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04:16.03 | kerio | DocScrutinizer05: we can just "update" the stock mediaplayer in our repo |
04:16.11 | kerio | don't we have permission to redistribute (c)Nokia packages? |
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06:32.56 | DocScrutinizer05 | yes, we have |
06:33.17 | DocScrutinizer05 | we don't have control over the nokia repos though, afaik |
06:34.12 | DocScrutinizer05 | we probably could repackage and ship via CSSU repo the stock player |
06:34.51 | DocScrutinizer05 | but just for handling the dependencies that feels like overkill. Maybe because I had no coffee yet |
06:40.38 | kerio | DocScrutinizer05: "just for handling the dependencies" |
06:40.45 | kerio | which is about 100% of what repo maintainership is about |
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07:45.51 | kerio | DocScrutinizer05: another good thing to do would be to rerelease packages with fixed dependencies |
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08:05.21 | Pali | TADA: It looks like we know what causing PA problems on some n900 devices |
08:05.47 | Pali | patch which adding nokia PA compatilbity with normal PA. |
08:06.29 | Pali | cssu testers, look: http://talk.maemo.org/showthread.php?p=1362206#post1362206 |
08:06.33 | kerio | :o |
08:07.15 | Pali | now need to understand why it is problem only on some n900 devices |
08:07.36 | Pali | and need to find another solution for compatibility with upstream non-nokia-hacked PA |
08:07.56 | kerio | Pali: this reminds me |
08:08.19 | kerio | often, when i plug the charger in, i get the message regarding the current not being sufficient to charge |
08:08.32 | kerio | but it actually is |
08:08.40 | Pali | kerio: update hald-addon-bme to last version |
08:08.40 | kerio | and the charge goes normally |
08:08.45 | Pali | and update also battery plugin |
08:08.46 | kerio | k |
08:08.54 | kerio | not now tho, i'm on the bus |
08:08.57 | Pali | I pushed more patches to both |
08:09.01 | kerio | with no recent backups |
08:09.03 | kerio | yay |
08:09.06 | kerio | i liek patches |
08:09.18 | Pali | battery applet is in cssu-devel |
08:09.26 | kerio | it's just an ui issue, yes? |
08:09.32 | Pali | no only |
08:09.40 | Pali | also in hald-addon-bme was some problems |
08:09.40 | kerio | oh, k |
08:10.54 | kerio | alright |
08:11.00 | Pali | because bq27200 chip do not report battery charging immediately, I added small hack to force hald-addon-bme to report battery charging for 10s after charger cable is attached |
08:11.35 | Pali | 10s should be enought time to report if charger is can really charge battery or not |
08:11.44 | kerio | Pali: do you reckon that it's possible to add a gconf key to force a certain value for the battery capacity? |
08:12.16 | Pali | there are no gconf keys for hald-addon-bme yet... |
08:12.29 | kerio | oh, is it just the battery applet? |
08:12.57 | kerio | it would still work |
08:12.58 | Pali | yes, only battery applet has gconf key for using design capacity or not |
08:13.04 | Pali | nothing more |
08:13.14 | kerio | something like "override_battery_capacity" |
08:13.43 | kerio | an int, when present and different from -1 should override other sources of battery capacity |
08:13.52 | kerio | in mAh, i suppose |
08:14.20 | kerio | DocScrutinizer05: why do we measure battery capacity in mAh and not in coulombs? |
08:49.21 | DocScrutinizer05 | because nobody knows how to spell Coulomb |
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12:51.50 | kerio | lol |
12:52.42 | kerio | i mean, 1 C = 0.2(7)mAh |
12:52.50 | kerio | so you'd just have to divide things by 3 |
12:52.52 | kerio | pretty much |
12:53.12 | kerio | by 3.6, in fact |
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15:31.23 | DocScrutinizer05 | if you consider better units, then use Joule alias Ws |
15:32.20 | DocScrutinizer05 | since THAT owuld really be an improvement over that basically fundamentally flawed resp meaningless mAh that don't consider the VOLTAGE which will change during discharge |
15:32.34 | DocScrutinizer05 | s/ow(wo/ |
15:32.39 | DocScrutinizer05 | meh |
15:34.34 | DocScrutinizer05 | btw 1C=1As |
15:35.11 | DocScrutinizer05 | =1000mAs = 1000/3600mAh |
15:36.02 | DocScrutinizer05 | not even Physicians use Coulomb |
15:38.18 | DocScrutinizer05 | btw if you wonder: the unit of that 3600 above is h/s |
15:38.43 | DocScrutinizer05 | err s/h |
15:39.44 | DocScrutinizer05 | = 60m/h * 60s/m |
16:05.42 | sixwheeledbeast | So the key is breaking up as much of the mammoth metapackage as possible. How easy is this to implement? |
16:05.51 | sixwheeledbeast | As for units of energy.... |
16:09.23 | sixwheeledbeast | joules are generally not used and coulombs are a larger number, Ah was invented as a lazy shorthand. |
16:09.55 | sixwheeledbeast | not used for batteries as a unit of measure anyway |
16:12.30 | sixwheeledbeast | 1A over 60 seconds is 60 coulombs, therefore in an hour 3600 coulombs have been used. |
16:21.04 | sixwheeledbeast | Joules or watt-seconds would be the accurate measure I agree, but it seems mAs/mAh/Ah are deemed accurate enough for us and easier to caluculate. |
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16:54.12 | DocScrutinizer05 | (MP) pretty easy |
16:55.59 | DocScrutinizer05 | (easier to..) measure. bq27200 though has also Ws iirc |
16:59.23 | DocScrutinizer05 | for system energy consumption (aka power) it's a simple conversion from A to W, since voltage is stabilized and known. The whole point is with battery, where you convert to those stabilized system voltages via a step-converter (not an LDO). Such step converter qould e.g eat 350mA@4.2V battery, or 420mA@3.5V, for feeding the identical system load |
17:00.56 | DocScrutinizer05 | so obviously mAh is a bit nonsensical in that case. mWh though was way nicer since the mW figure is constant for 350*4.2 and 420*3.5 |
17:03.52 | DocScrutinizer05 | 0x23 - 0x22: 3021 SAE Available Energy High - Low Byte (from bq27k-detail2) |
17:10.58 | sixwheeledbeast | IC. So is there a plan to take a pickaxe to mp soon? |
17:12.19 | DocScrutinizer05 | I always push that but for unclear (to me) reasons the chief maintainers are reluctant |
17:13.35 | DocScrutinizer05 | sure, as soon as you nuke MP completely, you need to make sure *all* your inter-package dependencies are comprehensive, complete and correct |
17:14.13 | DocScrutinizer05 | and it seems most devels are lazy to take care about that detail of their package |
17:16.02 | DocScrutinizer05 | and THAT part is not as easy, for the distro maintainers. Particularly when it's needed for dozens or hundreds of packages |
17:24.01 | sixwheeledbeast | I suppose it's a minefield of a job, but when done would provide huge flexibility. We need to look at this method of replacing these pkgs for FOSS alternatives. They have benefits and will be welcomed by the community. Having stock and FOSS-alt side-by-side is a pointless waste, other than for testing purposes. |
17:49.31 | kerio | DocScrutinizer05: why don't we use mWhs then? |
17:50.49 | DocScrutinizer05 | side by side? you mean concurrently installed? nah, that's actually pointless |
17:52.49 | kerio | why don't we just make nicocam lighter so it doesn't have to be preloaded? |
17:53.29 | sixwheeledbeast | "side by side" as in both stock and FOSS-alt installed at same time. Like we have now for OMP etc... |
17:56.55 | DocScrutinizer05 | yes, that's an alternative for some apps, while it's a nogo for others |
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22:47.14 | kerio | oh that fucking pali |
22:47.31 | kerio | now my battery applet can't report the correct full battery capacity |
22:48.18 | kerio | i don't fucking even |
22:48.22 | Raimu | kerio: What why not? |
22:48.27 | kerio | and extras-devel doesn't even have old package versions |
22:48.38 | kerio | Raimu: because If using bme replacement do not watch for bq27x00_battery and rx51_battery drivers, but always use data from replacement hald-addon-bme |
22:48.46 | kerio | and guess what |
22:48.51 | kerio | hald-addon-bme doesn't trust bq27k |
22:48.56 | kerio | for some dumb pali reason |
22:49.13 | kerio | battery.reporting.last_full = 1257 |
22:49.14 | kerio | battery.reporting.current = 1404 |
22:49.16 | Raimu | I am a little miffed by bmerep so far |
22:49.21 | kerio | DON'T YOU THINK THERE'S SOMETHING WRONG WITH THIS PICTURE |
22:49.30 | kerio | i don't fucking even |
22:49.47 | kerio | oh don't get me wrong, it's still good |
22:49.49 | Raimu | I get hilarious numbers like 1480 out of 1309 too. |
22:49.53 | kerio | but it's shit like this |
22:50.08 | kerio | where pali just outright refuses to acknowledge that his initial reasoning was dead wrong |
22:50.16 | kerio | because the battery design measured via resistor is simply useless |
22:51.14 | Raimu | And that 1480 out of 1309 of course is 100% on the battery widget |
22:51.46 | Raimu | It only starts to go below "100" after the count drops from over that 1309 |
22:51.51 | kerio | yeah |
22:52.09 | kerio | i feel that pali still hasn't understood that shit like that can come straight from bq27k |
22:52.19 | kerio | so when it's not reporting CI, you should blindly follow it |
22:52.33 | kerio | because it's probably a lot more accurate than anything you'll calculate on your own |
22:52.36 | kerio | including the percentage |
22:52.55 | kerio | Raimu: initial versions had silly stuff like 139% of battery |
22:53.52 | Raimu | I thought the data I received from bq27k via those neat scripts was bloody good too. |
22:54.17 | kerio | yeah but it would confuse users if bq27k isn't calibrated |
22:54.28 | Raimu | Maybe |
22:54.43 | kerio | NO |
22:54.47 | kerio | it won't |
22:54.57 | kerio | because you just say "bq27k isn't calibrated, click here for more info" |
22:55.20 | Raimu | I would totally use a batstatuswidget that relied upon bq27k for everything |
22:55.40 | kerio | +1 |
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22:58.01 | Raimu | Gnight now |
23:12.10 | DocScrutinizer05 | *sigh* |
23:13.07 | DocScrutinizer05 | while you could tolerate such stuff on strictly devel beta bme-replacement, it's kinda extremely scary for e.g PA |
23:13.32 | DocScrutinizer05 | since with CSSU you don't have a choice. Unlike with bmerep |
23:14.38 | DocScrutinizer05 | the results on a project from an extreme lack of manpower |
23:15.23 | DocScrutinizer05 | you hardly ever get any peer review, and eventually everything makes it into the main branch |
23:16.11 | DocScrutinizer05 | often a "one step ahead, two back" game |
23:17.01 | DocScrutinizer05 | interestingly enough an abundance of developers can have same effect |
23:17.27 | DocScrutinizer05 | see e.g. KDE4 |
23:18.49 | DocScrutinizer05 | and then there's the poettering effect. Yet to investigate |
23:19.56 | DocScrutinizer05 | something along "one stubborn moron fucks it up for everybody, despite hundreds of sound rationales why this is a BAD THING[tm]" |
23:22.37 | DocScrutinizer05 | but "HEY ITS for *FREEEEE*, you get this ABSOLUTELY FOR FREEEEEE!!1!11!!!" |
23:25.28 | DocScrutinizer05 | http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_detailpage&v=ZTdUmlGxVo0&t=3296 |
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23:30.22 | DocScrutinizer05 | I wonder if they will tell me same when they assrape me |
23:31.28 | DocScrutinizer05 | NO MrMORON, I need to invest my valuable free time to get rid of it |
23:32.47 | DocScrutinizer05 | probably a Balmer/Poettering doublefeature can't be beaten |
23:33.40 | DocScrutinizer05 | "It's FREEEEE!" "...developer developers developers... "FREEEEEE" developers deveopler deve...REEEE |
23:34.14 | drathir | sorry for little join/outs but im setting up sasl... |
23:34.19 | DocScrutinizer05 | hm, hidden at my side |
23:34.21 | DocScrutinizer05 | ;-P |
23:40.30 | RST38h | Free developers for the product you sell? =) This sound like Ouya |
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23:45.51 | DocScrutinizer05 | RST38h: you don't know Balmer developers monkey dance? |
23:46.26 | RST38h | Doc: Oh that |
23:46.40 | DocScrutinizer05 | http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KMU0tzLwhbE |
23:46.54 | DocScrutinizer05 | add in this: http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_detailpage&v=ZTdUmlGxVo0&t=3296 |
23:47.03 | DocScrutinizer05 | both on one stage! golden! |
23:47.04 | RST38h | Doc: When are they finally going to kick that uncle Fester out? |
23:47.28 | RST38h | Doc: What is that poettering doing with the bottle? |
23:52.54 | DocScrutinizer05 | guess! he's ... poettering (SCNR) |
23:53.18 | RST38h | Has he destroyed anything important lately? |
23:53.45 | DocScrutinizer05 | err, systemd resp /usr resp udev been latest I heard of |
23:53.50 | RST38h | Or is he busy standing at the stern of the GnomeOS, as it meets its iceberg? |
23:54.07 | RST38h | systemd is old news |
23:54.13 | DocScrutinizer05 | yep |
23:54.35 | DocScrutinizer05 | meybe he finally found a chick |
23:54.44 | DocScrutinizer05 | may* |
23:56.16 | DocScrutinizer05 | or whatever his preferences |
23:56.46 | RST38h | which returns us to that bottle on video... |
23:56.51 | DocScrutinizer05 | hehe |
23:57.12 | RST38h | probably a toadstool balzam of some sort... |