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| 00:07.59 | bleeter | lolol |
| 00:08.11 | *** join/#wowuidev Matrix110| (i=Matrix11@ip-95-222-224-247.unitymediagroup.de) |
| 00:08.11 | bleeter | someone needs to get their bot under control :P |
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| 00:09.14 | NeoTron | I suspect join/leave spam... since I see nothing and I'm blocking it |
| 00:09.18 | NeoTron | or nick changing |
| 00:09.18 | ckknight | hmm |
| 00:09.34 | ckknight | restarting it |
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| 00:11.15 | *** join/#wowuidev Repo (n=supybot@repos.curseforge.net) |
| 00:11.41 | Hirsute | So, did Blizz kill /castrandom with 3.2? |
| 00:12.26 | *** join/#wowuidev Repo (n=supybot@repos.curseforge.net) |
| 00:13.00 | Legorol | Hirsute: "kill" in what sense? |
| 00:13.09 | Legorol | the command is still there, and still does what it was originally intended for |
| 00:13.11 | Hirsute | Legorol: Does it no longer work? |
| 00:13.27 | Legorol | it just can't be used for facerolling anymore |
| 00:13.28 | Hirsute | Interesting. I've just seen/heard people grumbling about it here and there. |
| 00:13.32 | Legorol | yes |
| 00:13.44 | Legorol | people used /castrandom beyond its intended use for semi-automating spellcasting |
| 00:13.53 | Legorol | that ability got nerfed |
| 00:13.57 | Hirsute | Can't be used for facerolling = can't be used with combat spells? What's different about it now? |
| 00:13.57 | Legorol | that's what people grumble about |
| 00:14.15 | Legorol | ok, the way it was used is this: |
| 00:14.26 | Legorol | /castrandom Spell A, Spell B, Spell C |
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| 00:14.35 | Legorol | let's say all three spells have long-ish cooldowns (5-10 seconds) |
| 00:14.41 | Legorol | and your aim is to always cast whichever is not on cooldown atm |
| 00:14.41 | Hirsute | Okay |
| 00:14.48 | Legorol | what you did before 3.2 is spam that macro |
| 00:14.56 | Legorol | eventually it will attempt to cast the right spell |
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| 00:15.01 | Hirsute | Okay |
| 00:15.18 | Legorol | all you needed is one key, you smash it, and it will cast whichever spell is not on cooldown basically |
| 00:15.29 | Hirsute | I'm with you. |
| 00:15.59 | Legorol | this behaviour depends on a key fact though: /castrandom "rerolled the die" each time you pressed the macro |
| 00:16.04 | Legorol | this is what was changed in 3.2 |
| 00:16.20 | Hirsute | Does it only reroll on successful cast now? |
| 00:16.26 | Legorol | it now behaves as follows: the first time you press the macro, it picks a spell at random from the list and *remembers* that selection until you successfully cast it |
| 00:16.29 | Legorol | yes |
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| 00:16.36 | Hirsute | Slick fix. |
| 00:16.40 | Legorol | idd |
| 00:16.48 | Hirsute | Makes sense. |
| 00:16.53 | Legorol | it does have minor sideeffects for the intended use as well, |
| 00:17.09 | Legorol | for example a random mount macro, if you cancel the mount casting before it completes, will attempt to cast the same mount again |
| 00:17.16 | Legorol | but that's a very minor issue |
| 00:17.29 | Legorol | i wouldn't even necessarily call it an issue |
| 00:17.29 | Hirsute | Actually one I'd have preferred, myself. |
| 00:17.37 | Legorol | yeah me too |
| 00:18.00 | Legorol | although i did use my random mount macro like this: when i was in the mood, i let it choose randomly, and when i was after a specific mount, i'd spam it until it cast the right one |
| 00:18.03 | Legorol | i now can't do the latter |
| 00:18.06 | Hirsute | Star calling my mount, accidentally move, it'd be nice to have it keep the same mount until I actually mounted up. |
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| 00:18.14 | Hirsute | Ah |
| 00:18.31 | Hirsute | I moved to using an addon for that anyway, with the changes to mounts in Wrath |
| 00:18.47 | Legorol | sure, addon solves that problem, if you even consider it a problem, which i don't |
| 00:18.55 | Legorol | it was silly to spam a random macro anyway to get to a desired mout |
| 00:18.57 | Legorol | *mount |
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| 00:20.05 | Hirsute | *nod* |
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| 00:23.16 | Pytlask | ~lart Repo |
| 00:23.16 | purl | whips out a shotgun, trudges over to Repo, and goes postal |
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| 00:36.05 | Cloudwolf | ~lart purl |
| 00:36.05 | purl | takes a big bite out of cloudwolf's jugular vein |
| 00:36.10 | Cloudwolf | darn |
| 00:36.23 | Cloudwolf | that hurt my fealings purl |
| 00:36.28 | Cloudwolf | and i can't spell... |
| 00:36.48 | Cloudwolf | ~cookie |
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| 00:48.24 | *** mode/#wowuidev [+o Shirik] by ChanServ |
| 00:50.28 | Cloudwolf | ~cookie |
| 00:50.47 | Cloudwolf | ok that was a random cookie |
| 00:51.28 | Adys | ~cookie |
| 01:03.14 | Cloudwolf | Ok time to be random. Am i the only one who hates the word palindrome because it means a word spelled the same forwards and backwards but the word palindrome isn't a palindrome? unlike the word lisp which has an s and a p sound in it which is hard for people with a lisp to pronounce? |
| 01:03.48 | Adys | but |
| 01:03.54 | Adys | the word lisp doesnt have any parenthese in it |
| 01:04.07 | Cloudwolf | uhhh?... |
| 01:04.13 | Hirsute | buh dum dum psh |
| 01:04.24 | Cloudwolf | that made no sense to my adys |
| 01:04.48 | Hirsute | http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lisp_(programming_language) |
| 01:04.55 | Hirsute | I'm thinking |
| 01:05.06 | Adys | stop invalidating my point |
| 01:05.16 | Adys | "Lisp (programming language)" does have parentheses. |
| 01:05.35 | Cloudwolf | well if i dind't know that lisp was a programming languag ethe joke makes no sense. |
| 01:05.41 | Cloudwolf | ~Lisp |
| 01:05.42 | purl | methinks lisp is a theory that unexpectedly became a programming language http://paulgraham.com/icad.html |
| 01:05.44 | Cide | it does make sense |
| 01:05.58 | Hirsute | Well, yes, but that's just Wikipedia being Wikipedia. |
| 01:06.13 | Cloudwolf | cide the joke doesn't make sense to me with out the forknowledge of Lisp as a programing language... |
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| 01:06.26 | Cide | well it's not our fault you're ignorant |
| 01:07.26 | Adys | see it on the bright side |
| 01:07.42 | Adys | instead of entertaining you, the joke gave you so much more knowledge |
| 01:07.43 | olafski | <PROTECTED> |
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| 01:08.37 | Cide | on a related note |
| 01:08.45 | Cide | "bright" almost contains "light" |
| 01:09.03 | Cide | right? |
| 01:09.05 | Adys | "dark" almost contains "spark" |
| 01:09.06 | Adys | so.. |
| 01:09.07 | mikma | http://techvixen.com/blog/nokia-n900-rx-51-new-tabletsmart-phone-pictures-and-specification-revealed/ |
| 01:11.08 | Cide | boring |
| 01:11.12 | Cide | keyboards are so 2008 |
| 01:11.47 | mikma | .. you do understand that device has touchscreen and keyboard |
| 01:11.57 | Cide | keyboards are so 2008 |
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| 01:12.09 | mikma | and so, so good |
| 01:12.28 | mikma | i'll rather use keyboard than hit the screen |
| 01:12.45 | Adys | I rather hit you with a screen than hit your mom without a keyboard |
| 01:13.15 | mikma | you need the avatar more than fisker |
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| 01:16.58 | mikma | adys: http://www.mmowned.com/forums/avatars/scrawl.gif?dateline=1238203388 |
| 01:18.44 | Adys | Okay. |
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| 01:23.44 | Cloudwolf | am i the only one who enjoys finding glitches inside wow? |
| 01:24.00 | Mikk | i dont enjoy it |
| 01:24.03 | Mikk | i get annoyed |
| 01:24.06 | Adys | I used to, years ago |
| 01:24.08 | kd3 | ^ |
| 01:24.17 | Cloudwolf | heh why do you get annoyed mikk? |
| 01:24.19 | NeoTron | evades. |
| 01:24.25 | Mikk | unless it's fun glitches in the game |
| 01:24.28 | NeoTron | evades. |
| 01:24.35 | Mikk | but mostly i find glitches in the API and get really annoyed |
| 01:24.50 | Adys | now when there's some new mechanic ingame I take my bets on how to break it and im always right. |
| 01:24.53 | Cloudwolf | ah this is actualy in the game and not in the api |
| 01:24.58 | Mikk | and evades, floors that LoS you even though they're flat, and loot bugs == not fun at all |
| 01:25.02 | Adys | the api is actually in the game you know |
| 01:25.08 | Mikk | gamegame |
| 01:25.09 | kd3 | meh, I enjoy breaking the game if it's not doing any damage |
| 01:25.27 | Cloudwolf | im alliance and im inside the horde inn in dalaran :D |
| 01:25.33 | Mikk | now THAT is fun |
| 01:25.37 | Adys | totally. |
| 01:25.41 | kd3 | like back when mobs rode horses and the mount sheeped and the rider attacked with immunity |
| 01:25.47 | kd3 | s/immunity/impunity/ |
| 01:25.53 | kd3 | or the second-last pull in utgarde keep |
| 01:26.04 | Adys | thats wotlk stuff |
| 01:26.06 | Adys | weaksauceas |
| 01:26.19 | kd3 | there's plenty of earlier stuff too, but that was the first thing I remembered |
| 01:26.27 | Cloudwolf | im sad that they fixed the argent squires this last patch |
| 01:26.27 | kd3 | still misses wallrunning |
| 01:26.47 | Cloudwolf | you used to be able to take out your squire get another player to take out their squire |
| 01:26.48 | Adys | cliffwalking \o/ |
| 01:26.57 | Cloudwolf | talk to your friends squire and make your squire hold all of your flags at one time |
| 01:27.42 | Adys | you know what's not fun? |
| 01:27.47 | Adys | Seeing terrain |
| 01:27.52 | Adys | and knowing "Okay, I can't blink here." |
| 01:28.01 | Adys | but in the hope you might be wrong |
| 01:28.04 | Adys | you blink ANYWAY. |
| 01:28.05 | kd3 | I hate you, wsg tunnels |
| 01:28.08 | kd3 | haaaaate |
| 01:28.10 | Adys | but you're never wrong |
| 01:28.17 | Cloudwolf | so you fall through the world? :D |
| 01:28.21 | Adys | no |
| 01:28.25 | kd3 | nah, just blink back a few feet |
| 01:28.27 | Adys | that got fixed long ago |
| 01:28.31 | kd3 | falling through the world was just annoying |
| 01:28.37 | kd3 | especially when original naxx crashed |
| 01:28.42 | Adys | hahah |
| 01:28.55 | Adys | i remember original naxx |
| 01:28.58 | kd3 | oh, hey, we're all falling beneath stonetalon |
| 01:29.00 | Cloudwolf | i think the worst terrain glitch i experienced was in the barrens |
| 01:29.08 | Adys | getting to naxx's eastern plaguelands was awesome |
| 01:29.08 | kd3 | calling the raid, have a good night once you spirit res |
| 01:29.13 | kd3 | yup |
| 01:29.29 | Adys | i remember going to the snowy part thing |
| 01:29.41 | Cloudwolf | lets ee one time i was mounted up in the barrens and kinda walked over this one hill |
| 01:29.52 | Adys | while the guild was still on loatheb |
| 01:29.56 | Cloudwolf | i just fell right through the ground and i kept falling and falling looked at my minimap and i was traveling realy realy realy fast and far |
| 01:29.58 | Adys | "sup guys Im at kel" |
| 01:30.38 | Cloudwolf | and when i ended up landing i fell into artahi highlands |
| 01:30.56 | Adys | some other fun glitch |
| 01:30.59 | Cloudwolf | and i lookd up and saw arathi highlands mobs slowly falling from the sky and they ended up landing on some invisible boarder so i was below them |
| 01:31.02 | kd3 | then of course there's a lot of fun in schadenfraude. like <Overrated> wallhacking to skip most of aq40 |
| 01:31.24 | Adys | exploiting the bg panel |
| 01:31.32 | Adys | to remove wall feedback |
| 01:32.33 | Adys | you used to be able, once you won/lost a bg |
| 01:32.51 | Adys | to force a dc exactly when you hit Leave bg |
| 01:33.30 | Adys | then when you relogged you could walk over walls and shit like that like if it was smooth terrain |
| 01:35.57 | Cloudwolf | i also like the glitch that envolved me learning the language draconic |
| 01:36.05 | Cloudwolf | *involved i can't spell -_- |
| 01:37.17 | Arrowmaster | couldnt you understand draconic while wearing the dragonkin neck for the horde ony key chain? |
| 01:37.39 | Cloudwolf | im alliance |
| 01:37.55 | Cloudwolf | and i never did the onyxia chain |
| 01:38.42 | Hirsute | Now that I'm done reading about Lisp |
| 01:38.47 | Hirsute | And my brain has leaked out my ears. |
| 01:38.51 | Hirsute | *shakes head* |
| 01:39.09 | Cloudwolf | i didn't even read it im like oh look its a programing language and part of hte title has paranthesis ok thats the joke dont care any more lol |
| 01:39.54 | Adys | that wasnt the joke |
| 01:40.04 | Cloudwolf | doesn't matter |
| 01:40.07 | Cloudwolf | i refuse to learn! lol |
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| 01:40.21 | *** mode/#wowuidev [+o Seerah] by ChanServ |
| 01:40.34 | Adys | see that's the kind of behaviour I last saw while I was in primary school |
| 01:40.49 | Cloudwolf | ok its summer and ive already had to deal with summer homework which i still have some |
| 01:41.13 | Cloudwolf | so yeah... im fine with learning but that joke didn't make sense and i wasn't going to read a whole lot to understand it-_- sorry |
| 01:41.41 | Adys | Lisp (or LISP) is a family of computer programming languages with a long history and a distinctive, fully parenthesized syntax. |
| 01:41.44 | Adys | That's not one line |
| 01:41.49 | Adys | thats half a line |
| 01:42.08 | Hirsute | I then read the article that purl linked, and that's when the mind liquidating began. |
| 01:42.12 | Cloudwolf | i read that but meh |
| 01:42.32 | Cloudwolf | dont know what fully parenthesized syntax means... |
| 01:42.49 | Adys | it means a syntax with parentheses. |
| 01:43.01 | Adys | or you could just skip to the codeblocks |
| 01:43.14 | Adys | (if nil (list 1 2 "foo") (list 3 4 "bar")) |
| 01:43.50 | Cloudwolf | that looks really annoying... |
| 01:44.07 | Adys | yea, and that was the joke |
| 01:44.27 | Hirsute | takes away Cloudwolf's grumpy stick |
| 01:44.37 | Elusive | beats Hirsute with a trout. |
| 01:44.46 | Cloudwolf | goes and gets the whole grumpy tree |
| 01:44.51 | Arrowmaster | http://xkcd.com/297/ |
| 01:44.54 | Hirsute | takes the trout and cooks it. |
| 01:44.56 | Adys | Lisp influenced Lua and JavaScript what? |
| 01:46.59 | Hirsute | I think the claim is that languages evolve new features to solve problems that Lisp solved 50 years ago, and that they'll inevitably solve those problems the same way, or by implementing Lisp to solve the problem. Because Lisp was a theory, or paradigm that became a programming language. |
| 01:47.16 | Adys | Fuck you too. |
| 01:47.38 | Elusive | i Think somehow Adys isn't understanding this |
| 01:47.51 | Hirsute | Heh. |
| 01:48.00 | Hirsute | On another note: "About half of the weight gained during the first 4 months of life is in the form of fat, making the 4-month-old infant the fattest healthy human, with about 25-26% of weight as fat." |
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| 01:53.33 | bleeter | arghagrhargharg realm change bug |
| 01:55.05 | smoke__ | what is the converstion for SetStatusBarColor/SetVertexColor? |
| 01:55.21 | smoke__ | i have the r,g,b value in hex what do i need to do to convert it? |
| 01:57.23 | Hirsute | So in hex they are values between 00 and FF (0 and 255, I believe), in WoW, I think it's between 0 and 1, so you'd convert the value to decimal, then divide one by that value. |
| 01:58.28 | Ackis | Fisker does trine suck? |
| 01:58.48 | Mikk | tonumber("FF", 16)/255 -> 1.0 tadaa |
| 02:00.01 | Mikk | thinks |
| 02:00.19 | Ackis | so are there programs that I can record mouse movements/clicks and it'll repeat it for me over a period of time? |
| 02:00.47 | Hirsute | So, if you had 05F3C9, it would be R: 05 (5), G: F3 (243), and B: C9 (201), so if you do that, it think it would work out to roughly R: 0.2, G: 0.95, B: 0.79 |
| 02:00.49 | Codayus | Yes |
| 02:01.28 | Mikk | lua> local n = tonumber("e0f0ff", 16); return (n%256)/255, (n/256%255)/255, (n/65536%255)/255 |
| 02:01.29 | lua_bot | Mikk: 1, 0.82351409313725, 0.88212310192632 |
| 02:01.38 | Mikk | oups damnit other way around |
| 02:01.55 | Mikk | lua> local n = tonumber("e0f0ff", 16); return (n/65536%255)/255, (n/256%255)/255, (n%256)/255 |
| 02:01.56 | lua_bot | Mikk: 0.88212310192632, 0.82351409313725, 1 |
| 02:02.00 | Mikk | .... |
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| 02:02.15 | Mikk | that's not right either |
| 02:02.18 | Hirsute | Correction: You'd convert the value to decimal, then multiply that by 1/255, or just divide by 255. |
| 02:02.36 | Cairenn|afk | mikma: ROFL |
| 02:03.21 | Cairenn|afk | clicked the link and both daughter and I started laughing |
| 02:03.48 | Hirsute | lua> local n = tonumber("05F3C9", 16); return (n/65536%255)/255, (n/256%255)/255, (n%256)/255 |
| 02:03.49 | lua_bot | Hirsute: 0.023342297123928, 0.97562806372549, 0.78823529411765 |
| 02:03.58 | Mikk | lua> local n = tonumber("80c0ff", 16); return (n/65536%256)/255, (n/256%256)/255, (n%256)/255 |
| 02:03.58 | lua_bot | Mikk: 0.50491721957338, 0.75684742647059, 1 |
| 02:04.08 | Mikk | aha slight fubar in doing %255 in some of them :P |
| 02:04.25 | Hirsute | *nod* It was close |
| 02:04.26 | Mikk | lua> local n = tonumber("f8fcff", 16); return (n/65536%256)/255, (n/256%256)/255, (n%256)/255 |
| 02:04.26 | lua_bot | Mikk: 0.97642457251455, 0.99214154411765, 1 |
| 02:04.38 | Mikk | I'll note that there should be some floor()s in there |
| 02:04.46 | Hirsute | lua> local n = tonumber("05F3C9", 16); return (n/65536%256)/255, (n/256%256)/255, (n%256)/255 |
| 02:04.46 | lua_bot | Hirsute: 0.023342297123928, 0.95602022058824, 0.78823529411765 |
| 02:04.52 | Mikk | lua> local n = tonumber("f8fcff", 16); return floor(n/65536%256)/255, floor(n/256%256)/255, floor(n%256)/255 |
| 02:04.53 | lua_bot | Mikk: luabot:1: attempt to call global 'floor' (a nil value) |
| 02:04.56 | Hirsute | Yay, yep, that give sthe numbers I got when doing it by hand... |
| 02:05.02 | Mikk | lua> local n = tonumber("f8fcff", 16); local floor=math.floor; return floor(n/65536%256)/255, floor(n/256%256)/255, floor(n%256)/255 |
| 02:05.02 | lua_bot | Mikk: 0.97254901960784, 0.98823529411765, 1 |
| 02:05.14 | Hirsute | Well, almost |
| 02:05.22 | Mikk | it does with the floor |
| 02:05.54 | Mikk | (and if anyone wonders why i'm dicking around with floor and mod instead of just extracting the 2 letters.... then you haven't understood Lua garbage collection yet) |
| 02:06.09 | Hirsute | lua> local n = tonumber("05F3C9", 16); local floor=math.floor; return floor(n/65536%256)/255, floor(n/256%256)/255, floor(n%256)/255 |
| 02:06.09 | lua_bot | Hirsute: 0.019607843137255, 0.95294117647059, 0.78823529411765 |
| 02:06.29 | Hirsute | Yep, that gives me exactly what I got when doing it by hand. |
| 02:06.42 | Hirsute | Now I just need to figure out what exactly the floor is doing to make the difference. |
| 02:06.50 | Cloudwolf | lua> print(tonumber("o5F3C9",16) |
| 02:06.50 | lua_bot | Cloudwolf: luabot:1: ')' expected near '<eof>' |
| 02:06.53 | Cloudwolf | lua> print(tonumber("o5F3C9",16)) |
| 02:07.32 | lua_bot | Cloudwolf: nil |
| 02:07.32 | Hirsute | Cloudwolf: That o should be a 0 |
| 02:07.32 | Cloudwolf | lua> print(tonumber("05F3C9",16)) |
| 02:07.32 | lua_bot | Cloudwolf: 390089 |
| 02:08.34 | Cloudwolf | lua> print(tonumber("05",16)) |
| 02:08.35 | lua_bot | Cloudwolf: 5 |
| 02:08.48 | Cloudwolf | heh... |
| 02:08.54 | Cloudwolf | im not savy in the ways of hexcoding... |
| 02:09.01 | Legorol | 5 is 5 |
| 02:09.32 | Legorol | not sure why you are surprised |
| 02:09.41 | Hirsute | Hex is just base sixteen instead of base ten |
| 02:09.41 | Cloudwolf | because 05f3c9 is 390089 |
| 02:09.53 | Hirsute | So everything up to 9 will be the same in either |
| 02:10.04 | Legorol | 05f3c9 is in hex, 390089 is in decimal |
| 02:10.12 | Legorol | lua> print(tonumber("5",16)); print(tonumber("9",16)); print(tonumber("A",16)); print(tonumber("F",16)); print(tonumber("10",16)) |
| 02:10.12 | lua_bot | Legorol: 5, 9, 10, 15, 16 |
| 02:10.27 | Hirsute | Once you cross nine, however... 0A in hex = 10 in decimal |
| 02:10.46 | Legorol | tonumber(x, 16) just means convert the hexadecimal number in the string x into decimal |
| 02:11.04 | Hirsute | Up to 0F in hex equals 16 in decimal, and 10 in hex equals 17 in decimal. |
| 02:11.12 | Legorol | Hirsute: 0F is 15 :P |
| 02:11.26 | Legorol | and 10 is 16 |
| 02:11.26 | Cloudwolf | lua> print(tostring(255,16)) |
| 02:11.26 | lua_bot | Cloudwolf: 255 |
| 02:11.31 | Hirsute | Legorol: Thanks for catching my sloppy |
| 02:11.32 | Cloudwolf | >.> lol nvm then |
| 02:11.50 | Legorol | hexa-decimal: base ten+six |
| 02:12.00 | Legorol | so 10 hex = 16 decimal |
| 02:12.29 | Legorol | Cloudwolf: tostring doesn't take a second argument |
| 02:12.41 | Legorol | tonumber does, its second argument just says what base to interpret the string in |
| 02:12.43 | Cloudwolf | unfroutnalty your talking to me as if i know anything. Which somehow is a misconception you have. |
| 02:12.44 | Legorol | maybe this will help: |
| 02:13.02 | Legorol | lua> print(tonumber("321")) |
| 02:13.02 | lua_bot | Legorol: 321 |
| 02:13.12 | Legorol | tonumber's function is to convert a string into a number |
| 02:13.26 | Cloudwolf | yes... that much i know :P |
| 02:13.35 | Legorol | by default, it assumes the number inside the string is in decimal |
| 02:13.40 | Legorol | you can modify that behaviour |
| 02:13.54 | Legorol | so there really are two things happening when you write tonumber("ABC", 16) |
| 02:13.54 | Cloudwolf | decimal means the standard form correcT? |
| 02:14.11 | Legorol | yes |
| 02:14.26 | Hirsute | Yes, decimal is what most humans count in* |
| 02:14.29 | Legorol | with tonumber("ABC", 16), two things happen: one is that you are converting a string into a number, |
| 02:14.31 | Hirsute | *Except the geeks |
| 02:14.40 | Legorol | and another is that you are converting from one number base to another |
| 02:14.40 | Hirsute | Hrmm |
| 02:14.48 | Cloudwolf | woudlnt 1 be 1 2 is 2 up until you need to hit 10 which would be a? 11 is b? |
| 02:14.49 | Legorol | these are conceptually two different steps, but performed in one go |
| 02:15.06 | Legorol | Cloudwolf: correct |
| 02:15.10 | Hirsute | lua>local n=tonumber("ABC") return n |
| 02:15.10 | lua_bot | Hirsute: nil |
| 02:15.19 | Hirsute | Oh good, I was wondering what would happen there. |
| 02:15.20 | Cloudwolf | so would 1f be 16? |
| 02:15.26 | Hirsute | No |
| 02:15.29 | Legorol | lua> print(tonumber("9", 16)); print(tonumber("A", 16)); print(tonumber("B", 16)) |
| 02:15.30 | lua_bot | Legorol: 9, 10, 11 |
| 02:15.38 | Hirsute | 1f would be 16 + 15, or 31 |
| 02:15.48 | Legorol | Cloudwolf: let's start by understanding how standard decimal numbers work |
| 02:15.51 | Hirsute | Just like in decimal, 11 is 10 + 1 |
| 02:16.06 | Legorol | when you write 123, what you mean is: "take 1 piece of 100, plus 2 pieces of 10, and 3 pieces of 1" |
| 02:16.27 | Legorol | it's the same concept in any other number base as well |
| 02:16.41 | Cloudwolf | 100 + 20 + 3 = 123 |
| 02:16.41 | Kraps | NCsoft aims for Aion to be second only to WoW in US |
| 02:16.44 | *** join/#wowuidev tem (n=tardmrr@WoWUIDev/WoWI/Dongle/Tem) |
| 02:16.46 | *** mode/#wowuidev [+v tem] by ChanServ |
| 02:16.48 | Legorol | when you write 123 in hexadecimal, it means: "take 1 piece of 16*16, take 2 pieces of 16, and 3 pieces of 1" |
| 02:17.20 | Legorol | hence 1F is "1 piece of 16, and 15 pieces of 1" |
| 02:17.31 | Cloudwolf | ok so if f is 15 how would you make 16 ? would it be f1? |
| 02:17.39 | Mikk | 10 |
| 02:17.46 | Legorol | Cloudwolf: ask the same question in decimal |
| 02:17.53 | Legorol | if 9 is 9, how would you make 10? |
| 02:18.06 | Cloudwolf | add 1... |
| 02:18.06 | Mikk | 1,2,3,4,5,6,7,8,9,a,b,c,d,e,f,10,11,12,13,14,15,16,17,18,19,1a,1b,1c,1d,1e,1f,20 |
| 02:18.09 | Legorol | you would make it by taking 1 piece of 10, and 0 pieces of 1 |
| 02:18.14 | Legorol | 10 = 1*10+0 |
| 02:18.26 | Mikk | lua> format("%x", 256) |
| 02:18.26 | lua_bot | Mikk: luabot:1: attempt to call global 'format' (a nil value) |
| 02:18.31 | Mikk | lua> string.format("%x", 256) |
| 02:18.32 | lua_bot | Mikk: 100 |
| 02:18.39 | Legorol | Cloudwolf: ok, maybe this will help: |
| 02:18.57 | Legorol | when you write down any number in any number base, the general rule is this: |
| 02:19.26 | Legorol | the last digit is how many 1s you add. the 2nd to last digit is how many times you add the base number. the 3rd to last digit is how many times you add the base number squared |
| 02:19.27 | Legorol | and so on |
| 02:19.36 | Arrowmaster | try this, first learn binary, then octal, then hex will just make sense |
| 02:19.42 | Legorol | in decimal: 123 = 1*10*10+2*10+3 |
| 02:20.23 | Legorol | a hexadecimal example: CBA = 12*16*16+11*16+10 |
| 02:20.24 | Cloudwolf | binary is 01=1 10=2 11=3 100=4 101=5 110=6 111=7 blah blah blah blah i know binary decently |
| 02:20.38 | Legorol | no you don't know binary decently imo |
| 02:20.39 | Arrowmaster | do you know octal? |
| 02:20.45 | Legorol | if you didn't understand the general principle |
| 02:21.02 | Cloudwolf | arrow master no i do not know octal |
| 02:21.08 | Legorol | binary is: each digit represents how many times the appropriate power of two you need |
| 02:21.34 | Mikk | decimal is: each digit represents how many times the appropriate power of 10 you need |
| 02:21.36 | Legorol | 111 works out as 7 because it means "take 1 piece of 2*2, 1 piece of 2 and 1 piece of 1" |
| 02:21.43 | Legorol | in other words: 2^2 + 2^1 + 2^0 |
| 02:21.51 | Cloudwolf | -_- im starting to get a bloody headache.... |
| 02:22.02 | Arrowmaster | 111101101, here is a binary number, in octal the same number is 755 |
| 02:22.34 | Legorol | Cloudwolf: ok, back to binary. tell me how you would figure out what the binary number 111101101 is in decimal |
| 02:22.39 | Cloudwolf | 10^=1 10^1=10 10^2=100 10^3=1000.... |
| 02:22.46 | Legorol | exactly |
| 02:23.14 | Elusive | Yeah, I'm having a hard time following this but I need to learn it |
| 02:23.25 | Legorol | so if i write decimal 38193, it means: 3*10^4+8*10^3+1*10^2+9*10^1+3*10^0 |
| 02:23.31 | Cloudwolf | see i never learend the rule about each new place being to the next power |
| 02:23.58 | Legorol | ok, now you know |
| 02:24.06 | Legorol | that's how numbers are composed, in any number base, even decimal |
| 02:24.15 | Legorol | you can use money as an example if you like |
| 02:24.19 | Hirsute | *nod* each place has units equal to the base raised to a power equal to the number of places before it. |
| 02:24.26 | Cloudwolf | lua>print(tonumber(f,16)) |
| 02:24.27 | lua_bot | Cloudwolf: luabot:1: bad argument #1 to 'tonumber' (string expected, got nil) |
| 02:24.34 | Cloudwolf | lua>print(tonumber("f",16)) |
| 02:24.35 | lua_bot | Cloudwolf: 15 |
| 02:24.46 | Legorol | let's stick to decimal system for now |
| 02:24.52 | Cide | "before it" breaks down for places <0 |
| 02:24.54 | Legorol | in decimal, each digit runs from 0 to 9 |
| 02:25.04 | Adys | you know i think if mankind used binary instead of decimal as a general-use base it'd have evolved faster |
| 02:25.12 | Cide | no way |
| 02:25.12 | Legorol | lol |
| 02:25.19 | Legorol | i agree with cide |
| 02:25.28 | Legorol | it can use any base it wants that is reasonably large |
| 02:25.35 | Legorol | anything from about 6 onwards would've worked imo |
| 02:25.48 | Legorol | matching it to the number of fingers you have is a definite plus :) |
| 02:26.03 | Legorol | but for example it was matched to 12 historically in many cases |
| 02:26.07 | Adys | most of my fingers are busy with porn |
| 02:26.12 | tekkub | I vote for base-5 personally |
| 02:26.14 | Arrowmaster | btw i suggested starting with binary and octal for a reason, once you understand octal, hex will fall into place really easly because theres a shortcut |
| 02:26.17 | *** join/#wowuidev tardmrr (n=tardmrr@WoWUIDev/WoWI/Dongle/Tem) |
| 02:26.17 | *** mode/#wowuidev [+v tardmrr] by ChanServ |
| 02:26.19 | Shirik | I prefer base 1 |
| 02:26.21 | Adys | see tekkub thought the same as me |
| 02:26.37 | Legorol | Shirik: go back to your prison cell, carving notches :P |
| 02:26.40 | Adys | well I don't know Legorol |
| 02:26.44 | Adys | maybe not binary |
| 02:26.46 | Shirik | :( |
| 02:26.55 | tekkub | base-5 lets you do 1-30 on your fingers |
| 02:26.56 | Hirsute | Cide: You're correct. It's an over simplification, though you can work aorund it because when you put the "." there, you can say you have -1, -2, -3 places "before it", and it works out. But that's a "dirty hack" of a way to think about it. |
| 02:27.03 | tekkub | base-10 is only 1-10 |
| 02:27.04 | Shirik | notches is base 1, byw |
| 02:27.06 | Shirik | btw* |
| 02:27.07 | Adys | tekkub: while watching porn? |
| 02:27.19 | Legorol | tekkub: you can do lot more than 10 on your fingers |
| 02:27.25 | Shirik | ... |
| 02:27.28 | Shirik | notches is base 2* |
| 02:27.33 | Legorol | use one hand to count from 0 to 10 |
| 02:27.38 | Legorol | and the other to count the tens |
| 02:27.41 | Legorol | you can get up to 100 that way |
| 02:27.48 | Cloudwolf | lua>print(tostring(1^.5)) |
| 02:27.49 | lua_bot | Cloudwolf: 1 |
| 02:28.09 | Legorol | on way to count from 0 to 10 on one hand is to start raising fingers (for example starting with thumb), and after 5, you start lowering fingers |
| 02:28.13 | Adys | Legorol: I can count floats on my hands! |
| 02:28.19 | Shirik | nah Legorol |
| 02:28.19 | Legorol | so only thumb raised is 1, whereas only thumb lowered is 6 |
| 02:28.26 | Shirik | screw that |
| 02:28.32 | tekkub | and then what do you do if you can't remember if you raised the finger or not? |
| 02:28.33 | Shirik | only forefinger = 1 |
| 02:28.37 | Legorol | did you know that Japanese count in a way similar to that? |
| 02:28.38 | Shirik | only thumb = 6 |
| 02:28.42 | Arrowmaster | yes |
| 02:28.43 | Hirsute | Interesting, |
| 02:29.00 | Hirsute | Binary only gives you one extra unit over base 5 |
| 02:29.02 | Legorol | they start counting 1, 2, 3 by starting with an open palm, and closing their thumb first, then index finger |
| 02:29.20 | Elusive | lua> string.gsub(strsub(string.gsub("Testing <replace>", "<replace>", "This|Script"),1,-2), "|, "-") |
| 02:29.21 | lua_bot | Elusive: luabot:1: unfinished string near '<eof>' |
| 02:29.23 | Shirik | well |
| 02:29.25 | Shirik | using that logic |
| 02:29.33 | Legorol | i know you could use your fingers as binary |
| 02:29.39 | Legorol | in which case you can get up to 2^10-1 |
| 02:29.43 | Shirik | we should be able to have base 32 |
| 02:29.46 | Legorol | but that'd be too complicated |
| 02:30.06 | Shirik | But hell |
| 02:30.07 | Shirik | why stop there |
| 02:30.12 | Adys | hex could have worked on a common-use base |
| 02:30.13 | Cloudwolf | any way back to learning how to use decimal to beable to learn hexadecimal? XD |
| 02:30.20 | Shirik | We could have "finger extended" "finger down" and "finger half way up" |
| 02:30.24 | Shirik | lua> 3^5 |
| 02:30.24 | lua_bot | Shirik: 243 |
| 02:30.28 | Shirik | base 243! |
| 02:30.44 | Adys | hey Shirik |
| 02:30.57 | Legorol | Cloudwolf: it would all start making sense to you if you recognised this very important point about the relationship between a number and its digits: |
| 02:31.03 | Adys | come up with a decent way to represent floating points on your hands |
| 02:31.10 | Hirsute | Cloudwolf: Sure. So, in decimal, you have numbers representing values, 0-9. 10 values for each "place", thus why it's base 10. |
| 02:31.26 | Legorol | each digit in a number means how many times you take an appropriate power of the base number |
| 02:31.29 | Elusive | lua> string.gsub(strsub(string.gsub("Testing <replace>", "<replace>", "This|Script"),1,-2), "|", "-") |
| 02:31.29 | lua_bot | Elusive: luabot:1: attempt to call global 'strsub' (a nil value) |
| 02:31.31 | Shirik | Adys: Left hand is mantissa, right hand is exponent |
| 02:31.37 | Legorol | for decimal, the base numbers are 10^0, 10^1, 10^2 etc. |
| 02:31.53 | Legorol | as i said before: 432 is 4*100 + 3*10 + 2*1 |
| 02:31.55 | Elusive | lua> string.gsub(string.sub(string.gsub("Testing <replace>", "<replace>", "This|Script"),1,-2), "|", "-") |
| 02:31.55 | lua_bot | Elusive: Testing This-Scrip, 1 |
| 02:31.59 | Hirsute | In hexadecimal, you have symbols 0-F representing values, 16 values for each "place", so each successive place equals 16^n+1, where n is the "place" you're currently at. |
| 02:31.59 | Mikk | invented a 16-bit float for a net management app thingy.. it sucked. |
| 02:32.00 | Elusive | kk, ^ my last test spam |
| 02:32.05 | Legorol | if you understand this role of a digit, you'll understand the rest |
| 02:32.12 | Shirik | so only left thumb up = 1 * 2^0 = 1 |
| 02:32.21 | Shirik | both thumbs up = 1 * 2^1 = 2 |
| 02:32.42 | Mikk | thumb up arse = floating poo error |
| 02:32.59 | Shirik | left thumb and all right fingers up = 1 * 2^-1 = 1/2 |
| 02:33.03 | Legorol | for hexadecimal, the base is 16, so each digit represents how many times you take an appropriate power of 16 |
| 02:33.59 | Legorol | take the hexadecimal number 1A5 as an example: 1(the digit)*256(=16^2) + A(the digit)*16^1 + 5(the digit)*16^0 |
| 02:34.06 | Legorol | the digit "A" is 10 |
| 02:34.20 | Cloudwolf | lua>print(tonumber("10",16)) |
| 02:34.20 | lua_bot | Cloudwolf: 16 |
| 02:34.22 | Legorol | so 1A5 hexadecimal = 1*256 + 10*16 + 5 |
| 02:34.23 | Cloudwolf | yay XD |
| 02:34.31 | Adys | Shirik: but thats an awfully low precision and range then |
| 02:34.38 | Legorol | Cloudwolf: explain why that works, by breaking "10" down to digits like i did |
| 02:34.45 | Shirik | we only have 10 bits to work with |
| 02:34.50 | Shirik | what are you going to do |
| 02:35.05 | Adys | okay |
| 02:35.22 | Adys | keep your thumbs off your hands so you have 8 bits to work with |
| 02:35.30 | Cloudwolf | 1*16^1+0*16^0=16 |
| 02:35.44 | Legorol | btw, not all languages have a separate word for thumb |
| 02:35.46 | Arrowmaster | lua> tonumber("10000",2), tonumber("20",8), tonumber("16",10), tonumber("10",16) |
| 02:35.47 | lua_bot | Arrowmaster: 16, 16, 16, 16 |
| 02:35.55 | Legorol | in most languages, there is only "finger", and you have 10 of them |
| 02:36.28 | Adys | use your left thumb to represent whether you're in 8 or 16bit mode |
| 02:36.33 | Adys | and |
| 02:36.42 | Legorol | agod |
| 02:36.43 | Adys | your right thumb as the sign |
| 02:36.53 | Adys | and with that you can probably represent a 16-bit float |
| 02:37.08 | Adys | also Legorol |
| 02:37.08 | Legorol | Adys: where do you get 16-bit of info out of 8 fingers? |
| 02:37.23 | Mikk | wonders that too |
| 02:37.30 | Mikk | then again the french are all mutants |
| 02:37.32 | Shirik | too |
| 02:37.53 | Adys | hmm |
| 02:37.54 | Cloudwolf | lua> print(1*10^.5) |
| 02:37.54 | lua_bot | Cloudwolf: 3.1622776601684 |
| 02:37.57 | Adys | thats a good question |
| 02:38.15 | Adys | hold on |
| 02:38.26 | Legorol | ultimately, as long as your fingers (and thumbs) can have only 2 states, the maximal information content of your hands are 2^10 |
| 02:38.45 | Cloudwolf | lua> print(1*10^.1) |
| 02:38.45 | lua_bot | Cloudwolf: 1.2589254117942 |
| 02:38.47 | Adys | but you got two free thumbs |
| 02:38.57 | Legorol | that's included in the 10 |
| 02:39.03 | Legorol | you can use those 10 bits however you like, it's up to you |
| 02:39.08 | Legorol | but you don't have more than 10 bits |
| 02:39.12 | Mikk | you could indeed use your hands to signal two sets of bits |
| 02:39.14 | Adys | how about |
| 02:39.30 | Mikk | using one thumb as indicator of "now i'm showing the high 9 bits" and "now i'm showing the low 9 bits" |
| 02:39.50 | Adys | yeah |
| 02:39.58 | Legorol | Mikk: that just means you still have 10 bits (or 9 in your case), but you are breaking bigger numbers down to bytes |
| 02:40.03 | Mikk | idd |
| 02:40.10 | Cloudwolf | legorol how would i express a decimal in decimal? XD |
| 02:40.13 | Legorol | you still can't carry more information on your hands at any one time |
| 02:40.21 | Mikk | indeed not |
| 02:40.21 | Adys | however Legorol |
| 02:40.22 | Legorol | Cloudwolf: i gave you loads of examples |
| 02:40.36 | Adys | you can assume if you are showing the high set of bits that the lower one is set to 0 |
| 02:40.37 | Adys | OR |
| 02:40.43 | Adys | you can use two hand states. |
| 02:40.45 | Legorol | 234 = 2*10^2 + 3*10^1 + 4*10^0 |
| 02:40.47 | Mikk | magic up 6 extra thumbs? |
| 02:40.54 | Hirsute | *poof* |
| 02:40.54 | Cloudwolf | legorol i mean like 1.112 |
| 02:41.12 | Hirsute | Cloudwolf: Do you mean in Hex? |
| 02:41.23 | Legorol | you use negative powers |
| 02:41.38 | Legorol | 1.112 = 1*10^0 + 1*10^-1 + 1*10^-2 + 2*10^-3 |
| 02:41.41 | Legorol | it works consistently :) |
| 02:41.46 | Cloudwolf | oh >.> wow i must not be thinking any more lol |
| 02:41.48 | Legorol | it's magic |
| 02:41.52 | Shirik | that's not true, Legorol |
| 02:42.01 | Shirik | your fingers (and thubs) can have more than 2states |
| 02:42.05 | Shirik | what about "half way up" |
| 02:42.14 | Adys | what about "cut off" |
| 02:42.18 | Legorol | Shirik: hence the "as long as you only use two states" condition earlier |
| 02:42.22 | Cide | well |
| 02:42.23 | Mikk | what about base 90? |
| 02:42.28 | Mikk | 1 state per degree of bendedness |
| 02:42.28 | Mikk | omb |
| 02:42.30 | Cide | if we enumerate all the atoms in the fingers |
| 02:42.40 | Shirik | Like I said earlier, if you operate in three states, you can use base 243 |
| 02:42.46 | PProvost | Cairenn: I just updated an addon and I see it god approved but for some reason the date didn't get updated. |
| 02:42.50 | Cide | then we can enumerate all numbers from 1 to N, where N is the Nth permutation of all atoms in the fingers |
| 02:42.51 | Hirsute | Cide: But that only works if you can individually manipulate all the atoms in the fingers. |
| 02:42.59 | Cide | Hirsute: who says I can't? |
| 02:42.59 | Cairenn | PProvost: that's odd |
| 02:43.04 | Legorol | Shirik: why would you use base 243? for maximal information content, wouldn't base 3 be the best? |
| 02:43.09 | Hirsute | PProvost: Wow. That's got to be a pretty cool addon, if it's god approved. |
| 02:43.10 | Hirsute | >.> |
| 02:43.26 | PProvost | lol |
| 02:43.28 | Adys | god approves and never updates |
| 02:43.29 | Adys | deja vu there |
| 02:44.17 | Shirik | Legorol: It's easier to count |
| 02:45.07 | Legorol | Shirik: if you have half-bent as a state, i still only get up to 20 with fully open hands, if i follow conventional counting |
| 02:45.19 | Kraps | how many of you are going to buy aion? |
| 02:45.24 | Shirik | screw that |
| 02:45.29 | Legorol | it'd go like this: from 1 to 10, your 10 fingers all reach the half-bent state, then from 11 to 20, the fully extended state |
| 02:45.43 | Legorol | so how do you figure base 243 |
| 02:45.45 | Adys | Legorol: um |
| 02:45.51 | Shirik | lua> 3^5 |
| 02:45.52 | lua_bot | Shirik: 243 |
| 02:46.08 | Adys | thats wrong Shirik |
| 02:46.16 | Legorol | firstly, you have 10 fingers |
| 02:46.18 | Adys | shouldn't it be 5^3 ? |
| 02:46.22 | Shirik | I'm talking about one hand here |
| 02:46.23 | Legorol | secondly, your base is 3 then, not 243 |
| 02:46.29 | Shirik | nah |
| 02:46.35 | Shirik | because then your other hand counts the sets of 243 |
| 02:46.45 | Legorol | right |
| 02:46.45 | Shirik | using traditional counting |
| 02:46.58 | Legorol | the information content is still 3^10 though |
| 02:47.06 | Mikk | following that logic, decimal is a combination of base10, base100, base1000, etcetc |
| 02:47.08 | Shirik | nope |
| 02:47.15 | Shirik | 3^5 * 5 |
| 02:47.20 | Mikk | blinks |
| 02:47.34 | Legorol | that traditional counting on the left? |
| 02:47.39 | Sesshu | hello guys |
| 02:47.47 | Legorol | so you go to the length of using base 243 on the right hand, |
| 02:47.55 | Shirik | whatever side you feel is a better side to count on, sure |
| 02:47.56 | Legorol | and then screw it all up with an inefficient 1 to 5 on the left |
| 02:47.59 | Shirik | yup |
| 02:48.05 | Legorol | that sucks |
| 02:48.05 | Shirik | it's a compromise |
| 02:48.17 | Shirik | it's to make people not pissed off at the new counting syste |
| 02:48.21 | Legorol | lol |
| 02:48.24 | Legorol | ok, hats off, you win :) |
| 02:48.50 | Legorol | that's got to be the best proposal i ever heard for how to count on your hands |
| 02:49.42 | Shirik | :D |
| 02:50.05 | Cide | what about mine? |
| 02:50.09 | Mikk | i confused a painter recently |
| 02:50.11 | Cide | <Cide> if we enumerate all the atoms in the fingers <Cide> then we can enumerate all numbers from 1 to N, where N is the Nth permutation of all atoms in the fingers |
| 02:50.13 | *** join/#wowuidev TC_ (n=TC@cpe-76-171-31-86.socal.res.rr.com) |
| 02:50.24 | Mikk | took down the kitchen cupboard doors and sent them off for painting |
| 02:50.32 | Cide | where N is the number of permutations of all the atoms in the fingers |
| 02:50.35 | Shirik | how am I supposed to see these atoms |
| 02:50.36 | Mikk | of course i wanted to mark them somehow so i'd know how to put them up again |
| 02:50.46 | Cide | Shirik: who cares? it's the method that counts |
| 02:50.50 | Hirsute | Hrmmm. I wonder if I could use a :s// to prefix a block of code with a specific pattern in Vim... |
| 02:50.54 | Mikk | had a screwdriver. punched ridges at the tops/bottoms (whichever edge i can't see) |
| 02:50.57 | Shirik | no it's the fingers, actually |
| 02:51.01 | Mikk | wanna guess what number system i used? =P |
| 02:51.03 | Shirik | Hirsute: There's a better way |
| 02:51.07 | Cide | get an electron microscope |
| 02:51.10 | Hirsute | Don't say Emacs |
| 02:51.12 | Shirik | no |
| 02:51.13 | Mikk | |-- = door 8 |
| 02:51.13 | Hirsute | Shirik |
| 02:51.14 | Shirik | I love vim |
| 02:51.15 | Hirsute | Okay |
| 02:51.22 | Shirik | you have to go into visual block mode |
| 02:51.28 | Hirsute | Shirik: I already know how to do visual block mode |
| 02:51.31 | Shirik | ok |
| 02:51.37 | Shirik | then highlight the lines you want to prefix |
| 02:51.52 | Hirsute | It was more just a matter of playing with the s// command. Yep, then Shift-I, the prefix pattern, return |
| 02:51.55 | Shirik | ah ok |
| 02:51.57 | Shirik | nm then :( |
| 02:52.20 | Hirsute | Oh, no, that was a trick I wished I'd learned long before I did, so thanks for starting to point it out! |
| 02:52.45 | Hirsute | I learned it, actually, when I started working on Auctioneer, and was trying to put the window protection back in. |
| 02:52.47 | Mikk | can i poke fun at you for using a wonky editor now? =P |
| 02:53.11 | Hirsute | Mikk: But I'm so much faster in it than anything else I've ever used. |
| 02:53.20 | Yssaril | if i have a list of values and i want to chose a random one but each value has a different weight (chance of occuring) whats the easiest (sanest) way of doing this (the total of all weights doesn't have to equal 100 either) say the values can have a weight between 0 and n |
| 02:53.30 | Mikk | But you seem to have problems with the basics =) |
| 02:53.57 | Hirsute | Mikk: No, no problems with the basics, I already knew how to do it, it was moer just a matter of, "I wonder if I *could* do it this way" |
| 02:54.00 | Elusive | lua>function KeyCheck() local trigg = "hello; please"; local t = { strsplit(" ","Hello invite please") } for k, v in pairs(t) do if(strfind(triggs, t[k])) then local found = v end end end print found |
| 02:54.00 | lua_bot | Elusive: luabot:1: '=' expected near 'found' |
| 02:54.05 | Hirsute | But mock all you want! ;) |
| 02:54.10 | Elusive | hmm |
| 02:55.00 | Hirsute | Yssaril: I'd just take each value, multiply it by weight, sum them all up, then generate a random number between the lowest and the total. |
| 02:55.16 | Hirsute | Isn't that how you handle it in Mounted and Critters? |
| 02:55.24 | Mikk | Yssaril: good question. if you ask Shirik, I'm sure he'd tell you to use a very convoluted 3d integral where you describe the probability of a volume belonging to a random subset using imaginary numbers or whatnot |
| 02:55.31 | TC_ | after all that Shirik, i lied. it was bad ram...that decided to play nice for a few days for no reason |
| 02:55.45 | Mikk | grins |
| 02:55.52 | Shirik | huh? |
| 02:55.56 | Mikk | nuttin =) |
| 02:56.00 | Yssaril | Hirsute: naw wanted to avoid the way i did it in mounted |
| 02:56.20 | Shirik | That's an easy problem |
| 02:56.22 | Mikk | For a small subset, sum up the weights |
| 02:56.25 | Shirik | ^ |
| 02:56.33 | Mikk | like 0.2+0.5+1.2 = total 1.9 |
| 02:56.33 | Yssaril | there is simply made a table and added the mounts as many times as the weight and then got a random from that table |
| 02:56.37 | Legorol | Yssaril: roll a single die between 1 and sum of the weights |
| 02:56.39 | Mikk | now take a random number between 0 and 1.9 |
| 02:56.47 | Adys | TC_: so basically |
| 02:56.49 | Cide | easier, but less efficient |
| 02:56.50 | Adys | it wasnt nvidia |
| 02:56.54 | Mikk | and then loop over the table |
| 02:56.54 | Adys | you were wrong |
| 02:56.56 | Adys | I was right |
| 02:56.59 | Mikk | adding weights until you hit your value |
| 02:57.02 | Adys | nvidia makes awesome drivers. |
| 02:57.08 | Shirik | Interestingly enough, we were discussing this last night |
| 02:57.10 | TC_ | Adys: not quite |
| 02:57.12 | Shirik | Lua's RNG is screwed |
| 02:57.16 | Cide | store every entry n times in an array, where n = weight; choose a random entry in the array |
| 02:57.22 | Legorol | Mikk: you can set it up slightly more efficiently |
| 02:57.23 | Shirik | You can ask Lua for a random number between 0 and 2^30 |
| 02:57.23 | Hirsute | Shirik: it is? |
| 02:57.25 | Shirik | and..... |
| 02:57.28 | Legorol | Cide: ouch |
| 02:57.31 | Shirik | lua> math.random(0, 2^30) |
| 02:57.31 | lua_bot | Shirik: 327125360 |
| 02:57.34 | TC_ | Adys: with my 8800GTX i couldnt use the newer drivers |
| 02:57.34 | Shirik | .. |
| 02:57.34 | Mikk | Shirik i could have told you that. it's standard libc. |
| 02:57.35 | Cide | Legorol: much simpler to implement |
| 02:57.36 | Shirik | lua> math.random(0, 2^30) |
| 02:57.36 | lua_bot | Shirik: 641693899 |
| 02:57.40 | Shirik | lua> math.random(0, 2^31) |
| 02:57.40 | lua_bot | Shirik: luabot:1: bad argument #2 to 'random' (interval is empty) |
| 02:57.44 | Shirik | sigh |
| 02:57.47 | Shirik | NOW you work |
| 02:57.51 | Shirik | yesterday it was giving me negative numbers |
| 02:57.58 | Cide | well, neither algorithm is particularly hard to implement |
| 02:58.03 | Mikk | !lua math.random(0,2^31) |
| 02:58.03 | batbot | Mikk: @ [string "return math.random(0,2^31)"]:1: bad argument #2 to 'random' (interval is empty) |
| 02:58.05 | Kraps | http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lj3iNxZ8Dww |
| 02:58.06 | Cide | but I think mine is easier to understand conceptually |
| 02:58.14 | Legorol | Cide: agreed |
| 02:58.16 | Shirik | lua> math.random(0, 2^30) |
| 02:58.16 | lua_bot | Shirik: 462904472 |
| 02:58.19 | Shirik | strange |
| 02:58.20 | Shirik | oh well |
| 02:58.23 | Cloudwolf | well legorol thanks for helping me with that stuff |
| 02:58.25 | Legorol | btw, sounds like Yssaril is making a casino :o) |
| 02:58.29 | Yssaril | Cide: thats what i did origianly it just seams so brutal |
| 02:58.30 | Cloudwolf | im getting off for the night |
| 02:58.33 | Shirik | lua> math.random(-2^30, 2^30) |
| 02:58.33 | lua_bot | Shirik: -1130582489 |
| 02:58.39 | Cide | how many items are we talking? |
| 02:58.39 | Shirik | lua> math.random(0, 2^30) |
| 02:58.39 | lua_bot | Shirik: 184990414 |
| 02:58.40 | Legorol | Yssaril: it is brutal, don't do it |
| 02:58.43 | Shirik | I giveu p |
| 02:58.58 | Mikk | Yssaril: and doesn't work very well with e.g. scale values between 1 and 100 times 20 values |
| 02:59.05 | Mikk | because then you're building arrays of 10k nodes :P |
| 02:59.12 | Legorol | what you really want to do is invert your cumulative distribution function, if you have done that once, you have a very efficient lookup :o) |
| 02:59.21 | Cide | Mikk: if every value has a weight of 100 |
| 02:59.29 | Cide | that's equivalent to every value having a weight of 1 |
| 02:59.40 | Legorol | Cide: he said his weights are unnormalised |
| 02:59.50 | Legorol | so going by the simple algorithm you proposed, you can end up with very large tables |
| 02:59.51 | Cide | so normalize them CHRIST |
| 02:59.57 | Legorol | you didn't say that ;) |
| 03:00.04 | Legorol | whereas Yssaril did say it isn't normalised |
| 03:00.05 | Cide | that much is obvious |
| 03:00.11 | Legorol | not at all imo |
| 03:00.13 | Cide | hey |
| 03:00.14 | Legorol | obvious to you and me |
| 03:00.14 | Mikk | then you get granularity problems though. whether or not that matters is a different matter. |
| 03:00.16 | Yssaril | they will be normalized just havent decided where yet :P |
| 03:00.17 | Legorol | but not to everyone |
| 03:00.17 | Cide | are you taking me for a reader? |
| 03:00.24 | Cide | I just bitch and moan |
| 03:00.27 | Legorol | hehe |
| 03:00.35 | Legorol | Yssaril: normalisation is not a matter of decision |
| 03:00.45 | Legorol | if you think it is, you don't fully understand what normalisation is |
| 03:00.53 | Yssaril | i prolly dont :P |
| 03:01.05 | Legorol | so nvm, forget about it before we confuse the hell out of you |
| 03:01.40 | Legorol | just go with random die roll between 1 and the sum of the weights |
| 03:01.48 | Shirik | anyway |
| 03:01.49 | Shirik | Cide |
| 03:01.56 | Cide | yes |
| 03:01.57 | Shirik | I made a secure random number generator last night |
| 03:02.02 | Shirik | but I need more sources of entropy |
| 03:02.02 | Cide | secure as in? |
| 03:02.04 | Shirik | any ideas? |
| 03:02.04 | Mikk | lua> local t={ 0.3, 0.1, 0.9 }; local sum=0; for k,v in ipairs(t) do sum=sum+v; end; local rnd=math.random(0, sum); for k,v in ipairs(t) do rnd=rnd-v; if rnd<=0 then return k; end end |
| 03:02.04 | lua_bot | Mikk: 3 |
| 03:02.08 | Mikk | lua> local t={ 0.3, 0.1, 0.9 }; local sum=0; for k,v in ipairs(t) do sum=sum+v; end; local rnd=math.random(0, sum); for k,v in ipairs(t) do rnd=rnd-v; if rnd<=0 then return k; end end |
| 03:02.09 | lua_bot | Mikk: 3 |
| 03:02.10 | Cide | background radiation |
| 03:02.10 | Mikk | lua> local t={ 0.3, 0.1, 0.9 }; local sum=0; for k,v in ipairs(t) do sum=sum+v; end; local rnd=math.random(0, sum); for k,v in ipairs(t) do rnd=rnd-v; if rnd<=0 then return k; end end |
| 03:02.10 | Shirik | as in it pulls entropy from the wild |
| 03:02.11 | lua_bot | Mikk: 1 |
| 03:02.14 | Shirik | instead of being hard-coded |
| 03:02.21 | Shirik | like how /dev/random works |
| 03:02.25 | Cide | background radiation |
| 03:02.25 | Legorol | Shirik: the length of the skirt of the news announcer on your local TV station is a good source |
| 03:02.35 | Shirik | how am I supposed to measure background radiation |
| 03:02.37 | Shirik | it's in WoW |
| 03:02.39 | Cide | using a device |
| 03:02.41 | Shirik | there is no GetBackgroundRadiation() |
| 03:02.45 | Cide | oh |
| 03:03.00 | Legorol | in WoW, measure the time between LOGIN and PEW |
| 03:03.05 | Legorol | to say millisecond accuracy |
| 03:03.08 | Cide | that's not entropy :P |
| 03:03.09 | Legorol | that'll be a nice random seed |
| 03:03.12 | Mikk | time between ADDON_LOADED:s |
| 03:03.28 | Mikk | then you get several digits |
| 03:03.38 | Cide | I doubt you can get any true entropy in wow |
| 03:03.44 | Shirik | not looking for a seed, looking for persistent entropy :P |
| 03:03.54 | Legorol | trade chat? |
| 03:03.58 | Shirik | Already done |
| 03:04.02 | Shirik | that was my initial source |
| 03:04.04 | Mikk | mouse positions |
| 03:04.10 | Shirik | I've been considering the mouse position |
| 03:04.18 | Shirik | specifically its differential |
| 03:04.19 | Cide | do recent mouse movement rather than position |
| 03:04.22 | Shirik | yeah |
| 03:04.24 | Mikk | ya |
| 03:04.49 | Mikk | character position |
| 03:04.49 | Cide | maybe some hash of the nameplates around you |
| 03:05.04 | Shirik | I think that might remain consistent for too long, for example, during raids |
| 03:05.05 | Legorol | you can't read those from Lua, can you? |
| 03:05.14 | Cide | you can read nameplates |
| 03:05.17 | Legorol | ok |
| 03:05.22 | Cide | Shirik: combine that with health then |
| 03:05.22 | Shirik | now here's the real question, what do I do after I get some entropy values |
| 03:05.38 | Mikk | how secure do you need to get? |
| 03:05.48 | Shirik | I'm going back and forth between XORing it with a number from math.random() or just using it as the random number itsel |
| 03:05.49 | Shirik | f |
| 03:06.03 | Shirik | Mikk: To the point where statistical randomness tests come out better :) |
| 03:06.20 | Cide | there's no point in doing anything with it |
| 03:06.30 | Legorol | Shirik: what kind of in-WoW application is there for which math.random() isn't enough? :O |
| 03:06.31 | Cide | if they aren't random enough, doing anything with them won't make them more random |
| 03:06.35 | Mikk | that's only true if you have Really Really random values |
| 03:06.42 | Cide | of course, you could combine several sources for more randomness |
| 03:06.43 | Hirsute | Shirik: Do matrix mathematics on the difference in coordinates between you and your most distant guildmate? |
| 03:06.48 | Mikk | Legorol: several. i've had it bite me in the ass. |
| 03:06.52 | Shirik | Legorol: The particular case where this came up was when someone discussed the need to create GUIDs |
| 03:07.15 | Hirsute | Of course, that only works when you're in a giuld. |
| 03:07.19 | Shirik | ... |
| 03:07.20 | Hirsute | s/giuld/guild/ |
| 03:07.30 | Shirik | oh |
| 03:07.34 | Shirik | I thought that was a joke on GUID -> Guild |
| 03:07.41 | Hirsute | Ah, no. |
| 03:07.46 | Legorol | ok, i may be slow right now.. but why do you need random numbers for GUIDs? |
| 03:07.47 | Mikk | GUID as in Actually Global? |
| 03:07.59 | Shirik | well, hopefully, Mikk |
| 03:08.04 | *** join/#wowuidev Movix (n=Movix@mail.schiffmann.fr) |
| 03:08.04 | Shirik | you can never really be sure |
| 03:08.08 | Shirik | unless you're connected to all other clients |
| 03:08.10 | Mikk | If so I'd use something hysterically long |
| 03:08.19 | Cide | Shirik: time since last event |
| 03:08.28 | Shirik | Well the standard definition of GUID would be 128-bit numbers |
| 03:08.32 | Mikk | Like ServernameCharnamePlayedtime |
| 03:08.48 | Mikk | And poll played time at startup |
| 03:08.50 | Shirik | Cide: That's an interesting one |
| 03:08.52 | Legorol | servername+charname is at least almost entirely unique across regions |
| 03:08.57 | Legorol | throw in region there as well |
| 03:09.05 | Mikk | aye but where do you get that? :< |
| 03:09.07 | Legorol | and you are almost there |
| 03:09.08 | Shirik | Ok but anyway we're getting off-topic |
| 03:09.14 | Shirik | there are other solutions to that, sure |
| 03:09.23 | Legorol | i'm still curious why you need more than math.random for GUIDs |
| 03:09.24 | Shirik | but there could be a case where a need arises for a truly random number |
| 03:09.26 | Mikk | Generally speaking, I like the concept of working off of played time |
| 03:09.44 | Mikk | Poll it on startup. Multiply by how many values you MAX need per second. Then just +1 from that every time you need a value. |
| 03:09.46 | Shirik | because if generating a 128-bit GUID, you would probably encounter certain values far more frequently than others |
| 03:09.52 | Legorol | what i'm asking is, what do you gain over math.random by using a truly random number |
| 03:09.55 | Shirik | because the entropy is not sufficient to continue generating a number like that |
| 03:10.05 | Cide | Mikk: I'm not sure if that's entropy |
| 03:10.10 | Mikk | Legorol: math.random needs an actually-random feed to produce a "random" number |
| 03:10.24 | Mikk | Cide: no, no, that's not entropy. that's a guaranteed unique sequence number. |
| 03:10.27 | Mikk | That you won't be repeating |
| 03:10.35 | Mikk | (sorry, 2 discussions at once) |
| 03:10.47 | Cide | ah |
| 03:11.01 | Legorol | thanks for the answers |
| 03:11.29 | Cide | I think Legorol's point is that truly random numbers aren't very often necessary |
| 03:11.48 | Cide | the period is 2^32-1 or something? |
| 03:11.53 | Mikk | a bit less |
| 03:11.57 | Cide | for MT? |
| 03:12.06 | Cide | granted, not sure if that's what math.random uses |
| 03:12.09 | Mikk | libc |
| 03:12.13 | Shirik | libc is not MT |
| 03:12.14 | Mikk | on windows |
| 03:12.17 | Mikk | so it's an LCPRNG |
| 03:13.07 | Mikk | 2^31-1 iirc |
| 03:13.13 | Cide | oh well |
| 03:13.17 | Cide | one number off! |
| 03:13.30 | Cide | and 2^31 random numbers... |
| 03:13.31 | Mikk | more like 2 billion! |
| 03:13.31 | Hirsute | Hrmmm. Maybe take time since login * number of results for a /who of level 1s ^ (total displacement from login location)? |
| 03:13.57 | Cide | who results are too slow |
| 03:14.11 | Mikk | where the hell did my lua hash implementation go.... |
| 03:14.12 | Shirik | anyway, most RNGs actually exhibit a form of patternness even if the true "period" is on the order of 2^32 |
| 03:14.13 | Cide | the function ideally needs to return instantly |
| 03:14.20 | Shirik | let me show a good example |
| 03:14.24 | Cide | well yeah |
| 03:14.30 | Cide | that's the reason there are so many randomness tests |
| 03:14.33 | Legorol | isn't time of creation of GUID (with sufficient accuracy that is higher than the expected frequency of generation) + some unique element (region+realm+char) enough for the purpose? |
| 03:14.41 | Cide | if it only depended on the period those would be unnecessary! |
| 03:14.42 | Mikk | Legorol: quite |
| 03:15.06 | Legorol | granted accurate time might be a problem |
| 03:15.14 | Mikk | no |
| 03:15.15 | Legorol | since clients are not synced and server is a dummy |
| 03:15.15 | Mikk | playedtime |
| 03:15.22 | Mikk | like i said before |
| 03:15.39 | Legorol | but region+realm+char+playedtime is not unique |
| 03:15.45 | Shirik | Here is a plot of random numbers using PHP's rand() on Windows (I believe that's also libc): http://random.org/analysis/randbitmap-wamp.png |
| 03:15.48 | Mikk | .... |
| 03:15.54 | Shirik | ntice how easily your eyes find the pattern |
| 03:16.03 | Mikk | playedtime * 10000000 as base. remember for the rest of the session. +1 each time you need a new index. |
| 03:16.13 | Hirsute | Hrmmm. |
| 03:16.18 | Legorol | Mikk: you are missing my point |
| 03:16.20 | Cide | nice |
| 03:16.28 | Legorol | playedtime is NOT a unique starting point |
| 03:16.46 | Hirsute | You could use ping time, possibly, depending on the granularity you can get... |
| 03:16.47 | Legorol | playedtime can reoccur if a char with the same name is recreated |
| 03:16.52 | Mikk | true |
| 03:17.10 | Mikk | with disgustingly low probability |
| 03:17.12 | Arrowmaster | use player guid too? |
| 03:17.14 | Legorol | which is, in fact, going to occur surprisingly frequently |
| 03:17.25 | Legorol | many people roll a char, don't like it, delete it and restart in the beginning |
| 03:17.31 | Legorol | reusing the same name |
| 03:17.33 | Mikk | since you need to generate GUIDs at the same playedtime as the deleted player did |
| 03:17.46 | Mikk | you have a point there |
| 03:18.13 | Legorol | combine that with the fact that whatever addon needs these GUIDs may well have its settings reset during the process, |
| 03:18.28 | Legorol | and you have no way to distinguish |
| 03:18.32 | NightHawkTheSan1 | Shirik: stop showing me pretty pictures with moire patterns :( |
| 03:18.36 | Shirik | :( |
| 03:18.39 | Shirik | why |
| 03:18.52 | Mikk | player GUID sounds good then |
| 03:18.55 | NightHawkTheSan1 | because i'm not 100% sober, and its seriously distracting me :P |
| 03:19.50 | Shirik | so |
| 03:19.51 | Shirik | regardless |
| 03:19.58 | Shirik | let us assume a need arises for truly random numbers |
| 03:20.12 | Shirik | we've got mouse differential |
| 03:20.17 | Legorol | character facing to 100th of a degree accuracy |
| 03:20.19 | Shirik | time between events |
| 03:20.36 | Mikk | character position & facing |
| 03:20.37 | Legorol | dunno how accurately you can get facing |
| 03:20.38 | Shirik | I would prefer character facing differential |
| 03:20.45 | Shirik | and character position differential |
| 03:20.50 | Legorol | no don't use that shirik, facing differential is bad |
| 03:20.54 | Mikk | what you now do with all these values |
| 03:21.00 | Mikk | is not just add them to an accumulator |
| 03:21.04 | Mikk | you put them in a randompool |
| 03:21.04 | Shirik | hm yeah because you might always turn at the same rate (keyboard turning) |
| 03:21.15 | Mikk | that you get things out of using a good pooled RNG |
| 03:21.15 | Legorol | most mice have predictable dampeners, so camera rotation tends to end in a predictable range |
| 03:21.16 | Shirik | I do that Mikk |
| 03:21.23 | Shirik | I have an entropy pool |
| 03:21.24 | Shirik | that I build |
| 03:21.31 | Shirik | Actually two entropy pools |
| 03:21.33 | Legorol | i'm not saying it's not random, but i don't think it's fully random |
| 03:21.47 | Shirik | Because I provide two random "Devices" (like /dev/random and /dev/urandom) |
| 03:21.52 | Mikk | and yeah while it's tempting to just look at diffs... don't |
| 03:21.58 | Mikk | feed all of it as-is |
| 03:22.05 | Shirik | One is guaranteed-secure, and one is "best effort" |
| 03:22.10 | Shirik | and will reuse entropy if it runs out |
| 03:22.14 | Shirik | So anyway, I keep two entropy pools |
| 03:22.20 | Shirik | the secure one and the insecure one |
| 03:22.40 | Shirik | both go up to 1024 values (32-bit numbers) |
| 03:23.54 | Mikk | seriously i could have sworn i implemented some PRNG in Lua a while ago |
| 03:24.05 | Mikk | LFB maybe? |
| 03:24.49 | *** join/#wowuidev Dashkal (n=dashkal@WoWUIDev/Nexus/dashkal) |
| 03:27.41 | Mikk | Shirik: and what do you do with these pools? |
| 03:27.48 | Shirik | nothing yet |
| 03:27.51 | Shirik | I haven't decided |
| 03:28.06 | Shirik | that was what I was going to do after I got a reasonably reliable source of entropy |
| 03:28.12 | Shirik | right now I only get like 5 entropy values a minute or less |
| 03:28.15 | Hirsute | Does the client only get fps as an integer? |
| 03:28.18 | Mikk | because ideally you want an algorithm that picks 2 values based on previous values and combines them |
| 03:28.27 | Mikk | giving you an N->N interaction of the stuff you've gathered |
| 03:28.39 | Shirik | I was thinking about combining it with math.random though |
| 03:28.47 | Shirik | but that may be a bad idea |
| 03:31.44 | *** join/#wowuidev Relcuse (n=me@71.145.144.208) |
| 03:34.14 | Mikk | So why would I need a better RNG |
| 03:34.25 | Mikk | Something prods my memory saying "needed bigger numbers" |
| 03:34.40 | Shirik | ~weather pdx |
| 03:34.45 | Mikk | And didn't want to use two consecutive math.random() calls concatenated together |
| 03:34.47 | Shirik | ~weather kpdx |
| 03:35.00 | Mikk | Since they have rather unfortunate couplings |
| 03:35.11 | Mikk | The latter being the former * 1231548389 + 29837468273468 for example |
| 03:35.14 | Mikk | (or somesuch) |
| 03:35.54 | *** join/#wowuidev Movix (n=Movix@mail.schiffmann.fr) |
| 03:36.23 | Mikk | blood hell i even remember stealing it from an open source game... |
| 03:36.37 | Shirik | PRNGs are notorious for being bad at large numbers |
| 03:36.50 | Mikk | LCPRNGs* |
| 03:36.50 | Shirik | even a 32-bit number |
| 03:37.14 | Mikk | The bottom bits can exhibit disturbing sequences too |
| 03:37.34 | Mikk | Like the 3 lowest bits on openbsd always going 000 001 010 011 100 101 110 111 .... |
| 03:37.44 | Mikk | wanted to shoot Theo for not noticing that |
| 03:37.46 | Shirik | lol |
| 03:39.19 | bleeter | for those Linux users who ain't seen, yet... http://blog.cr0.org/2009/08/linux-null-pointer-dereference-due-to.html |
| 03:39.30 | Shirik | slooooooooo |
| 03:39.33 | Shirik | w |
| 03:39.44 | Adys | typoooooooo. |
| 03:40.57 | Shirik | you forgot the last o |
| 03:41.33 | bleeter | Shirik: hence the 'ain't seen it yet'... |
| 03:41.43 | Shirik | unacceptable |
| 03:41.44 | bleeter | you really should try to l2english :P |
| 03:41.53 | Shirik | you should l2shirik |
| 03:42.09 | bleeter | you should l2freenode :P |
| 03:42.32 | Shirik | you should l2l |
| 03:43.51 | bleeter | I did l2l, dot point #5 :P http://freenode.net/channel_guidelines.shtml |
| 03:44.30 | Mikk | Shirik: Either way you might want to look at http://www.wowwiki.com/StringHash |
| 03:44.39 | Shirik | I blame Cairenn |
| 03:44.43 | Mikk | It's certainly not an md5.. but it's decent |
| 03:44.47 | Cairenn | :( |
| 03:44.57 | bleeter | Shirik: it's Cairenn's fault you can't read guidelines? :P |
| 03:45.03 | Shirik | yup |
| 03:45.12 | Shirik | she is the mistress, I do what she tells me to do |
| 03:45.27 | Shirik | I decided to do my own hasing algorithm Mikk |
| 03:45.37 | Shirik | Here's what I do for chat messages |
| 03:45.37 | Mikk | You have a lot of experience doing that? =P |
| 03:45.56 | Shirik | I take a block of 32 characters (may span across multiple chat messages if necessary) |
| 03:46.20 | *** join/#wowuidev Iriel (n=Iriel@adsl-71-158-244-138.dsl.pltn13.sbcglobal.net) |
| 03:46.20 | *** mode/#wowuidev [+o Iriel] by ChanServ |
| 03:46.37 | Shirik | Character 1 ^ (character 2 brl 1) ^ (character 3 brl 2) ^ (character 4 brl 3) ^ ... ^ (character 31 brl 30) ^ (character 32 brl 31) |
| 03:46.42 | Shirik | where brl == bit rotate left |
| 03:47.01 | Shirik | I feel that should apply the character's value across all bits evenly |
| 03:47.04 | Mikk | i'd suggest you do some proper tests on the distribution of that |
| 03:47.13 | Shirik | I intend to |
| 03:47.15 | Mikk | but i can tell you straight out that the results will be .... bad |
| 03:47.19 | Shirik | why? |
| 03:47.19 | Mikk | reference http://www.wowwiki.com/StringHash/Analysis |
| 03:47.56 | Mikk | (not to mention the fact that Lua's floats don't have 64 bits of value.. only 50) |
| 03:48.06 | Mikk | (...52) |
| 03:48.08 | Shirik | I'm... not using 64 bits of value |
| 03:48.09 | Shirik | I'm using 32 bits |
| 03:48.17 | Mikk | 32<<31 |
| 03:48.23 | Shirik | bit rotate |
| 03:48.23 | Mikk | ohwait |
| 03:48.24 | Shirik | not bit shift |
| 03:48.31 | Mikk | and that'd still only be 40 |
| 03:48.37 | Shirik | It's.... 32 |
| 03:48.42 | Mikk | nods |
| 03:48.57 | Mikk | either way you might want to sift through my page |
| 03:48.58 | Shirik | Anyway, the distribution should theoretically be even |
| 03:48.59 | Iriel | Shirik: what's the input string? |
| 03:49.06 | Shirik | just based off statistics |
| 03:49.12 | Shirik | Iriel: A random chat message |
| 03:49.17 | Mikk | it has code that you can run too |
| 03:49.47 | Iriel | Random as in from the world, or as in a specifically generated uniformly distributed series of characters? |
| 03:49.57 | Shirik | We're discussing a secure random number generator I've been developing, Iriel. I got the core done, and now we're just discussing how to create entropy |
| 03:49.59 | Mikk | but i was actually more thinking about taking character guids, realm name, etc |
| 03:50.01 | Shirik | from the world |
| 03:50.04 | Mikk | and turning that into a nice little 32-bit value |
| 03:50.15 | Mikk | for your GUID thingy |
| 03:50.21 | Iriel | BEcause text isn't very independent, nor is it even close to uniform |
| 03:50.33 | Shirik | agree, which is why we need more sources of randomness :P |
| 03:50.40 | Shirik | I would be interested in your suggestions |
| 03:50.42 | bleeter | prolly old, too.. but.. lol http://asert.arbornetworks.com/2009/08/twitter-based-botnet-command-channel/ |
| 03:51.00 | Shirik | Chat also doesn't come in fast enough |
| 03:51.05 | *** join/#wowuidev Esamynn (n=chatzill@WoWUIDev/WoWI/Featured/Esamynn) |
| 03:51.05 | *** mode/#wowuidev [+v Esamynn] by ChanServ |
| 03:51.06 | Shirik | btw Mikk that only creates 1/4 of an entropy value |
| 03:51.11 | Shirik | and all of thsi is configurable |
| 03:51.16 | Mikk | yeah like i said, different purpose |
| 03:51.20 | Iriel | Are you trying to create a random seed for something? |
| 03:51.43 | Shirik | nope, trying to create a cryptographically secure random number generator |
| 03:51.57 | Shirik | by using the randomness of the wow environment as entropy |
| 03:52.29 | Shirik | for example, here's one of my sources of entropy right now |
| 03:52.35 | Shirik | (note: in early stages) |
| 03:52.37 | Iriel | Hm, sounds like you really should do some massive data captures, then run randomness tests on the output of various algorithms |
| 03:52.48 | Shirik | oh I will be running tests on the results |
| 03:52.57 | Shirik | but first they have to be implemented |
| 03:53.24 | Mikk | i suggest you take a lead from Yarrow though |
| 03:53.31 | Mikk | (a secure RNG framework design) |
| 03:53.33 | Shirik | http://wowi.pastey.net/120946 |
| 03:53.37 | Mikk | the basic principle is to have several pools |
| 03:53.39 | Shirik | My first entropy provider |
| 03:53.41 | Relcuse | Is there any way to :GetWidth on the text of a button? I tried extracting the font object and calling it, but it's apparently not a valid method? |
| 03:53.45 | Iriel | The key though, is to capture a LOT of data up front so you can test your algorthims externally |
| 03:53.45 | Mikk | where each pool has an estimate of how much entropy it has in it |
| 03:53.59 | Mikk | adding a 32-bit number maybe only adds ~3 bits of actual entropy (mouse coords anyone?) |
| 03:54.04 | Iriel | Recluse you need the FontString, rather than the Font |
| 03:54.12 | Mikk | and the theory goes |
| 03:54.24 | Mikk | that an attacker can't control ALL your entropy pools at once |
| 03:54.39 | Shirik | well same kinda thing is going here |
| 03:54.45 | Mikk | so when time comes to get new "secure" entropy, it wants at least 2 (or 3, or whatever) pools over a configured treshold |
| 03:54.47 | Shirik | I have a bunch of entropy providers |
| 03:54.55 | Mikk | and takes the data from those 2 (3...) and mixes it together |
| 03:55.01 | Relcuse | Iriel: :GetFontString perhaps? |
| 03:55.07 | Shirik | and they get mixed together |
| 03:55.20 | Shirik | though I haven't bothered to check to see if a sufficent number of them are ready |
| 03:55.36 | Mikk | as long as you're tossing out old data when putting new you shouldn't be too badly off |
| 03:55.39 | Mikk | er |
| 03:55.41 | Mikk | you're NOT tossing |
| 03:55.50 | Shirik | ? |
| 03:55.50 | Relcuse | saweeet, that works wonderfully |
| 03:55.59 | Iriel | Shirk: I'll note: The entropy rate of English text is between 1.0 and 1.5 bits per letter,[1] or as low as 0.6 to 1.3 bits per letter, according to estimates by Shannon based on human experiments |
| 03:56.06 | Iriel | Shirik: (From wikipedia's entropy page) |
| 03:56.16 | Mikk | i.e. don't do pool[i]=GetMousePosition()%blah. do pool[i]=(pool[i]+GetMousePosition())%blah |
| 03:56.18 | Iriel | Shirik: I'd argue in game chat messages have even LESS entropy |
| 03:56.42 | Cide | Iriel: could do time since last chat message I believe? |
| 03:56.54 | Cide | well |
| 03:56.57 | Iriel | Especially when you consider things like item links and whatnot which have long strings of predictable text |
| 03:57.01 | Cide | exclude the player I suppose |
| 03:57.08 | Mikk | i'd just do something stupid like timing of chat messages + length of message |
| 03:57.23 | Cide | time since last event should be a decent source as well |
| 03:57.25 | Iriel | Cide: As long as sufficient care is taken to not fall prey to things like chunking due to network latency and auomated events |
| 03:57.48 | Cide | aye, that's true |
| 03:58.01 | Mikk | aye you don't want to call messages arriving within 0.002s "randomly timed" |
| 03:58.10 | Cide | chunked traffic could make inbound chat messages pretty foreseeable |
| 03:58.38 | Mikk | haha something just struck me |
| 03:58.44 | Mikk | but it'd be too expensive |
| 03:58.48 | Shirik | ? |
| 03:58.57 | Mikk | leech entropy from blizzard's server by looking at how hard things hit =) |
| 03:59.17 | Shirik | I think Cide already suggested that |
| 03:59.20 | Cide | nope |
| 03:59.21 | Shirik | why do you call that too expensive? |
| 03:59.25 | Cide | besides |
| 03:59.36 | Mikk | COMBAT_LOG_EVENT_UNFILTERED = maaaaaaaaaany |
| 03:59.43 | Cide | is that a good source of entropy? given that blizzard's rng surely isn't secure |
| 03:59.49 | Mikk | it isn't |
| 03:59.53 | Shirik | Actually |
| 03:59.56 | Mikk | but the number of players doing something on a single server |
| 03:59.56 | Shirik | I think it is |
| 03:59.58 | Mikk | randomly |
| 03:59.58 | Shirik | and here's why |
| 04:00.01 | Shirik | ^ exactly |
| 04:00.02 | Cide | but I suppose the number of rolls makes it secure enough |
| 04:00.06 | Mikk | yap |
| 04:00.08 | Cide | yeah, stop typing so fast |
| 04:00.24 | Cide | time to sleep. good nighty |
| 04:00.29 | Shirik | unacceptable |
| 04:00.32 | Shirik | you may not sleep yet |
| 04:00.40 | Cide | hey, I need to pack my stuff |
| 04:02.01 | Cide | 'night |
| 04:05.14 | Shirik | so Iriel didn't really provide any sources of entropy |
| 04:05.16 | Shirik | :( |
| 04:05.23 | Shirik | he obviously does not like my idea |
| 04:05.51 | Iriel | I have no problem with the IDEA, I just think it's harder than it sounds |
| 04:06.52 | Mikk | Mneh, there's no problem with several low-entropy sources slowly trickling stuff in |
| 04:07.02 | Mikk | And then feeding it through something that doesn't expose your internal state |
| 04:07.22 | Mikk | Just save the entropy pool between sessions and you're golden |
| 04:08.09 | Shirik | it's finding that entropy that's the problem |
| 04:08.20 | Shirik | I'm not sure if Cide's idea of time between events firing is actually good entropy |
| 04:11.00 | Mikk | some events will be |
| 04:11.22 | Mikk | considering timing between chat events to have a few bits of entropy should be fairly safe, as long as they're not arriving at the same time |
| 04:11.32 | Mikk | others... not so much |
| 04:12.44 | Shirik | chat events are controlled by a human |
| 04:12.58 | Shirik | basically, I consider "for something to be entropic, it must be controlled by a human" |
| 04:13.16 | Shirik | that doesn't mean everything controlled by a human has entropy, but it does mean anything entirely controlled by a computer does not |
| 04:13.19 | Mikk | timings between characters typed in the inputbox |
| 04:13.26 | Iriel | Whyc ouldn't it be "the result of actions of humans, possibly indirectly" ? |
| 04:13.40 | Shirik | I would consider that controlled by a human :) |
| 04:13.47 | *** join/#wowuidev netcurse2 (n=hthieblo@dsl092-049-237.sfo4.dsl.speakeasy.net) |
| 04:14.07 | Shirik | but as your level of indirection grows deeper, it gets worse and worse |
| 04:14.49 | Shirik | if it were all direct, I think that would be best |
| 04:14.52 | Yssaril | Mikk: how does this look http://paste.wowace.com/958/ |
| 04:15.07 | Shirik | It would be really interesting to have a contest |
| 04:15.24 | Shirik | I could open up the entropy API and see who can create the best entropy source |
| 04:16.04 | Industrial | x^2+(p+q)x+p.q=(x+p)(x+q), I know this but I find it very hard to apply, eg x^2+12x+35=?, I just don't see it :| What's the easiest way to find p and q? |
| 04:16.07 | Shirik | but you would have to define "best" because there has to be a balance between "provides sufficient entropy to supply a consumer" and "provides high enough quality entropy to be secure" |
| 04:16.31 | Shirik | p AND q? It's impossible |
| 04:16.32 | bleeter | Shirik: just use the debian method and be done with it :P |
| 04:16.39 | Shirik | You have 3 variables and 2 equations |
| 04:17.02 | Industrial | err |
| 04:17.03 | Shirik | unless you're asking for a set of possible outcomes |
| 04:17.09 | Industrial | yes |
| 04:17.22 | Industrial | I just need one answer thats correct :p |
| 04:17.33 | Shirik | oh wait |
| 04:17.47 | Shirik | wtf are you doing |
| 04:17.47 | Industrial | 7 and 5 apparently |
| 04:17.48 | Shirik | what is p.q |
| 04:18.21 | Shirik | oh times |
| 04:18.33 | Industrial | er, yes, should have used * :p |
| 04:18.35 | Shirik | Well, there is an algorithmic way to find p and q, you know, Industrial |
| 04:18.40 | Shirik | A formula |
| 04:18.50 | Shirik | I'm sure you've seen it before, you just don't recognize the connection |
| 04:19.40 | Shirik | (-(p+q) +/- sqrt((p+q)^2 - 4*(p*q))) / 2 |
| 04:20.05 | Industrial | I am le terrible at making out that 7*5=35 and 7+5=12 so it has to be 7 and 5 :p |
| 04:20.08 | Shirik | note that all of those are either p+q or p*q, which are available values (in your example, 12 and 35) |
| 04:20.19 | Shirik | Do you recognize that formula? |
| 04:20.24 | Mikk | Yssaril: should work |
| 04:20.27 | Industrial | yes abc formula |
| 04:20.34 | Shirik | That's really how it was created |
| 04:20.47 | Shirik | by factoring ax^2 + bx + c |
| 04:21.04 | Shirik | so it follows that using that formula will always yield the result :PO |
| 04:21.21 | Shirik | had to derive the quadratic formula once in high school :( |
| 04:22.02 | Industrial | I have a math test in one week -_-, need to score 7/10 on three separate tests in 2 hours |
| 04:23.32 | Mikk | Welcome to #WoWUIDev. Today's topic is: Math problems! For our next demonstration, we will show how cyclotomic fields can help you solve the unsolvable. We hope you're awake and have plenty of coffee! |
| 04:26.07 | Shirik | let's discuss signals and systems |
| 04:26.09 | Shirik | ya batrick? |
| 04:26.15 | Shirik | phasors ftw |
| 04:26.27 | Mikk | wonders why he's even browsing through that book on cyclotomic fields.. Number Theory is teh brainache. |
| 04:27.00 | Shirik | Pop quiz |
| 04:27.05 | Shirik | first one to answer correctly gets a cookie |
| 04:27.22 | Shirik | n=e^(j*pi) where j^2 = -1. What is n? |
| 04:28.00 | Elusive | Seriously |
| 04:28.02 | Shirik | you all depress me :( |
| 04:28.05 | Elusive | I dont want to get out my graphing calculator |
| 04:28.08 | Elusive | give me one sec |
| 04:28.11 | Elusive | so I can type this shit in |
| 04:28.14 | Iriel | Why would you use j for i? |
| 04:28.16 | Shirik | It's a well known answer |
| 04:28.20 | Shirik | Because it's not i, it's j |
| 04:28.26 | Shirik | Python agrees with me! |
| 04:28.52 | Shirik | (To more directly answer your question, it's primarily because i is current) |
| 04:28.59 | Yssaril | -1 |
| 04:29.05 | Shirik | Yssaril gets a cookie |
| 04:29.16 | Yssaril | love google :P http://www.google.com/search?rlz=1C1GGLS_enUS291US301&sourceid=chrome&ie=UTF-8&q=e^(i*pi) |
| 04:29.18 | Iriel | http://www.math.toronto.edu/mathnet/questionCorner/epii.html |
| 04:32.22 | Shirik | Iriel, "In electrical engineering and related fields, the imaginary unit is often written as j to avoid confusion with electrical current as a function of time, traditionally denoted by i(t) or just i. The Python programming language also uses j to denote the imaginary unit, while in MATLAB, both notations i and j are associated with the imaginary unit." |
| 04:32.26 | Shirik | from Wikipedia |
| 04:33.51 | Shirik | Anyway, phasors are really fun |
| 04:33.58 | Shirik | Makes math so much easier |
| 04:34.27 | *** join/#wowuidev Movix (n=Movix@mail.schiffmann.fr) |
| 04:34.56 | tekkub | Good News Everyone! |
| 04:35.04 | Shirik | Re{e^jwt} = sin(t) |
| 04:35.09 | Shirik | ftmfw |
| 04:35.13 | kd3 | damn it, get out of my head, farnsworth's voice |
| 04:37.28 | Shirik | was that it tekkub? |
| 04:37.32 | Shirik | no real news? |
| 04:38.13 | tekkub | no, I was just working on Good New Everyone! and felt the need to say it |
| 04:38.26 | bleeter | New? |
| 04:38.31 | tekkub | *s |
| 04:38.56 | Shirik | You know |
| 04:39.02 | Shirik | 1/s is a very important number |
| 04:39.03 | *** join/#wowuidev AnduinLothar (n=AnduinLo@ip68-231-217-61.oc.oc.cox.net) |
| 04:39.03 | *** mode/#wowuidev [+v AnduinLothar] by ChanServ |
| 04:40.36 | kd3 | it hertz! it hertz! |
| 04:42.58 | *** join/#wowuidev Movix (n=Movix@mail.schiffmann.fr) |
| 04:43.35 | Shirik | .. |
| 04:43.37 | Shirik | wrong 1/s |
| 04:43.48 | kd3 | >.> |
| 04:44.18 | Shirik | L{1} = 1/s |
| 04:44.35 | Elusive | Basic science right thur. |
| 04:46.08 | Shirik | kd3 is not up to date on his diff eq |
| 04:46.45 | kd3 | I try to forget that branch of math when I can |
| 04:47.44 | tekkub | all I remember off diffeq was my teacher's silly french accent |
| 04:47.58 | tekkub | "if we have if duh why and if duh ecks |
| 04:48.45 | Shirik | lol |
| 04:52.08 | bleeter | such fail, half these URLs spelled out by dead bodies I can't read... |
| 04:52.36 | bleeter | I think the one in Org, Caelstrasz, is backwards too |
| 04:53.05 | bleeter | hmm nah just the second letter's impossible to read... fail |
| 04:54.04 | *** join/#wowuidev Movix1 (n=Movix@mail.schiffmann.fr) |
| 04:56.33 | batrick | Shirik: sup |
| 04:56.41 | batrick | Shirik: I'm working on that new linux exploit |
| 04:56.50 | Shirik | We were discussing signals |
| 04:56.54 | batrick | ah |
| 04:56.56 | Shirik | and how i > j |
| 04:57.04 | Shirik | er |
| 04:57.05 | Shirik | j > i |
| 04:57.06 | batrick | huh? |
| 04:57.07 | Shirik | :( |
| 04:57.08 | batrick | LOL |
| 04:57.16 | batrick | engineer fail =) |
| 04:57.18 | kd3 | so, yes. i > j |
| 04:57.19 | kd3 | tyvm |
| 04:57.37 | *** mode/#wowuidev [+b %Shirik!*@*] by Shirik |
| 04:57.51 | kd3 | bye? |
| 04:57.55 | batrick | ... |
| 04:57.59 | Shirik | strange thing is I think I can still talk |
| 04:58.05 | batrick | batbot: shirik fails? |
| 04:58.05 | batbot | batrick, Don't count on it. |
| 04:58.08 | batrick | sif |
| 04:58.11 | bleeter | Shirik: because you're op? |
| 04:58.12 | kd3 | you're +o. that overrides mute |
| 04:58.17 | bleeter | kd3++ |
| 04:58.20 | *** mode/#wowuidev [-b %Shirik!*@*] by Shirik |
| 04:58.35 | Shirik | I don't see why op should override mute |
| 04:59.09 | bleeter | it'd be a bit pointless to mute an op, because the op could just remove the mute |
| 04:59.15 | kd3 | it's the same reason admins can unban themselves on mediawiki installs if they don't get desysopped first |
| 04:59.17 | bleeter | thus leading to needless chanserv abuse |
| 04:59.22 | Shirik | it's a bit pointless to add functionality that is unnecessary :P |
| 04:59.30 | *** part/#wowuidev Seerah (n=Ryan@c-76-107-188-150.hsd1.tn.comcast.net) |
| 05:00.05 | Shirik | I don't see a reason to say "in a normal situation, an op might need to talk through a mute" |
| 05:00.16 | bleeter | one person could mute you and another take away the op |
| 05:00.17 | Shirik | normal being defined as something that's not stupid like the above |
| 05:00.40 | bleeter | thus... oh I see what you mean |
| 05:00.42 | bleeter | meh |
| 05:01.06 | kd3 | some idiot setting +b%*!*@*? |
| 05:01.19 | Shirik | Even if that was actually desired |
| 05:01.24 | Shirik | there is a ban exemption mode |
| 05:01.27 | Shirik | +e I think |
| 05:01.37 | Shirik | so it's not like you're getting additional functionality |
| 05:01.52 | Shirik | I could just as easily do +be %*!*@* %Shirik!*@* |
| 05:05.22 | kd3 | ah, the interweb... finding links to stuff a decade old: (sfw) http://www.ie.lspace.org/fandom/afp/timelines/stupidity.html |
| 05:08.39 | bleeter | kd3: crap, I remember when that was new! :P |
| 05:08.46 | bleeter | kids today... |
| 05:11.20 | kd3 | other scariness (still sfw) http://ratinthelab.wordpress.com/2008/03/11/death-of-a-turbo/ |
| 05:13.39 | kd3 | and other notes of schadenfreude that are keeping me up when I need to get up in 5 and a half hours or so... http://pipeline.corante.com/archives/how_not_to_do_it/ |
| 05:14.10 | Shirik | kd3, how do I change my DNS server in linux |
| 05:14.11 | Shirik | :( |
| 05:14.19 | kd3 | edit /etc/resolv.conf |
| 05:14.49 | Shirik | bah |
| 05:14.53 | Shirik | I was looking in conf.d |
| 05:15.29 | kd3 | or if you're in a NM-using distro... /etc/sysconfig/network-scripts/ifcfg-eth# to do it the NM way |
| 05:15.34 | Shirik | <3 |
| 05:15.42 | Shirik | the /etc/resolv.conf did it |
| 05:21.58 | Industrial | Is it possible to cast a spell on the target if a targettarget doesn't exits? |
| 05:22.00 | Industrial | exist* |
| 05:22.26 | Industrial | eg Hand of Reckoning |
| 05:22.28 | Industrial | :3 |
| 05:23.06 | Shirik | [target=targettarget,noexists] ? |
| 05:23.12 | Shirik | oh I see what you're saying |
| 05:23.17 | Shirik | how about |
| 05:23.24 | Shirik | stopmacro [target=targettarget,noexists] |
| 05:23.30 | Shirik | cast whatever |
| 05:23.32 | kd3 | ^ |
| 05:23.48 | Industrial | k |
| 05:24.31 | bleeter | feeds more coffee to kd3 |
| 05:28.20 | Shirik | shoves coffee beans down kd3's throat |
| 05:28.35 | kd3 | I get enough of that from the cute baristas near work |
| 05:28.45 | kd3 | not that I like the taste of coffee |
| 05:28.51 | kd3 | prefers tea |
| 05:28.58 | Shirik | you like the taste of the baristas |
| 05:29.07 | kd3 | >.> |
| 05:30.39 | Industrial | ^^ |
| 05:38.34 | Wobin | http://www.traileraddict.com/trailer/legion/red-band-trailer |
| 05:38.36 | Wobin | hm |
| 05:47.26 | ScytheBlade1 | I just spend 4 hours getting ipsec working between a whopping two hosts >< |
| 05:48.11 | ScytheBlade1 | *spent |
| 05:49.05 | *** join/#wowuidev Srosh (n=Srosh@d019124.adsl.hansenet.de) |
| 05:52.54 | Wobin | http://www.ananova.com/news/story/sm_3438747.html?menu= |
| 05:52.58 | Wobin | wow, that's kinda cool |
| 05:58.56 | *** join/#wowuidev Rincewind` (n=Rince@WoWUIDev/Norganna/QA-Engineer/Rincewind) |
| 06:00.10 | batrick | fuck this shit |
| 06:00.25 | VonhintenHOME` | Yeah, I dunno if I buy the whole getting on the train in the opposite direction and getting back to where they were |
| 06:00.33 | VonhintenHOME` | the rest of it I could see |
| 06:03.37 | bleeter | I gotta ask.. why the fuck heroic Onyxia, and no heroic VC/RFC??? IT DOES NOT MAKE SENSE |
| 06:03.54 | Elusive | lawl. |
| 06:04.01 | Elusive | It's one step towards the right direction though. |
| 06:04.09 | ScytheBlade1 | bleeter: could be worse. Heroic Gnomeregan. |
| 06:04.11 | Elusive | Revamping the Old World seems to be the concern of a lot of people. |
| 06:04.41 | bleeter | ScytheBlade1: you're seriously ill :P |
| 06:05.26 | bleeter | Elusive: I'd like to see NR engineering (as in, quality of world, flying, etc.) done to vanilla world, for sure |
| 06:05.41 | bleeter | might even make me feel good about the goddamn realm change bug |
| 06:05.43 | bleeter | ugh |
| 06:05.43 | Adys | complaining about old world being revamped better be the concern of everyone i've been banning |
| 06:06.01 | bleeter | Adys: have you banned me yet? |
| 06:06.05 | bleeter | if not WHY?!?!?!?!?!?! |
| 06:06.06 | bleeter | :P |
| 06:06.32 | Adys | because you're not registered on mmoc |
| 06:06.56 | Elusive | There was a post from someone that made quite a lot of since to why flying shouldn't be allowed in the old world... the redesigning of the old world to be able to allow flying would take way too much time |
| 06:07.17 | Elusive | but yeah, flying in the old world would be pretty nice. |
| 06:08.17 | bleeter | pokes Adys |
| 06:09.07 | bleeter | Elusive: I kinda like the theory that a certain site put forward about cataclysm and old world re-write by destroying the old world kinda thing, sorta cute. even if the rest of the story that website posted sounded like crack |
| 06:09.36 | bleeter | Adys: more precisely http://www.mmo-champion.com/index.php?topic=92689.0 :P |
| 06:10.03 | bleeter | think the issue is I ain't been a jerk on mmoc |
| 06:13.00 | Adys | >> |
| 06:13.10 | bleeter | Elusive: also, filling in the 'blank' bits would be nice |
| 06:13.24 | bleeter | Elusive: I know it's just me, but every time I see one I can't help but think of Ken and Barbie ;) |
| 06:13.51 | bleeter | Adys: awww :'( :P |
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| 06:37.27 | bleeter | Shirik: http://codahale.com/a-lesson-in-timing-attacks/ |
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| 06:39.37 | bleeter | or any java coder, really |
| 06:41.41 | ThunderChild | newegg's "discounts" suck |
| 06:42.32 | ThunderChild | got an email for a 72 hour 15% off all HDD's sale....read father, max discount of $10 |
| 06:43.05 | Wobin | ... |
| 06:43.26 | Wobin | that is pretty terrible |
| 06:43.43 | bleeter | ThunderChild: nah they just hate you |
| 06:44.00 | ThunderChild | ya, granted newegg's prices are the best around...it just seems silly to offer something like this |
| 06:44.17 | ThunderChild | bleeter: na, i just spent a bunch of money there, they like me for the moment |
| 06:47.36 | Arrowmaster | me too |
| 06:49.01 | Arrowmaster | but they didnt send me an email about a shitty deal |
| 06:49.34 | ThunderChild | is that a good thing or a bad thing? |
| 06:50.54 | Wobin | I guess they didn't think Arrow would fall for it =) |
| 06:51.18 | bleeter | haha |
| 06:51.22 | bleeter | Wobin++ |
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| 06:57.34 | ThunderChild | they would have been wrong then |
| 06:57.45 | Sabaren | Hello! |
| 06:58.02 | Arrowmaster | i just bought 16 harddrives from newegg, why would they think i would buy more |
| 06:58.18 | Sabaren | You can never have enough HDs. |
| 06:58.24 | ThunderChild | i want 5 2TB HD's from them |
| 06:58.28 | ThunderChild | that would make me happy |
| 07:00.49 | Arrowmaster | why they dont have the new samsung one, just the shitty slow WD and Seagate ones |
| 07:02.40 | Arrowmaster | damn they have an even better deal now for the harddrives i got |
| 07:02.42 | Arrowmaster | http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16822152119 |
| 07:02.46 | Wobin | cause you'll still buy it =) |
| 07:02.57 | Arrowmaster | same price but it was a free seagate 500gb when i bought them |
| 07:03.35 | Arrowmaster | free samsung f1 raid class 500gb is deffently better than a free seagate 500gb |
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| 07:37.36 | Wobin | what was that movie with the search and rescue chopper? |
| 07:37.46 | Wobin | where they were all training for sea rescue and stuff |
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| 07:44.44 | bleeter | Wobin: pub quiz again? :P |
| 07:45.15 | Wobin | Nah, name that movie thread |
| 07:45.25 | Wobin | I think I figured it to be The Perfect Storm |
| 07:45.38 | Wobin | and I'd be stupid if I relied on -you- lot for a pub quiz =P |
| 07:45.48 | Wobin | I'd need -snappy- answers =) |
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| 07:46.53 | bleeter | nah not perfect storm |
| 07:46.59 | bleeter | I know that much anyways |
| 07:47.31 | Wobin | The Guardian? |
| 07:47.51 | bleeter | dunno |
| 07:48.04 | Wobin | I swear |
| 07:48.17 | Wobin | http://tineye.com/ has revolutionised my 'name that pic' thread approach =P |
| 07:49.20 | Industrial | ok another math question |
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| 07:49.29 | Industrial | K=L(a-M), a=? |
| 07:49.40 | Industrial | I'd say K=La-LM, La=K-LM, a=(k-LM)/L |
| 07:49.44 | Industrial | but that's wrong |
| 07:50.24 | Industrial | a=(k+LM)/L is correct, why? |
| 07:50.35 | Wobin | La=K+LM |
| 07:50.43 | Wobin | you forgot to swap the sign |
| 07:51.04 | Wobin | since you need to add LM to both sides |
| 07:51.10 | Industrial | oh, wups |
| 07:51.14 | Industrial | right |
| 07:51.33 | Industrial | ok, check, next topic ;p |
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| 08:10.34 | Wobin | mp5 or spell penetration for an ele shammy? |
| 08:10.45 | Wobin | (in that I'm trying to get a blue gem...) |
| 08:11.23 | Elkano | why not go green or purple? |
| 08:11.36 | Wobin | slot bonus |
| 08:11.50 | Wobin | but honestly... the slot bonus is spirit |
| 08:11.55 | Wobin | so I might as well go flat spellpower =P |
| 08:18.53 | Elkano | well, if you're looking for blue for slot bonus only, green and purple work too ^^ |
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| 08:26.15 | Industrial | bonuses are not worth it imo, just pump SP |
| 08:26.31 | Industrial | only have the minimal amount of correct slots to satisfy the metagem requirements |
| 08:28.00 | Wobin | yeah |
| 08:28.22 | Wobin | I have mostly non-spec items anyway |
| 08:28.27 | Wobin | so the slot bonuses aren't useful |
| 08:28.35 | Wobin | (like spirit) |
| 08:29.03 | Industrial | also enh ftw! ;p |
| 08:29.20 | Wobin | I'm having a hard enough time getting two sets for ele/resto |
| 08:29.24 | Wobin | let alone three |
| 08:31.58 | Industrial | I'm going to raid once a week now, just ToC25 methinks |
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| 08:36.49 | Industrial | What is the function of the parabola that goes through top [1,4] and also goes through [-5,3] <-- how do I do this :| |
| 08:36.52 | Industrial | Wobin: ^ |
| 08:41.03 | Wobin | um |
| 08:41.56 | Industrial | a*x^2+b*x+c, right? |
| 08:43.20 | Industrial | I can guess that its something with -x^2+b*x+4 because the top is at 1,4 but don;t know how to get b ( and a) :| |
| 08:45.37 | Wobin | it's been a while since I've done any parabola |
| 08:45.53 | Industrial | thats what she said >_> |
| 08:45.57 | Industrial | anyway, meh |
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| 08:49.21 | Industrial | Shirik: ping :D |
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| 08:56.20 | Vilkku | hmm, is it possible to change how date and time is displayed on the wowi boards? |
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| 09:24.44 | augustl | are there any action bar mods there that keeps the default vehicle bar? |
| 09:24.50 | augustl | I kinda like the überstyled look of those :) |
| 09:25.37 | krka | i think bartender has the option to use the plain one |
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| 09:27.42 | augustl | indeed it has! Thanks |
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| 09:38.01 | augustl | what is that 5 minute countown the default unit frames some times has? |
| 09:38.08 | augustl | Pitbull4 also has it |
| 09:42.03 | augustl | is it what is referred to as "pvp timer"? |
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| 10:55.50 | kd3 | sonofa |
| 10:56.06 | kd3 | the new ptr downloader is starting from scratch... again |
| 10:56.09 | kd3 | 1.24GB |
| 10:56.13 | kd3 | >.< |
| 10:56.30 | Aelobin | anyone know how long Aion beta takes to download? :/ |
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| 11:00.36 | Stanzilla | aion was 6gb or so |
| 11:01.10 | nevcairiel | Anyone know if the author of TipTac is on IRC somewhere? |
| 11:02.17 | kd3 | meh. at least the downloader's redlining my connection. will be back after work with the goodies (hopefully it'll be done by then) |
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| 11:21.33 | Torhal | nevcairiel: H's usually here when he's on |
| 11:21.50 | nevcairiel | i hope he reads his WoWI comments then =P |
| 11:22.33 | Torhal | He should. I know he responds to PMs |
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| 11:44.04 | Legorol | kd3: did you start from the last, fully patched version of the 0.2.0 PTR client? |
| 11:44.27 | Legorol | my PTR client refuses to succeed in handshaking, so doesn't even start downloading the patch :/ |
| 11:44.44 | nevcairiel | did you start the launcher? |
| 11:44.49 | nevcairiel | it starts downloading for me |
| 11:44.53 | Legorol | good tip, thanks |
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| 11:45.21 | nevcairiel | Silly them and their full-ptr-patch-from-3.0.1 |
| 11:45.31 | nevcairiel | that thing will be *huge* for 3.4 or something =P |
| 11:45.52 | Legorol | ugh, my PTR client is not the latest version, and the launcher wants to patch from 10147 to 10170 first |
| 11:46.06 | Legorol | that's 0.2.0.10147 to 0.2.0.10170, and that one is not authorised |
| 11:46.15 | Legorol | i guess i'm fubared |
| 11:46.49 | nevcairiel | you could wait until 0.2.2 hits the usual mirrors |
| 11:47.12 | Legorol | nah i just roll back to the 3.0.1 PTR |
| 11:47.20 | Legorol | it should start downloading the 0.2.2 from there |
| 11:47.44 | Legorol | nevcairiel, did you have the absolute latest PTR, and is it still downloading a complete 0.2.2 for you? |
| 11:47.50 | nevcairiel | yes |
| 11:47.52 | Legorol | ok |
| 11:47.59 | Legorol | then i don't miss out on anything by rolling back to 3.0.1 |
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| 11:49.47 | ZorbaBeta | we got a 3.2.2 changelog yet? |
| 11:50.11 | ZorbaBeta | aha never mind found it |
| 11:50.53 | nevcairiel | Honor Among Thieves: A 1-second cooldown is now enforced on how often a rogue can gain combo points from his party via this talent. |
| 11:51.03 | nevcairiel | ^ wasnt that always intended from the talent description? |
| 11:51.14 | olafski | hmm, are wow addons case sensitive? I seem to have accidentally packaged my addon as a lowercase dir but the .toc file has capital letters in it |
| 11:51.37 | nevcairiel | olafski: on windows they are not, on other systems .. it might just break, or might not |
| 11:51.39 | nevcairiel | better fix it :D |
| 11:51.48 | olafski | okay |
| 11:51.54 | olafski | I'll repost it.. can I remove the old file somehow? |
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| 12:05.07 | Arrowmaster | on other systems it will break it afaik |
| 12:12.12 | olafski | alright :) I retagged it and removed the old file :) |
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| 12:24.06 | Aelobin | if i have a table which is {[1337=true, [1339]=true, [14]=true}, when doing table.remove(t, 1337) would it effect the indexes of the other elements? |
| 12:24.29 | Aelobin | or shall i just do t[1337]=nil ? :P |
| 12:24.42 | Arrowmaster | you cant use table.remove on hash tables |
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| 12:24.57 | Aelobin | by hash tables, do you mean tables which aren't 1,2,3,4 etc? |
| 12:25.01 | Arrowmaster | yeah |
| 12:25.03 | Aelobin | ok thanks |
| 12:25.05 | Aelobin | i'll nil it out |
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| 12:28.33 | Fisker | slaps Cide around a bit with a large trout |
| 12:28.37 | Cide | hi |
| 12:30.01 | Aelobin | rawr |
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| 12:32.18 | Aelobin | dyou ever write an addon then go back and think "fuck i coulda done that a lot better", then end up renaming half your variables? :P |
| 12:38.52 | nevcairiel | sure, but renaming variables isnt what i really do then :P |
| 12:38.55 | alestane | You can use table.remove on tables that aren't arrays as far as I know, but it won't do anything very special. |
| 12:39.55 | alestane | It will basically be an alias for (local v = t[i]; t[i] = nil; return v) |
| 12:40.36 | alestane | If you're just trying to eliminate an element without changing other indices, just niling the key is your best bet. |
| 12:42.14 | Aelobin | ty alestane |
| 12:44.19 | olafski | aelobin: refactoring sounds like a better plan ;) |
| 12:44.28 | Aelobin | O_o |
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| 12:44.43 | olafski | (though I do my addons in ultraedit without even syntax highlighting so renaming is what I do :P) |
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| 12:52.51 | Aelobin | olafski: what do you mean by refactoring? |
| 12:53.30 | olafski | it's a form of advanced find/replace :P |
| 12:53.33 | alestane | Can we call a moratorium in the forum on correcting peoples' capitalization of "Lua"? It never accomplishes anything except making people angry. |
| 12:53.54 | Fisker | refactoring is cleaning up your code/improving it |
| 12:54.58 | alestane | Or, writing code starting from your final specs after all the changes you made during the first development phase. |
| 12:55.03 | Wobin | hehe |
| 12:55.12 | Wobin | I love how the hatchling changes size as you feed it day by day |
| 12:56.19 | Wobin | alestane: you'll have to talk to krka and his trigger =P |
| 12:56.29 | Wobin | oh the forum |
| 12:56.31 | Wobin | nm |
| 13:02.19 | alestane | I'm just sick and tired of somebody coming in with a reasonably intelligent question, and then deciding we're a bunch of trolls because the first response they get is "It's Lua not LUA." |
| 13:02.28 | krka | alestane: Whenever someone writes Lua in upper case, god kills a kitten. :( ;-) |
| 13:02.35 | foxlit | meh, flyable is still broken in WG |
| 13:02.50 | foxlit | "You can't do that right now" it says |
| 13:02.52 | Wobin | perhaps you could insert that gem of wisdom in amongst your response to their question |
| 13:03.00 | foxlit | (well, it's a better point to break it, but it's still meh) |
| 13:03.25 | Wobin | "Why yes! Most chickens are intergratable with the scripting language. BTW, it's Lua, not LUA, as it's not an acronym" |
| 13:03.54 | alestane | Wobin: Better, but to most poster that will still only make you look like an obsessive jerk. |
| 13:04.03 | Wobin | Well screw them then |
| 13:04.14 | Wobin | if they don't want to learn, they can go fuck themselves =) |
| 13:04.47 | Wobin | It's not like I'm saying "OMG NOOB IT'S NOT LUA IT'S Lua!!!!11!!!1" |
| 13:05.04 | alestane | It's true. You're not being anywhere near as rude. |
| 13:05.10 | Wobin | If they can't handle a little gentle correction, they have no right to ask the question =P |
| 13:05.49 | alestane | But most people didn't think it was an acronym and have no idea why it's important to capitalize it one way or the other. |
| 13:05.58 | Wobin | but generally, the one line LUA/Lua corrections are coming from people who don't actually know the answer to the initial question. |
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| 13:09.15 | *** mode/#wowuidev [+v Lopeppeppy] by ChanServ |
| 13:09.49 | alestane | pouncles Lopeppeppy. |
| 13:11.12 | alestane | Wobin: You could maybe link them to http://www.lua.org/about.html#name if you want to give them a correction in passing. |
| 13:11.22 | Lopeppeppy | Morning, alestane. |
| 13:11.42 | alestane | ~LUA |
| 13:11.43 | purl | rumour has it, lua is a powerful light-weight programming language designed for extending applications. It is often used as a configuration language. See http://www.lua.org/. Note: Lua is not an acronym. It is the Portuguese word for "moon". |
| 13:11.49 | wsoul | Wobin: about to exchange conquest for valor for the feet armor |
| 13:12.25 | Wobin | um |
| 13:12.32 | Wobin | which armour is that? |
| 13:12.42 | Wobin | and have you both set pieces from conquest? |
| 13:12.49 | wsoul | kosyzc or somesuch |
| 13:12.54 | wsoul | mine is the bs one |
| 13:12.58 | Wobin | the stompers? |
| 13:13.02 | wsoul | yeah |
| 13:13.04 | Wobin | don't trade in conquest to get those |
| 13:13.12 | Wobin | save the conquest for the tier head and chestpieces |
| 13:13.20 | wsoul | got both |
| 13:13.28 | Wobin | ah, k, and all the sigils you need? |
| 13:13.37 | wsoul | not the sigil no |
| 13:13.42 | wsoul | shouldi get that first |
| 13:13.54 | wsoul | the dodge one instead of unfiliated knight |
| 13:14.06 | Wobin | and neck |
| 13:14.10 | Wobin | got the neckpiece? |
| 13:14.12 | wsoul | got it |
| 13:14.19 | Wobin | gloves? |
| 13:14.24 | wsoul | and waist yeah |
| 13:14.27 | Wobin | hehe |
| 13:14.31 | Wobin | you've been busy on the heroics |
| 13:14.38 | *** join/#wowuidev TopTop18 (n=TopTop18@ip231-37-173-82.adsl2.static.versatel.nl) |
| 13:14.42 | wsoul | just the sigil from conq |
| 13:14.54 | wsoul | at the beginning yeah, now leveling up a warrior ally on a diff realm |
| 13:15.05 | Wobin | and the legs, eh |
| 13:15.12 | wsoul | one of the leaders is a firned of mine, been knowing him since 90s |
| 13:15.18 | wsoul | legs are from vh still |
| 13:15.25 | wsoul | planning to do os25 to get the legs |
| 13:15.51 | Wobin | hm, yeah, the badge legs have block on them |
| 13:15.54 | wsoul | the one for conq shield block etc |
| 13:16.01 | wsoul | isn't it useless for dks? |
| 13:16.07 | Wobin | yeah |
| 13:16.08 | Wobin | well |
| 13:16.22 | Wobin | if it's a actual upgrade on everything else, it'll just be a useless stat |
| 13:16.28 | Wobin | but the legs could still be an upgrade |
| 13:16.39 | Wobin | just on the raw stats alone for the others |
| 13:16.50 | wsoul | i'm hoping to get the os25 or from toc crusader |
| 13:17.04 | TopTop18 | It doesn't matter where a function is placed in my lua code right? So if I call a function it doesn't matter if it's set before the call or at the end of the code? |
| 13:17.08 | wsoul | the only thing i am missing from conquest is the sigil and i can get it right away |
| 13:18.22 | Wobin | hm, I don't see any plate legs for TotCrusader |
| 13:18.38 | wsoul | hmm |
| 13:18.41 | wsoul | i thought there is |
| 13:19.27 | Wobin | My atlasloot might not show all of them |
| 13:19.31 | *** join/#wowuidev Yssaril (n=Yssaril@99-57-35-45.lightspeed.cicril.sbcglobal.net) |
| 13:19.36 | wsoul | ah right |
| 13:20.11 | Wobin | normal TotChamp has better tanking pants than VH |
| 13:20.14 | Wobin | maybe |
| 13:20.22 | Wobin | same ilvl though |
| 13:20.23 | wsoul | i think iu have it |
| 13:20.35 | Wobin | TopTop18: You're correct, it doesn't. unless it's a local function |
| 13:21.10 | alestane | TopTop18: If you're making the call from inside another function, it doesn't much matter. |
| 13:21.30 | wsoul | brb |
| 13:21.41 | *** join/#wowuidev Kaso (n=Kaso@87.76.110.226) |
| 13:21.53 | alestane | But if you say "ParseMyData(someArg); function ParseMyData(theData) [[ ]] end", then that does fail. |
| 13:23.43 | *** join/#wowuidev Erkki (n=Vilkku@86-60-151-150-dyn-dsl.ssp.fi) |
| 13:24.40 | Wobin | http://current.com/items/90679758_flat-screen-tv-fail.htm |
| 13:26.06 | *** join/#wowuidev Gotai (n=Gotai@ip503d59c0.speed.planet.nl) |
| 13:26.07 | Lopeppeppy | Yeah... that's excellent. Andthey can't even close the closet door, which is extra-fail! |
| 13:26.09 | *** join/#wowuidev Xinhuan (n=xinhuan@WoWUIDev/WoWAce/xinhuan) |
| 13:27.48 | zenzelezz | so... deciding to try to manually upgrade GTK on my Slackware box at work turned out to not be such a good idea |
| 13:28.11 | Lopeppeppy | Uh oh |
| 13:28.44 | zenzelezz | and I also discovered that it reboots if I disconnect both the mouse and the keyboard (but if either is left plugged in, it's fine) |
| 13:28.56 | Lopeppeppy | Oh... kay... |
| 13:29.05 | zenzelezz | probably some messed up USB setting or driver |
| 13:32.12 | *** join/#wowuidev zeheres (n=crs@dslb-084-061-098-254.pools.arcor-ip.net) |
| 13:32.25 | TopTop18 | Thanks Wobin and alestane! |
| 13:34.03 | alestane | Remember that your Lua file is effectively a function that will be executed once it's compiled. Order is real, just in most WoW files, you won't call the function in the Lua file, just define them. |
| 13:36.49 | TopTop18 | Ah okay, so the whole lua file will only start running when the whole file is loaded |
| 13:39.31 | alestane | That's pretty close. |
| 13:39.56 | alestane | The key is that in Lua, function definitions are executed code. |
| 13:40.22 | alestane | The function is defined only when the interpreter gets to that part of the file. |
| 13:40.51 | alestane | It's easier to remember if you use the basic syntax "name = function (args) body end". |
| 13:41.50 | *** join/#wowuidev aesir (n=Aesir@WoWUIDev/Norganna/Developer/Aesir) |
| 13:42.38 | *** join/#wowuidev MentalPower (n=MPower@WoWUIDev/Norganna/Administrator/MentalPower) |
| 13:42.38 | *** mode/#wowuidev [+v MentalPower] by ChanServ |
| 13:44.14 | wsoul | back |
| 13:44.20 | wsoul | so Wobin whatcha think |
| 13:44.31 | wsoul | that sigil or trade conq for valor and get that feet |
| 13:45.13 | Wobin | sigil |
| 13:45.20 | *** join/#wowuidev MentalPower (n=MPower@WoWUIDev/Norganna/Administrator/MentalPower) |
| 13:45.20 | *** mode/#wowuidev [+v MentalPower] by ChanServ |
| 13:45.24 | wsoul | buying it naw :d |
| 13:45.35 | Wobin | You're already outgearing me =) |
| 13:46.27 | wsoul | Still your young padawan master ;) |
| 13:47.06 | TopTop18 | Alestane, but without an XML file I've got to call functions from the same lua file, otherwise nothing gets run |
| 13:47.33 | wsoul | what's your name again |
| 13:47.37 | wsoul | let me check armory |
| 13:47.46 | alestane | So you do need to make sure that any function is defined before it can be called. |
| 13:48.28 | Industrial | loool |
| 13:48.38 | Industrial | http://www.explosm.net/comics/1764/ |
| 13:48.49 | Wobin | wsoul: snuusnu on proudmoore US |
| 13:50.13 | wsoul | My gear isn't as good as yours |
| 13:51.44 | wsoul | Good enough |
| 13:51.50 | wsoul | err |
| 13:51.56 | wsoul | Still want that feet before the sigil |
| 13:52.22 | wsoul | :/ |
| 13:53.22 | wsoul | 13 conq to get that stompers |
| 13:54.42 | Wobin | what -is- the sigil? |
| 13:55.07 | wsoul | Sigil of defliction |
| 13:55.14 | wsoul | Deflection |
| 13:55.59 | wsoul | http://www.wowarmory.com/item-info.xml?i=45144 |
| 13:56.18 | wsoul | mine is unfeltaring knight |
| 13:57.13 | olafski | hmm |
| 13:57.16 | wsoul | more strength, dod def just -9 stamina from stompers |
| 13:57.22 | olafski | can I download the PTR client? it says there are no test realms available |
| 13:57.30 | wsoul | and i think with the enchant 15 stmaiina should be fine |
| 13:57.41 | TopTop18 | Thanks alestane! |
| 13:59.32 | alestane | You can download the client, but I don't think there are any current test patches or realms running right now. |
| 13:59.45 | A-KO | according to mmo-champ they are |
| 14:00.07 | olafski | yeah |
| 14:00.11 | nevcairiel | the 0.2.2 patch is out there |
| 14:00.13 | olafski | people have already killed onyxia on the ptr |
| 14:00.15 | nevcairiel | dunno if realms |
| 14:00.29 | olafski | I want in on that action :) |
| 14:04.10 | zenzelezz | peppy, someone took your picture while you were sleeping on the job: http://icanhascheezburger.com/2009/08/14/funny-pictures-new-compact-version/ |
| 14:05.44 | *** join/#wowuidev Kaso (n=Kaso@87.76.110.226) |
| 14:12.24 | olafski | funny, in firefox wow-europe.com/ptr/ takes ages to load, in IE it shows up instantly and tells me "this service is not available" when I log in |
| 14:15.27 | *** join/#wowuidev bluspacecow (n=bluspace@60-234-165-167.bitstream.orcon.net.nz) |
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| 14:27.57 | *** mode/#wowuidev [+o Seerah] by ChanServ |
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| 14:35.39 | *** mode/#wowuidev [+o ckknight] by ChanServ |
| 14:39.44 | Yssaril | anyone know which is faster something like this local var = true and false and 2 or true and 3 or 5 or doing a if then elseif end tree? |
| 14:40.13 | Yssaril | lua> true and false and 2 or true and 3 or 5end tree? |
| 14:40.13 | lua_bot | Yssaril: luabot:1: unexpected symbol near 'true' |
| 14:40.21 | Yssaril | lua> true and false and 2 or true and 3 or 5 |
| 14:40.22 | lua_bot | Yssaril: 3 |
| 14:40.22 | Adys | Yssaril: repeat that... with commas |
| 14:40.44 | Yssaril | anyone know which is faster something like this: local var = true and false and 2 or true and 3 or 5, or doing a if then elseif end tree? |
| 14:40.50 | Adys | right |
| 14:41.02 | Adys | the inline one, normally, but |
| 14:41.13 | *** join/#wowuidev malreth (n=triti@dhcp-128-83-45-226.its.utexas.edu) |
| 14:41.15 | Adys | an "false or" will never evaluate to true |
| 14:41.20 | Adys | but i suppose thats placeholder |
| 14:41.42 | Seerah | how can something be true *and* false? :P |
| 14:41.45 | Yssaril | yea the booleans are vars in my case just put some in ther for clarity |
| 14:42.42 | *** join/#wowuidev Kaso (n=Kaso@87.76.110.226) |
| 14:43.11 | Yssaril | it looks more like this in my code :P = a and b and 2 or c and 3 or 5 |
| 14:43.27 | *** join/#wowuidev A-KO^ (i=as@unaffiliated/a-ko) |
| 14:43.28 | Adys | right |
| 14:43.31 | Adys | use parentheses |
| 14:44.33 | Yssaril | why? |
| 14:45.42 | zenzelezz | for clarity? |
| 14:46.32 | Shirik | bleeter: Interesting |
| 14:46.37 | Shirik | Industrial: pong |
| 14:46.57 | Shirik | Seerah: Like this |
| 14:47.25 | Yssaril | zenzelezz: i dont think it would help much my entire line is fairly long |
| 14:47.44 | zenzelezz | it helps readability |
| 14:48.19 | Yssaril | like this: local macrotable = (self.state.isMoving and self.db.profile.activeMacroSets.isMoving and self.db.profile.macrosets.isMoving) or (self.db.profile.activeMacroSets[self.state.inZone] and self.db.profile.macrosets[self.state.inZone]) or self.db.profile.macrosets.default? |
| 14:48.25 | Shirik | batbot: var = loadstring(string.dump(function() return ({[true]=true})[true] end):gsub('\1\1', '\1\2'))() |
| 14:48.36 | Shirik | --> var = loadstring(string.dump(function() return ({[true]=true})[true] end):gsub('\1\1', '\1\2'))() |
| 14:48.42 | Shirik | --> var |
| 14:48.42 | batbot | Shirik: > true |
| 14:48.48 | Shirik | --> var == true |
| 14:48.48 | batbot | Shirik: > true |
| 14:49.00 | Shirik | aw, is batbot running patched? :( |
| 14:49.02 | Shirik | that's boring |
| 14:49.10 | Shirik | --> var ~= true and var ~= false |
| 14:49.11 | batbot | Shirik: > false |
| 14:49.14 | Shirik | boo |
| 14:49.27 | Shirik | lua> var = loadstring(string.dump(function() return ({[true]=true})[true] end):gsub('\1\1', '\1\2'))(); print(type(var), var ~= true, var ~= false); |
| 14:49.28 | lua_bot | Shirik: boolean, false, true |
| 14:49.31 | Shirik | man |
| 14:49.34 | Shirik | they take all my fun away |
| 14:49.48 | Yssaril | lol |
| 14:52.17 | Adys | Yssaril: indenting and using parentheses helps clarity |
| 14:52.27 | *** join/#wowuidev Movix (n=Movix@mail.schiffmann.fr) |
| 14:52.55 | nicoli_s | has blizz fixed the /dump exploit yet? |
| 14:53.27 | mikma | didn't work on me |
| 14:53.35 | mikma | told my my chataddon has performed illegal action or so |
| 14:53.48 | Yssaril | Adys: i guess still a confoluted mess to make a oneline logic statement (imo at least) but hey its faster so its all good |
| 14:53.57 | nicoli_s | i think some people were saying that it only worked with no addons |
| 14:54.43 | Shirik | Logically it would only work if you don't have an addon installed that modifies the chat window |
| 14:54.49 | Shirik | and, of course, you can't have devtools installed |
| 14:55.00 | *** join/#wowuidev TT18 (n=TopTop18@ip231-37-173-82.adsl2.static.versatel.nl) |
| 14:55.35 | bluspacecow | hotfixed ? |
| 14:56.22 | Shirik | It can't really be hotfixed. It's... on your computer |
| 14:58.11 | foxlit | Shirik: who knows. |
| 14:58.18 | Shirik | ? |
| 15:00.58 | ZorbaBeta | I, as well, am kind of surprised they don't have any way of hotpatching client code |
| 15:01.05 | ZorbaBeta | but it seems they don't |
| 15:01.24 | Shirik | I think there would be a bit of an uprising if they were able to do that |
| 15:01.33 | bluspacecow | i got a hot fix |
| 15:01.38 | Shirik | people want to know when something changes |
| 15:01.42 | bluspacecow | threaten people who use it with a hot poker |
| 15:01.52 | ZorbaBeta | so it would include a tiny changelog :P |
| 15:02.01 | ZorbaBeta | and, honestly, it's not like Blizz lists every little bugfix and change |
| 15:02.08 | ZorbaBeta | or even a significant number of them. this would be similar to that. |
| 15:02.11 | Shirik | But people want to have to click "ok, do patch!" |
| 15:02.18 | Shirik | not just have code secretly snuck into their computer |
| 15:02.22 | ZorbaBeta | hell, they patch without even including a changelist sometimes. |
| 15:02.38 | *** join/#wowuidev spode (n=spode@85.134.127.203) |
| 15:02.40 | Adys | Shirik: There are some clientside hotfixes |
| 15:02.59 | ZorbaBeta | I don't think that would actually be an issue, but even if it was, you just make it so you log in and it says "need to download a tiny update" and you click yes and it does. |
| 15:03.10 | Adys | During login, wow can change your WTF files, and can reset your cache files |
| 15:03.10 | bluspacecow | yeah well except for some change log that basically says "we changed some crap lol" |
| 15:03.11 | Adys | at will |
| 15:03.11 | Shirik | but what are you going to do until they click yes :) |
| 15:03.23 | ZorbaBeta | sit there at the login screen waiting for them to click yes |
| 15:03.31 | Adys | it just cant add files to a mpq yet |
| 15:03.32 | ZorbaBeta | same thing you do when you try to log in and it says "you need to go patch, sucka" |
| 15:03.34 | Bruners | Shirik: isnt the loader thingie on autoupdate? |
| 15:03.36 | Shirik | well if it's at the login screen I don't really see you gaining much |
| 15:03.47 | Adys | its during login |
| 15:03.47 | Shirik | over a normal patch |
| 15:03.54 | Shirik | I really meant while the game is running |
| 15:04.01 | Adys | right |
| 15:04.11 | foxlit | Something as simple as revoking their UI signing key would do the trick. |
| 15:04.28 | Adys | i don't think there is any advantage doing it while playing |
| 15:04.38 | Adys | during login is quite enough imo |
| 15:05.11 | ZorbaBeta | yeah, that sounds overly messy to me. at worst you just toss out a hotfix, then broadcast "log out and log back in, you'll be logged out in an hour if you don't" (obviously that takes some extra infrastructure) |
| 15:05.22 | Shirik | but if you're going to do it there, why not just release it as a client patch :) |
| 15:05.43 | ZorbaBeta | one big advantage is that it's zero-downtime |
| 15:05.51 | ZorbaBeta | I'm not sure if they have the ability to release zero-downtime client patches |
| 15:05.53 | Adys | ZorbaBeta: meh? |
| 15:05.58 | Shirik | I don't see why the servers should have to go down to do that, but I really wouldn't know |
| 15:06.02 | Adys | everyone logs off once in a while |
| 15:06.17 | Adys | if there's a hotfix wave, servers need to get restarted anyway |
| 15:06.32 | ZorbaBeta | adys, that's why I said "at worst", I imagine most can just wait for the client to relog |
| 15:06.50 | Adys | why's it messy? |
| 15:06.53 | ZorbaBeta | on the other hand you might end up with something like Eve, where the developers were all proud of their zero-downtime hotpatching system |
| 15:07.05 | ZorbaBeta | on a game that now has a mandatory one-hour downtime every single damn day |
| 15:07.19 | Shirik | lol |
| 15:07.34 | Adys | ffs |
| 15:07.41 | Shirik | In all honesty, you COULD patch this issue while the user is logged into a server |
| 15:07.41 | Adys | Launcher.exe requires upnp too now |
| 15:07.43 | ZorbaBeta | "messy" in that doing it while the user is actively killing trolls playing is messy |
| 15:07.51 | Shirik | you just need additional code to be able to handle that |
| 15:08.02 | Adys | ZorbaBeta: ah thought you meant the login patch is messy |
| 15:08.21 | Adys | and Shirik i dont see the benefit |
| 15:08.23 | mikma | eh hehe |
| 15:08.25 | Adys | again if its critical |
| 15:08.27 | Shirik | I agree Adys |
| 15:08.28 | Adys | restart servers |
| 15:09.36 | mikma | funny thing. ChatIcons and BasicChatMods prevent me from exploitinh the /dump |
| 15:09.44 | mikma | after disabling them... it works fine |
| 15:10.19 | Shirik | as soon as the edit box gets tainted, you're done |
| 15:10.32 | Shirik | the whole issue is that the entire path, from code entry, all the way to execution, is secure |
| 15:10.44 | foxlit | mikma: make a macro. |
| 15:11.03 | mikma | foxlit: well, i'm not actually planning on using this :) just testing and lolling |
| 15:11.33 | Arrowmaster | there is a /dump exploit? |
| 15:11.42 | mikma | <PROTECTED> |
| 15:11.44 | mikma | go and try |
| 15:12.02 | mikma | i'm pretty sure it gets hotfixed really, really fast |
| 15:12.13 | bluspacecow | how fast ? |
| 15:12.21 | Adys | faster than you in bed |
| 15:12.22 | foxlit | next scheduled patch fast. |
| 15:12.50 | TT18 | Alestane, if you call a function from the onload event the function can be defined after? |
| 15:13.02 | Adys | Anyone got the ptr patch downloaded? |
| 15:13.11 | bluspacecow | before it comes out on the PTR fast ? 3.2.1ohshit fast ? |
| 15:13.21 | ZorbaBeta | adys, in theory I now do |
| 15:13.24 | ZorbaBeta | though I haven't tried it out |
| 15:13.32 | nicoli_s | well its obviously not ohshit fast, since its been out over a day |
| 15:13.35 | Adys | ZorbaBeta: Mind uploading the patch somewhere? |
| 15:13.44 | Fisker | bluspacecow 3.2.1 fast i'd guess |
| 15:13.55 | ZorbaBeta | oh man, I've got 30kbps upstream |
| 15:13.57 | Fisker | aka on wednesday |
| 15:14.01 | bluspacecow | i like how they come out with a 3.1.1 |
| 15:14.02 | ZorbaBeta | that would take a very long time :P |
| 15:14.05 | Adys | blah |
| 15:14.07 | bluspacecow | then a 3.1.1a |
| 15:14.18 | ZorbaBeta | if I had something heftier I would, but I don't |
| 15:14.47 | ZorbaBeta | I could upload the downloader .exe, don't know if that would help |
| 15:14.58 | *** join/#wowuidev Movix (n=Movix@mail.schiffmann.fr) |
| 15:14.58 | Adys | yeah that would |
| 15:15.29 | Fisker | what downloader are we talking about? |
| 15:15.34 | Arrowmaster | DevTools_Dump({ func() }, "value"); |
| 15:15.38 | *** join/#wowuidev Kowski (n=ykow@pv130242.reshsg.uci.edu) |
| 15:15.38 | Adys | 0.2.2 |
| 15:15.42 | Arrowmaster | why |
| 15:15.53 | Fisker | http://rapidshare.com/files/267285835/WoW-0.2.2.10257-enGB-ptr-downloader.exe.html |
| 15:15.54 | bluspacecow | 3.2.2 PTR Fisker |
| 15:16.04 | Adys | Fisker: hurry engb |
| 15:16.07 | Adys | hurray* |
| 15:16.19 | Fisker | whats up? |
| 15:16.31 | Arrowmaster | why the hell do they have to pick code that was written for lua 5.0 and is absolutely horrible for use in lua5.1 |
| 15:16.33 | bluspacecow | Me |
| 15:16.38 | bluspacecow | in more way then 1 |
| 15:17.36 | foxlit | Arrowmaster: because "absolutely horrible" is relative |
| 15:17.43 | alestane | TT18: Generally, yes. |
| 15:17.48 | Arrowmaster | foxlit: going to remake your 'magic' video for 3.2? |
| 15:17.52 | mikma | http://db.mmo-champion.com/s/69243/create-mohawk-grenade/ |
| 15:17.57 | foxlit | Arrowmaster: I did. |
| 15:18.01 | Adys | IT'S TIME TO PITY SOME FOOLS |
| 15:18.14 | foxlit | (It's a separate bug, though) |
| 15:18.14 | Adys | also the downloader still requires upnp but doesnt crash |
| 15:18.16 | Adys | just works |
| 15:18.20 | bluspacecow | zomg is that 3.2.2 or 3.2 ? |
| 15:18.29 | Adys | 3.2.2 |
| 15:19.40 | Fisker | why so ZOMG? |
| 15:20.08 | bluspacecow | just funny thats all |
| 15:20.16 | Bruners | hi Fisker |
| 15:20.19 | bluspacecow | cogwheel heard of the /dump exploit ? |
| 15:20.40 | Fisker | man |
| 15:20.48 | Fisker | I get flamed for even suggesting there is an exploit |
| 15:20.56 | Fisker | You guys just blatantly post it |
| 15:20.59 | Fisker | >:E |
| 15:21.05 | Arrowmaster | yeah some idiot copy and pasted code into the secure default ui that included 'local func,err = loadstring("return " .. msg);' |
| 15:21.06 | Fisker | i call fiskism |
| 15:21.15 | Fisker | (Racism just against me) |
| 15:21.23 | Bruners | haha |
| 15:21.24 | bluspacecow | meh we has no scruples here |
| 15:21.27 | ZorbaBeta | arrow, whooops :) |
| 15:21.33 | alestane | I know exactly who did it. |
| 15:21.41 | Arrowmaster | who? |
| 15:21.49 | Fisker | cog|work ! |
| 15:21.51 | Adys | ME, SUCKERS! AHAHAHA |
| 15:22.01 | bluspacecow | yep all cog's fault |
| 15:22.05 | alestane | Not my place to say, I'm afraid. |
| 15:22.15 | Fisker | don't tease me bro |
| 15:22.20 | Fisker | slaps alestane around a bit with a large trout |
| 15:22.22 | Arrowmaster | alestane: well i know it wasnt slouken or zootfizzle |
| 15:22.29 | bluspacecow | *starts up 3.01 8874 PTR installer* |
| 15:22.40 | bluspacecow | *sigh another 15GB of HD space gone* |
| 15:22.48 | alestane | They're not on the WoW UI team at the moment though, they moved to another project. |
| 15:22.49 | bluspacecow | *waves goodbye with hankie in hand* |
| 15:22.55 | Arrowmaster | exactly |
| 15:23.02 | Adys | I bet it was Brian |
| 15:23.03 | *** join/#wowuidev PProvost (n=PProvost@c-71-229-131-32.hsd1.co.comcast.net) |
| 15:23.10 | Arrowmaster | yoshi was never really on the ui team |
| 15:23.17 | alestane | No, I mean the person who did it isn't on the team right now. |
| 15:23.30 | Fisker | did he use hax0rs? |
| 15:23.41 | Fisker | since he's not on the team why is he making code for it? :P |
| 15:23.55 | alestane | AlexanderYoshi is not on the UI team and never really has been, although I believe he was one of teh Cosmos devs and he wrote the new combat log. |
| 15:24.28 | alestane | And no, it wasn't Alex and I need to stop talking now. |
| 15:24.29 | nicoli_s | that name is familiar |
| 15:24.30 | Arrowmaster | alestane: is that why the debugstack() call is still broken? they created the debugtools and then got transfered right after it got put on the PTR? |
| 15:25.06 | alestane | The debugstack() level I told them about but it was too late to fix it for 3.2 unless it were something more important. |
| 15:25.18 | alestane | I think that one should be fixed for 3.2.2. |
| 15:26.13 | Fisker | Feel free to name everyone it wasn't alestane :P |
| 15:26.25 | alestane | You see, that's why I need to stop talking. |
| 15:26.28 | Fisker | wouldn't even know as i only know slouken, zoot and Yoshi |
| 15:26.48 | *** join/#wowuidev Kraps (n=chatzill@pool-71-169-26-120.pghk.east.verizon.net) |
| 15:26.57 | Arrowmaster | those are the only 3 blizzard employees i knew of that ever touched the UI |
| 15:27.06 | Arrowmaster | although i know others did |
| 15:27.19 | alestane | I think the team is about six people right now. |
| 15:27.37 | Kraps | morning |
| 15:27.43 | Fisker | Pretty sure i remember another guy in here being in Blizzard |
| 15:27.48 | Fisker | but i don't think he was ui |
| 15:28.04 | Arrowmaster | yoshi wasnt on the ui team |
| 15:28.13 | Arrowmaster | he was a raid encounter designer afaik |
| 15:28.15 | Fisker | well he did a bit still counts :P |
| 15:28.17 | alestane | Still is. |
| 15:28.33 | Arrowmaster | although wasnt slouken an ai designer? |
| 15:28.37 | Fisker | so he's the one i have to channel all my hate into |
| 15:28.58 | Bruners | Fisker: but you consist of only love |
| 15:28.59 | alestane | slouken was never actually on the UI team. He was a game systems programmer. |
| 15:29.03 | MentalPower | yoshi was responsible for the combat log changes too |
| 15:29.07 | Fisker | I think atleast i heard he wasn't doing ui on the new mmo |
| 15:29.41 | cog|work | shakes his fist at Jelly_ |
| 15:30.23 | nicoli_s | she dont use jelly |
| 15:31.30 | Fisker | there's not even 10 people on the EU ptr server |
| 15:31.30 | Fisker | :( |
| 15:31.54 | olafski | :o |
| 15:31.56 | nicoli_s | well then heres yer chance to be number 1 on the server |
| 15:32.05 | olafski | I downloaded the installer.. how do I install it fisker? I'll come to the ptr ;) |
| 15:32.58 | olafski | I figured I'd just run blizzard updater.exe but it doesn't do anything |
| 15:33.05 | MentalPower | alestane: pardon for not reading further up, you are completely correct, Yoshi was one of the original Cosmos devs |
| 15:33.13 | *** join/#wowuidev Aeyan (n=pancake@cpe-174-098-002-214.triad.res.rr.com) |
| 15:33.30 | Fisker | I thought Yoshi was still active at some times |
| 15:33.32 | Fisker | on cosmos |
| 15:33.47 | alestane | I don't think anyone is active on Cosmos anymore. |
| 15:34.04 | mikma | you know why? |
| 15:34.08 | mikma | they stopped developing it |
| 15:34.48 | bluspacecow | olafski : did you keep all your old PTR installers ? |
| 15:34.53 | olafski | bluspacecow: no |
| 15:35.06 | olafski | I remove my PTR installation and installers when a patch is released live |
| 15:35.10 | Kraps | i just found mmorpg.com, its awesome |
| 15:35.16 | olafski | I just downloaded the new ptr patch :) |
| 15:35.17 | bluspacecow | ah then you'll have to download all the 3.2 PTR installers I think |
| 15:35.25 | bluspacecow | at least the 0.2 1GB patch |
| 15:35.35 | olafski | oO |
| 15:35.36 | bluspacecow | im unzipping mine now (I backed up all mine) |
| 15:35.40 | olafski | can't it just copy from the main game? |
| 15:35.43 | olafski | like it usually does |
| 15:35.47 | alestane | Not since 3.0. |
| 15:35.50 | bluspacecow | apparently not |
| 15:35.55 | olafski | hm the 3.2 PTR did that |
| 15:36.01 | bluspacecow | you install teh 3.01 PTR installer then patch from that |
| 15:36.06 | Arrowmaster | no it didnt |
| 15:36.08 | bluspacecow | no it didnt |
| 15:36.23 | olafski | blegh why did the ptr download page only direct me to this file then >_< |
| 15:36.23 | bluspacecow | it installed 3.01 and you patched up to the 3.2 ptach |
| 15:36.41 | bluspacecow | there was no 3.1 -> 3.2 PTR installer |
| 15:37.01 | bluspacecow | you need to install the 3.01 PTR then patch up to 3.2.2 |
| 15:37.42 | bluspacecow | downloading ≠installing :) |
| 15:38.14 | nicoli_s | kraps: mmorpg.com has alot of info, but i cant really trust much of their reviews |
| 15:38.19 | nicoli_s | they tend to be kinda fanboyish |
| 15:38.34 | olafski | that's all very interesting bluspacecow.. but I ask again why did it direct me to this file if it's not all that I need? |
| 15:38.42 | nicoli_s | i remember for months they could only say good shit about darkfall despite the fact the game was horribybad |
| 15:38.44 | bluspacecow | its where you start |
| 15:38.49 | bluspacecow | thats the installer for 3.01 |
| 15:39.02 | bluspacecow | it will then get you to download the rest |
| 15:39.14 | bluspacecow | im short cutting it by having all the PTR installers backed up |
| 15:39.26 | olafski | well, as I said it does nothing except download something :P |
| 15:39.27 | bluspacecow | so my process == quicker but not the usaul process |
| 15:39.31 | alestane | I think what olafski means is, "Why didn't they update the download to supply the PTR patch?" |
| 15:39.38 | bluspacecow | exactly |
| 15:40.00 | olafski | no, what I mean is "why doesn't the download they provide install a PTR client on my pc, regardless what version" |
| 15:40.23 | bluspacecow | meh idk |
| 15:40.29 | olafski | I'm sure once this 3.0.1.8874 EU PTR Installer is installed I can just log in and grab the updates (right?), but it doesn't install :P |
| 15:40.38 | *** join/#wowuidev TopTop18 (n=TopTop18@ip231-37-173-82.adsl2.static.versatel.nl) |
| 15:40.47 | bluspacecow | they've doing this "install the 3.01 PTR first then the rest" method for a while |
| 15:40.48 | Kraps | http://db.mmo-champion.com/s/68884/silence-fool/ wah |
| 15:40.52 | bluspacecow | correct oldafski but remember |
| 15:40.56 | bluspacecow | always run the PTR launcher |
| 15:41.01 | Kraps | what class is that? |
| 15:41.02 | olafski | sigh |
| 15:41.05 | bluspacecow | after each PTR build always run the PTR launcher |
| 15:41.13 | olafski | nevermind :P |
| 15:41.15 | Adys | http://garfieldminusgarfield.net/post/162782719 |
| 15:41.18 | olafski | I'm not going to get my point across |
| 15:41.35 | alestane | Are you saying that the file you download doesn't work? |
| 15:41.58 | bluspacecow | the launcher is how all updates are now pushed out ...its the point you should start from |
| 15:42.30 | Industrial | launcher </3 wow.exe <3 |
| 15:42.33 | Industrial | :p |
| 15:42.56 | olafski | alestane: I downloaded the file the "download client" page provides me |
| 15:43.02 | olafski | which is WoW-3.0.1.8874-PTR-EU-Installer-downloader.exe |
| 15:43.15 | olafski | I then ran that, which downloaded about 200MB into a directory called 3.0.1.8874 EU PTR Installer |
| 15:43.21 | olafski | my real question is "now what" :P |
| 15:43.35 | olafski | the only .exe in that directory does nothing |
| 15:43.49 | bluspacecow | wait |
| 15:43.56 | bluspacecow | whats the name of the folder again ? |
| 15:44.00 | olafski | 3.0.1.8874 EU PTR Installer |
| 15:44.05 | bluspacecow | Hmmmm |
| 15:44.15 | olafski | it has a Blizzard Updater.exe and two installer tomes |
| 15:44.22 | olafski | and some mac stuff :P |
| 15:44.24 | alestane | That installer should load the PTR. Is the downloader done? |
| 15:44.37 | bluspacecow | is the installler even launching ? |
| 15:44.39 | olafski | yep, ran it again to be sure and it completed instantly |
| 15:44.40 | olafski | no bluspacecow |
| 15:44.48 | olafski | maybe I'll just reboot, that sometimes works ;) |
| 15:44.51 | bluspacecow | it is Blizzard Updater.exe |
| 15:45.02 | bluspacecow | possibly registery keys are missing |
| 15:45.09 | Kraps | nicoli_s: i like reading it because it takes me out of wow mode, which is becoming less and less attractive lately |
| 15:45.14 | olafski | hmm |
| 15:45.16 | bluspacecow | or check your start bar it could be minimize down there |
| 15:45.26 | olafski | regkeys. that could be the case, I've been messing with partition names |
| 15:45.27 | bluspacecow | check it for funny icons |
| 15:45.37 | bluspacecow | ok hang on i has links |
| 15:45.38 | olafski | na it's not running I checked task manager :) |
| 15:46.25 | bluspacecow | is there any new icons down there on ya start bar ...including the funny little area to the right windows has :D |
| 15:46.33 | olafski | no :P |
| 15:46.44 | alestane | bluspacecow: It's called the system tray. |
| 15:46.47 | Kraps | Righteous Fury: The bonus threat from Holy spells caused by this talent has been reduced from 90% to 80%. |
| 15:46.52 | Kraps | why? |
| 15:46.59 | olafski | because paladins had it too easy |
| 15:47.20 | Kraps | ... |
| 15:47.24 | bluspacecow | http://forums.wow-europe.com/thread.html?topicId=9941638166&sid=1 |
| 15:47.30 | olafski | well what did you want to hear kraps |
| 15:47.44 | olafski | "the patch notes are a mistake, that change hasn't actually happened"? |
| 15:47.53 | Fisker | :o |
| 15:47.54 | olafski | bluspacecow: [The topic you're looking for is not found] |
| 15:47.58 | Fisker | i got spotted by GM's again |
| 15:47.59 | bluspacecow | wot ? |
| 15:48.15 | bluspacecow | oh dear hang on |
| 15:48.29 | Duman | hmm |
| 15:48.50 | sacarasc | What were you doing Fisker? |
| 15:49.05 | Fisker | sacarasc reported a "OMG FREE SPECTRAL TIGER GO TO THIS LINK"-guy |
| 15:49.05 | bluspacecow | http://forums.worldofwarcraft.com/thread.html?sid=1&topicId=18031236330&ST=US-4921753-Iv7u91dkKzcvGHaGKBwPGDOrVUZi6UFyUAO |
| 15:49.16 | Fisker | And i got a GM recognizing me from the forums :P |
| 15:49.26 | *** join/#wowuidev Elusive (n=designer@unaffiliated/elusive) |
| 15:49.53 | Kraps | olafski: "lets balance tanks by making it harder to hold aggro"? imo increase all threat adding moves/stances by 1000% |
| 15:50.05 | bluspacecow | olafski : what kinda of checksums can you run on your computer - sh1 ? md5 ? |
| 15:51.14 | olafski | kraps: tanking should not require skill? or what |
| 15:51.28 | olafski | bluspacecow: I remember that post somehow.. it doesn't help though |
| 15:51.42 | Duman | I think the days of tanking requiring real skill are long gone |
| 15:51.46 | olafski | I checked btw, I do have the registry keys (at least those pointing to my normal wow) |
| 15:51.48 | bluspacecow | maybe the download's corrupt ? |
| 15:52.08 | alestane | Try rerunning the downloader? I think it should verify the files. |
| 15:52.19 | olafski | did that several times |
| 15:52.26 | bluspacecow | not the 3.01 8874 PTR unfortunately |
| 15:52.30 | olafski | removed the downloaded data now |
| 15:52.30 | Industrial | olafski: most dps classes and I think tank classes too can be widled down to pressing 5-6 buttons in a certain roder, withe r rotation or priority based |
| 15:52.47 | Industrial | the only skill needed to play is knowledge of the encounter and ability to move around accordingly |
| 15:52.51 | Industrial | (IMHO) |
| 15:52.55 | olafski | just checking, when it asks for which directory to install to, I don't have to pick my wow folder right? |
| 15:53.08 | olafski | industrial: that doesn't mean tanks should just have to press taunt and keep aggro automatically |
| 15:53.08 | bluspacecow | alestane : problem is the PTR has its own installer sepereate from WOW |
| 15:53.09 | Industrial | order, either* |
| 15:53.18 | alestane | bluspacecow: I'm aware of this. |
| 15:53.20 | bluspacecow | olafski : install it outside your wow folder pls |
| 15:53.38 | olafski | right, redownloading |
| 15:53.38 | alestane | You can download the installer to somewhere like your desktop. |
| 15:53.50 | olafski | D:\World of Warcraft = wow, D:\wowptr = ptr |
| 15:54.27 | Industrial | I think this is true for most MMO's or dare I say, play versus the computer - you just get the trick after some time :p |
| 15:54.31 | *** join/#wowuidev Movix (n=Movix@mail.schiffmann.fr) |
| 15:54.49 | alestane | The installer doesn't have to go where you want the PTR client either, it should ask you where you want it installed. |
| 15:54.52 | Kraps | hehe i would play this http://www.mmorpg.com/showFeature.cfm/loadFeature/3396/Dana-Massey-Asks-Why-Not-Why-Not-A-Survival-MMO.html |
| 15:55.04 | olafski | that's what I thought alestane, usually it puts itself in D:\World of Warcraft Public Test |
| 15:55.05 | bluspacecow | need to have about 17GB free tho |
| 15:55.48 | olafski | downloader just finished and closed itself |
| 15:56.47 | olafski | meh I'll just reboot, doubt that will work though :P |
| 15:57.54 | ZorbaBeta | industrial, there's a little more skill involved in dealing with When Things Go Wrong |
| 15:58.06 | ZorbaBeta | most obviously on the shoulders of tanks and healers, but sometimes with DPS as well |
| 15:58.33 | olafski | doesn't every dps have some sort of reduced threat mechanism btw? |
| 15:58.39 | olafski | they should stop being lazy and start using them :P |
| 15:58.44 | Elusive | eh |
| 15:58.46 | olafski | (rebooted, it works now.. weird..) |
| 15:58.47 | Elusive | I wouldn't say every. |
| 15:58.47 | ZorbaBeta | olafski, of one kind or another, I believe. some of them aren't active, however, some are just passive |
| 15:58.53 | bluspacecow | they do ? |
| 15:58.54 | olafski | yeah zorbabeta |
| 15:58.56 | bluspacecow | even DKs ? |
| 15:58.59 | olafski | I'm a DK :) |
| 15:59.05 | Elusive | Not all of them have it. |
| 15:59.07 | bluspacecow | olafski : so the installer's working now ? |
| 15:59.09 | olafski | I never come close to taking aggro from a tank in raids |
| 15:59.11 | olafski | yep bluspacecow oO |
| 15:59.20 | bluspacecow | http://a.wirebrain.de/wow |
| 15:59.20 | ZorbaBeta | blu, many dps classes have a percentage threat reduction. some have threat dumps. |
| 15:59.21 | Elusive | Well th en you must not be critting enough. ;P |
| 15:59.30 | olafski | I do quite nice damage elusive :P |
| 16:00.00 | Elusive | I have a warlock inmy raids for whatever reason likes to start DPSing off the bat, doing 8k crits 10 seconds in and pulls more aggro then necessary. |
| 16:00.07 | olafski | DKs have http://www.wowhead.com/?spell=49491 |
| 16:00.11 | Elusive | Needless to say, I don't midn if the mob turns and 1-shots him. |
| 16:00.17 | olafski | 25% less threat, tier 1 talent |
| 16:00.18 | ZorbaBeta | wowwiki claims that blood and unholy presence have a 0.8x threat multiplier, while the Subversion talent can reduce that down by another 25% (multiplicative) |
| 16:00.21 | Elusive | Hit fault for not waiting 3-5 seconds for threat. |
| 16:00.27 | bluspacecow | patching patching patching patching the PTR |
| 16:00.35 | bluspacecow | sigh |
| 16:00.36 | olafski | zorbabeta: oh, didn't know about the 0.8 |
| 16:00.46 | olafski | bluspacecow: installing installing installing :P |
| 16:00.56 | ZorbaBeta | http://www.wowwiki.com/Threat there's a lot of wacky bonuses and reductions |
| 16:01.08 | bluspacecow | why cant they build a "lets-copy-from-3.2-live-then-patch-to-3.2.2 " installer |
| 16:01.25 | bluspacecow | 1GB worth of data to write |
| 16:01.35 | *** join/#wowuidev Lunessa (n=Lunessa@129.7.91.5) |
| 16:01.40 | Lunessa | station |
| 16:01.50 | sacarasc | Port. |
| 16:01.52 | bluspacecow | STATION! |
| 16:02.11 | bluspacecow | party on dudes and be excellent to each other ? |
| 16:02.23 | bluspacecow | WYLD STALLIONS *Guitar riff* |
| 16:02.28 | olafski | wewt one person put my new addon on his favourites, my day is complete |
| 16:03.38 | *** join/#wowuidev Shadowed (n=outlaw@c-98-207-200-159.hsd1.ca.comcast.net) |
| 16:03.54 | bluspacecow | O_O |
| 16:04.04 | bluspacecow | www.brothersoft.com/auctionmaster-257785.htm 4th result down on google for AuctionMaster |
| 16:04.18 | olafski | oO |
| 16:04.46 | nicoli_s | yah those people have been hosting alot of addons recently |
| 16:05.01 | bluspacecow | thought you guys served em with a DMCA hammer |
| 16:05.14 | Elusive | C&D letter incoming! |
| 16:05.30 | nicoli_s | they probably did, that page 404s |
| 16:05.31 | olafski | I get a 404 on that url |
| 16:06.04 | bluspacecow | it does ? |
| 16:06.08 | bluspacecow | oh nvm then :) |
| 16:06.40 | *** join/#wowuidev TopTop18 (n=TopTop18@ip231-37-173-82.adsl2.static.versatel.nl) |
| 16:06.46 | olafski | whoa this ptr installer takes a lot of my resources |
| 16:07.20 | Elusive | w0t |
| 16:07.28 | Elusive | my addon is #2 in googlw hen you search "Autoinvite wow" |
| 16:07.42 | Elusive | But some, outdated bs addon is #1 |
| 16:08.06 | olafski | mine are both #1 when you search for addonname wow ;) |
| 16:08.20 | olafski | bit less of a generic name though |
| 16:08.40 | Adys | my addon is #1 when you search for its exact lua contents |
| 16:08.44 | olafski | ^^ |
| 16:08.49 | Elusive | lol |
| 16:08.51 | Elusive | ;x |
| 16:09.53 | *** join/#wowuidev Kalroth (n=kalroth@2506ds1-hj.0.fullrate.dk) |
| 16:09.53 | Yssaril | olafski: whats your new addon? |
| 16:10.03 | olafski | oh I love progress bars.. it just jumped from 30% to 100% :P |
| 16:10.09 | olafski | yssaril: http://wow.curse.com/downloads/wow-addons/details/togglenames.aspx |
| 16:10.39 | Adys | there was a discussion on the bzr list |
| 16:10.47 | Adys | about just how much progress bars sucked |
| 16:11.07 | olafski | and that funny comic on xkcd about progressbarman |
| 16:11.16 | Adys | yea |
| 16:11.25 | Yssaril | olafski: i like the idea (may i recomend having an option to turn everything exept the name of in dalaran) less info makes game run faster |
| 16:11.39 | Adys | it's so much better to have a checklist of items |
| 16:11.40 | olafski | http://www.xkcd.com/612/ |
| 16:11.43 | Adys | rather than a progressbar |
| 16:12.19 | alestane | My frackin' download is not authorized.. |
| 16:12.31 | Yssaril | Adys: you dont like progress bars that do not run smoothly and tell you your install will be done in a "moment" |
| 16:12.35 | olafski | yssaril: so outside dalaran it would show guild/title but in dalaran it wouldn't? |
| 16:13.02 | olafski | seems I still had some ptr installers, it's going at about 50mb/s now |
| 16:13.04 | Yssaril | olafski: yea or if you wanna go fancy you could do settings per zone :) |
| 16:13.07 | olafski | where does wow save these? I want them gone :P |
| 16:13.12 | Adys | Yssaril: a progress bar is a graphical display of a percentage |
| 16:13.21 | olafski | yssaril: nah if I add that it'll be "hide names in cities" or so :) |
| 16:13.34 | Adys | you can be 99% done after 5 min but still have another 10 min for the last % |
| 16:13.53 | Yssaril | Adys: yea which is why progressbars suck |
| 16:14.06 | Adys | .. which was.. my point |
| 16:14.12 | olafski | some progressbars are fine imo |
| 16:14.14 | Yssaril | :P |
| 16:14.20 | Adys | which was also my point |
| 16:14.28 | Elusive | So, how can I find out why my addon isn't loading? It's been working up to this point, but now all of a sudden it doesn't load anymore (yes it is disabled). |
| 16:14.28 | olafski | e.g. copying or downloading a large file could easily use a progress bar |
| 16:14.48 | olafski | yssaril: anywho, I'll add that feature =) |
| 16:14.57 | olafski | .. tonight, really must study now |
| 16:14.58 | alestane | WoWWiki apparently stops hosting PTR patches once they go live. |
| 16:15.13 | Adys | wowwiki doesnt host patches |
| 16:15.15 | Adys | no olafski |
| 16:15.26 | alestane | Or listing patch mirrors for it then. |
| 16:16.00 | Adys | the speed for copying a file depends a lot on what's cached in your hard drive for exampe |
| 16:16.01 | Adys | +l |
| 16:16.02 | bluspacecow | yep |
| 16:16.05 | olafski | sure |
| 16:16.09 | olafski | but a good estimate can be made |
| 16:16.12 | bluspacecow | alestane : that's why I backed up mine |
| 16:16.19 | olafski | in my opinion it's a lot better than a checklist of files |
| 16:16.20 | Adys | No, olafski |
| 16:16.23 | alestane | I didn't have that much disk space. |
| 16:16.23 | olafski | ok adys |
| 16:16.27 | olafski | whatever you say then :) |
| 16:16.31 | Adys | if you suddenly use your hard drive |
| 16:16.39 | olafski | bluspacecow: I apparently had mine as well, dunno where they were :P |
| 16:16.40 | Adys | the r/w operations will go completely off |
| 16:16.46 | Adys | and eat up the copy process |
| 16:17.05 | Adys | eg imagine you are copying two files concurrently |
| 16:17.12 | bluspacecow | :( |
| 16:17.18 | olafski | I know how pcs work.. enough smartassery now :) |
| 16:17.22 | bluspacecow | i forgot i had path of frost on |
| 16:17.29 | olafski | fell to your death? |
| 16:17.29 | bluspacecow | dismounted above a lake ... |
| 16:17.32 | olafski | ouch |
| 16:17.33 | bluspacecow | == splat |
| 16:17.34 | Adys | olafski: I'm not being a smartass, you're wrong here |
| 16:18.06 | Adys | if you are copying two files concurrently, unless the file browser or whichever app is doing something smart, you cant estimate anything |
| 16:18.24 | olafski | sigh :P I've seen enough |
| 16:18.28 | alestane | It depends on how you view an operation's progress, I guess. |
| 16:18.43 | Adys | I'm not proposing a checklist of files |
| 16:18.46 | Adys | but for example |
| 16:19.02 | Adys | "1654/2000 files copied (212.3MB / 500 MB) |
| 16:19.02 | Duman | bleh |
| 16:19.12 | Adys | is a LOT better than a 149 days progressbar |
| 16:19.46 | Duman | I guess I am fail, since I never downloaded the last patch from the previous PTR |
| 16:20.13 | Duman | "download not authorized" |
| 16:20.23 | Duman | hmm |
| 16:20.35 | alestane | Adys: Put that over the progress bar? |
| 16:20.46 | Lunessa | bluspacecow: I used to cast water walking on people who were jumping off cliffs into lakes for the lul. |
| 16:20.53 | bluspacecow | eval |
| 16:20.55 | Adys | a progress bar gives you a false sense of "things being done Real Soon Now" |
| 16:20.58 | bluspacecow | simply EEEEVAL |
| 16:21.43 | Adys | what IS nice: a checklist of operations left to do with "This may take up to x minutes" |
| 16:22.04 | olafski | sure a growing blue bar showing 75% is a LOT different than 1500/2000 in text form :DD |
| 16:22.09 | olafski | run along now :) |
| 16:22.35 | Adys | olafski: if you're just being hostile to be hostile, please stop arguing |
| 16:22.42 | olafski | I could say the same about you |
| 16:22.44 | olafski | seriously |
| 16:22.49 | olafski | you're just proposing text-mode progress bars |
| 16:22.55 | zenzelezz | no |
| 16:22.58 | Adys | ok, and that makes me hostile |
| 16:23.02 | zenzelezz | files can be immensely different in size |
| 16:23.14 | zenzelezz | at the very least, include a X of Y bytes progress text |
| 16:23.14 | olafski | indeed zenzelezz.. his 212.3MB / 500MB thing made a little sense |
| 16:23.20 | alestane | olafski: I think he's saying that one shouldn't really try to estimate time remaining. |
| 16:23.23 | olafski | but it's still not different than a progress bar showing the same |
| 16:23.29 | olafski | sure alestane but that's not what a progress bar is :) |
| 16:23.30 | zenzelezz | yes it is |
| 16:23.40 | Adys | it gives you that feeling, yes |
| 16:23.47 | zenzelezz | a progress bar in general is much less obvious |
| 16:23.47 | Duman | As long as it's not a "progress" bar that gets to the end and starts over (and over, and over)... ;-) |
| 16:23.47 | olafski | a progress bar shows progress, not time remaining |
| 16:23.54 | Duman | those drive me batshit crazy |
| 16:23.57 | Arrowmaster | speaking of progress bars, the wow install progress bar is so fucked up |
| 16:24.00 | olafski | yeah that's more like a "busy indicator" duman :) |
| 16:24.03 | Adys | it doesnt matter what it shows, it matters what the user thinks |
| 16:24.05 | Adys | see like |
| 16:24.08 | olafski | arrowmaster: that's how this conversation started :P |
| 16:24.13 | Adys | this fucking Blizzard Updater |
| 16:24.16 | Arrowmaster | it downloads 6.6gigs and ends up being over 16gigs |
| 16:25.21 | bluspacecow | apparently it has ADD |
| 16:25.25 | zenzelezz | my pirated Carmageddon installer back in the day was a DOS program that still did graphics by straight memory addresses... the progress bar ended up covering four lines on the screen before it finished |
| 16:25.47 | bluspacecow | 6 ! no 7 ! no 12 ! no 14! no i mean 16 ? |
| 16:25.49 | alestane | I wouldn't put too much stock in "what I think when I see this", though, that varies heavily from person to person. |
| 16:26.22 | zenzelezz | visual progress bars for slow operations: "did that just grow a pixel or am I seeing things?" |
| 16:26.26 | *** join/#wowuidev Kaso (n=Kaso@87.76.56.59) |
| 16:26.35 | Adys | exactly alestane |
| 16:26.58 | Arrowmaster | no the 3.0 installer really does download only 6.6gigs, its just somehow the install ends up being over 16gigs when its done which is confusing |
| 16:27.09 | olafski | zenzelezz: if it's a slow operation perhaps you shouldn't be sitting there watching the progress bar ;) |
| 16:27.18 | olafski | arrowmaster: it could download compressed data.. |
| 16:27.25 | bluspacecow | hmmm maybe it ate too many pies well installing |
| 16:27.26 | *** mode/#wowuidev [+v netcurse] by ChanServ |
| 16:27.41 | Arrowmaster | most of the wow data shouldnt be very compressable afaik |
| 16:27.49 | Adys | it is already compressed |
| 16:27.52 | alestane | If you look at a progress bar and assume that its rate of increase will be constant, I consider that a faulty assumption on your part, not a faulty design of the progress bar. |
| 16:28.11 | olafski | arrowmaster: well, if 6GB downloaded turns into 16GB something must have happened to it ;) |
| 16:28.26 | Legorol | padded with zeros! |
| 16:28.32 | olafski | heh yes that's possible too |
| 16:28.37 | olafski | or ones! |
| 16:28.52 | ZorbaBeta | blizzard has entered into a secret contract with hard drive manufacturers |
| 16:28.55 | *** join/#wowuidev TopTop18 (n=TopTop18@ip231-37-173-82.adsl2.static.versatel.nl) |
| 16:29.06 | Lopeppeppy | Sweet! |
| 16:29.09 | ZorbaBeta | they get paid for every extra megabyte they grow the installation by |
| 16:29.16 | bluspacecow | *pokes 0.2 PTR installer* |
| 16:29.19 | alestane | My current ghoul: "Beetlecruncher." |
| 16:29.21 | bluspacecow | *glares* |
| 16:29.28 | bluspacecow | Hurry the fuck up you ! |
| 16:30.07 | Adys | see |
| 16:30.14 | alestane | I'm only going to worry about finding the 0.2.0 patch if you actually get 3.2.2, |
| 16:30.20 | Adys | progress bars are fine for http/ftp downloads |
| 16:30.35 | Adys | for torrents they're just screwed up |
| 16:30.47 | Adys | i like utorrent's bar |
| 16:31.10 | bluspacecow | alestane : as opposed to ? |
| 16:31.19 | olafski | bluspacecow: downloading the last patch I think :) |
| 16:31.30 | bluspacecow | poop |
| 16:31.38 | olafski | got the download not authorized thing earlier |
| 16:31.40 | bluspacecow | idk its still patching the 0.2 PTR |
| 16:31.52 | olafski | :o |
| 16:32.12 | alestane | I'm not going to jump through hoops trying to get ready for a patch that I might not be able to download anyway. |
| 16:32.14 | olafski | wow-0.2.2 is the one I'm getting now.. 1.5GB |
| 16:32.40 | alestane | Okay, in that case I do need to try and get the 0.2.0 patch. Anyone know a link for the mac version? |
| 16:32.50 | bluspacecow | hmm i mihht be patching the wrong one :) |
| 16:32.53 | bluspacecow | oh dear |
| 16:33.11 | olafski | bluspacecow: if you had kept your previous patches wherever blizzard puts them on your HD it would have picked the right one ;) |
| 16:33.28 | bluspacecow | blah think i;; need to this again |
| 16:33.44 | olafski | 768K of 1.5GB - about 10 hours :-) |
| 16:33.51 | bluspacecow | * need to do this again |
| 16:35.01 | Duman | hmm |
| 16:36.00 | *** join/#wowuidev Movix (n=Movix@mail.schiffmann.fr) |
| 16:36.25 | Duman | yay for being able to see revisions on wowwiki :) |
| 16:36.51 | Duman | had to grab the last 2 previous ptr patches |
| 16:36.58 | olafski | doesn't the blizzard downloader work? |
| 16:37.06 | Duman | not if I was behind on patches |
| 16:37.12 | Duman | I got "download not authorized" |
| 16:37.14 | olafski | oO mine just downloaded them |
| 16:37.18 | Duman | weird |
| 16:37.21 | olafski | do you have a b.net account? |
| 16:37.23 | Duman | yes |
| 16:37.23 | *** join/#wowuidev Neffykins (n=chatzill@cpe-68-174-198-185.si.res.rr.com) |
| 16:37.29 | bluspacecow | Duman were you opening the PTR Launcher ? |
| 16:37.30 | olafski | try logging in with your old account |
| 16:37.36 | Duman | blu: yes |
| 16:37.38 | olafski | (start wow.exe and log in with a non bnet account) |
| 16:37.39 | olafski | that worked for me |
| 16:37.49 | olafski | I even entered the wrong password, didn't matter :P |
| 16:37.52 | Duman | no, the ptr launcher (tried) to download them |
| 16:37.58 | Duman | this was before any logging in |
| 16:38.03 | olafski | which is why I said start wow.exe, not launcher.exe |
| 16:38.11 | Duman | irrelevant now, I have the files :) |
| 16:38.14 | olafski | :) |
| 16:38.21 | olafski | I'd still like to know where all these installers are cached |
| 16:38.24 | Neffykins | I can't seem to find much on WoWWiki. Is there a way to set a binding to a button that only works for the current session, and won't save the binding cross-session? |
| 16:38.26 | olafski | it really doesn't have to do that for me :P |
| 16:38.26 | Legorol | duman: which 2 previous ptr patch did you need? |
| 16:38.42 | Legorol | Duman: afaik you only need the PTR 3.0.1 installer, then download today's 0.2.2 patch, that's it |
| 16:38.44 | olafski | 15% of the 0.2.2 patch done :D |
| 16:38.45 | bluspacecow | olafski its usaully better to use Launcher.exe as thats how they push out new updates these days ... |
| 16:38.58 | olafski | legorol: I had to install a ton of patches before it started downloading the 0.2.2 patch |
| 16:39.10 | olafski | bluspacecow: probably, but I got download not allowed :P |
| 16:39.12 | Duman | oh, they are only doign an 0.0.1 -> 0.2.2 patch, and not 0.2.0 -> 0.2.2? sigh |
| 16:39.15 | durcyn | the only thing launcher.exe does is update iself and launch the background downloader |
| 16:39.24 | Legorol | olafski: you could've avoided that by reverting to the 3.0.1 install |
| 16:39.32 | olafski | legorol: I did have the 3.0.1 install |
| 16:39.33 | Legorol | on the PTR, they haven't got all the patch paths covered |
| 16:39.52 | olafski | this is a clean PTR installation started today |
| 16:39.53 | bluspacecow | yeah and i've tons of people get "failed to apply patch"errors on the PTR forums that were solved by running launcher.exe |
| 16:39.55 | Legorol | olafski: strange, when i installed 3.0.1, it went straight to 0.2.2 |
| 16:39.57 | bluspacecow | it downloads a small MPQ |
| 16:39.58 | Duman | I know that they don't have 'all' of them, but they should have one for the previous PTR, you'd think ;) |
| 16:40.04 | bluspacecow | then applys the new build |
| 16:40.05 | Kraps | http://www.gossipgamers.com/popcap-laughs-at-evony-ads/ |
| 16:40.23 | Legorol | Duman: indeed. at least the last version they released on PTR is usually authorized to log in and grab 0.2.2 |
| 16:40.27 | *** join/#wowuidev Cide (n=EAndre@hus110a.bobbnet.com) |
| 16:40.27 | *** mode/#wowuidev [+v Cide] by ChanServ |
| 16:40.30 | Legorol | but not every build that was on the PTR during the 0.2.0 cycle |
| 16:41.05 | olafski | dunno what evony is :( |
| 16:41.11 | bluspacecow | yeah but it solved the "failed to apply patch" error every single time |
| 16:41.20 | bluspacecow | i have made copy pasta for it |
| 16:42.15 | theorbtwo | olafski: It's some sort of multiplayer rts, with ads fucking everywhere, and full of boobies. |
| 16:42.17 | theorbtwo | (Which the game, apparently, isn't.) |
| 16:42.21 | olafski | cool |
| 16:42.23 | olafski | oh |
| 16:42.24 | olafski | :P |
| 16:42.40 | olafski | dumdedum 33% |
| 16:42.42 | bluspacecow | zomg the ptr forums are only just open |
| 16:42.49 | bluspacecow | already theres 1 post about premades |
| 16:42.53 | bluspacecow | a post about mirrors |
| 16:43.00 | bluspacecow | 2 about patch problesm |
| 16:43.03 | bluspacecow | and 1 rogue post |
| 16:44.34 | *** join/#wowuidev TopTop18 (n=TopTop18@ip231-37-173-82.adsl2.static.versatel.nl) |
| 16:44.42 | bluspacecow | are the PTR servers even up yet ? anyone got an IP for them ? |
| 16:45.17 | *** join/#wowuidev Hjalte (n=chatzill@cpe.ge-0-2-0-835.arcnqu2.customer.tele.dk) |
| 16:45.59 | bluspacecow | http://forums.worldofwarcraft.com/thread.html?topicId=19110159361&sid=1 |
| 16:46.02 | olafski | people killed onyxia already |
| 16:46.02 | bluspacecow | roflsz |
| 16:46.04 | olafski | so I 'd say so |
| 16:46.18 | bluspacecow | EU not US |
| 16:46.20 | bluspacecow | im on US |
| 16:46.23 | bluspacecow | :) |
| 16:46.26 | olafski | ah.. I'm on EU :P |
| 16:48.04 | Duman | well, that was a waste.. haha... guess I'll just wipe my PTR folder and reinstall 0.0.1 and let it patch up :P |
| 16:48.33 | bluspacecow | olafski : zomg my bar is at 80% |
| 16:48.45 | olafski | installation or download? |
| 16:49.04 | olafski | 56% here (download of 0.2.2) |
| 16:49.17 | bluspacecow | install of 0.2 |
| 16:49.38 | Shirik__ | omghai |
| 16:49.40 | Shirik__ | tackles Lopeppeppy |
| 16:49.52 | bluspacecow | ~fish Shirik_ |
| 16:49.52 | purl | ACTION slaps Shirik_ around with a large trout |
| 16:50.12 | *** join/#wowuidev Movix (n=Movix@mail.schiffmann.fr) |
| 16:50.15 | olafski | ah |
| 16:50.40 | bluspacecow | to think some bright spark posted something to the O.Forums about their being a "rivalary" between Curse and WOWI and that they "hated each other" |
| 16:50.56 | *** join/#wowuidev Cloudwolf (n=chatzill@c-71-231-97-151.hsd1.wa.comcast.net) |
| 16:51.11 | amro | wait, more UI drama? |
| 16:51.14 | amro | we haven't had any for a while |
| 16:51.16 | olafski | cool |
| 16:51.19 | olafski | I like drama |
| 16:51.20 | nicoli_s | link? |
| 16:51.20 | Duman | heh |
| 16:51.52 | bluspacecow | i can't find it :( |
| 16:52.25 | Lopeppeppy | They've been claiming that for a long time, bluspacecow, they just always forget to post the parts where the admins all say it's not true. |
| 16:52.36 | bluspacecow | oh here it is |
| 16:52.36 | bluspacecow | http://forums.worldofwarcraft.com/thread.html?topicId=19110157889&postId=191083706851&sid=1#15 |
| 16:53.07 | bluspacecow | infighting between Curse and WowI ! |
| 16:53.26 | bluspacecow | *stuffs Shirik into a mexican wrestler uniform with Mask* |
| 16:53.31 | Lopeppeppy | Oh, whatever. *laugh* Everyone's here in the lounge happily, no catfights. |
| 16:53.41 | bluspacecow | hmmm need someone from Curse .... |
| 16:54.09 | nicoli_s | is from curse |
| 16:54.10 | Lopeppeppy | hides the Cursers! |
| 16:54.24 | bluspacecow | *grabs Arrowmaster and puts him into a Red Jimmy the fly costume* |
| 16:54.25 | olafski | I'm registered on curs e;-) |
| 16:54.37 | bluspacecow | *shoves both in a mud wrestling ring* |
| 16:54.42 | bluspacecow | now go at it ! |
| 16:54.47 | bluspacecow | i wannna see in fighting ! |
| 16:54.48 | nicoli_s | whars my gun? |
| 16:54.59 | bluspacecow | thats cheating :( |
| 16:55.02 | Lopeppeppy | No guns, use chopsticks. |
| 16:55.08 | Fisker | i'm cheating on you bluspacecow |
| 16:55.14 | nicoli_s | i cant use those to eat, why would i use them to kill? |
| 16:57.32 | bluspacecow | done the 0.2 now onto the 9 build updaters X_X |
| 16:59.54 | *** join/#wowuidev Kaso| (n=Kaso@87.76.110.226) |
| 17:01.00 | Lunessa | http://ihasahotdog.com/2009/08/13/funny-dog-pictures-humiliated-elephant/ |
| 17:01.51 | *** join/#wowuidev NeoTron (n=neotron@pool-173-64-144-162.sttlwa.fios.verizon.net) |
| 17:01.53 | bluspacecow | loldogs ? |
| 17:03.52 | *** join/#wowuidev Doow (n=Miranda@unaffiliated/doow) |
| 17:04.30 | Kaso| | does lua not have an xor? thats annoying |
| 17:04.56 | Kaso| | though i guess falls in the category of not having ++ type annoying |
| 17:05.20 | ZorbaBeta | lua doesn't have any built-in bitwise operators, although WoW includes functions for them |
| 17:06.18 | Kaso| | i just want a logical xor |
| 17:06.32 | bluspacecow | http://ihasahotdog.com/2009/08/14/funny-dog-pictures-take-eezy/ |
| 17:06.37 | foxlit | Kaso|: ~= |
| 17:06.50 | alestane | Works if you have true boolean values. |
| 17:06.50 | Kaso| | oh |
| 17:06.56 | Kaso| | thats a fair point |
| 17:06.59 | Kaso| | didnt think about that >< |
| 17:07.08 | Kaso| | i do have boolean values |
| 17:07.11 | foxlit | Logical xor is a very, very odd thing to want :) |
| 17:07.27 | nicoli_s | its not weird, i think its very logical someone would want that :P |
| 17:07.53 | Lunessa | Ah yes... I love being razzed out our mailbox sizes on the server... It makes me so happy. |
| 17:08.24 | foxlit | Hm, they broke the EU auth? |
| 17:08.40 | bluspacecow | hmm ? |
| 17:14.55 | bluspacecow | dang installer is slow |
| 17:15.16 | bluspacecow | had to run a ls -l command as the finder is updating too slowly .... |
| 17:15.23 | *** join/#wowuidev Tepel (n=Tepel@cc624207-a.gorre1.fr.home.nl) |
| 17:15.29 | *** join/#wowuidev TopTop18 (n=TopTop18@ip231-37-173-82.adsl2.static.versatel.nl) |
| 17:15.33 | olafski | 9 people on my ptr oO |
| 17:15.42 | tlund | 3.2.2 is up? |
| 17:15.52 | bluspacecow | yep |
| 17:15.58 | *** join/#wowuidev Kaso (n=Kaso@87.76.110.226) |
| 17:16.07 | bluspacecow | olafski : is that what you get from /who |
| 17:16.14 | bluspacecow | try /who classname |
| 17:16.19 | bluspacecow | see what you get :) |
| 17:16.45 | olafski | I'm the only DK |
| 17:16.51 | olafski | 1 mage.. |
| 17:16.55 | bluspacecow | thats like that song |
| 17:16.57 | tlund | niice |
| 17:16.57 | tlund | onyxia raid! :) |
| 17:17.14 | bluspacecow | "i'm the only gay eskimo ....... in my tribe: |
| 17:17.42 | bluspacecow | "i go out seal hunting with my best friend taka but all i want to do is get into his parka ....." |
| 17:18.23 | *** join/#wowuidev Tinyboom (n=nahh@182.80-202-154.nextgentel.com) |
| 17:18.46 | augustl | man my HD works it's ass of when I log in to dala |
| 17:19.00 | augustl | even though I very recently defragged it! Meh.. |
| 17:19.30 | olafski | bluspacecow: so yeah, 9 people on the ptr :P |
| 17:21.14 | augustl | hah, 1x titanium ore is worth a little more than 20x saronite ore on my server atm |
| 17:22.29 | Legorol | then you have it cheap¬ |
| 17:22.51 | Legorol | on mine, one stack saronite is around 15-18g |
| 17:23.19 | Legorol | one ore *starts* at 18 if you are lucky, but more like 20-25 |
| 17:23.47 | augustl | they're @ 22 here, saronite is @ 19 |
| 17:24.19 | Legorol | they should up spawnrate imo |
| 17:24.34 | Legorol | problem is, the demand for titanium ore for high-end raiding/JC-ing means that low-end uses of it are shafted |
| 17:24.52 | Legorol | you can't get titanium for titansteel bars, which is needed for i200 crafted stuff |
| 17:24.57 | Legorol | ie. fresh 80s |
| 17:25.11 | Duman | hmm |
| 17:26.06 | augustl | I ended up farming it myself |
| 17:26.21 | augustl | needed 3-4 h of farming for ~ 20 bars, though.. |
| 17:26.31 | Legorol | i can't find any :( my realm has very active alliance population, so i can never find any during sane hours |
| 17:27.07 | Legorol | farming titanium is so bad actually, you are better off doing dailies and buying it from the AH |
| 17:27.11 | Legorol | it still works out cheaper |
| 17:27.19 | *** join/#wowuidev Movix (n=Movix@mail.schiffmann.fr) |
| 17:27.39 | A-KO | yeah |
| 17:27.43 | A-KO | I just do dailies these days |
| 17:27.47 | A-KO | it's the easiest, most consistent way to make gold |
| 17:28.00 | A-KO | I mine while I do them, and sell what I find |
| 17:28.43 | augustl | I'm a gathermate addict, though |
| 17:28.51 | augustl | makes farming veins much more efficient |
| 17:30.31 | A-KO | I just circle around Sholazar |
| 17:30.38 | A-KO | for like an hour on occasion |
| 17:30.48 | A-KO | to be honest, though, it's just not worth it |
| 17:30.54 | A-KO | a stack of saronite on my realm is down to 15gt |
| 17:30.56 | A-KO | -t |
| 17:31.14 | A-KO | personally, I feel there is no reason to price things like that |
| 17:31.18 | A-KO | that's way too low |
| 17:31.36 | A-KO | little to do with botters/hackers and a lot to do with morons |
| 17:31.37 | ZorbaBeta | supply and demand? sell it 'cause you've got it, and otherwise it's just piling up in your bank |
| 17:31.42 | A-KO | it's not supply/demand |
| 17:31.46 | A-KO | supply/demand assumes greed |
| 17:31.55 | A-KO | and since this is a video game, not every person who mines is in it for 100% amount of money |
| 17:32.15 | ZorbaBeta | no, but you only need a few good AH barons to bring supply and demand back |
| 17:32.19 | A-KO | yeah |
| 17:32.22 | A-KO | I've considered doing that |
| 17:32.25 | ZorbaBeta | I resold stuff all the time on my server until I found a better way to make money |
| 17:32.35 | ZorbaBeta | and, yeah, it gravitated towards a reasonable equilibrium |
| 17:33.04 | nicoli_s | you just need to add a kill switch to quest helper and extort money from people ZorbaBeta |
| 17:33.15 | A-KO | do what I was planning to do |
| 17:33.25 | A-KO | when you buy stuff from a vendor, it never resells for the same amount of gold |
| 17:33.29 | A-KO | so just buy and resell til gold = 0 |
| 17:33.40 | A-KO | make the frame take over their movement keys so they can't move while it does it ;P |
| 17:33.58 | A-KO | notes such an addon would get me perma-banned from wow, from curse, from everywhere |
| 17:36.24 | olafski | 15 people already.. I can do onyxia now! |
| 17:41.25 | *** join/#wowuidev Kraps (n=chatzill@pool-71-169-26-120.pghk.east.verizon.net) |
| 17:42.26 | cbreak | onlyxia only needs two or three. I heard paladins can solo her. |
| 17:42.56 | End | I've heard that she's been solo'd by every class |
| 17:43.03 | cbreak | I doubt mages can. |
| 17:43.18 | End | I heard that mages could, too. |
| 17:43.26 | End | needed some crazt absorb based spec though |
| 17:43.29 | End | crazy* |
| 17:43.45 | End | and lots of bandages and glyphed evocate |
| 17:43.48 | Lopeppeppy | I've seen druids solo her. |
| 17:43.57 | End | druids, paladins, dks, etc aren't too surprising |
| 17:47.02 | Duman | yay, 0.2.2 download finally finished... sheesh |
| 17:47.25 | ZorbaBeta | I soloed her as a hybrid prot/fury warrior |
| 17:47.41 | ZorbaBeta | couldn't pull it off as pure fury, took too much damage even with tank gear |
| 17:47.55 | VonhintenHOME` | my shadow priest friends can solo ony easily |
| 17:48.15 | Dagmar | BM tank spec |
| 17:48.19 | Cloudwolf | question if i right click an item can i get the status of that item such as if its locked? or if its soulbound? |
| 17:48.50 | Industrial | eh, read the tooltip? |
| 17:48.54 | *** join/#wowuidev bluspacecow (n=bluspace@60-234-165-167.bitstream.orcon.net.nz) |
| 17:49.17 | Cloudwolf | well can i pull info from said tooltip? for an addon to use as if statement checks? |
| 17:49.53 | bluspacecow | weird |
| 17:50.04 | Dagmar | Why would you pull the information from the tooltip. |
| 17:50.05 | bluspacecow | PTR installer crashed bad can't work out why |
| 17:50.20 | Dagmar | bluespacecow: Does it matter? The PTR probably isn't up] |
| 17:50.28 | bluspacecow | it was like it was using up 98.222222222 % of the CPU and handing notihing back |
| 17:51.03 | bluspacecow | WoW-0.2.2.10257-enUS-ptr-patch.app |
| 17:51.09 | Industrial | beh I'm bored |
| 17:51.12 | bluspacecow | well at least i have the right installer this time |
| 17:51.18 | bluspacecow | *weird* |
| 17:51.20 | Industrial | and out of pot at that ~:| |
| 17:51.28 | Cloudwolf | Dagmar so i could check if the item is locked and if it is when i rightclick have it pick lock it instead of needing to press an ability button every time. |
| 17:52.16 | Dagmar | Cloudwolf: You know, a smart coder wouldn't try and read the tooltip, they'd use the same mechanisms as whatever is providing the tooltip to look it up |
| 17:52.45 | Cloudwolf | question if i right click an item can i get the status of that item such as if its locked? or if its soulbound? and some one commented read the tooltip... |
| 17:53.17 | Lopeppeppy | Your question didn't say why you wanted to know, or how you'd use it. Incomplete question doesn't render perfect answer. |
| 17:53.19 | Industrial | Dagmar: stingy |
| 17:53.20 | bluspacecow | ah good night folks i play with dis in the morning |
| 17:53.33 | Industrial | Dagmar: a smart person would just tell the dude how instead of stinging at me |
| 17:53.36 | *** join/#wowuidev Matrix110| (i=Matrix11@ip-95-222-224-247.unitymediagroup.de) |
| 17:53.52 | Dagmar | Industrial: I'm not the one with the problem |
| 17:54.06 | Dagmar | ...so... Maybe call an adult in to Google it for you? |
| 17:54.12 | Industrial | pfff |
| 17:54.15 | Dagmar | Heh |
| 17:54.18 | Cloudwolf | found the api IsInventoryItemLocked(slotId) |
| 17:54.20 | Industrial | since when is this the googleit channel? |
| 17:54.28 | Dagmar | That's the default mode |
| 17:54.33 | Industrial | since never and I was here first. |
| 17:54.34 | olafski | < cbreak> onlyxia only needs two or three. I heard paladins can solo her. <-- on the ptr? :P |
| 17:55.02 | End | on the ptr? hah, I don't think so |
| 17:55.02 | cbreak | even on the live realms. |
| 17:55.18 | End | if anyone can solo her on the ptr, she's not tuned/designed correctly |
| 17:57.50 | Dagmar | Industrial: I'm just starting to delve into item info retrieval, so I actually would NOT be the guy you'd want to get specifics from about that |
| 17:58.14 | Dagmar | Industial: ABout all I can tell you is that you can poll the thingie to look for the attributes in question |
| 17:58.42 | Cloudwolf | tiemt o find out how i can figure out what bagid and bagslot my mouse is over... |
| 17:59.18 | Industrial | I'm ok with being wrong, not with "a smart coder wouldn't", that's all I'm saying. |
| 18:00.17 | alestane | Who decided murlocs were allowed to be *cute*? |
| 18:00.46 | *** join/#wowuidev Hirsute (n=chatzill@ebc-node-uconnect-93.wireless.utah.edu) |
| 18:01.20 | *** join/#wowuidev Matrix110| (i=Matrix11@ip-95-222-224-247.unitymediagroup.de) |
| 18:01.42 | *** join/#wowuidev Shirik|Ghost (n=mpdelbuo@WoWUIDev/WoWIStaff/Norganna/StatisticalEngineer/Shirik) |
| 18:01.44 | *** join/#wowuidev Pharaun (n=dmoy@tempura.cs.umn.edu) |
| 18:01.45 | *** mode/#wowuidev [+o Shirik|Ghost] by ChanServ |
| 18:03.32 | Lunessa | Blizzard, when they made the murloc suit |
| 18:03.43 | Lopeppeppy | "If I had a murloc.... pet!" |
| 18:04.46 | Industrial | Lopeppeppy: didnt they have the companion for collectors edition before that? lurky and murky? |
| 18:04.53 | Industrial | er, Lunessa ^ |
| 18:05.13 | Lunessa | There's not collectors edition pet, but there is the Blizzcon one. And soon to be two. |
| 18:07.16 | Industrial | http://www.wowhead.com/?item=30360 |
| 18:07.16 | Arrowmaster | EU tbc got lurky for collectors edition as a bonus because they fucked up the whelps |
| 18:07.30 | Lopeppeppy | Winken, Blinken and Nod. |
| 18:08.34 | Kraps | does chatzilla have something better than /list? |
| 18:08.34 | Industrial | !api GetActionCooldown |
| 18:08.34 | lua_bot | GetActionCooldown: Returns cooldown information about an action (http://wowprogramming.com/docs/api/GetActionCooldown) |
| 18:08.34 | Industrial | what if I only know the spell? can i get the current cooldown time on it? |
| 18:08.36 | Cloudwolf | !api cursor |
| 18:08.36 | lua_bot | Found 26 possible matches for 'cursor'. Please be more specific |
| 18:08.41 | Cloudwolf | !api cursorclick |
| 18:08.42 | lua_bot | Could not find a match for 'cursorclick'. |
| 18:08.44 | Cloudwolf | meh... |
| 18:08.52 | Cloudwolf | !api cursor click |
| 18:08.53 | lua_bot | Could not find a match for 'cursor click'. |
| 18:09.01 | Industrial | doesn't do search I'm afraid ^^ |
| 18:09.17 | Dagmar | p!api mouseover |
| 18:09.21 | Dagmar | !api mouseover |
| 18:09.21 | lua_bot | Found 6 possible results for 'mouseover': Button:GetAllowMouseover, QuestMapUpdateMouseOverPOI, UPDATE_MOUSEOVER_UNIT, QuestMapGetMouseOverInfoByIndex, Button:SetAllowMouseover, QuestMapGetMouseOverPOIInfo |
| 18:09.32 | Dagmar | Hmm.. overkill |
| 18:09.57 | Industrial | s/^$// |
| 18:10.05 | Industrial | waits fur purl |
| 18:10.09 | Industrial | take back my sentence! |
| 18:10.21 | Industrial | oh, I even messed up the regex, grats me |
| 18:11.00 | Cloudwolf | -_- im so bad at finding my way throught he wowwiki... |
| 18:11.19 | *** join/#wowuidev Cide (n=EAndre@hus110a.bobbnet.com) |
| 18:11.19 | *** mode/#wowuidev [+v Cide] by ChanServ |
| 18:11.21 | Arrowmaster | what you are trying to do cant really be done |
| 18:11.34 | Cloudwolf | to find out which item in which bag my mouse is hovering over? |
| 18:12.03 | Industrial | never mind my question, found GetSpellCooldown(spellname) |
| 18:12.11 | Industrial | time for a new addon! |
| 18:12.18 | Arrowmaster | !api GetMouseFocus |
| 18:12.19 | lua_bot | GetMouseFocus: Returns the frame that is currently under the mouse, and has mouse input enabled. (http://wowprogramming.com/docs/api/GetMouseFocus) |
| 18:12.34 | Arrowmaster | good luck getting it to work |
| 18:13.36 | Lopeppeppy | I don't think a part of the bag is a separate frame, is it? |
| 18:13.48 | foxlit | items are buttons. |
| 18:13.59 | foxlit | For that matter, they should show a tooltip. |
| 18:14.01 | Arrowmaster | it does, but getting it to work with different bag mods is hell |
| 18:14.31 | foxlit | Can't you interrogate GameTooltip until it tells you? |
| 18:14.56 | *** join/#wowuidev tekkub (n=tekkub@WoWUIDev/WoWI/Featured/Dongle/GitHub/Tekkub) |
| 18:14.56 | *** mode/#wowuidev [+v tekkub] by ChanServ |
| 18:17.10 | Funkeh` | sigh |
| 18:17.15 | Funkeh` | is there no way to who an exact name |
| 18:17.21 | Funkeh` | witohut it giving a bunch of similar names |
| 18:18.35 | Arrowmaster | guessing putting quotes around the name doesnt work? |
| 18:19.00 | *** join/#wowuidev nevcairiel (n=hleppkes@WoWUIDev/WoWAce/Ace3/nevcairiel) |
| 18:19.01 | Funkeh` | nope |
| 18:19.03 | Funkeh` | neither does |
| 18:19.12 | Funkeh` | SendWho("n-CharName") |
| 18:19.20 | Lopeppeppy | brb, restart |
| 18:19.32 | Funkeh` | for example |
| 18:19.39 | Funkeh` | trying to who a guy called "Ha" |
| 18:19.45 | Funkeh` | brings up more than 49 results |
| 18:19.50 | Funkeh` | and he's name isn't even one of them |
| 18:20.27 | Cloudwolf | !api tooltip |
| 18:20.27 | lua_bot | Found 78 possible matches for 'tooltip'. Please be more specific |
| 18:20.43 | Funkeh` | must be some way to who exact names surely |
| 18:20.44 | *** join/#wowuidev Lopeppeppy (n=Lopeppep@141.222.29.18) |
| 18:20.44 | *** mode/#wowuidev [+v Lopeppeppy] by ChanServ |
| 18:21.39 | Cloudwolf | !api gettooltip |
| 18:21.40 | lua_bot | Could not find a match for 'gettooltip'. |
| 18:22.57 | *** join/#wowuidev Lopeppeppy (n=Lopeppep@141.222.29.18) |
| 18:22.57 | *** mode/#wowuidev [+v Lopeppeppy] by ChanServ |
| 18:23.46 | *** join/#wowuidev Movix (n=Movix@mail.schiffmann.fr) |
| 18:25.22 | Cloudwolf | well this isn't going to be fun... if i use frame names to get the info i need then i have to deal with differntly formated addons like onebag and arkinventory because the fame names are different.... and i have no idea atm how to grab info from a tooltip... |
| 18:27.16 | nicoli_s | theres a lib for getting tooltip info im pretty sure |
| 18:27.49 | nevcairiel | there is a lib that helps you, but you should still know wtf you are doing with the tooltips |
| 18:27.52 | nevcairiel | its no magic sauce |
| 18:28.32 | Cloudwolf | well if i cant get the info then i cant start to figure out what i need to do with the info... |
| 18:28.51 | foxlit | Cloudwolf: you could also just assume that all possible bag addons use SABT. |
| 18:29.04 | foxlit | Since UseContainerItem is protected in most cases. |
| 18:29.05 | alestane | They don't, though. |
| 18:29.12 | Arrowmaster | Cloudwolf: i told you that it was almost impossible |
| 18:29.18 | Cloudwolf | sabt?.... |
| 18:29.40 | alestane | Soprano Alto Bass Tenor...or in this case, SecureActionButtonTemplate. |
| 18:29.44 | foxlit | alestane: Oh? So some just cease to work in combat? |
| 18:29.59 | alestane | No, most of them use ContainerItemButtonTemplate. |
| 18:30.42 | Arrowmaster | and you want to make it cast lockpicking right? |
| 18:31.31 | Cloudwolf | yes i would like it to cast lockpicking on the item if its locked when i right click it |
| 18:31.35 | Funkeh` | I think I might need to do something a bit more inventive than using SendWho then >.< |
| 18:32.15 | Arrowmaster | yeah thats impossible to do in any sane way |
| 18:33.21 | Shirik__ | rofl |
| 18:33.26 | Shirik__ | so I tried to have visual studio refactor some of my code |
| 18:33.37 | Shirik__ | It gave me a preview of the method signature it was going to create |
| 18:33.45 | Shirik__ | void MyMethod(MemberVariable member in from subelement in element.GetSubElement<MemberVariable>() where (A_CONSTANT_NAME + ).Equals(subelement.Attributes[]) select subelement, ComponentConfigurator element) |
| 18:33.49 | Arrowmaster | did it end up looking like ms word html output? |
| 18:34.20 | nicoli_s | lol, looks like good code to me shirik |
| 18:34.30 | *** join/#wowuidev Movix (n=Movix@mail.schiffmann.fr) |
| 18:34.35 | Shirik__ | I think it really gets confused by the query in the middle of hte code |
| 18:34.58 | Funkeh` | Arrowmaster, I was thinking of hijacking the friends list |
| 18:35.13 | Arrowmaster | Funkeh`: wasnt talking to you |
| 18:35.17 | Funkeh` | oh |
| 18:35.19 | Funkeh` | ok |
| 18:36.26 | Arrowmaster | Funkeh`: what are you trying to do? |
| 18:36.39 | Funkeh` | Who morons with small names |
| 18:36.52 | Arrowmaster | for what reason? get level? |
| 18:36.57 | Funkeh` | Actually someone randomly asked in /gen what leel he was |
| 18:37.08 | Funkeh` | at which point I who'd him and couldn't get he's level |
| 18:37.17 | Funkeh` | then I realized it could be a problem for badboy_levels |
| 18:37.22 | *** join/#wowuidev Dewin (n=Daniel@c-71-59-222-35.hsd1.or.comcast.net) |
| 18:37.37 | Arrowmaster | somebody found a trick on the 0.2.0 ptr |
| 18:38.14 | Funkeh` | a trick? |
| 18:38.20 | Arrowmaster | i think it had to do with tooltip scanning since the chat messages now have the guid, but doing something like sending a guild invite before setting a tooltip |
| 18:38.58 | Funkeh` | wtf O.o |
| 18:39.01 | Arrowmaster | and worked if you werent in a guild or didnt have power to send guild invites |
| 18:39.16 | Funkeh` | is it documented somewhere? |
| 18:39.17 | Arrowmaster | yeah apparently sending a guild invite puts the persons lvl in your cache |
| 18:39.28 | Arrowmaster | i forget who found it |
| 18:39.42 | Arrowmaster | ~logs |
| 18:39.43 | purl | All conversations are logged to http://ibot.rikers.org/channel, where "channel" is replaced by the URL-encoded channel name, such as %23freenode for #freenode. Lines starting with spaces are not logged. |
| 18:39.43 | Shirik__ | but then they get a guild invite |
| 18:39.46 | Funkeh` | Could you please try find it for me? *bateyes* |
| 18:40.10 | Arrowmaster | i dont remember which channel it was in, here or wowace |
| 18:40.29 | Funkeh` | this is wowace! |
| 18:40.34 | Funkeh` | oh it's not |
| 18:40.37 | Funkeh` | haha |
| 18:40.39 | Lopeppeppy | This is CNN |
| 18:41.23 | alestane | Drakwater clams don't appear to have gotten the memo that clam meat stacks. |
| 18:42.17 | Lopeppeppy | Grrr, my package is still in Phoenix, 3 days later, wtf. |
| 18:42.40 | alestane | What is this package, and why did it go to Phoenix? |
| 18:42.47 | foxlit | Peppy: that's why you order shipping without tracking :) |
| 18:42.51 | Funkeh` | Arrowmaster, the only other way I can think is add friends > get level > remove friends [supress messages] |
| 18:43.02 | Lopeppeppy | It's coming from Amazon, and it's stuck in Phoenix and they won't let go. |
| 18:43.26 | Lopeppeppy | 4 business days it's been in Phoenix. Rawr. Wants my books! |
| 18:43.41 | Lunessa | Lopeppeppy: When you start sounding like James Earl Jones, I'm going to have to seriously re-think thinking about you as a girl. |
| 18:44.08 | Lopeppeppy | *sniff sniff* |
| 18:44.15 | Lopeppeppy | Ask Shirik, he'll tell ya. |
| 18:44.18 | Lopeppeppy | I'm a girl! |
| 18:44.25 | A-KO | auto buying 20K bullets from a vendor takes the game a while to process apparently :P |
| 18:46.03 | Lopeppeppy | Yeah, that's gonna hurt. |
| 18:46.26 | Lunessa | I know you are, but a girl who sounds like JEJ doesn't tickle the "Lookit that tomato" portion of my brain, ya konw? |
| 18:46.38 | Lopeppeppy | Tomato? |
| 18:46.47 | Lopeppeppy | checks her anatomy for fruits. |
| 18:47.40 | Lunessa | http://www.urbandictionary.com/define.php?term=tomato #2 |
| 18:48.11 | A-KO | lol |
| 18:48.31 | Lopeppeppy | Aww, that's sweet! *hug* |
| 18:48.51 | Lopeppeppy | Sadly, I'm a jeans and tshirt girl, so it only half applies. |
| 18:48.57 | *** join/#wowuidev Gryphon (n=gryphon@c-76-104-164-148.hsd1.wa.comcast.net) |
| 18:49.14 | Lunessa | It's slang from the 30s/40s though it was less kind in the 20s. |
| 18:49.35 | Lopeppeppy | "I'm a plant." "I thought men like you were called fruits." |
| 18:52.48 | Lunessa | ... ouch? |
| 18:53.00 | Ackis | ZorbaBeta: ping |
| 18:55.12 | Lopeppeppy | *huggle* |
| 18:55.18 | Lopeppeppy | Bad corny movie is bad! |
| 18:57.45 | Fisker | http://forums.wow-europe.com/thread.html?topicId=10543535376&sid=1 <-after creating 8 topics on his account being hacked |
| 18:58.30 | Fisker | poor GM apologizing for her conduct which was perfectly fine |
| 18:59.37 | alestane | Okay, PTR client is downloading the right patch now. |
| 19:01.38 | A-KO | if I was the customer service person I'd just ban their account and hang up |
| 19:01.41 | A-KO | nad tell 'em to f off :P |
| 19:01.43 | A-KO | but that's just me |
| 19:01.53 | A-KO | If you want to berate the people that can help you, then you deserve it :P |
| 19:03.14 | Lunessa | Usually, that's the wrong way to go - Frustrated people are frustrated/angry and looking for something to punish for their misfortune. Understand this and you too can be a CS Kung-Fu Master. |
| 19:03.31 | A-KO | oh no I spent years in TS/CS |
| 19:03.39 | Fisker | Lunessa i agree |
| 19:03.40 | A-KO | I know *how* to please them |
| 19:03.44 | Fisker | But that was his "second strike" |
| 19:03.54 | A-KO | but kissing ass to someone screaming at me and putting me down is not the right way to go :P |
| 19:03.57 | Dagmar | Oh yes, like last night for instance |
| 19:04.12 | Dagmar | A woman upstairs called to say channel 16 was out on the campus cable network |
| 19:04.33 | Funkeh` | Arrowmaster, can you help me out a bit here |
| 19:04.36 | Funkeh` | like date |
| 19:04.42 | Lunessa | Fisker: Frankly, I'd have told him exactly what the GM told him, and if he persisted in being a prick, I'd give him a forum vacation - which is why I'm a terrible CS person in theory. :) |
| 19:04.44 | Dagmar | She didn't like that I told her frankly nothing was going to happen until morning, and this is like the fifth time in two weeks I've told her that. The tuner is defective and the department responsible isn't thinking that's a priority. |
| 19:04.59 | Arrowmaster | Funkeh`: i dont really remember, i tried searching my logs but didnt come up with anything |
| 19:05.01 | Dagmar | She decided that I was "rude" for telling her that nothing was going to happen and said she was going to file a complaint. |
| 19:05.08 | Funkeh` | gah |
| 19:05.11 | Dagmar | That channel will now never be coming back if I can wing it. |
| 19:05.17 | Funkeh` | I think ill just use the frinds hijacking |
| 19:05.18 | *** join/#wowuidev Pytlask (i=c64a263b@gateway/web/freenode/x-yqrvfchvdcfzrygi) |
| 19:05.19 | A-KO | lol Dagmar |
| 19:05.22 | Funkeh` | friends |
| 19:05.24 | Dagmar | It's a local channel that no one watches anyway |
| 19:05.37 | Lunessa | Dagmar: Haha... I've had a chat or two with a boss for telling people pretty much the same thing. |
| 19:05.46 | robotusch | ok, this is weird |
| 19:05.53 | Fisker | hej robotusch |
| 19:05.59 | robotusch | on the PTR, if I log on with a horde char, there's no problems |
| 19:06.07 | robotusch | if I log on with my alliance char, wow locks up after a few secs |
| 19:06.11 | Lunessa | Someone yesterday called and /demanded/ an mailbox size increase. I told her "not unless you have have a mandate from God in 15' high letters of fire." |
| 19:06.24 | Dagmar | Lunesssa: I'm not kidding. I'm now making the argument to network engineering that perhaps that channel tuner isn't worth replacing and they should consider dropping it from the campus cable lineup. |
| 19:06.33 | Dagmar | Oh win. :) |
| 19:06.41 | Dagmar | I'd get written up for hyperbole like thatr |
| 19:06.50 | Fisker | your computer sucks robotusch |
| 19:07.04 | Fisker | I think it's disconnecting you but because your computer sucks it looks like a crash |
| 19:07.04 | Lopeppeppy | robotusch, try paging a gM to ask them to move your character for you. You may be in a high-login area that's crashing a lot. |
| 19:07.13 | Lunessa | Dagmar: The skill is in target selection and delivery. |
| 19:07.25 | Fisker | Well earlier the server kept doing hiccups |
| 19:07.41 | Fisker | I'd login, get disconnected, login, get disconnected x10 before it would stop again |
| 19:07.56 | Fisker | And since disconnects can usually hang the task while it works it's plausible :P |
| 19:08.16 | *** join/#wowuidev kd3 (n=kd3@wikia/kaydeethree) |
| 19:13.19 | *** join/#wowuidev Shishire (i=Shishire@wr-130-64-217-220.medford.tufts.edu) |
| 19:14.13 | Shishire | I keep getting errors on the first line of this. Can anyone figure out why it doesn't like this assignment? http://pastebin.com/d5d85f2e2 |
| 19:14.30 | robotusch | Fisker, then why wouldn't it do it on a horde char :P |
| 19:14.37 | alestane | Should I take Firefox's advice and upgrade from 3.0 to 3.5 yet? |
| 19:14.40 | robotusch | either way, looks like it's fixed, we're about to pull Onyxia |
| 19:15.03 | mikma | shishire: you are missing () in the first line |
| 19:15.21 | Shishire | no, I'm trying to assign the function to the variable, not the result |
| 19:15.24 | Lopeppeppy | alestane, nope. |
| 19:15.36 | Shishire | I need to make it smaller to have a hope of fitting it in a macro |
| 19:16.23 | Fisker | robotusch seemed to be area related |
| 19:19.44 | malreth | Shishire: local a=AuctionLite; local v=a.GetAuctionValue; v(a,36930) |
| 19:19.50 | malreth | do you see what i did there? |
| 19:20.41 | Lunessa | alestane: I'm using Firefox 3.5.2 and it's verrrra nice. |
| 19:20.58 | Arrowmaster | they fix the security issues yet? |
| 19:21.13 | Lunessa | Depends on which issue you're talking about. |
| 19:21.25 | Shishire | yeah |
| 19:21.28 | ScytheBlade1 | Lopeppeppy: any reason not to? (curious) |
| 19:21.41 | Lopeppeppy | Upgrade-hate, mostly. |
| 19:21.42 | Shishire | so I can't assign with the colon operator in the way? |
| 19:21.54 | ScytheBlade1 | Ah. So that is from the mouth of a help desk person. |
| 19:21.56 | ScytheBlade1 | That I can see |
| 19:22.25 | Arrowmaster | there was some security issues with the new javascript engine |
| 19:22.47 | Lopeppeppy | ScytheBlade1, pretty much.... I've had a bad Friday with incompatable things, so I have The Hate now. |
| 19:22.53 | ScytheBlade1 | I recall an issue, which was patched pretty quickly |
| 19:22.57 | *** join/#wowuidev Philemon (n=myspoons@pool-173-67-144-5.hrbgpa.fios.verizon.net) |
| 19:22.57 | ScytheBlade1 | Lopeppeppy: gotcha. |
| 19:23.08 | Lopeppeppy | has The Hate! |
| 19:23.27 | ScytheBlade1 | You see that picture the other day, concerning the help desk in general? |
| 19:23.31 | Arrowmaster | yeah but i thought another was found the day 3.5.1 was released |
| 19:23.43 | *** join/#wowuidev Movix (n=Movix@mail.schiffmann.fr) |
| 19:23.48 | malreth | Shishire: no. the colon is syntactic sugar for obj.method(obj, args) |
| 19:24.12 | malreth | so you have to think about what would have to happen for var=obj:method to have to work in the way you expect it to |
| 19:24.39 | malreth | somehow, the variable would also have to know not just the address of the function but also the object that you wish to call it on |
| 19:24.40 | Shishire | yeah, that makes sense. I guess I thought the engine would be smart enough to deal with that, but oh well |
| 19:25.07 | Shishire | meh, it won't fit in a macro now, but I can still stick it in a script |
| 19:26.00 | *** join/#wowuidev AbsolutRayne (n=chatzill@XPLR-MCI-74-127-239-30.barrettxplore.com) |
| 19:26.04 | ScytheBlade1 | Lopeppeppy: http://www.flickr.com/photos/ferneyes/337735343/sizes/o/ |
| 19:26.16 | *** join/#wowuidev Movix1 (n=Movix@mail.schiffmann.fr) |
| 19:26.18 | AbsolutRayne | Hey guys, isnt there a cooking addon that shows you what recipes you do and dont have? |
| 19:27.21 | Jamash | tsi |
| 19:27.25 | Jamash | is the shizzle |
| 19:27.29 | malreth | Shishire: i shouldn't give up so easily... you might be able to cook something up using a table |
| 19:27.43 | malreth | s/should/would/ |
| 19:29.25 | Shishire | oooh |
| 19:29.27 | *** join/#wowuidev Spellshaper (n=Spellsha@dslb-084-056-210-160.pools.arcor-ip.net) |
| 19:29.28 | Shishire | good point |
| 19:29.32 | malreth | hmm... actually, it might be even easier than that... you're using a lot of those locals only once |
| 19:29.48 | Shishire | although the for loop may take up more space than the table saves... |
| 19:29.50 | malreth | if a->b and b->c then you might as well just a->c |
| 19:30.02 | *** join/#wowuidev Dashkal (n=dashkal@WoWUIDev/Nexus/dashkal) |
| 19:30.09 | Shadowed | nice |
| 19:30.11 | Shishire | write them inline? |
| 19:30.13 | Shadowed | C:\Projects\WoW\Bin\Interface\FrameXML\UI.xsd"> |
| 19:30.17 | Shadowed | in the latest PTR :< |
| 19:30.38 | Arrowmaster | no build server path? |
| 19:30.48 | Shadowed | apparently not |
| 19:30.54 | Shadowed | I think they might have fixed the focusunit issue too |
| 19:31.08 | Lopeppeppy | AbsolutRayne, hi! Yes, Ackis Recipe List does that, IIRC |
| 19:31.18 | Yssaril | the one where the dropdwon gets tainted shadowed? |
| 19:31.22 | Shadowed | maybe |
| 19:31.58 | Arrowmaster | tell kd3 to stop working so he can send out our ui diffs |
| 19:32.09 | Shadowed | theres nothing interesting Arrowmaster |
| 19:32.23 | Shadowed | the UI.xsd got updated |
| 19:32.25 | Arrowmaster | then how could they have fixed the focus unit shit? |
| 19:32.30 | Shishire | sweet. It works. |
| 19:32.34 | *** join/#wowuidev daev` (n=bleh@pool-72-86-106-233.aubnin.fios.verizon.net) |
| 19:32.34 | Shadowed | they didn't, all they did was fix it for arenas it looks like |
| 19:32.58 | Arrowmaster | huh? |
| 19:33.06 | malreth | Shishire: good job |
| 19:33.50 | malreth | yeah, you should be able to do the entire thing with two locals and one single print statement |
| 19:33.59 | Shadowed | actually not even then looks like they didn't realy fix that either, out of luck on the taint issue then :< |
| 19:34.21 | Shadowed | there's some new field called jumpNavigateStart though, not sure what that is |
| 19:34.54 | Pytlask | Is there a PTR UI guild yet? |
| 19:37.24 | *** join/#wowuidev smoke_ (n=smoke@adsl-76-241-30-251.dsl.skt2ca.sbcglobal.net) |
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| 19:40.20 | *** mode/#wowuidev [+o Shirik|Ghost] by ChanServ |
| 19:41.07 | *** join/#wowuidev Jamash- (n=Jamash@c-98-234-176-205.hsd1.ca.comcast.net) |
| 19:41.37 | *** join/#wowuidev pompy1 (n=Mike@c-68-38-45-3.hsd1.nj.comcast.net) |
| 19:41.50 | robotusch | okay |
| 19:41.57 | robotusch | sliiiightly different encounter |
| 19:42.03 | *** join/#wowuidev netcurse2 (n=hthieblo@dsl092-049-237.sfo4.dsl.speakeasy.net) |
| 19:43.17 | alestane | Does that mean "slightly different" or does it mean |
| 19:43.20 | Adys | it means slightly |
| 19:43.53 | alestane | "What the heck was that thing they called Onyxia?" |
| 19:43.53 | Adys | theres more whelps, and an add popping in p2 |
| 19:43.53 | Adys | shes not immune fire |
| 19:43.53 | robotusch | a hell of a lot more adds |
| 19:43.53 | Adys | nothing not fun :) |
| 19:43.53 | robotusch | nah, but it caught me a bit out :D |
| 19:44.04 | Lopeppeppy | New add? Nice touch. |
| 19:44.04 | Adys | also |
| 19:44.04 | Adys | and |
| 19:44.04 | Adys | this isnt a joke |
| 19:44.04 | Adys | she deep breaths more |
| 19:44.12 | robotusch | ^^ |
| 19:44.14 | robotusch | a lot more forgiving though |
| 19:44.34 | Adys | no its more of the fact we dont have 3k hp |
| 19:44.42 | robotusch | nah |
| 19:44.48 | *** join/#wowuidev haste (i=haste@hirano.ixo.no) |
| 19:44.48 | *** join/#wowuidev cog|work (n=cogwheel@WoWUIDev/WoWProgramming/morlando/cogwheel) [NETSPLIT VICTIM] |
| 19:44.49 | *** join/#wowuidev jnwhiteh (n=jnwhiteh@WoWUIDev/WoWI/Featured/Dongle/cladhaire) |
| 19:44.49 | *** mode/#wowuidev [+o jnwhiteh] by ChanServ |
| 19:44.50 | robotusch | but when she cast the first one, I was way down south |
| 19:44.55 | robotusch | and I still made it up north before she cast |
| 19:44.57 | Cloudwolf | http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SMWi7CLoZ2Q&NR=1 |
| 19:45.21 | Adys | breath is the same cast time robo |
| 19:45.54 | robotusch | hm, weird |
| 19:46.00 | Adys | it always was this long |
| 19:46.28 | Lopeppeppy | We've all gotten a LOT more experience at moving during raids since Ony was first out. :) |
| 19:46.40 | Adys | har har |
| 19:47.02 | Adys | its more that if you didnt move out of the shit you couldnt progress |
| 19:47.12 | AbsolutRayne | Lopeppeppy: HIYA :D And thanks |
| 19:47.12 | Adys | so people were forced to know what moving mean |
| 19:47.12 | Arrowmaster | wait you moved during ony? |
| 19:47.13 | Cloudwolf | global notice? |
| 19:47.13 | Adys | s |
| 19:47.18 | *** join/#wowuidev Repo (n=supybot@repos.curseforge.net) |
| 19:47.18 | Arrowmaster | i just stood there |
| 19:47.22 | Adys | Arrowmaster: deep breath |
| 19:47.29 | Arrowmaster | yeah i just stood there |
| 19:47.38 | Adys | depends what she faces |
| 19:47.43 | Adys | if she faces you, keep standing there ya |
| 19:47.43 | Adys | :p |
| 19:47.45 | Arrowmaster | she couldnt kill me |
| 19:47.55 | Adys | well now she can |
| 19:48.02 | Adys | its 6*6500dmg |
| 19:48.13 | Arrowmaster | i tanked her as a warlock at 60 and she couldnt kill me |
| 19:48.20 | Adys | well now |
| 19:48.21 | Adys | she can |
| 19:48.30 | *** join/#wowuidev nevcairiel (n=hleppkes@WoWUIDev/WoWAce/Ace3/nevcairiel) |
| 19:49.05 | Arrowmaster | they also made me tank her at 70 when there was a perfectly good warrior tank in the raid |
| 19:49.14 | MentalPower | they're actually updating the damage numbers on the old bosses... nice |
| 19:49.15 | Adys | well NOW |
| 19:49.17 | Adys | she CAN |
| 19:49.58 | *** join/#wowuidev vince` (n=vschiu@adsl-99-137-141-186.dsl.pltn13.sbcglobal.net) |
| 19:50.00 | Arrowmaster | FR still work on the deepbreath? |
| 19:50.11 | Adys | ya |
| 19:50.27 | Lopeppeppy | I sometimes had to dodge her tail, I was a rogue back then. |
| 19:50.41 | Lopeppeppy | When I went there healing, I found a wall spot and stood there. :) |
| 19:50.44 | alestane | She still do the terrifying roar thing? |
| 19:50.56 | MentalPower | deep breath, yes |
| 19:50.56 | Adys | ya alestane |
| 19:51.04 | Adys | he meant p3 MentalPower |
| 19:51.07 | Arrowmaster | i wasnt allowed to stand on the wall after a while |
| 19:51.08 | Lopeppeppy | I'd assume so, that required some movement to get back into position, another aspect of the fight. |
| 19:51.11 | Arrowmaster | she kept teleporting me |
| 19:51.24 | MentalPower | Adys: its been a while since I've seen Onyxia |
| 19:51.47 | Adys | phase 3, mass fear |
| 19:52.53 | MentalPower | ah yes, those somewhat sucked |
| 19:53.03 | *** join/#wowuidev Kandoko (n=Testing@WoWUIDev/Norganna/Developer/Kandoko) |
| 19:53.59 | alestane | I originally built my warrior around DPSing that fight...of course, by the time she was 60, my guild had fallen apart, Death Wish no longer protects against fear, and Berserker Rage is usable in any stance now, but hey, I'd love to actually get to do what I built my character for in the first place. |
| 19:56.05 | *** join/#wowuidev nichdu (n=nichdu@nerdcraft.eu) |
| 19:56.49 | Lunessa | I can't wait. Onyxia mount. Make her your bitch, then ride her like one. (is going to hell for that, I know it). |
| 19:57.04 | malreth | hey Lunessa |
| 19:57.10 | Lunessa | sup? |
| 19:57.17 | malreth | you're going to Hell |
| 19:57.35 | Lunessa | I know. Got me a condo picked out and everything. |
| 19:57.54 | malreth | brick and mortar construction? |
| 19:58.07 | Lunessa | With a nice view of the Lake of Fire. |
| 19:58.18 | Lunessa | Hot and cold running vice on tap. |
| 19:58.35 | malreth | that's important... Location is the one thing you can't change with real estate |
| 19:58.42 | Lopeppeppy | What vice would be cold? |
| 19:59.01 | Lunessa | Lopeppeppy: My vice for indulging in revenge. |
| 19:59.06 | robotusch | xD Adys |
| 19:59.13 | robotusch | You have to admit, that was bloody good timing |
| 19:59.25 | Lopeppeppy | Yummy, lunessa. |
| 20:01.30 | *** join/#wowuidev Aps|MR (n=chatzill@201.208.44.87) |
| 20:02.04 | *** join/#wowuidev NeoTron (n=neotron@pool-173-64-144-162.sttlwa.fios.verizon.net) |
| 20:03.05 | Pharaun | Weird, my test character just got randomly snared for 3 seconds |
| 20:03.23 | Lopeppeppy | Fun times. |
| 20:03.28 | Pharaun | right after my other test character got freakishly disconnected |
| 20:03.38 | Pharaun | two level ones standing side by side with nearly identical names in a pig farm |
| 20:04.00 | Pharaun | I mean the snare did fuckall considering the characters never actually move anywhere XD |
| 20:05.09 | Pharaun | If I didn't know any better, I'd say the GMs just fucked with me for shits & giggles |
| 20:06.05 | malreth | if any of you are going to be in Austin, TX this Saturday... http://www.austinicecreamfestival.com/ |
| 20:06.18 | Lopeppeppy | Oooh... malreth, you're such a tease. |
| 20:06.22 | *** join/#wowuidev Diao (i=vschiu@adsl-99-137-141-215.dsl.pltn13.sbcglobal.net) |
| 20:06.23 | Cruciformer | Hi all quick question. Is PLAYER_LOGIN sent each time you /reload? Or only the first time you log in to the server? |
| 20:07.12 | Pharaun | man that looks good :S |
| 20:07.17 | Lunessa | malreth: Sadly, I won't be in Austin this weekend. Work tomorrow, then zoooooom down I-10 to California. |
| 20:07.37 | Lopeppeppy | Zoooom UP I-10! |
| 20:07.44 | Lopeppeppy | California is not down from Texas, is it? |
| 20:07.54 | Lunessa | ... Down = West. |
| 20:07.55 | malreth | everything's down from Texas |
| 20:08.36 | Lopeppeppy | No no no. I just looked. It's up from Austin. |
| 20:08.42 | Lunessa | Because Texas is just that AWESOME |
| 20:08.57 | Lopeppeppy | Up up up. |
| 20:09.44 | Lunessa | It's almost a straight line from Houston to my final destination in California. |
| 20:09.47 | robotusch | weee |
| 20:10.02 | robotusch | Congrats Adys, we did it :3 |
| 20:10.56 | Lopeppeppy | Yeah, it's pretty solidly i-10, there. |
| 20:12.06 | Fisker | hej robotusch |
| 20:12.09 | robotusch | hej Fusker |
| 20:12.15 | Fisker | er folk online på brill overhovedet |
| 20:12.15 | robotusch | Mig og Adys skød lige drango |
| 20:12.17 | Fisker | hordesiden that is |
| 20:12.26 | robotusch | Var et par da jeg var på før |
| 20:12.39 | Fisker | nok til et raid din nub |
| 20:12.44 | robotusch | self |
| 20:12.49 | robotusch | var et par før der kun manglede tank |
| 20:13.17 | Fisker | :o |
| 20:13.33 | *** join/#wowuidev TopTop18 (n=TopTop18@ip231-37-173-82.adsl2.static.versatel.nl) |
| 20:14.06 | Cloudwolf | what are you guys saying lol i dont know your language |
| 20:14.18 | Cloudwolf | or thats the entire point :P |
| 20:14.20 | Lunessa | It's ok. Most of them don't either. |
| 20:14.26 | robotusch | blame fisker |
| 20:14.56 | Dashkal | Good advice in general |
| 20:14.59 | nicoli_s | yep |
| 20:15.05 | nicoli_s | 150% chance its his fault |
| 20:16.30 | TopTop18 | PLAYER_GUILD_UPDATE fires lots of times at login. I use the event to trigger some piece of code that's bad to run multiple times at login. I can unregister it after the piece of code has run, but I need the event later on to notice changes. Is there a better way to prevent it from triggering the code multiple times at login then to unregister it and reregister it with a event that occurs later, like joining a channel? |
| 20:17.30 | Dashkal | When you notice the event, schedule a job, say, 2s in the future. If there's a job already scheduled, just do nothing. Do your work in that job. Multiple quick firings of the event will just cascade together. |
| 20:18.03 | Adys | or wait for an event that happens after PGU and reenable it then! |
| 20:18.31 | Cruciformer | local job_done = false; local function work_you_only-want_done_once() if (job_done) then return end do_the_work() end |
| 20:18.52 | Cruciformer | the call it as many times as you like |
| 20:18.56 | Cruciformer | *then |
| 20:19.27 | Cruciformer | of course the first thing you do in do_the_work() is set job_done to true |
| 20:19.29 | Adys | Cruciformer: he needs to run it later on |
| 20:19.45 | Adys | he just doesnt want it to run many times on login |
| 20:19.57 | Cruciformer | Adys: he needs to trap PLAYER_GUILD_UPDATE later on, not the initial stuff on login |
| 20:20.02 | TopTop18 | Dashkal, can you set it to a timer? oO |
| 20:20.21 | TopTop18 | Cruciformer, the stuff it does at the beginning is the same as later on |
| 20:20.51 | TopTop18 | Adys got it right |
| 20:21.09 | *** join/#wowuidev Philemon (n=myspoons@pool-173-67-144-5.hrbgpa.fios.verizon.net) |
| 20:21.48 | Cruciformer | I understand your problem. Set a mutex (for want of a better word). Always call do_the_login_stuff() from the event handler, but the login stuff immediately returns if its been run before. |
| 20:23.20 | TopTop18 | Mutex? |
| 20:23.35 | Cruciformer | and set another one for i_am_ready_to_process_you_now ... if thats not set also bail out early inthe handler. Then after login, whenever you are ready to start listening to P_G_U again, set that to true. |
| 20:24.19 | Cruciformer | one second let me pastey I cant type what I am thinking in irc |
| 20:24.28 | TopTop18 | Okay :D |
| 20:24.32 | TopTop18 | brb |
| 20:24.53 | *** join/#wowuidev Zhinjio (n=Geo@70-91-168-59-BusName-Colorado.hfc.comcastbusiness.net) |
| 20:25.53 | Dashkal | TopTop18: A timer of some sort would work, but I've long since forgotten the actual calls to make. |
| 20:26.04 | Dashkal | Cruciformer's suggestion is quite possibly simpler |
| 20:26.23 | Fisker | robotusch |
| 20:26.27 | Fisker | du crashede mig |
| 20:28.08 | Cruciformer | http://wowuidev.pastey.net/121465 |
| 20:28.14 | Lopeppeppy | okie dokie, everypeople. TTFN! |
| 20:28.15 | Hjalte | Fisker: There's an ugly paladin standing next to me on the PTR. |
| 20:28.28 | Cruciformer | later Lopeppeppy |
| 20:28.32 | *** join/#wowuidev Philemon (n=myspoons@pool-173-67-144-5.hrbgpa.fios.verizon.net) |
| 20:28.33 | *** join/#wowuidev Aelobin_ (n=Aelobin@81.170.27.13) |
| 20:28.43 | *** part/#wowuidev Lopeppeppy (n=Lopeppep@141.222.29.18) |
| 20:29.08 | robotusch | :D |
| 20:30.23 | Cruciformer | TopTop18: get that? |
| 20:30.33 | TopTop18 | Cruciformer, that's basically what I do now. I unregister PGU when job's done and reregister it some time after login, with an other event |
| 20:30.34 | Fisker | cool Hjalte |
| 20:30.47 | Hjalte | Fisker: Unfortunately he is horde ;) |
| 20:30.51 | Cruciformer | No need to unregister and re-register |
| 20:30.59 | TopTop18 | But your idea looks much better :D |
| 20:31.08 | Cruciformer | if it gets called you have two conditions to process and you bail |
| 20:31.16 | Lunessa | I don't care ... what you do... I wouldn't want to be like you.... ! |
| 20:31.48 | TopTop18 | Ye, if I can;t find a better way I'm really going to implement your idea, Thanks! |
| 20:31.59 | Cruciformer | any time |
| 20:33.06 | TopTop18 | Note to self, next time make a plan how the code has to look so there's no need to totally revamp ti xD |
| 20:33.25 | TopTop18 | Made myself a nice diagram now :D |
| 20:33.38 | Cruciformer | revamping is good. Once the problem has already been solved in ugly code, you tend to write it much better the second time. |
| 20:34.41 | Cruciformer | I think teh CS propellerheads call it "refactoring" but thats just a fancy word for "doing shit better the second time with more experience under your belt" |
| 20:35.01 | TopTop18 | Writing a good, readable functional code at first time might be best xD |
| 20:35.58 | TopTop18 | Hmm not exactly what i did, I did stuff with a small idea and then rebuild it with a actual building plan |
| 20:36.07 | Lunessa | Sometimes, you learn more about the problem solving the first ugly way that guides you to a better solution the second time. Actually, it's more like "Usually" than "sometimes. |
| 20:36.32 | Cruciformer | Lunessa: agree fervently. Third time is even better yet. |
| 20:36.46 | Cruciformer | but there are diminishing returns. |
| 20:36.57 | Lunessa | This is why M$ often "gets it right the third time." |
| 20:37.24 | Cruciformer | in other news, I used my mod for the first time for a full, not-just-testing raid and it worked absolutely perfectly. |
| 20:37.38 | Cruciformer | my very first mod woohoo |
| 20:38.34 | TopTop18 | Gratz! |
| 20:38.44 | Cruciformer | tyvm :) |
| 20:38.53 | Fisker | slap my trout |
| 20:38.56 | Cruciformer | its a good feeling |
| 20:39.09 | Cruciformer | fisker: id rather tickle than slap |
| 20:39.15 | TopTop18 | slaps fiskers trout around a bit with a large trout |
| 20:39.30 | Fisker | slaps TopTop18 around a bit with a large trout |
| 20:39.31 | Fisker | slaps Cruciformer around a bit with a large trout |
| 20:39.36 | *** join/#wowuidev krka (n=krka@c83-250-5-183.bredband.comhem.se) |
| 20:39.43 | TopTop18 | I'm gone now bye! |
| 20:41.22 | Lunessa | ... don't tickle Fisker's fish. He'll never leave then. |
| 20:41.45 | Cruciformer | he never leaves anyway |
| 20:41.48 | *** join/#wowuidev Philemon (n=myspoons@pool-173-67-144-5.hrbgpa.fios.verizon.net) |
| 20:43.33 | Aelobin_ | does penance count as a holy or disc spell? |
| 20:44.18 | *** join/#wowuidev MentalPower (n=MPower@WoWUIDev/Norganna/Administrator/MentalPower) |
| 20:44.18 | *** mode/#wowuidev [+v MentalPower] by ChanServ |
| 20:45.43 | olafski | if I write "table1 = table2" does table1 then contain a copy of table2 or do they point to the same table? |
| 20:46.12 | Cruciformer | point to the same table |
| 20:46.16 | Adys | point to same |
| 20:46.22 | Fisker | Aelobin_ lol |
| 20:46.32 | Fisker | lol'd |
| 20:46.33 | Aelobin_ | ? |
| 20:46.42 | olafski | dang |
| 20:46.51 | olafski | is there a tablecopy function in Lua or wow-Lua perhaps? |
| 20:46.57 | Fisker | penance is holy school |
| 20:47.04 | alestane | No, but it's trivial to write. |
| 20:47.04 | Fisker | there is no discipline school |
| 20:47.06 | Cruciformer | no but its trivial to write one |
| 20:47.19 | Fisker | No, but it's trivial to write one. |
| 20:47.27 | olafski | I guess it's trivial to write one |
| 20:48.00 | Fisker | No, but it's trivial to write one. |
| 20:48.29 | Cruciformer | http://wowui.pastey.net/121471 |
| 20:48.52 | olafski | awesome, cheers :) |
| 20:49.08 | durcyn | f = { stuff goes here } g = {} for k,v in pairs(f) do g[k]=v end |
| 20:51.10 | Cruciformer | durcyn: that doesnt hanbdle the case where "stuff goes here" itself contains tables |
| 20:51.24 | ScytheBlade1 | neither handle metatables though, right? |
| 20:51.30 | ScytheBlade1 | ^^ |
| 20:51.37 | Adys | import deepcopy |
| 20:51.39 | Adys | .. oh, wait |
| 20:51.58 | Cruciformer | mine certainly doesnt handle metatables |
| 20:52.15 | ScytheBlade1 | It's a single line though |
| 20:52.57 | Cruciformer | setmetatable (dest, getmetatable (src))? |
| 20:53.14 | ScytheBlade1 | something like that, yeah |
| 20:55.38 | olafski | function copytable(src) ret = {}; for k,v in pairs(src) do ret[k]=v end return ret end |
| 20:55.41 | olafski | that should work right |
| 20:55.56 | Cruciformer | only if your tables have no tables |
| 20:56.01 | olafski | I'm not bothered with deepcopying, it's a simple hash table :) |
| 20:56.44 | *** join/#wowuidev Elusive (n=designer@unaffiliated/elusive) |
| 20:57.20 | *** join/#wowuidev JerekDain (n=JerekDai@71-82-127-149.dhcp.roch.mn.charter.com) |
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| 21:01.40 | *** join/#wowuidev NeoTron (n=neotron@pool-173-64-144-162.sttlwa.fios.verizon.net) |
| 21:03.42 | *** join/#wowuidev drfuzzykins (i=internet@seerius.biz) |
| 21:08.29 | Arrowmaster | alestane: dont you have code in the wow ui, you should know theres a table copy function |
| 21:08.49 | Cruciformer | while doing a for k,v in ipairs(sometable) it is safe to table.remove (sometable, 1) right? |
| 21:10.08 | Arrowmaster | Cruciformer: i think |
| 21:10.25 | durcyn | or just wipe() it when you're done |
| 21:10.37 | Arrowmaster | check the lua manual |
| 21:10.37 | durcyn | Cruciformer's code is a lot more thorough though |
| 21:11.26 | nicoli_s | i dont think yer supposed to remove elements from any sort of list like that as you are iterating |
| 21:11.38 | nicoli_s | at least i know yer not supposed to in high level languages, not sure how it is in lua |
| 21:11.56 | Cruciformer | nicoli_s: Somethging I read in teh lua manual indicates its safe but I cant be bothered reding it all again :) |
| 21:12.32 | foxlit | Lua does not have issues if you remove things while iterating |
| 21:13.08 | foxlit | It's only insertion that you're not allowed to do. |
| 21:13.40 | Cruciformer | foxlit: what will happen if you do insert? Will it correct the pairs/ipairs loop ort will it simply not be itterated over? |
| 21:13.41 | foxlit | (The reason being that = nil just sets the key as dead in the hash table, while inserting may cause a rehash, throwing away any semblance of order) |
| 21:13.51 | Cruciformer | s/correct/corrupt/ |
| 21:13.57 | foxlit | It'll make an effort to throw an error. |
| 21:14.10 | olafski | yssaril: added the functionality you suggested ;) |
| 21:14.33 | foxlit | Generally, the behavior is undefined -- but there is an error that you can get under some circumstances. |
| 21:15.00 | foxlit | Which makes me realize that my event dispatcher could fail horribly if someone were to register for the event currently being dispatched. |
| 21:16.15 | Cloudwolf | do orcs get a bonus to rep gain like humans do? |
| 21:17.18 | *** join/#wowuidev Tuller (n=muffins@c-68-57-187-183.hsd1.va.comcast.net) |
| 21:17.38 | Fisker | no |
| 21:19.40 | alestane | Arrowmaster: If there is, I had nothing to do with it. We created table.wipe. |
| 21:20.18 | Lunessa | Awesome - http://www.wired.com/threatlevel/2009/08/firefox-plug-in-frees-court-records-threatens-judiciary-profits |
| 21:21.44 | *** join/#wowuidev Kaso (n=Kaso@87.76.110.226) |
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| 21:31.00 | *** join/#wowuidev Aps|MR (n=chatzill@201.208.44.87) |
| 21:31.50 | Pytlask | There *is* a CopyTable function in the official code. It's a deep copy. |
| 21:32.15 | Aps|MR | Anyone familiar with event horizon config.lua_ |
| 21:32.17 | Aps|MR | ? |
| 21:32.41 | mikma | nope |
| 21:35.38 | Kaso | Aps|MR, ive looked at it, its fairly simple lua |
| 21:35.41 | Kaso | whats your problem |
| 21:35.56 | Aps|MR | ok, this lines... |
| 21:36.01 | Aps|MR | -- Border texture. |
| 21:36.02 | Aps|MR | config.border = "Interface\\Tooltips\\UI-Tooltip-Border" |
| 21:36.29 | Aps|MR | what if i dont want any border on the whole window? |
| 21:36.53 | Lunessa | http://www.wired.com/gamelife/2009/08/penny-arcade-the-card-game/ - looks like I'll be picking this up. |
| 21:36.55 | Kaso | try "" |
| 21:37.04 | Aps|MR | btw, I'm doing as suggested in wowinterface's addon page and writing my on myconfig.lua |
| 21:37.15 | Aps|MR | k, will try that |
| 21:38.22 | Aps|MR | Perfect, thanks Kaso |
| 21:39.21 | *** join/#wowuidev Movix (n=Movix@mail.schiffmann.fr) |
| 21:41.51 | Fisker | Can you determine the hp gained from last stand? |
| 21:46.04 | Fisker | can you get notepad++ to find a certain string and then discard everyone else |
| 21:46.29 | Fisker | Say i'm looking for "Ackis sucks" in a document and there's 5 places it occurs |
| 21:46.50 | Fisker | Then it deletes everything else but the lines containing "Ackis sucks" |
| 21:48.58 | Cruciformer | can do that with 1 command in unix (grep or sed -n /pattern/p) |
| 21:49.17 | *** join/#wowuidev augustl (n=augustl@s0034-0015.dsl.start.no) |
| 21:49.33 | Fisker | found out how to do it as well |
| 21:49.36 | Fisker | I can "mark all lines" |
| 21:49.41 | Fisker | and then i can copy them |
| 21:49.47 | Fisker | close enough |
| 21:58.16 | malreth | http://www.fakeplasticrock.com/2009/08/14/the-beatles-rock-band-song-list/ |
| 21:58.56 | *** join/#wowuidev Movix (n=Movix@mail.schiffmann.fr) |
| 21:59.31 | kd3 | ugh |
| 21:59.34 | kd3 | I hate getting eye exams |
| 21:59.57 | Elusive | Same. |
| 22:00.01 | Elusive | Almost failed mine for the air force. |
| 22:00.02 | kd3 | had to stay there for an hour after the exam until I could focus well enough to drive home |
| 22:01.04 | kd3 | I just failed mine today... farsighted, just barely |
| 22:01.19 | kd3 | sighs at having to get glasses at 24 |
| 22:02.52 | Lunessa | Going home. If I don't see you fine people tomorrow... I'll see you at BlizzCon. |
| 22:02.54 | Arrowmaster | kd3: you need to goto a better doctor with newer toys |
| 22:03.23 | A-KO | :D |
| 22:03.29 | A-KO | I'll be at blizzcon yay |
| 22:03.35 | A-KO | you'll see me in the nerdiest shirt ever :P |
| 22:03.45 | Arrowmaster | kd3: mine doesnt dialate my pupils anymore, but has a camera to take extremely high res images of the inside of your eye |
| 22:07.30 | Fisker | 8/13 20:50:08.720 SPELL_HEAL,0x020000000155EC35,"Lothran",0x514,0x02000000001697BD,"Rudolphus",0x514,48785,"Flash of Light",0x2,4575,4575,0,nil |
| 22:07.33 | Elusive | Hm... people complaining they got hacked via wowmatrix somehow today |
| 22:07.36 | Fisker | Does that mean the heal overhealed for 4575? |
| 22:08.33 | NeoTron | aka people stupid enough to get themselves hacked needs to find something to blame |
| 22:08.33 | NeoTron | usually that's curse profiler or something though.. :P |
| 22:08.33 | Elusive | haha, yeah. |
| 22:08.33 | Elusive | It's not them blaming it though. |
| 22:08.42 | Elusive | It's Blizzard and their reps |
| 22:09.18 | Arrowmaster | adobe needs to make it so i dont have to restart my browser to apply their damn security patches |
| 22:09.21 | Fisker | tell me! |
| 22:09.54 | Arrowmaster | Fisker: yes |
| 22:12.30 | *** join/#wowuidev Wobin (n=Wobin@124-170-216-168.dyn.iinet.net.au) |
| 22:12.35 | Fisker | lwat |
| 22:12.36 | Fisker | wat |
| 22:12.38 | Fisker | this is madness |
| 22:12.49 | Fisker | i finally found something to go from |
| 22:12.59 | Fisker | Leader of the pack restores x% hp |
| 22:13.11 | Fisker | And our maintank doubled their hp for some odd reason yesterday |
| 22:13.21 | Fisker | But it was there the whole time |
| 22:13.26 | Fisker | so that doesn't help much |
| 22:13.40 | *** join/#wowuidev Kaso (n=Kaso@87.76.110.226) |
| 22:14.25 | Arrowmaster | haha |
| 22:14.32 | Arrowmaster | omg thats fucking funny |
| 22:15.16 | Arrowmaster | i opened up IE because i decided i might as well make sure its got the most recent flash too since some things embed its renderer into them and use flash like steam |
| 22:15.37 | Fisker | ownt |
| 22:16.02 | Arrowmaster | and as the flash installer is going i see my antivirus pop up saying gcc.exe was added to the low restricted program list on its first run |
| 22:16.07 | Wobin | ~wowinterface |
| 22:16.08 | purl | [wowinterface] at http://www.wowinterface.com |
| 22:16.28 | Wobin | ah |
| 22:16.30 | Wobin | ~framexml |
| 22:16.31 | purl | Official: (Mac) http://ftp.blizzard.com/pub/WoW/other/AddOnKit.dmg, (Win) http://ftp.blizzard.com/pub/WoW/other/AddOnKit.zip. Compare: http://wowprogramming.com/utils/xmlbrowser |
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| 22:16.53 | *** mode/#wowuidev [+o Iriel] by ChanServ |
| 22:16.56 | NeoTron | Elusive: source? |
| 22:17.29 | *** join/#wowuidev Spellbinder (i=Spellbin@c-1075e455.312-21-64736c14.cust.bredbandsbolaget.se) |
| 22:18.33 | mikma | http://kuvaton.com/kuvei/pussy_and_cock.jpg |
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| 22:26.16 | *** join/#wowuidev theorb (n=theorb@91.84.53.6) |
| 22:28.32 | *** join/#wowuidev Movix (n=Movix@mail.schiffmann.fr) |
| 22:34.19 | *** join/#wowuidev Sixen (n=Sixen@173-25-22-158.client.mchsi.com) |
| 22:37.17 | Fisker | my confused face is confused |
| 22:37.22 | kd3 | +ERR_REMOVE_FROM_PVP_QUEUE_FACTION_CHANGE_NONE = "You have been removed from a PvP Queue because you changed your faction."; |
| 22:37.23 | kd3 | ? |
| 22:37.56 | Fisker | maybe they have to make sure you won't EXPLOITZZZ |
| 22:37.56 | Wobin | \o/ |
| 22:38.01 | Fisker | kd3 |
| 22:38.05 | Fisker | find out how our tank got 80k hp |
| 22:38.14 | Wobin | crazy bug? |
| 22:38.19 | Fisker | yeah |
| 22:39.07 | Wobin | where are you that it occurs? |
| 22:39.44 | Fisker | Nowhere at the moment |
| 22:39.53 | Fisker | But our tank suddenly saw he had 80k hp in ulduar |
| 22:40.03 | nicoli_s | is that more or less than normal? |
| 22:40.04 | Fisker | But according to the log he also had it in Trials of the Crusader |
| 22:40.09 | Fisker | But lost it again at some point |
| 22:40.15 | Fisker | Then got it again before we engaged Razorscale |
| 22:40.24 | Wobin | Maybe the game thought he was his mount |
| 22:40.35 | Fisker | i'm your mount ;3 |
| 22:40.46 | Wobin | Your mom's my mount |
| 22:41.00 | Fisker | only aura he gains is guardian spirit |
| 22:41.03 | nicoli_s | this is when someone is supposed to chime in with "i mounted your mother last night" in a shawn connery voice |
| 22:41.22 | Fisker | But it doesn't make sense with razorscale as we had it before we began |
| 22:41.23 | *** join/#wowuidev Movix (n=Movix@mail.schiffmann.fr) |
| 22:42.03 | Wobin | hm, I don't think there's anything in TotCrusader that offers that sort of change |
| 22:42.14 | Wobin | so it's not something that's just stuck |
| 22:43.27 | Adys | <InvalidTag http-equiv=Content-Type content="text/html; charset=utf-8"> |
| 22:43.30 | Adys | good old generators |
| 22:44.12 | Fisker | 8/13 19:37:53.690 SPELL_PERIODIC_HEAL,0x02000000001697BD,"Rudolphus",0x8000514,0x02000000001697BD,"Rudolphus",0x8000514,34299,"Improved Leader of the Pack",0x1,3480,3480,0,nil |
| 22:44.13 | Fisker | ;E |
| 22:45.48 | Industrial | http://gist.github.com/168141 |
| 22:45.51 | Industrial | need some help on an addon |
| 22:46.05 | *** join/#wowuidev Shishire (n=emperors@nmd.sbx07205.arlinma.wayport.net) |
| 22:46.39 | Industrial | it makes a frame with a texture and sets the texture according to whatever getShamanEnhancementSpell() returns, which is the priority list of DPS spells |
| 22:47.07 | Industrial | I check if the spells are on cooldown with GetSpellCooldown and hide the frame otherwise |
| 22:47.23 | Industrial | however it hides every GCD |
| 22:47.36 | Industrial | if I dont hide it it will only show the next spell at the next gcd, not before it |
| 22:47.40 | Industrial | any way to fix that? |
| 22:47.44 | foxlit | Yeah. |
| 22:47.53 | foxlit | Your cooldown logic is silly. |
| 22:47.56 | Industrial | wh |
| 22:47.57 | Industrial | y |
| 22:48.03 | foxlit | GetSpellCooldown('Stormstrike') <= 0 |
| 22:48.15 | foxlit | That is only true when you can actually cast stromstrike. |
| 22:48.24 | foxlit | (and is false when you invoke the GCD) |
| 22:48.30 | Industrial | hmm |
| 22:49.25 | Industrial | so I check if the cd is lower then 1.5sec instead? |
| 22:49.39 | foxlit | You could do that. |
| 22:49.44 | Industrial | mm no what about fast cooldowns, that wonr work for all classes |
| 22:49.59 | Industrial | I intend to make this work for as many classes as I can :) |
| 22:50.03 | foxlit | However, that'd become erratic when you're outside GCD, but the spell has <= 1.5 s left to cast. |
| 22:50.07 | *** join/#wowuidev ckknight_ (n=ckknight@69.73.16.202) |
| 22:50.13 | Wobin | !api cooldown |
| 22:50.14 | lua_bot | Found 22 possible matches for 'cooldown'. Please be more specific |
| 22:50.23 | Wobin | !api spellcooldown |
| 22:50.23 | lua_bot | GetSpellCooldown: Returns cooldown information about a spell in the spellbook (http://wowprogramming.com/docs/api/GetSpellCooldown) |
| 22:52.13 | Fisker | Are there any talents that increase the healing on leader of the pack |
| 22:52.14 | Fisker | ? |
| 22:52.17 | foxlit | In short, there's a way to make it work (and make it work reasonably), but it's just too boring. |
| 22:52.36 | foxlit | [plus there are all sorts of per-spec mods that already do this, so the novelty value is meh] |
| 22:52.44 | *** join/#wowuidev Spellbinder (i=Spellbin@c-1075e455.312-21-64736c14.cust.bredbandsbolaget.se) |
| 22:53.13 | Wobin | Fisker: Nuturing Instinct |
| 22:53.37 | Industrial | I think if a 75 line addon (so far) can do it then thats great :p |
| 22:54.00 | Fisker | thanks Wobinz0rz |
| 22:54.46 | Fisker | sense, this makes none |
| 22:54.54 | Wobin | Fisker: also, I'm pretty sure personal +healpercent talents may affect it too |
| 22:55.02 | Wobin | like Vampiric Blood for DKs |
| 22:55.26 | Fisker | does warriors have one? |
| 22:55.32 | Industrial | foxlit: what's the long explanation? :p |
| 22:55.54 | Wobin | Probably. I don't have a warrior, so I can't say off the top of my head |
| 22:56.36 | Slafsinator | no, warriors can't increase their healing taken |
| 22:56.48 | foxlit | Industrial: there's a longer method; not so much of an explanation. |
| 22:57.04 | foxlit | Another remark is that perhaps you're operating at the wrong level of abstraction. |
| 22:57.21 | foxlit | Rotations are essentially data -- and you're writing code for them. |
| 22:57.41 | Industrial | well its priority based, not rotation based |
| 22:57.58 | Industrial | so it adapts, like maelstrom weapon proccing 5 times -> lightningbolt |
| 22:58.01 | foxlit | I may well be mixing terminology, but ultimately, it's irrelevant to me. |
| 22:58.16 | foxlit | Some sort of portable "cast blah if blah, otherwise move on to the next point" data format could eliminate most of your code. |
| 22:58.21 | Industrial | I'm sure other classes need things like that too, debuffs need to be up on the target etc |
| 22:59.31 | Industrial | I don't see the code growing that much IF i get it to work right, this function is complete for enhancement shamans and I can make the survival hunter one easily too in a few lines |
| 22:59.43 | Wobin | foxlit: also, Indy has a history of writing addons just for himself =) |
| 22:59.49 | Industrial | ^^ |
| 23:00.14 | foxlit | Wobin: then he's definitely writing at the wrong level. |
| 23:00.33 | Wobin | wrong level? |
| 23:00.36 | Industrial | ^ |
| 23:00.39 | foxlit | If this is "my character only", most of the abstractions become irrelevant. |
| 23:00.58 | Wobin | eh, just because it's for his own character, doesn't mean he can't use good coding practises |
| 23:01.07 | Wobin | even if it's just -for- the practise |
| 23:01.25 | Wobin | coding for oneself is no excuse for sloppy coding |
| 23:01.27 | foxlit | Use the right tool for the job :) |
| 23:01.31 | mikma | i also write addons for myself |
| 23:01.39 | mikma | then i release them if they are good |
| 23:02.00 | Wobin | I'm more addressing the "There are already addons that do this sort of thing" point |
| 23:02.53 | Industrial | oh that wont stop me :P got my own chat, actionbat, unitframes, etc. |
| 23:03.08 | Industrial | actionbat! to the batmobile! |
| 23:03.57 | mikma | oh the rotations... |
| 23:04.04 | mikma | i really, really hate them |
| 23:05.58 | mikma | took me freaking long to get my rotation code working properly |
| 23:09.17 | Industrial | What are you calling me a murderer for, I've never killed anyone! I don't need to kill anyone, I think it. I have it in here! |
| 23:09.35 | Industrial | np: Combichrist - Joy of the world |
| 23:18.10 | *** join/#wowuidev cbreak (n=cbreak@217-162-238-189.dclient.hispeed.ch) |
| 23:24.31 | *** join/#wowuidev Tuller (n=muffins@c-68-57-187-183.hsd1.va.comcast.net) |
| 23:25.03 | Tuller | so jumpnavigationenabled = ? :P |
| 23:27.22 | mikma | tuller: penis penis penis lol |
| 23:28.04 | Tuller | huh? :P |
| 23:28.37 | mikma | jumpnavigationenabled = penis penis penis lol |
| 23:32.18 | Arrowmaster | self:GetUTF8CursorPosition() |
| 23:32.20 | Arrowmaster | holy shit |
| 23:32.21 | Elusive | epeeen. |
| 23:33.56 | Arrowmaster | strlenutf8() |
| 23:34.08 | Arrowmaster | yeah they just keep hacking away at the string lib |
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| 23:36.53 | *** join/#wowuidev Kaso (n=Kaso@87.76.56.72) |
| 23:37.13 | Elusive | I have no clue what UTF8 really is. I know I've seen what it can do, but still idk. |
| 23:39.05 | NeoTron | so they are adding utf8 functions.. wish I had some of those before |
| 23:39.12 | mikma | wtf9 |
| 23:39.31 | Arrowmaster | its a way of encoding the Unicode characterset so that it works with legacy systems that are expecting 8bit characters |
| 23:40.01 | Legorol | Arrowmaster: i think that's slightly incorrect way of putting it |
| 23:40.01 | Arrowmaster | oh it is |
| 23:40.02 | Legorol | it's a way of encoding the Unicode charset so that it can be stored as a byte-stream |
| 23:40.08 | Legorol | it has nothing to do with being legacy |
| 23:40.29 | Arrowmaster | be stored as an 8bit clean byte-stream |
| 23:50.11 | Arrowmaster | alestane: since you think you know who let these coding failures into the 3.2 patch you can try to get this one fixed before 3.2.2 |
| 23:50.15 | Arrowmaster | +OnShow = function(self) |
| 23:50.15 | Arrowmaster | +_, _, _, self.timeleft = GetWorldPVPQueueStatus(1); |
| 23:50.15 | Arrowmaster | +end, |
| 23:51.03 | Arrowmaster | and theres also an extra tab after the 'end,' that doesnt belong there |
| 23:51.46 | alestane | Where, exactly, are you looking at this? |
| 23:52.50 | Arrowmaster | FrameXML/StaticPopup.lua @@ -553,6 +553,9 @@ |
| 23:54.16 | Arrowmaster | those _'s are not local and dont let them add 'local _', that function isnt called often at all so it should just use select(4, GetWorldPVPQueueStatus(1)) |
| 23:54.16 | *** join/#wowuidev Zeksie (n=zeksie@cpc1-nott9-0-0-cust756.nott.cable.ntl.com) |
| 23:54.32 | alestane | I'll point it out. |
| 23:56.01 | *** join/#wowuidev BWMerlin (n=chatzill@58.174.148.250) |
| 23:57.53 | Elusive | Just wondering how the variables work in WOW addons, I know when they load and how they save but during that time all the variables are basically in WOW itselves, until the time comes for it to write to the SavedVariable folder? Is that a simple guess of how it works? |
| 23:58.45 | alestane | They get serialized back into Lua text that will load those values into those globals when it's run. |
| 23:59.10 | Elusive | mhm. |
