| 04:52.04 | bobstay | anyone know what packages I need to do ir dialup? |
| 06:21.05 | Twiun | rehi |
| 06:31.42 | Twiun | urgh |
| 06:32.12 | Twiun | note to self: make SUBDIRS=packages/ipkg distclean is NOT the way to clean out ipkg completely! |
| 06:34.37 | Twiun | that's gonna be another few hours gone |
| 06:43.19 | ibz|work | boo! |
| 07:11.04 | smee|w | morning - anyone use bluetooth with oz and t68i? |
| 07:11.08 | smee|w | er, afternoon |
| 07:12.35 | datenpunk | hello - I want to use my Opera on oz - there aqre scripts mentioned on the oz homepage - where can I find them? |
| 07:20.29 | Twiun | datenpunk: have looked at zsi? |
| 07:22.21 | benmeyer | morning |
| 07:24.04 | Twiun | howdy ben |
| 07:25.35 | datenpunk | Twiun: Sorry - what is zsi? |
| 07:27.00 | Twiun | ibot: zsi |
| 07:30.14 | datenpunk | Thank you! |
| 07:30.26 | datenpunk | Also thanks to ibot :) |
| 07:31.38 | Twiun | ibot: botsnack |
| 07:31.38 | | :) |
| 07:31.52 | Twiun | ibot: thanks |
| 07:31.52 | | pas de quoi, Twiun |
| 07:37.03 | ibz|work | bipolar: get my message? |
| 07:43.48 | god|other | are there any disadvantages to the use of openzaurus over the installed OS that comes with it? |
| 07:44.13 | god|other | for example, do software packages listed on www.myzaurus.com not work? |
| 07:44.44 | chouimat | morning |
| 07:45.25 | god|other | morning |
| 07:55.12 | bipolar | ibz|work: how did you send it? |
| 07:56.35 | ibz|work | bipolar: memoserv |
| 07:56.53 | bipolar | ibz|work: no, I did not get anything |
| 07:59.19 | bipolar | ibz|work: could you repeat the message? :) |
| 08:11.34 | ibz|work | bipolar: i probably could... |
| 08:11.51 | bipolar | :) |
| 08:13.28 | bipolar | I don't know why I didn't get it... strange |
| 08:15.19 | ibz|work | bipolar: ruby -lne 'print $1 if /(http:\/\/[\w.\/]*\.ipk)/' zaurus.dump |
| 08:15.40 | bipolar | early beta at http://longbros.com/benjamin/zaurus/zsifeed/ |
| 08:17.23 | ibz|work | bipolar: lemme know if you have any problems... |
| 08:17.48 | bipolar | ibz|work: ok. I'm installing ruby on my webserver since I moved the scripts there. |
| 08:18.13 | ibz|work | you have perl? replace "ruby" with "perl". |
| 08:18.23 | bipolar | oh, ok...heh |
| 08:21.40 | bipolar | ibz|work: it seems to be cutting out about 100 packages. :\ |
| 08:25.09 | ibz|work | where's this file again? i think i should look at it... |
| 08:25.44 | bipolar | http://killefiz.de/zaurus/zaurus.dump |
| 08:27.14 | ibz|work | ahh...got it. |
| 08:27.22 | ibz|work | try this... |
| 08:27.43 | ibz|work | bipolar: ruby -lne 'print $1 if /(http:\/\/[\w.\/-_]*?\.ipk)/' zaurus.dump |
| 08:28.34 | bipolar | only 132 packages found with that. there should be about 230 |
| 08:28.49 | ibz|work | ipk filenames have underscores and hyphens...i wasn't including those in the regexp. |
| 08:28.54 | ibz|work | ? |
| 08:29.03 | ibz|work | am getting 240 over here. |
| 08:29.10 | bipolar | :\ |
| 08:29.36 | bipolar | ruby 1.6.4 (2001-06-04) [i386-linux-gnu] |
| 08:29.42 | bipolar | too old? |
| 08:30.07 | ibz|work | ruby-1.6.7 -lne 'print $1 if /(http:\/\/[\w.\/_-]*\.ipk)/' zaurus.dump | wc -l |
| 08:30.07 | ibz|work | 240 |
| 08:30.13 | bipolar | perl does the same |
| 08:30.21 | bipolar | perl -lne 'print $1 if /(http:\/\/[\w.\/-_]*?\.ipk)/' zaurus.dump | wc -l |
| 08:30.21 | bipolar | 132 |
| 08:31.02 | ibz|work | perl -lne 'print $1 if /(http:\/\/[\w.\/_-]*\.ipk)/' zaurus.dump | wc -l |
| 08:31.02 | ibz|work | 240 |
| 08:31.14 | bipolar | that is just so weird |
| 08:31.28 | bipolar | ibz|work: what distribution are you running? |
| 08:31.56 | ibz|work | redhat/nt at work, debian home. |
| 08:32.20 | bipolar | rh or debian here. |
| 08:32.29 | ibz|work | perl 5.8.0 |
| 08:33.10 | ibz|work | i can only suggest you try a newer version of {perl|ruby}... |
| 08:33.28 | bipolar | I have that version of perl |
| 08:33.43 | ibz|work | ? |
| 08:34.00 | bipolar | bash-2.05b$ perl -v |
| 08:34.00 | bipolar | This is perl, v5.8.0 built for i386-linux-thread-multi |
| 08:34.30 | ibz|work | have you tampered with zaurus.dump? |
| 08:35.00 | bipolar | ahh |
| 08:35.19 | bipolar | I cut and pasted your line that got the 240 result and got 240 |
| 08:36.03 | ibz|work | yay! |
| 08:36.15 | bipolar | I can see the error now. |
| 08:36.35 | bipolar | now that I scroll up and look closely |
| 08:37.30 | ibz|work | are you setting up a feed? |
| 08:37.44 | bipolar | ibz|work: yes |
| 08:38.02 | bipolar | we'll see how well it works |
| 08:38.03 | ibz|work | so you gonna be downloading all those files right? wget? |
| 08:38.13 | bipolar | yes |
| 08:39.16 | ibz|work | cool...so you still have a little scripting to do to complete your task right? |
| 08:39.36 | bipolar | ibz|work: Almost done now |
| 08:40.11 | ibz|work | i was gonna say, just replace "print $1" with `wget $1`, and you should be done.. |
| 08:40.43 | ibz|work | note, those are backticks.... |
| 08:41.20 | ibz|work | for perl anyway... |
| 08:41.21 | bipolar | ibz|work: my script is running now :) |
| 08:51.50 | kergoth`zzz | hey |
| 08:55.48 | bipolar | kergoth: morning |
| 08:55.58 | scanline | morning kergoth |
| 08:56.17 | bipolar | kergoth: I'm building a feed of all the zsi ipks that I can get |
| 08:56.54 | chouimat | kergoth: does opie build?????? |
| 08:57.13 | kergoth | chouimat: i just built it for x86 about 20 minutes ago |
| 08:57.16 | kergoth | chouimat: i'll test arm in a sec |
| 08:57.22 | kergoth | bipolar: cool cool |
| 08:58.13 | bipolar | kergoth: ibz|work gave me a perl command that pulls ipk urls from the mysql dump. The rest is just shell scripting ;) |
| 08:58.13 | Infamous2 | is there a longer lasting battery for the Z? |
| 08:59.01 | kergoth | eh? |
| 08:59.13 | bipolar | cbok: Next time be careful not to let the zaurus fall in the blender |
| 08:59.40 | bipolar | cbok: whats the problem? |
| 08:59.45 | cbok | nothing |
| 08:59.51 | cbok | i just like givin' kergoth a little grief |
| 08:59.53 | cbok | :) |
| 08:59.57 | bipolar | ahh.... |
| 09:00.12 | bipolar | mmmm.... coffee...... |
| 09:02.05 | numatrix | Infamous2: a few, but none that fit in the usual battery spot, they're all external as far as I know. |
| 09:02.48 | Infamous2 | numatrix: ah, i see....where could i find those? |
| 09:03.24 | benmeyer | morning kergoth |
| 09:03.37 | numatrix | Infamous2: I don't remember offhand, let me poke around. You try asking in #zaurus? |
| 09:04.23 | cod | maybe I'm little OT but can someone tell me why I cannot access www.zaurus.com ? |
| 09:04.36 | Infamous2 | yea, already tried |
| 09:05.00 | benmeyer | cod: because it is changing host |
| 09:05.02 | numatrix | ibot: digipower |
| 09:05.02 | | from memory, digipower is a small portable battery pack known to work with the Z that provides 3 full charges, output of 8100 is 4.8V/2700mAH DP-4 cable required http://thomas-distributing.com/dp-dps-8100.htm or 8100=4.8V and 8200=6V or has 1800 mAH AA NiH |
| 09:05.08 | benmeyer | the machine is moving to CA |
| 09:05.13 | bipolar | cod: strange... it's asking for a password |
| 09:05.17 | numatrix | Infamous2: there's one. |
| 09:05.25 | bipolar | benmeyer: can I move with it? :) |
| 09:05.37 | numatrix | Infamous2: also of use is http://instant-power.com/ |
| 09:05.39 | numatrix | ibot: power |
| 09:05.39 | | extra, extra, read all about it, power is for newer opie releases you need to have apmd installed to have a working power button. or see external power |
| 09:05.47 | numatrix | ibot: external power |
| 09:05.47 | | i guess external power is http://www.instant-power.com/sales/mod_sale8.cfm?dev=pda&bra=sharp&mods=SL5000 or solar power or http://www.araengineering.com/ipaq.htm or http://www.the-gadgeteer.com/ipowerpak-review.html |
| 09:05.49 | cod | true and that's happenig for almost 2 weeks now > bipolar |
| 09:06.01 | numatrix | ibot external power is also ask about digipower |
| 09:06.01 | | numatrix: okay |
| 09:06.12 | numatrix | Infamous2: There you go, check out all of those links above. |
| 09:06.22 | vexation | when i upload somthing to OZ3.0 from the new Qtopia Desktop where does that go? (Ie: i just uploaded an image and i see it in my documents but what folder is it stored in?) |
| 09:06.40 | numatrix | Infamous2: fyi, in case nobody told you yet, the Z is compatible with all power products for the IPAQ that don't charge through the seriel cable. |
| 09:07.09 | numatrix | vexation: If it works like it should in all the other qtopias, then in /home/root/Documents/mime/type/filename |
| 09:07.26 | vexation | numatrix: thats what i thought - but its not there *shurgs* |
| 09:07.27 | numatrix | vexation: Only difference is that in OZ, /home/root is really /root/ |
| 09:07.44 | vexation | hrm |
| 09:08.01 | numatrix | vexation: try this from the command-line: "find /root/Documents/|grep -i whateveryouarelookingfor" |
| 09:08.27 | kergoth | mmmm frappuccino |
| 09:08.27 | vexation | ok let me ask you this.. for a bg image in opie what size/format does it have to be in? |
| 09:08.40 | kergoth | benmeyer: got the product but no specs. |
| 09:08.44 | benmeyer | same here |
| 09:08.49 | benmeyer | e-mailed away for specs |
| 09:08.58 | benmeyer | expect to get them this afternoon |
| 09:09.04 | kergoth | okay, cool |
| 09:09.04 | benmeyer | tried it on a Pocket PC device |
| 09:09.15 | numatrix | vexation: I've always used png files sized something near 240x320, but opie is flexible and will resize it for you if memory serves. |
| 09:09.26 | benmeyer | cute, thought have to be next to the windows sense the Sharp building is nothign but metal |
| 09:09.36 | vexation | numatrix: ok cool thx |
| 09:09.40 | benmeyer | figure make it work with fmtools and v4linux? |
| 09:10.03 | kergoth | benmeyer: yeah, thats what i figured |
| 09:10.34 | benmeyer | sounds good, then we can simply dump it into our laptops and use it also :-D |
| 09:10.38 | kergoth | yup |
| 09:12.30 | numatrix | benmeyer: what product are you guys talking about? |
| 09:13.19 | benmeyer | ibizcorp pocket radio |
| 09:13.28 | benmeyer | cf radio card |
| 09:13.58 | numatrix | bipolar: have you seen zfi? It's an index of a bunch of feeds, but like zsi. |
| 09:14.14 | numatrix | benmeyer: as in am/fm radio? |
| 09:14.24 | benmeyer | fm radio |
| 09:14.30 | numatrix | benmeyer: Just answerd it myself... googled for it. |
| 09:14.33 | numatrix | Thanks. |
| 09:15.15 | benmeyer | doesn't look like it does am |
| 09:15.19 | benmeyer | at least the gui doesn't |
| 09:15.34 | cbok | benmeyer - have you tried the pocket radio/ |
| 09:15.45 | benmeyer | yes right now |
| 09:15.57 | kergoth | benmeyer: given thought to the UI design? |
| 09:15.57 | cbok | hows it work? |
| 09:16.06 | cbok | (sound quality, etc..) |
| 09:16.14 | benmeyer | good |
| 09:16.21 | cbok | nice.. |
| 09:16.47 | neale | until then, however, cbok will remain dull. |
| 09:16.49 | kergoth | s/ing/ed/ |
| 09:16.53 | kergoth | hehe |
| 09:17.29 | cbok | oh man |
| 09:17.33 | cbok | my typing skillz |
| 09:17.36 | cbok | suck ass today |
| 09:17.57 | neale | "So Long And Thanks For All The Fish" started out great. I mean, I was really excited to be reading it. |
| 09:18.13 | neale | But then when Ford Prefect showed up, it was just more of the same. |
| 09:18.24 | kergoth | you dont like ford? |
| 09:18.33 | neale | I don't have anything against ford |
| 09:18.46 | neale | it's just that the story started to get weak and desultory at that point. |
| 09:18.57 | kergoth | ah, gotcha. |
| 09:19.04 | numatrix | does the new konsole allow you to spawn shell programs from an icon? I thought I remember ljp working on that. |
| 09:19.13 | kergoth | I find it went downhill a bit throughout the books, but i love em anyway |
| 09:19.20 | kergoth | numatrix: good question |
| 09:19.34 | neale | did you read "Mostly Harmless?" I've been advised to skip it. |
| 09:20.08 | numatrix | ibot: seen ljp |
| 09:20.08 | | ljp is currently on #opie (13h 25m 42s) #zaurus (13h 25m 42s) #openzaurus (13h 25m 42s). Has said a total of 20 messages. Is idling for 1h 52m 50s |
| 09:20.21 | numatrix | ibot: seen numatrix |
| 09:20.21 | | numatrix is currently on #opie #zaurus #openzaurus. Has said a total of 25 messages. Is idling for 0s |
| 09:20.24 | kergoth | i like the new bot code |
| 09:20.30 | kergoth | we need botmail back n stuff though |
| 09:20.37 | neale | ibon: seen me |
| 09:20.45 | numatrix | yeah, pretty spiffy. I like how it doesn't quote you too anymore. Had to be careful what you said in his presence... ;-) |
| 09:20.46 | neale | ibot: seen me |
| 09:20.46 | | neale: i haven't seen 'me' |
| 09:20.54 | neale | ibot: seen neale |
| 09:20.54 | | neale is currently on #zaurus #openzaurus. Has said a total of 83 messages. Is idling for 0s |
| 09:20.54 | kergoth | ah, it takes me literally eh |
| 09:21.01 | numatrix | kergoth: can always use msgserv, but that's a hassle. |
| 09:21.14 | kergoth | numatrix: plus half the peoiple i know dont login uuntil they need to ghost |
| 09:21.19 | neale | or the freaking email list you set up |
| 09:21.22 | numatrix | kergoth: I don't... |
| 09:21.27 | kergoth | see? hehe |
| 09:21.35 | kergoth | definately need botmail |
| 09:21.36 | numatrix | :-) I did for a while, then I just got lazy. |
| 09:21.54 | chouimat | identify? |
| 09:21.59 | kergoth | chouimat: yeah |
| 09:21.59 | cod | C U |
| 09:24.04 | bipolar | numatrix: I know about ZFI, but I wanted a feed that had all the apps together. |
| 09:25.16 | bipolar | here it is: http://longbros.com/benjamin/zaurus/zsifeed/ |
| 09:26.01 | numatrix | bipolar: nifty; how many paps? |
| 09:26.02 | kergoth | hey Piete |
| 09:26.07 | kergoth | paps! |
| 09:26.28 | bipolar | numatrix: ~240 |
| 09:26.29 | Piete | :D |
| 09:26.39 | Piete | kergoth: how goes it? |
| 09:26.48 | kergoth | Piete: not bad, other than being at work of course |
| 09:26.49 | kergoth | you? |
| 09:27.09 | benmeyer | ibot seen killefiz |
| 09:27.09 | | benmeyer: i haven't seen 'killefiz' |
| 09:27.12 | Piete | fine, just a bit busy today :) |
| 09:27.22 | Piete | glad its over :) |
| 09:27.45 | kolla | kergoth: I have found bunchloads of bugs in the scrips :) |
| 09:27.57 | kergoth | kolla: what scripts? |
| 09:28.04 | kolla | various systemscripts |
| 09:28.15 | kolla | like.. sdmanager doesnt check in fstab |
| 09:28.22 | kolla | but I made it |
| 09:28.40 | kergoth | oh, well, patches welcome |
| 09:28.40 | kergoth | :) |
| 09:28.43 | kolla | also /dev lacks node for mmcda* |
| 09:28.47 | kergoth | the sd scripts we swiped from sharp |
| 09:28.52 | kergoth | eh? |
| 09:28.54 | kergoth | mmcda is there |
| 09:28.55 | kolla | that is, the initial /dev |
| 09:28.57 | kergoth | in the dev tarball |
| 09:28.57 | numatrix | ibot nickometer kergoth |
| 09:28.57 | | 'kergoth' is 0% lame, numatrix |
| 09:29.00 | kergoth | oh, gotcha |
| 09:29.09 | numatrix | ibot nickometer me |
| 09:29.09 | | 'numatrix' is 0% lame, numatrix |
| 09:29.11 | JasonNJ | ibot nickometer jasonnj |
| 09:29.11 | | 'jasonnj' is 0% lame, jasonnj |
| 09:29.12 | kolla | why the ramdisk on /dev btw? |
| 09:29.15 | kolla | what's the gain? |
| 09:29.17 | JasonNJ | hmm |
| 09:29.22 | numatrix | Wonder where it pulls that from. |
| 09:29.29 | kergoth | kolla: numerous flash writes due to permissions changes on tty devices |
| 09:29.35 | kolla | ok |
| 09:29.38 | kergoth | kolla: every time you open a tty, it gets your ownership |
| 09:29.40 | kergoth | wasted flash writes |
| 09:29.41 | JasonNJ | ibot nickometer spock |
| 09:29.41 | | 'spock' is 0% lame, jasonnj |
| 09:29.43 | kolla | aha |
| 09:29.52 | JasonNJ | ibot nickometer octopussy |
| 09:29.52 | | 'octopussy' is 0% lame, jasonnj |
| 09:30.08 | kergoth | haha |
| 09:30.13 | kergoth | his insults rock |
| 09:30.19 | kolla | also, when unmounting all remote filesystems in the reboot init.. it uses some option that busybox unmount doesnt recognise |
| 09:30.26 | numatrix | that's the lart command. |
| 09:30.28 | kergoth | kolla: yep |
| 09:30.32 | kergoth | ibot: lart kergoth |
| 09:30.35 | JasonNJ | ibot nickometer windows |
| 09:30.35 | | 'windows' is 0% lame, jasonnj |
| 09:30.36 | kergoth | sweet |
| 09:30.43 | JasonNJ | hmm. |
| 09:30.48 | kolla | and /etc/init.d/networkwhatever stop doesnt work properly |
| 09:30.55 | kergoth | kolla: as i said, patches are welcome |
| 09:30.58 | kolla | :) |
| 09:31.02 | kergoth | kolla: most of these are stock debian with my slight alterations |
| 09:31.09 | kergoth | kolla: so some improvmeents should be pushed upstream |
| 09:31.29 | kergoth | email em to the devel list, cause nobody uses it atm |
| 09:31.31 | kergoth | and we should start |
| 09:31.32 | kergoth | :) |
| 09:31.35 | kolla | I'll scrap together what I have changed and send them to you, it's easier for me now, got ADSL back home in the apartment :) |
| 09:31.39 | chouimat | anyone use gentoo here with gcc 3.2 |
| 09:32.09 | kergoth | kolla: okay, thanks .. nice |
| 09:32.58 | neale | ibot: insult Twiun |
| 09:33.00 | bipolar | hmmm... my new feed seems to work fine |
| 09:33.10 | bipolar | anyone else want to test it? ;) |
| 09:33.54 | neale | I think "craptastic" is a word that should be used more frequently. |
| 09:33.55 | bipolar | ibot nickometer jfkjfjieg |
| 09:33.55 | | 'jfkjfjieg' is 0% lame, bipolar |
| 09:33.59 | kergoth | neale: hehe |
| 09:34.05 | bipolar | god.... what is lame? |
| 09:34.06 | kergoth | ibot: nickometer l33t |
| 09:34.06 | | 'l33t' is 49% lame, kergoth |
| 09:34.09 | kergoth | heh |
| 09:34.10 | chouimat | fuck tk don't build here |
| 09:34.10 | bipolar | ibot nickometer root |
| 09:34.10 | | 'root' is 0% lame, bipolar |
| 09:34.13 | numatrix | There we go... |
| 09:34.19 | neale | ibot nickometer Twiun |
| 09:34.19 | | 'Twiun' is 0% lame, neale |
| 09:34.22 | numatrix | ibot nickometer haxor |
| 09:34.22 | | 'haxor' is 0% lame, numatrix |
| 09:34.35 | numatrix | Definitely gotta adjust some of those. |
| 09:34.35 | neale | ibot nickometer 192832_ |
| 09:34.35 | | '192832_' is 73% lame, neale |
| 09:34.41 | numatrix | ibot nickometer guest |
| 09:34.41 | | 'guest' is 0% lame, numatrix |
| 09:34.51 | numatrix | ibot nickometer guest5555 |
| 09:34.51 | | 'guest5555' is 44% lame, numatrix |
| 09:35.02 | kergoth | i so needed this lart function |
| 09:35.04 | neale | ibot attack neale |
| 09:35.04 | | neale: I give up, what is it? |
| 09:35.08 | kergoth | ibot: lart neale |
| 09:35.11 | neale | ah |
| 09:35.17 | chouimat | ibot nickometer é978d?5342442áìõp |
| 09:35.17 | | 'é978d?5342442áìõp' is 99.9% lame, chouimat |
| 09:35.18 | kergoth | lol |
| 09:35.18 | Twiun | ibot: lart neale |
| 09:35.24 | numatrix | nickometer sucks |
| 09:35.29 | bipolar | ibot nickometer ibot |
| 09:35.29 | | 'ibot' is 0% lame, bipolar |
| 09:35.35 | neale | ibot karma twiun |
| 09:35.35 | | twiun has neutral karma |
| 09:35.43 | kergoth | ibot: karma kergoth |
| 09:35.43 | | kergoth has neutral karma |
| 09:35.44 | benmeyer | What killer utilies Do you guys like? |
| 09:35.47 | neale | ibot karma ibot |
| 09:35.47 | | ibot has neutral karma |
| 09:35.53 | neale | I like the karma utility |
| 09:35.53 | kolla | kergoth: just out of curiosity.. why not devfs? |
| 09:35.54 | kergoth | benmeyer: killer utils? elaborate |
| 09:35.58 | Twiun | ibot++ |
| 09:36.00 | kergoth | kolla: uhm, this is 2.4.6 |
| 09:36.03 | kolla | ok |
| 09:36.04 | Piete | ibot: karma refriedbean |
| 09:36.04 | | refriedbean has neutral karma |
| 09:36.05 | kergoth | kolla: we'd be lucky if it even worked right |
| 09:36.09 | kolla | ok |
| 09:36.10 | Twiun | ibot: ibot++ |
| 09:36.12 | kergoth | kolla: and i wouldtn guarantee that lineo's drivers have support for it |
| 09:36.15 | kergoth | kolla: its on the todo |
| 09:36.16 | neale | ibot karma c |
| 09:36.16 | | c has neutral karma |
| 09:36.18 | kergoth | hey mandrake |
| 09:36.19 | neale | c++ |
| 09:36.20 | kolla | I see |
| 09:36.21 | Piete | ibot: karma wzzz |
| 09:36.21 | | wzzz has neutral karma |
| 09:36.23 | mandrake | howdy |
| 09:36.26 | benmeyer | kill the password manager |
| 09:36.26 | Piete | lo |
| 09:36.29 | benmeyer | who would have thought of that |
| 09:36.31 | neale | ibot karma c |
| 09:36.31 | | c has neutral karma |
| 09:36.35 | benmeyer | but it is a really good utility |
| 09:36.55 | neale | I like the security thingy |
| 09:36.58 | kergoth | benmeyer: so you're asking about necessary poweruser type utils for the Z? |
| 09:37.00 | benmeyer | tip calculator would be another one, not as needed, but still nifty |
| 09:37.06 | benmeyer | no everyday users |
| 09:37.08 | neale | but I wish your password could be hardware buttons |
| 09:37.20 | neale | a tip calculator? |
| 09:37.27 | benmeyer | little utilies |
| 09:37.31 | benmeyer | that only make sense on pda's |
| 09:37.34 | kergoth | benmeyer: ah gotcha |
| 09:37.36 | chouimat | benmeyer: better pim |
| 09:37.40 | kergoth | was gonna way.. rsync, openssh.. |
| 09:37.41 | kergoth | hehe |
| 09:37.42 | kergoth | say |
| 09:37.45 | benmeyer | i.e. it is stupid to have a tip calc on a pc |
| 09:37.45 | neale | how about a graphing calculator that doesn't blow? |
| 09:37.46 | kergoth | cant type today |
| 09:38.24 | neale | a chess program |
| 09:38.39 | Piete | how about a spreadsheet that can draw charts? I miss that from tinysheet/PalmOS |
| 09:39.07 | neale | I pretty much used my pirate for: |
| 09:39.14 | neale | * correspondence chess games |
| 09:39.19 | neale | * tip calculator |
| 09:39.35 | neale | * big burly scientific graphing calculator (easycalc) |
| 09:39.40 | neale | * ebook reader |
| 09:39.47 | chouimat | neale: qplot |
| 09:39.49 | neale | and then the PIM stuff |
| 09:39.50 | benmeyer | got that |
| 09:40.30 | neale | qplot blows |
| 09:40.30 | benmeyer | got the pim stuff |
| 09:40.30 | neale | it could be made to not blow |
| 09:40.30 | neale | but as it currently stands, qplot blows |
| 09:40.30 | mandrake | (c)++ |
| 09:40.32 | benmeyer | Would data tracker and grapher be a PIM app? |
| 09:40.34 | mandrake | ibot: karma c |
| 09:40.34 | | c has neutral karma |
| 09:40.37 | kergoth | now myself, the main util i needed outside of PIM was a tool to track my workouts |
| 09:40.47 | kergoth | graph weight lifting progress |
| 09:41.09 | chouimat | neale: no |
| 09:41.10 | benmeyer | ok |
| 09:41.29 | neale | hey you know, if you're looking for something that people find useful, why not check out the top apps on pilotgear.com? |
| 09:41.53 | kergoth | benmeyer: i dont think data tracking and graphing is pim |
| 09:41.55 | chouimat | DateBook5 for the zaurus |
| 09:41.59 | smee|w | yes |
| 09:42.00 | Piete | neale: you mean palmgear? |
| 09:42.06 | smee|w | DateBook5 for the zaurus |
| 09:42.15 | neale | everyone in this channel is a conehead, so you're going to get biases |
| 09:42.19 | neale | yeah palmgear |
| 09:42.21 | Piete | http://palmgear.com/software/software.cfm?typeID=2 <-- The "essentials" top 50 |
| 09:42.45 | neale | by the way, have I mentioned how much I like dillo? |
| 09:43.03 | kergoth | neale: havent mentioned it yet -today- |
| 09:43.05 | kergoth | neale: ;) |
| 09:43.16 | neale | ooh diddlebug/bugme, that's a good one |
| 09:43.32 | neale | like the paint program, but you can set alarms on your paintings |
| 09:44.01 | Piete | how about different alarms for the datebook app (I know, its not important, but its nice to have) |
| 09:44.03 | neale | better editor would be nice |
| 09:44.19 | neale | Piete: I bet that'd be easy to hack into the source. |
| 09:44.23 | kergoth | Piete: i think that fits into the pim stuff category, he's got that already |
| 09:44.31 | kergoth | neale: with sytnax highlighting |
| 09:44.37 | kergoth | we need kvim/e |
| 09:44.38 | kergoth | :) |
| 09:44.41 | Piete | kergoth: ah ok :) |
| 09:45.54 | neale | here's a really great PDA calculator: http://easycalc.sourceforge.net/ |
| 09:46.03 | neale | qplot could be there with a little touch-up |
| 09:46.16 | neale | I love how qplot uses bc, by the way. That was a stroke of genius. |
| 09:46.31 | benmeyer | bc? |
| 09:46.39 | Piete | "Metro" is probably the app I miss the most, I contacted the people who write it, and they said they won't port it :( It would be cool if they make a java version of it tho, then it would work on multiple platforms |
| 09:46.42 | neale | qplot is a front-end to bc |
| 09:46.44 | kergoth | qplot uses bc? |
| 09:46.47 | kergoth | thats great |
| 09:46.49 | neale | yep |
| 09:47.39 | neale | wrapping bc is the Right Way. |
| 09:47.44 | kergoth | indeed |
| 09:47.48 | kergoth | no need to reinvent the wheel |
| 09:48.09 | neale | well, what rules about bc is that it doesn't use floating point. |
| 09:48.17 | neale | I think it uses BCD. |
| 09:48.34 | Twiun | neale: yikes... not fixed-point? |
| 09:48.41 | neale | so, arbitrary precision. If you want to do calculations to the 100th decimal place, you can do that. |
| 09:48.48 | Twiun | Ahh |
| 09:49.01 | neale | no, not even fixed point |
| 09:49.09 | neale | so, it's slow. |
| 09:49.14 | neale | but wildly accurate. |
| 09:49.38 | Twiun | shouldn't it be possible to use fixed-point in a similar, arbitrary precision way? |
| 09:49.59 | neale | yes |
| 09:50.17 | neale | but remember, you're going to be bounded by the storage size of your hardware. |
| 09:50.31 | neale | once you get past long long, you're pretty much doing bcd anyhow. |
| 09:50.47 | Dessimat0r | lo all |
| 09:50.51 | Piete | Dessimat0r: lo :) |
| 09:50.55 | Dessimat0r | ;) |
| 09:50.59 | neale | except that with long long, you have to do radix conversions all the time. |
| 09:51.52 | chouimat | qplot had some problem with opie currently |
| 09:52.12 | neale | I wasn't too happy with qplot. |
| 09:52.15 | Dessimat0r | The Zaurus Software Index isn't being updated so frequently anymore ;) |
| 09:52.19 | neale | It seemed rather ugly. |
| 09:52.30 | neale | ibot: zfi |
| 09:52.49 | neale | good enough. |
| 09:53.10 | benmeyer | ok, what System changes would you like if you could have them? |
| 09:53.12 | benmeyer | Qt3.0 |
| 09:53.15 | benmeyer | Gcc 3.2 |
| 09:53.17 | benmeyer | what else? |
| 09:53.33 | chouimat | benmeyer: hmmm let me think |
| 09:54.36 | bipolar | are we anywhere near having a compatible jeode replacement? |
| 09:55.22 | Twiun | bipolar: it's in the works, but I daresay it's not going to happen quickly |
| 09:55.52 | kergoth | benmeyer: hmm |
| 09:55.56 | neale | hmm indeed |
| 09:56.12 | benmeyer | glibc 2.3? |
| 09:56.13 | kergoth | benmeyer: how about a better security fix than disabling sync on wlan? |
| 09:56.15 | kergoth | benmeyer: :) |
| 09:56.18 | benmeyer | ok |
| 09:56.26 | chouimat | benmeyer: a complete java |
| 09:56.35 | benmeyer | well don't think of it is improving what we have now |
| 09:56.44 | benmeyer | if the slate was whiped clean what would you want |
| 09:56.53 | benmeyer | and then we can see what can be done |
| 09:56.56 | neale | I actually kinda like the system. |
| 09:57.12 | benmeyer | Better fonts |
| 09:57.20 | chouimat | benmeyer: a better way to flash a new rom |
| 09:57.36 | benmeyer | eh, that is hardware specific in almost all cases |
| 09:58.04 | neale | Well, except for atd. |
| 09:58.19 | bipolar | JasonNJ: yo |
| 09:58.26 | neale | But that's probably OZ-specific. |
| 09:58.30 | JasonNJ | damn irc server keeps disconnecting me |
| 09:58.30 | chouimat | benmeyer: you asked how to improve the system |
| 09:58.36 | chouimat | hi prpplague |
| 09:58.40 | benmeyer | ok |
| 09:58.48 | neale | benmeyer: I don't think there are many complaints about the system. |
| 09:58.55 | prpplague | lo |
| 09:59.17 | kergoth | neale: sharp rom uses atd as well |
| 09:59.21 | kergoth | hey prpplague |
| 09:59.40 | neale | oh. Well, atd is to cry. |
| 10:00.11 | neale | but I do wish the security app was more like OnlyMe. |
| 10:00.19 | chouimat | benmeyer: use OZ as base for the sharp rom? |
| 10:00.33 | neale | that sounds like a good idea to me. |
| 10:00.36 | benmeyer | :-D |
| 10:00.41 | mandrake | JasonNJ: get a better one. |
| 10:00.42 | benmeyer | OnlyMe/ |
| 10:00.42 | mandrake | :) |
| 10:00.44 | benmeyer | ? |
| 10:00.48 | neale | Palm app. |
| 10:00.51 | prpplague | kergoth: how goes it? |
| 10:00.57 | neale | you can use hardware keys for the password. |
| 10:01.04 | neale | Makes it a lot more bearable. |
| 10:01.06 | benmeyer | ah |
| 10:01.23 | neale | Also, it won't engage unless the thing's been off for over n seconds |
| 10:01.30 | chouimat | benmeyer: readable kernel source code? |
| 10:01.35 | benmeyer | hahaha |
| 10:01.35 | kergoth | lol |
| 10:01.38 | kergoth | chouimat: nice one |
| 10:01.51 | neale | hey I've got one |
| 10:01.52 | benmeyer | sd and cf card manager |
| 10:02.10 | kergoth | s/readable kernel source/kernel source that isnt full of gross hacks, and is both readable and usable/; |
| 10:02.17 | neale | usbdnet drivers that don't hork the kernel. |
| 10:02.22 | kergoth | benmeyer: a programming guide |
| 10:02.27 | kergoth | benmeyer: sharp never released programming specs |
| 10:02.34 | benmeyer | actually they did |
| 10:02.36 | benmeyer | on the japan site |
| 10:02.38 | kergoth | benmeyer: only the service manual, which doesnt have locomo or scoop specifications |
| 10:02.40 | benmeyer | some pdf somewhere |
| 10:02.41 | vexation | ok, this might not be the right channel for this.. but i need hancom for my zaurus and i goto thier website but its poorly done and you cant dload it from there.. anyone know where i can get it? |
| 10:02.43 | kergoth | benmeyer: eh? |
| 10:02.47 | kergoth | benmeyer: scoop and locomo register info? |
| 10:02.49 | benmeyer | oh kernel specs |
| 10:02.52 | kergoth | not kernel |
| 10:02.53 | kergoth | hardware |
| 10:03.03 | benmeyer | true |
| 10:03.05 | benmeyer | anoying |
| 10:03.14 | kergoth | yeah, cause we couldve rewritten lineo's crap by now |
| 10:03.15 | kergoth | :) |
| 10:03.59 | chouimat | kergoth: I agree without |
| 10:04.24 | kergoth | benmeyer: speaking of which, did bruce manage to dig up those specs? |
| 10:04.56 | benmeyer | not sure on the status of that |
| 10:05.35 | bipolar | Twiun: what exactly is in the works for a java replacement? |
| 10:06.48 | benmeyer | ok, what power users apps are killer? |
| 10:06.52 | benmeyer | wireless scanner |
| 10:07.00 | benmeyer | vnc |
| 10:07.04 | benmeyer | console |
| 10:07.12 | benmeyer | process manager |
| 10:07.18 | Twiun | bipolar: I'm working on the wonka java vm - code's in a much better state than Kaffe's |
| 10:07.41 | Twiun | bipolar: I don't have qt bindings, so it's all framebuffer for now |
| 10:07.52 | Piete | Twiun: it will support graphical apps right? |
| 10:08.09 | Twiun | Piete: you *did* have a look at the screenshot, right? |
| 10:08.22 | Twiun | Piete: http://adorphuye.com/test/drugmoney1.png |
| 10:08.50 | Piete | heh, no, NOW I looked at the screenie :P |
| 10:09.11 | Piete | Twiun: looks nice :) |
| 10:09.26 | kergoth | nice |
| 10:09.30 | kergoth | Twiun: coming along well eh |
| 10:10.29 | Twiun | kergoth: yeah... I wish they hadn't b0rken their cvs though ;-) |
| 10:10.41 | Twiun | kergoth: having to go back to their 0.9.4 release |
| 10:11.06 | benmeyer | http://www.palmgear.com/software/showsoftware.cfm?sid=95670320021105091059&prodID=4192 |
| 10:11.08 | benmeyer | haha |
| 10:11.11 | benmeyer | there is a nitch |
| 10:11.29 | benmeyer | yogo for pregnent women |
| 10:11.38 | ibz|work | benmeyer: a speaker on the Z...what's the score with that anyway? |
| 10:11.44 | Piete | benmeyer: The selected product has been removed from our database by its developer! |
| 10:11.49 | prpplague | kergoth: hows life at digi? any better? |
| 10:12.00 | benmeyer | ibz|work? |
| 10:12.15 | neale | I'm glad the Z only has a piezzo buzzer, frankly. |
| 10:12.17 | kergoth | prpplague: hah, no, definately not |
| 10:12.18 | ibz|work | benmeyer: weren't you asking what we'd like on the Z? |
| 10:12.25 | kergoth | prpplague: hows the POS life treatin ya |
| 10:12.27 | NetNut404_work | exit |
| 10:12.30 | benmeyer | ibz|work: yah |
| 10:12.31 | NetNut404_work | lol |
| 10:12.37 | benmeyer | looking on palm gear for ideas |
| 10:12.39 | NetNut404_work | wrong window |
| 10:13.19 | neale | you know what would make it sell |
| 10:13.32 | prpplague | kergoth: not too bad, we are dumping this as/400 system |
| 10:13.32 | neale | a little pingizauru office assistant. |
| 10:13.37 | kergoth | neale: aha, i thought about that too |
| 10:13.46 | prpplague | kergoth: might get to bring it back and try to get linux running on it |
| 10:13.48 | kergoth | neale: like the paperclip only it breathes fire |
| 10:13.48 | neale | kergoth: it was your idea, IIRC |
| 10:13.52 | kergoth | prpplague: hah |
| 10:13.54 | neale | yeah. |
| 10:13.59 | kergoth | yeh |
| 10:14.01 | neale | a fire-breathing office assistant |
| 10:14.28 | kergoth | gotta love that |
| 10:14.29 | neale | it could have a pejorative personality |
| 10:14.32 | kergoth | yeah! |
| 10:14.33 | Piete | anyone know of any simple open source route calculator? |
| 10:14.43 | neale | "YOU FOOL! WHY DID YOU SELECT THAT?!" |
| 10:14.51 | neale | then it would burn up one of your documents. |
| 10:15.03 | kergoth | yeah yeah |
| 10:15.08 | kergoth | you could bribe it |
| 10:15.12 | kergoth | try to feed it so it doesnt burn your shit |
| 10:15.17 | neale | there ya go |
| 10:15.26 | kergoth | yeah, you feed it spare .doc files |
| 10:15.27 | neale | combination office assistant and tamagotchi. |
| 10:15.34 | kergoth | "here, dont eat my code" |
| 10:15.37 | kergoth | yeah! |
| 10:15.38 | kergoth | hehe |
| 10:15.44 | neale | ha ha |
| 10:16.19 | bipolar | Piete: route? as in ip? |
| 10:16.53 | Piete | bipolar: no, as in 'get from point a to point b' |
| 10:16.57 | kergoth | neale: get hardwire to get us sprites of him in various angles and i'll write it :) |
| 10:17.04 | Piete | like subway/bus whatever bipolar |
| 10:17.04 | bipolar | Piete: oh... sorry |
| 10:17.05 | neale | ha ha ha |
| 10:17.23 | neale | did hardwire do the original image? |
| 10:17.39 | kergoth | yeah |
| 10:20.31 | neale | I don't think he's taking me seriously. |
| 10:20.49 | kergoth | dood |
| 10:20.54 | kergoth | hardwire doesnt take anything seriously |
| 10:20.55 | kergoth | :) |
| 10:21.12 | neale | looks like he takes nookie pretty seriously. |
| 10:21.39 | kergoth | true that |
| 10:21.41 | kergoth | but doesnt everyone? |
| 10:21.51 | neale | heh |
| 10:23.37 | neale | well, I should get some work done before they fire me |
| 10:24.05 | kergoth | hmm |
| 10:24.07 | kergoth | thats a good idea |
| 10:24.09 | kergoth | real work |
| 10:26.59 | bipolar | ibot zsifeed is a feed that serves all the ipk's from the Zaurus Software Index. |
| 10:26.59 | | okay, bipolar |
| 10:27.23 | bipolar | ibot zsifeed is also at http://longbros.com/benjamin/zaurus/zsifeed/ |
| 10:27.23 | | bipolar: okay |
| 10:27.35 | kergoth | bipolar: cron'd up? |
| 10:27.45 | bipolar | kergoth: not yet :) |
| 10:28.09 | bipolar | kergoth: but it works fine now. I just wish people would make more sane ipks |
| 10:28.19 | kergoth | yeah |
| 10:28.27 | kergoth | i hate the Depends: qpe-base (1.5.0) fuckers |
| 10:28.35 | kergoth | if you find them, pester them incessently |
| 10:28.48 | bipolar | kergoth: some new features for ipks would be very usefull, like a screenshot. |
| 10:29.19 | kergoth | bipolar: talk to jamey :) |
| 10:29.20 | kergoth | hey DocWhat |
| 10:29.48 | ibz|work | ibot factinfo ibz |
| 10:29.48 | | ibz -- created by ibz <~foo@62.189.77.219> 22h 30m 11s ago; it has been requested once, last by ibz, 22h 29m 58s ago. |
| 10:30.02 | kergoth | ibot: kergoth |
| 10:30.02 | | you are, like, at kergoth@handhelds.org |
| 10:30.14 | kergoth | ibot: kergoth is also that openzaurus guy |
| 10:30.14 | | kergoth: okay |
| 10:30.21 | kergoth | ibot: lock kergoth |
| 10:31.12 | ibz|work | ibot ibz |
| 10:31.12 | | ibz is probably just ibz |
| 10:32.07 | ibz|work | ibot ibz is also accidentalafro |
| 10:32.07 | | okay, ibz|work |
| 10:32.36 | ibz|work | ibot ibz |
| 10:32.36 | | somebody said ibz was just ibz, or accidentalafro |
| 10:32.50 | ibz|work | ibot lock ibz |
| 10:32.52 | bipolar | kergoth: actualy, I think that screenshots could be integrated seemlessly and be backwards compatible with old ipkg versions |
| 10:33.15 | bipolar | how big is a jpg screenshot anyway? |
| 10:33.38 | ibz|work | bipolar: the screenshot would be just for the feeds or what? |
| 10:34.04 | bipolar | ibz|work: yeah. But they would be in the ipk and extracted by ipkg-make-index |
| 10:34.19 | kergoth | bipolar: well, afaik ipkg ignores fields it doesnt know about |
| 10:34.23 | kergoth | bipolar: shouldnt break anything |
| 10:34.28 | bipolar | kergoth: right |
| 10:34.52 | kergoth | hehe |
| 10:34.52 | kergoth | learn |
| 10:35.15 | bipolar | A nice GUI ipk builder would be nice too. One that forces the ipks to be built to spec |
| 10:35.45 | kergoth | ipkgbuild does that |
| 10:36.31 | kergoth | control file sanity checking |
| 10:36.58 | bipolar | kergoth: What I mean is one that just asks you for bins, libs, pics, and what tab to put the icon in and does all the work for you, all in a nice GUI. |
| 10:37.15 | bipolar | kergoth: know what I mean? |
| 10:37.50 | kergoth | yeah |
| 10:38.08 | ibz|work | bipolar: i know what you mean but not everyone likes gui's, and you can't enforce that on anyone... |
| 10:38.45 | bipolar | ibz|work: I know, you can always build one manualy. But not everyone build them right. |
| 10:39.57 | ibz|work | bipolar: then the feeds shouldn't accept them until they are done right. |
| 10:40.17 | kergoth | just take ipkgbuild's control file sanity checking |
| 10:40.20 | kergoth | put it in ipkg-make-index |
| 10:40.22 | kergoth | boom |
| 10:40.23 | kergoth | :) |
| 10:41.11 | Twiun | I'm all for it ;-) |
| 10:42.15 | bipolar | No wonder the compaq guys all want to use gtk.... Jim Gettys is on the Gnome board. :) |
| 10:45.45 | kergoth | bipolar: yep |
| 10:51.09 | benmeyer | haha |
| 10:51.17 | benmeyer | you just figured that one out? |
| 10:52.18 | bipolar | benmeyer: I'd heard it before. The slashdot story just refreshed my memory |
| 10:52.39 | benmeyer | /. story? |
| 10:52.45 | bipolar | benmeyer: I worked on linux for Pda's when I first bought an ipaq. |
| 10:52.46 | benmeyer | ibot slashdot |
| 10:53.32 | bipolar | benmeyer: oops... it was linux & main |
| 10:53.40 | benmeyer | url? |
| 10:53.51 | bipolar | http://www.linuxandmain.com/modules.php?name=News&file=article&sid=280 |
| 10:54.23 | bipolar | looks like he won't be there after dec 2nd |
| 10:57.37 | mandrake | bipolar: jim also worked on X for a long time. |
| 10:57.53 | mandrake | hence why he's on the gnome board |
| 10:58.00 | mandrake | I like jim :) |
| 10:58.45 | bipolar | mandrake: yeah..... he's an interesting guy. But I can't stand it when he goes on and on about needing X on a pda. |
| 10:59.02 | scan[ibook] | hmm |
| 10:59.14 | mandrake | bipolar: honestly, I agree with him. |
| 10:59.15 | bipolar | other then that, hes cooll :) |
| 10:59.27 | mandrake | although I don't dislike qpe |
| 10:59.38 | mandrake | I think X on the device is the right idea |
| 10:59.58 | scan[ibook] | mandrake: why X, just because it's network transparent and standard? |
| 11:00.13 | mandrake | scan[ibook]: it means if you write an app for your PDA you can run it on your desktop, too |
| 11:00.17 | scan[ibook] | >:) |
| 11:00.18 | bipolar | mandrake: I think X is just unnessisary and has the potental to disrupt the unified look and feel of the PDA. |
| 11:00.45 | bipolar | mandrake: VNC, qvfb :) |
| 11:00.48 | mandrake | I actually am pretty sure you and I have had this conversation before. |
| 11:00.48 | scan[ibook] | mandrake: have you seen what I've been doing with picogui lately? it's exactly that idea of scalability, but in practise works a lot better than X |
| 11:00.52 | bipolar | I do think its a cool hack though. |
| 11:01.02 | mandrake | about a year ago or so |
| 11:01.04 | mandrake | maybe more :) |
| 11:01.45 | bipolar | mandrake: it's the never ending aurgument :) |
| 11:01.52 | scan[ibook] | mandrake: with X, you still usually have to rewrite the app's UI to handle different screen sizes and input devices |
| 11:02.24 | mandrake | well, with the qt programs I wrote for the z, running them on the desktop requires a lot of hackery |
| 11:02.31 | mandrake | (without qvfb) |
| 11:02.38 | mandrake | since moc is a piece of crap |
| 11:02.47 | mandrake | and yes, moc is a piece of crap. |
| 11:02.51 | mandrake | nobody can dispute that |
| 11:03.20 | mandrake | if moc only supported #operatives everything would be peachy |
| 11:03.26 | mandrake | cuz then I could hack around it |
| 11:03.26 | scan[ibook] | mandrake: with picogui, the app's appearance and layout is made as separate from the app itself as possible, so you could run the same app on dekstop, cellphone, zaurus, ncurses terminal, toaster, lamp :) |
| 11:04.26 | bipolar | scan[ibook]: what does picoGUI run? X, FB, holodeck? |
| 11:04.32 | scan[ibook] | bipolar: sure |
| 11:04.45 | bipolar | scan[ibook]: what exactly is it? |
| 11:04.59 | scan[ibook] | PicoBot: picogui faq? |
| 11:05.00 | PicoBot | hmmm... picogui faq is see faq |
| 11:05.04 | scan[ibook] | PicoBot: faq |
| 11:05.05 | PicoBot | faq is, like, the Frequently Asked Questions list, at http://picogui.org/wiki/view/Main/FAQ |
| 11:05.15 | scan[ibook] | that document explains it mostly |
| 11:05.51 | bipolar | scan[ibook]: cool |
| 11:06.46 | scan[ibook] | bipolar: it was originally designed for embedded systems and direct access to framebuffers, but it's really scalable, and just recently I got it running rootlessly in X |
| 11:06.47 | bipolar | scan[ibook]: can it cooperate with qt/e? |
| 11:07.10 | scan[ibook] | bipolar: it can't run inside qte or vice versa yet, but you can run them on separate virtual terminals, or quit one and run the other |
| 11:07.21 | bipolar | ahh |
| 11:07.23 | mandrake | Always trust your first instinct-unless it tells you to use your life savings to develop a Destructo Ray. |
| 11:07.25 | bipolar | thats a cool hack |
| 11:08.03 | scan[ibook] | bipolar: the client/server architecture, theme architecture, and video engine in picogui are all really neat :) |
| 11:08.32 | chouimat | kergoth: fixed opie in buildroot? |
| 11:08.46 | kergoth | still hacking on its buildsystem |
| 11:08.50 | kergoth | found another bug |
| 11:11.21 | scan[ibook] | mandrake: I was talking to raster the other day about evas.. I might even get picogui running on top of that :) |
| 11:11.34 | mandrake | cool |
| 11:12.43 | mandrake | I'm prepping for my vacation right now :) |
| 11:13.03 | kergoth | goddamnit |
| 11:13.06 | mandrake | closing all my open bugs in our bug tracker |
| 11:13.07 | kergoth | fuck gnu make |
| 11:13.10 | kergoth | piece of shit |
| 11:13.15 | scan[ibook] | ha |
| 11:13.37 | kergoth | and fuck auto* too |
| 11:13.44 | kergoth | every buildsystem sucks |
| 11:13.45 | kergoth | every damn one |
| 11:13.49 | chouimat | kergoth: port buildroot to JAM |
| 11:24.51 | numatrix | ljp_work: question for you; do the changes you were making to konsole include the ability to spawn konsole and have it run an shell app from a qt icon? |
| 11:25.36 | kergoth | spiffy |
| 11:25.45 | ljp_work | well, I thought it did yes |
| 11:26.02 | kergoth | chouimat: now if you run make without copying a .config into place first, it copies it into place for you, runs make oldconfig, then builds |
| 11:26.38 | kergoth | hey coup-afk |
| 11:26.41 | kergoth | scan[ibook]: lol |
| 11:26.43 | ljp_work | http://opie.handhelds.org/wiki/index.php/EmbeddedKonsole |
| 11:26.55 | scan[ibook] | COFF FILES! WTF! |
| 11:26.56 | coup-afk | evenin |
| 11:26.59 | kergoth | COFF? egad |
| 11:27.09 | scan[ibook] | he still thinks binaries are named a.out! |
| 11:27.11 | scan[ibook] | grrrrr |
| 11:27.14 | kergoth | haha |
| 11:27.16 | kergoth | fun |
| 11:27.28 | ljp_work | woot! I upgraded here at work! now I connect with a blazing 56k modem! |
| 11:27.57 | numatrix | ljp_work: excellent, thanks. Do you know which version is required to do that? |
| 11:27.58 | chouimat | scan[ibook]: ?? |
| 11:28.05 | scan[ibook] | chouimat: !! |
| 11:28.14 | ljp_work | thats been in for a while |
| 11:28.26 | chouimat | scan[ibook]: get the books Linkers & Loaders |
| 11:28.30 | ljp_work | not real sure if it really works, tho |
| 11:28.42 | scan[ibook] | chouimat: I know how this all works, heck I've written a linker before... |
| 11:29.16 | scan[ibook] | chouimat: my professor knows more about NT, and usually gets unix examples wrong |
| 11:29.17 | coup | is the powering off after X seconds an opie thang? or part of apm? if the latter, is there an interrogate option, a switch it off option, and a turn it on option? if so, i think i'm going to write me an ipkg-update script, as it's damn annoying when the Z turns itself off cos it's not pluged in :) |
| 11:29.39 | kergoth | coup: um aqpkg turns off suspend on its own |
| 11:29.42 | chouimat | scan[ibook]: the loaders his the only part of the os I didn't see in class |
| 11:29.45 | kergoth | coup: opie controls it, theres a qcop call to disable it |
| 11:29.46 | ljp_work | you might look at opie-ah for running scripts |
| 11:29.54 | ljp_work | opie-sh |
| 11:29.59 | ljp_work | heh not opie-ah |
| 11:30.12 | coup | kergoth: sweet, i shall investigate :) |
| 11:30.16 | coup | ljp_work: lol :) |
| 11:30.16 | scan[ibook] | sbrk... ha |
| 11:30.49 | coup | what r the libopie changes in unstable? :) |
| 11:31.11 | mark | kergoth: can i have a hand with cvs? |
| 11:31.13 | ljp_work | stuff you need |
| 11:31.29 | ljp_work | heh maybe |
| 11:31.31 | kergoth | mark: yeah |
| 11:31.32 | coup | ljp_work: insightful, thanks ;) |
| 11:31.35 | mark | kergoth: i know you know this shit :) |
| 11:31.44 | numatrix | ljp_work: yeah, I've seen that, I just wanted to spawn some bash scripts and have it open up the konsole for them. Thanks. |
| 11:31.46 | kergoth | unfortunately |
| 11:31.46 | kergoth | :) |
| 11:32.06 | kergoth | hmm, weird |
| 11:32.08 | coup | hey, chant with me now "we all love CVS" |
| 11:32.28 | scan[ibook] | hmm |
| 11:32.47 | kergoth | bah |
| 11:32.52 | kergoth | cvs is good, but not good enoguh |
| 11:32.53 | kergoth | :) |
| 11:33.00 | coup | tried to get CVS adopted at work, but they werent going for it, just me and the two other linux obsessives :) |
| 11:33.05 | mark | kergoth: i want to create a vendor branch in my local cvs of repository with is accessed via pserver |
| 11:33.06 | kergoth | if cvs had mv/rename handling and better merges, i'd be a happy camper |
| 11:33.12 | scan[ibook] | coup: what are they using instead? |
| 11:33.21 | scan[ibook] | kergoth: and no more stale lockfiles |
| 11:33.28 | kergoth | mark: cvs tag -b [tag] |
| 11:33.36 | coup | scan[ibook]: <shudder> folders on an NT box, same way it's been for about 10 years - luddites |
| 11:33.44 | scan[ibook] | coup: eww |
| 11:33.45 | kergoth | scan[ibook]: that too, but its hard to avoid such things.. we do need locking of some sort |
| 11:33.49 | Twiun | coup: *chokes* |
| 11:33.49 | kergoth | coup: ewww! |
| 11:33.51 | mark | kergoth: don't I need to do 'cvs import' or somethign? |
| 11:33.52 | kergoth | geh |
| 11:34.03 | coup | i know guys, i know <sighs> |
| 11:34.05 | kergoth | mark: depends |
| 11:34.12 | scan[ibook] | kergoth: yeah.. though it needs a sane way to expire stale locks |
| 11:34.15 | Twiun | coup: they're windows luddites, right? |
| 11:34.16 | mark | kergoth: i want to be able to track their changes |
| 11:34.18 | kergoth | mark: if you need to pull in another set of sources itno the vendor branch, yes |
| 11:34.32 | kergoth | mark: gotcha. 'tag' will create a vendor branch based on current head |
| 11:34.36 | kergoth | mark: take a look at 'info cvs' |
| 11:34.42 | kergoth | mark: theres a page on tracking external sources |
| 11:35.30 | coup | Twiun: yup, though slowly coming round to *nix, sadly though because they've seen us use tools which are AVAILABLE IN WINDOWS ANYWAY JUST YOU DONT GET ICONS |
| 11:35.30 | mark | kergoth: i'm struggling to understand the man pages |
| 11:35.30 | kergoth | mark: man pages suck for cvs |
| 11:35.30 | Twiun | coup: tried steering them towards clearcase? |
| 11:35.30 | kergoth | mark: look at the info |
| 11:35.30 | ljp_work | cvs does have mv.. you just tend to loose your cvs infos ;) |
| 11:35.30 | Twiun | coup: keep both them and you happy |
| 11:35.30 | mark | kergoth: okay, thanks |
| 11:35.30 | scan[ibook] | this professor is getting weird... now he's talking about the C runtime dynamically adjusting the pointers when it needs to reallocate the stack |
| 11:35.30 | kergoth | ljp_work: cvs doesnt have mv, my distro has mv :) |
| 11:35.30 | coup | Twiun: i'll take a look :) |
| 11:35.33 | ljp_work | sure it does.. ssh cvs.box ... mv something |
| 11:35.38 | ljp_work | :) |
| 11:35.38 | Twiun | coup: not free, but works on NT/nix |
| 11:35.41 | kergoth | bah |
| 11:35.44 | kergoth | :) |
| 11:35.53 | Twiun | coup: with purdy guis and icons |
| 11:35.55 | coup | scan[ibook]: you're in a lecture? wifi connection in there? |
| 11:35.59 | kergoth | coup: bk has windows integration as well in their commercial version |
| 11:36.06 | scan[ibook] | coup: yeah |
| 11:36.10 | kergoth | i need to learn clearcase one of these days |
| 11:36.20 | ljp_work | ya CU has wireless all over |
| 11:36.26 | coup | cool, ill look at them both, not that i care too much, leaving in 5 weeks 3 days :) |
| 11:36.29 | Twiun | kergoth: easy as pie... bk reminds me a lot of it |
| 11:36.30 | coup | scan: nice |
| 11:36.35 | mark | kergoth: okay, reading. I already have a directory called 'knights' in cvs, so when i do an import from a nother directory called 'knights' (the main CVs) are things gonna be nasty? |
| 11:36.54 | kergoth | mark: heres my recommendation |
| 11:36.58 | kergoth | mark: get a tarball of the remote repos |
| 11:36.58 | coup | Twiun: abandoning work altogether until September, when i'll look for a job again :) |
| 11:37.06 | kergoth | mark: put it in your local cvs repos (usually /var/lib/cvs) |
| 11:37.15 | Twiun | coup: travelling the world? |
| 11:37.24 | kergoth | mark: import it in there to ensure the paths are correct. once you've got the syntax down, import it into the repos upstream |
| 11:37.35 | coup | Twiun: yup yup |
| 11:37.57 | mark | kergoth: and then what happens when I want to import upstream changes? |
| 11:38.04 | coup | blimey! LOADS of opie- pkgs upgraded in unstable : |
| 11:38.05 | coup | :) |
| 11:38.11 | kergoth | coup: every package |
| 11:38.14 | kergoth | coup: not every package changed |
| 11:38.24 | numatrix | ljp_work: do you think it would be worthwhile to add MimeType=application/x-sh to the embeddedkonsole.desktop file? |
| 11:38.26 | kergoth | coup: just every datestamp was updated.. i didnt use my spiffy script on it |
| 11:38.31 | coup | kergoth: snapshots huh? :) |
| 11:38.36 | kergoth | eh? |
| 11:38.40 | numatrix | ljp_work: I mean in the default configuration; I just did it for myself, but... |
| 11:38.43 | kergoth | it puts the current date in the ipk name at ipk creation time |
| 11:38.51 | kergoth | regardless of what date the cvs of each package was updated |
| 11:39.00 | coup | ahh righto |
| 11:39.17 | coup | my poor 56k connection :) |
| 11:39.26 | coup | still just IRC doesnt really hammer it ;) |
| 11:39.37 | mark | kergoth: its only one directory of the upstream i want actually. Safe to copy this straight into /var/lib/cvs ? |
| 11:39.43 | Twiun | coup: it could be arranged ;-) |
| 11:39.56 | coup | Twiun: lol :) |
| 11:39.59 | Twiun | coup: one dcc of the gcc tarball incoming! |
| 11:40.04 | coup | woot |
| 11:40.20 | neale | man, writing an HTML preprocessor in scheme was a real mistake. |
| 11:40.22 | kergoth | mark: yup |
| 11:40.38 | kergoth | neale: hah |
| 11:40.39 | Twiun | coup: drat... can't find it |
| 11:40.44 | coup | neale: sounds like one of those really enjoable tasks :) |
| 11:41.02 | neale | well, I wanted to learn scheme |
| 11:41.03 | mark | kergoth: and safe to rename? |
| 11:41.09 | kergoth | mark: yep |
| 11:41.32 | neale | but now I have to contend with crap like http://woozle.org/~neale/stml/ntp-stml.scm |
| 11:42.20 | coup | neale: looks lovely |
| 11:42.34 | neale | it's worth learning. |
| 11:42.40 | neale | Just don't actually *do* anything in it. |
| 11:42.54 | mark | kergoth: now cvs import -m "import" ???/??? KNIGHTS_UPSTREAM ? |
| 11:43.01 | coup | neale: LOL |
| 11:43.21 | kergoth | make: fuck you and your implicit rules too! |
| 11:43.44 | neale | seriously. scheme is like latin. If you learn it, you will be one formidable mofo. But don't try to actually use it anywhere or you're a kook. |
| 11:45.01 | mark | kergoth: i'm not sure what i'm meant to put where fsf/wdiff is in the cvs info page |
| 11:45.20 | coup | Minutus cantorum, minutus balorum, minutus carborata descendum pantorum |
| 11:45.53 | scan[ibook] | haha |
| 11:46.00 | coup | :) |
| 11:46.58 | neale | (define (fac x) (cond ((zero? x) ()) (else (mul x (fac (- x 1)))))) |
| 11:47.14 | kergoth | neale: fun |
| 11:47.18 | coup | Fac ut gaudeam |
| 11:47.20 | neale | that was for coup |
| 11:47.43 | chouimat | scan[ibook]: sarcasm? |
| 11:47.49 | neale | okay, back to work. |
| 11:47.53 | scan[ibook] | chouimat: nope |
| 11:48.06 | coup | if x =0, then return x, else return the result of mul on the result of fac minus 1? |
| 11:48.12 | chouimat | scan[ibook]: with a nice pyqt interface :P |
| 11:48.24 | scan[ibook] | pyqt is ugly :P |
| 11:48.40 | coup | neale: reverse polish notation in a language is just plain evil |
| 11:48.46 | scan[ibook] | chouimat: use something like anygui |
| 11:49.14 | kergoth | chouimat: BAH |
| 11:49.31 | kergoth | just use lkc as the configuration interface and python on the backend |
| 11:49.51 | kergoth | hey mickeyl|away |
| 11:50.04 | mickeyl | Hi kergoth! |
| 11:50.06 | mickeyl | Hi all! |
| 11:50.32 | coup | one for kergoth when release time is upon us: Re vera, potas bene |
| 11:50.53 | coup | meaning: Say, you sure are drinking a lot. |
| 11:51.16 | kergoth | hah |
| 11:51.27 | kergoth | fucking make |
| 11:51.32 | kergoth | when you -include blah |
| 11:51.38 | coup | and the ever useful: Te audire no possum. Musa sapientum fixa est in aure |
| 11:51.38 | kergoth | it looks for an implicit rule to generate that file |
| 11:51.51 | kergoth | but i dont fucking want to generate that fucking file implicitly, i want to do it explicitly |
| 11:52.19 | coup | well...fuck |
| 11:54.15 | bipolar | Do we have python bindings availible? |
| 11:54.41 | scan[ibook] | bipolar: for buildroot? |
| 11:55.11 | bipolar | scan[ibook]: yeah |
| 11:55.26 | chouimat | huh? a pornstar explain how double penetration work on tv |
| 11:55.35 | coup | classy |
| 11:55.39 | coup | which channel? :) |
| 11:55.43 | kergoth | bipolar: look in scripts/kconfig/ |
| 11:55.56 | kergoth | bipolar: theres a couple bindings, but no python yet |
| 11:56.10 | bipolar | kergoth: ok |
| 11:56.13 | bipolar | ibot: bk? |
| 11:56.13 | | [bk] see bitkeeper or under a really crappy license |
| 11:56.22 | bipolar | pffft |
| 11:56.37 | kergoth | ibot: oz bk |
| 11:56.37 | | hmm... oz bk is bk clone http://openzaurus.bkbits.net/buildroot buildroot-oz; cd buildroot-oz; bk -r co -q; cp def-configs/openzaurus .config; make oldconfig; make or see bitkeeper (free download but non-gpl) or see 'oz snapshot' if you don't want to use bk |
| 11:59.45 | mickeyl | btw kergoth, I'm trying to figure out what the various fields in the Makefile (for instance ncurses, which is bloody complicated :) mean... do you think you could find the time to document these... aka "adding a package to OZ buildsystem tutorial"? |
| 12:04.59 | ciaolinux | chouimat: we are waiting for explanation |
| 12:06.03 | kergoth | mickeyl: yeah, chouimat has been bugging me on it for some time now :) |
| 12:08.33 | kergoth | mickeyl: i'm almost done revamping the opie buildsystem, then i'll work on the buildroot some more |
| 12:08.38 | mickeyl | kergoth: it would be very fine :) I'd love to add python and PyQt to the buildsystem but can't find enough time to experiment with the makefiles to reverseengineering the meaning :) |
| 12:08.55 | mickeyl | great. appreciating this! |
| 12:08.57 | kergoth | hehe. it works well, not exactly intuitive though |
| 12:09.07 | kergoth | and to think i was going to revamp it again :) |
| 12:09.13 | kergoth | i'll write a perl script to add something to the buildroot |
| 12:09.18 | kergoth | just prompt for the various bits of info we need |
| 12:09.39 | mickeyl | ah - that sounds really good... so i guess it's better to wait for this to be completed :)) |
| 12:09.53 | kergoth | well, you can ask .. |
| 12:10.14 | kergoth | all the variables at the top of the file and on the $(stamp-blah-rootinstall) : rules are for is makefile generation |
| 12:10.17 | kergoth | ipk generation |
| 12:10.19 | kergoth | er |
| 12:10.24 | kergoth | it plugs those vars into the fields in the control file |
| 12:10.40 | kergoth | every other variable is solely internal.. that is, its only used elsewhere in the makefile itself |
| 12:10.43 | kergoth | self contained |
| 12:11.09 | Twiun | kergoth: not to be a another moaner... but an add script is good, but docco is better... not all things we want to add to the buildroot use good buildsystems |
| 12:11.24 | kergoth | eh? |
| 12:11.30 | kergoth | the add script will prompt you for the build commands |
| 12:11.34 | kergoth | to build the package in question |
| 12:11.45 | kergoth | it makes no assumptions regarding the actual compilation, it leaves that to you |
| 12:12.02 | Twiun | right, but without experimenting with the makefile myself, I wouldn't have known wtf the wonka jamfiles were up to |
| 12:12.04 | kergoth | but i will document. i just hate writing docs |
| 12:12.13 | kergoth | ? |
| 12:12.16 | Twiun | and I wouldn't know ahead of time what to stick into the script |
| 12:12.25 | mickeyl | kergoth: so if I have to patch a file after ./configure before it compiles, i have to express this as makefile dependencies |
| 12:12.29 | kergoth | i dont see what the buildroot has to do with your app compiliation, other than the variables defined in Make.rules |
| 12:12.33 | kergoth | mickeyl: no |
| 12:12.35 | kergoth | mickeyl: you add a patch to Sources |
| 12:12.44 | kergoth | mickeyl: it extracts and applies patches implicitly |
| 12:12.57 | mickeyl | kergoth: hmm... but what about patching _after_ ./configure? |
| 12:13.01 | kergoth | eh? |
| 12:13.02 | kergoth | for what? |
| 12:13.15 | kergoth | seems pointless, but yes, you could do it with makefile dependencies |
| 12:13.49 | Twiun | kergoth: my explanations always seem so... unexplaining ;-) nevermind - I'll be happy with docs ;-) |
| 12:13.57 | mickeyl | kergoth: well, we'll see... as i've said python really is a bitch when it comes to crosscompiling, it needs some foul tricks :)) |
| 12:14.16 | kergoth | mickeyl: hack away, but i'm sure theres a superior solution |
| 12:14.52 | mickeyl | kergoth: hah, the superiour solution would be for it to comply to --host and --build :) |
| 12:14.56 | kergoth | generally you can 1) patch configure.(ac|in) and run autoconf, or 2) supply configure test results in the config cache |
| 12:15.01 | kergoth | assuming a autoconf build |
| 12:15.08 | kergoth | others need different solutions |
| 12:15.08 | kergoth | heh |
| 12:15.14 | kergoth | mickeyl: comply? |
| 12:15.20 | mickeyl | kergoth: honor. |
| 12:15.27 | kergoth | mickeyl: --host and --build and --target dont necessarily cause CC, LD, etc to change |
| 12:15.43 | kergoth | mickeyl: its not a requirement, in fact most builds dont assume a crosscompilation prefix |
| 12:15.49 | kergoth | which is why we set CC, LD, etc in Vars.make |
| 12:15.56 | kergoth | for those cases |
| 12:16.12 | kergoth | isnt crosscompilation fun? |
| 12:16.22 | mickeyl | kergoth: absolutely :) |
| 12:16.36 | kergoth | mickeyl: look at the perl buildsystem sometime |
| 12:16.41 | kergoth | mickeyl: it doesnt even use autoconf |
| 12:16.52 | kergoth | mickeyl: it has its own shell ./configure, completely proprietary |
| 12:17.02 | kergoth | and completely unable to crosscopmile |
| 12:17.04 | kergoth | piece of shit |
| 12:17.54 | ljp_work | skiffcluster :) |
| 12:17.59 | kergoth | bah |
| 12:18.08 | kergoth | skiffs are useful for some things |
| 12:18.10 | kergoth | so damn slow tho |
| 12:18.19 | kergoth | get spoiled by quick crosscompiles |
| 12:18.26 | mickeyl | kergoth: yeha. so perl is worse than python... python "just" uses the core portion of itself during the buildprocess and does not define $HOSTPYTHON or stuff like that which would make crosscompiling easier. |
| 12:18.38 | kergoth | mickeyl: ahh gotcha |
| 12:18.55 | kergoth | yeah that sounds like a bitch alright |
| 12:19.07 | kergoth | when you get a basic packages/python/Makefile email it to me |
| 12:19.11 | kergoth | i'll push it into bk and play around |
| 12:19.50 | mickeyl | keroth: will do this this week (hopefully) :) |
| 12:19.59 | mickeyl | s/keroth/kergoth |
| 12:23.25 | benmeyer | yup |
| 12:24.01 | Twiun | ibot: kill wonka |
| 12:24.01 | | Twiun: i don't know |
| 12:24.14 | Twiun | ibot: Not bloody good enough |
| 12:24.14 | | Twiun: I give up, what is it? |
| 12:24.23 | Twiun | ibot: lart ibot |
| 12:28.21 | Guru | Hello all |
| 12:28.32 | Guru | ibot oz feed |
| 12:28.32 | | hmm... oz feed is http://www.openzaurus.org/official/unstable/feed/ |
| 12:29.04 | Guru | is anyone else having problems installing apps via aqpkg? (ie is it crashing on you?) |
| 12:29.27 | Guru | and if so... how are you installing apps (ie, getting around the problem) |
| 12:29.29 | chouimat | kergoth: anything fixed? |
| 12:29.32 | kergoth | Guru: aqpkg crashing has been reported, and may even be fixed |
| 12:29.40 | kergoth | Guru: upgrade it from that feed if you havent already |
| 12:30.06 | Guru | just tried last night, and it still crashed. I'll go grab it again |
| 12:30.26 | kergoth | what circumstances does it crash in? |
| 12:30.31 | kergoth | report it at the opie bug tracking system |
| 12:30.36 | kergoth | ibot: opie bugss |
| 12:30.36 | | bugger all, i dunno, kergoth |
| 12:30.37 | kergoth | ibot: opie bugs |
| 12:30.37 | | methinks opie bugs is http://opie.info/bugs/ |
| 12:30.51 | Guru | installing apps to SD or Root. Doesnt always crash, but it is quite frequent |
| 12:31.05 | Guru | already made a note at SF bugs |
| 12:31.16 | kergoth | opie bugs go in their bug tracking system |
| 12:31.37 | kergoth | please report it there, i'll close it in ours |
| 12:31.50 | Guru | oh. okay! |
| 12:32.00 | kergoth | Guru: thanks |
| 12:32.34 | MSpin | kergoth: do you know that the config.in files for centericq, libsigcplusplus, and libsigcplusplus-1.2 are missing from the snapshot? |
| 12:32.43 | ciaolinux | kergoth: what is the format of mails in opie-mail2? mbox or mh? |
| 12:32.58 | kergoth | MSpin: they are? okay |
| 12:33.05 | kergoth | ciaolinux: not certain. ask in #opie |
| 12:33.43 | datenPUNK | Sorry to bother, but is there any info, when the ppp setup will be finished? Thanks. |
| 12:33.51 | MSpin | kergoth: yeah, I had to remove them from the main config file |
| 12:34.05 | kergoth | datenPUNK: ask ben |
| 12:34.13 | kergoth | datenPUNK: i'm not his keeper. check in #opie |
| 12:34.18 | kergoth | datenPUNK: benmeyer is its developer |
| 12:35.11 | datenPUNK | o.k. thanks |
| 12:35.26 | Guru | Is there a simple way to get intellisync to work w/Oz3? I can't figure it out. I am able to do file xfer, but not intellisync. |
| 12:35.38 | kergoth | Guru: read the faq |
| 12:35.45 | Guru | ibot faq |
| 12:35.45 | | [faq] at http://www.newbreedsoftware.com/zaurus-faq/ or at http://www.handhelds.org/handhelds-faq/handhelds-faq.html or at http://adorphuye.com/zaurus/java/faq.jsp or http://www.travellingkiwi.com/zarus/faq/faq.html or http://unc.dl.sourceforge.net/sourceforge/openzaurus/FAQ |
| 12:35.58 | kergoth | bah |
| 12:36.02 | kergoth | ibot: forget faq |
| 12:36.31 | kergoth | ibot: no, faq is at http://www.newbreedsoftware.com/zaurus-faq/ or at http://www.handhelds.org/handhelds-faq/handhelds-faq.html or at http://adorphuye.com/zaurus/java/faq.jsp or at http://www.travellingkiwi.com/zarus/faq/faq.html or at http://www.openzaurus.org/ |
| 12:36.31 | | kergoth: okay |
| 12:36.50 | Twiun | hiya bbeattie |
| 12:37.12 | kergoth | hey bbeattie |
| 12:39.51 | bbeattie | hello |
| 12:40.30 | bbeattie | any news I missed in the last 12 hours? |
| 12:41.45 | kergoth | bbeattie: not really |
| 12:42.12 | chouimat | kergoth: fixed the opie build problem? I don't have any ipk here |
| 12:42.32 | bbeattie | I still need to find someone who has gtk working on the zaurus... |
| 12:43.47 | Guru | brb |
| 12:45.04 | kergoth | bbeattie: talk to dajoker or prpplague, they've used X in OZ |
| 12:45.56 | benmeyer | Anyone have some hard numbers on X11 vs VFB? |
| 12:46.02 | benmeyer | speed and memory size? |
| 12:46.36 | kergoth | chouimat: ow |
| 12:46.42 | kergoth | chouimat: hold on, i'm committing the last opie buildsystem bits |
| 12:46.51 | bbeattie | kergoth: have you seen anyone working on embedded gtk lately? |
| 12:47.04 | benmeyer | gpe |
| 12:47.08 | benmeyer | go to #pge |
| 12:47.12 | benmeyer | there is activity |
| 12:47.29 | benmeyer | #gpe I mean |
| 13:04.14 | Guru | hello again. |
| 13:04.37 | Guru | hey anyone know what the difference between the two packages: konqueror-full-snapshot and konqueror-snapshot? |
| 13:09.24 | kergoth | full has javascript support |
| 13:12.26 | Guru | cool! thanks |
| 13:12.48 | kergoth | np |
| 13:13.11 | bipolar | perhaps that one should be relabled konqueror-javascript |
| 13:13.57 | kergoth | hehe |
| 13:14.04 | kergoth | people ask that question a few times a good |
| 13:14.04 | kergoth | er |
| 13:14.06 | kergoth | a day |
| 13:14.28 | mezzendo | So, now for a another question people probably ask regularly.... |
| 13:14.44 | mezzendo | How do you get OZ3 to sync with Intellisync on XP? |
| 13:15.02 | mezzendo | I have tried the setting from the OZ faq page to no avail. |
| 13:15.26 | mezzendo | And, no luck with the suggestions in the ZaurusZone forum. |
| 13:15.49 | mezzendo | I have a feeling it has something to do with my routes but I am not sure. |
| 13:24.58 | bbeattie | kergoth: Do you know if it's possible to get gtk compiled applications that work on the IPAQ/X11 working (With embedded gtk libraries) on the zaurus?, using opie/framebuffer instead of an X server? |
| 13:25.13 | benmeyer | unlikly at this time |
| 13:25.19 | kergoth | bbeattie: um, gtk doesnt use framebuffer/opie, its X only to my knowledge |
| 13:25.33 | benmeyer | actually a fb port has been done |
| 13:25.50 | bbeattie | kergoth: There was a project started 3 years ago to get GTK working in framebuffer, but I lost that bookmark. |
| 13:26.11 | kergoth | gotcha |
| 13:27.07 | scanline | bbeattie: boo. I'm in here too, no need to /msg me :) |
| 13:28.23 | bbeattie | scanline: I only msg people who are 1 hour > idle |
| 13:28.29 | scanline | bbeattie: There's gtk/fb and gtk/directfb, but AFAIK they're single-app only, so not useful for a PDA yet |
| 13:28.49 | scanline | bbeattie: DirectFB has a relatively new multi-app mode, and you could theoretically run gtk/directfb on top of that |
| 13:32.14 | bbeattie | mplayer uses directfb, correct? So if I was able to get a gtk app staticle built for directfb it should work, but then there's the redraw issues of opie after the app is exited, right? |
| 13:32.30 | gooroo | can you install apps that rely on qpe-base-1.5 onto oz3 by forcing? |
| 13:38.15 | kergoth | yep |
| 13:38.49 | scanline | bbeattie: if you can get directfb to handle VT switching properly (if it doesn't already) you could run Gtk/DirectFB and Opie on separate VTs |
| 13:41.06 | benmeyer | hey kergoth: did you happen to get a chance to look at the code I sent you yesterday? |
| 13:41.21 | kergoth | benmeyer: nope, didnt get a chance, been finishing up the new opie buildsystem |
| 13:41.33 | kergoth | benmeyer: but thankfully i'm about done with it, should be able to play with it today |
| 13:41.35 | benmeyer | ah ok |
| 13:41.47 | benmeyer | it is probably nothing more then a 1 line change |
| 13:41.54 | benmeyer | maybe 3 |
| 13:44.09 | noda | Moo! |
| 13:44.31 | benmeyer | MoooooOoo! |
| 13:44.35 | noda | Anything new in the past week of OZ-ness? Besides the 3.0 release that is :) |
| 13:44.42 | benmeyer | bug fixes mostly |
| 13:44.56 | noda | Ah, I haven't run into any biggies so I guess I'm okay :) |
| 13:45.03 | noda | ibot seen kergoth |
| 13:45.03 | | kergoth is currently on #opie (19h 36m 32s) #uclibc (19h 36m 32s) #picogui (19h 36m 32s) #tuxscreen (19h 36m 32s) #zaurus (19h 36m 32s) #handhelds.org (19h 36m 32s) #openzaurus (19h 36m 32s). Has said a total of 877 messages. Is idling for 3m 30s |
| 13:45.09 | chouimat | noda: MOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO! |
| 13:45.09 | benmeyer | fixed a dozen or so small ones in my network app |
| 13:45.19 | noda | benmeyer: Woo :) |
| 13:45.21 | noda | chouimat: Moo |
| 13:45.26 | kergoth | hey noda |
| 13:45.28 | chouimat | ibot seen chouimat |
| 13:45.28 | | chouimat is currently on #zaurus #openzaurus. Has said a total of 145 messages. Is idling for 0s |
| 13:45.29 | benmeyer | MoooOOO Moo MOo |
| 13:45.43 | chouimat | *BELCH* |
| 13:45.44 | noda | kergoth: Just an apology for taking so long on this changelog. :P |
| 13:45.52 | noda | All I came here for, I'm leaving in 5. |
| 13:45.57 | cbok | KERGOTH |
| 13:46.07 | cbok | so, i reflashed, installed pcmcia updates |
| 13:46.22 | cbok | everything 'cept the dhcpcd works,.. |
| 13:46.24 | chouimat | kergoth: bk push? |
| 13:46.27 | cbok | *however* |
| 13:46.43 | cbok | ifup eth0 or ifdown eth0 (and of course ifup) will yield an address |
| 13:47.15 | cbok | have you all had any problems with tkc apps showing up displaying funny? |
| 13:48.09 | noda | kergoth: Anyway, I haven't forgotten about the changelog. Just attempting to get a slight bit of a life :) |
| 13:53.18 | cbok | ok this is weird. |
| 13:53.30 | cbok | since i have updated the pcmcia stuffs, usbd0 syncing no longer works. |
| 13:58.27 | ljp_work | sicko |
| 13:59.18 | mezzendo | I have not been able to sync with Intellisync since I flashed to OZ3. |
| 13:59.44 | mezzendo | Everything works great (wireless, apps, installs, etc), but no syncing. |
| 14:01.17 | cbok | i did it earlier |
| 14:01.36 | cbok | but right now, since updating a few things, its unresponsive |
| 14:01.38 | kergoth | mezzendo: read the faq |
| 14:01.41 | cbok | :) |
| 14:01.41 | kergoth | mezzendo: syncing works fine |
| 14:01.47 | cbok | yes, yes it does. |
| 14:02.06 | kergoth | cbok: err, usbd shouldnt be affected by pcmcia.. odd |
| 14:02.15 | kergoth | cbok: what card do you have again? |
| 14:02.24 | mezzendo | I did read the faq. But, it did not work. |
| 14:02.49 | kergoth | can you ping it? |
| 14:02.52 | mezzendo | What about routes? I read somewhere that routes sometimes do not get setup automatically for usbd0. |
| 14:02.59 | kergoth | what sync software are you using? |
| 14:03.02 | cbok | mezz - you dont need routs |
| 14:03.05 | mezzendo | Intellisync. |
| 14:03.12 | cbok | well |
| 14:03.13 | cbok | you doo |
| 14:03.24 | cbok | within the zaurus, you'll have a route of 192.168.129.200 |
| 14:03.47 | cbok | kergoth: network card is 10/100 hawking technology hard CF+ |
| 14:04.14 | cbok | kergoth - syncing is occuring, of course, via the cradle, and i'm gettin gthe network unreachable error when attempting to ping the NT box |
| 14:05.22 | AndyQ | evenin all |
| 14:06.49 | kergoth | hey AndyQ |
| 14:07.07 | AndyQ | kergoth: like the title - having fun with make huh? |
| 14:07.23 | kergoth | oh yeah :) |
| 14:07.44 | kergoth | AndyQ: about done with the opie buildsystem |
| 14:07.51 | kergoth | AndyQ: and know more about make than i ever wanted to know |
| 14:08.10 | AndyQ | heh - what changes have you made - easier for newbies like me to understand? |
| 14:08.41 | kergoth | cvs co -d:ext:kergoth@handhelds.org:/cvs co -P opie; cd opie; make; |
| 14:08.45 | kergoth | easy enough for you? ;) |
| 14:09.10 | kergoth | from a devel standpoint there isnt much they need to do |
| 14:09.22 | kergoth | theres now a config.in file in each app directory, which controls the configuration system |
| 14:09.29 | kergoth | (make menuconfig/xconfig/config) |
| 14:09.37 | AndyQ | depends - does that build everything (kernel, OZ, opie, packages, et al? |
| 14:09.47 | kergoth | this is the opie buildsystem, not oz |
| 14:09.53 | kergoth | the oz buildroot already does everything |
| 14:10.30 | kergoth | for now in opie you still run ./mkipks to build packages |
| 14:10.30 | AndyQ | ahhhh - I still can't get my head round the OZ build system an how the opie build system links in to it |
| 14:10.39 | kergoth | hehe |
| 14:10.43 | AndyQ | at which point to I rung make menuconfig? |
| 14:10.54 | kergoth | the oz buildsystem just downlaods sources, extracts them, compiles, builds ipks, and creates an image |
| 14:10.55 | AndyQ | run even |
| 14:11.03 | kergoth | when you want to change what pieces of opie to build |
| 14:11.13 | kergoth | or when yo uwant to change whether to copmile for x86 or ipaq or sharp |
| 14:11.23 | kergoth | or when you want to select qt3 or x11 build instead of normal |
| 14:11.44 | kergoth | or if you only want to build certain apps in opie, you no longer have to edit the root makefile |
| 14:11.52 | kergoth | you just run make menuconfig and enable and disable apps |
| 14:12.39 | AndyQ | OK, so the OZ build system builds the kernel and the main linuxey files and the Opie build system builds the opie front end and libraries (stuff in the opie cvs tree) |
| 14:12.40 | kolla | anyone tried that? just compiling some zaurs app with QT/X11? |
| 14:12.47 | kolla | some opie app I mean |
| 14:13.14 | AndyQ | I've get opie compiled on my linux box for x86 - running under qvfb |
| 14:13.19 | AndyQ | but not qt3 |
| 14:13.38 | chouimat | kergoth: did you uploaded it? |
| 14:15.47 | kolla | what happened to ext3 support anyways? :) |
| 14:16.00 | kergoth | AndyQ: yes, and the oz buildsystem -uses- the opie buildsystem to compile it. all the oz ubildroot does is builds other things |
| 14:16.08 | kergoth | chouimat: upload what? |
| 14:16.18 | kergoth | chouimat: the opie buildsystem stuff is in opie cvs, but in Makefile.test, not Makefile |
| 14:16.39 | AndyQ | ahhh - OK it makes sense a bit more now - you've got effectively two build systems - one which calls into the other |
| 14:16.49 | kergoth | yeah |
| 14:16.50 | ljp_work | great. you just overwrote _my_ Makefile.test :) |
| 14:17.00 | kergoth | er? |
| 14:17.03 | kergoth | dont confuse me |
| 14:17.12 | AndyQ | heh :) |
| 14:17.18 | AndyQ | so when can I use it? |
| 14:17.30 | kergoth | AndyQ: right now. make -f Makefile.test menuconfig |
| 14:17.32 | kergoth | AndyQ: or xconfig |
| 14:17.36 | kergoth | AndyQ: cvs up first of course |
| 14:17.44 | ljp_work | qconfig |
| 14:17.47 | ljp_work | heh |
| 14:17.52 | ljp_work | opieconfig |
| 14:17.54 | kergoth | actually, its missing one little piece, it doesnt symlink the custom.h yet |
| 14:18.05 | AndyQ | but I need to check it out first - OK, I'll give a go - should I update my buildroot also? |
| 14:18.10 | kergoth | heh, xconfig is actually a qt frontend |
| 14:18.14 | ljp_work | now to add an app, what do we have to do? |
| 14:18.16 | kergoth | AndyQ: shouldnt need to for this |
| 14:18.20 | kergoth | AndyQ: in general, if you want to , feel free |
| 14:18.30 | AndyQ | OK - I'll follow you instructions......... |
| 14:18.42 | kergoth | ljp_work: add .pro, .control, as usual. then add config.in and add your app to $OPIEDIR/packages |
| 14:19.07 | kergoth | ljp_work: $OPIEDIR/packages controls the -connection- between the config system and the makefiles. it controls what subdirs get descended into |
| 14:19.15 | chouimat | kergoth: did you fix the fonts problem in buildroot? |
| 14:19.19 | kergoth | its relatively basic, i'll be uploading docs shortly |
| 14:19.22 | kergoth | chouimat: havent had a chance |
| 14:19.47 | kolla | mm.. with 1Mbit ADSL the z has become a nice "radio" :) |
| 14:20.04 | chouimat | kergoth: did you enable buildroot to use the new opie build system? |
| 14:20.11 | ljp_work | 56k is alot faster than 33 modem |
| 14:20.17 | ljp_work | hehe |
| 14:20.22 | kergoth | chouimat: no, oz uses the stock one.. then i'll replace the stock one with this |
| 14:22.44 | kergoth | hey badalex |
| 14:22.54 | badalex | hey kergoth whats up? |
| 14:23.03 | kergoth | nada, finishign up the opie bulidsystem |
| 14:23.04 | kergoth | you? |
| 14:23.18 | badalex | kergoth: not much either... |
| 14:23.37 | kergoth | they put up monitors here that show who's logged on our queue now |
| 14:23.40 | ljp_work | so, when are the opie cheerleaders showing up? |
| 14:23.41 | chouimat | it's erection day in USA? |
| 14:23.42 | kergoth | so i cant slack, actually have to do real work |
| 14:23.43 | kergoth | fuckers |
| 14:24.00 | chouimat | s/erection/election |
| 14:24.24 | ljp_work | opie needs groupies |
| 14:24.30 | AndyQ | kergoth: do I run make menuconfig in the opie dir or the dir above? |
| 14:24.35 | kergoth | man, i love shell scripts |
| 14:24.37 | kergoth | find ./ -name \*.pro | ( for i in `cat`; do dir=`dirname $i`; echo Removing generated makefiles from $dir...; rm $dir/Makefile* 2>/dev/null; cvs rm $dir/Makefile; cvs rm $dir/Makefile.in; done; ) |
| 14:24.42 | kergoth | heh |
| 14:24.43 | kergoth | AndyQ: cd opie; make -f Makefile.test menuconfig |
| 14:24.46 | AndyQ | ljp_work: I'll ask my wife if she fancies being an Opie groupie :) |
| 14:25.02 | ljp_work | hmmm.. no married groupies, thanks |
| 14:25.08 | kergoth | hehe |
| 14:25.10 | AndyQ | heh |
| 14:25.19 | ljp_work | too much baggage |
| 14:25.28 | ljp_work | :D |
| 14:25.33 | AndyQ | OY - you callin me baggage? |
| 14:25.46 | ljp_work | for a groupie.. yes |
| 14:25.55 | AndyQ | :) |
| 14:27.16 | ljp_work | cheerleaders can be married, tho |
| 14:27.23 | kergoth | hah |
| 14:28.02 | benmeyer | My wife was a cheerleader in college |
| 14:28.05 | benmeyer | :-D |
| 14:28.19 | AndyQ | we don't really have cheerleaders over here :( |
| 14:28.25 | kergoth | benmeyer: which email are the specs on this thing going to go to? @digi? |
| 14:28.27 | AndyQ | we just get the Spice Girls :( |
| 14:28.34 | kergoth | AndyQ: lol |
| 14:28.34 | kergoth | window 11 |
| 14:28.36 | kergoth | er |
| 14:28.39 | kergoth | / helps |
| 14:29.23 | benmeyer | kergoth: mine, and I will forward it to you when I get them |
| 14:29.34 | benmeyer | Chris Larson <kergoth@digitalnemesis.net> is what I have |
| 14:29.36 | kergoth | benmeyer: okay, cool. forward it to my @handhelds.org addy |
| 14:29.39 | kergoth | okay |
| 14:29.40 | kergoth | that works |
| 14:29.42 | kergoth | same mailbox |
| 14:29.44 | benmeyer | k |
| 14:29.58 | numatrix | Anybody doing the devnull nethack tournament? |
| 14:30.01 | AndyQ | kergpth: pah - you didn't say I needed bison |
| 14:30.40 | kergoth | AndyQ: hehe. sorry. it uses it to generate the parser for the config.in files |
| 14:31.31 | kergoth | hehe |
| 14:31.47 | AndyQ | whats apt-get? |
| 14:31.50 | mandrake | apt mangled my wife's laptop the other day |
| 14:32.46 | mandrake | at least she's very forgiving |
| 14:33.01 | mandrake | I'll prolly dump RH 8 on it soon so I feel better :) |
| 14:33.13 | mandrake | alrighty I'm gonna go migrate downstairs to the bagel shop for the remainder of the afternoon |
| 14:33.17 | mandrake | later |
| 14:34.38 | AndyQ | kergoth: should HOSTQTDIR be set to the same location as QTDIR? |
| 14:36.03 | kergoth | AndyQ: no |
| 14:36.10 | kergoth | AndyQ: HOSTQTDIR is where your QT is on the -desktop- |
| 14:36.16 | kergoth | AndyQ: aka /usr/share/qt or what have you |
| 14:36.27 | AndyQ | k |
| 14:36.29 | ljp_work | like /opt/qt for sane people |
| 14:36.36 | kergoth | bah |
| 14:36.40 | kergoth | :) |
| 14:36.43 | ljp_work | :D |
| 14:36.50 | AndyQ | or in may case /usr/lib/qt |
| 14:37.09 | AndyQ | what do I need to add to use qt-mt? |
| 14:37.13 | kergoth | AndyQ: i'll add a bit mor elogic to its makefile.. have it check a couple locations |
| 14:37.22 | kergoth | AndyQ: edit scripts/kconfig/Makefile, change -lqt to -lqt-mt |
| 14:37.28 | ljp_work | I usually have too much stuff in /usr, and too many versions of qt installed |
| 14:37.30 | kergoth | AndyQ: i'm fixing that as well, make it check for qt-mt |
| 14:38.40 | AndyQ | OK - and libkconfig? |
| 14:38.47 | kergoth | libkconfig? |
| 14:38.50 | kergoth | it should be building that |
| 14:38.55 | kergoth | you did cvs up right? |
| 14:38.56 | kergoth | heh |
| 14:39.06 | kergoth | did it error out saying it couldnt find libkconfig.so? |
| 14:39.19 | AndyQ | yes - I did a cvs co - but not a cvs up |
| 14:39.27 | kergoth | cvs co when? |
| 14:39.42 | AndyQ | right at the beginning before anything else |
| 14:40.07 | kergoth | AndyQ: okay, and you're doing xconfig? or menuconfig? or .. |
| 14:40.07 | AndyQ | xconfig |
| 14:40.10 | AndyQ | I'm just doing a cvs up now |
| 14:40.19 | ljp_work | is there a winconfig yet? ;) |
| 14:40.23 | kergoth | okay let me check my sanity |
| 14:40.25 | kergoth | ljp_work: you're evil |
| 14:40.36 | AndyQ | I want a cross compiler that works under windows :) |
| 14:41.30 | ljp_work | I wish gcc was as fast as vc++ compiler |
| 14:41.30 | kergoth | yeah |
| 14:41.30 | kergoth | gcc is slow at compiling c++ |
| 14:41.49 | ljp_work | but I guess gcc's real purpose is for being able to compile many different platforms |
| 14:42.08 | AndyQ | kergoth: can I do a make clean on makefile.test? |
| 14:42.16 | AndyQ | should I be able to I mean? |
| 14:42.21 | kergoth | AndyQ: it doesnt have a clean target. just make -C scripts/kconfig clean for now |
| 14:42.29 | kergoth | i'm about to add those targets and mrproper and distclean as well |
| 14:42.36 | kergoth | me too |
| 14:42.54 | AndyQ | kergoth: OK, I've done a cvs up and I still get a link error for kconfig |
| 14:43.02 | AndyQ | no such file or dir |
| 14:43.09 | kergoth | okay hold on |
| 14:43.16 | ljp_work | bbl |
| 14:44.47 | kergoth | AndyQ: fixed, cvs up |
| 14:44.51 | AndyQ | k |
| 14:49.00 | AndyQ | kergoth: woot - got the xconfig up |
| 14:49.19 | kergoth | AndyQ: yay |
| 14:49.21 | AndyQ | looks good |
| 14:50.43 | AndyQ | kergoth: maybe add another option to build X86 but using the X86 QTEmbedded (QVFB) |
| 14:50.50 | AndyQ | under Build Parameters |
| 14:50.54 | kergoth | AndyQ: eh? |
| 14:51.01 | AndyQ | or is the X86 doing that ? |
| 14:51.02 | kergoth | x86 build -is- for use with desktop qt/e |
| 14:51.07 | kergoth | whether fb or qvfb |
| 14:51.09 | kergoth | yeah |
| 14:51.17 | AndyQ | OK, so can you build for QT3 (desktop) |
| 14:51.33 | AndyQ | or even QT2.2 |
| 14:52.13 | kergoth | AndyQ: adding qt3 build option is on my todo |
| 14:52.22 | kergoth | AndyQ: tomorrow zecke and i are adding an option to build for qt/x11 |
| 14:52.22 | AndyQ | k |
| 14:53.45 | benmeyer | sounds good |
| 14:54.38 | AndyQ | excellent |
| 14:56.23 | AndyQ | kergoth: when I do a make sould I use the Makefile.test as the makefile? |
| 14:57.14 | AndyQ | kergoth: if I don't and just run make I get a no runle to make target Makefile in opie/library |
| 15:06.09 | AndyQ | OK, got to go - bye |
| 15:06.50 | MSpin | kergoth: got a sec? |
| 15:07.45 | kergoth | MSpin: yeah, whats up |
| 15:08.35 | MSpin | how do you feel about expanding the OZ build system beyond OZ?:) |
| 15:09.10 | kergoth | it already supports another completely different device |
| 15:09.14 | kergoth | what were you thinkign of? |
| 15:09.22 | chouimat | MSpin: like what? |
| 15:09.37 | MSpin | this is a StrongArm baord from AppliedDataSystems |
| 15:09.47 | kergoth | ah, feel free |
| 15:09.52 | kergoth | you'll need to add a kernel |
| 15:09.53 | MSpin | cool |
| 15:10.00 | kergoth | and like a -base package to support that |
| 15:10.04 | kergoth | the rest should just work |
| 15:10.07 | chouimat | MSpin: the cost of the board? |
| 15:10.20 | MSpin | I think it's in the $600 range |
| 15:10.27 | MSpin | kergoth: cool, thanks |
| 15:10.43 | MSpin | chouimat: it's their GraphicsMaster board |
| 15:10.57 | kergoth | MSpin: np. let me know if you need assistnace |
| 15:11.08 | MSpin | we're going to be putting it in a NEMA enclosure for some industrial monitoring stuff |
| 15:11.10 | kergoth | MSpin: if you need write access to the bk tree on bkbits to add your stuff, let me know and i'll add you |
| 15:11.20 | MSpin | kergoth: cool |
| 15:11.53 | chouimat | I like that Quote: "Is Mr Freely there? Initial I.P." |
| 15:13.13 | MSpin | chouimat: from? |
| 15:13.26 | chouimat | MSpin: simpsons :) |
| 15:15.05 | MSpin | chouimat: ahh |
| 15:15.17 | MSpin | all, that's what the RAMSES entry was.... |
| 15:15.28 | kergoth | yep |
| 15:15.36 | kergoth | ramses is an industrial device |
| 15:16.00 | MSpin | cool |
| 15:16.07 | MSpin | these ADS boards are rock solid |
| 15:16.11 | MSpin | I'me quite happy |
| 15:16.33 | kergoth | MSpin: the ramses base appears to be like the oz one, except it uses devfs |
| 15:16.48 | chouimat | MSpin: url for the board? |
| 15:17.04 | MSpin | chouimat: www.applieddata.net/ |
| 15:17.27 | MSpin | kergoth: cool, I'm not too worried about devfs.... |
| 15:17.48 | kergoth | then you may just need to add your kernel and leave it at that |
| 15:18.13 | chouimat | yurk! Celine Dion is the new artist for the ads of Daimler-Chrisler |
| 15:18.25 | kergoth | ew |
| 15:19.29 | MSpin | kergoth: actually, it's based on the 2.4.19-rmk2 kernel |
| 15:20.22 | mezzendo | I just followed the instructions for setting up syncing with OZ3. I can ping both the computer and the Zaurus. I am running Windows XP Professional with Intellisync 1.43E. Everything seems correct but it will not sync. |
| 15:21.55 | mezzendo | Any ideas? |
| 15:23.43 | kergoth | MSpin: cool |
| 15:24.00 | kergoth | mezzendo: is that the latest intellisync? what error do you get? did you run Security and hit oK/ |
| 15:25.05 | mezzendo | kergoth: I am not sure what the latest version is...that was why I included what I was running. I did run Security and hit OK. There is no error....it says to put the |
| 15:25.28 | mezzendo | Z in the cradle and press OK. Then, it seems to timeout and says Put into cradle and Press OK. |
| 15:30.03 | kergoth | mezzendo: attempt to ftp into your Z, port 4242. when it prompts for password enter 'rootme' |
| 15:40.18 | MSpin | kergoth: so, I can list the patches on the Sources line, and they get applied in that order by the build system? |
| 15:40.25 | kergoth | MSpin: yup |
| 15:40.36 | MSpin | shweet |
| 15:40.46 | kergoth | MSpin: currently it cds into $(SourceTree) and applies with a -p1.. you can specify the -p# as a option on the sources line, see the opie makefile for examples |
| 15:41.25 | MSpin | should I creat my own kernel package, or try to integrates with the existing 2.4.19 one? |
| 15:41.50 | kergoth | probably easiest to add your own for now, whatever you prefer |
| 15:43.23 | MSpin | ok |
| 15:43.27 | chouimat | kergoth: can we add other target to buildroot? |
| 15:43.31 | kergoth | chouimat: what target? |
| 15:43.51 | chouimat | kergoth: x86 for testing purpose |
| 15:44.01 | kergoth | ah, good idea |
| 15:45.11 | chouimat | kergoth: so that way we propably add familiar, agenda, name it support (OZ can be a generic embbedded linux framework) |
| 15:45.42 | mezzendo | kergoth: I used "nc 192.168.129.201 4242" and then I get "220 Qtopia 0.9.1-snapshot FTP Server" "530 Please login with USER and PASS" |
| 15:46.24 | PeZ2001 | i want to offer my help to the project... |
| 15:47.00 | PeZ2001 | no, not money...coding of something... |
| 15:47.04 | kergoth | chouimat: yes |
| 15:47.12 | kergoth | mezzendo: ? |
| 15:47.15 | kergoth | mezzendo: i told you, its -ftp- |
| 15:47.24 | kergoth | mezzendo: login using an ftp client as root with a password of rootme |
| 15:47.35 | kergoth | mezzendo: i want to verify you can login |
| 15:47.39 | chouimat | kergoth: and maybe add other os support (I will look for that) |
| 15:47.51 | kergoth | yeah |
| 15:47.55 | kergoth | brb |
| 15:52.39 | mezzendo | kergoth: I was able to ftp in, when I connected, it asked if it should allow the connection. I said Allow and it let me right in. Then, I disconnected, tried to sync, and it worked perfectly. Thank you for your help. I really appreciate it. Gotta leave the office now. Good night. |
| 15:52.50 | kergoth | mezzendo: great, thanks |
| 15:53.16 | mezzendo | kergoth: If I can ever be of service, let me know. I will be around. |
| 15:53.36 | kergoth | its appreciated. its weird that you had to ftp first though.. it shouldve just worked |
| 15:53.39 | kergoth | hrm |
| 15:54.05 | chouimat | huh? Microsoft Broadband Networking Wired Base Station Router? |
| 15:54.30 | mezzendo | After clicking Allow, it worked fine. Maybe clicking OK on Security was not enough or my wireless settings made an odd change to it. |
| 15:54.41 | mezzendo | I am just using USB cradle on an XP Pro system. |
| 15:55.04 | kergoth | k |
| 15:55.10 | mezzendo | I did have to disable some funky crap MS put on the Local Area Connection by default. |
| 15:55.45 | mezzendo | I am outta here. Thanks again. |
| 16:14.31 | Twiun | Grrr |
| 16:14.58 | Titeuf | hi |
| 16:15.02 | Twiun | hey |
| 16:15.50 | Titeuf | i've got a problem with init on my Z with oz3 |
| 16:16.42 | Titeuf | i don't know what to do |
| 16:17.18 | Titeuf | ini: Id "sy" respawning too fast: disabled for 5 minutes |
| 16:17.32 | Titeuf | init: Id "ln" respawning too fast: disabled for 5 minutes |
| 16:25.34 | coup-PDA | kergoth: ping |
| 16:26.16 | kergoth | Titeuf: there is no 'ln' entry in the inittab.. are you sure on that error message? |
| 16:26.20 | kergoth | coup-PDA: pong |
| 16:26.28 | Titeuf | maybe |n |
| 16:26.36 | coup-PDA | kergoth: is there something up with the battery app in unstable? mine keeps bouncing from full to low! |
| 16:26.42 | Titeuf | or 1n |
| 16:26.49 | Titeuf | something like that :) |
| 16:27.20 | kergoth | coup-PDA: could be, report it to th eopie folks |
| 16:27.39 | kergoth | Titeuf: well, regardless, something is hosed badly. i'm not sure how to recover it in that state. do you get to a login? |
| 16:27.40 | coup-PDA | yeah, will do, but from a desktop pc later :) |
| 16:27.48 | kergoth | hehe |
| 16:27.54 | Titeuf | kergoth: no |
| 16:28.24 | kergoth | Titeuf: you'll likely have to reflash then. howd it get in this state? |
| 16:28.40 | Titeuf | i was downloading packages on OZ3 |
| 16:28.54 | Titeuf | my Z hanged |
| 16:28.55 | kergoth | eh? it did more than that.. |
| 16:28.57 | kergoth | ah |
| 16:29.05 | kergoth | it must've been in the middle of replacing somethign critical when it hung |
| 16:29.14 | Titeuf | :( |
| 16:29.28 | kergoth | ah the perils of having a writable root filesystem, eh? :) |
| 16:29.32 | Titeuf | i've no cf reader on my pc :( |
| 16:29.36 | kergoth | full reset cant bring you back to a sane state |
| 16:29.45 | Titeuf | i tried that |
| 16:29.49 | kergoth | i know |
| 16:29.49 | Titeuf | it did nothing |
| 16:29.55 | kergoth | i just said, it -doesnt- bring you back to a sane state |
| 16:29.59 | kergoth | it cant, because flash is writable |
| 16:30.35 | Titeuf | yes you're right |
| 16:31.14 | Titeuf | i've to buy a cf adaptator to install a new system i think :( |
| 16:31.34 | coup-PDA | u dumped the contents of your cf? |
| 16:31.34 | kergoth | most likely. they're good to have |
| 16:31.39 | kergoth | good point |
| 16:31.48 | kergoth | if you still have the initrd.bin on the card, you can reflash |
| 16:32.23 | Titeuf | i don't think so |
| 16:32.39 | Titeuf | i think i'll buy a sd card too |
| 16:33.03 | Titeuf | instead of installing application on the cf card |
| 16:33.13 | Titeuf | it will be better |
| 16:33.49 | kergoth | yeah |
| 16:34.31 | coup-PDA | yeah, it rules |
| 16:34.31 | DaJoker | yep.. it's much better.. especially when you have wireless as well |
| 16:34.31 | DaJoker | ;) |
| 16:34.32 | coup-PDA | yup, i can sit here in the park near my house, ircing |
| 16:34.32 | Titeuf | sure |
| 16:34.34 | kergoth | hehe |
| 16:36.03 | Titeuf | i think i'd love to do that to |
| 16:41.09 | kergoth | finally |
| 16:41.15 | kergoth | the opie buildsystem is fairly solid |
| 16:41.22 | kergoth | time to test out an ARM build |
| 16:41.38 | coup-PDA | ok, struggled through and reported bug in konq/e |
| 16:41.45 | kergoth | hehe, i saw that |
| 16:43.44 | nasa | Hi, does anyone know how to connect to the z via usb in win2K? I am using the latest beata.... |
| 16:43.54 | kergoth | read the faq |
| 16:44.18 | nasa | ibot faq |
| 16:44.18 | | i guess faq is at http://www.newbreedsoftware.com/zaurus-faq/ or at http://www.handhelds.org/handhelds-faq/handhelds-faq.html or at http://adorphuye.com/zaurus/java/faq.jsp or at http://www.travellingkiwi.com/zarus/faq/faq.html or at http://www.openzaurus.org/ |
| 16:44.28 | kergoth | openzaurus.org |
| 16:44.59 | coup-PDA | kergoth: need a faqbot |
| 16:45.04 | kergoth | yes |
| 16:45.06 | kergoth | thatd be spiffy |
| 16:45.24 | coup-PDA | hehe |
| 16:45.47 | coup-PDA | never tried writing an irc bot b4 is there an API framework? |
| 16:45.56 | coup-PDA | if so, i may give it a go |
| 16:47.07 | coup-PDA | anyone got a server i can run it on if/when i manage it? |
| 16:48.46 | coup-PDA | site on bot writing: http://www.programmersheaven.com/zone14/cat256/4363.htm |
| 16:50.26 | coup-PDA | how do i save link as in konq/e?? |
| 16:50.51 | Twiun | coup-PDA: I'd imagine you would use an existing bot and customise it |
| 16:51.41 | coup-PDA | Twiun: aye :) |
| 16:52.16 | coup-PDA | got a howto but its in doc format |
| 16:52.30 | coup-PDA | anyone ported vwware to the Z? |
| 16:52.55 | coup-PDA | would be handy as hancom dont work :) |
| 16:53.09 | Twiun | lol |
| 16:53.16 | Twiun | get wine+word! |
| 16:54.20 | coup-PDA | wine on the Z? |
| 16:54.29 | coup-PDA | and word? |
| 16:54.39 | Twiun | of course! you're talking vmware, I say wine... |
| 16:54.44 | coup-PDA | hmmmm *cough* bloat *cough* |
| 16:54.46 | Twiun | let's both fantasise |
| 16:54.59 | Twiun | how about plex86 even? |
| 16:55.21 | coup-PDA | i meant vw (i think) file for converting word docs to ither formats |
| 16:55.29 | Twiun | ahhh |
| 16:56.33 | kergoth | Twiun: bochs is ported to the z |
| 16:56.34 | coup-PDA | i may setup the crosscompiler |
| 16:56.44 | coup-PDA | bochs? |
| 16:56.54 | Twiun | ooo |
| 16:56.58 | kergoth | bochs |
| 16:57.03 | kergoth | hardwire had an old as dirt linux in it |
| 16:57.04 | kergoth | and dos |
| 16:57.12 | kergoth | and somebody had windows 95 running in it |
| 16:57.14 | kergoth | funny as hell |
| 16:57.25 | coup-PDA | sweet |
| 16:57.35 | coup-PDA | 95 on the Z? |
| 16:57.58 | kergoth | yeah |
| 16:58.04 | coup-PDA | i have to get that running, think of the bragging rights |
| 16:58.21 | coup-PDA | any idea where the ipkg is? |
| 16:59.17 | coup-PDA | ibot search zsi for bochs |
| 16:59.38 | coup-PDA | damn ibot |
| 16:59.39 | kergoth | yeah, its on zsi |
| 17:00.19 | coup-PDA | not in the feed tho |
| 17:02.08 | BZFlagVoted | coup-PDA: changes syntax with the new ibot. |
| 17:02.15 | BZFlagVoted | ibot zsi bochs |
| 17:02.27 | kergoth | ah |
| 17:02.29 | coup-PDA | sweet the screenie shows win98 boot screen |
| 17:02.33 | kergoth | hehe |
| 17:02.37 | kergoth | scary eh |
| 17:03.30 | coup-PDA | dling now |
| 17:03.46 | coup-PDA | will have to smbmount some space and try it out |
| 17:07.17 | tux_mike | coup: word on the Fujitsu? |
| 17:08.28 | coup-PDA | tux: gah! clean forgot! |
| 17:08.37 | tux_mike | doh |
| 17:08.45 | tux_mike | coup: i got word the sound will work |
| 17:08.55 | tux_mike | only hold up is the wifi |
| 17:09.05 | coup-PDA | tux: can u mail me on gavin.carey@tfn.com and ill check tommorow |
| 17:09.59 | tux_mike | sure |
| 17:13.07 | tux_mike | done |
| 17:13.16 | coup-PDA | ta |
| 17:14.16 | coup-PDA | cheers |
| 17:14.31 | coup-PDA | right, my batt is going, so im heading home |
| 17:14.42 | tux_mike | bye |
| 17:14.49 | coup-PDA | ooo beeps in konsole? |
| 17:15.05 | coup-PDA | when tabbing |
| 17:15.19 | coup-PDA | anyway, bye all |
| 17:16.55 | Titeuf | good night |
| 17:45.38 | godsmoke | hey ... can someone recomend the amount of memory/storage I should allocate for openzaurus? ... I haven't used it yet (obviously) ... and hence I don't know how it will perform under certain conditions |
| 17:48.38 | Twiun | godsmoke: read the download page - it has recommendations |
| 17:52.31 | godsmoke | Twiun: thank you |
| 17:52.43 | godsmoke | ok .. so I have to ask ... I just backed up all of my data |
| 17:52.52 | godsmoke | but that didn't back up the existing rom image right? |
| 17:53.07 | godsmoke | just the ram? |
| 17:53.13 | Twiun | just bits of the ram |
| 17:53.33 | Twiun | and btw SharpROM backup!=OZ backup |
| 17:53.37 | Twiun | they're not compatible |
| 17:53.44 | godsmoke | ok |
| 17:54.05 | godsmoke | how do I make a backup of the SharmROM? |
| 17:54.11 | godsmoke | SharpROM* |
| 17:55.07 | ljp | very carefully |
| 17:55.15 | Twiun | you don't need to, it's freely available for download |
| 17:55.21 | godsmoke | oh ok |
| 17:55.34 | godsmoke | so, I have to unload all of the data off of my CF card? |
| 17:55.53 | Twiun | not if you have enough space for the initrd.bin and zImage files |
| 17:56.05 | godsmoke | hmm ... ok |
| 17:56.20 | Twiun | only data on the Z itself gets overwritten |
| 17:56.40 | godsmoke | Twiun: you mean the ROM |
| 17:56.49 | godsmoke | RAM is not overwritten? |
| 17:57.04 | Twiun | RAM goes.. poof! when you do a hard reset |
| 17:57.10 | Twiun | so that never counts |
| 17:57.10 | godsmoke | ok |
| 17:57.32 | godsmoke | so when I just did a "backup" from the Zaurus menu ... what did that do? |
| 17:57.43 | godsmoke | I have no files on there (that I made) |
| 17:57.49 | godsmoke | I just got the thing like 2 hours ago |
| 17:57.51 | ljp | I thought ram went pffffffffffffft with a hard reset |
| 17:57.56 | Twiun | backed up things like preferences... |
| 17:58.06 | Twiun | if you've only had it for 2 hours, backups are irrelevant |
| 17:58.09 | godsmoke | Twiun: but that means nothing with OpenZaurus |
| 17:58.19 | Twiun | ljp: absolutely... my bad |
| 17:58.33 | godsmoke | uhh ... ok ... lemmie get my CF card connected to my desktop |
| 17:58.48 | Twiun | godsmoke: no, because the filesystems are arranged slightly differently (OZ is better of course!) |
| 17:58.59 | ljp | I once had ram go 'zzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzttt' |
| 17:59.11 | Twiun | that doesn't sound healthy |
| 17:59.16 | Twiun | were you frying a kitten on it? |
| 17:59.24 | godsmoke | Twiun: and what filesystem does OZ use? |
| 17:59.58 | Twiun | godsmoke: jffs2 - makes the ROM writable... you should really read the faq before kergoth start's foaming at the mouth and shouting rtfm ;-) |
| 17:59.59 | kergoth`out | godsmoke: i'd recommend reading the faq entitled "What are all these zimages for? (aka how does OZ make use of the Z's flash and ram)" |
| 18:00.05 | ljp | no, but the blue smoke got out of the computer, so it died |
| 18:00.08 | kergoth`out | hehe |
| 18:00.50 | godsmoke | Twiun: I've read quite a bit of it |
| 18:01.04 | godsmoke | kergoth`out: I know what zimages are |
| 18:01.04 | kergoth`out | godsmoke: go read the faq i just pointed you to :) |
| 18:01.13 | godsmoke | kergoth`out: I am not new to linux |
| 18:01.15 | kergoth`out | godsmoke: read the aka portion of that () |
| 18:01.24 | kergoth`out | godsmoke: 'how does OZ make use of the Z's flash and ram' |
| 18:02.22 | godsmoke | kergoth`out: I'm sorry .. that has nothing to do with my question |
| 18:02.32 | kergoth`out | dood, are you dense? |
| 18:02.39 | kergoth`out | filesystem type is part of a description of what we do with flash |
| 18:02.40 | godsmoke | http://openzaurus.sourceforge.net/oz_website/faq/faq.php?id=9 |
| 18:03.07 | kergoth`out | flash is writable |
| 18:03.11 | godsmoke | yes |
| 18:03.12 | kergoth`out | theres only one sane filesystem to put on flash |
| 18:03.16 | kergoth`out | writable falsh that is |
| 18:03.23 | godsmoke | I'm talkign about the ROM |
| 18:03.26 | kergoth`out | any other filesystem makes no sense |
| 18:03.33 | kergoth`out | godsmoke: dood, there is no ROM in the Z |
| 18:03.35 | kergoth`out | godsmoke: its *flash* |
| 18:03.40 | kergoth`out | godsmoke: aka 'flash ROM' |
| 18:03.46 | godsmoke | kergoth`out: uh ok |
| 18:03.50 | kergoth`out | godsmoke: and as i said there is -one- sane filesystem to put on flash |
| 18:03.52 | kergoth`out | godsmoke: jffs2 |
| 18:03.53 | kergoth`out | ibot: jffs2 |
| 18:03.53 | | hmm... jffs2 is at http://sources.redhat.com/jffs2/ or alien technology from that ufo crash in New Mexico in the 1940's |
| 18:03.55 | kergoth`out | read up |
| 18:04.05 | kergoth`out | hehe |
| 18:04.07 | kergoth`out | thats evil |
| 18:04.19 | godsmoke | kergoth`out: ok ... I don't need a RTFM speech ... just be a little more calm about the issue |
| 18:04.25 | kergoth`out | eh? |
| 18:04.27 | kergoth`out | it is documented |
| 18:04.31 | godsmoke | I know that |
| 18:04.32 | kergoth`out | i dont like repeating myself |
| 18:04.42 | godsmoke | but it doesn't say that in the faq article you pointed to |
| 18:04.44 | kergoth`out | particularly when getting asked the same question 6 times a day |
| 18:04.45 | ljp | it really is alien technology |
| 18:04.48 | godsmoke | I had no idea it was FLASH ROM |
| 18:04.53 | kergoth`out | godsmoke: and apparently you didnt read your manual |
| 18:04.58 | kergoth`out | godsmoke: in which it documents that it uses flash rom |
| 18:05.04 | godsmoke | kergoth`out: just calm down |
| 18:05.07 | kergoth`out | your assumptions are not my problem |
| 18:05.38 | godsmoke | this is exactly why the average home user is scard to use linux |
| 18:05.41 | kergoth | eh? |
| 18:05.48 | kergoth | what does irc have to do with linux? |
| 18:05.49 | godsmoke | confrontational attitude |
| 18:05.55 | kergoth | most end users dont know what irc is |
| 18:06.02 | kergoth | much less that it can be used as a support channel |
| 18:06.03 | godsmoke | people new to something, go to irc to find help |
| 18:06.06 | kergoth | no |
| 18:06.10 | kergoth | people who know enough to use irc go to irc |
| 18:06.14 | kergoth | most end users do not |
| 18:06.20 | godsmoke | hmm |
| 18:06.21 | Twiun | godsmoke: I disagree - most newbies I know of use the websites |
| 18:06.23 | kergoth | you're talkinga bout a very explicit subsection of the market |
| 18:06.29 | kergoth | Twiun: bingo |
| 18:06.34 | kergoth | and some may use the mailing lists |
| 18:06.39 | kergoth | but irc is an even smaller group |
| 18:07.18 | kergoth`out | bbl, movie |
| 18:07.18 | ljp | whats irc? |
| 18:09.25 | chouimat | kergoth`out: fix the font problem opie don't do ipk without them |
| 18:30.49 | Infamous2 | is there a Zaurus SL-5600 coming out? |
| 18:55.45 | ciaolinux | any news about a new kernel? |
| 19:12.25 | godsmoke | hmm ... no go |
| 19:13.59 | godsmoke | I got the logo + the cursor thing ... but looked at the faq |
| 19:14.11 | godsmoke | and I made sure I named the file "zImage" |
| 19:14.20 | godsmoke | 2nd time's the charm? :) |
| 19:16.01 | ljp | you need to wait... |
| 19:16.49 | godsmoke | nah ... I waitd |
| 19:16.57 | godsmoke | and I just did it agian ... it worked fine this time |
| 19:17.13 | godsmoke | the 1st time ... I let it sit there for 4 minutes ... and no backlight came on |
| 19:17.22 | godsmoke | the 2nd time, the backlight came on right away |
| 19:17.27 | godsmoke | yeay!! working |
| 19:18.00 | ljp | oh |
| 19:18.31 | godsmoke | reconfiguring all packages installed to root |
| 19:18.34 | godsmoke | :) |
| 19:19.43 | godsmoke | wow ... Opie beautiful |
| 19:23.40 | godsmoke | whops ... seg fault |
| 19:31.34 | badlex|bbl | ibot mplayer |
| 19:31.34 | | extra, extra, read all about it, mplayer is http://www.tjhsst.edu/~agupta/mplayer_0.90pre7-1e_arm.ipk |
| 19:34.01 | godsmoke | hmm |
| 19:34.38 | DaJoker | godsmoke: good luck |
| 19:34.40 | kergoth`out | chouimat: huh? opie doesnt require ttf-openoffice |
| 19:34.58 | godsmoke | DaJoker: why do I need luck? ... is there a lack of one? |
| 19:35.08 | DaJoker | godsmoke: lack of a decent one anyway |
| 19:35.18 | godsmoke | DaJoker: which ones exist? |
| 19:35.25 | DaJoker | opiemail |
| 19:35.35 | kergoth`out | godsmoke: opie-mail2 is being rewritten, but is only usable for limited imap use. opiemail supports pop3 iirc, but is no longer maintained |
| 19:35.39 | kergoth`out | godsmoke: neither are really sufficient |
| 19:35.46 | DaJoker | yup |
| 19:35.48 | godsmoke | damn |
| 19:35.54 | DaJoker | been thinking of writing a pyqt one.. |
| 19:35.56 | DaJoker | just too lazy |
| 19:35.56 | godsmoke | kergoth`out: what do you use? |
| 19:36.05 | kergoth`out | godsmoke: ssh and mutt and screen |
| 19:36.11 | kergoth`out | godsmoke: i run mutt on a remote box if i need mail at all |
| 19:36.14 | kergoth`out | godsmoke: and i usually dont |
| 19:36.17 | kergoth`out | heh |
| 19:36.24 | godsmoke | hmm |
| 19:37.48 | godsmoke | where can I get opiemail? |
| 19:37.59 | DaJoker | opie-mail2 is in the feed IIRC |
| 19:39.34 | godsmoke | oh no ... no windows syncing either? ... darn, my windows machine is the only one I have contacts on |
| 19:39.45 | DaJoker | no windows syncing? |
| 19:39.52 | godsmoke | I just ran a search |
| 19:39.57 | godsmoke | on faq |
| 19:40.07 | godsmoke | but maybe it was because my dns servers just died |
| 19:40.07 | DaJoker | hrmm.. |
| 19:40.16 | DaJoker | I better tell my Winxp box to stop syncing then |
| 19:40.21 | godsmoke | hah |
| 19:40.27 | godsmoke | maybe it was the dns servers |
| 19:40.42 | godsmoke | yeah ... can't access any websites now |
| 19:40.44 | godsmoke | brb |
| 19:41.04 | DaJoker | after a fresh flash, just go into the security app and reset the ip range allowed to connect to the Z |
| 19:42.05 | godsmoke|other | DaJoker: what do you sync your mail with (from your desktop)? |
| 19:42.18 | DaJoker | I don't sync mail |
| 19:42.23 | godsmoke|other | oh |
| 19:42.30 | DaJoker | why bother.. I have imap everywhere |
| 19:42.34 | godsmoke|other | see ... that is like 1/4 of the use for this thing |
| 19:42.38 | DaJoker | why would I want copies everywhere |
| 19:42.44 | godsmoke|other | I need to write e-mails while on the subway |
| 19:43.17 | DaJoker | probably chose the wrong pda for that |
| 19:43.19 | godsmoke|other | maybe openzaurus isn't for me |
| 19:43.31 | godsmoke|other | DaJoker: uhh ... it worked fine in SharpROM |
| 19:43.48 | godsmoke|other | the other 3/4 of the use is kismet :) |
| 19:44.07 | DaJoker | well.. maybe I should get off my ass and write a pyqt email app then |
| 19:44.12 | godsmoke|other | heh |
| 19:49.14 | bbeattie | kergoth`out: you havn't seen a map viewer for USGS census data/vector maps have you? |
| 20:05.26 | KallDrexx | hola |
| 20:05.34 | KallDrexx | lol kergoth`out |
| 20:06.28 | kergoth`out | ? |
| 20:06.34 | KallDrexx | the title |
| 20:06.36 | KallDrexx | topic rather |
| 20:10.00 | kergoth`out | ah |
| 20:10.01 | kergoth`out | hehe |
| 20:11.08 | godsmoke|help | hmm ... I'm trying to reflash my zaurus ... with the original rom |
| 20:11.35 | godsmoke|help | and it goes ... then reports that it couldn't find a formatted partition and then it asks for a root password |
| 20:15.43 | kergoth`out | you're doing c+d+full reset right |
| 20:15.47 | kergoth`out | with ospack on the card |
| 20:15.52 | kergoth`out | and initrd.bin and zImage -removed- |
| 20:16.12 | godsmoke|help | yes |
| 20:16.17 | godsmoke|help | wait ... just got it |
| 20:16.18 | godsmoke|help | weird |
| 20:16.33 | godsmoke|help | I just did a hard reset (no c+d) after the error |
| 20:16.37 | godsmoke|help | and booted |
| 20:16.39 | kergoth`out | ah |
| 20:16.40 | godsmoke|help | now it's fine |
| 20:16.59 | godsmoke|help | I really would have loved to use openzaurus |
| 20:17.17 | godsmoke|help | but it just seems like I'm looking for a more finished solution for this thing |
| 20:17.35 | DaJoker | oz seems pretty finished to me |
| 20:17.54 | godsmoke|help | DaJoker: I ABSOLUTELY need e-mail syncing and checking to be good |
| 20:18.26 | DaJoker | only because your backend is inferior |
| 20:18.30 | DaJoker | but oh well |
| 20:18.38 | godsmoke|help | and although I am REALLY impressed with openzaurus ... it seems it just isn't the right solution for me right now |
| 20:18.43 | godsmoke|help | my backend? |
| 20:18.53 | godsmoke|help | the backend on the zaurus? |
| 20:18.56 | DaJoker | no |
| 20:19.00 | DaJoker | your backend mail system |
| 20:19.09 | STrRedWolf | Heya. |
| 20:19.09 | DaJoker | syncing mail to a pda is really a silly thing to do |
| 20:19.23 | godsmoke|help | DaJoker: I don't have time to argue with you |
| 20:19.35 | STrRedWolf | I do that for art commissions and some newsletters I read on the road. |
| 20:20.04 | godsmoke|help | I need to do it EVERY day ... I get something close to 40 e-mails a day |
| 20:20.13 | godsmoke|help | being able to answer them on the train is great |
| 20:24.54 | kergoth`out | godsmoke|help: sounds like you should wait until opie-mail2 gets its rewrite :) |
| 20:25.33 | DaJoker | or, write your own ;) |
| 20:25.42 | godsmoke|help | kergoth`out: maybe |
| 20:25.50 | godsmoke|help | DaJoker: too busy with work and school |
| 20:25.52 | godsmoke|help | but I would |
| 20:27.30 | neale | So, I was looking at make replacements today |
| 20:27.34 | neale | and I think I have decided to use Aegis and scons |
| 20:27.42 | neale | the end. |
| 20:32.26 | DaJoker | neale: tell us another bed time story.. that one was too short |
| 20:32.33 | STrRedWolf | Any word on if the Image Viewer will soon understand GIFs? |
| 20:32.46 | neale | hm, okay |
| 20:32.54 | trepine | Hey has anyone lost the use of their digitizer with OZ? |
| 20:32.55 | neale | once there was a guy named elaen |
| 20:33.06 | neale | that's a new one on me, trepine |
| 20:33.07 | STrRedWolf | trepine: I have a few times. |
| 20:33.21 | neale | and elaen had a workstation that didn't have much RAM |
| 20:33.21 | trepine | what did you do short of reinstalling? |
| 20:33.33 | neale | so he asked #openzaurus what some good browsers were |
| 20:33.35 | STrRedWolf | I had to reflash it, and be careful about installing. |
| 20:33.36 | neale | and they said "dillo" |
| 20:33.41 | neale | so he used it, and it was great |
| 20:33.42 | neale | the end |
| 20:33.43 | trepine | I have it setup with the 64 RAM 0 Storage and a 128 MB SD |
| 20:33.53 | neale | trepine: rebooting doesn't help? |
| 20:34.38 | trepine | no...is there a digitizer daemon or somthing I can change a config on or something |
| 20:35.00 | DaJoker | only if you are using X |
| 20:35.03 | DaJoker | otherwise, no |
| 20:35.09 | trepine | Da*& |
| 20:35.13 | neale | I'd try rebooting. |
| 20:35.18 | DaJoker | yup |
| 20:35.23 | neale | just flip the switch on the back |
| 20:35.28 | neale | you don't even need to reset. |
| 20:35.36 | trepine | Tried That, Guess I could hard reset... |
| 20:35.42 | neale | wacko |
| 20:35.48 | neale | maybe it's way *way* out of alignment |
| 20:35.54 | neale | did you try re-calibrating the digitizer? |
| 20:36.05 | trepine | I would but I cannot select it |
| 20:36.09 | neale | yes you can |
| 20:36.14 | neale | use the "home" button |
| 20:36.16 | STrRedWolf | It takes a while to select it via keyboard. |
| 20:36.21 | neale | keep pressing it until you get to settings |
| 20:36.22 | trepine | ok |
| 20:36.25 | trepine | let me try |
| 20:36.27 | neale | then use the D-pad to get to calibrate |
| 20:36.38 | neale | then press the friendly round button |
| 20:36.40 | neale | cbok! |
| 20:36.44 | cbok | howdy |
| 20:36.47 | neale | is that the sound that a cchicken makes? |
| 20:38.56 | STrRedWolf | Better than a quantum duck. |
| 20:39.41 | trepine | HRMMM...no go, maybe have to redo |
| 20:39.53 | STrRedWolf | Hmmm, Konquerer doesn't like to scale GIFs... |
| 20:41.27 | STrRedWolf | It'll scale over 50%, intrestingly enough... |
| 20:51.41 | neale | hey, ya ever used mooviewer? |
| 20:53.23 | STrRedWolf | mooviewer? |
| 20:53.41 | neale | ibot zfi mooviewer |
| 20:53.49 | neale | dangit |
| 20:54.01 | neale | ibot zsi mooviewer |
| 20:54.10 | neale | ibot zfi image |
| 20:54.58 | neale | ibot zfi mooview |
| 20:55.03 | neale | that's the one |
| 20:55.06 | neale | check that sucker out |
| 20:55.13 | neale | let me know how it is |
| 20:56.11 | STrRedWolf | Checking... |
| 20:58.13 | STrRedWolf | It's not showing. |
| 20:58.28 | STrRedWolf | Can't run it off of the launcher. |
| 21:01.38 | STrRedWolf | Ahhh! Run from the command line and it segfaults. |
| 21:06.04 | kergoth | xmms segfaults? |
| 21:06.14 | STrRedWolf | I can't run it myself with OZ. |
| 21:06.51 | kergoth | weird |
| 21:07.23 | badalex | ibot howto |
| 21:07.23 | | extra, extra, read all about it, howto is at http://www.zauruszone.com/howtos/ or see xcompile for cross compiler setup |
| 21:08.05 | STrRedWolf | Time to NFSMount... |
| 21:08.05 | chouimat | back |
| 21:08.16 | chouimat | kergoth`bored: boring movie? |
| 21:16.08 | kergoth`bored | chouimat: nah, movie over, now i'm bored |
| 21:16.12 | kergoth`bored | chouimat: working on buildroot |
| 21:17.15 | kergoth`bored | hey cbok |
| 21:23.13 | cbok | what movie did you see? |
| 21:23.23 | kergoth`bored | watched a dvd, payback |
| 21:23.29 | cbok | nice |
| 21:23.32 | cbok | not a bad movie |
| 21:23.46 | kergoth`bored | nah not bad at all |
| 21:23.59 | godsmoke | kergoth`bored: how old are you? |
| 21:24.03 | kergoth`bored | 22 |
| 21:24.03 | godsmoke | (just wondering) |
| 21:24.04 | chouimat | kergoth`bored: ok, was working with some firewall/vpn related stuff. and other cpu target in buildroot will be good for me |
| 21:24.16 | kergoth`bored | chouimat: okay, i'll add it. easy enough. just x86 or others as well? |
| 21:24.39 | kergoth`bored | chouimat: might have to grep around, some of the makefiles may be using hardcoded archs in their ./configure lines, but they need fixing if thats the case regardless |
| 21:24.52 | chouimat | kergoth`bored: x86 for now. and add docs, I check for other os support too |
| 21:25.02 | kergoth`bored | k |
| 21:25.08 | kergoth`bored | new opie buildsystem works grea |
| 21:25.10 | kergoth`bored | t |
| 21:25.17 | kergoth`bored | i'm building it against arm right now as a test |
| 21:25.32 | chouimat | kergoth`bored: I think that for oz4 a generic embeded system would be great |
| 21:25.46 | kergoth`bored | yes |
| 21:26.12 | kergoth`bored | tim riker and i have been discussing the buildsystem to drive such a thing. would be superior to what we have now. but i'll make this as generic as possible |
| 21:26.34 | chouimat | kergoth`bored: any test implementation of that? |
| 21:27.29 | kergoth`bored | not yet. the upcomign system we're discussing is completly in the design phase |
| 21:27.29 | chouimat | kergoth`bored: any doc? |
| 21:27.29 | kergoth`bored | tim fired up a SF project for it and started a wiki, but not much beyond that |
| 21:27.29 | chouimat | url |
| 21:27.29 | kergoth`bored | elinux.org iirc |
| 21:27.29 | kergoth`bored | we've been discussing it for some time now |
| 21:28.00 | kergoth`bored | hey DaJoker |
| 21:28.08 | DaJoker | heya |
| 21:28.41 | chouimat | kergoth`bored: ok. maybe adding support for *BSD will be my target |
| 21:30.36 | kergoth`bored | chouimat: thatd be nifty |
| 21:30.41 | kergoth`bored | chouimat: shouldnt take too much really |
| 21:31.01 | chouimat | kergoth`bored: I speaking os xcompiling :P |
| 21:31.01 | neale | AHHH! |
| 21:31.10 | kergoth`bored | hehe |
| 21:31.13 | kergoth`bored | neale: ? |
| 21:31.22 | neale | just trying to break the monotony. |
| 21:31.25 | DaJoker | damn laptop.. |
| 21:31.26 | kergoth`bored | ah |
| 21:31.30 | neale | no |
| 21:31.30 | kergoth`bored | boring night |
| 21:31.31 | neale | AHHH! |
| 21:31.33 | kergoth`bored | all the chans are dead |
| 21:31.38 | DaJoker | thing won't keep accurate time.. and this thing is brand new |
| 21:31.44 | chouimat | kergoth`bored: hehe oskit support :) |
| 21:31.44 | neale | well, I am happily crashing the Z now. |
| 21:31.48 | kergoth`bored | hehe |
| 21:31.49 | neale | for what that's worth. |
| 21:31.50 | kergoth`bored | neale: fun |
| 21:31.53 | kergoth`bored | neale: apmd? :) |
| 21:31.56 | neale | yay |
| 21:32.00 | neale | you betcha |
| 21:32.16 | chouimat | kergoth`bored: Dreamcast support |
| 21:33.20 | kergoth`bored | mm mods |
| 21:34.42 | chouimat | mmm porto |
| 21:34.55 | kergoth`bored | got a white russian here |
| 21:35.08 | chouimat | white russian? |
| 21:35.09 | kergoth`bored | i'm still completely out of rum. and no porto here, and no cider either |
| 21:35.09 | neale | I'm picking lice out of my hair |
| 21:35.20 | kergoth`bored | chouimat: vodka, coffee liquor, milk |
| 21:35.28 | chouimat | ok |
| 21:38.27 | neale | how very very curious |
| 21:39.06 | kergoth`bored | neale: ? |
| 21:39.22 | kergoth`bored | chouimat: just made buildroot use new opie buildsystem, packages/opie/Makefile is much easier to read :) |
| 21:39.42 | neale | well, it looks like apmd doesn't actually make any ioctls to /dev/apm |
| 21:39.46 | neale | it just opens it |
| 21:39.56 | kergoth`bored | oh |
| 21:39.57 | kergoth`bored | i had an idea |
| 21:40.15 | kergoth`bored | neale: we should alter opie, to instead of opening apm and issuing ioctl calls, to open it via the apm library |
| 21:40.24 | neale | well yeah |
| 21:40.34 | kergoth`bored | neale: which shouldnt contend with apmd, as i believe the apm library keeps a static variable with the file descriptor for the open apm dev |
| 21:40.42 | kergoth`bored | neale: should be much more sane imho |
| 21:40.49 | neale | the apm library checks for a running apmd |
| 21:40.58 | neale | I wish I understood better what this button did. |
| 21:41.06 | kergoth`bored | the power button? |
| 21:41.08 | kergoth`bored | theres two modes |
| 21:41.15 | kergoth`bored | either the kernel handles it, and suspends/resumes |
| 21:41.16 | kergoth`bored | or |
| 21:41.28 | kergoth`bored | it passes the keycode up through the keyboard drivers to userspace |
| 21:41.34 | kergoth`bored | and the userspace app handles it all |
| 21:41.36 | kergoth`bored | which is what opie does |
| 21:41.48 | kergoth`bored | it uses the ioctl call to tell the kernel not to handle it |
| 21:43.00 | neale | do you know what the kernel does by default? |
| 21:43.04 | kergoth`bored | yes, it handles it |
| 21:43.08 | kergoth`bored | opie changes that |
| 21:43.13 | kergoth`bored | now the thing is, apmd shouldnt interfere |
| 21:43.18 | neale | so if I never ran opie, it'd be handled by the kernel. |
| 21:43.20 | kergoth`bored | i think opie is just failing to open the device and change it |
| 21:43.21 | kergoth`bored | yep |
| 21:43.27 | kergoth`bored | have you tried spawning apmd -after- opie has started? |
| 21:43.35 | kergoth`bored | that is, after opie has told the kernel itll handle it |
| 21:43.36 | neale | that's the only way I've tried it so far |
| 21:43.40 | kergoth`bored | ah |
| 21:43.48 | neale | but the strange thing |
| 21:43.51 | kergoth`bored | see thats the strange part. its already told the kernel whats up, the behavior shouldnt break |
| 21:43.59 | neale | well lemme try again |
| 21:44.02 | kergoth`bored | k |
| 21:44.48 | neale | no, definitely not coming back after that |
| 21:44.54 | kergoth`bored | so something changes |
| 21:44.59 | kergoth`bored | after apmd grabs the device |
| 21:45.05 | neale | so what's odd is that if I start apmd, then kill it, then suspend, it comes back. |
| 21:45.13 | kergoth`bored | haha |
| 21:45.16 | kergoth`bored | its temporary? |
| 21:45.18 | kergoth`bored | thats hilarious |
| 21:45.24 | kergoth`bored | wtf |
| 21:45.28 | neale | indeed |
| 21:46.17 | neale | but you think apmd should work fine if I never start opie, huh? |
| 21:46.20 | kergoth`bored | okay, time to read the code in opie which changes the behavior |
| 21:46.23 | kergoth`bored | neale: probably |
| 21:46.27 | neale | I'll try that. |
| 21:46.28 | kergoth`bored | neale: kernel would handle it |
| 21:46.29 | kergoth`bored | good idea |
| 21:48.21 | neale | okay, without starting opie or apmd, the button works great |
| 21:48.54 | raja | whats the oz webpage |
| 21:49.00 | neale | openzaurus.org |
| 21:49.10 | neale | so, I start apmd (still no opie) and it doesn't come back |
| 21:49.17 | neale | looks like this isn't an opie problem at all. |
| 21:49.47 | kergoth`bored | ah |
| 21:49.50 | kergoth`bored | interesting |
| 21:49.56 | kergoth`bored | so its pure kernel space |
| 21:50.01 | kergoth`bored | bug in collie_apm.c perhaps |
| 21:50.04 | chouimat | kergoth`bored: push something ? |
| 21:50.49 | neale | gaw, and I was so hoping not to have to look at kernel code again tonight. |
| 21:51.12 | chouimat | kergoth`bored: pushed something ? |
| 21:51.21 | kergoth`bored | chouimat: havent pushed anything into bk yet, hold on |
| 21:51.24 | kergoth`bored | chouimat: testing |
| 21:51.51 | STrRedWolf | Hmmmm.... intresting behavior w/ipkgs... |
| 21:52.13 | kergoth`bored | ? |
| 21:52.23 | raja | anyone from canada here |
| 21:52.30 | raja | im looking to get a zaurus and im not sure where to get one from |
| 21:52.41 | raja | or a good american online store at a good price |
| 21:52.56 | STrRedWolf | ipkg doesn't do a list of the ipk's data.tar.gz and do links as nessisary when installing to anything other than root. |
| 21:52.58 | chouimat | raja: yup |
| 21:53.12 | neale | oh my, collie_apm.c is a rather large file. |
| 21:53.18 | raja | chouimat: im at queen's here in kingston.. where did you get your z from? |
| 21:53.29 | kergoth`bored | neale: its horrible |
| 21:53.32 | chouimat | raja: sharp contest |
| 21:53.40 | neale | I got mine at buydig.com |
| 21:53.42 | kergoth`bored | neale: its like apm.c, but modified for collie specifically to avoid an assload of ifdefs |
| 21:53.59 | kergoth`bored | neale: and its ugly |
| 21:53.59 | STrRedWolf | Which is why alot of apps have images missing at the very least... |
| 21:54.02 | raja | wonder if buydig ships to canada |
| 21:54.05 | kergoth`bored | STrRedWolf: eh? |
| 21:54.07 | chouimat | kergoth`bored: goood :) |
| 21:54.10 | kergoth`bored | STrRedWolf: of course ipkg doesnt |
| 21:54.13 | kergoth`bored | STrRedWolf: aqpkg does |
| 21:54.18 | kergoth`bored | STrRedWolf: use the gui, or use ipkg-link |
| 21:54.25 | chouimat | raja: asked them |
| 21:54.28 | kergoth`bored | STrRedWolf: (ipkg-link is a shell script to link/unlink after install) |
| 21:54.30 | chouimat | raja: ask them |
| 21:54.41 | raja | chouimat: where did you get yours from? |
| 21:54.50 | chouimat | raja: form sharp challenge |
| 21:54.51 | STrRedWolf | Used the GUI to install kinkattalite, and it didn't link. |
| 21:55.01 | raja | oh nevermind |
| 21:55.02 | raja | sorry |
| 21:55.03 | raja | thanks |
| 21:55.08 | kergoth`bored | STrRedWolf: eh? |
| 21:55.08 | STrRedWolf | Looks like it just runs ipkg. :P |
| 21:55.10 | kergoth`bored | STrRedWolf: yes, it does |
| 21:55.16 | chouimat | raja: check the web or ebay |
| 21:55.20 | kergoth`bored | STrRedWolf: confirmed, verified |
| 21:55.21 | neale | maybe he told it not to link. |
| 21:55.28 | kergoth`bored | STrRedWolf: check your preferences |
| 21:55.42 | kergoth`bored | STrRedWolf: check the 'link to root' option, though its barely even used.. i think andy removed it in new versions |
| 21:55.59 | STrRedWolf | Yep, still checked. |
| 21:56.10 | kergoth`bored | STrRedWolf: no idea then. works flawlessly here |
| 21:56.56 | STrRedWolf | Strange. |
| 21:56.58 | kergoth`bored | STrRedWolf: use ipkg-link for now to do it manually |
| 21:57.04 | STrRedWolf | Done. |
| 22:01.41 | kergoth`bored | chouimat: bk pull, it uses opie's new buildsystem |
| 22:01.46 | kergoth`bored | chouimat: looking into ttf-openoffice now |
| 22:03.05 | neale | uhhhh |
| 22:03.16 | neale | what the feeping furbleschwartz is this... |
| 22:03.20 | neale | my green LED is flashing |
| 22:03.35 | neale | I went to pinch a loaf, and when I come back my green led is flashing |
| 22:03.37 | neale | this is ominous |
| 22:03.45 | STrRedWolf | You've got mail! :D |
| 22:03.53 | kergoth`bored | neale: opie isnt running |
| 22:03.59 | neale | true |
| 22:04.00 | kergoth`bored | neale: it does that when it suspends in console for some reason |
| 22:04.04 | neale | huh! |
| 22:04.06 | kergoth`bored | hehe |
| 22:04.14 | neale | that sounds a lot like a CLUE! |
| 22:04.19 | kergoth`bored | hehe |
| 22:04.22 | kergoth`bored | um, no |
| 22:04.27 | kergoth`bored | i doubt it anyway |
| 22:04.28 | neale | oh come on, it has to be |
| 22:04.40 | neale | when opie suspends, no green flashy, but when console does, green flashy |
| 22:04.40 | kergoth`bored | opie probably changes the state of the led device |
| 22:04.45 | kergoth`bored | could be |
| 22:04.46 | neale | obviously the two are doing it differently |
| 22:04.46 | kergoth`bored | who knows |
| 22:04.55 | kergoth`bored | not necessarily |
| 22:05.06 | kergoth`bored | the light change can be done by manipulating the sharp led device |
| 22:05.19 | neale | now all I have to do is find the part of the apm driver that flashes the green light when the processor isn't executing instructi... wait a second... |
| 22:05.21 | kergoth`bored | we could try commenting out any opie calls to touch that device, so it stays in a stock state, and see if the green led flashes |
| 22:05.26 | kergoth`bored | found it? |
| 22:05.33 | neale | no, just making a joke |
| 22:05.38 | kergoth`bored | fucker |
| 22:05.39 | kergoth`bored | :) |
| 22:05.52 | neale | all this to fix the time. |
| 22:06.02 | neale | maybe I should just buy a $5 wristwatch. |
| 22:06.37 | kergoth`bored | hehe |
| 22:06.47 | kergoth`bored | whats stupid is |
| 22:06.54 | kergoth`bored | that shitty lineo apm driver will go away |
| 22:07.02 | kergoth`bored | in favor of something clean, when we upgrade the kernel |
| 22:07.08 | chouimat | kergoth`bored: fixe the font issue :) |
| 22:07.14 | neale | why's that? |
| 22:07.28 | kergoth`bored | neale: because all of lineo's code is hack filled and ugly |
| 22:07.34 | neale | yes I know that part |
| 22:07.39 | kergoth`bored | .. |
| 22:07.42 | neale | but is all the collie stuff in the upstream kernel now? |
| 22:08.31 | kergoth`bored | no |
| 22:08.32 | kergoth`bored | none of it |
| 22:08.38 | kergoth`bored | and it wont be until its made sane |
| 22:08.39 | kergoth`bored | :) |
| 22:08.43 | kergoth`bored | which is of course on our todo |
| 22:09.06 | neale | so basically what you're telling me is, as soon as someone cleans up this code, we won't have to use the old unclean code anymore. |
| 22:09.12 | kergoth`bored | yes |
| 22:09.24 | kergoth`bored | theres a 2.5 and a 2.4 kernel tree on the linux-cl bkbits project |
| 22:09.27 | kergoth`bored | untouched in months and months |
| 22:09.27 | neale | that's not the eye-opener I thought it was going to be. |
| 22:09.30 | kergoth`bored | but thats where we do it |
| 22:09.41 | DaJoker | anyone happen to have built X for debian before? |
| 22:09.43 | kergoth`bored | we throw away the lineo shit, reimplement it in a clean and sane manner, and we're done |
| 22:09.57 | neale | but first we have to know what the hell a collie is |
| 22:10.02 | kergoth`bored | hehe |
| 22:10.08 | kergoth`bored | collie is the name of this sa11x0 machine type |
| 22:10.14 | kergoth`bored | just a name, nothing more |
| 22:10.24 | neale | but, can you get documentation on it? |
| 22:10.27 | kergoth`bored | I have Sharp's service manual, including Z schematics |
| 22:10.32 | neale | oh rad |
| 22:10.39 | kergoth`bored | its missing register and chip docs for the two primary chips in the Z though |
| 22:10.47 | kergoth`bored | so i'm still flying blind in a lot of ways |
| 22:10.47 | neale | ha ha ha |
| 22:10.52 | chouimat | kergoth`bored: the ttf-openoffice thing :) |
| 22:10.54 | kergoth`bored | all i have is lineo code to go on |
| 22:10.57 | kergoth`bored | chouimat: yeah yeah, i'm on ity |
| 22:11.01 | kergoth`bored | chouimat: why do you need it anyway? |
| 22:11.05 | kergoth`bored | chouimat: its not required to build opie |
| 22:11.19 | neale | come on man, he's talking about fixing my clock. your fonts can wait. |
| 22:11.27 | neale | this could save me $5! |
| 22:12.37 | kergoth`bored | hehe |
| 22:12.42 | kergoth`bored | cheap bastard |
| 22:12.44 | kergoth`bored | :) |
| 22:14.06 | kergoth`bored | chouimat: buildroot uses new opie buildsystem now. you'll want to update that opie cvs though :) |
| 22:14.34 | neale | you know |
| 22:14.35 | kergoth`bored | chouimat: ttf-openoffice now defaults to disabled in the configs, i'm working on documentation ow |
| 22:14.50 | neale | I have half a mind to completely uninstall opie, put emacs21 on the thing, and just run it in console mode. |
| 22:14.56 | kergoth`bored | hehe |
| 22:14.56 | chouimat | kergoth`bored: I ope I will have opie ipks now |
| 22:15.05 | kergoth`bored | i've been using vim as my primary TODO app on my Z for a week |
| 22:15.06 | kergoth`bored | :) |
| 22:15.11 | kergoth`bored | chouimat: me too, mine is building now |
| 22:15.25 | DaWorm | vim as todo? |
| 22:15.30 | chouimat | kergoth`bored: it's build but no ipk |
| 22:15.31 | kergoth`bored | hehe |
| 22:15.32 | neale | works gread |
| 22:15.33 | neale | great |
| 22:15.34 | kergoth`bored | chouimat: k |
| 22:15.43 | kergoth`bored | vim doesnt make a good datebook though, having no alarms |
| 22:15.51 | kergoth`bored | but it makes a snazzy todo and addressbook |
| 22:15.57 | kergoth`bored | if you dont mind text files |
| 22:15.58 | kergoth`bored | :) |
| 22:16.02 | DaWorm | how does that work? |
| 22:16.05 | DaWorm | i dont mind at all |
| 22:16.12 | kergoth`bored | vi TODO |
| 22:16.12 | neale | well |
| 22:16.15 | kergoth`bored | type stuff |
| 22:16.16 | kergoth`bored | :wq |
| 22:16.17 | neale | there you go |
| 22:16.21 | kergoth`bored | hehe |
| 22:16.33 | DaWorm | hehehe |
| 22:17.30 | neale | good lord |
| 22:17.35 | neale | if (prev_ac_line_status != COLLIE_AC_LINE_STATUS) { |
| 22:17.36 | neale | /* Flont Light contrast */ |
| 22:17.37 | neale | struct pm_dev *dev; |
| 22:17.37 | neale | dev = pm_find(PM_ILLUMINATION_DEV, NULL); |
| 22:17.38 | neale | if (dev && blank_state != APM_STATE_STANDBY) { |
| 22:17.39 | neale | DPRINTK("FL contrust :callback=%08x\n",dev->callback); |
| 22:17.53 | kergoth`bored | hehe |
| 22:17.54 | kergoth`bored | having fun yet? |
| 22:17.56 | kergoth`bored | i warned you |
| 22:18.02 | neale | which one is it guys, "flont light contrast" or "FL contrust"? |
| 22:18.11 | kergoth`bored | lol |
| 22:18.12 | STrRedWolf | Hmmm... |
| 22:18.18 | kergoth`bored | isnt lineo code great |
| 22:18.30 | kergoth`bored | its 99.9% crap |
| 22:18.37 | kergoth`bored | with like .1% useful information |
| 22:18.39 | neale | well, bad spelling doesn't always mean bad code |
| 22:18.53 | neale | I never have liked reading kernel code though |
| 22:19.01 | kergoth`bored | neale: its unreadable. some of it is tolerable -code-. not much, but some. 99% is unreadable |
| 22:19.41 | neale | what was lineo called before they were lineo? |
| 22:19.45 | kergoth`bored | you can manage to glean a fair bit of info about locomo and scoop from the code |
| 22:19.48 | neale | and aren't they located in bellevue? |
| 22:19.49 | kergoth`bored | well |
| 22:19.50 | kergoth`bored | scoop anyway |
| 22:19.52 | kergoth`bored | not locomo |
| 22:20.01 | kergoth`bored | neale: no, they're based in japan iirc |
| 22:20.08 | kergoth`bored | neale: they have a us office, dunno where |
| 22:20.11 | neale | ??? |
| 22:20.18 | neale | I'm way confused then |
| 22:20.21 | kergoth`bored | lineo japan did this work |
| 22:20.24 | kergoth`bored | in this kernel source |
| 22:20.28 | neale | ah, branch office |
| 22:20.30 | kergoth`bored | yep |
| 22:20.43 | neale | well dude, you can't fault them too much |
| 22:20.49 | kergoth`bored | well, they had to get it done |
| 22:20.51 | neale | they're having to write code in a foreign language |
| 22:20.57 | kergoth`bored | i suspect they were down to a time crunch |
| 22:21.01 | neale | the ABSOLUTE WORST code I've ever seen |
| 22:21.12 | kergoth`bored | as this was -obviously- coded for function, not maintainability |
| 22:21.15 | neale | was this russian BASIC program to control a nuclear reactor |
| 22:21.20 | kergoth`bored | neale: egad |
| 22:21.24 | kergoth`bored | neale: thats scary |
| 22:21.41 | neale | it had variable names like "A", "AA", "AAA", and "AAAAA". "AAAA" was mysteriously missing. |
| 22:21.54 | kergoth`bored | hahaha |
| 22:21.55 | neale | it was a space nuclear reactor |
| 22:22.09 | neale | so they only tested it with this program, using heater elements. |
| 22:22.13 | neale | but still. |
| 22:22.45 | neale | this was for the russian space program. |
| 22:23.30 | neale | Which we all know was very much a rubber bands and paper clips sort of enterprise. |
| 22:23.30 | kergoth`bored | hehe |
| 22:23.30 | neale | Not unlike our own space program. |
| 22:23.30 | kergoth`bored | indeed |
| 22:23.30 | neale | Except much, much more gory. |
| 22:23.41 | neale | But hey, that's Stalinist Communism for ya. |
| 22:28.43 | STrRedWolf | Oh geesh. AQpkg just froze on me |
| 22:28.53 | neale | wow man |
| 22:29.02 | neale | my mod player just started playing all my samples |
| 22:29.26 | neale | one at a time |
| 22:29.27 | neale | weird |
| 22:29.29 | STrRedWolf | Shall I killall it? I'm SSH'ed into it. |
| 22:29.47 | neale | if you like |
| 22:29.52 | neale | where'd it die? |
| 22:30.10 | STrRedWolf | I dropped down the server line to select ZaurusZone and it froze. |
| 22:30.42 | STrRedWolf | I killed it earlier, and tried it again, and it died again. Just happened. |
| 22:30.57 | neale | huh |
| 22:33.28 | neale | kergoth, did you find out what opie is doing to take over the button? |
| 22:36.45 | chouimat | FUCK!!!! |
| 22:36.56 | neale | okay, if you insist... |
| 22:37.05 | neale | what'd ya do? |
| 22:37.14 | chouimat | FUCK!!!! |
| 22:37.15 | chouimat | FUCK!!!! |
| 22:37.15 | chouimat | FUCK!!!! |
| 22:37.17 | chouimat | FUCK!!!! |
| 22:37.17 | chouimat | FUCK!!!! |
| 22:37.19 | chouimat | and |
| 22:37.20 | chouimat | FUCK!!!! |
| 22:37.22 | chouimat | :P |
| 22:37.33 | STrRedWolf | Ohkay. When and where? :) |
| 22:37.37 | neale | sounds like you're having a more interesting night than I am. |
| 22:37.46 | chouimat | opie don't build at all |
| 22:38.11 | KallDrexx | chouimat: a little mad? |
| 22:38.26 | neale | KallDrexx: that, or horny. |
| 22:38.34 | KallDrexx | lol |
| 22:38.38 | chouimat | KallDrexx: I just need to fuck soon |
| 22:38.47 | neale | ah, horny then, |
| 22:39.17 | chouimat | neale: horny? me not at all only 3 yrs since last time :P |
| 22:39.19 | KallDrexx | night |
| 22:39.27 | chouimat | night KallDrexx |
| 22:39.56 | kergoth`bored | chouimat: eh? |
| 22:40.14 | chouimat | kergoth`bored: opie build just crashed here |
| 22:40.19 | kergoth`bored | whats the error |
| 22:40.37 | chouimat | qpe/custon.h no such file .... |
| 22:40.46 | chouimat | qpe/custom.h no such file .... |
| 22:40.52 | kergoth`bored | eh? |
| 22:40.54 | kergoth`bored | cvs up |
| 22:40.57 | kergoth`bored | it creates that |
| 22:41.13 | kergoth`bored | cd build/opie; CVS_PASSFILE=`pwd`/../../.cvspass cvs up -Pd |
| 22:41.18 | chouimat | kergoth`bored: I just did SUBDIRS=package/opie mrproper |
| 22:41.28 | kergoth`bored | mine creates it just fine.. |
| 22:42.26 | kergoth`bored | hehe |
| 22:42.33 | kergoth`bored | okay mine's pulling from cvs now |
| 22:43.22 | neale | oh, wow, the API for grabbing hold of the power button is very clean. |
| 22:44.19 | kergoth`bored | the ioctl to the set the power button source? yeah |
| 22:44.36 | neale | I don't see where it gets to the apm driver, though. |
| 22:44.58 | kergoth`bored | ? |
| 22:45.15 | neale | I don't get where that ioctl happens in the kernel source yet |
| 22:45.25 | neale | don't worry about it, just mumbling aloud |
| 22:46.22 | kergoth`bored | ah |
| 22:46.24 | kergoth`bored | gotcha |
| 22:46.34 | kergoth`bored | find collie_apm.c's ioctl function |
| 22:46.50 | chouimat | hmmm that porto is very good |
| 22:46.50 | neale | yes, it appears to be ioctl 204 |
| 22:47.04 | kergoth`bored | chouimat: um |
| 22:47.08 | kergoth`bored | touch /usr/src/coding/projects/userspace/buildroot/build/opie/stamp-headers |
| 22:47.08 | kergoth`bored | ln -sf custom-sharp.h /usr/src/coding/projects/userspace/buildroot/build/opie/library/custom.h |
| 22:47.11 | kergoth`bored | make -C library |
| 22:47.18 | kergoth`bored | creates custom.h fine here.. |
| 22:47.19 | kergoth`bored | hmmm |
| 22:47.24 | kergoth`bored | err |
| 22:47.34 | kergoth`bored | ahh |
| 22:47.38 | kergoth`bored | found it |
| 22:47.41 | chouimat | yes? |
| 22:48.58 | kergoth`bored | er, no i didnt |
| 22:49.06 | kergoth`bored | cvs diff shows no differences on my Rules.make |
| 22:49.10 | kergoth`bored | but the one in my buildroot is different |
| 22:49.12 | kergoth`bored | hold on |
| 22:50.38 | neale | oh GOOD GRIEF there's MORE |
| 22:50.46 | kergoth`bored | haha |
| 22:50.49 | kergoth`bored | having fun yet? |
| 22:50.55 | neale | yeah, actually :) |
| 22:51.02 | neale | I think I've got something here. |
| 22:51.25 | neale | what channel is this? |
| 22:51.29 | chouimat | TQS |
| 22:51.32 | kergoth`bored | chouimat: eh? what explanation is necessary? hehe |
| 22:51.37 | neale | The Queef Station? |
| 22:51.51 | chouimat | kergoth`bored: she speak by experience |
| 22:51.56 | kergoth`bored | chouimat: i bet |
| 22:52.04 | chouimat | neale: Television Quatre Saison |
| 22:52.13 | neale | You must live in Canadia. |
| 22:52.15 | chouimat | kergoth`bored: quite nice |
| 22:52.21 | kergoth`bored | something weird is going on |
| 22:52.24 | chouimat | neale: Quebec |
| 22:52.39 | chouimat | kergoth`bored: the chick |
| 22:52.49 | neale | alors, tu parle le français. |
| 22:53.01 | kergoth`bored | hehe |
| 22:53.03 | chouimat | neale: non pouquoi |
| 22:53.47 | neale | ne t'inquiéte pas. Je ne le dirais à personne. |
| 22:54.07 | neale | inquiétes |
| 22:54.08 | chouimat | neale: bien sur |
| 22:54.21 | neale | crap, I haven't written french in too long. |
| 22:54.39 | neale | I had it right the first time, didn't I. |
| 22:54.56 | chouimat | fuck! the chick tell us that she get anal relation with her boyfriend |
| 22:58.04 | chouimat | neale: yes you get it right |
| 22:59.28 | kergoth`bored | hey hunger_ |
| 22:59.58 | chouimat | kergoth`bored: did you find the source of the problem? |
| 23:00.16 | kergoth`bored | chouimat: i wiped mine again, rebuilt, again, and it worked |
| 23:00.18 | kergoth`bored | chouimat: lol |
| 23:00.43 | chouimat | kergoth`bored: mrproper for everything? |
| 23:00.49 | kergoth`bored | chouimat: opie |
| 23:00.54 | kergoth`bored | make SUBDIRS=packages/opie mrproper |
| 23:01.15 | kergoth`bored | hey murph |
| 23:01.36 | murph | Hola. |
| 23:01.45 | kergoth | okay, so network problems |
| 23:01.46 | kergoth | give me details |
| 23:02.31 | murph | Yeah. The Win98 PC doesn't show any interface pointing at the Z, and ifconfig on the Z shows only loopback. |
| 23:02.54 | kergoth | ah, well if the interface doesnt even show up, not even the usb eject icon in the tray, you've got problems |
| 23:03.06 | kergoth | either 1) general usb problems, or 2) Z doesnt have th enecessary modules loadeed |
| 23:03.10 | kergoth | did this work in sharp? |
| 23:04.05 | murph | Yeah. It was difficult to tell because I switched to a new PC at the same time as I switched to OZ, but I just tried it on the old PC where the Sharp ROM was working, and same results. |
| 23:04.13 | kergoth | chouimat: note: my opie build is still going now, building datebook atm |
| 23:04.20 | kergoth | murph: lsmod on the Z |
| 23:04.35 | STrRedWolf | Anyone know why opie-showimg doesn't handle GIF files? |
| 23:04.37 | kergoth | murph: sa1100_bi, usbdmonitor, usbdcore, net_fd |
| 23:04.49 | neale | STrRedWolf: probably because of the LZW patent |
| 23:05.00 | murph | kergoth: Yeah, they're all there |
| 23:05.07 | neale | STrRedWolf: http://www.burnallgifs.org/ |
| 23:05.08 | kergoth | murph: then it should show up on the usb bus |
| 23:05.13 | STrRedWolf | I know that. |
| 23:05.31 | STrRedWolf | *grumbles* |
| 23:05.36 | murph | kergoth: Of the PC? |
| 23:05.44 | kergoth | murph: yep |
| 23:05.48 | kergoth | murph: i dont see any problems atm |
| 23:05.50 | neale | so install gif2png |
| 23:05.52 | kergoth | murph: should work flawless |
| 23:05.53 | STrRedWolf | The Sharp ROM aparently doesn't see it that way. |
| 23:06.03 | neale | sharp can pay a licensing fee |
| 23:06.14 | neale | I'm just pulling this out of my butt, by the way |
| 23:06.33 | kergoth | * -no-gif ............ Do not compile in GIF reading support. |
| 23:06.38 | neale | I don't know why it can't read gif, but the question you should be asking yourself is why you haven't converted them into pngs yet. |
| 23:06.39 | kergoth | gif support is disabled by default in qt |
| 23:06.58 | kergoth | and showimg just uses qt |
| 23:07.07 | STrRedWolf | Ugh. |
| 23:07.24 | STrRedWolf | Gotta port gif2png over to Zaurus... |
| 23:07.34 | STrRedWolf | Or ImageMagick. |
| 23:07.45 | murph | kergoth: Not exactly sure how to check the USB bus in Windows, but it recognized it fine when I connected the Z to install drivers. |
| 23:08.02 | kergoth | it did? |
| 23:08.06 | kergoth | check device manager |
| 23:08.13 | kergoth | and network |
| 23:08.17 | kergoth | fucking weird |
| 23:08.26 | kergoth | if it picked it up at that point, it should pick it up now |
| 23:08.59 | murph | kergoth: SL Series and TCP/IP for SL Series both exist in the Network panel. |
| 23:09.13 | kergoth | er |
| 23:09.18 | kergoth | then the interface -does- exist in windows |
| 23:09.32 | kergoth | and that interface has an ip? |
| 23:09.34 | kergoth | of 192.168.129.1? |
| 23:09.50 | murph | Yup. |
| 23:10.06 | kergoth | and ping's from windows to Z give what error? |
| 23:10.10 | murph | But should something show up when I do a winipcfg? |
| 23:10.18 | kergoth | when you select the usb interface, yes |
| 23:13.01 | murph | I'm not getting a listing for the USB under winipcfg |
| 23:13.33 | neale | uhh |
| 23:13.40 | neale | so that flashing green light? |
| 23:13.46 | neale | it's not in suspend mode when it does that |
| 23:13.54 | neale | I think it just means the display is turned off |
| 23:14.02 | neale | cause I just sshed in :) |
| 23:14.14 | kergoth | neale: hah |
| 23:14.54 | neale | damn. apmd does not unmask the power-on button. |
| 23:15.18 | kergoth | wtf |
| 23:15.20 | neale | it may be in the kernel. |
| 23:15.25 | kergoth | wouldnt surprise me |
| 23:15.29 | murph | WHat the...? |
| 23:15.34 | neale | if it unmasked it, that'd mean we could just mask it again. |
| 23:15.39 | neale | er |
| 23:15.44 | neale | s/mask/set/ |
| 23:15.48 | kergoth | well the thing is |
| 23:15.49 | kergoth | dood |
| 23:15.52 | kergoth | the power button mask |
| 23:15.58 | kergoth | is a collie specific interface |
| 23:16.02 | neale | yeah |
| 23:16.02 | kergoth | not a standard apm interfacd |
| 23:16.04 | kergoth | apmd wont touch it |
| 23:16.10 | neale | well I was hoping |
| 23:16.11 | kergoth | our apmd is unpatched, untouched |
| 23:16.13 | kergoth | yeah |
| 23:16.14 | kergoth | dont blame ya |
| 23:16.20 | murph | What the heck...Pinging 192.168.129.201 with 32 bytes of data: |
| 23:16.20 | murph | Reply from 216.234.106.65: Destination host unreachable. |
| 23:16.23 | neale | my next guess is that it's just because it's holid apm_bios open |
| 23:16.35 | neale | murph: ifup usbd0 on the z |
| 23:16.49 | neale | oh |
| 23:16.49 | kergoth | neale: thats what i was thinking.. but why would that affect it? its odd |
| 23:16.52 | neale | yeah |
| 23:16.59 | neale | kergoth: shitty driver |
| 23:17.17 | neale | they probably just never debugged that case, since they never ran into it |
| 23:17.29 | murph | How did it turn 192.168.129.201 into 216.234.106.65? |
| 23:17.37 | kergoth | murph: your eth interface is replying |
| 23:17.45 | kergoth | murph: the usb interface in windows isnt up |
| 23:18.08 | neale | well, that's all for tonight's round. |
| 23:18.15 | kergoth | hehe |
| 23:18.21 | neale | ta ta, all. |
| 23:18.24 | kergoth | we've got some ideas anyway |
| 23:18.25 | kergoth | night |
| 23:18.33 | neale | yeah, I'll find the bugger. |
| 23:18.40 | murph | Err... ok, I tried ifup usbd0, and got a few No such device lines |
| 23:18.48 | kergoth | murph: on the Z? |
| 23:18.48 | neale | at which point I will probably throw up my hands and say "I'm not touching that driver" |
| 23:18.53 | neale | ;) |
| 23:18.53 | kergoth | murph: do ifconfig -a |
| 23:18.57 | kergoth | murph: is the interface listed? |
| 23:19.21 | murph | kergoth: yeah, SIOCSIFADDR, SIOCSIFNETWORK, and SIOCGIFFLAGS |
| 23:19.22 | kergoth | neale: i said that .. which is why i wanted to redo everything from scratch in our 2.4.19 port |
| 23:19.26 | kergoth | neale: night |
| 23:19.31 | kergoth | murph: reboot your Z |
| 23:20.33 | murph | kergoth: Yeah, a fresh start sounds good. :) |
| 23:21.20 | murph | kergoth: Incidentally, when I did the ifconfig -a, I got lo and sit0 |
| 23:21.31 | kergoth | it wont be listed |
| 23:21.33 | kergoth | in ifconfig -a |
| 23:21.35 | kergoth | until you plug it into usb |
| 23:21.53 | murph | ok... rebooted. Let's try this again. |
| 23:22.02 | kergoth | k |
| 23:22.36 | murph | Good Lord. |
| 23:23.33 | murph | Ok, I swear that's not the first time I've rebooted... :p |
| 23:23.42 | murph | But we have pingage. |
| 23:24.07 | kergoth | lol |
| 23:24.12 | kergoth | okay, progress |
| 23:24.44 | murph | And it looks like Qtopia Desktop might even work... |
| 23:24.57 | kergoth | sometimes the Z usbd stack gets into a weird state |
| 23:25.08 | kergoth | the driver shows a usage of (deleted) |
| 23:25.11 | kergoth | only reboot clears it |
| 23:25.55 | kergoth | chouimat: any luck with your opie build? mine's still going |
| 23:26.02 | murph | Well hallelujiah. It appears to be working. |
| 23:26.07 | kergoth | murph: nice |
| 23:26.22 | murph | Thanks a bundle kergoth. :) My next project... bluetooth. |
| 23:27.31 | chouimat | hmmm any a floor planing app |
| 23:27.38 | kergoth | murph: np, let me know how that goes |
| 23:27.38 | bbeattie | Anyone know of a sample application that is as basic as it comes but has make scripts to build either native, or cross, and build an ipkg? |
| 23:27.41 | chouimat | hmmm I need a floor planing app |
| 23:28.11 | kergoth | bbeattie: well, ipkg-build gives you ipk creation, and tmake or qmake can do the native/cross. so can automake or autoconf or qmake or any number of others |
| 23:28.29 | kergoth | hey killefiz_ |
| 23:28.30 | chouimat|Zzzz | night |
| 23:28.33 | kergoth | night chouimat|Zzzz |
| 23:29.12 | bbeattie | kergoth: alright, I was looking at using reversi as a base since it had a make.sh script to handle for each, but you're saying that maybe I should just get a simple app, get it working with regular QT, and it should port down easily? |
| 23:29.17 | chouimat|Zzzz | kergoth: know any app that can solve my problem? I need to move my furniture in my office to gain space |
| 23:29.35 | kergoth | chouimat|Zzzz: hmm, not offhand |
| 23:29.48 | kergoth | bbeattie: pretty much, yeah |
| 23:30.07 | chouimat|Zzzz | hey! a floor planer for the zaurus that will rock :) |
| 23:30.31 | kergoth | hehe |
| 23:31.06 | chouimat|Zzzz | kergoth: any way it's 1h32 am I will move them tomorrow |
| 23:32.15 | bbeattie | kergoth: do you know of a sample QT application to start with? |
| 23:32.31 | bbeattie | kergoth: Just the basics. a menu, and ability to draw lines and text is all I need. |
| 23:46.10 | chouimat|Zzzz | kergoth: error in irda.cpp now |
| 23:52.37 | kergoth | chouimat|Zzzz: email me the error |
