| 00:00.01 | foxlit | Bubble-hearthing paladin of my very own <3 |
| 00:00.22 | NightHawkTheSane | but, in my holy gear, with wisdom up, i usually dont run out of mana kiting zombies around so i can dispel almost indefinitely |
| 00:01.42 | Lopeppeppy | Mmm, holy gear... |
| 00:06.20 | Xinhuan | lol every npc in shattrath is a zombie now |
| 00:06.33 | seebs | Including Adal? |
| 00:06.38 | Xinhuan | except adal |
| 00:06.38 | seebs | That'd be sorta awesome. |
| 00:06.46 | seebs | They never let us have ANY fun. |
| 00:06.47 | Xinhuan | the entire lower city is zombieland |
| 00:06.51 | seebs | How about the other Naruu? |
| 00:06.57 | *** join/#wowuidev soufron_ (n=soufron@cpe-72-229-125-229.nyc.res.rr.com) |
| 00:07.01 | Xinhuan | they look healthy haha |
| 00:07.05 | seebs | Huh. |
| 00:07.15 | Xinhuan | since they do millions of damage per hit |
| 00:07.16 | NightHawkTheSane | shattrath is pretty peaceful here, actually |
| 00:07.33 | NightHawkTheSane | lower city is fairly safe, mostly people are just infecting the groups of 10-20 SSO npcs doing drilling |
| 00:07.56 | NightHawkTheSane | (at which point i holy wrath, kite them to a healer, and pat my back at a job well done) |
| 00:08.08 | Drakhaon | hmm.. what would be a good symbol for: healing, dps and tank? |
| 00:08.39 | NightHawkTheSane | peruse Interface\\Icons and pick one? there's a lot that would be good |
| 00:08.59 | End | hahahaha |
| 00:09.14 | End | the Orc commoners are letting me know that Putress needs my help |
| 00:09.16 | End | that's loltastic |
| 00:09.53 | NightHawkTheSane | Hmm. |
| 00:10.16 | NightHawkTheSane | How long have these "Reverent Paladins" and "Revenent Priests" been in shatt? |
| 00:10.22 | foxlit | http://forums.worldofwarcraft.com/thread.html?topicId=11829527371&sid=1 |
| 00:11.26 | NightHawkTheSane | foxlit: omg, that OP is so win. |
| 00:11.26 | seebs | No clue. |
| 00:11.32 | Seerah | ~seen Ackis |
| 00:11.57 | purl | ackis is currently on #waruidev (1d 13h 45m 40s) #wowace (1d 13h 45m 40s) #curseforge (1d 13h 45m 40s) #wowwiki (1d 13h 45m 40s). Has said a total of 24 messages. Is idling for 1d 10h 5m 42s, last said: 'I can't remember if it does or not the little i played with it zhinjio =/'. |
| 00:11.57 | End | ~whalelspa Ackis |
| 00:11.58 | End | arg |
| 00:11.58 | End | I've gone lisdexic! |
| 00:12.32 | seebs | The amount of hostility and vitriol on the forums astounds. I'd expect less if they replaced all mage talents with 61-point trees consisting only of Arcane Fortitude over and over. |
| 00:13.38 | foxlit | seebs: gief 61-point trees with Arcane Fortitude |
| 00:13.49 | foxlit | With any luck, that'd make mages viable mitigation tanks. |
| 00:13.54 | NightHawkTheSane | seriously, how long has this been here? http://www.asylumsw.com/misc/porta_pew.jpeg |
| 00:14.24 | Seerah | rofl |
| 00:14.34 | seebs | No clue. Never saw it before. |
| 00:14.46 | *** join/#wowuidev Thelyna (n=burp@222-152-95-114.jetstream.xtra.co.nz) |
| 00:15.00 | Xinhuan | Seerah: where's pick of the week this week ;p |
| 00:15.02 | End | hm |
| 00:15.06 | End | I can hearth while sitting down |
| 00:15.08 | Seerah | writing it right now :P |
| 00:15.08 | End | that's neat |
| 00:15.43 | NightHawkTheSane | And, also, if you click on one of the pews to sit down, quartz pops up just for a split second a cast bar that says "Wotlk Prologue" |
| 00:16.52 | seebs | Sounds likely. |
| 00:17.18 | seebs | I'm sort of expecting that the Big Event will be tonight within another couple of hours. Basically aimed at peak hours. |
| 00:17.30 | seebs | And then Stuff Will Happen Which Is Really Cool. |
| 00:17.42 | seebs | And it will be awesome enough that a ton of people will log back in to see it, and the servers will all go down. |
| 00:17.58 | End | haha |
| 00:18.01 | AnduinLothar | anyone know of a mod like this http://www.wowinterface.com/downloads/info9592-EventAlert.html but that also shows some sort of visual timer for the buff duration. liek a status bar or a timer or a cooldown graphic? I need one for Art of War mainly |
| 00:18.18 | End | "So elf, as your race's self-proclaimed name implies... Do you have blood to spare? Fresh blood is welcome blood indeed..." |
| 00:18.28 | End | <-- plays a blood elf |
| 00:18.43 | Xinhuan | Seerah: got Routes in it? :D |
| 00:19.06 | Seerah | get out of my brain! |
| 00:19.17 | Xinhuan | zombieeeeeeee |
| 00:19.19 | *** join/#wowuidev alestane (n=nevin@c-76-24-240-47.hsd1.ma.comcast.net) |
| 00:19.19 | *** mode/#WoWUIDev [+v alestane] by ChanServ |
| 00:19.30 | End | is that what brains say? |
| 00:19.42 | Xinhuan | shattrath is completely unusable now on my server lol |
| 00:19.56 | Xinhuan | ironforge is half usable |
| 00:20.13 | Xinhuan | i'm seeing zombies mindlessly attacking the training dummies in darnassus |
| 00:20.18 | Seerah | haha |
| 00:20.19 | Xinhuan | for hours on end |
| 00:20.29 | NightHawkTheSane | Xinhuan: i saw that in silvermoon. i laughed and put them out of their misery |
| 00:20.53 | Xinhuan | i've concluded that the only safe place in IF is next to the IF king |
| 00:21.32 | NightHawkTheSane | rumor has it that IF is unusable here on whisperwind. But all the horde cities are more or less safe |
| 00:21.38 | NightHawkTheSane | shatt's actually not too bad |
| 00:21.45 | kd3 | stormwind's been unusuable for a while on my server |
| 00:22.07 | Xinhuan | well no NPC is alive in lower city right now, except for a level 12 npc that seems immune to it |
| 00:22.20 | Xinhuan | its all undead hehe |
| 00:22.42 | Xinhuan | also, i'll like to point out that on my server, the entire coast of murl... umm i mean zombies |
| 00:22.46 | Xinhuan | reproduce themselves |
| 00:23.00 | NightHawkTheSane | yeah. like i said here it seems like there's a lot of people willing to keep the zombies put down |
| 00:23.05 | Xinhuan | because the lvl 1 murlocs respawn instantly |
| 00:23.15 | Xinhuan | and the zombies kill them, spread zombies |
| 00:23.22 | Xinhuan | and all the naga get infected on the isle |
| 00:23.23 | kd3 | heh. the murlocs on IQD were doing that too |
| 00:23.26 | Xinhuan | and the whole coast is unquestable |
| 00:23.45 | Xinhuan | it would have been ownage if the bombing quest worked on them ;p |
| 00:23.55 | kd3 | rofl |
| 00:24.19 | kd3 | ooh. new quest in shattrath |
| 00:24.26 | Xinhuan | kd3: i was excited |
| 00:24.32 | AnduinLothar | mmm Abominations and an apothicary in shatt |
| 00:24.42 | Xinhuan | until i turned it in, it was just a 5 gold 90 silver delivery quest with no followup :< |
| 00:24.43 | seebs | Oooh. |
| 00:24.49 | kd3 | bah |
| 00:24.50 | seebs | That sounds like an actual World Event Happening. |
| 00:24.59 | kd3 | still. one quest closer to 3k |
| 00:25.04 | seebs | Unless they were there all along? |
| 00:25.07 | NightHawkTheSane | also, holy apothecary camp batman |
| 00:25.19 | Xinhuan | well the guy gave me a "light-infused artifact" |
| 00:25.23 | Xinhuan | to bring to the tinker king |
| 00:25.32 | Xinhuan | he says WHOA at the item and that was it |
| 00:26.03 | *** join/#wowuidev smcn (i=smcn@c-24-20-232-27.hsd1.wa.comcast.net) |
| 00:26.46 | seebs | So this is new content? If so, lemme know and I can get one of my less-crazy friends to log in and give me news updates. :) |
| 00:26.59 | kd3 | apparently, yes |
| 00:27.02 | kd3 | just got added to the wiki |
| 00:27.12 | kd3 | people have been pretty good about keeping the play-by-play up to date |
| 00:27.26 | seebs | Cool. |
| 00:29.51 | AnduinLothar | mmm stormwind seems to have been overrun |
| 00:30.11 | NightHawkTheSane | i dont see any argent healers in TB >.> |
| 00:30.36 | Shirik | quick, creative people: Find me a better class name. CMutex and CMutexLock are both "Reserved class names" |
| 00:30.56 | End | CDuck, CDuckLock! |
| 00:31.00 | Shirik | ... |
| 00:31.14 | End | oh, you wanted better, not silly |
| 00:31.20 | End | well, sir, I'm afraid I cannot help you!@ |
| 00:32.46 | AnduinLothar | Mutexorz |
| 00:33.07 | Lopeppeppy | I know nothing of Visual Studio to help you with a naming convention, dear. |
| 00:33.57 | Mikk | CMut, CMutLock |
| 00:33.59 | Mikk | \o/ |
| 00:34.34 | Xinhuan | DMutex, DMutexLock |
| 00:34.44 | Mikk | <dont shoot its me jesus> ... mildly interesting guild name |
| 00:34.52 | Xinhuan | CMutex2, CMutexLock2 |
| 00:34.53 | Xinhuan | :D |
| 00:36.37 | Mikk | They're firing shit up at the same time worldwide it seems |
| 00:36.44 | Mikk | Which means it fires up in the middle of the night here >.< |
| 00:37.04 | Shirik | AnduinLothar: http://images.gammatester.com/pics/86abdcaa7e7885e7e9a2a1e704a74b00.jpg |
| 00:37.54 | End | hm, silvermoon has some level 65 non-infectible mechanical guards |
| 00:38.14 | selckin | new camps in major cities |
| 00:38.18 | selckin | they are fighting back! |
| 00:38.32 | AnduinLothar | Shirik: <3 |
| 00:39.37 | *** join/#wowuidev Thunder_Child (n=TC@cpe-76-171-31-114.socal.res.rr.com) |
| 00:40.45 | NightHawkTheSane | End: yeah, they keep silvermoon rasonably safe |
| 00:40.50 | seebs | I think it has to be the same time everywhere, or else spoilers. |
| 00:41.00 | NightHawkTheSane | selckin: i noticed all the argent healers have disappeared from capital cities >< |
| 00:41.15 | selckin | argent down is out |
| 00:41.17 | selckin | argent crusade ! |
| 00:41.39 | selckin | i don't know any lore and am just making stuff up |
| 00:41.48 | seebs | Oooh, cool. |
| 00:42.08 | seebs | Sounds like my prediction ("around 8PM server time for Central folks") is gonna win. |
| 00:42.27 | seebs | 6PM Pacific = peak West Coast hours. |
| 00:43.05 | *** join/#wowuidev Riffage (n=nnscript@78-86-205-138.zone2.bethere.co.uk) |
| 00:49.35 | *** join/#wowuidev Amarande (i=amarande@24-151-102-150.dhcp.nwtn.ct.charter.com) |
| 00:51.01 | Drakhaon | anyone that can comment the start of our guildsite? :P http://tnt.citra.se/ |
| 00:51.56 | Sixen | I'm digging the layout. |
| 00:52.06 | Lopeppeppy | What do the funny color boxes by the classes mean? |
| 00:52.17 | Drakhaon | green - we take applications |
| 00:52.26 | Lopeppeppy | And the roster could get quite large, you should probably link to it rather than try to have it on your home page. |
| 00:52.30 | Drakhaon | yellowish - you can apply but we have sort of full of them |
| 00:52.34 | Drakhaon | red - we're packed |
| 00:52.59 | Drakhaon | the roster will only list officers, and then link to armory for the complete version |
| 00:53.53 | Drakhaon | is it a good system for the applications? :P |
| 00:53.53 | Lopeppeppy | Good. Ideally your home page shouldn't be something they have to scroll down to see important information. |
| 00:54.11 | Lopeppeppy | I think the number of boxes in each line gets confusing. One color, one box. |
| 00:54.13 | Drakhaon | yea - the logo thing will prolly be smaller |
| 00:54.33 | Drakhaon | well.. warriors can be dps and tanks cant they - hence 2 boxes |
| 00:55.04 | Drakhaon | but yea - should config it a bit more |
| 00:55.09 | Drakhaon | hide the healer box etc :P |
| 00:55.48 | Drakhaon | thanks for feedback tho - now its time for sleep :D |
| 00:56.11 | *** join/#wowuidev Yssaril (n=Yssaril@adsl-99-145-232-29.dsl.emhril.sbcglobal.net) |
| 00:56.21 | *** join/#wowuidev Martin8523 (i=Miranda@86.56.37.218) |
| 00:58.01 | Amarande | yay ... Fail ISP is fail |
| 00:58.08 | Amarande | 2 multi-hour outages in 2 days |
| 00:58.18 | Amarande | so ... how's life in zombie world? |
| 00:58.27 | seebs | Big world event may be starting. |
| 00:58.32 | seebs | Putress in Shattrath with a new quest and all. |
| 00:58.58 | Xinhuan | putress? |
| 00:59.01 | seebs | I will not be shocked if they do Cool Stuff tonight and pretty much end the zombie thing. Holding on to it until tomorrow means the weekend players can't see it. |
| 00:59.10 | Lopeppeppy | I want to see it... but I'm so tired of the hole zombie crap |
| 00:59.10 | seebs | Grand Apothecary Putress. |
| 00:59.21 | *** join/#wowuidev Funkeh` (n=funk@WoWUIDev/WoWAce/Ace3/BigWigs/funkeh) |
| 01:00.08 | NightHawkTheSane | yeah, putress. hehe |
| 01:00.22 | NightHawkTheSane | this can only end well. smirk. |
| 01:00.22 | Amarande | Lopeppeppy: you too? |
| 01:00.26 | Amarande | I'm getting tired of the zombies too |
| 01:00.35 | End | I don't think they're doing everything all at once |
| 01:00.39 | Amarande | waiting for the world to get back to normal so I can at least get some power leveling in on my characters before xpack hits |
| 01:00.49 | Amarande | or at least, to 'normal' as in 'no non-consenting PvP' |
| 01:01.16 | End | I miss being able to go afk in capital cities :P |
| 01:01.34 | End | I'd live longer afk in AV :P |
| 01:01.44 | NightHawkTheSane | End: flying mount, imo ;) |
| 01:01.58 | End | only works in shattrath, unfortunately |
| 01:02.00 | seebs | The CMs said that people who can't handle PvP would be able to do Hallow's End quests "very soon", and that there'd be enough time to work on them some. |
| 01:02.01 | Amarande | yeah, yesterday afternoon I spent most of my time just hovering at max height in Shattrath |
| 01:02.29 | Amarande | seebs: any word on STV, or is it time to suggest to Jame the removal of BB quests from the leveling guides? |
| 01:02.42 | seebs | What about STV? |
| 01:02.50 | seebs | I assume it'll be back to normal shortly. |
| 01:03.02 | Amarande | seebs: except for the fact that the goblins are regularly decimated for pirate hat purposes |
| 01:03.14 | seebs | Ahh, hadn't noticed. |
| 01:03.23 | kd3 | where's the apothecary camp in shattrath? all I see is the alliance group |
| 01:03.36 | End | closer to the elevator |
| 01:03.39 | End | I think |
| 01:03.43 | Amarande | Right now, it's virtually unusable, apart from Gurubashi Arena and the Nesingwary/faction specific quests |
| 01:03.46 | End | it's between aldor elevator and aldor bank |
| 01:03.48 | End | iirc |
| 01:03.50 | NightHawkTheSane | ^^ |
| 01:03.55 | kd3 | oh, duh |
| 01:04.02 | Amarande | btw, zombies hardly ever hang out around Gurubashi Arena, so the stands seem to be a good hideout if you're trying to stay clean |
| 01:04.15 | End | lol |
| 01:04.17 | seebs | Anyway, I really hope it's tonight. Because then I could call billing tomorrow and re-up. :) |
| 01:04.31 | kd3 | holy hell, it's putress |
| 01:04.39 | End | yea |
| 01:04.44 | End | spit on him for me :) |
| 01:04.56 | NightHawkTheSane | kd3: well, really who else would it be? :) |
| 01:05.01 | kd3 | true |
| 01:05.08 | kd3 | but I'm glad we see him before the fact |
| 01:05.34 | NightHawkTheSane | yeah. it makes the whole storyline flow quite a bit smoother |
| 01:05.44 | End | when we met him on beta, it was like "who the hell is that guy"...now on live, it's..."oh, it's -that- guy" |
| 01:06.13 | Sixen | I still don't know how he is. |
| 01:06.32 | NightHawkTheSane | and the people who aren't in beta are like "who the hell is that guy", and when they meet him in wrath it'll be "oh, -that- guy" |
| 01:06.33 | NightHawkTheSane | ;) |
| 01:06.36 | End | he's a guy |
| 01:06.41 | Sixen | nowai |
| 01:06.52 | End | NightHawkTheSane: yeah, it'll flow smoothly for them :) |
| 01:06.56 | Sixen | What's he got an NPC or something? |
| 01:07.03 | kd3 | go to shattrath |
| 01:07.08 | kd3 | outside the aldor bank |
| 01:07.13 | End | he's an cunning evil bastard :) |
| 01:07.50 | seebs | *sigh* |
| 01:08.05 | End | anyway, if I had to guess, whatever Putress has in mind while come into play tomorrow |
| 01:08.15 | Sixen | Who is it though, kd3? A beta-tester? |
| 01:08.20 | End | an npc |
| 01:08.22 | Tem | hmm |
| 01:08.23 | *** join/#wowuidev soufron (n=soufron@user-387hrtl.cable.mindspring.com) |
| 01:08.24 | Tem | I am intrigued |
| 01:08.25 | Tem | http://wotlk.wowhead.com/?spell=53440 |
| 01:08.27 | seebs | If it's tomorrow, a ton of people will miss it. Strikes me as poor planning. |
| 01:08.27 | NightHawkTheSane | Sixen: it's not anyone, it's an npc. |
| 01:08.29 | Sixen | So what's the big deal? |
| 01:08.31 | Tem | http://blue.mmo-champion.com/1/11855817061-tenris-mirkblood-down-gg-blizzard.html |
| 01:08.34 | End | he has a significant role in wotlk |
| 01:08.37 | kd3 | sixen; you ever do the quests after they fixed the wrathgate? |
| 01:08.40 | End | let me repeat myself |
| 01:08.42 | End | SIGNIFICANT |
| 01:08.43 | Sixen | No, :(. |
| 01:08.43 | End | :) |
| 01:08.51 | End | remember that name |
| 01:08.53 | kd3 | go do them |
| 01:08.54 | NightHawkTheSane | Sixen: then you wont really know i guess. surprise for you :D |
| 01:08.56 | End | you'll meet him again :) |
| 01:08.57 | Sixen | heh |
| 01:09.09 | seebs | So, in Wrath, will there still be all the lowbie quests for the RAS? |
| 01:09.18 | kd3 | yes |
| 01:09.21 | End | RAS? |
| 01:09.26 | NightHawkTheSane | Royal Apothecary Society |
| 01:09.27 | kd3 | royal apothecary society |
| 01:09.29 | End | oh yes |
| 01:10.09 | Amarande | actually, are there any Azeroth quests that have been taken out, aside from the ones involving old Naxx? |
| 01:10.15 | ScytheBlade1 | New part of the event just spawned |
| 01:10.18 | seebs | I have a bit of a willing suspension of disbelief problem with the continued hand-ins of RAS quests after all this. |
| 01:10.20 | seebs | Woot! |
| 01:10.24 | ScytheBlade1 | New questgivers in the capital cities |
| 01:10.27 | End | ScytheBlade1: besides Putress? |
| 01:10.31 | kd3 | all the cap cities? |
| 01:10.34 | seebs | The more stuff they spawn now, the less of this junk I have to wait through. |
| 01:10.37 | ScytheBlade1 | All I've been to is IF |
| 01:10.38 | NightHawkTheSane | Amarande: no, they dont typically remove quests unless the npcs for them have significantly changed |
| 01:10.43 | NightHawkTheSane | ie - alliance ony c hain |
| 01:10.46 | Amarande | seebs: no more of a suspension of disbelief issue than the fact that all those Dalaran guys still hang out in Silverpine and Alterac even though Dalaran is gone from the area |
| 01:10.50 | Shirik | oh dear, 2 hours of coding and no warnings or errors to show for it |
| 01:10.54 | Shirik | This won't end well.... |
| 01:10.59 | seebs | Uhm. |
| 01:11.01 | seebs | Well, yeah. |
| 01:11.10 | kd3 | meh, they'll bring onyxia back as soon as they have the time to fix sw keep's phasing |
| 01:11.12 | seebs | I am a champion suspender of disbelief. |
| 01:11.14 | *** join/#wowuidev Shirik_ (n=Shirik@83.120.33.65.cfl.res.rr.com) |
| 01:11.34 | NightHawkTheSane | right, which brings my back to my original statement, that they generally don't remove quests ;) |
| 01:11.51 | seebs | I hope Ony comes back some day, because I've never actually gotten to do that stupid quest. |
| 01:11.54 | kd3 | sbo; where, what quests? |
| 01:12.03 | seebs | Obviously, this will take some tweeking on their side... |
| 01:12.06 | NightHawkTheSane | the philosophy is that a player moves through the story at his own pace, so asynchronous events are sort of "ignored" |
| 01:12.08 | ScytheBlade1 | "A Desperate Alliance" |
| 01:12.11 | ScytheBlade1 | + new NPCs in Shatt |
| 01:12.26 | ScytheBlade1 | I picked it up in IF |
| 01:12.40 | NightHawkTheSane | ScytheBlade1: yeah, we know, they lead to shatt, and then back to a cap city |
| 01:12.42 | NightHawkTheSane | but thats all so far |
| 01:12.50 | ScytheBlade1 | Ours just spawned :/ |
| 01:13.06 | kd3 | crap. I missed a quest then. only saw the shat->IF side |
| 01:13.09 | *** join/#wowuidev ievil (n=asys@codemonkey.isd.no) |
| 01:15.48 | kd3 | gah. weird seeing IF so empty |
| 01:15.55 | ScytheBlade1 | empty? o_0 |
| 01:16.05 | Sixen | What's going on in the PRT? |
| 01:16.07 | Sixen | PTR* |
| 01:16.17 | kd3 | nothing, though the event is running |
| 01:16.24 | Sixen | Oh, heh. |
| 01:16.25 | ScytheBlade1 | Where did the Putress spawn? |
| 01:16.32 | kd3 | outside the aldor bank |
| 01:17.37 | *** join/#wowuidev vithos_ (n=vithos@unaffiliated/vithos) |
| 01:17.38 | *** join/#wowuidev Shirik_ (n=Shirik@83.120.33.65.cfl.res.rr.com) |
| 01:18.03 | mikma | cairenn: http://kuvaton.com/bshit/catnip-toy-broke.jpg |
| 01:18.18 | Cairenn | hehehhehe |
| 01:18.19 | kd3 | rofl |
| 01:18.55 | Lopeppeppy | Buy some telnets, Shirik. |
| 01:18.56 | Amarande | Shirik: putty :P |
| 01:19.23 | *** join/#wowuidev netcurse (n=hthieblo@c-67-169-39-244.hsd1.ca.comcast.net) |
| 01:19.55 | Lopeppeppy | Even I have putty |
| 01:20.14 | ievil | putress? |
| 01:20.26 | Shirik | I forgot putty can do that |
| 01:20.27 | ScytheBlade1 | I see some people questing and talking to the Putress |
| 01:20.43 | Shirik | the real question is "did putty manage to connect or not" |
| 01:20.45 | NightHawkTheSane | ScytheBlade1: its the horde version of that quest |
| 01:20.49 | ScytheBlade1 | =[ |
| 01:21.21 | Shirik | uh |
| 01:21.25 | NightHawkTheSane | Except it's more like "here's a zombie brain we infected with our anti-plague, take it to my assistant in <some capital city>" |
| 01:21.29 | Shirik | why are you still here |
| 01:21.35 | NightHawkTheSane | and the brain -whispers- you as long as you have it in your inventory |
| 01:21.41 | seebs | Cool. |
| 01:21.45 | seebs | That sounds really fun. |
| 01:22.28 | NightHawkTheSane | http://pastey.net/99813 |
| 01:23.17 | seebs | Thanks much. |
| 01:23.35 | seebs | I really love the lore stuff, and I have been SO bummed about missing out. :( I really appreciate the updates and links. |
| 01:24.01 | NightHawkTheSane | actually, i missed two lines, the first two things it whispers you is: |
| 01:24.10 | NightHawkTheSane | "You... I've seen you in Shattrath..." |
| 01:24.19 | NightHawkTheSane | "My King knows of you. He wants to see you..." |
| 01:24.20 | seebs | Yayyyy! "Blood and souls for ..." |
| 01:24.28 | seebs | Yay for literary references in WoW. |
| 01:24.37 | NightHawkTheSane | (which makes perfect sense given certain quest lines in wrath) |
| 01:24.39 | kd3 | shattrath->gnomes quest: http://www.wowwiki.com/Quest:Ironforge |
| 01:25.29 | seebs | Man, this part of the event is SO full of awesome. |
| 01:26.37 | Xinhuan | putress lore |
| 01:26.42 | Xinhuan | its starting to all fit in now! |
| 01:27.54 | NightHawkTheSane | indeed |
| 01:30.50 | kd3 | huh... phase 5 isn't up on the PTR yet |
| 01:32.17 | End | PTR doesn't always have the right time set |
| 01:34.28 | mikma | heh |
| 01:34.59 | mikma | frozen shade told me "say goodbye to those you love, shaman..." |
| 01:38.31 | Shadowed | Anyone on beta noticing "party# is not in your party" spam while in a raid? |
| 01:38.42 | Shadowed | seems to have just started happening within a patch or two |
| 01:40.13 | End | nope |
| 01:40.25 | End | although I haven't spent a lot of time on beta |
| 01:40.25 | Shadowed | hrm |
| 01:40.34 | End | mostly just patching and taking a look |
| 01:40.52 | NightHawkTheSane | oof. lag so bad that i was zombied before the debuff even showed up |
| 01:42.53 | seebs | That's pretty much normal. :) |
| 01:43.05 | NightHawkTheSane | nah, it hasn't been quite that bad yet |
| 01:43.18 | *** join/#wowuidev deltron (i=ryan@24-171-1-182.dhcp.stls.mo.charter.com) |
| 01:43.52 | *** part/#wowuidev deltron (i=ryan@24-171-1-182.dhcp.stls.mo.charter.com) |
| 01:44.11 | seebs | It varies a lot, I think. |
| 01:44.58 | Amarande | Night: is the timer still 2 min? |
| 01:45.02 | *** join/#wowuidev Quaiche (n=PProvost@WoWUIDev/WAU/Admin/Pprovost) |
| 01:45.06 | NightHawkTheSane | no |
| 01:45.06 | NightHawkTheSane | 1m |
| 01:45.13 | Amarande | hmm |
| 01:45.23 | Amarande | how long do you think before it goes directly to zombie without the debuff phase even happening? |
| 01:45.29 | NightHawkTheSane | *shrug* |
| 01:46.30 | seebs | Dunno. |
| 01:46.32 | Shadowed | wouldn't surprise me if it went to 30s or something |
| 01:46.38 | Shadowed | or next is the razing |
| 01:46.39 | mikma | i wonder what is now supposed to happen, after i dropped the item to exodar |
| 01:46.51 | seebs | I assume that there's some interaction between the timer being down to one minute and the quest mobs for the "cure". |
| 01:47.20 | NightHawkTheSane | no |
| 01:47.40 | NightHawkTheSane | well, yes, but only in the sense that it's all part of the overall plot |
| 01:47.43 | seebs | Well, yeah. |
| 01:47.44 | NightHawkTheSane | they didn't happen at the same time. |
| 01:47.46 | seebs | That's what I meant. |
| 01:48.10 | Amarande | hmm |
| 01:48.11 | Amarande | more QQ from chat |
| 01:48.18 | Amarande | apparently, people can't do the world event quests because of the world event :| |
| 01:48.25 | seebs | Heh. |
| 01:48.30 | seebs | You see why I'm not trying. |
| 01:48.33 | Amarande | "go here" |
| 01:48.36 | Amarande | "it's full of zombies" |
| 01:48.39 | Amarande | "I can't do my quest QQ" |
| 01:48.54 | Amarande | apparently like half hte quest NPCs for the zombie quest have been killed by ... zombies |
| 01:49.07 | seebs | Yeah. |
| 01:49.24 | NightHawkTheSane | not the case here. *shrug* |
| 01:49.26 | Amarande | also, apparently hunters are totally screwed :| |
| 01:49.32 | seebs | How so? |
| 01:49.43 | Amarande | seebs: unable to obtain ammo, unless they're engineers |
| 01:49.46 | seebs | Ahh. |
| 01:50.01 | mikma | err? |
| 01:50.05 | mikma | why is that |
| 01:50.10 | NightHawkTheSane | they're just not looking hard enough then |
| 01:50.12 | *** join/#wowuidev Shirik_ (n=Shirik@83.120.33.65.cfl.res.rr.com) |
| 01:50.16 | NightHawkTheSane | there's fucking ammo vendors -everywhere- |
| 01:50.21 | mikma | aye |
| 01:50.23 | Amarande | mikma: cities/towns getting decimated so you can't buy any ammo anywhere reasonable |
| 01:50.25 | seebs | On some servers, the people selling stuff are all dead, or at least, all dead within a given city. |
| 01:50.30 | mikma | thats why i am wondering |
| 01:50.31 | Shirik | hrm... well, it didn't segfault! |
| 01:50.32 | End | it might be harder to find the exotic ammo vendors |
| 01:50.33 | seebs | There seems to be HUGE variance between servers. |
| 01:50.35 | End | er, specialty whatever |
| 01:50.37 | Shirik | I declare that a victory |
| 01:50.40 | End | but there's a lot of white ammo vendors |
| 01:50.43 | NightHawkTheSane | End: meeh |
| 01:50.44 | Shirik | (even if SIGABRT is just as bad >.> ) |
| 01:50.47 | Amarande | especially if you're a bow user, in which case except for the adamantite tipped arrows from eng, all your ammo is vendor |
| 01:51.01 | mikma | get teh legendary lol |
| 01:51.05 | Amarande | and I don't think 'get thoridal' is a reasonable option :P |
| 01:51.12 | NightHawkTheSane | there really are SO many place to buy ammo, that it's pretty much impossible for them all to be dead simultaneously |
| 01:51.21 | Amarande | you know, they should add a high end ranged weapon enchant |
| 01:51.27 | Amarande | 'enchant weapon - infinity ammo' |
| 01:52.12 | mikma | hell no |
| 01:52.12 | mikma | hunters are doing sick dps anyway |
| 01:52.12 | mikma | cant even fight the bastards in pvp |
| 01:52.12 | Shirik | ammo is the only thing that keeps hunters having to think :) |
| 01:52.12 | Amarande | mikma: actually, it would kinda lower your dps if the infinity ammo only did the damage of regularly available ammo |
| 01:52.12 | Amarande | because an enchant would use up your scope slot |
| 01:52.30 | mikma | oh i know |
| 01:52.52 | mikma | have the fookers CREATE some with mana |
| 01:52.54 | Shirik | I might be willing to accept it if the "infinite ammo" wasn't as good as regularly purchasable ammo |
| 01:53.11 | Shirik | That way they would need to purchase the ammo, but they aren't "out of luck" if they run out |
| 01:53.31 | Amarande | Shirik: maybe one for 350-375 enchanting that makes it like the best pre-BC ammo |
| 01:53.37 | Amarande | and one for 425-450 that makes it like the best BC |
| 01:53.48 | seebs | It may be hard for them to be all dead simultaneously. It's easy for you to be unable to reach one which isn't dead, especially because you're defenseless without ammo. |
| 01:54.04 | NightHawkTheSane | meh, mount and ride. |
| 01:54.13 | mikma | shirik: simple skill that uses mana to create 1 arrow |
| 01:54.26 | mikma | pew, 5mp, pew, 5mp |
| 01:54.26 | Shirik | on GCD? |
| 01:54.33 | Shirik | haha |
| 01:54.35 | NightHawkTheSane | hunters would be oom so fast |
| 01:54.37 | Shirik | brb have to create ammo |
| 01:54.45 | Shirik | lua> 200 * 1.5 |
| 01:54.46 | lua_bot | Shirik: 300 |
| 01:54.49 | Amarande | and even if you ARE an eng |
| 01:54.52 | Shirik | lua> 300 / 60 |
| 01:54.52 | lua_bot | Shirik: 5 |
| 01:54.58 | Amarande | well ... my hunter would need to be mailed mats from my warlock |
| 01:54.58 | Shirik | 5 minutes later "ok guys I have a stack of ammo now" |
| 01:55.06 | mikma | no no |
| 01:55.09 | Amarande | which means having to go to a mailbox sufficiently remote as to not be near zombies ... |
| 01:55.19 | mikma | they use the mana to *shoot* |
| 01:55.40 | mikma | everytime an arrow is shot, -5mp |
| 01:55.45 | Shirik | Devil's advocate: "But mages don't have to spend mana to shoot!" |
| 01:55.57 | Gngsk | what's the easy way to find the name of the continent you're currently in? aka, "Kalimdor", "Eastern Kingdoms", "Outland", "Northrend" |
| 01:55.57 | mikma | "uses mana to shoot a magical arrow" |
| 01:56.17 | mikma | gngsk: GetContinent? |
| 01:56.20 | Amarande | hmm, how about this ... an enchant that makes your bow/gun not use ammo BUT: |
| 01:56.23 | NightHawkTheSane | Gngsk: select(GetCurrentMapContinent(),GetMapContinents()) |
| 01:56.27 | mikma | does it even exist |
| 01:56.27 | Amarande | 1) you DO have to have something equipped in the ammo slot |
| 01:56.38 | Amarande | 2) you LOSE the quiver attack speed bonus |
| 01:56.59 | Gngsk | NightHawkTheSane, I'm talking without the map being set to the correct continent already |
| 01:56.59 | Corrodias | not worth it |
| 01:57.00 | Amarande | and of course, by virtue of being an enchant you can't use a scope |
| 01:57.11 | Corrodias | extremely not worth it |
| 01:57.21 | NightHawkTheSane | Gngsk: uh, get currenet zone and use a lookuptable |
| 01:57.25 | Corrodias | a 15% speed bonus is almost directly 15% more damage for a hunter |
| 01:57.27 | Gngsk | I can get the name of the zone using GetRealZoneText() |
| 01:57.34 | Gngsk | yah, so that's the only way? |
| 01:57.35 | Corrodias | well, for the hunter itself |
| 01:57.38 | Corrodias | not the pet |
| 01:57.59 | Amarande | yeah, maybe just my original infinity-ammo idea would be enough then |
| 01:58.02 | mikma | i still say a skill to shoot a magical arrow with mana |
| 01:58.11 | Amarande | make it equivalent to the highest ammo a regular vendor sells |
| 01:58.23 | Amarande | however - since you're not firing from a quiver, and it's not Thori'dal, you don't get a quiver speed bonus |
| 01:58.26 | mikma | that might introduce the normal fun of drinking manawater |
| 01:58.39 | Gngsk | ok, I got it |
| 01:58.48 | Corrodias | hunters would just keep using regular ammo |
| 01:59.42 | Corrodias | we griped about having to carry ammo, but we'd never trade it for the 15% (or is it 18%?) speed bonus |
| 01:59.46 | mikma | new gathering |
| 01:59.51 | mikma | "woodwork" |
| 02:00.03 | mikma | chop down trees and make arrows |
| 02:00.13 | NightHawkTheSane | Gngsk: as far as i know yeah, but *shrug* |
| 02:01.02 | seebs | You know, wood-gathering would be an awesome gathering skill. |
| 02:01.07 | Gngsk | loop on the zones inside a loop on the continents, return the index of the first loop for the continent, index of second for the zone |
| 02:01.10 | seebs | And orcs and humans would get a racial +5 to it. |
| 02:01.38 | seebs | I should make an addon which, when you trigger a gathering skill, says "More work?" |
| 02:01.49 | seebs | I bet that would NEVER get old. |
| 02:02.24 | mikma | that would rule |
| 02:03.01 | seebs | If you could cycle through the work sounds, it might be slightly less tedious. |
| 02:06.28 | *** join/#wowuidev topsub (n=josh@cpe-075-176-027-152.carolina.res.rr.com) |
| 02:06.55 | Yssaril | how do i add my frame to the list of frames that get hidden when ESC is called? |
| 02:07.14 | Yssaril | s/called/pressed |
| 02:07.16 | Gngsk | add it's name to a special table |
| 02:07.35 | Yssaril | Gngsk: which one? |
| 02:07.45 | Gngsk | i dunno off the top of my head |
| 02:08.03 | Yssaril | bah |
| 02:08.15 | Gngsk | http://www.wowwiki.com/Make_Frames_Closable_With_the_%22Esc%22_Key |
| 02:09.23 | *** join/#wowuidev kaiden (n=kaiden@c-71-231-115-214.hsd1.wa.comcast.net) |
| 02:09.41 | NightHawkTheSane | there's a wagon train of plagued vermin assaulting the terrace of light |
| 02:10.30 | mikma | umm, where is that |
| 02:10.56 | Yssaril | Gngsk: thanks |
| 02:11.00 | NightHawkTheSane | *shrug* i just saw it, but can't find it anymore. |
| 02:11.11 | NightHawkTheSane | but seriously, there were like a dozen or two rats filing up from the lower city towards adal |
| 02:11.21 | mikma | but terrace of light... cant remember where |
| 02:11.31 | NightHawkTheSane | that's the central portion of shatt |
| 02:11.36 | mikma | ah |
| 02:11.50 | mikma | funny event is funny |
| 02:12.41 | mikma | the new boss that hands a quest... infront of her was like 40 zombies forming a train when i went to see it =D |
| 02:12.47 | mikma | was quite nice |
| 02:13.06 | mikma | oh, in 2 different lines |
| 02:14.08 | Xinhuan | lol this is hilarious |
| 02:14.23 | Xinhuan | there's at least 2 retchs active at any one time all over shatt |
| 02:16.10 | NightHawkTheSane | i take it no one is actually killing the zombies? :P |
| 02:16.33 | Shirik | so has some new phase started recently? I haven't logged in in a while |
| 02:16.36 | Shirik | and this doesn't sound familiar |
| 02:17.25 | NightHawkTheSane | well, we do appear to be starting a new phase, yes |
| 02:17.56 | NightHawkTheSane | but most of what Xinhuan's talking about is just the culmination of the fact that the infection debuff is at 1m, which makes it very easy to build zombie hordes |
| 02:18.21 | Xinhuan | i've had 3 ppl try to kill me now, i'm sitting next to IF king |
| 02:18.23 | Xinhuan | they are failing ;p |
| 02:18.34 | Xinhuan | cos of the argent healer there lol |
| 02:18.44 | Xinhuan | and the king himself |
| 02:19.00 | Shirik | 1m? |
| 02:19.05 | Shirik | damn |
| 02:19.06 | *** join/#wowuidev Quaiche_ (n=PProvost@nat/microsoft/x-f1786e8da28ef22d) |
| 02:20.07 | mikma | the disease also resists like 9/10 |
| 02:20.54 | Shirik | psh |
| 02:20.58 | NightHawkTheSane | i wonder if spell pen would help that |
| 02:20.59 | Shirik | l2abolishdisease |
| 02:21.16 | Lopeppeppy | <PROTECTED> |
| 02:21.22 | mikma | shirik: 9/10 of the dispels are resist! |
| 02:21.32 | mikma | abolish wont help much =/ |
| 02:21.34 | Shirik | mikma: 5 chances on every cast! |
| 02:21.51 | mikma | shirik: takes 2-3 casts to get it off |
| 02:22.07 | mikma | took me 10 casts and a totem to do it |
| 02:22.09 | Shirik | lua> .9 ^ 10 |
| 02:22.09 | lua_bot | Shirik: 0.3486784401 |
| 02:22.24 | Shirik | There is a 34% chance that 2 casts will not get rid of it |
| 02:22.27 | Shirik | lua> .9 ^ 15 |
| 02:22.28 | lua_bot | Shirik: 0.20589113209465 |
| 02:22.28 | Xinhuan | someone should do some definitive tests on the dispel rates on that debuff |
| 02:22.36 | Shirik | There is a 20% chance that 3 casts will not get rid of it |
| 02:22.36 | Xinhuan | like cast it 1000 times |
| 02:22.40 | Shirik | and this is assuming that 90% is accurate |
| 02:22.44 | NightHawkTheSane | Xinhuan: ill do that as i'm fleeing for my life |
| 02:22.46 | mikma | xinhuan: i nominate you. |
| 02:22.54 | Xinhuan | i'm a mage, sorry :) |
| 02:23.01 | mikma | l2reroll |
| 02:24.10 | Amarande | Night: spell hit maybe? |
| 02:24.14 | Amarande | it's probably considered a L80 effect |
| 02:24.24 | Amarande | but I don't know if spell hit affects that |
| 02:24.42 | Amarande | all I know right now is that I only FP to Zangarmarsh and then I use my epic flyer the rest of the way |
| 02:24.49 | NightHawkTheSane | Amarande: no |
| 02:24.59 | NightHawkTheSane | if it was hit related it would say miss, i belieeve |
| 02:25.26 | Yssaril | is there anyway to upload beta files to wowi? |
| 02:25.51 | NightHawkTheSane | does it bring all the.. you know, im going to stop right there before i have to ~lart myself |
| 02:27.43 | Lopeppeppy | Shirik, that crap will rot your brains. |
| 02:27.51 | Shirik | why :( |
| 02:27.52 | Lopeppeppy | ~lart NightHawkTheSane |
| 02:27.52 | purl | pulls out a ClueBat (tm) and thwaps NightHawkTheSane |
| 02:27.54 | Shirik | It's just chocolate |
| 02:28.03 | Lopeppeppy | .... Shirik, I will kill you for that. |
| 02:28.21 | Shirik | chocolate is good for you I thought :/ |
| 02:29.20 | Shirik | Lopeppeppy is being mean to me today :< |
| 02:29.53 | seebs | Peppy, you CAN'T kill Shirik, you're being corpse-camped. :) |
| 02:30.05 | Shirik | oh now you're the meanie!! |
| 02:30.14 | Shirik | Don't corpse camp peppy, even if she is a gnome |
| 02:31.49 | Lopeppeppy | seebs, don't remind me. I did try to log in to see what was going on, couldn't get my friggin' paladin out of Honor Hold. I give up. |
| 02:32.03 | seebs | I understand it's supposed to be done within a day or so. |
| 02:33.01 | Amarande | I somehow managed to get my cooking daily without becoming a zombie |
| 02:34.25 | seebs | Woot. |
| 02:35.46 | Amarande | mainly because lynxes and crocolisks ... are not zombies |
| 02:35.54 | Amarande | mana berries are not zombies |
| 02:36.09 | Amarande | and somehow, the Rokk and I were not zombies, and the FMs at Swamprat and Stormspire weren't zombies either |
| 02:36.11 | NightHawkTheSane | your mom's not a zombie |
| 02:36.16 | Amarande | however, most of the rest of the stuff in Shattrath, is zombies |
| 02:36.30 | NightHawkTheSane | my sense undead is satisfyingly clear :D |
| 02:36.37 | Amarande | Night |
| 02:36.39 | Amarande | are you a zombie? |
| 02:36.42 | NightHawkTheSane | nope |
| 02:37.15 | seebs | Are you SURE mana berries aren't zombies? :) |
| 02:38.53 | Amarande | well, they might become zombies |
| 02:38.59 | Amarande | I'm sure the poor goblin will become a zombie soon enough |
| 02:39.08 | Amarande | and then the mana berry seeds will probably become zombie seeds |
| 02:39.36 | Shirik | --> local t = setmetatable({print = print}, {__index = t}); setfenv(0, t); print(foo) |
| 02:39.37 | batbot | Shirik: function: 0xb7c41588 |
| 02:39.52 | Shirik | ... what? |
| 02:40.06 | Shirik | --> foo |
| 02:40.06 | batbot | Shirik: > function: 0xb7c41588 |
| 02:40.08 | Shirik | oh |
| 02:40.19 | Shirik | --> local t = setmetatable({print = print}, {__index = t}); setfenv(0, t); print(kwlaejflwaejf) |
| 02:40.19 | batbot | Shirik: nil |
| 02:40.50 | batrick | Shirik: I haven't seen it exploited in any real way |
| 02:40.58 | Shirik | not looking for an exploit |
| 02:40.59 | batrick | and it can be fixed easy enough |
| 02:41.09 | batrick | I was answering your earlier ping |
| 02:41.13 | Shirik | Was trying to show AnduinLothar something, but .... wtf is up with setfenv |
| 02:41.16 | Shirik | it doesn't seem to work right? |
| 02:41.31 | Shirik | foo should not have existed there |
| 02:41.41 | Shirik | --> local t = setmetatable({print = print}, {__index = t}); setfenv(0, t); print(foo) |
| 02:41.41 | batbot | Shirik: function: 0xb7c41588 |
| 02:41.59 | batrick | !lua setfenv(0, {}) print(foo) |
| 02:41.59 | batbot | batrick: function: 0xb7c41588 |
| 02:42.04 | batrick | hmm |
| 02:42.18 | batrick | maybe it's because you fucked with numbers |
| 02:42.18 | Shirik | in that case, print shouldn't exist either :) |
| 02:42.21 | Shirik | rofl |
| 02:42.25 | Shirik | roofl |
| 02:42.26 | Shirik | --> return 1 |
| 02:42.26 | batbot | Shirik: > 1 |
| 02:42.29 | batrick | !lua debug.setmetatable(0, nil) |
| 02:42.29 | batbot | batrick: > :) |
| 02:42.29 | Shirik | no I think I fixed them |
| 02:42.34 | batrick | !lua setfenv(0, {}) print(foo) |
| 02:42.34 | batbot | batrick: function: 0xb7c41588 |
| 02:42.36 | Shirik | oh yeah, but I changed true/false |
| 02:42.46 | batrick | I'll go looka t it |
| 02:44.43 | Shirik | I do like :) and :( though |
| 02:44.46 | batrick | !lua return tonumber(0) |
| 02:44.46 | batbot | batrick: > 0 |
| 02:45.02 | batrick | I'm not sure why it's broken |
| 02:45.12 | Shirik | OH!!! |
| 02:45.13 | batrick | !lua debug.getinfo(setfenv).src |
| 02:45.13 | batbot | batrick: > nil |
| 02:45.15 | Shirik | Did you hook setfenv? |
| 02:45.18 | batrick | !lua debug.getinfo(setfenv).short_src |
| 02:45.19 | batbot | batrick: > ./sandbox.lua |
| 02:45.24 | batrick | no one changed it |
| 02:45.31 | Shirik | Did you remember to increment the value by 1? |
| 02:45.34 | batrick | yes |
| 02:45.38 | Shirik | oh, then I dunno |
| 02:45.48 | Amarande | batrick: blame zombies |
| 02:45.57 | batrick | !lua tonumber(print) |
| 02:45.57 | batbot | batrick: > nil |
| 02:46.06 | Shirik | o.O |
| 02:46.16 | Pneumatus | hmm, is it possible to pass by reference in Lua? |
| 02:46.31 | Shirik | several things are passed by reference |
| 02:46.41 | Shirik | tables, functions, userdata, threads |
| 02:47.02 | Shirik | well, technically everything is passed by reference, however strings and numbers are immutable |
| 02:48.03 | Shirik | what are you trying to do, Pneumatus? |
| 02:48.07 | batrick | !lua while true do end |
| 02:48.12 | batbot | batrick: @ maximum execution time/memory exceeded |
| 02:48.16 | batrick | !lua setfenv(1, {}) print"hi" |
| 02:48.16 | batbot | batrick: @ [string "setfenv(1, {}) print"hi""]:1: attempt to call global 'print' (a nil value) |
| 02:48.18 | Pneumatus | oh, didn't realise tables were passed by reference |
| 02:48.18 | Shirik | aww, batrick :( |
| 02:48.28 | batrick | it must have been a metatable thing |
| 02:48.30 | Shirik | ok so something was broke? |
| 02:48.33 | batrick | (apparently) |
| 02:48.44 | Shirik | ok back to what I was doing |
| 02:48.53 | Shirik | --> local t = setmetatable({print = print}, {__index = t}); setfenv(0, t); print(foo) |
| 02:48.53 | batbot | Shirik: nil |
| 02:48.58 | Shirik | curious |
| 02:49.00 | batrick | err |
| 02:49.10 | batrick | err wait |
| 02:49.11 | batrick | duh |
| 02:49.20 | batrick | Shirik you changed thread's environment not the running functions :P |
| 02:49.26 | batrick | so it still has access to print |
| 02:49.31 | Shirik | uh |
| 02:49.43 | Shirik | batrick |
| 02:49.47 | Shirik | I gave the environment print |
| 02:49.48 | batrick | wat |
| 02:50.05 | batrick | right? |
| 02:50.12 | Shirik | that's why it still has access to print |
| 02:50.16 | batrick | no |
| 02:50.18 | Shirik | {print = print} |
| 02:50.25 | Shirik | --> foo = 1; local t = setmetatable({print = print}, {__index = t}); setfenv(0, t); print(foo) |
| 02:50.25 | batbot | Shirik: 1 |
| 02:50.27 | Shirik | hrm |
| 02:50.32 | Shirik | --> foo = 1; local t = setmetatable({print = print}, {__index = t}); setfenv(1, t); print(foo) |
| 02:50.32 | batbot | Shirik: nil |
| 02:50.36 | batrick | You changed the threa'ds environment, not the running function |
| 02:50.37 | Shirik | that seems odd to me |
| 02:50.41 | Shirik | anyway! |
| 02:50.48 | Shirik | irrelevant. I expected it to error |
| 02:51.47 | batrick | expected to error how? |
| 02:52.01 | Shirik | never mind |
| 02:52.02 | Shirik | sigh |
| 02:52.11 | batrick | infinite loop indexing? |
| 02:52.28 | Shirik | --> foo = setmetatable({}, {__index = foo}); print(foo.bar) |
| 02:52.28 | batbot | Shirik: @ [string "foo = setmetatable({}, {__index = foo}); pr..."]:1: attempt to index a number value |
| 02:52.29 | batrick | you need a cycle at least 3 deep I think |
| 02:52.41 | Shirik | oh oh oh I know why |
| 02:52.47 | Shirik | the table constructor ran first |
| 02:53.11 | Shirik | --> foo = 1; local t = {print=print}; setmetatable(t, {__index = t}); setfenv(1, t); print(foo) |
| 02:53.11 | batbot | Shirik: @ [string "foo = 1; local t = {print=print}; setmetata..."]:1: loop in gettable |
| 02:53.13 | Shirik | Yay |
| 02:53.17 | Shirik | AnduinLothar: ^ |
| 02:59.44 | Lopeppeppy | Did you unbreak yourself, Shirik? |
| 03:00.01 | Shirik | I feel a little better at least |
| 03:00.10 | Lopeppeppy | Good! |
| 03:00.46 | batrick | im sick of being tricked... RELINQUISH YOUR SINISTER SQUASHLINGS INNKEEPER HEATHENS |
| 03:01.10 | Lopeppeppy | I got a toothpick on one character, whee. |
| 03:01.25 | Shirik | I blame the rice |
| 03:01.37 | Shirik | or maybe it's that chinese lady that came over to deliver it |
| 03:01.40 | Shirik | I'm sorry that was wrong |
| 03:01.51 | batrick | i actually had the sinister squashling on my main early in the season from HH. I started selling them for 1k gold in my little group shortly after |
| 03:01.54 | batrick | we made tons of gold |
| 03:02.15 | Tekkub | it's only wrong if you're implying that if she wasn't chinese it wouldn't have happened |
| 03:02.16 | *** join/#wowuidev Matrix110 (i=Matrix11@pD957E3F2.dip.t-dialin.net) |
| 03:04.33 | Xinhuan | ok apaprently that delivery quest in Shatt is race dependant |
| 03:04.39 | Xinhuan | humans deliver it to stormwind |
| 03:04.39 | NightHawkTheSane | yes |
| 03:04.44 | NightHawkTheSane | it sends you to your home city |
| 03:04.51 | kd3 | xin; http://www.wowwiki.com/Quest:A_Desperate_Alliance |
| 03:04.52 | End | yeah |
| 03:04.54 | Lopeppeppy | Makes sense. |
| 03:05.06 | Shirik | delivery quest? |
| 03:05.19 | End | I'm kinda curious what will happen though |
| 03:05.24 | Xinhuan | yah, near putress |
| 03:05.29 | NightHawkTheSane | there's a capital city -> shatt -> home city quest chain now |
| 03:05.30 | End | I mean, it can't too overtly screw you over |
| 03:05.56 | Amarande | End: here's what actually happens |
| 03:06.08 | Amarande | you go to a capital city (unless it's exodar or silvermoon), and it's full of zombies |
| 03:06.13 | Amarande | you go to shattrath, and it's DEFINITELY full of zombies |
| 03:06.24 | Amarande | then you try to get to your home city (unless it's Ex or SMC) and there's zombies there, too |
| 03:06.25 | End | that's currently :P |
| 03:06.29 | Amarande | usually implying that the NPCs you need are zombies, also |
| 03:06.30 | Tekkub | good ol peaceful exodar |
| 03:06.34 | NightHawkTheSane | all the horde cities are reasonably clean |
| 03:06.37 | kd3 | meh, I got zombied as soon as I ported into exo |
| 03:06.39 | NightHawkTheSane | on whisperwind at least |
| 03:06.48 | End | ogrimmar alternates between kinda messy and not messy |
| 03:06.55 | Amarande | if I need to do city business on Quel'dorei, I go to Silvermoon |
| 03:06.58 | NightHawkTheSane | hell, even shatt's more reasonably intact. |
| 03:07.00 | End | thunderbluff alternates between really messy and not messy at all |
| 03:07.04 | Tekkub | we had one zombie bomb in exodar today, but it went away quickly |
| 03:07.11 | Amarande | I don't trust UC or Oggy, don't know much about TB's status of late |
| 03:07.13 | End | undercity isn't messy at all usually, and neither is silvermoon |
| 03:07.34 | NightHawkTheSane | I think the abom guards in UC are immune to the disease, and the golem guards in silvermoon are, which helps |
| 03:07.35 | End | well, all the guards in UC don't pick up the disease |
| 03:07.36 | Amarande | actually Shatt seems to be improving tonight |
| 03:07.42 | Shirik | Lopeppeppy, are you on a PvP server? |
| 03:07.45 | End | yea, what NightHawkTheSane said |
| 03:08.03 | Shirik | I'm curious: Does the zombiness rely on pvp flags? |
| 03:08.04 | Amarande | however, you still need to avoid the inner ring area around a'dal's whatever you call it, building heh |
| 03:08.14 | Amarande | Shirik: no |
| 03:08.14 | NightHawkTheSane | Shirik: what do you mean? (generally no, though) |
| 03:08.22 | Amarande | Shirik: you can infect anyone, regardless of pvp flag |
| 03:08.27 | Shirik | i.e., can you, as a zombie, only attack pvp flagged players |
| 03:08.28 | Amarande | you can even infect and be infected by your own faction |
| 03:08.31 | Lopeppeppy | Shirik, no. RP server, for the love of sanity |
| 03:08.32 | NightHawkTheSane | Amarande: heh, that's actually one of the safest spots in shatt on my server |
| 03:08.43 | Lopeppeppy | And what Amarande said. |
| 03:09.01 | Amarande | Night: I find the only spot I ever rely on in Shatt to be safe is 'on a flying mount, above the height of the top of A'dal's spire' |
| 03:09.09 | Lopeppeppy | :P |
| 03:09.18 | Amarande | after all, you can only puke *downwards* |
| 03:09.25 | Lopeppeppy | I'm going to bed, guys. See you tomorrow, when hopefull the zombie wars will be over. |
| 03:09.30 | End | cya Lopeppeppy |
| 03:09.38 | Shirik | byes |
| 03:09.47 | *** part/#wowuidev Lopeppeppy (n=Lopeppep@cpe-67-246-45-198.nycap.res.rr.com) |
| 03:10.08 | Amarande | hmm |
| 03:10.17 | Amarande | trying to remember now, does zombie disease communicate during BGs? |
| 03:10.42 | NightHawkTheSane | there's a fairly large contingent of players killing zombies in shatt on my server, it helps a ton |
| 03:11.12 | Amarande | ah, did they hotfix it so the shatt sanctuary status no longer affects zombies? |
| 03:11.19 | NightHawkTheSane | nope |
| 03:11.29 | NightHawkTheSane | player zombies are still running loose, but npc zombies usually dont last very long |
| 03:12.03 | Amarande | and I've also heard this is nowhere near as bad for lowbies as BC's launch |
| 03:12.13 | Amarande | apparently at BC's launch, they had this thing called Kruul |
| 03:12.21 | NightHawkTheSane | kruul was awesome |
| 03:12.23 | Amarande | which every few servers were even able to defeat at all |
| 03:12.35 | seebs | I think this is way worse in many ways. |
| 03:12.37 | Amarande | and pretty much totally made it impossible for lowbies to get in or out of orgrimmar, according to folks in chat |
| 03:12.41 | seebs | Kruul didn't camp newbies. |
| 03:12.55 | seebs | True, hard to get to one specific place, but everything ELSE was available. |
| 03:12.55 | Amarande | seebs: didn't he camp city entrances so you couldn't get in or out of the city? |
| 03:13.10 | Xinhuan | you could still fly and in out of cities ;p |
| 03:13.12 | Tekkub | I find people uproar more amusing than the event itself |
| 03:13.21 | seebs | Flight points. Run to XR, get your "how to fly" quest. |
| 03:13.31 | Amarande | I still need to email Jame about a major change to the 30-50 or so phase of his guides |
| 03:13.49 | Amarande | even with the zombies going away, with the pirate achievement it might be a REALLY good idea to be rid of BB quests from those guides |
| 03:13.58 | Xinhuan | trade chat on my server has been going on and on about the zombie event now |
| 03:14.05 | Xinhuan | pro/con/arguments |
| 03:14.41 | Amarande | yeah, people complain far too much about being able to or not able to get places when high level enemies are present |
| 03:14.42 | seebs | I think the pirate achievement thing will wear off "soon". |
| 03:14.49 | Amarande | seebs: soon(TM)? |
| 03:15.00 | Amarande | seebs: also, Betelgeuse is supposed to explode in a supernova "soon" |
| 03:15.06 | seebs | Eh, next month or so. People will still do it occasionally, but there won't be a huge competition to get at it. |
| 03:15.15 | Amarande | so is Rigel, apparently. good luck recognizing Orion in a few thousand years :) |
| 03:15.29 | seebs | Million, probably. |
| 03:15.41 | seebs | And yes, I'm afraid I probably won't be able to recognize Orion a million years from now. |
| 03:15.45 | Amarande | seebs: the -entire lifespan- of stars like Rigel and Betelgeuse is a few million years |
| 03:15.47 | seebs | qq, etc., my fault for rolling a mortal species. |
| 03:15.54 | Amarande | the fact that they're supergiants means that most of that time is already over :) |
| 03:15.55 | seebs | That short? Wow. |
| 03:16.06 | seebs | <-- not very clear on astronomy |
| 03:16.15 | Amarande | yeah, stellar mass and lifespan are -inversely- related, even though this seems odd to the uninitiated |
| 03:16.23 | seebs | Oh, that makes sense, actually. |
| 03:16.25 | Amarande | you'd think, more mass, more nuclear fuel, more lifespan |
| 03:16.28 | Amarande | but nope :) |
| 03:16.42 | seebs | I just hope that I know tomorrow during the day whether the PvP thing is over. |
| 03:16.52 | seebs | I'm gonna need to do a TON of redialing to get in to billing after that. |
| 03:16.55 | Amarande | heh, I work 3-9:30 tomorrow evening anyway |
| 03:17.04 | Amarande | seebs: un-canceling? |
| 03:17.28 | seebs | The moment I know when the PvP's over, I want to uncancel as of as soon after that as I can. |
| 03:17.31 | Amarande | I'm not considering the idea of canceling till ... February, at the earliest |
| 03:17.48 | Amarande | seebs: can't you just let it cancel, then reactivate via the website? :) |
| 03:17.58 | seebs | I qq'd at billing and they gave me time credit. |
| 03:18.08 | seebs | So even though I'm early in a 6-month cycle, they agreed to give me an extension for this. |
| 03:18.17 | seebs | Clinical diagnosis ftw. |
| 03:18.22 | Amarande | seebs: when you cancel, you still have till your currently credited/paid time is up before your account actually becomes unusable |
| 03:18.42 | seebs | Right. And I didn't cancel. I qq'd at them about unplayable time and they offered to give me an extension, but I have to call them before I log in again. |
| 03:18.54 | Amarande | Ah. |
| 03:18.56 | seebs | Or else I don't actually get the extension. |
| 03:19.19 | seebs | Which is "until November 5", but unless they're much crazier than I think they are, the PvP part will be done by Tuesday or so and then I want to see the rest so I can pursue the lore. |
| 03:19.25 | Amarande | If WOTLK is really epic epic fail, I might cancel, but then I'd still be playing till sometime in Feb |
| 03:19.35 | Amarande | since I'm on the 3-month plan and my next billing's in Nov |
| 03:19.50 | Amarande | although I'm not sure what game I'd migrate to *if* I left WoW |
| 03:19.53 | seebs | Honestly... If WotLK is absolute junk... I'll probably just hang out in lowbie stuff with friends, farm TBC content at >70, and so on. |
| 03:20.07 | Amarande | Let's see, I'm not too keen on EQ, don't know anything about EQ2 |
| 03:20.13 | Amarande | FFXI is practically impossible to get into at this point ... |
| 03:20.15 | seebs | I wouldn't mind getting my toons into the ~75 range or higher farming shadowmoon. |
| 03:20.31 | Amarande | WAR, maybe, though being that it's a PvP based game I'm not sure why I'd bother to pay for that when I could play GW to get my PvP fix |
| 03:20.35 | seebs | And the fact is, I've never played most classes past about 20, so there's a TON of stuff that's still interesting to me. |
| 03:20.48 | Amarande | maybe ... hell, I might do this even if WotLK is awesome |
| 03:20.55 | Amarande | maybe I might go to the new Star Wars MMO coming out from Bioware |
| 03:21.17 | Antiarc | http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ubQKbE5fNUs |
| 03:21.18 | Antiarc | <_< |
| 03:21.23 | Shirik | Hahahaha |
| 03:21.26 | Shirik | family guy is awesome |
| 03:21.44 | seebs | I agree that Bioware tempts me. |
| 03:21.49 | ScytheBlade1 | Antiarc: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oHg5SJYRHA0 |
| 03:22.02 | Antiarc | Thanks, haven't had that happen in a couple of weeks |
| 03:22.03 | seebs | I used to trade email with Ray Muzyka about Baldur's Gate wayyyyy back when. |
| 03:22.08 | Shirik | Oh squiggly line in my eye fluid. I see you lurking there on the peripheral of my vision. |
| 03:22.08 | ScytheBlade1 | np |
| 03:22.09 | Shirik | But when I try to look at you, you scurry away. |
| 03:22.09 | Shirik | Are you shy, squiggly line? |
| 03:22.12 | Amarande | I wonder if the MMO genre as a whole is on its way out. |
| 03:22.14 | Shirik | ^ awesome |
| 03:22.19 | Amarande | Maybe even gaming itself. |
| 03:22.21 | seebs | Nah. |
| 03:22.27 | seebs | I think gaming is booming. |
| 03:22.42 | Amarande | Yeah, I'm more worried about the fan moddable RPG scene |
| 03:22.49 | seebs | I mean, come on. WoW could totally collapse by 80% and still be larger than anyone thought an MMO could ever be. |
| 03:22.50 | Amarande | and whether that one's essentially a dead scene walking |
| 03:23.09 | Amarande | are NWN2 and Oblivion to be the last games allowing for epic fan modules? |
| 03:23.16 | seebs | I think there's some short-term issues for gaming, but as the newbies Nintendo is bringing in go out exploring, I think there'll be a ton of stuff. |
| 03:23.42 | ScytheBlade1 | Antiarc: that's pretty |
| 03:23.46 | Amarande | will world weavers need to go back to writing normal novels in a couple years? |
| 03:24.08 | Shadowed | ScytheBlade1: Horribly late, but Proximo doesn't actually handle spec watching either :p |
| 03:24.13 | Shadowed | thats another library |
| 03:24.24 | ScytheBlade1 | Shadowed: meh, it's the only addon I know of that shows it :P |
| 03:24.44 | Shadowed | It uses TalentGuess-1.0 |
| 03:24.50 | seebs | I'd guess that the market for RPGs will be booming in a while. |
| 03:25.06 | Shirik | oh my |
| 03:25.12 | seebs | They've always been a niche market of gaming, so they've been capped by gaming industry itself. |
| 03:25.18 | Shirik | trade chat has evolved into a bunch of people acting like they know things about computers |
| 03:25.22 | seebs | ... |
| 03:25.26 | seebs | Oh, that's always a treat. |
| 03:25.33 | Amarande | seebs: maybe one-shot single-story RPGs, like have always been the case |
| 03:25.38 | Shirik | My personal favorite so far: [2. Trade] It crashes a helluva lot, but Vista actually only needs 16MB of memory |
| 03:25.41 | seebs | ... |
| 03:25.45 | Amarande | I'm worried of the future of RPGs that have toolsets like the NWN and Elder Scrolls series |
| 03:26.03 | seebs | I've had people on chat tell me all sorts of things about computers. |
| 03:26.12 | seebs | I love it when they try to show off how much they know about C. :) |
| 03:26.21 | Amarande | Ones that allow people to actually design their own stuff within them, so you don't have to choose between being relegated to normal old style novels, or having to somehow get a job in the industry |
| 03:26.43 | Amarande | and even if you do get a job in the industry, visionaries tend to get butchered (Saga and Takahashi, anyone?) |
| 03:26.48 | seebs | I think those have potential. There's some real interest in player-made content again. |
| 03:27.10 | seebs | The problem is that the HD-focused crowd have been pushing everything towards insane budgets and production values, making things like NWN less practical. |
| 03:27.23 | Amarande | Yeah, how did everything get so graphics-oriented anyway? |
| 03:27.25 | seebs | If only there were millions upon millions of new users coming in who were more interested in gameplay... |
| 03:27.34 | Amarande | To the point that it's better to release a bad game with awesome graphics than a good game with mediocre graphics |
| 03:27.39 | NightHawkTheSane | It's driven by the hardware manufacturers, really |
| 03:27.40 | seebs | I think it mostly comes out of the vicious Sega/Nintendo infighting in the 16-bit era. |
| 03:27.56 | Amarande | It seems to take a flop on the scale of Daikatana to make a bad game with decent enough graphics exposed |
| 03:27.58 | NightHawkTheSane | no one would buy their cards if the games didn't require them. |
| 03:28.13 | Amarande | Night: do they actually get more money from NVIDIA/ATI than they do from actual sales? |
| 03:28.41 | seebs | Look at Sony/MS. They've been pushing "our hardware is better" for so long... Maybe not working so great this year, though. |
| 03:28.51 | Amarande | after all, requiring the top end cards means by definition that your sales drop, a lot, because a lot of people won't have the machine for your game |
| 03:28.58 | NightHawkTheSane | *shrug* |
| 03:29.02 | Amarande | they must be making more on these endorsements than they do on the actual game |
| 03:29.10 | Tekkub | I think the argent healer at the center of shatt is some sort of new raid boss |
| 03:29.19 | Tekkub | people on my server are ganging up on him |
| 03:29.19 | NightHawkTheSane | I don't know the financial details |
| 03:29.25 | NightHawkTheSane | but it's a fairly obvious situation |
| 03:29.42 | NightHawkTheSane | hardware manufacturers keep pushing the limit forward. If games did not keep pace, no one would buy the cards |
| 03:29.50 | Amarande | Wonder how long before they get endorsed strongly enough by one or the other video card company that they start making the games so slanted towards that kind of card that they become semi-incompatible with the other card |
| 03:30.00 | Amarande | that's actually kinda happened in the past |
| 03:30.16 | ScytheBlade1 | Antiarc: re: your link - how'd you pull that off? Addon tricks? |
| 03:30.17 | Amarande | around 2000 or so, there were games that needed Glide, and either epicfailed or semifailed with D3D cards |
| 03:30.21 | Amarande | Ultima IX comes to mind |
| 03:30.28 | Antiarc | ScytheBlade1: Yeah, I'm writting a minimap addon |
| 03:30.33 | selckin | you have directx and opengl |
| 03:30.34 | selckin | cards implement that |
| 03:30.35 | Antiarc | With an eye towards sexifying it |
| 03:30.38 | selckin | so cant happen |
| 03:30.40 | ScytheBlade1 | That's a disturbingly pretty minimap |
| 03:30.50 | Antiarc | Speaking as someone who has done game development |
| 03:30.55 | Antiarc | You still have to program hacks for specific cards |
| 03:30.57 | Amarande | UIX was so focused programmatically on Glide that it took a MONSTER (for the time anyway) of a PC to perform decently with a non-Voodoo card |
| 03:31.15 | Antiarc | Supporting DX or OpenGL gets you most of the way there |
| 03:31.31 | Antiarc | But you still have to do a lot of work to get it to work smoothly across all your target cards |
| 03:31.35 | selckin | standard needs fixing then |
| 03:31.41 | Antiarc | Easy to say |
| 03:31.42 | Amarande | I think with a P3-733 with a GeForce II, I was getting a framerate comparable to a Pentium MMX with a Voodoo 2 or 3 |
| 03:31.42 | Antiarc | Hard to do |
| 03:31.49 | Amarande | that's how slanted it was |
| 03:31.51 | selckin | easy todo |
| 03:31.53 | selckin | they just refuse |
| 03:32.02 | Antiarc | Well, you must be the expert then :P |
| 03:32.14 | selckin | its not in their best interest |
| 03:32.34 | selckin | its why you can't have compatible softare for your cellphone too |
| 03:32.34 | Antiarc | I think you're being a little paranoid about it |
| 03:32.35 | Amarande | Antiarc: can you comment on how much profit comes from the endorsements vs. actual game sales? |
| 03:32.38 | Antiarc | It is in their best interest |
| 03:32.48 | Antiarc | Amarande: I have no idea; all my work has been amateur |
| 03:33.22 | Amarande | And yeah, I'm wondering how used the toolset in, say, an NWN3 or Elder Scrolls V actually will be |
| 03:33.25 | Antiarc | I'd like to do pro dev some day, but I'm not there yet :) |
| 03:33.35 | Amarande | by that point, graphics will be such that you'll need actual 3D modeling skills |
| 03:33.53 | Amarande | plus, if you're not a student or working for the right industry, you'll be paying a $2,000 entry fee at the least |
| 03:34.10 | Amarande | although if I actually had any talent at graphics, I'd probably gladly save the $2k for Maya |
| 03:34.41 | Amarande | (Not Max, as it is not possible for me to buy Max, no matter how much money I saved.) |
| 03:34.45 | NightHawkTheSane | If i have a frame that inherits from some random not-normally-a-template frame, what comes with that inheretence? |
| 03:34.50 | Antiarc | UT2K3 packaged a lite version of Maya with it |
| 03:35.08 | Antiarc | You can probably get an equivalent version for free |
| 03:35.13 | Amarande | Antiarc: the game company has to specifically license with Autodesk to allow that version of Maya to be used with a given game |
| 03:35.21 | Antiarc | Oh, that's right |
| 03:35.21 | Amarande | no one has done that since UT2K3 as far as I know |
| 03:35.35 | Amarande | all the other game devs stupidly went with GMax, which has since been EOL'd |
| 03:35.58 | Antiarc | Epic also has stupid amounts of cash compared to most studios, though |
| 03:36.03 | Antiarc | GMax is a lot more economical |
| 03:36.07 | *** join/#wowuidev Quaiche (n=PProvost@WoWUIDev/WAU/Admin/Pprovost) |
| 03:36.18 | Amarande | not sure if it would still be now, though, if it still existed |
| 03:36.20 | Amarande | seeing as they're both Autodesk now :) |
| 03:36.24 | Antiarc | well, yeah |
| 03:36.31 | Antiarc | I should rephrase: Was more economical. :) |
| 03:36.40 | Amarande | I'm surprised the price of the lower-end version of Maya hasn't been raised to not compete so much with Max |
| 03:36.52 | Amarande | I'm really not sure what the reason to buy 3DS MAX would even be right now |
| 03:37.00 | Amarande | either you're a low end dev with money to burn and you buy the low end maya for $2000 |
| 03:37.07 | Amarande | or you need tons of features and you buy the high end maya for $7000 |
| 03:37.44 | Amarande | I know for me, it would be literally impossible for me to buy 3DS MAX even if I had tens of thousands available LOL |
| 03:38.05 | Amarande | (it's naturally never seen in stores, and none of my payment methods allow me to spend that much in one go :P) |
| 03:39.10 | Amarande | the question arises though as to why you don't really see other devs spring up who don't take the money from nvidia/ati to do uber graphics |
| 03:39.27 | Amarande | unless nVidia/ATI are paying 'farm subsidy' style money too |
| 03:40.10 | Amarande | by which I mean, paying devs who might make an awesome enough game that doesn't need the newest video cards NOT to develop that game |
| 03:40.42 | Amarande | the gaming industry is destroying gaming :P |
| 03:41.05 | *** join/#wowuidev Shirik_ (n=Shirik@83.120.33.65.cfl.res.rr.com) |
| 03:41.08 | Amarande | wb |
| 03:41.15 | Amarande | Shirik, do you think the gaming industry is destroying gaming? |
| 03:41.31 | selckin | http://xkcd.com/484/ |
| 03:41.41 | Shirik | That's an interesting question |
| 03:41.55 | Shirik | Can you clarify it? Because my initial response would be that this is impossible |
| 03:42.07 | End | plink plunk! |
| 03:42.13 | Shirik | Since the community defines what gaming is supposed to be |
| 03:42.15 | Amarande | Shirik: the collusion between nVidia/ATI and game devs to ensure continued sales of new video cards |
| 03:42.26 | Shirik | oh sorry I read it wrong |
| 03:42.36 | Amarande | which results in ever increasing ramp-up of the graphics quality needed to make a 'successful game' |
| 03:42.41 | Shirik | No actually I would think it advances it |
| 03:42.50 | Amarande | to the point that only the largest Hollywood-studio style gaming companies can make a game |
| 03:42.56 | Shirik | I'm one that loves visual effects, etc. |
| 03:43.13 | Amarande | which as a result makes games more and more blah and mainstream because they have to stick to what sells to the average slack-jawed yokel |
| 03:43.13 | selckin | i counter that with |
| 03:43.14 | Shirik | The old-style less graphically-intensive games still exist all over the place |
| 03:43.16 | Antiarc | I don't even know that you could call it collusion |
| 03:43.16 | selckin | http://xkcd.com/484/ |
| 03:43.23 | Shirik | Touhou project is a very prominent example of that |
| 03:43.25 | Antiarc | And selckin hits the nail on the head |
| 03:43.27 | Shirik | It's just not as widespread |
| 03:43.31 | NightHawkTheSane | Personally, I prefer solid gameplay and/or story (if appropriate) over visual effects, but visual effects are a real nice layer on top if you have that already |
| 03:43.35 | Antiarc | Popcap games makes shitloads of money |
| 03:43.43 | Antiarc | And their stuff will run on 10-year old hardware |
| 03:43.48 | NightHawkTheSane | ^^ |
| 03:44.09 | Amarande | The problem is, if you're not a huge graphic talent and aren't advanced enough in the industry to get a job designing your dream game |
| 03:44.18 | Amarande | how do you actually *implement* your solid gameplay and/or story? |
| 03:44.34 | Amarande | NWN2's and Oblivion's lifespans grow short |
| 03:44.50 | Amarande | especially with Windows 7 on the horizon, and NWN2 apparently already having issues with Vista for many people |
| 03:44.51 | Antiarc | Games are not one-man gigs, and haven't been for years |
| 03:44.51 | Shirik | Again, Touhou project is a very good example of a great game that is very, very popular |
| 03:45.00 | Antiarc | With the exception of flash games |
| 03:45.02 | Shirik | and requires almost no hardware |
| 03:45.10 | Antiarc | If you want to make a game you need a team with a bunch of different skills |
| 03:45.27 | Antiarc | It's a very specialized industry just due to the nature of the requirements |
| 03:45.28 | NightHawkTheSane | Antiarc: eh, it depends on the game. |
| 03:45.43 | NightHawkTheSane | i mean, if you want to put out the next halo or warcraft, then yeah, you need to be more than a guy in a garage. |
| 03:45.43 | Antiarc | NightHawkTheSane: The sorts of games that Amarande is talking about, I don't think you could dispute it |
| 03:45.47 | Antiarc | On the other hand, there's nethack |
| 03:45.58 | Antiarc | An obscenely popular game that is entirely text. |
| 03:46.14 | selckin | my entire school played those browser based 'mmorpg's |
| 03:46.14 | NightHawkTheSane | yeah, i mean, 'mainstream brick & mortar' games are not one man affairs. |
| 03:46.16 | selckin | and most payed for it |
| 03:46.18 | NightHawkTheSane | but there are a LOT of good games that are. |
| 03:46.22 | NightHawkTheSane | (or, reasonably close to it) |
| 03:46.26 | Antiarc | agreed |
| 03:46.28 | Antiarc | I mean |
| 03:46.30 | Amarande | well, I'm not even that interested in the money, as much in seeing people actually play it. :) |
| 03:46.31 | Antiarc | Desktop Defense |
| 03:46.38 | Antiarc | One guy wrote it in a weekend |
| 03:46.43 | Amarande | which means ... free internet distribution is fine to me :) |
| 03:46.45 | Antiarc | And he pulls in $100k+/month off of it now |
| 03:47.02 | Amarande | that's the reason I'm worried to use the NWN's or Oblivion |
| 03:47.11 | Amarande | (well, and Oblivion needing significant 3D talent just to design decent terrain) |
| 03:47.22 | Shirik | Pop quiz: what are the chances Shirik_ segfaults when I try to connect to him? |
| 03:47.32 | selckin | can just get semi stock graphics really |
| 03:48.10 | Antiarc | You don't need fancy graphics to tell a good story |
| 03:48.33 | Amarande | yeah, I could always get a decent enough arrangement of basic textures from the Freedoom project that seems to have gone almost dead lately |
| 03:49.09 | Amarande | Antiarc: Yeah, Unlimited Adventures is still popular even now |
| 03:49.21 | Antiarc | What I hear you saying is "gaming is moving too fast for single guys to make compelling games" and I just don't think that's true |
| 03:49.29 | Amarande | although it's kinda limited in a technical sense, and it's hard to get more than a smallish community to play |
| 03:49.35 | Antiarc | It's moving too fast for single guys to make MMOs or FarCry killers |
| 03:49.39 | Amarande | since UA games require UA to play |
| 03:49.44 | Antiarc | But those aren't single-man projects |
| 03:49.49 | NightHawkTheSane | Shirik: ... 80%? |
| 03:49.54 | selckin | you can't start a 20 truck, trucking company either |
| 03:49.54 | Shirik | you cheated! |
| 03:49.57 | Shirik | It already crashed |
| 03:49.58 | selckin | doesn't mean trucking is dead |
| 03:50.01 | Amarande | and UA is rather ... *difficult* to acquire |
| 03:50.09 | Shirik | And for the record, it wasn't a segfault, it was an uncaught exception |
| 03:50.13 | Amarande | meh, that's one thing I hate about old games |
| 03:50.20 | Amarande | it's practically impossible to get them without being a pirate :| |
| 03:50.21 | Antiarc | Specialization of an industry means a higher barrier to entry in that industry, but it also means better products |
| 03:50.24 | NightHawkTheSane | your mom's an uncaught exception |
| 03:50.25 | Antiarc | That's true in any industry |
| 03:50.36 | Amarande | Antiarc: in arts industries like gaming, not necessarily |
| 03:50.40 | Antiarc | Amarande: http://www.the-underdogs.info/ |
| 03:50.51 | Amarande | what appeals to the average slack-jawed yokel consumer is not necessarily anything resembling 'good' |
| 03:51.01 | Amarande | that would be like saying the jonas brothers are one of the best bands ever |
| 03:51.09 | Antiarc | When did we start talking about slack-jawed yokels? |
| 03:51.27 | Antiarc | Are you trying to make a compelling game, or make a shiny pretty collection of models and textures that dazzle people into buying it? |
| 03:51.28 | Amarande | Antiarc: success in an industry is measured in sales numbers |
| 03:51.29 | *** join/#wowuidev Seerah (n=Ryan_L@adsl-242-180-218.mem.bellsouth.net) |
| 03:51.29 | *** mode/#WoWUIDev [+o Seerah] by ChanServ |
| 03:51.33 | Shirik | "Error 0x00002745: An established connection was aborted by the software in your host machine." |
| 03:51.35 | Shirik | wtf does that mean :/ |
| 03:51.37 | Antiarc | Amarande: Desktop Tower Defense. |
| 03:51.43 | Amarande | which is why I disagreed with your 'better' notion |
| 03:51.50 | Antiarc | One dude, limited programming experience, one weekend of work, and he's retiring off of the income |
| 03:52.04 | Amarande | because there are plenty of creative arts to teach us that that which sells is not necessarily that which is good :) |
| 03:52.12 | Amarande | hell, almost every creative endeavor |
| 03:52.23 | Amarande | people don't buy Cuervo because it's good tequila, they buy it because it's cheap and well-marketed tequila :P |
| 03:52.37 | Antiarc | I'm just at a loss as to what your argument is. |
| 03:53.10 | Amarande | I was saying that specialization of an industry means a higher barrier to entry in that industry which is primarily measured by ability to generate sales numbers, rather than actual product quality |
| 03:53.10 | Antiarc | Guys in garages don't mass-produce automobiles, but the auto industry hasn't killed itself |
| 03:53.24 | Amarande | three other words also: "MADE IN CHINA" |
| 03:54.07 | Amarande | and the typical consumer they're trying to generate sales numbers off of is not the discriminating connoisseur |
| 03:54.17 | Antiarc | What I hear you saying is "I can't make a game that looks like Crysis and sells like WoW in my basement, so the industry is killing itself" |
| 03:54.20 | Amarande | but the typical easily-marketed to, easily wowed by flashy sensory stimulation yokel. |
| 03:55.35 | Amarande | Antiarc: more like "I can't make a game mod that will be downloaded now and won't be forgotten in a year due to the host engine becoming incompatible with the evolution of Windows, so the industry is killing epic story design" |
| 03:55.36 | *** join/#wowuidev Shirik (n=nospam@conspiracy/developer/Shirik) |
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| 03:56.10 | Antiarc | That's a bit of a logical leap. |
| 03:56.22 | Antiarc | Windows 7 not supporting Oblivion doesn't mean the death of the gaming industry. |
| 03:56.31 | Amarande | Yeah, it still remains to be seen if Elder Scrolls V will have the construction set. |
| 03:56.36 | Amarande | Also, I'm not even at all sure about Oblivion |
| 03:56.42 | Amarande | I know NWN2 will probably die with Windows 7 |
| 03:57.00 | Antiarc | It takes a number of years for people to upgrade their OS, as well |
| 03:57.01 | Amarande | and probably the NWN series with it |
| 03:57.12 | Antiarc | I'm still on XP, as are many, many people |
| 03:57.13 | Amarande | it already has enough issues with Vista that I expect that the second NWN2 expansion's sales will tank |
| 03:58.10 | Amarande | I can't go back to XP myself. |
| 03:58.18 | Amarande | I don't care to find out if my floppy drive still works so I can install to SATA |
| 03:58.40 | Amarande | Even if it does, I have to do the repartitioning tango. |
| 03:59.18 | Amarande | (original XP disc + hard drive larger than 137GB) |
| 03:59.22 | Corrodias | what's currently irritating me is Vista's continued lack of the ability to specify refresh rates |
| 03:59.29 | Antiarc | I tri-boot OS X, XP, and Ubuntu, so I'm probably not going to be too sympathetic :P |
| 03:59.32 | Amarande | Corrodias: doesn't really bug me much |
| 03:59.40 | Corrodias | i don't care |
| 03:59.44 | Amarande | probably because I have an LCD monitor, which only really supports one significant refresh rate |
| 03:59.49 | Corrodias | and i don't |
| 04:00.11 | Amarande | Corrodias: you're still on a huge energy guzzling box? |
| 04:00.23 | Corrodias | microsoft and nvidia, much like you, apparently consider it "lol not their problem" |
| 04:00.40 | Amarande | it's probably because CRT's are more or less EOL'd at this point |
| 04:00.49 | Amarande | does anyone even still manufacture CRT's on a mass consumer basis? |
| 04:00.55 | Corrodias | if you're willing to send me the $1200 i need for the LCD monitor i have my eye on, i'll upgrade and drop the subject |
| 04:01.08 | Corrodias | otherwise, you can take your elitism to the bank and cash it, because i can't |
| 04:02.26 | Amarande | Corrodias: I'd blame the ... FCC I think it is? for that one |
| 04:02.39 | *** join/#wowuidev Mike-N-Go (n=MikeNGoS@michaelg20.goshen.edu) |
| 04:02.43 | Amarande | also, the copy protection zealots at the MPAA |
| 04:02.59 | Mike-N-Go | What is .. called? |
| 04:03.06 | Amarande | the combination of them basically killed the CRT screen, and led to the apathy of MS and nVidia about supporting them |
| 04:03.07 | Mike-N-Go | I forget how it is spelled. |
| 04:03.11 | NightHawkTheSane | concatenation |
| 04:03.19 | Mike-N-Go | Thank you. |
| 04:04.19 | Amarande | Corrodias: after all, on the TV front, there's absolutely no reason to manufacture anything but flat panels, because with the whole HDCP and digital TV thing, there's no point to making anything but screens that can actually take advantage of hi-def resolutions |
| 04:04.24 | Amarande | which means flat panels |
| 04:04.32 | Antiarc | Who wants to buy CRTs anyhow? |
| 04:04.38 | Amarande | which means that there's much less industrial point to keeping CRT plants open |
| 04:04.42 | Mike-N-Go | ~crt |
| 04:04.43 | purl | hmm... crt is (Cathode Ray Tube) This is one of the main components of monitors and TVs. A beam of electrons is shot towards the CRT and as they collide with phosphors on the inside surface, they produce light. Today, other technologies are performing better than the heavy and bulky tube monitors. LCD panels and projection units are both in contention, but they still can't come close to the low cost of a CRT monitor or TV. |
| 04:04.51 | Shirik | You know, holding a remote by the sides at a 90 degree angle is very difficult |
| 04:04.58 | Mike-N-Go | CRT.. sounds painful. |
| 04:05.14 | Shirik | Antiarc: CRTs actually do still have a few useful characteristics |
| 04:05.23 | Shirik | the most notable of which is that it does not require a polarizing lens |
| 04:05.31 | Shirik | s/lens/filter/ |
| 04:05.32 | Antiarc | Sure, but the markets don't want them, for the most part |
| 04:05.36 | Shirik | true |
| 04:05.39 | Antiarc | People like their sexy flat screens |
| 04:05.57 | Antiarc | It's not the MPAA killing CRTs, it's the consumers wanting that extra foot of desk space back |
| 04:06.08 | Shirik | you can't blame them |
| 04:06.12 | Amarande | Antiarc: I don't know of any CRT's that support HDCP |
| 04:06.26 | Antiarc | CRTs are analog, so they can't support it, AFAIK |
| 04:06.31 | Amarande | or even DVI or HDMI for that matter, and you have to have one of those to support HDCP |
| 04:06.37 | Antiarc | Correct |
| 04:06.39 | Amarande | if you don't support HDCP, then you are the enemy to the MPAA |
| 04:06.40 | Antiarc | Because they're analog :P |
| 04:06.45 | Antiarc | That's beside the point. |
| 04:06.52 | Amarande | analog still falls under 'piracy facilitating protocol' to them |
| 04:06.54 | Antiarc | Whether or not HDCP existed, the market would want flat panels over CRTs |
| 04:07.05 | Amarande | that reminds me |
| 04:07.09 | seebs | Lack of HDCP would make flat panels more popular. :) |
| 04:07.12 | Amarande | time to look at the flat panel deals on ebay this week |
| 04:07.15 | Antiarc | People want DVD players over VCRs, even though VCRs don't have copy protection, and DVD players do. |
| 04:07.24 | Antiarc | Because DVDs are just more attractive products. |
| 04:07.26 | Amarande | Antiarc: VCR's have copy protection |
| 04:07.29 | Antiarc | Uh. |
| 04:07.31 | Arrowmaster | macrovision |
| 04:07.31 | Amarande | it's called macrovision |
| 04:07.41 | Antiarc | Haha, I forgot about that. |
| 04:07.45 | Amarande | and unless you still have a 20th century VCR, by law, your VCR has to have it |
| 04:07.49 | Antiarc | Point being, DVDs are more restrictive |
| 04:08.00 | Antiarc | Pff, who has bought a VCR in the last 10 years? :P |
| 04:08.05 | NightHawkTheSane | ^^ |
| 04:08.11 | NightHawkTheSane | until my mom sold it, i still had one back at home |
| 04:08.12 | Amarande | well actually, VCR's don't have Macrovision per se, but they're legally required to have digital auto tracking |
| 04:08.15 | Amarande | This is not for your benefit. |
| 04:08.16 | Corrodias | by the way, if you search for info on refresh rate overriding in vista, you'll see there are plenty of people using CRT's for gaming |
| 04:08.21 | NightHawkTheSane | it was so ancient, though |
| 04:08.26 | Amarande | This is because DAT is required to support Macrovision's functionality :P |
| 04:08.51 | Amarande | and yes, it's BS like that that makes me increasingly a libertarian supporter |
| 04:09.04 | NightHawkTheSane | oh yeah, cause -That- follows |
| 04:09.13 | Amarande | for now, I'll just have to vote McCain because Democrats are generally much more regulation-happy than Republicans, when it comes to anything that has a major impact on the business world :| |
| 04:10.15 | Amarande | Night: libertarians believe in getting back to basics on regulation, rather than having a Byzantine array of rules that requires you to hire a team of lawyers before doing anything more significant than adding two and two together on an industrial basis |
| 04:10.19 | Amarande | actually, wait |
| 04:10.28 | Amarande | no, you still have to hire a team of lawyers these days to add two and two together |
| 04:10.39 | Amarande | since you have to make sure your twos aren't patented or otherwise regulated against being used together |
| 04:11.32 | Amarande | Night: all the laws a society *really* needs could probably be squeezed into a book the size of your typical manual that comes with a game :) |
| 04:11.49 | Antiarc | That's a pretty bold statement. |
| 04:12.07 | Amarande | Antiarc: There are those who believe that the Ten Commandments are sufficient law for a society to go by. |
| 04:12.11 | seebs | Depends on the structure of the laws. |
| 04:12.32 | seebs | Eww. Please, no. The ten commandments are neither necessary, nor sufficient, nor suitable, for a working society. |
| 04:13.00 | *** join/#wowuidev amnith (i=robert@217-14-8-187-dhcp-osl.bbse.no) |
| 04:13.00 | seebs | At least one or two of them cannot be made to work for a functional and healthy society, several are unenforceable, and they omit rules you would need to keep a society functional. |
| 04:13.17 | Amarande | seebs: the point is, that a small but increasing number of people believe that there only a very small number of basic, able to be succinctly expressed tenets that are truly necessary as the core of society |
| 04:13.36 | Amarande | at the VERY least, anyway, it's clear that at least 95% of current law is cruft |
| 04:13.45 | seebs | That could be. I have never seen any attempt to create a working society through law succeed. Of course, the alternatives don't work either. :) |
| 04:14.02 | seebs | I do agree that in many cases, laws exist only to make up for mistakes in other laws. |
| 04:15.27 | Amarande | In any case, copy protection that will be all but mandatory in the coming years is more than enough reason for the CRT monitor to go the way of the dodo |
| 04:16.04 | Antiarc | Copy protection is a silly idea, and the industry will eventually realize it |
| 04:16.05 | seebs | I'm not sure copy protection will win. I think anti-DRM business models are winning. |
| 04:16.34 | seebs | They make more money faster selling more products with less overhead. That's pretty much pure win. |
| 04:16.37 | Legorol | The problem with laws is that if you keep them to a minimum, they have to be general in scope. In which case people will come up with many ways to push its boundaries. |
| 04:16.58 | Legorol | Existing legal systems are large and complex because they define those boundaries very precisely at many different points. |
| 04:17.23 | ccox | Antiarc - only after users beat industry over the head with the facts |
| 04:17.23 | Legorol | Think of it like an area you want to fence in. You could do that with a polygon with just a few vertices, but that's crude. |
| 04:17.26 | Amarande | Yeah, that's one reason I detest DRM |
| 04:17.34 | Antiarc | ccox: Yup. But it'll eventually happen. |
| 04:17.42 | Aiiane | the question is, which takes more time; sorting out the boundary pushers, or sorting out the boundaries for those who aren't trying to push them |
| 04:17.43 | Legorol | You have to keep increasing the number of vertices to sufficiently mark the boundary. |
| 04:17.43 | Amarande | Eventually, we're going to get to the point where system performance becomes like, say, ret pally mana :) |
| 04:17.52 | ccox | Antiarc - developers and customers know it fails, but executive draw all the wrong conclusions from their profits |
| 04:18.02 | Antiarc | Preaching to the choir :P |
| 04:18.25 | Legorol | Aiiane: good point, you then need a system to continuously deal with boundary pushers. |
| 04:18.31 | Legorol | Hence the judiciary. |
| 04:18.38 | Legorol | But then you get onto the next problem: consistency. |
| 04:18.40 | Amarande | Eventually, system performance gains in speed terms will be more than eaten up by mandated security measures to make sure ... hmm, whoever it is now and their MPAA buddies will be happy. |
| 04:18.47 | Legorol | and finaly you arrive at precedence, and hence laws. |
| 04:18.47 | NightHawkTheSane | ccox: It's not just profits that they draw the worng conclusions from, t hough. It's that they see totally bogus statistics about piracy, and think they need to do something abou tit |
| 04:18.51 | Legorol | We are back to square 1 |
| 04:18.52 | Amarande | I was going to say Jack Valenti but he died last year |
| 04:19.11 | ccox | NightHawkTheSane: the statistics they see may be right, but again, they get the wrong conclusions |
| 04:19.16 | Amarande | I wonder if Valenti was one of those sort who ended up so hated that his funeral was attended only by his most immediate family members :| |
| 04:19.26 | seebs | I reported a post on General Discussion. I wrote "Crybabies is a term offensive to my people. We prefer to be called People of the QQ." |
| 04:19.39 | NightHawkTheSane | ccox: well.. i don't mean correct/incorrect statistics, i just mean they really don't say the things that they think, or are told. |
| 04:19.40 | ccox | NightHawkTheSane: ie: X million people in china pirate a product, so obviously you need better DRM in china |
| 04:19.54 | ccox | NightHawkTheSane: exactly, write data, wrong conclusion |
| 04:19.58 | Legorol | I don't know about bogus statistics, but in my immediate vicinity, every young person of my generation that i have ever come into contact with has downloaded music illegally at one point or another. At least the computer literate ones who use the internet. |
| 04:20.26 | Antiarc | That was primarily due to a distribution failure by the labels, though |
| 04:20.41 | Antiarc | Anecdotally, iTunes' debut cut music piracy among those I know severely |
| 04:20.51 | Aiiane | If you don't mind inconsistency, it takes away a lot of the problematic issues ;) |
| 04:20.52 | ccox | Legorol - and the music industry wants to stop that, instead of thinking about *why* they pirated it, and if they would ever *buy* it |
| 04:20.54 | Antiarc | Because hey, I could get the music I wanted distributed over the channel I wanted |
| 04:21.07 | NightHawkTheSane | Antiarc: and for a reasonable price to boot |
| 04:21.11 | ccox | Legorol: I know in college, pirated software was sort of "try before you buy" |
| 04:21.12 | Legorol | ccox: indeed |
| 04:21.13 | NightHawkTheSane | (well, more reasonable) |
| 04:21.16 | Antiarc | NightHawkTheSane: Right |
| 04:21.19 | seebs | I finally found a source for the one piece of pirated music I had. |
| 04:21.22 | ccox | Legorol: because nobody could @#%@#$ afford it |
| 04:21.30 | Corrodias | i'm going to try messing with my display drivers' .inf file and specify the refresh rate for the resolution i'm aiming for |
| 04:21.31 | NightHawkTheSane | i still think itunes is on the high end of appropriate price |
| 04:21.33 | Corrodias | wish me luck~ |
| 04:21.36 | Hirsute | I love trying to explain to my brother-in-law that I'm not being a jerk by not helping him download that music, I'm just not wanting to put myself in the *AA's sights. |
| 04:21.38 | NightHawkTheSane | but thats not apple's fault |
| 04:21.40 | seebs | Everything else anyone's waved at me, I've either not gotten it or gotten it legitimately, eventually. |
| 04:21.42 | Legorol | Most of those people do indeed feel that if the service and price was adequate, they'd pay, but felt that CD prices are too high |
| 04:21.43 | seebs | Corrodias, good luck! |
| 04:21.57 | ccox | seebs - that's another factor: can't buy it legally, might as well pirate it |
| 04:21.59 | Corrodias | thanks |
| 04:22.05 | Amarande | Yeah, I still hate to buy a CD unless it's on the discount 6.99-11.99 rack at work |
| 04:22.09 | ccox | (such as a few albums I want that were never released on CD) |
| 04:22.45 | Amarande | or unless it's something really special |
| 04:22.45 | Legorol | i think that if you look at what you are really payig for at itunes and similar, it's these two convenience factors: |
| 04:22.47 | ccox | Legorol: now, there are some that would never pay, or would never see the price as appropriate |
| 04:22.53 | Amarande | like I paid $15 each for an Emerald Rose and a Michelle Belanger CD at Dragon Con |
| 04:22.54 | Legorol | - being able to search from a relatively complete collection |
| 04:22.57 | Legorol | - not have to leave your home |
| 04:23.15 | Legorol | you aren't really paying for the music imo, since that same music is also available from illegal downloads |
| 04:23.19 | Amarande | however, I have actually MET Emerald Rose and Michelle Belanger, the band and the woman are both total win and awesome and actually *deserve* that extra support. :) |
| 04:23.25 | ccox | Legorol: for instance, those who use professional applications for personal, amateur use would probably not find the professional price reasonable (think video software, or 3D) |
| 04:23.44 | NightHawkTheSane | ccox: thats really -any- software |
| 04:23.55 | Legorol | software is tricky |
| 04:24.03 | Amarande | yeah, not having to leave one's home is a biggie these days |
| 04:24.04 | ccox | NightHawkTheSane: most people find it hard to argue with $20 software |
| 04:24.05 | NightHawkTheSane | almost all professional level applications are -vastly- overpriced for a non-enterprise consumer |
| 04:24.07 | Amarande | people don't want to pay for gas |
| 04:24.15 | Amarande | Night: indeed |
| 04:24.26 | ccox | NightHawkTheSane: but when you start talking about hundreds or thousands of dollars, the perception changes |
| 04:24.31 | Amarande | in fact, I've actually heard they also do that to deliberately keep OUT the non-enterprise consumers |
| 04:24.32 | Legorol | indeed they find it overpriced, but that price isn't that unjustified |
| 04:24.34 | Amarande | for two specific reasons |
| 04:24.40 | seebs | There's a ton of software that I would love to use, but I can't justify it at $800 a pop. |
| 04:24.44 | Legorol | sometimes a lot of professional and specialised knowledge goes into making that piece of software |
| 04:24.47 | ccox | NightHawkTheSane: even if the professional users make that money back in a day, the amateurs don't see that |
| 04:24.58 | Amarande | 1) in order that they only sell to people who are presumably competent enough already in that sort of software that they won't have to spend tons of money on complex tech support for the newbies |
| 04:25.20 | Amarande | 2) because the enterprise customers feel more secure with that barrier to entry that the cost of buying the necessary software produces to people breaking into that sector |
| 04:25.26 | ccox | NightHawkTheSane: join a company that produces such software and look at the market research - most of them are pretty fairly priced *for their target market* |
| 04:25.53 | NightHawkTheSane | ccox: all that means is that everyone aligns their price to the price of their competitors :p |
| 04:25.56 | Amarande | It's always occurred to me that if, say, Photoshop or Maya was reduced to $200 |
| 04:26.03 | ccox | But, some people want the professional package even if they have no idea how to use it - then complain about the high price |
| 04:26.11 | Amarande | they'd sell a HELL of a lot more copies, and probably have a hugely decrased piracy rate |
| 04:26.18 | ccox | Amarande: I'd bet against that |
| 04:26.25 | seebs | It's hard to say. |
| 04:26.28 | ccox | Amarande: and both companies would make less money |
| 04:26.39 | Aiiane | $200 would still be too high to discourage most piracy from individuals |
| 04:26.42 | Amarande | ccox: how? especially with, say, photoshop |
| 04:26.44 | Legorol | I think there's an important factor to consider, and that's growing generations: |
| 04:26.50 | ccox | Amarande: again, these companies do huge marketing studies to check the prices |
| 04:26.52 | seebs | I don't think Quark would sell enough more copies at $200 to make up the difference compared to $800... And they'd lose a fortune on support. |
| 04:26.53 | Amarande | I'm sure that reducing it from 800-1000 to 200, you'd sell more than four or five times as many copies |
| 04:26.57 | Legorol | the first couple of strongly computer literate generations are growing up |
| 04:26.57 | seebs | Hmm. |
| 04:27.08 | seebs | ccox, I think you're missing a key point. Market research necessarily evaluates the existing market. |
| 04:27.10 | Aiiane | The thing is, a good portion of adobe's market is businesses |
| 04:27.12 | ccox | Amarande: how many more copies would be sold to make up for the lower price |
| 04:27.17 | seebs | Read Christensen's work on "disruptive innovation". |
| 04:27.18 | Legorol | when they were small/young and were taking interest in computers, they couldn't afford to buy software |
| 04:27.21 | Aiiane | and those pay the higher price |
| 04:27.27 | Amarande | Okay, say you reduced Maya to $59.99, then. |
| 04:27.28 | ccox | seebs - no, research is all about potential market, not current market |
| 04:27.33 | seebs | In many cases, companies with an established market price themselves out of a prospective emerging market until someone new comes along. |
| 04:27.41 | Amarande | Every amateur game modder and their brother would be buying a copy |
| 04:27.46 | seebs | It's about reasonable guesses of prospective markets. |
| 04:27.48 | Legorol | i think the mentaility towards IP, piracy etc. will change as some more generations mature |
| 04:27.52 | Amarande | and I'm sure there are FAR more such people than there are major graphics companies |
| 04:27.54 | Legorol | in a favourable way too |
| 04:27.57 | seebs | Look at the failure rate in disk drive companies when entirely new applications come into existence. |
| 04:27.59 | Aiiane | Amarande: yes, but Maya's retail price is ~$3000 currently, so you'd need to sell 50x as many copies |
| 04:28.02 | ccox | aiiane - most of the Photoshop and maya market is professionals, but not necessarily corporations |
| 04:28.21 | seebs | The companies that sold drives for minicomputers *totally* missed the possibility for desktops, because they had no idea how to even inquire about the possibility of such a market occurring. |
| 04:28.26 | Aiiane | ccox: yes, but many of the legit professionals pay the higher price sa well |
| 04:28.26 | Antiarc | I'm pretty sure Autodesk has figured out the price points that maximize their profits. |
| 04:28.31 | Antiarc | They don't pick those price points to lose money. |
| 04:28.32 | Legorol | offtopic: where can i catch a boat to theramore nowadays? |
| 04:28.35 | Amarande | Aiiane: with the size of the game modding community versus the size of the enterprise 3D community, you'd probably sell that many |
| 04:28.35 | Legorol | is it in SW harbour now? |
| 04:28.44 | ccox | Aiiane: and most Photoshop or Maya professional users could afford to pay MORE based on what they make off of using the software |
| 04:28.48 | seebs | I think that's still Menethil. |
| 04:29.02 | seebs | Or, wait... Hmm. |
| 04:29.03 | Legorol | ok |
| 04:29.03 | Aiiane | Amarande: I think you'd be wrong. |
| 04:29.15 | seebs | Yeah, Auberdine now goes to Stormwind, so Theramore's still Menathil, I think. |
| 04:29.36 | Amarande | seebs: what's that |
| 04:29.41 | Legorol | Here is another factor to consider: the lack of low-end alternative productcs. |
| 04:29.44 | seebs | What's what? |
| 04:29.47 | Legorol | Consider people trying to dabble in music |
| 04:29.51 | ccox | Legorol: yes |
| 04:29.51 | Amarande | I can start a low level alliance and now actually HAVE the convenience of getting between all my capitals in one piece like Horde does? |
| 04:29.54 | Legorol | if you are a pro, you get very expensive gear |
| 04:29.56 | seebs | I think so. |
| 04:30.05 | Antiarc | For the amateur, there are still products like Blender |
| 04:30.07 | seebs | Yeah, look at Logic Pro vs. Logic Express. Apple's on top of that one. |
| 04:30.08 | Legorol | if you just want to dabble in music, or try to learn or something, you get something dirt cheap first to learn on |
| 04:30.09 | Antiarc | Which is pretty freakin' pro |
| 04:30.10 | Amarande | Used to be you COULD NOT get between Menethil and SW/IF area without at least 1-2 deaths |
| 04:30.17 | ccox | Legorol: the market might be different if there were real competitors to Photoshop and Maya |
| 04:30.18 | seebs | Sure you could. |
| 04:30.20 | seebs | I did it repeatedly. |
| 04:30.32 | seebs | When I did it on Sentinels, I met THREE groups of people during the swim from Menethil to Westfall. |
| 04:30.33 | Aiiane | blender has a hell of a learning curve, in my experience |
| 04:30.36 | Amarande | seebs: how did you manage to avoid that crocolisk in wetlands? |
| 04:30.36 | ccox | Legorol: but there aren't any real competitors to those apps, they're just too big |
| 04:30.49 | seebs | Just swim the long way around. You just have to fight L12 murlocs. |
| 04:31.15 | seebs | Tedious but safe. |
| 04:31.15 | Legorol | Microsoft Paint ftw :) |
| 04:31.15 | Antiarc | Every 3D package has a hell of a learning curve |
| 04:31.15 | Antiarc | Except, like, Wings3D or something |
| 04:31.15 | Antiarc | Which is very specialized |
| 04:31.18 | Amarande | More to the point, what support for current games does Blender have? |
| 04:31.25 | seebs | I think that new incoming "cheap" paint software could easily develop a HUGE market, much larger than those that things like Photoshop go after. But... Photoshop couldn't make money in that market. |
| 04:31.30 | Amarande | Especially, say, Oblivion |
| 04:31.41 | Antiarc | http://www.google.com/search?q=blender+oblivion&ie=utf-8&oe=utf-8&aq=t&rls=org.mozilla:en-US:official&client=firefox-a |
| 04:31.45 | seebs | Again, Christensen's approach to evaluating markets strikes me as intensely applicable. |
| 04:31.51 | ccox | seebs - that could be why Adobe has Photoshop Elements, Photoshop Lightroom, Photoshop Express, etc. |
| 04:32.00 | Amarande | because for some reason Bethesda used an obsolete version of Max to develop Oblivion, which means even people who SPENT the money on Maya or current Max couldn't make stuff for Oblivion or Morrowind |
| 04:32.10 | ccox | seebs - smaller, more directed packages for lower end customers who won't pay for the big guns |
| 04:32.22 | Legorol | it's interesting to note how MMOs have transformed the game market |
| 04:32.32 | Legorol | you can't pirate an MMO |
| 04:32.36 | seebs | Yeah. |
| 04:32.36 | Amarande | ccox: meanwhile, Autodesk absolutely refuses to make anything lower end than $2,000 |
| 04:32.40 | seebs | And they save me a ton of money. |
| 04:32.49 | Amarande | Here's the real kicker |
| 04:32.58 | seebs | Between self, spouse, and roommate, I'll be paying 4 accounts next month -- and spending less than I used to on PC desktop games. |
| 04:32.59 | Amarande | even many people who *have* that much money can't buy that kind of software |
| 04:32.59 | Legorol | at the same time, i get lot more out of an MMO as opposed to a single player product |
| 04:33.05 | NightHawkTheSane | Legorol: people still try.. |
| 04:33.06 | Amarande | because the only reasonable way for an individual to order it is online |
| 04:33.15 | ccox | Amarande: yeah, I never understood that part, maybe they think there's enough low end 3D software out there and they don't need higher profits? |
| 04:33.22 | Amarande | and due to fraud, most bank and credit cards have security that prohibits you from charging such huge amounts in a single charge |
| 04:33.26 | Legorol | seebs: indeed |
| 04:33.36 | Legorol | people QQ about WoW's subscription cost, but it's actually very very cheap |
| 04:33.40 | Amarande | unless you have a history of making such charges regularly, pretty much |
| 04:33.42 | ccox | Legorol: you can pirate an MMO, but you get caught pretty quickly |
| 04:33.52 | Legorol | ccox: what's there to pirate? i'm confused |
| 04:34.21 | ccox | Legorol: fake tryout codes, fake prepaid cards, etc. |
| 04:34.30 | Amarande | ccox: I've wondered if it's reason 2) I noted above |
| 04:34.33 | ccox | Legorol: or fake payment |
| 04:34.40 | Amarande | that the enterprises that pay those huge amounts for Maya and Max |
| 04:34.41 | Legorol | that's not piracy, that's scamming |
| 04:34.47 | Legorol | entirely different thing |
| 04:34.52 | Legorol | and the person is still *paying* |
| 04:34.59 | Amarande | partially do so, in the feeling that they have some level of security against competition due to the barrier to entry that cost creates |
| 04:35.01 | ccox | Legorol: think about it |
| 04:35.32 | ccox | Amarande: as far as people affording Maya and AutoDesk software - look at their income, someone out there pays for it |
| 04:35.32 | Amarande | especially if a lot of it is individual pros, too |
| 04:35.52 | seebs | It's easy to steal an account long enough to register as Hgaugugahu and stand in Orgrimmar. It's harder to stay long enough to actually enjoy playing. |
| 04:35.53 | ccox | Amarande: you could make a good business model just selling really high priced stuff to movie studios and special effects houses |
| 04:35.54 | Amarande | in this day and age, you are THANKFUL for a barrier to entry for your profession |
| 04:35.56 | Amarande | whatever profession that is. |
| 04:36.06 | Amarande | you know what happens to professions without a strong enough barrier to entry? |
| 04:36.20 | Antiarc | They are occupied by unskileed workers? |
| 04:36.22 | ccox | Amarande: sometimes, yes |
| 04:36.24 | Amarande | they become minimum wage jobs :P |
| 04:36.32 | ccox | Amarande: until you need to hire an assistant and can't @!#$%@% find one |
| 04:37.06 | ccox | Amarande: or your engineer gets hit by a bus and you have to hire 4 people to replace him |
| 04:37.53 | Legorol | i love this zombie thing, i totally get into the spirit |
| 04:38.01 | Legorol | when i'm normal, i hate them with a passion and cleanse/kill them |
| 04:38.09 | Legorol | when i turn into a zombie, i go grief living folks |
| 04:38.23 | Amarande | I usually end up being a zombie too far away to do anything with it :| |
| 04:38.33 | ccox | Amarande: and then they get shipped to India or China |
| 04:39.31 | Amarande | Yeah, it seems like the job world is necessarily getting to the point where jobs need to require the RL equivalent of a 61/0/0 spec in order to get in, in order to not have said jobs degenerate into immigrant fodder |
| 04:40.02 | ccox | Amarande: interesting way of phrasing it, but yes |
| 04:40.06 | Antiarc | If you think specialized industries are a recent phenomenon, I'd like to point you to the industrial revolution |
| 04:40.18 | Amarande | well, except for some jobs that are themselves illegal I suppose. but hey, rogues always got away with heavily divided triple tree specs :) |
| 04:40.19 | ccox | Amarande: sometimes you can get in as unskilled and prove yourself (level) |
| 04:40.21 | seebs | I have a ton of coworkers in China now. It's not all bad. |
| 04:40.34 | ccox | Amarande: but some jobs need full T5 before they'll let you in the door |
| 04:40.50 | Amarande | ccox: and you can't raid to get that T5 without already being in the door :) |
| 04:40.57 | ccox | exactly |
| 04:41.45 | Amarande | actually, sometimes I can feel very much anti-industry |
| 04:41.50 | Amarande | it seems all too often when you hear |
| 04:41.56 | Amarande | "X made Y into a successful multi-billion dollar industry" |
| 04:42.13 | Amarande | if you were a fan of whatever Y was, you can probably kiss it a sad goodbye, because it's never really anywhere near the same anymore |
| 04:42.40 | *** join/#wowuidev Shirik_ (n=Shirik@83.120.33.65.cfl.res.rr.com) |
| 04:42.46 | Amarande | especially if it was something that used to be dominated by dedicated artisans, and then becomes dominated by whatever crap can be marketed well while being able to be made cheaply in China out of dog poo |
| 04:43.31 | Amarande | er, lack of ability |
| 04:45.40 | Amarande | two things I've learned about chairs of late |
| 04:45.56 | Amarande | even with an armless chair, you get the fun that is tightening screws (including hex screws) 2-3 times a week |
| 04:46.07 | Amarande | and with a chair with arms, don't you ever, EVER think that the arms are for your use. |
| 04:46.11 | *** join/#wowuidev Shirik_ (n=Shirik@83.120.33.65.cfl.res.rr.com) |
| 04:46.20 | Shirik | fricking race conditions |
| 04:46.22 | Amarande | The arms solely exist to help support the back of the chair. |
| 04:46.47 | ccox | Shirik: but race conditions are fu |
| 04:46.48 | ccox | n |
| 04:46.57 | Shirik | I'm just glad I caught it on the first test |
| 04:47.03 | Shirik | that could have been hard to find... |
| 04:47.22 | Shirik | aannnd then he crashes |
| 04:47.45 | Amarande | ccox: you like debugging? |
| 04:47.54 | ccox | Amarande: sometimes |
| 04:47.56 | Amarande | ccox ... do you by any chance have a small scarlet mote in your left eye? :) |
| 04:48.07 | ccox | Amarande: it's big time puzzle solving |
| 04:48.22 | *** join/#wowuidev Shirik_ (n=Shirik@83.120.33.65.cfl.res.rr.com) |
| 04:48.28 | Shirik | debugging is actually sometimes fun :) Especially when it's your students, hehe |
| 04:48.32 | ccox | Amarande: also, my comment to shirik was a joke about race conditions |
| 04:48.49 | Shirik | sometimes it makes you want to shoot yourself in the head though |
| 04:49.34 | ccox | only if the error was mine the in the first place, otherwise I save it for the person responsible |
| 04:50.30 | ccox | of course, that's why I have a long list of people at OS vendors that need to meet my CLUE STICK(TM) |
| 04:50.40 | Shirik | Sigh. Well.... at least it's getting easier to track down |
| 04:52.27 | *** join/#wowuidev Shirik_ (n=Shirik@83.120.33.65.cfl.res.rr.com) |
| 04:52.27 | Shirik_ | JOIN #wowuidev |
| 04:52.27 | *** mode/#WoWUIDev [+rRf #shiibot] by Shiibot |
| 04:52.27 | Shiibot | Channel locked temporarily. Elapsed time: 4570 minutes |
| 04:52.37 | Shirik | ok.... |
| 04:52.42 | Shirik | that might be a sign I need to stop for tonight |
| 04:52.42 | NightHawkTheSane | lol |
| 04:53.15 | *** mode/#WoWUIDev [-rRf] by Shirik |
| 04:53.35 | Shirik | I should find a less public testing channel |
| 04:53.51 | ccox | might be a good idea |
| 04:53.58 | *** join/#wowuidev digmouse (n=chatzill@58.217.207.178) |
| 04:54.05 | Shirik | Lua wasn't this hard! |
| 04:54.23 | ccox | Lua is easy compared to, well, most everything else |
| 04:54.41 | Shirik | The issues mostly stem from me having to reinvent a lot of wheels |
| 04:55.35 | Shirik | !quit |
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| 04:56.00 | *** mode/#WoWUIDev [+o Shiibot] by ChanServ |
| 04:58.32 | Mikk | ML |
| 04:58.49 | Amarande | No. INTERCAL is worse than direct machine language. |
| 04:58.53 | Shirik | in what? |
| 04:59.31 | Amarande | http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Intercal |
| 04:59.37 | NightHawkTheSane | you know what I need more of? |
| 04:59.39 | NightHawkTheSane | beer. |
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| 05:01.06 | Corrodias | no luck here |
| 05:01.19 | Corrodias | although vista does allow you to change display drivers without rebooting. that's a nice little thing. |
| 05:01.28 | Shirik | .... wow, Amarande |
| 05:01.52 | Shirik | Mikk: I have quite a bit of experience hand assembling code, sadly. |
| 05:02.07 | Shirik | Also, Motorola's reference manuals need better organization. |
| 05:02.18 | Shirik | and less abbreviations. |
| 05:05.52 | Mikk | Shirik: If you think that ML means "machine language", you are sadly mistaken |
| 05:05.56 | Mikk | ML means "Meta Language" |
| 05:06.02 | Sixen | Hey, so where's Putress? |
| 05:06.02 | Shirik | I was going off Amarande's translation :) |
| 05:06.04 | Mikk | It is a language devised by mathematics professors |
| 05:06.07 | Shirik | oh dear god |
| 05:06.08 | Mikk | It contains no loops |
| 05:06.08 | Sixen | I need him for a quest. |
| 05:06.10 | Shirik | keep it away then |
| 05:06.12 | Mikk | Only recursion |
| 05:06.15 | Shirik | no |
| 05:06.30 | Mikk | It does not have if/then, only functions declared for specific inputs |
| 05:06.35 | NightHawkTheSane | 'To iterate is human, to recurse divine' |
| 05:06.41 | Shirik | no |
| 05:07.08 | Mikk | function iseven(0) return true end function iseven(1) return false end function iseven(n) return iseven(n-2) end |
| 05:07.23 | Mikk | except i don't recall the exact syntax |
| 05:07.28 | Shirik | wtf... |
| 05:08.09 | Shirik | and this was designed.... why? |
| 05:08.18 | Mikk | This was the first language I was trained in when starting my comp sci masters. And possibly one of the major contributing factors to why I gave them the finger and quit. |
| 05:08.40 | Mikk | Or maybe it was the fact that I got hold of a detailed plan for the coming 4 years, and realized I already knew everything relating to computers. |
| 05:08.48 | pigeon | hi all, is there a downloadable wow lua api reference somewhere? |
| 05:08.52 | Shirik | recursion is one of the last topics we talk about in CS 2.... And you got it on the first day? |
| 05:08.54 | Shirik | ~framexml |
| 05:08.54 | purl | Get the official Blizzard Interface AddOn Kit here: http://www.worldofwarcraft.com/ui/ or view it online at http://wowcompares.com/ |
| 05:09.04 | Shirik | ~wowprogramming |
| 05:09.04 | purl | World of Warcraft Programming: A Guide and Reference for Creating WoW Addons (http://tinyurl.com/5hnxob) a book written by Cladhaire, Cogwheel and Kaelten, or the companion site and API reference available online for free at http://wowprogramming.com |
| 05:09.32 | pigeon | thanks |
| 05:09.36 | Mikk | http://www.wowwiki.com/Portal:Interface_customization |
| 05:09.46 | Mikk | None of these are easily downloadable. But the book is buyable. |
| 05:09.55 | pigeon | aah |
| 05:10.32 | Mikk | Shirik: It did weed out some of the clueless. It only made the rest want to vomit. |
| 05:10.41 | Mikk | Did I mention that one of its designers was our professor? |
| 05:10.51 | Shirik | oh well that will explain it |
| 05:11.28 | Mikk | or well later-generation designers anyway |
| 05:11.39 | NightHawkTheSane | ~framexml |
| 05:11.39 | purl | Get the official Blizzard Interface AddOn Kit here: http://www.worldofwarcraft.com/ui/ or view it online at http://wowcompares.com/ |
| 05:11.39 | Mikk | The original is to be blamed at the scots |
| 05:12.01 | Mikk | http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/ML_(programming_language) |
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| 05:21.15 | Shirik | ok, night all |
| 05:22.18 | NightHawkTheSane | night shirik |
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| 05:41.36 | Cidan | grrrr |
| 05:41.54 | Cidan | Does anyone know of a clever way to make the GameTooltip stop from fading out when you mouse away from things? |
| 05:41.58 | Cidan | I want it to just Hide() |
| 05:49.16 | AnduinLothar | anyone got a table equivalence function handy? |
| 05:51.36 | AnduinLothar | nm, dont need it |
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| 05:54.59 | *** mode/#WoWUIDev [+v cogwheel_] by ChanServ |
| 05:55.19 | Tekkub | for i,v in pairs(t1) do if t2[i] ~= v then return false end for i,v in pairs(t2) do if t1[i] ~= v then return false end return true |
| 05:55.20 | Tekkub | :P |
| 05:56.24 | ccox | you know, it's not easy testing an auction house addon when zombies keep killing the auctioneers |
| 05:56.41 | Kaelten | ccox: heh |
| 05:56.48 | Tekkub | ccox, exodar |
| 05:57.09 | ccox | how did exodar miss out on all the fun? |
| 05:57.28 | Tekkub | people never go there |
| 05:57.36 | Tekkub | the few that do go there for the peace |
| 05:58.32 | NightHawkTheSane | silvermoons more or less the same |
| 05:59.13 | Tekkub | hrm... the battlemap breaks the main map, nice |
| 05:59.17 | Amarande | Exodar and Silvermoon are too remote to bother with |
| 05:59.30 | Amarande | and also tend to bitch loudly in trade chat when someone IS bothering with them |
| 05:59.48 | Amarande | and usually there are so few people doing the bothering that they're sitting ducks for even a small group of defenders :) |
| 05:59.59 | ccox | silvermoon on my main server is kinda littered with zombies |
| 06:00.21 | ccox | (just had to go back and buy a mount for an alt) |
| 06:00.35 | Amarande | ccox: someone probably got infected as they were trying to dash through the middle of Shattrath to get to SMC to hide |
| 06:00.49 | ccox | or went intentionally |
| 06:01.08 | ccox | many people are having "fun" infecting as many NPCs as possible |
| 06:01.41 | Corrodias | this is not fun. it is merely "fun". |
| 06:03.04 | Amarande | ccox: on my main server, they usually go to org where there's more victims |
| 06:03.23 | ccox | org is already a wasteland, as is stormwind, darnassus, and UC |
| 06:03.42 | Amarande | however, there's also an extremely high bitch rate on trade chat right now on Quel'dorei |
| 06:03.53 | Amarande | so people are trying to maintain sanctuaries, I guess |
| 06:03.58 | ccox | even goldshire and human starting areas as littered with zombies |
| 06:04.27 | Amarande | debuff still 1 min? |
| 06:04.48 | Amarande | I'm wondering if tomorrow it will stop having a disease debuff altogether and just go straight to zombie |
| 06:06.56 | Amarande | man |
| 06:07.07 | Amarande | I did a search on google regarding the future of game modding and a lot of old history comes up |
| 06:07.20 | Amarande | for instance, I'm seeing old threads on the WoW UI forum |
| 06:07.30 | Amarande | apparently, QQ exists in all days and ages |
| 06:07.51 | Amarande | QQ probably started as far back as Eden |
| 06:08.05 | Amarande | <Eve> God, you're kicking me out? Why! Why! <GOD> KEW KEW |
| 06:10.51 | *** join/#wowuidev Tinyboom (n=nahh@178.80-202-153.nextgentel.com) |
| 06:12.38 | Amarande | hah, a comment on how screwed up people are about gaming content: |
| 06:13.15 | Amarande | "You know, blood is not for children, but killing is. :)" -- A comment on EA's orders to fan sites to remove a particular Crysis mod |
| 06:13.31 | Amarande | hmm |
| 06:13.55 | Amarande | you know, between that, the Spore DRM case, the Ultima IX fiasco, and a bunch of other things, I think we can draw one conclusion in particular WRT the gaming industry: |
| 06:13.59 | Amarande | Fail EA is fail |
| 06:14.26 | Corrodias | hear hear |
| 06:14.53 | Kaelten | EA kinda put me off when they updated WAR's lua api.... they changed the chatwindow's varaible name from ChatWindow to EA_ChatWindow |
| 06:15.21 | NightHawkTheSane | what? |
| 06:15.28 | Kaelten | ya a few big patches back |
| 06:15.28 | NightHawkTheSane | That's.. what? |
| 06:15.30 | *** join/#wowuidev Nargiddley (n=narg@203-97-236-74.cable.telstraclear.net) |
| 06:15.35 | Kaelten | broke pretty much every addon. |
| 06:15.38 | Kaelten | for WAR |
| 06:15.52 | NightHawkTheSane | That's seriously absurd |
| 06:16.05 | Kaelten | yep |
| 06:16.13 | Kaelten | breaking for functionality changes is one thing |
| 06:16.24 | Corrodias | i'd hate to think that they were using somebody else's chatwindow |
| 06:16.30 | Corrodias | good thing they named it after themselves. |
| 06:16.40 | Kaelten | breaking for branding? I mean I suppose it's possible it's a coding standard missed that somewhere, but damn wtf |
| 06:16.45 | Corrodias | as for WAR... i always think it stands for Warhammer: Arhammer Rhammer |
| 06:16.57 | Kaelten | lol |
| 06:17.13 | Kaelten | Age of Reckonging or however you spell it |
| 06:17.32 | NightHawkTheSane | it'd be a silly coding standard |
| 06:17.40 | Kaelten | very much so |
| 06:18.41 | Amarande | WAR is from EA? |
| 06:18.45 | Amarande | hmm |
| 06:18.48 | Amarande | so much for the idea of getting WAR |
| 06:18.55 | Amarande | EA is fail, plain and simple |
| 06:19.16 | Amarande | hell, they can't even program java games 100% for pogo, you know how many pogo tokens I've gained that I shouldn't because of an idiotic bug in their java? |
| 06:19.36 | Amarande | basically, I've noticed, don't know if it still happens on vista but it definitely happened on XP |
| 06:19.46 | Kaelten | fits EA Mythic |
| 06:19.48 | Amarande | that playing any Pogo game with a timer will cause the system clock to race |
| 06:19.50 | Kaelten | er it's* |
| 06:20.07 | Amarande | eventually the computer will notice that the system clock is as much as ten or fifteen minutes fast, and will reset it |
| 06:20.17 | Amarande | if you (as you usually are when playing a pogo game) are still playing the pogo game at this point |
| 06:20.27 | Amarande | the timer (which affects how many tokens you get for that game) will STOP |
| 06:20.36 | Amarande | and it appears to stay stopped until the real time gets back to where it was before it snapped back |
| 06:20.46 | Tekkub | "notice"? you mean your clock resyncs to a net time server? :P |
| 06:20.53 | Amarande | Tekkub: yeah something like that |
| 06:21.02 | Amarande | basically, Pogo games are doubly buggy with time |
| 06:21.19 | Amarande | one, they rely on the system clock to always be accurate for purposes of awarding tokens based on completion time |
| 06:21.29 | Corrodias | how the hell do they affect the system clock with a java app |
| 06:21.30 | Corrodias | omg. |
| 06:21.30 | Amarande | two, they apparently cause the system clock to race further and further ahead of the proper time |
| 06:21.41 | Tekkub | so run nettime to update more often than window's time service does |
| 06:21.53 | Amarande | Corrodias: I have no idea, but EVERY pogo game I've played with a timer has had the fast clock bug |
| 06:22.03 | Corrodias | hilarity ensues. |
| 06:22.13 | Amarande | Corrodias: it's probably some secret means of epic fail that only EA is fail enough to manage to do |
| 06:22.22 | Tekkub | http://nettime.sourceforge.net/ |
| 06:22.58 | Amarande | oh, other Stupid Pogo Problems I've seen |
| 06:23.08 | Amarande | every so often (especially when either using Firefox or a non-Windows OS) |
| 06:23.21 | Amarande | you'll be in a game that has a room that's divided into tables |
| 06:23.41 | Amarande | and parts of the 'tables in this room' window will end up rendered to the window with your current game table instead |
| 06:24.01 | Amarande | I mean, for light's sake |
| 06:24.08 | Amarande | how can one manage to fuck up JAVA that bad |
| 06:24.12 | Amarande | only EA ... |
| 06:25.26 | Amarande | not that EA has ever been that great with bugs |
| 06:25.36 | Amarande | I still remember the insane exp exploit in Bard's Tale III |
| 06:25.55 | Amarande | basically gave you such an insane level that you could more or less ignore every battle after that until you hit Malefia |
| 06:27.57 | Amarande | I'm trying to think of a game EA had control of that wasn't marred by all kinds of bugs falling into the 'just stupid' category |
| 06:28.20 | Amarande | Ultima VII part 2 Serpent Isle maybe |
| 06:30.21 | seebs | Which one? |
| 06:30.26 | seebs | I always used the Devil Dogs. |
| 06:30.38 | seebs | Devil Dog gnaws! Devil Dog gnaws! |
| 06:32.00 | Cronoh | How would I go about being able to fire off a function whenever I recieve a whisper :? |
| 06:33.39 | Amarande | seebs: this one was stupidly simple |
| 06:34.08 | *** join/#wowuidev cog|away_ (n=cogwheel@c-98-210-42-186.hsd1.ca.comcast.net) |
| 06:34.58 | Amarande | the summon glitch |
| 06:35.11 | seebs | Cronoh, I guess you'd look at chat events. |
| 06:35.13 | seebs | Summon glitch? |
| 06:35.18 | Amarande | after you finished arboria, the old man at the old skara brae review board gave you 600k exp |
| 06:35.37 | Amarande | however, if you then went outside, summoned something into slot 1, and went back inside |
| 06:35.37 | Amarande | you got another 600k exp |
| 06:35.49 | Amarande | and you could do it as many times as you wanted |
| 06:36.04 | seebs | Ahh. |
| 06:36.17 | seebs | That's awesome. |
| 06:36.25 | Amarande | at least, that worked in the Apple IIe version, according to the FAQ at gamefaqs |
| 06:36.32 | Amarande | I'm not sure what versions all told that it works in |
| 06:36.38 | Amarande | knowing EA, it probably was in all of them :P |
| 06:36.42 | seebs | Mine was to rely on summoning monsters (devil dogs). Good tanks in front row, have a bard cast the "heal every turn" spell and then enter combat. The spell started outside combat so it never expired. |
| 06:36.54 | Seerah | BRAIIINS! http://www.darklegacycomics.com/index.html |
| 06:37.13 | seebs | So you gained some number of hit points every round -- enough to keep you for quite a while against the dogs. Meanwhile, they summoned more dogs. Once it got up to 99 dogs, cast two AoE spells, reducing it to about 4 dogs. Repeat. |
| 06:37.15 | Corrodias | bard's tale 3, is that a game i should play? |
| 06:37.47 | seebs | It was pretty fun, but it took forever and the UI would be pretty painful now. |
| 06:38.26 | *** part/#wowuidev Seerah (n=Ryan_L@adsl-242-180-218.mem.bellsouth.net) |
| 06:40.46 | digmouse | Fallout 3 9 hours left! |
| 06:42.28 | Amarande | Corrodias: if you like old, old games |
| 06:42.30 | Amarande | it's about twenty years old |
| 06:42.43 | Amarande | it used to be considered one of the best RPGs of its time, though |
| 06:42.45 | Corrodias | i have been known to play some old games, but that's stretching it |
| 06:43.03 | Amarande | i.e., a time when about the only other major RPG titles out were Ultima I-V or so and maybe pool of radiance |
| 06:43.16 | Corrodias | the oldest game i still play these days is subspace, from only like 10 years ago |
| 06:43.40 | Corrodias | well, 13 |
| 06:44.44 | Amarande | this was back in the day when 320x200 graphics was good enough for anyone |
| 06:44.47 | Amarande | I kinda miss those days :S |
| 06:45.30 | *** join/#wowuidev p3lim (n=p3lim@212251216176.customer.cdi.no) |
| 06:46.04 | seebs | I have so much no confidence in Bethesda's ability to make a game I could recognize as Fallout. |
| 06:46.59 | Amarande | seebs: and it's going to be a Bethesda game without a construction set |
| 06:47.01 | Amarande | I don't like this |
| 06:47.06 | seebs | I tried to like Oblivion, but the twitch factor ruined it for me. In an RPG, if my character is skilled with a weapon, I should be able to indicate a target and let the character's skill control the swings/shots. That's essential, for me, to "an RPG". |
| 06:47.18 | Amarande | mainly because it gives me that sinking feeling ES5 won't have a construction set :| |
| 06:47.26 | End | well, Oblivion got rerated because of the construction set |
| 06:47.30 | seebs | As soon as I realized that I had to aim above a monster to shoot it, I lost interest. |
| 06:47.37 | *** join/#wowuidev Diskmaster (n=YOURFACE@76.85.147.197) |
| 06:47.41 | seebs | If I wanted to play an archery sim, I wouldn't be looking for something labeled "RPG". |
| 06:47.41 | End | skins have no clothes, and since you can make a mod to show no clothes... |
| 06:48.12 | Amarande | End: how long before 'having an unrestricted construction set' comes with an automatic AO rating regardless of whether the actual stuff you provide with the game is care bear level? |
| 06:48.21 | End | I don't know |
| 06:48.27 | End | ask the ESRB that, not me |
| 06:48.38 | Amarande | maybe it's time to stop having games be rated by ESRB |
| 06:48.41 | Amarande | what's the need, anymore? |
| 06:48.47 | Amarande | Jack Thompson is no longer an attorney |
| 06:49.40 | seebs | There exist people who value game ratings. |
| 06:49.43 | End | They serve a purpose, but rerating Oblivion was silly |
| 06:49.49 | seebs | I don't, but my friends who have a 5-year-old do. |
| 06:50.23 | Amarande | seebs, it's better to test out the game yourself in such a case |
| 06:50.53 | seebs | Yeah, but it's hard to have time. So a flawed rating system may be more useful than none at all. |
| 06:51.10 | NightHawkTheSane | Amarande: jack thompson was not unique. |
| 06:51.14 | *** join/#wowuidev amnith (i=robert@217-14-8-187-dhcp-osl.bbse.no) |
| 06:51.28 | End | Jack Thompson was vocal, however |
| 06:52.16 | Amarande | seebs: not if it eventually destroys game modding altogether |
| 06:52.22 | NightHawkTheSane | no doubt. But I find it hard to believe that a) disbarment will make him stop trying. b) there is no one else who shares his views |
| 06:52.36 | seebs | I think that's a separate question from the issues with modding. |
| 06:52.53 | seebs | I think it would make more sense to work on getting the ESRB to fix the system to distinguish between provided content and possible downloaded content. |
| 06:53.25 | End | well |
| 06:53.41 | Corrodias | as it stands, if the ESRB considers modding to be worth noting in the game's rating, the ESRB has become useless |
| 06:53.50 | End | Jack Thompson was prone to making ridicilous filings |
| 06:53.52 | seebs | Agreed. |
| 06:53.54 | Corrodias | absolutely worthless, and we're back where we were 10 years ago |
| 06:54.00 | Amarande | Night: It will be extremely difficult for him to find an attorney in good standing who's willing to put that standing at risk to file stuff for him |
| 06:54.06 | seebs | Anyway, I gotta work and stuff. See you gouys later in the week, maybe, if I get lucky. |
| 06:54.10 | Corrodias | bye |
| 06:54.29 | seebs | (BTW, other lawyers may file rating-related suits not because of Thompson, but because they're not idiots like he is and know how to pick a case...) |
| 06:54.32 | Amarande | Corrodias: except 10 years ago, game companies didn't care, because they didn't have to care |
| 06:54.40 | NightHawkTheSane | stupidity is highly persistent. |
| 06:54.42 | Amarande | now they have to care about an AO in particular |
| 06:54.50 | Corrodias | well okay, they "have to care", but they shouldn't any more |
| 06:54.59 | Amarande | because wally world and gamestop are a bunch of care bears who refuse to carry any game that has it |
| 06:55.27 | Corrodias | i think they could survive on digital distribution channels if Valve or any of the others have the balls to host them |
| 06:55.54 | Corrodias | on a side note: i love when games support proper windowed mode. why is it that these two cheap games, Multiwinia and Spectraball, have such nice windowed modes when games like WoW and Bioshock can't get it right? |
| 06:56.10 | Amarande | ... I've never had a problem with WoW in windowed mode? |
| 06:56.27 | End | I think WoW's windowed mode is pretty good |
| 06:56.29 | Amarande | aside from the fact that even fullscreen I feel like I need a bigger monitor to have enough room for all my addons |
| 06:56.30 | End | but maybe that's just me |
| 06:56.36 | End | and also |
| 06:56.42 | Corrodias | when i first started playing, launching in windowed mode only had the problem that it didn't center the window, so i had to adjust its position |
| 06:56.43 | End | I use the not really windowed windowed mode |
| 06:56.51 | Corrodias | (the windows i play in are the same width as my desktop) |
| 06:57.18 | Corrodias | some patch broke that, so then WoW's windows didn't even start at the proper width. they included the borders or something, so i had to resize AND reposition it |
| 06:58.15 | Corrodias | a minor nuisance, but why was i spending an extra 10 seconds counting pixels? it can't be so hard if so many games get it right |
| 06:58.47 | End | Well, I dunno, I use Window Mode with the Maximized setting |
| 06:59.13 | End | don't really have any expierence with that mode with it really acting like a window |
| 06:59.52 | Corrodias | well, at least WoW worked well in a window, aside from the size issue |
| 07:01.42 | Amarande | hmm, I wonder if http://ire.sourceforge.net/ will survive as a good engine for developing stuff in |
| 07:01.56 | Amarande | it looks like it's been about two and a half years since it was last updated though :| |
| 07:02.03 | Amarande | then again, it was about two years between the last update and the update before that |
| 07:03.03 | Amarande | basically, selecting an engine is always my most onerous decision when designing something |
| 07:03.32 | Amarande | I want something that's not going to suddenly go forevermore obsolete probably, given Murphy's Law, the moment everything is all done, tested, and ready to rumble |
| 07:04.16 | *** join/#wowuidev Srosh (n=Srosh@c209112.adsl.hansenet.de) |
| 07:05.43 | Amarande | or ... http://uaf.sourceforge.net/ |
| 07:05.52 | Amarande | which seems to be getting somewhere, albeit painfully slowly |
| 07:17.04 | Tekkub | fucking wendy's retards |
| 07:17.13 | Tekkub | how hard is only ketchup add bacon |
| 07:18.44 | Corrodias | you |
| 07:18.49 | Corrodias | should use the Unreal engine. for everything! |
| 07:19.13 | End | especially for duke nukem |
| 07:19.25 | End | you cannot fail! |
| 07:20.06 | Tekkub | what does that have to do with MY FICKING BACON |
| 07:20.25 | End | Nothing. Anything. Everything! |
| 07:20.41 | Tekkub | and they didn't have choco frosty |
| 07:20.47 | End | D: |
| 07:20.56 | Tekkub | so instead I get this nasty nerd mix thing |
| 07:21.01 | End | o_O |
| 07:21.03 | Tekkub | at least it's pure sugar |
| 07:21.28 | Tekkub | it still doesn't make up for the lack of bacon |
| 07:22.36 | *** join/#wowuidev Elkano (n=elkano@WoWUIDev/WoWAce/Elkano) |
| 07:25.58 | ZorbaTHut | hmm, maybe someone knows the answer to this. I'm making a tooltip frame with CreateFrame("GameTooltip", "uniquename", nil, "GameTooltipTemplate") but it doesn't appear to respect the UI scaling. Any idea what's going wrong here? Should it be? |
| 07:26.42 | *** join/#wowuidev ecstasia (n=ecs@unaffiliated/ecstasia) |
| 07:27.07 | Legorol | you need to set a parent for it |
| 07:27.21 | Legorol | the UI scale affects UIParent, and all its children (and subchildren) |
| 07:27.33 | Legorol | unparented frames are therefore unaffected |
| 07:27.36 | Corrodias | what's up with all these "free to play" mmorpgs |
| 07:27.38 | *** join/#wowuidev zenzelezz (n=zenzelez@084202095252.customer.alfanett.no) |
| 07:27.57 | ZorbaTHut | that makes sense |
| 07:28.11 | ZorbaTHut | wait |
| 07:28.13 | ZorbaTHut | "If nil, UIParent is used." |
| 07:28.36 | ZorbaTHut | so, in theory, I *am* using UIParent |
| 07:28.38 | Legorol | is that what the doc says? |
| 07:28.44 | ZorbaTHut | that's what wowwiki says, at least |
| 07:28.50 | ZorbaTHut | trying UIParent explicitly to see if it makes a difference |
| 07:28.52 | Legorol | that'd be surprising if it worked that way, because how would you create an unparented frame then |
| 07:29.03 | Legorol | then again, wowwiki could be right and something else could be going on |
| 07:29.10 | ZorbaTHut | well, when would you want to? |
| 07:29.27 | ZorbaTHut | hey hey, that helped |
| 07:29.31 | ZorbaTHut | I guess wowwiki is wrong |
| 07:29.49 | Legorol | try again with nil, and do a GetParent on it |
| 07:29.53 | Legorol | see what that returns |
| 07:32.42 | ZorbaTHut | says the parent is nil |
| 07:33.01 | Legorol | then wiki is wrong |
| 07:33.13 | ZorbaTHut | indeed |
| 07:34.04 | NightHawkTheSane | the wiki MAY have ben right at one point, and it changd. *shrug* |
| 07:34.38 | Lukian | so fix wowwiki |
| 07:34.45 | Lukian | it's a wiki :p |
| 07:35.32 | *** join/#wowuidev Mike-N-Go (n=MikeNGoS@michaelg20.goshen.edu) |
| 07:38.05 | *** join/#wowuidev zenzio (n=zenzelez@85.19.77.194) |
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| 07:43.05 | Tekkub | NOTE TO SELF |
| 07:43.18 | End | damn zombie |
| 07:43.25 | Tekkub | <PROTECTED> |
| 07:43.27 | End | I teleported to TB and met a zombie on my way out |
| 07:43.32 | Tekkub | WILL NOT SAVE MY ASS FORM FALLING |
| 07:43.40 | End | now I just spread it across half the city |
| 07:43.51 | End | it's not my fault I have to explode to get rid of it |
| 07:44.10 | End | Tekkub: haha |
| 07:45.07 | Tekkub | "Can't do that while moving" "Can't do that while moving" "Can't do that while moving" "Can't do that while moving" SPLAT |
| 07:45.26 | End | why the hell would it give that error message? |
| 07:45.36 | Tekkub | cause it's on my mount macro |
| 07:45.41 | Tekkub | mount OOC, "oh shit" IC |
| 07:45.46 | End | ahhh |
| 07:45.49 | End | lol |
| 07:46.21 | Tekkub | I do the same on all my toons, priest it's scream, huntard's FD |
| 07:49.21 | *** join/#wowuidev MoonWolf (n=MoonWolf@i209133.upc-i.chello.nl) |
| 07:49.21 | *** mode/#WoWUIDev [+v MoonWolf] by ChanServ |
| 07:55.06 | *** join/#wowuidev zlotmaste (n=bonhyoun@211.196.247.196) |
| 07:55.12 | *** join/#wowuidev Doow (n=Miranda@unaffiliated/doow) |
| 08:00.05 | NightHawkTheSane | Tekkub: heh, problem there is that.. sometimes, you want to hit that ability when you're ooc ;) |
| 08:07.22 | Thunder_Child | yes, i belive he figured that out |
| 08:07.34 | Thunder_Child | once he hit the grund |
| 08:07.38 | Thunder_Child | ground* |
| 08:12.33 | *** join/#wowuidev keias (i=saiek@c-69-245-192-208.hsd1.in.comcast.net) |
| 08:15.05 | Mikk | Okay.. here's something to scratch you heads over, I know it's doing ME in... |
| 08:15.24 | Mikk | This is from chatframe.lua: |
| 08:15.30 | Mikk | SlashCmdList["READYCHECK"] = function(msg) |
| 08:15.30 | Mikk | if ( ((IsRaidLeader() or IsRaidOfficer()) and GetNumRaidMembers() > 0) or (IsPartyLeader() and GetNumPartyMembers()) ) then |
| 08:15.30 | Mikk | DoReadyCheck(); |
| 08:15.30 | Mikk | end |
| 08:15.30 | Mikk | end |
| 08:15.59 | Mikk | Now... if I install an "/rc" alias thusly: SLASH_RCANN1 = "/rc"; SlashCmdList["RCANN"] = SlashCmdList["READYCHECK"]; ... |
| 08:16.04 | zenzio | what about it? |
| 08:16.11 | Mikk | I get tainting problems, use "/rc" in combat and I spew errors |
| 08:16.31 | Mikk | BUT... if I do SlashCmdList["RCANN"] = function() DoReadyCheck() end ... I get no errors |
| 08:16.40 | Mikk | Can anyone explain that? oO |
| 08:18.37 | zlotmaste | hi guys :> how can i get some wow lua manual? |
| 08:19.01 | Mikk | ~wowprogramming |
| 08:19.02 | purl | World of Warcraft Programming: A Guide and Reference for Creating WoW Addons (http://tinyurl.com/5hnxob) a book written by Cladhaire, Cogwheel and Kaelten, or the companion site and API reference available online for free at http://wowprogramming.com |
| 08:19.14 | Mikk | ~framexml |
| 08:19.15 | purl | Get the official Blizzard Interface AddOn Kit here: http://www.worldofwarcraft.com/ui/ or view it online at http://wowcompares.com/ |
| 08:19.16 | Mikk | ~wowwiki |
| 08:19.17 | purl | The largest English-language Warcraft wiki in existence, with over 55,000 articles. It is located at http://www.wowwiki.com |
| 08:19.33 | Mikk | Meh.. Portal:Interface customization is what you want |
| 08:19.33 | zlotmaste | oh. thanks very much :) |
| 08:20.14 | zenzio | so PHP is aiming to use backslash ("\") as namespace separator... x.x |
| 08:20.17 | NightHawkTheSane | Mikk: im not sure to hate you for making my brain hurt. or to thank you for giving me something to take my mind of the depressing crap i was thinking about. |
| 08:20.34 | NightHawkTheSane | ..hm. that was ALMOST proper english. |
| 08:20.37 | Arrowmaster | Mikk: taint errors? |
| 08:21.00 | Mikk | Arrowmaster: As in raidframes complaining about not being able to call protected functions due to taint from my addon |
| 08:21.22 | Mikk | As in http://www.wowinterface.com/downloads/fileinfo.php?id=7139#comments |
| 08:21.27 | Arrowmaster | oh really |
| 08:22.10 | Mikk | It is totally and utterly fucked up. DoReadyCheck() is a fricking API for god's sake. |
| 08:22.22 | Mikk | It just returns! |
| 08:22.30 | Mikk | Everything else happens on events :S |
| 08:22.34 | Arrowmaster | what if you do SlashCmdList["RCANN"] = function(...) SlashCmdList["READYCHECK"](...) end |
| 08:22.40 | Mikk | Interesting question |
| 08:23.16 | Thunder_Child | ~kick NightHawkTheSane |
| 08:23.16 | purl | ACTION kicks NightHawkTheSane |
| 08:23.35 | Arrowmaster | its probably something wrong with the internal slash command stuff then |
| 08:23.47 | *** join/#wowuidev Thelyna (n=burp@222-152-95-114.jetstream.xtra.co.nz) |
| 08:24.03 | Arrowmaster | unless that function from chatframe.lua isnt calling global functions |
| 08:24.36 | Mikk | That does not error |
| 08:25.09 | Arrowmaster | can you post on us forums? |
| 08:25.12 | Mikk | no |
| 08:25.15 | Arrowmaster | boo |
| 08:25.23 | Arrowmaster | give me something to copy paste then |
| 08:25.34 | Mikk | Right |
| 08:25.54 | Arrowmaster | its clearly something internal that only blizz can investigate |
| 08:29.50 | Mikk | Arrowmaster: http://wowui.pastey.net/99830 |
| 08:30.20 | Mikk | Arrowmaster: oops, missing edits |
| 08:30.36 | Mikk | http://wowui.pastey.net/99831 |
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| 08:33.18 | *** join/#wowuidev Kalroth (n=kalroth@0x573f1066.hjnqu1.static.dsl.tele.dk) |
| 08:35.02 | Arrowmaster | http://forums.worldofwarcraft.com/thread.html?topicId=11676470259&postId=118283238776&sid=1#6 |
| 08:35.12 | Arrowmaster | put it in the 3.0.2 taint sticky |
| 08:37.20 | zenzio | "The number of days that an old, crusty Perl developer can laugh at another language are few and far between. Thank you, PHP." heh |
| 08:40.41 | *** join/#wowuidev pb_ee1 (n=nospam@meilleu015869-2.clients.easynet.fr) |
| 08:42.14 | Mikk | I wonder if it's something funky like my alias making it into the securecmd hash and thereby tainting it |
| 08:43.00 | Arrowmaster | shouldnt be |
| 08:43.22 | Kalroth | mmm |
| 08:43.38 | Kalroth | well /readycheck is a "system" command |
| 08:43.52 | Kalroth | so since your alias calls it, it's probably tainted |
| 08:44.13 | Mikk | More the other way around.. it loops the command list, checks if the function refs are secure, then builds the securecmd hash |
| 08:44.31 | Mikk | If it does this on an event, my alias will already be installed |
| 08:44.58 | Arrowmaster | the secure commands are kept in a different table though |
| 08:45.05 | Mikk | Aye, but when it is populated? |
| 08:47.18 | Mikk | mmmm no it's populated way earlier than addons being loaded |
| 08:53.13 | p3lim | when i rightclick an item in my backpack, what function runs? |
| 08:53.37 | p3lim | i want to hook it, so if i hold shift and the item is a ring or a trinket it will use the 2nd slot instead of the top one |
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| 08:55.04 | p3lim | thats possible, right? |
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| 09:24.08 | Asuah | Beginner wow addon programmer here, can anyone comment on why I can't seem to access tables that I define in another lua file? Trying to use Ace3, learning as I go along. |
| 09:24.54 | haste | Wield guess would be that you define the table as a local |
| 09:24.59 | haste | s/e// |
| 09:26.27 | Asuah | I didn't =( |
| 09:26.28 | Lonny`afk | This might be helpful. http://www.wowwiki.com/Lua_variable_scoping |
| 09:26.55 | *** join/#wowuidev soufron (n=soufron@user-387hrtl.cable.mindspring.com) |
| 09:26.56 | clad|sleep | this also might be helpful |
| 09:26.58 | clad|sleep | ~wowprogramming |
| 09:26.58 | purl | World of Warcraft Programming: A Guide and Reference for Creating WoW Addons (http://tinyurl.com/5hnxob) a book written by Cladhaire, Cogwheel and Kaelten, or the companion site and API reference available online for free at http://wowprogramming.com |
| 09:27.44 | Asuah | thanks, looking into it now. the variable scoping will at least be very helpful even if its doesnt apply to this problem |
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| 09:30.08 | haste | you don't really give any info at all |
| 09:30.25 | haste | and most people aren't going to give you much of a helping hand when we have to play the guessing game |
| 09:30.34 | Asuah | sorry, i didn't mean it like that |
| 09:30.57 | Asuah | i've been having scoping problems as it is and this will be extremely helpful regardless if i dont find what i need in it |
| 09:36.24 | p3lim | haste: whats the point in CPoints.unit ? |
| 09:37.05 | haste | oUF does it on a X -> Y unit base |
| 09:38.49 | *** join/#wowuidev |pez| (n=user@213-187-182-126.dd.nextgentel.com) |
| 09:39.33 | p3lim | ah i see, GetComboPoints has another arg |
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| 09:40.50 | p3lim | whats the diffrence between the old and new GetComboPoints? |
| 09:41.05 | haste | new works for all units |
| 09:41.17 | p3lim | so i can see anyone's cps? |
| 09:41.46 | p3lim | if i anchor it to say party |
| 09:41.52 | haste | wouldn't suprise me |
| 09:42.36 | *** topic/#WoWUIDev by Cairenn -> http://wowuidev.pastey.net/ | 3.0.x ToC: 30000 | #WoWUIDev-commits: CIA & JIRA bots reporting | Thou shalt not use thy Blackberry during times of carnal knowledge. |
| 09:43.19 | Asuah | Heres my problem: I define an empty table named Buff_Defaults in a file named Buffs.lua which is not local, and try to retrieve that value in Addon.lua as [local buffList = Buff_Defaults;], but though I load Buffs.lua before Addon.lua it always seems to retrieve a nil value. |
| 09:43.53 | Saryai | Hey haste... |
| 09:44.04 | *** join/#wowuidev sioraiocht (n=sioraioc@94-192-60-10.zone6.bethere.co.uk) |
| 09:44.35 | Saryai | Been stumped by the buff api. Any hints on how to do class-filtered buffs and dispellable debuffs in ouf? |
| 09:45.14 | haste | by writing your own filter list =/ |
| 09:45.19 | Saryai | x.x |
| 09:45.21 | Saryai | Figured. |
| 09:45.53 | Saryai | Not too hard to do, was kinda hoping to use the interface option. =P |
| 09:46.18 | haste | you can use that one also, with self.Buffs.filter etc |
| 09:46.30 | haste | not completely sure what values they set for those now however |
| 09:46.41 | haste | just check the UnitAura docs on wowwiki |
| 09:47.09 | Saryai | I did... there's an isMine flag, but not one for isCastable |
| 09:47.30 | haste | that's returns, not filters |
| 09:47.31 | Saryai | Pretty sure I can set up a type filter for debuffs, that part's easy. |
| 09:47.41 | Saryai | o.0? |
| 09:47.53 | Saryai | I must've read the code completely wrong. |
| 09:48.10 | haste | http://www.wowwiki.com/API_UnitAura take a look at the filter argument |
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| 09:48.41 | Saryai | Hm. |
| 09:48.51 | Saryai | I wonder if PLAYER would do it. |
| 09:49.06 | Saryai | ...prolly not... |
| 09:49.17 | Saryai | OH I SEE |
| 09:49.28 | *** join/#wowuidev soufron_ (n=soufron@cpe-72-229-125-229.nyc.res.rr.com) |
| 09:50.00 | Saryai | So I could potentially use HELPFUL|RAID for the same effect as the default filter. |
| 09:54.12 | haste | Asuah: you have to be doing something odd then, when do you define it? |
| 09:54.17 | clad|sleep | Does anyone know which dock in SW harbor goes to Auberdine? |
| 09:54.49 | haste | the one with the guy who says so :D |
| 09:55.34 | Asuah | I define the empty table before everything in the Buffs.lua file, but all that follow are a few local assignments and local functions |
| 09:55.48 | clad|away | there is no guys who say so |
| 09:55.57 | clad|away | err maybe there is |
| 09:55.58 | clad|away | heh |
| 10:04.03 | WobWork | You know |
| 10:04.30 | WobWork | I think the fact that I really don't care at -all- about any achievements has made my current WoW gaming much more relaxed and unstressed =P |
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| 10:06.50 | Arrowmaster | clad|away: guessing the one with a few nightelfs at the end? |
| 10:07.03 | clad|away | ? |
| 10:07.09 | Arrowmaster | the doc |
| 10:07.10 | Arrowmaster | dock |
| 10:07.14 | clad|away | yeah |
| 10:07.16 | clad|away | i figured that much out :P |
| 10:07.29 | Arrowmaster | i remember one having some auberdine guards at the end of it |
| 10:07.40 | Arrowmaster | they really stupid proofed the docks for alliance |
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| 10:24.35 | *** mode/#WoWUIDev [+o cladhaire] by ChanServ |
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| 10:26.53 | Antiarc | 6http://i37.tinypic.com/2mpx1jd.jpg |
| 10:28.55 | Industrial | oo nice |
| 10:29.05 | zenzio | is that just a reskinned minimap? |
| 10:29.05 | Industrial | the minimap i assume |
| 10:29.54 | Castigo | is there a way to have 2 separate xml |
| 10:30.05 | Castigo | without having to define all the frames in one xml as virtual? |
| 10:30.54 | Antiarc | I'm working on a mod that lets you do some serious minimap reskinning |
| 10:30.58 | Antiarc | So yes |
| 10:30.59 | zenzio | great job :-o How does it handle buttons like the usual addon buttons? |
| 10:31.01 | Antiarc | Reskinned minimap |
| 10:31.09 | Antiarc | Hover over the map and they appear |
| 10:31.11 | Antiarc | By default |
| 10:31.15 | Antiarc | You can turn them always on or off if you want |
| 10:31.15 | Saryai | haste: Was just thinking about the ToT name tag issue... I'd assume registering "UNIT_TARGET" as a tag event would resolve it? And if so, would I need to register for each unit target I want to display? |
| 10:31.32 | Saryai | Something like 'if unit == "focustarget" then f:RegisterEvent("UNIT_TARGET", focus) end' |
| 10:31.39 | zenzio | Antiarc: sweet :) |
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| 10:31.46 | haste | Saryai: you would have to do polling, which I wouldn't recommend doing with the current tag base |
| 10:32.09 | Antiarc | http://i36.tinypic.com/2j1s8bk.jpg |
| 10:32.25 | Antiarc | TexBrowser + SexyMap = lots of fun things :D |
| 10:32.30 | Saryai | Antiarc: That IS sexy. |
| 10:33.01 | Saryai | haste: Good point. |
| 10:33.09 | Castigo | Antiarc that is cool |
| 10:33.13 | zenzio | Antiarc: is SexyMap available yet, or WotLKish? |
| 10:33.22 | Antiarc | I'm still working on it |
| 10:33.25 | Antiarc | I jsut started it today |
| 10:33.38 | zenzio | aha :) Will have to keep an eye out for it |
| 10:34.28 | Saryai | Think you'd be able to manage some custom pointer textures for the truly sexymap? =P |
| 10:35.24 | Antiarc | Like, arrows and stuff? |
| 10:35.29 | Antiarc | I mostly doubt it |
| 10:35.34 | Antiarc | But you never know |
| 10:36.34 | Saryai | Shouldn't be too hard to whip up something if the paths are known. I'm just thinking things like simple colored triangles to replace the default arrows |
| 10:36.53 | Antiarc | I dunno if you can replace them, since they're actually model files |
| 10:36.57 | Antiarc | But you never know! |
| 10:36.58 | Lonny`afk | Anyone knows a good free UML app similar to StarUML ? (unfortunately they abandoned the project) |
| 10:37.14 | Saryai | Ah, I see... |
| 10:37.15 | zenzio | I actually like the default arrows |
| 10:37.45 | cbreak | UML? tried inkskape? :D |
| 10:38.06 | Lonny`afk | Nop :P |
| 10:38.08 | Saryai | Default arrows are nice, I'm just thinking in the realm of color schemes |
| 10:40.03 | Lonny`afk | It's seems to be a painting program ? haha :P |
| 10:40.14 | cbreak | yes |
| 10:40.35 | cbreak | you can create UML if you're artistically inclined :D |
| 10:43.18 | Lonny`afk | I don't want to paint anything, I'm interesting in code generation of a model I want to create :P |
| 10:43.40 | cbreak | *shiver* |
| 10:43.45 | cbreak | automated code generation is evil |
| 10:43.57 | Lonny`afk | Yeah but it's good for drafts :) |
| 10:46.28 | Lonny`afk | Well I guess I'll use eclipse and convert it from Java to C# |
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| 11:43.42 | Drakhaon | anyone wanna comment the "final" update of our site? http://tnt.citra.se/ :P |
| 11:45.09 | cbreak | looks a lot more serious than mine :) |
| 11:45.15 | Drakhaon | =) |
| 11:45.22 | castigo | is it google chrome compatible? |
| 11:45.30 | Drakhaon | dunno, should be |
| 11:45.58 | Drakhaon | google chrome is opera (I think, or safari..) so it should be :P |
| 11:46.18 | castigo | opera |
| 11:46.24 | castigo | i belive, safari ain't based on that |
| 11:46.36 | castigo | website is very nice, shame u play horde tho :P |
| 11:46.39 | Drakhaon | then it should work just fine in chrome |
| 11:46.48 | Drakhaon | hehe =) I played alliance first |
| 11:46.57 | Drakhaon | but.. then I ran into Goldshire.. and never came back |
| 11:47.52 | Drakhaon | Goldshire on Argent Dawn is a pornographic metropolis |
| 11:48.18 | krka | O_o |
| 11:48.28 | Drakhaon | krka > dont go roll AD alliance now :P |
| 11:48.43 | Drakhaon | my first encounter in Goldshire was a lesbian night elf vampire.. |
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| 11:49.22 | cbreak | Chrome is KHTML, which is WebKit, which is Safari |
| 11:49.28 | cbreak | it has nothing at all to do with opera |
| 11:49.55 | Drakhaon | still should be fully functional in chrome =) |
| 11:50.09 | cbreak | there are three big browsers: Gekko, WebKit and Trident |
| 11:50.09 | Drakhaon | if youd say MSIE5 Id say "hell no!" - IE 6 might even display it with some errors |
| 11:50.10 | castigo | cbreak rox and castigo sucks :P |
| 11:51.24 | Drakhaon | =) |
| 11:51.43 | cbreak | the best on my guild page/forum is the header: http://www.thecorewithin.net/forum/styles/hestia/imageset/tcw_logo.png |
| 11:51.46 | Drakhaon | cbreak > and Firefox is Gekko? |
| 11:51.48 | cbreak | I made it msyself :) |
| 11:51.51 | cbreak | yes |
| 11:51.58 | Drakhaon | thought so |
| 11:52.12 | Drakhaon | I think I saw it once or twice when checking http headers :P |
| 11:52.29 | cbreak | microsoft's engine is trident |
| 11:52.35 | cbreak | (I think) |
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| 11:54.07 | cbreak | ah, the google says it's "Gecko" :) |
| 11:55.03 | Drakhaon | cbreak > for msie? |
| 11:55.27 | cbreak | no, ms has trident |
| 11:55.41 | Drakhaon | Explorer's engine is "fucked" - even in v7 its not entirely ok :P |
| 11:55.51 | castigo | cbreak that screenshot is GENIOUS |
| 11:55.58 | castigo | i am still looking for the picture i saw an year ago |
| 11:56.06 | castigo | with the warlocks dead, the tank as atank |
| 11:56.11 | castigo | the mages showed as "food" |
| 11:56.23 | castigo | was hilarious but i can't find it anymore :( |
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| 12:00.56 | Drakhaon | in our guild the mages always dies - not the locks |
| 12:02.04 | cbreak | here usually the rogues die |
| 12:02.11 | cbreak | to cleave or something comparable |
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| 12:04.27 | castigo | in our the tank :P |
| 12:04.37 | castigo | most likely the warlock tank for anything |
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| 12:27.26 | Drakhaon | well.. we do have a rogue who is totally unable to control his aggro |
| 12:27.41 | Drakhaon | so he always dies atleast 10 times per raid |
| 12:27.59 | cbreak | did you try to redicule him? |
| 12:28.35 | Drakhaon | yup |
| 12:28.52 | Drakhaon | if you mean ridicule that is :P |
| 12:30.16 | cbreak | yeah, or tax him :) |
| 12:30.37 | Drakhaon | gah! my game keeps crashing - crashes when reading textures (different texture each time) - wonder if I should just reinstall the entire thing instead of repairing three times per day |
| 12:31.05 | Drakhaon | I believe the repairbills are taxes enough :P nah but he knows if he doesnt improve he wont raid with us in wotlk |
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| 12:42.47 | AbsoRayne | Drakhaon: Tell him to watch his threat or youre going to need to start sitting him |
| 12:42.56 | AbsoRayne | Dead DPS =/= Good DPS |
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| 12:44.49 | *** mode/#WoWUIDev [+v Lopeppeppy] by ChanServ |
| 12:45.33 | Lopeppeppy | Ya-hi. |
| 12:47.00 | zenzio | hai peppy |
| 12:47.09 | cbreak | maybe tricks of the trade helps him |
| 12:47.39 | Lopeppeppy | So how did the whole zombie thing pan out last night? |
| 12:47.53 | AbsoRayne | Zombie thing? |
| 12:48.35 | Lopeppeppy | Apparently there was some world event level stuff going on last night with the zombies. |
| 12:49.17 | AbsoRayne | Oh....its some quick quest, nothing special |
| 12:49.23 | AbsoRayne | Unless theyve boosted it again |
| 12:50.05 | AbsoRayne | Nothing new |
| 12:50.15 | cbreak | the zombie thing is on all the time |
| 12:50.17 | cbreak | very anoying |
| 12:50.17 | AbsoRayne | So....who else is never playing their ret Pali again? |
| 12:50.38 | cbreak | I got infected twice while trying to port from black temple to sunwell |
| 12:50.50 | cbreak | AbsoRayne: me |
| 12:50.58 | cbreak | never got him past level 5 though |
| 12:51.12 | cbreak | so it might not classify as ret pala, since the first talent point comes with 1 |
| 12:51.13 | cbreak | 10 |
| 12:51.14 | AbsoRayne | I have one in S3/4 that ill never play again come tomorrow. |
| 12:51.43 | AbsoRayne | Thank you Blizzard, for not only nerfing a class, but making it as useful as someone 10 levels below the instance level. |
| 12:52.01 | AbsoRayne | To the ground, palis. To the ground. |
| 12:52.29 | cbreak | can't be that bad |
| 12:52.35 | cbreak | mages have managed all those years :) |
| 12:52.46 | AbsoRayne | Its horrible. trust me. |
| 12:53.14 | Drakhaon | is there a smooth way to detect who breaks say sheep and with what? |
| 12:53.22 | AbsoRayne | Imagine them taking it frostbolt. Now imagine them making it hit for half. Then imagine it being affected by armor level, then making it a 51 point talent. |
| 12:53.29 | AbsoRayne | Thats how it currently feels. |
| 12:53.32 | cbreak | Drakhaon: I have only seen heuristics |
| 12:53.50 | Lopeppeppy | AbsoRayne, I am also abandoning my holy paladin, because they already did the equivalent. |
| 12:54.02 | Drakhaon | cbreak > ok.. and that is? |
| 12:54.08 | AbsoRayne | Lopeppeppy: That too. They took the entire class down with em. |
| 12:54.15 | AbsoRayne | Prot Palis are dying, too |
| 12:54.32 | Lopeppeppy | Drakhaon, look for CCBreaker, it does awesome. Or Tattle(r?) or Big Brother. |
| 12:54.36 | cbreak | Drakhaon: CCBreaker does it. I think it just parses the combat log for CC fades and reports the previous event on the same entity |
| 12:54.51 | AbsoRayne | Lopeppeppy: btw, did you get your Prowl bar to work? Sorry I didnt answer you last night |
| 12:54.55 | Drakhaon | Lopeppeppy > ok |
| 12:55.01 | cbreak | AbsoRayne: The world will not end. :) |
| 12:55.18 | Lopeppeppy | Yeah. Someone took a look at paladins and said "Screw that!" and killed us. They took a healing spec that was gimped in T6/T7 content, told us a joke, and walked away. |
| 12:55.48 | selckin | its a smart commercial move tho |
| 12:55.57 | selckin | ppl cry about paladin, paladins are used to being shafted |
| 12:56.00 | selckin | what shall we do |
| 12:56.06 | AbsoRayne | What disgusted me throughout the whole thing is that GC kept making jokes |
| 12:56.12 | Lopeppeppy | AbsoRayne, I finally did. I have decided that I still cannot groove on the way that Tuller does paging... but I got it to work until the frellin' zombies found me in AZSHARA and killed me. |
| 12:56.36 | Lopeppeppy | GC has also had some good positive things to say... but yeah, he's who I meant about telling us a joke and then walking away. |
| 12:56.39 | selckin | they should have made bubble do -90% damage, and hammer break on damage |
| 12:56.42 | selckin | fixed. |
| 12:56.55 | zenzio | at least it sounds like the zombie problem is starting to get under control |
| 12:57.06 | cbreak | I am not too bothered about paladins |
| 12:57.10 | Lopeppeppy | On some servers it is, zenzio. Some servers are still a bit wild. |
| 12:57.21 | cbreak | they will continue to exist like all the other classes |
| 12:57.31 | zenzio | Lopeppeppy: I mean in the sense that I hear rumors there's a "cure" coming in-game |
| 12:57.34 | AbsoRayne | Lopeppeppy: I actualy got bugged last night thanks to the zombies. I ran from some in IF, from the trade district. 3 mins later in the Forlorn cavern, I was still in combat, they were still chasing |
| 12:57.49 | cbreak | even with all of blizzards incompetence the problems shouldn't last |
| 12:58.06 | cbreak | GC? |
| 12:58.13 | zenzio | GhostCrawler IIRC |
| 12:58.15 | Lopeppeppy | Cure Coming Real Soon Now (tm). Of course there is, zen. LK in November. |
| 12:58.20 | cbreak | oh, that US forum guy |
| 12:58.25 | Lopeppeppy | GC = Ghostcrawler, yup. |
| 12:58.42 | zenzio | Blizzard could do the fun thing and transform all paladins to death knights |
| 12:58.46 | Lopeppeppy | AbsoRayne, I've seen the zombies climb walls and walk through them to get to me. I'm so excited that they are mages with blink. |
| 12:59.24 | AbsoRayne | Lopeppeppy: I personally enjoy the ones that agro the army of other ones attacking someone else to come at you |
| 12:59.29 | zenzio | peppy: the post on WoWInsider made me hope there can be a cure before release |
| 13:00.13 | Lopeppeppy | Oh, AbsoRayne, that's a hoot. 20 zombies kill my level 20 so much faster, after all. *rolls eyes* Totally unquestable anywhere I go, whatever level. |
| 13:00.16 | zenzio | considering how intensely a large proportion of the players are hating the event, it would be unwise to let it run for two+ more weeks |
| 13:00.54 | AbsoRayne | Lopeppeppy: Just do what I do. Join in after awhile, but be a dick about it. Go somewhere that isnt commonly infested and go crazy |
| 13:01.02 | AbsoRayne | I was infecting Crossroads last night |
| 13:01.31 | Lopeppeppy | I hear you, zenzio. I think it's likely in the next week... to coincide with the Halloween stuff I can't do because I get ganked in every inn I try to trick or treat in. :) |
| 13:01.48 | zenzio | AbsoRayne: because all the lowbies whining will make the high-level players stop being idiots? |
| 13:02.18 | AbsoRayne | because its a game, right? |
| 13:03.03 | zenzio | if that works for you, go ahead; in my book you just lowered yourself to the level of the griefers |
| 13:03.13 | AbsoRayne | Whatever |
| 13:03.20 | Lopeppeppy | Not only lower levels are unhappy, zen. Some of the higher level characters are peeved to not be able to go to an inn for their achievements too. |
| 13:03.42 | zenzio | Lopeppeppy: I know that, but I don't see how wrecking the lowbie areas will help |
| 13:04.02 | zenzio | it's for reasons like this that I play on PvE servers |
| 13:06.45 | *** join/#wowuidev leethal (n=leethal@kontoret-intern.hardware.no) |
| 13:07.16 | Lopeppeppy | zenzio, I play on an RP server. And PvE servers. And that's what it's like there too. |
| 13:07.34 | AbsoRayne | PvP servers are more fun |
| 13:07.34 | Lopeppeppy | It's not just the PvP servers that are going nuts with this, I promise. |
| 13:08.33 | AbsoRayne | Not doubting you at all |
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| 13:09.52 | AbsoRayne | Ive also personally found that its the lowbies personally getting the infection and running around griefing their own zones |
| 13:13.47 | Lopeppeppy | Yup, there's a good chunk of that as well. |
| 13:13.47 | *** join/#wowuidev Shirik (n=nospam@conspiracy/developer/Shirik) |
| 13:13.47 | *** mode/#WoWUIDev [+o Shirik] by ChanServ |
| 13:17.24 | Lopeppeppy | Morning, Shirik |
| 13:17.44 | zenzio | <Lopeppeppy> It's not just the PvP servers that are going nuts with this, I promise. <-- I know, and I mean that that's the problem. The event itself is fine, and I admit it'd make little sense if it adhered to PvE rulesets, but it would still be kinder to the customers |
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| 13:18.20 | Lopeppeppy | Well... even if I personally don't like it, I think it's a great event and they did do well with it. |
| 13:19.42 | *** join/#wowuidev Shirik|Ecole (n=nospam@conspiracy/developer/Shirik) |
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| 13:20.13 | Kalroth | I love zombiefying other people, especially those yelling in general |
| 13:20.46 | Kalroth | me and another guildie was hunting a paladin in Orgrimmar that kept bitching about it in general, it was good fun |
| 13:27.10 | |pez| | If I ever get a cat... I want it to be a cat like the landlord has. |
| 13:28.02 | |pez| | The cat is now neatly lying between me and the computer, for easy cuddleaccess. :P |
| 13:28.33 | cbreak | my cat used to sleep on my monitor |
| 13:28.35 | *** join/#wowuidev Shirik (i=9b1f45a5@gateway/web/ajax/mibbit.com/x-ed2ab10fae5dbc7b) |
| 13:28.45 | cbreak | now I have an LCD. he doesn't like it. |
| 13:28.57 | Lopeppeppy | RAWR! |
| 13:29.17 | Guest54633 | I failed to identify in time for the nickname Shirik |
| 13:29.24 | Guest54633 | stupid mibbit |
| 13:29.42 | |pez| | cbreak: this one is sleeping between my legs(I'm sitting in the sofa yogastyle). |
| 13:29.43 | Lopeppeppy | My cat has a special cat-bed next to my monitor, so that she can assist me with my every computing need. And when I'm downstairs with the laptop, she lays on the footrest to make sure I practice safe computing. |
| 13:29.51 | *** mode/#WoWUIDev [+o Shirik] by ChanServ |
| 13:29.53 | Lopeppeppy | Darned mibbit-ribbit |
| 13:30.10 | |pez| | and it has its head on my laptop keyboard. :P |
| 13:31.12 | Lopeppeppy | No kitty touchie computers. She learned that the hard way when she knocked a glass of soda onto my keyboard and then wore the other half of the can of soda... |
| 13:31.19 | Shirik | Why are there 3 shiriks online? |
| 13:32.10 | Lopeppeppy | To confuse me? |
| 13:32.13 | |pez| | Lopeppeppy, which ended on the kitty? |
| 13:33.07 | Lopeppeppy | |pez|, I splashed the other half of the can of soda at her after she dumped the glass onto the keyboard... so she got wet and sticky. |
| 13:33.19 | |pez| | aww, hehe |
| 13:34.12 | Lopeppeppy | I didn't have the canned air handy or the squirt bottle.... *gentle shrug* She ruined almost $100 worth of computer equipment. Having to wash soda off her fur was small compensation for losing my vintage Zboard. |
| 13:34.38 | cbreak | 100 |
| 13:34.46 | cbreak | sounds like apple price level :) |
| 13:35.06 | Lopeppeppy | Meh. It was my baby zboard! *cries* |
| 13:35.14 | Lopeppeppy | I might get a g15 just for the backlit love. |
| 13:35.38 | |pez| | I want a new keyboard. |
| 13:35.58 | |pez| | I love the logitech DiNovo Edge... but it's been kinda wonky on the boyfriends computer. |
| 13:36.33 | Lopeppeppy | Does he have updated drivers? |
| 13:39.45 | Shane|Work | i like my g15, i had a first gen and replaced it (ruined the same way, same cause even) and now have a second gen |
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| 13:43.04 | |pez| | Lopeppeppy: I think that was on his todo list for today, check for new drivers. |
| 13:43.15 | |pez| | the keyboard just sort of hangs sometimes, or isn't responsibe. |
| 13:45.24 | Drakhaon | can two frames have the same name if not in the same parent? |
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| 13:45.49 | *** part/#wowuidev Sangi_ (n=Sangi@72.242.44.146) |
| 13:46.06 | cbreak | names are global |
| 13:46.24 | |pez| | so, that's a no. |
| 13:46.31 | cbreak | I think you can give several frames the same name, but it probably causes lots of problems |
| 13:46.46 | Drakhaon | :P ok |
| 13:46.58 | cbreak | (not that I've tried it :) |
| 13:47.36 | Drakhaon | so.. I dynamicly create 10 frames, in these I want to create a frame to put an icon in.. how would I name these then? |
| 13:47.52 | |pez| | dynamicly ;P |
| 13:47.54 | Drakhaon | TNTThreat.unitFrame[I].portraitBox = CreateFrame("Frame", nil, TNTThreat) - would be wrong according to what you say |
| 13:48.00 | |pez| | framename1, framename2 |
| 13:49.58 | cbreak | why name them at all? |
| 13:50.14 | cbreak | you can just keep references to them |
| 13:50.46 | Drakhaon | ok? |
| 13:50.58 | Drakhaon | Im sort of (a lot) new to lua-creating frames etc |
| 13:53.08 | *** join/#wowuidev kneeki (n=chatzill@66.45.169.50) |
| 13:53.08 | cbreak | something like my_frames = {}; table.insert(my_frames, CreateFrame("Frame", nil, ParentFrame)) |
| 13:53.12 | Drakhaon | ah |
| 13:53.12 | kneeki | Morning everyone |
| 13:53.24 | cbreak | you can store them where you want |
| 13:53.56 | zenzio | heya kneeki |
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| 13:58.38 | castigo | prat for 3.0 is deadly bugging! |
| 13:58.48 | castigo | i clicked on "copychat" and froze my wow |
| 13:59.53 | sylvanaar | what version? |
| 14:00.55 | Shirik | Dear IT: I have a serious problem with the software you have installed at school. You installed emacs and not vim. Now my professor uses it all the time and laughs at my "inferior program." I demand you resolve this issue immediately. Thank you. |
| 14:01.06 | sylvanaar | lol |
| 14:02.18 | sylvanaar | castigo i have fixed that specific issue a few times. what version are you using? |
| 14:03.09 | Drakhaon | hm... will UnitClass("unit") result in "Death Knight" or "Deathknight"? |
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| 14:03.35 | sylvanaar | Yeah, isnt it both? |
| 14:03.45 | castigo | sylvanaar the version from curse |
| 14:03.53 | castigo | r706 |
| 14:03.58 | sylvanaar | castigo ? |
| 14:04.08 | castigo | which doesn't "hide" the normal sidebutton |
| 14:04.08 | sylvanaar | castigo 76? |
| 14:04.19 | castigo | now i was fiddling with the options and freezed wow again :p |
| 14:04.36 | Shane|Work | Drakhaon: returns 2 values, localized and DEATHKNIGHT |
| 14:04.38 | castigo | sorry that was ace version :P |
| 14:04.52 | castigo | ## Version: 3.0 (Alpha Version) $Revision: 82160 $ |
| 14:05.06 | castigo | just downloaded it from curse |
| 14:05.17 | Lopeppeppy | Dear Sheeple: I looked at your problem and it's not web related. You need to learn to use Microsoft Word to create a document before you can post it on the web. Do not put in another ticket calling me incompetent, because it will get bounced right back to the software trainer and not the web team. kthxbai |
| 14:05.39 | kneeki | Lopeppeppy: lol! |
| 14:05.50 | sylvanaar | castigo um i dunno, doesnt sound like the current version to me |
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| 14:06.20 | Drakhaon | Shane|Work > why all caps? when testing on a druid in my party I get "Druid" =) |
| 14:06.22 | castigo | sylvanaar -> curse -> download -> manual install :P |
| 14:06.23 | Lopeppeppy | kneeki, true story, someone I helped last week just put in a ticket to try to get around me and waste someone else's time. This ain't an IT fix, it's an RTFM/learnWord issue. |
| 14:06.24 | Shane|Work | castigo: current revs are <100 recently |
| 14:06.31 | Shirik | Lopeppeppy: :( |
| 14:06.35 | kneeki | lol I agree |
| 14:06.42 | castigo | r82160 | sylvanaar | 2008-09-28 22:26:34 -0400 (Sun, 28 Sep 2008) | 3 lines |
| 14:06.44 | Lopeppeppy | Shirik, that's why I love my sheeple... they do sometimes bite. |
| 14:06.53 | Shane|Work | Drakhaon: the second return value is english version in all caps, first return is localized, that's what you're seeing |
| 14:07.14 | Shirik | oh was that not directed at me? |
| 14:07.31 | sylvanaar | castigo i just downloaded it from curse myself, ## Version: Beta 11 |
| 14:07.34 | Drakhaon | Shane|Work > ah ok |
| 14:08.11 | sylvanaar | castigo same version that's on wowinterface |
| 14:08.22 | Lopeppeppy | It was an exchange to share and show you that people suck on Mondays. *much of love* |
| 14:08.53 | Lopeppeppy | And learn to programswap, boyo. You're young, be flexible! |
| 14:09.08 | castigo | sylvanaar wth did i clicked to download that one then ^^ |
| 14:09.12 | Lopeppeppy | TKFT graduated from an emacs program like.... 15 years ago! |
| 14:09.28 | sylvanaar | castigo i dont know |
| 14:09.52 | sylvanaar | castigo but that version is over a month old. so... |
| 14:10.06 | sylvanaar | or around a month |
| 14:10.31 | castigo | sorry bout that sylvanaar |
| 14:11.05 | Lopeppeppy | I see... Prat 3.0 Beta 11, r74 | sylvanaar | 2008-10-26 20:43:04 +0000 (Sun, 26 Oct 2008) up on Curse this morning. |
| 14:11.24 | Drakhaon | hmm.. whats wrong with this path: "Interface\\Icons\\UI-CharacterCreate-Classes_"..UnitClass(tmp[I])..".png" ? (UnitClass(tmp[I])) returns values like Hunter Druid etc |
| 14:11.51 | Pneumatus | shouldnt it be .tga? |
| 14:12.09 | Drakhaon | *DOH!* |
| 14:12.13 | Drakhaon | :P |
| 14:12.17 | kneeki | Drakhaon: .blp? |
| 14:12.19 | Shane|Work | some actually are png i think |
| 14:12.46 | Drakhaon | nah - its all tga format in .blp extensions or something =) |
| 14:15.03 | Drakhaon | nope - still no luck, tried .tga .blp and even no extension |
| 14:16.05 | zenzio | did you print out the resulting string to verify that it is what you expect it should be? |
| 14:16.24 | Drakhaon | yup |
| 14:16.36 | Drakhaon | "Interface\\Icons\\UI-CharacterCreate-Classes_Hunter" - in my case |
| 14:16.55 | Drakhaon | tho Im only grabbing the filename there from wowwiki so even not sure its the correct one |
| 14:16.56 | Pneumatus | i cant see that path in the mpqs |
| 14:17.15 | Drakhaon | Pneumatus > can you find the class-icons in there? :P |
| 14:17.16 | Pneumatus | theres Interface\\GLUES\\CharacterCreate\\UI-CharacterCreate-Classes though |
| 14:17.24 | Drakhaon | ah |
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| 14:17.46 | Drakhaon | and in there druid, hunter etc or a long weirder filename? |
| 14:17.46 | Pneumatus | Interface\\Glues\\CharacterCreate\\UI-CharacterCreate-Classes is the full texture of all classes |
| 14:18.06 | Pneumatus | dont think there are separate versions |
| 14:18.09 | Pneumatus | like with raid icons |
| 14:18.14 | Drakhaon | ah |
| 14:18.16 | Pneumatus | youll have to SetTexCoord() |
| 14:18.35 | Pneumatus | wait! |
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| 14:18.54 | Lopeppeppy | Morning Cogwheel. |
| 14:19.38 | Pneumatus | Drakhaon: CLASS_BUTTONS[select(2, UnitClass(unit))] will give you the 4 points you need to SetTexCoord with |
| 14:20.08 | Drakhaon | ok.. so I can do: SetTexCoord(CLASS_BUTTONS[select(2, UnitClass(unit))]) ? |
| 14:20.25 | Pneumatus | p1, p2, p3, p4 = CLASS_BUTTONS[select(2, UnitClass(unit))]; frame:SetTexture("Interface\\Glues\\CharacterCreate\\UI-CharacterCreate-Classes"); frame:SetTexCoord(p1, p2, p3, p4) |
| 14:20.27 | Pneumatus | or something like that |
| 14:20.52 | Pneumatus | i dunno if SetTexCoord will let you pass a table |
| 14:22.08 | Drakhaon | I'll do it your way, it looks safer |
| 14:22.21 | Pneumatus | dunno, anyway, but thats how you do it :) |
| 14:24.31 | Drakhaon | omw to try :P |
| 14:24.44 | Pneumatus | oh, you might have to assign it to one variable, then reference each table index |
| 14:24.58 | castigo | sylvanaar how do u profile your addons? Cpu usage wise i mean |
| 14:25.24 | Pneumatus | t = CLASS_BUTTONS[] then settex(t[1], t[2], t[3], t[4]) |
| 14:26.05 | Pneumatus | as it returns a table, not multiple results |
| 14:26.34 | Pneumatus | could probably do it on 1 line with unpack() |
| 14:26.43 | Drakhaon | ah |
| 14:27.21 | Drakhaon | so p = CLASS_BUTTONS[select(2, UnitClass(tmp[I]))] and then p[1] etc |
| 14:27.54 | sylvanaar | castigo well, i used to use expo. currently im in search of a newer tool. |
| 14:28.04 | Pneumatus | frame:SetTexCoord(unpack(CLASS_BUTTONS[select(2, UnitClass(tmp[I]))])) |
| 14:28.07 | Pneumatus | i reckon |
| 14:28.08 | Drakhaon | Pneumatus > it works =) |
| 14:28.36 | Drakhaon | is ther a similiar thing for beasts? :D |
| 14:28.39 | Drakhaon | there* |
| 14:28.47 | *** join/#wowuidev Lyn (i=Lyn@195.37.117.14) |
| 14:28.52 | sylvanaar | castigo why? |
| 14:29.03 | Pneumatus | you mean like all the npc creature type icons? |
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| 14:29.40 | Drakhaon | well - Im using the icons for a threatmeter - so now I have a class icon next to each name in the list |
| 14:29.50 | Drakhaon | would be a bonus if I also could have one for each pet |
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| 14:30.04 | Drakhaon | if not I'll just pick a spellicon from hunters and use that |
| 14:30.21 | Pneumatus | i think youll need special cases for pets |
| 14:30.23 | Wikwocket | Anyone know if the UIDropDownMenu_Initialize taint issues may be fixed in 3.0.3 or sometime? |
| 14:30.39 | Drakhaon | Pneumatus > yea - sounds easier too - just take the Bestial Wrath spell icon |
| 14:30.58 | Pneumatus | and track demons for warlock pets :P |
| 14:31.09 | Drakhaon | yeaps |
| 14:31.22 | castigo | sylvanaar copy chat bug is fixed btw :P now just few random bugs |
| 14:31.24 | castigo | but much better |
| 14:32.05 | Drakhaon | lol :P my 3yr old son is in his mom's lap while she's at the computer |
| 14:32.39 | Pneumatus | getting ganked while fishing in orgrimmar makes me sad :< |
| 14:32.39 | Drakhaon | he now plugged in an old laptop mouse (small thing) into the not-connected floppy (its in the case, just not plugged in) and happily shouted "I have a mouse too!" |
| 14:32.52 | castigo | Drakhaon bless u, mine is running around the kitchen yelling |
| 14:33.54 | Drakhaon | castigo > well.. Im actually worried about my kid :P he cant start the flash game I made for him, restart the same game and operate the game on his own, he can also "use" the dig. camera so he runs around and takes photos of everything - he knows that he is taking photos and he do aim for a good pic |
| 14:34.01 | Drakhaon | even tho most of them are blurred |
| 14:34.08 | Drakhaon | he can start** |
| 14:35.12 | Drakhaon | is there a HasPet function? :P |
| 14:35.27 | Drakhaon | cause UnitName(strUnit.."pet") returns an error |
| 14:35.44 | Drakhaon | strUnit can be any valid unitID - raid1 party3 etc |
| 14:36.10 | Pneumatus | you need to do some dickery with "party1" etc |
| 14:36.18 | Pneumatus | its partypet1, not party1pet |
| 14:36.31 | Drakhaon | so raidpet1 aswell? |
| 14:36.41 | Wikwocket | Yup |
| 14:36.43 | Pneumatus | yeh |
| 14:36.48 | Drakhaon | ah |
| 14:37.29 | Drakhaon | so UnitName("raidpet40") is valid even if the unit doesnt exist? |
| 14:38.30 | Pneumatus | unitname wil just return nil, nil if the unit isnt known, or doesnt exist |
| 14:38.35 | Pneumatus | iirc |
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| 14:38.58 | malreth | holy crap! hour and a half on the bus this morning! |
| 14:39.38 | malreth | frikkin accident shut down the mopac/35th street exit -- the one the bus needed |
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| 14:43.48 | Drakhaon | Pneumatus > do elementars and that shadow thing from priests works as pets (as can be called with raidpetNumber |
| 14:43.59 | Pneumatus | uhuh |
| 14:44.03 | Pneumatus | and ghost wolves now |
| 14:44.06 | Drakhaon | ok |
| 14:44.20 | Pneumatus | although you can only ever get info on 1 ghost wolf, not both afaik |
| 14:44.30 | Drakhaon | so they count as one pet |
| 14:44.38 | Pneumatus | well, not really |
| 14:44.50 | Pneumatus | they are 2 pets, but you can only ever have a unitframe for one of them |
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| 14:45.11 | Drakhaon | ok - so the game system as far as it goes for me - its one pet =) |
| 14:45.37 | Drakhaon | then I need to find.. uhm.. 4 icons.. hunter pet, priest pet, shaman pet, warlock pet |
| 14:45.41 | Drakhaon | oh - and mage pet.. 5 icons |
| 14:46.35 | Drakhaon | maybe it would be easier to just use the PortraitTexture :D |
| 14:47.22 | Lopeppeppy | Maybe |
| 14:47.33 | Pneumatus | that could work just as well |
| 14:48.31 | Drakhaon | tho the icons are 16x16 so prolly wouldnt look too good |
| 14:49.00 | Drakhaon | but it would make it more fun for demon and hunter pets since they can be different kinds |
| 14:49.12 | Drakhaon | oh well - I'll just set it with 5 different |
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| 14:53.35 | Drakhaon | wait.. druid trees... pets? |
| 14:53.47 | Wikwocket | Treants |
| 14:53.59 | Wikwocket | Not sure if they have a health bar |
| 14:54.22 | Drakhaon | they can be killed |
| 14:54.22 | jnwhiteh | they do |
| 14:54.41 | Drakhaon | but do they count as pets :P |
| 14:54.58 | Drakhaon | bah.. I'll let them follow with the shaman elementars just in case |
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| 14:56.16 | Drakhaon | Im gonna guess both mage and shaman pets are counted as elementars |
| 14:56.21 | Drakhaon | and priests are beasts |
| 14:57.01 | Lopeppeppy | Rawr. |
| 14:57.40 | Drakhaon | :P |
| 14:57.56 | Drakhaon | meaning - lazy me only needed 3 icons - beast, elementar and demon' |
| 14:58.11 | malreth | I'm no longer frost spec so i don't know the answer, but did Blizzard change Icy Veins so that it doesn't fall through like it used to when used in a macro? |
| 14:58.48 | malreth | I know combustion still falls through |
| 14:59.59 | Wikwocket | I can tell you if a Shadowfiend is a beast in a sec |
| 15:00.58 | Drakhaon | awsome |
| 15:02.28 | Pneumatus | Drakhaon: shadowfiends are undead iirc |
| 15:05.40 | Wikwocket | Shadowfiends are not beasts (or undead) |
| 15:05.44 | Wikwocket | They are not classified |
| 15:06.06 | Wikwocket | This seems to confirm it as well: http://www.wowhead.com/?npc=19668 |
| 15:06.50 | castigo | what addon gives u the /rl command? |
| 15:07.03 | haste | tons |
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| 15:07.49 | |Jelly| | *insert Ace mod here* |
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| 15:09.05 | kneeki | DevTools gives you the /reload command, I like that one a lot |
| 15:09.27 | Elkano | /console reloadui ? |
| 15:10.19 | Shane|Work | it's really simple to do one yourself, too |
| 15:11.06 | castigo | kneeki i love /rl |
| 15:11.20 | jnwhiteh | SLASH_RELOAD1 = "/reload"; SLASH_RELOAD2 = "/rl"; SlashCmdList["RELOAD"] = function() ConsoleExec("reloadui") end |
| 15:11.23 | castigo | Shane|Work nah i got it already, i just wondered which one was it |
| 15:11.48 | castigo | tho i've a neat question |
| 15:12.00 | castigo | why the frame has to be "BIGGER" than a texture or a button inside the frame itself? |
| 15:12.04 | castigo | i make the the same size |
| 15:12.17 | castigo | no special scaling, SetAllPoints(parentFrame) |
| 15:12.24 | castigo | and neverthless it's "smaller" |
| 15:12.25 | castigo | why? |
| 15:13.35 | *** join/#wowuidev Seerah (n=Ryan_L@adsl-177-38-28.mem.bellsouth.net) |
| 15:13.35 | *** mode/#WoWUIDev [+o Seerah] by ChanServ |
| 15:14.03 | castigo | i was never bothered by it up to now, if i clamp a frame to the screen |
| 15:14.15 | castigo | then i can't put my "stuff" in the corners due to that |
| 15:19.10 | Pneumatus | is there a way to remove an element of a table by value without pairs()ing over it to find the index? |
| 15:19.54 | Wikwocket | tablename["value"] = nil |
| 15:20.15 | Shane|Work | not sure that's what he meant, Wikwocket |
| 15:20.29 | Shane|Work | i was thinking { 1 = "blue", 2 = "red" } |
| 15:20.36 | Wikwocket | Ah, I see |
| 15:20.38 | Industrial | he said pairs not ipairs |
| 15:20.39 | Shane|Work | he wants to be able to remove "red" without finding the index |
| 15:20.49 | Industrial | no, you cant |
| 15:21.25 | castigo | how do i disable a bar in dominos? |
| 15:21.36 | Pneumatus | yeh, the latter, sorry :P |
| 15:21.39 | Industrial | hover over it and read the text castigo |
| 15:21.52 | Industrial | in edit mode, ofc |
| 15:22.11 | |Jelly| | Peppy: <3333333 |
| 15:22.15 | castigo | :P |
| 15:22.21 | Industrial | >_> |
| 15:23.52 | Lopeppeppy | Morning, Jelly-dear |
| 15:25.35 | *** join/#wowuidev Anaral (n=Anaral@ip68-107-151-223.hr.hr.cox.net) |
| 15:26.29 | Drakhaon | Wikwocket > so you got nil when doing UnitCreatureType on it? (fleshbeast) |
| 15:26.36 | Drakhaon | shadowfiend** |
| 15:28.38 | Wikwocket | The tooltip di not have any type info |
| 15:28.39 | malreth | Fleshbeast... reminds me of one of my ex girlfriends |
| 15:29.28 | Drakhaon | ok |
| 15:29.29 | Industrial | ew |
| 15:29.43 | Drakhaon | I guess I could verify by checking with a priest and do a UnitCreatureType("unit") |
| 15:29.58 | Industrial | Drakhaon: pastey.net |
| 15:30.56 | castigo | anyone here is dominos developer apart from tuller that is offline? |
| 15:31.08 | Nom- | heh lolret nerfed into the ground |
| 15:31.09 | Nom- | *sigh* |
| 15:31.17 | Wikwocket | Drakhaon: I can check that function later just not at the moment |
| 15:31.18 | Industrial | castigo: whats the problem (no im not) |
| 15:31.49 | Seerah | Tuller is the only developer of dominos |
| 15:31.53 | Seerah | but what's up? |
| 15:32.02 | castigo | just wanted to know if there is a way of having "onebag" as in bartender4 |
| 15:32.28 | Industrial | f its not apparent then probably not. |
| 15:32.37 | malreth | when you right click on the bag bar in dominos, what options does it have? |
| 15:32.43 | Seerah | I don't remember if that's planned or not. You can check the dominos thread on wowace if you want |
| 15:32.58 | Seerah | it doesn't collapse to one atm |
| 15:33.07 | Seerah | but you could hide until mouseover, castigo |
| 15:33.37 | malreth | or just hide it entirely and press B to open your inventory |
| 15:33.49 | Seerah | *nod* |
| 15:33.57 | castigo | i like to have one bag shown |
| 15:34.00 | Seerah | that's what I do |
| 15:34.01 | castigo | makes me feel at home! |
| 15:34.02 | castigo | :P |
| 15:34.26 | *** part/#wowuidev Lopeppeppy (n=Lopeppep@141.222.30.131) |
| 15:36.47 | Industrial | i just press the bag button to open my bags |
| 15:42.55 | *** join/#wowuidev kaiden (n=kaiden@c-71-231-115-214.hsd1.wa.comcast.net) |
| 15:53.04 | Shirik|Ecole | WOW |
| 15:53.07 | Shirik|Ecole | Have I been on this whole time? |
| 15:53.11 | malreth | sigh... http://forums.worldofwarcraft.com/thread.html?topicId=11829508902&pageNo=1&sid=1#1 |
| 15:53.20 | Shirik|Ecole | My laptop has been on, in my bag, for the last 3 hours |
| 15:53.44 | Shirik|Ecole | It's like a personal heater now :) |
| 15:54.07 | Shirik|Ecole | Fisker-, do you go to my school? |
| 15:54.17 | Shirik|Ecole | I'm looking at a sign right now in front of me in the cafeteria, and it says on it "Why so serious?" |
| 15:54.56 | Fisker- | it would be a pretty long commute |
| 15:57.04 | *** join/#wowuidev smcn (i=smcn@75-164-154-84.ptld.qwest.net) |
| 16:00.49 | Drakhaon | hmm.. how do I replace a already set texture? |
| 16:01.32 | cog|work | SetTexture... |
| 16:01.47 | Drakhaon | ok.. then its something else that bugs |
| 16:01.48 | malreth | cog|work: why do people keep insisting that they're smarter than us? |
| 16:02.03 | cog|work | ~comfort malreth |
| 16:02.04 | purl | There, there, malreth. It's OK. I'm here for you. |
| 16:04.42 | kneeki | Captain Skyshatter is a cheating bitch. |
| 16:06.23 | Drakhaon | is there a method to find out who in the raid is maintank? |
| 16:07.19 | Wikwocket | Speaking of that thread Cog and mareth, was an ETA given for fixes for the UIDropDownMenu taint issues? |
| 16:07.35 | Stanzilla | 3.0.3 imo |
| 16:07.35 | Wikwocket | Or is there a good workaround for long dropdown menus? |
| 16:08.57 | cog|work | i've never used dropdown menus so i haven't really been paying close attention |
| 16:10.19 | Wikwocket | Drakhaon: http://wowprogramming.com/docs/api/GetPartyAssignment |
| 16:10.57 | *** join/#wowuidev malreth (n=triti@w-central-233-216.public.utexas.edu) |
| 16:12.39 | *** join/#wowuidev kagaro (n=washu@12.38.10.178) |
| 16:17.12 | *** join/#wowuidev Lopeppeppy (n=Lopeppep@141.222.30.131) |
| 16:17.12 | *** mode/#WoWUIDev [+v Lopeppeppy] by ChanServ |
| 16:20.34 | *** join/#wowuidev Lyn (n=Lyn@Lcad1.l.pppool.de) |
| 16:23.46 | Drakhaon | now.. what should I name my addon :P |
| 16:24.06 | *** join/#wowuidev Shirik (i=9b1f447b@conspiracy/developer/Shirik) |
| 16:24.06 | *** mode/#WoWUIDev [+o Shirik] by ChanServ |
| 16:24.33 | Lopeppeppy | Purple Rain |
| 16:24.52 | Drakhaon | :P |
| 16:25.19 | Drakhaon | I wish I had made 3 addons instead of one.. |
| 16:25.47 | Drakhaon | now its one addon with: Auto repair and auto sell trash, easy raidtargeting and a threatmeter |
| 16:26.30 | Lopeppeppy | Very kludgy. Why not break them up? |
| 16:26.35 | malreth | yes |
| 16:26.58 | malreth | addons that overreach make baby tekkub cry |
| 16:27.24 | Drakhaon | Its easy to break them up so I might do it |
| 16:27.28 | krka | perhaps Kitchensink is a good name |
| 16:27.33 | Drakhaon | they all have their own lua file and xml if needed |
| 16:27.59 | *** join/#wowuidev foxlit (n=foxlit@0x573e6bae.alb2nxx18.dynamic.dsl.tele.dk) |
| 16:29.09 | foxlit | But hey, a cookie! What have I done to deserve one? :) |
| 16:29.50 | malreth | because you're a smart cookie |
| 16:29.52 | Lopeppeppy | and hey, I do the cookies around here! |
| 16:30.16 | malreth | NOT ANYMORE SISTER |
| 16:30.24 | Lopeppeppy | It's war! |
| 16:31.09 | malreth | OWWWWW!!!!! I accidentally pulled out some of my arm hair doing that |
| 16:31.16 | *** part/#wowuidev Shane|Work (n=mellerfa@64-199-29-162.ip.mcleodusa.net) |
| 16:31.26 | Lopeppeppy | Doofus. Don't get it in the cookies. |
| 16:32.09 | Lopeppeppy | Boring. |
| 16:32.30 | malreth | *gasp* |
| 16:32.49 | Shirik | soon I shall only need one login, thank god |
| 16:33.03 | Lopeppeppy | Yay, Shirik! |
| 16:33.47 | sacarasc | use a bouncer or something, Shirik ;p |
| 16:34.01 | *** join/#wowuidev Malgayne (n=caseymon@cpe-24-30-145-15.san.res.rr.com) |
| 16:34.09 | Lopeppeppy | Oh, piping doesn't save you, boyo |
| 16:34.13 | *** mode/#WoWUIDev [+v Malgayne] by ChanServ |
| 16:34.30 | *** part/#wowuidev Malgayne (n=caseymon@cpe-24-30-145-15.san.res.rr.com) |
| 16:34.58 | malreth | what if they're lemon cream cheese spritz cookies? |
| 16:35.10 | Lopeppeppy | Eeew. |
| 16:35.19 | Lopeppeppy | Cream cheese? That's for old ladies to eat with celery |
| 16:35.28 | Shirik | sacarasc: Working on it :) |
| 16:35.41 | malreth | oooh.... i'll get you for that! |
| 16:35.57 | Lopeppeppy | And my little dog too. |
| 16:36.00 | Lopeppeppy | If I had one. |
| 16:36.02 | Lopeppeppy | If I were scared. |
| 16:36.03 | Lopeppeppy | :P |
| 16:37.36 | Lopeppeppy | Not until May, pretty boy. |
| 16:38.07 | *** join/#wowuidev cncfanatics (n=cncfanat@WoWUIDev/cncfanatics) |
| 16:38.07 | malreth | no, they're also made for christmas |
| 16:38.31 | Lopeppeppy | Blarch. |
| 16:38.53 | malreth | AAAAARRRRGGH!!! |
| 16:38.59 | malreth | I can't compete with you! |
| 16:39.03 | Lopeppeppy | Nope. |
| 16:39.06 | Lopeppeppy | I wins. |
| 16:39.34 | malreth | i should stay true to myself |
| 16:39.41 | malreth | and bake from the heart |
| 16:39.44 | malreth | MY heart |
| 16:39.49 | Lopeppeppy | Oooh. If you can create a recipe for lemon snickerdoodles, I'll trade you the secret Sprocket Cookies recipe. |
| 16:40.27 | Lopeppeppy | But are they lemony good? |
| 16:41.01 | malreth | hmm... that should be easy... just add a teaspoon of lemon zest and a touch of extract, i figure |
| 16:41.17 | Lopeppeppy | Do snickerdoodles have molasses in them? |
| 16:41.25 | malreth | hmm... but that throws off the pH |
| 16:41.27 | Drakhaon | where is this apothecary Chaney located? |
| 16:42.02 | malreth | adding molasses lowers the pH even more |
| 16:42.22 | Lopeppeppy | No. Is there originally molasses in the basic snickerdoodle recipe, is what I'm asking. |
| 16:42.30 | malreth | that means i leave out the cream of tartar |
| 16:42.40 | malreth | no molasses in my recipe |
| 16:43.03 | Lopeppeppy | Okay. I can't remember the recipe myself, but think they're basically sugar cookies in concept? |
| 16:43.05 | Nom- | Anyone here good with VBA macros in Excel ? |
| 16:43.18 | malreth | Lopeppeppy: to some degree, yes. |
| 16:43.24 | Nom- | I'm trying to remember how to find out the cell currently being calculated so i can find it's rown number |
| 16:43.32 | Nom- | *row number |
| 16:44.27 | Lopeppeppy | You should be able to add lemon oil without screwing up the recipe too much, and then use the zest on top with a glaze to punch it around. |
| 16:45.02 | *** join/#wowuidev Drayeah (i=5065af6a@gateway/web/ajax/mibbit.com/x-8e7ec0c36072cd56) |
| 16:45.07 | malreth | ah, but i don't think you should glaze snickerdoodles. the hallmark of the cookie is the crackled broken tops |
| 16:45.09 | *** join/#wowuidev Chompers (n=Chompers@cpc1-cove9-0-0-cust541.brhm.cable.ntl.com) |
| 16:45.31 | Lopeppeppy | If you do a very delicate wash you could get away with it. Not like frosting, a transparent glaze. |
| 16:45.39 | malreth | hmm... maybe |
| 16:45.58 | malreth | we'd bake beautiful cookies together, Peppy |
| 16:45.59 | Wikwocket | Nom-: Are you using Worksheet_Calculate()? |
| 16:46.23 | malreth | gotta move... later |
| 16:46.31 | Wikwocket | If you use Worksheet_Change() it provides the Target argument, but Calculate doesn't |
| 16:49.57 | *** join/#wowuidev Tristanian (n=Tristani@adsl53-133.kln.forthnet.gr) |
| 16:51.35 | Nom- | hmm well i'm writing a function in VBA |
| 16:51.44 | Nom- | and in order for my function to work, i need to know the cell which is being calculated :( |
| 16:52.14 | Nom- | ActiveCell doesn't work :( |
| 16:55.34 | *** join/#wowuidev Dashkal (n=dashkal@WoWUIDev/Nexus/dashkal) |
| 16:55.57 | Dashkal | Just in case anybody missed it (I know I'm late to the game) the zombies end at noon PST (about 2 hours from now) http://blue.mmo-champion.com/1/11829528491-regarding-the-zombie-plague.html |
| 16:56.12 | Lopeppeppy | Neat. |
| 16:56.18 | Lopeppeppy | I'm sorry to have missed so much of it, but hey. |
| 16:57.08 | Dashkal | If you want to nom some brains, now would be the time :p |
| 16:58.32 | *** join/#wowuidev malreth (n=triti@w-central-233-216.public.utexas.edu) |
| 16:59.07 | *** join/#wowuidev Lunessa (n=Lunessa@WoWUIDev/Lunessa) |
| 17:00.01 | Lunessa | station. |
| 17:00.13 | malreth | greetings, brother! |
| 17:00.23 | Lunessa | 'sup? |
| 17:00.38 | malreth | recovering from last week's madness |
| 17:00.40 | *** join/#wowuidev [dRaCo] (n=drc@p5B22A5E6.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) |
| 17:00.59 | malreth | our group has a policy against patching labs on fridays |
| 17:01.05 | Lunessa | I've got to patch all my VMs but other than that I think I'm done. |
| 17:01.13 | malreth | since if we screw up, it means a weekend call |
| 17:01.42 | malreth | we rarely ever mess up... but i always worry |
| 17:01.44 | Lunessa | Yeah, I hear that. And I can't imagine any of your guys working Sat/Sun. :P |
| 17:02.02 | malreth | everything looks good so far. |
| 17:03.16 | malreth | i haven't talked to the security office today.. so i don't know how big the attack is, if there's even one at all |
| 17:03.48 | malreth | they'll mostly bounce off the border IDS |
| 17:03.59 | Drakhaon | question of curiosity: what does CT stand for in CTMod? |
| 17:04.14 | malreth | the developer's initials |
| 17:04.18 | malreth | or is it developers' |
| 17:04.24 | Drakhaon | ah |
| 17:04.33 | malreth | if i recall correctly |
| 17:04.39 | malreth | i'm likely wrong |
| 17:04.44 | Cairenn|afk | you aren't |
| 17:04.51 | malreth | I'M NEVER WRONG |
| 17:05.07 | Drakhaon | hmm.. wont sound as nice for me tho.. "DM" |
| 17:05.43 | malreth | Drakhaon: you need a name that is suitable for this web 2.0 era |
| 17:06.07 | Drakhaon | yea =) |
| 17:06.08 | malreth | i recommend taking an -er verb and ending it with just -r instead |
| 17:06.33 | Drakhaon | -er verb.. hmm.. Refr? :D |
| 17:06.45 | malreth | it doesn't sing, Drakhaon |
| 17:07.01 | malreth | ketchup -> ketchuper -> ketchupr |
| 17:07.15 | Drakhaon | ah.. make an -er verb from something random :D |
| 17:08.03 | Drakhaon | wonder what web 3.0 will bring us |
| 17:08.13 | malreth | oh, that's easy |
| 17:08.19 | malreth | words spelled backwards |
| 17:08.23 | *** join/#wowuidev Dewin (n=Daniel@c-71-193-237-252.hsd1.or.comcast.net) |
| 17:08.51 | malreth | it'll be made easier with the .www TLD |
| 17:09.05 | Wikwocket | I am in favor of names that are evocative of what the mod does |
| 17:09.14 | Amarande | Heya Cairenn :) |
| 17:09.17 | Amarande | so, how are things in zombie world |
| 17:09.29 | malreth | moc.sseleriw-tta.www |
| 17:09.33 | Wikwocket | Names like CT or Cosmos are great for compilations, but my mods are named things like CCBreakWarner for a reason :P |
| 17:09.42 | Cairenn | hi Amarande |
| 17:09.46 | Amarande | I can't use my initials for software development, apparently they're trademarked |
| 17:10.15 | Amarande | How's things? |
| 17:14.15 | Cairenn | things are good, you? |
| 17:15.14 | Amarande | Pretty good, slept in again today |
| 17:15.27 | Amarande | thinking of seeing what the zombies are like now |
| 17:15.35 | Drakhaon | Wikwocket > its the compilation name Im working on :P the "suffix" will be very informative |
| 17:15.46 | Drakhaon | say I go with DM - then it will be DMThreatMeter |
| 17:15.52 | malreth | Kyleigh finally fell to the zombies yesterday |
| 17:15.59 | malreth | couldn't get to a healer in time |
| 17:15.59 | Wikwocket | That works, lots of people release mods like that |
| 17:16.01 | malreth | :( |
| 17:16.03 | Amarande | Alvaerin has still remained untouched |
| 17:16.26 | malreth | she's too eager to light them up like candles |
| 17:16.30 | Wikwocket | Just, whenever I see DM I think of DangerMouse. Your mileage may vary. |
| 17:16.37 | Cairenn | hahhahaa |
| 17:16.42 | Cairenn | errr, sorry |
| 17:16.43 | Drakhaon | so atm I have 3 addons - which is why I want a compilation name =) |
| 17:17.00 | Drakhaon | Wikwocket > same here - it goes on TV during the morning and I have kids who watches it :P |
| 17:17.01 | Amarande | AoD: "This is my BOOMstick!" |
| 17:17.11 | Amarande | WoW: "This is my EPIC FLYING MOUNT, Sayonara zombies!" |
| 17:17.17 | Lunessa | Don't try to use the Inscription Trainer/Supplier in Stormwind during the invasion. It's an exercise it futility. |
| 17:17.33 | haste | when I see DM I thing of deathmatch |
| 17:17.37 | malreth | on silver hand, shattrath is a wasteland |
| 17:17.42 | Amarande | Lunessa, do they keep inscribing on your head with Scourge-infected ink? :) |
| 17:17.47 | haste | but that's how it is with most "acronyms" |
| 17:18.03 | Amarande | DM means a few zillion different things to me, all of them important |
| 17:18.07 | Lunessa | You spend a lot of time dead. Or zombie-fied and then dead. |
| 17:18.18 | *** join/#wowuidev leethal (n=leethal@cm-84.215.134.225.getinternet.no) |
| 17:18.31 | malreth | after Kyleigh went zombie once, there was pretty much no point in holding back |
| 17:18.44 | malreth | she went to IF and decided to eat all the people that annoyed her |
| 17:18.51 | malreth | like that gnome pie vendor guy |
| 17:18.59 | malreth | sraaz |
| 17:19.14 | malreth | he was as tasty as the pies he sells |
| 17:19.54 | malreth | i wish you could kill player zombies in shattrath, however |
| 17:20.03 | malreth | it's really annoying that you can't |
| 17:20.26 | Amarande | yeah, people are blaming Shattrath's sanctuary status for at least half the total QQ about the world event |
| 17:20.48 | Dashkal | Sadly you _still_ couldn't eat the little shit with the girl's dolly |
| 17:21.01 | malreth | Dashkal: can't kill children in video games |
| 17:21.11 | malreth | not with a T rating |
| 17:21.14 | Dashkal | malreth: Bioshock :p |
| 17:21.16 | Dashkal | ahh |
| 17:21.25 | Dashkal | And I never expected I would be able to. Just wanted to :p |
| 17:21.28 | Amarande | because unlike anywhere else, there's no way to prevent griefers from infecting whatever NPCs they damn well want to |
| 17:21.37 | Amarande | malreth: "Ultima" |
| 17:21.55 | malreth | Ultima was back before the ESRB, isn't it? |
| 17:21.55 | Dashkal | Amarande: That's why I did most of my asshattery in major cities. At least they could kill me in retaliation |
| 17:21.56 | Wikwocket | Abolish Disease FTW |
| 17:21.59 | Amarande | EVERY Ultima game from ... V I think it is, through IX had some or other situation where you could (and were indeed expected to) kill kids |
| 17:22.33 | Amarande | malreth: most of them |
| 17:22.36 | Amarande | the ones worth playing, anyway |
| 17:22.40 | malreth | true |
| 17:22.44 | *** join/#wowuidev Shane|Work (n=mellerfa@64-199-29-162.ip.mcleodusa.net) |
| 17:22.58 | malreth | still, my point stands |
| 17:23.58 | Amarande | IX was rated Mature, but it was more like M for Mediocre |
| 17:24.26 | malreth | anyways, that's why the SW boss was the archbishop instead of the boy king |
| 17:24.50 | Amarande | Actually, I think the whole kid killing thing in Ultima started by accident |
| 17:25.05 | Amarande | they had designed a room in Hythloth level 7 in Ultima V that was prison cells filled with kids |
| 17:25.13 | Amarande | well ... at that point, it wasn't possible to have friendlies in a dungeon room ... |
| 17:25.50 | Amarande | but, the gaming community being the laid-back fun-loving group it was back then, and Garriott being practically a paragon of that gaming attitude, they left the room in |
| 17:26.10 | Amarande | apparently the invulnerable-children thing is more of a European thing than an American one |
| 17:26.30 | Amarande | since in several EU carebear countries it's illegal to allow players to kill kids in a video game |
| 17:26.34 | malreth | hmm... could be |
| 17:26.46 | malreth | probably the french |
| 17:26.59 | malreth | they'll give cigarettes to babies but we're not allowed to kill them |
| 17:27.25 | Amarande | heh, unlike here where an 18 year old is old enough to die for his country in Iraq, but not old enough to enjoy the simple pleasure of a beer |
| 17:27.41 | Lunessa | The French? Are you kidding me? They arm suburbanites with Molotovs. But they still can't fight a war. |
| 17:28.16 | Amarande | (though I've heard that in the Army under-21's drink beer pretty often anyway :P) |
| 17:28.18 | malreth | Lunessa: that's because guillotines aren't very mobile |
| 17:28.37 | ScytheBlade1 | lol - http://forums.worldofwarcraft.com/thread.html?topicId=11694179879&pageNo=17&sid=1#339 |
| 17:28.38 | malreth | ever try to get your enemy to stand still long enough for one of those things? |
| 17:28.41 | Lunessa | Amarande: Point of contention. In the event of conscription, american soldiers are allowed to drink once they're out of basic. :P |
| 17:29.22 | Lunessa | SBO... We should take up a collection and send him something better than GIN. |
| 17:29.28 | ScytheBlade1 | ha |
| 17:29.34 | ScytheBlade1 | He could probably use it. |
| 17:29.38 | malreth | brandy |
| 17:30.15 | malreth | by that, i mean my ex girlfriend, brandy |
| 17:30.18 | ScytheBlade1 | lol |
| 17:30.22 | malreth | she had this thing she'd do with her hips |
| 17:30.58 | Nom- | epic fail |
| 17:31.11 | foxlit | You know, the "TO THE GROUND BABY." just makes GC more awesome <3 |
| 17:31.13 | Nom- | new ret pally oom in 65 seconds |
| 17:31.22 | Redguard | good |
| 17:31.30 | Redguard | old one OOM'ed in about 30 |
| 17:31.36 | Redguard | 65 is twice what they are used to |
| 17:31.40 | Hirsute | Amarande: regarding not old enough for beer: There's fairly reliable research that indicates that is, infact, the case. Rates of Alcoholism are almost twice for those who started drinking before 20 than they are for those who start drinking after. |
| 17:32.03 | Nom- | lol |
| 17:32.15 | malreth | Hirsute: there's confounding issues with that |
| 17:32.25 | Nom- | it's a bit of a kick in the pants, when our yard stick for oomness is enhance shaman |
| 17:32.40 | malreth | since currently the "taboo" status of underage drinking may cause people to actually drink more than they normally would |
| 17:33.19 | Hirsute | malreth: Except the *amount* one drinks early on is not correlated with the difficulty they have stopping later. |
| 17:33.30 | Hirsute | So that argument doesn't really stand up. |
| 17:33.31 | Lunessa | Nom-: As an enhancement shaman I'm rarely OOM |
| 17:33.50 | malreth | based on my made up statement, yours is refuted too |
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| 17:34.06 | malreth | :) |
| 17:34.29 | Hirsute | Perhaps, but mine aren't made up. |
| 17:34.35 | Gnarfoz | did /targetexact change to not target dead enemies? |
| 17:34.35 | Nom- | Lunessa: Exactly... you can easily last say 4 minutes on a boss fight without using mana pots, right ? |
| 17:34.50 | Shirik | sigh |
| 17:34.54 | Shirik | I can't go to the public school labs anymore |
| 17:35.02 | Shirik | I get instantly hounded by students needing help from my classes, lol |
| 17:35.07 | Lunessa | I don't know. I haven't fought anything that lasted more than 2.5 minutes since the patch. |
| 17:35.11 | foxlit | Hm, they broke something with the forums |
| 17:35.19 | malreth | I'm lucky if i can last more than 4 minutes nowadays |
| 17:35.19 | Lunessa | And in beta, NOTHING lasted 2.5+ mins. |
| 17:35.24 | Hirsute | Shirik: Heh. Time for seclusion. |
| 17:35.33 | foxlit | thread rows are four times their usual height for no apparent reason when I shrink the window :/ |
| 17:36.25 | Shirik | bbl |
| 17:37.09 | Amarande | so, is it official then that paladins are not acceptable melee DPS in any raid setting? |
| 17:37.45 | Amarande | and, ergo, that paladins will be permabenched for any raid except when there's a need for additional tankadins or additional single-target healers? |
| 17:38.07 | malreth | oh look, a book about what i was talking about: http://www.questia.com/library/book/alcohol-education-what-we-must-do-by-david-j-hanson.jsp |
| 17:38.12 | Amarande | (the latter not being very promising, seeing as BC had several raid instances where single-target i.e. holydin healers just plain stank) |
| 17:38.48 | Lunessa | Amarande: Ummm... I don't know what you're on about. Ret Paladins ROCK the DPS. |
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| 17:39.26 | foxlit | It's official that you will have fun in wotlk. |
| 17:39.32 | Wikwocket | Ret's getting nerfs, but clearly Blizz won't nerf any 1 dps spec until it's not viable, what would the point be? |
| 17:39.33 | malreth | dear Thor do they ever |
| 17:39.41 | foxlit | It's also official that people need to stop whining :) |
| 17:39.46 | Nom- | http://standen.id.au/Retribution%20Mana%20Calc.xlsm <-- in case anyone wants to play |
| 17:39.56 | Amarande | Lunessa: it's almost 100% consensus now that ret paladins will not be able to sustain their DPS long enough to be useful in a boss fight, however |
| 17:40.09 | Nom- | Oh yeeah... i've crunched the numbers |
| 17:40.17 | Amarande | even if you have a mana pot, it only extends your DPS by another what, 20 or 30 seconds at most? |
| 17:40.29 | Industrial | "pwned" |
| 17:40.39 | Nom- | at 3 minutes |
| 17:40.42 | Lunessa | Amarande: I have two words for all conventional wisdom about WoW classes "universally wrong." |
| 17:40.53 | Amarande | and dark runes have a 2 minute cooldown as well |
| 17:40.53 | Nom- | Current: 2229 mana, New: -7413 mana |
| 17:41.02 | Nom- | That's at fight duration 180 seconds |
| 17:41.14 | Nom- | That's how harsh it is |
| 17:41.18 | Amarande | basically, raid groups that use ret paladin dps are going to have STRANGE composition |
| 17:41.21 | Nom- | Aint no mana pot in the *world* that will make that up |
| 17:41.27 | Amarande | like, they'll have to shove a shadow priest into the melee dps group ... :| |
| 17:41.39 | Nom- | That's based on my mana pool at level 70 btw |
| 17:41.50 | Amarande | heh, that makes me think, though |
| 17:41.54 | foxlit | Amarande: what do groups have to do with anything? |
| 17:42.02 | foxlit | Most effects are raid-wide. |
| 17:42.10 | Amarande | foxlit: is spriest's mana battery effect raid wide now? |
| 17:42.14 | foxlit | Yes. |
| 17:42.16 | Amarande | it's been forever since I played my priest so I can't remember :S |
| 17:42.25 | Lunessa | Mana totems, Prayer of Hope, Replenishment, etc. cf: "universally wrong." |
| 17:42.39 | Nom- | That worksheet is also working under the assumption that you will always get the full ticks of replenishment every time it goes off |
| 17:43.02 | Amarande | Nom: I take it the use of a ret paladin therefore means having to have 2-3 shadow priests in the raid by necessity? |
| 17:43.32 | Lunessa | I did 6 Heroics yesterday with a Ret Paladin. He did twice the damage of the rest of the party, and he was NEVER OOM. |
| 17:43.35 | Amarande | I'd say shamans but I don't think multiple mana totems stack |
| 17:43.44 | Industrial | they wont |
| 17:43.45 | Industrial | dont |
| 17:43.54 | Amarande | Lunessa: a lot of the theorycrafting is also at 80, though |
| 17:43.59 | Amarande | remember this |
| 17:44.10 | *** join/#wowuidev Atriace (n=omnizeta@188.118.189.72.cfl.res.rr.com) |
| 17:44.10 | Amarande | right now, on a ret pally, you have substantial additional int from gear |
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| 17:44.12 | Lunessa | *shrug* I've played at 80 too. |
| 17:44.19 | Amarande | at 80, you'll be using warrior gear, with no int at all |
| 17:44.24 | malreth | Horrible o' Lantern: http://i36.tinypic.com/2mfnpeq.jpg |
| 17:44.39 | Amarande | which means you'll have maybe about the same mana pool but things will cost more because of the % of base mana rule |
| 17:44.41 | foxlit | malreth: cute |
| 17:44.56 | Lunessa | I'm telling you... people complaining that "X class" will be "useless" in "end-game" are... bluntly "universally wrong." |
| 17:45.04 | NightHawkTheSane | ~Lunessa++ |
| 17:45.08 | malreth | unless they're talking about mages |
| 17:45.15 | malreth | SNAP |
| 17:45.43 | Amarande | Lunessa: basically, I'm still trying to wrap myself around how a ret paladin (which is what a paladin will be specced if they are being taken along as DPS) will be able to sustain enough DPS to be worthy of their raid slot, over the entire length of a typical raid boss fight |
| 17:45.53 | Amarande | even heroic bosses tend to be relatively quick affairs |
| 17:45.55 | NightHawkTheSane | the same way EVERYONE ELSE DOES. |
| 17:46.04 | Lunessa | Even in beta when shaman spells/buff were broken I was a useful member of raids. And Ret Pallies were rocking the house. |
| 17:46.17 | NightHawkTheSane | you need to stop overreacting. |
| 17:46.30 | Hirsute | malreth: But who else could turn your enemies into penguins? |
| 17:46.52 | NightHawkTheSane | Hirsute: just wait for the Hex->Penguin glyph ;) |
| 17:47.20 | malreth | i applied the Penguin inscription... and then my Polymorph spell disappeared from my spell book |
| 17:47.22 | Amarande | I'm told the mage penguin glyph isn't the best idea in the world |
| 17:47.22 | malreth | :( |
| 17:47.31 | Amarande | like, say you spend 2000g to learn polymorph: turtle ... |
| 17:47.34 | Lunessa | I'm dead serious, every single class can put out valued contributions in a raid. Buffs, debuffs, DPS, utility or heals, everyone brings something that makes them all desirable. |
| 17:47.37 | Amarande | apparently, THAT will turn into a penguin, too |
| 17:48.02 | malreth | it didn't affect my piggymorph spell |
| 17:48.02 | NightHawkTheSane | yay pez :) |
| 17:48.03 | Amarande | btw, regarding raids in WOTLK also |
| 17:48.11 | Amarande | are there fewer, or more lenient hard enrages this time than there were in BC? |
| 17:48.17 | malreth | that's the only poly spell that i can use now |
| 17:48.36 | Amarande | (IMO every enrage should be a soft enrage, but I know that's probably not happening) |
| 17:48.58 | Lunessa | Enrage is not the only time-limiting mechanism to fights now. |
| 17:48.58 | NightHawkTheSane | Naxx has as many as the original naxx did, i believe. |
| 17:49.16 | Amarande | Naxx is the same as it always was except for being re-tooled for 10 or 25 people, right? |
| 17:49.33 | NightHawkTheSane | more or less. |
| 17:49.53 | Lunessa | I never did Naxx pre WotLK beta. But everyone was telling me it was the same. |
| 17:50.06 | Amarande | Lunessa: well, even periodic use by a boss of attacks that ensure that you will eventually succumb to attrition no matter how good your healers are, is pretty much a type of soft enrage |
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| 17:50.50 | Amarande | 'oops you're dead' types of enrages need to go, though :) |
| 17:50.59 | Amarande | unless there's a specific story reason why the boss should be able to do that kind of thing |
| 17:51.02 | NightHawkTheSane | almost every boss does that, though, simply by virtue of mana being a limited resource. |
| 17:51.06 | Amarande | e.g. Sin's overdrive in FFX |
| 17:51.25 | NightHawkTheSane | Amarande: That's moronic. There's no story reason for ANY kind of enrage mechanic. They are -purely- there to enforce progression limits. which is good. |
| 17:53.23 | Xinhuan | oh dear, 1.1 hours to the end of the plague? |
| 17:53.23 | Xinhuan | zombie plague that is |
| 17:53.23 | NightHawkTheSane | roughly |
| 17:53.23 | Amarande | Xinhuan: thank the Light |
| 17:53.23 | Industrial | FINALLY |
| 17:53.26 | foxlit | Meh. |
| 17:53.27 | Amarande | Like I've been saying before, the zombie plague was the kind of thing that was fun in the beginning, but rapidly got old, especially when you were forced to participate in it somehow almost every time you logged on |
| 17:53.32 | Nom- | Amarande: The problem with that.. how are you going to get that many shadow priests in a 10-man |
| 17:53.46 | Nom- | and then you're filling up your raid with a specific class JUST to feed one player mana |
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| 17:53.52 | Amarande | hmm |
| 17:53.53 | Nom- | It's stupid |
| 17:53.59 | Amarande | how are shadow priests DPS-wise now? |
| 17:54.03 | Nom- | They're OK |
| 17:54.07 | foxlit | "fine" |
| 17:54.10 | foxlit | applies to everyone. |
| 17:54.25 | foxlit | And everything, because "now" is massively nerfed content against massively overpowered players |
| 17:54.34 | Dashkal | Glad I got some braaaiiinnnsss time in last night. Too bad it'll be cleared before I get home from work |
| 17:54.40 | Amarande | so, you pretty much choose your raid class balance based on how the classes work together, then. |
| 17:54.45 | Amarande | isn't that how you design a raid group? :| |
| 17:55.00 | Wikwocket | Does this paladin spreadsheet include mana regained thru healing the pally? |
| 17:55.01 | foxlit | You could stack 18 of the "worst" dps class and still win a dps race. |
| 17:55.08 | Nom- | hmm if they changed it to 25% of base mana, that lets us go 120 seconds |
| 17:55.11 | Amarande | at least, that's how the best raid leaders design a raid group |
| 17:55.12 | NightHawkTheSane | foxlit: that only works because the -current- content is nerfed. |
| 17:55.18 | foxlit | NightHawkTheSane: indeed. |
| 17:55.35 | Nom- | i suppose with divine plea it'll be different... i should try and crunch that now |
| 17:55.37 | NightHawkTheSane | Amarande: bring the people you want. That's all you really need to do, in theory. |
| 17:55.38 | foxlit | see " because "now" is massively nerfed content against massively overpowered players" |
| 17:55.44 | Amarande | there's plenty of scrub raid leaders who probably think 'ok, here's a couple tanks, couple healers, few dps guys, we can just have them each do their own thing without coordination' |
| 17:55.57 | Amarande | These are the kind of raid leaders whose progression is stuck in kara. Post-nerf kara. :) |
| 17:56.06 | NightHawkTheSane | foxlit: I think his question is more long-term than "now" though. |
| 17:56.10 | Wikwocket | Nom-: Divine Plea is one of the best regen abilities out now... I would hope you include it in your mathcrafting |
| 17:56.17 | foxlit | NightHawkTheSane: I think the question used the word "now" :) |
| 17:56.33 | Nom- | Wikwocket: I will now... I was working with level 70 numbers |
| 17:56.37 | Nom- | Divine Plea is a level 75 ability |
| 17:56.51 | Wikwocket | Ah |
| 17:56.57 | NightHawkTheSane | foxlit: you make a fair point, good sir, although I'd argue "now" was "post 3.0 looking forward, relative to pre 2.4" |
| 17:57.00 | Wikwocket | Well everything will be balanced around 80 of course :) |
| 17:57.11 | Amarande | foxlit: 'now' = 'assuming today's classes but assuming there was actually some kind of half-decently challenging raid boss to measure against' |
| 17:57.34 | foxlit | Amarande: your assumptions are flawed, you aren't entitled to an accurate response. |
| 17:57.51 | Amarande | basically, 'how do shadow priests stack up versus other DPS builds in 3.0' |
| 17:57.52 | foxlit | The way they've chosen to balance things at 70 involves massive overpowering of everything. |
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| 17:58.30 | foxlit | The only semblance of "looking forward" balance would be to look at what would happen at 80, with 80 gear. None of that is final, so there's no way to answer that question in a meaningful way. |
| 17:59.11 | Amarande | do you think they're going to re-itemize ret paladin gear, btw? |
| 17:59.19 | foxlit | Current gear? |
| 17:59.23 | Amarande | 80 |
| 17:59.31 | foxlit | Anything could happen. |
| 17:59.32 | Amarande | it seems that part of the whole problem is not just that they nerfed the retadin's mana recovery |
| 17:59.33 | Lopeppeppy | Yah right, Amarande. |
| 18:00.04 | Amarande | but that they nerfed the mana recovery, in a situation where the gear was all itemized in a way that means they were designed to rely on high-powered mana recovery via their skills |
| 18:00.16 | Amarande | er by 'gear' the 'gear they will be using at 80' |
| 18:00.22 | Atriace | Does anyone know of an Actionscript/Flex IRC channel out there? |
| 18:00.35 | malreth | awww.... http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3185/2577682520_9cd724e2c9_b.jpg |
| 18:01.24 | Amarande | the whole idea of making paladins use warrior gear seems kinda flawed anyway |
| 18:01.36 | Amarande | and possibly induced by QQ from death knights |
| 18:01.45 | NightHawkTheSane | no, it's not, on both counts. |
| 18:01.53 | NightHawkTheSane | and no, I don't think they will re-itemize any gear. In fact, I think they're going to make it even worse by further nerfing retribution sustainability, including every class you have any intention of playing. You should just quit now. |
| 18:02.12 | Amarande | heh |
| 18:02.13 | malreth | everyone knows that's hunter gear, anyway |
| 18:02.18 | NightHawkTheSane | Because let's face it, blizzard are mean old idiots who have no intentions of making the game playable at all |
| 18:02.22 | Amarande | I'm just glad I stayed prot. |
| 18:02.39 | Amarande | malreth: heh. plate is about the one thing that hunters could actually be larted for rolling on |
| 18:02.52 | Wikwocket | Right, and they probably reinvented the whole buff system to make it fair for all other classes, except paladins |
| 18:02.53 | NightHawkTheSane | If you're going to continue to qq like a terrible forum troll, i'd have preferred you stayed unsubscribed. |
| 18:03.11 | Amarande | half the problem with the whole 'hunter need' stereotype is that almost everything that can be equipped by a hunter is something that a hunter could conceivably make some positive use of. |
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| 18:04.31 | Nom- | ROFL |
| 18:04.36 | Nom- | Just did the level 80 numbers |
| 18:04.48 | Nom- | If you use divine plea after your first rotation, you're OOM before the cooldown is up |
| 18:05.03 | foxlit | Nom-: that's a good thing |
| 18:05.19 | foxlit | Otherwise, what the heck is the point in giving you a mana resource? |
| 18:05.25 | Nom- | err |
| 18:05.30 | Amarande | heh, to paraphrase an old saying about going west |
| 18:05.34 | Amarande | advice to paladins in 3.0 ... |
| 18:05.38 | Amarande | "spec prot, young man, spec prot" |
| 18:05.47 | Amarande | thankfully, I've always specced prot, so this is not a problem :) |
| 18:05.51 | Nom- | Using divine plea at the best possible time, you're oom in under 56 seconds |
| 18:06.01 | Nom- | That's pathetic |
| 18:06.18 | Wikwocket | Blizzard has said they will undo some of the nerfs if it's too much. If pallies at 80 in Naxx gear are OOM in 60 seconds then of course they will fix it. |
| 18:06.25 | malreth | can't we talk about something less infuriating... like politics |
| 18:06.28 | malreth | or religion |
| 18:06.38 | NightHawkTheSane | malreth: my obama can beat up your god. |
| 18:06.40 | Lunessa | sex is always non-infuriating. |
| 18:06.41 | vith__ | favorite text editors, go! |
| 18:06.42 | Dashkal | McCain wins. Election rigged. The interwebs told me so :p |
| 18:06.42 | malreth | oh... wait... i forgot that the two are the same now in america |
| 18:07.06 | Amarande | speaking of politics, my father really should not comment on answering machine messages when he first wakes up :| |
| 18:07.19 | malreth | i like the sex conversation idea |
| 18:07.21 | Amarande | I got a call from one of my bosses at work, whose name is Sara, and I was trying to listen to it intently |
| 18:07.32 | Amarande | and he's going on like 'it's a message from Sarah Palin it's not important' |
| 18:08.26 | Wikwocket | ... |
| 18:08.37 | Amarande | heh, come to think of it the whole ret pally thing reminds me of something I saw in someone's sig with regards to warriors |
| 18:08.37 | *** join/#wowuidev drc|away (n=drc@p5B22A5E6.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) |
| 18:08.43 | foxlit | gah |
| 18:08.44 | *** join/#wowuidev Matrix110| (i=Matrix11@pD957E3F2.dip.t-dialin.net) |
| 18:08.45 | Amarande | the 'patch day treason and plot' quote |
| 18:08.49 | malreth | purl, yuri Cairenn and Lopeppeppy |
| 18:08.50 | purl | ACTION and Cairenn and Lopeppeppy exchange sweet, long glances at each other amidst a background of pastel flowers and that's all that ever happens. Ever. |
| 18:08.50 | foxlit | I've made too many associative indices. |
| 18:08.59 | NightHawkTheSane | you know, im kinda surprised how untouched shatt has remained on my server |
| 18:09.01 | foxlit | now I can't look them up backwards :/ |
| 18:09.04 | Amarande | There was this one guy who was absolutely convinced one patch, I'm trying to remember which patch it was |
| 18:09.16 | Amarande | that Blizzard was absolutely trying to make warriors give up on Fury and Arms spec and go prot |
| 18:09.30 | Lopeppeppy | There's always outcry. |
| 18:09.34 | Lopeppeppy | Every time. |
| 18:09.43 | Lunessa | malreth: That's totally NOT what I thought you were going to add to purl for that. |
| 18:09.54 | NightHawkTheSane | people who think blizzard wants anything but to make the game as balanced and fun for every class/spec as possible are idiots. :p |
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| 18:09.56 | Lopeppeppy | Nerf bats hurt, but when you cry, come up with solid numbers. Sometimes even solid numbers don't help though, because Blizz does their own studies. |
| 18:10.15 | Wikwocket | Amarande: http://forums.worldofwarcraft.com/thread.html?topicId=50988075 ? |
| 18:10.17 | Amarande | something like ... 'there ain't no good reason for MS and cleavin cause Blizzard wants us to spec prot' |
| 18:10.18 | Lopeppeppy | I'm sad about paladins. I'm changing my main. I hate to do it. I cried when I made the decision. Oh wells. |
| 18:10.24 | Drakhaon | whats that monkey pet item called? |
| 18:10.34 | Dashkal | Bananas |
| 18:10.35 | Amarande | Wikwocket: Yeah, that one. |
| 18:11.18 | Amarande | I'm just glad that tankadins are as awesome as always, but I'm probably going to mostly retire my pally at 80 |
| 18:11.19 | Wikwocket | Wow a lot of people in that thread made that their sig |
| 18:11.36 | Amarande | outside of necessary instance runs to acquire BoP/rep reward Alchemy recipes, and to gather herbs |
| 18:11.49 | Wikwocket | Clearly some of the people complaining about classes forced to spec for a certain role never played an early MMO before WoW o_O |
| 18:11.52 | Amarande | well, not gather herbs in instances, but my pally is my herbing character so I'd be using her for that |
| 18:12.14 | Amarande | Wikwocket: and weren't there oh so many classes in such games that were utterly hated for that reason? |
| 18:12.24 | Lopeppeppy | I retired my holy paladin until I see how they get adjusted in the next few small patches. T6/t7 content was so discouraging for me. |
| 18:12.28 | Drakhaon | Dashkal > thanks =) |
| 18:13.00 | Amarande | From what I understood, the main issue with holy paladins was that they're very much a single-target healer, and T6 was heavy on the AoE healing needs |
| 18:13.04 | ScytheBlade1 | Lopeppeppy: new class = ? |
| 18:13.49 | Wikwocket | My point is that Blizzard is almost obsessive that each class/spec should have uses for solo play, parties, raids, and pvp, and though they aren't perfect, every major patch takes big steps forward |
| 18:14.26 | Amarande | Indeed, the prot pally changes are making solo questing on a pally much more fun |
| 18:14.39 | malreth | which profession do you all think i should pick up when i drop tailoring? I'm thinking either Herbalism or Inscription (and relying on my wife's herbalist for mats). |
| 18:14.51 | NightHawkTheSane | Amarande: thats an absurd statement, as soloing on a prot pally was fine before |
| 18:14.54 | Amarande | of course, you can still die by running headlong into a group of mobs with your protadin thinking you should be able to take them all out ... |
| 18:15.03 | Amarande | ... and then not discovering till after you die that one of those was an elite :) |
| 18:15.22 | Amarande | the other day I was having fun with the never-ending blue bar that is prot |
| 18:15.24 | NightHawkTheSane | see, my experience would be like that, except instead of dying, i'd kill them all and be like "oh, one was elite" huh.. |
| 18:15.33 | Dashkal | (second-hand) soloing on a prot was a bit annoying anytime you had to take down a single target. It just took too long |
| 18:15.39 | Amarande | and I run straight into all the mobs at the bottom of hellfire |
| 18:15.46 | Wikwocket | malreth: do you play a class who would benefit from the new Herbailism hot? |
| 18:15.47 | Amarande | then I noticed my health wasn't holding out, and I died |
| 18:15.54 | Amarande | and then I'm like 'oh, there's that 62+ down there' |
| 18:16.03 | malreth | Wikwocket: Mage. more healing couldn't hurt |
| 18:16.03 | NightHawkTheSane | Dashkal: yeah, single targets were a pain, as is anything that does elemental damage, but that's still the case. |
| 18:16.13 | malreth | my other primary profession is Enchanting |
| 18:16.15 | |Jelly| | http://wowuidev.pastey.net/99871 <-- I love people |
| 18:16.46 | Dashkal | I've discovered that I kinda miss my ability to tank. But on the whole I'm still very happy with the feral druid changes. King of the Jungle + tigers fury is amazing |
| 18:17.02 | NightHawkTheSane | miss your ability to tank? eh? |
| 18:17.10 | Amarande | this being my protadin ... http://www.wowarmory.com/character-sheet.xml?r=Quel%27dorei&n=Sadaiya |
| 18:17.14 | Dashkal | I'm feral/cat. I can't tank anything serious anymore |
| 18:17.21 | NightHawkTheSane | ah, well raid content yeah |
| 18:17.31 | NightHawkTheSane | but you could probably tank any 5-man and probably heroics, depending on gear just fine |
| 18:17.33 | Dashkal | Most of my tanking gear got nerfed, and I didn't take the tank talents |
| 18:17.43 | Dashkal | normals for sure. heroics, maybe |
| 18:17.51 | NightHawkTheSane | Depending on gear level, obviously |
| 18:17.53 | Nom- | wow... that's impressive.... 70 seconds duration @ level 70 - 56 seconds duration @ level 80 |
| 18:17.53 | Dashkal | with a good healer I could |
| 18:17.57 | Nom- | without using mana pots |
| 18:18.10 | NightHawkTheSane | Dashkal: I assume, at least, you took survival of the fittest? |
| 18:18.14 | Dashkal | But I'd prolly just save the stress and drop the 100g to tank it right |
| 18:18.21 | *** join/#wowuidev kd3 (n=kd3@wikia/kaydeethree) |
| 18:18.21 | Dashkal | NightHawkTheSane: of course. That thing's good for both |
| 18:18.22 | Lopeppeppy | Holydin. http://www.wowarmory.com/character-sheet.xml?r=Argent+Dawn&n=Kirwan |
| 18:18.35 | Dashkal | I also have thick hide over infected wounds (mistake) so I have a reasonable shot |
| 18:18.39 | NightHawkTheSane | Dashkal: *nod* imo, that's about 40% of what you need anyway ;) |
| 18:18.49 | kd3 | whee power outages wiping out a 50+-day uptime |
| 18:19.04 | Dashkal | The thick hide has been paying off against rogues in pvp anyway. Battlegrounds are fun again :p |
| 18:19.25 | NightHawkTheSane | the other stuff is pretty much all passive DR, so yeah, with better gear is less necessary |
| 18:19.26 | Lopeppeppy | Must love fall, kd3. /comfort |
| 18:20.25 | *** join/#wowuidev malreth (n=triti@w-central-233-216.public.utexas.edu) |
| 18:20.32 | malreth | wireless network died here |
| 18:20.37 | malreth | as i was saying |
| 18:20.40 | malreth | I don't know if making/enchanting my own vellums is worth it |
| 18:20.55 | Lunessa | malreth: STILL freaking patching VMs 1:20 later. |
| 18:21.31 | Dashkal | My tanking gear is enough to do kara, but not past it. I should go tank something just to see how I do |
| 18:21.38 | Dashkal | Need my dungeon achievements anyway |
| 18:21.39 | NightHawkTheSane | malreth: a) i hate you for having a name that shares it's first three lettesrs with like THREE other people here, b) probably not. |
| 18:23.32 | *** join/#wowuidev kd3 (n=kd3@wikia/kaydeethree) |
| 18:24.24 | *** join/#wowuidev kd3 (n=kd3@wikia/kaydeethree) |
| 18:25.05 | *** join/#wowuidev kd3 (n=kd3@wikia/kaydeethree) |
| 18:25.25 | kd3 | </3 peer |
| 18:25.26 | *** part/#wowuidev Shane|Work (n=mellerfa@64-199-29-162.ip.mcleodusa.net) |
| 18:25.28 | Dashkal | I know it was expected, but so strange seeing GC posting on live and braving that crowd |
| 18:25.50 | Lunessa | http://forums.worldofwarcraft.com/thread.html?topicId=11694179879&pageNo=17&sid=1#339 |
| 18:25.56 | Lunessa | Must be the Gin. |
| 18:26.05 | Dashkal | Must be |
| 18:26.42 | NightHawkTheSane | can you blame him? you'd have to be half drunk to post on the live forums |
| 18:27.04 | Lopeppeppy | He does try very very hard indeed, and has a thankless job. Too many Blues go postal. |
| 18:27.37 | Dashkal | Given what they deal with, I don't really blame the blues from snapping |
| 18:27.38 | *** join/#wowuidev KarlKFI (n=chatzill@adcom137.adcom.uci.edu) |
| 18:28.18 | Dashkal | GC seems to be reasonably unaffected by it. I'm more confused. I was under the impression that the CMs existed explicitly to keep GC from having to deal with that directly |
| 18:28.42 | Dashkal | With his 'spokesperson' role, he's kinda gone half-cm |
| 18:29.03 | Hirsute | I can understand it, though. The sheer amount of QQ that's been directed at Addon authors since the patch has be unbelievable. To have to deal with that on a higher level, all day, every day... |
| 18:29.10 | Hirsute | yeah, I'd probably have killed people by now. |
| 18:29.15 | Dashkal | Agreed |
| 18:29.19 | NightHawkTheSane | Dashkal: I don't think that was the CMs sole role, just maybe part of it. But I think the change is to attempt a better direct communication between designers/devs and the player base |
| 18:29.55 | Dashkal | NightHawkTheSane: *nods* that follows. It's a good change. It just surprised me. I hope GC really is resilient enough to keep it up. His skin is thicker than mine, that's for damn sure. |
| 18:30.21 | Drakhaon | hah! name found - and logo made :D |
| 18:30.27 | Dashkal | And I know the CMs exist for more than just buffering the devs from the raving masses. They're pretty much our main contact to blizzard. |
| 18:30.31 | Dashkal | In all fronts. |
| 18:30.48 | Lopeppeppy | GC is a crab, he has a pretty thick shell. :) |
| 18:31.13 | Dashkal | Thick shell doesn't protect against slow poison :( |
| 18:31.19 | NightHawkTheSane | does he also have a succulent and tastey inside, that goes well with butter? |
| 18:31.34 | Hirsute | I... wouldn't... know.... |
| 18:32.01 | Amarande | Night: nono |
| 18:32.05 | Amarande | it's 'crunchy and goes well with brie' |
| 18:32.16 | Amarande | Get it right. :) |
| 18:32.19 | Lopeppeppy | NightHawkTheSane, ask me some other time. :P |
| 18:32.20 | NightHawkTheSane | meh |
| 18:32.25 | NightHawkTheSane | i don't eat crab anyway |
| 18:32.39 | NightHawkTheSane | Lopeppeppy: .... i'll just keep quiet, i think. :D |
| 18:32.40 | Lopeppeppy | I love seafood. |
| 18:33.34 | Dashkal | Crab is good, but more expensive than it's worth. I'd rather spend that same cash on more steak :p |
| 18:34.20 | Hirsute | Steak is also much easier to eat. |
| 18:34.26 | Hirsute | No protective shell. |
| 18:34.32 | Dashkal | exactly |
| 18:34.48 | Hirsute | I wonder if Netherspite feels the same way about eating a warrior vs. eating a mage. |
| 18:35.12 | Dashkal | Dunno, his netherbreath may be able to soften the armour into a nice, soft, burrito type offering |
| 18:35.39 | Hirsute | Possibly, though my armor has generally held out, even when I haven't. |
| 18:35.58 | Dashkal | mmm, paladin burrito |
| 18:36.10 | Hirsute | <--One of thos Prot Warriors who has absolutely nothing to QQ about since the patch. |
| 18:36.17 | Hirsute | Can I tell you how much more fun soloing is now? |
| 18:36.37 | Dashkal | :p |
| 18:36.42 | Dashkal | LONG overdue change |
| 18:36.45 | Hirsute | Shockwave = awesome. |
| 18:37.08 | ckknight | Dashkal: palito? |
| 18:37.15 | Hirsute | Yeah, although I still haven't managed my guild to take me to Heroic Shattered Halls yet.... people still hate that place, even if it should be far easier for me to tank it now. |
| 18:37.23 | Dashkal | ckknight: sounds good, lets open a shop outside of kara :p |
| 18:37.26 | malreth | NightHawkTheSane: the other thing to consider (regarding inscription) is the shoulder enchants... they grant more SP than the reputation enchants from sons of hodir |
| 18:37.39 | ckknight | Dashkal: I was thinking more along the lines of a roach coach |
| 18:37.47 | Dashkal | that could work too |
| 18:37.54 | malreth | that's a good deal more SP when combined with the ring enchants |
| 18:38.10 | Dashkal | Have to wait a couple weeks, though. My druid wouldn't have much to do with that. Dashkal, on the other hand |
| 18:39.04 | *** join/#wowuidev sioraioc_ (n=sioraioc@94-192-60-10.zone6.bethere.co.uk) |
| 18:39.04 | *** join/#wowuidev cladhair_ (n=jnwhiteh@94-192-60-10.zone6.bethere.co.uk) |
| 18:40.36 | NightHawkTheSane | malreth: true.. |
| 18:46.14 | *** join/#wowuidev Antiarc (n=Antiarc@wsip-70-167-195-98.ph.ph.cox.net) |
| 18:46.25 | *** join/#wowuidev Ose (n=chatzill@static142-224.adsl.no) |
| 18:47.44 | Lopeppeppy | Too many TLA's, dnr. :) |
| 18:47.58 | zenzelezz | kd3: what about it? |
| 18:50.13 | kd3 | it keeps losing packets or something. it says I've got latency going on 10 minutes |
| 18:53.02 | *** join/#wowuidev malreth_ (n=triti@w-central-233-216.public.utexas.edu) |
| 18:56.34 | *** join/#wowuidev soufron (n=soufron@pool-70-23-249-23.ny325.east.verizon.net) |
| 18:58.15 | Lunessa | Who was it that was praising the hell out of ShockAndAwe on Friday? |
| 18:58.40 | *** join/#wowuidev Funkeh` (n=funk@WoWUIDev/WoWAce/Ace3/BigWigs/funkeh) |
| 19:01.09 | *** join/#wowuidev QQngsk (n=Gngsk@c-69-138-214-242.hsd1.md.comcast.net) |
| 19:02.01 | NightHawkTheSane | Neuro_Medivh i think? |
| 19:02.28 | foxlit | Cairenn has a strange new avatar? |
| 19:02.40 | foxlit | http://www.wowinterface.com/forums/image.php?u=6&dateline=1225127426 |
| 19:02.42 | foxlit | (ew, JPEG!) |
| 19:04.35 | Cairenn | it was in response to dolby's, but he's changed his back to normal now, so I'm going to too |
| 19:05.07 | foxlit | the quality is sufficiently bad for me not to be able to recognize it :( |
| 19:05.24 | foxlit | What does it depict? |
| 19:05.48 | Cairenn | it was of a couple of the ladies tempting Sir Galahad in Monty Python's Holy Grail |
| 19:06.11 | *** join/#wowuidev isman (n=drag@mlr78-3-88-162-68-235.fbx.proxad.net) |
| 19:06.26 | Cairenn | he had the French Knight taunting the "silly english kkkknigits!" as his for a little bit |
| 19:07.13 | Cairenn | we were having a bit of an admin war last night, luckily everyone missed it *giggle* |
| 19:07.29 | Dolby | this is her avatar now http://www.wowinterface.com/forums/member.php?u=6 |
| 19:07.41 | Cairenn | DAMNIT dolby! |
| 19:07.52 | Dashkal | ~lart Dolby |
| 19:07.52 | purl | blames Dolby for all the evil in the world |
| 19:08.03 | Dashkal | I did not need that. *reaches for the brain bleach* |
| 19:08.05 | Cairenn | I said last night |
| 19:08.11 | ScytheBlade1 | lol |
| 19:08.16 | Cairenn | NOT today! |
| 19:08.18 | Cairenn | lol |
| 19:08.27 | Cairenn | that's such a horrendous picture |
| 19:08.37 | Antiarc | http://picasaweb.google.com/cheald/LoganWeek2#5261910279772664306 <-- my kid is a leet raider |
| 19:08.40 | Dolby | you like it |
| 19:08.47 | Cairenn | not even slightly |
| 19:08.50 | ScytheBlade1 | I see her usual avatar? |
| 19:08.55 | Cairenn | Antiarc: awwww |
| 19:08.59 | Dolby | you were too slow ScytheBlade1 |
| 19:09.05 | Dolby | she changed it back |
| 19:09.06 | ScytheBlade1 | Stupid login |
| 19:09.19 | Cairenn | Antiarc: too cute! |
| 19:09.27 | Cairenn | babies are the bestestest! |
| 19:09.37 | Antiarc | Yes :D |
| 19:09.43 | *** join/#wowuidev Jim-Bim (n=chatzill@ip-77-25-68-179.web.vodafone.de) |
| 19:10.12 | foxlit | wowi uids are surprisingly sparse |
| 19:10.35 | ScytheBlade1 | Dolby: link to what it was? ;) |
| 19:10.47 | Cairenn | no |
| 19:10.49 | Cairenn | ewwww |
| 19:10.56 | ScytheBlade1 | You're not helping your case here |
| 19:10.59 | Cairenn | trust me, you REALLY don't want to see it |
| 19:11.04 | ScytheBlade1 | You're not helping your case here |
| 19:11.07 | Cairenn | fine, but I warned you |
| 19:11.21 | ScytheBlade1 | Course |
| 19:11.27 | ScytheBlade1 | I still don't have a link... :( |
| 19:11.30 | Dolby | a smaller version of this http://www.gamerevolution.com/images/misc/hasselhoff.jpg |
| 19:11.34 | ScytheBlade1 | hahaha |
| 19:11.37 | ScytheBlade1 | yesss |
| 19:11.38 | kd3 | the hoff? |
| 19:11.44 | Cairenn | ewwwwwww |
| 19:12.01 | Cairenn | don't click the link if you want to keep your lunch down :p |
| 19:12.25 | ScytheBlade1 | I've trolled many a people with that image |
| 19:12.29 | Dolby | Cairenn has a thing for the hoff |
| 19:12.35 | Cairenn | ewwwww |
| 19:12.36 | Cairenn | no |
| 19:12.37 | ScytheBlade1 | I'd believe it, Dolby |
| 19:12.39 | Dolby | so do most people in canada |
| 19:12.41 | malreth_ | Cairenn: i... i never knew |
| 19:12.51 | Cairenn | malreth_: neither did I |
| 19:13.39 | malreth | i didn't know you were in to that either. kinky. |
| 19:13.45 | Cairenn | ewwww |
| 19:13.59 | Cairenn | Lopeppeppy: help, they're grossing me out |
| 19:14.41 | Dolby | Lopeppeppy is a big hoff fan too |
| 19:15.11 | ScytheBlade1 | Cairenn: on the flip side, I'm sitting here with this stupid grin on my face in math, half laughing in an otherwise silent room... no one grins during math, so the teacher knows something is up and is giving me looks |
| 19:15.21 | Cairenn | heh |
| 19:15.34 | ScytheBlade1 | Cairenn: THE Hoff fan. |
| 19:15.36 | malreth | no one got my piano music reference... :( |
| 19:15.39 | ScytheBlade1 | That could work |
| 19:15.45 | malreth | or... no one WANTED to |
| 19:15.51 | ScytheBlade1 | Dolby: custom title? |
| 19:15.58 | Dolby | lol |
| 19:16.17 | Dolby | i think she should add it her self |
| 19:16.46 | *** join/#wowuidev Dewin (n=Daniel@c-71-193-237-252.hsd1.or.comcast.net) |
| 19:16.49 | *** join/#wowuidev Corgan (n=Corgan@adsl-69-105-23-71.dsl.irvnca.pacbell.net) |
| 19:16.52 | Lopeppeppy | Dolby, I am not! |
| 19:16.57 | Cairenn | ScytheBlade1: your wish is my command! http://www.wowinterface.com/forums/member.php?u=25484 |
| 19:17.02 | ScytheBlade1 | ......... |
| 19:17.04 | ScytheBlade1 | I know that uid |
| 19:17.10 | ScytheBlade1 | Read my signature |
| 19:17.10 | Dolby | haha |
| 19:17.13 | Dewin | *stares at the topic* ... lol. |
| 19:17.16 | ScytheBlade1 | You hate me, this is not news |
| 19:17.42 | Cairenn | Dewin: hahahaha, finally! I was wondering how long until someone saw it |
| 19:17.59 | Dashkal | Note to self, read topics more |
| 19:18.22 | Cairenn | I only changed it at 6am my time this morning :p |
| 19:18.31 | Dewin | Cairenn: You misspelled Crackberry. |
| 19:18.34 | Cairenn | took you guys long enough for anyone to notice it |
| 19:18.35 | Lopeppeppy | *snark* She totally did. |
| 19:18.38 | malreth | i read that earlier |
| 19:18.54 | Dewin | Well, I noticed it 3 seconds into logging into the channel (I wasn't paying attention to this window until pidgin crashed) |
| 19:18.55 | malreth | it also applies to twittering |
| 19:19.16 | Dewin | I'd say you shouldn't use any technology, but... there are certain... useful... kinds of technology. |
| 19:19.50 | Cairenn | ScytheBlade1: http://www.wowinterface.com/forums/member.php?u=25484 |
| 19:20.05 | ScytheBlade1 | ......... |
| 19:20.12 | Lopeppeppy | Ahem. |
| 19:20.16 | Lopeppeppy | Batteries not included. |
| 19:20.19 | Cairenn | oh go look, big baby |
| 19:20.22 | Cairenn | Lopeppeppy: ;) |
| 19:20.23 | ScytheBlade1 | ................................. |
| 19:20.28 | *** join/#wowuidev kd3 (n=kd3@wikia/kaydeethree) |
| 19:20.36 | ScytheBlade1 | Stop making me grin uncontrollably in math! |
| 19:20.37 | ScytheBlade1 | Gah |
| 19:20.37 | Cairenn | hahahha |
| 19:20.40 | Dewin | batteries not required? |
| 19:20.43 | NightHawkTheSane | haha |
| 19:20.43 | ScytheBlade1 | Dirty looks SUCK |
| 19:20.45 | Cairenn | okay, that wasn't me! |
| 19:21.01 | Cairenn | I changed your title, not the avatar |
| 19:21.03 | ScytheBlade1 | Does it matter? |
| 19:21.07 | Dewin | That's alright, my raid group last night was one of 'those' raid groups. |
| 19:21.08 | ScytheBlade1 | Who am I going to blame it on? |
| 19:21.15 | Cairenn | my money is on Dolby |
| 19:21.20 | Dewin | But what do you expect when you raid with "Friends and Lovers" |
| 19:21.21 | Dolby | wasnt me |
| 19:21.26 | Dolby | prolly some hacker |
| 19:21.36 | Cairenn | god that picture is horrible |
| 19:21.38 | ScytheBlade1 | s'ok. I'll still blame it on Cairenn. |
| 19:21.41 | mikma | ok, i have a question |
| 19:21.42 | Cairenn | :( |
| 19:21.53 | mikma | how can 8 year old shoot himself in the head with uzi? |
| 19:22.03 | *** part/#wowuidev Wikwocket (n=wikwocke@adsl-68-79-12-235.dsl.emhril.ameritech.net) |
| 19:22.12 | Lopeppeppy | ScytheBlade1, if you can't take the heat, do not talk to Peppy and Cairenn, kk? |
| 19:22.30 | Cairenn | <PROTECTED> |
| 19:22.32 | Lopeppeppy | mikma... recoil on those things is strong for adults. Kid couldn't hold it. |
| 19:22.32 | ScytheBlade1 | Lopeppeppy: which is why I'm leaving it and shall start tormenting them by making sure that avatar is EVERYWHERE. |
| 19:22.54 | ScytheBlade1 | Err, her. Them doesn't apply well in that situation. |
| 19:22.56 | Lopeppeppy | At least he's naked. I can put a bag over his head. |
| 19:22.58 | mikma | lopeppeppy: ok, then next question. why was the uzi in the kids hands? |
| 19:23.12 | kd3 | hey, finally! |
| 19:23.16 | Lopeppeppy | mikma, it was a licensed gun demo and he had permission from a guardian and a licensed instructor. |
| 19:23.17 | kd3 | free transfers off my overcrowded realm |
| 19:23.26 | Lopeppeppy | That doesn't make any of them less stupid, but it was legal. |
| 19:23.26 | Dewin | kd3: which? |
| 19:23.31 | kd3 | medivh |
| 19:23.32 | Dolby | wow you look young for your age ScytheBlade1 http://www.wowinterface.com/forums/member.php?u=25484 |
| 19:23.33 | kd3 | they're doing a bunch |
| 19:23.40 | mikma | lopeppeppy: jebus christ, freaking 8 year old with uzi? |
| 19:23.41 | kd3 | http://forums.worldofwarcraft.com/thread.html?topicId=11855820322&sid=1 |
| 19:23.51 | ScytheBlade1 | Dolby: bah, ruin my fun |
| 19:23.53 | Dewin | ah, ours isn't on the list. |
| 19:23.55 | Lopeppeppy | mikma, for sure. I don't disagree that it was stupid. |
| 19:24.03 | NightHawkTheSane | mikma: "ima gonna teach mah son to defend himself from the gub'mint!" |
| 19:24.13 | Dewin | I have no desire to transfer though |
| 19:24.22 | Lopeppeppy | AD is getting them in advance of the holiday rush, that's good. |
| 19:24.49 | Dewin | Hmm, I might move my AD characters for giggles |
| 19:24.57 | Dewin | I don't play them anymore though |
| 19:25.41 | Lopeppeppy | If I could free xfer to anywhere I wanted to be, I'd take it in a heartbeat. Might wind up paying to xfer so I go someplace fun, though. |
| 19:26.11 | Dewin | I'd take a free xfer to Hawaii. |
| 19:26.30 | Cairenn | BVIs plzkthx |
| 19:26.58 | Lopeppeppy | BVD's? I prefer boxer-briefs. |
| 19:27.09 | Lopeppeppy | Oh, was that in my outside voice? So sorry. |
| 19:27.35 | ScytheBlade1 | ....... |
| 19:27.40 | Lunessa | Cairenn: And what evil would you have in store for my WoWI id? *bats eyelashes* |
| 19:27.45 | ScytheBlade1 | So do I have a dynamic avatar now? |
| 19:27.50 | Cairenn | Lopeppeppy: I'm all for nekkid on the beachs of BVI |
| 19:28.05 | Dolby | new feature ScytheBlade1 |
| 19:28.06 | Lopeppeppy | Drinks with umbrellas? |
| 19:28.10 | ScytheBlade1 | Ah. |
| 19:28.13 | Lopeppeppy | Can I pack anyone into my suitcase? |
| 19:28.24 | Cairenn | Lopeppeppy: definitely! |
| 19:28.31 | Cairenn | on both counts |
| 19:28.47 | malreth | we packed one of my girlfriends into a suitcase once |
| 19:28.57 | malreth | well, it was really a big duffel bag |
| 19:29.04 | kd3 | o_O |
| 19:29.06 | malreth | she is pretty tiny, tho |
| 19:29.19 | Hirsute | Especially before you blow her up, right? |
| 19:29.21 | Lunessa | malreth: Holly? |
| 19:29.25 | Lopeppeppy | She was packed this way... why again? |
| 19:29.26 | malreth | no, Kristina |
| 19:29.36 | malreth | don't think you've met her |
| 19:29.48 | Dolby | cheap way to fly? |
| 19:29.50 | Lunessa | ... Mmmm... Damn you and your bevy of pretty ladies who are non-available. |
| 19:29.54 | malreth | Holly is my mistress... Kristina is my other girlfriend |
| 19:30.12 | malreth | Kristina's available... she just lives in Japan now |
| 19:30.38 | Lopeppeppy | Long distance OSO isn't a bad arrangement. |
| 19:30.58 | Lunessa | malreth: Japan = too far to commute. |
| 19:31.04 | malreth | she's also celibate |
| 19:31.15 | Lunessa | That writes her RIGHT off the list. |
| 19:31.41 | Lopeppeppy | Yeah. Celibacy = not for me or Lunessa. |
| 19:31.45 | Dolby | did you know Seerah is a big urkel fan? |
| 19:31.54 | zenzelezz | O_O |
| 19:31.58 | Seerah | did you change it again? |
| 19:32.01 | Lunessa | 0.o |
| 19:32.05 | Seerah | actually, though, I did used to watch that show :P |
| 19:32.17 | malreth | Seerah: http://www.shopwiki.com/detail/q=1991_Steve_Urkel_Urkel-os_Ralston_Cereal_Box/d=1991_Steve_Urkel_Urkel-os_Ralston_Cereal_Box/jumpToFirst=true/ |
| 19:32.47 | Dewin | shopwiki? |
| 19:32.52 | Seerah | UrkelOs! |
| 19:32.55 | Dewin | Does that mean I can edit the price before I order? |
| 19:33.06 | Seerah | lol |
| 19:33.21 | *** join/#wowuidev MoonWolf (n=MoonWolf@i209133.upc-i.chello.nl) |
| 19:33.21 | *** mode/#WoWUIDev [+v MoonWolf] by ChanServ |
| 19:34.01 | NightHawkTheSane | "sanctity"? |
| 19:34.07 | malreth | why the hell do i know about UrkelOs?! |
| 19:34.10 | Lopeppeppy | Nothing, tra la la |
| 19:34.20 | *** join/#wowuidev KingTom (i=KingTom@ool-182f2d46.dyn.optonline.net) |
| 19:35.20 | Lopeppeppy | *sniff* |
| 19:35.25 | Lopeppeppy | *sad* |
| 19:35.34 | NeoTron | my hunter's pets are Steve and Urkel |
| 19:35.50 | Dolby | the hoff will cheer you up Lopeppeppy |
| 19:35.55 | ScytheBlade1 | ^ |
| 19:37.34 | Lopeppeppy | No, he's ugly. Keanu Reeves is at least cute, if schtoop'd. |
| 19:37.55 | ScytheBlade1 | Dolby just said "cheer you up" not "look amazing" |
| 19:38.19 | Lopeppeppy | Dolby knows how to cheer a lady up real goodly, ya. |
| 19:38.46 | Lopeppeppy | Oh look, I can add me to my Ignore list. Neat. |
| 19:39.41 | Lunessa | Heh... all that forum avatar changing made me go update my WoWi one. |
| 19:39.41 | malreth | seriously? |
| 19:40.22 | Lunessa | Seriously. |
| 19:40.34 | Lunessa | It matches my EQTraders one now. |
| 19:42.25 | Lunessa | Totally NOT the hoff. *gag* |
| 19:43.04 | ScytheBlade1 | I have a friend who has a collection of just about every funny/stupid/repulsive image the internet has ever seen, and as a result I'm no stranger to the hoff. |
| 19:43.10 | ScytheBlade1 | Having access to said collection.. |
| 19:44.16 | ScytheBlade1 | ack, class over. Plotting will have to resume later. |
| 19:44.20 | Lunessa | ... Um, you may not abuse your status at the nascent almanac for said revenge. |
| 19:51.25 | *** join/#wowuidev vithos (n=vithos@unaffiliated/vithos) |
| 19:53.22 | *** join/#wowuidev Tem|work (i=d195b804@gateway/web/ajax/mibbit.com/x-5de335cc12ee89f8) |
| 19:53.22 | *** mode/#WoWUIDev [+v Tem|work] by ChanServ |
| 19:53.28 | *** join/#wowuidev Remaxer|PT (n=Remaxer@88.157.244.133) |
| 19:54.16 | Industrial | http://www.nbc.com/Saturday_Night_Live/video/clips/digital-short-rasta-man/787201/ |
| 19:55.29 | cog|work | \o/ new chair http://www.bluehen.com/tempurpedicregistered-wood-accent-kneeling-chair-p-632.html |
| 19:56.55 | Lunessa | Oh man... Those things kill me. |
| 19:57.08 | cog|work | Industrial: that reminds me of of most of the people i knew in elementary school....... and their parents...... |
| 19:58.11 | Remaxer|PT | is there a site where you can download special eepanels? |
| 19:58.21 | Remaxer|PT | eepanels textures i mean |
| 19:59.04 | Lunessa | wowtextures.com |
| 19:59.33 | Lunessa | cog|work: Hazard of growing up in Ca. |
| 20:01.08 | *** join/#wowuidev nfsnobody (n=nnscript@sexy.whitey.hostaroo.net.au) |
| 20:04.28 | NightHawkTheSane | cog|work: that chair looks like a torture device |
| 20:04.50 | *** join/#wowuidev smcn (n=smcn@75-164-166-211.ptld.qwest.net) |
| 20:05.18 | Lunessa | Cairenn: HUMDINGER! |
| 20:05.25 | Dashkal | Cairenn: move west. Weather is fine in Vancouver :p |
| 20:05.28 | malreth | living in canada must be awesome |
| 20:05.35 | malreth | it'd be like a snow day every day |
| 20:05.38 | Dashkal | Kinda nippy: It dropped to +3 overnight :p |
| 20:06.02 | Lunessa | malreth: No, the major detraction is the molly-coddling of the Franco-philes. |
| 20:06.02 | malreth | not like here in texas |
| 20:06.04 | cog|work | NightHawkTheSane: http://officechairadvice.com/ergonomic/kneeling/kneeling_chairs_how_they_work.html |
| 20:06.08 | *** join/#wowuidev cladhaire (n=jnwhiteh@WoWUIDev/WoWI/Featured/Dongle/cladhaire) |
| 20:06.09 | *** mode/#WoWUIDev [+o cladhaire] by ChanServ |
| 20:06.22 | *** join/#wowuidev KingTom (i=KingTom@ool-182f2d46.dyn.optonline.net) |
| 20:06.23 | malreth | today it's a brisk and positively CHILLY 68 degrees F |
| 20:06.28 | KingTom | WANT FREE WOW GOLD? WATCH THIS VID - http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CI-Mg47C60U |
| 20:06.28 | KingTom | WANT TO HACK WoW ACCOUNTS? WATCH THIS VID - http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FFW3TB3Iqoc |
| 20:06.32 | malreth | whew! |
| 20:06.32 | KingTom | WANT FREE WOW GOLD? WATCH THIS VID - http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CI-Mg47C60U |
| 20:06.32 | KingTom | WANT TO HACK WoW ACCOUNTS? WATCH THIS VID - http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FFW3TB3Iqoc |
| 20:06.37 | *** kick/#WoWUIDev [KingTom!n=Cairenn@MMOI/Administratrix/Cairenn] by Cairenn (Cairenn) |
| 20:06.40 | Dashkal | oh god, make it die |
| 20:06.41 | Syzgyn | OMG I want free gold! |
| 20:06.43 | Dashkal | danke |
| 20:06.50 | Lunessa | malreth: It's even cooler here by the coast. |
| 20:06.59 | malreth | we might just have to wear some longer sleeves today |
| 20:07.07 | nevcairiel | Cairenn: no fair, they already waited for you to hibernate :( |
| 20:07.07 | *** mode/#WoWUIDev [+b *!*@ool-182f2d46.dyn.optonline.net] by Cairenn |
| 20:07.08 | Fisker- | lol |
| 20:07.09 | Dashkal | rickroll? |
| 20:07.12 | NightHawkTheSane | you know, i have to admit, i'm actually curious about those links >.> |
| 20:07.23 | nevcairiel | its youtube, what could happen |
| 20:07.26 | zenzelezz | I wish the Armory would stop forgetting my character |
| 20:07.32 | Fisker- | I'm afraid the majority in here might not be as stupid as he wishes |
| 20:07.32 | NightHawkTheSane | nevcairiel: thats why i'm curious |
| 20:07.44 | Lopeppeppy | Shirik, go ebola those links for me! :) |
| 20:08.00 | Dolby | I get free gold all the time... its called playing the game =p |
| 20:08.14 | cog|work | i get free gold all the time too |
| 20:08.21 | NightHawkTheSane | Dolby: i know, it's crazy.. it's like the monsters drop it or some shit |
| 20:08.24 | cog|work | it's called Mikina+Auctioneer |
| 20:08.28 | Fisker- | lol wtf |
| 20:08.29 | Syzgyn | Nonsense! |
| 20:08.33 | Fisker- | "Choose computer speed" |
| 20:08.34 | Fisker- | hahaha |
| 20:08.36 | Dashkal | Mikina? |
| 20:08.47 | Lopeppeppy | cog|work, I'm totally forming a labor union for her! |
| 20:08.48 | cog|work | Mrs. Cogwheel |
| 20:09.01 | Dashkal | Ahh |
| 20:09.01 | Lunessa | She plays the AH for Mr. Cogwheel. |
| 20:09.10 | NightHawkTheSane | she's one of those savvy ah types, eh? |
| 20:09.12 | cog|work | it's much more efficient that way :P |
| 20:09.14 | Lopeppeppy | And does it very very well. |
| 20:09.29 | Dashkal | I'm going to decline to mention what I first read when you mentioned that name and quickly get back to work *nogs* |
| 20:11.21 | Fisker- | i will cog|work you |
| 20:14.01 | Dolby | ok watched that first youtube video |
| 20:14.06 | Dolby | funny as heck |
| 20:19.35 | Fisker- | indeed Dolby |
| 20:19.41 | Fisker- | best hax evar |
| 20:19.52 | Fisker- | it's funny how he just want subscribers though |
| 20:20.15 | *** join/#wowuidev vithos_ (n=vithos@unaffiliated/vithos) |
| 20:20.24 | *** part/#wowuidev Lopeppeppy (n=Lopeppep@141.222.30.131) |
| 20:20.43 | mikma | hoho |
| 20:20.46 | mikma | good videos |
| 20:25.16 | *** join/#wowuidev Seerah1 (n=Ryan_L@adsl-177-21-150.mem.bellsouth.net) |
| 20:26.07 | *** join/#wowuidev smcn (n=smcn@75-164-163-62.ptld.qwest.net) |
| 20:26.18 | *** mode/#WoWUIDev [+o Seerah] by ChanServ |
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| 20:28.42 | kd3 | hm |
| 20:28.46 | kd3 | interesting bug report from a guildie |
| 20:28.55 | kd3 | he just switched guilds and is still seeing the calendar from his old guild |
| 20:29.09 | NeoTron | cool |
| 20:29.24 | NeoTron | sure he just doesn't have old guild events he accepted? |
| 20:29.50 | kd3 | dunno. told him to log out and clear his cache |
| 20:29.56 | kd3 | still waiting on him to get back in |
| 20:34.01 | *** join/#wowuidev Saryai_ (n=chatzill@HW-ESR1-208-102-168-7.fuse.net) |
| 20:35.53 | NightHawkTheSane | wweeee Ted Stevens found guilty of all seven felony charges: http://thehill.com/leading-the-news/stevens-guilty-of-felony-charges-2008-10-27.html |
| 20:36.12 | zenzelezz | who is Ted Stevens? |
| 20:36.20 | kd3 | the internet is tubes |
| 20:36.24 | NightHawkTheSane | ^ |
| 20:36.43 | NightHawkTheSane | Alaska Senator Ted "Series of Tubes" Stevens |
| 20:37.01 | NeoTron | lol |
| 20:37.06 | NeoTron | that's why the name was familiar |
| 20:37.09 | *** join/#wowuidev smcn (i=smcn@75-164-144-82.ptld.qwest.net) |
| 20:37.10 | malreth | well good for him |
| 20:37.25 | NeoTron | malreth: I'd argue it's not so good, but that's jus me |
| 20:37.42 | NightHawkTheSane | not so good for him, very good for us. |
| 20:37.42 | malreth | i betcha the MSM glosses over it like how they've done with the Palin "Troopergate" crap |
| 20:38.32 | malreth | since neither of them are 'exciting' stories |
| 20:38.47 | malreth | there's no sex and no blood.... so there's no story |
| 20:41.45 | Fisker- | What is he guilty of? |
| 20:41.46 | smcn | methylsulfonylmethane? |
| 20:42.03 | Fisker- | "making false statements"? :P |
| 20:42.11 | Fisker- | But the internet is a series of tubes ;_; |
| 20:43.23 | malreth | no... failing to report gifts |
| 20:43.30 | NightHawkTheSane | ^^ |
| 20:43.39 | malreth | government employees are required to report all gifts given to them |
| 20:44.12 | malreth | even me, lowly systems administrator guy |
| 20:44.46 | malreth | i don't know what the threshold is for Alaska, but for here in texas it's $15 |
| 20:44.57 | NightHawkTheSane | Its probably similar |
| 20:45.04 | malreth | not likely |
| 20:45.33 | malreth | the south has a long history of political corruption in the form of 'gifts' and texas is especially restrictive in that regard |
| 20:46.22 | NightHawkTheSane | looks like there's some federal regulation on it, as well actually. |
| 20:46.22 | malreth | still tho... a quarter mil is probably well past that threshold |
| 20:46.30 | Arrowmaster | the us has a long hisotry of political corruption |
| 20:46.37 | Lunessa | malreth: Yeah, and I'd say $250,000 in home renovations and furniture counts. |
| 20:46.41 | NightHawkTheSane | malreth: oh, well past. :p |
| 20:46.54 | Lunessa | Every nation has a long history of political corruption. |
| 20:47.13 | NightHawkTheSane | I'd be surprised if any states regulations were above 100-200 |
| 20:49.19 | Lunessa | Heh, fiction from the 50s thought we'd all be served by a pneumatic network to deliver items and food directly to our homes... |
| 20:49.40 | NightHawkTheSane | Lunessa: wait, you aren't? |
| 20:49.53 | Lunessa | I blocked the tubes. |
| 20:50.09 | NightHawkTheSane | well, they probably wouldn't have survived the hurricane anyway |
| 20:51.18 | NightHawkTheSane | haha: http://www.overheardintheoffice.com/archives/007820.html |
| 20:53.31 | Remaxer|PT | Is there a way to make multiple copies of a certain panel instead of making copy paste of each atribute in eePanels? |
| 20:54.09 | Lunessa | It amazes me how much trouble people will get into when we don't lock down every aspect of their computers. Someone just called to complain they're getting porn pop-ups. *faceplam* |
| 20:54.29 | Remaxer|PT | lolz |
| 20:55.38 | foxlit | Cairenn: it's also a series of highly intelligent flood gates to manage sewage flow along those tubes :) |
| 20:56.09 | Cairenn | heh |
| 20:56.29 | Lunessa | If there were tubes that big, surely someone would have seen them by now! "Hey Frankie, lookit the tubes!" |
| 20:57.14 | foxlit | saturable pipes are a viable, if somewhat incomplete, metaphor |
| 20:58.19 | NightHawkTheSane | hmm, watchmen sketches: http://www.guardian.co.uk/books/gallery/2008/oct/27/watchmen-alan-moore-dave-gibbons?picture=339028360 |
| 20:59.23 | Ose | so I can't get GoGoMount to work :/ |
| 21:01.04 | mikma | http://www.wowhead.com/?item=40110 <- so cool |
| 21:01.53 | NightHawkTheSane | Heh, Chrono Trigger DS adds a new ending. cause the game needs MORE ENDINGS. |
| 21:01.56 | *** join/#wowuidev alestane (n=nevin@c-76-24-240-47.hsd1.ma.comcast.net) |
| 21:01.56 | *** mode/#WoWUIDev [+v alestane] by ChanServ |
| 21:02.10 | mikma | yey zombie event is over! |
| 21:02.31 | foxlit | mikma: some of those comments are odd |
| 21:04.15 | Dashkal | Amazing how many people are absolutely convinced that the event ended 'early' |
| 21:04.42 | Arrowmaster | mikma: seriously =( |
| 21:04.44 | Lunessa | NightHawkTheSane: Thanks for the link. Alan Moore's stories are among my favorites. |
| 21:04.54 | Arrowmaster | cant even login right now to check |
| 21:05.11 | alestane | Whereas really it's entirely possible that the vent was scheduled long enough to great that great sense of relief when it ended. |
| 21:05.43 | Remaxer|PT | ahhh....isn't there anyway to make copies of one panel...like i made a separation panel and i want to make 3 copies of them! Do i have to make those 3 panels and config them one by one? |
| 21:05.49 | NightHawkTheSane | alestane: s/possible/probable/ |
| 21:06.11 | alestane | Wow I couldn't type there. |
| 21:06.29 | Lunessa | Remaxer|PT: Make your frame, save and exit. |
| 21:07.15 | Lunessa | Next edit the saved variables and copy the settings for one frame as many times as you like. Make sure you change the frame names. Save and exit. Log back in. |
| 21:09.46 | Lunessa | The forum is being overrun by the belligerent and the stupid. |
| 21:09.56 | alestane | Our forum? |
| 21:10.12 | NightHawkTheSane | Lunessa: how is this different than normal? |
| 21:10.12 | Lunessa | UI & Macros. |
| 21:10.27 | Esamynn | Lunessa: that happened a couple of years ago :P |
| 21:10.28 | Lunessa | Today it is pissing me off. I need a beer. |
| 21:10.34 | alestane | I invoke the blessing of St. Dogbert! Out! Out ye demons of stupidity! |
| 21:10.41 | Esamynn | lol |
| 21:10.45 | Esamynn | if only it worked! |
| 21:11.20 | Lunessa | New forum sig ^^ |
| 21:12.15 | *** join/#wowuidev Kraps (n=chatzill@pool-98-113-100-116.nycmny.east.verizon.net) |
| 21:12.48 | Kraps | can priests aoe farm? |
| 21:12.53 | *** join/#wowuidev Tuller (n=muffins@c-76-27-160-125.hsd1.va.comcast.net) |
| 21:12.57 | ScytheBlade1 | HOLY NOVA |
| 21:13.02 | NightHawkTheSane | sure, if they bring a mage/lock/paladin |
| 21:13.11 | Kraps | haha |
| 21:13.31 | NightHawkTheSane | i'd love to see a holy nova aoe priest |
| 21:13.37 | ScytheBlade1 | Me too |
| 21:13.44 | Dashkal | hrm, ubuntu intrepid is out in three days... now the question of how to migrate my kde4 settings. Hopefully I can just rename .kde4 to .kde and have it work... hopefully |
| 21:13.47 | *** join/#wowuidev |Yssaril| (n=Yssaril@adsl-99-145-232-29.dsl.emhril.sbcglobal.net) |
| 21:13.48 | Esamynn | http://forums.worldofwarcraft.com/thread.html?topicId=11829509144&sid=1 <-- good post, he makes some good points about the zombie event |
| 21:13.50 | ScytheBlade1 | For reasons unrelated to AoE farming |
| 21:13.57 | Lunessa | Seen it. I play on an RP server. Trust me... I've seen EVERYTHING. |
| 21:14.23 | NightHawkTheSane | Lunessa: i suppose i should have clarified that i wanted to see someone make it work well ;) |
| 21:14.26 | Kraps | i'm trying to decide between a priest or mage to support a pally friend |
| 21:14.55 | Lunessa | NightHawkTheSane: *chuckle* |
| 21:15.13 | Kraps | i dont know why, but i really like priests |
| 21:15.33 | kneeki | Kraps: My wife and I play a Prot Pally + Holy priest combo. We really enjoy it |
| 21:15.58 | Kraps | except that mages can port and conjure food |
| 21:16.10 | NightHawkTheSane | i leveled my prot pally with a shadow priest, that worked well also |
| 21:16.30 | Industrial | how do i make a macro to do feral charge bear in bear and cat in catform? |
| 21:16.41 | smcn | never having to look for a tank or healer is a good thing |
| 21:16.44 | Kraps | you had no mana issues between the 2 of you? |
| 21:17.37 | NightHawkTheSane | Industrial: "/cast [stance:1] Feral Charge - Bear; [stance:3] Feral Charge - Cat;" |
| 21:18.14 | NightHawkTheSane | Kraps: not significantly, no. |
| 21:18.16 | smcn | unless of course you never did the aquatic form quest ;P |
| 21:18.30 | NightHawkTheSane | well sure, but i don't make allowances for idiocy |
| 21:19.24 | Dashkal | it'dve been nice if they had added stance aliases, though. stance:bear, stance:cat, stance:flight, etc |
| 21:19.40 | NightHawkTheSane | feh, that just takes up more space in your macro |
| 21:19.52 | Dashkal | A macro that short isn't likely to be space constrained |
| 21:19.55 | NightHawkTheSane | i, for one, can count to 5 just fine |
| 21:20.09 | Dashkal | I can't. I had to go hunt through wowprogramming to find the 1 and 3 |
| 21:20.17 | smcn | well lah dee dah |
| 21:20.19 | Dashkal | (wowwiki was dead at the time) |
| 21:20.46 | Dashkal | I also hate magic numbers on principal. So yeah, wtb aliases |
| 21:20.56 | Dashkal | kd3: forums too. Was a bad day for sites :p |
| 21:20.57 | Lunessa | Dashkal: ~fail! Cogwheel's Complete Macro Guide is on the forums, n00b! |
| 21:21.05 | Dashkal | It was shortly after 3.0 hit live |
| 21:21.29 | *** join/#wowuidev MoonWolf (n=MoonWolf@i209133.upc-i.chello.nl) |
| 21:21.29 | *** mode/#WoWUIDev [+v MoonWolf] by ChanServ |
| 21:21.33 | Industrial | NightHawkTheSane: ty |
| 21:22.12 | NightHawkTheSane | np. I've macroed like half of my druids abilities, as they're on keybinds shared with cat/bear/caster form, so each button does three things >.> |
| 21:22.18 | Dashkal | Not that it would have mattered long term. I mean worst case I just trial and error it. It was either counting from zero or from one |
| 21:22.42 | NightHawkTheSane | as far as wow is concerned, you pretty much always count from 1 |
| 21:22.47 | Dashkal | yep |
| 21:22.57 | Dashkal | So had I been forced to guess, I likely would have had it first try anyway |
| 21:23.04 | NightHawkTheSane | see :) |
| 21:23.17 | Dashkal | The fact that it can be figured out doesn't excuse the use of magic numbers |
| 21:23.42 | NightHawkTheSane | certainly not disagreeing. but i just don't think it's a huge problem |
| 21:23.52 | *** join/#wowuidev keias (i=saiek@c-69-245-192-208.hsd1.in.comcast.net) |
| 21:24.13 | Dashkal | not really, no. I managed my macros just fine (actually, macro singular, I only ended up having to macro faerie fire all said and done) |
| 21:25.04 | malreth | ok... now THIS is a scary jack-o-lantern: http://starbucks.mirror.waffleimages.com/files/27/27752a96d20f1f0239a9357e8c87a8795f2820a5.jpg |
| 21:25.49 | foxlit | They're not "magic" |
| 21:26.10 | foxlit | In fact, your assumption that stance:1 is bear form is flawed |
| 21:26.15 | cladhaire | truth |
| 21:26.26 | cladhaire | !api shapeshift |
| 21:26.27 | lua_bot | Found 6 possible results for 'shapeshift': CastShapeshiftForm, GetNumShapeshiftForms, GetShapeshiftFormInfo, GetShapeshiftFormCooldown, GetShapeshiftForm, CancelShapeshiftForm |
| 21:26.41 | Dashkal | foxlit: using 'magic' in the sense that the numbers are not inherently meaningful in the light of stances. |
| 21:26.53 | cladhaire | you use GetNumShapeshiftForms and GetShapeshiftFormInfo to get what you need |
| 21:26.58 | cladhaire | and they're programatically correct |
| 21:27.11 | Dashkal | all well and good except you can't use those in a macro. |
| 21:28.01 | NightHawkTheSane | foxlit: assuming the druid isn't an idiot and does their quests in the order they get them the numbers will be same across board. as i said, i dont make allowances for stupidity :) |
| 21:28.03 | Lunessa | malreth: And right now, some one, somewhere is saying "I can't wait to be alone in the dark with that." |
| 21:28.26 | cog|work | Dashkal: http://forums.worldofwarcraft.com/thread.html?topicId=3881820910&sid=1#11 |
| 21:28.39 | cog|work | fwiw |
| 21:28.43 | Dashkal | cog|work: I know. the forums were down at the time I had that problem |
| 21:28.56 | Dashkal | I used the book again, pretty sure it was one of your chapters that documented it, actually |
| 21:29.16 | cog|work | Chapter 26 ;) |
| 21:29.35 | cog|work | in fact, that section of chapter 26 was taken mostly verbatim from my macro guide ;) |
| 21:29.41 | Dashkal | :p |
| 21:29.59 | foxlit | zomg plagiarism! |
| 21:30.23 | Dashkal | That would be why I thought of it. Failing that I would have just guessed (omg it's so hard to count across my stance bar :p) But it made me glad for the book again |
| 21:30.43 | Dashkal | still wtb aliases for those numbers |
| 21:31.08 | cog|work | one problem with aliases is localization... |
| 21:31.09 | foxlit | your shapeshift bar makes for a viable alias when you're writing your own macros |
| 21:31.20 | Dashkal | cog|work: point |
| 21:31.32 | Dashkal | foxlit: Not enough space on the cat bar |
| 21:31.55 | foxlit | no, I mean you can easily look up the indices. |
| 21:32.09 | Dashkal | or bear for that matter. I ran out of buttons on both. Cat is mostly alievated by macrosing the stealth powers, but the extra ones from talents were just too many |
| 21:32.22 | Dashkal | oh, yeah, that's what I said |
| 21:32.24 | cog|work | malreth: stop feeding the troll... |
| 21:32.31 | cog|work | we don't need another magelo thread :P |
| 21:32.31 | Dashkal | stance bar == shapeshift bar |
| 21:32.45 | NightHawkTheSane | Dashkal: get an action bar mod that uses a prowl bar for stealth? >.> |
| 21:32.59 | NightHawkTheSane | not that cats actually have many abilities that are stealth only |
| 21:33.02 | Dashkal | NightHawkTheSane: I use blizzard default. Makes life easier when switching computers |
| 21:33.24 | Dashkal | Not realy no. I just attached ravage to mange and pounce to rake |
| 21:33.27 | malreth | mmm... no. gonna keep feeding him. he's entertaining. |
| 21:33.27 | foxlit | macro them |
| 21:33.30 | Dashkal | (yes, I use rake, it's handy vs rogues) |
| 21:33.43 | NightHawkTheSane | rake's dps seems to have been buffed at some point |
| 21:33.49 | NightHawkTheSane | the dot is surprisingly powerful |
| 21:33.58 | Dashkal | I should consider adding it to my rotation then |
| 21:34.33 | Dashkal | pounce, rake, and rip under mangle buff should be pretty good then |
| 21:34.56 | Dashkal | wtb DPS warriors in my guild so I can skip mangle for more shreds :p |
| 21:37.17 | Lunessa | malreth: He's stupid, belligerent, and possibly failed logic in school. |
| 21:37.51 | *** join/#wowuidev Shirik (n=nospam@conspiracy/developer/Shirik) |
| 21:37.52 | *** mode/#WoWUIDev [+o Shirik] by ChanServ |
| 21:38.08 | Dashkal | What's the name of the warrior +bleed talent? |
| 21:39.22 | Dashkal | I need to write myself a trivial snooping addon that checks for interesting talents on other raid members |
| 21:40.08 | NightHawkTheSane | trauma, i want to say? |
| 21:40.51 | Dashkal | there it is, arms talent |
| 21:40.53 | Dashkal | danke |
| 21:41.14 | Dashkal | sadly arms warriors are rather rare in PvE |
| 21:41.44 | Dashkal | But especially with the new energy system shred is simply better than mangle. Only way to avoid mangle is with an arms warrior |
| 21:42.12 | NightHawkTheSane | er, arms warriors have been more common than fury, typically |
| 21:42.39 | Esamynn | oh? |
| 21:42.41 | Dashkal | Our warriors seemed to prefer fury *shrugs* there was one who preferred arms, but was almost never not prot |
| 21:42.59 | NightHawkTheSane | *shrug* up until 3.0 at least, arms was better raid dps, i believe |
| 21:43.03 | Dashkal | When he wanted to do damage he just switched to the hunter alt |
| 21:43.08 | NightHawkTheSane | i dont now, though |
| 21:48.50 | *** join/#wowuidev Jagannath (i=Jagannat@adsl-75-33-15-53.dsl.sndg02.sbcglobal.net) |
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| 21:54.25 | *** join/#wowuidev vithos (n=vithos@unaffiliated/vithos) |
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| 21:59.47 | Lunessa | Hunter aspects honor the '!' modifier, no? |
| 22:05.12 | vithos | Lunessa: yes |
| 22:05.29 | Lunessa | thanks. Deleted my hunter before it was added. |
| 22:06.26 | Saryai_ | Is it just my code, or is the Offline tag and colordisconnected = true in oUF not working properly? |
| 22:07.53 | Saryai_ | NightHawkTheSane: Fury was better up to a certain gear level, then they evened out. I think arms got marginally better at the absolute top end. |
| 22:09.25 | Saryai | Is it just my code, or is the Offline tag and colordisconnected = true in oUF not working properly? |
| 22:10.06 | Saryai | (Sorry if I doubleposted there... got disconnected a while back and hadn't realized my reg had expired) |
| 22:10.23 | mikma | "Thank you for participating in our most memorable event to date. for better or for.. brrrrrrraaaaaains. " |
| 22:12.02 | NeoTron | Dashkal: we had one arms warrior that managed to do 1800-2000 DPS on patchwer |
| 22:12.11 | NeoTron | in addition to >400 RDPS benefit from the debuff |
| 22:12.27 | Dashkal | NeoTron: Now here's hoping that some of my guild |
| 22:12.31 | Dashkal | s warriors will realize that |
| 22:12.41 | NeoTron | of course... he sucked on M'uru :( |
| 22:12.44 | Dashkal | I hate the class, personally, so won't be doing that myself :p |
| 22:13.07 | Saryai | I still haven't tried arms since the patch. |
| 22:14.14 | Dashkal | Saryai: be sure to pick up trauma, the druids will love you :p |
| 22:14.23 | Dashkal | cats anyway :p |
| 22:14.27 | Saryai | Hehe, wouldn't leave home without it. |
| 22:14.48 | NightHawkTheSane | i'd have to bitchslap any arms war who showed up to a raid without it |
| 22:14.59 | NeoTron | I tried to tank on my paladin in Heroic MGT |
| 22:15.11 | NeoTron | it was pretty sad, lost threat a lot to the SWP geared dps |
| 22:15.26 | NeoTron | ... then I realized that it might have helped if I used a weapon with weapon skill higher than 330 |
| 22:15.36 | NeoTron | I used the one weapon type (1h axe) which I hadn't skilled up |
| 22:15.45 | Saryai | XD |
| 22:16.00 | Saryai | Was about to ask if you were using a spellpower weapon or not, that answered it. =P |
| 22:16.23 | Gnarfoz | spellpower weaponz ftw |
| 22:16.28 | NightHawkTheSane | i thought you were going to say "it might have helped if i was using righteous fury" |
| 22:16.37 | Saryai | Hehe |
| 22:16.37 | Gnarfoz | yeah, that was my initial thought, too |
| 22:16.46 | NightHawkTheSane | cause, uh, i've done that ;) |
| 22:17.05 | NeoTron | Saryai: I wasn't but should have |
| 22:17.24 | NeoTron | still despite this crap weapon skill I did 1500 tps on a single target boss |
| 22:17.34 | Saryai | Eh, full tanking weapons are better unless you're doing massive aoe pulls |
| 22:17.40 | NightHawkTheSane | argh |
| 22:17.43 | NeoTron | it also helped a bit when I put righteous defense back on my toolbar |
| 22:17.47 | NightHawkTheSane | wtb more necropolis spawns |
| 22:17.51 | Saryai | lawlz. |
| 22:17.51 | NeoTron | Saryai: yeah but not at 330 skill :P |
| 22:17.55 | Saryai | Hehe |
| 22:17.55 | Gnarfoz | even more? |
| 22:18.05 | NeoTron | I use the tank axe from ZA |
| 22:18.07 | Gnarfoz | they respawn into themselves now |
| 22:18.13 | Saryai | Ahh, nice one. |
| 22:18.21 | NightHawkTheSane | Gnarfoz: aside from the bugged one in blasted lands, there hasn't been ANY for an hour or so now |
| 22:18.32 | Gnarfoz | must be your realm |
| 22:18.34 | Gnarfoz | :} |
| 22:18.35 | NightHawkTheSane | yeah |
| 22:18.40 | *** join/#wowuidev _Xoc (i=Xoc@89.160.66.26) |
| 22:18.40 | NeoTron | I am also a bit squishy to aoe tank the whole of HMGT |
| 22:18.43 | Gnarfoz | or my realm sucking at actually killing the invaders |
| 22:18.44 | NeoTron | kara/za level gear |
| 22:18.50 | NightHawkTheSane | There's raids of alliance camping spawns usually |
| 22:18.56 | NeoTron | we didn't use any CC until after the 2nd boss |
| 22:18.57 | Gnarfoz | :O |
| 22:19.00 | Gnarfoz | raids |
| 22:19.05 | NightHawkTheSane | raids. |
| 22:19.11 | Gnarfoz | I've not seen raids of people anywhere |
| 22:19.17 | Gnarfoz | except instances, of course :p |
| 22:19.23 | NightHawkTheSane | i -know- they were raids, because i saw a priest slap pw:f on like 12 people :p |
| 22:19.23 | Gnarfoz | damn my server is dead^^ |
| 22:20.11 | NightHawkTheSane | i managed to find one uncamped one in WS earlier, got my shaman the tabard. but i'd like to get it on my other toons, and maybe some gear on my pally |
| 22:20.44 | *** join/#wowuidev Dewin1 (n=Daniel@c-71-193-237-252.hsd1.or.comcast.net) |
| 22:20.50 | Dashkal | Oh good, GC is looking at paladin's single target DPS when they don't (ab)use the AoE abilities to bolster it. |
| 22:24.21 | NeoTron | maybe the problem is that the pally design makes dps higher, in general, while using aoe? |
| 22:24.29 | NeoTron | since if you don't use consecration you waste GCD's |
| 22:25.50 | NightHawkTheSane | wait, a paladin using consecration has higher dps than one not in a non-gcd-limited situation? that's crazy talk! |
| 22:26.05 | NeoTron | only way to make aoe not worth it is to have something to do on each gdc instead of it |
| 22:26.13 | NeoTron | that does more single target dps... |
| 22:26.23 | NeoTron | sort of like DK's - blood strike vs bloodboil |
| 22:26.46 | NightHawkTheSane | sadly, the one thing i liked about paladins is that they weren't fighting the gcd |
| 22:27.11 | NeoTron | Consecrate Weapon - your weapon deals an additonal x to y damage per hit for 10 seconds. |
| 22:27.15 | Dashkal | Actually, that's part of why I enjoy cat DPS. We aren't GCD constrained, we're energy constrained, which is quite a bit slower |
| 22:27.22 | NeoTron | where x-y depends on speed, and is more than consecrate |
| 22:27.54 | NeoTron | NightHawkTheSane: I find you're quite gcd constrained now, at least against undead mobs |
| 22:28.00 | *** join/#wowuidev alestane (n=nevin@c-76-24-240-47.hsd1.ma.comcast.net) |
| 22:28.00 | *** mode/#WoWUIDev [+v alestane] by ChanServ |
| 22:28.06 | Gnarfoz | yeah :O |
| 22:28.15 | Gnarfoz | I have trouble using everything ;D |
| 22:28.21 | Gnarfoz | especially under 35% |
| 22:28.33 | NightHawkTheSane | NeoTron: maybe so against undead mobs, and I also haven't played ret since before 3.0. |
| 22:28.38 | Gnarfoz | it's like "damn which button does the most damage of these, I gotta leave some of them out" |
| 22:28.52 | Gnarfoz | but now on beta, to not run oom... |
| 22:28.54 | NeoTron | consecrate on average seems to add 458 DPS |
| 22:28.59 | Gnarfoz | *boring* |
| 22:29.06 | Gnarfoz | because there's only judgement + cs :X |
| 22:29.17 | NightHawkTheSane | NeoTron: regarding 'consecrate weapon', i think a better solution would be to make it equal dps, but maybe more mana efficiant :p |
| 22:29.34 | NeoTron | sure |
| 22:29.44 | NightHawkTheSane | that way you're not actually buffing ret dps, which they probably don't really need |
| 22:29.46 | NeoTron | still it would give the pally a choice that matches the situation |
| 22:29.53 | NightHawkTheSane | exactly |
| 22:30.42 | Dashkal | suggestions forum gogo? Be nice if GC got wind of that :p |
| 22:31.09 | NightHawkTheSane | go NeoTron, go! |
| 22:31.49 | Gnarfoz | well... well. |
| 22:31.57 | Gnarfoz | bottom of the barrel, anyway ~~ |
| 22:32.13 | NightHawkTheSane | actually. what precisely IS the problem with a paladin spamming consecrate to boost their dps anyway? is it just the fact that it blows them out of mana? |
| 22:32.52 | Dashkal | NightHawkTheSane: That appears to be the current thinking, yes. |
| 22:32.55 | NightHawkTheSane | hmm. |
| 22:33.25 | Dashkal | The thought goes that a pala operating at max DPS will run oom before the average boss runs ooh |
| 22:33.34 | NightHawkTheSane | so really, the problem isn't "paladins are abusing consecrate to inflate their dps" but "paladins are filling in gcd cycles with their only other ability -- consecrate -- which happens to be highly inefficiant" |
| 22:33.59 | NeoTron | NightHawkTheSane: the problem is in fact that to be competetive they need consecrate |
| 22:34.19 | NeoTron | DPS is good but only by wasting mana on expensive aoe abilities, which in turn makes them burn mana too fast |
| 22:34.20 | Dashkal | Yep. If that's actually the issue than NeoTron's idea is a pretty good solution. |
| 22:34.37 | Dashkal | Just make sure the CD is shared between the two |
| 22:34.43 | NightHawkTheSane | obvoiusly |
| 22:36.20 | NightHawkTheSane | the thing i'm thinking is that if they look at paladin dps sans-consecrate, that's flawed, because unless they can honestly fill every GCD with a superior ability, consecrate would always provide a dps boost, and you're back at square one. |
| 22:37.39 | Dashkal | Not necessarily. If they can get pala DPS sans-concencrate up where it needs to be, those who pump aoe anyway in spare cycles and go oom can pretty much deal. Side effect is pala DPS will inversely scale with the length of the fight up until that magic OOM time is reached |
| 22:38.02 | NeoTron | http://forums.worldofwarcraft.com/thread.html?topicId=11829579251&postId=118545938924&sid=2000#43 |
| 22:38.20 | Dashkal | (not saying it's ideal, just that it wouldn't necessarily break) |
| 22:38.49 | Dashkal | woot |
| 22:38.57 | NightHawkTheSane | Dashkal: well, the problem then becomes in fights short enough to avoid the OOM issue, paladins have a solid source of extra dps |
| 22:39.05 | Dashkal | hopefully he takes it. But we're so close to live getting a new skill in will be hard. |
| 22:39.12 | Dashkal | NightHawkTheSane: Agreed |
| 22:39.24 | NightHawkTheSane | That's like saying "rogues get 5% extra dps on fights under 3m" |
| 22:39.35 | Dashkal | That's exactly what I was saying |
| 22:39.48 | Dashkal | Which is why it isn't at all ideal. |
| 22:40.00 | NeoTron | NightHawkTheSane: except by sharing the cooldown, that wouldn't be an issue |
| 22:40.11 | NeoTron | I think holy wrath is completely inconsequental with its 30s cooldown though |
| 22:40.17 | NeoTron | or mostly |
| 22:40.18 | Gnarfoz | consecrate should have a minimum number of targets requirement or smoething |
| 22:40.19 | Saryai | oUF_TaroParty.lua:129: Usage: UnitIsConnected("unit") |
| 22:40.21 | Saryai | Grr... |
| 22:40.21 | NightHawkTheSane | NeoTron: yeah, i was just considering other possibilities for solving the problem, though |
| 22:40.28 | Dashkal | With the new skill this issue is avoided. I was talking about an alternate solution of buffing single target abilities |
| 22:40.29 | NightHawkTheSane | Gnarfoz: nah, that'd be a prot nerf then |
| 22:40.35 | Gnarfoz | NightHawkTheSane: not at all? |
| 22:40.39 | NeoTron | as long as consecrate adds 450 DPS ppl will use it if there isnt' a better choice |
| 22:40.51 | Gnarfoz | at least not for AoE tanking, that is |
| 22:41.06 | NeoTron | Gnarfoz: it's a pretty important tank threat tool in general, even single targets |
| 22:41.10 | NightHawkTheSane | not for aoe tanking, but tanking anything under that minimum number, it would be, although arguably minor |
| 22:41.10 | Gnarfoz | well |
| 22:41.18 | Gnarfoz | that's because it does so much dps + is holy dmg |
| 22:41.26 | NeoTron | right |
| 22:41.35 | NightHawkTheSane | if it adds 450 dps to a ret pally on a single target, how much tps does it add to a prot pally? :p |
| 22:41.38 | NeoTron | but yeah buffing two seals does nothing |
| 22:41.47 | Gnarfoz | toggling RF should make some abilities' dmg turn holy only then. :D |
| 22:41.50 | NeoTron | it will just mean ppl will use consecration adn buffed seals |
| 22:42.11 | Gnarfoz | it's a serious design problem :\ |
| 22:42.37 | Dashkal | NeoTron: I was pointing out earler that while true, smart palas would conserve mana, maintain their overall DPS, and not run oom for fights longer than the magic duration |
| 22:42.38 | Gnarfoz | too bad instead of 'toning ret down' they hammered it into the ground for the time being. ;D |
| 22:42.48 | Dashkal | dumb ones would just spam anyway, run oom, and QQ |
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| 22:42.59 | NightHawkTheSane | Gnarfoz: I think that'd also be less than ideal, as ret paladins could potentially use RF to avoid armor issues or something ;) |
| 22:43.20 | Gnarfoz | RF gives you +90% threat |
| 22:43.23 | Gnarfoz | I doubt that's a wise idea |
| 22:43.24 | Gnarfoz | :D |
| 22:43.30 | NightHawkTheSane | well, not in pve, no. |
| 22:43.31 | NeoTron | Dashkal: but minmaxers would farm scholo for dark runes and such to maximize mana regen enough to be able to use consecrate |
| 22:43.33 | *** join/#wowuidev Droolio (n=drool@87-194-188-170.bethere.co.uk) |
| 22:43.33 | NightHawkTheSane | but in other situations |
| 22:43.35 | Dashkal | I agree that the new skills would be better suited. Just thinking that the buffs might make a good stopover until there's time for the new ones |
| 22:43.37 | Gnarfoz | oh, right |
| 22:43.42 | Gnarfoz | I keep forgetting about pvp |
| 22:43.53 | NightHawkTheSane | yeah, as much as i am loathe to admit it, the designers DO care about pvp ;) |
| 22:44.09 | NeoTron | pvp for ret pallies is rpetty grim |
| 22:44.10 | *** join/#wowuidev Norsken (n=xkxaxn@84-217-13-171.tn.glocalnet.net) |
| 22:44.17 | NeoTron | a few seconds to go OOM abd become totally useless |
| 22:44.19 | jacklondon | Hi, If I wanted to make a macro that cast chimera shot, kill command, aimed shot and then had a reset for 10 seconds on it how would i do that? |
| 22:44.20 | Gnarfoz | s/pvp/wow/ |
| 22:44.22 | Dashkal | Good as blizzard can be for getting new abilities out, three weeks is prolly not gonna happen :p |
| 22:44.29 | Gnarfoz | no purl, I meant NeoTron, grrr |
| 22:44.50 | NeoTron | I wouldn't say pve is horrible |
| 22:44.51 | Dashkal | Gnarfoz: leave off the final / :p |
| 22:45.15 | NightHawkTheSane | Dashkal: *shrug* i wouldn't put it past them, but I think they have longer than 3 weeks |
| 22:45.25 | NightHawkTheSane | Dashkal: this honestly isn't an issue until paladins start raiding at level 80 |
| 22:45.26 | Antiarc | WTB beta testing for SexyMap >_> |
| 22:45.31 | Gnarfoz | Dashkal: 3 weeks tells me nothing's gonna happen, but I'm pessimistic about this because I switched mains from rogue to pally for wrath (*before* they were insanely OP, mind you. xD) |
| 22:45.38 | Dashkal | NightHawkTheSane: that would make it 4 weeks :p |
| 22:45.38 | Antiarc | http://wow.curse.com/downloads/wow-addons/details/sexymap.aspx |
| 22:45.43 | NeoTron | it's easier for them to tweak a seal |
| 22:45.56 | NeoTron | but if they think ppl will stop using consecrate due to that they are sorely mistaken |
| 22:46.08 | NightHawkTheSane | Dashkal: nah, i'd say 6-7 before any more than the most hardcore guilds really start |
| 22:46.13 | Dashkal | less for the min/max world first guilds. I expect to see Kel'Thuzzad die within a week of release |
| 22:46.17 | Gnarfoz | NightHawkTheSane: what |
| 22:46.27 | NeoTron | Dashkal: likely but.. who cares? :P |
| 22:46.29 | Dashkal | quite the span in our predictions |
| 22:46.42 | Dashkal | NeoTron: those guilds that will be trying for naxx world firsts? |
| 22:46.44 | NeoTron | and NightHawkTheSane said "more than the most hardcore guilds" |
| 22:46.50 | Dashkal | and every guild trying for a realm first |
| 22:47.06 | Lunessa | Antiarc: If it's a sexy as Chatter... |
| 22:47.08 | Gnarfoz | it's not like kel'thuzad is challenging ;) |
| 22:47.08 | NeoTron | I know it won't be us, our members have lives :P |
| 22:47.08 | Dashkal | While not the majority, that's still a good chunk of players |
| 22:47.17 | NightHawkTheSane | Antiarc: now, why would i use this over simpleminimap? |
| 22:47.20 | Dashkal | I won't see 80 until a month post release :p |
| 22:47.20 | Gnarfoz | level up 25 people, already in full SWP gear |
| 22:47.23 | Gnarfoz | beat naxx25 |
| 22:47.24 | Gnarfoz | done |
| 22:47.30 | Antiarc | NightHawkTheSane: It's prettier, and it handles your buttons better |
| 22:47.40 | Antiarc | Options to hide them, and fade them in when you hover over the map |
| 22:47.47 | NeoTron | I suspect my guild might have visitied Naxx before I make 80 |
| 22:47.48 | Antiarc | Makes for a very clean UI |
| 22:47.52 | Antiarc | Lunessa: http://www.wowace.com/projects/sexymap/images/ |
| 22:48.36 | Lunessa | Curse you. Curse you.. Now I might have to go back to a non-square map... |
| 22:48.38 | NightHawkTheSane | Antiarc: does it have fun stuff like auto-zoom, and moving quest watch, capture, and quest timer frame? :P |
| 22:48.48 | Lunessa | ^^ |
| 22:48.49 | Antiarc | Doesn't have autozoom yet, but that's trivial |
| 22:48.51 | Antiarc | Has the other stuff though |
| 22:49.07 | NightHawkTheSane | close enough :) |
| 22:49.23 | NightHawkTheSane | but yeah, an auto-zoom-out after x seconds would be nice |
| 22:49.32 | Lunessa | Actually, it might lower my number of embedded libs ... hrm... |
| 22:49.39 | Dashkal | Mine may well be poking at naxx before I 80, but that's cause I have a 15 level penality |
| 22:49.55 | Dashkal | *shrugs* it'll be worth it |
| 22:51.31 | Dashkal | I'm gonna have serious issues gearing up my tank set :S |
| 22:51.38 | Dashkal | I won't be playing enough to command a tank slot |
| 22:51.55 | Lunessa | SPeaking of Chatter - the border expands to cover the tabs on all frames but the combat log... which gives me a jumping border ... what gives? :P |
| 22:52.34 | Antiarc | The combat frame is "special" :/ |
| 22:52.40 | Antiarc | combat log frame* |
| 22:53.13 | Antiarc | Check Borders/Background => Chat Frame 2 => tick "Combat Log Fix" |
| 22:53.17 | mikma | http://wow.reaktio.net/test/WoWScrnShot_102808_005127.jpg |
| 22:53.44 | krka | is there a boat from stormwind to menethil? |
| 22:53.48 | mikma | yes |
| 22:53.50 | Dashkal | Is there a mod that can steal the minimap buttons (all of them if possible) and turn them into LDB launchers? |
| 22:53.58 | mikma | propably |
| 22:53.59 | Lunessa | Ahh... I KNEW there was a setting for it. |
| 22:54.00 | Dashkal | krka: neg |
| 22:54.04 | Lunessa | Thanks man. |
| 22:54.12 | Dashkal | stormwind connects to auberdine and borean tundra |
| 22:54.19 | mikma | oh right |
| 22:54.20 | krka | so... how do i get to menethil? |
| 22:54.23 | mikma | it was audorkdine |
| 22:54.27 | Dashkal | Ironforge and a bird |
| 22:54.29 | krka | ironforge and then walk / bird? |
| 22:54.29 | alestane | krka: From? |
| 22:54.31 | krka | doh |
| 22:54.37 | Dashkal | Menethil connects to Theramore and Howling Fjord |
| 22:54.38 | krka | dont have menethil FP yet |
| 22:54.48 | Dashkal | walk :p |
| 22:54.49 | krka | hm... how do i get to theramore? |
| 22:54.56 | NightHawkTheSane | walk. |
| 22:54.57 | Dashkal | what do you have? |
| 22:55.04 | alestane | Run through level 35 territory. |
| 22:55.06 | krka | SW -> northrend -> fjord -> theramore -> menethil |
| 22:55.09 | kd3 | deathflop through wetlands or go to BB and head to rachet |
| 22:55.15 | Dashkal | Theramore is level 35, you'd be much better off running ironforge, loch modan, wetlands |
| 22:55.49 | krka | i have darnassus, auberdine, astranaar |
| 22:56.10 | NightHawkTheSane | hmm.. so wait, the auberdine boat now goes to SW and not menethil? |
| 22:56.14 | Dashkal | You can also stash your gear and run out of the dward starter zone and splat, which will let you spirit rez next to menethil |
| 22:56.25 | alestane | NightHawkTheSane: That is correct. |
| 22:56.25 | NightHawkTheSane | shit, that made nelf runs to SW so much easier. |
| 22:56.41 | krka | yes, and one of the quest so much harder |
| 22:56.41 | NightHawkTheSane | man, fucking alliance. |
| 22:56.43 | Dashkal | (There's a spot in Dun Morgath[sp] that lets you just run right out, but there's no safe way down, you _will_ splat) |
| 22:56.51 | krka | the quest literally says "take the boat from auberdine to menethil" |
| 22:57.02 | NightHawkTheSane | krka: bug report imo |
| 22:57.06 | krka | yeah |
| 22:57.13 | Dashkal | NightHawkTheSane: about damn time too. I've been jealous of the zeps forever |
| 22:57.38 | NightHawkTheSane | Dashkal: with that change, alliance capital city interconnectivity is pretty much strictly better than horde |
| 22:58.06 | Dashkal | NightHawkTheSane: it is, I admit. Darnassus to the Exodar is easier than Org to Thunder Bluff |
| 22:58.21 | NightHawkTheSane | especially for lowbies |
| 22:58.37 | krka | all alliance cities are basically connected now |
| 22:58.42 | NightHawkTheSane | ^ |
| 22:58.47 | krka | darnassus <-> auberdine <-> exodar |
| 22:58.52 | Dashkal | krka: Exodar still requires jumping through Darkshore |
| 22:59.01 | Dashkal | TB requires jumping through the barrens |
| 22:59.01 | krka | auberdine <-> stormwind <-> ironforge |
| 22:59.01 | NightHawkTheSane | Dashkal: but you never have to leave town |
| 22:59.13 | krka | jumping through darkshore? |
| 22:59.23 | krka | just fly from darnassus to auberdine and take the boat |
| 22:59.24 | Dashkal | the zone, not running along the road |
| 22:59.33 | Dashkal | we're in agreement here |
| 22:59.33 | krka | true |
| 22:59.46 | krka | i thought this was abuse |
| 22:59.48 | Dashkal | I have little sympathy having had to make that damn deathflop so many damn times :p |
| 22:59.57 | Antiarc | NightHawkTheSane: (3:59:50 PM) Repo: sexymap: Antiarc master * 6d2172f / (4 files in 2 directories): [+1 commit] Add AutoZoom module |
| 23:00.08 | NightHawkTheSane | Antiarc: you're the man. |
| 23:00.10 | Dashkal | The barrens isn't nearly as dangerous as the wetlands :p |
| 23:00.28 | NightHawkTheSane | true, especially now that they're FPs every thirty feet |
| 23:00.59 | Dashkal | That said, an automatic flight point between TB and XR and Org wouldn't really be a bad thing |
| 23:01.10 | NightHawkTheSane | meh, don't even need XR |
| 23:01.18 | Dashkal | or a zep tower near TB |
| 23:01.26 | NightHawkTheSane | I really think every toon ought to have the FP for every capital city automatically learned |
| 23:01.55 | Dashkal | I was under the impression that the flight from TB to Org passed through XR? Alli here so I could just be wrong |
| 23:02.00 | NightHawkTheSane | it does not |
| 23:02.06 | NightHawkTheSane | there's a direct flight, like there is from sw-if |
| 23:02.08 | Dashkal | ahh ok, then yes, it should just be there by default |
| 23:02.09 | alestane | There is a direct flight. |
| 23:02.51 | Dashkal | I have my tram, which is faster than the bird depending on where in town you are :p |
| 23:03.01 | NightHawkTheSane | fucking tram ;) |
| 23:03.21 | *** join/#wowuidev jacklondon (n=simpleja@118.13.189.72.cfl.res.rr.com) |
| 23:03.58 | NightHawkTheSane | course, we've got the silvermoon/UC teleporter, so thats nice |
| 23:04.01 | Dashkal | Oh hell no, it's good for horde too. Makes a hell of a staging area |
| 23:04.07 | NightHawkTheSane | true, that |
| 23:04.46 | Dashkal | MUCH easier to attack the cities from there than from the gates. Avoiding the commercial plazas is win |
| 23:05.19 | Dashkal | and *hint hint* the stormwind keep is right near the tram :p |
| 23:06.53 | Lunessa | Tram... I thought that's where the fucking went on? |
| 23:08.06 | Dashkal | Lunessa: no, that's the inn |
| 23:08.29 | Dashkal | Or the house hidden in old town |
| 23:08.32 | Lunessa | Goldshire: You will never find a more wretched hive of scum and villainy. |
| 23:09.00 | Dashkal | I try to stay the hell away from that town. Despite my preference for the human starting quests, I stay out of town as much as I can |
| 23:09.02 | *** join/#wowuidev Sangi_ (n=Sangi@adsl-074-180-078-094.sip.msy.bellsouth.net) |
| 23:09.50 | Dashkal | Bonus: I'm on an RP server. |
| 23:10.02 | Antiarc | Goldshire is the worst place ever |
| 23:10.05 | *** join/#wowuidev Funkeh` (n=funk@WoWUIDev/WoWAce/Ace3/BigWigs/funkeh) |
| 23:10.38 | ZorbaTHut | no more zombies :( |
| 23:10.54 | NightHawkTheSane | grinding scourge invasion mobs on my prot pally is so win |
| 23:12.06 | Dashkal | Now... what's Arthas gonna throw at us next? |
| 23:12.14 | Drakhaon | is it possible to save variables without reloading UI? |
| 23:12.14 | mikma | himself |
| 23:12.22 | mikma | drakhaon: no |
| 23:12.36 | Gnarfoz | not for us, at least |
| 23:13.29 | Drakhaon | ok - so /reload is the current quickest way to safekeep variables |
| 23:13.37 | *** join/#wowuidev Sixen1 (n=Sixen@12-210-157-250.client.mchsi.com) |
| 23:13.41 | *** join/#wowuidev |Yssaril| (n=Yssaril@adsl-99-145-232-29.dsl.emhril.sbcglobal.net) |
| 23:13.48 | mikma | i'm sure some *cough*developers*cough* can use blizzard restricted API to do whatever they want |
| 23:14.09 | Cide | >>> 10*10^6/100000 |
| 23:14.09 | Cide | Cide: 100 |
| 23:14.34 | Gnarfoz | cide wins the IQ competition |
| 23:14.35 | Cide | >>> 10^7/10000 |
| 23:14.35 | Cide | Cide: 1000 |
| 23:14.43 | mikma | like back in the day when slouken coded the moving-pad for the guy that had only one working arm |
| 23:14.48 | Cide | Gnarfoz: probabl |
| 23:14.50 | Cide | probably |
| 23:15.30 | Gnarfoz | mikma: movepad didn't do anything restricted back then? oO |
| 23:15.44 | mikma | gnarfoz: yes it did actually |
| 23:15.56 | mikma | you couldn't use any movement-keys in addons |
| 23:16.06 | mikma | they just had them restricted to disable AutoTravel |
| 23:16.08 | Gnarfoz | pre 2.0? |
| 23:16.16 | mikma | aye |
| 23:16.16 | Gnarfoz | hm that. |
| 23:16.21 | *** join/#wowuidev art3mis (n=art3mis@WoWUIDev/WoWI/HKUI/art3mis) |
| 23:16.30 | Gnarfoz | so he signed the addon? |
| 23:16.33 | Gnarfoz | or what |
| 23:16.35 | mikma | yeah |
| 23:16.41 | Gnarfoz | well |
| 23:16.47 | art3mis | clad|sleep: pelase go to this and get me a t-shirt http://i36.tinypic.com/eajo2b.jpg |
| 23:16.47 | Gnarfoz | that's not surprising then, is it |
| 23:17.00 | mikma | http://www.wowinterface.com/downloads/info5476-MovePad.html |
| 23:17.11 | mikma | only addon ever released by blizz members that is signed :D |
| 23:17.51 | *** part/#wowuidev art3mis (n=art3mis@WoWUIDev/WoWI/HKUI/art3mis) |
| 23:17.51 | Gnarfoz | yeah |
| 23:17.56 | Gnarfoz | the first comment says it all |
| 23:17.57 | Gnarfoz | "Cheat? I was looking forward to see how the heck you did the movement code, but instead of secure template voodoo this is secure = 1 + .sig :P" |
| 23:18.11 | mikma | lol he even has his own rank in the forums |
| 23:23.04 | *** part/#wowuidev Tristanian (n=Tristani@adsl53-133.kln.forthnet.gr) |
| 23:26.01 | *** join/#wowuidev Kraps (n=chatzill@pool-98-113-100-116.nycmny.east.verizon.net) |
| 23:28.29 | Kraps | whats the name of the addon that turns your spell buttons red if out of range and blue if out of mana? |
| 23:28.56 | Gnarfoz | redrange? |
| 23:29.12 | Gnarfoz | (or your bar mod itself) |
| 23:29.54 | Kraps | bar mods are too messy for me |
| 23:31.01 | NightHawkTheSane | its kinda disturbing the way its easier for me to solo elites when i have 2-3 other mobs as well |
| 23:31.52 | Syzgyn | Woohoo, Wintersaber Exalted |
| 23:32.10 | NightHawkTheSane | grats |
| 23:41.46 | Kraps | NightHawkTheSane: warrior? |
| 23:41.50 | NightHawkTheSane | Kraps: prot paladin |
| 23:51.01 | NightHawkTheSane | wee, 86 necrotic runes. |
| 23:51.20 | NeoTron | Syzgyn: I'm sorry! |
| 23:51.29 | NightHawkTheSane | I think i only need two more.. |
| 23:51.32 | Syzgyn | NeoTron: Eh? |
| 23:52.14 | NeoTron | Syzgyn: having spent all that time.. for a kitty! |
| 23:54.46 | Syzgyn | A Pro kitty though! |
| 23:56.22 | NeoTron | I admire your patience |
| 23:56.33 | NeoTron | not doing much for achievements atm |
| 23:56.41 | NeoTron | since I'm changing mains I'm not very motivated |
