| 00:00.12 | Dagmar | Well, no easy _legal_ way to stop that |
| 00:00.12 | Arrowmaster | Jerub: thats just standard teleport hacks which are caused by the same thing |
| 00:00.12 | Dagmar | I can stop it. |
| 00:00.22 | Arrowmaster | the client can tell the server its anywhere it wants to be |
| 00:00.24 | Dagmar | I just want jurisdictional grey areas that sell nice cocktails to work in. |
| 00:00.28 | NeoTron | WoW is very trusting of the client |
| 00:00.28 | Arrowmaster | and the server will listen |
| 00:00.30 | kd3 | breaking hands tends to stop a lot |
| 00:00.32 | Jerub | Arrowmaster: yeah, but it's so easy to detect, if you have the tools to look at what's happening in the game. |
| 00:00.34 | NeoTron | to avoid the rubber banding effect primarily |
| 00:00.36 | *** join/#wowuidev Repo (n=supybot@repos.curseforge.net) |
| 00:00.44 | NeoTron | which had the effect of making it easier to speed hack |
| 00:00.50 | Arrowmaster | it is easy to detect, and they ban people that do it |
| 00:00.53 | Dagmar | kd3: Saddling a company with a few hundred thousand in failed transaction fees will do it pretty well too |
| 00:01.03 | Arrowmaster | but when its a first time offense for that account the ban doesnt come quickly |
| 00:01.13 | NeoTron | not to mention the initial moveplayerto(X,y,z) type command that actually was accessible for a while |
| 00:01.18 | Jerub | but they really don't detect it, the billboards are up for 8-12 hours at a time |
| 00:01.19 | Dagmar | heheh |
| 00:01.29 | kd3 | say uh... worldport getting enabled on the ptr? |
| 00:01.30 | kd3 | laughs |
| 00:01.32 | Dagmar | Jerub: report them |
| 00:01.43 | Adys | WOW |
| 00:01.44 | Dagmar | I remember that |
| 00:01.47 | Jerub | Dagmar: with a 24 hour turnaround on tickets? meh. |
| 00:01.49 | Adys | The Monk ep with Jay Mohr |
| 00:01.50 | Adys | amazing |
| 00:01.51 | Dagmar | Picking random numbers was not a good idea |
| 00:02.05 | NeoTron | and from what I recall the server doesn't really keep track of Y at all (thus "flying hacks") |
| 00:02.10 | Adys | the guy you hate that you love to hate hating him and loving it |
| 00:02.12 | Adys | AWESOME. |
| 00:02.31 | Jerub | NeoTron: does that mean i can basically turn off falling damage? |
| 00:02.47 | Arrowmaster | yes thats one of the common hacks |
| 00:03.06 | Jerub | i only just realised the other day that the damage i take when i port to ogrimmar and drop a few stories actually results in repair bills. |
| 00:03.06 | NeoTron | basically the client knows about the terrain, not the server |
| 00:03.07 | Arrowmaster | slowfall too |
| 00:03.08 | NeoTron | server is 2d |
| 00:03.22 | Adys | no its not |
| 00:03.28 | Adys | server does keep track of y |
| 00:03.33 | *** join/#wowuidev theorbtwo (n=theorb@91.84.53.6) |
| 00:03.41 | Adys | it just doesn't record falls |
| 00:03.41 | NeoTron | it doesn't validate it, or didn't. |
| 00:04.02 | NeoTron | this information came from slantinga back in original beta |
| 00:04.20 | Adys | things changed since original beta |
| 00:04.29 | Adys | namely, flying mounts have been added to the game |
| 00:04.38 | WobWork | you notice this on jumping |
| 00:04.46 | WobWork | cause the server thinks you're at your leaping off point |
| 00:04.51 | WobWork | not your current midair position |
| 00:04.55 | WobWork | eg Heigan |
| 00:05.20 | NeoTron | true but that doesn't mean it orks differently |
| 00:05.20 | WobWork | also boats =) |
| 00:05.33 | WobWork | see DK deathgrip World Tour fun |
| 00:05.46 | NeoTron | obviously the game always had Y location from a player point of view, including places where player X and Y has the same world location ant different altitudes |
| 00:05.47 | Legorol | O.o |
| 00:05.54 | Legorol | what's that World Tour, and where do i sign up |
| 00:06.01 | WobWork | I dunno if it's still in the game |
| 00:06.04 | WobWork | but it was AWESOME |
| 00:07.30 | Dagmar | Oh yes. |
| 00:07.37 | Arrowmaster | got a video? |
| 00:07.38 | Dagmar | I can tell you what happens when the server doesn't track Z properly. |
| 00:07.43 | Dagmar | You get crap like Plane of Fear |
| 00:08.02 | WobWork | basically you duelled a DK at booty bay on the boat |
| 00:08.03 | Corrodias | what's that? |
| 00:08.08 | WobWork | with one of you on the dock and the other on the boat |
| 00:08.09 | Dagmar | ...where just walking *under* one guy gets about 50 epic asskickers to come down and stomp you and all your friends into epic meatpaste. |
| 00:08.11 | WobWork | he deathgripped you |
| 00:08.13 | Gnarfoz | <WobWork> cause the server thinks you're at your leaping off point <-- that's why I keep telling people in my raids to not fucking jump around all the time, when moving to a safe spot (say, Hodir Flash Freeze?) |
| 00:08.18 | WobWork | and you get sent to 0,0,0 |
| 00:08.22 | WobWork | WORLD TOUR |
| 00:08.46 | Dagmar | That was a pretty cool sploit, but I understand why the GMs would get upset |
| 00:08.54 | Dagmar | No one likes to spend all day fishing idiots out of the drink. |
| 00:08.55 | Gnarfoz | 0,0,0 is also where the taxis are on standby |
| 00:08.58 | NeoTron | haven't you noticed in WoW how things can hit you even if you're way the heck below/abov ethem btw? |
| 00:09.08 | NeoTron | Azjol'nerub, when you jump down the hole |
| 00:09.11 | Dagmar | NeoTron: Actually no. |
| 00:09.12 | kd3 | that's because mobs ignore z |
| 00:09.24 | Dagmar | Attacks ignore z |
| 00:09.28 | jnwhiteh | same reason you can hit onyxia |
| 00:09.29 | Gnarfoz | yay world first firemaw ;) |
| 00:09.32 | jnwhiteh | or used to be able to :P |
| 00:09.38 | Dagmar | You can't anymore |
| 00:09.39 | Gnarfoz | you still can |
| 00:09.41 | NeoTron | I've died sitting in the pool |
| 00:09.41 | jnwhiteh | that's what I hear |
| 00:09.45 | NeoTron | down below |
| 00:09.47 | Dagmar | My pet just stood there and hoarded focus the entire damn run |
| 00:09.50 | NeoTron | with mobs about 200ft above hitting me |
| 00:10.04 | Gnarfoz | pets r dum rite? :o |
| 00:10.12 | Arrowmaster | autoattacks used to not be able to hit her but special melee attacks could |
| 00:10.13 | NeoTron | good indication z isn't all it should be in the server |
| 00:10.17 | Dagmar | Pets can't melee targets flying 25 feet in the air |
| 00:10.34 | Gnarfoz | players can, though |
| 00:10.34 | Gnarfoz | :D |
| 00:10.38 | Arrowmaster | player attacks dont ignore Z, just mobs |
| 00:10.38 | Dagmar | Next time I'm making macros to make the pet attack the wardens |
| 00:10.41 | kd3 | http://www.wowwiki.com/Quest:Subdue_the_Subduer |
| 00:11.03 | Gnarfoz | anyway, I rather like prefer how wow handles movement compared to Aion, lol |
| 00:11.16 | Gnarfoz | can't... move... must... finish... attack |
| 00:11.32 | WobWork | Gnarfoz: You -can- melee Ony in air phase now? |
| 00:11.47 | WobWork | Gnarfoz: hm, that sounds like AoC |
| 00:11.54 | Arrowmaster | you always could |
| 00:12.04 | Arrowmaster | just not autoattack |
| 00:12.13 | WobWork | ugh |
| 00:12.16 | Gnarfoz | not seen anything about Aion's crappy attack/movement implementation WobWork? ^^ |
| 00:12.20 | WobWork | nyet =) |
| 00:12.26 | WobWork | i've not looked too much into Aion |
| 00:12.39 | Gnarfoz | should be in basically every review, I hear it's pretty annoying ^^ |
| 00:12.43 | Tepel | I used to kill the tower guards in AV through the wall :P |
| 00:12.50 | Tepel | The crossbow guys |
| 00:12.58 | Gnarfoz | yeah |
| 00:13.06 | Dagmar | I used to get eaten by bears who would bite me in half through the walls of the hut |
| 00:13.07 | Tepel | And singing "You can't touch this" in my mind |
| 00:13.22 | Jerub | Tepel: da nah nah nah. can't touch this. |
| 00:13.22 | Lunessa | Aion: http://www.penny-arcade.com/comic/2009/10/2/ |
| 00:13.37 | WobWork | Gnarfoz: is it like AoC's? |
| 00:13.50 | WobWork | ie if you're mid combat move, you can't actually move til you finish it? |
| 00:14.16 | Gnarfoz | not sure, never played AoC, but I hear that's basically it |
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| 00:14.41 | Dagmar | Good luck swinging a bastard sword on one foot |
| 00:15.07 | NeoTron | WobWork: what is weird in aion? I might not love it but haven't noticed anything overly bad about the combat itself |
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| 00:25.13 | ScytheBlade1 | holy crap they changed a lot in terms of the stock UI |
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| 00:26.59 | NightHawkTheSane | ScytheBlade1: in 3.3? |
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| 00:27.02 | ScytheBlade1 | yes |
| 00:27.10 | ScytheBlade1 | the world map is.. well |
| 00:27.17 | ScytheBlade1 | I think they're building QH into the UI |
| 00:27.34 | kd3 | pretty much; they're still not done yet |
| 00:27.45 | NightHawkTheSane | Ah, yeah, well they started doing that for 3.2 yeah? |
| 00:27.47 | Arrowmaster | i dont think they like ZorbaBeta having so much control |
| 00:28.19 | ZorbaBeta | do they actually have the waypoints working now? |
| 00:28.28 | ZorbaBeta | didn't know they were doing so much with UI changes in 3.3 |
| 00:28.30 | ScytheBlade1 | working, no |
| 00:28.41 | ScytheBlade1 | but the map is drastically different |
| 00:28.41 | ZorbaBeta | I really don't get how they can *not have them working* for this long |
| 00:28.53 | ZorbaBeta | huh, wonder how tough it'll be to make QH work. time to update my PTR client I suppose |
| 00:29.23 | Dagmar | They're probably finding that its' a lot of data to build into the client |
| 00:29.28 | ZorbaBeta | it's not that much data |
| 00:29.46 | Dagmar | ...because every time something strange happens because of the one-off way some of the quests work, people are going to squeal "OOOO BLIZZ CODE SUX" |
| 00:29.47 | ZorbaBeta | the entire database in QH is about 12 megs, and that includes all languages and assumes I cannot query the server for names |
| 00:29.48 | kd3 | have fun downloading 1.4GB to get a few hundred megabytes of actual data |
| 00:29.52 | ScytheBlade1 | for example, if you open the world map, it now lists quests on the right side |
| 00:30.01 | ScytheBlade1 | if you click a quest, the bottom fills up with quest info |
| 00:30.03 | Arrowmaster | they are probably finding that their shitty interns cant code worth a damn and thats why its taking so long |
| 00:30.42 | ScytheBlade1 | ZorbaBeta: you on a PC or OSX? |
| 00:30.50 | NightHawkTheSane | ZorbaBeta: eh, how many hours do you think you put into QH? |
| 00:31.08 | NeoTron | one would assume they could more easily get the data required |
| 00:31.11 | NightHawkTheSane | or, more appropriately, how many hours do you think were put in to QH total... |
| 00:31.24 | Dagmar | NeoTron: It's not quite that simple |
| 00:31.44 | NeoTron | naturally |
| 00:32.01 | NeoTron | also it's not really comparable to QH |
| 00:32.25 | NeoTron | QH uses farmed data, which really isn't viable for a built-in product. They have to generate the data and/or build it into the quests themselves |
| 00:32.25 | ZorbaBeta | scythe, PC |
| 00:32.32 | ScytheBlade1 | <PROTECTED> |
| 00:32.37 | ZorbaBeta | nighthawk, I dunno. Call it 10 hours per week, maybe? |
| 00:32.41 | ZorbaBeta | neotron, they *have the database*, though |
| 00:32.42 | Jerub | NeoTron: they can farm from 11 million subscribers ;) |
| 00:32.46 | ZorbaBeta | I mean if I had the database I'd just make it work |
| 00:32.52 | ZorbaBeta | scythe, thanks :) |
| 00:32.55 | ScytheBlade1 | yup |
| 00:32.59 | NeoTron | ZorbaBeta: sort of right |
| 00:33.11 | kd3 | reiterates his annoyance at having to download 1.4GB to get a few hundred megs of patch data |
| 00:33.15 | NeoTron | I mean they know the general area of mob spawns but I dobut they have it in a format suitable to be used |
| 00:33.34 | ZorbaBeta | neotron, so they change the format :P or run a little data collection server in fast-forward-with-data-recording |
| 00:33.48 | ZorbaBeta | seriously if I was at Blizzard I'd have a working near-perfect database in weeks |
| 00:33.57 | NeoTron | well |
| 00:34.02 | Jerub | NeoTron: man, this is the sort of problem that thousands of devleopers the world over deal with daily. "I hvae tihs map with this coordinate system, and this data in a different coordinate system from a different point of reference, and i need to integrate the data" |
| 00:34.09 | NeoTron | you likely haven't seen their data or code ;-) |
| 00:34.27 | ZorbaBeta | no, I haven't, but these things are not hard :) |
| 00:34.33 | A-KO | http://www.explosm.net/db/files/Comics/Rob/objectaphilia.png |
| 00:34.36 | NeoTron | Blizzard is both great and well, horrible, at the same time |
| 00:34.48 | NeoTron | it's pretty obvious from the bugs they tend to push live that some things are lacking |
| 00:34.58 | ZorbaBeta | they should hire me, I'd whip things into shape :D |
| 00:34.59 | Jerub | blizzard is successful, i don't confuse that with great. |
| 00:35.01 | ZorbaBeta | (they wouldn't want to hire me) |
| 00:35.04 | NightHawkTheSane | ZorbaBeta: mand for how many weeks? my point, really, not to critisize, is that while they may be able to take pointers frome some existing code (yours, others), and have the data already there, they're probably developing a lot of it from scratch. QH probably took a damn long time.. and its certainly not the only thing blizzard is working on, UI wise |
| 00:35.34 | ZorbaBeta | nighthawk, sure, but they're also not writing questhelper |
| 00:35.40 | NeoTron | Aion has a cool feature for mobs especially |
| 00:35.41 | ZorbaBeta | and they're also not fighting with their own APIs |
| 00:35.58 | NeoTron | it doesn't just tell you whjere to go but gives you an X on where a mob is right now |
| 00:36.00 | NightHawkTheSane | well, they very well mayb e doing that, depending ;) |
| 00:36.01 | ZorbaBeta | I know roughly how long it would have taken me *just* to put the locations on the map. And that's solo. They should have had it for 3.2. |
| 00:36.09 | ZorbaBeta | I do not believe they're doing the shortest-path thing ;) |
| 00:36.13 | NeoTron | CO has a circle on the map, sometimes helpful, sometimes terribly confusing |
| 00:36.19 | Dagmar | They weren't when they last rolled it out on the PTR |
| 00:36.22 | NeoTron | but both were designed to have it |
| 00:36.30 | Dagmar | I *would* however like MORE RAID MARKERS |
| 00:36.39 | ScytheBlade1 | nine aren't enough? |
| 00:36.40 | NeoTron | yes yes |
| 00:36.43 | NeoTron | ScytheBlade1: no |
| 00:36.51 | ZorbaBeta | I'd like slightly more customizable raid markers |
| 00:37.01 | ZorbaBeta | text, or a larger number of symbols and control over color, or something |
| 00:37.02 | Dagmar | 1. There's only 8. |
| 00:37.03 | NeoTron | from a Magic Marker point of view for example it'd be nice to have X and [] mean sheep, always |
| 00:37.12 | Jerub | Is there a way to hotkey to 'target skull' ? |
| 00:37.15 | Dagmar | 2. Some that can be duplicated would also be useful. |
| 00:37.15 | NeoTron | but there aren't enough markers to avoid overloading even for the most basic CC's |
| 00:37.17 | NightHawkTheSane | Jerub: no |
| 00:37.26 | Dagmar | Jerub: That would be too ez-mode |
| 00:37.29 | Jerub | I have a macro that marks the current target as skull, and I use that when tanking heroics. |
| 00:37.54 | NeoTron | Jerub: you know you can just key bind marks too right? :P |
| 00:38.14 | Jerub | no |
| 00:38.20 | NeoTron | you can |
| 00:38.32 | Jerub | <-- noob |
| 00:38.35 | Dagmar | The issue I have is when you're trying to see where someone is in a cloud of glowing soup and attack animations |
| 00:38.46 | NeoTron | it took me a long time to realize you could since I never needed to :P |
| 00:39.01 | NeoTron | Dagmar: main thing I disliked about melee |
| 00:39.05 | Jerub | Dagmar: exactly. |
| 00:39.10 | NeoTron | I couldn't see anything unless I turned effects off |
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| 00:39.20 | NeoTron | and if I turned effects off I couldn't see things I shouldn't stand in |
| 00:39.28 | Jerub | Dagmar: I either <tab> cycle through mobs or fiddle with camera so i can click. |
| 00:39.37 | Jerub | doesn't think 'targetting skull' is an ezmode hack. |
| 00:39.53 | NeoTron | it is if you realize you can automatically mark targets programmatically |
| 00:40.17 | NeoTron | it could be used for a lot of things that were possible pre 2.0 |
| 00:40.22 | Jerub | it's possible to macro 'the tank's target' right? |
| 00:40.27 | Lunessa | Jerub: If you could target the marks, then you would be able to runa raid with 1 good tank, 3 good healers and 21 DPS bots who hit 1 button over and hover. |
| 00:40.28 | NeoTron | like mark people that needs dispells |
| 00:40.40 | NeoTron | and get one button dispells again |
| 00:40.52 | NightHawkTheSane | Jerub: i think so, yeah, you'd have to more or less hard-code the tanks name in, though |
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| 00:41.08 | Jerub | NightHawkTheSane: i'm okay with pulling up the macro window each time. |
| 00:41.14 | Lunessa | The /assist command is delicious |
| 00:41.21 | NightHawkTheSane | ^^ |
| 00:41.44 | Lunessa | Though something like DAoC's /sticky would be nice. |
| 00:41.51 | Jerub | I only just realised i could bind an attack key to proc my trinkets too |
| 00:42.01 | NightHawkTheSane | I've got a macro that's jsut /assist <someones name>, and have that bound to something like shift-f |
| 00:42.31 | Jerub | (realised, last night, when fiddling with my dodge trinket) |
| 00:43.14 | Dagmar | hehe |
| 00:43.31 | Dagmar | Man I used to use a macro to pop every burst thing I had at once and shout "MOAR!" |
| 00:44.10 | Dagmar | Now they keep taking my toys away. |
| 00:44.37 | Jerub | now when i lacerate spam i proc my dodge trinket :) |
| 00:46.28 | Lunessa | takes Dagmar's toys away. |
| 00:47.42 | Jerub | considers making it also proc his barmaid trinkets. |
| 00:47.55 | Dagmar | THe only thing left to do now is to change Beast Within so that the hunter and his pet merely turn pink instead of red. |
| 00:48.08 | Dagmar | Jerub: Yoiu can't stack those |
| 00:48.15 | Adys | Man |
| 00:48.21 | Jerub | Dagmar: there's a GCD on those? |
| 00:48.24 | Adys | i go on twitter for the first time in months |
| 00:48.27 | Adys | I try one single search |
| 00:48.30 | Dagmar | Jerub: They have their own GCD |
| 00:48.34 | Dagmar | er CD |
| 00:48.34 | Adys | they cant fucking figure out who jay mohr is |
| 00:48.58 | Dagmar | Jerub: Basically you're never seeing both beer ladies at the same time |
| 00:49.22 | Jerub | Dagmar: that's fine! |
| 00:49.27 | Lunessa | From the same person |
| 00:49.44 | Jerub | Dagmar: but i just want to see the beer ladies in raids ;) |
| 00:50.28 | NightHawkTheSane | mm.. beer ladies... |
| 00:51.06 | Dagmar | If I had my way I'd have a macro that would summon all four of them at once. |
| 00:51.11 | Dagmar | I would then shout "PARTY TIME!" |
| 00:52.22 | Jerub | there are 4? i have the two +170 tanking trinkets. |
| 00:52.37 | NightHawkTheSane | i think he's including the two from last year |
| 00:52.49 | Jerub | oh interesting. |
| 00:52.52 | Dagmar | There are only four that summon beerladies. |
| 01:00.23 | kd3 | huh; neat |
| 01:00.31 | kd3 | finally got off his ass and ran diffs off the listfiles |
| 01:00.53 | kd3 | 11986 lines in the diff, not even counting the enUS bits |
| 01:01.29 | NeoTron | that's a lot of lines |
| 01:02.59 | kd3 | it's a lot less than when I first got... lowercasing, sorting, running uniq got it down to that line |
| 01:03.07 | kd3 | now for the locale bits |
| 01:03.51 | kd3 | just the common stuff, no locale bits: http://wowi.pastey.net/126144 |
| 01:05.57 | NeoTron | I have a feeling half my addons will randomly break for no reason |
| 01:07.05 | Thrae | NeoTron: You voice a common concern with all computer users that don't exactly understand what they're using. |
| 01:08.00 | NeoTron | Thrae: I meant the addons I made and others use :P |
| 01:08.14 | mikma | meh |
| 01:08.18 | mikma | unarmed arthas |
| 01:09.43 | WobWork1 | Dagmar: I have a full chef's outfit with rolling pin and cleaver for putting out fish feasts. As a tauren, it looks -awesome- |
| 01:10.03 | jnwhiteh | have a good night |
| 01:10.06 | Dagmar | heheh |
| 01:10.16 | Shirik | chicken with rice and garlic bread == yum |
| 01:10.23 | Dagmar | I have a crazy messican suit for riding the chopper |
| 01:10.28 | Dagmar | ...but that's about it |
| 01:10.46 | Dagmar | We should have Foror's Crate of Statless Dressup Gear |
| 01:11.22 | Jerub | oh, a serious question: |
| 01:11.29 | Jerub | how do i tell what armor set i'm wearing? |
| 01:12.05 | WobWork1 | Dagmar: oh the mexican suit is for DANCING |
| 01:12.09 | WobWork1 | I have two maracas |
| 01:12.44 | WobWork1 | although they fixed the bug where you could temporarily have the weapons wielded when tauren dancing |
| 01:12.48 | WobWork1 | =( |
| 01:12.58 | Jerub | WobWork1: they did? when? it worked for me. |
| 01:13.06 | Jerub | i mean, before 3.2.2 |
| 01:13.10 | Jerub | i haven't tested since. |
| 01:18.50 | Lunessa | Wait... Where the FUCK do you get maracas? |
| 01:20.05 | Lunessa | I mean, I have the mariachi hat and suit... |
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| 01:23.11 | ScytheBlade1 | kd3: well, that explains the size at least |
| 01:24.45 | Jerub | there are no maracas listed on wowhead. |
| 01:25.06 | Jerub | i have an offhand item that looks like a purple shard that makes a good maraca though ;) |
| 01:25.13 | kd3 | and here's the locale diff: http://wowi.pastey.net/126145 |
| 01:25.56 | kd3 | now without dupe linebreaks |
| 01:27.19 | Dagmar | I don't want maracas. |
| 01:27.25 | Dagmar | I want PISTOLAS! |
| 01:27.53 | Dagmar | If I have to stop to reload them every fourteen shots, it'll be fine. |
| 01:28.32 | Jerub | So, any news on how emblems will work in PTR? |
| 01:28.44 | Jerub | are EoC and EoT staying exactly the same as now? |
| 01:28.50 | Dagmar | They will rain from the sky like candy |
| 01:28.57 | Jerub | Dagmar: no, you're thinking 3.2 |
| 01:29.04 | NightHawkTheSane | yay. candy |
| 01:29.22 | kd3 | jerub; we'll let you know when they implement boss loot |
| 01:29.24 | kd3 | >.> |
| 01:29.25 | Dagmar | No, right now they come down from above like confetti. |
| 01:29.30 | Jerub | at 10 emblems of frost for a raid quest, I'm thinking we'll have to walk through snowdrifts of them... |
| 01:29.44 | Dagmar | I will defintiely have enough shards to buy a full suit of twinkomatic gear by the time Cataclysm comes out |
| 01:29.51 | Dagmar | Actually, we'll probably see a LOT of that going around then |
| 01:30.09 | kd3 | must come up with a more automated way to do that listfile diffing |
| 01:30.13 | Dagmar | It will be WoW 4.0: Revenge of the Twinks |
| 01:30.30 | Jerub | actually onyxia gave me a massive boost to my EoT this week. 6 emblems in 6 hours was good. |
| 01:30.38 | Jerub | I didn't realise she dropped EoT |
| 01:31.01 | Dagmar | She drops six of them? |
| 01:31.05 | Dagmar | I should pay more attention |
| 01:31.08 | kd3 | 3 in 10, 3 in 25 |
| 01:31.08 | Jerub | Dagmar: 10 and 25 |
| 01:31.11 | Dagmar | Ah |
| 01:31.26 | Dagmar | I still gotta turn that head in |
| 01:31.43 | Jerub | lol, you have thehead? |
| 01:31.43 | Jerub | I wish onyxia gave me the head |
| 01:31.43 | Lunessa | Dagmar: if you give them pistolas they will want ze bandoliers, no? And tequila! And a burro to ride. |
| 01:32.13 | Dagmar | I have no problem with that. |
| 01:32.18 | Dagmar | Just so long as it's NOT ANOTHER GOAT |
| 01:32.38 | Dagmar | I especially no problem with tequila if it contains a tiny jormungar at the bottom. |
| 01:32.48 | kd3 | lmao |
| 01:33.16 | Lunessa | Brings a whole new meaning to the achievement "Not one but two jormungar" |
| 01:33.21 | Dagmar | :) |
| 01:34.13 | Dagmar | If you can drink twenty bottles within thirty seconds you should get a tiny jormungar minipet that emits particle bubbles. |
| 01:34.21 | Dagmar | ...without throwing up mind you. |
| 01:35.27 | Dagmar | Then we can all laugh at the kiddies on the forums who'll try to claim that 'real' tequila is made with mescaline. |
| 01:35.54 | Dagmar | Not even mexican bandits are crazy enough to drink something like that. |
| 01:37.08 | Jerub | bwahahaha |
| 01:37.33 | Arrowmaster | has an unopened bottle of 20+ years old tequila with the worm |
| 01:37.41 | WobWork1 | oh wait |
| 01:37.44 | WobWork1 | lemme look them up |
| 01:38.05 | NightHawkTheSane | >.> |
| 01:38.15 | NightHawkTheSane | would not drink any tequila that comes with a worm |
| 01:38.27 | WobWork1 | http://www.wowhead.com/?item=6323 |
| 01:38.32 | Jerub | will drink anything if it involves body shots |
| 01:38.33 | WobWork1 | two of those! |
| 01:38.52 | Arrowmaster | do you have any idea how much alcohol that worm has absorbed by now? |
| 01:39.18 | WobWork1 | one worm's bodyweight in alcohol? |
| 01:39.49 | WobWork1 | and now I'm visualising Jormungar body shots |
| 01:40.14 | WobWork1 | I think that's putting my face too close to a jormungar's body for my comfort |
| 01:40.33 | kd3 | imagines blowing jormungar up with dynamite instead |
| 01:40.45 | WobWork1 | I totally kept that dynamite |
| 01:40.59 | WobWork1 | so I could run through those giant worms with impunity while questing |
| 01:41.03 | Jerub | your face? what about your toungue! |
| 01:41.18 | *** join/#wowuidev Spellshaper (n=Spellsha@dslb-084-057-247-030.pools.arcor-ip.net) |
| 01:41.25 | WobWork1 | Jerub: Furry, I'd imagine |
| 01:41.28 | Jerub | bodyshots aren't right unless they involve salt. |
| 01:43.27 | Adys | http://derrenbrown.co.uk/blog/2009/10/woman-builds-house-human-hair/ |
| 01:43.27 | WobWork1 | but yeah, those maces make -great- maracas |
| 01:44.34 | WobWork1 | and Jerub, you used to be able to hit unsheathe while dancing, and the weapons would temporarily be held in the hands, but it stopped doing it for male tauren recently =( |
| 01:45.35 | Jerub | WobWork1: in 3.2 that worked on my female tauren. |
| 01:45.51 | Jerub | WobWork1: i have a video of it somewhere too :) |
| 01:50.35 | Adys | kd3: ping |
| 01:51.02 | WobWork1 | Jerub: maybe just the male tauren dance then =( |
| 01:51.06 | WobWork1 | I was most disappointed |
| 01:51.32 | WobWork1 | cause the soft shoe shuffle bit, had the maracas crossed across the chest =) |
| 01:52.44 | Lunessa | La cucaracha! |
| 01:55.58 | Lunessa | Male Draenei dance is so lame I always use my Murloc Costume or Ghost Wolf if I want to dance. |
| 01:57.03 | WobWork1 | Tunak tunak! |
| 01:58.11 | *** part/#wowuidev Dewin (n=Daniel@c-71-59-222-35.hsd1.or.comcast.net) |
| 01:58.17 | Kraps | plans to kill his parents friends in their sleep |
| 02:07.48 | Jerub | Kraps: hm? sleep time is the best time for a murder, but not if you want it to look like an accident. |
| 02:08.22 | Jerub | Kraps: while driving or doing some kind of outdoor activity is best. |
| 02:09.35 | MentalPower | building ImageMagick, worse than watching paint dry... |
| 02:13.17 | tem | Wowhead needs a filter for items that are only obtainable by one faction |
| 02:13.20 | Kraps | Jerub: murders of frustration aren't usually thought out well, so i'm sticking to that |
| 02:13.44 | tem | I'm really sick of seeing two copies of every item when I try to pull up a list for upgrades because I'm seeing the horde version alongside my alliance version |
| 02:14.00 | Thunder_Child | Jerub, there are quite a few things that simulate a natural death |
| 02:15.44 | Ackis | ZorbaBeta: pi9ng |
| 02:15.48 | Ackis | ping to but w/e |
| 02:17.22 | *** join/#wowuidev Iriel (n=Iriel@adsl-71-158-244-138.dsl.pltn13.sbcglobal.net) |
| 02:17.23 | *** mode/#wowuidev [+o Iriel] by ChanServ |
| 02:17.34 | Jerub | Kraps: why are you frustrated with them? |
| 02:19.43 | Ackis | anyone here using curse client v3.xxxx? |
| 02:19.46 | Ackis | pm me if so please |
| 02:20.16 | WobWork1 | I might be... if it didn't autoupdate |
| 02:20.24 | WobWork1 | but not at the computer it's installed on atm |
| 02:20.29 | Ackis | 3.xx autoupdated to 4.xx already? |
| 02:20.43 | WobWork1 | shrugs |
| 02:21.12 | WobWork1 | I just assumed from your question that a good percentage of people -wouldn't- be running 3.xxx |
| 02:21.32 | Thunder_Child | Ackis, i have 3.0.0.9 installed |
| 02:21.43 | Ackis | 4.x is in beta right now not fully released |
| 02:21.46 | Thunder_Child | and i have 4 installed, but thats just me |
| 02:21.49 | Ackis | Thunder_Child: do you have questhelper installed? |
| 02:21.53 | Thunder_Child | yes |
| 02:22.22 | Ackis | did you update with 4.0 recently? I'm trying to see if the 3.xxx client is pushing out the right version of quest helper |
| 02:22.39 | Thunder_Child | yes i did update with 4, and 3 is erroring out on it |
| 02:22.47 | Ackis | wicked |
| 02:22.48 | Thunder_Child | but the 4 update was odd... |
| 02:23.03 | Thunder_Child | it called it something other than it's usual name |
| 02:24.37 | *** join/#wowuidev DWSR (i=1872fcf4@gateway/web/freenode/x-olshscvpyuknjbvr) |
| 02:24.52 | DWSR | hey, anyone know if the US login servers just died? |
| 02:25.16 | DWSR | nvm. |
| 02:25.18 | DWSR | Fucking ISP. |
| 02:25.34 | Thunder_Child | Ackis, it's saying that the latest is 1.1.20 but i have 1.1.19 installed |
| 02:26.33 | Ackis | Thunder_Child: v3? |
| 02:26.35 | ScytheBlade1 | How the crap do I tell ARL to give me a list of what I'm missing and nothing more? |
| 02:26.41 | Thunder_Child | Ackis, yes |
| 02:26.54 | Thunder_Child | Ackis, a physical check shows i have 1.1.20 installed |
| 02:27.02 | Thunder_Child | so sayeth the toc |
| 02:27.30 | Ackis | ScytheBlade1: uncheck the "known" filter |
| 02:28.09 | ScytheBlade1 | I click the filter button and it gives me a series of 7 options |
| 02:28.11 | DWSR | SB1: Wondering the same thing |
| 02:28.43 | Ackis | ScytheBlade1: the first one iirc |
| 02:29.03 | ScytheBlade1 | Hey that is better |
| 02:29.05 | Ackis | doesn't use that shitty addon |
| 02:29.18 | ScytheBlade1 | Straight up honest with you, the only reason I use it is to see what I'm missing |
| 02:29.18 | NightHawkTheSane | hugs Ackis |
| 02:29.25 | ScytheBlade1 | You should make that more accessible/obvious :P |
| 02:29.33 | NightHawkTheSane | thats pretty much the only reason anyone uses it, isn't it? |
| 02:29.40 | Ackis | ScytheBlade1: that's all I use it for too but I have them memorized, default settings will display everything that you're missing |
| 02:29.41 | NightHawkTheSane | i really dont need a list of things i already know |
| 02:29.47 | ScytheBlade1 | hm |
| 02:29.49 | ScytheBlade1 | weird |
| 02:30.17 | Ackis | NightHawkTheSane: there were requests (more than a few) to have it display stuff you already knew, mainly for data export purposes |
| 02:30.37 | NightHawkTheSane | o_0 odd |
| 02:31.16 | Ackis | afk to install win 7 on the gf's pc |
| 02:31.30 | DWSR | Ackis: Good call. |
| 02:31.32 | DWSR | W7 > * |
| 02:31.36 | DWSR | You should all upgrade. Now. |
| 02:32.18 | NightHawkTheSane | hm. im not sure i like the upgrade path of jaunty -> w7 |
| 02:32.46 | DWSR | Windows<-Linux is never an upgrade. |
| 02:33.33 | NightHawkTheSane | so, i probably SHOULDN'T upgrade then. ;) |
| 02:33.37 | Thrae | Windows->Linux isn't an upgrade either. It's all about what you want to do with your computer, your expertise, and perspective. |
| 02:33.37 | DWSR | It's not an upgrade, is it? ;) |
| 02:33.48 | Thrae | They're like apples and oranges. |
| 02:33.57 | NightHawkTheSane | Thrae: i'm mostly just poking fun :P |
| 02:34.39 | Thrae | NightHawkTheSane: At rabid Linux fans or rabid Windows fans? |
| 02:34.48 | NightHawkTheSane | yes. |
| 02:35.14 | DWSR | both |
| 02:36.02 | DWSR | I'm a pretty avid Linux user. |
| 02:36.07 | DWSR | But I raelly really like W7 |
| 02:36.15 | ScytheBlade1 | I am too |
| 02:36.18 | ScytheBlade1 | I also really like Vista |
| 02:36.20 | ScytheBlade1 | waits for it |
| 02:36.22 | DWSR | Still have to figure out some of the stuff specific to my laptop (i.e. multitouch)(, but yeah. |
| 02:36.27 | DWSR | TROLL |
| 02:36.34 | ScytheBlade1 | Nope, dead serious |
| 02:36.39 | DWSR | meh. |
| 02:36.40 | DWSR | I didn't hate it. |
| 02:36.45 | DWSR | I just didn't like it all that much either |
| 02:37.03 | NightHawkTheSane | Actually, the only thing that -really- irked me (so far) about w7 is that i couldn't easily set up samba sharing of an entire drive. |
| 02:37.14 | NightHawkTheSane | granted, I was probably doing somethign wrong. But it shouldn't have been so hard that i COULD do somethign wrong |
| 02:37.21 | ScytheBlade1 | It's already setup by default |
| 02:37.25 | ScytheBlade1 | points at C$ |
| 02:37.36 | Thrae | From a programmer's perspective I liked Vista, but from a GUI perspective I didn't. Those few key features in Windows 7 really makes a difference. |
| 02:37.38 | NightHawkTheSane | er, no? |
| 02:37.48 | ScytheBlade1 | Sure is |
| 02:37.53 | ScytheBlade1 | That's how I get access to the drives |
| 02:38.05 | NightHawkTheSane | I wanted public read-only access to several secondary drives. It didn't work |
| 02:38.13 | ScytheBlade1 | Ah, yes, that would not work |
| 02:38.14 | NightHawkTheSane | i couldn't figure out how to make it work. |
| 02:38.20 | ScytheBlade1 | Namely the read only |
| 02:38.23 | NightHawkTheSane | it shouldn't be hard. |
| 02:38.25 | ScytheBlade1 | The admin shares are RW to admin only |
| 02:38.51 | NightHawkTheSane | It takes me 30s to set that up in osx, maybe a minute more in linux. :( |
| 02:40.07 | DWSR | NHTS: Err? |
| 02:40.14 | DWSR | You wanted RO shares to drive roots? |
| 02:40.20 | NightHawkTheSane | yeah, pretty much |
| 02:40.32 | tem | well this is odd |
| 02:40.33 | DWSR | Just did it. |
| 02:40.35 | DWSR | 30 seconds. |
| 02:40.36 | NightHawkTheSane | hell, even RO share of a subdirectory, which also didn't work |
| 02:40.36 | DWSR | Not even. |
| 02:40.40 | tem | wowhead's sort is busted |
| 02:40.51 | DWSR | tem: Oh, so it is. |
| 02:40.55 | NightHawkTheSane | DWSR: Want to explain what you did? I swear it wasn't working for me |
| 02:41.09 | tem | check this out: |
| 02:41.09 | tem | http://www.wowhead.com/?items=2&filter=ty=0:4:7;minle=187;maxle=232;ub=6;cr=79;crs=3;crv=0;gm=4;wt=36:32:20:119:96:103:21:77;wtv=36029:691:261:171:144:126:114:100#0-22+1 |
| 02:41.19 | tem | try to sort by score |
| 02:41.43 | tem | every time I click the score column to sort it, I get a different weapon at the top |
| 02:42.01 | DWSR | NHTS: Right click the drive, go to share with->Advanced sharing. |
| 02:42.18 | ScytheBlade1 | Or better yet |
| 02:42.25 | ScytheBlade1 | Use the sharing MMC snapin |
| 02:42.36 | Thunder_Child | i am sad when the native res of a video file is larger than my screen |
| 02:42.52 | DWSR | SB1: I'm doing this the beginner friendly way. |
| 02:43.12 | NightHawkTheSane | DWSR: i did that, but boxee (on my appletv, which is what i wanted to share to) would see the drive, but NOTHING underneath it. |
| 02:43.15 | ScytheBlade1 | Right, straight to "Advanced Sharing" is beginner friendly ;) |
| 02:43.39 | DWSR | SB1: Only option there is. ;) |
| 02:44.08 | NightHawkTheSane | and doing the same thing with a sub-directory on the drive wouldnt show up at all :P |
| 02:44.28 | DWSR | NHTS: Anyway I can remote into your system to have a look? |
| 02:44.33 | ScytheBlade1 | Sounds like NTFS permissions, actually |
| 02:44.35 | DWSR | Not that I don't trust you, but you might have overlooked something. |
| 02:45.04 | ScytheBlade1 | Enable access denied auditing, open up boxee, and take a look in the event log |
| 02:45.16 | NightHawkTheSane | DWSR: i may have. but in either case, I'm not booted into w7 right now (i dual boot my mac pro) |
| 02:45.17 | ScytheBlade1 | I bet you'll see a wall of "access denied" |
| 02:45.21 | tem | actually, it doesn't even sort by weapon speed properly |
| 02:45.37 | NightHawkTheSane | ScytheBlade1: could be. which is kinda silly |
| 02:45.44 | DWSR | NHTS: Did you make sure that your W7 PC is set to even enable sharing (i.e. set to a home/private network as opposed to public)? |
| 02:45.54 | NightHawkTheSane | yeah |
| 02:46.14 | cogwheel | Shirik: ping |
| 02:46.14 | DWSR | huh |
| 02:46.16 | Iriel | NightHawkTheSane: the poor machine 8-) |
| 02:46.17 | DWSR | Well mine's working fine. |
| 02:46.21 | cogwheel | (or any C++ experts) |
| 02:46.21 | Shirik | no |
| 02:46.25 | Shirik | ok what |
| 02:46.25 | cogwheel | :( |
| 02:46.30 | Shirik | C++ always gets my time :) |
| 02:46.33 | cogwheel | http://codepad.org/HpkYEMj1 <-- any ideas? compiles fine on VS |
| 02:46.36 | Shirik | so long as it's not C++ bashing |
| 02:46.39 | NightHawkTheSane | Iriel: hehe, i only really boot into w7 for a few games that don't have mac versions. :P |
| 02:46.53 | Iriel | NightHawkTheSane: Ok, that's acceptable 8-) |
| 02:47.05 | Iriel | NightHawkTheSane: I'd have to do that if I didn't have a separate PC for such things |
| 02:47.05 | Shirik | in raid atm |
| 02:47.08 | Shirik | give me a bit to look at it |
| 02:47.17 | cogwheel | kk... also gonna post in #C++ |
| 02:47.49 | NightHawkTheSane | Iriel: yeah, i don't, so thats my only real option. Pain in the ass to install it, too. >< |
| 02:48.04 | Ackis | i just saw a dude take lamb testicles and rip them out with his mouth |
| 02:48.18 | NightHawkTheSane | apprently w7 doesn't like installing to 'secondary' drives |
| 02:49.59 | A-KO | what? |
| 02:50.06 | A-KO | what do you mean by that? |
| 02:50.21 | A-KO | I've had no drive problems :P raids, usb drives, usb flash drives, dvd roms, dvd burners, blu-ray, etc. |
| 02:50.35 | Thrae | Ackis: A lamb is a young sheep. That's cruel. |
| 02:51.06 | Dagmar | Not a constant reference? |
| 02:51.23 | Thrae | NightHawkTheSane: Really? Works fine with me. Even with my RAID 0. |
| 02:51.48 | Ackis | Thrae: yes, a lamb is a young sheep |
| 02:51.50 | Lunessa | Windows 7 - Not just for C:\ anymore. |
| 02:51.52 | NightHawkTheSane | I forgot the exact issue, but w7 would throw an error if I tried to install it to a partition that wasn't on my first drive. (disk0 or what-have-you) |
| 02:51.52 | Dagmar | There's rather a LOT of these showing up |
| 02:51.56 | Ackis | it's on dirty jobs on discovery channel lol |
| 02:51.58 | *** join/#wowuidev robotusch (n=robotusc@50A2DBFE.flatrate.dk) |
| 02:52.12 | NightHawkTheSane | i found the issue somewhere on microsofts site, but i've since deleted the bookmark for it i had ;\ |
| 02:52.22 | Dagmar | NightHawkTheSane: It's hell-bent on being the first enumeratable partition on your machine just like the Windows before it |
| 02:52.34 | cogwheel | Shirik: by the error message it seems to be something to do with the way g++ handles references to literals... i'll try to find a simpler test case |
| 02:52.36 | NightHawkTheSane | I ended up having to install it to a partition on my primary drive, image the partition, and then move it to a partition on a secondary drive |
| 02:52.46 | NightHawkTheSane | Dagmar: yeah, something like that. |
| 02:53.02 | Dagmar | cogwheel: There's about a ton of nearly identical issues that'll come up from a Google search on "no match for 'operator^'" |
| 02:53.27 | cogwheel | Dagmar: that's relatively meaningless ;) |
| 02:54.00 | cogwheel | that's like generic error message 003 when you have problems with templates |
| 02:54.19 | Thrae | Anyway, why would you want Windows 7 on a secondary drive? It's RTM now and pretty damn stable. |
| 02:54.59 | Corrodias | RTM = read the manual? |
| 02:54.59 | ScytheBlade1 | Thrae: because my primary drive is linux |
| 02:55.00 | Thrae | Release To Manufacturing |
| 02:55.00 | Dagmar | Well, it looks like the issue is that it's getting upset because it's being handed something that isn't a reference to a constant |
| 02:55.00 | Lunessa | Because he wants it on another device than his primary Mac OSX partition? |
| 02:55.00 | Corrodias | oh yeah. i always wait until at least the first service pack for a new windows OS. |
| 02:55.01 | Corrodias | at least i do now. |
| 02:55.03 | NightHawkTheSane | what Lunessa said |
| 02:55.27 | Thrae | Corrodias: Well, consider Windows 7 like Vista SP2 + a few changes. |
| 02:55.39 | A-KO | Corrodias: that's an aged assumption for using an OS |
| 02:55.46 | Thrae | Which it basically is, even down below in the API. |
| 02:55.52 | Dagmar | I just freaking BARELY understnad it |
| 02:56.00 | Corrodias | an "aged assumption" valid through XP and Vista |
| 02:56.09 | A-KO | incorrect Corrodias |
| 02:56.28 | A-KO | both XP and Vista were fine at release, at least from my standpoint (having used every Windows OS since Windows 3.0) |
| 02:56.34 | Thrae | What was the problem with Vista Gold? I used Vista x64 Gold and didn't have any problems. |
| 02:56.39 | Corrodias | you just have lower standards |
| 02:56.40 | Lunessa | I've been using Windows 7 for a week or so here in the office. It makes me want to install it at home. |
| 02:56.46 | A-KO | Thrae: it had its fair share of problems but some people are just idiots |
| 02:56.49 | A-KO | that's all |
| 02:56.50 | A-KO | :P |
| 02:57.21 | Corrodias | i don't remember the early issues. fuck, i never experienced them because i waited. but people talk about them. even this article that explains why vista is a good OS admits it had problems early on, as all windowses have. |
| 02:57.24 | Thrae | A-KO: XP had some big security holes at release and general fuck-ups. I could see XP SP1 as a better alternative. |
| 02:57.40 | A-KO | Corrodias: Every OS and person has their own metric for using software. Some run up-to-the-second betas, others wait for repositories to update, others wait until it's been tested for years. Some wait for service packs, others wait for updates--and yet others wait until you absolutely cannot possibly get support anymore and they're forced to change. |
| 02:57.45 | Dagmar | Corrodias: It's a bald-faced lie |
| 02:57.53 | Corrodias | not hugemajor ones, but genuine issues that were addressed eventually. |
| 02:57.57 | Dagmar | er boldfaced lie |
| 02:58.36 | A-KO | It works for and against many operating systems to have those policies :P |
| 02:59.05 | Dagmar | A-KO: I measure their utility by how much time gets wasted waiting for a support rep to get back to us |
| 02:59.06 | Thrae | Corrodias: They said the same thing about XP, and now people tote XP as a godsend over Vista. Really it's all about program and hardware compatibility, which isn't Microsoft's fault. People's favorite programs / hardware has problems and they blame Microsoft, when really what Microsoft was doing was reworking the API to clean up a bunch of security holes and hacks that XP had for backwards compatibility. |
| 02:59.07 | Corrodias | well, you can believe what you wish, i'm not really invested in convincing you. |
| 02:59.25 | A-KO | for example here, Debian/Ubuntu didn't update ProFTPD for a long, long, long, long time. And a lot of FTP clients fixed some stuff related to terminating SSL connections. ProFTPD released a patch update, but those distros didn't update to it. Needless to say, it was a pain in the ass to get in there. |
| 02:59.45 | Corrodias | Thrae: and they were right about XP, it did have issues in the early days that were addressed later on. |
| 02:59.45 | A-KO | yep Thrae |
| 02:59.45 | Thrae | Corrodias: A lot of people don't realize that a) XP had the full Win 3.x API, and B) How idiotic that was |
| 02:59.45 | Dagmar | Thrae: Because XP was a corncob up the wazoo when it came out. People explicitly waited to Sp1 for it to stop sucking enough to make itself a successor to 98se |
| 02:59.53 | DWSR | Wait until SP1 of any new operating system really only applies to large scale environments (read: corporate). |
| 02:59.59 | Dagmar | Thrae: It didn't get "good" until SP2. Vista was just a repeat of that |
| 03:00.09 | Shirik | I think |
| 03:00.10 | Corrodias | Thrae: what, do you want me to pity XP? do you want me to install XP GOld because i feel it tried? |
| 03:00.10 | DWSR | For home users, hoping on the Vista or XP bandwagon at release didn't really have any detrimental effects. |
| 03:00.13 | Lunessa | Frankly backwards compatibility for the microcomputer age shouldn't be as big a deal as it is. 10 years, tops. :P |
| 03:00.13 | Shirik | cogwheel |
| 03:00.14 | Dagmar | You might as well just call W7 Vista SP2 |
| 03:00.16 | A-KO | There is no need to wait for a service pack to update to the latest OS. |
| 03:00.25 | ScytheBlade1 | DWSR: I'd agrue the exact opposite. Corporate can make it work no matter what. Home users are going to have 10000 different devices all needing varied drivers |
| 03:00.31 | Dagmar | Lunessa: but it lets Microsoft f*ck the other OS vendors over |
| 03:00.31 | A-KO | In fact, I'd argue against staying with the older technology |
| 03:00.41 | DWSR | SB1: Untested security flaws. |
| 03:00.42 | Dagmar | Like, you know why you can't use UTC in your system clock with XP? |
| 03:00.45 | DWSR | Or, unknown. |
| 03:00.46 | Dagmar | "DOS COMPATIBILITY" |
| 03:00.56 | Dagmar | A complete and utter load of bollocks. |
| 03:00.57 | Corrodias | in the particular case of 7, being built on vista/2008 as it is, waiting may not provide any significant benefits |
| 03:01.04 | Lunessa | Dagmar: DOS isn't done until Lotus doesn't run. |
| 03:01.05 | DWSR | ^^ |
| 03:01.10 | Thrae | Dagmar: I fail to have heard the major reasons Vista failed, besides the Basic/Premium OEM scam. |
| 03:01.12 | cogwheel | Shirik: pong |
| 03:01.13 | A-KO | DWSR: every application carries a risk of security flaws, every OS, everything. Whether you wait for service packs or not. |
| 03:01.17 | Dagmar | Lunessa: There's some users that need to have "accidents">? |
| 03:01.18 | Shirik | nm |
| 03:01.21 | ScytheBlade1 | DWSR: going to happen anyway, and kinda pointless as the DOS aspect hasn't changed since 2k |
| 03:01.23 | A-KO | Thrae: Recession, honestly. |
| 03:01.28 | Dagmar | If these fuckers are still using Lotus, then why the hell would they upgrade to XP? |
| 03:01.30 | A-KO | Thrae: and XP's longetivity and support. |
| 03:01.42 | A-KO | XP SP2 was the worst thing that could have happened to Vista |
| 03:02.07 | Dagmar | W7 has appeared to at least be a good flying start to the Sp1 stage |
| 03:02.08 | A-KO | that and the fact it took Core 2 a long time to catch on with users |
| 03:02.29 | Thrae | A-KO: I'm talking logical, not practical. |
| 03:02.45 | Dagmar | A-KO: s/catch on/become affordable/; |
| 03:02.45 | Lunessa | Dagmar: I'm actually perfectly happy to keep supporting XP for another year or so. After that, really I'd like us to skip Vista and just go to 7. And then virtualize XP for legacy stuff we /must/ keep. |
| 03:02.48 | Dagmar | Lunessa: That's _exactly_ what we're doing |
| 03:03.08 | Dagmar | literally everyone who got saddled with Vista was practicalyl crippled by it. They all got "upgraded" back to XP. |
| 03:03.12 | Dagmar | We're going straight to W7. |
| 03:03.17 | A-KO | Dagmar: yes, the point I'm making is that Vista had a slow/terrible start because most people were still stuck on their P4 Northwoods, 2.4Ghz-2.8Ghz, or Athlon 64 3000+ with 1GB of DDR1 ram systems running the 6800 series of graphics cards in AGP. |
| 03:03.24 | A-KO | and that was pretty standard up until pretty much late last year |
| 03:03.25 | Shirik | lol cogwheel this is a mess |
| 03:03.27 | Dagmar | What |
| 03:03.29 | Dagmar | No. |
| 03:03.33 | Corrodias | that's unfortunate that your people had problems with vista |
| 03:03.39 | Dagmar | Don't even *try* to blame the suck in the OS on the hardware they were running it on. |
| 03:03.40 | A-KO | Vista was a great OS |
| 03:03.41 | Lunessa | We're trucking along doing Vista installs - because we probably won't go to Windows 7 for 12+ months after it ships. |
| 03:03.43 | Thrae | I'll agree Microsoft didn't make the best marketing decisions, so Vista failed practically but not logically. |
| 03:03.50 | Corrodias | maybe they switched too early, or maybe they didn't bother to learn how to use vista |
| 03:03.50 | A-KO | We're doing a massive Vista rollout at work |
| 03:03.53 | Dagmar | There are serious architectural issues in Vista |
| 03:04.01 | A-KO | no, there aren't :P |
| 03:04.07 | Dagmar | It's got nothing to do with _perfectly functional hardware_ |
| 03:04.14 | A-KO | there were some serious architectural changes, all of which carried over to Windows 7 |
| 03:04.17 | Corrodias | i'm not a fan of the audio system change in vista. otherwise i am not aware of problems. |
| 03:04.19 | A-KO | so what is "flawed" in Vista is carried over to 7 |
| 03:04.21 | cogwheel | Shirik: fo shizzle ;) |
| 03:04.23 | Thrae | Dagmar: Vista was designed to FIX architectural issues in XP. So what issues were there? |
| 03:04.28 | Corrodias | and A-KO is dead-on about 7. |
| 03:04.39 | Dagmar | A-KO: Login to Vista on a domain connected system. Then logout. Now look at the screen. Who is logged in? NO ONE. What's it show? The user you just logged in then logged back out. |
| 03:05.01 | Corrodias | what's it "show"? |
| 03:05.04 | A-KO | uhm, what? |
| 03:05.14 | A-KO | And that is a problem, why? |
| 03:05.15 | Corrodias | what do you mean it shows the user? |
| 03:05.16 | Lunessa | Yeah... I'm confused too. |
| 03:05.21 | Shirik | cogwheel |
| 03:05.24 | Shirik | explain the logic to me |
| 03:05.25 | Dagmar | Thrae: I'm sorry, I don't feel any need to go into details that have been posted all over the internet in the course of blowing a hole in the "theory" that the problem with Vista is that everyone didn't buy new hardware. |
| 03:05.25 | A-KO | Corrodias: XP had a policy to not display the last logged in username |
| 03:05.28 | A-KO | apparently he dislikes it |
| 03:05.30 | Shirik | because I agree with g++ right now |
| 03:05.32 | cogwheel | Shirik: it's identical to yours |
| 03:05.35 | Dagmar | The lack of PAE in the CPU should not even be a minor issue |
| 03:05.41 | Shirik | I see no match for double ^ anything |
| 03:05.49 | Corrodias | A-KO: i'm pretty sure that was actually a configurable option in the group policy, and i bet vista does too, though i'm not sure. |
| 03:05.58 | Dagmar | A-KO: No, XP shows who *is* logged in. |
| 03:06.01 | cogwheel | friend T operator ^ (const T& left, ConstIdentifierClass <T, Op >& right) |
| 03:06.02 | cogwheel | { return right._op(left, right._obj); } |
| 03:06.05 | Dagmar | If no one's logged in, you can tell. |
| 03:06.16 | A-KO | Corrodias: Vista forces Windows Welcome, but I fail to see the problem--at work everyone has their own system, so I mean, the last logged in username is the person who sits at that desk. |
| 03:06.18 | Shirik | mmm |
| 03:06.23 | Dagmar | With Vista, you've got no idea if what you're seeing is someone else's active session or not. |
| 03:06.31 | Dagmar | ...and that's just for starters |
| 03:06.34 | Thrae | Dagmar: If you read what I said before, I agree Vista was a marketing failure, but I do not see how it failed from a logical perspective of OS design. |
| 03:06.38 | A-KO | Dagmar: Pretty sure Vista says that "other users are logged into this system" |
| 03:06.42 | ScytheBlade1 | A-KO: w7 forces it as well |
| 03:06.43 | Corrodias | oh, i think i get what he means. i don't have this on a domain, so i can't verify his claims. |
| 03:06.47 | A-KO | I know ScytheBlade1 |
| 03:06.51 | cogwheel | Shirik: since - has higher precedence than ^ I had to do that side first |
| 03:06.55 | A-KO | my work machine is Vista SP2, on the corporate domain |
| 03:06.57 | A-KO | I don't see an issue |
| 03:07.17 | A-KO | I boot up, log in, lock machine, shutdown at end of day. We're also doing a massive 1200 machine rollout of vista business in the coming weeks. |
| 03:07.22 | Dagmar | It's been a pain in our ass in this office becuause we do have a bunch of workstations and laptops in docking stations an no "assigned seats" per se |
| 03:07.53 | Corrodias | i have no idea what vista does for its login screen in a domain environment |
| 03:08.01 | Jerub | hehehehe |
| 03:08.03 | A-KO | Corrodias: same thing as it does in a workgroup environment |
| 03:08.05 | Dagmar | Vista simply _stayed_ in a pre-SP1 state |
| 03:08.08 | A-KO | except it says DOMAIN\USER |
| 03:08.10 | Jerub | is it okay for me to just listen to this and chuckle? |
| 03:08.29 | A-KO | Dagmar: It sounds like you're making a mountain out of a mole hill, honestly. |
| 03:08.41 | Thrae | Jerub: Yeah, it's beating a dead horse. |
| 03:08.45 | Dagmar | Any way you slice it, the majority of the business world definitely decided Vista was crap and backed off. |
| 03:09.01 | Jerub | Thrae: dead, buried, forgotten about since before I'd had sex with a woman. |
| 03:09.01 | Jerub | ;) |
| 03:09.02 | Dagmar | A-KO: No, I'm listing one really obvious issue where it fails in an office |
| 03:09.03 | A-KO | Dagmar: Probably because they wanted to save a shitton of $ on IT, since you know, IT is a money pit. |
| 03:09.11 | Dagmar | I have to keep reiterating it because you can't pay attention |
| 03:09.13 | A-KO | "Vista is bad" was just an excuse |
| 03:09.40 | Corrodias | Dagmar: so what happens when you enable "Interactive Login: Do not display last user name" group policy? |
| 03:09.42 | Dagmar | You haven't seen the contracts these folks sign |
| 03:09.45 | A-KO | I think Vista is one of the best things to happen to the WIndows world, 7 even better. |
| 03:09.58 | A-KO | Dagmar: I'm pretty sure the contracts that my company is signing for what we're using rivals what you're seeing :P |
| 03:10.00 | Dagmar | Corrodias: I would *hope* it would then make it apparently whether or not anyone is logged in |
| 03:10.12 | Dagmar | A-KO: Doubt it. |
| 03:10.18 | Dagmar | I used to work for Deloitte & Touceh. |
| 03:10.24 | Lunessa | I'm only griping that we're moving to Vista still because Windows 7 is better - but here, adopting anything new is a long, slow process. |
| 03:10.34 | Dagmar | Unless your company was handling licences in the >50,000 users bracket, then no. |
| 03:10.34 | A-KO | Dagmar: 6 figures on a single software suite, not counting the hardware costs nor the OS licensing :P |
| 03:10.34 | Corrodias | nobody is logged in if you see the login screen. did the person hit "switch user" instead of "lock computer"? |
| 03:10.53 | A-KO | Dagmar: 25K :P |
| 03:11.00 | Thrae | A-KO: Save a shit ton on upgrading components. Government is a huge contract for computers, yet many rather crucial departments are still in the DOS / Win 3.x age with the programs they use. The bottom line is that the bigger a company is, the harder such massive change can be. |
| 03:11.04 | Dagmar | You don't pay for upgrades at that level, you're flat out shipping trucks of money to them on a regular interval. |
| 03:11.37 | Dagmar | They renegotiate every three to five years. |
| 03:11.38 | Corrodias | this is what you get? http://img135.imageshack.us/i/vistadomainlogonap3.png |
| 03:11.44 | Dagmar | ...but this is not something that's tied to OS upgrades. |
| 03:11.56 | A-KO | Thrae: I agree, but what I'm saying is that part of the problems, at least from what I've seen, is that people are resistant to change moreso than the products being good, bad, or worse. Learning something new involves not only learning it, but its quirks--I'm one of the types of people where I thrive on learning something new, and I quickly realize where the previous tech fails. |
| 03:12.12 | Dagmar | Corrodias: Considering I stick with the machines that use XP? A 404 seems somewhat appropraite |
| 03:12.15 | Shirik | cogwheel: |
| 03:12.16 | Shirik | Found it |
| 03:12.40 | A-KO | Thrae: It also involves actually working for their $, something they haven't had to do in a long ass time |
| 03:12.43 | A-KO | until management comes knocking |
| 03:12.43 | Shirik | Visual Studio is actually quite helpful in this |
| 03:12.46 | Thrae | A-KO: The people that ultimately make the decisions barely know how to check their email. |
| 03:12.47 | A-KO | then it's back into maintenance mode |
| 03:13.02 | Shirik | cogwheel: Go to /w4: http://wowi.pastey.net/126148 |
| 03:13.03 | Corrodias | does anyone else get 404 on that link? |
| 03:13.07 | A-KO | yes Corrodias |
| 03:13.11 | ScytheBlade1 | yup |
| 03:13.12 | Arrowmaster | yes |
| 03:13.22 | Dagmar | Thrae: I imagine A-KO's company contract also has Microsoft in control of the "first right of refusal" so yes, I'd have to agree. |
| 03:13.25 | Corrodias | how about with this thing on the end? http://img135.imageshack.us/i/vistadomainlogonap3.png/ |
| 03:13.36 | Thrae | If you find a company where IT is actually trusted on their word, and the company isn't already in the IT sector itself, that's a cool company. |
| 03:13.39 | Dagmar | The people at Microsoft who make the decisions about whether large companies run a given software package or not can barely find their butts with both hands. |
| 03:14.09 | A-KO | Thrae: It's a fighting process :P |
| 03:14.13 | A-KO | but so far |
| 03:14.14 | Thrae | Dagmar: Yeah that's what I hear from insiders. But the programmers are a whole different breed. |
| 03:14.15 | Dagmar | Corrodias: Other than it's a login screen, sort ot |
| 03:14.17 | A-KO | in the IT world |
| 03:14.22 | Corrodias | now, i don't see how you're going to see that login screen if someone is already logged in |
| 03:14.31 | A-KO | the hate for Vista/7 is merely down to "he said she said" sort of deal |
| 03:14.52 | Dagmar | Thrae: It's not a rumor. I had to go through a lot of crap to write an RFP that prevented Microsoft from being run on the web server for the internal security department there. |
| 03:14.53 | Arrowmaster | can i still hate office 07? |
| 03:15.02 | Dagmar | Thrae: It was the ONLY webserver still running when Blaster hit. |
| 03:15.11 | Shirik | cogwheel http://codepad.org/pOMvEsp6 |
| 03:15.12 | A-KO | blaster? |
| 03:15.12 | Shirik | Fixed |
| 03:15.14 | Thrae | I remember being told about a room in Microsoft where the lowest-level programmers are basically given free roam and shout out every time they save a few clock cycles. |
| 03:15.17 | A-KO | how many years ago was that? |
| 03:15.21 | Dagmar | Corrodias: Here it still shows the user's icon after they've logged out. |
| 03:15.29 | A-KO | Dagmar: what's wrong with that? |
| 03:15.30 | Thrae | Even if you hate Microsoft, that is still cool. |
| 03:15.43 | A-KO | Dagmar: I fail to see where the problem is that it still shows a user's icon or last logged in username. |
| 03:15.47 | Jerub | Thrae: do they refer to these people as the 'bug adders' or something? |
| 03:15.47 | Corrodias | that sounds like non-domain-connected behavior. that's what i get here at home... |
| 03:15.51 | Dagmar | A-KO: That it looks exactly the same as the screen when someone's locked it, |
| 03:16.01 | Corrodias | and my "locked" screen looks very different. |
| 03:16.05 | A-KO | Dagmar: on the locked screen it says "This computer is locked, press CTRL + ALT + DEL" |
| 03:16.11 | Jerub | "edit random parts of the sourcetree and make the code more complex and buggy in the name of optimisation" |
| 03:16.27 | cogwheel | Shirik: VS isn't giving me any warnings on W4 |
| 03:16.28 | Dagmar | Either way, I don't care. I'm done with tolerating Vista |
| 03:16.29 | A-KO | at least on mine it does :P |
| 03:16.32 | ZorbaBeta | jerub, MS has heavy, heavy testing. if they're working on the deep down core code I imagine their code gets horrifyingly tested. plus, anyone who's able to work effectively in those circumstances is probably crazy good at writing bugfree code in the first place |
| 03:16.36 | Dagmar | W7 hasn't worked hard at screwing up |
| 03:16.38 | Shirik | cogwheel: 2008? |
| 03:16.41 | cogwheel | yep |
| 03:16.43 | Shirik | Pro? |
| 03:16.49 | Shirik | I think it's the same compiler, pro shouldn't matter |
| 03:16.50 | cogwheel | yep |
| 03:16.56 | Dagmar | Zorba's high. |
| 03:17.03 | A-KO | If you guys want to learn the internals of WIndows, go grab that new Sysinternals book that was released. |
| 03:17.03 | cogwheel | but thanks anyway =) |
| 03:17.20 | A-KO | The people that wrote that book would make any critic of Windows go cry in a corner :P |
| 03:17.25 | Shirik | well you see the problem though right? :) |
| 03:17.27 | alestane | My wife is digging her way through that book. She says it's very high in fiber. |
| 03:17.28 | Corrodias | if your login screen looks like this, http://media.photobucket.com/image/vista%20home%20login%20screen/skyangel14/All_Vista_logons1.jpg - then you may not be properly connected to the domain, i don't know. |
| 03:17.34 | Thrae | Jerub: Haha, no. A bug would save infinite clock cycles because you'd instantly get a BSOD ;) |
| 03:17.51 | ZorbaBeta | The core of Windows tends to be quite stable, and has been for a very, very long time |
| 03:17.59 | ZorbaBeta | the UI, that's another matter. Drivers, that's also another matter. |
| 03:18.05 | cogwheel | Shirik: not really... I thought the fact that the ConstIdentifier's member object was const would've been enough |
| 03:18.06 | A-KO | ZorbaBeta: Try getting "the masses" to understand that |
| 03:18.06 | Dagmar | ZorbaBeta: http://www.theregister.co.uk/2009/08/14/ms_zero_day_long_gestation/ |
| 03:18.11 | Jerub | but drivers touch the core so heavily, that's the problem :/ |
| 03:18.13 | ZorbaBeta | You wouldn't put that much effort into saving clock cycles anywhere besides the core, however. |
| 03:18.15 | DWSR | lol |
| 03:18.22 | DWSR | A-KO: If they understood that, people wouldn't buy Macs. |
| 03:18.27 | cogwheel | s/object/reference/ |
| 03:18.29 | A-KO | lol DWSR |
| 03:18.35 | Thrae | ZorbaBeta: What I was talking about was people working on the kernel. |
| 03:18.42 | Dagmar | There were variations on nestea that worked for over a year after they were supposedly patched. |
| 03:18.49 | Shirik | problem is you're binding a non-lvalue ConstIdentifier to a reference |
| 03:19.01 | Shirik | you can't bind a non-lvalue to a reference |
| 03:19.02 | ZorbaBeta | dagmar, what about it? there's a big difference between the kernel hacker groups and the management in charge of pretending that MS Office is secure |
| 03:19.02 | A-KO | Dagmar: and the same sorts of problems exist in other OS' |
| 03:19.13 | Shirik | non constant reference* |
| 03:19.15 | ZorbaBeta | thrae, yeah, I have a lot of respect for MS's kernel team. That part at least works well. |
| 03:19.22 | Arrowmaster | Dagmar: i dont understand how they can use the term zero day in that article |
| 03:19.31 | Dagmar | A-KO: other OSes ship bugfixes that arent' checks for the tainted data |
| 03:19.33 | A-KO | Arrowmaster: makes it hyped up |
| 03:19.41 | Shirik | the result of __-5 is not an lvalue |
| 03:19.43 | Dagmar | Arrowmaster: You're not the only one. |
| 03:19.47 | Shirik | thus it cannot be bound to a non-constant reference |
| 03:19.47 | Lunessa | ActiveX - Crap, crap, more crap, and then even more crap. |
| 03:19.53 | Arrowmaster | we need a new term for zero day |
| 03:19.58 | Dagmar | Apparently if they use the term "zero day" they can pretend they haven't been made aware of it over a year ago. |
| 03:20.01 | Arrowmaster | then a new term for when that one gets abused |
| 03:20.12 | Jerub | that's theregister. |
| 03:20.17 | Shirik | make sense cogwheel? |
| 03:20.18 | Jerub | you can't believe anything they say. |
| 03:20.19 | Dagmar | I saw we just start shooting marketing people who lie. |
| 03:20.28 | Shirik | I know it's hard to parse because there's like 3 conversations going on |
| 03:20.28 | Jerub | stupid goddamn sensationlist rag. |
| 03:20.38 | Arrowmaster | Dagmar: im for that |
| 03:20.39 | Dagmar | Hackers invented the term 0day for a specific reason with a rather specific meaning. |
| 03:21.03 | Dagmar | Jerb: The problem is they're not being sensationalist. MS has a history of sitting on bugs until they're well in the wild. |
| 03:21.05 | A-KO | 0day exploit code for a vulnerability that is released on the same day. |
| 03:21.24 | Thrae | Really it's the Marketing department that has been to blame for much of XP's problems. From insiders, Windows XP was basically designed by the Marketing department. Vista was more of a collaboration, which is why you found a lot saner API choices. However, the Marketing department again screwed up by releasing Vista so early. |
| 03:21.30 | Dagmar | I wish I could remember the name of that last big RPC exploit |
| 03:21.33 | A-KO | Dagmar: was that bug truly exploited in the wild though? How prevalant was it? |
| 03:21.44 | Dagmar | I saw working code for it three full months before MS even admitted there was a problem |
| 03:21.55 | NightHawkTheSane | Thrae: you could substitute any product for 'XP' in that sentance and have it be true |
| 03:22.00 | NightHawkTheSane | well, not any, but a lot |
| 03:22.05 | Lunessa | http://www.crn.com/security/220301140 - /sigh/ |
| 03:22.07 | A-KO | Dagmar: You also have to take into consideration Vista/UAC now, which mitigates exploits as well far more than XP did. :P |
| 03:22.11 | Dagmar | ...and the whole time Microsoft was swearing it wasn't possible |
| 03:22.19 | DWSR | A-KO: No it doesn't. |
| 03:22.20 | Arrowmaster | UAC doesnt really do anything |
| 03:22.24 | NightHawkTheSane | (well, you know what i mean.. *goes back to doing what ever it was he was doing before( |
| 03:22.30 | DWSR | A-KO: It just means the user has to be involved in the process. |
| 03:22.31 | Dagmar | A-KO: People could have always just made their account NOT be the freaking administrator |
| 03:22.31 | Arrowmaster | because people arent willing to use a non admin account |
| 03:22.47 | DWSR | A-KO: You're assuming users are intelligent on some level. They're not, by in large. |
| 03:22.56 | Arrowmaster | UAC doesnt really protect against anything if you are running as an admin |
| 03:23.00 | A-KO | Dagmar: yes but then most software would have broken, which isn't entirely the user's fault, nor Microsoft's. (as the practice of proper development had been pushed by Microsoft since the 2000 days) |
| 03:23.05 | A-KO | Arrowmaster: yes, yes it does. |
| 03:23.11 | Corrodias | that's not true, Arrowmaster, because you still have to say "yes, rape my PC" |
| 03:23.21 | A-KO | DWSR: no, you're right, but the burden gets placed on the user, not the OS> |
| 03:23.27 | Arrowmaster | no it doesnt, microsoft engineers have said that UAC will not protect you if you have admin rights |
| 03:23.32 | cogwheel | Shirik: i finally got it as i was trying to explain how i didn't get it :) |
| 03:23.34 | A-KO | Arrowmaster: URL? |
| 03:23.38 | Shirik | lol |
| 03:23.41 | Arrowmaster | go google it |
| 03:23.52 | Arrowmaster | theres a lot of pages about it |
| 03:23.54 | A-KO | Arrowmaster: UAC will protect you, it simply tells you to click yes. Whether or not a user clicks yes is up to the user, not the OS. |
| 03:24.10 | *** join/#wowuidev tekkub (n=tekkub@WoWUIDev/WoWI/Featured/Dongle/GitHub/Tekkub) |
| 03:24.10 | *** mode/#wowuidev [+v tekkub] by ChanServ |
| 03:24.13 | Arrowmaster | theres code to get around that |
| 03:24.14 | A-KO | I make very key distinctions between what the OS is responsible for and what the user is responsible for. |
| 03:24.18 | Arrowmaster | and it will not be fixed |
| 03:24.20 | A-KO | Arrowmaster: not when UAC is kicked up to its maximum |
| 03:24.34 | Dagmar | Well, it'll be fixed once someone makes a public tool to let any idiot exploit it. |
| 03:24.39 | A-KO | it's impossible as changing the UAC level requires a UAC prompt to begin with--assuming you clicked it to maximum. |
| 03:24.42 | Arrowmaster | they already did Dagmar |
| 03:24.46 | Dagmar | If they didn't all have day jobs now, it would probably be the cDc that would do it |
| 03:24.46 | Corrodias | "Note that the Secure Desktop Mode which appears when the UAC prompt pops up - namely the darkening of the screen and suspension of background activity - while equally annoying, is an essential component of UAC specifically designed to prevent a range of tricks like the spoofing of UAC prompts or moving the actual position of your mouse cursor to the left so that when you think you're clicking Cancel, you're actually clicking C |
| 03:24.53 | Shirik | tbh cogwheel, that's a very strange extension Microsoft has |
| 03:25.09 | Shirik | allowing you to bind a non-lvalue to a non-const reference is dangerous |
| 03:25.27 | A-KO | Dagmar: The problem is that basically, under Windows 7's reduced UAC prompting, applications can fuck with UAC's settings--which is entirely true. But I mean, people wanted less UAC prompts--which also in exchange brings less security, so they reap what they sew IMO. |
| 03:25.33 | Shirik | there's a very good reason it's illegal |
| 03:25.36 | A-KO | I immediately kick UAC to maximum, which mitigates said flaw |
| 03:25.40 | A-KO | and removes it |
| 03:25.48 | Dagmar | A-KO: It's still not going to help them when they make their account an admin level account |
| 03:26.16 | A-KO | Dagmar: yes it does, it absolutely does, because an ADMIN LEVEL ACCOUNT with UAC simply provides the user with an ADMINISTRATIVE TOKEN which says "hey, they are an admin, but prompt them anyway." |
| 03:26.21 | Dagmar | XP could already keep people about as safe as UAC is going to keep them, but they always made their accounts admin by default |
| 03:26.50 | Dagmar | A-KO: Are you living in some other world where users don't immediately click 'Yes' on everything that appears just because they think they need to? |
| 03:27.01 | Shirik | I don't |
| 03:27.02 | ScytheBlade1 | With UAC, the user actually lacks an admin token in their session entirely |
| 03:27.04 | A-KO | Dagmar: Like I said, it's not the OS' responsibility at that point. If the user clicks YES, that's their fault. |
| 03:27.07 | A-KO | no |
| 03:27.09 | A-KO | they don't ScytheBlade1 |
| 03:27.12 | ScytheBlade1 | They do |
| 03:27.17 | ScytheBlade1 | They start a second process that has it |
| 03:27.18 | A-KO | don't make me dig out the MS articles on this |
| 03:27.20 | A-KO | .... |
| 03:27.22 | ScytheBlade1 | Same to you! |
| 03:27.28 | Shirik | A-KO: ScytheBlade1 is right |
| 03:27.28 | Thrae | The introduction of UAC makes all users run in 'standard user mode', where admin-level accounts can accept UAC prompts without passwords (because they're already admin). |
| 03:27.30 | ScytheBlade1 | Don't make ME dig out articles on this! |
| 03:27.37 | Shirik | You need to do impersonation |
| 03:27.38 | *** join/#wowuidev Kandoko1 (n=Testing@adsl-068-159-119-207.sip.gsp.bellsouth.net) |
| 03:27.40 | ScytheBlade1 | The session you log in as lacks an admin token |
| 03:27.44 | ScytheBlade1 | Check it out with process explorer |
| 03:27.47 | Shirik | which is how UAC works |
| 03:27.55 | ScytheBlade1 | explorer.exe has _no_ admin token with UAC enabled |
| 03:28.08 | Dagmar | Meanwhile, everyone in the Linux world already has these thigns. |
| 03:28.35 | Arrowmaster | everyone in the linux world knows not to fucking login to X as root |
| 03:28.48 | Shirik | um |
| 03:28.50 | Shirik | I used to :/ |
| 03:28.51 | Dagmar | Hahahah |
| 03:28.55 | Dagmar | You have never been in #Ubuntu |
| 03:28.57 | Shirik | and when I did, my background showed a buncch of bombs |
| 03:29.07 | Thrae | Dagmar: If you really want to diss Microsoft, might as well say everyone in the Mac world had it first too. But this it's a red herring. |
| 03:29.09 | A-KO | Dagmar: How many hosting companies run their webhosting on the default apache user? I would imagine well over 50-60% of them :P And beyond that, how many people even understand how and when to use user-level accounts and not to? How many applications provide the ability to automatically back off process permissions? And how easy is it to create services running as a specific user? It's not VERY easy (though doable) on most systems. |
| 03:29.23 | Dagmar | A-KO: So what if they run it as the "default" apache user |
| 03:29.28 | A-KO | Dagmar: lol |
| 03:29.35 | A-KO | and there you go :P |
| 03:29.40 | Dagmar | You don't understand how uids work under Unix if you think that matters. |
| 03:29.53 | Shirik | sets Dagmar's UID to -1 |
| 03:29.53 | Dagmar | The username is just decoration. |
| 03:29.56 | DWSR | A-KO: It doesn't matter. |
| 03:29.58 | Arrowmaster | i think most daemons in linux know how to drop permissions |
| 03:30.01 | Shirik | -1 == superroot |
| 03:30.05 | Arrowmaster | http://www.istartedsomething.com/20090611/uac-in-windows-7-still-broken-microsoft-wont-fix-code-injection-vulnerability/ |
| 03:30.09 | Shirik | every command is rm -rf / |
| 03:30.14 | DWSR | sets Shirik's UID to -2 |
| 03:30.21 | DWSR | -2 is megaroot. |
| 03:30.26 | DWSR | Every command formats the world. |
| 03:30.30 | Shirik | oh snap |
| 03:30.31 | A-KO | Dagmar: When you're running a hosting environment, user's data > the system server. One can REBUILD an apache server, but one cannot rebuild a user's data without backups. That said, at the file system level, every user has access to every other user's directory--at least, from the filesystem level. WHich is bad, very bad. |
| 03:30.33 | tem | UAC is a cool idea, but it annoys the piss out of me |
| 03:30.39 | Shirik | I love UAC |
| 03:30.44 | NightHawkTheSane | DWSR: i would give anything to reformat the world. :( |
| 03:30.45 | A-KO | I don't mind losing my servers, what I mind is user data |
| 03:30.50 | tem | particularly with older programs that don't expect it |
| 03:30.52 | Dagmar | A-KO: Go back to your clicking, mouse boy. |
| 03:30.54 | A-KO | and my users don't give a shit about me being able to restore the server if it doesn't have their data |
| 03:30.58 | Thrae | tem: Have you used 7 yet? They handle it a lot better. |
| 03:31.02 | Dagmar | You've just shown you don't have a damn clue how Unix permissions models work. |
| 03:31.04 | tem | I'm on win7 |
| 03:31.08 | Kraps | Jerub: http://www.nypost.com/p/news/local/manhattan/cab_pedicab_fight_in_times_square_irK6W3egAoNqKgPlt1TZ4O |
| 03:31.08 | tem | and it annoys the piss out of me |
| 03:31.08 | Shirik | Thrae: They handle it a lot worse |
| 03:31.08 | DWSR | sets NightHawkTheSane's UID to -3 |
| 03:31.19 | Shirik | The default settings are less secure |
| 03:31.21 | Dagmar | If the users all have access to each other's data, its' because you set it up that way. |
| 03:31.22 | NightHawkTheSane | ooh, full universe format? :P |
| 03:31.22 | Shirik | I don't understand the logic behind that |
| 03:31.25 | Kraps | em misstel |
| 03:31.27 | Shirik | because users don't want to be secure? |
| 03:31.29 | DWSR | -3 is ultraroot. Every command formats the universe. |
| 03:31.31 | A-KO | Dagmar: You're welcome to enlighten me, but I"m pretty sure I'm right on this, which is why they created MPM-ITK, which you're welcome to research. |
| 03:31.53 | Dagmar | Dude I was one of the first 5000 CISSPs |
| 03:32.24 | *** part/#wowuidev Seerah (n=Ryan@c-76-107-191-65.hsd1.tn.comcast.net) |
| 03:32.26 | A-KO | and you don't know why something like mpm-itk was created :P Lot of good that cert has done for you. |
| 03:32.32 | ScytheBlade1 | A-KO: I just double checked, my explorer.exe lacks an admin token |
| 03:32.32 | Dagmar | I know exactly why it was created. |
| 03:32.34 | A-KO | but if I'm incorrect, breka out that CISSP knowledge |
| 03:32.46 | Dagmar | Hell I've deployed it. |
| 03:32.55 | Thrae | Shirik: I was talking about the way it's handled on the user side, not internally. I assumed that's what tem was annoyed about. |
| 03:32.56 | Dagmar | The answer is still the same. |
| 03:33.13 | Dagmar | If the thing lets all the users see each other's data, it was because the admin decided that was the security model necessary. |
| 03:33.14 | Shirik | but by changing how it's done on the user side, they gave up its power |
| 03:33.15 | Gnarfoz | why do you wave that CCCP certificate thing around like your dick in a dick waving contest everytime someone questions your knowledge? lol |
| 03:33.23 | A-KO | ScytheBlade1: ah, interesting. Well, what I was implying was that the only real difference between a user in the admin group in Vista and a user in the standards user group is whether or not the user gets prompted with a yes/no prompt or prompted for a password. |
| 03:33.27 | Dagmar | If it's not what the users wanted then they signed up with the wrong company or bought the wrong service. |
| 03:33.35 | tem | I fucking hate that I have to run wow and vent as admin just so that it works |
| 03:33.43 | Dagmar | It's not like a virtual server to yourself is THAT big of an issue |
| 03:33.43 | DWSR | tem: Fail. |
| 03:33.46 | DWSR | What OS are you on? |
| 03:33.50 | Shirik | tem: That's because of the authors of the program |
| 03:33.52 | Shirik | not because of the OS |
| 03:34.01 | Thrae | Shirik: Like when UAC prompts UAC which prompts UAC...even though it's a goddamn Microsoft Control Panel Applet. Microsoft fixed multiple UAC prompts on a lot of its own services and programs. |
| 03:34.06 | tem | I'm not saying it's the OS's fault |
| 03:34.09 | Shirik | Programs that are having this trouble are having trouble because they've violated microsoft best practices for years |
| 03:34.13 | tem | I'm just saying that the OS isn't helping me |
| 03:34.20 | Arrowmaster | shared webhosts are a security nightmare, if you are using one its your own damn fault when something goes wrong |
| 03:34.21 | ScytheBlade1 | A-KO: nope, actually. You can control that with group policy. I can enforce that an admin enters a password, and I can give guest level users access to a yes/no button |
| 03:34.27 | Arrowmaster | example, incgamers |
| 03:34.29 | Dagmar | Gnarfox: For one, it's probably the second time I've mentioned it in here. |
| 03:34.31 | A-KO | yes ScytheBlade1, I'm talking defaults here. |
| 03:34.35 | Shirik | group policy is <3 |
| 03:34.38 | Shirik | ctrl+alt+del ftw |
| 03:34.39 | A-KO | I know it's configurable :P I've had to work around uac for my deployment. |
| 03:34.41 | ScytheBlade1 | Ah |
| 03:34.49 | Dagmar | Gnarfoz: For the other, it's the nicest way I can say "Your'e being unnecssarily insulting cockface" |
| 03:34.51 | ScytheBlade1 | Well as long as you know I guess ;) |
| 03:35.09 | Shirik | the more you know⢠|
| 03:35.09 | ScytheBlade1 | ^ |
| 03:35.19 | Dagmar | Gnarfoz: You woulnd't go up to a NASCAR racer and try to jeer at them because they don't drive a four speed transmission, which you have determined is the best thing evar. |
| 03:35.28 | Dagmar | You just make an ass of yourself. |
| 03:35.30 | cogwheel | Shirik: the examples compile on gcc once more =) |
| 03:35.34 | Shirik | :) |
| 03:35.39 | Shirik | just needed those "const" in there? |
| 03:35.51 | Dagmar | Shirik: I b'lieev I said something along those lines about 40 minutes ago |
| 03:36.04 | Dagmar | I just suck too much at C++ to phrase it better than I did |
| 03:36.05 | cogwheel | yup. only had to add it to one place. |
| 03:36.13 | Thrae | My parents didn't care about UAC and wanted it disabled, along with ignoring their anti-Virus and Spyware programs, until they got a virus. Now they look at what Windows is doing a lot more carefully. Obviously, we need to infect more computers to enlighten the world about security. |
| 03:36.27 | Shirik | um |
| 03:36.30 | Shirik | are you sure |
| 03:36.38 | Shirik | even if it "works" are you sure you don't want to? |
| 03:36.43 | cogwheel | preprocessor metaprogramming lends itself to refactoring ;) |
| 03:36.48 | Shirik | oh |
| 03:36.48 | Dagmar | Thrae: Lucky you. I still get to drive halfway across town to un-bowb my parents' machine every three months or so |
| 03:36.54 | A-KO | Dagmar: You wave around the CISSP shit but you have yet to explain the difference. Yes, you've placed the burden of system security on the Administrator, rightly so. What I'm saying is that most users don't use things such as mpm-itk and instead, at the filesystem level, www-data has full privileges to all their hosted sites. One can assume apache has no vulnerabilities that can be exploited on that level, but you never know :P All I'm saying. Unless my assu |
| 03:36.58 | Shirik | ok guys |
| 03:37.02 | Shirik | you need to chill out a bit now |
| 03:37.28 | Dagmar | A-KO: Dude your argument still keeps turning back into "The person who set up apache can do it wrong. I blame apache and unix" |
| 03:37.29 | Gnarfoz | people who keep saying (and it's certainly not the 2nd time :P) "oh but I have this and that cert, so I'm right" just look stupid after a while :\ You probably know your stuff, though, which makes me wonder time and again why you need to wave your certification around like that (if you get what I'm saying :\) |
| 03:37.44 | Thrae | Dagmar: You need UltraVNC ;) Yeah, my parents have let me close up their computers decently. I would still like to add more security to them but it's too much of a PITA for them. |
| 03:37.49 | Dagmar | You don't blame a screwdriver for sucking at driving in nails. YOU GET A HAMMER. |
| 03:37.58 | DWSR | err. |
| 03:37.59 | WobWork1 | Thrae: That's how I trained my father |
| 03:37.59 | DWSR | Sorry. |
| 03:38.04 | DWSR | No, I use my face |
| 03:38.07 | DWSR | FACEROLL |
| 03:38.10 | Dagmar | Thrae: I would except the asshats at their ISP keep flashing the DSL modem and blowing away my tunnel for it |
| 03:38.11 | WobWork1 | Every time he got a virus |
| 03:38.15 | WobWork1 | I reformatted his computer |
| 03:38.29 | WobWork1 | he learned quickly what not to do =) |
| 03:38.35 | Thrae | Dagmar: No-Ip.org? |
| 03:39.03 | Dagmar | Thrae: It's got a dyndns address. This doesn't much matter when there's no way to get an inbound connection. |
| 03:39.29 | Thrae | Dagmar: Oh wait, you mean the ports. Well UltraVNC has UPnP support. So I'm guessing that modem does not. |
| 03:39.30 | Arrowmaster | A-KO: if you have given www-data full access to your data YOU ARE A FUCKING MORON SET YOUR FUCKING UMASK TO 022! |
| 03:39.31 | Dagmar | They'll have some issue come up with the DSL, they'll tech support, and the flunkie will flash upgrade their router to rese it's configuration. |
| 03:39.34 | A-KO | Dagmar: True, but you're the one that brought up the fact of Linux, I was merely pointing out a situation where the default install (which isn't WRONG, mind you, and I never said it was) isn't adequate for a specific use on the internet. So you're saying the same thing I am, the burden of whether or not a system is secure relies mostly on the operators, not the system itself, so bringing up "well Linux users have had this type of thing for years" is a moot p |
| 03:39.43 | A-KO | Arrowmaster: hey I've met quite a few people that do :P |
| 03:39.48 | A-KO | Arrowmaster: it makes me cringe, just an FYI. |
| 03:39.50 | Dagmar | Thrae: At that point, my rule to make sure I can actually get in with VNC is gone, gone, gone. |
| 03:40.07 | Dagmar | A-KO: Thta's the most retarded argument you've made yet, |
| 03:40.19 | Dagmar | "A default installation isn't suitable for every purpose." |
| 03:40.39 | Dagmar | Security models *must* fit the requirements of the environment, and generally they must be tailored to fit them. |
| 03:40.43 | Arrowmaster | im perty sure every distro uses a default umask of 022 |
| 03:41.13 | Dagmar | There is *no* default installation that can support J. Random Noob's setup securely unless it's just rejecting all packets. |
| 03:41.24 | *** join/#wowuidev pompy (n=Mike@c-68-38-45-3.hsd1.nj.comcast.net) |
| 03:41.38 | Gnarfoz | ultravnc has a reverse connect mode, too, btw |
| 03:41.38 | Gnarfoz | no need to configure routers on the other end, ever |
| 03:41.43 | Dagmar | Arrowmaster: The assumption there is that if people are actually using the same machine instead of their workstations, they _probably_ want to be able to share files with each other. |
| 03:41.45 | Gnarfoz | just make sure *yours* is setup correctly, once, and you're done |
| 03:41.49 | A-KO | Arrowmaster: what I'm saying is, if you fire up apache with say, ubuntu's default user www-data--and then start using virtualhosting on it, make a bunch of websites, and never configure otherwise, then god forbid someone exploits apache and gets through to the system, they have read/write access to your users' web directories (since this is needed for users to manage their own individual sites) |
| 03:41.58 | Thrae | Gnarfoz: That's what I was talking about, but I think it uses UPnP for that. |
| 03:42.04 | Dagmar | A-KO: So what |
| 03:42.20 | Gnarfoz | no, it doesn't and doesn't need to (nor can it, my network doesn't have a upnp aware router :D) |
| 03:42.27 | Arrowmaster | A-KO: default umask is 022, www-data doesnt have write access to anything |
| 03:42.27 | Dagmar | You've described a situation in which apparently NO ONE was taking responsibility for security. |
| 03:42.32 | Dagmar | Yes, that'll fail horribly. |
| 03:42.59 | A-KO | Arrowmaster: for various web apps these days, write access to a user's web directory is required :P |
| 03:43.12 | Arrowmaster | no its not |
| 03:43.19 | Dagmar | I've just been ignoring the whole "read/write" issue because generally its' never been that damn hard to leverage one login into many more |
| 03:43.24 | Arrowmaster | you create the file and give write access to that file |
| 03:43.31 | Arrowmaster | not the entire fucking directory |
| 03:43.41 | A-KO | take away write access to a user's web directory and see how easy it is for them to manage whatever cms they want to use (wordpress, etc.) |
| 03:43.48 | A-KO | they'll come crying |
| 03:44.02 | Arrowmaster | its their fucking fault then |
| 03:44.14 | Arrowmaster | they are the one that gave it write access |
| 03:44.17 | Dagmar | A-KO: So your problem is that the system was designed to allow a role account to write into user's directories |
| 03:44.23 | Dagmar | OH NOE |
| 03:44.23 | Arrowmaster | do i need to remind you of incgamers |
| 03:44.29 | Dagmar | It follows instructions! |
| 03:45.07 | Arrowmaster | you NEVER trust the security on a shared host |
| 03:45.25 | Dagmar | Crap like this is why generall my first bullet point to clients is "Start making regular backups" |
| 03:45.52 | Dagmar | ...because when you don't start with a default deny policy and proceed from there, you'll get people thinking like A-KO. |
| 03:45.55 | A-KO | Dagmar: Obvoiusly the argument is going nowhere fast, I simply made a point where you brought up linux vs. Windows, and I pointed out a situation where a lot of people "get it wrong". My solution obviously isn't right for every environment, but clearly you've completely misunderstood my point in the first place. Going back to Windows' UAC, whether or not a user clicks yes to everything is not the fault of the OS, and the fault of the user. |
| 03:45.57 | Gnarfoz | yay, 22 level 80s online on my realm, heh |
| 03:46.07 | Dagmar | That the system is going to magically *know* it shouldnt' allow certain things you _set it up to allow_ to happen. |
| 03:46.07 | Jerub | Gnarfoz: new realm? |
| 03:46.22 | A-KO | Dagmar: you don't think I don't have a regular backup policy with default deny? And the painstaking process that is involved in configuring all of that? |
| 03:46.26 | Shirik | Arrowmaster: Is that really how incgamers got hacked? |
| 03:46.30 | Arrowmaster | yes |
| 03:46.33 | Shirik | through a shared host? |
| 03:46.44 | Shirik | that's lol |
| 03:46.48 | Arrowmaster | yes, some cgi script on another site was exploited |
| 03:46.52 | Dagmar | A-KO: No, you're just talking through your hat like the average forum kiddie, and when someone disagrees with you you resort to personal attacks, just like the average forum kiddie. |
| 03:47.05 | Gnarfoz | Jerub: no, online since 2005-9 |
| 03:47.09 | A-KO | Dagmar: I have not resorted to personal attacks, it is you who brought out the personal information :P Not I. |
| 03:47.15 | Arrowmaster | and the web server user/group had write access to their dir/files |
| 03:47.15 | Shirik | ok |
| 03:47.18 | Shirik | enough personal attacks |
| 03:47.19 | Dagmar | A-KO: Yes, it's called a certification. |
| 03:47.22 | Shirik | next one I see is taking a little vacation |
| 03:47.23 | Gnarfoz | Jerub: ...but it's 05:47 ;-) |
| 03:47.34 | Jerub | Gnarfoz: ah, american server then. |
| 03:47.42 | Gnarfoz | no... not really? |
| 03:47.46 | Dagmar | A-KO: They're generally used to show that a large body of people agrees that the person who is certified knows WTF they're talking about. |
| 03:47.52 | Thunder_Child | your mom Shirik! |
| 03:47.53 | Shirik | In fact, just change the conversation |
| 03:47.54 | Jerub | it's nearly 2 in the afternoon here. some lazy afternoon raids are happening on my server right now probably. |
| 03:48.02 | Gnarfoz | I doubt it's 05:47 anywhere in the US right now, unless the US moved to Europe :D |
| 03:48.16 | Jerub | you foreigners are all the same, making me think with timezones. |
| 03:48.21 | Shirik | Europe just wishes it was where the US was |
| 03:48.31 | A-KO | Dagmar: I fully understand what a certification is, thank you. But I'm quite aware that if CISSP involves becoming as arrogant as you seem to be, then it's probably something I should look into to change the perception a bit :P |
| 03:48.32 | A-KO | is done. |
| 03:48.40 | Dagmar | I have a better idea. I'm going to go back to cursing and swearing at SElinux |
| 03:48.50 | Jerub | Dagmar: huzzah! |
| 03:48.55 | Dagmar | OKay so maybe it's not a better idea, but I've blown five hours on it now, I might as well finish up. |
| 03:48.57 | Jerub | Dagmar: selinux is pain :( |
| 03:49.03 | Dagmar | Don't I know it |
| 03:49.21 | Dagmar | I go to lengths to avoid dealing with it because there's a point at which even *i* despise the principle of least privlege. |
| 03:49.22 | Jerub | Dagmar: it's worse than sendmail to configure. |
| 03:49.25 | DWSR | No you don't Dagmar. |
| 03:49.29 | DWSR | There's a reason you're still putzing with it./ |
| 03:49.33 | DWSR | ;) |
| 03:49.50 | Dagmar | Well, the reason I'm still putzing with it is that I'm going to be putting a nameserver on a hacker convention network at the end of this month. |
| 03:50.01 | Dagmar | I'd rather it not fall prey to any unpublished attacks. |
| 03:50.16 | Dagmar | ...and I don't feel like writing my own BIND implementation for this. |
| 03:50.39 | DWSR | lol |
| 03:50.46 | DWSR | You sure it wouldn't be easier? ;) |
| 03:50.50 | Arrowmaster | put the bind server outside the network and run dnsmasq on the network |
| 03:50.54 | Dagmar | ...and if I don't then we're going to have just the one nameserver again and the dimwits trying to race lookups will choke it to death *again* |
| 03:50.59 | Jerub | Dagmar: if you're interested, i do hvae my own nameserver implementation i use for untrusted networks to deal wth dns tnunelling ; |
| 03:51.02 | Jerub | ) |
| 03:51.49 | Dagmar | DWSR: Actually I did look into whether or not it would be easier to just write my own |
| 03:51.57 | DWSR | LOL |
| 03:51.58 | Dagmar | I couldn't get the perl daemon's performance up high enough |
| 03:52.14 | Jerub | I ran twisted.names as a dns server on a small network for years. |
| 03:52.26 | Jerub | one of those things - it worked first try ,and i never touched it since. |
| 03:53.51 | *** join/#wowuidev KarlKFI1 (n=KarlKFI@ip68-231-217-61.oc.oc.cox.net) |
| 03:54.52 | DWSR | Jerub: The demands of this particular application are a little...er....different. |
| 03:55.01 | Jerub | understood. |
| 03:56.30 | *** join/#wowuidev Sesshu (n=Sesshu@ip-66-17.travedsl.de) |
| 03:56.38 | ZorbaBeta | dwsr, if I had a spare computer, I would totally do everything I could to set up a honeypot system with a working DNS server. and then have the DNS port on that IP redirect to the real box, and every other port redirect to the honeypot. |
| 03:56.45 | ZorbaBeta | just for the sheer confusion once they hacked the honeypot computer. |
| 03:57.27 | A-KO | no comment |
| 03:58.40 | A-KO | ZorbaBeta: In that case wouldn't you have to have another daemon loaded on the honypot system? if they went in through DNS, and all traffic is being routed to another machine, then it's that other machine that gets attacked, not the honeypot...if I'm reading what you're saying correctly. |
| 03:58.53 | A-KO | all dns traffic* |
| 03:58.59 | A-KO | pardon my lack of clarification |
| 03:58.59 | ZorbaBeta | a-ko, yeah, you'd have a similar DNS server on the honeypot system |
| 03:59.21 | ZorbaBeta | but the goal would be to make it easier to attack via some other service running on the "computer" |
| 03:59.26 | A-KO | ah |
| 03:59.27 | ZorbaBeta | only when they got in, they're on the wrong computer. |
| 03:59.29 | A-KO | fair enough |
| 03:59.33 | A-KO | it would be funny :P |
| 03:59.35 | ZorbaBeta | and very confused. |
| 03:59.41 | ZorbaBeta | I do not know if it would be worth the time, but funny ;) |
| 03:59.56 | A-KO | honeypots are fun, I should build mine again |
| 04:00.15 | A-KO | messing with normal people is just too easy....messing with people who try to break into things is much more rewarding IMO |
| 04:00.23 | Kraps | "Modern Warfare 2 is a squeal to the award winning Call of Duty 4: Modern Warfare." |
| 04:00.38 | A-KO | Kraps: Wonder how they deduced that one :P |
| 04:00.40 | Corrodias | SQUEEEAL LITTLE PIGGIE |
| 04:00.51 | *** join/#wowuidev robo\afk (n=robotusc@50A2DBFE.flatrate.dk) |
| 04:02.43 | Arrowmaster | i love how infinity ward actually realizes that multiplayer achievements cause nothing but harm and dont make any |
| 04:03.30 | ZorbaBeta | I think multiplayer achievements work great as long as they encourage people to do things that aren't idiotic |
| 04:03.42 | ZorbaBeta | problem is that a lot of multiplayer achievements are absolutely idiotic. |
| 04:03.48 | *** join/#wowuidev Vilkku (n=Vilkku@dsl-tkubrasgw1-ffc7c100-46.dhcp.inet.fi) |
| 04:04.15 | Arrowmaster | the bigger problem is when multiplayer had died off for that game and they become impossible to do |
| 04:04.49 | DWSR | ZorbaBeta: You mean like the achievements in TF2? =\ |
| 04:05.04 | Arrowmaster | TF2 is the only game thats gotten them right |
| 04:05.12 | ZorbaBeta | I haven't actually played much TF2 |
| 04:05.39 | DWSR | Arrowmaster: The newer packs are better. The Pyro pack was fucking dumb. |
| 04:06.19 | Arrowmaster | medic wasnt that great either but i atleast managed to get all of them in 24 hours |
| 04:06.57 | Corrodias | "right" |
| 04:06.59 | DWSR | yeah |
| 04:07.06 | Corrodias | isn't one of the achievements "get killed a certain number of times"? |
| 04:07.17 | DWSR | no. |
| 04:07.18 | Jerub | I love TF2 |
| 04:07.19 | Arrowmaster | for TF2? |
| 04:07.28 | Jerub | TF the original was my first real lan play game |
| 04:07.31 | Corrodias | yeah. for the... sniper? |
| 04:07.40 | DWSR | no...? |
| 04:07.41 | Arrowmaster | oh one of the sniper ones is get backstabed a certain number of times |
| 04:07.50 | DWSR | Oh, right. |
| 04:07.58 | DWSR | Yeah, that one's easy though and just happens through the course of a round. |
| 04:07.59 | Arrowmaster | as a consolation achievement |
| 04:08.01 | DWSR | Like, it's easy. |
| 04:08.08 | Corrodias | sort of a misguided achievement, to me. |
| 04:08.34 | DWSR | Corrodias: In TF2, if the spies are any good, they will be backstabbing the snipers constantly. |
| 04:08.40 | DWSR | Corrodias: Spy is a hard counter to Sniper. |
| 04:08.51 | Corrodias | well, congratulations on getting the achievement, i guess |
| 04:08.52 | Arrowmaster | that achievement is ment as a joke |
| 04:09.03 | Corrodias | oooh |
| 04:09.03 | DWSR | ^^ |
| 04:09.50 | Arrowmaster | they even joked about it in the preview postings for that patch |
| 04:10.17 | Corrodias | that's nice |
| 04:16.13 | *** join/#wowuidev Lonny`afk (n=anonymou@bzq-84-109-210-254.red.bezeqint.net) |
| 04:28.46 | *** join/#wowuidev Aeyan| (n=pancake@cpe-174-098-002-214.triad.res.rr.com) |
| 04:29.22 | *** join/#wowuidev tekkub (n=tekkub@WoWUIDev/WoWI/Featured/Dongle/GitHub/Tekkub) |
| 04:29.22 | *** mode/#wowuidev [+v tekkub] by ChanServ |
| 04:30.28 | *** join/#wowuidev theorbtwo (n=theorb@91.84.53.6) |
| 04:31.10 | Thunder_Child | ~vomit |
| 04:31.12 | purl | ACTION vomits on thunder_child |
| 04:33.37 | Thunder_Child | ~spew |
| 04:33.38 | purl | i guess spew is to vomit |
| 04:38.40 | Fisker | pukes all over Thunder_Child in an attempt to impress Shirik |
| 04:38.56 | Thunder_Child | ~dodge Fisker |
| 04:38.57 | purl | at the last second thunder_child dodges out of the way of Fisker's malicious and unprovoked attack. |
| 04:50.43 | Fisker | licks Thunder_Child |
| 04:56.00 | *** join/#wowuidev Vilkku (n=Vilkku@dsl-tkubrasgw1-ffc7c100-46.dhcp.inet.fi) |
| 05:09.35 | Shirik | finally ffs |
| 05:09.38 | Shirik | yogg +1 down |
| 05:09.49 | Shirik | die stupid people |
| 05:09.51 | tem | 10 or 25? |
| 05:10.00 | Shirik | 10 |
| 05:10.03 | tem | oh yes |
| 05:10.13 | tem | stupid people were involved if it was a "finally" |
| 05:10.19 | Shirik | lol |
| 05:10.23 | Shirik | server first though! |
| 05:10.23 | Thunder_Child | i think windows fails at installed program size |
| 05:10.27 | Shirik | our server is so bad |
| 05:10.28 | tem | fof 10 man anyway |
| 05:10.31 | tem | for* |
| 05:10.38 | tem | 25s is a different story |
| 05:10.47 | tem | but 10 man one light is pretty easy |
| 05:11.02 | Shirik | now only razorscale is left for my achievement |
| 05:11.09 | Shirik | yes, trust me, stupid people |
| 05:11.56 | tem | lame you're going to beat my DK to a rusted drake |
| 05:12.11 | tem | all he needs is one light in the darkness |
| 05:12.41 | Shirik | we're doing razorscale now so |
| 05:12.46 | Shirik | unless you get that within the next 10 minutes |
| 05:12.47 | tem | and stupid people keep ruining the groups I go to do it on |
| 05:13.00 | tem | all I need for champion is yogg, too |
| 05:13.10 | tem | but I'll probably never get that now |
| 05:13.42 | Fisker | you suck Shirik loL! |
| 05:13.56 | *** join/#wowuidev Shirik|Ghost (n=mpdelbuo@WoWUIDev/WoWIStaff/Norganna/StatisticalEngineer/Shirik) |
| 05:13.56 | *** mode/#wowuidev [+o Shirik|Ghost] by ChanServ |
| 05:14.30 | Shirik | fuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuu |
| 05:14.33 | Thunder_Child | you typed "loL" |
| 05:15.32 | Fisker | fu |
| 05:15.47 | Fisker | http://forums.wow-europe.com/thread.html?topicId=11030995656&sid=1 <-i need to troll this |
| 05:15.51 | cogwheel | Fisker: you suck Shirik |
| 05:16.05 | Fisker | so he can get it into his fucking head that not being launched != not working properly |
| 05:16.24 | Fisker | good point btw cogwheel |
| 05:16.34 | Shirik | brighthouse is such shit |
| 05:17.56 | *** join/#wowuidev Aeyan (n=pancake@cpe-174-098-002-214.triad.res.rr.com) |
| 05:19.12 | Fisker | assist me Shirik |
| 05:25.40 | ZorbaBeta | fisker, you realize he's reporting a totally different bug from that, yes? |
| 05:25.53 | Fisker | yep |
| 05:32.34 | *** join/#wowuidev Funkeh`` (n=funk@82.111.119.253) |
| 05:32.44 | Fisker | everybody hide |
| 05:38.37 | Shirik | So |
| 05:38.41 | Shirik | I just found a bug... in my oven |
| 05:39.08 | Shirik | Apparently a particular combination of using the kitchen timer and the oven causes the timer to partially reset itself |
| 05:40.31 | Fisker | working as intended |
| 05:40.42 | Ackis | Shirik: I thought you meant like a fly |
| 05:42.06 | *** join/#wowuidev krka (n=krka@88.80.164.166) |
| 05:46.07 | Shirik | tem, you lose |
| 05:46.14 | tem | yeah whatever |
| 05:46.19 | tem | I'm filling out an app for another guild |
| 05:46.32 | tem | my guild is circling the drain |
| 05:46.43 | tem | and I don't plan to watch as people progress through Icecrown |
| 05:46.48 | tem | while my guild can't fill a raid |
| 05:47.01 | Shirik | you can join my guild |
| 05:47.07 | Shirik | I'll be leaving soon probably |
| 05:47.28 | tem | I'm alliance |
| 05:47.32 | tem | and don't plan on changing that |
| 05:47.38 | tem | also server transfers are lame |
| 05:48.08 | Shirik | I will be going to alliance probably |
| 05:48.13 | Shirik | joining up with an old group of friends |
| 05:52.04 | NeoTron | considers returning. |
| 05:52.31 | NeoTron | I'm not good at quitting :P |
| 05:52.32 | Fisker | kisses Shirik |
| 05:52.42 | NeoTron | although last time I quit, I was gone for a month. been like 3 months this time! |
| 05:52.51 | NeoTron | or something |
| 05:58.28 | *** join/#wowuidev Srosh (n=Srosh@d019162.adsl.hansenet.de) |
| 05:58.59 | *** join/#wowuidev Funkeh` (n=funk@WoWUIDev/WoWAce/Ace3/BigWigs/funkeh) |
| 06:03.06 | Fisker | Today is awesome Shirik |
| 06:03.08 | Fisker | do you hear me? |
| 06:03.34 | Jerub | oh, apparently google died over the weekend and wave invites weren't going out at all. |
| 06:03.53 | Jerub | and now they're starting to go out again |
| 06:04.42 | Fisker | :( |
| 06:04.47 | Fisker | haven't gotten mine yet |
| 06:05.04 | Fisker | But atleast my machine was pwnt last week |
| 06:05.42 | Fisker | 5. oktober 2009 16:33 Ankommet til 704 Københavns Pakkecenter |
| 06:05.45 | Fisker | Fear me Shirik |
| 06:07.49 | Fisker | cries |
| 06:08.08 | *** join/#wowuidev tekkub (n=tekkub@WoWUIDev/WoWI/Featured/Dongle/GitHub/Tekkub) |
| 06:08.08 | *** mode/#wowuidev [+v tekkub] by ChanServ |
| 06:08.25 | *** join/#wowuidev soufron (n=soufron@vol75-1-81-57-79-123.fbx.proxad.net) |
| 06:11.57 | Shirik | Fear me Fisker |
| 06:12.02 | Fisker | no |
| 06:12.05 | Fisker | Fear me Shirik |
| 06:12.11 | Shirik | no |
| 06:12.13 | Shirik | Fear me Fisker |
| 06:12.17 | Fisker | no |
| 06:12.18 | Fisker | Fear me Shirik |
| 06:12.21 | Shirik | no |
| 06:12.23 | Shirik | Fear me Fisker |
| 06:12.23 | Fisker | no |
| 06:12.25 | Fisker | Fear me Shirik |
| 06:12.33 | Shirik | I don't want to set off Shiibot |
| 06:12.39 | Fisker | bring it! |
| 06:12.46 | Fisker | why don't you make it ignore you anyways? hoho |
| 06:12.54 | Shirik | !quote KICK #wowuidev :Fisker pwzoened |
| 06:12.55 | batbot | Shirik, kick has not said anything with your given pattern. |
| 06:12.58 | Shirik | :/ |
| 06:13.04 | Shirik | Shiibot, you fail me |
| 06:13.43 | Shirik | !quote KICK #wowuidev Fisker :pwzoened |
| 06:13.43 | batbot | Shirik, kick has not said anything with your given pattern. |
| 06:13.44 | *** kick/#wowuidev [Fisker!n=Shiibot@WoWUIDev/Nospam] by Shiibot (pwzoened) |
| 06:13.47 | *** join/#wowuidev Fisker (i=55181266@gateway/web/freenode/x-yxgujwfukmojojaq) |
| 06:13.50 | Shirik | Stupid colon |
| 06:13.50 | Fisker | le fu |
| 06:15.21 | Fisker | you can't really beat "5. oktober 2009 16:33 Ankommet til 704 Københavns Pakkecenter" though |
| 06:15.27 | *** join/#wowuidev stolenlegacy (n=stolenle@193.170.222.163) |
| 06:15.44 | *** part/#wowuidev stolenlegacy (n=stolenle@193.170.222.163) |
| 06:16.23 | Shirik | yes I can |
| 06:16.42 | *** join/#wowuidev stolen|school (n=stolenle@193.170.222.163) |
| 06:16.48 | Shirik | ããªãã¯æ¥æ¬èªãããã¾ããããï¼ |
| 06:17.20 | Fisker | no u |
| 06:17.41 | Jerub | the japanese codepoint for ? is a nice touch. |
| 06:18.03 | Shirik | It's annoying to switch IMEs :P |
| 06:18.07 | Shirik | I just typed it all out and hit enter without switching |
| 06:18.13 | Shirik | japanese comma too |
| 06:19.05 | *** join/#wowuidev Elkano (n=elkano@WoWUIDev/WoWAce/Elkano) |
| 06:19.37 | Fisker | i could just destroy you Shirik |
| 06:21.31 | stolen|school | Fisker, you wouldn't dare |
| 06:21.49 | Fisker | destroys Shirik |
| 06:22.12 | stolen|school | forces Fisker to do ritual suicide. |
| 06:22.26 | *** join/#wowuidev tekkub (n=tekkub@WoWUIDev/WoWI/Featured/Dongle/GitHub/Tekkub) |
| 06:22.26 | *** mode/#wowuidev [+v tekkub] by ChanServ |
| 06:22.31 | Arrowmaster | gently scratches Fisker behind the ears |
| 06:22.44 | Fisker | purrs |
| 06:23.10 | Arrowmaster | http://i192.photobucket.com/albums/z175/spartanui/Taurendus|v1.jpg |
| 06:23.11 | Arrowmaster | lol |
| 06:23.36 | Fisker | nice lightweight ui |
| 06:24.02 | Arrowmaster | were you here when it was linked earlier? |
| 06:24.48 | Fisker | naw |
| 06:24.56 | Arrowmaster | look closely at the unitframes |
| 06:25.13 | Fisker | FFFFFFFFFFFFFUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUU- |
| 06:25.18 | Arrowmaster | lol |
| 06:25.32 | Arrowmaster | ahaha |
| 06:25.37 | Fisker | who would do such a thing? :( |
| 06:25.41 | Thunder_Child | everyone |
| 06:25.52 | Arrowmaster | pets Fisker |
| 06:26.04 | *** join/#wowuidev smcn (i=smcn@67.166.76.157) |
| 06:26.21 | Jerub | aww, isn't it a cute little kitty. |
| 06:26.35 | Jerub | so what ui is that? I'm interested in getting it. |
| 06:26.47 | Arrowmaster | spartanui |
| 06:27.03 | Arrowmaster | version 1 i think, its one of the screenshots linked on the site |
| 06:27.11 | Shirik | pets Fisker |
| 06:27.14 | Jerub | okay. |
| 06:28.08 | Jerub | oh, and is it 8 hour downtime tonight again? |
| 06:28.43 | Jerub | checks the forum |
| 06:29.08 | *** join/#wowuidev svenadh (n=sven@L0.moenchengladbach01.fdknet.de) |
| 06:30.10 | Jerub | yeah, long downtime again :/ |
| 06:30.19 | Jerub | stupid blizzard. |
| 06:32.08 | Fisker | say that again |
| 06:32.31 | Jerub | maybe i mean, stupid blizzard treating oceanic like americans. |
| 06:37.02 | Fisker | :E |
| 06:37.45 | Fisker | where's my damn psu? |
| 06:41.09 | stolen|school | Nice one, arrow |
| 06:41.57 | *** join/#wowuidev isman (n=drag@mlr78-3-88-162-68-235.fbx.proxad.net) |
| 06:42.51 | Shirik | Pro tip: |
| 06:42.55 | Fisker | fu? |
| 06:43.13 | Shirik | When you apply to a guild, and one of the primary recruiters sends a tell to you asking you for clarification on the application |
| 06:43.20 | Shirik | The correct response is not "holy shit you are an annoying cunt" |
| 06:43.56 | Fisker | that's how i joined my guild |
| 06:45.04 | Jerub | I turned down two guilds who wanted to recruit me on the weekend. |
| 06:45.43 | *** join/#wowuidev cyndis (i=cyndis@82.128.132.130) |
| 06:46.19 | Fisker | hahahahaha gtfo |
| 06:46.31 | Shirik | No |
| 06:46.36 | Shirik | this was not me going to someone else saying "hey come join!" |
| 06:46.44 | Shirik | This was someone who posted an application, then I ask a question about the application |
| 06:46.57 | Jerub | what sort of quesiton? |
| 06:47.08 | haste | a friend of mine wrote: "Yes, fucking dead nigger babies is one of my favorite activities" on some app, asking if he could handle mature language |
| 06:47.29 | Fisker | Was just looking through the products of a shop |
| 06:47.36 | Fisker | And there was a page with laptops and shit |
| 06:48.11 | *** join/#wowuidev smcn (i=smcn@67.166.76.157) |
| 06:48.13 | *** join/#wowuidev Athrun-- (n=drag@mlr78-3-88-162-68-235.fbx.proxad.net) |
| 06:48.21 | Fisker | And then it had this "Climate advice: Buy a laptop instead of a desktop and save energy and the enviroment!111" |
| 06:48.24 | Fisker | i lol'd |
| 06:48.25 | Fisker | irl |
| 06:49.02 | Jerub | but it's true. |
| 06:49.02 | Jerub | well, apart from thebit where lithium batteries kill babies and kittens. |
| 06:49.02 | Fisker | not nessecarily |
| 06:49.02 | Fisker | hoho |
| 06:49.21 | Fisker | Point is there's probably a reason why you buy a desktop instead of a laptop |
| 06:50.17 | Fisker | btw |
| 06:50.29 | Fisker | the laptop has a Athlon 64 X2 Mobile chip |
| 06:50.32 | Fisker | so the point is moot |
| 06:50.36 | haste | recompilses fisker with --disable-troll. |
| 06:50.36 | Jerub | ahahaha |
| 06:50.37 | Jerub | :) |
| 06:51.00 | Fisker | haste your compiler just crashed and ordered you a thousand liters of milk |
| 06:51.07 | haste | haha |
| 06:52.39 | Jerub | hey, are any of you on spirestone? |
| 06:54.24 | Fisker | baww |
| 06:54.30 | Fisker | just got a mail from the microsoft store |
| 06:55.09 | Fisker | thought they had sent out my key early :( |
| 06:57.20 | Shirik | You know |
| 06:57.42 | Shirik | I have just determined, security by obfuscation is pointless |
| 06:57.42 | Shirik | all security is by obscurity |
| 06:57.48 | Shirik | how do you keep your email secure? You hide your password |
| 06:57.54 | Shirik | How do you keep SSL secure? You hide the private key |
| 06:58.13 | Shirik | I thus claim this argument null and void |
| 07:00.57 | ZorbaBeta | shirik, there's a difference between a secret key and a secret algorithm, however |
| 07:01.06 | ZorbaBeta | "security by obscurity" refers to the algorithm |
| 07:01.06 | Shirik | I know |
| 07:01.09 | Shirik | it's 3 AM |
| 07:01.18 | Shirik | I'm just being stupid |
| 07:01.20 | ZorbaBeta | righto, then :) |
| 07:01.26 | Shirik | I turn into Fisker around 2:30 |
| 07:01.34 | Shirik | but Fisker with technical knowledge |
| 07:01.50 | Fisker | oh u |
| 07:01.55 | Fisker | i have technical knowledge |
| 07:03.30 | Duman | hmm |
| 07:03.59 | Shirik | 1>1) Test Error : LabVIEWMarshalTests.LabviewMarshal.TestIllegalStringLength |
| 07:03.59 | Shirik | 1> System.AccessViolationException : Attempted to read or write protected memory. This is often an indication that other memory is corrupt. |
| 07:04.01 | Shirik | :( |
| 07:04.13 | Fisker | fuck yeah |
| 07:04.16 | Fisker | i hope you die |
| 07:06.11 | Fisker | btw Shirik |
| 07:06.14 | Fisker | you will experience rage |
| 07:06.20 | NightHawkTheSane | Okay, so someone here (i totally forget who) linked to a blog post about some site developing custom-cloud-storage arrays for fairly cheap (relatively speaking) anyone have that link? |
| 07:06.32 | Shirik | I am already experiencing rage |
| 07:06.36 | Shirik | epic unit test failure ftl |
| 07:07.34 | Fisker | http://blog.backblaze.com/2009/09/01/petabytes-on-a-budget-how-to-build-cheap-cloud-storage/ |
| 07:07.37 | Fisker | anyways Shirik |
| 07:07.41 | Fisker | i heard teh postal guy! |
| 07:07.50 | Fisker | But no package :( |
| 07:07.59 | Fisker | and usually the package guy is there before the letter guy |
| 07:08.06 | Fisker | which means i may be raging |
| 07:08.18 | NightHawkTheSane | Fisker: you're amazing |
| 07:08.27 | Fisker | that's what she said |
| 07:08.32 | Shirik | I'm amazing |
| 07:08.56 | Shirik | this is pretty epic |
| 07:09.02 | Shirik | I think the unit test actually found a flaw :/ |
| 07:09.09 | Shirik | I claim victory |
| 07:09.46 | NightHawkTheSane | goes to sleep. |
| 07:10.44 | Fisker | can someone go blow something up in the UK? |
| 07:10.53 | Fisker | Need the pound to drop a bit more before Windows 7 is out |
| 07:15.14 | Shirik | Fisker |
| 07:15.18 | Shirik | Yo dawg I herd yo and yo dawg like yo yos so we put yo dawg in a yo yo so yo can yo yo yo dawg while yo dawg yo yos, dawg |
| 07:15.20 | Fisker | Shirik: |
| 07:15.22 | Fisker | old |
| 07:18.04 | Elkano | Yo dawg I herd yo like cookiez... but I eated it... |
| 07:18.15 | *** join/#wowuidev tlund (i=tlund@nxs.se) |
| 07:23.10 | Fisker | yo Elkano |
| 07:23.30 | Fisker | im really happy for you and all and imma let you finish but Shirik had the best yo dawg of all time |
| 07:23.31 | Fisker | ALL TIME |
| 07:23.34 | Shirik | FU |
| 07:23.36 | Shirik | off-by-one error |
| 07:23.40 | Shirik | has been here for 6 months |
| 07:23.51 | Fisker | ? |
| 07:24.05 | Fisker | btw i found out it was letter guy and not package guy who was here |
| 07:24.09 | Fisker | so there's still hope! |
| 07:24.09 | Shirik | owned |
| 07:24.11 | Shirik | no |
| 07:24.12 | Shirik | no hope |
| 07:24.14 | Fisker | :( |
| 07:24.14 | Shirik | package guy will not come |
| 07:24.44 | Fisker | he had no troubles coming into your mom |
| 07:24.48 | Fisker | hoho's |
| 07:26.31 | Fisker | btw Jerub |
| 07:26.34 | Fisker | patch 3.3 tomororw? |
| 07:26.40 | Fisker | cataclysm? |
| 07:27.27 | *** join/#wowuidev Kalroth (n=kalroth@0x573f1066.cpe.ge-1-1-0-1101.hjnqu1.customer.tele.dk) |
| 07:28.24 | theorbtwo | 3.3 != cataclysm. |
| 07:30.14 | Fisker | Who said 3.3 = cataclysm? |
| 07:31.16 | Fisker | haste |
| 07:31.28 | WobWork1 | 3.3 is a blind lion sitting on top of a one eyed lion. |
| 07:32.11 | WobWork1 | weird. Pidgin must keep it's own clock |
| 07:32.21 | Fisker | sup WobWork1 |
| 07:32.22 | WobWork1 | cause it's not updated to daylight savings like my system clock... |
| 07:32.25 | Fisker | where's my damn PSU? |
| 07:32.35 | WobWork1 | Public Service Unit? |
| 07:33.49 | Fisker | We already went back to wintertime? :E |
| 07:33.54 | Fisker | naw WobWork1 |
| 07:33.59 | Fisker | Power Supply Unit |
| 07:34.01 | haste | pro tip! |
| 07:34.16 | haste | reading comics posted under... "Soul-Crushingly Depressing"... is not recommended |
| 07:34.26 | WobWork1 | Too cheery? |
| 07:34.27 | Fisker | btw haste |
| 07:34.45 | WobWork1 | haste: You should read Sandman! |
| 07:34.56 | Fisker | we're banning tanning saloons! |
| 07:34.57 | Fisker | gogog |
| 07:35.11 | haste | Fisker: lawl, they're talking about making it 18 years here |
| 07:35.28 | *** join/#wowuidev Movix (n=Movix@mail.schiffmann.fr) |
| 07:35.34 | theorbtwo | sandman++ |
| 07:35.35 | Fisker | hoho haste |
| 07:35.40 | Fisker | when do they ban alcohol really? |
| 07:35.46 | haste | never! |
| 07:36.00 | Fisker | can't be less worse than tanning saloons or smoking |
| 07:36.35 | *** part/#wowuidev Movix (n=Movix@mail.schiffmann.fr) |
| 07:37.14 | theorbtwo | Ah, but alcohol is the sort of vice MPs enjoy, rather then the sort of vice people who can't vote enjoy. |
| 07:37.26 | theorbtwo | Most people only want to save other people from themselves. |
| 07:38.30 | WobWork1 | Don't worry theorbtwo, I'll save you from you!! |
| 07:38.38 | WobWork1 | wraps theorbtwo in cotton wool |
| 07:39.10 | theorbtwo | Mm, nice warm straightjacket! |
| 07:41.51 | Torhal | Fisker: You're banned from #wowace? |
| 07:42.01 | Fisker | no |
| 07:42.18 | Torhal | Ah. I was going to tell someone to not make you rage, and you're not there. |
| 07:42.23 | Fisker | So there i was |
| 07:42.28 | Fisker | Playing computer |
| 07:42.32 | Fisker | when BAM my computer shutdown |
| 07:42.54 | Fisker | Figuring it was just the run-of-the-mill surge, brownout, etc. i turned it on again |
| 07:42.56 | Fisker | But it wouldn't! |
| 07:42.59 | Torhal | It knows you need your rest. |
| 07:43.09 | Fisker | So it looks like my PSU is fucked |
| 07:43.19 | Thrae | New Nvidia drivers today (yesterday), new branch too. |
| 07:43.22 | Torhal | Evuhl. |
| 07:43.23 | Fisker | And as such i'm running some webirc shit and can't be bothered joining other channels etc. |
| 07:43.26 | Fisker | old Thrae |
| 07:44.33 | Thrae | Fisker: Still important for 7 users. |
| 07:44.53 | Fisker | It was released like a week ago as beta |
| 07:45.26 | Fisker | also what's the point for 7 users? |
| 07:45.29 | Thrae | Fisker: Release drivers aren't the same as Beta drivers, even if they have the same number. |
| 07:45.38 | Fisker | but in this case they are |
| 07:45.41 | Fisker | except the whql status |
| 07:46.05 | Thrae | I can't argue with you because I'd be breaking a NDA. |
| 07:46.24 | Fisker | I'm sure the elawyers would be mad ;3 |
| 07:46.27 | Kalroth | Ooh, nice out. I'll use that on Fisker in the future too. |
| 07:46.40 | Fisker | true |
| 07:47.52 | Fisker | i still wonder why they're so important for 7 users :o |
| 07:48.49 | Thrae | Because Nvidia has been reportedly working hard on 7 compatibility especially, and the release notes show a lot of 7 fixes. |
| 07:49.28 | theorbtwo | Oh, good. |
| 07:49.32 | Fisker | the official ones show 0 |
| 07:49.38 | Fisker | dunno what your magic nda ones say :o |
| 07:49.43 | theorbtwo | has some problems with his nvidia drivers under 7... |
| 07:50.02 | Fisker | oh wait |
| 07:50.23 | Fisker | there be release notes! |
| 07:51.35 | Fisker | lol |
| 07:51.45 | Fisker | the release notes mention even less fixes than the summary on their page |
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| 08:22.51 | Shirik|zZz | Fisker |
| 08:22.53 | Shirik|zZz | you will be destroyed |
| 08:22.56 | Shirik|zZz | on the morrow |
| 08:24.43 | Fisker | ok Shirik|zZz |
| 08:25.10 | Thrae | phiz: Hmm, that seems to be a stronger benzodiazepine then Klonopin, and more habit-forming. |
| 08:25.16 | Thrae | Ah whoops |
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| 08:34.08 | ZorbaBeta | wooooot, strand crawler |
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| 08:44.59 | Fisker | i'm not gonna be part of your system ZorbaBeta |
| 08:46.14 | Grum | whooo no kodo ... ~120 kills orso and no frikkin kodo seen |
| 08:46.51 | ZorbaBeta | grum you're about to hate me |
| 08:47.00 | ZorbaBeta | I got the kodo on my second set of five kills |
| 08:47.00 | Grum | nah gz on kodo! |
| 08:47.02 | Fisker | hey Grum |
| 08:47.07 | ZorbaBeta | I got the ram on my first set of five kills. :D |
| 08:47.11 | Grum | in 2 years i saw 1 kodo drop |
| 08:47.15 | Fisker | i got it last year |
| 08:47.26 | Fisker | think i did brewfest for like 3 days |
| 08:47.27 | Grum | and last year i did ~20 summons per day O.o |
| 08:47.31 | Fisker | saw the ram and kodo in those 3 days |
| 08:47.45 | ZorbaBeta | I was all set to offer multiple thousands of the ram or kodo, and I ended up just getting them through pure luck. |
| 08:47.59 | Fisker | btw funny story |
| 08:47.59 | ZorbaBeta | and I just got the strand crawler today, too. |
| 08:48.03 | ZorbaBeta | now watch me lose loot rolls for like three months |
| 08:48.37 | Fisker | Someone got Needy, Brewfest Kodo & The achievement on the same roll :P |
| 08:48.45 | Grum | i got the crawler on the first time i did my fishing daily |
| 08:48.46 | ZorbaBeta | fisker, niiiice :D |
| 08:48.50 | Fisker | btw Grum |
| 08:48.56 | Fisker | you should do like some people did on our server |
| 08:48.58 | ZorbaBeta | grum, okay, that evens things out a bit |
| 08:49.03 | ZorbaBeta | got the polar bear? that one took me months :( |
| 08:49.08 | Fisker | have a group of 3 or 4 and spam LFG/Trade for players to summon |
| 08:49.12 | Fisker | then let them summon and kick him |
| 08:49.20 | Grum | lol i have a good reputation on the server |
| 08:49.28 | Grum | can't do that without having to leave my guild :D |
| 08:50.26 | ZorbaBeta | I was definitely planning to do the money payout thing |
| 08:50.42 | ZorbaBeta | tank available, no summon, paying 3000g for ram or kodo |
| 08:50.56 | Grum | i have the ram, trinkets, remote |
| 08:51.13 | Grum | how can i not have em lol |
| 08:51.26 | ZorbaBeta | I've never seen the remote, myself |
| 08:51.28 | Grum | i used to spawn the boss 9 times myself per day last year :( |
| 08:51.46 | Grum | seen like 6 remotes this year |
| 08:53.00 | ZorbaBeta | man, I'm up to 83% of pets |
| 08:53.18 | ZorbaBeta | and a lot of the remaining ones are ones I just can't get until the season rolls around again |
| 08:53.29 | Grum | i have peddlefleet! |
| 08:53.34 | Grum | so meh! ;( |
| 08:53.38 | ZorbaBeta | lucky :( I couldn't get him :( |
| 08:53.46 | ZorbaBeta | or the scorchling |
| 08:53.50 | Grum | i took me until the last day to get all the fucking candy |
| 08:58.52 | Fisker | hah |
| 08:58.56 | Fisker | my psu > you |
| 09:03.50 | Fisker | yay |
| 09:03.52 | Fisker | just tested it |
| 09:03.56 | Fisker | and teh lights are normal! |
| 09:04.01 | Fisker | so i think it's fixed |
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| 09:49.23 | Wobin | http://www.kontraband.com/videos/17119/Slow-Kylie-George-Michael/#show |
| 09:49.25 | Wobin | ahah =) |
| 09:56.18 | tem | should I feel bad for not knowing who either of those people are? |
| 09:57.15 | Wobin | Probably |
| 09:57.39 | tlund | [Ammo]: ora3 doesnt have its own maintank window (like ora2)? |
| 09:57.47 | Elkano | tlund, no it hasn't |
| 09:58.13 | Elkano | it does provide some means to set an order for Blizzard though iirc |
| 09:58.38 | tlund | yeah, but the blizzard ones can not change scale and can not show targets-target and such |
| 09:59.04 | tlund | what i "need" is something that looks just like the one in ora2 :) |
| 09:59.54 | tlund | alot of other things are better in ora3, like the cooldown monitor and such |
| 10:00.00 | tlund | i am using both of the at the moment |
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| 10:03.56 | jpmorgan | how does one reorder tanks in ora3? |
| 10:05.15 | Elkano | just use the tank panel ^^ |
| 10:06.29 | jpmorgan | yah some people were having probs w that the other day. one person setting up tank windows and them showing up in the wrong order for others (not all reported probs tho) |
| 10:11.48 | tlund | is there an addon that the raidleader/master looter can use that automatically links the boss drops when he opens the loot window (preferably it would be smart and only do it if you are leader/looter, and also detect if someone else with the addon has already linked it) |
| 10:12.12 | Mikk | good ole xloot has the announce button |
| 10:12.16 | Mikk | but it doesnt auto do it |
| 10:12.45 | [Ammo] | jpmorgan: the order is not transmitted |
| 10:12.51 | [Ammo] | it's your personal order |
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| 10:18.38 | jpmorgan | thx ammo |
| 10:20.32 | Grum | What was the skill paladins could use to 'shield' a raid for a certain amount of dmg? |
| 10:21.13 | Grum | it would eat a percentage of the dmg taken from all people and give it to the pally who cast it |
| 10:22.57 | jpmorgan | divine shield? |
| 10:23.17 | Zyn | Divine Sacrifice |
| 10:23.17 | jpmorgan | guessing i dont have a pal over lev 2 |
| 10:23.39 | Grum | Zyn; thanks thats it :) |
| 10:23.40 | Zyn | http://www.wowhead.com/?spell=64205 |
| 10:23.43 | Grum | for some reason i couldnt find it :) |
| 10:24.17 | Grum | trying to find ways to cope with the risks of those frost-touchy-thingies during anub p3 :( |
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| 10:39.33 | Zyn | "A Ministry of Defence document giving advice on how to stop documents leaking onto the internet has been leaked onto the internet. " |
| 10:39.34 | Zyn | ._. |
| 10:41.36 | Arrowmaster | ive got better advice, you print it and hand out the paper version |
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| 10:53.55 | Jerub | I'm trying spartanui. |
| 10:54.26 | Jerub | the chat frame is covering my drood buttons... |
| 10:55.28 | Jerub | is there a way to make the chat frame more customisable? |
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| 11:02.50 | *** mode/#wowuidev [+v Legorol] by ChanServ |
| 11:08.30 | Wobin | awesome: http://www.splitreason.com/product/538 |
| 11:10.22 | Wobin | also: http://www.turtlehead.ie/stuffformen/men_enlarged.php?id=72&sex=Male |
| 11:18.25 | Jerub | ah, found it. |
| 11:18.25 | Jerub | my stance bar is auto hididng behind spartan or something, and i don't know how to stop it... |
| 11:18.38 | *** join/#wowuidev Fisker (i=lolgourr@62.61.142.209.generic-hostname.arrownet.dk) |
| 11:18.46 | Fisker | FUCK YEAH |
| 11:19.19 | Fisker | can you dig it? |
| 11:21.40 | Wobin | possibly if you have a spade |
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| 11:50.59 | Wobin | hm |
| 11:51.05 | Wobin | the new fire nova mechanic is interesting |
| 11:52.01 | Wobin | shaman can now aoe somewhat without losing ToW or FT |
| 11:52.30 | Wobin | Could also be used like a proximity trap =) |
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| 12:00.06 | Jerub | me answers his own stupid questions |
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| 12:23.01 | Jerub | wow, afro samurai doesn't pull any punches. |
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| 12:56.13 | zenzelezz | what news from Peppyland? |
| 12:56.31 | Lopeppeppy | Morning. I have one for sale. Really frakkin' cheap. Anyone want? |
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| 12:58.00 | Wobin | You sell mornings? |
| 12:59.23 | Lopeppeppy | I'll sell this one. *gggrrrrrrrowllllll* |
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| 13:04.48 | batrick | u r |
| 13:04.54 | batrick | lua workshop \o/ |
| 13:05.05 | Lopeppeppy | yay! |
| 13:05.44 | *** join/#wowuidev DWSR (i=c04b8bfb@gateway/web/freenode/x-qoekzlmqdjoxncuj) |
| 13:07.15 | batrick | most of it is in portuguese |
| 13:07.24 | batrick | so I'm just working on my slides |
| 13:08.05 | zenzelezz | then he realised it was actually an astrology workshop |
| 13:08.30 | Lopeppeppy | :P |
| 13:15.22 | DWSR | any javascript devs on? |
| 13:15.28 | DWSR | Need a quick script for Google Chrome |
| 13:15.38 | DWSR | I mean quick, like 5 lines, I think. |
| 13:15.56 | Cide | I can do javascript. |
| 13:16.06 | Elkano | what do you pay? ;) |
| 13:16.17 | Cide | quit stealing my lines |
| 13:16.24 | Elkano | :P |
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| 13:59.11 | Adys | jnwhiteh: ping me when you get back, got a couple of suggestions for wp |
| 14:00.21 | zenzelezz | WordPerfect? WordPress? |
| 14:00.57 | Lopeppeppy | wowprogramming |
| 14:01.00 | cogwheel | Wow programming |
| 14:01.17 | cogwheel | morning, fast peppy |
| 14:04.41 | Lopeppeppy | both hands mostly work again, I can type. |
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| 14:11.41 | Fisker | cogwheel |
| 14:11.47 | Fisker | my dad is not a phone |
| 14:11.48 | Fisker | duh |
| 14:12.19 | cogwheel | orly? |
| 14:12.29 | Fisker | yarly |
| 14:12.33 | cogwheel | nowai |
| 14:13.06 | Fisker | yawai |
| 14:15.14 | cogwheel | din mor, my friend... din mor... |
| 14:15.29 | cogwheel | so... Win7 vs vista ... |
| 14:15.31 | cogwheel | hides |
| 14:16.06 | cogwheel | but seriously, i get better framerates in games under 7 even with aero enabled (by a hefty margin) |
| 14:16.10 | Lopeppeppy | is hungry! |
| 14:16.24 | cogwheel | i wish i had noms 4 u |
| 14:16.32 | cogwheel | and i wish i had noms 4 me |
| 14:16.38 | cogwheel | caffeine will do |
| 14:16.43 | cog|away | bbl |
| 14:17.12 | mikma | shirik|zzz: http://kuvaton.com/kuvei/caffeine_intake.jpg |
| 14:17.17 | Ackis | Lopeppeppy: http://ow.ly/sWuN !!!! |
| 14:17.20 | mikma | wobin: you too, ^---- |
| 14:17.55 | cog|away | umm... i don't know about you but i've never had #4 from caffeine.... |
| 14:18.05 | cog|away | oh and #5 is completely preventable... just need moar caffeine :P |
| 14:18.06 | Lopeppeppy | aww, a budding dental hygienist! |
| 14:18.26 | Wobin | hasn't encountered #4 either |
| 14:18.31 | mikma | cog|away: i've had that couple of times... too much coffee ^^ |
| 14:19.43 | cog|away | i used to drink ~ 20 cups (the measurement, not the vessel) of coffee / day |
| 14:20.00 | mikma | wow |
| 14:20.00 | cog|away | |aways |
| 14:20.09 | mikma | that's amazingly high amount |
| 14:20.22 | mikma | i start my day (usually) with 1 litre of coffee... |
| 14:20.23 | Wobin | stopped drinking coffee after first year uni |
| 14:20.29 | mikma | that's why i get the #4 sometimes ^^ |
| 14:20.48 | mikma | after that litre, i usually don't drink coffee anymore during that day |
| 14:20.51 | Wobin | caffiene doesn't 'wake' me up |
| 14:21.02 | Shirik | mikma: I don't drink caffeine :) |
| 14:21.07 | Fisker | Windows 7 cog|away |
| 14:21.08 | Wobin | coffee gives me jitters and heart palpitations =P |
| 14:21.10 | Ackis | has never fully drank a cup of coffee |
| 14:21.15 | Wobin | prefers tea |
| 14:21.22 | mikma | shirik: :( |
| 14:21.36 | *** join/#wowuidev mojosdojo (n=gdbzet26@p4FEFFC0D.dip.t-dialin.net) |
| 14:21.39 | Wobin | I love the -smell- of coffee =) |
| 14:21.41 | mikma | wobin: i know australian girl who also got the same from coffee |
| 14:21.43 | Wobin | and the taste |
| 14:21.52 | Wobin | but I just can't handle the caffiene =( |
| 14:22.02 | mikma | noobs cant handle the power.. ? |
| 14:22.19 | Wobin | well, it's not worth the discomfort =P |
| 14:22.28 | Fisker | Shirik |
| 14:22.32 | Fisker | YOU THINK I'M STUPID?! |
| 14:22.51 | mikma | wobin: http://naurunappula.com/115296 |
| 14:22.58 | Ackis | ping ZorbaBeta |
| 14:23.02 | Fisker | slaps Ackis around a bit with a large trout |
| 14:23.09 | Ackis | Fisker: no one thinks you're stupid |
| 14:23.14 | Ackis | it's a known fact |
| 14:23.19 | mikma | shirik: yes, answer yes for the love of god! |
| 14:23.25 | Fisker | old Ackis |
| 14:23.30 | Shirik | Fisker: You cannot talk to me, you have been destroyed. |
| 14:23.54 | Fisker | nope |
| 14:24.13 | Fisker | cause i threw my PSU on the ground |
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| 14:25.41 | *** mode/#wowuidev [+o Seerah] by ChanServ |
| 14:26.18 | ZorbaBeta | ackis, pong |
| 14:27.39 | Elkano | playing ping pong again? ;) |
| 14:27.53 | mikma | ~ping |
| 14:27.54 | purl | ~pong |
| 14:28.00 | mikma | ~bong |
| 14:28.01 | purl | bong is, like, a device for the consumption of drugs. Normally cannabis. The cannabis is burned on a wire mesh, and the resulting smoke is bubbled through water, to cool it and remove many harsh elements, before it is inhaled by the drug 'user.' |
| 14:28.37 | Adys | ~bing |
| 14:28.37 | purl | bing is probably an Empirical stochastic bandwidth tester |
| 14:28.54 | Shirik | ~boop |
| 14:28.58 | Shirik | :( |
| 14:29.11 | Shirik | rofl @ purl's definition of bing |
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| 14:29.18 | *** mode/#wowuidev [+o ckknight] by ChanServ |
| 14:29.52 | Fisker | i'm not part of your system Shirik |
| 14:30.23 | Wobin | In the Ning Nang Nong |
| 14:30.47 | Wobin | Where the Cows go Bong |
| 14:30.49 | Wobin | And the monkeys all say BOO |
| 14:31.06 | ZorbaBeta | although just going off to bed |
| 14:31.12 | ZorbaBeta | so, unpong I guess |
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| 14:40.42 | *** join/#wowuidev laeg (n=laeg@unaffiliated/laeg) |
| 14:40.57 | laeg | is there anyway to check which is the best eu battlegroup pvpwise? |
| 14:41.31 | mikma | was it that you can't change frames to target persons in combat? |
| 14:41.50 | mikma | http://s.wowinterface.com/preview/pvw30281.png <- someone is asking that list to be clickable |
| 14:41.56 | Kraps | cod:waw crashes when i try to get into a multiplayer game and the error dialog is covered up |
| 14:42.21 | Fisker | i can help you Kraps |
| 14:42.40 | Kraps | ok... |
| 14:42.51 | Fisker | uninstall it |
| 14:42.53 | Fisker | problem solved |
| 14:43.16 | Kraps | words cannot describe how much i hate you |
| 14:44.27 | Fisker | should've thought of that before you installed a shitty game |
| 14:45.23 | Kraps | so i should take your word for it that its a shitty game? |
| 14:45.30 | mikma | wobwork1: you know? |
| 14:45.34 | Fisker | sure Kraps |
| 14:45.36 | Fisker | It's CoD |
| 14:45.40 | zenzelezz | I enjoyed WaW |
| 14:48.35 | nicoli_s | im just hoping mw2 is gonna be good |
| 14:48.42 | nicoli_s | i need a good fps |
| 14:50.29 | Kraps | i bought waw for multiplayer and i cant get in a game |
| 14:50.38 | Codayus | WaW was terribad. :-/ |
| 14:50.58 | Codayus | But then, it wasn't Infinity Ward, so what do you expect? :-) |
| 14:51.58 | Codayus | In any case, I have to agree with Fisker. Your really not missing much if you can't get into a multiplayer game. Just uninstall and play COD4 until the next real COD game is released. :-) |
| 14:53.29 | mikma | NO NO NO |
| 14:53.32 | mikma | L4D <3 <3 <3 <3 |
| 14:53.45 | zenzelezz | how ironic |
| 14:53.54 | zenzelezz | I'd have thought L4D would be > 3 |
| 14:53.57 | Kraps | but now i'm out 50 bucks |
| 14:54.15 | Kraps | wtf headdesk |
| 14:54.37 | Kraps | and my nvidia card wont update |
| 14:55.27 | Codayus | Think of it as a learning experience. You've learned not to trust Treyarch. (Yeah, I'm a bit bitter too. Although I admit, at least I got the stupid thing to run...) |
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| 14:56.08 | zenzelezz | Treyarch? |
| 14:59.18 | Kraps | i have a pirated cod 4, cant do multiplayer with that either |
| 15:01.02 | Codayus | Kraps: I recommend buying it, it's win. |
| 15:02.41 | olafski | is cod4 modern warfare? |
| 15:02.45 | Kraps | http://brokershandsontheirfacesblog.tumblr.com/ |
| 15:02.53 | Kraps | olafski: yes |
| 15:03.19 | olafski | oh that one is great |
| 15:03.25 | olafski | I recommend buying it too ;) |
| 15:03.40 | Ackis | ZorbaBeta: ping to your pong (was in a meeting) |
| 15:04.02 | Kraps | Modern Warfare 2 is out in a month |
| 15:04.21 | Ackis | olafski: I bought 4 x 2800 point cards last night |
| 15:04.48 | Ackis | I couldn't enter them all because it said you've redeemed the maximum number for the day lol |
| 15:05.29 | olafski | lol! |
| 15:05.39 | olafski | try the shadow complex demo if you haven't already btw |
| 15:05.45 | olafski | it's awesome imo :) |
| 15:06.15 | olafski | basically all the arcade games on my profile are good imo.. but not everyone might like them, some of them are kinda weird like Ikaruga and Rez |
| 15:06.34 | olafski | reminds me i should play Rez again someday, it's great if you turn the sound up and have had a few beers |
| 15:06.52 | Kraps | i thought steam had MW2 but i dont see it |
| 15:07.47 | Arrowmaster | olafski: its better with multiple controllers and if you play the 'Mitz' way |
| 15:07.54 | olafski | what's Mitz? |
| 15:08.05 | Arrowmaster | the guy that created the game |
| 15:08.10 | olafski | apparently you're supposed to put one controller on your belly |
| 15:08.13 | olafski | is that what you mean? |
| 15:08.33 | Arrowmaster | behind your back, your neck, and on your feet |
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| 15:09.16 | olafski | oO |
| 15:09.16 | olafski | wow :P |
| 15:09.41 | Ackis | olafski: I have so many games right now I don't want to buy anything new til I finish at least half of them lol |
| 15:09.51 | olafski | ^^ |
| 15:09.58 | olafski | with finish you mean get full achievements? :o |
| 15:10.02 | olafski | I should "finish" keflings sometime too |
| 15:10.08 | Ackis | yup lol |
| 15:10.10 | olafski | but so much running around and that engine is so bad :< |
| 15:10.21 | olafski | buy DOAX2 for cheap, you'll be a while before you get 1000 points there ;) |
| 15:12.05 | nicoli_s | doax2 is the volley ball game right? |
| 15:12.07 | Ackis | I want to finish batman first then I'll move on to lego batman lol |
| 15:12.07 | olafski | yes |
| 15:12.10 | olafski | it suuuuuuuuucks |
| 15:12.31 | olafski | glad I didn't get any achievements in doax2 so I could remove it from my profile |
| 15:12.33 | Ackis | batman or lego batman? |
| 15:12.34 | nicoli_s | and ikaruha and rez arent just weird, they are fucking great |
| 15:12.41 | olafski | but then again you don't "accidentally" get achievements in doax2 |
| 15:12.46 | olafski | ackis: doax2 ;) |
| 15:12.49 | olafski | nicoli_s: yes :) |
| 15:12.57 | olafski | I eventually even managed to finish ikaruga |
| 15:13.06 | nicoli_s | god, i cant get past like the 2nd level |
| 15:13.17 | olafski | for every hour playtime you have, you can get an extra continue :) |
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| 15:13.41 | olafski | I'm at like 3-4 hours now I think :P |
| 15:13.43 | Arrowmaster | me too i think |
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| 15:13.43 | Arrowmaster | im on the 4th level i think |
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| 15:13.51 | olafski | got chapters 1-2 down pretty well, on a good run I can do those without dying |
| 15:13.51 | nicoli_s | ahh didnt know that |
| 15:13.52 | olafski | but after that it becomes horror |
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| 15:14.47 | olafski | nicoli_s: if you get 10 hours you get infinite continues ;) |
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| 15:14.48 | olafski | chapter 4 is just horrible |
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| 15:14.48 | olafski | 5 is much better :) |
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| 15:16.53 | laeg | is there anyway to check which is the best eu battlegroup pvpwise? |
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| 15:19.10 | Pneu^ | cyclone |
| 15:21.03 | AckisWork | Cannot add points. You have reached your daily purchase limit. /sigh |
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| 15:22.07 | olafski | :) |
| 15:22.14 | olafski | do you really need that many points right now? :P |
| 15:22.38 | AckisWork | I wanted to break 10k |
| 15:23.01 | Kraps | so i should buy cod4 even though the sequel is out on nov 24? |
| 15:23.47 | Arrowmaster` | probably not |
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| 15:24.26 | AckisWork | olafski: have you heard about the wireless N adapter coming out? |
| 15:24.33 | olafski | no.. what's that oO |
| 15:24.42 | olafski | I bought a dreamcast just for ikaruga btw ;p |
| 15:24.57 | AckisWork | http://www.xbox360achievements.org/news/news-3650-GameStop-Confirms-New-Wireless-N-Adapter.html |
| 15:25.11 | olafski | oh.. I'm not much into wireless, I assume that means the N protocol thingy so faster than g or b? oO |
| 15:25.39 | AckisWork | aye |
| 15:25.50 | AckisWork | wonder if it'll support aes2 |
| 15:26.50 | olafski | no clue what all that is |
| 15:26.50 | olafski | I use wired lan |
| 15:26.51 | Ackis | olafski: did you get the southpark code at all? |
| 15:26.56 | olafski | I don't even know how to use a router :D |
| 15:27.02 | olafski | hmm no nothing about southpark |
| 15:27.05 | olafski | let me check spambox |
| 15:27.06 | Ackis | lol |
| 15:27.27 | olafski | I just plug my ethernet cable in the wall and it works, love it |
| 15:28.43 | olafski | nope no code |
| 15:28.47 | olafski | bbl, gonna pick up the lady |
| 15:29.26 | Ackis | make her walk! |
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| 15:29.56 | Antiarc | So, if I were theoretically to write a logarithmic cooldown bar, any things you all would like to see in it? |
| 15:31.09 | Ackis | Antiarc: I'd like it to tell me where to go for quests |
| 15:31.15 | Ackis | I just got spore on facebook! |
| 15:31.31 | Lopeppeppy | ... is that good? |
| 15:31.36 | Ackis | I dunno |
| 15:31.41 | Ackis | but spore was a lot of fun |
| 15:31.48 | Ackis | if it wasn't for wow i'd still be playing it |
| 15:31.48 | Antiarc | Ackis: REQUEST DENIED |
| 15:32.29 | Ackis | Antiarc: I am ENTITLED DO IT! RAWR |
| 15:33.36 | jnwhiteh | okay lunch break! |
| 15:33.39 | jnwhiteh | Antiarc: I love cooldownline |
| 15:33.40 | zenzelezz | what's a logarithmic cooldown bar? |
| 15:33.40 | jnwhiteh | but he's a nazi =) |
| 15:33.48 | jnwhiteh | Antiarc: so yes, I would use it.. but I dont need 10,000 options |
| 15:33.50 | jnwhiteh | just basic ones :P |
| 15:33.57 | jnwhiteh | and tell me when you're done |
| 15:33.57 | jnwhiteh | kthx. |
| 15:34.15 | Antiarc | jnwhiteh: CoolLine isn't really logarithmic. It's a hack, fixed at 6 minutes, doesn't animate smoothly |
| 15:34.25 | jnwhiteh | yes |
| 15:34.29 | jnwhiteh | you've identified my problems =) |
| 15:34.39 | jnwhiteh | you had me at "logarithmic cooldown bar" |
| 15:34.50 | zenzelezz | you lost me at the same place |
| 15:34.57 | Antiarc | Mine supports arbitrary time max, and you can even tweak the log base so you get different time compression |
| 15:35.12 | Antiarc | So, you can pick a scale that fits the size you desire |
| 15:35.18 | jnwhiteh | Antiarc: does it adjust automatically at all? |
| 15:35.20 | jnwhiteh | That would be nice |
| 15:35.27 | Antiarc | Define what you mean |
| 15:35.33 | jnwhiteh | with a 30 sec cooldown, it'd be one scale.. when you have one that's 1:30 on top it would change again. |
| 15:35.46 | Antiarc | Right now you just pick a timemax in the settings, but you could have it automatically adjust up to a given threshold |
| 15:35.56 | Antiarc | I suspect that'd be visually irritating, though, jumping around like that |
| 15:35.57 | jnwhiteh | yeah that'd be neat |
| 15:35.59 | jnwhiteh | make it happen =) |
| 15:36.00 | Antiarc | But it could do it trivially |
| 15:36.04 | jnwhiteh | even with the configurable max |
| 15:36.04 | Antiarc | I'll add an option for it. |
| 15:36.07 | jnwhiteh | and <3 |
| 15:36.13 | Antiarc | You can set a hard max |
| 15:36.33 | Antiarc | But it'll collapse to the nearest 30-second minimum, perhaps |
| 15:36.33 | jnwhiteh | okay, lunch |
| 15:36.41 | jnwhiteh | but someone ping me when Antiarc is done =) |
| 15:36.55 | Antiarc | I have a proof of concept working already. Worked on it before the servers went down :) |
| 15:37.08 | Antiarc | Honestly, if I add the ability to move and resize the frame, it'd be good enough for v1. |
| 15:37.16 | Fisker | engage jnwhiteh |
| 15:38.34 | *** join/#wowuidev Dewin (n=Daniel@71.59.222.35) |
| 15:38.49 | zenzelezz | <Antiarc> I have a proof of concept working already. Worked on it before the servers went down :) <--- your logarithms crashed the servers! |
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| 15:43.32 | zenzelezz | so I finally found a way to make my oldest computer quiet (the case is the kind that is prone to rattling noises occasionally) |
| 15:43.45 | zenzelezz | put a bathrobe under it |
| 15:44.10 | Lopeppeppy | ... get a few felt feet, raises the case without as much heat retention. |
| 15:44.42 | zenzelezz | I don't imagine there'd be any heat retention from the bath robe; the case doesn't have any air inlets/outlets underneath it |
| 15:45.27 | *** join/#wowuidev Fisker (i=lolgourr@62.61.142.209.generic-hostname.arrownet.dk) |
| 15:46.30 | Lopeppeppy | The case puts out heat. Having it sit on an insulator keeps in heat, even just a little bit. Felt feeties would be better, probably. |
| 15:47.06 | zenzelezz | perhaps. It's cool enough anyhow; and the stupid feet are hollow, so felt feet wouldn't stick anyway |
| 15:47.26 | Lopeppeppy | those are silly feetsies |
| 15:47.38 | zenzelezz | it's a silly case |
| 15:47.53 | zenzelezz | but I don't care enough to put in any effort |
| 15:49.52 | *** join/#wowuidev Lunessa (n=Lunessa@WoWUIDev/Lunessa) |
| 15:50.22 | Aelobin | Fisker: :o |
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| 15:51.40 | Lopeppeppy | Morning, Lunessa. |
| 15:51.50 | Lunessa | Station Lopeppeppy. |
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| 15:53.09 | Fisker | WHAT YOU THINK I'M STUPID Aelobin? |
| 15:53.15 | Fisker | I'M NOT PART OF YOUR SYSTEM |
| 15:53.39 | Aelobin | i have a system? :o |
| 15:54.44 | Raws | A complex system of levers and pulleys |
| 15:55.04 | cog|work | any curse people around? |
| 15:55.20 | zenzelezz | warlocks? |
| 15:55.26 | cog|work | curse.com... |
| 15:55.27 | Fisker | yeah Aelobin |
| 15:55.30 | zenzelezz | oh, Curse |
| 15:55.51 | Aelobin | invites Fisker to be part of his system. |
| 15:55.52 | Fisker | http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=whwFlTrqWZ0 |
| 15:56.25 | Lunessa | My office mate has been playing the "think with yer dipstick" commercials over and over and over... and I've only been here 15 minutes. |
| 15:57.31 | Aelobin | Fisker: oh |
| 15:57.48 | Sesshu | rofl fisker |
| 15:57.52 | *** join/#wowuidev ArrowmasterClass (n=arrow@WoWUIDev/WoWAce/ResponsibleForEverythingAndNothing/Arrowmaster) |
| 15:58.01 | Sesshu | this video is crazy |
| 15:58.28 | *** join/#wowuidev brykrys_ (n=chatzill@82-44-26-119.cable.ubr02.craw.blueyonder.co.uk) |
| 15:58.52 | zenzelezz | Lunessa: download "Barbie Girl" and put that on repeat until he gets the message |
| 15:59.12 | Lunessa | zenzelezz: That way lies Mutually Assured Destruction |
| 16:00.58 | cog|work | is a barbie girl, in the barbie wo-orld |
| 16:01.43 | Fisker | Jeg er en dåse slime |
| 16:01.47 | Fisker | og du kan lege med mig |
| 16:01.50 | Fisker | fordi jeg er en dåse slime |
| 16:01.54 | Sesshu | english please |
| 16:01.55 | Sesshu | ! |
| 16:01.55 | Fisker | no |
| 16:02.00 | nicoli_s | wheres my sc2 fisker? |
| 16:02.05 | Fisker | where's my sc2? |
| 16:02.17 | Fisker | http://www.dr.dk/pirattv/klip/gramsespektrum-akva/ |
| 16:06.55 | NightHawkTheSane | Lunessa: mutually assured destruction is better than going insane alone. |
| 16:08.20 | Lopeppeppy | Wow, yeah, Barbie World would destroy poor Lunessa, be nice! |
| 16:09.01 | Lunessa | I don't know. I could use a party with a girl composed mostly of plastic... /trying not to laugh too hard/ |
| 16:09.07 | *** join/#wowuidev dardack (n=chatzill@static-68-236-156-25.alb.east.verizon.net) |
| 16:09.30 | Lopeppeppy | *laugh* |
| 16:09.56 | Gnarfoz | http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dW1Epl2LdFM&hd=1 |
| 16:10.26 | NightHawkTheSane | gives Lunessa a beer. |
| 16:10.39 | Lunessa | toasts NHTS |
| 16:11.54 | durcyn | gives Lunessa a flamethrower. |
| 16:13.03 | Lunessa | durcyn: Instigator. |
| 16:13.25 | *** join/#wowuidev Kraftman (n=Chris@cpc1-cwma7-2-0-cust280.7-3.cable.virginmedia.com) |
| 16:13.54 | ArrowmasterClass | Lunessa: get the non english version of the song |
| 16:14.35 | Lunessa | ArrowmasterClass: Now that's a wickedly cruel suggestion. Your mind is evil, warped, and generally my kind of thinking. |
| 16:15.59 | *** join/#wowuidev KarlKFI (n=KarlKFI@ip68-231-217-61.oc.oc.cox.net) |
| 16:16.02 | NightHawkTheSane | oh man, someone did that in a language other than english? |
| 16:16.04 | NightHawkTheSane | shudders |
| 16:16.23 | ArrowmasterClass | its originally not in english |
| 16:16.37 | NightHawkTheSane | thats even more disturbing |
| 16:16.37 | ArrowmasterClass | its from one of those crazy scandinavian countries |
| 16:16.55 | ArrowmasterClass | probably swedes |
| 16:17.03 | zenzelezz | which song are you talking about? |
| 16:17.13 | Lunessa | Months of daylight followed by months of darkness will do that to their minds. |
| 16:17.26 | ArrowmasterClass | zenzelezz: the one you suggested |
| 16:17.37 | ArrowmasterClass | although i missed the convo before that point |
| 16:18.06 | zenzelezz | I wasn't aware there was a non-English version of that |
| 16:18.27 | zenzelezz | but the group (Aqua) was a couple of Danish guys and the Norwegian girls inger |
| 16:18.29 | zenzelezz | *singer |
| 16:18.53 | ArrowmasterClass | bah so i was wrong |
| 16:19.04 | ArrowmasterClass | it wasnt swedes |
| 16:19.59 | Fisker | i have an idea for a new social networking site |
| 16:20.07 | ArrowmasterClass | no |
| 16:20.09 | Fisker | yes |
| 16:20.14 | Fisker | I call it stalker |
| 16:20.17 | ArrowmasterClass | pets Fisker |
| 16:20.18 | Lunessa | http://www.pvponline.com/2009/10/06/left-4-dress/ |
| 16:20.23 | Fisker | It's like twitter but you send status updates about others |
| 16:21.17 | *** join/#wowuidev Shirik (n=mpdelbuo@WoWUIDev/WoWIStaff/Norganna/StatisticalEngineer/Shirik) |
| 16:21.17 | *** mode/#wowuidev [+o Shirik] by ChanServ |
| 16:21.30 | NightHawkTheSane | Lunessa: hilarious. :) |
| 16:21.48 | Lunessa | Clean out your #&)(*&$@ ears woman! |
| 16:23.24 | Shirik | "Particularly for the domain of safety-critical applications, where the developers are typically application domain experts with less background in programming fault-tolerant real-time systems [16], the possibility to provide extensive code generation would be crucial." |
| 16:23.25 | Shirik | ... what? |
| 16:23.38 | Shirik | safety-critical application developers have less background in fault tolerance? |
| 16:23.43 | zenzelezz | yes |
| 16:24.05 | Lunessa | If it fails once, it's not safe. Kill it with fire. |
| 16:24.06 | Shirik | uh, no :P |
| 16:24.10 | Shirik | totally wrong Lunessa |
| 16:24.23 | Shirik | if it fails, then there should be recovery mechanisms |
| 16:24.29 | Shirik | do you honestly want planes falling out of the sky? |
| 16:24.42 | Lunessa | Shirik: Do I need to include <sarcasm> </sarcasm> tags? |
| 16:24.57 | Shirik | approximately 25% of flights have some kind of hardware fault mid flight. 99.999+% of those are never known by the pilot. |
| 16:24.58 | Lopeppeppy | kill it with lysol instead, cheaper |
| 16:25.01 | Shirik | :( |
| 16:25.04 | Shirik | fine |
| 16:25.14 | NightHawkTheSane | i dunno, fire is pretty cheap |
| 16:25.23 | Lunessa | But that quote sounds like "consultant speak" |
| 16:25.47 | ArrowmasterClass | Shirik: what is this for that the devs dont have background in real-time systems? |
| 16:26.20 | Shirik | someone proposing a mechanism to provide safety-critical fault tolerance in automatic code generation |
| 16:27.00 | Lunessa | Lopeppeppy: http://icanhascheezburger.com/2009/10/06/funny-pictures-cleared-my-evening/ |
| 16:27.39 | Fisker | man Shirik |
| 16:27.51 | Fisker | being away from a computer for a few days have hurt my ability to use computers :( |
| 16:28.00 | Fisker | I'm like "What do i wanna do now?" |
| 16:28.04 | Fisker | and then i'm like "lol idk" |
| 16:28.06 | Fisker | :( |
| 16:28.18 | ArrowmasterClass | Shirik: seems like the kinda field you want devs with background in fault tolarent real time operations |
| 16:28.31 | Shirik | exactly... |
| 16:28.34 | Shirik | I think the guy's smoking something |
| 16:29.06 | ArrowmasterClass | my uncle speciallizes in fault tolarent real time stuff i think |
| 16:29.22 | NightHawkTheSane | Fisker: read a book? |
| 16:29.29 | Shirik | so do I :P Well, as much as I can while I'm a student |
| 16:29.32 | Shirik | but that's what I worked on all summer |
| 16:29.44 | ArrowmasterClass | but then again thats probably why hes been involved with systems around AEGIS and AWACS |
| 16:29.57 | Shirik | UAVs ftw |
| 16:30.06 | Shirik | UAVs need a lot of fault tolerance :P |
| 16:30.23 | Shirik | or else it will decide to go flying off into the middle of nowhere |
| 16:30.32 | Shirik | and then the FAA will hate you |
| 16:31.08 | ArrowmasterClass | "Specification for Real-Time Distributed Java" something about that just sounds wrong |
| 16:31.19 | Shirik | actually not the first time I've heard that |
| 16:31.23 | Shirik | there's a lot of people trying to latch on to this concept of "Real-Time Java" |
| 16:31.31 | Shirik | Personally, I think it'll never take off |
| 16:32.14 | Shirik | as a start, I know at the very least the FAA would hate it |
| 16:32.14 | Shirik | the FDA is worse than the FAA |
| 16:32.14 | Shirik | so.. |
| 16:32.14 | Shirik | there's two major fields gone |
| 16:32.27 | ArrowmasterClass | "Multilevel Secure Real-Time DOS Study" sounds even worse |
| 16:33.41 | Shirik | why does DOS need to be real-time? |
| 16:33.44 | Shirik | It's not multitasking is it? |
| 16:34.01 | ArrowmasterClass | i dont know but thats probably kinda old |
| 16:35.31 | ArrowmasterClass | i really need to see if i can get my uncle to help me find a job, the place he works for really sounds interesting |
| 16:35.46 | Fisker | slaps Shirik around a bit with a large trout |
| 16:35.57 | Fisker | of course DOS is multitasking |
| 16:36.11 | Fisker | l2DOS 4 |
| 16:36.28 | Shirik | ArrowmasterClass: Work those connections :) |
| 16:36.28 | Shirik | where does he work? |
| 16:36.30 | ArrowmasterClass | The Open Group |
| 16:37.14 | Shirik | ~ping |
| 16:37.14 | purl | ~pong |
| 16:37.19 | Shirik | IT is so worthless |
| 16:37.22 | cog|work | You might be a redneck if your neighbors took up a collection to get your dog neutered. |
| 16:37.26 | Shirik | why can't we have functional stuff |
| 16:38.46 | Fisker | slaps Shirik around a bit with a large trout |
| 16:41.56 | *** join/#wowuidev brykrys (n=chatzill@WoWUIDev/Norganna/Dev/Brykrys) |
| 16:42.46 | zenzelezz | hm, people still use Smalltalk? o_O |
| 16:43.26 | Fisker | slaps zenzelezz around a bit with a large trout |
| 16:44.36 | kdtresh | a friend of mine just had an interviewer ask the question "why is (1/6)*3 = 1/2 wrong?" |
| 16:45.24 | Sesshu | lua> (1/6)*3 |
| 16:45.25 | lua_bot | Sesshu: 0.5 |
| 16:45.26 | zenzelezz | requires lvalue |
| 16:46.05 | Fisker | surprise no u zenzelezz |
| 16:46.08 | zenzelezz | I would be really tempted to answer that just to see their reaction |
| 16:47.09 | kdtresh | hmmm, it may be the monty hall problem |
| 16:47.15 | *** join/#wowuidev alestane (n=nevin@c-66-30-209-28.hsd1.ma.comcast.net) |
| 16:47.15 | *** mode/#wowuidev [+v alestane] by ChanServ |
| 16:47.23 | *** join/#wowuidev Movix (n=Movix@mail.schiffmann.fr) |
| 16:47.26 | kdtresh | i've never seen it put that way before though |
| 16:48.29 | zenzelezz | what's that? |
| 16:48.29 | zenzelezz | or rather, how's that? |
| 16:48.48 | kdtresh | the monty hall problem? |
| 16:49.10 | zenzelezz | how would the monty hall problem apply to the question? |
| 16:49.25 | Dagmar | kdthresh: You know what it is, right? |
| 16:49.36 | Dagmar | nevermind |
| 16:49.40 | Dagmar | Still absorbing coffee |
| 16:50.12 | Dagmar | kdtresh: Because they're not using base 10 |
| 16:50.25 | zenzelezz | or was the question spoken, as in he couldn't know if it was "(1/6)*3" or "1/(6 * 3)"? |
| 16:50.33 | Dagmar | Otherwise, three one sixths is sure as hell one half |
| 16:51.20 | Dagmar | I like zenseless's answer tho |
| 16:51.47 | Dagmar | The Monty Hall problem has nothing to do with sixths tho |
| 16:52.54 | kdtresh | they apparently had her get up in the interview and do this stuff on a whiteboard |
| 16:52.58 | kdtresh | so i imagine it was written |
| 16:53.23 | ArrowmasterClass | for what kinda job? |
| 16:53.29 | zenzelezz | then I at least don't know how those couldn't be equal |
| 16:53.49 | kdtresh | i don't know the specifics, but i used to date the interviewer, lol |
| 16:53.54 | kdtresh | at least the one that asked that question |
| 16:53.59 | Dagmar | Pretty much the only way that would be not true is if it were in octal or something crazy, but then the question would be invalid becuase you're not "allowed" to notate numbers without specifying the base (other than 10) next to them for this reason |
| 16:54.02 | nevcairiel | its a kinda evil question, if the answer is based on another base then 10, since when its not explicitly mentioned, its generally always implied to be 10 :P |
| 16:54.17 | nevcairiel | maybe its integer divisons |
| 16:54.19 | nevcairiel | or somethint :P |
| 16:54.25 | Dagmar | ,..but if you're interviewing for a coding job... |
| 16:54.39 | nevcairiel | in C that wouldn't work like that :) |
| 16:54.42 | Dagmar | ...that would be exactly the kind of crazy paranoia required to spot a lot of bugs. |
| 16:54.42 | zenzelezz | nevcairiel: that could be one explanation |
| 16:55.03 | Dagmar | "Hey lol they are sending URLs in ASCII!" |
| 16:55.18 | kdtresh | the interviewee doesn't speak very good english, it must have been rough |
| 16:56.57 | kdtresh | i know the interviewer doesn't speak any japanese |
| 16:57.26 | kdtresh | it was for a math job |
| 16:57.28 | kdtresh | product analyst |
| 16:57.31 | kdtresh | at igt |
| 16:57.48 | Dagmar | Japanese company? |
| 16:57.55 | nevcairiel | if its a math job it probably isnt my integer division |
| 16:57.57 | Dagmar | "It's wrong because my boss said it's wrong." |
| 16:58.02 | Dagmar | Simple as that. |
| 16:58.12 | kdtresh | apparently the job has something to do with second-guessing the math |
| 16:58.37 | kdtresh | the interviewer does statistical stuff for them |
| 16:58.47 | nevcairiel | maybe the answer would be "it isn't wrong, here is the proof" |
| 16:58.57 | nevcairiel | :P |
| 16:59.13 | nevcairiel | I dunno, i could never work a math job all day |
| 16:59.45 | kdtresh | i couldn't either |
| 16:59.50 | kdtresh | at least i can't imagine being able to |
| 17:00.21 | Shirik | Best application ever: http://wowi.pastey.net/126166 |
| 17:00.42 | Lopeppeppy | "I can't answer that without more information. What is the context of the statement?" |
| 17:01.23 | Shirik | I especially like the answer to the last question |
| 17:01.57 | nevcairiel | I don't get the answer |
| 17:02.18 | zenzelezz | Shirik: score, you're lucky to get such a clearly talented person! |
| 17:02.36 | nevcairiel | Hey he doesnt even want to raid, whats the problem :P |
| 17:02.55 | Lopeppeppy | Yeah... he answered n/a to the raid availability question. |
| 17:03.00 | Shirik | It's synonymous for "please deny me" |
| 17:03.14 | zenzelezz | he also said he wants to join to be in the same guild as his friend |
| 17:03.17 | nevcairiel | He is just looking for a place to learn and play with his friend |
| 17:03.21 | zenzelezz | are you a strictly raid guild? |
| 17:03.31 | nevcairiel | we used to have some people like that |
| 17:04.02 | nevcairiel | although they didn't post applications |
| 17:04.10 | nevcairiel | their friend usually talked to the officers |
| 17:05.52 | Shirik | zenzelezz: I have no problems with letting friends in |
| 17:05.53 | ArrowmasterClass | yeah we used to have a lot of members like that too |
| 17:05.54 | Shirik | but |
| 17:05.54 | Legorol | I don't see what the big deal with that app is. He is clearly applying for a social membership. |
| 17:06.00 | Shirik | they could at least take the time to fill out the app |
| 17:06.05 | Legorol | He did. |
| 17:06.13 | Legorol | he answered every single question correctly as far as i can see |
| 17:06.13 | Shirik | I'm not sure I call that last question "filling it out" |
| 17:06.32 | Legorol | the last question is n/a if you don't want to raid, so he is showing a sense of humour |
| 17:06.34 | Legorol | big deal |
| 17:06.49 | Shirik | ? |
| 17:06.52 | Shirik | how do you say that |
| 17:06.55 | ArrowmasterClass | http://www.engadget.com/2009/10/05/microsoft-research-shows-off-multitouch-mouse-prototypes/ |
| 17:06.56 | zenzelezz | I have to agree with Legorol |
| 17:07.06 | ArrowmasterClass | i need to get my multitouch mouse idea patented |
| 17:07.08 | Shirik | Tell us about yourself? |
| 17:07.09 | zenzelezz | until I noticed he wasn't applying for a raid spot, I'd say it was a bad application |
| 17:07.18 | NightHawkTheSane | ArrowmasterClass: sounds like its too late for that |
| 17:07.20 | Shirik | oh well not my decision, and it was already denied :) |
| 17:07.26 | Legorol | i think for a social membership application, it's the most serious i have seen |
| 17:07.36 | Shirik | then you've seen some pretty bad apps :P |
| 17:07.38 | ArrowmasterClass | NightHawkTheSane: i think one of those gets close to my idea but its still different |
| 17:07.38 | Legorol | he actually answered all the questions, even the ones that don't apply |
| 17:07.43 | Legorol | Shirik: yes |
| 17:07.53 | Shirik | I still don't understand how you call that last question "answered" |
| 17:07.54 | zenzelezz | to be nitpicky, "tell us about yourself?" sounds more like a "you can" than "you must" |
| 17:08.26 | Legorol | Shirik: since he isn't applying to raid, he doesn't need to give any more details. So he went for a humorous answer, which in itself speaks of his personality. |
| 17:08.30 | Legorol | Imo the question is answered. |
| 17:08.41 | Shirik | I think you are totally missing the point of that question |
| 17:08.43 | Legorol | that last question really sounds like a generic "any other comments" question |
| 17:08.51 | Shirik | regardless of whether or not he's applying to raid, we want to know what our members are like |
| 17:08.52 | zenzelezz | Shirik: no, we disagree about it. That's different |
| 17:09.02 | *** join/#wowuidev cyndis (n=quassel@lyseo.edu.ouka.fi) |
| 17:09.15 | Legorol | for a raiding application, i'd have interpreted that last question as "is there anything else you can impress us with" |
| 17:09.21 | Shirik | regardless of whether or not we disagree, it's my guild, so I'm pretty sure I know the point of that question |
| 17:09.29 | Shirik | your interpretation may be different, but that doesn't change its purpose |
| 17:09.39 | zenzelezz | Shirik: we're just stating our opinions, stop taking it personally |
| 17:09.39 | Shirik | perhaps it is flawed for its purpose, but its purpose still does not change |
| 17:09.40 | Legorol | we don't disagree on what you *intended* with the question |
| 17:09.45 | Legorol | we are just saying how it comes across from the outside |
| 17:09.51 | Legorol | maybe this is a sign that you need to reword the question? |
| 17:10.02 | Shirik | I'm not taking it personally, I'm just saying you can't say you disagree about the purpose |
| 17:10.11 | zenzelezz | we never did |
| 17:10.17 | zenzelezz | we said we had a different interpretation |
| 17:10.19 | Legorol | i am just saying what i perceived as the purpose |
| 17:10.21 | Shirik | (13:08:34) (@Shirik) I think you are totally missing the point of that question |
| 17:10.22 | Shirik | (13:08:45) (zenzelezz) Shirik: no, we disagree about it. That's different |
| 17:10.25 | Legorol | which is clearly different from the intended one |
| 17:10.42 | Legorol | ok well enough e-drama for one day, need coffee |
| 17:10.46 | Shirik | what e-drama |
| 17:10.51 | Legorol | hugs Shirik |
| 17:10.52 | zenzelezz | we disagree about the interpretation, if you prefer a more elaborate explanation |
| 17:10.53 | Shirik | if that's what you call drama you need to play wow more |
| 17:10.59 | Legorol | :D |
| 17:11.09 | Legorol | maybe because I do play a lot and see a lot of drama, i got sensitive ;) |
| 17:11.14 | Legorol | j/k |
| 17:11.19 | Legorol | i know this is not drama, but i do need that coffee |
| 17:11.19 | Shirik | hell |
| 17:11.22 | Shirik | you should see my raids |
| 17:11.26 | Legorol | hehe |
| 17:11.27 | Shirik | that's epic drama :P |
| 17:11.37 | Shirik | that reminds me |
| 17:11.40 | Legorol | fortunately our guild is pretty drama free atm, as far as raid guilds go |
| 17:11.45 | Shirik | if I want to transfer to another server on a different faction |
| 17:11.48 | Shirik | do I have to pay twice or just once? |
| 17:11.52 | Legorol | we had quite a bit a few weeks ago but we shed 5 people and it's all gone |
| 17:12.01 | Legorol | i think you pay twice |
| 17:12.07 | Shirik | bah |
| 17:12.13 | Aelobin | ArrowmasterClass: that video is cool |
| 17:12.22 | jnwhiteh | 96k LoC in the wow ui |
| 17:12.25 | jnwhiteh | of Lua |
| 17:12.27 | Shirik | but there's no restriction on 30 days or sanything, right? |
| 17:12.29 | zenzelezz | Legorol: was it you that play on Silvermoon? |
| 17:12.34 | Legorol | yup |
| 17:12.44 | Shirik | jnwhiteh: True LoC? Or with comments/blank lines/etc |
| 17:12.46 | Legorol | jnwhiteh: what's a LoC? |
| 17:12.57 | NightHawkTheSane | lines of code |
| 17:12.57 | jnwhiteh | Shirik: comments and blank lines included |
| 17:13.01 | zenzelezz | Legorol: what's it like there these days? Still no horde and incessant shouting from not-so-great guilds at the good guilds? |
| 17:13.02 | Legorol | it's not a warLoCk, is it |
| 17:13.06 | jnwhiteh | but Blizzard is pretty sane about the amount of spaces |
| 17:13.09 | Shirik | yeah |
| 17:13.14 | Legorol | zenzelezz: yup, pretty much |
| 17:13.19 | Legorol | and even more alliance guilds |
| 17:13.19 | Shirik | and (much to my dismay) there is somewhat a lack of comments P |
| 17:13.20 | Shirik | :P |
| 17:14.02 | Legorol | zenzelezz: the top 15 guilds are pretty stable, but the top 30 fluctuates somewhat |
| 17:14.06 | Legorol | which i think is a good sign |
| 17:14.13 | Legorol | and there are occationally new guilds that break into the top 15 |
| 17:14.14 | zenzelezz | Legorol: yeah, that's about how I remember it |
| 17:14.31 | Legorol | i'd say the number of guilds at the top has grown in wotlk, it seems |
| 17:14.36 | Legorol | we had a lot of transfers as well |
| 17:14.42 | Legorol | coming in that is |
| 17:14.42 | jnwhiteh | portuguese is pretty.. but i just tune out |
| 17:14.48 | jnwhiteh | when a slide is on for 2 minutes |
| 17:14.51 | jnwhiteh | i get so lost. |
| 17:14.52 | zenzelezz | IS/Numen/Nevermore and whatstheirname still the top four? |
| 17:15.01 | Legorol | not anymore, no |
| 17:15.03 | Legorol | IS is |
| 17:15.07 | Legorol | Numen is gone |
| 17:15.09 | Legorol | Nevermore sunk |
| 17:15.17 | Legorol | Nevermore is around 12 i think |
| 17:15.20 | Fisker | damn |
| 17:15.20 | zenzelezz | really? That's... interesting |
| 17:15.24 | *** join/#wowuidev soufron (n=soufron@vol75-1-81-57-79-123.fbx.proxad.net) |
| 17:15.36 | Fisker | This guy is arguing that if Blizzard allows Ninjalooting then it's normal for ninjalooting to occur |
| 17:15.36 | zenzelezz | any idea what happened to Numen? They were pretty solid throughout BC |
| 17:15.40 | Legorol | some new names to know: Minions of Mithril, Silence, Escape, Crush |
| 17:15.47 | Legorol | they are still around |
| 17:15.52 | Legorol | they just don't seem to be doing that great |
| 17:15.59 | Dagmar | Fisker: The law "allows" sodomizing your grandmother, but that doesn't mean it's right |
| 17:16.02 | zenzelezz | oh yeah, a lot of people left the top guilds for MoM, I forgot... and Silence is still going? |
| 17:16.11 | zenzelezz | remember the drama when they beat everyone to Vashj |
| 17:16.11 | Legorol | yes, quite well in fact |
| 17:16.28 | Fisker | nono Dagmar |
| 17:16.29 | Legorol | but overall the top hasn't changed much |
| 17:16.29 | Shirik | The law allows me to call Fisker owndeded |
| 17:16.36 | Shirik | but I know I'm right |
| 17:16.39 | Fisker | It means it's normal for me to sodomize my grandmother! |
| 17:16.40 | Dagmar | Fisker: It does. |
| 17:16.50 | Legorol | oh wait, i was mixing Numen up with someone else >.< |
| 17:16.53 | Legorol | nvm, Numen is still there |
| 17:16.56 | Legorol | sorry, i had a brainfart |
| 17:17.00 | zenzelezz | happens :) |
| 17:17.14 | zenzelezz | Legorol: any idea where Winters Heart is? Used to be approximately ~12-15 in BC, but I haven't been keeping up |
| 17:17.17 | Legorol | so yah the familiar names are mostly still around, some a bit lower down |
| 17:17.23 | Legorol | yup, WH is going strong |
| 17:17.30 | Legorol | it's sunk a bit in rankings i'd say, bu |
| 17:17.31 | Legorol | *but |
| 17:17.39 | Shirik | Fisker |
| 17:17.39 | Legorol | i think that's mostly because there are more guilds at the top now |
| 17:17.40 | Shirik | Tell me why |
| 17:17.49 | Legorol | WH is still progressing at the same rate i think |
| 17:18.03 | Dagmar | It's because they didn't have to go to school in the morning during the summer. |
| 17:18.24 | Fisker | why Shirik |
| 17:18.25 | Fisker | WHY?! |
| 17:18.50 | Legorol | zenzelezz: which guilds were you in that i might have heard of? |
| 17:19.02 | alestane | I think the principle appeal to me of bagpipe music is precisely the way in which the best is melodically incomprehensible. |
| 17:19.45 | Legorol | alestane: i love bagpipe too |
| 17:19.52 | Legorol | plus, its' a technological marvel... |
| 17:20.00 | Legorol | a wind instrument that keeps going when you breath in? win! |
| 17:20.09 | Dagmar | euuuuwww |
| 17:20.11 | zenzelezz | Legorol: the two raid guilds I were in were Surge up to BC, then WH until a little before Sunwell |
| 17:20.18 | kdtresh | kenny g's saxophone plays while he's breathing in |
| 17:20.24 | Legorol | WH is a guild i respect a lot |
| 17:20.27 | Legorol | very mature, very solid imo |
| 17:20.32 | Dagmar | kdtresh: That's the magic of "reed synching" |
| 17:20.36 | Legorol | got a couple friends in there |
| 17:20.41 | kdtresh | or circular breathing |
| 17:20.56 | zenzelezz | Legorol: yeah, they were (probably still are) great; I just had some personal issues to deal with :-| |
| 17:20.57 | Dagmar | There's no circular breathing. |
| 17:21.21 | Dagmar | You can pump air out through your mouth using only your mouth to bridge the gap between breaths, but you can not inhale and exhale at the same time |
| 17:21.29 | alestane | The classic bagpipe airs use this technology to produce music that flagrantly defies most rules of rhythm and melodic progression, but comes just close enough to be facsinating. |
| 17:21.30 | Legorol | now that i think about it, it's interesting to watch what happens to guilds and people if you played the game for 5 years |
| 17:21.33 | Dagmar | "circular breathing" is a hideous misnomer. |
| 17:21.40 | zenzelezz | Legorol: yeah |
| 17:21.43 | Legorol | i just realised i probably have friends in 15 out of 30 of the top guilds :D |
| 17:21.45 | zenzelezz | I can never entirely check out of a guild |
| 17:21.59 | Legorol | and even more fun is, thinking back of when and in what guild i did play with them years ago :) |
| 17:22.02 | Dagmar | I say this having spent years playing brass instruments in jazz and concert bands. |
| 17:22.16 | kdtresh | i don't think it's overly hideous |
| 17:22.27 | Dagmar | Kenny reed synchs |
| 17:22.35 | kdtresh | how does that work? |
| 17:23.00 | kdtresh | he stuck a microphone to his nose at the concert i went to so we could hear him sniffing while he played |
| 17:23.25 | Dagmar | You close your throat and use your mouth and the back of your tongue to keep air going out while you suck in more air through your nose |
| 17:23.52 | kdtresh | is that circular "breathing"? |
| 17:23.56 | Dagmar | So it's not breathing by the normal definition, and it's definitely not circular because there's only one linear path for airflow |
| 17:24.15 | alestane | "buffered exhalation"? |
| 17:24.19 | Dagmar | Basically |
| 17:24.25 | kdtresh | but the idea that air is going out and in at the same time is the not-so-accurate "circular" part |
| 17:24.37 | kdtresh | just not in and out of your lungs |
| 17:24.45 | Dagmar | Air is a lot thinner than a liquid and there's no way you're getting air to be going both in and out through your esophagus at the same time |
| 17:25.17 | Shirik | Dagmar played band |
| 17:25.21 | Shirik | I knew there was a reason for me to hate him |
| 17:25.24 | kdtresh | no, but it is going in and out of your body at the same time, sin't it? |
| 17:25.30 | Shirik | orchestra ftw |
| 17:25.33 | Shirik | die band people |
| 17:25.36 | Dagmar | I played heavy metal sometimes. |
| 17:25.40 | Dagmar | 40lb sousaphone. |
| 17:25.52 | Shirik | We played Black Sabbath |
| 17:25.57 | Dagmar | Anything but a trumpet basically. |
| 17:26.01 | Dagmar | I hate trumpets. |
| 17:26.02 | Shirik | our orchestra instructor was awesome |
| 17:26.02 | kdtresh | i played the old beatup alto sax my dad played in high school |
| 17:26.08 | Shirik | we did some awesome stuff |
| 17:26.12 | Shirik | awesome |
| 17:26.24 | Dagmar | French horns, baritones, tubas, trombones, I'm fine with. |
| 17:26.27 | Dagmar | No trumpet |
| 17:26.34 | kdtresh | my wife played violin with practically the whole violin section of the reno philharmonic |
| 17:26.40 | kdtresh | before they were that good |
| 17:26.45 | Shirik | http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_aIhh9nFYv4 |
| 17:26.48 | Shirik | Imagine playing that on a cello |
| 17:26.50 | Dagmar | ...and how how brass instruments make you popular with the women. |
| 17:26.51 | NightHawkTheSane | i never understood the whole band/orchestra hate. they're both musical instruments people. |
| 17:26.51 | Shirik | so awesome |
| 17:26.59 | *** join/#wowuidev Dashkal (n=dashkal@WoWUIDev/Nexus/dashkal) |
| 17:27.03 | NightHawkTheSane | Dagmar: especially the women who play brass instruments? >.> |
| 17:27.08 | Dagmar | NightHawkTheSane: TOO MUCH WALKING AROUND |
| 17:27.08 | Lunessa | And this one time, at band camp... |
| 17:27.13 | kdtresh | my cousin played the trombone |
| 17:27.19 | kdtresh | yeah, she's a lesbian |
| 17:27.28 | Dagmar | NightHawkTheSane: The ones who've clued in to what that does to your lips, yes |
| 17:27.40 | Dagmar | kdthresh: lol |
| 17:27.42 | Dagmar | rofl |
| 17:27.46 | alestane | "Kiss a brass player...they do it better!" |
| 17:27.57 | Shirik | NightHawkTheSane: It's just one of those things that has to be done |
| 17:28.13 | Dagmar | Spent six or seven years blowing into a mouthpiece and you'll be able to remove beer bottle caps with your lips |
| 17:28.23 | Dagmar | ...whether they're twist off or not. |
| 17:28.28 | NightHawkTheSane | hehe |
| 17:28.34 | Shirik | it's like emacs vs vim |
| 17:28.41 | Shirik | They could get along |
| 17:28.41 | Shirik | they're both editors |
| 17:28.47 | Shirik | well, one's a bloated OS and one's a fully functional editor |
| 17:28.48 | Shirik | but anyway |
| 17:28.52 | Lunessa | Chrome, trailer hitch. Golf ball, garden hose. It's all the same joke. |
| 17:28.57 | Shirik | it is just how it is |
| 17:29.22 | Dagmar | Lunessa: Nah, brass players just blow |
| 17:29.24 | Lopeppeppy | OMG, how hard is this division? If you're a new user, you sign up for beginner class. If you are an experienced user, you sign up for study hall. |
| 17:29.44 | alestane | But how do I know which I should take? |
| 17:30.06 | Lunessa | by which objective standard do I measure? |
| 17:30.41 | Dagmar | Lunessa: That you think it's the same thing tells us you've probably not experienced it. |
| 17:30.42 | Dagmar | heh |
| 17:30.47 | Lopeppeppy | exactly. bunch of airhead sheeple idiots |
| 17:31.07 | Lunessa | Dagmar: That's both cruel and untrue. |
| 17:31.42 | Lunessa | To quote Joe Rogan, "Nobody kicks blowjobs. NOBODY." |
| 17:31.50 | Dagmar | hahah |
| 17:32.17 | Dagmar | Yeah but see, the entire thing about brass instruments is being able to control the pressure applied by one's lips and change it rapidly to maintain the proper pitch |
| 17:32.38 | Dagmar | The more brass instruments you play the greater the variation in mouthpiece size and therefore the greater control required. |
| 17:33.09 | Lunessa | Dagmar: I was a flautist. Never very good, but I did get to meet some interesting women that way. |
| 17:33.09 | Dagmar | It's a bit like just because you can type doesn't mean you can even play scales on a piano without the volume going wildly up and down |
| 17:33.21 | Dagmar | ...and I will not go any further than that without requiring ID checks. |
| 17:33.27 | dardack | so any tips on solo'ing the 3rd required boss in AQ40? |
| 17:34.26 | Dagmar | I aced my undeclared minor in college because of band stuff. |
| 17:34.56 | Dagmar | Those were my favorite classes. |
| 17:35.02 | kdtresh | i minored in math because i only had to take two extra classes |
| 17:35.11 | kdtresh | and one was "theory of positive integers" |
| 17:35.13 | Dagmar | singsongs, "Someone doesn't get it" |
| 17:35.35 | *** part/#wowuidev ArrowmasterClass (n=arrow@WoWUIDev/WoWAce/ResponsibleForEverythingAndNothing/Arrowmaster) |
| 17:35.45 | Dagmar | ...or if they do they have a very liberal school. |
| 17:35.56 | Dagmar | I wanna take classes there |
| 17:36.25 | Dagmar | Hell I'd go back to living in a dorm for that |
| 17:39.25 | NeoTron | AQ40 might be level 60 but even so... doesn't seem very soloable |
| 17:41.06 | Dagmar | I don't know that you can do twins solo |
| 17:41.24 | Dagmar | So... not a lot of point in trying to solo the place, afaik |
| 17:45.40 | zenzelezz | would be interesting soloing C'thun |
| 17:45.49 | Dagmar | hehe |
| 17:46.03 | Dagmar | At least there'd be no issues with someone running in early |
| 17:46.21 | Dagmar | No Indiana Jones fail that way |
| 17:46.54 | Shirik | http://catb.org/~esr/html-hell.html I love the comment about marquees |
| 17:47.39 | Dagmar | The marquee tags are useful. |
| 17:47.46 | Dagmar | Wrap each word in it's own tag. |
| 17:47.52 | Shirik | o.o |
| 17:47.54 | Shirik | what |
| 17:47.56 | Dagmar | "Lynx-friendly" |
| 17:48.05 | Shirik | how is that lynx-friendly? |
| 17:48.15 | Shirik | by destroying all the other browsers? :P |
| 17:48.20 | Dagmar | It's about the only browser that's going to not make readers send you nastygrams. |
| 17:48.26 | Shirik | lol |
| 17:48.30 | *** join/#wowuidev foxlit (n=foxlit@0x573e6bae.alb2nxx18.dynamic.dsl.tele.dk) |
| 17:49.10 | Dagmar | Its much better than using font name="Symbol, Sans" |
| 17:49.47 | KarlKFI | So, what's new in addon land these days? |
| 17:50.21 | Lopeppeppy | bacon |
| 17:50.38 | KarlKFI | nah, Tekkub's been around for a while |
| 17:52.19 | Lopeppeppy | but is he delivered via pandaren? |
| 17:52.31 | *** join/#wowuidev Kowski (n=ykow@dhcp-v015-008.mobile.uci.edu) |
| 17:52.41 | KarlKFI | i spose if a pandaren pushed the button... |
| 17:54.41 | alestane | "This bastard cousin of the blink tag can cause vertigo and seizures in susceptible individuals, reducing them to exactly that state of drooling lobotomized idiocy that's such an essential prerequisite to purchasing Microsoft products. Coincidence? We think not." |
| 17:55.28 | industrial | what tag |
| 17:55.30 | industrial | marquee? |
| 17:55.34 | ScytheBlade1 | holy crap, candied bacon ice cream |
| 17:55.36 | ScytheBlade1 | http://www.davidlebovitz.com/archives/2008/03/candied_bacon_i_1.html |
| 17:55.36 | Dagmar | Well, the author of that page also has some things wrong |
| 17:55.53 | Dagmar | "since most fonts are scaled for 72dpi they're already 30% smaller than they ought to be at 100dpi." |
| 17:56.00 | Dagmar | If they are, your font renderer is broken. |
| 17:56.17 | NightHawkTheSane | ScytheBlade1: as the date on that post clearly indicates, welcome to a year and a half ago ;) |
| 17:56.20 | Dagmar | dpi == "real world" size, after all |
| 17:56.34 | industrial | dpi is just MORE DOTS |
| 17:56.47 | Dagmar | This becomes *painfully* problematic when you say, plug your laptop into an eight foot projector screen that reports it's _actual_ size over EDID. |
| 17:56.52 | ScytheBlade1 | NightHawkTheSane: who cares |
| 17:56.56 | ScytheBlade1 | NightHawkTheSane: still amazing |
| 17:57.04 | NightHawkTheSane | oh, hey, no doubt. but hardly new ;) |
| 17:57.19 | Dagmar | It's really awesome to see everything come out about three pixels high. |
| 17:58.38 | KarlKFI | bleh, these last few wow patches haven't broken any of my addons. it seems i'm down to maintaining only the most resilient ones |
| 17:58.38 | Dagmar | industrial: The dot density should only affect bitmap fonts, never anything vector based like ttf |
| 17:59.08 | industrial | Dagmar: its just a wow related joke, dots per inch -> 100 is more dots then 75 -> MORE DOTS |
| 17:59.16 | industrial | is bored atm |
| 17:59.19 | Dagmar | Ah okay |
| 17:59.24 | Dagmar | That's actualy funny. |
| 17:59.30 | industrial | :> |
| 17:59.32 | industrial | I don't have a desktop :( gfx card broke |
| 17:59.43 | Dagmar | I'm a bit off my game because we're having weather here right now. |
| 18:00.19 | *** join/#wowuidev siorai (n=siorai@user-5447b1e2.wfd88b.dsl.pol.co.uk) |
| 18:00.32 | NightHawkTheSane | industrial: read a book! |
| 18:00.59 | NightHawkTheSane | Dagmar: ... isn't there weather everywhere, all the time? |
| 18:01.38 | Dagmar | NightHawkTheSane: Have you ever been to San Francisco? |
| 18:01.59 | Dagmar | By the standards we use here in Nashville, they don't have weather. |
| 18:02.29 | Dagmar | I think I saw lightning there three times. |
| 18:02.44 | Dagmar | I just counted off four lightning strikes here. |
| 18:02.55 | NightHawkTheSane | hey, even nice weather is weather. :P |
| 18:03.01 | Dagmar | There's "weather" and there's "god is angry!" mode |
| 18:03.08 | Dagmar | We're approaching the latter right now. |
| 18:03.37 | industrial | where I live we dont have hurricanes and tidal waves and all that |
| 18:03.52 | Dagmar | We're way inland |
| 18:03.54 | industrial | .. but half the country (literally) could sink under water \:D/ |
| 18:04.01 | Dagmar | ...but thanks to the TVA, we're not underwater. |
| 18:04.18 | Grum_ | good lord, someone shoot that gearscore addon O.o |
| 18:04.23 | Dagmar | We just buy out some farmers and build new lakes to keep it out of the way. |
| 18:04.49 | Dagmar | Being that I live on the banks of a river used to shunt all this excess water back and forth, I gotta pay attention |
| 18:04.57 | Shirik | http://www.fourmilab.ch/webtools/demoroniser/ rofl! |
| 18:05.05 | Dagmar | I *might* be able to fish from my balcony when I get home if things go bad. |
| 18:05.36 | Dagmar | Until they've fully fixed the Wolf Creek Dam, this is more of a concern than most people like to think about. |
| 18:05.41 | NightHawkTheSane | Dagmar: from what i hear, sevral of the dams a bit south of seattle are in pretty bad shape, and there's a real danger of some of the valleys flooding, populated valleys... |
| 18:05.43 | jnwhiteh | i read that as 'flash' |
| 18:05.47 | nevcairiel | if you get home, then :P |
| 18:05.49 | jnwhiteh | and was wondering why you wanted to 'flash from your balcony' |
| 18:05.56 | Dagmar | nevcariel: Oh I'd be able to get home |
| 18:05.58 | NightHawkTheSane | a few of my friends live down there.. :\ |
| 18:06.11 | *** join/#wowuidev Keias (n=bleh@pool-72-86-106-233.aubnin.fios.verizon.net) |
| 18:06.19 | Dagmar | When the Corps of Engineers started making those flood maps _publicly available on the Internet_, it was a hint they were scared. |
| 18:06.35 | Dagmar | I've looked those maps over really carefully |
| 18:06.52 | Fisker | slaps jnwhiteh around a bit with a large trout |
| 18:07.11 | Dagmar | A worst-case scenario would mean I'd have to park at the opposite end of the complex, but I could probably get into the apartment without getting my ankles wet |
| 18:07.30 | industrial | Fisker likes to flash from balconies |
| 18:07.30 | Lopeppeppy | You have to live on a mountain to avoid all flooding, and then you just get avalanches and landslides. |
| 18:07.39 | *** join/#wowuidev Antiarc (n=Antiarc@wsip-70-167-195-98.ph.ph.cox.net) |
| 18:07.54 | Dagmar | I can underhand pitch into the river from here. |
| 18:08.09 | NightHawkTheSane | Lopeppeppy: i live on the side of a hill a stone's throw from the ocean. Does that count? |
| 18:08.17 | Dagmar | They dropped the water level 15 feet yesterday |
| 18:08.18 | NightHawkTheSane | all the water just goes right past me, down to the sound. |
| 18:08.46 | Fisker | I'M NOT PART OF YOUR SYSTEM industrial |
| 18:09.18 | Lopeppeppy | you get wet, nhts. |
| 18:10.41 | NightHawkTheSane | Lopeppeppy: nah, water never sticks around, and i live on the second floor |
| 18:10.53 | *** join/#wowuidev Dagmar (i=dagmar@c-98-193-180-167.hsd1.tn.comcast.net) |
| 18:11.08 | industrial | "Customers always find an approach which pays us less money." <<-- yeah cause you keep finding ways to get more |
| 18:11.17 | industrial | it doesnt even matter that that quote is from ballmer |
| 18:11.20 | industrial | :p |
| 18:11.30 | Dagmar | NightHawkTheSane: ...said by a man who does not live at the bottom of a flood plain. |
| 18:11.51 | NightHawkTheSane | Dagmar: i don't... :D |
| 18:11.58 | Fisker | well how much would you pay for this operating system? |
| 18:12.01 | Fisker | DON'T ANSWER! |
| 18:12.04 | Dagmar | Two apartments ago I actually bought an industrial dehumidifier |
| 18:12.24 | Dagmar | It wasn't until six months after I moved from there that metro fixed the drainage |
| 18:12.28 | NightHawkTheSane | but yeah, like i said, a couple of my friends do, and apparently there's real danger of the green river bursting a few dams and floodingthis winter |
| 18:12.51 | Lopeppeppy | snuggles Lunessa up warm and dry! |
| 18:13.01 | Dagmar | If you're _really_ lucky it'll happen when there's a few inches of ice atop the water to add mechanical grinding |
| 18:13.02 | Fisker | anyways industrial |
| 18:13.03 | Fisker | my stance is this |
| 18:13.10 | Fisker | either you pay, or you pirate the fuck out of it |
| 18:13.28 | Fisker | Paying 20$ for a fake msdnaa account is fucking retarded |
| 18:13.41 | Fisker | You don't have a valid license, your copy is just as illegal if you had downloaded it |
| 18:13.46 | Fisker | why the fuck pay 20$ a year for it? |
| 18:14.38 | Dagmar | It saves having to remove the viruses you get from using a keygen |
| 18:14.43 | *** join/#wowuidev Thunder_Child (n=TC@WoWUIDev/PITA/TC) |
| 18:15.13 | Fisker | i think you have to move on from using kazzaa Dagmar |
| 18:15.51 | *** join/#wowuidev Kaso (n=Kaso@host86-147-210-155.range86-147.btcentralplus.com) |
| 18:17.44 | Pneumatus | lol kazzaa |
| 18:18.05 | Lunessa | huggles Lopeppeppy and offers her half his sammich |
| 18:18.41 | *** join/#wowuidev Gryphon (n=gryphon@c-76-104-164-148.hsd1.wa.comcast.net) |
| 18:18.48 | Pneumatus | more like Napster, anyway |
| 18:19.12 | Lopeppeppy | What flavor sammiches are for today, Lunessa? |
| 18:19.30 | Lunessa | Ummm - grilled cheddar |
| 18:20.12 | Lopeppeppy | Hmm. I think that I'll wait until tuna fish day to use my cute innocent look to snag food. Grilled cheese its aren't on my list of very edible foods |
| 18:20.29 | Lunessa | Tuna was last night |
| 18:21.59 | Dagmar | That means you just reheat it in the microwave. |
| 18:22.00 | Dagmar | :) |
| 18:22.45 | NightHawkTheSane | mm... grilled cheese |
| 18:22.55 | Thunder_Child | you people are making me hungry >.< |
| 18:23.36 | Lunessa | Dagmar: no, tuna is for tuna salad sammiches only. I can't eat it otherwise. |
| 18:23.57 | Dagmar | Ah okay |
| 18:24.10 | Lopeppeppy | What else do you do with tuna? *curious* 'cause I can only eat it as sammiches too. |
| 18:24.12 | Lopeppeppy | Need some more little purple onions |
| 18:24.13 | Dagmar | Tuna salad doesn't go quite straight to "chemical weaponry" as fast |
| 18:24.51 | Dagmar | Day old fish + microwave oven =~ "chemical weapons alert" |
| 18:25.45 | Lopeppeppy | Eew. |
| 18:25.50 | Lopeppeppy | Never ever cook fish at home. Ugh. |
| 18:25.58 | Lopeppeppy | and don't bring it to work, either. |
| 18:26.00 | nicoli_s | my gf has gotten it down |
| 18:26.17 | olafski | why cook it? |
| 18:26.18 | nicoli_s | she can do salmon and tilapia(both blackened and fried) |
| 18:26.19 | olafski | tuna is nice when raw |
| 18:26.46 | Lopeppeppy | tilapia is a nice fish. A favorite when going out to eat. |
| 18:26.51 | Lopeppeppy | but I won't cook fish in the house, ugh. |
| 18:27.00 | Dagmar | Yes but it's *hilarious* when it's gone even a tiny bit old and you microwave it. |
| 18:27.18 | Lopeppeppy | That's why. Ugh. |
| 18:27.30 | Lopeppeppy | I used to eat my leftover salmon cold. |
| 18:28.37 | nicoli_s | i cant do salmon cold |
| 18:28.59 | nicoli_s | <PROTECTED> |
| 18:28.59 | kdtresh | egad msn video is horrible |
| 18:33.38 | Arrowmaster | ive probably had more fish than like, my dad likes to go fishing a lot |
| 18:34.11 | Arrowmaster | him and 2 of his friends caught over 100 fish one weekend years ago, brought them all home and cleaned and deepfried them |
| 18:35.05 | Sesshu | fish is good for your memory |
| 18:35.17 | Lopeppeppy | lox /= cold salmon |
| 18:35.50 | Dagmar | It encourages you to remember never to microwave it again. |
| 18:36.34 | NightHawkTheSane | stays away from fish altogether |
| 18:37.59 | ScytheBlade1 | http://notalwaysright.com/why-husbands-should-play-boy-the-rules/2546 |
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| 18:41.09 | Shirik | the internets |
| 18:41.12 | Shirik | they are dying |
| 18:41.26 | Sesshu | hm |
| 18:41.33 | Lopeppeppy | nooooo. |
| 18:42.26 | *** join/#wowuidev Kaso (n=Kaso@host217-44-65-234.range217-44.btcentralplus.com) |
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| 18:45.22 | Lopeppeppy | You've been "juped" |
| 18:45.32 | Arrowmaster | damn you sbo now im reading notalwaysright again |
| 18:45.41 | Arrowmaster | http://notalwaysright.com/youve-got-the-wrongest-number/2538 |
| 18:46.01 | ScytheBlade1 | Arrowmaster: sucker, that is what an RSS reader is for |
| 18:46.20 | NightHawkTheSane | ^ |
| 18:48.21 | Shirik | mode Shirik +w damnit! |
| 18:48.26 | Shirik | Freenode is not listening to me :( |
| 18:49.47 | Thunder_Child | wallups Shirik |
| 18:50.50 | *** join/#wowuidev Doow (n=Miranda@unaffiliated/doow) |
| 18:51.12 | zenzelezz | Shirik: your +w doesn't have enough remaining charge |
| 18:52.02 | Lopeppeppy | You can't put damaged items in the auction house |
| 18:52.26 | Shirik | puts zenzelezz in an auction house |
| 18:52.29 | Sesshu | +w does what? |
| 18:52.36 | Sesshu | that thing with whois? |
| 18:56.35 | Shirik | no |
| 18:56.41 | Shirik | allows me to see wallops |
| 18:56.55 | Shirik | non-critical messages from ircops regarding the network |
| 18:57.18 | Dagmar | Information control. |
| 18:57.40 | Dagmar | Before timestamping on nicknames, you didn't exactly want to let people know things like which server just split from the network. |
| 18:58.10 | Sesshu | lol |
| 18:58.11 | Sesshu | okey |
| 18:58.15 | Fisker | slaps Shirik around a bit with a large trout |
| 18:58.30 | Dagmar | Well, let's say, for example, you allowed just everyone to see wallops. |
| 18:58.40 | Dagmar | They'd see that irc.neosoft.com just split from the network. |
| 18:58.50 | Dagmar | So you'd spawn a clone over on that, and name it say, "Shirik". |
| 18:59.00 | Sesshu | hehe |
| 18:59.08 | Dagmar | During the rejoin, you'd ping yourself and change nicks. |
| 18:59.13 | Dagmar | *BAM* no more Shirik. |
| 18:59.14 | Shirik | and then I go bye bye when they relink :( |
| 18:59.39 | Dagmar | You didn't really have to change nicks, it just meant you could keep the clone afterwards. |
| 19:00.42 | Shirik | I think Freenode still doesn't let you know what server split |
| 19:00.55 | Lopeppeppy | I think I see which server goes away. |
| 19:00.57 | Shirik | something about protecting the infrastructure |
| 19:01.08 | Lopeppeppy | verne.freenode.net irc.freenode.net? |
| 19:01.08 | Dagmar | Pretty much. |
| 19:01.10 | Shirik | the quit message shows what server /you/ are on |
| 19:01.18 | nevcairiel | they said it was luxemburough, or however you spell that countrys name in english |
| 19:01.23 | Shirik | yeah |
| 19:01.25 | nevcairiel | Lopeppeppy: thats your server |
| 19:01.33 | nevcairiel | cant have that many servers in lux :P |
| 19:01.38 | Shirik | because technically it did in fact split from you |
| 19:01.45 | Shirik | it just also split from everyone else |
| 19:01.51 | Lopeppeppy | I'm pretty sure that's not my server, that's the one that dropped zenzelezz etc. |
| 19:01.54 | Shirik | the irc.freenode.net is the other side :P |
| 19:02.01 | Shirik | it's your server, I promise Lopeppeppy |
| 19:02.06 | Lopeppeppy | Oh well. *gentle shrug* It died, and I didn't. |
| 19:02.12 | Dagmar | To be really evil, you'd attack neosoft's choice of NTP servers. |
| 19:02.21 | nevcairiel | Lopeppeppy: whois yoruself, it'll tell you which server you#re on |
| 19:02.21 | Dagmar | Then timestamping on nicks became academic. |
| 19:02.23 | zenzelezz | I was on bartol |
| 19:02.28 | Shirik | For example Lopeppeppy |
| 19:02.30 | Shirik | (14:40:13)  -⺠Netsplit (pratchett.freenode.net â¹-⺠irc.freenode.net) 6 quits: siorai, soufron, brykrys, Tepel, zenzelezz, chrippa- |
| 19:02.34 | Shirik | Notice how my message is different |
| 19:02.40 | siorai | ? |
| 19:02.46 | nevcairiel | * [Whois] nevcairiel is online via kornbluth.freenode.net (Frankfurt, DE, EU) |
| 19:02.47 | Shirik | sorry :( |
| 19:02.47 | nevcairiel | ^ |
| 19:02.57 | Dagmar | They're pretty closed-mouth about the names of individual servers here. |
| 19:03.28 | Lopeppeppy | I know about 2/3 of the ones at my school, and I can guess most of the rest based on naming schemes. |
| 19:03.43 | Shirik | I know all of the ones where I worked :) |
| 19:03.50 | Arrowmaster | nah /links will tell you all the server names, it just has the topology intentionally hidden |
| 19:03.58 | Shirik | at the school I honestly think I know all of the ones that are active |
| 19:04.02 | Shirik | because they're all always dead |
| 19:04.07 | Shirik | eclipse is the only one that's up |
| 19:04.08 | Shirik | ever |
| 19:04.11 | nevcairiel | they have all the freenode servers on the webpage |
| 19:04.24 | *** join/#wowuidev lua_bot (n=lua_bot@li37-84.members.linode.com) |
| 19:04.40 | MentalPower | Most of the servers at my workplace don't have names :( they're accessed by IP |
| 19:04.41 | Dagmar | Compared to other networks I've used in the past, they are definitely being quiet about it |
| 19:04.42 | MentalPower | shivers |
| 19:05.11 | nevcairiel | quiet? they talk to the users why something breaks, even with soem details, other nets don't even mention it :P |
| 19:05.11 | Shirik | really? |
| 19:05.17 | Shirik | I thought it was like, the big thing to do in IT |
| 19:05.20 | *** join/#wowuidev dardack_ (n=chatzill@static-68-236-156-25.alb.east.verizon.net) |
| 19:05.24 | Shirik | your servers always have to have some kind of naming convention |
| 19:05.25 | nevcairiel | I name all my servers :( |
| 19:05.28 | Shirik | like they're all stars |
| 19:05.30 | Dagmar | If the servers gave topology info in a nice formatted way that includes topology, I had scripts that could immediately know how to take advantage of it. |
| 19:05.30 | Shirik | or all elements |
| 19:05.32 | Shirik | or something |
| 19:05.44 | nevcairiel | mine are goa'ulds .. or egyption gods, whatever you like more :P |
| 19:06.07 | Shirik | I have a naming convention too |
| 19:06.08 | Dagmar | I buy stickers from those grocery store vending machines and name machines based on what comes out. |
| 19:06.11 | Shirik | mine are all named after me |
| 19:06.16 | Shirik | I have server MATT |
| 19:06.20 | Shirik | and that's it |
| 19:06.28 | nevcairiel | and what if you need a second one? |
| 19:06.32 | nevcairiel | i had to name like 10 |
| 19:06.33 | Lopeppeppy | Mine are all named for exes, so I have a reason to trash them. |
| 19:06.33 | Shirik | I'm screwed :P |
| 19:06.38 | Shirik | I'm broke so I don't think that's a big deal |
| 19:06.57 | Dagmar | Lopeppeppy: And your dates have _what_ to say about that? |
| 19:07.02 | Shirik | rofl |
| 19:07.05 | Shirik | huggles Lopeppeppy |
| 19:07.11 | Lopeppeppy | Absolutely-frellin'-nothing, Dagmar. :) |
| 19:07.32 | nevcairiel | well most of mine are "old" servers that left their datacenter for newer ones, and we bought them for cheap servers for our LAN Partys .. we don't always need state of the art servers :p |
| 19:07.42 | Shirik | mine is an old desktop |
| 19:07.47 | Shirik | it actually has two names |
| 19:07.49 | Shirik | I lied |
| 19:07.52 | Shirik | its official name is MATT |
| 19:08.03 | industrial | desktom and laptom, no servers :p |
| 19:08.08 | Shirik | but it also identifies itself on the M$ workgroup as ECOCAR-BUILDSVR |
| 19:08.08 | nevcairiel | lol |
| 19:08.23 | nevcairiel | thats not a name shirik, thats a functional description ;) |
| 19:08.26 | Arrowmaster | mine have weird names, i had an HP desktop named HP-SUX, a laptop named Warm-nutz, my new desktop is Tohsaka |
| 19:08.27 | Shirik | I know :P |
| 19:08.47 | Shirik | Tohsaka! |
| 19:08.52 | Shirik | Yes |
| 19:08.58 | Shirik | maybe I should name my servers after FSN characters |
| 19:09.08 | Arrowmaster | play the fucking game |
| 19:09.09 | nevcairiel | My Desktop doesnt fit my naming scheme, its named Tylan because i liked the name :p |
| 19:09.16 | Shirik | there's a game? |
| 19:09.19 | Arrowmaster | yes |
| 19:09.21 | Shirik | ! |
| 19:09.26 | Shirik | 360? |
| 19:09.26 | Shirik | or what |
| 19:09.27 | Arrowmaster | its a visual novel |
| 19:09.34 | Shirik | PC? |
| 19:09.39 | industrial | Arrowmaster: tohsaka... fate stay night? |
| 19:09.49 | Shirik | that's what I took it as industrial |
| 19:09.54 | Arrowmaster | pc, theres a ps2 version thats censored |
| 19:10.00 | Fisker | Shirik |
| 19:10.02 | Fisker | lov eme |
| 19:10.05 | Fisker | love me* |
| 19:10.06 | Shirik | no Fisker |
| 19:10.09 | Fisker | do it |
| 19:10.11 | Arrowmaster | industrial: yeah |
| 19:10.14 | industrial | \o/ |
| 19:10.19 | Fisker | or you ordered a thousand liters of milk |
| 19:10.20 | Thunder_Child | at my last job someone had their personal servers tied into the work network. one of them was called "Corpse fucker" |
| 19:10.26 | Arrowmaster | industrial: have you played the game? |
| 19:10.28 | Shirik | haha |
| 19:10.38 | Shirik | And I thought it was bad what we did |
| 19:10.45 | Fisker | I named one of my servers skullfuck |
| 19:10.49 | Shirik | We had a system that tracks all requirements, code, etc., with a number |
| 19:10.49 | Fisker | Instead of skulltrail |
| 19:10.50 | Fisker | hoho |
| 19:10.57 | Shirik | and one of the things it tracks is resouces, i.e., developers |
| 19:11.04 | Shirik | someone went in and added to one of the managers their dog |
| 19:11.09 | industrial | Arrowmaster: nope, just watched the anime. I'm not really into reading the comics and or playing the games :P |
| 19:11.21 | Shirik | so you go to that number and you see a description of a chihuahua |
| 19:11.23 | industrial | on the other hand, I'm pretty bored. |
| 19:11.27 | industrial | right now. |
| 19:11.29 | Shirik | he didn't know any programming languages though :( |
| 19:11.50 | Shirik | he also only worked 1 hour a week |
| 19:11.52 | Shirik | such a slacker |
| 19:12.11 | Arrowmaster | industrial: then atleast keep an eye out for the new movie whenever it comes out on dvd and thus gets fansubbed, although the movie isnt even out in theaters yet |
| 19:12.48 | Arrowmaster | so it will be a while |
| 19:12.50 | industrial | mmm :p is there RSS for this sort of thing? |
| 19:13.02 | industrial | (I'm not lazy) |
| 19:13.38 | *** join/#wowuidev ckknight (n=ckknight@WoWUIDev/WoWAce/CurseStaff/CurseForge/ckknight) |
| 19:13.38 | *** mode/#wowuidev [+o ckknight] by ChanServ |
| 19:13.50 | industrial | Fisker: there's your lover |
| 19:13.54 | Tepel | RFB Naming Scheme: http://www.well.com/~cynsa/newbutt.html |
| 19:14.15 | Arrowmaster | umm www.tokyotosho.info has an rss but that gets a lot of posts |
| 19:17.15 | industrial | onder why they wont add post filtering to google reader :S |
| 19:19.16 | Fisker | slaps industrial around a bit with a large trout |
| 19:23.47 | industrial | Fisker: harder |
| 19:24.05 | Lopeppeppy | Whee, get a private room, you two! |
| 19:26.10 | Antiarc | http://i35.tinypic.com/1zbcsg5.png |
| 19:27.09 | industrial | top one |
| 19:27.21 | Antiarc | You can do 'em all, heh |
| 19:27.25 | industrial | :p |
| 19:27.30 | Antiarc | I'm writing a logarithmic cooldown bar mod |
| 19:27.34 | Antiarc | And the bar is prototyped |
| 19:27.47 | Antiarc | So you can create multiple bars, and the intent is that you can select certain types of timers for each bar |
| 19:27.52 | industrial | right |
| 19:27.57 | Antiarc | So one bar might be your cooldowns, another might be your debuffs on a target, whatever |
| 19:28.04 | Antiarc | It'll work as a general timer mod, with a focus on cooldowns |
| 19:28.44 | ScytheBlade1 | win @ http://www.theonion.com/content/video/little_boy_heroically_shoots |
| 19:29.12 | Fisker | slaps industrial around a bit with a large trout |
| 19:29.46 | industrial | Fisker: I said harder, this isn't doing it for me anymore. |
| 19:31.28 | *** join/#wowuidev nuoHep (n=nuoHep@89.222.156.36) |
| 19:33.19 | *** join/#wowuidev DWSR (n=doingwha@unaffiliated/dwsr) |
| 19:33.25 | DWSR | hey al |
| 19:33.26 | DWSR | all* |
| 19:35.55 | Fisker | what you think i'm stupid industrial ? |
| 19:37.50 | NightHawkTheSane | yes |
| 19:38.09 | Tepel | Stupid no, intelectually challanged yes |
| 19:38.18 | Tepel | I spelled that wrong |
| 19:38.26 | *** join/#wowuidev smcn (i=smcn@67.166.76.157) |
| 19:38.45 | DWSR | So yeah, anyone a javascript dev? I need a script for Chrome. |
| 19:38.59 | DWSR | Ought to be something like 6 lines sans comments. |
| 19:39.13 | nicoli_s | i r |
| 19:40.02 | DWSR | nicoli_s: You ever write a greasemonkey script before? I need one to make Chrome's titlebar include the domain name of the currently active tab. |
| 19:40.05 | Fisker | i'm not part of your system Tepel |
| 19:40.07 | nicoli_s | nope |
| 19:41.04 | Tepel | DWSR: do you mean google chrome or firefox? |
| 19:41.11 | DWSR | google chrome. |
| 19:41.24 | DWSR | i.e. chromium. |
| 19:41.27 | Tepel | Didn't even know they had a plugin system |
| 19:42.17 | DWSR | Supports greasemonkey. |
| 19:42.21 | DWSR | and also extensions. |
| 19:42.30 | Tepel | Then how hard can it be? |
| 19:42.39 | DWSR | I'm not a javascript developer. |
| 19:42.54 | *** join/#wowuidev pompy (n=Mike@c-68-38-45-3.hsd1.nj.comcast.net) |
| 19:43.02 | DWSR | I was hoping someone who's had experience with greasemonkey/chrome before would be able to help me out, like I said, it can't possibly be that hard. |
| 19:43.04 | Tepel | Yet you determined the approximate size of the script |
| 19:43.14 | DWSR | http://jean-francois.im/2009/04/using-keepass-with-google-chro.html <-- Because I found one that doesn't work here. |
| 19:43.17 | Tepel | So you must know _something_ |
| 19:44.07 | Fisker | you probably fail DWSR |
| 19:44.14 | DWSR | Probably. |
| 19:45.09 | *** join/#wowuidev tekkub (n=tekkub@WoWUIDev/WoWI/Featured/Dongle/GitHub/Tekkub) |
| 19:45.09 | *** mode/#wowuidev [+v tekkub] by ChanServ |
| 19:45.40 | Tepel | Yeah, I mean, you paste the contents of that script in a file |
| 19:45.50 | DWSR | Tepel: I did.. |
| 19:45.51 | Tepel | Navigate to it from within Chrome, and voila |
| 19:45.54 | DWSR | Userscripts are enabled. |
| 19:46.15 | DWSR | It has no specific URL that it works with. |
| 19:46.17 | Fisker | did you put it in the right dir? |
| 19:46.19 | DWSR | Yes. |
| 19:46.27 | DWSR | I have other userscripts currently running atm, and they work. |
| 19:46.38 | Fisker | ,E |
| 19:47.00 | Tepel | Did you navigate to the script from within Chrome? |
| 19:47.12 | Tepel | Or did you just magically expected it to work when it's in C:\scripts |
| 19:47.22 | DWSR | Except it doesn't go into C:\scripts. |
| 19:47.35 | DWSR | And why do I need to navigate to the script? |
| 19:47.49 | Tepel | Cause then Greasemonkey fires and it will install the script |
| 19:47.52 | Tepel | IIRC |
| 19:47.55 | DWSR | no. |
| 19:48.05 | DWSR | Chrome's installation is a bit different than on FFox. |
| 19:48.21 | DWSR | Just putting the script in the correct directory is enough. |
| 19:49.03 | Tepel | Appearantly not |
| 19:49.07 | Tepel | Since it's not working |
| 19:49.30 | *** join/#wowuidev jpmorgan (n=jpmorgan@67.183.221.120) |
| 19:51.04 | DWSR | Tepel: My LinkYouTube, AdSweep, and Google scripts are all working. |
| 19:53.03 | *** join/#wowuidev Fisker (i=lolgourr@62.61.142.209.generic-hostname.arrownet.dk) |
| 19:57.20 | industrial | anyone care to donate to my vaporizer funds? providing cleaner smoking experience to anyone that would like to come over and smoke with me. |
| 19:57.23 | industrial | actually I just calculated (science ftw) in what kind of term the vaporizer would be more efficient moneywise |
| 19:57.31 | industrial | 5.7 months at a price of 439 with two usages a day with 9 usages for 5 euros |
| 19:57.35 | industrial | compared to the total costs of two joints a day |
| 19:57.52 | industrial | damn! :p |
| 19:58.02 | DWSR | dude. |
| 19:58.03 | DWSR | wtf. |
| 19:58.08 | Lopeppeppy | Did you include cleaning costs? |
| 19:58.45 | industrial | cleaning a vaporizer only includes emtying the tray after a few (!) uses :p |
| 19:59.12 | industrial | maybe buy a spare part once in X years |
| 19:59.15 | Lopeppeppy | There's no buildup of residue, or water mineral deposits? |
| 20:00.02 | industrial | the one i want doesnt have a water filter but I guess residue can build up |
| 20:00.25 | Lopeppeppy | Usually does. I have to scrub my cat's water fountain every week to get off the water deposits. |
| 20:00.41 | Legorol | just use distilled water, no minerals |
| 20:00.45 | Legorol | cat might die, but meh |
| 20:01.05 | industrial | sigh :p |
| 20:01.15 | industrial | http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vGhmzKk75Bc |
| 20:02.30 | industrial | http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1olkU4yKERk that one shows better how it works |
| 20:03.50 | industrial | http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hTI6TcYO7Kw lool hilarious |
| 20:03.54 | industrial | d-d-d-digital man |
| 20:07.52 | Shirik | rofl |
| 20:07.57 | Shirik | I have to give a 15 minute presentation |
| 20:08.02 | Shirik | and I have 31 slides |
| 20:08.17 | zenzelezz | then you need to slide fast |
| 20:08.20 | nevcairiel | i had like 40 slides for my 45minutes.. :P |
| 20:08.29 | zenzelezz | http://icanhascheezburger.com/2009/10/06/funny-pictures-was-invented/ |
| 20:08.32 | Shirik | There's just so much in this paper |
| 20:08.41 | Shirik | it's a really fascinating topic, and the paper was reallywell written |
| 20:08.46 | Shirik | I can't possibly cover it all :( |
| 20:08.49 | nevcairiel | well good summarizing skill is important too |
| 20:09.00 | Fisker | that reminds me |
| 20:09.00 | *** join/#wowuidev spode (n=spode@213-21-77-27.bon.t3.se) |
| 20:09.02 | Shirik | I took out some stuff |
| 20:09.13 | Fisker | I was showing some project as part of an exam |
| 20:09.19 | Shirik | I'll probably take out a little more |
| 20:09.27 | Shirik | he really drives down on "see what everyone's doing wrong" |
| 20:09.31 | Shirik | don't need so many examples |
| 20:09.32 | Fisker | So my plan was tell a bit about the tools we used and then how we use dthem |
| 20:09.44 | zenzelezz | "A Google study of DRAM errors in their data centers found that they are hundreds to thousands of times more common than has been previously believed"... interesting |
| 20:09.46 | Fisker | I just got to cover the tools we used, and then i got pwnt for not talking about how we used it |
| 20:09.46 | Fisker | :D |
| 20:13.06 | *** join/#wowuidev pompy1 (n=Mike@c-68-38-45-3.hsd1.nj.comcast.net) |
| 20:13.13 | Thrae | http://thedailywtf.com/ <-- read one and don't plan on getting much sleep if you've never visited before. |
| 20:14.06 | DWSR | Good lord. |
| 20:14.14 | DWSR | ##windows is run by nazis. |
| 20:17.19 | Tepel | Daily WTF is awesome |
| 20:18.36 | NightHawkTheSane | Tepel: whats scary is that i recognize the classic wtfs from when they first ran. >< |
| 20:19.03 | zenzelezz | "For people who enjoyed the first Operation Flashpoint, expectations for Dragon Rising may have been high. First of all it has been eight years since the previous game"... well yes, if you only count the ones with "Operation Flashpoint" in the name, and not ArmA + ARMA2 which are the more genuine successors... |
| 20:21.55 | industrial | loool |
| 20:21.56 | industrial | http://www.wow.com/2009/10/06/three-worgen-moon-graces-jinx/ |
| 20:22.02 | industrial | worgen shirt GETS YOU LAID |
| 20:22.08 | jnwhiteh | damn. |
| 20:22.10 | zenzelezz | I'll take two! |
| 20:22.13 | jnwhiteh | explaining the secure templat system |
| 20:22.20 | jnwhiteh | and the whole taint system |
| 20:22.21 | jnwhiteh | is complicated. |
| 20:23.00 | zenzelezz | try metaphors |
| 20:23.14 | jnwhiteh | don't need to, these are programmers. |
| 20:23.18 | jnwhiteh | metaphors would make it worse =) |
| 20:23.28 | zenzelezz | "Blizzards's code is like the hot girl in school. If you touch it, bad things are likely to happen" |
| 20:23.38 | jnwhiteh | :P |
| 20:23.57 | nevcairiel | But you do it anyway |
| 20:24.01 | cog|work | Shirik: now with reference material ;) http://cogwheel.info/idop/reference.html |
| 20:24.10 | NightHawkTheSane | and then you end up with a lifetime of pain in your groin? |
| 20:24.28 | nevcairiel | but it was worth it? |
| 20:24.31 | zenzelezz | NightHawkTheSane: sort of... things don't tend to work afterwards |
| 20:24.38 | nicoli_s | ahh .h, evil! |
| 20:24.39 | *** join/#wowuidev Torhal (n=callahan@74-132-200-5.dhcp.insightbb.com) |
| 20:24.59 | NightHawkTheSane | this metaphore has taken a strange turn for the awesome. |
| 20:26.12 | alestane | jnwhiteh: That's part of why I wanted to explain the basic idea first, then cover how to use the templates before explaining the precise mechanics of taint as "if you need to debug this..." |
| 20:26.30 | jnwhiteh | yeah |
| 20:26.35 | jnwhiteh | i'm still working out how this talk is going tow ork |
| 20:26.38 | jnwhiteh | :P |
| 20:26.51 | jnwhiteh | i have like.. 18 hours to figure it out |
| 20:26.57 | alestane | Oh, are you worrying about the Lua talk now? That is coming up, isn't it? |
| 20:27.03 | jnwhiteh | tomorrow |
| 20:27.04 | jnwhiteh | not worrying |
| 20:27.07 | jnwhiteh | just finishing my slides. |
| 20:27.21 | alestane | Well, that's better than worrying alright. |
| 20:27.21 | nevcairiel | you're holding a talk on the secure system and taint and all? |
| 20:27.27 | NightHawkTheSane | lua talk? |
| 20:27.31 | jnwhiteh | nevcairiel: a technical talk on Lua in Wow, so yes. |
| 20:27.40 | olafski | where are you giving that talk? |
| 20:27.42 | jnwhiteh | very different from the one I gave last year |
| 20:27.47 | jnwhiteh | olafski: Lua Workshop 2009 |
| 20:27.57 | olafski | ah nice |
| 20:28.11 | NightHawkTheSane | neat |
| 20:28.22 | Thrae | http://twitter.com/Shitmydadsays <-- this is like my parents, except without the cursing. Warning: Possibly NSFW |
| 20:29.36 | Lopeppeppy | ttfn, everypeople |
| 20:30.22 | *** join/#wowuidev dardack (n=chatzill@static-68-236-156-25.alb.east.verizon.net) |
| 20:32.18 | *** join/#wowuidev Aqua (n=Aquavett@74-137-176-182.dhcp.insightbb.com) |
| 20:33.52 | cog|work | Shirik: lol... IDOP stands for International Day Of Prayer... quite fitting for use with preprocessor-meta-template-metaprogramming |
| 20:36.03 | *** join/#wowuidev A-KO (i=as@c-69-143-90-155.hsd1.md.comcast.net) |
| 20:36.41 | cog|work | "Dear FSM: please guide my code safely through your preprocessor, and may your error messages provide enough information to track down the problem. Ramen" |
| 20:40.01 | *** join/#wowuidev Aelobin (n=Aelobin@88-109-52-18.dynamic.dsl.as9105.com) |
| 20:40.43 | Aelobin | slaps Fisker. |
| 20:40.49 | *** join/#wowuidev Gotai (n=Gotai@ip54546435.adsl-surfen.hetnet.nl) |
| 20:45.49 | Lunessa | I'm going to kill the guy who munged our call-logging database. |
| 20:47.46 | *** part/#wowuidev Zhinjio|AFK (n=Geo@75-166-227-34.hlrn.qwest.net) |
| 20:48.06 | cog|work | You've got an alibi in me |
| 20:51.45 | Lunessa | Excellent. |
| 20:52.09 | Lunessa | hums the theme from "Toy Story" /You've got a Friend in Me/ |
| 20:52.25 | mikma_ | pervert |
| 20:53.47 | industrial | kinky |
| 20:54.07 | industrial | i mean, thats what she said |
| 21:03.38 | *** join/#wowuidev Pewpewarrows (n=Pewpewar@c-68-33-19-176.hsd1.md.comcast.net) |
| 21:10.42 | *** join/#wowuidev spode- (i=spode@213-21-88-111.bon.t3.se) |
| 21:13.43 | *** join/#wowuidev Kraftman (n=Chris@cpc1-cwma7-2-0-cust280.7-3.cable.virginmedia.com) |
| 21:18.39 | *** part/#wowuidev Dewin (n=Daniel@71.59.222.35) |
| 21:25.29 | Shirik | cog|work: ? |
| 21:25.34 | Shirik | what was that in reference to? |
| 21:25.47 | cog|work | IdOp |
| 21:25.52 | Shirik | oh nice |
| 21:26.09 | Shirik | sorry I'm working on code generation stuff right now soyouconfused me :P |
| 21:26.27 | Thunder_Child | L2Spacebar Shirik |
| 21:26.36 | Shirik | not looking at screen while typing |
| 21:26.59 | Thunder_Child | maybe you should then |
| 21:27.13 | NightHawkTheSane | l2touchtype, stop staring at your keyboard ;) |
| 21:27.34 | Shirik | I'm staring at a presentation :P |
| 21:28.18 | Arrowmaster | then you fail, i just typed this with my monith off |
| 21:28.26 | Shirik | monith |
| 21:28.30 | Arrowmaster | fuck you |
| 21:28.32 | Arrowmaster | monitor |
| 21:28.45 | NightHawkTheSane | hha |
| 21:28.48 | NightHawkTheSane | ... |
| 21:28.48 | Arrowmaster | i got all the spaces right though |
| 21:28.50 | cog|work | llo |
| 21:32.36 | *** join/#wowuidev Tuller (n=muffins@pool-96-228-39-44.rcmdva.fios.verizon.net) |
| 21:32.51 | Shirik | rloof? |
| 21:32.58 | Thunder_Child | ~fail Arrowmaster |
| 21:32.59 | purl | Arrowmaster, you Fail! |
| 21:33.37 | Arrowmaster | at least i provide comedic entertainment |
| 21:36.49 | Thunder_Child | yes, but you are supposed to laugh WITH a comedian, not at them. |
| 21:38.05 | NightHawkTheSane | eh, i'm okay with either |
| 21:38.33 | Arrowmaster | Thunder_Child doesn't seem to know what slapstick comedy is |
| 21:38.59 | Thunder_Child | Arrowmaster, if you think about it you are laughing with them. |
| 21:44.19 | Lunessa | You can do either, depending on the sort of humor employed. |
| 21:46.36 | Thunder_Child | it has to do with the other person not you. since laughing at someone has negitive connotations it depends on if they are doing it on purpose. |
| 21:48.46 | DWSR | lol |
| 21:48.53 | DWSR | You guys have obviously never seen Louis CK |
| 21:49.18 | DWSR | That man you just laugh |
| 21:49.20 | industrial | ..yes we have. |
| 21:49.22 | DWSR | Not at your with. |
| 21:49.27 | DWSR | s/your/or/ |
| 21:50.11 | DWSR | anyone that can help me troubleshoot a steam problem? |
| 21:50.46 | Thunder_Child | you need heat |
| 21:50.57 | Thunder_Child | and a towel |
| 21:51.41 | DWSR | funny guy |
| 21:52.10 | Thunder_Child | ~asktoask |
| 21:52.11 | purl | This is IRC. Don't ask to ask a question. Just ask your question and if someone's around, they'll be glad to help. |
| 21:52.24 | DWSR | I'm asking to ask to ask |
| 21:52.31 | Thunder_Child | ~lart DWSR |
| 21:52.31 | purl | accelerates a free AOL cd to 50,000 rpm and lets DWSR feel it |
| 21:53.14 | industrial | cute, I made my torrent client make my laptop take off |
| 21:53.33 | industrial | load above 1 only though :S |
| 21:54.04 | industrial | 1, 1, 0.86 MEH i can do better then that - but its only the torrent client :p |
| 21:55.05 | Arrowmaster | lol |
| 21:55.10 | Arrowmaster | ive done way better than that |
| 21:55.34 | Arrowmaster | like 7.9, 7.7, 7.5 |
| 21:56.45 | Arrowmaster | 1 hour of video from a dvd encoded using h264 in a little over 1 hour |
| 21:59.24 | DWSR | lol |
| 21:59.36 | Shirik | is it proven that pi has an infinite number of digits? |
| 21:59.40 | DWSR | yes |
| 21:59.57 | Shadowed | Sounds like a lie from the man to keep the digits down |
| 22:00.11 | foxlit | You actually want "has an infinite number of non-repeating digits" |
| 22:00.19 | foxlit | 1/3 has an infinite number of digits :) |
| 22:00.39 | Thunder_Child | what question did you have about steam DWSR |
| 22:00.49 | *** join/#wowuidev Kraft (n=Chris@cpc1-cwma7-2-0-cust280.7-3.cable.virginmedia.com) |
| 22:00.50 | Shirik | foxlit: That depends onwhich base |
| 22:01.06 | Dashkal | waits impatiently for his TF2 servers to populate |
| 22:01.32 | NightHawkTheSane | DWSR: pi is a non-repeating non-terminating decimal. |
| 22:01.41 | foxlit | stalled maple for 120s by asking for sum(mobius(i), i=1..1000000) |
| 22:01.41 | Shirik | proof |
| 22:01.42 | NightHawkTheSane | er, i meant that for shirik. |
| 22:01.59 | NightHawkTheSane | i dont even know if you CAN prove that |
| 22:02.09 | foxlit | Sure you can :) |
| 22:02.16 | Shirik | ifyou can't prove it I don't know how you can say it with certainty |
| 22:02.27 | DWSR | Shirik: I don't know the mathematical proof. |
| 22:02.33 | foxlit | http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Transcendental_number |
| 22:02.39 | *** join/#wowuidev dustice (n=dustin@wireless-128-62-93-119.public.utexas.edu) |
| 22:03.13 | DWSR | Shirik: found it: http://wiki.answers.com/Q/Is_pi_a_terminating_decimal |
| 22:03.42 | NightHawkTheSane | math gives me headaches. |
| 22:03.49 | foxlit | "In 1882, http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ferdinand_von_Lindemann published a proof that the http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pi is transcendental. He first showed that e to any nonzero algebraic power is transcendental, and since eiÏ = â1 is algebraic (see http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Euler%27s_identity), iÏ and therefore Ï must be transcendental." |
| 22:04.02 | Shirik | <3 |
| 22:04.28 | DWSR | So there you have it. |
| 22:04.38 | DWSR | pi never ends. Now...where's my fork? |
| 22:04.42 | Arrowmaster | http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Proof_that_%CF%80_is_irrational |
| 22:04.57 | Arrowmaster | related? |
| 22:05.10 | DWSR | irrationality is not what Shirik was asking. |
| 22:05.12 | DWSR | I don't think. |
| 22:05.21 | foxlit | Nah, irrationality is fine. |
| 22:05.33 | foxlit | Any repeating fraction is rational. |
| 22:05.35 | Arrowmaster | then why it listed as see also on http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lindemann%E2%80%93Weierstrass_theorem |
| 22:06.15 | DWSR | foxlit: Does irrationality prove non-termination? |
| 22:06.34 | NightHawkTheSane | it would have to, wouldn't it? |
| 22:06.46 | foxlit | DWSR: If it terminates, it can be expressed as a x/10^huge fraction. |
| 22:06.47 | DWSR | e is irrational. |
| 22:06.51 | NightHawkTheSane | if it terminated, at all, it must be able to be expressed as a (potentially absurd) fraction |
| 22:06.56 | DWSR | but terminates, I thought. |
| 22:07.01 | NightHawkTheSane | no |
| 22:07.09 | NightHawkTheSane | e is like pi, trancendental (ie, non-terminating, non-repeating) |
| 22:07.47 | foxlit | [Transcendental is a harder condition to impose than irrationality] |
| 22:07.58 | Lunessa | Beware the Jabberwock, my son! |
| 22:08.43 | Thunder_Child | yes father |
| 22:08.54 | DWSR | Danger, Will Robinson! |
| 22:09.19 | DWSR | Anyone here play NFS Shift on PC and figure out how to turn without fucking sliding? |
| 22:10.10 | DWSR | Like, no matter how I attempt to turn (i.e. accelerating, coasting, braking, constant speed), the car always slides. |
| 22:11.04 | Thunder_Child | not if you go slow enough |
| 22:11.21 | DWSR | That "slow enough" is WAYY too slow. Like under 30clicks an hour. |
| 22:11.23 | Thunder_Child | other than that, yes it slides, though upgrades can lower it |
| 22:11.36 | Thunder_Child | just facter that in to your turning |
| 22:11.45 | DWSR | How come the NPC cars all never slide? |
| 22:12.08 | NightHawkTheSane | the computer hacks |
| 22:12.10 | Arrowmaster | because the NPC cars always fucking cheat like hell in NFS games |
| 22:12.14 | DWSR | lol |
| 22:12.17 | Thunder_Child | because as usual, the AI always cheats |
| 22:12.19 | Arrowmaster | fucking hated it in underground 1 |
| 22:12.24 | DWSR | Mario Kart 64. |
| 22:12.29 | DWSR | Good lord does the computer cheat in that game. |
| 22:12.41 | DWSR | Arrowmaster: The AI in NFSU1 was so bad they needed to cheat. |
| 22:12.58 | DWSR | Like, I played that game on hard the first time through and only had trouble with the drags for the first couple of times. |
| 22:13.00 | Arrowmaster | i got fucking stuck at the beginning of nfs underground 1 because i was too good that the computer had to cheat to a level that made it impossible for me to beat the race i was stuck on |
| 22:13.14 | NightHawkTheSane | the AI basically cheats in every game ever |
| 22:13.15 | Shirik | ~~~~~~~~~~~~ |
| 22:13.16 | purl | ~~~~~~~~~~~ are YOU READY?????????? ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ |
| 22:13.24 | industrial | ;o |
| 22:13.26 | Arrowmaster | i almost fucking lapped them yet all 3 of them would come out and pass me before the finish line |
| 22:13.31 | DWSR | Arrowmaster: The AI in NFSU2...I fucking hate them. |
| 22:13.40 | Shirik | NightHawkTheSane: So many games implement AI "levels" by increasing resource rate, etc. |
| 22:13.44 | Shirik | no more intelligence |
| 22:14.03 | DWSR | Shirik: The computer in NFS shift seems to actually drive better when I turn up the difficulty level. |
| 22:14.09 | Arrowmaster | i didnt really have a problem with NFSU2 |
| 22:14.11 | DWSR | like, more on the racing line. |
| 22:14.15 | Shirik | the SC map recommendations say that computers should start with some number of resources |
| 22:14.19 | DWSR | Arrowmaster: Did you unlock expert or whatever the fuck it is? |
| 22:14.27 | Arrowmaster | dont know |
| 22:14.46 | DWSR | I had a problem at the start of NFSU2 on the highest difficulty. |
| 22:14.55 | NightHawkTheSane | Shirik: its far easier to just change the computer's numbers than it is to develop better intelligence |
| 22:14.57 | Arrowmaster | i think i beat it or almost beat it but it was mostly a lan game |
| 22:15.06 | DWSR | But I just used the Mazda MX-5 and tuned it for maximum acceleration + handling and just cranked through everything. |
| 22:15.25 | DWSR | Like, StreetX, Drifts were all rediculously easy. |
| 22:15.26 | Arrowmaster | the AE86 or whatever it was in NFSU2 was so broken |
| 22:15.30 | DWSR | I lapped the computer 7 or 8 times. |
| 22:15.47 | DWSR | Dude, NFSU 1 and 2, the MX-5 was so OP. |
| 22:16.00 | DWSR | Had the same stats as the Skyline, but better handling and no drift. |
| 22:16.08 | Arrowmaster | yeah it was good but the AE86 was completely broken |
| 22:16.15 | DWSR | Never tried it. |
| 22:16.19 | DWSR | Mx-5 was enough speedhax. |
| 22:16.35 | Arrowmaster | the handling was the best in the game even though the stats didnt show it |
| 22:16.52 | NightHawkTheSane | w |
| 22:16.56 | NightHawkTheSane | er, this isn't vim.. |
| 22:17.01 | NightHawkTheSane | sighs |
| 22:17.06 | DWSR | T_C: What does Steering lock do in Shift? |
| 22:17.20 | DWSR | Arrowmaster: Yeah, once you got all the L3 upgrades and everything, sometimes the stats went off the charts. |
| 22:17.22 | Arrowmaster | some of my friends at a lanparty couldnt figure out how i was kicking their ass so hard with it, i was drifting through turns without breaking or slowing down |
| 22:17.44 | DWSR | Arrowmaster: Did you beat all of the SUV challenges though? Those were easily the most frustrating part of the game |
| 22:17.57 | Arrowmaster | it was a long time ago i dont really remember |
| 22:18.05 | *** join/#wowuidev mikma (i=mikma@reaktio.net) |
| 22:18.15 | DWSR | Shift's so easy... |
| 22:18.23 | Arrowmaster | i mostly played the NFS games for fun and wasnt out to beat them, just unlock everything |
| 22:18.32 | DWSR | I have it on expert driving controls + hard AI and I got all the starts from Tier 1. |
| 22:18.57 | *** join/#wowuidev Kraps (n=chatzill@ool-44c20717.dyn.optonline.net) |
| 22:19.02 | DWSR | I'm hating my T2 car though. |
| 22:19.16 | DWSR | It just...drifts too much |
| 22:19.25 | DWSR | Hopefully softening up the springs a little will help things. |
| 22:19.28 | Arrowmaster | in carbon at first i couldnt drift at all in it then i figured out i was trying to counter steer but the game already does that for you |
| 22:19.30 | DWSR | About to find out. |
| 22:19.36 | DWSR | yeah. |
| 22:19.40 | DWSR | Carbon was meh. |
| 22:19.45 | DWSR | Liked Most Wanted way more. |
| 22:19.49 | DWSR | Carbon was just a Carbon Copy. |
| 22:19.56 | Arrowmaster | then i couldnt stop drifting, just did continous laps of a single drift |
| 22:20.15 | Arrowmaster | way too easy |
| 22:20.35 | Kraps | "Tirion Fordring and the Argent Crusade have forged an alliance with Darion Mograine and the Knights of the Ebon Blade to form the %bAshen Verdict%b" that is a BADASS name |
| 22:20.41 | DWSR | Oh yeah, WAY better. |
| 22:21.08 | DWSR | Kraps: I thought it was called something else? |
| 22:21.21 | Dagmar | ...and after you do their mission chain, no loot drops in their area, ever again. |
| 22:21.47 | DWSR | Dagmar: DK starting zone? |
| 22:21.48 | NeoTron | so Argent Crusade and KotEB had a guild merge, due to people quitting? |
| 22:22.00 | DWSR | ROFL |
| 22:22.09 | Kraps | i think this is specifically for taking on arthas |
| 22:22.11 | Dagmar | DWSR: If you were a skinner there was somethign really special about the Argent Vanguard |
| 22:22.14 | Lunessa | Heh, I wanted to make a guild called <Salt the Earth> but I figured most people wouldn't get the reference. |
| 22:22.22 | Kraps | NeoTron: that is win |
| 22:22.27 | Dagmar | I think the adults would |
| 22:22.33 | DWSR | I don't get it. Link? |
| 22:22.42 | Dagmar | DWSR: Easier to just tell you |
| 22:22.46 | ckknight | Lunessa: what reference? |
| 22:22.58 | ckknight | Lunessa: I know of salting the earth |
| 22:23.05 | ckknight | is there something specific you're refering to? |
| 22:23.10 | Dagmar | DWSR: When you first went there, and the place was under attack by spider-things, they had like a 30-50% drop rate for nerubian chitin |
| 22:23.23 | Lunessa | DWSR - in ancient times when you wanted to obliterate your enemy you sewed the ground of their field with salt to prevent any farming after you defeated them |
| 22:23.52 | Dagmar | DWSR: Probably closer to 50% actually, if nor more |
| 22:23.53 | NightHawkTheSane | so wait.. didn't the argent dawn form from a splinter group from the order of the silver hand..? |
| 22:24.14 | DWSR | NHTS: It wasn't a splinter group, afaik. |
| 22:24.26 | Dagmar | DWSR: Those chitin were big money |
| 22:24.36 | Dagmar | DWSR: Once you do the chain, no more spiders |
| 22:24.57 | DWSR | Dagmar: Guess you shouldn't do it on your skinning alt then |
| 22:25.05 | NightHawkTheSane | DWSR: wait, no, it was a splinter from the scarlet crusade |
| 22:25.09 | Dagmar | I don't have a skinning alt, I have a skinning main |
| 22:25.17 | Lunessa | http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Salting_the_earth |
| 22:25.29 | Dagmar | I actually asked a GM if they could just punt me back to phase one there, promising I'd never talk to those NPCs again |
| 22:25.34 | Dagmar | No dice. |
| 22:25.41 | DWSR | lol |
| 22:25.51 | DWSR | skinning, main? |
| 22:25.52 | NightHawkTheSane | and the scarlet crusade formed out of the silver hand... |
| 22:25.53 | DWSR | why? |
| 22:25.58 | Dagmar | If you find people with tons and tons of leather and chitin tho, they probably stopped at phase one |
| 22:26.05 | Dagmar | DWSR: Because I'm a hunter. |
| 22:26.12 | Dagmar | It's what hunters do. |
| 22:26.18 | DWSR | you on an rp server? |
| 22:26.31 | Dagmar | The bracer attack power buffs and so on were just Blizzard filling in some gaps |
| 22:26.32 | NightHawkTheSane | so.. SIlver hand -> Scarlet Crusade -> Argent Down -> AD + Silver Hand == Argent Crusade -> AC + EbonBlade = Ashen Verdict? zomg, crazy guild drama in azeroth |
| 22:26.41 | Kraps | "Supreme Overseer of the Cult of the Damned, Lady Deathwhisper is the next opponent. She bolsters the faith of her followers by promising them the opportunity to give eternal service in undeath." http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/IfYouKnowWhatIMean |
| 22:26.43 | Dagmar | DWSR: It's an RPG. |
| 22:27.22 | Dagmar | DWSR: Regardless of how the kiddies approach them, I've found it's almost always easier to trust that the developers aren't complete idiots (or Sony) and that certain things that make sense together IRL will work together well in-game. |
| 22:27.59 | Dagmar | Skinning/leatherworking is a great combo for hunters |
| 22:28.19 | DWSR | Dagmar: Why? |
| 22:28.32 | Dagmar | l2p |
| 22:28.33 | DWSR | It doesn't provide a really big benefit compared to Jewelcrafting. |
| 22:28.52 | NightHawkTheSane | about the same, really. |
| 22:28.54 | Dagmar | Oh, and Jewelcrafting would be better, why? |
| 22:29.03 | NightHawkTheSane | the basically free leg armor is nice. |
| 22:29.19 | Dagmar | 'Steeply discounted' I'd call it |
| 22:29.25 | DWSR | Dagmar: 3 dragons eyes. |
| 22:29.27 | Dagmar | The bracer enhancements kick ass |
| 22:29.34 | Dagmar | DWSR: So how is that better? |
| 22:29.37 | DWSR | + the ability to sell all your crap for assloads of cash. |
| 22:29.38 | kdtresh | jc + bs works pretty well |
| 22:29.50 | Dagmar | DWSR: I paid for a mekgineer's chopper with epics I made |
| 22:29.53 | Dagmar | In a month. |
| 22:29.55 | NeoTron | and in the end, it doesn't greatly matter :P |
| 22:30.55 | Dagmar | Well, skinning/leatherworking are just about perfect for hunters. |
| 22:31.07 | DWSR | Dagmar: If all I did was Dailies, I could pay for the Chopper in like a month and change. |
| 22:31.09 | NightHawkTheSane | they did a pretty good job of balancing the crafting professions |
| 22:31.15 | Dagmar | You get critical strike rating from http://www.wowwiki.com/Master_of_Anatomy |
| 22:31.18 | NeoTron | skinning isn't "perfect" in any way from a dps benefit point of view |
| 22:31.26 | NightHawkTheSane | Dagmar: eh, its good, yeah, but its pretty close to most other combinations |
| 22:31.27 | NeoTron | but in the end it really doesn't matter |
| 22:31.46 | Dagmar | 114 attack power wrist buffs http://www.wowwiki.com/Fur_Lining_-_Attack_Power |
| 22:32.00 | Kraps | The Lich King's most powerful death knight then stands as the final obstacle for the heroes to enter the upper reaches of the citadel. |
| 22:32.05 | Kraps | whos that? |
| 22:32.30 | Kraps | not the tourny guy i hope |
| 22:32.34 | DWSR | lol |
| 22:32.35 | NightHawkTheSane | your mom |
| 22:32.36 | DWSR | Black Knight. |
| 22:32.39 | DWSR | rofl, what a scrub. |
| 22:32.42 | Dagmar | NightHawkTheSane: It also means I don't have to futz around with skills that can't make as many things *I* can personally use |
| 22:33.18 | DWSR | omg |
| 22:33.21 | NeoTron | Dagmar: no one is arguing LW is bad, but skinning isn't comparable |
| 22:33.21 | DWSR | shift isn't like underground. |
| 22:33.28 | DWSR | Soft suspensions + tires actually fucking work. |
| 22:33.34 | NightHawkTheSane | Dagmar: thats a great benefit, sure. Although one can easily find personal use for a lot of professions, even on a hunter. ANd the numbers balance out. My point is that it's not head and shoulders above an other choice, but not below either. |
| 22:33.49 | Dagmar | NeoTron: Good luck getting your hands on cheap materials without it |
| 22:34.04 | DWSR | Dagmar: How often do you craft your own gear? |
| 22:34.23 | Dagmar | Borean leather is a saturated market on most servers, but teh dragonscales and so on are far from it |
| 22:34.31 | Dagmar | DWSR: Pretty much always |
| 22:34.38 | DWSR | Don't do much raiding I take it? |
| 22:34.42 | Dagmar | I do |
| 22:34.49 | DWSR | then how do you always craft gear? |
| 22:34.54 | Dagmar | But again <shout>the game isn't all raiding</shout> |
| 22:35.02 | DWSR | No, but it's a big part of it. |
| 22:35.11 | Dagmar | No, it's a minor part of it |
| 22:35.15 | DWSR | And PvP gear isn't craftable either (except for Savage, but =\). |
| 22:35.27 | Kraps | HOW ARE YOU GUYS BUYING ALL THESE GAMES WITH A CLEAN CONSCIENCE? |
| 22:35.29 | Dagmar | It's only a big part of it if you want to rush to 80 and then start doing the same thing, day in and day out. |
| 22:35.32 | NightHawkTheSane | the size of any part of the game is entirely what you make of it |
| 22:35.39 | Dagmar | Kraps: We have jobs. |
| 22:35.52 | Dagmar | DWSR: I'll bother with PvP when someone adds permadeath |
| 22:35.57 | Dagmar | Until then it's only a griefer's tool |
| 22:36.09 | DWSR | Dagmar: I'm talking BGs and Arenas. |
| 22:36.09 | Kraps | Dagmar: i do too! not too well paying though.... |
| 22:36.10 | DWSR | Not world PvP. |
| 22:36.34 | Dagmar | I'm sorry... Did they add a need for resilience to the mounted cannons? |
| 22:36.53 | DWSR | yes. |
| 22:36.58 | DWSR | Cannons scale with your gear level. |
| 22:37.12 | Dagmar | DWSR: WEll it's a good thing I'm geared up |
| 22:37.31 | Dagmar | Might explain how I got Damage Control so fast |
| 22:37.34 | NeoTron | Dagmar: with 30k gold, why would I need to? |
| 22:37.42 | Dagmar | NeoTron: Good for you |
| 22:37.43 | NeoTron | I made money from JCing not by farming the nodes, but from farming the AH |
| 22:37.58 | Dagmar | You don't even want to bring economic leeching up in front of me |
| 22:38.10 | Dagmar | If you're not adding value to the economy, you're draining it. |
| 22:38.44 | NightHawkTheSane | Dagmar: .. yeah, welcome to capitalism. |
| 22:38.52 | Dagmar | Welcome to where capitalism breaks |
| 22:39.11 | Dagmar | Greed is *not* a virtue, last I checked. |
| 22:39.23 | DWSR | yes it is. |
| 22:39.30 | DWSR | Greed is good, in the twilight zone. |
| 22:39.38 | NightHawkTheSane | and yet, greed is what makes capitalism work. >< but i'm getting off topic, so i'll go back to my work |
| 22:39.42 | Dagmar | Yes, and it works out so well for the people there. |
| 22:39.51 | Dagmar | Greed is what makes capitalism break down. |
| 22:39.59 | DWSR | Dagmar: No it's not. |
| 22:40.02 | Dagmar | Yes, it is. |
| 22:40.04 | DWSR | Greed is why capitalism works. |
| 22:40.11 | DWSR | Explain |
| 22:40.35 | Dagmar | It's how capitalism causes portions of the population to be permanently shafted when it gets out of control. |
| 22:40.35 | Dagmar | Otherwise, capitalism works _great_ |
| 22:40.48 | NightHawkTheSane | capitalism is based on the idea that a person behaves entirely in their own self interest |
| 22:40.50 | Dagmar | You make a deal with someone, then you're better off and they're better off. |
| 22:41.03 | Dagmar | Once greed kicks in, you try cutting deals where only YOU are better off. |
| 22:41.13 | NightHawkTheSane | in theory, if everyone does this, it balances out, and people are relatively equal |
| 22:41.17 | Dagmar | That's why it's classified as a sin, even by the relatively clueless christians |
| 22:41.18 | NightHawkTheSane | "in theory" |
| 22:41.54 | ScytheBlade1 | Shirik: still waiting on you to find that quote! |
| 22:42.05 | DWSR | Dagmar: Right, except for a compromise lies somewhere in between. |
| 22:42.11 | ScytheBlade1 | unrelated! |
| 22:42.12 | ScytheBlade1 | http://www.seriouseats.com/required_eating/images/rickroll.jpg |
| 22:42.13 | DWSR | Dagmar: People won't make a deal if they are worse off. |
| 22:42.22 | DWSR | (or they perceive that they are). |
| 22:42.25 | Dagmar | DWSR: Nonsense. They'll deal because they _have_ to |
| 22:42.32 | Shirik | wonders why anyone would click something that says "rickroll.jpg" |
| 22:42.33 | NightHawkTheSane | ScytheBlade1: awesome. |
| 22:42.41 | NightHawkTheSane | Shirik: because it's awesome, thats why |
| 22:42.45 | DWSR | Dagmar: They're better off dealing if they have to, wouldn't you agree? |
| 22:42.54 | DWSR | What's the alternative to having a shitty deal? |
| 22:42.56 | Dagmar | No. |
| 22:43.08 | Dagmar | Having your personal finances come full stop. |
| 22:43.15 | DWSR | Right. |
| 22:43.29 | DWSR | And what does the deal cause? |
| 22:43.30 | ScytheBlade1 | Shirik: still waiting! |
| 22:43.34 | Dagmar | You can't run most businesses without a supply of something coming from someone else |
| 22:43.49 | Dagmar | DWSR: Massive bailouts |
| 22:44.12 | Dagmar | The more people that are simply draining an economy, the unhealthier it becomes |
| 22:44.24 | Dagmar | Because they are not increasing the value of the economy, you wind up with fewer produced goods. |
| 22:44.40 | Dagmar | ...and these fewer goods aren't more valuable, they're simply more scarce. |
| 22:45.00 | DWSR | Dagmar: I'm not trying to say that capitalism is perfect. |
| 22:45.06 | DWSR | Dagmar: but it works better than anything else we have. |
| 22:45.16 | Dagmar | You certainly seem to be arguing that greed doesn't break it |
| 22:45.23 | DWSR | No, it doesn't. |
| 22:45.29 | Dagmar | ...and thta's nonsense. |
| 22:45.33 | NightHawkTheSane | (it kind of does, actually) |
| 22:45.34 | DWSR | How so? Greed is why it works. |
| 22:45.36 | Dagmar | Capitalism didn't make Linux happen. |
| 22:45.41 | Dagmar | Greed is not why it works |
| 22:45.44 | DWSR | Dagmar: How not? |
| 22:45.49 | DWSR | People wanted a better operating system. |
| 22:45.52 | DWSR | So they went out and built it. |
| 22:45.56 | DWSR | And by sharing it, it became better. |
| 22:45.57 | Dagmar | Yes, so they made one and shared it |
| 22:45.58 | NightHawkTheSane | you're both wrong. Greed -is- why it works, and greed -is- why it breaks. ;P |
| 22:45.59 | DWSR | That's pretty greedy. |
| 22:46.10 | Dagmar | NightHawkTheSane: Need is why it works |
| 22:46.23 | NightHawkTheSane | hardly. |
| 22:46.34 | DWSR | Dagmar: If need was why it works, socialism would work as well. It doesn't. |
| 22:46.43 | NightHawkTheSane | thats also wrong. |
| 22:46.55 | Dagmar | It's low administrative overhead, since you don't have to put a vampirically-funded infrastructure in place to facilitate it |
| 22:47.07 | *** join/#wowuidev Lopeppeppy (n=Lopeppep@cpe-67-246-40-12.nycap.res.rr.com) |
| 22:47.07 | *** mode/#wowuidev [+v Lopeppeppy] by ChanServ |
| 22:47.11 | Dagmar | DWSR: Tell that to the countries that are doing just fine with socialism |
| 22:47.26 | DWSR | Dagmar: There are no countries which are totally socialist. |
| 22:47.34 | DWSR | Just like there are no countries which are totally capitalist. |
| 22:47.35 | Dagmar | There are no countries that are totally capitalist. |
| 22:47.37 | NightHawkTheSane | ... and there are none that are totally capitalist |
| 22:47.41 | DWSR | I win. |
| 22:47.46 | Lopeppeppy | black, white, orange, purple, grey |
| 22:47.51 | Dagmar | Lopeppeppy++ |
| 22:47.59 | NightHawkTheSane | pure capitalism and pure (economic) socialism are opposite ends of the spectrum |
| 22:48.11 | DWSR | and neither work. |
| 22:48.11 | NightHawkTheSane | one is selfishness, one is selflessness. |
| 22:48.15 | NightHawkTheSane | right |
| 22:48.34 | NightHawkTheSane | somewhere in the middle you find something that kind of, sort of, manages to get you through the day |
| 22:48.38 | Dagmar | Read http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Selfish_Gene |
| 22:48.48 | Kraps | nothing ever works at an extreme |
| 22:48.56 | NightHawkTheSane | except extremeism. |
| 22:48.59 | NightHawkTheSane | :P |
| 22:49.01 | Kraps | ^ |
| 22:49.06 | foxlit | "There are no absolutes" is clearly not absolutely true. |
| 22:49.27 | jpmorgan | eat the rich |
| 22:49.35 | DWSR | ^^ |
| 22:49.35 | Dagmar | They're delicious |
| 22:49.46 | Dagmar | Especially rich co-eds |
| 22:49.48 | DWSR | Dagmar: You remind me of the Heavy Weapons guy. |
| 22:49.58 | DWSR | DELICIOUS |
| 22:50.07 | Kraps | the statement below is false |
| 22:50.08 | cog|work | Kraps: that's a fallacy, actually... |
| 22:50.08 | Kraps | the statement above is true |
| 22:50.17 | DWSR | lol |
| 22:50.23 | DWSR | C-C-COMBO BREAKER |
| 22:50.36 | cog|work | (assuming that the "best" x is always somewhere between two extremes) |
| 22:50.36 | DWSR | I know, 3 Cs, but whatever. |
| 22:50.56 | DWSR | cog|work: Not really. |
| 22:51.10 | mikma | cockbreaker |
| 22:51.13 | mikma | ouuuuuuch |
| 22:51.14 | DWSR | If you're trying to please the entire planet, you're most likely to end up pleasing the most amount of people by being something in the middle. |
| 22:51.22 | Kraps | ^ |
| 22:51.30 | DWSR | cog|work: Standard distribution, or whatever that thing's called. |
| 22:51.34 | DWSR | The giant bell distribution. |
| 22:51.38 | Dagmar | ...and then they nail you to something. |
| 22:51.49 | cog|work | sure, if you're talking about the set of all decisions you can possibly make |
| 22:51.57 | cog|work | but it doesn't hold true for every given decision |
| 22:52.15 | DWSR | cog|work: Right. I'm not takling about every decision individually. |
| 22:52.24 | DWSR | But rather as a general rule of thumb for all decisions as a whole. |
| 22:52.34 | DWSR | The most moderate decision gets you in the least amount of trouble. |
| 22:52.38 | cog|work | hence why i addressed Kraps not you :P |
| 22:52.42 | Lopeppeppy | No, DWSR |
| 22:52.46 | Lopeppeppy | Not categorically true |
| 22:52.53 | cog|work | and no, that can't be said to be true either |
| 22:52.55 | Kraps | right, theres no in-between in "do i slap my nephew or not" |
| 22:53.08 | Lopeppeppy | Sure there is, beat your nephew instead! |
| 22:53.08 | DWSR | Kraps: hit him with a wet pool noodle? |
| 22:53.19 | DWSR | Lopeppeppy: Like I said, it's not an absolute truth. |
| 22:53.25 | DWSR | Absolutely no truth it absolutely true. |
| 22:53.44 | foxlit | Ahem. |
| 22:54.01 | Kraps | unless you're an extremist |
| 22:54.11 | cog|work | nah |
| 22:54.20 | cog|work | just 'cause you're certain something is true doesn't mean it is |
| 22:54.30 | Lopeppeppy | Wizards's First Rule. Love the rules. Live the rules |
| 22:54.45 | DWSR | cog|work: Just because you're certain something is false doesn't mean it is either. |
| 22:55.30 | cog|away | again, was addressing Kraps :P |
| 22:55.30 | DWSR | cog|away: I am sure that you can find 2 people who will disagree on anything. |
| 22:55.30 | cog|away | gtg |
| 22:57.37 | mikma | http://www.geekologie.com/2009/10/wait_what_fake_virginity_kits.php |
| 22:58.30 | DWSR | wow. |
| 22:58.32 | DWSR | w.t.f. |
| 22:58.57 | Lopeppeppy | I've heard of plastic surgery to "regrow" your virginity... |
| 22:59.05 | Lunessa | Wizard's First Rule is "People are stupid." And that's about the only thing worth reading in the whole fucking book. |
| 22:59.57 | Lopeppeppy | Yeah... the first book is okay, the rest go downhill rapidly, IMO. |
| 22:59.57 | Lopeppeppy | I still like the rules though. |
| 23:00.02 | Kraps | sword of truth? |
| 23:00.07 | Lopeppeppy | Yup |
| 23:00.33 | Lunessa | More like "Sword of Why The Hell Am I Reading This Again"? |
| 23:01.53 | Kraps | havent read it but i'm in the middle of the tv show and kahlen is so freaking HOT |
| 23:02.05 | Dagmar | Because you're tired of reading about young girls dry-humping dragons? |
| 23:03.46 | Lunessa | Dagmar: I slogged all the way through the first book because so many of my friends /loved/ it. And the whole time I kept thinking "Tanith Lee would have told this whole story in 180 pages with more action, more sex, and a better plot." |
| 23:03.59 | Dagmar | Lunessa: You're probably right |
| 23:04.05 | Dagmar | ...but at least it's not the Wheel of Time |
| 23:04.09 | ZorbaBeta | mikma, for some reason I'm giggling wildly at their discount pricing for large quantities |
| 23:04.36 | Lunessa | I do like some long-winded novels/series. But they have to be well written and engaging. Sword of Truth was neither. |
| 23:04.38 | ZorbaBeta | haha, the package contains two of them |
| 23:05.11 | DWSR | ahahaha |
| 23:05.22 | DWSR | Dude, I love car battles. |
| 23:05.29 | Lopeppeppy | There's a TV show of it? Freakin' travesty |
| 23:05.31 | DWSR | Tap out the NPC car and win. |
| 23:06.13 | Kraps | Lopeppeppy: kahlen is so HOT |
| 23:06.23 | Kraps | ...sorry |
| 23:07.14 | Lopeppeppy | What channel carries it? |
| 23:07.30 | Lunessa | Lopeppeppy: Legend of the Seeker - I believe it's on Hulu. I watched an episode because it has a crazy Aussie actor in it I like - but then I relaized what it was based on. |
| 23:07.31 | Kraps | from what i've read, it barely follows the books |
| 23:08.31 | Kraps | but as a standalone fantasy tv show its not bad |
| 23:08.54 | ZorbaBeta | anyone got an idea why the blizzard PTR installer refuses to run? I doubleclick it and it does absolutely nothing :( |
| 23:08.57 | Lunessa | It's not all that great either. About on the level of "The Beastmaster" TV show. |
| 23:09.30 | *** join/#wowuidev mojosdojo_ (n=gdbzet26@p4FEFC387.dip.t-dialin.net) |
| 23:09.30 | Lopeppeppy | Of course they all expire today. *laugh* |
| 23:09.33 | Lopeppeppy | Oh well. |
| 23:09.41 | Kraps | what does? |
| 23:09.51 | Lopeppeppy | This seasons episodes of Legend of the Seeker |
| 23:10.08 | Thunder_Child | every one i know that heas read the wizards series and seen the show, want to /wrists after seeing it |
| 23:10.10 | theorbtwo | How does an episode expire? |
| 23:10.21 | Lopeppeppy | Hulu no longer carries it. |
| 23:10.28 | Lunessa | theorbtwo: They quit making it available to stream |
| 23:10.36 | Lopeppeppy | They contract to carry whatever the network will let them, and when it's over, they take it down. |
| 23:11.18 | DWSR | Thunder_Child |
| 23:11.24 | Thrae | http://notalwaysright.com/a-high-credit-limit/2422 <-- nothing better then a pot dealer who takes debit cards. |
| 23:11.39 | Thunder_Child | DWSR |
| 23:11.50 | DWSR | What does Works conversion do in Shift? |
| 23:12.05 | mikma | http://www.iwatchstuff.com/2009/10/2012_has_some_great_performanc.php <- HAHAHAHA, damnit |
| 23:12.25 | Thunder_Child | DWSR, i have no idea....seeing as i dont even know what that is |
| 23:13.43 | DWSR | WTF @ the cat at the end. |
| 23:14.05 | DWSR | T_C: Well, if you install all of the upgrades available for a car and it's Works compatible, you get an option to install a $250k upgrade |
| 23:14.14 | DWSR | Which apparently makes it uber. |
| 23:14.14 | mikma | "Well its official: We have a great Transformers 3 story. The release date is now July 1st 2011." |
| 23:14.16 | DWSR | But like...wtf? |
| 23:14.28 | DWSR | mikma: great....Transformers.....story? |
| 23:14.36 | DWSR | Sorry....what just came out of your computer? |
| 23:14.41 | Thunder_Child | i dunno, my cars always seem to out perform the people i play against at equal levels |
| 23:15.10 | Kraps | DWSR: shhh its ok, its not his computers fault, really |
| 23:15.21 | mikma | dwsr: http://www.iwatchstuff.com/2009/09/29/new-moon-posters-1.jpg |
| 23:15.22 | DWSR | Kraps: His computer needs to be cleansed. |
| 23:15.36 | DWSR | mikma: looks about as bad as the last one. |
| 23:15.40 | DWSR | possibly worse. |
| 23:16.11 | DWSR | T_C: Did you actually buy the game? |
| 23:16.13 | Kraps | stewart looks hotter though |
| 23:16.39 | DWSR | Kraps: The whole series is just an excuse to not have to do anything when the actors roll out of bed. |
| 23:16.40 | Thunder_Child | DWSR, hell no. i dont usually even finish them |
| 23:16.46 | DWSR | Look: bedhead! all the rage. |
| 23:17.04 | DWSR | Puffy bags? That's all part of the mystique. |
| 23:17.39 | DWSR | If anyone gets assassinated I hope it's whoever plays Edward. |
| 23:17.50 | DWSR | And I hope the assassin uses a garlic covered cross. |
| 23:18.13 | Thunder_Child | whomever did the voice was rather bad |
| 23:18.49 | theorbtwo | wonders if the most effective weapon against a vampire might be a syringe full of garlic puree. |
| 23:19.34 | DWSR | theorbtwo: that's a torture device. |
| 23:19.54 | DWSR | Do all of the people on that poster die in the end? |
| 23:19.58 | DWSR | Please say yes. |
| 23:20.15 | Thunder_Child | a modified cancer virus that excretes garlic |
| 23:20.21 | DWSR | T_C: ahaha |
| 23:21.28 | Jerub | theorbtwo: do you know how hard it is inject someone who doesn't want to be injected? |
| 23:21.55 | Jerub | spray bottle with a weak garlic solution would be better. |
| 23:22.06 | theorbtwo | Jerub: Er, um... no? Happens in various TV shows all the time, though. |
| 23:22.32 | theorbtwo | ponders saying something about an episode he saw today where somebody does it, but that'd be spoilerish. |
| 23:22.32 | Thunder_Child | Jerub, they have guns that will fire something si,ilar |
| 23:22.36 | Thunder_Child | similar* |
| 23:23.09 | *** join/#wowuidev Burgundy (i=bingothe@188.26.247.118) |
| 23:23.09 | Jerub | theorbtwo: yeah, apparently my mother had to literally sit on me so my doctor could sedate me when i was 5. |
| 23:23.36 | theorbtwo | Jerub: I think it's mostly a matter of surprsing people with it. |
| 23:23.51 | Jerub | theorbtwo: oh, i was surprised! |
| 23:23.52 | theorbtwo | Hell, they called in people from other wards to hold me down when I was 12, and had pnemonia. |
| 23:24.45 | mikma | http://www.iwatchstuff.com/2009/09/see_conan_obrien_smash_his_hea.php |
| 23:32.49 | *** join/#wowuidev kd3 (n=kd3@wikia/kaydeethree) |
| 23:36.38 | kd3 | hrm... so apparently software is sold, not licensed |
| 23:36.42 | kd3 | wonder what that says about the wow eula? |
| 23:38.37 | ZorbaBeta | it says that they probably can't stop people from using the WoW software on private servers, but once they're subscribing to a service, the EULA and TOS and the like almost certainly apply |
| 23:39.14 | theorbtwo | kd3: Who says that software is sold, not licensed? |
| 23:39.19 | Codayus | Sounds about right. |
| 23:39.21 | Lopeppeppy | and who says that applies? |
| 23:39.26 | kd3 | the us district court of washington |
| 23:39.38 | kd3 | http://www.channelregister.co.uk/2009/10/06/software_ownership_ruling/ |
| 23:39.43 | Codayus | theorbtwo: If it's what I'm thinking of, Autodesk recently lost a case about whether they can stop people reselling software on ebay. |
| 23:40.34 | Lopeppeppy | Now it will enter appeals, it's not final by a long shot |
| 23:40.38 | Codayus | Autodesk tends to license their software with strict non-transferability clauses; a court said they didn't apply because at least in the very particular case of AutoCAD in one particular jurisdiction, it was sold, not licensed, despite what Autodesk claimed. |
| 23:41.07 | Codayus | How that applies to other software, other vendors, other license terms, or other jurisdictions is unclear, and, yes, it'll be appealed. |
| 23:41.27 | Dagmar | You can tell some companies are definitely warming up to the idea of never selling anyone anything. |
| 23:41.36 | Codayus | *shrug* |
| 23:41.40 | Dagmar | Say, for intances, Sony's new PSP Go To Hell |
| 23:42.31 | Codayus | In many cases, it makes sense. It's marketing buzzspeak, but true nonetheless: People want solutions, not software. :) |
| 23:43.02 | Dagmar | It's a shame that trying to claim they never sold anything generally means they didn't give the customer either. |
| 23:43.30 | Dagmar | I'll *not* be buying anything from a company that's so firmly against admitting they sold me something. |
| 23:44.58 | Codayus | Dagmar: So...you're saying you won't buy things from people that don't sell things? That seems easy enough to follow. :D |
| 23:45.22 | ZorbaBeta | codayus, sadly, if it were easy to follow, there wouldn't be a problem. but it's not :) |
| 23:45.24 | Dagmar | Exactly |
| 23:51.40 | *** join/#wowuidev Arcalyth (n=arcalyth@c-24-11-8-47.hsd1.mi.comcast.net) |
| 23:53.15 | DWSR | :D |
| 23:53.19 | DWSR | I just pirate it. |
| 23:53.22 | DWSR | Then they have no choice. |
| 23:59.11 | Shirik | the question is whether your pirating is legal or illegal |
| 23:59.22 | DWSR | No it's not. |
| 23:59.25 | DWSR | It's illegal. |
| 23:59.42 | Shirik | not according to that court |
