| 00:00.49 | Antiarc | I think she looks like Jennifer Aniston |
| 00:01.24 | Kraps | that scares me |
| 00:01.53 | Wobin | Antiarc: Aniston has a narrower face |
| 00:02.24 | Kraps | so all the movies about women wooing gvmt officials and stealing secrets are true :/ |
| 00:02.58 | Antiarc | Now that you say it, I see Staite more than Aniston |
| 00:03.28 | *** join/#wowuidev theorb (~theorb@91.84.53.6) |
| 00:03.55 | *** join/#wowuidev Jelly|Laptop (~odiusxpop@69.42.103.8) |
| 00:05.54 | Adys | http://garfieldminusgarfield.net/post/786923651 |
| 00:05.54 | Wobin | Antiarc: that is not a bad thing to happen, in general =) |
| 00:22.35 | *** join/#wowuidev A-KO (as@c-68-33-146-13.hsd1.md.comcast.net) |
| 00:22.35 | *** join/#wowuidev A-KO (as@unaffiliated/a-ko) |
| 00:25.25 | Shirik | ohi Cide |
| 00:25.37 | Cide | hi shirik |
| 00:25.41 | Cide | how are you? |
| 00:28.13 | Shirik | ok |
| 00:28.14 | Cide | that good eh?! |
| 00:28.16 | Cide | oh |
| 00:28.18 | Shirik | I just packed up my entire cube |
| 00:28.19 | Cide | you just answered |
| 00:28.30 | Shirik | my office is moving tomorrow! |
| 00:28.31 | Cide | well you didn't answer my question but continue |
| 00:28.40 | Shirik | I said ok |
| 00:28.44 | Cide | oh |
| 00:28.55 | Cide | I see |
| 00:29.01 | Cide | where is your office moving? |
| 00:29.03 | cogwheel | HAI |
| 00:29.07 | Shirik | to ORR |
| 00:29.08 | Shirik | OR |
| 00:29.10 | Shirik | cogwheel |
| 00:29.12 | Shirik | omg |
| 00:29.14 | Shirik | epic codes |
| 00:29.27 | Cide | OR = ? |
| 00:29.32 | Cide | oregon? |
| 00:31.42 | *** join/#wowuidev Ressy (~valwws@CPE002129d9fabf-CM0014e88eec26.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com) |
| 00:32.03 | Shirik | yes |
| 00:32.17 | cogwheel | Shirik: where? |
| 00:32.22 | Shirik | hood river |
| 00:32.30 | cogwheel | epic codes -_- |
| 00:33.48 | *** join/#wowuidev MoonWitch (~Kelly@d51A4DB5F.access.telenet.be) |
| 00:34.34 | *** join/#wowuidev Kandoko1 (~Kandoko@adsl-068-159-119-207.sip.gsp.bellsouth.net) |
| 00:34.36 | *** join/#wowuidev Kandoko (~Kandoko@WoWUIDev/Norganna/Developer/Kandoko) |
| 00:35.08 | Cide | I know two people in portland |
| 00:35.13 | Cide | should go say hi to them for me |
| 00:35.23 | Cide | or are you moving with the office? |
| 00:35.26 | Cide | or not |
| 00:36.18 | *** join/#wowuidev A-KO^ (as@unaffiliated/a-ko) |
| 00:40.15 | *** join/#wowuidev Mihau (~alexia@c-68-62-169-133.hsd1.al.comcast.net) |
| 00:43.59 | Shirik | yes |
| 00:48.06 | Cide | ah |
| 00:48.17 | Cide | http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=134124 |
| 00:54.21 | foxlit | patched in 3... 2... |
| 00:54.53 | Kraps | http://kotaku.com/5582531/layoffs-hit-civilization-v-creators |
| 00:59.59 | Kraps | "Some people have a gross misunderstanding of the way decisions are made around here. When it comes to Blizzard's future, having Mr. Morhaime's attention is about as important as anything." |
| 01:01.26 | Wobin | who? |
| 01:01.39 | Kraps | who what? |
| 01:01.56 | Wobin | oh ceo |
| 01:02.07 | Wobin | I read that as Morihame |
| 01:02.15 | Wobin | and was wondering who the japanese bloke was |
| 01:09.11 | frontendloader | David Kim? |
| 01:24.59 | Kraps | 2200+ |
| 01:30.50 | Jerub | today is the two year anniversary of my office burning down. |
| 01:31.07 | Kraps | thanks for sharing |
| 01:31.12 | Kraps | <PROTECTED> |
| 01:31.53 | Jerub | i hereby declare today "check your offsite backups day" |
| 01:32.09 | Wobin | http://www.gizmodo.com.au/2010/07/fight-the-filter-make-sure-youre-enrolled-to-vote/ |
| 01:32.16 | Wobin | and you thought your American elections were exciting! |
| 01:32.18 | Kraps | the fuck? http://www.techdirt.com/articles/20100708/02510310122.shtml |
| 01:34.33 | *** join/#wowuidev bediko_ (~chatzilla@p4FE34464.dip.t-dialin.net) |
| 01:35.08 | Jerub | Kraps: you didn't know this? |
| 01:35.08 | Kraps | no |
| 01:35.20 | Jerub | Kraps: this is why every movie distributor has a /slightly/ different name. |
| 01:37.16 | Kraps | never noticed |
| 01:39.03 | Jerub | it would never fly in australia. our tax office has some amazing powers. |
| 01:39.34 | Jerub | "oooh, you restructured for tax purposes? that's neat. the way it should have been was like THIS, so we'll tax you like it was structured properly" |
| 01:39.49 | Jerub | "oh, and here's a fine for tax evasion" |
| 01:40.02 | Jerub | "now restructure sanely or go to gaol" |
| 01:44.20 | cogwheel | wonders how Word would feel about "gaol" |
| 01:45.13 | Jerub | cogwheel: ask it. |
| 01:45.18 | Jerub | it's a perfectly cromulent word. |
| 01:45.22 | cogwheel | it feels red and squiggly |
| 01:45.37 | cogwheel | i knows bettah |
| 01:46.06 | Jerub | it's the australian/nz spelling of jail according to wiktionary. |
| 01:46.24 | Jerub | and we know best when it comes to gaol. |
| 01:46.29 | cogwheel | indeed |
| 01:48.21 | Kraps | Jerub: you're austrailian? |
| 01:49.17 | Jerub | australian, yes. |
| 01:50.50 | Kraps | hey hey |
| 01:51.10 | cogwheel | i got that from the "our" in "our tax office" |
| 01:51.14 | cogwheel | :P |
| 01:51.21 | Wobin | It's (wednes) Saturday! |
| 01:51.45 | *** join/#wowuidev A-KO (as@unaffiliated/a-ko) |
| 01:52.45 | Jerub | iirc, they can also make those decisions take effect 7 years retrospectively too. |
| 01:54.32 | Kraps | what happened here http://forums.worldofwarcraft.com/thread.html?topicId=2856225038&sid=1 |
| 01:55.27 | *** join/#wowuidev SeanK (~SeanK@pool-98-117-120-73.sttlwa.fios.verizon.net) |
| 01:55.37 | Jerub | oh, i think i've seen that bug |
| 01:56.02 | Jerub | i sometimes have a 60-120 second lag between entering an instance and being able to use any of my abilities that target a mob |
| 01:56.14 | Jerub | this is a drama when you're a compulsive chainpulling tank |
| 01:57.14 | cogwheel | i remember at one point they changed the way global cooldown worked to prevent certain macro tricks... could this have been related? |
| 02:02.13 | Kraps | Jerub: its from 2007 |
| 02:03.08 | Jerub | Kraps: oh, heh |
| 02:03.20 | Jerub | okay, my current thinghappened twice this week or me |
| 02:03.22 | Jerub | er to me |
| 02:04.10 | Kraps | what thung |
| 02:04.12 | *** part/#wowuidev Cralor` (~Chris@c-75-68-70-97.hsd1.ma.comcast.net) |
| 02:04.17 | Kraps | thing* |
| 02:05.43 | Jerub | 11:56 < Jerub> i sometimes have a 60-120 second lag between entering an instance and being able to use any of my abilities that target a mob |
| 02:06.16 | Wobin | Jerub: not.. 1 to 2 mins? |
| 02:06.42 | Kraps | shit all hell is breaking loose http://www.wow.com/2010/07/08/that-scary-gearscore-real-id-screenshot-is-fake-guys/ |
| 02:07.03 | Kraps | http://forums.worldofwarcraft.com/thread.html?topicId=25968836715&sid=1 |
| 02:08.43 | Kraps | and in an amazing coincidence http://www.coasttocoastam.com/show/2010/07/08 |
| 02:10.54 | Wobin | You know |
| 02:11.01 | Wobin | I think the RealID on the forum |
| 02:11.09 | Wobin | is just going to make ingame much more vicious |
| 02:11.15 | Wobin | because they have nowhere else to vent |
| 02:11.54 | cogwheel | i think it's an interesting experiment |
| 02:12.11 | cogwheel | that's about the only conclusion i've been able to reach |
| 02:12.13 | Wobin | cogwheel: oh so do I. From an outside perspective |
| 02:12.16 | cogwheel | ambivalates |
| 02:12.27 | Wobin | perambivalates |
| 02:12.33 | Shadowed | IT'll certainly be interesting to see how it plays out |
| 02:12.38 | Kraps | not interesting :( |
| 02:12.45 | Wobin | I'd be fascinated if it was happening on another game =P |
| 02:12.51 | Kraps | ^ |
| 02:13.01 | Kraps | i'm just sad |
| 02:13.08 | Wobin | no, you're Kraps |
| 02:13.32 | Kraps | i feel krappy yes |
| 02:14.50 | Kraps | also, Lebron James goes to Miami |
| 02:15.40 | Kraps | so the Knicks threw away 2 years of ball for nothing |
| 02:16.40 | Kraps | dont really care, not into basketball |
| 02:17.55 | *** join/#wowuidev sioraiocht (~tomh@unaffiliated/sioraiocht) |
| 02:18.16 | Jerub | http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QuEfGbj9qS4 |
| 02:19.52 | Kraps | you can sell me water anytime jen http://www.adrants.com/images/anniston_glaceau.jpg |
| 02:22.30 | *** join/#wowuidev Stanzilla (Stan@irc.kuja.in) |
| 02:22.44 | *** join/#wowuidev ccox (~ccox@WoWUIDev/Norganna/Developer/CCox) |
| 02:28.16 | ScytheBlade1 | cogwheel: you still play eve? |
| 02:29.10 | cogwheel | nope |
| 02:29.26 | ScytheBlade1 | ah |
| 02:29.34 | ScytheBlade1 | I picked it up for $2, was curious about it |
| 02:30.14 | bleeter | wait... next gearscore release will be giving up everyone's full name whether we like it or not? |
| 02:30.31 | ScytheBlade1 | bleeter: good, everyone will stop using it then |
| 02:30.38 | cogwheel | ScytheBlade1: i've played it three different times for about 3 months each |
| 02:30.44 | bleeter | oh, maybe the vid's a fake... hmm |
| 02:30.50 | ScytheBlade1 | cogwheel: not a good sign |
| 02:30.53 | cogwheel | it's pretty fun, and I love the concept |
| 02:31.07 | cogwheel | but it takes a certain personality to really fit well |
| 02:31.08 | ScytheBlade1 | but? |
| 02:31.09 | ScytheBlade1 | ah |
| 02:31.18 | Antiarc | Whether or not that video's a fake that technique will be possible once the realid forums launch. |
| 02:31.31 | cogwheel | well, a few certain personalities, but still |
| 02:31.31 | Antiarc | web scraper -> data packages -> bam |
| 02:31.37 | bleeter | Antiarc: quite |
| 02:31.55 | cogwheel | ScytheBlade1: my attention span for time sinks is very short |
| 02:32.04 | cogwheel | (wow being the obvious exception) |
| 02:32.05 | bleeter | Antiarc: I'm still looking forward to picking up DBs of people who've posted 'IVE BEEN HACKED' to GM forums ;) |
| 02:32.19 | ScytheBlade1 | cogwheel: I was about to say... ;) |
| 02:32.52 | ScytheBlade1 | and holy crap I love this keyboard |
| 02:32.55 | ScytheBlade1 | AMAZING KEYBOARD |
| 02:32.58 | cogwheel | wat |
| 02:33.03 | cogwheel | clicky? |
| 02:33.10 | ScytheBlade1 | http://www.daskeyboard.com/model-s-ultimate-silent/ |
| 02:33.22 | ScytheBlade1 | I'll add that it is NOT silent |
| 02:33.26 | ScytheBlade1 | But quite nice |
| 02:33.42 | cogwheel | yes... mechanical KBs are win |
| 02:34.13 | cogwheel | unicomp even custom printed the u & h onto keys with nubs for my dvorak home row ;) |
| 02:34.25 | ScytheBlade1 | heh, nice |
| 02:34.45 | ScytheBlade1 | I really like the USB 2.0 hub on this keyboard though |
| 02:34.47 | ScytheBlade1 | Very nice touch |
| 02:34.47 | *** join/#wowuidev airtonix (~airtonix@unaffiliated/airtonix) |
| 02:36.00 | cogwheel | unicomp manufactures ibm model M clones and similar |
| 02:36.56 | ScytheBlade1 | Yeah I've seen them |
| 02:37.49 | cogwheel | it was love at first click for mrs. cog... |
| 02:37.57 | ScytheBlade1 | lol |
| 02:38.07 | ScytheBlade1 | I really like the finish of this keyboard |
| 02:38.18 | ScytheBlade1 | You probably can't tell from the website, but it is a glossy, black finish |
| 02:38.32 | ScytheBlade1 | Gives me a perfect reflection |
| 02:38.52 | cogwheel | yeah they needed more lights ;) |
| 02:39.00 | ScytheBlade1 | lol |
| 02:39.11 | ScytheBlade1 | ah crap |
| 02:39.21 | ScytheBlade1 | I was going to code stuff tonight but it is already 8:40 :/ |
| 02:42.05 | A-KO | http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MX0D4oZwCsA |
| 02:43.09 | A-KO | http://www.break.com/index/that-doesnt-make-you-a-model-song.html |
| 02:44.17 | *** join/#wowuidev kd3 (~kd3@wikia/kaydeethree) |
| 02:47.21 | Jerub | this is australia: http://notalwaysright.com/exchanges-at-this-rate-will-get-you-nowhere/6092 |
| 02:52.55 | Kraps | http://twitter.com/Dinorah_Pena/status/18076926807 |
| 02:54.26 | Jerub | did that kayne thing basically destroy his career? or is he still around? |
| 02:54.28 | Dagmar | Oooo! Harsh! |
| 02:54.45 | Dagmar | Jerub: He didn't have much of one to begin with |
| 02:55.14 | Dagmar | ...except now people basically _expect_ him to say something dumb as hell at an inappropriate time. |
| 02:56.13 | Dagmar | Remember, this is also the moron who busted out with "George Bush doesn't care about black people." |
| 02:56.37 | Kraps | http://twitter.com/brittonlowe/status/18082093455 |
| 02:56.39 | Dagmar | If he wasn't so obsessed with race he'd have gotten it right... George Bush doesn't care about *poor* people. |
| 02:56.44 | *** join/#wowuidev mascondante (~kvirc@pool-72-71-110-203.atl01.dsl-w.verizon.net) |
| 02:58.56 | *** join/#wowuidev Xinhuan (~xinhuan@165.21.240.246) |
| 02:59.02 | *** join/#wowuidev Xinhuan (~xinhuan@WoWUIDev/WoWAce/xinhuan) |
| 02:59.40 | Kraps | Dagmar: as ive gotten older ive learned that every administration is the same, except for the one or two major thing that they latch on to |
| 03:00.27 | Dagmar | I'm not sure Reagan actually understood poor people existed. |
| 03:08.08 | Kraps | http://forums.worldofwarcraft.com/thread.html?topicId=25968836802&postId=259664199577&sid=1#108 thats me btw |
| 03:16.23 | *** join/#wowuidev Imk0tter (LiTHiuM@ool-182cbf8b.dyn.optonline.net) |
| 03:16.44 | *** join/#wowuidev Imk0tter (LiTHiuM@ool-182cbf8b.dyn.optonline.net) |
| 03:17.21 | TC-Away | it would be rather awsome if there was a guild of nothing but 'john smiths' and then they all posted on the forums. |
| 03:17.27 | Dagmar | Kraps: Hmm... Hadda comment on that thread (as Eshk) |
| 03:18.15 | Thunder_Child | not 'have to' 'chose to' |
| 03:18.34 | Dagmar | Pedantic much? |
| 03:18.40 | Thunder_Child | yes |
| 03:18.44 | Thunder_Child | all. the. time. |
| 03:19.00 | Dagmar | Tell me.. what does the difference between the two phrases matter. |
| 03:19.24 | *** join/#wowuidev kd3 (~kd3@wikia/kaydeethree) |
| 03:19.33 | Thunder_Child | well, matter is a personal thing |
| 03:19.38 | Thunder_Child | i cant tell you what matters |
| 03:20.29 | Imk0tter | so yeha |
| 03:20.33 | Imk0tter | what kind of flash games do you nigs like? |
| 03:20.50 | Imk0tter | anyone play FlashFlashRevolution when the website was up? |
| 03:20.51 | Thunder_Child | oh yea, thats not going to go over well |
| 03:21.04 | Imk0tter | who the fuck still plays flash games dude |
| 03:21.12 | Dagmar | I |
| 03:21.13 | Imk0tter | i mean with all the shit on the internet |
| 03:21.16 | Imk0tter | and pc technology |
| 03:21.24 | Imk0tter | could build a gaming pc for $250 |
| 03:21.28 | Imk0tter | that could handle like |
| 03:21.32 | Imk0tter | mw2 |
| 03:21.34 | Dagmar | I'd just like to go on record as saying if I had his real name and were within driving distance, I'd already be buying a dozen eggs right now. |
| 03:21.39 | Thunder_Child | agreed |
| 03:21.47 | Thunder_Child | but it wouldnt be eggs in my case |
| 03:21.49 | Imk0tter | dude |
| 03:21.54 | Imk0tter | what the fuck are eggs going to do |
| 03:21.56 | Imk0tter | i'm in a fucking house |
| 03:22.07 | Thunder_Child | if we are lucky? kill you |
| 03:22.09 | *** join/#wowuidev Jamash (~chatzilla@99-92-174-69.lightspeed.iplsin.sbcglobal.net) |
| 03:22.11 | Imk0tter | dude |
| 03:22.14 | Imk0tter | you're awesome |
| 03:22.15 | Imk0tter | for one reason |
| 03:22.19 | Imk0tter | you think you could kill me with an eg |
| 03:22.24 | Imk0tter | that's pretty badass of you |
| 03:22.26 | Imk0tter | that's like |
| 03:22.28 | Imk0tter | if you had a beard |
| 03:22.35 | Wobin | well |
| 03:22.35 | Imk0tter | you would have gotten mad kudos for that |
| 03:22.39 | Wobin | you have to think outside the box |
| 03:22.39 | Imk0tter | you can't really consider your self a man |
| 03:22.42 | *** mode/#wowuidev [+q #wowuidev!*@*] by Shadowed |
| 03:22.43 | Wobin | and wrap the eggs in bricks |
| 03:22.44 | Imk0tter | untill you have a manbeard |
| 03:22.46 | Shadowed | hmm |
| 03:22.50 | Kraps | lolwut |
| 03:22.50 | *** mode/#wowuidev [-q #wowuidev!*@*] by Shadowed |
| 03:22.57 | *** mode/#wowuidev [+q Imk0tter!*@*] by Shadowed |
| 03:22.59 | Kraps | dont kick him |
| 03:22.59 | Shadowed | there we go |
| 03:23.05 | Kraps | :( |
| 03:23.17 | Wobin | he's Kotter! |
| 03:23.31 | *** mode/#wowuidev [-q Imk0tter!*@*] by Shadowed |
| 03:23.33 | Thunder_Child | ah, he's a new yorker |
| 03:23.38 | Thunder_Child | that explains things |
| 03:23.44 | Kraps | hey |
| 03:23.45 | Kraps | ! |
| 03:23.50 | Thunder_Child | what? |
| 03:23.51 | Imk0tter | people already trying to get my dox |
| 03:23.57 | Imk0tter | yeah so basically i came here |
| 03:23.59 | Imk0tter | to get some input |
| 03:24.00 | Imk0tter | on like |
| 03:24.04 | Imk0tter | what kind of flash games |
| 03:24.06 | Imk0tter | gamers like to play |
| 03:24.10 | *** kick/#wowuidev [Imk0tter!~Ryan@c-98-251-190-189.hsd1.tn.comcast.net] by Seerah (wanna try me?) |
| 03:24.16 | *** join/#wowuidev Imk0tter (LiTHiuM@ool-182cbf8b.dyn.optonline.net) |
| 03:24.18 | Imk0tter | ohh dude |
| 03:24.23 | Imk0tter | no reason to get so defensive |
| 03:24.26 | Imk0tter | i wasn't "challenging" anyone |
| 03:24.32 | Imk0tter | i just wanted to get some voice |
| 03:24.33 | Kraps | its ma'am btw |
| 03:24.36 | Imk0tter | ma'am |
| 03:24.37 | Imk0tter | doesn't matter |
| 03:24.38 | Thunder_Child | Op > you |
| 03:24.43 | Imk0tter | when you're on the internet you don't have a gender |
| 03:24.52 | Wobin | dude is gender specific |
| 03:24.54 | Imk0tter | you're just a computer |
| 03:24.54 | Thunder_Child | acutally, dude is rather gender neutral i think Kraps |
| 03:24.57 | Imk0tter | dude is NOT gender specific |
| 03:25.00 | Imk0tter | i don't care how gay you are |
| 03:25.09 | Kraps | depends on the context |
| 03:25.14 | Imk0tter | well |
| 03:25.19 | Imk0tter | i call everyone dude |
| 03:25.22 | Imk0tter | so don't feel offended |
| 03:25.27 | Wobin | ~wiki dude |
| 03:25.31 | Imk0tter | if you're like not a "dude" but rather, a "dude" ... |
| 03:25.48 | Kraps | oh i'm not, it was on Seerahs behalf |
| 03:26.05 | Imk0tter | but honestly |
| 03:26.07 | Dagmar | Don't you have homework to be doing or something |
| 03:26.11 | Imk0tter | if you could have any flash game made for you |
| 03:26.13 | Imk0tter | what would it be |
| 03:26.17 | Thunder_Child | or forums to be trolling |
| 03:26.22 | Seerah | Imk0tter: keep spamming and spouting garbage and you will be banned. not just kicked again |
| 03:26.23 | Wobin | One that could punch people in the face over the internet |
| 03:26.35 | Imk0tter | Seerah, you're like the person i look at |
| 03:26.39 | Kraps | hets trolling right now Thunder_Child ! |
| 03:26.42 | Imk0tter | basically |
| 03:26.46 | Thunder_Child | no kidding Kraps |
| 03:26.47 | Imk0tter | Seerah, you're defining your community right now |
| 03:26.51 | Imk0tter | since you're an operator |
| 03:27.01 | Imk0tter | so you should speak on behalf of it |
| 03:27.05 | Seerah | I am. We don't like spam, and we don't like garbage. :) |
| 03:27.10 | Kraps | awesome, philosophy! |
| 03:27.15 | Shadowed | If we took a vote, I don't think anyone would disagree with her |
| 03:27.23 | Thunder_Child | and if we liked flash games we would be flashuidev |
| 03:27.29 | Imk0tter | dude, i'd rather see the community active |
| 03:27.37 | Imk0tter | you know? |
| 03:27.40 | Imk0tter | but then |
| 03:27.41 | Imk0tter | who am i |
| 03:27.44 | Imk0tter | but a lowly member |
| 03:27.48 | Kraps | Dagmar: sup |
| 03:27.58 | Seerah | I'm sorry, but you were spamming so much, that no one could continue their conversations..... |
| 03:28.02 | Kraps | stay in your place plebe |
| 03:28.45 | Seerah | We don't mind it when new people come into the channel. Not at all. :) But we do ask that they behave themselves. |
| 03:29.08 | Imk0tter | ohh my bad, i usually don't realise that i'm typing on mad lines n shit |
| 03:29.15 | Imk0tter | i just like |
| 03:29.18 | Imk0tter | type shit as i go along |
| 03:29.37 | Dagmar | And yet square roots baffle you |
| 03:29.46 | Imk0tter | can does anyone here know how to script mIRC? |
| 03:29.53 | Imk0tter | out of curiosity |
| 03:34.28 | Kraps | Troll in: 2006: Post on your lvl 60 or your point is invalid. - 2007: Nice arena score, loser - 2009: Nice GS loser - 2011: WTF you have only 1 kid and make 32k a year? Your comment is invalid. |
| 03:35.04 | Seerah | Kraps: "what? you're a girl? your comment is invalid" |
| 03:35.13 | Imk0tter | yeah dude |
| 03:35.16 | Seerah | no need to go further than that :) |
| 03:35.18 | Imk0tter | basically you have a vagina |
| 03:35.30 | Imk0tter | that's like the biggest difference between me and you |
| 03:35.35 | Seerah | where's fisker? |
| 03:35.40 | Imk0tter | "biggest" difference |
| 03:35.41 | Imk0tter | get it |
| 03:35.44 | Imk0tter | as in |
| 03:35.52 | Imk0tter | nvm i have a small dick |
| 03:35.57 | Imk0tter | so i can't even go there |
| 03:36.07 | Kraps | Seerah: what about obviously racial names? |
| 03:36.20 | Kraps | its gonna be crazy |
| 03:36.27 | Seerah | how about hippie names? |
| 03:37.04 | Kraps | i'm not familiar with those |
| 03:37.43 | Dagmar | You've never known a girl with a messed up name like "Rainbow" or "Starshine"? |
| 03:37.50 | Seerah | just a name that their parents came up with when on LSD or something |
| 03:37.56 | Seerah | ^^ |
| 03:38.01 | Kraps | heh |
| 03:38.57 | Imk0tter | i mean honestly if you're a girl |
| 03:39.02 | Imk0tter | let's go off the record for this one |
| 03:39.06 | Imk0tter | you should be like outside |
| 03:39.09 | Imk0tter | making wow players happy |
| 03:39.13 | Imk0tter | rather than inside |
| 03:39.16 | Imk0tter | making them miserable |
| 03:39.24 | Imk0tter | you should totally be sucking dick |
| 03:39.27 | Kraps | ur funny |
| 03:39.30 | Kraps | wait no |
| 03:39.32 | Thunder_Child | so should you |
| 03:39.33 | Imk0tter | dude |
| 03:39.35 | Imk0tter | i don't even play wow |
| 03:39.37 | Imk0tter | i came here because |
| 03:39.39 | Imk0tter | i love wow players |
| 03:39.42 | Imk0tter | dude if i were a chick |
| 03:39.45 | Seerah | I was going to joke back and say something like "you mean like beating them at pvp?" |
| 03:39.46 | Imk0tter | i'd totally be banging wow players |
| 03:39.50 | Imk0tter | instead of actually playing wow |
| 03:39.54 | Seerah | but then you went and said that... |
| 03:39.58 | Kraps | <PROTECTED> |
| 03:40.32 | Seerah | I'll give you one more chance to stick your foot in your mouth. go ahead. |
| 03:41.01 | Imk0tter | Seerah, I know you love me |
| 03:41.08 | Imk0tter | and you don't have the "balls" to kick me after reading this |
| 03:42.05 | Seerah | you're right. I don't have the balls. |
| 03:42.06 | Seerah | /mode #wowuidev +b Imk0tter!LiTHiuM@ool-182cbf8b.dyn.optonline.net |
| 03:42.13 | Seerah | sighs |
| 03:42.17 | Kraps | eep |
| 03:42.20 | *** mode/#wowuidev [+b Imk0tter!LiTHiuM@ool-182cbf8b.dyn.optonline.net] by Seerah |
| 03:42.24 | *** kick/#wowuidev [Imk0tter!~Ryan@c-98-251-190-189.hsd1.tn.comcast.net] by Seerah (Imk0tter) |
| 03:42.38 | Wobin | I'm glad you don't, Seerah |
| 03:42.42 | Wobin | it would be odd if you did |
| 03:42.45 | Seerah | hugs Wobin |
| 03:42.46 | Seerah | hehe |
| 03:42.52 | Kraps | O_o |
| 03:43.01 | ajmitch | that troll wasn't even very entertaining |
| 03:43.43 | Seerah | no. I was in an especially forgiving mood this evening, it seems.... If he had spouted a couple extra swear words in his initial introduction, he would have been banned then, though. |
| 03:43.54 | Seerah | Figured I'd give him a chance to be put in his place. |
| 03:45.32 | *** join/#wowuidev Iriel (~Iriel@adsl-71-158-244-138.dsl.pltn13.sbcglobal.net) |
| 03:45.32 | *** mode/#wowuidev [+o Iriel] by ChanServ |
| 03:45.49 | Kraps | Seerah: stalker or troll of the year? http://i25.tinypic.com/10sdgts.png |
| 03:45.55 | Wobin | I probably would have answered his question about Flash games seriously if he were otherwise =P |
| 03:46.12 | Kraps | Wobin: miniclip? |
| 03:46.22 | Seerah | troll |
| 03:47.10 | Wobin | troll |
| 03:47.25 | Wobin | or rather, using trolling to put a point forward |
| 03:47.30 | Seerah | *nod* |
| 03:58.02 | Kraps | so wobin what about flash games? |
| 03:58.26 | Wobin | oh |
| 03:58.31 | Wobin | I'd have to think about it =P |
| 03:58.44 | Wobin | I don't notice playing them anymore =P |
| 03:59.14 | Kraps | i occasionally pop into miniclip |
| 04:01.00 | Thunder_Child | there are some nice ones |
| 04:03.30 | *** join/#wowuidev kd3 (~kd3@wikia/kaydeethree) |
| 04:03.40 | kd3 | forums fall over or just me? |
| 04:04.00 | Kraps | just you |
| 04:04.03 | Thunder_Child | pushes kd3 over |
| 04:05.28 | *** join/#wowuidev kd3|hate`net (~kd3@wikia/kaydeethree) |
| 04:05.38 | kd3|hate`net | winces |
| 04:10.11 | cogwheel | scrolls up |
| 04:10.13 | cogwheel | O.O |
| 04:11.41 | *** join/#wowuidev olafski (~egrimm@dream.student.utwente.nl) |
| 04:13.09 | Kraps | we need more one time trolls here, its exciting |
| 04:14.39 | Jamash | yeah, well, you're ugly |
| 04:15.36 | Corrodias | we just get the same old same old most of the time. and i'm not even here most of the time! |
| 04:16.36 | Kraps | Jamash: so's your mom |
| 04:16.47 | cogwheel | someone should've said "wb k0tter" when he re-joined... :< |
| 04:18.52 | Cairenn | he's lucky I wasn't here, he would have been banned on his very first line |
| 04:19.06 | cog|sleep | ~hug Cairenn |
| 04:19.07 | purl | ACTION jumps into Cairenn's lap and huggles and *hugs* Cairenn |
| 04:19.11 | Cairenn | hugs cog|sleep |
| 04:19.24 | Kraps | awww Cairenn its fun! |
| 04:19.56 | Cairenn | I don't allow racial slurs in here :p |
| 04:20.18 | Torhal | What about inebriated slurs? |
| 04:20.19 | Torhal | :D |
| 04:20.31 | Cairenn | you're a slur, Torhal :p |
| 04:20.35 | Cairenn | ;) |
| 04:22.53 | Torhal | Foof! |
| 04:23.09 | Kraps | i like turtles |
| 04:24.24 | Cairenn | hugs Torhal, then turns it into a tickle when he's off-guard |
| 04:25.20 | Torhal | eeps! |
| 04:25.24 | Jerub | Cairenn: second line. |
| 04:25.36 | Cairenn | Jerub: ? |
| 04:25.50 | Jerub | the first line was "so yeha" |
| 04:25.57 | Cairenn | ah, you're correct |
| 04:25.59 | Cairenn | second line |
| 04:28.31 | *** join/#wowuidev Wobin (~quassel@124-169-10-190.dyn.iinet.net.au) |
| 04:29.16 | Kraps | wonders why the FBI and FTC are fearmongering http://www.ftc.gov/bcp/edu/pubs/consumer/tech/tec14.shtm http://www.fbi.gov/kids/k5th/safety2.htm |
| 04:30.10 | Jerub | Cairenn: i'm glad you have a low tolerance too, i can't stand that kind of thing. |
| 04:30.55 | Cairenn | I'm just presuming the others hadn't seen it |
| 04:52.33 | Thunder_Child | i did |
| 04:58.43 | DWSR | Remember that people online may not be who they say they are. Someone who says that "she" is a "12-year-old girl" could really be an older man. |
| 04:58.44 | DWSR | win |
| 04:58.46 | DWSR | So hard. |
| 04:58.56 | *** join/#wowuidev airtonix (~airtonix@ppp203-122-193-45.static.internode.on.net) |
| 04:59.00 | *** join/#wowuidev airtonix (~airtonix@unaffiliated/airtonix) |
| 04:59.57 | Thunder_Child | what do you mean 'could' |
| 05:00.14 | DWSR | http://www.fbi.gov/kids/k5th/safety2.htm |
| 05:00.18 | DWSR | Thunder_Child: xD |
| 05:01.14 | DWSR | anyway, night all. |
| 05:01.40 | Thunder_Child | "Never write to someone who has made you feel uncomfortable or scared." if that were the case no one would ever write their familys |
| 05:01.45 | *** join/#wowuidev bluspacecow (~bluspacec@60-234-165-167.bitstream.orcon.net.nz) |
| 05:02.31 | Thunder_Child | "Do not meet someone or have them visit you without the permission of your parents." and that just makes 'strage' uncomfortable |
| 05:03.23 | Thunder_Child | "Tell your parents right away if you read anything on the Internet that makes you feel uncomfortable." yes, it's called 'the internet' |
| 05:06.33 | Nechckn | Anyone know if steam will find a local host on a local network and use it or is it all direct d/l of somesort? |
| 05:07.06 | Kraps | snowfox is trollin http://forums.worldofwarcraft.com/thread.html?topicId=25968746907&sid=1 |
| 05:08.51 | Seerah | http://www.comedycentral.com/videos/index.jhtml?videoId=11912&title=if-the-internet-was-a-real-place |
| 05:08.57 | Seerah | nsfw |
| 05:10.48 | Seerah | I think this is the short version |
| 05:13.47 | *** part/#wowuidev Seerah (~Ryan@c-98-251-190-189.hsd1.tn.comcast.net) |
| 05:26.22 | Dagmar | Nechckn: Far as I know there no 'lowly mortal' cache it really cares about |
| 05:26.59 | Dagmar | Things can at least be sped up for reinstalls, since you have the ability to tell Steam to backup a game as a self-installable archive of epic size |
| 05:27.21 | Dagmar | Cocmast and some other large ISPs have CDN nodes for it tho |
| 05:27.40 | Dagmar | Steam's the only thing that'll pull 2Mb/s here without a fight |
| 05:28.11 | Jamash | It's actually vastly more efficient to backup your steam directory whole than to use the internal backup system |
| 05:29.23 | Jamash | I rsync steam to my raid array occasionally |
| 05:29.23 | Dagmar | The internal backup system makes neat 4.7Gb/650Mb/700Mb images |
| 05:29.33 | Dagmar | Mind you, i'm just dumping those images across the network here, but a few things are burned |
| 05:34.36 | Mirrormn | so I've got a bit of quandry |
| 05:35.06 | Mirrormn | I'm trying to make it so a frame automatically shows or hides at the same time as the default chat frame editbox |
| 05:35.26 | Mirrormn | but the default chat frame editbox doesn't actually show or hide anymore, it just changes its alpha |
| 05:35.44 | Mirrormn | so I can't hook into the OnShow and OnHide handlers |
| 05:36.09 | Kraps | Twilight for Guys VNSFW http://www.ebaumsworld.com/video/watch/81031649/ |
| 05:36.43 | ZorbaTHut | nech, you can manually just copy entire games in, as long as they've been downloaded via steam once, and steam will recognize them |
| 05:41.53 | Nechckn | Oh?? Awesome - and thanks to all for the other infos!! |
| 05:44.01 | *** join/#wowuidev airtonix (~airtonix@ppp203-122-193-45.static.internode.on.net) |
| 05:44.07 | *** join/#wowuidev airtonix (~airtonix@unaffiliated/airtonix) |
| 05:47.27 | ZorbaTHut | yeah, close steam first, but then it Just Does The Right Thing in all cases I've seen |
| 05:47.36 | ZorbaTHut | occasionally a small extra download to synch things up, but the bulk is done |
| 05:56.05 | Dagmar | Kraps: WIN! |
| 05:56.37 | Dagmar | I likes the backup images because they do a data integrity check |
| 05:57.20 | Dagmar | is generally distrustful of overworked MS-designed filesystems |
| 05:58.50 | Dagmar | Hate my guild leader |
| 05:59.01 | Dagmar | He pulled out his wife's spriest to heal so he could top BOTH meters. |
| 05:59.07 | Dagmar | The bastard |
| 05:59.47 | Wobin | o.O |
| 06:00.04 | Wobin | Boo? |
| 06:00.07 | Wobin | Yay? |
| 06:00.14 | Wobin | does it -really- matter? =P |
| 06:00.21 | Dagmar | I'm just crossing the 3k line for GS on that 'lock |
| 06:00.36 | Dagmar | S'not fair. *pout* |
| 06:00.47 | Dagmar | I wouldda had top DPS there for sure without the pesky healer. hehe |
| 06:00.57 | Wobin | hehe |
| 06:00.57 | Mirrormn | wha? |
| 06:01.03 | Wobin | yeah I do that at times, heal in shadowform |
| 06:01.18 | Dagmar | We had some crazed DK the other night doing almost 6k dps while tanking |
| 06:01.21 | Wobin | It makes the run a bit more interesting |
| 06:01.28 | Dagmar | I hadda ask him to slow down so I could get some damn spells off |
| 06:01.35 | *** join/#wowuidev vangual (d5ada582@pdpc/supporter/active/vangual) |
| 06:01.37 | Wobin | especially HVH, when you hardly have to heal anything |
| 06:01.39 | Dagmar | "Crist man leave some mobs for the rest of us" |
| 06:03.16 | ZorbaTHut | I would've just told you to keep up ;) |
| 06:03.51 | Jerub | Wobin: i was told i was mad for that |
| 06:04.23 | Dagmar | ZorbaTHut: Seriously the first boss we hit, I got off three curses, one shadowbolt, and it was dead. |
| 06:04.25 | Jerub | my warrior chainpulled DTK |
| 06:04.31 | Jerub | that the first chainpulling i've done |
| 06:04.37 | Wobin | DTK is fun to chainpull |
| 06:04.39 | Dagmar | I LIKE high DPS but damn |
| 06:04.46 | Jerub | then i did gundrak and up |
| 06:04.48 | Jerub | it was fun |
| 06:04.56 | Jerub | warrior survival cooldowns are awesome |
| 06:04.57 | ZorbaTHut | dagmar, keke l2curse nub |
| 06:05.07 | Wobin | I wouldn't do it with mobs that knockdown |
| 06:05.13 | Wobin | but most of the time, it's pretty good |
| 06:05.36 | ZorbaTHut | wobin, I had a fun HVH run on my druid where I tossed a few hots on the tank at the beginning of the pull, dropped out of tree form, and hurricaned |
| 06:05.53 | Jerub | ZorbaTHut: why case from tree form? |
| 06:05.56 | ZorbaTHut | he never ended up below 50% on any pull |
| 06:05.58 | Jerub | it's only a 5% drop in SP |
| 06:06.07 | ZorbaTHut | jerub, after the first pull or two, I stopped bothering with it :P |
| 06:06.10 | Wobin | can't cast hurricane in tree, can you? |
| 06:06.15 | Jerub | ZorbaTHut: on my bear i asked the healer to jump into dps spec. |
| 06:06.19 | ZorbaTHut | although it's more than that, as I remember |
| 06:06.21 | Jerub | it was on the 11th pull i asked him to perhaps heal a little. |
| 06:06.35 | ZorbaTHut | I probably would've done that but I didn't have healing binds on my dps bars |
| 06:06.37 | Jerub | he'd not healed between the first and 11th pull. at all. |
| 06:06.51 | Wobin | actually for the healer, there's a good technique for Ahune, I found |
| 06:07.03 | Wobin | stay near the left ledge |
| 06:07.07 | Wobin | and wait for a icespike |
| 06:07.27 | Wobin | and aim yourself to land on -top- of the ledge there |
| 06:07.46 | Wobin | you'll get pulled down occasionally, but for the most of it, you won't have to worry about adds |
| 06:08.00 | Dagmar | That's sneaky. I like it |
| 06:08.22 | Mirrormn | that is sneaky, but it seems wildly unnecessary |
| 06:08.25 | Mirrormn | also, ahune is gone :( |
| 06:08.41 | Jerub | yaygone |
| 06:08.42 | Wobin | oh sure, but I had to do-something- in ahune aside from tossing bubbles hither and yon =\ |
| 06:09.05 | Dagmar | That's true. |
| 06:09.21 | Dagmar | melee DPS has to run around like mad while everyone else stands there grinning |
| 06:09.26 | Mirrormn | also, wow seems to freeze on load when I tell it to layout 240 buttons in a frame |
| 06:09.39 | Dagmar | hahahah |
| 06:11.04 | Wobin | I spend most of the Anub fight in AN hoping someone gets hit by the ground spikes |
| 06:11.08 | Wobin | so I can levitate them |
| 06:11.31 | Mirrormn | I spend most of the anub fight trying to convince people to give me enough buffs that I can skip the third phase |
| 06:13.30 | Mirrormn | it'll do 40 buttons each in 6 different frames |
| 06:13.36 | Mirrormn | but god forbid I try 240 buttons in 1 frame |
| 06:15.13 | *** join/#wowuidev Calahil (~calahil@76.14.13.114) |
| 06:15.33 | Calahil | hello everyone |
| 06:15.43 | Mirrormn | hallo |
| 06:16.06 | Calahil | could anyone help with a problem i am having... |
| 06:16.31 | Wobin | Go buy some cream from your nearest pharmacy? |
| 06:16.45 | Calahil | lol |
| 06:16.54 | *** join/#wowuidev Dagmar (1000@c-98-193-180-167.hsd1.tn.comcast.net) |
| 06:16.57 | *** join/#wowuidev Dagmar (1000@unaffiliated/dagmar) |
| 06:17.10 | Dagmar | Interesting. |
| 06:17.24 | *** join/#wowuidev cbreak_work (~cbreak@drz-wizzer.drz.ethz.ch) |
| 06:17.57 | Calahil | i have been trying to make a function to parse the guild chat to find text inside " " i thought i knew how to do it but maybe i am wrong |
| 06:18.24 | Mirrormn | inside what? quotes? |
| 06:18.48 | Calahil | yeah |
| 06:18.56 | Calahil | i am using the match function |
| 06:18.59 | Calahil | strmatch(msg, "'.*'", 1) |
| 06:19.09 | Calahil | is that wrong? |
| 06:19.24 | tlund | trying to use regexps in lua? :) |
| 06:19.55 | Calahil | how would it been done then? |
| 06:20.08 | Mirrormn | well |
| 06:21.30 | Mirrormn | there's a subtle different between telling it to match a repetion of any character, and telling it to match a repetition of any character except for a quote character, for one |
| 06:22.08 | Mirrormn | the former would get you the largest string starting and ending with a quote, whereas the latter would not allow quote characters inside your quote |
| 06:23.36 | *** join/#wowuidev tekkub (~tekkub@WoWUIDev/WoWI/Featured/Dongle/GitHub/Tekkub) |
| 06:23.37 | *** mode/#wowuidev [+v tekkub] by ChanServ |
| 06:23.38 | Calahil | am i doing the latter with that bit of code |
| 06:23.41 | Calahil | ? |
| 06:23.48 | Mirrormn | no |
| 06:23.53 | Mirrormn | the former is .* |
| 06:24.04 | Mirrormn | the latter is [^"]* |
| 06:24.17 | Mirrormn | I'm not exactly sure how lua does string interpretation, though |
| 06:24.39 | Mirrormn | you're trying to match double quote characters for the start and finish, not single quotes, right? |
| 06:24.44 | Wobin | use the boundary argument |
| 06:24.49 | Calahil | yeah it confusing and lacking any kind of builtin debugging is frustrating me |
| 06:24.54 | Wobin | %b"" |
| 06:25.18 | Mirrormn | ah yes |
| 06:25.22 | Mirrormn | that sounds way simpler |
| 06:25.31 | Calahil | i want whats inside the quote so "sweet" i would like it to return: sweet |
| 06:25.40 | Wobin | er frontier |
| 06:25.49 | Wobin | http://lua-users.org/wiki/FrontierPattern |
| 06:27.04 | *** join/#wowuidev Elkano (~elkano@pool013.vpn.uni-saarland.de) |
| 06:27.04 | *** join/#wowuidev Elkano (~elkano@WoWUIDev/WoWAce/Elkano) |
| 06:27.53 | Calahil | ah that does seem to be what i am looking for |
| 06:34.49 | Mirrormn | it seems like %b"" would be easier |
| 06:36.42 | Wobin | I had that wrong |
| 06:36.45 | Wobin | I think |
| 06:36.52 | Wobin | it should be %f |
| 06:37.17 | Mirrormn | huh? |
| 06:37.25 | Mirrormn | %b and %f are different things |
| 06:37.50 | Mirrormn | %bxy -- matches a substring starting with x and ending with y. The substring must also have the same number of x and y |
| 06:38.24 | Mirrormn | %f was not one I was familiar with but it looks like it basically detects a character or set without actually matching it |
| 06:38.30 | Wobin | no you're right |
| 06:38.42 | Wobin | and yeah %b"" is easier for your situation |
| 06:38.49 | Mirrormn | so, in the example on that page |
| 06:38.55 | Wobin | I just got confused =) |
| 06:39.03 | Mirrormn | it reads until it detects any letter |
| 06:39.15 | Mirrormn | but then it doesn't match the letter unless it's upper case also |
| 06:40.15 | Mirrormn | and that allows it to exclude punctuation and lower case letters at the beginning of the words its matching |
| 06:40.59 | *** join/#wowuidev brykrys (~chatzilla@WoWUIDev/Norganna/Dev/Brykrys) |
| 06:41.52 | Mirrormn | what I'm not quite sure about is how to properly insert the double quote character into the match string |
| 06:42.16 | Wobin | \"\" |
| 06:42.34 | Mirrormn | you can just do regular backlash escaping in lua? |
| 06:42.51 | Wobin | oh god, it's been so long =( |
| 06:42.54 | Wobin | yes I think so |
| 06:44.22 | Mirrormn | you could also probably use the double bracket notation |
| 06:44.41 | Mirrormn | match(msg, [[%b""]]) |
| 06:45.52 | Mirrormn | although WoW UI Designers spits errors at me when I use double bracket strings =/ |
| 06:46.36 | Calahil | for what i understand yes...cant you also use ' inside the " in code to mean " |
| 06:46.55 | Mirrormn | I dunno |
| 06:49.28 | Calahil | the %b\"\" worked like a charm =) |
| 06:49.45 | Calahil | thank you guys i have been banging my head on that for a day now |
| 06:50.11 | Mirrormn | lua> print("%b''") |
| 06:50.12 | lua_bot | Mirrormn: %b'' |
| 06:50.32 | Mirrormn | lua> print([[%b""]]) |
| 06:50.33 | lua_bot | Mirrormn: %b"" |
| 06:50.54 | Mirrormn | lua> print('%b""') |
| 06:50.54 | lua_bot | Mirrormn: %b"" |
| 06:51.00 | Mirrormn | well there ya go |
| 06:51.52 | Calahil | so in order to get the double " u need to use single ' for the string container |
| 06:52.58 | Mirrormn | lua> print(string.match('I called it "sweet" but I really meant it "sucked"', '%b""')) |
| 06:52.58 | lua_bot | Mirrormn: "sweet" |
| 06:53.45 | Mirrormn | lua> print(string.match('I called it "sweet" but I really meant it "sucked"', '%f["].*%f["]')) |
| 06:53.45 | lua_bot | Mirrormn: "sweet" but I really meant it "sucked |
| 06:53.55 | Mirrormn | well that doesn't work so well |
| 06:54.20 | Mirrormn | lua> print(string.match('I called it "sweet" but I really meant it "sucked"', '%f["][^"]*%f["]')) |
| 06:54.20 | lua_bot | Mirrormn: No output |
| 06:54.22 | Arrowmaster | you arent using %f properly |
| 06:54.30 | Mirrormn | yeah I bet I'm not |
| 06:55.51 | Mirrormn | I'm not sure the %b is the right matching pattern, though |
| 06:56.35 | Calahil | how do you use the lua bot? |
| 06:56.43 | Mirrormn | you just type lua> |
| 06:56.54 | Arrowmaster | lua> print(string.match('I called it "sweet" but I really meant it "sucked"', [[".-"]]) |
| 06:56.54 | lua_bot | Arrowmaster: luabot:1: ')' expected near '<eof>' |
| 06:56.55 | Calahil | do you just type lua> and then your code |
| 06:57.07 | Arrowmaster | lua> print(string.match('I called it "sweet" but I really meant it "sucked"', [[".-"]])) |
| 06:57.07 | lua_bot | Arrowmaster: "sweet" |
| 06:57.55 | Calahil | lua> print(string.match('I called it "sweet" but I really meant it "sucked"', [%f\"\"][%f\"\"]) |
| 06:57.56 | lua_bot | Calahil: luabot:1: unexpected symbol near '[' |
| 06:57.57 | Arrowmaster | lua> for _,v in string.gmatch('I called it "sweet" but I really meant it "sucked"', [[".-"]]) do return k end |
| 06:57.58 | lua_bot | Arrowmaster: nil |
| 06:58.16 | Mirrormn | it's a list, not a table, I think |
| 06:58.20 | Arrowmaster | you shouldnt be using frontier pattern |
| 06:58.35 | Calahil | lua> print(string.match('I called it "sweet" but I really meant it "sucked"', %f\"\"%f\"\") |
| 06:58.36 | lua_bot | Calahil: luabot:1: unexpected symbol near '%' |
| 06:58.44 | Calahil | ah |
| 06:58.45 | Mirrormn | lua> print(string.gmatch('I called it "sweet" but I really meant it "sucked"', [[".-"]])) |
| 06:58.45 | lua_bot | Mirrormn: function: 0x81cfc18 |
| 06:58.52 | Mirrormn | hrm |
| 06:58.55 | Mirrormn | guess not ^_^ |
| 06:59.01 | *** join/#wowuidev airtonix (~airtonix@unaffiliated/airtonix) |
| 06:59.10 | Arrowmaster | lua> for _,v in string.gmatch('I called it "sweet" but I really meant it "sucked"', [[".-"]]) do return v end |
| 06:59.10 | lua_bot | Arrowmaster: nil |
| 06:59.18 | Arrowmaster | lua> for k in string.gmatch('I called it "sweet" but I really meant it "sucked"', [[".-"]]) do return k end |
| 06:59.18 | lua_bot | Arrowmaster: "sweet" |
| 06:59.58 | Calahil | lua> print(string.match('I called it "sweet" but I really meant it "sucked"', %f[\"\"]%f[\"\"]) |
| 06:59.58 | lua_bot | Calahil: luabot:1: unexpected symbol near '%' |
| 07:00.09 | Calahil | oh well |
| 07:00.09 | Arrowmaster | Calahil: STOP TRYING TO USE FRONTIER PATTERN |
| 07:00.12 | Mirrormn | you need a second ) |
| 07:00.22 | Calahil | doh |
| 07:00.34 | Mirrormn | I think we're both a little curious has to how it actually works |
| 07:00.44 | *** join/#wowuidev akhe (~akhe@0x573bb4a2.ronqu1.dynamic.dsl.tele.dk) |
| 07:00.58 | Arrowmaster | look at UrlCopy.lua in Prat or Chatter or any of the other chat mods |
| 07:01.07 | Arrowmaster | they all practically use my code |
| 07:01.09 | Calahil | shouldnt it be able to find both those with what i have with the extra ) at the end >< |
| 07:01.19 | Arrowmaster | Calahil: no |
| 07:01.26 | Calahil | kk |
| 07:06.17 | Mirrormn | mm, now that I have looked at the line of code pattern = "%f[%S]([%w_.-%%]+[%w_-%%]%.(%a%a+):[0-6]?%d?%d?%d?%d)%f[%D]", my understanding of the frontier pattern has instantly gone from rudimentary to perfect |
| 07:09.37 | *** join/#wowuidev Vilkku (~Vilkku@86-60-145-155-dyn-dsl.ssp.fi) |
| 07:12.30 | *** join/#wowuidev stolenlegacy (~stolenleg@d86-33-7-18.cust.tele2.at) |
| 07:17.13 | Jamash | easy pattern matching with lua: don't use lua |
| 07:22.27 | Arrowmaster | i actually perfected most of those patterns even more but never updated the addons |
| 07:24.06 | Mirrormn | it seems like adding a button to a frame is O(x^2) with regards to how many buttons are already in the frame |
| 07:24.19 | mrpoundsign | is there a good existing library for scanning and filtering chat channels? |
| 07:27.44 | cbreak_work | that sounds terrible |
| 07:27.56 | Mirrormn | what does? |
| 07:28.41 | cbreak_work | quadratic complexity for adding buttons |
| 07:28.47 | Mirrormn | ah yeah |
| 07:28.57 | Jamash | What do you mean "adding a button to a frame"? |
| 07:29.05 | Mirrormn | well |
| 07:29.17 | Mirrormn | creating a button with the frame as its parent |
| 07:29.21 | Jamash | ok |
| 07:29.42 | Mirrormn | I'm writing a character map addon |
| 07:29.57 | cbreak_work | you can make a frame that handles click events |
| 07:30.10 | cbreak_work | I do that in some of my addons, it works ok |
| 07:30.12 | Mirrormn | yeah I might have to |
| 07:30.15 | *** join/#wowuidev Kalroth (~kalroth@mail1.retailplanit.com) |
| 07:30.26 | Jamash | does this actually cause noticeable lag? |
| 07:30.28 | cbreak_work | but that's because I need the exact click pos |
| 07:30.31 | Dagmar | Mirrormn: Generally I *think* the way around that is to use fixed sizes for everything |
| 07:30.35 | Mirrormn | but that would be a ton of extra work |
| 07:30.47 | Mirrormn | mmm yes |
| 07:31.07 | *** join/#wowuidev haste (haste@hirano.ixo.no) |
| 07:31.13 | Mirrormn | maybe the problem is that since each element is anchored to the previous element, it has to traverse a big tree of anchors to find the absolute position |
| 07:31.27 | Jamash | lawl |
| 07:31.32 | Jamash | probably, yes |
| 07:32.05 | cbreak_work | now that's terrible design |
| 07:32.14 | Dagmar | Yesa |
| 07:32.38 | Mirrormn | all designs have their pluses and minuses |
| 07:32.59 | cbreak_work | making a frame stack as high as the tower of bable has no pluses |
| 07:33.05 | cbreak_work | unless you like to play jenga |
| 07:33.20 | Mirrormn | lol |
| 07:33.41 | mrpoundsign | I love jenga. |
| 07:33.48 | *** join/#wowuidev Kalroth (~kalroth@mail1.retailplanit.com) |
| 07:34.40 | Mirrormn | I thought you meant the anchoring system itself was bad design |
| 07:35.01 | cbreak_work | no, being able to relatively position is rather common |
| 07:35.16 | cbreak_work | Apple's CoreAnimation does it, Qt's QGraphicsScene as well |
| 07:35.30 | cbreak_work | HTML's object model does it |
| 07:35.35 | cbreak_work | I think everyone does |
| 07:36.07 | Mirrormn | there's no reason why my buttons can't be absolutely positioned within the frame other than that would make me have to calculate their positions |
| 07:36.24 | Dagmar | No reason except massive CPU time |
| 07:36.37 | Jamash | massive? |
| 07:36.57 | Mirrormn | I'm trying to *avoid* massive cpu time |
| 07:37.02 | Dagmar | Oh wait no got it backwards yeah |
| 07:37.05 | Jamash | that's, like, two multiply operations per button |
| 07:37.10 | Jamash | I don't call that massive |
| 07:37.16 | Mirrormn | well there are 240 buttons |
| 07:37.32 | Dagmar | Earlier it was mentioned the method used was hanging up the client |
| 07:37.36 | cbreak_work | positioning is relative to parent |
| 07:37.44 | cbreak_work | or anchor |
| 07:37.46 | Jamash | Dagmar: That was positioning each button relative to the one before |
| 07:37.53 | Jamash | in a giant linked list |
| 07:37.55 | Dagmar | Yeah. I'm tired |
| 07:37.56 | Jamash | 240 buttons long |
| 07:38.02 | Jamash | k |
| 07:38.04 | Mirrormn | haha |
| 07:38.15 | Jamash | So what I do is anchor the left column in a linked list like you do |
| 07:38.25 | Mirrormn | to be fair, their only linked lists in a row |
| 07:38.30 | Mirrormn | *they're |
| 07:38.34 | Jamash | but then anchor each row in a separate linked list to the leftmost item in the row |
| 07:38.41 | Jamash | ah, so basically the same thing |
| 07:38.47 | Mirrormn | yeah, that's what I did |
| 07:38.51 | Mirrormn | it doesn't work so well |
| 07:39.00 | Jamash | odd |
| 07:39.16 | *** join/#wowuidev sioraiocht (~tomh@unaffiliated/sioraiocht) |
| 07:39.16 | Mirrormn | I made a little function that would load the buttons 1 row at a time when I called it from command line |
| 07:39.24 | Mirrormn | the first 3 rows loaded instantly |
| 07:39.31 | Mirrormn | the fourth had like a 2 second freeze |
| 07:39.38 | Mirrormn | the fifth completely hanged |
| 07:39.38 | Dagmar | OKay, that's just weird |
| 07:40.00 | Jamash | you've clearly hit some sort of pathological behavior |
| 07:40.09 | Dagmar | I figured it was spending a lot of time trying to figure out how to arrange them neatly |
| 07:40.13 | Jamash | I don't get any problem like that when creating ~100 buttons |
| 07:40.28 | Mirrormn | =/ |
| 07:40.59 | Mirrormn | I also have the same 240 buttons, essentially, already loaded into 6 different frames |
| 07:41.09 | Mirrormn | and that works no problem |
| 07:41.24 | Jamash | huh? |
| 07:41.24 | Mirrormn | I mean they're different buttons, but they are created the same way |
| 07:41.34 | Jamash | why 6 copies? |
| 07:41.40 | Mirrormn | they're not copies |
| 07:41.47 | Mirrormn | it's 6 different sets of symbols |
| 07:41.52 | Jamash | ah |
| 07:42.20 | Mirrormn | I was trying to put them all on a single keyboard in case anyone happened to want to look at them all at once |
| 07:42.30 | Jamash | I would probably use the same buttons but remap the symbols |
| 07:42.35 | Dagmar | Is this some CJK language? |
| 07:42.43 | Mirrormn | huh? |
| 07:42.58 | Dagmar | What language has 240+ characters? |
| 07:42.59 | Jamash | can you fit 1680 buttons on screen at once? |
| 07:43.25 | Mirrormn | the default wow font has about 240 extra symbols |
| 07:43.30 | *** join/#wowuidev pompy (~Mike@c-68-32-133-69.hsd1.nj.comcast.net) |
| 07:43.35 | Mirrormn | that I am trying to provide easy access to |
| 07:43.39 | Jamash | have you ever used a onscreen keyboard? |
| 07:43.39 | Dagmar | Yes, that's fairly normal |
| 07:43.51 | Jamash | they generally have extra shift keys for symbols |
| 07:43.57 | Dagmar | However, one language typically doesn't have that many unless it's chicken-scratch |
| 07:44.04 | Jamash | they don't display 1680 keys at once |
| 07:44.06 | Mirrormn | well that's basically exactly what it is, jamash |
| 07:44.22 | Jamash | Yes, I mean have you ever used a typical onscreen keyboard in any operating system |
| 07:44.29 | Mirrormn | yeah |
| 07:44.36 | Mirrormn | I already made it like that to begin with |
| 07:44.51 | Mirrormn | 6 different keyboards that you access through modifier keys |
| 07:45.03 | Mirrormn | each with about 40 keys |
| 07:45.47 | mikma | http://www.cad-comic.com/comics/c0a129271278475206.jpg |
| 07:46.01 | Mirrormn | but then my brother was giving me grief about how he didn't want to have to remember all these modifier combinations so I was trying to provide options for viewing the keyboard in other ways, in case anyone wanted to |
| 07:46.06 | Dagmar | I'm thinking we should have started killing people when the kiddies first started sticking gratuitous euro charset variants in their names |
| 07:46.14 | Jamash | tabs |
| 07:46.18 | Jamash | clickable tabs |
| 07:46.22 | Mirrormn | yeah |
| 07:46.33 | Mirrormn | I was gonna get to that next |
| 07:46.39 | Dagmar | mikma: The worst part is it's pretty much right |
| 07:46.54 | Dagmar | mikma: Except the troll's name will be "Harry Ballsac" |
| 07:46.57 | Jamash | but you don't actually need 6 sets of buttons, just 6 sets of key labels that you swap onto the buttons |
| 07:47.39 | Mirrormn | mmm, I could probably do that |
| 07:48.01 | *** join/#wowuidev Caleb| (~caleb@dsl4E5C027F.pool.t-online.hu) |
| 07:48.26 | Mirrormn | having all the buttons loaded and hidden on separate frames might be a little gratuitous with memory usage |
| 07:49.17 | Dagmar | You could always do like a lot of input method widgets and start witha list of unadorned base characters that bring up a list of them with various forms of font lice around |
| 07:49.28 | Jamash | I like "font lice" |
| 07:49.31 | Jamash | that's good |
| 07:49.32 | Mirrormn | hehe |
| 07:49.34 | Mirrormn | me too |
| 07:49.44 | *** join/#wowuidev Eluna (~Eluna@161-81-8.connect.netcom.no) |
| 07:49.54 | Mirrormn | but that would only really work for the alphabet-analogous characters |
| 07:50.04 | Mirrormn | and that's only the first 2 sets of 6 |
| 07:51.10 | Mirrormn | anyway, the other problem I'm having with this |
| 07:51.12 | *** join/#wowuidev digmouse (~chatzilla@111.193.193.184) |
| 07:51.18 | Mirrormn | which no one seemed to have any input on earlier |
| 07:51.47 | Mirrormn | is I was trying to figure out a way to make it auto-show and hide along with the default chat frame edit box |
| 07:52.04 | Mirrormn | but the default chat frame edit box doesn't actually show or hide anymore, it just changes its alpha setting |
| 07:52.17 | mrpoundsign | or start with the lice (like ´, ¨, ˆ, etc) in a list, then a frame they type the char to add it to. e.g. they select ¨ then the letter u they get ü |
| 07:52.55 | Mirrormn | I tried hooking into OnFocusGained and OnFocusLost but that doesn't produce the exact result I want either |
| 07:53.00 | mrpoundsign | the way the mac does it, which I really like... is it's alt-i gives you ˆ and then you type a character to put the accent on. |
| 07:53.27 | *** join/#wowuidev tekkub (~tekkub@WoWUIDev/WoWI/Featured/Dongle/GitHub/Tekkub) |
| 07:53.27 | *** mode/#wowuidev [+v tekkub] by ChanServ |
| 07:53.36 | mrpoundsign | but that doesn't cover things like ø, ƒ, etc |
| 07:53.58 | Mirrormn | wouldn't ø go under o? |
| 07:54.05 | mrpoundsign | (those are alt-o and alt-f respectivly) |
| 07:54.22 | mrpoundsign | depends. |
| 07:54.29 | mrpoundsign | do you want to group by accent or letter? :) |
| 07:54.39 | Mirrormn | I don't really want to do either |
| 07:54.47 | Mirrormn | to be honest |
| 07:56.03 | Mirrormn | I was gonna type some of the characters I was more concerned with but this online IRC client won't even support them lol |
| 07:56.26 | mrpoundsign | what is this for? |
| 07:56.27 | cbreak_work | is there any other kind of IRC client? |
| 07:56.34 | cbreak_work | offline IRC clients seem pointless |
| 07:56.39 | Mirrormn | er |
| 07:56.44 | Mirrormn | I meant brower-based |
| 07:56.54 | Mirrormn | *browser |
| 07:57.14 | Mirrormn | this is a character map of every character that the wow font supports |
| 07:57.20 | Mirrormn | or as many as I could find, anyway |
| 07:57.40 | mrpoundsign | so it's not for inviting people with å∑é∫øm£ names? |
| 07:57.45 | Mirrormn | well |
| 07:57.58 | Mirrormn | it's for that, too |
| 07:58.03 | Mirrormn | but I wanted it to be more complete |
| 07:58.08 | Arrowmaster | the ariel narrow font? |
| 07:58.22 | Mirrormn | sure |
| 07:58.45 | Arrowmaster | well there are 4 fonts used in wow |
| 07:59.17 | Mirrormn | well, I mean, yes, the font is Ariel Narrow |
| 08:00.35 | Mirrormn | but I'm not entirely sure that "Ariel Narrow" is the correct way to refer to all of the characters that you can actually view correctly in the english client |
| 08:00.54 | Arrowmaster | well thats the name of one of the fonts |
| 08:01.22 | Mirrormn | there are probably definitions for Ariel Narrow for every character in unicode, but WoW certainly doesn't support them all |
| 08:01.47 | Arrowmaster | wow has an arieln.ttf font file it uses |
| 08:02.00 | mrpoundsign | ... |
| 08:02.05 | *** join/#wowuidev Repo (~supybot@repos.curseforge.net) |
| 08:02.15 | Mirrormn | fair enough |
| 08:02.15 | mrpoundsign | it's nto the font, but the latin1 character map. |
| 08:02.16 | Arrowmaster | wow is not limiting the characters, the limit is from the font file |
| 08:02.23 | Arrowmaster | mrpoundsign: no |
| 08:02.34 | Dagmar | You've no idea how deep that rabbit hole goes |
| 08:03.02 | Mirrormn | mm, no, there's definitely more characters than in latin1 |
| 08:03.47 | Arrowmaster | you can take a copy of 'ariel unicode ms' rename it arieln.ttf and drop it in a Fonts folder in your wow dir and be able to display over 60000 characters |
| 08:04.15 | mikma | http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Lpron8ptpm8 rap song gone metal :D |
| 08:04.15 | Mirrormn | well yes |
| 08:04.36 | Mirrormn | but when you transmitted them, other less font-happy people would not be able to see them |
| 08:04.47 | Arrowmaster | right |
| 08:05.20 | Arrowmaster | but also people using an alternate font might not be able to see everything the default font has |
| 08:05.45 | Mirrormn | well, that sounds like a personal problem to me -.- |
| 08:06.08 | cbreak_work | if people chose to not see certain characters, that's a choice we have to respect |
| 08:06.08 | mrpoundsign | I think character names do hame some sort of limitation, however, beyond the font. |
| 08:06.23 | Mirrormn | I actually stopped using a custom font a long time ago due to similar reasons |
| 08:06.27 | cbreak_work | yes, you can only pick your real name. |
| 08:06.47 | mrpoundsign | ? |
| 08:07.10 | Mirrormn | oh, actual character names |
| 08:07.14 | Arrowmaster | i know wows arieln.ttf has cyrillic characters but not all the fonts i see being used as replacements have them |
| 08:07.27 | Mirrormn | can only be alphabet-analagous characters |
| 08:07.41 | mrpoundsign | I mean like Sîlentkîllér (which I think is the most common name wow, with every permutation, and is only used by rogues) |
| 08:07.45 | Eluna | Since this channel is actually active. I've now gotten on "top" of the whole RealID thing, and I don't see the big problem. |
| 08:08.08 | Mirrormn | basically the ones with "font lice" and then ß and þ |
| 08:08.18 | Mirrormn | and actually I'm not sure about þ |
| 08:08.35 | Arrowmaster | i dont think you can use either of those in character names on the US realms |
| 08:08.42 | mrpoundsign | <PROTECTED> |
| 08:08.51 | Mirrormn | you can definitely use ß in names |
| 08:08.55 | Mirrormn | I've seen some people around |
| 08:09.07 | mrpoundsign | yes, they are all oevr US realms. |
| 08:09.25 | mrpoundsign | I am on Maelstrom (us) and Porsché is in my guild :) |
| 08:09.31 | Mirrormn | it's kind of weird, too, cause it doesn't have a proper macroscule, so it is the same character when used at the beginning of the name or not |
| 08:09.40 | *** join/#wowuidev sylvanaar_atwork (~sylvanaar@unaffiliated/sylvanaar) |
| 08:09.42 | Arrowmaster | Eluna: you dont see a problem with forum posts using peoples first and last names? |
| 08:09.51 | Eluna | Arrowmaster: Actually no. |
| 08:09.58 | mrpoundsign | nor do I |
| 08:09.59 | Eluna | You don't have to post if you don't like it. |
| 08:10.03 | Eluna | I don't care if someone sees my name |
| 08:10.06 | Eluna | I'm Kim Visnes |
| 08:10.06 | Arrowmaster | then you havent looked hard enough |
| 08:10.08 | Eluna | Search it up. |
| 08:10.10 | Eluna | It's cool. :p |
| 08:10.15 | Mirrormn | well, on the one hand, it doesn't seem like nearly as big of a deal as people think it is |
| 08:10.18 | mrpoundsign | I think having classic style forums should be added. but it's not like you every have to post to the forums. |
| 08:10.20 | Dagmar | Eluna: wait until you have an argument with someone who isn't all that stable |
| 08:10.23 | Eluna | Arrowmaster: Or maybe I don't care because it's my name, and it's who I am. |
| 08:10.24 | Dagmar | Its a bad idea. |
| 08:10.33 | Dagmar | *Someone* will take their argument offline. |
| 08:10.33 | *** join/#wowuidev Repo (~supybot@repos.curseforge.net) |
| 08:10.36 | Eluna | People hiding behind some online persona is kinda retarded in and of itself. |
| 08:10.43 | Mirrormn | on the other hand, it seems wildly unnecessary to use real names instead of just allowing people to see your alts |
| 08:10.48 | Dagmar | No, it's not. It's called privacy. |
| 08:10.55 | Eluna | Anonymity spawns harassment and bad behavior. |
| 08:11.01 | Dagmar | You see this "online persona" I'm posting as? |
| 08:11.06 | Dagmar | EVERYONE calls me that. |
| 08:11.17 | Dagmar | ...and it doesn't link back to my physical location in any way. |
| 08:11.21 | mrpoundsign | so... don't post to the forums? |
| 08:11.32 | Dagmar | Kids are _vicious_ little bastards. |
| 08:11.33 | Arrowmaster | online anonymity also protects people from retarded employment policies in real life |
| 08:11.49 | Mirrormn | the "you can just not post on the forums" argument is pretty weak, though |
| 08:11.55 | Dagmar | Now, imagine that J. Random C*cktroll decides they don't like what someone says about the FOTM build they're using. |
| 08:12.05 | Arrowmaster | its extremely weak considering everything the forums are used for |
| 08:12.07 | Eluna | Again, you yourself chose to use the system or not. |
| 08:12.09 | *** join/#wowuidev cbreak_work (~cbreak@drz-wizzer.drz.ethz.ch) |
| 08:12.17 | Eluna | There are a billion other alternatives to the official forum. |
| 08:12.20 | Eluna | That are actually far far better. |
| 08:12.25 | mrpoundsign | the "we need to be anonymous in a totally optional part of a system" is pretty weak, too. |
| 08:12.28 | Eluna | So if that is huge problem, use something else. |
| 08:12.31 | Mirrormn | none of them are even close to as good |
| 08:12.34 | Arrowmaster | Eluna: you realize customer support and technical support are done on the forums too |
| 08:12.35 | Mirrormn | as an official forum |
| 08:12.49 | Eluna | Arrowmaster: You can send them an e-mail, or you can call them. |
| 08:12.49 | Dagmar | It's irresponsible for them to basically entice people into doing something that virtually nowhere else makes mandatory for privacy reasons |
| 08:12.52 | Eluna | Really not that big of a deal. |
| 08:12.59 | Dagmar | ...because too many people have had people show up at their doorstep |
| 08:13.07 | Kalroth | You have to be really numb if you think it stops at the forums. |
| 08:13.08 | Arrowmaster | Eluna: and they tell you to post on the forums when they dont have a cookie cutter answer for you |
| 08:13.12 | mrpoundsign | Facebook it is manditory to use your real name |
| 08:13.19 | Dagmar | Really |
| 08:13.25 | Dagmar | I'm listed as Dagmar d'Surreal there, too. |
| 08:13.30 | Dagmar | It's never been a problem. |
| 08:13.45 | Dagmar | What makes this a problem is that it's tied to the bloody credit card you pay for your account with. |
| 08:14.03 | Arrowmaster | facebook is a social network website, not a fucking video game |
| 08:14.04 | Dagmar | That doesn't give you a way to put in a psuedonym for privacy. |
| 08:14.04 | Mirrormn | no it's not |
| 08:14.16 | mrpoundsign | so if you pay with a gamecard, you're anonymous! |
| 08:14.26 | Dagmar | mrpoundsign: Which trolls will be doing |
| 08:14.36 | Dagmar | So... this *doesn't* stop anything but casual trolls... |
| 08:14.48 | Dagmar | ...and it destroys player's privacy in the same stroke. |
| 08:14.51 | Mirrormn | game time can be paid for with a payment type that does not have the same name as your account name |
| 08:14.52 | mrpoundsign | ok, so you can be anonymous. |
| 08:15.04 | |Jelly| | As near as I've been able to find, the only person in the country with my name, I really think it's an issue to be forced to post using your real name in order to continue with the community you (in some of the people's cases in here) helped to build in the first place. |
| 08:15.10 | Dagmar | They're not really taking away anonymity in any real sense. |
| 08:15.16 | Dagmar | ...but they are trashing privacy. |
| 08:15.26 | mrpoundsign | I think |
| 08:15.32 | Dagmar | ...because some idiot manager thinks they can make a bucnh off it somewhere like Mark Zuckerberg does |
| 08:15.36 | mrpoundsign | that they should do first name . last initial. |
| 08:15.42 | mrpoundsign | and |
| 08:15.45 | Dagmar | I would be fine with first name and last initial |
| 08:15.53 | Maldivia | bnet names, day 3... |
| 08:15.56 | mrpoundsign | they should have the old 4chan style forums for the people who like that asshattery |
| 08:16.03 | Mirrormn | hehe |
| 08:16.08 | |Jelly| | I'd still be screwed. Thanks mom for my awesome name. |
| 08:16.15 | Dagmar | But I can definitely tell ya from the stuff *I* used to do to people that crossed me severely in the 90's, you *don't* want player's real names out there. |
| 08:16.26 | mrpoundsign | "Sunshine" is not unique in the US ;P |
| 08:16.27 | Arrowmaster | |Jelly|: you should talk to orionshock |
| 08:16.38 | |Jelly| | ? |
| 08:16.49 | Mirrormn | anyway, that's a real good point, Dagmar |
| 08:17.10 | Mirrormn | they want to destroy anonymity, and they should be protection privacy |
| 08:17.16 | Dagmar | All they'd have to do to accomplish their stated goals would be to require a battlenet account have one, persistant, unchangeable psuedonym, like a whole TON of us already use |
| 08:17.26 | Mirrormn | but they're destroying privacy without doing a whole lot to anonymity |
| 08:17.26 | Arrowmaster | |Jelly|: he said his parents are total hippies, hes got 2 or 3 sisters with names he cant even spell and they all just go by nicknames |
| 08:17.46 | Dagmar | Mirrormn: Yeah it's the key to the problem. Privacy and anonymity are separate, but the change is throwing them both out |
| 08:17.48 | |Jelly| | Yeah |
| 08:17.59 | Mirrormn | well, they're not separate |
| 08:18.01 | |Jelly| | And I'm sorry but the defense "well, then just don't use it" is a total cop out. |
| 08:18.02 | Mirrormn | completely |
| 08:18.05 | Dagmar | They are separate. |
| 08:18.06 | Mirrormn | but they're not the same |
| 08:18.51 | Dagmar | The sort of atomic difference between them is that with privacy there's still a persistant identifier, but it's restricted in the scope to which it can be used to associate to other sources of data |
| 08:18.53 | mrpoundsign | How does it get rid of privacy and anonymity? |
| 08:19.05 | *** join/#wowuidev airtonix (~airtonix@unaffiliated/airtonix) |
| 08:19.08 | Mirrormn | "then just don't use it" would be a better argument if the wow forums were truly completely optional |
| 08:19.11 | Dagmar | Anonymity restricts linking to all other sources of data. No persistance. |
| 08:19.31 | mrpoundsign | I have been playing wow since it's inception. I have never had to post to the forums. |
| 08:19.46 | Mirrormn | well, I haven't either |
| 08:19.47 | |Jelly| | Congratulations to you |
| 08:20.00 | Dagmar | Them letting forum trolls roll up level 1 alts and go post with them pretty much hands out near-perfect anonymity |
| 08:20.01 | mrpoundsign | so how are the forums manditory? |
| 08:20.01 | Mirrormn | "had" to |
| 08:20.11 | Mirrormn | I didn't say they were mandatory |
| 08:20.19 | Dagmar | mrpoundsign: In case you didn't notice, this is a pretty complex game |
| 08:20.27 | Wobin | http://hyperboleandahalf.blogspot.com/ |
| 08:20.31 | Wobin | truly, this woman is awesome |
| 08:20.34 | Mirrormn | but there are certain tasks that are easier with the forums |
| 08:20.42 | |Jelly| | I've been a member of the UI community for what? Four years? And now I'm being forced to choose: give up a community or keep my privacy. That's an idiotic choice to be forced to make. |
| 08:20.54 | mrpoundsign | like trolling? |
| 08:21.21 | Dagmar | There's no real reason they can't allow persistant nyms |
| 08:21.28 | mrpoundsign | absolutely |
| 08:21.32 | mrpoundsign | or identicons |
| 08:21.41 | mrpoundsign | but |
| 08:21.42 | Dagmar | I can't stand those thing. |
| 08:21.51 | Dagmar | Look like bloody quilting experiments. |
| 08:22.03 | |Jelly| | Wobin: lol |
| 08:22.05 | mrpoundsign | I think it would be nice to have a set of optional forums where it does show your real id name |
| 08:22.08 | Cairenn | let me use my nick, it's what I'm known by everywhere else on the net |
| 08:22.12 | mrpoundsign | and us adults will use those, tyvm! |
| 08:22.30 | Dagmar | Yeah, I've been using the 'nym Dagmar d'Surreal for longer than about a third of the players have even been alive |
| 08:22.34 | |Jelly| | Cairenn: I don't think I'd call you anything different, even if I did know your real name. <3 |
| 08:22.45 | Cairenn | exactly |
| 08:22.46 | Dagmar | That kinda makes it more real than they are in some aspects. :) |
| 08:22.48 | mrpoundsign | so legally change your name |
| 08:22.57 | |Jelly| | . . . |
| 08:22.58 | Dagmar | No legal name change is needed. |
| 08:22.59 | mrpoundsign | it costs like $25 |
| 08:23.04 | Dagmar | It doesn't cost anything. |
| 08:23.15 | |Jelly| | That's quite possible the dumbest response to this I've read thus far. |
| 08:23.19 | theorbtwo | It costs a lot of pain in the ass. |
| 08:23.44 | mrpoundsign | I think you mail in a form. |
| 08:23.51 | Dagmar | Heck, there's even rules to handle stage names |
| 08:24.01 | theorbtwo | Depends on where you are. |
| 08:24.02 | Mirrormn | iirc, when you legally change your name, you either have to do a ton of paperwork to notify all kinds of different agencies about your name change, or you have to pay someone to do it for you |
| 08:24.03 | Dagmar | You can legally have more than one name. |
| 08:24.10 | Dagmar | Well, in NA |
| 08:24.17 | *** join/#wowuidev Kaso (~Kaso@89.240.5.140) |
| 08:24.26 | Dagmar | Mirrormn: The IRS. |
| 08:24.46 | Dagmar | ...and obviously the police because now you need a new ID. |
| 08:25.45 | Dagmar | Either way tho, the change isn't going to stop trolling, but it will put a lot of people at needless risk |
| 08:25.55 | Mirrormn | DMV |
| 08:25.58 | mrpoundsign | no, I hear you, Dagmar. I'm not really upset because it doesn't impact me personally. That doesn't mean that I don't understand your concerns, and half of what I am saying is just me being sarcastic, which is lost in chat. I think I like the idea of optional Real ID forums, however, that run in parallel. |
| 08:25.58 | Mirrormn | Social Security |
| 08:26.05 | Dagmar | ...not to mention how freaking nosy and judgemental some HR departments are |
| 08:26.09 | Mirrormn | uh |
| 08:26.25 | Mirrormn | you might need to get a new birth certificate, I dunno where you'd go to do that |
| 08:26.32 | Jamash | y'know, the announcement has lead to an increase in trolling |
| 08:26.36 | Dagmar | mrpoundsign: I *really* would welcome a persistant nym |
| 08:26.48 | Mirrormn | you'd probably have to run it past your employer, and do paperwork for them if you're in a large organization |
| 08:26.51 | |Jelly| | About 131 results (0.30 seconds) <-- this is why it's a bad idea, for the record. |
| 08:27.01 | Mirrormn | your bank |
| 08:27.05 | Jamash | I'm fine with posting as "Jamash" on the forum since I do that anyway since that's my main's name |
| 08:27.22 | Mirrormn | and you'd need to get new credit cards |
| 08:27.25 | Jamash | I'm not fine with having to post as my real name |
| 08:27.33 | mrpoundsign | links to the wow forums about anything will lead to more people reading the forums. More activity on the forums - more trolling. |
| 08:27.35 | theorbtwo | I would suggest just using the account name, not the real name, but historically that's been considered secret information that may be used to steal your account. |
| 08:27.40 | mrpoundsign | most of the wow population is asshats. |
| 08:27.43 | Mirrormn | haha |
| 08:27.51 | Mirrormn | you'd also have to notify blizzard |
| 08:27.54 | Dagmar | mrpoundsign: This is what happens when people don't beat their kids |
| 08:27.57 | Mirrormn | and send them a notarized form |
| 08:28.02 | mrpoundsign | damn straight. |
| 08:28.04 | Mirrormn | so they could change the name on your account ^_^ |
| 08:28.10 | mrpoundsign | actually... |
| 08:28.18 | Dagmar | Mirrormn: Easier to just use payment cards I think |
| 08:28.20 | mrpoundsign | I will take karma points over persistant identities. |
| 08:28.23 | Jamash | well the account name is now your email address |
| 08:28.25 | mrpoundsign | vote people up and down. |
| 08:28.31 | Jamash | so that's right out |
| 08:28.42 | theorbtwo | Good point, but I disagree that it's right out. |
| 08:28.45 | Dagmar | Oh yeah that would be primo |
| 08:28.56 | Mirrormn | no... your account login name is your e-mail address |
| 08:29.04 | Jamash | ... |
| 08:29.11 | Dagmar | Let's put everyone's account email out in the open where Google can index it, and then about half of the third world can just start spearfishing like mad |
| 08:29.13 | Mirrormn | but there is still a full name field attached to your account |
| 08:29.16 | Jamash | yes, your account name is your email address |
| 08:29.23 | Dagmar | There'd be enough work there to keep all of Romania busy |
| 08:29.24 | Jamash | the name of your account is your email address |
| 08:29.37 | Jamash | your email address is the name of your account |
| 08:29.39 | mrpoundsign | identicon of the email address SHA1 hash |
| 08:29.43 | Jamash | are we disagreeing here? |
| 08:29.50 | Mirrormn | but there is still a real name field attached to your account that is your actual name |
| 08:29.53 | Mirrormn | which RealID uses |
| 08:29.59 | Jamash | which is not the name of your account |
| 08:30.00 | Mirrormn | unless I am severly mistaken |
| 08:30.05 | Dagmar | ...and Blizz will use if you ever have your account compromised. |
| 08:30.16 | Dagmar | So it's not like someone can change that trivially, unfortunately. |
| 08:30.36 | Mirrormn | well, yeah, it is not the name of your account in that sense |
| 08:30.44 | Jamash | load up wow and tell me what the text above the login field says |
| 08:30.46 | Mirrormn | but how is that relevant? |
| 08:31.12 | Jamash | theorbtwo>I would suggest just using the account name, not the real name, but historically that's been considered secret information that may be used to steal your account. |
| 08:31.34 | Dagmar | I was assuming he meant the human name attached to the account. |
| 08:31.43 | mrpoundsign | it could take your real email address and replace it with a unicode enhanced version! |
| 08:31.47 | Dagmar | You know, the one they'll wanna see on the fax of your ID should you get really boned up |
| 08:31.49 | theorbtwo | No, I meant the pre battle.net account name. |
| 08:32.03 | *** join/#wowuidev akhe (~akhe@0x573fa156.ronqu2.dynamic.dsl.tele.dk) |
| 08:32.11 | mrpoundsign | mÿdád@yøûrmõm.cóm = secure! |
| 08:32.19 | Jamash | except they want to tie in your entire bnet account together |
| 08:32.22 | theorbtwo | I was being pretty stupid there -- I haven't actually used wow much since that change rolled in. |
| 08:32.32 | Jamash | you can have multiple wow accts attached to your bnet acct |
| 08:32.35 | Mirrormn | your email address there seems to have a sever case of font lice |
| 08:32.43 | Mirrormn | breaks out the shampoo |
| 08:32.47 | mrpoundsign | HAHAH! |
| 08:33.02 | Dagmar | The sad thing is that we just went through this with the first RealID change, with getting everyone to see that it's _okay_ if your _actual friends_ know your real name. |
| 08:33.03 | Jamash | google zalgo if you want to see real unicode lice |
| 08:33.05 | mrpoundsign | I think it has font tape worms, too |
| 08:33.49 | mrpoundsign | I won't use realid until they have a "log in invisible" option |
| 08:33.50 | Dagmar | If your actual friends can't be trusted with your real name, you are more paranoid than me and it's probably time to seek help |
| 08:33.52 | mrpoundsign | sometimes |
| 08:33.54 | Jamash | I'd paste some zalgo into chat but I don't want to get kicked from freenode |
| 08:33.58 | mrpoundsign | I don't want people to know I am on-line |
| 08:34.03 | Dagmar | ...but random people on the internet? Sheesh |
| 08:34.18 | Mirrormn | Zalgo looks more like Font Ebola |
| 08:34.22 | Jamash | true |
| 08:35.06 | Mirrormn | I feel like we should start discussing that GearScore tooltip screenshot again |
| 08:35.22 | Dagmar | Right so... people who come up with things like Zalgo will have access to someone's birth name if they have a disagreement on the new forums. |
| 08:35.30 | Dagmar | No... nothing can possibly go wrong with that. |
| 08:35.37 | |Jelly| | http://dragonage.bioware.com/da2/ <-- discuss |
| 08:35.52 | mrpoundsign | oh they can have my real name |
| 08:36.09 | mrpoundsign | I just want them to bugger off and not know about my alts and when I am on-line all the time. |
| 08:36.24 | Dagmar | Jelly: I can only imagine the video card I'm going to need |
| 08:36.32 | Dagmar | Time to start pricing out 4xx cards |
| 08:36.57 | |Jelly| | http://www.hardocp.com/news/2010/07/07/asus_ares_single_card_dual_5870_sneak_peek |
| 08:37.13 | mrpoundsign | my birth name is Brian Nelson. haxx away |
| 08:37.18 | Dagmar | I said pricing out cards, not looking for a cosigner on a mortgage |
| 08:37.23 | |Jelly| | :P |
| 08:37.23 | Jamash | Let's discuss not caring about dragon age |
| 08:37.28 | mrpoundsign | DO EEIT! |
| 08:37.36 | Mirrormn | ooh ooh |
| 08:37.43 | Mirrormn | I don't care about Dragon Age at all |
| 08:37.50 | Jamash | I don't care thiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiis much |------------------------------------------------| |
| 08:37.56 | |Jelly| | Must be nice to have a name that will likely bring up a million results on Google. |
| 08:38.02 | Dagmar | I don't know about "care" but i liked the last one |
| 08:38.18 | Jamash | I am unimpressed by their palette of brown, brown, brown, dried blood, mud, and brown |
| 08:38.29 | Dagmar | jelly: Yeah but someone who posts anything about any other interests on the forums is just making it easier to narrow it down |
| 08:38.34 | |Jelly| | Some of us have not been afforded that luxury. Again, thanks mom. |
| 08:38.46 | Dagmar | Jamash: You never watched any Monty Python, did you |
| 08:38.48 | Jamash | I am the only person on the internet with my name, hi. |
| 08:38.51 | mrpoundsign | haha yeah |
| 08:39.04 | Mirrormn | also, considering that Dragon Age 2 seems to be for PS3 and XBox360, I don't see how they could make the PC version much more hardware-greedy than the first |
| 08:39.05 | Jamash | Dagmar: I plead the 5th |
| 08:39.18 | Mirrormn | they're going to be limited by the console hardware |
| 08:39.20 | theorbtwo | shrugs. If I could use a persistant name on the forums, I'd just use this one, which is trivial to link to my real name. |
| 08:39.48 | theorbtwo | ...and while my name isn't terribly uncommon, I probably have, by far, the largest footprint of anybody named James Mastros. |
| 08:39.56 | Dagmar | Jamash: Peasants are always covered with shit. It's how you know they're peasants. |
| 08:40.05 | |Jelly| | lol |
| 08:40.28 | Kalroth | http://i171.photobucket.com/albums/u308/anotherneko/WorldofActivbook.jpg |
| 08:40.48 | Dagmar | NOt sure but... http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dOOTKA0aGI0 |
| 08:41.08 | Dagmar | Kalroth: AIEEEEE!@@!@# |
| 08:41.11 | Maldivia | theorbtwo, well i share name with a famous bicycle racer, so not much on me shows up on google :) |
| 08:41.39 | Dagmar | Yeah I think that's the bit they mention it, but note... medieval stuff... brown, brown, dried mud, and brown |
| 08:44.21 | Mirrormn | do you see him oppressing me? |
| 08:45.04 | Eluna | Anyway, back from customers and phone calls. :p |
| 08:45.06 | Jamash | anyway, dragon age can come to my house and bite me |
| 08:45.21 | Eluna | To recap, realid not as bad as it sounds. As long as they fix the security leaks :P |
| 08:45.32 | Arrowmaster | they wont |
| 08:45.39 | Jamash | Eluna: You mean "as long as they change the entire system" |
| 08:45.47 | Mirrormn | what security leaks? |
| 08:45.57 | Jamash | uh, realid is a security leak |
| 08:45.59 | Arrowmaster | those are features not security leaks |
| 08:46.01 | Jamash | inherently |
| 08:46.14 | Eluna | Seriously, what is the difference between using RealID and using Facebook to log into websites? |
| 08:46.16 | Eluna | None. |
| 08:46.26 | Dagmar | Nothing makes you use your _real name_ on Facebook. |
| 08:46.29 | Jamash | I don't want to use facebook to log into anything |
| 08:46.30 | Jamash | ever |
| 08:46.35 | mrpoundsign | Facebook exposes a lot more of your PII? |
| 08:46.35 | Arrowmaster | youre actually dumb enough to use facebook to login to other websites? |
| 08:46.41 | Mirrormn | yeah I definitely purposefully avoid facebook |
| 08:46.44 | Dagmar | ...and Facebook is a *social network* meant for people's _friends_ in the first place. |
| 08:46.55 | Mirrormn | the too |
| 08:46.57 | Mirrormn | *that |
| 08:46.58 | Jamash | to non-friends, my facebook page exposes no information |
| 08:47.19 | Dagmar | We've seen *multiple* cases of hostile stalker crap from Facebook already |
| 08:47.33 | Eluna | Arrowmaster: I do'nt. |
| 08:47.38 | Eluna | But then again, I don't hide my name either. |
| 08:47.45 | Arrowmaster | i have everything from the facebook domains blocked if im not actually on facebook, i dont even see that login shit |
| 08:47.47 | mrpoundsign | I think privacy is politically important. I think in a video game, you get an absolute vote with your money. |
| 08:47.52 | Eluna | Why would I? Or rather, why should I? |
| 08:48.02 | Dagmar | Because there's bloody psychos on the web |
| 08:48.08 | Eluna | Is your real name actually that important, that you don't want people to know it? |
| 08:48.10 | mrpoundsign | so in a video game, I really don't give a crap. If it sucks, then I will stop paying/playing. |
| 08:48.25 | Eluna | Dagmar: Newsflash! There are bloody psychos in real life too. |
| 08:48.34 | Arrowmaster | Eluna: i have my full name home address and home phone number in the whois results for two domain names, im not exacty hiding either but i dont advertise it |
| 08:48.38 | krka | it's not about knowing names, it's about the public link between your name and your gaming identity |
| 08:48.44 | Dagmar | How'd you like it if the next time you went looking for a job, you got turned down because some dimwit put up some phony pictures with your name on them, and HR fell for it |
| 08:48.44 | Jamash | ^ |
| 08:48.49 | Maldivia | Eluna, exactly the reason to be careful |
| 08:48.53 | Dagmar | That's a MILD theoretical example. |
| 08:49.09 | Eluna | Maldivia: You could go through life worrying about it, or you could just be like most people, and not care. |
| 08:49.11 | *** join/#wowuidev harl (harl@dslb-084-063-109-144.pools.arcor-ip.net) |
| 08:49.12 | Jamash | how would you like it if someone set your house on fire because you ganked them in stranglethorn vale |
| 08:49.17 | Eluna | If people really want to find out who you are, then they will find out who you are. |
| 08:49.22 | Dagmar | Eluna: The bloody psychos in real life are limited in their access to you by GEOGRAPHICAL SEPARATION. |
| 08:49.27 | Eluna | It's not like having your name there will change that. |
| 08:49.36 | Eluna | It will only remove one step in the chain of finding your "real" identity. |
| 08:49.37 | mrpoundsign | I would feel... so violated. by mcdonalds. for doing that to me. |
| 08:49.44 | krka | public available name makes it much easier |
| 08:49.48 | Dagmar | Geographical separation is why people can't easily appear magically in your front yard, show you their tiny penis, and then disappear. |
| 08:49.53 | mrpoundsign | but my job I got from having a sound resume and working with people. so eh |
| 08:49.57 | harl | wuff |
| 08:50.00 | Dagmar | THe lack of it is why they *CAN* on say... Second Life. |
| 08:50.07 | Jamash | how would you like it if someone stabbed you because you killed them in counter-strike, which HAS ALREADY HAPPENED |
| 08:50.13 | Eluna | The only excuse I could think of that this is a "bad idea" is that it might put you off jobs because your would be employer sees you playing WoW. |
| 08:50.24 | Dagmar | Elune: You've not been on the internet long enough then |
| 08:50.36 | Eluna | Jamash: The guys spent 6 months tracking down the guy he killed. |
| 08:50.43 | Jamash | yes, exactly |
| 08:50.45 | Eluna | RealID would make it happen faster. |
| 08:50.50 | Eluna | Would't remove it happening. |
| 08:50.51 | Jamash | yes, exactly |
| 08:50.52 | Maldivia | as a scientist, i dont want my name plastered over wow forums, it doed exactly improve credability |
| 08:50.58 | mrpoundsign | @Jamash: CS has nothing like Real ID. So your point is moot. |
| 08:51.04 | Dagmar | So you're saying it's a good thing people would have less wait before their murderer found them? |
| 08:51.16 | Arrowmaster | Eluna: yeah some emplyeers would probably fire instantly if they found out you play wow, like public school teachers |
| 08:51.22 | Jamash | how many people are willing to take 6 months to track someone down? |
| 08:51.22 | Eluna | If you are that dedicated to wanting to kill someone for that, then you will find out regardless of the system implemented. |
| 08:51.31 | Dagmar | Imagine the fodder for gossip in some of these backwater places |
| 08:51.42 | Jamash | how many people are willing to take *five minutes* to track someone down? |
| 08:51.55 | Jamash | I propose that the second set is dramatically larger than the first |
| 08:51.56 | Dagmar | "Mr. McGilllicuty plays World of Warcraft because he likes the easy access to children in a children's game, away from the eyes of parents." |
| 08:51.58 | Eluna | Jamash: Once a psycho, always a psycho. |
| 08:51.59 | Eluna | Internet or no internet. |
| 08:52.06 | mrpoundsign | wow googleing myself I was reminded that I have a livejournal account. deldeted! |
| 08:52.13 | Jamash | Eluna: In CS, with no real names, one person has been stabbed |
| 08:52.15 | Dagmar | Jamash: I used to do it for as long as I stayed pissed off. |
| 08:52.27 | Eluna | I love this hysteria btw. :) |
| 08:52.33 | Dagmar | It's not hysteria. |
| 08:52.36 | Jamash | In WoW, with real names, how many people will be stabbed? |
| 08:52.38 | Eluna | It is :) |
| 08:52.42 | Dagmar | No, it's not. |
| 08:52.46 | Dagmar | It's reality. |
| 08:52.52 | Eluna | Even better. |
| 08:52.53 | Jamash | It's concern for real, physical harm. |
| 08:52.53 | Maldivia | people already habe been |
| 08:53.02 | theorbtwo | Reality is what you make of it. |
| 08:53.11 | Dagmar | Back in the fraking late eighties we had BBSes that you had to dial into using your phone and a modem. |
| 08:53.19 | Dagmar | Many of these places required real names at first |
| 08:53.24 | mrpoundsign | Jamash: 12. |
| 08:53.27 | Jamash | I like how you treat the concept of someone coming to your house and murdering you with all the seriousness of an emoticon. |
| 08:53.30 | Mirrormn | alright, so |
| 08:53.35 | mrpoundsign | Jamash: 10 of them for their cheetos. |
| 08:53.37 | theorbtwo | Maldivia: People have already died from being hit by falling roof tiles. |
| 08:53.47 | Eluna | Jamash: Sensationalism. |
| 08:53.50 | Jamash | No. |
| 08:53.52 | Jamash | Fact. |
| 08:53.56 | Dagmar | ...but almost invariably and nearly without exception, they all eventually CHANGED that policy because some asshole was ALWAYS willing to take an argument online, offline and go bust someone's windows or start calling them up in the middle of the night. |
| 08:54.01 | Mirrormn | I rewrote the layout function for my frames to anchor all the buttons to the parent frame instead of to anchor them in lines |
| 08:54.05 | Maldivia | yes, but not because they ganked in stv |
| 08:54.07 | Mirrormn | and now it works instantly |
| 08:54.12 | Jamash | cool, Mirrormn |
| 08:54.19 | Dagmar | THe same freaking nonsense went on in the 90's with the online services like AOL. |
| 08:54.24 | mrpoundsign | quick, everyone talk like dwight from the office. |
| 08:54.26 | Jamash | Yes, because they ganked in stv |
| 08:54.31 | Dagmar | ...and THEY learned to NOT force people's birth names out there. |
| 08:54.35 | Mirrormn | so in case you ever need to add a ton of frames into some parent frame |
| 08:54.40 | mrpoundsign | question. |
| 08:54.42 | mrpoundsign | fact. |
| 08:54.42 | Eluna | Jamash: You think harassment is something new for the 21st century? |
| 08:54.42 | theorbtwo | If you want to avoid anything that could possibly kill you, you'd never leave your bed. |
| 08:54.45 | Mirrormn | take it from me: don't anchor them to each other |
| 08:54.47 | Dagmar | It's not hysteria, it's freaking historical record. |
| 08:54.52 | theorbtwo | Oh, wait. Plenty of people die in their bed, too. |
| 08:54.54 | Jamash | Eluna: Do you drive? |
| 08:55.01 | Maldivia | jamash, was a refetence to falling brick |
| 08:55.07 | Eluna | Jamash: Don't go outside! You might get hit by a metero! |
| 08:55.21 | mrpoundsign | Jamash: stop asking questions about my habits. you're creeping me out. |
| 08:55.24 | Eluna | That argument is just as valid as saying "YOU'LL BE MURDERED!" |
| 08:55.25 | Jamash | Eluna: Do you drive? |
| 08:55.35 | Eluna | Nope |
| 08:55.42 | Jamash | Do you ever ride in a car? |
| 08:56.01 | Dagmar | So... don't get out a whole lot beyond your neighborhood and possibly the calm quiet places that have public transportation |
| 08:56.03 | Mirrormn | it's not "YOU'LL BE MURDERED" |
| 08:56.04 | mrpoundsign | I live in the bay area. I take the train from Sunnyvale to San Mateo to work, then the reverse route home. |
| 08:56.16 | Mirrormn | it's "there's no reason to make things easier for murderers" |
| 08:56.18 | cbreak_work | calm places like the whole country? |
| 08:56.20 | Dagmar | mrpoundsign: Hah I used to work in San Mateo |
| 08:56.20 | Eluna | Jamash: Of course? Please do a car analogy. |
| 08:56.21 | mrpoundsign | although I should be taking the 8:24am train, I usually end up being late and taking the 9:24. |
| 08:56.23 | Eluna | I so need it. |
| 08:56.33 | Jamash | Do you wear a seatbelt, or do you say "Seatbelts lol" and refuse to wear one. |
| 08:56.39 | mrpoundsign | stab me and prove a point. :) |
| 08:56.43 | Maldivia | eluna, why should i share private information with complete strangers, just to write on a forum |
| 08:56.44 | Mirrormn | just like there is no reason to wear a big meteor magnet (if such a thing existed) on your head, even if meteors were ridiculously rare |
| 08:56.44 | Dagmar | Oh I like where he's goin' |
| 08:57.03 | Eluna | Maldivia: You could also, I don't know. Not write on the forum? |
| 08:57.07 | Eluna | Jamash: Please, just get to the point.. |
| 08:57.09 | theorbtwo | Yes, there is a reason to make things easier for murders -- because it'll make people troll less. |
| 08:57.12 | Maldivia | for google in all eternity to cache and index |
| 08:57.12 | Jamash | Yes or no. |
| 08:57.14 | Dagmar | mrpoundsign: No one cares enough, but with what you've already told, someone could get your home address in about 45 minutes or less. |
| 08:57.29 | Cairenn | dial it back guys |
| 08:57.37 | Eluna | Jamash: Like most people, I wear a seatbelt. If in a bus, I don't. |
| 08:57.40 | mrpoundsign | get mu home address in 45 minutes,and I will paypal you $45.00 |
| 08:57.46 | Eluna | Hi Cairenn <3 |
| 08:57.47 | harl | agrees with Cairenn. |
| 08:57.49 | Maldivia | morning cairenn :) |
| 08:58.11 | mrpoundsign | I totally get it's possible. |
| 08:58.14 | Dagmar | mrpoundsign: There's a lot of places on the 'net that do public records searches and so on for about that much. |
| 08:58.15 | Cairenn | Hi Eluna, morning Maldivia |
| 08:58.18 | mrpoundsign | I know it is. :) |
| 08:58.24 | Jamash | Why wear a seatbelt? People who wear seatbelts die in accidents too. |
| 08:58.49 | mrpoundsign | yes, I have given you many, many more points of interest in my personal life than Real ID ever would. |
| 08:58.50 | Maldivia | cairenn, want in on the bet on when they retract realid from forums, im currently saying within next week :) |
| 08:58.51 | Dagmar | But frankly I'm not really worried about the in-person stalkers as much as I am really sure kooks will start harassing people outside the Wow forums once they're incenced |
| 08:58.51 | Eluna | And the award for "Worst argument ever" goes to Jamash. |
| 08:58.57 | mrpoundsign | in it's current form. |
| 08:59.26 | Dagmar | I can't remember if it was one or two kids that offed themselves last year over chronic harassment. |
| 08:59.38 | Cairenn | Maldivia: pass, thanks |
| 08:59.39 | mrpoundsign | Jamash: knowledge kills people. It kills people in IRC. Don't use IRC or knowledge. Remember sk0t. |
| 08:59.41 | Arrowmaster | mrpoundsign: well ive already got 33 people in the bay area with your name |
| 08:59.58 | Jamash | K, now that Eluna has abandoned any pretense at serious debate, who would like to talk sensibly about this? |
| 08:59.59 | Eluna | Cairenn: How are you today. :) |
| 09:00.06 | Dagmar | Heck, you've seen trade chat. You know this game has players with deep seated problems |
| 09:00.14 | Eluna | Jamash: I've tried being serious the past 10 minutes. |
| 09:00.16 | Cairenn | Eluna: frustrated |
| 09:00.18 | Dagmar | ...on just about every server |
| 09:00.23 | Jamash | No you haven't. |
| 09:00.25 | Eluna | But unserious arguments will make me less serious. |
| 09:00.30 | Eluna | Cairenn: Aww? |
| 09:00.42 | Jamash | My seatbelt analogy is 100% serious. |
| 09:00.44 | Cairenn | Eluna: look at the last 3 days, how can I be anything but? |
| 09:00.53 | krka | mm... butt! |
| 09:00.58 | mrpoundsign | and my sk0t one is too. log out now. or die from IRC and knowledge. |
| 09:01.01 | Eluna | Cairenn: Poor thing *hug* |
| 09:01.26 | Eluna | Jamash: Ok, let me try it on you. Do you look up into the sky every time you go outside to see if you might be hit by a meteor? |
| 09:01.47 | Jamash | You have asked, why should people concern themselves with their personal safety? I have asked you, why do *you* concern yourself with *your* personal safety? |
| 09:01.49 | Eluna | Do you actively walk around watching out for every and all dangers that "might" happen? |
| 09:01.53 | Dagmar | It would be a concern if he lived in the asteroid belt and zoomed around it at hundreds of miles an hour |
| 09:02.04 | Eluna | Jamash: Because I don't see my real name as a personal safty. |
| 09:02.08 | Eluna | Finding my real name isn't hard. |
| 09:02.09 | Jamash | ah ha |
| 09:02.11 | Mirrormn | in case anyone cares |
| 09:02.14 | Jamash | now we come to the crux of it |
| 09:02.18 | mrpoundsign | do you live in a city full of cyberkillers? |
| 09:02.23 | Jamash | Who doesn't? |
| 09:02.28 | Eluna | And by finding that you find my address, phone number, internetsites, what I made last year, where I work etc. |
| 09:02.28 | Mirrormn | moving around a frame with 240 buttons on it completely kills my framerate |
| 09:02.32 | Dagmar | The astronomical (hah) chances of being struck by a meteor have both no bearing, and nowhere NEAR the risk that jerks on the internet like to take things too far |
| 09:02.38 | Mirrormn | from 110 down to 24 |
| 09:02.56 | theorbtwo | Dagmar: That hasn't been my experience. |
| 09:02.57 | Dagmar | Elura: So go take on the forum trolls with your real name waving about |
| 09:03.13 | Arrowmaster | Mirrormn: wow has problems when doing lots of nested anchoring |
| 09:03.22 | Dagmar | Get into an argument with the kiddies over their flavor-of-the-month spec |
| 09:03.23 | Mirrormn | it's not nested anymore |
| 09:03.23 | Eluna | Dagmar: Why would I? I don't even use the forum now. :P |
| 09:03.37 | Jamash | and then we find that you're trolling |
| 09:03.39 | Mirrormn | I made all the buttons anchor to the parent frame with different offsets |
| 09:03.41 | Dagmar | Eluna: So what the heck makes you think you know about the people who use that forum? |
| 09:03.54 | cbreak_work | delusions of the unknowning |
| 09:03.54 | harl | Mirrormn: cool :) |
| 09:03.58 | Eluna | Dagmar: Because I used to use it. But was put off because of all the idiots? :P |
| 09:04.01 | Jamash | "I'm not concerned because it doesn't affect me in any way and I don't care about anyone but myself." |
| 09:04.04 | Arrowmaster | you must have missed the good old days of IRC where arguments were ended by somebody getting DDoSed |
| 09:04.27 | Mirrormn | oh man |
| 09:04.33 | Mirrormn | I did that one time ^_^ |
| 09:04.35 | Dagmar | ...and you don't see those little reprobates as being quite capable of going off the deep end on someone and looking up their info to start spending an hour or two each day trying to find a way to torment them, just because they're bored. |
| 09:04.39 | mrpoundsign | Jamash: I'm sorry you're being attacked by cyberkillers from the wow forums :( |
| 09:04.39 | |Jelly| | So you think that people using their 'real names' is going to stop the idiocy on the forums? |
| 09:04.54 | krka | only John Smith will continue trolling :P |
| 09:04.56 | Jamash | what's the term for someone who has no concept that other people have feelings, emotions, inner mental states, etc.? |
| 09:05.01 | Dagmar | Jelly: There's the million dollar stock option er question |
| 09:05.04 | Mirrormn | sociopath? |
| 09:05.07 | Dagmar | Jamash: Asperger's |
| 09:05.10 | Dagmar | ...which this might be |
| 09:05.15 | Kalroth | I already made a fake US account for the day RealID goes live - my name? Mike Litoris! |
| 09:05.18 | krka | Jamash: solipsist? |
| 09:05.19 | Dagmar | I don't know any way to do the tests over IRC |
| 09:05.26 | theorbtwo | Arrowmaster: I've hung about IRC for some time, though not continiously. I've never gotten DDoSed. |
| 09:05.32 | mrpoundsign | narcissism? |
| 09:05.34 | Mirrormn | pretty cool guy, eh doesn't afraid of anything? |
| 09:05.44 | Dagmar | theorbtwo: Lilo gave me this mask |
| 09:05.51 | Kalroth | theorbtwo: Anecdotal data sucks! |
| 09:05.59 | Arrowmaster | theorbtwo: i have, and it was even in the late 90s when that stuff was in the decline |
| 09:06.00 | Eluna | The internet is getting more and more transparent. |
| 09:06.01 | Jamash | I was thinking of antisocial personality disorder, but whatever |
| 09:06.05 | Eluna | it's not like it was in the 90s |
| 09:06.08 | |Jelly| | I'm unable to express what's going to happen myself, so I'll leave it to the guys at Ctrl+Alt+Delete: http://www.cad-comic.com/cad/20100707 |
| 09:06.11 | krka | i think my answer was closest :P |
| 09:06.12 | Eluna | Where anonymity was a huge concern. |
| 09:06.19 | Dagmar | YOu have lost your mind |
| 09:06.23 | Eluna | People are more transparent, and don't actually care that much anymore. |
| 09:06.32 | Mirrormn | that's a good one, jelly |
| 09:06.34 | krka | some people don't care |
| 09:06.34 | Kalroth | Eluna: Dumb people don't care that much anymore :) |
| 09:06.38 | Jamash | Who are these "people" |
| 09:06.40 | theorbtwo | Kalroth: Ah, but everybody only has antecdotal data. |
| 09:06.43 | |Jelly| | Seriously. |
| 09:06.55 | Eluna | I'm not saying I don't care about privacy. But the best fix for it is _not_ to use the service that reveals said information. :P |
| 09:06.55 | theorbtwo | The closest thing we've gotten to real information is "it happened once, to that one guy, you know". |
| 09:06.56 | |Jelly| | People who genuinely don't care, should really get a reality check. |
| 09:06.57 | Dagmar | I was personally raising hell on the internet in the 90's, and I'm pretty darn sure people can be hurt a lot more NOW online then they could be then |
| 09:07.06 | Jamash | Obviously not the people who have made 47770 posts on the topic |
| 09:07.27 | Eluna | How many million people use the internet each day? How many get killed for using it? |
| 09:07.28 | Dagmar | Clearly, those people use the forums and find this unacceptable |
| 09:07.38 | Kalroth | Eluna: Really? |
| 09:07.41 | Eluna | You all mention that one french guy who killed the guy for stabbing him in CS. |
| 09:07.42 | Dagmar | Eluna: What's that got to do with this |
| 09:07.52 | Kalroth | Eluna: How do you manage to breathe every day?! |
| 09:07.53 | Eluna | You guys mention seat belts and shit. |
| 09:08.03 | Eluna | It's like the worst argument ever. |
| 09:08.12 | Jamash | Yes, seat belts are method of decreasing the odds something bad ill happen to you. |
| 09:08.17 | Dagmar | What does the number of people using the internet each day have anything to do with this |
| 09:08.23 | Jamash | RealID is a method of increasing the odds something bad will happen to you. |
| 09:08.31 | Dagmar | The REST OF THE INTERNET allows for reasonable levels of privacy |
| 09:08.35 | Eluna | Jamash: So then again, why would you post on a forum if you know that your full name will be shown. |
| 09:08.39 | Jamash | I guess there's noooooooooooo possible connection between the two |
| 09:08.41 | Eluna | Wouldn't not posting be the same as using a seat belt? |
| 09:08.41 | Jamash | I wouldn't |
| 09:08.50 | |Jelly| | But your rebuttal is simple 'then don't use it' which is fucking stupid. Why should people be ***forced*** to choose between their privacy and a community that they've helped shape over the past five years? |
| 09:08.53 | Mirrormn | the better question to ask is "what percentage of the people who have been involved in an internet-related murder did not take proper steps to keep their identity private" ^_^ |
| 09:09.11 | krka | would be awesome if all ip addresses could be mapped (correctly) to personal information such as name |
| 09:09.14 | Dagmar | Eluna: PErhaps because you'd like to use official forums because they've got a vested interest in keeping the trolls, keyloggers, shock pictures, and sexual deviants from taking over |
| 09:09.21 | Jamash | Let's say Major Car Company decided, all on their lonesome, that they'd stop putting seat belts in their cars. |
| 09:09.22 | krka | maybe with ip6 and some new funky laws, we'll see that |
| 09:09.22 | Mirrormn | not posting would be the same as not ever using a car |
| 09:09.32 | Dagmar | People would still buy the car |
| 09:09.33 | Mirrormn | "nobody ever said you had to use a car" |
| 09:09.37 | Mirrormn | "just walk to work" |
| 09:09.39 | theorbtwo | |Jelly|: Because the shape the forums are now in is pretty shitty? |
| 09:09.40 | Dagmar | ...because they're freaking stupid. |
| 09:09.44 | Kalroth | Yup, what Jelly said. "Don't use it" isn't an argument and do you really think it'll stop with the forums? |
| 09:10.08 | |Jelly| | So perhaps, just perhaps Blizzard should ... I don't know, moderate their own forums? Crazy, I know. |
| 09:10.09 | Dagmar | Blizz's stated reasoning for this change is highly questionable |
| 09:10.14 | krka | first they came for the forums, i did nothing |
| 09:10.14 | Jamash | Would you say that that'd be okay, and it's their right to not put seatbelts in their cars, and that it's "hysteria" when it's pointed out that customers *will die* because of the lack of seatbelts? |
| 09:10.17 | |Jelly| | Perhaps ... hmm ... actually ban people? |
| 09:10.19 | Eluna | Anyway, can we all agree to disagree? I don't think we should discuss it anymore. Seeing as people get so hot headed about the topic right now. |
| 09:10.23 | krka | then they came for the in game characters, i did nothing |
| 09:10.23 | |Jelly| | You know, things like that. |
| 09:10.35 | Dagmar | Eluna: Most of us are being very calm about this because it's quite serious |
| 09:10.35 | Jamash | I think we can agree that you're wrong, and that you disagree with that fact. |
| 09:10.43 | mrpoundsign | so the forums get you from icecrown to undercity faster? |
| 09:10.49 | Dagmar | Jamash++ |
| 09:10.51 | Jamash | mrpoundsign: yes |
| 09:10.56 | Mirrormn | well, I still don't think it's as big a deal as everyone thinks it is |
| 09:11.12 | Dagmar | There's a reason no other gaming networks do this. |
| 09:11.12 | Cairenn | Jamash: no one's opinion is 'wrong', it is their opinion - you can choose to not agree with it, but that doesn't make it 'wrong' |
| 09:11.17 | Dagmar | That reason is Internet Kooks. |
| 09:11.22 | Jamash | we're not discussing opinions |
| 09:11.34 | Eluna | Jamash: Actually are.. |
| 09:11.34 | mrpoundsign | well, just saying, the forums aren't as necessary to wow as a car is to daily life. |
| 09:11.36 | Mirrormn | we're hyperbolizing the danger of having your real name viewable online *and* the inconvenience of not being able to use the official forums quite a bit |
| 09:11.36 | Eluna | We actually are. |
| 09:11.43 | Kalroth | mrpoundsign: The forums help you recruit new members, the forums help you arrange server events, the forums allow you to post technical questions, the forum allows you to post dumb question in the class section, etc. etc. |
| 09:11.45 | Cairenn | and, *I* asked that Eluna stop, that she agree to disagree, and I'm asking the same of the rest of you |
| 09:11.48 | Kalroth | But not anymore. |
| 09:11.56 | Dagmar | Eluna seems quite convinced that the internet is full of stable happy people who would never reach out and try to ruin someone's real life over something trivial. |
| 09:12.08 | Dagmar | I'm quite convinced she's been huffing something. |
| 09:12.13 | Jamash | Is the existence of crazy people on the internet "just an opinion"? |
| 09:12.18 | Eluna | Dagmar: No, I live in the real world, where I know people aren't stable at all. |
| 09:12.19 | mrpoundsign | Kalroth: yes, but I think comparing it to a car for daily life is a huge exaggeration of their usefulness. |
| 09:12.24 | Eluna | Being on the internet won't change that. |
| 09:12.31 | Cairenn | shall I repeat myself? |
| 09:12.32 | Jamash | Eluna: I am not sure of tha. |
| 09:12.33 | Eluna | I'm just more transparent then most I guess. |
| 09:12.43 | Eluna | Anyway, I'm done in respect to Cairenn. |
| 09:12.44 | |Jelly| | I don't wear a shirt that says my full name on it in real life either. Just saying. |
| 09:12.52 | mrpoundsign | Kalroth: if the forums are like cars... your car breaks down every week,and is constant assaulted as you try to drive anywhere by thousands of people wearing scream masks. |
| 09:12.53 | Dagmar | I'm guessing that so far, it's never burned you |
| 09:12.56 | krka | Cairenn: http://xkcd.com/386/ |
| 09:12.58 | Arrowmaster | in my younger days i ruined a few peoples lifes over stuff that was probably trivial |
| 09:13.00 | Kalroth | mrpoundsign: I don't know about any car comparisons :) I'm simply saying that the forums are used today and enforcing RealID will effectively kill that. |
| 09:13.00 | Dagmar | It *does* get some people burned, tho'. |
| 09:13.02 | mrpoundsign | Kalroth: then yes, the forums are jsut like a car. |
| 09:13.05 | harl | whoa, so.. you're saying now that realid's exposing my real name, blizzard knows that bit as well? holy shit, there goes my anonymity.. (lol, scnr) |
| 09:13.27 | Dagmar | Arrowmaster: yeah I was a right bastard in the 90's but these new guys have no sense of what's appropriate |
| 09:13.39 | theorbtwo | The question isn't if there are crazy people on the internet. The question is if, on balance, the forums exposing real names will do more harm then good, or vice-versa. |
| 09:13.43 | Dagmar | Arrowmaster: They make me feel like I might as well have been saying "Darn you kids" by comparison |
| 09:13.58 | theorbtwo | It's not like anybody is claiming that it is obviously purely good. |
| 09:14.03 | Jamash | theorbtwo: I would argue that the question is "will it do harm" |
| 09:14.12 | mrpoundsign | I'm not at all saying that. |
| 09:14.14 | Dagmar | I think that it will do harm, and it will fail to do what they're wanting to do with it |
| 09:14.25 | krka | i predict that this will turn out exactly like the changed addon development conditions |
| 09:14.28 | mrpoundsign | I think Firstname Lastninital. would be cool tho. |
| 09:14.36 | harl | no |
| 09:14.40 | Jamash | krka: I doubt it (that is an opinion) |
| 09:14.44 | Dagmar | mrpoundsign: I'd think we'd be lucky if we got that |
| 09:14.44 | harl | it wouldn't |
| 09:15.03 | |Jelly| | I think I'd still be screwed. |
| 09:15.07 | Kalroth | The changed addon conditions made sense, krka |
| 09:15.13 | Kalroth | This doesn't |
| 09:15.25 | Arrowmaster | Dagmar: did you know that there is a website that lets you chat with an operator that places phone calls for you? |
| 09:15.33 | theorbtwo | Jamash: I think, then, that airbags are a good example. Airbags kill some people, but they save a lot more. |
| 09:15.34 | Arrowmaster | we had it attached to an irc bot |
| 09:15.35 | Dagmar | Arrowmaster: Oh yes. |
| 09:15.42 | mrpoundsign | oh if there's any realid identity sharing addon that becomes popular, I am totally writing an addon to flood it with names |
| 09:15.49 | Dagmar | I have both *made* those calls, and gotten calls from people using them |
| 09:16.03 | krka | Kalroth: i recall there being heated debates over that as well |
| 09:16.14 | Dagmar | Worked a few different telephone jobs like a travel agency and a tech support department |
| 09:16.22 | Kalroth | krka: Sure, in these channels - outside, not so much. |
| 09:16.26 | Jamash | theorbtwo: who is realid saving? |
| 09:16.26 | harl | mrpoundsign: looking forward to it |
| 09:16.42 | Jamash | We're talking about balancing real world harm vs internet benefit |
| 09:16.44 | krka | Kalroth: because it only affected developers then, not regular users |
| 09:16.50 | theorbtwo | Jamash: Yes, we are. |
| 09:16.51 | mrpoundsign | maybe add it as a feature to my "Chuck Ignorris" addon :) |
| 09:16.53 | theorbtwo | Deal with it. |
| 09:16.53 | Dagmar | I think you can probably still find a few TDD dialins if you happen to have a working modem around |
| 09:16.55 | Kalroth | krka: Yup, exactly |
| 09:16.59 | mrpoundsign | (still in concept stages) |
| 09:17.02 | Jamash | I would argue that internet benefit = 0 and real world harm = large amount |
| 09:17.13 | Jamash | and that 0 < large amount |
| 09:17.27 | mrpoundsign | Jamash: I think the benefit is pretty large for me. I may actually use the forums post-change |
| 09:17.31 | Dagmar | Yeah I don't see this as really adding anything useful to the forums |
| 09:17.45 | theorbtwo | And I would argue that internet benefit = medium amount, and real world harm = within the margin of error. |
| 09:17.55 | Jamash | mrpoundsign: I'm sure both you and ghostcrawler will enjoy each other's company |
| 09:18.04 | Dagmar | We'll get to see racism and sexism go right back into play as "arguments" to try and jerk other people around with. |
| 09:18.05 | Jamash | as the only two people on the forums |
| 09:18.06 | Arrowmaster | Dagmar: one of the greatest things i have ever witnessed and been only moderately involved with was just a simple irc spam bot |
| 09:18.07 | mrpoundsign | Jamash: and you say we lack empathy. |
| 09:18.24 | theorbtwo | We shall begin to see what actually happens soon. |
| 09:18.25 | mrpoundsign | "everyone generalizes using a single example. At least, I do." |
| 09:18.33 | Jamash | Are you Eluna multiboxing IRC, mrpoundsign? |
| 09:18.40 | Cairenn | seriously, calm down guys |
| 09:18.57 | Jamash | Because I notice that you seem to have taken all the comments I directed at her as if they were directed at you. |
| 09:19.05 | Dagmar | Arrowmaster: At one time I could draw you the entire EFNet network map, including both server to server links, and the internet backbones they routed across |
| 09:19.14 | Dagmar | there's a reason I could do that from memory |
| 09:19.30 | Dagmar | ;) |
| 09:19.34 | theorbtwo | I'm calm, Cairenn. Therefore, to generalize from a single example, everybody is calm. |
| 09:19.41 | Cairenn | As I just said to someone else - I wish everyone would step back and count to 10, then agree to disagree. if people have made up their minds, there is no way an argument is going to change it. |
| 09:19.41 | theorbtwo | ;) |
| 09:19.48 | Jamash | happiness is mandatory, citizen |
| 09:19.49 | Cairenn | spanks theorbtwo |
| 09:20.00 | mrpoundsign | I simply was pointing out your hypocrisy. |
| 09:20.06 | Arrowmaster | i used to know a few locations and exactly which irc servers on different networks were hosted on them |
| 09:20.08 | Jamash | hallo what? |
| 09:20.11 | theorbtwo | Yeah, Cairenn, right *there*. |
| 09:20.15 | theorbtwo | ducks. |
| 09:20.15 | Cairenn | ;) |
| 09:20.23 | |Jelly| | wow |
| 09:20.24 | Arrowmaster | since when one got attacked they all went down |
| 09:20.26 | |Jelly| | sexy teim! |
| 09:20.38 | Dagmar | Cairenn: I like to think that maybe in the meantime at least more kids will learn to take steps to not let the freaks find them |
| 09:20.44 | |Jelly| | Don't make me dig up old Blizzcon pictures, Cairenn! I think you know which one! :P |
| 09:20.46 | Jamash | Tell me how I have been hypocritical, in detail. |
| 09:20.46 | Cairenn | theorbtwo: be careful what you wish for, you may just get it *goes looking for her carriage whip* |
| 09:21.03 | harl | i totally agree on the racism and sexism argument |
| 09:21.20 | |Jelly| | Actually ... nevermind, I don't want to be banned. <3 |
| 09:21.20 | Jamash | rlscore |
| 09:21.20 | Dagmar | Arrowmaster: Those people were amateurs. :) |
| 09:21.30 | Dagmar | Arrowmaster: We liked being far, far more surgical about it. |
| 09:21.37 | mrpoundsign | Jamash: just saying that Eliune didn't take your opinion seriously, only thought about her own. But if I express an opposing opinion of yours, it's not met with a serious discussion but put-downs. This is the same thing. |
| 09:22.03 | *** join/#wowuidev Satisfyme (5da2300a@gateway/web/freenode/ip.93.162.48.10) |
| 09:22.24 | Jamash | I wasn't commenting on Eluna's sympathy for my viewpoint |
| 09:22.42 | Dagmar | Arrowmaster: Better to pinch just one connection, just hard enough, to stop what you want to stop, without anyone else experiencing service degradation |
| 09:22.48 | Jamash | I was commenting on her sympathy for the person who will be stabbed in the face due to RealID |
| 09:22.55 | mrpoundsign | aah I misunderstood your statement earlier, apparently. my apologies. :) |
| 09:23.00 | Eluna | Jamash: Haha, what? |
| 09:23.13 | Dagmar | Arrowmaster: Cuz you know.... if a link falls over on the internet, and no one's using it, does anyone really care |
| 09:23.17 | mrpoundsign | Jamash: he probably ninja'd an epic anyway. |
| 09:23.17 | Satisfyme | Hi all |
| 09:23.23 | Eluna | Can't you just call me "gay" or something, and get it done with? :P |
| 09:23.23 | |Jelly| | Jamash: If only one person gets stabbed though, it's ok ... apparently |
| 09:23.23 | |Jelly| | Hi |
| 09:23.32 | Dagmar | Eluria: You're Alliance? |
| 09:23.39 | Eluna | Very much for the horde. |
| 09:23.41 | *** mode/#wowuidev [+m] by Cairenn |
| 09:23.46 | Cairenn | As I just said to someone else - I wish everyone would step back and count to 10, then agree to disagree. if people have made up their minds, there is no way an argument is going to change it. |
| 09:23.57 | Cairenn | And since you can't count to 10 on your own, I'll do it for you |
| 09:23.59 | Cairenn | 1 |
| 09:24.03 | Cairenn | 2 |
| 09:24.06 | Cairenn | 3 |
| 09:24.09 | Cairenn | 4 |
| 09:24.12 | Cairenn | 5 |
| 09:24.15 | Cairenn | 6 |
| 09:24.17 | Cairenn | 7 |
| 09:24.20 | Cairenn | 8 |
| 09:24.22 | *** join/#wowuidev foxlit (~foxlit@0x573e6bae.alb2nxx18.dynamic.dsl.tele.dk) |
| 09:24.23 | Cairenn | 9 |
| 09:24.26 | Cairenn | 10 |
| 09:24.31 | *** mode/#wowuidev [-m] by Cairenn |
| 09:24.35 | |Jelly| | [404] |
| 09:24.35 | Eluna | Cairenn <3 |
| 09:24.39 | |Jelly| | oh |
| 09:24.39 | cbreak_work | I bet 10 in-game gold that there will be at least a 10% drop in traffic on the new forum |
| 09:24.41 | krka | plz stop the spamming Cairenn! |
| 09:24.47 | Jamash | Help, help, I'm being oppressed! |
| 09:24.50 | mrpoundsign | Cairenn: agreed. haha. and this likely isn't the right place for this discussion anyway. I just find it fascination what people think is important, including myself -- and I am happy to be wrong. :) |
| 09:24.57 | Mirrormn | You see him opressing me! |
| 09:24.59 | Mirrormn | wheeee |
| 09:25.00 | mrpoundsign | fascinating* |
| 09:25.04 | krka | imo, i think this has been a very calm discussion |
| 09:25.12 | Jamash | yeah |
| 09:25.38 | |Jelly| | Yeah ... I think I'm the only person who cursed. I blame it being 4am but really, it's just immaturity. |
| 09:25.51 | Dagmar | I blame violent video games. |
| 09:25.54 | Shirik | It's only 2:30 you are lying |
| 09:25.56 | Cairenn | To a degree, yes, but some of it was getting out of line, I just gave everyone a chance to calm back down, and to let you all be pissed off at me instead of each other :p |
| 09:26.00 | |Jelly| | HOLY HELL! SHIRIK! |
| 09:26.02 | Dagmar | The _language_ they use in APB. Oh my |
| 09:26.10 | |Jelly| | tackles Shirik and steals his wallet! |
| 09:26.11 | Shirik | I'm not actually here |
| 09:26.14 | Dagmar | Wait... was someone pissed? |
| 09:26.16 | mrpoundsign | yeah, I am not nearly ready to stab any of you yet :) |
| 09:26.22 | |Jelly| | Dagmar: I don't think so |
| 09:26.32 | Dagmar | I was thikning it was going pretty calmly, too |
| 09:26.41 | Cairenn | Not everyone was |
| 09:26.43 | |Jelly| | woah woah woah ... someone got mad at Cairenn? |
| 09:26.48 | Dagmar | I'd have given up trying to wrap my head around it otherwise |
| 09:26.53 | |Jelly| | Now /that/ will piss us off. :P |
| 09:27.05 | Cairenn | Regardless, now you are all nicely unified in going "WTF Cairenn?!?!" ;) |
| 09:27.14 | Cairenn | *grin* |
| 09:27.14 | Kalroth | Wtf Cairenn! |
| 09:27.18 | Dagmar | heh |
| 09:27.20 | theorbtwo | I'm more thinking "well done, Cairenn". |
| 09:27.31 | mrpoundsign | haha |
| 09:27.35 | |Jelly| | I'd be lying if I said I wasn't totally spamming you while you were counting. I'm sorry. :( |
| 09:27.37 | Maldivia | I'm more thinking... mmm, lunch time soon :P |
| 09:27.43 | Jamash | I'm thinking, "Where are my pants?" |
| 09:27.48 | |Jelly| | Me too, actually |
| 09:27.56 | Cairenn | Jamash: if you were enough of a regular, you'd know that I have them |
| 09:27.58 | |Jelly| | Had to puppy proof the place and don't remember where I put them. |
| 09:28.00 | Jamash | O_O |
| 09:28.05 | Kalroth | I'm saving it for when Cairenn goes to bed, can we agree to meet by then and duke it out?! |
| 09:28.15 | Cairenn | I run around the channel on a not irregular basis stealing everyone's pants |
| 09:28.18 | |Jelly| | Cairenn goes to bed? |
| 09:28.23 | Jamash | Cairenn doesn't sleep... she waits. |
| 09:28.23 | mrpoundsign | argh I should be working. :/ |
| 09:28.33 | Cairenn | |Jelly|: only if you make it worth my while |
| 09:28.37 | theorbtwo | Cairenn: You can steal my pants anytime, baby. ;) |
| 09:28.42 | Shirik | ! |
| 09:28.44 | mrpoundsign | Arrowmaster: you have my address yet? bring me some taco bell and I will hand you your $45.00 |
| 09:28.49 | |Jelly| | Cairenn: ... yeah, I got nothin |
| 09:28.55 | Kalroth | best pickup line |
| 09:28.55 | Cairenn | *grin* |
| 09:28.58 | |Jelly| | I do have the butt picture though! |
| 09:28.59 | Jamash | there's a taco bell just up the street from my house |
| 09:29.07 | Arrowmaster | mrpoundsign: im on the other side of the country |
| 09:29.15 | Cairenn | |Jelly|: lots of people have that, it's still up on the 'net |
| 09:29.20 | Cairenn | |Jelly|: /shrug :) |
| 09:29.25 | Arrowmaster | mrpoundsign: and playing RDR so no i dont have it yet |
| 09:29.25 | theorbtwo | Order him delivery pizza, COD. |
| 09:29.31 | theorbtwo | pizza hut has a web site. |
| 09:29.32 | mrpoundsign | oh. |
| 09:29.33 | Dagmar | Wait... there *might* be some thugs in Oakland we can hire |
| 09:29.39 | mrpoundsign | well, I live on Golden Oak Ct, if that helps. |
| 09:30.24 | |Jelly| | Thanks for making me feel like the regular guy that I am instead of the unique snowflake that I want. :( |
| 09:30.24 | harl | Dagmar: haha |
| 09:30.24 | Dagmar | Not sure if they'd fit into the budget tho |
| 09:30.24 | theorbtwo | Dagmar: Just tell them he's a friend of that transit cop. They'll beat him up free of charge! |
| 09:30.24 | Jamash | mmm, pizza |
| 09:30.24 | Cairenn | |Jelly|: <3 u anyway |
| 09:30.24 | Cairenn | ;) |
| 09:30.24 | Dagmar | I'm pretty sure there's thugs in Oakland tho. Hehe. (not going to hire any either) |
| 09:30.28 | Arrowmaster | do you think they would find it suspicious if all 33 Brian Nelson's in the bay area ordered pizza at the same time? |
| 09:30.31 | Dagmar | Went to a few parties there. Sketchy. |
| 09:30.38 | mrpoundsign | HAHAH! |
| 09:30.41 | Jamash | sounds like a standalone complex |
| 09:30.49 | mrpoundsign | if only 1 accepted it... |
| 09:30.52 | |Jelly| | And actually, I'm not sure that I have the link anymore. When I went from Windows to Linux full time, I forgot to move a lot of my bookmarks. :( |
| 09:31.20 | Dagmar | theorbtwo: That transit cop thing was just wrong |
| 09:31.21 | Jamash | you know, Linux is Xenu spelled backwards |
| 09:31.46 | Dagmar | Jesus... shootin' a guy you have pinned on the ground pacified? wtf |
| 09:31.49 | |Jelly| | Nevermind ... there it is |
| 09:31.54 | krka | > ("Linux"):reverse() |
| 09:31.57 | theorbtwo | Dagmar: The joke? Slightly. What the cop did? Very. |
| 09:32.02 | krka | lua> ("Linux"):reverse() |
| 09:32.02 | lua_bot | krka: xuniL |
| 09:32.06 | Jamash | curse your inferior earth alphabet! |
| 09:32.25 | Jamash | I mean, uh, look, a bunny. |
| 09:32.28 | theorbtwo | On the other hand, he *does* look very surprised afterward in the video, which is consistant with his story that he meant to taze the guy. |
| 09:32.29 | Dagmar | Oh I've no problem with the joke, although I think it would be a bit more dire |
| 09:32.51 | mrpoundsign | hehe, I really tried to get into lunix. landed at a happy medium with OSX between crappy corporate OS and good terminal app in the OS and ability to use opensource tools... but it's been getting worse since apple's focus has turned to consumer electronics. |
| 09:32.55 | Dagmar | theorbtwo: Cops aren't supposed to get so high they confuse their pistol with a taser |
| 09:32.57 | Jamash | there's a related thing on the internets to that |
| 09:33.29 | |Jelly| | Man, you mention Linux in here and it's like the dog from Up seeing a squirrel. |
| 09:33.30 | mrpoundsign | Dagmar: they're not SUPPOSED to but there is room for personal creativity on the job! |
| 09:33.37 | Dagmar | It didn't appear he even needed to tase the guy |
| 09:33.49 | |Jelly| | Anywho ... I'm off to go get my puppy. Take care all. |
| 09:33.50 | theorbtwo | Dagmar: Quite. |
| 09:34.01 | harl | what's unex |
| 09:34.13 | mrpoundsign | |Jelly|: I use ubuntu for all my servers. |
| 09:34.23 | Mirrormn | I keep meaning to hack my computer into running OS X |
| 09:34.23 | Dagmar | harl: It's when they take away an employee's huevos |
| 09:34.30 | mrpoundsign | I was just saying, as a desktop OS, it doesn't work well fro me. |
| 09:34.34 | mrpoundsign | for* |
| 09:34.37 | harl | Dagmar: ooh.. that one.. |
| 09:34.44 | harl | ok |
| 09:34.58 | Mirrormn | I stopped using linux because there is no ventrilo client =/ |
| 09:35.05 | Dashkal | I do all my real work in Ubuntu. Windows is for gaming |
| 09:35.07 | Dagmar | The *looks* I used to get from people |
| 09:35.09 | Dashkal | Mirrormn: mangler |
| 09:35.16 | mrpoundsign | mac is for gaming. hehe ;P |
| 09:35.16 | Mirrormn | also because the support for dual monitors was annoying |
| 09:35.22 | Dagmar | "No, I don't use Winows at home, I run eunuchs." <-- what they heard. |
| 09:35.27 | Dashkal | I actually prefer mangler to ventrilo. Wish it ran on windows |
| 09:35.41 | mrpoundsign | mangler? |
| 09:35.44 | Mirrormn | ooh, Mangler |
| 09:35.48 | Mirrormn | that looks promising |
| 09:35.49 | Dashkal | Mangler. Linux ventrilo client |
| 09:36.08 | Mirrormn | last time I tried to run WoW on Wine, it worked pretty well |
| 09:36.17 | mrpoundsign | I heard they are coming out with a vent client for android phones XD |
| 09:36.20 | Jamash | ok there's a penny arcade or vgcats or something where the guy walks up to a scientist and is all "not gonna set him on fire, not gonna set him on fire" and he sets him on fire |
| 09:36.22 | Dashkal | Just remember to run ogl and you're pretty much plug-n-play |
| 09:36.23 | mrpoundsign | *hugs his nexus one |
| 09:36.25 | Dagmar | It's out |
| 09:36.26 | theorbtwo | I run windows for the gaming, and debian under vmware inside of it for everything else. |
| 09:36.40 | harl | mrpoundsign: d'uh! |
| 09:36.50 | Dashkal | hmm, now that I actually have a modern cpu. I should play with virtualization again. |
| 09:36.56 | Dashkal | KVM will actually work! |
| 09:37.08 | Dagmar | VirtuaBox <-- easy mode |
| 09:37.24 | Mirrormn | now I guess my only other problem is |
| 09:37.27 | mrpoundsign | mmm, VirtualBox |
| 09:37.31 | mrpoundsign | that's what I use. |
| 09:37.45 | Dagmar | It was fairly self-explanatory |
| 09:37.46 | Mirrormn | my SSD is too small to install another operating system on =/ |
| 09:37.57 | Jamash | I used to use coLinux |
| 09:38.01 | Jamash | it's a bit funky thouh |
| 09:38.03 | Dagmar | Mirromn: There's probably something in your spam folder to fix that |
| 09:38.05 | mrpoundsign | wow I am going to try out mumble now. |
| 09:38.10 | Jamash | s/ou/oug/ |
| 09:38.17 | Mirrormn | Dagmar: what? |
| 09:38.22 | mrpoundsign | save myself some scratch on ventrilo server.... |
| 09:38.33 | Jamash | pokes purl |
| 09:38.33 | Dagmar | You know... ads... for people who have small disks and want bigger disks. |
| 09:38.40 | Mirrormn | -.- |
| 09:38.47 | harl | d'uh! |
| 09:38.48 | Shirik | is bored :( |
| 09:39.03 | Jamash | ~shirik |
| 09:39.04 | purl | methinks shirik is "If I had to sum up my life, I'd have to say, the one thing I hate doing is nothing." --Shirik |
| 09:39.12 | Shirik | ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^ |
| 09:39.14 | Dashkal | If you want to _host_ a server, there are better (technically) options than Vent. Vent tends to win simply because it's already dominant |
| 09:39.18 | Dagmar | Unless it's a 1Gb SSD card I Wouldn't be so sure there's not enough space left on it |
| 09:39.43 | Jamash | mumble seems pretty awesome from what I've read |
| 09:39.43 | Dashkal | I've heard really good things about Mumble |
| 09:39.53 | Jamash | problem is our guild already has a vent server |
| 09:40.00 | Jamash | so there's a certain amount of lock-in there |
| 09:40.00 | Dagmar | I heard really horrifying noises out of Mumble |
| 09:40.08 | Mirrormn | I've heard good things about TeamSpeak 3 |
| 09:40.16 | Dagmar | It's default config for Win7 was prone to being messed at first |
| 09:40.18 | Dashkal | Same deal. They just went and paid for vent hosting rather than looking into other options. |
| 09:40.24 | Satisfyme | Shirik: http://www.wowace.com/addons/gnome-run/ you could comment this :P |
| 09:40.26 | Jamash | there really ought to be a pure p2p voice system |
| 09:40.45 | Jamash | or, failing that, blizzard could make voice chat actually work well or something |
| 09:40.46 | mrpoundsign | yeah except P2P kills your internet connection. |
| 09:40.49 | Dagmar | Jamash: bandwidth problem |
| 09:41.01 | Dagmar | ...on both counts |
| 09:41.27 | Mirrormn | or http://www.wowace.com/addons/lkannounce/ |
| 09:41.49 | Dashkal | Related, vent also wins because that's about all you can find hosting for. |
| 09:41.58 | Dashkal | And you need a host for the bandwidth. |
| 09:41.58 | Shirik | Satisfyme? |
| 09:42.02 | Dagmar | There's mumble hosting |
| 09:42.04 | Dagmar | Cheap, too |
| 09:42.43 | Jamash | how much bandwidth does a voice server take per client, anyway? |
| 09:43.21 | Mirrormn | depends on codec |
| 09:43.21 | Satisfyme | yep |
| 09:43.54 | Dagmar | codec and quailty |
| 09:43.54 | Satisfyme | did you ask for me Shirik ? |
| 09:43.58 | Dagmar | er quality |
| 09:44.00 | Shirik | no, you asked for me |
| 09:44.52 | Dashkal | I hate it when companies refuse to put pricing online. I don't want to bloddy well call you unless I think I'll actually do business with you... |
| 09:45.01 | Jamash | hmm, the mumble faq says 58.8 kbit/s on default settings |
| 09:45.15 | Satisfyme | hehe I was refering to that you was bored. :P you coult comment that link I send before :) |
| 09:45.27 | Satisfyme | giving your opinion :P |
| 09:45.39 | Jamash | so, probably no hosting it on my adsl |
| 09:47.31 | *** join/#wowuidev Marla (~Marla@fabe.xs4all.nl) |
| 09:48.14 | harl | btw, SSD is for solid state disk/drive, not SD card |
| 09:48.46 | foxlit | Jamash: how much bandwidth does a voice server take per client, anyway? << Let's overshoot and say everyone gets a 64Kbps stream |
| 09:49.08 | foxlit | lua> 64/8*3600*24*31*25/(1024^3) |
| 09:49.08 | lua_bot | foxlit: 0.49889087677002 |
| 09:49.19 | harl | oO |
| 09:49.22 | Jamash | again referring to the mumble faq, they suggest one to three megabits |
| 09:49.48 | foxlit | For what, exactly? |
| 09:49.55 | Jamash | my adsl has about that much download, much less upload |
| 09:50.02 | Jamash | 20 users, 2 speaking at once |
| 09:50.24 | foxlit | lua> 64*20 |
| 09:50.25 | lua_bot | foxlit: 1280 |
| 09:50.31 | Jamash | my guild has 2 10-man groups so that's a reasonable estimate |
| 09:50.32 | foxlit | Close enough. |
| 09:51.53 | harl | "bandwidth" doesn't equal "traffic" though |
| 09:52.06 | foxlit | Context. |
| 09:52.15 | Jamash | yes, bandwidth is technically incorrect to use as "bits per second" |
| 09:53.03 | Mirrormn | why? |
| 09:53.17 | Jamash | bandwidth is an analog measurement |
| 09:53.25 | Jamash | bits per second is digital |
| 09:53.50 | foxlit | I'm afraid wikipedia redefined that word for you. |
| 09:53.53 | Mirrormn | erm |
| 09:54.01 | foxlit | or, rather, while you weren't looking :) |
| 09:54.11 | Jamash | oh snap |
| 09:54.13 | Mirrormn | how is bandwidth analog? |
| 09:54.45 | Arrowmaster | it has always been |
| 09:54.58 | Kalroth | wat |
| 09:55.03 | *** join/#wowuidev Adys (~Adys@unaffiliated/adys) |
| 09:55.04 | Arrowmaster | the correct term for what people call bandwidth is throughput |
| 09:55.10 | Kalroth | http://searchenterprisewan.techtarget.com/sDefinition/0,,sid200_gci211634,00.html |
| 09:55.40 | Jamash | bandwidth originally referred to the actual frequency width of a electromagnetic signal |
| 09:55.59 | Kalroth | wikipedia even says "Bandwidth has several related meanings" |
| 09:56.10 | Kalroth | Bandwidth (computing) or digital bandwidth: a rate of data transfer, throughput or bit rate, measured in bits per second (bps) |
| 09:56.11 | Kalroth | Bandwidth (signal processing) or analog bandwidth, frequency bandwidth or radio bandwidth: a measure of the width of a range of frequencies, measured in hertz |
| 09:56.34 | Dagmar | I don't know about you guys, but my voice is still analog. |
| 09:56.42 | Jamash | using bandwidth to mean throughput is still technically incorrect |
| 09:56.45 | Arrowmaster | just because everybody uses it incorrectly doesnt mean you get to change the definition |
| 09:56.53 | Jamash | it's common usage, but it's incorrect |
| 09:57.06 | Kalroth | Arrowmaster: So most of the American language is incorrect? :) |
| 09:57.30 | Arrowmaster | i incorrectly use it all the time but i still acknowledge its incorrect |
| 09:57.45 | Jamash | you can get a dramatically different amount of data via the same amount of bandwidth depending on your noise, encoding, transmission conditions, equipment, etc. |
| 09:57.50 | foxlit | Jamash: it's in the dictionary. |
| 09:57.56 | Jamash | so's your mom |
| 09:58.00 | Kalroth | haha |
| 09:58.14 | foxlit | While you can protest technical correctness all you like, it's unfortunately not what defines usage. You hacker. |
| 09:58.23 | Mirrormn | Arrowmaster: At a certain point, that's exactly what it means |
| 09:58.25 | Arrowmaster | Kalroth: you cant just redefine technical terms and still have them be technical terms |
| 09:58.27 | Jamash | I said already that it's common usage |
| 09:58.40 | Jamash | but, nonetheless, incorrect |
| 09:58.46 | Kalroth | Arrowmaster: So once something technical is coined once, it sticks |
| 09:58.58 | Mirrormn | you can redefine technical terms if their accepted meaning changes within the specific communities that actually use those terms technically |
| 09:59.10 | Arrowmaster | once it jumps from technical term to buzzword |
| 09:59.12 | Arrowmaster | we play bingo |
| 09:59.20 | mrpoundsign | Arrowmaster: hmm, actually, I think it's throughput capacity |
| 09:59.32 | Arrowmaster | it is |
| 09:59.54 | Mirrormn | I'd agree with you if like ISPs still considered "bandwidth" to be referring to electromagnetic signals |
| 10:00.08 | Mirrormn | but I doubt that's the case |
| 10:00.35 | Arrowmaster | Mirrormn: use the term bandwidth with a cable technician and see what he thinks you are talking about |
| 10:00.52 | Dagmar | He'll know exactly what you're talking about. |
| 10:01.00 | Mirrormn | can it be a cable technician installing cable internet? |
| 10:01.27 | Jamash | can it be larry the cable guy? |
| 10:01.31 | Jamash | 'cause I doubt he knows |
| 10:01.39 | Mirrormn | I'm not saying that the old definition has to be thrown out |
| 10:01.41 | Arrowmaster | just because their customer service and marketing departments are filled with mindless lemmings doesnt mean everybody at an ISP doesnt know the proper usage |
| 10:01.55 | Arrowmaster | the old definition is still used! |
| 10:02.06 | Mirrormn | just that the new definition seems persasive enough to the point that it is valid |
| 10:02.10 | Arrowmaster | you cant just throw it out |
| 10:02.13 | Mirrormn | many many words have multiple definitions |
| 10:02.32 | Arrowmaster | but you still cant just throw out the old definition |
| 10:02.52 | Mirrormn | [06:01] <Mirrormn> I'm not saying that the old definition has to be thrown out |
| 10:03.07 | Jamash | I like how AT&T says I don't have the "optimal experience" for playing online games with a 3 mbit/s connection |
| 10:03.19 | Dagmar | Why *can't* you exactly |
| 10:03.33 | Jamash | find me a game that requires more than 3M down / 150k up |
| 10:03.35 | Arrowmaster | reading on this screen is so hard |
| 10:03.37 | Mirrormn | well you could throw the old definition out if nobody used it anymore |
| 10:03.48 | Mirrormn | Jamash: How about that new OnLive service |
| 10:03.55 | Dagmar | Every coder on the planet knew one kilobyte to be 1,024 bits, until some damn MBAs and English majors got involved |
| 10:03.59 | Mirrormn | where they actually stream video of the game to you |
| 10:04.04 | Arrowmaster | Jamash: easy, try any of the many console games that dont use dedicated servers |
| 10:04.08 | Jamash | Mirrormn: I don't believe in unicorns. |
| 10:04.19 | Jamash | Arrowmaster: good point |
| 10:04.25 | Mirrormn | I'm pretty sure OnLive is up and operational now |
| 10:04.36 | mrpoundsign | hehe murmur server created! woo |
| 10:04.46 | Jamash | I'm pretty sure Voldemort extended his lifespan by drinking the blood of a unicorn. |
| 10:05.03 | Mirrormn | no, he just created a terrible torn existence |
| 10:05.04 | Mirrormn | duhhhh |
| 10:05.53 | *** join/#wowuidev cbreak_work (~cbreak@drz-wizzer.drz.ethz.ch) |
| 10:07.01 | Jamash | what happens when you run shadow labyrinth while chatting on a murmur server |
| 10:07.37 | Mirrormn | Jamash: Vuvuzelas |
| 10:07.42 | Mirrormn | somehow |
| 10:07.43 | Jamash | fu |
| 10:08.08 | *** join/#wowuidev Legorol (~legorol@catv-80-99-38-36.catv.broadband.hu) |
| 10:08.08 | *** mode/#wowuidev [+v Legorol] by ChanServ |
| 10:08.52 | Jamash | oh man oh man oh man engineer update |
| 10:09.01 | Jamash | when will I have time to play all these games |
| 10:12.47 | *** join/#wowuidev Legorol (~legorol@catv-80-99-38-36.catv.broadband.hu) |
| 10:12.47 | *** mode/#wowuidev [+v Legorol] by ChanServ |
| 10:15.16 | mrpoundsign | I actually have an OnLive account, and it works. |
| 10:15.28 | mrpoundsign | except, my mouse doesn't work with it. |
| 10:15.36 | mrpoundsign | I played some lego star wars, tho. |
| 10:24.42 | mrpoundsign | wow and Mangler on android actually works haha |
| 10:24.51 | mrpoundsign | that's really freaky. |
| 10:26.14 | Cairenn | runs around the channel stealing everyone's pants/slacks/trousers/jeans/skirts/shorts/kilts/whathaveyou then gives every indication of going to bed |
| 10:27.39 | *** join/#wowuidev Guardix (~Martin@0x5da165ee.hinqu1.dynamic.dsl.tele.dk) |
| 10:27.40 | Dagmar | Valve Anti-Cheat technology in Moonbase Alpha |
| 10:27.42 | Dagmar | WHY |
| 10:29.35 | Dagmar | This game needs better failure states. |
| 10:32.13 | harl | wants interplanetary internet |
| 10:32.32 | Dagmar | If you take too long to fix the oxy generators, people should be gasping into mics |
| 10:32.34 | harl | i wanna finally chat with my extraterrestrial friends that badly. |
| 10:32.38 | Dagmar | Begging you to work faster. |
| 10:33.33 | Dagmar | "Jim... when you go back home.... do one thing for me... Take a moon rock... to my kid... He should... should have something... to remember his father bye... *pant* *pant*" |
| 10:34.11 | harl | thick air |
| 10:34.19 | Dagmar | No. No air. |
| 10:34.39 | harl | well. yes. ultimately. |
| 10:35.00 | Dagmar | The scenario is the foolish scientists couldn't be bothered to compress some brick and protect the oxygen generators, which are now all full of holes because of some meteorites. |
| 10:35.24 | Dagmar | herl: I'm talking about http://store.steampowered.com/app/39000/ |
| 10:35.38 | Maldivia | Tell me how I'm supposed to breathe with no air... :P |
| 10:36.08 | Dagmar | If it takes you longer than a rather short pile of minutes to complete, everyone dies |
| 10:36.17 | harl | i knew you were talking about that game ;) |
| 10:36.26 | Dagmar | Hah okay |
| 10:36.35 | Dagmar | I was just startled at how sterile the thing is |
| 10:36.49 | Dagmar | "Bob, can we get a status update on that repair' |
| 10:37.31 | Dagmar | I wanted to respond "Hey guys, guess what. I didn't even _look_ at the manual. Breathe shallow, this might take awhile" |
| 10:37.47 | Kalroth | "I'm not really Bob." |
| 10:38.12 | harl | actually, i think i might be startled by how sterile a planet without an amosphere (or a very thin one) could seem to me. |
| 10:38.26 | Dagmar | THe entire thing is also just the one crater. |
| 10:38.28 | harl | haven't gotten onto one yet though |
| 10:38.44 | harl | *atmosphere, actually |
| 10:38.53 | Dagmar | I thought I was going to go hop in the rover and look around, sort of a different view of Google's moon map, but... NOPE. |
| 10:38.55 | harl | d'uh |
| 10:39.01 | Dagmar | Our old friend, the invisible wall. |
| 10:39.30 | *** join/#wowuidev Fierceflame (~timo.meij@ip231-37-173-82.adsl2.static.versatel.nl) |
| 10:39.49 | harl | hehe |
| 10:42.15 | harl | invisible wall always give me this feeling of the game being an incomplete piece of work in progress and someone just put those walls up to prevent me from actually seeing this. |
| 10:42.22 | *** join/#wowuidev Legorol (~legorol@catv-80-99-38-36.catv.broadband.hu) |
| 10:42.22 | *** mode/#wowuidev [+v Legorol] by ChanServ |
| 10:42.58 | Dagmar | I was thinking "It's the freaking MOON. We have lots and lots of pictures of it. Enough to easily make the map a little bigger than the one crater |
| 10:49.03 | harl | anyway, even without any pictures forehand, it's kind of up to the creativity of the artists and programmers to do more than just adding some building blocks and leaving the basic 'chroma key' lattice surroundings untouched. |
| 10:49.11 | Eluna | First question I'm met with when I enter wow.answers.wikia.com "How long is my penis?" |
| 10:49.15 | Eluna | So many jokes, so little time.. |
| 10:50.34 | harl | whoa. funny question. |
| 10:51.11 | Eluna | Right? :P |
| 10:51.15 | harl | yea. |
| 10:53.19 | *** join/#wowuidev Schnaks (~Schnaks@p4FC4BDEB.dip.t-dialin.net) |
| 10:54.24 | Eluna | Fun, just found out that a wow place I registered at gave away my e-mail to a spammer.. :P |
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| 11:12.18 | Kaso | Why all spammers dont cleanse +tags yet i dont know |
| 11:14.34 | harl | they want to get caught, blackmailed, sued and humped down. |
| 11:14.47 | foxlit | Kaso: Those addresses are probably a drop in the ocean. |
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| 12:08.37 | *** join/#wowuidev airtonix (~airtonix@unaffiliated/airtonix) |
| 12:15.38 | airtonix | hi i am from romania and am looking for some realid |
| 12:16.52 | *** join/#wowuidev Schnaks (~Schnaks@p4FC4FAB8.dip.t-dialin.net) |
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| 12:28.18 | *** part/#wowuidev zespri_home (zespri@unaffiliated/zespri) |
| 12:28.22 | fiphi | http://www.cad-comic.com/cad/20100707 |
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| 12:36.57 | Arrowmaster | Dagmar: but we only have pictures of one side! |
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| 13:06.37 | *** join/#wowuidev Lopeppeppy (~Lopeppepp@141.222.29.18) |
| 13:06.37 | *** mode/#wowuidev [+v Lopeppeppy] by ChanServ |
| 13:07.54 | alestane | Tag! |
| 13:08.02 | Lopeppeppy | Oh noes. |
| 13:08.06 | Lopeppeppy | Help. |
| 13:08.10 | Lopeppeppy | runs in circles happily |
| 13:08.55 | fiphi | Haha, like a dog with the tongue out? |
| 13:09.20 | Lopeppeppy | Um... maybe something not so flattering. |
| 13:09.51 | alestane | doesn't run away very fast. |
| 13:14.36 | *** join/#wowuidev Odlaw (ozzy@c-98-245-3-204.hsd1.co.comcast.net) |
| 13:19.29 | alestane | From the Lua mailing list: "Maybe it is just my age, but this entire discussion sounds a lot like trying to do nasty things to the language to protect inexperienced people from shooting themselves in the foot. Which is an activity bound to fail due to fools being so ingenious." |
| 13:20.45 | *** join/#wowuidev digmouse_ (~chatzilla@111.193.193.112) |
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| 13:30.59 | Maldivia | time for weekend |
| 13:33.33 | Kraps | what does that even mean? |
| 13:34.08 | Maldivia | which part of it |
| 13:34.17 | Kraps | not you |
| 13:35.09 | Maldivia | alestanes quote from mailimglist then? |
| 13:35.37 | Kraps | yes |
| 13:35.59 | Arrowmaster | whats not to get? |
| 13:36.05 | alestane | There's a tussle on the mailing list about whether Lua's handling and declaration of globals ought not to change. |
| 13:37.04 | Arrowmaster | have they changed the plans again? |
| 13:38.08 | airtonix | everyone agrees with the terms outlined in red here ? http://imagebin.org/index.php?mode=image&id=104660 |
| 13:39.48 | Maldivia | no? |
| 13:40.02 | Maldivia | :) |
| 13:42.17 | airtonix | FUUUUU |
| 13:42.20 | airtonix | why not |
| 13:42.35 | alestane | Not environments, Arrowmaster, but mostly the fact that any unrecognized token is treated as a global reference. |
| 13:43.12 | *** join/#wowuidev Adys (~Adys@unaffiliated/adys) |
| 13:43.40 | smcn | cooldown timer bar recommendations... GO! :P |
| 13:43.46 | Maldivia | always called them radio button |
| 13:44.48 | Maldivia | (and checkbox) |
| 13:45.44 | Maldivia | http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Radio_button |
| 13:45.57 | airtonix | Maldivia, yes the thing on the right is the radio button |
| 13:46.03 | airtonix | and on the left is the checkbox |
| 13:46.25 | airtonix | ohh you Maldivia |
| 14:07.31 | *** join/#wowuidev A-KO (~ako@neo.maryland2600.org) |
| 14:10.00 | Kraps | http://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af103/Animati/Facebook.gif |
| 14:13.06 | airtonix | who is the evil guy ? |
| 14:15.50 | alestane | It's a Zero Wing reference, airtonix. |
| 14:16.10 | airtonix | all your base are belong to me ? |
| 14:16.25 | Kraps | yes |
| 14:16.43 | airtonix | but clearly the evil guy has had recent facial surgery |
| 14:16.55 | Kraps | airtonix: its kotic |
| 14:16.58 | Kraps | er |
| 14:17.07 | Kraps | kotick? |
| 14:17.12 | Kraps | yeah |
| 14:17.26 | airtonix | haha |
| 14:17.41 | airtonix | things that defined the end of my career : |
| 14:17.50 | airtonix | shaman nerfs |
| 14:17.52 | airtonix | realid |
| 14:19.17 | airtonix | isn;t that how it goes? mediocrity is defined by its downfall not its highlights ? |
| 14:19.47 | Mirrormn | is it considered poor coding practice to assume that your lua files will necessarily load in the order you put them in your .toc? |
| 14:19.48 | airtonix | i mean the good deeds |
| 14:19.59 | airtonix | Mirrormn, yes |
| 14:20.13 | Kraps | airtonix: thing is, i'll never understand people who quit because of a mechanic change, disappointment yes but no change has ever been gamebreaking. this affects RL and is a whole other situation |
| 14:20.23 | Mirrormn | I was afraid of that =/ |
| 14:20.37 | airtonix | Mirrormn, always test that 1 == 1 |
| 14:20.43 | alestane | ToC loading order is supposed to be consistent. |
| 14:20.46 | Mirrormn | -.- |
| 14:21.04 | airtonix | <evil grin> |
| 14:21.09 | Mirrormn | h8 |
| 14:21.24 | alestane | But if you aren't sure you can rely on it, put links to the files in an XML file and load that from your ToC. |
| 14:22.16 | Mirrormn | how would that be better? |
| 14:22.37 | Ackis | lol blizzardPR: Calling us the BP of the Video Game industry is a harsh and a falsehood. We only want to spill your names, not oil |
| 14:23.52 | bediko | ackis: http://asnowstormbyanyothername.blogspot.com/ |
| 14:25.01 | *** join/#wowuidev nicoli_s (~nsinkule@69.73.16.202) |
| 14:25.01 | *** mode/#wowuidev [+v nicoli_s] by ChanServ |
| 14:25.37 | Ackis | shrugs |
| 14:25.57 | Ackis | I'm only following the Real ID stuff for the humor |
| 14:28.17 | Kraps | bediko: i just read the name correctly, nice |
| 14:28.45 | bediko | :D |
| 14:32.30 | airtonix | btw |
| 14:32.31 | Ackis | https://greyshades.wordpress.com/2010/07/08/an-open-letter-to-blizzard/ amusing for the pictures/rant about internet dragons |
| 14:32.42 | airtonix | i walked into a store selling HTC desires today |
| 14:33.00 | airtonix | and in about 4 presses installed android scripting environment |
| 14:33.03 | airtonix | and python |
| 14:33.04 | airtonix | and lua |
| 14:33.28 | airtonix | on a demo machine |
| 14:33.45 | airtonix | s/machine/phone/ |
| 14:33.59 | Mirrormn | wow |
| 14:34.08 | airtonix | did you know ASE gives you a working bash terminal ? |
| 14:34.09 | Mirrormn | that's a real useful bot function |
| 14:34.49 | airtonix | yesyes |
| 14:34.55 | airtonix | its 2010 |
| 14:37.48 | Kraps | know whats cool? TotalBiscuit, who was against the armory changes because of "privacy", is in favor of realid |
| 14:38.34 | Ackis | heh |
| 14:40.01 | Ackis | http://img594.imageshack.us/img594/7513/avatarsonicbody.png <-- I need my avatar to look like that |
| 14:41.32 | Shirik | I don't |
| 14:42.19 | Ackis | GET IN MY VAN shirik |
| 14:42.23 | Shirik | noty |
| 14:42.47 | Kraps | <PROTECTED> |
| 14:45.15 | Kraps | wtf http://www.prnewswire.com/news-releases/play-anonymous-play-gamersfirst-98027674.html |
| 14:47.28 | nicoli_s | haha thqats awesome ackis |
| 14:49.18 | Kraps | finally http://www.penny-arcade.com/comic/2010/7/9/ |
| 14:51.48 | *** join/#wowuidev pompy (~Mike@c-68-32-133-69.hsd1.nj.comcast.net) |
| 14:59.23 | *** join/#wowuidev Kalroth (kalroth@d40aa413.rev.stofanet.dk) |
| 15:02.56 | *** join/#wowuidev malreth (~triti@wireless-128-62-145-226.public.utexas.edu) |
| 15:04.49 | harl | what the.. http://img.chan4chan.com/img/2009-11-08/192927Bogo-gone-wrong.gif |
| 15:05.57 | malreth | harl: NO! NEVAR AGAIN! |
| 15:06.30 | airtonix | veil has the same letters as evil |
| 15:07.36 | harl | well observed, watson. |
| 15:07.44 | harl | malreth: lol.. |
| 15:08.41 | Maldivia | anyone watched Futurama last night? |
| 15:09.20 | nicoli_s | i wish i did, got home right as it was over |
| 15:12.52 | Kraps | <PROTECTED> |
| 15:13.03 | Kraps | <PROTECTED> |
| 15:13.35 | *** join/#wowuidev Odlaw (ozzy@c-98-245-3-204.hsd1.co.comcast.net) |
| 15:13.46 | Ackis | mourns Kraps |
| 15:14.02 | Maldivia | nicoli_s: if I say prop ∞ and "a storm is coming" :) |
| 15:14.11 | Kraps | join me in death https://greyshades.wordpress.com/2010/07/08/an-open-letter-to-blizzard/ |
| 15:14.28 | Ackis | 08:32Ackishttps://greyshades.wordpress.com/2010/07/08/an-open-letter-to-blizzard/ amusing for the pictures/rant about internet dragons |
| 15:14.37 | Ackis | only 45 minutes too late Kraps |
| 15:15.02 | airtonix | haha kraps |
| 15:15.04 | Kraps | long respawn times :( |
| 15:15.17 | Maldivia | s/coming/gathering/ |
| 15:17.27 | nicoli_s | if anyone here likes david cross, they should check out "the increasingly poor decisions of todd margaraet" |
| 15:17.30 | nicoli_s | very very funny |
| 15:18.09 | krka | he's awesome as tobias anyway |
| 15:18.14 | krka | thought his standup was so so |
| 15:21.26 | Ackis | apparently there's a Civ 5 special edition :'( |
| 15:21.33 | Ackis | I pre-ordered the normal off of steam already |
| 15:21.49 | nicoli_s | i liked his older standup |
| 15:22.15 | nicoli_s | his thing about people who use the word literally when they mean the exact opposite is fucking great |
| 15:22.37 | krka | yes, that's literally the funniest thing ever |
| 15:23.03 | krka | http://xkcd.com/725/ |
| 15:24.05 | nicoli_s | "oh my god, he literally grew wings and ascended to heaven just to catch the ball!" |
| 15:25.34 | krka | my eyes literally start to bleed when people misuse the word literally :/ |
| 15:28.18 | Lopeppeppy | arranges a transfusion. |
| 15:29.07 | TC-Work | "WinRAR supports files and archives up to 8,589 billion gigabytes in size." i wonder if they actually tested it |
| 15:29.13 | TC-Work | XD |
| 15:30.43 | *** join/#wowuidev Vangual (~bah@pdpc/supporter/active/vangual) |
| 15:34.23 | Maldivia | TC: hopefully not on extra strong compression setting |
| 15:34.29 | Ackis | https://cheezfailbooking.files.wordpress.com/2010/07/funny-facebook-flavored-con.png flavoured condoms make your babies smell like strawberries... |
| 15:35.14 | Kraps | ~ping |
| 15:35.15 | purl | ~pong |
| 15:35.27 | Kraps | hmm |
| 15:35.35 | Kraps | ~ping |
| 15:35.36 | purl | ~pong |
| 15:36.48 | Kraps | my connection is too slow for pandora |
| 15:37.35 | *** join/#wowuidev Kaso (~Kaso@host217-42-54-44.range217-42.btcentralplus.com) |
| 15:38.16 | *** join/#wowuidev Lunessa (~Lunessa@WoWUIDev/Lunessa) |
| 15:38.29 | Lunessa | station |
| 15:38.58 | malreth | Lunessa: Wanna learn to be a bartender? There's an app for that. http://nimblestrong.com/ |
| 15:39.06 | Lopeppeppy | Morning, Lunessa. |
| 15:39.25 | Lunessa | malreth: I keel yooou! |
| 15:39.44 | *** join/#wowuidev Bartlomehus (~Michel@wetering.xs4all.nl) |
| 15:40.27 | malreth | it doesn't play so well on my 3G... i needs a new phone |
| 15:40.37 | Lopeppeppy | I'll take the old one. :P |
| 15:40.40 | Lunessa | malreth: I have a 3G too. |
| 15:42.47 | Lunessa | ooo... new growl... |
| 15:44.31 | Lopeppeppy | what growl? |
| 15:45.00 | Lopeppeppy | Hallelujah, the AC has been fixed! I may be in an endurable office by Monday! |
| 15:45.12 | Lunessa | Growl is a Mac application for handling notifications. It's delicious, and I wish Windows had a similar tool. |
| 15:45.37 | Lopeppeppy | Ah, Growl-program! When it wasn't capitalized I assumed you were cranky about something. |
| 15:46.13 | PProvost | Lunessa: http://www.growlforwindows.com/gfw/ |
| 15:46.18 | Lunessa | I can always be grumpy about something. Sometimes it's just nice to be mildly happy about something. |
| 15:47.02 | Lunessa | PProvost: Now that's delicious. |
| 15:47.28 | PProvost | No more grumpy! |
| 15:47.30 | PProvost | Yay! |
| 15:47.45 | Ackis | Real ID - The Terminator found Sarah Connor by killing every other Sarah Connor in the phone book. |
| 15:48.01 | Kraps | saw that yesterday |
| 15:49.32 | *** join/#wowuidev kd3 (~kd3@wikia/kaydeethree) |
| 15:50.01 | PProvost | Lunessa: there is also Snarl for windows |
| 15:50.05 | PProvost | Samey same -ish |
| 15:50.58 | Lunessa | I really need to poke around and see more of the deliciousness that people have crafted. I recently found Synergy+ and I'm getting ready to install it here at work. |
| 15:51.13 | PProvost | I <3 Synergy++ |
| 15:51.32 | PProvost | I've got three machines (2 OSs) and 4 surfaces in front of me right now |
| 15:51.36 | PProvost | But I use it all like one |
| 15:52.16 | Lunessa | I'm going to install it here to control my Windows 7 box (and its VMs) and my iMac - reducing my desk clutter is important to me. |
| 15:52.33 | PProvost | same |
| 15:52.54 | cog|away | alestane: http://scienceblogs.com/pharyngula/2010/07/friday_cephalopod_lovely.php |
| 15:54.52 | Ackis | http://kotaku.com/5582893/blizzard-is-the-pixar-of-the-video-game-world |
| 15:55.44 | *** join/#wowuidev pompy (~Mike@c-68-32-133-69.hsd1.nj.comcast.net) |
| 15:55.53 | airtonix | http://kotaku.com/55823822/ackis-is-still-banned-from-wow |
| 15:56.20 | cog|work | shakes his fist at "don't use for more than 3 days" on the Afrin label |
| 15:56.39 | malreth | you don't let a bottle tell you what to do, cog|work |
| 15:56.40 | cog|work | chuckles at airtonix |
| 15:56.52 | cog|work | malreth: no, i let the science behind the label do that -_- |
| 15:56.59 | malreth | cog|work: you tell that label that you're no one's bitch. |
| 15:57.11 | cog|work | apparently if you use it for more than a few days you end up getting "rebound" congestion |
| 15:57.14 | Kraps | airtonix: "You were redirected to our front page because the URL you requested is unavailable. Please try again later." :9 |
| 15:57.17 | airtonix | Lunessa, windows does have a growl clone |
| 15:57.20 | Kraps | :( |
| 15:57.28 | airtonix | Lunessa, so does linux |
| 15:57.30 | cog|work | but it's soooooooo good while it lasts |
| 15:58.13 | malreth | Lunessa: if you have a fancy multi-touchy wireless apple mouse, install synergy server on the mac and slave the windows 7 box to it |
| 15:58.26 | airtonix | Kraps, damn they must have deleted it before you reached it |
| 15:58.33 | Ackis | http://bit.ly/awV03S does this mean that when I go to the movies, they're going to tell which people are in which movie theatre? |
| 15:58.42 | Lunessa | I use a trackman wheel on both machines. |
| 15:59.06 | airtonix | resizing windows on macs makes me rage |
| 15:59.14 | malreth | Lunessa: then it won't matter. synergy can't make heads or tails of momentum scrolling |
| 15:59.15 | airtonix | at least windows has taekwindow |
| 16:00.30 | *** join/#wowuidev nicoli_s (~nsinkule@69.73.16.202) |
| 16:00.30 | *** mode/#wowuidev [+v nicoli_s] by ChanServ |
| 16:00.34 | airtonix | i mean apple is the company that has released the ipad and they are still in the 50's on resizing windows.... |
| 16:00.45 | airtonix | fss get with the multitouch biatch |
| 16:02.07 | malreth | i think in the 50s, one had to swap out vacuum tubes to resize windows |
| 16:02.50 | Lunessa | I think in the 50s it took a skill-saw and carpentry. |
| 16:03.44 | malreth | touché |
| 16:08.41 | *** join/#wowuidev Osagasu (~Creek@67-197-1-37.rh1.dyn.cm.comporium.net) |
| 16:11.24 | malreth | A useful tip in here for the ladies: http://www.scientificamerican.com/blog/post.cfm?id=one-reason-why-humans-are-special-a-2010-06-22 |
| 16:16.19 | *** join/#wowuidev Dewin (~Daniel@c-71-59-222-35.hsd1.or.comcast.net) |
| 16:17.50 | *** join/#wowuidev Dagmar (1000@c-98-193-180-167.hsd1.tn.comcast.net) |
| 16:17.53 | *** join/#wowuidev Dagmar (1000@unaffiliated/dagmar) |
| 16:19.12 | TC-Work | ~cackle |
| 16:19.13 | purl | ACTION cackles |
| 16:19.13 | Lunessa | malreth: That makes me think of the scene from Dogma. |
| 16:19.45 | alestane | 'Sa cuttlefish, cog|work. |
| 16:22.42 | *** join/#wowuidev Cide (~Andre@hus110a.bobbnet.com) |
| 16:22.42 | *** mode/#wowuidev [+v Cide] by ChanServ |
| 16:23.19 | Kraps | tl;dr |
| 16:23.49 | malreth | you mean to say you got bored halfway through and decided to rub one out? |
| 16:24.08 | cog|work | the author apparently hasn't heard of bonobos |
| 16:24.11 | TC-Work | i never did really like dogma |
| 16:26.15 | Lopeppeppy | Love that movie |
| 16:27.40 | nicoli_s | i liked it |
| 16:28.27 | Maldivia | malreth: well, the author did suggest halfway through to "rub one out" :) |
| 16:28.42 | malreth | Maldivia: i never got that far... |
| 16:29.03 | Maldivia | "Go on, put this article aside, take a five minute break and put my challenge to the test (...)" |
| 16:29.05 | Lunessa | malreth: Just the scene at the Mooby Burger where they discuss masturbation. |
| 16:29.20 | TC-Work | malreth: well if you do get that far then you to can rub one out |
| 16:29.46 | Kraps | plays a game to get his mind clear of realid |
| 16:30.20 | malreth | Kraps: i recommend World of Warcraft. it's a new MMO from the makers of Starcraft |
| 16:30.46 | Kraps | :( |
| 16:31.03 | TC-Work | and D3 |
| 16:31.06 | TC-Work | err..D2 |
| 16:33.25 | Kraps | Bejeweled Twist |
| 16:33.37 | TC-Work | i enjoy that game |
| 16:33.46 | TC-Work | it quite mindless |
| 16:33.49 | TC-Work | it's* |
| 16:33.57 | Kraps | i think i'm getting the hang of it |
| 16:34.07 | Kraps | only took 3 days :/ |
| 16:34.07 | TC-Work | it's all about speed |
| 16:34.31 | TC-Work | i dont even bother using the purchaseable powers |
| 16:34.39 | TC-Work | just speed |
| 16:34.51 | Kraps | ? |
| 16:35.14 | TC-Work | elaborate please |
| 16:35.28 | nevcairiel | so you need to be on speed to play it? |
| 16:35.29 | TC-Work | oh, nvm |
| 16:35.37 | TC-Work | i am thinking of bejewled blitz |
| 16:35.47 | TC-Work | but yes, i like twist as well |
| 16:35.52 | Kraps | looks that up |
| 16:36.04 | *** join/#wowuidev Kazie (Kazie@188.114.185.143) |
| 16:36.27 | TC-Work | and no, i dont use the FB integration |
| 16:36.39 | TC-Work | mutters darkly about that |
| 16:37.09 | Kraps | hmm its not on steam |
| 16:37.41 | Kraps | You'll need to be logged in to Facebook to play |
| 16:37.45 | Kraps | wut |
| 16:38.36 | *** join/#wowuidev Srosh (~Srosh@d019145.adsl.hansenet.de) |
| 16:39.13 | TC-Work | no you dont |
| 16:39.21 | Kraps | where do you play it then TC-Work? |
| 16:39.25 | TC-Work | it just lets you track things if you are |
| 16:39.31 | TC-Work | umm...at home |
| 16:39.37 | malreth | i... just had tourists come by to take pictures of one of my computer labs... o_o |
| 16:39.39 | Kraps | ... |
| 16:39.49 | TC-Work | it is its own program |
| 16:39.51 | Kraps | did you buy it on amazon? |
| 16:39.58 | TC-Work | it simply lets you log into FB from it |
| 16:40.02 | TC-Work | i didnt buy it |
| 16:40.09 | TC-Work | *hit hit* |
| 16:40.15 | Lunessa | malreth: And they own that likeness of you forever! muwahahaha! |
| 16:40.15 | TC-Work | errr...*hint hint* |
| 16:40.21 | Kraps | mk |
| 16:40.42 | Kraps | it looks kinda like twist |
| 16:41.18 | TC-Work | no twisting involved however |
| 16:41.27 | TC-Work | and it has achievements! |
| 16:41.33 | TC-Work | that are a pain in the ass |
| 16:41.39 | TC-Work | but i have nothing better to do |
| 16:44.45 | Lunessa | Penny Arcade weighed in. http://www.penny-arcade.com/ - I'm probably late, but I wanted to read all the links before I said anything. |
| 16:45.04 | TC-Work | the one with the troll? |
| 16:45.26 | Kraps | no that was cad |
| 16:47.37 | Lopeppeppy | I l ike that Penny Arcade roundup, Lunessa, thanks. |
| 16:47.55 | Lopeppeppy | My non-WoW friends were quizzing me over dinner about why this all mattered. It was... interesting debate. |
| 16:52.29 | malreth | http://www.penny-arcade.com/comic/2004/03/19/ does pretty much sum me up in a single graphic |
| 16:54.06 | *** join/#wowuidev Fisker (3e3d8ed1@gateway/web/freenode/ip.62.61.142.209) |
| 16:54.10 | Fisker | TODAY IS A GLORIOUS DAY |
| 16:54.21 | malreth | Fisker: you got a beta key? |
| 16:54.26 | Kraps | no Fisker |
| 16:54.29 | Fisker | nope malreth |
| 16:54.40 | malreth | Fisker: then this day continues to suck for you |
| 16:54.43 | Fisker | they decided to back down on the real id included in forum posts |
| 16:55.09 | malreth | what a buncha pussies they are |
| 16:55.22 | Vangual | <3 pussies. |
| 16:55.34 | Ackis | http://bit.ly/8XqHM7 |
| 16:55.42 | Ackis | anyone who talks about Real ID will be banned |
| 16:55.49 | Ackis | or something like that |
| 16:56.43 | Trela | http://forums.worldofwarcraft.com/thread.html?topicId=25968987278&sid=1 |
| 16:57.03 | foxlit | "However, when we launch the new StarCraft II forums that include these new features, you will be posting by your StarCraft II Battle.net character name + character code, not your real name. The upgraded World of Warcraft forums with these new features will launch close to the release of Cataclysm, and also will not require your real name. " |
| 16:57.11 | Fisker | so that was probably like 100000 posts it took to reverse the decision :P |
| 16:57.19 | Lopeppeppy | Oh, poor Neth, to have to post that. |
| 16:57.24 | Kraps | no way! |
| 16:57.42 | *** join/#wowuidev Caleb| (~caleb@5400E9DD.dsl.pool.telekom.hu) |
| 16:58.00 | Lopeppeppy | I don't see any reversal, Fisker. |
| 16:58.02 | malreth | well thank goodness... now i don't have to worry about shitfucks googling my real name and finding out that I live at 11160 Jollyville Rd, Apt 903, Austin TX 78759 |
| 16:58.06 | Lopeppeppy | Oh. |
| 16:58.08 | Lopeppeppy | Oh! |
| 16:58.10 | Lopeppeppy | can't read! |
| 16:58.18 | Vangual | Mike Morhaime probably didn't want to disclose his real na.. oh wait |
| 16:58.21 | Lunessa | malreth: You moved! |
| 16:58.21 | Lopeppeppy | does a very very happy dance |
| 16:58.32 | alestane | Why can't Lopeppeppy read? |
| 16:58.32 | Fisker | well of course you can say that they will attempt this again a few years down the line |
| 16:58.50 | Maldivia | Kraps: told you, within a day! |
| 16:58.56 | alestane | Or they may attempt it again if the forums are still a steaming pile of rabbit turds. |
| 16:59.04 | alestane | Three days, Kraps. |
| 16:59.17 | Kraps | tips his hat to Maldivia and smiles |
| 16:59.25 | Fisker | alestane it still doesn't work |
| 16:59.35 | *** join/#wowuidev durcyn (~durcyn@WoWUIDev/Durcyn) |
| 17:00.03 | Kraps | whats a Battle.net character name + character code? |
| 17:00.36 | nicoli_s | its their name, plus the code to friend them without their email |
| 17:00.46 | Fisker | ^^ |
| 17:00.53 | Trela | Kraps: Say you chose "Kraps" as your SC2 name. SC2 would display you as Kraps.code with the code it generated. |
| 17:00.56 | Maldivia | Kraps: when you log in the first time on SC, you're asked to enter a name |
| 17:00.59 | Fisker | Basically in the start of the SC2 beta it was something you decided |
| 17:01.06 | Fisker | For example Nick.Identifier |
| 17:01.15 | Fisker | Then they went to Nick.(Hidden identifier) |
| 17:01.17 | Ackis | I want my code to be 69 |
| 17:01.22 | Fisker | Now it's just Nick.(Predetermined identifier) |
| 17:01.32 | nicoli_s | and the identifiert is only shown some times |
| 17:01.59 | *** join/#wowuidev Fierceflame (~timo.meij@ip231-37-173-82.adsl2.static.versatel.nl) |
| 17:02.03 | cog|work | that thread gained 7 pages since you posted that link |
| 17:02.26 | cog|work | make that 8 |
| 17:02.27 | alestane | How many of those posts are basically "Woohoo!" |
| 17:02.43 | Fisker | It's a great day |
| 17:02.44 | cog|work | "i win.. back to trolling" |
| 17:02.45 | Kraps | so in the new forums post-cata, its Kraps.<rand#> on every char? |
| 17:02.45 | alestane | or "Awesome, you listen to us!" |
| 17:02.58 | Fisker | unfortunately i have my doubts about it :/ |
| 17:03.04 | Lopeppeppy | I have that album, alestane. Very rare. |
| 17:03.18 | alestane | Album? |
| 17:03.26 | Lopeppeppy | "Y can't Tori Read" |
| 17:03.32 | Lunessa | All I can say is that it least they didn't just blindly go ahead and ruin forum use for me. |
| 17:04.18 | alestane | I'm pretty sure they're still planning to unify forum identities. Just for the moment they're not unifying them under your general-purpose name. |
| 17:04.33 | alestane | I'm lost, Lopeppeppy. Come lead me out? |
| 17:04.57 | Fisker | they should alestane |
| 17:05.22 | Fisker | I have no problem with a display, even one that shows all my characters |
| 17:05.25 | Fisker | display name |
| 17:05.59 | Kraps | oh its Mike Morhaime himself |
| 17:06.06 | alestane | I do stand by the notion that a move is not automatically bad just because it is unpopular...but I also think that real names were probably not a critical requirement to their stated goal. This is probably the best outcome, but we'll see what happens. |
| 17:06.15 | alestane | That's the Man, Kraps. |
| 17:06.45 | alestane | Mike's awesome. |
| 17:07.11 | Lopeppeppy | It's a rare Tori Amos album, alestane. I have it. :) |
| 17:07.37 | Lunessa | http://epicwinftw.com/2010/07/08/awesome-photos-science-is-awesome/ |
| 17:07.39 | alestane | What does it have to do with you not being able to read? |
| 17:08.09 | Kraps | wow Lunessa |
| 17:08.13 | alestane | I'm not terribly thrilled about Tori Amos, although I suspect that has little to do with her or her music, and more to do with a college friend's slavering obsession over her. |
| 17:08.17 | Kraps | is that real? |
| 17:08.46 | Lunessa | alestane: Tori Amos - I too had a fetish for her, until she hooked up with Trent Reznor. |
| 17:08.48 | Lopeppeppy | I didn't see the one line in that post at first, which said, "we're not posting names" |
| 17:09.22 | alestane | The only time I ever heard her perform, she played a pack of cover songs, including "House of the Rising Sun" and "Smells Like Teen Spirit" (very strange as a solo piece with piano). |
| 17:09.34 | alestane | It was odd for someone who was legendary as a singer-songwriter. |
| 17:09.37 | *** join/#wowuidev Jamash (~chatzilla@99-92-174-69.lightspeed.iplsin.sbcglobal.net) |
| 17:10.00 | Kraps | someone pointed out "we've decided *at this time* that real names will not be required" |
| 17:10.13 | alestane | It's an ongoing experiment, Kraps. |
| 17:10.30 | Jamash | wow they actually listened |
| 17:10.44 | alestane | You sound like that's strange, Jamash. |
| 17:11.11 | alestane | Good companies are not slaves to user feedback, but they do consider it. And Blizzard is a very good company. |
| 17:11.40 | Jamash | It seemed to me that this change was so obviously dumb that they wouldn't have even announced it unless they had some really compelling reason |
| 17:11.47 | *** join/#wowuidev sioraiocht (~tomh@unaffiliated/sioraiocht) |
| 17:12.04 | Jamash | and there was a chance (not a certainty) that that reason would override community feedback |
| 17:12.19 | Jamash | so anyway I'm glad they listened |
| 17:12.25 | alestane | I think demands that the forums not change at all would have been overriden. |
| 17:12.30 | Jamash | yeah |
| 17:12.44 | alestane | But the feedback was overwhelmingly focused on a point not as core to their goal. |
| 17:13.09 | alestane | And enough of it came from people who were reasoning it out instead of just going "Aaaaahhhh!" |
| 17:13.33 | alestane | Also, I doubt they expected the extremity of the response when they made the announcement. |
| 17:14.50 | Satisfyme | Should: UIDropDownMenu_GetSelectedValue(frame), not be the one to use when I want to get the value of a bropdown menu?? I always get a nil value |
| 17:15.13 | Kraps | problem is alestane, with all the quotes flying around and this very debacle, no one knows what the hell their goal *is* |
| 17:15.35 | alestane | Well, they've stated a few: |
| 17:15.53 | Jamash | time to go post "thank you" and reactivate my recurring billing |
| 17:15.55 | alestane | Promote constructiveness on the forums by making it easier to ignore obstructive people; |
| 17:15.57 | *** join/#wowuidev bediko (~chatzilla@ip-88-152-253-127.unitymediagroup.de) |
| 17:16.22 | alestane | Strengthen Battle.net and their games as tools for people to build gaming communities; |
| 17:16.41 | Jamash | hahaha http://forums.worldofwarcraft.com/thread.html?topicId=25968987278&sid=1&pageNo=30#595 |
| 17:16.48 | alestane | ...and, um, not sure if there's a third thing. |
| 17:16.57 | Kraps | if they thought that real names is the only solution to that they have some very stupid people in there |
| 17:17.09 | Kraps | the trolling |
| 17:17.16 | Jamash | provide for the common defense, promote the general welfare, and secure for ourselves and our posterity the blessings of something something |
| 17:17.22 | A-KO | Kraps: The big question is: How many people posting on the wow forums also play Farmville/Mafia Wars/etc on FB? |
| 17:17.26 | A-KO | probably quite a few |
| 17:17.36 | Jamash | well, I know two people who do |
| 17:17.56 | alestane | If they thought it was the only solution, Kraps, they wouldn't be backing down on it. |
| 17:17.57 | Jamash | and I am extremely glad that facebook lets me block the incessant nattering from their facebook games |
| 17:18.22 | A-KO | Jamash: That has nothing to do with it. If you install an application on FAcebook--whether it's a game, app, or something else--it has full access to your profile, and your friends' profiles. |
| 17:18.29 | Jamash | so, how long till official farmville addon |
| 17:18.43 | A-KO | Which means if you have friends playing Mafia Wars/Farmville, then they also have access to your data that you've shared to your friends-only. |
| 17:18.45 | alestane | And honestly, when attempting to effect change, it is often useful to start by attempting something big. |
| 17:18.56 | Jamash | A-KO yeah, facebook has major issues |
| 17:19.19 | wereHamster | blizz backed off of displaying the realid name in the forums? |
| 17:19.21 | A-KO | Jamash: And yet so many millions of people continue to use it, and probably a good AT LEAST 10-20% of the people biching on the WoW forums have installed at least SOMETHING to their FB profile. |
| 17:19.28 | Kraps | A-KO: is there a bigger chance of getting harassed because of Farmville or killing someone in pvp? |
| 17:19.36 | Jamash | alestane: I don't want to derail into politics but that's one thing that bugged me about healthcare reform, that they didn't start big enough |
| 17:19.41 | A-KO | Kraps: The chance exists no matter what--there is no larger chance or smaller chance. |
| 17:19.45 | Kraps | or posting as a girl on the forums |
| 17:19.49 | alestane | Several of them tried, Jamash. |
| 17:19.50 | *** join/#wowuidev ZorbaTHut (tocohl@173-228-13-9.dsl.static.sonic.net) |
| 17:20.13 | Kraps | or being of a certain race/sexuality |
| 17:20.23 | Jamash | I actually am a mexican jew lizard |
| 17:20.32 | A-KO | Kraps: If someone posts as a girl on the forums, they cannot get harassed. One of the key elements understanding here is that those people posting the informati on on Blizzard's employees ALSO know where they live, something that the RealID won't post--but people assume as a result of working for Blizzard Entertainment. |
| 17:20.35 | alestane | Because a substantial portion of the nation and Congress reacted to the idea of a "public option" about the same way the Blizzard forum public reacted to "real names required to post." |
| 17:20.39 | A-KO | Those employees are already at a disadvantage to you. |
| 17:20.40 | *** join/#wowuidev Cide (~Andre@hus110a.bobbnet.com) |
| 17:20.40 | *** mode/#wowuidev [+v Cide] by ChanServ |
| 17:20.51 | alestane | Your father was a hebrew iguana, Jamash? |
| 17:20.55 | Jamash | sure, why not |
| 17:21.48 | Jamash | secure the blessings of liberty, that was it |
| 17:21.58 | alestane | Oh dear gods...there's a Forsaken outpost where the Hiriwatha trolls used to be in the Hinterlands, and the innkeeper is a four-foot high abomination named Bitsy. |
| 17:22.03 | Jamash | THEY CAN TAKE OUR ADDON REVENUE |
| 17:22.09 | Jamash | BUT THEY'LL NEVER TAKE OUR FREEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEDOM |
| 17:22.13 | A-KO | haha alestane, yeah. |
| 17:22.23 | Jamash | alestane: are u srs |
| 17:22.34 | alestane | Completely, Jamash. |
| 17:22.34 | Jamash | that is amazingly awesome |
| 17:22.39 | Jamash | piiiiiiiiiiiics |
| 17:22.40 | Kraps | A-KO: using the procces of elimination, many people can be found |
| 17:24.19 | Lunessa | Here I am in Tiajuana ,eating barbecued iguana. |
| 17:24.35 | Jamash | that iguana was my uncle! how dare you! |
| 17:24.42 | Lunessa | mmmm... tasty |
| 17:24.48 | malreth | Lunessa: you insensitive clod! |
| 17:25.09 | Lunessa | Well, it sure made a hell of a sandwich |
| 17:25.25 | Jamash | the new google interface annoys me |
| 17:25.44 | Jamash | where is my image search |
| 17:26.03 | Jamash | or is it not ssl enabled yet? |
| 17:26.26 | PProvost | Assume this was posted here already but in case it wasn't: http://forums.wow-europe.com/thread.html?topicId=13816839821&sid=1 |
| 17:28.11 | Maldivia | PProvost: yes, I've already claimed my victory :P |
| 17:28.31 | nevcairiel | At least they decided fast |
| 17:28.36 | Jamash | weeeeeeeeeee are the champioooooooooooons |
| 17:29.07 | Maldivia | nevcairiel: didn't I say within a day yesterday (and yeah, changed it to within a week) |
| 17:29.57 | nevcairiel | I thought you meant the idiots complaining would see the error in their ways |
| 17:30.44 | nevcairiel | which would obviously never happen |
| 17:30.47 | A-KO | Keep in mind: As far as Blizzard's concerned (versus your personal information)--each of their employees was already disadvantaged to you, as their employer + general living area would have already been known, which is what made it "easy" to find the "specific" person that was being talked about on those forums. |
| 17:30.51 | A-KO | It'll definitely come back, in time. |
| 17:30.59 | A-KO | And by that time most people won't care/bother with it |
| 17:31.04 | A-KO | It'll be a few years though |
| 17:31.10 | Jamash | now let's go back to bitching about the new talent system |
| 17:31.15 | A-KO | I love it Jamash |
| 17:31.17 | nevcairiel | bitching? its teh awesome |
| 17:31.18 | A-KO | I think it's great |
| 17:31.26 | Maldivia | it looks really cool |
| 17:31.29 | Jamash | I'm just saying if we're going to bitch about something that should be it |
| 17:31.30 | malreth | Jamash: Shut yo mouth... new talents are awsome |
| 17:31.41 | Jamash | I'm cautiously optimistic about it |
| 17:31.47 | Jamash | I think it needs some tweaking though |
| 17:32.01 | Satisfyme | Have anyone of you worked with DropDown menu before ? |
| 17:32.04 | *** join/#wowuidev Seerah (~Ryan@c-98-251-190-189.hsd1.tn.comcast.net) |
| 17:32.04 | *** mode/#wowuidev [+o Seerah] by ChanServ |
| 17:32.05 | Jamash | like, I don't appreciate being locked in to one tree until level 70 |
| 17:32.25 | nevcairiel | As long as the talents are worth taking, i'm all for it |
| 17:32.39 | alestane | My only changes based on what they've said so far, are that 1) I would require that you have more talents in your spec tree than outside it, rather than being trapped in it until 70; and 2) It's unclear whether you MUST take the 31 point talent to move on, or only spend 31 points in the tree overall. |
| 17:32.41 | Maldivia | Jamash: in most cases, you stay in one tree till you're at the bottom anyway |
| 17:32.48 | Jamash | I really like the idea that you get a "signature" ability at level 10 |
| 17:32.55 | alestane | Unlesss you play a druid, Maldivia. |
| 17:33.03 | nevcairiel | alestane: imho it was pretty clear that it just said 31 points spend, not the 31 point talent |
| 17:33.17 | alestane | Except for one line in the recap, nevcairiel. |
| 17:33.25 | nevcairiel | which was that? |
| 17:33.32 | Jamash | water elemental at 10, woo |
| 17:34.06 | Jamash | alestane: exactly, every druid has to put points in resto (as things stand) |
| 17:34.14 | nevcairiel | today, sure |
| 17:34.17 | nevcairiel | wait until you see new trees |
| 17:34.21 | Jamash | they'll have to make omen of clarity baseline or something |
| 17:34.21 | alestane | Because it's REALLY hard to pass up Omen of Clarity. |
| 17:34.27 | Lunessa | Satisfyme: Several people have. I haven't. None of my projects needed one. |
| 17:34.37 | nevcairiel | They already said omen is a problem talent |
| 17:34.46 | alestane | "They'll have a 31-point tree to work down, with each talent being more integral and exciting than they have been in the past. Once they spend their 31'st point in the final talent (at level 70), the other trees open up and become available to allocate points into from then on." |
| 17:34.48 | Jamash | Satisfyme: I've only used easymenu |
| 17:34.52 | nevcairiel | either putting it way up for everyone to reach, or making it baseline for resto only |
| 17:35.16 | alestane | That's not authoritative, but it IMPLIES that you might have to get the cap talent. |
| 17:35.36 | nevcairiel | They surely want that everyone takes the 31 |
| 17:35.43 | nevcairiel | but i dont think they force you |
| 17:35.54 | alestane | Talent trees are cupposed to be about cool choices, though, as they say. |
| 17:35.54 | nevcairiel | but we'll see |
| 17:36.14 | alestane | So saying "You WILL get this talent" seems to go against that. |
| 17:36.19 | Jamash | I wonder what the hunter signature abilities will be |
| 17:36.21 | nevcairiel | Yeah main design idea is that you are free to choose, and have not many baseline have-to-have talents |
| 17:36.29 | alestane | But I'm only unhappy about that if that's actually how it turns out to work. |
| 17:36.36 | Lunessa | I think another sub-goal is to prevent people from making really bad talent tree decisions. |
| 17:36.44 | Jamash | True enough |
| 17:36.53 | Jamash | like putting equal points in every tree |
| 17:36.57 | nevcairiel | they explicitly said that, Lunessa :) |
| 17:36.58 | *** join/#wowuidev ZorbaTHut (tocohl@173-228-13-9.dsl.static.sonic.net) |
| 17:36.58 | alestane | Or eliminate the really bad decisions in the first place. |
| 17:37.04 | Lunessa | Ghostcralwer as much as said so :) |
| 17:37.07 | *** join/#wowuidev Proditor (~Proditor@c80-217-71-99.bredband.comhem.se) |
| 17:37.37 | alestane | Personally, I would still like to see a little more room for hybrid specs, but given the design constraints, I can deal with that. |
| 17:38.14 | nevcairiel | hybrids have sucked since way back, honestly |
| 17:38.32 | alestane | If I had to spend at least 21 of my 41 points in my primary tree, and always have more there than in other trees, I would be happy with that, but I'm aware that hybrids are predominantly regarded as dilution rather than variety these days. |
| 17:38.50 | Jamash | yeah |
| 17:38.54 | Kraps | http://kotaku.com/comment/25735903/ |
| 17:39.13 | Jamash | nice |
| 17:39.25 | nevcairiel | (btw, if you spend 21 in one tree, you'll always have more in that then in the others, no need for the second clause :p) |
| 17:39.59 | Jamash | until level cap gets raised to 90 |
| 17:40.09 | nevcairiel | sure, this is all assuming 41 points |
| 17:40.26 | alestane | Sure there is, nevcairiel, unless you also say they have to put those 21 points into that tree before they go outside. |
| 17:40.38 | Jamash | in my D&D game our GM has house ruled in that you get extra feats but they have to be assigned to "non-combat" feats |
| 17:40.48 | *** join/#wowuidev smcn (smcn@c-174-52-104-121.hsd1.ut.comcast.net) |
| 17:40.57 | Jamash | I'd kind of like a tree of combat talents and a tree of non-combat talents |
| 17:41.05 | Jamash | but the talent system is complicated enough already |
| 17:41.33 | A-KO | the talent system is getting so much simpler |
| 17:41.35 | A-KO | it's gonna be awesome |
| 17:41.39 | A-KO | in fact, this will further help leveling |
| 17:41.42 | A-KO | that's a pretty HUGE change |
| 17:41.45 | Jamash | medium glyphs should be interesting |
| 17:42.13 | Jamash | yes, leveling will be soooooooo much easier with the "signature" abilities at 10 |
| 17:42.17 | A-KO | THe whole idea of "specialization" will drastically help with leveling, I always hated that aspect of talents where it didn't *REALLY* matter until later levels. |
| 17:42.30 | A-KO | because all the shit was like 20 points down anyway |
| 17:42.48 | A-KO | Jamash: in addition to abilities scaling at every level |
| 17:42.48 | nevcairiel | yah, some classes that heavily rely on those talents, like ret paladins, will be alot more fun |
| 17:42.50 | A-KO | I can't wait to play with it |
| 17:43.00 | Jamash | I might actually level a warrior or rogue |
| 17:43.03 | A-KO | they need to hurry up and do this shit on the beta already.. |
| 17:43.14 | Jamash | which I haven't to date because warriors and rogues are meh at low levels |
| 17:43.19 | nevcairiel | They said its all done and all, coming in the next push |
| 17:43.39 | *** join/#wowuidev Thaoky (Thaoky@22.228-244-81.adsl-dyn.isp.belgacom.be) |
| 17:43.44 | alestane | Scholomance and Dire Maul now 40-45. |
| 17:43.45 | Cairenn|afk | yay victory! |
| 17:43.52 | Jamash | cool beans |
| 17:44.10 | alestane | I'm not sure it was victory, Cairenn. But yay compromise. |
| 17:44.16 | Kraps | hugs Cairenn|afk |
| 17:44.19 | A-KO | it'll come back :) |
| 17:44.22 | Jamash | hey that means that you can do the warlock mount quest again |
| 17:44.26 | alestane | Victory isn't necessarily what anyone's after. |
| 17:44.33 | Jamash | I think it was victory |
| 17:44.52 | alestane | Victory implies that they wanted one thing, we wanted something else, and we won. |
| 17:44.56 | Cairenn|afk | well, victory in that they aren't (at least at this time) going ahead with requiring real names |
| 17:45.08 | A-KO | Keep in mind, RealID is a new feature entirely--as time goes on, people will become more accustomed to handling out their real name information on a less stringent basis overall. You'll realID friend guildies that you just want to keep in touch with and so forth. |
| 17:45.20 | A-KO | So they'll reintroduce it in a few years, after everyone's already accustomed to giving it out anyway |
| 17:45.23 | A-KO | Just like FB :P |
| 17:45.35 | alestane | I think this was strenuous collaboration. |
| 17:45.37 | Jamash | I will continue to only realid friend people I already know in real life |
| 17:45.39 | Cairenn|afk | and, good morning |
| 17:45.45 | Jamash | alestane: negotiations with a lightsaber? |
| 17:45.48 | Kraps | [01:44:34]<A-KO>it'll come back <--- lets worry about that then k? |
| 17:45.52 | A-KO | Jamash: A vast majority of people probably won't do that over the course of the next few years. |
| 17:46.07 | malreth | shares BBQ with Cairenn |
| 17:46.12 | Jamash | for example, one of our raid leaders is /super annoying/ |
| 17:46.29 | Jamash | I'm not going to make it so he can annoy me while I'm playing sc2 |
| 17:46.40 | Mirrormn | ooh |
| 17:46.43 | alestane | But I think it's good too, Cairenn. I just don't like framing it in such a confrontational way. I don't think that was their goal either. |
| 17:46.47 | Jamash | BBQ tofu, I hope |
| 17:46.51 | Mirrormn | they caved in to popular demand on realID forums? |
| 17:46.55 | Mirrormn | linky? |
| 17:47.24 | Lunessa | I suggested that Dual Talent Spec be moved to 30 with this change. |
| 17:47.31 | Jamash | http://forums.worldofwarcraft.com/thread.html?topicId=25968987278&sid=1 |
| 17:47.40 | Mirrormn | thanks Jamash |
| 17:47.41 | alestane | They agreed that it was not a sufficiently necessary step at this time to justify overriding the objections, Mirrormn. |
| 17:48.02 | Jamash | doesn't really matter what level dual talent spec is so long as it costs 1000g |
| 17:48.27 | Cairenn | alestane: will this suit better? "Yay! Common sense prevails!" |
| 17:48.38 | alestane | Sure, Cairenn. |
| 17:48.46 | Jamash | talk about a "hybrid tax" |
| 17:48.50 | alestane | snuggles with Cairenn. |
| 17:48.59 | malreth | is Cairenn a meaty or a veggie? |
| 17:49.10 | Cairenn | huggles alestane |
| 17:49.15 | Kraps | Cairenn: "but its not a big deal hurrrrrrr /falls over" |
| 17:49.17 | Jamash | Want to heal and dps or tank at low levels? You better have an 80! |
| 17:49.37 | Mirrormn | haha |
| 17:49.37 | alestane | I think as long as it isn't artificially sweetened she's pretty much good with it, malreth. |
| 17:49.39 | Mirrormn | it |
| 17:49.42 | Lopeppeppy | Carienn is carnivorous! |
| 17:49.47 | Mirrormn | is like New Coke -> Classic Coke |
| 17:49.53 | Mirrormn | everybody loves Blizzard now |
| 17:50.14 | *** join/#wowuidev ZorbaTHut (tocohl@173-228-13-9.dsl.static.sonic.net) |
| 17:50.22 | malreth | thinks about sugar-free BBQ |
| 17:50.26 | Kraps | Mirrormn: which is the wrong attitude |
| 17:50.32 | alestane | They've said the same thing about changing class balance...it's generally better to overcorrect and then nerf back bit by bit as needed. |
| 17:50.35 | Mirrormn | well... kind of |
| 17:50.50 | Jamash | Mirrormn: I was thinking about new coke the past few days |
| 17:50.54 | alestane | Doesn't have to be sugar-free, malreth, just no fake sugar. |
| 17:50.56 | Mirrormn | I dunno, I think I wanted them to go through with it purely out of curiosity |
| 17:51.12 | malreth | alestane: i understand... i was just thinking about it |
| 17:51.13 | Seerah | cheers re. RealID forums |
| 17:51.18 | Mirrormn | since I never post on the forums anyway |
| 17:51.20 | Kraps | "Mike is a pretty cool guy. He pwns where needs be and doesn't afraid anything." |
| 17:51.28 | Mirrormn | it wouldn't really have affected me personally |
| 17:52.10 | Jamash | Oh yeah, I'd have been fascinated to see it go live, but I don't want to see the social experiment enough to want them to ruin the forums with it. |
| 17:52.42 | Jamash | I think making it optional (Like Amazon.com does) would be ok |
| 17:52.52 | Jamash | except that might lead to "post on your realid noob" |
| 17:53.02 | Mirrormn | that would be wonderful |
| 17:53.13 | Jamash | bbl work time |
| 17:53.27 | Jamash | oh btw starcraft II beta phase 2 is up |
| 17:53.59 | Lopeppeppy | yay beta! |
| 17:54.09 | cog|work | Shirik: halp |
| 17:54.11 | NeoTron | my account is not working |
| 17:54.14 | NeoTron | says I'm out of play time |
| 17:54.26 | Mirrormn | now's about the time of day when I realize I have about 25 browser tabs open -.- |
| 17:54.54 | *** join/#wowuidev Audible (~jon@212.20.222.174) |
| 17:55.33 | alestane | Tarren Mill looks much more "undeady" now. |
| 17:55.54 | NeoTron | Mirrormn: only? |
| 17:56.13 | NeoTron | vertical tab bar, organized in a tree makes many tabs work |
| 17:56.25 | NeoTron | my tab usage is entirely incompatible with a "chrome" style design |
| 17:57.02 | Kraps | "The original post was updated to accurately reflect features of the new community site and forums. "conversation threading" was inaccurate as a forum feature, but will be available in other commenting systems." |
| 17:57.19 | Kraps | WHAT other commenting systems? |
| 17:57.31 | Mirrormn | Twowter |
| 17:57.44 | Kraps | :) |
| 17:58.04 | Mirrormn | oh man, that gives me an idea for an addon |
| 17:58.09 | malreth | EPIC WIN: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AmKwF_Si734 |
| 17:58.21 | Mirrormn | that spams all your realid friends with notices whenever you do the most mundane things in game |
| 17:59.02 | Seerah | Mirrormn: there's already one for leveling and achievements |
| 17:59.22 | Ackis | writes the RealAFKPooping addon. |
| 17:59.27 | Mirrormn | I'm thinking much more satirical and mundane than that |
| 18:00.06 | Mirrormn | @Seerah Mirrored has been inspected by someone in Orgrimmar! #epicgears |
| 18:00.29 | Mirrormn | actually it should probably have much worse spelling than that |
| 18:01.13 | Ackis | https://twitter.com/WarcraftPets/status/18136811287 w00t |
| 18:01.19 | Ackis | yeah but people care when I poop |
| 18:01.29 | Ackis | on a side note I had red beets for dinner |
| 18:01.38 | malreth | Ackis: i have a real life pet named after arthas |
| 18:02.48 | Ackis | Murky would kick his ass! |
| 18:02.49 | *** join/#wowuidev Funkeh` (~funk@WoWUIDev/WoWAce/Ace3/BigWigs/funkeh) |
| 18:02.57 | Seerah | Mirrormn: unfortunately, there's no way to tell when you've been inspected by someone ;) |
| 18:03.07 | *** join/#wowuidev Cralor` (~Chris@c-75-68-70-97.hsd1.ma.comcast.net) |
| 18:03.08 | Ackis | has a cat named Murky and a cat named Nefy after Nefarian |
| 18:03.24 | Mirrormn | no problem, it could just spam it randomly |
| 18:03.26 | malreth | http://www.flickr.com/photos/fizzboy/2238755262/ |
| 18:03.29 | Mirrormn | no one would know the difference |
| 18:03.46 | Ackis | that's Arthas? |
| 18:03.55 | malreth | Ackis: aye |
| 18:04.50 | malreth | http://www.flickr.com/photos/fizzboy/522129836/ |
| 18:05.16 | Ackis | adorable :) |
| 18:05.23 | *** join/#wowuidev bediko (~chatzilla@ip-88-152-253-127.unitymediagroup.de) |
| 18:05.35 | malreth | Ackis: thanks! what'd you think of the cat, though? |
| 18:06.09 | Ackis | lol :P |
| 18:06.31 | Lunessa | ARTHAS! |
| 18:06.33 | Seerah | Ackis: did you see this one of his? http://www.flickr.com/photos/fizzboy/467137692/in/set-72157600173231983/ |
| 18:06.57 | Ackis | lol awww |
| 18:07.08 | malreth | Seerah, Ackis: http://www.flickr.com/photos/fizzboy/465768587/ |
| 18:07.18 | Seerah | :D |
| 18:07.31 | Ackis | aww |
| 18:08.53 | Ackis | my critters are all here http://www.facebook.com/album.php?aid=53566&id=512851685 |
| 18:08.55 | Ackis | 4 cats and a dog |
| 18:09.27 | malreth | Ackis: facebook hates me and says no pics for me |
| 18:10.02 | Seerah | oh - he was going to kill you with that stare: http://www.facebook.com/album.php?aid=53566&id=512851685#!/photo.php?pid=1320831&id=512851685 |
| 18:10.09 | Ackis | it should be open for everyone |
| 18:10.19 | Ackis | haha Seerah |
| 18:11.33 | Ackis | ttp://www.facebook.com/album.php?aid=53566&id=512851685&l=3de9140d91 |
| 18:11.34 | malreth | http://skitch.com/fizzboy/dm46e/facebook-content-not-found |
| 18:11.36 | Ackis | http://www.facebook.com/album.php?aid=53566&id=512851685&l=3de9140d91 |
| 18:11.37 | *** join/#wowuidev Odlaw (ozzy@c-98-245-3-204.hsd1.co.comcast.net) |
| 18:11.45 | malreth | ah... that works, Ackis |
| 18:11.50 | Ackis | my bad |
| 18:12.54 | Ackis | Chantelle gave the dog a bad about a month ago, he got away from her and ran to me (jumped on my lap) for protection |
| 18:14.58 | Lunessa | Really, I should get a camera. |
| 18:15.36 | Ackis | I should warn you, there's a picture of a dead hamster in my hands (or almost dead, can't remember) and a picture of two cat anuses (tagged with my nieces for the lulz) :P |
| 18:20.54 | *** join/#wowuidev Odlaw (ozzy@c-98-245-3-204.hsd1.co.comcast.net) |
| 18:21.41 | *** join/#wowuidev alestane (~alestane@c-66-30-209-28.hsd1.ma.comcast.net) |
| 18:21.41 | *** mode/#wowuidev [+v alestane] by ChanServ |
| 18:21.44 | malreth | Unicorn chaser alert: http://www.boingboing.net/2010/06/30/dog-fish-wriggle-aft.html |
| 18:22.35 | Kaso | its the salt |
| 18:22.44 | Kaso | and lemon |
| 18:23.01 | malreth | salt + aluminum foil + lemon juice = ZOMBIE FISH FROM HELL |
| 18:23.24 | Dagmar | ...and, it'll recharge your watch |
| 18:24.06 | Dagmar | malreth: o.O I wouldn't be eating that |
| 18:24.27 | alestane | Or you could do like Alton Brown and build an incandescent pickle. |
| 18:28.31 | Lopeppeppy | alton brown kicks ass. |
| 18:29.58 | alestane | I am amused by the sections of Good Eats where he gets "suppressed" by "network lawyers" (most of whom appear to be him in different clothes). |
| 18:32.44 | *** join/#wowuidev Blia (~unknown@vno44-1-88-172-189-200.fbx.proxad.net) |
| 18:32.46 | Blia | hello |
| 18:33.08 | malreth | Hi. I'm called malreth. What's your name? |
| 18:33.56 | Blia | do you think (since I am very new to the wow addon development) that it's a good idea to request an addon on wow interface forums, instead of coding it by myself (I am sure it will take a year for me to complete it) |
| 18:34.21 | Kaso | depends how complicated your idea is |
| 18:34.35 | alestane | Keep in mind that if your project does not hold your interest, it is unlikely to hold anyone else's. |
| 18:34.54 | Blia | my idea does hold it |
| 18:35.05 | malreth | well, nameless one, you can pitch the idea but since no one's getting paid to do it, it'll only become a reality if someone shares the same interest |
| 18:35.29 | Blia | yeah, of course. |
| 18:35.46 | Kraps | hey Dagmar |
| 18:36.01 | Dagmar | Heya Kraps |
| 18:36.08 | Kraps | heard the latest? |
| 18:36.25 | Dagmar | About Mehserle? |
| 18:36.40 | Kraps | wut |
| 18:36.53 | Kraps | http://forums.worldofwarcraft.com/thread.html?sid=1&topicId=25968987278 |
| 18:37.02 | Dagmar | The Oakland transit cop who killed that dude in front of hundreds of witnesses. |
| 18:37.16 | Dagmar | He got a freaking conviction for _involuntary manslaughter_ |
| 18:37.32 | Dagmar | So, people are burning stuff now |
| 18:37.42 | malreth | Dagmar: it's probably the highest conviction they could give him |
| 18:37.55 | malreth | since murder requires proof beyond reasonable doubt |
| 18:38.07 | frontendloader | isn't there just Manslaughter? |
| 18:38.11 | frontendloader | instead of involuntary |
| 18:38.18 | Dagmar | Kraps: THANK GOD |
| 18:38.33 | Kraps | Dagmar: i thought the burning was because of LeBron |
| 18:38.36 | Dagmar | frontendloader: Yeah that's what I don't get |
| 18:38.45 | Dagmar | Kraps: Nononon... heeh |
| 18:38.46 | Lunessa | Involuntary Manslaughter is a different category in some states. |
| 18:38.57 | *** join/#wowuidev nicoli_s (~nsinkule@69.73.16.202) |
| 18:38.57 | frontendloader | or negligent homicide? |
| 18:38.59 | Dagmar | "he didn't *mean* to kill him" |
| 18:39.00 | *** mode/#wowuidev [+v nicoli_s] by ChanServ |
| 18:39.18 | Dagmar | WTF do you think is going to happen when you have some guy pinned down and you step back and pop a couple rounds into his torso? |
| 18:39.36 | malreth | Involuntary Manslaughter essentially just means that the accused had the intent to commit a criminal act but happened to kill a person in the process of doing so |
| 18:39.57 | Dagmar | It should have been murder two, and there should have been some extra nasty heaped on because they actually tried to collect all the video phones from people at the scene and cover it up |
| 18:40.28 | malreth | Dagmar: but that alone doesn't imply intent to kill |
| 18:40.39 | Dagmar | If they don't hit him with the max sentence, people will seriously burn stuff |
| 18:40.51 | Dagmar | malreth: It's basically what a gun is *for* |
| 18:40.55 | amro | Dagmar: link? |
| 18:41.00 | Dagmar | They don't teach you to shoot to scratch people up |
| 18:41.01 | malreth | Dagmar: yes... but justice is decided in the courts and not by rioters in the streets |
| 18:41.28 | Dagmar | malreth: I dont' see what the rioters have to do with a terrible judgement in a court case |
| 18:41.47 | malreth | Dagmar: If they don't hit him with the max sentence, people will seriously burn stuff |
| 18:41.55 | malreth | you're the one that said it |
| 18:42.11 | Dagmar | It's not a two-way association |
| 18:42.46 | malreth | *shrugs* |
| 18:43.16 | Dagmar | http://www.sfgate.com/cgi-bin/blogs/inoakland/detail?&entry_id=67504 http://www.sfgate.com/cgi-bin/article.cgi?f=/c/a/2010/07/08/BAM21EBDOD.DTL <-- not that I'm a fan of SFGate, they're just high Google rank right now |
| 18:43.27 | Dagmar | You can watch the cop kill the guy on YouTube still |
| 18:44.25 | malreth | Dagmar: i'm familiar with the case |
| 18:44.34 | Dagmar | I can't believe the judge used the term "minor criminal act" |
| 18:44.34 | *** join/#wowuidev tekkub (~tekkub@WoWUIDev/WoWI/Featured/Dongle/GitHub/Tekkub) |
| 18:44.34 | *** mode/#wowuidev [+v tekkub] by ChanServ |
| 18:44.46 | malreth | i know that he pulled a gun on the fellow |
| 18:44.51 | Dagmar | malreth: Well, for the record, I'm not for burning stuff |
| 18:45.28 | malreth | he committed a criminal act, that much we are all in agreement |
| 18:47.17 | Dagmar | Shooting a guy you've got pinned to the ground is just not right |
| 18:47.27 | malreth | take it one step back |
| 18:47.40 | malreth | pulling a gun on a guy you've got pinned to the ground is criminal |
| 18:47.47 | malreth | and the jury agreed |
| 18:49.01 | malreth | unfortunately, the jury did not see that Mehserle had the intent to kill Grant |
| 18:49.28 | Dagmar | I'd like to know what they thought he was trying to do |
| 18:49.48 | Lopeppeppy | brush his teeth |
| 18:49.57 | malreth | probably threaten him |
| 18:49.59 | Kraps | https://twitter.com/BlizzardPR/status/18133067190 |
| 18:50.01 | malreth | or subdue him |
| 18:50.06 | *** join/#wowuidev kd3 (~kd3@wikia/kaydeethree) |
| 18:50.08 | malreth | or maybe kill him |
| 18:50.20 | Dagmar | Kraps: Well, yeah. |
| 18:50.40 | malreth | but since there's many reasons why Mehserle *could* have pulled his weapon, that leaves doubt |
| 18:50.43 | Dagmar | Kraps: If it had been Sony, we'd have gotten a scolding today for questioning their judgement |
| 18:51.04 | Ackis | "What BP and the U.S. government don't want you to know: BP has punched a hole in an actual volcano, and their ability to stop it may be beyond the reach of human technology. May god have mercy on our souls." <-- fark headline aka everyone panic |
| 18:51.12 | malreth | if Mehserle had screamed, "I |
| 18:51.13 | Ackis | http://www.examiner.com/x-33986-Political-Spin-Examiner~y2010m7d8-BP-Gulf-disaster-Relief-well-progress-and-media-blackout-paint-a-grim-picture-Video-photos |
| 18:51.28 | malreth | "I'm gonna kill you." well then you have intent beyond all shadow of a doubt |
| 18:51.35 | cbreak | undersea vulcanoes are no problem |
| 18:51.37 | Lopeppeppy | doubt is the key term |
| 18:51.47 | malreth | or if he wrote in his diary that morning, "i'm gonna shot a man today. durp durp." |
| 18:51.49 | cbreak | worst that could happen are a few earthquakes, a tsunami and a few new islands |
| 18:51.55 | Kraps | https://twitter.com/BlizzMicah |
| 18:52.02 | Ackis | cbreak: or the end of the world! |
| 18:52.23 | cbreak | that sounds inplausible |
| 18:52.33 | Dagmar | malreth: Cor the nightmare that would have ensued had they found something like that |
| 18:52.59 | Dagmar | It would have been gangs that have been blood enemies for ages, banding together, to wipe out Oakland cops |
| 18:53.46 | malreth | so... doubt -> manslaughter |
| 18:53.56 | malreth | well... involuntary manslaughter |
| 18:55.00 | malreth | a lesser charge, to be sure, but until we invent the technology to read peoples' minds and then murder everyone else who would use such technology for evil, it's what we've got |
| 18:55.13 | Cralor` | How do I fix the SC2 Beta "Game time has run out" error |
| 18:55.29 | *** join/#wowuidev nicoli_s (~nsinkule@69.73.16.202) |
| 18:55.36 | *** mode/#wowuidev [+v nicoli_s] by ChanServ |
| 18:58.13 | cbreak | how do I fix the SC2 Server is offline error? :/ |
| 18:58.23 | Lopeppeppy | I recommend a hammer to you both. |
| 18:58.27 | amro | how do I fix the SC2 you don't have a key error? |
| 18:58.39 | cbreak | amro: preorder |
| 18:58.58 | amro | how do I fix the bank you don't have money error? |
| 18:59.06 | cbreak | hammer. |
| 18:59.09 | Lopeppeppy | Hammer! |
| 18:59.11 | Lopeppeppy | :) |
| 18:59.22 | Lunessa | My fix is *boot you both off-planet in a small box on a long trajectory into the sun." |
| 18:59.25 | amro | I don't have a piggy bank |
| 18:59.32 | Kraps | how do you fix i'm doing your mom error? |
| 18:59.50 | cbreak | burn your necronomicon |
| 19:00.00 | Kraps | necwhat? |
| 19:00.55 | *** join/#wowuidev Cide (~Andre@hus110a.bobbnet.com) |
| 19:00.55 | *** mode/#wowuidev [+v Cide] by ChanServ |
| 19:01.56 | Cralor` | thanks for the answers :D |
| 19:02.23 | malreth | no prob. whenever you're ready to play wow instead, just let us know |
| 19:03.28 | *** join/#wowuidev Bartlomehus (~Michel@wetering.xs4all.nl) |
| 19:04.46 | Cralor` | you didn't help, malreth! |
| 19:04.51 | malreth | i never do |
| 19:05.47 | foxlit | "amro: how do I fix the SC2 you don't have a key error?" << Like so: "M9XKF6-9NRP-F2XXKH-GFX8-6N4HBV" |
| 19:06.09 | Lunessa | lies, malreth. LIES. You helped me get totally hammered at the lake house. |
| 19:06.23 | malreth | i never lie |
| 19:06.38 | Dagmar | Hmm... I was just gonna say "move out of Russia" |
| 19:06.49 | Lopeppeppy | Oooh, do want "lake house" |
| 19:06.57 | malreth | it's being sold |
| 19:07.06 | Lopeppeppy | Awww. |
| 19:07.15 | malreth | yeah... guy only has like two other houses |
| 19:07.17 | Lunessa | malreth: So we need another place to party in the summer? |
| 19:07.21 | malreth | boggle |
| 19:07.30 | malreth | Lunessa: yep. i have a backyard now. :) |
| 19:07.56 | Lunessa | Awesome. So I can get hammered at your place and fertilize your shrubs. |
| 19:08.12 | malreth | Lunessa: there's a gate that will handily lead you to some other person's yard |
| 19:08.15 | Dagmar | "hydrate" |
| 19:08.36 | Lunessa | Dagmar: No, vomit usually has lumps that aren't liquid. :P |
| 19:09.48 | Lopeppeppy | Eeew. On second thought, I don't drinks with you guys, you're too hard core for me. |
| 19:10.05 | malreth | Lopeppeppy: you'll be in charge of the grill |
| 19:10.16 | malreth | the grill grll |
| 19:10.32 | Cide | cool |
| 19:10.39 | Cide | real name stuff reverted |
| 19:10.47 | Cide | old news I'm sure but cool |
| 19:11.02 | malreth | rearranges Cide's name to spell dice. |
| 19:11.14 | Cide | yeeeeah |
| 19:11.16 | Maldivia | Cide, pssh, that's soo yesterday... |
| 19:11.24 | Cide | indeed |
| 19:11.57 | NeoTron | so Blizzard gave it up |
| 19:12.24 | foxlit | let it down, and deserted it. |
| 19:13.01 | malreth | http://io9.com/5582032/lego-dune-if-only-these-figures-were-for-sale |
| 19:13.23 | foxlit | Eating icecream out of a thermally insulated glass. |
| 19:13.26 | *** join/#wowuidev daev (~bleh@pool-72-86-110-88.aubnin.fios.verizon.net) |
| 19:13.31 | foxlit | Kind of cool, but takes an eternity to melt :/ |
| 19:13.34 | Cide | bobby kotick must be angry |
| 19:13.47 | Cide | his vision, desecrated, denied, devastated |
| 19:14.05 | A-KO | not really |
| 19:14.06 | A-KO | it'll come back :P |
| 19:14.06 | Dagmar | Lunessa: Why would you waste booze like that? |
| 19:14.09 | A-KO | you'll see |
| 19:14.12 | A-KO | RealID is here to stay |
| 19:14.13 | A-KO | done |
| 19:14.28 | Dagmar | Gotta party hardcore. "You drank it, you keep it" |
| 19:14.32 | Cide | not for the forums it won't |
| 19:14.38 | Cide | but of course it's here to stay |
| 19:15.23 | A-KO | Cide: it will reveal itself on the forums at some point in the future. |
| 19:15.43 | Cide | oh? |
| 19:15.44 | Cide | how? |
| 19:15.53 | Cide | and link? |
| 19:16.13 | Lunessa | Actually, the problem last year was that I drank before eating, in the heat, and forgot to account for those factors when gauging my liquor consumption. Also, I was teaching Malreth to make martinis. |
| 19:16.16 | A-KO | Cide: The problem ultimately isn't the whole real name thing--the problem is the way it was introduced on to the players. Give it time as people get more and more used to sharing their name, and then introduce it. |
| 19:16.25 | Dagmar | Really? |
| 19:16.27 | A-KO | Cide: It will definitely come back, but when it does, nobody will care. |
| 19:16.28 | Cide | A-KO, ah, I see |
| 19:16.30 | Cide | got a source? |
| 19:16.39 | A-KO | No, no source--but you can be sure it will return :P |
| 19:16.42 | Cide | because you're not stating that as speculation |
| 19:16.44 | malreth | it was freakin hot last year |
| 19:16.46 | Cide | and you have no source |
| 19:16.50 | foxlit | Cide: you're being very slow and polite |
| 19:16.52 | malreth | at least there's actually a lake now |
| 19:16.52 | Dagmar | At which step in the martini-making process is one generally doubled-over in the bushes? |
| 19:16.54 | Cide | I'm guessing you're talking out of your ass |
| 19:17.01 | Lunessa | So hot that the lake was more like a puddle. |
| 19:17.01 | Cide | foxlit, why thank you |
| 19:17.13 | Dagmar | You need margarita drinks for hot weather. Granulated ice is win |
| 19:17.16 | Cide | I'm just working my way up to the big finish |
| 19:17.34 | Lunessa | Dagmar: The "I think 10 of these is too goddamned many, gonna sleep it off on the balcony" stage |
| 19:17.34 | Dagmar | Bloody, bloody mary |
| 19:17.46 | malreth | Dagmar: i am intrigued by your ideas and wish to subscribe to your newsletter |
| 19:18.02 | Cide | A-KO, don't state speculation as facts. it makes you unscientific and seem stupid |
| 19:18.17 | Cide | you have absolutely no idea what their plan is |
| 19:18.25 | malreth | tries to shush Cide lest he become a "troll" again |
| 19:18.32 | Dagmar | We're about to enter the time of year here where Ahune's return would be very popular in the polls |
| 19:18.57 | Lunessa | Dagmar: Are you also in TX? |
| 19:18.58 | foxlit | Curse you, > 22 degree weather. |
| 19:19.00 | Cide | I was never a troll |
| 19:19.06 | Cide | just an ass |
| 19:19.08 | Dagmar | Right now it's 87F and thunderstorms... Tornady weather |
| 19:19.12 | Cide | the two are quite distinct |
| 19:19.23 | Dagmar | Lunessa: Worse. Nashville. |
| 19:19.27 | Kraps | smatter Cide sad about realid? |
| 19:19.27 | malreth | Cide: ;) |
| 19:19.35 | Lunessa | Cide: You are also a sarcastic bastard. |
| 19:19.47 | Lopeppeppy | It's down to 80 in my office! Wheee! |
| 19:19.51 | Lunessa | Dagmar: Ouch. |
| 19:20.05 | Cide | Kraps, I don't post much on the forums |
| 19:20.05 | Dagmar | We're probably all in agreement now. Some because Blizz changed their minds, and the rest, because they're tired of hearing us say "OMG THIS IS NUTS" |
| 19:20.09 | Cide | I think it's a good change |
| 19:20.19 | Cide | the revert change that is |
| 19:20.32 | Cide | I would have preferred it to stay but other people obviously don't |
| 19:20.41 | *** join/#wowuidev kd3 (~kd3@wikia/kaydeethree) |
| 19:20.58 | Cide | Lunessa, I try when I can |
| 19:21.09 | Cide | lately I just get called a troll when I'm not even sarcastic |
| 19:21.12 | Cide | makes me sad |
| 19:21.27 | Lunessa | I know, Cide. It's the quality about you that I respect most. |
| 19:22.17 | Torhal | Good lord. The "OMG WE WON" thread is already 149 pages. |
| 19:22.37 | Kraps | supporting something bad just because it doesnt affect you is no cool |
| 19:22.49 | Dagmar | Now we need to track down Mike Morhaime's address, in order to... |
| 19:22.51 | Dagmar | ...send him beer. |
| 19:23.05 | alestane | fans Lopeppeppy with palm fronds and adds ice to her drink. |
| 19:23.52 | Lopeppeppy | That "we won" attitude isn't getting any brownie points, let me tell you. "Us vs. Them" isn't a good thing. |
| 19:24.13 | Cide | Kraps, that's an astoundingly awesome argument. I bow down to you. |
| 19:24.26 | Torhal | Lopeppeppy: Oh, definitely not. |
| 19:24.39 | Torhal | I'm just glad they listened to reason. |
| 19:25.36 | Lunessa | Dagmar: Just offer to buy him booze at BlizzCon. He's a very cool and approachable fellow. |
| 19:25.55 | Dagmar | Well, if I were going I'd just give him some whether he liked it or not |
| 19:26.12 | Dagmar | <-- goes to hacker cons. ...is familiar with the ritual of handing people beers. |
| 19:26.46 | Dagmar | ...although it is probably turning our best and brightest into raging alcoholics |
| 19:27.05 | Lunessa | that's nothing new in history |
| 19:27.52 | Kraps | Cide: i know you supported it but my point still sdands |
| 19:28.45 | Lunessa | Actually, we should send Cide liquor. Just 'cause. |
| 19:28.50 | foxlit | Kraps: your point is a cloud. |
| 19:29.11 | Dagmar | Lunessa: We take it to new extremes. Back in 2001 DefCon set a new record for most alcohol consumed by one group in Vegas, ever. |
| 19:29.20 | Kraps | it floats? |
| 19:29.22 | *** join/#wowuidev Dashkal (~dashkal@WoWUIDev/Nexus/dashkal) |
| 19:29.28 | Dagmar | ...which means we drank more than the Navy and the Air Force. |
| 19:29.29 | foxlit | The definition of "something bad" can be stretched to encompass everything, thus the argument applies to everything |
| 19:29.45 | Lunessa | Dagmar: I haven't been to a hacker con since Hackfest in 98 |
| 19:30.13 | Dagmar | It's the most black you'll see outside of a goth convention |
| 19:30.28 | Cide | Kraps, yeah, like I said, your point is awesome. Totally valid, too. And it makes sense. |
| 19:30.41 | Cide | now what was your point again? |
| 19:31.13 | Cide | oh yeah, that I should support you because you were in the minority |
| 19:31.26 | Cide | I'll consider it |
| 19:31.29 | Kraps | yeah! |
| 19:31.44 | Kraps | in the minority? |
| 19:31.55 | Dagmar | I somewhat believe that if ever people up and jerry rig air-conditioning for an entire city, it'll happen at DefCon before Maker Faire |
| 19:31.58 | Cide | yeah!? |
| 19:32.13 | Cide | (this is 'repeat what the other person said but with a question mark' right?) |
| 19:32.35 | Kraps | where was i in the minority? |
| 19:33.03 | Cide | in the men's room |
| 19:33.12 | Cairenn | cold! |
| 19:33.13 | Kraps | <PROTECTED> |
| 19:33.41 | Cide | in the whole real name debacle, I am pretty sure |
| 19:33.52 | Lopeppeppy | snuggles Cairenn to stay warm. |
| 19:34.00 | Cairenn | *giggle* |
| 19:34.03 | Cairenn | huggles Lopeppeppy |
| 19:34.09 | Cide | but we will never know unless someone conducts a large-scale poll |
| 19:34.14 | Kraps | what sample size are you using really? |
| 19:34.19 | Kraps | exactly |
| 19:34.44 | Kraps | in here you and 2 others supported this |
| 19:34.45 | alestane | Are you cold, Cairenn, or was that comment cold? |
| 19:34.51 | Cairenn | the comment |
| 19:34.53 | Cide | and like 5 others were against it |
| 19:35.05 | Cide | 3 - 5 isn't a very reliable result |
| 19:35.23 | Dagmar | Was it Lunessa was saying PA were waiting until they could make a joke? |
| 19:35.24 | Dagmar | http://www.penny-arcade.com/comic/2010/7/9/ |
| 19:35.35 | Kraps | ok so we'll use the sticky then? |
| 19:35.36 | Lunessa | Yeah. I saw it. |
| 19:35.42 | amro | 8 is not an acceptable sample size |
| 19:35.55 | amro | it's not even food for thought, it's worthless |
| 19:36.14 | Kalroth | Do I get a vote too?! |
| 19:36.22 | malreth | you know... it seems to me that if the U.S. Mint really wanted to get people to use $1 coins, they'd get the U.S. Bureau of Engraving and Printing to stop making $1 bills. |
| 19:36.27 | Cide | the sticky is a "bitch here" poll |
| 19:36.34 | Cide | that's not very scientific |
| 19:36.37 | *** join/#wowuidev Caleb| (~caleb@dsl4E5C0505.pool.t-online.hu) |
| 19:37.08 | Cide | nor is it the appropriate audience |
| 19:37.12 | amro | so where are you getting minority from again? |
| 19:37.22 | Cide | oh, myself |
| 19:37.25 | Dagmar | malreth: Nah... They need vending machines to accept gold dollars |
| 19:37.26 | Cide | is that not good enough for you? |
| 19:37.50 | Dagmar | I made a complete FOOL of myself outside a BART station one afternoon because I didn't realize the ticket machine gave change back in gold coins. |
| 19:37.51 | amro | no, not at all |
| 19:37.52 | Kraps | i never said it was, theres usually an even amount of yea/nay in stickys that are reasonable |
| 19:38.02 | Cide | amro, you underestimate me |
| 19:38.10 | malreth | Dagmar: that could probably be done with a firmware change |
| 19:38.19 | Kraps | this wasnt it |
| 19:38.20 | Dagmar | I heard *that sound* and looked down... stuck my hands in the air and yelled "GOOOOOLD!" |
| 19:38.21 | Cide | Kraps, you're under the assumption that the sticky is unreasonable |
| 19:38.28 | Cide | you're not being very scientific at all |
| 19:38.46 | amro | yes kraps, you need to say "because I think so" |
| 19:39.02 | Dagmar | malreth: Nah those are almost entirely mechanical. I firmware change *would* be needed, but the sorter has to route for the larger coins |
| 19:39.22 | amro | Dagmar: gold? what?? |
| 19:39.23 | Cide | oh no, amro, much more than that is required for scientific proof |
| 19:39.28 | malreth | Dagmar: true... plus there's something else that my wife reminded me about the other day... cash registers |
| 19:39.31 | Kraps | there was definitely a trend |
| 19:39.38 | Dagmar | Seriously tho, it's a beautiful thing to look down and see shiny gold coins in the tray, glinting in the California sunlight |
| 19:39.42 | Cide | in the forums. to the "bitch here" topic. |
| 19:39.52 | amro | Cide: nuh uh, you just need a name that nobody can pronounce and a presentation that puts people to sleep |
| 19:39.55 | malreth | all cash register trays have wells for 4 types of coins plus rolls |
| 19:39.57 | amro | most people won't bother to ask for details |
| 19:40.03 | Dagmar | malreth: hehe. Walmart already has a problem with $2 bills as it is |
| 19:40.05 | Cide | as has been said before, the vocal minority flocks to the forum |
| 19:40.09 | Kalroth | Cide: Is that where you sit or where you post? |
| 19:40.20 | Cide | Kalroth, hm? |
| 19:40.29 | Kalroth | "bitch here" |
| 19:40.31 | Cide | while I don't understand your question, probably both |
| 19:40.36 | Cide | ah. both. |
| 19:41.11 | malreth | so i thought... well just put dollar coins where the bills would have gone, and maybe stash the ones in another cash box to be sent to the bank or something |
| 19:41.46 | Dagmar | Give 'em to Parker Brothers |
| 19:41.54 | amro | Dagmar: california still uses gold coins? |
| 19:42.08 | malreth | amro: http://news.cnet.com/2300-11386_3-10004035.html?tag=mncol |
| 19:42.18 | Lunessa | dollar coins are no good for tipping strippers. |
| 19:42.20 | Dagmar | amro: Unless they've changed it, the BART (train) line has ticket machines at every stop that give change in gold dollar coins |
| 19:42.37 | malreth | Lunessa: use fives... then call it "inflation" |
| 19:42.41 | Dagmar | I still have some because they're so purty |
| 19:42.57 | amro | how much are the coins worth (in materials)? |
| 19:43.01 | Lunessa | malreth: Depends on the quality of the talent, I'm just saying. |
| 19:43.21 | Dagmar | amro: Probably more than a buck due to manufacturing costs. |
| 19:43.24 | Dagmar | They ain't solid |
| 19:43.33 | Dagmar | They'd be worth WAY more than a dollar if they were |
| 19:43.44 | amro | yeah that's what I was thinking |
| 19:44.00 | amro | so they're just golden coins, not gold coins |
| 19:44.03 | Dagmar | That whole "defacing currency" law would get used in a whole new way if they were |
| 19:44.08 | Dagmar | They're gold-plated |
| 19:45.18 | Dagmar | http://www.usmint.gov/mint_programs/golden_dollar_coin/index.cfm?action=sacDesign <-- color is way off in the illustrations |
| 19:45.19 | amro | still it's kinda cool |
| 19:45.54 | Dagmar | http://www.coinnews.net/wp-content/images/2008/Sacagawea-Golden-Dollar.jpg <-- much closer |
| 19:46.14 | Dagmar | Yeah I looked down and saw GOLD way before my eyes focused on what I was looking at |
| 19:46.25 | malreth | it's really brass, not gold |
| 19:47.26 | malreth | for a while, the U.S. Mint allowed you to buy dollar coins over the web and they'd ship them to you for free |
| 19:48.19 | malreth | people exploited that... buying thousands of them with their reward credit cards and then depositing them right back into the bank to pay off the credit charge before interest would be accrued |
| 19:48.53 | malreth | and then reap the benefits of the 'free' miles |
| 19:48.57 | cbreak | what's a reward credit card? |
| 19:48.58 | Dagmar | Not a bad plan |
| 19:49.16 | Dagmar | cbreak: A card given by a company who lets you have some of the transaction fee back as credit |
| 19:49.16 | malreth | cbreak: a credit card that rewards you points or frequent flier miles for purchases |
| 19:49.36 | cbreak | that sounds evil |
| 19:49.45 | malreth | points could be exchanged for cash rewards or other benefits |
| 19:50.27 | cbreak | the two major local shopping chains have special code cards which you can use to earn points with purchases |
| 19:50.55 | cbreak | just as evil |
| 19:51.14 | cbreak | encourages mindless consumption and allows tracking of customers for personalized advertisements |
| 19:52.37 | foxlit | aren't personalized advertisements a good thing? |
| 19:54.29 | *** join/#wowuidev clever (~clever@142.167.205.19) |
| 19:55.44 | *** part/#wowuidev Thaoky (Thaoky@22.228-244-81.adsl-dyn.isp.belgacom.be) |
| 19:55.50 | alestane | Given that I am simply not going to get away from advertisement, and only sort of want to, I would much rather the ads be relevant to my interests. |
| 19:56.05 | alestane | Advertising is a service for all involved when correctly targeted. |
| 19:56.34 | alestane | And sending it to people who have already received so much that they discard it out of hand is not targeting correctly. |
| 19:57.14 | cbreak | I don't want adds. |
| 19:57.29 | foxlit | Be more careful when you pull, then. |
| 19:57.51 | cbreak | I don't really get many adds anyway |
| 19:57.52 | malreth | bwah ha ah! http://www.cnn.com/2010/TECH/web/07/09/comic.sans.cavs.james/index.html?hpt=T2 |
| 19:59.42 | Dagmar | "careful" is for classes that don't stack stamina |
| 20:00.32 | Dagmar | I got a weird reaction from people in a heroic last night on the 'lock when I got carried away with Seed of Corruption and then popped Soul Shatter. |
| 20:00.39 | Ackis | cog|work: I hate you. http://sensen-no-sen.blogspot.com/2010/07/climategate-not-so-much.html |
| 20:00.46 | Dagmar | Apparently they'd never seen a warlock *lose* aggro before |
| 20:01.02 | Dagmar | Like, wow... what kinda players are we dealing with here |
| 20:02.39 | cog|work | Ackis: why? 'cause i told you so? :P |
| 20:03.03 | Ackis | rawr |
| 20:03.39 | Dagmar | I'm now of the opinion that Recount needs a secondary counter with a length of about 10 seconds so warlocks can see their DPS go "it's over 9000!!!" in heroic trash pulls |
| 20:04.59 | Dagmar | Turning 80 three days ago, and slamming three >12k Soul Fire crits in a row tho'... PRICELESS |
| 20:06.19 | Dagmar | Now at least I know why the other guild warlock would just streak past my hunter in DPS on some boss fights |
| 20:06.42 | alestane | Deci,mation and Molten Core are sweet. |
| 20:06.53 | Dagmar | I looooves Molten Core |
| 20:07.07 | Dagmar | I made the Power Auras check for that really big |
| 20:07.55 | Dagmar | Segui checks for Hellfire with "/say FUUUUU-UUUUU-", also win |
| 20:08.58 | Fisker | why didn't Vaneras mention all the comics about the Real ID change in the community news? |
| 20:08.59 | Fisker | HOHOHO |
| 20:10.10 | amro | if they knew about the comics, they would have given it another week before reversing |
| 20:10.14 | amro | that way we'd get a few more laugh |
| 20:10.16 | amro | s |
| 20:10.29 | Lunessa | So playing a warlock is much more interesting than "Send in pet, spam the shadowbolts, lawl" |
| 20:10.34 | *** join/#wowuidev Repo (~supybot@repos.curseforge.net) |
| 20:11.44 | Dagmar | amro: I can get behind that justifcation for delay. :) |
| 20:12.15 | Dagmar | Lunessa: Yeah I used to fuss at them for not considering what a high crit rating means to DPS rate changes, but now I see WHY the allure is so strong |
| 20:12.29 | Dagmar | If/when you manage to stack all the conditionals, the output is insane |
| 20:13.00 | Lunessa | Dagmar: I'm demonlogy spec on my 'lock, and I really don't play him much anymore. |
| 20:13.19 | Lunessa | So each time I /do/ play, I pretty much have to re-learn from scratch. |
| 20:13.33 | Dagmar | Lunessa: Install Destruction for Dummies |
| 20:13.45 | Lunessa | http://www.wowarmory.com/character-sheet.xml?r=Kirin+Tor&cn=Woefire |
| 20:14.05 | Dagmar | A bit of a faceroller, but a real win for those times you get frazzled and have to say "Wait... wtf am I supposed to fire off next?" |
| 20:16.50 | Dagmar | Lunessa: Whew you're way ahead of me |
| 20:17.07 | Dagmar | I'm just starting on the heroic pinatas and the badge gear |
| 20:17.56 | Dagmar | I figure I'm probably getting away with more than I should still because I'm not super-geared yet |
| 20:18.17 | Lunessa | WoW goes like this for me: Play main to level cap, do intro raids like crazy waiting for friends to catch up. Get bored. Level all my big alts to level cap, do intro raiding. Friends FINALLY catch up. Raid, Dailies, and achievements on Main. Putter with alts when people start bailing on other events. |
| 20:18.39 | Dagmar | For me, you can insert "buy moar dps" right after "hit 80" |
| 20:19.00 | Dagmar | ...as can be seen by the flood of [Superior] and [Epic] right after I hit 80 http://www.wowarmory.com/character-feed.xml?r=Skywall&cn=Bremslicht |
| 20:19.02 | Lunessa | So I have a shit-ton of high level, decently geared alts that I almost never play. |
| 20:19.40 | Dagmar | I usually trot out all my toons to take a whack at soloing holiday bosses |
| 20:19.47 | foxlit | You know what Lua needs? An equation solver |
| 20:20.07 | Dagmar | foxlit: That would facilitate rolling Rawr right into the client |
| 20:20.23 | Wobin | hm |
| 20:20.23 | Lunessa | For example, I respecced my 'lock 'cause I got sick of trying to figure out how to use Metamorphosis. |
| 20:20.25 | Dagmar | ...which um, *might* be a good thing |
| 20:20.35 | Wobin | So... since the last 12hrs I've been asleep |
| 20:20.44 | Dagmar | It would certainly put an end to senseless "X is always better than Y" arguments |
| 20:20.46 | foxlit | I'm not sure that's an actual prereq. |
| 20:20.46 | Wobin | The -WoW- forums are not going to be linked with RealID |
| 20:20.52 | Wobin | but the SCII ones will be? |
| 20:20.56 | foxlit | I'm talking about the language |
| 20:20.59 | Dagmar | Wobin: Probably not |
| 20:21.21 | Dagmar | foxlit: It would save a heap of work |
| 20:21.40 | foxlit | Rawr actually uses some form of solver? |
| 20:21.41 | Lunessa | foxlit: more than the current math functions? |
| 20:21.47 | foxlit | Lunessa: yes. |
| 20:22.13 | foxlit | would be nice to have something like |
| 20:22.16 | foxlit | s = solve(s^2 = (x^2 + (x-s)^2)/4, s > 0, s) |
| 20:22.35 | foxlit | for when you can't be bothered to do the math yourself. |
| 20:22.36 | Dagmar | foxlit: No, someone has to code in all the stuff and be sure it's correct, instead of having it scroll out step-by-step so you can see it |
| 20:22.38 | Cide | haha |
| 20:22.52 | Dagmar | Yeah that |
| 20:22.53 | Cide | that would be fun |
| 20:25.31 | cbreak | I had a calculator that solved such stuff |
| 20:25.38 | *** join/#wowuidev Marla (~Marla@fabe.xs4all.nl) |
| 20:25.41 | cbreak | some HP graphical thing. gigantic. |
| 20:25.52 | foxlit | I have a calculator that solved such stuff |
| 20:25.52 | Cide | trivial to do with numerical approximation |
| 20:25.58 | Cide | doing it symbolically is the real stuff |
| 20:26.05 | *** join/#wowuidev Marla (~Marla@fabe.xs4all.nl) |
| 20:26.08 | foxlit | My particular example isn't really that hard to do analytically either. |
| 20:26.15 | *** join/#wowuidev kd3 (~kd3@wikia/kaydeethree) |
| 20:26.31 | Cide | you're just lazy |
| 20:26.43 | foxlit | A virtue. |
| 20:26.59 | foxlit | also, wow frame layouts are weird |
| 20:27.25 | Kraps | Lunessa: so you have full t9 |
| 20:27.31 | foxlit | OVERLAY layer of a lower frame gets drawn above a BACKGROUND layer from a higher frame |
| 20:27.46 | Dagmar | Kraps: It'll get ya into ICC |
| 20:27.50 | Lunessa | Kraps: because full t9 is a weekend or so of instances. |
| 20:27.54 | Cide | foxlit, nah, I don't think that's the case |
| 20:27.56 | Kraps | mmm |
| 20:27.58 | Cide | are they the same framelevel? |
| 20:28.12 | Cide | and framestrata? |
| 20:28.24 | Dagmar | Aren't there two slightly higher pieces for locks that make it worth taking only four of the T9 pieces like it is for Hunters? |
| 20:28.27 | foxlit | Cide: all of those frames are created by the same code. |
| 20:28.59 | foxlit | No explicit messing with strata or level. |
| 20:29.01 | Dagmar | It looked sorta like that for DKs and I was wondering if it was a design theme across classes |
| 20:29.15 | Cide | I don't think there's any concept of "above" or "below" besides level and strata |
| 20:29.39 | Cide | children are "above" parents in the sense that children's frame level is by default the parent's + 1 |
| 20:29.55 | *** join/#wowuidev Hjalte (~chatzilla@cpe.ge-0-2-0-835.arcnqu2.customer.tele.dk) |
| 20:30.14 | foxlit | So what you're basically saying is that the behavior is undefined. |
| 20:30.18 | Kraps | <PROTECTED> |
| 20:30.39 | Cide | well, if the frame level is the same than the layer level entirely defines rendering order |
| 20:30.41 | Lunessa | Dagmar: There very well may be. I've done one thing over heroics on my 'lock and that was an ICC run that was /begging/ for ranged DPS. |
| 20:30.50 | Cide | I believe if they're on the same level then the rendering is undefined |
| 20:30.57 | foxlit | Cide: the problem is that it doesn't do it consistently. |
| 20:30.59 | Lunessa | Kraps: Yeah, my alts-stash and banking guild. |
| 20:31.12 | Dagmar | Well, with T9 you are quite ready to walk in there and handle things at LEAST as far as Deathbringer Orcface |
| 20:31.48 | Lunessa | I did all the way through Rotface and Festergut. I just wasn't steallar. |
| 20:32.06 | Lunessa | Or even very good for that matter. |
| 20:32.21 | Cide | foxlit, just set the frame level manually then I guess |
| 20:32.32 | Cide | or parent them accordingly |
| 20:32.33 | foxlit | Yes, yes, it's fixable :) |
| 20:32.33 | Dagmar | Yeah that's about as far as we get because we're mostly in T9 and whatever we've picked up on VOA PUGs and a few other things. We pretty much ignored ToGC and used Ulduar as a playground |
| 20:32.36 | Cide | according to your definition of above and below |
| 20:32.38 | Cide | afk! |
| 20:32.45 | foxlit | I just mildly expected rendering to be grouped by frame. |
| 20:33.12 | Dagmar | BTW if you're wondering... few people find it amusing if you drive around Ulduar on your actual summonable chopper. hehe |
| 20:33.37 | Dagmar | You can PULL just FINE that way tho. lol |
| 20:33.43 | Lunessa | Dagmar: lol. |
| 20:34.00 | Dagmar | I like to bring back OMGLOTS of iron dwarves |
| 20:35.57 | Wobin | can they run through the shield? |
| 20:36.02 | Wobin | before you start stuff? |
| 20:36.03 | Lunessa | I know it wasn't people's favorite raid instance, but I enjoyed Ulduar. One of these days, I'd like to finish it. |
| 20:36.13 | *** join/#wowuidev Antiarc (~Antiarc@ip70-190-192-186.ph.ph.cox.net) |
| 20:36.34 | Dagmar | I liked it because the trains bring back memories |
| 20:36.54 | Dagmar | cept NOW we've got the proper tools to deal with 100 angry mobs |
| 20:36.56 | Wobin | I liked the train to robotface |
| 20:37.24 | Dagmar | Wobin: what shield? |
| 20:37.45 | *** join/#wowuidev Alram (~Marla@fabe.xs4all.nl) |
| 20:38.00 | Wobin | well, before you start the first encounter, you have all the KT mages holding a shield up |
| 20:38.08 | Dagmar | Oh no |
| 20:38.18 | Kraps | the warrior and rogue in toc: who dies first? |
| 20:38.26 | Dagmar | ...but in my case I was sitting on my bike next to the siege bikes and someone jumped in the sidecar and typed "GOGOGO" |
| 20:38.34 | Wobin | Kraps: you organise that much? =) |
| 20:38.46 | alestane | Usually the warrior in my experience, Kraps. |
| 20:38.46 | Dagmar | Kraps: Rogue if your people ain't so good at not stepping in puddles |
| 20:38.53 | Wobin | oh toc5? |
| 20:38.56 | Wobin | yeah, the rogue |
| 20:39.01 | Wobin | easier for positioning |
| 20:39.07 | Wobin | cause the warrior will toss you everywhere |
| 20:39.08 | Dagmar | I was like, "Sure, buddy. Let's roll" |
| 20:39.13 | zenzelezz | wait... what's this? Slashdot has already got a newspost about Blizzard backing down on real names on forums? I didn't know today was already three days in the future... |
| 20:39.22 | mikma | so, anonymous won. |
| 20:39.25 | Dagmar | It took him a moment to realize the chopper he was in was NOT a siege vehicle. heheh |
| 20:39.35 | Dagmar | By then, it was too late to hop out |
| 20:39.39 | Wobin | muhahah |
| 20:39.50 | Dagmar | Yeah that was pretty much what I typed |
| 20:40.16 | Kraps | no Wobin just an idle thought :) |
| 20:40.43 | Dagmar | zenzeless: wait three days |
| 20:40.51 | Dagmar | It'll probably get posted again |
| 20:41.04 | zenzelezz | Dagmar: true |
| 20:41.04 | Wobin | Kraps: I thought you meant toc10, for which the order is "kill the healers, then run around screaming til the others are dead too" |
| 20:41.47 | Kraps | pretty much |
| 20:44.05 | foxlit | Wha? We kill dps first in toc :/ |
| 20:44.36 | foxlit | s/ll/lled/ |
| 20:45.19 | Wobin | foxlit: our last run had the druid and priest |
| 20:45.28 | Wobin | both kept everyone else up too easily |
| 20:45.32 | Kraps | those NPC heals are pretty op |
| 20:45.49 | Wobin | we ended up with Raid: 0 - FC: Full Health |
| 20:46.10 | Wobin | so we chainDG'd the priest and focussed him down, then the druid, then the rest |
| 20:46.16 | Dagmar | Kraps: Teach your huntards to not fear the stigma of speccing for Aimed Shot |
| 20:46.22 | Wobin | hunters? |
| 20:46.33 | Wobin | we had four DKs =P |
| 20:46.39 | Dagmar | That'll work |
| 20:46.46 | Dagmar | It's gotta be worth at least two hunters. ;) |
| 20:46.53 | Wobin | admittedly the 'Lets Use Army Of The Dead To Pull' technique was amusing |
| 20:47.01 | Wobin | if painful on my fps |
| 20:47.17 | Dagmar | AotD is win if you need to light a cigarette |
| 20:48.34 | Dagmar | ...also good for dealing with that pesky Ahunite Hailstone race condition |
| 20:48.57 | Dagmar | AotD, grab loot, 'port out |
| 20:49.10 | Wobin | race condition? |
| 20:49.34 | Dagmar | yes. If you're DPS was just borderline enough, Ahune would die while spawning a new hailstone and going back to Phase one |
| 20:49.47 | Dagmar | It happened about a third of the time for me |
| 20:49.59 | malreth | i saw that happen quite a times, too |
| 20:50.06 | Dagmar | So, you're there looking at the loot chest, and there's this damn hailstone trying to eat your mages |
| 20:50.11 | malreth | and yeah, people would loot and port out |
| 20:50.25 | malreth | which sucked for me since i was a squishy mage |
| 20:50.46 | Dagmar | Yeah it was why AotD's "taunt everything" comes in real handy |
| 20:51.44 | Lunessa | I wanted an ice chip. Never got lucky though. |
| 20:52.04 | Cairenn | has an ice chipper |
| 20:52.13 | Dagmar | I wanted the scythe for my 'lock, but I have Staff of Draconic Combat now so it's okay |
| 20:52.14 | Wobin | http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AWKcnEI_tDA |
| 20:52.16 | Wobin | ahaha |
| 20:52.21 | Dagmar | First time in Heroic Occulus for that toon too |
| 20:52.29 | Wobin | "I licked Florence Henderson!" |
| 20:52.38 | malreth | i got the scythe on my very first drop... never got the ice pet, tho |
| 20:54.00 | *** join/#wowuidev bediko (~chatzilla@ip-88-152-253-127.unitymediagroup.de) |
| 20:56.12 | *** join/#wowuidev Alram (~Marla@fabe.xs4all.nl) |
| 20:56.15 | Cairenn | Wobin: ROFL |
| 20:58.26 | Lunessa | lol |
| 21:04.39 | Antiarc | Morning everyone. |
| 21:04.46 | Antiarc | Man, good news to wake up to. |
| 21:05.17 | NeoTron | Antiarc: you saved a ton on car insurance? |
| 21:05.23 | Antiarc | The RealID reversal |
| 21:05.27 | Wobin | indeed |
| 21:05.46 | Wobin | wait.. what time is it over in AntiarcLand? |
| 21:05.51 | Antiarc | 2 PM |
| 21:06.01 | Antiarc | I work from home, I went to bed about 6:30 AM |
| 21:06.03 | Wobin | ah, it's 7am here which is why I was wondering =P |
| 21:07.26 | Kraps | loooool http://forums.worldofwarcraft.com/thread.html?topicId=25968747359&pageNo=4&sid=1#75 |
| 21:08.04 | Wobin | http://zanypickle.com/2010/07/happiness-happiness-happiness-happiness/ |
| 21:10.23 | *** join/#wowuidev A-KO (as@c-68-33-146-13.hsd1.md.comcast.net) |
| 21:10.23 | *** join/#wowuidev A-KO (as@unaffiliated/a-ko) |
| 21:12.50 | Wobin | ahaha |
| 21:12.54 | Wobin | best mashup ever http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wgT9EfZerwA&feature=player_embedded |
| 21:14.34 | *** join/#wowuidev brykrys (~chatzilla@WoWUIDev/Norganna/Dev/Brykrys) |
| 21:14.45 | *** join/#wowuidev A-KO (as@c-68-33-146-13.hsd1.md.comcast.net) |
| 21:14.46 | *** join/#wowuidev A-KO (as@unaffiliated/a-ko) |
| 21:16.45 | Lunessa | Hey Shadowed, I managed to get SUF to crash WoW last night, repeatedly. Profiles > New Profile, Copy from {select any existing profile} *WoW stops responding* |
| 21:16.56 | Shadowed | weird |
| 21:17.03 | Shadowed | I don't really have time to look into it right now, I'll check later |
| 21:17.21 | mikma | denied. |
| 21:18.28 | Wobin | http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VnEDHb1WqWw |
| 21:18.31 | Wobin | crying |
| 21:28.07 | Lunessa | Wobin: It's a good thing frogs have legs to jump with, otherwise I'd be gone with the Schwinn. |
| 21:28.53 | Kraps | " The internet is populated by rabid and unrepentant assholes who will wade into a reasonable discussion on Zerg vs. Protoss and begin an argument over whether or not Obama ordered NASA to create the Twilight movies as a smokescreen to cover up the fact that the Xbox red ring of death was caused by gays in the military." |
| 21:29.21 | Lunessa | WAIT? It wasn't? |
| 21:30.16 | Dagmar | It was not. |
| 21:30.18 | Dagmar | Suprising, isn't it. |
| 21:31.04 | *** join/#wowuidev SeanK (~SeanK@pool-98-117-120-73.sttlwa.fios.verizon.net) |
| 21:31.07 | Lunessa | I no rite? |
| 21:31.20 | Kraps | my sister has a friend who has an uncle in the military who says its true |
| 21:32.19 | Dagmar | A significant portion of NASA would eat a bullet if it was ever proven true. |
| 21:32.24 | *** join/#wowuidev A-KO (as@c-68-33-146-13.hsd1.md.comcast.net) |
| 21:32.24 | *** join/#wowuidev A-KO (as@unaffiliated/a-ko) |
| 21:32.34 | Dagmar | Granted, some of them would butter it first. |
| 21:33.08 | Lunessa | I work down the street from the Johnson Space Center. |
| 21:33.17 | *** part/#wowuidev Cralor` (~Chris@c-75-68-70-97.hsd1.ma.comcast.net) |
| 21:34.17 | Dagmar | I suppose pimping Clone Wars is kind of like being in the "space" industry |
| 21:35.02 | Lunessa | I swear, I don't even like to drive down NASA Rd 1 because of the stupid banners. |
| 21:35.16 | Kraps | banners? |
| 21:35.51 | nicoli_s | i live a few minutes away from a bunch of nasa stuff |
| 21:35.58 | nicoli_s | i see that giant rocket every day to and from work |
| 21:37.06 | Lunessa | The Johnson Space Center is home to the NASA tourist tra... er 'attraction' "Space Center Houston" which has a big Clone Wars exhibit/tie-in/marketing-felatio thing going on right now. |
| 21:37.58 | malreth | http://abstrusegoose.com/283 |
| 21:38.05 | Kraps | Lunessa: thats in florida? |
| 21:38.07 | *** join/#wowuidev Marla` (~Marla@fabe.xs4all.nl) |
| 21:38.11 | Lunessa | And all the street lights on NASA Rd 1 have "Clone Wars" promo banners on them. |
| 21:38.21 | malreth | Kraps: houston |
| 21:38.23 | cog|work | NSFW (Language) http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=l8eE6k5ktYo <-- for everyone who hates teen culture |
| 21:38.29 | Wobin | malreth: <3 the epilogue |
| 21:38.55 | Kraps | whats the one in florida? |
| 21:39.06 | malreth | cog|work: i saw 'teenage girl' and 'penetrating' and immediately closed the window |
| 21:39.15 | cog|work | malreth: your loss imo |
| 21:39.17 | nicoli_s | Lunessa:we have the clone wars thing here too |
| 21:39.20 | nicoli_s | in huntsville |
| 21:39.28 | nicoli_s | george lucas was actually in town for the opening |
| 21:40.58 | *** join/#wowuidev Moonwitch (~Kelly@d51A4DB5F.access.telenet.be) |
| 21:42.38 | Kraps | http://blue.mmo-champion.com/t/13816839851/a-thank-you-to-blizz-realid/ |
| 21:42.58 | nicoli_s | but it was gonan be like 150 bucks for a ticket so i said fuck that |
| 21:42.59 | Kraps | herp |
| 21:43.04 | *** join/#wowuidev A-KO (as@c-68-33-146-13.hsd1.md.comcast.net) |
| 21:43.04 | *** join/#wowuidev A-KO (as@unaffiliated/a-ko) |
| 21:43.51 | sylvanaar | do some of you live in houston or something |
| 21:44.08 | *** join/#wowuidev Dashkal (~dashkal@WoWUIDev/Nexus/dashkal) |
| 21:44.19 | malreth | <- Austin, TX |
| 21:44.34 | sylvanaar | i went to college in Austin |
| 21:44.40 | Kraps | otoh, pwned http://blue.mmo-champion.com/t/25969517402/the-many-the-proud-the-banned/ |
| 21:48.31 | malreth | facebook: making the world a safer place, one stupid asshole murderer at a time. http://www.english.rfi.fr/france/20100706-teenager-arrested-after-facebook-murder-boast |
| 21:49.41 | Kalroth | s/facebook/stupidity/r |
| 21:49.58 | olafski | this is alarming |
| 21:50.12 | olafski | how can people even consider to post such a thing |
| 21:50.32 | Kalroth | people think facebook is private |
| 21:50.50 | olafski | well, his sister reported him ;) |
| 21:51.42 | malreth | Kalroth: but he reportedly posted the exploit to facebook to boast, implying that he knew and hoped that other people would read it. |
| 21:51.58 | olafski | maybe just his friends |
| 21:52.06 | olafski | shows how trustworthy those and his family are |
| 21:52.40 | olafski | someone tells you they murdered someone for saying something wrong and you report them.. what better way to anger someone than to have them thrown in jail :P |
| 21:52.44 | Wobin | um |
| 21:52.51 | Wobin | facebook had nothing to do with it =P |
| 21:53.01 | olafski | yeah not really :P |
| 21:53.08 | olafski | the article doesn't imply that it had though |
| 21:53.09 | Wobin | ZOMG SOCIAL MEDIA |
| 21:53.11 | Wobin | ZOMGZOMG |
| 21:53.20 | olafski | just says that he posted it on facebook and got arrested afterwards ;) |
| 21:53.32 | olafski | nn |
| 21:53.35 | Wobin | with a nice big facebook image |
| 21:53.49 | Wobin | despite the fact that even if he hadn't 'boasted on facebook' he'd still be arrested |
| 21:53.58 | malreth | ~dict snark |
| 21:54.10 | malreth | ... |
| 21:54.15 | Wobin | hehe |
| 21:54.23 | malreth | ~dict Wobin |
| 21:54.24 | Wobin | win |
| 21:54.28 | cog|work | ~dict 2 snark |
| 21:54.37 | Lunessa | http://lifestyle.msn.com/your-life/bigger-picture/article.aspx?cp-documentid=24682236&page=0 |
| 21:54.43 | Kraps | holy fuck |
| 21:54.54 | Kraps | fucking fucker |
| 21:55.54 | cog|work | ~poke Kraps |
| 21:55.55 | purl | ACTION cuts down a small tree, sneaks up behind Kraps, pokes Kraps repeatedly, hilarity ensues. |
| 21:55.58 | malreth | Kraps: what? did Fisker get a beta key? |
| 21:58.22 | mrpoundsign | so anyone have any opinion on the best editor for creting wow interfaces in mac? |
| 21:58.49 | Wobin | lua code |
| 21:59.10 | alestane | I use TextWrangler. |
| 21:59.26 | malreth | mrpoundsign: i prefer TextMate but it costs $ |
| 21:59.33 | mrpoundsign | yeah I have TM |
| 21:59.52 | mrpoundsign | I'm a web developer haha |
| 22:00.05 | cog|work | Addon Studio for World of Warcraft running under Parallels!!!!!111one |
| 22:00.09 | cog|work | </sarcasm> |
| 22:00.10 | alestane | Any reasonable text editor that does syntax coloring for Lua and smart formatting is your friend, pretty much. |
| 22:00.29 | malreth | mrpoundsign: get the Lua module for TM and go to town. |
| 22:00.56 | *** join/#wowuidev Kraps (~chatzilla@pool-71-169-17-147.pghk.east.verizon.net) |
| 22:01.27 | Kraps | i was commenting on your link |
| 22:02.59 | Kraps | malreth |
| 22:03.12 | malreth | ah... okeh |
| 22:04.12 | Lunessa | ok. I'm out. See you all Monday unless I go nuts over the weekend. |
| 22:05.08 | *** join/#wowuidev Fierceflame (~timo.meij@ip231-37-173-82.adsl2.static.versatel.nl) |
| 22:05.42 | *** join/#wowuidev dropson_ (~nnscript@cm-84.209.69.153.getinternet.no) |
| 22:05.46 | cog|work | http://www.theatlanticwire.com/features/view/feature/Iran-Bans-Mullets-1569 |
| 22:11.17 | *** join/#wowuidev dropson (~nnscript@cm-84.209.69.153.getinternet.no) |
| 22:14.59 | Zyn | mullets should have world wide ban :[ |
| 22:15.25 | bleeter | so they turned off RealID yet? |
| 22:15.56 | Kraps | http://forums.worldofwarcraft.com/thread.html?topicId=25968987278&sid=1 bleeter |
| 22:16.15 | bleeter | Kraps: nah, I'm talking about the other issue. addons. |
| 22:16.31 | bleeter | ie, the issue that exists NOW, not what was the pending forum problem |
| 22:17.10 | mrpoundsign | bleeter: so explain the attack, using addons. |
| 22:17.40 | bleeter | mrpoundsign: not so much an 'attack', just a fubar trust model. |
| 22:18.05 | bleeter | mrpoundsign: if I have a RealID, it implies that I trust that friend to not run addons that transmit my RealID information to third parties |
| 22:18.42 | bleeter | whether third parties be ingame comms channels, or uploading to third party websites where universe+1 downloads said data |
| 22:19.31 | bleeter | mrpoundsign: I cannot control how my RealID friends read my RealID info and transmit this, without opting out |
| 22:20.04 | dropson | nice, login servers are down! :-D |
| 22:20.12 | bleeter | hehe |
| 22:21.11 | mrpoundsign | don't realid people you don't trust :) also, I jsut generally have a problem with the idea that an exploitive system would really get in the wild. |
| 22:21.29 | mrpoundsign | I think it's highly improbable. |
| 22:21.54 | A-KO | this hype over realid will blow over come Cataclysm |
| 22:22.05 | A-KO | once SC2/Diablo 3 come out |
| 22:22.07 | A-KO | and Cata hits |
| 22:22.12 | A-KO | we'll see far more acceptance of the plan |
| 22:22.25 | A-KO | and then as Activision starts rolling it into non-Blizzard properties |
| 22:23.03 | mrpoundsign | space invaders with realid |
| 22:26.07 | dropson | seriously, how can they not scale their login servers, or servers in general as high availability web applications that can deal with one or more servers failing ! |
| 22:26.53 | dropson | i'm gonna farm in farmville :-/ |
| 22:27.02 | bleeter | mrpoundsign: there are very few Friends of mine who I'd trust to check every line of addon code they use |
| 22:27.35 | bleeter | mrpoundsign: further, I recall being told that MITM attacks against authenticators would be highly unlikely |
| 22:27.44 | bleeter | when I raised it as a possible issue |
| 22:27.58 | bleeter | so excuse me while I have a little doubt |
| 22:29.33 | mrpoundsign | bleeter: I understand. So please explain how it does happen that someone, anyone can reliably get your name from an addon. I think they should just lock out Real ID, but I also think that it's not even remotely a viable way to get someones real name right now. |
| 22:29.44 | A-KO | bleeter: well technically, they aren't MITM'd--in the sense that you have to get a payload on a user's computer, first :P |
| 22:30.01 | bleeter | still, as the only way one can protect oneself from friends running bad code is to disable RealID. |
| 22:30.11 | A-KO | aren't the functions protected? |
| 22:30.13 | A-KO | and who cares, really |
| 22:30.19 | A-KO | once again |
| 22:30.22 | A-KO | first + last name is not personal information |
| 22:30.34 | Kraps | see? all the privacy dude are in http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/technology/8806623.stm |
| 22:30.35 | A-KO | if you think otherwise, feel free to talk to your congressman/government officials/whatever you have |
| 22:31.17 | bleeter | A-KO: I believe that was FB's attitude, then the Canadian Privacy COmissioner got on their case |
| 22:31.40 | bleeter | just because you don't care, doesn't mean other's aren't entitled to care |
| 22:31.40 | A-KO | bleeter: Facebook's primary business is sharing your personal information. They continue to do it even if they added a few click buttons and checkboxes for you, the consumer |
| 22:31.55 | mrpoundsign | bleeter: that wasn't about names, it was about other personal information. on facebook, your name is still public, and your real name is still required. |
| 22:31.59 | A-KO | Zynga's primary business--is sharing your personal information (Farmville, Mafia Wars, etc.) |
| 22:32.24 | amro | A-KO: that only matters if you intend to sue |
| 22:32.31 | amro | which most people don't, they intend to boycott |
| 22:32.45 | A-KO | It'll get reintroduced at a later point in time |
| 22:32.50 | A-KO | they'll just smooth it over |
| 22:32.53 | A-KO | get people more used to the idea |
| 22:32.56 | A-KO | the internet's going that way anyway |
| 22:33.16 | *** join/#wowuidev Eluna (~Eluna@85.196.121.142) |
| 22:33.22 | A-KO | how many people have profiles on facebook, myspace, linkedin, bebo, gamerdna, etc etc. |
| 22:33.23 | bleeter | may as well just chip everyone now, isn't that right?! |
| 22:33.36 | A-KO | the new Windows Live Messenger integrates with Facebook |
| 22:33.46 | amro | A-KO: that's completely different |
| 22:33.49 | A-KO | no it's not amro :P |
| 22:33.52 | amro | yes it is |
| 22:34.09 | amro | just because I have a facebook account doens't mean I want people on an internet forum to know my real name |
| 22:34.11 | A-KO | it's ALL public information, on the internet, for anyone at any time to see if they wanted to. At any given time, questionable people have access to your personal information. |
| 22:34.28 | A-KO | I assure you it's a LOT more prevalant than you even consider thinking about |
| 22:34.32 | amro | but at any given time, questionable people have little interest in me specifically |
| 22:34.41 | A-KO | and they don't on the forums, either |
| 22:34.44 | A-KO | That said |
| 22:34.44 | A-KO | again |
| 22:34.51 | amro | they do if you piss them off in a discussion |
| 22:34.55 | amro | and it doesn't even matter |
| 22:35.07 | amro | I may want to give my name to site A, doesn't mean I want it on site B |
| 22:35.10 | A-KO | the only reason it was so easy to target the Blizzard employees--is because you already have 3 pieces of information on them: Name, Employer, Location--your RealID reveals none of that. |
| 22:35.20 | amro | I need no other reason than simply "not wanting to give my name" |
| 22:35.32 | A-KO | that's fine, the law doesn't agree with you |
| 22:35.38 | amro | again, who said anything about the law |
| 22:35.48 | amro | stop assuming I want to sue |
| 22:35.50 | A-KO | private companies don't agree with you :P |
| 22:36.02 | amro | in which case my wallet wouldn't agree with them, it's that simple |
| 22:36.08 | amro | and whether they care or not is immaterial |
| 22:36.10 | A-KO | Sure it does |
| 22:36.17 | A-KO | "HEY LOOK, INSTALL THIS FREE GAME!" |
| 22:36.19 | A-KO | *free* |
| 22:36.25 | A-KO | *free as in (hand us your personal information)* |
| 22:36.48 | amro | now you're just going off topic |
| 22:37.04 | amro | blizzard already *has* my personal information |
| 22:37.19 | A-KO | Every major social networking site has your public information traded to any number of companies that want access to it--every individual "game company" on those social networking sites, ad companies, all of them--access to your information. And then anyone beyond them as well. |
| 22:37.26 | frontendloader | A-KO: it doesn't take much looking to determine someone's location |
| 22:37.28 | A-KO | The reality is: Nobody cares about you |
| 22:37.33 | frontendloader | people casually mention it in conversation all the time |
| 22:37.46 | A-KO | frontendloader: Given just the fact that you play WoW and your first/last name, does not give away who you are or where you live. |
| 22:37.52 | frontendloader | I could say I live in Salt Lake City |
| 22:37.54 | frontendloader | right now |
| 22:38.00 | frontendloader | and you wouldn't be able to find out anything more about me |
| 22:38.09 | frontendloader | because this nick isn't linked to a real name |
| 22:38.14 | amro | A-KO: and the reality is, I don't care about that |
| 22:38.21 | bleeter | A-KO: Nobody may care about you, so you don't care about this info passing around. However your feelings are immaterial to how I want my info bandied around. |
| 22:38.22 | mrpoundsign | htey ar no longer putting you name on forums. If you don't use Real ID with anyone then you don't expose your real name. |
| 22:38.32 | amro | again, like I said earlier, giving my information to A doesn't mean I want a completely unrelated B to have access to it |
| 22:38.43 | A-KO | It'll all blow over as the years go on, as people share their information with their guildies, and get more comfortable with the idea. |
| 22:38.46 | A-KO | Nothing more, nothing less. |
| 22:38.51 | A-KO | you'll eventually accept it as normal |
| 22:38.52 | A-KO | :P |
| 22:38.54 | amro | no |
| 22:39.06 | frontendloader | That isn't an idea anyone should be comfortable with ever |
| 22:39.11 | amro | exactly |
| 22:39.16 | bleeter | A-KO: if it's not a big deal, feel free to put your name on your IRC account /who info thing |
| 22:39.27 | amro | that's like a stripper telling people that eventually people will walk around naked and feel totally comfortable |
| 22:39.35 | bleeter | mmm |
| 22:39.40 | A-KO | frontendloader: People will end up complacent, period--it *will* happen. As soon as they go "man I really like this arena buddy of mine. But I want to play SC2 and chat." |
| 22:39.41 | amro | if you're cool with it, that's fine, don't assume that everyone else has to be/will be |
| 22:40.09 | A-KO | bleeter: Again, there's a difference--IRC has my IP address on it, which can then infer my location :P |
| 22:40.29 | amro | as opposed to your real name, which can't be used to track you down |
| 22:40.37 | amro | get real. |
| 22:40.38 | frontendloader | so mask it with a vhost |
| 22:40.53 | A-KO | amro: your real name, by itself, cannot be used to track you down. |
| 22:40.58 | A-KO | your real name + location, well |
| 22:40.58 | frontendloader | You sound pretty hypocritical right now. |
| 22:41.00 | amro | my real name totally can be |
| 22:41.00 | A-KO | that's a different situation |
| 22:41.16 | A-KO | no frontendloader, I'm a realist--and I deal with these types of questions every day at work--it's part of my job. |
| 22:41.22 | amro | there's only 3 people with my name, one of them is dead and the other doesn't have a computer |
| 22:41.32 | A-KO | People are just paranoid |
| 22:41.42 | A-KO | but maybe it's just me, I've been meeting friends online from all over the world since I was 14... |
| 22:41.43 | A-KO | so :P |
| 22:41.44 | amro | like I said A-KO, it has nothing to do with paranoia |
| 22:41.48 | frontendloader | And rightfully so, there are all kinds of creepers on the internet. |
| 22:41.49 | mrpoundsign | amro: so you have exposed your real identity welsewhere on the webs? |
| 22:41.49 | *** join/#wowuidev foxlit (~foxlit@0x573e6bae.alb2nxx18.dynamic.dsl.tele.dk) |
| 22:41.54 | A-KO | frontendloader: not really |
| 22:42.07 | foxlit | Wait, Ruby Sanctum trash can be CC'ed? |
| 22:42.11 | bleeter | A-KO: I've been meeting people online since i was 14 as well, you appeal from authority has bugger all weight |
| 22:42.15 | amro | mrpoundsign: I'm sure it can be found on some mailing list somewhere as I contribute with my name |
| 22:42.24 | A-KO | frontendloader: The number of really crazy, psychotic people in the world is more or less overblwon with the fact that we have up to the minute information from any point on the globe that has internet. |
| 22:42.27 | bleeter | your |
| 22:42.27 | amro | but attaching my name to an open source project is something I don't mind doing |
| 22:42.28 | frontendloader | I've only recently disclosed my real name to 3 internet-only friends that I have known for half a decade, and I was uncomfortable with that too. |
| 22:42.59 | A-KO | frontendloader: really? I disclosed my name and address to a good chunk of my online friends, largely for sending stuff to and from |
| 22:43.04 | mrpoundsign | amro: unless you actually have an attack vector that you don't opt into, knowing it exposes your real name, then you're just upset you have a unique name. |
| 22:43.25 | amro | mrpoundsign: I've already said it has nothing to do with potential attacks |
| 22:43.38 | amro | why can't I just decide who I want to give my name to? is it so hard for you guys to wrap your head around it? |
| 22:43.41 | mrpoundsign | amro: then I am sorry about your name. Next topic? |
| 22:43.46 | amro | you're not entitled to know my name just because you play the same game |
| 22:43.50 | mrpoundsign | you can! |
| 22:43.53 | amro | what's your point mrpoundsign? |
| 22:43.53 | A-KO | amro: Because ultimately, at the end of the day, you don't get to choose who has your name |
| 22:43.54 | mrpoundsign | you don't use Real ID |
| 22:43.54 | A-KO | sorry :P |
| 22:44.09 | bleeter | hang on, I'm confused right now. is realid enabled by default? |
| 22:44.10 | A-KO | yo ucan "vote with your dollars" all you want, or whatever |
| 22:44.12 | A-KO | it won't matter |
| 22:44.16 | amro | bleeter: no |
| 22:44.17 | mrpoundsign | yes |
| 22:44.20 | mrpoundsign | it is. |
| 22:44.25 | mrpoundsign | but unless you add someone to it.. |
| 22:44.26 | A-KO | bleeter: in-game, RealID is on--you can add real life friends to your RealID friend's list. |
| 22:44.29 | mrpoundsign | no one sees it. |
| 22:44.42 | A-KO | I've got about 10 realID friends already |
| 22:44.45 | mrpoundsign | you opt into other people having access to it. |
| 22:44.50 | mrpoundsign | so it's not a security flaw. |
| 22:44.58 | mrpoundsign | it's jsut not designed the way you want to use it. |
| 22:45.02 | mrpoundsign | so don't use it until it is. |
| 22:45.04 | amro | nobody's saying that it is, people are overreacting about the addon thing |
| 22:45.24 | amro | I'm talking about A-KO's suggestion that eventually blizzard will just smoothly force realid on everyone |
| 22:45.37 | bleeter | ... I'd certainly say the "addon thing"'s not as widely understood as it possibly could be |
| 22:45.45 | amro | and then you call the rest of us paranoid A-KO' |
| 22:45.55 | A-KO | mrpoundsign: Ultimately Blizzard's only mistake was introducing the system too early--someone mistakenly thought that because everyone just passes their information out to Facebook, that people were actually aware of what they're doing. In reality, people aren't quite aware of where their personal information is going, and most of the time don't care. |
| 22:46.05 | A-KO | mrpoundsign: Just look at the # of people that browse their accounts and shit over public wifi ;) |
| 22:46.21 | bleeter | I still can't see why it has to be a full name, and not a nick like Steam uses. |
| 22:46.22 | A-KO | most of them just don't know |
| 22:46.55 | A-KO | bleeter: Largely because ATVI is trying to do something that more or less merges Facebook and Steam, at the end of the day. They want to be the "next big thing", because there's loads of $ in being that company. |
| 22:46.59 | mrpoundsign | bleeter: it doesn't have to be anything. don't use it until it's useful to you. that's what I am doing. :) |
| 22:47.01 | A-KO | Facebook is making ridiculous amounts of cash |
| 22:47.29 | amro | you're missing the point entirely |
| 22:47.39 | A-KO | Blizzard mistakenly assumed that people actually read the Facebook privacy policy |
| 22:48.12 | A-KO | Is more or less what it comes down to |
| 22:48.16 | bleeter | P.S. I always love legal agreements that are longer than most constitutions |
| 22:48.16 | amro | and you're mistakenly assuming that a) everyone uses facebook and b) nobody is aware of privacy issues |
| 22:48.27 | foxlit | Explain this to me: what is the benefit, to Blizzard, or even Activision, in revealing your name on public forums? |
| 22:48.37 | amro | exactly foxlit |
| 22:48.55 | bleeter | foxlit: or your name vs a permanent cross-account nick ingame |
| 22:48.58 | amro | realid on forums was a bad idea that is unlikely to rear its head again as they consider other soluitions |
| 22:49.04 | mrpoundsign | foxlit: none, and they agree and have retracted the concept. |
| 22:49.16 | foxlit | A-KO seems convinced it'll be back. |
| 22:49.50 | foxlit | So I'm merely asking "why?" to that. |
| 22:50.35 | mrpoundsign | I think at best you could say there's a remote, slim chance. |
| 22:50.45 | mrpoundsign | no way could you say YES! it'll happen. |
| 22:50.50 | amro | yeah, ther'es a chance they will try again |
| 22:51.03 | amro | perhaps a slightly tamer version (like restricting it to logged in users) |
| 22:51.04 | A-KO | foxlit: It'll return once people are ready for it, I would imagine it had some type of marketing purpose--there's always a reason. I mean, it costs development time to have made that happen. The reason was definitely not "so we can make a better community." That's just the bullshit they tell you :P |
| 22:51.21 | amro | there's no revenue benefit to them |
| 22:51.25 | A-KO | Since they do have a business reason to do it |
| 22:51.28 | A-KO | which I'm sure they do |
| 22:51.30 | A-KO | it'll come back |
| 22:51.39 | mrpoundsign | A-KO: It was probably less resource intensive than toons. |
| 22:51.42 | amro | second is your assumptiont hat people will be "ready for it |
| 22:52.03 | mrpoundsign | but that can be solved using a single, unchangable unique name a user can have. like an alias. |
| 22:52.18 | *** join/#wowuidev jacobeiting (~jacobeiti@209-255-131-97.ip.mcleodusa.net) |
| 22:52.33 | foxlit | A-KO: You have to realize "I don't know why, but I'm totally sure it'll happen" doesn't sound very convincing. |
| 22:52.38 | jnwhiteh | So |
| 22:52.46 | jnwhiteh | someone reported an issue to me on WowI |
| 22:52.57 | A-KO | mrpoundsign: There were probably some minor technical reasons for it--but I still believe they've had a purposeful business reason for it, largely so that it would be easier for companies to data mine how active you are in WoW or something :P |
| 22:52.58 | jnwhiteh | "My Curse client consistently reports latest version as v3.2 and therefore out of date." |
| 22:53.06 | jnwhiteh | My response: "WowLua r33 is the latest version available on both sites. I have no idea what you would like me to do." |
| 22:53.11 | A-KO | either way--I was tempted to order that GM a pizza |
| 22:53.21 | jnwhiteh | Then they go on to clarify that they're reporting this issue to me |
| 22:53.25 | jnwhiteh | what the fuck am I suposed to do about it? |
| 22:53.37 | mrpoundsign | A-KO: that's very tinfoil hat of you. but there's 0 evidence of that. |
| 22:53.39 | A-KO | jnwhiteh: snap your fingers and fix it |
| 22:53.42 | amro | A-KO: why would making it public for datamining be a good business decision? |
| 22:53.47 | A-KO | mrpoundsign: Sure there is, the fact they did it in the first place :P |
| 22:53.51 | amro | if anything, hiding it and selling access to it would be a better idea |
| 22:53.53 | cog|work | what A-KO said |
| 22:54.01 | cog|work | you're cladhaire you can do anything! |
| 22:54.21 | A-KO | amro: not really, not legally anyway |
| 22:54.29 | A-KO | anyways, I'm done with this nonsense, it's not going to happen, everyone can shut up now |
| 22:54.29 | A-KO | and move on |
| 22:54.31 | A-KO | :P |
| 22:54.33 | cog|work | (also i still get e-mail alerts to wowlua comments... it's been fun to watch ;) ) |
| 22:54.33 | A-KO | back to WoW |
| 22:54.46 | mrpoundsign | Trying to make the forums less annoying and make it less resource intensive to have to do a lookup on each toon in order to render each forum post are much more compelling than your scenario. |
| 22:54.54 | amro | A-KO: with a change to the policy it would be |
| 22:57.32 | bleeter | cyaz, I'ma gunna go back to watching Bab5 and wondering why anyone would send me an https session token URL thing in an unsigned email |
| 22:58.03 | bleeter | jnwhiteh: what to do? write that protocol to smack people via udp |
| 22:58.35 | amro | bleeter: it's called the holy grail of the internet |
| 23:00.59 | Torhal | jnwhiteh: Clarify to them that clarifying to you doesn't empower you in any way. |
| 23:02.07 | bleeter | amro: yes and if anyone can do it, jnwhiteh can! ;) |
| 23:02.25 | bleeter | 08:54 < cog|work> you're cladhaire you can do anything! |
| 23:02.34 | bleeter | troof! :D |
| 23:06.38 | *** join/#wowuidev Jamash (~chatzilla@99-92-174-69.lightspeed.iplsin.sbcglobal.net) |
| 23:07.17 | Wobin | amro: There's -always- revenue benefit to any sort of social media information gathering |
| 23:07.31 | Wobin | You don't think Google does what it does out of fairy gold? |
| 23:07.38 | amro | Wobin: they already have the informatino |
| 23:07.42 | Torhal | I know Wobin! He said "hi" to me once! |
| 23:07.45 | Wobin | but they can get -more- |
| 23:07.46 | amro | where's the revenue from revealing it to everyone? |
| 23:07.58 | Wobin | the benefit is in the interactions |
| 23:08.05 | Wobin | and the data gathered from said interactions |
| 23:08.23 | Wobin | Social media info is useless alone |
| 23:08.37 | Wobin | it's benefit is in how it interacts with other media |
| 23:08.40 | Wobin | (thus the social) |
| 23:08.50 | cog|work | "some guy ran in and tried to steal my kill - so I ran ahead and agroed everything then vanished dumping it all on him" |
| 23:08.54 | cog|work | go mrs cog >< |
| 23:09.07 | Wobin | cog|work: You're totally corrupting her =P |
| 23:09.20 | cog|work | Wobin: she needed no help from me :) |
| 23:09.42 | cog|work | (one could say i need her help, since she plays wow way more than i do :> ) |
| 23:10.32 | amro | Wobin: I still don't see why making it available to everyone (and not just other users) is beneficial |
| 23:10.50 | Jamash | I don't think it is |
| 23:11.30 | amro | and I don't see why they can't just make celestial steed II if they need more money :P |
| 23:11.42 | amro | no need to take risks |
| 23:11.56 | Jamash | celestial steed II, son of celestial steed |
| 23:12.05 | Jamash | this one is exactly the same, but half the size |
| 23:12.11 | amro | celestial pony |
| 23:12.17 | amro | that would sell |
| 23:12.20 | Jamash | sure |
| 23:12.21 | Wobin | Celestial Steed O'CelestialSteed? |
| 23:12.23 | ZorbaTHut | just keep releasing new, smaller horses every time the funds run low |
| 23:12.29 | A-KO | hey |
| 23:12.31 | A-KO | I like my sparkle pony |
| 23:12.33 | A-KO | thank you very much |
| 23:12.38 | A-KO | in fact I'm riding around on it right now |
| 23:13.06 | Wobin | they'll release another sparkle pony |
| 23:13.09 | Wobin | but this time pink |
| 23:13.19 | Wobin | and all the husbands/bfs will have to buy it again |
| 23:13.38 | A-KO | Almost 50k posts, with those posts being made by a little over 13k accounts. |
| 23:13.42 | A-KO | lol |
| 23:13.55 | A-KO | so an average of 4 posts per account |
| 23:13.56 | A-KO | nice |
| 23:14.30 | A-KO | you know the only thing that sucks about Cata is trying to get friends to play WoW--I don't even want to mention it until Cataclysm releases |
| 23:14.37 | A-KO | because it'll just be a much better game experience for them |
| 23:14.41 | *** join/#wowuidev mrpoundsign_ (~mrpoundsi@99-185-41-30.lightspeed.sntcca.sbcglobal.net) |
| 23:15.01 | Pneumatus | only if they get everything fixed :> |
| 23:15.01 | A-KO | damn it's already 7:15 |
| 23:15.03 | Wobin | and it'll be massively confusing for them if they start now, and switch over |
| 23:15.06 | *** join/#wowuidev mrpoundsign (~mrpoundsi@99-185-41-30.lightspeed.sntcca.sbcglobal.net) |
| 23:15.10 | A-KO | yeah wobin |
| 23:15.20 | harl | nah, it's 1:15 ;) |
| 23:15.29 | Wobin | 9:15 on a sat morning >< |
| 23:15.30 | A-KO | honestly, after I get my druid to 85, I"ll level a char |
| 23:15.53 | Wobin | A-KO: by that time the newbie areas will have calmed down slightly =P |
| 23:16.33 | A-KO | I just race to max level |
| 23:16.41 | A-KO | it's just a thing I do when the expansions hit |
| 23:16.53 | A-KO | I hope they do something cooler with Cataclysm's collector's though |
| 23:17.03 | A-KO | a figurine of Deathwing would be pretty bad ass |
| 23:17.12 | A-KO | you know, I never did get my figures I ordered at blizzcon |
| 23:17.23 | A-KO | kinda bothering me now |
| 23:17.35 | A-KO | I mean, they didn't charge me yet--but I was kind of expecting 'em |
| 23:17.52 | bleeter | yeah 9:15 sta morning |
| 23:17.54 | bleeter | sat |
| 23:18.06 | bleeter | I agree with Wobin, everyone else is backwards |
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| 23:20.20 | Wobin | http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FOHJUrcVdJk&feature=player_embedded# |
| 23:20.21 | Wobin | awww |
| 23:20.31 | Wobin | The Adventures of Lil'Cthulhu |
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| 23:27.04 | taroven | haste: Ping |
| 23:28.23 | A-KO | http://www.break.com/index/girlfriend-pranked-with-pube-mustache |
| 23:28.25 | A-KO | owned |
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| 23:29.49 | alestane | welcomes Peppy back with food. |
| 23:30.06 | alestane | Apples okay, or no? |
| 23:30.58 | Shirik | tackles Lopeppeppy |
| 23:31.39 | Lopeppeppy | they are edible, but I don't much count them as "food" |
| 23:31.41 | Lopeppeppy | Heya, Shirik! |
| 23:31.52 | Lopeppeppy | Oh, crap, no, no fruit. |
| 23:32.24 | alestane | Was afraid of that. Frittata has apples in it. |
| 23:33.53 | alestane | And milk, might not be okay for lactose. |
| 23:34.22 | Lopeppeppy | nope. very not on the menu |
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| 23:46.01 | Shirik | "A discovery of three antibodies that neutralize over 90% of HIV strains has the potential to possibly lead to a future vaccine, according to an article published in Science magazine." |
| 23:53.09 | NeoTron | so how do they test such a vaccine? |
| 23:53.16 | NeoTron | not like people would volunteer to get infected |
| 23:53.47 | Shirik | well apparently the vaccine isn't through the use of dead viruses |
| 23:53.50 | Shirik | it's through the use of antibodies |
| 23:54.05 | Shirik | It seems surprising that a person with HIV infection can carry powerful anti-HIV antibodies and not be cured. But other recent studies suggest that as many as one in four people with HIV infection may carry such antibodies. |
| 23:54.07 | NeoTron | but it's preventing the infection stage, not curing already infected cells |
| 23:54.14 | Shirik | The problem is that the antibodies appear naturally only long after HIV has established a death grip on the body. Because the virus replicates often and mutates quickly, people don't just carry a single strain of HIV -- their blood swarms with a vast number of HIV "quasi-species." By the time a person develops neutralizing antibodies, the virus has had time to evolve escape variants. |
| 23:54.14 | Shirik | But if a vaccine were able to elicit neutralizing antibodies before a person was exposed to HIV, it's very likely the antibodies would keep the virus from taking root. |
| 23:54.46 | NeoTron | from what I read on this one, it attacks the "hook" the virus uses to attach itself to cells |
| 23:54.53 | Shirik | I found this more interesting though: |
| 23:54.55 | Shirik | The finding has implications far beyond HIV and AIDS. The new techniques used to find the anti-HIV antibodies can be used to spur research into vaccines against other diseases that have long stymied researchers. |
| 23:54.57 | NeoTron | but that makes it sound as if the virus is already attached, you're SOL |
| 23:55.03 | NeoTron | thus vaccine, not cur |
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