10.01 | Humbedooh | dunno, doesn't make a whole lot of sense :) |
| 11:10.34 | Humbedooh | we also have debates about whether it's kikke or kigge, and højtaler ot højttaler :| |
| 11:10.43 | tharper | heheh |
| 11:11.07 | tharper | like kalder was never, as far as I know, pronounced with a d |
| 11:11.25 | Humbedooh | no, it could just as easy have been kaller |
| 11:11.36 | Humbedooh | though that would be the plural of Kalle ;D |
| 11:11.50 | tharper | lol |
| 11:12.07 | Humbedooh | you eating a lot of Kalles yet? ;) |
| 11:12.14 | tharper | oh dear |
| 11:12.36 | Humbedooh | bbq flavor ftw! |
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| 11:35.59 | foxlit | So, this PTR build is incapable of running addons altogether? |
| 11:39.15 | bluspacecow | i dunno lol |
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| 12:56.37 | Maldivia | hmm... why am I never here when the Danish language is under "attack" :) |
| 12:56.55 | haste | the danish language is always under attack |
| 12:57.38 | Maldivia | well, true |
| 12:58.03 | Kalroth | pøls |
| 12:58.11 | Humbedooh | e |
| 12:58.16 | Kalroth | nej |
| 12:58.19 | Fisker | hey haste |
| 12:58.21 | Fisker | pøls' |
| 12:58.27 | Kalroth | see, i am correct |
| 12:58.33 | Maldivia | og brød |
| 12:58.55 | Fisker | e' rø' pøls' me' brø' |
| 12:59.02 | Kalroth | moooar, jeg ska' pøls' |
| 12:59.14 | Fisker | moooar jeg ska' lave rasmus |
| 12:59.20 | Kalroth | årh |
| 12:59.28 | haste | we say pølse! |
| 12:59.38 | haste | who the fuck says pøls :P ? |
| 13:00.00 | Fisker | thats what your mom did when i boned her |
| 13:00.06 | Kalroth | real danes |
| 13:00.50 | Maldivia | I pronounce it like pøls ;) |
| 13:01.11 | karl_w_w | oh no, the channel is under attack from the Danish language |
| 13:03.31 | bluspacecow | really ? |
| 13:03.40 | bluspacecow | i thought it was too apes with speech impediments |
| 13:03.45 | bluspacecow | *two |
| 13:04.31 | *** join/#wowuidev p3lim (~p3lim@139.199.202.84.customer.cdi.no) |
| 13:05.33 | karl_w_w | oh zing |
| 13:05.55 | Kalroth | self burn best burn |
| 13:06.03 | Kalroth | also i count at least 4 of us |
| 13:07.49 | Sintacks | throws bluspacecow at karl_w_w |
| 13:08.11 | Sintacks | heh... 3 minutes, to render a 2 min, 28 second video |
| 13:08.14 | Sintacks | my computer sucks |
| 13:08.24 | Maldivia | ok, granted, I don't speak Danish, I speak Fynsk |
| 13:10.13 | Kalroth | fla' uj dær kommr a jætjagr |
| 13:12.23 | Maldivia | nu d' ti t kaf å ka'u |
| 13:12.57 | Humbedooh | mmm |
| 13:13.19 | Humbedooh | æ kaf sounds like a good idea |
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| 13:16.24 | Sintacks | Tu oui cbayg Al Bhed? |
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| 13:31.57 | alestane | Morning, Peppy. Have some cocoa. |
| 13:32.14 | Lopeppeppy | Hmmmm. But the cherry pepsi is scrumptious. |
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| 13:46.33 | zenzio | so I opened a "live chat" with Sony to talk about my phone problem. Entered a description of the problem like they said, including the steps I have already tried to do to remedy the problem |
| 13:46.37 | zenzio | a window pops up, saying the usual "please wait for a customer service representative". One answers, tells me he's reading the mail, and then tells me to... try what I wrote that I had already done |
| 13:46.59 | Humbedooh | awesome support |
| 13:47.48 | zenzio | indeed. He then told me to contact the store I bought it from about it (which is reasonable, but annoying) |
| 13:48.03 | Lopeppeppy | Strangle him with pixels! |
| 13:48.20 | zenzio | somehow I'm not sure I trust the service company to correctly test it, since it's an intermittent problem that shows up after anything from minutes to a day |
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| 14:18.31 | mikma | http://hackaday.com/2013/01/09/unsigned-code-running-on-windows-rt/ |
| 14:21.20 | *** join/#wowuidev Xandr (~Xandr@89.101.75.36) |
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| 14:25.46 | foxlit | http://www.curse.com/addons/wow/auctionator#c4429 << |
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| 14:27.33 | zenzio | foxlit: I kept wondering what about the post was so weird... until I noticed that the browser had somehow scrolled to 4426 instead of 4429 |
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| 14:28.05 | zenzio | (I'm guessing javascript or something messed up things after the page loaded) |
| 14:28.21 | Kalroth | "lol, This addon is about AUCTIONHOUSE, but still it wont lett me change talents??? what the fuck?" |
| 14:28.56 | foxlit | it's the top comment that's interesting. |
| 14:29.04 | Kalroth | sure, the exe thingy |
| 14:29.19 | Kalroth | i find the random taint more interesting |
| 14:29.45 | smcn | mapster does the same thing sometimes |
| 14:31.37 | zenzio | like the song, "randomly tainted love"? |
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| 14:38.24 | smcn | til some pandaria rares are stealthed |
| 14:39.09 | pompy | Arrowmaster: if you play that Happy Wars game at all... they handed out free tickets. |
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| 14:42.09 | zenzio | " Implementing breadth first search in Java (and all the required tree data structures) with minimal syntax errors in under 10 minutes is a lot like the BJ scene in Swordfish. It's no more than a puzzle with some added drama." |
| 14:50.14 | pompy | http://sphotos-b.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ash4/s480x480/253938_4286961295639_702130784_n.jpg :o |
| 14:51.08 | zenzio | that would mean the internet is full of scientists |
| 14:51.32 | pompy | lol |
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| 15:18.27 | Wobin | Stanzilla: ty for the DOTA2 invite, but it's not my sort of game =) |
| 15:19.25 | Stanzilla | Wobin: no problem, just throwing around my thousands of gift copies :D |
| 15:28.30 | Rythal | dunno how valve expects to make money selling early access when they keep giving every a billion invites |
| 15:28.41 | Rythal | everyone* |
| 15:31.01 | karl_w_w | well somebody must buy them |
| 15:31.13 | karl_w_w | considering it won a community choice vote during the last sale |
| 15:32.21 | TC-work | It's for the skins mostly. |
| 15:32.25 | pompy | http://sphotos-b.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-prn1/s480x480/13590_10101703399161272_933209083_n.jpg on my friends 3D printer. |
| 15:34.47 | karl_w_w | what was it? |
| 15:35.17 | TC-work | A pun |
| 15:35.45 | pompy | yeah the name of the print. |
| 15:40.55 | Rythal | hrmm... was gunna buy a nexus4, but think i'll wait for the galaxy4 and see if they use the new 8 core they showed at ces |
| 15:44.02 | pompy | i still love my Kindle Fire, even if it's the first gen one |
| 15:45.01 | Rythal | yeah the fire was great once I rooted it... being in canada the unrooted sucked since amazon blocked me from everything lol... |
| 15:48.46 | pompy | lol |
| 15:48.59 | pompy | country laws ftw and shit. |
| 15:49.39 | Rythal | wonder if autorip is available here... or US only |
| 15:49.54 | *** join/#wowuidev MidnightAge (~midnight@50-90-9-206.res.bhn.net) |
| 15:54.57 | EthanCentaurai | is Kindle Fire an Android? :B |
| 15:55.48 | Rythal | yep |
| 15:56.37 | Rythal | http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=re1EatGRV0w Do want... just not on x-box :/ |
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| 16:01.43 | Unkle | Station |
| 16:03.36 | Rythal | and for some strange reason, my first thought is... man WoW would be awesome like that |
| 16:03.45 | karl_w_w | <pompy> yeah the name of the print. <- clearly, but what was it? lol |
| 16:07.42 | *** join/#wowuidev brykrys (~chatzilla@WoWUIDev/Norganna/Dev/Brykrys) |
| 16:07.55 | pompy | you know the show fresh prince of bel aire? |
| 16:08.07 | pompy | with will smith from the 1990s |
| 16:08.46 | pompy | karl_w_w: ^ |
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| 16:10.58 | *** part/#wowuidev Unkle1 (~mconverse@50-0-113-124.dedicated.static.sonic.net) |
| 16:14.14 | karl_w_w | so he printed a tv show? pretty awesome |
| 16:17.19 | *** join/#wowuidev g0urra (~g0urra@unaffiliated/gourra) |
| 16:18.19 | Semlar | how do you take a bunch of points and efficiently create an outline around them |
| 16:19.04 | Semlar | i'm pretty sure someone already told me but i forgot what it was called |
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| 16:20.31 | foxlit | Convex hull |
| 16:20.45 | Semlar | thanks |
| 16:21.23 | foxlit | n log n, sort the points by the heading from the leftmost point |
| 16:22.35 | foxlit | then iterate over the points in that order, doing something locally clever. |
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| 16:27.08 | cbreak | take the point with the smallest angular derivation |
| 16:28.09 | foxlit | that's not n log n |
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| 16:43.31 | mikma | SO TEMPTATED! http://youtu.be/Qsx6ZMfcPUs |
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| 16:49.15 | neutronimity | is it possible to match multiple patterns with strfind? |
| 16:49.32 | neutronimity | I'd like to delete multiple items with a macro. |
| 16:50.58 | mikma | well, yeah anything is possible |
| 16:51.33 | neutronimity | Then, hmm, do you perhaps know how? I'd like to be divined with suck knowledge. |
| 16:51.35 | Semlar | well, you have to run multiple patterns |
| 16:51.45 | neutronimity | s/suck/such/ |
| 16:51.56 | Semlar | lua has no "or" for its pattern matching |
| 16:52.18 | neutronimity | Ah, thanks :/ |
| 16:54.01 | Semlar | it's actually pretty intensive if you run enough of them |
| 16:54.10 | mikma | neutronimity: http://pastebin.com/kNWw0Dis |
| 16:56.56 | Semlar | do you even need to use find? shouldn't they be exact matches |
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| 17:09.25 | Fisker | wants haste |
| 17:18.08 | alestane | Anyone remember the integral of d 1/x /dx off the top of their head? |
| 17:18.48 | Lopeppeppy | What? Are you nuts? |
| 17:18.56 | alestane | Ah, looks like it's ln(x). |
| 17:19.17 | alestane | Not usually your thing, Peppy, I know. |
| 17:20.39 | Lopeppeppy | You made me break out in hives just thinking that someone would *know* that. |
| 17:21.52 | alestane | If it hadn't been almost 20 years since I had to do any calculus, there's a good chance I would have remembered it myself. |
| 17:22.14 | alestane | Although I asked it wrong, really, it's been taht wrong. |
| 17:22.43 | karl_w_w | fuck wow is so buggy these days |
| 17:23.09 | karl_w_w | im in this pet battle completely unable to give my pets any commands |
| 17:24.06 | karl_w_w | i press the button, it lights up, the timer saying waiting for opponent ticks down and runs out, my pet does nothing, his attacks |
| 17:24.09 | karl_w_w | over and over |
| 17:24.28 | *** join/#wowuidev Sixen (~Sixen@173-25-23-124.client.mchsi.com) |
| 17:24.55 | karl_w_w | woot its finally working after 2 of my pets are dead |
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| 17:37.30 | pompy | gg http://www.facebook.com/photo.php?fbid=10151207906108663&set=a.397912903662.171895.57851763662&type=1 |
| 17:37.42 | *** join/#wowuidev Darkchaos (~darkchaos@88.130.194.112) |
| 17:40.28 | Lopeppeppy | And facebook didn't ban her for having two accounts? |
| 17:40.45 | Lopeppeppy | What a scam, AVG is right! :) |
| 17:42.12 | pompy | yup |
| 17:43.52 | jnwhiteh | Ackis: are you streaming on twitch? |
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| 17:59.00 | Fisker | if you had one lol jnwhiteh |
| 17:59.13 | Humbedooh | just the one? |
| 17:59.13 | jnwhiteh | k |
| 17:59.22 | Fisker | just the one Humbedooh |
| 17:59.26 | Humbedooh | damn |
| 18:00.13 | Fisker | yep |
| 18:00.14 | Fisker | it's intense |
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| 18:03.03 | Adys | What's the best way to implement loose searches over multiple columns on a sqlite-based app? specifically, I have eg author="Michael Jackson", name="Thriller" and want "michael jackson - thriller" to find that |
| 18:03.06 | *** join/#wowuidev Droolio (~drool@host86-178-33-182.range86-178.btcentralplus.com) |
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| 18:05.32 | Adys | Dagmar: maybe you know? |
| 18:05.50 | TC-work | how close is that to mysql? |
| 18:06.09 | Humbedooh | quite close |
| 18:08.32 | iShirik | Uh |
| 18:08.46 | iShirik | You want the database to match the string? |
| 18:08.49 | TC-work | and you want it done in pure sql syntax? |
| 18:09.01 | iShirik | Possible but not a good idea |
| 18:09.07 | Adys | ah django-haystack |
| 18:09.09 | Adys | sweet |
| 18:09.13 | *** join/#wowuidev foxlit (N@2a01:7e00::f03c:91ff:feae:d316) |
| 18:09.16 | Humbedooh | I'd split the query into an array of words first |
| 18:09.30 | iShirik | The fact that its possible still does not make it a good idea |
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| 18:09.40 | *** join/#wowuidev brykrys (~chatzilla@WoWUIDev/Norganna/Dev/Brykrys) |
| 18:09.51 | Humbedooh | then perhaps try "WHERE `author` IN (foo, bar, baz) OR `name` IN (foo, bar, baz)" or some such |
| 18:10.05 | Humbedooh | though it's been ages since I've done sqlite :( |
| 18:10.17 | foxlit | heh, most of the UK freenode servers are refusing connections :/ |
| 18:10.29 | Humbedooh | zelazny for the win! |
| 18:12.02 | Gnarfoz | blehhhh |
| 18:12.13 | Gnarfoz | can you change the colors of window title bars and the taskbar in the windows basic color scheme? |
| 18:12.42 | Humbedooh | I believe you can ;o |
| 18:13.16 | Gnarfoz | I can't seem to find it |
| 18:13.35 | Humbedooh | Windows 7? 8? |
| 18:13.38 | Gnarfoz | 7 |
| 18:13.47 | Gnarfoz | (and no, the *very* old style "active title bar, inactive title bar, icons thingy does not affect it.) |
| 18:14.01 | *** join/#wowuidev cogwheel (~cogwheel@WoWUIDev/WoWProgramming/morlando/cogwheel) |
| 18:14.15 | Gnarfoz | well... I could switch to the "windows classic" scheme, because the preview in the window I just referred to looks like windows 2000 |
| 18:15.16 | iShirik | You can. But I don't have access to a computer to guide you there. |
| 18:15.35 | iShirik | But you don't have an enormous amount of control. |
| 18:16.35 | TC-work | rclick -> 'personalize' -> 'Window Color' listed at the bottom of the page. |
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| 18:54.17 | Gnarfoz | TC-work: no, that does not affect it. |
| 18:54.48 | TC-work | Are you using aero? |
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| 18:59.20 | Gnarfoz | no, that's why I said basic |
| 18:59.44 | Gnarfoz | I found out Aero is severly affecting my FPS |
| 18:59.50 | Gnarfoz | (since I got a second monitor) |
| 19:08.40 | Gnarfoz | it's probably also the source of my weird video stuttering that I observed after getting these screens |
| 19:12.39 | pompy | le sigh http://www.turnto23.com/news/local-news/report-at-least-one-person-shot-at-taft-high-school |
| 19:13.25 | Semlar | haha bakersfield |
| 19:13.55 | Semlar | it's not a good sign that the nearest hospital is in bakersfield |
| 19:14.35 | Unkle | Large parts of Northern CA are sparsely settled. |
| 19:16.31 | Semlar | bakersfield is not in northern california |
| 19:16.44 | Unkle | There is a bakersfield. |
| 19:17.14 | Semlar | it's a horrible, horrible place |
| 19:17.33 | Unkle | Sorry, I should say that my LA-centric upbringing makes me think of anything north of LA as "northern" Ca. |
| 19:18.00 | Semlar | yeah i guess anything would be north if you were in LA |
| 19:18.36 | Semlar | i used to live in Davis |
| 19:18.49 | Semlar | hippytown |
| 19:19.24 | Semlar | up near sacramento |
| 19:19.55 | Unkle | I live in Sonoma County now. So pretty far North. |
| 19:20.13 | Semlar | wine country? |
| 19:20.28 | Unkle | yeah |
| 19:22.11 | Semlar | i think my dad used to commute out there |
| 19:22.36 | Semlar | it might have been petaluma |
| 19:23.15 | Unkle | I'm a bit north of Petaluma, but not much. |
| 19:25.10 | Semlar | pretty nice out there huh |
| 19:26.01 | TC-work | Really Unkle, anything north of la.... |
| 19:29.27 | Unkle | TC-work: I grew up in LA. Anything north of Burbank was basically a foreign country. |
| 19:29.43 | TC-work | >.< |
| 19:30.07 | Unkle | Until I moved to Santa Barbara for a summer. |
| 19:31.38 | Unkle | Getting my driver's license changed that too. |
| 19:42.29 | *** join/#wowuidev foreplay (~osnap@h184-61-247-39.cntral.dsl.dynamic.tds.net) |
| 19:45.39 | kd3 | eh. npcs get all the cool buffs |
| 19:45.43 | kd3 | Power Word: Dinosaur |
| 19:46.30 | smcn | i wonder if hozen rare mobs always evading is fixed in 5.2 |
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| 20:05.46 | pompy | http://blog.malwarebytes.org/intelligence/2013/01/cta-unpatched-java-exploit-in-the-wild/# |
| 20:17.50 | Unkle | Well, well, well... 5GHz band opened up for wifi in the US - http://arstechnica.com/tech-policy/2013/01/fccs-genachowski-govt-will-open-up-radio-spectrum-to-improve-wi-fi/ |
| 20:18.02 | Lopeppeppy | You gief to me now. |
| 20:18.15 | Unkle | I predict at least a 3-year horizon. |
| 20:19.50 | durcyn | isn't 5ghz already assigned to 802.11a/n? |
| 20:20.40 | Unkle | This is "195MHz of new spectrum" |
| 20:21.15 | Unkle | most of 802.11x stuff in in the 2.4GHz band. |
| 20:22.06 | Unkle | Expect to see a lot of "range extenders" and new phones, routers, etc. |
| 20:22.24 | durcyn | b/g/n uses unlicensed, yes, but the trend is towards dual-band |
| 20:22.31 | Semlar | yeah 5ghz is going to have pretty poor range |
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| 20:23.25 | Unkle | So - unless the antenna in your current phone or device is already good for that band, and can up fixed with a firmware patch, you'll get nothing from this until you buy a new device anyway. |
| 20:24.29 | Unkle | But it will make a difference in crowded spots - like dense apartment blocks or shopping districts. |
| 20:25.12 | durcyn | what's the actual range? i'd be surprised if it's not already supported by 802.11a, but not licensed for use in the states |
| 20:25.39 | Unkle | I don't actually know - not a radio scientist. |
| 20:27.30 | Unkle | http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/IEEE_802.11 - says 5GHz in use mostly in Europe. |
| 20:27.45 | Unkle | Actually it says "most of the world" my bad. |
| 20:27.53 | karl_w_w | <kd3> eh. npcs get all the cool buffs <- like http://www.wowhead.com/spell=130788 |
| 20:27.58 | durcyn | http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_WLAN_channels#5.C2.A0GHz_.28802.11a.2Fh.2Fj.2Fn.29.5B14.5D |
| 20:28.08 | durcyn | that's a hell of an anchor tag. |
| 20:28.58 | bleeter | yeah USA (North America) is the odd one out with the whole 5GHZ shizz |
| 20:28.59 | foxlit | hm, you should submit a patch to clean that up |
| 20:30.47 | Unkle | And this list says 250m outdoor, 70m indoors. |
| 20:31.04 | karl_w_w | 5 ghz is piss poor |
| 20:31.06 | Dagmar | "70m indoors" lol |
| 20:31.10 | Lopeppeppy | Unless some oliaphaunts are in the way. Then it's 70cm. |
| 20:31.25 | karl_w_w | the vast majority of people have no use at all for it |
| 20:31.25 | Dagmar | oliaphaunts, or walls. |
| 20:31.32 | Lopeppeppy | Are they not the same? |
| 20:31.38 | Dagmar | If your house is made of rice paper, 70m is probably doable. |
| 20:31.39 | Unkle | Close any internal door way or put a chair in the path... |
| 20:32.50 | Unkle | I used to do in-home consults as a side business. You'd be shocked how many people stuffed their wifi router behind something "cause it's ugly!" and then bitch that they couldn't connect over their network. One client had it under a metal desk. |
| 20:33.02 | Dagmar | heh |
| 20:33.52 | smcn | simple ignorance imo |
| 20:34.08 | Dagmar | Oh if there's one thing I'm sure of is that ignorance is seldom simple. |
| 20:34.09 | karl_w_w | you gave it up as a side business when it all got too much and you cracked said client's head against said desk |
| 20:34.28 | Dagmar | If it were it wouldn't have taken nearly so long to get those fucking cell phone antenna booster stickers off the market. |
| 20:34.32 | smcn | i'm guessing 99% of plebes don't install their own router, or routers don't come with instructions on how/where to place them for best reception (or not) |
| 20:35.22 | Dagmar | Last time I saw one in Walgreen's I asked the manager if they had a home trepanation kit I could buy with it |
| 20:35.22 | Unkle | Or at the university library they had this room with a giant table for maps. the room was two stories high and a very, very, very large, empty space. Far enough away we couldn't get access points near enough to provide sufficient coverage. Students used to complain all the time. I basically said "you can't use wifi on the map table, sorry. |
| 20:35.52 | Dagmar | Unkle: You should do what we do and glue one to the ceiling. |
| 20:36.25 | Unkle | Yeah, eventually we put three extra in the ceiling of the floor below. |
| 20:36.29 | Elkano | can't you just use a directed antenna? |
| 20:37.11 | Unkle | good enough for general web surfing, but not so good for streaming video. Called it "good enough." |
| 20:38.24 | Unkle | Don't have that problem here. no one expects wifi outside the office. :) |
| 20:38.33 | karl_w_w | but if you surf the web your board will get stuck to it! |
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| 20:43.03 | Dagmar | I wish I had a damn clue who the chick in the new Bowie video is |
| 20:44.38 | Arrowmaster | speaking of wireless, if i upgrade my wrt54g to a new router should i expect better 2.4ghz quality? i have a device that will not connect to the current wifi reliably in a certain room but other devices can |
| 20:45.21 | *** join/#wowuidev Kaylin (~Kaylin@c-67-201-226-127.reshall.wwu.edu) |
| 20:46.44 | Arrowmaster | the device is a small android powered tv dongle so its wifi antenna is really small thus the shitty connection |
| 20:47.36 | bleeter | hmm, well that's annoying. on PvE realm, a flagged hunter's pet has red nameplate making it look like an agressive mob :-/ |
| 20:47.50 | bleeter | (flagged hunter's nameplate is correctly yellow) |
| 20:48.38 | bleeter | Arrowmaster: have you put openwrt on your wrt54g and messed about with power output that way yet? |
| 20:48.58 | Arrowmaster | its got tomato on it |
| 20:49.17 | Arrowmaster | ive doubled the power output and it went from never connecting to connecting sometimes |
| 20:49.39 | Arrowmaster | i dont want to put the output too high because the rest of the devices (like this laptop) are in the same room as the router |
| 20:49.57 | bleeter | fair enough |
| 20:50.32 | Arrowmaster | if i had the tools to figure out when is too high i would probably mess with it more |
| 20:51.01 | bleeter | fwiw, I <3 my WDR4300 ;) |
| 20:51.24 | bleeter | not the greatest, but bang for buck is OK |
| 20:51.27 | karl_w_w | have you checked that you're on the best channel? |
| 20:51.51 | Arrowmaster | yes |
| 20:52.13 | Arrowmaster | none of the channels are completely clear though unless i want to use channel 14 |
| 20:53.09 | bleeter | ah, well. there's the solution. track down the origins of the competing transmitters and burn their houses down |
| 20:53.59 | Arrowmaster | in most rooms i only pickup my own wifi |
| 20:54.07 | Unkle | Or, go low-tech. Put tin-foil on your ceiling. |
| 20:55.01 | Arrowmaster | poweroutages are the worst, most of the neighbors routers seem to be the kind that try to pick a clean channel when they power on |
| 20:55.21 | bleeter | the tinfoil goes on your head |
| 20:56.48 | Arrowmaster | i was thinking of getting an rt-n66u for its other uses when proper firmware is installed even though i dont think any of my devices support 5ghz |
| 20:57.06 | Unkle | No, seriously. you can Faraday cage up your house and nuke some of the "noise" from your neighbors. It's just ugly and only useful in specific circumstances. |
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| 21:11.04 | *** join/#wowuidev EthanCentaurai_ (~EthanCent@host-92-24-176-233.ppp.as43234.net) |
| 21:15.12 | pompy | http://www.facebook.com/photo.php?fbid=10152408541230261&set=a.10151362562415261.817101.137830960260&type=1 |
| 21:20.30 | kd3 | er... |
| 21:20.36 | kd3 | how can a devilsaur be fascist? |
| 21:20.38 | Unkle | http://www.tested.com/tech/449316-inside-adam-savages-cave-geeking-out-about-bits-and-bytes/ |
| 21:22.19 | TC-work | http://sphotos-b.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ash3/71677_485266024850005_1664584897_n.jpg what the what? |
| 21:22.57 | pompy | they look like stuffed animals |
| 21:23.54 | pompy | http://www.facebook.com/photo.php?v=4060075429353 this was well done. |
| 21:37.45 | *** join/#wowuidev ShadniX (shadow1st@b045.apm.etc.tu-bs.de) |
| 21:42.39 | bleeter | I've decided that WoW needs a playable fish-type race |
| 21:42.45 | bleeter | because then we can have Fish Tanks |
| 21:42.59 | bleeter | hides |
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| 21:48.26 | *** mode/#wowuidev [+o Seerah] by ChanServ |
| 21:49.58 | VIad | does women think these shoes feel good? http://www.virtualfunzone.com/slike/bizarre/Fashion_in_japan/Fashion_in_japan13.jpg |
| 21:50.37 | Arrowmaster | thats not fashion |
| 21:50.38 | pompy | no disclaimer? |
| 21:51.12 | Arrowmaster | i dont think you realize what all is required to wear those shoes, and those are the only shoes that lady can wear now |
| 21:51.27 | VIad | disclaimer? |
| 21:52.38 | alestane | That's footbinding. |
| 21:52.41 | Seerah | tiny feet were the ideal in China. You weren't beautiful and you couldn't find a husband if you did not bind your feet |
| 21:53.32 | VIad | even if I was born in those times I'd still feel it's wrong to do this :( |
| 21:53.44 | Seerah | the same with neck rings in other cultures: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Neck_ring |
| 21:53.46 | Arrowmaster | and foot binding means they break most of the bones in a little girls foot and wrap them up until they heal |
| 21:54.00 | Seerah | they keep the foot bound as she grows |
| 21:54.21 | Seerah | they didn't break the bones (at least not usually) |
| 21:54.28 | Seerah | starts at a very young age |
| 21:54.45 | Arrowmaster | for foot binding they break the bones |
| 21:54.47 | bleeter | almost as stupid -> high heeled shoes. almost |
| 21:54.55 | Seerah | (I did a research paper in my college english class on the concept of beauty) |
| 21:55.02 | Arrowmaster | and wrap the toes underneath the foot |
| 21:55.08 | VIad | I'd file it under the category of "doing things to your children that will affect their lives without their consent" |
| 21:55.24 | VIad | (physically) |
| 21:55.45 | Seerah | as the children grew up, they understood and accepted that cultrue |
| 21:55.52 | Seerah | even as children, it was "normal" |
| 21:56.33 | VIad | it did start at some point |
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| 21:56.57 | VIad | if in the future it's normal to cut of your index finger, it did start at some point and I wonder how it was accepted as a norm :P |
| 21:57.08 | Seerah | Arrowmaster: ah, http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Foot_binding says that some sub-cultures broke the bones and some didn't |
| 21:58.55 | *** join/#wowuidev Kaylin (~Kaylin@wlan097-222.wlan.wwu.edu) |
| 22:00.02 | Arrowmaster | Seerah: yeah read under process and it details what was broken |
| 22:00.29 | Seerah | yeah, looking now :) guess I had forgotten some things in the years that have passed ;) |
| 22:01.06 | VIad | you are not that old Seerah |
| 22:01.18 | Seerah | I'm probably older than you think I am :p |
| 22:01.37 | VIad | you are probably around 30-35 |
| 22:01.54 | VIad | that's young |
| 22:01.57 | Seerah | okay, I am in that range. but it was still 14ish years ago that I wrote that paper :) |
| 22:02.03 | VIad | ^^ |
| 22:02.13 | Semlar | oh oh do me, how old am i |
| 22:02.21 | VIad | you are around my age |
| 22:02.26 | VIad | perhaps some years above |
| 22:02.29 | VIad | 24-28 |
| 22:02.46 | VIad | in your twenties |
| 22:02.58 | Semlar | i'm 23, you can have that one |
| 22:03.41 | VIad | was gonna do from 23 at first but was a bit uncertain |
| 22:03.48 | VIad | you act like you are 18 sometimes |
| 22:04.08 | VIad | is it nerdom or nerddom? |
| 22:04.09 | Semlar | that's because i have the mentality of a 13 year old |
| 22:04.20 | VIad | I am totally fine with that, Semlar :D |
| 22:04.21 | Kaylin | me too omg boys. |
| 22:04.38 | Unkle | VIad: Don't be foolish. Never, ever, ever ask a woman her age. She's always young, beautiful and/or perfect. Never guess, estimate, or calculate her age and then say it either. Doing so always leads to sorrow |
| 22:05.13 | Semlar | you sound you speak from experience |
| 22:05.45 | VIad | I am never shy to ask |
| 22:05.46 | Unkle | I know many secret things, I am forged in adversity, tempered in expereince. |
| 22:05.56 | VIad | shows I am different from the rest since I do ask :P lol |
| 22:06.16 | VIad | never ask the first times ofc, but once I know the person, I am not shy |
| 22:07.06 | Seerah | I can guess Kaylin's, though :p |
| 22:07.13 | Unkle | When a woman wants you to know her age, she'll tell you. |
| 22:08.04 | Unkle | (assuming western cultures. I don't know about all cultures, but I'm safe enough on western) |
| 22:08.21 | VIad | if a person is so obsessed with their age and feel angry or hurt when you ask them, THEY should reconsider their view on the matter of their age :P |
| 22:08.46 | Semlar | i don't really care how old anyone is, it doesn't really factor into anything i do |
| 22:09.04 | Unkle | Spoken like someone for whom age has never been a point on which life-decisions are made on your behalf. |
| 22:09.29 | VIad | give me examples Unkle |
| 22:10.13 | VIad | Semlar: nah don't care either :p |
| 22:10.32 | VIad | though I prever company of mature nature, more fun ^^ |
| 22:10.48 | VIad | not much new stuff to learn from too young people, not usually :P |
| 22:11.08 | Unkle | Current western cultures put a lot of emphasis on a woman being married - and reaching the age at which you find it much harder to get married carries a stigma. It impacts career decisions. It impacts decisions about having children. |
| 22:11.30 | VIad | perhaps it's more of a US thing no? |
| 22:11.31 | Unkle | It's a trope that older men of means often discard an older wife |
| 22:12.00 | Unkle | These are cultural legacies (that suck) that make many women touchy about age. |
| 22:12.12 | Unkle | Give them 200 years and they'll have mostly died out. |
| 22:12.14 | VIad | I am not such a person, it's too superficial tbh |
| 22:12.43 | Semlar | in 200 years i'll mostly have died out too |
| 22:12.48 | VIad | it's lame if men are like this where you live Unkle |
| 22:12.55 | Kaylin | Seerah: Oh? |
| 22:12.57 | VIad | makes me a bit sad on your behalf :< |
| 22:13.10 | Semlar | that's okay, i won't mind |
| 22:13.57 | Seerah | Kaylin: 25-28 |
| 22:14.11 | VIad | btw why isn't Petrah yellow anymore? |
| 22:14.12 | Kaylin | yup :D |
| 22:14.25 | Semlar | kaylin is -3? |
| 22:14.29 | Seerah | yes |
| 22:14.32 | Kaylin | :( |
| 22:14.36 | Unkle | VIad: *sigh* You'll see it if you look for it. It's in nearly every western culture. Watch some dramas, see a play, read a novel - these stories play out. Age sensitivity in women is a direct result in women's value being tied to child-bearing and beauty. Attitudes which are changing, but aren't yet gone. |
| 22:14.49 | Seerah | hugs Kaylin |
| 22:15.30 | Seerah | VIad: just because you don't care, doesn't mean that's not how the world works ;) |
| 22:15.49 | Kaylin | hugs back. |
| 22:15.49 | VIad | I understand people have different backgrounds, but if you know me you'd know I wouldn't be asking because I am "one of those men" with some weird intentions, sadly over the internet you can read a message and make out a hundred reasons why I am a jerk :P |
| 22:16.00 | Unkle | And you can be sensitive to the issue without buying into perpetuating it. |
| 22:16.28 | VIad | Seerah: are you suggesting all women are sensitive about their age? if so, isn't it good to do something about it so they aren't? |
| 22:16.37 | Unkle | It's the reason why everyone on TV is pretty. |
| 22:16.56 | Seerah | VIad: all? no. 99%? yes |
| 22:17.29 | VIad | I hope I get a wife that is one of those 99% so I can show her so she changes her mind :D |
| 22:18.16 | Unkle | *chuckle* "Get a wife" is exactly the thing I'm talking about. :) |
| 22:18.45 | VIad | you think as in "obtain" but that's not what I mean :P lol |
| 22:18.52 | Seerah | and what do you propose? the roots of the age thing go back to primal urges - men want to reproduce, men want to reproduce with a partner they find will give them the best children or push them up the social ladder |
| 22:19.00 | Unkle | But the phrase is embedded in the language. |
| 22:19.32 | VIad | doesn't mean I put the same weight in the words as you think I do, it's just a word describing "when you get married" i.e. when you find someone you love and want to spend your life with |
| 22:19.36 | VIad | i.e. not just a "girlfriend" |
| 22:19.59 | Seerah | we're not trying to make you be politically correct or anything, just proving points :) |
| 22:20.04 | VIad | when people say married they don't mean the old version where it was purely for economical purpose :p |
| 22:20.14 | VIad | I am the least political correct person here lol |
| 22:20.35 | VIad | I just use what I know, often I don't realize what weight the words I use carry either :P |
| 22:20.39 | Unkle | Yeah, I'm just pointing out the root causes of the things I said above and why it leads to the arguments I was making. I'm not picking on you particularly. :) |
| 22:20.49 | VIad | I know |
| 22:21.05 | Unkle | If I was picking on you, Cairenn would make me stop. |
| 22:21.14 | Cairenn | heh |
| 22:23.46 | VIad | it's silly to pick on others on things they can't change :P |
| 22:23.55 | VIad | age, gender, nationality, list goes on |
| 22:25.13 | VIad | am I the only one against this? considering the silence lol |
| 22:25.20 | VIad | feels like I am in a room full of rednecks |
| 22:25.21 | Unkle | Remember than next time someone calls someone old and creepy or fat and disgusting or ugly. They're silly, but they're built in to the culture. We're shedding them, but cultures take a long time to change. |
| 22:25.47 | VIad | aye, if I heard someone say that to someone else, I'd probably get involved, if I had time, or if the person was someone I know :P |
| 22:25.54 | Seerah | I asked you how you intend to change it ;) |
| 22:26.14 | Semlar | just focus on changing yourself |
| 22:26.15 | Mr_Rabies | should i copy all the mpqs from /Data/ to the ptr folder, or just select ones? |
| 22:26.33 | VIad | Semlar: I always am |
| 22:26.40 | kd3 | all of them |
| 22:29.42 | Mr_Rabies | i don't know why the ptr launcher can't do this automatically :| |
| 22:30.06 | kd3 | one more edge case to test |
| 22:30.11 | Mr_Rabies | instead of downloading the files, check for a valid wow folder and copy those |
| 22:30.13 | VIad | Seerah I hope you are okay after me guessing your age, I just like to guess ages over the internet, regardless of gender :P |
| 22:30.33 | Mr_Rabies | most people miss my age when they guess |
| 22:30.50 | VIad | sadly I need more interaction, otherwise I may be off the mark :P |
| 22:30.56 | VIad | we don't chat so much Mr_Rabies |
| 22:31.08 | Mr_Rabies | a lot of people think i'm older than i am for some reason |
| 22:31.19 | Mr_Rabies | i'm immature as heck so i don't know how they manage to get that |
| 22:31.27 | Semlar | 19 |
| 22:31.33 | Seerah | VIad: I am at that age where I don't personally feel young anymore. At least not as young. I am not offended that you asked my age. But I give my students the same advice Unkle gave you. :) |
| 22:31.53 | VIad | did I ask? lol I don't know why I did |
| 22:32.15 | Mr_Rabies | I'm 25, Semlar :p |
| 22:32.16 | VIad | I just remember you saying something about "long ago" so I tried to give a compliment :p |
| 22:32.28 | Semlar | close enough |
| 22:32.37 | Mr_Rabies | i honestly don't feel any different than i did at 16 |
| 22:32.38 | VIad | guess me Semlar |
| 22:32.53 | Semlar | 26 |
| 22:33.03 | Seerah | that's true. and, as mentioned, I don't feel so young anymore, so I made a comment myself. which is why you guessed |
| 22:33.21 | VIad | you seriously think I am 26 Semlar? like a smiley face in each message and it's usually ":P" |
| 22:33.34 | Semlar | well just going off what you said earlier |
| 22:33.37 | durcyn | i was going to guess 12, VIad. |
| 22:33.46 | durcyn | but i suppose we're doing physical age rather than mental. |
| 22:33.51 | Semlar | oh mental age? |
| 22:33.55 | Semlar | let's see |
| 22:34.06 | Mr_Rabies | I'm going to guess you were born in 1431 CE, Vlad |
| 22:34.09 | VIad | :P |
| 22:34.23 | Seerah | Earlier, VIad said someone was around his age or a little older, then guessed 24- |
| 22:34.32 | VIad | Seerah is onto something |
| 22:34.48 | VIad | I like her, being creative and checking the chatlog :P |
| 22:34.55 | Seerah | I didn't have to check |
| 22:35.03 | VIad | you remember, even better! |
| 22:35.31 | VIad | anyone played Anno 2070? |
| 22:35.46 | VIad | it's settlers 7 simcity like game |
| 22:36.27 | VIad | I am 24 but I feel like 20 :P |
| 22:36.35 | Semlar | i was going to guess "14 year old female" |
| 22:36.37 | VIad | mentioned Anno 2070 because I spend like 5 hours :( |
| 22:36.47 | VIad | Semlar: that's only when I am at work |
| 22:37.00 | Semlar | oh dear |
| 22:37.10 | durcyn | also, who cares. |
| 22:37.23 | Semlar | the emoticons take off at least 10 years |
| 22:37.51 | Semlar | vlad where do you live |
| 22:37.53 | VIad | norway |
| 22:37.58 | Semlar | i knew it |
| 22:38.12 | VIad | also I was thinking more of at work as in me being the guy finding creeps to put in jain :P |
| 22:38.14 | VIad | jail* |
| 22:38.30 | VIad | booting anno 2070, fun game, but eats my time |
| 22:38.36 | Semlar | well my first guess was transylvania but norway was my second |
| 22:38.56 | VIad | :P |
| 22:38.59 | Semlar | actually ikea was my second |
| 22:39.01 | VIad | I got a vlad teppes tshirt |
| 22:39.07 | VIad | with people on stakes on the back |
| 22:39.15 | Semlar | sounds lovely |
| 22:39.27 | VIad | got it as a birthday gift |
| 22:41.00 | VIad | anyone saw the movie cloud atlas? |
| 22:41.25 | AcidWeb | yep |
| 22:41.40 | VIad | what are your thoughts? |
| 22:41.49 | AcidWeb | As always - book was better. |
| 22:42.01 | AcidWeb | But it was not bad. |
| 22:42.04 | VIad | your problem was reading the book first :P |
| 22:42.21 | Semlar | i prefer to read the book while watching the movie |
| 22:42.25 | VIad | you create your own version in your mind, and unless the movie maker does what you imagined, you get disappointed :P |
| 22:42.26 | AcidWeb | One of better films recently |
| 22:43.00 | AcidWeb | I read to much ;p |
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| 23:06.53 | *** join/#wowuidev Semlar|Laptop (~chatzilla@72.188.127.100) |
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| 23:44.08 | VIad | I AM ADDICTED |
| 23:45.20 | Semlar|Laptop | addiction is defined by consequence |
| 23:45.47 | VIad | I need to fill up my storage to the max :( |
| 23:45.52 | VIad | and make sure people are always happy |
| 23:46.15 | VIad | building my own city, actually got 2 islands :P |
| 23:46.57 | VIad | anno 2070 is awesome |
| 23:49.44 | pompy | http://www.facebook.com/photo.php?fbid=10151346701926842&set=a.61248886841.68283.26367351841&type=1 |
| 23:51.02 | Mr_Rabies | the "a little patience scenario" really shouldn't have been added in the state that it's in :| |
| 23:51.17 | Mr_Rabies | it's buggy as heck and also doesn't really tell you anything about how to complete it |
| 23:52.11 | VIad | what is it? |
| 23:52.25 | VIad | why are the routers so special? |
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