| 00:03.02 | NeoTron | Amarande: Amazon.com has "release day delivery" which isn't one day shipping (it's cheaper). |
| 00:03.17 | NeoTron | rather the boxes are shipped with a slower shipping option before release day |
| 00:03.47 | Seerah | *nod* we got ours through amazon - should have them delivered on the 13th |
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| 00:04.43 | NightHawkTheSane | i just put in a pre-order at the gamestop downtown, ill pop down there sometime on the 13th |
| 00:05.04 | NeoTron | I have one via amazon one via gamestop midnight release |
| 00:05.37 | Xuerian | Isn't the box irrelevant, really? Or is there actual content that was not included in the 3.0 patch? |
| 00:05.52 | NeoTron | Xuerian: the cd key |
| 00:06.10 | Xuerian | NeoTron: Won't blizz be offering "Upgrade to WotlK" like they did with bc? |
| 00:06.17 | NeoTron | Xuerian: that came later |
| 00:06.33 | NightHawkTheSane | Xuerian: they did not have that option available when TBC was released. |
| 00:06.36 | Xuerian | coming later is the question 0_o |
| 00:06.44 | NeoTron | I'm sure they will offer that in month or three after release, when the retail chains have been satiated |
| 00:06.48 | NightHawkTheSane | likely part of contractual issues with their pu blisher |
| 00:07.17 | Amarande | I'm mostly concerned if they're going to have enough copies ordered on online retailers to fill ALL the preorders |
| 00:07.22 | Amarande | or only the ones who sprung for release day shipping |
| 00:07.40 | NightHawkTheSane | Amarande: they will. to think otherwise is a little.. well. stupid. |
| 00:08.03 | Amarande | Night: I've had bad experiences with Gamestop and preorders before, mainly |
| 00:08.10 | Amarande | like when a couple of the Shin Megami Tensei games came out |
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| 00:08.28 | Amarande | people who ordered on release day got their games days before my preorder was processed |
| 00:08.52 | Neuro_Medivh | I'm just gonna show up at Wal Mart at midnight and grab a copy |
| 00:08.55 | Xuerian | Is Direct2drive offering cdkeys like they did with WAR? |
| 00:08.56 | Amarande | I preordered with one day shipping only to find out people on GameFAQs were posting that they ordered from gamestop.com on release day and had theirs day after release, while I didn't get mine for a whole damn week |
| 00:08.56 | NightHawkTheSane | I suspect that WoTLK will probably have much higher stock |
| 00:09.08 | Xuerian | Otherwise I might just drop in on walmar like Neuro_Medivh.. |
| 00:09.08 | Neuro_Medivh | sadly, I can't do what I did last time |
| 00:09.14 | Amarande | On the good side, I have two copies of Digital Devil Saga 2 because Gamestop screwed up |
| 00:09.35 | Amarande | I called up, told them I didn't get my preorder bonus like I was supposed to (after having already waited a week to get the preordered game in the first place) |
| 00:09.46 | Amarande | ... they sent me a second copy of the GAME instead of the preorder bonus. :| |
| 00:09.47 | Neuro_Medivh | for BC, I was, um, fortunate enough to get a copy, um, the day before |
| 00:10.09 | Amarande | I suppose I should have sent it back, but I really didn't feel like having Gamestop screw anything more up. :| |
| 00:10.35 | Amarande | Like, for instance, they might have given me a refund for the sent-back copy, which would mean I'd have to send -both- copies back and hope I would be able to order one back. |
| 00:10.40 | Amarande | No, that doesn't work. :) |
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| 00:12.53 | ScytheBlade1 | ... lol |
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| 00:13.07 | ScytheBlade1 | WoWInsider *just* posted a wrap-up of the Blizzcon UI panel |
| 00:13.13 | mikma | http://www.wowinterface.com/downloads/info11361-Overachiever.html |
| 00:13.34 | mikma | we need a bot that tells us about new addons! |
| 00:13.57 | Amarande | Basically, at this point, whenever I order stuff from gamestop.com I almost expect them to botch it |
| 00:14.28 | NightHawkTheSane | mikma: i nominate you to be the bot |
| 00:14.46 | Arrowmaster | i ordered fallout3 from gamestop because the preorder bonus was better than bestbuy (which i normally use) |
| 00:15.01 | mikma | nighthawkthesane: yay! |
| 00:15.07 | Arrowmaster | i didnt opt for paying extra for shipping, wonder how many months it will take |
| 00:15.21 | Amarande | I usually put preorders on 2-day now |
| 00:15.24 | Amarande | 1-day is too expensive |
| 00:15.25 | Thrae | Arrowmaster: You paid $40 for a clock? |
| 00:15.29 | NightHawkTheSane | i rarely ever order from brick & mortar stores. |
| 00:15.39 | Arrowmaster | huh? |
| 00:15.45 | NightHawkTheSane | the last time i did was for.. uh.. tbc i think. |
| 00:15.53 | Thrae | You ordered Amazon's "Survival Edition"? |
| 00:15.59 | Arrowmaster | no |
| 00:16.04 | Thrae | Ah, OK then. |
| 00:16.06 | Dashkal | Ordered from EB Games (Canadian GameStop).. will be there in person thursday morning to get the damn thing |
| 00:16.12 | Amarande | actually, perhaps the worst botch I've seen Gamestop do was Neverwinter Nights 2 |
| 00:16.18 | Amarande | I can't even remember now how long extra I waited for that |
| 00:16.25 | Amarande | And I didn't even GET the preorder bonus |
| 00:16.33 | Amarande | (although I understand the NWN2 POB can be hacked into the game with ease) |
| 00:16.55 | Wobin | Cairenn: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xWZWVng-Rjc |
| 00:17.06 | Arrowmaster | i preordered Gears of War 2 from bestbuy as soon as i saw it was available |
| 00:17.41 | Amarande | and Night: mainstreamness is no insurance against Gamestop fuckups |
| 00:17.45 | Cairenn | love all the old english! |
| 00:17.54 | Amarande | my copy of NWN2 that I preordered was delayed heavily |
| 00:18.05 | Amarande | on the other hand, my copy of a niche game like Wild ARMS 5 that I preordered came perfectly on time |
| 00:18.19 | Lopeppeppy | I ordered from Amazon last time, it came the day after release. I ordered from them again, hoping to see the same. |
| 00:18.20 | Xuerian | Don't forget, Target sometimes sells games early >_> |
| 00:18.34 | Xuerian | If you ask for them specifically, ayway |
| 00:18.47 | Arrowmaster | trying to remember where i preordered Mass Effect from, but it was online and i didnt get it for like a week to two weeks after the release |
| 00:19.10 | Arrowmaster | Xuerian: lol @ sometimes |
| 00:19.16 | Amarande | Xuerian: I'm surprised Target is still allowed to carry games :) |
| 00:19.24 | Arrowmaster | they sell everything early |
| 00:19.28 | Xuerian | heheh |
| 00:19.30 | Xuerian | You'd think |
| 00:19.30 | Wobin | Cairenn: best ad ever =) |
| 00:19.32 | Amarande | isn't the usual penalty for selling stuff before release date that the game vendor will stop allowing you to wholesale games from them? |
| 00:19.34 | Arrowmaster | including MGS4 edition PS3s |
| 00:19.45 | Xuerian | But I actually had to go in for quake wars twice, they had a sell limit on them in the register system |
| 00:19.48 | Cairenn | Wobin: it's certainly up there :) |
| 00:19.54 | Wobin | Cairenn: The OES used to be my avatar |
| 00:20.04 | Wobin | cause somehow I ended up with the surname of 'dWonderdog |
| 00:20.16 | Cairenn | hehehe |
| 00:20.23 | Wobin | (Not quite sure how that happened =P) |
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| 00:22.34 | Antiarc | Anyone know the max table size in WoW lua? |
| 00:24.16 | NightHawkTheSane | Fun: Finding a nelf hunter fishing in the -very- back of the waterfall in the valley of honor. Turning into a zombie, and infecting him. |
| 00:24.36 | Amarande | Night: that's a dubious sort of fun |
| 00:24.52 | Amarande | that's like infecting someone trying to make the mad dash through SW to get into stocks |
| 00:25.15 | alestane | Antiarc: Pretty much the limit of Lua's memory. |
| 00:25.17 | NightHawkTheSane | if by dubious, you mean hilarious. |
| 00:27.01 | End | ...this wipe() function, is it new? |
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| 00:27.56 | Amarande | Night: I guess, despite having certain sadistic tendencies, I'm not inclined to be -that- mean when griefing |
| 00:28.11 | Amarande | it's one thing to grief someone who's doing an ezmode or medium challenge task |
| 00:28.19 | Amarande | it's quite another when their task is already ultra-hard as it is |
| 00:28.22 | NightHawkTheSane | see, normally, i'm not that kind of person. |
| 00:28.28 | NightHawkTheSane | and i'd agree with you entirely |
| 00:28.35 | NightHawkTheSane | but the zombification totally made me do it |
| 00:28.46 | Shirik | alestane: Not true :) Antiarc: The guys at Auctioneer know |
| 00:28.47 | NightHawkTheSane | For the ho^WScourge! |
| 00:28.54 | Shirik | I'm not quite sure what it is off the top of my head though |
| 00:29.11 | Shirik | Antiarc: The table size has a limit due to the constants limit |
| 00:29.13 | Antiarc | In stock Lua I was able to hit 200k entries of "foo" before I aborted my test |
| 00:29.31 | Antiarc | I thought the constants limit only applied to locals? |
| 00:29.36 | Shirik | eh, actually |
| 00:29.40 | Shirik | I should be more clear |
| 00:29.43 | Shirik | are you talking about SVs? |
| 00:29.47 | Antiarc | No |
| 00:29.48 | Antiarc | Just a data file |
| 00:29.49 | Shirik | oh ok |
| 00:29.56 | Shirik | well, a data file |
| 00:29.56 | Antiarc | SVs are 64k, I think |
| 00:30.01 | Shirik | so you're going to write out a table constructor |
| 00:30.10 | Shirik | ? |
| 00:30.16 | Shirik | or you're going to process the data file? |
| 00:30.17 | Antiarc | I just have a C# program dumping a list of textures in the MPQs to a Lua table |
| 00:30.26 | Antiarc | Gonna load it up and use it as an in-game texture browser |
| 00:30.39 | Shirik | ok is it something you're processing, or is it something that'll be loadfile()'d? |
| 00:30.41 | Antiarc | Currently running 1mb and 20.3k entries |
| 00:30.43 | Xuerian | Antiarc: That's pretty much what Yatlas did |
| 00:30.57 | Antiarc | Just loading it; loadfile doesn't work in WoW, IIRC |
| 00:31.00 | Shirik | ok so in that case, alestane is correct :) |
| 00:31.06 | Antiarc | Woot. |
| 00:31.06 | Shirik | Yes it doesn't (going back to the SV idea for loadfile) |
| 00:31.12 | Shirik | Though |
| 00:31.14 | Shirik | that seems expensive :P |
| 00:31.21 | Antiarc | It's a dev tool |
| 00:31.21 | Shirik | But code first, optimize later |
| 00:31.23 | Antiarc | And will be LOD |
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| 00:31.29 | Antiarc | So I don't really care if it's clunky |
| 00:31.48 | Shirik | But to answer your question, the constants limit also applies to table constructors |
| 00:31.51 | Shirik | which is where I was going |
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| 00:32.22 | Shirik | I should go back to eating instead of picking up a conversation in the middle, sorry alestane :) |
| 00:32.33 | Shirik | I blame Lopeppeppy, she distracted me |
| 00:33.25 | Lopeppeppy | I did what huh? |
| 00:33.26 | Lopeppeppy | No way. |
| 00:35.03 | mikma | grrrrrrrrrrr |
| 00:35.18 | mikma | whats the freaking biting-fetish on cats |
| 00:35.28 | Amarande | Eww, C# |
| 00:35.34 | Shirik | Yeah Antiarc |
| 00:35.37 | Shirik | I kinda feel the same way :) |
| 00:35.42 | Shirik | Be a man, use C++ |
| 00:35.47 | mikma | *purrr, purrr, purrrr* -> Bite in hand ... wtf? |
| 00:36.02 | Tekkub | bite back, dur |
| 00:36.09 | alestane | mikma: Siamese? |
| 00:36.22 | mikma | alestane: mixed |
| 00:36.29 | Tekkub | or better yet, push in deeper so they can't close their mouth |
| 00:36.49 | alestane | That's usually just how they tell you they're done now. |
| 00:36.57 | mikma | but they have freaking sharp teeth |
| 00:37.12 | Tekkub | bonk em on the head? |
| 00:37.26 | mikma | the girlcat was purring next to me and gently but powerfully bit me in palm |
| 00:37.40 | mikma | like "oh look, chicken" |
| 00:38.23 | mikma | well i did slap the cat, cant see where i hit her cause its too dark |
| 00:39.43 | mikma | alestane: and it wasnt the usual "now i will bite you and hit my claws in you" bite =D |
| 00:40.12 | Amarande | so ... are there any well-established mage builds out yet for 3.0? |
| 00:41.02 | mikma | amarande: go frost. its freaking annoying in pvp |
| 00:41.10 | End | lol |
| 00:41.11 | mikma | cant kill good icemages |
| 00:41.16 | End | <PROTECTED> |
| 00:41.31 | ScytheBlade1 | End: yeah, it's one of the fun easter eggs in the UI. It's intentional, too |
| 00:41.31 | mikma | freeze, pew pew pew, freeze, pew pew dead. |
| 00:41.34 | Antiarc | It's 50 lines of C# to do what I need |
| 00:41.38 | Antiarc | So :P |
| 00:41.40 | alestane | End: Yes. |
| 00:41.46 | NightHawkTheSane | mikma: yay brain freeze! |
| 00:41.49 | End | yeah, I never noticed before :P |
| 00:42.13 | mikma | nighthawkthesane: if you meen the immobilizing freeze with frostmages by that... i hate you |
| 00:42.38 | NightHawkTheSane | mikma: no, i mean the 15% chance to proc an instant/free fireball off any spell with a chill effect |
| 00:43.09 | mikma | nighthawkthesane: the freezing freeze is imba =/ |
| 00:43.27 | mikma | you cant do anything when you are in it |
| 00:43.49 | NightHawkTheSane | deep freeze? |
| 00:44.43 | *** join/#wowuidev Shirik_ (n=Shirik@65-97-131-2.jax.fdn.com) |
| 00:45.07 | NightHawkTheSane | .. he's multiplyling.. KILL IT |
| 00:45.18 | Shirik | I actually don't know how to kill it |
| 00:45.33 | NightHawkTheSane | i can think of one way ;) |
| 00:45.52 | Amarande | mikma: isn't that the sort of way to get killed by a retadin? :) |
| 00:47.40 | Shirik | - Quit: Shirik_ (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)) |
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| 00:47.47 | Shirik | - Quit: Thunder_Child (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)) |
| 00:47.50 | Shirik | Coincidence? I think not! |
| 00:48.12 | mikma | amarande: no =/ |
| 00:48.28 | Amarande | also, speaking of mages |
| 00:48.40 | Amarande | is it at all possible to kill the water elemental in ghostlands at the level you're supposed to do the quest? |
| 00:48.46 | End | damn that peer! |
| 00:49.07 | Antiarc | Hrm |
| 00:49.08 | Amarande | or do mages mostly need to overlevel quests in general, unless the mobs are vulnerable to slow/immobilize effects? |
| 00:49.13 | Antiarc | 15177: escape sqeuence too large |
| 00:49.20 | Shirik | nice |
| 00:49.26 | Shirik | what's the line? |
| 00:49.34 | Antiarc | Oh |
| 00:49.35 | Antiarc | Duh |
| 00:49.37 | Antiarc | "Interface\Pictures\9330_gammerita_color_256.blp", |
| 00:49.40 | mikma | nighthawkthesane: yes, deep freeze. annoying bugger |
| 00:49.42 | Antiarc | Needs to be escaped :V |
| 00:49.43 | Shirik | failure |
| 00:50.03 | Amarande | mikma: heh, I took a look at deep freeze and it looks wimpy |
| 00:50.23 | Amarande | and living bomb looks even wimpier ... like a crappy version of seed of corruption that's also the most resisted element in the game as far as I know |
| 00:50.26 | mikma | it looks wimpy but its really annoying in pvp |
| 00:50.35 | Amarande | I forget what the 51 point arcane is or if it's any good |
| 00:50.52 | mikma | its basicly a 5sec stun |
| 00:50.54 | Amarande | but LB ... well ... |
| 00:51.05 | mikma | but keeps you iced to the ground |
| 00:51.11 | mikma | pew pew |
| 00:51.15 | Amarande | warlocks get similar at 70, it does more damage, and it doesn't even require talent investment :S |
| 00:51.25 | Amarande | plus shadow isn't resisted by as many mobs is it? |
| 00:51.47 | NightHawkTheSane | er.. as many as resist typically resist anything else |
| 00:51.47 | End | there's probably as many shadow resistant as there are fire |
| 00:51.52 | End | or arcane |
| 00:51.53 | mikma | antiarc: i like the gnomepicture more |
| 00:51.54 | End | or whatever |
| 00:52.00 | End | however, blizzard lives fire immune |
| 00:52.04 | Antiarc | what? |
| 00:52.05 | End | s/lives/loves/ |
| 00:52.21 | mikma | antiarc: gammerita aint so cool than the gnomepicture =D |
| 00:52.31 | Shirik | time to disappear home |
| 00:53.13 | NightHawkTheSane | the l75 guards that spawn out of nowhere make infecting major cities.. difficult.. |
| 00:53.59 | Amarande | Yeah, a weaker fire version of SoC for 51 talent points = F A I L |
| 00:54.28 | Amarande | I fully expect fire builds are going to be something like 21/50/0 or 0/50/21 |
| 00:54.34 | NightHawkTheSane | End: i didn't notice a specific excess of fire immune mobs in wotlk |
| 00:54.42 | Amarande | just like how no one ever took the 41 point destro lock talent in BC |
| 00:54.53 | End | yeah, I dunno about wotlk |
| 00:54.59 | End | I don't remember any immune mobs |
| 00:55.13 | NightHawkTheSane | oh, i remember immune mobs. :P just nothing that made me hate my life. :) |
| 00:55.25 | NightHawkTheSane | sapph is probably the only one of consequence |
| 00:55.34 | End | tbc had a lot more fire immune stuff for raid stuff (although, probably non-raid is more earth immune) |
| 00:55.46 | End | frost immune? |
| 00:56.05 | End | well, at least mages can do something about that |
| 00:56.39 | NightHawkTheSane | i dont remember fire immune mobs in tbc.. |
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| 00:56.44 | NightHawkTheSane | er, raid mobs. |
| 00:56.48 | End | al'ar? |
| 00:56.52 | NightHawkTheSane | oh, right.. |
| 00:56.54 | End | flames of azzinoth? |
| 00:57.06 | End | that's all I can think of actually :P |
| 00:57.14 | NightHawkTheSane | fair enough, thats still pretty minimal though |
| 00:57.15 | ScytheBlade1 | That's all of the fire immune mobs |
| 00:57.16 | Amarande | End: fire elementals |
| 00:57.19 | ScytheBlade1 | pre-BC was -far- worse |
| 00:57.21 | Amarande | there's plenty of fire elementals in smv |
| 00:57.22 | End | Amarande: raid mobs? |
| 00:57.25 | NightHawkTheSane | hydross was frost & water |
| 00:57.27 | NightHawkTheSane | er... |
| 00:57.28 | NightHawkTheSane | frost & nature |
| 00:57.32 | End | oh yeah, hydross |
| 00:57.33 | Amarande | ah, raid mobs |
| 00:57.45 | NightHawkTheSane | well, really raid -bosses-. trash is pretty meaningless |
| 00:57.46 | End | was fun for our elemental shaman |
| 00:58.16 | mikma | antiarc: the gnomepicture comes with questitem you get from a boatwreck in ungoro |
| 00:58.40 | NightHawkTheSane | End: but yeah, those three are the only ones that i can immediately think of.. |
| 00:59.06 | mikma | antiarc: http://www.wowhead.com/?item=11108 |
| 00:59.06 | End | well pre-tbc was a bigger problem :P |
| 00:59.13 | NightHawkTheSane | oh, definitely |
| 00:59.27 | NightHawkTheSane | but at this point we're talking ancient history :p |
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| 01:01.32 | Amarande | so ... how are locks doing in arenas at 80 in beta? |
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| 01:01.50 | Amarande | or is 80 still subject to the 3.0 Simple Arena Rule too? |
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| 01:02.21 | Amarande | simple arena rule: |
| 01:02.25 | Amarande | 1) is it a ret pally? |
| 01:02.40 | Amarande | if the answer is 'yes', then it is awesome in the arena. if not, then it is meat for ret pallies. :) |
| 01:02.51 | Gnarfoz | yeah, because they were already nerfed |
| 01:02.54 | Gnarfoz | ... d'uh |
| 01:03.23 | End | clearly it only takes one nerf :P |
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| 01:04.06 | Lopeppeppy | That was a ... long drive... |
| 01:05.00 | Legorol | Is anyone aware of any clever solution to the in-game calendar's following problem: how do you create a raid event that people can join on an "opt in" basis, as opposed to the creator inviting people? |
| 01:05.23 | Amarande | ah, did they nerf the retadins already? |
| 01:05.59 | ScytheBlade1 | Legorol: you don't |
| 01:06.47 | Legorol | ScytheBlade1: i know i don't, that's why i asked if anyone knows a reasonable alternative that works well enough |
| 01:06.49 | ScytheBlade1 | Legorol: I know what you're asking but the only "clever solution" involves mandatory addons on both the event creator and the person interested, and it involves replicating a lot of data to every person |
| 01:07.10 | Legorol | ScytheBlade1: that's no different than a 3rd party calendar solution then :/ |
| 01:07.17 | ScytheBlade1 | 21:05 < ScytheBlade1> Legorol: you don't |
| 01:07.21 | Amarande | hmm, a different thought that occurred to me regarding the ret pallies etc. |
| 01:07.31 | Amarande | is there still a 'this tree sucketh eternally' tree anywhere on any class? |
| 01:07.49 | Legorol | it's a real shame, i was really looking forward to the in-game calendar to make my life easier, and at the moment we are completely unable to utilise it in our guild |
| 01:07.49 | Amarande | i.e., a tree that has always sucked compared to almost any other tree on any class as a main spec tree, still sucks, and probably ever shall suck? |
| 01:07.51 | Legorol | QQ |
| 01:08.00 | ScytheBlade1 | Legorol: so just use the mass invite? |
| 01:08.31 | Legorol | not a solution, if it worked, i wouldn't be here asking |
| 01:08.35 | ScytheBlade1 | Why not? |
| 01:08.36 | Legorol | mass invite is limited to 100 people |
| 01:08.41 | Legorol | that means 100 characters |
| 01:08.48 | ScytheBlade1 | And you routinely raid with >100 characters? |
| 01:08.53 | Legorol | yes |
| 01:08.56 | ScytheBlade1 | (Unless this is for RP events, in which case noted) |
| 01:08.59 | Legorol | because we do have 30 people with 3 alts |
| 01:09.06 | Legorol | consider this: |
| 01:09.10 | ScytheBlade1 | So have a "member" and "member alt" rank |
| 01:09.11 | ScytheBlade1 | --> bam |
| 01:09.11 | batbot | ScytheBlade1: > nil |
| 01:09.16 | ScytheBlade1 | ~stab batbot |
| 01:09.16 | purl | ACTION runs at batbot with an origami Swiss Army knife, and inflicts a nasty paper cut. |
| 01:09.17 | Cide | ... |
| 01:09.33 | Legorol | ScytheBlade1: not so simple, consider a 25-man raid that we want to be "free for all", so anyone can bring whatever character they want |
| 01:09.33 | Cide | --> bam = "ScytheBlade fails." |
| 01:09.39 | Legorol | and we very easily exceed 100 chars |
| 01:09.46 | ScytheBlade1 | Then they sign up on their main |
| 01:09.55 | ScytheBlade1 | And bring whatever |
| 01:10.14 | *** join/#wowuidev Dolby (n=Dolby@MMOI/Administrator/Dolby) |
| 01:10.14 | *** mode/#WoWUIDev [+o Dolby] by ChanServ |
| 01:10.14 | Legorol | bring whatever on the spot is not the same as sign whatever |
| 01:10.19 | Legorol | sorry i should've worded it better |
| 01:10.23 | ScytheBlade1 | Ah |
| 01:10.30 | Legorol | we routinely run raids where you sign with whatever, and then the raid leader picks out what he needs |
| 01:10.52 | Legorol | consider something like maggy/gruul |
| 01:11.30 | Cide | it is still better than a 3rd party solution though |
| 01:11.37 | Legorol | more to the point: whilst the number of characters that end up signing up is usually in the cozy 25-30 range, the *potential* range of characters that could theoretically sign is larger than 100 |
| 01:11.42 | Cide | it's integrated in both the armory and in-game |
| 01:11.54 | ScytheBlade1 | ^ |
| 01:12.14 | Legorol | I understand those advantages, which is why i'd like to be able to use it |
| 01:12.34 | Legorol | Unfortunately, at the moment the 100-char limit is preventing us in using it the way we are used to running events |
| 01:12.53 | ScytheBlade1 | The prick in me wants to say that you should quit being so collectively weird and just pick mains :P |
| 01:13.01 | Legorol | we do have mains |
| 01:13.03 | ScytheBlade1 | But yes, that would break the current method of doing invites |
| 01:13.06 | Legorol | but we don't use them in maggy/gruul :P |
| 01:13.27 | Legorol | the problem is not when we do progress raids with mains |
| 01:13.34 | Legorol | it's when we want an event that you can join with alts |
| 01:14.02 | Legorol | so no clever solution :( |
| 01:14.23 | ScytheBlade1 | Keep in mind that events are only visible to those that are invited |
| 01:14.30 | Legorol | which makes it worse |
| 01:14.36 | ScytheBlade1 | The only way to get that data to those not invited is to send that data to *everyone* |
| 01:14.44 | Legorol | yeah |
| 01:15.04 | ScytheBlade1 | And then have the event creator run it and dynamically send invites |
| 01:15.08 | Legorol | it's not that much data to send though, is it? |
| 01:15.20 | ScytheBlade1 | It doesn't have to be |
| 01:15.29 | Legorol | needs 3rd party solution though |
| 01:15.37 | Legorol | and then we are better off with our existing raid calendar that works |
| 01:15.39 | ScytheBlade1 | It's safe to say that you won't sign up for events past, or anything more than say 2 weeks in advance |
| 01:15.52 | NightHawkTheSane | will `/use Master Healthstone` match ANY healthstone size? |
| 01:16.04 | NightHawkTheSane | er, any master healthstone size, to be sure |
| 01:16.13 | ScytheBlade1 | You're capped at one healthstone now |
| 01:16.15 | ScytheBlade1 | So it's a moot point |
| 01:16.17 | ScytheBlade1 | But yes :) |
| 01:16.29 | End | well |
| 01:16.32 | NightHawkTheSane | well i -seem- to remember having issues with it not properly doing that, but it may have been me |
| 01:16.46 | End | if you don't want to redrag healthstones to your bar... |
| 01:16.52 | End | it's nice |
| 01:17.38 | NightHawkTheSane | yeah, its the "i have no idea what this stupid lock put into imp HS and i dont want to keep fucking with my bars" |
| 01:17.56 | NightHawkTheSane | although, I want to fix up autorack at some point. |
| 01:19.28 | Amarande | hmm |
| 01:19.34 | Amarande | maybe it's time I started stacking stam on this mage |
| 01:19.36 | Amarande | at least, when leveling |
| 01:22.07 | End | goddammit |
| 01:22.11 | End | I'm used to my broom now |
| 01:22.24 | End | tried to mount up on my hunter, but it was fail because I started moving |
| 01:22.47 | Amarande | heh, it's the same with my shaman |
| 01:22.58 | Amarande | I have a mount, but half the time I use ghostwolf anyway because I'm used to instant cast |
| 01:24.11 | Amarande | say, how hard is it going to be post-LK to start an enchanter? |
| 01:24.42 | Amarande | or if I don't have 375 enchanting before LK |
| 01:24.45 | Gnarfoz | it's always shitty and expensive. |
| 01:25.48 | Amarande | Gnarfoz: mostly wondering if there will come a time when it will be next to impossible to get the runed eternium rod |
| 01:25.59 | Amarande | since 1) you can't skip any rods |
| 01:26.09 | Amarande | and 2) unlike runed arcanite rod, runed eternium rod requires *epics* to be disenchanted |
| 01:26.51 | Amarande | so unless it's going to be possible to solo heroics, you somehow need to get a group for a dead instance to get the crystals you need, right? |
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| 01:27.07 | *** part/#wowuidev Paene (n=Jim@24-236-190-128.dhcp.mrqt.mi.charter.com) |
| 01:27.17 | Gnarfoz | *boggle* |
| 01:27.34 | alestane | Unless it's possible to break WotLK shards down into BC ones. |
| 01:29.07 | Gnarfoz | Amarande: runed eternium rod requires epics to be disenchanted... why? |
| 01:29.17 | Gnarfoz | http://wotlk.wowhead.com/?item=22463#created-by |
| 01:29.18 | Shirik | Ok this bug with the ashtung cowl |
| 01:29.19 | Shirik | omfg |
| 01:29.24 | Shirik | ashtounge |
| 01:29.25 | kromar | is it possible to get a frames coordinates relative to some point of the screen even if its in a different screen zone? |
| 01:29.27 | Gnarfoz | ashtongue |
| 01:29.39 | Adys | what bug? |
| 01:29.52 | Shirik | When Tauren put it on, the model is missing |
| 01:29.57 | Adys | lol |
| 01:30.01 | Shirik | so your client freezes for 15 seconds, and then... |
| 01:30.01 | Shirik | well |
| 01:30.03 | Shirik | screenshot is better |
| 01:31.36 | Amarande | Gnarfoz: hmm, did they change it |
| 01:31.42 | Amarande | I could have sworn it used to require void crystals |
| 01:31.52 | Dewin | Why do people get their jollies by sneaking into the lv1-5 starting area that's supposedly protected by argent healers and 1shotting newbie characters? |
| 01:31.59 | Shirik | http://images.gammatester.com/pics/de250a501dfeed1b4ba80f3ecee65111.jpg |
| 01:32.03 | Shirik | Isn't that awesome |
| 01:32.09 | Amarande | Dewin: because they were beaten up on the playground today |
| 01:32.42 | Gnarfoz | Amarande: wowhead rocks because of useful comments. read them. ;) |
| 01:33.30 | Amarande | I guess they must have seen that same concern coming :) |
| 01:33.31 | Shirik | Adys ^ |
| 01:33.43 | Adys | rofl |
| 01:33.51 | Amarande | since, well |
| 01:33.59 | Amarande | where are you going to get a void crystal after wotlk is in full swing :) |
| 01:34.38 | Wobin | ~weather YSSY |
| 01:34.56 | ScytheBlade1 | Shirik: nice |
| 01:35.23 | Amarande | On the good side |
| 01:35.32 | Amarande | I expect 39's will have a lot less pain from twinked rogues come WOTLK, though |
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| 01:35.55 | Shirik | why's that? |
| 01:36.12 | Amarande | Shirik: economy being starved of Void Crystals for Mongoose due to lack of people going to areas that give DE'able 70 epics |
| 01:36.13 | Wobin | xp from pvp? |
| 01:36.28 | Legorol | ScytheBlade1: I have just counted, we have 138 level 70 characters in our guild (including alts) that belong to people with full raiding rights, and that doesn't include our social members who do tag along occasionally |
| 01:36.43 | Wobin | Legorol: WoW has gotten terribly top heavy |
| 01:36.47 | Amarande | Unlike, say, Righteous Orbs for Crusader |
| 01:36.53 | Amarande | void crystals are going to be impossible to farm alone |
| 01:36.59 | Amarande | (unless by some miracle you can solo a heroic at 80) |
| 01:37.29 | Wobin | Amarande: Just buy badge gear and DE it =) |
| 01:37.32 | Amarande | Not to mention that at least on new servers, people won't be too inclined to run Kara and thus Mongoose itself will be hard to get :) |
| 01:37.48 | Amarande | wow, I assumed badge gear couldn't be DE'd |
| 01:37.55 | Wobin | Oh, I've never tried |
| 01:37.57 | Amarande | seeing as arena gear can't be, honor gear can't be, special event gear can't be ... |
| 01:37.59 | Legorol | new server? what's that |
| 01:37.59 | ScytheBlade1 | Legorol: so literally everyone in your guild has 2-3 level 70 alts. I don't know if that's scary or impressive. |
| 01:38.11 | Legorol | well no, we have a very big guild |
| 01:38.21 | Wobin | ScytheBlade1: I have... 4 70s |
| 01:38.26 | Amarande | Legorol: the ones that will open after LK is out |
| 01:38.31 | ScytheBlade1 | An individual having multiple 70s is fine |
| 01:38.32 | Legorol | we routinely used to run into the 500 guildmember limit |
| 01:38.41 | ScytheBlade1 | An entire guild where -every- individual has >2 is a bit weird |
| 01:38.47 | Wobin | ScytheBlade1: not really =P |
| 01:38.56 | Wobin | Not since tbc came out SO LONG AGO =P |
| 01:39.00 | Legorol | ScytheBlade1: i don't think everyone has an alt |
| 01:39.03 | Legorol | or >2 |
| 01:39.21 | ScytheBlade1 | No, statistically about half the playerbase has a second (or more) characters |
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| 01:40.18 | Amarande | hmm, maybe badge gear can be DE'd |
| 01:40.24 | Amarande | that still implies being able to do a heroic, though |
| 01:40.37 | Amarande | and if the 70 instances become as deserted as the 60 ones are now ... |
| 01:40.48 | Amarande | yeah, void crystals are going to get MEGA expensive |
| 01:40.54 | Legorol | We have 191 L70 characters in the guild, out of which only 47 belong to social members |
| 01:41.02 | Amarande | since about the only way you'll be able to get them will be from crafting epics just to DE them, and crafted epics cost a mint in mats |
| 01:41.15 | Legorol | i think that actually makes sense, there's a correlation playing a lot, being interested in raiding, and having a high-level alt |
| 01:41.25 | Wobin | =( |
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| 01:41.36 | Wobin | RIP Ezra Chatterton |
| 01:41.41 | Legorol | yeah :( |
| 01:41.57 | Amarande | Wobin: yeah, I heard :( |
| 01:42.05 | Amarande | I was asking earlier if his memory will be preserved, too |
| 01:42.14 | Amarande | (since the item he designed will be obsolete very soon) |
| 01:42.52 | Amarande | or did s3/s4 crossbow use the same model, and thus it's likely that the 80 ones will also? |
| 01:44.15 | Wobin | He has a card in the TCG too |
| 01:44.30 | Wobin | http://www.cardhaus.com/images/143151.jpg |
| 01:47.27 | ScytheBlade1 | 30GB in 7 minutes? NO PROBLEM |
| 01:47.43 | Amarande | Some of these people on the WoW boards need a visit from Ursa Apathia. :) |
| 01:47.46 | ScytheBlade1 | .... get off me |
| 01:47.59 | ScytheBlade1 | And leave that gigabit switch where you found it |
| 01:48.00 | Amarande | We know who Ursa Apathia is, right? |
| 01:48.09 | ScytheBlade1 | And something tells me that you don't command her like that :P |
| 01:48.31 | Shirik | no, she pretty much gets her way all the time :( |
| 01:48.34 | Tekkub | ScytheBlade1, that's only 600 Mb/s |
| 01:48.40 | Shirik | damn dinos and their pointy teeth |
| 01:49.36 | ScytheBlade1 | Tekkub: hard disks suck |
| 01:49.36 | cog|away | ^ |
| 01:49.36 | Shirik | define "hard disk" |
| 01:49.36 | Tekkub | 75 MB/sec... yea sounds like standard sustained write speed |
| 01:49.37 | Amarande | Ursa Apathia is the almighty I Don't Care Bear. :) |
| 01:49.45 | cog|away | when I first used vista, file copies between drives were like 3MB/s |
| 01:50.10 | cog|away | my internet spikes higher than that :( |
| 01:50.27 | Shirik | cogwheel: We use a program known as NX to do our CAD modeling |
| 01:50.33 | Wobin | Care Bear Sta... meh. |
| 01:50.38 | Shirik | and we had to convert an entire car CAD |
| 01:50.46 | Shirik | it was approximately 40GB of data |
| 01:50.49 | Shirik | omg that took forever |
| 01:50.51 | Shirik | on Vista |
| 01:51.04 | Shirik | moved over to a Unix variant and it was all "zoom zoom" |
| 01:51.05 | Wobin | So, 15 Microsoft Minutes? |
| 01:51.33 | cogwheel | now i get about 7 >< |
| 01:51.55 | Tekkub | 1000 MB/mss |
| 01:52.02 | Tekkub | (microsoftsecond |
| 01:52.12 | Shirik | Then I had to convince a mechanical engineer why using the beowulf cluster would be slower to do that conversion |
| 01:52.16 | Shirik | He still doesn't believe me |
| 01:52.44 | Wobin | http://www.userfriendly.org/cartoons/archives/99mar/uf000432.gif |
| 01:55.27 | Wobin | rofl |
| 01:55.27 | Wobin | http://www.livescience.com/strangenews/your-astronomical-sign.html |
| 01:55.33 | Wobin | I'm apparently a GEMINI! |
| 01:55.45 | Wobin | after all these years =P |
| 01:59.29 | Lopeppeppy | Peppy is a Libra! |
| 02:00.48 | Amarande | hahah |
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| 02:01.06 | Amarande | "I'm a lonely male dwarf. VERY lonely." -- Slugs, Area 52 |
| 02:01.19 | Amarande | "Doesn't your starter area have sheep?" -- Chojin, Sisters of Elune |
| 02:05.37 | kd3 | hm... beta patch |
| 02:05.56 | Lopeppeppy | No.... Nooooo! |
| 02:09.53 | *** join/#wowuidev nfsnobody (n=nnscript@220.235.245.229) |
| 02:13.54 | Shirik | :( |
| 02:15.08 | Amarande | hmm |
| 02:15.15 | Amarande | collecting candy buckets with a lowbie is ... er ... fun :| |
| 02:16.38 | Shirik | why you all are mean to Lopeppeppy :( |
| 02:16.43 | Shirik | I'm the only one to come to her rescue :( |
| 02:17.09 | Amarande | it's strange, though |
| 02:17.16 | Amarande | people who stay in the shelter of cities catch the scourge and become zombies |
| 02:17.29 | Amarande | I'm slogging my way stark naked through EPL and I don't get the scourge at all :) |
| 02:20.45 | Amarande | say, does the resurrect timer cap eventually, or will persistent corpserunning eventually result in "please wait until server reset to rez"? |
| 02:20.57 | kd3 | nah. cap's at 2m iirc |
| 02:21.16 | kd3 | and rofl. was wondering how long it was going to take for them to pull some of the statistics out of the achievement system |
| 02:21.41 | Lopeppeppy | Which ones left? |
| 02:22.04 | kd3 | any of the statistics in the "attributes" section. max health, mana, stam, etc... |
| 02:22.32 | kd3 | http://forums.worldofwarcraft.com/thread.html?topicId=11829374580&sid=1 |
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| 02:24.18 | Amarande | also, are they ever going to connect some of the other stats to achievements? |
| 02:24.25 | Amarande | like 'Dirt Nap' maybe for dying enough times? :) |
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| 02:34.37 | Amarande | heh, other fun on the boards |
| 02:34.46 | Amarande | apparently someone's 19 twink got a serious tummy ache from halloween candy |
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| 02:35.14 | Amarande | they dinged :) |
| 02:36.38 | Dashkal | how terrible :p |
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| 02:38.57 | Mikk | whaha |
| 02:39.09 | Mikk | i didn't realize achievements gave xp |
| 02:39.42 | alestane | ^ |
| 02:40.24 | Dashkal | My gues would be teh 6k each candy bin |
| 02:41.03 | ScytheBlade1 | Whoa, achievements give XP? |
| 02:41.56 | alestane | That's under discussion. |
| 02:43.20 | ScytheBlade1 | Oh |
| 02:45.32 | Gnarfoz | how's it under discussion when it already does so on live? :p |
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| 02:47.28 | alestane | Is it confirmed? That story about the ding is the first mention I've heard of it? |
| 02:48.33 | Gnarfoz | achievements, not bgs |
| 02:48.46 | alestane | I have no idea what the designers think of it either way, presumably they've finished whatever discussion they were aving. |
| 02:49.23 | Dashkal | Unless something changed without an announcement, achievements do not give anything aside from cosmetic rewards |
| 02:49.41 | Dashkal | Now whatever you did to gain the achievement may well give xp |
| 02:49.58 | Gnarfoz | eating enough halloween candy will not give exp ;p |
| 02:50.05 | Dashkal | Collecting it will |
| 02:50.27 | Dashkal | Each candy bucket gives something like 6k |
| 02:50.48 | alestane | Depends on your level. |
| 02:51.11 | alestane | My 58 was getting 4500 a bucket. |
| 02:51.14 | Dashkal | If a 19 twink went around collecting candy from the tubs, they'd gain xp |
| 02:52.25 | Gnarfoz | you can get candy without grabbig from the buckets |
| 02:53.03 | Dashkal | Ok, what do you know that confirms that a character gained XP from an achievement? |
| 02:53.23 | Amarande | hmm |
| 02:53.34 | Amarande | getting the eastern kingdoms candy achievement at level 14 is proving ... a wee bit difficult heh |
| 02:53.40 | Dashkal | :p |
| 02:53.43 | Amarande | and I just had my first taste of zombie-osis, too |
| 02:53.47 | Dashkal | You may need to deathflop some :p |
| 02:53.57 | Amarande | Dash: yeah, EPL was fun |
| 02:54.11 | Amarande | I'm still trying to figure out how insane it's going to be to make it over to either Arathi or Hinterlands |
| 02:54.16 | Amarande | seeing as any death in Hillsbrad puts you back to TM |
| 02:54.17 | Dashkal | ouch. I thought it was bad when I did it in my 40s. At least I was mounted |
| 02:55.21 | Amarande | say, is there anywhere where you can die with a low level while trying to do something like that and have no practical choice but to delete your character? |
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| 02:55.50 | Dashkal | Not to my knowledge. You'll always have the option of deathfloping your way home |
| 02:56.08 | Dashkal | Don't break your hearth |
| 02:56.29 | Amarande | I was more thinking, whether there exist graveyards where if you make the mistake of spirit rezzing there at too low a level, you're stuck there basically for good |
| 02:56.34 | Amarande | since you won't have ten seconds to hearth before being hit |
| 02:57.14 | Dashkal | There's two things that prevent that. There's a maximum aggro range. No matter the level diff things won't aggro from that range or further |
| 02:57.31 | Dashkal | The other being that you can always deathflop to such a spot even if the graveyard is in range of a spawn |
| 02:57.47 | |Jelly| | Seriously. The lack of healers is bloody annoying. |
| 02:57.50 | kd3 | hm... one more achievement I've got as much done as possible til 80... the critter /loving |
| 02:57.52 | Dashkal | This is what keeps level 1s from getting murdered by warp stalkers in Shatt |
| 02:57.59 | kd3 | s/80/wrath/ |
| 02:59.12 | Mikk | it wouldn't surprise me if such a graveyard exists |
| 02:59.18 | Mikk | though getting a level 1 to there would be a pita |
| 03:03.49 | Amarande | Fail server is fail |
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| 03:04.42 | *** mode/#WoWUIDev [+ooo Shirik ckknight ChanServ] by irc.freenode.net |
| 03:04.48 | kd3 | whee, a netsplit |
| 03:05.37 | Shirik | (23:04:14) - Join: 131 nicks have joined #WoWUIDev |
| 03:05.37 | Shirik | ow. |
| 03:06.48 | *** part/#wowuidev alestane (n=nevin@c-76-24-240-47.hsd1.ma.comcast.net) |
| 03:06.55 | Amarande | actually, you know what perhaps the dumbest thing with the whole zombie thing is |
| 03:07.04 | Amarande | they really shouldn't have started it till after the halloween event |
| 03:07.08 | NightHawkTheSane | the level 75 guards? |
| 03:07.33 | NightHawkTheSane | why? |
| 03:09.47 | Amarande | nono, not the level 75 guards |
| 03:09.55 | Amarande | they should have waited till after halloween to start the scourge world event |
| 03:10.02 | Amarande | that's probably what's pissing people off the most |
| 03:10.13 | Amarande | they're trying to do the once a year Halloween stuff, and getting disrupted by the Scourge stuff |
| 03:10.17 | Mike-N-Go | Why do you say that? |
| 03:10.25 | Legorol | i can see Amarande's point |
| 03:10.28 | Legorol | the timing is unfortunate |
| 03:10.37 | NightHawkTheSane | well, the events dont really intersect heavily |
| 03:10.55 | Legorol | true dat |
| 03:11.02 | NightHawkTheSane | i mean, barring the one npc in the newbie towns and maybe some dead flight masters.. the hallows end stuff doesn't really rely on npcs being up |
| 03:11.04 | Mike-N-Go | Zombies and candy; what could go together better? |
| 03:11.51 | Shirik | horse and carriage? |
| 03:11.51 | Amarande | Night: on the other hand, getting to the candy in one piece, especially at lower levels ... |
| 03:11.59 | Mikk | And actually making an achievement an... achievement.. isnt bad in my eyes =) |
| 03:12.08 | Amarande | I've already died one additional time than already needed from deathflops, because TM was fully infected |
| 03:12.24 | ccox | the dead battlemasters are far more annoying |
| 03:12.44 | Amarande | ccox: yeah, that interferes with halloween as well |
| 03:13.15 | Amarande | GNERD rage, plus if you're trying to do the pumpkin head achievement, how are you going to find enough opposite faction when you're not at Outland yet ... |
| 03:13.52 | Amarande | How can we get GNERD rage if we can't BG? |
| 03:14.14 | Amarande | That one's more important, too, since the GNERDs have a duration |
| 03:14.30 | Amarande | the weighted jackolanterns appear to have an infinite shelf life, so you can -always- get that one |
| 03:14.38 | NightHawkTheSane | meh, you cant do the meta achievement at low levels anway, so the inability to do a few others isn't really an issue |
| 03:15.14 | Amarande | yeah, it just occurred to me I still can't finish the meta till next year |
| 03:15.28 | Amarande | even if I hire runs for HH at 20, I still can't get the southshore related ones |
| 03:16.10 | Amarande | I've already resolved myself to go for the old world candy buckets at least though :| |
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| 03:17.40 | Amarande | say, was there also an achievement for a complete set of flight paths? I forget now |
| 03:17.44 | NightHawkTheSane | no |
| 03:17.54 | NightHawkTheSane | considering DKs start with that, it would be unfair |
| 03:19.32 | Amarande | hmm, maybe I should take herbing/inscription on my DK |
| 03:19.42 | Amarande | though herbing seems a waste |
| 03:19.47 | Amarande | since I already have one 300+ herbalist :S |
| 03:21.16 | Amarande | and sooner or later I'll start a rogue for LW/skinning |
| 03:21.34 | Amarande | which means I'll have all ten earlier professions represented |
| 03:21.43 | Amarande | what's the best thing to pair with inscription if you already have an herbalist? |
| 03:22.06 | *** part/#wowuidev Lopeppeppy (n=Lopeppep@cpe-67-246-45-198.nycap.res.rr.com) |
| 03:22.41 | Legorol | Amarande: enchanting |
| 03:22.54 | Legorol | if you don't have one yet |
| 03:23.06 | Legorol | since it doesn't require a gathering skill |
| 03:23.07 | Amarande | got that on the mage |
| 03:23.16 | Legorol | or you can just pick up skinning/mining for extra cash |
| 03:23.40 | NightHawkTheSane | or even herbalism again |
| 03:24.06 | Legorol | no i think it's useful to have as many gathering skills covered as you can |
| 03:24.29 | NightHawkTheSane | well, i mean if you already have those, i'd go multiple herbalists over multiple of anything else |
| 03:24.53 | Legorol | if you already have all the gathering profs, then get your class-appropriate armor-crafting prof. as the 2nd imo |
| 03:27.35 | Amarande | heh, this blood elf here is apparently going to get reported come LK if not sooner |
| 03:27.42 | Amarande | he named himself Arthas with a high ASCII A :| |
| 03:29.18 | jaxdahl | one of these? ÀÁÂÃÄÅ |
| 03:32.16 | Dewin | Anybody know off-hand if the CreateFrame background bug is fixed in 3.0.3? |
| 03:34.19 | Amarande | jax: the second one, I believe :) |
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| 03:37.47 | Amarande | dammit |
| 03:37.49 | Amarande | I need to find a dwarf |
| 03:37.57 | Amarande | I've gotten everything for the pumpkinhead one except a dwarf :S |
| 03:38.55 | Wobin | why don't you report him now? =P |
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| 03:40.25 | Amarande | Wobin: I didn't have time, I was trying to catch the boat to BB, and nab a draenei and gnome I saw for the halloween pumpkin head thing |
| 03:41.33 | Shirik | batbot: debug.setmetatable |
| 03:41.36 | Shirik | --> debug.setmetatalbe |
| 03:41.37 | batbot | Shirik: > nil |
| 03:41.42 | Shirik | --> debug.setmetatable |
| 03:41.42 | batbot | Shirik: > function: 0xb7c5c280 |
| 03:42.11 | Shirik | --> a = 1; debug.setmetatable(a, {__tostring = function() return "2"; end}); print(a); |
| 03:42.12 | batbot | Shirik: 2 |
| 03:42.24 | *** join/#wowuidev Zootfizzle (n=z00t@WoWUIDev/Blizz/Zooty-Zoot-Zoot) |
| 03:42.24 | *** mode/#WoWUIDev [+o Zootfizzle] by ChanServ |
| 03:42.41 | Shirik | hey Zootfizzle, I just proved 1 == 2 |
| 03:42.55 | Shirik | --> return a; |
| 03:42.55 | batbot | Shirik: > 2 |
| 03:42.59 | Shirik | return a + 1; |
| 03:43.01 | Shirik | --> return a + 1; |
| 03:43.01 | batbot | Shirik: > 2 |
| 03:43.04 | Shirik | :D |
| 03:43.37 | Wobin | hm |
| 03:43.44 | Wobin | I like the new login screen music |
| 03:43.56 | Amarande | I usually don't personally report anything other than CGF spambots, anyway |
| 03:44.22 | jaxdahl | --> return a*a; |
| 03:44.22 | batbot | jaxdahl: > 2 |
| 03:44.34 | jaxdahl | --> return a-a; |
| 03:44.34 | batbot | jaxdahl: > 2 |
| 03:44.34 | Shirik | woah |
| 03:44.48 | Shirik | oh wow, I didn't expect that to happen |
| 03:44.50 | jaxdahl | --> return a/a; |
| 03:44.50 | batbot | jaxdahl: > 2 |
| 03:44.52 | Shirik | --> return a + 3; |
| 03:44.52 | batbot | Shirik: > 2 |
| 03:44.58 | Wobin | hm, time to start addons from scratch again, I guess |
| 03:45.05 | Legorol | --> return type(a) |
| 03:45.05 | batbot | Legorol: > number |
| 03:45.11 | Amarande | I came up with a proof awhile back that a = b for all reals, actually |
| 03:45.19 | Legorol | --> return 1, 2 |
| 03:45.19 | batbot | Legorol: > 2, 2 |
| 03:45.19 | Amarande | but it requires that infinity be defined -as a number- rather than as a concept |
| 03:45.22 | Shirik | Amarande: |
| 03:45.23 | Legorol | lol |
| 03:45.24 | Shirik | Assume a = b |
| 03:45.27 | jaxdahl | --> return 1+2; |
| 03:45.27 | batbot | jaxdahl: > 2 |
| 03:45.27 | Shirik | a^2 = ab |
| 03:45.31 | kromar | is it possible to get the coordinates of a frame like x, y = GetCursorPosition(); and not relative to those strange screen zones? |
| 03:45.33 | Shirik | a^2 - b^2 = ab - b^2 |
| 03:45.38 | Legorol | --> return 1 |
| 03:45.38 | batbot | Legorol: > 2 |
| 03:45.40 | Shirik | (a+b)(a-b) = b(a-b) |
| 03:45.43 | Shirik | a+b = b |
| 03:45.50 | Shirik | b+b = b (substituting a for b since a = b) |
| 03:45.50 | jaxdahl | --> return some sensible answer besides 2; |
| 03:45.50 | batbot | jaxdahl: @ [string "return some sensible answer besides 2;"]:1: '<eof>' expected near 'sensible' |
| 03:45.52 | Amarande | Nah, this one didn't involve dividing by zero. :) |
| 03:45.52 | Shirik | 2b = 1b |
| 03:45.53 | Shirik | 2 = 1 |
| 03:45.57 | Amarande | It works like this: |
| 03:46.01 | Shirik | Therefore it follows 3 = 2 |
| 03:46.07 | Shirik | Therefore it follows all real numbers == all real numbers |
| 03:46.10 | Amarande | a / infinity = 0, for all a |
| 03:46.17 | Amarande | now, if a / b = c, then cb = a |
| 03:46.22 | Amarande | which means that 0 * infinity = a, for all a |
| 03:46.29 | Shirik | You have a flaw |
| 03:46.33 | Amarande | therefore, all numbers are equal |
| 03:46.36 | Shirik | a / infinity does = 0 |
| 03:46.42 | Shirik | 0 * infinity does not = a real number |
| 03:46.50 | jaxdahl | a/infinity is not possible |
| 03:46.55 | Shirik | a / infinity is definitely possible |
| 03:47.00 | Shirik | lim(a/x) x -> infinity |
| 03:47.03 | Shirik | very clearly defined |
| 03:47.03 | jaxdahl | infinity is not a number |
| 03:47.08 | kd3 | slightly more possible than a/0 |
| 03:47.13 | Shirik | It's elementry calculus, jaxdahl |
| 03:47.20 | kd3 | ^ |
| 03:47.25 | jaxdahl | you can't add, subtract, divide with infinity |
| 03:47.35 | Shirik | lim(a/x) as x->infinity is 0 |
| 03:47.37 | jaxdahl | you can do limits with it |
| 03:47.43 | Legorol | Shirik: actually not so elementary. Proving that 1/x tends to 0 as x->inf is rather hard |
| 03:47.48 | Shirik | lim(a/x) as x->0 is +/- inf |
| 03:47.53 | Legorol | proving it properly that is |
| 03:47.59 | Shirik | (technically undefined, however most people will argue +/- inf) |
| 03:48.23 | Shirik | Legorol: You should be able to do it with l'hopital's rule |
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| 03:48.38 | Shirik | [d/dx(a)]/[d/dx(x)] = 0 |
| 03:48.44 | Legorol | meh |
| 03:48.46 | Legorol | that's cheating |
| 03:49.03 | Legorol | besides, proving l'hopital's in the first place is probably harder than proving 1/x->0 |
| 03:49.08 | Shirik | Well that's not fair |
| 03:49.13 | Shirik | it's been proven I refuse to prove it again :P |
| 03:49.18 | Legorol | lol |
| 03:49.24 | ScytheBlade1 | "Sbo gains Sbo's Zombie Explosion!" |
| 03:49.28 | ScytheBlade1 | I love that line in my combat log |
| 03:49.34 | Legorol | i could say the same about 1/x |
| 03:49.59 | Legorol | btw Shirik, whether 1/x goes to +inf or -inf depends on which direction you go x->0 |
| 03:50.08 | Shirik | right |
| 03:50.14 | Shirik | which is why it's technically undefined :) |
| 03:50.26 | Legorol | it might not mean much, but when you do 1/z as z->0 depends strongly on how you go to the origin of the complex plane |
| 03:50.30 | Shirik | Also I did say a/x so I was partially wrong, as it could also equal 0 |
| 03:50.47 | Thrae | You're not a real mathmatician until you prove 1+1=2. |
| 03:51.03 | Shirik | subtract 1 from both sides |
| 03:51.03 | Legorol | hehe |
| 03:51.04 | Shirik | 1 = 1 |
| 03:51.05 | Shirik | win. |
| 03:51.14 | Legorol | Shirik wins the intarwebz |
| 03:51.19 | Shirik | 1+1-1 = 1, 1-1 cancels, 1 = 1 |
| 03:51.57 | Shirik | Alternatively, we could begin taking the fourier transform if you so desire |
| 03:52.03 | Legorol | i'm a bit confused actually Thrae |
| 03:52.18 | Legorol | i thought that it's impossible to prove that 1+1=2, and that it's an axiom |
| 03:52.39 | Thrae | Of course, you have to do so without using any previous theorums or axioms. |
| 03:52.42 | Legorol | well that's not the actual axiom, but you start by counting sets, and the axioms amount to 1+1=2 |
| 03:52.57 | Shirik | Actually, I think the z transform might be easier |
| 03:52.59 | *** part/#wowuidev Dainton (n=user@pool-71-160-75-248.lsanca.dsl-w.verizon.net) |
| 03:53.09 | Thrae | Legorol: It's possible -- the actual proof is about 200 pages long. |
| 03:53.18 | Legorol | interesting |
| 03:53.24 | Legorol | what axioms do you start from? |
| 03:53.36 | Legorol | and what branch of math? set theory? number theory? |
| 03:54.09 | Thrae | Do I look like I have the time to go through 200 pages, much less skim the start of them?! |
| 03:54.15 | Legorol | hehe |
| 03:54.34 | Shirik | Ok, we'll do the inverse z transform. 1 -> delta(n). So on the LHS we have 2delta(n) |
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| 03:55.11 | Shirik | eh, actually |
| 03:55.28 | Shirik | that requires that I prove 1delta(n) + 1delta(n) = (1+1)(delta(n)) = 2delta(n) |
| 03:55.35 | *** join/#wowuidev Dainton (n=user@pool-71-160-75-248.lsanca.dsl-w.verizon.net) |
| 03:56.01 | Shirik | --> 1+1; |
| 03:56.01 | batbot | Shirik: > 2 |
| 03:56.05 | Shirik | There, batbot proved it |
| 03:56.36 | Shirik | Here we go, proof that 1+1=2 |
| 03:56.37 | Shirik | http://mathforum.org/library/drmath/view/51551.html |
| 03:56.42 | Shirik | google wins again |
| 03:57.45 | Shirik | my head exploded though |
| 03:59.42 | *** join/#wowuidev leethal (n=leethal@cm-84.215.134.225.getinternet.no) |
| 04:00.25 | *** join/#wowuidev Lonny (n=Lonny@82.80.140.2) |
| 04:00.47 | Ackis | FUCK BLIZZARD |
| 04:00.54 | Shirik | :( |
| 04:00.57 | Shirik | what's wrong? |
| 04:01.04 | Ackis | is there a way for me to generate an e-mail to blizzard from within a mod? |
| 04:01.10 | Shirik | uh |
| 04:01.13 | kd3 | ...no |
| 04:01.14 | Shirik | no |
| 04:01.31 | Ackis | and you can't file tickets anymore correct? |
| 04:01.40 | Shirik | yes you can |
| 04:01.47 | Ackis | automatically? |
| 04:01.48 | Shirik | not from a mod though |
| 04:01.49 | kd3 | it's protected |
| 04:01.54 | Ackis | yah exactly |
| 04:01.58 | Shirik | why do you need to? |
| 04:02.08 | Ackis | payback |
| 04:02.09 | Shirik | They protected that because they don't have the resources to respond to that |
| 04:02.13 | Shirik | payback? |
| 04:02.17 | Ackis | yes |
| 04:02.31 | Ackis | they're being dicks still so I want to overwhelm their asses |
| 04:02.32 | Shirik | care to explain? |
| 04:02.38 | Shirik | I think you need to calm down |
| 04:02.41 | Ackis | explained numerous times before |
| 04:02.43 | jaxdahl | may i recommend a nice botnet? |
| 04:03.00 | Ackis | I don't want anything automated |
| 04:03.18 | Ackis | i want a click here to call blizzard a douche button |
| 04:03.27 | *** join/#wowuidev Thunder_Child (n=TC@cpe-76-171-31-114.socal.res.rr.com) |
| 04:03.39 | jaxdahl | will a placebo mod work, ackis? |
| 04:03.40 | Dashkal | You need to play something else until the zombies subside, don't you |
| 04:03.57 | Shirik | I could write you a mod that makes you think that Blizzard is being spammed with emails if you want |
| 04:04.02 | Ackis | no i'm still fucking pissed my forum account is banned for asking contact info |
| 04:04.33 | Ackis | hypocritical assholes |
| 04:04.49 | Wobin | >< |
| 04:04.55 | Dashkal | Perm bans are permanent. Buy a new account or deal. With your attitude on the matter, it may be warranted |
| 04:05.02 | Wobin | 20 minutes later |
| 04:05.07 | Wobin | I'm up to the H's |
| 04:05.08 | Ackis | hey dashkal, fuck off k? |
| 04:05.16 | Shirik | Ackis, watch yourself |
| 04:05.21 | Shirik | I suggest a nice beer |
| 04:05.31 | Wobin | Tekkub? |
| 04:05.33 | Ackis | * Added dashkal!*@* to ignore list problem solved, don't have to see his bs anymore |
| 04:05.34 | Wobin | Oh you said Beer |
| 04:05.38 | Tekkub | wut |
| 04:05.46 | Wobin | Never mind |
| 04:05.48 | Wobin | You're not nice anyway |
| 04:06.02 | Tekkub | I was told there would be punch and pie and bears? |
| 04:06.10 | Shirik | ~lart Tekkub |
| 04:06.10 | purl | crushes Tekkub with a full height scsi disk |
| 04:06.44 | Daint | how high is a full height scsi disk? |
| 04:06.57 | Shirik | tall enough to crush Tekkub |
| 04:07.01 | Shirik | which is pretty damn tall |
| 04:07.09 | Tekkub | a 3.5" wide one? like 1.75" or so |
| 04:07.31 | Tekkub | it works out to roughly the size and weight of a brick |
| 04:08.05 | Daint | wtf, Tekkub is 4 inches tall? |
| 04:08.31 | Shirik | Well, Tekkub is 4 inches. I don't think "tall" is the right word though. |
| 04:08.38 | Shirik | I'M SORRY I'M SORRY I HAD TO I SHOULDN'T HAVE |
| 04:08.56 | Tekkub | bigger if you include the shaft |
| 04:10.10 | Wobin | You're a terrible friend, Shirik =P |
| 04:10.21 | Shirik | :( |
| 04:10.26 | *** part/#wowuidev Ackis (n=asdf@WoWUIDev/WoWAce/ARL/Troll/Ackis) |
| 04:10.35 | Wobin | now I remember why I hate reinstalling addons |
| 04:10.40 | Wobin | I get up to M then get bored |
| 04:11.30 | Wobin | what's a good unitframe addon now? |
| 04:11.37 | Tekkub | oUF_* |
| 04:11.54 | Wobin | hm |
| 04:12.00 | Amarande | what the, you can't buy honor gear anymore except for the battleground-specific items like the av wolf and wsg epic bracers? |
| 04:12.03 | Wobin | where's the base addon? |
| 04:12.32 | Tekkub | you don't need oUF |
| 04:12.40 | Tekkub | it can be packaged in the layout now |
| 04:12.50 | Wobin | oh righty |
| 04:13.50 | Daint | can anyone help me out by telling me how i can set autolootdefault to 1 when i pickpocket and set it back to 0 afterwards without it being too complicated? |
| 04:14.39 | Daint | the only real reference addon i've found is cutup, but it uses a lot of ace libraries that i'd prefer not to use |
| 04:15.25 | Neuro_Medivh | does anyone have a spare beta key lying around? |
| 04:15.36 | Tekkub | actually, I might |
| 04:15.38 | *** join/#wowuidev seebs (n=seebs@home.seebs.net) |
| 04:16.08 | Neuro_Medivh | would you mind if I used it? I'm trying to show a friend of mine around on Beta |
| 04:17.18 | Shirik | If I wanted to get a list of all globals, what would you guys recommend as a way to do that? Create an addon to do it and write to SV? |
| 04:17.42 | Tekkub | Neuro_Medivh, US? and email addy? |
| 04:17.44 | Shirik | There needs to be a better way :/ |
| 04:17.51 | Neuro_Medivh | yes |
| 04:20.19 | seebs | Heyyy. |
| 04:20.25 | seebs | Are there PTRs right now? |
| 04:20.39 | kd3 | yes |
| 04:20.43 | seebs | ... I am such a moron. |
| 04:20.52 | kd3 | only way to get to it was to have a 0.0.2 ptr and patch up to 0.0.3 from there |
| 04:20.55 | seebs | I've been really frustrated 'cuz I couldn't play, and I coulda just gone to PTRs. |
| 04:21.09 | kd3 | only if your account was active at the time they brought the PTRs up |
| 04:21.20 | seebs | Oh, it's been active for about two years straight, I think. |
| 04:21.25 | seebs | Almost three nowp. |
| 04:21.26 | seebs | now. |
| 04:22.15 | ScytheBlade1 | wow, phpBB3 has a jabber component |
| 04:22.21 | ScytheBlade1 | I'm totally going to abuse the heck out of that |
| 04:23.32 | *** join/#wowuidev Corrodias (n=no@adsl-75-17-199-112.dsl.euclwi.sbcglobal.net) |
| 04:23.50 | Amarande | hmm |
| 04:23.57 | Amarande | did AQ gates reset everywhere or just on a few buggy servers? |
| 04:24.04 | kd3 | just a few |
| 04:24.07 | kd3 | they're open on mine still |
| 04:25.12 | NightHawkTheSane | hmm |
| 04:25.41 | Shirik | does anyone know if WoW's GC runs in a separate thread from everything else? |
| 04:25.43 | Shirik | It shouldn't |
| 04:25.48 | Shirik | but something wierd just happened |
| 04:28.52 | Shirik | cogwheel: ping |
| 04:28.59 | Shirik | (not related to the previous question) |
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| 04:33.29 | Wobin | I don't know what to do with my rogue =( |
| 04:33.37 | Wobin | he's a hemo mace rogue |
| 04:33.46 | Wobin | and I haven't logged him on in months |
| 04:34.50 | Wobin | and I have no idea if hemo hammers is still a viable build |
| 04:36.04 | *** part/#wowuidev Seerah (n=Ryan_L@adsl-177-4-196.mem.bellsouth.net) |
| 04:36.36 | Shirik | sigh, wow keeps crashing at my code :( |
| 04:42.46 | Amarande | hmm |
| 04:42.54 | Amarande | apparently now pallies are QQing again |
| 04:43.07 | Amarande | apparently with pretty damn good reason |
| 04:43.21 | Amarande | stupid ret arena people having to ruin it |
| 04:43.39 | Amarande | apparently, they're lowering judgment of the wise from 33% to 15%. And seriously, all someone could say on the boards after hearing that news was "Fuck." |
| 04:43.43 | Amarande | Just that one simple word. |
| 04:45.16 | Amarande | hmm |
| 04:45.23 | Amarande | someone just posted to the paladin forum that they quit WoW over the nerf |
| 04:45.25 | Corrodias | well, shit. |
| 04:46.14 | Amarande | Corrodias: actually the nerf is a pretty serious one |
| 04:46.15 | Shirik | oh no! They don't get 600 mana per swing anymore?! WTF! |
| 04:46.24 | Amarande | Shirik: the nerf goes too far though |
| 04:46.35 | jaxdahl | how do you know it goes too far? |
| 04:46.44 | Amarande | to the point that retadins once again will be going back to being an inferior choice over other melee dps |
| 04:46.59 | Amarande | jaxdahl: it's been calculated |
| 04:47.14 | Shirik | You know what I say to those calculations? They're crap |
| 04:47.22 | jaxdahl | Seal of Wisdom now deal [ 16% of AP + 25% of Spell Power + 1 ] holy damage when unleashed. (Down from [ 20% of AP + 32% of Spell Power + 1 ] Holy damage) |
| 04:47.25 | Shirik | because they always make improper assumptions and idealizations |
| 04:47.27 | jaxdahl | is that what you're talking about? |
| 04:47.41 | jaxdahl | Fan of Knives cooldown has been lowered from 30 seconds to 10 seconds. <-- oooh |
| 04:47.43 | Shirik | Until it's actually played nobody will know for sure |
| 04:47.45 | Amarande | If a feral druid, rogue, fury warrior, or enh shaman (did I get all the other serious melee DPS there?) keeps their regular DPS rotation up in a raid boss length battle |
| 04:47.49 | Amarande | they will be fine. |
| 04:47.54 | Shirik | Funny thing, Amarande |
| 04:48.09 | Shirik | A feral druid, rogue, and fury warrior all barely help the raid aside from their personal contributions |
| 04:48.18 | Amarande | If a post-nerf Ret paladin attempts this, they will be guzzling mana pots like a chain-smoker. |
| 04:48.34 | Shirik | Ret paladins, on the other hand, help the raid significantly |
| 04:48.58 | Shirik | People care too much abou damage meters |
| 04:49.22 | Amarande | Moreover, paladins fear that leveling up will become a chore instead of being fun like a game ought to be |
| 04:49.23 | Corrodias | increase everybody's damage by 3% or make up the difference yourself by doing more personal output |
| 04:49.28 | Corrodias | either way accomplishes the same thing |
| 04:49.48 | Amarande | because, say, the enh shaman will almost never need to stop to drink |
| 04:49.51 | Shirik | Corrodias: That's my point. They're just different playstyles |
| 04:49.57 | Amarande | the retadin will have to stop to drink after every couple mobs like casters |
| 04:50.55 | Corrodias | that sounded pretty disparaging against the physical melee guys, though, Shirik. unless what you were saying was "A feral druid, rogue, and fury warrior all barely help the raid aside from their awesomeness, which is admittedly worth bringing them for" |
| 04:51.09 | Shirik | Yes, that's not what I meant to say |
| 04:51.12 | seebs | Drat, test realms won't do me any good, I didn't actually do the previous test realm. |
| 04:51.20 | Shirik | I merely meant to say that the paladin makes up for its lack of DPS by supporting everyone else |
| 04:51.33 | Amarande | hmm |
| 04:51.46 | Corrodias | right. now... how do i make winamp enqueue only the song i double-click on and NOT the entire playlist |
| 04:51.48 | Amarande | does it mean that paladins have just been stripped of all pvp role outside of healbot, though? |
| 04:52.35 | Corrodias | there's the option! |
| 04:52.46 | kd3 | whee. more armory failure... http://www.wowarmory.com/item-info.xml?i=34478 |
| 04:52.53 | Amarande | Someone did an add-up of incoming and outgoing mana for retadins in PvP |
| 04:53.30 | ZorbaTHut | amarande, meanwhile, us poor prot warriors have absolutely no way of regaining hit points besides eating |
| 04:53.32 | Amarande | with the lowered JotW, starting at full, it is expected that a post-nerf ret pally will be down to 15-20% of the mana pool within one minute or so of arena fight |
| 04:53.47 | ScytheBlade1 | kd3: the lack of the "Use"? |
| 04:53.53 | ZorbaTHut | I cry for the poor paladins, who can heal themselves at will. So, so sad. |
| 04:54.04 | kd3 | the use line's not supposed to be there. it's the comment line now |
| 04:54.10 | ScytheBlade1 | lol |
| 04:54.12 | Amarande | Zorba: assuming they have the mana to do it |
| 04:54.19 | NightHawkTheSane | zombiepocalypse! |
| 04:54.23 | ScytheBlade1 | OH |
| 04:54.26 | ZorbaTHut | hey you're right, warriors can heal with enough mana also! |
| 04:54.28 | ScytheBlade1 | ha now that clicked |
| 04:54.35 | ZorbaTHut | except *we don't have mana ever and we can never, ever self-heal* |
| 04:55.03 | ZorbaTHut | I'm sorry but I feel very little sympathy for "sometimes, if our mana is low, we might have to drink", considering that my *entire class* always has to eat :P |
| 04:55.16 | Amarande | Zorba: the ret pally post-nerf is slated to run out of mana within slightly more than a minute even just doing their damage dealer rotation |
| 04:55.41 | Amarande | that's not counting either being mana burned (which will happen) or perhaps having to use some mana for emergency self heals |
| 04:56.03 | Amarande | then they, in an arena setting, will have to find somehow the ability to drink, which is happening around the same time your warrior will get to eat |
| 04:56.18 | Amarande | the same is the case in a raid boss battle, too |
| 04:56.24 | ZorbaTHut | yeah, but see, there's my point |
| 04:56.33 | ZorbaTHut | your complaint comes down to "paladins will have the same limits as other classes" |
| 04:56.34 | Amarande | worse in a raid really, since in arena, you have a glimmer of hope of dropping out of combat |
| 04:56.52 | Amarande | in a raid battle, you don't drop out of combat till either the boss is dead or the raid is :) |
| 04:57.11 | Shirik | Anyone here use visual studio? |
| 04:57.33 | Amarande | Zorba: the complaint, which is really more forums than my own, since I only play prot on my pally anyway |
| 04:57.43 | Amarande | is that other melee dps classes *don't* have that limitation |
| 04:57.44 | Corrodias | i... have used it to a minimal extent, Shirik, a few years ago |
| 04:57.58 | Shirik | heh, no offense then you probably can't answer the question, but I'll ask anyway |
| 04:58.04 | Amarande | Warriors and bears are never wanting for rage, cats and rogues are never wanting for energy, enh shamans are able to keep their mana up |
| 04:58.05 | Corrodias | i bet i can't :3 |
| 04:58.13 | ZorbaTHut | I suppose that's true, but . . . paladins are meant to be bursty, if I understand the dev's goals |
| 04:58.16 | Amarande | but ret paladins can't keep their mana up, and will quickly run out and be dead weight |
| 04:58.22 | ZorbaTHut | and you don't set up a bursty class and make it able to sustain that burst |
| 04:58.25 | Shirik | Is there any way to, while debugging a program, search for a given value in memory (i.e., a string) |
| 04:58.34 | ZorbaTHut | perhaps they're merely meant to ration their mana use, and use more efficient abilities in general? |
| 04:58.34 | seebs | In what language? |
| 04:58.47 | Shirik | C++ but why is that relevant? I don't have the code for the program in question |
| 04:58.58 | Amarande | unless they cut back their DPS significantly, in which case they will be passed over in favor of other melee DPS classes who can sustain full-tilt DPS |
| 04:58.58 | Corrodias | well.. answer A is i don't know about how to do that in the IDE, but answer B is that you can always search for strings in memory with winhex |
| 04:59.07 | seebs | Well, it's pretty different between, say, Lua and C. :) |
| 04:59.12 | Shirik | not really |
| 04:59.13 | seebs | Anyway, some debuggers have a way to do this. |
| 04:59.18 | Amarande | heck, look at T6 raiding now |
| 04:59.20 | Shirik | either way it's still in memory |
| 04:59.23 | ZorbaTHut | except that's the point, ret paladin full-tilt DPS is currently far above that of other classes (from what I've seen, at least) |
| 04:59.39 | Amarande | do pallies even get to go at all usually in a well-oiled raid group, unless there's a slot for a tankadin? |
| 04:59.39 | Corrodias | please do not tilt the paladin |
| 04:59.44 | ZorbaTHut | if ret paladin sustainable DPS is equal to that of other melee dps classes, or even slightly below given a paladin's other useful abilities, it'll still be helpful |
| 05:00.21 | ZorbaTHut | pre-3.0, ret pallies were underpowered. at this point, my groups are cramming as many as we can find in, 'cause even a crummy ret pally with inferior equipment will out-DPS the others :P |
| 05:00.25 | ZorbaTHut | I don't think either of those are the goal however. |
| 05:00.26 | Amarande | zorba: http://forums.worldofwarcraft.com/thread.html?topicId=11829534729&sid=1 |
| 05:00.30 | Amarande | what would you say about sorrax's post? |
| 05:00.56 | Amarande | maybe I'm missing something but it looks like the mana flow is still significantly negative even without divine storm (which seems to be the big killer button) |
| 05:01.01 | ZorbaTHut | I'd say he's calculating full burst damage and hoping that he can sustain it |
| 05:01.05 | ZorbaTHut | yeah, I'm not arguing that |
| 05:01.17 | ZorbaTHut | what I'm saying is, I don't believe paladins are meant to be hitting all their damage buttons in a raid situation |
| 05:01.29 | ZorbaTHut | they are meant to have burst abilities, not sustained-ridiculous-damage |
| 05:01.44 | Amarande | zorba: going by those numbers, and well, since we have nothing else to go on, going by current itemization |
| 05:02.02 | ZorbaTHut | if their sustained is, say, equal to Rogue level, then their burst can be 50% higher |
| 05:02.09 | Amarande | would you say a ret pally is able to sustain enough performance (counting the extra dps given to party members via blessings) to maintain a raid spot vs. a different melee DPS? |
| 05:02.23 | Amarande | and if yes, would you still say yes at 80 where retadin gear has no int to speak of? |
| 05:02.27 | Corrodias | if they are willing to put out. |
| 05:02.39 | Amarande | which is really one of the big fears as well |
| 05:02.40 | ZorbaTHut | judging from what I've seen in my groups? Maybe. I don't know pallies well enough to know which of those abilities might be less efficient. |
| 05:02.54 | Amarande | mana cost will go up (due to base mana %) as the paladin levels |
| 05:02.57 | ZorbaTHut | which of those abilities has the worst damage-per-mana ratio? Dump it and see. |
| 05:03.20 | ZorbaTHut | but that's immaterial |
| 05:03.24 | Amarande | on the other hand, the mana pool will hardly increase at all, and it'll really be a negative effective mana pool change, due to the fact that retadins use warrior itemization in LK and thus don't get ANY int |
| 05:03.27 | ZorbaTHut | JotW is based off base mana % |
| 05:03.37 | ZorbaTHut | what you're talking about is sustainable DPS |
| 05:03.44 | ZorbaTHut | the size of the mana pool is meaningless for this debate |
| 05:03.59 | Amarande | Zorba: +int doesn't affect *base mana %* costs |
| 05:04.12 | ZorbaTHut | yes, I'm aware. That's why I'm saying +int is immaterial for sustained DPS. |
| 05:04.12 | Amarande | therefore, the size of the mana pool affects how long a negative mana flow situation can be sustained before oom |
| 05:04.16 | ZorbaTHut | It simply doesn't matter. |
| 05:04.31 | ZorbaTHut | my argument is simple. If paladins are forced to remove their less-mana-efficient cooldowns, and stay at a sustainable rate of mana use, how much damage will they do relative to other melee classes? |
| 05:04.32 | Amarande | Zorba: it can matter, depending on the length of the fight, right? |
| 05:04.51 | ZorbaTHut | I don't know the answer to this, but Sorrax isn't even considering it a possible argument |
| 05:05.03 | ZorbaTHut | he's saying that paladins can't go all-out forever. Well duh. |
| 05:05.09 | Amarande | What I'm saying is that a ret paladin's already short (post-nerf) sustained max DPS will become even shorter come LK |
| 05:05.27 | ZorbaTHut | I'm honestly not seeing that myself, I'm still seeing extremely high DPS overall |
| 05:05.58 | ZorbaTHut | seriously, look at the post right after sorrax's |
| 05:06.00 | ZorbaTHut | " Hmmm...I'll be honest and say that a lot of paladins have already anticipated some kind of a nerf with JoW...it just too good, WAY too good when every other mana classes have to deal with re precautions when spamming their highest damage abilities non-stop." |
| 05:06.15 | ZorbaTHut | you seem to think paladins should be able to just spam everything non-stop. I disagree. :P |
| 05:06.21 | Amarande | hmm, what do you say about the claimed infinite mana of enhance shamans and feral druids? |
| 05:06.40 | ZorbaTHut | feral druids, as far as I know, don't use mana for their damage-dealing attacks |
| 05:06.50 | ZorbaTHut | I don't know much about enhance shamans, to be honest. |
| 05:06.59 | Amarande | nor do I, I've been using elemental |
| 05:07.04 | Amarande | though maybe I should go enh |
| 05:07.07 | Amarande | I'm getting tired of being oom |
| 05:07.20 | ZorbaTHut | it's sort of silly to say that feral druids have near-infinite mana though. I mean of course it's near-infinite, they don't use any :P |
| 05:07.38 | kd3 | oh wow... didn't even notice |
| 05:07.48 | kd3 | flash10 has finally fixed transparency on wow's sites |
| 05:07.50 | ZorbaTHut | (although their ability to grind without ever resting is kind of infuriating, but) |
| 05:07.51 | Amarande | But would you agree that other melee DPS are able to keep up a normal rotation indefinitely? |
| 05:08.06 | ZorbaTHut | well, yes, by the appropriate definition of "normal" |
| 05:08.12 | ZorbaTHut | namely "not blowing all your most expensive abilities constantly" |
| 05:08.23 | ZorbaTHut | obviously, paladins are just going to have to come up with a more mana-efficient rotation :P |
| 05:08.36 | Amarande | Zorba: there's also more PvP-specific concerns, too, I suppose |
| 05:08.41 | Amarande | for instance, mana burn |
| 05:08.45 | ZorbaTHut | rogues certainly can't just hammer their most expensive ability on every cooldown, they have nowhere near enough energy for that |
| 05:08.47 | Amarande | there is no energy burn or rage burn. there is mana burn. |
| 05:09.05 | Amarande | and the new JotW guarantees that ret paladins won't be able to recover from a mana burn. |
| 05:09.12 | ZorbaTHut | omg rogues are underpowered, they can't even sustain their basic damage rotation |
| 05:09.36 | ZorbaTHut | no, it means they'll have to drop their dps to compensate. what do mages do if they're mana burned? |
| 05:09.39 | Amarande | as a result, they will go back to being inferior to rogues and arms/fury warriors whose "MP" can't be blasted out at will by a priest |
| 05:10.12 | Amarande | and as far as PvP is concerned |
| 05:10.18 | Amarande | rogues already have way too much love :) |
| 05:11.01 | ZorbaTHut | well, what *do* mages do when they're manaburned in pvp? :P |
| 05:11.06 | Amarande | Zorba: go squish, usually |
| 05:11.10 | ZorbaTHut | uh-huh |
| 05:11.15 | ZorbaTHut | why should paladins be immune to this? |
| 05:11.18 | Amarande | haven't mages already been on the way out in arenas, though? |
| 05:11.28 | ZorbaTHut | congratulations, now paladins are also! :D |
| 05:11.40 | Amarande | they've been kinda on the decline ever since resilience made PoMPyro iffy |
| 05:11.57 | ZorbaTHut | I mean, honestly, you're pointing out classes that have it better than you, and ignoring all the classes that have it worse than you |
| 05:12.14 | ZorbaTHut | a paladin is not supposed to be the ideal class in every possible situation, immune to anything that could theoretically damage them |
| 05:12.22 | Amarande | let's see who else ... Warlocks have been on the decline ever since resilience made DoTs iffy, while armor ignorance leaves them just barely hanging on via SL/SL and being almost entirely unviable otherwise |
| 05:12.50 | Amarande | in the ideal arena team, with the exception of 3.0.2 ret pally ... is there any reason even to take a class with a blue bar except as a healer? |
| 05:12.52 | Wobin | oh man |
| 05:12.57 | Wobin | looks like we're all screwed =P |
| 05:13.06 | Wobin | we should give up on pvp entirely |
| 05:13.18 | Wobin | gogo 5dps arena team! |
| 05:13.22 | Amarande | wobin: that might not be a bad idea |
| 05:13.29 | ZorbaTHut | well, according to http://www.sk-gaming.com/arena/, the best team out there right now is rogue, shaman, mage |
| 05:13.30 | Amarande | pvp was, is, and ever shall be imba :P |
| 05:13.35 | ZorbaTHut | so apparently there is :) |
| 05:14.24 | Amarande | but 80 puts real pressure on the class balance, due to the fact that all pvp gear is partly arena gear |
| 05:14.25 | Corrodias | i swear the audio on this computer is louder despite being the same hardware with the same settings |
| 05:14.35 | Amarande | therefore, any class to be viable in endgame as pvp has to be viable in arena |
| 05:14.49 | NightHawkTheSane | So. we took a zombie raid from grom'gol, and went up hitting the rebel camp, darkshire, lakeshire, eastvale, and finally goldshire. |
| 05:15.11 | ScytheBlade1 | How big of a raid? |
| 05:15.14 | Amarande | hmm, those of you in beta |
| 05:15.26 | Amarande | are locks any better off in 5's at 80 than they are now at 70? |
| 05:15.30 | NightHawkTheSane | well.. there's ~23 of us actually -in- the raid |
| 05:15.42 | NightHawkTheSane | plus however man horde & alliance tagged along with us |
| 05:15.50 | ScytheBlade1 | Oh, looking over your targets now, that makes more sense |
| 05:15.50 | NightHawkTheSane | plus howevermany npc zombies we managed to spawn and drag along |
| 05:15.51 | Amarande | or is zerg-the-lock still the indicated strategy there too? |
| 05:16.45 | Amarande | that's really the whole problem with the locks in 5's at 70 :) |
| 05:17.02 | NightHawkTheSane | at points, there must have been soemthing like 60-70 zombies in the towns |
| 05:17.03 | Amarande | it's not the problem of there being a counter to them, it's the problem of the strategy becoming entirely too simple for the opposing team |
| 05:17.35 | Amarande | you specifically assist-train zerg the lock, and you are virtually guaranteed to either gain man advantage or to drain their healer dry |
| 05:18.02 | Amarande | I'd prefer to see arena actually require some thought from teams :) |
| 05:18.11 | NightHawkTheSane | it kinda fell apart in goldshire, because the infinitely spawning l75 guards kinda kicked our ass, along with a bunch of alliance players |
| 05:18.27 | ScytheBlade1 | That's what I was guessing would happen |
| 05:18.41 | ScytheBlade1 | Honestly if you can focus-fire the guards, they're a non-issue |
| 05:18.48 | ScytheBlade1 | But with only 23 actually in raid that is difficult |
| 05:18.59 | Amarande | Zorba, what do you think about the zerg the lock thing? |
| 05:19.17 | ZorbaTHut | I think it's entirely unrelated to the original argument, and I also think that it's completely outside my knowledge :) |
| 05:19.18 | NightHawkTheSane | well the infitnitely-spawning part was obnoxous. but yeah, if we had a -full- raid of horde 70s we probably would have had an easier tiem |
| 05:19.44 | ScytheBlade1 | Every time you smack someone, it drops the time on their "Infected!" debuff by 5s |
| 05:19.51 | ScytheBlade1 | So you focus fire and just force them to transform |
| 05:20.09 | ScytheBlade1 | (Plus the health leech and AoE health regen) |
| 05:20.13 | NightHawkTheSane | yeah |
| 05:21.48 | ScytheBlade1 | Stupid browser is taking forever to fire up |
| 05:21.59 | ScytheBlade1 | But it's running WoW + writing at 50MB/sec... |
| 05:22.54 | Amarande | Zorba: http://forums.worldofwarcraft.com/thread.html?topicId=11855816231&sid=1 thoughts? |
| 05:23.32 | ScytheBlade1 | NightHawkTheSane: I did a zombie raid in SW a bit ago. http://images.aboveaverageurl.com/WoW/3.0/zombies/WoWScrnShot_102208_224712.jpg |
| 05:23.32 | ZorbaTHut | amarande, "we want to just mash all our buttons and not have to worry about mana! pretty please make the game easy for us" |
| 05:24.04 | NightHawkTheSane | nice :) |
| 05:24.05 | ZorbaTHut | hell, rogues run on their base mana pool for the entire game |
| 05:24.10 | ZorbaTHut | and they can barely increase that pool size |
| 05:24.15 | ZorbaTHut | it's called energy, not mana, but it's the same thing. |
| 05:24.20 | ScytheBlade1 | NightHawkTheSane: probably the best screenshot of them all: http://images.aboveaverageurl.com/WoW/3.0/zombies/WoWScrnShot_102208_233942.jpg |
| 05:25.14 | Amarande | Zorba: not to mention there's the other nitpick some have brought up |
| 05:25.27 | ScytheBlade1 | http://images.aboveaverageurl.com/WoW/3.0/zombies/WoWScrnShot_102208_224418.jpg is win too |
| 05:25.28 | Amarande | Paladins are designed to be extra effective against Undead in particular. |
| 05:25.44 | Amarande | However, against, say, an undead raid boss (which I expect there will be a lot of in LK, hmm, LICH king go figure) |
| 05:25.55 | NightHawkTheSane | awesome :) |
| 05:26.09 | ScytheBlade1 | I'm so glad I remembered to mash the screenshot button |
| 05:26.24 | Amarande | that extra effectiveness is going to become highly moot |
| 05:26.57 | Amarande | because it seems that even if you do a reasonably mana efficient rotation, you're still not going to be able to find the mana 'cashflow' to afford exorcism anyway :| |
| 05:27.07 | Amarande | as a result, you might as well not even have the spell |
| 05:28.11 | ZorbaTHut | amarande, then they tweak exorcism a little until it's worth using in place of a different ability |
| 05:28.13 | ZorbaTHut | not hard to fix |
| 05:28.33 | ZorbaTHut | "if you're fighting most things, your rotation is XYZ, if you're fighting undead, it's XY Exorcism" |
| 05:28.50 | Shirik | Damn you Conspiracy, you're too smart!!! |
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| 05:36.48 | Shirik | !g 0xC00000FD |
| 05:36.49 | batbot | Shirik: MSDN Visual C++ General The application failed to initialize ... <http://social.msdn.microsoft.com/forums/en-US/vcgeneral/thread/ff83c41b-1d6b-48cb-a51d-d931580c4d08> |
| 05:36.52 | Shirik | sigh |
| 05:36.54 | Amarande | hmm |
| 05:36.55 | Shirik | FAILURE BATBOT |
| 05:36.58 | Shirik | !g NTSTATUS 0xC00000FD |
| 05:36.59 | batbot | Shirik: wine/include/ntstatus.h <http://source.winehq.org/source/include/ntstatus.h> |
| 05:36.59 | Amarande | I'm still not sure I'm going to find my paladin fun in LK |
| 05:37.17 | Amarande | I'll probably end up just leveling her to 80 so I can make the top end alchemy stuff and that will be that |
| 05:37.42 | Amarande | the warlock is already destined to be leveled to 80 and then mothballed outside of JC and mining |
| 05:37.58 | Amarande | hmm. looks like my mage, hunter, and future rogue and DK will be my future in WoW |
| 05:40.01 | seebs | Why would you need to be 80 to make the top alchemy stuff? |
| 05:40.12 | ZorbaTHut | yeah, I believe the level requirement is 65 |
| 05:40.13 | seebs | You only need 50 to make out professions now. |
| 05:40.19 | seebs | max out. |
| 05:40.25 | ZorbaTHut | 50? even for the 450 skill cap? |
| 05:40.27 | NightHawkTheSane | well, if you want to gather on the same toon |
| 05:40.30 | seebs | 50 for 375. |
| 05:40.35 | seebs | 65 for 450, I assume. |
| 05:40.45 | ZorbaTHut | right, I presume amarande is talking about crafting post-wrath |
| 05:42.07 | Amarande | seebs: I'm presuming a large number of the top craft recipes will fall into categories that require you to be 80, though |
| 05:42.13 | seebs | Could be. |
| 05:42.21 | Amarande | such as BoP instance drops and rep rewards that require you to do 80 instances to get your rep up |
| 05:42.30 | seebs | Meh. I shoulda kept my PtR client. |
| 05:42.36 | seebs | Ahh, yeah. |
| 05:43.07 | Amarande | o.0 |
| 05:43.18 | Amarande | apparently, retadins are seeing an out, and it's going to hurt hunters and shamans |
| 05:43.50 | NightHawkTheSane | huh? |
| 05:43.55 | Amarande | Night: The new strategy apparently is that since ret pallies are a DPS class, not a tank class |
| 05:44.04 | Amarande | and therefore, have much less need than prot pallies to actually wear plate |
| 05:44.15 | Amarande | the ret guys are going to start rolling on caster friendly chain in order to help with the mana problems |
| 05:44.23 | Amarande | which means especially shamans will have to compete more |
| 05:44.46 | NightHawkTheSane | eh, any sane guild would say "no, asshat, shaman and hunters have priority on mail. end of discussion" |
| 05:45.10 | Amarande | though OTOH, when it comes to caster-based mail I guess it's not as bad as it seems |
| 05:45.21 | Amarande | there are exactly two builds that make serious use of caster mail, namely the resto shaman and the ele shaman |
| 05:45.34 | Amarande | and in 5-mans, most of the time you probably don't even HAVE a shaman |
| 05:45.34 | NightHawkTheSane | well |
| 05:45.38 | NightHawkTheSane | well.. |
| 05:46.04 | NightHawkTheSane | presumably by "mail" they mean the agi/int/ap mail geared toward enh shaman and hunters |
| 05:46.13 | seebs | That seems like a bad fit. |
| 05:46.15 | NightHawkTheSane | no ret pally in their right midn would wear -true- casetr mail |
| 05:46.18 | NightHawkTheSane | it'd be shitty for dps |
| 05:46.23 | Amarande | seebs: ret pallies are desperate now |
| 05:46.50 | Amarande | and it *is* undeniable that retadins really don't need plate |
| 05:46.52 | seebs | Eh, things will be so different by the time of the "official" release anyway. |
| 05:47.06 | Amarande | since a class whose roll is dps and not tanking does not truly need top end armor |
| 05:47.16 | NightHawkTheSane | Amarande: they don't need plate the same way fury warriors and dks wont need plate. Blizzard pretty much doesn't want them wearing mail/leather though |
| 05:47.17 | Amarande | otherwise, we'd be lol'ing at rogues "melee? without plate?" :) |
| 05:47.38 | NightHawkTheSane | they've actually explicitly stated such |
| 05:47.45 | Amarande | though I *will* admit that's a reason I've shied away from starting a rogue |
| 05:47.50 | Amarande | I feel squishy as melee with only leather |
| 05:48.20 | NightHawkTheSane | it's really not bad. rogues get a fuckton of dodge + evasion and high dps and its hardly a problem |
| 05:49.05 | Amarande | Night: so, what do you think of the retadin's fate then? |
| 05:49.13 | Amarande | they gonna go back to being lolret like BC or is there an out? |
| 05:49.55 | *** join/#wowuidev |Yssaril| (n=Yssaril@adsl-99-139-120-222.dsl.emhril.sbcglobal.net) |
| 05:49.56 | seebs | I seem to recall concluding that a shieldless plate was surprisingly close in effective mitigation to a shielded mail, but I may have done the math wrong. |
| 05:49.57 | NightHawkTheSane | I think blizzard will do what they have to do to keep paladins viable and in plate. *shrug* |
| 05:49.59 | Shirik | night all |
| 05:49.59 | Amarande | will ret become strictly a utility tree, and pallies will once again either have to only tank or heal? |
| 05:50.02 | NightHawkTheSane | but i pretty much write off anyone who qq's about their class being useless as an idiot. |
| 05:50.26 | Amarande | well, there are two categories I suppose who can be concerned legitimately |
| 05:50.43 | NightHawkTheSane | seebs: I think at higher ilvls, shielded mail can outstrip plate, because the shield contributes SO MUCH armor, but that's generaly true yes |
| 05:51.09 | seebs | Yeah. The gimmick is that since there's diminishing returns on armor, an amount of armor which makes a shield significant to a plate-wearer makes it insane to a mail-wearer. |
| 05:51.12 | Amarande | 1) the PvP crowd ... I'm not sure how good holydins are as arena healers, and well, how useful is a tank in pvp? :) |
| 05:51.15 | seebs | My shammy was getting half his armor from his shield. |
| 05:51.37 | NightHawkTheSane | seebs: same, my shammy is pushign ~12k armor on live right now, and that could easily be higher with a few pieces of upgraded gear |
| 05:51.47 | Amarande | 2) solo leveling, as neither tanks nor healers are especially fun to level solo |
| 05:51.55 | NightHawkTheSane | Amarande: as far as i'm concerned, pvpers really don't matter. |
| 05:51.59 | seebs | I think mine was around 6k, but he's only 62. |
| 05:52.00 | Amarande | Night: how about 2) |
| 05:52.03 | Amarande | I can't really deny this myself |
| 05:52.07 | NightHawkTheSane | Amarande: prot pallies are FUN AS HELL to level. |
| 05:52.10 | Amarande | I've tried to level a priest, and hated it, and got stuck at 61 |
| 05:52.15 | seebs | I actually really enjoyed levelling a pally as holy. |
| 05:52.17 | Amarande | I've tried to level a prot warrior, and never got past ... 14 |
| 05:52.28 | NightHawkTheSane | feral druids are -great-, prot warriors were not bad, but ought to be better this patch |
| 05:52.47 | NightHawkTheSane | Leveling as a healer has always been extremely painful if you tried to solo it |
| 05:52.47 | Amarande | also, prot pallies will have some of the mana issues that rets have |
| 05:52.52 | NightHawkTheSane | nah |
| 05:53.05 | NightHawkTheSane | BoSanc pretty much does away with significant mana issues |
| 05:53.10 | Amarande | thankfully I never had the chance to get addicted to wisdom |
| 05:53.18 | Amarande | though I understand judgment/seal of light are getting the nerf bat too |
| 05:53.51 | ScytheBlade1 | http://www.nynaeve.net/?p=226 <-- fun post (not WoW related) |
| 05:53.58 | Amarande | which means I'll probably be headed back to my old strategy |
| 05:54.05 | Amarande | level-wise, that is |
| 05:54.35 | Amarande | the other night I decided to pull out the stops on my tankadin and tank UB at 62, since the thing I had really worried about the most (crushing blow + PUG healer) was a nonissue with CB requiring mob be 4 levels higher |
| 05:55.04 | Amarande | however, it was still a rough ride even with the 3.0.2 judgment + seal of light |
| 05:55.17 | Amarande | I'm probably going to have to go back to only tanking instances where the bosses are 2 levels higher, I suppose |
| 05:56.22 | NightHawkTheSane | i dont know, i never had an issue tanking anything on my pally leveling up |
| 05:57.41 | Amarande | Night: UB was the first time in a long long while that I tanked anything with bosses 3 levels higher, though :) |
| 05:57.48 | Amarande | I think the last time I did that may have been SM Lib |
| 05:57.50 | Neuro_Medivh | BAH... cheesy clip show |
| 05:58.12 | Neuro_Medivh | I hate when shows do 'clip episodes' |
| 05:58.34 | Amarande | I made a basically absolute policy to not tank instances unless the bosses were, at most, two levels above me |
| 05:58.56 | Amarande | hence (plus having my charger) not going to Outland till 60 |
| 05:59.41 | NightHawkTheSane | heh, see my feeling is that i'll tank anything as long as the healer can keep up ;) |
| 05:59.41 | Amarande | before expansion became too imminent for it to matter, I was planning on going for exalted Thrallmar for the caster sword, as a result, I did not want to touch the quests in HFP until I'd milked Ramps and BF for all the rep I could get |
| 05:59.57 | Amarande | Night: that's why I worried of tanking +3 levels bosses until 3.0 |
| 06:00.11 | NightHawkTheSane | translation: group with better healers ;) |
| 06:00.33 | Amarande | most leveling healers tend to be off spec, and I didn't trust an off-spec with my life against crushing blows |
| 06:01.00 | NightHawkTheSane | *shrug* i leveled with a spriest, she healed when she had to, and well enough to tank anything level appropriate. |
| 06:01.12 | NightHawkTheSane | but then again, i also know she's very competent |
| 06:01.22 | Amarande | but then I discovered with the UB run that even with super awesome 3.0 seal and judgment of light, bosses were painful |
| 06:01.26 | seebs | Competent often makes up for spec. |
| 06:01.31 | Amarande | even though they could no longer crush at +3 levels |
| 06:01.34 | NightHawkTheSane | s/often/always |
| 06:01.51 | Amarande | seebs: I blame Blizzard for the lack of competence to a degree, though |
| 06:02.05 | seebs | Not the fact that the players are generally morons? |
| 06:02.11 | Amarande | well, there's that |
| 06:02.18 | Amarande | but there's also the fact that with the accelerated leveling changes in 2.3 and 3.0 |
| 06:02.21 | NightHawkTheSane | why blame blizzard for player stupidity? |
| 06:02.32 | Amarande | Night: players see fewer instances on the way up than they used to |
| 06:02.38 | NightHawkTheSane | trust me, them taking longer to level will not improve their skills |
| 06:02.46 | seebs | I never did instances anyway, couldn't stand pugs. |
| 06:02.48 | Amarande | Night: they don't get as much of a chance to get the instance healing experience they need |
| 06:03.06 | seebs | I did finally do deadmines, on my first toon, after that I didn't bother until muuuuuch later. Too annoying. |
| 06:03.24 | Amarande | and in the case of dps pulling aggro |
| 06:03.29 | NightHawkTheSane | Amarande: i think you give people too much credit |
| 06:03.32 | seebs | Experience doesn't seem to matter as much as smarts. I've seen a player who never healed before train up over a single instance run. |
| 06:03.51 | seebs | Come to think of it, my first ever healing instance run, I got complimented on doing a good job. |
| 06:04.02 | NightHawkTheSane | seebs: yeah, how do you think anyone starts healing? they just start doing it :P |
| 06:04.04 | Amarande | I think DPS pull aggro more often now because of the routines instilled when you level |
| 06:04.18 | seebs | Never tried before. Just paid attention and remembered what someone said about focusing on healing rather than trying to show off by doing damage AND healing. |
| 06:04.51 | NightHawkTheSane | seebs: that surprisingly sums up healing from level 1-70. Pay attention. Heal first. |
| 06:05.01 | Amarande | when you level as DPS, you get used to going full tilt, and because DPS level so quickly, they tend to skip a lot of the instances and thus don't get the experience at holding back to keep from pulling aggro |
| 06:05.14 | Amarande | Then you get to Mechanar and wipe the group because you didn't know. |
| 06:05.28 | NightHawkTheSane | well, its not that they skip instances |
| 06:05.29 | seebs | I don't think it takes much experience, just awareness. You have to know about it and care. |
| 06:05.46 | NightHawkTheSane | its that the paradigm between soloing and instancing as a dps is significantly different |
| 06:05.48 | seebs | The people I've seen pulling aggro badly were quite often just stupid. |
| 06:06.03 | Corrodias | and i would walk five hundred miles, and i would walk five hundred more |
| 06:06.07 | seebs | Again, decent players, I rarely have to tell them twice. |
| 06:06.13 | Amarande | Night: that too, and the fact that that's not just a player skill thing |
| 06:06.17 | NightHawkTheSane | exactly, seebs |
| 06:06.28 | Amarande | when you solo level up, you don't generally take such niceties as threat lowering talents that a serious raid DPS uses |
| 06:06.36 | Corrodias | just to be the tank who ran a thousand miles to get killed at the door |
| 06:06.43 | NightHawkTheSane | Amarande: well the thing is, good -players- will pick that up very fast |
| 06:06.55 | Amarande | and if you don't have a serious raid |
| 06:07.02 | Amarande | well, who's that willing to respec for a casual PUG? |
| 06:07.03 | seebs | I ended up with threat reduction talents when they merged them with other stuff. Before that I sucked enough that it rarely mattered. |
| 06:07.17 | Amarande | unless they're the kind of super rich people who already have albino drakes on every 70 alt :P |
| 06:07.27 | seebs | I did actually pull aggro a few times in my first Mara run, but that was by request of the healer, because our tank was either an idiot or very very sick. |
| 06:07.45 | seebs | So my secondary task was to make sure that nothing stayed on the healer for any length of time. Which I did. |
| 06:07.52 | Amarande | I've pulled aggro a few times on my lock |
| 06:08.01 | Amarande | though I think part of that has to do with that the tanks were wearing raid gear |
| 06:08.06 | NightHawkTheSane | yeah, i pretty much do the same if i see mobs heading for clothies |
| 06:08.18 | seebs | I had such a horrible time with my lock and aggro. |
| 06:08.19 | NightHawkTheSane | mail & shield means i can take a couple extra hits :p |
| 06:08.21 | Amarande | and wearing raid gear in normal 5-mans tends to lead to rage/mana deficiency which leads to TPS deficiency |
| 06:08.29 | seebs | At 61 if I didn't pay attention I'd EASILY pull off 67-70 tanks. |
| 06:08.38 | NightHawkTheSane | Amarande: again, not so much anymore, in theory |
| 06:08.44 | Amarande | there's also a few specific battles where aff locks end up with particular difficulties |
| 06:08.49 | Amarande | Blackheart the Inciter comes to mind |
| 06:09.02 | seebs | I actually specced out of unstable affliction because I was pulling too much aggro so it was useless to have another spell. |
| 06:09.05 | Amarande | the main reason for this: the MC is short enough that DoTs present on Inciter before the MC can easily still be there after MC is over |
| 06:09.14 | Amarande | as a result, the DoTs deal the first DPS post-MC, and the warlock gets aggro |
| 06:09.21 | *** join/#wowuidev Vilkku (n=Vilkku@86-60-157-18-dyn-dsl.ssp.fi) |
| 06:09.34 | NightHawkTheSane | agro on blackheart's wonky anyway |
| 06:09.39 | Amarande | additionally, I can and have seen my lock, while under MC, actually attack inciter instead of party members :) |
| 06:09.40 | NightHawkTheSane | he WILL drop agro |
| 06:10.01 | Amarande | any dots set under such circumstances are -guaranteed- to still be active after |
| 06:10.08 | Amarande | he drops aggro at the end of each MC cycle, right? |
| 06:10.19 | Amarande | that's where I get boned |
| 06:10.20 | NightHawkTheSane | after each mc cycle, i think after knockbacks, and maybe other times |
| 06:10.40 | NightHawkTheSane | although, honestly, non-heroic blackheart is such a pussy |
| 06:10.53 | Amarande | I get boned because DoTs I set before the MC started are still there, so I deal damage right away afterwards, catch aggro, and depending on where the tank ended up after MC, they may not be able to react in time to save me |
| 06:10.55 | NightHawkTheSane | even heroic he's not really hard, if you have people with decent gear |
| 06:11.40 | Amarande | Then there was the first time I went to SL, which was a Murphy's Law incident |
| 06:11.48 | Amarande | - We had a pally tank, which seems to be a big disadvantage on inciter |
| 06:12.02 | NightHawkTheSane | o_0 |
| 06:12.03 | *** join/#wowuidev Srosh (n=Srosh@d019017.adsl.hansenet.de) |
| 06:12.22 | Amarande | Night: It's my understanding that warrior tanks are better at loading a lot of burst aggro at battle's start or after an aggro wipe |
| 06:12.25 | NightHawkTheSane | it is, /slightly/ because he likes to drain your mana fast, but i wouldn't say "big" |
| 06:12.36 | NightHawkTheSane | eh |
| 06:12.41 | Amarande | paladins do a lot more sustained TPS, but build it more slowly, which isn't so good when aggro is being dropped every 40s or so |
| 06:12.55 | NightHawkTheSane | if a pally has mana and CDs are up, the pally is actually equal or better, because they dont require rage |
| 06:13.12 | NightHawkTheSane | where the pally falls down is when he's out of mana and not taking damage/getting heals |
| 06:13.17 | Amarande | - The DoT aggro pull thing happened |
| 06:13.20 | Amarande | but worst of all |
| 06:13.24 | Amarande | that time, Inciter was bugged |
| 06:13.30 | NightHawkTheSane | which is a minor issue on inciter because, as noted, he likes to use high-mana-cost abilities |
| 06:13.49 | NightHawkTheSane | but i've never ever had an issue tanking him on my paladin |
| 06:13.52 | Amarande | I've only seen it happen that one fight, but for the first -several- MC cycles, for some reason he'd keep fully resetting after MC |
| 06:14.17 | Amarande | we never did figure out why ... all I know is he came unbugged eventually |
| 06:15.13 | Amarande | actually, the warrior falls down when he's not taking damage, too, right? |
| 06:15.25 | Amarande | I think that's why I pulled aggro that time in Arcatraz |
| 06:15.31 | NightHawkTheSane | rightr |
| 06:15.42 | NightHawkTheSane | no incoming damage means anemic rage generation |
| 06:15.47 | Amarande | our tank was our guild's then-MT, who wears raid gear easily good enough to do T5 or maybe even T6 |
| 06:17.02 | NightHawkTheSane | it's the tank paradox, really. as your gear improves, your ability to do your job gets worse |
| 06:17.11 | Amarande | that problem may more or less entirely go away at 80, though |
| 06:17.17 | NightHawkTheSane | *shrug* |
| 06:17.25 | NightHawkTheSane | it WAS true pre-3.0 |
| 06:17.32 | NightHawkTheSane | it's anyones guess now, though |
| 06:17.38 | Amarande | Night: Since crushing blow requires a mob four levels higher, it means there will no longer be that huge emphasis on 102.4% avoidance that existed in BC |
| 06:17.48 | Amarande | tanks will be taking more hits |
| 06:17.57 | NightHawkTheSane | eh, thats hardly been an issue, though |
| 06:18.29 | NightHawkTheSane | pre-3.0, warriors used shield block to hit it, and so didn't -need- huge avoidance, paladins just stacked block which blocked for (relatively) little, and druids just sucked it up and dealt. |
| 06:19.11 | NightHawkTheSane | the real change that will affect it is not the crushing blow change, but the change to the underlying tank philosophy, and itemization shift |
| 06:20.15 | NightHawkTheSane | tank skills now "generally" deal damage based on dps stats (str/ap), and buff/stance/forms provide the extra threat on top of that |
| 06:20.32 | Amarande | how is spell power factoring in now on tankadins? |
| 06:20.42 | NightHawkTheSane | as opposed to low-damage moves that had high-threat attached on afterwards |
| 06:20.57 | NightHawkTheSane | prot pallies don't itemize for spell power anymore |
| 06:21.13 | NightHawkTheSane | they get 30% sta -> spell power, and all their skills scale with AP |
| 06:21.34 | NightHawkTheSane | (well, ap and spell power) |
| 06:21.46 | Amarande | in practice they might need to itemize for spell power though |
| 06:21.51 | Amarande | due to the stats that come on spellpower plate |
| 06:21.52 | NightHawkTheSane | nah, not at all |
| 06:22.01 | Amarande | don't they need those stats to not get stuck in the same oom trap as rets? |
| 06:22.03 | NightHawkTheSane | what? no |
| 06:22.12 | Amarande | hell, in 2.4.3, I was always running low on mana on my protadin |
| 06:22.18 | NightHawkTheSane | a) "spellpower plate" will now be -entirely- healer mail |
| 06:22.35 | Amarande | holydins won't be using plate anymore either? |
| 06:22.38 | NightHawkTheSane | b) blessing of sanctuary. look it up. This is why prot pallies will NEVER run out of mana. |
| 06:22.46 | NightHawkTheSane | why not? there |
| 06:22.52 | NightHawkTheSane | tehre's still plenty of healing itemized plate out there |
| 06:22.58 | Amarande | yeah, I did notice my blue bar seems to stay a lot more filled since 3.0 :) |
| 06:23.28 | Amarande | I guess the big question comes down to |
| 06:23.36 | NightHawkTheSane | blessing of sanctuary alone could potentially solve the tank paradox, as it directly converts improved gear into rage/mana |
| 06:23.39 | Amarande | is ret, post-nerf, still a viable main tree? |
| 06:23.50 | NightHawkTheSane | .. it doesn't matter. |
| 06:23.58 | NightHawkTheSane | if it is, it's fine. if it's not, it'll be adjusted so it is. |
| 06:24.12 | NightHawkTheSane | anyone saying "omg my spec sucks, no one will take me" is an idiot, end of story |
| 06:24.43 | Amarande | actually there's a few other trees that seem to be worried of at this point too |
| 06:24.44 | Amarande | arcane mage comes to mind |
| 06:24.52 | NightHawkTheSane | ... i stand by my statement. |
| 06:25.02 | Amarande | EJ seems to be pretty much convinced that arcane spec is noticeably anemic compared to frost or fire for PvE DPS |
| 06:25.28 | Amarande | personally I'm still totally clueless about 3.0 mage spec |
| 06:25.33 | NightHawkTheSane | EJ (typically) has the good sense to test this stuff, and provide solid data to blizzard, though |
| 06:25.41 | NightHawkTheSane | they don't go running to the hills QQing |
| 06:25.55 | Amarande | I was going to go 43/11/7 in 2.x, but I can't think what spec that would be like in 3.0's trees |
| 06:26.37 | NightHawkTheSane | i think you need to spend less time listening to what everyone else says, and start deciding things for yourself. ;) |
| 06:27.03 | Amarande | I've also not yet played a mage past level 15, so I'm really not yet sure what talents are important for what |
| 06:29.30 | Amarande | yeah, aside from my shaman, I've mostly used canned specs |
| 06:30.02 | NightHawkTheSane | There's nothing specifically wrong with that, but it's important to look at the spec yourself, and understand why the points were placed where they were |
| 06:30.43 | Amarande | I've been trying to find a good mage spec so I can piece together what the 'must have' talents are |
| 06:30.45 | NightHawkTheSane | if you get to that point, it becomes pretty easy to look at a new/updated tree and come up with a not-terrible spec |
| 06:31.17 | Amarande | but since I'm still at low level all the skills I really have (other than dampen magic, sheep and maybe one or two others) are generic pewpew |
| 06:31.41 | NightHawkTheSane | yeah, the other thing is you really DO have to play just play the class and level up ;) |
| 06:32.09 | Amarande | I -am- pretty certain that the 51 point fire talent sucks rocks, though |
| 06:32.22 | Amarande | to the point of being basically as fail as the 41 point destro lock talent :) |
| 06:32.29 | NightHawkTheSane | *shrug* maybe. maybe it's just a highly situational talent |
| 06:32.34 | NightHawkTheSane | honestly, i've never even looked at it |
| 06:32.43 | NightHawkTheSane | my mage is frost, with no inention of changing soon, so :) |
| 06:32.45 | Amarande | well, to me it seems very similar to a warlock's Seed of Corruption |
| 06:33.00 | Amarande | except that SoC deals more damage AND doesn't require talents |
| 06:33.30 | Amarande | there's also a lot fewer shadow immune mobs (aren't nether dragons the only really major one?) vs. fire immune mobs when soloing |
| 06:33.42 | NightHawkTheSane | looks like a pvp talent, honestly |
| 06:33.53 | NightHawkTheSane | it's an on-dispel trigger as well, which SoC doesn't have |
| 06:33.57 | Amarande | actually I'm not sure if ND's are shadow immune but they're resistant enough that shadow is basically fuhgeddaboutit |
| 06:34.37 | NightHawkTheSane | also, as was noted eaerlier, there really aren't many major immune mobs |
| 06:34.56 | Amarande | elementals, mostly, if I feel like farming fire elemental items |
| 06:35.12 | Arrowmaster | the only thing chaos bolt is good for is cthun |
| 06:35.15 | NightHawkTheSane | primarly, yeah, and they're usually nonelite so it doesn't matter if you're not using your primary nuke |
| 06:35.36 | Amarande | kinda like how ele shamans have trouble farming motes of air for lw because air elementals are immune to nature |
| 06:35.57 | Amarande | hmm |
| 06:36.03 | Amarande | now to decide if fire, frost or arcane is better for leveling |
| 06:36.24 | NightHawkTheSane | honestly, -thats- an issue strictly because they only have one spammable nuke |
| 06:36.36 | NightHawkTheSane | shocks are not spammable, so killing them isn't hard, just annoyingly time consuming |
| 06:36.47 | ScytheBlade1 | Amarande: anything but arcane. Good for raid DPS, not so good for leveling |
| 06:36.50 | NightHawkTheSane | and, obnoxiously, they -still- haven't fixed that in wotlk. |
| 06:37.01 | NightHawkTheSane | i'd fucking kill a man for a non-nature nuke on my shaman |
| 06:37.06 | Amarande | Scythe, is it worth going 21/40/0 or 21/0/40 to get PoM? |
| 06:37.14 | ScytheBlade1 | For leveling? Dear no |
| 06:37.25 | NightHawkTheSane | imo, straight up frost for levling :D |
| 06:37.36 | ScytheBlade1 | Either straight up frost or straight up fire |
| 06:37.40 | Amarande | how about 20/0/41 so you can have improved counterspell and arcane meditation |
| 06:37.49 | NightHawkTheSane | nah |
| 06:37.55 | ScytheBlade1 | ^ |
| 06:38.00 | NightHawkTheSane | its not worth even touching Arcane until you run out of things to tkae in fire/frost |
| 06:38.21 | Amarande | or torment the weak, since frost means that mobs will be snared most of the time? |
| 06:38.29 | Amarande | (does frostbolt's effect count as a snare for that?) |
| 06:38.43 | NightHawkTheSane | yes |
| 06:38.54 | NightHawkTheSane | but meh, its so deep in arcane, its not worth the good stuff you lose in frost |
| 06:39.12 | Amarande | deep freeze is useless in pve I surmise ... |
| 06:39.22 | NightHawkTheSane | not useless, just highly situational. |
| 06:39.29 | ScytheBlade1 | For leveling it's incredible |
| 06:39.59 | Amarande | frost makes me glad I didn't level my alliance mage any further though :) |
| 06:40.00 | NightHawkTheSane | you think so? admittedly i haven't played my mage a lot, but i dont use it often on her. |
| 06:40.09 | Amarande | *cough* STV water elementals *omgwtfQQ* |
| 06:40.12 | NightHawkTheSane | things either die before they get to me, or smack ice barrier a few times |
| 06:40.22 | Amarande | pretty sure Horde never ever has to go to that island |
| 06:40.28 | NightHawkTheSane | Amarande: they do |
| 06:40.35 | ScytheBlade1 | leveling a mage is -all- about not taking damage.. be it through shields, outright nuking, and when that fails, any number of CC abilities |
| 06:40.38 | Amarande | or maybe Jame's guide just didn't go there |
| 06:41.09 | NightHawkTheSane | ScytheBlade1: yeah, im just saying between snare/frostbite/ice barrier, i haven't needed the stun a lot, but when i have it's been wonderful |
| 06:41.38 | NightHawkTheSane | also, brain freeze makes me happy in my pants. |
| 06:41.52 | ScytheBlade1 | Almost exactly.. it's somewhat situational sure, but you can easily work it into a rotation to keep things moving even quicker |
| 06:42.06 | NightHawkTheSane | maybe i'll play around with it some more. |
| 06:42.25 | NightHawkTheSane | i dont play my mage much, so |
| 06:42.27 | ScytheBlade1 | I've leveled as fire... always, and things like the knockback on BW, DB, and Hot Streak are all incredible |
| 06:42.27 | Amarande | I keep undervaluing pushback resistance too |
| 06:42.39 | Amarande | probably because I tend to think of pushback in 3.0 as a joke |
| 06:42.52 | NightHawkTheSane | in 3.0 it is |
| 06:42.59 | ScytheBlade1 | It isn't long term, even in 3.0 |
| 06:43.09 | Amarande | well, compared to 2.x |
| 06:43.14 | NightHawkTheSane | well, for raid dps i imagine it would be a significant dps issue |
| 06:43.15 | ScytheBlade1 | But keep in mind that talented 70% pushback resist + pally aura = 100% pushback resist |
| 06:43.17 | Amarande | although pushback itself took a lot of getting used to |
| 06:43.18 | NightHawkTheSane | but for leveling, i dont think its a big deal |
| 06:43.24 | ScytheBlade1 | Which in raids is kinda huge |
| 06:43.33 | Amarande | because I came from Guild Wars |
| 06:44.04 | Amarande | where, with the exception of 'easily interrupted' skills, you could only be interrupted by skills specifically designated as such |
| 06:44.26 | Amarande | not to mention GW interrupts rarely disabled other skills at the same time |
| 06:44.39 | Amarande | having half my action bars put on cooldown by an interrupt as standard took getting used to, too |
| 06:44.49 | NightHawkTheSane | GW isn't wow, though, comparisons aren't really very valid |
| 06:44.55 | Amarande | most GW interrupts just aborted the skill being cast |
| 06:45.05 | Amarande | although getting interrupted in GW meant that your skill got put on cooldown as if you had cast it |
| 06:45.19 | Amarande | and cooldowns in GW are irritatingly long :P |
| 06:45.20 | *** join/#wowuidev UltraNurd (n=UltraNur@c-98-216-191-209.hsd1.ma.comcast.net) |
| 06:46.51 | Amarande | wonder if northrend mobs tend to have blanketly high frost resistance |
| 06:47.17 | krka | hm, does anyone know if there's a guide on how to update a year old fubar plugin to the new fubar? |
| 06:47.24 | NightHawkTheSane | Amarande: they do not. |
| 06:47.38 | UltraNurd | hey all. getting a weird bug from the main UI on account of my mod |
| 06:47.45 | UltraNurd | or at least, I think it's the main ui |
| 06:47.47 | NightHawkTheSane | krka: rewrite it from scratch for LDB? :D |
| 06:47.55 | UltraNurd | I have a macro that sets focus on my sap target |
| 06:47.57 | krka | is there a guide i could follow? |
| 06:48.00 | UltraNurd | there's that new focus display |
| 06:48.09 | krka | tutorial / documentation / manual / whateve |
| 06:48.10 | UltraNurd | when I tried to clear it, I got an error from my mod about drop down menus! |
| 06:48.19 | UltraNurd | my mod uses dropdowns in its UI config |
| 06:48.21 | krka | rewriting it from scratch is not a bad idea anyway |
| 06:48.27 | UltraNurd | but... no idea how they're related |
| 06:48.35 | UltraNurd | somehow I got a global something |
| 06:48.46 | NightHawkTheSane | krka: aside from existing documentation in LibFubarPlugin or LibDataBroker, i dont know of any other info, but you might ask in #wowace |
| 06:49.32 | UltraNurd | the full error from Swatter! is here: http://wowuidev.pastey.net/99627 |
| 06:50.36 | krka | NightHawkTheSane: thanks! |
| 06:51.21 | Amarande | 0/0/61 cannot possibly be viable ... |
| 06:51.38 | Amarande | I usually lol when I see 61 points in a single tree in people's tooltips :| |
| 06:51.49 | Amarande | not openly, but silently to myself |
| 06:52.10 | NightHawkTheSane | viable? certainly |
| 06:52.14 | NightHawkTheSane | optimal? *shruG* maye not |
| 06:52.45 | Amarande | There are never enough talent points. :) |
| 06:53.08 | Amarande | or I should say, there are never -too many- talent points |
| 06:54.00 | Amarande | http://www.wowhead.com/?talent=oZZAhcIsfzIbzgfst I am -sure- I'm missing something important here |
| 06:54.09 | Amarande | doesn't look like it but it just feels that way |
| 06:54.45 | NightHawkTheSane | ice shards |
| 06:54.56 | NightHawkTheSane | you -really- want ice shards. |
| 06:56.10 | NightHawkTheSane | oh, and shatter |
| 06:56.16 | NightHawkTheSane | ice shards and shatter are cornerstones of frost |
| 06:56.49 | NightHawkTheSane | and winters chill.. jeeze, how did you go 61 into frost and NOT take those three talents? |
| 06:57.16 | ScytheBlade1 | Anyone know offhand of a floppy that can hand booting off to a CD-ROM? |
| 06:57.23 | ScytheBlade1 | This BIOS is *hating* on me... |
| 06:57.37 | Amarande | Night: "There are never enough talent points" |
| 06:57.44 | Amarande | I'm not entirely sure what can go to make room for those, though |
| 06:57.49 | NightHawkTheSane | lots of things. |
| 06:58.20 | NightHawkTheSane | permafrost, imp blizzard, frozen core, ice floes, imp elemental |
| 06:58.37 | NightHawkTheSane | this is the build i'm working toward on my mage: http://www.wowhead.com/?talent=of0VZZAcccosu0fzgfot |
| 07:01.15 | Amarande | hmm, how about this one: http://www.wowhead.com/?talent=oZZAIcIofuhfzgfot |
| 07:01.40 | NightHawkTheSane | at least you actually have the important frost talents. :p |
| 07:02.08 | NightHawkTheSane | im not a huge fan of imp CoC, Ice Floes, or permafrost for leveling/pve, though |
| 07:02.15 | Xuerian | Is the pally epic going to be buyable from the trainer like the dreadsteed? |
| 07:02.21 | Amarande | while we're at it, how does http://www.wowhead.com/?talent=fZMxAd0VxqrubxRzcbc look for a rogue? |
| 07:02.25 | UltraNurd | xuerian: yes |
| 07:02.43 | NightHawkTheSane | the cooldowns reduced by Ice Floes aren't usually a big deal when leveling |
| 07:02.44 | UltraNurd | amarande: for raiding? |
| 07:02.49 | Amarande | leveling, mainly |
| 07:03.09 | UltraNurd | leveling I'd recommend mutilate. the CP generation is ridonkulous with SF and shiv spam right now |
| 07:03.09 | NightHawkTheSane | and permafrost really doesn't boost your dps, at all.. you'll probably kill stuff fast enough anyway to not need the extra snare |
| 07:03.16 | UltraNurd | but if you really want combat |
| 07:03.31 | UltraNurd | lose 5/5 precision |
| 07:03.52 | Amarande | how important is shattered barrier, Night? |
| 07:04.07 | Amarande | I guess I just figure, if the mobs are within ten yards, as a frost spec I'm probably doing something wrong |
| 07:04.11 | NightHawkTheSane | IMO, it's a purely pvp talent |
| 07:05.05 | UltraNurd | amarande: put the points 3/5 in close quarters combat at 2/2 in imp. sprint |
| 07:05.07 | Amarande | Ultra: I thought that was a must-take talent for dual wield monkeys :) |
| 07:05.24 | Amarande | also, close quarters combat and sword spec aren't friends :) |
| 07:05.27 | UltraNurd | well, you really only need hit when you're whacking on level+3 boss mobs |
| 07:05.32 | UltraNurd | oh, right. swords |
| 07:05.52 | Amarande | you forget also the major ass to-hit penalty from dual wielding |
| 07:05.54 | UltraNurd | drop 'em in imp S&D |
| 07:06.11 | NightHawkTheSane | >.> why did you go 8 into subtlety for that build? |
| 07:06.17 | NightHawkTheSane | no malice? |
| 07:06.20 | NightHawkTheSane | who DOESN'T pick up malice? |
| 07:06.31 | UltraNurd | also, opportunity isn't worth much if you're swods |
| 07:06.53 | UltraNurd | put the 2 in relentless strikes |
| 07:06.56 | UltraNurd | (which they moved) |
| 07:07.00 | UltraNurd | so you can get to the stealth stuff |
| 07:07.16 | *** join/#wowuidev Doow (n=Miranda@unaffiliated/doow) |
| 07:07.45 | Amarande | so precision *isn't* that important, even with the dual wield hit penalty? |
| 07:08.09 | NightHawkTheSane | Amarande: imo, http://www.wowhead.com/?talent=f0xZMgVb00xqru0gRtx |
| 07:08.11 | NightHawkTheSane | thats a much saner build |
| 07:08.46 | UltraNurd | he's soloing though |
| 07:08.51 | UltraNurd | hence all the parry and dodge stuff |
| 07:08.54 | NightHawkTheSane | eh |
| 07:08.58 | NightHawkTheSane | i never liked parry/dodge even while soloing |
| 07:09.06 | NightHawkTheSane | extra dps means the mobs die faster :p |
| 07:09.14 | NightHawkTheSane | lightning reflexes is a massively underpowered talent |
| 07:09.18 | UltraNurd | I like mutilate or subtlety for soloing |
| 07:09.25 | UltraNurd | mutilate for the ridiculous poison damage and CP generation |
| 07:09.29 | UltraNurd | subtlety because it feels roguier |
| 07:09.44 | UltraNurd | http://www.wowhead.com/?talent=fZMxAd0VxqrubxRzcbc |
| 07:09.48 | UltraNurd | is how I'd modify your stuff |
| 07:09.52 | NightHawkTheSane | i haven't tried mutilate, and i only tried sub at 60+, but it was pretty n eat |
| 07:10.24 | UltraNurd | I was subtlety most of the way to 60, and then even to 70. I only went combat grudgingly as we started Kara |
| 07:10.35 | NightHawkTheSane | Opp/Camo just doesn't seem worth it to me, in a combat leveling build though |
| 07:10.42 | UltraNurd | but I like my spec to fit my RP, so I'm totally bonkers :D |
| 07:10.53 | NightHawkTheSane | you wont be using ANY of those openers, nor backstab |
| 07:11.18 | NightHawkTheSane | and losing pray on the weak seems silly |
| 07:11.36 | NightHawkTheSane | and nerves of steel is pretty worthless for soloing, seems like a pvp talent mainly |
| 07:12.02 | NightHawkTheSane | oh wait, i know why i put 2 in blade twisting, they made the talent not sucktactular and added +10% SS damage. |
| 07:12.11 | UltraNurd | for soloing, pick the things that are fun |
| 07:12.21 | UltraNurd | min-maxing just doesn't matter much when a mob dies in ~10s |
| 07:12.36 | NightHawkTheSane | min-maxing is fun for me :) |
| 07:12.39 | UltraNurd | I generally avoid long-CD talents like Killing Spree for soloing |
| 07:12.48 | UltraNurd | because I forget to use them |
| 07:13.12 | UltraNurd | not saying it can't be, more just that most min-maxing only applies for sustained combat |
| 07:13.45 | Amarande | Night: hmm, after a little thought it looks like I've gotten almost the same frost build you did |
| 07:13.47 | UltraNurd | although you do want to optimize your talents for your loadout |
| 07:13.55 | UltraNurd | so, no opportunity with swords, for example |
| 07:14.00 | NightHawkTheSane | Amarande: not surprising ;) |
| 07:14.03 | Amarande | except I only took four in arcane concentration and took the second point of arctic reach |
| 07:14.10 | NightHawkTheSane | *nod* |
| 07:14.19 | NightHawkTheSane | thats a fair choice, i'd say |
| 07:15.37 | NightHawkTheSane | hm, they added 4% sta onto endurence? wow, thats an amazing talent now |
| 07:17.18 | Amarande | hmm, how about: http://www.wowhead.com/?talent=f0xZMxAd0Vxqru0xRt |
| 07:17.58 | UltraNurd | Prey on the Weak should trigger pretty much all the time when soloing |
| 07:18.22 | NightHawkTheSane | I'd still say drop lightning reflexes for Relentless strikes |
| 07:18.27 | NightHawkTheSane | especially if you're not picking up unfair advantage. |
| 07:18.44 | *** join/#wowuidev digmouse (n=chatzill@222.94.151.228) |
| 07:19.10 | NightHawkTheSane | but aside from that and picking up deflection/riposte instead of unfair advantage, thats more or less what i posted :p |
| 07:19.13 | Industrial | rogues |
| 07:19.18 | UltraNurd | I know. |
| 07:19.24 | UltraNurd | we're bad people |
| 07:19.34 | Industrial | I still need to make one some time to maybe understand why being an ass by defenition is fun |
| 07:19.44 | NightHawkTheSane | im not actually a rogue, i haven't played one in a while ;) |
| 07:19.44 | Industrial | because, obviously, im not |
| 07:19.46 | Industrial | :D |
| 07:19.52 | UltraNurd | hey, I don't PvP |
| 07:20.01 | UltraNurd | I'm not the one ganking you |
| 07:20.04 | Amarande | hmm |
| 07:20.07 | Amarande | and by not rolling a druid |
| 07:20.15 | Amarande | I have managed to successfully maintain all of my characters as blood elf women |
| 07:20.15 | Amarande | heh |
| 07:20.18 | UltraNurd | I'm the one sneaking into zones far above my level to collect Elders coins |
| 07:20.36 | UltraNurd | or disarm traps in the ::shudder: Suppression Room |
| 07:21.02 | NightHawkTheSane | hehe, everyone's favorite room to hate |
| 07:21.12 | UltraNurd | I kind of miss it though. secretly |
| 07:21.22 | NightHawkTheSane | well of course |
| 07:21.23 | UltraNurd | and I didn't get achievement credit for Nefarian QQ |
| 07:21.30 | Amarande | in any case, both 5/51/5 builds seem to lead to http://www.wowhead.com/?talent=f0xZMgAd0Vxqru0gRtx at 79 |
| 07:21.36 | NightHawkTheSane | you're a rogue, that room gave you validation for being in bwl at all ;) |
| 07:21.37 | Amarande | (and then I have no idea at all where the last point will go at 80) |
| 07:21.49 | UltraNurd | night: we had 8 rogues on our raid team then. it was nuts |
| 07:21.59 | UltraNurd | for Razuvious in Naxx, we just had an evasion rotation instead of MC |
| 07:22.00 | NightHawkTheSane | thats crazy |
| 07:22.10 | Industrial | lets talk shaman! |
| 07:22.11 | Amarande | btq |
| 07:22.11 | Industrial | http://www.wowhead.com/?talent=hE0zqcdetMxot0xx |
| 07:22.12 | Amarande | btw |
| 07:22.23 | Amarande | is it a general indication that a talent build is bad if there's a straggling point like that? |
| 07:22.27 | UltraNurd | I'm assuming no one knows anything about that UIDropDownMenu error I posted earlier |
| 07:22.29 | Amarande | one that doesn't seem like it can really go anywhere? |
| 07:23.16 | Industrial | put it in some passive talent :P |
| 07:24.21 | NightHawkTheSane | Amarande: for 80, i might go with this: http://www.wowhead.com/?talent=fbe0oZMgAd00xqru0gRtx |
| 07:24.48 | Amarande | UA without LR? |
| 07:24.53 | NightHawkTheSane | (although, the points in vigor & imp evisc can be put anywhere, probably, like imp kick or imp sprint, or dirty tricks |
| 07:24.58 | NightHawkTheSane | i'm -not- a fan of LR. |
| 07:25.14 | Amarande | hmm |
| 07:25.18 | Amarande | apparently I also need to plan my hunter, too |
| 07:25.23 | NightHawkTheSane | UA might make it worthwhile, but I have a hard time justifying avoidance on a dps class. |
| 07:25.29 | Amarande | since the old build I had planned is no good anymore :) |
| 07:25.59 | *** join/#wowuidev Thunder_Child (n=TC@cpe-76-171-31-114.socal.res.rr.com) |
| 07:26.04 | Amarande | is the 51 point BM talent worth taking if not intending on an exotic pet? |
| 07:26.29 | *** join/#wowuidev Sixen (n=Sixen@12-210-157-250.client.mchsi.com) |
| 07:26.34 | NightHawkTheSane | depends on how valuable those extra talent points are to you i guess |
| 07:26.56 | NightHawkTheSane | honestly, i'd say it probably is |
| 07:27.14 | NightHawkTheSane | but not by as big of a margin |
| 07:27.25 | |Yssaril| | Tekkub: you should add a printout of how much money StealYourCarbon is spending at a vendor :) |
| 07:29.10 | NightHawkTheSane | bleh, i hate eating pizza because i -invariably- burn the crap out of the roof of my mouth >< |
| 07:29.53 | Amarande | how's http://www.wowhead.com/?talent=cEbhzgxoiu0eoxZg look? |
| 07:30.22 | Amarande | and dangit, why isn't the DK talent calc out yet so we can theorycraft builds in advance :| |
| 07:30.48 | NightHawkTheSane | erm... wotlk.wowhead.com, talent.mmo-champion.com |
| 07:30.50 | Neuro_Medivh | ? What do you mean? There's several |
| 07:30.53 | NightHawkTheSane | they ARE out |
| 07:31.02 | NightHawkTheSane | there's LOTS of theorycrafting already |
| 07:31.14 | NightHawkTheSane | are you.. perhaps living under a rock of some sort? |
| 07:31.21 | Amarande | ah, I figured they'd have moved the talent calc over already with 3.0 |
| 07:31.25 | Neuro_Medivh | like, of gibralter |
| 07:31.31 | Amarande | even though you can't actually roll a DK yet :) |
| 07:31.35 | NightHawkTheSane | Neuro_Medivh: indeed. |
| 07:31.42 | Amarande | so, anything major missing from that hunter build? |
| 07:31.49 | Neuro_Medivh | heck, there's a beta calc on the WoW site even |
| 07:31.50 | Amarande | or anything one *doesn't* need in pve? |
| 07:32.08 | NightHawkTheSane | i couldn't say, as i've never played a hunter, and don't really know the theorycraft there |
| 07:32.32 | NightHawkTheSane | But, it seems like Lethal shots is worth more dps than imp tracking |
| 07:33.55 | Amarande | beast within can probably go |
| 07:34.10 | Amarande | bestial wrath ... well, nice against certain mobs as insurance against pet getting feared into adds |
| 07:34.28 | NightHawkTheSane | hm. do i want to sleep, or play some FFT. |
| 07:34.31 | Xuerian | Hmm... I've got a problem.... I've started playing bejeweled in-game and I can't stop |
| 07:34.45 | NightHawkTheSane | Xuerian: there's only one solution. give me your computer. |
| 07:34.50 | Mike-N-Go | Xinhuan: Simple. Do something else with your time. |
| 07:35.07 | Xinhuan | Mike-N-Go: Xinhuan ~= Xuerian |
| 07:35.38 | NightHawkTheSane | Xinhuan: pfft, it's excusable, both your names start with X. freaks. |
| 07:35.44 | Xinhuan | and end with N |
| 07:35.49 | NightHawkTheSane | ^^ |
| 07:35.52 | Mike-N-Go | s/Xinhuan/Xuerian/ |
| 07:35.53 | Xuerian | And have I's and As |
| 07:35.54 | Xuerian | YET |
| 07:36.00 | Xinhuan | however, second letter is different! |
| 07:36.01 | NightHawkTheSane | abd are the exact same length |
| 07:36.08 | Xuerian | All it requires is one more letter before tab |
| 07:36.19 | Xinhuan | he has a letter E though |
| 07:36.21 | NightHawkTheSane | i thank the gods that you two don't get into long conversatins with each other on irc, i dont think i could keep up |
| 07:36.24 | Amarande | http://www.wowhead.com/?talent=cEbhzgxoiu0e0t0xb definitely looks better come to think of it |
| 07:36.35 | Xinhuan | some irc chats can color names that are different |
| 07:36.36 | Xuerian | NightHawkTheSane: Haha we do at times |
| 07:36.37 | Xinhuan | hehe |
| 07:37.19 | NightHawkTheSane | Xinhuan: yeah, i dont like that option, though |
| 07:37.24 | NightHawkTheSane | it always seems to have poor collision detectin |
| 07:37.24 | Amarande | I wonder how many huntards will insist on taking pathfinding at all costs |
| 07:37.32 | Amarande | especially with the nerf of speed bonuses at 71 |
| 07:38.08 | NightHawkTheSane | I would expect talents to continue to function properly post 70 |
| 07:38.16 | NightHawkTheSane | trinkets and enchants may not |
| 07:38.27 | Amarande | yeah |
| 07:38.38 | Amarande | hence why huntards would insist on wasting talent points on it :) |
| 07:38.47 | Industrial | http://www.wowhead.com/?talent=cE0GzgxRVuMxst0L |
| 07:38.47 | NightHawkTheSane | *shrug* |
| 07:38.55 | NightHawkTheSane | if its valuable to them, its not really a ast |
| 07:39.03 | NightHawkTheSane | waste |
| 07:40.27 | Amarande | it's like retadins insisting on taking PoJ |
| 07:41.16 | NightHawkTheSane | eh, thats slightly more optimal, though. there's good data that suggests run speed is a significant dps boost |
| 07:41.58 | Amarande | in any case |
| 07:42.13 | Amarande | I have to work in about 3 and a half hours, and I'd better get a nap in first |
| 07:42.15 | Amarande | so ... night :) |
| 07:42.31 | Industrial | runspeed dps boost? -_^ |
| 07:42.45 | NightHawkTheSane | Industrial: time spent running to a mob is time spent NOT killing it |
| 07:43.05 | NightHawkTheSane | so if you make some assumptions about movement required in a raid situation, its not hard to equate run speed to dps |
| 07:43.13 | Industrial | l2ranged-dps \o/ |
| 07:43.23 | NightHawkTheSane | hehe |
| 07:43.31 | NightHawkTheSane | indeed |
| 07:44.26 | Industrial | I see it like this: meelee dps is poking big fugly mofos in the _ass_ for a job. |
| 07:44.48 | NightHawkTheSane | to be fair, with some mobs it'smore like the ankle, or the knee. ;) |
| 07:57.55 | *** join/#wowuidev Kody (n=kody@c-98-210-196-21.hsd1.ca.comcast.net) |
| 07:58.20 | *** join/#wowuidev netcurse (n=hthieblo@c-67-169-39-244.hsd1.ca.comcast.net) |
| 08:29.49 | Wobin | hm MrT isn't as hard as I expected |
| 08:29.52 | Wobin | (normal) |
| 08:31.15 | Wobin | also, eclipse is an interesting mechanic |
| 08:31.23 | Wobin | I'm glad it's not a 'next cast' sort of thing |
| 08:31.29 | Wobin | otherwise it'd be useless |
| 08:32.30 | Wobin | also lol, 20% of my total damage was from hurricaneing the mana wyrms |
| 08:33.16 | Fisker- | WTF |
| 08:33.42 | Fisker- | Blizzard admitted a couple of weeks ago that seals were doing too little damage now with the spellpower/ap change |
| 08:33.47 | Fisker- | and now they nerf it again? |
| 08:33.53 | Fisker- | that's just awesome |
| 08:36.42 | nevcairiel | they want you to leave already |
| 08:36.46 | nevcairiel | (so do we, btw) |
| 08:37.29 | nevcairiel | did you see retribution dps lately? I wouldnt say they dont do enough dps |
| 08:41.18 | Redguard|zz | lol |
| 08:42.26 | Fisker- | nevcairiel i'm holy |
| 08:42.39 | nevcairiel | what do you care about damage ? |
| 08:42.57 | Fisker- | Because i can't heal mobs to death? |
| 08:43.04 | nevcairiel | too bad |
| 08:43.05 | nevcairiel | respec |
| 08:43.08 | Fisker- | no |
| 08:43.22 | nevcairiel | then diaf |
| 08:43.36 | Fisker- | nope |
| 08:44.09 | Fisker- | Since our main source of damage was more than halved someone said that judgement damage as holy sucked |
| 08:44.34 | Fisker- | Looks like Blizzard saw it was a holy paladin and said "Hey why did we promise to buff that?" |
| 08:44.49 | nevcairiel | they hate you, go play another game |
| 08:44.49 | nevcairiel | :P |
| 08:44.52 | Fisker- | no |
| 08:45.01 | Fisker- | respeccing ret when i get the chance of course |
| 08:45.59 | Fisker- | but regardless of you are a healer or not the design Blizzard is going for this expansion is not just bad for the healers, but bad for those groups that requires those healers in the first place |
| 08:46.24 | nevcairiel | holy priests dont really do alot of dps either |
| 08:48.11 | Fisker- | That wasn't the point |
| 08:48.25 | Fisker- | But from what i hear, anyone and their mom would want to do holy dps if it was sustainable |
| 08:49.02 | nevcairiel | i dont |
| 08:49.15 | Fisker- | Perhaps you just suck |
| 08:50.07 | cladhaire | Fisker-: can you do me a random favor? |
| 08:50.20 | Fisker- | wat? |
| 08:50.34 | cladhaire | go to your account management on wow-europe and click the recruit a friend link |
| 08:50.38 | cladhaire | i'm being told my account isn't eligible. |
| 08:50.49 | Fisker- | mine isn't either |
| 08:50.54 | cladhaire | hrm |
| 08:51.09 | cladhaire | any idea why? |
| 08:51.19 | Fisker- | country |
| 08:51.40 | nevcairiel | mine seems to be |
| 08:51.41 | cladhaire | I'm in the UK.. and UK is listed |
| 08:52.02 | cladhaire | Players with a World of Warcraft account from the following countries are able to use the "Recruit A Friend" service: Austria, Finland, France, Germany, Italy, the Netherlands, UK, Norway, Sweden, Greece, Ireland, Belgium, Spain, Russia, Ukraine, Latvia, Lithuania and Belgium. Players from outside of these countries; players with trial accounts, or with full accounts with five referrals from the "Recruit A Friend |
| 08:52.05 | cladhaire | " service currently pending, are ineligible. |
| 08:52.07 | Fisker- | Is your account registered as being in the UK? |
| 08:52.10 | cladhaire | yes |
| 08:52.20 | cladhaire | its my account, at my address in the UK |
| 08:52.30 | cladhaire | ooh |
| 08:52.30 | cladhaire | no |
| 08:52.32 | cladhaire | apparently not |
| 08:52.40 | cladhaire | apparently my address on the account is my us address |
| 08:52.48 | nevcairiel | heh |
| 08:52.57 | Fisker- | You'll have to call billing i believe |
| 08:53.28 | cladhaire | ayye |
| 08:53.38 | cladhaire | how odd |
| 08:54.16 | cladhaire | and naturally, they're not open today |
| 08:55.17 | *** join/#wowuidev Daemona (n=koaschte@pD9E29258.dip.t-dialin.net) |
| 08:56.00 | Fisker- | Well you can try to fix it by changing the address |
| 08:56.08 | Fisker- | but i think it'll still consider you an "outsider" :P |
| 08:56.11 | cladhaire | I cant change the country |
| 08:56.43 | Fisker- | Ah ok |
| 08:56.56 | Fisker- | Was under the impression that you could, but it wouldn't update the account for it |
| 08:56.58 | cladhaire | where is Pixel when I need her :P |
| 08:57.27 | cladhaire | I'm going to be considerably annoyed if I have to make a new account to recruit a friend |
| 08:58.05 | *** join/#wowuidev MoonWolf (n=MoonWolf@i209133.upc-i.chello.nl) |
| 08:58.05 | *** mode/#WoWUIDev [+v MoonWolf] by ChanServ |
| 08:58.56 | cladhaire | so to do this, I'd need to spend the money on two new accounts |
| 08:59.03 | cladhaire | then the cost to transfer both of those characters to my parent accounts |
| 08:59.04 | cladhaire | hrm |
| 08:59.35 | Fisker- | her? |
| 09:00.15 | mikma | cladhaire: why is that? |
| 09:00.25 | cladhaire | mikma: because I can't recruit on my parent account |
| 09:00.29 | cladhaire | so I'd need to make a full account |
| 09:00.30 | cladhaire | then recruit from that |
| 09:00.45 | mikma | you need to do that gecause of...? |
| 09:00.59 | cladhaire | ... so i can recruit a friend and two-box level.. which is the whole point? |
| 09:01.23 | mikma | dont start that =( its lame |
| 09:01.31 | cladhaire | ... |
| 09:01.36 | cladhaire | what the hell are you talking about |
| 09:01.43 | Industrial | level to 60 yourself |
| 09:01.48 | Industrial | then level an alt to 30 |
| 09:01.53 | Industrial | and give him 30 levels |
| 09:01.59 | Industrial | pewpew 2 60s |
| 09:02.03 | cladhaire | ... |
| 09:02.09 | cladhaire | and you have to have recruited a friend to do this |
| 09:02.15 | cladhaire | what the hell aren't your people understanding |
| 09:02.18 | mikma | cladhaire: me no liek multiboxing |
| 09:02.23 | cladhaire | okay, sod off |
| 09:02.24 | cladhaire | i could care |
| 09:02.28 | cladhaire | i dont have anyone else to do it with |
| 09:02.39 | Industrial | me neither |
| 09:02.44 | Industrial | thats why i didnt do recruit a friend |
| 09:02.46 | Industrial | :P |
| 09:02.47 | mikma | pay me and i will play with you lul |
| 09:03.05 | Industrial | mikma: lul means dick in dutch, just so you know |
| 09:03.08 | cladhaire | umm no |
| 09:03.12 | mikma | industrial: i know |
| 09:03.16 | Industrial | oki |
| 09:03.53 | mikma | cladhaire: i am cheap! 1x 1,5 bottle of coke in a week! |
| 09:04.17 | mikma | 1.5l of course |
| 09:04.39 | cladhaire | anyway, what classes should I do if I'm going to do this |
| 09:04.46 | cladhaire | Industrial: this way, I'd be able to get four level 60s |
| 09:04.47 | cladhaire | :P |
| 09:04.51 | Neuro_Medivh | pre-lk or post? |
| 09:04.59 | cladhaire | Two guys level together at 300% experience to 60 |
| 09:05.08 | cladhaire | Neuro_Medivh: Pre, I suppose |
| 09:05.14 | cladhaire | as in my death knight won't be on either account |
| 09:05.14 | mikma | shamans <3 |
| 09:05.34 | mikma | cladhaire: warrior and priest are good, or mage and priest |
| 09:05.35 | Neuro_Medivh | Well, for maximim versatility, pally+shaman |
| 09:05.47 | mikma | aoe-fun <3 |
| 09:06.06 | Neuro_Medivh | if you're dual-boxing, war+druid |
| 09:06.09 | tlund | how can i reset the positions of ag_unitframes? my player and target frames seems to be outside the screen? |
| 09:06.14 | cladhaire | alright have a druid |
| 09:06.18 | cladhaire | i'm thinking mage and something else |
| 09:06.22 | cladhaire | to fill out gaps we don't have right now. |
| 09:06.44 | Neuro_Medivh | mage-lock |
| 09:06.50 | Neuro_Medivh | or mage-hunter |
| 09:06.50 | mikma | cladhaire: check out voice control |
| 09:07.12 | mikma | mage-priest <3 |
| 09:08.23 | cladhaire | mikma: voice control? |
| 09:08.32 | mikma | wait i'm searching |
| 09:08.40 | mikma | http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6Dt215PuQew |
| 09:08.43 | mikma | http://wow.curse.com/downloads/wow-addons/details/voice-commander.aspx |
| 09:08.53 | mikma | example of usage and the program itself |
| 09:09.40 | Neuro_Medivh | HORSESHIT... they nerfed the broom |
| 09:10.03 | *** join/#wowuidev Xoc (n=Xoc@89.160.66.26) |
| 09:10.11 | cladhaire | Neuro_Medivh: ? |
| 09:10.42 | Neuro_Medivh | the Magic Broom is no longer instant cast on beta |
| 09:10.46 | cladhaire | BULLSHIT |
| 09:10.51 | mikma | YEY |
| 09:10.51 | cladhaire | that was the only reason it wa scool |
| 09:11.10 | mikma | well try playing in pvp with opposite faction having brooms |
| 09:11.20 | cladhaire | so get brooms |
| 09:11.22 | cladhaire | nubs. |
| 09:11.33 | mikma | whoa, retardins got a nerf |
| 09:11.36 | Neuro_Medivh | it's not like they'll be here much longer |
| 09:11.45 | Neuro_Medivh | nerfS |
| 09:14.56 | Xinhuan | lol |
| 09:15.10 | Xinhuan | the brooms are cool |
| 09:15.14 | Xinhuan | go into an AV, the gates open |
| 09:15.20 | Xinhuan | and 30 people out of 40 mount on brooms |
| 09:15.24 | Xinhuan | and you have a quidditch match |
| 09:15.55 | cladhaire | :P |
| 09:17.22 | mikma | but try catching one :D |
| 09:17.57 | mikma | i don't mind that my teammembers have then lol, but catching something instacast epicspeed is... |
| 09:18.20 | nevcairiel | its good that they nerf it, imho |
| 09:19.28 | mikma | http://kuvaton.com/kuvei/duals.jpg |
| 09:20.08 | *** join/#wowuidev Lyn (n=Lyn@Ld95e.l.pppool.de) |
| 09:24.50 | Xinhuan | whoa whoa whoa |
| 09:25.00 | *** join/#wowuidev Slakah (n=Slakah@5acd4394.bb.sky.com) |
| 09:25.02 | Xinhuan | you can use Create All now on Void Shattering! |
| 09:25.27 | Xinhuan | ok i'm about 1 week late here, so don't dig me ;p |
| 09:25.42 | mikma | i didn't know that :I |
| 09:27.00 | bleeter | VRRRAAAAAIIINNNNZZZZZZZ |
| 09:27.04 | bleeter | BAH |
| 09:27.13 | mikma | i mostly agree |
| 09:27.23 | Lyn | BOOJA |
| 09:27.30 | mikma | KASHA! |
| 09:27.43 | Redguard|zz | Xinhuan ya it comes in handy |
| 09:27.47 | Xinhuan | http://warcraft.swagdog.com/ |
| 09:27.47 | Redguard|zz | i sold ~ 300 LPS today |
| 09:27.47 | Xinhuan | lol |
| 09:27.55 | Xinhuan | direct link from wow's launcher |
| 09:30.35 | Lyn | mikma, amusing.. leveling in outland is so fast now, ~10-12 quests for a level. that is ... fun! |
| 09:30.56 | mikma | yeah they did speed up the 1-70 enough :) |
| 09:30.59 | cladhaire | Lyn: its that quick? |
| 09:31.21 | Lyn | okay, i am 59 atm, but with my dk on beta that wasnt much different for 60+ |
| 09:31.35 | Lyn | i did 60-70 in about 2*6 hours |
| 09:31.35 | Lyn | lol |
| 09:31.48 | cladhaire | wow, thats impressive |
| 09:33.32 | Lyn | should i level my druid now, or play something different to not getting sick of leveling for my dk? x< |
| 09:33.56 | mikma | try pokemon! |
| 09:34.19 | Lyn | i already have all 150 classic ones on my old gameboy game :< |
| 09:34.24 | Lyn | but then i lost my game.. damnit |
| 09:34.29 | Wobin | gnah |
| 09:34.39 | Wobin | how does one adjust the placement of unitframes with ouf? |
| 09:34.48 | mikma | wobin: SetPoint |
| 09:35.12 | Wobin | Where is it all defined in the first place? |
| 09:35.23 | nevcairiel | in the lua |
| 09:35.31 | Wobin | aha |
| 09:35.31 | nevcairiel | oUF doesnt have much of configuration :P |
| 09:35.36 | Wobin | blah |
| 09:35.46 | Wobin | any other ones with somewhat more ingame modification? |
| 09:35.49 | *** join/#wowuidev QQngsk (n=Gngsk@c-69-138-214-242.hsd1.md.comcast.net) |
| 09:35.55 | mikma | wobin: local oUFplayer = oUF:Spawn"player" |
| 09:36.02 | mikma | wobin: oUFplayer:SetPoint("TOPLEFT", 20, -30) |
| 09:36.03 | Lyn | :o |
| 09:36.09 | mikma | basicly like that |
| 09:36.12 | Lyn | llalala |
| 09:36.26 | Lyn | does darnassus have a hairdresser or how its called? |
| 09:36.36 | mikma | afaik, no it doesn't |
| 09:36.46 | Lyn | damn elves |
| 09:37.19 | Wobin | where are they? |
| 09:37.58 | mikma | in ironforge you stand at the bank looking at ah's direction, then you start running right with the inner circle and it's right at the corner |
| 09:38.08 | mikma | you can't miss the "barbershop twirl" |
| 09:38.13 | Lyn | i know where it is in ironforge |
| 09:38.13 | Lyn | but |
| 09:38.19 | Lyn | i am in hellfire with my drood |
| 09:38.26 | Lyn | and i couldj ust do moonglade |
| 09:38.26 | Lyn | and |
| 09:38.29 | Lyn | darnassus |
| 09:38.29 | Lyn | but |
| 09:38.39 | Lyn | ironforge is too far away :o |
| 09:38.41 | mikma | also, in stormwind you come out of the AH, go left to the alley where the begger is and take a right, same twirl |
| 09:38.48 | mikma | lyn: was telling wobbit |
| 09:38.53 | Lyn | i wanna have a bald hair cut! |
| 09:38.55 | Lyn | ah oaky |
| 09:38.56 | Lyn | :< |
| 09:39.05 | mikma | lyn: bald draenei? :) |
| 09:39.16 | Lyn | no bald elf |
| 09:39.19 | Lyn | female |
| 09:39.25 | mikma | that ain't possible |
| 09:39.34 | Lyn | i know, sadly |
| 09:39.42 | mikma | do a draenei :I |
| 09:39.47 | Lyn | i have |
| 09:39.53 | Lyn | but they cant do bald one afaik |
| 09:40.05 | mikma | i took the nicest one of the hairs with my nelf female <3 |
| 09:40.14 | Lyn | wich one? |
| 09:40.19 | Lyn | the one with the hair band? |
| 09:40.29 | mikma | that! |
| 09:40.34 | mikma | and as white |
| 09:40.40 | Lyn | yeah, did that with my rogue, too |
| 09:40.52 | Lyn | but let the hair color as it was |
| 09:41.04 | Lyn | but my dr00d will get this in white or maybe another in white |
| 09:44.52 | Fisker- | THIS IS MADNESS |
| 09:44.57 | leethal | nerf. paladins. |
| 09:45.04 | Lyn | THIS IS BLASPHEMY |
| 09:45.11 | mikma | they got a nerf! |
| 09:45.13 | Lyn | this is fisker.. |
| 09:45.13 | Fisker- | Mount scaling doesn't work when zoning from blasted lands to outlands |
| 09:45.29 | Lyn | mikma, but they want to review divine storm again <3 |
| 09:45.41 | mikma | was is das |
| 09:45.45 | Fisker- | They're just sweet talking you |
| 09:46.08 | Lyn | mikma, do you try to speak german? :P divine storm is retardin ultimate |
| 09:46.34 | mikma | lyn: trying and failing. is that some sort of aoe that you can run out? :P |
| 09:47.07 | Lyn | no was not bad, just missing a "t" on "is" ;) ... no its something like whirlwind of the warrior |
| 09:47.22 | Lyn | was holy but then nerfed to physical and will be holy again - MAYBE |
| 09:47.42 | mikma | are you german then? |
| 09:48.47 | Lyn | yep |
| 09:48.53 | mikma | nice, didn't know that :D |
| 09:48.58 | Lyn | ^^ |
| 09:49.14 | mikma | then i can start screaming scheisse and lederhosen to you and nevcairiel |
| 09:49.24 | Lyn | hahaha |
| 09:49.28 | Lyn | and weiÃwurst |
| 09:50.26 | Lyn | (do you have the à on your keyboard? :P) |
| 09:50.26 | mikma | that's some kind of sausage? |
| 09:50.26 | Lyn | yep |
| 09:50.26 | mikma | no we don't, but they are planning on adding it actually! |
| 09:50.26 | Lyn | !!! |
| 09:50.26 | *** join/#wowuidev sb (n=sb@sb.stgt.ipv6.sbuehl.com) |
| 09:50.33 | mikma | i heard it from news 2 days ago that finnish keyboard will get all the cool characters |
| 09:50.37 | Lyn | weiÃwurst is a ugly sausage from the same area where they a wearing the lederhosen :P |
| 09:51.08 | mikma | oh, oh, OH! and, Schimanski! |
| 09:51.14 | Lyn | lol yes :) |
| 09:51.17 | mikma | maybe the best thing ever from germany |
| 09:51.36 | Lyn | my mom watched it xD |
| 09:51.59 | mikma | i bought a dvd with 3x schimanski in it :D |
| 09:52.06 | Lyn | haha |
| 09:52.29 | Lyn | you have to watch derrik! |
| 09:52.50 | Lyn | *derrick |
| 09:53.31 | mikma | i think they have been on tv several times, but haven't watched |
| 09:53.36 | Lyn | *g* |
| 09:53.47 | cladhaire | hrm so making a new trial account |
| 09:53.48 | Lyn | wikipedia doesnt have an english article :< |
| 09:53.49 | mikma | once, years ago, i left the channel on when schimanski was on ... and the result is this :D |
| 09:53.50 | Lyn | about it |
| 09:53.57 | cladhaire | you dont get off the trial until it ends |
| 09:54.04 | cladhaire | which means I can't invite anyone to my party |
| 09:54.05 | mikma | cladhaire: are you sure? |
| 09:54.18 | nevcairiel | You cant pay instantly? |
| 09:54.22 | cladhaire | I did pay |
| 09:54.25 | cladhaire | already upgraded |
| 09:54.30 | Lyn | 72 hours |
| 09:54.32 | nevcairiel | still on trial account? |
| 09:54.32 | cladhaire | but that's not as of 4/11 |
| 09:54.34 | Lyn | till everything works |
| 09:54.34 | cladhaire | yep |
| 09:55.13 | cladhaire | http://images.gammatester.com/pics/7ab50334846aecdf461e4e5fa5be7914.png |
| 09:55.31 | cladhaire | tho I can recruit friends on this account ?> |
| 09:55.32 | cladhaire | >< |
| 09:55.50 | mikma | so basicly, you got 2 free months now |
| 09:55.56 | cladhaire | huh? |
| 09:56.00 | cladhaire | i didn't get free anything? |
| 09:56.25 | mikma | didn't you do the "send invitation to friend" thing? |
| 09:56.35 | cladhaire | ... yes |
| 09:56.50 | mikma | and now you, as your own friend upgraded ... |
| 09:56.54 | mikma | ain't that a free month |
| 09:56.58 | cladhaire | which gives me one month, yes |
| 09:57.01 | Fisker- | cladhaire |
| 09:57.03 | cladhaire | not that i need it |
| 09:57.07 | mikma | and when you add gamecard... |
| 09:57.15 | cladhaire | if i do |
| 09:57.17 | mikma | you will get zhevra mount and another free month? |
| 09:57.17 | Fisker- | You don't get the free month until the upgrade has been processed |
| 09:57.22 | cladhaire | if i can't do anything.. whas the point |
| 09:57.28 | cladhaire | Fisker-: i know, im not concerned about that in the least |
| 09:57.37 | cladhaire | i just want to be able to invite my clone to my party |
| 09:57.39 | cladhaire | and i can't =/ |
| 09:57.52 | Fisker- | doesn't take 10 days btw |
| 09:58.02 | Fisker- | online upgrades have to be upgraded manually |
| 09:58.09 | cladhaire | oh for fuck's sake. |
| 09:58.10 | Fisker- | that'll most likely happen on monday |
| 09:58.38 | cladhaire | so no way for me to see how the 300% works before monday |
| 09:58.54 | Fisker- | so they keep the non-spamming restrictions but leave the leveling available |
| 09:59.00 | Redguard | cladhaire, i imagine it works 200% faster than normal |
| 09:59.05 | Redguard | :P |
| 09:59.07 | cladhaire | i hate you :P |
| 09:59.10 | Redguard | lol |
| 09:59.27 | Fisker- | chinese hax0rs used fraudulent CC info to upgrade trial accounts and spam |
| 09:59.37 | Fisker- | then /lol at blizzard when the charge was declined |
| 09:59.42 | Neuro_Medivh | this is so annoying.. I want to know the stats of those bind-to-account items at various levels, but there's no way to find the info |
| 09:59.42 | Fisker- | because then the damage was already done |
| 09:59.47 | *** join/#wowuidev p3lim (n=p3lim@212251216176.customer.cdi.no) |
| 10:00.07 | cladhaire | why can't they process my cc online? |
| 10:00.12 | cladhaire | like a normal retailer? |
| 10:00.16 | nevcairiel | Neuro_Medivh: well on your current level, you can |
| 10:00.23 | Fisker- | I have no idea |
| 10:00.35 | Fisker- | Gotta ask Pixel about their incompetence in that area |
| 10:00.36 | Neuro_Medivh | nev, my 80 DK can't find out what it would be at, say, 19 |
| 10:00.53 | nevcairiel | how is that important anyway? :) |
| 10:01.01 | nevcairiel | or find a lvl 19 and link it to him :P |
| 10:01.04 | Neuro_Medivh | honestly? I want to see how it stacks |cff9d9d9d|Hitem:7073:0:0:0:0:0:0:0|h[Broken Fang]|h|r |
| 10:01.08 | Neuro_Medivh | gah |
| 10:01.09 | Neuro_Medivh | sorry |
| 10:01.14 | Lyn | lalala |
| 10:01.20 | nevcairiel | item links do have the level in them now |
| 10:01.23 | nevcairiel | maybe forge the link |
| 10:01.23 | Neuro_Medivh | I want to see how it stacks up with other gear at the top of the brackets |
| 10:01.26 | nevcairiel | and modidy the level |
| 10:01.27 | nevcairiel | *shrug |
| 10:01.33 | Neuro_Medivh | I tried forging it, didn't work, or I don't know how |
| 10:01.58 | Neuro_Medivh | maybe I could build me an addon to do it =) |
| 10:02.11 | Redguard | Fisker- cc authentication is permitted or rejected by automagic in most cases |
| 10:02.36 | Redguard | only an idiot from 1990-1995 would allow invalid cc data and not authenticate it right away while still permitting it as valid |
| 10:02.49 | Redguard | (which did happen) |
| 10:03.05 | nevcairiel | Neuro_Medivh: try that /script DEFAULT_CHAT_FRAME:AddMessage("Shift-click this to place a link into a chat message: \124cff\124Hitem:42946:0:0:0:0:0:0:0:19\124h[Charmed Ancient Bone Bow]\124h\124r"); |
| 10:03.08 | Fisker- | I don't know the exact details |
| 10:03.14 | Fisker- | But i know this is why it's there |
| 10:03.24 | Fisker- | But as far as i know it's not the case in the US |
| 10:03.31 | Fisker- | so i do believe it has to be idiot related |
| 10:03.37 | cladhaire | well |
| 10:03.40 | cladhaire | they can reject ccs |
| 10:03.44 | cladhaire | so i assume they do _something_ |
| 10:04.05 | cladhaire | but now i can't try any of this out until monday, which.. sucks. |
| 10:04.12 | cladhaire | I was gonna set up my clonekeys, and such |
| 10:04.13 | cladhaire | dual mage |
| 10:04.15 | cladhaire | heh |
| 10:04.16 | *** join/#wowuidev Kaso (i=Kaso@dyn-139.52.lancs.ac.uk) |
| 10:05.15 | Neuro_Medivh | nope, still shows my current level |
| 10:05.31 | Neuro_Medivh | sadness |
| 10:05.36 | nevcairiel | oh well probably adjusts to your current level |
| 10:06.14 | *** join/#wowuidev cncfanatics (n=cncfanat@WoWUIDev/cncfanatics) |
| 10:08.19 | Industrial | Anyone have experience with the Google Charts api? |
| 10:09.03 | haste | isn't it straight forward? |
| 10:09.54 | Industrial | well |
| 10:09.56 | Industrial | http://chart.apis.google.com/chart?cht=p&chs=500x500&chd=t:10,10,10,10,9,8,8,6,5,5,5,5,4,4,3,2,2,2,2,1&chl=a|b|c|d|e|f|g|h|i|j|k|l|m|n|o|p|q|r|s|t |
| 10:10.04 | Industrial | my labels arent showing :S |
| 10:12.43 | haste | there are some limits, but I don't remember them :p |
| 10:13.46 | mikma | http://chart.apis.google.com/chart?cht=p3&chd=t:60,40&chs=250x100&chl=You|Suck |
| 10:13.52 | mikma | well, dunno how it fails |
| 10:13.54 | Industrial | I was wondering if I could make charts out of Google Query Stats :p |
| 10:13.57 | cladhaire | lol |
| 10:14.23 | haste | mikma: http://chart.apis.google.com/chart?cht=p3&chd=t:91,9&chs=250x100&chl=Failure&chtt=Industrial imo |
| 10:14.38 | mikma | ahahahha |
| 10:15.15 | Industrial | <PROTECTED> |
| 10:15.31 | Redguard | lol |
| 10:15.39 | Industrial | tip: do not give charts to people that aim to burn you down every day. |
| 10:16.43 | haste | tip: don't put ideas into the heads of those people. |
| 10:17.13 | Redguard | is there an easy way when moving frames to keep them within the bounds of the parent |
| 10:17.21 | mikma | i'm sorry if we hurt your feelings numbboy |
| 10:17.24 | Redguard | or stop moving if they hit/exceed the boundary |
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| 10:18.19 | haste | easiest would probably be to just move it within the bounds on mouse button relaese |
| 10:18.52 | Redguard | hrm |
| 10:19.09 | Redguard | SetClampedToScreen |
| 10:19.14 | Redguard | that should do it actually |
| 10:19.17 | haste | that's the screen only |
| 10:19.21 | mikma | that will keep the frame inside the screen |
| 10:19.26 | Redguard | very true |
| 10:19.33 | Redguard | luckily my parent is UIParent |
| 10:19.35 | Redguard | so it works out |
| 10:19.47 | Redguard | i will keep the other idea noted for when it is not UIParent |
| 10:20.51 | darko`` | Hello. How would I go about finding out what are the minimum requirements for certain widget to become 'defined' if you will. The least properties that need to be set for the widget to be displayed. A concrete example of my question would be using CreateFrame to create a button. I set it's width, height, text, anchor it and unless i created it to inherit from some Blizzard button - it won't show up. |
| 10:21.28 | darko`` | I am guessing that is because for a really new button i would need to set up more properties, like font, background etc. |
| 10:22.17 | Redguard | i would imagine that varies from object to oject darko`` |
| 10:22.20 | darko`` | So where would it be possible to find such information (something along the lines of 'this field is neccessary' kind of thing) |
| 10:22.26 | Redguard | i doubt that |
| 10:24.17 | darko`` | Okay, where to find material that will let me learn to think in terms of widgets and their necsessities. I get quite confused when i see multitude of different SetFont SetTextFontBoject SetFontStringObject etc - all of them as Button methods. |
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| 10:25.53 | darko`` | It's kind of counter intuitive (to me at least) to have a method that is described on wowwiki as something that will make button use the settings of the font in question )called SetTextFontObject i thinkg), and then have another that is called SetFont and allows to set a font, size and flags |
| 10:26.56 | cladhaire | darko``: as usual, wowwiki is incredibly out of date |
| 10:27.12 | Redguard | it's an ok reference, not a guide |
| 10:27.22 | darko`` | How disheartening :( |
| 10:27.45 | cladhaire | you should be using Button:SetFontString() if you want to add a fontstring to a button, or you can use Button:SetNormalFontObject() to actually set what font is being used on the default font string |
| 10:28.04 | mikma | ~wowbible |
| 10:28.05 | purl | i heard wowbible is http://wowprogramming.com |
| 10:28.05 | cladhaire | some of the methods you mentioned don't even exist anymore. |
| 10:28.05 | cladhaire | http://wowprogramming.com/docs/widgets/Button |
| 10:28.05 | cladhaire | those are the only methods that exist for the Button object. |
| 10:28.30 | cladhaire | purl, no, wowbible is http://wowprogramming.com/docs |
| 10:28.30 | purl | okay, cladhaire |
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| 10:28.44 | cladhaire | the main page doesn't have all that much :P |
| 10:28.51 | mikma | it has a link :D |
| 10:30.10 | darko`` | Thanks, i'll go through it a bit. |
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| 10:49.32 | darko`` | Well, cry. |
| 10:56.10 | mikma | is that like far cry 3 - well cry |
| 10:57.03 | darko`` | It's cry me a river, except there's no rivers on this tiny island. They're the well people. |
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| 10:57.21 | mikma | oh, so it's justin timberlake well cry |
| 11:01.34 | Redguard | lol |
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| 11:27.26 | mikma | cairenn|afk: http://matin.maapallo.org/kuvatuuppari/garfield/2496/20081025.gif |
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| 11:28.49 | Drakhaon | whats the API to find out the amount of aggro I have on a target? |
| 11:29.04 | mikma | let's see now. |
| 11:29.28 | Drakhaon | I checked the WoW_API page but couldnt find anything |
| 11:29.40 | Drakhaon | or rather - I searched the page for "aggro" |
| 11:29.43 | mikma | http://wowprogramming.com/docs/api/UnitDetailedThreatSituation |
| 11:29.48 | mikma | errrr |
| 11:29.59 | mikma | that link won't work cause it don't have any text in it |
| 11:30.05 | mikma | but UnitDetailedThreatSituation might be one |
| 11:30.13 | mikma | UnitThreatSituation |
| 11:30.19 | Drakhaon | ah - thanks |
| 11:30.59 | mikma | i'll go and test that too |
| 11:31.14 | Drakhaon | Im gonna guess threat-meters are gonna become a lot more accurate now =) |
| 11:31.40 | Industrial | I need to make a threat meter |
| 11:32.09 | Industrial | one that just lists the top 5 persons in text above the target unitframe (which sits under my character) as <name> - <threatpercent> |
| 11:32.52 | Drakhaon | shouldnt be so hard with the above API |
| 11:33.09 | Drakhaon | just use raid1-40 and target, sort them in a table and dang! done |
| 11:33.36 | Redguard | Drakhaon omen 3 uses bliz internal threat |
| 11:33.40 | Redguard | for it's displays etc |
| 11:34.08 | Redguard | look at it |
| 11:34.43 | mikma | industrial: have a look at tek's threat-addon |
| 11:35.58 | mikma | drakhaon: [14:36:01] UnitDetailedThreatSituation("player", "target") => 1, 3, 100, 255, 400 |
| 11:36.12 | cladhaire | mikma: I'm putting all of them in right now |
| 11:36.14 | cladhaire | well working on it slowly |
| 11:36.18 | cladhaire | since no one else helps update = |
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| 11:36.19 | cladhaire | =( |
| 11:36.24 | Drakhaon | mikma > ? |
| 11:36.47 | mikma | drakhaon: [14:36:46] UnitThreatSituation("player", "target") => 3 |
| 11:37.01 | mikma | cladhaire: do you... want us to help you? |
| 11:37.14 | cladhaire | if you're willing, sure |
| 11:37.23 | Redguard | update what |
| 11:37.33 | cladhaire | i don't expect anyone to, but otherwise its constrained by my time |
| 11:37.51 | Redguard | what choo updating |
| 11:37.58 | cladhaire | the api on wowprogramming.com |
| 11:37.59 | mikma | ~wowbible |
| 11:38.00 | purl | wowbible is, like, http://wowprogramming.com/docs |
| 11:38.11 | cladhaire | but iriel's actual changes aren't all correct |
| 11:38.19 | cladhaire | so it needs to be tested and fully documented. |
| 11:38.25 | Drakhaon | mikma > so I wont be able to get exact prct values like 63% ? |
| 11:38.59 | mikma | drakhaon: most likely local threatperc = select(3,UnitDetailedThreatSituation("player","target")) |
| 11:39.13 | Redguard | Drakhaon you can get % and raw |
| 11:39.17 | mikma | i have no idea because the documentation doesn't exist, yet :) |
| 11:39.27 | Drakhaon | ok.. time to test then :P |
| 11:39.56 | Fisker- | take that cladhaire |
| 11:40.03 | Fisker- | we killed your precious city boss goooooood |
| 11:40.11 | cladhaire | huzzah |
| 11:43.16 | mikma | drakhaon: have a look at this... http://wowcompares.com/3029056/FrameXML/UnitFrame.lua |
| 11:43.20 | mikma | drakhaon: the bottom of the page |
| 11:43.36 | mikma | local isTanking, status, percentage = UnitDetailedThreatSituation(indicator.feedbackUnit, indicator.unit) |
| 11:44.01 | mikma | so this time i was correct, select(3,UnitDetailedThreatSituation("player","target")) |
| 11:44.28 | mikma | drakhaon: also notice you might need this: "UNIT_THREAT_SITUATION_UPDATE" |
| 11:45.53 | Drakhaon | mikma > yea I thought Id use that rather than the update timer |
| 11:46.11 | mikma | better to use the event yeah :) |
| 11:46.52 | Drakhaon | I remember my first target addon, used the update tick to check if I had a new target :D |
| 11:47.27 | mikma | tekkub has this: local a, status, threatPct1, threatPct2, rawthreat = UnitDetailedThreatSituation("player", "target") |
| 11:47.31 | mikma | http://github.com/tekkub/areyouthreateningme/tree/master/AreYouThreateningMe.lua |
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| 11:48.59 | Drakhaon | yea - I just tried it - gives % with a lot of accuracy |
| 11:49.03 | Drakhaon | like 61.4342122% |
| 11:49.09 | mikma | hoho |
| 11:50.25 | Drakhaon | tho.. if I make a table.. like tblThreat["raid1"] = select(3,UnitDetailedThreatSituation("raid1","target")) |
| 11:50.34 | Drakhaon | and one for each in raid - how would I sort that one? |
| 11:50.58 | mikma | no idea |
| 11:51.21 | Drakhaon | there is a sort for tables: http://www.wowwiki.com/API_sort |
| 11:53.05 | Drakhaon | or should I just make a sorting function myself.. |
| 11:56.30 | cladhaire | no, you should use table.sort |
| 11:56.33 | cladhaire | its silly to implement your own |
| 11:56.57 | Drakhaon | how would I use it on a table with the layout I described above? |
| 11:57.15 | Drakhaon | hmm.. wait.. maybe I dont need to |
| 11:57.17 | cladhaire | you don't, you make a new table, use a custom comparison function |
| 11:57.33 | cladhaire | in that case |
| 11:58.08 | Drakhaon | if I have a table.. tblThreat = { 12, 43, 17, 64 } - that means tblThreat[0] = 12, tblTreat[1] = 43 etc |
| 11:58.10 | cladhaire | local tmp = {}; for k,v in pairs(tblThreat) do table.insert(tmp, k) end; table.sort(tmp, function(a,b) return tblThreat[a] < tblThreat[b] end) |
| 11:58.16 | cladhaire | no |
| 11:58.20 | Drakhaon | after I sort it - will tblThreat[1] still be 43 or 17? |
| 11:58.20 | cladhaire | tblThreat[1] = 12 |
| 11:58.30 | Drakhaon | ah yes, lua starts at 1 |
| 11:58.42 | cladhaire | and that won't do what yuo want |
| 11:58.50 | cladhaire | since you'll lose the mappings between id/threat |
| 11:58.59 | Drakhaon | thought so |
| 11:59.29 | Drakhaon | I need to get out a table with the data percent and unitname |
| 11:59.36 | Drakhaon | sorted by treat |
| 11:59.39 | Drakhaon | threat* |
| 11:59.40 | cladhaire | well i told you how to do that |
| 11:59.49 | Drakhaon | oh - missed that :D |
| 11:59.51 | Drakhaon | thanks |
| 12:00.52 | Drakhaon | and then Id just take tmp[1] to get the highest on threat? |
| 12:01.07 | cladhaire | tmp[1] would give you the unit with the highest threat |
| 12:01.21 | Drakhaon | awsome |
| 12:01.31 | cladhaire | and tblThreat[tmp[1]] would give you that threat |
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| 12:02.05 | Drakhaon | yea |
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| 12:03.51 | Drakhaon | WoW UI Designer causes some serious CPU lag on my comp. :P |
| 12:07.33 | Drakhaon | to reload the .toc - do I need to restart the game or is a logout enough? |
| 12:08.07 | cladhaire | depends on which part of it |
| 12:08.21 | cladhaire | you can add files to load to it and those will work |
| 12:08.27 | Drakhaon | ok |
| 12:08.30 | cladhaire | as long as the files already existed when the client was open |
| 12:08.31 | Drakhaon | just /reload then |
| 12:08.36 | cladhaire | when in doubt, always best to exit and come back |
| 12:08.39 | Drakhaon | ah no they didnt |
| 12:08.42 | Drakhaon | restarting then :D |
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| 12:14.01 | Drakhaon | will this work: TNTThreat.unitName[1] = TNTThreat:CreateFontString(nil, nil, "GameFontNormalSmall") ? |
| 12:17.31 | Drakhaon | it did :P |
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| 12:20.35 | Drakhaon | cladhaire > can I use SetTexture on a FontString to make its background display a special color? |
| 12:20.47 | cladhaire | a fontstring isn't a frame, so no |
| 12:20.54 | cladhaire | you'd need a frame with a background, and then you'd add a fontstring to it. |
| 12:21.13 | Drakhaon | ok |
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| 12:29.00 | Drakhaon | cladhaire > TNTThreat.unitFrame[I] = CreateFrame("Frame", nil, TNTThreat) and then TNTThreat.unitFrame[I].SetPoint("TOPLEFT", TNTThreat, "TOPLEFT", 10, yPos) gives me an error.. any idea what I did wrong? |
| 12:29.14 | Drakhaon | its the second command that faults me |
| 12:32.06 | Wobin | hm |
| 12:32.11 | Wobin | wow seems to never actually want to quit |
| 12:32.28 | Fisker- | it's keeping you in the game >:3 |
| 12:32.34 | Drakhaon | =) |
| 12:32.41 | Fisker- | I'm afraid i can't let you do that Michael |
| 12:32.59 | darko`` | Do questions related to development tools pertain to this channel's topic? |
| 12:34.01 | [dRaCo] | as long as they don't violate the ToS, of course |
| 12:34.11 | Redguard | anything besides canadian beer pertains |
| 12:34.15 | Redguard | imho |
| 12:34.35 | Wobin | Who's michael? |
| 12:35.09 | Drakhaon | an angel? |
| 12:36.00 | darko`` | Right, how do you set some properties that are not provided for in Addon Stuido - but exist (talking about the WYSIWYG design pane). If i edit them manualy into XML, any changes get overwriten in the next build. |
| 12:38.29 | cladhaire | Drakhaon: telling us what error would help |
| 12:38.49 | Drakhaon | cladhaire > oh, I solved it :P |
| 12:39.00 | Drakhaon | I had accidently a . not : infornt of SetPoint |
| 12:49.57 | Drakhaon | hmm.. player aint included in GetNumPartyMembers but in GetNumRaidMembers? |
| 12:50.50 | mikma | lyn: hi, the prowl/shadowmeld macro i gave you last night didn't work, but now i got it to work :) |
| 12:51.21 | Lyn | haha ;) |
| 12:51.53 | mikma | ./cast [combat] Shadowmeld; [noform:3] !Cat Form; [nostealth] !Prowl; Track Humanoids |
| 12:52.00 | mikma | like that it works :) |
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| 13:35.25 | Drakhaon | whats the best way to make a timed function? say I want it to occur every 0.5 seconds |
| 13:36.35 | Drakhaon | mikma > got any ideas there? |
| 13:36.54 | mikma | what what, me highlighted |
| 13:37.03 | mikma | drakhaon: i have an example here |
| 13:37.09 | Drakhaon | awsome |
| 13:37.34 | mikma | drakhaon: http://svn.wowinterface.com/filedetails.php?repname=mikma&path=%2FMikma%2FMikma.lua |
| 13:37.39 | mikma | see local function onUpdate(this,elapsed) |
| 13:38.11 | mikma | gets used like so: elseif (event == "PLAYER_ENTERING_WORLD") then; total = 0; eventbox:SetScript("OnUpdate", onUpdate) |
| 13:38.49 | mikma | that one there waits for 5 seconds after login, and then it disables all grass and stuff from ground. perfect example of timer :P |
| 13:39.05 | mikma | if you want it to loop, just put total = 0 at the last line of the onUpdate function |
| 13:41.02 | darko`` | How do I justify the button text? Or do I have to create some FontString on the button and justify that? |
| 13:41.34 | Drakhaon | mikma > but.. you mean OnUpdate from the frame is trigger over and over and that make onUpdate count up to 5 seconds? |
| 13:42.19 | mikma | drakhaon: OnUpdate gets executed every 0.1 seconds ingame automatically (afaik) |
| 13:42.36 | mikma | you just need to make a timer that waits for X amount of time before it allows the script to be executed again |
| 13:43.19 | Drakhaon | ok.. then Im already on the right track here, tho I dont get my OnUpdate to trigger at all |
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| 13:44.27 | Drakhaon | just for kicks: <OnUpdate> message("Hello!"); </OnUpdate> - does nothing |
| 13:44.49 | mikma | drakhaon: http://pastey.net/99642 |
| 13:44.57 | Drakhaon | oh my god.. Im sooo stupid :D |
| 13:45.01 | mikma | something like that should paste stuff in chatframe1 every 5 seconds or so |
| 13:45.10 | cladhaire | no |
| 13:45.12 | mikma | not quite sure :I |
| 13:45.13 | cladhaire | message uses the error handler |
| 13:45.43 | cladhaire | so you have to have lua errors enabled to see it in the first place |
| 13:45.47 | mikma | you might need to add total = 0 at the last line of the pastey |
| 13:47.57 | Drakhaon | basicaly this is all I should need then: local eventbox = CreateFrame("FRAME"); eventbox:SetScript("OnUpdate", TNT_ThreatUpdate) - and then a counter inside my function? |
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| 13:48.32 | mikma | something like that yes |
| 13:50.35 | darko`` | I am at loss at what should i be using to build this. I want a simple very similar to, say, Guild Roster frame - so containing the header with a few clickable buttons below which is a list of rows each of which will have like a text field and a check button or similar. |
| 13:50.58 | darko`` | So far i was going into direction of a bunch of buttons layed all over the place but this now seems like a forced solution. |
| 13:51.24 | darko`` | Like something that can maybe do the job but is not really the way to do it. |
| 13:51.33 | mikma | and your point actually is? :) |
| 13:51.44 | Lyn | mikma, does feral charge work in stealth? |
| 13:51.55 | mikma | lyn: YES! wohoo! |
| 13:52.07 | Lyn | AWESOME |
| 13:52.09 | mikma | it just jumps behind them and doesn't break prowl |
| 13:52.10 | Lyn | :D |
| 13:52.13 | Lyn | sweet |
| 13:52.16 | Lyn | okay thats hot |
| 13:52.25 | mikma | have you tried pounce lately? |
| 13:52.30 | Lyn | yeah |
| 13:52.31 | Lyn | looks funny |
| 13:52.37 | mikma | i like the current version quite alot :D |
| 13:52.40 | mikma | jump! |
| 13:52.46 | mikma | boing boing! |
| 13:52.46 | Lyn | :o |
| 13:52.50 | Lyn | xD |
| 13:53.04 | darko`` | So studying further the available widgets and some of the Blizzard's own code it seems less and less likely i can figure it out. Any suggestions? |
| 13:54.48 | mikma | do a mockup image to show us what you are after. |
| 13:55.47 | Lyn | mikma, my shred does only 50% of the damage of my mangle :< |
| 13:56.11 | darko`` | mikma, actually guild roster is practically the perfect example. |
| 13:56.57 | mikma | darko``: i'm doing haste-attitude and cba to search D: |
| 13:57.33 | darko`` | I wouldn't expect you to search. |
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| 13:57.58 | *** join/#wowuidev cncfanatics (n=cncfanat@WoWUIDev/cncfanatics) |
| 13:58.12 | mikma | lyn: wait what, that shouldn't be |
| 13:58.17 | Lyn | yeah :/ |
| 13:58.52 | mikma | http://www.wowhead.com/?spell=27002 vs http://www.wowhead.com/?spell=33983 |
| 13:59.33 | Lyn | ah lol mikma |
| 13:59.37 | Lyn | the tooltip says for me |
| 13:59.44 | mikma | i have 225% in shred, mangle is 240% |
| 13:59.45 | Lyn | mangle cat : 240% dmg + 307 |
| 13:59.51 | Lyn | and |
| 13:59.53 | Drakhaon | gah.. maybe I should make the threat update trigger on mob damage instead |
| 13:59.56 | Lyn | shred 225% + 180 |
| 13:59.57 | Lyn | oO |
| 14:00.19 | mikma | what level are you then? |
| 14:00.42 | Lyn | 59 :D |
| 14:00.58 | mikma | then you have rank5 shred |
| 14:01.18 | mikma | which is true, mangle is better at that point |
| 14:01.42 | Lyn | yeah |
| 14:01.43 | Lyn | :o |
| 14:02.13 | mikma | remember to whack Rake after Mangle |
| 14:03.03 | mikma | maxdps.com says the cycle should be: Mangle, Shred X4, Rip |
| 14:03.10 | mikma | but this is for instances where you have tank :I |
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| 14:03.57 | mikma | i usually start with pounce, shred x2, mangle, ferocious bite |
| 14:04.20 | mikma | pretty often one of those "procs" and causes double combopoint |
| 14:05.10 | Lyn | yeah rake is nice cause its bleeding then and big crit chance! |
| 14:05.20 | Lyn | for ferocious bite :o |
| 14:09.30 | mikma | oh wow... |
| 14:09.34 | mikma | the bleeding effects are quite the killers |
| 14:09.58 | mikma | i left some mob alive with all bleeding effects available when he had 3k, moment ago he died :) |
| 14:11.57 | mikma | lol... GlobalStrings.lua:WHO_LIST_GUILD_FORMAT = "|Hplayer:%s|h[%s]|h: Level %d %s %s <%s> - %s"; -- Exa |
| 14:12.01 | mikma | mple: Tigole: Level 40 Human Rogue <Legacy of Steel> - Westfall |
| 14:14.56 | Fisker- | fail |
| 14:14.58 | Fisker- | human rogue! |
| 14:15.06 | Fisker- | he should have buuuuffffffffeeeeeeeeed us |
| 14:15.18 | mikma | perception is your buff |
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| 14:34.03 | Lyn | mikma, how do i use faerie fire (feral) in macro? Like Faerie Fire (Feral) ? |
| 14:34.22 | nevcairiel | you need to do Faerie Fire (Feral)() |
| 14:34.26 | Lyn | ah |
| 14:34.27 | Lyn | nice |
| 14:34.30 | Lyn | thx |
| 14:34.42 | nevcairiel | or it will think "Feral" is your rank :P |
| 14:34.56 | Lyn | sweet works now |
| 14:34.57 | Lyn | :D |
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| 15:02.00 | darko`` | That's strange. |
| 15:02.16 | darko`` | It shouldn't work now. Did they not change it to Feary Fire - Feral? |
| 15:02.30 | darko`` | or that was only mangle? |
| 15:03.27 | mikma | drakhaon: lol now i'm having problems with timers :D |
| 15:04.12 | mikma | darko``: fairie fire, fairie fire (feral), mangle - bear, mangle - cat |
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| 15:29.32 | ScytheBlade1 | http://www.pennyarcademerch.com/pat080111.html |
| 15:30.41 | Lyn | aww watching dexter s03e01 now awww :D |
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| 15:39.14 | Lyn | p3lim, i mean size of ouf buffs |
| 15:39.35 | p3lim | ah |
| 15:39.43 | p3lim | depends on which you mean |
| 15:39.58 | Lyn | the debuffs on your screen |
| 15:40.02 | Lyn | they look "perfect" :o |
| 15:40.07 | Lyn | on target |
| 15:40.47 | p3lim | the raid pic? |
| 15:41.10 | Lyn | erm,.. both? on both your debuffs on your ouf (target!) are good and sharp :o |
| 15:41.34 | p3lim | 21,34 |
| 15:41.41 | p3lim | 21.34* is the size |
| 15:41.56 | Lyn | oO funny number |
| 15:42.08 | p3lim | 22 * 0.97 |
| 15:42.28 | Lyn | why the 0.97? |
| 15:42.45 | Lyn | i am open to nice tricks for getting rid of the 1px issue ;) |
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| 15:45.02 | ScytheBlade1 | rofl - so |
| 15:45.10 | ScytheBlade1 | Zombies can open and close gates that others cannot |
| 15:45.21 | ScytheBlade1 | Turns out that the Hall of Legends can be closed by the zombies |
| 15:46.50 | nevcairiel | zombies can also use town portals of the opposite faction, its kinda OP :P |
| 15:47.13 | *** join/#wowuidev nfsnobody (n=nnscript@sexy.whitey.hostaroo.net.au) |
| 15:47.23 | nevcairiel | i still hate that damn event, leave my quest npcs alone, i just want to get some achievements done |
| 15:49.20 | krka | zombies really interfere with my addon dev :/ |
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| 15:52.06 | ScytheBlade1 | hahaha, I just closed the SW door to the honor gear area |
| 15:52.24 | ScytheBlade1 | Ran in, closed it, exploded |
| 15:52.38 | ScytheBlade1 | Leaving several people trapped inside |
| 15:52.42 | ScytheBlade1 | This event is the -best ever- |
| 16:00.38 | p3lim | Lyn: went afk to eat.. |
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| 16:00.46 | Lyn | ;) |
| 16:00.55 | p3lim | Lyn: the 0.97 is 97% of the 22, to make it fit perfectly due the with of the frame |
| 16:01.04 | Lyn | ah |
| 16:01.10 | Lyn | thought to fix the 1 px issue :x |
| 16:01.19 | p3lim | to fit 10 debuffs in 230 pixels wide (or something alike that) |
| 16:01.23 | p3lim | ah |
| 16:01.53 | p3lim | no, thats just the texture, if you look closely you can see it still fucking up, but not as major as other cases |
| 16:02.06 | p3lim | like the left side of my raid frames >_< |
| 16:02.18 | Lyn | hm |
| 16:02.26 | Lyn | okay :) |
| 16:04.07 | ScytheBlade1 | [3. Trade] [Rollintanks]: i do not want to be traped in teh champions hall ne more.aaaaa |
| 16:04.11 | ScytheBlade1 | I'm a jerk |
| 16:04.54 | ScytheBlade1 | [Zahman] says: wahts up with the door? |
| 16:04.54 | ScytheBlade1 | [3. Trade] [Rollintanks]: i do not want to be traped in teh champions hall ne more.aaaaa |
| 16:04.57 | ScytheBlade1 | <DND>[Sbo] says: no idea |
| 16:04.59 | ScytheBlade1 | That's probably more accurate |
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| 16:23.25 | qz | do i need to tell game somewhere that my files are in utf-8 or its default? |
| 16:23.32 | qz | i mean .lua ones |
| 16:25.18 | mikma | suuuuuuure |
| 16:25.40 | mikma | ChatFrame1:AddMessage"My AddOn is WTF-8" |
| 16:31.09 | qz | not funny =( |
| 16:32.12 | darko`` | IS it legitimate to name a widget foo[3] in the XML and then refer to it as foo[3] in lua? |
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| 16:33.07 | darko`` | or rather, refer to is as i=3; foo[3]:Something |
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| 16:33.13 | darko`` | i mean foo[i] |
| 16:33.31 | foxlit | no |
| 16:33.39 | foxlit | xml is not Lua |
| 16:33.51 | darko`` | Obviously. |
| 16:34.28 | darko`` | Is there a way to enumerate them in the manner similar to what i showed? |
| 16:39.41 | *** join/#wowuidev bazz (n=bazz@84.45.129.54) |
| 16:39.54 | bazz | Afternoon, all |
| 16:41.14 | bazz | I'm just starting to develop addons for WoW and need a bit of advice with a problem I'm having.. |
| 16:42.20 | mikma | ok |
| 16:42.44 | bazz | Can I post code in here.. I'm sure it's a very simpe problem |
| 16:42.51 | bazz | simple, even |
| 16:42.54 | Industrial | pastey.net |
| 16:43.13 | Industrial | post it there, link it here |
| 16:43.54 | bazz | Done.. http://wowuidev.pastey.net/99652 |
| 16:44.55 | bazz | It's a very simple code just gets the pet xp when you leave combat.. puts a message in chat frame. |
| 16:44.55 | Industrial | yes |
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| 16:45.05 | *** mode/#WoWUIDev [+o Kaelten] by irc.freenode.net |
| 16:45.31 | Industrial | bazz: what's the question? :p |
| 16:45.35 | bazz | Ok.. it all owrks, except the event appears to fire 3-7 times. Yet, eventful only shows the event fires once. as expected |
| 16:47.21 | [SW]Dodge | register combat start event and use a trigger that avoids calling PetStat() for mutliple events ;) |
| 16:48.42 | bazz | So, I set my frame to register player_regen_disabled? as well as enabled? |
| 16:48.51 | [SW]Dodge | http://wowuidev.pastey.net/99654 |
| 16:48.53 | mikma | bazz: http://wowuidev.pastey.net/99653 <- i made it shorter for you |
| 16:48.56 | [SW]Dodge | something like that |
| 16:48.57 | [SW]Dodge | ^^ |
| 16:50.19 | mikma | and, so what [sw]dodge said |
| 16:50.31 | mikma | looks pretty darn good |
| 16:50.48 | [SW]Dodge | http://wowuidev.pastey.net/99655 <- the storted wersion |
| 16:50.53 | [SW]Dodge | shorted version* :D |
| 16:51.55 | foxlit | er, that won't ever work |
| 16:52.10 | [SW]Dodge | right |
| 16:52.14 | [SW]Dodge | 6 local function PetStat() |
| 16:52.17 | [SW]Dodge | 6 local function PetStat(event) |
| 16:52.21 | [SW]Dodge | ^^ |
| 16:53.04 | bazz | Ok, I'm trying it out... thanks for the help! |
| 16:53.16 | foxlit | Of course, it still won't work :) |
| 16:53.47 | [SW]Dodge | foxlit: well yea the player_rege_disabled is missing :D |
| 16:53.59 | [SW]Dodge | foxlit: that happens when stupidly copy/pasting :D |
| 16:54.01 | foxlit | Nah, I'm objecting to a purely Lua issue :) |
| 16:54.13 | [SW]Dodge | found it |
| 16:54.18 | [SW]Dodge | and trg = true then <- |
| 16:54.23 | *** join/#wowuidev grzesieq (n=grzesieq@3905ds1-brh.0.fullrate.dk) |
| 16:54.27 | [SW]Dodge | neeeds to be "and trg == true then" |
| 16:54.31 | [SW]Dodge | :D |
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| 16:54.34 | *** mode/#WoWUIDev [+o Iriel] by ChanServ |
| 16:55.08 | foxlit | there's one more, at least |
| 16:55.09 | [SW]Dodge | but imo bazz should be able to fix that ;D |
| 16:55.15 | bazz | yep, i saw that... and added the DISABLED event reg..just need to find something to kill. |
| 16:55.19 | *** join/#wowuidev grzesieq (n=grzesieq@3905ds1-brh.0.fullrate.dk) |
| 16:55.24 | Lyn | sb, i want mucumba's equip ... then i would play enhance :< i only have the same offhand and one of the trinkets as he has :<< |
| 16:55.34 | [SW]Dodge | foxlit ah well found last one |
| 16:55.35 | [SW]Dodge | ^^ |
| 16:56.04 | sb | Lyn: haha :P |
| 16:56.06 | foxlit | But how would you know if it really was the last one? :) |
| 16:56.11 | Lyn | sb :< |
| 16:56.14 | [SW]Dodge | local PetStat |
| 16:56.14 | [SW]Dodge | ...SetScript... |
| 16:56.14 | [SW]Dodge | function PetStat(event... |
| 16:56.38 | sb | Lyn: http://wowwebstats.com/bhsmghiy1uckg?s=106125-137138 |
| 16:56.43 | [SW]Dodge | in current setscripot petstat is nil :D |
| 16:57.06 | Lyn | whaaat, onnly on 7? |
| 16:57.16 | sb | see... :p |
| 16:57.28 | Lyn | sb, he should put more points in elemental :P |
| 16:57.34 | Lyn | static shock istn worth it |
| 16:57.51 | [SW]Dodge | wtf 4279 dps o_O |
| 16:58.15 | Industrial | ^ |
| 16:58.42 | sb | Lyn: and you want my head, right? :p |
| 16:58.51 | Lyn | sb, why i want your head? |
| 16:59.29 | sb | [SW]Dodge: deep wounds... :P |
| 16:59.53 | Lyn | sb, i feel sorry for tuvil... poor elemental is really shitty atm.. with lava burst we get a little burst but i think it will not as good as it was pre-3.0 |
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| 17:00.24 | *** mode/#WoWUIDev [+v Cide] by ChanServ |
| 17:04.49 | Lyn | meh funny, armory doesnt work |
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| 17:09.45 | mikma | durids rouls ok |
| 17:09.58 | Lyn | woot? |
| 17:10.24 | mikma | claw claw purrrr |
| 17:10.42 | Lyn | swipe swipe rawr rwar oO; |
| 17:11.03 | Lyn | man i dont like this albino drake, looks ugly |
| 17:11.22 | mikma | me neither |
| 17:11.37 | mikma | protodrakes are cuul |
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| 17:11.42 | Lyn | naww |
| 17:11.44 | Lyn | no |
| 17:11.45 | Lyn | i want |
| 17:11.51 | Lyn | an ufo |
| 17:11.52 | Lyn | :D |
| 17:11.58 | mikma | lulz |
| 17:12.04 | Lyn | engineer for northrend! |
| 17:12.10 | mikma | industrial: cockz |
| 17:12.13 | Lyn | with funky disco laser |
| 17:12.25 | mikma | pewpewmount |
| 17:12.31 | Lyn | :D |
| 17:12.35 | mikma | the magic carpet is nice |
| 17:12.37 | Lyn | haah yes |
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| 17:15.30 | mikma | now, pick a letter and complete the nick: cladhair_ |
| 17:15.44 | Lyn | y |
| 17:15.46 | Lyn | :p |
| 17:15.56 | Industrial | haha i wanted to say s but Lyn wins |
| 17:15.57 | mikma | i pick y, which results cladhairy |
| 17:16.05 | Lyn | xD |
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| 17:16.26 | *** mode/#WoWUIDev [+o cladhaire] by ChanServ |
| 17:17.22 | ScytheBlade1 | This other hard drive sucks |
| 17:17.26 | qz | if i'm getting lines from own tooltip, do i replace GameTooltipTextLeft1 with MyTooltipNameTextLeft1 for example? |
| 17:17.28 | ScytheBlade1 | 36MB/sec sustained write |
| 17:18.10 | mikma | ewwww, creating tooltips |
| 17:18.42 | qz | mikma, huh? ;) |
| 17:19.50 | [SW]Dodge | haha my last upload to wowi is still pending and there is allready a new one xD' |
| 17:20.10 | mikma | its nasty. see tinytip, tiptac, ranttooltip, cowtip... |
| 17:20.45 | qz | mikma, i just want to get information about items in my tradeskill. so i want :SetTradeSkillItem and parse lines. for such task its nasty also? |
| 17:21.06 | Lyn | so, now i will make a rune mod for my dk x] |
| 17:21.15 | Lyn | which fits in my ui |
| 17:21.16 | mikma | qz: no idea |
| 17:21.22 | qz | Lyn, mod to do what? ;) |
| 17:21.23 | sb | Lyn: yup, elemental sucks... |
| 17:21.33 | Lyn | qz, just customize the rune frame :p |
| 17:22.16 | Lyn | sb, sadly :/ i think to respec for addon.. but... my enhance gear is not thaat good, too less hit; wrong socketed etc |
| 17:22.21 | qz | sad.. and worst is that i had this tooltip code working well in Hack, but in own addon it is not working =p |
| 17:22.32 | sb | Lyn: faction change :p |
| 17:22.43 | sb | go play deathknight :p |
| 17:22.50 | sb | (horde deathknight :p) |
| 17:23.07 | Lyn | i do, but will raid with densetsu with addon... and i dont think schwarzfaust want me on horde ;) |
| 17:24.56 | sb | haha :p |
| 17:25.09 | mikma | lederhosen |
| 17:25.27 | sb | mikma: uhm... yes!? :p |
| 17:25.48 | Lyn | mikma, weiÃwurst! :p |
| 17:26.08 | mikma | sb: huuh you like that! |
| 17:26.12 | mikma | busted |
| 17:26.27 | Drakhaon | mikma > my aggrometer works :P just gonna add warnings etc to it aswell |
| 17:26.34 | Lyn | sb, and i farmed stuff for my dk (professions) so when i would change i've nothing :o |
| 17:26.47 | mikma | drakhaon: is niiiiiice, sexytime! |
| 17:26.52 | sb | Lyn: mh, why not? |
| 17:27.05 | sb | just put it on some horde char |
| 17:27.20 | *** part/#wowuidev bazz (n=bazz@84.45.129.54) |
| 17:27.26 | sb | zombie trade still works ;) |
| 17:28.07 | Drakhaon | mikma > =) even got each name to color the background from green (safe aggro) to red (aggro) |
| 17:28.11 | *** join/#wowuidev Thunder_Child (n=TC@cpe-76-171-31-114.socal.res.rr.com) |
| 17:28.15 | Drakhaon | tho it wont show aggro below 30% and maximum 10 names |
| 17:28.30 | mikma | drakhaon: GetThreatColor or so |
| 17:28.47 | mikma | drakhaon: see tekkubs addon i linked earlier =) |
| 17:29.10 | Drakhaon | nah I use the threatvalue / 100 and settexture |
| 17:29.14 | Lyn | sb, yeah it works.. not clear yet, atm i have an "save" raid spot ... dunno how it is when i would change |
| 17:29.20 | Drakhaon | so it fades nicely between green and red |
| 17:29.27 | sb | yup, thats right |
| 17:29.32 | Drakhaon | tho it wont show party/raid members so I guess I cant collect their info |
| 17:29.45 | Drakhaon | meaning, I'll need to send that info through channels |
| 17:33.05 | Lyn | so... work to do :x |
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| 17:51.33 | kd3 | blah... what is it with the PTR and beta running different builds? |
| 17:54.41 | Shirik | they just want to mess with your head, kd3 |
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| 18:04.42 | *** part/#wowuidev Sangi_ (n=Sangi@adsl-074-180-078-094.sip.msy.bellsouth.net) |
| 18:07.01 | *** join/#wowuidev Dashkal (n=dashkal@S0106000476e7af4b.vc.shawcable.net) |
| 18:07.26 | kd3 | +RESILIENCE_CRIT_CHANCE_TO_DAMAGE_REDUCTION_MULTIPLIER = 2.2; |
| 18:07.28 | kd3 | hm |
| 18:07.33 | *** join/#wowuidev grzesieq_ (n=grzesieq@3905ds1-brh.0.fullrate.dk) |
| 18:07.39 | Lyn | teletubbies.. teletubbies... *sing |
| 18:08.12 | mikma | tubgirlies, tubgirlies... |
| 18:08.43 | *** join/#wowuidev cncfanatics (n=cncfanat@WoWUIDev/cncfanatics) |
| 18:09.00 | Shirik | Things I don't want to see in my SVN logs: |
| 18:09.19 | Shirik | <Added> E:\s..\InternalObjectException.cpp |
| 18:09.24 | Shirik | who made a folder named s.. .... |
| 18:09.50 | mikma | named sad cock? |
| 18:10.01 | Shirik | no |
| 18:10.02 | Lyn | mikma, :O |
| 18:10.03 | Shirik | it's named s.. |
| 18:10.14 | Lyn | anyone have some funky new textures for runes? |
| 18:10.19 | Lyn | i have to replace the original |
| 18:10.34 | mikma | shirik: i would like to buy a, like anus |
| 18:10.38 | Shirik | ... |
| 18:11.53 | mikma | shirik: got windows xp? |
| 18:11.58 | Drakhaon | mikma > ignore what I said earlier :P sometimes I get double rows with the same name - displaying threat over 100% on the second line |
| 18:12.33 | Lyn | :< |
| 18:12.40 | mikma | drakhaon: whaaa, have you said something to me? |
| 18:14.44 | Drakhaon | about my threat addon working :D |
| 18:14.52 | Shirik | mikma: vista, why |
| 18:14.52 | Drakhaon | Arena titles etc was bugged right? |
| 18:15.06 | mikma | shirik: damnit :I |
| 18:15.27 | mikma | shirik: i wanted you to watch this: http://pouet.net/prod.php?which=7138 |
| 18:15.34 | mikma | shirik: but i have no idea will it work with vista |
| 18:18.03 | mikma | shirik: if it won't work in vista, there's links for the videos on that page, .avi and .mp4 |
| 18:20.31 | *** join/#wowuidev grzesie__ (n=grzesieq@3905ds1-brh.0.fullrate.dk) |
| 18:24.12 | *** join/#wowuidev Remaxer|PT (n=Remaxer@88.157.244.133) |
| 18:24.30 | Remaxer|PT | Hi |
| 18:24.45 | Remaxer|PT | hmm...is it just me or does the new aloft not work? |
| 18:24.59 | mikma | is aloft ace addon? |
| 18:25.09 | Remaxer|PT | not sure...i guess yes |
| 18:25.16 | mikma | then try #wowace :) |
| 18:25.21 | Remaxer|PT | ahh ok ty |
| 18:25.23 | mikma | or #curseforge ? |
| 18:25.52 | Remaxer|PT | ahh...on the same server or on another? |
| 18:26.04 | mikma | same server |
| 18:26.44 | mikma | remaxer|pt: http://www.wowace.com/projects/aloft/ |
| 18:30.35 | Shirik | : bad interpreter: no such file or directory |
| 18:30.37 | Shirik | ^ wtf |
| 18:31.21 | kromar | is it possible to get the coordinates of a frame relative to the screen and not the screen zones? |
| 18:33.15 | Iriel | kromar: ? |
| 18:33.31 | Iriel | kromar: Can you explain the difference, i'm not sure what you're asking |
| 18:33.38 | Remaxer|PT | hmm seems im not the only one with aloft probs |
| 18:35.15 | kromar | iriel: when i use frame:GetPoint() it will return the x/y of the screen zone (CENTER,BOTTOM, LEFT, ...) what i need is something like GetCursorPosition() which returns the x/y relative to BOTTOMLEFT no matter where the curser is |
| 18:35.45 | Iriel | frame:GetRect() is what you want |
| 18:35.46 | Iriel | I think |
| 18:36.53 | kromar | what exactly does GetRect() do? |
| 18:38.10 | Iriel | returns the x,y,width,height of the frame |
| 18:38.19 | Thrae | kromar: It gets the hitbox of the frame. |
| 18:38.20 | Iriel | relatve to the bottomleft of the screen |
| 18:38.28 | Iriel | it's not the hitbox |
| 18:38.40 | Thrae | kromar: It doesn't get the hitbox of the frame. |
| 18:38.40 | Iriel | (Since you can change that with SetHitRect) |
| 18:38.48 | Iriel | or something along those lines |
| 18:39.44 | *** join/#wowuidev Thunder_Child (n=TC@cpe-76-171-31-114.socal.res.rr.com) |
| 18:40.56 | kromar | thx for the help, gona try that |
| 18:41.13 | Thrae | Wow, sucks to be in Australia. And I thought USA's Net Neutrality problems were bad... |
| 18:41.44 | Amarande | what are they doing in Oz? |
| 18:42.32 | Thrae | http://arstechnica.com/news.ars/post/20081024-aussie-govt-dont-criticize-our-terrible-net-filters.html <-- also has a link to EF Australia's analysis |
| 18:42.35 | *** join/#wowuidev Mike-N-Go (n=MikeNGoS@michaelg20.goshen.edu) |
| 18:44.38 | kd3 | holy hell |
| 18:44.43 | kd3 | they're doing the fully-fledged naxx invasion |
| 18:44.49 | kd3 | tanaris, azshara, winterspring under attack |
| 18:44.53 | Lyn | mikma, can you help me please? :< |
| 18:45.17 | NightHawkTheSane | kd3: whaaaaaaa? |
| 18:46.30 | mikma | lyn: i can try! |
| 18:46.34 | seebs | Cool! |
| 18:47.09 | Lyn | mikma, how can i replace the two tables with own textures? (local iconTextures and runeTextures) in http://wowcompares.com/3029056/FrameXML/RuneFrame.lua ? |
| 18:47.11 | kromar | Iriel: what about x,y = frame:GetCenter() what x/y are those? |
| 18:47.18 | seebs | I'm still trying to figure out when they'll do the sacking-cities part of this. :) |
| 18:47.21 | Iriel | the center of the frame |
| 18:47.23 | Lyn | i tried to copy the tables and change path |
| 18:47.23 | Iriel | screen relative |
| 18:47.26 | Lyn | but that throws out some errors |
| 18:47.39 | Iriel | (They may be frame effective scale tho, I dont remember offhand) |
| 18:47.49 | kromar | ok thx |
| 18:48.02 | Iriel | there's GetLeft and GetRight too |
| 18:48.19 | Iriel | GetRect is nice because you get enough information to answer any question with just one call |
| 18:48.34 | mikma | lyn: umm humm |
| 18:49.00 | kromar | ok i will see what fits best for my needs, thx again |
| 18:50.52 | Neuro_Medivh | it seems the special bosses from the Scourge Invasion from back in 06 are back |
| 18:51.17 | kd3 | yay |
| 18:51.44 | ScytheBlade1 | HOLY CRAP |
| 18:51.51 | ScytheBlade1 | There's a giant floating necropolis outside of IF |
| 18:51.55 | Lyn | mikma, no idea? ^^ |
| 18:52.06 | mikma | lyn: i'm checking the code now, was in middle of HH moment ago |
| 18:52.14 | Iriel | ScytheBlade1: The Vogons have arrivef |
| 18:52.16 | Lyn | ah ok :) |
| 18:52.19 | Iriel | s/f/d/ |
| 18:52.22 | ScytheBlade1 | Indeed |
| 18:52.36 | Neuro_Medivh | lol, just saw that Scythe |
| 18:53.18 | mikma | lyn: try something like /spew RuneButtonIndividual1:GetChildren() |
| 18:53.37 | mikma | i need to install stuff on wotlk to test things out. |
| 18:53.38 | *** join/#wowuidev Tekkub (n=tekkub@WoWUIDev/WoWI/Featured/Dongle/GitHub/Tekkub) |
| 18:53.38 | *** mode/#WoWUIDev [+v Tekkub] by ChanServ |
| 18:53.41 | Lyn | does that work without libs? :x |
| 18:54.24 | mikma | libs? which one? |
| 18:54.25 | *** join/#wowuidev XTZGZoReX (n=xtzgzore@0x3e42c894.adsl.cybercity.dk) |
| 18:54.25 | haste | spew is a tekkub addon |
| 18:54.34 | mikma | ya sorry, spew or print |
| 18:54.37 | mikma | i like spew more |
| 18:54.57 | Iriel | or /dump if you have my DevTools |
| 18:54.58 | mikma | gah, 25.9mb patch |
| 18:55.03 | ScytheBlade1 | ! |
| 18:55.07 | ScytheBlade1 | New questgivers in SW |
| 18:55.08 | mikma | loltools! |
| 18:55.14 | mikma | no-one uses loltools |
| 18:55.21 | mikma | scytheblade1: where? |
| 18:55.27 | *** part/#wowuidev XTZGZoReX (n=xtzgzore@0x3e42c894.adsl.cybercity.dk) |
| 18:55.27 | ScytheBlade1 | mikma: outside the AH |
| 18:55.30 | seebs | Oooh, cool. New content! |
| 18:55.31 | *** join/#wowuidev XTZGZoReX (n=xtzgzore@0x3e42c894.adsl.cybercity.dk) |
| 18:55.56 | ScytheBlade1 | hahahaha |
| 18:56.02 | ScytheBlade1 | They cloned the Naxx invsasion |
| 18:56.09 | mikma | xtzgzorex: hi! welcome to wowuidev! |
| 18:56.23 | XTZGZoReX | mikma: Hai? =o |
| 18:56.29 | Lyn | so devtools :x |
| 18:57.04 | mikma | ~devtools |
| 18:57.05 | purl | Iriel's DevTools, a highly useful set of debugging tools for developers on WoW. Found at http://www.wowinterface.com/downloads/fileinfo.php?id=3999 Why isn't it in the default client yet? |
| 18:57.13 | Lyn | ;) |
| 18:57.38 | mikma | scytheblade1: i even got mail! |
| 18:57.44 | mikma | "argent dawn needs your help!" |
| 18:58.03 | ScytheBlade1 | lol |
| 18:58.57 | kd3 | ah, memories |
| 18:59.10 | ScytheBlade1 | They literally cloned the Naxx invasion |
| 18:59.10 | kd3 | wonder if they added casters to the invader packs in the high-level zones |
| 18:59.13 | ScytheBlade1 | And added a quest |
| 18:59.51 | *** join/#wowuidev Godzmack_ (n=Godzmack@85-220-2-78.dsl.dynamic.simnet.is) |
| 18:59.52 | NightHawkTheSane | oh snap.. naxx invasion, sweet |
| 18:59.53 | NeoTron | mikma: about to go do that quest now |
| 19:00.03 | Antiarc | http://wow.tachyonsix.com/WoWScrnShot_102508_115921.jpg |
| 19:00.09 | NightHawkTheSane | i should go check out LHC |
| 19:00.29 | NeoTron | I'm currently on my way to LHC... flying on a griffin... as a zombie |
| 19:00.34 | NeoTron | that was pretty hot |
| 19:01.56 | NeoTron | so I died |
| 19:01.59 | NeoTron | that was more fun |
| 19:02.03 | mikma | i'm going to check the karazhan crypt |
| 19:02.16 | Lyn | Antiarc, sweet |
| 19:02.59 | mikma | lol |
| 19:03.07 | mikma | there's skeleton skulls on worldmap |
| 19:04.16 | Lyn | meh |
| 19:04.18 | NeoTron | ~Chamber of Secrets quest is up |
| 19:04.19 | purl | roulette |
| 19:04.30 | Lyn | i think i just replace the textures inside the Icons folder |
| 19:04.31 | Lyn | :< |
| 19:05.42 | *** join/#wowuidev IdentifyTarget (n=Identify@241.23.119.70.cfl.res.rr.com) |
| 19:05.44 | Remaxer|PT | is there a mod that can make my Micromenu go to a fubar menu like? |
| 19:05.53 | Remaxer|PT | addon |
| 19:05.55 | ScytheBlade1 | Where is the Servent's Quarters in Kara? |
| 19:06.18 | Remaxer|PT | nevermind i found one |
| 19:06.20 | mikma | "servant's quarters in karazhan" |
| 19:06.41 | mikma | scytheblade1: i'm thinking about the place before prince |
| 19:06.46 | mikma | or the place where moroes is |
| 19:06.57 | ScytheBlade1 | sigh |
| 19:07.04 | ScytheBlade1 | Animal Boss/Maiden |
| 19:07.11 | NightHawkTheSane | There's a quest leading to Kara from LHC |
| 19:07.57 | NeoTron | that quest was right in IF too near the bank |
| 19:08.04 | Amarande | yay |
| 19:08.08 | Amarande | at least prot pallies still kick ass |
| 19:08.12 | Remaxer|PT | Servants' Quarters is the place with spiders at the beginnin |
| 19:08.17 | Amarande | glad I didn't fall into the ret trap |
| 19:08.44 | mikma | hohoo |
| 19:09.31 | Neuro_Medivh | I see no quest near the bank, NeoTron |
| 19:09.46 | mikma | lyn: no luck so far? |
| 19:09.57 | Lyn | no.. |
| 19:10.21 | Amarande | Here's the difference between ret and prot: |
| 19:10.26 | Amarande | Prot is WAA. Rets go Waa. |
| 19:10.44 | Amarande | at least, high end rets |
| 19:11.29 | NightHawkTheSane | could you try and whine more? :P |
| 19:11.30 | Lyn | mikma, i just replaced the icons now... inside the folder, looks good so far lol |
| 19:11.42 | Amarande | By WAA, I mean total Win and Awesome. :) |
| 19:11.51 | Amarande | Night: actually, I'm sticking with prot more :) |
| 19:11.59 | mikma | lyn: data-replacing? |
| 19:12.25 | Lyn | yep inside the interface folder |
| 19:12.30 | seebs | Is prot fun for levelling now? I never tried it, I always went holy because I'm used to it. |
| 19:12.32 | Lyn | Interface\\PlayerFrame\\XXX |
| 19:12.36 | Amarande | seebs: prot is win and awesome |
| 19:12.39 | Amarande | just ... don't be ret |
| 19:12.43 | NightHawkTheSane | seebs: its been fun since 2.0 |
| 19:12.44 | *** join/#wowuidev Godzmack- (n=Godzmack@85-220-2-78.dsl.dynamic.simnet.is) |
| 19:12.51 | mikma | lyn: that's evil, eeeeeeevil! |
| 19:12.55 | NightHawkTheSane | Amarande: seriously, stop bitching. it's obnoxious |
| 19:13.05 | Lyn | no, it would be evil if i do it inside the Data folder @ mikma |
| 19:13.08 | seebs | Cool. |
| 19:13.12 | seebs | I may try it, I have a lowbiedin. |
| 19:13.20 | mikma | lyn: interface is as evil :O |
| 19:13.40 | Lyn | mikma, but on the other way i dont know how to do it.. :< |
| 19:13.45 | Lyn | < nub |
| 19:13.59 | Remaxer|PT | hmm...seems fubar_micromenuFu is not working with the latest patch |
| 19:14.33 | Amarande | seebs: just remember one thing about prot |
| 19:14.45 | Amarande | you aggro the ENTIRE FEL ORC CAMP |
| 19:14.51 | Amarande | if you don't, you aren't making the best use of prot |
| 19:15.34 | Amarande | seriously, prot pallies thrive on being ganged up on |
| 19:15.45 | NightHawkTheSane | well, there is an upper limit. |
| 19:16.11 | Amarande | well, yeah |
| 19:16.25 | Amarande | however, the normal solo strategy of trying to fight only one or two mobs at a time, is subpar for prot :) |
| 19:17.16 | seebs | Weird. How's that work? |
| 19:17.26 | seebs | It can't be rage generation. :) |
| 19:17.37 | seebs | Do you use ret aura or something? |
| 19:17.43 | Syzgyn | Yes |
| 19:17.46 | NightHawkTheSane | a lot of prot's damage is reflective (holy shield, ret aura, shield spikes) |
| 19:17.46 | Amarande | seebs: first of all, there's ret aura |
| 19:17.59 | seebs | Ahh. |
| 19:18.02 | Amarande | second of all, there is the fact that BoS will pretty much keep the blue flowing forever if you have lots of mobs on you |
| 19:18.05 | NightHawkTheSane | not to mention reactive damage procs (redoubt, reckoning) |
| 19:18.07 | Syzgyn | Gather a bunch of mobs, judge light, /afk |
| 19:18.13 | NightHawkTheSane | all of which scale up with the more things hitting you |
| 19:18.15 | Amarande | while if you're fighting 1 or 2 mobs at a time, you may start running low on mana |
| 19:18.41 | seebs | Man, I feel dumb. I got thrown off by the talents. I figured since devo was in prot, and improved ret was in ret, that prot pallies were supposed to use devotion (which is not my favorite aura...) |
| 19:18.44 | seebs | BoS? |
| 19:18.44 | NightHawkTheSane | and yes, boSanc scales with the number of mobs hitting as well. Hammer of the rightous is also most optimal with 3+ targets |
| 19:18.54 | NightHawkTheSane | Blessing of Sanctuary |
| 19:19.00 | *** join/#wowuidev Funkeh` (n=funk@WoWUIDev/WoWAce/Ace3/BigWigs/funkeh) |
| 19:19.18 | mikma | lyn: well, i can't help you with the tables anyway, needs to be someone much much better |
| 19:19.32 | Lyn | haha np :9 |
| 19:19.35 | Lyn | thanks anyway ;) |
| 19:19.37 | NightHawkTheSane | seebs: also, consecrate is most optimal the more mobs that are in it |
| 19:19.42 | Lyn | i think i'll leave it like that now |
| 19:19.48 | Amarande | dammit |
| 19:19.49 | Amarande | I got zombied |
| 19:19.55 | seebs | Consecrate was why I originally rolled holy, but that's changed. |
| 19:20.10 | Lyn | mikma, http://img1.abload.de/img/wowscrnshot_102508_211ibuy.jpg x] now it fits in my ui (on live) |
| 19:20.12 | seebs | Oohhhhhh. |
| 19:20.27 | seebs | Huh, wowhead hasn't got BoS, only GBoS. |
| 19:20.44 | seebs | What level do you get it at? |
| 19:20.51 | NightHawkTheSane | its a talent |
| 19:20.56 | mikma | lyn: much better imho |
| 19:20.58 | seebs | Ahh. Doh. |
| 19:21.29 | Lyn | mikma, yep.. just have to relocate it at the same place where my totem timer is normally (which looks the same) and then i'm happy :] |
| 19:21.38 | seebs | So before you get that (say, up through L29), is prot still better off grabbing a ton of targets? |
| 19:22.07 | NightHawkTheSane | Before level ~30-35, prot's not really amazingly good. you don't have a full range of skills yet |
| 19:22.19 | NightHawkTheSane | It's often better to spec ret until that point |
| 19:22.47 | NightHawkTheSane | argh, this SG:A is a fucking clip show, isn't it. |
| 19:23.26 | Amarande | btw |
| 19:23.33 | Amarande | why do zombies have a 'leave vehicle' button? |
| 19:23.44 | NightHawkTheSane | probably because they're implemented as vehicles. |
| 19:23.45 | *** join/#wowuidev Yssaril (n=Yssaril@adsl-99-139-120-222.dsl.emhril.sbcglobal.net) |
| 19:23.48 | NightHawkTheSane | have you tried clicking it? :P |
| 19:23.51 | Amarande | yeah |
| 19:23.53 | Amarande | it doesn't do anything |
| 19:24.00 | NightHawkTheSane | yeah, not surprising. |
| 19:24.26 | mikma | lyn: you must be playing beta atm :O |
| 19:24.47 | NightHawkTheSane | But yeah, they're just implemented as vehicles i imagine. Lets them set the speed properly, change your action bar, and model, etc. |
| 19:24.49 | Lyn | mikma, no, exited wow after i finished :) |
| 19:25.05 | mikma | bah, i was coming to whoop your ass with my mighty dk |
| 19:25.16 | Lyn | lol :P |
| 19:25.17 | Lyn | you cant! |
| 19:25.28 | mikma | well no, if you logged out |
| 19:25.30 | Amarande | gah |
| 19:25.38 | Lyn | mh.. whats the output of UnitClass for DK? DEATHKNIGHT ? |
| 19:25.49 | Amarande | lemme guess, my chance of leveling my existing characters up reasonably in this world event is about zero unless I go somewhere empty like Ysondre or Azshara |
| 19:26.00 | mikma | lyn: "Death Knight", "DEATHKNIGHT" |
| 19:26.11 | Lyn | okay thanks |
| 19:26.49 | NightHawkTheSane | (the first being localized, of course) |
| 19:26.59 | Amarande | I discovered Hellfire's not so bad after all when you're a prot pally. |
| 19:27.02 | Amarande | Then I ran into zombies. :) |
| 19:27.20 | NightHawkTheSane | honestly, most mid-range areas are probably untouched |
| 19:28.07 | Neuro_Medivh | NightHawkTheSane: Yes, SG:A was a shitty clip show this week |
| 19:29.37 | Syzgyn | Ok, so where the hell is this new boss in kara? |
| 19:30.21 | Amarande | hmm |
| 19:30.25 | Amarande | with the new below-70 experience changes |
| 19:30.39 | Amarande | is it even worth it to quest before 68-69 or so (on a prot pally in particular) or is it actually faster to just grind? |
| 19:31.37 | Lyn | meh, undead invasion is back :x |
| 19:31.38 | *** join/#wowuidev netcurse (n=hthieblo@adsl-99-173-10-198.dsl.pltn13.sbcglobal.net) |
| 19:31.58 | mikma | gah! |
| 19:32.10 | mikma | this debuff flashing while flying is annoying |
| 19:32.15 | Amarande | Neuro: eCastingBar has a slight bug |
| 19:32.38 | Amarande | gathering felweed - bar reads: "Herb Gathering (Apprentice)" |
| 19:33.14 | seebs | I've consistently found that questing is nearly always a lot faster. It gets me a lot more use out of my rest bonus. |
| 19:33.33 | seebs | With questing, a full rest bonus can usually get me two levels or possibly three. |
| 19:34.32 | mikma | WOO! i accidentally found Thor Modan :D |
| 19:35.23 | ScytheBlade1 | Anyone found the boss in Kara? |
| 19:35.29 | Duman | is he in this patch? |
| 19:35.37 | ScytheBlade1 | The just activated quest |
| 19:35.39 | mikma | ye, he's open now |
| 19:36.10 | ScytheBlade1 | Where? |
| 19:36.31 | mikma | where the spiders are, or above moroes (i think) |
| 19:36.39 | Duman | ahh |
| 19:36.39 | kd3 | in the kitchen? |
| 19:36.47 | Duman | upstairs there would make sense |
| 19:36.53 | mikma | there's a locked room above moroes |
| 19:37.04 | mikma | has been there quite long, but dunno what's inside |
| 19:37.32 | *** join/#wowuidev coren (n=chatzill@e180068063.adsl.alicedsl.de) |
| 19:39.02 | Neuro_Medivh | I found the boss, he killed me |
| 19:39.07 | Neuro_Medivh | it's above Attumen |
| 19:39.14 | mikma | lol |
| 19:39.15 | Neuro_Medivh | Blood Soaked Door |
| 19:39.26 | Lyn | lol |
| 19:42.06 | bleeter | kd3: oO those AD quests are allegedly appearing on Oceanic Live now |
| 19:42.12 | bleeter | kd3: I'm trying to get details |
| 19:42.21 | sb | there are also on EU |
| 19:42.30 | bleeter | ah, sweet |
| 19:42.44 | bleeter | this horde guy picked 3 quests up from UC |
| 19:44.17 | Amarande | ah, no wonder I just died |
| 19:44.20 | Amarande | there was an elite in that bunch :| |
| 19:45.36 | kd3 | bleeter; they're probably active worldwide at this point. the invasion's been up on my server for an hour at least |
| 19:46.25 | bleeter | kd3: we had a restart about 30 mins ago, I'm guessing to sync us up given we're a day ... no, scratch that, you're a day behind ;) :P |
| 19:47.19 | Amarande | ... So much for the cooking daily today I guess, too. :) |
| 19:48.09 | Amarande | heh, our shattrath is screwed |
| 19:48.18 | Amarande | everyone with a flying mount is desperately hanging out in the air where they can't be spat down on |
| 19:49.22 | Amarande | hmm ... trade chat is complaining that they're already bored of the event, too |
| 19:49.22 | seebs | Sounds to me like they picked Saturday for Big Event Day. |
| 19:49.45 | seebs | I would be SO into the scourge invasion thing. Sounds awesome. |
| 19:49.48 | bleeter | more like 'sunday a day for not doing anything except hotfix' ;) |
| 19:50.28 | *** join/#wowuidev Sangi_ (n=Sangi@adsl-074-180-078-094.sip.msy.bellsouth.net) |
| 19:50.34 | bleeter | BBBRRAINNNZZZ |
| 19:50.56 | seebs | Heh. |
| 19:51.17 | seebs | But yeah, I'm sorta guessing that the exciting drama part will be done tonight, when everyone's on, and tomorrow will be aftermath. |
| 19:51.29 | Amarande | so, is that it for the scourge invasion after tonight, then? |
| 19:51.34 | Amarande | or does the zombie thing keep going till the 13th |
| 19:51.36 | Remaxer|PT | finally my ui is ready |
| 19:51.37 | Remaxer|PT | lol |
| 19:51.38 | bleeter | nah, I suspect the really exciting bit will be the last two days before the XPAC |
| 19:51.44 | Remaxer|PT | well...im of making dinner |
| 19:51.46 | Remaxer|PT | cya later |
| 19:51.47 | *** part/#wowuidev Sangi_ (n=Sangi@adsl-074-180-078-094.sip.msy.bellsouth.net) |
| 19:51.50 | bleeter | I'm hoping for razed cities and mobs like Araj going nutzo |
| 19:52.01 | *** join/#wowuidev soufron (n=soufron@pool-96-246-108-59.nycmny.east.verizon.net) |
| 19:52.11 | seebs | They've said that the zombie PvP thing will be over soon enough to let people do Hallow's End stuff. |
| 19:52.33 | seebs | I think the phrase was "days, not weeks". |
| 19:52.48 | bleeter | yeah, at the moment being largely player driven, it's pretty 'random'. I could see they'd wanna slowly turn stuff over to scripted foo |
| 19:53.07 | seebs | I'm sort of expecting that we'll have razed cities by the end of the weekend so we can have a week or two of aftermath to explore before the xpac. |
| 19:53.18 | bleeter | that could be cool |
| 19:53.35 | Amarande | seebs: so any questing involving cities is then out of order? |
| 19:53.40 | Amarande | e.g., no more shattrath dailies till xpac? |
| 19:53.43 | seebs | Dunno. |
| 19:53.59 | seebs | My guess would be that all the city quests will still work, they'll just have "on-fire" terrain and the like. |
| 19:54.21 | seebs | What the CMs said was that this was a "short" event and "all your quests and activities will be waiting for you when it's over". |
| 19:54.28 | NightHawkTheSane | Amarande: with all your complaining have you considered doing something other than wow for the next month? ;) |
| 19:54.31 | Amarande | yeah, like for some reason the mages are still hanging out outside of dalaran completely oblivious to the missingness of the giant purple bubble :) |
| 19:54.35 | sb | where is that boss? |
| 19:56.23 | Amarande | Night: the main trouble is - I don't have any characters in the 30-50 or so range which seems least affected by all this |
| 19:56.34 | Amarande | I have characters who are still low enough level that they go through the cities and nearby areas often |
| 19:56.36 | seebs | I can't even log until it's over. |
| 19:56.48 | Amarande | or characters who are high enough level that they need to use Shatt regularly |
| 19:57.10 | Amarande | my current levels: 70, 62, 21, 15 on Quel'dorei |
| 19:57.18 | Amarande | and hellfire has zombies, too |
| 19:57.20 | NightHawkTheSane | shatt's still pretty unaffected |
| 19:57.27 | Amarande | Night: that's highly server dependent |
| 19:57.48 | Amarande | a lot of servers, people are practically -exploiting- Shattrath's sanctuary status to send zombies all over the place without anyone being able to do anything to stop it |
| 19:58.25 | Amarande | at the least, there is absolutely nothing one can do to stop an infected player from griefing the quest npcs and battlemasters |
| 19:58.37 | Amarande | because it's Sanctuary, so you can't attack them before they can infect the NPCs |
| 19:58.38 | seebs | My guess is that the PvE servers are the worst right now because the PvE players aren't used to how griefing plays out. :) |
| 19:59.03 | Amarande | seebs: also, a lot of us rolled on PvE servers simply -because- we wanted to avoid griefers |
| 19:59.42 | seebs | I rolled PvE because I am legally mentally disabled. :) |
| 19:59.49 | Amarande | the idea that a few angsty teenagers is pretty much all it takes on a PvP server to completely shut you down for the evening is enough to make a lot of folks roll PvE |
| 19:59.58 | NightHawkTheSane | seebs: honestly, most players i know are enjoying it |
| 20:00.08 | seebs | NH, I don't doubt that "most" players are enjoying it. |
| 20:00.21 | ScytheBlade1 | Prince Tenris Mirkblood down! |
| 20:00.24 | Syzgyn | Amarande: no, they cant shut you down for the evening, unless you keep trying to do whatever they're preventing you to. |
| 20:00.28 | NightHawkTheSane | seebs: Anyone who claims anything about "most" of the entire playerbase is absolutely wrong |
| 20:00.28 | Syzgyn | Go do something else :P |
| 20:00.29 | seebs | The problem is that, with every other event, the players who didn't enjoy it could, you know, ignore it. |
| 20:00.36 | NightHawkTheSane | i only said the players i know, th ough :P |
| 20:00.45 | seebs | I'd guess that most players enjoy it. |
| 20:00.56 | seebs | The thing is, with other stuff that most people enjoy and I don't, I just don't do it. |
| 20:01.16 | seebs | With this, I don't have the option of not doing it. So I'm waiting, and very curious as to when the PvP event will be over so I can play again. |
| 20:01.20 | NightHawkTheSane | HOnestly, the single best part about this event is it's unavoidable nature. |
| 20:01.37 | Amarande | I guess I'm just staying at max height above Shattrath till further notice |
| 20:01.41 | NightHawkTheSane | You could pretty much pretend like any other world event simply didn't exist |
| 20:01.41 | Amarande | netherdrake ftw |
| 20:01.49 | seebs | Right. |
| 20:01.59 | *** join/#wowuidev Shadowed (n=outlaw@12.157.177.162) |
| 20:02.05 | lonk | it really is a brillant evetn. Players running the npc zpmbie horde. love it |
| 20:02.08 | Amarande | hmm |
| 20:02.08 | seebs | And the thing is... If there's some reason for which a given event or activity is absolutely incapable of being fun for a given player, letting them not do it is good game design. |
| 20:02.13 | Amarande | you know, maybe I should do netherwing dailies :) |
| 20:02.14 | NightHawkTheSane | while i'm no RPer, I love the immersion of it. |
| 20:02.20 | Amarande | after all, there is no way for zombies to get over there |
| 20:02.27 | NightHawkTheSane | seebs: see, there i disagree |
| 20:02.29 | Amarande | except on the off chance of an infected player making it that far in time |
| 20:02.47 | NightHawkTheSane | the world IS. It does not, and should not, change itself for the whims of an individual. |
| 20:02.57 | seebs | That's good simulationism, but bad game design. |
| 20:03.09 | Amarande | Night: the PvE/PvP distinction, I think, is an issue here |
| 20:03.17 | Thrae | seebs: *reasonably*, then burst into argument of what is reasonable. |
| 20:03.18 | NightHawkTheSane | i dont think its bad game design at all |
| 20:03.18 | bleeter | course, the old scourge invasion, people bitched endlessly that they couldn't be a zombie |
| 20:03.21 | *** join/#wowuidev vince` (i=vschiu@adsl-75-52-240-200.dsl.pltn13.sbcglobal.net) |
| 20:03.24 | Amarande | it comes down to this: |
| 20:03.30 | bleeter | so they enable folks to be zombies, and people bitch about players being zombies |
| 20:03.32 | bleeter | blizz can't win >< |
| 20:03.37 | seebs | Blizz could win easily. |
| 20:03.44 | NightHawkTheSane | bleeter: people will always bitch, the problem is people are idiots |
| 20:03.46 | Amarande | Blizzard -designed-, as -the way the game was supposed to work-, that you could decide whether you wanted to play on a server where PvP did or did not require consent |
| 20:04.14 | bleeter | maybe the idea of people on PvE realms totally avoiding the event was abhorrent to the event designers /shrug |
| 20:04.18 | seebs | Yeah. |
| 20:04.35 | Amarande | people basically expect that on a PvE server, you don't have to PvP unless you want to |
| 20:04.36 | seebs | I think they didn't realize that there were players who didn't just "not prefer" PvP. |
| 20:04.40 | NightHawkTheSane | bleeter: like i said, the unavoidability of it is what makes it great |
| 20:05.00 | Amarande | when you make an event that allows people to be dragged into PvP on a PvE server without their wishing to, then you have fail |
| 20:05.11 | seebs | Okay, NightHawk, is there anything in life that you really HATE? Anything that freaks you out? Makes your heart pound? Triggers your fight-or-flight reflex? |
| 20:05.20 | seebs | Maybe just utterly disgusts you? |
| 20:05.22 | NightHawkTheSane | seebs: actually, yes. WOrld pvp. |
| 20:05.39 | seebs | So if something you absolutely hated were totally unavoidable, would that be fun? I wouldn't think so. |
| 20:05.43 | mikma | woooooooooo |
| 20:05.44 | NightHawkTheSane | seebs: i loath, with a firey passion that rivals a thousand suns, the mouth breathing asshats who think world pvp is somehow fun. |
| 20:05.48 | mikma | new minipet!! |
| 20:05.48 | Amarande | Night: well, that's exactly what this event does |
| 20:05.51 | NightHawkTheSane | seebs: and yet, i love this event |
| 20:06.01 | seebs | It may vary. |
| 20:06.05 | Amarande | it allows said mouth breathing asshats to force world pvp on people who rolled on a pve server simply because they -did not want- world pvp |
| 20:06.17 | seebs | For me, PvP in and of itself is absolutely horrible. I can't stand it. |
| 20:06.26 | Amarande | it reminds me of the days of Diablo II, almost |
| 20:06.29 | seebs | So I can't log in until they make it so that no player can attack me unless I flag. |
| 20:06.34 | mikma | Arcanite Ripper and Vampiric Batling!! |
| 20:06.43 | NightHawkTheSane | Amarande: except this is temporary, interesting, and actually attempts to tell a story and set the stage for something bigger |
| 20:06.51 | NightHawkTheSane | it's not just some fucktard ganking you in STV for the fifth time |
| 20:07.04 | NightHawkTheSane | There's an actual higher purpose here |
| 20:07.05 | seebs | It may be temporary and interesting, but it's temporary, interesting, and absolutely totally unenjoyable for me. |
| 20:07.10 | mikma | hehe |
| 20:07.12 | mikma | nice little bat |
| 20:07.21 | Amarande | Night: however, it's not the players being able to force zombie on players issue that bugs people the most |
| 20:07.21 | seebs | If I don't want to have sex with someone, that it would be "temporary" and "for a higher purpose" does not suddenly make it fun. |
| 20:07.38 | bleeter | seebs: if it were totally npc zombies owning towns, you'd still have an 'issue' with dead npcs, etc. |
| 20:07.42 | Amarande | the biggest issue seems to be Shattrath being zombied into uselessness on many servers |
| 20:07.59 | Amarande | combined with the fact that Shattrath CANNOT BE DEFENDED |
| 20:08.08 | Amarande | cities in Azeroth, you have the option to defend it from the scourge invasion |
| 20:08.11 | bleeter | well a'dal's a moron |
| 20:08.12 | mikma | DROPS FROM THE NEW BOSS IN KARA! http://wow.reaktio.net/WoWScrnShot_102508_230627.jpg and http://wow.reaktio.net/WoWScrnShot_102508_230634.jpg |
| 20:08.14 | ccox|sleep | "Download percentage completed: nan %" |
| 20:08.14 | seebs | For many people, the issue with dead NPCs is a big deal. For me, it's not. So for me personally, if I could stay unflagged and just kill NPC zombies, I'd be having a blast. |
| 20:08.28 | Amarande | but because Shattrath is marked Sanctuary, you have no choice but to let people infect whoever |
| 20:08.49 | NightHawkTheSane | seebs: its still surprisingly easy to avoid zombies altogether, at least on whisperwind |
| 20:08.54 | bleeter | but that's 'coz a'dal's a moron and won't let us defend properly ;) |
| 20:09.00 | Amarande | heh |
| 20:09.02 | seebs | Again, that might work for some people. It doesn't for me. |
| 20:09.02 | Amarande | can A'dal be zombied? |
| 20:09.10 | NightHawkTheSane | Amarande: I'll admit, that's one minor quirck that kinda sucks. But i think writing off the whole event because of it is idiotic. |
| 20:09.20 | bleeter | Amarande: afaik, nah |
| 20:09.21 | *** join/#wowuidev Gryphen (n=gryphon@c-76-22-0-105.hsd1.wa.comcast.net) |
| 20:09.25 | NightHawkTheSane | shattrath is a hub, but it's not like you can't avoid it |
| 20:09.49 | Amarande | Night: it makes it extremely difficult to do anything productive on a 70 except for dungeons and raids, though |
| 20:10.07 | Amarande | you can't rely on Shattrath because the quest NPCs get zombied |
| 20:10.16 | bleeter | .. the freaking scourge are invading, and you expect EZ mode to continue?? |
| 20:10.17 | Amarande | you can't rely on IQD because the sheer number of humanoids there means, yeah, you're gonna get zombied |
| 20:10.17 | NightHawkTheSane | *shrug* honestly, I've been extremely productive on all my 70s |
| 20:10.24 | NightHawkTheSane | without spending much time in shattrath at all |
| 20:10.27 | seebs | It's nothing to do with "EZ mode". |
| 20:10.36 | seebs | If there were swarms of elite 70 NPC zombies attacking, I'd be having a blast. |
| 20:10.43 | Amarande | bleeter: I expect to be able to play the game with my high levels as something other than a giant battleground that gives no honor |
| 20:11.18 | NightHawkTheSane | actualy, you do get honor from killing players as a zombie ;) |
| 20:11.40 | Amarande | since I have yet to succeed in gathering or finding a suitable raiding group for my schedule, and 5-mans have been more or less dead since 2.4, that means about all I can do on my 70's is BGs or dailies |
| 20:11.54 | Amarande | er wait, I can't do BGs, because apparently people most <3 zombie-ing battlemasters |
| 20:12.11 | Amarande | and yeah, Night, you're gonna send Apathy Ursine at me, I can tell. :) |
| 20:12.21 | bleeter | sounds to me you're fishing for excuses for your own inabilities |
| 20:12.33 | kd3 | 5 capital cities... they can't all be zombified |
| 20:12.40 | NightHawkTheSane | like i said, since you complain so damn much, you should consider not playing for a while. this isn't even concern trolling, just a piece of honest advice. |
| 20:12.44 | seebs | I don't need an excuse. I'm disabled. I have problems. |
| 20:12.49 | NightHawkTheSane | if you're not having fun, either find a way to have fun, or stop doing it. |
| 20:12.55 | seebs | NightHawk, did you miss the part where I said I wasn't playing for a while? |
| 20:13.03 | seebs | All I'm wondering is when I can play again. |
| 20:13.09 | Amarande | Night: actually that's another legitimate reason to complain about the world event |
| 20:13.18 | Amarande | when people decide they need to mostly stop playing till xpac because of the world event ... |
| 20:13.20 | NightHawkTheSane | hardly |
| 20:13.32 | Amarande | and apparently, that number of people is growing |
| 20:13.34 | NightHawkTheSane | your inability to find fun in the event is really not blizzards problem |
| 20:13.36 | seebs | It's probably not until xpac, but you never know. The CMs said we could finish Hallow's End quests after it's over. |
| 20:13.42 | Amarande | I think they started the world event too soon :) |
| 20:13.42 | seebs | NightHawk, I'd have to disagree with that. |
| 20:14.11 | seebs | If a few percent of their players find the event totally unfun for reasons that are completely obvious and which Blizzard new about, it seems to me to be bad planning that they didn't make some plan to deal with that. |
| 20:14.21 | Amarande | Trade chat is becoming increasingly bored with it already, and there's still almost three weeks till expansion |
| 20:14.28 | *** join/#wowuidev Random (n=Denial@unaffiliated/windaria) |
| 20:14.38 | seebs | They have made it, I think, pretty clear that they were totally blindsided by the existence of players for whom it's a serious problem rather than a minor inconvenience. |
| 20:14.45 | NightHawkTheSane | seebs: nah, the thing is you CANNOT please all the people all the time. |
| 20:14.46 | bleeter | lol as if /trade has ever been a good guage of any opinions |
| 20:15.02 | NightHawkTheSane | there are ALWAYS going to be a percentage of your player base that is unhappy with your decisions |
| 20:15.02 | seebs | Once again, I'm not expecting them to *please* all people all the time. |
| 20:15.23 | Amarande | also, the fact that shattrath is developing an increasing number of people who are just hovering on their flying mounts in order to stay out of range of zombie spit is telling |
| 20:15.37 | NightHawkTheSane | what, common sense? :P |
| 20:15.43 | bleeter | it's telling that players have learned how to avoid stuff |
| 20:15.51 | bleeter | just like they learn how to avoid stuff at level 1 |
| 20:15.51 | Lyn | sb, what dropped from the boss for you? |
| 20:16.01 | NightHawkTheSane | bleeter: yeah, i would hav put that beyond most people. they normally can't stay out of fire on archi ;) |
| 20:16.08 | seebs | I'm just expecting them to limit the un-pleased to "something's not fun so I avoid it", rather than "something's so categorically unfun and unavoidable that I don't want to log in for a week". |
| 20:16.14 | Amarande | Night: you mean they get to archi? |
| 20:16.26 | Amarande | don't those kind of scrubs usually never complete kara because they stand in the black dots against netherspite? :) |
| 20:16.45 | NightHawkTheSane | *shrug* either or. :P it was just one example |
| 20:17.29 | seebs | Anyway, it sounds like it'll be "over" soon (and back to merely normal end-of-world events, with lots of lore, which sounds really fun...) |
| 20:17.55 | NightHawkTheSane | Amarande: also, you're more or less wrong in assuming that this will necessarily continue in the same vein for 3 weeks |
| 20:18.03 | NightHawkTheSane | they've already proven the event CAN and WILL change over time. |
| 20:18.17 | seebs | Oh, yes. |
| 20:18.25 | NightHawkTheSane | so at this point, any assumptions about where it will go and how long it will last are pretty much baseless speculation |
| 20:18.39 | seebs | I think a lot of the problem comes from everyone asserting that "the event" goes all the way to LK, thus, "forced world PvP with no opt-out" continues until LK. |
| 20:18.47 | NightHawkTheSane | exactly |
| 20:19.04 | seebs | For the first day, the CMs all hinted that "the event" lasted until LK. |
| 20:19.09 | seebs | Then they got buried in complaints and forum drama. |
| 20:19.15 | Amarande | well, I suppose you could play on fun servers like ... azshara heh |
| 20:19.32 | seebs | So after about a day, they started hinting that after the zombie plague is over, you'd be able to finish your Hallow's End quests, so people would stop complaining about that. |
| 20:19.34 | NightHawkTheSane | hell, when the event first started people were complaining that it was too avoidable/containable |
| 20:19.57 | Amarande | Nobody plays on Azshara, so you don't have to worry about zombies probably :) |
| 20:20.09 | NightHawkTheSane | seebs: i've still yet to see any effect on my hallow's end stuff * shrug* |
| 20:20.29 | bleeter | I said it earlier, not sure if in here, but it'd lkinda make sense if the event starts off 'random' (being player driver) and slowly gets turned over to scripts and quests the close we get to the Lich King's arrival |
| 20:20.30 | seebs | NH, once again: There's a non-empty set of players for whom this is too stressful/unfun for them to play AT ALL until it is over. |
| 20:20.52 | bleeter | NightHawkTheSane: it's folks infecting the candy bukkit!! |
| 20:20.54 | seebs | I'm not going to be able to log in until I can trust my PvE rules again. |
| 20:21.12 | NightHawkTheSane | seebs: yeah, but that's not affecting the hallows end event at all |
| 20:21.14 | seebs | Once that's done, I'm not worried about zombie invasions, I'll happily swap between a 70 and a 15 killing NPC zombies and then logging in to do quests. |
| 20:21.38 | bleeter | seebs: 2 things. 'Gameplay may change due to online experience' and Blizz never fully release all patch notes, so you do not ever have a guarantee on the PvE thing anyways ;) |
| 20:21.40 | seebs | Er, how is it not affecting Hallow's End? Right now, I can't log in (because of my admitted disorder), so I can't do any Hallow's End quests. Because I can't log in to do them. |
| 20:21.58 | NightHawkTheSane | thats not a problem with the events. :P |
| 20:22.03 | seebs | They've actually been 100% consistent on PvE all along, and it's an advertised feature. They have said that it will go back to normal. |
| 20:22.15 | Amarande | Some servers probably have problems doing the fire daily |
| 20:22.37 | seebs | It's a problem which is inextricably linked to the event, and affecting a noticeable number of people. Keep in mind, if it's only 1% of the WoW population, that's over 100,000 people... |
| 20:22.48 | Amarande | Brill and (what's the other one besides Falconwing ... Razor Hill?) are in rather heavily trafficked areas |
| 20:22.59 | bleeter | seebs: and 9,999,000 who aren't effected |
| 20:23.03 | NightHawkTheSane | seebs: and, yet, if it's only 1% of the population, that's.. how many million who are perfectly happy? :P |
| 20:23.05 | bleeter | er |
| 20:23.07 | seebs | Yeah. |
| 20:23.08 | bleeter | 9,900,000 |
| 20:23.11 | Amarande | I'm lucky my low level is a belf, I hate to think about what it's like for low level orcs |
| 20:23.27 | Amarande | since I was by Razor Hill on the way to Barrens last night and yeah ... zombies |
| 20:23.31 | NightHawkTheSane | no offense, i'd call anything under 10% statistically insignificant :p |
| 20:23.35 | seebs | But as one of the ones affected, I *am* affected. I'm not saying Blizzard is totally wrong to do the event. |
| 20:23.51 | seebs | And if they gave account credit to everyone who was badly affected, I probably wouldn't care much either way. |
| 20:24.10 | NightHawkTheSane | nah, they wont give account credit |
| 20:24.15 | NightHawkTheSane | for good reasons too |
| 20:24.16 | seebs | I am not expecting them to completely alter all world events to make me enjoy them. I am pretty disappointed that they didn't make it possible for me to either enjoy them or opt out. |
| 20:24.25 | seebs | Well, when I called, they said they would. |
| 20:24.25 | bleeter | lol if they won't give account credit to oceanic players who had 6 months of outages... |
| 20:24.33 | bleeter | what?! |
| 20:24.42 | seebs | Keep in mind, I'm not just randomly whining. I'm legally disabled, with paperwork and everything. |
| 20:24.44 | Amarande | bleeter: technical matters are specifically stated in the user agreement as not grounds for account credit |
| 20:25.06 | bleeter | Amarande: gameplay may change is also part of the agreement |
| 20:25.08 | seebs | So there's a definite reputation hit for screwing with me and not giving me credit. |
| 20:25.31 | seebs | Anyway, no skin off their nose, even if they just gave me a month per account, it costs 'em $26. |
| 20:26.20 | seebs | And honestly, if it ends up just being this weekend, I won't even care either way. I only called them because at the time the CMs were hinting that it'd be all PvP all the time for three weeks. |
| 20:28.21 | bleeter | oh well, I guess they could try hotfixing/patching a lot of this on Tuesday |
| 20:28.33 | bleeter | then just let loose squads of zombies to flatten towns and stuff instead |
| 20:28.51 | bleeter | one can then moan about not being able to do stuff, without blaming it on other players |
| 20:28.54 | seebs | From what the CMs have said, I think they're going to try to do the Big Event on the weekend so more players can participate in the actual excitement. |
| 20:29.03 | bleeter | Lich King gets his distruption, players get their PvE, everyone's happy |
| 20:29.13 | seebs | Well, some of 'em won't be. |
| 20:29.27 | seebs | But if it were NPC zombie swarms, I could go protect the lowbies for a while and it'd be a great RP event. :) |
| 20:29.50 | bleeter | there already are lowbie zombie swarms outside towns >< |
| 20:29.59 | seebs | Woot, someone on forums seems to have figured out how to trigger the invasion events. |
| 20:29.59 | NightHawkTheSane | there were a surprising amount of 70s protecting lowbies at goldshire last night |
| 20:30.36 | *** join/#wowuidev Soulsbane (n=Soulsban@dial-69-55-144-239.sofnet.net) |
| 20:33.07 | Remaxer|PT | link seebs plz^ |
| 20:34.02 | seebs | Oh, dammit. I think they're deleting the threads revealing the quest. |
| 20:34.41 | seebs | I think it was a shade of Kael'thas on the Isle of Quel'Danis or something, you go there as a zombie and get a quest, you die, and when enough people have done it the next phase happens. |
| 20:35.02 | Matrix110| | hmmm |
| 20:35.15 | Matrix110| | Dongle and DongleStub seem to have problems with each other |
| 20:35.26 | seebs | Ahh, here we go. |
| 20:35.27 | seebs | http://forums.worldofwarcraft.com/thread.html?topicId=11829535727&sid=1 |
| 20:35.53 | seebs | There are a lot of threads going missing, though, presumably for spoilers. |
| 20:36.25 | bleeter | seebs: check the last post of that thread 'Nothing there' |
| 20:36.29 | seebs | Ahh, drat. |
| 20:36.45 | bleeter | suspect a fair bit of disinformation getting around ;) |
| 20:36.46 | Matrix110| | TomTom alone(DongleStub) works Auditor2 alone(Dongle1.1) works both together=TomTom errors about missing Astrolabe |
| 20:36.47 | seebs | Of course, could just be that on that server, someone finished it. Or that there's something else which has to happen first. |
| 20:40.33 | Remaxer|PT | damm |
| 20:40.39 | Remaxer|PT | aUF_Layouts aint working |
| 20:40.51 | Remaxer|PT | and i can't join the ace channel |
| 20:41.12 | NightHawkTheSane | holy crap |
| 20:41.20 | NightHawkTheSane | infected debuff time down to 2m |
| 20:41.26 | Remaxer|PT | yep |
| 20:41.31 | Remaxer|PT | phase 4 ^^ |
| 20:41.42 | NightHawkTheSane | awesome |
| 20:42.59 | Amarande | Night: yeah, that's what's making some people worried, too |
| 20:43.11 | Amarande | that soon enough the debuff phase will go away entirely and you'll go straight to zombiehood |
| 20:43.34 | NightHawkTheSane | oh, if only |
| 20:44.10 | seebs | If they're accelerating, it'll be tonight or so, and they'll raze cities and all. Otherwise, that'll presumably be tomorrow. |
| 20:44.31 | seebs | I'm not sure which night has better server population. |
| 20:45.04 | bleeter | this is interesting, an invasion necropolis outside of UC, but it's not showing on the world map as an invasion point |
| 20:45.17 | seebs | Why would it be? I'm expecting it's the Apothecaries. |
| 20:45.17 | bleeter | wonder if they're permanent features outside capitals |
| 20:45.30 | seebs | Which makes me wonder -- will the Apothecary Society quests still exist in WotLK? |
| 20:45.34 | NightHawkTheSane | bleeter: i believe so |
| 20:45.43 | NightHawkTheSane | seebs: yes |
| 20:45.56 | Arrowmaster | bleeter: those where there during the naxx opening |
| 20:46.16 | Matrix110| | Remaxer|PT thats because ag_unitframes is a complete rewrite based on Ace3 instead of Ace2 and aUF_Layouts is made for the Ace2 version of ag_unitframes |
| 20:46.20 | Amarande | hmm |
| 20:46.22 | seebs | I wonder how. |
| 20:46.29 | Amarande | what's the safe place to be during the invasion proper? |
| 20:46.31 | seebs | And what about quests handed in to NPCs that no longer exist? |
| 20:46.37 | Amarande | "on a flying mount" I'm assuming? :) |
| 20:46.45 | seebs | The safe place to be during the invasion proper is the forums. :) |
| 20:47.22 | Remaxer|PT | so my best hope is to wait for a update i guss |
| 20:47.34 | bleeter | oO there's this weird eye of naxx like mob following a player around the summoning circle |
| 20:47.42 | bleeter | can't target it at all, doesn't seem to be doing much either :/ |
| 20:47.49 | bleeter | very very very hard to see |
| 20:48.07 | seebs | Huh, that thread I linked to sort of suggested something like that. |
| 20:48.09 | seebs | Could be cool. |
| 20:48.20 | seebs | Maybe the zombie armies will spawn from the summoning circles. :) |
| 20:49.20 | seebs | I've probably asked this before. Is there a trivial way to get a list of the emotes the game provides? |
| 20:49.21 | bleeter | seebs: they are |
| 20:49.27 | seebs | Cool. |
| 20:49.30 | bleeter | just here outside UC, the zombies are lvl 10's hehe |
| 20:49.39 | seebs | This sounds like a seriously neat event. |
| 20:49.44 | bleeter | looks like this part is the same as the last invasion, or substantially similar |
| 20:50.11 | seebs | Meh. Who would have thought a disability would have a downside. :) |
| 20:51.03 | Iriel | seebs I think they're all in a table in the chat frame code |
| 20:51.09 | seebs | Oh, that'd make sense. |
| 20:51.20 | NightHawkTheSane | ^^ |
| 20:51.23 | NightHawkTheSane | ChatFrame.lua i think |
| 20:51.27 | bleeter | oO Iriel |
| 20:51.29 | seebs | It just seems like there ought to be, you know, a "/listemotes" or something. |
| 20:51.40 | seebs | BTW, Iriel, I have a small complaint about DevTools. |
| 20:51.40 | Iriel | seebs: Look for EMOTE<x>_TOKEN |
| 20:51.54 | bleeter | i wanted to show you some tilt-shift videography the other day.. lemme grab the URL, was rather good stuff thought you'd be interestedf |
| 20:51.57 | Iriel | "complaint" or "suggestion for improvement" |
| 20:52.00 | seebs | It seems to me that you have not yet taken Blizzard devs' family members hostage until they agree to make them part of the base client. |
| 20:52.06 | seebs | I guess it's more of an RFE, really. |
| 20:52.13 | Iriel | seebs I persuaded them to add print(...) |
| 20:52.15 | seebs | Because these absolutely should have been there all along. |
| 20:52.15 | Iriel | it's a start 8-) |
| 20:52.31 | seebs | In particular, /dtframestack has been an absolute lifesaver while debugging crazy addon interactions. |
| 20:52.45 | seebs | In retrospect, my decision to try to learn to develop addons without grabbing devtools was probably dumb. |
| 20:53.32 | Tem | okay, I _love_ the zombie mechanics now |
| 20:53.44 | Tem | I have created a zombie army in tinkertown |
| 20:53.59 | Amarande | hmm |
| 20:54.08 | Amarande | apparently iceblock doesn't remove zombie disease - bug or WAI? |
| 20:54.10 | Tem | I have enough minions to turn anything basiclly instantly |
| 20:54.17 | Tem | iceblock makes you turn faster |
| 20:54.21 | bleeter | Tem: I found it interesting how to take plan an attack to take over a town |
| 20:54.23 | Tem | which is awesome |
| 20:54.36 | Amarande | I'm assuming pally bubble has the same effect? |
| 20:54.40 | Tem | aye |
| 20:54.42 | kd3 | ama; wai. pally bubble does the same thing |
| 20:54.45 | NightHawkTheSane | Amarande: any immunity will instantly zombify you |
| 20:54.48 | bleeter | and then do it, kind of like planning to solo an instance or world boss |
| 20:55.05 | NightHawkTheSane | or, actually, more specifically: Ice block & Bubble -do- remove the disease |
| 20:55.06 | Amarande | and it seems to take 3 or 4 castings of cure disease to get it off you, too |
| 20:55.15 | kd3 | been that way since phase 2 |
| 20:55.18 | NightHawkTheSane | but there's a trigger on the disease such that if it fades you turn into a zombie |
| 20:55.26 | NightHawkTheSane | (unless dispelled, i guess) |
| 20:56.08 | kd3 | gah! 729/730 kalimdor quests |
| 20:56.10 | bleeter | Iriel: http://www.vimeo.com/keithloutit |
| 20:56.14 | kd3 | need to find one more... >.> |
| 20:56.20 | bleeter | kd3: MOAR! /spank |
| 20:56.31 | NightHawkTheSane | kd3: you have wya too much free time on your hands ;) |
| 20:57.01 | Iriel | bleeter: those are pretty cool |
| 20:57.16 | kd3 | nhts; 2635 points and counting... |
| 20:57.26 | NightHawkTheSane | kd3: WAAAAY too much free tie |
| 20:57.28 | NightHawkTheSane | time |
| 20:58.00 | kd3 | the bad thing is... I've got a quest completed, but it requires a turn-in in booty bay... which isn't exactly friendly to me atm |
| 20:58.06 | bleeter | hmm, are the necrotic rune drops only from mobs of similar level? |
| 20:58.20 | bleeter | kd3: haha, that sounds like half the wow population at the moment |
| 20:58.32 | bleeter | every man + dog is unfriendly to goblins atm |
| 20:58.53 | NightHawkTheSane | i recall necrotic runes being a fairly rare drop |
| 20:59.16 | Amarande | yeah, BB is a bloody abattoir right now pretty much |
| 20:59.20 | Amarande | between the zombies and the pirates :) |
| 21:00.14 | kd3 | hahaha... haven't seen EPL this busy in years |
| 21:00.20 | bleeter | i love the lack of static-ness atm |
| 21:00.45 | NightHawkTheSane | kd3: not since the last invasion? ;) |
| 21:00.57 | Corrodias | as much as it sounds like a pain in the ass... this invasion thing sounds like it's actually fun |
| 21:00.59 | kd3 | since 2.0ish hit |
| 21:01.01 | Corrodias | giving WoW something DIFFERENT to do |
| 21:01.18 | NightHawkTheSane | its fun as hell |
| 21:02.08 | Amarande | this invasion thing makes me think it might be a good idea to start that rogue |
| 21:02.27 | NightHawkTheSane | nah, you'll just be annoyed at someone taking over goldshire |
| 21:02.36 | Amarande | why would I care about goldshire |
| 21:02.41 | Amarande | I play horde :| |
| 21:02.56 | Remaxer|PT | Question: Do custom unit frames (ag_unitframe/pitbull...etc) disable the target change sound? |
| 21:03.02 | NightHawkTheSane | then, <insert equivalent horde town here> |
| 21:03.23 | Amarande | Night: whatever that village in eversong is |
| 21:03.32 | Amarande | I -almost- had the irritating experience of that village being taken over |
| 21:03.42 | NightHawkTheSane | Amarande: you mean the one i just took over all by myself? :D |
| 21:03.51 | Amarande | but when it happened the other night, I was busy fighting amani trolls and the zombie players quit by the time I got back to turn stuff in |
| 21:04.10 | bleeter | NightHawkTheSane: don't forget to break up the party down the road ;) |
| 21:04.39 | NightHawkTheSane | woah.. 63 elite skellies running loose in UC, "Flameshockers" wtf? |
| 21:04.44 | seebs | Remaxer: I don't know. What's a target change sound? |
| 21:04.55 | seebs | NightHawk: It's just the Naxx invasion buffed by apparently about 8 levels. |
| 21:05.06 | Mike-N-Go | I have an interesting problem. After I reload my UI, not through logging out or quitting WOW, my FPS in WOW drops to next to nothing and my computer and WoW hangs. |
| 21:05.08 | seebs | My mid-30s gnome actually managed to damage one once! |
| 21:05.09 | NightHawkTheSane | i dont remember them being inside the city, but that WAS a while ago |
| 21:05.16 | kd3 | they were |
| 21:05.20 | Mike-N-Go | After I reload my UI a few times, that is. |
| 21:05.20 | seebs | MNG: Does it happen if you have all your addons off? |
| 21:05.26 | Amarande | Poor little goblins |
| 21:05.30 | seebs | I actually managed to kill my UI completely by writing bad Lua once. :) |
| 21:05.43 | Mike-N-Go | I am thinking it has something to do with an addon. |
| 21:05.56 | Amarande | so the big invasion thing's tonight then? |
| 21:06.22 | Mike-N-Go | seebs: Yah, I did that once, too; a script I wrote locked up my computer on logging. |
| 21:06.28 | seebs | Dunno, but I'm guessing tonightish. |
| 21:06.36 | seebs | I don't know. Is population higher Saturday or Sunday? |
| 21:06.38 | Amarande | I just figure starting the rogue might be a good idea because rogues have the best chance of avoiding the most of the zombie stuff |
| 21:06.45 | Mike-N-Go | One thing it was because of a stack overflow. |
| 21:06.48 | seebs | I'd guess they'll pick the busiest night. |
| 21:08.53 | *** join/#wowuidev vithos (n=vithos@unaffiliated/vithos) |
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| 21:10.53 | *** mode/#WoWUIDev [+o Seerah] by ChanServ |
| 21:11.52 | Amarande | hmm |
| 21:12.02 | Amarande | I'm going to take a wild guess and assume that opening a Conspicuous Crate is a bad idea |
| 21:12.25 | Amarande | seebs: how did you break your ui? |
| 21:12.27 | Iriel | that depends on how much you like braaaains |
| 21:12.42 | NightHawkTheSane | Amarande: i dunno, it IS pretty conspicuous, i suggest you try and see |
| 21:13.00 | NightHawkTheSane | also, wow that infection is real resistent to dispel |
| 21:14.36 | *** join/#wowuidev grzesieq (n=grzesieq@3905ds1-brh.0.fullrate.dk) |
| 21:14.53 | Fisker- | any tacs on tenris? |
| 21:15.28 | kd3 | he's a kara boss... tactics? |
| 21:15.49 | Lyn | kd3, get away from the orbs |
| 21:15.53 | Lyn | that he spawns |
| 21:16.23 | Amarande | yeah, I've dispelled it on myself and one other person, it usually takes 3-4 casts |
| 21:16.34 | Amarande | also, why is it that when I cast cure disease on an infected player, it puts me in combat? |
| 21:16.50 | ScytheBlade1 | kd3: watch for the orbs, and watch for the spirit link. Killing healers by DPSing the boss is bad. |
| 21:16.54 | ScytheBlade1 | err |
| 21:16.55 | ScytheBlade1 | Fisker-: ^ |
| 21:19.23 | seebs | Amarande, I assume it's because they're in combat and thus buffing them adds you to the combat. |
| 21:19.52 | seebs | Huh, forum sentiment is going rapidly south. |
| 21:19.55 | Fisker- | the red stuff he channels to another play = spirit link? |
| 21:20.02 | ScytheBlade1 | yes |
| 21:20.05 | ScytheBlade1 | You hit the boss |
| 21:20.09 | ScytheBlade1 | It hurts the boss AND the player |
| 21:22.08 | ccox | API question - I need to find out if an item has charges used (and thus might sell to vendor for a lesser price than normal) |
| 21:23.09 | Iriel | tooltip? |
| 21:24.34 | ccox | I was hoping to avoid parsing the tooltip, but that is one way I could do it (but localization will be a mess) |
| 21:24.37 | mikma | Update 22:15 CEST - You can actually play guitar with your Arcanite Ripper ! |
| 21:24.38 | mikma | HAHA |
| 21:24.42 | mikma | http://www.mmo-champion.com/ |
| 21:24.43 | sb | yup |
| 21:24.44 | mikma | see the video |
| 21:25.01 | sb | i dont need video, i can see it live here :p |
| 21:25.10 | mikma | how do you actually use it ? |
| 21:25.17 | sb | just click |
| 21:25.20 | sb | rightclick |
| 21:25.23 | Iriel | ccox: the template patterns are all in GlobalStrings.lua |
| 21:25.29 | mikma | ooh, hidden use :D |
| 21:28.48 | *** join/#wowuidev Adys (n=Adys@unaffiliated/adys) |
| 21:30.19 | NightHawkTheSane | ooh, finally got a squashling on ONE character. |
| 21:30.33 | mikma | The infection now lasts 2 minutes instead of 5 |
| 21:31.01 | NightHawkTheSane | and is freaking hard to dispel |
| 21:31.06 | mikma | lol ya |
| 21:31.07 | *** join/#wowuidev CrazyMYKL (n=rumors@149.152.112.26) |
| 21:31.10 | mikma | resist resist resist resist |
| 21:31.30 | NightHawkTheSane | i empted half of my (admittedly small) mana bar into one person :p |
| 21:31.32 | Amarande | yeah, thank the gods cure disease is spammable |
| 21:32.36 | mikma | it should be like "dispel resist, ZOMBIETIME!" |
| 21:32.45 | ScytheBlade1 | I sincerly hope it gets to the point that trying to cure it is pointless |
| 21:32.51 | ScytheBlade1 | Not because I want that much grifeing |
| 21:32.57 | ScytheBlade1 | But because I want to laugh at the paladins and shaman :P |
| 21:32.59 | NightHawkTheSane | ScytheBlade1: it would almsot make sense lore wise |
| 21:33.11 | ScytheBlade1 | NightHawkTheSane: it would, and we have hints that it WILL get that bad |
| 21:33.12 | ScytheBlade1 | =] |
| 21:33.17 | NightHawkTheSane | as a CM put it, you think it woudl have happened the way it did if they could go around spamming clense? |
| 21:33.26 | mikma | don't forget priests |
| 21:33.32 | mikma | the annoying little bastards |
| 21:34.00 | NightHawkTheSane | yeah, abolish disease ftw? i still thing the resist rate will climb to the "why bother" point, though |
| 21:34.16 | ScytheBlade1 | I /hope/ so |
| 21:34.18 | NightHawkTheSane | i wonder if we'll see even people who are infected being 'hostile' |
| 21:34.24 | Shirik | oh noes |
| 21:34.27 | Shirik | dead argent healer :( |
| 21:35.12 | ScytheBlade1 | As in someone killed him, or it just happened? |
| 21:35.34 | Iriel | I've seen the healers get infected, perhaps it just got too much for him to heal himself? |
| 21:35.47 | ScytheBlade1 | The healers usually just heal their own selves |
| 21:37.08 | Shirik | Not sure, ScytheBlade1 |
| 21:37.10 | Shirik | he's just dead |
| 21:37.29 | ScytheBlade1 | Ah |
| 21:37.41 | Shirik | lots of zombies around so I assume he got overwhelmed |
| 21:37.51 | ScytheBlade1 | He can AoE nuke them though.. |
| 21:37.56 | Shirik | thhey don't have much HP |
| 21:37.56 | Shirik | 4k |
| 21:38.10 | cogwheel | Shirik: pong... |
| 21:38.10 | Shirik | and worse, they don't regen when out of combat |
| 21:38.21 | Shirik | cogwheel: NACK, RST? |
| 21:38.51 | cogwheel | Emu, pomegranate |
| 21:38.55 | cogwheel | O.o |
| 21:38.59 | Shirik | I pinged you? |
| 21:39.01 | Shirik | Oh right! |
| 21:39.08 | Shirik | Nm I kinda got my answer |
| 21:39.13 | Shirik | It was a question about visual studio |
| 21:39.13 | Shirik | night! |
| 21:39.18 | cogwheel | nn |
| 21:39.37 | Amarande | heh, the whole cure disease thing annoys me in D&D, too |
| 21:39.51 | Amarande | how do you make a great plague epic when any old level five priest scrub can cure disease |
| 21:40.01 | *** join/#wowuidev Cairenn (n=Cairenn@MMOI/Administratrix/Cairenn) |
| 21:40.01 | *** mode/#WoWUIDev [+o Cairenn] by ChanServ |
| 21:42.31 | NightHawkTheSane | night? even on the east coast its only what.. 6 pm? |
| 21:43.23 | Amarande | Heya Cairenn :) |
| 21:43.30 | Cairenn | hey :) |
| 21:43.32 | Amarande | so, I found a place that seems safe enough from zombies |
| 21:43.35 | Amarande | told my guildies about it |
| 21:43.36 | Remaxer|PT | I don't understand this....when i play wow my music player is having breaks :( |
| 21:43.41 | Amarande | so this guy's like "I'm gonna send you some pals" LOL |
| 21:43.48 | Amarande | I decided it was time to leave that island :) |
| 21:43.49 | seebs | This is weird. |
| 21:43.58 | seebs | I am getting about a survey an hour about GM responses, but no GM responses. |
| 21:44.12 | Amarande | thankfully, STV is big, and full of plenty of areas where people who don't want to be found pretty much can't be found. :D |
| 21:44.22 | seebs | I think the problem is that since I say my problem isn't solved, they open a new ticket, and since they don't plan to solve the problem, they then close it, triggering a survey. :) |
| 21:45.03 | Amarande | heh, those survey things can cause weird things |
| 21:45.05 | Amarande | I once reported a GM |
| 21:45.33 | Amarande | had an addon that was designed to auto report spam |
| 21:45.45 | Amarande | and apparently it picked up on the URL you were supposed to go to to take the survey and reported the GM for spamming : |
| 21:45.47 | Amarande | :| |
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| 21:46.27 | NightHawkTheSane | nice |
| 21:46.45 | seebs | I'm not even logged in, haven't been for like two days. |
| 21:46.55 | seebs | So I'm just getting email every hour or so saying "please give us feedback". |
| 21:47.16 | seebs | I pointed out the loop, and said that if I keep getting surveys without even a polite "sorry, we can't answer", I'm gonna start rating the professionalism down. |
| 21:48.07 | seebs | Really, what would be most convenient would be to just say "yes" to "was your problem resolved", but if I could say things I didn't believe, I probably wouldn't have this problem in the first place. |
| 21:49.11 | Amarande | and please remember, zombieHarmony.com is for zombies only, we are not responsible for the fate of those living who choose to set up a date with zombies ... |
| 21:49.16 | seebs | Hee. |
| 21:49.41 | Amarande | playing my alliance shammy now |
| 21:49.44 | *** join/#wowuidev |Yssaril| (n=Yssaril@adsl-99-139-120-222.dsl.emhril.sbcglobal.net) |
| 21:49.50 | Amarande | since STV seems to be chock full of places where you can go if you don't want to be found |
| 21:49.59 | NightHawkTheSane | the best part about dating a zombie is that i know they like my for my brain. |
| 21:50.05 | *** join/#wowuidev Jagannath (i=Jagannat@adsl-75-33-203-220.dsl.sndg02.sbcglobal.net) |
| 21:51.14 | Amarande | hmm |
| 21:51.14 | Amarande | almost time for gurubashi arena |
| 21:51.14 | Amarande | wonder if anyone's bothering to do it today with the zombies and all |
| 21:51.14 | NightHawkTheSane | "braiiiii-- triiiiinkettts...." |
| 21:53.37 | Amarande | hmm |
| 21:53.43 | Amarande | completely deserted, and it's less than ten minutes till trinket |
| 21:54.15 | foxlit | qq at goblin guards |
| 21:54.38 | foxlit | They can't tell people saving them from a zombie invasion from... well, people killing other players :( |
| 21:55.00 | NightHawkTheSane | zombies are peopel too! |
| 21:57.49 | foxlit | indeed. Damn you, pvp tag |
| 21:58.07 | ScytheBlade1 | There was a paladin cleansing the disease in the SW AH |
| 21:58.15 | ScytheBlade1 | So I got the disease and PvP flagged |
| 21:58.16 | *** join/#wowuidev Tem (n=tardmrr@WoWUIDev/WoWI/Dongle/Tem) |
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| 21:58.30 | ScytheBlade1 | Cleanse --> had a horde rogue friend gank --> win |
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| 22:04.39 | Amarande | dammit, apparently other people had the same idea as I did to try to get the gurubashi trinket while everyone's busy with zombies :| |
| 22:04.46 | Amarande | am I going to need to be 70 with 450+ resil to be able to get that? |
| 22:04.54 | NightHawkTheSane | yes |
| 22:05.04 | Amarande | as in, even S2 won't do - you need rating and S4? |
| 22:05.32 | NightHawkTheSane | totally. if you're not 2k+ rating, its a waste of tiem. * nod* |
| 22:05.50 | seebs | Does rating change anything, or is it just a measure of how you've done before? |
| 22:06.10 | seebs | Oh, this is ridiculous. |
| 22:06.27 | seebs | Some idiot's demanding that blizz fire the dev who came up with the zombie thing. That's just stupid. |
| 22:06.41 | Amarande | seebs: you need high enough rating to be able to buy most S4 gear |
| 22:06.49 | Amarande | that's really the only thing |
| 22:06.50 | Iriel | That ranks pretty high on the 'retardoscale' |
| 22:07.14 | seebs | Ahh, I see. |
| 22:07.35 | seebs | I mean, I probably dislike this event more than just about anyone, and I don't see why people would expect anyone to get fired. |
| 22:07.55 | NightHawkTheSane | seebs: which thread, we should reply demanding they be given a promotion |
| 22:07.58 | Iriel | The whole point of an 'event' is that it makes a material difference to your world experience |
| 22:08.04 | Iriel | I think this is one of the best they've done |
| 22:08.12 | seebs | "Re: Someone should be fired for this zombie B..." in general. |
| 22:08.22 | NightHawkTheSane | Iriel: agreed. i'd rate it as the single best event i've seen |
| 22:08.29 | Tekkub | yea, the idea of the event is to make people have a reason to hate artie |
| 22:08.34 | Tekkub | instead they hate the dev |
| 22:08.37 | Tekkub | fuck them |
| 22:08.49 | seebs | It's a disaster for a tiny tiny fraction of the player base. I think they botched that. They could have done an event which was a ton of fun and didn't become absolutely awful for that minority. |
| 22:09.08 | *** join/#wowuidev QQngsk (n=Gngsk@c-69-138-214-242.hsd1.md.comcast.net) |
| 22:09.12 | seebs | But I don't think it's a firing offense, just the sort of thing which happens when you try to plan for ten million people. |
| 22:09.20 | Tekkub | only thing I've seen is that the starter towns with the HH event need an argent healer |
| 22:09.27 | Tekkub | and that's only cause the events overlap |
| 22:09.46 | Tekkub | I don't think they took other events into consideration when they picked the healer locations |
| 22:10.01 | seebs | My thoughts were that newbie areas should be completely zombie-free, and they should just let people know when the event will be over so the people who want to do HE quests can do 'em later. |
| 22:10.15 | Tekkub | but then, I'm still hanging out in exodar and it's still peaceful as usual here |
| 22:10.19 | seebs | A ton of the QQ is from people who concluded that they would be unable to pursue their quests until after Hallow's End. |
| 22:10.27 | *** join/#wowuidev Thelyna (n=burp@222-152-99-60.jetstream.xtra.co.nz) |
| 22:10.57 | seebs | The other thing is the very small minority who have real problems with any kind of PvP and rolled PvE to avoid it. And I suspect they just plain didn't realize that this was a possibility. |
| 22:11.09 | Amarande | seebs: there are still those who are very passionate about the idea that companies should consider the customer their first priority |
| 22:11.17 | Tekkub | I have mojor problems with PvP and I don't hate this event |
| 22:11.19 | Amarande | and therefore, as a corollary, become extremely irritated when they are not satisfied as customers |
| 22:11.21 | Iriel | I think a vast majority of the customers would LIKE to see this |
| 22:11.23 | NightHawkTheSane | Amarande: those people are morons :) |
| 22:11.32 | ScytheBlade1 | ^ |
| 22:11.46 | Amarande | I *do* think it's a rather sad thing that customer service has steadily degenerated in general in recent years (as a general business thing) |
| 22:11.49 | seebs | I have major problems with PvP in that the very concept of a player attacking me triggers my full flight-or-flight reflex and makes me uncomfortable and panicky. |
| 22:11.55 | ScytheBlade1 | Amarande: uh, it has? |
| 22:11.57 | seebs | So I can't even log in until it's over. |
| 22:12.02 | Amarande | seebs: ehh |
| 22:12.04 | seebs | But I'm very, very, unusual. |
| 22:12.06 | NightHawkTheSane | Amarande: i wouldn't say it has at all |
| 22:12.08 | Amarande | players attacking me don't make me panic |
| 22:12.10 | Amarande | they just make me dead :) |
| 22:12.15 | Gngsk | seebs, I get that too. |
| 22:12.17 | seebs | I don't care about dead really. |
| 22:12.19 | Tekkub | I think everyone needs to work a shitty CS job (walmart or tech support) as a requirement |
| 22:12.29 | seebs | If it were 70 elite NPCs, I'd be having a blast. |
| 22:12.30 | Amarande | At least Blizzard is not Verant. |
| 22:12.47 | Tekkub | then they don't take companies to be these perfect entities that make everyone who gives them money unconditionally happy |
| 22:12.49 | Amarande | From what I understand, to be hired by Verant to work in their MMOs, you need to have been fired from previous jobs for being mean to customers :) |
| 22:12.58 | Tekkub | and they also learn to treat CS like fucking humans |
| 22:13.12 | seebs | So I think it's a pretty specialized case. There can't be more than maybe 1% of players, if that, who have actual mental disorders that wreck the event for them. |
| 22:13.18 | Amarande | I treat CS nicely as long as they do not do inane things |
| 22:13.24 | NightHawkTheSane | seebs: even 1% sounds high |
| 22:13.25 | Amarande | for instance: when I was 18, I bought a lotto ticket at this one place |
| 22:13.27 | Amarande | I was not carded. |
| 22:13.28 | seebs | I think if they'd done something about the newbie areas, it'd be pretty livable for almost everyone. |
| 22:13.45 | Tekkub | well there are always idiots in CS too |
| 22:13.46 | Amarande | Then AFTER I had already scratched the ticket, and have found out I didn't win, then the manager comes along out of nowhere and wants to see my ID |
| 22:13.57 | Amarande | I pledged never to shop there again |
| 22:13.57 | Tekkub | the thing is to learn when they are idiots, and when they're not |
| 22:14.01 | seebs | If they'd done that, and they'd just told me when it'd be over, I'd have no real complaints. I think it's great that they're doing a cool world event. |
| 22:14.05 | Amarande | (and I never will, since that place went out of business a few years ago :P) |
| 22:14.09 | *** join/#wowuidev Corrodias (n=no@adsl-75-17-199-112.dsl.euclwi.sbcglobal.net) |
| 22:14.14 | Tekkub | i.e., the people that designed this event, not idiots |
| 22:14.18 | seebs | The only thing that blizzard CS did that offended me was some posts saying "try it, maybe you'll like it." |
| 22:14.50 | seebs | Failing to prevent new-character griefing strikes me as a pretty major gaffe. I don't suppose it affected PTR, though. |
| 22:14.56 | Amarande | the other thing I find irritating is ISP tech support |
| 22:15.08 | mikma | i found a place in shattrath where you can complete the Going Down? :) |
| 22:15.13 | mikma | uploading a screenie |
| 22:15.14 | seebs | I did tech support for an OS vendor for a few years. |
| 22:15.18 | seebs | mikma, there's a ton. |
| 22:15.21 | Tekkub | try working ISP tech support |
| 22:15.22 | Amarande | I will call them, and explain the problem, and they'll tell me to do something that I can 100% say -will not- have any effect on the problem |
| 22:15.26 | mikma | http://wow.reaktio.net/WoWScrnShot_102608_011429.jpg |
| 22:15.27 | seebs | The easiest one is to run off the scryer elevator and land next to the bridge. |
| 22:15.45 | Tekkub | the people that call in with problems are, more often then not, beyond help because it's a hardware issue |
| 22:15.53 | Amarande | For instance, I will be offline because my cable modem is not connected to their network, and I can tell this because one or more of the four lights that indicate a successful connection are either off or blinking. |
| 22:16.01 | Amarande | The ISP tech will then suggest I bypass my router. |
| 22:16.01 | seebs | I once dealt with a user who did not comprehend the notion of areas on a screen; she couldn't distinguish between prompts and displays or anything else. |
| 22:16.06 | Tekkub | their computer is shit, their phone line sucks, either way their repeat issues are out of your hands |
| 22:16.07 | seebs | And I walked her through a complete reload of SunOS. |
| 22:16.20 | Amarande | Exactly how would bypassing my router do ANYTHING when it's the actual cable connection that's out, and is clearly so based on status lights? |
| 22:16.34 | seebs | Every time I had to ask what was on the screen, she started by reading the inverse-video line at the top with the key bindings. |
| 22:16.34 | NightHawkTheSane | mikma: like seebs said, scryer tier is a perfect height. i jumped off one of the overhangs, landed on the ground, and got the achivement just fine |
| 22:16.34 | Tekkub | that's someone not following their troubleshooting map |
| 22:16.35 | Tekkub | :P |
| 22:16.37 | Amarande | Or one day back when I had dialup ... I called up because my modem wouldn't handshake with theirs |
| 22:16.45 | Amarande | they tried to tell me to change my DNS settings |
| 22:16.56 | Tekkub | that's just you getting an idiot :P |
| 22:16.58 | mikma | nighthawkthesane: i completed mine shown in my screenshot |
| 22:17.01 | Fisker- | btw lulz kd3 |
| 22:17.04 | Fisker- | o wait |
| 22:17.06 | Tekkub | lern2troubleshoot |
| 22:17.06 | Fisker- | you already read |
| 22:17.35 | Amarande | the way I got going down was kinda like |
| 22:17.38 | Amarande | I got on my flying mount |
| 22:17.54 | Amarande | backed up a bit from the scryer elevator, towards the middle of shatt, staying above the elevated walkway though |
| 22:18.12 | Amarande | then I put myself about halfway up that sort of triangle shaped thing that protrudes above the top of the elevator |
| 22:18.14 | Amarande | and dismounted |
| 22:18.43 | cogwheel | ut oh... users starting to aggro... must update mods... |
| 22:18.47 | *** join/#wowuidev IdentifyTarget (n=Identify@241.23.119.70.cfl.res.rr.com) |
| 22:19.05 | seebs | I just hope I don't get any bug reports for a bit. :) |
| 22:19.18 | NightHawkTheSane | cogwheel: user agro? i say wipe and start over |
| 22:19.20 | Tekkub | screw that, just chainfear the users |
| 22:20.03 | cogwheel | eh... it'll get me in the mood to finish something less fun i've been working on :P |
| 22:20.18 | seebs | I actually have pending bugs I should be working on. :( |
| 22:22.04 | cogwheel | hmm... it would be one of my two buy-stuff-from-a-vendor mods... this is gonna cost me :> |
| 22:22.22 | ScytheBlade1 | haha |
| 22:23.02 | NightHawkTheSane | hah |
| 22:23.39 | *** join/#wowuidev Redguard (n=Redguard@108.177.121.70.cfl.res.rr.com) |
| 22:23.44 | Iriel | cogwheel: dev on a PTR or Beta server |
| 22:24.45 | cogwheel | anyone know a list/map of vendors with limited quantity items? |
| 22:25.26 | bleeter | two handed axe lol |
| 22:25.38 | seebs | Cogwheel, there might be one in Recipe Radar, if that's updated. |
| 22:25.56 | Iriel | Try the enchanting vendors |
| 22:25.56 | bleeter | cogwheel: fizzwidget's addon must have the list somewhere |
| 22:26.03 | Iriel | they've almost always got a bunch of stuff nobody buys |
| 22:26.19 | bleeter | cogwheel: oh, on beta? nm me :) |
| 22:27.02 | Redguard | ok, I am old school, but who holds business conferences on IRC? |
| 22:27.11 | Redguard | [freenode-info] if you're at a conference and other people are having trouble connecting, please mention it to staff: http://freenode.net/faq.shtml#gettinghelp |
| 22:27.27 | Iriel | Consider something like a sys admin conference |
| 22:27.32 | Iriel | or a fanfest for a game |
| 22:27.35 | Redguard | fair enough |
| 22:27.36 | *** join/#wowuidev Cide (n=Cide@hus110a.bobbnet.com) |
| 22:27.36 | *** mode/#WoWUIDev [+v Cide] by ChanServ |
| 22:27.39 | Redguard | I can see that |
| 22:27.42 | Iriel | or indeed, any of the languages that have their channels on freenode |
| 22:27.56 | seebs | $dayjob has an internal IRC server, which is pretty heavily used. :) |
| 22:28.02 | NightHawkTheSane | i've seen a lot of irc interviews/q&a sessions as well |
| 22:28.10 | Redguard | interesting |
| 22:28.49 | Dave2 | They don't hold the conference on IRC, but they do generally have a shared connection and a lot of people wanting to IRC from it. |
| 22:29.08 | cogwheel | i don't need anything updated... in fact the cheaper the stuff the better :P |
| 22:29.21 | cogwheel | (well data updated, anyway) |
| 22:29.39 | Iriel | cogwheel: Like I said, enchanting vendors, there's a bunch in outland (Stormspire, scryers terrace) |
| 22:29.41 | mikma | http://www.wowhead.com/?spell=51728 ROFL! look at the hidden comments |
| 22:29.46 | mikma | industrial: especially you! |
| 22:29.52 | Iriel | stupid green dust etc |
| 22:29.57 | cogwheel | ah |
| 22:30.06 | Iriel | silvermoon's clothier tends to have some limited qty cloth |
| 22:30.46 | cogwheel | i'm actually omw there... don't think they'll sell anything to me though (and that's assuming i can make it to 'em alive) |
| 22:30.49 | NightHawkTheSane | mikma: heh, /amused |
| 22:30.57 | *** join/#wowuidev assassin (n=assassin@c-69-138-65-13.hsd1.md.comcast.net) |
| 22:31.05 | cogwheel | being a gnome and all |
| 22:31.10 | assassin | what happend to bottom scanner? |
| 22:31.17 | Iriel | cogwheel: ah 8-) |
| 22:31.25 | Iriel | I just surived azuremist |
| 22:31.40 | Iriel | and, suprisingly, teldrassil |
| 22:31.41 | Iriel | as a BE |
| 22:32.02 | Iriel | Stormwind is the only place that got me killed |
| 22:32.25 | assassin | What happened to the bottom scanner on the auctioneer |
| 22:32.39 | ScytheBlade1 | assassin: still there |
| 22:32.53 | assassin | yea |
| 22:33.07 | ScytheBlade1 | ... as in |
| 22:33.09 | ScytheBlade1 | It's still there |
| 22:33.11 | ScytheBlade1 | Nothing happened to it |
| 22:33.14 | assassin | i dont see it or atlest the new virseion aint working for me |
| 22:33.43 | ScytheBlade1 | If you're running Auctioneer Classic, you need to switch to Advanced |
| 22:34.05 | ScytheBlade1 | If you're running Advanced then you should read the FAQs on installing mods because you broke it somehow |
| 22:34.42 | assassin | i aint break it you fuckin moron its just a drag and drop |
| 22:34.48 | ScytheBlade1 | ... |
| 22:34.55 | Iriel | assassin: hey, that kind of attitude isn' |
| 22:34.55 | ScytheBlade1 | Welcome to ignore! |
| 22:35.00 | Iriel | isnt welcome here |
| 22:35.03 | seebs | Huh. |
| 22:35.17 | seebs | You know, if you call the people who write addons morons, your chances of getting help from them go down. |
| 22:35.19 | seebs | Pretty fast, actually. |
| 22:35.36 | NightHawkTheSane | good to zero in three words? |
| 22:35.39 | seebs | I mean, sure, I've set up and debugged auctioneer about fifteen times, run into a ton of common problems, and figured out how to find "missing" UI components. |
| 22:35.51 | leethal | wohoo, epix |
| 22:35.53 | seebs | And I could probably tell you what happened, but I don't think I like you enough to put in the effort. |
| 22:36.17 | assassin | FUCK ALL OF YOU NOOBS |
| 22:36.19 | *** part/#wowuidev assassin (n=assassin@c-69-138-65-13.hsd1.md.comcast.net) |
| 22:36.29 | seebs | Huh. |
| 22:36.39 | seebs | Well, I'm deeply, deeply, hurt. |
| 22:36.44 | seebs | Anyone else? I think we should have a therapy group. |
| 22:37.04 | Iriel | does your 'therapy' involve pitchforks and boiling oil? |
| 22:37.19 | ScytheBlade1 | .... I'd join |
| 22:38.20 | NightHawkTheSane | i'd be okay with just a ban, really |
| 22:38.37 | ScytheBlade1 | ~Iriel++ |
| 22:39.03 | ScytheBlade1 | Boo it doesn't |
| 22:39.59 | NightHawkTheSane | hmm. horseradish in egg salad, thoughts? |
| 22:40.25 | Iriel | Finally, all the pre-northrend exploration achievements done |
| 22:41.09 | foxlit | And now, for bonus points, repeat them on your death knight alt :/ |
| 22:41.26 | Iriel | When the time comes.... |
| 22:41.27 | ScytheBlade1 | At least they start out with all of the flight points |
| 22:41.32 | NightHawkTheSane | ^ |
| 22:41.34 | ScytheBlade1 | It'd be much, much more painful otherwise |
| 22:41.42 | Iriel | it sucked when they didn't |
| 22:42.06 | foxlit | Meh |
| 22:42.15 | foxlit | You have to ride around the zones anyway. Might as well pick up the FPs :) |
| 22:43.01 | foxlit | (of course, if you didn't want to bother with the achievements, getting from EPL to BL might be painful) |
| 22:44.41 | mikma | lol this is great |
| 22:44.44 | mikma | get the disease |
| 22:44.50 | mikma | go out waiting for people to duel |
| 22:44.54 | mikma | smashy smashy |
| 22:44.58 | ScytheBlade1 | lol |
| 22:45.01 | ScytheBlade1 | I approve |
| 22:59.21 | seebs | Heh. |
| 22:59.30 | seebs | Someone on forums: "What class can I play that won't get nerfed." |
| 22:59.52 | Corrodias | GM |
| 23:00.18 | seebs | Hah. |
| 23:00.26 | seebs | If they aren't nerfed, why's the in-game queue over a day right now? |
| 23:02.31 | seebs | The forum mods are getting pretty aggressive about deleting a lot of the threads from people who are complaining. |
| 23:02.49 | Corrodias | good, that place could use a little moderation |
| 23:02.53 | Amarande | heh, I've been hiding out in the stands of gurubashi arena |
| 23:02.53 | seebs | I think the sentiment's going south fast and they want to keep it under control until the Big Event happens so they don't have to deal so much. |
| 23:02.58 | Amarande | no one seems to be coming out here |
| 23:03.09 | Amarande | yeah, the sentiment is definitely going south |
| 23:03.19 | Corrodias | hiding? you clud just not play, no? |
| 23:03.21 | seebs | Wednesday and Thursday, it was about 10:1 in favor. By now it's about 2:1 against. |
| 23:03.22 | Corrodias | *could |
| 23:03.32 | Amarande | Corrodias: I'm chatting in guild chat :P |
| 23:03.39 | Corrodias | can't dou do that dead? |
| 23:03.45 | Corrodias | i hate not seeing my edit box... |
| 23:03.51 | Corrodias | can't spell now |
| 23:03.52 | Amarande | I think it's because of two factors, the whole sentiment going south thing |
| 23:04.05 | Amarande | 1) the fear that this might last till LK |
| 23:04.17 | Amarande | 2) the fact that while it can be fun in the beginning, it gets old after a couple days |
| 23:04.30 | leethal | hmm. How come closet gnome shows up in the addons panel in interface options, but no minimap icon appears and the /cg command doesn't work? |
| 23:05.06 | Amarande | has anything really changed at all with the zombie thing besides the debuff being 2 minutes now instead of 5? |
| 23:05.39 | seebs | Harder to cleanse, many healers gone, and of course the more invasions. |
| 23:05.50 | seebs | I think it's more "been there, done that". |
| 23:05.54 | Amarande | Basically ... imagine if, say, AV, once you entered it, could not be exited until server reset. |
| 23:06.11 | Amarande | And you were shoved into it on Tuesday afternoon. |
| 23:06.19 | seebs | Once people have cleansed a village or two and zombified a village or two, many of them stop enjoying it. And then after about another day, they want to do something else. |
| 23:06.27 | Amarande | Even many die-hard PvP fans would probably be bored stiff by Monday. |
| 23:06.46 | Amarande | Oh, by that I also mean, imagine that it was only the one AV match every week |
| 23:06.57 | Amarande | that lasted the entire week once you entered it. |
| 23:07.22 | seebs | Heh. |
| 23:08.33 | *** join/#wowuidev kd3 (n=kd3@wikia/kaydeethree) |
| 23:10.17 | Remaxer|PT | so boring |
| 23:10.20 | Remaxer|PT | :( |
| 23:11.41 | foxlit | Meh, only one real problem with the whole arrangement is the bogus pvp flagging |
| 23:12.09 | foxlit | Zombies can attack you regardless, but attacking zombies of opposite faction is considered pvp. |
| 23:13.15 | seebs | Yeah. Or cleansing zombies, or anything else. Honestly, if I could have an account flag set where my characters can't be attacked by player zombies when I'm not flagged, I probably wouldn't care about it. |
| 23:13.45 | foxlit | actually, that'd kill the event |
| 23:13.45 | NightHawkTheSane | -that- would defeat the entire purpose |
| 23:13.49 | seebs | Yeah. |
| 23:14.03 | seebs | Basically, I'm personally just plain incompatible with the event. |
| 23:14.11 | seebs | Although.. I dunno. |
| 23:14.17 | foxlit | I'll eat your brains. |
| 23:14.21 | foxlit | While you're not looking :) |
| 23:14.23 | Coren{de} | so you or the event need an upgrade? |
| 23:14.29 | *** join/#wowuidev Corrodias (i=no@adsl-75-17-199-112.dsl.euclwi.sbcglobal.net) |
| 23:14.37 | seebs | If player zombies could attack NPCs and flagged players, I think there could be a ton of fun for everyone, but the few die-hard PvEers could stick to fighting NPC zombies. |
| 23:14.48 | Tekkub | seebs, shut up and hang out in exodar, problem solved |
| 23:14.51 | seebs | Eh, I probably do need an upgrade, but apparently none is available. |
| 23:15.08 | seebs | "Hang out in exodar" isn't much of a reason to log in. :) |
| 23:15.19 | foxlit | PvE zombies are braindead. |
| 23:15.20 | NightHawkTheSane | sure there is. we can rebuild you. |
| 23:15.22 | NightHawkTheSane | make you better. |
| 23:15.23 | NightHawkTheSane | stronger. |
| 23:15.24 | NightHawkTheSane | faster |
| 23:15.24 | seebs | I don't really care much, I'll just wait it out. |
| 23:15.30 | Coren{de} | I'd like the event to get an upgrade... or rather downgrade. atm it feels overdone. |
| 23:15.48 | foxlit | I'd be happier if they just took away the opportunities for cross-faction griefing. |
| 23:15.48 | Tekkub | even more reason to want wrath to go on sale! |
| 23:16.10 | foxlit | Stuff like NPC guards attacking you for attacking zombies; or you getting flagged for cleansing the disease. |
| 23:16.32 | Tekkub | considering how many NPCs in NR are all like "blah blah what artie did to <home town>" I think it's just about perfectly done |
| 23:16.39 | foxlit | Which'd make it a mandatory players-vs-zombies game with optional pvp elements :) |
| 23:16.41 | NightHawkTheSane | foxlit: yeah, that would have been nice. but i suspect a lot of that is some low-level code that would have been difficult to work around |
| 23:16.50 | Tekkub | he caused a big problem! |
| 23:16.52 | seebs | I don't really care which faction is doing the griefing. I'd be fine just being able to start a new toon or something. |
| 23:17.05 | Coren{de} | it also ruins the chance to put out the fires of the helloween towns, basically... that's what bothers me right now ;) |
| 23:17.08 | seebs | I'd happily do my 1-5 quests in a newbie area if it weren't being camped by 70s. |
| 23:17.20 | Xinhuan | well its a roleplaying event |
| 23:17.21 | NightHawkTheSane | Coren{de}: i've yet to have any problem accomplishing that, at all. |
| 23:17.28 | Xinhuan | people complained past events didn't have an impact |
| 23:17.37 | Tekkub | they didn't! |
| 23:17.45 | Xinhuan | and now they do and people complain! |
| 23:17.45 | NightHawkTheSane | ^ |
| 23:17.50 | seebs | I think there's two or three substantially different sets of complaints, and they tend to have mutually-exclusive solutions. |
| 23:17.55 | NightHawkTheSane | Xinhuan: we've been over this. people will -always- complain |
| 23:18.01 | foxlit | Xinhuan: it's very simple: forums are there to complain. |
| 23:18.06 | foxlit | It doesn't really matter what about :) |
| 23:18.10 | Xinhuan | lol |
| 23:18.14 | seebs | So, for instance, I would be fine with 70 elite mobs spawning on villages and attacking everyone, as long as there were no non-optional PvP. Some people would be fine with PvP as long as questgivers were immune. And so on. |
| 23:18.14 | Tekkub | yea, and this is not the place for complaining about not-addons |
| 23:18.22 | Tekkub | so piss off and complain on the forums! |
| 23:18.22 | seebs | Tekkub has a point. |
| 23:18.25 | Tekkub | *hides* |
| 23:18.37 | Xinhuan | braaaaains! |
| 23:18.43 | NightHawkTheSane | blizzard could magically manage to give everyone -exactly- what they wanted from the game, and a pony, and people would complain |
| 23:18.45 | Tekkub | vaaaaaaariables! |
| 23:19.10 | foxlit | NightHawkTheSane: But I didn't want a pony! (damn, that's such a reversal) |
| 23:19.32 | Tekkub | [Candy Corn] what a rip, I want my pet, this event is shit |
| 23:19.35 | NightHawkTheSane | foxlit: well, it was your mother's idea anyway. I wanted to get you a ps3 |
| 23:19.36 | Coren{de} | local Tekkub = Tekkub; Tekkub.Relax(); =) |
| 23:19.38 | Tekkub | someone fire someone because of it |
| 23:19.51 | Xinhuan | keep doing it every hour |
| 23:19.52 | Xinhuan | :D |
| 23:19.57 | Tekkub | I AM! |
| 23:20.06 | NightHawkTheSane | ill keep doing YOU every hour. ... |
| 23:20.06 | Tekkub | how sad is that? |
| 23:20.06 | NightHawkTheSane | er.. |
| 23:20.09 | foxlit | Tekkub.SetOutput("/dev/null") |
| 23:20.11 | Xinhuan | i've gotten like 4 squashlings and 3 hats |
| 23:20.17 | NightHawkTheSane | Xinhuan: fuck you. |
| 23:20.20 | Tekkub | foxlit, IMMUNE |
| 23:20.28 | Xinhuan | and passed on another 4 more! |
| 23:20.37 | Tekkub | I've not been doing the HH |
| 23:20.37 | NightHawkTheSane | Xinhuan: seriously, fuck you. :P |
| 23:20.40 | Xinhuan | but seen no monuts drop yet |
| 23:20.43 | Tekkub | too lazy to drag my ass up there |
| 23:20.44 | foxlit | grumble grumble |
| 23:20.47 | Xinhuan | hmm monuts |
| 23:20.51 | seebs | My bank alt has a squashling. |
| 23:20.53 | Tekkub | I'd rather stare at the innkeeper and work on addons |
| 23:20.56 | seebs | This really offends me. |
| 23:21.12 | NightHawkTheSane | ive yet to see a mount, only seen 3 squashlings -ever-, and only like 4 hats, and of all that, i only one one sqashling |
| 23:21.22 | Coren{de} | I've yet to see a squashling... |
| 23:21.25 | NightHawkTheSane | er, "won one" |
| 23:21.31 | Xinhuan | i'm trying to contemplate if i should spend 3 hours flying around on my alt to complete the "visit innkeepers around the world" achievements |
| 23:22.00 | foxlit | You know, I thought that achievement was their sneaky way of deflating gold value by charging gryphon fees. |
| 23:22.03 | seebs | Inkeepers around the world? |
| 23:22.13 | foxlit | But the quests actually reward more than you'd ever spend on flights. Way to fail. |
| 23:22.15 | Xinhuan | yeah there's candy buckets next to them |
| 23:22.15 | seebs | Like trick-or-treat, you mean? |
| 23:22.44 | seebs | Yeah. As soon as the PvP's over, I have a handful of lowbies that had run all the way from Silvermoon to Revantusk picking up flight points and candy. :) |
| 23:23.02 | Coren{de} | too much work for not enough gain... I rather go explore and be an explorer some day, when I grow up :) |
| 23:23.16 | foxlit | Actually, you should've seen the PvE part of this on my server. |
| 23:23.19 | Xinhuan | 3435 achievement points now, on my main! |
| 23:23.22 | NightHawkTheSane | Xinhuan: if you already the pet/hat achievement, its kinda silly not to just get the meta |
| 23:23.24 | Tekkub | you get like 5k exp per bucket |
| 23:23.35 | Tekkub | I pushed into 66 thanks to them |
| 23:23.49 | foxlit | Around 2 40-man raids worth of people per necrotic crystal.... overpopulated as heck. |
| 23:23.50 | Xinhuan | do they give rep? |
| 23:23.57 | NightHawkTheSane | no |
| 23:23.59 | Coren{de} | all the chars I want at 70 are there... 3 feral druids be enough ;) |
| 23:24.01 | Tekkub | don't thik so, wasn't watching |
| 23:25.24 | Xinhuan | i wonder whats the backstory behind Tenris |
| 23:25.30 | Xinhuan | and how he got into karazhan |
| 23:25.51 | foxlit | Xinhuan: harry killed snape with dumbeldore and locked Tenris into Karazhan. |
| 23:26.15 | NightHawkTheSane | ^^ |
| 23:26.20 | Xinhuan | yes, and we need 10 quidditch brooms to rescue hermione |
| 23:26.43 | foxlit | http://uncyclopedia.org/Spoiler is just too awesome for its own good |
| 23:27.23 | Coren{de} | to distract from all the event stuff... is there any *proper* way to get the results of SendWho("...") that avoids the FriendsFrame from popping up, being tainted besides unregistering its WHO_LIST_UPDATE? |
| 23:27.44 | Xinhuan | no. |
| 23:28.09 | foxlit | tbh |
| 23:28.24 | foxlit | They really need to fix the who mechanic. It's been 3 years. |
| 23:28.38 | Xinhuan | WhoLib was written as a library approach to do all these background /whos, which acts as a certal library to surpress the friends frame from popping up, but it basically still uses the same methods |
| 23:28.53 | seebs | The reason for the big trick-or-treat run is partially the XP (about a level and a half) and partially to get all the flight points so we never have to deal with that again. :) |
| 23:28.54 | NightHawkTheSane | foxlit: there's a lot of things that could use fixing >.> |
| 23:28.56 | Xinhuan | you can probably unregister it |
| 23:29.15 | foxlit | NightHawkTheSane: for the lack of better conversation, list them :) |
| 23:29.24 | Xinhuan | but reregister it by securehooking a ChatEditBox's OnEnter if it contains a "/who" in it |
| 23:29.32 | Xinhuan | then unregister again or something after that |
| 23:29.51 | Coren{de} | that's what I do right now, the unregister, send, wait for answer, re-register... but it feels awkward and if my AddOn has a bug, the user might lose the ability to /who interactively... that last part bothers me |
| 23:29.52 | foxlit | Xinhuan: just hook the /who handler |
| 23:29.59 | Xinhuan | yah |
| 23:30.16 | foxlit | And probably that FriendsFrame button, too |
| 23:30.19 | NightHawkTheSane | foxlit: quests, for one. It'd be nice to get information about quests in the log even if the header is collapsed. same applies to reputations, really |
| 23:30.37 | NightHawkTheSane | but the whole quest mechanism is kinda awkward to mod. |
| 23:30.48 | foxlit | That applies to more or less every structured list they have in the game |
| 23:31.08 | foxlit | It's all bloody cheating by moving the collapse behavior to C API rather than Lua UI. |
| 23:31.23 | Xinhuan | its faster C side at least |
| 23:31.35 | seebs | Actually, that is a question I have sometimes had: |
| 23:31.44 | foxlit | Meh, dunno. |
| 23:31.44 | seebs | Actual dev-related, too! |
| 23:31.51 | Coren{de} | the worst part of the quest thing is that it has (had?) some initialization bug, sometimes I could crash the game by trying to get the questinfo immediately after logging in :D |
| 23:32.08 | seebs | Is there a way to obtain the complete list of current quests, regardless of collapsed headers, and to verify that the list is actually loaded and not just empty due to not being logged in? |
| 23:32.08 | foxlit | Insignificantly so, I'd say -- if the Lua implementation is reasonable. |
| 23:32.22 | foxlit | Delay until PLAYER_ENTERING_WORLD? |
| 23:32.25 | Xinhuan | no seebs, you need to manually expand all of them |
| 23:32.26 | seebs | My todo addon has a ton of problems because I can't tell whether the quest list is actually empty or merely not yet loaded. |
| 23:32.29 | Xinhuan | with code or otherwise |
| 23:32.40 | seebs | Ah-hah. |
| 23:32.47 | seebs | And that explains why quest addons make LightHeaded go crazy. |
| 23:32.58 | Coren{de} | foxlit, I did after the last possible event, still random crash... then I just added a FriendsFrame_Open/Close ~ |
| 23:32.59 | seebs | Because they're having to expand headers and change the order of the quest log, I bet. |
| 23:33.12 | Xinhuan | ya |
| 23:33.15 | seebs | Eww. |
| 23:33.23 | Xinhuan | expanding the headers cause events to fire to reupdate the display |
| 23:33.29 | seebs | Ugh. |
| 23:33.32 | NightHawkTheSane | is it just me, or are most of the argent healers forsaken? |
| 23:33.37 | seebs | It would be really nice if there were an API to query that. |
| 23:33.40 | seebs | I think they are all forsaken. |
| 23:33.51 | foxlit | Neh, I'm pretty sure I've seen other races. |
| 23:33.54 | seebs | And I am sort of suspicious that they may not actually be opposed to the scourge... |
| 23:33.59 | seebs | I've only seen forsaken ones so far. |
| 23:33.59 | Xinhuan | the ones in stormwind are human |
| 23:34.10 | Xinhuan | ironforge as well |
| 23:34.29 | NightHawkTheSane | hm, okay, so i guess there's PROBABLY not a huge argent healer/scourge conspiracy >.> |
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| 23:34.41 | Xinhuan | but argent dawn is known to accept all races, as long as they have the common goal of killing undead |
| 23:34.43 | Coren{de} | well, the forsaken have probably better resistance to getting infected yet again :) |
| 23:35.02 | foxlit | or are they? |
| 23:35.05 | foxlit | drumroll, please |
| 23:35.08 | Amarande | seebs: Ehh. You might as well say then that the various neutral factions that consist of humans are suspiciously un-loyal to the alliance |
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| 23:35.35 | NightHawkTheSane | Xinhuan: indeed, which is why i didn't think much of it at first, it just -seemed- like every one i saw was undead |
| 23:36.03 | seebs | Well, if it's an apothecary plague, it would be a great way for them to break the defenses; defend against the weak zombies with "cleansing" effects which make the plague harder to kill... |
| 23:36.33 | foxlit | I wonder if they've actually fixed the beta quest lines |
| 23:36.59 | foxlit | Horde apothecary quests were like failure-failure-failure-miserable failure-eh, a cure?-POISON EVERYONE |
| 23:37.27 | Lonny`afk | I'm trying to create a new enumerator and I'm wondering if I'm way off http://wowi.pastey.net/99687 |
| 23:37.43 | seebs | I do wonder what's gonna happen with the apothecaries in the expansion. :) |
| 23:38.30 | foxlit | Lonny`: just slightly |
| 23:39.16 | Lonny` | Care to explain ? :) |
| 23:39.44 | seebs | Hmm. |
| 23:39.45 | seebs | I wonder. |
| 23:39.50 | foxlit | http://www.lua.org/manual/5.1/manual.html#2.4.5 |
| 23:39.54 | NightHawkTheSane | >.> *sigh* the weird pet sizing issues with exotic pets are obnoxious at times. |
| 23:40.00 | seebs | Can I scroll of resurrection my old account that I haven't used for a few months? |
| 23:40.04 | foxlit | Then scroll a bit down |
| 23:40.17 | foxlit | Starting with "The generic for statement works over functions, called iterators" |
| 23:42.41 | foxlit | but basically, things you should fix are |
| 23:42.50 | foxlit | "GetNumMounts" is a crappy function name to return an iterator from |
| 23:43.19 | foxlit | You're creating an iterator function for every call to GetNumMounts (bad, garbage generation) |
| 23:44.55 | foxlit | but other than that, it's semi-okay. |
| 23:46.04 | Lonny` | hmm, that's really depends on the details and the task at hand :P |
| 23:47.56 | foxlit | What provides GetMountInfo? |
| 23:49.10 | Lonny` | Well basically, I'm expanding 'GetCompanionInfo' so I would know whether a mount is a fast mount or flyable |
| 23:49.48 | Coren{de} | why not just use a table and collect the values there, once? |
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| 23:50.54 | seebs | "Gratz to <Cancer> for finally downing Ezra!" <-- worst taste ever in forum thread title. |
| 23:54.16 | Coren{de} | I'd give 7/10 for touching an interesting taboo of people :> |
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| 23:54.44 | Lonny` | Coren{de} that's what I already have, but I still want to have an iterator that returns the values based on the params I pass it |
| 23:56.21 | Xinhuan | ok |
| 23:56.32 | Xinhuan | if i want to upload Routes to wowi, what category does it fit in? |
| 23:57.39 | seebs | Thread disappeared before I could even refresh the page. |
| 23:57.42 | ScytheBlade1 | Hmm |
| 23:57.48 | ScytheBlade1 | I can't remember their categories :P |
| 23:57.49 | NightHawkTheSane | map mods, imo |
| 23:57.51 | ScytheBlade1 | Either data mods or map mods |
| 23:57.57 | ScytheBlade1 | Probably map |
| 23:58.31 | NightHawkTheSane | tradeskill -maybe- |
| 23:59.43 | Coren{de} | logically, I'd say Plugins&Patches (it's kind of a patch to whatever AddOn can use those routes)... but noone would find it there... wowi needs a data section (not data mod, just data) |
| 23:59.52 | seebs | Oh, hey. 3.0.3 makes it possible to buy the pally epic mount if you have training without doing the quest. |
