| 00:02.40 | foxlit | Shirik: pointer coercion warnings? I'm pretty sure GCC whines at you for that. |
| 00:02.49 | Shirik | it's not coercion |
| 00:02.54 | Shirik | it's straight up illegal |
| 00:03.08 | foxlit | A pointer is a pointer. |
| 00:03.11 | *** join/#wowuidev theorb (n=theorb@91.84.53.6) |
| 00:03.16 | *** join/#wowuidev Bruners (i=lasseb@colargol.tihlde.org) |
| 00:03.29 | Shirik | you cannot implicitly cast a void* to a T* for any T != void, in C++ |
| 00:06.14 | Corrodias2 | i think that's right. you can do it explicitly as much as you can, and i have done so a couple of times. |
| 00:06.20 | Corrodias2 | *as much as you want |
| 00:08.49 | Shirik | I know it's right :) |
| 00:08.54 | Shirik | I wasn't complaining about the error |
| 00:08.58 | Shirik | I was complaining about how it's legal in C |
| 00:10.04 | cbreak | C's probably the lowest high level language |
| 00:10.07 | foxlit | And GCC doesn't whine. |
| 00:10.12 | foxlit | So yeah, carry on. |
| 00:11.05 | ScytheBlade1 | The droid is quite nice, I have decided |
| 00:11.31 | foxlit | I'm now convinced DA:O is an elaborate blood-stain-on-armor simulator |
| 00:11.48 | Corrodias2 | the rest of the game is just secondary |
| 00:11.53 | Dagmar | Too right |
| 00:12.14 | Dagmar | I'm sure one of the first hacks we'll see is something to turn down the blood spatter a bit |
| 00:12.30 | Dagmar | It's disturbingly consistent |
| 00:12.30 | Corrodias | i think there -are- options to reduce the effect... |
| 00:12.39 | Dagmar | There's either none, or OMGLOTS |
| 00:12.49 | Corrodias | ah |
| 00:13.16 | Dagmar | It's also so evenly distributed it looks like they were doing something gratuitously bloody to get themselves to evenly covered |
| 00:14.09 | *** join/#wowuidev Aqua (n=Aquavett@74-137-182-78.dhcp.insightbb.com) |
| 00:15.11 | Dagmar | Corrodias: It's also damned weird to be doing "romance" dialog with an NPC who looks like she's been in a massive ketchup fight |
| 00:16.08 | Corrodias | hmm. maybe there'll be a mod to make it white instead, then. :3 |
| 00:20.51 | Dagmar | eeeuuww |
| 00:22.12 | Dagmar | Even for the japanese market that would be overkill |
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| 00:27.47 | Thunder_Child | lua>1358*2 |
| 00:27.47 | lua_bot | Thunder_Child: 2716 |
| 00:27.51 | Thunder_Child | hmm... |
| 00:28.17 | Thunder_Child | if i have 1358 str as a pally and i get 2696 ap from that, what am i missing |
| 00:30.18 | Dagmar | Sex. |
| 00:31.25 | Thunder_Child | besides that |
| 00:31.48 | Thunder_Child | whay am i short 20 ap? |
| 00:33.40 | Dagmar | A gem someplace maybe |
| 00:33.48 | Dagmar | ..or perhaps the GMs stole it |
| 00:34.10 | Lopeppeppy | nom nom nom. |
| 00:38.18 | Thunder_Child | Dagmar, that makes no sense |
| 00:38.49 | *** join/#wowuidev Riffage (n=nnscript@78-86-205-138.zone2.bethere.co.uk) |
| 00:44.26 | Shirik | pets Lopeppeppy |
| 00:44.39 | Lopeppeppy | Hi hi. Cookies done yet? |
| 00:45.16 | Shirik | I burned them :( |
| 00:45.27 | Lopeppeppy | Oh no! |
| 00:45.30 | Thunder_Child | a likely excuse |
| 00:45.34 | Lopeppeppy | You have no luck with electricity in that apartment. |
| 00:47.51 | ccox | Lope - I think it's more a problem of "geek attempting to cook" |
| 00:48.04 | ccox | Lopeppeppy: of course, it could be worse if he was cooking with gas |
| 00:48.59 | Lopeppeppy | Shirik can read a recipe, I would hope. |
| 00:49.45 | ccox | "read" or "follow"? |
| 00:50.29 | Dagmar | wagnerrp: Hopefully no one will get pissed that I created an account there just to cite explicitly WHY one doesn't translate names |
| 00:50.35 | Dagmar | @#$@ wrong chan |
| 00:51.26 | Antiarc | Yay for new internets. |
| 00:51.27 | Antiarc | http://imgur.com/pUnQK.png |
| 00:51.28 | A-KO | just an FYI |
| 00:51.31 | Antiarc | Is v. nice. :D |
| 00:51.33 | Thunder_Child | ccox, excuse me, some geeks can cook just fine |
| 00:51.33 | A-KO | Super Mario Brothers Wii is awesome |
| 00:51.45 | Shirik | Lopeppeppy: You should know this |
| 00:51.48 | Shirik | guys never read instructions |
| 00:51.49 | ccox | Thunder_Child: yes, but we're the exception, not the rule |
| 00:52.02 | Shirik | and for the record |
| 00:52.04 | Shirik | my cooking is fine |
| 00:52.05 | Shirik | tyvm |
| 00:52.18 | Thunder_Child | ccox, thats sad |
| 00:52.31 | Shirik | chicken and shrimp teriyaki rawr |
| 00:52.43 | Lopeppeppy | He looked competent to me... but cookies are hard, I admit |
| 00:52.48 | Shirik | or my specialty, seasoned chicken over fettucine alfredo |
| 00:52.50 | Dagmar | Antiarc: I like how Comcast has that stuff capped at a T1 speed |
| 00:52.51 | Thunder_Child | ...not really |
| 00:53.34 | Thunder_Child | cooking != baking btw |
| 00:53.49 | Lopeppeppy | I make a wonderful alfredo sauce, Shirik, although it's deadly dangerous bad for you. |
| 00:53.55 | Shirik | that's ok |
| 00:54.59 | Lopeppeppy | :) |
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| 00:56.15 | Arrowmaster | haha 32/6 behold the power of camping a sniper nest with a shotgun |
| 00:59.52 | *** join/#wowuidev Riffage (n=nnscript@78-86-205-138.zone2.bethere.co.uk) |
| 01:00.26 | *** join/#wowuidev Tuller (n=Tuller@pool-72-84-246-12.rcmdva.fios.verizon.net) |
| 01:01.54 | tem|afk | I don't think a shotgun makes a very good sniper weapon, Arrowmaster |
| 01:02.10 | Arrowmaster | no but its great against the snipers |
| 01:02.13 | Lopeppeppy | Mmm, but so yummy. |
| 01:04.43 | Arrowmaster | and that was just an 8 shot pump shotgun, not the dual double barrels i had been using and shooting so many people in the back of the head with from point blank |
| 01:05.35 | ScytheBlade1 | just finished making lunch for tomorrow |
| 01:05.55 | ScytheBlade1 | shredded, BBQ pork on a hard roll with pepperjack cheese |
| 01:07.50 | Lopeppeppy | Won't the roll get soggy by tomorrow? |
| 01:08.07 | ScytheBlade1 | not really |
| 01:08.14 | ScytheBlade1 | It's in the fridge right now |
| 01:08.23 | ScytheBlade1 | Plus I prepare it cold, microwave it there |
| 01:08.51 | Lopeppeppy | I'd be paranoid, and bring them in separate containers or something. |
| 01:09.00 | Lopeppeppy | But then, I cheat and bring microwave frozenthings. |
| 01:09.25 | ScytheBlade1 | When I say fridge I mean minifridge |
| 01:09.33 | ScytheBlade1 | And when I say minifridge, I mean minifreezer |
| 01:09.45 | ScytheBlade1 | They won't be soggy |
| 01:10.00 | ScytheBlade1 | if anything very very very very slightly frozen |
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| 01:15.04 | *** join/#wowuidev Yssaril (n=Yssaril@99-57-32-25.lightspeed.cicril.sbcglobal.net) |
| 01:20.58 | *** join/#wowuidev Ancu (n=c@ppp41.pm3-5.man-ch.nh.localnet.com) |
| 01:21.19 | Ancu | Is zorba on? |
| 01:21.45 | batrick | http://bash.org/?908184#d |
| 01:22.34 | Ancu | ~seen zorbathut |
| 01:22.39 | purl | zorbathut is currently on #wowuidev (4d 16h 7m 27s) #curseforge (4d 16h 7m 27s). Has said a total of 202 messages. Is idling for 1d 2h 53m 54s, last said: 'ancu, use a text editor that understands unix hardreturns :P'. |
| 01:22.51 | Ancu | Still hasnt been on since then? |
| 01:23.06 | Lopeppeppy | It's the weekend, he must be busy having a Real Life. |
| 01:24.59 | Ancu | Whats that? |
| 01:25.20 | Lopeppeppy | Check with wikipedia. I sure can't tell you. |
| 01:25.39 | Ancu | Lol |
| 01:25.45 | Ancu | Wiki for the win |
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| 01:33.51 | Shirik | ~wiki Real life |
| 01:33.58 | Adys | ~wiki Shirik |
| 01:34.12 | Shirik | ~wiki User:Mpdelbuono |
| 01:34.20 | Shirik | RAWR |
| 01:34.23 | Shirik | infobox spam! |
| 01:34.25 | Adys | ~wiki Adys |
| 01:34.26 | Gryphon | ono i esceared of teh rawr! i need a huggle. |
| 01:34.33 | Adys | :[ |
| 01:34.33 | Shirik | huggles Gryphon |
| 01:34.37 | Gryphon | huggles Shirik |
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| 01:52.36 | Shirik | ow |
| 01:52.38 | Shirik | owwwww |
| 01:52.48 | Shirik | I accidentally just found one of my dad's papers from when he was in school |
| 01:53.01 | Shirik | First sentence of the abstract: |
| 01:53.03 | Shirik | In lymphocytes, the cytoskeletal protein spectrin exhibits two organizational states. Because the plasma membrane lipids of lymphocytes also display two organizational states, it was asked whether there is a relation between the organization of spectrin and of membrane lipids. When mouse thymocytes were stained with merocyanine 540 (MC540), a fluorescent lipophilic probe that binds preferentially to loosely packed |
| 01:54.02 | Lopeppeppy | Bless you. |
| 01:57.11 | Thunder_Child | wow..mega man 9 has an achievement to beat the game 5 times in a single day |
| 01:57.48 | Thunder_Child | Shirik, sadly i could follow that to some degree |
| 01:58.37 | Dagmar | Thunder_Child: Umm... was it re-released or something? |
| 01:58.44 | Dagmar | I didn't think the platform that was on even had an RTC |
| 01:59.05 | Dagmar | Ah... rereleased on the wii |
| 01:59.24 | Thunder_Child | ^^ |
| 01:59.50 | Dagmar | I wonder if it'd notice if you did it five times in um, about thirty minutes |
| 01:59.56 | Lopeppeppy | *snark* |
| 02:00.37 | Thunder_Child | i dunno after the first 2 it might ignore me |
| 02:09.10 | Ancu | does all xml code have to be inside the ui tag? or outside the ui tag |
| 02:16.45 | tem | inside |
| 02:18.36 | Ancu | thanks |
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| 02:30.56 | *** join/#wowuidev Riffage (n=nnscript@78-86-205-138.zone2.bethere.co.uk) |
| 02:31.36 | Ancu | XML is alot like C++ |
| 02:32.07 | amro | Ancu: er... what? |
| 02:32.22 | *** join/#wowuidev Tuller (n=Tuller@pool-72-84-246-12.rcmdva.fios.verizon.net) |
| 02:33.43 | Adys | Can someone explain what kind of reasoning there can be behind such a statement |
| 02:35.32 | Shirik | Adys: This is the same person that was saying earlier that Notepad is universal |
| 02:36.06 | Adys | so,xml is a lot like c++ because they can both be edited in notepad |
| 02:36.09 | Adys | see i agree there |
| 02:36.21 | Adys | wtf does universal mean anyway? |
| 02:36.38 | Shirik | It means it's time for me to get some food |
| 02:36.42 | Shirik | where should I go, mcdonalds? |
| 02:36.51 | Thunder_Child | no |
| 02:36.59 | Adys | wtf are you, american or what? |
| 02:37.05 | Shirik | no shit Adys |
| 02:37.20 | Shirik | Notice the distinct lack of your puny AltGr key |
| 02:37.37 | Adys | my alt gr key means I can insult you in code |
| 02:38.10 | Shirik | my lack of an AltGr key means that I have a keyboard that is actually useful |
| 02:38.51 | Adys | why? |
| 02:39.00 | Adys | its not like you ever use the right alt key |
| 02:39.21 | Adys | i mean |
| 02:39.45 | Adys | you cant possibly defend the fact that you dont have an altgr key |
| 02:39.56 | Shirik | I believe I just did |
| 02:40.17 | Adys | you badly |
| 02:40.18 | Adys | did. |
| 02:40.22 | Shirik | but I did |
| 02:40.30 | Adys | and ffs |
| 02:40.41 | Adys | I was gonna save Monk for when Im in france |
| 02:40.43 | Adys | but I cant wait |
| 02:41.30 | amro | I was going to sleep 2 and a half hours ago |
| 02:41.32 | amro | but I can't wait |
| 02:41.35 | amro | wait that didn't fit |
| 02:42.59 | Shirik | YOU |
| 02:43.00 | Shirik | you |
| 02:43.05 | Shirik | since you're not asleep |
| 02:43.22 | Shirik | there was something I needed to tell you |
| 02:43.23 | Shirik | oh yeah |
| 02:43.45 | Tuller | I had no idea that there was a such thing as altgr |
| 02:44.17 | Shirik | because it's stupid |
| 02:45.03 | Ancu | So post tutorial knowladge, treat xml like html tables, and treat lua like c. |
| 02:45.07 | *** join/#wowuidev netcurse2 (n=hthieblo@dsl092-049-237.sfo4.dsl.speakeasy.net) |
| 02:45.14 | Thunder_Child | Shirik, you fail |
| 02:45.17 | Thunder_Child | at eating dinner |
| 02:45.25 | Shirik | agreed |
| 02:47.02 | Shirik | tackles Seerah |
| 02:47.10 | Seerah | tickles Shirik |
| 02:47.30 | Ancu | tuller: altgr? is that like an alt key that growles at you |
| 02:49.24 | tem | DEFIANCE |
| 02:49.30 | tem | A FLAW OF MORTALITY |
| 02:49.43 | tem | fml, I hate doing ulduar at this point |
| 02:50.17 | Shirik | "at tihs point"? |
| 02:51.58 | Jerub | I'm seeing more 10toc pugs than 10uld pugs on my server at the moment. |
| 02:52.18 | Jerub | in fact, I have to wade through piles of 10toc barkers to find someone wanting something as mundane as a uld or naxxx. |
| 02:56.00 | Thunder_Child | the problem is that you cant go to toc10 from toc5, creating an iritating gap |
| 03:05.17 | Shirik | no |
| 03:05.20 | Shirik | PUGs are just stupid |
| 03:05.22 | Shirik | and won't let you go |
| 03:05.27 | Shirik | not that you can't |
| 03:06.26 | NightHawkTheSane | surprisingly, im in this togc-10 pug thats not total fail |
| 03:06.37 | Shirik | So, I hear that 2012 sucked |
| 03:06.44 | Shirik | Seerah, you saw it didn't you? |
| 03:06.52 | Seerah | no |
| 03:06.58 | Shirik | bah |
| 03:06.59 | Shirik | useless |
| 03:07.07 | Seerah | :( |
| 03:08.22 | *** join/#wowuidev Kraps (n=chatzill@ool-44c20717.dyn.optonline.net) |
| 03:10.11 | Kraps | hay guiz i herd boycotts r gud http://kotaku.com/5403286/what-modern-warfare-2-boycotters-are-playing |
| 03:11.07 | Jerub | Thunder_Child: meh, the gap can be bridged by using EoC and EoT |
| 03:11.16 | *** join/#wowuidev Marein (i=5590e185@gateway/web/freenode/x-nuhcvypwcmhaqffh) |
| 03:11.24 | Marein | Hello :) |
| 03:11.36 | Jerub | Thunder_Child: T8.5 set bonus + T9.0 set bonus + ilvl219 stuff from HToC is enough to do 10toc |
| 03:12.01 | Jerub | 30 days of doing the daily H is enough to get you into 2 piece of T9. |
| 03:12.10 | Jerub | (less if you do ony/voa |
| 03:13.03 | ZorbaTHut | ancu, here now |
| 03:14.15 | Ancu | lol, I gave up laready |
| 03:16.13 | Seerah | hello, Marein |
| 03:16.29 | Marein | :) |
| 03:16.42 | Marein | This is the right place to ask about WoW addons, I understand? |
| 03:16.47 | Seerah | it is |
| 03:16.53 | Seerah | :) |
| 03:17.15 | Marein | Well, I came up with an idea that I want to ask about, though it's probably been asked many times before |
| 03:17.16 | batrick | thought the topic here was "make fun of shirik"? |
| 03:17.28 | ZorbaTHut | btw, if you didn't get my message, everything-on-one-line is because you're using a text editor that doesn't support unix-style returns :P |
| 03:17.30 | Jerub | Can anyone point me to some information about how to use oUF grids? I tried freebgrid last night but i was suck totally unable to understand what buffs i had on who... |
| 03:17.52 | Marein | Zorba: Hey, you make QuestHelper, don't you? |
| 03:18.04 | ZorbaTHut | marein, I do indeed |
| 03:18.17 | Jerub | ZorbaTHut: are you worried about 3.3 making qh obsolete? |
| 03:18.29 | Marein | Awesome, what's the surpise that's being worked on in the background? ;) |
| 03:18.40 | ZorbaTHut | jerub, eh. I still do a lot of stuff they don't, but I'm sort of getting tired of fighting with them |
| 03:19.08 | ZorbaTHut | it's less "worry about making it obsolete" and more "man, why am I providing free interface research to Blizzard" |
| 03:19.23 | ZorbaTHut | marein, achievements. :) |
| 03:19.38 | Marein | May I inquire why 3.3 would make QH obselete? |
| 03:19.47 | Marein | Zorba: Ah, that is awesome :) |
| 03:19.52 | Shirik | Geirryf yells: ALL HAIL Magma Totem VII, CHAMPION OF VALHALAS! |
| 03:20.03 | Jerub | Marein: wow map will now show where to do quests. |
| 03:20.04 | ZorbaTHut | jerub, on top of that it's "goddamn why can they still not get it right", on the PTR it doesn't show half the quests I have :P |
| 03:20.13 | Marein | Jerub: I see |
| 03:20.42 | Marein | Also with ant trails and filters? |
| 03:20.48 | Marein | And whatnot |
| 03:21.00 | ZorbaTHut | no, they're not doing any sort of routing |
| 03:21.07 | ZorbaTHut | just showing locations |
| 03:21.19 | Marein | Alright |
| 03:22.40 | Marein | Well I'd like to take this chance to personally thank you for all your work, Zorba ^^ |
| 03:23.17 | ZorbaTHut | thanks :) |
| 03:23.23 | ZorbaTHut | it's been fun to work on. Good challenge, for a while. |
| 03:23.32 | Jerub | ZorbaTHut: any plans to fix up the argent tournament quests btw? |
| 03:23.45 | ZorbaTHut | what's the problem you're running into with them? |
| 03:24.03 | ZorbaTHut | are you talking about the Valiant quests that have sort of a mid-point that QH doesn't understand? |
| 03:24.42 | Seerah | Marein: did you have an idea you wanted to ask about? |
| 03:24.52 | Jerub | ZorbaTHut: uh, the weapon one specifically (getting hyacinths, burning brand) |
| 03:25.01 | ZorbaTHut | yeah, I'd like to fix those but it's a matter of time |
| 03:25.04 | ZorbaTHut | I only have so much of it :P |
| 03:25.13 | Jerub | ZorbaTHut: but also the one where you need 25 valiant thingies would be good to sort out too. |
| 03:26.01 | Marein | Seerah: Ah yeah. I know nothing about WoW addon programing (and not much about programming in general), but I just want to know if something is possible to see if it's useful to spend time on investigating |
| 03:27.58 | Jerub | dammit. i was going to finally submit my QH data, and it turns out my copmuter at home is suspended. |
| 03:28.01 | Marein | Namely, I frequent a chat room called Cyan Chat (very old room run by Cyan Worlds, creators of the Myst series) and would like to know if it's possible to log onto that chat from within WoW and display messages to and from it in the chat window |
| 03:28.19 | Shirik | no, sorry |
| 03:28.32 | Shirik | no communication in and out of WoW, period |
| 03:28.48 | Shirik | what's in WoW stays in WoW. What's outside of wow stays out. |
| 03:29.05 | Marein | Mweh, that's a shame |
| 03:29.05 | Jerub | ZorbaTHut: would you be upset if I set up a cronjob to submit QH data, and if I were to do that, pick one of 'Daily' 'Weekly' or 'Monthly'. |
| 03:29.28 | ZorbaTHut | jerub, weekly, and that would be quite acceptable :) |
| 03:29.45 | Marein | Oh well. Guess my ventures into the world of WoW addons will have to wait until I come up with another idea ;) |
| 03:30.04 | ZorbaTHut | Thanks :) |
| 03:30.10 | Jerub | ZorbaTHut: also, does it need to be transmitted uncompressed for your automated script? |
| 03:30.22 | ZorbaTHut | nah, you can attach it as a .zip, .rar, or .7z |
| 03:30.27 | ZorbaTHut | maybe one or two others |
| 03:30.29 | Jerub | I was thinking .gz |
| 03:30.34 | ZorbaTHut | I think I support that too |
| 03:30.35 | ZorbaTHut | lemme check |
| 03:31.00 | ZorbaTHut | yep, gz's fine |
| 03:31.54 | Jerub | sweet |
| 03:31.57 | Jerub | i'll set something up |
| 03:33.46 | Thunder_Child | well it is possible Shirik, just a serious PITA, and legal |
| 03:34.06 | Jerub | Thunder_Child: you mean that other thing, right? |
| 03:34.40 | Thunder_Child | Jerub, well i only know of one legal way |
| 03:34.44 | Thunder_Child | so sure |
| 03:35.07 | Thunder_Child | though out only, not in and out |
| 03:35.46 | Shirik | it is theoretically possible to do inbound data |
| 03:36.00 | Thunder_Child | that doeant break any rules? |
| 03:36.01 | Shirik | it would be practically infeasible though |
| 03:36.06 | Shirik | yup |
| 03:36.21 | Shirik | You would have a severe realtime requirement on it though |
| 03:43.33 | Thunder_Child | Shirik, have you eaten yet? |
| 03:43.39 | Shirik | yes... |
| 03:43.54 | Thunder_Child | just checkign |
| 03:43.59 | Thunder_Child | ing* |
| 03:44.44 | Shirik | btw DWSR, remember that old guild I was talking about? |
| 03:44.53 | Shirik | they just downed both beasts and jarraxus |
| 03:45.05 | Shirik | so maybe they're not that far behind |
| 03:45.46 | Marein | Wait, so there's a loophole in the "what is in WoW stays in WoW" rule? |
| 03:45.51 | Shirik | not really |
| 03:46.00 | Shirik | not for your purposes at least |
| 03:46.14 | Dagmar | Let me know when you figure out how to get belfs out |
| 03:46.29 | Shirik | >< |
| 03:46.50 | Marein | Hm alright |
| 03:46.59 | Shirik | Marein, every time the UI is reloaded, there is a window through which one pulse of information can be sent out, and one pulse can potentially be sent in |
| 03:47.20 | Marein | So you would have to continuously reload the UI? |
| 03:47.34 | Thunder_Child | Shirik, yes there is |
| 03:47.38 | Thunder_Child | thats what i was saying |
| 03:47.38 | Marein | Is that like a resetting the AI? |
| 03:47.43 | Thunder_Child | it's just a pita |
| 03:47.48 | Marein | That kind of reloading? |
| 03:47.54 | Shirik | no |
| 03:47.56 | Marein | Oh |
| 03:47.59 | Shirik | it's like logging out and in again |
| 03:48.04 | Shirik | not the same, but similar |
| 03:48.04 | Marein | Aha |
| 03:48.13 | Dagmar | oH come on |
| 03:48.22 | Thunder_Child | use an overlay to parse a particular part of the screen and you win |
| 03:48.26 | Marein | Hm |
| 03:48.33 | Dagmar | You act like you've never thought of having your own personal belf bitch to do your laundry |
| 03:48.34 | Thunder_Child | like ocr |
| 03:48.42 | Shirik | I don't think that would be considered "legal" Thunder_Child |
| 03:48.49 | Thunder_Child | overlays are legal |
| 03:48.51 | Shirik | sure |
| 03:48.56 | Shirik | doesn't mean parsing it is |
| 03:49.05 | Thunder_Child | what do you think a screencap is |
| 03:49.07 | Thunder_Child | or a vid |
| 03:49.16 | Shirik | and putting an overlay on wow isn't exactly "giving wow information" |
| 03:49.21 | ZorbaTHut | not being screenscraped in realtime, for one thing :P |
| 03:49.22 | Thunder_Child | no, i mean pulling out |
| 03:49.32 | Thunder_Child | he said post chat into irc didnt he? |
| 03:49.59 | ZorbaTHut | the line between "allowed" and "disallowed" isn't a technical one, it's a descriptive one. Yes, it's *possible*, but it may or may not be *permitted*. |
| 03:50.14 | Shirik | I don't believe screenshots are available immediately, are they? |
| 03:50.15 | Jerub | there ar ethings that are specificaly verbooten |
| 03:50.15 | Marein | Thunder: The chat I mean is not IRC |
| 03:50.29 | Shirik | wasn't there a vulnerability where someone was using a "double screenshot" to signal something to an external application? |
| 03:50.32 | Jerub | like the 'do not allow horde to talk with alliance in any meaningful way beyond /spit' |
| 03:51.03 | Thunder_Child | well if you stream a fraps vid live isnt not much different |
| 03:51.17 | Thunder_Child | or use the gaming im client |
| 03:51.23 | Thunder_Child | forgot what it was called |
| 03:51.31 | Marein | Xfire? |
| 03:51.35 | Thunder_Child | ya, thanks |
| 03:51.49 | Marein | :) |
| 03:53.40 | Thunder_Child | oh..now i get what you were saying, you want an ingame irc client. |
| 03:53.49 | Thunder_Child | hmm..best bet is to get an overlay irc |
| 03:54.11 | Thunder_Child | that way you can have one screen and do both |
| 03:54.11 | Marein | No, not IRC |
| 03:54.11 | Jerub | I use dual head. |
| 03:54.12 | Jerub | wow on one head. im+irc on the other. |
| 03:54.14 | Jerub | (and wowhead of course) |
| 03:54.21 | ZorbaTHut | I still kinda wish they'd give us some kind of basic HTTP access from inside the client, with proper security built around it, but they never ever will :P |
| 03:54.24 | Marein | But IRC or not it's probably the same principle |
| 03:54.25 | Thunder_Child | well irc/chat room |
| 03:54.26 | ZorbaTHut | it would be so incredibly convenient |
| 03:54.30 | Thunder_Child | same enough |
| 03:54.37 | Jerub | ZorbaTHut: yeah, SL has that, it's nice. |
| 03:54.48 | ZorbaTHut | Eve Online has something of the sort also, though no UI mods |
| 03:55.00 | Jerub | Eve has a web browser ;) |
| 03:55.01 | Thunder_Child | Marein, is it a web interface? |
| 03:55.04 | ZorbaTHut | people used it to build some great ingame apps and utilities |
| 03:55.07 | ZorbaTHut | yes, albeit a crappy one ;) |
| 03:55.27 | Marein | There are many clients for it including a java web interface |
| 03:56.00 | Thunder_Child | or you can do something like dashboard |
| 03:56.03 | Thunder_Child | possibly |
| 03:56.36 | Marein | What do you mean? |
| 03:56.49 | Marein | Zorba: Yes quite :) |
| 03:57.32 | Marein | I use a client called Magenta Chat myself, a seperate program |
| 04:00.31 | Thunder_Child | Marein, if you can find an app do do what you want here http://widgets.yahoo.com/ you could use that as a go around |
| 04:01.13 | *** join/#wowuidev Antiarc (n=Antiarc@70.190.192.186) |
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| 04:02.58 | Marein | Thunder: So the idea of that would be to have a chat widget that displays on top of WoW? |
| 04:03.15 | Thunder_Child | Marein, only when you hit a key to bring it up, yes |
| 04:04.10 | Thunder_Child | it would be cool if one of them could do a semi-transparent clickthrough mode so you could see faint outlines but still do something else |
| 04:04.30 | Thunder_Child | but that might be more trouble than it's worth |
| 04:05.05 | Marein | Heh |
| 04:05.25 | *** join/#wowuidev Funkeh` (n=funk@82.111.118.25) |
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| 04:27.19 | Marein | I just had a great idea |
| 04:27.33 | Marein | I will do a client for that chat of mine in MEL (Maya Embedded Language) |
| 04:27.44 | Marein | That way I can talk to the chat while working in Maya! |
| 04:28.03 | Marein | I'd have it to reports of my actions and from time to time statistics on the vertex count and such |
| 04:30.23 | amro | can't you tab out to the chat? |
| 04:31.11 | Marein | Yeah, I was joking :) |
| 04:35.16 | *** join/#wowuidev Cloudwolf (n=chatzill@71.227.249.44) |
| 04:35.26 | ZorbaTHut | and now I have seven separate running computers in my apartment |
| 04:35.47 | Cloudwolf | Well i just found out i forgot how to manualy seperate a string... |
| 04:36.06 | ZorbaTHut | I usually go with :match(), myself |
| 04:36.14 | ZorbaTHut | sometimes :gmatch() |
| 04:36.32 | Thunder_Child | ZorbaTHut, that reminds me of the bash quote of someone saying they lost their comp in their house. it still responds to pings but they just cant find it. |
| 04:36.51 | ZorbaTHut | I have had to spend a minute or two digging a computer out of a pile of crud before |
| 04:37.10 | ZorbaTHut | but I do know where they all are :P |
| 04:37.16 | Marein | Thunder: Heh, I know that quote ^^ |
| 04:37.17 | Thunder_Child | for now |
| 04:37.34 | ZorbaTHut | meh, all of them but one are on, under, or to the side of my desk |
| 04:37.36 | ZorbaTHut | that one is in a closet |
| 04:39.19 | Adys | question to the experts |
| 04:39.42 | Adys | what should be fired before the other; onClick or onMouseUp? |
| 04:44.03 | Marein | Another addon that should be made is one that remembers your pet abilities' autoshoot setting across play sessions |
| 04:44.56 | Dagmar | Pets have auto-shoot? |
| 04:45.42 | Marein | Well I don't know what it's called officially, but you can set them to use certain abilities when they feel like it (like growl) |
| 04:46.16 | Adys | autocast |
| 04:46.22 | Marein | That's it |
| 04:46.29 | Marein | But there's also prowl, and I don't really want it to use that ever |
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| 04:46.54 | Marein | So I always turn it off autocast, but the next session it's always on again |
| 04:47.27 | ZorbaTHut | funny, my warlock keeps his pet settings |
| 04:47.33 | Marein | hm |
| 04:47.40 | Marein | My hunter doesn't |
| 04:47.55 | Dagmar | Put them on your pet bar. |
| 04:48.02 | Dagmar | The client stores and sets them |
| 04:48.33 | Marein | I just checked and it stores other ones but not prowl |
| 04:48.39 | Dagmar | if they're not on your pet bar, then yes, they definitely will flip themselves off and on every time your pet instantates |
| 04:48.47 | Thunder_Child | speaking of remembering, it ould be nice if grid rememberd positions per char |
| 04:49.24 | Marein | Dag: It remembered that I had Dash off though |
| 04:49.27 | Dagmar | By the way, you can live without /petpassive being on there. ;) |
| 04:49.44 | Dagmar | Marein: It didn't "remember". YOu got lucky. |
| 04:50.06 | Marein | Okay? |
| 04:50.21 | Dagmar | Stuff you put in the pet bar will stay, stuff you didn't just kinda seems to pick from an improperly initialized pointer or some stuf |
| 04:50.34 | Thunder_Child | ~wb Cairenn |
| 04:50.48 | Thunder_Child | .... |
| 04:50.48 | Thunder_Child | ~~~~~ |
| 04:50.49 | purl | grrrr |
| 04:50.49 | Cairenn | hi Thunder_Child |
| 04:51.05 | Marein | Ah |
| 04:51.10 | Dagmar | I've had wayyyy too many times where I've had to practically grow extra fingers to shoot fast enough to compensate for the pet abilities being set to god knows what on the first pull |
| 04:51.27 | Marein | Heh |
| 04:51.53 | Marein | Well that would be a good addon, that checks on logon/pet summon if they are set as the user prefers |
| 04:52.00 | Dagmar | With a couple of different action bar addons you can yank even the protected buttons, so I did. |
| 04:52.03 | Dagmar | Problem ended. |
| 04:52.36 | Marein | Ah yeah I wanted to download an extended pet bar |
| 04:53.03 | Marein | Also another one that would be cool; one where you can set the percentage of health at which the pet uses Lick Your Wounds |
| 04:53.12 | Dagmar | You can fake one with Maul's thing pretty easily... er Macaroon |
| 04:53.59 | Dagmar | It just takes some slightly fancy conditional macros to activate 'em |
| 04:54.06 | Marein | Heh |
| 04:54.07 | Dagmar | Stuff like [pet:gorilla] and so on |
| 04:54.22 | Dagmar | I haven't redone them since the last time I had something nuke them all |
| 04:55.17 | Cloudwolf | why isn't this coming to me...it should be easier than im thinking it is... |
| 04:57.15 | Dagmar | Merein: I'm pretty sure the lick your wounds thing you mention would be considered verboten |
| 04:57.22 | Dagmar | Just set up a Power Aura to remind you |
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| 05:01.46 | Cloudwolf | hmm must figure out how to seperate a string via spaces... |
| 05:01.57 | Marein | Dagmar: Really? |
| 05:02.12 | Dagmar | Pretty sure. |
| 05:02.15 | *** join/#wowuidev Ancu1 (n=c@ppp10.pm3-16.man-ch.nh.localnet.com) |
| 05:02.27 | Dagmar | They've been fairly clear about not wanting people automating client behaviour |
| 05:02.42 | Marein | Hm yeah |
| 05:02.56 | Dagmar | Triggering a pet heal when the pet gets low without user intervention would be small-scale botting |
| 05:03.43 | Dagmar | ...and kinda sad. |
| 05:03.46 | Dagmar | Mana is cheap |
| 05:03.56 | Dagmar | I just hit it every 15 second or ignore it entirely. ;) |
| 05:04.13 | Shirik | can you actually do that? |
| 05:04.16 | Shirik | shouldn't be able to |
| 05:04.18 | ZorbaTHut | someday I really need to try a hunter, they sound kind of like fun |
| 05:04.23 | Shirik | they aren't |
| 05:04.27 | Shirik | at least they weren't 4 years ago :P |
| 05:04.27 | kd3 | lua> strsplit(' ',"This is a string") |
| 05:04.28 | lua_bot | kd3: This, is, a, string |
| 05:04.30 | Dagmar | You shouldn't, but there's probably still a way to do it |
| 05:04.34 | kd3 | Cloudwolf, ^ |
| 05:04.49 | Dagmar | ZorbaTHut: There's only one thing you need to ask yourself... "Do I like hitting people when they can't hit back?" |
| 05:04.54 | Cloudwolf | it doesn't return a table does it? |
| 05:05.05 | Dagmar | Is the answer is "yes" then it's either a hunter a rogue or a paladin. ;) |
| 05:05.22 | ZorbaTHut | well, right now I have a prot warrior I stun people with, a rogue, and a warlock with lots of fun fears and dots |
| 05:05.24 | ZorbaTHut | so . . . yes :D |
| 05:05.31 | Dagmar | lol |
| 05:05.45 | kd3 | lua> a, b, c, d = strsplit(' ',"This is a string"); echo d |
| 05:05.45 | lua_bot | kd3: luabot:1: '=' expected near 'd' |
| 05:05.53 | kd3 | er |
| 05:06.10 | ZorbaTHut | man if I could buy an heirloom item that increased the speed of regenerating rested time, I would so buy it |
| 05:06.40 | kd3 | if you want a table, just create one |
| 05:06.56 | Cloudwolf | and what if the number of arguments given is dynamic? |
| 05:06.57 | kd3 | lua> t={strsplit(' ',"This is a string")} |
| 05:06.57 | lua_bot | kd3: No output |
| 05:09.13 | Cloudwolf | well i got that to work |
| 05:09.30 | Cloudwolf | now i gota figure out why i can't update the color right when i show the frame |
| 05:10.53 | Marein | Dagmar: I didn't mean Heal Peat, I meant Lick Your Wounds :) |
| 05:11.09 | Dagmar | It makes a difference? |
| 05:11.09 | Marein | The one that your pet activates by itself when its health becomes under a certain level |
| 05:11.29 | tem | these new bullshit flash adds that make a video pop up when you roll over them are intollerable |
| 05:12.01 | Cloudwolf | would any one know why |
| 05:12.06 | Cloudwolf | _G["NoteToteNoteBG"]:CreateTexture():SetTexture(ntnotes.prefs.bgcolr,ntnotes.prefs.bgcolg,ntnotes.prefs.bgcolb) |
| 05:12.08 | Marein | Dagmar: Yes |
| 05:12.11 | Cloudwolf | woudln't set hte color right away? |
| 05:12.50 | Dagmar | Wait, you want pet abilities that _work_? |
| 05:12.50 | Dagmar | lol |
| 05:12.57 | Marein | : D |
| 05:12.57 | tem | _G["StringLiteral"] is pointless |
| 05:13.13 | Dagmar | There's a reason our pet abilities have been flipping around on their own for what, two years now... |
| 05:13.18 | Dagmar | Pain is an integral part of the process |
| 05:13.26 | Dagmar | You must maintain total situation awareness. :) |
| 05:13.34 | Marein | Heh :P |
| 05:13.47 | Cloudwolf | k tem i can fix that eventualy |
| 05:13.51 | Cloudwolf | still doens't tlel me why it doens't work |
| 05:13.53 | Dagmar | I didnt' even know that one was supposed to trigger by itself |
| 05:14.24 | tem | Cloudwolf, for the texture to be visible, it needs a size and anchor |
| 05:14.26 | Dagmar | I never run into situations where it would matter. |
| 05:14.48 | Dagmar | Either pet heal's been keeping ahead of the periodic damage, I have an actual healer watching the pet, or the pet is dead. |
| 05:15.15 | *** join/#wowuidev TecnoBrat (n=tecnobra@tecnobrat.com) |
| 05:15.27 | Cloudwolf | so i can't update a previosuly made texture then? |
| 05:15.42 | Cloudwolf | or do i have to update the anchor every time? |
| 05:15.44 | Dagmar | Seems like my cat and wolf are either taking busloads of damage or they're fine with no in-between |
| 05:16.41 | Shirik | hi Cairenn |
| 05:16.46 | Cairenn | hi Shirik |
| 05:17.06 | Jerub | Dagmar: pets don't get healing. |
| 05:17.36 | Jerub | i've never even had a hunter mention they'd like it. |
| 05:17.42 | Jerub | do pets do much? really? |
| 05:18.33 | Marein | My pet does half the damage I do? |
| 05:18.48 | Marein | Either that means my pet does a lot of damage or I do not a lot of damage |
| 05:18.50 | Marein | You decide |
| 05:19.18 | Dagmar | Jerub: When my gorilla is tanking it damn well better get heals or the run won't get very far |
| 05:19.40 | Dagmar | Bm hunter pets do much more damage than SV or MM |
| 05:20.02 | Dagmar | It's much closer to a 50/50 split |
| 05:20.21 | Jerub | i see. |
| 05:20.26 | Dagmar | Part of the reason attack power is your new god if you spec BM |
| 05:20.30 | Jerub | so i should probably figure out how to treat pets like peoples. |
| 05:20.49 | Marein | Haha |
| 05:20.57 | Dagmar | Well, most BMs can keep their pets alive on their own if they're not four manning someplace with their pet as a tank |
| 05:20.59 | Cloudwolf | ok this is annoying |
| 05:21.23 | Cloudwolf | why do i have to reload my ui every time i change a color value for it to take effect |
| 05:21.47 | Jerub | clearly you need adys's laptop |
| 05:21.53 | Jerub | an SSD would make that much faster. |
| 05:21.59 | Dagmar | heh |
| 05:22.08 | Cloudwolf | Apparnelty calling the frames Global name and doing :CreateTexture():SetTexture(info i want) setting the alpha and setting all poitns every time it doens't change... |
| 05:23.59 | Cloudwolf | hmm i wonder how xperl does it |
| 05:25.00 | Cloudwolf | or not i don't have the time to weed through all that code... |
| 05:25.12 | Marein | Well, I'm going to go to sleep |
| 05:25.24 | Marein | Thanks for the answers to my questions :) |
| 05:25.34 | Marein | Bye all |
| 05:25.35 | Adys | hi Shirik |
| 05:25.50 | Cloudwolf | Can any one explain to me how i would update the color (texture) of a frame with out needing to reload my ui |
| 05:27.26 | Thunder_Child | ~logs |
| 05:27.27 | purl | All conversations are logged to http://ibot.rikers.org/channel, where "channel" is replaced by the URL-encoded channel name, such as %23freenode for #freenode. Lines starting with spaces are not logged. |
| 05:29.52 | Cloudwolf | Would any one?... |
| 05:30.43 | Seerah | Cloudwolf: what exactly are you trying to do, and how is it not working? |
| 05:30.57 | Cloudwolf | I want to update the color of a frame |
| 05:31.03 | Cloudwolf | the only way it changes its color is if i do a reload ui |
| 05:31.18 | Seerah | what frame and how (hence the "exactly" ;) ) |
| 05:31.20 | Cloudwolf | I'm not sure how to update the color with out needing a reloa dui |
| 05:31.33 | Cloudwolf | A frame i created |
| 05:31.48 | Cloudwolf | Its not a default ui frame |
| 05:32.55 | Seerah | I'm waiting for the how :) |
| 05:33.01 | Cloudwolf | ive been trying to use Globalname:CreateTexture():SetTexture(red,green,blue) then globalname:CreateTexture():SetAlpha(alpha) globalname:CreateTexture():SetAllPoints() |
| 05:33.34 | *** join/#wowuidev Torhal (n=callahan@74-132-200-5.dhcp.insightbb.com) |
| 05:33.36 | Seerah | wait, wait... is this exactly how it looks in your code? |
| 05:33.44 | Cloudwolf | no |
| 05:33.54 | Seerah | Globalname:CreateTexture():SetTexture(r,g,b)? |
| 05:33.55 | Cloudwolf | let me go sticky the section of ht code |
| 05:33.58 | Cloudwolf | err pasty |
| 05:34.05 | Seerah | thank you |
| 05:34.31 | Cloudwolf | NoteToteNoteBG:CreateTexture():SetTexture(ntnotes.prefs.bgcolr,ntnotes.prefs.bgcolg,ntnotes.prefs.bgcolb) |
| 05:34.42 | Cloudwolf | where each of those variables has a default and is changed via chat commands |
| 05:35.11 | Seerah | don't do frame:CreateTexture():SetTexture() |
| 05:35.12 | Cloudwolf | http://www.pastey.net/128790 |
| 05:35.38 | Cloudwolf | how would i update the texture on a frame then? |
| 05:35.45 | Seerah | you'd be creating a texture every single time you call CreateTexture() :p |
| 05:36.08 | Seerah | local texture = frame:CreateTexture() frame:SetTexture() |
| 05:36.15 | Seerah | *texture:SetTexture() |
| 05:37.04 | Cloudwolf | i have that earlier in my code |
| 05:37.08 | Seerah | currently, with your code, you're creating 12 different texture objects/widgets (if each arg were called) |
| 05:37.10 | Cloudwolf | that i didn't pastey it |
| 05:37.36 | Cloudwolf | can you give a texture object a global name? |
| 05:37.45 | Seerah | yes |
| 05:37.53 | Cloudwolf | err der i just gota remove local from the code... |
| 05:37.58 | Torhal | ... |
| 05:38.00 | Torhal | Why the hell? |
| 05:39.51 | Cloudwolf | there we go |
| 05:39.53 | Cloudwolf | ty seerah |
| 05:40.00 | Cloudwolf | i shoulda realized that... |
| 05:40.27 | Seerah | yw :) showing code is always more helpful (for us to help you) than just asking generic questions :) |
| 05:41.58 | Dagmar | I think you should keep all your data structure changes secret from main(). |
| 05:42.01 | Dagmar | :) |
| 05:45.41 | *** join/#wowuidev DWSR2 (n=doingwha@24.114.252.244) |
| 05:53.31 | Cloudwolf | If any one knows how to use fontinstances and has enough free time would they be willing to create a wowwiki tutorial on it? |
| 05:55.20 | Cloudwolf | Ty for the help again Seerah and the other people who tried to help. |
| 05:55.25 | Cloudwolf | Good night. |
| 05:56.35 | Fisker | i like trolling retards who go "wah wah i have issues and Blizzard doesn't care so i must post in an unrelated forum where blue posts are guaranteed and QQ" |
| 05:57.18 | Jerub | I cross posted between customer service and bug report forums during brewfest. |
| 05:57.25 | Fisker | :O |
| 05:57.38 | Jerub | don't know why i bothered with hallow's end being worse. :( |
| 05:57.54 | Jerub | I won't get the title until at least next hallow's end, because getting the ttitle required a random drop i didn't get. |
| 05:58.22 | Fisker | aww |
| 05:58.47 | Fisker | Someone here was complaining about battlegroups and said that Blizzard never listens anyways |
| 05:58.53 | Fisker | so i told him to cancel his account |
| 05:58.56 | Fisker | he didn't like that :) |
| 06:00.03 | Jerub | battlegroup QQ? |
| 06:00.08 | Jerub | what? horde always loses or something? |
| 06:00.54 | Fisker | queues |
| 06:01.06 | Fisker | he has to wait 20 minutes for each fight |
| 06:01.11 | Fisker | and the germans are to blame |
| 06:01.22 | Fisker | Because apparently adding realms = bigger queues |
| 06:02.56 | Dagmar | "only" 20 minutes? |
| 06:02.57 | Dagmar | Pfft |
| 06:03.26 | *** join/#wowuidev Amarande (i=amarande@68-191-37-155.dhcp.nwtn.ct.charter.com) |
| 06:03.38 | Amarande | hmm, I think my hunter might be twinked a tad much :D |
| 06:03.41 | Fisker | Anyways i told him that if he really believes that Blizzard doesn't care he should vote with his wallet and cancel his account |
| 06:03.56 | Amarande | let's put it this way: just soloed a 28 elite, at 25 and with interference from a second (normal) mob |
| 06:04.18 | Fisker | He then got pissed off and i reminded him that the reason why it may seem like they're ignoring you was that they first of all don't respond to suggestion, and second of all the battlegroups can't be changed without physically moving the server |
| 06:04.20 | Fisker | hurr hurr |
| 06:04.32 | Amarande | Without being really prepared for elite beat down, either. |
| 06:04.45 | Amarande | More like "cool, a rare" then "OH SHI- it's an elite" |
| 06:06.03 | Amarande | Fisker: what was this guy's reason for asking to change the battlegroups? |
| 06:06.23 | Fisker | The queue |
| 06:06.28 | Amarande | BG or instance? |
| 06:06.52 | *** join/#wowuidev Cairenn (n=Cairenn@MMOI/Administratrix/Cairenn) |
| 06:06.52 | *** mode/#wowuidev [+o Cairenn] by ChanServ |
| 06:07.00 | Amarande | I do have the thought that people on the less well performing servers in each BG might not be happy with the cross-server LFG |
| 06:07.21 | Fisker | bg |
| 06:07.23 | Amarande | (mainly because people who don't meet the *battlegroup's* average performance will probably get votekicked every time ... even if they're doing well for their server) |
| 06:07.27 | Amarande | Heya Cairenn |
| 06:07.53 | Jerub | who the hell is going to votekick based on what server you're from? |
| 06:07.58 | Jerub | i sure hope that doesn't become common place. |
| 06:07.59 | Amarande | Jerub: it will be more like this |
| 06:08.21 | Amarande | there will probably be one or two servers that, for whatever reason, lag significantly behind in progression compared to the rest of the battlegroup |
| 06:08.28 | NightHawkTheSane | Jerub: no one, really, Amarande just takes things waaaaay out of proportion. |
| 06:08.36 | Amarande | someone from one of those servers will get into a random cross-server group |
| 06:08.43 | Jerub | NightHawkTheSane: I thought forum QQ was bad. |
| 06:08.52 | Jerub | i'm more worried about occy |
| 06:08.57 | Amarande | and then they will get votekicked by meter monkeys who find they're not meeting the DPS standard as practised by THEIR server |
| 06:09.03 | NightHawkTheSane | Jerub: Amarande is like forum qq personified |
| 06:09.20 | Amarande | heh Night |
| 06:09.30 | Amarande | I start to wonder if I should get a job in logic flaw analysis |
| 06:09.35 | Amarande | then I can say things like this all the time and get paid |
| 06:09.45 | Amarande | and better, tell people I TOLD YOU SO when they don't listen and it goes wrong :) |
| 06:09.48 | NightHawkTheSane | no, you'd say things like that all the time |
| 06:09.50 | NightHawkTheSane | and get fired |
| 06:09.53 | NightHawkTheSane | because its stupid. |
| 06:10.12 | Amarande | and anyway, I'm in a pretty good mood tonight, anyhow. |
| 06:10.28 | Amarande | soloing an elite three levels higher than you with interference from another mob and having been mostly unprepared for the fight does that to you. :) |
| 06:10.29 | Shirik | wb Cairenn |
| 06:11.20 | Amarande | either that, or sister riven is really wimpy for a 28 elite |
| 06:13.20 | Jerub | before i boought wotlk, i spent 4 weeks at level 70, and ended up with some nice gear. |
| 06:13.30 | Jerub | i was running around doing 5man quests solo. |
| 06:13.38 | Jerub | quite easy when you're wearing wotlk starter gear. |
| 06:14.00 | Amarande | Jerub: this was at level 25, with just a few enchanted pieces of gear, MM spec, spider pet, and some engineering kablooie |
| 06:14.06 | Jerub | now i'm trying to do 3 and 5 man quests at 80 and failing badly. they really are 5 man quests. |
| 06:14.22 | *** join/#wowuidev Zyn- (n=zyn@h243n2-av-a11.ias.bredband.telia.com) |
| 06:14.40 | Amarande | biggest enchants on my kit right now being two swords with +15 agi and a chestpiece with +100 health |
| 06:16.18 | Jerub | +15 is a lot at 25 |
| 06:16.41 | Amarande | yeah, I'm finding that I steamroll even orange mobs, and even orange elites are just a nice challenge |
| 06:16.56 | Amarande | I actually died during that combat, but not till after Sister Riven was dead and looted |
| 06:17.14 | Amarande | didn't have enough HP left to be able to take on the remaining Storm Witch, and Mog was dead |
| 06:17.15 | *** join/#wowuidev Yssaril (n=Yssaril@99-57-32-25.lightspeed.cicril.sbcglobal.net) |
| 06:17.50 | Amarande | still, pretty good considering I didn't even realize I was fighting an elite until I was already in combat heh |
| 06:18.20 | Amarande | I'd mistaken her for the *other* named harpy in stonetalon, which isn't elite |
| 06:20.50 | Amarande | and really didn't expect to live to defeat her, even with the aid of a goblin land mine |
| 06:21.23 | Bruners | is the aggro on anub reset when he goes under? |
| 06:23.41 | *** part/#wowuidev Seerah (n=Ryan@c-76-107-191-65.hsd1.tn.comcast.net) |
| 06:29.48 | NightHawkTheSane | Bruners: i dont think so |
| 06:40.02 | *** join/#wowuidev isman (n=drag@mlr78-3-88-162-68-235.fbx.proxad.net) |
| 06:42.26 | *** join/#wowuidev Tinyboom_ (n=nahh@ti0121a340-dhcp0974.bb.online.no) |
| 06:45.17 | *** join/#wowuidev Tinyboom_ (n=nahh@ti0121a340-dhcp0974.bb.online.no) |
| 06:45.58 | tem | All of Michael J Fox's sodas are flat. Because of Parkinson's |
| 06:46.30 | tem | Michael J Fox's arch enemy is the Etch-A-Sketch. Because of Parkinson's |
| 06:46.35 | tem | giggles |
| 06:47.42 | Shirik | You know what, women suck |
| 06:47.48 | Shirik | they lead you into traps intentionally |
| 06:48.18 | tem | manipulative women? shocking. |
| 06:48.21 | tem | :P |
| 06:49.36 | Jerub | i hate that trap they use when they coerce you into having sex and then don't burden you emotionally afterwards. |
| 06:49.39 | Jerub | wait.... |
| 06:49.40 | *** join/#wowuidev Tinyboom (n=nahh@ti0121a340-dhcp0974.bb.online.no) |
| 06:49.54 | Jerub | . o O ( gnomish druid? ) |
| 06:53.31 | *** join/#wowuidev krka (n=krka@88.80.164.166) |
| 06:53.41 | *** join/#wowuidev Tinyboom_ (n=nahh@ti0121a340-dhcp0974.bb.online.no) |
| 06:54.10 | *** join/#wowuidev Zyn (n=zyn@h243n2-av-a11.ias.bredband.telia.com) |
| 06:54.30 | *** join/#wowuidev BWMerlin (n=chatzill@CPE-58-174-148-250.mjcz1.woo.bigpond.net.au) |
| 06:57.52 | *** join/#wowuidev stolen|school (n=stolenle@193.170.222.163) |
| 06:59.50 | NightHawkTheSane | Shirik: did you JUST realize this? |
| 06:59.57 | Shirik | ok you know what |
| 07:00.02 | Shirik | I live in my fantasy world of computers and code |
| 07:00.06 | Shirik | anything I want I can program, ok |
| 07:00.12 | Shirik | Everything is perfectly logical |
| 07:00.13 | *** join/#wowuidev Yssaril|Away (n=Yssaril@99-57-32-25.lightspeed.cicril.sbcglobal.net) |
| 07:00.23 | Shirik | Programs do not twist my code around to find the most evil interpretation of it that can be found |
| 07:00.44 | Shirik | Enter the woman |
| 07:00.45 | krka | did i miss something fun? |
| 07:00.49 | Shirik | She is the quantum computer, ok |
| 07:00.57 | Shirik | She exists in every state simultaneously |
| 07:00.57 | Thunder_Child | beither do "women" |
| 07:01.02 | Thunder_Child | neither* |
| 07:02.49 | Shirik | and if you try to question what state she's actually in, you get a seemingly-random one |
| 07:02.49 | Shirik | and, per murphy's law, it is also always the worst one |
| 07:03.50 | *** join/#wowuidev Tinyboom (n=nahh@ti0121a340-dhcp0974.bb.online.no) |
| 07:04.32 | Thunder_Child | that thought process is a self fulfilling prophecy |
| 07:04.48 | *** join/#wowuidev Vilkku (n=Vilkku@dsl-tkubrasgw1-ffc7c100-46.dhcp.inet.fi) |
| 07:05.41 | krka | that's the best kind of prophecy |
| 07:07.03 | Thunder_Child | i thought an inverted fork prophecy was the best kind |
| 07:13.21 | *** join/#wowuidev Fisker- (i=503f4262@gateway/web/freenode/x-aekfpdxihgkpfxyy) |
| 07:14.00 | *** join/#wowuidev Twisol (n=solugon@cpe-76-174-158-239.socal.res.rr.com) |
| 07:14.21 | Fisker- | Shirik |
| 07:14.23 | Fisker- | You |
| 07:15.06 | Twisol | Anyone happen to know how to get from a quest's log index to the quest's unique ID (like what's sent in a quest link)? |
| 07:18.06 | *** join/#wowuidev Caleb| (i=caleb@client-136-65.wifi.elte.hu) |
| 07:18.34 | *** join/#wowuidev Trela_ (n=alexia@c-69-136-65-241.hsd1.pa.comcast.net) |
| 07:18.44 | Shirik | Fisker |
| 07:18.45 | Shirik | you |
| 07:18.52 | *** join/#wowuidev Lukian (n=lukian@203.123.90.21) |
| 07:19.28 | Fisker- | no you Shirik |
| 07:20.00 | Twisol | Guess nobody knows, then. I am now a sad Pandaren. |
| 07:20.02 | Twisol | :( |
| 07:20.27 | Dagmar | Yes, but hopefully five bucks went to Make-A-Wish for you |
| 07:20.32 | *** join/#wowuidev Elkano (n=elkano@WoWUIDev/WoWAce/Elkano) |
| 07:20.40 | Dagmar | Like, I would normally utterly ignore something like those two pets, but... |
| 07:20.50 | Dagmar | I can totally get behind half of the money going to Make-A-Wish |
| 07:20.55 | Twisol | Heheh. |
| 07:21.01 | Dagmar | ...so I'll probably get the Pandaren for that reason. |
| 07:21.24 | Dagmar | It's less trouble than figuring out how to send 'em five bucks independently |
| 07:21.38 | Twisol | Hmm. I could probably get a quest link for the log entry and parse out the ID... but that seems a bit much for a simple ID... |
| 07:21.59 | Twisol | Dagmar - and you get a digital pet for your troubles! |
| 07:22.08 | Dagmar | Yeah it works fine for me |
| 07:22.25 | Dagmar | If I actually pull it out and people see it and that induces them to give five bucks to MAW more the better |
| 07:22.30 | Twisol | The 50% thing is supposed to expire after New Year's though, right? |
| 07:22.37 | Dagmar | Yeah afaik |
| 07:22.41 | Twisol | Stinks. |
| 07:22.57 | Dagmar | Still, it's just ten bucks. It's not like I have to plan to budget that |
| 07:23.03 | Dagmar | Steam is a bigger threat to my finances |
| 07:23.15 | Thunder_Child | Twisol, look at an addon that does it and see how it does it |
| 07:23.27 | Dagmar | Them and they're dropping the price of games I've liked to ten bucks or freaking less |
| 07:23.39 | Twisol | Thunder_Child: Easy for you to say, but I'm back to the same effective problem: I need to find someone who does it. |
| 07:24.16 | Thunder_Child | Twisol, i read what you said but i'm not sure i follow |
| 07:24.21 | Twisol | Hence, I figured it would be easier to just ask. (Unless nobody knows, in which case I'll just get its questlink and parse it out) |
| 07:24.56 | Twisol | T_C: You say I should find an addon that does it, but I don't know of any. So it's just another problem for me to solve. |
| 07:25.19 | Thunder_Child | Twisol, QH maybe? |
| 07:25.22 | Twisol | Rather, I don't know where to begin looking |
| 07:25.26 | Twisol | QH? |
| 07:25.31 | Thunder_Child | questhelper |
| 07:25.33 | Twisol | Ah. |
| 07:25.36 | Twisol | I'll give it a look. |
| 07:25.38 | Twisol | Thank you. |
| 07:25.45 | Thunder_Child | welcome, dunno if it will help |
| 07:25.59 | Dagmar | LightHeaded would probably have that info |
| 07:25.59 | Twisol | It's a lead, at least. |
| 07:26.14 | Dagmar | ...and then some. It would be kinda heavyweight for the purpose tho. |
| 07:26.23 | Thunder_Child | i dunno, it pulls from wowhead |
| 07:26.24 | *** join/#wowuidev cncfanatics (n=cncfanat@WoWUIDev/cncfanatics) |
| 07:26.28 | Dagmar | There's surely some way to dump the data structure behind what you're seeing in the quest log |
| 07:26.33 | Thunder_Child | wowhead might do the parsing externally |
| 07:26.35 | Twisol | Hmmm. |
| 07:26.42 | Dagmar | It pulls from WoWhead but *not* in realtime |
| 07:26.45 | Dagmar | It's a big-ass database |
| 07:26.49 | Twisol | Ah, heh |
| 07:27.06 | Twisol | I just want to use the ID to key a table. |
| 07:27.07 | *** join/#wowuidev kd3 (n=kd3@wikia/kaydeethree) |
| 07:27.42 | Twisol | Speaking of - do you know if quest names are guaranteed to be unique among all quests? |
| 07:27.51 | Arrowmaster | they are not |
| 07:27.52 | *** join/#wowuidev Zyn (n=zyn@h243n2-av-a11.ias.bredband.telia.com) |
| 07:27.59 | Twisol | I didn't think so, thanks |
| 07:28.28 | Dagmar | There's numerous chains all with the same name halfway through them |
| 07:28.39 | Twisol | Aah, you're right. |
| 07:28.49 | Twisol | Well. |
| 07:28.58 | Twisol | Nevermind the well. |
| 07:29.21 | Adys | laters peeps, be back from france |
| 07:29.34 | Thunder_Child | but we dont want you back |
| 07:29.36 | Twisol | I'm optimizing my SimpleQuestLevel plugin (adds the quest level to the name in a few places) with a string memoizer, and I want the quest ID to use as a key. |
| 07:29.38 | Twisol | *laughs* |
| 07:30.43 | Twisol | Yep, looks like LH parses the ID from the link. |
| 07:31.00 | Torhal | Twisol: http://www.wowinterface.com/downloads/fileinfo.php?id=8631 |
| 07:31.23 | Twisol | Something like that. |
| 07:31.32 | Dagmar | I know there's a thing like Data::Dumper in perl for lua--just can't remember what it is at the moment |
| 07:31.40 | Twisol | His looks better. Mine's just an ongoing learning process. |
| 07:31.54 | *** part/#wowuidev Trela_ (n=alexia@c-69-136-65-241.hsd1.pa.comcast.net) |
| 07:32.05 | Torhal | Don't re-invent the wheel unless the wheel is square and warped. |
| 07:32.24 | Twisol | It's harder to build custom engines when you don't have a good grasp of the parts. |
| 07:32.25 | Torhal | Pr if you're just that bored. |
| 07:32.33 | Torhal | s/Pr/Or/ |
| 07:32.51 | Twisol | ...I like that bot. |
| 07:33.14 | Twisol | It's not so much about being bored as it is learning the basics, is all. |
| 07:33.46 | Torhal | Well, then, look at his AddOn and see how it differs from yours. |
| 07:34.02 | Twisol | I can already see how it differs from mine, just from the summary. |
| 07:34.22 | Twisol | It has the extra tags (+GDRP*) and also appears in the gossip frame. |
| 07:34.26 | Torhal | But you're interested in programming, so open his code and see how it ticks |
| 07:34.30 | Twisol | *nod* |
| 07:34.32 | Twisol | But, see |
| 07:35.02 | Twisol | I don't want his coding practices to taint my own view of the code. I will -definitely- check his out later, but only after I've sufficiently finished mine to my satisfaction. |
| 07:35.26 | Thunder_Child | ~kiss Twisol |
| 07:35.27 | purl | ACTION forces Twisol to give malikeye a big kiss on the forehead |
| 07:35.34 | Twisol | ? |
| 07:35.44 | Thunder_Child | *shrug* bored |
| 07:35.47 | Twisol | Heh. |
| 07:35.58 | Torhal | ~whalecrit Thunder_Child |
| 07:35.58 | purl | ACTION crits Thunder_Child with a mathematically skilled whale named Isaac for #NaN. Thunder_Child dies |
| 07:35.58 | *** join/#wowuidev Trela_ (n=alexia@c-69-136-65-241.hsd1.pa.comcast.net) |
| 07:36.12 | Thunder_Child | ~whaleparry Torhal |
| 07:36.13 | purl | ACTION uses a slightly less-huge but eminently more agile killer whale named Edwardo to parry Torhal's attacks. |
| 07:36.13 | Trela_ | :O |
| 07:36.35 | Trela_ | ~whaleparry Thunder_Child |
| 07:36.36 | purl | ACTION uses a slightly less-huge but eminently more agile killer whale named Edwardo to parry Thunder_Child's attacks. |
| 07:36.36 | Twisol | I seriously like that bot. |
| 07:36.46 | Thunder_Child | ~whalestab Trela_ |
| 07:36.47 | purl | ACTION stabs Trela_ with a rather narrow and pointy whale named Montgomery |
| 07:36.54 | Trela_ | ;-; |
| 07:37.15 | Torhal | ~botsnack |
| 07:37.16 | purl | Torhal: aw, gee |
| 07:37.47 | Torhal | ~karma |
| 07:37.47 | purl | torhal has neutral karma |
| 07:38.02 | Twisol | >_> |
| 07:38.15 | Trela_ | ~karma |
| 07:38.15 | purl | trela_ has neutral karma |
| 07:38.25 | Trela_ | ++Torhal |
| 07:38.31 | Fisker- | ~kiss Thunder_Child |
| 07:38.31 | purl | ACTION forces Thunder_Child to give malikeye a big kiss on the lips |
| 07:38.43 | Torhal | ++Fisker- |
| 07:38.44 | Fisker- | malikeye is popular today |
| 07:38.51 | Fisker- | you fail Torhal |
| 07:38.54 | Torhal | BWAH! |
| 07:38.56 | Thunder_Child | thats not how you karma people, people |
| 07:39.08 | Trela_ | :O |
| 07:39.09 | Trela_ | HOW?! |
| 07:39.11 | Thunder_Child | .~<name>++ |
| 07:39.13 | Torhal | Thunder_Child: If I'd actually upped his karma, he'd implode |
| 07:39.15 | Thunder_Child | w/o the . |
| 07:39.20 | Thunder_Child | ~karma |
| 07:39.20 | purl | thunder_child has karma of 4 |
| 07:39.22 | Fisker- | ~kiss Thunder_Child |
| 07:39.23 | purl | ACTION forces Thunder_Child to give jaxdahl a big kiss on the hand |
| 07:39.25 | Thunder_Child | or -- |
| 07:39.29 | Fisker- | ~karma Fisker- |
| 07:39.29 | purl | fisker- has karma of 1 |
| 07:39.32 | Fisker- | ~karma Fisker |
| 07:39.32 | purl | fisker has karma of 8 |
| 07:39.37 | Thunder_Child | poor Fisker |
| 07:39.54 | Thunder_Child | ~fisker-- |
| 07:39.55 | Fisker- | i'm the valued community member this channel needs Thunder_Child :( |
| 07:40.12 | Thunder_Child | s/member/troll/ |
| 07:40.18 | Trela_ | ~Torhal++ |
| 07:40.42 | Fisker- | naw Thunder_Child |
| 07:40.44 | Trela_ | ~karma Torhal |
| 07:40.44 | purl | torhal has karma of 1 |
| 07:40.46 | *** join/#wowuidev cncfanatics (n=cncfanat@WoWUIDev/cncfanatics) |
| 07:40.49 | Trela_ | It works! |
| 07:40.49 | Twisol | ~karma |
| 07:40.49 | purl | twisol has neutral karma |
| 07:41.15 | Torhal | you wouldn't ask a giraffe on a date Fisker- |
| 07:41.36 | Fisker- | you wouldn't drugrape a lion |
| 07:42.05 | *** join/#wowuidev BWMerlin_ (n=chatzill@CPE-58-174-148-250.mjcz1.woo.bigpond.net.au) |
| 07:43.15 | Dagmar | Fisker: You sure as hell wouldn't do it to one while he's sober |
| 07:43.19 | Torhal | Fisker-: You should write some SGU episodes. |
| 07:43.28 | Dagmar | ...and the one guy who would do that got killed by a stingray. |
| 07:43.34 | Torhal | ROFL |
| 07:44.03 | Dagmar | I never understood that man's willingness to go find dangerous animals and then poke them with a stick for the camera. |
| 07:44.16 | Fisker- | nice Torhal |
| 07:44.17 | Fisker- | why? |
| 07:44.31 | Dagmar | Personally, I'd expect everyone to be happy that "Hey, this animal here is real dangerous. Admire this footage but don't be stupid and get up close yourself." |
| 07:44.36 | Torhal | Fisker-: SGU needs a thousand-litre milk episode. |
| 07:44.57 | Dagmar | Lord only knows what would be living in that milk |
| 07:45.46 | Fisker- | or how this "milk" was produced Dagmar |
| 07:46.08 | Fisker- | excess semen from needless romance scenes imo |
| 07:46.30 | Dagmar | I was thinking more along the lines of having to milk some caniverous megafauna |
| 07:47.36 | Thunder_Child | Fisker, if milk == semen in your mind....it explains a lot |
| 07:48.40 | Fisker- | if you would notice Thunder_Child |
| 07:48.44 | Fisker- | I said "milk" |
| 07:49.01 | Fisker- | notice how there are 2 "'s around it |
| 07:49.15 | NightHawkTheSane | there's two "'s around YOU |
| 07:49.18 | Dagmar | I'm still with Thunder_Child on that one. |
| 07:49.24 | Fisker- | not if i can stop it NightHawkTheSane |
| 07:58.54 | *** join/#wowuidev Iodine (n=lenvik@23.213.233.220.static.exetel.com.au) |
| 07:59.56 | *** join/#wowuidev xilcoy (n=_xilcoy_@98.197.254.215) |
| 08:00.34 | Fisker- | see NightHawkTheSane |
| 08:00.35 | Fisker- | i stopped it |
| 08:00.55 | Twisol | guess my memoizer isn't really helping memory usage. Away it goes. >_> |
| 08:02.21 | *** join/#wowuidev Repo (n=supybot@repos.curseforge.net) |
| 08:03.20 | Thunder_Child | lies Fisker- |
| 08:03.35 | Fisker- | naw |
| 08:03.37 | Fisker- | ::( |
| 08:03.51 | Fisker- | ooh four-eyes :( |
| 08:04.16 | *** join/#wowuidev Wobin (n=Wobin@203-158-60-123.dyn.iinet.net.au) |
| 08:04.57 | Fisker- | it's Wobin |
| 08:05.05 | Fisker- | he's responsible for all bad things happening in .au |
| 08:05.11 | Wobin | True. |
| 08:05.22 | Wobin | Wobin d'stroyer |
| 08:10.37 | *** join/#wowuidev Repo (n=supybot@repos.curseforge.net) |
| 08:14.17 | Thunder_Child | hmmm...i wonder how the loremaster ahcievments are going to work after cataclysm |
| 08:15.24 | Fisker- | FoS it and make a new one |
| 08:16.49 | *** join/#wowuidev sioraiocht (n=tomh@unaffiliated/sioraiocht) |
| 08:16.50 | Elkano | "I'm missing only one more quest!" *shutdown* *patch* "FUUUUUUUUUU!" |
| 08:16.56 | Elkano | ;) |
| 08:17.52 | Amarande | T_C: I suspect they'll probably either be reset, or become sillily easy for those of us who already had significant progress |
| 08:18.18 | Amarande | by reset, I mean they'd delete all the credits for quests exiting the game |
| 08:18.25 | Amarande | but ... I don't know how likely that is |
| 08:18.32 | Fisker- | of course Elkano |
| 08:18.33 | Fisker- | l2p |
| 08:18.34 | Amarande | "sillily easy for those of us who already had significant progress" is probably more likely. :) |
| 08:18.57 | Fisker- | we had 9 players in our guild need one achievement for glory of the raider |
| 08:18.58 | Amarande | just like Seeker is going to be sillily easy, with all the hundreds of new quests on top of the ones we have credit for that will no longer exist |
| 08:19.05 | Fisker- | and i got it :P |
| 08:19.09 | Fisker- | as the only one |
| 08:19.13 | Fisker- | the day before the patch |
| 08:19.15 | Amarande | Fisker: and then they added more achievements required? |
| 08:21.36 | Fisker- | they removed the mount durr |
| 08:22.09 | Amarande | ah. I'm still foggy on the changes to earlier raid achievements |
| 08:22.14 | Amarande | I heard "The Immortal" title was yanked too? |
| 08:22.28 | Fisker- | though glory of the ulduar raider is insanely easy :P |
| 08:22.31 | Fisker- | not yet |
| 08:22.44 | Fisker- | perhaps should go do it sometime |
| 08:22.50 | Amarande | at least I remember a post saying something about someone spoiling the last possible week to get immortal |
| 08:22.51 | Fisker- | Did a run a few months ago |
| 08:23.20 | Fisker- | and some idiot on kel'thuzad didn't move out of void zones |
| 08:23.20 | Fisker- | only death in the instance |
| 08:23.20 | Fisker- | He probably got flamed to death |
| 08:24.21 | Amarande | was the removed mount a 310 or a 280, by the way? |
| 08:24.39 | Amarande | (I'm assuming it was a proto drake, which means it's only any good if it's a 310 IMO because proto drakes as far as I am concerned are FUGLY) |
| 08:25.04 | *** join/#wowuidev Kalroth (n=kalroth@0x573f1066.cpe.ge-1-1-0-1101.hjnqu1.customer.tele.dk) |
| 08:25.59 | Amarande | I'm fairly disappointed in general with WotLK's mount offerings |
| 08:26.00 | Thunder_Child | less care about how they look and more about their speed |
| 08:26.03 | Fisker- | of course it was 310% |
| 08:26.19 | Fisker- | though i wonder if they even care about the 310% mounts anymore |
| 08:26.32 | Fisker- | You can get it randomly, and through the world events now |
| 08:26.39 | Thunder_Child | well 330% for us pallies |
| 08:26.45 | Fisker- | So they'll probably introduce better mounts |
| 08:26.56 | Thunder_Child | but not faster ones |
| 08:27.06 | Thunder_Child | they already said they didnt even want us this fast |
| 08:27.10 | Amarande | and now that you can do TK with what, 5-7 or so 80s without too much trouble? |
| 08:27.33 | Amarande | what's left for them to do in the way of 'better', besides passenger flyers? |
| 08:28.24 | Thunder_Child | abilites maybe |
| 08:28.28 | Dagmar | Personal catapults. |
| 08:28.32 | Amarande | yeah, combat mounts perhaps :) |
| 08:28.56 | Thunder_Child | that would be awesome for WG |
| 08:29.13 | Amarande | but yes, the wotlk mounts in general are very meh |
| 08:29.41 | Amarande | even the mammoth lost its luster for me when I realized there's so many places it just doesn't fit through |
| 08:29.46 | Amarande | especially since I died due to this. LOL |
| 08:29.50 | Thunder_Child | honestly this is not the game to play if you are worried about looks |
| 08:30.12 | Amarande | T_C: thing is, looks are the main reason to bother to get a wotlk mount, pretty much (well that and achievements) |
| 08:30.17 | Amarande | otherwise, you might as well stick with a BC mount |
| 08:30.36 | Amarande | I've found like one WotLK flying mount that looks decent enough to actually use instead of just using my netherdrakes |
| 08:30.48 | Amarande | that being the bronze drake from HCoS |
| 08:31.03 | Thunder_Child | Amarande, ease of Acquisition |
| 08:31.17 | Thunder_Child | that why you use wrath mounts |
| 08:31.36 | Amarande | except BC mounts still have Wrath's number on that, at least on flyers far as I know |
| 08:32.01 | Amarande | don't wrath flyers generally require either achievements, stupid amounts of gold, or lots of rep grinding AND stupid amounts of gold? |
| 08:32.22 | Amarande | or stupid amounts of luck, in the case of onyxia's mount |
| 08:33.04 | Thunder_Child | not the bronze drake |
| 08:33.29 | Amarande | actually, defeating the bonus HCoS boss is an achievement, so that falls under 'achievements' |
| 08:33.53 | Thunder_Child | you dont get it FROM an achivement |
| 08:34.08 | Amarande | that's still the only one that's reasonably quickly acquired |
| 08:34.47 | Amarande | unless you're doing chain heroics, the netherdrake is probably still the easiest non-starter 280 flyer to get after that |
| 08:36.11 | Amarande | you can also get the netherdrake entirely solo now, zuluhed is not hard at 80 |
| 08:36.40 | Amarande | which was the only part that really ever needed a group :) |
| 08:38.35 | Twisol | Somewhat off-topic, but: I nearly solo'd SM Graveyard on my level 40 mage (who has only 1k health)... The last boss (who has 7000, for comparison) was down to 200 before I finally died. |
| 08:38.35 | Twisol | >_< |
| 08:39.19 | *** join/#wowuidev soufron (n=soufron@LSt-Amand-152-32-15-81.w193-252.abo.wanadoo.fr) |
| 08:39.26 | Amarande | Twisol: as I was mentioning earlier, I managed to solo Sister Riven in Stonetalon on a level 25 hunter (i.e., not only elite, but still orange level) |
| 08:39.35 | Twisol | Oi. |
| 08:39.48 | Twisol | Wait, is that just one NPC, or an instance? |
| 08:39.59 | krka | i solod hogger at 72 |
| 08:40.04 | Amarande | Rare spawn in Charred Vale in Stonetalon |
| 08:40.09 | Twisol | Ah. |
| 08:40.15 | Twisol | I've solo'd tougher elites before. >_> |
| 08:40.23 | industrial | Anyone here use Google Sync with Windows Mobile? It's only syncing one calendar (of 6). |
| 08:40.27 | Twisol | I'm just proud I nearly solo'd a whole instance, hah |
| 08:40.32 | Amarande | I didn't realize she was elite till I was in combat, which I ran Rambo right into because I've been finding orange mobs are totally easy LOL |
| 08:40.34 | krka | maybe you should just compare your epeens directly and save us some time |
| 08:40.50 | Amarande | then I'm like ohshitit'sanelite |
| 08:40.54 | Twisol | Hahah. |
| 08:41.05 | Amarande | I did have to use one of my two remaining Goblin Land Mines, too |
| 08:41.19 | Twisol | Nice. |
| 08:41.38 | industrial | I killed a level 40 mob at 30 |
| 08:41.43 | industrial | Fisker-: your turn |
| 08:41.46 | Amarande | industrial: lemme guess ... hunter? |
| 08:41.52 | Amarande | Dinged shortly after ... http://www.wowarmory.com/character-sheet.xml?r=Turalyon&n=Amaagnar is the hunter in question |
| 08:41.52 | industrial | ofcourse |
| 08:42.02 | Twisol | I've been using my fire AoE spell (forgot the exact name) a lot lately in tough spots. It's gotten me out of some close spots. :D |
| 08:42.06 | Amarande | yeah, hunters seem to be able to defeat mobs stupidly above their level |
| 08:42.21 | Amarande | I think it's the combination of the fact that hit % seems to be more lenient for physical characters than casters, and the fact that you're a pet class |
| 08:42.22 | Twisol | I'm a mage. >:D |
| 08:42.38 | Twisol | been going for high crits and mostly pure fire spec |
| 08:43.06 | krka | yeah, totally blizzards pet class :/ |
| 08:43.17 | industrial | Amarande: pet classes are usually the best solo classes simply because you have .. say if you have 1k hp the pet will have like 1.5 making your hp 2.5 which would be totally above your level |
| 08:43.24 | Fisker- | it's because he's ranged physical Amarande |
| 08:43.26 | industrial | oh and you can 'heal yourself' for that 1.5k hp |
| 08:43.30 | Fisker- | they can bypass most mitigation effects |
| 08:43.33 | Fisker- | melee cannot |
| 08:43.46 | Amarande | Fisker: exactly |
| 08:43.51 | Twisol | Pets are like your own personal party, without the distracting chatter. |
| 08:43.53 | Amarande | and casters can, but are too handicapped by the much harsher hit rating curve |
| 08:43.57 | ZorbaTHut | industrial, that's a bit of a false comparison though. many of the non-pet classes have more armor, more damage mitigation, self-healing, etc |
| 08:44.12 | ZorbaTHut | yes, all other things being equal, pet classes have a big advantage. but not everything else is equal. :) |
| 08:44.18 | krka | druids are their own pets instead |
| 08:44.23 | Twisol | Heheh. |
| 08:44.27 | Amarande | I think I did take out a couple of 50 mobs at 45 on my priest when I was questing in Tanaris though |
| 08:44.30 | industrial | ZorbaTHut: well only the pets armor matters, not the plasyers' |
| 08:44.49 | ZorbaTHut | if only the pet's armor matters, then only the pet's hp matters. |
| 08:44.57 | Twisol | Zorba, how do mages fit in there? Low armor, no self healing (except with created food), dunno about the mitigation thing... |
| 08:45.00 | industrial | hm, I guess |
| 08:45.09 | industrial | Twisol: CC :p |
| 08:45.09 | ZorbaTHut | twisol, I haven't played a mage so I honestly can't tell you for sure |
| 08:45.20 | ZorbaTHut | however, their various CC abilities and AOE abilities probably contribute a lot. |
| 08:45.20 | Twisol | Crowd control? |
| 08:45.20 | Amarande | btw, industrial: were you MM or BM when doing this? |
| 08:45.31 | ZorbaTHut | you don't need damage mitigation if you can just kill them before they reach you. |
| 08:45.32 | Amarande | I was MM when I soloed the +3 levels elite (and still am) |
| 08:45.39 | industrial | Amarande: BM |
| 08:45.45 | Twisol | True |
| 08:45.50 | industrial | with surv/mm I pull aggro after a few shots :\ |
| 08:46.01 | Dagmar | You don't have Intimidation? |
| 08:46.10 | industrial | not for MM/surv |
| 08:46.16 | Dagmar | Heh |
| 08:46.22 | Twisol | My tactics usually involve high damage as they approach and a freeze to stop them in their tracks so I can back up and finish them. >_> |
| 08:46.39 | Twisol | and AoE = pwn for multiple mobs |
| 08:46.39 | Dagmar | Mine usually involve giving the monkey a three count. |
| 08:46.43 | Dagmar | If I'm feeling lazy. |
| 08:47.15 | industrial | mine involve(d) only pressing and holding 1 and then doing a full dps rotation while I eat chips |
| 08:47.16 | Dagmar | Anything non elite will maybe manage to get about ten feet from where I attacked it |
| 08:47.24 | industrial | if I was really lazy I'd use a weight for the 1 key |
| 08:47.29 | Twisol | heh |
| 08:47.42 | industrial | (but blizzard doesnt like it if you do that :<) |
| 08:48.03 | Dagmar | Once you're epiced up, mobs your own level are like tissue |
| 08:48.18 | industrial | not like they can check, cause you only send a hardware event every gcd ofcourse :p |
| 08:48.41 | Dagmar | I like doing the kill-ten-guys daily from the Tournament in one go |
| 08:49.41 | Amarande | awww, why must the TOS prevent me from using my drinking duck to dps? :) |
| 08:49.44 | Amarande | heh |
| 08:50.43 | Amarande | in my case, mobs have to wait till they're un-snared before they can even think of running after me. |
| 08:50.45 | Amarande | yay spider. :) |
| 08:53.54 | krka | wouldn't a pet with good taunt/aggro be better than a pet with snare? |
| 08:55.29 | industrial | gorillas are awesome |
| 08:55.39 | industrial | because of their aoe |
| 08:57.02 | Amarande | krka: don't think any of the pet specials are really taunts. and all pets have growl. :) |
| 08:57.55 | Amarande | snare is probably ideal, since, well ... there's two situations when you're going to easily pull aggro off the pet and have a monster try to nom you or force you to move so you aren't Too Close to shoot |
| 08:58.08 | Amarande | one is after several shots, and as MM, there's really no way to avoid that one |
| 08:58.39 | Amarande | the other is right at the beginning, if you want to go in with guns blazing (which allows for much faster soloing) |
| 08:59.04 | Amarande | in this case, snare is awesome, because it gives the pet some time to get its aggro up before the mob is able to move and try to nom you. |
| 09:00.13 | Amarande | basically snare = I can fire the first shot, letting the pet's approach be during the CD before my next shot, thus meaning I kill each mob faster than if I had to send the pet in and just stand and wait till it's over there and attacking |
| 09:01.14 | Amarande | like I said, I don't think there's a way to avoid pulling aggro eventually as MM anyway if the mob lives long enough |
| 09:01.34 | Amarande | just like with warlocks, even your voidwalker isn't going to be holding aggro forever |
| 09:02.17 | Amarande | actually come to think of it, I wonder if that's a reason why warlocks' higher threat per DPS than other DPS classes has never really been fixed |
| 09:02.31 | Amarande | because it would cause threat balance issues when soloing with VW? |
| 09:04.32 | Amarande | btw, can even BM pets hold aggro indefinitely, or will the hunter still pull from them too? |
| 09:09.20 | Torhal | you wouldn't stir-fry a flailing kitten Fisker- |
| 09:10.00 | Fisker- | maaaaaaan Torhal |
| 09:10.15 | Fisker- | Why did i see the blinking window thinking "You wouldn't ping a Fisker?" |
| 09:10.42 | Torhal | I have no such knowledge, Fisker-. Try again. |
| 09:10.58 | Fisker- | i will physically harm you |
| 09:13.11 | Torhal | I'm happy you're finding your Zen. |
| 09:14.28 | Twisol | Torhal - I looked over Tekkub's questlevel plugin. |
| 09:14.37 | Twisol | the code seems overall better than mine. XD |
| 09:14.45 | *** join/#wowuidev Aeyan (n=pancake@cpe-174-098-002-214.triad.res.rr.com) |
| 09:15.10 | olafski | amarande: hunters will very easily pull aggro from their pets if they don't hold back |
| 09:15.12 | Twisol | the only substantial difference is that I'm adding the levels of linked quests to the tooltip rather than in the chat... |
| 09:15.29 | Torhal | Ah |
| 09:15.55 | *** join/#wowuidev zenzio (n=zenzio__@85.19.77.194) |
| 09:18.21 | Twisol | however, I'm not entirely sure how he's accounting for the extra width in the tracker frame. O_o |
| 09:18.42 | Twisol | I see a variable questWatchMaxWidth, but it's not used... |
| 09:19.53 | *** join/#wowuidev Thelyna (n=burp@219-89-246-32.adsl.xtra.co.nz) |
| 09:25.23 | Amarande | olafski: yeah, I'd probably notice that more often |
| 09:25.44 | Amarande | if it wasn't for the fact that most of the time when soloing many monsters in a row I tend to eventually get reduced to just hunter's mark and auto shot heh |
| 09:26.00 | olafski | yep that's what I did when leveling mine |
| 09:26.03 | olafski | had a macro to automate most of it |
| 09:26.19 | olafski | target a close mob, cast hunters mark, send in pet and start autoshooting |
| 09:26.27 | olafski | then I could casually run to the previous mob to loot it |
| 09:27.03 | Amarande | I tend to at least try to make use of serpent sting and arcane shot |
| 09:27.13 | Amarande | but usually run out of mana after going more than a few mobs without a break heh |
| 09:28.06 | Amarande | on another point, the naga section of desolace will be awesomely fun. |
| 09:28.14 | Amarande | well, the naga and crab men. the whole underwater part basically. :) |
| 09:29.29 | Amarande | wonder if the deepdive helm schematic is going to become an unavailable legacy item once cata hits |
| 09:36.24 | msoul | I'm not sure what class i should level up now |
| 09:36.42 | msoul | extremely difficult to get into a guild with a DK |
| 09:36.47 | Twisol | it is? |
| 09:36.51 | msoul | ye |
| 09:36.54 | msoul | Aye |
| 09:36.58 | Twisol | huh. Why? |
| 09:37.16 | msoul | I've no idea... |
| 09:37.41 | msoul | maybe because i didn't play wow back in vanilla/TBC |
| 09:37.51 | Kalroth | It's easy to get in a guild, it's hard to get in a good raiding guild though :) |
| 09:38.05 | msoul | Did most raids with wotlk except the last two bosses in ulduar and it is not enough for the guilds i apply for |
| 09:38.14 | msoul | Kalroth: well put |
| 09:38.53 | msoul | been into 3 guilds so far, 2 small guilds one of them happen to have drama, the 3rd guild were abusing their council and disbanded 2 days after i left |
| 09:39.11 | msoul | and i dont wa t t |
| 09:39.27 | msoul | don't want to join any guild... i love raiding never missed one even |
| 09:40.24 | msoul | one of the guild leaders told me "i don't have enough experience" when i asked him to define experience he said you didn't clear naxxramas back in january "I started playing wow last march" |
| 09:40.28 | Amarande | msoul: maybe it's time to found a guild. :) |
| 09:40.42 | msoul | Amarande: I am trying, it's just hard |
| 09:41.18 | Amarande | and yeah, what is with the rabid obsession so many wowers have with making sure their party/raid mates are folks who zoomed straight to 80 when wotlk came out and went straight to raiding? |
| 09:41.44 | msoul | you should come to kazzak and have a good gag |
| 09:42.06 | msoul | "LFM toc25 link stats and ach and come to dala north bank for gear inspection" |
| 09:42.14 | msoul | my ignore list is full of those idiots |
| 09:42.21 | Amarande | which battlegroup is kazzak on? |
| 09:42.27 | Amarande | please dont say stormstrike, please dont say stormstrike |
| 09:42.30 | msoul | eu |
| 09:42.33 | mitch0 | msoul: eh :) |
| 09:42.34 | Amarande | ah. |
| 09:42.37 | msoul | kaazzak realm |
| 09:42.58 | Amarande | I need to read up on my battlegroups' servers before 3.3.0 hits |
| 09:43.04 | msoul | i am planning to move my char elsewhere once i find a guild |
| 09:43.13 | Amarande | in case there's a douchebag central server I need to keep an eye on people from when I'm in cross-server groups |
| 09:43.39 | msoul | if you play on eu realms then keep an eye on kazzak |
| 09:43.48 | Amarande | I play US |
| 09:43.53 | msoul | lucky you |
| 09:43.55 | Amarande | right now Turalyon, Horde side |
| 09:44.11 | msoul | i wanted to play on a us realms but blizz screwed me up with the keys |
| 09:44.23 | msoul | waited two weeks for them to exchange them and gave up at the end |
| 09:44.29 | Kalroth | uhm, it's the same stuff everywhere |
| 09:44.40 | msoul | possible... |
| 09:45.06 | msoul | a 15 years old who don't even have a pubic hair trash talking you |
| 09:45.10 | Kalroth | people dont want to pug with a green geared newbie with no clue of the fights, it might mean they wipe a few times |
| 09:45.29 | msoul | http://eu.wowarmory.com/character-sheet.xml?r=Kazzak&n=Spindrift |
| 09:46.14 | *** join/#wowuidev Caleb| (n=caleb@dsl4E5C0218.pool.t-online.hu) |
| 09:46.20 | Kalroth | yes, that's what I said :p |
| 09:46.24 | msoul | :) |
| 09:46.37 | Amarande | Kalroth: heh, yeah, people are way too sensitive about that |
| 09:46.48 | Amarande | gee, you might have to wipe a few times while someone learns the fights |
| 09:46.51 | Kalroth | well it's their raid, so their rules |
| 09:46.52 | Amarande | OH THE HUMANITY |
| 09:47.00 | msoul | haha |
| 09:47.02 | Amarande | don't they ever remember when they were learning? :) |
| 09:47.05 | Kalroth | you can always start a raid yourself if you're unhappy about it |
| 09:47.17 | Kalroth | Amarande: they remember all too well and they dont want to repeat it :P |
| 09:47.23 | Amarande | everyone was a newbie at some point :P |
| 09:47.28 | msoul | exactly |
| 09:47.50 | msoul | but in general they try to find anyone to throw the blame on |
| 09:48.01 | Twisol | leeroooy jenkiiinssss....? |
| 09:48.02 | Kalroth | sure, but if you're the raid leader, would you go with 9/24 newbies or 9/24 people that have done it a few times at least |
| 09:48.04 | msoul | omg tank you are this, omg healer you are that and the drama begins |
| 09:48.18 | Amarande | yeah, there's always the blame game |
| 09:48.23 | Kalroth | besides msoul, I hope you got tanking gear |
| 09:48.32 | Amarande | Kalroth: that depends on how much time I and the rest of the raid have to burn |
| 09:48.33 | msoul | Kalroth: if i am the raid leader i'd explainthe fight beforehand for those who didn't do this fight before |
| 09:48.47 | Amarande | if it's a long instance like naxx, I'm probably more likely to select the people who have done it a few times so we can actually FINISH |
| 09:48.50 | Kalroth | a DPS DK is a dime a dozen and every guild got like 10-15 of them :p |
| 09:48.52 | msoul | and 3 wipes are fine.. but truly hard to find ppl who does that |
| 09:49.04 | Kalroth | Amarande: It's a pug, assume minimal time |
| 09:49.06 | Amarande | if it's the usual WotLK fare where the entire "raid instance" is pretty much a single bossfight, it really doesn't matter that much though :) |
| 09:49.08 | msoul | Kalroth: true :/ |
| 09:49.23 | msoul | which is why i am planning to level up a new char, dunno what class |
| 09:49.31 | msoul | probably a hunter |
| 09:49.44 | Kalroth | I thought you wanted to be in a guild? :P |
| 09:49.55 | Amarande | msoul: meh, forget hunter |
| 09:49.59 | Amarande | I suggest some fun classes |
| 09:50.02 | msoul | i do except i didn't find any |
| 09:50.02 | Amarande | like resto shaman |
| 09:50.03 | Twisol | mage ftw! |
| 09:50.05 | Amarande | or holy priest |
| 09:50.09 | Amarande | wait no not holy priest |
| 09:50.12 | Amarande | disc priest |
| 09:50.13 | Amarande | BUBBLES! |
| 09:50.19 | Amarande | holy priests are fail angels LOL |
| 09:50.19 | Kalroth | resto shaman is fun? :P |
| 09:50.20 | Twisol | bage! |
| 09:50.23 | Twisol | *mage! |
| 09:50.32 | Amarande | Kalroth: well, if getting into a raid guild is one's idea of fun? :) |
| 09:50.36 | msoul | disc priest for single heal in raids isn't it? |
| 09:50.37 | Amarande | also |
| 09:50.42 | *** join/#wowuidev Tinyboom_ (n=nahh@ti0121a340-dhcp0974.bb.online.no) |
| 09:50.44 | Amarande | the way things are for shamans these days in particular |
| 09:50.46 | Kalroth | msoul: yes |
| 09:50.51 | Amarande | you pretty much HAVE to go resto. |
| 09:50.58 | Kalroth | Amarande: why? |
| 09:51.10 | Kalroth | we run with more enhance shamans than resto shamans these days :p |
| 09:51.16 | Amarande | Kalroth: because until you have lots of badge gear you're hopeless when it comes to actually getting groups for anything else :) |
| 09:51.23 | Amarande | other classes get into groups with 3k |
| 09:51.26 | msoul | never thought of healing but i guess i've got a better chance with a healer than melee dps |
| 09:51.33 | Amarande | dps shamans? you better have 5k apparently |
| 09:51.40 | msoul | no my dp |
| 09:51.41 | msoul | dk |
| 09:51.55 | Twisol | Night. |
| 09:52.14 | Amarande | see, the thing about healing is this |
| 09:52.26 | Kalroth | well the advantage of playing a healer is that you can gear up for both healing and dps and tanking (the latter only if paladin/druid!) |
| 09:52.29 | Amarande | nobody actually looks at your recount unless you wipe and need to figure out where the underperformance is. :) |
| 09:52.41 | Amarande | the thing about tanking is this |
| 09:53.02 | Amarande | nobody actually looks at your recount, they look at your omen, and all that matters is that you don't die, let raid members die, or lose aggro too easily |
| 09:53.07 | Amarande | the thing about dps is this |
| 09:53.09 | Kalroth | tanking is pretty much the easiest role in WoW |
| 09:53.18 | Amarande | EVERYBODY LOOKS AT YOUR BLOODY RECOUNT AND IF THE NUMBERS AREN'T HIGH ENOUGH THEN YOU JUST SUCK. |
| 09:53.29 | Amarande | no matter how well you execute the strategy. :P |
| 09:53.43 | msoul | aye |
| 09:53.49 | msoul | a penis envy if you ask me |
| 09:53.54 | msoul | excuse my language |
| 09:53.57 | Amarande | many groups will take someone who does 5k dps and stands in fire all the time than someone who does 3k and knows what to do. :| |
| 09:54.03 | Kalroth | Sure, what good are you if you execute the strategy, but at 1k dps :) |
| 09:54.07 | ZorbaTHut | I do hope they extend the new LFD into LFR, assuming it works well |
| 09:54.11 | ZorbaTHut | I'm quite looking forward to it |
| 09:54.18 | Amarande | zorba: that might backfire |
| 09:54.27 | ZorbaTHut | amarande, it can be argued that if the raid doesn't wipe, the dude doing 5k DPS is, in fact, more valuable |
| 09:54.42 | *** join/#wowuidev Wobble (n=Wobin@203-158-39-103.dyn.iinet.net.au) |
| 09:54.47 | Amarande | Zorba: see, the reason I'm leery about LFR is this |
| 09:54.57 | Kalroth | And it is possible to do both things you know :P |
| 09:55.01 | msoul | my ap is 5120 crit 32 something % iirc |
| 09:55.05 | Amarande | right now, as it is, servers tend to be dominated by a small few raid guilds that everyone wants to run with |
| 09:55.05 | Kalroth | Dish out decent DPS and not die |
| 09:55.06 | *** join/#wowuidev Srosh (n=Srosh@c209091.adsl.hansenet.de) |
| 09:55.22 | Amarande | if you have LFR, then raiding starts to become dominated by a small few raid guilds in the -entire battlegroup- |
| 09:55.26 | msoul | ZorbaTHut: and they tell me "you don't have enough experience" for clearing naxx later than january |
| 09:55.27 | Fisker- | hey Kalroth |
| 09:55.29 | Amarande | and yeah, I'm kinda self serving in that statement |
| 09:55.32 | Amarande | mostly because I'm on Stormstrike |
| 09:55.33 | Fisker- | TROLL |
| 09:55.34 | Amarande | Which has MAL'GANIS |
| 09:55.35 | Kalroth | Hej Fisker skat |
| 09:55.45 | Amarande | which means everyone would have to compete with friggin EJ |
| 09:55.54 | Fisker- | hej Kalroth |
| 09:55.56 | Fisker- | du gør mig våd |
| 09:56.01 | ZorbaTHut | amarande, I'm not entirely convinced that'll be a huge problem, though. I mean, yes, you're competing with the big guys in a sense, but it's not like EJ is going to be pugging HTOC25 |
| 09:56.05 | msoul | guess i will level up a priest or paladin for later healing |
| 09:56.11 | ZorbaTHut | and with LFR you wouldn't really be able to choose your members anyway |
| 09:56.25 | msoul | nice |
| 09:56.31 | Kalroth | ZorbaTHut: They are, but they already got their own set groups, so there wont be any competition |
| 09:56.34 | Amarande | yeah, I do like the random thing very much |
| 09:56.39 | Amarande | preventing people from cherry picking |
| 09:56.51 | Amarande | although there's some things that will suck with |
| 09:56.55 | Kalroth | The only thing you have to fear from MG is the players that are too dumb to get into the good pug/alt groups :p |
| 09:56.55 | msoul | bbl |
| 09:56.55 | Amarande | actually, maybe it won't suck, in a way |
| 09:57.08 | ZorbaTHut | yeah. I'm looking forward to seeing it, I *think* it'll work out well, bu there's some potential issues. We'll see. |
| 09:57.19 | Kalroth | EJ and friends got set raid teams, even on alts |
| 09:57.25 | Amarande | I expect that the obsession with damage meters will abate somewhat when you don't get to pick and choose your tanks and therefore have to worry about whether your tanks are able to hold aggro with people doing obscene DPS |
| 09:57.38 | Kalroth | uhm |
| 09:57.49 | Amarande | like in BC, where the meter pushers got punished severely eventually in many cases because it resulted in pulling aggro :) |
| 09:57.57 | Amarande | and by 'got punished severely' I mean 'died' heh |
| 09:57.58 | Kalroth | If your tank got aggro issues on any boss fight, then he's pretty shit :p |
| 09:58.14 | Amarande | Kalroth: depends on the relative progression |
| 09:58.28 | ZorbaTHut | kalroth, eh, there are people who decide not to take the -threat talents because "lol tank can handle it" |
| 09:58.32 | Kalroth | The only fight I can remember aggro was an issue, was Malygos after second vortex |
| 09:58.43 | Kalroth | ZorbaTHut: it really shouldn't be an issue anyways |
| 09:58.47 | ZorbaTHut | and tank threat isn't scaling as fast as dps threat is |
| 09:58.48 | Amarande | Kalroth: I mean ... let's say you have a random raid |
| 09:59.07 | Amarande | and you end up with T9, T10 geared DPS, and meanwhile the tank is still badging up ... |
| 09:59.09 | ZorbaTHut | in naxx it was just ridiculous, now people are actually fighting for threat again. in IC, I dunno. Threat may be a problem. |
| 09:59.16 | Amarande | yeah, you're gonna have people having to hold back or die. :) |
| 09:59.27 | Kalroth | ZorbaTHut: I know, but on most ToC25 encounters our tanks still got a 60-80% lead 2 minutes into the fight |
| 09:59.34 | Amarande | since the random LFG will be in effect for heroics, you'll have to especially watch it in 5-mans. |
| 10:00.06 | Kalroth | Well 5-mans are always an issue, on the trash anyways :) |
| 10:00.15 | Kalroth | But the healers knows to heal DPS there, not the tank |
| 10:00.17 | ZorbaTHut | kalroth, odd, ours don't tend to have that at all, at least on fights that involve everyone punching the boss. |
| 10:00.40 | Amarande | actually, that brings us to one of perhaps, then, one of the genuine issues that cross server random LFG faces |
| 10:00.46 | *** join/#wowuidev Tinyboom (n=nahh@ti0121a340-dhcp0974.bb.online.no) |
| 10:00.48 | Amarande | tanks trying to gear up. |
| 10:00.58 | Amarande | I'm just thinking we'll get a lot of tanks being unable to gear up because: |
| 10:01.07 | Kalroth | ZorbaTHut: Well we're probably ahead of the pack, having cleared heroic a while back, but still, even at half that performance it should be 30-40% ahead |
| 10:01.08 | Amarande | * Tank gets all the stuff they can without doing heroics, including some TOC farming. |
| 10:01.22 | Amarande | * Tank tries to get in the queue for heroics so he can gear and badge up for serious tanking. |
| 10:01.32 | Kalroth | A tank is really, really easy to gear up for heroics |
| 10:01.41 | Amarande | Kalroth: the next step |
| 10:01.46 | Kalroth | Get 560 defense and ask once in LFG |
| 10:01.54 | ZorbaTHut | 560? |
| 10:02.01 | Trela_ | 560? o.o |
| 10:02.13 | olafski | 560 defense with 20k hp? ,) |
| 10:02.14 | Amarande | * Starter tank is constantly getting paired up with uber geared DPS by random LFG due to how many heavily progressed people there are on the battlegroup |
| 10:02.26 | Kalroth | yeah, that means they wont shit my pugs up until they're overgeared |
| 10:02.28 | Kalroth | :P |
| 10:02.32 | Amarande | with the result that the tank never gets badges because he keeps getting votekicked after the first boss, and then people go talking about how much he sucks as a tank |
| 10:02.35 | ZorbaTHut | also, in the current system, it can be surprisingly hard for a tank to start doing heroics |
| 10:02.48 | ZorbaTHut | you get comments like "only 30k HP? lol get more stam nub, that's not enough for heroic nexus" |
| 10:02.52 | Amarande | Zorba: yeah, that's the thing |
| 10:02.53 | olafski | zorbathut: exactly |
| 10:02.58 | Amarande | and votekick is just going to make it worse |
| 10:03.04 | Kalroth | Well retards are retards, cant prevent dumb comments |
| 10:03.08 | olafski | when we started heroics in december or so 20k was fine :P |
| 10:03.09 | Kalroth | tanks dont need 30k |
| 10:03.24 | Trela_ | Just need competent groups. |
| 10:03.26 | Amarande | votekick means that a tank needs to constantly cart two friends around until they're heavily geared, in order to have two reliable votes in their favor whenever it comes up |
| 10:03.27 | Kalroth | I've done most heroics with a 23k tank |
| 10:03.36 | ZorbaTHut | I started tanking at 20k myself ;) |
| 10:03.41 | Trela_ | http://www.wowarmory.com/character-sheet.xml?r=Moon+Guard&cn=KÃÂssy |
| 10:03.44 | Amarande | (and you can't bring friends into the LFG tool, I'm assuming you have to be alone to enter it?) |
| 10:03.53 | olafski | on another note, we did oculus last night with 5 overgeared people and wiped 4 times.. and we even knew all the encounters |
| 10:03.59 | olafski | amarande: you can bring friends |
| 10:03.59 | ZorbaTHut | is there any penalty for kicking a dude out of your LFD team? |
| 10:04.08 | Trela_ | Bam, 542 defense, 23,000 health. More than enough to do heroics, from regular instance gear. |
| 10:04.12 | olafski | doesn't look like it zorbathut |
| 10:04.23 | ZorbaTHut | mmm, that may be a problem |
| 10:04.34 | Amarande | olafski: does it automatically provide you with a replacement and port them up to where the party is, or do you have to wait? |
| 10:04.35 | Kalroth | ZorbaTHut: yes there is |
| 10:04.44 | Kalroth | ZorbaTHut: you're 4 in the party now, not 5 |
| 10:04.47 | olafski | you have to wait amarande |
| 10:05.05 | olafski | trela_: you sure? I for some reason take TONS of damage when tanking on my DK.. much much more than on my paladin or warrior who are worse geared |
| 10:05.16 | olafski | trela_: I think it has to do with not having a shield :< |
| 10:05.20 | *** join/#wowuidev Wobb (n=Wobin@124-168-160-64.dyn.iinet.net.au) |
| 10:05.29 | ZorbaTHut | kalroth, ah, it doesn't get filled back up? |
| 10:05.37 | olafski | the leader can have it filled back up |
| 10:05.38 | Kalroth | ZorbaTHut: Yeah, but not instantly |
| 10:05.41 | Trela_ | olafski: Are you going into frost presence? |
| 10:05.45 | olafski | trela_: yes :P |
| 10:05.48 | Trela_ | :P |
| 10:05.53 | olafski | trela_: I've tanked raids without problems.. but heroics hurt like hell |
| 10:06.06 | olafski | so I think it's all those little hits that would have been blocked by a warrior or paladin |
| 10:06.31 | Amarande | basically, I think the LFG tool as it apparently will be is just a fine and dandy thing |
| 10:06.32 | Kalroth | all those little hits doesn't hurt like hell though :p |
| 10:06.44 | Trela_ | I do fine as is. |
| 10:06.51 | ZorbaTHut | I can see that being a problem for dks, personally, they're the only class that doesn't have a shieldy mechanic |
| 10:06.55 | Amarande | (also: am I interpreting right that it counts the first heroic you do with a random LFG tool pug in the day as the daily heroic?) |
| 10:07.11 | olafski | amarande: yes, even if it was a "premade" group |
| 10:07.13 | Sentri | yep |
| 10:07.32 | Amarande | that's total woot too, means I'll never have to see Oculus |
| 10:07.37 | Amarande | heh |
| 10:07.37 | olafski | :) |
| 10:07.40 | Amarande | wonder if anyone will even do oculus |
| 10:07.41 | olafski | wait 15 minutes if you get oculus |
| 10:07.47 | ZorbaTHut | man, oculus is awesome |
| 10:07.51 | olafski | I did oculus last week and it took like 25 minutes, was super easy |
| 10:07.53 | ZorbaTHut | I have no idea why everyone hates it |
| 10:07.55 | olafski | yet last night we completely failed |
| 10:08.03 | olafski | we wiped 2-3 times on the 3rd boss |
| 10:08.16 | Amarande | Zorba: I think it's basically the whole matter of having to learn what is basically a completely different character that you use only for those specific battles |
| 10:08.26 | olafski | and a couple of people died because seemingly every drake in the instance wanted to aggro us all the time |
| 10:08.44 | ZorbaTHut | yeah, but it's a really easy character :P |
| 10:08.55 | Amarande | also, the fact that presumably people die a lot *because* of having to use the drakes |
| 10:09.00 | olafski | yeah the final fight isn't that hard |
| 10:09.09 | olafski | but that frostbomb throwing guy raped us |
| 10:09.10 | Amarande | because people can be the best wow players in the world at their regular class, and proceed to fail horribly when forced to use an unfamiliar vehicle |
| 10:09.20 | Sentri | the hardest thing there is to see the ranges to the drakes |
| 10:09.28 | olafski | amarande: everybody hates oculus, I hope blizzard learned their lesson with vehicles ,) |
| 10:09.40 | olafski | well everybody except zorbathut |
| 10:10.02 | olafski | zorbathut: maybe you can have questhelper "nudge" people to play oculus more ,0 |
| 10:10.18 | Sentri | it's not hard actually, it's annoying |
| 10:10.22 | Amarande | anyway, I think the new LFG tool and new approach to daily heroics is awesome |
| 10:10.30 | Amarande | on the other hand, I tend to still think votekick is a pretty fail idea |
| 10:10.40 | ZorbaTHut | bah server melted |
| 10:10.46 | olafski | how else do you remove people who go afk all the time amarande? |
| 10:10.53 | olafski | would it be better if the leader could just kick them? |
| 10:10.55 | Amarande | the only time I'd get the warm fuzzies about votekick I think is if the leader DCs |
| 10:11.07 | olafski | and what if the leader is an ass, nobody could kick him |
| 10:11.11 | Amarande | olafski: yes, it would be better for the leader to be able to function as the, er, leader |
| 10:11.19 | Amarande | olafski: then you shouldn't have grouped with that leader |
| 10:11.21 | Amarande | same as now |
| 10:11.26 | olafski | you can't choose to group with him :P |
| 10:11.33 | olafski | all you can do is leave the group |
| 10:11.46 | olafski | if 4 people agree that the 5th is an ass, the 5th should go imo even if he is the leader |
| 10:11.59 | Amarande | well, yeah, if they're being an ass |
| 10:12.05 | tekkub | okey |
| 10:12.11 | Kalroth | how will I ever pug then |
| 10:12.12 | tekkub | I have to say this |
| 10:12.20 | tekkub | then I'm adding htat word to the highlight blacklist |
| 10:12.25 | Sentri | votekick is find as long as it requires 4 votes to kick someone |
| 10:12.28 | tekkub | WHO THE FUCK CARES ABOUT VOTEKICK |
| 10:12.28 | Kalroth | tekkub: ass?! |
| 10:12.33 | Kalroth | oh |
| 10:12.35 | tekkub | stop pinging me |
| 10:12.43 | Sentri | fine* |
| 10:12.43 | Amarande | I just think it will be abused and make it difficult for a lot of newer players to get geared up because people will use the votekick to throw out people based on recount results and such |
| 10:13.03 | tekkub | I think you're overthinking it :P |
| 10:13.04 | olafski | do you play with such people now amarande? leaders who remove people based on recount? |
| 10:13.15 | olafski | once I'm in a group with someone it takes a LOT for me to kick them |
| 10:13.17 | Kalroth | votekick is only going to be an issue for the people that's going to get kicked a lot, eg. people that plays like shit! |
| 10:13.22 | Amarande | olafski: occasionally |
| 10:13.37 | Amarande | occasionally leaders want you to be able to declare certain dps measurements before you're invited |
| 10:13.39 | tekkub | I think once people see how fast the system works, they're not going to care unless they get a real asstard |
| 10:13.43 | olafski | really bad attitude, going afk all the time.. low dps I really couldn't care less about |
| 10:13.44 | Amarande | and I did have that one ony25 group where I got asked to leave |
| 10:13.45 | Wobin | hehe vo-tek-ick |
| 10:13.55 | Amarande | although that raid was really pretty fail anyway |
| 10:14.00 | tekkub | and I also bet in most cases the system will be used to fill in one or two spots |
| 10:14.10 | olafski | there's no votekicking in raids though |
| 10:14.21 | olafski | tekkub: well, I plan to vigorously pug on my own with it tbh :) |
| 10:14.32 | Wobin | A Raid is not a Democracy =P |
| 10:14.34 | ZorbaTHut | yeah I think it'll mostly be used for entire groups, myself |
| 10:14.39 | olafski | I like that I don't have to whisper people and such to pug anymore |
| 10:14.41 | olafski | can just click a button |
| 10:14.45 | tekkub | I have no plans to pure-pug |
| 10:14.55 | tekkub | but I'll probably use it to fill 2-3 slots |
| 10:14.57 | Amarande | in any case, I like how it's going to be easy to get a group quickly and badge up |
| 10:14.58 | Amarande | also |
| 10:14.58 | ZorbaTHut | I'd probably do a lot more instances if I could avoid that annoying looking-for-group thing |
| 10:15.02 | olafski | I did a couple of pugs on the PTR and it worked quite well in all cases |
| 10:15.02 | tekkub | I like coming in with a healer and tank already |
| 10:15.07 | Amarande | this LFG tool works for instances of all levels, I presume? :) |
| 10:15.08 | tekkub | less room for fuckupery |
| 10:15.13 | ZorbaTHut | push butan receive emblems |
| 10:15.15 | Sentri | i will use it to pug with my friend |
| 10:15.19 | Amarande | means I might actually be able to do the on the way up instances again! |
| 10:15.24 | ZorbaTHut | amarande, yep, and I'm looking forward to that too :) |
| 10:15.27 | olafski | we had a group with 4 english and one german guy who didn't understand a word we said and nobody even suggested to kick him |
| 10:15.38 | *** join/#wowuidev EthanCentaurai (n=ethan@92.24.57.255) |
| 10:15.42 | olafski | amarande: yep and you even get nice rewards for pugging low level instances ,) |
| 10:15.55 | Wobin | olafski, so why didn't you? |
| 10:15.56 | Amarande | there IS on the other hand one concern I have with 3.3.0 and instance groups that seems like it might really be genuine now that I think of it though |
| 10:15.59 | Amarande | the icecrown instances |
| 10:16.22 | Amarande | I understand you have to do each one in order to attune to the next, like you had to do Durnholde to get into BM in BC? |
| 10:16.24 | olafski | wobin: why would we, pugs are pugs and generally you accept a little bad stuff |
| 10:16.48 | olafski | yes amarande |
| 10:16.54 | Sentri | amarande: yes |
| 10:16.55 | olafski | you start with forge of souls, then pit of saron, then halls of reflection |
| 10:16.57 | Amarande | I have to wonder if that's going to cause problems later on |
| 10:16.59 | olafski | they are "connected" so to say |
| 10:17.13 | Amarande | basically, people not being able to get into pit or halls on newer characters/recently leveled alts |
| 10:17.19 | olafski | meh |
| 10:17.19 | Amarande | because no one is doing forge/pit anymore |
| 10:17.23 | olafski | you're overthinking it again imo :P |
| 10:17.27 | olafski | they all drop equal levels of loot |
| 10:17.32 | ZorbaTHut | I don't think the gear on the third one is any better |
| 10:17.34 | olafski | 219 normal, 232 heroic |
| 10:17.45 | Amarande | olafski: well it pretty much did happen in BC that a lot of people had issues getting into BM because they could not find groups for Durnholde after a point |
| 10:18.09 | olafski | amarande: hm, I didn't play TBC so I wouldn't know.. but I got into a durnholde group quite easily when I returned a few weeks before wotlk came |
| 10:18.11 | ZorbaTHut | did BM have better gear than Durnholde? |
| 10:18.18 | Amarande | Zorba: yes |
| 10:18.20 | ZorbaTHut | well |
| 10:18.21 | ZorbaTHut | problem solved |
| 10:18.23 | Amarande | BM was a 70 instance |
| 10:18.25 | Sentri | all three drop equal level loot and all three as awesome |
| 10:18.26 | ZorbaTHut | :P |
| 10:18.30 | Amarande | Durnholde was a 66-68 instance, which was part of the problem |
| 10:18.32 | olafski | amarande: couldn't you do heroic durnholde? |
| 10:18.37 | olafski | hm. |
| 10:18.37 | Amarande | olafski: not really |
| 10:18.42 | olafski | I guess that might be a problem |
| 10:18.44 | Amarande | because you needed at least honored with keepers of time to do heroic durnholde |
| 10:18.44 | olafski | no reputation and all |
| 10:18.50 | Amarande | and the ONLY way to get rep with KoT was the instances |
| 10:18.51 | olafski | that issue is also not there anymore |
| 10:19.04 | olafski | so equal gear and no reputation involved, I think this won't be an issue now |
| 10:19.11 | *** join/#wowuidev stolen|school (n=stolenle@193.170.222.163) |
| 10:19.14 | olafski | and remember you're pugging with your entire battlegroup |
| 10:19.18 | Amarande | Zorba: the other reason people complained about BM |
| 10:19.19 | olafski | there are always other people gearing up alts |
| 10:19.30 | Amarande | was that it was REQUIRED for the Elixir Master alchemy spec quest |
| 10:19.46 | olafski | gg potion master and respec |
| 10:19.50 | Amarande | you needed items that dropped off the rift lords which were only found there |
| 10:19.50 | olafski | or did they add the respec option later? |
| 10:19.59 | Amarande | no, the respec option was always there |
| 10:20.14 | olafski | I did elixir master at lvl 80, horrible.. should've done potion :) |
| 10:20.24 | Amarande | olafski: you'd rather have gone to botanica? :) |
| 10:20.30 | olafski | oh that's potion? |
| 10:20.32 | olafski | transmute than perhaps |
| 10:20.34 | Amarande | potion requires an instance too, yeah |
| 10:20.40 | olafski | I thought potion only required potions you made while leveling :P |
| 10:20.47 | olafski | s/than/then/ |
| 10:20.47 | Amarande | transmute is just stupidly expensive to the point of ludicrity, though |
| 10:20.51 | Fisker- | hmm |
| 10:20.57 | Amarande | well, not so much now that primal might isn't as in demand and has no more CD to make |
| 10:21.02 | Amarande | but in BC, it was stupid to spec transmute |
| 10:21.02 | olafski | :) |
| 10:21.06 | Amarande | at least, off the bat |
| 10:21.09 | Fisker- | arla is making a new facility that can handle a BILLION LITERS OF MILK! |
| 10:21.10 | olafski | I want 10 primal mights for my cool looking sword :< |
| 10:21.21 | Amarande | basically, you could respec for basically what ONE PRIMAL MIGHT cost |
| 10:21.26 | olafski | bah 11.20, I should really get dressed or something |
| 10:21.43 | olafski | bbl |
| 10:21.44 | Amarande | and I think you needed like ... four primal mights to do the transmute master spec quest |
| 10:22.02 | Fisker- | a billion liters Shirik |
| 10:22.05 | Amarande | yeah, anyone who did transmute mastery quest either was really dumb or really rich or both |
| 10:24.30 | Amarande | Fisker, do you have dreams of filling the Super Kamiokande with milk too? :P |
| 10:24.41 | Fisker- | no |
| 10:26.41 | *** join/#wowuidev Wobble (n=Wobin@124-168-146-202.dyn.iinet.net.au) |
| 10:28.51 | Fisker- | you |
| 10:35.37 | Amarande | Fisker: heh, the billion liters thing made me wonder :) |
| 10:35.43 | Amarande | you know what the Super Kamiokande is right? :) |
| 10:37.32 | *** join/#wowuidev Legorol (n=legorol@82.41.49.132) |
| 10:38.06 | Fisker- | no idea Amarande |
| 10:38.56 | Amarande | it's this super gigantic tank of water in Japan heh |
| 10:39.00 | Amarande | they use it to detect neutrinos |
| 10:40.52 | *** join/#wowuidev soufron (n=soufron@did75-14-82-236-19-233.fbx.proxad.net) |
| 10:42.52 | Fisker- | :o |
| 10:43.03 | Fisker- | Was actually thinking it was something japanese, chinese, etc. |
| 10:43.59 | Amarande | Kamiokande actually means "Kamioka Neutrino Detection Experiment." |
| 10:44.25 | *** join/#wowuidev Kandoko1 (n=Testing@adsl-068-159-119-207.sip.gsp.bellsouth.net) |
| 10:49.35 | *** join/#wowuidev cncfanatics (n=cncfanat@WoWUIDev/cncfanatics) |
| 10:55.51 | industrial | http://s3.amazonaws.com/data.tumblr.com/tumblr_kt4hfrRd8E1qa40vqo1_1280.jpg?AWSAccessKeyId=0RYTHV9YYQ4W5Q3HQMG2&Expires=1258454352&Signature=bRq4BoVWoQ3exLDlOK%2By2RQT5w0%3D |
| 10:55.54 | industrial | :) |
| 10:56.07 | industrial | good memories :) |
| 11:09.36 | *** join/#wowuidev Elkano (n=elkano@WoWUIDev/WoWAce/Elkano) |
| 11:10.41 | Fisker- | win industrial |
| 11:13.48 | Dezzimal | it made me realize how little I remember about matricies |
| 11:18.17 | zenzio | got to love people sometimes... user on Stackoverflow asks about something about iPhone coding, other person responds with snippet from Apple's documentation stating it's not allowed. First person responds "my question wasn't if it was allowed, but if it was possible". Second person elaborates that it was relevant to the question because Apple rejects apps it detects to be using private APIs or breaking the guidelines. First person thanks him for the in |
| 11:18.17 | zenzio | sight, but *again* asks if it's possible |
| 11:18.49 | zenzio | I can picture a few weeks ahead in time when person one is back on SO asking how to get his app to not be rejected |
| 11:21.33 | Amarande | I wonder if Apple's going to be forced to open that up soon anyway |
| 11:21.43 | Amarande | or start losing too many customers to the Droid |
| 11:22.02 | zenzio | I'm also pretty curious about that |
| 11:22.45 | Jerub | I hate that attitude. |
| 11:22.59 | Jerub | the "must protect $megacorp's interests by beating down on people in the community" |
| 11:23.03 | Jerub | attitude. |
| 11:23.10 | Amarande | Jerub: Megacorps suck. |
| 11:24.30 | Dezzimal | public discussion of the iphone API is by definition forbidden too I think |
| 11:24.37 | Amarande | Jerub: Then there's the copyright crap, which oh so frequently results in media megacorps actively pissing off the people they're trying to sell to. |
| 11:25.02 | Amarande | Dezzimal: given that you can download the dev kit free if you have a Mac, I'm not sure how secret it is |
| 11:25.15 | Amarande | although I think it costs money to publish stuff |
| 11:25.28 | Dezzimal | maybe that restriction got lifted |
| 11:25.46 | Amarande | besides, who ever takes corporations' do not discuss orders seriously :P |
| 11:26.12 | zenzio | Dezzimal: I think that was just unreleased APIs (ie. discussing 3.0 API before it was released) |
| 11:26.19 | *** join/#wowuidev zeheres (n=crs@dslb-084-061-034-135.pools.arcor-ip.net) |
| 11:27.02 | *** join/#wowuidev Zyn- (n=zyn@h243n2-av-a11.ias.bredband.telia.com) |
| 11:27.08 | Dezzimal | http://arstechnica.com/apple/news/2008/07/iphone-nda-doing-more-harm-than-good.ars |
| 11:28.47 | Amarande | Trouble is these days everyone willingly eats up "what is good for the business world is good for the world" with gusto :P |
| 11:28.59 | Amarande | like it's the most important thing in the world |
| 11:29.08 | Jerub | I was kicked from a mac channel for using 'damage' as a synnonym for 'drm' |
| 11:29.25 | Amarande | Jerub: mac people LIKE drm? |
| 11:29.32 | Amarande | that's odd. |
| 11:29.34 | ZorbaTHut | mac people like anything apple does |
| 11:29.35 | Jerub | Amarande: they fiercely defend apple's right to use it. |
| 11:29.38 | ZorbaTHut | if apple does it, it's good, QED |
| 11:29.42 | Fisker- | if white && apple logo == true |
| 11:29.42 | Amarande | unless they think what's good for the business world is what's good for the world, too |
| 11:29.53 | ZorbaTHut | amarande, no, if microsoft does it, it's bad |
| 11:29.53 | Jerub | I think the sentence was, "you can use a tool that will remove the damage from the file as it's being downloaded" |
| 11:29.56 | ZorbaTHut | it's only good if apple does it |
| 11:30.02 | Amarande | or am I failing to see the light because I actually have, well, you know, a job |
| 11:30.03 | Fisker- | why so hivemind ZorbaTHut ? |
| 11:30.18 | ZorbaTHut | I'm exaggerating a little, but it really is a stronger issue in the Mac world than in any other tech area I know of |
| 11:30.24 | Amarande | the world these days being full of people who lost theirs and would do anything to see the world have more jobs so they can have one again |
| 11:30.31 | ZorbaTHut | fisker, I think some of it is due to their (deserved) beatdown during the OS9 days |
| 11:30.35 | Amarande | whether those jobs end up being slavishly serving Evil |
| 11:30.41 | Dezzimal | meta-fanboying is pretty silly too ZorbaTHut |
| 11:30.50 | ZorbaTHut | the only people still using a Mac a year before OSX came out where those who were absolutely and totally devoted to Apple |
| 11:31.14 | zenzio | Jerub: the real question here is... what were you doing on a Mac channel? |
| 11:31.26 | Amarande | Basically, there seems to be this other notion, which is: |
| 11:31.27 | ZorbaTHut | then OSX comes out and is actually, y'know, good, and the culture starts expanding a bit, but I feel like it kept an unfortunate amount of its rather obsessive Mac fanboyism. |
| 11:31.44 | Amarande | If it's awesome, but would result in a net decrease of cash flowing through the economy, it's NASTY SEDUCTIVE EVIL rather than awesome |
| 11:31.46 | Jerub | zenzio: it's a long story, but it starts with, "So I was given a brand new quad core G5 by IBM" |
| 11:32.01 | zenzio | :) |
| 11:32.15 | ZorbaTHut | note that I'm saying this as someone who has a shiny new Mac Mini sitting on his desk ;) |
| 11:32.19 | Amarande | no, it's still awesome. so what if there is a net decrease of cash flowing through the economy? |
| 11:32.27 | Jerub | I have never paid for apple gear for myself. |
| 11:32.45 | ZorbaTHut | amarande, the problem is that "awesome" is a subjective thing, while "economy" is an objective thing |
| 11:32.51 | Jerub | (i've bought it for the wife, but that's like buying her shoes and makeup) |
| 11:32.55 | ZorbaTHut | they believe that something hurting the economy makes it non-awesome |
| 11:33.17 | Amarande | Zorba: is the economy important enough to gut the world of its awesomeness to buoy it up, though? :| |
| 11:33.32 | ZorbaTHut | personally, I feel like the economy *is* actually one of the most important things, if not *the* single most important thing. I just have somewhat liberal/socialist views of what helps the economy. |
| 11:33.39 | Amarande | or is this one of those other questions whose answer tends to depend on whether one actually has a job :) |
| 11:34.00 | Amarande | I mean, we'll put it this way. |
| 11:34.04 | Amarande | *I work for a grocery store*. |
| 11:34.10 | Amarande | And have massive seniority there. |
| 11:34.15 | ZorbaTHut | amarande, from my perspective, if it hurts the economy significantly in the long run, it probably is actually *less awesome*. Therefore, "buoy the economy by being less awesome" is internally something of a paradox. |
| 11:34.37 | Amarande | Which means I'm almost economy-proof, basically the *store would have to go out of business, in an industry that is perpetually essential and thus very resistant to bad economies* for me to lose my job without doing something dumb to get fired. |
| 11:34.40 | ZorbaTHut | And "hurt the economy while being totally awesome" is, equally, rather paradoxical. |
| 11:35.01 | Amarande | Zorba: mostly it would apply towards the creative industries, I suppose |
| 11:35.27 | ZorbaTHut | ironically, one of the socialist things I'd love to do which the hardcore capitalists hate would pretty specifically target grocery stores, and, I suspect, also be a large long-term bonus to the economy ;) |
| 11:35.29 | olafski | why would apple not have the right to use drm? :s |
| 11:35.38 | olafski | like it or not, it's their stuff so they can use it :P |
| 11:35.52 | ZorbaTHut | olafski, there are people, myself included, who believe that DRM should be heavily scrutinized for legality for *all* companies. |
| 11:35.55 | Amarande | whether it's really more important to make the best possible creation, or if dumbed-down high-profit "creation" is actually better for the world and those of us who think strongly about "art" are just being plain pig-heads who will hasten the time when the world economy can no longer support its population? |
| 11:36.07 | olafski | zorbathut: hmkay, I'm not one of those people I guess :) |
| 11:36.24 | *** join/#wowuidev Funkeh` (n=funk@WoWUIDev/WoWAce/Ace3/BigWigs/funkeh) |
| 11:36.38 | Amarande | Basically, is "dumbing down for the masses" the bad thing we think it is, or is NOT dumbing it down for the masses actually the greater evil? |
| 11:36.41 | ZorbaTHut | amarande, I think there's room for both kinds of art. Art so expensive that nobody can afford it is somewhat pointless. |
| 11:36.55 | ZorbaTHut | I also have a real hard time believing that things are actually being dumbed down for the masses |
| 11:37.10 | Amarande | Zorba: is it better for people to make awesome that sells a few thousand copies, or blandness that sells a few hundred thousand, basically |
| 11:37.35 | Amarande | as you probably have noticed, there seems to have been a steady decline in the quality of creative works produced by "the industry" over the years |
| 11:37.35 | ZorbaTHut | people have been complaining about that particular issue for literally centuries, and yet there are many forms of modern art that are far more complex and subtle than they used to be. We're getting better at art, not worse. |
| 11:37.40 | ZorbaTHut | amarande, define "better". |
| 11:37.43 | ZorbaTHut | And no, I haven't noticed that at all |
| 11:37.46 | ZorbaTHut | I've noticed the exact opposite |
| 11:38.03 | Amarande | as the objective quality (mainly in terms of how detailed the experience is) increases, it seems that the subjective quality (primarily, how enjoyable the experience is, and its depth as a work of art) has decreased |
| 11:38.06 | ZorbaTHut | there's still just as much crud out there, but there's more and more people making truly amazing stuff. |
| 11:38.21 | Amarande | in gaming, for instance, we seem to see gameplay and story increasingly take a back seat to "ooh shiny" |
| 11:38.35 | ZorbaTHut | I honestly couldn't disagree more |
| 11:38.39 | ZorbaTHut | I mean, Braid. |
| 11:38.51 | Amarande | Zorba: but on the other hand, look at the RPG industry |
| 11:38.56 | ZorbaTHut | World of Goo. The Path. Blueberry Garden. Osmos. Portal. |
| 11:39.07 | Amarande | the classic RPG is increasingly evolving into that stage of "faded old glory" it would seem |
| 11:39.26 | Amarande | while RPG as an industry are turning into either MMOs, or action games that are as RPG as Devil May Cry 3 is RPG. |
| 11:39.34 | ZorbaTHut | And Yet It Moves, Darwinia, Everyday Shooter, Machinarium, Trine, Zeno Clash, do you want me to go on 'cause I probably can |
| 11:39.38 | Jerub | I was just lamenting today how it sucks how in WoW there's no real consequence for failure in a quest. |
| 11:39.53 | ZorbaTHut | you're looking at the big budget games designed for mass consumption |
| 11:40.09 | Jerub | that's something I liked in RPGs of yore. failure would mean either a) having to restore from a saved game, or b) having to live with a material detriment for failing. |
| 11:40.12 | ZorbaTHut | yes, those are getting more polished and more generalized |
| 11:40.28 | Amarande | it's time for the industry to learn that no, having visible hit point quantities and labeling the health and power bars HP and MP DOES NOT NECESSARILY MAKE YOU AN RPG |
| 11:40.36 | ZorbaTHut | on the other hand I think they're also getting *better*. it's not that their target is becoming stupider, it's that they're doing a better job of targeting the same stupid people they always wanted to |
| 11:40.59 | ZorbaTHut | We're learning about all the issues that made "classic" games, let's be honest here, kind of suck |
| 11:41.02 | Amarande | I've seen all too many so-called RPGs that basically are action games where they label the health and power bars HP and MP and make a few stats more visible to the player and think this somehow makes it any more RPG than DMC3. |
| 11:41.04 | ZorbaTHut | and we're *not doing them anymore* |
| 11:41.32 | zenzio | Amarande: I agree, but do you have some examples of such games? |
| 11:41.37 | ZorbaTHut | sure, but what does make an RPG? Is Final Fantasy X an RPG? |
| 11:41.46 | Amarande | zenzio: the first Fullmetal Alchemist RPG was a good example |
| 11:41.59 | Amarande | Kingdom Hearts becomes more and more that way with every incarnation too |
| 11:42.26 | ZorbaTHut | there's a huge difference between JRPGs and CRPGs. They're essentially different genres. |
| 11:42.46 | Amarande | Yeah, and the classical JRPG type seems to be pretty much dead |
| 11:42.51 | ZorbaTHut | Then we've got the current breed of what I'd term "single-player MMORPGs" which are yet another new genre. |
| 11:42.53 | Amarande | FF13 may be its last hurrah |
| 11:42.56 | ZorbaTHut | the classic JRPG is evolving |
| 11:43.00 | ZorbaTHut | TWEWY, for example |
| 11:43.07 | ZorbaTHut | we got tired of the old mechanics and so now they're branching out pretty heavily. |
| 11:43.12 | Amarande | at least, on non-handheld platforms |
| 11:43.52 | ZorbaTHut | today's gamers want more complex and deeper game mechanics, the JRPG genre largely branched into handheld and into tactical things like Disgaea, The Last Remnant, and Valkyria Chronicles |
| 11:44.17 | Amarande | also: why do things work on handhelds that don't work on full-size screen consoles? |
| 11:44.18 | ZorbaTHut | classic JRPGs are dead because people started to realize the battles were basically timesinks |
| 11:44.30 | Amarande | if anything, I would think RPGs would suck on handhelds |
| 11:44.41 | ZorbaTHut | (I both blame and credit FF8/FF9/FF10/FF12 for driving that in like a brick) |
| 11:44.58 | Amarande | mainly due to the fact that long games that encourage playing long stretches at a time (especially when a save point system is used) |
| 11:45.03 | ZorbaTHut | (there is no way you can play any of those games without realizing that 2/3 of the game is a goddamn timesink) |
| 11:45.04 | Amarande | and handhelds with limited battery life |
| 11:45.05 | Amarande | do not really mix |
| 11:45.20 | ZorbaTHut | handhelds have far longer battery life than most people's gaming chunks are |
| 11:45.27 | ZorbaTHut | the DS flavors all get >8hr |
| 11:45.30 | Amarande | Zorba: and yet games like Nocturne and Digital Devil Saga are revered by the RPG fandom |
| 11:45.43 | Amarande | those have even *fewer* story scenes (though still quite deep story) |
| 11:45.49 | Amarande | and basically *the entire game* is grinding |
| 11:46.11 | Amarande | Zorba: DS, yeah. PSP, not so much |
| 11:46.14 | Amarande | let's put it this way |
| 11:46.21 | Amarande | I even bought a double capacity third party battery for my PSP |
| 11:46.46 | Amarande | figured the PSP would be sufficient entertainment when I was riding the limo and plane and sitting in the airport on my way to Dragon Con this year |
| 11:46.54 | ZorbaTHut | the psp is basically a dead platform at this point, I think the new psp is going to be either its salvation or its death knell |
| 11:46.55 | Amarande | I had FULLY charged the battery the night before I left |
| 11:47.01 | ZorbaTHut | but in any case the original disc psp is not going anywhere now |
| 11:47.25 | Amarande | the battery died while I was sitting in Kennedy and still had an hour or so to wait for my flight, and I had to buy a book anyway. |
| 11:47.38 | ZorbaTHut | I actually haven't played Digital Devil Saga yet, though it's on my list. I've heard people say the battles are more complex than Final Fantasy's |
| 11:47.53 | Amarande | yeah, the battles are more strategic, but basically 9/10ths of the game is battles. |
| 11:48.02 | ZorbaTHut | on the other hand, I brought my DS with me to Europe, and played it pretty much constantly on the plane, and it was still fine on landing :) |
| 11:48.22 | ZorbaTHut | yeah, but that's what I'm saying - it's not a timesink if it's fun and/or interesting |
| 11:48.34 | ZorbaTHut | and what's the other 1/10, unskippable cutscenes? ;) |
| 11:48.44 | Amarande | yeah, for the most part it's pretty good and keeps you on your toes since things can very easily go south if you aren't |
| 11:48.52 | Jerub | man, i'm missing on a great converstaion |
| 11:48.55 | Amarande | the other 1/10 or so is cutscenes, I forget if they're skippable off the top of my head |
| 11:49.04 | ZorbaTHut | really, if it's 9/10 "fun combat" and 1/10 "plot" I'm totally fine with it |
| 11:49.06 | Jerub | i /hate/ cutscenes. |
| 11:49.14 | Jerub | especially unskippable ones. |
| 11:49.17 | Amarande | although, there are times when it gets boring and grindy, like getting ready for Satan or Hitoshura |
| 11:49.19 | ZorbaTHut | the problem is that the FF8-FF12 games were 8/10 "unfun combat" and 2/10 "plot" |
| 11:49.26 | Amarande | Let's put it this way. |
| 11:49.30 | industrial | Anyone here use Windows Mobile and Google Sync? How do I sync more then one calendar? |
| 11:49.34 | *** join/#wowuidev mojosdojo (n=gdbzet26@p4FEFCBF2.dip.t-dialin.net) |
| 11:49.34 | ZorbaTHut | jerub, never play FFX |
| 11:49.35 | ZorbaTHut | my god |
| 11:49.36 | Amarande | Hitoshura is thought to be the single most difficult boss battle in all RPGdom. |
| 11:49.39 | ZorbaTHut | I used to make dinner, then go to play that game |
| 11:49.45 | Jerub | actually, some are good. |
| 11:49.47 | ZorbaTHut | frequently by the time I could actually do anything, I'd have finished eating. |
| 11:49.55 | Jerub | privateer II had cutscenes I skipped gameplay to see. |
| 11:50.10 | Amarande | Zorba: yeah, that's the one thing that usually bugs me about JRPGs and is probably a major reason I find it so hard to get started on a new game |
| 11:50.10 | ZorbaTHut | I need to go cheat my ass off through Privateer II someday |
| 11:50.15 | Jerub | Amarande: really? I thought frogger was. |
| 11:50.24 | ZorbaTHut | I was better at making money than at fighting, and unfortunately they scaled fight difficulty based on moneymaking ability :( |
| 11:50.26 | Jerub | ZorbaTHut: impossible these days. it's a DOS game. |
| 11:50.28 | Amarande | you need to set aside so much time on the first session before you can even really do anything |
| 11:50.29 | Jerub | probably one of the last of the DOS games. |
| 11:50.36 | ZorbaTHut | pfft, possible. emulators, etc. |
| 11:50.37 | Amarande | Jerub: Frogger isn't an RPG. :) |
| 11:50.42 | ZorbaTHut | if it's not possible today it'll be possible eventually. |
| 11:50.49 | Jerub | ZorbaTHut: it requires a 3d accelerator, sound, cd drive and DOS. |
| 11:50.53 | Jerub | didn't work in win95 |
| 11:51.03 | Arrowmaster | should work fine in dosbox then |
| 11:51.04 | Jerub | Amarande: I meant the boss after patchwork. |
| 11:51.14 | ZorbaTHut | dosbox handles all of that but the 3d accelerator. Glide wasn't all that complex. It'll exist again someday. |
| 11:51.19 | Amarande | Jerub: we're talking inherent difficulty here |
| 11:51.19 | Jerub | Arrowmaster: dosbox will give a 3d accelerator? |
| 11:51.25 | Amarande | not "how to make 24 people not act like retards at the same time" |
| 11:51.29 | Arrowmaster | i thought it did |
| 11:51.39 | Amarande | Okay. Here's the first thing about Hitoshura. |
| 11:51.40 | Amarande | He is not alone |
| 11:51.44 | Arrowmaster | i got some really old games to run in dosbox |
| 11:51.44 | Amarande | He always has two buddies with him. |
| 11:51.51 | ZorbaTHut | apparently people have gotten dosbox priv2 to work |
| 11:51.59 | ZorbaTHut | honestly, I think priv2 probably supports software rendering |
| 11:51.59 | Amarande | Between him and his buddies, Serious Punishment gets thrown your way to kick your ass. |
| 11:52.02 | Amarande | This is normal. |
| 11:52.06 | Amarande | Now here's where it gets fun. |
| 11:52.18 | Amarande | You are not allowed to use any sort of effect or skill that gives you immunity to any of this sort of ass kicking. |
| 11:52.25 | Amarande | If you do, Hitoshura's next act will be Gaia Rage. |
| 11:52.40 | *** join/#wowuidev kd3 (n=kd3@wikia/kaydeethree) |
| 11:52.54 | Amarande | This deals about eighteen thousand unavoidable (we'll get to this later) damage to the entire party, in a game where HP maxes at three digits. |
| 11:52.59 | Amarande | Needless to say, this WILL kick your ass. :) |
| 11:53.24 | ZorbaTHut | amarande, this sounds like an optional boss, though :) |
| 11:53.35 | Jerub | ZorbaTHut: i have the privateer2 box at home. |
| 11:53.37 | Amarande | Also, if you do not kill off his buddies in a timely manner, eventually one will sacrifice itself to heal Hitoshura back to full. So you must keep killing his buddies regularly. |
| 11:53.43 | Jerub | it's probably one of the last games i have the box for still. |
| 11:54.22 | Amarande | Every third buddy he summons (counting the two he starts with), will cast Dormina to put your party to sleep, and then Hitoshura will use Gaia Rage to kick your ass. |
| 11:54.22 | Amarande | Basically, the entire battle revolves around being |
| 11:54.26 | Amarande | a) lucky enough that instant death spells don't kick your ass |
| 11:54.48 | Amarande | and b) having the "dodge 100% while asleep" ability equipped, and hoping that every time he summons that third buddy, Dormina puts someone to sleep so that Gaia Rage doesn't kick your ass. |
| 11:54.57 | Amarande | Hard. As. Hell. |
| 11:55.24 | Jerub | Amarande: meh. |
| 11:55.28 | ZorbaTHut | that sounds mostly "grindy and crummy" in some ways. I mean, it's not player skill there |
| 11:55.38 | ZorbaTHut | it's just "grind your stats all to fuck, then cross your fingers and push butan" |
| 11:55.40 | Amarande | Satan is almost as hard, but not quite ... without giving it away, Satan revolves around having to keep precise track of his HP and what the current round number modulo 4 is, and planning the battle exactly, while Hitoshura revolves around luck |
| 11:55.56 | Jerub | again, eh. |
| 11:55.58 | Jerub | er meh. |
| 11:56.23 | Jerub | that's just a game mechanic fight. |
| 11:56.31 | Amarande | and yeah, both are optional bosses |
| 11:56.31 | Jerub | it's got nothing to do with rpgs |
| 11:56.38 | Amarande | actually, the most irritating thing about satan is the damned two rare drops |
| 11:56.44 | Amarande | in order to fight Satan, you have to have fought Seth first |
| 11:56.51 | Amarande | in order to fight Seth, you have to first fight Vishnu and Shiva |
| 11:57.01 | Amarande | in order to fight Vishnu and Shiva, you have to get the two items that open the doors to the rooms they're in |
| 11:57.05 | Wobin | ...current number modulo 4? |
| 11:57.07 | Amarande | and both items are rare drops from enemies that are also rare :| |
| 11:57.18 | Wobin | who the fuck thought -that- mechanic up =P |
| 11:57.32 | Jerub | I want more golden age echos. |
| 11:57.40 | Amarande | Wobin: yeah, Satan's attack pattern (and his elemental resistances) is fixed in a four-round repeating cycle |
| 11:57.48 | Amarande | and he gains new attacks when going below 1/2 and 1/4 of his HP |
| 11:57.50 | Jerub | quest for glory, fallout1/2. |
| 11:57.58 | Wobin | oh man QfG |
| 11:58.01 | Wobin | I <3 those games |
| 11:58.06 | Amarande | and if he has a turn with HP below 1,500 (he starts with 30,000) he will use Diarahan to heal to full |
| 11:58.07 | Wobin | the music was awesome |
| 11:58.26 | Wobin | esp QfG4 where it was all gypsy and gothic |
| 11:58.42 | Jerub | Amarande: I do'nt understand anything you're saying. it's all just "fight the game designer" combat mechanics. |
| 11:58.56 | Jerub | Wobin: yeah, that was fucking incredible. |
| 11:59.00 | ZorbaTHut | and yeah I agree with jerub here, those mechanics kind of suck ;) |
| 11:59.00 | Wobin | I also remember taping down the spacebar in the Thieves guild to level up climbing =P |
| 11:59.05 | Amarande | Jerub: isn't that pretty much every RPG boss, though? |
| 11:59.17 | Jerub | Wobin: you know how the voice actors would often go off-script? apparently they just adlib'd half the crap because it sounded better. |
| 11:59.23 | Amarande | really every game boss, in general |
| 11:59.26 | Jerub | Amarande: not all rpgs have "bosses" |
| 11:59.30 | Amarande | and c'mon, you have to admit it's better than Mega Man |
| 11:59.31 | Wobin | Jerub, highly entertaining =) |
| 11:59.38 | Jerub | Amarande: and not all rpgs require that you fight the desginer, some just require you play a game! |
| 12:00.02 | Amarande | Mega Man: "hey, we'll give you all these worlds you can feel free to visit in any order but if you don't do it in just the right order you won't have the right items when you hit each boss and it will kick your ass" |
| 12:00.07 | Jerub | Amarande: I've never played megaman, and i've played a tiny handful of jrpgs. |
| 12:00.17 | Wobin | http://l-userpic.livejournal.com/90390697/309140 |
| 12:00.26 | Amarande | Jerub: in a single player game, aren't you always playing against the game designer? |
| 12:00.27 | ZorbaTHut | yeah, early Mega Mans had that problem. In the more recent ones you can usually kill any boss with your basic weapon, if you're good. |
| 12:00.34 | Amarande | the designer poses a challenge to which you respond. :) |
| 12:00.37 | Amarande | that's called 'game design' |
| 12:00.43 | krka | you could kill bosses in megaman 1 in any order though |
| 12:00.45 | ZorbaTHut | if the designer's good, then you are, but you don't realize it. :) |
| 12:00.50 | ZorbaTHut | fight the boss, not the designer. |
| 12:00.57 | ZorbaTHut | those are very definite "game designer is your enemy" fights. |
| 12:01.34 | Jerub | or, in many cases, |
| 12:01.38 | Jerub | "the publisher of the game guide" |
| 12:01.53 | Amarande | I guess I just mean that 'fight the boss, not the designer' is silly, because the boss fights the way it does because the game designer designed it that way |
| 12:01.56 | ZorbaTHut | yeah, ff12 had a horrible case of that |
| 12:01.58 | Amarande | therefore, you're fighting the designer in any case |
| 12:02.05 | ZorbaTHut | the Ultimate Weapon could be gotten only by *avoiding* four specific containers in the world |
| 12:02.13 | Jerub | Amarande: I think really the point I'm trying to make is that you're ranting about stupid game mechanics as a result of a conversation about RPGs. which is the core of the RPG problem at the moment. |
| 12:02.18 | Wobin | ZorbaTHut, that's... terrible |
| 12:02.20 | ZorbaTHut | they were completely unmarked, and if you accidentally opened them, you could never get the ultimate weapon. |
| 12:02.21 | Jerub | I want to play a Role. In a Game. |
| 12:02.24 | Amarande | Zorba: I think you also had a chance of getting it even if you did open those containers |
| 12:02.33 | Amarande | however, it would take you a long, long, long long long long time |
| 12:02.35 | Jerub | playing a player in a jrpg isn't what i want. |
| 12:02.41 | ZorbaTHut | amarande, something like 1/10000 from an unmarked enemy in the bottom of an otherwise-unremarkable dungeon. |
| 12:02.52 | Amarande | it was like a 1% (or was it 0.1%?) chance from a chest that only had a random chance to be there or not each time you went to where it was |
| 12:02.58 | Wobin | I get irritated at jrpgs at times |
| 12:02.59 | Amarande | and you had to move two screens away to make the screen respawn |
| 12:03.07 | Wobin | I want to whap the main character upside the head for being whiny |
| 12:03.12 | ZorbaTHut | ah, yeah, that's what it was. 1% chance of the chest being there, 1% chance of it dropping the item. something like that. |
| 12:03.21 | Wobin | it's not really role playing when I don't relate in any way to the main character =P |
| 12:03.24 | Amarande | and really, that was only one of the ultimate weapons anyway |
| 12:03.26 | ZorbaTHut | wobin, you should play twewy, the main character is totally whiny and everyone else whaps him upside the head for it constantly |
| 12:03.28 | ZorbaTHut | it's fantastic |
| 12:03.39 | Wobin | Amarande, Clearly it's not ultimate enough =P |
| 12:03.51 | Amarande | Zorba: the main character is totally whiny and everyone else whaps him upside the head ... you know, that sounds like FFX |
| 12:03.55 | ZorbaTHut | but really that's one of the big differences between JRPGs and CRPGs |
| 12:04.01 | ZorbaTHut | in CRPGs you're playing a character |
| 12:04.09 | Wobin | CRPGs? |
| 12:04.10 | ZorbaTHut | in JRPGs you're watching a story |
| 12:04.16 | ZorbaTHut | computer RPGs, things like Fallout |
| 12:04.17 | Amarande | as for the zodiac spear, I'm trying to remember what the punishment for not having it was |
| 12:04.20 | Wobin | ah |
| 12:04.22 | Wobin | yeah |
| 12:04.22 | Amarande | besides just plain not having it |
| 12:04.29 | Amarande | I can't remember if it screwed you out of license points or not |
| 12:04.50 | ZorbaTHut | you're not really meant to be saying "I don't empathize with the person and cannot play him properly", you're meant to be rooting for him or whatever. Same deal with someone whiny in a movie. |
| 12:04.54 | Amarande | a few of the 'ultimate' gear items were such that you HAD to have a character spend the license points on them, whether you wanted to or not, simply in order to access one of the Quickening spaces |
| 12:05.12 | Amarande | and since everyone had to use three DIFFERENT quickenings, you had to access all 18 if you wanted everyone to have 3 |
| 12:05.18 | Wobin | ZorbaTHut, I usually can't wait til they get eaten by the zombies |
| 12:05.22 | Amarande | but I can't remember if Zodiac Spear was in front of a quickening or not |
| 12:05.38 | Wobin | (in the movie) |
| 12:05.41 | ZorbaTHut | amarande, you weren't really hurting for LP in that game, though |
| 12:05.42 | Wobin | cause it was bound to happen |
| 12:05.46 | ZorbaTHut | you could just get everything and be done with it |
| 12:05.55 | Wobin | it's like being african american in a horror movie |
| 12:05.55 | Amarande | Zorba: well, yes and no |
| 12:05.58 | Amarande | LP were unlimited |
| 12:06.00 | ZorbaTHut | (another problem with the game, IMHO :P) |
| 12:06.01 | Wobin | (and not the main character) |
| 12:06.09 | Amarande | but in my experience getting them was incredibly boringly grindy |
| 12:06.32 | Amarande | actually it was the LP grind that ended up causing me to take a break and then forget to go back |
| 12:06.56 | Amarande | seriously I once had a 999 chain and it bought so very little compared to how long it took to gain the LP |
| 12:07.07 | Amarande | they really should have made chains give bonus LP |
| 12:07.32 | Amarande | also getting that 999 chain was so mindless too |
| 12:07.42 | Amarande | literally, all I did was move the analogue stick while IRCing |
| 12:07.44 | Jerub | i dunno what wow is. |
| 12:07.47 | Amarande | and not really even paying all that much attention to the game. |
| 12:07.53 | Jerub | i'm certainly not emphathising with my character. |
| 12:08.01 | Amarande | Jerub: wow is about two words |
| 12:08.03 | Amarande | "ooh shiny" |
| 12:08.04 | Jerub | but in fallout[123], qfg, i would certainly do. |
| 12:08.23 | Amarande | I mean, how many people really do raids for the characters and story? |
| 12:08.26 | Amarande | maybe the first time or two |
| 12:08.36 | Amarande | once it's on farm, it's all about the loot though |
| 12:08.48 | Wobin | wow is more the MMO part of the MMORPG section |
| 12:08.57 | Wobin | I only play it for the social factor |
| 12:09.03 | Amarande | indeed, that's kind of a sad commentary on WoW |
| 12:09.13 | ZorbaTHut | the real problem with the Fallout games is that they are very hard to make. there's no company that exists that I'd trust to make those reliably. Even Bethesda, as far as I'm concerned, has only made a good game once, ever, at most. |
| 12:09.14 | Amarande | Blizzard went to so much effort to create a vibrant world with tons of lore and important characters |
| 12:09.17 | Amarande | and you know what, in the end? |
| 12:09.23 | Amarande | Arthas is a pinata. A fucking PINATA. |
| 12:09.35 | Amarande | at least as far as the vast majority of the playerbase cares. |
| 12:09.49 | ZorbaTHut | (I haven't actually played Fallout 3 yet so I'm giving them the benefit of the doubt, but Oblivion and Morrowind were IMHO atrocious) |
| 12:09.52 | Amarande | a nicely rendered graphical pinata, but a pinata nonetheless. |
| 12:09.59 | Kalroth | Well the vast majority of the playerbase doesn't care about excessive lore |
| 12:10.01 | ZorbaTHut | amarande, news flash, people play games for different reasons |
| 12:10.09 | Amarande | Zorba: indeed |
| 12:10.18 | *** join/#wowuidev Wobble (n=Wobin@124-168-165-210.dyn.iinet.net.au) |
| 12:10.21 | ZorbaTHut | that's really WoW's strength more than anything else |
| 12:10.25 | Amarande | however, all the non-loot reasons to deal with Arthas pretty much are taken care of in the first one or two kills :) |
| 12:10.28 | ZorbaTHut | it allows so many different play styles |
| 12:10.30 | Amarande | after that, it's about getting the shinies |
| 12:10.42 | Jerub | ZorbaTHut: fallout3 goes a long way into making you feel part of the role. |
| 12:10.45 | ZorbaTHut | (all of which are full of people claiming their style is the only style and calling everyone who disagrees with them homosexuals) |
| 12:10.50 | Jerub | ZorbaTHut: but it does it in the same way as oblivion |
| 12:10.52 | Wobin | bah |
| 12:11.07 | Kalroth | ZorbaTHut: raidz or gtfo fgt! |
| 12:11.18 | ZorbaTHut | jerub, see, my role in oblivion was, as near as I can tell, "the only actual human being in a city full of boring people with boring quests and a lot of really excitingly boring and slow backend code" |
| 12:11.31 | Wobin | I was just trying to fit "For .g...The.." what? |
| 12:11.37 | ZorbaTHut | kalroth lol if you dont arena ur a fagt lol |
| 12:11.39 | Amarande | yeah, Oblivion seemed a step down from Morrowind, sadly :( |
| 12:11.49 | Wobin | Amarande, it was -terrible- =( |
| 12:11.52 | Kalroth | ZorbaTHut: Oh true, PvPers are usually worse than raiders |
| 12:11.55 | ZorbaTHut | amarande, my role in Morrowind was the same, except the backend code wasn't even interesting. |
| 12:12.02 | Amarande | the worst thing was Oblivion basically -forced- you to play a fighter |
| 12:12.03 | Wobin | I think DA:O is what Oblivion should have been |
| 12:12.19 | Amarande | oh, sure, it allowed you the option to be a thief or archer or mage |
| 12:12.24 | Amarande | it's just that those options, kinda, well, sucked |
| 12:12.35 | Wobin | Zero Punctuation reviewed Oblivion so well |
| 12:13.06 | zenzio | Wobin: how so? I find DA:O and Oblivion to be two different types of games |
| 12:13.19 | Amarande | you couldn't really be an archer, because you had no tank and thus you were forced into melee long before the mob was dead |
| 12:13.21 | Wobin | maybe not exchangable |
| 12:13.26 | zenzio | after work today I need to figure out how to make my party survive Broodmother :( |
| 12:13.28 | Amarande | which basically meant as an archer you pretty much had to be the fighter or thief archetype as well |
| 12:13.31 | Wobin | but in the spirit of how epic it was supposed to be |
| 12:13.42 | Amarande | you couldn't really be a mage for two reasons |
| 12:13.44 | Kalroth | zenzio: need more fire resist |
| 12:13.45 | zenzio | Wobin: in that aspect I might agree |
| 12:14.02 | Amarande | 1) it took you many hours into the game before you actually had spare cash to BUY any spells in the FIRST PLACE |
| 12:14.06 | Wobin | http://www.escapistmagazine.com/videos/view/zero-punctuation/75-Oblivion |
| 12:14.14 | Amarande | because all your cash normally went to just keeping your gear non-broken |
| 12:14.51 | Amarande | and 2) there were all kinds of restrictions placed on being a mage, basically you had to do a chain of sidequests about half as long as the game itself, before you were even allowed things that were basic staples in Morrowind like enchanting and spellmaking |
| 12:14.53 | Jerub | Amarande: uh, my wife played all through oblivion as an archer. |
| 12:15.16 | Amarande | therefore, if you wanted to be a mage, you had to basically have one of the fighter or thief archetypes for most of the game anyway before you were even able to be an effective mage (which kinda ruined the point) |
| 12:15.45 | Amarande | and the problem with not being a fighter in general? |
| 12:15.57 | Amarande | mainly that you needed heavy armor to not die horribly, at least as far as I could tell |
| 12:16.02 | zenzio | I remember selling thousands of arrows individually to level mercantile... |
| 12:16.11 | Kalroth | hahah |
| 12:16.22 | Amarande | if you weren't a fighter build, you didn't have the Strength in the early game to both wear armor and be able to carry enough loot back to town to sell to keep that armor in repair |
| 12:16.45 | Amarande | and since the game PUNISHES you HEAVILY for leveling up more than a little bit |
| 12:16.53 | Amarande | at least as far as the main quest is concerned |
| 12:16.55 | Amarande | that's bad. |
| 12:17.29 | Amarande | by punishes you heavily, I mean the game would level up monsters with you but not NPC allies |
| 12:17.43 | Amarande | so basically, you level more than a little bit beyond what an area was designed for, & you're screwed |
| 12:17.50 | Wobin | zenzio, also, I -really- wished that Oblivion had more voice acting |
| 12:17.56 | Wobin | instead of everyone sounding the same =( |
| 12:17.58 | Jerub | Amarande: you are talking about a game i don't remember playing. |
| 12:18.08 | Wobin | unlike DA:O |
| 12:18.18 | Jerub | Amarande: I found playing a mage or an archer in oblivion easy to do... |
| 12:18.23 | Amarande | I'm thinking if I should get DA:O soon or wait till after my next round of upgrades |
| 12:18.35 | Amarande | Jerub, how did you manage to play a mage without having to be something else for basically the first half or so of the game? |
| 12:18.44 | Jerub | Amarande: the first hour maybe. |
| 12:18.57 | Jerub | you get a fire spell, and you cast it all the time. done. |
| 12:19.10 | Amarande | yeah, if you want to basically be an archer who uses spells instead of arrows yeah |
| 12:19.16 | Amarande | if you want to really play a mage, though, it's kinda a problem |
| 12:19.30 | Amarande | because of the cost of spells, and all the shit you had to do for the mages guild before you could even get anything decent magely |
| 12:19.40 | ZorbaTHut | man, I don't always agree with Yahtzee, but he got Oblivion dead-on |
| 12:19.41 | Wobin | I really wanted to play a monk in Morrowind |
| 12:19.44 | Kalroth | so a mage that uses fire spells isn't a real mage? :p |
| 12:19.49 | Wobin | But having to kill people twice drove me insane =P |
| 12:19.58 | *** join/#wowuidev Aelo (n=chatzill@81.170.71.202) |
| 12:20.01 | Wobin | ZorbaTHut, in that review, absolutely =) |
| 12:20.26 | Amarande | Kalroth: when I think a 'mage', I'm assuming that you use magic heavily in general during your adventuring, not just throwing fireballs to kill things and otherwise just playing the way an archer would |
| 12:20.44 | Wobin | I don't always agree with yahtzee, but he -does- have a talent of picking out the irritating things in games. |
| 12:20.52 | Jerub | ZorbaTHut: you know yahtzee is local to me, right? |
| 12:21.03 | Amarande | and Oblivion was really tedious when it came to things like getting a reasonably sized arsenal of spells |
| 12:21.14 | Kalroth | Amarande: I know what you mean, but "just throwing fireballs" is relying heavily on magic :p |
| 12:21.19 | Amarande | and really, when it came to anything that cost money in general, unless you played a Strength oriented build |
| 12:21.38 | Amarande | because stuff sold for shit pretty much so you had to drag back half the dungeon with you just to repair your armor let alone have money to spare |
| 12:21.47 | zenzio | <Wobin> zenzio, also, I -really- wished that Oblivion had more voice acting <-- totally agree, that's one of my main issues with Oblivion |
| 12:21.58 | Amarande | no more killing a dremora or two getting you set for life like morrowind |
| 12:22.04 | ZorbaTHut | jerub, I've actually run into him a few times, he came to the last GDC and we went to the same panel at one point |
| 12:22.08 | ZorbaTHut | ironically, he didn't say a lot. |
| 12:22.13 | zenzio | I enjoyed Oblivion a lot because I ektp running around for days doing stuff before realising that "hey, this isn't the main quest" |
| 12:22.26 | zenzio | kept |
| 12:22.30 | Jerub | ZorbaTHut: he's actually a very withdrawn person ;) |
| 12:22.35 | Amarande | zenzio: and then finding the main quest impossible because of the aforementioned issue I mentioned with NPC allies and leveling? :) |
| 12:22.35 | Wobin | ZorbaTHut, he doesn't work well unscripted =) |
| 12:22.54 | Wobin | You can tell by watching his 'live' ones |
| 12:23.29 | zenzio | Amarande: actually no, I didn't have trouble with that as far as the main quest went... but my first attempt was a character of the thief kind which had zero health and armor, and could only kill by repeatedly backstabbing |
| 12:23.37 | zenzio | so there the leveling defeated me |
| 12:24.30 | Jerub | oh goodness. |
| 12:24.40 | Jerub | half the members of my lug are joining my guild :/ |
| 12:24.49 | Amarande | anyway, the thing I notice about gaming, regarding the whole business issue |
| 12:24.53 | Amarande | is that it seems like there are two types of games |
| 12:24.54 | Jerub | was hoping to conceal his addicted nature a few more months. |
| 12:25.05 | Jerub | might move his main toon to that raiding guild that's been trying to recruit him. |
| 12:25.05 | Amarande | a) games that *hundreds of thousands of people* play and that are usually dumbed down to be saleable to those masses |
| 12:25.10 | Amarande | and b) games that no one plays. |
| 12:25.14 | zenzio | Jerub: tell them it's not you but a fork |
| 12:25.46 | zenzio | Amarande: by and large, yeah |
| 12:26.00 | ZorbaTHut | amarande, honestly, you really need to hit up the indie game scene |
| 12:26.09 | zenzio | I loved Operation Flashpoint (the original) |
| 12:26.10 | Amarande | basically, how do you get people to play your game once you've designed it, if you don't have a marketing engine like corps do? |
| 12:26.12 | ZorbaTHut | there are many, *many* profitable and popular games out there |
| 12:26.41 | Amarande | It used to be that design was all about building the better mousetrap. |
| 12:27.02 | Amarande | Now it's all about gutting the funds you use to build your mousetrap and using them instead to market your mousetrap, while the person who actually built the better one has nothing left to use for promotion. |
| 12:27.16 | jnwhiteh | Anyone here very familiar with the way ld finds dynamic libraries on Linux? |
| 12:27.23 | *** join/#wowuidev Movix (n=Movix@mail.schiffmann.fr) |
| 12:27.37 | Amarande | jnwhiteh: not really. all I know is that moving the ld.so is a very, very, very bad thing |
| 12:27.38 | zenzio | you also need to use marketing correctly, ie. *not* go claiming "<lead developer> will make you his bitch" |
| 12:27.47 | Jerub | jnwhiteh: a little. are you compiling samba? |
| 12:27.51 | jnwhiteh | I'm compiling something with -lelf and it's rejecting the 64-bit version (as it should, it's -m32 as well), but not finding the lib in /usr/lib/libelf.so.1 |
| 12:28.02 | Amarande | and yes, once I made that mistake. |
| 12:28.06 | jnwhiteh | and I suspect if I moved it to libelf.so it would find it, but I can't do that |
| 12:28.12 | Amarande | back when I tried to manually upgrade one machine to glibc from source |
| 12:28.21 | Amarande | I forgot to set PREFIX properly when compiling glibc |
| 12:28.29 | Amarande | everything ended up in /usr/local/lib instead of /usr/lib where I wanted it |
| 12:28.34 | Amarande | so I tried moving it back there |
| 12:28.36 | jnwhiteh | ack! |
| 12:28.46 | Amarande | and apparently, the moment I moved ld-linux.so.2 from /usr/local/lib to /lib |
| 12:28.48 | Amarande | let's just say |
| 12:28.49 | Jerub | jnwhiteh: have you tried -l/usr/lib ? |
| 12:28.50 | Amarande | Things Stopped Working |
| 12:29.04 | jnwhiteh | Jerub: -L you mean? |
| 12:29.20 | Amarande | that's probably the worst case of FAIL I've ever had as a Linux user. |
| 12:29.41 | jnwhiteh | Jerub: if so, then yes.. and that doesn't fix it.. |
| 12:30.06 | jnwhiteh | Jerub: the issue is the name of libelf.so.1 |
| 12:30.11 | jnwhiteh | if I move it to /tmp/lib/libelf.so |
| 12:30.16 | jnwhiteh | and -L/tmp/lib, then it works properly |
| 12:30.21 | Jerub | ooh, right. |
| 12:30.40 | Amarande | Zorba: is there still a place for the classical story-driven RPG, or is that genre not going to be rising from the dead? |
| 12:30.51 | Jerub | wonders why he's bothering with correct css when he's generating a pdf from his html. |
| 12:31.16 | ZorbaTHut | amarande, I think if you don't want some kind of tactical game in it, it's largely gone. If you're okay with a tactical game in it, it's alive and well. |
| 12:31.40 | ZorbaTHut | Or some kind of more interesting combat than old FF-style, at least. |
| 12:31.48 | Amarande | Odd ... that would mean the Gold Box and older Ultima games' style would actually have a better chance of revival than old FF :) |
| 12:31.59 | Amarande | And yet, it seems nobody tries to revive those two, if anything people try the FF style more |
| 12:32.26 | Amarande | Gold Box and Ultima III-V all had tactical grid based battle |
| 12:32.53 | Wobin | U7 was good |
| 12:33.14 | Amarande | Yeah, Ultima VII Serpent Isle in particular was one of my favorites ever |
| 12:33.19 | Wobin | this ^ |
| 12:33.43 | Amarande | I guess I wonder, whatever happened to those long, complex stories? |
| 12:33.57 | Wobin | instant gratification generation |
| 12:34.14 | Amarande | bah |
| 12:34.21 | Jerub | I liked 6 better than 7 |
| 12:34.24 | Amarande | someone should make a general agreement to *not* cater to Joe Sixpack and his family |
| 12:34.25 | Jerub | call me strange. |
| 12:34.53 | Amarande | although that's kinda saying that joe sixpack doesn't have a right to entertainment I guess, which might be being heavily elitist |
| 12:34.54 | Wobin | Hey Jerub |
| 12:34.56 | Jerub | Ultima had a great mechanic i always loved. glass swords. "having trouble killing something, use a glass sword and just kill the bastard" |
| 12:35.23 | Wobin | You're strange! |
| 12:35.32 | ZorbaTHut | the stories went away because people realized they might as well just read a book instead |
| 12:35.36 | Amarande | Jerub: except for the enemies (in VII and IX at least) that glass swords didn't work on :P |
| 12:35.39 | ZorbaTHut | also, the content issue reared its ugly head |
| 12:35.47 | Amarande | Zorba: is passively reading a book actually *better* though? |
| 12:35.53 | ZorbaTHut | as graphics improve, people expect better graphics. really long stories tend to be *very* expensive in terms of content. |
| 12:35.54 | Wobin | enjoys it |
| 12:35.58 | Amarande | actually in general, is noninteractive entertainment simply a better idea? |
| 12:36.01 | ZorbaTHut | amarande, it's far cheaper to make, and far cheaper to buy. |
| 12:36.17 | ZorbaTHut | it's difficult to make the economics work out for huge story games. |
| 12:36.18 | Wobin | It's a lot less stressful =) |
| 12:36.31 | Amarande | that basically, the desire to make something interactive is a foolish idea and one is better off writing a straight novel? |
| 12:36.51 | Wobin | Amarande, too many games are like that nowadays |
| 12:37.00 | ZorbaTHut | amarande, nope. I think interactivity is awesome |
| 12:37.14 | Wobin | You essentially end up playing a noninteractive story due to lack of choice, or railroading of options |
| 12:37.14 | ZorbaTHut | but it's tough to justify when the userbase is so restricted. |
| 12:37.23 | Jerub | WoW has no options. |
| 12:37.26 | Amarande | (and yet, even novels are kinda in a sort of slump lately ... plus they have the lifespan of night-blooming cereus, pretty much, Laurell K. Hamilton's blog indicates that the average novel has a commercial lifespan of about six weeks before it goes to be recycled and pretty much goes out of print ...) |
| 12:37.26 | Jerub | that's what shits me. |
| 12:37.30 | ZorbaTHut | Especially since you end up having to make something *very very long* in order to make it sufficiently bulky. |
| 12:37.40 | Jerub | no options, no ability to take consequences of quest failure. |
| 12:38.00 | Jerub | a lot of RPGs (and even simply plotline driven games) would show you in dramatic detail what your failure caused. |
| 12:38.06 | Wobin | Jerub, yeah, one of my friends was loving DA:O cause, as he said "Dialoge options actually MAKE A DIFFERENCE" |
| 12:38.13 | Amarande | What do you guys think of the old Lone Wolf/Fighting Fantasy type gamebook format? |
| 12:38.23 | Wobin | Amarande, I cheated a lot |
| 12:38.25 | ZorbaTHut | amarande, it was kind of neat, even though the stories were absolutely atrocious |
| 12:38.32 | Jerub | (destruction of everything you know and loved, epic death sequence, permanant character detriment) |
| 12:38.37 | ZorbaTHut | and so was the gameplay, really |
| 12:38.44 | Amarande | Zorba: Lone Wolf wasn't too bad |
| 12:38.49 | ZorbaTHut | Lone Wolf was as good as it got, and even Lone Wolf would just royally fuck you for not being psychic |
| 12:38.56 | krka | they should make wow in hardcore mode |
| 12:38.58 | Jerub | Amarande: FF was my very first pencil+paper RPG. I still have the book. |
| 12:38.58 | Amarande | other than the strings of That One Boss |
| 12:38.59 | krka | like old diablo |
| 12:38.59 | Wobin | I liked reading the lore books for those |
| 12:39.04 | ZorbaTHut | it was only "not too bad" compared to its alternatives, which . . . were worse |
| 12:39.05 | Amarande | Zakhan Kimah *shudder* |
| 12:39.06 | Jerub | krka: fuck, that'd be incredible. |
| 12:39.11 | Amarande | Chaos-Master *ohshit* |
| 12:39.30 | krka | level 60 toons would be rare i suppose |
| 12:39.40 | krka | auction house would actually be used for low level gear |
| 12:39.55 | Amarande | "You have the Sword of Win and Awesome that gives +8 to your combat skill, so we'll give the boss +10 to his combat skill AND HIS ENDURANCE compared to what you'd otherwise fight!" |
| 12:39.55 | Jerub | krka: i'd be afraid to step outside of ogrimmar without a healer in my party. |
| 12:39.59 | Wobin | Amarande, 'best seller' novels are like that, because they cater to the lowest common denominator |
| 12:40.03 | Wobin | point in case, Twilight |
| 12:40.20 | ZorbaTHut | amarande, yeah, Lone Wolf did that more than a few times. Oy. |
| 12:40.25 | Amarande | Chaos-Master sucked especially bad |
| 12:40.35 | ZorbaTHut | the Sommerswerd was really one of the biggest mistakes in that entire series. |
| 12:40.37 | Amarande | mainly because the alternative weapon you were given there if you didn't have the Sommerswerd ALSO GAVE +8 TO COMBAT SKILL |
| 12:40.43 | ZorbaTHut | it either should have been mandatory or nonexistent. |
| 12:40.43 | Jerub | in fact, that book is next to my bed. |
| 12:41.02 | Amarande | and the Chaos-Master took a 7 CS dive in addition when you used it instead of the SS |
| 12:41.12 | Amarande | All we can say about Chaos-Master is this |
| 12:41.28 | Amarande | "Died facing the Chaos Master twenty three female-parent-having-sex-with times." -- RPGnet, Let's Play Lone Wolf |
| 12:41.56 | Amarande | Trouble was, if you didn't take the Sommerswerd with you then the 38/46 fight at the end would kick your ass |
| 12:42.12 | Jerub | newbie who is installing wow for the first time. what addons should i tell him to get? |
| 12:42.24 | Jerub | QH, Auctioneer, Cartographer, is that enough? |
| 12:42.27 | Amarande | Jerub: cartographer and questguru, for starters |
| 12:42.31 | Amarande | and auctioneer, yeah |
| 12:42.32 | Wobin | not quest addons =( |
| 12:42.44 | Wobin | let them find out about quests by themselves |
| 12:42.47 | Amarande | Wobin: I'd recommend QG, at the least |
| 12:42.57 | ZorbaTHut | jerub, push him through at least five or ten levels without any quest addons, then show him questhelper and find out if he wants to use it. |
| 12:43.03 | Torhal | And replace Cartographer with Mapster and Cromulent and HandyNotes |
| 12:43.06 | Amarande | simply for the reason that QG makes it a lot more painless to find the guy who gave you the quest again, since it records the coordinates where you started the quest |
| 12:43.07 | Torhal | Cartographer is dead. |
| 12:43.21 | Amarande | also: omen |
| 12:43.29 | Amarande | he may not use it immediately, but will be expected to have it the first time he groups |
| 12:43.30 | Wobin | Vive le cartographiqe |
| 12:43.53 | Jerub | wait, cartographer is dead and it should be replaced by 3 other addons? |
| 12:43.55 | Wobin | Amarande, eh, not at that level |
| 12:44.06 | Jerub | meh. |
| 12:44.11 | Jerub | I didn't ever care about omen until 80 |
| 12:44.16 | Amarande | heh |
| 12:44.19 | Amarande | actually, in a way |
| 12:44.24 | Amarande | omen is more important before 80 than after |
| 12:44.30 | Amarande | at least, when it comes to 5-mans |
| 12:44.31 | Wobin | Jerub, just because Cartographer is -one- addon doesn't mean it wasn't a terrible bloat of an addon |
| 12:44.35 | Jerub | you have the yellow/red halos, that's enough |
| 12:44.38 | Torhal | Jerub: Cartographer is dead. Mapster replaces the map portion. HandyNotes replaces the notes portion, and Cromulent is ripped straight from Cartographer - it's the map info overlay |
| 12:44.51 | Wobin | SexyMap |
| 12:44.52 | Jerub | Torhal: I don't know what those things are :/ |
| 12:45.07 | Torhal | Look them up. |
| 12:45.07 | Amarande | see, the thing is, at 80, in five-mans, you usually have a real tank, and unless there's a huge gear disparity (like T9 DPS and ilvl 187-200 tank maybe) you're not going to pull aggro in most boss fights |
| 12:45.33 | Amarande | before 80, on the other hand, you very frequently are going to be instancing with a tank who's either in dps-oriented gear or off-spec because they're in leveling gear/spec |
| 12:45.34 | Wobin | Amarande, but you have to play enough to -know- how to handle your aggro |
| 12:45.50 | Wobin | which you usually don't do until your third or fourth toon |
| 12:45.59 | Wobin | s/aggro/play properly/ |
| 12:46.00 | Amarande | i.e., you will much more often before 80 than at 80 be playing with a tank who's playing far enough below usual tank TPS potential that you have to worry |
| 12:46.26 | Jerub | my wife does poor TPS :( I swapped to healer gear earlier just to give her an easier time tanking :/ |
| 12:46.26 | Wobin | I don't actually remember what we're arguing about =P |
| 12:46.42 | Torhal | Wobin: Chicken or egg. Which came first. |
| 12:46.48 | Amarande | is thinking to be writing some gamebooks in the near future |
| 12:46.48 | Wobin | The egg |
| 12:47.00 | Amarande | wonders if I am a fool, or someone with a good vision :) |
| 12:47.04 | Wobin | CHickens had to evolve first |
| 12:47.10 | Wobin | before they were chickens |
| 12:47.14 | Torhal | Wobin: So what laid the egg? |
| 12:47.15 | Torhal | :D |
| 12:47.22 | Wobin | the prechicken =) |
| 12:47.23 | Amarande | I suppose I should try to avoid the difficulty balancing fails that gamebooks had in the 80s |
| 12:47.58 | Jerub | Amarande: meh, gamebooks are about plot . |
| 12:48.03 | Jerub | turn to page 24 to die. |
| 12:48.05 | Jerub | etc. |
| 12:48.11 | Wobin | one thing that always impressed me with stuff like M:TG and 40K and the like, is the amount of maths put into the balancing |
| 12:48.15 | Amarande | Zorba: as for the Sommerswerd, I think the trouble with that was that Dever didn't plan out the whole series' gameplay ahead of time |
| 12:48.44 | Wobin | maybe more for M:TG |
| 12:48.58 | Amarande | and then kinda overbalanced when he tried to account for it |
| 12:49.10 | Amarande | I think it's book 8 where it starts screwing you over |
| 12:49.17 | ZorbaTHut | well, he coulda fixed it |
| 12:49.26 | Jerub | Wobin: the only reason M:TG is balacned is the number o fcards that are invalid for tournament play. |
| 12:49.30 | ZorbaTHut | Do you have the Sommerswerd? If so go to page 112. Otherwise go to page 83 |
| 12:49.38 | Amarande | except the fun kicker is, in book 8 you HAD to have the Sommerswerd ANYWAY *despite* the fact that it screwed you over most of the time. |
| 12:49.39 | ZorbaTHut | 83: You find the Sommerswerd! It's totally awesome. Go to page 112. |
| 12:49.43 | Wobin | Jerub, well they had to =P It's such a huge library |
| 12:49.44 | ZorbaTHut | FIXED |
| 12:49.58 | Amarande | there is one reason why you needed it |
| 12:50.20 | Amarande | http://www.projectaon.org/en/xhtml/lw/08tjoh/sect13.htm This. |
| 12:50.24 | Wobin | was the Sommerswerd a Sommer swerd or a Sommers werd? |
| 12:50.28 | Amarande | This is where you ended up at the end if you didn't have the Sommerswerd |
| 12:50.36 | Amarande | And more likely than not that meant you were going to go to 158. :) |
| 12:50.41 | jnwhiteh | s/quit |
| 12:50.43 | jnwhiteh | ohai |
| 12:50.43 | *** join/#wowuidev Aelo_ (n=chatzill@81.170.124.144) |
| 12:51.02 | ZorbaTHut | wobin, Sommer swerd. It was a sword that glowed and made your enemies more badass. |
| 12:51.03 | Amarande | The fight with the Sommerswerd (287) is the same, except that it has no 158 branch and the Sommerswerd just cuts Vordaks like butter. |
| 12:51.38 | Jerub | crud, was going to do that automated submission thing |
| 12:51.40 | Wobin | "I Can't Believe It's Not Vordak!" |
| 12:51.51 | Amarande | and here, on the other hand, is when having the Sommerswerd really started to *fucking suck*: http://www.projectaon.org/en/xhtml/lw/09tcof/sect128.htm |
| 12:52.14 | Amarande | People would literally try to manipulate the South Gate guard into arresting them in that book so they could temporarily be rid of the damned thing. :) |
| 12:53.32 | Amarande | one thing I've always wondered about the LW 'verse though is exactly why some of the evil creatures are undead and some are not |
| 12:53.43 | Amarande | for instance, Vordaks and Helghast are undead, but Giaks are not |
| 12:53.50 | Amarande | however, IIRC, all of them are spawned in vats in the Darklands |
| 12:54.23 | Amarande | speaking of which, where did the idea of spawning cannon fodder in vats come from anyway? |
| 12:54.28 | Amarande | I seem to remember something about orcs but now I'm foggy |
| 12:55.51 | Wobin | lotr? |
| 12:55.58 | Wobin | turok hahn? |
| 12:56.03 | Wobin | urok? |
| 12:56.05 | Wobin | gah |
| 12:56.09 | Amarande | Zorba: my first Lone Wolf book was book 5, and it wasn't for over a year afterwards that I found out just where you got the Sommerswerd :) |
| 12:56.22 | Wobin | uruk-hai? |
| 12:56.28 | Wobin | something like that =P |
| 12:57.33 | Amarande | anyway. |
| 12:57.38 | Amarande | I have to be at work in six and a half hours. |
| 12:57.41 | Amarande | time for me to get some sleep. |
| 12:57.44 | Amarande | later. |
| 12:57.46 | ZorbaTHut | cya amarande |
| 12:57.58 | Wobin | or |
| 12:57.59 | Wobin | damn =P |
| 12:58.00 | Wobin | http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Black_Cauldron_%28novel%29 |
| 12:58.04 | Wobin | would have been another suggestion |
| 12:59.08 | *** join/#wowuidev stolenlegacy (n=stolenle@d86-32-145-179.cust.tele2.at) |
| 13:01.03 | Jerub | *waits for mail to make round trip* |
| 13:02.01 | *** join/#wowuidev Ancu (n=c@64.179.24.225) |
| 13:03.41 | Jerub | ZorbaTHut: first of my automated QH data submissions should be on its way now |
| 13:04.10 | ZorbaTHut | excellent :) |
| 13:04.41 | *** join/#wowuidev ChanServ (ChanServ@services.) |
| 13:04.42 | *** mode/#wowuidev [+o ChanServ] by irc.freenode.net |
| 13:04.42 | Jerub | ZorbaTHut: it's a big database. is there a way to prune it without losing data? |
| 13:04.48 | ZorbaTHut | "/qh purge" |
| 13:04.57 | Jerub | can i do that after i submit? |
| 13:05.13 | ZorbaTHut | yep, don't do it before you submit or it's kind of pointless ;) |
| 13:05.28 | Jerub | ;) |
| 13:06.07 | Jerub | yow. I could reduce the size considerably just removing indentation |
| 13:07.39 | ZorbaTHut | yeah. if I had the ability to control WoW's output more precisely, I would. |
| 13:08.04 | Jerub | yikes. |
| 13:08.09 | Jerub | ZorbaTHut: do you support bz2? |
| 13:08.14 | Jerub | that's 1/3 smaller. |
| 13:08.45 | Jerub | i guess it won't matter if i purge on a regular basis |
| 13:09.20 | ZorbaTHut | I don't at the moment, but I could easily. Still, it probably doesn't matter much overall, it's just a slightly longer upload. |
| 13:10.03 | Jerub | ZorbaTHut: my brain always scales things |
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| 13:25.43 | *** join/#wowuidev EthanCentaurai (n=ethan@92.24.57.255) |
| 13:31.51 | *** join/#wowuidev Wobin (n=Wobin@124.168.129.3) |
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| 13:37.10 | *** join/#wowuidev taleden (n=atfrase@user-38q41i6.cable.mindspring.com) |
| 13:37.17 | Fisker | captures Shirik |
| 13:38.01 | Wobin | Do you have a Shirik hunting licence, Fisker!? |
| 13:38.13 | Wobin | is it even Shirik season! |
| 13:38.39 | *** join/#wowuidev Lopeppeppy (n=Lopeppep@141.222.29.18) |
| 13:38.39 | *** mode/#wowuidev [+v Lopeppeppy] by ChanServ |
| 13:39.03 | zenzio | huggles Lopeppeppy |
| 13:39.12 | *** join/#wowuidev cncfanatics (n=cncfanat@WoWUIDev/cncfanatics) |
| 13:39.19 | Lopeppeppy | Morning. |
| 13:40.24 | zenzio | interesting point from Slashdot comments... |
| 13:40.28 | zenzio | "Makes me wonder what the jokes will be like in 50 years. "Back in my day, we had to type our posts on a keyboard, and we measured ping times in milliseconds!"" |
| 13:42.04 | Fisker | it is in my world Wobin |
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| 13:44.40 | *** join/#wowuidev boshi23 (n=chris@c-75-75-186-99.hsd1.nj.comcast.net) |
| 13:48.09 | Aelo | how would you make a texture show above a model frame? |
| 13:48.16 | Aelo | model frames dont seem to be layered regions :< |
| 13:50.42 | zenzio | well, a model frame is a frame; you could try adding a subframe on top of it with the texture in it perhaps? |
| 14:13.50 | *** join/#wowuidev Kraps (n=chatzill@ool-44c20717.dyn.optonline.net) |
| 14:16.31 | Kraps | morning |
| 14:16.48 | Lopeppeppy | Heyo |
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| 14:45.59 | *** join/#wowuidev Caleb| (n=caleb@dsl4E5C0218.pool.t-online.hu) |
| 14:46.24 | Bruners | nevcairiel: got any tips with pulseaudio ? |
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| 14:53.29 | Aelo | is it possible to put an outline around text? |
| 14:53.35 | Aelo | or only a shadow |
| 14:54.18 | mikma | ah ah ah, dk with berserking enchant |
| 14:54.34 | Aelo | O_o |
| 14:55.19 | *** join/#wowuidev Ackis (n=Ackis@67.23.21.108) |
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| 15:07.00 | Kraps | pelham 123 is fucking awesome |
| 15:07.01 | *** join/#wowuidev Shadowed (n=Shadowed@li89-205.members.linode.com) |
| 15:07.23 | Kraps | and im only 30 minutes in |
| 15:07.42 | Ackis | is in a mood today |
| 15:07.56 | Lopeppeppy | Uh oh!! |
| 15:10.44 | Ackis | so I made a post on the UDE forums and wow.com made a news story about it/a response in it... I feel special |
| 15:10.59 | Lopeppeppy | Awww. |
| 15:11.20 | *** join/#wowuidev Antiarc (n=Antiarc@ip70-190-192-186.ph.ph.cox.net) |
| 15:11.25 | Ackis | http://tinyurl.com/yjdc29k muhahha i r rumor hore |
| 15:11.57 | mikma | cairenn: http://kuvaton.com/kuvei/cookies3.jpg |
| 15:12.01 | mikma | COOOOOOOOOOOKIEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEES |
| 15:12.29 | Aelo | :O |
| 15:13.54 | Torhal | Ackis: You start some shit about once every two months. |
| 15:14.09 | Ackis | never! |
| 15:14.18 | Ackis | speaking of that, time to make antoher forum thread about carbonite eh? |
| 15:14.29 | *** join/#wowuidev Spellshaper (n=Spellsha@dslb-084-056-240-130.pools.arcor-ip.net) |
| 15:14.42 | Torhal | ROFL |
| 15:17.00 | *** join/#wowuidev zeheres (n=crs@dslb-084-061-067-208.pools.arcor-ip.net) |
| 15:17.55 | Shadowed | Ackis: I think you should spread a rumor that amount of files slows down addons considerably |
| 15:18.39 | Ackis | http://www.engadget.com/2009/11/16/asus-courting-toshiba-in-bid-to-become-top-3-pc-maker/ (click on it for the first image) |
| 15:18.42 | Ackis | Shadowed: oh I already do |
| 15:18.52 | Shadowed | excellent |
| 15:24.13 | Lopeppeppy | I am plotting to own Star Trek tomorrow... trying to figure out the least traffic hell way to get it. Hmm. |
| 15:25.07 | *** join/#wowuidev spode (i=spode@213.21.88.111) |
| 15:25.43 | mikma | mm, star trek |
| 15:25.49 | mikma | i like that movie |
| 15:25.52 | Lopeppeppy | Sylar is hot. That's what I'm sayin'. |
| 15:26.29 | Ackis | I want to et the best buy edition which has an enterprise blue-ray case |
| 15:31.04 | Fisker | slaps Ackis around a bit with a large trout |
| 15:31.07 | Fisker | consolefag |
| 15:31.53 | Ackis | MW2fag |
| 15:32.44 | Ackis | lua> 50.85 / 7.25 |
| 15:32.45 | lua_bot | Ackis: 7.0137931034483 |
| 15:32.56 | mikma | L4D2fag |
| 15:33.02 | mikma | in 14h! |
| 15:34.03 | Ackis | i'm a daofag |
| 15:34.04 | Ackis | well |
| 15:34.06 | Ackis | forza3fag |
| 15:34.16 | mikma | is forza3 good? |
| 15:34.30 | Ackis | it's a racing sim, not a racing game |
| 15:34.35 | Ackis | aka no story, etc |
| 15:34.36 | Ackis | just racing |
| 15:34.41 | Ackis | looks beautiful |
| 15:34.45 | Ackis | but I'm getting bored of it |
| 15:34.47 | *** join/#wowuidev Seerah (n=Ryan@c-76-107-191-65.hsd1.tn.comcast.net) |
| 15:34.47 | *** mode/#wowuidev [+o Seerah] by ChanServ |
| 15:34.56 | Lopeppeppy | I don't even have a dvd player, no idea why I'm so interested in buying the dvd. |
| 15:35.22 | Torhal | Ackis: Coding is much more enjoyable than Xbox. |
| 15:35.22 | Ackis | I completed season 6, which means I only have like another 100 hours of racing to "finish" all the events hehe |
| 15:35.27 | Ackis | Torhal: no u |
| 15:35.31 | Torhal | NEIN! |
| 15:35.38 | Ackis | NEIT |
| 15:35.40 | Ackis | NON |
| 15:35.40 | Ackis | NO |
| 15:35.44 | Ackis | PENIS |
| 15:35.48 | Torhal | pen15 |
| 15:36.07 | Ackis | Torhal: come sit on my lap, we can talk about what's up |
| 15:37.11 | Seerah | Ackis: "niet" :p |
| 15:37.18 | mikma | SCHEISSE! |
| 15:37.30 | Ackis | Seerah: pfft |
| 15:37.39 | Seerah | pfft you! :) |
| 15:37.42 | Ackis | Torhal: you see collectinator image stuff? |
| 15:37.46 | mikma | seerah: omglol |
| 15:37.48 | Torhal | Ackis: I'm sorry, the number you have dialed is no longer in service. Please hang up, and try your call again. |
| 15:37.58 | Torhal | Ackis: Yah. Looks a little blurry :( |
| 15:38.03 | Ackis | I read number as member and I giggled |
| 15:38.08 | Ackis | wow QQ more |
| 15:38.10 | Torhal | ... |
| 15:38.28 | Torhal | kew-kew MOAR |
| 15:38.50 | Ackis | Imma gonna get chantelle to draw another icon today |
| 15:39.04 | Ackis | if she doesn't I'll give her another black eye! just like Lopeppeppy wants me to! |
| 15:39.32 | mikma | QQ WoW |
| 15:40.08 | Torhal | Ackis: If you'd quit drugging her it might make a difference. |
| 15:40.34 | Ackis | she punched me in my nose last night :( |
| 15:40.38 | Ackis | is abused. |
| 15:41.01 | Lopeppeppy | Dude, you guys need counseling! |
| 15:41.22 | Ackis | she meant to slap my face but I leaned forward and she ended up punching me kinda |
| 15:45.36 | Ackis | http://www.examiner.com/examiner/x-6894-Video-Game-News-Examiner~y2009m11d16-Xbox-360-Wireless-Adapter-pricing-causing-outrage <-- what's N network support? is that the two antenas? |
| 15:47.03 | Seerah | faster wireless than their old antenna adapter |
| 15:47.33 | Ackis | ah ok so same concept behind a/b |
| 15:48.55 | Seerah | so, like, instead of 802.11g, it's 802.11n |
| 15:49.56 | Ackis | I just know some of the 802.11 protocols supported security, penises, etc... didn't know n was a new speed one, must investigate... hell I don't even know if I'm on a/b/g |
| 15:50.14 | Seerah | I *think* it's the new speed one |
| 15:50.31 | Lopeppeppy | I got an N card for my desktop. |
| 15:50.32 | *** join/#wowuidev Kivnel (n=lenvik@23.213.233.220.static.exetel.com.au) |
| 15:50.34 | Lopeppeppy | Which I unburied! |
| 15:50.37 | Lopeppeppy | I can has updates! |
| 15:50.39 | Seerah | yay! |
| 15:50.42 | Lopeppeppy | I can plays WoW someday! |
| 15:50.52 | Seerah | yay! I can play with peppy! |
| 15:50.54 | Lopeppeppy | ... if I get a new hand. I feel like a reject from the Wizard of Oz lineup. |
| 15:51.11 | Seerah | "if I only had a hand"? |
| 15:51.18 | Lopeppeppy | Seriously. |
| 15:51.23 | Ackis | watches Seerah throw a ball to have Lopeppeppy fetch it. |
| 15:51.47 | Lopeppeppy | I don't think we'll do surgery, I think we'll do a wait and see attitude, it's not doing *enough* to warrant ripping me open right when I have an injured cat to be taking care of. |
| 15:54.39 | zenzelezz | <Seerah> yay! I can play with peppy! <--- pictures, please |
| 15:54.59 | Seerah | ~lart zenzelezz |
| 15:54.59 | purl | sends a legion of lawyers after zenzelezz's head |
| 15:55.02 | Lopeppeppy | zenzelezz, you know how I feel about cameras. |
| 15:56.29 | zenzelezz | that's okay, we can find you a spy cam |
| 15:57.18 | krka | cameras can trap your soul forever! |
| 15:57.25 | krka | (or until you unload the memory disk) |
| 15:57.32 | Ackis | i have no soul |
| 15:57.37 | Torhal | Confirmed. |
| 15:59.31 | Ackis | twitters that Torhal is being mean to me. |
| 15:59.50 | Ackis | on a different note apparntly my network storage device supports torrenting |
| 15:59.53 | Torhal | Hey! Wait! I was backing up your story! |
| 16:01.21 | zenzelezz | Ackis: so your wedding night video is already on the torrent sites, cool |
| 16:01.39 | Torhal | zenzelezz: Those were simply roleplaying exercises. |
| 16:01.43 | Ackis | I got married? :( |
| 16:02.07 | Ackis | my gf picked my father up from the hospital and told the nurse that she was his "future daughter-in-law" |
| 16:02.29 | zenzelezz | she was giving you a hint |
| 16:02.48 | Torhal | That sounds more like saying it how it is. |
| 16:03.27 | Torhal | Ackis: The roleplaying has gone too far. I hate to say this, but, MOAR XBOX! |
| 16:03.41 | Ackis | roleplaying? |
| 16:04.21 | Torhal | [11:01] <Torhal> zenzelezz: Those were simply roleplaying exercises. |
| 16:04.39 | Ackis | oh |
| 16:04.40 | Ackis | hah |
| 16:04.44 | Ackis | ~rlart |
| 16:04.45 | purl | squeezes Stanzilla till Stanzilla turns blue like papa smurf |
| 16:04.49 | Ackis | w00t |
| 16:05.24 | Stanzilla | :( |
| 16:07.45 | Fisker | hey Ackis |
| 16:07.46 | Fisker | you suck |
| 16:07.57 | Ackis | you're the one playing MW2 |
| 16:11.31 | Fisker | you suck |
| 16:12.57 | Torhal | you wouldn't play a shitty game Fisker |
| 16:13.00 | *** join/#wowuidev kdtresh (n=kdtresh@76.212.99.109) |
| 16:16.49 | cogwheel | yawns |
| 16:19.02 | Lopeppeppy | Hi hi. |
| 16:21.15 | Seerah | *gasp!* |
| 16:21.25 | Seerah | is that... Collectinator I see in the queue? |
| 16:21.39 | Lopeppeppy | No way. |
| 16:22.12 | *** join/#wowuidev cncfanatics (n=cncfanat@WoWUIDev/cncfanatics) |
| 16:22.46 | Torhal | Seerah: I've been slaving away at it. About damn time Ackis quit playing Xbox to upload it. |
| 16:22.51 | Torhal | hides. |
| 16:22.54 | Seerah | hehe |
| 16:23.06 | Seerah | it says it's version is only Beta1 |
| 16:23.13 | Seerah | when can we expect it to be finished? :p |
| 16:23.27 | Lopeppeppy | When gmail is? |
| 16:23.34 | Seerah | :D |
| 16:23.36 | Jerub | fail htoc10 pug |
| 16:23.40 | Jerub | but very tight fail |
| 16:23.51 | Ackis | Seerah: :D |
| 16:23.51 | theorbtwo | notes that gmail lost it's beta tag quite some time ago. |
| 16:24.00 | Torhal | Seerah: When I add support for titles. I'm not touching tabards or "fun items", because I refuse to allow Ackis to torture me. |
| 16:24.22 | Seerah | what's under "fun items" anyway? |
| 16:24.27 | Ackis | Seerah: nothing atm |
| 16:24.35 | Ackis | Torhal forgot to update the desc |
| 16:24.53 | Seerah | oh, blame him for that one? I see your name as the author/uploader :P |
| 16:25.15 | Ackis | if it's not a dry-code issue it's his fault |
| 16:25.19 | Ackis | that's how we split the blame |
| 16:25.22 | Torhal | Seerah: I believe "fun items" would be things like the TCG tiger or the Disco Ball |
| 16:25.29 | Seerah | ahhh |
| 16:25.34 | Ackis | the canon trinket |
| 16:25.37 | Seerah | also, wtb screenshot nao plox |
| 16:25.39 | Ackis | skeleton trinket |
| 16:25.52 | Torhal | Seerah: Think of ARL, for pets/mounts. |
| 16:26.01 | Ackis | Seerah: will get them for you tonight unless I don't do it |
| 16:26.03 | Ackis | :) |
| 16:26.06 | Seerah | but... but... but.... I don't use ARL :P |
| 16:26.20 | *** join/#wowuidev Kazie (n=Kazie@port207.ds1-vg.adsl.cybercity.dk) |
| 16:26.24 | Ackis | :O |
| 16:26.29 | Seerah | you have til Sunday ;) |
| 16:26.52 | Ackis | man that's like a whole week |
| 16:26.52 | Torhal | WoWI needs multi-author support :P |
| 16:27.01 | Seerah | though, I do like the dog/cat graphic |
| 16:27.10 | Seerah | there is for svn |
| 16:27.22 | Ackis | Seerah: gf drew that, it's the icon in the mod itself for pets/mounts |
| 16:27.40 | Seerah | then tell Chantelle that I like it :) |
| 16:28.05 | Ackis | will do :) I like it too, Torhal doesn't though, he's a meanie |
| 16:28.15 | Torhal | I didn't say I didn't like it :P |
| 16:28.22 | Torhal | I said it looks blurry in the AddOn :P |
| 16:28.22 | olafski | ooh I would love it if ARL had titles, mounts, pets etc :< |
| 16:28.31 | Torhal | olafski: Collectinator |
| 16:28.41 | olafski | yeah I considered that but for some reason I went with The Collector |
| 16:28.46 | olafski | don't remember why |
| 16:28.49 | Seerah | http://www.wowinterface.com/downloads/info15154-Collectinator.html |
| 16:28.57 | Torhal | Probably because Collectinator wasn't usable. |
| 16:29.29 | olafski | hm.. looking at that, the only reason I can think of is that it doesn't support titles |
| 16:29.46 | Torhal | olafski: It will. |
| 16:29.54 | Lopeppeppy | Favorited-ded! |
| 16:29.57 | olafski | yeah but that doesn't help me today does it ,) |
| 16:30.04 | Torhal | I'll actually probably start that as soon as I backport the changes I made to ARL into it |
| 16:30.07 | theorbtwo | Don't titles automatically happen when you can get them, rather then needing to be bought? |
| 16:30.09 | olafski | I don't really care about collecting titles anyway I think |
| 16:30.17 | olafski | theorbtwo: except the shattered sun one :) |
| 16:30.29 | olafski | but that doesn't mean you can keep a list of the ones you don't have yet |
| 16:30.33 | batrick | My buddy in Parallel Algorithms (our cluster is malfunctioning night before assignment is due): "err, it's because we started too late. also, we don't have powerful enough machine to handle slackers' contention,hehe" |
| 16:31.13 | Torhal | Arrowmaster: If you're awake, the new Doctor Who special is out. |
| 16:35.15 | Fisker | old Torhal |
| 16:35.18 | Fisker | epic doctor rage though |
| 16:36.40 | *** join/#wowuidev ckknight (n=ckknight@WoWUIDev/WoWAce/CurseStaff/CurseForge/ckknight) |
| 16:36.40 | *** mode/#wowuidev [+o ckknight] by ChanServ |
| 16:37.54 | *** join/#wowuidev Lunessa (n=Lunessa@WoWUIDev/Lunessa) |
| 16:38.46 | cog|work | station! |
| 16:39.33 | Fisker | Postoffice |
| 16:40.24 | Fisker | come on cog|work |
| 16:40.27 | Lopeppeppy | Morning, Lunessa dear. |
| 16:40.52 | Lunessa | Morning Lopeppeppy! |
| 16:40.54 | Fisker | you wouldn't be polite to other people on irc :( |
| 16:40.55 | Lunessa | Station! |
| 16:41.00 | Fisker | POSTOFFICE |
| 16:41.29 | Lunessa | drowns Fisker with 1000 liters of milk. |
| 16:41.40 | Fisker | a thousand liters of milk? |
| 16:41.46 | Fisker | Try a BILLION LITERS OF MILK |
| 16:41.48 | Fisker | yeah that's right |
| 16:41.57 | Lunessa | You crazy Euros. |
| 16:42.29 | Fisker | http://www.arla.com/press/arla-foods-uk-to-invest-in-worlds-largest-fresh-milk-dairy/ |
| 16:42.39 | Fisker | they just ordered a billion liters of milk-facilities |
| 16:43.38 | theorbtwo | 1gigaliter per ... ? |
| 16:43.50 | Fisker | It's so they can fill all those orders you made |
| 16:50.15 | Cide | hey Lunessa , don't group me up with Fisker |
| 16:50.37 | Fisker | i'm not crazy either |
| 16:50.37 | ZorbaTHut | that is a lot of milk |
| 16:50.42 | Lunessa | Cide: Geographically only. Sorry. Pick a better place to be born next time. |
| 16:51.05 | Cide | nah, fisker should have picked a worse place |
| 16:51.55 | Fisker | you mean like the US? |
| 16:52.03 | Fisker | went there |
| 16:52.09 | Fisker | in b4 international politics etc. |
| 16:53.11 | Fisker | my opinion is 5 times more correct than the next leading brand |
| 16:53.47 | Legorol | you are a brand? |
| 16:53.51 | theorbtwo | 9 out of 10 dentists agree that Fisker is silly? |
| 16:54.05 | Legorol | if Fisker is a brand, can I press him on the side of my horse? |
| 16:55.14 | zenzelezz | 9 out of 10 dentists agree that there are always dentists willing to come on TV to claim that 9 out of 10 dentists recommend some product |
| 16:57.43 | Lunessa | 5 of 7 people surveyed think Fisker is detrimental to your mental health. 1 of 7 was a gibbering nutter and another 1 of 7 was Fisker. |
| 16:59.18 | Fisker | :3 |
| 17:00.26 | Cide | Lunessa: it's not conclusive whether or not fisker himself believes he is detrimental to one's mental health |
| 17:00.51 | Lunessa | Which is why he's his own bracket in the findings. |
| 17:01.21 | Cide | kinda sad, really |
| 17:01.31 | Lunessa | I know, the sample size is too small for rigorous analysis, but one does what one can with the tools to hand. |
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| 17:14.10 | Ancu | Hello! |
| 17:16.53 | zenzelezz | hi |
| 17:20.27 | Lunessa | brb, system update, reboot required. |
| 17:23.44 | batrick | http://developers.slashdot.org/comments.pl?sid=1445528&cid=30116838 |
| 17:24.03 | batrick | Shirik: ^ |
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| 17:28.59 | *** join/#wowuidev Lunessa (n=Lunessa@WoWUIDev/Lunessa) |
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| 17:34.01 | *** mode/#wowuidev [+o Iriel] by ChanServ |
| 17:34.56 | AbsolutRayne | Morning |
| 17:35.49 | Lopeppeppy | Hi hi |
| 17:36.44 | AbsolutRayne | <3 Peppyyyy |
| 17:37.55 | AbsolutRayne | Oh hey, rolling restarts! brb shower! |
| 17:38.09 | Lopeppeppy | Sweet. |
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| 17:44.06 | *** join/#wowuidev cncfanatics (n=cncfanat@WoWUIDev/cncfanatics) |
| 17:45.47 | cog|work | reports SERVER for spamming |
| 17:46.05 | cog|work | @blizz: do we really need restart reminders at 15-sec intervals for 5 whole minutes? |
| 17:46.25 | *** join/#wowuidev Srosh (n=Srosh@c209091.adsl.hansenet.de) |
| 17:47.28 | nevcairiel | they should just restart it faster |
| 17:49.27 | *** join/#wowuidev Ancu (n=c@ppp41.pm3-10.man-ch.nh.localnet.com) |
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| 17:49.46 | *** mode/#wowuidev [+v alestane] by ChanServ |
| 17:50.55 | Ancu | Server restart? |
| 17:50.56 | Lopeppeppy | Morning, alestane |
| 17:50.59 | Ancu | Realy? |
| 17:51.01 | Lopeppeppy | Rolling restarts. |
| 17:51.10 | Ancu | I must have missed the meme |
| 17:51.14 | Ancu | memo* |
| 17:51.17 | alestane | Good morning, Peppy dear. |
| 17:51.21 | Lopeppeppy | Might not be on your server. |
| 17:51.33 | Ancu | I got the restart |
| 17:52.42 | kdtresh | uldum did |
| 17:52.54 | kdtresh | cenarius doesn't appear to, or already did before i logged on |
| 17:52.56 | Ancu | The Scryers did |
| 17:53.50 | Ancu | still down |
| 17:53.53 | AbsolutRayne | We FINALLY got Twin Valks ToGC25 last night @_@ |
| 17:54.11 | Fisker | <PROTECTED> |
| 17:54.16 | Fisker | old AbsolutRayne |
| 17:54.18 | Fisker | we got them as well |
| 17:54.26 | Fisker | we're not in the same guild are we? |
| 17:54.27 | Fisker | :3 |
| 17:54.37 | AbsolutRayne | Iunno, are we? |
| 17:54.50 | theorbtwo | Time for 3.3, then? |
| 17:54.51 | Fisker | i doubt it |
| 17:55.51 | Fisker | naw |
| 17:55.57 | Fisker | gotta kill anub'arak |
| 17:56.02 | Fisker | but it's going to be hard ;_; |
| 17:56.13 | AbsolutRayne | http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v442/SinOfDreams/WoWScrnShot_111509_225005.jpg I know this is a super busy raid shot and it doesnt look pretty, but do you guys think the DBM Bars should be going down or stay going up like they are? |
| 17:56.36 | Fisker | dbm = gtfo |
| 17:56.44 | Lopeppeppy | Which ones are the DBM bars? *laugh* |
| 17:57.00 | AbsolutRayne | The large ones on the Left of the Player and Right of the Target |
| 17:57.13 | Lopeppeppy | I like them going up, in your style of layout. |
| 17:57.17 | Fisker | we found a neat trick yesterday |
| 17:57.23 | Fisker | you can interrupt the heal before the shield goes down .3 |
| 17:57.24 | Lopeppeppy | But you could do going down, as you do have plenty of room there. |
| 17:57.51 | AbsolutRayne | The only thing that really comes through there is the MSBT Data, but I hate seeing it overlap. |
| 17:58.30 | Lopeppeppy | Guess that isn't visible in this screenshot. So going up is your best option. |
| 17:58.42 | AbsolutRayne | Seems that way :) |
| 17:59.22 | AbsolutRayne | ZzZz waiting for my Realm to come back up |
| 18:00.22 | Lopeppeppy | Every realm needs a monday nap. |
| 18:00.26 | Lopeppeppy | What were the restarts for? |
| 18:00.51 | cog|work | dunno... only some realms it looks like |
| 18:01.00 | cog|work | mine's not even in the list right now |
| 18:01.18 | AbsolutRayne | go go total ghetto redneck duct tape nasal strip! |
| 18:02.36 | Lunessa | AbsolutRayne: I'm late to the party, but pick a style for data direction and use it consistently. If other things go top -> bottom DBM should too. Don't make the user have to mentally process exceptions. |
| 18:03.12 | AbsolutRayne | Lunessa: Oh, I know. The only thing that goes down is SBFs DoT style timer that im using, but everything else is up. :) |
| 18:04.23 | AbsolutRayne | http://www.nostockui.com/2009/10/move-over-peggle-hello-tower-defense/ Wat |
| 18:04.24 | Lunessa | AbsolutRayne: *nod* Just a comment. I know we don't always agree, but somethings are standard. |
| 18:04.42 | Lunessa | Also - Apple's "Human Interface Guidelines" are an excellent read. :) |
| 18:06.23 | AbsolutRayne | I, personally, hated Tower Defense. |
| 18:06.53 | Seerah | AbsolutRayne: PrimalDefense was a PotW when it first came out on WoWI |
| 18:07.49 | NeoTron | So another thing that makes loot-for-gold runs fun - BoE items |
| 18:08.03 | AbsolutRayne | O_o |
| 18:08.14 | NeoTron | This friday I bought a tank ring from our GDKP run for 3400 gold.. which I sold on the AH for just over 7k gold after AH tax |
| 18:09.50 | Legorol | Tome of Cold Weather Flying ftw |
| 18:09.57 | Legorol | i love flying in Northrend at 70 |
| 18:10.46 | alestane | It's a beautiful thing. |
| 18:10.57 | alestane | Makes a lot of quests way easier. |
| 18:11.15 | industrial | Any new MMO I should sign for beta? I'm so bored :< |
| 18:11.49 | krka | we'll get Regular Weather Flying in cataclysm for level 84 i bet |
| 18:12.12 | krka | industrial: i am writing one as we speak, but it's not ready for beta yet |
| 18:12.31 | krka | our team killed the first boss yesterday |
| 18:12.33 | ZorbaTHut | I'm betting on Underground Flying. Or some kind of swimming mount. |
| 18:12.52 | ZorbaTHut | I suspect they'll let us fly in Azeroth at level 60. |
| 18:13.00 | NeoTron | Changes of Firefox Mobile coming to the iPhone on a scale of 1 to 10? |
| 18:13.09 | NeoTron | s/Changes/Chance/ |
| 18:13.34 | Gnarfoz | <Fisker> dbm = gtfo < agreed, a guildy of mine hacked up his copy of DBMFTLBBQ so the DBM version check will show his version as "Get BigWigs, sucker! (r1234)" :D |
| 18:14.18 | krka | ZorbaTHut: no way, how do you explain cold weather flying then |
| 18:15.00 | ZorbaTHut | krka, they built Northrend as an entire new continent, and they wanted to restrict flying in that new continent. My theory is that the aboveground zones in Azeroth will be minimal, and they'll have belowground or underwater zones for the bulk of the 80-85 leveling. |
| 18:15.19 | Kraps | http://message.snopes.com/showthread.php?t=52983 |
| 18:15.58 | krka | oh just don't let there be entire swimmin zones |
| 18:16.04 | krka | i hate swimming with a passion |
| 18:16.28 | ZorbaTHut | it's to compete with Aion! they have flying, we have swimming :D :D :D |
| 18:16.43 | Grum | hmmm how can you see if an item is BoE? |
| 18:16.43 | Seerah | ZorbaTHut: there will be water mounts. at least one is already in the mpq's, if not several |
| 18:16.46 | ZorbaTHut | seriously though, I've suspected ever since the turtle mount showed up that we'd be seeing a lot more swimming stuff in the next expansion |
| 18:17.35 | ZorbaTHut | http://www.wowwiki.com/Sunken_City_of_Vashj%27ir hey look at that |
| 18:17.37 | ZorbaTHut | am I right or am I right |
| 18:19.05 | mikma | "Thank you for reporting offensive content and helping to keep the Steam Community clean and friendly. Buy yourself some cake, you deserve it." <- lol what |
| 18:19.20 | ZorbaTHut | mikma, they're lying to you |
| 18:19.57 | Gnarfoz | http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v442/SinOfDreams/WoWScrnShot_111509_225005.jpg <- is that an actual working strat for Twin Val'kyr Heroic? oO looks utterly chaotic |
| 18:20.04 | mikma | zorbathut: thats basicly them telling me to fuck off imho |
| 18:20.44 | AbsolutRayne | Gnarfoz: Its not that bad. |
| 18:21.02 | AbsolutRayne | We dropped the strat we were using in favor of it, and got it in 6-7 tries. |
| 18:21.16 | Gnarfoz | hmm. |
| 18:21.32 | Gnarfoz | we've got serious trouble breaking shields and with people dying |
| 18:21.44 | Gnarfoz | not entirely sure how to tackle either ^^ |
| 18:22.55 | AbsolutRayne | What we did, was have everyone go Dark but 6 people, who were of course Filters. We had 2 filters also as Dark to help them for bad clusters, most of them were healers. |
| 18:23.23 | AbsolutRayne | We pre-switched on shields that we knew were dark, and had the 2 Rogues (myself and another) just Blade Flurry. |
| 18:23.45 | ZorbaTHut | what the fuck, they have a famous dragon showing up in cataclysm named "Dargonax" |
| 18:23.57 | AbsolutRayne | Worst things to deal with were Light Vortexes. |
| 18:24.05 | AbsolutRayne | And even then those wernt bad. |
| 18:24.29 | ZorbaTHut | "Hey, we need a new dragon. What should we call him?" "I dunno. Dragon." "Not awesome enough." "Axes are pretty awesome." "Okay. I'll call him Dragonax. Go type it in, and don't misspell it this time!" |
| 18:24.44 | Gnarfoz | well, pre-switching is of course neat, but it's only a 1/4 occurance :\ |
| 18:25.18 | AbsolutRayne | Eh |
| 18:25.23 | AbsolutRayne | We did fine |
| 18:26.57 | AbsolutRayne | http://worldoflogs.com/reports/rt-mjgfkgdx6kcy4n4m/dashboard/?s=4061&e=4316 Theres our Kill Report |
| 18:27.10 | AbsolutRayne | Er, http://worldoflogs.com/reports/rt-mjgfkgdx6kcy4n4m/sum/damageDone/?s=4061&e=4316 |
| 18:27.22 | zenzelezz | world o' flogs? |
| 18:27.42 | AbsolutRayne | Sure |
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| 18:33.07 | TC-Away | flogs zenzelezz |
| 18:33.46 | zenzelezz | sorry, I only enjoy it with girls |
| 18:35.37 | *** join/#wowuidev Ancu (n=c@ppp41.pm3-10.man-ch.nh.localnet.com) |
| 18:35.38 | alestane | zenzelezz: You met one? |
| 18:35.53 | alestane | shouldn't be that mean. |
| 18:36.07 | zenzelezz | I meet many, you just have to know how to entice them |
| 18:37.40 | Ancu | crap, I think one of my fans went in my laptop. I think I am gona have issues with overheating |
| 18:37.53 | AbsolutRayne | I -LOVE- getting Death Gripped past max range. |
| 18:38.28 | Dagmar | You expect PvP player's won't cheat or something? |
| 18:38.41 | Dagmar | sr's/rs/; |
| 18:44.29 | cbreak | max range is fluid in a concurrent client server environment with high latency |
| 18:48.44 | Dagmar | That and people like to cheat. |
| 18:56.31 | alestane | Potentiality doesn't prove actuality, as it turns out. |
| 18:58.05 | Fisker | i'll break your legs Dagmar |
| 18:58.10 | Dagmar | ...and yet "anything that can be stolen, will be stolen". |
| 18:58.23 | Lunessa | Shuttle Launch "Holding" |
| 18:58.55 | alestane | Dagmar: That's no kind of proof, nor is it necessarily true. Common, but neither universal nor mandated. |
| 18:59.10 | Fisker | http://worldoflogs.com/reports/rt-bdr5jhb2xoncmd7r/sum/damageDone/?s=9442&e=9681 |
| 18:59.12 | Fisker | I > U AbsolutRayne |
| 18:59.21 | Dagmar | You sound like a man who has never played online multiplayer games. |
| 18:59.59 | Dagmar | If you put a new machine in Ironforge that had one button that said "Click here to steal money from someone nearby" it would bring down the server with the number of people gathered around it to click on it as fast as they can. |
| 19:00.12 | Dagmar | ...and the Horde would raid daily so that they could click on it, too. |
| 19:00.51 | alestane | Even if it did nothing, that's the real beauty of it. Plenty of people would click just to see what it really did, because they wouldn't believe it could possibly work as advertised. |
| 19:00.53 | Dagmar | The days of decent, upstanding people being the overwhelming majority went away when closed beta ended. Heh |
| 19:01.51 | alestane | It's true that if a loophole exists and is known, it's likely that somebody will be exploiting it. But that also doesn't mean that "every one who could be exploiting a loophole, will be." |
| 19:03.14 | Dagmar | There's over eleven million players. |
| 19:03.23 | *** join/#wowuidev ckknight (n=ckknight@WoWUIDev/WoWAce/CurseStaff/CurseForge/ckknight) |
| 19:03.23 | *** mode/#wowuidev [+o ckknight] by ChanServ |
| 19:03.58 | Dagmar | This means that if even one half one percent of them are dirty cheaters (lol) that there's fifty-five thousand of them. |
| 19:04.05 | Dagmar | That's a lot of cheaters per server. |
| 19:05.52 | alestane | But the likelihood that that guy who just appeared to do something impossible was deliberately exploiting hax is still close to one percent. |
| 19:10.49 | Seerah | http://www.youtube.com/worldofwarcraft |
| 19:12.50 | Fisker | kisses Dagmar |
| 19:13.58 | Torhal | Seerah|away: Why you make mah head asplode? |
| 19:14.01 | alestane | I am amused by the fact that he is wearing a "Murlacos" T-Shirt with the sleeves off. |
| 19:14.14 | Seerah|away | :D |
| 19:15.07 | *** join/#wowuidev maggie_n (n=mnelson@wan-xl1.paetec.ny.schematic.com) |
| 19:16.23 | *** join/#wowuidev Thunder_Child (n=TC@WoWUIDev/PITA/TC) |
| 19:18.08 | AbsolutRayne | I, for one, welcome our new Google Overlords. |
| 19:18.10 | Lopeppeppy | is hungry now, grlmrglrmglmrgl! |
| 19:18.43 | AbsolutRayne | And im also heading out, so byebye <3 |
| 19:18.48 | alestane | You sound like Kent Brockman. |
| 19:18.50 | Lopeppeppy | bye bye! |
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| 19:24.12 | *** mode/#wowuidev [+v tekkub] by ChanServ |
| 19:24.59 | Fisker | i'm sick Lopeppeppy |
| 19:25.12 | Thunder_Child | of life? |
| 19:25.19 | Kraps | have any of you seen the indie movie ink? |
| 19:25.51 | zenzelezz | I didn't know indie movies used ink |
| 19:26.03 | maggie_n | some of them do, it's what makes them indie |
| 19:26.47 | Lopeppeppy | Fisker, go back to bed for a nap then, dear. |
| 19:26.49 | Kraps | ~fail zenzelezz |
| 19:26.50 | purl | zenzelezz, you Fail! |
| 19:27.00 | Kraps | ~fail maggie_n |
| 19:27.00 | purl | maggie_n, you Fail! |
| 19:27.10 | Kraps | so there! |
| 19:27.28 | maggie_n | lol |
| 19:27.47 | maggie_n | takes a long time to make one, have to draw all scenes |
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| 19:40.52 | alestane | The Mohoawk grenade is apparently an actual item in game. |
| 19:42.22 | Lopeppeppy | Neat. |
| 19:43.01 | Ackis | I get to have 36 chances to get a spectral kitten this weekend /cheer |
| 19:43.46 | zenzelezz | alestane: what does it do? Turn all nearby enemies' haircuts into mohawks? |
| 19:43.53 | alestane | Probably. |
| 19:44.45 | alestane | "Right click to throw and pity some fools!" |
| 19:49.13 | *** join/#wowuidev Kaso (n=Kaso@host86-167-224-234.range86-167.btcentralplus.com) |
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| 19:50.13 | Kaso | Any wow-wine users around, i'm seeing a wierd thing where whenever i patch the permissions on my WoW dir will be set to d----wS--- which is a little odd |
| 19:50.18 | Kaso | anyone else seen that? |
| 19:50.53 | nevcairiel | yeah happens to everyone |
| 19:50.56 | nevcairiel | dont start the launcher |
| 19:51.16 | Kaso | doesnt the launcher automatically start after the patching is finished? |
| 19:52.27 | Kaso | ah well at least i know its common now |
| 19:52.34 | Kaso | its not like the fix takes more than 2 seconds |
| 19:52.56 | *** join/#wowuidev Bibi (n=Bibi@AVelizy-151-1-53-77.w82-120.abo.wanadoo.fr) |
| 20:02.04 | Esine | Kaso: everything's fine in cedega land |
| 20:02.38 | Esine | I've ran wow on cedega ever since I came to wow, and I've tried wine a lot of times.. but even now it seems there are many more problems with wine |
| 20:03.33 | Esine | runs a bit slower on wine, weird graphical glitches.. but that's just how I've noticed it runs (versus cedega) |
| 20:03.44 | Esine | and only on one system |
| 20:10.37 | *** join/#wowuidev Repo (n=supybot@repos.curseforge.net) |
| 20:10.46 | *** join/#wowuidev Ginji (n=Ginji@cc1040670-a.gorre1.fr.home.nl) |
| 20:10.53 | Kaso | do you run in opengl mode or directx mode with cedega out of interest? |
| 20:11.06 | Kaso | one of the things that annoys me is theres no pretty shadows in opengl mode in wine |
| 20:11.45 | Fisker | awwwwwwwwwwwwwwww |
| 20:12.11 | Ginji | The only thing annoying about opengl is the lack of a hardware cursor |
| 20:12.18 | *** join/#wowuidev Jiminizer (n=jiminize@152.105.165.179) |
| 20:12.30 | Ginji | I could care less about shadow |
| 20:12.34 | Ginji | s/w/ws/ |
| 20:12.48 | nevcairiel | blizz could do that easily |
| 20:12.55 | nevcairiel | they just dont care |
| 20:14.48 | Cide | nobody cares for opengl |
| 20:14.56 | nevcairiel | mac users do, i heard |
| 20:15.26 | nevcairiel | but then the mac opengl backend is completly different to teh windows opengl backend |
| 20:15.31 | nevcairiel | so maybe they even have hw cursors |
| 20:17.11 | ccox | http://www.wow.com/2009/11/16/night-elf-mohawk-grenade-now-active-in-wow/ |
| 20:17.27 | Fisker | slaps ccox around a bit with a large trout |
| 20:17.42 | Fisker | nevcairiel why would mac users care? |
| 20:17.59 | nevcairiel | because all they have is opengl? doh! |
| 20:18.26 | Fisker | do they know that nevcairiel ? |
| 20:19.05 | alestane | Why yes, yes they do (some of them, anyway). |
| 20:22.45 | Dagmar | ccox: Seriously? |
| 20:22.53 | Dagmar | I thought that was a joke made for the commercial |
| 20:23.02 | ccox | apparently not |
| 20:23.21 | ccox | when I saw the commerical link, I wondered, but sure enough - people are reporting it in game |
| 20:23.23 | Dagmar | OMG that is HILARIOUS |
| 20:23.42 | ccox | after 5pm, I'll check it out... |
| 20:25.34 | Fisker | well i had sex with your mother alestane |
| 20:25.35 | Fisker | does that mean you know? |
| 20:25.35 | Fisker | :3 |
| 20:25.52 | ccox | (any bets on how long before wowhead has a special section on mohawk grenades?) |
| 20:28.06 | *** join/#wowuidev Ose (n=chatzill@wikia/Ose) |
| 20:28.41 | *** mode/#wowuidev [+v nicoli_s] by ChanServ |
| 20:29.27 | alestane | Fisker: Every now and then I try to figure out why you actually hang out in this channel. The only answer I've arrived at is "Because he can." |
| 20:29.54 | ccox | alestane: why are you complaining about the bot? |
| 20:30.17 | zenzelezz | be kind, Fisker actually helps out sometimes |
| 20:30.26 | haste | alestane: I know why, but telling you could jeapordize the universe |
| 20:33.21 | Lunessa | tekkub: Thanks. |
| 20:33.35 | *** join/#wowuidev NeoTron (n=neotron@pool-173-64-144-162.sttlwa.fios.verizon.net) |
| 20:33.43 | Dagmar | I wonder if I'd be the first to complain that the night elf mohawk grenades are inexcusably OP |
| 20:34.04 | *** join/#wowuidev Aeyan| (n=pancake@cpe-174-098-002-214.triad.res.rr.com) |
| 20:37.38 | Aelo | how do you change the font object of a dropdown? |
| 20:37.48 | Aelo | there's info.fontObject, but i dont understand how it works ^^ |
| 20:39.06 | *** join/#wowuidev Zyn (n=zyn@h243n2-av-a11.ias.bredband.telia.com) |
| 20:41.04 | Aelo | ah nvm, CreateFont :) |
| 20:41.29 | *** join/#wowuidev Trela_ (n=alexia@c-69-136-65-241.hsd1.pa.comcast.net) |
| 20:42.17 | Fisker | i don't even know myself haste |
| 20:42.18 | Fisker | :( |
| 20:42.40 | *** join/#wowuidev Ruck (n=bleh@pool-72-86-106-233.aubnin.fios.verizon.net) |
| 20:42.46 | alestane | zenzelezz: Occasionally he does. And then he tells whoever it is that they wouldn't have needed to ask if they'd been listening last night when he was sleping with their mom, and slaps them around with a large trout. |
| 20:42.54 | zenzelezz | Sorry kid. You have the gift, but it looks like you're waiting for something. |
| 20:47.35 | Cide | yeah, I'm never getting that !@%*#@ red pill everyone's talking about |
| 20:50.31 | Ginji | How about a NE Mohawk Grenade? |
| 20:55.11 | Lunessa | zenzelezz: Nice reference. |
| 20:55.44 | zenzelezz | :) |
| 20:55.59 | Fisker | i'll boycott the mohawk because we only get ne mohawks |
| 20:57.54 | Fisker | i think i'm coming down with the flu |
| 20:57.57 | Fisker | teh swine flu! |
| 20:58.12 | zenzelezz | get out of Borean Tundra |
| 20:58.45 | Fisker | oh great idea |
| 20:58.56 | Fisker | atleast you don't want me dead :) |
| 20:58.56 | *** join/#wowuidev Ancu1 (n=c@ppp40.pm3-5.man-ch.nh.localnet.com) |
| 20:59.53 | Lopeppeppy | Fisker, go out and get whatever you need now, while you're still mobile, and make sure someone checks in on you every day, okay? |
| 21:00.17 | Fisker | was just kidding, just think it's a cold :P |
| 21:00.22 | Lopeppeppy | Jerkface. |
| 21:00.56 | Fisker | jerkfacebook |
| 21:01.04 | Fisker | the facebook site for 90% of all facebook users |
| 21:02.02 | Fisker | hehe 48% of internet users want to pay for news |
| 21:02.12 | Fisker | i want if that coincides with the percentage of stupid internet users |
| 21:02.13 | Fisker | hoho |
| 21:03.36 | AbsolutRayne | ZzZz |
| 21:03.49 | Lopeppeppy | It's a sleeptyper attack! |
| 21:03.54 | Lopeppeppy | Sound the alarms! |
| 21:03.59 | AbsolutRayne | It does critical damage. :( |
| 21:04.07 | zenzelezz | embraces Lopeppeppy protectively |
| 21:04.27 | Fisker | sleeptypers are worse than people who have "AFK" next to their nick and types |
| 21:04.32 | ccox | wowhead - undergoing maintenance -- aka, adding a mohawk to the main page |
| 21:04.34 | AbsolutRayne | I never understood why Cats like to stick their heads in Shoes. |
| 21:05.08 | Fisker | but now i'll go sleep AbsolutRayne |
| 21:05.10 | Fisker | be afraid |
| 21:05.48 | Cide | ccox: why would that require maintenance? |
| 21:05.52 | Cide | it's a simple commit |
| 21:06.02 | ccox | I don't know, just guessing |
| 21:06.44 | AbsolutRayne | Also, Sweet Chilli chicken wings |
| 21:06.47 | AbsolutRayne | om nom nom |
| 21:06.52 | *** join/#wowuidev Dewin (n=Daniel@c-71-59-222-35.hsd1.or.comcast.net) |
| 21:08.48 | Lopeppeppy | Those do sound good, AbsolutRayne |
| 21:09.36 | AbsolutRayne | Theyre delicious |
| 21:11.28 | Lopeppeppy | I have...red sugar free jello. |
| 21:11.40 | Lopeppeppy | I say "red" because the flavor is indeterminate. It is not cherry or strawberry. |
| 21:14.54 | AbsolutRayne | :( |
| 21:15.13 | Shirik | tackles Lopeppeppy |
| 21:15.19 | Lopeppeppy | I see now it's strawberry orange, which explains the weird. |
| 21:15.23 | Lopeppeppy | Heya, Shirik-dear. |
| 21:15.43 | alestane | braces Peppy from behind. |
| 21:16.05 | Lopeppeppy | *snark* |
| 21:16.21 | Lopeppeppy | I am a very bad Peppykins |
| 21:16.40 | Lopeppeppy | Frankenrosie goes for more lazers today, wish her luck in acquiring that certain glow! |
| 21:16.50 | alestane | Snark all you like, dear, you're not getting knocked u...over on my watch. |
| 21:17.29 | alestane | ...okay, the naughty is apparently catching. |
| 21:17.53 | Lopeppeppy | I caugtched you! |
| 21:18.19 | nicoli_s | mmmmi could eat some jello |
| 21:18.23 | Shirik | My guild is so strange |
| 21:18.28 | Shirik | "I'm afraid we're going to have to repossess your testosterone for failing to like Michael Bay movies." |
| 21:18.51 | nicoli_s | lol |
| 21:18.55 | nicoli_s | but they are so bad! |
| 21:19.14 | Lopeppeppy | Who is michael bay? |
| 21:19.18 | Shirik | I especially like his comparison of Michael Bay advertising campaigns |
| 21:19.33 | nicoli_s | the guy who did transformers and other big esplosion movies Lopeppeppy |
| 21:19.38 | alestane | Shirik: http://www.penny-arcade.com/comic/2007/3/21/ |
| 21:19.50 | Lopeppeppy | Oh, he goes boom. |
| 21:19.50 | Shirik | Independance Day blowing shit up |
| 21:19.50 | Shirik | Day After Tomorrow blowing shit up |
| 21:19.50 | Shirik | 2012 blowing shit up |
| 21:20.02 | Shirik | That is his comparison of michael bay advertising campaigns :P |
| 21:20.07 | Shirik | (each is a link) |
| 21:20.11 | *** join/#wowuidev NeoTron (n=neotron@pool-173-64-144-162.sttlwa.fios.verizon.net) |
| 21:20.15 | nicoli_s | day after tom was so incredibly horrible |
| 21:20.16 | alestane | I wouldn't mind Bay so much if he knew how to hold a camera steady, or hire someone who did. |
| 21:20.22 | nicoli_s | "omg outrun the cold!" |
| 21:20.42 | Shirik | basically his argument is "The movies suck. The advertisements are awesome." |
| 21:20.55 | Shirik | "his movies always have AMAZING advertisement campaigns, which is why his movies do so well even though they blow ass." |
| 21:21.16 | Lopeppeppy | I can't say I've ever "liked" those, although they did have pretty to them. |
| 21:21.39 | nicoli_s | independence day was awesome just cuz i was like 12 or something |
| 21:21.52 | Shirik | sorry I keep saying Michael Bay |
| 21:22.02 | Lopeppeppy | "I could have been.... at a barbeque!!!!" |
| 21:22.05 | Shirik | I meant to say Rolland Emmerich |
| 21:22.12 | nicoli_s | whos that? |
| 21:22.15 | Shirik | Michael Bay is another problem though :P |
| 21:22.19 | olafski | michael bay rocks :( |
| 21:22.21 | Shirik | director/producer of 2012 |
| 21:22.33 | Shirik | and Independance Day |
| 21:22.38 | Shirik | and Day After Tomrrow |
| 21:22.40 | Shirik | etc. |
| 21:23.09 | Shirik | Godzilla, The Patriot, 10,000 BC |
| 21:23.17 | Shirik | (The sucky Godzilla, not Godzilla 2000) |
| 21:23.28 | Torhal | Shirik: At least you aren't repeating the words "Uwe Boll". |
| 21:23.33 | Shirik | um |
| 21:23.40 | Shirik | that was also in the post actually |
| 21:23.43 | Torhal | lol |
| 21:23.45 | Shirik | "So yeah, I have no sympathy for anyone who pays money to go see this. It's like paying to see an Uwe Boll, or Michael Bay movie." |
| 21:23.51 | Torhal | Hahaha |
| 21:26.03 | Shirik | what the fuck |
| 21:26.12 | Shirik | I just got this junk email that says "Viagra for Free!" |
| 21:26.14 | Shirik | here is the contents |
| 21:26.15 | olafski | I paid to see the same michael bay movie three times |
| 21:26.25 | olafski | never seen a Boll movie appear in cinema though |
| 21:26.44 | Shirik | Best junk mail ever: http://wowi.pastey.net/128898 |
| 21:27.17 | nicoli_s | that was junkmail? |
| 21:27.19 | Shirik | yes |
| 21:27.25 | nicoli_s | weird |
| 21:27.35 | Shirik | I was wondering why the spam filter didn't pick it up |
| 21:27.37 | Shirik | so went to look at it |
| 21:27.40 | Shirik | and was like "wtf is this" |
| 21:28.06 | nicoli_s | i couldnt even start to guess wtf that is |
| 21:28.21 | alestane | They sent you some CSS? |
| 21:28.27 | Shirik | It looks like css |
| 21:28.43 | *** join/#wowuidev Bibi- (n=Bibi@AVelizy-151-1-36-181.w82-120.abo.wanadoo.fr) |
| 21:29.03 | Cide | is that all of it, Shirik? |
| 21:29.07 | Shirik | yes |
| 21:29.12 | Cide | weird |
| 21:29.33 | Cide | the last two lines are outlook conditionals |
| 21:29.53 | Shirik | Well I don't use outlook, that might be the first problem :P |
| 21:30.01 | Cide | ya, but they're incomplete |
| 21:30.04 | Cide | which is the very weird part |
| 21:30.11 | Cide | clearly the spammers fail at life |
| 21:30.37 | alestane | Some kind of unsanitized escape exploit? |
| 21:30.58 | *** join/#wowuidev Sennen (i=Eric23@adsl-070-145-165-095.sip.jax.bellsouth.net) |
| 21:31.11 | *** join/#wowuidev Antiarc (n=Antiarc@ip70-190-192-186.ph.ph.cox.net) |
| 21:31.14 | ccox | What I love is getting SPAM where they couldn't fill in the replacment keys: |
| 21:31.47 | Kraps | http://notalwaysright.com/pepperoni-extremism/3163 |
| 21:31.48 | ccox | Subject: $SUBJECT_RANDOM $USERNAME $KEYWORD_RANDOM |
| 21:32.13 | ccox | Dear $USERNAME; We at $COMPANY_RANDOM would like to offer.... |
| 21:32.16 | Shirik | lol |
| 21:32.22 | *** join/#wowuidev KarlKFI|work (n=KarlKFI|@adcom005v.adcom.uci.edu) |
| 21:32.25 | alestane | Kraps: Some people are just insane. |
| 21:32.38 | alestane | Humurous, but insane. |
| 21:35.16 | olafski | I love that site |
| 21:42.48 | *** join/#wowuidev Doow (n=Miranda@unaffiliated/doow) |
| 21:47.32 | *** join/#wowuidev Bibi (n=Bibi@AVelizy-151-1-32-155.w82-124.abo.wanadoo.fr) |
| 22:00.25 | Lunessa | that and textsfromlastnight.com make good reading |
| 22:00.34 | Shirik | the branches |
| 22:00.37 | Shirik | they have diverged |
| 22:01.12 | Shirik | bzr's error messages are intentionally confusing imo |
| 22:03.57 | Lunessa | Oh joy.. .I get to send out 6,500 e-mails tomorrow. |
| 22:04.18 | Shirik | batrick |
| 22:04.26 | Shirik | Lua API check failed: Assertion failed: (((L->top - 1)->tt) == 5) |
| 22:04.29 | Shirik | Translation tyvm |
| 22:08.37 | *** join/#wowuidev Funkeh` (n=funk@WoWUIDev/WoWAce/Ace3/BigWigs/funkeh) |
| 22:09.08 | amro | Shirik: looks like unbalanced stack |
| 22:09.35 | Shirik | You don't have to balance the stack |
| 22:10.06 | Shirik | if you return from a call and you have an inappropriate number of values on the stack, it handles it |
| 22:10.16 | Shirik | unless I'm missing what you're saying |
| 22:10.24 | Shirik | see #lua :P |
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| 22:36.48 | Aelo | any UK people watching that 3d magic show on 4? :P |
| 22:39.53 | *** join/#wowuidev malikeye (n=malikeye@unaffiliated/malikeye) |
| 22:44.17 | theorbtwo | What's a nice debug event dumper thingy? |
| 22:44.34 | theorbtwo | I'm trying to find out what events fire on quest turn-in for finding rep & XP gains. |
| 22:46.19 | theorbtwo | ZorbaTHut: Just noticed you uploaded a new QH, 1.2.7. The changelog entry tells me to look at 1.3.0... which isn't there. |
| 22:46.27 | zenzelezz | DevTools? |
| 22:48.18 | theorbtwo | Ah. Is there as beta. |
| 22:53.04 | *** join/#wowuidev Tuller (n=Tuller@pool-72-84-246-12.rcmdva.fios.verizon.net) |
| 23:06.32 | AbsolutRayne | So is MTV really making a show called Jersey Shore? |
| 23:12.14 | *** join/#wowuidev Dezzimal (n=Dezzimal@207-118-168-123.dyn.centurytel.net) |
| 23:18.52 | cog|work | woot! first ever exalted rep on cogwheel |
| 23:18.59 | cog|work | >< |
| 23:19.07 | nicoli_s | AbsolutRayne: probably so sadly enough |
| 23:20.07 | Shirik | is exalted with cog|work |
| 23:20.44 | ScytheBlade1 | cog! |
| 23:21.06 | ScytheBlade1 | how2press esc on the droid/connectbot? |
| 23:21.47 | Dagmar | * You are now Exalted with the Night Elf Mohawks. |
| 23:22.56 | cog|work | ScytheBlade1: double press the middle button in the d-pad? |
| 23:23.05 | jnwhiteh | Were the way frame levels are calculated changed in 3.2 at all? Previously, a sub-frame defined in XML would have a frame level one higher than its parent. That doesn't seem to be the case any more (at least in this limited case I have). Any ideas? ;-) |
| 23:24.04 | cbreak | reached the level cap? |
| 23:24.05 | ScytheBlade1 | hmm |
| 23:24.17 | ScytheBlade1 | how do you hit alt+5? |
| 23:24.41 | cbreak | on a keyboard? |
| 23:25.00 | cog|work | ScytheBlade1: that i haven't figured out... i think there needs to be an update |
| 23:25.10 | cog|work | since i assume it was originally designed for G1 |
| 23:25.13 | Kraps | http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=98uDkyzVvSc&feature=player_embedded |
| 23:25.39 | cog|work | or wait, i'm thinking of the F-keys... |
| 23:25.44 | cog|work | i dunno |
| 23:25.45 | Shirik | You have chosen to open "log.zip" |
| 23:25.54 | Shirik | How should thunderbird open this file? |
| 23:25.54 | Shirik | Default option: Notepad |
| 23:25.54 | Shirik | ... what? |
| 23:26.37 | ScytheBlade1 | I hit the dpad center twice, then hit alt+5 |
| 23:26.46 | ScytheBlade1 | which is why I ask |
| 23:26.48 | cog|work | yeah |
| 23:26.55 | cog|work | i think it's interpreting alt on its own |
| 23:27.02 | cog|work | and can't figure out that you're trying to type a number |
| 23:27.17 | cog|work | since the G1 had a separate row for #s |
| 23:27.24 | ScytheBlade1 | without the dpad x2, it doesn't work |
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| 23:38.07 | Ancu1 | Hello! |
| 23:38.50 | Cairenn | hi |
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