| 00:00.18 | *** part/#wowuidev WobWork (~Wobwork@234.128.233.220.static.exetel.com.au) |
| 00:01.09 | Amarande | Heya Cairenn :) |
| 00:01.16 | Cairenn | hi |
| 00:01.17 | Amarande | Dagmar: ahh, they'll gladly kill your party members, just like Iolo. :) |
| 00:01.24 | *** join/#wowuidev Archarodim (HydraIRC@lev92-4-88-164-134-95.fbx.proxad.net) |
| 00:01.43 | Amarande | sooo ... I guess I'm keeping my Turalyon characters there to help my buddies, but will be looking to reroll elsewhere now |
| 00:01.46 | tem | Anyone able to invite the Alliance beta guild? |
| 00:01.50 | tem | my worgen needs an invite |
| 00:03.54 | *** join/#wowuidev theorb (~theorb@91.84.53.6) |
| 00:04.00 | tem | nevermind, I got one |
| 00:04.11 | NightHawkTheSane | http://kottke.org/10/09/the-luckiest-bastards-alive |
| 00:05.38 | Amarande | tem, it seems I've figured out what's gotten my gears ground to the point that I whined as much as I did |
| 00:05.55 | Amarande | it's presumably come of insisting on playing on a server and faction environment that probably wasn't really suited to me. |
| 00:06.07 | tem | you're just a whiny cunt? |
| 00:06.08 | Amarande | I came there because my buddies from elsewhere play there. But it doesn't seem to be home for ME. |
| 00:06.27 | tem | ah yeah, some servers are definitely pretty awful |
| 00:06.36 | tem | I didn't realize my old server was horrible until I transferred |
| 00:06.37 | Amarande | To really have fun on Turalyon Horde, you either have to be a really dedicated progression player or have absolutely no interest in raiding at all |
| 00:06.56 | Amarande | which ... doesn't work well for me |
| 00:07.08 | *** join/#wowuidev Borgleader (~borgleade@modemcable253.146-130-66.mc.videotron.ca) |
| 00:07.16 | Amarande | Apparently Silvermoon Alliance seems pretty much the same based on the GS requests I've been seeing in trade there, so I shan't be rolling there either |
| 00:07.25 | Amarande | I'm tempted to go back to Quel'dorei, since they always have a history of poor progression |
| 00:07.47 | Amarande | and the people there have always been really friendly, meanwhile :) |
| 00:08.00 | Amarande | Horde side anyway. Alliance side is apparently spearheaded by a total d-bag. |
| 00:08.14 | NightHawkTheSane | ~tem++ |
| 00:08.36 | Amarande | ... now to figure out WHAT I want to roll |
| 00:09.58 | Wimpeh | So tonight, I went from 500 haste rating to 760 while picking up 3 new pieces of gear, one being heroic Midnight Sun on my shaman. |
| 00:10.03 | Wimpeh | This has been a fantastic night. |
| 00:11.53 | Amarande | Wimpeh: speaking of shamans |
| 00:12.01 | Amarande | is ele shaman any fun while leveling or should I be leveling enh? |
| 00:12.07 | Amarande | I haven't played shammy since BC |
| 00:13.14 | NightHawkTheSane | you can level however you want. |
| 00:13.22 | NightHawkTheSane | Wimpeh: what spec, out of curiosity? |
| 00:14.55 | *** join/#wowuidev kapipi (~tor@raichu.netlab.jp) |
| 00:15.56 | Wobin | Resto is intersting to level with |
| 00:16.03 | Wobin | you end up healtanking groups of mobs =P |
| 00:16.18 | TC-Work | it's as slow as OG pally prot leveling |
| 00:16.23 | Wobin | shock/chainlightning/healself repeat =P |
| 00:16.33 | erikd | tekkub: are you around? |
| 00:17.09 | Wobin | elemental is probably easiest to level with, as enh's cooldowns are more suited to slower pulls |
| 00:17.35 | NightHawkTheSane | Wobin: i suspect once 4.0 hits and you get ES at level 10, it'd be pretty awesome to do that then |
| 00:17.50 | NightHawkTheSane | (restotank, that is) |
| 00:18.00 | *** join/#wowuidev kapipi (~tor@raichu.netlab.jp) |
| 00:18.02 | Wobin | NightHawkTheSane: oh hell yes =) |
| 00:18.05 | Wobin | well |
| 00:18.15 | Wobin | really, ES isn't that useful for self tanking |
| 00:18.31 | Wobin | mostly because you don't have the mitigation to back it up like a tank does |
| 00:18.58 | Wimpeh | NightHawkTheSane: Restoration. |
| 00:19.32 | Wimpeh | Amarande: I got boosted to 60, then levelled as resto throuhg dungeons and AV to 70, then went Enhancement until 75. Enhancement is stupidly easy, Elemental after 75 twoshots mobs. |
| 00:19.35 | Wimpeh | So it's what you prefer. |
| 00:19.44 | NightHawkTheSane | Wobin: eh, i dunno, at that level, just having a shield is pretty awesome. |
| 00:19.47 | Wimpeh | I had no BoAs, but I finished with 5 days played and I'm a terribly slow levler. |
| 00:19.59 | NightHawkTheSane | Wimpeh: cool, good haste bump for you then :) |
| 00:20.12 | Wimpeh | Aye. :) Made me happy! |
| 00:20.13 | Wimpeh | Thing is |
| 00:20.17 | Wimpeh | I didnt think of this until now |
| 00:20.29 | Wimpeh | But I've got an unused token to bump my 251 t10 to 264. |
| 00:20.39 | NightHawkTheSane | hah, nice. (also, fuck you :P) |
| 00:20.40 | Wimpeh | Question though, is, does that token upgrade wipe enchants and gems off the shoulder? |
| 00:20.45 | NightHawkTheSane | yes |
| 00:20.48 | NightHawkTheSane | its an all new itme |
| 00:20.49 | Wimpeh | FFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFF |
| 00:20.49 | NightHawkTheSane | item* |
| 00:21.00 | Wimpeh | I wasted the remaining of my 200g to gem and enchant it. |
| 00:21.04 | Wimpeh | BRB crying |
| 00:21.26 | NightHawkTheSane | eh, do some dailies, buy more in a few days ;) |
| 00:21.34 | Wimpeh | Yeah, I'll have to do that. |
| 00:21.49 | Wimpeh | I mean, I have 1.4k saved on a separate character, but they must not be used for they are my cataclysm savings. |
| 00:21.54 | Wimpeh | 50% of what I earn goes to that :3 |
| 00:23.00 | Amarande | yeah, some classes will have a lot of spending to do when 4.0 hits |
| 00:23.08 | Amarande | particularly a fair amount of caster DPS |
| 00:23.12 | Amarande | since a lot of them will have to regem |
| 00:23.48 | NightHawkTheSane | not really. |
| 00:23.55 | NightHawkTheSane | seeing as you can just.. you know.. LEVEL UP. |
| 00:24.07 | Amarande | Night: 4.0 before Cata |
| 00:24.23 | NightHawkTheSane | people spending hordes of gold on that are.. dumb. |
| 00:24.39 | NightHawkTheSane | post-4.0 really wont be long enough, or matter enough, to spend the money on dumb shit like that |
| 00:24.45 | Amarande | besides, it's probably only two gems I'll have to redo anyway on the lock |
| 00:24.58 | Amarande | replacing the spirit ones with gems that have a different blue stat in them |
| 00:25.04 | NightHawkTheSane | unless you're literally rolling in tens of thousands, but then, who cares if you spend a little? |
| 00:25.17 | Amarande | (right now, spirit's the best of bad worlds for aff locks when it comes to having to socket blue) |
| 00:25.28 | Wimpeh | Same for shadowpriests. |
| 00:25.53 | *** join/#wowuidev ckknight (~ckknight@WoWUIDev/WoWAce/CurseStaff/CurseForge/ckknight) |
| 00:25.53 | *** mode/#wowuidev [+o ckknight] by ChanServ |
| 00:26.06 | Amarande | Wimpeh: you guys use chaotic skyflare too right? |
| 00:26.21 | Amarande | yeah, a lot of caster DPS is stuck with two spirit gems right now simply because chaotic skyflare is the meta to use and it requires 2 blue |
| 00:27.14 | Amarande | mp5, in the tiny amount that you get from two gems, isn't worth it, and spell pen is utterly useless in pve :) |
| 00:27.26 | Amarande | so basically right now it's stam or spirit, and spirit's a LITTLE more useful till 4.0 hits |
| 00:27.51 | Wimpeh | Yeah. We did until I quit 6 months ago but I'm quite sure nothing's changed. |
| 00:27.57 | Amarande | you know what a testament to spell pen being useless in pve is |
| 00:28.05 | Amarande | during BC, I cut a spell pen blue gem |
| 00:28.05 | Wimpeh | Spirit was quite good for us. Not that good, but not terrible. |
| 00:28.10 | Amarande | it's still sitting there in my guild bank |
| 00:28.11 | Amarande | unused |
| 00:28.14 | Wimpeh | lol'd |
| 00:28.41 | Jerub | Amarande: uh, what about a +10 all stats and 1 spirit gem? |
| 00:28.58 | Amarande | Wimpeh: for aff locks, basically 1/2 our spirit is a flat out spellpower bonus in all practical senses |
| 00:29.07 | *** join/#wowuidev durcyn (~durcyn@WoWUIDev/Durcyn) |
| 00:29.32 | Amarande | Jerub: I looked at nightmare tear and it really didn't seem that useful for caster DPS, now or after 4.0 |
| 00:29.44 | Amarande | casters tend to mostly use stuff that isn't base stats currently |
| 00:29.54 | Amarande | mostly spellpower/haste/crit |
| 00:30.16 | Amarande | after 4.0, the int will contribute to spellpower (right now gemming int on a warlock is really bad) |
| 00:30.22 | Amarande | but the spirit will be useless again |
| 00:31.42 | Amarande | I'm really tempted now to pick a poor progression server and try to gather up the various disgruntled can't find a group folks into a new guild. It could work well for me. |
| 00:32.06 | Amarande | I can't do that on Turalyon because things are too ossified |
| 00:33.26 | Amarande | also, it really occurs to me that Eastern Time servers are not good for me |
| 00:33.38 | Wimpeh | From the west coast? |
| 00:33.43 | Amarande | Wimpeh: No, East Coast |
| 00:33.51 | Wimpeh | So |
| 00:33.52 | Wimpeh | Wait |
| 00:33.52 | Wimpeh | what |
| 00:33.56 | Amarande | but as I said, I work evenings a lot, and that combined with being in the same time zone as server time means I miss a lot of raid opportunities |
| 00:34.02 | Wimpeh | Ah. I see. |
| 00:34.07 | Amarande | if I was on a Mountain or Pacific time server, the time shift would give me a lot more options |
| 00:34.15 | Wimpeh | Or West Coast. |
| 00:34.46 | Amarande | seeing as the current raid circuit is fast approaching an end, now is probably a perfect time to plan my next move and reroll somewhere |
| 00:34.56 | Amarande | since I'll have plenty of time to make connections and level before Cata |
| 00:35.28 | Amarande | (besides, it looks like I can always go back and get Kingslayer at 85, anyway, since PTR at least is showing all the old LK raid achievement stuff as business-as-usual) |
| 00:35.56 | Amarande | I wonder if you can still get a frostbrood vanquisher at 85, though. One particular hurdle is coming to mind. |
| 00:36.20 | Amarande | We seem to be getting a power boost with 4.0, at least based on how I was doing in heroic UK on the PTR |
| 00:36.48 | Amarande | It's going to be a real challenge to keep things alive long enough to actually get thirty stacks of Necrotic Plague going for that one achievement :) |
| 00:36.54 | Amarande | at 85, that is |
| 00:37.00 | Wimpeh | lold |
| 00:37.26 | Amarande | Wimpeh: actually even now, some of the achievements (particularly 5 man heroic related ones) are getting hard to get, simply because bosses die so fast now |
| 00:37.28 | *** join/#wowuidev ckknight (~ckknight@WoWUIDev/WoWAce/CurseStaff/CurseForge/ckknight) |
| 00:37.28 | *** mode/#wowuidev [+o ckknight] by ChanServ |
| 00:37.57 | Amarande | Like the one that requires everyone to get impaled by Gal'darah, or ... what was that one ... the one about the multiple slimes for Sjonnir |
| 00:38.18 | Amarande | Sjonnir usually dies in about half a minute or so now :) |
| 00:41.04 | Wimpeh | I was doing Share The Love yesterday |
| 00:41.10 | Wimpeh | It took _ ages _ and I didn't even get it |
| 00:41.17 | Wimpeh | Because the tank wasn't getting impaled |
| 00:41.24 | Wimpeh | and eventually, passive DPS from the tank etc killed him |
| 00:42.56 | taroven | So note to self. When TortoiseSVN says stuff about trying to resolve file conflicts, don't let it. |
| 00:43.00 | Jerub | Wimpeh: you know you need two tanks for that one, right? |
| 00:43.10 | Wobin | yeah |
| 00:43.52 | Jerub | Wimpeh: the tank never gets impaled, otherwise RNG would wipe groups. you get the tank to stand there looking pretty while an OT takes him until the MT gets impaled once, then the MT taunts off and you wait until OT is impaled. |
| 00:44.00 | Jerub | by that time you've usually got all 5 done |
| 00:44.18 | Legorol | you can also cheat the achi |
| 00:44.38 | Wimpeh | FFFFFFFFFFFUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUU :(((((( |
| 00:44.40 | Wimpeh | I had no idea |
| 00:44.42 | Wimpeh | Hahaha. |
| 00:44.53 | Wobin | Legorol: really? |
| 00:44.54 | Legorol | a combat ressed/soulstoned person getting impaled again after being ressed also counts as one extra, so you can do it without a second tank |
| 00:45.03 | Wimpeh | amg |
| 00:45.09 | Wimpeh | An ankhed shaman? |
| 00:45.13 | Legorol | that too |
| 00:45.15 | Wobin | oh really, so it's more a count of people impaled |
| 00:45.23 | Legorol | well, i think that one is a bug |
| 00:45.25 | Wobin | instead of 'every person having been impaled' |
| 00:45.32 | Legorol | it should be a count of the number of unique players |
| 00:45.34 | Jerub | you can 4man it too i think. |
| 00:45.44 | Legorol | but somehow death seems to make you unique from your prior life ^^ |
| 00:46.04 | Dagmar | Legorol: That's one way to be sure you don't retake your place on the aggro lists |
| 00:46.22 | Legorol | that too :) |
| 00:47.15 | Jerub | i still need watch him die and the watchers one. |
| 00:47.20 | kd3 | "Feign death? Bah. Mages drop aggro with real death!" |
| 00:47.42 | NightHawkTheSane | /quit |
| 00:47.46 | Dagmar | I was just thinking I could use that and Distracting Shot to maybe get the tank spiked next time I'm in there |
| 00:47.47 | NightHawkTheSane | hm. |
| 00:48.12 | Legorol | Dagmar: you can't have the boss on you for too long with distract/feign |
| 00:48.19 | Legorol | the chances that the boss impales him during that is too low |
| 00:48.26 | Dagmar | Sez you |
| 00:48.36 | Dagmar | Distracting Shot only lasts for six secondsw. |
| 00:49.00 | Dagmar | After that I've got Deterrence or FD. Either way I'm not going to die |
| 00:49.12 | Wimpeh | Watch Him Die was quite easy. We had a rogue vanishpull to bug the boss so we could start behind him |
| 00:49.14 | *** join/#wowuidev SeanK (~SeanK@pool-98-117-120-73.sttlwa.fios.verizon.net) |
| 00:49.25 | Wimpeh | Then we just zerged with me dropping magma totems + fire nova on the small adds if it gets that far |
| 00:49.30 | Wimpeh | Bloodlust did a great deal, though. |
| 00:50.00 | Wimpeh | Tank had to pop all his cooldowns to live though |
| 00:50.32 | Dagmar | We got it for being drunk/hiigh |
| 00:51.14 | Dagmar | We couldn't really remember what to do there, so we figured OMGDPS on the boss would probably work |
| 00:51.56 | Jerub | my bear has 61k health with party buffs now |
| 00:52.16 | Jerub | just need zerg dps. to get it i think. |
| 00:52.51 | Amarande | hmm, what do I still need for glory of the hero on my DK |
| 00:53.41 | Amarande | I might try to finish that one out at least before Cata |
| 00:53.56 | Amarande | since I feel like I need something to crown off what's been a pretty successful character despite the difficulties getting raids |
| 00:54.57 | *** join/#wowuidev spode (spode@213.21.119.83) |
| 00:55.01 | Amarande | emerald void, amber void, experienced drake rider, zombiefest, incredible hulk, abuse the ooze, what the eck, share the love, less-rabi, chaos theory, respect your elders, and volunteer work. |
| 00:55.02 | Wimpeh | My priest was a rather successful character, though I'm hoping to get my Shaman to that level instead. |
| 00:55.13 | Wimpeh | Taht is a lot of shit |
| 00:55.15 | Amarande | EDR is easy, I can get that in two days |
| 00:55.28 | Amarande | What the Eck basically just needs me to find a Gundrak group that's actually *doing* Eck |
| 00:55.35 | Wimpeh | We did it today |
| 00:55.35 | Wimpeh | :3 |
| 00:55.41 | Wimpeh | Got my "What the Eck" tonight. |
| 00:55.44 | Amarande | the others probably are going to need dedicated groups |
| 00:55.53 | Jerub | i have pugged less-rabi twice now |
| 00:55.56 | Amarande | especially since as DPS, I have little control over the drake choices |
| 00:55.56 | Jerub | without coordination. |
| 00:56.03 | Wimpeh | I doubt it. Except maybe Zombiefest. |
| 00:56.09 | Jerub | the trick for less-rabi is to trigger first transformation just before 50% |
| 00:56.13 | Jerub | er, interrupt |
| 00:56.14 | Amarande | if I was a healer, I'd just have to not hop on a green drake as normally expected, and then just zerg Eregos down |
| 00:56.29 | Amarande | Jerub: you just need two interrupters, basically |
| 00:56.34 | Wimpeh | _TRIGGER_ first transformation |
| 00:56.35 | Wimpeh | Wait what? |
| 00:56.43 | Jerub | i mean interrupt. |
| 00:56.47 | Wimpeh | Oh |
| 00:56.48 | Jerub | Amarande: and zerg quality dps. |
| 00:56.49 | Wimpeh | Well yeah |
| 00:56.56 | Amarande | Jerub: well that goes without saying in heroics now :) |
| 00:56.58 | Wimpeh | We nearly had it tonight |
| 00:56.59 | Wimpeh | but |
| 00:57.07 | Jerub | Amarande: because after a certain point he goes instant. |
| 00:57.07 | Amarande | in fact, I think I may only need the second interrupter once |
| 00:57.08 | Wimpeh | Me and my tank friend, interrupted the first cast simultaneously. |
| 00:57.13 | Wimpeh | Even though we agreed I was doing it |
| 00:57.14 | Amarande | because I think a DK can interrupt all the other ones alone |
| 00:57.16 | Wimpeh | So we were like: Oh right. |
| 00:57.18 | Amarande | frost DK, anyway |
| 00:57.28 | Amarande | with the zero runic power mind freeze |
| 00:57.50 | Wimpeh | Just get 5 dps |
| 00:57.54 | Wimpeh | 2 being able to interrupt |
| 00:57.56 | Wimpeh | and you're done |
| 00:57.58 | Wimpeh | ask 4 friends to come |
| 00:58.05 | Wimpeh | "So yeah all you need to do is rape him." |
| 00:58.09 | Wimpeh | Make sure to get a shaman since BL is hot |
| 00:58.22 | Jerub | Wimpeh: not that easy. at a certain health level he transforms instantly. |
| 00:58.31 | Amarande | besides, the only healer friend I have who's on particularly much is a shaman anyway :) |
| 00:58.45 | Amarande | which really is what gets me when it comes to building friends groups |
| 00:58.51 | Amarande | I only know one or two healers, most aren't on very much |
| 00:59.04 | Amarande | and basically no tanks, apart from the one who tanks some of our ICC 10 runs |
| 00:59.17 | Amarande | granted I can tank SOME heroics just on power alone now, but not all of them |
| 01:00.00 | Legorol | Amarande: a DK can interrupt with the exact same frequency as a warrior or rogue, no more often |
| 01:00.09 | Legorol | regardless of the Mind Freeze talent |
| 01:00.26 | Amarande | Legorol: you can also use strangulate on one transform |
| 01:00.33 | Amarande | (this is probably required at one point) |
| 01:00.34 | Legorol | i don't think so |
| 01:00.47 | Legorol | bosses are immune to strangulate generally |
| 01:00.59 | Amarande | anyway, I do have over 30k unbuffed in my tank gear, but I only have 477 def |
| 01:01.09 | Amarande | which basically means I'm not going to be tanking ICC5 heroic, nor likely TOC5 heroic |
| 01:01.13 | Legorol | getting defense up is easy, even with blue gear |
| 01:01.14 | Amarande | but *probably* could handle most of the others |
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| 01:01.29 | Legorol | if you don't mind help/advice/tips on how to, i am very happy to help |
| 01:01.29 | Amarande | depends on the healer, I'm guessing |
| 01:01.58 | Legorol | the problem with doing the smart thing and getting your defense up is that your Hp would drop some, and stupid GS-whore puggers look at Hp instead of other stats |
| 01:02.11 | Amarande | that's one thing I *won't* miss in Cata, anyway, is the defense rating stuff |
| 01:02.17 | Amarande | Legorol: well, they do kind of have a point |
| 01:02.28 | Legorol | it's a very bad point that's overabused |
| 01:02.31 | Amarande | if you've got a great healer and the HP to take a crit the defense doesn't matter as much |
| 01:02.38 | Legorol | Hp doesn't in any way actually reduce the amount of damage you take |
| 01:02.39 | Legorol | defense does |
| 01:02.56 | Legorol | i think what you said the wrong way to look at it |
| 01:03.06 | Amarande | let's put it this way ... even in my DPS gear |
| 01:03.09 | Legorol | if you want to have enough Hp to comfortably take crits, why not avoid crits altogether and go with half the Hp? |
| 01:03.21 | Amarande | I almost managed to save us against heroic Tyrannus after the tank went down by just grabbing aggro before he could go for the squishies and going all out |
| 01:03.37 | Legorol | sure, plate dps is generally viable as emergency tanks, and that'sa great thing |
| 01:03.43 | Amarande | so basically, 4-man, with a tank in DPS gear, we got Tyrannus down to 80k HP |
| 01:03.54 | Amarande | if we'd had the whole party I would have definitely pulled it off ;) |
| 01:04.05 | Legorol | as for great healers: a great healer is one that doesn't get into trouble and is always able to heal you |
| 01:04.24 | Legorol | such a healer will not care about your Hp, as he will be able to cope with bursts regardless, and you help him more by taking less damage imo |
| 01:04.40 | Amarande | however, defense rating will indeed very soon be a thing of the past |
| 01:04.49 | Legorol | it's the sucky healers that react too slow, or don't pay attention, or look at other stuff and drool, which require the huge Hp pools that allow 5-second reaction times |
| 01:04.50 | Amarande | I'm not at all sure how tanking stats are going to work in 4.0 |
| 01:05.05 | Legorol | i understand why blizz is getting rid of it, and i don't mind it going |
| 01:05.11 | Dagmar | Just that? |
| 01:05.18 | Amarande | I looked at my tank gear on PTR, I noticed the defense on my shoulder enchant was changed to dodge but I'm finding it a bit difficult to figure out what happened to it on the rest of the items |
| 01:05.18 | Legorol | however, i liked the stat a lot, it fit in very nicely with the image of a tank |
| 01:05.39 | Amarande | Legorol: it was, however, too single-mindedly focused into one stat |
| 01:05.47 | Legorol | you put on massive plate armor: of course you "defend" better, and take less damage |
| 01:05.56 | Legorol | how plate armor helps you swiftly dodge attacks is beyond me |
| 01:06.05 | Amarande | it's just like how I find it a little flawful of PvP that it's almost all based on one stat now |
| 01:06.07 | Dagmar | Magnets |
| 01:06.14 | Legorol | lol |
| 01:06.23 | Legorol | well Amarande, tank gear had lots of other stats too |
| 01:06.24 | Amarande | also: it contributed to the shortage of tanks, I'm sure |
| 01:06.34 | Amarande | especially at the heroic level |
| 01:06.34 | Legorol | but to me, the defense stat on it signified its value to make you tougher as a tank |
| 01:06.50 | Legorol | i have heard that said before, and i disagree |
| 01:06.50 | Amarande | remember: healers have no really fixed stat requirement for heroics. they just have to be able to heal hard enough that things don't die |
| 01:06.57 | Legorol | it's not the lack of gear that's stopping people from tanking 5-mans |
| 01:07.05 | Legorol | tank gear is so easy to get if they chose to |
| 01:07.05 | Amarande | DPS have very little fixed stat requirement for heroics either, because depending on talents they need either no or very little hit rating for 82's |
| 01:07.20 | Legorol | ok, that's a good point you make there |
| 01:07.25 | Amarande | Tanks, on the other hand, are forced to gather up gear to 535 defense before they can tank heroics at all, otoh |
| 01:07.26 | Legorol | so it might have stopped some people from tanking |
| 01:07.37 | Dagmar | No they're not |
| 01:07.38 | Legorol | but i think by far the majority of the barrier came from tanking being a hassle of a role |
| 01:07.43 | Jerub | Amarande: that's not true today |
| 01:07.48 | Dagmar | They're not forced to |
| 01:07.49 | Jerub | Amarande: i started tanking heroics at 490 |
| 01:07.51 | Amarande | Jerub: well, that's more meta |
| 01:08.03 | Amarande | mainly the fact that stuff dies so quickly now due to uber DPS |
| 01:08.03 | Jerub | it was only necessery when boss fights were routinely 1-2 minutes |
| 01:08.04 | Legorol | you are not forced to, but pugs will kick you if you didn't |
| 01:08.05 | Dagmar | You can get close enough from just regular instance drops |
| 01:08.09 | Jerub | because it was multiple crits killing tanks. |
| 01:08.20 | Legorol | but Amarande does have a point: |
| 01:08.26 | Legorol | generally as people level, everyone has dps gear |
| 01:08.28 | Dagmar | F**king puggers can barely be bothered to notice most of the time |
| 01:08.34 | Jerub | but with these 20 second fights, the boss isn't alive long enough to lucky tripleshot the tank |
| 01:08.36 | Legorol | healers can also use whatever caster gear they happen to have (with the exception of paladins) |
| 01:08.49 | Legorol | tanks are the only ones that have to prep a bit upon reaching 80 before they can go to heroics |
| 01:09.10 | Legorol | but, again, i don't think this is the biggest problem |
| 01:09.27 | Legorol | god knows i have seen paladins dps-ing in healing gear, or DK-s dps-ing in tank gear |
| 01:09.35 | Legorol | so people routinely take the piss and enter in wrong gear |
| 01:09.50 | Wimpeh | Legorol: I understand what you're saying about big health pools. My friend that I run heroics with usually goes for a DPS hybrid gear that gets him nearly def capped (if not just over) but focuses on armor penetration and strength for more DPS to make it all go quicker. He sits in around 34k hp in this and when he does need healing that's no problem, since 34k is more than enough to handle any spell in the game. |
| 01:09.54 | Legorol | i do think the biggest barrier to tanking is this: you do actually have to focus constantly on the game for the full duration of the run |
| 01:10.00 | Legorol | if you don't play, the group doesn't progress |
| 01:10.01 | Dagmar | I watched a pug chewing out my girl the other night for being unable to keep up with healing ToC 5-man |
| 01:10.06 | Legorol | but dps can afk, alt-tab, drink, eat etc. |
| 01:10.11 | Dagmar | Problem #1: Fucking DK tank in blood |
| 01:10.20 | Legorol | and a healer, with a decent tank/group, can toss a heal every so often but otherwise watch TV |
| 01:10.26 | kd3 | whee, goatcaller's having a bit too much fun tonight |
| 01:10.27 | Dagmar | Problem #2: No one getting out of the damn poison puddles |
| 01:10.36 | kd3 | http://forums.worldofwarcraft.com/thread.html?topicId=26725954789&sid=1&pageNo=23#447 |
| 01:10.43 | Jerub | Legorol: yep, that's how i heal heroics. |
| 01:10.49 | Jerub | and for that matter, classic dungeons. |
| 01:10.51 | Amarande | Dagmar: I thought blood was the preferred tanking spec now for DKs? |
| 01:10.52 | Jerub | BRD + firefly |
| 01:10.54 | Legorol | Dagmar: yah, i hate that, people going mental on the healer when not even knowing encounter mechanics |
| 01:10.57 | Amarande | (And in Cata, it will be the ONLY tanking spec for DKs) |
| 01:11.00 | Legorol | Amarande: spec yes, presence no |
| 01:11.08 | Amarande | ahh, presence |
| 01:11.16 | Amarande | yeah that's bad |
| 01:11.26 | Amarande | at least till cata, where they're swapping the effects of blood and frost presences |
| 01:11.41 | Amarande | s/cata/4.0 |
| 01:11.42 | Amarande | (that's already on PTR) |
| 01:12.45 | *** join/#wowuidev Repo (~supybot@repos.curseforge.net) |
| 01:12.46 | Dagmar | Yeah, like I was saying earlier, there's a hell of a lot of puggers who think their gear will make up for playing like imbeciles |
| 01:13.06 | Dagmar | If you want short queue times, don't let your successful pug-members run off at the end |
| 01:13.10 | Adys | anyone here has ever compiled pulseaudio? |
| 01:13.26 | *** join/#wowuidev Limbero (~Limbero@c83-250-2-110.bredband.comhem.se) |
| 01:13.30 | Dagmar | Adys: I'm not sure I should even answer that |
| 01:13.37 | Dagmar | It could be incriminating. |
| 01:13.47 | Dagmar | PA is not much of a fix for anything |
| 01:14.09 | Adys | yeah well bite me, I have usb headphones |
| 01:14.11 | Dagmar | I'll suggest outright that if you can avoid a dependency on pulse, that's probably the way you wanna go |
| 01:14.21 | Dagmar | So don't unplug them. ;) |
| 01:14.47 | Dagmar | Okay so that's the one thing pulse is good for, hotpluggable headphones |
| 01:14.48 | Amarande | Dagmar: and then you end up with a pug environment where they assume everyone IS an imbecile and needs uber gear to make up for it :| |
| 01:15.08 | Dagmar | Amarande: Exactly. F**k the idiots and what they want |
| 01:15.10 | Amarande | hence EG telling you you should be doing ICC25h and being barely able to qualify for groups for ICC10n |
| 01:15.29 | Adys | Dagmar: just because car tires may go flat doesn't mean you should always walk |
| 01:15.33 | Adys | if you catch my drift |
| 01:15.41 | Dagmar | Amarande: That's EG telling you your'e not skilled enough for ICC10 |
| 01:16.11 | Amarande | Adys: but the way it actually goes is more like people saying you need an XK for driving that a Civic will do just fine for |
| 01:16.29 | Adys | dude Im not even remotely talking about wow |
| 01:16.42 | Amarande | oh I thought you were referring to the gear thing |
| 01:16.48 | Amarande | which is pretty much exactly that sort of attitude |
| 01:16.50 | Dagmar | Adys: When your car can also explode, electrocute everyone on the driver's side, spontaneously turn inside out, as well as scream out "N*GG*RS!" in the completely wrong part of town, what then? |
| 01:17.10 | Wimpeh | Naggers? |
| 01:17.21 | Adys | alsa has a terribly large set of issues |
| 01:17.26 | Amarande | in fact, it's pretty precisely that sort of attitude, because generally the equivalent in raiding is that you bring people in uber gear and they keep running into so many potholes and stop and go traffic that even if you had a Jag it wouldn't do you any good. :) |
| 01:17.31 | Adys | but since it's so much better than OSS nobody talks about them |
| 01:17.31 | Dagmar | Yeah but their issues sit still |
| 01:17.32 | kd3 | largely 'cause it's freaking alsa |
| 01:17.43 | Adys | either way Im compiling pulse because ubuntu's version is full of hacks which apparently make wine go sadface |
| 01:17.49 | Adys | trying to debug some crap |
| 01:17.50 | Adys | anyway |
| 01:18.00 | Amarande | case in point: Sindy |
| 01:18.03 | Amarande | I know the Sindy fight |
| 01:18.05 | Dagmar | Pulse brings you NEW issues, oh, and you are generlaly using it in conjunction with ALSA anyway so... Better to limit the number of issues in play |
| 01:18.09 | Amarande | I break iceblocks like a pro now |
| 01:18.17 | Wimpeh | I shit iceblocks like a pro. |
| 01:18.19 | Amarande | and yet, only one week have I actually downed sindy, because the raid spoiled it for me the other weeks. |
| 01:18.40 | Wimpeh | It's a retard check? I've never actually done it. |
| 01:18.48 | Amarande | Wimpeh: it's a choreography check |
| 01:18.54 | Adys | my compiled pulse works fine with apps that have a pulse backend but it doesn't seem to emulate alsa properly |
| 01:18.57 | Amarande | p2, especially |
| 01:18.58 | Amarande | p1 is cake |
| 01:19.00 | Amarande | but p2, oh god p2 |
| 01:19.07 | Wimpeh | As in? Rape this at the right time? |
| 01:19.14 | Amarande | Wimpeh: as in, here's how it works |
| 01:19.17 | Adys | This is my configure line |
| 01:19.18 | Adys | http://dpaste.com/243560/ |
| 01:19.19 | Jerub | uh, you mean p3 |
| 01:19.31 | Jerub | sindy is p1/p2/p1/p2 then p3 |
| 01:19.33 | Amarande | Jerub: our raid considers the whole thing before 35% to be a single phase |
| 01:19.35 | Adys | Im somewhat positive Im disabling a wrong component but can't see which it would be |
| 01:19.45 | Amarande | so does DBM, for that matter |
| 01:20.00 | Jerub | dbm says 'air phase' |
| 01:20.09 | Wimpeh | DOESN'T MATTER. EXPLAIN FIGHT PLEASE. |
| 01:20.12 | Amarande | yeah, we consider ground/air phase swaps to both be part of p1 |
| 01:20.13 | Amarande | anyway. |
| 01:20.13 | Dagmar | Adys: Allow me to suggest you use a few _less_ --disable statements. |
| 01:20.20 | Amarande | Sindy's most salient ability is Frost Beacon. |
| 01:20.23 | Adys | like what? |
| 01:20.36 | Dagmar | Like only disable the stuff you know you don't want |
| 01:20.39 | Legorol | Amarande: i'm not sure why yo are referring to the fight as a "choreography". |
| 01:20.46 | Amarande | A raid member with Frost Beacon will be encased in an iceblock after a short time. This iceblock is separately targetable and DPS'able. |
| 01:20.55 | Legorol | Isn't it mostly about "you got nasty debuff that bombs/nukes/explodes/freezes the raid, so run away"? |
| 01:20.56 | Dagmar | ...or go grab the ubuntu source deb and modify it (probably the winning scenario) |
| 01:21.00 | Adys | yeah and I don't want any of this shit; the only thing I may want is x11 but apparently it's somethign totally unrelated |
| 01:21.04 | Legorol | that concept is as old as vanilla raiding imo |
| 01:21.06 | Amarande | The person in it is stunned and invulnerable, but will start taking on damage and die after a period of time. |
| 01:21.15 | Adys | i dont like when packages pull hundred libs |
| 01:21.20 | Amarande | now, here's the thing about frost beacon |
| 01:21.21 | Wimpeh | So you break them out |
| 01:21.21 | Adys | you should see my vlc configure line |
| 01:21.22 | Adys | sec. |
| 01:21.26 | Dagmar | You already have the damn things installed |
| 01:21.41 | Amarande | anyone who's too near the beaconed person a short time before the iceblock (the critical time is when you see a flash) |
| 01:21.42 | Adys | no i dont |
| 01:21.45 | Amarande | will ALSO be iceblocked |
| 01:22.01 | Adys | only one i have installed is openssl |
| 01:22.21 | Amarande | anyway in air phases during the first 2/3 of the battle, two people are beaconed, and that part is easy enough, just don't destroy the iceblocks too soon because they're your shield against her frost breath attack that she uses 4 times before landing |
| 01:22.26 | Amarande | the hard part is in the last third |
| 01:22.44 | Dagmar | Adys: WHat distro are you using? |
| 01:22.46 | Adys | Dagmar: you forget on ubuntu the -dev packages are separate |
| 01:22.48 | Amarande | a random person (not the MT or OT) is beaconed at intervals |
| 01:23.06 | Amarande | which means that person has to run away from the raid, or the whole raid's going to be iced |
| 01:23.21 | *** join/#wowuidev Xyphoid (~xyph@unaffiliated/xyphoid) |
| 01:23.24 | Amarande | however, RIGHT AFTER that person is iced, the raid has to immediately break down the iceblock because there's not much time before the NEXT beacon. |
| 01:23.39 | Adys | Also Dagmar / kd3 if you want a laugh |
| 01:23.39 | Adys | http://dpaste.com/243561/ |
| 01:23.46 | Amarande | basically, it's a precise run back and forth fest where you have to break down the iceblocks before the next one comes or you're basically screwed |
| 01:23.53 | kd3 | wtf adys |
| 01:24.01 | Amarande | and you basically have to designate two alternating locations and dance between them |
| 01:24.05 | Wimpeh | Sounds like fun |
| 01:24.11 | Dagmar | NO fucking wonder it doesn't work |
| 01:24.15 | Wimpeh | Sounds like a lot of fun, I want to do that fight |
| 01:24.20 | Dagmar | --disable-worky |
| 01:24.21 | Amarande | because all the iceblock locations have to be far enough from the raid, but still near enough to the tank that the healer can keep the tanks up through all this |
| 01:24.21 | Adys | Dagmar: eh? |
| 01:24.23 | Wimpeh | I shalt pug it tomorrow! |
| 01:24.52 | Dagmar | If you honestly expect that many squirrely configure arguments will all work correctly, you have probably lost your mind |
| 01:24.52 | Amarande | but so much can go wrong in that phase it's silly |
| 01:25.02 | Wimpeh | It sounds rather easy |
| 01:25.05 | Amarande | remember, also, that the last 35% of sindy basically has to be taken down by tanks alone, with only a little help from dots |
| 01:25.06 | Adys | vlc works fine, wtf are you talking about |
| 01:25.07 | Wimpeh | "I step over here, heal and dps me asap" |
| 01:25.16 | Dagmar | You might also want these patches https://tango.0pointer.de/pipermail/pulseaudio-discuss/2008-May/001749.html |
| 01:25.17 | Adys | in fact vlc is the app that works best right here |
| 01:25.18 | Amarande | because DPS basically do not have *time* to wail on sindy during that whole phase |
| 01:25.31 | Wimpeh | Affliction and ShadowPriests dominate. |
| 01:25.34 | Wimpeh | I understand! |
| 01:25.37 | Adys | WOW STOP USING RETARDED HTTPS CERTS |
| 01:25.45 | Dagmar | I mean, seriously dude. The #1 best way I've ever found to make a package fuck up is to specify as much weird shit to configure as you possibly can. |
| 01:25.48 | Amarande | when you get one block down (assuming it's not a 10m with people who really outgear it) |
| 01:25.57 | Amarande | you already have to be on the move towards the next one |
| 01:26.02 | Dagmar | You will generally encounter all kinds of crazy ass problems that way |
| 01:26.06 | Amarande | and you absolutely cannot afford the time to DPS Sindy while an ice block exists |
| 01:26.11 | Wimpeh | Wouldn't warriors be effective |
| 01:26.13 | Wimpeh | charging etc |
| 01:26.13 | Amarande | and every now and then two people get iced because someone was too close |
| 01:26.18 | Wimpeh | A lot of melee have a way of getting in close |
| 01:26.23 | Adys | Dagmar: most of this is disabled by default, i specify it to be verbose |
| 01:26.25 | Wimpeh | Sprint for rogues if they fall behind, leaps for cat druids etc |
| 01:26.26 | Adys | helps me keep track |
| 01:26.30 | Legorol | Amarande: there is a big point there that i disagree with, and that's dps not having time, that's just not true if done correctly |
| 01:26.35 | Dagmar | If you only specify the things you *absolutely need* and let the configure script handle the rest, you wind up with *defaults that the developers have actually looked at* |
| 01:26.42 | Amarande | And don't think tanks can't get iced ... they can't be targeted, but they CAN be iced |
| 01:26.47 | Legorol | the key is that you only need to be behind the ice block the *moment* Sindy pulses to refresh your stack of Mystic Buffet |
| 01:26.57 | Legorol | that happens when your current stack has around 3 seconds left |
| 01:27.01 | Dagmar | Adys: Dude, just because you say --disable-whizbang doesn't mean it's going to actually DISABLE feature whizbang |
| 01:27.06 | Legorol | so we tell our dps to be hiding between 4-1 second |
| 01:27.14 | Amarande | Legorol: we rarely have issues with stacks |
| 01:27.14 | Legorol | the rest of the time they stay out, next to the block, ready to jump behind it |
| 01:27.14 | Adys | Dagmar: lemme rephrase that |
| 01:27.22 | Adys | most of this stuff is disabled at configure time by default |
| 01:27.33 | Adys | eg all the oss crap, dns and what not |
| 01:27.33 | Wimpeh | Oh I am pugging that fight tomorrow. |
| 01:27.33 | Dagmar | There's a non-insignificant chance it'll actually enable that feature, or better yet, make the thing skip a test that keeps it from setting something else some other configure test looks for |
| 01:27.35 | Legorol | Amarande: this is not an issue with the stack. This is making sure that the dps doesn't spend longer behind the iceblocks than they need to |
| 01:27.36 | Wimpeh | After the reset. |
| 01:27.37 | Legorol | so they can actually dps |
| 01:27.38 | Amarande | the main issues I've seen are related to the dance and to getting the iceblocks down fast enough |
| 01:27.48 | Amarande | Legorol: except |
| 01:27.49 | Dagmar | Adys: When it's set by default THEN DON'T SPECIFY IT |
| 01:27.50 | Amarande | if an iceblock is up |
| 01:27.50 | Legorol | you don't need to kill the iceblock before the 2nd spawns |
| 01:27.53 | Legorol | you have ages to kill it |
| 01:27.56 | Dagmar | Adys: I'm not just talking shit here man |
| 01:27.58 | Amarande | it always has to be your priority target or too many people get iced at once and then you go south |
| 01:28.01 | Amarande | particularly on 10 |
| 01:28.08 | Legorol | that's true, but.. they don't really have a lot of Hp |
| 01:28.10 | Amarande | might be different on 25 when you have more people to work with |
| 01:28.14 | Legorol | if you are going with 3 healers, you have 5 dps |
| 01:28.17 | Dagmar | I built Gnome from source from versions 1.2 or so all the way to about 2.8 |
| 01:28.18 | Legorol | even if one is tombed, that's 4 dps |
| 01:28.20 | Dagmar | Every damn release |
| 01:28.24 | Adys | Dude |
| 01:28.24 | Legorol | 4 dps should be able to get a block down pretty fast |
| 01:28.27 | Adys | Im not fucking building gnome |
| 01:28.36 | Adys | I got a dozen or so packages Im compiling thats it |
| 01:28.41 | Wimpeh | Get bursty DPS such as Arcane MAges? |
| 01:28.41 | Amarande | Legorol: yeah, the real problem is that every week we end up having to get someone new into the raid |
| 01:28.44 | Legorol | heck, in our gear, when running 10-man, we assign *one* dps to the block |
| 01:28.48 | Dagmar | I say these things because I learned the hard way how to get GNOME to actually work, and these same practices apply to every bloody thing else one compiles |
| 01:28.53 | Amarande | because only about 6-8 or so of our raid is every-weekers |
| 01:28.55 | Adys | if theres configure mess i report the bug and it gets fixed |
| 01:29.02 | Dagmar | If you specify a million flags you will not get a working system. |
| 01:29.03 | Amarande | and there's always SOMEONE who doesn't know sindy and screws it up |
| 01:29.07 | Jerub | iceblock breaking is a matter of dpsing slowly and precisely, not speed |
| 01:29.08 | Legorol | Amarande: yah that sounds like the biggest problem, sindy fight needs learning |
| 01:29.09 | Adys | heres the thing |
| 01:29.15 | Adys | i dont give a damn about gnome |
| 01:29.16 | Dagmar | Just because you're only building one thing doesn't mean specifying a million flags won't fuck it right up |
| 01:29.17 | Legorol | but, don't you have a finite number of people in your guild? |
| 01:29.20 | Jerub | the BQ fight needs just as much learning |
| 01:29.23 | Legorol | wouldn't they eventually all learn the fight? |
| 01:29.27 | Legorol | i disagree, jerub |
| 01:29.27 | Amarande | Legorol: I raid with a different guild, so I don't know their stats |
| 01:29.30 | Jerub | and more coordination |
| 01:29.32 | Gnarfoz | meh, when will they finally make real names optional for RealID friends-of-friends... |
| 01:29.32 | Legorol | sindi needs more |
| 01:29.35 | Dagmar | You make SMALL changes from the baseline default build |
| 01:29.52 | Dagmar | Not "I'm a gentooer so I am blessed by god" USE flags a mile long |
| 01:29.54 | Amarande | in any case it pisses me the hell off because I've been doing sindy for three weeks and about fifteen atts total and have it down like the back of my hand |
| 01:29.57 | Legorol | Gnarfoz: they announced that there will be an option Soon(TM) that lets you opt out of the friend-of-friend |
| 01:29.59 | Jerub | Legorol: on sindy, healers can just heal and stand on the steps when they get iceblocked. |
| 01:30.02 | Amarande | and yet I've only downed her once |
| 01:30.13 | Jerub | Legorol: one tank can ZZ the entire fight, and then just tauntswap and hide in p3 |
| 01:30.15 | Gnarfoz | Legorol: what makes you think I'm not aware of exactly that? ;p that's why I was asking! :P |
| 01:30.23 | Adys | Dagmar: are you going to start being helpful? |
| 01:30.33 | *** join/#wowuidev Aeyan (~pancake@cpe-024-163-016-179.triad.res.rr.com) |
| 01:30.40 | Adys | theres 20ish configure flags in PA most of them disabled by default |
| 01:30.45 | Legorol | Gnarfoz: because you asked about real names being optional. |
| 01:30.48 | Amarande | Legorol: does your 10-man have mostly 277 now? |
| 01:30.52 | Jerub | the only issue iv'e had with sindy is dps surviving the whole fight so we can get her down before enrage. |
| 01:30.55 | Legorol | there will not be a friend-of-friend feature without real names |
| 01:30.58 | Gnarfoz | Legorol: there will. |
| 01:31.00 | Gnarfoz | that announcement was from middle of July |
| 01:31.03 | Adys | Im looking at what could be making me miss alsa compat |
| 01:31.08 | Gnarfoz | http://blue.mmo-champion.com/t/26137024221/answers-to-common-community-questions-real-id <- |
| 01:31.09 | Wimpeh | I've heard that the most annoying fight by far is The Blood Prince Council due to RNG factors |
| 01:31.10 | Wimpeh | True/false |
| 01:31.14 | Amarande | Wimpeh: False |
| 01:31.15 | Legorol | Gnarfoz: as far as i remember, what is optional is the friend-of-friend feature |
| 01:31.18 | Amarande | I LOVE the Blood Prince Council fight |
| 01:31.19 | Gnarfoz | Legorol: http://blue.mmo-champion.com/t/26137024221/answers-to-common-community-questions-real-id |
| 01:31.21 | Legorol | i don't think they said that you will be able to |
| 01:31.24 | Amarande | it's easily my favorite fight in ICC and probably in all of WoW |
| 01:31.32 | Wimpeh | Really |
| 01:31.39 | Legorol | Amarande: have you done yogg-saron? |
| 01:31.41 | Jerub | Wimpeh: blood prince council with 3 tanks and 3 healers on 10 man is zzzz. |
| 01:31.42 | Legorol | that's my favourite |
| 01:31.44 | Amarande | Legorol: missed Ulduar |
| 01:31.49 | Wimpeh | YOGG-SARON <3 I loved that fight. |
| 01:31.49 | Jerub | yogg-saron is totally awesome |
| 01:31.49 | Amarande | no one does it anymore on Turalyon, either |
| 01:31.51 | Wimpeh | It was fantastic. |
| 01:31.51 | Gnarfoz | they said exactly what I "meh"'d about just now. |
| 01:31.59 | Wimpeh | Best fight I've ever done, shared with Firefighter. |
| 01:32.10 | Amarande | Jerub: we usually 2-tank it |
| 01:32.15 | Legorol | Gnarfoz: no they didn't, and i quote: |
| 01:32.16 | Amarande | maybe that's why it's more fun |
| 01:32.16 | Legorol | "we plan to include an option that will allow players to opt out of appearing on their Real ID friends friends of friends lists" |
| 01:32.36 | Legorol | Gnarfoz: show me where it says that you will be able to use friend-of-friend but with in-game name instead of real names |
| 01:32.36 | Amarande | Legorol: wait |
| 01:32.40 | Amarande | every time I add a Real ID friend |
| 01:32.48 | Amarande | I'm also adding them to the friends list of all my OTHER real id friends? |
| 01:32.54 | Legorol | not quite |
| 01:32.57 | Jerub | Amarande: the only danger on blood council is getting bored for tank+healer |
| 01:32.57 | Wimpeh | Nearly. |
| 01:32.58 | Gnarfoz | Amarande: read the FAQ |
| 01:33.12 | Legorol | Amarande: all your real ID friends have the ability to have a look at *your* real ID friend list |
| 01:33.16 | Gnarfoz | Legorol: I apologize, I took the "in this fashion" a bit earlier in the sentence to mean what I said. |
| 01:33.28 | Amarande | Jerub: actually, the main thing I've seen go south there is the kelly tank getting gibbed |
| 01:33.35 | Legorol | they can then invite people from there, but they need approval of course |
| 01:33.38 | Gnarfoz | full opt-out is even better! :D |
| 01:33.44 | Amarande | usually because someone uses an attack with an AoE component on Keleseth while he's empowered |
| 01:33.46 | Gnarfoz | (too bad it's still not there) |
| 01:33.52 | Amarande | causing the tank to lose aggro from shadow orbs |
| 01:33.59 | Amarande | and then taking full damage from the empowered shadow lance |
| 01:34.03 | Jerub | Amarande: sounds like youneed better dps. |
| 01:34.03 | Amarande | which kind of is gibby. |
| 01:34.09 | Legorol | Amarande: i don't understand. The kelly tank doesn't actually stand at kelly. |
| 01:34.10 | Gnarfoz | sounds like you need better tanks, too |
| 01:34.14 | Legorol | If they do, they are doing the wrong thing. |
| 01:34.15 | Gnarfoz | indeed |
| 01:34.27 | Gnarfoz | or, well, melee tanks can stand right next to keleseth |
| 01:34.30 | Amarande | Jerub: like I said, we have 6-8 regular raiders each week |
| 01:34.35 | Amarande | which means we're grabbing 2-4 pugs most time |
| 01:34.48 | Legorol | Amarande: achi ftw! demand the pugger to have sindi achi |
| 01:34.52 | Wimpeh | Pugs aren't necessarily bad. |
| 01:35.07 | Legorol | and no, i don't think that it's a problem to ask for sindi achi when you don't have it, as long as you explain why |
| 01:35.08 | Xyphoid | my favourite failure at tanking keleseth on my DK was going 'well, i have seven orbs, i may as well run over and put threat on him so people can unload |
| 01:35.09 | Amarande | Wimpeh: yeah, but pugs are also the ones who are going to be new to the fight and not know something is bad until after you wipe |
| 01:35.12 | Xyphoid | and heart striking |
| 01:35.22 | Legorol | your group with hours of practice on sindi does have the right to expect tactics knowledge from a pug |
| 01:35.29 | Wimpeh | Amarande: Not if you demand an achievement. |
| 01:35.38 | *** join/#wowuidev Tuller (~Tuller@c-69-143-56-163.hsd1.va.comcast.net) |
| 01:35.41 | Legorol | an achi is *not* an indication that they know what they are doing, but |
| 01:35.58 | Legorol | the presence of the achi does correlate with knowledge, even if it's not a perfect correlation |
| 01:35.58 | Wimpeh | It certainly shows they atleast know _somewhat_ how the fight works. |
| 01:36.07 | Xyphoid | heart strike also lead me to fail at tanking saurfang, whoops |
| 01:36.09 | Legorol | idd |
| 01:36.21 | Legorol | person with achi is more likely (even if not guaranteed to) know what they are doing than one without |
| 01:36.37 | Amarande | yeah saurfang is one fight that makes me glad and bored to be a frost DPS DK |
| 01:36.41 | Amarande | glad because it's easy |
| 01:36.50 | Amarande | bored because basically on a frost dps dk, saurfang is patchwerk |
| 01:37.03 | Xyphoid | toss some chains |
| 01:37.08 | Wimpeh | Isn't he for every class |
| 01:37.23 | Amarande | Wimpeh: not really |
| 01:37.30 | Wimpeh | Except for maybe tanks |
| 01:37.33 | Wimpeh | Who need to swap |
| 01:37.35 | Amarande | RDPS have to stop and take down bloodbeasts every time |
| 01:37.43 | Wimpeh | Takes like 10 seconds |
| 01:37.45 | Amarande | Healers have to pay attention to marks and such |
| 01:37.55 | Xyphoid | if you felt like helping the ranged you could, i toss chains of ice on beasts as they spawn while tanking |
| 01:37.56 | Amarande | MDPS, though, MDPS just stand there and wail on saurfang mindlessly the whole fight |
| 01:37.58 | Wimpeh | Marked targets move into tank range and Wild Growth + Chain Heal take care of them |
| 01:38.24 | Wimpeh | I basically just stand there spamming chain heal and keeping riptide up on tanks |
| 01:38.26 | Amarande | unless you have such a melee heavy raid that you are forced to melee the beasts (happens sometimes on 10) |
| 01:38.37 | Wimpeh | dropping earthbind whenever they spawn |
| 01:38.52 | Legorol | Amarande: what others said earlier, help CC with chains of ice. |
| 01:38.58 | Legorol | It will spruce up the fight for you, i promise |
| 01:39.01 | Jerub | hey, is it possible to have a macro that will cast one spell if it's off CD and another spell if it's on Cd |
| 01:39.08 | Jerub | is that what /castsequence is? |
| 01:39.12 | Wimpeh | Nope |
| 01:39.13 | Legorol | Being able to chain 2 (or more) beasts with the correct timing so that it's actually useful, is actually quite tricky. |
| 01:39.18 | Wimpeh | Not possible. |
| 01:39.26 | Jerub | what's castsequence? |
| 01:39.42 | Legorol | keep trying to cast a spell until it succeeds, when it does, move on to a different one. |
| 01:39.50 | Wimpeh | ./castsequence Fireball, Frostbolt means it casts Fireball the first click, Frostbolt second click, repeat. |
| 01:40.03 | Legorol | Wimpeh: not entirely true, it keeps trying FB until you succeed. |
| 01:40.08 | Wimpeh | Well yeah |
| 01:40.09 | Legorol | (fireball i mean) |
| 01:40.16 | Wimpeh | Yeah. |
| 01:40.32 | Wimpeh | Was a bit unclear, Legorol is correct. :) |
| 01:40.59 | Amarande | soo ... PTR peeps |
| 01:41.03 | Amarande | who actually have a mage |
| 01:41.07 | Amarande | is frost dps viable in 4.0? |
| 01:41.15 | Wimpeh | Sooo. |
| 01:41.35 | Wimpeh | Raider peeps. Who thinks Marrowgar should spit out more coldflame rows? :D |
| 01:41.37 | Jerub | oh, so i could use castsequence for my blizzard/flamestrike alternation on my mage? |
| 01:41.56 | Jerub | Wimpeh: nah, positioning now means that he only coldflames tanks and they just move lots |
| 01:42.06 | Xyphoid | i like coldflame it gives me something to AMS |
| 01:42.16 | Wimpeh | I love coldflame |
| 01:42.22 | Amarande | meh. |
| 01:42.26 | Gnarfoz | Jerub: hasn't it always? ^^ |
| 01:42.30 | Amarande | marrowgar is just a loot pinata for me anyway |
| 01:42.34 | Wimpeh | It should spit out as often as it does during bone storm. |
| 01:42.37 | Wimpeh | In fact make him constantly bone storm |
| 01:42.41 | Amarande | we really need to start doing heroic marrowgar in our raid |
| 01:42.48 | Wimpeh | So much more fun, while also spiking people. |
| 01:42.50 | Amarande | or is he actually hard on heroic? |
| 01:42.59 | Amarande | since he certainly isn't on normal |
| 01:43.01 | Gnarfoz | not that much harder |
| 01:43.02 | Jerub | i hope we do it on HM this week. |
| 01:43.03 | Xyphoid | turn off the 30% buff and try him |
| 01:43.03 | Wimpeh | Hits harder and bonestorms longer |
| 01:43.17 | Gnarfoz | and bonestorm does damage depending on your distance |
| 01:43.21 | Jerub | we got him to 30% on first try the other day, then decided to just smash through 1st quarter and continue on further |
| 01:43.22 | Gnarfoz | and spikes during bonestorm |
| 01:43.23 | Legorol | he is harder on heroic by quite a bit |
| 01:43.34 | Legorol | the fires and the bonestorm both hit significantly for more |
| 01:43.41 | Jerub | on heroic the tanks can't move left/right because the coldflames last longer. |
| 01:43.47 | Legorol | on normal, you can afford slacky dps who can't look at the screen to get hit a few times, on heroic you can't |
| 01:43.47 | Gnarfoz | Jerub: uh what |
| 01:43.49 | Jerub | you go left left left riiiiiiight |
| 01:43.53 | Gnarfoz | ok ;p |
| 01:43.59 | Jerub | like a typewriter. |
| 01:44.01 | Legorol | and you need coordinated movement so you don't get people spiked during the bonestorm miles away from the raid |
| 01:44.06 | Legorol | another choreography fight for you ;) |
| 01:44.21 | Gnarfoz | well 'CLUMP IN THE MIDDLE' is not a choreography, really |
| 01:44.22 | Jerub | Gnarfoz: i tanked it. |
| 01:44.22 | Gnarfoz | ;p |
| 01:44.34 | Wimpeh | rofl |
| 01:44.35 | Jerub | Gnarfoz: and neither i or the other tank had done it on hm before. |
| 01:44.40 | Legorol | Gnarfoz: that's not what you need the choreography for. You need it for which way to run when Marrowgar decides to be in the middle |
| 01:44.48 | Gnarfoz | he doesn't "decide" |
| 01:44.51 | Legorol | i do think heroic marrowgar is significantly harder |
| 01:45.00 | Gnarfoz | he charges from where he is to the furthest target 'in range' |
| 01:45.01 | *** join/#wowuidev Cairenn_ (~Guest9566@CPE00235435c2a1-CM0012c9213c9c.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com) |
| 01:45.12 | Legorol | Gnarfoz: ok, i used wrong terminology. |
| 01:45.17 | Gnarfoz | so you have the raid in the middle, and 3 people in a triangle outside |
| 01:45.18 | Legorol | It still happens often enough, especially the first one |
| 01:45.35 | Wimpeh | How hard can that be |
| 01:45.36 | Wimpeh | I dunno |
| 01:45.43 | Adys | Dagmar: fixed it; it was configuration, nothing to do with configure |
| 01:45.44 | Wimpeh | But, off to bed! |
| 01:45.49 | Gnarfoz | well, he's not free loot, but there's harder fights in heroic ICC ;) |
| 01:45.50 | Wimpeh | Good night. :) |
| 01:46.11 | Gnarfoz | there's also easier ones -_- |
| 01:46.30 | Legorol | Gnarfoz: well it's not hard for me or my guild. I just think that it is significnatly harder than normal. |
| 01:46.34 | Legorol | Not like the gunship :o) |
| 01:46.37 | Gnarfoz | hehe |
| 01:46.46 | Amarande | btw |
| 01:46.56 | Amarande | what is with PvP realms being consistently higher ranked on progress than PvE realms? |
| 01:47.06 | Gnarfoz | coincidence. |
| 01:47.08 | Amarande | you'd think people whose focus is raiding would want to be on PvE realms, so as to avoid PvP activity getting in the way |
| 01:47.25 | Gnarfoz | you don't get involuntary pvp action getting in the way of raiding *anyway* |
| 01:47.58 | Amarande | of course, the *lowest* ranked realms are always PvP ones too |
| 01:48.03 | Amarande | are there more PvP than PvE realms? |
| 01:48.03 | Legorol | i don't think it's just coincidence, Gnarfoz |
| 01:48.10 | Gnarfoz | what, then? |
| 01:48.18 | Legorol | i do think that people with a "gamer" mentality are more likely to be on a PvP realm |
| 01:48.28 | Amarande | Gnarfoz: not while you're raiding, but while doing ancillary actions like leveling and dailies and resource gathering |
| 01:48.32 | Legorol | people with more competitive/aggressive personality, or striving for success |
| 01:48.41 | Gnarfoz | leveling has nothing to do with raid progress raiding |
| 01:48.41 | *** join/#wowuidev tekkub (~tekkub@WoWUIDev/WoWI/Featured/Dongle/GitHub/Tekkub) |
| 01:48.41 | *** mode/#wowuidev [+v tekkub] by ChanServ |
| 01:48.50 | Gnarfoz | errr |
| 01:48.51 | Gnarfoz | *rating |
| 01:49.18 | Legorol | another factor is: i think the majority of top guilds do consist of mostly people that have been around since WoW's start |
| 01:49.27 | Amarande | Gnarfoz: resource gathering does, though |
| 01:49.40 | Gnarfoz | resources you gather from the AH and... who does dailies... also, who does them at a time or in a way that affects progress rating |
| 01:49.42 | Amarande | you need mats for flasks and for craftable gear and for gems and buff food and such |
| 01:49.44 | Legorol | when WoW first came out, PvP realms appealed more to the type of people mentioned above, or those wanting to experience the game more fully, and hence they started there |
| 01:49.54 | Amarande | you do dailies so you can afford to buy resources from the AH :) |
| 01:49.59 | Gnarfoz | no, you don't? |
| 01:50.06 | Gnarfoz | or well, you don't have to :P |
| 01:50.09 | Amarande | not to mention the repair bill when the pug members wipe you on sindy for the fifth time in a row |
| 01:50.14 | Amarande | and remember, in cata |
| 01:50.17 | Amarande | we ALL get plate repair bills! |
| 01:50.25 | Gnarfoz | there's no pug members in raids that are "high rated" in raid progress *cough* |
| 01:50.38 | Amarande | Gnarfoz: I'm looking at realm rankings, not specific guilds |
| 01:51.00 | Gnarfoz | realm rankings make as much as the question did in the first place :( |
| 01:51.40 | Gnarfoz | but... at least Legorol's answer fits realm rankings perfectly, IMHO ^^ |
| 01:51.45 | Gnarfoz | why is it 4am? |
| 01:51.54 | Gnarfoz | why do days not have at least 30 hours? |
| 01:52.05 | Gnarfoz | those are the questions /I/ want answers to! :P |
| 01:52.05 | Amarande | Legorol: you mean it's actually really rare for expansion startup guilds to ever get much of anywhere? |
| 01:52.16 | Amarande | and most of the guilds that are worth being in are the ones that have been around since 05? |
| 01:52.35 | Amarande | which means getting into WoW late was actually a *lot* worse than one might think? |
| 01:52.47 | Gnarfoz | uhm... |
| 01:52.54 | Legorol | we are talking about world class top end progressoin guilds |
| 01:52.59 | Legorol | those are not the majority :0 |
| 01:53.19 | Amarande | nobody will ever catch up to the likes of Ensidia, will they ... |
| 01:53.23 | Gnarfoz | and the answer he wrongly extrapolated that from just now was about *realms* |
| 01:53.24 | Amarande | that hasn't been around since 05 anyway |
| 01:53.36 | Gnarfoz | of course they can |
| 01:54.04 | Amarande | Gnarfoz: I imagine there's one problem on that though |
| 01:54.06 | Gnarfoz | it's not like guilds like that don't also have player churn |
| 01:54.22 | Amarande | how do you keep your best prospects without them constantly getting siphoned off to the #1 guild once they reach the caliber? |
| 01:54.36 | Amarande | dammit, I should have bought that guild leader guide from the steve jackson games booth at D*Con |
| 01:54.46 | Gnarfoz | if you need a guide for that |
| 01:55.01 | Amarande | but yeah, that's one thing I do have to wonder about the care and feeding of guilds |
| 01:55.04 | Gnarfoz | 1) the #1 guild may be full most of the time |
| 01:55.11 | Gnarfoz | 2) loyalty |
| 01:55.13 | Amarande | what's the trick to keeping your best players from attrition to uber guilds |
| 01:55.17 | SqueeG | there're a lot of startup guilds traht do well |
| 01:55.18 | Legorol | Amarande: player churn always happens, the top leaving for better guilds always happens. |
| 01:55.26 | SqueeG | becauce their original guilds got too bitchy/dramatic |
| 01:55.30 | SqueeG | so they split off |
| 01:55.30 | Gnarfoz | 3) your guild not consisting entirely of 4 raids a week, 4 hours, nothing else to do |
| 01:55.31 | Legorol | There are incentives that can keep them though longer, if you can play your cards right. |
| 01:55.33 | SqueeG | because* |
| 01:55.37 | Gnarfoz | 3) results in 2) |
| 01:55.43 | Amarande | Legorol: but that kinda suggests that a new guild can't ever really rise on a server unless the top guilds suddenly collapse |
| 01:55.57 | Legorol | I don't think that's true, just very hard. |
| 01:55.58 | Amarande | because the top WILL leave for better, thus kinda forcing the guild hierarchy to remain more or less static |
| 01:56.04 | Legorol | There is, indeed, a pecking order of guilds that is hard to break |
| 01:56.15 | Legorol | and no, it's not true that the top necessarily leaves |
| 01:56.16 | Gnarfoz | Amarande: they "WILL" not necessarily |
| 01:56.59 | Gnarfoz | what really limits a change of old guild pecking orders on realms is: limited size player pools |
| 01:57.00 | Amarande | Legorol: you basically have to get 10/25 tops *all at once* to prevent it though, I'm supposing |
| 01:57.15 | Amarande | which I imagine is as rare as it sounds |
| 01:57.18 | Gnarfoz | one realm can only sustain so many raiding guilds |
| 01:57.46 | Amarande | moreover, it might have to be *exactly* 10/25 new top players all at once ... having 11 or 12 is probably the worst thing that can happen to your guild :) |
| 01:57.52 | Gnarfoz | because so many players have no interest in it, no skill to speak of, not enough time, or any combination of it |
| 01:58.15 | Amarande | 11 or 12 high caliber players at once, and you're going to get whomped HARD with drama because they can't all fit in the raid at once ... and drama is really damn hard to tank :) |
| 01:58.39 | Gnarfoz | what are you even talking about right now |
| 01:58.41 | Legorol | actually drama is not hard to deal with if you don't let it happen |
| 01:58.47 | Amarande | Gnarfoz: yeah, time is the thing that hits me the hardest, personally |
| 01:58.52 | Legorol | you have to have a drama-intolerant attitude: if someone starts a drama, don't listen |
| 01:58.54 | Gnarfoz | Legorol: exactly |
| 01:58.58 | Amarande | given that I picked up on the boss strategies like a phenom |
| 01:59.05 | Corrodias | but what if OTHER people listen? |
| 01:59.11 | Corrodias | and banning them outright can just cause MORE drama |
| 01:59.13 | Gnarfoz | Corrodias: kick the troublemaker |
| 01:59.18 | Legorol | what matters is whether leadership listens or not |
| 01:59.22 | Corrodias | you can't just be Hardass McFee and expect everyone to be okay with it. |
| 01:59.34 | Legorol | i'll tell you what i think is the hardest part about leading a guild: |
| 01:59.40 | Corrodias | big surprise, running a business or a guild is not so easy |
| 01:59.48 | Amarande | Legorol: yeah, the main thing I'm wondering though is what happens if you get like ... one or two more Super Awesome recruits (the kind you want to keep and not let be dragged off to your server's Ensidia/Fusion/EJ etc.), than the raid can handle |
| 01:59.48 | Legorol | you don't have *any* real tools to penalise players effectively for infractions. |
| 01:59.49 | Gnarfoz | Corrodias: worked for me so far, YMMV ^^ |
| 01:59.53 | Legorol | the only real power you have is gkcik |
| 01:59.57 | Legorol | everything else is superficial |
| 02:00.05 | Legorol | and that's too course a tool |
| 02:00.10 | Amarande | consider say a 10-man raid, which is usually going to need 2 tanks, 5 DPS, and 3 healers |
| 02:00.22 | Amarande | what do you do when you end up with four awesome healers in your guild, or six awesome DPS or three tanks |
| 02:00.28 | Adys | Legorol: you got a horde char in a guild on beta? |
| 02:00.32 | Gnarfoz | Legorol: benching raiders also works, if you can afford it |
| 02:00.35 | Amarande | to prevent them from all warring on each other and shattering you wide open from the drama because someone's always going to be benched? |
| 02:00.39 | Corrodias | Gnarfoz: perahps you don't do it quite as i described it |
| 02:00.42 | Legorol | Adys: nope, sorry |
| 02:00.47 | Adys | anyone does? |
| 02:00.48 | Legorol | i can roll a level 1 if that helps |
| 02:00.57 | Adys | I need a horde guild |
| 02:01.08 | Legorol | Amarande: in my experience, in reality, being over-populated hasn't been a big problem |
| 02:01.14 | Legorol | that one is easiest to handle imo |
| 02:01.21 | Gnarfoz | Amarande: raiders who can't accept that there's going to be either 1) benching or 2) canceled raid because just ONE player couldn't come lack perspective |
| 02:01.36 | Legorol | attendance problems, inattention, lack of preparation, poor performance in raid, general idiocy/muppetry, these are lot harder to deal with |
| 02:01.43 | *** join/#wowuidev Zyn- (~faggotry@h187n4-av-a11.ias.bredband.telia.com) |
| 02:01.46 | Gnarfoz | and indeed, too many raiders > too few |
| 02:01.52 | SqueeG | well considering there're dual specs now legorol, you have someone start a new spec |
| 02:01.53 | Corrodias | truth |
| 02:01.53 | Legorol | you *want* too many |
| 02:01.54 | Amarande | Gnarfoz: yeah, if anything it's the Ensidia grade guilds that probably get hit worst with drama like that |
| 02:01.56 | Legorol | you need to have backup |
| 02:02.09 | Amarande | remembering that ANYONE can get Kingslayer or Light of Dawn or whatnot |
| 02:02.15 | Amarande | but only a select 10 or 25 can be there for the Realm First |
| 02:02.22 | Amarande | which such guilds are likely to be going for |
| 02:02.55 | Amarande | that 11th or 26th who had what it took but can NEVER get that achievement is going to be looking at you with fire and vitriol |
| 02:03.09 | Legorol | actually i like to refer to Paragon grade guilds :P |
| 02:03.16 | Gnarfoz | well, there's high-end guilds who transferred those who were left out + enough other to make a full raid and got those who were left out their title on another realm. :P |
| 02:03.39 | Amarande | also the other thing to figure out is how to get the 'seed' for a new guild |
| 02:03.50 | SqueeG | people that are that....'hardcore' ..... hurt my brain |
| 02:03.51 | Amarande | how to get them to want to band up with you, rather than all join existing groups |
| 02:03.58 | Gnarfoz | Amarande: and no, "is going to" is just an assumption. you want the guys who can live with not having some title/item/whatever. ;) |
| 02:04.21 | Legorol | Amarande: in my 5-years of experience of being in a raid guild, the thing that works out the best and keeps the guild together/stops members from being leeched is this: |
| 02:04.38 | Legorol | try to have members that have, as much as possibly, the same level of commitment/attitude to the game |
| 02:04.42 | Legorol | i am not talking about time here |
| 02:04.57 | Legorol | do you like reading up on boss tactics and watch videos? then make sure the other 9 also likes to |
| 02:04.58 | Amarande | granted, yes, you do need a certain number of friends to start the guild founding process. but unless you *personally know outside of WoW* nine other people, all of whom play WoW and that you can coax to play on the same realm as you and not join some other guild first, you're not going to found a guild on your personal friends alone. |
| 02:04.59 | Gnarfoz | I'm more OCD than you, get out of my guild! |
| 02:05.12 | Legorol | do you hate wiping endlessly and you prefer quitting after 5 tries if it doesn't work? make sure others' patience threshold is the same |
| 02:05.33 | Legorol | now obviously finding 10 such people through /2 spamming won't happen |
| 02:05.46 | Gnarfoz | but someone might know someone! |
| 02:05.50 | Legorol | but you get some people in, try them out, and don't hesitate to kick them (even if they are leet) if they don't seem compatible in that sense |
| 02:05.52 | Amarande | I guess it's also rare to find people with a natural talent for the game but NOT OCD hardcoreness, too |
| 02:05.53 | Corrodias | and you have to compromise |
| 02:05.54 | Legorol | they will leave soon anyway |
| 02:06.15 | Legorol | Amarande: indeed |
| 02:06.25 | Legorol | although which particular usage of "hardcore" do you have in mind? |
| 02:06.40 | Legorol | hardcore can be completionist, or playing a lot, or being awesome at the game, or being min/maxing |
| 02:06.46 | Gnarfoz | which particular usage of "talent" did you have in mind? they need to be able to use their brain! ^^ |
| 02:07.00 | Amarande | Legorol: I mean, someone who's really good at the game, but at the same time isn't the Fusion/Ensidia/Paragon type |
| 02:07.03 | Amarande | there ARE some of us out there |
| 02:07.19 | Gnarfoz | s/us/those/? :p |
| 02:07.35 | Amarande | I'm virtually certain I am one of them ... I was picking up on my role in boss battles super fast |
| 02:07.57 | Amarande | If I actually DID have the availability and time to do it, I'd probably BE material for world class guilds |
| 02:08.01 | Amarande | but at the same time |
| 02:08.03 | Amarande | I play WoW for fun |
| 02:08.05 | SqueeG | I managed to tank the ..... third part of HFC as Arms back in the day :D |
| 02:08.10 | Amarande | and I'm not willing to warp my real life in order to be that hardcore |
| 02:08.19 | SqueeG | actually... i did most of my tanking as Arms until WoTLK xD |
| 02:08.40 | Legorol | Amarande: well you see, consider comparing you and me |
| 02:08.46 | Amarande | so basically yeah, the sort of people I work best with are ones with the skill and the desire to see content, but who aren't 'omg I need to plan my entire life around WoW' |
| 02:08.56 | Amarande | and preferably are night owls, since late night is the time I tend to be most consistently able to be around |
| 02:09.05 | Legorol | I don't like to spend a lot of time raiding. But what I *do* absolutely consider important is whatever raiding schedule you do subscribe to, you are committed to |
| 02:09.20 | Legorol | You don't go to the cinema on nights you have a raid, you don't come up with poor excuses, and you tell your friends to bugger off |
| 02:09.29 | Legorol | It can be once a week, but the raid schedule is absolute |
| 02:09.32 | SqueeG | right on, lego xD |
| 02:09.34 | Amarande | Indeed, I'm no longer sure if even early evening is a good idea for me for raiding except on Tuesdays and Wednesdays |
| 02:09.35 | Gnarfoz | Amarande: start a night raiding guild, that's a common enough criteria to sort by at first |
| 02:09.54 | Legorol | Barring a real emergency (which means, hospital/burning house/mom died), I will be at the raid. |
| 02:10.03 | Legorol | That's the kind of guild I like to be in, because it makes life so much easier. |
| 02:10.13 | Legorol | And i want others in the guild to prioritise with that attitude |
| 02:10.18 | Amarande | I'm wondering now how much I'm hurting my raid this week by the fact that I unexpectedly had to work till 9PM Thursday (our raid time is 8 Thursday evenings) due to a coworker being on vacation and me having to cover |
| 02:10.37 | Legorol | So if I'm in a guild where people look at WoW as a spare-time filler, which they will not turn up to as soon as there's somethig more "important" in real life, then i wouldn't want to raid with them |
| 02:10.40 | Xyphoid | yeah i think it's much better if people commit to a smaller timeslot than they expect to have |
| 02:10.48 | Amarande | Legorol: I'm assuming this also means that a real raider never goes on vacation at all unless they have a laptop and only travel to places with reliable wifi? |
| 02:11.00 | Gnarfoz | /facepalm |
| 02:11.10 | Legorol | i never mentioned "real" or not real :0 |
| 02:11.11 | Corrodias | depends on your guild's level of raid commitment |
| 02:11.13 | Legorol | and of course you can vacation |
| 02:11.15 | Gnarfoz | you take *everything* to extremes, Amarande |
| 02:11.22 | Legorol | you just make sure to plan it ahead |
| 02:11.32 | Legorol | let the guild leader know 2 weeks in advance, and make sure someone can fill in |
| 02:11.39 | Corrodias | ours was pretty laid back. |
| 02:11.39 | Gnarfoz | ^ |
| 02:11.44 | Amarande | yeah, I did properly give notice for Dragon Con |
| 02:11.50 | Amarande | apparently the raid kinda fell flat that week though :S |
| 02:11.51 | Legorol | basically, act like you would if you were in the national football team.. but only commit 3 hours a week on this level |
| 02:11.59 | *** join/#wowuidev the-golem (~Darrin@c-98-255-201-176.hsd1.ca.comcast.net) |
| 02:12.10 | Legorol | and Amarande, i never said this is how *everyone* should raid |
| 02:12.32 | Legorol | i mentioned earlier today some great experiments where guilds essentially pug from their roster, and there is no amount of raid you definitely have to commit to |
| 02:12.33 | Legorol | that works too |
| 02:12.38 | Corrodias | everyone should play exactly like me |
| 02:12.40 | Gnarfoz | I could use around... 10 or 12 Legorols in my raid right now |
| 02:12.40 | Legorol | I just said what's the one like that I like to be in |
| 02:12.48 | Legorol | lol Gnarfoz |
| 02:12.49 | Xyphoid | i used to be a full-time fillin, that worked pretty well |
| 02:12.58 | Amarande | also, I probably should try to get into raiding earlier in expansion cycles |
| 02:13.04 | Amarande | a lot of my frustration probably stems from timing |
| 02:13.10 | Legorol | could be |
| 02:13.14 | Amarande | in BC I didn't even hit 70 until March of the year LK came out |
| 02:13.16 | Legorol | what Xyphoid said is interesting too |
| 02:13.18 | Xyphoid | was almost always on for the guild raids, but couldn't commit to it, so i just swapped in for the first person to DC or bail |
| 02:13.22 | Legorol | we have social members in my guild |
| 02:13.24 | Legorol | and we use them as fillers |
| 02:13.26 | Amarande | in LK, I swapped mains, didn't get into raiding until August of this year |
| 02:13.27 | Xyphoid | but i didn't expect to be in all the time |
| 02:13.28 | Gnarfoz | our raid pool got kind of watered down over time, we now have too many people that don't really fit in with us :( |
| 02:13.36 | Legorol | basically, they get invited to every raid we do, they dont' have to turn up at all, just whenever they want to |
| 02:13.47 | Legorol | but the understanding is that we never take them unless there is a free spot due to shortage of regulars |
| 02:13.48 | Amarande | Gnarfoz: yeah the most important thing of a guild is it needs to have a strongly knit core |
| 02:13.58 | Xyphoid | Legorol: yep, that was pretty much it - worked fine for me |
| 02:14.03 | Legorol | this system works quite well, with the social members providing a buffer so that our main raid roster can be smaller |
| 02:14.16 | Amarande | hence why I stay in my friends guild on Turalyon ... I wouldn't leave them for the world, certainly not for a raid group that I barely know people in :S |
| 02:14.16 | Jerub | i'm on the 10man team of a guild I'm not a member of. |
| 02:14.18 | Legorol | it helped us get through summer |
| 02:14.18 | Xyphoid | i got in on our first kills of vashj and illidan |
| 02:14.18 | Gnarfoz | we rather refrain from using our social members in our raids |
| 02:14.22 | Amarande | Jerub: yeah, same here |
| 02:14.26 | Jerub | because while they run 25mans, they hate >half of their roster. |
| 02:14.36 | Legorol | Gnarfoz: same. but when the choice is between cancelling or taking 2 socials, the latter is better |
| 02:14.37 | Amarande | although the guild I raid with is pretty tight knit too |
| 02:14.46 | Xyphoid | the thing that particularly suited it was that i hate farm content |
| 02:14.51 | Amarande | Jerub: do you think that 'out of guild regular raider' thing is going to mostly die with Cata? |
| 02:15.02 | Amarande | because of all the perks they're giving out for guild runs? |
| 02:15.05 | Jerub | Amarande: no. |
| 02:15.19 | Legorol | no amount of perks will substitute friends/good players |
| 02:15.27 | Amarande | Legorol: indeed |
| 02:15.29 | Gnarfoz | Legorol: true, luckily it mostly doesn't come to that for us, or we just run with 23 for a while, or move the raid an hour later |
| 02:15.36 | Amarande | and I do still tend to think the guild perks stuff is kind of a mistake |
| 02:15.39 | Legorol | Xyphoid: another thing that helped us with that is that in terms of skill, our socials are pretty good, often on par/better than our raiders |
| 02:15.47 | Amarande | at least, the achievement stuff that forces people to be officially guilded to get |
| 02:15.52 | Legorol | in our case, social are people with lack of time, not lack of skill |
| 02:15.54 | Gnarfoz | if it's more than that, then it's probably obvious beforehand from the raid signups |
| 02:16.01 | Gnarfoz | oh we have plenty of both |
| 02:16.06 | Amarande | and yeah ... I'm definitely the lack of time rather than lack of skill type myself |
| 02:16.18 | Xyphoid | and often it's not so much lack of time as lack of ability to commit to time |
| 02:16.22 | Amarande | I have other interests and I don't want to bleed them dry to do nothing but WoW |
| 02:16.38 | Amarande | Xyphoid: yeah that's a weakness of mine too and not so much my choice either |
| 02:16.38 | Legorol | atm i raid 3 times a week, and i consider that a lot |
| 02:16.40 | Amarande | (job stuff) |
| 02:16.42 | Legorol | i want to drop it to 2 |
| 02:17.00 | Gnarfoz | you don't need to do nothing but WoW, but if you commit a certain amount of time to WoW, you can probably achieve more than you do right now |
| 02:17.09 | Xyphoid | what we're doing is extending a single icc10 and raiding 4-5 hours a week |
| 02:17.10 | Amarande | even Tuesdays, I can sometimes have to work till 9pm. Wednesday is the only day I absolutely am always around in the early evenings. |
| 02:17.21 | Legorol | btw Amarande, i totally sympathise with your frustration over not being able to regularly schedule your free time |
| 02:17.32 | Legorol | it's a bummer, especially if it's stopping you from progrtessing in WoW. progress is fun |
| 02:17.38 | Xyphoid | bash on a boss for 2.5 hrs one night, maybe the next night, and extend next week. we're getting about one down a week. |
| 02:17.49 | Amarande | hence why I crave the late nights, because I *never* get scheduled after midnight or before 7am (and before 9am is rare, in general) |
| 02:18.15 | Gnarfoz | well, again, start a late night raiding group, if that's what works for you |
| 02:18.17 | Amarande | Xyphoid: I hope you get your KS |
| 02:18.20 | Gnarfoz | can advertise that |
| 02:18.23 | Legorol | Amarande: you in US or EU? |
| 02:18.27 | Amarande | I'm still not at all sure of the chances of it happening after 4.0.1 |
| 02:18.32 | Legorol | my realm has a late night guild that *starts* raids at 23:30 |
| 02:18.37 | Amarande | Not because I expect the title to be removed, but for mechanical reasons |
| 02:18.40 | Amarande | Legorol: US |
| 02:18.41 | Legorol | they are 10/12 25-man HM |
| 02:19.11 | Amarande | Basically, I simply am not at all very confident of the ability of 90+% of groups, even ones that handle ICC well now, to be able to handle it in 4.0.x pre-Cata |
| 02:19.34 | Gnarfoz | how about crossing that bridge when you get there? oO |
| 02:19.45 | Amarande | I've said it before ... the fact that everyone's going to be learning all new specs and stat balances, combined with the threat mechanics and lack of boss nerfs making it seem like DPS race battles will be very iffy indeed |
| 02:20.25 | Legorol | the changes will be buffs, more than anything |
| 02:20.34 | Legorol | same sort of thing as pre-TBC |
| 02:20.39 | Amarande | Legorol: yeah, it's the threat mechanics that are mostly worrying me |
| 02:20.44 | Gnarfoz | which is why Blizzard is considering turning off the ICC zone buff, Legorol :> |
| 02:20.51 | Amarande | because bosses in LK were designed on the idea that DPS could go all out |
| 02:20.53 | Legorol | cool! that'd be nice |
| 02:20.55 | Amarande | which you won't be able to in 4.0 |
| 02:21.02 | Legorol | Amarande: that just needs brains |
| 02:21.04 | Gnarfoz | Amarande: assumption |
| 02:21.05 | Legorol | i'm not worried |
| 02:21.15 | Legorol | not over-aggroing is elementary dps basics |
| 02:21.21 | Amarande | Legorol: indeed |
| 02:21.21 | Legorol | that most dps suck at ^^ |
| 02:21.22 | kd3 | how so? dps should be able to go out if they wait the three seconds it takes for the tank to get solid aggro |
| 02:21.23 | Amarande | and there's the rub. |
| 02:21.48 | Legorol | btw, this is why i think tank/healer has harder time in a dungeon than dps: |
| 02:21.56 | Legorol | i'm dps right now, and i'm not even paying attention. i'm chatting here |
| 02:22.00 | Amarande | Currently, bosses are balanced on the fact that tanks have obscene levels of threat that allow for DPS to constantly give their best without pulling, assuming the gear levels of group are balanced |
| 02:22.01 | SqueeG | not over-aggroing isn't basic |
| 02:22.04 | Legorol | i throw occasional frostbolt on every second group |
| 02:22.16 | SqueeG | most dps can't fucking get it through their heads that a warrior needs some time to build aggro |
| 02:22.27 | Amarande | With the 4.0 threat mechanics, tanks will be putting out a lot less threat |
| 02:22.28 | Legorol | actually, warrior doesn't ^^ |
| 02:22.28 | Gnarfoz | Amarande: our gear is balanced, our DPS can out-tps our tanks. |
| 02:22.37 | Legorol | warriors have excellent single-target threat at least |
| 02:22.40 | Legorol | aoe, well, that's tough |
| 02:22.40 | kd3 | er... no? I've been able to out-threat tanks |
| 02:22.55 | Amarande | I'm going to go out on a limb and suggest that Festergut is the battle where there will be the most trouble. |
| 02:22.57 | kd3 | minutes into the encounter, not right at the beginning |
| 02:23.09 | Legorol | Amarande: then you don't know festergut's mechanics |
| 02:23.12 | Legorol | on him, tanks get a huge buff |
| 02:23.14 | Gnarfoz | Amarande: you're going out on a limb on pretty much everything you said about 4.0 just now |
| 02:23.18 | Amarande | Legorol: actually it's because I know Festergut's mechanics |
| 02:23.20 | Legorol | right now, threat is milllllllllllllllllles away on festergut |
| 02:23.23 | Amarande | It's a high HP, tight DPS race |
| 02:23.26 | Legorol | that buff will still be there |
| 02:23.32 | Legorol | and you know about the buff on the tanks too? |
| 02:23.36 | Amarande | Legorol: that I do |
| 02:23.52 | Amarande | but I also know it's one where tanks need to have their taunt for a very specific reason and can't afford to blow it simply to maintain threat |
| 02:23.58 | Xyphoid | what? |
| 02:24.02 | Jerub | not a tight dps race if you have a bear tank |
| 02:24.02 | Jerub | :D |
| 02:24.08 | Amarande | which is going to be really punishing if the threat race gets made closer |
| 02:24.10 | Xyphoid | your taunt is on less than a 100 second cooldown |
| 02:24.11 | Legorol | taunt to mantain threat? *boggles* |
| 02:24.14 | Legorol | taunt does NOT give threat |
| 02:24.17 | Legorol | doesn't |
| 02:24.20 | Gnarfoz | Jerub: *any* tank who's not asleep will do |
| 02:24.23 | Amarande | Legorol: taunt to pull it off a DPS that pulled aggro |
| 02:24.29 | Legorol | Amarande: what? |
| 02:24.32 | Gnarfoz | Amarande: if a dps ... what |
| 02:24.34 | Amarande | you can't afford to do that on Festergut at times because you need it to get aggro off the other tank? |
| 02:24.34 | Legorol | on festergut, that can never be allowed to happen |
| 02:24.36 | kd3 | dps shouldn't pull aggro on fester |
| 02:24.36 | Xyphoid | you need to taunt once every 100 seconds |
| 02:24.40 | Legorol | you can NOT afford a dps pulling aggro |
| 02:24.51 | Gnarfoz | because that's a dead dps, not a waste taunt |
| 02:24.56 | Legorol | nothing to do with the availability/lack of taunting |
| 02:25.01 | Amarande | Legorol: that's why Festergut's going to have issues ... because it's a short enrage timer and HIGH HP |
| 02:25.06 | Legorol | you simply screw up positionioning and/or oneshot someone if a dps pulls |
| 02:25.12 | Jerub | Gnarfoz: 9 of the 10 top dps on world of logs for fester25 is druids. |
| 02:25.13 | Legorol | Amarande: i still don't get you |
| 02:25.15 | Amarande | which is going to be really hard on the new threat mechanics. |
| 02:25.17 | Jerub | druid tanks specifically |
| 02:25.20 | Xyphoid | what is this 'blow a taunt' idea, you're just making this up |
| 02:25.27 | Amarande | ok, I got the taunt thing wrong, I don't tank enough |
| 02:25.36 | Gnarfoz | Jerub: so? it's the buff? ^^ |
| 02:25.52 | Amarande | however, it does seem to me that high HP bosses with short enrages are going to have a lot of sudden issues with DPS pulling aggro that weren't there before |
| 02:25.57 | Jerub | Gnarfoz: yeah, but the dps increase for going to kitty and shredding the crap out of him is so hoooj |
| 02:26.01 | Amarande | with little that can be done about it because you NEED that much DPS to meet the timer |
| 02:26.05 | Gnarfoz | Amarande: it seems to your IMAGINATION, yes |
| 02:26.06 | Jerub | compared to other tanks |
| 02:26.12 | Legorol | Amarande: any boss that has very tight dps requirements has mechanics in place to make aggro a non-issue |
| 02:26.16 | Legorol | festergut: check |
| 02:26.16 | Jerub | large enough to eclipse MS dps. |
| 02:26.18 | Legorol | bql: check |
| 02:26.28 | Amarande | Legorol: yeah, I'm not worried about BQL at all because I know of the zero threat mechanic |
| 02:26.40 | Wobin | PS. If your dps are pulling aggro. It's not the tank's fault |
| 02:26.40 | Legorol | sindragosa: check |
| 02:26.44 | kd3 | then you should be equally non-concerned about fester |
| 02:26.45 | Wobin | (or responsibility, really) |
| 02:26.54 | Legorol | saurfang is the only potential problem |
| 02:27.00 | Amarande | yeah, Saurfang might be bad :| |
| 02:27.03 | Wobin | The tank will be outputting their maximum tps |
| 02:27.06 | Legorol | but his berserk is a soft enrage |
| 02:27.20 | Amarande | Legorol: also we seem to get more stamina in 4.0 |
| 02:27.24 | Legorol | however, you have tanks tauntrotating every 10 seconds, so threat won't be an issue there either |
| 02:27.25 | Amarande | so we'll have a LITTLE more survivability |
| 02:27.28 | Gnarfoz | a berserk is a berserk, what is a "soft enrage"? : |
| 02:27.30 | Wobin | if the dps fucks up by outdoing it, it's the goddamn dps' fault |
| 02:27.36 | Amarande | Gnarfoz: there's two ways they limit time on boss fights |
| 02:27.43 | Gnarfoz | Amarande: please don't |
| 02:27.50 | Amarande | either you have a fixed timer after which the boss goes berserk and one-shots everyone super fast |
| 02:27.59 | Amarande | or the boss just gets stronger and stronger over time and eventually overwhelms the healers |
| 02:28.11 | Gnarfoz | he does have a berserk timer, too, was my point. |
| 02:28.12 | Amarande | good examples of the latter being Gruul and Faerlina |
| 02:28.19 | Wobin | well technically saurfang doesn't do either of those |
| 02:28.30 | Amarande | Wobin: too many marks for the healers eventually |
| 02:28.31 | Wobin | he just marks too many people for healers to keep up |
| 02:28.38 | Amarande | so a case of the second type |
| 02:28.38 | Legorol | Wobin: that's a soft enrage |
| 02:28.39 | Wobin | he doesn't get stronger |
| 02:28.51 | Amarande | well, by 'get stronger' I mean 'outputs more and more damage' |
| 02:28.51 | Gnarfoz | a soft berserk, would be more sensible terminology, tbh |
| 02:28.53 | Legorol | he does, he is dealing more and more raid damge |
| 02:28.56 | Wobin | he just gets unkillable |
| 02:29.28 | Amarande | you know what's really interesting is that outside the MMO genre there seems very little incidence of berserk timers |
| 02:29.30 | Wobin | also, ffs, marked people ankhing |
| 02:29.31 | Gnarfoz | Wobin: he's the son of SAURFANG! what did you expect? :P |
| 02:29.40 | Amarande | Wobin: not everyone is a shaman! |
| 02:29.43 | Wobin | Gnarfoz: I expect him to just cleave everyone to death =P |
| 02:29.49 | Wobin | Amarande: or using soulstone |
| 02:29.51 | Legorol | Amarande: because outside of MMOs you don't have the possibility to alter the group composition so much |
| 02:30.06 | Amarande | Legorol: it's viable. you see it in some fights in non-MMOs |
| 02:30.07 | Legorol | because you have the ability to stack tanks and healers with little/no dps, you need berserk |
| 02:30.12 | Gnarfoz | <Amarande> Wobin: not everyone is a shaman! <-- you meant: "not everyone can be a moron!"? |
| 02:30.22 | Amarande | Overdrive Sin from FFX, Vegnagun from FFX-2, Margaret from Persona 4 |
| 02:30.53 | Amarande | Margulis at low HP in Xenosaga 2 |
| 02:31.06 | Xyphoid | there's a berserk timer in space invaders |
| 02:31.35 | Amarande | and Xenosaga 2 pretty much did the soft enrage thing a lot because healing was so crappy in battle in that game that any boss that had hard hitting attacks had to die fairly fast or you were going down |
| 02:31.59 | Amarande | but in general, it seems like non-MMOs give you battles that you can just let go on and on and on without any worry |
| 02:32.12 | Amarande | even the normally cruel Shin Megami Tensei series does that most of the time |
| 02:32.31 | Amarande | (it gets ridiculous in the later games, mostly because of Mediarahan being far too accessible) |
| 02:32.50 | cog|away | scrolls up a few pages and gives up trying to follow the conversation |
| 02:32.53 | Xyphoid | it's not worth it |
| 02:33.03 | Xyphoid | it's not really even a conversation |
| 02:33.15 | cogwheel | wallofchat |
| 02:33.21 | Xyphoid | reading logs here is amazing |
| 02:33.35 | Amarande | cogwheel: I was speculating on whether 4.0.1 is going to cause issues with existing content related to DPS races and the removal of easymode tank threat |
| 02:34.08 | TC-Work | and by amazing you mean amazing in a fail sort of way |
| 02:34.18 | Amarande | and from what I saw in heroic UK on PTR, it does seem to be extremely easy for DPS to pull aggro in 4.0 |
| 02:34.23 | *** join/#wowuidev Aznamir (~a@ool-18e45e8f.dyn.optonline.net) |
| 02:34.27 | Gnarfoz | or you had a shitty tank. |
| 02:34.31 | cogwheel | if they're not putting the new zones in for the pre-cata patch along with all the new spells i'm not gonna bother reactivating until cata |
| 02:34.35 | Xyphoid | did you actually do any threat measurements |
| 02:34.39 | Amarande | Xyphoid: that I couldn't do |
| 02:34.43 | Amarande | I don't have addons that work with PTR |
| 02:35.12 | cogwheel | s/spells/spells, talents, ui, etc. |
| 02:35.16 | Amarande | cogwheel: I'm not sure what's going to hit live |
| 02:35.22 | Amarande | the current PTR is just the new mechanics |
| 02:35.36 | cogwheel | Amarande: yeah, it still seems like the ptr could change significantly between now and then |
| 02:35.44 | Amarande | yeah, it's certainly going to |
| 02:35.50 | Amarande | there's a fair amount of stuff that's still not addressed yet |
| 02:35.56 | Wobin | also |
| 02:36.00 | Amarande | hell, primary professions other than gathering don't even work right on PTR right now |
| 02:36.10 | Wobin | rofl lololol at even considering doing content -at level- |
| 02:36.14 | Aznamir | Did Blizzard accidently broke mouse wheel handling in Cataclysm beta? |
| 02:36.17 | Wobin | people won't be going into ICC at level 80 |
| 02:36.19 | Amarande | Which is hampering some testing, because people are unable to regem to fit the stat changes |
| 02:36.22 | Wobin | they'll be going into ICC at 85 |
| 02:36.23 | cogwheel | Amarande: i got spammed with tips to use heroic strike on my action bar because there was no heroic strike on my warrior -_- |
| 02:36.35 | cogwheel | until level 3 or something... |
| 02:36.52 | cogwheel | (i wanted them on to see what they'd do under normal circumstances) |
| 02:36.53 | SqueeG | HEROIC STRIKE FOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO *pow* |
| 02:36.55 | Amarande | That and there's douchebags putting what gems ARE available up for 3000, 5000, 10000 g so you can't even try them |
| 02:37.09 | cogwheel | ooh i should check my auctions |
| 02:37.13 | SqueeG | why do they do that on beta? /facepalm |
| 02:37.22 | cogwheel | i was strapped for cash given that there was no economy... |
| 02:37.35 | kd3 | just because people are idiots and think that gold is worth something in beta |
| 02:37.36 | Amarande | Squee: because people are jerks |
| 02:37.39 | cogwheel | sucks having to balance between bags (6-slot) and spells/professions |
| 02:38.13 | Amarande | they also apparently haven't *entirely* finished the item stat transitions |
| 02:38.20 | Amarande | either that, or attack power is being left in in a few cases |
| 02:38.33 | Amarande | my heroic Frost Giant's Cleaver still has an AP socket bonus, and my Mark of Supremacy still gives AP on use, in particular |
| 02:38.48 | Amarande | think my head and leg enchants still have AP, too |
| 02:39.10 | Amarande | also some items have just been screwed up |
| 02:39.18 | Amarande | I had a druid link me his idol. It said it was a relic for a DK. |
| 02:39.34 | Gnarfoz | all idols are relics now. |
| 02:39.42 | Gnarfoz | as are all librams and totems. |
| 02:39.48 | Amarande | Gnarfoz: yeah, but apparently druid stuff is being marked as "Class: Death Knight" in some cases |
| 02:39.57 | Amarande | oops. :) |
| 02:40.40 | SqueeG | are they taking away the need to purchase ranks of spells as you level? |
| 02:40.47 | cogwheel | yep |
| 02:40.48 | Gnarfoz | no |
| 02:40.50 | Gnarfoz | oh, yes |
| 02:40.53 | SqueeG | <=== hasn't been bothered to watch the beta |
| 02:40.56 | kd3 | there's only one rank of spells |
| 02:40.57 | Gnarfoz | ranks, yes, new spells, no ^^ |
| 02:40.59 | SqueeG | how... are they managin that |
| 02:41.01 | Amarande | Squee: that I'm not sure since I haven't had a character on PTR who's not level 1 or 80 |
| 02:41.07 | cogwheel | SqueeG: they scale with level |
| 02:41.12 | Gnarfoz | SqueeG: simple: no ranks, no need to buy ranks. |
| 02:41.12 | kd3 | caster abilities scale like melee abilities do |
| 02:41.14 | cogwheel | there's patch notes in the ptr forum |
| 02:41.19 | SqueeG | but... what do you do upon each level up? |
| 02:41.27 | cogwheel | nothing sometimes |
| 02:41.32 | kd3 | either you get another talent point or a new spell or nothing at all |
| 02:41.35 | SqueeG | that's.... unfullfilling |
| 02:41.38 | SqueeG | too many l's |
| 02:41.38 | cogwheel | talents are on odd levels, new spells are on even |
| 02:41.39 | Xyphoid | there's whole new ui elements for when you level telling you your new stuff |
| 02:41.43 | Xyphoid | it's quite nice from the look of it |
| 02:41.44 | cogwheel | SqueeG: no it isn't |
| 02:41.48 | cogwheel | because levelling is so much faster |
| 02:41.52 | cogwheel | and profitable |
| 02:41.54 | kd3 | all of your abilities hit harder automatically |
| 02:41.55 | cogwheel | and painless |
| 02:41.58 | Amarande | cogwheel: is 71-80 xp nerfed? |
| 02:41.59 | Gnarfoz | even MORE profitable? |
| 02:41.59 | Gnarfoz | :D |
| 02:42.06 | Gnarfoz | Amarande: no |
| 02:42.07 | kd3 | not yet |
| 02:42.26 | Amarande | anyway some stuff just isn't ready for primetime yet |
| 02:42.38 | cogwheel | SqueeG: any assumptions you make are wrong. leveling in beta is teh secks |
| 02:42.38 | Amarande | druid idols being misclassed for DK, for instance |
| 02:42.49 | Gnarfoz | there's no druid idols anymore. |
| 02:42.49 | Gnarfoz | :D |
| 02:42.57 | cogwheel | not so sure how it's going to be between 4.0 and cata though |
| 02:43.01 | Amarande | Gnarfoz: ok, relics that are supposed to be for druids being marked for DKs, then |
| 02:43.03 | Gnarfoz | should do what blizzard does: read mmo-c |
| 02:44.00 | Amarande | and crafting professions not working |
| 02:44.00 | Gnarfoz | blergh only 2 hours of sleep :( |
| 02:44.57 | Amarande | and the badge system still isn't ironed out fully yet |
| 02:45.11 | SqueeG | is there a closet for all the bloody tabards yet/ |
| 02:45.13 | SqueeG | ?* |
| 02:45.13 | Amarande | since 1) when I copied to ptr I only got 1 justice point per badge, but stuff costs far more than that conversion rate |
| 02:45.28 | Amarande | and 2) you still get badges instead of justice points when you do heroics, despite badges being no good for anything anymore |
| 02:45.33 | *** join/#wowuidev Cairenn__ (~Guest9566@CPE00235435c2a1-CM0012c9213c9c.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com) |
| 02:46.18 | kd3 | which means they haven't fixed everything yet |
| 02:46.44 | Amarande | yeah, everyone's saying nov 2 for cata but I really don't think so now |
| 02:46.50 | Amarande | there just seems so much that still needs to be ironed out |
| 02:46.53 | kd3 | who's "everyone"? |
| 02:46.59 | kd3 | certainly doesn't buy nov 2 |
| 02:47.06 | Amarande | kd3: everyone who's said anything at all to me about current release date estimates |
| 02:47.13 | Xyphoid | one point of data is enough for amarande |
| 02:47.19 | Adys | You can't buy nov 2 kd3 |
| 02:47.26 | Amarande | yeah |
| 02:47.27 | Adys | days of the year are in the public domain |
| 02:47.30 | Amarande | I think at this point we're still "soon" |
| 02:47.42 | Amarande | or maybe "real soon now" |
| 02:47.47 | kd3 | it's "soon" up until the press release with the date |
| 02:47.59 | kd3 | believing anything else is just getting your hopes up for no good reason |
| 02:48.13 | Adys | also more seriously, nov 2 is the planned marketee date but it's unrealistic |
| 02:48.16 | Jerub | wooooo |
| 02:48.21 | Jerub | finally got my guildmaster on mumble |
| 02:48.28 | Adys | ~jerub++ |
| 02:48.45 | Adys | Im just looking at cataclysm and urgh |
| 02:48.49 | Amarande | Adys: yeah I was going to believe it when I saw 4.0.1 on PTR |
| 02:48.50 | Adys | way off |
| 02:48.56 | Amarande | but then I actually tried the PTR and saw how much still needs work |
| 02:49.12 | Adys | Amarande, you realize 4.0 can hit ages before cata right |
| 02:50.15 | Adys | here's a couple of "details" |
| 02:50.23 | Adys | worgen females arent ingame |
| 02:50.30 | Adys | opengl doesn't support BEING UNDERWATER WTF |
| 02:50.44 | kd3 | they still haven't fixed that? |
| 02:50.49 | Adys | nop... |
| 02:50.51 | kd3 | wtf |
| 02:50.57 | SqueeG | lol |
| 02:51.06 | SqueeG | The new xpac is being built and tested... |
| 02:51.22 | SqueeG | ...and i still haven't played a Death knight through the opening story |
| 02:51.39 | cogwheel | XD |
| 02:51.40 | Adys | they might as well fucking remove opengl mode on windows if they're going to treat it like crap |
| 02:51.51 | cogwheel | i'm leveling a horde DK so i can do the echo isles quests... |
| 02:51.56 | cogwheel | was instantly my highest level horde toon |
| 02:52.02 | Kraps | SqueeG: !!! |
| 02:52.19 | Amarande | Adys: yeah water is screwed up |
| 02:52.32 | Amarande | I took the FP from Gadgetzan to Org and didn't see ANY water that I can remember |
| 02:52.33 | cogwheel | water's screwed up period |
| 02:52.35 | Legorol | SqueeG: i have not played a blood elf through the first start zone yet |
| 02:52.39 | Legorol | got to level 10 |
| 02:52.41 | cogwheel | i'm on windows |
| 02:52.45 | cogwheel | and it's all invisible |
| 02:52.47 | Adys | thats only ptr Amarande |
| 02:52.51 | Kraps | are pallies really that weak on the ptr? |
| 02:52.53 | the-golem | goblin questline is fun |
| 02:52.56 | SqueeG | I've gone through the belf zone... 3 times now? |
| 02:52.57 | the-golem | but |
| 02:52.59 | Amarande | Kraps: not sure but I heard rets complaining |
| 02:53.00 | SqueeG | 2 Nelfs 1 troll |
| 02:53.10 | SqueeG | Some NPCs wouldn't talk to my troll xD |
| 02:53.13 | the-golem | the boat quest is broken |
| 02:53.22 | the-golem | still ^^ |
| 02:53.30 | Adys | so many mobs <PH DRESS ANIMS TEXTURE SPELLS NEEDS 4 WEEKS OF WORK> |
| 02:53.37 | SqueeG | When aren't Rets complaining? :p |
| 02:53.42 | Amarande | Adys: and yeah, 4.0 could hit a fair while before Cata |
| 02:53.46 | Amarande | Squee: they didn't complain in 3.0.2 |
| 02:53.50 | Amarande | everyone else complained ABOUT them ;) |
| 02:53.54 | SqueeG | lol |
| 02:54.00 | Corrodias | i complained about everything ever |
| 02:54.00 | SqueeG | imo they needed a boost |
| 02:54.01 | Amarande | however |
| 02:54.03 | SqueeG | so did warriors |
| 02:54.07 | SqueeG | and we both got them |
| 02:54.09 | SqueeG | so I was happy |
| 02:54.14 | Amarande | Blizzard's track record seems to have been that the X.0 patch hits a few weeks before the expansion. |
| 02:54.19 | Adys | worgens are completely broken |
| 02:54.20 | Corrodias | you know what i liked? when the rogues complained about being buffed, when they no longer needed a consumable for their dust-in-the-eyes trick |
| 02:54.23 | Corrodias | SOME rogues |
| 02:54.47 | cogwheel | i felt the same way -_- |
| 02:54.48 | Adys | oh and |
| 02:54.54 | Adys | WHAT THE FUCK IS UP WITH LIMITED STOCKS. |
| 02:55.10 | cogwheel | ? |
| 02:55.30 | Adys | is it like.. intended to be so high? |
| 02:55.46 | cogwheel | you mean how they'll have like 50 of something "limited"? |
| 02:55.57 | Adys | 50? |
| 02:56.02 | Adys | you mean like 800? |
| 02:56.06 | cogwheel | O.o |
| 02:56.21 | Adys | the reagent vendor in dalaran had like 1200 strange dust last time i checked |
| 02:56.41 | cogwheel | for a while i could buy a lot of things without it taking my money |
| 02:56.59 | Amarande | speaking of bugs, I'm still trying to figure out why dark pact just plain fails sometimes |
| 02:57.04 | Adys | getiteminfo is still completely broken |
| 02:57.04 | cogwheel | i think that might be on purpose for ptr & beta |
| 02:57.04 | Amarande | on live, in fact. |
| 02:57.06 | Adys | lots of uI bugs |
| 02:57.22 | Amarande | I'm in reg HoR and I try to get mana from my pet, it's got plenty of mana, cast animation goes off, no mana transfers |
| 02:57.26 | Amarande | no error message |
| 02:57.32 | Legorol | Amarande: do you mean DP failing on beta/ptr, or on live? |
| 02:57.37 | Amarande | on live. |
| 02:57.53 | Gnarfoz | what does /combatlog say |
| 02:57.59 | Amarande | I'll have to look next time it happens |
| 02:58.22 | Amarande | I've also been having issues with tab not switching targets |
| 03:00.48 | Legorol | Amarande: you know that DP can miss, right? |
| 03:00.58 | Legorol | It's considered a spell, and you have 17% spell miss chance against bosse |
| 03:01.12 | Legorol | but in those cases you get a clear Miss message |
| 03:01.25 | Amarande | Legorol: we're talking dark pact here |
| 03:01.31 | Amarande | the spell aff locks use to drain mana from their *pet*? :) |
| 03:01.38 | Amarande | not an attack spell |
| 03:01.56 | Legorol | oh |
| 03:02.06 | Legorol | i confused it with something else >.< do mock me |
| 03:03.34 | Wobin | puts Legorol on his mocking queue |
| 03:05.54 | Kraps | yay pallies now have 2 attacks at low levels |
| 03:06.04 | cogwheel | lol... i accidentally rolled on the EU ptr... |
| 03:06.17 | cogwheel | i thought those german spells were a weird bug -_- |
| 03:06.34 | SqueeG | rofl |
| 03:06.35 | Aznamir | Were there any changes in Cataclysm for OnMouseWheel event? |
| 03:06.43 | Amarande | I wonder if atlasloot works at all on the ptr |
| 03:06.50 | cogwheel | lol ping is 32ms ... i have a feeling it's not actually in Europe ;) |
| 03:07.13 | Aznamir | I'm getting -1 delta for both up and down mouse wheel move |
| 03:07.17 | SqueeG | is there anything not being changed? |
| 03:08.01 | cogwheel | in ptr the world (quests, zones, etc) are unchanged on the ptr |
| 03:08.08 | cogwheel | rendundancy is redundant |
| 03:08.42 | cogwheel | but there's no telling what'll happen between now and then |
| 03:12.45 | cogwheel | "randomize" for a gnome's name came up with "Part" |
| 03:12.49 | cogwheel | (taken, of course) |
| 03:15.51 | Aznamir | Well, it looks like OnMouseWheel returns arg1 = nil |
| 03:17.27 | Amarande | Dammit. Can't look at item changes on PTR with atlasloot. |
| 03:17.29 | Amarande | "Cannot read files" |
| 03:18.49 | Amarande | also: lol: "Good Death Knight: Rarer than Quel'dorei progression kills. " |
| 03:22.33 | Amarande | looks like that server's just as bad as it was when I left it ... heh |
| 03:24.01 | Aznamir | where can I find Cataclysm FrameXML ? |
| 03:24.32 | Amarande | Dear GODS some of these servers suck |
| 03:24.48 | Amarande | Misha, for instance: |
| 03:24.57 | Amarande | Number of total guilds with Light of Dawn: Zero. |
| 03:25.10 | Amarande | Number of total guilds with Kingslayer 25: Four. |
| 03:25.16 | Amarande | Number of Horde guilds with Kingslayer 25: Zero. |
| 03:25.48 | Amarande | maybe these are the realms I need to whip into shape for Cata ... or maybe they just suck. :) |
| 03:26.21 | Amarande | but I'm finding it really hard to imagine how a realm can suck that badly :| |
| 03:26.38 | Amarande | hell, there's only four horde guilds there with KS10 |
| 03:27.07 | Amarande | cogwheel, why do some servers suck? |
| 03:29.09 | *** join/#wowuidev Wobster (~quassel@203-214-158-61.perm.iinet.net.au) |
| 03:29.46 | Kraps | i dont think SLI does anything :/ |
| 03:30.07 | Amarande | Kraps: yeah SLI is pretty much a gimmick, I'm not sure how many games really shine with it lately |
| 03:30.35 | Amarande | besides, I'd rather my electricity meter not start spinning faster than a magnetar :| |
| 03:30.38 | *** join/#wowuidev Esamynn (~chatzilla@WoWUIDev/WoWI/Featured/Esamynn) |
| 03:30.38 | *** mode/#wowuidev [+v Esamynn] by ChanServ |
| 03:34.09 | the-golem | for most game, SLI is pointless. |
| 03:35.08 | the-golem | and any game where it might matter, I'm too poor to buy it anyway ^^ |
| 03:36.46 | Wobin | http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=utpdzQj2S6o |
| 03:36.48 | Wobin | <3 <3 <3 Stephen Fry |
| 03:37.01 | Wobin | ...in a pink, slightly special way |
| 03:37.26 | Amarande | hah |
| 03:37.41 | Amarande | actually, maybe these realms with bad progression are where I should be going |
| 03:37.55 | Amarande | bad progression is kind of an indicator that quite probably, a lot of players are more concerned with experiencing and enjoying the content |
| 03:38.04 | Amarande | rather than being so damn focused on results like more hardcore raiding servers are :) |
| 03:38.15 | Amarande | who needs results, anyway? :S |
| 03:44.05 | *** join/#wowuidev Repo (~supybot@repos.curseforge.net) |
| 03:45.30 | the-golem | Amarande: or, those servers have few players, i.e. dead |
| 03:46.04 | Amarande | the-golem: the ones I'm looking at that suck this bad are actually pretty solidly Medium |
| 03:46.26 | Amarande | yeah, there's a few realms that just don't have much of any activity at all, most of them are PvP servers though and I don't really look at PvP servers |
| 03:48.28 | *** join/#wowuidev nuoHep (~nuohep@89.222.156.36) |
| 03:48.34 | Amarande | come to think of it, I'm not sure why I should really care about more than 11/12 in ICC10 on my DK anyway |
| 03:48.42 | Amarande | apart from wanting to help out my raid buddies |
| 03:48.57 | Amarande | apart from the Kingslayer title, I stand to gain absolutely zilch from the Lich King |
| 03:49.25 | Amarande | hell there's only even one thing sindy drops that's really of use to me, and it's a marginal upgrade at best |
| 03:49.51 | Amarande | although LK was pretty fun to fight and wipe to the one time I saw him |
| 03:50.10 | Amarande | Sindy, on the other hand, is not fun, so the only real point to fighting her is as a roadblock to get to LK :) |
| 03:58.52 | Dagmar | How about hte ability to flip on hard mode? |
| 04:02.03 | Amarande | yeah, that's true |
| 04:02.12 | Amarande | though Turalyon is so full of KS's that you basically trip over them |
| 04:02.28 | Amarande | I can't remember the last time we haven't had one handy for hard mode (and we pretty much only use that for lootship anyway) |
| 04:06.00 | *** join/#wowuidev Repo (~supybot@repos.curseforge.net) |
| 04:06.07 | *** join/#wowuidev RJohn (~Tanner@h123.65.149.24.cable.rdwd.jetbroadband.com) |
| 04:08.16 | Amarande | Crawling with KS's and people with tens of thousands of gold to bid at the drop of a hat on GDKPs. I don't get some players at all. |
| 04:10.04 | Dagmar | ...and yet the goldsellers are now making level 1 toons and then sending personal messages out to people |
| 04:10.37 | Dagmar | I get "Hello?" out of the blue, I send back "Hm?" |
| 04:10.49 | Corrodias | BUYGOLDPLZTHX |
| 04:11.00 | Dagmar | Then they tell me "I was wondering if you were interested in buying any gold. If you were I would be more than happy to make you an offer." |
| 04:11.03 | Corrodias | inundates Dagmar with pictures of naked ladies. with lots of money. |
| 04:11.15 | Dagmar | "I would be more than happy if you would go f**k yourself and die." |
| 04:11.26 | Corrodias | ... wow, polite and using Real English. |
| 04:11.31 | Corrodias | a new breed! |
| 04:11.39 | Dagmar | Corrodias: See, there's the problem. He didn't send me any porno to butter me up with |
| 04:11.55 | Dagmar | It was probably a script, or just pasted |
| 04:12.11 | Dagmar | Either way, I look at it like being accosted by beggars in the grocery store. |
| 04:12.21 | Legorol | Bummer. I rolled a DK on the PTR. Unfortunately, probably due to the new spellbook UI, the Runeforging ability doesn't work. Which means I can't get past the 2nd quest, and can't progress this fresh DK. |
| 04:12.32 | Jerub | Dagmar: i reply with 'Die in a fire' now |
| 04:12.36 | Jerub | that's happened to me 3 times |
| 04:12.41 | Amarande | Dagmar: goldsellers prey on people in such realms because they know you need a jillion gold |
| 04:12.41 | Dagmar | Legorol: Try a new hunter. :) |
| 04:12.48 | Amarande | Legorol: none of the crafting professions work. |
| 04:12.55 | Legorol | that... sucks |
| 04:12.58 | Dagmar | Jerub: Was it the exact same text in response each time? |
| 04:12.59 | Legorol | so i can't use this DK at all |
| 04:13.00 | Amarande | Legorol: indeed |
| 04:13.12 | Jerub | Dagmar: i found they stopped talking if you said die in a fire |
| 04:13.13 | Amarande | people are also unable to regem to fit the changes to stats (particularly for casters) |
| 04:13.15 | Jerub | i think it's actual humans |
| 04:13.17 | Amarande | because there's no gems to use |
| 04:13.31 | Dagmar | They didn't respond to me telling them to fuck off and die either |
| 04:13.42 | Legorol | Amarande: at least they are able to travel the world... |
| 04:13.46 | Legorol | this DK is now stuck in Acherus |
| 04:14.01 | Dagmar | ...but I'm reporting the dude regardles of hte language I used, because I'd hope Blizz would be able to pull the logs of everyone he talked to and just ban anyone who wanted gold |
| 04:15.05 | Dagmar | Amarande: Easy solution. Load up a toon with gems and copy them |
| 04:15.57 | Dagmar | If my honor copies over I'll have 71000 to spend, which is gonna convert to a pile even by the new standard |
| 04:17.01 | Amarande | Dagmar: that won't help you on gems, since nobody can cut them :) |
| 04:17.36 | Dagmar | I'm not a jewelcrafter, so... not my problem. :) |
| 04:18.24 | *** join/#wowuidev boshi23 (~boshi23@c-68-81-3-76.hsd1.nj.comcast.net) |
| 04:21.16 | Amarande | heh. |
| 04:21.36 | Amarande | Dagmar: also, is it normal this time of expansions for even *guilds* to often start focusing oddly on gearedness, even if they don't normally? |
| 04:21.51 | Amarande | I've seen a fair number of recruitment ads that asked for GS. |
| 04:22.16 | Amarande | Both on Turalyon Horde and Silvermoon Alliance, in particular |
| 04:22.34 | *** part/#wowuidev Seerah (~Ryan@adsl-226-65-237.mem.bellsouth.net) |
| 04:26.08 | Mr_Rabies | can you add using an item into a castsequence? |
| 04:27.24 | Jerub | Amarande: that's pretty normal. |
| 04:28.48 | Mr_Rabies | like, /castsequence mangle, rake, 10, mangle, or do i have to name the item? |
| 04:29.35 | Jerub | Mr_Rabies: i hope that's not a real example. |
| 04:29.53 | Mr_Rabies | i didn't feel like bothering with the () stuff for mangle |
| 04:29.54 | Mr_Rabies | i'm lazy |
| 04:30.03 | Mr_Rabies | but i couldn't think of anything else |
| 04:30.33 | Mr_Rabies | i want it to use my gloves as part of the sequence, but i don't want to have to rewrite it every time i get a new pair of gloves |
| 04:30.48 | Dagmar | Nope. |
| 04:31.47 | Corrodias | hail rabies. |
| 04:31.54 | Mr_Rabies | what up Corrodias |
| 04:31.54 | Dagmar | TBH any attempt to make an IWIN button is doomed to failure |
| 04:32.06 | Mr_Rabies | i'm still as terrible at macroing and addoning as ever |
| 04:32.07 | Dagmar | Now, a "ho hum no other cooldowns" button to do filler with is another matter |
| 04:32.14 | Corrodias | heh |
| 04:32.25 | Corrodias | i haven't played in years now, so i sure can't help ya |
| 04:32.33 | Mr_Rabies | i just don't have enough room on my bars, and i know i'll never use it if i can't work it into my rotation |
| 04:32.42 | Corrodias | but i never used macros to decide what to do; i just used them for keybinds |
| 04:33.09 | Corrodias | numbers, control+numbers, shift+numbers, alt+numbers, control+shift+numbers... |
| 04:33.15 | Jerub | Mr_Rabies: but uh, mangle is a 60 second debuff now, you should be using shred. |
| 04:33.19 | Dagmar | Mr_Rabies: Double stack one with a macro. On my hunter I've got single target fire and ice traps until I hit the ALT button, at which point they drop the AOE versions |
| 04:33.48 | Dagmar | ...or just get an addon thnat makes lots of buttons |
| 04:34.26 | Mr_Rabies | i know jerub, i have a macro that does the following |
| 04:34.41 | Mr_Rabies | rake, mangle, FFF, mangle, mangle, mangle |
| 04:34.52 | Mr_Rabies | i hit it 3 times normally unless mangle misses or i'm not behind |
| 04:35.00 | Jerub | oh, this is for soloing? |
| 04:35.20 | Mr_Rabies | the extra mangles are more of a contingency plan if i need to use them for any reason |
| 04:35.25 | Mr_Rabies | pvp, soloing, whatever |
| 04:35.37 | Jerub | righto. sorry, i always thing in terms of 5-25 man groups :P |
| 04:35.38 | Mr_Rabies | it resets after a timer that i forget |
| 04:35.45 | Mr_Rabies | like, 9 seconds i think? |
| 04:35.58 | Mr_Rabies | then i reapply rake, and leave it there to reset every 9 seconds |
| 04:36.05 | Mr_Rabies | reapplying rake as necessary |
| 04:36.13 | Jerub | nice |
| 04:36.16 | Mr_Rabies | shred is on its own button |
| 04:36.35 | *** join/#wowuidev eidolarr (~zls@c-24-23-180-212.hsd1.ca.comcast.net) |
| 04:36.38 | *** join/#wowuidev SeanK (~SeanK@pool-98-117-120-73.sttlwa.fios.verizon.net) |
| 04:36.43 | Mr_Rabies | since there's no real set rotation, it's basically my debuff button |
| 04:36.44 | Amarande | Yeah, the only I.W.I.N. buttons I ever find are broken :( |
| 04:36.52 | Corrodias | man, stop it, you're making me think about nightbane and how much fun it was to rake his ass |
| 04:36.58 | Amarande | They probably need 526 engineering to fix. :( |
| 04:37.06 | Mr_Rabies | Corrodias: come back to the dark siiiide |
| 04:37.11 | Corrodias | lol |
| 04:37.11 | Mr_Rabies | i did just recently |
| 04:37.13 | Mr_Rabies | in may |
| 04:37.19 | Mr_Rabies | i quit around ZA's launch |
| 04:37.22 | Dagmar | We dont' want to hear about what you'd like to do with a horse |
| 04:37.24 | Mr_Rabies | came back in may |
| 04:37.35 | Corrodias | i'm still thoroughly MMO'd out, and even then, i'd try other MMO's. |
| 04:37.48 | Corrodias | i'm always in search of new experiences! |
| 04:37.50 | Mr_Rabies | i mostly just didn't ahve time for wow |
| 04:37.51 | Dagmar | Corrodias: You should try FFXIV then. :) |
| 04:37.58 | Dagmar | Turn-based fishing! |
| 04:37.59 | Mr_Rabies | i still really don't but i'm an addict |
| 04:38.05 | Corrodias | yeah, uh, no thx >_> |
| 04:38.18 | Dagmar | It's pretty but I think I'll probably be wanting my disk space back tonight |
| 04:38.32 | Corrodias | i still chuckle tha ttheir E3 demo consisted of a couple people just standing there doing nothing. |
| 04:38.33 | Dagmar | The whole "three second delay between each menu" to me says "f**ked" |
| 04:38.42 | Dagmar | They weren't doing nothing. |
| 04:38.55 | Dagmar | They were probably waiting for the next menu selection to appear |
| 04:38.56 | Corrodias | they were waiting for menus? |
| 04:38.59 | Corrodias | hah, you beat me |
| 04:38.59 | Mr_Rabies | i started again in may with 1 70 and a 45 |
| 04:39.03 | Mr_Rabies | now i have 3 80s :x |
| 04:39.13 | Corrodias | well done, MR |
| 04:39.23 | Mr_Rabies | ofc i have level 60ish alts on another server but i'm too poor to afford bringing them over and changing faction |
| 04:39.25 | Mr_Rabies | 55 each character |
| 04:39.27 | Mr_Rabies | nothankyou.jpg |
| 04:39.29 | Amarande | I started WoW in 2.2, didn't level very much since leveling was still slow then and I was a priest, really got into it more in 2.3 |
| 04:39.49 | Amarande | and also, apparently, always seem to have the really bad luck to get most active in WoW just as a given expansion is ending :| |
| 04:40.03 | Jerub | Amarande: at this point you've got a good chance of a LK kill |
| 04:40.12 | Corrodias | i don't know when i started, but it was 1.something, some tim ebefore AQ was in |
| 04:40.16 | Amarande | at the point where the demands for hardcoreness tend to approach fever pitches because everyone's trying for that last drive before things end :S |
| 04:40.57 | Mr_Rabies | oh my god the macro works |
| 04:41.01 | Mr_Rabies | 10 actually worked for gloves |
| 04:41.19 | Amarande | Jerub: yeah, hopefully I get it |
| 04:41.22 | Corrodias | yay |
| 04:41.29 | Amarande | there's still a chance, and I'm still showing up for raids unless work scotches me |
| 04:41.41 | Mr_Rabies | see i'm not too bad |
| 04:41.47 | Mr_Rabies | jokers ruining my self esteem >:( |
| 04:42.03 | Amarande | I still don't like the fever-pitched rushes at the end of expansions all that much though :S |
| 04:42.17 | Dagmar | What rush? |
| 04:42.32 | Mr_Rabies | /castsequence [button:2] Faerie Fire (Feral); reset=combat,target,6 Rake, Mangle (Cat), Faerie Fire (Feral), 10, Mangle (Cat), Mangle (Cat) |
| 04:42.34 | Mr_Rabies | BEHOLD |
| 04:42.36 | Mr_Rabies | SUPER MACRO |
| 04:42.49 | Amarande | Dagmar: it's not always obvious, but it's definitely there |
| 04:43.02 | Dagmar | Seriously, what rush? |
| 04:43.08 | Corrodias | i behold it. but i did all that manually, and it was a blast. but that was one expansion ago. fewer abilities to manage, even. |
| 04:43.12 | Corrodias | jesus, i can't imagine what it's like now |
| 04:43.14 | Amarande | more and more groups drop their 'progression' goals and instead focus on getting the proven people in so they can get their results before the new expansion |
| 04:43.24 | Amarande | Many raid guilds ask for gearscore even if they don't normally during other parts of expansions ... |
| 04:43.30 | Dagmar | Oh, see, that's because you actually give a shit what those people think |
| 04:43.41 | Mr_Rabies | <Corrodias> i behold it. but i did all that manually, and it was a blast. but that was one expansion ago. fewer abilities to manage, even. |
| 04:43.48 | Xyphoid | gearscore didn't exist in BC |
| 04:43.50 | Mr_Rabies | druid. druid has changed. |
| 04:43.50 | Dagmar | To me, it's a fucking *game*, not some stupid competition I *have to finish* |
| 04:44.02 | Mr_Rabies | they gave us savage roar and that changed everything |
| 04:44.13 | Corrodias | whole new ballgame, folks! |
| 04:44.14 | Mr_Rabies | also boosted rake's output to a decent number |
| 04:44.19 | Amarande | Dagmar: to me, it's "I've seen almost everything. About the only thing I haven't seen a billion times already is the raids ... and thus, I'm stuck with what the raid groups want if I want to see those" |
| 04:44.26 | Mr_Rabies | now they're nerfing savage roar and it makes me sad |
| 04:44.27 | Mr_Rabies | :[ |
| 04:44.34 | Corrodias | fortunately, i don't have to care :3 |
| 04:45.06 | Mr_Rabies | now here's the problem with my macro, it's gonna throw a fit if my gloves are on cooldown i think |
| 04:45.06 | Dagmar | If someone wants to give me shit because I don't have full 25-man gear, I can just as easily point out that I've probably been wasting my time having all that sex and partying. |
| 04:45.12 | Amarande | well, actually now I've seen most of ICC |
| 04:45.20 | Amarande | so I guess I've seen pretty much it all now |
| 04:45.29 | Amarande | except for Ulduar and ToC and most of Naxx, but who does those anymore? |
| 04:45.37 | Amarande | oh, EoE, too. I never even got to set foot into EoE. |
| 04:45.40 | Dagmar | I take skirt-chasing seriously. |
| 04:45.52 | Dagmar | One of us is going to have much better times to look back on 30 years from now. |
| 04:46.55 | Amarande | Dagmar: on high progression servers it almost gets to the point of "what's that? you don't have 25-man gear? well, I hope you didn't even want to see what ICC has anymore?" |
| 04:47.04 | Dagmar | Still looking for an asian girl for that United Women Of Benetton achievement. |
| 04:47.05 | Dagmar | ;) |
| 04:47.15 | Amarande | It wasn't till mid-August that I could even find a group that was going at the right time to even get to go to ICC10. |
| 04:47.24 | Dagmar | Amarande Yeah your server is crap |
| 04:47.48 | Corrodias | you could play other games |
| 04:47.52 | Amarande | and well, in the end, I couldn't care less whether I actually down LK |
| 04:47.54 | Corrodias | that's what i'm up to! |
| 04:48.00 | Amarande | but if I'd never gone to Icecrown, I'd have missed out on some pretty fun stuff |
| 04:48.05 | Amarande | like Blood Princes and such |
| 04:48.11 | Dagmar | Been there. |
| 04:49.07 | Dagmar | The only reason I can see for people to be just that damn picky about gear is that maybe you've got a lot of boobs on your server who can literally be counted on to fuck up with both hands. |
| 04:49.22 | Amarande | Dagmar: yes, it's finally dawning on me that Turalyon is a piece of crap and the only reason I'm there is because I have really good friends who play there |
| 04:49.27 | Amarande | and WoW is always more fun with good friends to talk to |
| 04:49.40 | Corrodias | yes |
| 04:49.41 | Dagmar | I know when it was just people on our server pugging, before LFR, we never generally saw people standing in fire and stuff and expecting to run an instance without saying a single word |
| 04:49.42 | Amarande | but I also talk to them outside of WoW |
| 04:49.43 | Corrodias | while you run across the barrens |
| 04:49.57 | Dagmar | Now some of these guys in LFR act like you just asked them to touch your special place if you speak |
| 04:50.15 | Kraps | did you? |
| 04:50.19 | Amarande | Your server uses LFR? |
| 04:50.23 | Dagmar | God forbid you ask them to stop clicking the DPS button and move out of some AoE crap |
| 04:50.25 | Amarande | I'm not sure most of Turalyon even knows what LFR is |
| 04:50.34 | Dagmar | Meh I meant LFG |
| 04:50.44 | Dagmar | We only use LFR when filling out a 10-man |
| 04:50.45 | Amarande | eh, there's times when you don't move immediately out of the AoE |
| 04:50.57 | Dagmar | Amarande: When exactly are those times if you are not a healer |
| 04:51.00 | Amarande | for instance, the stuff I read about caster DPS says that it's usually a very bad idea to clip casts to move out of AoE unless you are *going to die*. |
| 04:51.08 | Amarande | you finish casting, THEN you move. |
| 04:51.19 | Dagmar | If you are not a healer, and even if you ARE a healer if no one is about to die, you MOVE |
| 04:51.45 | Dagmar | Frankly, you stand a better chance of surving a fight if you don't piss away healer mana. |
| 04:51.57 | Mr_Rabies | i wish people would use LFR |
| 04:51.58 | Mr_Rabies | :[ |
| 04:52.00 | Dagmar | Cutting off a few casts early isn't going to affect much. |
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| 04:52.36 | Dagmar | ...but I'm not even talking about that. I'm talking about people who will literally just stand there in the damn black smoke, green goo, purple fire, whatever it is, and ignore it and expect the healer to just cast like mad |
| 04:52.47 | Amarande | Yeah, those people just suck. :) |
| 04:52.55 | Amarande | I'd say they should die in a fire, but they usually do a few seconds later anyway ;) |
| 04:52.57 | Dagmar | .,..becuse the guild healer with the 6100gs and the AOE heal can get away with it |
| 04:53.05 | Mr_Rabies | i usually let them die on my priest but i just hit 80 on her |
| 04:53.13 | Dagmar | Yeah I keep counseling my girl just to let some bitches die |
| 04:53.17 | Mr_Rabies | i'm kind of an old school jerk when it comes to failing |
| 04:53.31 | Mr_Rabies | a simple mistake is fine, i'll mention something |
| 04:53.34 | Dagmar | She'll try to keep everyone alive, run out of mana, and THEN they wipe |
| 04:53.40 | Mr_Rabies | but go full moron and you will pay the vendors |
| 04:53.42 | Jerub | Dagmar: is this on normal or HM? |
| 04:53.46 | Amarande | Dagmar: I'm not sure exactly what the main rationale for people being picky about gear is, specifically |
| 04:53.47 | Amarande | *but* |
| 04:53.50 | Dagmar | Jerub: Heroics. |
| 04:54.00 | Amarande | they also get away with it because there's so damn many people on this server oozing excessive gearedness |
| 04:54.02 | Jerub | Dagmar: then not moving from fire is insane. |
| 04:54.13 | Dagmar | Amarande: They don't have any other way to try to determine if you're an idiot or not, so they assume you're at least as big an idiot as they are |
| 04:54.14 | Amarande | and if you want to get geared, you're expected to farm tens of thousands of gold to spend on BoE's and GDKP's |
| 04:54.38 | Dagmar | Amarande: Yeah see, there's way better ways to spend one's time |
| 04:54.49 | Amarande | I'm pretty sure the hilt STILL hasn't gone below 7000 ... this server is just inundated in excessive gold |
| 04:55.16 | Amarande | yeah, I'm strongly tempted to roll on Quel'dorei again, or Misha |
| 04:55.22 | Dagmar | Jeurb: EVen in regular mode unless it's a particularly wimpy fire there's no sense in wasting healer mana |
| 04:55.27 | Amarande | looks like people on those servers actually mostly have this thing called "fun" |
| 04:55.36 | Jerub | Dagmar: all fire in normals is wimpy. |
| 04:55.36 | Dagmar | Amarande: Do it |
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| 04:56.13 | Dagmar | Jerub: That would be why you finish whatver you were dong and then strafe out... so you can be ready to do it in heroics |
| 04:56.21 | Amarande | and wow, I looked at some posts on the QD forum |
| 04:56.25 | Amarande | and I recognize some of the folks I ran with in BC |
| 04:56.53 | Jerub | anyone know an addon to manage blacklists? apart from just /ignore ? |
| 04:57.02 | Dagmar | Franklt I think Skywalls worst problem is there's a bunch of damn ninjas |
| 04:57.08 | Jerub | i'm creating quite a crop of people i never want to raid with again :/ |
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| 04:57.22 | Jerub | Dagmar: does reporting ninjas achieve anything? |
| 04:57.27 | Jerub | i'm trying to establish this |
| 04:58.30 | Dagmar | Yep. |
| 04:59.14 | Dagmar | If they ninja'd the GM will generally go through the log, see that they ninja'd, yank that item from them, take "whatever measures are appropriate" and drop it on whoever actually won it |
| 04:59.25 | Dagmar | We've actually seem them drop a week ban on a few people |
| 04:59.52 | Amarande | Dagmar: it's more insidious on Turalyon apparently |
| 04:59.56 | Dagmar | Most of our server is decent about it tho |
| 04:59.59 | Amarande | since ninjas there tend to steal the GDKP pots instead |
| 05:00.08 | Amarande | and by the time they GMs can look at it have usually spent the money |
| 05:00.18 | Amarande | which probably is also responsible for the crushing inundation of gold |
| 05:00.31 | Amarande | because I don't think they consider it fair recourse to take away gold from innocent people who received it from auctions ... |
| 05:00.42 | Dagmar | We seldom have to do much more than say "MS > OS, everyone greed on the BoE's, and don't be a damn whore about it" |
| 05:00.48 | Amarande | which means they have to restore the gold to the pot people AND the ninja'd gold is all over the place since the ninja usually spent it on the AH ... |
| 05:01.02 | Amarande | probably brings in tens of thousands of surplus MORE gold instantly every time there's a ninja, I imagine |
| 05:01.22 | Amarande | if not hundreds of thousands, since stuff like Lana'thel's choker can go for 20,000+ for just the one item |
| 05:01.23 | Dagmar | Well, the worst problems are when the RL is a ninja |
| 05:01.38 | Jerub | what we heard on our realm after a gdkp pot was stolen was that the ninja had it yoinked, but none of the gold was redistributed. |
| 05:01.39 | Amarande | our economy is seriously broken |
| 05:01.50 | Jerub | and the GM said that blizz doesn't support gdkp runs |
| 05:01.56 | Dagmar | Ah |
| 05:02.04 | Amarande | Jerub: the ninja still had the money? |
| 05:02.09 | Dagmar | Yeah that would be messy to audit |
| 05:02.13 | Amarande | I would imagine they'd tend to spend it on high-ticket AH items as soon as they get it |
| 05:02.14 | Dagmar | At least with drops it's clear cut |
| 05:02.16 | Jerub | Amarande: no idea. |
| 05:02.37 | Jerub | the KB article about ninjas says that they often don't redistribute the item too |
| 05:03.03 | Dagmar | Yeah that's where logs come in handy |
| 05:03.09 | Xyphoid | i really don't think a significant portion of the gold inflation is from ninjas and GM action |
| 05:03.17 | Dagmar | I'm with Xyph |
| 05:03.22 | Amarande | Xyphoid: yeah I'm not sure where it all floods in |
| 05:03.25 | Dagmar | Bots are generally where mudflation comes from |
| 05:03.30 | Amarande | but we have a serious overload of gold in this server economy |
| 05:03.34 | Xyphoid | people doing dailies |
| 05:03.49 | Xyphoid | is responsible for tens of thousands of new gold entering existence every day per server |
| 05:03.52 | Jerub | Dagmar: what i did the other day when we had a ninja in icc25, i attempted to get a fair roll done,a nd asked the gm to redistribute the item |
| 05:03.55 | Amarande | I suppose *part* of it is spurred by the dailies and heroics people do in order to make all the money they need for the overpriced AH items and GDKP items they need in order to meet everyone's fever GS requirements |
| 05:04.05 | Jerub | but their policy is also to never tell you what they did in action to a ticket. |
| 05:04.11 | Dagmar | Jerub: Hopefully it'll get sorted |
| 05:04.15 | Jerub | hence my original question, is it actually any use to file a ticket |
| 05:04.30 | Dagmar | I know we've had it sorted on our server a few times because I spoke to the guy who got hte itme in an in-game mail |
| 05:04.44 | Jerub | no roll was conducted before the ninja'ing |
| 05:04.54 | Jerub | it was after the ninja lef tgroup with the item that i got the roll done |
| 05:04.56 | Jerub | so i have no idea :/ |
| 05:04.57 | Amarande | Turalyon is sinking, basically. :S You're right, Dagmar. |
| 05:04.58 | Xyphoid | i don't see why you *wouldn't* file a ticket |
| 05:05.13 | Dagmar | Jerub: You didn't have ML set on? |
| 05:05.27 | Dagmar | I mean, that may have been a mistake but the GM won't really care about that I think |
| 05:05.39 | Jerub | Dagmar: too hard to explain conscisely. |
| 05:05.43 | Jerub | http://leaf.posterous.com/the-curious-case-of-wow-ninjas |
| 05:05.52 | Jerub | i blogged. read that if you care. |
| 05:06.57 | Dagmar | Yep. That is something the GM will be able to see went on |
| 05:08.04 | Xyphoid | http://us.blizzard.com/support/article.xml?locale=en_US&articleId=17761 |
| 05:08.17 | Amarande | I wonder if the out of control inflation can be traced to the GS addon, actually |
| 05:08.43 | Xyphoid | Amarande: perhaps you should trace it to space lizardmen, it's about as plausible |
| 05:09.13 | Amarande | I don't remember it being nearly as bad during BC ... with the exception of epics that were either really rare or required a lot of hard stuff like cooldown cloth to craft, I don't remember a rash of insanely high priced stuff on AH then |
| 05:09.22 | Amarande | Xyphoid: I'm thinking on the lines of |
| 05:09.41 | Amarande | as GS demands increase, people feel increasingly obligated to obtain the top end crafted stuff |
| 05:09.53 | Amarande | which tends to be the highest priced stuff on the AH unless something like a hyacinth macaw drops |
| 05:10.12 | Amarande | therefore, people feel like they HAVE to obtain huge amounts of gold in order to make it in PvE |
| 05:10.30 | Amarande | and so, they go get it, and that's another several thousand gold entering the economy with only an AH cut to offset it. |
| 05:10.46 | kd3 | or you just ignore the idiots who demand excessive GS--who are doing so because they want to get carried? |
| 05:10.51 | Jerub | Amarande: i think you can more closely link it to the lack of money sinks, and people having more free assets. |
| 05:11.03 | Jerub | like, no one really needs emblem gear on their mains anymore |
| 05:11.19 | Amarande | Jerub: plus the fact that there really are all those high end BoE items available, too |
| 05:11.24 | Amarande | BC had a lot fewer of real significance if I remember :S |
| 05:11.37 | Jerub | so every 6/12 icc10 run is 120 new emblems in the game -> 5 primordial saronites. |
| 05:12.03 | Jerub | so people don't need to hoard capital to buy them anymore. it's running around more |
| 05:12.04 | Amarande | Jerub: eh. I'd think the people still doing 10's probably still do use the emblems for gear |
| 05:12.18 | Amarande | most of the people who've already used up all that frost badges can give are probably on 25's now |
| 05:12.38 | Jerub | Amarande: uh, i said that as the absolute basic level of icc raiding. |
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| 05:13.11 | Amarande | Myself, I'm trying to get to 95 for the T10 chestpiece, since I have a tier token that will let me have a 264 |
| 05:13.29 | Amarande | however, if 4.0.1 appears imminent, I might buy saronites, since if PTR is any indication we're not getting a very good return at all on our existing badges |
| 05:13.40 | Jerub | a raiding guild doing icc25 10/12 is bringing 625 emblems into the game, meaning at least 25 primodial saronites |
| 05:13.48 | Jerub | (20 emblems for bosses, 5 for weekly) |
| 05:13.57 | sylvanaar | i just realized that I was having a dream about Shirik |
| 05:14.00 | Dagmar | Those don't convert into cash directly tho |
| 05:14.39 | Jerub | Dagmar: no, but they mean that people dont' need to hoard lots of csah in order to be able to buy them. |
| 05:14.48 | sylvanaar | it was about something nerdy |
| 05:14.52 | Amarande | yeah if anything saronites decrease the amount of cash, since so many of them are sold on AH with the resulting cut |
| 05:15.02 | Dagmar | Amarande: Dude, there's an expansion coming up. Eff saronites. Buy some heirlooms for your new worgen |
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| 05:16.08 | Dagmar | This is basically what I'm doing with all those extra badgers on my hunter |
| 05:16.45 | Dagmar | Jeurb: By the way I have not disabled cookies and POsterous is upset with me. Just sayin' |
| 05:24.10 | Jerub | depresses the value because there's more liquid money that was previously held for big finance deals on massive amounts of saronite |
| 05:24.25 | Jerub | Dagmar: yeah, posterous has been crap lately. |
| 05:24.55 | Jerub | Dagmar: i really should make it post to a blog on a real site somewhere |
| 05:25.12 | Jerub | i didn't intentionally use it as a blog host, just as a place for my psts to go |
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| 05:46.58 | Wobin | Jerub: you could find out if they did |
| 05:47.01 | Wobin | by asking the druid |
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| 05:47.34 | Jerub | Wobin: i've been having a gander at their armory every day. their trinkets haven't changed :P |
| 05:47.43 | Wobin | send them a mail |
| 05:47.47 | Jerub | dunno if they've logged back in |
| 05:47.50 | Wobin | and tell them you posted a ticket |
| 05:48.01 | Jerub | they also lodged a ticket. |
| 05:48.08 | Wobin | if it happened to me, and I won, I'd happily inform you that the process went through |
| 05:48.40 | Wobin | and check the armory of the ninja =P |
| 05:49.03 | Jerub | Wobin: interestingly, the ninja doesn't seem to be wearing it, but i think they'll logging out in their pvp crap |
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| 05:56.05 | Wobin | Jerub: at least now you know what guild to avoid |
| 05:56.52 | Jerub | Wobin: oh yes. |
| 05:57.06 | Jerub | but now i'm cehcking the guild membership of all raid members |
| 05:57.13 | Jerub | but i can't seem to see their guildmembership unless i'm close to them |
| 05:57.15 | Jerub | which is annoying |
| 05:57.30 | Jerub | so i have to zone in and wait for summons to finsih before i raid |
| 05:59.38 | *** join/#wowuidev Guardix-lagtop (~Martin@edu-clients.nat.esnord.dk) |
| 06:00.26 | Wobin | maybe use EG's browser and hope they get parsed first =P |
| 06:00.37 | Wobin | although I dunno if it stores guild |
| 06:04.42 | Jerub | Wobin: EA is down, or i could use the url button |
| 06:05.10 | Wobin | well |
| 06:05.23 | Wobin | ah, nm |
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| 06:17.02 | zenzio | http://yro.slashdot.org/story/10/09/14/2254235/PAs-Dept-of-Homeland-Security-Shared-Oil-Shale-Protester-Info-With-Companies . nice security there |
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| 06:24.55 | Fisker | patch tuesday my arch nemesis |
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| 06:38.24 | Shirik | sleepifies |
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| 07:03.11 | zenzio | http://icanhascheezburger.com/2010/09/14/funny-pictures-get-ur-own-cave/ |
| 07:04.18 | zenzio | and for all you Milla fans, http://roflrazzi.files.wordpress.com/2010/09/f989ea53-d611-49c8-84c1-ef81c860ade5.jpg |
| 07:13.18 | Fisker | scared-y farts zenzio |
| 07:18.17 | zenzio | now this is cool: http://vimeo.com/12488149 |
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| 08:10.53 | airtonix | ~ping |
| 08:10.53 | purl | ~pong |
| 08:11.30 | the-golem | >.< |
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| 08:34.14 | mikma | http://www.wulffmorgenthaler.com/strip.aspx?id=45c943e5-b38c-43f9-9351-2986e329e7e8 |
| 08:35.08 | zenzio | :-p |
| 08:35.24 | zenzio | Wulffmorgenthaler actually has some funny stuff |
| 08:37.16 | mikma | i love it |
| 08:40.06 | zenzio | http://thedailywtf.com/Articles/The-Test-Machine.aspx |
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| 08:44.50 | mikma | we had a fake-doctor in finland =) |
| 08:45.08 | mikma | he worked as a doctor in two hospitals without any school/training |
| 08:45.24 | mikma | all he did was learn stuff at home from the bible of doctors |
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| 08:46.21 | cbreak_work | was he good? |
| 08:46.48 | mikma | apparently |
| 08:47.35 | mikma | they are trying really hard to find people that died because of him |
| 08:47.46 | mikma | i am 100% sure they wont find any |
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| 08:54.39 | bluspacecow | \o |
| 08:56.20 | unfo- | o/ |
| 08:56.46 | bluspacecow | i has to go into work 1hr early tonight |
| 08:56.48 | bluspacecow | :( |
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| 09:45.37 | msoul | Greetings... |
| 09:46.33 | msoul | If I wanted to change the combat text the name of the font file should be frizqt__.ttf? |
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| 09:47.40 | amro | that or you can use an addon to change it at runtime |
| 09:48.32 | msoul | amro: didn't try the addon, same result I'd think :) |
| 09:48.51 | msoul | but the frizqt__ file changes the text as well |
| 09:48.55 | amro | it does |
| 09:49.06 | msoul | all I wanted was to change the combat text font damage specifically |
| 09:49.08 | amro | but if you're tweaking around, you'd have to restart each time you change it |
| 09:49.41 | msoul | I see, there is no way I could change the damage text only |
| 09:50.17 | amro | there might be a way, I'm sure I recall some SCT addon doing that |
| 09:50.35 | msoul | nice damage font if I am not mistaken it's called |
| 09:51.01 | amro | nah this was a while ago when there was just one addon called SCT |
| 09:51.30 | msoul | oh I see |
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| 10:21.28 | zenzio | "In honour of Agatha Christie, turn off all the lights and kill one of your work colleagues" |
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| 10:32.24 | Olorin | are any of the admins for WoW Interface around? |
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| 10:45.20 | Wobin | http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=txdv_oNq81I&feature=player_embedded#! |
| 10:45.29 | Wobin | AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA AAAAAAAA AAAA |
| 10:45.46 | Wobin | holy crap |
| 10:45.58 | Wobin | I wasn't scared of heights |
| 10:46.00 | Wobin | til now |
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| 10:50.13 | zenzio | cool |
| 10:50.17 | zenzio | ~logs |
| 10:50.17 | purl | All conversations are logged to http://ibot.rikers.org/channel, where "channel" is replaced by the URL-encoded channel name, such as %23freenode for #freenode. Lines starting with spaces are not logged. logs are updated daily |
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| 10:56.18 | unfo- | Wobin, holy crap! |
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| 10:58.03 | zenzio | okay, that video is just awesome |
| 10:59.06 | Wobin | "Eventually we run out of elevator, so we climb the ladder, then we run out of ladder, so we cling to these sticks... then we run out of those..." |
| 11:01.44 | Olorin | ok now i'm feeling sick, not to mention the fear of needing a pee once ya get to the top |
| 11:04.12 | Olorin | ok that guys mad, he unhooks the safety line whilst climbing which is the one time his foot might slip... I just couldnt do it |
| 11:04.59 | Xyphoid | from the sound of it a lot of people get killed doing tower climbing too |
| 11:05.10 | Xyphoid | so it's not like one of those videos where it looks unsafe but it's really fine |
| 11:05.56 | Olorin | lol gotta love the comment "theres no quick way down" well actually there is... |
| 11:06.26 | unfo- | well there's no PRACTICAL and SAFE way down :) |
| 11:06.31 | unfo- | +quick |
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| 11:10.27 | Cide | hm? |
| 11:10.31 | Cide | if you have to pee you just pee |
| 11:10.35 | Cide | see how far it goes |
| 11:11.49 | Olorin | far too high up, wouldnt even see the poor bugger ya pissed on |
| 11:12.43 | cbreak_work | it would probably disperse |
| 11:13.05 | Olorin | anyone else gotten e-mails sent to wowinterface@<your domain name>? |
| 11:14.01 | Olorin | pretending to be from blizard... i dont even use the domain they sent this stuff to for forums or wow |
| 11:15.38 | Maldivia | Wobin: tht climbing video... ehh... yeah ok, can see what you mean about not being scared of heights till now :P |
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| 11:24.49 | cbreak_work | heights are not the problem. lows are. |
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| 11:51.13 | Wobin | Olorin: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2MrKxzqJhR8#t=3m19s |
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| 12:20.52 | Olorin | Wobin, I dont normally like Joe Brand but that was hillarious, cheers |
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| 12:53.24 | Kraps | whats the point of being on the tower except for repairs? |
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| 13:02.09 | Olorin | basejumping? |
| 13:03.06 | Kraps | i dont think these guys are doing that :) |
| 13:03.29 | Kraps | http://www.wow.com/2010/09/15/cataclysm-beta-guild-ranks-can-be-set-to-require-authenticator/ |
| 13:05.00 | Ycarene | I don't think"can be set" is the right phrase. |
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| 13:14.27 | *** mode/#wowuidev [+v Lopeppeppy] by ChanServ |
| 13:17.08 | Ressy | No it is. |
| 13:17.24 | Ressy | Its a toggle. GM either chooses a rank to require an auth, or he doesn't |
| 13:17.39 | Ressy | of course, this will force officers to have'em, and won't be able to fake having them now. |
| 13:18.32 | Olorin | quite a good idea really, having had my guild bank emptied once it saves a lot of grief |
| 13:18.40 | Ressy | GMs don't HAVE to use the rank below GM. Just most guilds use that as the officer one. |
| 13:18.48 | Ressy | It is. Saves them time & money |
| 13:20.19 | Ressy | I mean hell... They had to give the Tech Support GMs Billing training because Tech support became the place to spam "I got hacked! Remove their authenticator fro mmy account" |
| 13:20.52 | zenzio | about "the rank below GM", couldn't you already set up pretty fine-grained rank privileges? |
| 13:22.12 | Legorol | zenzio: yes |
| 13:22.19 | Legorol | you can assign any of the privileges to any of the ranks |
| 13:22.31 | Legorol | nothing special about the rank below GM, it's just set up by default with more privileges than the rest |
| 13:22.41 | zenzio | I see |
| 13:22.54 | Legorol | for example, in one guild that i'm in, the system in use is this: |
| 13:23.11 | Legorol | GM > Officer > Raiding Member > Social Member > Officer Alt > Normal Alt |
| 13:23.18 | Lopeppeppy | In some guilds, that rank has the *least* privileges (it was the Silenced group in one guild I was in) |
| 13:23.20 | Legorol | the Officer Alt rank has more privileges than the members |
| 13:23.38 | Legorol | the reason for this setup is that back before they added Guild Events to the calendar, you could only invite 100 people max to an event |
| 13:23.53 | Legorol | so if you had alts on the same rank as mains, when you wanted to invite the whole guild, you had too many people |
| 13:24.18 | Legorol | by putting alts (including officers) below the members, that problem was solved, and of course officer alts still needed privileges |
| 13:24.27 | |Jelly| | pounce-huggles Peppy! |
| 13:24.41 | Lopeppeppy | Morning, Jelly-dear. |
| 13:26.40 | zenzio | speaking of alts, my first raid guild didn't allow them... so the guild was always silent outside of raids, and we had a separate "alts" chat channel |
| 13:26.54 | zenzio | before I joined I wondered how they could be a raid guild and I hadn't heard of them |
| 13:27.10 | zenzio | made sense since they were either raiding or on alts, not running around Ironforge! |
| 13:27.52 | Ressy | lol |
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| 13:43.30 | Ackis | HALO REACH |
| 13:43.32 | Ackis | Shirik: ^ |
| 13:43.41 | industrial | zenzio: that's actually a pretty good policy |
| 13:44.10 | industrial | good thing I don't raid anymore though :P |
| 13:45.01 | zenzio | http://kottke.org/10/09/the-luckiest-bastards-alive - some people are incredibly lucky, others incredibly stupid |
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| 13:47.42 | Ackis | anyone here have halo 1 on the PC that doesn't care about xbox halo's? |
| 13:49.39 | mikma | wobin: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=txdv_oNq81I |
| 13:50.01 | Lopeppeppy | Holy crap, zenzio! |
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| 13:51.19 | Ackis | Arrowmaster: are you bungie pro? |
| 13:51.45 | zenzio | in the case of the people jumping away from trains, I keep wishing the train would win |
| 13:51.54 | Wobin | mikma: Posted that a few hours ago |
| 13:52.04 | mikma | wobin: :) i wasn't here noooooob! |
| 13:52.08 | elb0w | im confused why is this a dev channel lol. In two days I dont think ive seen anything code related? :P |
| 13:52.47 | Ackis | http://www.bungie.net/stats/reach/playermodel.ashx?rpis=CLibn0VqK39EGp%2bMgowbOL2%2bawB0%2fYa3HArJL1nUmEE%3d |
| 13:52.50 | Ackis | that's me |
| 13:52.55 | Ackis | if I were Noble 6 |
| 13:53.07 | mikma | elb0w: we don't code 24/7 |
| 13:53.47 | Ackis | mikma: lies |
| 13:53.59 | Ackis | your body is constantly reproducing cells which is based off of your DNA code |
| 13:54.02 | zenzio | it's more a channel of coders being social |
| 13:54.15 | elb0w | just odd to me lol, new to wow development. The other channels im always in are never like this though lol |
| 13:54.27 | elb0w | yeah just making observations |
| 13:54.29 | elb0w | I dont mind |
| 13:54.36 | zenzio | :) |
| 13:54.50 | elb0w | #wowace seems a little more geared towards code |
| 13:54.56 | mikma | and sucking |
| 13:54.57 | elb0w | but this is cool too |
| 13:54.58 | mikma | they suck |
| 13:55.02 | elb0w | lol why |
| 13:55.16 | mikma | it's like :O====B |
| 13:55.21 | mikma | lots of penis in the cheek |
| 13:55.23 | zenzio | http://icanhascheezburger.com/2010/09/15/funny-pictures-other-peoples-kids/ |
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| 14:05.35 | Ackis | "If I ever saw an amputee being hanged, I would just start shouting out numbers." |
| 14:06.19 | Humbedooh | Fiskackis |
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| 14:19.15 | Ackis | was anyone getting login server issues this morning? |
| 14:19.39 | Arrowmaster | Ackis: no |
| 14:19.51 | Ackis | strange |
| 14:19.59 | Humbedooh | I'm sure "someone" was :> |
| 14:20.27 | Ackis | Arrowmaster: how far did you get last night? |
| 14:20.37 | Arrowmaster | 4th mission |
| 14:20.46 | Arrowmaster | not finished it either |
| 14:20.55 | Ackis | were you having issues or doing other stuff? |
| 14:21.01 | Arrowmaster | both |
| 14:21.18 | Ackis | I got to the third mission in normal, did some firefight and MP |
| 14:21.28 | Ackis | I could see myself getting better each game |
| 14:21.36 | Ackis | I'm still terrible however |
| 14:22.07 | Humbedooh | that's just 'cause you're a terrible person in real life too ;> |
| 14:22.26 | Ackis | :P |
| 14:24.34 | nicoli_s | Ackis:so do you like the mp in reach? |
| 14:26.05 | Ackis | nicoli_s: I'll like it better when I start to win |
| 14:26.06 | Ackis | :D |
| 14:26.09 | Fisker | nicoli_s |
| 14:26.10 | Fisker | i hate idra |
| 14:26.29 | Ackis | although, I did get the high score in head hunting, I turned in 15 at once I think |
| 14:28.02 | nicoli_s | i hate how its call of duty-halo |
| 14:28.15 | nicoli_s | i miss weapon placements and such |
| 14:28.15 | Arrowmaster | ? |
| 14:28.36 | Arrowmaster | huh? |
| 14:28.36 | nicoli_s | like all the matches ive played are just regular or alien rifles |
| 14:28.37 | Ackis | weapon placements? like turrets? |
| 14:28.51 | nicoli_s | no like there bing shotguns, and sniper rifles, etc lying around |
| 14:29.02 | Arrowmaster | there should be |
| 14:29.12 | Arrowmaster | maybe you are just too slow and everybody else gets them first |
| 14:29.15 | Lopeppeppy | Is it sad that I want an iPod Touch for Plants vs. Zombies? |
| 14:29.44 | Fisker | nicoli_s |
| 14:29.47 | Fisker | i really hate idra |
| 14:30.03 | nicoli_s | Arrowmaster:just the loadouts in general dont sit right with me |
| 14:30.08 | Fisker | he's like a homosexual goat |
| 14:30.29 | nicoli_s | they should have playlists that are more like halo 3 |
| 14:30.33 | Ackis | I like my jet pack |
| 14:30.36 | Ackis | it has jets |
| 14:30.53 | Ackis | I just wished I had lasers |
| 14:32.19 | Humbedooh | don't be silly, Ackis |
| 14:32.24 | Humbedooh | only combat bears have lasers |
| 14:32.32 | Humbedooh | ninja combat bears |
| 14:33.03 | nicoli_s | im just hoping firefight renews my interest in MP |
| 14:33.41 | Arrowmaster | the matchmaking firefight is kinda boring |
| 14:34.02 | Arrowmaster | unlimited respawns and a 15 minute time limit |
| 14:37.36 | Ackis | nicoli_s: http://community.livejournal.com/baaaaabyanimals/4057769.html |
| 14:37.58 | Ackis | I need to get 1 million points in firefight |
| 14:38.06 | Ackis | took me an hour to get 200k points =/ |
| 14:39.25 | Fisker | double robo Ackis |
| 14:39.37 | Ackis | Fisker: how you liking halo on your ps3? |
| 14:41.56 | Fisker | i'm not Ackis |
| 14:43.28 | airtonix | orly? |
| 14:45.03 | Fisker | yep |
| 14:45.06 | Fisker | i'm not ackis at all |
| 14:46.59 | airtonix | http://tirania.org/blog/archive/2010/Sep-09.html |
| 14:47.28 | airtonix | still costs money though |
| 14:49.03 | Fisker | looks like shit i wouldn't care about airtonix |
| 14:49.10 | Fisker | is it? |
| 14:50.02 | *** join/#wowuidev Mihau (~asmith@69.73.16.202) |
| 14:50.18 | Fisker | rage |
| 14:52.36 | Ackis | Complete all of the Daily Challenges in a given day. <-- Arrowmaster wth? aren't those challenges very time consuming? |
| 14:52.43 | *** join/#wowuidev nifty (~nifty@5.223.189.109.customer.cdi.no) |
| 14:52.50 | Arrowmaster | no |
| 14:53.01 | Arrowmaster | yesterdays were kinda easy |
| 14:53.42 | Ackis | 100 kills would take me 50 games |
| 14:53.44 | zenzelezz | "Former Google employee David Barksdale accessed user accounts to spy on call logs, chat transcripts, contact lists. As a Site Reliability Engineer, Barksdale had access to the company's most sensitive information and even unblocked himself from a teen's buddy list. He met the minors through a Seattle technology group. Angry parents cut off contact with him and complained to Google, who quietly fired him." |
| 14:53.56 | Arrowmaster | 100 kills in firefight takes 2 games |
| 14:54.32 | Ackis | Arrowmaster: I'm that bad |
| 14:54.51 | Arrowmaster | the 75 kills in matchmaking was easy because i was playing multi team and getting over 15 kills a game |
| 14:55.12 | Ackis | think you're going to get the weekly challenge done? |
| 14:55.18 | Arrowmaster | yes |
| 14:55.34 | Ackis | I died 3x doing the first two missions on normal :( |
| 14:55.46 | Ackis | wanna do co-op legendary?!?! |
| 14:55.47 | Ackis | :P |
| 14:56.37 | Humbedooh | what the ef...hail storm in september.. :< |
| 14:57.15 | industrial | how is that weird :P |
| 14:57.31 | industrial | its been raining for a month already (in amsterdam) |
| 14:58.31 | Arrowmaster | Ackis: let me try and finish the 4th mission first |
| 14:59.22 | Humbedooh | I s'pose it's not that weird nowadays...we did have snow in May as well |
| 15:00.35 | Ackis | Arrowmaster: I was trying to make a joke... no way I'd survive on legendary right now |
| 15:01.05 | Arrowmaster | dude im mostly letting the npcs do all the work |
| 15:01.08 | Arrowmaster | its the only way |
| 15:02.07 | Ackis | oh ok I wasn't sure if that was the normal way to do it or not |
| 15:02.13 | Ackis | I felt like being rambo a few times |
| 15:02.17 | Ackis | (and died) |
| 15:04.29 | *** join/#wowuidev Wimpeh (~IceChat7@c83-252-63-142.bredband.comhem.se) |
| 15:11.40 | Wimpeh | hurr |
| 15:11.54 | nicoli_s | im hoping my MP play time today is a little more enjoyable |
| 15:15.51 | industrial | what game is this about? |
| 15:16.21 | Legorol | zenzelezz: holy excrement! I hope they bring criminal charges too |
| 15:17.02 | cog|away | Fisker: |
| 15:17.46 | nicoli_s | industrial:halo rech |
| 15:18.36 | nicoli_s | reach* |
| 15:19.13 | cog|work | all y'all with halo reach are just as bad as Lost fans... |
| 15:21.55 | nicoli_s | nah, i just started watching lost and halo > lost |
| 15:22.37 | *** join/#wowuidev Zyn (~faggotry@h187n4-av-a11.ias.bredband.telia.com) |
| 15:22.47 | cog|work | the subject of my sentence was the fans not the game/show :P |
| 15:24.04 | *** join/#wowuidev kd3|netbook (~kd3@reverse.kennesaw.edu) |
| 15:24.12 | *** join/#wowuidev kd3|netbook (~kd3@wikia/kaydeethree) |
| 15:24.44 | kd3|netbook | ugh. school's having a press conference as to the results of whether or not we're getting a football team |
| 15:25.02 | Lopeppeppy | That's a big decision, kd3. |
| 15:25.03 | kd3|netbook | dunno why they're doing it on a school day... police closed all of the parking decks >.< |
| 15:25.11 | Lopeppeppy | Okay, that sucks big time. |
| 15:25.15 | kd3|netbook | 25 minutes late to class because nobody on campus could find a spot |
| 15:28.58 | nicoli_s | heres hoping they shut them down kd3 |
| 15:29.39 | Fisker | i just sprayed all over my screen |
| 15:30.06 | Lopeppeppy | .... |
| 15:30.08 | Lopeppeppy | eeew. |
| 15:30.13 | Lopeppeppy | Rubbing alcohol! |
| 15:31.22 | Fisker | what a dirty minded individual you are Lopeppeppy |
| 15:33.44 | *** join/#wowuidev Kody- (~nope@70-36-245-200.dsl.static.sonic.net) |
| 15:33.44 | *** mode/#wowuidev [+v Kody-] by ChanServ |
| 15:34.08 | Lopeppeppy | nah, rubbing alcohol cleans everything |
| 15:35.25 | zenzelezz | I'm sure we could have some fun with alcohol and rubbing, peppy, but I doubt it'd be clean ;-o |
| 15:35.54 | Lopeppeppy | bad for sensitive skin!!! |
| 15:36.18 | zenzelezz | I never said the alcohol would be rubbed |
| 15:38.46 | *** join/#wowuidev Robsato (~Robsato@wetering.xs4all.nl) |
| 15:43.52 | Ackis | I'll drink a bottle of rubbing alchohol for $100 |
| 15:44.03 | Lopeppeppy | You're crazy. |
| 15:44.43 | Ackis | no I just need $100 |
| 15:44.52 | sylvanaar_atwork | donate sperm |
| 15:45.15 | Ackis | can I make a "Your mom" joke to that? |
| 15:45.51 | sylvanaar_atwork | only if i can make one |
| 15:46.20 | nicoli_s | yer such a drunk ackis |
| 15:46.25 | nicoli_s | drinking rubbing alcohol |
| 15:46.37 | sylvanaar_atwork | it will make your stomache explode |
| 15:47.07 | Ackis | I remember getting an hour long lecture in high school asking if I could boil the water out of vodka to make pure alchohol |
| 15:47.31 | Ackis | after he was done, I said "so, you could've just said yes and saved me 59 minutes" |
| 15:47.36 | Ackis | I got kicked out of class that day |
| 15:48.17 | sylvanaar_atwork | azeotrope |
| 15:48.31 | sylvanaar_atwork | 95% only |
| 15:50.24 | Ackis | I wished I was still in high school... |
| 15:50.36 | sylvanaar_atwork | i wish i was 17 |
| 15:50.39 | sylvanaar_atwork | again |
| 15:50.47 | Ackis | life was easier back then |
| 15:51.05 | Ackis | getting old makes me resent how right my parents were :( |
| 15:51.08 | *** join/#wowuidev nuoHep (~nuohep@89.222.156.36) |
| 15:51.28 | sylvanaar_atwork | you are in your 20's then |
| 15:51.40 | Ackis | only for a few more months |
| 15:51.46 | sylvanaar_atwork | after the terrible 2's are over...it gets better |
| 15:51.51 | Ackis | Jan 1 is when I hit 30 |
| 15:52.24 | Arrowmaster | mission 4 done on legendary! |
| 15:52.32 | Ackis | wewt |
| 15:52.46 | Ackis | Arrowmaster: try heros over europe in ace mode :( |
| 15:53.14 | Arrowmaster | try CoD1 on vet |
| 15:53.58 | Ackis | I did |
| 15:54.01 | Ackis | I also used a trainer |
| 15:54.04 | Arrowmaster | im at 5/9 on the weekly challenge |
| 15:54.05 | Ackis | EZ mode |
| 15:56.09 | Arrowmaster | mission 5 has no fucking cover at the beginning |
| 15:58.00 | nicoli_s | yer 29 ackis? |
| 16:00.00 | Ackis | yup |
| 16:00.11 | nicoli_s | old fucker |
| 16:01.33 | sylvanaar_atwork | <old |
| 16:02.01 | nicoli_s | hell im only 25 and i feel old :( |
| 16:02.12 | sylvanaar_atwork | i have already had my midlife crisis |
| 16:02.41 | foxlit | does that mean that half of your life is already over? |
| 16:02.50 | sylvanaar_atwork | dunno |
| 16:02.55 | sylvanaar_atwork | ill tell you when its over |
| 16:03.19 | sylvanaar_atwork | http://www.amazon.com/o/ASIN/B003TFEQQC?tag=betteraddons-20 lol |
| 16:03.24 | sylvanaar_atwork | $200 |
| 16:04.36 | nicoli_s | thats alot to spend on a light bulb |
| 16:04.43 | sylvanaar_atwork | seriously |
| 16:04.54 | nicoli_s | and i totally read the title and assumed it was for changing a baby |
| 16:05.06 | sylvanaar_atwork | i think its meant for pot-heads, cause you have to be high to buy something like that |
| 16:05.38 | nicoli_s | i get high alot and id never spend 200 dollars on a light bulb |
| 16:05.55 | sylvanaar_atwork | hmm...there goes my theory |
| 16:06.12 | sylvanaar_atwork | how about....acid heads |
| 16:06.22 | nicoli_s | i could see that |
| 16:06.58 | sylvanaar_atwork | whoa flashback! |
| 16:07.03 | nicoli_s | lol |
| 16:07.16 | nicoli_s | i had a flashback from tripping off benadryl before |
| 16:08.42 | sylvanaar_atwork | benadryl just makes me grouchy |
| 16:08.54 | nicoli_s | thats why you gotta take alot of it :P |
| 16:08.56 | Ackis | nicoli_s: from now on you are required to call me Mr. Ackis :P |
| 16:09.01 | nicoli_s | lol |
| 16:09.08 | nicoli_s | what about sir Ackis? |
| 16:09.17 | sylvanaar_atwork | HRH Ackis |
| 16:09.17 | Ackis | wait til I'm knighted |
| 16:09.51 | nicoli_s | ill just call you gov'na |
| 16:10.05 | Ackis | sylvanaar_atwork: and Queen Fisker amiright? |
| 16:10.16 | sylvanaar_atwork | lol |
| 16:10.50 | sylvanaar_atwork | The Queen Bum |
| 16:11.38 | Arrowmaster | Ackis: i just got the two daily challenges that i think have to be done all in one game done on my first try |
| 16:12.16 | Arrowmaster | im uploading it to my file share if you want to see how to be a total dick with active camo |
| 16:12.17 | Ackis | I didn't look at what they were today |
| 16:12.35 | Ackis | you need bungie pro to watch vids off the xbox =/ |
| 16:13.29 | Arrowmaster | i wish you could watch my vids from the beta |
| 16:13.33 | *** join/#wowuidev augustl (~augustl@6.79-160-9.customer.lyse.net) |
| 16:13.43 | Arrowmaster | ive got an epic sword spree with active camo on sword base |
| 16:14.18 | Arrowmaster | its like kill, double kill, double kill, double kill, kill, finally die |
| 16:14.21 | Ackis | I wonder if playing Halo Reach will make me a better Shadowrun player |
| 16:16.53 | Ackis | so with the badge changes in 4.0.1, what happens to the achievements, and how much are my 600ish badges of justice worth? |
| 16:17.24 | kd3|netbook | the "x badges earned" achievements become feats |
| 16:17.30 | *** join/#wowuidev Lunessa (~Lunessa@WoWUIDev/Lunessa) |
| 16:17.34 | Lunessa | station |
| 16:17.34 | kd3|netbook | your badges are worth crap |
| 16:18.08 | Lunessa | badges? we don' need no steeekin' badges! |
| 16:18.49 | Ackis | so do you just get 1 feat kd3|netbook or is there multiple feats? |
| 16:19.21 | foxlit | You already got your one feat. |
| 16:19.27 | kd3|netbook | afaik one -- the biggest <x badges earned> one |
| 16:19.30 | Ackis | I have 2 feets |
| 16:19.39 | zenzelezz | not for long |
| 16:22.56 | Ackis | wth http://www.wowhead.com/achievement=2019 became a feat :( |
| 16:24.03 | zenzelezz | can you still do it? |
| 16:24.10 | kd3|netbook | well, yea... the quests aren't being offered any more |
| 16:24.14 | kd3|netbook | s/yea/no/ |
| 16:24.25 | zenzelezz | sounds reasonable that it's a Feat then |
| 16:24.38 | Ackis | I had 3/4 of it done |
| 16:24.52 | *** join/#wowuidev Dewin (~Daniel@c-71-237-228-188.hsd1.or.comcast.net) |
| 16:26.15 | Wimpeh | I'm playing around with a slinky. |
| 16:26.30 | Wimpeh | It is awesome. |
| 16:27.17 | *** join/#wowuidev ckknight (~ckknight@WoWUIDev/WoWAce/CurseStaff/CurseForge/ckknight) |
| 16:27.17 | *** mode/#wowuidev [+o ckknight] by ChanServ |
| 16:27.21 | Humbedooh | well d'uh |
| 16:27.27 | Humbedooh | Slinky's always been awesome |
| 16:27.33 | Wimpeh | Agreed :3 |
| 16:27.43 | Humbedooh | just like the Brio dog! |
| 16:28.59 | *** join/#wowuidev Srosh (~Srosh@d057175.adsl.hansenet.de) |
| 16:29.56 | sylvanaar_atwork | i need more screenshots for my blog post, anyone use prat that's playing right now |
| 16:30.26 | *** join/#wowuidev brykrys (~chatzilla@WoWUIDev/Norganna/Dev/Brykrys) |
| 16:30.29 | Ackis | so I need to get 700 more badges before 4.0.1 comes out... |
| 16:30.36 | zenzelezz | why? |
| 16:30.44 | Ackis | so I get the 2500 feat |
| 16:30.51 | Fisker | i badge u |
| 16:31.09 | Fisker | Why won't they just migrate the achievement Ackis ? |
| 16:31.25 | Ackis | I only have the 1500 achievement Fisker |
| 16:31.26 | kd3|netbook | ugh... compiling wine on this netbook is going to take all week. >.< |
| 16:31.29 | Ackis | I want the 2500 |
| 16:32.05 | Fisker | oh fail Ackis |
| 16:32.17 | Fisker | it won't kd3|netbook |
| 16:32.31 | Fisker | and if it doesn't take exactly all week or more you will be killed |
| 16:32.33 | Ackis | I need to find a 25 man horde guild that does achievements :( |
| 16:34.42 | *** join/#wowuidev Sixen (~Kevin@149-169-115-92.nat.asu.edu) |
| 16:36.24 | *** join/#wowuidev bediko (~chatzilla@p4FE35931.dip.t-dialin.net) |
| 16:36.53 | foxlit | Ackis: you lost. |
| 16:37.14 | foxlit | That's about 10 weeks, being optimistic |
| 16:37.44 | foxlit | Or not; I'm thinking frost. |
| 16:38.31 | Fisker | i do achievements Ackis |
| 16:38.54 | Ackis | foxlit: oh I know I lost |
| 16:39.29 | Fisker | you lost the game infact |
| 16:39.55 | TC-Work | grrrr....why are there no good IM clients on andriod |
| 16:41.06 | sylvanaar_atwork | well |
| 16:42.14 | sylvanaar_atwork | everyone knows webOS is where its at |
| 16:42.31 | TC-Work | yes, where not to be |
| 16:43.02 | sylvanaar_atwork | anyone have linksies to ie9 beta yet? |
| 16:43.25 | TC-Work | sylvanaar_atwork: http://windows.microsoft.com/ie9?os=win7&arch=a&browser=other |
| 16:43.31 | TC-Work | L2GOOGLE |
| 16:43.40 | sylvanaar_atwork | i did google |
| 16:44.05 | TC-Work | need better googlefu then |
| 16:44.13 | sylvanaar_atwork | truth |
| 16:44.40 | sylvanaar_atwork | im ready for something less bloated than firefox |
| 16:45.22 | Ackis | my k/d ration isn't as bad as I thought: 25/38/7 |
| 16:45.26 | Ackis | k/d/a |
| 16:45.56 | nicoli_s | im sure mine is pretty terrible |
| 16:46.07 | Arrowmaster | Ackis: already got all the daily challenges done, just took one firefight match and 2 rumble pit matches |
| 16:46.08 | nicoli_s | ive been playing team slayer though |
| 16:46.28 | Ackis | Arrowmaster: 3-4 hours then? |
| 16:46.28 | nicoli_s | i cant wait to try out firefight, the only thing worthwhile in odst |
| 16:46.43 | Arrowmaster | no more like 45 minutes tops |
| 16:46.45 | NightHawkTheSane | sylvanaar_atwork: chrome? :P |
| 16:47.05 | sylvanaar_atwork | yeah, i use chrome, safari, opera and firefox |
| 16:47.22 | sylvanaar_atwork | im not happy with any of them 100% |
| 16:47.49 | nicoli_s | someone should just make a browser thats all 4 of them each with 1/4 of the screen\ |
| 16:47.53 | TC-Work | mmm.....only 6 more days till Civ V |
| 16:48.12 | NightHawkTheSane | sylvanaar_atwork: yeah, me either, but chrome is the closest to what i want. *shrug* |
| 16:48.20 | sylvanaar_atwork | yeah - its not bad |
| 16:48.30 | Fisker | i already completed it TC-Work |
| 16:48.48 | *** join/#wowuidev Pneumatus (~WiN@unaffiliated/pneumatus) |
| 16:48.52 | TC-Work | Fisker: good for you. but it's something like wow, it really cant be 'completed' |
| 16:49.05 | TC-Work | sylvanaar_atwork: i googled http://www.avantbrowser.com/ but i dont know anything about it |
| 16:49.51 | sylvanaar_atwork | i wonder what engine it uses |
| 16:51.27 | sylvanaar_atwork | http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eGRmFhzTQE4&feature=related |
| 16:51.58 | sylvanaar_atwork | i just watched the movie again |
| 16:53.52 | Arrowmaster | i thought avant was just an IE reskin |
| 16:55.25 | *** join/#wowuidev ^RaK^ (~rakkeh@109.170.128.22) |
| 16:57.09 | Fisker | i totally killed you TC-Work |
| 16:58.20 | Lunessa | http://www.engadget.com/2010/09/14/hdcp-master-key-supposedly-released-unlocks-hdtv-copy-protect/ - vellily intelestink |
| 16:58.43 | *** join/#wowuidev Sliker (~ponies@5e07bbc9.bb.sky.com) |
| 16:59.05 | TC-Work | Fisker: didnt work, try harder |
| 16:59.08 | Fisker | old Lunessa |
| 16:59.10 | Fisker | and no care |
| 17:03.13 | TC-Work | Fisker: go to blizzcon |
| 17:03.41 | Fisker | i wish i could TC-Work |
| 17:04.02 | TC-Work | you 'can' you choose not to |
| 17:05.05 | *** join/#wowuidev kd3|netbook (~kd3@wikia/kaydeethree) |
| 17:05.47 | Fisker | i can't TC-Work |
| 17:05.53 | TC-Work | can |
| 17:06.03 | Fisker | can't |
| 17:06.08 | Fisker | unless murdering jnwhiteh is an option |
| 17:06.09 | TC-Work | can |
| 17:06.14 | Fisker | jnwhiteh |
| 17:06.17 | Fisker | is murdering you an option? |
| 17:06.24 | TC-Work | how exactly will that get you there? |
| 17:06.50 | Fisker | yeah i can't even remember if he's going |
| 17:09.45 | kd3|netbook | so, as expected, we're getting a football team. still pissed that I was so late to class because of it, blah |
| 17:10.04 | Fisker | class kd3|netbook ? |
| 17:10.30 | *** join/#wowuidev Silker (~ponies@5e07b272.bb.sky.com) |
| 17:11.00 | *** join/#wowuidev sylvanaar_atwork (~sylvanaar@unaffiliated/sylvanaar) |
| 17:11.01 | kd3|netbook | 11:25:16> <kd3|netbook> 25 minutes late to class because nobody on campus could find a spot |
| 17:11.43 | Shirik | sounds like my school |
| 17:12.09 | Ackis | Shirik: grats! |
| 17:12.18 | Shirik | ? |
| 17:12.25 | TC-Work | ?? |
| 17:12.27 | Ackis | Foxswift has reached a new milestone: Completion Percentage of 30% |
| 17:12.33 | Shirik | I have? |
| 17:12.37 | Shirik | of what |
| 17:12.38 | Shirik | Star Ocean? |
| 17:12.50 | nicoli_s | how are the star ocean games? |
| 17:12.51 | Ackis | xbox 360 achievements, all of them total that you could get for the games you've played |
| 17:12.54 | kd3|netbook | it's usually not that bad. the po-po closed primarily-communter-student-parking decks for media/visitors (as best as we can tell) |
| 17:12.54 | Shirik | oh |
| 17:13.03 | Ackis | http://www.trueachievements.com/Foxswift.htm |
| 17:13.08 | Shirik | yeah I picked up a few star ocean achievements yesterday |
| 17:13.11 | Shirik | I guess that put me over |
| 17:13.24 | Shirik | also, I love star ocean: the last hope, nicoli_s |
| 17:13.26 | TC-Work | Ackis: why do i have you listed in that MS beta i cant talk about? |
| 17:13.28 | Shirik | however I don't recommend it to anyone |
| 17:13.40 | Shirik | it's one of those games (like aion) that I feel that I am in the minority for liking |
| 17:13.48 | Shirik | because it takes a very different playstyle |
| 17:13.48 | Ackis | TC-Work: because I'm in that beta? |
| 17:13.58 | TC-Work | Ackis: though seemingly never on it |
| 17:14.35 | Ackis | I haven't been on the xbox for like 2-3 days |
| 17:14.35 | Ackis | last night I was on all night |
| 17:14.35 | Ackis | previous nights played for about 30 mins |
| 17:16.34 | *** join/#wowuidev Limbero (~Limbero@c83-250-2-110.bredband.comhem.se) |
| 17:17.25 | *** join/#wowuidev Limbero (~Limbero@c83-250-2-110.bredband.comhem.se) |
| 17:17.57 | nicoli_s | Shirik:you like aion? |
| 17:18.02 | Shirik | yup |
| 17:18.09 | TC-Work | iriel does iirc |
| 17:20.51 | *** join/#wowuidev Limbero (~Limbero@c83-250-2-110.bredband.comhem.se) |
| 17:21.39 | nicoli_s | didnt expect that |
| 17:21.43 | nicoli_s | whats yer gamertag? |
| 17:21.44 | *** join/#wowuidev Limbero (~Limbero@c83-250-2-110.bredband.comhem.se) |
| 17:22.19 | *** join/#wowuidev Limbrero (~Limbero@c83-250-2-110.bredband.comhem.se) |
| 17:25.39 | TC-Work | heh, someone went through and deleted the old SC2 googledoc, guess they forgot there are revisions one can go and revert to. |
| 17:25.41 | TC-Work | silly people |
| 17:26.55 | Ackis | http://www.skein-hash.info/ |
| 17:28.22 | nicoli_s | sc2 googledoc? |
| 17:29.52 | TC-Work | yes |
| 17:30.00 | TC-Work | it was for the beta |
| 17:30.53 | nicoli_s | ahh yeah i remember now |
| 17:41.28 | Fisker | you mentioned it in the wrong channel TC-Work |
| 17:41.40 | Fisker | wtf is that shit Ackis ? |
| 17:41.41 | TC-Work | Fisker: it started here, so not really |
| 17:41.55 | TC-Work | it's a hash fiasker, just like your brain |
| 17:44.58 | zenzelezz | that's not fair TC |
| 17:45.32 | zenzelezz | Fisker's brain is more like a redundancy check |
| 17:45.37 | zenzelezz | that always returns "redundant" |
| 17:47.45 | Ackis | Fisker: one of the contenders for the new SHA-3 hash |
| 17:47.47 | Ackis | https://twitter.com/alqaeda/status/24525767471 |
| 17:52.59 | Fisker | naw Ackis |
| 18:00.38 | *** join/#wowuidev daev (~bleh@pool-72-86-110-88.aubnin.fios.verizon.net) |
| 18:01.17 | nicoli_s | mmm sub |
| 18:01.43 | *** join/#wowuidev Seerah (~Ryan@adsl-66-37-227.mem.bellsouth.net) |
| 18:01.43 | *** mode/#wowuidev [+o Seerah] by ChanServ |
| 18:05.07 | TC-Work | damit nicoli_s now i am hungry |
| 18:05.27 | *** join/#wowuidev Fisker (n_a@62.61.142.209.generic-hostname.arrownet.dk) |
| 18:05.35 | Fisker | in the city |
| 18:05.38 | Fisker | TC-Work |
| 18:06.03 | *** join/#wowuidev yoshimo (~Kassandra@p5499853D.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) |
| 18:06.55 | Shirik | uh oh |
| 18:07.46 | nicoli_s | Shirik:whats yer gamertag? |
| 18:07.51 | Shirik | foxswift |
| 18:08.11 | nicoli_s | mmk im Sankle if you want to add me |
| 18:08.29 | Shirik | How not to edit on Wikipedia: |
| 18:08.31 | Shirik | (14:05:28) (+BetacommandBot8) Stalked summary: "[[WP:AES|â]]Replaced content with 'YOU JUST WAIT UNTIL I GET AN ADMIN OVER HERE! THEN YOU WILL BE BANNED BUDDY!'" (matched replaced content with) used by [[User:99.233.114.82]], edited [[Vaginal discharge]]; Diff: http://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?diff=385018041&oldid=385017809 |
| 18:08.41 | Shirik | Tripping bots saying "I'm going to call an admin" would be a bad idea |
| 18:08.43 | Cairenn | cog|work: you ever get both tickets you were looking for, or are you still short? |
| 18:09.02 | cog|work | i got one from lunessa and one from Xinhuan |
| 18:09.03 | Fisker | in the city Shirik |
| 18:09.04 | cog|work | <3 to them |
| 18:09.07 | Fisker | oh btw Cairenn |
| 18:09.09 | Cairenn | okay |
| 18:09.11 | Fisker | TC-Work told me to murder you |
| 18:09.17 | Cairenn | okay |
| 18:09.21 | Fisker | but i told him no |
| 18:09.26 | Fisker | but he's still trying to make me do it |
| 18:09.30 | Cairenn | awww, that's sweet of you |
| 18:10.02 | nicoli_s | you all should make sure to have a moment of silence for my absence from blizzcon |
| 18:10.09 | Fisker | haha what |
| 18:10.21 | Fisker | this terran player in GSL almost killed his own refinery |
| 18:10.54 | TC-Work | points Cairenn in the direction of the sign that says http://images.tribe.net/tribe/upload/photo/454/dbe/454dbe4b-6a87-4e0d-8c0d-5ff7b6ca9569 |
| 18:12.49 | Shirik | Cairenn might be getting off the hook this year |
| 18:12.55 | Shirik | my camera might be in the shop during Blizzcon |
| 18:12.56 | Shirik | we'll see |
| 18:13.40 | Dagmar | Crazy talk |
| 18:13.50 | Dagmar | You can buy a disposable camera for Blizzcon |
| 18:13.58 | Cairenn | TC-Work: heh |
| 18:14.23 | TC-Work | Dagmar: not like what Shirik has. though you can rent them |
| 18:14.23 | Ackis | Arrowmaster: http://360junkies.com/xbox-live/1685-take-look-bungies-halo-reach-recon.html |
| 18:14.26 | TC-Work | hmmm.... |
| 18:14.47 | Dagmar | TC-Work: "disposable" |
| 18:15.02 | TC-Work | Dagmar: aka P.O.S. |
| 18:15.03 | Arrowmaster | cool |
| 18:15.22 | Arrowmaster | i want to get the EVA helmet and the black visor color |
| 18:15.54 | Arrowmaster | i just hijacked a banshee in single player btw |
| 18:15.59 | Shirik | I hate you all |
| 18:16.04 | Shirik | I shipped my damn copy to Oregon |
| 18:16.10 | Shirik | I had to call a coworker to send it to me |
| 18:16.33 | TC-Work | "Last seen 09/12/10 playing Windows Media Center" |
| 18:16.40 | TC-Work | i didnt know media center was a game |
| 18:16.43 | Shirik | ?? |
| 18:16.44 | Shirik | is that me? |
| 18:16.48 | TC-Work | no, fisker |
| 18:16.51 | Shirik | lol |
| 18:16.54 | Shirik | fisker trolled xbox live |
| 18:17.18 | *** join/#wowuidev Vilkku (Vilkku@dsl-tkubrasgw1-fe0bfa00-122.dhcp.inet.fi) |
| 18:21.48 | Arrowmaster | 6/9 for the weekly challenge |
| 18:22.00 | Arrowmaster | heroic is a hell of a lot fucking easier than legendary |
| 18:22.31 | *** join/#wowuidev Natch| (~natch@c-35cfe155.25-4-64736c10.cust.bredbandsbolaget.se) |
| 18:22.50 | nicoli_s | im doing heroic |
| 18:23.07 | zenzelezz | <Shirik> I shipped my damn copy to Oregon <-- why did you do that? |
| 18:23.19 | Shirik | because gamestop remembered an old address |
| 18:23.55 | zenzelezz | in unrelated news, I must have read too many WoW forum posts... |
| 18:24.02 | Arrowmaster | i need to return my copy to gamestop |
| 18:24.03 | zenzelezz | <Ackis> Arrowmaster: http://360junkies.com/xbox-live/1685-take-look-bungies-halo-reach-recon.html <--- I read this as "retcon" |
| 18:25.09 | nicoli_s | tired of it already Arrowmaster? :P |
| 18:28.24 | Arrowmaster | what? |
| 18:28.52 | nicoli_s | you are returning yer copy |
| 18:28.55 | *** join/#wowuidev boshi23 (~chris@c-68-36-37-83.hsd1.nj.comcast.net) |
| 18:29.00 | Arrowmaster | my unopened copy |
| 18:29.24 | nicoli_s | ahh |
| 18:29.28 | Xinhuan | do disposable cameras these days use digital storage or standard film? |
| 18:29.44 | Arrowmaster | film is cheaper |
| 18:29.45 | nicoli_s | i was surprised, when i bought the game was the first time gamestop didnt try and upsell me |
| 18:30.10 | Xinhuan | cos if its film, you still have to scan in the photos yourself |
| 18:30.15 | Xinhuan | to get a digital copy |
| 18:30.18 | Xinhuan | unless the shop does it for you |
| 18:30.29 | Arrowmaster | a lot of shops will do it for you i think |
| 18:30.35 | nicoli_s | yeah most do id say |
| 18:30.39 | Seerah | give you a cd-rom |
| 18:31.26 | Dagmar | CVS has a recyclable digital camera still |
| 18:31.54 | *** join/#wowuidev Hjalte (~chatzilla@cpe.ge-0-2-0-835.arcnqu2.customer.tele.dk) |
| 18:32.08 | *** join/#wowuidev TC-Work (~chatzilla@c-064-186-233-091.oc1.redwire.net) |
| 18:32.35 | Lunessa | http://www.newyorker.com/reporting/2010/09/20/100920fa_fact_vargas?currentPage=all - interesting, if somewhat tame piece. |
| 18:34.00 | cog|work | omg it's from the future! |
| 18:34.27 | nicoli_s | weird |
| 18:35.22 | Dagmar | Quick! check the lottery numbers before they take them down! |
| 18:36.03 | Lunessa | I assume the New Yorker organizes their site by paper-copy publication dates. |
| 18:38.57 | Ackis | it could be the 9th day of the 20th month....... |
| 18:39.08 | Cidan | Does anyone know why tooltipTitle and tooltipText entries don't work using the EasyMenu API? |
| 18:39.10 | cbreak | unlikely |
| 18:39.20 | Vilkku | anyone know a mod that lets me check what totems other shamans have dropped? something better than just checking the buff bar |
| 18:39.24 | Lunessa | Xinhuan: Most photo places will do that for you as part of processing. |
| 18:39.50 | Xinhuan | Cidan, check the source code of EasyMenu ;p |
| 18:39.52 | Dagmar | Eyeballs 2.1 |
| 18:39.56 | Cidan | Xinhuan: D: |
| 18:40.11 | Vilkku | Dagmar <_< |
| 18:41.31 | *** join/#wowuidev Osagasu (~Creek@67-197-1-37.rh1.dyn.cm.comporium.net) |
| 18:42.58 | *** join/#wowuidev Eluna (~Eluna@85.196.121.142) |
| 18:44.33 | Ackis | haha FML... chance of snow |
| 18:44.58 | Ackis | I might wake up tomorrow to snow! |
| 18:45.08 | Ackis | fuck you global warming |
| 18:45.10 | Ackis | cog|work: ^ |
| 18:45.26 | cog|work | k |
| 18:45.27 | Arrowmaster | space battle time |
| 18:45.31 | Arrowmaster | this should be fun |
| 18:45.55 | Ackis | Over 2,000,000 games of Halo: Reach have been logged on Xbox LIVE in the past 24 hours. |
| 18:46.03 | Fisker | noone cares |
| 18:46.10 | cog|work | that's 1,000,000 fewer than SC2 iirc... |
| 18:46.13 | *** join/#wowuidev Guardix (~Martin@0x5da165ee.hinqu1.dynamic.dsl.tele.dk) |
| 18:46.27 | cog|work | oh i thought that was purchases |
| 18:46.27 | zenzelezz | wasn't SC2 a few more days? |
| 18:46.31 | TC-Work | man, the IE9 beta is smoooooooooth |
| 18:46.55 | Fisker | just like your mom TC-Work |
| 18:46.56 | Fisker | bam |
| 18:47.07 | Dagmar | ...and yet, buggy, insecure, and incomplete |
| 18:47.20 | Fisker | looks like someone is jealous TC-Work |
| 18:47.28 | Fisker | that sucks |
| 18:47.51 | TC-Work | hence the 'beta' part |
| 18:47.52 | *** join/#wowuidev Sixen (~Kevin@149.169.83.61) |
| 18:50.32 | Fisker | hey Sixen |
| 18:50.35 | Fisker | are you Kevin? |
| 18:50.36 | Sixen | hi |
| 18:50.42 | Sixen | kevin who? |
| 18:50.51 | Sixen | my name is kevin, but there aer millions of kevins |
| 18:51.28 | ckknight | he is a Kevin, Fisker |
| 18:51.33 | ckknight | now ostracize him |
| 18:51.35 | ckknight | I command you |
| 18:51.36 | Sixen | one of many |
| 18:52.02 | ckknight | the very worst of many! |
| 18:52.04 | Sixen | You cannot ostracize one, you must ostracize all of us. For Kevin's stick together. |
| 18:52.28 | Sixen | At least i'm the best Sixen you know, amirite? |
| 18:52.49 | Ackis | wait Sixen is a Kevin? |
| 18:53.12 | Sixen | I'm too confused to keep this up. My name is Kevin. |
| 18:55.50 | Fisker | oh Sixen |
| 18:55.54 | Fisker | thought i knew you |
| 18:55.58 | *** join/#wowuidev RJohn (~Tanner@h123.65.149.24.cable.rdwd.jetbroadband.com) |
| 18:56.06 | Fisker | because i know someone else named kevin |
| 18:56.24 | Sixen | then you know me. Kevin is the Agent Smith of the real world. |
| 18:57.03 | Ackis | I know 2 other kevin's |
| 18:57.09 | Ackis | I'm confused |
| 18:57.12 | Shirik | does anyone know what git version numbers are? |
| 18:57.14 | Ackis | are you either of those Kevin's Sixen? |
| 18:57.15 | Shirik | are they sha1 hashes? |
| 18:58.22 | Fisker | your mom is a sha1 hash? |
| 18:59.09 | *** join/#wowuidev nicoli_s (~nsinkule@69.73.16.202) |
| 18:59.09 | *** mode/#wowuidev [+v nicoli_s] by ChanServ |
| 19:01.58 | zenzelezz | Shirik: "Git dispenses with the niceties of simple, integer version numbers in place of the mighty SHA1." |
| 19:02.03 | zenzelezz | seems your guess was right |
| 19:03.21 | Sixen | Ackis: I'm one of them, :P. |
| 19:03.38 | Sixen | I think. |
| 19:08.34 | Fisker | hey Ackis |
| 19:08.37 | Fisker | you are awesome |
| 19:08.40 | Fisker | no really |
| 19:08.40 | Ackis | h8 u Fisker |
| 19:08.41 | Ackis | h8 |
| 19:08.43 | Fisker | i meant Sixen |
| 19:08.43 | Ackis | l2reach |
| 19:08.49 | Fisker | reach sucks |
| 19:08.51 | Fisker | consoles suck |
| 19:09.48 | Ackis | hey Shirik can you play my priest tonight so I can play reach? |
| 19:09.55 | Ackis | you know, since you don't have reach? |
| 19:10.13 | sylvanaar_atwork | el-oh-el |
| 19:10.46 | *** join/#wowuidev Droolio (~drool@87-194-188-170.bethere.co.uk) |
| 19:11.26 | Sixen | burnt |
| 19:13.43 | *** join/#wowuidev kd3|netbook (~kd3@wikia/kaydeethree) |
| 19:16.44 | Fisker | Ackis |
| 19:16.49 | Fisker | halo sucks |
| 19:16.50 | Fisker | reach sucks |
| 19:16.53 | Fisker | xbox sucks |
| 19:16.57 | Fisker | consoles suck |
| 19:17.10 | Fisker | even you suck |
| 19:17.32 | nicoli_s | lies |
| 19:21.37 | cog|work | very few lies |
| 19:21.54 | Dagmar | Like the exchange rate |
| 19:22.05 | Dagmar | Surely those can't be the right figures |
| 19:22.56 | Dagmar | Making a piece of T9 cost the equivalent of >250 badges? Freaking insanity |
| 19:23.04 | Dagmar | That just can't be right |
| 19:23.42 | *** join/#wowuidev TC-Work (~chatzilla@c-064-186-233-091.oc1.redwire.net) |
| 19:23.51 | Dagmar | either it sucks horribly or they still haven't adjusted the price of the items properly to compensate for the exchange |
| 19:26.34 | Ackis | http://www.penny-arcade.com/comic/ :( |
| 19:26.51 | Adys | Maldivia, ping |
| 19:26.56 | Fisker | Ackis |
| 19:26.59 | Fisker | continue testing |
| 19:28.33 | mikma | dagmar: they wanna go back to the old style, where epics were harder to get |
| 19:28.53 | nicoli_s | Ackis:awesome |
| 19:29.11 | Dagmar | mikma: There's "harder" and there's "holy shit I have to do heroics for 600 hours to get three pieces?" |
| 19:29.44 | Dagmar | That currency change honestly should not apply to already-released tiers |
| 19:29.49 | mikma | dagmar: latter is the old style. back in tbc epic were hard tp get. bosses didnt always drop purple |
| 19:30.14 | Fisker | lol tbc |
| 19:30.33 | Dagmar | Dude, you realize the are basically cutting the value of Triumph badges by about 75%, right? |
| 19:30.50 | Dagmar | The time it took you to get four pieces of T9 will only get you one piece of T9. |
| 19:30.57 | Dagmar | That's a bit much |
| 19:31.13 | Ackis | casual |
| 19:31.26 | Ackis | you should have to kill a boss to get T9 |
| 19:31.33 | Dagmar | I can see that being okay for T11, but they don't generally nerf stuff quite that damn hard |
| 19:31.35 | mikma | i am fully awae whats going on, dagmar. |
| 19:31.41 | Dagmar | Ackis: You have a way to get badges without killing bosses? |
| 19:31.50 | Ackis | and bosses will only drop pally/shaman and warlock loot |
| 19:31.55 | Ackis | like how it was back in MC |
| 19:32.03 | *** join/#wowuidev tekkub (~tekkub@WoWUIDev/WoWI/Featured/Dongle/GitHub/Tekkub) |
| 19:32.04 | *** mode/#wowuidev [+v tekkub] by ChanServ |
| 19:32.15 | Dagmar | Ackis: Oh, let's not forget that dwarven hunters will get to roll on basically everything but plate |
| 19:32.25 | Ackis | yup! |
| 19:32.26 | Dagmar | New dwarven racial: Maces. |
| 19:32.47 | Dagmar | So, I'm not sure there's going to be weapons a dwarven hunter can't use |
| 19:33.04 | Ackis | wands |
| 19:33.19 | Dagmar | >.< why would a hunter even want a wand |
| 19:33.25 | Ackis | it's a weapon |
| 19:33.30 | Dagmar | Grey bows hit harder |
| 19:33.37 | Ackis | they're hunters |
| 19:34.50 | Dagmar | Either way I think it's crap that they're so heavily crashing the value of badges |
| 19:35.12 | Ackis | I'm going to get 1k gold for my badges of justice |
| 19:35.30 | *** join/#wowuidev sylvanaar_ipad (~sylvanaar@public.qvssoftware.com) |
| 19:35.36 | Ackis | I wonder if I can heal random dungeons while playing Reach tonight? |
| 19:35.41 | Dagmar | I'm actually going to go from being just under the honor cap, to almost being at hte _new_ honor cap after all my stonekeeper's shards cash in |
| 19:35.46 | Ackis | I need 600 wintergrasp things and 800 badges |
| 19:36.03 | Dagmar | ...which is why I'm thinking this might be messed up. PvP I seem to be keeping the same value |
| 19:36.16 | Ackis | they also need to remove pvp gear |
| 19:36.22 | Ackis | pom pyro was fun |
| 19:36.23 | Dagmar | For PvE it looks like I'd just be an idiot to not say "Fuck that gear" and trade them all in for gems |
| 19:36.24 | Ackis | giggles |
| 19:36.39 | nicoli_s | i think its hilarious its to the point where you have that many stacks of some items |
| 19:36.48 | nicoli_s | and that bosses have like millions of HP |
| 19:37.08 | nicoli_s | wow hyper inflation |
| 19:37.18 | Dagmar | nicoli_s: Honestly it doesn't take that long to hit the honor cap if you are trying to farm honor, and I mean explicitly trying to farm it |
| 19:37.49 | nicoli_s | well the time isnt the funny part, just the count |
| 19:38.03 | Dagmar | IoC runs are worth about 3-4k, you can hit like 12k for one Wintergrasp run... |
| 19:38.15 | Dagmar | The count is more or less meaningless |
| 19:38.38 | nicoli_s | i meant items not honor points |
| 19:38.47 | nicoli_s | like having 1k badges or something |
| 19:38.59 | Dagmar | You get them every time you beat a boss when your site controls WG |
| 19:39.14 | Dagmar | So, if you're mainly PvE, alll they do is pile the f**k up |
| 19:39.33 | Dagmar | It's why I've got >1000 of the things |
| 19:40.08 | Ackis | what annoys me is that the ones gotten from the weekly quests don'tcount for the achievement =/ |
| 19:40.34 | Dagmar | There's weekly shard rewards? |
| 19:40.51 | Ackis | wintergrasp quests net you 10/15 of them |
| 19:41.13 | Dagmar | Ah, I forgot about those |
| 19:46.42 | *** join/#wowuidev sylvanaar_ipad (~sylvanaar@public.qvssoftware.com) |
| 19:52.17 | Arrowmaster | so now im on a mission with no invincible spartans to back me up and even heroic is getting hard |
| 19:52.51 | Dagmar | Call in more frat boys |
| 19:57.19 | haste | damn you Fisker ! |
| 19:58.01 | TC-Work | i think i got spoiled on the itunes app market |
| 19:59.37 | *** join/#wowuidev solocommand (~josh@adsl-99-130-167-89.dsl.ipltin.sbcglobal.net) |
| 20:02.40 | *** join/#wowuidev nicoli_s (~nsinkule@69.73.16.202) |
| 20:02.40 | *** mode/#wowuidev [+v nicoli_s] by ChanServ |
| 20:05.13 | zenzelezz | "... launched from the unnamed planet, heading for the ... Fleet at a hundred lightyears an hour. Then he accelerated." |
| 20:05.16 | zenzelezz | I love sci-fi |
| 20:07.32 | Cide | I like the sci-fi where they try to explain FTL travel by not accelerating |
| 20:07.36 | Cide | that's even more funny |
| 20:07.56 | zenzelezz | hehe |
| 20:10.12 | nicoli_s | FTL? |
| 20:10.15 | nicoli_s | nm |
| 20:10.33 | *** join/#wowuidev Repo (~supybot@repos.curseforge.net) |
| 20:11.27 | zenzelezz | granted I'm only roughly 1/6th of the way through The Evolutionary Void, so far I'm enjoying it |
| 20:12.23 | nicoli_s | i need to find some good more recent sci fi |
| 20:12.33 | nicoli_s | im almost done with all my phillip k dick books |
| 20:12.45 | Arrowmaster | Cide: like BSG? |
| 20:13.42 | Lunessa | Try William Gibson, Bruce Sterling, George Alec Effinger, Neil Asher. |
| 20:14.08 | nicoli_s | mmk, any books in particular by them? |
| 20:14.18 | Lunessa | All of them. :) |
| 20:14.39 | nicoli_s | and i always hear people talking about stephenson i think his name is |
| 20:14.51 | Lunessa | Actually, for Sterling, just get "Mirrorshades: The Cyberpunk Compendium" and skip the rest. |
| 20:15.03 | Lunessa | Yeah, Neil Stephenson is also very good. |
| 20:15.56 | Lunessa | Glen Cook has some good SF stuff too, written in the 70s. |
| 20:16.10 | nicoli_s | kk |
| 20:17.08 | Lunessa | I should warn you that all of the authors I've pointed you to are 'srs bsns' stories. Nothing light-hearted. |
| 20:17.38 | zenzelezz | erects a Dyson Sphere around Fisker |
| 20:18.31 | Nechckn | No Harry Potter in Space, Lunessa? |
| 20:18.53 | nicoli_s | oh dont worry, ive been reading lots of phillip k dick, and most of them end with people going crazy or dying |
| 20:19.07 | Lunessa | Most of these are "Cyperpunk" stories. Gritty reading. |
| 20:19.27 | Lunessa | Not heroic action fiction. |
| 20:19.35 | *** join/#wowuidev Silker (~ponies@5e0b5ba5.bb.sky.com) |
| 20:19.39 | zenzelezz | Lunessa: sounds good, thanks for those tips! |
| 20:19.51 | *** join/#wowuidev Torhal (~callahan@74-141-248-166.dhcp.insightbb.com) |
| 20:20.14 | Lunessa | Also, C.J. Cherryh's Downbelo Station and other works. |
| 20:20.25 | Lunessa | "Downbelow Station" |
| 20:21.27 | Lunessa | used to write a review and suggestions section for BBS's (pre commercial internet access) and I have read mountains of SF. So, yeah. |
| 20:21.42 | Fisker | http://a248.e.akamai.net/www.direct2drive.com/Sites/RET/_img/product-btns.png <-it's funny because it should be "3rd party trojan horse" |
| 20:29.51 | Dagmar | Pfft. I would not classify the Difference Engine novels as things to be skipped |
| 20:30.00 | *** join/#wowuidev Funkeh` (~funk@WoWUIDev/WoWAce/Ace3/BigWigs/funkeh) |
| 20:31.04 | *** join/#wowuidev the-golem (~Darrin@c-98-255-201-176.hsd1.ca.comcast.net) |
| 20:36.24 | Lunessa | Dagmar: Actually, good point. That is, in my personal belief, his best novel. I prefer his short-stories though. |
| 20:39.07 | *** join/#wowuidev Dashkal (~dashkal@WoWUIDev/Nexus/dashkal) |
| 20:39.33 | haste | Fisker: fix my officer rank |
| 20:39.57 | zenzelezz | personally I prefer longer books, but shorter ones can be just as good |
| 20:40.27 | *** join/#wowuidev Funkeh` (~funk@WoWUIDev/WoWAce/Ace3/BigWigs/funkeh) |
| 20:40.48 | Lunessa | Oh, and check out David Brin too. Uplift books (all 7 or 8 of them), Kiln People, and Earth are all very good reads. |
| 20:43.23 | *** join/#wowuidev cygni (~slip@cm145-182.resnet.csumb.edu) |
| 20:44.47 | *** part/#wowuidev Sixen (~Kevin@149.169.83.61) |
| 20:45.49 | NightHawkTheSane | Lunessa: you read (or started) zero history (gibson's new book) yet? |
| 20:46.46 | *** join/#wowuidev Xyphoid (~xyph@unaffiliated/xyphoid) |
| 20:53.55 | *** join/#wowuidev kd3|netbook (~kd3@wikia/kaydeethree) |
| 20:55.24 | Arrowmaster | Shirik: so why dont you just go out and buy reach then return the preordered one once you finally get it? |
| 20:55.36 | Arrowmaster | i want somebody good to do multiteam with |
| 20:56.34 | zenzelezz | then why are you waiting for Shirik? |
| 20:56.37 | zenzelezz | =D |
| 20:56.41 | Arrowmaster | i dont know |
| 20:56.46 | Arrowmaster | who else has reach |
| 20:56.50 | Arrowmaster | ackis sucks |
| 20:57.13 | zenzelezz | I do not have it, and even if I did I would be pretty bad at it |
| 20:59.06 | *** join/#wowuidev SeanK (~SeanK@pool-98-117-120-73.sttlwa.fios.verizon.net) |
| 21:00.41 | Adys | I permanently logged off msn after my last contact got on xmpp |
| 21:00.46 | Adys | after 2 years of waiting. |
| 21:01.35 | Adys | i suggest everyone in here with msn still on goes through their list and check whether their last few msn buddies have a gtalk account or something |
| 21:01.51 | Adys | we can declare 15th september the international "fuck stupid protocols" day |
| 21:02.10 | zenzelezz | if only my friends were easier to convince |
| 21:02.14 | Adys | dude |
| 21:02.22 | Adys | did you miss the part where I mentioned "waiting 2 years"? |
| 21:02.41 | zenzelezz | I meant easier than they are, not in comparison to yours |
| 21:03.03 | Adys | i got that |
| 21:03.10 | Lunessa | NightHawkTheSane: I don't have it yet. I'll get it soon(tm). |
| 21:03.11 | Adys | just saying, dont complain and try harder! |
| 21:03.44 | foxlit | /care |
| 21:04.30 | Adys | I too care a great deal about you foxlit |
| 21:04.33 | Adys | wanna be AIM buddies? |
| 21:04.49 | foxlit | Adys: Join my Live group? |
| 21:05.03 | Adys | depends, do you have a myspace page? |
| 21:06.39 | zenzelezz | let me find my ICQ UIN... |
| 21:09.23 | Fisker | msn is awesome |
| 21:10.10 | Fisker | i especially like how in the new version it automatically supresses image links and uses photosharing (yeah that huge ugly box with a picture in it) for it |
| 21:12.16 | Shirik | Arrowmaster :( |
| 21:12.26 | Shirik | I guess I probably will go to BBY and buy it |
| 21:12.30 | Shirik | tonight |
| 21:12.33 | Shirik | my roommate needs a copy anyway |
| 21:13.52 | Ackis | 13:09Ackishey Shirik can you play my priest tonight so I can play reach? 13:09Ackisyou know, since you don't have reach? |
| 21:14.03 | Ackis | since you missed it Shirik |
| 21:14.43 | Ackis | Arrowmaster: lots of my friends have reach, just look at my xbl friends list |
| 21:14.49 | Shirik | um |
| 21:14.50 | Shirik | Ackis |
| 21:14.56 | NightHawkTheSane | zenzelezz: i still remember my icq uin. :\ |
| 21:15.00 | Shirik | how do I change my git repo origin? |
| 21:15.23 | zenzelezz | so do I, and I haven't used it for ... god knows how many years |
| 21:15.23 | Fisker | Shirik |
| 21:15.23 | Fisker | halo sucks |
| 21:15.23 | Fisker | halo reach sucks |
| 21:15.23 | Fisker | xbox 360 sucks |
| 21:15.23 | NightHawkTheSane | i think my client is still set to log into it, but i forget |
| 21:15.45 | NightHawkTheSane | Shirik: edit .git/config ? |
| 21:15.50 | Shirik | hm |
| 21:15.53 | NightHawkTheSane | there should be a [remote "origin"] section there? |
| 21:16.07 | Fisker | Shirik |
| 21:16.09 | NightHawkTheSane | there mght be a git command to do it too, i forget. |
| 21:16.11 | Fisker | why do you persist? |
| 21:17.39 | NightHawkTheSane | Lunessa: ah, I picked it up last week (got a signed copy at a reading by him, woo!), haven't started it yet, though. I want to read pattern recognition first... |
| 21:18.14 | Lunessa | Pattern Recognition is a very, very, very cool book. |
| 21:18.53 | Fisker | lold |
| 21:19.01 | Fisker | ret palas are getting roflstomped by hunter pets |
| 21:20.14 | Pneumatus | 35k+ kill commands are srs bsnss |
| 21:20.53 | zenzelezz | dude, you have too many processes running |
| 21:20.56 | Fisker | Hey i'm more than happy with a reverse of the pala situation |
| 21:21.20 | Fisker | Instead of being OP in beta and severely nerfed in live, i can live with being severely nerfed in beta but OP in live |
| 21:21.28 | *** join/#wowuidev Legorol (~legorol@cpc8-sgyl28-2-0-cust43.sgyl.cable.virginmedia.com) |
| 21:21.28 | *** mode/#wowuidev [+v Legorol] by ChanServ |
| 21:21.35 | *** join/#wowuidev nuoHep (~nuohep@89.222.156.36) |
| 21:22.16 | Adys | Im a fucking genius |
| 21:23.13 | Adys | Im offering beta keys to the last players in healing done/dmg taken/dmg done depending on spec |
| 21:23.17 | Adys | in my raid |
| 21:23.39 | Dagmar | To the worst healers? |
| 21:23.44 | NightHawkTheSane | damage taken? |
| 21:23.58 | Adys | for tanks NightHawkTheSane |
| 21:24.04 | foxlit | But Pinky, where would you get so many beta keys? |
| 21:24.14 | NightHawkTheSane | i'm not really sure why less dmage taken means a worse tank, though |
| 21:24.27 | Pneumatus | just means he tanked less, usually |
| 21:24.28 | Adys | if you're comparing skill, yes |
| 21:24.36 | Adys | if you're comparing which tank tries to tank the least, no |
| 21:24.37 | Adys | :p |
| 21:24.51 | NightHawkTheSane | heh, fair enough ;) |
| 21:24.52 | Adys | do you know what my pinky tells you foxlit? |
| 21:25.15 | NightHawkTheSane | so, i suspect ill regret th is, but why, and why does it make you a genius? |
| 21:26.06 | NightHawkTheSane | actually, i think i get it. |
| 21:26.59 | Adys | I knew you would |
| 21:29.05 | Arrowmaster | TOP MEDALS |
| 21:29.18 | Arrowmaster | First Strike x1 Arrowmaster |
| 21:29.27 | Arrowmaster | Shotgun Spree x1 Arrowmaster |
| 21:29.34 | Arrowmaster | Killing Spree x1 Arrowmaster |
| 21:29.40 | Arrowmaster | yeah these guys sucked |
| 21:30.37 | Ackis | or they have... REAL LIVES! |
| 21:30.38 | Ackis | ;) |
| 21:30.42 | Ackis | :( |
| 21:31.03 | Arrowmaster | i could have done better too |
| 21:31.12 | *** join/#wowuidev jaxdahl (~foobar@202.15.31.96.cable.dyn.premieronline.net) |
| 21:31.12 | Arrowmaster | only x1 for each of those medals |
| 21:31.15 | *** join/#wowuidev Aeyan (~Erik@cpe-024-163-016-179.triad.res.rr.com) |
| 21:31.20 | Arrowmaster | but i finally got the first strike achievement |
| 21:31.42 | jaxdahl | is there a lotro ui dev channel? |
| 21:32.24 | Ackis | don't think one has been set up yet |
| 21:32.39 | Ackis | Arrowmaster: what's the first strike medal for? |
| 21:32.42 | Ackis | first kill? |
| 21:32.44 | Arrowmaster | yes |
| 21:33.01 | Ackis | hell I ain't ever getting that |
| 21:33.46 | *** join/#wowuidev Amarande (amarande@68-191-37-155.dhcp.nwtn.ct.charter.com) |
| 21:34.51 | *** join/#wowuidev isman (~drag@mna75-2-82-67-196-34.fbx.proxad.net) |
| 21:35.15 | Ackis | The average Halo: Reach player on Raptr has played 8 hours and earned 9 achievements. |
| 21:35.32 | Ackis | I have more cheevs but less hours I think |
| 21:35.41 | Arrowmaster | ive got 33 achievements |
| 21:35.48 | Amarande | bah @ achievements |
| 21:35.55 | Amarande | Ackis, do you think achievements made games more or less fun? |
| 21:35.59 | Cide | you're such an overachiever Arrowmaster |
| 21:36.03 | Ackis | both Amarande |
| 21:36.10 | Amarande | yeah, I'll have to agree, definitely double edged |
| 21:36.12 | Ackis | there's good achievements, and there are bad achievements |
| 21:36.14 | Amarande | gives people more to shoot for |
| 21:36.19 | Amarande | but on the other hand makes people more obsessive over epeen |
| 21:36.22 | Cide | um |
| 21:36.26 | Amarande | and I really don't get people who play games to feel superior |
| 21:36.29 | Ackis | overall for me, I think they've made games less fun |
| 21:36.29 | Cide | I don't think it can be very bad |
| 21:36.38 | Cide | that's your own decision Ackis |
| 21:36.41 | Cide | stop being so ocd about it |
| 21:36.44 | Ackis | I know Cide |
| 21:37.00 | Ackis | that's why I said for me, however my stance is achievements overall are good and bad |
| 21:37.09 | Ackis | they offer replayability, but they force grinding |
| 21:37.16 | Cide | they don't force grinding |
| 21:37.18 | Amarande | I wanted to get into Icecrown, for instance, because I wanted to see Icecrown and get shinies since I'd already pretty much got everything I could get elsewhere ... sure, getting KS will be fun if I land it, but ... |
| 21:37.21 | Cide | they add replay value period |
| 21:37.27 | Cide | it's like adding a new game mode and said game mode makes the other game modes worse |
| 21:37.29 | Cide | doesn't make sense |
| 21:37.51 | Ackis | it's not a new game mode, it's an enhancement to existing game modes |
| 21:38.01 | Cide | you play it like a separate game mode |
| 21:38.04 | Cide | that you have to beat |
| 21:38.05 | *** join/#wowuidev Athrun-- (~drag@mna75-2-82-67-196-34.fbx.proxad.net) |
| 21:38.06 | Cide | you don't have to |
| 21:38.09 | Amarande | also: |
| 21:38.12 | Ackis | yes that's how I do it |
| 21:38.18 | Amarande | is it better to hit the Captain before, during, or after the raid, or all three? |
| 21:38.20 | Ackis | and how others do it as well |
| 21:38.28 | Arrowmaster | achievements for ranking up in multiplayer make the game less fun |
| 21:38.31 | Cide | that makes you stupid, not achievements |
| 21:38.43 | Cide | achievements tied to content is stupid |
| 21:38.48 | Cide | achievements tied to unlocking content rather |
| 21:38.51 | Ackis | what about the other millions of people who care about achievements as well? |
| 21:38.52 | Amarande | (And don't tell me you don't know what you mean by "hit the Captain" ... we're all a bunch of jaded old folks here :P) |
| 21:39.11 | Cide | caring about and obsessing about are two very different things |
| 21:39.12 | Ackis | during the raid Amarande |
| 21:39.31 | Cide | the captain usually hits me |
| 21:39.34 | Ackis | WoW's overall fun decreased for me when they added achievements Cide |
| 21:39.35 | Cide | from the blue |
| 21:39.38 | Ackis | that's an example |
| 21:39.40 | Cide | and then I wake up in someone's bed |
| 21:39.54 | Cide | Ackis: again, that's all you |
| 21:39.58 | Cide | achievements only add value |
| 21:40.01 | Cide | you abuse said value |
| 21:40.26 | Ackis | why do I feel like I'm arguing with a wall? :P |
| 21:40.33 | Cide | because you're wrong? :P |
| 21:40.38 | Ackis | I'm not wrong |
| 21:40.42 | Cide | sure youa re |
| 21:40.44 | Cide | sure you are |
| 21:41.06 | Ackis | mutters |
| 21:41.12 | Cide | I agree that achievements can be detrimental |
| 21:41.17 | Cide | but that's because of abuse, not use |
| 21:41.27 | Ackis | they're designed to be abused |
| 21:41.34 | Ackis | like an MMO |
| 21:41.36 | Cide | by that reasoning all games are |
| 21:41.47 | Cide | stay away from games then |
| 21:41.53 | Dashkal | Trees rule: http://happychairishappy.com/2010/09/13/objects-with-faces-rebellious-tree/ |
| 21:41.59 | Cide | achievements are designed to add replay value |
| 21:42.08 | Cide | not force you to accomplish everything |
| 21:42.19 | Ackis | no, not all games are meant to be abused, there's games that are meant to be played and that's it... done for fun |
| 21:42.28 | Cide | same theory behind achievements |
| 21:42.33 | Amarande | and yay my oracle egg hatched |
| 21:42.35 | Cide | I had great fun accomplishing the tf2 achievements |
| 21:42.40 | Amarande | another cobra hatchling. |
| 21:42.48 | Cide | but there's a reason I'm not "The Immortal" in wow |
| 21:42.54 | Amarande | Ackis: indeed, that F word, that word that so many people on this server seem to have forgotten about |
| 21:43.10 | Ackis | what's the reason Cide? |
| 21:43.10 | Amarande | Heya Cairenn :) |
| 21:43.14 | Cairenn | hi hi |
| 21:43.18 | Xyphoid | i am really enjoying the sc2 campaign achievements |
| 21:43.28 | Amarande | I don't understand hardcores |
| 21:43.30 | Cide | it's a difficult achievement and I can't be assed to lead raids again |
| 21:43.39 | Amarande | ok, I understand the ones that are hardcore because they find it *fun* to go for the most challenging stuff every time |
| 21:43.39 | Cide | fuck leading raids honestly |
| 21:43.41 | Amarande | but |
| 21:43.52 | Amarande | I don't understand the ones that think it's more important to get cheeves and curbstomp raids than have fun |
| 21:44.13 | Amarande | hell, let's put it this way, I don't mind wiping on sindy because I mind wiping |
| 21:44.16 | Ackis | but doesn't it annoy you to see people with the immortal and to know that in a month or two you'll never be able to get it? |
| 21:44.16 | Amarande | I've had fun wipes |
| 21:44.24 | Cide | Ackis: no, not at all |
| 21:44.36 | Cide | I never got "Hand of A'Dal" and I had the capability to do so for like a year |
| 21:44.37 | Ackis | see that's where it annoys hte hell out of me |
| 21:44.39 | Amarande | I mind wiping on sindy because sindy just isn't *fun* for me, but we get stuck spending an hour or two on just sindy atts most week :S |
| 21:44.43 | Cide | and it was just a simple questline |
| 21:44.48 | Cide | or whatever |
| 21:44.51 | Amarande | Cide: I got pissed off over Champion of the Naaru |
| 21:44.59 | *** join/#wowuidev TC-Work (~chatzilla@c-064-186-233-091.oc1.redwire.net) |
| 21:45.03 | Amarande | but that was because I was like within a freaking whisker of getting it when 3.0 came and took it away |
| 21:45.03 | Cide | couldn't care less |
| 21:45.20 | Cide | I do achievements that are fun |
| 21:45.26 | Cide | other people find other achievements fun |
| 21:45.42 | Cide | do whatever you find adds enjoyment instead of obessing about doing them all |
| 21:46.04 | Cide | by the same reasoning diablo 2 wasn't bad because there were tons of monsters in it |
| 21:46.06 | Ackis | has to catch them all. |
| 21:46.13 | Cide | but I bet you some guy killed every single monster in the whole game |
| 21:46.26 | Cide | only to have it crash in act 5 and having to redo it all |
| 21:46.29 | Ackis | I'd kill every mob on a level before advancing :( |
| 21:46.36 | Cide | told you |
| 21:46.37 | jaxdahl | http://s.wowinterface.com/preview/pvw38831.png where is this from? |
| 21:47.09 | Cide | that's from a game called World of Warcraft. |
| 21:49.00 | myrkraverk | Icecrown, to be more precise. |
| 21:49.23 | Kraps | thats a sexy ui |
| 21:49.23 | kd3|netbook | thinking by one of the ramparts? |
| 21:49.37 | jaxdahl | i'm just trying to figure out which download it is on wowi |
| 21:49.40 | Stanzilla | jaxdahl: LUI |
| 21:49.41 | Cide | 72.3, 58.8 precisely |
| 21:50.18 | jaxdahl | http://www.wowinterface.com/downloads/info14130-LUIv3.html thanks |
| 21:50.36 | Cide | how is that next generation? |
| 21:50.47 | Cide | does it use a new technology besides xml and lua? |
| 21:50.58 | foxlit | Cide: it uses a new and exciting technology in logos |
| 21:51.05 | Cide | nice |
| 21:51.07 | foxlit | namelyomittingallspaces |
| 21:51.35 | Cide | indeedtheyhave |
| 21:51.56 | Kraps | why is everyone so cranky today? |
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| 21:59.03 | Amarande | Cide: I think part of the reason I end up with some negative feelings about, say, WotLK is that like I said, my gaming history suggests I should be taking down the Lich King as a matter of routine |
| 21:59.28 | Amarande | When I played Diablo 2, I took down Baal as a routine matter of finishing the game ... In Guild Wars, I defeated the Lich, Shiro, and Abaddon as a routine matter of finishing the campaigns. |
| 21:59.36 | Amarande | But apparently Big Bads in WoW aren't supposed to be a routine matter :S |
| 22:00.13 | foxlit | I'd comment, but that would just increase my level of crankiness :( |
| 22:03.30 | *** join/#wowuidev Aeyan (~pancake@cpe-024-163-016-179.triad.res.rr.com) |
| 22:03.51 | Cide | DOITFOXLIT |
| 22:03.57 | Xyphoid | it's too easy |
| 22:04.01 | Xyphoid | it's clearly a troll |
| 22:05.12 | Lunessa | foxlit: Well LAH-DEE-DA Mr. Cranky-pants. I'm cranky too. What's say we choke the crap out of Fisker to cheer ourselves up? |
| 22:05.30 | Xyphoid | so i've got my addon that hacks around the default crafting panel in a not particularly clean way. is there any chance it'll work in Cata, or is the crafting interface completely new? |
| 22:05.35 | Humbedooh | Yes! |
| 22:05.43 | Humbedooh | agrees with Lunessa |
| 22:06.30 | myrkraverk | Xyphoid, last time I checked, the interface was the same. That was quite some patches ago though. |
| 22:06.32 | Lunessa | Xyphoid: The crafting interface is getting reworked, and chances are you will need at least minor revision. |
| 22:06.42 | Xyphoid | righto, ta |
| 22:07.58 | Xyphoid | i was trying to figure out whether it's worth fixing bugs and tidying at this point but probably not |
| 22:08.04 | Amarande | Lunessa: any idea if atsw has been 4.0-ified yet? |
| 22:08.40 | Lunessa | Amarande: Since crafting is mostly broken right now, I highly doubt it. |
| 22:14.10 | Adys | ckknight: ping |
| 22:14.45 | ckknight | Adys: pong |
| 22:14.50 | Adys | sec |
| 22:14.56 | ckknight | you should've been prepared |
| 22:14.58 | ckknight | now your time has passed |
| 22:15.15 | *** join/#wowuidev smcn (~smcn@c-174-52-104-121.hsd1.ut.comcast.net) |
| 22:15.17 | Adys | GRAWR |
| 22:15.18 | Adys | :( |
| 22:15.33 | Alram | did ckknight just pull an Adys on Adys |
| 22:15.39 | Alram | amazing |
| 22:15.46 | *** mode/#wowuidev [-v Adys] by ckknight |
| 22:16.00 | Adys | :( |
| 22:16.07 | ckknight | dude, what do you want? |
| 22:16.15 | ckknight | spit it out |
| 22:16.22 | Amarande | hmm, new one for punishments we should inflict on gold sellers |
| 22:16.22 | Dagmar | Lunessa: Cooking seems fine |
| 22:16.31 | Amarande | if only we could summon heroic Sindy in real life and sic her on them. ;) |
| 22:16.41 | Adys | ckknight: python question |
| 22:16.48 | ckknight | then ask! |
| 22:16.49 | Adys | I have a bunch of image decoders |
| 22:16.50 | ckknight | ~asktoask |
| 22:16.50 | purl | This is IRC. Don't ask to ask a question. Just ask your question and if someone's around, they'll be glad to help. |
| 22:17.06 | Adys | I want to write a function that will return the proper decoder for a file |
| 22:17.08 | Lunessa | Dagmar: Wait until you try to get upper-reaches. Most of my toons right now can't even fish, or access the crafting UI without using a macro. |
| 22:17.13 | Dagmar | #1 thing to remember: PIL hates you. |
| 22:17.14 | nicoli_s | that lies, no one is ever glad to help |
| 22:17.15 | Amarande | heroic sindy simply because that's probably the single most horrible, painful fight in the entirety of WoW so far :) |
| 22:17.47 | ckknight | Adys: k... |
| 22:17.53 | Cide | def getDecoder(file): for decoder in decoders: if decoder.handles(file): return decoder |
| 22:17.54 | Cide | imo |
| 22:18.02 | Amarande | Heck ... I wouldn't be surprised if most Lights of Dawn didn't beat heroic Sindy. :) |
| 22:18.19 | Dagmar | Lunessa: Well, being that the copy queue is slow as molasses right now I was doing some cooking on my level 7 dwarf hunter (since the pet being locked in aggressive mode will do nothing but GET ME KILLED right now). Ran it up to 60ish without a problem |
| 22:18.24 | Adys | one sec |
| 22:18.30 | ckknight | Cide: camelCase feels so out of place in python |
| 22:18.34 | Adys | Bibi is bibeing annoying. |
| 22:18.43 | Dagmar | They gotta fix that pet control thing or new hunters probably aren't going to happen |
| 22:18.49 | Cide | ckknight: I used the syntax Adys pm'd me |
| 22:18.54 | Cide | (00:15:52) Adys: getDecoder(<some file>) |
| 22:18.57 | ckknight | okay |
| 22:19.03 | Adys | camelcase is fine l2python |
| 22:19.08 | Kraps | http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LddOtJFuSv0&feature=player_embedded |
| 22:19.16 | ckknight | Adys: ...don't tell me to learn python |
| 22:19.26 | Adys | i didnt tell you to learn python |
| 22:19.28 | Cide | ckknight *MADE* python! |
| 22:19.28 | Adys | i told you to l2python |
| 22:19.39 | Adys | your sister made python |
| 22:20.10 | Adys | k one sec the world hates me |
| 22:20.12 | Adys | i need to hate it back. |
| 22:20.22 | *** join/#wowuidev Funkeh` (~funk@WoWUIDev/WoWAce/Ace3/BigWigs/funkeh) |
| 22:20.26 | *** join/#wowuidev kd3|netbook (~kd3@wikia/kaydeethree) |
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| 22:21.46 | Adys | ckknight / Cide ok this is more of a design question |
| 22:21.57 | ckknight | you've yet to ask a question! |
| 22:22.02 | Adys | yeah Im on it. |
| 22:22.17 | ckknight | k, stop chatting, figure out your question, once you got it, then ask. |
| 22:22.20 | Adys | yes |
| 22:22.24 | Adys | i'm trying. |
| 22:22.29 | Adys | Alram HELP ME HERE |
| 22:23.10 | Adys | I want to know what the sanest way to handle codecs is. something like, maybe register codecs with a central image codec repo |
| 22:23.22 | Alram | me helping you? after all the countless times you banned me for nothing? |
| 22:23.24 | Alram | no |
| 22:23.57 | Adys | [23:24:12] * #wowuidev :You're not channel operator |
| 22:23.58 | Adys | ffs. |
| 22:24.31 | Humbedooh | that's not a question, Adys - that's a statement :\ |
| 22:24.34 | Cide | Adys: I told you? |
| 22:24.41 | Cide | def getDecoder(file): for decoder in decoders: if decoder.handles(file): return decoder |
| 22:24.49 | Adys | Cide, yes, nice, but |
| 22:24.57 | Adys | it's more about how to register codecs in the first place |
| 22:25.50 | ckknight | def register_codec(codec): pass |
| 22:26.01 | ckknight | alternatively, just use PIL |
| 22:26.06 | Adys | I am using pil |
| 22:26.11 | Adys | but PIL is fucking garbage |
| 22:26.27 | Cide | or use a metaclass that stores created classes |
| 22:26.33 | Cide | I do that all the time |
| 22:26.34 | ckknight | just set up a registration pattern |
| 22:26.35 | kd3|netbook | whee. test time in database class. |
| 22:26.36 | ckknight | simple enough |
| 22:26.43 | kd3|netbook | puts his netbook away |
| 22:26.45 | Jamash | use file |
| 22:26.48 | ckknight | then register_codec(codec, ['filetype']) |
| 22:26.48 | Adys | "registration pattern"? |
| 22:27.55 | ckknight | yes |
| 22:28.02 | Jamash | http://pypi.python.org/pypi/python-magic/0.1 |
| 22:28.33 | Cide | just add them to a list and let each codec take a file and check if it supports it |
| 22:28.34 | Adys | Jamash: that doesn't help me, I need to make sure I handle custom file formats properly |
| 22:28.57 | Adys | Cide, yeah but what list? |
| 22:29.03 | Cide | a list? |
| 22:29.08 | ckknight | def register_codec(codec, filetypes=[]): codecs.add((codec, filetypes)) |
| 22:29.13 | Cide | in a module where getDecoder() resides? |
| 22:29.29 | Cide | and then you simply do |
| 22:30.03 | Cide | from path.to import module |
| 22:30.04 | Cide | module.register_decoder(obj) |
| 22:30.14 | *** join/#wowuidev the-golem (~Darrin@c-98-255-201-176.hsd1.ca.comcast.net) |
| 22:30.20 | Cide | ^ important to use it by the module handle in order to use the same list across all imports |
| 22:31.29 | Adys | Cide: but how would I make sure that this codec is available at runtime for other apps using that lib? |
| 22:31.54 | Cide | if it doesn't register itself it isn't there |
| 22:32.17 | Amarande | hmm, new thing learned about icc, apparently |
| 22:32.17 | Cide | if you're doing registration separate from the codec definition then you simply try to import it and if you get an importerror you don't register |
| 22:32.26 | Amarande | you can only fight LK on heroic if you fight the first eleven bosses all on heroic as well? |
| 22:32.39 | Amarande | I thought you were allowed to swap it on and off on a per boss basis for icc |
| 22:32.48 | Cide | you are allowed to swap it on and off |
| 22:32.50 | Adys | Cide: wouldnt that result in like 100 imports if i have 100 formats? |
| 22:32.58 | Cide | yes |
| 22:33.01 | Amarande | Cide: yeah, but foxlit says that doesn't work for LK |
| 22:33.09 | Cide | are the two mutually exclusive? |
| 22:33.15 | Lunessa | LULZ - (Also, I apologize. This was supposed to be short, but my wall of text popped Heroism/Bloodlust on you guys.) |
| 22:33.19 | Cide | you can do it lazily also |
| 22:33.26 | Adys | i was sort of hoping for a design that didnt have me do this |
| 22:33.31 | Adys | but im not sure theres a way around it |
| 22:33.56 | Cide | well if you need each codec to tell you if it supports a file then you need that |
| 22:34.17 | Cide | if you can deal with just file extensions you can tell without loading them and only load if you find a matching file extension |
| 22:34.17 | Adys | yeah |
| 22:34.18 | Amarande | Cide: so you *can* get light of dawn fighting the first 11 on normal and then turning on heroic just for LK? or did they put in a catch to keep you from doing that |
| 22:34.24 | Cide | fuck if I know |
| 22:34.29 | Amarande | since from what I'm seeing on the cheeve on wowhead, only LK himself is specifically required |
| 22:34.38 | Cide | ask foxlit |
| 22:35.41 | Dagmar | How many image formats could we possibly be talking about? I'm pretty sure there's a magic filetype module for python |
| 22:35.41 | Adys | Cide: but then the issue is |
| 22:35.47 | Adys | how would I know what to import |
| 22:35.55 | Adys | say i have all my codecs in pilgrim.codecs |
| 22:36.00 | Dagmar | if (it r not gif/png/tga/bmp) tell user "fuk u" |
| 22:36.09 | Adys | but then a user adds a codec in hislib.mycodec |
| 22:36.21 | Cide | you register the import path? |
| 22:36.40 | Amarande | ahh, apparently it's you have to beat the final boss of each wing on heroic, the other eight don't matter. |
| 22:36.59 | Amarande | too bad that means you're forced to do heroic sindy to do heroic LK. :( |
| 22:37.07 | Cide | and call __import__ or some import module helper |
| 22:37.26 | Adys | Cide: but how would the user register his lib to make it usable throughout all python apps calling pilgrim without modifying pilgrim source? |
| 22:37.48 | Cide | s/he registers the path and the module path |
| 22:37.58 | Cide | if the module is chosen it gets imported and must adhere to a specific interface |
| 22:38.05 | Cide | and then you use it like any other |
| 22:38.06 | Cide | good night |
| 22:38.14 | Adys | night |
| 22:38.30 | Kraps | do you open a ticket to report a name? |
| 22:38.41 | Adys | yes |
| 22:38.59 | Dagmar | Kraps: Emailing wowgm@blizzard.com works, too |
| 22:40.01 | Dagmar | There's a guild of b-tards on our server whose leader was named 'Ryansucks' until last weeks griefing incident |
| 22:40.13 | Dagmar | 'Youngblakman' is next. |
| 22:40.49 | Amarande | Dagmar: I'd be careful. |
| 22:41.05 | Dagmar | careful of what? |
| 22:41.07 | Amarande | do that and next thing those kiddies will start looking for all your characters whose names are too much like names from books or such |
| 22:41.09 | Amarande | and report *you* |
| 22:41.17 | Dagmar | I don't have any toons named things like that |
| 22:41.30 | Amarande | Dagmar: a lot of people do, though |
| 22:41.45 | Dagmar | ...and I say "next" because it's only a matter of time before I see more of them acting like jerks. |
| 22:42.18 | NightHawkTheSane | What's to be careful about? if you're name is in violation of policy, its your own damn fault. |
| 22:42.22 | NightHawkTheSane | yoru* |
| 22:42.24 | NightHawkTheSane | your* bah! |
| 22:42.33 | Dagmar | I generally just ignore victims of Stupid Name Syndrome until they choose to become metastacized and decide to greif people |
| 22:42.37 | *** join/#wowuidev TC-Mobile (~AndChat@c-064-186-233-091.oc1.redwire.net) |
| 22:43.19 | NightHawkTheSane | I usually ignore it until they annoy me. Griefing people is one way of doing that, but some days, just being in the same raid as me is enough. |
| 22:43.27 | Dagmar | hehe |
| 22:43.34 | NightHawkTheSane | (Yes, I have and will continue to report people for dumb names just because they showed up in my raid) |
| 22:43.52 | Dagmar | During the days of anal flooding I was sending lists with 20+ names at a time |
| 22:43.53 | *** join/#wowuidev Sixen (~Kevin@149.169.115.92) |
| 22:44.18 | Dagmar | ...because the majority of people who think anal spam is funny also seemed to like names like Giantcockboy |
| 22:44.25 | Lunessa | Well, my main is named "Unkle" - a handle I've been using since EQ |
| 22:44.31 | ckknight | hey Dagmar, you called? |
| 22:44.42 | Lunessa | and now there's a band... SO /technically/ I'm in violation. |
| 22:44.46 | Dagmar | ckknight: lol |
| 22:44.52 | ckknight | :P |
| 22:45.01 | Amarande | Night: do you have a lot of frustrating raids that require multiple shots of 100 proof liquor to clear the annoyance factor of? :) |
| 22:45.12 | NightHawkTheSane | Amarande: that's every raid ever. |
| 22:45.13 | Dagmar | Lunessa: I'm not sure if that's really a title, actually |
| 22:45.14 | Amarande | or probably scotch, in your case |
| 22:45.18 | NightHawkTheSane | I haven't raided sober in years. |
| 22:45.21 | Amarande | for some reason I keep thinking you're probably the type who drinks scotch |
| 22:45.36 | NightHawkTheSane | Vodka is my preferred hard liquor. Scotch is okay, but more expensive. |
| 22:45.37 | Lunessa | Dagmar: It's a trademark owned my a rock group. |
| 22:45.39 | Amarande | I have a bottle of Captain here. |
| 22:45.44 | Amarande | Rum FTW. |
| 22:46.00 | Dagmar | Amarande: You should try Jerry on for size |
| 22:46.03 | Dagmar | It's a nice change |
| 22:46.11 | Dagmar | Plus there's a hula girl on the bottle |
| 22:46.25 | NightHawkTheSane | vodka's nice, because it mixes well with a lot of things i typically have on hand (juice, mainly) |
| 22:46.25 | foxlit | Hm, Series 5 isn't out on DVD until November? |
| 22:46.31 | NightHawkTheSane | tequila's also really good for that |
| 22:46.36 | *** join/#wowuidev TC-Work (~chatzilla@c-064-186-233-091.oc1.redwire.net) |
| 22:46.37 | NightHawkTheSane | i should buy more teqluila. |
| 22:46.40 | foxlit | Haven't they all aired by now -- what are they waiting for? |
| 22:46.45 | Amarande | Night: Don Julio ftw. |
| 22:46.50 | Dagmar | NHTS: PIneapple vodka and Blue Demon Full Throttle. :) |
| 22:47.02 | Lunessa | foxlit: Series 5 of what? |
| 22:47.15 | foxlit | Doctor Who :) |
| 22:47.25 | Dagmar | OH! BBCA reair rights |
| 22:47.26 | Amarande | other things that mix well ... Midori |
| 22:47.28 | NightHawkTheSane | yeah, don julio is good. I'm also a fan of aha toro, but there's a number of good brands. |
| 22:47.32 | Lunessa | Oh. go go iTunes? |
| 22:47.42 | foxlit | Lunessa: not from this country :( |
| 22:47.44 | Amarande | although midori does have a tendency to make anything you mix it into look like toxic waste |
| 22:47.50 | NightHawkTheSane | foxlit, Lunessa: go go torrents. |
| 22:47.50 | Lunessa | foxlit: Oh. |
| 22:48.09 | Dagmar | Amarande: That's a feature. Japanese Slipper |
| 22:48.09 | Lunessa | NightHawkTheSane: We've had this conversation before. :P |
| 22:48.19 | NightHawkTheSane | have we? :P |
| 22:48.43 | Lunessa | Yes, since I make part of my living from the ownership of IP I don't feel right torrenting the IP of others. |
| 22:48.43 | foxlit | [Apparently I'm looking at the release date of the "complete series" box-- the indivudal volumes are out now] |
| 22:48.54 | foxlit | Which again, is an obvious money-grab |
| 22:49.49 | Amarande | foxlit: I got a Get Out of Death Free card from one of the T-shirt vendors at Dragon Con |
| 22:50.02 | Amarande | it can only be used twelve times |
| 22:50.03 | Amarande | :) |
| 22:50.11 | NightHawkTheSane | Lunessa: eh, definitely don't want to launch into a full on discussion, but that's fair. I'm not opposed to buying things I find high quality and/or enjoyable. I just like being able to determine that before spending any money on it ;) |
| 22:50.13 | Amarande | literally they made up the whole thing to look just like a Chance card |
| 22:50.38 | Dagmar | I find that placing a pre-order for something three months out tends to assuage my concience completely. |
| 22:50.44 | Lunessa | NightHawkTheSane: A position with which I sympathize, even if I don't endorse it. |
| 22:50.52 | Dagmar | It ain't my damn fault if they don't feel like selling to me |
| 22:53.36 | *** join/#wowuidev Jamash (~chatzilla@99-92-174-69.lightspeed.iplsin.sbcglobal.net) |
| 22:55.15 | Dagmar | NightHawkTheSane: If this is Dr. Who we're talking about, don't kid yourself. You know you're going to buy it. |
| 22:55.40 | Lunessa | We're in the interesting period between systems for doing things. Sort of the "Informational Industrial Revolution" and digital is the Assembly Line, the Cotton Gin, Electric Light and Radio rolled into one massive disruption. |
| 22:55.59 | Jamash | I saw an awesome Doctor Who fan video with the various incarnations of the Master to "When You're Evil" http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=D4gJuwGdBIg |
| 22:56.01 | Lunessa | digital data I mean |
| 22:56.31 | Jamash | digimal technography |
| 22:56.50 | Dagmar | Yes, they're introducing such wonderful innovations to the market, like "OnlyPlayOnOurHardware" and "ChargeYouPerEyeball", as well as "MakeYouBuyItAgainInAFewYearsWhenTheDRMFails" |
| 22:57.38 | Jamash | I came to the conclusion a while ago that the only effective way to use video from the iTunes store was to buy it and then torrent a non-DRM version |
| 22:57.40 | Dagmar | This is why I both buy media and pirate it at the same time (the same media) |
| 22:57.45 | Jamash | ding |
| 22:58.11 | foxlit | Jamash: the series 3 finale has an awesome musical scene. |
| 22:58.17 | Dagmar | I'm getting really tired of the song and dance bullshit you have to do to get around some of the not-quite-to-spec DVDs that are out there tho |
| 22:58.21 | Lunessa | I'm just saying that transition and change need to happen, and it's interesting and disruptive all at the same time. |
| 22:58.28 | *** join/#wowuidev hobocommand (~josh@adsl-99-130-167-89.dsl.ipltin.sbcglobal.net) |
| 22:58.56 | Jamash | which one, Voodoo Child or I Can't Decide? |
| 22:59.02 | foxlit | The latter. |
| 22:59.07 | Jamash | that was pretty epic |
| 22:59.52 | Dagmar | Lunessa: The only "disruptive" I see is media makers refusing to allow any change that doesn't result in dramatically increased profit margins |
| 23:00.31 | Dagmar | Seems like mainly they're expecting to be paid for the things other people invent. |
| 23:01.11 | Lunessa | Dagmar: By "disruptive" I meant that industries will die or mutate in the wake of what people are capable of doing and are or are not willing to pay ofr. |
| 23:01.23 | Dagmar | Let's take for instance, this new Google music thing |
| 23:01.49 | Dagmar | The labels are actually expecting to take a cut of Google's money for letting people stream their own music back to themselves from the cloud. |
| 23:02.22 | Dagmar | So basically, you buy a CD, you rip it yourself because they can't really be bothered, then you upload it to Google, and you wind up indirectly paying the label every time you listen to your own shit? |
| 23:02.28 | Dagmar | How is that anything but insane |
| 23:02.52 | Amarande | Dagmar: actually, the labels have a legal right to take a cut of Google's money |
| 23:02.53 | Lunessa | And producers of horse-products attempted to kill the automobile with legal actions too. |
| 23:02.56 | Amarande | have you seen the SoundExchange laws? |
| 23:03.05 | Dagmar | Amarande: Oh yes. I'm quite familiar with their shit |
| 23:03.05 | Amarande | they're label protective to the point of STUPID |
| 23:03.12 | Amarande | get this. if you make your OWN MUSIC FROM SCRATCH |
| 23:03.14 | Amarande | and stream it |
| 23:03.18 | Amarande | you STILL legally have to pay the RIAA tax |
| 23:03.21 | Dagmar | Yeah I know |
| 23:03.24 | Dagmar | Fuuuuuuck that |
| 23:03.28 | Dagmar | No chance in hell |
| 23:03.41 | Amarande | yeah, the day that law passed is now pretty much thought of as the modern day the music died |
| 23:04.03 | Amarande | time to take our Chevy to the levee, I guess. :) |
| 23:04.08 | Dagmar | Clearly they intend to destroy that market before they will consider trying to be "fair" |
| 23:04.23 | NightHawkTheSane | Dagmar: sure, for Doctor Who, because i've seen it.. because I torrented it. But I'm not going to go spend money on [series I haven't seen] just because the current system fails to let me see it without that investment. |
| 23:04.27 | Dagmar | I stopped really blaming kids for pirating the hell out of everything when that law passed |
| 23:04.41 | Dagmar | If you're already being treated like you steal everything, there's not much incentive to buy |
| 23:05.22 | Dagmar | NightHawkTheSane: No I mean specifically I toss in a pre-order because they won't let me buy the damn thing yet (although if I wanted a Region 2 DVD in the UK, that I could have a week after it airs!)... |
| 23:05.44 | NightHawkTheSane | yeah, sure. |
| 23:05.45 | Dagmar | ...and then I go pirate the thing until my pre-order comes, at which point I make a much better rip and upgrade my library with it |
| 23:06.00 | Dagmar | I acually had a discussion about that with a member of the GBI |
| 23:06.01 | Dagmar | er FBI |
| 23:06.24 | Amarande | Dagmar: heh the government really has your number, don't they :) |
| 23:06.28 | NightHawkTheSane | But that wasn't quite my point. ;) |
| 23:06.29 | Amarande | have you registered with South Carolina yet :) |
| 23:06.48 | Dagmar | Amarande: I was tempted to, but they might not like people from out of state registering as subversives |
| 23:06.50 | foxlit | Why does the FBI care, anyhoo? |
| 23:07.00 | Dagmar | I did however register the local Tea Party groups for them |
| 23:07.04 | Amarande | foxlit: because pirates in the US are investigated by the FBI |
| 23:07.12 | Dagmar | foxlit: Wow. Massive FBI warnings on every DVD |
| 23:07.24 | Dagmar | The FBI is more realistic about some things than the labels |
| 23:07.26 | foxlit | Hm, yes, again, wrong region. |
| 23:07.41 | Dagmar | It's probably in "my file" that I said that to them, but I honestly don't care. |
| 23:07.49 | Dagmar | I'm pretty sure the BBC doesn't care either. |
| 23:08.03 | foxlit | I thought the problem was more that you upload things while tormenting them, which constitutes illegal distribution. |
| 23:08.09 | Dagmar | I'm payin' for cable. I'm payin' for the DVDs |
| 23:08.29 | Dagmar | foxlit: This is where DCC transfers over IRC are handy |
| 23:08.39 | Dagmar | 1:1 transmission neatly avoids contributory infringement |
| 23:08.49 | foxlit | And there I'm suddenly less clear about what law you're breaking |
| 23:09.16 | Dagmar | I'm more worried about ethics than law, and I'm pretty sure there's nothin' unethical |
| 23:09.33 | *** join/#wowuidev kd3|netbook (~kd3@wikia/kaydeethree) |
| 23:10.24 | Dagmar | Everyone's gettin' their money, so I figure ethically I'm good. |
| 23:11.10 | Dagmar | Hmm.. vague. s/good/covered/; |
| 23:13.39 | *** join/#wowuidev spode (spode@213.21.119.83) |
| 23:19.02 | Jamash | I want a service that just straight up sells personal copyright licenses |
| 23:19.48 | Jamash | you go to the page, buy a license for (say) Series 5 of the new Doctor Who, and torrent away |
| 23:20.25 | Arrowmaster | never going to happen |
| 23:20.43 | Arrowmaster | remember you have to pay every time you want your media in a different format |
| 23:25.41 | Amarande | Jamash: sure you can do that ... got a few hundred thousand to a few million dollars you aren't using? :) |
| 23:25.50 | Jamash | lewl |
| 23:26.10 | Amarande | I'm sure you could get a personal license to the doctor who property ... if you have enough money :P |
| 23:26.29 | Amarande | You can get almost everything for money these days. |
| 23:26.46 | Amarande | Pretty much flat out everything, if you count illegal transactions heh |
| 23:26.52 | Amarande | and yes, I'm a little tipsy from the [Captain Morgan Rum]. |
| 23:28.12 | Humbedooh | original or spiced gold? |
| 23:28.57 | *** join/#wowuidev Torhal (~callahan@74-141-248-166.dhcp.insightbb.com) |
| 23:29.43 | Amarande | Humbedooh: 100 proof |
| 23:29.50 | Amarande | spiced |
| 23:30.07 | Humbedooh | tsk tsk, you young hipster you |
| 23:30.29 | Humbedooh | I used to have a troll friend who'd always log on whenever someone spoke of rum ;> |
| 23:31.23 | KarlKFI|work | i like rum. it makes my computer seem faster |
| 23:32.13 | Humbedooh | rum is good |
| 23:32.19 | Humbedooh | but more rum is better |
| 23:33.51 | KarlKFI|work | rummier |
| 23:34.14 | Torhal | Where's the rum? |
| 23:34.53 | ckknight | no rum for you! |
| 23:35.08 | ckknight | unless you can properly attain the Ballmer Peak |
| 23:35.16 | ckknight | http://xkcd.com/323/ |
| 23:35.23 | Dagmar | You really should mix rum and cocaine. |
| 23:35.53 | Humbedooh | aaw |
| 23:35.54 | Dagmar | er should NOT |
| 23:35.57 | Humbedooh | Windows ME was fun ;> |
| 23:36.07 | Dagmar | *pfft* definitely should not mix the two |
| 23:36.14 | Torhal | ckknight: If at some point tonight I once again have a desktop environment, I'll probably work on code. |
| 23:36.31 | Torhal | I'm pretty sure WoW won't run in the console, though. |
| 23:36.34 | *** join/#wowuidev A-KO (as@unaffiliated/a-ko) |
| 23:36.52 | ckknight | Torhal: see, real programmers don't use Linux |
| 23:36.53 | ckknight | <.< |
| 23:36.54 | ckknight | >.> |
| 23:36.58 | Torhal | :P |
| 23:37.28 | Dagmar | At least we finally got that finnish hippie to go legit and pay some taxes |
| 23:40.23 | Ama|raid | and ICC begins |
| 23:41.16 | A-KO | so IE9 is freaking awesome |
| 23:42.02 | ckknight | Dagmar: he'd've been paying taxes for a while. |
| 23:42.05 | Dagmar | We'll see how you feel about it next time it hands your crap over to criminals |
| 23:42.18 | Dagmar | ckknight: That was sarcasm |
| 23:42.35 | ckknight | ? |
| 23:42.37 | *** join/#wowuidev Ressy (~valwws@CPE002129d9fabf-CM0014e88eec26.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com) |
| 23:42.40 | ckknight | criminals? |
| 23:42.53 | Humbedooh | hackers or microsoft? ;p |
| 23:43.00 | Dagmar | Mainly romaniancs |
| 23:43.05 | Dagmar | er Romanians |
| 23:43.15 | Humbedooh | you mean Romas? |
| 23:43.36 | Dagmar | I object to Microsoft's pretending to care about standards, and I object to their continued ignorance of what security in a browser means |
| 23:43.36 | Humbedooh | Romanians = people from Romania, Romas = Gypsies |
| 23:44.02 | Dagmar | I've no idea why you're talking about Gypsies |
| 23:44.33 | Humbedooh | well you mentioned romanians, so I thought (or blatantly assumed) that you meant gypsies :) |
| 23:44.38 | Dagmar | I strenuously object to them spinning a whole lot of smoke and mirror nonsense into press releases |
| 23:44.42 | A-KO | Dagmar: in 2010 they had 8 vulnerabilities on Secunia |
| 23:44.43 | A-KO | for IE8 |
| 23:44.46 | A-KO | Chrome 5 had 7 |
| 23:44.47 | ckknight | Dagmar: actually IE8 has been pretty damn secure. |
| 23:44.55 | A-KO | you can verify that yourself, secunia.com |
| 23:45.05 | Dagmar | ckknight: killbits are the wrong approach and always will be |
| 23:45.11 | A-KO | this browser isn't smoke and mirrors |
| 23:45.11 | A-KO | heh |
| 23:45.22 | Dagmar | A-Ko: Ther'es this thing called "recess time" that should concern you |
| 23:45.24 | Humbedooh | cloak and daggers! |
| 23:45.29 | Humbedooh | the true pirate way |
| 23:45.34 | Humbedooh | aarrr |
| 23:45.38 | ckknight | Dagmar: killbits? |
| 23:45.40 | Dagmar | The other browsers tend to take about a week, tops, to patch |
| 23:45.47 | Dagmar | ckknight: ActiveX issue |
| 23:45.48 | Humbedooh | it's some movie I think, ckknight |
| 23:45.55 | Humbedooh | Killbit 1 and 2 |
| 23:45.58 | A-KO | Dagmar: MS has a patching schedule at the request of people who want a scheduled timeframe for release. |
| 23:46.02 | Humbedooh | ;> |
| 23:46.04 | A-KO | When you've gotta patch hundreds/thousands of machines |
| 23:46.07 | A-KO | you need a schedule |
| 23:46.10 | Dagmar | IE, well, it's whenever either A) Microsoft starts to get a lot of bad press or B) They damn well feel lkike it |
| 23:46.41 | Dagmar | So, similar "incident count" or not, IE stays vulnerable about four times longer than the rest combined |
| 23:46.54 | A-KO | actually |
| 23:46.55 | A-KO | they don't |
| 23:47.00 | Dagmar | They do. |
| 23:47.04 | A-KO | will find the article that points that out, sec. |
| 23:47.13 | Wimpeh | <PROTECTED> |
| 23:47.19 | Humbedooh | demands evidence from both Dagmar and A-KO! |
| 23:47.26 | Dagmar | Read Full Disclosure. Learn some stuff. |
| 23:47.28 | A-KO | Humbedooh: sec, I have evidence if I can find it. |
| 23:47.41 | A-KO | in general, IE has been patched faster than other browsers |
| 23:47.41 | Wimpeh | 1-1-2-repeat to DPS him, damn hard. Use shield whenever he focuses on you. |
| 23:47.45 | Wimpeh | Raaaaageeeeee |
| 23:47.45 | Humbedooh | also demands a bottle of rum while he reads it! |
| 23:47.55 | Wimpeh | and it's weekly, I won't get it done this week. I can feel it. |
| 23:48.27 | Dagmar | A-Ko: No, it has not. You've been drinking the MS kool-aid if you believe that. They had one last fell that was open for a month straight. |
| 23:48.32 | Dagmar | s/fell/fall/; |
| 23:48.42 | NightHawkTheSane | Wimpeh: the hard part is "omg, what do these buttons do! what do i press! i'm an idiot who cant read tooltips!" |
| 23:48.54 | Dagmar | The day MS deigns to acknowledge they have a problem is not the day the problem starts. |
| 23:48.56 | Wimpeh | That raid has been out for how long? |
| 23:49.03 | Wimpeh | WHO NEEDS TOOLTIPS THIS FAR IN. |
| 23:49.07 | Wimpeh | :(( |
| 23:49.17 | NightHawkTheSane | idiot pugs |
| 23:49.20 | Wimpeh | Also |
| 23:49.47 | Wimpeh | "Kill sparks, don't let them reach Malygos. Stand in the pulsing thing it drops when it dies for extra damage." -- This was apparently hard to understand |
| 23:50.02 | Wimpeh | As I, as a resto shaman, had to try to take them down alone until a random Mage realized. |
| 23:50.25 | Wimpeh | The rest were busy hugging Malygos' ass. |
| 23:51.10 | *** join/#wowuidev Sliker[Bed] (~ponies@5e0b746a.bb.sky.com) |
| 23:51.21 | A-KO | Dagmar: a whole month, again, it comes down to unless it's a highly critical flaw/being exploited in the wild, it doesn't get patched outside of Patch Tuesday--again, which is great. |
| 23:51.32 | A-KO | I've got an environment building that's going to be 5,000+ machines strong. |
| 23:51.39 | Dagmar | A-KO: It gets exploited in the wilkd |
| 23:51.40 | A-KO | I'm not going to patch everything as soon as something comes out |
| 23:51.43 | A-KO | http://secunia.com/advisories/product/21625/?task=advisories_2010 |
| 23:52.07 | Dagmar | ABout half the time I have copies of the exploits |
| 23:53.10 | A-KO | Dagmar: Unless you've got some super secret stuff that I don't know about, but generally speaking, all I've got to go on is what's published on these lists--and so does everyone else. What I do know is that IN GENERAL, I've had to deal with far less Vista/7 maintenance issues than XP did in its hayday. |
| 23:53.17 | Dagmar | Hell, here's one that's not so serious, but it demonstrates what I'm talking about with respect to when Microsoft patches it. http://seclists.org/fulldisclosure/2010/Sep/64 |
| 23:53.33 | A-KO | if it's not so serious... |
| 23:53.41 | Dagmar | A-ko: Like I said, read Full Disclosure. Hell, ANY security-related mailing list. Stop drinking the Microsoft kool-aid. |
| 23:54.13 | Dagmar | And yes, I genersally do have access to "super secret" stuff. |
| 23:54.22 | Dagmar | I knew about Blaster about three months before it happened. |
| 23:54.31 | Dagmar | So did Microsoft, but they didn't feel like doing anything. |
| 23:54.35 | A-KO | Because MS doesn't patch something as soon as it's found? I don't blame 'em. |
| 23:54.42 | A-KO | Blaster is how many years ago? |
| 23:54.45 | A-KO | 2000? |
| 23:54.57 | Jerub | '02 wasn't it? |
| 23:54.59 | Corrodias | 2000 years ago |
| 23:55.01 | Dagmar | Yes, becuase they are more interested in downplaying the severity of everything and forcing people to make public exploits |
| 23:55.01 | kd3|netbook | whee; looks like it's a scantron test for us history |
| 23:55.08 | A-KO | Corrodias: it may as well been in IT-land |
| 23:55.18 | Dagmar | Yes, that goes towards demonstrating a _history_ of neglect and lies |
| 23:56.24 | A-KO | Dagmar: Microsoft's handling of security and issues back in 2000-2002 is a far cry from where they're at today, especially with their latest products. In fact, you also have to remember that a vulnerability != system access, or even critical system access. All of which are confirmed by some of the top researchers as significantly more difficult in Vista/7. |
| 23:56.31 | A-KO | so getting code on there is one thing, getting it to execute, another story. |
| 23:56.39 | A-KO | but you should know these things |
| 23:56.46 | Dagmar | It still isn't enough. |
| 23:56.54 | Humbedooh | luckilly, I shouldn't know those things anymore :> |
| 23:56.55 | A-KO | It's *FAR* more than a whole lot of other vendors |
| 23:57.33 | Dagmar | ...and frankly, the crap I'm hearing from you isn't a whole lot difference from the nonsesnse I've heard from Microsoft fanboys for the last ten years and I no longer have an interest in whether or not you know the trugh. |
| 23:57.35 | *** part/#wowuidev Sixen (~Kevin@149.169.115.92) |
| 23:57.37 | Dagmar | s/trugh/; |
| 23:57.43 | Dagmar | ...because _your money spends just fine_. |
| 23:57.45 | A-KO | let's not forget the MASSIVE FUCKING HOLE in Debian Linux with openssl key generation that went on for YEARS without someone catching it. That's an amazing piece of work, considering you would end up having to re-generate SSL keys and create new CSRs for every single website or anything that uses SSL. |
| 23:58.05 | A-KO | Talk about a right pain in the ass.... |
| 23:58.13 | Humbedooh | you know what I hate... |
| 23:58.15 | Jamash | alt.sysadmin.recovery is that way -----> |
| 23:58.19 | A-KO | lol Jamash |
| 23:58.19 | Dagmar | So it was patched how quickly when it was found? |
| 23:58.28 | Humbedooh | people that attack Linux when Microsoft is being questioned and vice versa |
| 23:58.39 | A-KO | Dagmar: It would have never been an issue had Debian not fucked with it to begin with :P |
| 23:58.51 | Humbedooh | it's not a dichotomy, people |
| 23:58.57 | Dagmar | Yet for some reason you blame Debian for a bug in OpenSSL? |
| 23:59.01 | Adys | No command 'pass' found, did you mean: |
| 23:59.02 | Adys | <PROTECTED> |
| 23:59.05 | A-KO | Dagmar: Actually, it was a Debian problem |
| 23:59.06 | Dagmar | You know that's available and used on Win32, too, right? |
| 23:59.15 | Jamash | Humbedooh: let's all gang up and bash BeOS |
| 23:59.15 | A-KO | Dagmar: The guys at Debian commented out code they shouldn't have |
| 23:59.20 | A-KO | because they thought it wasn't necessary |
| 23:59.24 | Humbedooh | o/s 2!! |
| 23:59.28 | Dagmar | Either way, Debian patches things the moment they see even a _bug_ |
