| 00:07.00 | Fisker | ok i don't like you anymore Shirik |
| 00:09.11 | frontendloader | I always thought some of the shit uploaded to WP was absolutely ridiculous |
| 00:09.17 | frontendloader | do we really need a page on Prince Albert? |
| 00:09.28 | frontendloader | with an actual Prince Albert shown |
| 00:10.42 | frontendloader | Its like there is some sort of contest running somewhere, "How many places can you get your dick posted on wikipedia and have it stay" |
| 00:13.59 | frontendloader | This sudden bout of moral perspective from Jimmy Wales is quite the contrast to how he got his start on the internet |
| 00:14.50 | Shirik | I hate you for making me look up Prince Albert |
| 00:15.15 | frontendloader | heh |
| 00:16.07 | Torhal | Shirik: You continually frighten me with your innocence. Especially since you're a WP admin. |
| 00:16.17 | Shirik | why should I know that crap |
| 00:16.44 | Cide | newbie admin* |
| 00:17.01 | Shirik | hey fu |
| 00:17.01 | Torhal | Because you're on the Internet, where Rainbows and Unicorns dare not tread. |
| 00:17.14 | Shirik | http://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Special:Log&user=Shirik |
| 00:17.17 | Shirik | does that look like newbie to you?! |
| 00:17.25 | frontendloader | I'm not sure what the specifics are, but Jimmy Wales did get his start with websites catering to Men. |
| 00:17.38 | frontendloader | in the sexual sense |
| 00:20.06 | Shirik | ? |
| 00:20.07 | Shirik | really? |
| 00:20.58 | Torhal | Shirik: Bomis.com |
| 00:21.04 | Torhal | It's actually on Wikipedia :) |
| 00:21.10 | Lunessa | Shirik: Embrace the freakiness! EBRACE IT I SAY! |
| 00:21.23 | Lunessa | Learn to spell, Lunessa. |
| 00:25.24 | Lopeppeppy | Braces can be sexy. I guess. |
| 00:26.18 | Lunessa | Only if you don't mind getting hair ripped out. |
| 00:26.37 | Lopeppeppy | *blink blink* |
| 00:26.41 | Lopeppeppy | Some things are worth it? |
| 00:26.46 | Lunessa | ... |
| 00:27.42 | Shirik | is confuzzled |
| 00:28.07 | ScytheBlade1 | So it seems that chrome is in fact, fast |
| 00:28.22 | Cide | yes, yes it is |
| 00:28.30 | ScytheBlade1 | As in, stupidly fast |
| 00:28.34 | Cide | yes, yes it is |
| 00:28.41 | Cide | potato gun fast |
| 00:28.50 | ScytheBlade1 | Like beating firefox out by 6.63x on my CPU |
| 00:29.00 | ScytheBlade1 | eh that demo was kinda meh |
| 00:29.05 | ScytheBlade1 | too many variables, too many ways to cheese that one |
| 00:29.20 | ScytheBlade1 | and the sound one, note that the sound hit the microphone way before it hit the ear |
| 00:29.24 | ScytheBlade1 | Soooooooo |
| 00:34.53 | frontendloader | I've been using chrome for quite some time now just because it launches 10x as fast as firefox on my computer |
| 00:35.35 | ScytheBlade1 | if I could kill flash, it'd be even faster overall |
| 00:35.36 | ScytheBlade1 | stupid flash |
| 00:35.47 | frontendloader | the only drawback of chrome is no noscript yet |
| 00:36.01 | Cide | what do you need it for? |
| 00:36.04 | ScytheBlade1 | techie-buzz.com/browsers/disable-javascript-images-cookies-in-google-chrome.html |
| 00:36.08 | frontendloader | browsing seedy porn sites |
| 00:36.16 | frontendloader | that have talkies |
| 00:36.16 | Cide | point taken |
| 00:36.38 | frontendloader | gotta selectively disable javascript sometimes ScytheBlade1 |
| 00:36.43 | frontendloader | block one domain but not another |
| 00:37.17 | frontendloader | oh snap |
| 00:37.22 | frontendloader | did not know about that yet |
| 00:38.11 | frontendloader | uninstalling firefox now |
| 00:38.51 | ScytheBlade1 | I build chrome from source on 64-bit linux |
| 00:38.53 | ScytheBlade1 | and it be fast |
| 00:39.10 | frontendloader | do you unroll your loops? |
| 00:39.13 | ScytheBlade1 | =] |
| 00:39.19 | ScytheBlade1 | no I use stock compile options |
| 00:39.41 | *** join/#wowuidev Kandoko (~Kandoko@WoWUIDev/Norganna/Developer/Kandoko) |
| 00:39.44 | frontendloader | http://funroll-loops.info/ |
| 00:39.53 | ScytheBlade1 | I am aware of the site |
| 00:43.16 | ScytheBlade1 | related: if anyone wants a 64-bit linux build of chrome for fedora 12.. I've got a nice portable .tar.gz |
| 00:45.08 | *** join/#wowuidev Legorol (~legorol@cpc8-sgyl28-2-0-cust43.sgyl.cable.virginmedia.com) |
| 00:45.08 | *** mode/#wowuidev [+v Legorol] by ChanServ |
| 00:46.09 | Shirik | wtf http://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=User_talk:Rtgh12345&oldid=360816752 |
| 00:47.29 | Lopeppeppy | Crack. |
| 00:48.37 | Lopeppeppy | That's the only thing I can think. |
| 00:48.40 | Cide | Chuck Norris destroyed the periodic table, because Chuck Norris only recognizes the element of surprise. |
| 00:48.42 | Cide | classic |
| 00:49.22 | Lopeppeppy | I did rather like that one. |
| 00:58.06 | Dagmar | hahah |
| 00:58.24 | Dagmar | That's probably the first one of those I've thought was funny |
| 01:10.05 | Shirik | http://www.foxnews.com/scitech/2010/05/07/wikipedia-purges-porn/ |
| 01:10.12 | Shirik | I love how fox news is like "OH LOOK WHAT WE DID LOLOLOLOL" |
| 01:10.19 | kd3 | it's fox... |
| 01:10.21 | kd3 | what else is new? |
| 01:10.30 | kd3 | nice to see that they didn't run the rebuttal either |
| 01:14.34 | *** join/#wowuidev alestane (~alestane@c-98-217-60-101.hsd1.ma.comcast.net) |
| 01:14.34 | *** mode/#wowuidev [+v alestane] by ChanServ |
| 01:16.43 | Shirik | I like the responses to the article |
| 01:16.59 | Shirik | Only Fox News can curtail free speech while plastering scantily clad women all over their home page. Classic. |
| 01:17.51 | tem | oh christ low level 2v2 is terrible |
| 01:18.00 | tem | nothing but cheese and you constantly win |
| 01:18.08 | Cide | wanna play some tem? |
| 01:18.12 | Cide | 1v1 |
| 01:18.14 | Cide | or 2v2 |
| 01:18.16 | Dagmar | Time to link the Fox article from Memestreams |
| 01:18.18 | Cide | or any combination |
| 01:18.22 | Dagmar | We've got pretty goddamn good pagerank |
| 01:18.32 | tem | I will not play against toss in 1v1 until they fix phoenix harass |
| 01:18.39 | Cide | :( |
| 01:18.52 | tem | I do not enjoy being supply capped from minute 5 on |
| 01:18.53 | Cide | I've actually used phoenixes vs zerg a long long time |
| 01:19.09 | Cide | but now they're ridiculous |
| 01:19.11 | Shirik | oh phoenix vs overlord |
| 01:19.15 | Shirik | probably sucks |
| 01:19.21 | Shirik | omg |
| 01:19.22 | Cide | my 1v1 toss vs zerg strategy has been |
| 01:19.31 | Cide | get phoenixes, kill some overlords |
| 01:19.45 | Cide | and then tech to colossi and march in with zealots/colossi |
| 01:19.53 | Cide | the zerg player usually has a bunch of hydras then |
| 01:20.08 | Cide | but now zerg players will learn to defend better :( |
| 01:20.17 | kd3 | zerg? defend? |
| 01:20.19 | tem | if you're good at killing ovies, the zerg player will have nothing |
| 01:20.31 | Cide | it wasn't for the sake of killing overlords |
| 01:20.35 | tem | it's infuriating |
| 01:20.38 | Cide | just to force the zerg player to get hydras |
| 01:20.59 | tem | hydra/roach poops all over zealot/collosus |
| 01:20.59 | frontendloader | phoenixes are really awesome now |
| 01:21.03 | frontendloader | with the moveshoot |
| 01:21.20 | tem | and if it doesn't your mix of roach/hydra is off |
| 01:21.20 | Cide | overpowered yeah |
| 01:21.32 | Cide | tem: maybe, that's what I wanted to test vs you |
| 01:21.55 | tem | you know I'll just go mutas now since you're expecting roach/hydra, right? |
| 01:22.03 | tem | oops, maybe I won't |
| 01:22.08 | tem | :P |
| 01:22.12 | Cide | maybe you will :P |
| 01:22.20 | Cide | but we won't know until we try it |
| 01:22.22 | tem | yeah let's play a couple |
| 01:22.24 | frontendloader | PvZ is all about getting your mixture right for both races |
| 01:22.27 | *** join/#wowuidev Alram (~Marla@fabe.xs4all.nl) |
| 01:22.36 | tem | PvZ used to be my favorite matchup |
| 01:22.43 | frontendloader | Z is Roach/Hydra and then Infestors later on too |
| 01:22.55 | tem | I can't get infestors to do what I want |
| 01:22.55 | frontendloader | Infestors are so overpowered against colossi |
| 01:23.05 | Cide | overpowered is tossed around too much |
| 01:23.08 | Cide | infestors have like 5 hp |
| 01:23.10 | tem | infestors are only good if you can get your opponent to not notice them |
| 01:23.20 | frontendloader | Yeah I let that word slip out more than I should |
| 01:23.22 | tem | which never happens for me |
| 01:23.27 | frontendloader | but they're really amazing at countering colossi |
| 01:23.39 | Cide | now neural parasite takes tech though |
| 01:23.49 | tem | that's a really silly change imo |
| 01:23.50 | frontendloader | since their parasite is 9 range, same as the colossus shot range |
| 01:24.05 | Cide | tem: they had a pretty good explanation I thought |
| 01:24.07 | frontendloader | if your army is far enough up the protosses ass |
| 01:24.09 | tem | parasite is REALLY hard to use |
| 01:24.13 | frontendloader | he can't get to your infestor |
| 01:24.15 | tem | REALLY REALLY hard to use |
| 01:24.18 | tem | now it's even harder |
| 01:24.19 | tem | like woah |
| 01:25.06 | frontendloader | yea it takes a bit of finesse |
| 01:25.42 | frontendloader | but really no more than not sucking at micro with a P army |
| 01:25.53 | frontendloader | zealots in first, followed by stalker/sentry/immortal |
| 01:25.57 | frontendloader | adn colossus in the back |
| 01:28.13 | Thunder_Child | whats the 3rd free voip in the same vein as vent and TS3? |
| 01:28.48 | frontendloader | mumble |
| 01:28.52 | Thunder_Child | ty |
| 01:29.09 | frontendloader | wouldn't call vent free >_> |
| 01:30.48 | Thunder_Child | neither is the other 2 |
| 01:30.54 | Thunder_Child | i worded that wrong |
| 01:32.31 | frontendloader | just doing my duty to be a pedant on the internet |
| 01:42.52 | *** join/#wowuidev Wobin (~Wobin@203-214-143-109.perm.iinet.net.au) |
| 01:47.05 | Dagmar | Shirik: http://www.memestreams.net/thread/bid78327/ |
| 01:47.19 | Dagmar | People need to write moar articles like that |
| 01:47.39 | Wobin | http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CKNqc3a9Xqs&feature=player_embedded |
| 01:48.13 | Dagmar | Wobin: wha... |
| 01:48.19 | *** join/#wowuidev sylvanaar (~sylvanaar@unaffiliated/sylvanaar) |
| 01:48.31 | Wobin | ^^ |
| 01:48.39 | Wobin | totally unrelated to your link |
| 01:48.49 | Dagmar | Yeah but ... lol |
| 01:49.24 | Dagmar | I'm gonna make some calls here in a minute to get the ms article relinked but that yt post of yours is something I'll probably be shilling to people tomorrow. :) |
| 01:49.51 | Dagmar | It's positively unhinged. |
| 01:50.02 | Dagmar | ...and possibly contains more reality than the FOXNews article |
| 01:50.18 | Dagmar | Actually, I think it *does* contain more reality than the FOXNews article |
| 01:50.25 | Wobin | I totally agree with you |
| 01:50.44 | Wobin | we -must- find out when the FOXNews editors stopped molesting children for better ratings! |
| 01:50.53 | Wobin | WON'T SOMEONE THINK OF THE CHILDREN? |
| 01:52.45 | Thunder_Child | i do....so sexy |
| 01:55.57 | Thunder_Child | thinks of Wobin as a child |
| 01:56.36 | Wobin | sits on Thunder_Child's lap and bounces up and down. Hard. |
| 01:57.06 | Thunder_Child | has a cup |
| 01:57.27 | Wobin | smacks the cup into Thunder_Child's face a few times |
| 01:57.51 | Thunder_Child | wrong kind of cup Wobin |
| 01:58.02 | Wobin | We're talking about children here =P |
| 01:58.19 | Thunder_Child | whats that have to do with anything? |
| 01:58.35 | Wobin | You tell a kid that you have a cup... they're going to want to see what it takes to break it |
| 01:59.06 | Thunder_Child | more than bouncing |
| 01:59.07 | Shirik | Dagmar: Forwarded to #wikipedia-en :) |
| 01:59.11 | Dagmar | Heheh |
| 01:59.19 | Wobin | gets a hammer |
| 01:59.26 | Thunder_Child | gets a gun |
| 02:00.18 | Wobin | <PROTECTED> |
| 02:04.55 | Shirik | any music buffs around? |
| 02:05.02 | Shirik | Have you ever heard of a song in... |
| 02:05.09 | Shirik | 11/16 time? |
| 02:05.26 | Shirik | this song is really messing with my head |
| 02:05.34 | Shirik | the best I can boil it down to is 11/16 |
| 02:05.36 | Wobin | how did you even figure that out? =P |
| 02:05.43 | Shirik | uh |
| 02:05.57 | Shirik | it does 3 bars of 3/4 followed by a sporadic 2 beats |
| 02:06.06 | Shirik | the best I can think is it's 11/16 time |
| 02:06.24 | Wobin | does it need to be that regimented? |
| 02:06.34 | Wobin | Or can it just have a change in time signature for that section? |
| 02:06.38 | Shirik | it could |
| 02:06.42 | Shirik | but doing that over and over again is odd |
| 02:06.50 | Wobin | Or Prog rock =) |
| 02:15.48 | *** join/#wowuidev Yssaril|Away (~Yssaril@99-57-32-25.lightspeed.cicril.sbcglobal.net) |
| 02:16.03 | *** join/#wowuidev me345 (~me345@adsl-75-15-180-83.dsl.bkfd14.sbcglobal.net) |
| 02:17.59 | Wobin | http://www.smh.com.au/entertainment/restaurants-and-bars/this-real-iron-chef-will-make-you-pay-20100507-ujo6.html |
| 02:18.08 | Wobin | we need more restaurants like this |
| 02:20.47 | *** join/#wowuidev Yssaril|Away (~Yssaril@99-57-32-25.lightspeed.cicril.sbcglobal.net) |
| 02:21.40 | *** join/#wowuidev cygni (~slip@207.62.146.125) |
| 02:22.50 | Shirik | FUCK YEAH |
| 02:22.53 | Shirik | I love my professor |
| 02:23.09 | Shirik | I got a 79.1 in his class, but he was nice enough to give me a B because I never missed a class, etc. |
| 02:23.14 | Shirik | I hate history so much |
| 02:23.35 | kd3 | "Oh, I'm a sysop on enwiki. Could you give me a hand?" |
| 02:23.45 | Shirik | rofl |
| 02:23.46 | Shirik | no |
| 02:24.11 | Shirik | though honestly, any grade would have done so long as I didn't fail |
| 02:25.00 | Shirik | ahahaha and I STILL have a 4.0 on my graduate transcript |
| 02:25.08 | Shirik | shit I'm 1 semester away from graduating with a 4.0 |
| 02:25.19 | *** join/#wowuidev Yssarilz (~Yssaril@99-57-32-25.lightspeed.cicril.sbcglobal.net) |
| 02:26.00 | *** join/#wowuidev Yssaril|Away (~Yssaril@99-57-32-25.lightspeed.cicril.sbcglobal.net) |
| 02:27.19 | Shirik | I love my transcript notes |
| 02:28.15 | Shirik | In order, "Advanced Standing Granted", "Academic Probation", "Honor Roll", "Honor Roll", "Dean's List", "Cum: 4.0" |
| 02:28.17 | Thunder_Child | tekkub: http://www.playfractal.com/ same guys as cpyherprime |
| 02:28.22 | Thunder_Child | cipherprime* |
| 02:30.49 | *** join/#wowuidev Yssaril|Away (~Yssaril@99-57-32-25.lightspeed.cicril.sbcglobal.net) |
| 02:35.48 | *** join/#wowuidev Yssarilz (~Yssaril@99-57-32-25.lightspeed.cicril.sbcglobal.net) |
| 02:37.49 | *** join/#wowuidev Yssaril|Away (~Yssaril@99-57-32-25.lightspeed.cicril.sbcglobal.net) |
| 02:40.33 | *** join/#wowuidev ckknight (~ckknight@WoWUIDev/WoWAce/CurseStaff/CurseForge/ckknight) |
| 02:40.33 | *** mode/#wowuidev [+o ckknight] by ChanServ |
| 02:42.49 | *** join/#wowuidev Yssaril|Away (~Yssaril@99-57-32-25.lightspeed.cicril.sbcglobal.net) |
| 02:43.49 | *** join/#wowuidev Yssaril|Away (~Yssaril@99-57-32-25.lightspeed.cicril.sbcglobal.net) |
| 02:44.57 | *** join/#wowuidev Yssaril|Away (~Yssaril@99-57-32-25.lightspeed.cicril.sbcglobal.net) |
| 02:49.49 | *** join/#wowuidev Yssaril|Away (~Yssaril@99-57-32-25.lightspeed.cicril.sbcglobal.net) |
| 02:51.28 | *** join/#wowuidev Yssaril|Away (~Yssaril@99-57-32-25.lightspeed.cicril.sbcglobal.net) |
| 02:53.02 | Thunder_Child | Cairenn: ^^ |
| 02:53.19 | *** mode/#wowuidev [+b *!*@99-57-32-25.lightspeed.cicril.sbcglobal.net] by Cairenn |
| 02:57.41 | Shirik | fu Thunder_Child |
| 02:58.16 | Thunder_Child | Shirik: the least time you asked me to do that i did what i did and then i had to explain it to you, Cairenn is more.....intuitive |
| 02:58.19 | Thunder_Child | last* |
| 02:58.20 | Lunessa | Maybe he thought you were busy... |
| 02:58.35 | Shirik | :( |
| 03:05.36 | *** join/#wowuidev Gintaro (~Gintaro@cc1040670-a.gorre1.fr.home.nl) |
| 03:10.45 | Sargeras | Hello Cairenn, this is your 8:08PM PST appointment of one (1) hug. |
| 03:10.52 | Sargeras | hugs Cairenn |
| 03:10.54 | Cairenn | hugs Sargeras |
| 03:11.17 | Cairenn | Thanks Sargeras, I appreciate you keeping the appointment |
| 03:11.22 | Cairenn | ;) |
| 03:11.37 | Torhal | That'll be $35? |
| 03:12.29 | Sargeras | my hugs are free |
| 03:12.38 | Sargeras | I'm an equal opportunity lover |
| 03:12.43 | kd3 | only $35? getting off cheap |
| 03:12.44 | Cairenn | :) |
| 03:13.12 | Sargeras | Dolby has been getting hugs for years from me |
| 03:13.17 | Sargeras | because he's THE MAN |
| 03:13.24 | Sargeras | wait for it.... |
| 03:13.31 | Cairenn | As the expression goes .... "He may be easy, sleazy and cheap, but he's choosy!" |
| 03:13.36 | *** kick/#wowuidev [Sargeras!~mpdelbuon@WoWUIDev/WoWIStaff/Norganna/StatisticalEngineer/Shirik] by Shirik (Dolby told me to) |
| 03:13.40 | Cairenn | lol |
| 03:13.44 | dolby | ? |
| 03:13.49 | *** join/#wowuidev Sargeras (~Sargeras@cpe-72-129-100-195.socal.res.rr.com) |
| 03:13.52 | Cairenn | lol |
| 03:13.54 | Sargeras | Shirik |
| 03:14.02 | dolby | lol |
| 03:14.08 | Sargeras | cry |
| 03:14.09 | Sargeras | emi |
| 03:14.11 | Sargeras | emo* |
| 03:14.13 | dolby | thanks Shadowed |
| 03:14.14 | Sargeras | HI DOLBY |
| 03:14.15 | dolby | err |
| 03:14.17 | dolby | Shirik: |
| 03:14.17 | Shirik | wow |
| 03:14.20 | Shirik | no <3 |
| 03:14.22 | dolby | damn tab |
| 03:14.46 | dolby | hi Sargeras |
| 03:17.39 | Sargeras | how are you sir? |
| 03:18.09 | Sargeras | I dont see you on SC2, I haz a sad |
| 03:18.43 | dolby | you havent been in sc2 for weeks last i checked |
| 03:19.02 | Sargeras | Thor.durin? |
| 03:19.06 | Sargeras | or mah email |
| 03:19.10 | dolby | which was a couple days ago when i was trying out the mac client |
| 03:19.58 | Sargeras | hmmm, guess I should play him more |
| 03:20.03 | Sargeras | it more* |
| 03:20.24 | dolby | thought i had your email |
| 03:20.39 | Sargeras | sargeras@dolbyistheman.com |
| 03:21.22 | Cairenn | lol |
| 03:21.28 | *** join/#wowuidev Hirsute (~chatzilla@WoWUIDev/Norganna/Developer/Hirsute) |
| 03:21.49 | dolby | sighs |
| 03:22.09 | dolby | you know if i was the man i could get you to stop saying that |
| 03:22.19 | Hirsute | Bah. |
| 03:22.21 | kd3 | dolby: the man |
| 03:22.43 | dolby | lies |
| 03:22.44 | Hirsute | So, I'm trying to write a macro to switch me between full-screen and windowed mode. Only thing I've found is the CVar gxWindow, but I can't figure out how, once I've set it, to make it take effect. |
| 03:23.19 | kd3 | don't remember if it's gxrestart or reloadui, but one of those console commands should do it |
| 03:23.22 | kd3 | afaik |
| 03:23.25 | kd3 | it may take a client restart |
| 03:24.16 | Hirsute | Hrmm. There's an "apply" button on the ui that makes it work without a client restart. I wonder if gxrestart will do it. |
| 03:26.33 | Hirsute | gxrestart did it, now I just need to learn the proper way to set the CVar and run gxrestart in the same macro. |
| 03:26.38 | dolby | Sargeras: sc2 says you havent been on for a week |
| 03:26.53 | Sargeras | yeah this week has been busy |
| 03:27.00 | Sargeras | had corporate VIPs in from DC |
| 03:27.20 | Sargeras | work related ---^ |
| 03:27.32 | dolby | well, stop complainin about be not being on. its you =p |
| 03:27.42 | Sargeras | cries |
| 03:27.59 | Sargeras | I'd play some now, but we're seeing Ironman 2 tonught |
| 03:29.48 | dolby | sc2 mac client is buggy |
| 03:37.21 | Hirsute | Yay, I win. |
| 03:38.01 | Hirsute | Thanks for pointing me to gxrestart, kd3 |
| 03:38.20 | *** join/#wowuidev Thunder_Child (~Thunder_C@WoWUIDev/PITA/TC) |
| 03:39.22 | *** join/#wowuidev dolby (~dolby@MMOI/Administrator/pdpc.silver.dolby) |
| 03:39.22 | *** mode/#wowuidev [+o dolby] by ChanServ |
| 03:39.40 | kd3 | np |
| 03:54.32 | Thunder_Child | want http://gizmodo.com/5533412/the-nas-you-would-like-to-build-yourself |
| 03:54.55 | Thunder_Child | want in 2.5TB but want none the less |
| 04:09.58 | kd3 | good lord |
| 04:10.45 | Arrowmaster | 8 2TB drives in a raid5 is just stupid |
| 04:11.03 | ScytheBlade1 | why? |
| 04:11.57 | Shirik | I agree with Arrowmaster |
| 04:11.57 | Arrowmaster | if a drive ever fails, its going to take days to rebuild the array and that kinda stress is going to make the chances of another drive failing while its rebuilding kinda high |
| 04:12.08 | ScytheBlade1 | as compared to any other array? |
| 04:12.15 | Shirik | Well I just think it's stupid because SERIOUSLY WTF ARE YOU GOING TO DO WITH ALL THAT |
| 04:12.26 | Shirik | what is that |
| 04:12.31 | ScytheBlade1 | I've got a similar thing specced out in newegg |
| 04:12.32 | Shirik | lua> 2/3 * 8 * 2 |
| 04:12.35 | lua_bot | Shirik: 10.666666666667 |
| 04:12.36 | Arrowmaster | hey i have an 8 1TB drive array |
| 04:12.36 | ScytheBlade1 | I just can't find a decent case :( |
| 04:12.39 | Shirik | 10 TB |
| 04:12.40 | Shirik | seriously |
| 04:12.44 | kd3 | looks at his 2TB raid nearly full |
| 04:12.46 | Shirik | even kd3 can't use that much |
| 04:12.53 | kd3 | you wanna bet? |
| 04:12.59 | ScytheBlade1 | I've got 4TB sitting around |
| 04:13.07 | Shirik | key words SITTING AROUND |
| 04:13.16 | Arrowmaster | Filesystem Size Used Avail Use% Mounted on |
| 04:13.16 | Arrowmaster | /dev/mapper/storage-data |
| 04:13.16 | Arrowmaster | <PROTECTED> |
| 04:13.22 | ScytheBlade1 | This is why it is called STORAGE |
| 04:13.22 | ScytheBlade1 | =] |
| 04:13.51 | Shirik | That being said |
| 04:13.55 | Shirik | I do need to get a few TB soon |
| 04:14.00 | Shirik | I need to start dumping my pictures somewhere |
| 04:14.13 | ScytheBlade1 | Sounds like you could absolutely use one of those arrays |
| 04:14.29 | Shirik | no |
| 04:14.37 | Shirik | even with 25MB/picture I couldn't use that much |
| 04:14.47 | Shirik | lua> 10 * 1024 * 1024 / 25 |
| 04:14.47 | lua_bot | Shirik: 419430.4 |
| 04:14.54 | Shirik | 419 thousand pictures |
| 04:15.01 | Shirik | that's the life of my camera |
| 04:15.10 | kd3 | a nigerian scammer thousand pictures? |
| 04:15.28 | Shirik | my camera is due for maintenance at 50k shots |
| 04:15.37 | Shirik | I would have sent it in 10 times before I hit that |
| 04:16.31 | ScytheBlade1 | http://www.willudesign.com/Black_Dwarf/wireing.jpg |
| 04:16.34 | ScytheBlade1 | that's epic |
| 04:17.16 | ScytheBlade1 | I really need a case similar to that |
| 04:17.30 | ScytheBlade1 | Unfortunately, they are all custom, and I lack the tools to create one :/ |
| 04:17.32 | *** join/#wowuidev Wobin (~Wobin@203-214-143-109.perm.iinet.net.au) |
| 04:18.04 | Arrowmaster | usb? |
| 04:18.21 | ScytheBlade1 | SATA based |
| 04:20.01 | ScytheBlade1 | I would not slot them that close together, however |
| 04:21.31 | Arrowmaster | http://kotaku.com/5533677/experience-trons-legacy-with-space-paranoids-online |
| 04:21.37 | Arrowmaster | how the fuck am i supposed to play this |
| 04:22.19 | Arrowmaster | what the fuck is this shit? |
| 04:22.21 | Arrowmaster | activex? |
| 04:26.51 | Arrowmaster | http://unity3d.com/unity/system-requirements |
| 04:26.53 | Arrowmaster | fail |
| 04:26.57 | Arrowmaster | total fucking fail |
| 04:33.16 | *** join/#wowuidev Jamash (~chatzilla@99-92-174-69.lightspeed.iplsin.sbcglobal.net) |
| 04:35.53 | Arrowmaster | http://kotaku.com/5533787/its-not-the-size-of-the-game-world-but-how-you-use-it |
| 04:36.09 | Arrowmaster | islands in gta3 vs city blocks in burnout paradise |
| 04:36.26 | Arrowmaster | just goes to show you how fucking fast your driving in burnout paradise |
| 04:36.51 | Shirik | Fisker |
| 04:38.32 | Wobin | hehe |
| 04:38.44 | Wobin | Groo Woo Spoo! |
| 04:38.50 | Shirik | ? |
| 04:38.58 | Shirik | yo gabba gabba? |
| 04:39.43 | Wobin | http://www.escapistmagazine.com/videos/view/zero-punctuation/1684-Splinter-Cell-Conviction |
| 05:11.39 | Antiarc | http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_gqs97eJFfM >_> |
| 05:18.40 | Stanzilla | Antiarc: stop cheating |
| 05:19.34 | *** join/#wowuidev [Wobin] (~Wobin@203-214-143-109.perm.iinet.net.au) |
| 05:20.04 | Shirik | seriously, wtf: http://pastey.net/136256 |
| 05:20.35 | [Wobin] | Antiarc, rofl |
| 05:20.36 | [Wobin] | awesome |
| 05:21.19 | Wobin | who needs AVR? =P |
| 05:21.23 | Wobin | or whatever it's called |
| 05:21.59 | Wobin | although it'd probably take a little time to understand how the areas move in relation to yourself |
| 05:23.22 | Arrowmaster | Shirik: did you look at the previous diff? |
| 05:23.37 | Shirik | not the point |
| 05:23.49 | Shirik | the bot came in yelling "PEDOBEAR" right after I pointed out the abbreviation CP |
| 05:30.56 | Antiarc | Wobin: It's really intuitive once you play with it |
| 05:30.58 | Antiarc | But yeah |
| 05:31.33 | cogwheel | nerdrage is bad for disk performance: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tDacjrSCeq4 |
| 05:34.07 | Antiarc | It's all range-accurate and stuff, too :D |
| 05:37.41 | *** join/#wowuidev kd3 (~kd3@wikia/kaydeethree) |
| 05:38.29 | Wobin | Antiarc, is it inbuilt into sexymap? =) |
| 05:41.10 | Antiarc | It's an evolution of SexyMap's HudMap module, but I'm abstracting it into its own addon. |
| 05:41.22 | Antiarc | It includes the gathermate/routes/tomtom integration, though |
| 05:41.36 | Antiarc | so you can just replace the sexymap module with HudMap wholesale |
| 05:51.48 | Fisker | hey Wobin |
| 05:51.51 | Fisker | also fuck you Shirik |
| 05:52.51 | Fisker | maybe if you gifted me rocket knight i would like you Shirik |
| 05:53.00 | Shirik | qq |
| 05:53.46 | Fisker | just do it |
| 05:53.47 | Fisker | jerk |
| 05:53.50 | Fisker | i need it |
| 05:54.21 | Wobin | hey Fisker |
| 05:54.48 | Fisker | no Wobin |
| 05:55.10 | Fisker | Shirik |
| 05:55.22 | Fisker | i've placed a bomb in the back of your skull |
| 05:56.08 | Fisker | you will do as i ask you Shirik |
| 05:59.19 | *** join/#wowuidev Aeyan (~pancake@cpe-174-098-002-214.triad.res.rr.com) |
| 06:00.42 | Fisker | slaps Shirik around a bit with a large trout |
| 06:02.16 | Fisker | so Shirik |
| 06:03.15 | fiercerest | i'm downloading MW4. it working fine for everyone else who grabbed it |
| 06:03.17 | fiercerest | ? |
| 06:09.21 | Fisker | Antiarc is there an event for blowing up Shirik |
| 06:09.21 | Fisker | ? |
| 06:17.03 | Sixen | Rawr. |
| 06:35.19 | Shirik | Rawr. |
| 06:37.33 | Fisker | slaps Shirik around a bit with a large trout |
| 06:43.07 | mikma | (insert action) fisker (insert object) |
| 06:43.59 | Fisker | eww not that mikma |
| 06:44.04 | Fisker | anyway Shirik is a jerk |
| 06:44.42 | mikma | ya |
| 06:45.14 | *** join/#wowuidev airtonix (~airtonix@unaffiliated/airtonix) |
| 06:48.05 | Fisker | Shirik |
| 06:49.20 | Antiarc | You know what's amazing |
| 06:49.34 | Antiarc | Saurfang 10 where only 1 DPS manages to be above 3500 with the 15% buff. |
| 06:50.22 | Fisker | wat |
| 06:54.16 | Fisker | can i count on you to kill Shirik Antiarc ? |
| 06:54.21 | *** join/#wowuidev robotusch (~robotusch@50A2E67F.flatrate.dk) |
| 06:55.03 | Torhal | Fisker: You cannot kill Shirik - his programming is contained in a vast array of digital objects. |
| 06:55.24 | Torhal | Soon, he will be integrated fully into Wikipedia. |
| 06:55.49 | Fisker | i don't care |
| 06:56.11 | Fisker | i just want my damn rocket knight |
| 06:57.41 | *** join/#wowuidev Srosh (~Srosh@d019201.adsl.hansenet.de) |
| 06:59.01 | Torhal | Fisker: I'm sure a ROM is available for a Genesis emulator... |
| 06:59.49 | Fisker | no Torhal |
| 06:59.51 | Fisker | not acceptable |
| 07:00.05 | Fisker | i will kill one hostage every hour |
| 07:03.12 | Torhal | So now Shirik will have blood on his hands? |
| 07:03.42 | Fisker | yes |
| 07:07.33 | Fisker | i wonder if Shirik understands that in less than one hour a person will die |
| 07:07.35 | Fisker | :o |
| 07:09.05 | Thunder_Child | i wonder if Fisker understands people die all the time |
| 07:09.37 | Fisker | oh sure |
| 07:09.53 | Fisker | But Shirik is responsible for these deaths |
| 07:11.08 | *** join/#wowuidev Amarande (amarande@68-191-37-155.dhcp.nwtn.ct.charter.com) |
| 07:11.39 | Torhal | That's okay, Fisker - I'm downloading Farscape. |
| 07:15.43 | Sixen | Anyone have a Maco that creates an Action bar, offhand? |
| 07:18.20 | Torhal | That question just caused a hemorrhagic seizure. |
| 07:19.22 | *** join/#wowuidev Kivnel (~lenvik@23.213.233.220.static.exetel.com.au) |
| 07:25.33 | Thunder_Child | Shirik: whats the size of the wikipedia site? |
| 07:25.39 | Shirik | big |
| 07:25.51 | Arrowmaster | Torhal: ive got the dvd box set |
| 07:25.56 | Thunder_Child | Shirik: in gb |
| 07:26.01 | Thunder_Child | or tb if you prefer |
| 07:26.06 | Shirik | I don'tk now >< |
| 07:26.11 | Shirik | actually |
| 07:26.12 | Thunder_Child | round figure? |
| 07:26.13 | Shirik | I do know |
| 07:26.14 | Shirik | sec |
| 07:27.08 | Shirik | the articles' current revisions only are 5.6GB |
| 07:27.26 | Shirik | all revisions, all pages, is listed as "several terabytes" and that's all |
| 07:27.42 | Shirik | >5 TB |
| 07:27.50 | Shirik | uncompressed of course |
| 07:27.56 | Thunder_Child | well i'll be...there is an 'offline' wiki app that wanted to DL, and it was about 5.5gb in size |
| 07:28.00 | Shirik | compressed it's 280.3GB |
| 07:28.13 | Torhal | Arrowmaster: Been seeing rumors of a BluRay release but I seriously doubt it. |
| 07:28.54 | Thunder_Child | though i would think it was less stripped of all images |
| 07:30.39 | Arrowmaster | Torhal: impossible i bet, i have the dvds that were released at the end of last year which are from a different publisher than the original dvds and seasons 1-3 on the new release is interlaced, i doubt they even have the original masters anymore and could do a bluray or even a non interlaced release |
| 07:31.31 | Torhal | Ick |
| 07:33.47 | Arrowmaster | all i can say is that vdpau "motion adaptive temporal deinterlacing with edge-guided spatial interpolation" is fucking amazing |
| 07:34.16 | Arrowmaster | only deinterlacer that actually seemed to work |
| 07:35.23 | Torhal | Ok, V is starting to make my eyes cross with the retardation. |
| 07:35.39 | Arrowmaster | the stinger? |
| 07:35.49 | Torhal | I just finished episode 8... |
| 07:35.53 | Arrowmaster | oh |
| 07:36.04 | Arrowmaster | 10 was bad |
| 07:36.06 | Torhal | I sit on them for awhile then watch a bunch in a row |
| 07:36.45 | Torhal | But the end of 8 was just goofy. Guy kills his own people because "we can't beat them". |
| 07:36.49 | Torhal | /facepalms. |
| 07:37.25 | airtonix | V is bad. |
| 07:37.36 | Arrowmaster | no just the remake is |
| 07:37.55 | Arrowmaster | has both original miniseries and the original tv series on dvd |
| 07:38.03 | airtonix | ok |
| 07:38.38 | Arrowmaster | has a lot of early 80s stuff on dvd |
| 07:38.47 | Arrowmaster | was born in mid 80s....... |
| 07:39.02 | airtonix | turns on automated goblin therapist. |
| 07:39.41 | Torhal | I haven't watched Flashforward since it went on hiatus either. I'm kinda scared to. |
| 07:39.47 | Arrowmaster | lol same |
| 07:39.53 | Torhal | Ugh |
| 07:40.01 | Arrowmaster | ive got all the episodes but i havent watched them |
| 07:40.12 | Arrowmaster | it was good though before |
| 07:40.28 | Torhal | It started getting kinda "Huh?" right before the hiatus |
| 07:40.37 | Torhal | Right now I'm sitting on 8 episodes. |
| 07:40.41 | airtonix | i have this impression flash forward is something like melrose place except the characters were probed. |
| 07:41.03 | Arrowmaster | the first few episodes were just amazing |
| 07:41.10 | airtonix | then... nose dive |
| 07:41.38 | Arrowmaster | i wouldnt say that but they stoped ending every episode with a major cliff hanger and making you crave more |
| 07:43.37 | airtonix | is anyone playing with django and django-cms ? |
| 07:48.01 | Amarande | man, three tries to solo Tusker |
| 07:48.07 | Amarande | wonder what I managed to fuck up |
| 07:48.23 | Amarande | first try she was actually at like, 242 HP left when I died :P |
| 07:48.43 | Amarande | actually, I know what I managed to fuck up. I probably shouldn't be trying to solo elites at 69 with 30k xp to 70 |
| 07:49.30 | Amarande | now for Gurok |
| 07:49.34 | Amarande | hopefully he doesn't throw me off of the world :| |
| 07:50.43 | Amarande | tusker was actually the first time so far I've failed to solo an elite in outland, too :( |
| 07:50.46 | Amarande | on my DK, anyway |
| 07:51.28 | nevcairiel | and that with 69, shame on you! |
| 07:52.34 | Amarande | nev: I'm just thinking of the gear spike at 70 and how much easier things would get then |
| 07:53.20 | nevcairiel | If you're 70, and still running around outlands, you're doing it wrong |
| 07:58.06 | Amarande | actually, Jame's horde guide recommends that you do everything you can in outland before you go to northrend |
| 07:58.30 | Amarande | presumably for the ton of extra gold you make at 80 by making a late start at northrend |
| 07:58.51 | nevcairiel | you will be done in northrend with like 4 zones completly untouched |
| 07:58.58 | robotusch | yeah |
| 07:58.59 | nevcairiel | thats stuff from 76 up |
| 07:59.43 | Amarande | also, I remember some of the starting stuff in northrend being kinda nail biting going in even at 70 with halfway decent gear |
| 07:59.46 | nevcairiel | at least if you have both +exp heirlooms |
| 07:59.50 | Amarande | it was enough to make me respec my warlock demo for 70-80, anyway |
| 08:00.00 | Amarande | lol, yeah, I forget all of you guys use heirlooms now :p |
| 08:00.02 | nevcairiel | nah, its easy |
| 08:00.07 | Amarande | then again, this is a DK |
| 08:00.21 | Amarande | also, that was tusker |
| 08:00.27 | Amarande | that had to be finished, that's part of an achievement :) |
| 08:00.28 | nevcairiel | my DK didnt have any issues soloing group quests in northrend either |
| 08:00.48 | Amarande | actually, that IS an achievement to ITSELF |
| 08:00.51 | nevcairiel | if you go straight up with 68, it can be hard |
| 08:01.00 | nevcairiel | but with 70, easy |
| 08:01.33 | Amarande | not to mention, I already have a few quests left in nagrand. it would be a shame to ditch them now. |
| 08:02.22 | Cruciformer | Good morning everyone. |
| 08:02.22 | Amarande | yes, I hate to abandon quests |
| 08:02.26 | *** join/#wowuidev Repo (~supybot@repos.curseforge.net) |
| 08:02.29 | Amarande | although I did so with my hunter because I wanted to get on with it and get to outland for master blacksmithing and engineering |
| 08:02.42 | Amarande | looks like Ackis Recipe List is out of date :| |
| 08:02.50 | robotusch | questing in Outland, I always end up in that village in Netherstorm |
| 08:02.52 | Amarande | it didn't mention I could learn the roflcopter at Thrallmar now |
| 08:02.55 | robotusch | so much XP on so little space xD |
| 08:02.57 | Amarande | Area 52? |
| 08:03.07 | robotusch | nah, down by the tower |
| 08:03.30 | Amarande | let's see ... I should be able to solo Gurok, and probably Cho'war |
| 08:03.31 | robotusch | It sucks royally as caster, but then again, I haven't levelled a caster since Vanilla |
| 08:03.35 | Amarande | Durn is just screaming "forget it, kid" |
| 08:03.36 | Torhal | Amarande: It isn't out of date if you're using 1.1.0 beta2 |
| 08:03.48 | Amarande | I remember doing Durn at *80* and he was still a bitch to solo |
| 08:04.00 | *** join/#wowuidev isman (~drag@mlr78-3-88-162-68-235.fbx.proxad.net) |
| 08:04.16 | Torhal | Amarande: I'm not ready for a release yet but it's been awhile since the last release so I've been doing stable betas. |
| 08:04.31 | robotusch | Kirin'Var Village, there it was |
| 08:05.05 | *** join/#wowuidev Aeyan (~pancake@cpe-174-098-002-214.triad.res.rr.com) |
| 08:05.13 | Amarande | also, are these comments I'm reading in the changelog for QH an indication that I will have to do cata without my handy crazy taxi quest arrow? :( |
| 08:06.10 | robotusch | Just those 4 named mobs, that's 8 quests or so you can do in a couple of minutes |
| 08:08.07 | *** join/#wowuidev Athrun-- (~drag@mlr78-3-88-162-68-235.fbx.proxad.net) |
| 08:08.27 | *** join/#wowuidev Athrun-- (~drag@mlr78-3-88-162-68-235.fbx.proxad.net) |
| 08:10.35 | *** join/#wowuidev Repo (~supybot@repos.curseforge.net) |
| 08:12.03 | *** join/#wowuidev Aeyan| (~pancake@cpe-174-098-002-214.triad.res.rr.com) |
| 08:12.21 | Torhal | Amarande: If you find stuff wrong with ARL beta2, please file tickets so I can fix it. |
| 08:13.52 | *** join/#wowuidev Aeyan| (~pancake@cpe-174-098-002-214.triad.res.rr.com) |
| 08:15.57 | *** join/#wowuidev Aeyan (~pancake@cpe-174-098-002-214.triad.res.rr.com) |
| 08:16.36 | Amarande | Dammit, Gurok. |
| 08:19.39 | Amarande | Bah! |
| 08:19.42 | Amarande | Kicked off the mountain |
| 08:19.45 | Amarande | I didn't think you COULD fall off there |
| 08:22.07 | olafski | interesting spam.. someone started following me on twitter :< |
| 08:22.30 | olafski | yeah tank gurok with your back to the wall ;) |
| 08:24.33 | Amarande | yeah, I *thought* I had my back to the wall |
| 08:27.08 | Amarande | yay, ding. |
| 08:33.49 | Amarande | you know, the upgrades at 70 alone might be enough to make the difference here |
| 08:34.11 | Amarande | rune of the fallen crusader, stronger attacks, maybe unholy presence |
| 08:38.13 | *** join/#wowuidev isman (~drag@mlr78-3-88-162-68-235.fbx.proxad.net) |
| 08:38.33 | *** join/#wowuidev isman (~drag@mlr78-3-88-162-68-235.fbx.proxad.net) |
| 08:39.07 | Amarande | aright, Gurok, you're officially on fuck-you status now |
| 08:39.20 | Amarande | picks up a couple runic healing pots, a stack of strength elixirs and some +40 strength food from the AH ... |
| 08:39.52 | Amarande | Gurok, let me introduce you to two of my friends. This is the curb, this is my jack-booted foot. |
| 08:39.58 | olafski | what a waste for the same amount of xp you could've gotten from an intro quest in northrend :P |
| 08:40.22 | olafski | even less |
| 08:40.47 | Amarande | ... holy shit, the queue time for random at 70 as dps is a half hour |
| 08:40.51 | Amarande | olafski: now it's personal :) |
| 08:41.05 | *** join/#wowuidev Caleb| (~caleb@dsl51B78AD8.pool.t-online.hu) |
| 08:41.09 | Amarande | there are some times when you just do not walk away quietly after failing to kill the elite |
| 08:41.14 | olafski | should've gone tank :P |
| 08:41.20 | Amarande | olafski: as DW-frost? :) |
| 08:41.24 | olafski | yes? |
| 08:41.39 | *** join/#wowuidev Kazie (~Kazie@188.114.158.72) |
| 08:41.40 | Amarande | you're telling me that the normal DW-frost DPS build can tank at 70? |
| 08:41.43 | olafski | that's a viable tank spec nowadays |
| 08:41.47 | olafski | maybe not with a dps build |
| 08:41.49 | Amarande | then again, with my tendency to pull aggro during the 60s, that may even be the case :) |
| 08:41.55 | olafski | but I didn't say "should've gone tank with your current build" |
| 08:42.10 | olafski | threat is not an issue.. staying alive might be |
| 08:42.11 | Amarande | thankfully, mobs usually died before they had a chance to teach me that pulling aggro was bad though ;) |
| 08:42.18 | olafski | but if you have the gear the spec doesn't matter that much until you're 80 |
| 08:43.04 | Amarande | actually, in Utgarde, there may be some advantage to tanking as a DPS build |
| 08:43.14 | Amarande | mainly, the fact that DKs get most of their "mana" by beating the living shit out of things |
| 08:43.23 | Amarande | as opposed to other tanks, whose rage/mana depends so much on getting hit |
| 08:43.25 | olafski | how does a dps build help with that? |
| 08:43.34 | Amarande | some bosses, particularly Keleseth, seem like they might be better tanked that way |
| 08:43.53 | olafski | you've gained 15 levels so far and haven't noticed the amount of runic power isn't dependent on how hard you hit? :/ |
| 08:44.06 | Amarande | I mean, we get our runic power through attacking as opposed to getting hit |
| 08:44.19 | olafski | sure but you can attack pretty much just as often as a tank as with a dps build |
| 08:44.32 | Amarande | this gives issues with Keleseth with other tank classes, because they go OOM/rage starve because of Keleseth's rather slow attack pattern (which is basically ... shadowbolt, shadowbolt, shadowbolt ... heh) |
| 08:45.01 | olafski | yeah my warrior sometimes goes out of rage.. haven't noticed trouble with druid, DK or paladin though |
| 08:45.03 | Amarande | I've noticed he *does* seem to be one of the bosses that most 5-man tanks struggle to hold aggro on when I go with my lock |
| 08:45.18 | Amarande | DKs should never have runic power issues as long as they get to keep beating the crap out of the boss |
| 08:45.25 | olafski | anyway, I still don't see how a DPS build will help with that :P |
| 08:45.27 | Amarande | that's why I say DKs have something of an advantage, even DPS DKs ... |
| 08:45.35 | Amarande | well, DPS builds are designed to whack on things more, more often :) |
| 08:45.42 | olafski | ah, DKs themselves.. sure, but not dps specifically |
| 08:46.31 | olafski | improved unholy presence might let you generate RP faster, and of course the talents that give more RP for some attacks.. but you could just as well use those in a tank build (well, not IUP) |
| 08:47.26 | olafski | either way if you have tank gear you can easily tank in a dps build, though you might be a bit more squishy than dedicated tanks.. there is also the dual spec option though |
| 08:48.48 | Amarande | oh, lord, I just love over-eager DPS |
| 08:51.35 | *** join/#wowuidev Zyonin (~Zyonin@93-38-86-239.ip69.fastwebnet.it) |
| 08:51.35 | *** mode/#wowuidev [+o Zyonin] by ChanServ |
| 08:59.55 | *** join/#wowuidev Thrae (~ircuser@generalmx-1-pt.tunnel.tserv13.ash1.ipv6.he.net) |
| 09:01.45 | jnwhiteh | Amarande: not sure if/why QuestHelper would remove the arrow, but TomTom/QH integration would be trivial.. |
| 09:01.49 | jnwhiteh | and given that we had the arrow first =) |
| 09:02.00 | jnwhiteh | well, Cartographer had the arrow first |
| 09:02.24 | jnwhiteh | who took it from MobMap.. or something like that |
| 09:03.06 | olafski | a leveling guide _and_ a quest helper addon with arrows.. that must be fun :P |
| 09:03.20 | jnwhiteh | I like TourGuide |
| 09:03.22 | jnwhiteh | because I'm lazy |
| 09:03.28 | jnwhiteh | but it's not terribly efficient,a ctually |
| 09:03.39 | olafski | I tried it for a bit and figured that I could do it better myself |
| 09:03.57 | jnwhiteh | TomTom POI integration with proximity sort actually works shockingly well |
| 09:03.58 | Wobin | eh |
| 09:04.07 | jnwhiteh | its local optimum but it works |
| 09:04.07 | Wobin | TourGuide is 'efficient enough' |
| 09:04.19 | Wobin | especially with the recent quest xp changes |
| 09:04.25 | jnwhiteh | Wobin: just not up-to-date |
| 09:04.30 | jnwhiteh | tho I haven't tried with RAF options |
| 09:04.32 | Wobin | thus the 'enough' =) |
| 09:04.37 | jnwhiteh | because I haven't been RAF for two days |
| 09:04.48 | Wobin | unless of course, you slavishly follow it to completion |
| 09:04.50 | olafski | are you tanking yet jnwhiteh? :) |
| 09:04.54 | jnwhiteh | no |
| 09:04.55 | jnwhiteh | not 15 |
| 09:04.59 | olafski | oh =( |
| 09:05.02 | jnwhiteh | dont want to waste my time questing or killing with my friend |
| 09:05.05 | jnwhiteh | I have 12 quests to turn in |
| 09:05.13 | Wobin | I just did it til the next section of levels available in the guides |
| 09:05.14 | jnwhiteh | that'll make me hit 15 |
| 09:05.19 | jnwhiteh | but then gotta get him 15 |
| 09:05.21 | olafski | nice |
| 09:05.27 | olafski | tanking will be hella boring at first :P |
| 09:05.33 | jnwhiteh | tclap, rend |
| 09:05.35 | jnwhiteh | tclap, rend |
| 09:05.39 | jnwhiteh | victory rush |
| 09:05.40 | jnwhiteh | yawn |
| 09:05.46 | Wobin | (hope that stupid dps aren't pulling off you) |
| 09:06.06 | olafski | victory rush.. hm I never used that |
| 09:06.17 | jnwhiteh | its butter |
| 09:06.18 | jnwhiteh | free dps |
| 09:06.23 | olafski | yeah but not in defensive stance |
| 09:06.28 | olafski | tclap, rend, sunder |
| 09:06.33 | jnwhiteh | at this stage, tanking in def doesn't help |
| 09:06.38 | jnwhiteh | i'll probably stay in battle stance |
| 09:06.38 | olafski | oO |
| 09:06.42 | olafski | +90% threat doesn't help? |
| 09:06.46 | jnwhiteh | meh |
| 09:06.50 | jnwhiteh | pussy dps can learn to regulate =) |
| 09:06.55 | olafski | jeez |
| 09:06.59 | jnwhiteh | =) |
| 09:07.05 | jnwhiteh | i have heirlooms, as long as they don't i win |
| 09:07.08 | olafski | they should drop their dps to tank-levels :P |
| 09:07.15 | jnwhiteh | but I can just overpower |
| 09:07.26 | olafski | nearly everyone has heirlooms nowadays |
| 09:07.31 | jnwhiteh | their dps WILL be at tank levels when I'm better geared than they are |
| 09:07.32 | jnwhiteh | yeah |
| 09:07.35 | jnwhiteh | that I have to wait and see. |
| 09:07.39 | jnwhiteh | ooh |
| 09:07.53 | jnwhiteh | lets see if I'm guild leader |
| 09:08.08 | jnwhiteh | You have an open ticket: Wait time currently unavailable |
| 09:08.08 | jnwhiteh | wah |
| 09:08.08 | Wobin | ugh |
| 09:08.29 | Wobin | I hate recipes on the internet for stuff like brownies where you see "TAke one box of premix brownies..." |
| 09:08.36 | Wobin | that's not a fucking brownie recipe |
| 09:08.39 | olafski | lol |
| 09:08.44 | olafski | why bother writing a recipe for that |
| 09:08.45 | Wobin | that's a brownie decoration guide |
| 09:08.48 | olafski | it's already on the box anyway |
| 09:14.12 | Amarande | ... apparently, Stormstrike random groups expect a dedicated tank with tank gear and spec all the way up the levels, not just at 80 |
| 09:14.18 | Amarande | of course, we're also the battlegroup with those fucks from Mal'Ganis |
| 09:14.25 | Amarande | who expect everyone to be of EJ caliber |
| 09:14.30 | Amarande | (so they don't have to) |
| 09:15.11 | olafski | I would say tank gear at least is not an unreasonable expectation :P |
| 09:15.36 | Amarande | olafski: it's reasonable to expect that classes that can tank maintain two distinct sets of gear all the way up the levels? |
| 09:15.44 | olafski | yes |
| 09:15.45 | Amarande | it's hard enough to do it at 80, let alone when leveling |
| 09:17.27 | Amarande | especially in the 60-70 range, since it's hard enough to find plate rewards that are even useful when you're a warrior or DK let alone a set to quest and a set to tank |
| 09:17.28 | olafski | http://www.wowhead.com/compare?items=39087:39088:41974:39085:41975:39084:39086:39083 |
| 09:17.34 | olafski | there you go |
| 09:17.39 | Amarande | due to the number of quests whose plate reward is fucking spellpower shit |
| 09:18.06 | olafski | fresh tanking set for a lvl 70, sets you back about 40 gold |
| 09:19.03 | olafski | and maintaining two specs isn't that unreasonable either, given that it only costs 1k gold |
| 09:25.40 | jnwhiteh | meh |
| 09:25.42 | Amarande | "only" 1k gold |
| 09:25.47 | jnwhiteh | i dont bother having two sets of gear |
| 09:25.53 | Amarande | 1k gold is a lot when you have three characters who still need their flying mount training :) |
| 09:26.05 | olafski | amarande: you can _easily_ make 1k gold by the time you hit 70 |
| 09:26.16 | olafski | me neither jnwhiteh, I just keep a tank set |
| 09:26.49 | Amarande | olafski: I've noticed. But I won't still after I spend 250 on flying training :P |
| 09:26.52 | olafski | just don't spend gold on silly stuff and it's easy to get.. my warrior hit 80 with 3500g in his inventory and epic/cold weather flying |
| 09:28.08 | olafski | (no dual spec though as I don't need that :P) |
| 09:28.32 | jnwhiteh | i never spend gold |
| 09:28.37 | jnwhiteh | but how'd you manage 3500? |
| 09:28.57 | olafski | mined and skinned everything I came across while leveling |
| 09:29.14 | olafski | but even with just one gathering profession it would've been easy to at least afford dual spec and normal flying |
| 09:29.30 | olafski | the only thing I spent money on was that cobalt set I linked earlier, and the tempered saronite set a few levels later |
| 09:30.11 | Amarande | olafski: I do have dual gathering, but the mats are being held by my LW and alchemist for their grinds :) |
| 09:30.17 | Arrowmaster | wtf @ SGU cliffhanger |
| 09:30.46 | Amarande | ... and fucking Gurok wins again |
| 09:30.47 | Torhal | Arrowmaster: Damn it. Now I have to watch. I'll postpone V ep10 |
| 09:30.58 | Amarande | positioning issues seem like they may be insurmountable here unless you can really burn him down fast (are 80, or have a group) |
| 09:31.00 | Arrowmaster | not major but just a wtf |
| 09:31.02 | Amarande | he seems to have got smarter |
| 09:31.23 | Amarande | you put your back to the mountain? oh, he'll move to the side slightly so the knockback throws you at an angle, and since you don't have a U shaped mountain, you get thrown off the cliff anyway ... |
| 09:31.51 | olafski | easily solo'd him at 66 with my shaman |
| 09:31.58 | olafski | and probably my DK / paladin too |
| 09:32.11 | olafski | learn to position your enemies, that's important as a tank anyway ;) |
| 09:33.37 | Amarande | olafski: he also roots, which makes it rather difficult to move around to position him :) |
| 09:33.49 | olafski | meh |
| 09:34.06 | olafski | just saying, after I died to him the first time because I didn't know about the knockback I never found much trouble with him =( |
| 09:34.53 | Amarande | ... then there are some elites that are pathetic, like Mountain Gronn. |
| 09:35.50 | Amarande | hopes that failtanking stunt didn't just double my queue time as DPS, too |
| 09:36.20 | Amarande | I have a distinct feeling I know why tanks who fail desert rather than wait for the group to decide they fail, and I hope it didn't happen ... |
| 09:36.59 | Amarande | i.e., if you don't leave quickly enough when failing, there's probably a good chance that people will use a CS ignore on you to prevent you from ever drawing them again, which if you then fall back on DPS will just *ruin* you? |
| 09:39.08 | Amarande | (Especially on Stormstrike battlegroup, due to the fact that Mal'Ganis server represents so much of its popu, plus has a disproportunate D-Bag ratio ...) |
| 09:40.42 | Amarande | Heh, has anyone ever managed to, without doing anything totally unreasonable, screw up a character due to CS ignores to the point where they had to transfer off BG to get any queues to pop? |
| 09:42.46 | Thrae | Amarande: Sorry, I don't follow. CS ignores? |
| 09:43.52 | Amarande | Thrae: cross-server ignore list |
| 09:44.31 | Amarande | I wonder if people who fail at tanking and *don't* exit stage left when expected get put on enough of those that, due to the fact that the ignore list prevents you from being queued with someone who has you on theirs, end up not being able to even fall back on DPS because the queue will just *never* pop then |
| 09:44.37 | Thrae | Amarande: I didn't know that was even implemented, much less that it worked to avoid people in queues. |
| 09:44.57 | Amarande | I thought they had it already, when they added the DF? |
| 09:45.21 | Amarande | I do know if someone puts you on ignore it will do its damnedest to prevent you two from being put together anymore, even if it means even longer queues for all concerned |
| 09:45.30 | Thrae | DF? You're using acronyms again. |
| 09:45.55 | Amarande | Dungeon Finder. |
| 09:46.13 | *** join/#wowuidev nevcairiel (~nev@WoWUIDev/WoWAce/Ace3/nevcairiel) |
| 09:46.19 | Thrae | Ah. I usually hear it called just LFD by everyone. Or maybe I'm still a little sleepy. |
| 09:47.10 | Thrae | Well, to answer your original question, I don't know since I'm a tank/healer and I still get insta-queues no matter who hates me. And I also carry people I don't know and overall am patient and try to be democratic. |
| 09:47.13 | Amarande | Actually, the proper name *is* "dungeon finder" |
| 09:47.43 | Thrae | Not to say you're none of those things, just noting my own situation. |
| 09:47.45 | Amarande | yay, UK popped |
| 09:48.19 | Amarande | I tend to be patient, heck I didn't ditch group when I died while tanking, even though I had to go pay a repair bill :P |
| 09:48.46 | Thrae | Yeah I've died a lot, especially on HoR-H which is probably where I made most of my enemies, if I have any. |
| 09:48.47 | Amarande | though apparently we might be EXPECTED to ditch group when failing at tanking |
| 09:49.01 | Amarande | since everyone else does it after all, and lets the group get a better tank sooner |
| 09:51.28 | Thrae | I'm an old school tank, I don't really fail anymore. I've also tanked like 300+ Heroics or so. If people die and/or the group wipes, it's usually DPS and Heals in that order. |
| 09:51.54 | Amarande | I haven't really done much tanking since BC |
| 09:52.58 | Thrae | As a tank it's very hard to use LoS in Heroics these days because DPS tend to pick targets based on how much damage they can do (so usually nearby) and don't look at what the tank is doing. |
| 09:53.39 | Thrae | Amarande: Are you Horde or Alliance? |
| 09:54.58 | Amarande | Horde. |
| 09:55.39 | Thrae | Aww, well the Shadowburn (Maelstrom server's BG) would be happy to have you, but I play Alliance on Maelstrom. |
| 09:56.06 | Thrae | I wouldn't recommend Horde on Maelstrom as Horde outnumbers Alliance 2:1, with a 29% Blood Elf population. |
| 09:56.19 | Thrae | (Seriously) |
| 09:57.52 | Thrae | Amarande: If you do an all-in-one Transfer+Faction Change, I'll tank for you :) |
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| 10:00.32 | *** join/#wowuidev Grum (~grum@codebase2.xs4all.nl) |
| 10:00.40 | Jrhartley | Hi, everyone. I used to use an addon that displayed in-game events as they fired, and allowed you to filter out certain groups. Does anyone know what this addon was called? |
| 10:01.26 | Arrowmaster | devtools |
| 10:02.20 | Arrowmaster | parts of it have been put into the default ui now though try /eventtrace |
| 10:02.40 | Iriel | Essentially all of it is in the default UI |
| 10:02.48 | Iriel | I do need to try and get filtering in for cata tho |
| 10:03.06 | Jrhartley | You're right. But I don't think that's the one I used. The one I'm thinking of had it's own frame, and allowed you to select specifically which kind of events you wanted to trace. |
| 10:03.12 | nevcairiel | i still use devtools, the default ui thing always felt broken |
| 10:03.38 | Iriel | Jrhartley: that's the devtools version of eventtrace |
| 10:03.53 | Iriel | Which the blizzard one is based upon, but didn't quite do the same |
| 10:04.05 | Jrhartley | You're a star! Thanks, Iriel. Both for the help, and such a kick-arse addon. |
| 10:06.29 | Torhal | Arrowmaster: Ever notice on SGU, whenever they do the body-switching thing the people always have sex? WTF is up with that? |
| 10:06.33 | Iriel | Jrhartley: You should be able to get the original from wowinterface, though I'm not sure how well it works at the same time as the blizzard one (I try to use theirs, it makes helping folks more consistent) |
| 10:06.38 | Iriel | Anyway, sleep time |
| 10:06.42 | nevcairiel | Torhal: wouldnt you? |
| 10:06.43 | nevcairiel | :D |
| 10:07.02 | Torhal | Hah |
| 10:07.07 | Jrhartley | Thanks, and goodnight. :) |
| 10:11.31 | olafski | I doubt there are so few people on a battlegroup that being ignored by a couple of them will have a noticable impact on the queue times |
| 10:15.36 | *** join/#wowuidev brykrys (~chatzilla@WoWUIDev/Norganna/Dev/Brykrys) |
| 10:15.39 | Jrhartley | I know this sounds like a silly question, but can you use hooksecurefun() on non-secure functions? |
| 10:15.47 | Jrhartley | hooksecurefunc()* |
| 10:17.48 | *** join/#wowuidev doc-saintly (~doc-saint@ip68-3-77-249.ph.ph.cox.net) |
| 10:18.06 | doc-saintly | can anyone point me to a reference specifically for creating advanced ui things like dropdown menus and grid views? |
| 10:19.17 | Torhal | Arrowmaster: Looks like asencion or something akin to it. |
| 10:19.41 | Arrowmaster | Torhal: oh yeah i forgot that |
| 10:19.44 | Arrowmaster | duh |
| 10:23.26 | Torhal | doc-saintly: http://forums.wowace.com/showthread.php?t=15763 |
| 10:23.37 | Jrhartley | doc-saintly, this should help with the Dropdown menu - http://www.wowwiki.com/UI_Object_UIDropDownMenu |
| 10:23.51 | Torhal | My link has better info. |
| 10:24.10 | Torhal | Well, it's more like a HOWTO |
| 10:24.13 | Jrhartley | Fair enough. :) |
| 10:24.27 | airtonix | my first ace3 project ? |
| 10:25.10 | Torhal | Actually, your link is good for reference wheras mine is a good HOWTO/introduction |
| 10:25.18 | *** join/#wowuidev foxlit (~foxlit@0x573e6bae.alb2nxx18.dynamic.dsl.tele.dk) |
| 10:25.18 | Jrhartley | You're right, it is better. Consider it bookmarked. XD |
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| 10:27.36 | Jrhartley | Right - I'm offski. Wintergrasp waits for now Dwarf... |
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| 10:36.55 | Wobin | nom |
| 10:37.02 | Wobin | cherry ripe brownie batter |
| 10:37.15 | Wobin | I have to stop eating it =( |
| 10:41.46 | Amarande | you know, they really need to make instance battles less of a healer's battle |
| 10:42.05 | Amarande | seems like lately stuff depends less on whether the DPS can burn fast, or whether the tank can hold aggro as the healer's ability to keep green bars up |
| 10:43.10 | Amarande | (and really, that's one thing to be said for AD&D and D&D 3rd over MMOs, too. in D&D based games you hardly ever need the constant healing you see in MMOs ...) |
| 10:43.24 | Thrae | Amarande: One of the major reasons I still get wipes in HoR-H is when Healers don't LoS properly and/or can't take a hit. |
| 10:43.50 | Thrae | Amarande: Ah, well you've seen the new Cata stuff, right? They're using an "Eclipse" like talent for Healers to allow them to DPS *while* they're Healing. |
| 10:44.30 | Amarande | Thrae, what do you think the main reason for the "tank & healer" design decision in MMOs is? |
| 10:44.30 | Thrae | Amarande: A talent that makes some damage spells instant-cast and cost no mana if you critically heal, etc. |
| 10:44.47 | Thrae | Amarande: EQ. |
| 10:44.52 | Amarande | Guild Wars managed to avoid it to *some* degree, and was successful ... |
| 10:45.02 | Amarande | In fact, Guild Wars basically had no aggro management system at all |
| 10:45.03 | Thrae | WoW was, and still is to a large degree, heavily based off the model EQ used. |
| 10:45.09 | Wobin | Instant cast |
| 10:45.12 | Wobin | sure, but still a GCD |
| 10:45.28 | Amarande | Thrae: I'm guessing based on the success of WoW and EQ vs. their competitors that it's the *only* really viable model to succeed business-wise as an MMO? |
| 10:45.29 | Thrae | Wobin: Yeah, but we're talking spells like Starfire |
| 10:45.51 | nevcairiel | i thought they wanted to make healing more fun, where is the fun in requiring healers to use those instant casts while healing, or be replaced by someone that does o.o |
| 10:45.51 | Thrae | Amarande: No, the reason WoW is like EQ is because a lot of the developers from EQ1 were bought by Blizzard. |
| 10:46.03 | Wobin | hehe |
| 10:46.11 | Wobin | so now it'll depend on the healer keeping everyone up |
| 10:46.11 | *** join/#wowuidev Alram (~Marla@fabe.xs4all.nl) |
| 10:46.15 | Wobin | -and- supply enough dps |
| 10:46.33 | Wobin | and pull the dps out of the fire |
| 10:46.38 | nevcairiel | although i dont trust or read any leaked information |
| 10:46.45 | nevcairiel | so we'll see when i get in the beta |
| 10:47.03 | Amarande | I suppose to do otherwise in today's MMO market is a good way to be simply ignoring the desires of enough gamers, and thus you will end up living in your parents' basement for the rest of your life after your business folds and you can't afford to live on your own ever again because you're paying off your business debts for life :) |
| 10:47.29 | Thrae | Wobin: Maybe there will be Eclipse both ways -- Heals makes big DPS spells simple to cast, DPS makes Heals simple to cast |
| 10:47.30 | *** join/#wowuidev mascondante (~kvirc@75-105-24-144.cust.wildblue.net) |
| 10:47.52 | nevcairiel | either way, you'll be forced to dps |
| 10:47.54 | nevcairiel | which sucks |
| 10:47.57 | Amarande | (Unless you became corporate, but then you have to do what Wall Street wants, even if it's what neither you nor Main Street wants. :P) |
| 10:48.50 | Thrae | Amarande: The Tank/Healer model only works because people are willing to be Tanks and be Healers. Like 'ol masochistic me. |
| 10:49.35 | nevcairiel | where did you read that eclipse idea anyway Thrae? leak or official? i read all official stuff, and i dont remember them saying anything in that direction |
| 10:50.03 | Thrae | Amarande: Actually, EQ had the Tank/Healer/CC model, which is what WoW started with but eventually phased out and now they want to put it back in. |
| 10:50.26 | Thrae | nevcairiel: Recent Data Mining |
| 10:50.35 | Amarande | Thrae: Put CC back in? Who's designing under the influence of Sulfuron Slammer? |
| 10:50.37 | foxlit | <PROTECTED> |
| 10:50.41 | nevcairiel | data mining has proven to be wrong more often then it was right |
| 10:50.46 | nevcairiel | especially in alphas :p |
| 10:50.53 | Amarande | I thought the whole reason they took the need for CC out was so the whole smorgasbord of DPS classes had a chance to go to heroics |
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| 10:51.03 | Amarande | not to mention, making the Dungeon Finder possible by allowing for any combination of DPS classes |
| 10:51.04 | Thrae | nevcairiel: Nothing official, but if you read the class previews and other material they do say they want Healers to do more than Heal and some CC |
| 10:51.12 | Amarande | in BC, I'm not sure the dungeon finder would have worked |
| 10:51.21 | Amarande | because so many heroics almost required specific classes among the DPS in order to provide needed CC |
| 10:51.36 | nevcairiel | I remember GC talking about this, but he said they dont want to force healers to dps |
| 10:51.57 | Thrae | nevcairiel: Right, but they don't want to *penalize* them either. |
| 10:52.01 | Amarande | in BC, if you bring three random DPS to some heroics without attention to CC, your tank and healer better be in Sunwell gear |
| 10:52.11 | nevcairiel | Thrae: thats why tree form is going away |
| 10:52.16 | nevcairiel | so you *can* dps |
| 10:52.45 | Thrae | nevcairiel: No, there's different reasons Tree Form is going away, mainly to do with it was a badly designed hack in the first place |
| 10:53.02 | Amarande | Thrae: if tree form is a "badly designed hack" for healing |
| 10:53.11 | Amarande | wouldn't that mean, say, Moonkin form is a "badly designed hack" for caster DPS, too? |
| 10:53.19 | nevcairiel | no, its not |
| 10:53.20 | Thrae | Amarande: Well, the number of classes with CC has increased |
| 10:53.28 | nevcairiel | Other healers can DPS |
| 10:53.35 | nevcairiel | Druids cant |
| 10:53.43 | nevcairiel | without leaving tree-form, which is mandatory |
| 10:53.48 | Amarande | Thrae: hmm, think there's still some DPS without |
| 10:53.51 | Amarande | DKs come to mind |
| 10:53.55 | nevcairiel | Other DPS can't Heal |
| 10:53.55 | doc-saintly | thanks for info about dropdowns, any ideas on grids or list views? |
| 10:54.04 | nevcairiel | priests have shadow form that blocks healing as well |
| 10:54.08 | Amarande | unless DKs are going to be expected to become full on tanks |
| 10:54.18 | Thrae | Amarande: Yes, it was, but they greatly improved upon its original design. The main problem with Tree Form is that (in the beginning of Tree Form) it was added as a mechanic to allow Druids to heal as well as everyone else. |
| 10:54.29 | Amarande | Thrae: which just sounds weird |
| 10:54.34 | Amarande | since tree form didn't make it in till BC, no? |
| 10:54.40 | Thrae | DKs? DKs have a few very decent CCs |
| 10:54.44 | Amarande | and what were druids always expected to do in Classic? Heal! |
| 10:54.54 | Amarande | so druids were healing aplenty before tree form existed at all |
| 10:54.55 | nevcairiel | They could've formed a talent in any way to boost healing |
| 10:54.55 | Thrae | Things changed in BC |
| 10:55.24 | nevcairiel | saying tree form is bad isnt true, its a talent like any other that boosts your healing by some percent |
| 10:55.27 | Amarande | Thrae: you mean like heroic bosses hitting for 8000 at a time while meanwhile poor druids were mostly stuck with HoTs? :) |
| 10:55.32 | nevcairiel | however, its mandatory and limits the spells you can cast |
| 10:55.39 | nevcairiel | and other healers dont suffer from those limitations |
| 10:55.42 | Amarande | and the whatever second wait for lifebloom just wasn't cutting it? |
| 10:55.55 | Thrae | Burning Crusade wasn't that great of an expansion really. They took a lot of classes in directions that they later changed. |
| 10:56.16 | Amarande | Thrae: and half the quests now suck for plate classes |
| 10:56.25 | Amarande | unless you're leveling a holydin solo, in which case you are frankly a masochist |
| 10:56.39 | nevcairiel | how does a quest suck for an armor type |
| 10:56.46 | Thrae | nevcairiel: And for the game that gave us the Dressing Room, they want you to look pretty while doing it |
| 10:56.46 | nevcairiel | that doesnt even make sense |
| 10:57.01 | Amarande | nevcairiel: in BC, quest rewards that featured armor generally were one choice for each armor type |
| 10:57.13 | nevcairiel | I would've been happy with a new artwork for the tree |
| 10:57.13 | Amarande | a *very large* percentage of those quest rewards feature plate that's either Int or Spellpower based |
| 10:57.20 | Torhal | doc-saintly: Depends on what you're trying to do. |
| 10:57.21 | Thrae | I think Amarande plays a Paladin and is arguing about the rewards, like good Shields being very hard to find |
| 10:57.23 | nevcairiel | quest rewards are useless |
| 10:57.29 | Amarande | which is totally useless to all but Paladins, and now only Holy paladins really use SP |
| 10:58.04 | nevcairiel | seriously, i mostly sell quest rewards and only get a few blue pieces from group quests until wotlk |
| 10:58.05 | Amarande | (and yeah, Thrae, come to think of it, good shields *were* a bitch to find back in BC which is when I played a pally last heh) |
| 10:58.29 | Thrae | Amarande: They're still a bitch, especially for Paladins. |
| 10:58.46 | nevcairiel | instance drops from the 3.0 isntances suck as well now, because they changed classes around, so shrug, dont expect them to fix the gear :P |
| 10:59.09 | Amarande | so basically, they expect us now to |
| 10:59.14 | Amarande | 1) level to 80 on shit gear |
| 10:59.24 | Amarande | 2) expect to survive heroics long enough without being vote kicked for atrocious performance to get badges |
| 10:59.25 | Thrae | Anyway, let's look at the history of Tree Form (which is kinda like looking at the history of Druids overall, a very mashed-up class with perhaps the most changes over the course of the game) |
| 10:59.29 | Amarande | before we can really do anything other than suck? :) |
| 10:59.40 | nevcairiel | Amarande: you will always suck, sorry. |
| 10:59.53 | Amarande | or do they figure that most people who play now are just playing their 80s and not leveling anything new |
| 10:59.54 | airtonix | lol vote kick |
| 11:00.01 | airtonix | why do you still play the game ? |
| 11:00.02 | Amarande | and waiting for cata to level any alts? |
| 11:00.05 | nevcairiel | There are no problems leveling |
| 11:00.10 | nevcairiel | you just fail |
| 11:00.24 | nevcairiel | breaking news, outlands wont be changed with cataclysm |
| 11:00.43 | airtonix | shocked i am not |
| 11:00.47 | nevcairiel | i leveld a DK and a warrior |
| 11:00.48 | Amarande | nevcairiel: actually, the quest rewards would be :) |
| 11:00.49 | Torhal | nevcairiel: You mean, Deathwing's destruction won't ripple through the Twisting Nether? ZOMG! |
| 11:00.51 | nevcairiel | and i didnt have any issues in BC |
| 11:00.54 | Amarande | nevcairiel: and items in general |
| 11:00.58 | Amarande | due to the itemization changes in cata |
| 11:01.10 | Amarande | unless you're going to say that all gear BUT outland quest rewards and instance drops is changing, which would be weird to the max |
| 11:01.12 | Thrae | Tree Form 1.0 -- Your movement speed is slowed. You have additional armor. You give a bonus to healing received, based on your Spirit, to party members only. You cannot decurse or remove poison, cast Barkskin, or any spells other then HoTs, Direct Healing, or Nature's Swiftness. |
| 11:01.53 | nevcairiel | that was fun, everyone else had to decurse, was kidna relaxing =) |
| 11:02.03 | Amarande | Thrae: ... remind me to stick with something on my druid that doesn't, well, suck. Like boomkin. :) |
| 11:02.23 | nevcairiel | boomkin has had an even worse history |
| 11:02.34 | Wobin | Boomkin 1.0: You suck |
| 11:02.57 | nevcairiel | Boomkin 2.0: You do some damage, but are OOM very fast, and suck again |
| 11:03.00 | Amarande | nevcairiel: haven't really heard much negative to be said about Boomkin |
| 11:03.03 | Amarande | other than the mana issues |
| 11:03.04 | airtonix | Any Class : Any Version : QQ WE SUCK, GIEF BUFF |
| 11:03.25 | Thrae | Tree Form 1.5 -- You can now decurse and remove poison in Tree Form. Tree Form 2.0 (WotLK) -- Movement speed reduction removed. Healing bonus is a set # based on a talent and no longer Spirit based, same with Armor bonus. You can now cast Barkskin in Tree Form. |
| 11:03.32 | nevcairiel | Only in 3.x boomkin was really fun to play |
| 11:03.57 | nevcairiel | Didnt they remove the movement earlier? |
| 11:04.06 | nevcairiel | I remember it being gone in sunwell already |
| 11:04.17 | Thrae | Tree Form 2.5 (Current) -- Spirit now gives additional Spellpower to Tree Form. |
| 11:04.27 | Amarande | But yeah, one issue with Outland was that the plate quest rewards are too often useful only to one spec of one class |
| 11:04.28 | Thrae | nevcairiel: Hmm, maybe late, late BC, right before WotLK |
| 11:04.53 | Amarande | not only that, but to a spec that, overwhelmingly likely, won't be doing 60-70 through a lot of questing but will probably be taking advantage of quick dungeon queues to level by healing instances |
| 11:05.13 | Thrae | nevcairiel: I think they started trickling in some of the design choices they made for WotLK before WotLK, like they're doing now pre-Cata. |
| 11:05.18 | Amarande | meanwhile, as a warrior or DK or non-holy paladin you're like "why did I bother with this quest" |
| 11:05.29 | olafski | quick experience? |
| 11:05.32 | olafski | what else are quests for |
| 11:05.33 | nevcairiel | Seriously, no-one does quest for their rewards |
| 11:05.42 | nevcairiel | unless its some group quest with shiny blue items |
| 11:05.54 | nevcairiel | and even then, the exp is worth your while |
| 11:05.57 | olafski | meanwhile in the real-wow-world everybody levels with heirlooms so doesn't care about rewards at all :P |
| 11:06.07 | Amarande | olafski: yeah, heirlooms kinda screwed up the paradigm |
| 11:06.10 | Thrae | olafski: Or Friend bonus |
| 11:06.21 | nevcairiel | I was wondering about heirlooms, they say heirlooms wont work from 80-85 |
| 11:06.22 | olafski | heirlooms rock :P |
| 11:06.29 | nevcairiel | but is that only the increasing of their level |
| 11:06.34 | nevcairiel | or does the exp bonus stop working too? |
| 11:06.40 | olafski | I imagine they'll just stay at lvl 80 stats |
| 11:06.44 | olafski | and probably no bonus XP either yeah |
| 11:06.59 | nevcairiel | I'll try in the beta :D |
| 11:07.00 | olafski | would be fairer |
| 11:07.05 | Thrae | nevcairiel: Most likely they will later release 80-85 or more likely 1-85 specific Heirlooms which are a little better then the current Heirlooms, but at a later patch for Cata. |
| 11:07.17 | olafski | thrae: yeah like full sets! |
| 11:07.18 | nevcairiel | Thrae: they already said there will be new ones |
| 11:07.33 | Thrae | Yep probably it'll be full sets |
| 11:07.34 | nevcairiel | I was just wondering if the exp bonus turns itself off > 80 |
| 11:07.35 | olafski | repurposed judgement armor <-- :D |
| 11:07.46 | Amarande | heirlooms ... meh |
| 11:07.48 | nevcairiel | even if the item doesnt increase anymore |
| 11:07.49 | Thrae | Full PvE and PvP Sets (unless they finally realize PvP sets are stupid) |
| 11:07.58 | Amarande | I'm kinda not so happy with Blizzard's policy of trying to power people all the way to the newest content ASAP |
| 11:08.08 | olafski | Full PvE and PvP Sets (unless they finally realize PvP is stupid) <-- fixed |
| 11:08.14 | Amarande | it's like "ignore that old content, it sucks now, ICC and Ruby Sanctum are all that matters now" |
| 11:08.17 | nevcairiel | for low-level-pvp-idiots, it would probably be good |
| 11:08.31 | Thrae | nevcairiel: They don't know yet, they said they don't want people getting to 85 and getting an achievement for it with the XP bonus, so they may turn it off >80 or they may just make an exception in the achievement |
| 11:08.44 | olafski | are you saying low level content is equally enjoyable amarande? |
| 11:08.52 | olafski | nobody around to play with and such, much fun |
| 11:08.54 | nevcairiel | classic is stupid |
| 11:08.56 | nevcairiel | outlands is still fun |
| 11:09.09 | Torhal | Amarande: "Ignore all the old content, even though you absolutely had to purchase it in order to get the new content..." |
| 11:09.10 | olafski | I like classic more than outland, but they are both quite deserted |
| 11:09.15 | Torhal | :D |
| 11:09.37 | Thrae | nevcairiel: If I were designing, I would turn it off >80 as you want people to spend more time leveling for your new time sink so they'll experience as much of the new content as possible. |
| 11:09.47 | nevcairiel | They will re-do all old content for you, and even for free |
| 11:10.08 | nevcairiel | dont have to buy the expansion to experience the revamped classic world :) |
| 11:10.09 | Amarande | although there's some leveling stretches that will always suck, probably |
| 11:10.10 | Amarande | like 10-20 |
| 11:10.16 | Thrae | nevcairiel: But sometimes Blizzard makes bone-headed decisions. Nowadays they seem to be trying to start over from scratch rather than revamp old ideas that have been shown not to work. |
| 11:10.52 | nevcairiel | I'm curious to see what came out of the new tree form now |
| 11:11.00 | foxlit | Amarande: and yet, that's a good thing. |
| 11:11.04 | nevcairiel | they said it would be more like one of those ancient trees, and not a treant |
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| 11:12.06 | Amarande | foxlit: it's a good thing that 10-20 is torture? :) |
| 11:12.22 | Thrae | nevcairiel: Since Heirlooms are suppose to be a perk for getting to the end level, they may also remove the XP bonus entirely from Heirlooms 1-80 and say it'll return on 1-85 Heirlooms. That'll have a backlash but it makes design sense if you want people to not blaze through all the new 1-60 content too quickly. |
| 11:13.05 | nevcairiel | I just want to know if i should buy heirlooms for my druid to get the server first druid, or if its just wasted =) |
| 11:13.21 | olafski | I bet 10-20 will be better since they're redesigning so much |
| 11:13.45 | Thrae | nevcairiel: If they do that AND make BoA items able to cross servers as well as factions, I bet the backlash will be negligible, so there's a chance they may do it. |
| 11:14.02 | Thrae | nevcairiel: Nah, don't count on the XP bonus for the achievement. They *specifically* said they're trying to figure out how to avoid that. |
| 11:14.48 | foxlit | Amarande: it's not torture. And yes, it's good that the levelling is skewed to let people get to 80 fast. |
| 11:14.48 | foxlit | In fact, to ICC, fast. |
| 11:15.43 | Thrae | nevcairiel: I'm still up in the air about Tree of Life Form. Like I said, it was more of a hack, but they could just do another hack to Resto Druids. Cata seems to be blooming with great ideas, but you never know. |
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| 11:15.49 | Amarande | foxlit: but it's World of Warcraft, not World of ICC! :) |
| 11:16.12 | olafski | they've always said it was mostly about the endgame |
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| 11:16.15 | olafski | even in vanilla |
| 11:16.16 | foxlit | Amarande: My personal opinion is that you're whining for no good reason. |
| 11:16.21 | nevcairiel | If you know warcraft a single bit, you know that ICC and Arthas are one of its eclipses. |
| 11:16.28 | nevcairiel | foxlit: he always does that |
| 11:16.45 | Thrae | nevcairiel: If they make it Tree of Cooldown like they said they're planning on and make the cooldown too long (think Tranquility, if you know what that is), then you have an "OhShit" button you'll only be using for emergencies rather then something that's integral to the Resto tree. |
| 11:17.18 | foxlit | Although perhaps whining is a bit strong; it's just unclear why you're unsatisfied and why what you're proposing, if there is anything, would make the game better. |
| 11:17.21 | nevcairiel | they referenced that demon form of the locks |
| 11:17.23 | olafski | I don't really mind the way tree of life is at the moment :/ |
| 11:17.32 | foxlit | Tree of life is boring at the moment. |
| 11:17.40 | Thrae | nevcairiel: And I think *losing* that integral part of the Resto Tree would really suck, since I think *all* types of Druids should have some shapeshift form to use regularly, even if it's on a cooldown. |
| 11:17.43 | olafski | only if you find healing boring =( |
| 11:17.52 | foxlit | I can heal just as well in humanoid form. |
| 11:17.54 | olafski | I don't see shadowpriests complain that they can't cast healing spell |
| 11:17.56 | olafski | s* |
| 11:17.59 | nevcairiel | tree of life really is boring, it doesnt add anything |
| 11:18.03 | nevcairiel | juts makes you look differently |
| 11:18.09 | olafski | and improves your healing a bit ;) |
| 11:18.10 | Wobin | it gives you an awesome tree form |
| 11:18.11 | Wobin | to dance in |
| 11:18.14 | Wobin | and jump |
| 11:18.17 | foxlit | olafski: but we have paladins for that. |
| 11:18.24 | Wobin | -that- is an integral part of any druid healing |
| 11:18.26 | nevcairiel | ./cry is awesome too |
| 11:18.26 | olafski | foxlit: oh, didn't know they gave the same buff |
| 11:18.32 | Wobin | and /cower |
| 11:18.39 | olafski | I'm usually the only healer in a group :) |
| 11:18.43 | Wobin | almost as good as the boomkin cower |
| 11:19.15 | foxlit | I thought there was some form of spirit->sp conversion linked into ToL, but apparently not? |
| 11:19.19 | olafski | there is |
| 11:19.23 | nevcairiel | yeah |
| 11:19.26 | nevcairiel | but screw that bit of sp |
| 11:19.35 | olafski | but yeah.. if I outgear content I'll heal in humanoid form and cast some moonfires, if not I'll stay in tree form and only cast healing spells.. I really don't have a problem with it |
| 11:19.35 | foxlit | ah, improved tree of life |
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| 11:19.57 | Thrae | olafski: The Shadowform/Boomkin vs Tree of Life argument doesn't work because not only can you CC in DPS forms, Resto Druids can't go "Oh Shit more DPS" right now and shift out of Tree Form like SPriests/Boomkins can go "Oh Shit Spot Healing". |
| 11:19.57 | nevcairiel | some fights i just fight in human form for the fun of it |
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| 11:20.04 | foxlit | Find having to shapeshift in/out to cyclone people annoying |
| 11:20.12 | olafski | thrae: why can't they shift out of tree form to do dps? |
| 11:21.00 | Amarande | ... the heck, a fist weapon dropped with mp5 |
| 11:21.15 | airtonix | for monks |
| 11:21.15 | Amarande | that's gotta be the silliest item ever to be packed off to be disenchanted :) |
| 11:21.24 | Thrae | olafski: Because not only does their DPS suck, normally you have limited Healers in a 10-man group so the circumstances where a Healer switches to DPS are extremely limited compared to DPS switching to Healing. |
| 11:21.51 | olafski | thrae: ok so what you're saying is, there's no real reason for a healer to want to suddenly dps? |
| 11:22.24 | airtonix | disco priest ftw |
| 11:22.28 | olafski | there's a caster fist weapon from maexxna too |
| 11:22.30 | olafski | druids can use those |
| 11:22.33 | Amarande | olafski: pretty much. |
| 11:22.42 | Amarande | if you've read the equipment oriented previews for cata |
| 11:22.42 | Thrae | olafski: No, I specifically said it's extremely limited (in end-game PvE Raids). Please don't stretch my words. |
| 11:22.51 | Amarande | they're saying they're going to make gear for DPS and gear for healing *completely separate animals* |
| 11:22.58 | olafski | thrae: I was merely asking |
| 11:23.05 | Amarande | which means, forcing a healer to DPS is something that I'd think would be *eliminated* in cata, not encouraged further |
| 11:23.07 | olafski | thrae: I still don't see the problem then with druids being limited to healing spells :/ |
| 11:23.15 | Amarande | unless you like having your raids depend on whether enough 83% shots succeed :) |
| 11:23.36 | foxlit | olafski: is anything else limited to only healing spells? |
| 11:23.37 | Amarande | (and really, it will be a lot less than 83% come higher end raids, if what I'm reading about this scaling hit rating requirement with content tiers at 85 is right) |
| 11:23.48 | olafski | foxlit: no.. but that doesn't necessarily make it bad does it? :( |
| 11:23.51 | nevcairiel | Amarande: not true, druis for example, boomkind and trees wear the same gear exactly. |
| 11:23.57 | nevcairiel | boomkins get a talent toget Hit from Spirit |
| 11:23.59 | olafski | I mean, holy priests don't usually cast damage spells in raids either I'd think |
| 11:24.00 | nevcairiel | *druids |
| 11:24.08 | olafski | granted it's been a while since I raided but healers generally heal |
| 11:24.20 | foxlit | There's a difference between "don't usually" and "incur a penalty every time they do" |
| 11:24.22 | Thrae | olafski: Anyway, Healing is mainly Proactive and Reactive, while DPS is Active. If you switch out to DPS, you may find yourself needing to suddenly React and heal a ton. No other Healing class is penalized as much as the Resto Druid for trying to do spot DPS. |
| 11:24.43 | olafski | thrae: ah so it's the switching back to healing.. hmm I can see that |
| 11:24.57 | Amarande | Thrae: how about holy paladins, holy/disc priests, and resto shamans? |
| 11:25.02 | nevcairiel | Its also a limitation no other healer has |
| 11:25.10 | Amarande | (mostly because none of those tend to have any hit rating to speak of, thus making for shitty DPS when needed) |
| 11:25.19 | nevcairiel | neither does the druid |
| 11:25.21 | nevcairiel | your point? |
| 11:25.23 | Thrae | olafski: They could make it so Tree Form can cast all spells humanoid form can, but then it would be a Form just to have a Form with no real reason behind it. |
| 11:25.45 | Thrae | Amarande: Yeah, right now none of the Healing classes work that way, but Cata is changing that. |
| 11:25.47 | olafski | thrae: well it would still have a bonus to healing and as such be some kind of "good for you, you spent 50 points in resto" talent :) |
| 11:25.55 | nevcairiel | They also had the problem with poly-immunity in tree form, and druids dispelling magic |
| 11:25.57 | olafski | but the cooldown thing does seem better |
| 11:26.01 | nevcairiel | pvp kiddys cried already |
| 11:26.21 | foxlit | I don't get it, though |
| 11:26.24 | Amarande | nev: well, yeah, I'd think that's legitimate QQ |
| 11:26.27 | foxlit | They should still be crying |
| 11:26.29 | Thrae | olafski: That's why they're saying they might keep Tree of Life, with a new model (no longer re-using Ent) and putting it on a cooldown. The question I have is, how long of a cooldown? |
| 11:26.37 | foxlit | Since you can shapeshift out of polymorph |
| 11:26.43 | Amarande | when all it takes is a specific class selection for healer on your opponent's group to make one of your class features not just less effective, but totally useless? |
| 11:26.51 | Amarande | ... yeah, that's reason to QQ |
| 11:26.55 | olafski | thrae: something like the warlock thing seems good |
| 11:26.58 | Wobin | well disc healing is mostly proactive |
| 11:26.59 | nevcairiel | foxlit: yeah, in theory, maybe that will be nerfed then :( |
| 11:27.06 | olafski | but healing cooldowns are a bit more tricky than dps imo |
| 11:27.20 | olafski | I never ever use tranquility |
| 11:27.27 | olafski | except maybe after a bossfight to get everyone up quickly |
| 11:27.27 | Wobin | well, healing cooldowns, are responsible for keeping other people up |
| 11:27.30 | Amarande | and really, if it wasn't for the CC features, why would you bother being a mage over, say, a hunter |
| 11:27.34 | Wobin | dps cooldowns aren't |
| 11:27.46 | nevcairiel | Amarande: its not completly useless, its like using a polymorph against a combo with 2 magic dispellers |
| 11:27.53 | olafski | wobin: yeah.. I generally prefer a more constant healing boost though.. for dps it doesn't matter if it's a bit more spikey |
| 11:28.38 | Thrae | olafski: Well the Warlock cooldown is a good example. A 3 minute cooldown may be used twice in a raid fight, but I'd like to see a 2-minute cooldown at most. |
| 11:28.49 | olafski | thrae: indeed |
| 11:28.49 | Amarande | ... wow, Blade's Edge is deserted now |
| 11:28.55 | Thrae | olafski: In fact, I'd like to see a 2-minute cooldown for Metamorphosis too. |
| 11:29.00 | olafski | amarande: because everybody except you leaves outland at 68 |
| 11:29.03 | nevcairiel | If they design the fights with a bit more fun in them, a cooldown can be fun |
| 11:29.19 | airtonix | wow 2.0: chess in five moves. |
| 11:29.22 | nevcairiel | like, say blood queen, i would pop the improved healing form in her air phase, and heal all those idiots that cant move |
| 11:29.31 | olafski | thrae: yeah 2 minute is nice.. then you could use it every other surge of darkness :) |
| 11:29.43 | Amarande | nevcairiel: you can't win in some fights in a PUG, though :) |
| 11:29.48 | Amarande | don't move, you're an idiot for not moving |
| 11:29.56 | Amarande | move as needed, people bitch at you that your DPS is dropping |
| 11:30.07 | nevcairiel | If you die, you dont dps either |
| 11:30.10 | Thrae | nevcairiel: Yeah, but a 3 minute cooldown spell is harder to figure out exactly when's the right time to use it, like the current Nature's Swiftness. |
| 11:30.11 | nevcairiel | your logic is flawed |
| 11:30.30 | nevcairiel | Thrae: i use NS whenever i think it could be used, dont think much about it |
| 11:30.36 | nevcairiel | i never use tranq though |
| 11:30.40 | nevcairiel | but its shitty anyway |
| 11:30.42 | nevcairiel | group limitation etc |
| 11:30.57 | *** part/#wowuidev cncfanatics (~cncfanati@WoWUIDev/cncfanatics) |
| 11:31.00 | Thrae | nevcairiel: Well Tranq is extreme, I already suggested they make it 5 targets and raid too |
| 11:31.09 | olafski | that would be better yeah |
| 11:31.14 | nevcairiel | they are doign that |
| 11:31.18 | foxlit | Tranq's cooldown makes it bad. |
| 11:31.18 | nevcairiel | now, finally |
| 11:31.20 | olafski | that group limitation really has to go from all spells |
| 11:31.28 | foxlit | "Hey, let's give you a spell that you can use every 10 minutes" |
| 11:31.29 | olafski | it's also on some totems still right? |
| 11:31.42 | nevcairiel | I know that the draenei hit thing still has it |
| 11:31.48 | nevcairiel | anti-fear totem has it too |
| 11:31.58 | olafski | healing stream too I think(?) |
| 11:32.05 | Thrae | nevcairiel: Anyway, I think a 2-minute cooldown would also be better for non-raid fights, even just trash or blowing through dungeons. I'd still like to see Resto Druids shifting into some form often. Not always, but often. |
| 11:32.05 | olafski | the draenei hit thing goes out the window completely I imagine |
| 11:32.11 | nevcairiel | healing stream is a minor totem, doesnt matter :) |
| 11:32.31 | nevcairiel | tremor would be seriously OP if it hit everyone in the raid, though |
| 11:32.32 | olafski | sure but if all totems are raid wide and you have a couple of shamans, one of them might use healing stream |
| 11:32.37 | Thrae | olafski: Yes, they specifically said they're removing it |
| 11:32.48 | Amarande | btw, will people usually be going back to Azeroth for Cata at 80, or 78? |
| 11:33.10 | nevcairiel | i always suggest goign with the full level |
| 11:33.32 | Thrae | Amarande: Good question. Probably the quests will start ~78 like they did with both BC and WotLK. |
| 11:33.34 | nevcairiel | like you can go with 68 to wotlk, but you will have like 2 quests and not much fun |
| 11:33.44 | nevcairiel | until you hit 70 |
| 11:33.49 | Amarande | And yet people will go to northrend and outland on the 8's |
| 11:33.52 | Amarande | Wonder why they do it :S |
| 11:34.07 | nevcairiel | going to outland with 58 isnt too bad |
| 11:34.14 | Amarande | I guess in outland's case there's fairly few people who really like old world content still though |
| 11:34.18 | nevcairiel | even with just zerging mobs, you get faster exp then doign classic quests |
| 11:34.44 | Amarande | personally I actually love Winterspring, like the plaguelands, and have some appreciation for silithus |
| 11:34.52 | airtonix | exorcism in plaguelands lol |
| 11:34.59 | nevcairiel | anyway, need to reboot my irc proxy |
| 11:35.06 | Amarande | with that particular liking for content, it's hard not to even be 62 or so by outland |
| 11:35.11 | Thrae | Amarande: Profession leveling if they're already maxxed, and the rewards from those few quests available can be both amazingly good and amazingly easy. I remember when BC came out and saw the new Feral Druid reward in Hellfire that you could get pre-60. It was as good as BWL loot. |
| 11:35.20 | Wobin | people go at 68 |
| 11:35.31 | Wobin | because they're sick of the 68-70 quests in outlands |
| 11:35.46 | Thrae | Of course, Feral Druid is a bad example since their itemization has sucked until recently |
| 11:35.59 | Thrae | Better itemization is a good reason all around |
| 11:36.19 | Amarande | Profession leveling I can understand. I eventually packed up my bags on the Hunter and left for Outland at 62 because I decided it was high time to get master BS and eng. |
| 11:36.42 | *** join/#wowuidev nevcairiel (~nev@WoWUIDev/WoWAce/Ace3/nevcairiel) |
| 11:37.20 | Thrae | With the new LFD system going for 1-85 though, we may find a *decrease* in maxxed professions as you can level through dungeons now, and some do that. |
| 11:37.40 | Thrae | Hell my main still hasn't maxxed Fishing or Cooking. |
| 11:37.48 | Amarande | Yeah, I tend to neglect cooking and fishing |
| 11:37.50 | Amarande | except on my Chef warlock |
| 11:38.10 | Amarande | And then I keep thinking, why bother leveling cooking on the other characters when I can just send the meat to Alvaerin to cook |
| 11:38.21 | Thrae | Yeah on my alt I hope to do it, but when I made my main back in Vanilla, it wasn't as easy to level them while leveling yourself, nor was it as profitable. |
| 11:38.55 | *** part/#wowuidev doc-saintly (~doc-saint@ip68-3-77-249.ph.ph.cox.net) |
| 11:39.01 | olafski | going to northrend at 68 is no problem either tbh |
| 11:39.08 | olafski | if you just follow the initial quest line you'll never be starved for quests |
| 11:39.17 | olafski | you reach 69 in like 10 quests anyway :P |
| 11:39.28 | Amarande | that's more an issue with the combats, anyway, depending on your class |
| 11:39.35 | Amarande | I would not want to be there at 68 on a squishy in particular |
| 11:39.35 | olafski | yer |
| 11:39.49 | olafski | oh I went to northrend at 68 on my warlock, np at all |
| 11:39.56 | Amarande | Even at 70 with some decent gear from BC on my lock, it was enough to get me to switch to Demo for the stronger, better aggro holding pet |
| 11:39.59 | olafski | he did have like +1100 spellpower though |
| 11:40.22 | olafski | and now I pretty much abandoned him at 72 |
| 11:40.26 | olafski | boring dps-only class |
| 11:41.17 | Amarande | yeah, I don't play my warlock much now either |
| 11:41.23 | Amarande | hence the lack of heirlooms, since she's my only 80 |
| 11:44.25 | Amarande | WTB Utgarde Keep group that doesn't fail. |
| 11:45.28 | Amarande | first time I tried to tank ... I couldn't do it |
| 11:45.40 | Amarande | second group, we had a pretty good tank ... but the healer didn't have enough spellpower and we choked on the twin bosses |
| 11:53.06 | airtonix | <PROTECTED> |
| 11:55.07 | *** join/#wowuidev boshi23 (~boshi23@c-69-142-35-23.hsd1.nj.comcast.net) |
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| 12:12.09 | Amarande | yay, the third group's a charm :) |
| 12:12.21 | Amarande | and I ended up with ... a 2H axe drop from Ingvar |
| 12:12.24 | Amarande | ponders what to do with it |
| 12:13.47 | Wobin | hit people with the sharp end? |
| 12:14.03 | Amarande | I guess it would be useful if I set up a tank spec |
| 12:14.35 | Amarande | ... also I have just realized I have the absolute ugliest set of gear right now evar |
| 12:14.35 | Amarande | heh |
| 12:14.52 | Amarande | yay purple and green color scheme! heh |
| 12:15.55 | Amarande | Wobin: it was a greed roll ... as frost, I have fairly little use for 2H'ers |
| 12:16.02 | foxlit | lua> 10^17 < 2^32, 10^17 < 2^64 |
| 12:16.03 | lua_bot | foxlit: false, true |
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| 12:18.24 | *** mode/#wowuidev [+v Legorol] by ChanServ |
| 12:21.59 | Fisker | Shirik |
| 12:22.01 | Fisker | why won't you die? |
| 12:22.38 | Wobin | Waash =( |
| 12:24.39 | *** join/#wowuidev Tuller (~Tuller@c-69-143-49-212.hsd1.va.comcast.net) |
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| 12:34.29 | Thrae | Cool, I found a web service to send and receive SMS text messages that's officially supported by my carrier. |
| 12:39.46 | krka | http://code.google.com/codejam if anyone is interested - qualifier today |
| 12:39.56 | krka | solving the problems should only take 1-2 hours |
| 12:42.27 | *** join/#wowuidev airtonix (~airtonix@unaffiliated/airtonix) |
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| 13:02.01 | Thrae | Bleh I had to use Internet Explorer to hear sounds from ZipWhip, but still it's much easier to keep in contact with my teenage sister. |
| 13:05.01 | Fisker | ~seen Shirik |
| 13:05.03 | purl | shirik is currently on #sc2mapster (2d 16h 27m 2s) #norganna (2d 16h 27m 2s) #wowuidev (2d 16h 27m 2s) #wowace (2d 16h 27m 2s). Has said a total of 262 messages. Is idling for 5h 37m 3s, last said: 'compressed it's 280.3GB'. |
| 13:05.06 | Fisker | ~seen Ackis |
| 13:05.07 | purl | ackis is currently on #waruidev (4d 15h 55m 46s) #sc2mapster (4d 15h 55m 46s) #wowuidev (4d 15h 55m 46s) #arl (4d 15h 55m 46s) #wowace (4d 15h 55m 46s) #curseforge (4d 15h 55m 46s) #wowwiki (4d 15h 55m 46s). Has said a total of 122 messages. Is idling for 1d 22h 26m 14s, last said: 'RETCON'. |
| 13:05.19 | Fisker | i hate you both |
| 13:06.44 | *** join/#wowuidev Repo (~supybot@repos.curseforge.net) |
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| 13:24.25 | Fisker | http://i44.tinypic.com/14jp1si.jpg <-so we'll be starting off with almost higher ilevels than highend content :P |
| 13:24.59 | foxlit | +1357 Stamina. This is madness. |
| 13:25.23 | Fisker | can only be a bug |
| 13:25.35 | Fisker | unless the conversion from stamina to health have changed |
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| 13:28.25 | nevcairiel | only sane change would be to map it to health directly |
| 13:28.36 | zenzelezz | they did say they were dramatically increasing stamina |
| 13:28.42 | zenzelezz | though that does sound a little out of the ordinary |
| 13:29.35 | nevcairiel | not dramatically, just evenign out the stamina between tank items and other items |
| 13:29.35 | foxlit | nevcairiel: at that point, calling it Stamina is silly |
| 13:29.46 | foxlit | I thought the point was dramatically |
| 13:29.56 | nevcairiel | which would seem dramatically to everyone that isnt a tank |
| 13:30.15 | *** join/#wowuidev Tuller (~Tuller@c-69-143-49-212.hsd1.va.comcast.net) |
| 13:30.30 | foxlit | The point was to shift the balance between incoming damage and health |
| 13:30.44 | nevcairiel | yeah, everyone gets tank-level hp |
| 13:30.48 | foxlit | If they kept tank pools as they are now, they'd have to reduce damage, which seems unlikely. |
| 13:30.50 | nevcairiel | not 13k hp on one item |
| 13:31.31 | foxlit | lua> 13*13 |
| 13:31.32 | lua_bot | foxlit: 169 |
| 13:31.41 | nevcairiel | but its alpha, assuming that anything that looks odd is indeed a bug is always safe |
| 13:31.43 | foxlit | ~200k does sound nice, though |
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| 13:32.33 | nevcairiel | I would bet players end up somewhere in the range of 50-70k, and tanks due to talents and stuff above that somewhere |
| 13:33.35 | foxlit | Still seems too small to me. |
| 13:34.33 | foxlit | But meh, don't have nearly enough information to judge. |
| 13:34.36 | nevcairiel | Did they specify if they lowered the stamina budget again, or are we just going to pay with other stats for that? |
| 13:35.04 | airtonix | what name would you give to it foxlit |
| 13:35.20 | foxlit | ? |
| 13:35.25 | *** join/#wowuidev Kalroth (kalroth@3e6bae6c.rev.stofanet.dk) |
| 13:35.27 | foxlit | Ah. |
| 13:35.33 | foxlit | If it just adds hit points, call it Health. |
| 13:35.38 | foxlit | + 1000 Health, np. |
| 13:36.00 | Pneumatus^ | calling it health would indicate that it doesnt scale with BoK though |
| 13:36.08 | foxlit | Make BoK scale health, np. |
| 13:36.15 | nevcairiel | BoK will be changed anyway |
| 13:36.20 | zenzelezz | screw BoK |
| 13:36.21 | nevcairiel | it wont scale spirit, so it needs special wording |
| 13:36.24 | foxlit | into the ground, baby! |
| 13:36.25 | airtonix | i remember playing lone wolf where there was endurance. |
| 13:36.30 | *** join/#wowuidev nuoHep (~nuoHep@83.220.61.106) |
| 13:36.37 | foxlit | [There was talk about making it a motw-equivalent] |
| 13:36.45 | nevcairiel | ya there was |
| 13:36.54 | foxlit | motw: the most useless buff ever. |
| 13:37.02 | Pneumatus^ | idk though, no EU char copies yet anyway @:< |
| 13:37.07 | nevcairiel | they thought about getting the uniqueness out of those two buffs by making them the same |
| 13:37.11 | foxlit | Affects a bazillion stats, not nearly enough for anyone to care. |
| 13:37.14 | airtonix | i reckon items should have weight |
| 13:37.18 | airtonix | :) |
| 13:37.28 | nevcairiel | foxlit: people ignore that by affecting all stats its like the most powerful buff =( |
| 13:37.31 | airtonix | stop the cruelty to mounts |
| 13:38.00 | nevcairiel | I mean, as a caster you like int and spirit increase |
| 13:38.04 | nevcairiel | stamina is nice for everyone |
| 13:38.17 | nevcairiel | so thats 3/5 |
| 13:38.34 | foxlit | Would you rather have PWF or MotW, though? |
| 13:38.54 | Pneumatus^ | id rather AI |
| 13:39.17 | Pneumatus^ | and theres not even a scroll for that :< |
| 13:42.55 | Thrae | Cairenn|afk: Does Zam have anything like Curse's Wowstead (Guild Hosting)? It doesn't seem like it. |
| 13:47.21 | Thrae | foxlit: I would rather have MoTW, as it increases armor, ALL attributes, AND resistances. The resistance increase is not as high as Auras/Totems, but all of this provides nice PvE mitigation along with extra DPS, HPS, and TPS in one buff. PWF is better in PvP though. |
| 13:47.52 | nevcairiel | WoW is no PvP game :d |
| 13:48.12 | Thrae | Yeah, but I added that in there since comparing stackable buffs is silly anyway ;) |
| 13:50.32 | Thrae | Hmm, what should I name my 25-man raiding guild? |
| 13:50.56 | Amarande | hands airtonix a Black Cube |
| 13:52.30 | foxlit | Thrae: since I'm not a tank, I do not care about armor. Resistances are only ever interesting on gimmick fights, and you have appropriate classes providing auras there. I'd trade the minor mana/spirit/damage increases offered by mark for the extra survivability of having more stamina, since a lot of incoming damage cuts rather close to my maximum HP. |
| 13:53.19 | foxlit | Point is, in boosting everything, it may be a nice buff, but it doesn't feel like it makes enough of a difference in any single aspect. |
| 14:09.33 | Thrae | foxlit: I wouldn't say "gimmick", there isn't a fight in ICC that I know of where at least half of the damage is from some resistable school. For total migitation you need to factor in the +51 Stamina AND +75 Resistance. For a Shadow spell cast from Lady Deathwhisper (Level 83), +75 Resistance nets you +13% chance to avoid and +15% damage reduction. And for Resistances, the damage reduction scales *upwards*, meaning it ... |
| 14:09.39 | Thrae | ... has increasing returns instead of diminishing returns. If 200 Resistance halves your damage, you only need 100 more to halve it again. |
| 14:10.18 | foxlit | Again, I'm not a tank. |
| 14:10.20 | Thrae | foxlit: So where you'll most likely have added resistance from something other than MotW, the Resistances are pretty useful. |
| 14:10.59 | Thrae | foxlit: When I said "half of the damage", I meant half of the damage dealt to the *raid*, not to the tank. |
| 14:11.33 | Thrae | Half of the damage dealt to the tank is usually physical with half of that being some school. |
| 14:14.03 | foxlit | Is it really half the damage? |
| 14:14.34 | Thrae | In ICC Raid Damage, Marrowgar mainly deals Physical (Bone Storm, Bone Graveyard) and Frost (Ground Fire) damage. Lady Deathwhisper deals Shadow (adds, D&D) and Frost (Frostbolt Volleys) damage. Lootship is mainly Physical damage. |
| 14:14.53 | foxlit | I kind of meant half the damage mitigated over the raid |
| 14:14.58 | foxlit | Because that sounds like some sort of fantasy. |
| 14:15.08 | Thrae | Yes, raid damage |
| 14:15.13 | foxlit | Although perhaps I'm misreading that. |
| 14:15.24 | foxlit | Since you're just talking about half the incoming attacks, not half the incoming damage. |
| 14:16.29 | Thrae | Well there are some unresistable attacks, but most of ICC is resistable although not 100% resistable. |
| 14:16.41 | *** join/#wowuidev A-KO (as@unaffiliated/a-ko) |
| 14:17.00 | foxlit | Wonder if the volleys are actually binary |
| 14:17.07 | foxlit | Or if they got rid of that mechanic ages ago. |
| 14:17.31 | Thrae | Nope, my logs show the damage being reduced, but I've never seen a total avoidance of any spell |
| 14:17.42 | foxlit | But from that list, more or less the only legitimate example is that volley |
| 14:18.17 | foxlit | You shouldn't stand in crap, and, when you do, it's your health pool and not your resistance that'll save you. |
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| 14:23.31 | *** mode/#wowuidev [+v Cide] by ChanServ |
| 14:26.39 | Tuller | to not stand in crap is generally a good rule to live by |
| 14:31.31 | Thrae | So Marrowgar the non-health-based raid damage is Physical (x2) + Frost, Deathwhisper is Shadow (x3) + Frost, Lootship is Physical + Fire (x2), Saurfang is Physical only (x2), Festergut is Shadow (x3), Rotface is Nature (x2), PP is Nature (x3) + Shadow (x3), BC is Shadow + Fire + Physical, BQL is Shadow (x3), Dreamwalker adds are Fire + Frost + Nature (x3), Sindragosa is Frost (x5) + Arcane, and finally LK is Shadow (x5) ... |
| 14:31.37 | Thrae | ... + Frost (x2). |
| 14:32.09 | Thrae | foxlit: And that does not include any attacks that are only for the tank or should be avoidable based on boss/mob positioning by tanks. |
| 14:32.57 | foxlit | What did you count for sindragosa? |
| 14:33.17 | foxlit | Frost aura is the only one I would accept, I think. |
| 14:35.13 | Thrae | foxlit: Frost Aura (all), Permeating Chill (melee DPS/tank), Unchained Magic (Casters), Ice Tomb (2 players in 10-mode), Frost Bomb (avoidable), Blistering Cold (avoidable). |
| 14:35.28 | *** join/#wowuidev felipe` (~felipe@my.nada.kth.se) |
| 14:35.58 | foxlit | Chilled to the Bone and Instability are stack based; you control the number of stacks you get based on your HP, not resistance. |
| 14:36.12 | foxlit | As getting too many will just kill you. |
| 14:36.20 | nevcairiel | resisting half of its damage is still nice though =) |
| 14:36.59 | foxlit | Ice Tomb is irrelevant; you'll get hotted while it's flying and you're immune for its duration. |
| 14:37.06 | nevcairiel | without motw you would be with 0 resistance against arcane, and probably never resist a bit |
| 14:37.47 | Thrae | foxlit: So with greater resistance OR greater health, you can survive more attacks from any of these. |
| 14:38.26 | Thrae | And note MotW gives greater health too, so that should be factored in if you're making health-based decisions. |
| 14:38.32 | nevcairiel | greater health is nothing that helps you, healers will kill you instead afterwards :d |
| 14:39.06 | Thrae | Seriously, Sindragosa becomes pretty damn hard with 0 Frost Resistance |
| 14:39.18 | Thrae | Due to Phase 3's Mystic Buffet |
| 14:40.18 | Thrae | I read that someone got ~500 Frost Resistance from Gear+Buffs and was resisting like 50% of Sindragosa's damage. Very nice! |
| 14:40.33 | nevcairiel | 500 cripples your gear though |
| 14:40.43 | nevcairiel | i have 200 with aura and the resistance ring |
| 14:41.09 | Thrae | nevcairiel: Naww, he had some 213s even, lemme check |
| 14:42.18 | nevcairiel | there actually only are 3 pieces of frost resistance that are worth wearing |
| 14:42.37 | Stanzilla | we use one piece of resistance gear for 25man. used to use 2 pieces, tho |
| 14:42.42 | Stanzilla | boots and belt |
| 14:42.56 | nevcairiel | oh wait, 4 items with the ring |
| 14:43.18 | Thrae | nevcairiel: Yeah both the Polar and Icebane crap is 213 and will get you up to ~500 with Aura, Ring, and Buffs |
| 14:43.26 | nevcairiel | if you wear all 4, its 480 resistance with aura |
| 14:43.32 | Thrae | nevcairiel: Also, Sindragosa's melee swings happen to be Frost school too! |
| 14:43.32 | nevcairiel | no other stacking buff is there |
| 14:43.52 | nevcairiel | You didnt say he was a tank, thats quite usual for them to wear more resistance |
| 14:44.16 | Thrae | nevcairiel: Yeah I'm making a Polar Stam set for Sindragosa |
| 14:44.50 | nevcairiel | those items have alot of stam already, so tanks dont lose *that* much when wearing them |
| 14:44.57 | nevcairiel | other classes however lose those slots completly |
| 14:44.58 | Thrae | nevcairiel: And, of course, http://www.wowhead.com/item=43582 |
| 14:45.35 | Thrae | nevcairiel: True. Do you think I should do Stam + Agi or all Agi for increased TPS? |
| 14:45.54 | nevcairiel | depends how your TPS output is already :d |
| 14:46.09 | Thrae | It's fine once I get 2 stacks of Lacerate on pretty much anything |
| 14:46.29 | nevcairiel | you only have one mob to tank there |
| 14:46.40 | Thrae | Yep |
| 14:46.59 | Thrae | I'm thinking increased Stam is better due to allowing more stacks of Mystic Buffet |
| 14:47.23 | Thrae | Right now my 10-man group is wiping on Sindragosa even before Phase 3 so we have a lot of coordination to do, but anything I can do to help as the tank is gravy |
| 14:50.03 | DWSR | Thrae: What class are you? |
| 14:50.27 | Thrae | DWSR: If you scrolled up you'll see I mentioned it numerous times, but Druid |
| 14:50.39 | DWSR | Thrae: Just logged in. |
| 14:50.41 | DWSR | ZNC ftw. |
| 14:50.45 | Thrae | DWSR: I only play Druids. My alt is a Druid. |
| 14:50.45 | DWSR | So FUFUFUFUFUFUFU |
| 14:50.56 | Thrae | ZNC doesn't let you read the buffer? |
| 14:51.08 | DWSR | My buffer's set to 50 lines. |
| 14:51.19 | nevcairiel | so increase it |
| 14:51.28 | nevcairiel | what good is a irc proxy if it doesnt get you backlog? |
| 14:51.42 | DWSR | nevcairiel: Never need more than 50 lines. |
| 14:51.44 | Thrae | Is that the buffer per channel, per server, or overall? |
| 14:51.52 | DWSR | 50 lines per channel. |
| 14:52.03 | DWSR | I /can/ increase it, but I don't really feel it's neccessary. |
| 14:52.04 | Thrae | I think I said 50 lines ago something Druidish. |
| 14:52.09 | DWSR | anyway, you shouldn't be doiung anything but stam stacking. |
| 14:52.13 | nevcairiel | If you only need 50 lines, you dont need a proxy at all |
| 14:52.19 | Thrae | Anyway, I am a big Druid fan. Even my only alt is a Druid. |
| 14:53.00 | nevcairiel | My first char was a druid, and i still play the same char as my main. Not many people can claim that =) |
| 14:53.06 | DWSR | Thrae: As long as your TPS is (highest DPS) + 1, stam stack. |
| 14:53.08 | nevcairiel | release day char, too |
| 14:53.51 | Thrae | DWSR: That's pretty much true of any tank ;) |
| 14:54.02 | DWSR | Thrae: You shouldn't need to increase your TPS. |
| 14:54.09 | Thrae | Although Druids benefit from Stam more than any other Tank. |
| 14:54.12 | DWSR | If you're as geared as your DPS are, you shouldn't be having issues unless you're a bad. |
| 14:54.13 | DWSR | Are you a bad? |
| 14:54.38 | Thrae | DWSR: Well, specifically we were talking about using Polar gear (iLevel 213) with Sindragosa. |
| 14:54.55 | DWSR | Why? My guild killed her at 5% with just GotW and FR aura. |
| 14:55.01 | DWSR | There are no resist fights. |
| 14:56.08 | Thrae | DWSR: Because *my* guild is wiping on her, and I figure the more damage I can take the better, especially in Phase 3. |
| 14:56.21 | DWSR | Thrae: If you're not getting to P3 yet, you're not wiping from Frost damage. |
| 14:57.02 | DWSR | It's easily possible with only the ~200 resist that you get from aura + gift. You shouldn't be bothering with wearing resist gear. |
| 14:57.19 | nevcairiel | aura and gift dont stack, you are at 130. |
| 14:57.32 | Thrae | nevcairiel: I thought they stacked? |
| 14:57.38 | DWSR | They do. |
| 14:57.41 | nevcairiel | not for quite some time now |
| 14:57.43 | Thrae | They used to not stack |
| 14:58.20 | Thrae | DWSR: Anyway, while we have strategic problems, adding frost resistance can only help if I can maintain threat. |
| 14:58.50 | DWSR | Thrae: I guess it might be a little bit different for a druid, but our guild runs with paladin/DK tanks. |
| 14:58.53 | DWSR | Shit's ezmode. |
| 14:58.59 | DWSR | Your raid will wipe you far before you wipe you. |
| 14:59.07 | Thrae | As the tank I'm already doing my best. I can't make other people avoid the Frost Bombs, Blistering Cold, and DPS the Tombs correctly. |
| 14:59.53 | DWSR | Thrae: They're going to die if they fail on the fight mechanics, regardless of how much resist gear they're wearing. |
| 14:59.57 | Thrae | DWSR: That's true, but less healing on me means the healers can focus on others more, and in Phase 3 it means I can take more stacks of Mystic Buffet. |
| 15:00.25 | DWSR | Thrae: You should have a paladin or a shaman healer healing you. |
| 15:00.35 | DWSR | And if you do, then they're pretty limited in how much they can heal the raid ANYWAY. |
| 15:01.29 | Thrae | You're taking a very binary view of this fight. You don't either fail or not fail. You're not either good or not good. It's all about various variables, especially for this rag-tag group that doesn't do progression raids. |
| 15:01.51 | DWSR | Thrae: While I'll concede the second point, the first point is very much binary. |
| 15:01.53 | nevcairiel | He takes such a view on any topic, its quite annoying usually |
| 15:02.01 | DWSR | You kill the boss, (i.e. you win) or you don't (i.e. you lose). |
| 15:02.34 | Thrae | That would be a problem if our goal was progression, but it's not. |
| 15:02.36 | nevcairiel | When and how you fail is important to fix it, just the fact that you do isnt helping |
| 15:03.23 | Legorol | unfortunately Sindragosa does have pretty binary fight mechanics |
| 15:03.29 | DWSR | nevcairiel: You seem to be saying that I'm saying something to the contrary. I'm not. I'm simply pointing out that you fail or you don't, and how much loot you get adjusts accordingly. My recommendation, however, is that people learn the fights. It's not the easiest fight in the world. |
| 15:03.30 | Legorol | you either manage to run away from Blistering Cold, or you don't |
| 15:03.35 | DWSR | ^ |
| 15:03.38 | Legorol | you either manage to run away from the person with Frost Tomb, or you don't |
| 15:03.50 | Thrae | Legorol: Ice Tomb |
| 15:03.57 | Thrae | I keep calling it "Frost Tomb" myself |
| 15:03.57 | Legorol | both of which often results in immediate death, or at least puts the whole group at significant disadvantage |
| 15:04.02 | Legorol | Thrae: ah ok :) |
| 15:04.22 | Thrae | And we rarely wipe due to misaligned Beaconed |
| 15:04.38 | Legorol | these two mechanics are not something that you can "sort of" get right |
| 15:04.52 | Legorol | having said that, they are not that complicated, and with sufficient practice almost eveyr WoW player can learn them |
| 15:05.00 | Legorol | they are both about practice, practice :) |
| 15:05.23 | airtonix | balissimo! |
| 15:05.49 | Thrae | DWSR: I'm not saying we should all gear up for Frost and not learn the fights. I'm saying it's something auxillary to consider, especially for the tank. Logically, if we knew exactly how to do the Sindragosa fight then we wouldn't be having problems. But learning a fight is different for every raid group with different makeups, different people, interpreting things differently. |
| 15:06.19 | Legorol | Thrae: i'd dare to say that there are three stages to any fight, but this applies particularly to Sindra: |
| 15:06.23 | Legorol | 1. not knowing what to do |
| 15:06.30 | Legorol | 2. knowing what to do, but not able to execute it correctly |
| 15:06.34 | Legorol | 3. knowing and executing |
| 15:06.56 | Legorol | Sindra has very simple mechanics that require quick reaction/awareness, hence it mostly falls in category 2 for many raids |
| 15:07.13 | Thrae | DWSR: "Just learn the fight" is obvious of ANYthing in WoW, so your statement is full of arrogance. |
| 15:07.18 | DWSR | Thrae: No. |
| 15:07.24 | DWSR | You assume that the game takes anything but knowledge and practice. |
| 15:07.34 | Legorol | "just learn the fight" doesn't apply to the same extent to different bosses |
| 15:07.48 | nevcairiel | Ignorance, its all him |
| 15:07.56 | Legorol | sindra is easy to know, hard to execute |
| 15:08.31 | nevcairiel | the ability to execute is called "skill" usually, and if you dont have it, you probably will take aeons to execute it properly |
| 15:08.44 | Legorol | i have a different view of that Nechckn |
| 15:08.44 | Thrae | Legorol: Knowing what to do and knowing how to make your character do it are two different things. They are both learning processes. |
| 15:08.47 | Legorol | *nevcai |
| 15:08.49 | Legorol | bah |
| 15:08.58 | Legorol | Thrae: there is a third component too |
| 15:09.14 | nevcairiel | You also need situational awareness in a fight like that, which alot of people just lack |
| 15:09.14 | Legorol | knowing what to do, knowing how to make your char do it, *and* reacting quickly enough and executing it correctly |
| 15:09.20 | Legorol | it's the third part that most people need practice with |
| 15:09.28 | Legorol | nevcairiel: i disagree |
| 15:09.31 | Legorol | it needs practice more |
| 15:09.44 | Thrae | Legorol: I consider that part of "knowing how to make your character do it", where "it" is broadly defined. |
| 15:09.45 | Legorol | with designated ice tomb spots and raid symbols, there is no decision making involved |
| 15:09.52 | nevcairiel | Alot of people play with something that we ended up calling tunnel vision |
| 15:09.54 | DWSR | nevcairiel: I would say that situational awareness is much less useful if everything goes According to Plan. |
| 15:09.56 | Legorol | Thrae: interesting, i usually split the two |
| 15:10.00 | Legorol | to give you an example: |
| 15:10.05 | DWSR | When The Shit Hits the Fan, that's when situational awareness can be useful. |
| 15:10.10 | nevcairiel | they watch their dot timers, and run their rotation |
| 15:10.15 | nevcairiel | but thats where there abilities end |
| 15:10.31 | Legorol | a person playing a mage might know that they need to move out of the Blistering Cold, they might also know that the most efficient way to do it is to make a quick 180 and blink, |
| 15:10.46 | Legorol | but may not have sufficient reflexes or dexterity to execute the maneuver in a timely manner, without practice |
| 15:11.17 | Legorol | imo, there is often a difference between knowing what to do and being able to perform it |
| 15:11.45 | Legorol | nevcairiel: almost every person can be trained though |
| 15:11.46 | nevcairiel | my defintiion of situational awareness also includes a brain that actually functions fast enough to react on that before its too late |
| 15:11.52 | Legorol | humans have a propensity for learning, given time and effort |
| 15:12.00 | Thrae | Legorol: Right, and while that may be a more subconscious thing, it's still part of knowing how to do something. Aside from instinct and talent, reflexes and reactions are learned behavior. |
| 15:12.08 | Legorol | if you can tell them "this is what you need to practice and improve", *and* spend enough wipes, they can and will learn if motivated |
| 15:12.29 | Legorol | Thrae: right. i just don't use the word "know" for that |
| 15:12.43 | nevcairiel | If some player dies every try in that explosion thing, for a whole evening, i usually give up on their learning effort |
| 15:12.43 | Legorol | i tend to reserve "know" to mental knowledge of the abstract concept |
| 15:12.59 | Legorol | nevcairiel: of course |
| 15:13.05 | Legorol | i never said that people have infinite time and/or patience |
| 15:13.13 | Legorol | i'm just saying that people *can* eventually learn it, if they are trying |
| 15:13.19 | Legorol | if they are not trying, that's a different matter entirely |
| 15:14.22 | Legorol | anyway, back on point: |
| 15:14.40 | Legorol | frost resist on tank is a good idea if threat is not an issue, it gives the healers more slack and allows them not to have to multitask so much, |
| 15:14.48 | Legorol | enabling them to be more likely to succeed on the fight mechanics |
| 15:15.07 | Legorol | once they are comfortable with the fight mechancis and are able to do them without thinking, you can take the frost resist off |
| 15:15.18 | Stanzilla | I died to that grip AE like 10 times or so until I noticed that I stood too far away from her and as the flying way increases, you have less time to run away and are doomed to fail |
| 15:15.38 | Legorol | Stanzilla: it's not true that you are doomed to fail |
| 15:15.52 | Legorol | even if you are at max distance, you do (theoretically) have sufficient time to turn and run away, including latency |
| 15:16.01 | Legorol | it is harder a bit of course, but you are not doomed |
| 15:16.03 | Stanzilla | no, trust me :p |
| 15:16.03 | nevcairiel | you can also turn mid-flight |
| 15:16.05 | nevcairiel | and just run |
| 15:16.10 | Legorol | Stanzilla: no i don't trust you :) been there, done it |
| 15:16.18 | Stanzilla | meh |
| 15:16.23 | Stanzilla | I just hit dispersion everytime now |
| 15:16.26 | Stanzilla | fixed! |
| 15:16.32 | nevcairiel | i bet stan doesnt have movement speed on his boots |
| 15:16.32 | Legorol | i didn't say that *you* must succeed at it |
| 15:16.36 | Legorol | i just disagree that it's impossible |
| 15:16.43 | Stanzilla | nevcairiel: true |
| 15:16.46 | Legorol | oh yah |
| 15:16.59 | Legorol | in ICC, we make Tuskarr's mandatory for everyone who doesn't have run speed talents |
| 15:17.00 | nevcairiel | neither do i, but i'm a druid, if shit hits the fan, i either barkskin or just cheetah |
| 15:17.38 | nevcairiel | <3 that sindra is actually outdoors |
| 15:18.55 | airtonix | :( |
| 15:19.11 | Stanzilla | Legorol: we should do that, too |
| 15:19.14 | Stanzilla | for defile |
| 15:19.16 | airtonix | shapeshift should be dangerous |
| 15:21.49 | zenzelezz | ... one day I will learn not to go back and try old MMOs again :-| |
| 15:22.40 | airtonix | yeah playing wow is bad |
| 15:23.03 | zenzelezz | I still prefer WoW over any other I've tried |
| 15:23.29 | airtonix | after i stopped playing wow, i tried aion then i realised i just hate mmo |
| 15:23.55 | airtonix | most games infact. |
| 15:23.58 | zenzelezz | got a "hey, try Anarchy Online again, 30 days free"... I had so much fun in that one, but I can't seem to relive it now that I'm used to better mechanics and stuff |
| 15:25.02 | Bruners | airtonix: gogo herores of newerth |
| 15:25.11 | airtonix | ... |
| 15:26.22 | airtonix | strangely i prefer to be the only human playing my games and would prefer that the npcs all be played by advanced meglomaniac AIs that have a better grasp on the english language than me |
| 15:26.40 | *** join/#wowuidev Kazie (~Kazie@188.114.158.72) |
| 15:33.10 | zenzelezz | http://roflrazzi.com/2010/05/07/celebrity-pictures-hector-elizondo-better-known-as/ |
| 15:35.29 | DWSR | hehe |
| 15:37.46 | zenzelezz | it's so true... I never remember his name |
| 15:38.50 | *** join/#wowuidev Hirsute (~chatzilla@WoWUIDev/Norganna/Developer/Hirsute) |
| 15:39.58 | zenzelezz | for everyone who loves puns: http://verydemotivational.com/2010/05/07/demotivational-posters-our-base/ |
| 15:42.54 | Fisker | Oh hai i just bought a collectors edition and the key doesn't work |
| 15:43.01 | Fisker | Now Blizzard tells me that the key was in use |
| 15:43.11 | Fisker | But i think i'll trust some random ebay dude when he tells me he didn't use it |
| 15:43.20 | Fisker | Question; Why did Blizzard steal my key? |
| 15:44.13 | Wobin | zenzelezz, which movie is he in? |
| 15:44.16 | Fisker | Shirik do you know? |
| 15:44.34 | zenzelezz | Wobin: you know... the one with that guy |
| 15:44.37 | airtonix | some random tv show about doctors |
| 15:44.50 | zenzelezz | Chicago Hope or something? |
| 15:44.59 | airtonix | where hope goes to die |
| 15:45.16 | Wobin | oh |
| 15:45.17 | Fisker | Shirik |
| 15:45.20 | Wobin | never watched that |
| 15:48.12 | Bruners | any russians that could write som russian letters |
| 15:50.57 | *** join/#wowuidev digmouse (~chatzilla@111.193.203.235) |
| 15:54.08 | Kalroth | http://translate.google.com/#en|ru|hello%20world |
| 16:05.48 | airtonix | некоÑоÑÑе ÑÑÑÑкие бÑÐºÐ²Ñ |
| 16:05.50 | A-KO | sighs |
| 16:06.35 | Fisker | Kalroth |
| 16:13.00 | *** join/#wowuidev Thrae (~ircuser@generalmx-1-pt.tunnel.tserv13.ash1.ipv6.he.net) |
| 16:19.09 | *** join/#wowuidev Thrae (~ircuser@generalmx-1-pt.tunnel.tserv13.ash1.ipv6.he.net) |
| 16:19.37 | Shirik | Fisker |
| 16:19.40 | Shirik | I will destroy you |
| 16:19.44 | Shirik | you have now been destroyed |
| 16:19.46 | Shirik | you cannot retaliate |
| 16:19.48 | Shirik | I win |
| 16:24.37 | *** join/#wowuidev Tuller (~Tuller@c-69-143-49-212.hsd1.va.comcast.net) |
| 16:26.12 | Fisker | Shirik you will gift me Rocket Knight |
| 16:26.28 | Fisker | Shirik you will gift me Rocket Knight |
| 16:26.39 | Fisker | Shirik you will gift me Rocket Knight |
| 16:26.54 | Shirik | hm |
| 16:26.55 | Fisker | Where's your god now Shirik ? |
| 16:27.17 | *** mode/#wowuidev [+q Fisker!*@*] by Shirik |
| 16:27.29 | Kalroth | haaaaa |
| 16:28.44 | *** part/#wowuidev Fisker (n_a@62.61.142.209.generic-hostname.arrownet.dk) |
| 16:28.50 | *** join/#wowuidev Fisker (n_a@62.61.142.209.generic-hostname.arrownet.dk) |
| 16:29.08 | *** part/#wowuidev Fisker (n_a@62.61.142.209.generic-hostname.arrownet.dk) |
| 16:29.18 | *** join/#wowuidev Fisker (n_a@62.61.142.209.generic-hostname.arrownet.dk) |
| 16:29.31 | Shirik | wtf is eir doing |
| 16:30.29 | nevcairiel | btw Thrae, alpha version of the new ToL has 5 minutes cooldown |
| 16:30.49 | *** mode/#wowuidev [-q Fisker!*@*] by Shirik |
| 16:30.52 | Fisker | Tree of Life? |
| 16:31.11 | Fisker | Shirik you will gift me Rocket Knight and you will like it |
| 16:31.14 | Shirik | (REM) quiet[18996] Fisker!*@* was set on #wowuidev by Shirik!~mpdelbuon@WoWUIDev/WoWIStaff/Norganna/StatisticalEngineer/Shirik on 2010-05-08 16:27:18 and had an expiry date of 2010-05-08 16:28:27. It was removed by Shirik!~mpdelbuon@WoWUIDev/WoWIStaff/Norganna/StatisticalEngineer/Shirik on Sat May 8 16:30:50 2010 |
| 16:31.25 | Shirik | EXCEPT IT'S NOW 12:31 AND IT DID NOT EXPIRE |
| 16:31.29 | Fisker | you fail |
| 16:31.38 | Fisker | you will however gift me Rocket Knight |
| 16:31.42 | mikma | http://starwars.tomtom.com/voices/index-starwars.php?Lid=1 |
| 16:33.01 | Thrae | nevcairiel: Ouch. That's even longer than Metamorphosis. Hopefully that'll change by Open Beta, or there's already a way to reduce that. |
| 16:33.12 | nevcairiel | although 3x0.5s talent reduce |
| 16:33.16 | nevcairiel | so 3.5 |
| 16:33.22 | Fisker | naw nevcairiel |
| 16:33.31 | Fisker | 5 minutes and 58,5 seconds |
| 16:33.32 | Fisker | ;3 |
| 16:33.37 | Fisker | (had to be done) |
| 16:33.50 | Thrae | nevcairiel: 3.5 is still too long, I'd like to see 2 minutes. |
| 16:33.57 | nevcairiel | and ImpToL increases dmg done in tree form |
| 16:34.00 | nevcairiel | wtf is up with that |
| 16:34.05 | foxlit | It's a 45 second effect |
| 16:34.21 | Fisker | I think druids are missing part of their identity by the change |
| 16:34.22 | nevcairiel | 2 minutes is too short for 45 seconds |
| 16:34.22 | Kalroth | rocket knight is shit, fisker |
| 16:34.26 | Fisker | They should've kept tree form |
| 16:34.38 | Fisker | and maybe have a cooldown like that just makes you a prettier tree or something |
| 16:34.39 | Thrae | nevcairiel: Well that can be reduced too |
| 16:34.47 | Fisker | Kalroth |
| 16:34.48 | Fisker | fuck you |
| 16:34.56 | nevcairiel | I hate healing cooldowns that are like 20 seconds |
| 16:34.58 | Kalroth | im being honest |
| 16:35.06 | Fisker | have you played it? |
| 16:35.09 | nevcairiel | You have to move once due to some effect, and swoosh, the effect is gone |
| 16:35.15 | Kalroth | http://www.eurogamer.net/articles/download-games-roundup-7th-may-2010?page=2 |
| 16:35.33 | Kalroth | "Famous on the Mega Drive for about a year over two titles, Rocket Knight has been re-imagined by Climax as a slick 2.5D platformer-cum-shooter." |
| 16:36.05 | Fisker | cum shooter? |
| 16:36.20 | Fisker | anyway Kalroth |
| 16:36.26 | Fisker | you forgot one thing in your theory there |
| 16:36.30 | Fisker | IT'S A GAMING REVIEW SITE |
| 16:36.40 | Kalroth | and it reviews the game as shit! |
| 16:37.08 | Fisker | You could trust people with dynamite vests more than you could trust a game review site |
| 16:57.18 | *** join/#wowuidev Sum_Wun (~sumwun@72.183.41.75) |
| 17:02.26 | Thunder_Child | is it possible to get professions via mouseover? |
| 17:04.31 | foxlit | rephrase the question. |
| 17:05.20 | *** join/#wowuidev spode (spode@213.21.119.83) |
| 17:06.43 | Thunder_Child | how exactly is that not clear? |
| 17:06.53 | Thunder_Child | though i should add of someone else |
| 17:07.07 | foxlit | ^ like that. |
| 17:08.10 | foxlit | not directly, at least. |
| 17:08.42 | Thunder_Child | i'm rather surprised, since you can do it with talents |
| 17:09.09 | foxlit | Talents and professions are a bit unrelated. |
| 17:09.57 | *** join/#wowuidev Seerah (~Ryan@c-98-239-20-229.hsd1.tn.comcast.net) |
| 17:09.57 | *** mode/#wowuidev [+o Seerah] by ChanServ |
| 17:11.55 | *** join/#wowuidev Borgleader (~borgleade@modemcable253.146-130-66.mc.videotron.ca) |
| 17:15.14 | *** join/#wowuidev Guardix (~Martin@188.178.102.237) |
| 17:16.01 | Maldivia | Thunder_Child: you can inspect, and search for professions-specific enchants etc (like tailor cloak enchant, inscription shoulder, LW legs, JC gems, BS gem-slots) |
| 17:16.56 | foxlit | You'll never find Mining |
| 17:17.44 | Thunder_Child | or herb |
| 17:17.46 | Maldivia | add up all enchants and buffs and talents, and see of the stamina is too low :P |
| 17:18.29 | Maldivia | but yeah, you can't get the gathering professions that way |
| 17:18.40 | Maldivia | but didn't say it was perfect |
| 17:22.27 | Fisker | just give in-game armory already |
| 17:23.10 | foxlit | I can't get both stdin and stdout of a program using io.stdout? |
| 17:23.13 | foxlit | Lunacy |
| 17:23.23 | foxlit | er. io.popen |
| 17:28.01 | mikma | http://static.mmo-champion.com/mmoc/images/news/2010/may/cataclysm_models_npc/batch2/murloc1.jpg |
| 17:29.11 | A-KO | heh |
| 17:31.56 | *** join/#wowuidev sylvanaar (~sylvanaar@unaffiliated/sylvanaar) |
| 17:38.58 | Fisker | Shirik |
| 17:39.02 | Fisker | you will gift me rocket knight |
| 17:41.02 | Cide | is it unavailable in europe? |
| 17:43.57 | *** join/#wowuidev Aelobin (~Aelobin@85.211.65.153) |
| 17:44.46 | Aelobin | is there any way to drag "Spirit Walk" back onto my feral spirit's pet bar? :< |
| 17:44.58 | Aelobin | theirs no pet section in my spellbook when theyre out |
| 17:45.04 | Aelobin | *there's |
| 17:47.29 | Fisker | yeah Cide |
| 17:47.36 | Cide | why? |
| 17:48.09 | Fisker | idk |
| 17:48.25 | *** join/#wowuidev Dewin (~Daniel@c-71-59-222-35.hsd1.or.comcast.net) |
| 17:53.23 | Dashkal | It was pretty easy |
| 17:53.25 | Dashkal | mt |
| 17:56.32 | Maldivia | Aelobin: it should be back next time you summon them, I think? |
| 17:56.40 | Aelobin | nop :< |
| 17:56.49 | Maldivia | tried relogging? |
| 17:56.54 | Aelobin | hmm i will now, sec |
| 17:57.23 | Maldivia | other then that - no idea |
| 17:57.51 | Aelobin | nah still not there :< |
| 18:01.27 | mikma | anyone here has the murloc gurgle as highquality wav? |
| 18:02.18 | zenzelezz | high quality? As in higher quality than extracted from the MPQs? |
| 18:02.43 | Nechckn | Digitally remastered for more gurg! |
| 18:02.44 | mikma | as extracted |
| 18:02.50 | mikma | it'll do just fine :) |
| 18:04.01 | zenzelezz | you know, that would make a great ring tone |
| 18:05.02 | mikma | exactly the reason why i'm looking for it |
| 18:05.10 | mikma | all the versions in net are superlow :O |
| 18:05.24 | mikma | http://mikma.eu/nokia/Oh%20Yeah.mp3 |
| 18:05.27 | mikma | i made that one today |
| 18:09.03 | *** join/#wowuidev kd3 (~kd3@wikia/kaydeethree) |
| 18:13.09 | Cide | oh yeah |
| 18:14.12 | Thrae | Anyone want to make a Night Elf on Maelstrom and join my guild so I have a fake guild to use for Wowstead.com? |
| 18:15.02 | mikma | cheater |
| 18:15.03 | *** join/#wowuidev robotusch (~robotusch@50A2E67F.flatrate.dk) |
| 18:15.06 | nevcairiel | why a night elf? |
| 18:15.07 | mikma | go and code TinyTip |
| 18:15.22 | Thrae | nevcairiel: Because the guild leader is a level 1 Night Elf and I don't want to teleport him around |
| 18:15.49 | nevcairiel | also you need 10 people to make a guild |
| 18:16.03 | Thrae | Yes, and I have 6 signatures so far |
| 18:18.05 | zenzelezz | what's it called? |
| 18:18.20 | airtonix | ymca |
| 18:18.23 | zenzelezz | does it have a tabard? |
| 18:18.37 | airtonix | if they do it won't be on for long |
| 18:18.39 | Cide | why so serious? |
| 18:18.54 | airtonix | ^ found written on an empty toilet roll |
| 18:20.24 | Thrae | mikma: TinyTip works fine except for the errors |
| 18:20.33 | zenzelezz | am I misremembering things, or did the Defias in Northshire use to be hostile? |
| 18:20.52 | Thrae | zenzelezz: There's different factions of Defias, some aren't hostile I think |
| 18:21.08 | airtonix | the ones across the stream are |
| 18:21.18 | nevcairiel | they made alot of npcs in starting areas neutral |
| 18:21.21 | nevcairiel | nerfing it for the new guys |
| 18:21.22 | airtonix | fail |
| 18:21.22 | zenzelezz | I'm in the middle of the vineyards, and everyone's neutral |
| 18:21.35 | zenzelezz | they're all like "yo dawg, I heard you like grapes, so here you go" |
| 18:21.44 | Thrae | Maybe they're just Defias Farmers |
| 18:21.56 | Thrae | I mean even Bandits need to eat, when not stealing |
| 18:22.12 | zenzelezz | true |
| 18:22.15 | airtonix | if you read the story they aren't farming |
| 18:22.16 | Thrae | And there's a mob called Defias Bandits, so the Defias must be more than bandits |
| 18:22.42 | zenzelezz | these are called "Thugs", but after five+ years standing around the same field, everyone gets tired |
| 18:23.00 | airtonix | nameless goons |
| 18:24.14 | *** join/#wowuidev Colin_T (~ColinT@69-11-97-130.regn.static.sasknet.sk.ca) |
| 18:24.18 | *** join/#wowuidev Aeyan (~pancake@cpe-174-098-002-214.triad.res.rr.com) |
| 18:24.38 | zenzelezz | members of Project Defias have no name |
| 18:24.48 | airtonix | you went there |
| 18:25.04 | airtonix | <PROTECTED> |
| 18:25.11 | *** join/#wowuidev copystring (11794copy@o0o.o0o.o0o.o88-51-51-6o9.co.uk) |
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| 18:30.14 | *** mode/#wowuidev [+o Iriel] by ChanServ |
| 18:33.27 | *** join/#wowuidev frontendloader (~queue@207-118-171-154.dyn.centurytel.net) |
| 18:41.37 | Shirik | oh yay |
| 18:41.45 | Shirik | Wikipedia's finally making the Vector skin the default |
| 18:41.51 | Shirik | inc media freaking out |
| 18:41.59 | Shirik | and Fox claiming it's because of them |
| 18:42.21 | zenzelezz | the what skin? |
| 18:43.08 | Dashkal | Bibi: Thank you. I come home from surgery to see a ton of yummy screenies. Thank you for making my day :) |
| 18:43.11 | mikma | http://pouet.net/prod.php?which=25783 |
| 18:43.19 | Shirik | zenzelezz: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Main_Page?useskin=vector |
| 18:43.23 | mikma | one of the coolest demos ^^ |
| 18:43.40 | Thunder_Child | Dashkal: glad to see you are easy to cheer up |
| 18:43.41 | Shirik | it's their new skin they've been working on |
| 18:44.01 | Dashkal | I'm not in much pain right now. So I'm just enjoying small things :) |
| 18:44.13 | Thunder_Child | like not being in pain |
| 18:44.24 | mikma | http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vHQEGVxT3G4 |
| 18:44.35 | mikma | there you go, HD version of the same demo! |
| 18:44.49 | mikma | absolutely brilliant <3 |
| 18:46.00 | Dashkal | Thunder_Child: :D |
| 18:54.04 | *** join/#wowuidev frontendloader (~queue@207-118-132-65.dyn.centurytel.net) |
| 18:55.19 | Bibi | [20:42:46] <Dashkal> Bibi: Thank you. I come home from surgery to see a ton of yummy screenies. Thank you for making my day :) |
| 18:55.25 | Bibi | it's just called morphine leftovers. |
| 18:56.35 | Dashkal | *snickers* Sadly, I'm already weaned off of those |
| 18:57.25 | zenzelezz | so you've gone from morphine to caffeine |
| 18:58.02 | Arrowmaster | Shirik: why would fox claim its because of them? |
| 18:58.12 | zenzelezz | because it's Fox |
| 18:58.13 | Shirik | they did that last night |
| 18:58.34 | Shirik | why not |
| 19:03.54 | Shirik | Arrowmaster, did you see the article |
| 19:03.57 | Shirik | I linked last night? |
| 19:04.07 | Arrowmaster | no |
| 19:04.15 | *** join/#wowuidev Fisker (n_a@62.61.142.209.generic-hostname.arrownet.dk) |
| 19:05.11 | Shirik | http://www.foxnews.com/scitech/2010/05/07/wikipedia-purges-porn/ |
| 19:05.16 | Shirik | they seem to think it's all them |
| 19:05.28 | Shirik | that's like those guys in football that go "yeah it's all me all me yeah yeah" when they get a touchdown |
| 19:06.29 | Shadowed | Fox news told the sun to rise, it did |
| 19:06.29 | *** join/#wowuidev Cidwel (~Administr@83.58.203.27) |
| 19:06.34 | Cidwel | hiya |
| 19:06.36 | Shadowed | Fox news is now hailed as Jesus Christ |
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| 19:09.26 | *** join/#wowuidev Fisker (n_a@62.61.142.209.generic-hostname.arrownet.dk) |
| 19:12.14 | Shirik | Fisker |
| 19:12.17 | Shirik | do you like fox news? |
| 19:12.46 | foxlit | Shirik: code jam. |
| 19:12.51 | Cidwel | if I want to change the height of a frame, ¿what is the property to make it grow from the bottom anchor and not from the middle of the frame? |
| 19:12.53 | Shirik | no |
| 19:12.55 | Cide | NO FOXLIT |
| 19:12.55 | Shirik | not this year |
| 19:12.56 | foxlit | Now, while you have five hours left. |
| 19:12.58 | Shirik | I have enough on my plate |
| 19:13.11 | Shirik | I've been cleaning my apartment, moving, getting on trains, for like the past 3 days |
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| 19:13.20 | Shirik | google scheduled it at the worst possible time |
| 19:13.25 | foxlit | Clearly need a break from all that. |
| 19:13.35 | Shadowed | ah hrm |
| 19:13.40 | Shadowed | er nmt |
| 19:13.40 | Shirik | not gonna happen |
| 19:14.28 | foxlit | Technically, you can probably be done with it in like 10 minutes. |
| 19:14.48 | Shirik | heh |
| 19:14.55 | Shirik | irrelevant, I have too much to do and too little time |
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| 19:19.15 | *** mode/#wowuidev [+o Zyonin] by ChanServ |
| 19:20.53 | Xinhuan | Cidwel: just anchor the bottom of the frame (clear all anchors first), and setheight() |
| 19:21.15 | Fisker | yes Shirik |
| 19:21.18 | Fisker | i like fox news |
| 19:21.24 | Fisker | will you gift me rocket knight? |
| 19:22.15 | Fisker | wtf is the problem anyway Shirik ? |
| 19:22.26 | Fisker | omg wikipedia has "porn" on it's sites |
| 19:22.29 | Fisker | how inappropiate! |
| 19:22.31 | zenzelezz | so... a level 80 death knight in <Den danske pengetank> is asking on trade for gold for riding skill... |
| 19:22.44 | foxlit | zenzelezz: it's broke because of Fisker. |
| 19:22.54 | Fisker | i'm no banker |
| 19:23.02 | Cidwel | thanks Xinhuan :D |
| 19:23.20 | Fisker | i am however a terrorist, pedophile, sweatshop owner, etc. |
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| 19:25.46 | Cide | yay it builds |
| 19:27.53 | Thunder_Child | Fisker: welcome to the club |
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| 19:28.37 | *** mode/#wowuidev [+v tekkub] by ChanServ |
| 19:29.00 | airtonix | tc lol |
| 19:29.40 | Shirik | (15:23:09) (Fisker) i am however a terrorist, pedophile, sweatshop owner, etc. |
| 19:29.41 | *** join/#wowuidev Irish` (~DigitaLun@adsl-71-190-140.gsp.bellsouth.net) |
| 19:29.43 | Shirik | aka anonymous |
| 19:31.44 | *** join/#wowuidev Movix (~Movix@mail.schiffmann.fr) |
| 19:31.44 | Cide | true story |
| 19:31.48 | *** part/#wowuidev Movix (~Movix@mail.schiffmann.fr) |
| 19:32.22 | zenzelezz | so... for a noob mage, what heirloom weapon is the right one? |
| 19:32.31 | foxlit | staff. |
| 19:32.38 | Thunder_Child | ^^ |
| 19:32.56 | Thunder_Child | hmm...i just spell reflected drain life and gained life......my brain hurts from that |
| 19:33.00 | foxlit | It has the advantage of being a two-hander (so you don't have to find offhands) |
| 19:33.03 | zenzelezz | which of the two staves? |
| 19:33.10 | Fisker | Shirik |
| 19:33.13 | nevcairiel | not the pvp one |
| 19:33.14 | Shirik | Fisker |
| 19:33.16 | Thunder_Child | dignified headmasters charge |
| 19:33.20 | Fisker | you will gift me rocket knight |
| 19:33.24 | Shirik | no I will not |
| 19:33.24 | zenzelezz | Thunder_Child: cheers |
| 19:33.26 | foxlit | The one that looks like it should be wielded by a warlock |
| 19:33.27 | Fisker | yes you will Shirik |
| 19:33.32 | Shirik | no I will not |
| 19:33.36 | Fisker | yes you will Shirik |
| 19:33.38 | Shirik | I make you a deal |
| 19:33.41 | foxlit | What is the other, I wonder |
| 19:33.42 | Shirik | gift me rocket knight |
| 19:33.47 | Shirik | then I will gift you rocket knight |
| 19:33.55 | Fisker | i can't gift you rocket knight, it's not available in my region |
| 19:34.03 | Shirik | sucks to be you then |
| 19:34.07 | Shirik | move to a real part of the world |
| 19:34.10 | Fisker | that's why i want you to gift it :( |
| 19:34.10 | nevcairiel | foxlit: grand staff of jordan |
| 19:34.17 | nevcairiel | the pvp one |
| 19:34.27 | nevcairiel | looks like a typical NPC staff |
| 19:34.33 | foxlit | Headmaster's Charge all the way, really |
| 19:34.55 | foxlit | Hit rating is a waste, and the 20 stamina at 80 isn't really that big of a deal |
| 19:35.04 | foxlit | s/20/10/ |
| 19:36.15 | Fisker | i will give you 1000 (Zimbabwe) dollars for rocket knight Shirik |
| 19:37.16 | zenzelezz | I remember the single time in Vanilla that I saw the Headmaster's Charge drop |
| 19:37.34 | Fisker | i saw it drop once as well |
| 19:37.38 | nevcairiel | I ran scholomance so often, i took it for fun at some point |
| 19:37.39 | foxlit | I saw it while farming scholo the other night |
| 19:37.56 | Fisker | hilarious part being that some guy was on his alt and his main had spent countless hours and days farming it without seeing it drop |
| 19:38.00 | nevcairiel | scholomance was a hell of an instance, though. Could easily take 3 hours with a not-so-good group |
| 19:38.15 | nevcairiel | and we liked it |
| 19:38.24 | zenzelezz | I loved Scholomance |
| 19:39.22 | Shirik | best error ever |
| 19:39.25 | Shirik | Syntax error detected: Expected a ) at character 183, not found (found T_ID freaks instead). |
| 19:39.29 | Shirik | T_ID freaks |
| 19:40.32 | Cide | nice |
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| 19:41.39 | Cide | 183 characters on one line? |
| 19:41.40 | Cide | sounds epic |
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| 19:42.26 | Shirik | Cide: That's nothing |
| 19:42.35 | Shirik | some of the regexes I work with are nearly 1000 characters long |
| 19:42.38 | Cide | sounds like you could fit a \n in there |
| 19:42.42 | Cide | regexes can also be split up |
| 19:42.46 | Cide | string concatenation |
| 19:43.09 | Shirik | it gets considered all one line anyway |
| 19:43.19 | Cide | oh really |
| 19:43.22 | Shirik | I dunno why, the parser is strange |
| 19:43.34 | Cide | sounds like the parser would do line by line and not evaluate that |
| 19:43.35 | Shirik | statements are always one line, even if they're not |
| 19:43.53 | Cide | so... for class members that are lazily loaded, should they be pointers or just uninitialized regular member variables? |
| 19:44.29 | Xinhuan | whichever works best |
| 19:44.42 | Cide | they both work equally well really |
| 19:45.03 | Xinhuan | then follow the technical guidelines ;p |
| 19:45.09 | Cide | I'm designing it gosh |
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| 19:45.29 | Xinhuan | flip a coin then lol |
| 19:45.37 | Cide | but if it's a lazily loaded structure, it would take up memory all the time compared to only when allocated (+ the pointer) -- correct? |
| 19:46.12 | nevcairiel | C? |
| 19:46.15 | Xinhuan | you just have to figure out which would be a better long term solution |
| 19:46.18 | Cide | c++ |
| 19:46.26 | nevcairiel | use a pointer |
| 19:46.41 | Cide | why? |
| 19:46.44 | Xinhuan | and whether the class needs future expansion |
| 19:46.52 | Cide | I'm not disagreeing, just trying to figure out the rationale |
| 19:47.22 | nevcairiel | For what you said, rather have a null pointer then an unintialized structure sitting around |
| 19:47.29 | Xinhuan | with pointers, you initialze them to NULL to show that its uninitialized |
| 19:47.40 | Xinhuan | with uninitalized variables, you don't know if they are actually containing data |
| 19:47.52 | Xinhuan | unless you initialize the data to zero or soemthing that represents uninitialized |
| 19:48.00 | Cide | sounds good, thanks |
| 19:48.21 | Xinhuan | makes sense to you? |
| 19:48.27 | Cide | yeah |
| 19:48.33 | Xinhuan | pointers are slower to access though |
| 19:48.43 | Xinhuan | since you have to dereference |
| 19:48.45 | Cide | yeah |
| 19:49.01 | Xinhuan | so, depends on whether you need that kind of speed |
| 19:49.02 | Cide | it's not time-critical anyway |
| 19:49.41 | Cide | so uninitialized pointers just get whatever value that part of memory had before, right? |
| 19:49.47 | Cide | that is, I have to explicitly set it to NULL |
| 19:49.47 | Xinhuan | yes |
| 19:49.53 | Xinhuan | exactly the same as any other variable |
| 19:50.18 | Cide | yeah well, I only know the syntax of C++, not many semantics :) |
| 19:50.18 | nevcairiel | that actually depends on the compiler |
| 19:50.18 | nevcairiel | some null variables |
| 19:50.18 | nevcairiel | soem dont |
| 19:50.19 | Cide | alright |
| 19:50.22 | Xinhuan | if you compile in DEBUG mode |
| 19:50.31 | Xinhuan | most compilers will initialize variables and pointers to 0 for u |
| 19:50.41 | Xinhuan | but in RELEASE mode and usually in /o3, this is disabled |
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| 19:50.53 | Xinhuan | because as a programmer, initialization slows down programs |
| 19:51.08 | nevcairiel | <PROTECTED> |
| 19:51.20 | nevcairiel | it can actually make stuff slower |
| 19:51.39 | Xinhuan | it can, but that's what profilers are for |
| 19:51.49 | Xinhuan | for the most part it helps more than it hurts |
| 19:51.58 | nevcairiel | not really |
| 19:52.17 | nevcairiel | even if your code uses stuff that it can optimize, its a very slim advantage over O2 |
| 19:52.23 | Cide | so how can it optimize stuff slower? |
| 19:52.26 | Cide | I mean |
| 19:52.37 | nevcairiel | Usually due to bad assumptions |
| 19:52.44 | Xinhuan | only in very rare cases will it actually be worse |
| 19:53.05 | Cide | sounds pretty stupid |
| 19:53.12 | Cide | if what nevcairiel says is true |
| 19:53.12 | Xinhuan | consider if you use a constant |
| 19:53.17 | Xinhuan | const int m = 4 |
| 19:53.25 | Xinhuan | in debug mode or with no optimizations |
| 19:53.29 | Xinhuan | whenever you refer to m |
| 19:53.37 | Xinhuan | it will read the value wherever m is stored |
| 19:53.46 | Xinhuan | but with optimization |
| 19:53.53 | Xinhuan | the compiler may opt to hardcode the number 4 in |
| 19:53.56 | Cide | well yeah |
| 19:53.59 | Xinhuan | whereever its used |
| 19:54.03 | Cide | I'm aware of the concept of optimization :P |
| 19:54.06 | Xinhuan | so if you actually did something like |
| 19:54.41 | Xinhuan | int &k = const_cast<int>(&m) |
| 19:54.59 | Xinhuan | you'll find bugs |
| 19:55.01 | Cide | yeah |
| 19:55.03 | Xinhuan | when reading k |
| 19:55.05 | Cide | but if you do that you should be shot |
| 19:55.09 | Xinhuan | exactly ;p |
| 19:55.21 | Xinhuan | so that's why i said for the most part, optimization helps |
| 19:55.36 | nevcairiel | too bad i cant find the article benchmarking Os O2 and O3 |
| 19:55.36 | Xinhuan | its only if you do stupid stuff |
| 19:55.38 | Cide | well of course it's bad if it introduces bugs |
| 19:55.41 | Xinhuan | then compiler assumptions fail |
| 19:55.43 | nevcairiel | in many cases Os is even the fastest |
| 19:56.25 | Cide | it seems weird how additional optimizations lead to slower code... if they're usually bad optimizations, why optimize for them ata ll? |
| 19:56.26 | Cide | at all |
| 19:56.51 | nevcairiel | thats why people dont chose O3 too often |
| 19:56.59 | nevcairiel | it includes stuff thats questionable |
| 19:58.02 | Xinhuan | its just that sometimes, different optimizations conflict |
| 19:58.34 | Xinhuan | also o2 compiles faster :) |
| 19:58.49 | nevcairiel | O3 will inline alot more functions, which will make the code bigger, and if at some point your app happens to not fit in the cache anymore, while it before did, its already slower |
| 19:58.54 | nevcairiel | thats why Os sometimes wins, too |
| 19:59.32 | Xinhuan | without using a profiler or benchmark of some sort, its hard to tell |
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| 20:00.26 | nevcairiel | O2 is usually always safe to use, reasons to use O3 are very rare, and linux distribution developers will usually discourage use of O3 |
| 20:00.58 | Xinhuan | source engine uses O3 |
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| 20:11.31 | Shirik | Cide |
| 20:11.33 | Shirik | I wrote a paper on this |
| 20:11.50 | Shirik | It's because the compiler doesn't consider the PURPOSE of code, only the technical meaning of it |
| 20:12.00 | Shirik | often times developers write code along the lines of what they know it's doing |
| 20:12.32 | Shirik | often times the purpose of the code results in a particular path being followed that the developer might know but the compiler does not |
| 20:12.38 | Shirik | just because of expected inputs |
| 20:12.56 | Thunder_Child | $5 says Shirik will write his own full language one of these days. |
| 20:13.08 | Shirik | ha |
| 20:13.17 | Shirik | I don't really have a reason to supercede C++ |
| 20:13.33 | Shirik | Maybe I'll call it C++# just to make people think it's new and cool, but keep everything the same |
| 20:13.37 | Thunder_Child | except for the bitching you do it? |
| 20:13.43 | Thunder_Child | you do about it* |
| 20:13.47 | Shirik | ?? |
| 20:13.51 | Shirik | when do I bitch about C++ |
| 20:13.54 | Thunder_Child | from time to time |
| 20:14.00 | Shirik | don't think so :/ |
| 20:14.10 | Xinhuan | you'll call it c++++ yes? :P |
| 20:14.33 | Thunder_Child | you may not think so but i remeber teh bitching |
| 20:14.34 | Xinhuan | or c** |
| 20:14.46 | Thunder_Child | c>* |
| 20:14.59 | Shirik | the ++ operator returns a constant :( |
| 20:15.25 | Shirik | d--? |
| 20:15.33 | Cide | Shirik: ah |
| 20:15.38 | Cide | that makes sense |
| 20:15.51 | Shirik | Cide: I should give you a copy of the paper, I think it's pretty interesting |
| 20:15.57 | Cide | sure |
| 20:15.58 | Xinhuan | no, not a constant, just a temporary |
| 20:16.12 | Shirik | I came across the problem when I was working on a vision processing algorithm where 90% of the view was black |
| 20:16.16 | Shirik | and the goal was to find a white dot |
| 20:16.30 | Shirik | the compiler refused to make an optimization I could do manually because it wasn't aware of that fact |
| 20:16.38 | Shirik | it had to consider all cases, and for random data, the compiler's version would be better |
| 20:16.49 | Shirik | but for real cases, mine was about 3x faster |
| 20:19.07 | Cide | interesting |
| 20:19.10 | Cide | makes sense |
| 20:19.32 | Cide | afk for an hour |
| 20:20.02 | airtonix | how is a compiler supposed to make those assumptions ? |
| 20:20.14 | sylvanaar | does anyone know, are there chinese realms with less than 3 characters |
| 20:20.20 | sylvanaar | in their name |
| 20:20.32 | airtonix | glyphs |
| 20:20.45 | Iriel | The trick isn't to write a new language, it's to write a better compiler to use the language we already know. |
| 20:21.12 | Iriel | Shirik: That's one of the arguments for JIT compilation of code rather than WAT (Way Ahead of Time) compilation -- flow analysis |
| 20:21.36 | Shirik | airtonix: I don't expect the compiler to make those assumptions |
| 20:21.40 | Iriel | Shirik: Do you think there's an intermediate that's even better (A JIT/WAT hybrid which knows about historical data) |
| 20:21.56 | Shirik | Well we've done it for a while in hardware |
| 20:22.07 | Shirik | branch prediction, etc. |
| 20:22.12 | airtonix | would you provide some way of allowing to run specific test to be able to make those decisions ? |
| 20:22.20 | sylvanaar | eg. ?? |
| 20:26.05 | Iriel | Shirik: aren't most of the hardware tricks parallelization tricks, i.e. execute both and throw the one you dont use away -- You still waste the power of the calculation, but it performs quickly |
| 20:26.16 | Iriel | Shirik: or do I have a flawed understanding of the approach |
| 20:26.22 | Shirik | that's done too yes |
| 20:26.36 | Shirik | but at least I know intel's chips analyze loops, etc., and start to do branch prediction |
| 20:26.51 | Shirik | it causes a penalty if it guesses wrong, but it also can offer good performance gain |
| 20:27.00 | Shirik | but it's mostly for things like for loops which will loops hundreds of times |
| 20:27.38 | krka | my god, hundreds of times? |
| 20:27.41 | krka | that's a massive amount |
| 20:28.46 | airtonix | top 100 lines used by mad scientists ? |
| 20:29.15 | krka | i nerd sniped myself :/ http://code.google.com/codejam/contest/dashboard?c=438101#s=p3 |
| 20:29.20 | airtonix | great scots! |
| 20:29.22 | krka | can't think of any efficient solutions |
| 20:30.08 | Shirik | krka: Not my point ._. |
| 20:31.44 | Iriel | I wonder if you can isolate contradictions and similarity groups |
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| 20:32.13 | krka | you could form graphs of same city-pairs |
| 20:32.19 | krka | per statement-issuer |
| 20:32.35 | krka | but that's just a minor optimization i suspect |
| 20:32.40 | Iriel | I was thinking more about this sort of thing |
| 20:32.52 | Iriel | A and B make contradictory claims, C claims A and B are from the same city, C must be lying |
| 20:33.33 | krka | i wonder if the best approach is simply assume, recurse, fail on contradiction |
| 20:33.48 | Cide | that's what I was thinking |
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| 20:33.58 | Cide | I wonder to what extent you need to fail |
| 20:34.01 | krka | a full test of all combinations would obviously be too expensive, but if you choose the ordering of assumptions cleverly, it might be ok |
| 20:34.37 | krka | Iriel: yeah, you could probably define several rules such as that to preprocess it |
| 20:34.42 | krka | and do a full scan on the rest |
| 20:35.02 | krka | Cide: just regular backtracking |
| 20:35.03 | Iriel | I suspect the 500 statement cases might make that rather slow |
| 20:35.18 | krka | that's why you need a lot of preprocessing |
| 20:36.00 | Xinhuan | it seems like you need to write code that *finds* contradictions |
| 20:36.06 | Iriel | I screwed up my US take because I was trying to be too clever and oversimplified a post-processing step (and I didn't have the time to fix it before the large timer ran out) |
| 20:36.07 | Iriel | ah well |
| 20:36.12 | Xinhuan | which can then firm down whether someone is a liar |
| 20:36.24 | krka | curious fact: i L i can never occur and i T i doesn't prove anything at all |
| 20:36.38 | Xinhuan | which then leads to other conclusions, then you deduce more from there, and when you can't deduce anymore things, you start the contradiction finding process again |
| 20:36.38 | Iriel | Xinhuan: finding consistencies is useful too |
| 20:36.47 | Iriel | Xinhuan: since you can collapse those people into one logical unit |
| 20:36.55 | krka | Iriel: oh you actually tried it on large? |
| 20:36.59 | Xinhuan | so a 2 prong approach |
| 20:37.04 | Iriel | krka: the US one, not this one |
| 20:37.09 | krka | ah |
| 20:37.46 | Iriel | I was trying to use stock lua (no libraries) for them |
| 20:37.54 | krka | i wonder if a simple prolog program would be efficient for this :) |
| 20:37.55 | Iriel | Sadly that meant implementing arbitrary precision math |
| 20:38.00 | Iriel | And I got a bit lazy |
| 20:38.00 | amro | Shirik: got time to discuss the replication mechanism? |
| 20:38.04 | Xinhuan | finding consistencies doesn't imply truth though |
| 20:38.22 | Xinhuan | which is why i think finding contradictions is the way to go first |
| 20:38.22 | Iriel | Xinhuan: right, but it implies that the 2 consistent people are from T or L |
| 20:38.33 | krka | i just use java, BigInteger is pretty nice :) |
| 20:38.40 | Iriel | Xinhuan: so you can coalesce them from a brute force approach later |
| 20:38.43 | krka | and development is quick with intellijj |
| 20:39.19 | Iriel | krka: Indeed, BigInteger is neat, I use it a lot in the real world, I was approaching this more as a 'what can I do with just lua' exercise 8-) |
| 20:39.47 | Iriel | My string-based big integer functions weren't too awful, except for the lack of mul |
| 20:40.18 | Iriel | You dont actually need it to find the answer, but you need it to produce the answer in the right format and I didn't run into a situation where that really MATTERED until the large dataset |
| 20:40.47 | krka | right |
| 20:42.00 | Iriel | I actually have to give the creators of the test credit for creating a really pathalogical test case for just that situation too |
| 20:42.01 | Shirik | ................ |
| 20:42.04 | Shirik | I really pissed someone off |
| 20:42.08 | Shirik | http://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=User:Shirik&diff=360966287&oldid=356027601 |
| 20:42.10 | Iriel | And for putting it as case 6, not case 900 8-) |
| 20:42.17 | Shirik | he is proposing to ... delete ... me |
| 20:42.49 | Iriel | Well, your page |
| 20:42.51 | Iriel | not YOU |
| 20:43.01 | Iriel | You are not your wikipedia identity |
| 20:43.06 | Shirik | ok fine |
| 20:43.11 | Shirik | but he said he would destroy me |
| 20:43.12 | sylvanaar | Shirik + wikipedia = drama |
| 20:43.15 | Iriel | Much as you might be aspiring to become a being of pure information, living only in the internets |
| 20:43.16 | amro | Speedy delete this, User talk:Shirik and any other subpages as he destroyed my WikiMemories. Iwillgetmyrevenge (talk) 20:42, 8 May 2010 (UTC) |
| 20:43.18 | amro | ahahahaha |
| 20:43.46 | Shirik | I know exactly who he is |
| 20:43.53 | Shirik | but by policy I'm not allowed to do anything about it |
| 20:44.15 | Nechckn | Shirik BTW, the pedia needs to refute that claim by fox, if it is true... cause that makes them look like boobs, if that is why they started removing things. |
| 20:44.17 | krka | stop pissing people off |
| 20:44.54 | amro | Shirik: stop wasting time reverting vandalism and come help me |
| 20:48.59 | Fisker | Shirik |
| 20:49.04 | Fisker | have you considered my proposal |
| 20:49.05 | Fisker | ? |
| 20:49.10 | Thunder_Child | Fisker Shirik |
| 20:49.27 | Fisker | Thunder_Child amro |
| 20:54.22 | *** join/#wowuidev amro (~amro@41.102.248.157) |
| 20:55.23 | Torhal | Fisker: Stop logging into WP and threatening to destroy Shirik. You're supposed to do that here. |
| 20:55.39 | Shirik | no it wasn't Fisker, I know who it was |
| 20:56.04 | *** join/#wowuidev Aeyan| (~pancake@cpe-174-098-002-214.triad.res.rr.com) |
| 20:56.14 | Thunder_Child | we all know who it was |
| 20:56.22 | Thunder_Child | s/was/is/ |
| 20:56.30 | Torhal | I suppose I could watch the new Doctor Who episode while my kernel compiles. |
| 20:56.41 | Shirik | ? |
| 20:56.43 | airtonix | no |
| 20:56.47 | airtonix | dr who is bad |
| 20:56.54 | airtonix | total and utter fail |
| 20:57.00 | airtonix | hate the new doctor |
| 20:57.01 | Thunder_Child | ^^ |
| 20:57.01 | Shirik | ^ |
| 20:57.09 | Shirik | high fives Thunder_Child |
| 20:57.26 | Thunder_Child | returns the five |
| 20:57.27 | zenzelezz | buying two heirloom shoulder items... pro |
| 20:57.31 | Torhal | Eh, he seems like an awkward mashup of Tennant and Eccleston. |
| 20:57.44 | Torhal | With a Neanderthal brow. |
| 20:57.49 | airtonix | can you believe he has a facebook account! |
| 20:57.55 | airtonix | <PROTECTED> |
| 20:57.56 | Torhal | I should care? |
| 21:00.07 | airtonix | no |
| 21:02.08 | Fisker | Shirik |
| 21:02.12 | Fisker | did you consider my proposal? |
| 21:02.29 | airtonix | there can only be one |
| 21:03.12 | zenzelezz | unite the clans |
| 21:03.59 | zenzelezz | bah, thought you said "there can be only one" |
| 21:05.29 | *** join/#wowuidev Hjalte (~chatzilla@cpe.ge-0-2-0-835.arcnqu2.customer.tele.dk) |
| 21:05.54 | airtonix | i was refering to jet lee |
| 21:06.07 | airtonix | therr cun oohnly be wun |
| 21:06.15 | *** join/#wowuidev amro (~amro@41.102.248.157) |
| 21:06.26 | zenzelezz | I see |
| 21:06.37 | zenzelezz | I thought you meant the Warcraft 2 cheat cod |
| 21:06.38 | zenzelezz | +e |
| 21:10.28 | *** join/#wowuidev Shirik (~mpdelbuon@WoWUIDev/WoWIStaff/Norganna/StatisticalEngineer/Shirik) |
| 21:10.28 | *** mode/#wowuidev [+o Shirik] by ChanServ |
| 21:10.30 | *** join/#wowuidev frontendloader (~queue@207-118-128-29.dyn.centurytel.net) |
| 21:11.41 | airtonix | lol @ little red monster in tmnt(2007) |
| 21:14.09 | Fisker | du er et meget sygt individ airtonix |
| 21:14.19 | Fisker | so Shirik have you come to join the horde? |
| 21:14.26 | Fisker | err... have you considered my offer? |
| 21:16.40 | airtonix | Fisker, ÐÑ Ð¾ÑÐµÐ½Ñ Ð¿Ð»Ð¾Ñ
о оÑделÑнÑÑ
|
| 21:17.53 | Shirik | shadowmaster [~ignacio@wesnoth/developer/shadowmaster] has quit [Read error: error:1408F10B:SSL routines:SSL3_GET_RECORD:wrong version number] |
| 21:17.56 | Shirik | wtf is that |
| 21:18.04 | Nechckn | Does anyone play Lord of the rings online? |
| 21:18.11 | Thunder_Child | Так Ð²Ñ airtonix |
| 21:18.23 | airtonix | lulz |
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| 21:24.26 | Shirik | ok who here uses irssi |
| 21:24.30 | Shirik | how the hell do I set up highlights |
| 21:24.32 | Dashkal | <-- |
| 21:24.35 | Dashkal | no idea :S |
| 21:24.44 | Shirik | fuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuu |
| 21:24.55 | Dashkal | ccccccckkkkkkk? |
| 21:25.34 | airtonix | lol |
| 21:25.43 | airtonix | googlefu is weak in this one |
| 21:26.02 | Shirik | BLACKBERY NOT STAYING CONNECTED |
| 21:26.05 | Shirik | aiwfewpafwjpoeawpojefaejwf |
| 21:26.13 | Thunder_Child | there are some irssi diehard fans in here |
| 21:26.14 | airtonix | ._+ |
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| 21:27.13 | Dashkal | Not a diehard. I just wanted a non-suck terminal client |
| 21:27.29 | Thunder_Child | well you failed then |
| 21:27.34 | Thunder_Child | also, i wasnt refering to you |
| 21:27.46 | Arrowmaster | i just use irssi as a proxy |
| 21:29.35 | airtonix | LOL http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=O2rGTXHvPCQ |
| 21:29.40 | airtonix | irc : its like boats |
| 21:29.46 | airtonix | [wall of lol] |
| 21:31.29 | sylvanaar | anyone know much about the addon table variable they added in 3.3? |
| 21:31.59 | sylvanaar | ie, addon_name, addon_table = ... |
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| 21:49.00 | jnwhiteh | sylvanaar: what about it |
| 21:49.02 | jnwhiteh | its a table! |
| 21:49.15 | jnwhiteh | sylvanaar: I can probably answer most questions about it, as I played with that system when it came out. |
| 21:49.43 | sylvanaar | well, i understand how it works, i guess - why did they add it? |
| 21:49.56 | jnwhiteh | so you could have a 'private' table for your addon |
| 21:49.59 | jnwhiteh | think localization |
| 21:50.00 | jnwhiteh | for example |
| 21:50.15 | jnwhiteh | or think about stuff you want to keep out of the hands of other addons, but need them to span files. |
| 21:52.03 | sylvanaar | yeah, i had an ugly hack i was using to span files |
| 21:52.09 | sylvanaar | i guess this replaces that |
| 21:52.26 | nevcairiel | just create a table in the first, take it out of global in the last |
| 21:52.29 | nevcairiel | not that ugly tbh |
| 21:52.41 | sylvanaar | thats what i had |
| 21:52.48 | jnwhiteh | nevcairiel: you assume that nothing can get at it |
| 21:52.51 | jnwhiteh | you're probably wrong =) |
| 21:53.50 | nevcairiel | If you *need* to keep something private to your addon, you're doing it wrong, anyway =) |
| 21:54.23 | jnwhiteh | not _entirely_ true, and it wasn't created to fill that purpose, but in general I agree. |
| 21:54.30 | jnwhiteh | either way, it solves an issue =) |
| 21:55.27 | sylvanaar | its like a half-implementation of lua modules |
| 21:57.28 | sylvanaar | you could just setenv that table in all your addons lua files |
| 21:57.52 | sylvanaar | s/setenv/setfenv/ |
| 21:58.50 | Cidwel | anyone is going to participate in google jam? |
| 22:04.44 | sylvanaar | it also might be useful for 'mixin' style code re-use in place of certain utility libraries |
| 22:06.38 | jnwhiteh | its got lots of uses =) |
| 22:06.43 | jnwhiteh | and given that they gave us the addon name |
| 22:06.47 | jnwhiteh | it was an easy trivial change |
| 22:11.04 | Fisker | my offer Shirik |
| 22:11.08 | Fisker | is it under consideration? |
| 22:11.10 | *** join/#wowuidev Illuminar (~illuminar@host-88-83-5-226.adsl.gl) |
| 22:12.13 | Shirik | no |
| 22:12.26 | *** join/#wowuidev cybermind (~cm@c-71-200-90-36.hsd1.md.comcast.net) |
| 22:12.40 | sylvanaar | jnwhiteh: indeed |
| 22:12.48 | Fisker | oh so you've decided to help me Shirik ? |
| 22:14.01 | Shirik | no |
| 22:14.13 | Fisker | so you're still considering it? |
| 22:14.42 | airtonix | as your divorce lawyer i recommend you dont answer that |
| 22:14.59 | Shirik | no |
| 22:16.20 | Cide | hmm |
| 22:17.00 | Cide | cancel the hmm |
| 22:17.19 | Shirik | no |
| 22:17.34 | Cide | yes |
| 22:17.45 | Cide | well that's a plus |
| 22:17.46 | Cide | it doesn't crash |
| 22:19.59 | Cide | is an infinite loop an improvement or not? |
| 22:20.01 | Fisker | oh so you've decided to help me Shirik ? |
| 22:22.57 | Shirik | eh Cide? |
| 22:23.03 | Shirik | um |
| 22:23.09 | Cide | I was just making fun of my own inability to code |
| 22:23.23 | Shirik | well teh problem with infinite loops is you don't know if it's working and going very slowly or if it's broken |
| 22:23.30 | Cide | it was broken |
| 22:23.31 | Shirik | if it crashes, you know for sure it's broken |
| 22:23.37 | Cide | I had missed to increment the iterator |
| 22:25.10 | Cide | time to check if this stuff works! |
| 22:25.17 | Cide | wish me luck |
| 22:25.31 | Cide | good luck |
| 22:25.32 | Cide | thank you |
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| 22:26.54 | *** mode/#wowuidev [+o ckknight] by ChanServ |
| 22:28.24 | Shirik | Cide: |
| 22:28.31 | Shirik | Did you post-increment or pre-increment the iterator? |
| 22:28.37 | Cide | post |
| 22:28.42 | Cide | well previously not at all |
| 22:29.00 | Cide | now I do it as a separate statement after the body of the iteration |
| 22:29.07 | Cide | why? |
| 22:29.26 | Shirik | bad |
| 22:29.28 | Shirik | bad bad |
| 22:29.31 | Cide | why? |
| 22:29.33 | Shirik | bad bad bad |
| 22:29.37 | Cide | why? |
| 22:29.40 | Cide | why why why |
| 22:29.42 | Shirik | always pre-increment iterators |
| 22:29.47 | Cide | um |
| 22:29.55 | Cide | we're talking an std::vector<class T>::iterator |
| 22:29.59 | Shirik | yes |
| 22:30.08 | Shirik | always pre-increment them |
| 22:30.14 | Cide | pre-increment how? |
| 22:30.20 | Shirik | ++iter; |
| 22:30.23 | Cide | oh |
| 22:30.24 | Shirik | not iter++; |
| 22:30.32 | Cide | I thought you meant before the body |
| 22:30.36 | Shirik | no |
| 22:30.41 | Cide | I guess that makes sense |
| 22:30.47 | Cide | for some other reason other than efficiency? |
| 22:30.55 | Shirik | nope |
| 22:31.01 | Cide | figured as much |
| 22:31.09 | Cide | or hoped as much anyway |
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| 22:31.17 | Shirik | the only reason is because post-increment requires that the copy constructor be called then the increment |
| 22:31.27 | Cide | oh really |
| 22:31.29 | Shirik | whereas pre-increment has no copy constructor call |
| 22:31.35 | Cide | doesn't the compiler optimize that away? |
| 22:31.39 | Shirik | nope |
| 22:31.42 | Cide | or does it guess that the copy constructor can have side effects |
| 22:31.42 | Shirik | it's not allowed to |
| 22:31.45 | Shirik | exactly |
| 22:31.48 | bluspacecow | \o |
| 22:31.57 | bluspacecow | *vibrates in place excitedly* |
| 22:32.08 | bluspacecow | New Dr Who episode day ! |
| 22:32.17 | Cide | gotta dig up every place I've used iterators then |
| 22:32.22 | Cide | to make sure it pre-increments |
| 22:32.46 | Shirik | I would like to see some kind of keyword that allows the compiler to be given an optimization hint saying "This has no side effects" |
| 22:33.17 | bluspacecow | .... guys why would people believe the SCII beta is still going now the release date has been announced ? |
| 22:33.24 | Cide | Find all "++;", Subfolders, Find Results 1, "Current Project" |
| 22:33.25 | Cide | <PROTECTED> |
| 22:33.27 | Cide | yeah.... no |
| 22:33.32 | bluspacecow | wouldnt that mean the beta had ended >_> |
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| 22:33.38 | Thunder_Child | no? |
| 22:33.47 | nevcairiel | why would it mean that? |
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| 22:33.51 | bluspacecow | @cide & thunder - am I wrong in my assumption ? |
| 22:33.55 | bluspacecow | ok im wrong :) |
| 22:33.55 | Thunder_Child | yes |
| 22:34.13 | Shirik | yes |
| 22:34.20 | bluspacecow | ah ty ty |
| 22:34.25 | Shirik | beta will continue past the release date |
| 22:34.27 | Thunder_Child | there just isnt any reason to stop it, as a matter of fact, it would be a good idea to increas the number of people |
| 22:34.29 | zenzelezz | having a set release date just means "we feel confident we'll be ready by this time" |
| 22:34.38 | Thunder_Child | increase* |
| 22:34.51 | Shirik | it will just become an open, pay-for beta |
| 22:34.53 | bluspacecow | ah i see |
| 22:35.03 | Cide | yeah |
| 22:35.03 | bluspacecow | so be ever vigilant for fake beta emails |
| 22:35.13 | Thunder_Child | blizz is fairly good at not having that happen Shirik |
| 22:35.16 | Cide | anyone can enter the beta for a certain fee |
| 22:35.34 | Cide | say $60 or so |
| 22:35.50 | Shirik | I'm not convinced of SC's readiness Thunder_Child |
| 22:36.03 | Cide | why not? |
| 22:36.12 | zenzelezz | what do you mean "scam invite"... it came from the Internet, so it must be genuine! |
| 22:36.20 | bluspacecow | .... |
| 22:36.47 | zenzelezz | I'm sure they used totallygenuinesciibeta.blizzard.fake.com because it was too hard to set up a new subdomain at blizzard.com! |
| 22:36.48 | Shirik | and for that matter, I am not convinced of ANY game company's software engineering practices |
| 22:37.03 | bluspacecow | nvm i had something witty to say but forgot about it |
| 22:37.35 | Cide | hey I only post-incremented it at one place in the whole project |
| 22:37.36 | Cide | I'm awesome |
| 22:37.38 | airtonix | instead complain about stupid sidekicks |
| 22:37.47 | Fisker | Starcraft 2 is fine |
| 22:38.05 | Shirik | if you look at any of my code you will see I never post-increment Cide :) |
| 22:38.08 | Shirik | it has become a habit |
| 22:38.23 | Cide | well you can go through my code and change it |
| 22:39.22 | Shirik | no |
| 22:39.25 | Cide | yes! |
| 22:39.29 | Shirik | fully optimized code should flow from your fingertips |
| 22:39.34 | Cide | lol |
| 22:39.35 | Cide | yeah right |
| 22:39.36 | bluspacecow | ill do it ! |
| 22:39.41 | Cide | psh |
| 22:39.46 | Fisker | so Shirik |
| 22:39.47 | Cide | you don't have access to our secrits |
| 22:39.51 | Fisker | have you come to gift me rocket knight? |
| 22:39.53 | bluspacecow | ill replace every line with "printf("oh hai")" |
| 22:40.08 | Cide | fully optimized huh |
| 22:40.13 | bluspacecow | yep ! |
| 22:40.17 | bluspacecow | *nod* *nod* |
| 22:41.00 | bluspacecow | my first version of it was to build the string letter by letter , put it in a 8 global variables and call each one to build the string |
| 22:41.07 | bluspacecow | every time I used the print statement |
| 22:41.51 | Torhal | bluspacecow: The new episode was decent. airtonix, however, thinks Doctor Who is fail. |
| 22:42.04 | bluspacecow | lolz |
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| 22:42.12 | bluspacecow | vampires in venice torhal ? |
| 22:42.16 | Torhal | Yup |
| 22:42.18 | Shirik | fully optimized would be something like |
| 22:43.11 | Shirik | reinterpret_cast<void (*)(char*)>(0x12345678)("oh hai") |
| 22:43.11 | airtonix | Torhal, he is too iphony for my tastes |
| 22:43.21 | Torhal | iPhony? |
| 22:43.32 | bluspacecow | 1 line |
| 22:43.33 | airtonix | iPhony(tm) |
| 22:43.35 | bluspacecow | nice shirik |
| 22:44.29 | Shirik | I should try to write a program like that |
| 22:44.41 | nevcairiel | And we shall smite you |
| 22:44.54 | Shirik | instead of needing a linker, I will just write out all the addresses myself |
| 22:45.01 | bluspacecow | next april fools joke ? |
| 22:45.07 | foxlit | You can pry post-increments from my cold, dead fingers. |
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| 22:49.19 | Fisker | you cannot stop me Shirik |
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| 22:51.37 | airtonix | Fisker, are you like Hud in cloverfield ? |
| 22:51.39 | Fisker | lol |
| 22:51.41 | Fisker | http://news.cnet.com/8301-31322_3-20004504-256.html?tag=mncol;title |
| 22:51.47 | Fisker | The FCC ruled that it's "in the public interest" (PDF) to give the Motion Picture Association of America so-called selectable output controls, and that it will help enable the "new business model" of delivering on-demand movies closer to the theatrical release date. |
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| 22:54.21 | airtonix | ffs |
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| 22:54.22 | Fisker | no i ffs u |
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| 22:55.10 | airtonix | a pox on you |
| 22:55.43 | Shirik | a tux on you |
| 22:55.57 | bluspacecow | loz tux |
| 22:58.02 | cybermind | when you guys said you only post-incremented once, you mean just a standalone "i++" like in a for loop? |
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| 23:01.42 | foxlit | game needs better mass-looting controls |
| 23:01.42 | foxlit | takes 30 seconds to clear a scholomance room; 90 to loot everything |
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| 23:01.44 | zenzelezz | foxlit: "Master Looter" - point based AoE loot, requires level 85 |
| 23:02.05 | Fisker | wat? |
| 23:02.06 | Fisker | oh |
| 23:02.37 | Fisker | They should just give us an auto-loot option |
| 23:02.43 | Shirik | wat |
| 23:02.56 | Fisker | i.e. auto loot anything in range |
| 23:03.11 | Fisker | Then just postpone rolls until you're out of combat |
| 23:03.27 | airtonix | muwahaha |
| 23:05.54 | Mr_Rabies | <foxlit> takes 30 seconds to clear a scholomance room; 90 to loot everything |
| 23:06.13 | Mr_Rabies | this reminds me of how damned fast items would disappear from kills in diablo |
| 23:06.18 | Mr_Rabies | like everyone had an autolooter |
| 23:06.32 | haste | I remember playing diablo locally with others |
| 23:06.35 | Mr_Rabies | it was just up to the gods of battle.net |
| 23:06.38 | haste | Boss dies -> insert clciking noises |
| 23:06.38 | Adys | I had an autolooter! |
| 23:06.38 | Mr_Rabies | on who got it |
| 23:06.44 | Adys | I LEARNED ASSEMBLY MOM |
| 23:07.00 | airtonix | <clicking noises> |
| 23:07.00 | nevcairiel | haste: diablo was always clicking noises |
| 23:07.18 | haste | yes, but it increased exponentially with boss kills! |
| 23:07.21 | airtonix | <geiger counter> |
| 23:07.28 | Shirik | Adys |
| 23:07.38 | Shirik | int 80h |
| 23:07.48 | Adys | your momma |
| 23:08.03 | Adys | my alt-gr is disabled again |
| 23:08.04 | Adys | :( |
| 23:08.08 | Adys | and i forgot how to fix it |
| 23:08.15 | Shirik | alt-gr is supposed to be disabled |
| 23:08.19 | Shirik | it is not a real key |
| 23:08.39 | nevcairiel | it just functions as ctrl-alt |
| 23:08.41 | zenzelezz | only on American failkeyboards |
| 23:08.54 | nevcairiel | or ctrl-alt function as alt-gr? |
| 23:08.56 | nevcairiel | who knows! |
| 23:09.06 | haste | what nevcairiel says is true for linux |
| 23:09.15 | nevcairiel | windows too |
| 23:09.20 | haste | only if enabled on linux |
| 23:09.36 | haste | <cltr><alt> doesn't work as <alt gr> here for example |
| 23:09.42 | Shirik | are europeans that lazy that you can't type ctrl+alt ? |
| 23:09.47 | Shirik | you need a key to do it for you? |
| 23:09.52 | nevcairiel | yeah |
| 23:09.53 | Bruners | haha |
| 23:10.04 | haste | Shirik: do you want to click <ctrl><alt> everytime you want to make {} [] () ? |
| 23:10.11 | nevcairiel | seriously |
| 23:10.17 | Shirik | use a better layout |
| 23:10.21 | nevcairiel | although () are on shift |
| 23:10.26 | nevcairiel | the others are on alt-gr |
| 23:10.27 | haste | ah true |
| 23:10.36 | Bruners | Shirik: try typing øæåô on that keyboard of yours |
| 23:10.41 | haste | hasn't used scandinavian qwerty in a while. |
| 23:10.42 | Shirik | ?ae?? |
| 23:10.47 | haste | fail |
| 23:10.48 | haste | øæå! |
| 23:10.52 | Shirik | ?ae?! |
| 23:10.54 | Pneumatus^ | enGB [] are standard keys, {} are shift, () are shift |
| 23:10.55 | haste | fail again |
| 23:10.58 | *** join/#wowuidev jnwhiteh (~jnwhiteh@WoWUIDev/WoWI/Featured/Dongle/cladhaire) |
| 23:10.58 | *** mode/#wowuidev [+o jnwhiteh] by ChanServ |
| 23:10.59 | Shirik | I'm using a terminal |
| 23:11.04 | Shirik | I am typing exactly what I'm seeing |
| 23:11.05 | haste | so am I |
| 23:11.08 | airtonix | lol |
| 23:11.16 | Shirik | well obviously your terminal is broken |
| 23:11.17 | nevcairiel | Pneumatus^: you dont need all those standard keys for äöü etc :p |
| 23:11.20 | Fisker | btw Shirik |
| 23:11.20 | Fisker | i did it |
| 23:11.21 | Fisker | can you stop me? |
| 23:11.24 | haste | clearly Shirik ! |
| 23:11.25 | Bruners | means your terminal is shit and can't handle UTF8 |
| 23:11.29 | *** join/#wowuidev Osagasu (~Creek@67-197-1-37.rh1.dyn.cm.comporium.net) |
| 23:11.29 | airtonix | ._o |
| 23:11.41 | Shirik | I wonder what happens when I type japanese |
| 23:11.46 | Fisker | hey haste |
| 23:11.49 | Fisker | you know what i hate? |
| 23:11.50 | bluspacecow | japanese |
| 23:11.50 | haste | hey Fisker |
| 23:11.54 | Shirik | .... |
| 23:11.54 | Pneumatus^ | alt gr working as ctrl+alt is equally as useless for us |
| 23:11.58 | haste | :D:D:D |
| 23:11.59 | Shirik | lol |
| 23:12.00 | Fisker | i hate haste |
| 23:12.01 | Shirik | they become dots |
| 23:12.04 | Pneumatus^ | apart from for , not that we use that either |
| 23:12.10 | Bruners | i actually have a danish layout |
| 23:12.12 | Shirik | but for some reason irsii shows them up correctly first |
| 23:12.16 | Shirik | when I type them in |
| 23:12.16 | haste | Fisker: I'm soon L75! |
| 23:12.21 | Fisker | ;3 |
| 23:12.22 | Shirik | I guess it's irsii's fault somehow |
| 23:12.27 | nevcairiel | @ and ⬠are on alt-gr too |
| 23:12.27 | bluspacecow | kk time to watch dr who laters |
| 23:12.28 | Fisker | on who haste ? |
| 23:12.33 | Fisker | â¬@£$ |
| 23:12.36 | haste | Fisker: Otravi! |
| 23:12.45 | Bruners | Shirik: /set term_charset or something |
| 23:12.53 | Fisker | oh my |
| 23:12.56 | Fisker | ravencrest? |
| 23:13.01 | haste | y |
| 23:13.03 | Bruners | Fisker: is it pro to have danish keyboard? |
| 23:13.06 | Fisker | imma fuck you up |
| 23:13.06 | Pneumatus^ | @ is shift+' on UK layout |
| 23:13.14 | Shirik | hm that didn't seem to help |
| 23:13.19 | Pneumatus^ | shift+2 on US |
| 23:13.37 | Bruners | @ = alt-gr+2 |
| 23:13.47 | nevcairiel | @ = alt-gr Q |
| 23:13.56 | Bruners | qwertz layout ? |
| 23:14.05 | nevcairiel | yea |
| 23:14.07 | Fisker | it's über pro Bruners |
| 23:14.18 | Bruners | i have a qwertz keyboard as well |
| 23:14.31 | haste | Ã = alt-gr Q |
| 23:14.36 | haste | do I win? |
| 23:14.49 | nevcairiel | à = shift ä |
| 23:14.52 | nevcairiel | do i win? |
| 23:15.07 | haste | :D |
| 23:15.09 | Fisker | i will find you haste |
| 23:15.12 | Bruners | haste: what was the name of that layout you use? |
| 23:15.13 | Fisker | and i will destroy you |
| 23:15.23 | Fisker | you're in dragonblight i assume? |
| 23:15.25 | haste | Fisker: 59.76 63.24 |
| 23:15.34 | airtonix | Fisker, you have to get out of the padded cell next to me first. |
| 23:15.35 | haste | you can assume all you want! |
| 23:15.50 | Fisker | :( |
| 23:18.05 | *** join/#wowuidev KarlKFI (~chatzilla@ip70-181-89-32.oc.oc.cox.net) |
| 23:19.44 | Fisker | i can't find you haste |
| 23:20.20 | *** join/#wowuidev BWMerlin (~chatzilla@CPE-60-226-106-178.qld.bigpond.net.au) |
| 23:21.05 | Fisker | omg retarded horse |
| 23:21.21 | haste | lulz |
| 23:21.43 | haste | I miss my flying mount :( |
| 23:22.00 | cbreak | ... but you were hungry for chicken? |
| 23:22.08 | haste | possibly |
| 23:22.11 | Fisker | that mount coverage is ludicrous |
| 23:22.12 | *** join/#wowuidev dusky (~me@bas5-sudbury98-1279674973.dsl.bell.ca) |
| 23:22.13 | Fisker | err |
| 23:22.16 | Fisker | guard coverage* |
| 23:22.19 | haste | :D |
| 23:22.28 | Shirik | ok yeah it's definitely my terminal, not irssi |
| 23:22.33 | Shirik | I don't know how to fix it though |
| 23:23.49 | cbreak | recommends: Mac OS X |
| 23:24.03 | Fisker | :( haste |
| 23:24.04 | haste | oh noes |
| 23:24.39 | Iriel | Shirik: create an accurate termcap for the terminal you use? |
| 23:24.41 | cbreak | they come with LANG=de_CH.UTF-8 by default (or what ever language that is configured) |
| 23:24.49 | haste | Fisker: my panda will defend me! |
| 23:25.37 | haste | haha |
| 23:25.39 | haste | fancy effect |
| 23:26.05 | haste | Average Wait Time: 23min |
| 23:26.07 | haste | :( |
| 23:26.43 | Fisker | for dungeons? |
| 23:27.16 | haste | yy |
| 23:28.32 | Fisker | damn shaman on that retarded horse |
| 23:28.42 | haste | man, I this tiger is awesome |
| 23:28.59 | Arrowmaster | Shirik: what terminal are you using? |
| 23:29.27 | Fisker | lolwat haste |
| 23:30.00 | haste | I miss my other priests pets :( |
| 23:30.35 | Fisker | :3 |
| 23:30.39 | Shirik | Arrowmaster: : putty |
| 23:30.39 | Fisker | what priest is that? |
| 23:30.43 | Shirik | gah |
| 23:30.51 | Shirik | screw you irssi and your automated colons and spaces |
| 23:30.54 | Arrowmaster | Shirik: irssi faq says to try '/SET term_charset utf-8' |
| 23:30.55 | Bruners | cbreak: i recommend you to go get your money back |
| 23:30.59 | haste | Fisker: http://eu.wowarmory.com/character-sheet.xml?r=Grim+Batol&n=Yaranaika |
| 23:31.08 | Shirik | Arrowmaster: : I did that, but it's a terminal problem not an irssi problem |
| 23:31.13 | Shirik | omfg |
| 23:31.16 | Fisker | why not just transfer it haste ? |
| 23:31.17 | Shirik | stop with the colons and spaces! |
| 23:31.18 | Fisker | damn haker |
| 23:31.21 | Bruners | Shirik: set encoding to utf8 then |
| 23:31.25 | haste | Fisker: still use it! |
| 23:31.26 | Shirik | HAO |
| 23:31.28 | Fisker | oh |
| 23:31.45 | Arrowmaster | Shirik: i dont see it in the backlog but did you say what your LANG was set to? |
| 23:31.51 | Bruners | http://anti.teamidiot.de/nei/2007/02/irssi_putty_screen_unicode_utf/ |
| 23:32.15 | haste | evil! |
| 23:32.16 | Bruners | Shirik: also your screen has to be started with -U |
| 23:32.31 | Shirik | o |
| 23:32.40 | Arrowmaster | Bruners: i dont start screen with -U |
| 23:32.42 | Shirik | and what is LANG Arrowmaster ? |
| 23:32.46 | Arrowmaster | ..... |
| 23:33.00 | Arrowmaster | Shirik: echo "$LANG" |
| 23:33.02 | Arrowmaster | in a shell |
| 23:33.02 | Bruners | Arrowmaster: you probably have it set to utf8 by default |
| 23:33.15 | haste | local > echo $LANG |
| 23:33.15 | Bruners | Arrowmaster: or screen has been fixed to be utf8 by default |
| 23:33.18 | haste | locale* |
| 23:33.24 | Shirik | Arrowmaster: It just lols at me |
| 23:33.26 | Shirik | (empty) |
| 23:33.30 | haste | Fisker: 0130.39| Maisro yells: noob |
| 23:33.44 | Arrowmaster | Bruners: i think it is a system default since my entire distro uses nothing but utf8 |
| 23:33.44 | Fisker | that damn retarded horse haste |
| 23:33.49 | Arrowmaster | Shirik: what is the OS? |
| 23:33.54 | Shirik | gentoo linux |
| 23:34.00 | haste | and yet you have it :D |
| 23:34.11 | haste | Shirik: write locale |
| 23:34.17 | Fisker | of course haste |
| 23:34.22 | DWSR | http://www.aintitcool.com/node/44943 |
| 23:34.23 | haste | I don't :( |
| 23:34.47 | Shirik | locale outputs `LANG=` (along with a bunch of other stuff) |
| 23:34.58 | Arrowmaster | then your system is seriously FUCKED UP |
| 23:35.04 | Shirik | lol |
| 23:35.08 | haste | none are set Shirik :p ? |
| 23:35.14 | Shirik | no the others are set |
| 23:35.17 | Shirik | mostly to POSIX |
| 23:35.18 | Arrowmaster | reformat it and start from scratch |
| 23:35.18 | haste | his system isn't fucked up |
| 23:35.22 | haste | his locale definitions are |
| 23:35.41 | Fisker | don't worry though haste |
| 23:35.43 | haste | Time in queue: 21min |
| 23:35.47 | haste | average wait time: 11 |
| 23:35.48 | Fisker | in a few minutes 5000 level 80's will come |
| 23:35.49 | haste | wat |
| 23:36.02 | Shirik | haste: Arrowmaster http://pastey.net/136270 |
| 23:36.14 | haste | Shirik: locale -a |
| 23:36.15 | Fisker | i'm probably the most notorious player on the server :P |
| 23:36.28 | Fisker | i was passing through STV and i killed a level 40 or so |
| 23:36.37 | Shirik | ok that outputs more than I can fit on my screen |
| 23:36.44 | Fisker | i killed him again because he was so close to the graveyard |
| 23:36.47 | DWSR | Shirik: More than your buffer? |
| 23:36.50 | Shirik | yes |
| 23:36.54 | DWSR | Failure. |
| 23:36.55 | Arrowmaster | Shirik: rofl, locale -a only has 3 lines for me |
| 23:37.00 | Fisker | by the time i reached the rebel camp there was 5 alliance just arriving to gank me |
| 23:37.01 | haste | Fisker: har har har |
| 23:37.08 | haste | haha |
| 23:37.12 | haste | wonder if I died |
| 23:37.15 | Fisker | dungeon popped? |
| 23:37.16 | DWSR | I set my buffer to like 90k lines. |
| 23:37.17 | Fisker | you didn't |
| 23:37.17 | Shirik | are those all the languages I can use? |
| 23:37.21 | Fisker | couldn't just kill you |
| 23:37.22 | DWSR | no. |
| 23:37.27 | haste | yy |
| 23:37.36 | DWSR | What's your problem, Shirik? |
| 23:37.46 | Arrowmaster | haste: locale -a is kinda messed up for me, it shows "en_US.utf8" instead of "en_US.UTF-8" |
| 23:37.46 | Shirik | wtb UTF-8 support in terminal |
| 23:37.57 | cbreak | you want to buy? You can! :) |
| 23:38.00 | haste | Arrowmaster: en_US.UTF-8 points to en_US.utf8 |
| 23:38.20 | Arrowmaster | Shirik: figure out how to change your system wide default locale to en_US.UTF-8 |
| 23:38.29 | haste | Shirik: yes |
| 23:38.30 | Shirik | where's the control panel |
| 23:38.33 | DWSR | http://www.gentoo.org/doc/en/guide-localization.xml |
| 23:38.41 | DWSR | Shirik: ^ |
| 23:38.49 | Arrowmaster | this isnt something that is EVER on a 'control panel' |
| 23:38.50 | Shirik | or, for that matter, start menu |
| 23:39.28 | haste | Shirik: set /etc/env.d/02locale |
| 23:39.52 | haste | LANG=en_GB.utf8 or whatever you use |
| 23:39.52 | Arrowmaster | gentoo is weird |
| 23:40.00 | haste | isn't on gentoo |
| 23:40.08 | Arrowmaster | neither am i |
| 23:40.22 | Arrowmaster | but looking at that page im like wtf so complex |
| 23:40.35 | haste | didn't check it :p |
| 23:40.44 | Arrowmaster | on debian i just have to do 'dpkg-reconfigure locale' or something i think |
| 23:41.04 | DWSR | Arrowmaster: You can generate locale files on Gentoo as well. |
| 23:41.39 | Shirik | btw Arrowmaster |
| 23:41.42 | Shirik | mpdelbuono@heresiarchguild ~ $ locale -a | wc -l |
| 23:41.44 | Shirik | 718 |
| 23:41.50 | haste | lol |
| 23:42.05 | haste | 2220 ~ % locale -a | wc -l 2010-05-09 01:39:19 haste pts/12 |
| 23:42.09 | haste | 5 |
| 23:42.09 | haste | hi |
| 23:42.49 | Arrowmaster | 3 |
| 23:42.51 | Shirik | hi? |
| 23:43.16 | Bruners | 4! |
| 23:43.24 | Shirik | I win |
| 23:44.06 | haste | I you have too many! |
| 23:44.08 | Pneumatus^ | $ locale -a | wc -l |
| 23:44.08 | Pneumatus^ | 2 |
| 23:44.29 | Arrowmaster | Pneumatus^: thats not a good thing |
| 23:44.42 | Pneumatus^ | C and POSIX |
| 23:44.45 | Jamash | 'locale' is not recognized as an internal or external command, |
| 23:44.47 | Jamash | operable program or batch file. |
| 23:45.21 | haste | wrong OS! |
| 23:45.28 | Jamash | but seriously, 505 |
| 23:45.31 | Fisker | somebody likes me haste |
| 23:45.52 | Torhal | Fisker: You let the hostages go? |
| 23:46.16 | Jamash | Fisker eats hostages for breakfast |
| 23:47.02 | Arrowmaster | ok watching a movie now |
| 23:47.11 | Fisker | no Torhal |
| 23:47.49 | haste | Fisker: ohoh ohoh oh oh ! |
| 23:47.52 | Fisker | wat? |
| 23:48.22 | haste | Fisker: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9wmTv2nqTHo is released! |
| 23:49.11 | Fisker | <PROTECTED> |
| 23:53.49 | *** join/#wowuidev Shirik (~mpdelbuon@WoWUIDev/WoWIStaff/Norganna/StatisticalEngineer/Shirik) |
| 23:53.49 | *** mode/#wowuidev [+o Shirik] by ChanServ |
| 23:54.05 | Shirik | no dice ( |
| 23:54.07 | Shirik | :( |
| 23:54.12 | *** join/#wowuidev Lunessa (~Lunessa@WoWUIDev/Lunessa) |
| 23:54.14 | Shirik | it still comes out as dots |
| 23:54.21 | Cide | and your server is offline |
| 23:54.27 | Lunessa | station |
| 23:54.46 | Fisker | Shirik |
| 23:54.48 | Fisker | i killed you |
| 23:55.19 | Shirik | my server is offline? |
| 23:55.27 | Shirik | oshit |
| 23:55.28 | Shirik | yes |
| 23:55.35 | Shirik | I turned it off before I left :( |
| 23:55.37 | Shirik | without thinking |
| 23:55.40 | Cide | nice |
| 23:55.45 | Cide | fortunately I have the local source |
| 23:56.01 | Shirik | turn it into a hg repo or something |
| 23:56.03 | Cide | now msvc won't let me cancel the undo wtf |
| 23:56.08 | Shirik | lmao |
| 23:56.24 | Shirik | "fuck it deleting all files" |
| 23:56.31 | Cide | yeah right |
| 23:56.55 | Fisker | so any chatter over how awesome i am haste ? |
| 23:56.57 | *** join/#wowuidev krka (krka@bissa.eu) |
| 23:57.03 | Shirik | omg win: http://anti.teamidiot.de/nei/2007/02/irssi_putty_screen_unicode_utf/ |
| 23:57.49 | haste | nah |
| 23:57.54 | haste | then again, I'm not in 1. General :D |
| 23:57.59 | *** join/#wowuidev Shirik (~mpdelbuon@WoWUIDev/WoWIStaff/Norganna/StatisticalEngineer/Shirik) |
| 23:57.59 | *** mode/#wowuidev [+o Shirik] by ChanServ |
| 23:58.06 | haste | nor am I online anymoer! |
| 23:58.36 | Lunessa | taintLog 2 is a performance killer. |
| 23:58.49 | Shirik | ãã¯ãã |
| 23:58.53 | Shirik | yayy |
| 23:58.55 | Cide | yay |
| 23:58.56 | haste | good morning Shirik |
| 23:59.01 | Cide | equally much jibberish for me |
| 23:59.43 | Shirik | ãã¹ãã¯æ¥æ¬èªãããã¾ããï¼ |
| 23:59.58 | Fisker | i was pretty damn awesome haste |
