IRC log for #wowuidev on 20101102

01:45.24*** join/#wowuidev purl (~purl@rikers.org)
01:45.24*** topic/#wowuidev is http://wowuidev.pastey.net/ || 4.0.x ToC: 40000 || #WoWUIDev-commits: CIA & JIRA bots reporting || Cata Beta UI download: http://bit.ly/cvplpG || Can't be Halloween without: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bc80tFJpTuo or http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=S47MTZKsbCk or http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sOnqjkJTMaA&ob=av3e
01:58.33Krapsi'm halfway through toy story 3 and it is AWESOME
01:58.41Mirrormn<PROTECTED>
01:59.06Krapslol prison harmonica
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02:05.09Shirikneed more cowbell
02:18.13Cideyou do
02:18.36Thunder_Child~cowbell
02:18.36purlGuess what?!  I've got a fever and the only prescription... is more cowbell!
02:18.46Thunder_Child~cowbell Shirik
02:18.46purlShirik, I gotta have more cowbell!
02:18.54Thunder_Childhuh, that worked
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02:46.48KrapsMOST. INTENSE. DISNEY. MOVIE. EVER.
02:47.18Cidea must see?
02:47.26Krapsyes
02:47.33Cideawesome
02:48.16DagmarDid they keep the vibrator bit?
02:48.30Cidethat's what he meant by intense
02:48.47Krapswait what
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02:56.23*** join/#wowuidev MoonWitch (~Kelly@d54C547BE.access.telenet.be)
03:00.40NechcknWhile USians head to the polls tomorrow, we can all vote today!!  https://songcontest.nasa.gov/home.aspx Pretty nifty.
03:01.57Arrowmasteroh its election day again?
03:02.38MoonWitchfun question : codec packs -- any recommendations?
03:02.46Arrowmastercccp
03:03.01Cideccp
03:03.19MoonWitchyeah I'm using that one, but for some obscure reason some video's now no longer have sound ..
03:03.31Arrowmasterwhat player are you using?
03:03.32MoonWitchso something broke one of my codecs no clue which one
03:03.34MoonWitchMPC
03:03.39Cidemcp
03:04.13Arrowmastera new version of cccp came out this month, if you havent already install that one
03:04.19MoonWitchah
03:04.35Arrowmasterand uninstall any other codecs packs you have
03:04.55MoonWitchi have noticed that when I upgraded VLC the problem seems to have started
03:04.58MoonWitchbut can't verify yet
03:05.27Arrowmastervlc shouldnt have effected the rest of the system since it uses its own internal codecs
03:05.48MoonWitchI know -- it's the only thing I can think of that is related to vid stuff
03:06.55MoonWitchyep sound's ok again
03:07.17MoonWitchwanted to watch scary movie 2 while eating
03:08.05Shirik~x jp en ちいさな
03:08.16Shirikpurl
03:08.20Shirikobey me
03:08.31Shirikwhat
03:08.37Shirikwhat was that
03:08.38Cideowned
03:08.41Cideyou got so owned
03:09.20MoonWitchlol
03:10.20MoonWitcharent' there any better horror flick parodies left?
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03:12.15MoonWitchyou know -- while eating that puke scene isn't the best >.<
03:15.15Thunder_ChildLIES!
03:20.52MoonWitch...
03:22.34MoonWitchpoltergeist song still scares me lol
03:26.11*** join/#wowuidev toadicus (~toad@cpe-76-94-75-68.socal.res.rr.com)
03:26.48toadicusHrmm.  Does anyone know why a tooltip as hooked by LibTipHooker is throwing an "attempt to call null" when I try to tooltip:Addline()?
03:28.03toadicus(an itemtooltip, specifically)
03:28.15Seerahwhat is the exact error?
03:30.04toadicusSolaceGlyphs-4.0.1
03:30.04toadicusSolaceGlyphsKnown.lua:32: attempt to call method 'AddLine' (a nil value)\nLibTipHooker-1.1-14:170: in function <...aceGlyphs
03:30.04toadicuslibs
03:30.04toadicusLibTipHooker-1.1
03:30.04toadicusLibTipHooker-1.1.lua:165>\n<in C code>: ?\n<in C code>: in function `Outfitter_OrigSetBagItem'\nOutfitter-5.0.3
03:30.05toadicusOutfitter.lua:7481: in function `SetBagItem'\nInterface
03:30.05toadicusFrameXML
03:30.06toadicusContainerFrame.lua:780: in function `ContainerFrameItemButton_OnEnter':\nArkInventory-3.02
03:30.06toadicusArkInventory.lua:6101: in function `Frame_Item_OnEnter'\n<string>:\"*:OnEnter\":1: in function <[string \"*:OnEnter\"]:1>\n\nLocals:|r\ntooltip = GameTooltip {\n 0 = <userdata>\n SetText = <function> defined =[C]:-1\n Outfitter_OrigSetBagItem = <function> defined =[C]:-1\n SetExistingSocketGem = <function> defined =[C]:-1\n SetCurrencyToken = <function> defined =[C]:-1\n SetGuildBankItem = <function> defined =[C]:-1\n hasMoney = 1\n Outfi
03:30.12Thunder_ChildPASTEY
03:30.17toadicusEw, that's a little ugly.  Sorry all.
03:30.18Mirrormnthe new harry potter movie looks so... gray
03:30.58Seerahdid you expect sunshine and rainbows? ;)
03:31.10Sunshine`rainbows!
03:31.44HirsuteAye, use pastey for that.
03:31.59Seerahtoadicus: whatever you are trying to call AddLine() with (the whatever:AddLine() part) does not have the method AddLine() to call.
03:33.02toadicusRight, I'm just confused why it doesn't.  In looking at the GameTooltip docs on wowpedia, I don't see any conditions in which a tooltip doesn't have AddLine.  I also looked at some working mods that add to the tooltip, like RatingBuster, and they are doing things almost identically to the way I am, and are able to use AddLine.
03:33.28Seerahwhat is your "whatever" in whatever:AddLine() ?
03:33.45MoonWitchaka Pastey the relevant code :)
03:33.52Seerahhugs MoonWitch
03:34.00MoonWitchhugs Seerah
03:34.22toadicushttp://www.pastey.net/142343
03:35.01LuliaWhere's the tooltip being created?
03:35.22toadicusWhen I mouse over an item in my inventory
03:35.31toadicusPotentially of note, I have ArkInventory installed.
03:35.37LuliaNo, no, I mean the script creating the tooltip
03:35.44Thunder_Childso there is an argument in my guikd right now if the real name is supposed to be 'taint' or 'gooch'
03:35.47Thunder_Childguild*
03:36.00MoonWitchAlso : your if if .. you could replace it by if arg1 and arg2 then :)
03:36.29toadicusMoonWitch: Thanks.  I'm used to languages that spit at you when you try to reference stuff that doesn't exist.
03:36.53toadicusLulia: I'm not creating a tooltip at any point.  I'm hooking the game's tooltip call via LibTipHooker
03:37.03Seerahwhy don't you post your full code :)
03:37.17Seerahbecause right now, we need to know abotu SGK - your "whatever"
03:37.42toadicusThere's very little to it.  Just waiting on pastey
03:37.57toadicushttp://www.pastey.net/142346
03:38.21toadicusThat is the sum total of non-<include /> code in this module.
03:38.33SeerahSGK is a frame
03:38.41Seerahand you're trying to do SGK:AddLine()
03:39.00toadicusWhy would tooltip:AddLine be trying to call SGK:AddLine?
03:39.07toadicusPerhaps I don't know enough about widget
03:39.08toadicuss
03:39.32Seerahah, wait... actually, nvm.  I don't usually do stuff:function()
03:39.56Seerahthen what is tooltip?
03:40.41Seerahput print(tooltip, tooltip:GetName()) in your code right above that line
03:41.14toadicusStandby
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03:43.55toadicusIt spat at me for GetName this time
03:44.07SintacksI need moar ram
03:44.21toadicushttp://www.pastey.net/142347
03:44.40Seerahthen tooltip is not GameTooltip
03:45.13toadicusI'm confused as to what else it might be
03:45.19toadicusI don't disagree with you
03:45.27toadicusMaybe LibTipHooker is broken r something
03:45.37toadicusI'm just not sure what else I could be getting as tooltip
03:45.41Luliawe need to see where you're getting it from
03:45.53Seerah(or ItemRefTooltip)
03:47.39toadicusRather than pastey-ing all of LibTipHooker, these are what I understand to be the relevant portions:
03:47.41toadicushttp://www.pastey.net/142348
03:48.58toadicusLibTipHooker doesn't have a super-clear "this is how to use LibTipHooker to get tooltips" documentation.  But I'm using it more or less the way RatingBuster uses it, and trying to follow LTH's docs as I can.
03:49.20temI need to be able to turn off the ability to click those little control group icons to set a group
03:49.33temI am constantly misclicking on them and losing control groups that are a huge pain to redo
03:49.43temlike all my hatches suddenly becoming my muta grou
03:50.33Cidewhy would you click on them?
03:50.42Cideor are you accidentally clicking on them while doing other stuff?
03:51.24toadicus(fwiw; I just ran the mod with no other mods installed; tooltip:GetName and tooltip:AddLine still don't exist)
03:53.06Seerahwell, you could just skip LTH and set up your own hooking
03:53.32Seerahbtw - do you get anything for the first part of the print(tooltip, tooltip:GetName()) bit?
03:56.05toadicusNo, it errors on GetName as well
03:56.26SeerahThe first part. :p  It should print two things.  tooltip and tooltip:GetName()
03:56.36Seerahprint(tooltip, tooltip:GetName())
03:56.42Seerahor try just print(tooltip)
03:56.49MoonWitchif it errors on tooltip, there's something seriously wrong lol
03:56.54toadicusAnd, I could skip LTH.  But, I am confused why LTH doesn't work for me, when it seems to work fine for others (e.g. RatingBuster).
03:57.39toadicusI'm not just trying to get a working mod; I'm also trying to learn. :)
03:58.16toadicusJust plain print(tooltip) prints: "Valor Medal of the First War" (for example)
03:58.22SeerahThen first learn it yourself, before having libraries do stuff for you :)  Otherwise, you'll never understand what they're doing and how (or even if) they benefit you :)
03:58.35Seerahthen that's your item name.  Not the tooltip
03:58.49Seerahthis is why :AddLine() is failing
03:59.12Shadowedlisten to Seerah, while she maybe mean she is in fact right
03:59.19Seerahwhat? :p
03:59.29MoonWitchSeerah isn't mean Shadowed
03:59.32Shadowedyes she is!
03:59.36MoonWitchNo she isn't
03:59.38Seerah~lart Shadowed
03:59.38purlsmacks Shadowed up side the head with a clue-by-4
03:59.43MoonWitchyou've never heard her on ventrilo!
03:59.47Seerahhe's just picking on me, MoonWitch :)
03:59.52Seerah(he's met me in person)
03:59.59MoonWitchdamnit
04:00.16Shadowedher room was next to mine at blizzcon by some weird luck :P
04:00.23MoonWitchooh
04:00.27MoonWitchdo you have some inside info?
04:00.29Shadowedwell across the hall technically, but same thing
04:00.30Seerahhubby found your p2p network!
04:00.34Shadowedhaha
04:00.36MoonWitchLOL
04:00.47toadicusShe does have a valid point. ;)  I'm mainly just confused why, when I seem to be following a method that works, it doesn't work for me.  I have spent enough time digging in LTH today that I could do the hook myself.
04:00.50ShadowedI should bring a router next time, was trying to use the laptops wireless network for people
04:00.53MoonWitchyou know what I miss -- right now -- RED BULL
04:01.06Shadowedtoadicus no what she said is right
04:01.12Shadowedlibraries tend to be bad when you're starting out
04:01.17ArrowmasterShadowed: were you staying at the hilton with its restrictive wireless?
04:01.21Shadowedthere's like, 2 exceptions to that
04:01.28Seerahdoubletree (but same hotel family)
04:01.31ShadowedArrowmaster: No, doubletree but we had no wireless and one ethernet jack for 3 people
04:01.47MoonWitchI would go crazy then
04:02.00Seerahyou could always just plug in
04:02.02Shadowedyou didn't really spend your time in your room so it wasn't that bad
04:02.07Seerahthe rooms had their own cord
04:02.14Seerahyeah
04:02.15ShadowedI spent maybe 2 hours the entire 4 days not asleep
04:02.18Arrowmasteroh, i heard the hilton was charging $13 a night for wireless access and after you paid they locked it to your MAC address so it was per computer and not room
04:02.23Shadowedhahah
04:02.30Shadoweddoubletree was $13, but not MAC locked
04:02.35Shadowedat least I don't think it was
04:02.39toadicusShadowed: Again, I'm not disagreeing.  But, while I'm new with these libraries, I do know myself around a mod at least somewhat.  I've been writing non-libraried mods for four years.
04:02.41Arrowmasteri was like 'should have brought a wireless router'
04:02.44Seerahours was free :)  (HiltonHonors)
04:02.57toadicusWhat's aggravating me specifically is that I think I'm using the library right, and it's not working. ;)
04:02.59Arrowmasterwas free at Candy Cane Inn but slow
04:03.12MoonWitchSo again, Shadowed, any interesting inside in... Candy Cane Inn?
04:03.25MoonWitchwtf? That a hotel from a halloween parody?
04:03.30ShadowedMoonWitch not that I'm at liberty to say ;)
04:04.26Arrowmastertoadicus: just ditch that library, nobody uses it except RatingBuster and many of us dislike it for a reason
04:04.45ShadowedOh god, is it the ratingbuster library with the weird hooks
04:04.53Lulialol
04:04.56Seerahyeah
04:04.59LuliaWhat is this library of evil?
04:05.06ArrowmasterLibTipHooker
04:05.08MoonWitcha hooker
04:05.22SeerahLibTipHooker (previously known as TipHookerLib, iirc)
04:05.37LuliaTipHooker
04:05.39LuliaPriceless
04:05.50MoonWitchuh huh
04:05.53temCide, accidently clicking them
04:06.15toadicusThat /is/ useful info. :)
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04:08.50Krapstoy story 3 is rated g?
04:08.52Krapshuh
04:09.03Seerahwhat would make it pg?
04:09.27toadicusThanks, folks.  I'll write up the hook myself. :)
04:09.30LuliaClearly the talking toys
04:09.35LuliaMight scare some children
04:09.39Krapsits freaking scary
04:09.50Seerahmaybe the attempted murders?
04:10.04MoonWitchwhat?\
04:10.13MoonWitchthere's attempted murder in toy story?
04:10.15SeerahI won't ruin it for you, Moonie
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04:11.06KrapsSeerah: the toy whos a psycho prison warden?
04:13.20KrapsThe Farmer And The Viper sequence?
04:13.42Kraps(dont look it up if you dont want spoilers)
04:24.03Wobin<PROTECTED>
04:24.32mikmayah
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04:29.38Thunder_Childhttp://gizmodo.com/5676641/all-900gb-of-geocities-will-soon-be-downloadable
04:31.47MoonWitchThunder_Child: That is terrifying
04:32.21MoonWitchI am actually thinking of getting it, just to be able to look at it when I'm 60 and laugh thinking what crap technology we had back then :P
04:33.01Thunder_Childit wasnt tech, it was 'idead of new and exciting ness'
04:33.07Thunder_Childideas*
04:36.49MoonWitchanyhow, enough "awww I was so much younger then"
04:36.54MoonWitchI'm going for a smoke and a shower
04:37.53*** part/#wowuidev toadicus (~toad@cpe-76-94-75-68.socal.res.rr.com)
04:46.10Corrodias2holy shit.
04:49.50Seerahwow...  I used to have a GeoCities site
04:58.21Krapswhat http://kotaku.com/5678874/vagina-shooter-scores-penis-enlargement
04:58.36AurorusKraps: wtf is that article about? is it NSFW?
04:58.49KrapsAurorus: just the text
04:59.14Aurorusahh ok - might save it for home then, ty Kraps
04:59.48ShirikI used to have a geocities site too
04:59.58Shirikback when you had like a street name and a number
05:00.03Shirikhell if I remember what it was though
05:00.14Mirrormnthere is a game set on a micro-scopic scale inside a vagina, they have announced a DLC that is set inside a penis
05:00.30Mirrormnthat's about it!
05:00.38Krapshttp://blue.mmo-champion.com/t/27497533856/cataclysm-direct-download-and-game-cinematics/
05:01.29Seerahthank you, Kraps :)
05:01.29Krapswhy even mention the no-cinematic thing then? it just caused a lot of hand-wringing for no reason
05:01.52Mirrormnso people wouldn't datamine the movies and post them all over youtube, I assume
05:01.55Seerahit was mentioned in the Tech Support forums.  People were confused why their cinematics were missing and they were getting errors
05:02.17Seerahso the Blue found out why.  Then all chaos ensued
05:02.39Seerah(which I admit I was a part of, since I had purchased two digital upgrades an hour prior to reading it)
05:03.18KrapsSeerah: the blue responses were unclear and confusing, and the silence and moving threads just added fuel
05:03.40Seerahyes
05:05.25Thunder_Childhttp://gizmodo.com/5678968/google-is-suing-the-united-states-government
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05:15.26Kraps"The final boss of WoW is the RNG.  It's not the Old Gods. It's not the Titans. It's not the Burning Legion.  It's the RNG."
05:16.09ComputerpunksintAcks, I'd rename myself to sintAckis
05:16.39cog|awayComputerpunk: i read it that way right before i saw your comment -_-
05:16.55Krapsno, Computerpunk, hes a cool bro
05:17.09Computerpunk;o
05:17.20Computerpunkand I didn't know it's RNG. I thought it was MersenneTwister.
05:17.58Computerpunkthey should make an instance.
05:18.04Computerpunk30% chance to win, 70% chance to lose.
05:18.11Computerpunkfrom the beginning
05:18.12Computerpunkfree JPs.
05:18.38Krapswhat makes the vid all laggy? http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tbb8Ria6Rvw
05:19.24Krapsall her vids are like that
05:19.27Computerpunkbyeee
05:20.38*** part/#wowuidev Seerah (~Ryan@adsl-177-26-80.mem.bellsouth.net)
05:23.53cogwheelhttp://scienceblogs.com/pharyngula/upload/2010/11/finally_a_use_for_that_bad_plu/OCTOPI.jpeg
05:30.12Krapshttp://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jtsoneo9I5U&feature=channel
05:31.16cogwheelO.o beta prank?
05:31.27Krapscogwheel: what
05:32.09cogwheelsilly placeholder or something...
05:32.30Krapsnope
05:32.36Corrodias2you're a prank
05:34.00Corrodias2good commentary, though
05:40.17Mirrormnhttp://forums.worldofwarcraft.com/thread.html?topicId=27509091494&pageNo=2&sid=1#26 I guess my skepticism has been proven false!
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06:29.47temwell that was weird
06:29.51temthis guy just void ray rushed me
06:29.59temwhen it failed, he gged out immediately
06:30.15Mirrormngotta stick to a plan
06:30.18Jerubtem: in beta, voidray rush = quick victory
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06:30.23Jerub(for the person being rushed)
06:30.27Jerubis that still the case?
06:30.43temit's quite potent against zerg who still only have queens for AA in t1
06:30.55temit's easily possible to have 2 VRs in my base at like minute 5
06:31.16Jerubtem: oh, i only played terran in beta
06:31.19temif I were one-basing, I would probably only have 1 queen, and I'd lose to this strategy immediately
06:31.33Jerubwhere it was 'lol voidrays' and you just send all your troops at the enemy base and queue marines
06:33.27tembut I almost always 15 hatch 14 pool if I don't scout 2 gateway or 2 rax pressure
06:43.39Fiskerdon't kill me cog|sleep
06:43.55Jerubi should totally buy sc2
06:44.00Jerubafter i care i think
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06:47.56Fiskeri will kill you Jerub
06:47.58FiskerFOR FREE
06:48.53JerubFisker: i don't understand you or what you are
06:49.31Fiskeri'm hot Jerub
06:49.43Jerubpeople call you a troll, but you are literally the most innoccuous person i've met on irc
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06:57.54Mirrormnhe's just a fun guy!
06:58.11Fiskers/fun/awesome/
06:58.27Mirrormns/awesome/whip my hair back and forth/
06:58.34Jerubhttp://i.imgur.com/FQ4Jh.jpg
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07:29.18kaidenI used to have a 1 pixel ui tooltip blp that i could drop into Interface to make addons that were rounded before using the UI-TOOLTIP-BORDER.BLP file become square, anyone happen to have one of these?
07:31.29temwat
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07:49.19mikmatem: he replaced the square images with the 1x1 pixel
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07:49.29mikmatem: atleast thats what i understood
07:49.39mikmaerrr, rounded images*
07:49.45kaiden^ bingo
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07:49.48kaiden:)
07:50.02kaidenmade the rounded tooltip border into a square tooltip border
07:50.09mikmayeah
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08:00.59kaidenthat and a UI-QuickSlot replacement, damn hd failures, wish i had made a backup of that
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08:19.16zenzioI got to hand it to my ISP, they just sent me an SMS saying (paraphrased) "hey, someone apparently dug up our cable, we hope to fix it pretty quickly"
08:19.46adys_which isp zenzio?
08:21.17zenzioGET
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09:20.12Maldiviamorb
09:20.36Maldiviaand morning as well :)
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10:11.28MoonWitch|Mobileanyone awake?
10:11.37MoonWitch|MobileAnd cairenn? ping?
10:12.01Elunacairenn is never here! <3
10:12.29MoonWitch|Mobileit's just that I need some life advice
10:12.35MoonWitch|Mobilelol
10:12.47MoonWitch|Mobileor rather do I take a gamble with a job or not :P
10:14.05MoonWitch|MobileI have an interview scheduled this afternoon - which is 1.5h travel away (as is the job)... But I have to call a woman back for a job as well, and that job is about 30min away. I'd rather go for the closeby job, but it's no way sure I would even have it (i haven't a clue about which job I am supposed to return her call)
10:14.17MoonWitch|MobileI've been trying to get a hold of her since friday :P
10:14.35ElunaTravel time shouldn't be the reason to chose a job.
10:14.54ElunaI work about 1-1.5 hours away.
10:14.56MoonWitch|Mobilebelieve me it is when you're trying to schedule evening school for a bachelors :P
10:15.11ElunaThen why ask? :P
10:15.18ElunaYou've already decided on the other job then. XD
10:15.43MoonWitch|Mobileassurance that I am not crazy?
10:17.00Maldiviasorry, that's something we can't assure you of :)
10:19.05ElunaWhich of the two jobs would you rather have though?
10:19.15ElunaIf you had to chose. And only the actual job, not traveltime.
10:26.30MoonWitch|Mobilewell I don't know what the jobs are
10:27.04MoonWitch|Mobileone is a possible interview directly with the employer, the interview today (far) is just with a headhunter, so i don't know what job he's got in store for me
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10:30.07ElunaThen go check it out?
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10:36.36mitch0moonwitch: also keep in mind that most headhunters suck
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11:01.52adys_Cide stop sleeping
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11:25.29Maldiviabut sleep is good
11:26.00amroadys_ stop ciding
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11:41.19MoonWitch|Mobileyeah for someone who's relucrtant to go -- I lucked out :P @ Eluna
11:41.38MoonWitch|Mobile\s\reluctant
11:41.49MoonWitch|MobileI have no clue how that works :P
11:42.00MoonWitch|Mobile\s\relucrtant\reluctant
11:42.12zenzios/find/replace/
11:42.21MoonWitch|Mobiledamn
11:42.26MoonWitch|Mobilelol thanks zenzio
11:42.27zenzios/find/search/
11:42.42MoonWitch|Mobilebtw - did you know your name is mapname is day of defeat?
11:42.51MoonWitch|Mobileone of my personal favorites if I may add
11:43.19zenziosure? I wasn't aware of that. Been a long time since I played DoD
11:43.33MoonWitch|Mobileyeah
11:43.40MoonWitch|Mobileit's a custom one though ..
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11:44.06MoonWitch|Mobilebeen about 6 months since i played dod myself
11:44.07zenziomy actual nick is zenzelezz, but people got tired of writing that, so they shorten it to zenzio. Also, Zenzio looks okay capitalised, Zenzelezz does not... so zenzio's my in-game nick
11:44.11MoonWitch|MobileI kinda miss it
11:44.37MoonWitch|Mobileah
11:44.42MoonWitch|Mobilewell tab completion ftw?
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11:45.03MoonWitch|Mobilehell, i'd use it for my name, but then again, I respond to moon, moonie and just Kay or Kelly :P
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12:03.36zenziohttp://icanhascheezburger.com/2010/11/01/funny-pictures-basement-cat-scoffs/
12:03.52Flowykwhere are defined wow api functions?
12:04.17zenziosome are in FrameXML, some are in C
12:04.34Flowykcan I extract C files?
12:04.40zenziono
12:04.49Flowykok thanks
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12:44.11Lopeppeppysprays EZ Cheeze all over her voting booth. Take that!
12:45.16zenzioo_o
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12:47.38LopeppeppyMorning, zenzio.
12:47.57zenzioindeed, Lopeppeppy!
12:48.04alestanePolitics sort of gives me that feeling lately too.
12:48.41LopeppeppySometimes, spray cheese is the only answer for ludicrous posturing.
12:49.06LopeppeppyThat, or a vat of ravenous pirhana in a lime jello mold.  But I'm fresh out of lime jello.  Hence the spray cheese.
12:51.28Kraps"True friends stab you in the front." - Oscar Wilde
12:52.08Thunder_Childblizz can be seriously stupid some times
12:52.09LopeppeppyBad friends give you chocolate.
12:52.16LopeppeppyTC, what is the stupid today?
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12:52.34Thunder_ChildLopeppeppy: just got an email from them about the real id stuff
12:52.43Thunder_Childall of the sharing is enabled by default
12:53.18Thunder_Childexposure should always start off
12:53.24alestaneWasn't it like that before anyway, only you couldn't turn it off at all?
12:53.49Thunder_Childbut now they have the option and the default is still on
12:54.28Thunder_Childand on their list 4b and 4c are exactly the same
12:54.30alestaneFor new accounts too, or just for existing accounts where it was already on?
12:54.35Thunder_Childnew
12:54.53Thunder_Child"By default, these features are available and enabled on most Battle.net accounts, but you can easily opt out of any or all of them by managing your Battle.net privacy settings."
12:55.04ComputerpunkRawr.
12:55.32Thunder_Child"If parental controls are enabled on the account, then these features are disabled by default."
12:55.34harlwuff?
12:55.35Thunder_Childthats at least good
12:55.43Thunder_Childbut it should be for all accounts
12:55.49alestaneThey are adopting a somewhat different attitude as far as RealID privacy goes. Remains to see how stupid it will turn out to have been.
12:56.00Krapshttp://gizmodo.com/5679355/can-artificial-intelligence-beat-humans-at-starcraft
12:56.11foxlitYes, stupid question
12:57.12alestaneGiven that it can beat them at chess, it can probably beat them at SC with sufficient programming.
12:57.54foxlitchess is perfect information, though.
12:58.00alestaneAlthough, of course, AIs beat human beings at SC all the time.
12:58.01foxlitSo it's a bit apples to oranges.
12:58.07Thunder_Childindeed
12:58.12Thunder_Childno fog of war in chess
12:58.27foxlitDo AIs beat humans at poker?
12:58.32foxlitThat's the actual benchmark :P
12:58.34alestaneI presume what they meant was, "Can an AI be created that no human can beat at Starcraft?"
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13:00.55Kraps"Chess is hard because you need to look very far into the future. Poker's hard because it's a game of imperfect information. Other games are hard because you have to make decisions very quickly. StarCraft is hard in all of these ways,"
13:01.38foxlitpoker is hard because it's played by irrational agents trying to predict each others irrationality.
13:04.35Elkanoand compared to Go, Chess is piece of cake...
13:04.49Krapswouldnt a patch fuck up the AI :p
13:05.03Computerpunk_Best AI test.
13:05.08Computerpunk_Make a AI patchwerk run.
13:05.09Computerpunk_LOLOLO
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13:10.21Krapshttp://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JJGQ_tTmYgI&feature=player_embedded#!
13:12.27Computerpunk_Kraps, http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ddn4MGaS3N4
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13:14.23Lopeppeppy260
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13:16.01Kraps34 million views
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13:23.31KrapsComputerpunk_: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Oe-DnbB_KF4
13:24.07Computerpunk_country infleunces
13:24.08Computerpunk_meh
13:25.08Krapswell you just suck
13:25.11Kraps:p
13:25.26Computerpunk_:<
13:25.32Computerpunk_thank you.
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13:27.34Ackisderpaderp
13:28.05LopeppeppyBless you.
13:29.06Ackiswhere's my internet punch button
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13:35.09alestaneAnyone else having trouble logging into WoW (US), or logging in without trouble?
13:37.18Ackisthe truth about video game piracy: http://i.imgur.com/1hnVh.jpg
13:37.21alestaneNever mind, just took five minutes.
13:38.55solocommandlol Ackis. So true.
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13:39.52Ackisteabags MoonWitch|Mobile
13:42.01Ackisalestane: https://twitter.com/#!/BlizzardCS/status/29470530665
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13:42.29Kraftmanhow do i load an addon when the interface options are open? add a LoadAddOn() into InterfaceOptionsFrame_OpenToCategory  ?
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13:49.52LuliaHmm
13:50.34foxlitalestane:
13:50.54LuliaDoes WoWInterface have a tag feature for AddOn searches?
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13:52.50angayellehai people
13:52.58LuliaHey
13:53.49alestanefoxlit:
13:54.12Luliapeople:
13:54.16angayellei'm in the procress of making a very simple addon to maintank and offtank which will need syncronization with raid members, i found http://www.wowwiki.com/AddOn_communications_protocol is it still accurate ?
13:54.29angayelleor is there some better/easier way ?
13:54.38foxlitno.
13:54.54foxlitSAM doesn't slur if you're drunk and provides a better everything.
13:55.10foxlitalestane: still want a secure timer mechanism; would it help if I wrote some code? :)
13:56.00alestaneCode I can provide. What I need are proofs of concept, along with possible attack applications.
13:56.29Legorolangayelle: outdated, as foxlit said use SAM (SendAddonMessage)
13:57.08alestaneTimer mechanisms are inherently risky as long as cooldown info is considered sensitive. Devising a mechanism that can't be abused into a cooldown timer is the trick.
13:57.23foxlitalestane: remember my idea?
13:57.30alestaneSome of it.
13:57.38alestaneOnly start a timer on a hardware input.
13:57.53alestaneOnly one timer per environment, or something like that.
13:58.02foxlitShare a single timer for the entire UI
13:58.26alestaneSo, basically reserve a special status in the UI for "this is the thing waiting on user input."
13:58.26foxlitBoth of our use-cases are basically simulating interaction timeout with a single element
13:58.47Luliahttp://www.wowpedia.org/API_SendAddonMessage
13:58.50alestaneBenefit-cost is likely to be a problem.
13:59.23foxlitIt's almost easier to call this "focus" -- your addon can request "focus" for a fixed amount of time, and will be notified when it loses it -- either because the time expires, or someone else requested focus.
13:59.51alestaneIt's probably going to require support beyond just Lua to operate properly, which means I have to persuade people that it's not only worth the risk of potential abuse, but worth the programming work on their part.
13:59.52foxlitI'm not sure I see the cost part of this equation
14:00.41foxlit[I think you should be able to detect a hardware event in Lua]
14:00.46angayellethanks lulia
14:01.14foxlitAnd that's the only esoteric thing you need.
14:01.16angayelleand legorol
14:01.31angayelleand foxlite
14:01.39angayelle-e
14:02.26alestaneI don't know that there's any easy way to detect whether the person has gone and interacted with something else, which was a significant part of my design, although it is perhaps unneeded under yours.
14:02.44MoonWitch:)
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14:05.04alestaneHowever, the other issue is that we're incorporating a feature known to tread on dangerous ground to satisfy a use case with only two vocal advocates.
14:05.05foxlitalestane: Yeah, that's not really worth the trouble.
14:05.30LopeppeppyCost/benefit analysis on that sentence says you lose...
14:05.38foxlit(detecting interaction with /everything/, not incorporating new features)
14:06.05alestaneThe safety model was originally based on /castsequence.
14:06.08foxlitIn the long run, very few people use the Secure stuff to begin with.
14:06.50foxlitalestane: I think someone messed up at some point during that
14:07.06foxlitRE can currently implement the old /castsequence but not the new /castsequence
14:07.06alestaneDuring what?
14:07.23alestaneRE?
14:07.33LuliaI just provided the link, I didn't help overmuch ;)
14:07.39LuliaI know nothing about SAM :P
14:07.42foxlitsecure handlers.
14:09.11foxlitHm, I'm off on a tangent -- nevermind that.
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14:10.39LuliaHmm
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14:11.34foxlitHeck, it's always easy to remove functionality after the fact. At the moment, I do not see an nasty exploits of this thing.
14:12.18alestaneMy considerors aren't concerned about the exploits they can't see, so much as that there probably are some.
14:12.56alestane"We don't know how this might be abused" is not good. "We can see that this can't be abused" is more viable.
14:12.57cbreak_worknew castsequence?
14:12.59foxlitThere are probably some exploits in any code, I don't know how you get anything by that :)
14:16.35foxlitWe've been through that before, though -- it's difficult to prove that you cannot get anything malicious past something. It'd be better if there was a list of behaviors you don't want to allow.
14:17.21LuliaWhat are you guys making?
14:19.40alestaneThe big one here is that the behavior of a user input shouldn't change as that input is repeated over time according to some other interval elapsing. For instance, a button that cast frost nova when first pressed, then changes to arcane explosion each time pressed until 20-odd seconds have elapsed and reverts to Frost Nova is over the line.
14:19.40foxlitI want to be able to distinguish between button taps and holding down a button for a while.
14:20.00foxlitalestane wants to be able to close pop-out menus activated by keybinds.
14:20.02alestaneCases like that are why the animation had to be stripped out of the secure environment.
14:20.32alestaneAnd are also why I required timing out on inputs directed at other elements.
14:21.21foxlitHm, so, that.
14:22.40foxlitIf you can distinguish between time elapsing and time not elapsing, you're going to cause that Frost Nova/AE situation -- cannot opt out of it by design, so we'd basically have to patch that with a hack.
14:23.21alestaneHence why ANY user input had to either end or reset a timeout.
14:23.31foxlitKill all timers whenever you cast a spell.
14:24.06alestaneWhich might be kludgeable in Lua, but wanted C support for the best results.
14:24.50alestaneAnd when I look for peer review, the usual lack of response I get basically boils down to "I don't really have the time or investment to examine this thoroughly, but it sounds risky."
14:25.08alestaneSo I've pretty much filed it in the AGH file.
14:26.29angayellein the event "CHAT_MSG_ADDON" under which form is the sender arg received ? guid or plain name ?
14:26.40foxlitSeems to me like waiting for C support isn't really going to happen.
14:26.44angayelleits not specified in the wiki
14:27.13alestaneAnd I don't see a very good solution without it.
14:27.24MentalPoweranname
14:27.31MentalPowerangayelle: name
14:27.40angayelleok thanks mp
14:27.40MentalPowerfrigging tab-complete
14:27.50alestaneYou can send me a detailed design, if you want, and include explanations of attack vectors and how they are prevented by the design. I can't take code.
14:27.53foxlitHack it out in Lua -- hooking every function that casts an ability should do it.
14:27.57MentalPowermost API's in WoW return name
14:28.08MentalPowerthe exceptions are the combat log which has GUIDs
14:28.32angayelleaye i was ddep into combat log event earlier, so was wondering
14:29.16foxlitIf it ends up being exploited, they can pull it like any other piece of functionality. If it doesn't, and it becomes popular, they can look into removing the insignificant overhead. If it doesn't, and it doesn't become popular, we still win by getting functionality out of it.
14:29.24foxlitOf course, I'm not in your position, so it's easier for me to say that.
14:29.57alestaneThey don't like the "stick this in and see if people exploit it" tactic.
14:30.26foxlitYet I doubt they methodically check every single API function they introduce.
14:30.44foxlitIt's unfortunate, really.
14:31.19foxlitBut regardless, an explicit list of bad behaviors is extremely helpful at addressing them.
14:31.27*** join/#wowuidev Hirsute (~chatzilla@75.31.91.46)
14:31.35*** join/#wowuidev Hirsute (~chatzilla@WoWUIDev/Norganna/Developer/Hirsute)
14:31.41alestaneThe case I described to you above is the biggest one with time.
14:32.32alestaneOther cases like choice based on range are issues, and the most famous is the presence or absence of a buff on a given unit, self or over, used to make a choice between abilities.
14:32.46alestaneWhich includes a choice between a given ability and "no ability."
14:33.16foxlitWe agree that resetting timers on spell casts solves the alternation of abilities based on time?
14:33.37alestaneI'm not sure that actual casts are sufficient.
14:34.15foxlitI'd just search through the global api list for Cast* Use*.
14:34.19mikmacairenn: http://pics.kuvaton.com/kuvei/baby_giraffe.jpg
14:35.09cairennawww
14:35.10foxlitIf we require timers to be started from restricted environments, they already do not have information about buffs -- that's a sandboxing issue that's hopefully solved elsewhere.
14:36.10foxlit[And if you can get information into the restricted environment, you don't need this functionality to exploit the living daylights out of making casting decisions]
14:36.18nicoli_sall you cali people are voting yes today on prop 19 am i right?
14:38.11zenziowhat's prop 19?
14:38.21HirsuteLegalizing Marijuana?
14:38.25alestaneOkay, of all the feature issues I've run into in LimeChat, the shared input window is the most annyoing.
14:38.41zenzioshared input window?
14:39.26nicoli_syes thats it zenzio
14:39.36cbreak_workI think blizzard wastes too much time on securing their in-game API
14:39.41cbreak_workwhile real bots don't even use it
14:39.41alestaneIf I start typing something in one channel, and then someone says something in another channel that I want to respond to, I have to either send the first partially completed post, or cut it out of the window and paste it back in after I finish typing the other one.
14:40.04zenzioalestane: that's an intriguing UI decision
14:40.32cbreak_workthat sounds like the default UI to me
14:40.34zenziocbreak_work: real bots just emulate input on the OS level or something?
14:40.46cbreak_workzenzio: I suppose so
14:40.51cbreak_worknever looked at one
14:41.00cbreak_workbut... they couldn't do their work inside the environment anyway
14:41.11cbreak_workso they must have external code, so why not go all the way
14:41.32cbreak_workif I would write a bot, Id' just use addons to get data out of WoW in an easily parsable format
14:41.35Hirsutecbreak_work: The default UI changed with 3.3.5 to not be that way by default.
14:41.42alestaneIf the API were not secured, then bots could just be addons that asked the game about its own internal state and made decisions accordingly.
14:42.06cbreak_workdoes the secure API limit queries?
14:42.10cbreak_workI thought it only limited actions
14:42.14LuliaI'm curious. It's possible to click through a chat edit box, that means there must be some way to position the cursor in it, right?
14:42.46foxlitUltimatley, if someone is going to write a bot, they'd hack their way through whatever protection you put in place. Push comes to shove, read wow's memory directly.
14:43.11foxlitis making more typos than usual :(
14:43.23Luliapats foxlit comfortingly.
14:44.35cbreak_workreading an other app's memory is very invasive
14:44.46cbreak_workboth apple and microsoft have tried quite a bit to make this hard
14:45.12cbreak_workalthough I guess ASLR is not that meaningfull if you can read the symbols from the linker :)
14:46.06*** join/#wowuidev ZorbaTHut (tocohl@maximilian.pavlovian.net)
14:46.14zenzioI think Windows is somewhat limited in what it allows you to do cross-process by default now... though if you're running as an administrator you can (if I recall correctly) just as for debug privilege and there you go
14:46.26zenzio*ask
14:46.36*** join/#wowuidev spode (spode@213.21.119.83)
14:47.52cbreak_workof course you can... debugging programs would suck if you could not :)
14:48.14cbreak_workon os x you can even install kernel hooks for some things...
14:48.30zenzioI know, but my point was that I think you can't do it without having some (admin) priviliege in the first place :)
14:48.34cbreak_workDTrace FTW... (although that stuff is scray, so I stayed away from it)
14:48.40zenzio*privilege
14:48.48cbreak_workyou need those for installing WoW
14:48.53cbreak_workso I assume that most WoW users have them
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14:48.59zenzioah, I see
14:49.05Fiskerhas gas
14:49.09Arrowmasteri met a guy at blizzcon that said he was a security researcher and hacked wow a lot for his own research and one attack vector was to replace the lua runtime inside wow with his own
14:49.17zenzioI don't even recall if Windows still makes the default user an admin in Win7
14:49.33cbreak_workI bet it does
14:49.37cbreak_workit's microsoft
14:49.56foxlitI don't see why default settings matter, anyhow. If you wanted to do this, you'd configure it to allow you to do it
14:51.20zenziofoxlit: you're right, I mentally jumped somewhere outside the discussion
14:51.46LuliaIs it possible to temporarily suppress a keybinding without removing it completely?
14:52.03Arrowmaster!api OverrideBinding
14:52.03lua_botFound 7 possible results for 'OverrideBinding': ClearOverrideBindings, SetOverrideBindingItem, SetOverrideBindingSpell, SetOverrideBinding, SetOverrideBindingMacro, SetOverrideBindingClick, SetMouselookOverrideBinding
14:52.24Lulialol
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14:52.27*** mode/#wowuidev [+v Cide] by ChanServ
14:54.20LuliaHmm
14:54.35LuliaI dont think any of those actually do what I'm looking for.
14:56.41LuliaThose seem to set a key to a specific command binding from the bindings list, and then can be cleared
14:56.54Arrowmasterright
14:57.04Arrowmasterbut you could set them to a noop
14:57.05LuliaWhat I'm looking for is something that temporarily tells a key to not perform its routine binding
14:57.08LuliaWithout removing it.
14:57.15LuliaAh
14:57.21LuliaAnd then clear that after?
14:57.25Arrowmasteryeah
14:58.30LuliaNow I just need to look through FrameXML for the name of the chat edit box
14:58.31Lulialol
14:58.50Arrowmasteryou have to have a frame to to use override bindings because thats the first argument, so just make it a button and use SetOverrideBindingClick but dont set the OnClick to do anything
14:58.56kneekiMorning Everyone!
14:58.56alestane/framestack might make you life easier.
14:59.04LuliaHmm
14:59.15LuliaTrue
15:00.20LuliaMy Youtube channel's insight seems to be broken :(
15:00.26LuliaI think I broke 60k views though
15:01.41LuliaHmm, this log-in is taking an unusually long time
15:02.10LegorolHas anyone else noticed strange, small floating hourglass-looking things in the game in capital cities?
15:02.28LegorolThey are at ground level, in various corners, and have a swirling maelstrom inside them instead of sand
15:02.34LegorolI saw one in SW bank and mage quarter for example
15:02.58LegorolDefinitely something new, doesn't look like it's just a glitch
15:02.59LuliaThey're part of the pre-cata event
15:06.47alestaneThere's a quest line that explains them.
15:06.57LuliaSomething is definitely wrong with my log-in
15:07.07LuliaIt "loads" up and just sits there
15:07.20LuliaIf the server was restarting it would just d/c me, no?
15:13.21LopeppeppyDepends on how much it hates you, Lulia?
15:13.31LopeppeppyToday being Tuesday, all bets are off.
15:13.52Ackisat least it's not a manic monday
15:14.01LopeppeppyWish it were a Sunday.
15:14.23Ackiswin
15:14.30alestaneI had to wait like eight minutes looking at a filled bar before, Lulia.
15:16.25Lulialol, the login took so long that may character was away by the time I got in
15:16.35Lulia>.>
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15:22.47SpejnarAnyone seen any blue posts about servers for cata? new ones/merging low pop and so on? Feels like cata is a good time to do stuff like that
15:23.01Cidesup guys
15:23.54durcynthey already rearranged two battlegroups ,Spejnar, i wouldn't expect much of that to happen with the actual release
15:23.56LuliaHey there, Cide
15:24.25alestaneThere's usually enough strain on the infrastructure with actual releases as it is.
15:24.30Spejnardurcyn: kinda sucks when the expansion more or less encurages rerolling :/
15:24.40Spejnarencourages*
15:24.47durcynwhat does that have to do with anything
15:24.55LopeppeppyThere's always an "artificial" overload in December/January, with expansion and students home from college/vacations, etc.  I remember them re-balancing in the late winter last time
15:26.42Ackisso I reported people in trade/guild chat last night :|
15:26.51Cidethat's low!
15:26.55AckisI know
15:27.04cbreak_worktrade I can understand... but guild?
15:27.12cbreak_workaren't you all family?
15:27.39Cidenot anymore!
15:27.44Ackisa) I hate my guild b) I said I reported the two people in trade chat for using racial/homophobic comments in guild chat so one idiot in guild chat started doing it himself :P
15:28.24cbreak_workyou should leave
15:28.30cbreak_workno point being in a guild you don't like
15:28.37cbreak_worknot like they pay you
15:28.39AckisI won't be there come cataclysm :P
15:29.10Cidehe's staying so he can report as many fukkers as possible
15:29.15AckisI'm not getting anything out of the guild really, hell I hate the server I only transfered because the fiancee used to be from there and has a couple RL friends
15:29.15Cidegotta pull dem fukkers in
15:30.09LuliaHow odd
15:30.20Ackisreports Cide
15:30.33LuliaSetting a ChatFrame1EditBox OnEditFocusGained event makes it act wierd when you click on it
15:30.49LuliaLike, it gains focus, but remains "ghosted" and the cursor has an odd start position
15:31.12Cidecould be that you're overriding the default handler
15:31.23LuliaThose were my thoughts too, hmm
15:31.28LuliaI'll check it out in FrameXML
15:31.31LuliaThanks, Cide
15:35.19Ackiswasn't the election yesterday in the US?
15:35.47Bapsit is today
15:36.04Bapsso you've got another week of hand-wringing from whomever loses and then things should taper off a bit
15:36.07cbreak_workelection?
15:36.09cbreak_workwho?
15:36.26cbreak_workah well, no matter, americans are so slow, they take three months to find out who won anyway...
15:36.30LopeppeppyToday, silly Ackis.
15:37.03AckisLopeppeppy: I'm Canadian :P
15:37.53LuliaAdding ChatEdit_ActivateChat(self); fromt FrameXML\ChatFrame.lua fixed it
15:38.06DagmarAckis: Don't you worry.  Someday they'll find a cure.
15:38.17Dagmar:)
15:38.33Ackis:P
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15:40.36LuliaArrowmaster: You there?
15:40.41Arrowmasteryes
15:42.16LuliaHow might I go about doing the noop mentioned earlier? Do I just put nil in for the command value?
15:43.02Arrowmasteri would just create a button that doesnt do anything when clicked
15:43.12Arrowmasterand use SetOverrideBindingClick
15:43.21TC-Workmmm...noop
15:43.36Arrowmasternoop noop noop nom
15:46.08Lopeppeppynoms Cogwheel's work.
15:46.08Maldiviadoom doom doom doom
15:46.42cog|workLopeppeppy: it's good noms. Very drunkifying
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15:54.55Ackisblizzard sucks even more today
15:55.08DWSRhey, where's taint.log/
15:55.17Ackisbetween your balls and your asshole
15:55.26DWSRYou are so funny [/sarcasm]
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15:57.11AckisI wonder what blizzard will do if I put in a fraud complaint on my credit card against them
15:57.22DagmarTempban your account.
15:57.31Ackisit's for blizzard store items
15:57.37Lopeppeppycog|work, I know.  *weg*
15:59.37pompyDWSR: in teh logs folder?
16:00.15DWSRnot there, do I have to turn on taint logging?
16:00.57LuliaHmm
16:01.01LuliaOnKeyDown is not firing
16:01.12LuliaEven though ChatFrame1EditBox is of the appropriate FrameStrata
16:01.15*** join/#wowuidev stolenlegacy (~stolenleg@chello084115137250.5.graz.surfer.at)
16:01.40LuliaHowever, I didn't register it...
16:03.36TC-WorkAckis: that just taint right
16:03.43LuliaAlright, even with EnableKeyboard set to true it's still not recognizing OnKeyDown
16:04.16Ackis~dict fraud
16:04.48Lulia?
16:05.26Ackisme?
16:06.16LuliaDo the ChatFrame edit boxes have some sort of protection on them that disallows OnKeyDown?
16:07.06Lulia>.>
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16:08.49Maldiviaare you sure it's chatframe1editbox ?
16:08.57LuliaPositive
16:09.04LuliaI've used all sorts of print statements to confirm
16:09.10LuliaWith focus gained and lost
16:09.15Maldiviaok, because they changed it with3.3.5
16:09.16LuliaSo I know I have the right box
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16:10.09cog|workstation
16:10.10Lunessastation
16:10.11LuliaAnd it's definitely being set the KeyboardEnabled
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16:10.19LuliaI just checked that with a print
16:10.33LuliaIt's still not registering OnKeyDown though
16:11.41Maldiviaonkeydown fires if the editbox has focus snd you type something
16:12.05LuliaBut it's not, that's the issue :(
16:12.17cog|workhttp://hyperboleandahalf.blogspot.com/2010/11/news-update-dramatic-montage-and-video.html
16:12.30Luliahttp://paste.wowace.com/2773/
16:12.40LuliaThat's what I have for the script
16:12.40Maldiviaand you're setting it correxctly ?
16:14.15Maldiviawell, they might get iverridden by yhe default ui code... have you chrcked that ?
16:14.24LuliaHow would I?
16:14.51Maldivia<PROTECTED>
16:15.21Maldiviaor look in framexml code
16:16.07Maldiviaanother addon night also set the script, there are plenty of ways it could go wrong
16:17.27Maldiviaor that script type might not apply, check the widget reference
16:17.35LuliaHmm, the dump info doesn't mean much to me
16:17.50LuliaTrying to read it, but I'm not sure I know how >.>
16:18.02LuliaThere shouldn't be any other addons interacting with the chat frame
16:18.15LuliaOnKeyDown definitely applies to edit boxes, which this is.
16:18.49Maldiviatried with onkeypress or onchar ?
16:19.06DagmarLulia: http://evgenya.wordpress.com/2008/06/02/wow-addon-russian-translit/
16:19.07Maldivia(I think they are called)
16:19.22LuliaYeah, I found that Dagmar
16:19.35LuliaBut there was no explanation for why it would be, so they could have been simply not doing it correctly too
16:19.41LuliaI suppose I could ask on the Blizz forums
16:19.57LuliaI dont think OnChar will work for what I want
16:20.04LuliaSince it's supposed to look for arrowkeys
16:20.13LuliaOnKeyPRess might
16:20.16Maldiviacursorchanged
16:20.45LuliaThough OnKeyPress doesn't seem to be on the list
16:21.02MaldiviaThere is a script type for ehen the caret posituon changes
16:21.07DagmarMy guess is that it's not terribly useful to actually have a hook for OnKeyDown there unless you plan on adding a spellchecker
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16:21.24Maldiviacheck blizzards code, see how they handle it
16:21.28LuliaI'm just making a simple script to allow me to move the cursor with my arrow keys, Dagmar
16:21.42LuliaBlizzard doesn't offer it in the default UI
16:21.46Maldiviaalt+arroe keys
16:21.47LuliaThat's why I'm adding it :D
16:21.52DagmarShouldn't that _already_ work because it's an editobox?
16:21.52LuliaOh?
16:21.55Maldiviamoves the cursor
16:22.09LuliaI didnt know that
16:22.10Lulia>.>
16:22.17LuliaNow I have to figure out how Blizzard does it
16:22.20Luliaraaaawwwwwrrrr
16:22.23DagmarInterestin'
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16:22.58mikmaHAHA
16:23.05mikmayour name has been flagged for rename
16:23.08Maldiviaalt up/down is history
16:23.21LuliaI'm pretty bad at searching through FrameXML
16:23.33Maldiviaalt left/right is caret pos
16:23.46Maldiviasearch for IsAlt
16:24.00Maldiviashould probably narrow it down
16:24.27LuliaWell, apparently my text editor's file search option is pretty bad
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16:24.59Maldiviagrep is your friend ;)
16:25.16LuliaDont know how to use it ;) But my editor did find IsAlt
16:25.17Lulia:D
16:25.40LuliaIT's for cast sequence though
16:25.41Lulia....
16:25.50Maldiviaheh
16:25.51Lulia:(
16:26.05Maldiviaalt is used for more than the editbox
16:26.06LuliaWhat does CastSequence have to do with the chat frame?
16:26.07Luliableh
16:26.19LuliaIt's in ChatFrame.lua
16:26.27Maldiviamacros are inthere
16:27.05LuliaHmm
16:27.23LuliaI just did a search for "Alt"
16:27.28Lulia1090 occurrences in FrameXML
16:27.29Luliaomg
16:28.08Maldiviawell, that will get you alot, alternarive etc
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16:33.22Luliafml, I can't find this
16:33.24Lulia>.>
16:33.53Maldiviait's also a bit of a cheat actually :)
16:34.09Lulia?
16:34.41LuliaWhat is?
16:35.14Maldiviabecause it's not dont with code
16:35.40MaldiviaChatEdit:SetIgnoreArrows(true/false)
16:36.00Lulia>.>
16:36.03Maldiviait's build into the widget
16:36.25LuliaThat's not on WoWPedia
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16:36.40Luliawowprogramming?
16:36.55cog|work!api setignore
16:36.55lua_botCould not find a match for 'setignore'.
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16:37.29LuliaNot finding in a file search of FrameXML
16:37.40Maldiviafrom patch notes 1.7: EditBox:SetIgnoreArrows([isIgnored]) (Defaults to true)
16:37.40DWSR~api ignore
16:37.40purlhttp://www.wowwiki.com/API_ignore
16:37.45DWSR!api ignore
16:37.45lua_botFound 16 possible matches for 'ignore'.  Please be more specific
16:39.11LuliaHmm
16:39.12Maldiviafunny that the widget function never has been documented anywhere :)
16:39.21LuliaHow did you find it?
16:39.46Maldivialooked in ChatFrame.xml, saw ignoreArrows="true" on ChatFrameEditBoxTemplate
16:40.02LuliaHmm
16:40.09LuliaThat's why I couldnt find SetIgnoreArrows
16:40.14LuliaThey do it in XML
16:40.29Maldiviaand since there's a setter for all attributes, there should be an EditBox:SetIgnoreArrows(bool)
16:40.44Maldiviasearched for that, and patch notes for 1.7 popped up
16:40.50Lulia:P
16:41.03LuliaWell if I can get it to work in the game, I'll document it on WoWPedia
16:41.13Maldiviahehe, already begun that :)
16:41.16Lulia:P
16:41.32Maldiviabut if you want to, feel free
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16:41.52LuliaYou're amazing ;)
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16:43.35Computerpunk_dayum
16:43.38Computerpunk_boring to do Kalu'ak.
16:44.05zenzelezzperhaps
16:44.12zenzelezzbut Kalu'ak seemed to go really fast for me
16:44.27Computerpunk_It goes fast.
16:44.29foxlitKalu'ak is a fixed time investment. You get what, 1k/day?
16:44.34DagmarEasier to do those while you're in the area questing other things
16:44.35Computerpunk_1.5k
16:44.38Computerpunk_per day.
16:44.43MaldiviaLulia: hmm, but it appears the function has been removed again...?
16:44.54Computerpunk_but 1 quest is in Borean Tundra, one in Dragonblight, one Howling Fjord.
16:45.34MaldiviaLulia: which could be the reason it's not documented :)
16:46.26LuliaYeah
16:46.32LuliaI just got a nil value error on it
16:48.00Lulialol
16:48.04*** join/#wowuidev stolenlegacy|lap (~stolenleg@chello084115137250.5.graz.surfer.at)
16:48.06LuliaI just got the scroll wheel to work on it
16:48.13LuliaSo I can scroll through the chat text
16:48.14Lulia:D
16:48.45LuliaNow if only the mouse didnt have ot hover over the box for that to work
16:48.46Lulia>.>
16:49.04*** join/#wowuidev NiLon (nilon@62-113-191-177.bb.dnainternet.fi)
16:49.11*** join/#wowuidev NiLon (nilon@unaffiliated/nilon)
16:49.35Maldiviaalt-up/down works for history
16:51.42LuliaRight
16:51.56LuliaBut I didnt know alt-left/right scrolled through text
16:52.07LuliaStill, I'd rather use the normal arrow keys, but that may be impossible
16:52.13Luliasince OnKeyDown just doesn't work with it
16:53.02Maldiviacreate your own chat edit box, and don't specify "ignore keys"
16:53.30Maldiviaand since you don't like xml, apparently you can't specify it :)
16:54.35LuliaBut how does my own chatedit box replace the default one?
16:56.32LuliaHmm
16:56.39LuliaI could overlay it over the current one I guess
16:56.50LuliaAnd have it show and hide when the other one gains focus, switching focus to it.
16:59.14LuliaBut, by-the-by, is it possible to have a mousewheel event work on a frame that the cursor isn't positioned over?
16:59.32alestaneYou'd handle that as a binding.
17:00.00LuliaHmm
17:00.13LuliaSo I could bind it to an invisible button with setbindoverrideclick?
17:00.22LuliaAnd have the invisible button perform actions...
17:00.45DWSR!api GetActiveTalentGroup()
17:00.45lua_botGetActiveTalentGroup: Returns the index of the active talent specialization (http://wowprogramming.com/docs/api/GetActiveTalentGroup)
17:01.05alestaneYeah, you can bind mousewheel and modkey+mousewheel combinations. The default UI binds Shift+Mousewheel to cycling through action bars.
17:02.11LuliaHmm
17:02.21LuliaSetOverrideBinding specifically specifies a key
17:02.30Luliadoes MOUSEWHEEL count as a key in this instance?
17:04.16alestaneTake a look at your bindings-cache.wtf file to see what it expects you to give it.
17:06.31Luliauuuuuuuh
17:06.38alestane!api SetOverrideBindingClick
17:06.38lua_botSetOverrideBindingClick: Sets an override binding to "click" a Button object (http://wowprogramming.com/docs/api/SetOverrideBindingClick)
17:06.40LuliaDont see mousewheel in here
17:07.04MoonWitchis gon na eat and watch Halloween
17:07.18MoonWitchholds Cairenns hands
17:07.28MoonWitchalso why are there two cairenns in the room?
17:07.39alestaneFor example, SetOverrideBindingClick(frame, true, "MOUSEWHEELUP", "myButton", "WheelUp")
17:08.00Luliahehehe, MOUSEWHEELUP is was my guess
17:08.04Luliawas*
17:08.07alestaneI only see the one, MoonWitch...try refreshing your room list.
17:08.07LuliaSo I'm going to try it
17:08.16*** join/#wowuidev Codayus (~cody@web154.webfaction.com)
17:09.08LopeppeppyCan never have too much Cairenn.  :)
17:09.26cairennthere's two mes?
17:09.51LuliaPoor Cairenn
17:10.00cairennis confused
17:10.02LuliaWhy is Cairenn no purple anymore?
17:10.04*** join/#wowuidev kaiden^ (~kaiden@c-98-247-162-75.hsd1.wa.comcast.net)
17:10.08alestaneEIther we have an impostor, or unlooked-for bounty.
17:10.25cairennwait, what?
17:10.32cairennno, really, I'm confused beyond words
17:10.35Luliadooooooooooooolby
17:10.50Ackismakes cairenn sing.
17:11.00alestaneI dunno, cairenn, when I do a whois it says your real name is "purple".
17:11.14LuliaWell yes, there's that.
17:11.21LuliaBut her name isn't purple on my Pidgin
17:11.22alestanesec
17:11.24*** part/#wowuidev alestane (~alestane@c-66-30-209-28.hsd1.ma.comcast.net)
17:11.28LuliaIt's light green
17:11.28*** join/#wowuidev alestane (~alestane@c-66-30-209-28.hsd1.ma.comcast.net)
17:11.28*** mode/#wowuidev [+v alestane] by ChanServ
17:11.30Fiskerslaps cairenn around a bit with a large trout
17:11.36Fiskerlowercase cairenn
17:11.40Lulia~lart Fisker
17:11.40purltakes out Fisker with the trash
17:11.44Fiskeryou're like the bearded evil twin from star trek
17:12.04LuliaPuuuuuuuuuuurple
17:13.05LunessaThere can be only one!
17:13.35*** join/#wowuidev Srosh (~Srosh@d178073.adsl.hansenet.de)
17:13.45LuliaI think we scared Cairenn
17:14.27Ackisthat's pretty much unpossible
17:14.27LunessaIf you think that nonsense scares her, you've got no idea how fierce she really is!
17:14.45zenzelezzCairenn's not purple, she's orange
17:15.21KarlKFI|workgreen imo
17:15.22Fiskernonsense?
17:15.28Ackisshe's a purple people eater
17:15.34FiskerEvil Twin from alternate universes is very serious
17:15.42Cairennbut I have 2 eyes!
17:15.44Cairennso I can't be
17:15.48Cairennwhat?
17:15.57LuliaNow you're light bue
17:15.59Luliablue*
17:16.27LopeppeppyLight blue two eyed flying goddess spaghetti monster?
17:17.42*** join/#wowuidev NiLon (nilon@unaffiliated/nilon)
17:17.58DWSRof doom.
17:18.16cog|workhttp://lbrandy.com/blog/2010/11/using-genetic-algorithms-to-find-starcraft-2-build-orders/
17:18.16LunessaOk, this has gone on long enough.  I'm the only one around here allowed sleep-deprivation to the point of hallucination, so the rest of you are getting a nap, stat!  :P
17:18.22Fiskersup cog|work
17:18.39cog|worksoup Fisker
17:18.41CairennLopeppeppy: but I'm not blue eyed?
17:19.01Fiskersoup?
17:19.24cog|workmmmmm sooouuup
17:19.45LuliaHmm, these buttons are not being clicked
17:20.38Shirik"Zerg also have a third de factor resource: larva."
17:20.40Shirikde factor?
17:20.43LopeppeppyLunessa, any time you want to help me sleep, show me the way to the pillow, baby.
17:20.56LopeppeppyI think I was calling you a Smurf instead, Cairenn.  :)
17:21.02Fiskeryeah Shirik
17:21.04Fiskerde factor
17:21.07Cairennwhat?
17:21.17Lopeppeppy"light blue" instead of "blue eyed"
17:21.22Cairennokay
17:21.43LunessaLopeppeppy: I'll help you 'sleep' - bow chikka bow bow
17:22.00KarlKFI|workShirik: i noticed that too. prolly spellcheck to blame... doesn't knwo latin
17:22.30DWSRKarlKFI: I doubt it.
17:22.42KarlKFI|workyou can dont it all you want!
17:22.48KarlKFI|workor doubt it even
17:24.08LopeppeppyBring it dude, the Woodchuck doesn't cut it anymore.
17:25.09LuliaSetOverrideBindingClick(self, false, "LEFT", "ChatManager_Buttons_MoveCursorDn", "LEFT");
17:25.38LuliaThat should, in theory, put a left click on the ChatManager_Buttons_MoveCursorDn button when the left key is pressed, yes?
17:25.51LuliaFor the frame referenced by self
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17:27.31TorhalLopeppeppy: That's because you said "Woodchuck" instead of "Curevo Black".
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17:27.51TorhalCuervo. Damn these fingers!
17:29.13Lunessamassages Lopeppeppy's shoulders and gives her a turkey sammich.
17:29.20cog|workShirik: it was a typor
17:29.39syrae!!!!
17:29.48syraeLunessa: why does Lopeppeppy get massages?!?
17:30.13Lunessa'cause I'm totally flirting with her, and have been for years?
17:30.34syraeman, what do I have to do to get some flirts around here?
17:31.11Lunessa... Is this where I say "tits or gtfo"?  And get a ban?
17:31.22syraeLunessa: it's a trap!
17:31.25syrae^_^
17:32.31*** join/#wowuidev Yoshimo (~Miranda@p54998188.dip0.t-ipconnect.de)
17:33.15Fiskerarmed cog|work
17:33.57syraeSo, anyone else having problems with the World Event questline on their realms?  On Alliance side, we can't get Cho'gall to show up and do his speech bit outside of Stormwind.
17:34.03syraeThe NPCs are just stuck
17:34.30syraeand I heard rumors that they had to constantly reboot the PTR because of it
17:36.45Lulia(1:25:01 PM) Lulia: SetOverrideBindingClick(self, false, "LEFT", "ChatManager_Buttons_MoveCursorDn", "LEFT"); (1:25:30 PM) Lulia: That should, in theory, put a left click on the ChatManager_Buttons_MoveCursorDn button when the left key is pressed, yes?
17:36.59LuliaAnd I havent heard anything about it, Syrae
17:37.10*** join/#wowuidev stolenlegacy (~stolenleg@chello084115137250.5.graz.surfer.at)
17:37.27alestaneChange the second "LEFT" to "LeftButton" or leave it out entirely and it'll work like you describe.
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17:40.39LuliaIt didn't work though, alestane
17:40.41Luliawhich was odd
17:41.01LuliaI tried: SetOverrideBindingClick(self, false, "LEFT", "ChatManager_Buttons_MoveCursorDn");
17:41.32LuliaWith the button defined: http://paste.wowace.com/2774/
17:41.37LuliaAnd nada
17:42.48Luliahttp://www.collegehumor.com/video:1943183 lol
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17:53.15LuliaToday is just not my day :(
17:54.35*** join/#wowuidev farmbuyer (~farmbuyer@74.83.0.226)
17:55.43Dumanhmm
17:56.10Lulia?
17:57.00cog|workLulia: Duman just hmms randomly from time to time. Pay it no mind.
17:57.02cog|work<.<
17:57.11cog|work~poke Duman
17:57.11purlACTION cuts down a small tree, sneaks up behind Duman, pokes Duman repeatedly, hilarity ensues.
17:59.39LuliaWow... not enough people use my AddOn
17:59.40Fiskerhey cog|work
17:59.42Fiskerare you awesome?
17:59.44LuliaI just found a major bug
17:59.48LuliaAnd no one reported it :(
18:00.18foxlitThat's a good thing
18:00.26farmbuyerIf you "accidentally" package up some pr0n with the addon, it will get a lot more downloads.
18:03.35Luliafoxlit: It just means no one uses it
18:03.39Cairennif you package up some pr0n with the addon, accidentally or otherwise, it won't get any downloads on WoWI, since it won't be approved until it's removed
18:03.56LuliaLeast not DKs
18:04.09LuliaThe bug specifically auto-disabled the Rune frame for DKs
18:04.13farmbuyerjoking!  joking!  :-p
18:04.15foxlitSo no users were harmed by your incompetence. Rejoice! :)
18:04.19LuliaWhich would certainly be annoying enough to get it reported
18:04.20Lulia:P
18:04.50LuliaCairenn. I can has tag system on WoWInterface plz?
18:05.04Cairenntag system?
18:05.15*** join/#wowuidev Zyn (~faggotry@h187n4-av-a11.ias.bredband.telia.com)
18:05.23Fiskerwhat if it's just torrents with pr0n Cairenn ?
18:05.40*** join/#wowuidev Kalroth (kalroth@3e6bacb5.rev.stofanet.dk)
18:06.24LuliaLike, settings tags for AddOns for searches
18:06.44Luliafor instance, my AddOn does Holy Power for peeps, but since Holy Power isn't in the name, it won't turn up on a search for "Holy Power"
18:07.44Cairennhttp://www.wowinterface.com/find.php <== description
18:08.23*** join/#wowuidev Dajova (dajova@s83-177-178-104.cust.tele2.se)
18:08.40LuliaBut if I type Holy Power in there
18:08.46LuliaOh
18:08.52Luliaoops
18:08.54Cairenn:)
18:09.10LuliaOh hey, mine's at the top of the list too
18:09.13Lulia:P
18:09.51LuliaMaybe mine is at the top because it's me
18:09.54LuliaHmm
18:10.05LopeppeppyNope, it's top for me too.  Perhaps by date-last-updated?
18:10.33LuliaPossibly
18:10.34Lulia:)
18:10.37Fiskerhey Lopeppeppy
18:10.50Fiskeryou have huge toes
18:10.50LuliaHmm, but the default search is always by title, Cairenn?
18:11.00LopeppeppyYes I do, Fisker, but tiny feet.
18:11.11*** join/#wowuidev RJohn (~Tanner@h123.65.149.24.cable.rdwd.jetbroadband.com)
18:12.38LuliaHmm, a tag system could still be useful. Since tags are meant to draw specific attention, a "tag" option for search could be default along with title without giving undesired results.
18:12.47LuliaJust a suggestion :)
18:14.31Dajovahttp://screenshot.xfire.com/s/106315919-4.jpg suggestions about the new layout?
18:14.52LuliaWhy are the unit frames up so high?
18:15.04Dajovawell, i like them there, easier to notice
18:15.09Cidewhy do you only support something like 5 buffs?
18:15.16LopeppeppyWhat goes to left and right of action bars?
18:15.22LuliaHmm, but what if something is there that you need to click?
18:15.27Lopeppeppy(and why did you open yourself up!  :)  )
18:15.48Dajova>_>
18:15.53LuliaUI preference is highly subjective :P
18:16.02LopeppeppyYup yup.
18:16.06LuliaI mean, we could go into details of wasted space, etc...
18:16.08Dajovawell exactly
18:16.11LuliaBut maybe you like it that way
18:16.24Dajovappl like it, i like it, so it's all good
18:16.59LuliaThe main issue I have with anything in the center of my screen is that something could be beneath it that I need to click
18:17.00Dajovathat's the heal layout btw, dps layout is way different :P
18:17.08LuliaOtherwise I'd probably have my unit frames around there too
18:17.16Dajovai use clique if i need to click anything
18:17.25Dajovalike a res or dispel
18:17.32LuliaI meant a unit model
18:17.36LuliaLike if I was tanking
18:17.44LuliaAnd I had to grab a mob that aggroed on to someone else
18:17.45Lulia:P
18:17.50LunessaFor example, to me, that feels dark and as if it were cluttering my view.  I would remove the animated portraiture to save space/cpu cycles and reconsider just how much of those broker reports you /really/ need on the screen.
18:17.53Dajovai tab that :)
18:18.14Luliatab is just so slow at times
18:18.18Dajovawell, im not into minimalism
18:18.37LuliaI actually find I'm really bothered by not having unit portraits
18:18.38Lulia>.>
18:19.05Dajovawell, i have mana/hp on the same panel as the portraits
18:19.14Dajovaso its not wasted space
18:19.16LunessaAnd you put WAY more buttons on the screen than I would.  But  it's all subjective.  If it works for you, it works for you.  It wouldn't work for me.
18:19.38Dajovawell sorry for not using opie or maccaron :(
18:19.47Dajovaim not a pvp nerd ;P
18:20.20Dajovaits just my edit of tukui and i like it that way :)
18:20.30LopeppeppyYou asked, Dajova.  You were bound to get input you didn't like.  :P
18:20.49LunessaRight, but now you're defensive.  So what you really wanted was "OMG SO KAWAII!!" and not honest opinions. :)
18:20.54Dajovawell, you did... just not the way i was expecting :P
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18:21.40LunessaMost people do that with things of which they are proud.  They want confirmation, not critique. :)
18:21.57Dajovawell, that ive already gotten :o
18:22.21Dajovajust wanted to check if the tot/focus/pet frames was ok placed
18:22.22DajovaxD
18:22.32Dajovacause that's what im sowkring on atm
18:22.35Dajova*working
18:23.02Ackisok my hate for blizzard has decreased
18:23.05LuliaI usually push the target frame buff to the side
18:23.10Ackisand I just looked at the sun and am partially blind right now :(
18:23.12LuliaAnd stack ToT on top of the target
18:23.13farmbuyerWhat are the small boxes running down the side of the chat window on the left, Dajova?  I can make out "Hud"-something and what looks like "Primary" at the bottom.
18:23.15LunessaDid they fix your billing issue Ackis?
18:23.26AckisLunessa: yeah refunded shipping for one of the orders
18:23.51durcyni am angry with them in your stead, Ackis, they are unable to competently handle adding a CE key for a previous expansion without losing their minds
18:24.00LuliaI cant get SetOverrideBindingClick to click a button for me
18:24.02Lulia:-/
18:24.13farmbuyermy browser isn't scaling the image properly, so all the text in the image is about 3 pixels high :-)
18:24.36DajovaLulia, that would collide on the class timers i have :)
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18:25.06Dajovafarmbuyer, that's customized look of Fortress with LDB addons
18:25.22Ackisdurcyn: they laughed at me on the phone when they handled my vanilla CE key
18:25.27Dajovathose that i use anyway, its not in the package itself
18:25.27Ackisnot a good laugh either
18:25.38durcyni wish i could fucking find a vanilla CE anymore
18:25.51durcynthere was one on ebay for $1200 last week, not sure i want to pay quite that much
18:26.20LunessaI'm just glad I have my red whelpling and don't have to farm up a new one.
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18:27.52LopeppeppyI farmed for that for sooooooo long.  *le sigh*
18:29.09Ackishttp://i53.tinypic.com/2wg54lg.jpg vs http://i51.tinypic.com/2u8gmkk.jpg (do the math on the second pic and compare it to the price on the first one)
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18:31.20LuliaHmm
18:32.02AckisI'm pretty sure I was in the right bitching about that
18:32.22LuliaI wish I could see who had my AddOn as a favorite
18:32.23Lulia:P
18:32.42Nexiuzhehe same :)
18:33.09Fiskeryou're a bad person Ackis
18:33.18Ackisduh
18:35.55nicoli_shes just canadian
18:36.03LunessaLOL - "But monogamy does not preclude promiscuity, as exemplified by married footballers."  - http://www.independent.co.uk/news/science/the-science-of-women-and-sex-is-stephen-fry-right-after-all-2122625.html
18:36.52FiskerLOL - "Lunessa"
18:36.56Ackisnicoli_s: :(
18:36.59Ackisafk 4 life
18:37.03DagmarWords are hard.
18:38.08LopeppeppyFry needs to be fried.
18:39.23Lulia|AFKSummary of that article: Women need to be selective and look for Males that can commit. Males look to collect as many women as possible and keep them to themselves?
18:39.26Fiskerwomen doesn't know how to computer
18:39.28Lulia|AFK:P
18:39.36Lulia|AFKAnyways, AFK, off to grab an application
18:40.54Fiskerisn't that right Lopeppeppy ?
18:41.58LopeppeppyFisker, I certainly know how to smack you upside the head with a computer.  Wanna stop over for lunch and find out?
18:41.58alestaneLulia: Recently read a book called "Sex at Dawn" that refers to that principle as the "standard narrative" of so-called evolutionary psychology...but also contests it heavily. Worth a scan.
18:42.16Fiskertrue
18:42.18LopeppeppyLike in all subjects, the "history" is subjective.  :)
18:43.20FiskerDoes your lunch pack a mean punch or can i expect the same levels of punch as your smackdown?
18:43.27Fiskerhoho
18:43.54rocodeLulia, so girls are looking for guys with SVN experience?
18:44.06Dagmar*snicker*
18:44.34LunessaLopeppeppy: Fry says he was making a joke (typical of his style of humor) and the article goes on to discuss the different imperatives seemingly called for by biology.   I was amused at the dig at soccer players.
18:46.51Fiskerhttp://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NNHdo4zExL4 <-imma make salad for you Lopeppeppy
18:48.27LopeppeppyJoke.  Ha ha.  It is to laugh.  *grump*
18:48.35Fisker:O
18:48.53Lopeppeppyi was talking to Lunessa, not you, Fisker.  I can't watch videos at work, so yours is wasted salad.
18:49.23LunessaLopeppeppy: *hug*
18:49.49LopeppeppyI think I ran out of manic, huh?
18:51.03Ackisso hot
18:51.04Ackis:(
18:51.19CairennLopeppeppy: I can give you some of mine, if you really want it.  I seem to have an extreme overabundance of it atm
18:51.33Ackisoverabundance is putting it mildly
18:52.02LopeppeppyI had some this morning, Cairenn, then I ran out of stored-up-sleeps.  If you bottle it and send it FedEx, I should get it time for tomorrow!
18:52.09syraeheh
18:52.25syraeis running on sugar and caffiene
18:52.39AckisArrowmaster: the rank cap is getting updated today in halo reach
18:52.50Arrowmasteri havent touched reach in like a month
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18:53.13Computerpunk_is only my curse client bugged?
18:53.18Computerpunk_that wow list isn't refreshing?
18:55.05LunessaI hereby invite all attractive and sleep-deprived females to my place.  We'll all be sleep-deprived together. :)
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18:55.24LunessaI have cards, and board games.
18:55.26Fiskerhate Lopeppeppy
18:55.32Fiskeryou should be able to watch videos at work
18:55.36CairennLunessa: lol
18:56.09LopeppeppySounds good, Lunessa, we'll start driving and be there next week?
18:56.30LunessaI'll make up the guest beds.  *eyebrow waggle*
18:56.41Lopeppeppy... not coming then.
18:57.07Lopeppeppy*wink wink nudge nudge*
18:57.16AckisLopeppeppy: when Lunessa said that, you missed his gesture of straightening his pants
18:57.54LunessaLopeppeppy: There's only one 'guest' bed, it's the one I entertain 'guests' in. *wink*
18:57.55*** join/#wowuidev Srosh_ (~Srosh@d070013.adsl.hansenet.de)
18:59.38LopeppeppyAh, excellent.  I steals your pillow!
18:59.48LunessaI has a spare. )
19:00.01Cairennnot if you've got more than one 'guest', you don't
19:00.31Cairennsteals the other pillow
19:01.23LopeppeppyYuh-huh.  You're SOL, Lunessa!  :P
19:01.24FiskerTHIEF!
19:01.25Lunessadoesn't need pillows!
19:01.36Lunessahas guests to keep him occupied!
19:01.37*** join/#wowuidev sylvanaar (~sylvanaar@unaffiliated/sylvanaar)
19:01.37cog|workhe'll have four new ones by my reckoning
19:01.53Ackiswin
19:02.35Cairennchuckles at cog|work
19:02.38LopeppeppyI wasn't gonna go there, cog|work.  :)  Thanks for taking me along, kicking and screaming!
19:02.43*** join/#wowuidev Gintaro (~gintaro@harm.osso.nl)
19:02.49cog|work*wegg*
19:02.54Lunessabasks in the glow.
19:02.55cog|work(wickedly evil gnome grin)
19:03.00Lunessaalso goes to a meeting.
19:03.16*** join/#wowuidev Droolio (~drool@87-194-188-170.bethere.co.uk)
19:03.16Ackisthere's an achievement for killing 50 gnomes in Fable 3
19:03.25Ackiseverytime I shoot one I think of cog|work
19:03.32cog|work=)
19:03.58FiskerAckis
19:04.01Fiskeri have seen your heart
19:04.16Ackisyou have?
19:04.17cog|workFisker: did you go on a field trip to the sewage treatment plant too?
19:04.55Ackis:(
19:05.13Fiskeryes cog|work
19:07.03AckisFisker: http://www.albertahealthservices.ca/3061.asp
19:10.30Cidegood to know
19:10.34Fiskerdamn you can color your shit?
19:10.38*** join/#wowuidev stolenlegacy (~stolenleg@chello084115137250.5.graz.surfer.at)
19:10.39Fiskerif only i knew
19:13.02*** join/#wowuidev tekkub (~tekkub@WoWUIDev/WoWI/Featured/Dongle/GitHub/Tekkub)
19:13.02*** mode/#wowuidev [+v tekkub] by ChanServ
19:16.24*** join/#wowuidev Xinhuan (~xinhuan@WoWUIDev/WoWAce/xinhuan)
19:25.45TC-WorkFisker: you can be very american in your crap
19:26.08Ackisthat was a really low insult TC-Work
19:26.46TC-WorkAckis: to whom?
19:27.06Ackisto Fisker
19:27.09Ackiscalling him an american
19:27.14Ackisyou go too far!
19:27.19TC-Worki did not call him an american
19:27.21TC-WorkL2Read
19:31.54Lunessameetings.  Do not want.
19:32.44alestaneThey must be good for something. Or at least have the potential to be.
19:33.44*** join/#wowuidev Sliker (~ponies@5ad247f2.bb.sky.com)
19:35.20Fiskeris it you alestane ?
19:35.56LopeppeppyNope, alestane.
19:36.04alestaneDo I even want to know what you think might be me?
19:36.42alestaneOn the other hand, Lopeppeppy, I did finally see "Office Space" coming back from BlizzCon.
19:37.09zenzelezzwhat was Office Space doing at Blizzcon?
19:37.09LunessaYeah, I just think I'm not going to go any more.
19:37.53LunessaWe're putting the coversheet on top of the TPS reports.  I'm going to see that you get another copy of that memo.
19:38.30alestaneA friend who swore I needed to see it lent me the UMD while I was going away, zenzelezz.
19:39.37*** join/#wowuidev Volaan (~chatzilla@c-68-47-82-101.hsd1.ga.comcast.net)
19:40.23LunessaIt is one of the films that really taps into the roots of modern office culture.
19:40.55Volaanoffice space?
19:41.42alestaneThe futility..the lack of incentive.
19:41.50farmbuyerBlizzard needs to put a red stapler into the game, somewhere.
19:42.04alestaneThe inability to get anyone to hear you if you stammer quietly.
19:42.19LunessaAnd I said, "No.  No. No salt on the margarita1"
19:43.25alestaneI'm never sure if I feel sorry for Milton or not.
19:44.07alestaneHe's sort of a born Charlie Brown, but he's also kind of petty at the end and  got the distinct impression he burned the building down.
19:45.19cog|workZOMGSPOILER!
19:45.25cog|work:P
19:45.55Volaandangit, now i'm never gonna watch that movie
19:46.06LopeppeppyMy stapler, alestane!!
19:46.48LopeppeppyI watched Clerks 2 over the weekend, totally snarfed my drink soooo many times.
19:47.02mikmalopeppeppy: i love that movie
19:47.02Lunessaalestane: Milton is every bit the bad guy that gets intimated.  He's socially awkward and he's also a creepy, thieving bastard too.
19:47.09mikmalopeppeppy: lotr 1
19:47.13mikmalopeppeppy: lotr 2
19:47.20mikmalopeppeppy: lotr 3!
19:47.27alestaneSome shorts about Milton were the foundation for the movie, weren't they?
19:47.31Maldiviaand soon lotr -1 and lotr 0 ?
19:47.38alestaneClerks 2 is hilarious, Lopeppeppy.
19:47.48Volaantechnically, they aren't lotr
19:48.00mikmaintersoecies erotica fucko
19:48.06mikmaspecies*
19:48.41LopeppeppyI was seriously rolling on the floor at one point, alestane.
19:48.58mikmakinky kelly and the sexy stud
19:49.01alestaneI missed a bit of it somewhere, I think, I should see it again sometime.
19:49.12Volaanso...do i understand this correctly? in order to use a slash command, the variable must be SLASH_<cmdvarname>?
19:49.28Volaanor is that just some ppls naming convention?
19:49.29LopeppeppyRewatch.  A lot.
19:49.39MaldiviaVolaan: must be
19:49.43alestaneThe /command definition system is a little wonky to use because it's optimized for ease of localization.
19:50.03MaldiviaVolaan: SLASH_<cmd><index>
19:50.15Volaanalestane: I'm afraid I don't really understand localization at this point
19:50.47alestaneYou don't need to.
19:50.51VolaanMaldivia: so is that a yes, it has to start w/SLASH_ or can it be BLAHBLEEBLAH1 or w/e if I wanted to be a bad programmer
19:50.54Volaanah, ok
19:51.06Volaanthanks
19:51.08alestaneI only mentioned it because it's the reason why the system is so strange.
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19:51.33mikmai also find it funny how jay and silent bib are in both of the clerks movies
19:51.35Volaanok, but SlashCmdList is an actual reserved variable?
19:51.47alestaneYou have a function, it gets set as a key in the table stored in the global SlashCmdList.
19:52.19Lunessamikma:  They're recurring characters in all of Kevin Smith's films.
19:52.23Volaanok, making sense now
19:52.33alestanei.e. SlashCmdList["MYFUNC"] = function(msg, enteredFrom) ... end
19:52.49mikmalunessa: yeah but they are in "a real role", like in Dogma =D
19:52.52alestaneThen you set a global, SLASH_MYFUNC1 = "/myfunc"
19:53.13Volaanso when, in reference to Lua, one says table, it is the same as a hash in Perl? an Array in PHP? a dicitonary in Python?
19:53.27Volaan..or relatively the same
19:53.27alestaneIt's closest to a dictionary in Python AFAIK.
19:53.35mikmadogma... chris rock falling naked from the sky
19:53.39mikmaalso
19:53.41alestaneBut without the restriction on immutable values as keys.
19:53.44*** join/#wowuidev cygni (~slip@cm145-182.resnet.csumb.edu)
19:53.51Volaanimmutable?
19:54.01mikma"WHAT GEAR DO YOU HAVE ON?!?" ... 'GEAR??'
19:54.12Ackishttp://kotaku.com/5679434/world-of-warcraft-cataclysm-goes-live-the-same-time-for-everybody
19:54.17Ackiswhy isn't anyone complaining about that?
19:54.26mikmawobin: http://www.geekologie.com/2010/11/move_over_crack_you_got_nothin.php
19:54.33VolaanI actually JUST learned that Python calls what is similar to the others a dictionary today...not really experienced with Python
19:54.36alestaneAny Lua value can be used as a key, whereas in Python I think certain values like lists or other dictionaries aren't allowed.
19:54.45Volaanah, ok
19:54.53*** join/#wowuidev Matt646 (~Matt646@mn-10k-dhcp5-869.dsl.hickorytech.net)
19:55.00Xinhuanwrong, nil can't be used as a key :P
19:55.04VolaanI think Perl is similar in it's usage of Hash keys
19:55.18Fiskerwhy do they lie Ackis ?
19:55.20alestaneIn Lua, all the collection types (list, set, dictionary) are all handled as tables.
19:55.28krka(except for nil and nan)
19:55.38Dajovahmm... is there a way to determine in a macro if you are in blood/frost/unholy presence?
19:55.45krkawell, they can be used for get, but not set
19:55.53Dajovai know how with berserk/battle/defence
19:55.55krkaso not very useful, unless you use metatables
19:56.04Xinhuanu can determine, but why
19:56.05Fiskerwhy do they lie Ackis ?
19:56.08alestaneDon't see why you would exclude NaN.
19:56.10Xinhuanit won't be really usable
19:56.33Volaanawesome, thanks for the clarification
19:56.37alestaneWhat would you do with that info if you had it, Dajova?
19:56.43LunessaDajova: Not that you can /do/ anything with.
19:56.47FiskerAckis why do they lie?
19:56.51Dajovawell, i want in a single macro have heart strike in blood presence, blood strike in frost/unholy presence and using runestrike in all presence
19:57.04batrickalestane: you wouldn't be able to index the key
19:57.09Xinhuanshould still be the usual stance:1 stance:2 stuff
19:57.12batrickthe only way to access it would be through table traversal
19:57.13Xinhuandid u try that
19:57.16Dajovanope, already tested
19:57.17batrickso it doesn't really make sense
19:57.20Ackiswho lie Fisker/
19:57.20Volaansay something like, "Bloody hell" or "Brrrr" or whatnot
19:57.21Dajovapresence arent stances
19:57.23Fiskerkotaku Ackis
19:57.26batrickyou wouldn't even be able to remove it from the table
19:57.26Dajovathey dont change forms
19:57.35alestaneYou're right, Dajova, you can't do that.
19:57.42alestanePresences don't register as stances.
19:57.47Xinhuanwhich is a pity
19:57.48Dajovaexacly
19:57.52Dajovaso is there a way? :P
19:58.02XinhuanSuggestions forum that way --> :P
19:58.13alestaneIf there were, it would probably be handled through [stance] like the others.
19:58.36Dajovameh... i guess i have to ask via the interface forums :/
19:58.38alestaneBut no, there is no [presence] or any other equivalent.
19:59.25Fiskerexplain that to me Ackis
19:59.30alestaneMy understanding is that it is not considered to need one because there are no abilities that require a particular presence in order to work.
19:59.35Ackisshrugs
19:59.49Fisker^^
20:01.43Fiskerslaps Ackis around a bit with a large trout
20:04.17Dajovaalestane: no, but it's the only way atm, since i dont think a macro can determine what spec you are currently in :)
20:04.40alestaneThey can detect which of your primary and secondary spec you're in.
20:04.54Dajovayeah, but it's not reliable
20:05.14Dajovasince some have blood as primary, some have it as secondary
20:05.27alestaneIt's entirely reliable. [spec:1] is true if you're in your primary spec and [spec:2] is true if you're in your secondary spec.
20:05.57alestaneThen they need to set their macro up according to their particular configuration.
20:06.13Dajova-.-
20:06.34Dajovathere should be a better macro guide somewhere other than wowiki xD
20:06.50Ackiswowpedia?
20:06.57Lopeppeppywowprogramming?
20:08.38Dajovawowprogramming is only a Lua and XML site, not macros :P
20:10.40foxlitYou should clearly write a better macro guide than wowwiki
20:10.59foxlitkeep in mind that if you use wowwiki's guide as basis for your own, cogwheel owns your soul :P
20:12.02LunessaAnd he will lease it out for extra revenue.
20:12.31Lopeppeppy'cause Baby needs new shoes.
20:12.36farmbuyerat the very least, point to the one at wowpedia instead, it'll load about ten times faster :)
20:14.20Dajovak, ill check it :P
20:15.36cog|worktbqh, i've had a lot of trouble with wowpedia...
20:15.39Volaanok, I'm failing to fully grasp this /cmd thing...I understand that you must assign the desired function to the SlashCmdList["functionName"], but I'm failing to see how that function is called from the script
20:15.50cog|worksometimes pages can take upwards of 15 seconds to load
20:15.55cog|workand i get a lot of server errors
20:16.11cog|work"There has been an unexpected error with the backend servers, or they took to long to respond. This is probably a temporary issue. Please try again shortly."
20:16.23farmbuyerHuh.  I'm at the other end of the spectrum, no problems at all.
20:16.38cog|workit's really hit-and-miss...
20:16.41cog|work(for me)
20:16.48farmbuyerVolaan: got the SLASH_WHATEVER1 = "/blah" assignment also?
20:17.10cog|workDajova: "Stance is the generic term used for Warriors', Druids', Rogues' (Stealth), Priests' (Shadowform) and Shaman's (Ghost Wolf) forms. Stances are only applicable to situations where certain abilities are only usable in specific forms. Because of this, Paladin auras and Death Knight presences (despite being on the shapeshift bar), and Hunter aspects are NOT considered stances.
20:17.18Volaan...wait...ok, so the global variable to call the function MUST be named SLASH_functionName1?
20:17.30farmbuyermore or less
20:17.49mikmavolaan: SLASH_COCKSLAP1 = "/foo"
20:17.56farmbuyerSLASH_foo1, SLASH_foo2, etc, are all the different possible slashies for the SlashCmdList["foo"]
20:17.57DajovaI know that, i got it working now with [spec] instead of [form]
20:18.15cog|workDajova: i was just verifying what was said a moment ago
20:18.26Volaanand that in itself tells Lua that when a user types /whatever that's equal to to call the function assigned to SlashCmdList["bleh"]
20:18.31Volaanok ok ok ok
20:18.44Volaan*Joe Peschy(sp) style
20:18.45batbotVolaan, nothing found.
20:18.49*** join/#wowuidev TMc51 (~TMc@cpe-74-71-49-62.twcny.res.rr.com)
20:19.11durcynPesci
20:19.15Volaanty
20:19.18Volaan(:
20:19.21mikmavolaan: SlashCmdList["COCKSLAP"] = function() print("in the face") end
20:19.34TMc51lol
20:19.49Volaanalright, I got it...I think lol...I'm gonna give it a go...minus the cockslapping
20:20.03mikmathats what makes it good
20:20.07mikmait can be anything
20:20.12Volaanlol
20:20.18mikmaas long as the /command are correct
20:20.33Volaanok, one last question....just to make sure my game doesn't esplode
20:20.43Volaanis there an order of assignment?
20:20.55farmbuyerif you download the framexml zip, you can pick a builtin slash command and look it up in globalstrings.lua/chatframe.lua, to see how the existing stuff works
20:20.56foxlit(don't call ExplodeGame() unless you really, really mean to)
20:21.02Volaanlike, SLASH_bleh BEFORE SlashCmdList["bleh"]
20:21.10foxlitNo, that does not matter.
20:21.14farmbuyernope
20:21.15*** join/#wowuidev Xyphoid (~xyph@unaffiliated/xyphoid)
20:21.18Volaancoo
20:21.22Volaanthanks all
20:21.30mikmajust as long as the both lines exist
20:21.35mikmanotice
20:21.46mikmathe number needs to be there
20:21.50cog|workmourns the loss of AddonKit.exe
20:21.52mikmaits important
20:22.07farmbuyercog|work: do you know why the addon extracter was removed?
20:22.09VolaanI did note that
20:22.38cog|workcause blizzard is dumb!
20:22.46cog|work</troll>
20:22.56TC-Workor rather because they did not want to support it
20:22.59farmbuyeras good an explanation as any in this case, I suppose
20:23.02mikmaSLASH_Cajones1 = "/balls"; SLASH_Cajones2 = "/testes"
20:23.03Volaanso much inflection is lost in writing
20:23.14LopeppeppyInfection is never lost.  *innocent*
20:23.25TC-Workinfects Lopeppeppy
20:23.32farmbuyerdid it need "supporting"?  I downloaded it once like 5 years ago and it's worked through two xpacs since then \.
20:23.34*** join/#wowuidev anadept (~a@69.76.198.166)
20:23.48Lopeppeppy'cause they made changes?
20:23.53TC-Workpossibly something broke it in this one
20:23.54Volaancouldn't you also use SLASH_Cajones1, SLASH_Cajones2 = '/balls', '/testes';
20:24.02Lopeppeppyrandomly fribbles. 'cause it's awesome.
20:24.03cog|workfarmbuyer: probably something to do with the streaming client
20:24.16cog|worki'm sure the achive format has changed pretty significantly
20:24.17alestaneMaking it work with the streaming client might have been awkward.
20:24.20farmbuyerVolaan: yep
20:24.28LunessaVery.  And format changes.
20:24.47Volaansweet...hahaahaaaa, I'm LEARNING!! SOON I WILL RULE THE WORLD!...of Warcraft
20:24.55farmbuyerOkay, that's fair enough, I'll give them that.  Long as they keep that damn zip file up to date.  :-)
20:29.10LunessaTSquared said that the zip files were a temporary measure. And that he'd like a better, longer-term solution, but that it was sort of low-priority for now.
20:29.29foxlitWho is the T?
20:29.56LunessaTom Thompson.
20:30.29LunessaI asked him about the zips at the UI dinner since he was sitting on my left.
20:31.00Cideso you were his partner so to speak? lucky you.
20:31.04LopeppeppyTTFN, everypeople!
20:31.08cog|workbai
20:31.22nevcairielI dont think i ever saw him on the live forums, he did post some on the beta forums though, just very sneakily not in blue ;)
20:31.55LunessaCide: Well, I was sitting at the head of on table, and he was sitting across from Cairenn, so I guess you could say I was 'Lucky Pierre.'
20:32.04Cidelol
20:32.42Lunessawatches that reference shoot right past most of the channel.
20:34.07TC-Workyes Lunessa, you are old
20:34.28LunessaTC-Work: In this case, just dirty-minded.
20:35.05foxlitSo who is this Francois?
20:35.13TC-Workbesides, wasnt he sitting more across from alestane?
20:35.32LunessaI guess, but that doesn't make as funny as joke.
20:38.57Krapshttp://blue.mmo-champion.com/t/27509093895/blizzard-better-cinematics-please/
20:40.17Volaanso..if I wanted to check when a player gets a quest item..would i need to check EVERY item they pickup? or is there a particular function for that?
20:40.49Krapsthe orange light on the speaker is really bothering me and i can reach it  /rage
20:40.55syraeVolaan: you might want to try CHAT_MSG_LOOT and see if they get it with that
20:41.06Volaanhmm
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20:45.31Ackisif you're a NFL fan, this is what you're missing: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=d5BFaykcxGg
20:46.15*** join/#wowuidev olafski (~egrimm@dream.student.utwente.nl)
20:48.08Krapshttp://kotaku.com/5678903/supreme-court-pushes-hard-against-california-video-game-law
20:49.34KrapsAckis: the hell kinda football is that?!
20:49.52Volaanblah, so much for seeing how carbonite tracks it
20:50.08Volaanthey obfuscated their code....which i guess is understandable
20:51.23AckisKraps: CFL
20:51.38Ackishttp://ca.sports.yahoo.com/nhl/blog/puck_daddy/post/If-you-spent-40-on-Penguins-Igloo-ice-would-y?urn=nhl-281206 $40 bottle of water tehehe
20:51.55AckisKraps: our kicking rules are slightly different than yours
20:52.10Krapsi noticed
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20:53.05Ackisthere's no safe catch or w/e it's called for example
20:53.31bleeterraaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaar
20:53.32Volaanis there an event for when a player picks up an item?
20:54.00bleeterI believe the event is called NAO_GIVE_BLEETER_YOUR_PHAT_LOOTS
20:54.22bleeterI'm positive Ackis will back me up on this
20:54.37bleeterpokes Ackis
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20:55.18*** join/#wowuidev A-KO (as@unaffiliated/a-ko)
20:55.48Ackisyup
20:55.49AckisI do
20:57.06bleetertbh tho, that event fires on more than just picking up stuff
20:57.07syraewow
20:57.14syraeI want an Ackis minion
20:57.36Maldiviaok... that was spooky....
20:57.48syraeVolaan: try using /eventtrace
20:58.14Maldiviamy authenticator number was my birthday (day, month, year)...
20:58.23syraeIt'll show you all the events that are firing and all the args they have
20:59.13bleeterVolaan: remember this. syrae is a spoilsport. ;)
20:59.35Ackiswhat's an ackis minion?
20:59.41syraebleeter: so many people have been helpful to me, I figured I'd pass on the favor
21:00.02VolaanI'm thinkin i may be able to use QUEST_ITEM_UPDATE
21:00.07Krapshttp://fc07.deviantart.net/fs70/i/2010/094/4/3/Starcraft_Terran_Medic_by_VonSchlippe.jpg
21:00.09bleeterAckis: I think someone has mistaken me for a fanboi of yours
21:00.15bleetersyrae: well, fair enough then :)
21:00.21Ackisaren't you bleeter? ;)
21:00.31bleeterAckis: yes, I am bleeter.
21:00.44Ackisno, aren't you a fanboi? :P muhahahaha
21:00.51Ackisstamps Ackis' Fanboi on bleeter
21:00.56Volaankraps: nice, but not what i was hoping for ;P
21:00.56bleeterAckis: not since the last cheque bounced
21:01.03Ackis:(
21:01.07AckisKraps is a fanboi
21:01.19Krapsumm
21:02.00bleeterAckis: it's all cogwheel's fault, remember
21:02.42Volaanis Lua an OO lang?
21:02.59Volaannm
21:03.18Ackisno it's my fault
21:05.09farmbuyerVolaan: hit up www.lua.org next time you're bored :-)
21:06.09*** join/#wowuidev Seerah (~Ryan@adsl-66-38-148.mem.bellsouth.net)
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21:06.46Volaanhah, I get the hint....
21:08.37Lulia|AFKAnyone around right now that has used SetOverrideBindingClick successfully?
21:09.21AckisSeerah: where's my song?
21:10.17LuliaBah, I gotta run again for a bit
21:10.38Seerah1. I haven't gotten the microphone yet, 2. I am still recovering from a cold, and 3. I have to do something for some choir members first ><
21:11.08farmbuyerVolaan: no 'hint' really, it's just handy to learn how much of the weirdness is specific to Lua, versus how much is Lua-as-sandboxed-inside-WoW
21:12.11Volaanah
21:12.38Volaanwell, it is portugeuse isn't it?
21:13.58farmbuyeroriginally yes
21:14.06bleeteri thought it was brazillian
21:14.15farmbuyerstill maintained by the same 3 at puc-rio
21:14.38farmbuyerer, brazil, not portugal, not enough caffeine yet to be answering questions :-)
21:15.33MoonWitchAckis Seerah : Song?
21:15.41LunessaThey speak Portuguese in Brazil.
21:15.43bleeterfarmbuyer: no such thing as enough caffeine
21:16.00alestaneExcept according to the Portuguese, Lunessa.
21:16.03bleeterLunessa: I thought it was their own dialect
21:16.06durcynthey speak brazilian portugese
21:16.15durcyndid i just blow your mind?
21:16.30MoonWitchgod horror has gotten boring :(
21:16.30bleeterdurcyn: no, I deal with enUS, enUK and enAU every day ;)
21:16.48LunessaSame way that Spanish is spoken differently in different places, and English is mangled in all the places where it is spoken.
21:17.14farmbuyeroh, I meant location, not language
21:17.39MoonWitch@Cairenn : While it was a bit weird -- that pm -- I did mean it :)
21:17.41farmbuyerI think one of the Lua architects speaks like eight languages.
21:17.43bleeterEnglish is far mroe predisposed to be mangled, though. hence it's spread and use as universal language
21:17.47CairennMoonWitch: I know
21:18.05CairennI got your IMs as well, just haven't had the chance to get back to you yet
21:18.13*** join/#wowuidev Kraftman (~Kraftman@cpc1-bath4-0-0-cust95.aztw.cable.virginmedia.com)
21:19.09MoonWitchDon't worry.. I keep missing IMs from people because I circle 2 accounts (laptop and desktop), so I figured better safe then sorry :P
21:19.19Cairennnod
21:19.39MoonWitchI just realized I've never seen Halloween II - Rob Zombie's remake
21:19.47Cairennno, I've just been on-line/off-line/on-line/sleeping/sleeping/sleeping/on-line/off-line/on-line
21:20.04MoonWitchwow -- so specific :P
21:20.59Shirikyour quote for today
21:21.02Shirik"There are two ways of constructing a software design; one way is to make it so simple that there are obviously no deficiencies, and the other way is to make it so complicated that there are no obvious deficiencies. The first method is far more difficult. — C. A. R. Hoare"
21:22.03MoonWitchShirik: That quote requires further study and thought.
21:22.10MoonWitchI actually should print it :P
21:22.11CideI like C) just roll with it
21:22.21Cide>:)
21:22.35MoonWitchhey Cide
21:22.38Cidehi
21:22.45SeerahMoonWitch: see FB ;)
21:23.04Volaaner...so /eventtrace ...does that actually work? It doesn't seem to be showing anything for me
21:23.19Seerahit sure does
21:23.26Seerahdid it open a window on your screen?
21:23.33Volaandoes it show in game? or does it log somewhere?
21:23.39Lunessa<PROTECTED>
21:23.42VolaanI've got the window but nothin is showing up in it
21:23.42syraeVolaan: if you installed Blizz's debug tools and whatnot, it adds a bunch of new slash commands
21:23.44hasteit shows up in-gam
21:23.49hastee
21:23.59Volaanderp!
21:24.07Volaanscrolls down
21:24.12syraeIf you have NOT installed Blizz's addon development too,s you should
21:24.21MoonWitchSeerah:  Replied :P
21:24.26hasteyou have to install it :p ?
21:24.32syraes/too,s/tools,/
21:24.57nevcairielyou can't not install them, they come with the game
21:25.06haste<PROTECTED>
21:25.26syraeI assumed since /eventtrace didn't work for him, it's because he didn't have stuff set up right
21:25.55Cidemore likely is that he's personally responsible for the FEBKAC
21:26.07*** join/#wowuidev Morwrath (~zsc@unaffiliated/morwrath)
21:26.10nevcairielF?
21:26.11syraeheh
21:26.15CideFail.
21:26.16Shirikfailure
21:26.22Cidefailure is more appropriate
21:26.24Kethoany1 know if Iriel is going to update DevTools on WoWI? i really liked the /dtchatevent debug feature
21:27.52Ketho( well i guess i should try to catch iriel then .. nvm )
21:28.51MoonWitchsee how good we are in solving issues? Ketho solved the problem without us intervening :)
21:28.59Ketho=.=
21:29.19MoonWitchNaah, just pm him or post on the addon thing..
21:29.45LunessaSo we have a lecture hall with lots of high tech AV and computer equipment in it, built in the newest building on campus.  Which leaks, badly during the rain.  We have a big event scheduled for this hall... And it was filled with 4" of water completely covering the computers which run the AV equipment.  /sigh
21:30.15Seerahmore /sigh is why does the newest building on campus leak?
21:30.18Cairennugh
21:30.34nevcairielsounds like a story for dailywtf :p
21:30.48Cairennindeed
21:30.49LunessaSeerah: The original builders fucked up.  It's being repaired now, but ...
21:31.48LunessaRepairs to replace all the bad seals on all the glass walls and leaky fixtures has been underway for the last 3 months.  But the rain today has been intense.
21:34.41*** join/#wowuidev PProvost_ (~PProvost@174-16-121-54.hlrn.qwest.net)
21:38.02Fiskerslaps Shirik around a bit with a large trout
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21:44.03Cidanhugs Shirik
21:44.12Cidanso Shirik, just for kicks, installed Conspiracy on 4.0.1
21:44.15Cidanlol, still works
21:44.20Shirikseriously?
21:44.21Cidanhad to make like, 2 small adjustments
21:44.23CidanYeah
21:44.25Shirikwow
21:44.58CidanI fixed that popup bug too, moved to the easymenu api, lol
21:45.34ShirikWe were talking about RDX in my history class a few weeks ago
21:45.35Cidewell played sirs
21:45.43Cidanno kidding?
21:45.46Shirikexcept this was RDX explosives
21:45.48Cidanha
21:45.50Cidanlol
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21:48.48Fiskerslaps Shirik around a bit with a large trout
21:51.25*** join/#wowuidev RJohn (~Tanner@h123.65.149.24.cable.rdwd.jetbroadband.com)
21:52.06bleeterslaps Fisker around with a Sarcophilus Harrisii
21:52.39*** join/#wowuidev SNiLD (~snild@nurmijarvi.net)
21:56.17Volaansofer GetQuestItemInfo you need an actual item name? or item type? or number? i don't understand...qq
21:57.45*** join/#wowuidev SeanK (~SeanK@pool-98-117-120-73.sttlwa.fios.verizon.net)
22:03.34MoonWitch~api GetQuestItemInfo
22:03.35purlhttp://www.wowwiki.com/API_GetQuestItemInfo
22:04.06Volaanyeh, that's what i was lookin off of
22:04.56Volaanit seems I could GetNumQuestItems and use that as the index, but that keeps returning 0
22:05.07MoonWitchGetQuestItemInfo(type, itemNum);
22:05.15Jamashare you calling it while either talking to a quest NPC or having the quest log open?
22:05.22Volaanah, no
22:05.29Volaan..pew
22:05.52Volaanwas calling it on event QUEST_LOG_UPDATE
22:06.05Volaanwhich isn't working (:
22:06.12MoonWitchalso Rob Zombie's remake of Hallowing 2 is so sad :( it made me cry (especially with the Love hurts as end theme)
22:06.15Volaanso i guess i'd have to call it and store it?
22:06.29Volaanat initial quest reception?
22:06.59Volaan...i'm tryin to track how many of a particular quest item has been attained
22:14.22*** join/#wowuidev |stefan| (~stefan@80.245.231.105)
22:15.46*** join/#wowuidev MoonWitch|Mobile (~Kelly@d54C547BE.access.telenet.be)
22:17.37MoonWitch|MobileAckis .. I can persuade Seerah or Cairenn into kicking you :P
22:18.18MoonWitch|MobileI just saw that TB message :P
22:19.00*** join/#wowuidev Legorol (~legorol@cpc8-sgyl28-2-0-cust43.sgyl.cable.virginmedia.com)
22:19.11*** mode/#wowuidev [+v Legorol] by ChanServ
22:19.25MoonWitch|Mobilemeh -- can't I set up MPC as media streamer so i dont have to pauze my movies when i smoke?
22:21.59*** join/#wowuidev Hjalte (~chatzilla@cpe.ge-0-2-0-835.arcnqu2.customer.tele.dk)
22:24.54LunessaHorror movies are either LOL or Gross - and not really scary.
22:25.05*** join/#wowuidev Slackwise (~slackwise@c-98-228-240-33.hsd1.il.comcast.net)
22:25.36Cairennthat, Lunessa, is a matter of opinion
22:26.10LunessaTrue.  I speak only for myself, not ex cathedra.
22:26.18Cairenn:)
22:28.13LunessaThough, if I could speak with the voice/power of god, I think I'd abuse it and yell "Show me your tits" like a drugged out rockstar. :)
22:28.38syraeLunessa: -_-
22:29.41Lunessayou know that was funny.
22:31.46MoonWitch|MobileLunessa: Even I would do that, and I'm a woman
22:31.58MoonWitch|MobileThough I would add an age limit to my shout
22:32.12LunessaHeh
22:32.36MoonWitch|MobileI'd shout "All between 18 and 50" as well
22:32.47syraeLunessa: it's not really funny so much as derivative
22:32.48MoonWitch|Mobilethere's a limit to how far I'd go ;)
22:33.00MoonWitch|Mobileor low for that matter
22:34.02MoonWitch|Mobileanyhow
22:34.12MoonWitch|Mobilegrabbing snack and going back to desktop :)
22:34.52syraeLunessa: also, I hear it a LOT, so it's got a certain annoyance tied to it at this point.
22:34.52*** join/#wowuidev Lopeppeppy (~lopeppepp@cpe-67-252-44-53.nycap.res.rr.com)
22:35.48Xinhuanzzz
22:35.51LunessaReally?  I mean, I'm a crass, dirty old man and I don't think I have ever said that outside the context of a joke.
22:35.55LunessaNight Xinhuan.
22:35.56Xinhuanwtb the last 3 npcs to spawn for my Bloody Rare achievement
22:36.13Lopeppeppythinks this Colloquy thing is too complex
22:36.50LunessaLopeppeppy: IRC on a phone is probably more complex than trillian's IM interface for it.
22:36.54syraeLunessa: I have a group of friends (and guildies) who are pretty much constantly teasing me about taking of my shirt, providing picts, etc. It's actually pretty old at this point.
22:36.58syraebut they find it amusing
22:37.29Lunessasyrae: Bummer.  Sorry.  Jerks are jerks.  You should hang out with people who don't do that.
22:37.39Legorolsyrae: so did you?
22:37.42Cairenn^^
22:37.42Legorolthat'd shut them up :o)
22:37.44Legorolducks
22:37.53Cairenn(what lunessa said, not Legorol :p )
22:37.56Legorolhaha
22:37.58Legorolunfortunate timing
22:37.59syraeLegorol: no, but one of my friends stole my bra once and wore it as a hat
22:38.05LopeppeppyYeah Lunessa, took me a few, but I sorta think I got it.
22:38.10Legoroland posted pics of it on the net?
22:38.13Legorolotherwise it's not an interesting story
22:38.15LunessaYay! Lopeppeppy!
22:38.29syraeLegorol: I still have the picts, and should he ever deserve it, I can black mail him with it
22:38.38Legorol:)
22:38.40syraebye bye comfy gov't job!~
22:38.53LunessaHaha.
22:39.12*** join/#wowuidev kd3 (~kd3@user-1121sad.dsl.mindspring.com)
22:39.12*** join/#wowuidev kd3 (~kd3@wowwiki/Kaydeethree)
22:39.23Cairenn... /sigh, have to reboot, yet again, back shortly
22:39.40syraeregardless, they're good friends, if a bit uncreative in their taunts
22:40.09syraeand with my kind of real estate, it's kinda hard to ignore anyhow. >_<
22:41.16LunessaSo you have " 'uge tracts of land" ?
22:41.24syraeI prefer "vast"
22:41.27syrae^_^
22:41.35syraebut yes
22:41.38durcyni prefer people who recognize Python quotes.
22:41.39LunessaI was making a Monty Python reference.
22:41.43syraeI know
22:42.56durcynso, Lunessa, you get your bag of McRibs yet?
22:43.06LopeppeppyGrrr, stuck on downloading updated tools again!  I have a HATE for updates
22:43.20Lunessadurcyn: I don't generally eat pork sandwhices.
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22:45.25Aurorussyrae: what government is your govt job for?
22:45.55syraeAurorus: not my job.  I work for big business
22:46.00syraemy friend
22:46.04Aurorusahh
22:46.07Auroruswith you now
22:47.19syraes/big business/a massive, mutli-national, heartless corporation
22:48.37LunessaMmmm... soulless, heartless big-business.  They generate such delicious tears.
22:48.41durcynyou forgot the trailing slash, the bot parser isn't smart enough to assume you terminated your replacement with an EOL
22:49.23syraedurcyn: I know.  My bot doesn't care about the trailing slash, and honestly, I'm ok with it not auto replacing occasionally when the sub is so damned obvious and easy to do
22:49.42syraeversus the crazy people pulling out regexes and stuff
22:49.56*** join/#wowuidev Jamash (~Jamash@76.252.187.121)
22:50.38durcynyou're as heartless as your employer.
22:50.56Aurorusdidn't we establish earlier that syrae has a vast heart?
22:51.20AurorusI mean - very kind hearted
22:51.23Aurorus(*phew* :P )
22:51.24syraeOh, if I only had a brain...
22:51.52alestaneballet, ballet...men wearing pants so tight you can tell what religion they are.
22:52.00durcynno, Aurorus, because creeping on women in an IRC channel is weird.
22:52.16syraecreeping?
22:52.29durcynbeing creepy, as it were
22:52.31syraeah
22:52.33Jamashkilling neutral mobs to gain early xp?
22:52.34Shirikhey Cide
22:52.37Lunessaalestane: Unless they were born in the US, in which case the result are not indicative of religious up-bringing.
22:52.42ShirikJust thought I'd throw something out here
22:52.49ShirikThe minecraft guy
22:52.51Jamashs/out/up/
22:53.02syraeWell, I have already had a stalker in real life, sooo... being creepy in IRC isn't so bad on the scale of things
22:53.07ShirikIn the last 24 hours, 20820 people registered, and 6810 people bought the game.
22:53.15Shirikthat's about $80k
22:53.23alestaneThat was the ironic part, Lunessa. I'm certainly not Jewish. And I don't think my parents ever forgave the doctor.
22:53.39LunessaI don't think they even asked my parents.
22:53.49cog|workyou can sue and win if they didn't get permission
22:54.09Lunessacog|work: Doubtful.  I was born in a military hospital.
22:54.36LunessaAnd to be honest, I don't care that much.
22:54.40cog|workgeneral "you", maybe not you specifically in that case :P
22:54.53cog|work!g william stowell
22:54.54batbotcog|work: William Stowell sues doctor and hospital for circumcision battery <http://www.cirp.org/news/penthouse11-01-01/>
22:54.58LunessaNot like I'm emotionally missing anything. (lol)
22:55.57alestaneGod bless John Harvey Kellogg (preferably with a very big hammer).
22:56.17LopeppeppyHammers are good.  Pass me one?
22:56.25alestanehand Lopeppeppy a hammer.
22:57.11MoonWitchMy god Jamie Lee Curtis has awesome lungs .... I am so jealous right now
22:57.27alestaneKellogg proudly proclaimed that in forty years of marriage, he'd never "had congress" with his wife (as if it were something to be proud of).
22:57.47alestaneOn the other hand, a buff orderly gave him an enema every single morning.
22:57.50foxlitthe cereal brand?
22:58.00AurorusJohn Kellogg
22:58.04Aurorusyep, the guy who started it all
22:58.15*** join/#wowuidev Legorol|alt (~legorol@cpc8-sgyl28-2-0-cust43.sgyl.cable.virginmedia.com)
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22:58.20durcyncereal and anal fisting, what a combination
22:58.35Aurorusalso something about sex being bad
22:58.44DagmarPart of this nutritious breakfast regimen.  Yum.
22:58.55alestaneIn fact, Kellogg's Corn Flakes were originally devised and marketed specifically to reduce the urge/tendency to masturbate.
22:59.01DagmarAurorus: THat workd out so well for the Shakres.
22:59.08Dagmarer Shakers
22:59.42syraealestane: ditto with Graham Crackers.  Reduced masturbation urges (in theory)
22:59.45LunessaThere's a delightful spoof/comedy about him called "The Road to Wellville"
23:00.06alestaneYep, Mr. Graham was a contemporary IIRC.
23:00.10syraeyup
23:00.37syraebut graham crackers are SOOO GOOD with sticky, goey marshmellow and oozing chocolate all over them...
23:00.47alestaneKellogg also recommended circumcision without anaesthetic as a remedy for "incurable" sex drive.
23:00.48Lunessa"you must resist your marital impulses" was oft-given medical advice.
23:00.52cog|workfor those who aren't already aware, my grandmother is the founder of NOCIRC (nocirc.org)
23:01.22LunessaAnd on that note, I must get going.  Errands to run.  Ciao.
23:01.24syraemmmm s'mores.....
23:01.35foxlit"Ms O'Donnell's oddball pronouncements on masturbation, witchcraft and human-mouse hybrids have virtually handed a once-tight contest to Democrat Chris Coons."
23:01.36*** join/#wowuidev stew-a (~Stewart@unafilliated/stewa/x-008753)
23:01.37LopeppeppyMmm, incurable
23:01.46foxlitOne can't help but wonder whether BBC has an editorial point.
23:01.58foxlitThe human-mouse hybrids reference is particularly nice.
23:02.12Jamashwell, she is a nutter
23:02.20Jamashsaying so is not evidence of bias
23:03.03*** join/#wowuidev cairenn (~Cairenn@MMOI/Administratrix/Cairenn)
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23:03.08alestaneYep, Lunessa, I remember going through books while scanning them that insisted that consummating your marriage too frequently or with too much gusto was a violation of the Seventh Commandment.
23:03.11foxlitTrue true.
23:03.46Aurorusadultery?
23:04.01Aurorusor lust?
23:04.05alestaneBecause a lot of people basically interpreted the Seventh Commandment as "Thou shalt not enjoy sex."
23:04.13Auroruslol, how sad
23:04.52Aurorusbut it's funny how later in the New Testament, Paul writes to a group of people and says that if you are consumed by lust, then for God's sake marry and be happy
23:04.57Aurorusthey never remember that bit
23:05.11alestaneThe original meaning specifically refers to banning sex between a man and a woman who is not his wife.
23:05.34Arrowmasteroh what the fuck, i just got one shot by a fucking trapped chest in torchlight
23:05.36Aurorusyeah, although what would prostitution count as?
23:05.49Auroruse.g. single guy, prossy
23:06.01Aurorusis that still breaking the commandment, according the the original meaning?
23:06.19*** join/#wowuidev Angayelle (~oldchap_t@bri77-1-88-171-141-12.fbx.proxad.net)
23:06.24Angayellehai people
23:06.32JamashArrowmaster: at least it wasn't a mimic
23:06.49Arrowmastermimic would have been better
23:07.38alestaneProstitution wasn't exactly recognized under Old Testament law, Aurorus.
23:08.36alestaneAnd where it was, it was usually considered worthy of exile or death.
23:08.39*** join/#wowuidev xshan (~xshan@ip-78-137-150-18.wfd.metro.digiweb.ie)
23:09.44Aurorusexcept in Genesis 38 - awesome chapter to read to kids :P
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23:12.30*** join/#wowuidev Lopeppeppy (~lopeppepp@cpe-67-252-44-53.nycap.res.rr.com)
23:17.18JamashI think I'm going to start national haiku writing month
23:17.25LopeppeppyPatch, it's what's for dinner
23:17.26Jamashyou may write no more than one word per day
23:17.55alestaneFinally get the space arranged, Peppy?
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23:18.09*** mode/#wowuidev [+v Legorol] by ChanServ
23:19.04Angayellei'm using the UnitHealth API with a variable as arg for the name, when i query the hp the variable, no problem but if i want the hp of my variable target it becomes complicated
23:19.12LopeppeppyI had plenty of space, 42g.  I deleted and am re-installing out of desperation
23:19.22Angayellefor ex : /run local jtfmt1 = "Angayelle" local mt1hp = UnitHealth("jtfmt1-target") print(mt1hp) don't work obviously
23:19.47Angayellewithout hypen it doesn't either
23:20.00JamashAngayelle: UnitHealth(jtfmt1.."target")
23:20.14Angayelleoh yes vararg right ?
23:20.16Jamashno
23:20.20Jamashstring append
23:20.23Angayellek
23:21.11Angayelleand then for targettarget of jtfmt1 it should be : UnitHealth(jtfmt1.."target-target") ?
23:21.21Jamashno hyphens
23:21.36Angayelleokies
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23:33.24Angayellethe woring api is mt1hp = UnitHealth(jtfmt1.. "-target-target")
23:33.55Angayellefor hp of targetarget of jtfmt1
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23:37.11Lulia|AFKOoo, 20 favs on WoWInterface
23:37.22LuliaYay typos
23:38.35LuliaAnyone on right now that's used SetOverrideBindingClick effectively?
23:40.42*** join/#wowuidev Lunessa (~Lunessa@WoWUIDev/Lunessa)
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23:40.46LunessaStation
23:41.40LuliaStation?
23:41.45LunessaStation!
23:41.53A-KOwhy am I getting flashbacks to Bill and Ted?
23:42.22Jerubloltypo
23:42.23alestaneBecause.
23:42.28Lunessahttp://www.imdb.com/title/tt0101452/
23:42.28CairennStation!
23:42.29Jerubdid anyone else see the email from blizz about realid?
23:42.54Xyphoidi got an email saying 'hey we fixed realid! it's okay now!' a while back
23:43.04Jerub4. Under Privacy, you will find three checkboxes:
23:43.09Jerubb. The second box enables Friends of Friends. Un-checking this box will prevent your name (as listed on this
23:43.10LopeppeppyMe too, nothing recent
23:43.11A-KOI AM BILL S PRESTON ESQUIRE
23:43.12Jerub+Battle.net account) from being displayed to your Real ID friends' other Real ID friends.
23:43.15A-KOAND I'M TED THEODORE LOGAN
23:43.16Jerubc. The second box enables Friends of Friends. Un-checking this box will prevent your name (as listed on this
23:43.19A-KOAND WE ARE THE WIIILILD STALLIONS
23:43.19Jerub+Battle.net account) from being displayed to your Real ID friends' other Real ID friends.
23:43.22Jerub(sorry for the stupid 5 line paste, should've been 3)
23:43.24Jerubi love it
23:44.16A-KOJerub: I still think people made too much of a stink over that. If anyone knew what anyone actually did wit htheir data in the real world, they'd shit a gold brick. Your real-ID showing up in your friends-of-friends lists sould be the absolute LEAST of your concerns with your information.
23:44.31A-KOIt's about a fraction of a % of what Facebook shares about you
23:44.41A-KOand all of the very interesting metrics they, and their "partners", run on you as well.
23:44.51Xyphoidwhat pissed me off about it was linking it to a feature i actually wanted
23:45.01A-KOlike I said, it doesn't bother me in the least bit.
23:45.24A-KOI work with customer data every day of the week
23:45.30A-KOI, personally, treat it very sacredly
23:45.34A-KObut it's not required by my company to do so
23:45.38A-KOand they are very nonchalant about it
23:45.39A-KOso
23:45.46cbreakit is required by LAW to do it
23:45.56A-KOcbreak: No, it depends on what data you're storing.
23:46.00A-KO:P
23:46.11Xyphoidi don't really like the argument 'well, facebook does this WORSE'
23:46.13A-KOcbreak: It also depends what relation that data is.
23:46.23cbreaknames, addresses and credit cards are all very very high security requirements
23:46.36A-KOcbreak: Yes, but if you store anything except financial data--you can be pretty wide open with it.
23:46.43A-KOAnd even then
23:46.44cbreaknot really
23:46.55cbreakyou can't give customer data to anyone else without explicit consent
23:46.55A-KOyou're still allowed to open customer financial data to others in limited scenarios
23:47.00LuliaThere are no laws I know of about real names.
23:47.08A-KOyes, you can cbreak
23:47.14LuliaFor all you know you have explicit consent in their license agreement.
23:47.17cbreakyou even need special permission to get it out of the EU
23:47.18A-KOOr, you bury the clause into a 20 page contract
23:47.20LuliaNo one reads those, but they're important.
23:47.28A-KOexactly Lulia
23:47.33cbreak(if you outsource processing)
23:47.48Xyphoidi don't see why 'but they're legally allowed to do X' is a reason not to complain about it
23:47.57LuliaComplain about it all you want
23:48.03LuliaBut claiming they're breaking a law is silly.
23:48.10A-KOcbreak: In the US, most people don't know shit about what goes on. There's also things like public records. Interestingly enough, your financial information is public--except account numbers. But *what* you have, what you own, is public.
23:48.16A-KOAccessible by nearly anyone with enough $
23:48.17LuliaYou're not going to sue them overi t.
23:48.19Xyphoidclearly, complaining had some impact on them
23:48.23cbreakthe US doesn't have privacy laws anyway
23:48.26LuliaYou can stop using their products in protest if you want.
23:48.28cbreakit's wild west over there for all I know
23:48.37cbreakbut blizzard europe is a european company
23:48.41Xyphoidcomplaining is a perfectly valid technique for encouraging them to change
23:48.42A-KOcbreak: It's because most people don't care if it's not put in front of them.
23:49.08LuliaRight, Xyphoid
23:49.12A-KOXyphoid: I suppose, but I still think people are irrational--just like the facebook thing about 6 months ago. Blizzard simply timed it wrong, that's all. There was stink about FB 6 months ago with like international delete your FB day, etc.
23:49.20A-KOXyphoid: It's funny, because I convinced my friend it was a dumb idea
23:49.22LuliaSaying to Blizzard "I dont like this" in a constructive manner is fine.
23:49.28A-KOshe was going to delete her FB account, re-create a new one
23:49.38Xyphoidwhy is complaining about a direction that i don't like irrational
23:49.38A-KOshe was like "MY KID IS ON MY FB PAGE!"
23:49.45A-KOAmusingly enough
23:49.49LuliaSaying to Blizzard "OMG. this iz totally ILLGEAL. I'm GOING TO SUE" is dumb.
23:49.58A-KOshe went to a bdsm club, where they make you sign all of this stuff and give them your real info
23:50.01*** join/#wowuidev KarlKFI|work (~KarlKFI|w@adcom005v.adcom.uci.edu)
23:50.01A-KOand store it on al aptop
23:50.04A-KOthat anyone could walk off with
23:50.10A-KOAnd I told her that
23:50.11A-KOI was like
23:50.37A-KO"Why are you worried about your FB pictures when you gave all of your information to people who store it on a laptop that any potentially unsavory person could walk off with? Or follow you home?"
23:50.37LuliaI wish my AddOn could collect metrics of use
23:50.43LuliaAnd report it back to me >.>
23:50.49A-KOShe dropped the problem with facebook after that
23:50.50A-KO:P
23:50.53Xyphoidthe last time my CC got used fraudently was after using it in the Bangkok airport
23:51.01A-KOLulia: A rather significant amount of software does that, surprisingly. Moreso than people think.
23:51.05A-KOEven software they don't think does it.
23:51.10A-KOUse metrics are fine IMO
23:51.16A-KOIn fact
23:51.17LuliaWell
23:51.19Xyphoidpresumably the number got lifted by the guy at the icecream place
23:51.22LuliaIt cant report back to me
23:51.29A-KOI turn on all of the customer stuff in the software I use
23:51.30LuliaSo there's no point in doing it
23:51.32A-KOwell obviously Lulia :P
23:51.36A-KObut I mean, it's really really common
23:51.42LuliaOh, I know
23:51.44A-KOGoogle and Microsoft do it with their browsers, same with Apple
23:51.47LuliaI'm just saying I wish I could do it.
23:51.55A-KOMicrosoft is capable of saying "On average our users have about 3 tabs open at any given time."
23:51.58LuliaI want to know what people are doing with it, so I can make it better.
23:52.11LuliaBut some asshole would find a way to abuse it.
23:52.14Lulia:-/
23:52.26*** join/#wowuidev Kraftman (~Kraftman@cpc1-bath4-0-0-cust95.aztw.cable.virginmedia.com)
23:52.31A-KOI turn on all of the use-metrics of the software I use.
23:52.41A-KOI know it helps, and I also happen to know some people that work in the industry of those products.
23:52.53A-KONot that I trust their company with my information, but it's a trade-off I'm willing ot take.
23:52.55A-KOIt really does help :P
23:53.04LuliaI know
23:53.10LuliaI just wish I could do it.
23:53.27LuliaActually, right now, I'm trying to think of how someone could abuse it in an AddOn
23:53.27A-KOKnowing all sorts of stuff about workflow, how people use your application, is invaluable to making it not only easier for your customers, but a better product for you to sell.
23:53.29A-KOIt's a win-win all around
23:53.34LuliaAddOns don't have access to sensitive information
23:53.37LuliaHmm
23:53.47Xyphoidlog chat channels, send that back
23:53.48Xyphoidand tells
23:53.59Xyphoidthat's pretty sensitive
23:54.00A-KOYou would need something that keeps track in variables, then an external application that uploads that to you.
23:54.31LuliaI guess, Xyphoid, yeah. That would be how someone would abuse it.
23:55.00Luliasighs at the jerks in the world.
23:55.16LopeppeppyIt's a start to abusing stuff, that's for sure.
23:55.51LuliaWell, I mean, grabbing info from outside the game can easily be abused. The risks are fairly obvious. But just sending info... but there is the logging issue.
23:56.11DagmarMAH KEYS!
23:56.13LuliaWhat if they made an option to make it so AddOns couldn't access your chat channels?
23:56.22LuliaJust an option, for people who were suspicious
23:56.35*** join/#wowuidev SNiLD (~snild@nurmijarvi.net)
23:56.59DagmarLet's not do that
23:57.09AckisLulia: don't sigh at me
23:57.09LuliaHmm?
23:57.13DagmarI have need of addons being able to deal with the chat windows
23:57.26Ackiswill I get the tripping the rift achievement by doing something at ratchet?
23:57.28DagmarI have actually written some code at this point for it even
23:57.32Xyphoidyeah
23:57.32LuliaDagmar: It would be an option.
23:57.37Xyphoidyou get the achievement from any rifts
23:57.43DagmarAckis: assuming there's a rift to close there
23:57.50Xyphoidoutland is a pretty easy place to do it
23:57.52LuliaIt wouldn't be something forced on AddOn developers to limit them.
23:57.52Ackisthere is Dagmar according to wowpedia
23:58.01foxlitLulia: you already have that option
23:58.07LuliaDo we?
23:58.15DagmarI ust learned about the elemental invasion from MMOC
23:58.31DagmarLooking forward to getting home and taking a look see into a brand-new set of pockets
23:58.33LuliaMy Youtube channel is still broke over it
23:58.35foxlityes. It's called :don't run shit you can't trust"
23:58.42LuliaI agree, foxlit ;)
23:58.46Dagmarfoxlit++
23:58.52LuliaBut people out there are dumb
23:59.15LuliaI wish they weren't, so stuff wouldn't have to be so restricted.
23:59.17DagmarI blame the lack of a testing requirement before being allowed to use the internets
23:59.28LuliaYes, a license to use a computer
23:59.29LuliaI agree
23:59.52DagmarYou can do far more damage with a computer than you can a car, but we put all sorts of restrictions on cars.

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