IRC log for #sporewiki on 20160714

`00:03.32`	`Quark8`	`Okay. Thanks for the response.`
`00:06.33`	`Charles_Bot`	`Np!`
`00:28.34`	`*** join/#sporewiki Charles_Murray (cf268f3c@gateway/web/freenode/ip.207.38.143.60)`
`00:53.58`	`Charles_Murray`	`Ahhhh techno`
`00:54.02`	`Charles_Murray`	`Technobliterator`
`00:54.06`	`Charles_Murray`	`halp`
`00:54.19`	`Monet`	`She's not on.`
`00:54.38`	`Charles_Murray`	`Was just checking'`
`00:54.49`	`Monet`	`She's away, her name persists for some reason`
`00:56.27`	`Monet`	`<PROTECTED>`
`00:57.31`	`Monet`	`The smell is mostly tolerable after a thorough cleaning spell, thankfully.`
`00:57.48`	`Charles_Murray`	`:o`
`00:58.02`	`*** join/#sporewiki Tek0516 (uid149600@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-onorxlcdhpwqalqv)`
`00:59.20`	`Tek0516`	`Charles_Murray DrodoEmpire: "We have formed a Personal Union with France" I think I just had a minor heart attack while playing EU4. :P https://usercontent.irccloud-cdn.com/file/sVQhs6xH/20160713205628_1.jpg`
`01:00.08`	`Charles_Murray`	`Oooh myyy`
`01:01.38`	`Tek0516`	`Around 140% liberty desire. >.>`
`01:12.26`	`Tek0516`	`Charles_Murray: Yeah, I've got a great PU but have no ability to maintain it. :P`
`01:13.07`	`Charles_Murray`	`Gogogo!`
`01:37.42`	`*** join/#sporewiki Roboticking (6c07259d@gateway/web/freenode/ip.108.7.37.157)`
`01:59.12`	`*** join/#sporewiki Spluff5 (ae188812@gateway/web/freenode/ip.174.24.136.18)`
`01:59.39`	`Quark8`	`Hello Spluff5.`
`01:59.44`	`Spluff5`	`Hello`
`02:32.00`	`*** join/#sporewiki AnonyLurk (44048e73@gateway/web/freenode/ip.68.4.142.115)`
`02:32.06`	`DrodoEmpire`	`Hi`
`02:32.42`	`AnonyLurk`	`Hello.`
`02:32.45`	`AnonyLurk`	`https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BQAKRw6mToA ]`
`02:33.38`	`Spluff5`	`K`
`02:35.39`	`AnonyLurk`	`How does unarmed combat function between different species in SporeWiki?`
`02:35.54`	`AnonyLurk`	`Do species have dedicated fighting styles specific to beating other species?`
`02:36.02`	`DrodoEmpire`	`Interesting question`
`02:36.06`	`AnonyLurk`	`Or what.`
`02:36.54`	`AnonyLurk`	`Is it more common for coalitions of species to have such styles, or are they completely non-present, with fighting styles mainly being focused on making the best use of one's own species?`
`02:37.06`	`DrodoEmpire`	`I'm not sure personally, though Drodo unarmed fighting styles in general focus more on agility and striking as opposed to holds or wrestling, etc.`
`02:37.41`	`AnonyLurk`	`Link.`
`02:37.43`	`AnonyLurk`	`Plz.`
`02:37.58`	`Spluff5`	`My species hardly fight so...`
`02:38.00`	`DrodoEmpire`	`I haven't written at length about Drodo martial arts, so I probably don't have one`
`02:38.04`	`DrodoEmpire`	`I`
`02:38.12`	`AnonyLurk`	`Oh.`
`02:38.19`	`AnonyLurk`	`You should.`
`02:38.25`	`AnonyLurk`	`I've gotten a tad obsessive over martial arts recently.`
`02:38.31`	`AnonyLurk`	`What's your species, Spluff?`
`02:38.46`	`DrodoEmpire`	`*I'm still in the process of writing about the military history of the Drodo, so while I can answer most questions you have I've got nothing really on paper`
`02:39.49`	`Spluff5`	`Mine are the Sanurans. Still working on the history although I have recently updated it.`
`02:40.10`	`Tek0516`	`Most species probably have multiple combat styles developed over their history. It's possible there are specialized styles of them as well, optimized to exploit the relative strengths and weaknesses of each species.`
`02:40.40`	`DrodoEmpire`	`^`
`02:40.52`	`DrodoEmpire`	`There's likely too many to really count, especially among older societies`
`02:40.57`	`Tek0516`	`Though given the focus of armed combat (both ranged and melee) it's more likely they aren't highly developed for that.`
`02:41.28`	`AnonyLurk`	`So same as humans.`
`02:41.50`	`AnonyLurk`	`That is the most probable course of action, looking at it objectively.`
`02:42.19`	`AnonyLurk`	`But if a species was living in a close relationship with another species, like in an alliance, over a long period of time then maybe systems specialized to defeat the other species might develop.`
`02:42.31`	`AnonyLurk`	`I don't know, it could be a fun thing to write about at any rate.`
`02:42.35`	`AnonyLurk`	`Space MMA.`
`02:42.36`	`Tek0516`	`The same sort of way that traditional martial arts aren't really taught for much practical combat use, excluding areas such as self-defense and sport.`
`02:43.15`	`DrodoEmpire`	`It makes sense Anony`
`02:43.39`	`DrodoEmpire`	`Tek: Well... I believe a lot of East-Asian militaries still train their soldiers in martial arts`
`02:43.52`	`Tek0516`	`I'd say it's far more likely for such arts to form between rival species rather than allies, where the potential for unarmed combat is far more likely.`
`02:43.52`	`AnonyLurk`	`Not really, and not traditional martial arts.`
`02:43.54`	`DrodoEmpire`	`Its valuable knowledge still, and can save one's life`
`02:44.15`	`AnonyLurk`	`See, this is why I stated "Unarmed combat" in the opener.`
`02:44.31`	`DrodoEmpire`	`Tek0516: Not necessarily`
`02:44.40`	`AnonyLurk`	`H.istorical E.uropean M.ARTIAL A.RTS primarily addresses how to kill someone with a sword, knife, shield, polearm, etcetera.`
`02:45.04`	`AnonyLurk`	`"Martial Art" doesn't necessarily mean using your bare hands, is what I mean.`
`02:45.10`	`DrodoEmpire`	`Knowing how to disarm a certain species you encounter on a daily basis walking down the street's probably more valuable to your average person`
`02:45.17`	`AnonyLurk`	`Yeah.`
`02:45.31`	`Tek0516`	`Perhaps.`
`02:45.47`	`AnonyLurk`	`I find it unlikely for systems for fighting rival species to develop, because any conflict with a rival species would be more often ARMED than unarmed.`
`02:46.01`	`AnonyLurk`	`Well.`
`02:46.29`	`AnonyLurk`	`Systems for unarmed combat, at any rate. Martial Arts in the literal sense would certainly be more likely to develop between rival species, it'd just be more about shooting them with a gun.`
`02:46.44`	`Tek0516`	`Though when dealing with hostile species there would be a lot more active research into countering their physiology..`
`02:47.45`	`AnonyLurk`	`But that would involve countering it with bullets, not hands.`
`02:48.02`	`AnonyLurk`	`The practical use of knowing an unarmed combat system, is being able to incapacitate someone, when you're somewhere you can't carry a knife.`
`02:48.02`	`DrodoEmpire`	`Again, unarmed combat is more valuable if you're a private citizen, and inventing a martial art to fight a certain hostile species might not be seen as a valuable use of state resources`
`02:48.05`	`AnonyLurk`	`I.E., civilian situations.`
`02:48.40`	`DrodoEmpire`	`Its much better to use those same resources to learn where to shoot such a species to kill, or how to bayonet them L:p`
`02:49.05`	`AnonyLurk`	`Or, more likely, research into biological warfare.`
`02:49.40`	`DrodoEmpire`	`Well, no, because that'd be wildly unethical`
`02:49.52`	`AnonyLurk`	`But "They all died due to a plague" isn't as interesting of a story as "And then the spaceships shot lasers at each other, and there was this epic last stand and lots of explosions and coolness!", and creating an entertaining story is ultimately the goal of this collective writing exercise.`
`02:49.55`	`DrodoEmpire`	`And for much of the Xonexi cluster, illegal under the laws of wa\`
`02:49.56`	`DrodoEmpire`	`*war`
`02:50.02`	`AnonyLurk`	`See above.`
`02:50.26`	`AnonyLurk`	`Rule of Cool.`
`02:50.41`	`DrodoEmpire`	`I did see above, and I counter that its also illegal under the laws of war that've been put down`
`02:50.42`	`DrodoEmpire`	`:p`
`02:51.03`	`DrodoEmpire`	`Beyond some desire to make it all "rule of cool"`
`02:51.33`	`AnonyLurk`	`If you have a blanket governmental system stable enough to establish laws of war, you have a blanket governmental system stable enough to diplomatically resolve any conflict before it becomes a war.`
`02:52.27`	`DrodoEmpire`	`...Yes, the IGA exists which can mediate most conflicts between member states pretty well`
`02:52.37`	`DrodoEmpire`	`Which is exactly what happens`
`02:53.05`	`DrodoEmpire`	`What is your point, beyond trying to prove that war fictions are somehow contrived and that biological weapons are somehow the best weapons there are?`
`02:53.27`	`DrodoEmpire`	`(Which they aren't, especially in space where you can quarantine a world without too much difficulty`
`02:53.31`	`DrodoEmpire`	`*)`
`02:54.10`	`AnonyLurk`	`Therefore, I find 'laws' in war to be a silly concept, since the only situation in which a war would break out is a situation where total war would break out.`
`02:54.50`	`DrodoEmpire`	`Uhh`
`02:55.03`	`DrodoEmpire`	`No?`
`02:55.05`	`The_Randomness`	`yeah no`
`02:55.16`	`DrodoEmpire`	`Most wars in history have been relatively low-intensity`
`02:55.16`	`AnonyLurk`	`If you can have laws of war, then why didn't you just avert the war in the first place?`
`02:55.28`	`AnonyLurk`	`Most wars in history have been lawless.`
`02:55.32`	`DrodoEmpire`	`You know jack-shit`
`02:55.40`	`The_Randomness`	`^`
`02:55.46`	`DrodoEmpire`	`And how do laws of war make these wars total wars?`
`02:55.55`	`DrodoEmpire`	`(As for that- you're also wrong)`
`02:55.55`	`AnonyLurk`	`They don't, they make them the opposite.`
`02:56.21`	`DrodoEmpire`	`General courtesy and shared codes of honour have existed in many wars, long before any laws were legislated`
`02:56.45`	`DrodoEmpire`	`They were not two groups of lawless savages doing anything and everything to win`
`02:56.50`	`DrodoEmpire`	`In most cases`
`02:57.10`	`DrodoEmpire`	`As for averting war in the first place- yes, that can happen`
`02:58.03`	`DrodoEmpire`	`But how do laws of war mean that wars are simply averted?`
`02:58.07`	`DrodoEmpire`	`All the time?`
`02:58.14`	`DrodoEmpire`	`Where does that come from?`
`02:58.25`	`AnonyLurk`	`Laws of war have to be enforced by an entity, presumably a government.`
`02:58.37`	`DrodoEmpire`	`Not always`
`02:58.41`	`AnonyLurk`	`If that entity has enough control to establish laws in a war, then I would say they also have enough control to prevent the war in the first place.`
`02:58.58`	`DrodoEmpire`	`No, that makes no sense`
`02:59.35`	`DrodoEmpire`	`In addition, the Geneva conventions were for a long time not enforced by a central power- but people still followed them (with some unfortunate exceptions)`
`02:59.36`	`AnonyLurk`	`A brief aside, is there an image of Drodo I could look at? I don't see one on the creature page.`
`03:00.46`	`DrodoEmpire`	`As for that other leap of logic- why do you figure? An international entity could have the constitutional power to prosecute war criminals or intervene with peacekeepers, but it could very well lack the ability to end the state of war between two member states`
`03:00.53`	`DrodoEmpire`	`Especially if these were powerful member states`
`03:01.27`	`DrodoEmpire`	`Diplomatic pressure could do a lot of the work, sure, but your argument doesn't add up`
`03:02.02`	`DrodoEmpire`	`And keep in mind that a lot of SporeWiki nations, including the Drodo, have colonies in relatively lawless places like the quadrants, where war is still pretty common`
`03:02.35`	`DrodoEmpire`	`As for pictures- yeah that's been an issue for a while now`
`03:02.40`	`DrodoEmpire`	`I'll be fixing it soon`
`03:04.43`	`AnonyLurk`	`My point is mainly this.`
`03:05.03`	`AnonyLurk`	`Attempting to apply logic to a universe in the style of SporeWiki is an exercise in futility, because as soon as one question is answered it raises a dozen others.`
`03:05.16`	`AnonyLurk`	`If this universe was realistic, all the ships would be flown by AI.`
`03:05.26`	`AnonyLurk`	`But no one wants to read a story about the life and times of Ship AI #3004.`
`03:05.43`	`AnonyLurk`	`So it seems silly to me to try and justify any of it beyond a superficial level.`
`03:05.47`	`DrodoEmpire`	`That's... Also not necessarily true`
`03:05.49`	`AnonyLurk`	`*The most superficial of levels.`
`03:06.21`	`DrodoEmpire`	`The Science Fiction universe does have a lot of rule of cool, but its also somewhat internally consistent`
`03:06.35`	`DrodoEmpire`	`Also your previous argument is still wrong`
`03:06.38`	`DrodoEmpire`	`Flatly wrong`
`03:06.54`	`AnonyLurk`	`Which one?`
`03:07.06`	`DrodoEmpire`	`The one we've been having for the past ten or so minutes.`
`03:07.25`	`AnonyLurk`	`The one about laws of war being silly?`
`03:07.35`	`DrodoEmpire`	`You catch on quick. :p`
`03:07.37`	`DrodoEmpire`	`Yes, that one`
`03:08.41`	`DrodoEmpire`	`You can't just throw your hands up and say "yeah well your entire fiction universe is silly and illogical" without actually addressing anything I said`
`03:09.36`	`DrodoEmpire`	`And I mean, yes, it isn't scientifically accurate, and disorganized, but your assessment's also... not great. :p`
`03:09.40`	`AnonyLurk`	`An important aside. Being a silly and illogical setting isn't necessarily a bad thing. Star Trek and Star Wars are very silly and illogical, and they're still cool settings.`
`03:09.50`	`AnonyLurk`	`Not like it's a bad thing.`
`03:10.15`	`DrodoEmpire`	`I'd suggest talking to people about it, as while yes its total fantasy its also sorta internally consistent`
`03:10.29`	`DrodoEmpire`	`I make every effort to logically justify the more excessive bits of the Drodo :p`
`03:11.05`	`AnonyLurk`	`Please define "Internally consistent".`
`03:11.37`	`DrodoEmpire`	`As in, its not all just a contrived plot device whose characteristics change as is convenient to the writers`
`03:11.50`	`DrodoEmpire`	`Hyperspace has been discussed at length, for example`
`03:12.41`	`AnonyLurk`	`Oh.`
`03:12.41`	`DrodoEmpire`	`(Star Trek phasers would be something that aren't internally consistent, as everything about them seems to vary from episode to episode in ways that're hard to logically justify)`
`03:13.13`	`DrodoEmpire`	`(SporeWiki hyperspace doesn't really suffer from that, and creative shit comes about from it :p)`
`03:13.26`	`AnonyLurk`	`I never said it wasn't internally consistent, I just meant that it's internal consistency is really silly.`
`03:13.57`	`AnonyLurk`	`Again, not a bad thing, just different from reality.`
`03:14.11`	`DrodoEmpire`	`Right, you've discovered fiction then. :p`
`03:14.30`	`AnonyLurk`	`Yeah.`
`03:14.43`	`AnonyLurk`	`Anyway.`
`03:14.47`	`AnonyLurk`	`I read too much ProjectRho.`
`03:14.49`	`DrodoEmpire`	`What's your point, ultimately? Seeing as it would turn out you can logically justify a lot of elements in the fictionverse...`
`03:15.06`	`DrodoEmpire`	`Not all, of course, some stuff is just weird and undefined`
`03:15.10`	`DrodoEmpire`	`Essence for example`
`03:15.11`	`DrodoEmpire`	`:p`
`03:15.15`	`The_Randomness`	`ugh`
`03:16.07`	`AnonyLurk`	`We don't talk about Essence.`
`03:16.14`	`AnonyLurk`	`On a more interesting note, why aren't all the ships flown by AI?`
`03:16.28`	`DrodoEmpire`	`Right, I was gonna get to that`
`03:16.59`	`DrodoEmpire`	`Most ships probably have shipboard computers or AI, but in addition to that the flesh-and-blood crew of a lot of ships are still very capable people, if that makes sense`
`03:17.21`	`DrodoEmpire`	`I believe French humans are biologically immortal, and have some sort of enhancements that improve their cognitive ability`
`03:17.27`	`DrodoEmpire`	`Making them quite bright :p`
`03:17.47`	`DrodoEmpire`	`Also AI starships are extremely vulnerable to cyberwarfare`
`03:18.01`	`DrodoEmpire`	`Its much harder to convert an entire biological crew in such a fashion`
`03:18.15`	`DrodoEmpire`	`Like they exist, but they don't make up the whole fleet by any means`
`03:18.33`	`AnonyLurk`	`Cyberwarfare how?`
`03:18.47`	`DrodoEmpire`	`How do you think?`
`03:18.56`	`AnonyLurk`	`I mean, cyberwarfare requires establishing communications to the ship, so why wouldn't the AI just shut off all external input aside from sensors.`
`03:19.10`	`DrodoEmpire`	`...Because then you can't coordinate the fleet at any level`
`03:19.23`	`DrodoEmpire`	`Chain of command collapses and the fleet ceases to be an effective fighting force`
`03:19.51`	`AnonyLurk`	`But then, why isn't the fleet a single ship.`
`03:19.56`	`AnonyLurk`	`Actually, why is there a fleet in the first place.`
`03:20.14`	`DrodoEmpire`	`...Because bringing two ships practically doubles your effectiveness?`
`03:20.20`	`AnonyLurk`	`If you can create an interstellar starship, you can create an equally effective interstellar suicide bomber.`
`03:20.28`	`DrodoEmpire`	`Uhh, no`
`03:20.33`	`AnonyLurk`	`Then just stick an AI on board, tell it to go to the enemy's star system and blow up.`
`03:20.41`	`DrodoEmpire`	`Suicide bombers lack the versatility of a starship`
`03:20.53`	`AnonyLurk`	`Versatility to accomplish what task?`
`03:20.56`	`DrodoEmpire`	`They can't hold territory or fight prolonged battles`
`03:21.09`	`DrodoEmpire`	`Hold territory, transport troops to hold territory, etc.`
`03:21.10`	`DrodoEmpire`	`Patrol`
`03:21.16`	`AnonyLurk`	`Patrol space?`
`03:21.43`	`AnonyLurk`	`Why would you hold territory in an area that's completely devoid of anything useful? The only useful territory are celestial bodies in space such as asteroids and planets.`
`03:21.44`	`DrodoEmpire`	`War isn't about destroying your enemy, its about achieving a strategic objective, be it capturing assets, or forcing them in to a diplomatic accord`
`03:21.54`	`DrodoEmpire`	`And guess what genius?`
`03:21.57`	`AnonyLurk`	`Which are impossible to hold if they can throw an interstellar bomb at you.`
`03:22.05`	`DrodoEmpire`	`Starships are great at occupying star systems`
`03:22.13`	`AnonyLurk`	`But.`
`03:22.24`	`DrodoEmpire`	`And infantry and great at hold cities`
`03:22.29`	`DrodoEmpire`	`*are great`
`03:22.56`	`DrodoEmpire`	`As for "throwing an interstellar bomb", you do realise such a device could be shot down by point-defense, or deflected?`
`03:22.57`	`AnonyLurk`	`The only useful thing in the star system are the celestial bodies in it.`
`03:23.13`	`DrodoEmpire`	`...Yes, that's the territory that must be held`
`03:23.17`	`AnonyLurk`	`If the point defense is powerful enough to shoot down the bomb, then it would ALSO be powerful enough to shoot down the enemy starship.`
`03:23.26`	`DrodoEmpire`	`Uhh`
`03:23.27`	`DrodoEmpire`	`No?`
`03:23.27`	`AnonyLurk`	`The enemy bomb is just "A starship that is explosives".`
`03:23.38`	`AnonyLurk`	`*That is full of explosives instead of weapons.`
`03:24.09`	`DrodoEmpire`	`Right, but starships can actually maneuver and fight in an organized manner, fill roles that compliment the fleet, etc.`
`03:24.22`	`DrodoEmpire`	`Rather than make a beeline toward a planet`
`03:24.22`	`DrodoEmpire`	`Also`
`03:24.27`	`DrodoEmpire`	`And I can't stress this enough`
`03:24.33`	`DrodoEmpire`	`A bomb will destroy anything planetside`
`03:24.43`	`DrodoEmpire`	`A ship can hold troops that will capture it`
`03:25.35`	`AnonyLurk`	`Capturing the enemy planet with infantry requires the enemy to not be employing a scorched earth tactic.`
`03:25.52`	`DrodoEmpire`	`Whoever said they would?`
`03:25.56`	`The_Randomness`	`^`
`03:26.00`	`DrodoEmpire`	`Where did this harebrained assumption come from?`
`03:26.05`	`DrodoEmpire`	`What sort of idiotic deflection is this?`
`03:26.17`	`AnonyLurk`	`The same reason that modern militaries employ scorched earth tactics, it's practical to do in warfare.`
`03:26.20`	`DrodoEmpire`	`This is your entire debating tactic- I beat you in one thing, you jump to the next subject`
`03:26.25`	`DrodoEmpire`	`Its bull`
`03:26.40`	`AnonyLurk`	`But then again, what is there to capture? The point of putting a city on a planet is presumably to extract resources from it, so why wouldn't you just put a automated factory run by AI on the planet instead?`
`03:26.45`	`DrodoEmpire`	`Yeah, unless that world happens to be strategically valuable`
`03:27.08`	`DrodoEmpire`	`Look, you did again`
`03:27.14`	`AnonyLurk`	`If it's strategetically valuable, that's even more reason to destroy everything on it. To prevent the enemy from getting a hold of it.`
`03:27.20`	`DrodoEmpire`	`That's dumb`
`03:27.31`	`AnonyLurk`	`*Strategically.`
`03:27.39`	`AnonyLurk`	`Why?`
`03:27.48`	`DrodoEmpire`	`Look, I can throw up bullshit as well`
`03:27.51`	`The_Randomness`	`Drodo, I'd turn down the heat a bit, but I agree with what you're saying. It seems like you're up against an army of straw men`
`03:28.04`	`DrodoEmpire`	`Consider for a moment that world is valuable for its *location&`
`03:28.16`	`DrodoEmpire`	`Its set along, say, a hyperlane`
`03:28.21`	`DrodoEmpire`	`You can't just raze it and leave`
`03:28.46`	`DrodoEmpire`	`Now are you going to continue to be an evasive weasel or are you going to address my points directly?`
`03:28.59`	`AnonyLurk`	`Chill out.`
`03:29.13`	`AnonyLurk`	`I didn't think hyperlanes existed in this universe, to start with.`
`03:29.19`	`DrodoEmpire`	`No, you're being evasive and I don't like it`
`03:29.23`	`DrodoEmpire`	`Stick a damned point`
`03:29.25`	`AnonyLurk`	`I don't see why you couldn't just raze it and leave.`
`03:29.45`	`DrodoEmpire`	`...Because you'd be conceding a valuable location to the enemy`
`03:30.01`	`AnonyLurk`	`The only situation in which you'd raze it would be a situation in which the enemy is already guaranteed to take hold of it.`
`03:30.25`	`AnonyLurk`	`You burn everything to the ground when you're about to lose, so the enemy can't use your own resources against you, not when the fight kicks off.`
`03:30.29`	`DrodoEmpire`	`Right, but this is another evasive, specific example in an attempt to disprove the rule`
`03:30.34`	`DrodoEmpire`	`You can't do that`
`03:30.37`	`DrodoEmpire`	`That's all you're doing`
`03:30.53`	`AnonyLurk`	`I literally do not see what is evasive about anything I'm doing.`
`03:30.55`	`DrodoEmpire`	`And furthermore I think you think you know more than you actually do`
`03:31.04`	`DrodoEmpire`	`I spelled it out for you`
`03:31.23`	`DrodoEmpire`	`The minute I get you on something, you try to bring up some very specific scenario to disprove the rule`
`03:31.27`	`DrodoEmpire`	`Or you change the subject entirely`
`03:31.35`	`The_Randomness`	`You're being evasive since you are failing to address any of Drodo's points`
`03:32.41`	`AnonyLurk`	`I just addressed his point, though. He said you can't raze the location because you'd be giving the valuable location to the enemy. I said that the only situation in which you WOULD raze it is if the enemy was already going to take hold of it, in which case, they'd have the valuable location whether you razed it or not and therefore you should raze it to deny them resources. Therefore, youc an raze it.`
`03:32.54`	`AnonyLurk`	`*You can.`
`03:33.41`	`DrodoEmpire`	`Right, but if we're really reduced to fighting over a very specific example, sometimes it can be better to just hold the position anyway and deal as much damage to the enemy as possible`
`03:33.54`	`DrodoEmpire`	`And again, the area is valuable for its location`
`03:34.05`	`DrodoEmpire`	`You can't raze it so much that it changes location`
`03:34.15`	`AnonyLurk`	`You could destroy the location entirely.`
`03:34.31`	`The_Randomness`	`yes, but then you lose its value entirely`
`03:34.41`	`AnonyLurk`	`But you were going to lose its value entirely anyway when the enemy captured it.`
`03:34.44`	`DrodoEmpire`	`Actually you couldn't really, not often`
`03:34.44`	`The_Randomness`	`And if there was anyone there, you probably get charged for war crimes`
`03:34.59`	`AnonyLurk`	`So stay and fight for as long as it's economically feasible, and then blow it up when you're about to lose.`
`03:35.02`	`DrodoEmpire`	`You couldn't bulldoze the himalayas, for example`
`03:35.12`	`AnonyLurk`	`Charged by what?`
`03:35.28`	`DrodoEmpire`	`Aand we've come full-circle`
`03:35.39`	`AnonyLurk`	`It would seem so.`
`03:35.43`	`DrodoEmpire`	`But look, the location of the thing itself is important`
`03:35.52`	`AnonyLurk`	`Okay.`
`03:35.54`	`DrodoEmpire`	`You're gonna have a hell of a time destroying that, assuming you even can`
`03:36.05`	`AnonyLurk`	`So.`
`03:36.12`	`AnonyLurk`	`Is the location still valuable if there isn't a planet there any more?`
`03:36.17`	`DrodoEmpire`	`Possibly`
`03:36.27`	`The_Randomness`	`hah, destroying a planet entirely. That's a good one`
`03:36.31`	`DrodoEmpire`	`If even the star system's there, it could still be valuable`
`03:36.33`	`AnonyLurk`	`I mean.`
`03:36.40`	`AnonyLurk`	`He referenced capturing the planet with ground troops.`
`03:36.46`	`DrodoEmpire`	`What if the location's an entire nebula?`
`03:36.53`	`DrodoEmpire`	`Right, that's one scenario definitelu`
`03:36.56`	`DrodoEmpire`	`*y`
`03:37.12`	`AnonyLurk`	`So then presumably there has to be something ON the planet worth capturing.`
`03:37.18`	`DrodoEmpire`	`Not necessarily`
`03:37.25`	`AnonyLurk`	`Then why would you capture the planet?`
`03:37.37`	`DrodoEmpire`	`To remove any hostile presence from the system`
`03:37.54`	`DrodoEmpire`	`Plus its just easier to set up a staging area planetside`
`03:38.02`	`DrodoEmpire`	`Why do I have to spell out basic-ass shit to you?`
`03:38.06`	`DrodoEmpire`	`For your amusement?`
`03:38.09`	`AnonyLurk`	`Why would you deploy ground troops, instead of just destroying every hostile presence in the system with extreme prejudice by virtue of suicide bombing AI starships and hypervelocity weapons?`
`03:38.25`	`AnonyLurk`	`Why do you need a staging area if you can travel interstellar distances presumably indefinitely?`
`03:38.36`	`DrodoEmpire`	`...Because artillery has a proven track record of not being able to dislodge intrenched soldiers`
`03:38.45`	`DrodoEmpire`	`...because you can't do that`
`03:38.53`	`DrodoEmpire`	`You really haven't done your homework, have you?`
`03:38.56`	`AnonyLurk`	`Why would the ship ever need to stop and refuel or whatever, instead of just going straight to the enemy position?`
`03:39.00`	`AnonyLurk`	`Enemy homeworld or whatever.`
`03:39.11`	`The_Randomness`	`Also, ships are hard to make`
`03:39.13`	`DrodoEmpire`	`...because it needs fuel, fleets need to regroup, ships need to repair`
`03:39.15`	`The_Randomness`	`Why waste them like that?`
`03:39.23`	`DrodoEmpire`	`Crews need feeding, soldiers need reloading`
`03:39.27`	`DrodoEmpire`	`This is basic military science`
`03:39.28`	`DrodoEmpire`	`You'`
`03:39.32`	`AnonyLurk`	`Okay.`
`03:39.34`	`DrodoEmpire`	`*You're an idiot`
`03:39.37`	`DrodoEmpire`	`Deliberately too`
`03:39.39`	`AnonyLurk`	`Ad Hominem.`
`03:39.41`	`AnonyLurk`	`Anyway.`
`03:39.51`	`DrodoEmpire`	`I never said your argument was wrong because you're an idiot`
`03:39.52`	`The_Randomness`	`Argument by fallacy isn't valid either`
`03:39.53`	`AnonyLurk`	`But why would you have such a military, instead of just a bunch of starships piloted by AI chock full of explosives.`
`03:40.00`	`DrodoEmpire`	`Just said you're acting like one`
`03:40.10`	`DrodoEmpire`	`...For reasons I stated above`
`03:40.20`	`DrodoEmpire`	`You dense, dense human being`
`03:40.26`	`AnonyLurk`	`To capture a planet?`
`03:40.34`	`AnonyLurk`	`The only reason you need to capture the planet, is to feed the conventional military.`
`03:40.44`	`DrodoEmpire`	`...No`
`03:40.44`	`AnonyLurk`	`So there's no reason to capture it if you don't have a conventional military to begin with.`
`03:40.49`	`DrodoEmpire`	`...No`
`03:40.52`	`The_Randomness`	`...no`
`03:40.58`	`DrodoEmpire`	`You're wrong on both counts, you goddamn snake`
`03:41.12`	`DrodoEmpire`	`I'm starting to lose my patience for you now`
`03:41.25`	`AnonyLurk`	`Then let's regroup and try to take it from the beginning.`
`03:41.32`	`AnonyLurk`	`Why does the enemy want this hypothetical planet.`
`03:41.45`	`The_Randomness`	`...he's answered that multiple times`
`03:41.47`	`DrodoEmpire`	`No, I'm not going to argue this hypothetical scenario with you`
`03:41.51`	`DrodoEmpire`	`I know your bullshit`
`03:42.07`	`AnonyLurk`	`Location?`
`03:42.50`	`DrodoEmpire`	`No, I already said, I know your bullshit- you take a specific example to disprove the rule, and then you try and apply a logically faulty rule to disprove the example`
`03:42.55`	`DrodoEmpire`	`Its dishonest`
`03:43.30`	`AnonyLurk`	`I'm not trying to be dishonest.`
`03:44.06`	`DrodoEmpire`	`When I say ships are important, you try and use an example where a ship-like bomb is important to try and disprove it. When I use an example of a strategically-valuable planet, you question why planets are even necessary, dodging the point`
`03:44.10`	`DrodoEmpire`	`But you're being dishonest`
`03:44.12`	`DrodoEmpire`	`So stop`
`03:44.41`	`AnonyLurk`	`"...he's answered that multiple times" The first time he said it needs to be captured, the second time he said it's valuable because of where it is in space. If it needs to be captured, then the enemy will destroy it before you can capture it. If it's the location, then you might as well blow up all the enemies on the planet with a suicide bomber and then move in, instead of fighting a ground war with them.`
`03:44.43`	`DrodoEmpire`	`Read a book, look over your argument, and do better next time`
`03:45.16`	`AnonyLurk`	`Well now I'm sad that the argument has had no resolution.`
`03:45.34`	`The_Randomness`	`then learn how to argue and come back >_>`
`03:45.41`	`AnonyLurk`	`That's what I've been doing.`
`03:46.13`	`DrodoEmpire`	`" If it's the location, then you might as well blow up all the enemies on the planet with a suicide bomber and then move in" - WWI taught us that that doesn't work.`
`03:46.36`	`DrodoEmpire`	`entrenched enemies can't be defeated by bombing them back to the stone age`
`03:46.43`	`DrodoEmpire`	`Again`
`03:46.54`	`DrodoEmpire`	`Read a book, maybe on military history or science`
`03:47.08`	`DrodoEmpire`	`I'm not an expert myself, but I know a thing or to`
`03:47.09`	`DrodoEmpire`	`*two`
`03:47.19`	`AnonyLurk`	`But entrenched in what?`
`03:47.22`	`AnonyLurk`	`What is there to entrench in?`
`03:47.23`	`AnonyLurk`	`The planet?`
`03:47.42`	`AnonyLurk`	`The planet ITSELF can be destroyed.`
`03:48.04`	`DrodoEmpire`	`You really don't realise the sort of power it takes to do that, don't you?`
`03:48.15`	`DrodoEmpire`	`Again`
`03:48.17`	`DrodoEmpire`	`Read a book`
`03:48.19`	`AnonyLurk`	`Hold on.`
`03:48.21`	`AnonyLurk`	`Let me check.`
`03:48.42`	`DrodoEmpire`	`For a violent, alderaan-style explosion it takes an immense amount of energy`
`03:49.04`	`DrodoEmpire`	`And if you don't achieve that then the enemy's gonna survive, safe in their sci-fi underground hyperforts`
`03:49.22`	`DrodoEmpire`	`So now you're just flatly wrong`
`03:50.42`	`AnonyLurk`	`I.`
`03:50.50`	`AnonyLurk`	`I think I got this right?`
`03:51.03`	`DrodoEmpire`	`Hm?`
`03:51.38`	`AnonyLurk`	`A spherical dyson sphere around the Earth's sun would output enough power to completely destroy, not "Render uninhabitable" but COMPLETELY DESTROY, in about eleven days.`
`03:51.44`	`AnonyLurk`	`https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=L7n9eK_v2ZM`
`03:51.55`	`AnonyLurk`	`As based on this video, referencing how much energy it would take to destroy a planet.`
`03:52.07`	`AnonyLurk`	`https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dyson_sphere`
`03:52.22`	`AnonyLurk`	`And over here, CTRL-F "A spherical shell".`
`03:52.36`	`AnonyLurk`	`Relevant part of the video around 1:52.`
`03:53.26`	`DrodoEmpire`	`Assuming that that's correct, you're still using an immense amount of energy for such a gain`
`03:53.54`	`DrodoEmpire`	`How will you direct such energy to the front lines? What weapon will do that?`
`03:54.11`	`AnonyLurk`	`A laser would work.`
`03:54.17`	`DrodoEmpire`	`That would be an unmitigated logistical nightmare.`
`03:54.19`	`AnonyLurk`	`But this is also assuming the most brute-force method of destroying the planet.`
`03:54.40`	`AnonyLurk`	`It would require significantly less energy to, say, destroy everything on the planet's surface to a depth of a mile.`
`03:54.56`	`DrodoEmpire`	`That would be the equivalent of the French pouring literally every last shell, grenade, bullet, and stick of dynamite in to the German lines at Verdun`
`03:55.11`	`DrodoEmpire`	`AnonyLurk: Which wouldn't work`
`03:55.32`	`AnonyLurk`	`Space is not the battlefields of WWI.`
`03:55.41`	`DrodoEmpire`	`No, but the principles are the exact same`
`03:55.52`	`DrodoEmpire`	`Entrenched enemies are not defeated by artillery or air power alone`
`03:56.00`	`DrodoEmpire`	`This has been proven time and time again`
`03:56.05`	`DrodoEmpire`	`For centuries`
`03:56.24`	`AnonyLurk`	`I don't agree, when it would only take eleven days worth of energy to completely destroy not only the entrenched enemies, but everything they're standing on.`
`03:56.31`	`DrodoEmpire`	`Only?`
`03:56.41`	`DrodoEmpire`	`Only eleven days worth of a star's output?`
`03:56.50`	`DrodoEmpire`	`You have zero sense of scale`
`03:57.06`	`DrodoEmpire`	`Think of the logistical strain of transporting that sorta energy to the front`
`03:58.10`	`DrodoEmpire`	`Your solution is entirely impractical, and very fragile`
`03:58.28`	`DrodoEmpire`	`Such a plan could be disrupted easily by a wily enemy`
`03:58.56`	`DrodoEmpire`	`And think of it this way- at the strategic level, all that fortification must do is delay`
`03:59.07`	`AnonyLurk`	`You could perhaps convert the energy to antimatter and then transport that to the front, and blow it up?`
`03:59.18`	`AnonyLurk`	`There's also a massive logistical strain of transporting troops, ships, food and such to the front.`
`03:59.27`	`DrodoEmpire`	`An eleven-day delay, holding up a significant portion of the enemy army, is a huge boon to a general`
`03:59.30`	`AnonyLurk`	`I'm saying it'd be cheaper to just send robots with explosives.`
`03:59.37`	`DrodoEmpire`	`And that wouldn't work`
`03:59.46`	`AnonyLurk`	`It's not an eleven-day delay if the species you're at war with can store that amount of energy.`
`03:59.48`	`DrodoEmpire`	`And I'd like to see this magical conversion take place`
`03:59.57`	`AnonyLurk`	`It can store it in peace time and draw it out as needed.`
`04:00.07`	`DrodoEmpire`	`You'd still need to bring this immense amount of antimatter to the front, from facilities that produce it`
`04:00.08`	`AnonyLurk`	`I'm trying to find out what the modern efficiency rate of energy-to-antimatter is.`
`04:00.18`	`DrodoEmpire`	`That's easily intercepted`
`04:00.22`	`DrodoEmpire`	`The enemy could crush you`
`04:00.30`	`AnonyLurk`	`But that's WAY cheaper in terms of transportation costs than transporting troops and guns to the front.`
`04:00.42`	`DrodoEmpire`	`...Its also not a replacement`
`04:01.43`	`AnonyLurk`	`Okay.`
`04:02.04`	`AnonyLurk`	`So assuming space logic, and energy can be converted to antimatter at 100% efficiency.`
`04:02.21`	`AnonyLurk`	`Which is silly, it'd be more like 10%, but then it just takes ten times as long to create the weapon.`
`04:02.32`	`DrodoEmpire`	`just takes ten times as long?`
`04:02.36`	`DrodoEmpire`	`Again, that's huge`
`04:02.39`	`AnonyLurk`	`Ten times as long in peace time.`
`04:02.48`	`AnonyLurk`	`You produce these weapons in peace time, in preparation for war.`
`04:02.56`	`AnonyLurk`	`Like normal weapons.`
`04:03.01`	`DrodoEmpire`	`That's ten times the time for the enemy to learn of it via espionage`
`04:03.01`	`AnonyLurk`	`Only cheaper.`
`04:03.17`	`DrodoEmpire`	`Also nowhere near as versitile and far more vulnerale`
`04:03.19`	`DrodoEmpire`	`*able`
`04:03.28`	`DrodoEmpire`	`Again, read a fucking book and then come back and talk to me`
`04:03.35`	`AnonyLurk`	`What book.`
`04:03.36`	`AnonyLurk`	`Honestly.`
`04:03.46`	`AnonyLurk`	`What great education have you undergone that makes you oh-so-more qualified than me.`
`04:03.54`	`AnonyLurk`	`This is why I prefer Anony-mous communication.`
`04:04.07`	`DrodoEmpire`	`Anything related to military science or history, frankly`
`04:04.17`	`DrodoEmpire`	`The Art of War would make a decent start`
`04:04.25`	`DrodoEmpire`	`Learning about the history of war would be great as well`
`04:04.29`	`AnonyLurk`	`I did read that.`
`04:04.49`	`DrodoEmpire`	`As for my qualifications? I just read, I have no degree in this.`
`04:05.04`	`DrodoEmpire`	`But its something I take great interest in`
`04:05.22`	`AnonyLurk`	`Also, it turns out it would take a week to output the necessary energy, not eleven days.`
`04:05.23`	`AnonyLurk`	`https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=L7n9eK_v2ZM`
`04:05.25`	`AnonyLurk`	`4:32.`
`04:05.32`	`DrodoEmpire`	`The history of WWI and the tactics of it are particularly relevant to this discussion`
`04:06.20`	`DrodoEmpire`	`That's still a week`
`04:06.33`	`DrodoEmpire`	`And that's still transporting this little weapon of yours across a long supply line`
`04:06.41`	`AnonyLurk`	`Hold on.`
`04:06.44`	`AnonyLurk`	`What supply line?`
`04:06.51`	`DrodoEmpire`	`You're just saying "muh superweapon" and not addressing my point`
`04:06.56`	`AnonyLurk`	`You don't need a supply line with this.`
`04:07.02`	`DrodoEmpire`	`The supply lines every military operation has had`
`04:07.06`	`DrodoEmpire`	`...Yes, it does`
`04:07.14`	`AnonyLurk`	`To supply what?`
`04:07.16`	`DrodoEmpire`	`You can't send this thing unsupported`
`04:07.28`	`AnonyLurk`	`It's a spaceship flown by a robot that's full of antimatter, it's going to literally run into the planet to detonate itself.`
`04:07.31`	`DrodoEmpire`	`Spare parts, ammunition, communication to and from the front, etc.`
`04:07.38`	`AnonyLurk`	`What needs to be supplied to this thing?`
`04:08.04`	`DrodoEmpire`	`Then it just may break down, or, more reasonably, be intercepted by starships`
`04:08.25`	`AnonyLurk`	`Be intercepted by starships at what point?`
`04:08.27`	`DrodoEmpire`	`Your repeating this same damn argument as if its any good`
`04:08.27`	`DrodoEmpire`	`I`
`04:08.29`	`AnonyLurk`	`When it's travelling at interstellar velocities?`
`04:08.33`	`DrodoEmpire`	`...Yes`
`04:08.42`	`DrodoEmpire`	`Interstellar combat is very common in SporeWiki`
`04:08.48`	`AnonyLurk`	`Okay.`
`04:08.49`	`DrodoEmpire`	`In fact, hyperspatial combat exists`
`04:08.54`	`AnonyLurk`	`I'm going to assume this is happening in hyperspace.`
`04:09.00`	`DrodoEmpire`	`*I've disproven this argument fifty damn times`
`04:09.03`	`AnonyLurk`	`Because I just realized that "Interstellar velocities" is silly, so, hyperspace.`
`04:09.08`	`AnonyLurk`	`If this ship can be intercepted.`
`04:09.11`	`DrodoEmpire`	`You can't make a fleet of missiles`
`04:09.18`	`AnonyLurk`	`Then so can a conventional starship.`
`04:09.23`	`AnonyLurk`	`So therefore.`
`04:09.29`	`AnonyLurk`	`Stick a lot of armor, shields, and point defense on it.`
`04:09.41`	`AnonyLurk`	`It will have a higher likelihood of reaching its destination in fighting condition than a traditional fleet.`
`04:09.48`	`AnonyLurk`	`Assuming it was going to be intercepted.`
`04:09.53`	`DrodoEmpire`	`It lacks any ability to hold territory, maneuver, etc.`
`04:10.04`	`AnonyLurk`	`There is no reason to hold territory.`
`04:10.12`	`DrodoEmpire`	`There is in every goddamn war`
`04:10.25`	`DrodoEmpire`	`If you don't hold territory, the enemy will reclaim it and continue its advance`
`04:10.33`	`DrodoEmpire`	`And destruction of the enemy is not the goal of any way`
`04:10.35`	`DrodoEmpire`	`*war'`
`04:10.39`	`AnonyLurk`	`There will be no territory if the weapon detonates.`
`04:10.47`	`AnonyLurk`	`It will be completely annihilated.`
`04:10.50`	`DrodoEmpire`	`If you really read the Art of War, you'd know this shit`
`04:10.57`	`DrodoEmpire`	`And what advantage do you get from that?`
`04:11.02`	`DrodoEmpire`	`Wars of destruction don't end well`
`04:11.04`	`DrodoEmpire`	`They never do`
`04:11.09`	`AnonyLurk`	`What advantage to you have from taking control of the territory?`
`04:11.10`	`DrodoEmpire`	`They have no strategic objective in mind`
`04:11.19`	`AnonyLurk`	`I can't find a reason to hold the territory if you don't GIVE a reason for the territory to be valuable.`
`04:11.26`	`DrodoEmpire`	`...Really.`
`04:11.33`	`AnonyLurk`	`You've just said "You always need to hold territory in war because that's how it's always been!"`
`04:11.51`	`DrodoEmpire`	`I refuse to believe you are this fucking stupid, to not know why gaining more assets and territory are important`
`04:12.05`	`DrodoEmpire`	`No, its because its obvious to people that aren't stunned`
`04:12.14`	`AnonyLurk`	`I mean.`
`04:12.25`	`AnonyLurk`	`I'm going to go out on a limb and say it's so you can get something off the planet, surely.`
`04:12.31`	`AnonyLurk`	`Like some material or ancient alien artifact, or something.`
`04:12.32`	`AnonyLurk`	`Surely.`
`04:12.42`	`AnonyLurk`	`I have to make an assumption about this because you haven't provided a reason.`
`04:12.51`	`DrodoEmpire`	`That's part of it, but also population to tax, access to trade routes, and a million other reasons`
`04:13.20`	`AnonyLurk`	`There.`
`04:13.20`	`DrodoEmpire`	`In your attempt to question the very basework of fucking politics and military science you've made yourself look like an evasive snake denser than lead`
`04:13.24`	`AnonyLurk`	`There are no trade routes in space.`
`04:13.28`	`DrodoEmpire`	`...Yes there are`
`04:13.31`	`AnonyLurk`	`No.`
`04:13.32`	`AnonyLurk`	`There aren't.`
`04:13.34`	`DrodoEmpire`	`...Yes there are`
`04:13.34`	`AnonyLurk`	`Why would there be.`
`04:13.36`	`AnonyLurk`	`Why.`
`04:13.39`	`DrodoEmpire`	`Because of hyperlanes`
`04:13.42`	`DrodoEmpire`	`Do your fucking homework`
`04:13.56`	`AnonyLurk`	`Why does a planet need to be there for the hyperlane to work.`
`04:14.03`	`DrodoEmpire`	`You can't come in here and expect to be taken seriously when you refuse to even research anything`
`04:14.10`	`DrodoEmpire`	`...As a stop`
`04:14.15`	`AnonyLurk`	`Why do you need to stop.`
`04:14.24`	`DrodoEmpire`	`BECAUSE SHIPS NEED SUPPLIES`
`04:14.33`	`DrodoEmpire`	`You evasive little rat`
`04:14.34`	`Quark8`	`Night.`
`04:14.35`	`AnonyLurk`	`Why do the ships need supplies.`
`04:14.44`	`AnonyLurk`	`When the crew can be put in cryosleep, and the ship can be flown by a robot.`
`04:14.52`	`AnonyLurk`	`The only purpose of a ship is to transport cargo.`
`04:14.57`	`DrodoEmpire`	`And the ship needs fuel and spare parts`
`04:15.10`	`DrodoEmpire`	`Now I'm done because you're actually being dense just to be dense`
`04:15.15`	`DrodoEmpire`	`I`
`04:15.26`	`AnonyLurk`	`Fuel and spare parts.`
`04:15.27`	`DrodoEmpire`	`*I would strongly recommend leaving and not returning, because this isn`
`04:15.30`	`AnonyLurk`	`Okay, fair enough.`
`04:15.34`	`DrodoEmpire`	`*isn't the first time you've pulled this shit`
`04:15.57`	`AnonyLurk`	`I really can't understand how people can get this angry over banter.`
`04:16.02`	`AnonyLurk`	`It's not like this is a personal attack.`
`04:16.16`	`AnonyLurk`	`I'm trying to run you through my train of logic so you can understand my point of view, while also trying to follow yours.`
`04:16.23`	`AnonyLurk`	`So both of us can verify that the other is thinking correctly.`
`04:16.28`	`AnonyLurk`	`This is the point of an argument.`
`04:16.56`	`AnonyLurk`	`Fuel and spare parts.`
`04:17.06`	`DrodoEmpire`	`Sounds innocent enough, but you're also making stupid assumptions the entire way through as if to push a point`
`04:17.36`	`AnonyLurk`	`If it's travelling through space, or hyperspace, I don't think it needs fuel.`
`04:17.43`	`AnonyLurk`	`See, on an ocean, the ship has to constantly burn fuel to stay in motion.`
`04:17.59`	`DrodoEmpire`	`If you actually wanted came here to have a discussion or a serious argument, you'd do a bit of homework and you'd not run me around in circles`
`04:18.02`	`AnonyLurk`	`But in space, it can burn a certain amount of fuel and simply continue moving in that direction ad infinitum, there's nothing to slow it down so inertia just carries it.`
`04:18.15`	`AnonyLurk`	`The amount of fuel you burn only determines the amount of time it takes to get to your destination.`
`04:18.26`	`DrodoEmpire`	`*wanted to come here`
`04:18.42`	`AnonyLurk`	`Spare parts.`
`04:19.20`	`AnonyLurk`	`Conventional spacecraft build with mere 21st century human technology don't need to pick up spare parts or fuel in transit, so I find it unlikely that super future technology travelling through hyperspace would suddenly need fuel and spare parts.`
`04:19.45`	`AnonyLurk`	`Even if the distances were greater, the need for such things will be mitigated, first by hyperspace making the distances relatively smaller, and more advanced technology reducing the need for spare parts and fuel.`
`04:20.22`	`AnonyLurk`	`It is important to keep in mind, that the purpose of any spacecraft is to move a payload to a destination.`
`04:20.37`	`AnonyLurk`	`In the case of merchant vessels, presumably the ones in 'need' of trade routes, that payload is cargo.`
`04:21.03`	`AnonyLurk`	`But I don't think the merchant vessel will need to stop along trade routes to pick up more fuel and spare parts, because contemporary spacecraft don't need to do that.`
`04:21.10`	`AnonyLurk`	`So there are no trade routes in space.`
`04:23.20`	`AnonyLurk`	`There.`
`04:23.47`	`AnonyLurk`	`I didn't evade or weasel around you argument at all, I went right up against it and tried my darnedest to refute it.`
`04:24.43`	`DrodoEmpire`	`To your credit, you didn't this time`
`04:25.07`	`DrodoEmpire`	`But you're still wrong, and you still refused to actually research`
`04:25.21`	`DrodoEmpire`	`For someone who passes judgement on the fictionverse, you really haven't read enough of it`
`04:25.52`	`DrodoEmpire`	`http://spore.wikia.com/wiki/SporeWiki:Fiction_Universe/Important_Topics/Hyperspace`
`04:27.02`	`DrodoEmpire`	`Hyperlanes are strips of hyperspace that lack a disruptive "fog", and are, in this universe, valuable as FTL is easier (even simply possible) along them`
`04:27.36`	`DrodoEmpire`	`These constitute routes along space`
`04:40.25`	`AnonyLurk`	`[21:13] <AnonyLurk> Why does a planet need to be there for the hyperlane to work.`
`04:40.29`	`AnonyLurk`	`[21:14] <DrodoEmpire> ...As a stop`
`04:40.40`	`AnonyLurk`	`I was trying to demonstrate that you don't need a stop.`
`04:40.48`	`AnonyLurk`	`Therefore you don't need the planet.`
`04:41.03`	`AnonyLurk`	`So, there are sort-of trade routes in space, just not in the sense that I think you're thinking of them.`
`04:41.19`	`DrodoEmpire`	`No, they're exactly in the way I'm thinking of them`
`04:41.51`	`AnonyLurk`	`The ship doesn't need to stop.`
`04:42.06`	`DrodoEmpire`	`It does, but more importantly the crew needs to`
`04:42.27`	`AnonyLurk`	`Not if you put the crew to cryosleep.`
`04:42.33`	`DrodoEmpire`	`You still need a stop- ships will need to reprovision with things such as food and spare parts (I doubt the advancement of technology and increasing complexity reduces the needs for maintenance)`
`04:42.43`	`DrodoEmpire`	`Running a modern warship is extremely difficult`
`04:42.55`	`AnonyLurk`	`We're talking about merchant ships, not warships right now.`
`04:43.03`	`DrodoEmpire`	`any ship`
`04:43.08`	`AnonyLurk`	`We're also talking about rockets, not ocean ships.`
`04:43.12`	`AnonyLurk`	`The two are very different.`
`04:43.16`	`DrodoEmpire`	`...No, not rockets`
`04:43.21`	`AnonyLurk`	`No, yes rockets.`
`04:43.25`	`AnonyLurk`	`That's what a spaceship is, it's a rocket.`
`04:43.28`	`DrodoEmpire`	`Again, you have no clue what SW ships are like`
`04:43.43`	`AnonyLurk`	`It's not an ocean ship put into space, it's a long-term use single stage rocket.`
`04:43.48`	`AnonyLurk`	`With a lot of stuff added on.`
`04:43.48`	`DrodoEmpire`	`And these are still 'rockets' that need to have a crew, navigation, etc.`
`04:44.02`	`DrodoEmpire`	`That all needs maintenance`
`04:44.05`	`DrodoEmpire`	`Just- you're wrong`
`04:44.09`	`DrodoEmpire`	`You're dense, too`
`04:44.12`	`AnonyLurk`	`I'm trying to say that the ship won't need to stop along the route, because you can put the crew to sleep and have a robot do the navigation.`
`04:44.18`	`DrodoEmpire`	`You haven't done your research`
`04:44.27`	`AnonyLurk`	`I read the page on Hyperspace.`
`04:44.35`	`AnonyLurk`	`If that's what you mean.`
`04:45.09`	`DrodoEmpire`	`But the crew will need waking up, to unload the ship, in case of a crisis, so on`
`04:45.28`	`DrodoEmpire`	`But there's other shit you need to read`
`04:45.56`	`DrodoEmpire`	`Starships are and will be, undoubtedly, extremely complex`
`04:46.13`	`DrodoEmpire`	`Complex devices require lots of maintenace`
`04:46.14`	`DrodoEmpire`	`*ance`
`04:46.28`	`DrodoEmpire`	`Maintenance uses up resources, and resources need to come from somewhere`
`04:46.46`	`DrodoEmpire`	`Its not "just a rocket with some stuff slapped on", that's not the design philosophy`
`04:46.54`	`DrodoEmpire`	`Your assumption is wrong`
`04:47.17`	`AnonyLurk`	`Okay.`
`04:47.19`	`AnonyLurk`	`Let me rephrase.`
`04:47.25`	`AnonyLurk`	`It doesn't need to stop until it reaches its destination.`
`04:47.31`	`DrodoEmpire`	`Crews need feeding, crews need downtime, stuff needs unloading, and ships'll need to grab supplies`
`04:47.37`	`DrodoEmpire`	`Sometimes they will though!`
`04:47.39`	`AnonyLurk`	`It can perform any necessary maintenance at the port it's delivering its cargo to.`
`04:47.47`	`AnonyLurk`	`Again, why?`
`04:47.58`	`AnonyLurk`	`You're just assuming that starships will need lots of maintenance because "They're complex".`
`04:48.01`	`DrodoEmpire`	`[01:47] <DrodoEmpire> Crews need feeding, crews need downtime, stuff needs unloading, and ships'll need to grab supplies`
`04:48.09`	`DrodoEmpire`	`...Because complex things need maintenanc`
`04:48.10`	`DrodoEmpire`	`*e`
`04:48.10`	`AnonyLurk`	`Crews don't need feeding in cryosleep.`
`04:48.16`	`AnonyLurk`	`They don't need downtime in cryosleep.`
`04:48.19`	`DrodoEmpire`	`Cars need maintenance, lots of it`
`04:48.27`	`DrodoEmpire`	`But you can';t keep them there for ever`
`04:48.28`	`AnonyLurk`	`They don't need unloading until they reach their destination.`
`04:48.34`	`AnonyLurk`	`They don't need supplies until they reach their destination.`
`04:48.34`	`DrodoEmpire`	`Cars are very complex`
`04:48.39`	`DrodoEmpire`	`So're starships`
`04:48.46`	`DrodoEmpire`	`To use an example`
`04:48.58`	`AnonyLurk`	`Cars are subject to degrading environmental conditions, such as the atmosphere.`
`04:49.17`	`AnonyLurk`	`Once the starship fires its engines in the correct direction, it literally has to do nothing but sit and look pretty until it has to brake.`
`04:49.19`	`DrodoEmpire`	`And starship parts can degrade with usage or simple mechanical failure`
`04:49.39`	`DrodoEmpire`	`Except that's not what the only thing it'd be doing`
`04:49.59`	`AnonyLurk`	`It's a merchant ship, it just has to go from point A to point B and carry stuff to and fro.`
`04:50.03`	`AnonyLurk`	`*Carry stuff there and back.`
`04:50.16`	`AnonyLurk`	`It's a single stage rocket with a cargo hold and a lot of futuristic addons.`
`04:50.36`	`DrodoEmpire`	`No it isn't! That design philosophy is reductionist and incorrect`
`04:50.43`	`DrodoEmpire`	`Stop repeating shit`
`04:50.54`	`DrodoEmpire`	`Now, back to planets`
`04:51.43`	`DrodoEmpire`	`Planets'll be destinations, stops on especially long journeys (or maybe the crew just wants to stop), and also the if one is crossing a border, ship'll likely need to stop and register or be checke`
`04:51.45`	`DrodoEmpire`	`*d`
`04:52.41`	`DrodoEmpire`	`SW ships are clearly very complex things that're better compared to sea ships than rockets`
`04:52.47`	`AnonyLurk`	`(or maybe the crew just wants to stop) The crew doesn't want to stop in cryosleep.`
`04:52.48`	`DrodoEmpire`	`That's the design philosophy for them`
`04:52.57`	`AnonyLurk`	`and also the if one is crossing a border There are no borders in space.`
`04:53.01`	`DrodoEmpire`	`THE CREW WILL NOT WANT TO REMAIN IN CRYOSLEEP`
`04:53.03`	`DrodoEmpire`	`FOR EVER`
`04:53.09`	`AnonyLurk`	`ship'll likely need to stop and register or be checke It will do that at its destination.`
`04:53.11`	`DrodoEmpire`	`THERE ARE`
`04:53.21`	`AnonyLurk`	`stops on especially long journeys There is no reason to stop.`
`04:53.23`	`DrodoEmpire`	`In SW, there are absolutely borders`
`04:53.28`	`AnonyLurk`	`Until you reach your destination.`
`04:53.29`	`DrodoEmpire`	`Look at a fucking map`
`04:53.52`	`DrodoEmpire`	`There is reason to stop, because there may be mechanical failures, and supplies'll be used`
`04:54.00`	`DrodoEmpire`	`And all this 8assumes* the crew will remain in cryosleep`
`04:54.07`	`AnonyLurk`	`Why wouldn't they?`
`04:54.08`	`DrodoEmpire`	`Which I doubt`
`04:54.19`	`AnonyLurk`	`Their job is to go from A to B and unload stuff at both destinations, and haggle.`
`04:54.22`	`AnonyLurk`	`They're merchants.`
`04:54.34`	`DrodoEmpire`	`Hyperspace is rather fast, and it depends on the tech`
`04:54.51`	`AnonyLurk`	`Please rephrase that.`
`04:55.37`	`AnonyLurk`	`I know it's a simple sentence but I don't see any point to it, it doesn't invalidate anything I said.`
`04:55.48`	`DrodoEmpire`	`Cryotech may not work with all species/individuals, and people may have qualms about using it`
`04:55.59`	`DrodoEmpire`	`Now listen, I've tried stopping this bullshit earlier and it didn't work`
`04:56.03`	`DrodoEmpire`	`But you're wasting my time`
`04:56.12`	`AnonyLurk`	`Then they'll get put out of business by people who don't have qualms and species and individuals who don't have problems.`
`04:56.28`	`DrodoEmpire`	`Read the wiki, read some military history, and then maybe we'll have a char`
`04:56.31`	`DrodoEmpire`	`*chat`
`04:56.39`	`AnonyLurk`	`Well now you're just quitting.`
`04:56.52`	`The_Randomness`	`...`
`04:57.01`	`AnonyLurk`	`Here.`
`04:57.01`	`DrodoEmpire`	`Are you trying to goad me back in?`
`04:57.08`	`AnonyLurk`	`Since you had me read the thing on Hyperspace.`
`04:57.10`	`AnonyLurk`	`I ask you to read this.`
`04:57.11`	`AnonyLurk`	`http://www.projectrho.com/public_html/rocket/misconceptions.php`
`04:58.00`	`The_Randomness`	`Alright, what's your point with this?`
`04:58.56`	`DrodoEmpire`	`This offensively-gaudy little page of your assumes a super-hard sci-fi universe`
`04:58.58`	`DrodoEmpire`	`Which SW isn't`
`04:59.25`	`DrodoEmpire`	`I thought you said applying logic to the fictionverse was an "exercise in futility"- which isn't true, but applying real world stuff like this is`
`04:59.29`	`DrodoEmpire`	`Because SW works a bit differently`
`04:59.42`	`AnonyLurk`	`Read the whole thing, please, before making comment on it.`
`04:59.49`	`AnonyLurk`	`As I've done you the same courtesy.`
`05:00.02`	`The_Randomness`	`I read all of it, and I don't get the point you're trying to make with it`
`05:00.08`	`AnonyLurk`	`Seriously?`
`05:00.09`	`AnonyLurk`	`Damn.`
`05:00.25`	`AnonyLurk`	`Fast reader, that was less than two minutes.`
`05:00.32`	`AnonyLurk`	`I doubt your veracity but can't disprove it.`
`05:00.35`	`AnonyLurk`	`Anywho.`
`05:00.42`	`The_Randomness`	`Look, learn to argue or don't at all`
`05:00.49`	`DrodoEmpire`	`AnonyLurk: I'`
`05:00.54`	`The_Randomness`	`And if you try to press this any further, either of you, you're getting the boot`
`05:01.07`	`AnonyLurk`	`What else is the chat going to do, honestly, sit here and be a blank page?`
`05:01.22`	`DrodoEmpire`	`*I'd say the same of your suspiciously-fast reading of the hyperspace page, but I figured I'd be nice`
`05:01.25`	`AnonyLurk`	`That's what it is 90% of the time, at least this way it's doing something.`
`05:01.35`	`The_Randomness`	`Right, but this isn't constructive`
`05:01.35`	`DrodoEmpire`	`No, you just come on late`
`05:09.21`	`AnonyLurk`	`It was getting constructive, though.`
`05:09.54`	`AnonyLurk`	`Now I am left only with a feeling of disappointment, and no right to complain. I could've just played video games for the past two hours instead.`
`05:11.24`	`The_Randomness`	`I don't have time for this, and don't complain about it either since you're the one that refused to acknowledge our points, instead you wasted your time rejecting them and offering refutations that failed to take into account the world discussed`
`05:14.13`	`AnonyLurk`	`I refrained from profanity and insulting the character of my interlocutor, which is more than I can say of he.`
`05:14.57`	`DrodoEmpire`	`Right, but I was honest in my debating and knew my shit a bit better`
`05:15.06`	`The_Randomness`	`Indeed`
`05:15.12`	`DrodoEmpire`	`That's what real maturity looks like. Being polite is superficial.`
`05:15.49`	`The_Randomness`	`But despite Drodo trying to point that out to you, you pressed on. Yes, he probably shouldn't have done that, but I can't blame him with how far you pushed it.`
`05:16.24`	`The_Randomness`	`Yes, the channel would have been quiet, but that is not necessarily a bad thing.`
`05:18.59`	`AnonyLurk`	`I still don't see what I did dishonestly. If I legitimately was dishonest, then that is a failure of my competence and not of my character as I have endeavored to the best of my ability to retain honesty.`
`05:19.49`	`DrodoEmpire`	`You constantly shifted the argument around, and demanded that I spell things out to an unreasonable extent many, many times`
`05:20.06`	`AnonyLurk`	`I would also say, that by the end of the debate your statement could be reversed. He seemed to be rejecting my points off-hand toward the end there, particularly during the discussion of trade routes.`
`05:21.03`	`The_Randomness`	`Right, but that was only after repeated attempts to explain the problems with your argument`
`05:22.12`	`*** join/#sporewiki Spluff5 (ae188812@gateway/web/freenode/ip.174.24.136.18)`
`05:22.27`	`AnonyLurk`	`You missed everything, Splufferoo.`
`05:22.37`	`AnonyLurk`	`*Missed it.`
`05:22.55`	`AnonyLurk`	`Again, if that was the case, then it was a failure of competence and not character.`
`05:22.55`	`Spluff5`	`What happened?`
`05:22.56`	`DrodoEmpire`	`Thankfully, as it got rather messy`
`05:22.58`	`DrodoEmpire`	`Argument`
`05:23.02`	`The_Randomness`	`Don't drag him through the mud too`
`05:23.04`	`AnonyLurk`	`I will pastebin it for you.`
`05:23.06`	`Spluff5`	`About what?`
`05:23.08`	`DrodoEmpire`	`Don't`
`05:23.10`	`DrodoEmpire`	`Don't Anon`
`05:23.12`	`AnonyLurk`	`Spaec.`
`05:23.15`	`DrodoEmpire`	`Its not his argument`
`05:23.16`	`The_Randomness`	`Yeah, don't do that`
`05:23.40`	`Spluff5`	`Oh my Glob you guys, drama bomb!`
`05:23.47`	`AnonyLurk`	`Why.`
`05:23.57`	`DrodoEmpire`	`Spluff is keemstar in disguise 2016`
`05:23.57`	`AnonyLurk`	`I kind of want a wholly neutral point of view on this.`
`05:24.14`	`Spluff5`	`How dare you call me Keemstar!`
`05:24.15`	`DrodoEmpire`	`Its not worth getting him involved`
`05:24.24`	`DrodoEmpire`	`You're wrong, and Random is an admin that has final say anyhow`
`05:24.38`	`DrodoEmpire`	`For that matter, I'm staff as well but I wouldn't appeal to my own authority`
`05:24.50`	`AnonyLurk`	`Bless you for it.`
`05:25.01`	`AnonyLurk`	`This is why I prefer arguing anonymously.`
`05:26.13`	`Spluff5`	`Wow, sounds heated`
`05:26.25`	`DrodoEmpire`	`It was`
`05:26.57`	`AnonyLurk`	`For one of us.`
`05:27.07`	`The_Randomness`	`Alright, that's it.`
`05:27.09`	`*** mode/#sporewiki [+q AnonyLurk!@] by The_Randomness`
`05:27.35`	`Spluff5`	`Anyway`
`05:27.37`	`*** join/#sporewiki AnonyLurk (44048e73@gateway/web/freenode/ip.68.4.142.115)`
`05:27.56`	`DrodoEmpire`	`Ahh, thought he was a genius`
`05:28.03`	`*** join/#sporewiki AnonyLurk2 (44048e73@gateway/web/freenode/ip.68.4.142.115)`
`05:28.05`	`AnonyLurk2`	`Fair enough.`
`05:28.13`	`*** mode/#sporewiki [+q !@gateway/web/freenode/ip.68.4.142.115] by The_Randomness`
`05:28.15`	`DrodoEmpire`	`Ahh, defying the admin's decision?`
`05:28.18`	`DrodoEmpire`	`Naughty. :p`
`05:28.47`	`The_Randomness`	`sigh`
`05:28.50`	`Spluff5`	`What's his species/empire?`
`05:28.52`	`The_Randomness`	`I'm not used to doing that`
`05:28.59`	`*** join/#sporewiki James_Dean (44048e73@gateway/web/freenode/ip.68.4.142.115)`
`05:29.07`	`The_Randomness`	`He's not actually involved, just sits here and judges`
`05:29.12`	`DrodoEmpire`	`^`
`05:29.46`	`Spluff5`	`Ah, a Verlisify`
`05:30.05`	`DrodoEmpire`	`Who?`
`05:30.31`	`Spluff5`	`Nevermind, very specific joke for a very specific fandom`
`05:30.38`	`DrodoEmpire`	`ahh, fair enough`
`05:32.50`	`The_Randomness`	`I don't like doing that sort of stuff >_>`
`05:34.21`	`Spluff5`	`What?`
`05:34.34`	`DrodoEmpire`	`steps beside The_Randomness, a sly smile spreads on his face as an ominous soundtrack swells; "You... Did enjoy the power, didn't you?" he asked, his voice laced with venom and darkness.`
`05:34.36`	`The_Randomness`	`Actually using my op powers`
`05:34.58`	`Spluff5`	`Oh`
`05:34.59`	`DrodoEmpire`	`Come to the dark side`
`05:35.00`	`DrodoEmpire`	`<.<`
`05:35.11`	`Spluff5`	`I heard you have mini-muffins`
`05:35.20`	`DrodoEmpire`	`Indeed`
`05:36.46`	`Spluff5`	`How does the whole ID date thing work?`
`05:37.04`	`DrodoEmpire`	`How do you mean?`
`05:37.08`	`DrodoEmpire`	`The DI's date system?`
`05:37.40`	`*** join/#sporewiki James_Dean (a6aa0e59@gateway/web/freenode/ip.166.170.14.89)`
`05:37.45`	`James_Dean`	`I'm a bad boy. Ride motorcycles and smoke cigarettes in my leather jacket. Wanna come home with me tonight, baby? THE RIGHT TO FREEDOM OF SPEECH SHALL NOT BE INFRINGED. HE CAN CHOOSE NOT TO READ IT ANYWAY. http://pastebin.com/qWgrg1JD http://imgur.com/5lCKy94 I will admit that last barb was pointless though. Man, this reminds me of my ROBLOX days.`
`05:37.50`	`James_Dean`	`NO REGRETS!`
`05:38.03`	`The_Randomness`	`oh look, you've learned how to change your IP`
`05:38.25`	`James_Dean`	`Nah, just got a phone.`
`05:38.27`	`The_Randomness`	`Well done, I guess`
`05:38.30`	`DrodoEmpire`	`You're making yourself look real good, you muppet.`
`05:38.48`	`James_Dean`	`Rides motorcycle into the sunset, a hooker under either arm.`
`05:38.51`	`Spluff5`	`And not a popular one either like Beaker`
`05:38.59`	`DrodoEmpire`	`Indeed <.<`
`05:39.07`	`James_Dean`	`He-Man theme plays softly in the background.`
`05:39.19`	`*** mode/#sporewiki [+b !@gateway/web/freenode/ip.166.170.14.89] by The_Randomness`
`05:39.32`	`*** mode/#sporewiki [+b !@gateway/web/freenode/ip.68.4.142.115] by The_Randomness`
`05:40.22`	`DrodoEmpire`	`What're you trying to prove, anyway? That you can alienate an entire IRC channel as opposed to one user?`
`05:40.56`	`DrodoEmpire`	`You're not doing yourself any favours`
`05:41.25`	`Spluff5`	`It's getting a bit annoying, and I wasn't even involved.`
`05:42.08`	`*** kick/#sporewiki [James_Dean!~chatzilla@2601:441:1:5b80:1154:6c03:f1ab:8d0] by The_Randomness (James_Dean)`
`05:42.28`	`The_Randomness`	`sigh`
`05:42.41`	`DrodoEmpire`	`https://i.gyazo.com/06535b2a3e2721524adb0697e938bef4.png Found James' alter-ego`
`05:43.12`	`The_Randomness`	`Mind letting the other admins know about this guy? I need to go to bed`
`05:43.24`	`DrodoEmpire`	`Yep, I can`
`05:43.34`	`Spluff5`	`https://lh4.googleusercontent.com/-N1n17vG4a0M/AAAAAAAAAAI/AAAAAAAAAHA/CpJK8yC2kmA/photo.jpg`
`05:43.49`	`DrodoEmpire`	`IRL photograph`
`05:43.52`	`DrodoEmpire`	`never before seen`
`05:43.52`	`The_Randomness`	`I think I can forgive you throwing shit at this guy, he deserves it`
`05:44.11`	`DrodoEmpire`	`I said some pretty bad shit, but thank you for that`
`05:44.25`	`The_Randomness`	`Just lurks and occasionally passes judgement without making any sort of effort to understand the work done here`
`05:44.58`	`DrodoEmpire`	`^`
`05:45.28`	`The_Randomness`	`Didn't know how to argue and took the moral high ground when we called him out on it`
`05:45.46`	`The_Randomness`	`But still, even if I forgive you for shitting on him, that wasn't necessary`
`05:45.51`	`DrodoEmpire`	`Yeah, he just rubbed me the wrong way from the start`
`05:45.52`	`The_Randomness`	`And uncalled for`
`05:46.45`	`DrodoEmpire`	`I know I get heated, and it didn't exactly bring any good faith to the argument`
`05:47.13`	`The_Randomness`	`Maybe I should've stepped in earlier`
`05:47.15`	`The_Randomness`	`w/e`
`05:47.25`	`The_Randomness`	`Goodnight`
`05:47.26`	`DrodoEmpire`	`I have low tolerance for this and its a flaw of mine`
`05:47.53`	`DrodoEmpire`	`But, you know what? Seems like I know who to direct it at :p`
`05:48.30`	`Spluff5`	`Heh`
`05:57.10`	`Spluff5`	`Drodo, what's your stuff about?`
`05:57.23`	`DrodoEmpire`	`Fiction. you mean?`
`05:57.26`	`DrodoEmpire`	`*Fiction,\`
`05:59.34`	`Spluff5`	`Yeah, like tell me about your empire`
`05:59.43`	`DrodoEmpire`	`Oh, okay`
`06:00.03`	`DrodoEmpire`	`Well, the Drodo Empire is here - http://spore.wikia.com/wiki/Fiction:Drodo_Empire`
`06:00.19`	`DrodoEmpire`	`Now while that has a lot, I'm still working on it`
`06:00.38`	`DrodoEmpire`	`Especially the sorta political situation, which I don't have written down but I have in my head`
`06:00.48`	`DrodoEmpire`	`Basically, the Drodo aren't a united people`
`06:01.03`	`DrodoEmpire`	`The Drodo remain highly divided along ethnic, religious, and clan lines`
`06:02.01`	`DrodoEmpire`	`To the point that the Drodo Empire is more of a compromise- it is a fairly weak federal government that has been given the power to represent the Drodo race in foreign relations`
`06:02.17`	`DrodoEmpire`	`While provinces are given quite a bit of autonomy`
`06:02.54`	`DrodoEmpire`	`This results in a decentralized, though economically strong country that actually has a lot of political capital`
`06:03.17`	`DrodoEmpire`	`Anything else you wish to know?`
`06:08.08`	`Spluff5`	`Do you have any particular design aesthetic for them? Like, for example: MY Sanurans have very angular architecture based around crystals and the number 4 with a Black and Purple coloscheme.`
`06:08.37`	`DrodoEmpire`	`Right`
`06:09.01`	`DrodoEmpire`	`Well, the Drodo are very traditionalist.`
`06:09.42`	`DrodoEmpire`	`Military officers are required to wear their swords on duty and in battle, and male aristocrats do the same when in public`
`06:10.32`	`DrodoEmpire`	`Cavalry units, especially more famed and elite ones, often wear flamboyant uniforms and the whole art of designing such military dress is a respected one`
`06:10.54`	`DrodoEmpire`	`Anyone with a military background is expected to wear military dress on formal functions`
`06:11.41`	`DrodoEmpire`	`The most popular sort of cap to wear with military or police is a cap similar to the kepi, and these are often decorated with feathers or lace depending on rank`
`06:11.53`	`DrodoEmpire`	`Many other public services wear kepis as well`
`06:13.19`	`DrodoEmpire`	`Civilian dress (somewhat superficially) resembles that of the twenties and thirties, though both genders tend to dress similarly (Drodo women don't really wear dresses or anything that feminine in this way)`
`06:14.02`	`DrodoEmpire`	`Starships themselves are often built in a rather utilitarian way, though`
`06:14.10`	`DrodoEmpire`	`Especially military starships`
`06:14.27`	`DrodoEmpire`	`Blocky, angular, perhaps a bit monolithic, and very militaristic`
`06:14.38`	`DrodoEmpire`	`Civilian starships vary widely`
`06:14.55`	`DrodoEmpire`	`Does that make sense?`
`06:18.37`	`Spluff5`	`Yeah, do you have any naming themes? I name my ships after minerals and my individual Sanurans after volcanic rocks.`
`06:19.28`	`Spluff5`	`E.g. there is a famous ancient engineer called Rhyol, after Rhyolite.`
`06:19.30`	`DrodoEmpire`	`When it comes to characters I just sorta make'em up and they sound relatively consistent >.<`
`06:19.53`	`DrodoEmpire`	`Ships are named after all sorts of things, often people`
`06:21.46`	`Spluff5`	`Ah`
`06:21.57`	`Spluff5`	`Cool`
`06:22.08`	`Spluff5`	`What do they look like?`
`06:22.18`	`DrodoEmpire`	`Drodo or their ships?`
`06:22.49`	`DrodoEmpire`	`( http://4.bp.blogspot.com/-HjODjpL_Ll8/Uhl7lwaGItI/AAAAAAAAZcY/qDTZoGujCA0/s1600/Italian_Cavalry_stby.jpg - For reference, its very common to see a brigade of horse be dressed like this)`
`06:23.25`	`Spluff5`	`Are thy humanoid?`
`06:23.29`	`Spluff5`	`ish?`
`06:23.37`	`DrodoEmpire`	`Yeah, Drodo are humanoid`
`06:23.43`	`DrodoEmpire`	`Lemme pull up the pictures I have`
`06:24.06`	`DrodoEmpire`	`http://vignette4.wikia.nocookie.net/spore/images/a/aa/Drodo.png/revision/latest?cb=20140607001547 - spore model`
`06:24.52`	`DrodoEmpire`	`https://i.gyazo.com/31a605844422faeccc33a3a9293029c8.png - Sketch of a colonial lancer`
`06:25.06`	`DrodoEmpire`	`https://i.gyazo.com/6ed076baff1ef884962b71a6a1cf4c22.png - bottom detail`
`06:25.19`	`DrodoEmpire`	`https://i.gyazo.com/6ce6fe37564288a7e4c64b0a8c3dd61d.png - top detail`
`06:25.41`	`Spluff5`	`Yeah, I find humanoids the easiest to tell basic stories with because there usually aren't super weird physical features that distract.`
`06:25.45`	`DrodoEmpire`	`^`
`06:25.59`	`Spluff5`	`Although, I sometimes add modifications ;-)`
`06:26.04`	`Spluff5`	`http://i.imgur.com/qV2iWDb.png`
`06:26.20`	`DrodoEmpire`	`Drodo are covered in short, soft fur and Drodo males grow facial hair (proper hair, not fur). All Drodo have head hair.`
`06:26.51`	`Spluff5`	`I'm not sure if I want the Sanurans to have genders.`
`06:26.55`	`DrodoEmpire`	`They also have a yellow stripe going right down the middle of their face and down their chest- I figure its there as a sort of costly signal, like a peacock's feathers`
`06:27.12`	`DrodoEmpire`	`Interesting`
`06:28.53`	`Spluff5`	`Do you use a lot comedy in your stories?`
`06:29.12`	`DrodoEmpire`	`No, generally not`
`06:29.52`	`DrodoEmpire`	`I'm not good at writing comedy, though I've got good comedic timing when spoken`
`06:30.15`	`DrodoEmpire`	`Unfortunately, its hard to translate timing, which is one of the most important things in comedy, to paper`
`06:30.29`	`Spluff5`	`I add comedic elements to some of my species. Mostly through parody`
`06:30.34`	`DrodoEmpire`	`Writing good sci-fi comedy's hard, is what I'm saying >.<`
`06:30.38`	`DrodoEmpire`	`Fair enough`
`06:31.07`	`DrodoEmpire`	`(Hitchhiker's Guide being like the one good sci-fi comedy book series <.<)`
`06:31.23`	`Spluff5`	`Yeah, that sort of style`
`06:31.27`	`DrodoEmpire`	`(And it relied heavily on the sort of absurdist British humour that isn't everyone's taste)`
`06:31.38`	`Spluff5`	`Like, the Cambole. They are super-capatilist and corporate and so a richer country might have a shell-country to launder tax through.`
`06:31.56`	`DrodoEmpire`	`Right, right`
`06:32.15`	`Spluff5`	`That's those centaur-lizard people`
`06:32.44`	`DrodoEmpire`	`Alright`
`06:34.49`	`Spluff5`	`It's going to take a really long time to write about all these races in my coalition.`
`06:35.23`	`DrodoEmpire`	`Its good to start small, but yeah it will`
`06:35.34`	`DrodoEmpire`	`Feel free to contact me if you want to collab`
`06:35.35`	`DrodoEmpire`	`:D`
`06:36.54`	`Spluff5`	`Yeah, thanks`
`06:37.09`	`Spluff5`	`How old is your oldest spacefaring race?`
`06:37.34`	`DrodoEmpire`	`I've only got the Drodo, and the Empire is a little over two-hundred years old`
`06:37.42`	`DrodoEmpire`	`The species is about 200 000, 250 000`
`06:37.51`	`DrodoEmpire`	`Drodo civilization is ~10 000`
`06:39.25`	`DrodoEmpire`	`Is that a good answer? >.<`
`06:39.46`	`Spluff5`	`Yeah.`
`06:40.09`	`DrodoEmpire`	`I spend a lot of time studying history, and one thing you learn is that asking how old a people (or really anything) is is often a very complicated question`
`06:40.13`	`DrodoEmpire`	`>.<`
`06:40.18`	`Spluff5`	`I'll have to wait until I arrive in the modern time then to collab.`
`06:40.23`	`DrodoEmpire`	`Alright`
`06:40.45`	`Spluff5`	`You might find it interesting to look over the brief history I've written for the Sanurans so far then`
`06:40.53`	`Spluff5`	`Or possibly extremely cringy`
`06:41.02`	`Spluff5`	`;-)`
`06:41.07`	`DrodoEmpire`	`Alriht`
`06:41.09`	`DrodoEmpire`	`*Alright`
`06:41.16`	`DrodoEmpire`	`As for "extremely cringey"... Man, its okay`
`06:41.23`	`DrodoEmpire`	`I. Have. Been. There.`
`06:41.24`	`DrodoEmpire`	`XD`
`06:41.39`	`DrodoEmpire`	`Link?`
`06:44.11`	`Spluff5`	`http://spore.wikia.com/wiki/Fiction:The_Sanurans`
`06:44.27`	`Spluff5`	`Note, I have left some of the years blank until I decide what to put there.`
`06:45.17`	`DrodoEmpire`	`Right`
`06:45.59`	`DrodoEmpire`	`I'm a little suspicious about the "low populations increasing technological advancement" thing, but so far it seems fine`
`06:53.59`	`DrodoEmpire`	`https://pbs.twimg.com/media/CnLWQodW8AEG-KR.jpg:large`
`06:59.34`	`DrodoEmpire`	`https://pbs.twimg.com/media/CnCeYg5WIAIX-Tz.jpg`
`07:00.52`	`*** join/#sporewiki Liquid_Ink (79d0cd9d@gateway/web/freenode/ip.121.208.205.157)`
`07:02.10`	`Spluff5`	`I am bed know`
`07:02.18`	`Spluff5`	`I'm tired from all that writing`
`07:02.32`	`Spluff5`	`G'dnight`
`07:02.55`	`DrodoEmpire`	`Night`
`09:15.26`	`*** join/#sporewiki Ghelae (6d9ec921@gateway/web/freenode/ip.109.158.201.33)`
`09:15.26`	`*** mode/#sporewiki [+o Ghelae] by ChanServ`
`09:16.11`	`*** join/#sporewiki Treebeard (52068dfd@gateway/web/freenode/ip.82.6.141.253)`
`09:16.18`	`Treebeard`	`Hello`
`09:17.02`	`Ghelae`	`Hello.`
`10:05.55`	`*** join/#sporewiki Tek0516 (uid149600@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-roboxvgwwtkxmqnc)`
`11:06.34`	`*** join/#sporewiki Wormy_ (02184654@gateway/web/freenode/ip.2.24.70.84)`
`11:06.48`	`Wormy_`	`hi`
`11:08.16`	`Ghelae`	`Hello.`
`11:27.26`	`Wormy_`	`https://twitter.com/THR/status/753296853924401155`
`11:27.53`	`*** join/#sporewiki Monet (~Monet47@cpc90522-gill20-2-0-cust960.20-1.cable.virginm.net)`
`11:27.55`	`Wormy_`	`https://twitter.com/MuseZack/status/753301792474042369`
`11:31.28`	`*** join/#sporewiki Hachiman (5aff2fd5@gateway/web/freenode/ip.90.255.47.213)`
`11:31.30`	`Hachiman`	`Hi`
`11:32.05`	`Monet`	`Hi`
`11:32.07`	`Hachiman`	`Wormy_: Just finished the first chapter of Proxima, where Yuri discovers he is on the Ad Astra, now that I have had the time to read it properly`
`11:32.36`	`Hachiman`	`I am hoping that Yuri ends up having more personality than just shrugging and punching people hur`
`11:33.17`	`Hachiman`	`And that Kleine and Tollemache have more to their character than just being assholes`
`11:34.00`	`Hachiman`	`Or is this one of Baxter's books where he doesn't work on his characterisation all that much`
`11:34.38`	`Wormy_`	`Yuri will develop into a mature adult`
`11:35.06`	`Hachiman`	`How old is Yuri?`
`11:35.07`	`Wormy_`	`However, this series is one that spans generations`
`11:35.24`	`Wormy_`	`Isan't it a young man at the start?`
`11:35.31`	`Hachiman`	`I must have missed that`
`11:36.02`	`Wormy_`	`For me, its more of the world Ad Astra and its strange universe that pulls me in`
`11:36.13`	`Wormy_`	`Its a wild ride`
`11:36.16`	`Hachiman`	`Having him be a young adult makes more sense that he is friends with Lemmy now that I think about it`
`11:36.26`	`Hachiman`	`And why Yuri acts like an antisocial dick`
`11:37.45`	`Hachiman`	`I am guessing the girl with the baby in the first chapter plays a role in why this is a generation-spanning story`
`11:39.52`	`Wormy_`	`Hm, I actually can't remember that bit`
`11:40.27`	`Hachiman`	`Yuri wakes up and after he speaks to some doctor character, he meets a young girl with a baby called Cole and a Chinese guy called Liu Tao`
`11:42.55`	`Hachiman`	`I find it amusing that the Chinese seem to have an interplanetary monopoly though`
`11:43.59`	`Monet`	`China's a big space power atm but having a monopoly might be stretching it`
`11:44.20`	`Monet`	`Unless its a metaphor for their near-monopoly in manufacturing`
`11:45.12`	`Wormy_`	`They have a monopoly over the world's largest deposits of rare earth metals`
`11:45.27`	`Monet`	`that too`
`11:46.11`	`Wormy_`	`This is the 2160's however`
`11:46.59`	`Monet`	`Also China's one of the first nations to put a space station in orbit since the first ISS modules.`
`11:47.00`	`Wormy_`	`China is the setting means a huge East Asian block, while UN are essentially everyone-else`
`11:49.07`	`Hachiman`	`Hm so Lex is a major character too it seems`
`11:49.53`	`Hachiman`	`Also, I like the detail about astronauts being deemed as celebrities and near-royalty in the setting`
`11:50.02`	`Hachiman`	`And being both hated and loved hur`
`11:54.42`	`Wormy_`	`Everyone wanted to be an explorer, not a settler`
`12:03.25`	`Wormy_`	`http://imgur.com/gallery/1eixv`
`12:05.07`	`Wormy_`	`http://imgur.com/gallery/KRFJoVw`
`12:06.49`	`Monet`	`Interesting dress code.`
`12:24.22`	`*** join/#sporewiki dino82_ (52b0ddef@gateway/web/freenode/ip.82.176.221.239)`
`12:25.22`	`dino82_`	`hi`
`12:26.13`	`Liquid_Ink`	`Hello!`
`12:31.40`	`dino82_`	`howz all doing!`
`12:32.32`	`Liquid_Ink`	`Alright`
`12:38.51`	`dino82_`	`Great!`
`12:38.58`	`dino82_`	`Tis quiet on the wiki! and irc:P`
`12:39.14`	`*** join/#sporewiki Jepardi (591b4d42@gateway/web/freenode/ip.89.27.77.66)`
`12:39.15`	`Jepardi`	`Hi`
`12:46.22`	`Wormy_`	`Kitten Academy Live Stream https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_o74BnFSr8g`
`12:46.41`	`*** join/#sporewiki ImpyDroid (~androirc@62.175.182.135.static.user.ono.com)`
`12:46.58`	`ImpyDroid`	`Hi`
`12:49.39`	`Hachiman`	`Hi`
`12:49.44`	`dino82_`	`hi`
`12:54.11`	`Wormy_`	`so I'm noting the same amount of dislikes (733) on different puppy/kitten livestreams, obviously an attack by spambots. Probably Peta or some group like that.`
`12:54.28`	`Wormy_`	`noticing`
`13:13.17`	`*** join/#sporewiki OluapPlayer (badaf85e@gateway/web/freenode/ip.186.218.248.94)`
`13:13.17`	`*** mode/#sporewiki [+o OluapPlayer] by ChanServ`
`13:45.03`	`*** join/#sporewiki CyraBot (uid97882@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-klrfpyfsnetyuqly)`
`13:45.20`	`CyraBot`	`Hello everyone`
`13:45.34`	`Monet`	`hello`
`13:45.44`	`OluapPlayer`	`~eat CyraBot`
`13:45.44`	`infobot`	`ACTION eats CyraBot and falls over dead`
`13:46.17`	`CyraBot`	`~tickle OluapPlayer`
`13:46.18`	`infobot`	`ACTION jumps on OluapPlayer, yelling "TICKLE FIGHT!!!!"`
`13:47.05`	`CyraBot`	`How are we all today?`
`13:47.28`	`Monet`	`Calm`
`13:47.43`	`OluapPlayer`	`Indifferent`
`13:49.59`	`CyraBot`	`I'm waiting on the bus, which will no doubt give me something else to moan about`
`13:50.33`	`Monet`	`Is the bust that bad?`
`13:50.35`	`Monet`	`bus*`
`13:51.18`	`CyraBot`	`The local town service one is`
`13:52.19`	`CyraBot`	`People stopping the bus every few hundred metres instead of getting off at actual bus stops grinds my gears`
`13:55.02`	`Monet`	`I try t oignore those kinds of people.`
`13:55.02`	`CyraBot`	`Also I'm all out of Starbursts :(`
`13:58.50`	`Monet`	`How long is your commute?`
`14:02.06`	`CyraBot`	`That's the worst part. It's alright in the afternoon on the way home, though in the morning it takes just under an hour to reach the college even though it takes about ten minutes via another route`
`14:23.41`	`Wormy_`	`CyraBot: I'd walk that other route`
`14:25.36`	`Wormy_`	`I'm going to get Pokemon Go`
`14:26.46`	`Wormy_`	`I love augmented Reality I think its better than oldschool VR`
`14:42.20`	`Wormy_`	`I was always into Digimon when I was a kid`
`14:49.39`	`Wormy_`	`Lol Pokemon Go crashed`
`14:52.21`	`Monet`	`Apparently it is a little unpredictable`
`15:04.26`	`Wormy_`	`Chris Froome came off his bike today, was forced to run up the road until given a new a bike, a strange sight`
`15:10.44`	`*** mode/#sporewiki [+o Cyrannian] by ChanServ`
`15:11.34`	`Cyrannian`	`hi`
`15:19.59`	`Cyrannian`	`Oh the server is down`
`15:20.25`	`Wormy_`	`Monet: Determination https://twitter.com/TelegraphSport/status/753605444640309248`
`15:39.16`	`Cyrannian`	`http://vignette1.wikia.nocookie.net/spore/images/3/3d/20160710215954_1.jpg/revision/latest?cb=20160714153526 - Look who I discovered in the main game`
`15:39.54`	`OluapPlayer`	`[declare war]`
`15:41.04`	`Wormy_`	`"Empress Ramashe V2 empire"`
`15:41.59`	`Cyrannian`	`That one is pretty mild actually`
`15:47.57`	`Cyrannian`	`I also encountered the "Kamik'Shi Empire" (scientists) and the "Alien Ninja 1 Empire"`
`15:48.47`	`*** join/#sporewiki Quark8 (49c685a7@gateway/web/freenode/ip.73.198.133.167)`
`15:48.48`	`Quark8`	`Hello.`
`15:49.24`	`Wormy_`	`I encountered Sporn empires`
`15:49.26`	`Wormy_`	`hi`
`15:52.01`	`Cyrannian`	`Hi`
`16:06.59`	`*** join/#sporewiki DrodoEmpire (2f37c5db@gateway/web/freenode/ip.47.55.197.219)`
`16:07.13`	`DrodoEmpire`	`Hi everyone`
`16:07.54`	`Quark8`	`Hi Drodo.`
`16:08.09`	`DrodoEmpire`	`Hey`
`16:08.36`	`Cyrannian`	`Wormy_: I encountered an empire flying one of your ships`
`16:08.47`	`Cyrannian`	`The Desolation-class`
`16:10.22`	`Wormy_`	`Awesome`
`16:11.12`	`OluapPlayer`	`Came across any of mine yet?`
`16:11.12`	`Wormy_`	`Some Spore player out there must have met one of your empires with a matching ship, quite possibly unknowingly`
`16:13.41`	`Cyrannian`	`I'll let you know if I come across any, it's bound to happen`
`16:14.29`	`Cyrannian`	`Though I must say that it's fun revisiting the main game with GA after so long`
`16:15.12`	`*** join/#sporewiki TheDinoHunter (6bdc385b@gateway/web/freenode/ip.107.220.56.91)`
`16:19.09`	`*** join/#sporewiki ImpyDroid (~androirc@62.175.182.135.static.user.ono.com)`
`16:19.25`	`DrodoEmpire`	`Yeah its nostalgic for sure`
`16:25.29`	`DrodoEmpire`	`https://pbs.twimg.com/media/CnCeYg5WIAIX-Tz.jpg`
`16:56.01`	`Wormy_`	`Hachiman: Looks like creepy pasta to me, but great http://imgur.com/gallery/mSiz7`
`16:58.38`	`*** join/#sporewiki Spluff5 (ae188812@gateway/web/freenode/ip.174.24.136.18)`
`17:00.21`	`Spluff5`	`Hi Treebeard`
`17:00.53`	`Treebeard`	`Hello`
`17:05.47`	`*** join/#sporewiki Quark8 (49c685a7@gateway/web/freenode/ip.73.198.133.167)`
`17:20.14`	`*** join/#sporewiki DrodoEmpire (2f37c5db@gateway/web/freenode/ip.47.55.197.219)`
`17:43.48`	`DrodoEmpire`	`https://pbs.twimg.com/media/CnQRSiFWIAAj4HC.jpg:large`
`18:05.27`	`DrodoEmpire`	`http://cdn.akamai.steamstatic.com/steam/apps/201273/ss_73d524b8c2813f1d3c829acce987206071020e78.jpg?t=1447355044 - I don't care what anybody says, Shogun 2's got to be one of the best-looking Total Wars`
`18:05.41`	`Quark8`	`Is anyone else unable to edit wiki pages?`
`18:05.45`	`DrodoEmpire`	`Rome II is more recent, so it should have better graphics- but honestly it just looks boring`
`18:06.03`	`DrodoEmpire`	`That happens sometimes`
`18:06.25`	`DrodoEmpire`	`Wikia servers probably just having a hiccough`
`18:11.28`	`Hachiman`	`old = bad lel`
`19:01.49`	`*** join/#sporewiki Xho (b01b2759@gateway/web/freenode/ip.176.27.39.89)`
`19:05.53`	`ImpyDroid`	`Hi`
`19:06.57`	`ImpyDroid`	`Xho Cyrannian Wormy_away: http://m.imgur.com/a/pqSQf So I was in Valencia two days ago and I saw this in the local church`
`19:07.18`	`Xho`	`OOOOO`
`19:07.36`	`*** join/#sporewiki Spluff5 (ae188812@gateway/web/freenode/ip.174.24.136.18)`
`19:08.21`	`Cyrannian`	`Impy = illuminati confirmed`
`19:09.45`	`Xho`	`iluminados confirmado`
`19:09.50`	`OluapPlayer`	`spu`
`19:10.09`	`Xho`	`u`
`19:13.10`	`Xho`	`So I'm reading that new DV section`
`19:15.08`	`Xho`	`"Teael - That long, weird looking dark thing. ... Wait, that's not... " Longinus - DOES NOT PRAISE AUR`
`19:15.37`	`OluapPlayer`	`Hamoins - does praise hamoins`
`19:15.52`	`Xho`	`Longinus - was going to say fuck hamoins but pls no`
`19:18.15`	`Xho`	`Longinus - szalvetha has the right idea`
`19:19.17`	`*** join/#sporewiki DrodoEmpire (2f37c5db@gateway/web/freenode/ip.47.55.197.219)`
`19:19.29`	`Monet`	`So as I was walking along, this happened http://images.akamai.steamusercontent.com/ugc/266093849973253793/CBE9C86DC77DA24828FACE1B17F30866BC6724A2/`
`19:19.31`	`Monet`	`Hi`
`19:19.51`	`Monet`	`When I got down there all I found was a rather aggressive Mr. Handy.`
`19:20.38`	`DrodoEmpire`	`Oh jeez`
`19:25.35`	`Ghel`	`Hello.`
`19:26.09`	`Quark8`	`Hello.`
`19:28.53`	`Xho`	`needs septimus up in dat college shi`
`19:31.47`	`DrodoEmpire`	`test`
`19:32.27`	`Xho`	`failed`
`19:34.57`	`DrodoEmpire`	`>:`
`19:35.13`	`DrodoEmpire`	`Any plans to do Voidwalker today?`
`19:35.30`	`Xho`	`Suppose we can do some`
`19:35.41`	`DrodoEmpire`	`Cool`
`19:36.53`	`Xho`	`Monet Cyrannian Ghel Wormy_away: https://titanpad.com/uTzUtz9xLX`
`19:58.21`	`Spluff5`	`Did Wikia just update?`
`19:58.41`	`Spluff5`	`There's all sorts of stuff like sliders I haven't seen before.`
`20:00.03`	`Monet`	`Sliders?`
`20:01.12`	`Spluff5`	`A button to insert slideshows easily.`
`20:01.46`	`Quark8`	`Where is this button?`
`20:22.46`	`Wormy_away`	`I'll be on in a bit, gonna get hypnotised`
`20:24.03`	`Monet`	`Again?`
`20:26.14`	`Wormy_away`	`My relative is learning to be a psycho- and hynotherapist. As I am a psychonaut, I find it quite interesting.`
`20:27.18`	`Wormy_away`	`It feels very different to meditation and breathing/visualisation/yoga related trances`
`20:27.54`	`Wormy_away`	`Its like the deep relaxed feeling you get watching a film, but just notice that you was fully absorbed in the story`
`20:28.53`	`Wormy_away`	`A recent psychology article was published showing that hypnosis and meditation were two completely opposite states of consciousness`
`20:30.53`	`DrodoEmpire`	`One aligns all 76 chakras and the other harmonizes your vibrations and essential woo fluids <.<`
`20:32.12`	`Xho`	`https://i.ytimg.com/vi/OSCiMbMVDLI/hqdefault.jpg tfw`
`20:32.28`	`Monet`	`Don't be silly Drodo. We only have seven chakras.`
`20:32.46`	`OluapPlayer`	`skelly`
`20:34.07`	`DrodoEmpire`	`Monet: muh spirit science discovered even more though`
`20:37.17`	`Xho`	`Hachiman: http://i2.kym-cdn.com/photos/images/original/001/052/914/4c6.png`
`20:39.30`	`Xho`	`OluapPlayer: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WXdnYd0wwDE Santorakh's Theme`
`20:40.59`	`OluapPlayer`	`I don't get the Guy Fieri meme`
`20:41.09`	`Xho`	`Neither do I`
`20:41.21`	`Xho`	`still funny tho`
`20:54.36`	`*** join/#sporewiki OluapPlayer (badaf85e@gateway/web/freenode/ip.186.218.248.94)`
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`20:54.48`	`OluapPlayer`	`Cyrannian: answer pls`
`21:19.14`	`*** join/#sporewiki The_Randomness (~chatzilla@2601:441:1:5b80:5528:71ed:d72d:e072)`
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`21:19.34`	`Wormy_away`	`DrodoEmpire: You gotta pump them woo fluids like a three coiled snake piercing sensations of extreme pleasure an pain up your spine until it feels like your head is exploding`
`21:19.44`	`The_Randomness`	`Hello`
`21:19.52`	`Wormy_away`	`That happened to me once`
`21:19.56`	`The_Randomness`	`wat`
`21:20.40`	`DrodoEmpire`	`hey, that's pretty good`
`21:21.37`	`Wormy_away`	`It was, regardless of whether it real or completely imaginitive/induced-psychosis, it was something I learned from`
`21:22.46`	`Hachiman`	`DrodoEmpire: fuk off idubbbz`
`21:22.52`	`DrodoEmpire`	`>:`
`21:23.37`	`Xho`	`http://spore.wikia.com/wiki/Fiction:Voidwalker_Conflict#The_Biodome more spooky`
`21:24.09`	`DrodoEmpire`	`extra spoppy`
`21:25.22`	`OluapPlayer`	`Roasted Kicath`
`21:26.08`	`Xho`	`how u read that quickly`
`21:28.00`	`OluapPlayer`	`who sez im don`
`21:28.58`	`Monet`	`The roast Kicath part was near the end.`
`21:36.12`	`OluapPlayer`	`I glance at sections before reading them, I'm multitasking between reading and doing 2 roleplays`
`21:40.10`	`Xho`	`nigga get cho priorities str8`
`21:41.06`	`Monet`	`2 RPs at once is...busy.`
`22:17.14`	`*** join/#sporewiki morgothBotPy (~morgothBo@unaffiliated/morgoth1145/bot/morgothbotpy)`
`22:17.14`	`*** mode/#sporewiki [+v morgothBotPy] by ChanServ`
`22:20.15`	`DrodoEmpire`	`test`
`22:23.02`	`*** join/#sporewiki AdmiralPanda (65b30e25@gateway/web/freenode/ip.101.179.14.37)`
`22:23.19`	`*** join/#sporewiki morgoth1145 (~quassel@wikia/morgoth1145)`
`22:23.19`	`*** mode/#sporewiki [+o morgoth1145] by ChanServ`
`22:24.53`	`NeonPanda`	`Cyberpunk people: if you want to talk anything game related let me know`
`22:32.55`	`Wormy_away`	`Cyberpubk 2077 details coming out,, or the earlier game?`
`22:41.48`	`NeonPanda`	`2020 TTRPG me, Random, Hachi and Monet are playing`
`22:44.37`	`*** join/#sporewiki Tek0516 (uid149600@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-qizoajetymzbyydf)`
`22:44.48`	`*** join/#sporewiki LaptopPanda (65b30e25@gateway/web/freenode/ip.101.179.14.37)`
`22:46.18`	`Tek0516`	`Hello`
`22:46.35`	`LaptopPanda`	`hi`
`22:48.00`	`Monet`	`Hello`
`22:48.59`	`LaptopPanda`	`playing Dark Souls, so I figured having my laptop on the side for IRC would be prudent`
`22:53.25`	`*** join/#sporewiki Liquid_Ink (79d0cd9d@gateway/web/freenode/ip.121.208.205.157)`
`22:54.25`	`LaptopPanda`	`finally got the Black Knight Helmet, now I just need the greatsword and I have all the pieces`
`23:04.04`	`DrodoEmpire`	`test`
`23:04.21`	`Tek0516`	`DrodoEmpire: hello`
`23:04.37`	`DrodoEmpire`	`Hi`
`23:05.41`	`Tek0516`	`They're reporting a terror attack in Nice, France. :/`
`23:06.16`	`DrodoEmpire`	`Oh, no.`
`23:06.31`	`The_Randomness`	`I heard about that`
`23:06.57`	`Xho`	`They said at least 50 dead`
`23:07.08`	`DrodoEmpire`	`Jesus Christ, it seems like a truck ran through a crowd`
`23:07.15`	`Tek0516`	`Truck rushed right through a Bastille Day crowd, saying at least 60 dead now.`
`23:07.23`	`DrodoEmpire`	`That's barbaric`
`23:07.28`	`The_Randomness`	`ech`
`23:07.49`	`DrodoEmpire`	`Is it confirmed to be a terror attack?`
`23:08.01`	`LaptopPanda`	`the human race would be a lovely bunch if it weren't for the humans`
`23:08.09`	`DrodoEmpire`	`edgy :p`
`23:08.12`	`The_Randomness`	`^`
`23:08.21`	`DrodoEmpire`	`It'd hardly make it better if it were some horrible accident, but I mean...`
`23:08.35`	`Tek0516`	`DrodoEmpire: From what I've seen the truck entered a closed road and accelerated into the crowd`
`23:08.43`	`DrodoEmpire`	`Right`
`23:09.05`	`DrodoEmpire`	`Likely deliberate, but like with any tragedy we'll have to wait for the news to roll in`
`23:09.50`	`Tek0516`	`It was apparently closed, so there wasn't even supposed to be vehicles on the road.`
`23:10.02`	`Xho`	`Why France though`
`23:10.02`	`Xho`	`I mean`
`23:10.09`	`Xho`	`Charlie Hebdo attacks, Paris massacre and then this`
`23:10.15`	`Tek0516`	`Xho: Bastille Day.`
`23:10.31`	`Xho`	`I got that but I mean France is a hub for terrorism`
`23:11.30`	`Hachiman`	`Of course, ISIS will likely claim responsibility, even if this is very unlikely to be their doing`
`23:11.37`	`Hachiman`	`Has the driver been caught?`
`23:11.42`	`Tek0516`	`CNN in its usually tastefulnes is showing pictures and videos of the bodies. >.>`
`23:12.09`	`Xho`	`70 now`
`23:12.12`	`Tek0516`	`I've heard the driver was killed, there are report of shootings.`
`23:12.12`	`DrodoEmpire`	`Its a country that's been hit hard by the migrant crisis, which means terrorist organizations can no doubt sneak more operatives in/more people to just do this sorta thing`
`23:12.37`	`DrodoEmpire`	`Germany, while it has a much higher migrant population, also has a terrifyingly-efficient counter-terrorism operation`
`23:12.52`	`Tek0516`	`It's unfortunate for France that they get hit so hard by this.`
`23:12.54`	`DrodoEmpire`	`Or so I hear`
`23:13.02`	`Xho`	`Perhaps France should adopt it`
`23:13.17`	`LaptopPanda`	`oddly enough, by reputation France's is better`
`23:13.28`	`Xho`	`The UK's is pretty good regarding the number of terror attacks since 7/7`
`23:13.35`	`Xho`	`Only one comes to mind`
`23:14.00`	`DrodoEmpire`	`Anyway`
`23:14.29`	`DrodoEmpire`	`Like I said, it'd be best just to wait.`
`23:14.58`	`*** join/#sporewiki Tybusen (44053b94@gateway/web/freenode/ip.68.5.59.148)`
`23:15.39`	`Tek0516`	`I expect there's some embellishment of the extent of the attack, though the truck part alone is a significant tragedy.`
`23:15.58`	`Tybusen`	`Hello`
`23:16.13`	`Tek0516`	`Hello Tybusen`
`23:16.49`	`Tek0516`	`We're mostly getting contradictory and unconfirmed witness reports so it's too early to be certain.`
`23:20.41`	`Monet`	`This kind of attack feels new.`
`23:20.48`	`Monet`	`This strategy I mean`
`23:22.16`	`DrodoEmpire`	`It was far less elaborate than most terror attacks`
`23:23.57`	`Monet`	`The closest similar incident that comes to mind is someone driving a 4x4 into the foyer of Glasgow Airport.`
`23:24.59`	`DrodoEmpire`	`In Canada there was a similar attack not long ago when a fundimentalist muslim convert rammed a few off-duty soldiers with a vehicle`
`23:25.03`	`DrodoEmpire`	`I believe it was in Quebec`
`23:25.36`	`DrodoEmpire`	`So there is some precedent to this, perhaps`
`23:25.55`	`Monet`	`But this? It's either desperately planned or devious simplicity.`
`23:27.24`	`Xho`	`At least 73 now`
`23:31.43`	`Tek0516`	`DrodoEmpire: though if I recall the scope was comparatively smaller, 3 dead I think.`
`23:32.08`	`DrodoEmpire`	`Oh much smaller`
`23:32.20`	`DrodoEmpire`	`But still precedent for the use of vehicles in this way`
`23:35.46`	`Tek0516`	`Yes.`
`23:36.43`	`Xho`	`"Driver of truck shot dead by police"`
`23:36.52`	`Xho`	`Well that's a development if any`
`23:37.41`	`Cyrannian`	`According to the Guardian, the truck was full of arms and grenades`
`23:38.36`	`Monet`	`I'd wait until I get multiple sources before believing such a claim`
`23:38.48`	`Hachiman`	`Xho: http://spore.wikia.com/wiki/Fiction:The_Goldhawk_Chronicles#Elder_Drakes reed u milksop`
`23:41.09`	`Xho`	`Hald-Sleac - ... Am I talking to a bunch of bricks? Norrigan - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=g93mz_eZ5N4`
`23:41.29`	`Hachiman`	`Oh and there's a section after that too`
`23:42.40`	`Xho`	`That video still is weird`
`23:44.33`	`Tybusen`	`Hachiman: Have you watched Gekkan Shoujo Nozaki-kun / Monthly Girls' Nozaki-kun?`
`23:44.52`	`Hachiman`	`Do I look like I watch loli / moeshit`
`23:45.06`	`Hachiman`	`And also I've never heard of it hur`
`23:45.27`	`Tybusen`	`Well I'd recommend it because it's hilarious`
`23:46.13`	`Tybusen`	`The characters are all great and they're also all idiots in some way`
`23:47.39`	`Hachiman`	`Hm, I'll have a look`
`23:47.54`	`Hachiman`	`Also, looks like it was good I never ended up picking up Kabaneri of the Iron Fortress`
`23:48.15`	`Hachiman`	`Because apparently it's a dumb action style anime that takes itself too seriously and has shit plot and characters`
`23:48.30`	`Tybusen`	`Kabaneri was a cheap SnK knockoff by the same people who made the SnK anime, right?`
`23:49.01`	`Hachiman`	`It was a better-looking SnK knockoff that was actually better than SnK from what I heard`
`23:49.15`	`Xho`	`Hald-Sleac - ... I'm rich! I'm rich! I'm filthy, bloody, stinking rich! Asv-Aldz - but r u`
`23:49.34`	`Tybusen`	`I'm just glad they're finally rolling out SnK season 2`
`23:49.55`	`Hachiman`	`I'd be more glad if the manga didn't let me know to expect shit in the future to be animated`
`23:50.11`	`Hachiman`	`I'm honestly considering dropping the manga`
`23:50.38`	`Tybusen`	`You're up to Ch. 83 right?`
`23:50.46`	`Hachiman`	`I'm at the latest chapter`
`23:51.13`	`Hachiman`	`The whole "civil war, ultra political, class revolt" arc that happened is going to be awful when / if it gets animated because it's by far the most boring part of the entire series`
`23:51.48`	`Tybusen`	`They can probably compress the Revolution arc since a lot of it was action that can be condensed into shorter scenes`
`23:52.04`	`Tybusen`	`Though the Anti-Personnel Manuever Gear will be cool to see`
`23:52.16`	`Hachiman`	`Also, I like how SnK once prided itself on the fact that anyone could die and yet now no one fucking dies`
`23:52.26`	`Hachiman`	`Just nameless nobodies while the main cast are all fine apparently`
`23:52.34`	`Tybusen`	`TBF that's been the entire series if you think about it`
`23:53.05`	`Xho`	`Xitannoth - WHAT'S GOOD NIGGA`
`23:53.12`	`Hachiman`	`kek`
`23:53.12`	`Tybusen`	`The last major cast members that I can think that actually died was Squad Levi back in season 1`
`23:53.41`	`Tybusen`	`Oh, actually, Hannes died, he at least had a name and was relevant at one point`
`23:53.54`	`Hachiman`	`OH LOOK WHO SURVIVED AFTER GETTING BEAT INTO SUBMISSION AND HAVING HIS BODY DESTROYED TWICE FUCKING REINER AGAIN`
`23:54.16`	`Tybusen`	`At least Bertholdt is going to almost certainly die within two chapters`
`23:55.26`	`Hachiman`	`I'm going to predict that Levi and Eren are going to waste time shouting at each other and let Erwin die so they'll HAVE to give that damn thing to Armin`
`23:55.37`	`Hachiman`	`If it does that I am almost certainly dropping the manga`
`23:55.38`	`Tybusen`	`I want to see how the current arc plays out before passing judgement, it could still end up being a good arc depending on how the next two chapters go`
`23:56.11`	`Tybusen`	`Erwin would probably give it to Armin if he was conscious, he only wants the basement now`
`23:56.25`	`Hachiman`	`Erwin is humanity's greatest tactical mastermind`
`23:56.34`	`Hachiman`	`Why the FUCK would you consider giving it to Armin`
`23:56.48`	`Tybusen`	`Since Armin's the "future" of the Survey Corps`
`23:57.17`	`Tybusen`	`And Erwin was talking all about how guilty he feels about the pile of corpses he created in pursuit of his own personal goals`
`23:57.44`	`Hachiman`	`True`
`23:58.03`	`Tybusen`	`Though, Armin should still be dead considering the way he went out`
`23:58.16`	`Tybusen`	`From a physical and storytelling standpoint`
`23:58.45`	`Tybusen`	`I don't disagree that bringing back Armin now would ruin his entire sacrifice scene`
`23:59.44`	`Hachiman`	`The arc is already ruined by the fact that Reiner survived AGAIN`
`23:59.48`	`Hachiman`	`Through fucking asspulls`

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