| 00:00.35 | *** join/#wowuidev Repo (n=supybot@repos.curseforge.net) |
| 00:02.12 | Lopeppeppy | Heya, alestane |
| 00:02.44 | alestane | The Pagan Pride Day in Andover this week had muchmuch better weather than the one last week in New Hampshire. |
| 00:03.16 | Lopeppeppy | Excellent |
| 00:04.00 | *** join/#wowuidev theorb (n=theorb@91.84.53.6) |
| 00:05.03 | alestane | That one was mizzle from one end to the other. |
| 00:05.51 | Lopeppeppy | tis the time of year and the area for that. New England is never kind. |
| 00:26.30 | *** join/#wowuidev Mikk (n=Mikk@78.73.111.137) |
| 00:34.19 | WobWork | narf |
| 00:35.47 | WobWork | I'm tempted to have this page report, if one has no listed facebook friends "YOU HAVE NO FRIENDS! =(" |
| 00:35.54 | WobWork | But that might be somewhat undiplomatic |
| 00:37.43 | alestane | It would be undiplomatic if it reported, YOU HAVE NO FRIENDS! ...LOSER!" |
| 00:41.32 | *** join/#wowuidev jpmorgan (n=jpmorgan@67.183.221.120) |
| 00:46.35 | *** join/#wowuidev Synpra (n=Synpra@75.80.16.10) |
| 00:50.43 | *** join/#wowuidev Kandoko1 (n=Testing@adsl-068-159-119-207.sip.gsp.bellsouth.net) |
| 00:55.24 | ScytheBlade1 | so if anyone is bored |
| 00:55.36 | ScytheBlade1 | go fly over to the scryer tier, at the base of the elevator |
| 00:55.46 | ScytheBlade1 | And watch people fling themselves off of it, to get the achievement |
| 00:55.48 | ScytheBlade1 | .. and fail! |
| 00:55.56 | ScytheBlade1 | This one warlock has died five times so far |
| 00:56.17 | alestane | The 65 yards one? |
| 00:56.17 | ScytheBlade1 | And there are more skeletons around here than there ever were with TBC |
| 00:56.19 | ScytheBlade1 | Yeah |
| 00:56.42 | ScytheBlade1 | If you walk straight off it and jump at the last second, it is pretty much guaranteed |
| 00:56.50 | alestane | All you need is a flying mount and a wall or a mushroom or something to use as a yardstick. |
| 00:56.51 | ScytheBlade1 | But if you don't walk *straight* off you'll fall to far, and die |
| 00:57.05 | ScytheBlade1 | And if you don't jump, you won't make the height required |
| 00:57.48 | ScytheBlade1 | The funny thing about that warlock... every single one of his deaths were from not falling far enough, taking damage, then going back up and jumping off without healing up |
| 00:58.00 | Jerub | lol |
| 00:58.16 | Jerub | i'm a drood. i got the achievement while zepping around getting the pink elekks. |
| 00:58.19 | Jerub | :D |
| 00:58.35 | ScytheBlade1 | I have a 80 druid and mage.. it was simply too easy |
| 00:58.49 | alestane | Does it count if you were under Slow Fall? |
| 00:58.53 | ScytheBlade1 | No |
| 00:58.55 | Jerub | alestane: not afaik |
| 00:59.02 | ScytheBlade1 | Speed altering effects disqualify you |
| 00:59.04 | Jerub | the pally bubble works though |
| 00:59.17 | ScytheBlade1 | Ice block and the paladin bubble work great though |
| 01:02.08 | *** join/#wowuidev Kraps (n=chatzill@ool-44c20717.dyn.optonline.net) |
| 01:02.35 | Lopeppeppy | My bubbles. |
| 01:03.29 | Shirik | I think my compiler has lost its mind |
| 01:03.32 | Shirik | http://cpp.pastey.net/125482 |
| 01:04.24 | Dagmar | I see the problem |
| 01:04.42 | Dagmar | "c:\program files (x86)\icrosoft visual studio 9.0vc\include\cppunit\testassert.h" |
| 01:05.00 | Jerub | you seem to be using C++ |
| 01:06.16 | Dagmar | ...although offhand I suspect it's getting pissy about you using 'T' to represent more than one abstracted value |
| 01:06.38 | Shirik | T is a template parameter, not a value |
| 01:06.49 | Shirik | and they are the same type, and must be the same type |
| 01:07.12 | Dagmar | Time to shoot the compiler then |
| 01:07.29 | Shirik | Wow, I'm bad. I have the parameters in the wrong order. |
| 01:10.08 | tem | I wish the ignore list could save why you ignored someone |
| 01:10.22 | tem | and then add that to the "x is ignoring you" message |
| 01:10.34 | Shirik | sounds like a nice addon feature |
| 01:10.58 | tem | not quite possible for an addon, Shirik |
| 01:11.03 | tem | you could fake the feature |
| 01:11.05 | tem | but it would suck |
| 01:11.11 | Shirik | never say impossible |
| 01:11.37 | tem | did I say impossible |
| 01:11.39 | WobWork | hm |
| 01:11.44 | tem | I don't see the word impossible in my text at all |
| 01:11.49 | WobWork | I have a friend who has difficulty connecting to a website |
| 01:12.07 | WobWork | and when she pings it, it get the ip correctly (so it's not DNS) but the pings timeout |
| 01:12.12 | WobWork | where would the issue be? |
| 01:12.30 | WobWork | The ISP suggests that it's her antivirus doing something |
| 01:12.41 | Lopeppeppy | Inconceivable! |
| 01:12.41 | WobWork | but I suspect shenanigans on that behalf |
| 01:13.18 | WobWork | I guess I could walk her through a traceroute... |
| 01:13.20 | Dagmar | It could be literally anything |
| 01:13.21 | Lopeppeppy | WobWork, does she have any blocker addons? Is she using the right browser (some require IE, stupid things). Does she have bad cookies? |
| 01:13.37 | WobWork | Lopeppeppy: Someone installed IE8 for her =) |
| 01:13.44 | WobWork | Since then only -some- of her sites aren't working |
| 01:13.45 | Dagmar | Windows Firewalling is _capable_ of blocking access to a single host but it would be damn strange |
| 01:14.01 | WobWork | eg, she can access www.commbank.com.au |
| 01:14.09 | WobWork | but she can't do it for www.singaporeair.com |
| 01:14.14 | WobWork | or the amex site |
| 01:14.17 | *** join/#wowuidev kd3|hate`net (n=kd3@wikia/kaydeethree) |
| 01:14.35 | kd3 | ugh |
| 01:14.41 | kd3 | wtb 1x[Ark] |
| 01:14.48 | WobWork | you're such a h8er, kd3 =( |
| 01:14.49 | kd3 | they're thinking 6+ inches of rain |
| 01:14.51 | Lopeppeppy | Uninstall IE8, pretty simple there. |
| 01:15.09 | kd3 | had to take two detours to get home due to creek-flooded roads |
| 01:15.10 | WobWork | Lopeppeppy: Something I can talk her through over the phone? =P |
| 01:15.14 | Lopeppeppy | It could be that those sites aren't compatible in some way, or that she's got some extra IE8 option turned on now that wasn't on for IE7. |
| 01:15.21 | Lopeppeppy | Talk her through getting Firefox. :) |
| 01:15.30 | WobWork | There's an idea |
| 01:15.33 | WobWork | or chrome |
| 01:15.38 | jpmorgan | even firefox seems more bloaty nowadays |
| 01:15.41 | WobWork | although chrome will probably end up with more issues |
| 01:15.47 | WobWork | compatability wise |
| 01:15.54 | Lopeppeppy | FF. Chrome is nice, but not a supported right now. Stick with a known compatible browser. |
| 01:15.56 | Adys | firefox IS more bloated |
| 01:15.58 | WobWork | yeah |
| 01:16.10 | WobWork | I worry more about the supportedness than the bloat |
| 01:16.12 | Dagmar | I'd try and find out if she can ping anywhere at all |
| 01:16.18 | WobWork | (and why are we suddenly talking about breasts?) |
| 01:16.27 | WobWork | Dagmar: she can =) |
| 01:16.27 | Lopeppeppy | She can get to other sites, Dagmar, just not the ones she wants. |
| 01:16.30 | ScytheBlade1 | blinks |
| 01:16.36 | Lopeppeppy | Get her FF, make it the default browser, and see what happens. |
| 01:16.41 | Adys | er |
| 01:16.45 | Adys | supported what? |
| 01:16.56 | Adys | I didn't follow |
| 01:16.57 | WobWork | various websites |
| 01:17.07 | Adys | uh like what? |
| 01:17.19 | ScytheBlade1 | was waiting for Adys to notice that line |
| 01:17.19 | WobWork | FF is more likely to show websites as intended than a newer one like Chrome |
| 01:17.25 | Dagmar | There's an issue that pops up now and again with ECN, but Windows fairly well ignores it so it never affects Windows users |
| 01:17.34 | Lopeppeppy | [09:13] <WobWork> eg, she can access www.commbank.com.au[09:13] <WobWork> but she can't do it for www.singaporeair.com[09:14] <WobWork> or the amex site |
| 01:17.38 | Lopeppeppy | That, Adys. |
| 01:17.39 | Adys | WobWork: that's.. not true |
| 01:17.40 | kd3 | http://www.wunderground.com/cgi-bin/findweather/getForecast?query=30157 |
| 01:17.40 | WobWork | I'll see if I can get her to install FF |
| 01:17.56 | Lopeppeppy | That will at least help you narrow it down to being an ISP or a browser issue, WobWork. |
| 01:18.16 | WobWork | Adys: Well. It's less -likely- to come up with any issues that are due to Chrome being more compliant than FF with older websites |
| 01:18.23 | Adys | its not compliance |
| 01:18.29 | WobWork | ok ok |
| 01:18.31 | WobWork | fine =P |
| 01:18.35 | Lopeppeppy | It might be compliance, some setting in IE8. |
| 01:18.50 | Adys | its website straight out banning browsers most of the time |
| 01:18.54 | Dagmar | Yeah... bank sites... |
| 01:19.03 | WobWork | If the site doesn't render as expected due to chrome being more compliant and not having weird tweaks, then FF is more likely to have been specifically supported |
| 01:19.11 | WobWork | ie, Bank sites =P |
| 01:19.33 | Dagmar | Acutally, I was thinking, "malware infestation" |
| 01:19.56 | Adys | its not tweaks |
| 01:19.59 | roastx | one of my credit card sites only works 100% in IE |
| 01:20.02 | roastx | fire coders pls |
| 01:20.03 | WobWork | Adys: argh |
| 01:20.06 | WobWork | I don't CARE =P |
| 01:20.09 | Dagmar | Just because you can or can't ping a site doesn't mean a whole lot |
| 01:20.12 | WobWork | it's all fucking semantics |
| 01:20.18 | Adys | its not semantics. |
| 01:20.28 | WobWork | I want to make it the easiest, fastest way for her to get to the site |
| 01:20.29 | Adys | its websites banning browsers |
| 01:20.31 | Adys | or limiting UAs |
| 01:20.35 | WobWork | yes yes |
| 01:20.37 | WobWork | SEMANTICS |
| 01:20.38 | jpmorgan | can she open a telnet session to port 80 on the remote site? |
| 01:20.42 | WobWork | in this situation |
| 01:20.48 | Lopeppeppy | It is in this case, Adys. She wants a solution, not a discussion of wordplay. |
| 01:20.50 | WobWork | I don't -care- -why- |
| 01:20.56 | WobWork | this ^ |
| 01:21.06 | Dagmar | Well, you can keep kvetching or you can have her use telnet |
| 01:21.09 | Adys | what i mean is its not a solvable "support" problem |
| 01:21.10 | Adys | thats all |
| 01:21.13 | WobWork | she doesn't understand -why- it's doing it, she doesn't care =P She just wants it to -work- |
| 01:21.26 | WobWork | so if FF will allow her to access it where IE8 doesn't then it's good! |
| 01:21.36 | Lopeppeppy | Worth a try, 10 minutes of time. |
| 01:21.37 | WobWork | or Chrome |
| 01:21.40 | Dagmar | That would at least expose whether or not the problem is her browser refusing to connect to those sites, or some BGP buggery at her ISP |
| 01:21.48 | Adys | what you can also do is change the UA for some websites |
| 01:21.49 | WobWork | damn telstra =P |
| 01:22.04 | WobWork | that's a bit advanced for her, and for an over the phone solution |
| 01:22.15 | Dagmar | WobWork: Also worth finding out is what specifically "can't access" means |
| 01:22.23 | Adys | nah you can prolly just send an url to an extension |
| 01:22.39 | Dagmar | Just tell her to open a command prompt and type 'telnet www.singaporeair.com 80' and hit enter |
| 01:23.14 | Lopeppeppy | lurvs WobWork for being helpful. |
| 01:23.25 | Dagmar | Either the screen clears because she connected, or it times out |
| 01:23.54 | jpmorgan | if she cant telnet to 80, no browser will work |
| 01:24.22 | Dagmar | Exactly |
| 01:24.41 | jpmorgan | btw did this just start or was it always broken? |
| 01:25.02 | WobWork | it started just after her PA installed IE8 for her =P |
| 01:25.13 | Dagmar | ...and those nice keyloggers |
| 01:25.21 | Dagmar | I have a great idea. |
| 01:25.34 | Dagmar | Tell her to beat the PA with a baseball bat until the computer works properly again |
| 01:25.47 | kd3 | ^ |
| 01:25.48 | kd3 | ^^^^^^ |
| 01:25.50 | Dagmar | He fucked it up, he gets to fix it. |
| 01:26.09 | WobWork | She |
| 01:26.14 | WobWork | and she's a lovely person =( |
| 01:26.53 | WobWork | And I'd agree, but I don't think it'd help =) |
| 01:27.05 | WobWork | lets see what comes from the 'other browser' try |
| 01:27.45 | Arrowmaster | WobWork: when she did a ping and the address resolved but timed out, did she mentioned what the address resolved to? |
| 01:28.40 | WobWork | it resolved to the correct ip |
| 01:29.12 | Dagmar | Wob, no one cares. |
| 01:29.16 | WobWork | which happened to be a CDN address, but I'm not sure if that's relavant |
| 01:29.25 | Dagmar | You're the only person who seems to think DNS might be the problem. |
| 01:29.43 | WobWork | ? |
| 01:29.44 | Arrowmaster | i bet its a winsocks problem |
| 01:29.46 | WobWork | I don't think that |
| 01:29.58 | Dagmar | Right, so if she can type a URL into a browser, she can type the word "telnet" |
| 01:29.59 | WobWork | It resolved the address fine, it's not likely to be DNS |
| 01:30.46 | Dagmar | If you want, she can even be told to type "HEAD / HTTP\1.0" and hit enter twice after it connects and she can see the unlovely unparsed header response |
| 01:30.50 | WobWork | atm, it's tech support over SMS so response lag may vary |
| 01:31.07 | Dagmar | If it's the browser mucking things up due to security policies or whatever, telnet will work where the browser didn't. |
| 01:31.20 | Dagmar | If it's the networking stack, then telnet won't work either. |
| 01:31.37 | mikma | wobwork: cleric is fun! |
| 01:31.42 | mikma | i like it :D |
| 01:31.47 | WobWork | you can HEAL |
| 01:31.50 | Dagmar | Telnet netiher knows nor cares a fig about what goes on in IE's head |
| 01:31.56 | mikma | wobwork: aye :D |
| 01:32.15 | Jerub | heh, windows. |
| 01:32.35 | Jerub | you know MSIE uses a different parallel tcp stack? its arp cache has to be flushed separately to the rest of the Os. |
| 01:32.44 | mikma | wobwork: also, cleric doesnt get -effect to spells from plate! |
| 01:32.53 | WobWork | really? |
| 01:32.57 | WobWork | that's... unexpected |
| 01:33.19 | WobWork | I thought that was more the pally's area |
| 01:33.25 | mikma | well |
| 01:33.36 | Dagmar | That's... reallly... sounding like some forum jibber-jabber to me |
| 01:33.41 | mikma | cleric has 1/2 offensive spells after all |
| 01:33.46 | Arrowmaster | come on this is standard DnD rules |
| 01:33.55 | mikma | heal -> damage to undead |
| 01:33.56 | A-KO | oh really Jerub? |
| 01:34.00 | mikma | and summon creature |
| 01:34.00 | A-KO | I wasn't aware of this |
| 01:34.11 | mikma | other than that, melee. |
| 01:34.17 | A-KO | makes no sense to me |
| 01:34.21 | A-KO | arp is arp :P |
| 01:34.21 | roastx | I TOLD YOU ITS + 0.000001 NOT - 0.0000001 |
| 01:34.25 | mikma | cleric can use shield, too |
| 01:34.28 | mikma | hot! |
| 01:35.53 | *** join/#wowuidev cbreak (n=cbreak@217-162-238-189.dclient.hispeed.ch) |
| 01:36.21 | smcn | heh the question i asked the other day about heirloom shoulders giving +10% exp in bgs has been answered: http://www.wow.com/2009/09/20/patch-3-2-2-heirlooms-to-grant-xp-bonus-in-battlegrounds/ |
| 01:38.45 | Dagmar | D&D clerics are basically a LOT like you expect of a classic paladin type, minus the sword |
| 01:39.04 | WobWork | ah, mace instead, eh? |
| 01:39.07 | Dagmar | They're handiest when you're beset by undead |
| 01:39.08 | mikma | mace, shield, and heals |
| 01:39.21 | Dagmar | They can go "BOOGABOOGABOOGA" and make all the undead run away |
| 01:39.39 | mikma | they make undead die/die horribly! |
| 01:39.46 | Arrowmaster | unless they have an evil alignment, then they are the ones summoning the undead |
| 01:39.57 | Dagmar | Tehy can stammer out "THe power of Bleach compels you!" and some of them just evaporate. |
| 01:40.16 | mikma | dagmar: i really, really dig cleric! |
| 01:40.21 | WobWork | It's been a while since I looked at DnD |
| 01:40.29 | mikma | just needs ultimate damagedealer |
| 01:40.35 | Dagmar | I like the wizard class best, because it's the most unforgivingly tactical. |
| 01:40.52 | WobWork | my memories have been skewed by intervening games =) |
| 01:41.06 | Dagmar | Only problem there is sometimes you might bring a sack of fireballs to a fire mephit convention |
| 01:41.08 | WobWork | Dagmar: ie, you have to know precisely what you're up against to set your loadout? |
| 01:41.21 | Dagmar | WobWork: Not really. If you *do* tho, you can pwn the crap out of things. |
| 01:41.33 | Dagmar | Like, Wall of Fire is very cool. |
| 01:41.36 | mikma | hehe, i have been playing left 4 dead |
| 01:41.45 | WobWork | hehe, I can see that working for me =P Every trip into a dungeon will happen twice |
| 01:41.50 | Dagmar | You basically create a 2x5 (2x10, depending) area on the floor that's ON FIRE |
| 01:41.55 | WobWork | first time I run in and die to see what's in there =P |
| 01:41.59 | Dagmar | This is maybe not so useful sometimes |
| 01:42.11 | mikma | and some days ago i got addicted to wolfensteib |
| 01:42.24 | WobWork | Dagmar: Although maybe the convention might think you're the caterer |
| 01:42.32 | Dagmar | ...but you know, if you have a nice doorway to put it in, and the mobs aren't so bright, one guy with a shield can keep monsters from coming all the way through and they might well just burn to death like tweens at an metal show stampede |
| 01:43.04 | Dagmar | WobWork: Wizards are typically the guys who are entirely too smart for their own good. |
| 01:43.14 | WobWork | Dagmar: I like your sense of analogy. |
| 01:43.19 | Dagmar | They have their power from careful study of arcane lore |
| 01:43.35 | mikma | wobwork: that tactic works, too |
| 01:43.53 | mikma | plate users block the way and casters burn mobs |
| 01:44.02 | mikma | mobs cant reach them! |
| 01:44.06 | mikma | yey collision |
| 01:44.10 | WobWork | hehe |
| 01:44.19 | Lopeppeppy | but fire on my plate is very hot |
| 01:44.28 | *** join/#wowuidev nspb (n=nspb@66-215-19-200.dhcp.gldl.ca.charter.com) |
| 01:44.34 | mikma | dagmar: i also got a sigil week ago! 4-8 lvl =) |
| 01:44.35 | WobWork | Lopetisserie |
| 01:44.43 | nspb | yohoooy |
| 01:44.51 | Dagmar | mikma: I got one the moment I talked to that idiot with the "secret" |
| 01:44.58 | Dagmar | I was like, well that was easy enough to get |
| 01:45.14 | mikma | i got mihe from lighthouse reward |
| 01:45.14 | nspb | Be this the place to ask a question about macro scripting, or should I head somewheres else for that |
| 01:45.15 | Dagmar | I'm still level 3 on Ossim |
| 01:45.18 | mikma | mine* |
| 01:45.19 | alestane | cheshire |
| 01:45.24 | alestane | mt |
| 01:45.30 | WobWork | ~asktoask |
| 01:45.31 | purl | This is IRC. Don't ask to ask a question. Just ask your question and if someone's around, they'll be glad to help. |
| 01:45.47 | Lopeppeppy | manx |
| 01:45.57 | nspb | I just see this is called *UI* dev, and I didn't want to offend by asking something about macro scripting? |
| 01:45.58 | WobWork | RAGDOLL |
| 01:46.06 | mikma | wobwork: cleric and monk might work nicely |
| 01:46.10 | Lopeppeppy | nspb, if you have an existing macro, you might put it in a pastey from the channel topic, that others can see it and comment. |
| 01:46.12 | Dagmar | If you're going to ask how to /castsequence all your stuns together tho, the answer involves razor blades and a warm bathtub |
| 01:46.25 | WobWork | Dagmar: well, he won't be moving after that |
| 01:46.29 | WobWork | so it'd be... successful |
| 01:46.32 | Dagmar | Yep. :) |
| 01:46.41 | nspb | no... i just want to know if there's a way to check whether an action was successful |
| 01:46.42 | Dagmar | He'll never lose another PvP fight |
| 01:46.49 | nspb | and if it ain't, to abort |
| 01:46.50 | Dagmar | Not really |
| 01:46.51 | WobWork | alas not |
| 01:46.53 | nspb | like a break or continue |
| 01:46.59 | mikma | wobwork: i have a dogs butt in my armpit... really. |
| 01:47.02 | Dagmar | Either it casts, or it sticks and keeps trying every time you push da button |
| 01:47.17 | nspb | mm |
| 01:47.18 | WobWork | http://www.macroexplain.com/ is a good site though for the basic mechanics |
| 01:47.38 | Arrowmaster | which is why castsequence sucks for applying debuffs unless they cant miss |
| 01:47.50 | nspb | I didn't ask for castsequence help :/ |
| 01:48.14 | nspb | ok so one more thing, which is complex and that's why i didnt wanna look into it to begin with |
| 01:48.16 | WobWork | in other news, my friend has decided to get her PA to take the CPU down to the neighbourhood PC shop once she's gone, as she hasn't the time to do any complex troubleshooting |
| 01:48.20 | mikma | no |
| 01:48.22 | Dagmar | Arrowmaster: Dunno. I'd say the bigger problem is when one can't actually land |
| 01:48.27 | mikma | its not possible. |
| 01:48.30 | Dagmar | I like to be thorough with my Dots |
| 01:48.46 | WobWork | so it's now officially SEP |
| 01:49.00 | Dagmar | WobWork: She can always beat the PA with a bat just on general principle later |
| 01:49.02 | Lopeppeppy | I like those SEP fields, WobWork. |
| 01:49.18 | WobWork | Dagmar: -after- the computer is fixed! =) |
| 01:49.28 | WobWork | otherwise she'll have to take it down herself |
| 01:49.32 | nspb | mm is there a way to get something like Outfitter to change weapons for you automatically depending on whether you're stealthed or not, or in different stances? |
| 01:49.44 | mikma | no |
| 01:49.50 | nspb | only if you mount |
| 01:49.51 | Dagmar | WobWork: They make house calls |
| 01:49.54 | nspb | or something |
| 01:49.56 | WobWork | nspb: I'm pretty sure closetgnome did that |
| 01:50.01 | roastx | it does it for stances |
| 01:50.07 | Dagmar | Outfitter can do that afaik |
| 01:50.07 | roastx | not sure about stealth |
| 01:50.08 | WobWork | so I'm sure outfitter could |
| 01:50.10 | nspb | but not for stealthing |
| 01:50.29 | Dagmar | I've got Outfitter equipping my lance in all sorts of places in Icecrown |
| 01:50.32 | WobWork | I vaugely recall some stealth swapping stuff. but that was a few patches ago |
| 01:50.44 | *** join/#wowuidev kd3 (n=kd3@wikia/kaydeethree) |
| 01:50.48 | WobWork | Dagmar: That sounds like it could lead to terrible mishaps =) |
| 01:50.52 | Dagmar | Pretty sure it can switch things based on stances and other conditionals |
| 01:50.58 | roastx | tom cruise is in my closetgnome :( |
| 01:51.05 | Dagmar | WobWork: yeah a few suprise dismounts |
| 01:51.21 | roastx | ive had outfitter do some fucked up things sometimes |
| 01:51.23 | nspb | I'll look into that, then. Thanks |
| 01:51.30 | roastx | like make me naked spontantenously |
| 01:51.32 | roastx | thats amusing |
| 01:51.35 | Dagmar | I ran up those stairs behind all the Commanders and Lieutenants and *wham* on my butt |
| 01:51.50 | WobWork | good thing they despawned too =) |
| 01:51.57 | Dagmar | Maybe in your world they did |
| 01:52.04 | Dagmar | I got a beat down |
| 01:52.15 | WobWork | usually you can outphase them if you get far enough out of the zone |
| 01:52.30 | WobWork | but that takes not getting trampled, I guess |
| 01:52.34 | Dagmar | Yeah well, tehre's a reason I was trying to go up the steps to begin with |
| 01:52.37 | Dagmar | I had a LOT of guys chasing me |
| 01:53.11 | Dagmar | I left the subzone at about the fifth step up, and YOINK it reequips my gun and stick |
| 01:53.50 | Dagmar | I'm going to go out on a limb here and say that claim that IE has it's own arp cache is crack rock fantasy |
| 01:54.29 | Arrowmaster | arp cache maybe, but i wouldnt doubt if it had its own dns cache |
| 01:54.32 | Lopeppeppy | CRACK! |
| 01:57.40 | nspb | oh yeah, outfitter DOES it |
| 01:57.47 | nspb | how does outfitter do it? |
| 01:57.51 | nspb | so smart, so smart |
| 01:58.41 | WobWork | It reads your mind |
| 01:58.57 | nspb | <3 it for not judging me then |
| 01:59.01 | Dagmar | This is how it knows to strip your toon naked |
| 01:59.24 | nspb | lol like in Diablo 2, i just start dropping my items on the ground and some douche comes and collects em |
| 01:59.30 | nspb | "gotcha" |
| 01:59.52 | Dagmar | You shouldn't litter. |
| 02:00.06 | nspb | kittens should, though |
| 02:00.32 | Dagmar | Littering can also be abused when taken to excess |
| 02:01.01 | Dagmar | EQ GM's didn't like it when you got about a dozen people together and started leaving streaks of copper pieces all over |
| 02:01.11 | Dagmar | Something about "excessive zone load times" |
| 02:01.42 | Dagmar | ...the important thing there being not that it makes people take four or five times as long to zone in, but that it would murder ShowEQ. :) |
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| 02:12.01 | WobWork | ShowEQ? |
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| 02:12.23 | Jerub | My wife just got this trinket: http://www.wowwiki.com/Bitter_Balebrew_Charm |
| 02:13.08 | Lopeppeppy | Neat trinket. |
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| 02:34.21 | WobWork | Jerub: The brewmaiden doesn't last long enough imo |
| 02:34.32 | Dagmar | She last long enough to give me beer |
| 02:34.41 | WobWork | I want her to last longer so I can drink more! |
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| 02:42.32 | roastx | maybe google doesnt want noscript for chrome :P |
| 02:42.42 | roastx | because people would block googleadsyndication.com |
| 02:42.44 | roastx | :( |
| 02:43.06 | roastx | or google analytics |
| 02:43.42 | Shirik | Wow, the CppUnit framework is an absolute mess |
| 02:43.48 | Shirik | it looks like it was written by a C programmer |
| 02:44.16 | Jerub | WobWork: i always want her to last longer. |
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| 02:58.27 | A-KO | so it is just me or does anyone else have the feeling they won't have their full 245 set by the time 3.3 comes out? |
| 02:58.45 | A-KO | with 1 trophy per boss, it's pretty bad :P |
| 03:00.06 | Amarande | I'll be lucky if I get the Epic achievement before Cat, at this rate. |
| 03:00.13 | Amarande | And that only needs a full 213 set. |
| 03:00.39 | Amarande | also, I've started to notice Murphy's Law of PUG :| |
| 03:00.52 | Amarande | If you spend all day on the 80 you want to PUG with, there will never be an opening. |
| 03:00.52 | Jerub | I still haven't managed to do 10toc yet. |
| 03:00.59 | smcn | onxyia 25-man drops ilvl 245 |
| 03:01.09 | Jerub | I did get in a 10toc pug on the weekend so i've SEEN northrend beasts, but not gotten them down. |
| 03:01.09 | Amarande | If you give up and go to level an alt, EVERYONE will be looking for DPS for their PUGs. |
| 03:01.17 | Dagmar | "Anyone who can f**k up your PUG, will f**k up your PUG" |
| 03:01.28 | Jerub | I had a DK training his swords in a pug. |
| 03:01.28 | Amarande | (Of course, then it's useless to try to respond, since by the time you can log off your alt and get back to your 80 it'll be full :P) |
| 03:01.35 | Jerub | I had to tell him off and tell him to not do that on boss fights |
| 03:01.38 | Jerub | :( 600dps |
| 03:01.41 | Thunder_Child | Dagmar, Murphys law of MMO's? |
| 03:02.00 | Dagmar | I thought it was what Amarande was referring to |
| 03:02.06 | Amarande | Jerub: tell him to go pug Kara if he wants to do that on boss fights :D |
| 03:02.07 | smcn | jerub: that is one thing i haven't heard about cataclysm, you'd think with all the stuff they're doing to simplify gearing, and especially levelling they would get rid of weapon skill |
| 03:02.09 | Thunder_Child | "Jerub: WobWork: i always want her to last longer." i am so very amused. |
| 03:02.13 | Amarande | Dagmar: no, that's the other Murphy's Law of PUGs |
| 03:02.14 | Dagmar | There's also the inverse law of gearing |
| 03:02.26 | Dagmar | The higher the user's gear, the greater their idiocy can be |
| 03:02.34 | Amarande | the one I run into is that there are plenty of pugs *if and only if I am not playing my 80* |
| 03:02.37 | Jerub | Thunder_Child: ;) |
| 03:02.52 | Dagmar | Ideally you want only people who are comparably geared to yourself |
| 03:02.57 | Amarande | however, I don't even try to get the PUGs that advertise when I'm playing an alt, because groups fill up in less than ten seconds these days |
| 03:03.03 | Amarande | so by the time I could switch characters I'm sure it'd be full |
| 03:03.13 | Dagmar | ...simply because they're less likely to be in the habit of trying to click every cooldown at once. |
| 03:03.25 | Amarande | unless of course they're looking for a healer for low-mid 60s instances, I guess heh |
| 03:03.39 | Amarande | however, I'm not sure you want my shadow specced priest healing |
| 03:03.48 | Amarande | although I do have a veritable crapload of spellpower for that level ... like 400 or so |
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| 03:04.51 | Amarande | speaking of my priest, before I continue further with my hunter I should probably go rep up some more with timbermaw on the priest |
| 03:05.37 | Jerub | i still have no idea what a good amount of spellpower is to have on my tree healer. |
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| 03:06.18 | Amarande | Jerub: as much as humanly ... er, taurenly possible while still having enough int and mp5 to not go oom? :) |
| 03:06.52 | Jerub | I very very rarely have to hit innervate, let alone go totally oom. |
| 03:09.44 | smcn | that's the metric i used on my tree and do now on my priest, if you're not running out of mana always go w/spellpower |
| 03:10.01 | smcn | but that was when we were still in naxx, i still haven't seen ulduar |
| 03:10.41 | Jerub | I geared as fast as possible when i hit 80, which was just after patch 3.2 |
| 03:10.59 | Jerub | which means I'ma ctually better geared than half my guildies now :( and i topped the dps in ulduar the other day. |
| 03:11.29 | Jerub | so i now have to convince them to let me heal ulduar instead of dps it, after that performance :D |
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| 03:16.20 | Amarande | heh |
| 03:16.22 | Amarande | that sounds odd |
| 03:16.28 | Amarande | having trouble *getting to heal* an instance? |
| 03:16.49 | Amarande | usually it's us DPS who have opportunity issues |
| 03:16.58 | tem | smcn, I think druids value haste pretty highly right now |
| 03:17.01 | tem | at least until the soft cap |
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| 03:17.20 | Amarande | after all, not only do we DPS have to have the right stuff and not stand in fire |
| 03:17.29 | smcn | well, i haven't played my druid since before 3.1 |
| 03:17.30 | Amarande | but we also have to worry about the mob level (healers don't) |
| 03:17.48 | Amarande | and we also have to worry about presenting nice availability and such like a job everyone in town is applying for |
| 03:17.52 | Jerub | Amarande: i heal all heroics. it's just i tank or dps guild raids |
| 03:17.54 | Amarande | simply because pretty much everyone in town *is* dps, heh |
| 03:18.01 | tem | I wonder if you are supposed to gear for the soft cap and then drop gift of the earthmother when you do |
| 03:18.28 | smcn | i haven't played my druid since before 3.1, when it was all regrowth or WG spam :P |
| 03:18.45 | smcn | came back shortly before 3.2 and levelled a priest i had sitting at 70 |
| 03:21.20 | Amarande | I've been trying to level my 63 priest |
| 03:21.24 | Amarande | but it just doesn't feel right lately |
| 03:21.42 | Amarande | I don't know, there's just something about the priest playstyle that no longer grabs me the way playing my warlock or hunter does |
| 03:22.17 | Amarande | maybe it's the whole having a tank for everything without having to hire another player to do it thing |
| 03:22.37 | Amarande | given my online RPG history, that quite likely is it |
| 03:22.48 | Amarande | I came from Guild Wars, where you could have an entire AI party if need be |
| 03:22.52 | Amarande | and before that, from Diablo II, where you had your merc |
| 03:24.41 | batrick | 18:01:07 Freenode/DCC SEND from somebody [0.0.0.0 port 0]: startkeylogger [0B bytes] requested in channel #ubuntu |
| 03:24.46 | batrick | ... clever girl... |
| 03:25.00 | Dagmar | No one disconnected immediately? |
| 03:25.56 | Dagmar | There's still a number of home routers out there that crash due to a bug in their ipt_dcc module |
| 03:26.19 | Jerub | 'startkeylogger' was a thing that would immediately drop you off irc if you were running norton on the desktop |
| 03:26.23 | batrick | o i don't know, that was in my IRC client's status report |
| 03:26.28 | batrick | wasn't looking at the channel |
| 03:26.37 | batrick | so few people know about port 0 :) |
| 03:26.55 | jpmorgan | lol kind of like +++ATH |
| 03:26.57 | Dagmar | Jerub: Supplying zeroes for some of the arguments and using a string longer than a certain bit will do the router dump |
| 03:27.10 | Jerub | Dagmar: heh, so this is a combination attack ;) |
| 03:27.25 | Dagmar | More like two problems with the same symptom actually |
| 03:27.52 | Dagmar | easymode: /bind ^A SELF_INSETR |
| 03:28.18 | Amarande | Jerub: this is because norton is stupid :) |
| 03:28.22 | Dagmar | ...then ^ADCC SEND boogaboogabooyabyebye 0 0 0^A |
| 03:28.29 | Amarande | Norton Virus, is what I tend to refer to it as :P |
| 03:28.30 | Dagmar | kersplat. |
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| 03:29.13 | Amarande | Let's see, it's difficult+ to uninstall without reformatting, it drains system resources terribly and it interferes with some apps, giving them a vulnerability like that. |
| 03:29.19 | Amarande | Yeah, sounds like a virus to me :) |
| 03:29.30 | Dagmar | It works fine when you bother to learn how to set it up properly. |
| 03:29.47 | Dagmar | If it weren't overzealous in the default configuration, equally dimwitted people would claim it was vulnerable. |
| 03:29.53 | Dagmar | Damned if you do, and damned if you don't. |
| 03:30.12 | Dagmar | That having been said, I use Comodo because it's got a freaking whitelist |
| 03:30.53 | Dagmar | It is easier and safer for a security app to deny everything by default, and only allow known, good programs to execute. |
| 03:31.17 | Dagmar | Some new stuff shows up on the box, doesn't matter if it managed to write itself to the hard drive or not. It can't be run. |
| 03:31.52 | Dagmar | If a process tries to spawn a child process that's not explicitly approved, that's denied. |
| 03:32.27 | Amarande | Dagmar: depends |
| 03:32.45 | Dagmar | Depends on what? Pinstripes? |
| 03:32.53 | Amarande | Dagmar: a lot of larger programs these days tend to spawn a lot of separate little processes that may or may not have recognizable names |
| 03:33.04 | Dagmar | Nothing looks at names |
| 03:33.16 | Dagmar | ...and a whitelist is a whitelist. |
| 03:33.16 | Amarande | Dagmar: doesn't the "do you want to approve this program?" box show the name? |
| 03:33.35 | Dagmar | If your app calls a whole bunch of other binaries, you have a whole bunch of clicking to do to approve them. |
| 03:33.45 | Amarande | Dagmar: yeah, that's what I was getting at |
| 03:33.53 | Amarande | a lot of times, those other binaries aren't nearly so easily recognizable as the app itself |
| 03:33.55 | Dagmar | Amarande: The name is unimportant. The thing looks at a hash of the binary. |
| 03:33.58 | Amarande | and if you fail to approve ONE thing |
| 03:34.11 | Amarande | next thing you're going to spend the next week or two tearing your hair out as to why the original app doesn't want to work properly. :) |
| 03:34.13 | Dagmar | The name is just shown to the user because otherwise it would be useless. |
| 03:34.29 | Amarande | Dagmar: but the name is what the user would go by when making the decision whether or not to approve it |
| 03:34.31 | Dagmar | "Would you like to run application with md5sum of 3f5d2380ff238e4?" |
| 03:34.38 | Amarande | how many users have memorized md5sums :) |
| 03:34.44 | Dagmar | None. |
| 03:34.49 | Dagmar | This is why it shows you names. |
| 03:34.52 | Amarande | Exactly. The user is going to go by the name. |
| 03:35.06 | Amarande | And a lot of behind the scenes child processes tend to have names that are a LOT less recognizable and user friendly than the app name itself |
| 03:35.11 | Dagmar | If you don't like the idea of whitelists, you are quite welcome to stay with the other lemmings being terrorized by virus writing criminals |
| 03:35.16 | Dagmar | It's rather like the 80's. |
| 03:35.35 | Amarande | And that is BAD, because like I said ... fail to know one child binary's name and next thing you're spending a week or more trying to figure out why your app no longer works |
| 03:35.38 | Dagmar | ...when companies figured all tehy had to do to keep their systems secure was to make threats and hide passwords under a cocktail napkin. |
| 03:35.54 | Amarande | and probably end up growling that your app is either broken, mis-installed or incompatible with your security program |
| 03:36.05 | Dagmar | Amarande: Nothing can be done about hte user being an idiot. |
| 03:36.08 | Amarande | and since you can't really figure out that easily what you did wrong, you might end up going through the whole trouble of reformatting to try again. |
| 03:36.12 | Dagmar | Your argument fails. |
| 03:36.23 | Amarande | Dagmar: Example: Program is called "Wonderful Application for Foo." |
| 03:36.30 | Dagmar | If you reformat the machine to solve a problem, you're just an idiot. |
| 03:36.47 | Amarande | Child processes are called things like "Xynko," "Dynko," "Mynko," and "Cynko." |
| 03:36.57 | Dagmar | In crazy-land, sure. |
| 03:37.02 | Amarande | To make things worse, virus author makes MAJOR THREAT VIRUS called "Minko" or "Nynko" |
| 03:37.15 | Dagmar | So what |
| 03:37.26 | Dagmar | Let me put this simply to stop you wasting both our time |
| 03:37.31 | Dagmar | Install the thing and use it awhile. |
| 03:37.32 | Amarande | Dagmar: I'm assuming that if you're not like totally ins-and-outs technically familiar with the app you're running (and can you claim that for ALL your apps?) |
| 03:37.35 | Dagmar | What you're describing isn't possible. |
| 03:37.45 | Amarande | you might only KNOW that the program is "Wonderful Application for Foo" |
| 03:37.59 | Dagmar | Amarande: Actually, becasue I'm a royal bastard when it comes to malware and people trying to take control of my stuff from me, YES. |
| 03:38.02 | Amarande | and not be familiar with the crappy naming scheme the programmers used for the intermediaries (since they didn't EXPECT users to see or care about them) |
| 03:38.12 | Dagmar | I AM the asshole virus authors never manage to get to. |
| 03:38.24 | Amarande | and then you see that the program wants to run "Mynko" and you've heard of Nynko and Minko |
| 03:38.28 | Amarande | you get the names mixed up and click Deny |
| 03:38.40 | Amarande | and next thing you spend the next week trying to figure out why Wonderful Application for Foo no longer works. |
| 03:38.44 | Dagmar | Might take a few days for me to warm up on using a new app while I make sure it can't break my everything, but this is the reason I know about this crap before CNN is talking fear to everyone about it |
| 03:39.24 | Dagmar | Your example not only doesn't work, it's dumb. |
| 03:39.25 | Amarande | Dagmar: So basically, you err on the side of your computer being secure, even over other seemingly more important things like "is my computer usable" |
| 03:39.39 | Dagmar | $random_program does not magically become a child process of something you're running. |
| 03:39.42 | Dagmar | Ever. |
| 03:40.24 | Dagmar | I err on the side of my computer being kept secure because the alternative is OTHER PEOPLE TAKING MY STUFF. |
| 03:40.32 | Amarande | I've thought of ideas for ultimate computer security. |
| 03:40.48 | Dagmar | I actually respect that the machine is quite complex, and that I can't just bark and chew on the mouse to make it go. |
| 03:40.57 | Dagmar | Kill all MSCEs? |
| 03:41.00 | Amarande | Most fail to interest me because usually they seem to involve being willing to take the risk of permanently being locked out of your computer and data or having them destroyed if that's what it takes to protect it. |
| 03:41.17 | Dagmar | You're reading the rantings of more idiots than you think then |
| 03:41.21 | Amarande | If you *really* want full security, that is. |
| 03:41.48 | jpmorgan | dont hook it up to the interweb |
| 03:42.12 | Dagmar | If the value of your data is in no one but you having it, then YES it's perfectly valid for it to be destroyed before it's compromised. |
| 03:42.17 | Amarande | jpmorgan: once you can figure out a way of communicating with my good friends on web boards, going on IRC and playing WoW without doing that, get back to me. :) |
| 03:42.37 | jpmorgan | oh well thats not secure |
| 03:42.55 | Dagmar | You might as well be complaining that no one should use mechanical devices to move faster than walking speed because someone might bump their nose. |
| 03:43.41 | Dagmar | The difference there being that no one thinks that someone who gets drunk and drives off an overpass is anything but an idiot. |
| 03:43.51 | jpmorgan | its a discussion of risk avoidance vs aversion. my small point was interweb is bad (for security). put it in a safe, sink the safe into concrete, and sink it in the ocean |
| 03:43.57 | Dagmar | Somehow, this same standard doesn't hold true for people who have just fed Dokken their chicken. |
| 03:44.06 | Amarande | Dagmar: It's more like the idea of having an anti-theft system for your car that will destroy it on theft attempt because you're afraid a thief might use your car as a bank robbery getaway vehicle and involve you in a nasty investigation. |
| 03:44.07 | Dagmar | So stuff your "oops you clicked the wrong button" crap, okay? |
| 03:44.43 | Dagmar | You're just making it more and more apparent that you don't actualy have a clue. |
| 03:45.22 | Dagmar | Here's a clue now |
| 03:45.22 | Dagmar | http://www.google.com/search?q=argumentum+ad+ridiculum |
| 03:45.25 | Dagmar | Go get it! |
| 03:46.30 | Dagmar | Better yet, show up at DefCon just once and start talking that crazy and see how long the line gets to chew you out. |
| 03:48.30 | jpmorgan | defcon lol |
| 03:49.11 | Dagmar | There's a reason the admission there is high, adn it's to keep the kids away |
| 03:49.16 | Dagmar | No joke. |
| 03:49.50 | Dagmar | That and it reduces the chance Mudge will get fed up and shoot one of them |
| 03:51.10 | Dagmar | It's very simple. |
| 03:51.37 | Dagmar | The number of applications a user will install on their PC is almost ALWAYS smaller than teh number of malicious applications out there that other people want to install. |
| 03:51.52 | Dagmar | If you want to make a list, the shorter list is easier. |
| 03:52.24 | Amarande | Yeah, it's reasonable from that POV. |
| 03:52.33 | Dagmar | It's reasonable and it's workable. |
| 03:53.21 | Amarande | I've run into issues with stuff like that before, though. Like fullscreen games and firewalls. |
| 03:53.44 | Dagmar | The only place it fails is when a user explicitly refuses to think for themselves and expects the computer to magically be able to determine if the candy from the guy in the van is safe or not. |
| 03:53.48 | Amarande | The firewall message asking you to whitelist the game appears on the desktop, rather than on the game's display |
| 03:54.02 | Amarande | So one gets the appearance that the game has crashed. |
| 03:54.05 | Dagmar | more fail. Doesn't happen. |
| 03:54.13 | Amarande | And in some cases, the game will get really pissy technologically about the fact that it can't connect to the Internet. |
| 03:54.16 | Dagmar | The game is not executed and THEN the whitelist check happens. |
| 03:54.28 | Amarande | Dagmar: yeah, in the application whitelist case it works |
| 03:54.28 | Dagmar | The whitelist check happens and THEN the game is run, IF it's approved. |
| 03:54.44 | Dagmar | So again, you've come up with an insultingly impossible argument |
| 03:54.47 | Amarande | Fail happens with, for instance, cheap firewall applications that don't check until after the application requests to do something on the Internet. |
| 03:55.03 | Amarande | Which in a game's case means you're already in the full screen and don't even see the box. |
| 03:55.31 | Dagmar | You generally figure it out pretty quick after the game exits and the dialog is still there waiting on you to click on it, tho. |
| 03:55.45 | Dagmar | more fail. |
| 03:56.37 | Dagmar | If you installed such an app and didn't pre-approve it before running it, you fail because not only were you expecting the computer to by psychic about the man with the candy, you were expecting it to behave counter to what you told it by installing the firewall software in the first place. |
| 03:56.50 | NiLon_ | is there somekind limit for amount of chars that you can send to guild chat in 1 line? |
| 03:57.25 | Amarande | Dagmar: you know, I just had an idea so fiendish that if implemented in a game would have to go in something as high difficulty as a Roguelike. :) |
| 03:57.42 | Dagmar | Let me guess. It involves guessing a number? |
| 03:57.49 | Amarande | Dagmar: Simple. You have NPCs come up and offer our hero an innocent looking item, like candy or a potion. |
| 03:58.07 | Dagmar | Dude, 99% of the players would click GIMME without reading the quest text. |
| 03:58.11 | Amarande | You only have one opportunity to decide whether to take it or not. |
| 03:58.20 | Dagmar | You know it, I know it, everyone in here knows it. |
| 03:58.26 | Amarande | And the item only lasts a couple turns, so you don't really get to cast detect whatever on it without it disintegrating. |
| 03:58.30 | Amarande | Now here's the evil idea. |
| 03:58.41 | Amarande | ALMOST all of those guys are out to kill you and the items are poison. |
| 03:58.44 | Dagmar | You call it an "Internet Connection Optimizer" potion? |
| 03:58.45 | Jerub | wait, read quest text? |
| 03:58.49 | Jerub | you can DO that? |
| 03:58.49 | Amarande | But ONE of them, you HAVE TO HAVE that item to finish the game. :) |
| 03:59.12 | Amarande | (Remember, you only ever meet each particular NPC *once*.) |
| 03:59.20 | Amarande | Actually, speaking of the idea that that could only be implemented in a roguelike ... |
| 03:59.30 | Amarande | come to think of it, aren't roguelikes pretty much entirely based on this idea to some degree or other? :D |
| 03:59.36 | Dagmar | Nope. |
| 03:59.44 | Shirik | has fettucine alfredo |
| 03:59.46 | Dagmar | They give you plenty of time and ways to figure out what you're holding. |
| 04:00.13 | Amarande | Yeah, that's probably the case. |
| 04:00.19 | Dagmar | Throw a potion against a wall, at a chest, up at the ceiling, dip things into it, smell it, water it down and then drink it, the list goes on and on. |
| 04:00.22 | Amarande | And my idea as such is probably just a tad *too* evil to use and still be fun |
| 04:01.00 | Amarande | although, the idea of creating a situation where you have to choose from many similar items, all but one of which are deadly but the other one you need, without getting the opportunity to really agonize for more than a short time about each, seems to be a nifty challenge. |
| 04:01.40 | Amarande | Because letting the player agonize for ages like Linus over the chocolate box just isn't usually all that fun. |
| 04:01.53 | Amarande | (Besides, the player, like Linus, will probably end up picking the coconut one anyway. LOL) |
| 04:03.01 | Amarande | Dagmar: many of which choices will give you that "oh my god, I just destroyed the wand of wishing" feeling anyway, though :) |
| 04:03.20 | Dagmar | I never destroy those. |
| 04:03.21 | Amarande | Maybe I'm not one to judge, though |
| 04:03.30 | Amarande | every time I try Nethack I YASD within the first few floors :| |
| 04:05.03 | jpmorgan | ever seen "crawl" ? it has autoexplore ftw |
| 04:05.41 | Dagmar | I hit 5 a lot |
| 04:05.56 | Dagmar | i.e., "run until something happens" |
| 04:06.05 | Jerub | I've hacked around on TAEB |
| 04:06.19 | Jerub | the tactical amulet extraction bot. |
| 04:07.03 | Dagmar | hehe |
| 04:07.30 | Dagmar | By the time you actually GET to the Wizard, you either have the chops to take the Amulet and keep it, or you probably used a wand of digging for many levels |
| 04:07.45 | Dagmar | I leave freaking traps around |
| 04:09.11 | Amarande | Jerub, you'd better be careful about that. |
| 04:09.22 | Amarande | Mom always had a joke about creating bots to play games for you |
| 04:09.38 | Amarande | she always said, if you let the computer play by itself, eventually it'll decide it doesn't need you anymore and not let you play :D |
| 04:10.17 | Dagmar | ...or at some point, it will decide to punish you for making crappy games. |
| 04:10.35 | Dagmar | This is the lesson Maximum Overdrive teaches us. |
| 04:10.49 | Dagmar | Never combine a military AI with modern computer games. |
| 04:11.00 | Dagmar | It will get mad and make you play all the worst parts over and over. |
| 04:11.45 | Amarande | Heh |
| 04:11.56 | Dagmar | Not kidding about the plot of that movie either |
| 04:12.02 | Amarande | someone should take all the most exasperating parts of video gaming and put them all together into one super nasty fan game |
| 04:12.03 | Amarande | wait |
| 04:12.06 | Amarande | I think that might have been done |
| 04:12.11 | Amarande | ever see "I Wanna Be The Guy"? :) |
| 04:12.19 | *** join/#wowuidev Seerah (n=Ryan@c-76-107-191-65.hsd1.tn.comcast.net) |
| 04:12.19 | *** mode/#wowuidev [+o Seerah] by ChanServ |
| 04:12.24 | Dagmar | nope |
| 04:12.35 | Amarande | Dagmar: it's basically this homage to the old NES days, it's freeware |
| 04:12.37 | Amarande | well |
| 04:12.40 | Amarande | free to download and play |
| 04:12.52 | Amarande | they won't replace all the mice and monitors you smash to their end in rage after trying it for about twenty minutes |
| 04:13.17 | Amarande | there's like, four difficulties, which differ only in the number of save points you are offered. |
| 04:13.32 | Amarande | basically ANYTHING kills you in one shot (like the old NES days) |
| 04:13.44 | Amarande | but you only have *one* life before being forced back to your last save, too |
| 04:13.53 | WobWork | uu dd lr lr ba ss |
| 04:14.08 | Amarande | Wob: No Konami code either. :P |
| 04:14.14 | WobWork | damn =( |
| 04:14.17 | Dagmar | Oh crap I messed up the movie title |
| 04:14.20 | Amarande | And as if this wasn't bad enough, there's nice little surprises like apples that fall UP at you |
| 04:14.27 | Dagmar | _Maximum Surge_ was it's name |
| 04:14.28 | Dagmar | http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0382178/ |
| 04:14.34 | Amarande | or innocent looking stretches of land that when crossed cause the moon to fall down and squish you :D |
| 04:15.10 | Dagmar | The plot synopsis says something else, but it's fairly obvious to me that the Ai they invented was pissed off that it was made to play bad video games at an ultra-accellerated pace over and over to train it |
| 04:16.37 | WobWork | Amarande: "Random Acts of Death" do not make games fun |
| 04:17.37 | Dagmar | If you make the graphics flashy enough, people will play it anyway. |
| 04:17.41 | Dagmar | See also: Dragon's Lair |
| 04:18.02 | WobWork | "Rocks Fall, Everyone Dies" |
| 04:20.10 | Shirik | awww |
| 04:20.13 | Shirik | they removed concepts from C++0x |
| 04:21.27 | Dagmar | Have thay announced when they plan to start removing the insanity from it? |
| 04:22.14 | WobWork | http://www.somethingpositive.net/sp05032002.shtml |
| 04:23.41 | Shirik | there is no insanity |
| 04:24.21 | Shirik | WobWork |
| 04:24.25 | Shirik | In a few minutes I am going to hurt you for making me read yellow text on red background |
| 04:24.28 | Shirik | this better be good |
| 04:24.35 | WobWork | Rocks Fall, Everyone Dies |
| 04:26.22 | Shirik | yeah |
| 04:26.28 | Shirik | This is why I never understood DnD |
| 04:26.39 | Shirik | that's what I would do |
| 04:26.40 | Shirik | I win |
| 04:28.17 | Shirik | woah woah |
| 04:28.23 | Shirik | did google increase the size of their buttons too? |
| 04:28.47 | Dagmar | Good GMs would drop a lot of rocks on you |
| 04:33.38 | Amarande | Shirik: yup. |
| 04:33.43 | Amarande | I noticed that like the moment it first happened |
| 04:33.51 | Amarande | I was like wtf, a couple minutes ago it was smaller ... |
| 04:33.59 | Shirik | I don't use their homepage really so :/ |
| 04:34.31 | Amarande | I use it as my firefox homepage |
| 04:34.44 | Amarande | and really as the homepage for every browser I bother to configure the home page on |
| 04:35.16 | Amarande | one, it's about the most useful homepage there is, and two, it's lightweight enough to not complain about on browsers that auto-go to the home page when opening a new window or tab |
| 04:35.58 | Mikk | likes blank home pages |
| 04:37.39 | Amarande | unlike, say, the default IE home page, which is busy and slow to load and generally sucks. |
| 04:38.01 | Jerub | I don't hvae a homepage. |
| 04:38.13 | Jerub | but i set 'adultsheepfinder.com' as anyone elses if they leave their computer unlocked |
| 04:38.24 | Mikk | bwhahaha |
| 04:38.59 | Mikk | oh man the welsh in the guild are so getting it now |
| 04:39.20 | jpmorgan | muhahaha |
| 04:39.28 | Jerub | check the 'country' dropdown. |
| 04:40.00 | Mikk | *snort* |
| 04:41.57 | Codayus | Clearly made by an Australian in denial. |
| 04:42.50 | Mikk | Bah they're all exported welsh sheep shaggers anyway |
| 04:42.52 | Mikk | If not chinese |
| 04:42.57 | Mikk | mhm |
| 04:43.00 | Mikk | looks sage |
| 04:46.42 | Amarande | I always thought it was NZ where the men were men and the sheep were scared |
| 04:47.49 | Codayus | No, no. As any kiwi will tell you, that's Australia. :-) |
| 04:49.34 | Amarande | heh |
| 04:49.41 | Amarande | maybe it's Commonwealth countries in general :P |
| 04:50.00 | Amarande | you're all brits or expat brits anyway pretty much heh |
| 04:50.24 | Amarande | well, most of you |
| 04:50.24 | Amarande | wait |
| 04:50.28 | Amarande | I can't really use that one |
| 04:50.35 | Amarande | I'm American, and we're pretty much descended from brits too heh |
| 04:51.01 | *** join/#wowuidev Kazie (n=Kazie@port207.ds1-vg.adsl.cybercity.dk) |
| 04:51.27 | batrick | anyone think it's odd there is no __and metamethod (or __or equivalent)? |
| 04:51.39 | batrick | I just realized those aren't available |
| 04:52.55 | Shirik | or are they... |
| 04:53.09 | Shirik | hi batrick |
| 04:54.54 | batrick | what do you mean shirik? |
| 04:54.56 | batrick | and hi |
| 04:55.03 | Shirik | nothing :) |
| 04:58.35 | batrick | i suppose the __(n)and metamethod would only makes sense if we had explicit |
| 04:58.40 | batrick | "bitwise" operators |
| 04:59.04 | Adys | http://db.mmo-champion.com/search/all/onyxia/ |
| 04:59.06 | Adys | tabs \o/ |
| 04:59.35 | batrick | i'm pissed that we now can't get the original tier 2 headpieces |
| 04:59.49 | Adys | sure you can |
| 04:59.51 | Adys | go do onyxia |
| 04:59.58 | batrick | *original* |
| 05:00.01 | Adys | however in a couple of days that statement will be true |
| 05:00.10 | batrick | well id on't play anymore :P |
| 05:00.20 | A-KO | eh, tier 2 was cool but w/e |
| 05:00.21 | batrick | so i shouldn't be pissed, but if i played again i would be |
| 05:00.28 | Adys | tier 2 is the coolest of all |
| 05:00.30 | batrick | all mages should have full tier 2 |
| 05:00.33 | Adys | I HAVE IT |
| 05:00.40 | Adys | I'm running around in dalaran with it |
| 05:00.40 | batrick | i had it on my ally mage |
| 05:00.45 | batrick | never finished it on my hordie |
| 05:00.47 | Adys | fuck every single other tier |
| 05:01.10 | batrick | god i loved two shotting fools in battlegrounds back in the day |
| 05:01.14 | Adys | which reminds em |
| 05:01.15 | Adys | me |
| 05:01.19 | batrick | i was the epitomal glass cannon :) |
| 05:01.21 | A-KO | what I don't understand is why they are still putting on the resists |
| 05:01.24 | A-KO | what a waste of fucking stat budget |
| 05:01.26 | A-KO | seriously |
| 05:01.28 | Adys | ... |
| 05:01.35 | Adys | its not in the stat budget, for one |
| 05:01.39 | tem | I'm making a small and simple addon to hide feral ap on spellpower weapons |
| 05:01.40 | A-KO | resist isn't? |
| 05:01.43 | tem | any ideas for a name? |
| 05:01.44 | A-KO | ok then |
| 05:01.44 | A-KO | nm |
| 05:01.55 | Adys | and they're here because its a wink to old wow |
| 05:01.58 | tem | FAP Hider is kind of heavy on the inuendo for me |
| 05:02.00 | batrick | FuckDruids |
| 05:02.07 | *** join/#wowuidev DWSR2 (n=brandonm@24.114.252.243) |
| 05:02.28 | A-KO | eh |
| 05:02.39 | A-KO | hmmmm |
| 05:02.45 | batrick | FAP Discretely |
| 05:02.46 | A-KO | I might have to get that helm :P |
| 05:02.48 | batrick | or similar |
| 05:02.51 | batrick | i like that tbh |
| 05:03.11 | A-KO | she better drop 3 triumph emblems or more |
| 05:03.47 | Shirik | batrick: I disagree |
| 05:03.51 | Shirik | It makes sense imo |
| 05:03.55 | Shirik | well, maybe not |
| 05:04.05 | Shirik | we have no control over how to evaluate something as "true" or "false" either |
| 05:04.12 | Amarande | btw, is this new Onyxia raid a permanent thing? |
| 05:04.18 | Adys | batrick: http://db.mmo-champion.com/adys/nw.jpg |
| 05:04.23 | Adys | you cant argue with awesome |
| 05:04.23 | Amarande | and the 310% onyxia mount too? |
| 05:04.29 | batrick | Adys: ^_^ |
| 05:04.30 | Adys | yes and yes Amarande |
| 05:04.31 | DWSR2 | A-KO: It would be nice to see some better Frost Resist gear drop from Ony. |
| 05:04.36 | batrick | my female human mage got the same thing |
| 05:04.53 | batrick | no staff tho |
| 05:04.53 | Amarande | you know, I can see Onyxia remaining popular for the life of WoW now |
| 05:04.53 | Amarande | the mount will guarantee its popularity way past WotLK :) |
| 05:04.55 | Adys | yeah |
| 05:05.00 | Adys | because obviously that worked with kael thas |
| 05:05.01 | Amarande | Adys: also, where does it slot into the 80 progression? |
| 05:05.01 | Adys | ... right? |
| 05:05.06 | Adys | 232 245 |
| 05:05.12 | Amarande | heh, people still did original Onyxia at 80, too |
| 05:05.18 | DWSR2 | equivalent to TotCr10 H? |
| 05:05.23 | Adys | yea DWSR |
| 05:05.27 | Amarande | even without a mount incentive |
| 05:05.29 | Adys | because she was soloable Amarande |
| 05:05.31 | DWSR2 | ^ |
| 05:05.35 | DWSR2 | And she dropped like 100g. |
| 05:05.37 | Shirik | batrick, C++ has forsaken me |
| 05:05.38 | Amarande | actually, here's a more serious question |
| 05:05.38 | Adys | no |
| 05:05.42 | Adys | she dropped like 300g |
| 05:05.47 | Adys | they nerfed it thats all |
| 05:05.50 | Amarande | does the removal of Onyxia now mean that if you do not have an Onyxia Scale Cloak now, you basically can NEVER do BWL? |
| 05:05.52 | DWSR | They nerfed her money drop I thought. |
| 05:05.56 | Amarande | or does she still yield scales on skin? |
| 05:05.58 | *** part/#wowuidev Seerah (n=Ryan@c-76-107-191-65.hsd1.tn.comcast.net) |
| 05:06.07 | DWSR | Amarande: You don't need an Ony scale cloak for BWL anyway. |
| 05:06.12 | DWSR | I've been in there with like 25 80s. It's a joke. |
| 05:06.21 | Amarande | DWSR: unless you're a Paladin, you need like what, 40,000 HP to survive the final tick? |
| 05:06.35 | Amarande | unless you have guardian spirits or the such, anyway |
| 05:06.41 | DWSR | We like never got hit with it? O.o |
| 05:06.49 | DWSR | I dunno, we were just OP? |
| 05:07.03 | Amarande | also while we're discussing old school raids: |
| 05:07.12 | Amarande | is UBRS reasonably soloable now that the needs-3-people thing was nerfed? |
| 05:07.20 | Amarande | or will you still get your ass handed to you trying to solo it at 80? |
| 05:07.30 | Adys | you actually just made me buy scales of onyxia Amarande |
| 05:07.41 | DWSR | Amarande: It's soloable I think. |
| 05:07.53 | Amarande | I've still got Blackhand's Command in my Q log, I need to do that at some point :) |
| 05:07.57 | batrick | Shirik: C++ was never your friend to begin with. |
| 05:07.59 | Adys | anything lvl 60 today is soloable |
| 05:08.05 | Shirik | actually, C++ is still nice to me |
| 05:08.10 | Shirik | problem is CppUnit is an absolute mess |
| 05:08.17 | Shirik | it was written by someone who has no knowledge of C++ |
| 05:08.31 | Shirik | well, has technical (how-to) knowledge of C++, but no knowledge of how to make GOOD C++ code |
| 05:08.55 | Shirik | I managed to get a bug in an application I have never seen before in my life, because of the horrible way CppUnit is coded |
| 05:08.59 | *** join/#wowuidev Doow (n=Miranda@unaffiliated/doow) |
| 05:09.03 | Amarande | I suspect Ony80 will remain more popular than KT for another reason though |
| 05:09.11 | DWSR | ZOMG, Star Wars original trilogy is on Spike. |
| 05:09.12 | DWSR | Fuck yeah. |
| 05:09.18 | Amarande | as I remember, Ony had mechanics just complex enough to need to know them, but not uber complicated |
| 05:09.21 | DWSR | Amarande: Because the fight isn't 20 years too long? |
| 05:09.22 | Shirik | "Run-Time Check Failure #0 - The value of ESP was not properly saved across a function call. This is usually a result of calling a function declared with one calling convention with a function pointer declared with a different calling convention." |
| 05:09.27 | Adys | no Amarande its not that |
| 05:09.27 | Shirik | I have never seen that before, ever. |
| 05:09.30 | A-KO | I miss 10 minute fights |
| 05:09.34 | Amarande | whereas KT was a BC final raid boss, and as such, was by definition uber complicated |
| 05:09.47 | DWSR | What then Adys? |
| 05:09.50 | Adys | onyxia is a single boss, its soloable, its easy, its accessible, it dropped tons of gold, it dropped 18-slotters |
| 05:09.53 | Amarande | Besides, everyone likes killing dragons |
| 05:10.01 | Adys | THAT is why she's gotten soloed all that time |
| 05:10.08 | Adys | and yeha i agree with that Amarande |
| 05:10.11 | Adys | fuck the BC bullshit |
| 05:10.14 | Adys | NEED MORE DRAGONS |
| 05:10.22 | Amarande | Adys: plus until 80, you had to have her scales to reasonably get to do another classic raid (BWL) |
| 05:10.31 | Adys | ... |
| 05:10.33 | Adys | forget it Amarande |
| 05:10.36 | Amarande | it's pretty much only since WotLK that characters are getting on in power enough to ignore the shadowflame |
| 05:10.50 | Amarande | at least, I remember people still having issues with it at 70 |
| 05:10.55 | DWSR | ^^ |
| 05:10.58 | Adys | players doing bwl at 70 already had a scale cloak |
| 05:11.05 | DWSR | Besides, can't you cloak/vanish out of it? |
| 05:11.08 | Adys | only nostalgia brought it back to life |
| 05:11.11 | Amarande | DWSR: depending on class |
| 05:11.13 | Adys | you cant DWSR |
| 05:11.20 | Amarande | some classes don't have anything but the I'm Screwed button |
| 05:11.22 | Adys | you can iceblock the original tick, but not once you're dotted |
| 05:11.24 | DWSR | Adys: Achievement points, actually. |
| 05:11.28 | Adys | no |
| 05:11.31 | Adys | BC didn't have any AP |
| 05:11.34 | Adys | [08:10:59] <Adys> players doing bwl at 70 already had a scale cloak |
| 05:11.39 | Amarande | actually, come to think of it, the only class that I *know* can get rid of the dot is the paladin |
| 05:11.45 | DWSR | Yeah, but WotLK does, which is why this stuff's all coming back |
| 05:11.51 | Adys | no class can get rid of the dot Amarande |
| 05:11.56 | Adys | you can avoid it with bubble and IB |
| 05:12.03 | Adys | but once you have it you cant get rid of it |
| 05:12.05 | Amarande | Adys: I thought divine shield was effective on it |
| 05:12.23 | Adys | it used to be |
| 05:12.26 | Adys | that was nerfed in 1.8 |
| 05:12.27 | DWSR | Resilience! |
| 05:12.28 | A-KO | meh, my guild is a bunch of idiots/losers/failures :/ |
| 05:12.48 | Amarande | DWSR: yeah, that's probably the only chance of surviving it on most classes if you get the dot |
| 05:12.50 | Amarande | full S7, heh |
| 05:12.51 | A-KO | they don't believe in taking the 232 gear over their 226 gear because it would "break bonuses" and become a "downgrade" :/ |
| 05:13.18 | A-KO | hell some of 'em won't even take the 245 gear |
| 05:13.19 | Amarande | of course, like folks said, it's only a slight issue now |
| 05:13.28 | Amarande | and by next xpac, if HP keeps inflating as it has, it probably won't be an issue at all |
| 05:13.29 | DWSR | Amarande: Resilience doesn't affect PvE damage. |
| 05:13.36 | DWSR | Yeah, I know >.< |
| 05:13.48 | DWSR | My warlock has like 26k HP in full Deadly. Can't wait to see Relentless. |
| 05:14.08 | Amarande | wonders what tanks are going to have next xpac |
| 05:14.28 | DWSR | Amarande: I believe that you're going to see a drop in tank HP. |
| 05:14.43 | Amarande | DWSR: not so sure on that |
| 05:14.52 | Amarande | you won't have to stack defense rating anymore, because there won't BE defense rating |
| 05:14.56 | Amarande | so that's more slots to stack stam |
| 05:15.33 | DWSR | Amarande: I have a feeling blizzard's going to make up for that by making agility affect dodge/parry or something. |
| 05:15.56 | DWSR | But regardless, tank HP is pretty inflated atm, with the stat simplification, I believe that we're going to see a nerf in how much health you get per point of stamina. |
| 05:16.08 | Amarande | I can't believe people are QQing about the removal of defense rating and the replacement with talents to be uncrittable |
| 05:16.17 | DWSR | I am. |
| 05:16.27 | DWSR | It's a free pass for retards. |
| 05:16.32 | Amarande | apparently, the QQ is because defense rating was "a nice way of preventing nooblars from spoiling your run by tanking it" |
| 05:16.39 | DWSR | That. |
| 05:16.41 | Amarande | DWSR: you're forgetting something, though. |
| 05:16.51 | Amarande | druids can already tank without needing an iota of defense rating on their gear. |
| 05:16.58 | Amarande | how is it any worse to open it to other classes? |
| 05:17.05 | Amarande | there's plenty of fail druids out there and WoW hasn't collapsed |
| 05:17.05 | DWSR | Because I don't let druids tank for me. |
| 05:17.17 | DWSR | Yeah, but that's because druid tanks don't make up the majority of tanks in the game. |
| 05:17.18 | Amarande | hell ... didn't someone talk last night about knowing a tree who got kicked out of guild after guild for failing at healing? heh |
| 05:17.42 | DWSR | It's like driving. |
| 05:17.57 | DWSR | If everyone and their retarded uncle can just hop in a car and go, imagine what the hell happens. |
| 05:18.00 | DWSR | Same thing with tanking. |
| 05:18.03 | Amarande | Besides, there's the issue with getting geared up to begin with |
| 05:18.14 | Amarande | since you need to do the instances to get the gear you need to tank them |
| 05:18.33 | DWSR | It's very hard to tell the skill of a tank just by their gear. |
| 05:18.33 | Amarande | and it's hard enough to get an instance group as DPS as it is, let alone as a tank class |
| 05:18.52 | Amarande | trying to get away with being DPS as a tank class usually ends as well as trying to get to be shadow on a priest in 5-mans |
| 05:19.12 | DWSR | But it's pretty convincing proof that you're retarded if you aren't d-capped for a heroic |
| 05:19.26 | Amarande | usually, this happens as soon as you try to go "LF tank" (as tank class) or "LF healer" (as spriest) and everyone lols at you because "you're a warrior/priest, why can't you tank/heal yourself?" |
| 05:19.50 | DWSR | Amarande: Here's the general line of thought. |
| 05:20.07 | Amarande | at least, IIRC I had a hell of a lot of problems starting up instance groups as a spriest as I was leveling up due to the fact that when I tried to get a healer, people saw my class and expected me to do it |
| 05:20.07 | DWSR | There's 3 rolls in the game. tank, heal, dps. |
| 05:20.11 | DWSR | Everyone can dps. |
| 05:20.16 | DWSR | Not everyone can tank or heal. |
| 05:20.30 | DWSR | So why the fuck would you not tank/heal if you could do it? It makes getting into groups a fuckton easier. |
| 05:20.38 | DWSR | I agree it's flawed thinking, but that's generally how it is. |
| 05:20.53 | DWSR | tbh. |
| 05:20.55 | Amarande | DWSR: well, when I had the grouping issues as spriest (now I'm pretty much planning to blaze to 80 without doing any more instances) |
| 05:20.58 | DWSR | For leveling, shadow can heal fine. |
| 05:21.04 | DWSR | Until you hit like 70ish. |
| 05:21.08 | Amarande | I was still low level, had no alts to give me money, and respeccing was still horribly expensive |
| 05:21.53 | Amarande | I'm thinking more the issues that a Warrior up and coming tank in particular faces now |
| 05:21.55 | DWSR | Amarande: As long as you've got decent gear, you can heal as an spriest until you hit the 60s range. |
| 05:22.04 | DWSR | omg, warrior tanking's so broken. |
| 05:22.12 | Amarande | Basically, the thought that if they try to start groups so they can get tanking gear |
| 05:22.23 | Amarande | they're going to have trouble getting a tank because people will see the warrior asking for a tank and be wtf |
| 05:22.39 | DWSR | I don't make any assumptions, tbnh. |
| 05:22.41 | DWSR | tbh* |
| 05:22.59 | DWSR | Actually, that's a lie. |
| 05:23.06 | Amarande | I guess I figure warriors have a harder time of it than the others, too, for various reasons |
| 05:23.08 | DWSR | I assume that everyone's a bad until I see compelling proof otherwise. |
| 05:23.31 | Amarande | So many DKs fail utterly at just about everything that a lot of people don't trust them to tank anyway, thus it's actually easier for them to get the DPS role they need in order to gain tanking gear pre-defcap |
| 05:23.52 | Amarande | Paladins and Druids can heal, and no one cares about your gear stats as healer as long as people don't die |
| 05:24.50 | Amarande | You know, I envy healers. |
| 05:24.54 | DWSR | I don't. |
| 05:25.03 | DWSR | If I fuck up on DPS....meh. |
| 05:25.08 | DWSR | Group does a bit less damage. |
| 05:25.09 | Amarande | All they have to do is make sure people don't die, and nobody usually even looks at their HPS meter output |
| 05:25.19 | DWSR | If a healer fucks up, repair bills abound. |
| 05:25.27 | Amarande | As DPS? It doesn't matter just to make things die, I have to keep up appearances on Recount, or else I won't get invited to future PUGs. |
| 05:25.29 | DWSR | And besides, everyone blame's the healer (as a general rule of them). |
| 05:25.35 | DWSR | rofl |
| 05:25.40 | Amarande | They'll take that warlock in the ilvl 245 who can put out 4k DPS instead. |
| 05:25.55 | DWSR | failbot is a much more accurate picture of people's skill level. |
| 05:25.56 | DWSR | ROFL |
| 05:26.00 | DWSR | ilvl245 @ 4K? |
| 05:26.04 | Amarande | well |
| 05:26.07 | Amarande | or whatever ilvl 245 locks do |
| 05:26.08 | DWSR | AHAHAHAHA WHAT KINDA SCRUBS DO YOU HAVE ON YOUR SERVER? |
| 05:26.19 | Amarande | it's a hella lot more than I do with ilvl 200, anyway |
| 05:26.21 | Corrodias | your mother |
| 05:26.31 | Amarande | but basically, that's the point. |
| 05:26.49 | Amarande | Healers and tanks, aside from tank def rating, are never measured by raw numbers, as long as they do their role with half a brain and people don't die. |
| 05:27.04 | DWSR | Amarande: If you;re pugging. |
| 05:27.09 | Amarande | DPS, on the other hand, stop getting invited to PUGs if they get a reputation of not having the OMGNUMBERS |
| 05:27.25 | DWSR | From my experience in a guild, everything is scruntinized. |
| 05:27.33 | DWSR | I would say tanks and healers more, since DPS is a dime a dozen. |
| 05:27.46 | Amarande | Never mind that we don't have the numbers because we're still trying to get the gear upgrades so we can do the numbers, and to do that we need to go to instances :) |
| 05:27.47 | DWSR | Scrub DPS? Kick 10, you'll have 15 more apply. |
| 05:28.19 | Amarande | Speaking of which, does Brewfest's boss this year have any must-haves for warlocks? |
| 05:28.27 | DWSR | not really. |
| 05:28.33 | DWSR | btw, destro or aff? |
| 05:28.36 | Amarande | Aff. |
| 05:28.41 | DWSR | Eh, respectable. |
| 05:28.53 | DWSR | Even though Destro has the highest theoretical output. |
| 05:29.01 | Amarande | DWSR: is that gear dependent again like in BC? |
| 05:29.09 | Amarande | I know in BC, up through kara/maggie/gruul you were better as aff |
| 05:29.16 | Amarande | but then destro started winning out around Hyjal or so |
| 05:29.33 | *** join/#wowuidev kd3 (n=kd3@wikia/kaydeethree) |
| 05:29.40 | DWSR | You were better off as aff between 3 and 3.1 |
| 05:29.48 | DWSR | Then they nerfed aff to a 3 dot rotation isntead of 7. |
| 05:30.21 | Amarande | DWSR: how badly does that really nerf dps in the end though? |
| 05:30.27 | DWSR | Amarande: A *lot*,. |
| 05:30.30 | Amarande | given that a 3 dot rotation means you have time to cast shadow bolts and keep haunt up |
| 05:30.52 | Amarande | with 7, you barely get time to shoot off a non-instant-talent SB without letting dots drop off |
| 05:30.56 | DWSR | O_O |
| 05:30.59 | DWSR | I had tons of time. |
| 05:31.06 | kd3 | yay, I'm alive |
| 05:31.07 | DWSR | Like 40% of my damage was shadow bolts. |
| 05:31.08 | Amarande | maybe it's a haste thing, too |
| 05:31.14 | Amarande | I'm pretty sure my spell haste sucks |
| 05:31.19 | DWSR | IT is. |
| 05:31.23 | DWSR | Haste > crit for any warlock |
| 05:32.01 | DWSR | Which is fucking stupid, since T7 is haste-based. |
| 05:32.06 | DWSR | But T8 and T9 are all crit-based. |
| 05:32.07 | Amarande | however, at this point, there's really only a couple pieces of gear I can *freely* replace right now |
| 05:32.47 | DWSR | I remember when I upgraded my t7.5 for t9 |
| 05:32.48 | Amarande | I'm exactly hitcapped, so if I lose any of the pieces that have hit I need to replace it somewhere |
| 05:32.52 | DWSR | I replaced 3 other pieces of gear. |
| 05:33.02 | Amarande | and I only have a fairly small number of slots that don't have at least some hit in them |
| 05:33.08 | DWSR | You soft or hard capped? |
| 05:33.20 | Amarande | 368 with 3/3 suppression. 17%. |
| 05:33.27 | DWSR | that's soft capped. |
| 05:33.37 | DWSR | You in mostly 200/213? |
| 05:34.03 | Amarande | almost all 200, a couple of 187's because I haven't found a better cloak and the helm from H-CoS is actually worse than the hat of wintry doom |
| 05:34.38 | DWSR | Amarande: Deathchill cloak. |
| 05:35.11 | DWSR | Also, the Argent Skullcap. |
| 05:35.21 | DWSR | Win until you pick up your T8.5 headpiece from conquest. |
| 05:36.14 | DWSR | Why don't you have any 226 or anything? H ToC isn't hard. |
| 05:36.28 | DWSR | And also, conquest emblem upgrades are pretty good |
| 05:37.49 | Amarande | DWSR: trouble getting groups |
| 05:38.08 | Amarande | when I've been on my lock, there's usually too many other DPS around, and I'm apparently not quick enough to type /w <name> I'll go to get in half the time |
| 05:38.19 | Amarande | I once missed out after taking literally six seconds to reply to the LFM |
| 05:38.45 | DWSR | yeah, I know how you feel. |
| 05:39.01 | Amarande | I'll have to keep an eye out on the AH for deathchill |
| 05:39.13 | DWSR | Can't you get a group of guildies together for chain heroics? |
| 05:39.19 | DWSR | Amarande: Just get the mats and get it made. Much cheaper. |
| 05:39.21 | Amarande | we don't have enough 80s in the guild |
| 05:39.36 | Amarande | we do have a healer who transferred over with some nice gear including some naxx stuff |
| 05:39.38 | Jerub | Amarande: get a new guild. |
| 05:39.51 | DWSR | Yeah. |
| 05:39.55 | Amarande | but our current main tank candidate is still severely deficient on defense rating |
| 05:40.08 | DWSR | lol |
| 05:40.12 | DWSR | There's no excuse to not have gear. |
| 05:40.19 | DWSR | ToC on reg, Conquest, etc. |
| 05:40.21 | Amarande | the other 80s in the guild, myself included, are all DPS |
| 05:41.13 | DWSR | Just get into a decently progressed guild, get some gear, then /gquit |
| 05:41.39 | Amarande | DWSR: that feels ninja-ish. |
| 05:41.49 | DWSR | You tried it the honorable way. |
| 05:42.00 | DWSR | really worked well, didn't it? :P |
| 05:42.02 | Amarande | "Hi I'm gonna come to your raids just so I can take the loots and split on you after I get it." |
| 05:42.06 | Amarande | Maybe I'm too honorable. :| |
| 05:42.17 | *** join/#wowuidev Cide- (n=Cide@h161n1-far-gr100.ias.bredband.telia.com) |
| 05:42.17 | *** mode/#wowuidev [+v Cide-] by ChanServ |
| 05:42.19 | Amarande | What can I say, I'm a sweetie by nature. :| |
| 05:42.24 | DWSR | I am too. |
| 05:42.36 | DWSR | but as long as you aren't ninja'ing any memorable drops, it's no big deal. |
| 05:42.47 | Amarande | yeah, the last time I misused need on a drop was a long time ago |
| 05:42.48 | DWSR | If you get Val'anyr and then /gquit, that's a bit different. |
| 05:42.51 | Amarande | and didn't really have much impact. |
| 05:42.55 | DWSR | but like, if you're looking for heroic gear, it doesn't matter. |
| 05:43.01 | Amarande | that was in ... heroic nexus I think |
| 05:43.17 | Amarande | epic mace dropped. everyone already had a better caster weapon than that, so they all passed |
| 05:43.29 | Amarande | and of course, quite forgetting that warlocks can't use maces, I proceed to roll need on it *facepalm* |
| 05:43.34 | DWSR | lol |
| 05:43.40 | DWSR | Amarande: Look at it this way. |
| 05:43.53 | Jerub | that's not as bad as the asshat DK who on a 25OS pug rolled on the staff drop |
| 05:43.54 | DWSR | If you're in a guild that has progressed into Ulduar/TotCr10, they don't need gear from heroics, just the badges. |
| 05:44.09 | Amarande | oh well, it's not like there aren't plenty of abyss crystals going around as it is in World of Warcraft: Wrath of the Loot King :) |
| 05:44.10 | DWSR | So if you just take all the gear, no one's really going to QQ. |
| 05:44.15 | DWSR | indeed./ |
| 05:44.27 | DWSR | I'm a bit guilty of welfare epix. |
| 05:44.35 | Jerub | (that asshat DK was a 15 year old who we kicked out of our guild after a week) |
| 05:44.36 | DWSR | Spectral Kris? |
| 05:45.12 | Jerub | I feel really odd rolling on shards at the end of heroic dungeon runs when i'm the odd-one-out with a bunch of guildies. |
| 05:45.17 | Amarande | the hard part I suppose would be finding a guild who has room for a DPS, isn't fail, and isn't going to get angry about the fact that my work schedule makes my available nights be different every week |
| 05:45.29 | Jerub | because in my guild, we DE and throw abyss crystals and whatnot in the GB. |
| 05:45.48 | Amarande | (and I can't even know what said nights are until the Friday before a given week, too) |
| 05:46.05 | Jerub | Amarande: what DPS do you pull on heoric bosses? |
| 05:46.13 | Amarande | Jerub: I'll find that out next group |
| 05:46.25 | Amarande | I didn't have recount installed last time I went to a heroic |
| 05:46.28 | *** join/#wowuidev Sixen1 (n=Sixen@173-25-22-158.client.mchsi.com) |
| 05:46.34 | Jerub | lol |
| 05:47.09 | DWSR | Amarande: Search Xandros on US-Nazjatar on wow heroes. |
| 05:47.17 | Amarande | I'm sure it's not very good, given that I don't have any ilvl 213+ items like most folks do now |
| 05:47.32 | Amarande | although it was enough to have issues with aggro on Keleseth the other week |
| 05:47.48 | DWSR | Amarande: Warlocks have threat problems. |
| 05:47.58 | DWSR | You might have had a bad tank. |
| 05:47.58 | Amarande | (and yeah, I did use my soulshatter so I was just doing *that* much) |
| 05:48.08 | Amarande | yeah, the tank himself admitted to having threat issues on that fight |
| 05:48.28 | Amarande | apparently, San'layn aren't especially tank-friendly |
| 05:48.40 | DWSR | lol |
| 05:49.25 | Amarande | on the good side we got On The Rocks that run |
| 05:49.36 | Amarande | and yeah, that's probably going to be another sticking point, come to think of it |
| 05:49.43 | Amarande | an increasing number of groups/guilds want you to link ach |
| 05:49.48 | Amarande | and I don't have very many of them |
| 05:50.27 | Amarande | you know, the ach thing may not have been a good idea for that reason :| |
| 05:50.35 | Amarande | it reminds me a little of Heroes' Ascent back in Guild Wars |
| 05:50.52 | Amarande | In GW, that particular area had a ranking system, and you also got an emote to use at rank 3, which upgraded every 3 ranks after that |
| 05:51.23 | Amarande | and you could only get ranking points if you won ... but basically, every group wanted to you to be able to emote one of the mid-high end emotes in order to get in |
| 05:52.42 | Amarande | DWSR, what do you think about groups that want you to link achievement? |
| 05:52.43 | DWSR | http://www.wowhead.com/?profile=us.nazjatar.xandros <- Amarande. |
| 05:52.55 | DWSR | Amarande: Achievements can be faked, and don't really mean a lot. |
| 05:53.07 | DWSR | Since you can be carried for like 80% of them |
| 05:54.30 | Amarande | also, I don't get the emphasis on them either |
| 05:54.37 | Amarande | I mean, some of them denote that you've at least been on a raid |
| 05:54.49 | Amarande | but like, the vast majority of dungeon & raid achievements are for doing a given battle using a silly gimmick condition |
| 05:55.03 | DWSR | not really. |
| 05:55.11 | DWSR | Some of them, like the anomalus achievement, are hard. |
| 05:55.11 | Amarande | unless those gimmicks actually get you learning battle behaviors that are actually used normally in later content |
| 05:55.14 | *** join/#wowuidev Srosh (n=Srosh@c155008.adsl.hansenet.de) |
| 05:55.50 | Amarande | well, what I mean is, a lot of players might have skipped the 'challenges' and just decided to efficiently do their heroics |
| 05:56.00 | DWSR | Oh, sure. |
| 05:56.09 | DWSR | But some of the acheivements you ahve to try really hard not to get. |
| 05:56.13 | DWSR | Like Oh Novos. |
| 05:56.23 | DWSR | And the one for doing VH without using a crystal or having the door damaged. |
| 05:56.53 | Jerub | we did the all-5-members-impaled in DTK the other day |
| 05:57.04 | DWSR | GD*" |
| 05:57.07 | DWSR | GD?* |
| 05:57.17 | Jerub | hm, might be gundrak. |
| 05:57.21 | Jerub | yeah, gundrak |
| 05:57.21 | DWSR | yeh, it's GD. |
| 05:57.26 | DWSR | lol |
| 05:57.27 | Jerub | sorry, got myself confused. |
| 05:57.30 | DWSR | np. |
| 05:57.34 | Amarande | DWSR: well, yeah. |
| 05:57.42 | DWSR | Amarande: Heroic achievements like Consumption Junction are really easy. |
| 05:57.47 | Amarande | if you have the door damaged, you're just bad |
| 05:57.51 | DWSR | ^^ |
| 05:57.58 | Amarande | and as for the crystals ... I was like 'what crystals' after that |
| 05:58.00 | DWSR | I've seen some people who don't have it. |
| 05:58.01 | Jerub | i've ONCE had the door damaged, because a tank didn't see a mob got past him |
| 05:58.11 | DWSR | lol |
| 05:58.17 | Amarande | although I did find out afterwards that the crystals matter on certain bosses in particular |
| 05:58.20 | DWSR | I use the crystals to get dehydrated. |
| 05:58.21 | Amarande | and we were just lucky enough not to get those |
| 05:58.27 | DWSR | That's it. |
| 05:58.30 | Jerub | last time i did VH i didn't even heal for 1/2 the portals. |
| 05:58.33 | DWSR | If you have to use crystals after that, you're just bad. |
| 05:58.33 | Jerub | I just ran around skinning. |
| 05:58.36 | DWSR | lol |
| 05:58.47 | Amarande | Jerub: /gkick LOOTING IN COMBAT? |
| 05:59.10 | Jerub | Amarande: this was in a pug. |
| 05:59.13 | Jerub | I told them what i was doing. |
| 05:59.13 | Amarande | ah. |
| 05:59.14 | DWSR | lol |
| 05:59.21 | Jerub | the other half of the time i was using my 'MELEE TREE' macro |
| 05:59.28 | DWSR | ahahaha |
| 05:59.29 | Jerub | (not on bosses of course) |
| 05:59.44 | DWSR | I had a healer who didn't heal a heroic. |
| 05:59.46 | Amarande | I suspect Stratholme made people especially careful in ways that moved on to VH, though |
| 05:59.56 | DWSR | I healed with Soul Leech more than he did with his heals. |
| 06:00.12 | DWSR | He was like...I'll just lolsmitespam |
| 06:00.29 | Jerub | i had a guild mage the other night do a pull, so i stopped healing him. |
| 06:00.40 | Jerub | and he survived the last 3 bosses of DTK. |
| 06:00.41 | DWSR | Good man. |
| 06:00.43 | DWSR | ROFL |
| 06:01.03 | Jerub | (he got my wild growths because i can't stop that) |
| 06:01.14 | DWSR | Yeah, if I'm in my PvP gear I can pretty much tank for heroics. |
| 06:01.23 | DWSR | I just sit there, spam some searing pain and just pop sacrifice. |
| 06:01.28 | DWSR | And then I win because I have so much health. |
| 06:05.39 | DWSR | anyway Amarande, like I said. |
| 06:05.49 | DWSR | Get into a heroic chain with a good group and like need on everything you ned. |
| 06:06.00 | DWSR | They really don't care, I know that I don't care if I get any loot from heroic runs |
| 06:06.21 | DWSR | btw. |
| 06:06.31 | DWSR | YODA IN THE ORIGINAL STAR WARS FUCKING RAPES FACE |
| 06:06.49 | Amarande | err ... ? |
| 06:06.59 | Amarande | the only things I've seen in sci-fi that rape face are those spider things from the Aliens series :) |
| 06:07.12 | Amarande | and Light are those things scary. |
| 06:07.20 | Amarande | I remember I watched the movie and then tried to play Aliens TC in DOOM |
| 06:07.26 | Amarande | and my hands were shaking even in God Mode |
| 06:07.36 | Amarande | like ... I knew I couldn't die anyway, but they still were scary |
| 06:07.43 | DWSR | dude/. |
| 06:07.49 | DWSR | Here's scary: Teletubbies L4D mod |
| 06:07.55 | DWSR | LALA |
| 06:08.09 | Amarande | and really, the Aliens TC facehuggers were fairly weak ... they only did 3-24 damage a hit, too |
| 06:08.21 | Thunder_Child | ~lart Amarande |
| 06:08.21 | purl | calls Amarande on the phone ... the lights are on but nobody's home |
| 06:08.21 | Amarande | otoh, that mod was fairly health deficient and they stayed close so they hit you multiple times in a row |
| 06:08.31 | Amarande | DWSR: good grief. |
| 06:08.39 | Amarande | tell me you at least KILL teletubbies in that mod |
| 06:08.44 | DWSR | oh, you do. |
| 06:08.51 | DWSR | But they're like demented zombie teletubbies. |
| 06:08.57 | Amarande | wait |
| 06:09.04 | Amarande | teletubbies weren't already demented zombies? |
| 06:09.07 | DWSR | Nope. |
| 06:09.12 | DWSR | Somehow, they're worse in the mod. |
| 06:10.03 | Amarande | wow. |
| 06:10.22 | DWSR | Probably the fact that there's thousands of them doesn't help. |
| 06:11.05 | Amarande | oy. |
| 06:11.13 | DWSR | A horde of TINKIE WINKIE |
| 06:11.14 | DWSR | LALA |
| 06:11.16 | DWSR | PO |
| 06:11.19 | Amarande | I just had thoughts of being trapped in Pokemon in a room full of Jigglypuffs |
| 06:11.22 | DWSR | Fucking shat my pants jsut about. |
| 06:11.24 | DWSR | zomg. |
| 06:11.33 | DWSR | Fuck jigglypuff in her fat fucking balloon cunt. |
| 06:11.41 | Jerub | the single most scary computer game expeirence of my life was in prince of persia. |
| 06:11.57 | DWSR | Jerub: Which one? And what? |
| 06:12.08 | Jerub | where you're just running around, avoiding wobbly floors and jumping on buttons, and BANG a skeleton stands up and points a sword at you. |
| 06:12.13 | Amarande | Jerub: being almost almost done with it and seeing your counter is down to ten seconds? :) |
| 06:12.29 | Jerub | and he's got no hitpoints, totally unkillable, and for the last 8 levels skeletons were just scenery. |
| 06:12.50 | Amarande | Jerub: does he fall through pits? |
| 06:13.14 | Jerub | the way to deal wtih him is to fight throguh him, drive him back into a deep deep deep pit |
| 06:13.18 | Amarande | Pits are usually your friend. Like water in Ultima VIII. :) |
| 06:13.25 | Jerub | but man, him standing up was the scariest experience of my life. |
| 06:13.50 | DWSR | pft. |
| 06:13.51 | DWSR | Sorry. |
| 06:14.04 | Amarande | Ultima VIII had a number of NPCs that just weren't supposed to die, and if they hostiled on you you just went all gibby-goo right away |
| 06:14.20 | Amarande | however, *ANY* object in UVIII was insta-destroyed if it fell into water, and that includes those NPCs. |
| 06:14.35 | DWSR | lol |
| 06:14.37 | DWSR | Anyway, night |
| 06:14.38 | Amarande | one particularly annoying one of these NPCs was Beren, who was the law enforcement sorcerer for the town the game is in |
| 06:14.54 | Amarande | basically, you get caught at the slightest of crimes and Beren will show up and gib you |
| 06:15.22 | Amarande | however, there was still a way to get away with anything and it involved wood and water |
| 06:15.57 | Amarande | pretty much, Beren liked to pace around his house and had a pool of water outside said house. |
| 06:16.13 | Amarande | there were also moveable wooden planks in the game, and he would not be able to walk through or into them. |
| 06:16.18 | Amarande | you can probably figure out the rest. :D |
| 06:17.34 | *** join/#wowuidev kd3 (n=kd3@wikia/kaydeethree) |
| 06:21.47 | *** join/#wowuidev Elkano (n=elkano@WoWUIDev/WoWAce/Elkano) |
| 06:28.14 | Adys | http://db.mmo-champion.com/i/46735/synthebrew-goggles/ |
| 06:28.18 | Adys | where do you actually get this item? |
| 06:28.33 | Thunder_Child | in a game called wow |
| 06:29.34 | Shadowed | Adys: Talk to the guy who gives you the pink-elekk quest and you have an option to get the goggles |
| 06:29.37 | Shadowed | (in a game called wow) |
| 06:30.00 | Adys | what pink elekk quest |
| 06:30.10 | Adys | i did that one as horde |
| 06:30.12 | Adys | but not as ally |
| 06:30.39 | Shadowed | there's maybe 4 guys who give quests in the brewfest area, I'm sure you can find the pink elekk quest from one of them :p |
| 06:30.43 | Shadowed | (I also have only done it on Horde) |
| 06:30.47 | Adys | I'd have found it by now |
| 06:31.12 | Adys | This quest is not available right now. [09/21/09 - EU Realms only!) |
| 06:31.13 | Adys | ah. |
| 06:31.15 | Shadowed | My conclusion is you afil |
| 06:31.16 | Shadowed | fail |
| 06:31.18 | Shadowed | or EU does |
| 06:31.20 | Shadowed | both are accurate! |
| 06:43.23 | Fisker | not available on my pala |
| 06:43.32 | Fisker | my rage face |
| 06:43.34 | Fisker | over 9k |
| 06:44.57 | Fisker | this is unacceptable |
| 06:46.00 | *** join/#wowuidev kd3 (n=kd3@wikia/kaydeethree) |
| 06:47.00 | jnwhiteh | a slap in the face even! |
| 06:48.57 | Shirik | Man, there is something seriously messed up with my school's SVN installation |
| 06:50.33 | jnwhiteh | Shirik: whats wrong with it? |
| 06:50.47 | Shirik | The instant I try to do anything remotely complicated, it breaks |
| 06:50.56 | Shirik | I try to do a merge? Oh, no, mergeinfo is not supported. |
| 06:51.01 | Shirik | I try to hook up fisheye to it? Fisheye locks up. |
| 06:51.12 | Shirik | Now I'm trying to use svnsync to make a local copy of the repository, and it's locked up too |
| 06:51.16 | jnwhiteh | >< |
| 06:51.17 | jnwhiteh | = |
| 06:51.19 | jnwhiteh | that sucks |
| 06:51.21 | nevcairiel | mergeinfo not supported probably means they run an ancient version |
| 06:51.33 | nevcairiel | pre 1.5 |
| 06:51.35 | Shirik | Like, literally locked up. I can't use ctrl+C, and I'm watching iftop and it says no activity |
| 06:51.40 | Shirik | nevcairiel: Which is pathetic :P |
| 06:52.00 | Shirik | oh, not to mention the awesome self-signed ceritifcate they use on the server |
| 06:52.08 | Shirik | which says things like OU=SomeOrganizationalUnit |
| 06:52.22 | nevcairiel | someone fell asleep on the enter key when creating the cert |
| 06:52.30 | nevcairiel | default values ftw |
| 06:53.06 | jnwhiteh | so anyone use CACert? |
| 06:53.11 | nevcairiel | i do |
| 06:53.15 | jnwhiteh | I'm thinking of having a key signing party here |
| 06:53.17 | jnwhiteh | so we have more assurance |
| 06:53.35 | jnwhiteh | If it gets included in mozilla/firefox.. that would be very good. |
| 06:53.46 | Jerub | hehehe cacert |
| 06:54.02 | nevcairiel | my professor at the university is a cacert assurer |
| 06:54.04 | Shirik | even the Atlassian guys are completely confused |
| 06:54.06 | nevcairiel | thats where i got in |
| 06:54.15 | Shirik | "Our log files show that it's broke, but no reason for why it's broke" |
| 06:54.25 | Shirik | and what is this CACert I keep hearing about |
| 06:54.41 | nevcairiel | cacert.org |
| 06:54.43 | nevcairiel | go read :p |
| 06:55.33 | Shirik | interesting |
| 06:56.04 | Fisker | jnwhiteh |
| 06:56.09 | Fisker | you still on karazhan? |
| 06:57.25 | Shirik | Fisker |
| 06:57.28 | Shirik | you still not on karazhan? |
| 06:57.45 | Fisker | :o |
| 06:57.47 | Shirik | You know what |
| 06:57.53 | Shirik | why do we need 3GHz processors and all that |
| 06:58.02 | Shirik | why can't we just have 50 core 1GHz processors or so |
| 06:58.33 | Adys | you know what |
| 06:58.36 | Shirik | I'm going through my head and thinking, we could easily sacrifice performance on processors if we simply allowed for greater parallel processing |
| 06:58.39 | Adys | ... oh you know what |
| 06:58.46 | Adys | Fisker this one's for you |
| 06:58.58 | Fisker | :3+ |
| 06:59.00 | Adys | get a bunch of battle standards on different toons from argent tourney |
| 06:59.09 | Adys | and protect the apple kegs |
| 06:59.31 | Fisker | ;E |
| 07:00.01 | Adys | i said this one's for you because i'm not asshole enough to try |
| 07:01.00 | Fisker | i don't get it :3 |
| 07:01.21 | Adys | the argent tournament's battle flags or whatever are solid objects |
| 07:01.38 | Adys | with 2-3 standards you can completely fuck up a race |
| 07:02.03 | Fisker | so if you put them in an apple keg they can't use it? |
| 07:02.34 | Adys | a friend and i were wondering a few months ago |
| 07:03.04 | Adys | how long is it gonna take for them to be exploitable |
| 07:03.50 | *** join/#wowuidev NightHawkAtWork (n=jonathan@216-160-120-43.tukw.qwest.net) |
| 07:04.22 | NightHawkAtWork | hmm. |
| 07:04.25 | Shirik | Adys |
| 07:04.27 | Shirik | yes |
| 07:04.27 | Shirik | I do |
| 07:04.41 | Adys | ? |
| 07:05.14 | *** join/#wowuidev Sixen1 (n=Sixen@173-25-22-158.client.mchsi.com) |
| 07:05.14 | Shirik | I know what |
| 07:07.46 | *** join/#wowuidev kd3 (n=kd3@wikia/kaydeethree) |
| 07:15.41 | NightHawkAtWork | l |
| 07:15.45 | NightHawkAtWork | \quit |
| 07:15.57 | NightHawkTheSan1 | sighs |
| 07:16.42 | Shirik | epic failure |
| 07:16.47 | Shirik | \ != / |
| 07:16.52 | Shirik | \o/ |
| 07:16.59 | NightHawkTheSan1 | its past midnight, give me a break. :P |
| 07:17.37 | Shirik | It's 3:17 |
| 07:17.40 | Shirik | and I am coding C++ |
| 07:17.47 | Shirik | I don't want to hear your complaints |
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| 07:19.21 | NightHawkTheSan1 | well.. stop listening? :P |
| 07:19.27 | NightHawkTheSan1 | NightHawkAtWork: just testing... |
| 07:19.32 | NightHawkAtWork | l |
| 07:19.37 | Shirik | m |
| 07:19.41 | NightHawkTheSan1 | dammit, irssi != bash >< |
| 07:19.48 | Shirik | It's ok |
| 07:19.54 | Shirik | I find myself typing :wq into bash these days |
| 07:20.48 | Jerub | loser. |
| 07:20.56 | Jerub | ZZ is how to save and quit from vim, everyone knows that. |
| 07:21.23 | Jerub | NightHawkTheSan1: set -o vi |
| 07:21.25 | Shirik | nah |
| 07:21.26 | Shirik | :wq |
| 07:21.34 | WobWork | faster =) |
| 07:21.56 | Shirik | ZZ is more difficult |
| 07:22.00 | Shirik | because it's a repititon |
| 07:22.05 | Shirik | :wq can be typed very quickly |
| 07:22.11 | WobWork | it's the microseconds that count! |
| 07:22.15 | Shirik | yup |
| 07:22.15 | Jerub | Shirik: : requires shifting and unshifting. |
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| 07:22.25 | Shirik | So, it's a separate hand |
| 07:22.32 | WobWork | you basically roll the keyboard |
| 07:22.34 | Shirik | yup |
| 07:23.10 | msoul | WobWork: left the guild earlier today... you probably will laugh put "officers has more prio than anyone else when it comes to loot" |
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| 07:23.20 | msoul | the officers are friends and brother in law |
| 07:23.48 | Jerub | msoul: I applaud you for leaving that guild. |
| 07:24.02 | msoul | Jerub: hehe |
| 07:24.04 | WobWork | dittos |
| 07:24.09 | WobWork | a good move imo |
| 07:24.16 | Adys | [10:22:17] <Jerub> Shirik: : requires shifting and unshifting. |
| 07:24.18 | Adys | not here it doesnt |
| 07:24.24 | Adys | get a better layout |
| 07:24.32 | Shirik | and |
| 07:24.34 | Adys | <zxcvbn!.:/ |
| 07:24.34 | Shirik | you can remap : |
| 07:24.38 | msoul | yeah, i wish they ask why i left "check your loot prio idiot" would be my answer |
| 07:24.39 | Jerub | i use a default layout, just with esc and caps swapped |
| 07:25.08 | WobWork | msoul: eh, screw them, don't start caring about what they think now =) |
| 07:25.19 | WobWork | You're better off not in that guild |
| 07:25.32 | Fisker | slaps WobWork around a bit with a large trout |
| 07:25.35 | Fisker | oops |
| 07:25.38 | Fisker | whatcha gonna do now |
| 07:25.38 | msoul | WobWork: you're absolutely right, i applied to join one guild nowconverge one of the good/respectful guilds on kazzak |
| 07:25.48 | msoul | converge |
| 07:26.07 | Fisker | that's what i thought |
| 07:28.54 | Fisker | takes off his shirt |
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| 07:35.04 | Shirik | WobWork |
| 07:35.07 | Shirik | would you let me join your guild? |
| 07:36.58 | Kalroth | poor guild! |
| 07:37.03 | Shirik | :( |
| 07:37.04 | ccox | shirik - how many 386 cores could you fit on a modern die? |
| 07:37.18 | Shirik | I don't know, probably a lot (assuming you shrunk it) |
| 07:37.53 | ccox | assuming a process shrink |
| 07:37.59 | Shirik | let's see, 386 was a 1.5um process |
| 07:38.16 | Jerub | modern silicon chips are much smaller than the old days aren't they? |
| 07:38.21 | ccox | 275000 gates |
| 07:38.36 | ccox | yes, 1.5 u |
| 07:38.36 | Shirik | current ones are a 32nm process |
| 07:38.44 | ccox | but just count the gates |
| 07:38.51 | Shirik | where are you finding that info? |
| 07:39.08 | ccox | google |
| 07:39.14 | Shirik | oh |
| 07:39.27 | Jerub | i mean, the die |
| 07:39.28 | ccox | core i7 is 774 to 820M gates |
| 07:39.32 | Shirik | lua> 1.5 / .032 |
| 07:39.33 | lua_bot | Shirik: 46.875 |
| 07:39.38 | Shirik | hm that can't be right |
| 07:39.43 | ccox | the die is about the same area, maybe larger, but the features are smaller |
| 07:39.56 | Shirik | lua> 820000000 / 275000 |
| 07:39.56 | lua_bot | Shirik: 2981.8181818182 |
| 07:39.59 | Shirik | nice |
| 07:40.20 | ccox | now, the cache and bus control would add to the gate count |
| 07:40.24 | Shirik | right |
| 07:40.27 | Shirik | that's not entirely a fair comparison |
| 07:40.30 | ccox | (and bus control would be a nightmare) |
| 07:40.40 | Shirik | they've also done some really complex changes to the architecture for pipelining |
| 07:40.46 | ccox | plus you need thermal management per core, etc. |
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| 07:41.17 | Shirik | However |
| 07:41.21 | Shirik | I think you could probably fit at least 1000 |
| 07:41.29 | ccox | but even if it were just 200 independent cores - you have no great way to program them |
| 07:41.33 | Shirik | yeah |
| 07:41.43 | ccox | the parallelism constructs just aren't there yet |
| 07:41.51 | Shirik | well think about this |
| 07:41.54 | ccox | even OpenCL and friends aren't looking at more than 64 cores or so |
| 07:41.56 | Shirik | instead of the OS needing to context switch |
| 07:42.02 | Shirik | it just assigns cores |
| 07:42.20 | nevcairiel | that still makes every individual app pretty slow |
| 07:42.27 | nevcairiel | or threat, for that matter |
| 07:42.34 | nevcairiel | you can run lots of them |
| 07:42.37 | nevcairiel | just not very fast |
| 07:42.54 | Shirik | do you really think you need that kind of power? |
| 07:42.58 | Shirik | Very few apps today are CPU bound |
| 07:43.13 | Shirik | and, fine, we can do something like what we do with cache |
| 07:43.18 | Shirik | we keep one or two cores at 3 GHz |
| 07:43.30 | Shirik | then we have 100 386-class processors |
| 07:43.34 | nevcairiel | L1 cores and L2 cores? :P |
| 07:43.36 | Shirik | yes |
| 07:43.46 | ccox | but some are compute bound, and could use that kind of parallelism (raytracing will always be there :-) |
| 07:44.06 | Shirik | I totally agree with the need for that parallelism |
| 07:44.23 | Shirik | I'm just saying we don't need them to be at 3GHz with blazing, complex architectures |
| 07:44.24 | ccox | heterogenous cores -- talked about by many, but there are no good answers (and no schedulers in sight) |
| 07:44.34 | Shirik | I don't even want to think about trying to schedule that |
| 07:44.41 | Shirik | it already sounds like a nightmare |
| 07:44.43 | ccox | some tasks are serial, and need the single core speed |
| 07:45.01 | ccox | OpenCL starts to do that - scheduling CPUs and GPUs at the same time |
| 07:45.46 | Shirik | ROBOT CHICKEN |
| 07:45.47 | Shirik | YOU FAIL |
| 07:46.02 | Shirik | They said the "c" in E=mc^2 stands for "the speed of light in a vacuum" |
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| 07:46.22 | Shirik | Everyone knows the speed of light is a universal constant. This is the entire concept behind relativity. |
| 07:46.23 | ccox | it's a comedy show, they can make it stand for chickenn if they want to |
| 07:46.35 | ccox | um, no, the constant part is still debated |
| 07:46.44 | Shirik | nah |
| 07:46.47 | Shirik | screw all those disbelievers |
| 07:46.57 | ccox | no way to prove it yet - but some folks debate it |
| 07:47.07 | nevcairiel | Shirik, its not wrong saying its the speed of light in a vacuum .. its just not completly accurate :P |
| 07:47.09 | ccox | (dude, if it's not constant, I can build a warp drive) |
| 07:47.13 | Shirik | nevcairiel: true |
| 07:47.32 | Shirik | I still think there should be some way of doing faster-than-light-travel at some point in time |
| 07:47.38 | Shirik | surely not while I'm alive |
| 07:47.43 | nevcairiel | hyperspace! |
| 07:47.45 | nevcairiel | :D |
| 07:47.56 | Shirik | but it's going to involve some really strange shit like entering the 33rd dimension |
| 07:48.00 | Shirik | which, btw, has been proven to exist |
| 07:48.10 | Shirik | at least according to my math teacher whom claims to have taken a course in which it was proven |
| 07:48.24 | Shirik | I didn't bother trying to understand |
| 07:48.50 | NightHawkTheSan1 | er, "c" IS the speed of light in a vacuum, because light traveling through other mediums can change its speed.... |
| 07:49.08 | Shirik | ? no |
| 07:49.12 | ccox | um, last I checked we were looking at 12 to 19 dimensions for the latest string theories |
| 07:49.15 | Shirik | I mean, yes, it is the speed of light in a vacuum |
| 07:49.17 | Shirik | but |
| 07:49.20 | ccox | I don't recall any of them going to 33 |
| 07:49.27 | Shirik | it's the speed of light everywhere else too |
| 07:49.35 | Shirik | ccox: I'm just relaying information that I have no clue how to comprehend |
| 07:49.43 | ccox | no, the speed of light changes -- hence the index of refraction |
| 07:49.53 | ccox | light moves slower in a medium than in a vacuum |
| 07:49.57 | nevcairiel | at least wikipedia agrees on that |
| 07:50.00 | Shirik | hm |
| 07:50.01 | ccox | C is the speed of light in a vacuum |
| 07:50.09 | Shirik | how can that be possible |
| 07:50.10 | nevcairiel | "the speed at which light and all electromagnetic radiation travel in a perfect vacuum" |
| 07:50.14 | Shirik | ah well |
| 07:50.18 | Shirik | fine, robot chicken wins this round |
| 07:50.24 | Shirik | I'm not a physicist! |
| 07:51.44 | ccox | I am |
| 07:52.20 | Shirik | svnsync: The requested report is unknown. |
| 07:52.22 | Shirik | o.o |
| 07:52.26 | nevcairiel | lol |
| 07:52.28 | Shirik | Tally another 'wtf' at my school |
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| 07:56.48 | ccox | 8088 - 27000 transistors |
| 07:57.03 | ccox | but I doubt you could scale that design |
| 07:59.16 | ccox | 32nm process from intel, looking at 1.9 billion transistors |
| 07:59.21 | ccox | per die |
| 08:00.01 | ccox | NVidia GPU - 2.4 billion transisitors per die |
| 08:00.15 | Shirik | tbh |
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| 08:00.25 | Shirik | if designed intelligently, there could be some reuse too |
| 08:00.37 | Shirik | so it's not like 2x 386 is 2x 2700 |
| 08:00.40 | Shirik | 27000* |
| 08:00.46 | ccox | yep |
| 08:01.04 | ccox | but, for scheduling it's easier if they are independent and only touch at the buss |
| 08:01.39 | ccox | you could have 2 share an FP unit or something - but that complicates the internal scheduling of each core |
| 08:01.45 | Shirik | well I was thinking of more global things |
| 08:01.54 | Shirik | such as clock management, power management |
| 08:02.10 | Shirik | come to think of it |
| 08:02.14 | Shirik | is the clock controlled by the cpu? |
| 08:02.17 | ccox | power management is now thermal management - needs to be more local |
| 08:02.18 | Shirik | or is that suppled by the motherboard? |
| 08:02.28 | Shirik | I should probably know this |
| 08:02.30 | ccox | clock could be locallly scaled, but usually global |
| 08:02.45 | ccox | othwerise inter-core synchronization becomes a bitch |
| 08:02.53 | Shirik | yah |
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| 08:29.52 | tem | need moar ideas for feral ap addon |
| 08:29.58 | tem | name |
| 08:31.46 | Kalroth | feral ap addon? what does it do |
| 08:32.25 | tem | gets rid of it or at least makes it less conspicuous on weapons where it doesn't matter |
| 08:32.26 | tem | like one handeded anythings |
| 08:32.31 | tem | or weapons with spell power |
| 08:32.40 | Kalroth | Aha |
| 08:32.46 | Kalroth | Feralizer! |
| 08:32.57 | tem | more like Unferalizer |
| 08:33.07 | Kalroth | Notferal |
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| 08:33.48 | tem | I think I'm actually going to use Unferalizer for now |
| 08:34.20 | _rane | I'd go for Unferal |
| 08:34.26 | industrial | tem: Industrial, as its like the opposite of Feral |
| 08:34.27 | industrial | ;p |
| 08:34.45 | industrial | (I'm so creative) |
| 08:35.00 | tem | hmm |
| 08:35.02 | tem | Unferal |
| 08:35.03 | Kalroth | Feralfix |
| 08:35.04 | tem | I like that |
| 08:35.09 | *** join/#wowuidev smcn_ (i=smcn@67.166.76.157) |
| 08:35.28 | Kalroth | You have to think alphabetical letter position too! |
| 08:35.35 | Kalroth | like Aaaunferal |
| 08:35.40 | Kalroth | or !!Unferal |
| 08:35.54 | tem | why do I need that crap? |
| 08:35.59 | Kalroth | So you're on top! |
| 08:36.24 | tem | the answer is no one needs that crap |
| 08:36.25 | tem | ever. |
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| 09:06.29 | tem | Anyone around that plays on a non-english client? |
| 09:08.53 | Sesshu | yh |
| 09:09.14 | tem | do me a favor and /dump GetAuctionItemSubClasses(1) |
| 09:09.45 | tem | you should get a list with weapon types. I want to make sure it has the same order as the english client which is: |
| 09:10.30 | tem | One hand axes, 2 hand axes, guns, 1h maces, 2h maces, polearms, 1h swords, 2h swords, staves, fist weapons, misc, daggers, thrown, crossbows, wands, fishing poles |
| 09:11.15 | Sesshu | k one moment |
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| 09:12.44 | Sesshu | yes it is the same order |
| 09:13.04 | Sesshu | you forgot the bows |
| 09:13.48 | tem | bows right before guns? |
| 09:13.54 | Sesshu | yes |
| 09:13.57 | tem | I did skip them in my list because I suck |
| 09:14.03 | tem | What language is your client, btw? |
| 09:14.11 | Sesshu | german |
| 09:14.28 | tem | Thanks! |
| 09:14.33 | Sesshu | np :) |
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| 09:25.39 | Fisker | you |
| 09:30.02 | Sesshu | who? |
| 09:31.11 | Gnarfoz | no u |
| 09:31.16 | Sesshu | :( |
| 09:32.57 | Fisker | loves Gnarfoz |
| 09:33.07 | Gnarfoz | oozes all over Fisker |
| 09:33.07 | Fisker | Order Status: In Progress |
| 09:33.09 | Fisker | STOP IIIIIIT |
| 09:33.24 | Gnarfoz | Order Status: Sent |
| 09:33.29 | Gnarfoz | no way back now, mon |
| 09:33.48 | Gnarfoz | Fisker's gonna be a troll rogue, soon, amirite |
| 09:33.52 | Fisker | no |
| 09:33.58 | Gnarfoz | yeeees |
| 09:34.07 | Fisker | no |
| 09:34.15 | Sesshu | spam |
| 09:34.17 | Fisker | if i were to race change i'd race change to a blood elf |
| 09:35.25 | Gnarfoz | wut, from mainstream ud rogue to mainstream belf? |
| 09:38.15 | Kalroth | it's Fisker |
| 09:38.17 | Fisker | just more a question of everything looking shit on undead, trolls and to an extent orcs |
| 09:38.26 | Kalroth | he's a Ret Paladin |
| 09:38.32 | Fisker | your mom is a ret paladin |
| 09:38.34 | Fisker | in your butt |
| 09:38.41 | Fisker | game set and match |
| 09:39.02 | Kalroth | so she's poor class in my butt?! |
| 09:40.13 | Fisker | yes |
| 09:40.38 | Gnarfoz | Kalroth: Fisker and I are very alike |
| 09:41.00 | Gnarfoz | both originally Rogues, reborn Paladins, now finding the time to level/gear their rogues again |
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| 09:41.03 | Kalroth | Gnarfoz: I'm sorry to hear that. |
| 09:41.04 | Gnarfoz | it's scary, really |
| 09:41.14 | Gnarfoz | Kalroth: yeah, sometimes I'm not sure what to think of it, either |
| 09:41.25 | nevcairiel | wtf, now i have a fisker to the north and one to the south |
| 09:41.28 | nevcairiel | they are everywhere |
| 09:41.47 | Gnarfoz | nevcairiel: you are sorrounded |
| 09:42.12 | Gnarfoz | actually, surrounded |
| 09:42.20 | Gnarfoz | nevcairiel: Hamburg, right? |
| 09:42.21 | Fisker | your mom is a goblin to the south |
| 09:42.21 | Fisker | irl |
| 09:42.23 | nevcairiel | yea |
| 09:42.27 | Fisker | even though you said Fisker |
| 09:42.35 | Fisker | which is irrelevant |
| 09:42.41 | Fisker | my hair is also a bird |
| 09:42.42 | Fisker | so |
| 09:42.50 | Gnarfoz | your mom is wearing a Fisker t-shirt |
| 09:43.44 | Fisker | your mom is wearing a "I got banged by Fisker and all i got was this lousy t-shirt" t-shirt |
| 09:43.56 | Gnarfoz | I'm quite certain of it |
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| 10:26.23 | Grum | anyone here from the UK? where would you go to get a custom pc build from parts you pick? and is there any sort of proper price comparison site which happens to refer to these shops? |
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| 10:28.59 | A-KO | I highly doubt it |
| 10:29.06 | A-KO | if I were you, I'd go something like Dell :P |
| 10:29.13 | A-KO | you'll get close to what you want for a similar cost |
| 10:31.15 | Gnarfoz | how can you even suggest something like Dell ;\ |
| 10:31.22 | A-KO | how couldn't I? |
| 10:31.40 | A-KO | for someone who has no idea what they're doing, who would have very limited options for support |
| 10:32.19 | A-KO | http://www1.euro.dell.com/uk/en/home/Desktops/xpsdt_630/pd.aspx?refid=xpsdt_630&s=dhs&cs=ukdhs1 |
| 10:34.55 | A-KO | Particularly what he asked for is something that's not available--there aren't any websites that do comparisons of all the little shops and large shops that build PCs for people |
| 10:49.46 | *** join/#wowuidev kd3 (n=kd3@wikia/kaydeethree) |
| 10:54.13 | *** join/#wowuidev Sixen1 (n=Sixen@173-25-22-158.client.mchsi.com) |
| 10:55.44 | Grum | A-KO: i'd use that page to browse around |
| 10:55.59 | Grum | the problem is that right now there doesnt seem to be any register for these kinds of shops so i cant find *any* |
| 10:57.29 | nevcairiel | thats why i build the systems myself :/ |
| 10:57.50 | nevcairiel | plus i don't want to pay some idiot to do what i can do as good myself =p |
| 11:00.16 | Grum | i do the same |
| 11:00.28 | Grum | i'm just looking for something for a guild who's pc burned down last night |
| 11:00.35 | Grum | without actual fire sadly |
| 11:19.15 | Fisker | slaps nevcairiel around a bit with a large trout |
| 11:19.15 | Fisker | slaps Grum around a bit with a large trout |
| 11:19.19 | Fisker | slaps Gnarfoz around a bit with a large trout |
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| 11:31.43 | *** mode/#wowuidev [+v Cide] by ChanServ |
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| 12:35.28 | *** mode/#wowuidev [+v Lopeppeppy] by ChanServ |
| 12:38.10 | mikma | http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XyN2t_I613Y&feature=fvst#t=5m45s |
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| 12:44.03 | Gnarfoz | <A-KO> Particularly what he asked for is something that's not available--there aren't any websites that do comparisons of all the little shops and large shops that build PCs for people <-- there isn't for the UK? sucks to be there, then I guess, because there's several sites like that for Germany ;o |
| 12:44.52 | Fisker | slaps Gnarfoz around a bit with a large trout |
| 12:45.06 | Gnarfoz | I be slap'd |
| 12:45.27 | Fisker | yes |
| 12:45.40 | Fisker | i call myself the slapperer |
| 12:48.31 | Lopeppeppy | Ackis, PING already! |
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| 12:51.17 | Fisker | it would appear that my gruesome wishes came true Lopeppeppy :( |
| 12:53.36 | Lopeppeppy | You are in big trouble boy. |
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| 13:10.57 | *** join/#wowuidev Jiminizer (n=jiminize@jiminizer.plus.com) |
| 13:12.45 | olafski | ackis has fallen to the addiction of the xbox 360 |
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| 13:15.48 | *** join/#wowuidev Sixen (n=Sixen@173-25-22-158.client.mchsi.com) |
| 13:23.27 | Lopeppeppy | I see him posting his game achievements, so I know he's okay, just ignoring me! |
| 13:25.40 | olafski | I see him coming online on xbox live more often than anyone else ;) |
| 13:26.53 | Kraps | i cant find the whistle to summon the oracle pet |
| 13:45.07 | *** join/#wowuidev audible (n=chatzill@212.20.222.174) |
| 13:45.54 | audible | quick question, i would like to be able to parse my inventory and decide whats food and drink and place it accordingly, |
| 13:46.03 | audible | one way of doing this was to read the tooltip text |
| 13:46.10 | audible | are there any easier solutionss? |
| 13:47.00 | Lopeppeppy | Iterate through a list? *wrinkles nose* I think the tooltip is likely easier. |
| 13:47.54 | audible | well, pressing a button and sorting my bags isnt too much of a performance drop |
| 13:48.15 | audible | thing was i just didnt understand how to parse tooptips |
| 13:48.19 | audible | :) |
| 13:48.44 | Bruners | audible: you want to split food and drink or just place "food and drink" the same place? |
| 13:48.58 | audible | split food and drink |
| 13:49.03 | Wobin | audible: use PeriodicTable to figure out the food and drinks |
| 13:49.39 | Wobin | just extract out the food and drink from PT and use that alone =) |
| 13:50.05 | audible | i never heard of periodic table |
| 13:50.12 | audible | wowwiki didnt return anything |
| 13:50.33 | Bruners | @project periodictable |
| 13:50.35 | Repo | Bruners: No project found that matches 'periodictable' |
| 13:51.03 | Bruners | @project libperiodictable |
| 13:51.04 | Repo | Bruners: No project found that matches 'libperiodictable' |
| 13:53.11 | audible | thank you anyway, it give me a kick in the right direction |
| 13:53.15 | Elkano | @project libperiodictable_3_1 |
| 13:53.17 | Repo | Elkano: No project found that matches 'libperiodictable_3_1' |
| 13:53.23 | Pneumatus^ | try libperiodictable-3-1 |
| 13:53.23 | Elkano | hmm |
| 13:53.30 | Elkano | @project libperiodictable-3-1 |
| 13:53.31 | Repo | Elkano: http://www.wowace.com/addons/libperiodictable-3-1/. LibPeriodicTable-3.1. Game: WoW. Nymbia (Manager/Author), Azethoth (Author), Elkano (Author). Updated: 3 hours ago |
| 13:53.36 | Elkano | ^^ |
| 13:55.24 | *** join/#wowuidev Hjalte (n=chatzill@cpe.ge-0-2-0-835.arcnqu2.customer.tele.dk) |
| 14:01.21 | audible | thank you |
| 14:04.27 | mikma | http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bwJgA_cdaTs&feature=related |
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| 14:25.26 | Kraps | the brewfest relay is sweet, especially when i found the apple barrels |
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| 14:29.33 | *** mode/#wowuidev [+o Seerah] by ChanServ |
| 14:34.52 | Lopeppeppy | Ackis. I ping you one last time, then I barbeque your feet. |
| 14:35.06 | Wobin | Kraps: it's the only way it's worth doing =P |
| 14:35.20 | Kraps | Wobin: yep |
| 14:37.10 | Ackis | Lopeppeppy: this is the first ping I've seen my dear |
| 14:37.22 | Ackis | I haven't been on IRC since thursday |
| 14:37.42 | nevcairiel | man, i really would've liked some barbequed feet |
| 14:39.01 | Fisker | Ackismen |
| 14:42.13 | Lopeppeppy | You have too been on IRC, just not reading it! :P |
| 14:42.51 | Ackis | nope |
| 14:43.00 | Ackis | ZNC connection |
| 14:43.07 | Ackis | I'm here even when I don't have a client connected |
| 14:43.15 | Lopeppeppy | Yuh-huh, I've seen you in that column all weekend, brat. means you're here. |
| 14:43.25 | Ackis | :P |
| 14:52.15 | *** join/#wowuidev Kaso (n=Kaso@host86-145-163-1.range86-145.btcentralplus.com) |
| 14:59.53 | Kaso | Why does the wow client give direct support URLs when said URLs redirect to the central support index |
| 15:00.18 | Lopeppeppy | The redirects happened after the client happened? |
| 15:01.08 | Kaso | they update the client every few months, and im sure its been redirecting like that since long before the latest patch or two |
| 15:02.14 | Lopeppeppy | So? The redirect works, why change anything? |
| 15:03.55 | Kaso | Well its not very good from a usability perspective to force my to navigate around their site, finding the WoW support section and tracking down my particular error when the client new exactly the error and is trying to take me directly to the information i need |
| 15:05.33 | theorbtwo | Kaso: For what little it's worth, I quite agree. |
| 15:06.11 | Shirik | :/ |
| 15:06.17 | Kaso | Also it doesnt help that the URLs the client give arent clickable ;p |
| 15:06.28 | Kaso | so i spend 30sec copying it out only to find it was pointless |
| 15:06.32 | Shirik | I almost sent an email to one of my professors with the greeting "Hell Dr. Brixius" instead of "Hello Dr. Brixius" |
| 15:06.41 | Lopeppeppy | :) |
| 15:06.51 | Shirik | those two words are way too close to each other |
| 15:07.35 | Wobin | Shirik: You should have started it: "OHAI Dr Brixius" |
| 15:08.47 | nevcairiel | was it a complaining mail, too? |
| 15:08.53 | nevcairiel | hell would be perfect then! |
| 15:09.24 | Kaso | Also it doesn't help that the error im having is ridiculously vague, and the support site offers no support that can help. >< |
| 15:09.35 | *** join/#wowuidev olafski (n=egrimm@dream.student.utwente.nl) |
| 15:09.45 | Wobin | GURU MEDITATION ERROR |
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| 15:20.54 | Fisker | slaps Shirik around a bit with a large trout |
| 15:20.54 | Fisker | slaps Wobin around a bit with a large trout |
| 15:20.55 | Fisker | slaps nevcairiel around a bit with a large trout |
| 15:21.01 | Fisker | SLAPPING SPREE |
| 15:21.08 | Lopeppeppy | foolish mortal |
| 15:21.09 | nevcairiel | you know, x-chat has no slap button |
| 15:21.16 | nevcairiel | how weird is that |
| 15:23.04 | Lopeppeppy | Astra doesn't have a "send message" option. |
| 15:24.11 | Lopeppeppy | I must "query" instead. |
| 15:24.39 | nevcairiel | thats the same thing =p |
| 15:25.26 | nevcairiel | a privmsg usually opens a query window anyway |
| 15:25.51 | Kaelten | g'morning |
| 15:26.47 | Lopeppeppy | Query is something you ask, not something you tell. |
| 15:27.43 | Gnarfoz | yeah yeah, he's still right. |
| 15:27.53 | Gnarfoz | anyway, who stole my server :\ |
| 15:28.09 | Lopeppeppy | I am wicked tired of all the OMG Obama! coverage already. |
| 15:28.14 | Lopeppeppy | I want him to go home. |
| 15:28.15 | Kraps | what do people mean when they talk about the "summon" to diredrew? |
| 15:28.25 | nevcairiel | Kraps, the remote. |
| 15:28.53 | Kraps | thats what i thought, a guy said no :/ |
| 15:29.35 | Lopeppeppy | I suppose you could be in the instance and summon people in. |
| 15:29.54 | nevcairiel | i suppose |
| 15:30.04 | nevcairiel | thats always possible |
| 15:30.43 | nevcairiel | man i need some good movie to watch |
| 15:31.05 | Lopeppeppy | Shadow of the Vampire |
| 15:31.07 | Shirik | ~ping |
| 15:31.07 | purl | ~pong |
| 15:31.21 | Kraps | good as in... |
| 15:33.54 | Wobin | <PROTECTED> |
| 15:37.55 | *** join/#wowuidev Tepel (n=Tepel@217.120.68.90) |
| 15:38.05 | Wobin | mikma: http://www.l4dmods.com/index.php?option=com_content&view=article&id=250:left-4-teletubbies-even-the-teletubbies-have-been-infected&catid=2:news&Itemid=13 |
| 15:38.40 | nicoli_s | thats awesome wobin, ive been meaning to try out some of the custom l4d stuff |
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| 15:50.10 | *** mode/#wowuidev [+v Cide] by ChanServ |
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| 16:01.32 | *** join/#wowuidev Lunessa (n=Lunessa@WoWUIDev/Lunessa) |
| 16:03.25 | Shirik | AHAHAHAHA |
| 16:03.32 | Shirik | I found out why I'm having so much trouble with my school's SVN |
| 16:03.41 | Shirik | "Powered by Subversion version 1.1.4 (r13838)." |
| 16:03.43 | Shirik | Holy crap |
| 16:04.06 | Shadowed | well |
| 16:04.08 | Shadowed | that's only 0.5 out of date thats less than half of one! |
| 16:04.18 | Shadowed | er, that's only half of one |
| 16:04.28 | *** join/#wowuidev Tepel (n=Tepel@cc624207-a.gorre1.fr.home.nl) |
| 16:04.29 | Shirik | Yeah, but it explains why every single operation I try to do is failing |
| 16:05.34 | Lopeppeppy | Sometimes half a donut can really mess up a system. |
| 16:07.57 | nevcairiel | subversion 1.1? |
| 16:07.59 | nevcairiel | holy cow |
| 16:08.35 | Shirik | I'm going to contact Atlassian and apologize to them |
| 16:08.36 | *** join/#wowuidev Tepel (n=Tepel@cc624207-a.gorre1.fr.home.nl) |
| 16:08.46 | nevcairiel | the more recent clients even tend to break compat with those old servers |
| 16:08.54 | nevcairiel | no wonder your shit crashes |
| 16:09.00 | Shirik | I've had a support request open with them for about 3 days now and they're totally confused |
| 16:09.02 | Shirik | I'm sure this is why |
| 16:09.45 | nevcairiel | thats a safe bet =p |
| 16:11.49 | Gnarfoz | how old is 1.1.x? lol |
| 16:12.07 | nevcairiel | they probably run some very old debian stable and just installed what came with it =P |
| 16:12.33 | Gnarfoz | hehe |
| 16:13.00 | mikma | wobwork: that's hilarious |
| 16:13.21 | nevcairiel | 2005-04-05 |
| 16:13.25 | nevcairiel | 1.1.4 release ^ |
| 16:14.11 | Shirik | no nevcairiel |
| 16:14.15 | Shirik | they're probably just lazy |
| 16:14.19 | Shirik | if nobody cares, they won't upgrade it |
| 16:15.18 | nevcairiel | 5 years ago .. i think i was still using CVS back then :P |
| 16:17.24 | Gnarfoz | I hadn't even heard of WoW, then |
| 16:18.34 | nevcairiel | and i was already playing it =/ |
| 16:19.02 | nevcairiel | I started sept. 2004 or so in US closed beta |
| 16:19.39 | *** join/#wowuidev Synpra (n=Synpra@75.80.16.10) |
| 16:26.03 | Ackis | I'm on the xbox forums... and actually having an intelligent debate with someone |
| 16:26.07 | Ackis | I'm amazed |
| 16:27.06 | *** join/#wowuidev foxlit (n=foxlit@0x573e6bae.alb2nxx18.dynamic.dsl.tele.dk) |
| 16:27.30 | Lopeppeppy | ... screenshot or it didn't happen |
| 16:27.58 | Gnarfoz | sup |
| 16:28.14 | Gnarfoz | anyone remember what Teza's site was called before World of Raids came to be? |
| 16:30.08 | *** join/#wowuidev Srosh (n=Srosh@c155008.adsl.hansenet.de) |
| 16:31.58 | Shirik | ok bye |
| 16:32.56 | ScytheBlade1 | http://www.theonion.com/content/news/george_w_bush_chuckles_to_self?utm_source=onion_rss_daily |
| 16:33.13 | *** join/#wowuidev AnduinLothar (n=KarlKFI@WoWUIDev/Cosmos/AnduinLothar) |
| 16:33.13 | *** mode/#wowuidev [+v AnduinLothar] by ChanServ |
| 16:33.45 | Slafsinator | Gnarfoz: wasn't it cursegaming or something? |
| 16:34.11 | Gnarfoz | Slafsinator: well, of course he was in Curse then, but he had a stand-alone site at some point, before WoR |
| 16:34.19 | Slafsinator | yes |
| 16:36.32 | Shadowed | Hrm, when you login in combat are you considered to be in combat lockdown immediately or do you have a small window before the secure system becomes locked down? |
| 16:38.08 | Lopeppeppy | I've always been locked immediately. YMMV depending on how fast your computer/network is. :) |
| 16:38.50 | ScytheBlade1 | There is a window between P_E_W and the combat starting event |
| 16:38.52 | Shadowed | If you were locked immediately, wouldn't things like registering state drivers fail on logging in and basically break unit frames completely |
| 16:38.55 | nevcairiel | its not "immediately", you can of course do initialisation work |
| 16:39.00 | Shadowed | excellent |
| 16:39.05 | ScytheBlade1 | for proof of this, note how grid works after an in-combat reload |
| 16:39.14 | Lopeppeppy | Shadowed, I have often had my unit frames not work properly when I log in during combat. |
| 16:39.23 | nevcairiel | wasnt grid the addon that never works on compat-login? :P |
| 16:39.27 | nevcairiel | *combat |
| 16:39.35 | ScytheBlade1 | always worked great for me |
| 16:39.37 | Shadowed | Lopeppeppy: Depends what unit frames you use too |
| 16:40.01 | Shadowed | my wacky method for splitting raid frames into 8 headers and dynamically positioning them should work then :< |
| 16:41.21 | *** join/#wowuidev Doow (n=Miranda@unaffiliated/doow) |
| 16:43.14 | ScytheBlade1 | As long as you can set everything up inbetween PEW and the combat event, yes |
| 16:43.41 | *** join/#wowuidev Doow (n=Miranda@unaffiliated/doow) |
| 16:46.00 | Shadowed | I was thinking something like: Keep a table of the 8 headers, setup the headers to create everything as state unit watches, wrap button #1 with something that says when it's hidden to reposition the header that comes after it to the one it used to be parented to |
| 16:46.19 | Shadowed | slightly weird explanation, but just requires the OnAttributeChanged wrap to be set |
| 16:46.21 | Shadowed | hrm :> |
| 16:47.12 | Lunessa | Hrm indeed... |
| 16:47.44 | Shadowed | It is also somewhat elaborate just to make it look good in combat |
| 16:50.17 | *** join/#wowuidev Gotai (n=Gotai@ip503d59c0.speed.planet.nl) |
| 16:50.42 | Lopeppeppy | Just don't log in during combat, problem solved! :) |
| 16:51.09 | Lunessa | Actually the raid frames are one of the most annoying features to set up for SUF. But... worth fiddling with. |
| 16:51.18 | Shadowed | Annoying in what way Lunessa? |
| 16:52.06 | Lunessa | The thing that annoys me most is that groups collapse together. |
| 16:52.06 | *** join/#wowuidev soufron (n=soufron@did75-14-82-236-19-233.fbx.proxad.net) |
| 16:52.15 | Lunessa | And... No MT/MA units. |
| 16:52.35 | Shadowed | Actually there are MT/MA/MT ToT/MA ToT as of the push 5 days ago Lunessa :p |
| 16:53.00 | Gnarfoz | <nevcairiel> wasnt grid the addon that never works on compat-login? :P <-- only if you use bad additional Grid plugins. bare Grid always worked fine for me |
| 16:53.01 | Lunessa | I didn't see them, but I haven't fiddled with my raid set up in a few days. |
| 16:53.27 | Shadowed | The thing I was talking about a few minutes ago is related to the groups collapsing together thought, the reason I haven't done something to split them up yet is no good solution for groups changing in combat |
| 16:53.28 | Lunessa | And I did update on Saturday, so.. I'll set that up when I get home. :) |
| 16:53.51 | Shadowed | although, while it's true the odds of a group disappearing in combat are low I don't like the idea of it being a hack that only works OOC :p |
| 16:54.19 | Lunessa | Shadowed: Yeah, when I saw what the behavior was, I knew right away why you did it. But it does drive me nuts watching the groups expand and collapse based on where the raid leader sticks people. |
| 16:54.49 | Shadowed | I think I'll have time to play with the theory of the weekend, but if it works out I'll change it to switch between both |
| 16:55.08 | Shadowed | mostly a pain in the ass cause Macs don't let you launch two copies of WoW easily |
| 16:55.40 | Lunessa | Shadowed: Let me know if you need help testing. I have Windows Vista, and Mac OSX to play on. :P |
| 16:56.09 | Shadowed | Will do |
| 16:59.10 | Shadowed | and I am now just realizing that the party pet issue I've had for a while is more likely related to a small bit of wrapper code rather than something that required me to rewrite the system for positioning everything 50 times :< |
| 17:00.49 | Lunessa | Cool. 'cause that was another oddity that struck me. *snicker* |
| 17:01.14 | *** join/#wowuidev Sixen1 (n=Sixen@173-25-22-158.client.mchsi.com) |
| 17:01.18 | Shadowed | It's just a bug related to dynamically hiding pet frames when the owner enters vehicles most likely |
| 17:01.20 | Shadowed | stupid vehicles |
| 17:03.00 | Lunessa | Yeah. I noticed it playing my priest in ToC yesterday. |
| 17:03.47 | Shadowed | lua> local val = 1; if( val ) then print("true") end |
| 17:03.48 | lua_bot | Shadowed: true |
| 17:03.55 | Shadowed | lua> local val = 0; if( val ) then print("true") end |
| 17:03.55 | lua_bot | Shadowed: true |
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| 17:10.24 | *** join/#wowuidev soufron_ (n=soufron@vol75-1-81-57-79-123.fbx.proxad.net) |
| 17:11.31 | *** join/#wowuidev KarlKFI|work (n=chatzill@adcom005v.adcom.uci.edu) |
| 17:20.35 | foxlit | ffmpeg taunts me :( |
| 17:21.31 | *** join/#wowuidev alestane (n=Adium@c-66-30-209-28.hsd1.ma.comcast.net) |
| 17:21.31 | *** mode/#wowuidev [+v alestane] by ChanServ |
| 17:23.56 | Lopeppeppy | puts a scorching hot Pop-Tart down alestane's knickers. |
| 17:24.25 | alestane | runs around screaming and jumps into an ice cooler. |
| 17:24.46 | Lopeppeppy | I missed you! |
| 17:25.03 | foxlit | I'm right in thinking I can't ask securehandlers to wrap things from within the restricted environment? |
| 17:25.05 | *** join/#wowuidev Aelobin (n=Aelobin@81.170.77.25) |
| 17:25.23 | Shadowed | yes foxlit |
| 17:25.31 | Aelobin | morning y'all |
| 17:25.32 | alestane | foxlit: We've added state drivers, but right now I don't think wrapping is available inside. |
| 17:25.54 | Shadowed | wrapping secure code uses the _blah attributes which can't be called within the restricted env |
| 17:25.55 | Shadowed | if I recall |
| 17:26.10 | foxlit | Hm! |
| 17:26.23 | alestane | Not exactly, but it calls functions that aren't available inside. |
| 17:26.55 | Aelobin | msoul: ping? |
| 17:27.05 | Shadowed | Hrm I thought it was a bit of both, but either way! |
| 17:27.10 | alestane | One of the things I'd like to do is make a review of the secure infrastructure for Cataclysm, so if you have ideas for functionality that doesn't break the intent of the sandbox, let me know. |
| 17:27.31 | Shadowed | alestane: Remove it! |
| 17:28.11 | foxlit | <PROTECTED> |
| 17:28.23 | foxlit | saved by my inability to set frame references. Or, wait, I can. |
| 17:28.24 | alestane | Shadowed: That seems counter-productive. They won't be removing protection, so if we removed the sandbox you'd just lose all access to all such functions. |
| 17:28.25 | foxlit | Hah! |
| 17:28.34 | Shadowed | alestane: true :> |
| 17:28.50 | alestane | foxlit: What are you breaking now. |
| 17:28.57 | *** join/#wowuidev Awgy (n=Awgy@cpe-098-122-141-216.nc.res.rr.com) |
| 17:29.02 | foxlit | The same thing I break every patch, pinky :) |
| 17:29.11 | Dagmar | onoestheybesteelinmahfunkshuns |
| 17:29.20 | foxlit | I have an evil plan, and its name is SetScript. |
| 17:30.03 | alestane | I don't think that wrapping or unwrapping scripts fundamentally breaks the security model by itself. |
| 17:30.15 | Shadowed | I want to say there was something of the secure stuff that bugged me, but now I can't remember what :( |
| 17:30.22 | alestane | Keep in mind that SetScript preserves taint on its references. |
| 17:30.43 | foxlit | You cannot taint what is not there. |
| 17:32.14 | Shadowed | alestane: It would be nice if you could wrap secure code within the protected env from from initialConfigFunction from headers |
| 17:32.18 | Shadowed | that's the main thing thats annoying |
| 17:32.20 | foxlit | Anyway, I have a working prototype; it's just that without the ability to wrap things while in lockdown, it'd require an evil amount of frames. |
| 17:32.49 | Shadowed | what are you trying to do foxlit |
| 17:32.55 | alestane | Shadowed: I actually want to reevaluate the way headers create and configure units frames anyway. |
| 17:33.09 | Shadowed | That would be nice, although I haven't noticed it being a huge issue |
| 17:33.20 | Shadowed | it would be nice if it didn't show/hide units every RRU/PMC thought! |
| 17:33.41 | mikma | http://matin.maapallo.org/kuvatuuppari/sinfest/3279/20090921.gif |
| 17:33.55 | foxlit | Shadowed: nothing of value, fortunately. |
| 17:33.59 | alestane | I'm not sure how it could tell that no relevant change has taken place. |
| 17:35.19 | Shadowed | It could wait until it hides |
| 17:35.34 | Shadowed | Right now it hides the frame, sets the unit then shows it. Then it nils the unit attribute and hides any remaining frames |
| 17:36.19 | Dagmar | Then it waits for the right moment to strike |
| 17:37.19 | alestane | Shadowed: I'm not sure how much room there is to optimize those with the events we've got, but I can take a look sometime. |
| 17:39.08 | Shadowed | alestane: Yea I'm not sure how much of it is intended vs that's how it is. Would be nice if it was smarter to only update on a real change so it's not doing things like updating headers 40 times in AV... but I'm not sure how much complexity Blizzard wants to allow in it |
| 17:39.13 | Shadowed | well in the code to keep track |
| 17:39.16 | Shadowed | + breaking things |
| 17:39.43 | alestane | Optimization is a concern, but it has to be reasonable to achieve. |
| 17:40.05 | Adys | Mikk: quit spamming trade while Im not in it! |
| 17:40.34 | Mikk | But it was humor! |
| 17:40.41 | Mikk | Someone advertises that he pays 300g if the mount drops |
| 17:40.43 | Adys | but i wasnt in it :( |
| 17:40.48 | Adys | haha |
| 17:40.48 | Mikk | Someone else says that you pay more |
| 17:40.59 | Mikk | guy1 tells guy2 to STFU AND STOP QQING |
| 17:41.12 | Mikk | So I help and tell people about you some more |
| 17:41.12 | Adys | also I got my kodo now |
| 17:41.14 | Shadowed | Well, I think it could be done in a reasonable way, although I'm not really sure how you are supposed to test this kind of thing given you taint the secure code and make it not function anymore by doing so |
| 17:41.17 | Adys | so just need the ram |
| 17:41.35 | Shadowed | Actually the header stuff would still run up until the point where combat is entered wouldn't it? |
| 17:41.41 | Shadowed | with some trickery |
| 17:42.05 | Mikk | Adys: and how the heck did you know it was me? i was on a storage toon! |
| 17:42.30 | Adys | the guy whispered me saying it was "somethingkeeper" |
| 17:42.36 | Mikk | oh, yeah, i told you about that yesterday, go me :P |
| 17:42.48 | Adys | lol |
| 17:43.17 | *** join/#wowuidev Tepel (n=Tepel@cc624207-a.gorre1.fr.home.nl) |
| 17:48.02 | Bruners | haste: not sure if i signed, but in server queue and ready :P |
| 17:50.19 | *** join/#wowuidev tekkub (n=tekkub@WoWUIDev/WoWI/Featured/Dongle/GitHub/Tekkub) |
| 17:50.19 | *** mode/#wowuidev [+v tekkub] by ChanServ |
| 17:59.45 | *** join/#wowuidev Gryphon (n=gryphon@c-76-104-164-148.hsd1.wa.comcast.net) |
| 18:03.04 | cog|away | hmm... dell sent us a duplicate replacement SSD... To return, or not to return? /evil |
| 18:04.02 | Lunessa | *facapalm* People want the strangest things. |
| 18:04.57 | durcyn | Lunessa: just drop trou and close your eyes, it'll all be over soon |
| 18:05.42 | Lunessa | That's a lovely image durcyn. May I interest you in a great big serving of "that's not right"? |
| 18:05.50 | Dagmar | cog|away: It's Dell. |
| 18:05.57 | Dagmar | If they don't figure it out, too bad for them. |
| 18:06.09 | Dagmar | How much stuff have you ordered from them? |
| 18:06.20 | cog|away | Dagmar: "us" being the company i work for... |
| 18:06.24 | Dagmar | Yes. |
| 18:07.11 | Dagmar | It's my firm opinion that most of their "technical sales reps" would probably be working for collections agencies or timeshare sales if they weren't working for Dell. |
| 18:07.15 | durcyn | Lunessa: if you don't elaborate, other people will =P |
| 18:07.21 | Dagmar | So screw 'em |
| 18:07.44 | Dagmar | When I started working here I had to practically make threats to get the admins who were ordering equipment from them to stop listening to their lies |
| 18:08.13 | cog|away | Dagmar: this was a warranty claim not an order |
| 18:08.21 | cog|away | no sales reps involved |
| 18:08.38 | Dagmar | We'd be ordering a freaking ten thousand dollar 4U box, and they'd tell the admin that since the machine's configuration has 2Gb of RAM by default, that when they wanted it with 4Gb they'd have to take the 2Gb out but leave it on the bill, and then add and install the new 4Gb |
| 18:08.39 | cog|away | the replacement parts came next business day |
| 18:09.00 | cog|away | and the rep didn't make me go through hours of scripted diagnostics |
| 18:09.01 | Dagmar | Meaning when I was going through the parts room I noticed a box with at least 14 1Gb RAM sticks in it, and I wanted to know why |
| 18:09.15 | Lunessa | durcyn: Someone called from Galveston to complain that our school of computer engineering's software sales (discounted versions of applications for students) doesn't a) have a tech support number, and b) won't install software for them. |
| 18:09.25 | Dagmar | What they were telling our people was a blatant lie |
| 18:09.56 | Lopeppeppy | It's discounted. Now take it to the Geek Squad, Miss/ter Entitled! |
| 18:10.27 | durcyn | i'm assuming these are computer engineering students as well? |
| 18:10.30 | durcyn | expel them. |
| 18:10.36 | Dagmar | Yep. |
| 18:10.49 | Dagmar | If they can't install software themselves, someone's been sitting their exams for them |
| 18:11.38 | Lunessa | durcyn: No, this is someone in the education school, buying software for managing footnotes in her thesis. |
| 18:12.29 | Dagmar | So she's teaching computers but she can't install software? |
| 18:12.33 | Dagmar | F-i-r-e-d. |
| 18:12.47 | Seerah | ... EDUCATION school |
| 18:13.02 | Lopeppeppy | Them as cant |
| 18:13.09 | Lopeppeppy | Them as can't install, can sure whine about it. |
| 18:13.10 | Dagmar | Still fired. |
| 18:13.22 | Lunessa | She's probably teaching grade school since she called from a Galveston Independent School District office phone. |
| 18:13.34 | mikma | edumacation! |
| 18:13.35 | Dagmar | If you're working in anything that involves IT, and by which I mean if you have to use a computer, if you can't accomplish simple tasks on your own, you are not qualified for the job. |
| 18:13.36 | Codayus | Those poor kids. :-( |
| 18:13.42 | Dagmar | Period. |
| 18:14.12 | Lunessa | And they're 35 miles from here. But to hell with her and her complaints about getting a piece of software that owuld normally cost her $250-$400 for $10. |
| 18:14.14 | Dagmar | You might as well be expecting to continue to be employed when you can't read. |
| 18:15.00 | *** join/#wowuidev mojosdojo_ (n=gdbzet26@p4FEFFB97.dip.t-dialin.net) |
| 18:15.39 | Dagmar | Lunessa: Hey have you guys got Windows 7 on the menu yet over there? |
| 18:15.56 | *** join/#wowuidev Hjalte (n=chatzill@cpe.ge-0-2-0-835.arcnqu2.customer.tele.dk) |
| 18:16.20 | Lunessa | Dagmar: Yes, but the rollout is planned for anytime too soon seeing as we're /still/ upgrading boxes to Vista from XP/2003 |
| 18:16.41 | Dagmar | We've abandoned that here. |
| 18:16.56 | Dagmar | We're just flat out looking to fasttrack everything (particularly the Vista machines) to W7. |
| 18:17.18 | Lopeppeppy | I think my school is going to skip vista as well. |
| 18:17.23 | Dagmar | Our contractor who runs the software store here is being either lazy or stupid, I can't tell which. They've got the 32-bit version of Ultimate available, but not the 64-bit version |
| 18:17.24 | Lunessa | I'm expecting we'll be fast-tracking to W7 too, but the details haven't been worked out. |
| 18:17.37 | Dagmar | I'm a bit baffled ebcause I was under the impression that version only had one licence that did both |
| 18:18.15 | Dagmar | Kinda annoys me since Microsoft was swearing the RC would stay valid for months after release |
| 18:18.34 | Dagmar | ...but now that's looking like that might not be the case. I gotta secure a licence for hom that isn't gimpy "home premium" |
| 18:18.38 | Dagmar | s/hom/home/; |
| 18:20.58 | Lunessa | I'm trying to make sure that *I* can use our license. |
| 18:21.00 | *** join/#wowuidev Recluse_ (n=me@71.145.156.119) |
| 18:21.02 | *** join/#wowuidev Tepel (n=Tepel@cc624207-a.gorre1.fr.home.nl) |
| 18:21.15 | Dagmar | Frankly, I wish the normal "You don't ask an auto mechanic to work on a kid's tricycle" answer would work with these people |
| 18:22.04 | Dagmar | Certain factions within the building are convinced that everyone simply MUST know how to administer Windows machines |
| 18:22.21 | Dagmar | It's a shame they don't hold the people who are actually supposed to be running the Windows machines to that |
| 18:22.23 | Lopeppeppy | Like it's inbred or something. |
| 18:22.35 | Dagmar | Us Unix guys have no problems when you throw us at anything |
| 18:22.43 | Lunessa | This person annoyed me because she a) didn't want to look at the URL for the information, b) wanted me to install software for her, c) wanted someone else to do everything for her, and d) was down-right hostile about it. |
| 18:23.17 | Dagmar | You know if you push the hangup button while you're in mid-sentence, they'll think the cell tower just dropped their call |
| 18:23.36 | Lopeppeppy | No, they won't. |
| 18:23.47 | Lunessa | Dagmar: We don't give people Admin on most boxes. I'm terrified of what horrors we would unleash if we did. |
| 18:24.10 | Dagmar | Lopeppeppy: it works pretty good here. heh |
| 18:24.50 | *** join/#wowuidev Shirik (n=mpdelbuo@WoWUIDev/WoWIStaff/Norganna/StatisticalEngineer/Shirik) |
| 18:24.51 | *** mode/#wowuidev [+o Shirik] by ChanServ |
| 18:25.05 | Shirik | IT sucks |
| 18:25.06 | Dagmar | Lunessa: The difference between the unix guys and the windows guys here is that the Unix guys will take twice as long to find the right thing to click on |
| 18:25.15 | Dagmar | The windows people will very quickly find the thing to click on that doesn't actually work. |
| 18:25.37 | Lunessa | Dagmar: That's pretty funny. :) |
| 18:33.17 | Shirik | nah |
| 18:33.23 | Shirik | the unix guys don't click |
| 18:33.24 | *** join/#wowuidev Kraps (n=chatzill@ool-44c20717.dyn.optonline.net) |
| 18:33.26 | Shirik | what u talking about |
| 18:33.27 | Fisker | Shirik sucks |
| 18:33.37 | durcyn | mice are for macintosh users |
| 18:33.38 | Fisker | funny story btw |
| 18:33.38 | *** mode/#wowuidev [-o Fisker] by Shirik |
| 18:33.56 | Fisker | Someone suggested that Blizzard should have a backupserver for maintanence periods |
| 18:33.57 | Fisker | :DD |
| 18:34.04 | Shirik | fit everyone on that server at once? |
| 18:34.05 | Fisker | called himself a "computer consultant" |
| 18:34.06 | Fisker | lol'd |
| 18:34.10 | Fisker | no |
| 18:34.14 | Fisker | i mean a backup |
| 18:34.27 | Shirik | yes |
| 18:34.27 | Fisker | a backup of all services so that you can play like you usually do on maintanence days |
| 18:34.31 | Shirik | right |
| 18:34.34 | Shirik | so one backup server? |
| 18:34.41 | durcyn | obviously |
| 18:34.44 | Shirik | so while all the realms are down, everyone plays on that one server |
| 18:34.49 | Fisker | no |
| 18:34.51 | durcyn | Shirik, Master of Nitpickery |
| 18:34.55 | Shirik | one per server? |
| 18:35.02 | Fisker | RABS then |
| 18:35.03 | Shirik | That would cost a fortune |
| 18:35.09 | Fisker | (Redundant array of blade servers) |
| 18:35.17 | Dagmar | It's called "the PTR" |
| 18:35.20 | durcyn | and your fakeronym sucks |
| 18:35.20 | Shirik | ^ |
| 18:35.30 | Shirik | I dunno it kinda makes sense |
| 18:35.32 | Fisker | fuck you durcyn |
| 18:35.35 | Fisker | to hell |
| 18:35.36 | durcyn | sucks |
| 18:35.38 | durcyn | it sucks |
| 18:35.41 | Shirik | as servers go down, rotate them to the backup servers |
| 18:35.58 | Shirik | HAM servers do this |
| 18:36.14 | nevcairiel | thats alot of extra hardware just for a few hours a week |
| 18:36.16 | Fisker | not saying it's not possible |
| 18:36.20 | Fisker | that's my point nevcairiel |
| 18:36.20 | Shirik | exactly nevcairiel |
| 18:36.40 | nevcairiel | off-peak hours, at that |
| 18:37.03 | Lunessa | And if you notice, the EULA and Terms of Service don't promise that the service will "always be available." |
| 18:38.01 | Fisker | http://forums.wow-europe.com/thread.html?topicId=10920573386&sid=1 <-i had to keep my cool |
| 18:39.08 | Dagmar | If it were possible they'd only be running on giant server instance by now |
| 18:41.02 | Fisker | That's what i hate about computer consultants :P |
| 18:41.21 | Fisker | "Hey here's a "solution" to a several million dollars, and here's my equally expensive fee" |
| 18:41.32 | Lopeppeppy | Irreverent Peppy is irreverent. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Gq01UYiMyHg |
| 18:41.37 | Fisker | In one of my internships i were trying to fix some kind of OCR solution |
| 18:42.09 | Fisker | And i finally got it to work, except the output format was one Windows couldn't recognize |
| 18:42.20 | Fisker | (It had previously worked) |
| 18:42.55 | Fisker | So i gave up stating that something fishy was done with the software (Saw them use third-party, probably unlicensed and outdated libraries) and that i couldn't fix it |
| 18:43.00 | Fisker | So they called the consultant |
| 18:43.17 | Fisker | He spent half a day not coming up with a solution and left a bill 10 times the price of the solution itself |
| 18:43.55 | Fisker | if only i had gotten those money :( |
| 18:44.31 | Dagmar | Fisker: Odd. I always thought I came pretty cheap at #300/hour |
| 18:44.32 | Dagmar | Well, usually I only charged a bit over half that |
| 18:44.45 | Dagmar | Of course, I didn't charge if I couldn't *fix* the problem before I left |
| 18:44.56 | Fisker | well the solution were around ~200-400$ |
| 18:45.06 | Fisker | He claimed it was our fault |
| 18:45.16 | Dagmar | Let them hire someone else to prove that then |
| 18:45.21 | Fisker | I don't know what happened after that |
| 18:45.28 | Fisker | i gave them my perspective on the issue |
| 18:45.39 | Dagmar | I still maintain about a half dozen firewall around town here. |
| 18:45.47 | Fisker | also noting they used libraries that were probably illegally licensed and outdated as the fix was to update those libraries |
| 18:45.50 | Dagmar | My income from that is minimal because I know my stuff. |
| 18:45.56 | Dagmar | I hear from these guys maybe once a year, if that |
| 18:46.22 | Fisker | Only thing i was told was that they wouldn't admit their fault and they were going to sue for it |
| 18:46.27 | Dagmar | Let 'em |
| 18:46.39 | Dagmar | They were bluffing outright. |
| 18:46.52 | Dagmar | One phone call to 1-800-R-U-LEGIT and the problem goes away |
| 18:47.02 | Dagmar | ...and they probably know it. |
| 18:47.04 | Fisker | this was in denmark though :P |
| 18:47.10 | Fisker | i don't know what that number is |
| 18:47.17 | Dagmar | Then give them two fish and call it a day |
| 18:47.18 | Dagmar | :) |
| 18:47.27 | Fisker | And it was kinda fishy |
| 18:47.29 | Dagmar | Here in the US that's the BSA's anti-piracy hotline |
| 18:47.38 | Fisker | As the consultant was actually from the company who sold the solution |
| 18:47.46 | Dagmar | You call and make a report, if they're bored enough they'll investigate. |
| 18:47.56 | Dagmar | If they find someone's been pirating stuff, they're going to charge them out the butt |
| 18:48.06 | Fisker | sounds fun |
| 18:48.23 | Dagmar | It's handy for dealing with Windows houses who want you to fix their squeaky toys |
| 18:48.45 | *** join/#wowuidev taleden (n=atfrase@user-38q41i6.cable.mindspring.com) |
| 18:48.47 | Fisker | :P |
| 18:49.01 | Fisker | Another fun story btw |
| 18:49.03 | Dagmar | Suddenly they become just a bit too busy with internal auditing to give you crap about how their insane setup can't be used to wrapper an RDP tunnel back through itself and across the internet twice |
| 18:49.23 | Dagmar | Not joking about that either |
| 18:49.24 | Fisker | One of the admins at the same place used the key for the VLK-server(For Vista) to activate standalone versions of vista |
| 18:49.28 | Fisker | i'm even surprised it worked |
| 18:49.29 | *** join/#wowuidev jpmogran (n=jpmogran@67.183.221.120) |
| 18:50.26 | Dagmar | These guys had a VPN that was going across town, and the traffic's route actually went out through the VPN, through another VPN on the remote site, and eventually back through the first connection only to go to a third site |
| 18:50.38 | Dagmar | ...and they wanted to blame the firewall for making this slow. |
| 18:50.48 | Fisker | >:o |
| 18:51.13 | Dagmar | THe thing was choking itself and adding about 300ms latency just from it's path |
| 18:51.19 | Dagmar | Of COURSE it wasn't going to run well |
| 18:51.29 | *** join/#wowuidev smcn (i=smcn@67.166.76.157) |
| 18:51.42 | Lopeppeppy | Reminds me of one of those Family Circus cartoons, where they put a dotted line everywhere that the kid runs. |
| 18:51.46 | Dagmar | The firewall they had was giving them a whole 10ms latency |
| 18:51.54 | Dagmar | Pretty much |
| 18:52.05 | Dagmar | I'm sure they're enjoying their managed Checkpoint service |
| 18:52.20 | Dagmar | Lord knows it cost them enough |
| 18:52.38 | Dagmar | "You want to run it on NT? You'll have to find another consultant I'm afraid." |
| 18:53.22 | Lopeppeppy | Which part of "you're SOL" do you not understand? The shit? Or the being out of it? |
| 18:55.11 | mikma | http://indianapolis.craigslist.org/jwl/1371534641.html |
| 18:56.28 | Fisker | fake |
| 18:56.30 | Lunessa | mikma: ... |
| 18:56.48 | Lopeppeppy | And dont' forget your NSFW tags, kk? |
| 18:57.46 | nevcairiel | "It is great for a young girl as a going back-to-school gift." i giggled :P |
| 19:02.35 | Dagmar | Could be worse |
| 19:02.45 | Dagmar | Last night someone posted a link to a video stream from an escort service |
| 19:02.56 | Dagmar | I thought it was a Rammstien video |
| 19:06.58 | KarlKFI|work | owned |
| 19:07.48 | nevcairiel | well the new rammstein video .... :P |
| 19:08.03 | Stanzilla | it's awesome! |
| 19:08.16 | nevcairiel | i didnt see an uncensored version yet, so i dunno |
| 19:09.15 | *** join/#wowuidev Dewin (n=Daniel@c-71-59-222-35.hsd1.or.comcast.net) |
| 19:09.51 | Stanzilla | nevcairiel: http://visit-x.net/CAMS/DE/specials/Rammstein.html?track=Index nsfw obviously :P |
| 19:10.42 | Lopeppeppy | Rammstein is excellent, but yeah, nto always work music |
| 19:11.09 | KarlKFI|work | nto always a Rammstien video either |
| 19:15.45 | Shirik | what's with all these "dvd rental machines" all over the place these days |
| 19:16.04 | Lopeppeppy | Putting Blockbuster out of business, they are. |
| 19:16.15 | jpmogran | mm netflix |
| 19:16.32 | Lopeppeppy | If I had a TV, I'd consider netflix. |
| 19:17.08 | Shirik | why tv? |
| 19:17.11 | Shirik | Just use a laptop |
| 19:17.33 | Shirik | but seriously, even my school has a DVD rental machine now |
| 19:18.01 | jpmogran | maybe because machine costs X, and it generates some reasonable fraction of X per year? |
| 19:18.26 | nevcairiel | all the stupid online-movie-rental things don't work on linux |
| 19:18.26 | nevcairiel | they all suck |
| 19:18.26 | Lunessa | Shirik: Because renting a DVD for a buck without needing a membership to a service is pretty fucking sweet. |
| 19:18.32 | Lopeppeppy | I suppose I could do the download netflix, it just takes a while for me to download big files. I'd rather get an envelope, watch it, send it back. |
| 19:18.43 | Shirik | blockbuster is really going to die soon |
| 19:18.45 | Shirik | imo |
| 19:18.46 | *** join/#wowuidev sioraiocht (n=tomh@unaffiliated/sioraiocht) |
| 19:18.49 | Lopeppeppy | But the Redbox has also tempted me. |
| 19:18.58 | durcyn | blockbuster's been doing netflix-style dvds by mail for five years now |
| 19:19.01 | durcyn | they're not going anywhere |
| 19:19.04 | Shirik | orly? |
| 19:19.40 | Lopeppeppy | Their stocks say differently... |
| 19:20.24 | Shirik | gotta go to meeting byebye |
| 19:20.38 | Lunessa | And seriously... $1/night vs $3.25/night or $2.50/night. You do the math. |
| 19:21.27 | NeoTron | I'm just waiting for the blockbuster <-> tivo integration to be done |
| 19:21.55 | Lunessa | I'm waiting for someone to bring me a cheeseburger and a beer. |
| 19:22.06 | NeoTron | I bet I'll be waiting a shorter period of time |
| 19:22.18 | Lopeppeppy | I'm waiting for someone to come take me to get my car out of prison |
| 19:22.55 | Lunessa | I would peppy, but it's a 4 day drive round trip and I don't think you want to wait. |
| 19:23.40 | alestane | Even three and a half hours would be a goodly wait. |
| 19:23.42 | Lopeppeppy | Yeah, it's only like a 20 minute walk, I'm just being all Eeeeeyore. |
| 19:24.15 | *** join/#wowuidev pompy1 (n=Mike@c-68-38-45-3.hsd1.nj.comcast.net) |
| 19:24.29 | jnwhiteh | Hunters cannot macro things for range versus melee, correct? |
| 19:24.47 | *** join/#wowuidev harl (i=harl@dslb-088-077-211-255.pools.arcor-ip.net) |
| 19:24.55 | Lopeppeppy | correct, cannot macro for range. |
| 19:25.06 | jnwhiteh | thanks. |
| 19:27.37 | Fisker | where's my damn windows 7 key jnwhiteh ? |
| 19:27.43 | jnwhiteh | i ate it =( |
| 19:28.04 | KarlKFI|work | it's nto october yet, is it? |
| 19:28.14 | Fisker | no |
| 19:28.29 | Fisker | but it looks like they're about to charge my card and give me my damn key KarlKFI|work |
| 19:28.34 | p3lim | Does any macro condition work for the 3rd argument in RegisterStateDriver? |
| 19:28.38 | KarlKFI|work | about it? |
| 19:28.46 | KarlKFI|work | about to* |
| 19:28.57 | KarlKFI|work | how can you tell that? |
| 19:29.23 | alestane | p3lim: It uses the same code that macros use. |
| 19:29.44 | KarlKFI|work | i ordered the student pro copy and it said it would ping my account now and charge me when it ships basically |
| 19:31.07 | p3lim | ok |
| 19:34.45 | *** join/#wowuidev Keias (n=bleh@pool-72-86-106-233.aubnin.fios.verizon.net) |
| 19:34.59 | Lopeppeppy | Why do the sheeple never contact me before they've broken something beyond repair? *sigh* |
| 19:36.10 | p3lim | id really wish for more conditions than that |
| 19:37.06 | p3lim | [exists], sure, but I'd like to have it on a chosen unit's target, not the player |
| 19:37.24 | p3lim | one for pet happiness, one for casting, one for health and one for power |
| 19:37.28 | p3lim | would be ideal |
| 19:38.52 | alestane | Lopeppeppy: Today I heard the word "sheepwalker". |
| 19:39.04 | Lopeppeppy | What's a that? |
| 19:39.28 | Ackis | any ARL users here that are DK's? |
| 19:39.31 | alestane | The kind of person who just sort of trundles around in line with their head down, peroccupied with their cud. |
| 19:39.47 | Lopeppeppy | Yeah, I have some of those too. |
| 19:39.49 | *** join/#wowuidev Repo (n=supybot@repos.curseforge.net) |
| 19:40.14 | alestane | p3lim: If we made conditions like those, macros would do all kinds of things that Blizzard doesn't like. |
| 19:40.37 | p3lim | well yeah |
| 19:40.46 | alestane | If you just want to display those various characteristics, you shouldn't need protected frames in the first place. |
| 19:40.53 | p3lim | im just using the visibility state, could do it manually though |
| 19:42.54 | audible | it does seem you can automate quite alot already, like repairing or questpicking |
| 19:43.47 | audible | instant picking up all quests at a questnpc is quite nice when you are leveling up your 10th alt |
| 19:48.49 | *** join/#wowuidev Repo (n=supybot@repos.curseforge.net) |
| 19:51.33 | Fisker | http://forums.wow-europe.com/thread.html?topicId=10920573386&postId=109196610519&sid=1#8 <-hohoho |
| 19:57.29 | Lunessa | Awww, fisker took the gloves off. |
| 19:59.03 | Dagmar | Fisker: People like him are the reasons banks were sporting epic levels of FAIL worldwide |
| 19:59.07 | Dagmar | Fisker: You can point that out |
| 19:59.08 | Fisker | ^^ |
| 19:59.13 | Dagmar | No one would think it was a low blow. |
| 19:59.14 | Dagmar | ;) |
| 19:59.14 | Fisker | i would've |
| 19:59.17 | Fisker | if i had taken my gloves off |
| 20:00.01 | Dagmar | Of course when money is no object because you're playing with other people's money you can afford to needlessly spend thirty million dollars to completely double the size of your infrastructure |
| 20:00.02 | foxlit | it lives. |
| 20:00.08 | *** join/#wowuidev pompy (n=Mike@c-68-38-45-3.hsd1.nj.comcast.net) |
| 20:00.15 | Lopeppeppy | mmm, infrastructure. |
| 20:00.40 | Dagmar | Of course, Blizzard is actually beholden to stockholders who care, so they aren't likely to be making everything 100% redundant |
| 20:01.00 | Dagmar | ...because it's just a freaking GAME. |
| 20:01.13 | p3lim | hm |
| 20:01.30 | Dagmar | 2N+1 is for datacenter and critical services only |
| 20:01.37 | p3lim | clever and safe way to get the number (1-4) out of 'party#' |
| 20:01.49 | p3lim | was thinking gsub, but im unsure |
| 20:01.52 | Lopeppeppy | People just need to get over their friggin entitlement issues. End of story. |
| 20:02.00 | foxlit | p3lim: are you guaranteed that it's party#? |
| 20:02.04 | p3lim | yeah |
| 20:02.14 | foxlit | tonumber(str:match("%d$")) |
| 20:02.27 | foxlit | or just tonumber(str:sub(-1)); |
| 20:02.31 | Lunessa | Dagmar: seriously. Even in the wild and wooly days of early online services and internet access 24/7 uptime/availabilty was never a given. |
| 20:03.46 | Dagmar | Lunessa: Well, it's also that it's just not smart to completely dupe everything unless there's a damn good reason |
| 20:04.02 | Dagmar | Shareholders will fire your ass in a heartbeat for that |
| 20:04.08 | Lunessa | The hardware requirements would be stupidly large. |
| 20:04.17 | Dagmar | Exactly |
| 20:05.15 | *** join/#wowuidev nuoHep (n=nuoHep@89.222.156.36) |
| 20:06.35 | Lunessa | I remember when we ran a bunch of Stratus boxes - each machine ran everything internally in a mirrored set up so that if a box lost a drive or processor the mirrors took up right away. The first thing we did was strip out the mirroring functions because we desperately needed the capacity instead. |
| 20:08.32 | *** join/#wowuidev luigithekid (n=chatzill@201.208.44.87) |
| 20:08.37 | p3lim | trying to see if I can add vehicle support to headers for oUF |
| 20:08.47 | p3lim | now I just proper macro arguments, if there are any |
| 20:09.19 | p3lim | oUF is currently using [target=vehicle,exists,bonusbar:5] |
| 20:09.31 | p3lim | now to make that work for any unit, not just player/pet |
| 20:09.40 | Lunessa | p3lim: [bonusbar:5] is the closest we have for vehicle. |
| 20:09.55 | p3lim | yeah but that only works for player |
| 20:09.58 | foxlit | What exactly are you trying to support? |
| 20:10.05 | p3lim | vehicle for raid/party |
| 20:10.08 | foxlit | Click on a player's frame to target their vehicle? |
| 20:10.12 | p3lim | yeah |
| 20:10.19 | foxlit | It's very easy :) |
| 20:10.44 | foxlit | The SABT/SUBT templates allow unit remapping for vehicles. |
| 20:10.49 | p3lim | actually i just want to swap unit and unitpet with eachother if unit is in a vehicle |
| 20:10.58 | foxlit | Same thing. |
| 20:11.09 | foxlit | set "toggleForVehicle", true. |
| 20:11.14 | p3lim | is there any documentation on that? |
| 20:11.20 | foxlit | http://www.wowwiki.com/SecureActionButtonTemplate |
| 20:11.27 | p3lim | directly as an attribute? |
| 20:11.33 | nevcairiel | the lua code is docs :P |
| 20:11.34 | foxlit | On the unit frames, yes. |
| 20:12.22 | p3lim | oh lol |
| 20:12.25 | p3lim | that was easy |
| 20:12.32 | p3lim | no need for securestatedrivers |
| 20:12.47 | foxlit | The only potentially difficult part is telling the UFs that they're supposed to be displaying something else. |
| 20:13.47 | p3lim | do I need petframes visible for it to work? |
| 20:14.09 | foxlit | Nope. |
| 20:14.35 | foxlit | It essentially checks whether UnitHasVehicleUI returns true when you click the button, and, if so, messes with the default unit attribute resolution. |
| 20:14.54 | p3lim | cool |
| 20:15.23 | p3lim | gotta test this |
| 20:16.31 | p3lim | hm |
| 20:17.22 | p3lim | niiice |
| 20:17.27 | p3lim | clicking works fine |
| 20:17.40 | p3lim | now I just need the frames to update |
| 20:17.41 | foxlit | You can also go the modifier route: [target=party1,help][target=party1,harm] party1; [target=party1pet,exists,help] party1pet |
| 20:17.57 | foxlit | (On the observation that you cannot help/harm people in vehicles. |
| 20:18.07 | foxlit | s/modifier/conditional/ |
| 20:18.24 | p3lim | true.. |
| 20:18.24 | *** join/#wowuidev Cargor (n=Cargor@dslb-088-070-230-172.pools.arcor-ip.net) |
| 20:19.09 | p3lim | but going over that for each unit (raid1-40, raidpet1-40, party1-4, partypet1-4) manually, that would be a bitch |
| 20:21.26 | foxlit | Up to you to figure out which way annoys you less :) |
| 20:22.02 | nevcairiel | I wrote a wrapper function on every unit access for that |
| 20:22.07 | p3lim | well just setting toggleForVehicle makes it clickable, though it doesnt update since the unit attribute doesnt change |
| 20:22.09 | nevcairiel | seemed easier at the time |
| 20:22.45 | p3lim | nevcairiel: will you be adding raid/party support to the vehicle element you wrote for oUF? |
| 20:23.04 | nevcairiel | i wrote a vehicle element? |
| 20:23.41 | foxlit | I registered state drivers with that conditional for my party frames -- it gives me a nice event to sync my (somewhat silly) frame -> unit map. |
| 20:23.48 | p3lim | nevcairiel: http://github.com/Nevcairiel/ouf/commit/263ee5d11f7a1420738b67d0a4a83cc5b1ba31a2 |
| 20:24.28 | p3lim | I assume that is you since its the same name except for the uppercase N |
| 20:24.28 | nevcairiel | oh that, nah probably not |
| 20:24.38 | nevcairiel | i don't play anymore |
| 20:24.41 | p3lim | ah |
| 20:24.49 | nevcairiel | and i didn't use oUF for raid anyway |
| 20:25.43 | *** join/#wowuidev pompy (n=Mike@c-68-38-45-3.hsd1.nj.comcast.net) |
| 20:25.46 | p3lim | I dont need that many fancy functions, still its nice to have vehicle support for it |
| 20:26.31 | p3lim | thats why I use oUF > grid etc |
| 20:27.00 | p3lim | nevcairiel: though could I have a look at the wrapper function you were talking about? |
| 20:27.23 | p3lim | Im guessing you just passed the unitid through a funciton returning formatted conditions |
| 20:27.29 | *** join/#wowuidev Colin_T (n=ColinT@69-11-97-130.regn.static.sasknet.sk.ca) |
| 20:37.54 | *** join/#wowuidev pompy1 (n=Mike@c-68-38-45-3.hsd1.nj.comcast.net) |
| 20:42.41 | *** join/#wowuidev Dezzimal (n=Dezzimal@207-118-129-158.dyn.centurytel.net) |
| 20:43.21 | jnwhiteh | *sigh* |
| 20:43.22 | jnwhiteh | this person |
| 20:43.23 | jnwhiteh | in email |
| 20:43.30 | jnwhiteh | won't get it.. i tell him what he wants can't be accomplished. |
| 20:43.38 | jnwhiteh | "well what if i simulate a click using Click()" |
| 20:43.45 | jnwhiteh | *ninja stab* |
| 20:43.48 | jnwhiteh | rages |
| 20:43.57 | foxlit | You do email support for addons? <3 |
| 20:44.05 | cbreak | click()? |
| 20:44.10 | foxlit | :Click() |
| 20:44.22 | cbreak | since when does that simulate anything? |
| 20:45.02 | foxlit | It's been around for quite a while; whether or not it simulates anything depends on your definition of it :) |
| 20:51.30 | p3lim | issue |
| 20:51.41 | *** join/#wowuidev Sesshu (n=Sesshu@ip-57-18.travedsl.de) |
| 20:51.43 | p3lim | oUF doesnt set the unit attribute on header children |
| 20:53.08 | kd3 | egah |
| 20:53.10 | kd3 | in the last 24 hours we've gotten a foot of rain out here. that's on top of what else has fallen the past week and a half |
| 20:54.04 | alestane | That's...a lot of rain. |
| 20:54.36 | kd3 | the flooding has been horrendous. had to take about a 20-mile detour to get home |
| 20:55.43 | *** join/#wowuidev NightHawkAtWork (n=jonathan@173-14-241-5-washington.hfc.comcastbusiness.net) |
| 20:56.11 | *** join/#wowuidev Shirik (n=mpdelbuo@WoWUIDev/WoWIStaff/Norganna/StatisticalEngineer/Shirik) |
| 20:56.11 | *** mode/#wowuidev [+o Shirik] by ChanServ |
| 20:58.47 | *** join/#wowuidev t_ (i=tom@freenode/staff/tomaw) |
| 20:59.17 | p3lim | how can I get attributes of children :s |
| 21:08.57 | *** join/#wowuidev Tuller (n=muffins@pool-96-248-0-53.rcmdva.fios.verizon.net) |
| 21:10.38 | Zyn | <insert Chris Hansen joke here> |
| 21:15.26 | *** join/#wowuidev Kaso (n=Kaso@host86-145-163-1.range86-145.btcentralplus.com) |
| 21:15.47 | Fisker | noo Shirik :( |
| 21:15.56 | Thunder_Child | why is there such a derth of RTS games |
| 21:18.36 | *** join/#wowuidev pompy (n=Mike@c-68-38-45-3.hsd1.nj.comcast.net) |
| 21:19.29 | NightHawkAtWork | because everything since wc3 feels like a shoddy imitation? |
| 21:21.37 | Lunessa | because rts games are evil, and wicked and I can't play them. I'm mounting a campaign to return to the halcyon days of TURN-BASED GAMING! |
| 21:22.08 | NightHawkAtWork | I like turn based games |
| 21:22.51 | Arrowmaster | fuck any game that the most common tactic is to rush the other person and try to catch them off guard as soon as the game begins |
| 21:22.54 | NightHawkAtWork | There was an old web-based game i used to play that was neatly turn-based, but entirely "asychronous". you accumulated turns over time, and spent them on actions whenever you logged in |
| 21:23.02 | Lunessa | I do too. RTS games cause me physical discomfort because of all the mouse-control for individual units. |
| 21:23.18 | Dagmar | Nipplization? |
| 21:23.20 | Dagmar | er Evony? |
| 21:23.45 | NightHawkAtWork | Dagmar: you asking me? No, an old game named 'Monarchy' |
| 21:23.57 | Arrowmaster | what the hell was that rts game i read about in pc gamer that was suppost to put the strategy back in rts games |
| 21:23.59 | Thunder_Child | NightHawkAtWork, hardly, there just havent been many lately |
| 21:34.33 | durcyn | Arrowmaster: doesn't matter, go find a used copy of Ground Control or Homeworld and you're done. |
| 21:34.43 | durcyn | or better yet, Myth |
| 21:35.05 | Arrowmaster | i think i have homeworld somewhere, i should finish it |
| 21:35.24 | Arrowmaster | i got suck on one mission in homeworld2 |
| 21:35.42 | NiLon_ | are here mostly US or EU players? :p |
| 21:35.50 | p3lim | hm anyone knows if any other attributes are set when a unit is changed thanks to the attribute 'toggleForVehicle' ? |
| 21:35.56 | p3lim | that I could check for |
| 21:36.36 | p3lim | stupid vehicles :/ |
| 21:37.08 | NightHawkAtWork | Myth was pretty awesome.. i wonder how well that'd run... >.> |
| 21:37.40 | durcyn | NightHawkAtWork: it was DirectX, it should be fine |
| 21:37.52 | durcyn | damn, now i have to dust off my copy |
| 21:37.52 | Dagmar | You'd think that |
| 21:38.01 | Dagmar | ...then you'd try to run something like Omicron |
| 21:38.11 | Lunessa | NiLon_: a mix, both well-represented |
| 21:38.27 | durcyn | Dagmar: don't tread on my dreams. </yeats> </equillibrium> etc. |
| 21:41.44 | NiLon_ | dim dam, my realm was down for hours, and then it came back up for 20 minutes and now world server is down :/ |
| 21:42.07 | NiLon_ | this is like pre extended maintenance |
| 21:42.31 | Fisker | http://forums.wow-europe.com/thread.html?topicId=10920573386&postId=109196611094&sid=1#15 <-i really begin to understand this financial crisis now |
| 21:42.40 | Fisker | "Lol - thats not a statistical sample; take the serveral THOUSAND users that use Vashj alon, and times by the amount of money they each pay each and every month, and then look at how much that is compaired to the cost of a single purchase of some extra hardware, which will last for years, and its relatively nothing!" |
| 21:43.14 | Fisker | "Lol take the several thousand bank customers that use our bank alone and multiply it with the amount of money they pay you every month, that's our IT budget" |
| 21:44.12 | *** join/#wowuidev PProvost (n=PProvost@c-71-229-131-32.hsd1.co.comcast.net) |
| 21:44.13 | alestane | I like how he's supposed to be this high-powered IT consultant and he says "Lol" all the time. |
| 21:44.38 | Dagmar | I told you they were in the "playing with other people's money" game |
| 21:44.56 | Dagmar | His idea of what a reasonable cost of infrastructure should be is _stupidly_ inflated |
| 21:52.51 | Lunessa | The sky is probably green in his world, the bathrooms have hot and cold running cocaine and dumb-guys get to be king of the world. |
| 21:52.57 | Fisker | hmm |
| 21:53.03 | Fisker | i should've trolled a whole different way |
| 21:53.21 | Fisker | "Yo Tim Longson im real happy for you and all and imma let you finish but..." |
| 21:54.02 | Lunessa | we all know Beyonce has the best servers ever. |
| 21:54.42 | Fisker | i'm still wondering why a bank is using over 13000 servers for their shit |
| 21:54.47 | Fisker | what possibly can they use that for? :o |
| 21:55.12 | Lunessa | Financial institutions use a LOT of computing power. |
| 21:55.21 | cbreak | stupid real-time trading gambles? |
| 21:55.28 | Fisker | meh |
| 21:55.36 | Fisker | 1 ps3 > 13000 blade servers |
| 21:55.37 | Fisker | lolol |
| 21:55.46 | cbreak | massive statistical analyses of some stock markets |
| 21:56.02 | Lunessa | derivatives, asset tracking, ATM information, and all the other crap that happens in other companies too. |
| 21:56.14 | Fisker | sure |
| 21:56.27 | Fisker | still can't believe that would surpass Blizzard in a server count |
| 21:56.34 | Fisker | though |
| 22:01.53 | Lunessa | Fisker: You'd be shocked at what banking systems use - especially the systems that do transaction-clearing for inter-bank transfers. |
| 22:02.06 | Thunder_Child | oh lol "The server farm is so massive, it will require the construction of three separate nuclear power plants in southern India to provide electricity to power and cool it, sources say." |
| 22:02.41 | Dagmar | yay intel chips |
| 22:02.45 | Dagmar | *snicker* |
| 22:03.51 | Fisker | yeah i might also have misunderstood him :P |
| 22:04.01 | Fisker | Obviously big international banks are another matter |
| 22:04.26 | Fisker | for some reason i was like "some national local bank" |
| 22:07.30 | Dagmar | Considering that he's making it all up does it even matter? |
| 22:09.24 | alestane | A ScrollChild doesn't need to be anchored in the conventional sense, does it? |
| 22:09.39 | Lunessa | He's a tard. Special in a non-good, non-interesitng way. |
| 22:11.52 | audible | is there any way i could get up a list over creatures that are around me? |
| 22:12.15 | alestane | audible: Not really a good one. You can scan the combat log and see what names are mentioned in it. |
| 22:12.30 | audible | what about widget things? |
| 22:12.53 | audible | i mean, if you scroll frame names or something |
| 22:13.06 | alestane | I'm sorry, what? |
| 22:13.19 | cog|away | weighs being too hot with risking CO2 poisoning |
| 22:13.32 | cog|away | s/with/against/ |
| 22:13.52 | audible | alestane: gameobject : tooltip |
| 22:13.59 | alestane | Are you trying to decide whether to open the window? |
| 22:14.02 | audible | or the CTRL + V |
| 22:14.21 | audible | no, i would just want a popup with different animals i can attack in my proximity |
| 22:14.59 | audible | i would assume there is some array that can be parsed since each animal has a frame for name etc |
| 22:14.59 | alestane | Setting a tooltip to a unit requires that it have a valid unit ID at the time, such as mouseover. Nameplates will work within a certain radius, but they're not generated by the UI and difficult to track. |
| 22:15.30 | audible | okey, so basically you would have to parse unitIDs |
| 22:15.37 | audible | easier with memory reading then :P |
| 22:15.46 | alestane | Which can get you banned. |
| 22:15.52 | audible | not really no |
| 22:16.00 | audible | warden doesnt scan external processes |
| 22:16.09 | audible | but that is not my goal, i wanted to make it as an addon |
| 22:16.40 | jpmogran | get u banned heh.. ive been reporting the same gold farmer for sending me spam for weeks |
| 22:17.33 | alestane | Well, you can scan through children of WorldFrame looking for nameplates, which should give you a list of names within range, but making them functionally targetable would be hard beyond macro text that said "/targetexact name". |
| 22:17.43 | alestane | jpmogran: They do those in batches. |
| 22:18.09 | jpmogran | if they'd just ban the people who bought the gold... |
| 22:18.30 | audible | they would probably ban 10% of the community |
| 22:18.36 | audible | easily |
| 22:18.37 | jpmogran | works for me |
| 22:18.45 | audible | me aswell |
| 22:18.56 | alestane | That's like locking up fences and letting burglars run free...sounds like it might be practical, but hard to say if it really solves the problem. |
| 22:18.56 | cog|work | obviously you don't own businesses :P |
| 22:19.12 | cog|work | (at least not customer-oriented ones) |
| 22:19.29 | audible | well. majority of people getting banned like that are so addicted to wow that they will buy another account |
| 22:19.34 | Lunessa | economics - might as well be ancient Greek to so many folks. |
| 22:19.46 | audible | just imagine why they bought gold in the first place |
| 22:20.23 | jpmogran | if 90% dont buy gold, and their experience is diminished by the 10% who do, which customer subset do you cater to? |
| 22:21.31 | Dagmar | The ones who'd like to see goldfarmers gutted and left to feed carrion birds |
| 22:21.55 | jpmogran | isnt buying gold a violation of tos too? |
| 22:22.08 | Dagmar | Pretty much |
| 22:22.20 | cog|work | yes, but one seller can sell to innumerable buyers. It makes much more sense to attack the supply |
| 22:22.38 | jpmogran | hell kill em all |
| 22:22.41 | *** join/#wowuidev Lopeppeppy (n=Lopeppep@cpe-67-246-40-12.nycap.res.rr.com) |
| 22:22.41 | *** mode/#wowuidev [+v Lopeppeppy] by ChanServ |
| 22:22.41 | jpmogran | buyers and sellers |
| 22:23.01 | jpmogran | maybe export them to their own server / battlegroup |
| 22:23.07 | audible | imo, apart from the spam |
| 22:23.10 | Dagmar | I thikn they should go after a certain corpse-spammer for tort. interfernce |
| 22:23.18 | cog|work | and just because you know of people who haven't been banned for buying gold doesn't mean they don't ban people who buy gold |
| 22:23.18 | audible | buying and selling gold isnt that bad |
| 22:23.30 | audible | if it wasnt for spam |
| 22:23.38 | Dagmar | ...or simply get me a ticket to somewhere outside the US and not ask a lot of questions about what I do to them |
| 22:23.46 | Lopeppeppy | It's against game rules, it doesn't ahve to be good or bad. |
| 22:24.00 | Dagmar | <PROTECTED> |
| 22:24.08 | jpmogran | lol |
| 22:24.12 | audible | well, there are alot of stuff thats against game rules |
| 22:24.23 | audible | Dagmar : you just need a "need to know basis" |
| 22:24.42 | Dagmar | audible: No seriously. I need jurisdictional problems |
| 22:24.53 | Dagmar | Never assume no one can or will ever know. |
| 22:25.02 | Dagmar | Ensure that even if they DO know they can't do anything about it. |
| 22:25.16 | Dagmar | ...or won't because you'll die of old age before the paperwork is finished. |
| 22:25.57 | audible | whats not known has never happened |
| 22:26.05 | audible | if someone knows, someone will tell |
| 22:26.13 | audible | no-matter what graveyard shit you have |
| 22:26.29 | Dagmar | I think if I sink a goldselling outfit for a few million incompletable transaction fees, they're going to know something's up |
| 22:29.49 | *** join/#wowuidev Pneumatus^ (n=WiN@81.174.255.129) |
| 22:30.37 | Lunessa | And naturally you spoke about it in any fashion on the internet. |
| 22:31.24 | Dagmar | Of course |
| 22:31.54 | Dagmar | ...because like I said, it's not whether anyone knows or can prove something, it's whether or not there's any point or benefit to doing anything about it. |
| 22:32.11 | Dagmar | Why do you think it takes so long to stop spammers from flagrantly running fraud campaigns? |
| 22:32.13 | Lunessa | *nod8 |
| 22:34.46 | Dagmar | It's almost a shame Seeland isn't the place it used to be |
| 22:35.01 | durcyn | mauritius is the new sealand anyway |
| 22:37.26 | Dagmar | That place looks pretty pleasant |
| 22:39.45 | Lunessa | Looking to create a data haven? |
| 22:40.23 | Dagmar | No, looking for someplace that has a nice bar, steady power, decent connectivity, and jurisdictional grey areas to spare |
| 22:40.26 | Dagmar | ;) |
| 22:40.59 | Lunessa | I hear Belize is nice. |
| 22:41.22 | Dagmar | No good. |
| 22:41.27 | Dagmar | Their police will arrest you |
| 22:41.55 | Lunessa | Oh well. |
| 22:42.11 | Dagmar | ...at least for some things. This I know from relatively recent news. |
| 22:42.12 | Lunessa | Let me know if you find a good spot. I could use a new place to live. |
| 22:42.27 | Dagmar | You kill someone somewhere and they'll definitely arrest you at request in Belize |
| 22:42.35 | Lopeppeppy | Where was the data haven in Cryptonomicon? Somewhere in southeast asia |
| 22:42.53 | Dagmar | I don't remember where the book said it was, but he was talking about Sealand |
| 22:43.06 | Dagmar | A LOT of that book was based on modifications of real events |
| 22:43.26 | Dagmar | ...up to and including the revelation about handling other people's drug money. |
| 22:43.42 | Lunessa | It's a good read. |
| 22:44.15 | Lunessa | I just finished Anathem by Stephenson too. |
| 22:44.22 | Dagmar | Very nice |
| 22:45.57 | Lopeppeppy | I'm working through Robin Hobb's Soldier Son trilogy. Very good. |
| 22:46.45 | Lunessa | I'm working my way through manually resetting the passwords on 100 accounts... |
| 22:47.03 | A-KO | ouch |
| 22:47.09 | A-KO | vbscript ftw? |
| 22:47.57 | Lunessa | I'm an admin, but my rights are restricted - I can't talk to Active directory via scripting - because I'm not THE admin. |
| 22:50.46 | Lunessa | And I'm cleaning up the mess from someone else's script explosion. /sigh |
| 22:52.06 | Dagmar | Yuck |
| 22:53.24 | Lunessa | I'm all for tight security on access to the things that grant access. But there are times when the restrictions chafe. |
| 22:54.32 | Lopeppeppy | I have to upload and link 104 pdf files tomorrow. I could batch upload them, but then the software won't recognize them for linking. *grimace* |
| 22:55.45 | Lunessa | Don't think about it tonight. Sufficient unto the day, the evils thereof. |
| 22:57.34 | Lopeppeppy | Yeah, today was evil enough, it should be ove rsoon! |
| 23:04.04 | *** join/#wowuidev Shirik (n=mpdelbuo@WoWUIDev/WoWIStaff/Norganna/StatisticalEngineer/Shirik) |
| 23:04.04 | *** mode/#wowuidev [+o Shirik] by ChanServ |
| 23:04.28 | Shirik | ScytheBlade1: ping |
| 23:04.36 | Shirik | kd3: ping |
| 23:04.49 | ScytheBlade1 | Shirik: you have the best/worst timing, as I *just* got home from a 4.5h interview |
| 23:06.51 | jpmogran | those are fun |
| 23:11.11 | Lopeppeppy | Holy hell-screening, ScytheBlade1. |
| 23:12.09 | ScytheBlade1 | It was a heck of an interview |
| 23:12.15 | ScytheBlade1 | And I have another one with another company thursday |
| 23:15.28 | alestane | The Blizzard interview was almost that long, but only if you counted the programming test, and they gave me food in the middle. |
| 23:15.52 | *** join/#wowuidev Movix (n=Movix@mail.schiffmann.fr) |
| 23:17.25 | ScytheBlade1 | heh, mine started at 1:00 |
| 23:17.28 | ScytheBlade1 | So no lunch |
| 23:19.01 | Lopeppeppy | Just the post-lunch coma |
| 23:19.34 | alestane | I occasionally wish that Lua had something like Python's for...: else: cunstruction. |
| 23:19.37 | alestane | sp* |
| 23:20.03 | Dagmar | I think perhaps the Python people would be a little upset |
| 23:21.28 | jpmogran | oh cool they are remaking elite |
| 23:22.58 | jpmogran | lets hope they dont screw it up |
| 23:23.45 | mikma | shirik: http://kuvaton.com/kuvei/yes_sir.jpg |
| 23:24.20 | theorbtwo | Why would te python people be upset by Lua being inspired by them? |
| 23:28.42 | Dagmar | I still think most of them don't care for for...else |
| 23:32.02 | Lunessa | Joe Biden - The Dan Quayle of 2009 - http://www.slate.com/id/2228872/?GT1=38001 |
| 23:35.06 | *** join/#wowuidev MrRuben5 (n=MrRuben5@85.148.20.110) |
| 23:35.18 | WobWork | ok, I have a variable list of tags. I also have 5 weighting fonts to size these tags depending on how many tags of each occur in a grouping. What's the best way to apply an appropriate weighting to a list of tags where I have a collection of {tag, count} |
| 23:43.36 | *** join/#wowuidev ajmitch (n=ajmitch@172.41.255.123.static.snap.net.nz) |
| 23:51.36 | *** join/#wowuidev Thelyna (n=burp@219-89-246-193.adsl.xtra.co.nz) |
| 23:52.11 | Lunessa | WobWork: You're applying larger font sizes to stings based on the count? |
| 23:57.11 | WobWork | Lunessa: yeah |
| 23:57.14 | WobWork | it's for a tag cloud |
| 23:57.57 | Lunessa | You only have 5 weights, so it's ranges for sure. Any idea how large the counts might get? |
| 23:58.01 | mikma | wobwork: cumulus? nimbus? |
| 23:58.25 | WobWork | Lunessa: no, but lets say at most, 25 tags |
| 23:59.11 | Lunessa | Oh wait, you want a multi-dimensional value, not just the count of the tag? |
