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| 00:09.25 | Jucato | that tickles! :) |
| 00:09.37 | smileaf | =) |
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| 00:21.35 | oneforall | err still blanks out :( |
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| 00:23.24 | bomber | i installed xfce4 and now i cant get startkde to fire up |
| 00:23.30 | bomber | can someone help |
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| 00:42.56 | oneforall | 1darn any other suggestion to have this stop blanking out ? |
| 00:43.17 | Jucato | what blanking out |
| 00:43.57 | Shadow_mil | why does .bash_profile not get run when I open konsole? |
| 00:44.34 | Shadow_mil | or for that fact, any other GUI consoles |
| 00:45.13 | Shadow_mil | nvm |
| 00:45.17 | oneforall | my monitor |
| 00:45.20 | Shadow_mil | .bashrc is getting ran |
| 00:45.27 | Shadow_mil | simple fix :P |
| 00:45.58 | Jucato | it's the difference between .bashrc and .bash_profile I think |
| 00:46.12 | Jucato | by defalt .bash_profile source .bashrc afaik |
| 00:46.22 | Jucato | oneforall: check your power saving settings for Display |
| 00:46.36 | Jucato | KControl -> Peripherals -> Display -> Power saving tab |
| 00:46.48 | oneforall | no screen saver is on, Perifial>Display is unchecked for the ower. I tried checking it and disabling all but that fails too |
| 00:47.14 | Jucato | no idea anymore |
| 00:47.50 | oneforall | gettign sick of it blanking when I don't want it to |
| 00:48.34 | trpr | oneforall: xset q ... dpms and screensaver are off? |
| 00:49.04 | trpr | i don't know why it would fail setting it from the gui |
| 00:49.12 | Sho_ | I think the KCM controlling DPMS blanking has been broken for as long as I've been using KDE :) |
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| 00:50.15 | oneforall | dpms? that Peripherals -> Display -> Power saving tab ? |
| 00:50.39 | Jucato | moin Sho_ :) |
| 00:51.03 | Sho_ | yo Jucato (Yocato?) |
| 00:51.13 | Jucato | hahah :) |
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| 00:52.22 | Sho_ | oneforall: "xset -dpms && xset s noblank" should disable the blanking; you could put that into a script and the script into your autostart |
| 00:52.23 | oneforall | noe DPMS line in my xorg.conf either |
| 00:53.00 | Sho_ | or rather "xset -dpms && xset s off" |
| 00:53.58 | Jucato | hm... breaKfast |
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| 00:54.42 | Jucato | sweet dreams Sho_ :) |
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| 01:04.52 | thechef | Is it possible to have virtual workspaces not only for windows, but also for desktop icons? |
| 01:05.25 | thechef | switch it the same way, both synchronous and asynchrous |
| 01:05.31 | thechef | with the window switcher |
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| 01:08.30 | Mathman | thechef: not that I know of |
| 01:08.55 | Mathman | at least not without some hacking I figure |
| 01:09.06 | thechef | Or any other idea to solve the problem: direct access to the latest used files/software |
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| 01:09.44 | thechef | and having a free desktop at the same time where files can be placed |
| 01:09.47 | Mathman | well the menu has a most used apps thing. I'm not sure about recent documents |
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| 01:10.05 | thechef | no, any files not just documents |
| 01:10.25 | thechef | and it must be easy to add files there |
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| 01:10.45 | thechef | Whatever the desktop already is for |
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| 01:13.27 | Sho_ | thechef: It'd be a fairly simple modification to the kdesktop source code, fwiw |
| 01:14.02 | thechef | I guess so |
| 01:14.10 | Sho_ | (listing a different file system location per virtual desktop, that is) |
| 01:14.23 | thechef | noo |
| 01:14.28 | thechef | what about the same location |
| 01:14.49 | thechef | an enlargement of the space |
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| 01:15.18 | thechef | like X does with VirtualSize |
| 01:15.23 | Sho_ | I'm not following you, sorry |
| 01:15.37 | Sho_ | Originall you wanted different desktop icons per virtual desktop |
| 01:15.48 | Sho_ | If you want to do that, you're looking at making KDIconView::desktopURL() VD-aware |
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| 01:16.10 | Sho_ | (in kdebase/kdesktop/kdiconview.cc) |
| 01:16.13 | thechef | I actually need free space on the desktop |
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| 01:18.22 | thechef | ? |
| 01:18.35 | Sho_ | thechef: Well, if you spice up KDIconView::desktopURL() a bit you could also have a facility to change the file system location that kdesktop is listing seperately from the virtual desktop system |
| 01:18.58 | Sho_ | thechef: And then flip through them via keyboard shortcuts or somesuch |
| 01:19.36 | thechef | I only want files on ~/Desktop nowhere else |
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| 01:20.08 | Jucato | wait for plasma? :) |
| 01:20.15 | thechef | hehe |
| 01:20.49 | thechef | What does plasma do? |
| 01:20.55 | CPrgmSwR2 | I wish the plasma menu raptor would hurry up |
| 01:21.00 | CPrgmSwR2 | thechef: its part of kde4 |
| 01:21.09 | CPrgmSwR2 | its like gadgets of mac |
| 01:21.15 | oneforall | kewl thanks Sho_ looks like that got it to stop blanking |
| 01:21.20 | Jucato | but a bit more than that |
| 01:21.25 | CPrgmSwR2 | true |
| 01:21.31 | Jucato | it's basically a rethinking of the desktop metaphor |
| 01:21.40 | CPrgmSwR2 | kde4 is really awsome |
| 01:21.57 | CPrgmSwR2 | just can't wait until it resolves its many bugs |
| 01:22.02 | Sho_ | thechef: Plasma is the KDE 4 replacement for the kdesktop and kicker applications in KDE 3 |
| 01:22.11 | Jucato | I'm not sure how virtual desktops will be implemented yet though. but basically with plasma, you can zoom in/out, a bit like virtualsize |
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| 01:22.46 | Sho_ | thechef: One of the concept it introduces is grouping of objects living on the desktop space, and zooming out and switching between groups |
| 01:22.54 | Sho_ | thechef: Which sounds like it would solve your problem |
| 01:22.54 | CPrgmSwR2 | Jucato: not to worry, all the user needs to do is install kde4 and the world opens up |
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| 01:24.53 | thechef | is it like: zoom out -> overview, choose group/part of the "virtual" desktop -> zoom in? |
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| 01:26.34 | thechef | where the zoomed state is the one for normal desktop item interactions?! then it's right what i need |
| 01:26.40 | Sho_ | Well, Plasma is a fairly obvious evolution of the old kdesktop and kicker applications. Both kdesktop and kicker started out with a fairly limited, fixed set of functionality, that soon had to face user demand for more complex objects living on their UI real estate and thus were fitted with extensibility models, namely Kicker applets and SuperKaramba. Both of those extensibility models were fairly poorly implemented - SuperKaramba suffers from integration problems, and |
| 01:26.45 | Sho_ | Kicker applets from the lack of seperation between data providers and visualizations for data - and as it turned out there's no good reason for that duplication anyway, so Plasma is a clean reimplementation of the desktop and panels with a single, unified extensibility model. |
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| 01:27.24 | Sho_ | In the end it's the usual cycle of the old stuff outgrowing its original design and a clean reimplementation empowered by hindsight |
| 01:27.55 | Sho_ | At some point Plasma will share the same fate ;) |
| 01:28.14 | CPrgmSwR2 | how long has kicker been with kde |
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| 01:28.23 | Jucato | all of KDE 3? |
| 01:28.37 | Sho_ | KDE 2, too |
| 01:28.41 | Jucato | it was called kpanel previously right? |
| 01:28.43 | Jucato | oooh |
| 01:28.46 | Jucato | 2 lifecycles... |
| 01:28.48 | Jucato | not bad :) |
| 01:29.00 | Sho_ | Kicker was first introduced back in '99 iirc |
| 01:29.02 | CPrgmSwR2 | so plasma will be here for a while |
| 01:29.08 | Sho_ | thechef: And yeah, that's about right |
| 01:29.10 | Jucato | well... who knows :) |
| 01:29.15 | Jucato | we don't have a KrystalBall |
| 01:29.40 | Jucato | let's just hope that it will remain useful and relevant while it exists :) |
| 01:29.41 | Sho_ | CPrgmSwR2: Yeah probably :) But then so will KDE, so at some point the cycle will probably start again |
| 01:29.45 | nicio | what can i do to get back my display?i have 680x480 insted of 1024x780.i went in display to change it but the limit was 680x480.how could i put it back? |
| 01:29.48 | CPrgmSwR2 | hard to imagine what will replace plasma at this point |
| 01:30.40 | CPrgmSwR2 | the main point is kde is growing up |
| 01:30.52 | Sho_ | It's very easy to observe in the Linux kernel: Somebody proposes and implements a design for a certain component, and everybody is happy. As the years go by, new demands are placed on that component, and it's patched up to meet them. At some point, it starts to be an ugly mess, if a working one, and someone rebellious comes up with a new, cleaner design empowered by hindsight. And it starts again. |
| 01:30.52 | Jucato | as it should. yay almost 11 years old :) |
| 01:31.17 | nicio | what can i do to get back my display?i have 680x480 insted of 1024x780.i went in display to change it but the limit was 680x480.how could i put it back? Jucato :( |
| 01:31.23 | Jucato | thesis -> antithesis -> synthesis... |
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| 01:31.40 | Jucato | nicio: hm.. don't know. ask in #kubuntu? |
| 01:31.45 | Jucato | er #kubuntu ? |
| 01:31.55 | nicio | ban |
| 01:32.25 | Jucato | oh can't help with that. |
| 01:32.39 | Jucato | you can try asking until when in #ubuntu-ops |
| 01:32.46 | CPrgmSwR2 | its amazing to me the changes that kde4 will bring |
| 01:33.27 | CPrgmSwR2 | Its like a teenager going through a growth sprout |
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| 02:54.35 | elenril | hi |
| 02:54.55 | elenril | how do i assign a protocol (irc) to application (xchat)? |
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| 03:04.07 | Klaus_Dieter | hello world |
| 03:04.24 | tvtoon | HA! |
| 03:04.25 | Klaus_Dieter | I am just wondering - is there any way to trigger a custom command, when a new message arrives in kopete? |
| 03:04.57 | Klaus_Dieter | I want to turn on the IM-LED on my mouse when I receive an IM message |
| 03:05.20 | Klaus_Dieter | and I have a program to just do this - but do not know of a way to trigger it |
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| 03:05.38 | Jucato | Klaus_Dieter: Settings -> Configure Notifications in Kopete |
| 03:05.47 | Jucato | there's a column there for running scripts |
| 03:06.06 | Jucato | or Execute a program |
| 03:06.18 | Klaus_Dieter | Jucato: I am in theconfigure dialog of kpete |
| 03:06.21 | Jucato | (the one with a gear icon column header) |
| 03:06.26 | Klaus_Dieter | I see behavior and there the tab events |
| 03:06.30 | Jucato | Configure Notifcations, not plain Configure |
| 03:06.39 | Klaus_Dieter | ah lol |
| 03:06.40 | Klaus_Dieter | found it |
| 03:06.41 | Klaus_Dieter | thank you |
| 03:07.47 | Klaus_Dieter | so what about the "all messages have been read event" |
| 03:07.52 | Klaus_Dieter | is there something like this? |
| 03:08.12 | Klaus_Dieter | after all - I want to turn off that led when I ahve seen all messages |
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| 03:10.02 | elenril | is kwin + transparent windows + mplayer + xv + Intel GMA = X11 error: BadAlloc a known bug? |
| 03:10.37 | xp_killer | i need help installin driver for my graph card.im folowing this right now at feisty section https://help.ubuntu.com/community/BinaryDriverHowto/ATI the part where i have to put the version of the driver they told me file or folder does not existe |
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| 03:19.38 | ganymede | xp_killer: #ubuntu perhaps |
| 03:20.50 | ganymede | Klaus_Dieter: it's an open-source program. the taskbar entry stops flashing when you've read the messages so there must be a trigger for it somewhere |
| 03:21.07 | ganymede | Klaus_Dieter: and the feature you are requesting sounds very useful |
| 03:21.14 | ganymede | Klaus_Dieter: is it already implemented in windows? |
| 03:21.42 | Klaus_Dieter | I have no clue about windows I am not using it |
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| 03:22.15 | Klaus_Dieter | I have made up a workaround though. I set the event of sending a message to turn off that led |
| 03:22.26 | Klaus_Dieter | because when I send something I have seen all incoming messages |
| 03:22.30 | Klaus_Dieter | so taht works |
| 03:22.47 | Klaus_Dieter | different question though: is it possible to turn of sounds only when I'm in away status? |
| 03:22.54 | Klaus_Dieter | so I want all notifications but sounds |
| 03:23.13 | Klaus_Dieter | I have found "enable events while away" but that includes sounds |
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| 04:11.17 | what_if | I'm wondering why Konqueror has problems with my FTP server when no other program does... is there a fix for this ? |
| 04:11.26 | what_if | says "Cannot access folder ." |
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| 04:19.01 | marx2k | How do i set KDM as my default display manager? |
| 04:20.50 | what_if | marx2k: what distro ? |
| 04:20.58 | marx2k | Ubuntu Fiesty |
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| 04:22.10 | what_if | sudo dpkg-reconfigure kdm |
| 04:22.21 | marx2k | ah! |
| 04:22.33 | level1 | hi, I have a problem with my keyboard shortcuts |
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| 04:22.38 | what_if | marx2k: asks you to choose from gdm/kdm/(xdm?) |
| 04:22.48 | marx2k | yep |
| 04:22.53 | what_if | level1: hi! |
| 04:22.59 | what_if | whats the prob ? |
| 04:23.00 | level1 | basically, XF86Media is currently opening amarok, but I want it to show the kopete window |
| 04:23.10 | marx2k | Thats the info I needed :) thanks! Brb |
| 04:23.20 | level1 | but I can't figure out where XF86Media is bound to amarok so I can unbind it |
| 04:23.30 | level1 | I looked in amarok's configs and in the kmenu editor |
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| 04:25.05 | what_if | not familiar with either software , use kopete though :) |
| 04:25.06 | marx2k | Ah MUCH better :) |
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| 04:26.58 | level1 | I wish kde provided a utility that could tell you where you keyevents went |
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| 04:32.22 | Klaus_Dieter | level1: I use xbindkeys and no other key-event-manager |
| 04:32.33 | Klaus_Dieter | but then again I also use mainly xfce and not kde :) |
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| 04:33.26 | level1 | hmmm... |
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| 04:41.39 | johnny69 | I live |
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| 04:59.06 | TVSET | is it possible to make quanta store its files somewhere in my home directory and not in the project directory? |
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| 05:01.00 | Jucato | troy: it's called Ubuntu Developers Summit btw :) |
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| 05:34.34 | Kubuntero | AmyRose: hi It's daSkreech |
| 05:34.44 | Jucato | so that's who you are! |
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| 05:34.54 | Kubuntero | Yeah |
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| 05:35.33 | Kubuntero | Sorry trying to fix something and wanted to be low key for a bit |
| 05:35.54 | Jucato | forgot to append ;) there. sorry :) |
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| 05:36.04 | Kubuntero | Anyway I saw http://xr-s.com/sxf/ today and said Woah Amyrose has to see this :) |
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| 05:37.12 | Kubuntero | Jucato: You didn't see the loads of questions I was asking about Games? :) |
| 05:37.31 | Jucato | in #k? |
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| 05:37.45 | Kubuntero | k-buntu |
| 05:37.55 | Jucato | yeah. I was about to ask you to take it to OT |
| 05:38.02 | Jucato | but I was busy being busy |
| 05:38.17 | Jucato | now I'm busy being gone. bbl :P |
| 05:38.53 | AmyRose | Jucato: I am getting nothing in OO.o's channel |
| 05:38.58 | Kubuntero | gonna help crane then I'm gone |
| 05:39.10 | Kubuntero | AmyRose: the user or the dev chan? |
| 05:39.26 | AmyRose | #openoffice.org |
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| 05:40.17 | Kubuntero | Ah right. |
| 05:40.34 | Kubuntero | I think they put that back to being the user channel |
| 05:40.49 | Kubuntero | good luck getting help |
| 05:41.14 | Kubuntero | Dev chan is far chattier but they refuse to help anyone unless it's something they are working in |
| 05:41.15 | Kubuntero | on |
| 05:41.38 | Kubuntero | AmyRose: Sorry for the nickkonfusion |
| 05:41.46 | Kubuntero | I'll catch you later |
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| 06:16.35 | what_if | anyone know of any konqueror/ftp compatibility problems? Its the only program that will not work with my FTP server (vsftp) |
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| 06:48.04 | burner | how do i edit the ~/.kde/share/config/kwinrulesrc, and make it permanent? |
| 06:48.13 | burner | it keeps changing back everytime i change it |
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| 06:54.22 | burner | nevermind |
| 06:54.24 | burner | :) |
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| 07:07.07 | LatinHacker | does anyone knows how to make Linux Fedora 7 recognize a second hard drive? |
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| 07:10.29 | LatinHacker | Jucato, it tells me that I need to be identified to join #fedora, what does that mean? |
| 07:10.58 | Jucato | LatinHacker: you need to register your nickname. they have a link on how to do that in the channel topic |
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| 07:12.32 | criswell_ | f kde >_< |
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| 07:20.44 | ninjak | hello. I have a little problem. I would like to use Run command window (that it's opened by pressing Alt+F2) to do some math calc. but under Mepis KDE seems to use only integer number (if I try 5/2 I get 2 and not 2,5) |
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| 07:21.16 | ninjak | what I have to change to obtain the right results, please? |
| 07:21.44 | ninjak | I apologyze for my bad english :-) |
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| 07:22.10 | Daverocks | ninjak: look in "configure kcalc" |
| 07:22.26 | Daverocks | ninjak: there's a setting about decimal precision there |
| 07:22.35 | ninjak | umh... I'm going to check... thanks |
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| 07:23.03 | Daverocks | ninjak: it's under the "settings" menu of kcalc, by the way |
| 07:24.07 | ninjak | I tried but it doesn't work |
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| 07:24.30 | ninjak | the configuration works for KCalc but not for the Run command window... |
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| 07:25.44 | ninjak | I know that my question is strange :-) but I have to write an article with some tricks and the use of Run command is one of this tricks :-) |
| 07:27.41 | Jucato | that has puzzled me too. previous versions of Kubuntu, I couldn't get floating point math to work in the mini-cli. but now I can |
| 07:29.07 | ninjak | ok Jucato :-) perhaps I will have to write that sometimes this trick doesn't work well :-) |
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| 07:31.03 | logixoul | hi; what's the config incantation to make konq again ask me where to put that new bookmark? |
| 07:31.27 | Jucato | Settings -> Configure Konqueror -> Web Browsing |
| 07:31.38 | Jucato | first or second checkbox at the top |
| 07:31.49 | logixoul | LOL |
| 07:31.52 | logixoul | thanks :) |
| 07:31.55 | Jucato | ;) |
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| 08:19.47 | logixoul | FUCK FUCK FUCK stupid firefox reloads the whole page on ctrl+r instead of opening a SearchReplace dialog and now I lost all frickin changes to the text |
| 08:19.52 | logixoul | god I hate firefox |
| 08:20.29 | Jucato | :/ |
| 08:20.54 | erphan | Opera is best :P |
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| 08:22.07 | om_ | firefox is awsome |
| 08:22.14 | om_ | opera doesnt even open youtube videos lol |
| 08:22.19 | om_ | poor in plugins |
| 08:22.36 | om_ | i have nerver had a problem with firefox |
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| 08:31.32 | Xemanth^ | henriquev: how do you access irc from Konqi ? :D |
| 08:31.47 | logixoul | good question :) |
| 08:32.11 | Xemanth^ | so you're not fan of Dolphin? :P |
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| 08:32.28 | Jucato | hm... we were talking about Konqi the browser... |
| 08:32.37 | henriquev | YES |
| 08:32.40 | henriquev | i WAS JUST KIDDING :p |
| 08:32.50 | henriquev | Xemanth^: I'm not ;P |
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| 08:33.02 | logixoul | heh... I thought you were using some java/ajax thing for irc |
| 08:33.04 | Jucato | irc:// links should technically open up/start an IRC client |
| 08:33.29 | Xemanth^ | henriquev: heh |
| 08:34.00 | Raging_Hog | is konqi becoming the emacs of browsers? |
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| 08:34.45 | logixoul | um, no... for one thing it has a clearly defined purpose - "manage and browse files" |
| 08:34.52 | logixoul | :) |
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| 08:35.01 | Jucato | hm... you forgot a few stuff |
| 08:35.24 | logixoul | what stuff |
| 08:35.35 | henriquev | Raging_Hog: looooooooool |
| 08:35.46 | henriquev | I use Konversation |
| 08:35.51 | Jucato | in the About, there's an ellipsis... in the web page there's "and more!" |
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| 08:39.18 | Raging_Hog | logixoul, doesn't emacs also have a clearly defined purpose, be a text editor :p |
| 08:40.36 | logixoul | Raging_Hog: not really. you know what they say... |
| 08:40.37 | logixoul | A novice of the temple once approached the Chief Priest with a question. "Master, does Emacs have the Buddha nature?" the novice asked. The Chief Priest had been in the temple for many years and could be relied upon to know these things. He thought for several minutes before replying. "I don't see why not. It's got bloody well everything else." With that, the Chief Priest went to lunch. The novice suddenly achieved enlightenment, several years later. |
| 08:40.41 | logixoul | :D |
| 08:41.14 | logixoul | [source wikiquote] |
| 08:41.56 | logixoul | Raging_Hog: among other things it has a finance manager, an automated psychiatrist and a web browser :) |
| 08:42.24 | Jucato | don't forget Tetris!!! |
| 08:42.29 | logixoul | heh heh |
| 08:42.56 | Raging_Hog | and phases-of-the-moon |
| 08:43.08 | Jucato | like they said, it's a great OS :) |
| 08:43.28 | Chani | and irc |
| 08:43.56 | Chani | and /me thinks konqi already *is* the emacs of web browsers |
| 08:44.11 | Chani | konq does all sorts of things |
| 08:44.14 | logixoul | no, Firefox is |
| 08:44.18 | Jucato | if it is, then it's a severely bad emacs... |
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| 08:44.32 | Chani | I use it more of a sort of unified document viewer and web browser |
| 08:44.46 | Jucato | I use it all :) |
| 08:44.57 | Jucato | except for viewing contacts and calenders and media :) |
| 08:45.08 | Chani | I really like to have my viewing in the same window. I don't like having lots of windows cluttering up my desk |
| 08:45.40 | Chani | although I think ideally I'd want a document viewer that kept a file tree over to the left - konq has something for folders, but it doesn't show files |
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| 08:46.21 | Chani | and intelligent "next" and "prev" buttons for viewing sequentially numbersed files |
| 08:47.02 | Jucato | perhaps okular? |
| 08:47.05 | logixoul | Chani: hm, good idea. the gwenview part does split the window into "browse" and "view" parts, would be cool if this was generalized to all kinds of files... |
| 08:47.32 | logixoul | konq can split the window already, all that's needed is a "open files from one pane in the other without drag and drop" option |
| 08:47.34 | Jucato | actually Amarok and Kate already have that kind of sidebar |
| 08:47.41 | logixoul | yup |
| 08:47.44 | Jucato | Filesystem Browser in kate |
| 08:48.05 | logixoul | Jucato: can okular browse files in the main window though? |
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| 08:48.47 | pinotree | no |
| 08:48.47 | Jucato | don't know, but what Chani was thinking about was not a main window browser |
| 08:48.58 | logixoul | pinotree: thought so |
| 08:49.08 | Jucato | she specifically said "over to the left" :) |
| 08:49.34 | logixoul | which is, uh, like a sidebar :p so in the main window |
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| 08:50.06 | Jucato | ... |
| 08:50.07 | Chani | Jucato: perhaps. I don't really understnad what okular's going to be |
| 08:50.18 | Jucato | ask pinotree :) |
| 08:50.33 | Chani | logixoul: oh yeah, konq *can* do that' |
| 08:50.36 | Chani | I had it set up once |
| 08:50.46 | Chani | it's just completely and utterly un-discoverable |
| 08:50.54 | logixoul | true |
| 08:50.55 | pinotree | i don't understand the real problem |
| 08:51.12 | Jucato | logixoul: you can lock and link the two views |
| 08:51.30 | Chani | you split the screen click a couple of weird buttons so that there's a weird icon in the corner of each screen, "lock" one, and then the locked one is the file browser |
| 08:52.04 | Jucato | yep |
| 08:52.08 | logixoul | yeah, but if I click a file in one the panes, it opens in both |
| 08:52.20 | Chani | someone taught me to do it last year. I'd totally forgotten |
| 08:52.22 | Jucato | you forgot to lock one of the views |
| 08:52.27 | Chani | it really needs to be made more discoverable |
| 08:52.51 | Chani | like, have some one-click way to set it up maybe, and call it something that people might understand |
| 08:52.58 | logixoul | Jucato: locking one locks the other here... you mean the chain icon bottom right, don't you? |
| 08:53.09 | Jucato | no. the chain icon is the link |
| 08:53.17 | logixoul | aaah |
| 08:53.24 | Jucato | link them, with the chain icon, then right-click on the status bar of one and select Lock |
| 08:53.30 | Jucato | or Window menu -> Lock |
| 08:53.32 | Chani | logixoul: like I said, it's weird. |
| 08:54.01 | logixoul | yeah... |
| 08:54.18 | Chani | maybe make it one of the view modes or something... |
| 08:54.30 | logixoul | Jucato: ok that works. but when I navigate up one level in the locked view, the _other_ one goes up instead |
| 08:54.41 | logixoul | guess that's not how it was intended to be used ? |
| 08:55.12 | Jucato | nope. I think it was intended to be used for web browsing |
| 08:56.13 | logixoul | heheh I have 4 columns of Google now and I can drag and drop links among them like mad |
| 08:56.18 | logixoul | not sure what that gives me :D |
| 08:56.47 | logixoul | well, I'm sure I'll find a purpose for window splitting one day |
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| 08:58.48 | Jucato | file transfer |
| 08:59.22 | logixoul | cut, navigate, paste. works always except when I'm not sure what I wanna be moving. but that's pretty rare :) |
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| 09:00.08 | logixoul | but, I used to split the window to move files in Dolphin - because there it's done right :) |
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| 09:00.21 | Jucato | but can be done only once :) |
| 09:01.08 | logixoul | that's more than enough :) btw dolphin now has a finder like mode where it adds a column for every dir level |
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| 09:02.28 | logixoul | hm, funky |
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| 09:02.57 | Jucato | yeah. finder.. need to get used to that... |
| 09:04.06 | logixoul | http://web479.sv16.pixelx.de/fnder.png |
| 09:04.20 | logixoul | and when I open too many columns it scrolls horizontally |
| 09:04.25 | logixoul | hmm.. |
| 09:04.50 | Jucato | yeah I've used it before |
| 09:04.55 | logixoul | ah |
| 09:05.04 | eSa| | i'd like a right to left pathbar... is it feqasible? |
| 09:05.06 | Jucato | I mean dolphin's column view |
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| 09:05.44 | logixoul | eSa|: is your language RTL? |
| 09:05.56 | Jucato | pathbar where? |
| 09:08.16 | eSa| | logixoul: not at all |
| 09:08.28 | eSa| | ehm... *defintely not |
| 09:08.41 | logixoul | eSa|: what's the point of a rtl breadcrumb bar? |
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| 09:10.43 | eSa| | i see , as a ltr language user, that it's disturbing to read the origin-to-destination path while it would be more convenient to have it placed right justified and with destination-to-origin form |
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| 09:11.01 | eSa| | (with properly turned arrows of course) |
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| 09:11.44 | logixoul | that's an interesting possibility. |
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| 09:17.51 | logixoul | The only action you can perform in the pathbar is go up (any number of levels). Hence, this is "what the pathbar does", i.e. "the way to do what you want in the pathbar", i.e. "the way to move forward with the pathbar". *Forward*. But with the current pathbar, you click to the *left* of the current dir, which suggests *backwards*. And now that eSa| mentioned it, I realized I *have* felt a discomfort with this inconsistency when using Dolphin. |
| 09:18.02 | logixoul | Jucato: I think that's the problem. |
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| 09:18.59 | Jucato | I still don't get it... |
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| 09:20.52 | logixoul | Jucato: I wanna move onto another dir, let's say an ancestor dir. So, I wanna move *forward* into that dir, right? But the button I need to click to get there is located to the left of where I am, which means *backwards*. The idea to reverse the pathbar seems to solve that. |
| 09:21.15 | logixoul | I guess we'll have to try that to really get it |
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| 09:21.51 | Jucato | why are you thinking of moving forward in the first place? |
| 09:22.37 | Jucato | the fact that it's the parent directory means you're moving up/back in terms of location |
| 09:23.08 | eSa| | past-present-future this is moving forward |
| 09:23.26 | Jucato | we're not talking about chronological movement here. |
| 09:25.05 | eSa| | whell, the path bar shows the choices you have when you need to access a dir (node) in your path |
| 09:25.31 | Jucato | yes. the "metaphor" is spatial, not chronological |
| 09:25.34 | eSa| | the fact that the first choice (root) is the more distant seems to the point to me |
| 09:27.03 | logixoul | Jucato: I think it's related to the way I think of browsing. E.g. a gnome person would probably always start at ~, then click his way into the depths, then go back up... I, on the other hand, will write ~/my/wallpapers/oxygen in minicli and *that* will be my starting point, _not_ home. From then on, the movement I perform (in my mind) *is* indeed chronological, and not spatial. I'll go to various dirs, sometimes by clicking, sometimes by writing another |
| 09:27.03 | logixoul | path in the location bar, and, so, traverse a path to which dir depth is irrelevant... |
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| 09:27.26 | logixoul | anyway, explanations won't get me anywhere :) |
| 09:27.37 | Jucato | so use the editable location bar. that's not what the breadcrumb bar is for |
| 09:28.14 | annma | hi Jucato :) |
| 09:28.18 | annma | not too bad weather? |
| 09:28.47 | Jucato | ugh!! it was raining while shining a while ago... now the air feels so sticky... |
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| 09:30.52 | logixoul | Jucato: maybe; but the breadcrumb bar is more convenient -- if I wanna get from ~/a/b/c/d/e to ~/a/b/x/y/z/w, it's still the easiest way -- easier than typing the path by hand for me. |
| 09:32.54 | logixoul | ah, that. Ever since the Win Explorer days, I couldn't get used to that one, even though it seemed to make sense :) I always just disabled it |
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| 09:35.28 | Jucato | I do understand what you're trying to say. but I still believe that the current metaphor/implementation of the breadcrumb bar isn't for that use case... |
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| 09:35.47 | Jucato | but aseigo might know better. it's his pet anyway :) |
| 09:35.55 | yellowChicken | does koffice read ms office 2007 files? |
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| 09:36.49 | logixoul | yellowChicken: I don't think so |
| 09:36.55 | logixoul | yellowChicken: you can ask in #koffice though |
| 09:36.57 | Jucato | might want to confirm with #koffice |
| 09:36.59 | Jucato | hmph |
| 09:37.05 | logixoul | *g* |
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| 09:37.45 | ManaPirat | hi guys |
| 09:37.52 | logixoul | (just for the record, Peter Penz added the breadcrumbs to Dolphin. In the first version ;) |
| 09:37.57 | logixoul | hi Mana |
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| 09:38.59 | Jucato | yeah |
| 09:39.12 | Jucato | but it was still aseigo's pet for some time :) |
| 09:39.20 | logixoul | true |
| 09:39.25 | ManaPirat | when my KDE-sessions hangs during "end this session" due to crappy ATI-Drivers - could this lead to data-loss? I had to hard-reset this machine and suddenly evolution lost all its preferences though .evolution exists. Firefox losts the config that tells where to store downloads default. But the rest looks OK |
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| 09:41.18 | logixoul | ManaPirat: short answer: it can lead to data loss of KDE settings, yes |
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| 09:41.41 | logixoul | ManaPirat: long answer: when KDE hangs at that point, (almost) any KDE app that hasn't been able to quit until that point will also not have flushed the config changes to disk. So you're left with the config of the last session. |
| 09:41.56 | progress0r | where can i change a file association in kde 3.5.7? |
| 09:42.11 | Jucato | Konqueror -> Settings -> Configure Konqueror -> FIle Associations |
| 09:42.20 | progress0r | many thanks |
| 09:42.21 | logixoul | ManaPirat: I can't speak for non-KDE apps, since they don't follow any consistent tradition of when to save the config |
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| 09:42.34 | Jucato | KControl -> KDE COmponents -> File Associations also |
| 09:42.49 | progress0r | cool thanks |
| 09:42.55 | Jucato | afaik, KDE doesn't save non-KDE apps state and data when ending the session |
| 09:43.11 | ManaPirat | :-/ hmm yes - thank you |
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| 09:43.29 | ManaPirat | grmpf - this damn crappy driver stuff |
| 09:43.37 | logixoul | Jucato: sure it doesn't. but it does leave them the chance to exit cleanly - including saving their config |
| 09:44.23 | logixoul | ManaPirat: rejoice, for it is but getting better! ATI is opening the drivers, and then... ;) |
| 09:44.24 | Jucato | yeah. but not automatically |
| 09:44.36 | ManaPirat | i heard about that :) |
| 09:44.49 | logixoul | heh |
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| 09:46.50 | Raging_Hog | are there any patches or programs to tile windows on kde? |
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| 09:48.54 | annma | Raging_Hog: I don't think so |
| 09:49.03 | annma | you can split views and that's it |
| 09:49.24 | Raging_Hog | split views? |
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| 09:50.02 | annma | Window menu |
| 09:50.49 | logixoul | (in Konqueror, that is) |
| 09:51.07 | annma | logixoul: also in Kate |
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| 09:51.20 | logixoul | ah, yes |
| 09:51.27 | annma | or is it only in KDE 4? |
| 09:51.35 | Raging_Hog | yes but konqueror doesn't yet have the capabilities of window manager(yet) |
| 09:51.36 | annma | ;) OK |
| 09:51.56 | annma | Raging_Hog: a window manager manages konqueror |
| 09:52.03 | logixoul | no kidding |
| 09:52.06 | annma | konqueror is a webbrowser |
| 09:52.10 | logixoul | Raging_Hog: ya think so? gopc.net :P |
| 09:52.22 | annma | Raging_Hog: you are mixing up concepts |
| 09:52.27 | Raging_Hog | annma, before you logged in we talked about how konqueror will soon konquer the world as a new emacs |
| 09:52.31 | Raging_Hog | annma, I'm kidding |
| 09:52.40 | annma | ah |
| 09:52.43 | annma | :) ok |
| 09:53.04 | Jucato | not good to be messing with my annmom :) |
| 09:53.11 | logixoul | annma is overstressed with all this ironing... :) |
| 09:53.12 | logixoul | (sorry) |
| 09:53.39 | Raging_Hog | seriously tho, every once in a while I could use an automatic tiler for example to compare an openoffice document to info on web site |
| 09:54.01 | Raging_Hog | btw, konqueror still lacks a word processor :D |
| 09:54.21 | logixoul | Raging_Hog: with the Maximize Vertically (or horizontally) feature in KWin, this can take like 10 seconds |
| 09:54.22 | annma | logixoul: lol, yes, still undone |
| 09:54.39 | logixoul | hehe |
| 09:54.39 | Jucato | Raging_Hog: well basically it just doesn't have a writeable KWord Kpart.. |
| 09:55.05 | Jucato | it's kate and kword kparts are read-only... |
| 09:55.24 | Jucato | but it's korganizer and kaddressbook aren't... :/ |
| 09:56.01 | logixoul | :D |
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| 09:56.35 | Jucato-Konvirssi | hello :) |
| 09:56.54 | logixoul | laughing out loud at this point :D |
| 09:56.55 | Jucato-Konvirssi | hey. that's a nice name... Konvirssi.. sounds Italian or something |
| 09:57.17 | Jucato-Konvirssi | Sho_ is sooo going to kill me. glad he's not here to see this :) |
| 09:57.25 | logixoul | lol |
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| 09:58.19 | Jucato-Konvirssi | hm... Konsole tab highlight at every join/part/activity... not good :) |
| 09:58.28 | Jucato-Konvirssi | this is fun though :) |
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| 09:59.16 | logixoul | Kat? |
| 09:59.17 | Jucato-Katirssi | hi logixoul! |
| 09:59.32 | Jucato-Katirssi | think man, think! :) |
| 09:59.38 | logixoul | hold on |
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| 10:00.04 | logixoul | lol... right. Kate |
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| 10:00.20 | logixoul | I was thinking Kat-the-dead-file-indexer |
| 10:00.22 | Jucato-Konqirssi | got it right! :) |
| 10:00.47 | logixoul | now construct an elaborate scenario where you use an ASCII-Art X driver and pipe that into a terminal embedded in Emacs... |
| 10:00.47 | Jucato-Konqirssi | heh.. I would have preferred Kat, just for the cat :) |
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| 10:01.39 | logixoul | that was even their logo |
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| 10:02.11 | Jucato-Katirssi | hehe this will be the perfect way to code/type & chat! :) |
| 10:02.28 | logixoul | wait... did I just say ASCII-Art X driver? this could put an end to ncurses apps! =) |
| 10:02.50 | Jucato-Katerssi | there, a more obvious name |
| 10:03.15 | Jucato-Konvirssi | before Sho_ comes in and catches me |
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| 10:04.00 | logixoul | KDE Advanced Text Editor Relay Chat -_O |
| 10:04.06 | Jucato-Katerssi | ehehe |
| 10:04.39 | Jucato-Katerssi | hm.. not for from becoming a slight possibility... aseigo was looking for a gobby KDE counterpart... |
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| 10:04.49 | Jucato-Katerssi | s/possibility/reality/ |
| 10:05.16 | Jucato-Katerssi | hm... bbl :) |
| 10:05.39 | JuKaterssi | economy of space... |
| 10:06.04 | logixoul | JuK for short |
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| 10:11.09 | Raging_Hog | I told you people, soon there will be a emaks |
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| 10:12.56 | Raging_Hog | except that irssi-in-konqi/kate isn't really emacs-like. in emacs most features are made from scratch into one humongous app |
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| 10:14.28 | logixoul | ...exactly like in Firefox, except in Lisp and not JavaScript |
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| 10:15.36 | wilsby | hi |
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| 10:18.18 | logixoul | the reason Konqueror can't have extensions like Firefox is that it, like 99% of software, uses a mostly procedural approach to building the UI, as opposed to the declarative XML part of Gecko's XUL. XML can be overrid because there's no order of "execution", as opposed to C++ where there's a lot more to take into account. The tradeoff, AFAICS, is performance. And where we already use declarative formats, e.g. XMLGUI for toolbars and menus, it already _is_ |
| 10:18.18 | logixoul | overridable by KParts. |
| 10:18.37 | logixoul | meh who am I talking to :) |
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| 10:24.48 | JuKaterssi | to no one obviously :P |
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| 10:25.59 | mosno | not me logixoul, but what you said was interesting |
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| 10:27.41 | pinotree | what for? |
| 10:27.49 | JuKaterssi | nothing |
| 10:28.04 | pinotree | exactly - then you have your reply :) |
| 10:28.06 | logixoul | next thing you know we have a konqpart and Konqueror becomes self aware. Within 24 hours we're all dead. |
| 10:28.08 | JuKaterssi | just an exercise in futility |
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| 10:28.54 | logixoul | Not in #kde it isn't, you damn hippie... |
| 10:29.04 | JuKaterssi | heheh :) |
| 10:29.33 | JuKaterssi | ok getting back to work... |
| 10:29.52 | logixoul | me neither :p |
| 10:31.51 | Raging_Hog | konqueror.. learning at geometric speeds?! Self-aware?! sKynet?! |
| 10:31.53 | mosno | logixoul: becomes self aware, rouses the dormant Gnome install on the HDD, and together they rule teh interwebs |
| 10:32.45 | mosno | "fluxbox... *pants* windowmaker....... *catches breath* they never stood a chance..." |
| 10:33.01 | logixoul | :D |
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| 10:54.43 | Raging_Hog | can I specify a certain workspace where a certain program would start? |
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| 11:04.39 | Cope | is katapult configurable? ie can it be made to index new programs? I don't understand how it decides what it can launch |
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| 11:33.02 | m_ | hi all. |
| 11:33.16 | |timrs| | hi |
| 11:33.33 | m_ | i just started using kopete and i can't find the menu item that can add another account ... |
| 11:33.42 | timrs | hold on |
| 11:34.02 | timrs | Settings>Configure..>Accounts |
| 11:34.14 | m_ | wow |
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| 11:34.16 | m_ | thanks man |
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| 11:38.21 | m_ | another thing ... i've just tried using the data wallet and i'd like to restore passwords as unsafe |
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| 11:38.48 | timrs | i don't know what you mean by 'restore passwords as unsafe' |
| 11:39.12 | timrs | sorry --- i've to go to school now |
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| 11:39.31 | m_ | during first launch of kopete, i've been asked if i wanted to store passwords inside the data wallet |
| 11:40.13 | m_ | now i've changed my mind, so i'd like to save them normally, inside the application |
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| 12:39.21 | boguh_ | is there something like xmodmap for kde? |
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| 12:41.00 | apokryphos | boguh_: what do you mean? KDE respects X's settings if defined with xmodmap |
| 12:41.36 | boguh_ | apokryphos i want to map ESC to caps lock |
| 12:41.53 | boguh_ | thought there might be a tool in kcontrol |
| 12:42.19 | apokryphos | not really; use xmodmap (grabbing the keycodes from xev) for that |
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| 12:48.59 | logixoul | Raging_Hog: `kstart --desktop 2 kcalc` |
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| 12:50.16 | logixoul | Raging_Hog: or rightclick titlebar->advanced->special application settings->desktop->apply initially |
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| 12:52.21 | Raging_Hog | thank you logixoul |
| 12:52.22 | idem | Hello :) |
| 12:52.27 | logixoul | np |
| 12:52.29 | logixoul | hi idem |
| 12:53.46 | JuKaterssi | anyone know of a way to switch from Kate main window to the embedded konsole through a shortcut? |
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| 12:54.26 | JuKaterssi | at least you didn't see earlier |
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| 12:54.54 | Sho_ | Saw what? |
| 12:55.21 | logixoul | JuKaterssi: there's a "show terminal" shortcut - double pressing it will switch the focus, you can make that into a khotkeys macro |
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| 12:55.36 | Jucato-Katirssi | heh ok never press Ctrl+Z in irssi :) |
| 12:55.58 | [nrx] | LOL |
| 12:56.01 | Jucato-Katirssi | Sho_: btw have you read this? KDE ported to Nokia's Linux-powered Web tablets http://www.linuxdevices.com/news/NS8623627920.html |
| 12:56.08 | logixoul | Sho_: he was running irssi in the konsole embedded in konvi :D |
| 12:56.21 | Jucato-Katirssi | hush!! |
| 12:56.23 | Sho_ | logixoul: Well, that is the only legitimate way to run irssi, if barely |
| 12:56.39 | logixoul | Jucato-Katirssi: sorry sorry orz |
| 12:56.44 | logixoul | Sho_: hehe |
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| 12:57.49 | Jucato-Katirssi | Sho_: this is just a new way of distracting myself while studying/making notes in Kate :) |
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| 12:58.04 | Jucato-Katirssi | hm... wrong nick hah |
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| 12:59.10 | Sho_ | Jucato-Katirssi: kwin has the amazing ability to not maximize windows and display two at the same time, one below the other, btw |
| 12:59.40 | Jucato-Katirssi | Sho_: I know. that's what I've been doing in the past. hence the "new way" :) |
| 12:59.44 | logixoul | too bad it can't group them though |
| 12:59.58 | Jucato-Katirssi | if I were seriously trying to be productive, I wouldn't even put them on the same desktop :) |
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| 13:07.38 | Nyle | hey |
| 13:07.40 | Nyle | wow |
| 13:07.41 | Nyle | you can? |
| 13:08.01 | Nyle | Sho_: Jucato: how do you do that with kwin |
| 13:08.12 | Jucato | O.o |
| 13:08.41 | Nyle | 08:57 < Sho_> Jucato-Katirssi: kwin has the amazing ability to not maximize windows and display two at the same time, one below the other, btw |
| 13:08.57 | Sho_ | Nyle: Right-click the title bar and uncheck "Maximize", then drag the window by its title bar to move it or drag the window borders to resize it |
| 13:09.27 | Nyle | umm |
| 13:09.29 | Nyle | yeh |
| 13:09.37 | Nyle | oh |
| 13:09.39 | Sho_ | you never know |
| 13:09.39 | Nyle | hey |
| 13:09.46 | Nyle | quit messin withme |
| 13:09.55 | Nyle | I thought it was some cool transparency thing you were talking bout |
| 13:10.00 | Nyle | window z order |
| 13:10.03 | Nyle | :( |
| 13:10.33 | Jucato | Sho_: so have you seen the link? is it true or a hoax? |
| 13:10.36 | Nyle | i thought it was some cool feature i didn't know about. |
| 13:11.01 | Jucato | nah, Sho_ was just messing with me for running irssi in Konversation and Kate :) |
| 13:11.10 | Nyle | irssi > * |
| 13:11.19 | Sho_ | Jucato: The real question is whether he has patched Qt to integrate it with the Hildon input method; building Qt and KDE for the N800 is trivial aside from that |
| 13:11.27 | Nyle | no offense, but konversation aint nothing compared to irssi :D |
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| 13:12.07 | Nyle | nothing comes close, nothing. so yeh, kde4 should be good for me |
| 13:12.16 | Nyle | once konversation is finally finished |
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| 13:12.55 | Nyle | what does tickle my pickle, is that ati will hopefully release better 3d drivers for their hw forlinux |
| 13:13.05 | Nyle | fglrx with aiglx and composite support |
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| 13:13.51 | Sho_ | kde4 should be good for you because you like irssi? you can use irssi just fine in kde3, too |
| 13:13.57 | Nyle | no |
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| 13:14.00 | Nyle | for konversation |
| 13:14.13 | Jucato | you should talk to the maintainer of Konversation :) |
| 13:14.15 | Nyle | maybe i won't use irssi anymore if konv. has all i need |
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| 13:14.18 | Nyle | no i shouldn't |
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| 13:14.28 | Nyle | he doesn't like my opinions of konversation and he gets defensive. |
| 13:14.33 | Jucato | he might be able to help you find what you need :) |
| 13:14.40 | Nyle | I tried already, many times. |
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| 13:14.48 | Jucato | hehe :) |
| 13:15.37 | Nyle | im kinda cold, and bored |
| 13:15.49 | Sho_ | Nyle: I have no recollection of ever talking with you about Konversation, fwiw |
| 13:15.52 | Nyle | and hungry too, but I'm fasting. It is the first day of Ramadan |
| 13:15.55 | Nyle | Sho_: stoned. |
| 13:16.13 | Jucato | he's stoned :) |
| 13:16.22 | Jucato | oh that just sounds so right :) |
| 13:16.28 | Nyle | no no |
| 13:16.45 | Nyle | that my other nickname, I'm fasting, im not stoned and won't be for another 29 days |
| 13:16.49 | Sho_ | Nyle: In that case I have no recollection of not liking your opinions. Iirc you wanted an X-Chat style nickname column seperator, and that's on the todo. |
| 13:17.09 | Nyle | whatever, I don't want to get into it again |
| 13:17.21 | Nyle | you remeber what you remember and lets just leave it at that |
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| 13:29.37 | Angelus | hey , i installed kicker-compiz from kdeapps website, but the size of the Desktop Pager And prieview became big as hell, any help? |
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| 13:36.19 | Ace2016 | Hi all |
| 13:36.48 | Ace2016 | whats the kde-look like site which had template files for stuff like scribus (i think it was scribus) |
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| 13:42.08 | Sho_ | Ace2016: kde-files.org |
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| 13:50.18 | Vinay-blr | hellloo room |
| 13:51.16 | Vinay-blr | are multiuser and thin client one and the same? |
| 13:52.19 | linduxed | hey guys, i need to create a new user...however when created through "kusers", as soon as i try to log in with it i get an error saying something about kstartconfig |
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| 13:52.31 | linduxed | then it starts kdm over again |
| 13:52.52 | Vinay-blr | yaa do it thru users and groups |
| 13:53.16 | Vinay-blr | even i had some problem with kuser |
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| 13:55.36 | Ace2016 | Sho_: Thanks, thats what i was looking for |
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| 14:04.54 | WeeJeWel | Any change i can make pixmap based themes for kde? |
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| 14:06.26 | annma | WeeJeWel: png themes? |
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| 14:06.45 | WeeJeWel | is that an app? |
| 14:06.50 | WeeJeWel | *theme |
| 14:07.17 | annma | ? |
| 14:07.28 | annma | WeeJeWel: I don't understand |
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| 14:07.55 | WeeJeWel | i mean i can put image files (png, gif, xpm) as a border, buttons etc |
| 14:08.38 | WeeJeWel | now you have to native code them right? |
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| 14:12.23 | poleman | hi all |
| 14:12.52 | WeeJeWel | hey poleman |
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| 14:13.36 | Jucato | WeeJeWel: you'll have to find a widget style that support pixmaps (ala GTK+?). I'm not sure, but I think there will be one for KDE 4... |
| 14:13.39 | poleman | I need to have an openGl app under kde to be fullscreen, but glutFullscreen() only works sometimes, I need to access kwin from python to set the window fullscreen |
| 14:13.58 | WeeJeWel | Jucato, that's what i'm trying to find here :-) |
| 14:14.15 | Jucato | don't think there's one for KDE 3 |
| 14:14.27 | Jucato | there is a windeco like that (IceWM and deKorator) |
| 14:15.29 | poleman | any idea? |
| 14:16.05 | annma | poleman: #kde-devel maybe is more appropriate |
| 14:16.09 | annma | what is the app? |
| 14:16.44 | poleman | is something like a game ( a GLUT window ) |
| 14:16.51 | Sho_ | WeeJeWel: KDE ships a window decoration engine that can load pixmap-based themes following the IceWM format, for half a decade now or longer |
| 14:17.07 | WeeJeWel | Sho_, i know, but im searching for widgets :) |
| 14:17.26 | Sho_ | WeeJeWel: Ah ... no, pixmap-based widget styles are not really viable |
| 14:17.38 | WeeJeWel | no theme that can load them or so |
| 14:17.48 | WeeJeWel | like some decorators :) |
| 14:18.13 | poleman | thanks annma |
| 14:18.45 | Jucato | Sho_: isn't there something called Kokoon or something for KDE 4? |
| 14:18.59 | Sho_ | WeeJeWel: Window decorations are much simpler than widget styles, though. Widget styles need to be a lot more flexible and provide a lot more variation, so the number of required pixmaps explodes, and it also starts to be rather sub-optimal performance-wise, so making a pixmap-based style for a modern toolkit is not really viable |
| 14:19.25 | Sho_ | Jucato: Cokoon uses SVG resources, and it's actually fairly complicated too |
| 14:19.32 | WeeJeWel | Okay, thanks Sho_ :) |
| 14:19.36 | Sho_ | Jucato: But at least SVG is a lot more mallable than pixmaps |
| 14:19.42 | WeeJeWel | ...however gtk seems to handle it quite well :P... |
| 14:19.47 | Sho_ | *malleable |
| 14:20.08 | Sho_ | WeeJeWel: The good/popular GTK themes are native code engines, too |
| 14:20.22 | Sho_ | WeeJeWel: Actually I think the pixmap engine was discontinued after GTK1, but I'm not sure |
| 14:20.48 | WeeJeWel | hmm, i wonder why there are so many more gtk2 themes out there then |
| 14:20.56 | Jucato | oh yeah... GTK/GNOME themes are just color schemes + metacity pixmaps + icon themes |
| 14:21.11 | Jucato | because they're less powerful than what Qt/KDE styles offer? |
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| 14:21.28 | Sho_ | WeeJeWel: Mostly because their terminology is less differenciated |
| 14:21.28 | Jucato | and probably easier to make (given what they're just composed of) |
| 14:21.38 | Sho_ | WeeJeWel: They both call a style engine and a color scheme for it a "theme" |
| 14:21.57 | Sho_ | WeeJeWel: So there are lots of "themes", but most are just color schemes / settings files for a smaller number of engines |
| 14:22.20 | WeeJeWel | most have different buttons / checkboxes etc? |
| 14:22.22 | Jucato | mostly clearlooks afaik |
| 14:22.30 | Sho_ | WeeJeWel: If you were to count every variant of KDE themes with lots of settings, like QtCurve or Lipstik, and every color scheme for it a theme too, you would have an enormous amount of themes for KDE as well ;) |
| 14:22.49 | Sho_ | e.g. QtCurve has lots of different appearances |
| 14:22.58 | WeeJeWel | yeah hehe, but i mean 'real' different buttons, with diff. shapes |
| 14:23.14 | Jucato | it could be just settings for Clearlooks |
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| 14:23.46 | Jucato | or maybe pixmaps... don't really know either. haven't gone down into that world |
| 14:24.36 | WeeJeWel | i just have a gtk theme i want to port to kde, lol |
| 14:24.47 | Sho_ | Which one? |
| 14:24.57 | WeeJeWel | some vista style |
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| 14:25.03 | WeeJeWel | aero close or so |
| 14:25.07 | WeeJeWel | clone* |
| 14:25.53 | raphael_ | manu_hack |
| 14:26.03 | raphael_ | ???? |
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| 14:32.19 | psymin | Not sure if this is a KDE issue or not, but .. OS: Gentoo, KDE-version: 3.5.7 .. http://people.montana.com/~psymin/darkspots.png .. sometimes konsole and kmail don't refresh their windows properly when I change desktops. |
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| 14:38.00 | rooter_ | hello! |
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| 14:44.25 | wishie | is there an applet/program for kde to show sensors information from lm_sensors ? |
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| 14:45.30 | Sho_ | wishie: There's a Kicker applet for KSysGuard shipped with KDE, yeah |
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| 14:47.32 | wishie | thanks |
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| 15:28.08 | KDEusr | hello all. |
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| 15:28.52 | KDEusr | is there a way to disable kde from drawing the wallpaper? |
| 15:29.09 | annma | drawing? |
| 15:29.14 | looker | hi, i was wondering what part of kde is responsable for shortcut bindings on kde menu editor, since i'm missing there a button to make shortcut to a program |
| 15:30.08 | KDEusr | im using compiz fusion. i can use 4 diffrent background images on the cube. are you famlilier with the cube? |
| 15:30.17 | annma | you can set the shortcut i kcontrol looker |
| 15:30.27 | annma | I know what the cube is |
| 15:30.38 | Jucato | the cube.. the matrix.. :) |
| 15:30.40 | KDEusr | i've got to figure out how to disble KDE from "painting" the background. |
| 15:30.43 | looker | annma: i can't set shortcut there, because kcontrol crashes after i try to set it |
| 15:31.09 | KDEusr | something like the root window or something |
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| 15:31.17 | annma | that's bad! what about other kcontrol settings? |
| 15:31.27 | KDEusr | i've got to turn that off so i can set the background with compiz-fusion |
| 15:32.00 | annma | compiz-fusion should go over it |
| 15:32.00 | looker | annma: other kcontrol settings are ok |
| 15:32.04 | Jucato | KDEusr: right-click on the destkop -> COnfigure Desktop -> Background -> No picture |
| 15:32.21 | KDEusr | that dont work. |
| 15:32.25 | KDEusr | i've tried it. |
| 15:32.26 | annma | beautiful Jucato |
| 15:32.36 | Jucato | then it's not KDE's fault... |
| 15:32.40 | KDEusr | its not exactly what im looking for, but sounds really close. |
| 15:32.42 | annma | why not KDEusr? |
| 15:32.58 | KDEusr | because KDE will still be setting a blank image for the root window |
| 15:32.59 | Sho_ | KDEusr: Try Right-click desktop -> Configure Desktop -> Behavior -> [x] Allow programs in desktop window |
| 15:33.08 | KDEusr | perhaps Sho_ |
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| 15:34.19 | KDEusr | i dont think that worked Sho_ |
| 15:34.25 | Jucato | next week, after Software Freedom Day :) |
| 15:34.40 | KDEusr | it would be cool if compiz could just paint overtop of.... |
| 15:34.43 | KDEusr | but it dont. |
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| 15:35.13 | Jucato | compiz, being just a window manager, probably couldn't... probably... |
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| 15:35.54 | Sho_ | It could, but it would be hackish |
| 15:35.56 | KDEusr | i appreciate you giving forth effort. |
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| 15:36.10 | KDEusr | im not expert on things windowy either. |
| 15:36.11 | KDEusr | lol |
| 15:36.28 | KDEusr | i've read there is a patch somewhere Sho_ but i'll be darned if i can find the thing. |
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| 15:43.57 | KDEusr | could someone tell me how i can turn off blinking tabs? |
| 15:44.08 | Jucato | in? |
| 15:44.18 | looker | this is the backtrace, when kde control center crashes, when i try to bind a short cut to any program. Besides there's no button for binding a shortcut on KDE menu editor. Someone help me :) http://pastebin.ca/695859 |
| 15:44.21 | KDEusr | say for instance, if i get a new instant message. that blinks in the bar across the bottom of the screen |
| 15:44.39 | Jucato | that would be a notification setting in Kopete |
| 15:44.57 | KDEusr | i've already searched there, there isnt one. |
| 15:45.35 | Jucato | huh? I have two enabled by default. Highlighted messsage and incoming message has been receive\d |
| 15:45.44 | Jucato | both have Flash taskbar entry enabled |
| 15:46.15 | KDEusr | where should i look? |
| 15:46.27 | Sho_ | It's interesting that you refer to the taskbar as tab bar though :) |
| 15:46.35 | Jucato | I thought you said you searched there? Settings -> COnfigure Notifications |
| 15:46.46 | Jucato | that's why I asked "in?" :) |
| 15:47.04 | Jucato | (well taskbar buttons are like tabs too right?) |
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| 15:48.37 | KDEusr | thanks Jucato. sorry for me not being very descriptive. |
| 15:48.49 | KDEusr | i dont know all of the "technical" names of things in KDE |
| 15:48.59 | KDEusr | im no KDE guru, i just like it alot. |
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| 16:00.39 | mhb | troy: is there even a place where we can send our KDE3 patches? |
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| 16:01.08 | mhb | troy: (our = downstream) |
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| 16:01.37 | mhb | hi Jucato and all the other great kde folks! |
| 16:02.36 | Jucato | mhb: #kde-devel for KDE 3 or #kde4-devel for KDE 4 might know too. aseigo seems to be alive and kicking right now :) |
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| 16:03.50 | mhb | Jucato: yeah, I wanted to ask troy, as a little follow-up to my comment to his blog... I will join kde-devel |
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| 16:04.02 | Jucato | ooh blog? post? comment? |
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| 16:04.15 | RichiH | what is the konqueror view that shows you directory size as recursive rectangles, again? |
| 16:04.27 | Jucato | File Size View |
| 16:05.06 | aseigo | Jucato: not so much kicking as doing the breast stroke |
| 16:05.14 | Jucato | hahah :) |
| 16:06.37 | RichiH | Jucato: you wouldn't happen to know in what debian package that hides? |
| 16:06.44 | RichiH | or the name of the view so i can search |
| 16:06.51 | RichiH | filename of the view, that is |
| 16:07.08 | Jucato | if it's not in View menu, try installing konq-plugins |
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| 16:09.35 | tvparys | Hi all. I've been messing around with Big Desktop (fglrx). Now I'm back on 1 (laptop) screen, KDE seems to keep on thinking that it's on a secondary screen or something. Only one monitor is displayed, but I can't eg. change the background of my desktop, only the background of some non-existing other desktop... hope I'm making myself clear here... |
| 16:10.25 | tvparys | To rephrase it: my background seems to be stuck on the one I'd set for a temporary secondary screen |
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| 16:12.58 | RichiH | Jucato: it's not in konq-plugins |
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| 16:13.46 | Jucato | Highlights for directory browsing include directory filters, image gallery creation, archive compression and extraction, quick copy/move, a sidebar media player, a file information metabar/sidebar, a media folder helper, a graphical disk usage viewer and image conversions and transformations. |
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| 16:15.32 | mhb | Jucato: do you have any idea on how often troy checks irc for pinging? |
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| 16:15.49 | Jucato | not really sure. |
| 16:16.03 | faern | Hi all! I just switched from gnome to kde. now I have a question: |
| 16:16.11 | Jucato | I guess it would be 11:16am at his place... |
| 16:16.32 | faern | I clicked the checkbox that says "dont ask me again" in the confirm delete dialog in konqueror |
| 16:16.41 | Sho_ | mhb: He tends to be around for a few hours in the evening of his timezone is my impression |
| 16:16.51 | faern | how can I get it back? it's dangerous when files just go away |
| 16:17.05 | mhb | Sho_: thanks! |
| 16:17.19 | Sho_ | (we should add a statistics plugin to Konvi :) |
| 16:17.30 | Jucato | faern: Konqueror -> Settings -> Configure Konqueror -> Behavior -> Ask for confirmation options near the bottom |
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| 16:18.42 | faern | Jucato, thank you. kde feels much more configurable than gnome, thats my first impression along with the speed increase |
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| 16:23.47 | RichiH | Jucato: it is defiantely not working as a kpart, but i can call the standalone binary |
| 16:24.29 | Jucato | huh? |
| 16:25.07 | Jucato | View menu -> View mode -> File Size View |
| 16:25.15 | Jucato | you should be viewing a directory to see that option |
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| 16:29.44 | RichiH | Jucato: oh. it used to be in settings, load view profile, fs view |
| 16:29.47 | RichiH | Jucato: thanks |
| 16:30.15 | Jucato | :) |
| 16:30.20 | Sho_ | RichiH: That profile was simply a profile that happened to be set to that view mode, though ... |
| 16:30.30 | RichiH | Jucato: yah, i parsed that into load view profile :p |
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| 16:30.49 | RichiH | Sho_: makes sense |
| 16:32.30 | RichiH | hrm, can i _exclude_ directories? having /mnt in there does not make sense |
| 16:32.48 | RichiH | especially not when you have two corporate NAS mounted.. :p |
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| 16:37.12 | wishie | what is the name of the archive manager in KDE (for zip, tar etc) ? |
| 16:37.24 | Jucato | karchiver, ark |
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| 16:38.50 | wishie | thanks |
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| 16:39.59 | Sho_ | Jucato: karchiver is a third-party app |
| 16:40.11 | Jucato | it is? oh... |
| 16:40.21 | Jucato | what's the official one? isn't ark in eg? |
| 16:40.31 | Sho_ | Jucato: Ark is in kdeutils |
| 16:41.11 | Jucato | aaaah ok my bad :) |
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| 16:48.58 | Jucato | wb Sho_ |
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| 16:49.56 | Jucato | Sho_: quick konvi question... do you remember a few months ago when I asked you something about konvi commands and -domain? |
| 16:50.11 | Jucato | to sort of create an alias for bans/quiets |
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| 16:52.49 | Sho_ | Jucato: hazily |
| 16:53.08 | Jucato | um ok nvm :) |
| 16:54.07 | Sho_ | Jucato: well assuming that I would have replied "yes", what would have been the next question? |
| 16:54.27 | Jucato | the next question would be... what was it? |
| 16:54.28 | Jucato | heh nvm... |
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| 16:56.09 | Sho_ | Jucato: The /ban command accepts -host, -domain, -userhost and -userdomain parameters which generate banmasks which correspond to the four variants seen in the "Kick / Ban" sub-context menu of a nick |
| 16:56.36 | Jucato | ah. I guess -domain is the one I need... |
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| 16:57.00 | Jucato | <PROTECTED> |
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| 16:59.15 | Jucato | hm.. I wonder... is there a special %parameter to "extract" the domain... because freenode has this peculiar /mode +q... |
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| 17:03.03 | tso | grumble, i have a webshop that insists on sending mails in html format, and not only that but with a non-white background. for some reason kmail do not set said color on the background. but it does set the text to white :( |
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| 17:17.04 | aantipop | is it possible to turn of the explosion-like animations when klicking stuff on the desktop or in the kicker ? |
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| 17:24.55 | bluesceada | hmm |
| 17:25.01 | bluesceada | anyone knows a good IM for kde |
| 17:25.06 | bluesceada | except licq and kopete |
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| 17:25.11 | Jucato | kopete |
| 17:25.12 | Jucato | heh |
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| 17:25.20 | bluesceada | :S |
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| 17:27.04 | MinceR | bitlbee+irssi+screen+urxvt :> |
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| 17:29.30 | maki | when will kde 4 come out? |
| 17:29.53 | GraveDigger | rumor has it, that 4.0 will be released this september |
| 17:29.53 | aantipop | december |
| 17:30.17 | GraveDigger | sry, december that is |
| 17:30.40 | maki | december :( |
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| 17:35.38 | Sho_ | bluesceada: You could try combining Konversation with bitlbee. Another popular IM client is Sim. |
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| 17:51.31 | Siddharta | hello everybody |
| 17:51.36 | motac | hi |
| 17:52.30 | Siddharta | i would like to know how can we tell KATE to open files in ISO-88591 by default |
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| 17:53.50 | annma | yes, set it in open/save in Kate settings |
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| 17:54.56 | motac | i want to install kde4 on pardus |
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| 17:55.13 | motac | but i cant find its svn adress |
| 17:55.20 | annma | motac: look at techbase |
| 17:55.26 | annma | tachbase.kde.org |
| 17:55.30 | annma | techbase |
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| 17:55.35 | motac | ok |
| 17:55.38 | motac | thanx |
| 17:55.47 | annma | follow the tutorial for installing kde4 |
| 17:55.50 | annma | follow it exactly |
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| 18:01.30 | motac | i want install the kde4 |
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| 18:02.03 | motac | someone give me its svn adress please |
| 18:02.09 | motac | i cant find |
| 18:02.19 | motac | because i am and user :D |
| 18:02.23 | motac | *end |
| 18:02.37 | apokryphos | an end user probably can't compile it |
| 18:02.41 | pinotree | there are two options for you: |
| 18:02.45 | motac | hehe :) |
| 18:02.47 | pinotree | a) compile yourself |
| 18:02.56 | annma | motac: if you cannot find it on techbase then probably you cannot compile it |
| 18:02.59 | pinotree | b) use the distro packages, if it provides some |
| 18:03.07 | apokryphos | c) try a KDE 4 live CD |
| 18:03.26 | motac | hmm |
| 18:03.45 | annma | motac: you went to techbase.kde.oirg?? |
| 18:03.49 | aantipop | kubuntu wasnt good with beta 2 |
| 18:04.07 | apokryphos | *shock* |
| 18:04.14 | motac | i must compile myself |
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| 18:04.26 | annma | motac: on techbase.kde.org |
| 18:04.29 | annma | Setting up a KDE development environment |
| 18:04.29 | annma | Learn how to get, build and run KDE. |
| 18:04.35 | annma | you see that? |
| 18:04.38 | motac | annma yes |
| 18:04.46 | apokryphos | motac: why not just try the live CD if you want to see what it's like? |
| 18:04.52 | annma | click on the link!!! |
| 18:04.59 | annma | motac: if you cannot click you cannot build |
| 18:05.08 | annma | read the linked page now |
| 18:05.15 | motac | apokryphos limited internet user |
| 18:05.25 | annma | ah that's no good then motac |
| 18:05.38 | annma | svn is about downloading stuff and code |
| 18:05.41 | apokryphos | motac: you'll still have to download a lot if you want to compile |
| 18:05.48 | annma | yes motac |
| 18:05.51 | annma | forget it |
| 18:06.05 | annma | wait for some magazine having it |
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| 18:07.15 | motac | :( |
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| 18:40.56 | neol | where do i find all the commands for each program, ? |
| 18:42.31 | gkiagia | neol: what do you mean? |
| 18:43.15 | neol | let me explain in details gkiagia |
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| 18:44.31 | neol | actually i have forgotten the name of the kde control center which i usually use to type after pressing alt+f2, wherein i could easily find all settings, software properties, their paths, their commands to run them from launcher or from terminal gkiagia |
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| 18:46.11 | gkiagia | kcontrol ? |
| 18:46.31 | neol | gkiagia: its something else. :( |
| 18:47.36 | gkiagia | kfmclient ? |
| 18:47.59 | neol | gkiagia: no dude. |
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| 18:48.20 | annma | kde control center is named kcontrol |
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| 18:48.33 | annma | if you have another name it's maybe your distro tool |
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| 18:48.49 | annma | ask in your distro channel |
| 18:48.54 | neol | annma: no its not. |
| 18:48.56 | neol | ok |
| 18:48.59 | neol | thx anyways |
| 18:49.03 | annma | no? |
| 18:49.11 | annma | KDE has only 1 control center |
| 18:49.14 | neol | i meant its not based on distro |
| 18:49.25 | annma | it's not based on kde either |
| 18:49.43 | gkiagia | kcmshell then? :P |
| 18:50.04 | neol | annma: its based on kde only. |
| 18:50.17 | neol | i require it badly now.!!!! |
| 18:50.18 | annma | neol: what is your distro? |
| 18:50.22 | neol | mandriva |
| 18:50.35 | annma | drake something |
| 18:50.42 | annma | drakconf |
| 18:50.52 | annma | try that |
| 18:51.25 | neol | annma: no no not that, |
| 18:51.32 | neol | sorry for the trouble guys. !! |
| 18:51.53 | annma | what doe sit do? |
| 18:52.01 | neol | waht ? |
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| 18:52.26 | neol | oh.... i used to show commands for each programs |
| 18:52.36 | gkiagia | kdcop ? |
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| 18:53.07 | neol | gkiagia: that is showing functions dude. |
| 18:53.08 | gkiagia | I am going to list all available kde programs like that...... :P |
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| 18:53.38 | neol | i'm already trying to search in kconsole by tab.... damn so many possibilities. |
| 18:54.00 | annma | neol: so his programs shows COMMANDS for each KDE programs? |
| 18:54.05 | annma | define PROGRAMS |
| 18:54.14 | annma | define COMMANDS I mean |
| 18:54.19 | annma | giove an example |
| 18:54.27 | neol | ok guys got it kdemenuedit... finally got it.......... thanks any ways . :) |
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| 18:54.52 | gkiagia | :D |
| 18:55.10 | neol | how dumb, we sometimes even forget the most important things. |
| 18:55.20 | DebianTUX | hi. im using debian sid, kde version 3.5.7, and i whant to know why speech recognition doesnt work on the hotkeys |
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| 19:02.04 | bline | anyone know what would cause my kmenu shortcuts to quit working sometimes? |
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| 19:03.40 | bline | to fix it I have to go into kmenuedit, change the shortcut to something else, save it, then change it back and save it again... |
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| 19:03.51 | vargran | hi everyone! |
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| 19:04.12 | vargran | people is there any way to make Kate (editor) to show directory _tree_ not listing? |
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| 19:17.58 | looker | hi, why there is no button in kde menu to assign a hot key to a program? |
| 19:18.10 | looker | kde version 3.5.7 |
| 19:18.58 | looker | there should be, but i don't have it... and on my friends computer there's (we installed from the same cd's slackware, with kde 3.5.6) |
| 19:19.15 | benJIman | looker: right click -> edit menu |
| 19:19.24 | benJIman | then you can find the app and assign a shortcut |
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| 19:20.04 | looker | thereis no such button (i'll make a screen shot to prove it) |
| 19:21.09 | annma | looker: distro? |
| 19:21.18 | annma | slackware, hmm |
| 19:21.20 | looker | slackware 12.0 |
| 19:21.29 | annma | does anything else work OK? |
| 19:21.43 | looker | http://tornado.ktu.lt/kebabas/~rs/no_hotkey_button.png |
| 19:21.55 | looker | yes, everything else works (so far), i only installed today it |
| 19:22.40 | looker | what part of kde is responsible for those hot keys? |
| 19:23.42 | gkiagia | looker: in the kde control center there is also a module that handles hotkeys |
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| 19:24.00 | looker | gkiagia: and it makes control center crash |
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| 19:24.18 | looker | that's why i care what part of kde is responsible for those hot keys |
| 19:24.28 | looker | to start investigating at some point |
| 19:24.29 | gkiagia | ok, then something is wrong with your kde packages |
| 19:24.39 | looker | which package? |
| 19:24.55 | pinotree | looker: kde control center -> regional & accessibility -> keybaord shortcuts |
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| 19:25.08 | looker | pinotree: yes, yes, that makes kcontrol crash |
| 19:25.15 | pinotree | ?? |
| 19:25.16 | gkiagia | that's a good question! I don't know :) I am not a kde developer (yet) |
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| 19:25.49 | pinotree | looker: and what would be the backtrace of the crash? |
| 19:26.10 | vargran | people are there any text editors which can: directory tree, auto indentation, code highlighting, tabs? |
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| 19:26.48 | annma | our editor is Kate |
| 19:27.10 | looker | pinotree: http://rafb.net/p/lMICJw38.html |
| 19:27.27 | vargran | annma: question: has Kate normal directory tree view instead list view? |
| 19:27.37 | vargran | annma: and how to make Kate indent a document? |
| 19:27.46 | pinotree | vargran: Ctrl+I |
| 19:27.52 | pinotree | (as in capital i) |
| 19:27.58 | annma | an editor edit a file |
| 19:27.59 | looker | pinotree: that backtrace doesn't say me a thing |
| 19:28.03 | annma | ot's not a browser |
| 19:28.05 | looker | might be it does a bit to you, not sure |
| 19:28.08 | vargran | pinotree: every time? no automatization? |
| 19:28.14 | ZeiP | Why doesn't Kaffeine's picture show up on my both displays? Using E17, Xinerama, ati-drivers and Xorg. The video box only shows content on the primary display (although also that is garbage). |
| 19:28.20 | annma | why would kate have directory tree view? |
| 19:28.33 | annma | vargran: automated to what??? |
| 19:28.42 | annma | each devel I know does it differently |
| 19:29.05 | vargran | annma: I mean auto indentataion, not pressing Ctrl+I every time |
| 19:29.07 | pinotree | vargran: settings → configure kate → editor → indentation |
| 19:29.19 | pinotree | looker: distro? |
| 19:29.58 | vargran | pinotree: by the way, has Kate some plugins/scripting possibilities? |
| 19:30.00 | looker | slackware 12.0, kernel 2.6.22.6 |
| 19:30.20 | annma | vargran: some, yes. Any specific? |
| 19:30.47 | annma | not sure what you have in Linux except vim, xemacs and kate vargran as editors |
| 19:30.52 | vargran | annma: I want to make my indentations/macroses/scripts for work. how can I do that? |
| 19:31.03 | pinotree | vargran: what about taking a look there? |
| 19:31.05 | annma | ? |
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| 19:31.15 | annma | vargran: do you have Kate installed? |
| 19:31.19 | vargran | yes |
| 19:31.26 | annma | so please go where pinotree said |
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| 19:32.23 | vargran | and nothing worked :( |
| 19:32.31 | vargran | enabled auto identation C-style |
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| 19:32.39 | RThomas | [OT] could anyone recommend a channel where I might expect an answer to a sockets/multicast programming question? |
| 19:32.46 | vargran | trying to type something in file tes.c and no indentation :( |
| 19:32.50 | annma | RThomas: KDE or pure Qt? |
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| 19:34.29 | RThomas | er, pure C |
| 19:34.40 | RThomas | like I said, it's [OT] |
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| 19:35.01 | vargran | annma: anyway, it's not a solution for the main problem: where is normal tree for directories? |
| 19:35.09 | gkiagia | vargran: enable this: tools->identation->C-style |
| 19:35.19 | annma | normal tree for directories? |
| 19:35.21 | vargran | gkiagia: I already did that |
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| 19:35.47 | annma | vargran: you want that in kate? |
| 19:35.56 | vargran | annma: yes |
| 19:36.07 | vargran | annma: look here for example: http://macromates.com/images/manual/project_window_with_tabs.png |
| 19:36.12 | vargran | annma: left side |
| 19:36.22 | annma | ugly |
| 19:36.29 | vargran | ? |
| 19:36.31 | annma | you want a browser in an editor |
| 19:36.35 | vargran | yes |
| 19:36.44 | annma | kate doe snot have that fortunately |
| 19:36.52 | annma | why not a mp3 player? |
| 19:36.55 | vargran | unfortunately :( |
| 19:36.59 | gkiagia | kate has a browser |
| 19:37.01 | vargran | by the way it would be nice |
| 19:37.06 | gkiagia | but it is not in tree stype |
| 19:37.08 | gkiagia | style* |
| 19:37.12 | annma | and also a toaster |
| 19:37.33 | vargran | annma: no, I don't need a toster, but mp3 and browser would be nice |
| 19:37.42 | vargran | :) |
| 19:37.47 | annma | a few integrated games as well to play |
| 19:38.10 | vargran | not required, scripting language is more interesting |
| 19:38.40 | annma | it has a file system plugin |
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| 19:38.44 | annma | but no tree view |
| 19:38.49 | sputnick | hi there |
| 19:39.06 | vargran | annma: and where can I find info about witing those plugins? |
| 19:39.33 | annma | #kate is probably dead |
| 19:39.38 | annma | look at them maybe |
| 19:39.55 | annma | take the file system and hack from that I would say |
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| 19:42.16 | sputnick | I try to configure my kde3.5 on debian etch to automaticly open the *.torrents whith a shell script ( in the $PATH ). the script is : konsole --noclose -e btdownloadcurses "$1" but I have some troubles when I open torrents files with firefox : http://rafb.net/p/gXVf7M81.html If I download on the disk & open the .torrent with my script, all is right. |
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| 19:44.46 | gkiagia | sputnick: and why do you use firefox? :P konqueror rocks! |
| 19:45.11 | gkiagia | it's obviously a firefox problem |
| 19:45.12 | picca | yeah konqueror is superb :) |
| 19:45.28 | picca | links is my second best |
| 19:46.12 | litb | konqueror is lame as hell |
| 19:46.14 | sputnick | I wiil try with konqueror :) |
| 19:46.25 | sputnick | *will |
| 19:46.41 | picca | litb: in your humble opinion |
| 19:47.30 | litb | picca: yes, of course |
| 19:47.37 | picca | :) |
| 19:47.43 | litb | but smart one, indeed |
| 19:47.48 | picca | lol |
| 19:47.52 | sputnick | no, same problem with konqueror. I think there's a window manager problem... |
| 19:48.07 | gkiagia | :S |
| 19:49.03 | gkiagia | where do you see this message that you pasted in the paste bin? |
| 19:49.17 | sputnick | konqueror is the swiss army knife of geeks (ftp, local browsing, remote browsing, document viewver etc... ) |
| 19:49.32 | sputnick | in my new konsole, opened by my script |
| 19:50.21 | picca | firefox is the toblerone of browsers, hurts the palette of the mouth |
| 19:50.22 | sputnick | instead, I need btdownloadcurses running with the torrent file |
| 19:50.38 | gkiagia | I see... |
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| 19:53.52 | gkiagia | you could make another script that says konsole --noclose -e echo "$1" and try it with a torrent to see what arguments it actually passes to btcursesdownloader |
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| 19:57.19 | Vince976 | can anybody help me with compiz-fusion? |
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| 20:11.16 | DDustin | does kde have a kiosk mode? |
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| 20:12.01 | annma | yes |
| 20:12.40 | JordanC | Yeeeaah baby ;-) |
| 20:12.44 | DDustin | annma: could i say, use firefox fullscreen in kiosk mode? |
| 20:13.10 | JordanC | Kiosk mode is just a set of tools that disable some functionality |
| 20:13.27 | annma | not sure why you need kiosk for that DDustin |
| 20:13.29 | JordanC | If you just make firefox run full screen on startup and restrict the kicker, etc |
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| 20:13.40 | annma | exactly |
| 20:13.45 | DDustin | thats awesome =D |
| 20:13.47 | annma | http://techbase.kde.org/SysAdmin/Kiosk/Introduction |
| 20:13.54 | annma | doc ^^ |
| 20:13.59 | JordanC | annma: Well, i think you wouldn't want people just using a pen on the end of the screen and clicking the kicker, then running shit on the kiosk |
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| 20:16.20 | JordanC | Okay, just a note -- KDE URL Restrictions; you can do this more efficiently by just banning connections outside of a whitelist of hostnames |
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| 20:16.52 | JordanC | Then if you migrate desktops or such, regardless the URL won't go through |
| 20:16.57 | JordanC | i.e content filtration |
| 20:18.18 | DDustin | annma: ah thanks for the link, i missed it before |
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| 20:18.47 | DDustin | JordanC: there wont be a keyboard |
| 20:18.54 | DDustin | i'm not too worried about url blocking |
| 20:19.04 | DDustin | if someone browses the internet on it, more power to em =P |
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| 20:20.33 | troy | mhb: pong |
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| 20:24.02 | mhb | troy: hi! |
| 20:24.33 | troy | mhb: what's shakin? (was at lectures all day, sorry for not replying to pings...) |
| 20:24.45 | mhb | troy: no problem at all |
| 20:25.22 | mhb | troy: well I wanted to discuss some ideas from your blog post further |
| 20:25.48 | troy | okay - that's regarding upstream+downstream communication? |
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| 20:26.22 | mhb | troy: yes. you seem to think that we (kubuntu guys) do not send patches upstream - but I thought there is no more upstream to send kde3 patches to |
| 20:26.38 | troy | it's a personal pet peeve of mine that I'm in a position to actually do something about... see the latest commit digest - amarok bug was fixed in debian 7 months ago - never made it upstream... |
| 20:26.53 | troy | there is a kde 3.5.8 pending |
| 20:27.33 | troy | and we have pretty loose restrictions on what you can do in the 3.5 branch right now, taking into account that there's no place else for changes to 3.x to go... |
| 20:27.45 | mhb | troy: I had the impression kde3 is more or less dead to upstream, perhaps that is what keeps some of the patches downstream |
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| 20:28.31 | pinotree | mhb: then you're threathing your user as testers, that's not good |
| 20:28.40 | troy | the opensuse team requested we have a 3.5.8 release, so we reopened it a while back - it's not widely publized since we're mostly talking about 4.0 in the news :) |
| 20:28.41 | mhb | troy: I agree that we probably should have done better in the past |
| 20:29.12 | mhb | pinotree: not sure what you mean, though. We usually test stuff on ourselves :o) |
| 20:29.17 | troy | mhb: let the past be the past - best to be studied so we can learn from it, but of no real other use :) |
| 20:29.18 | pinotree | sure? |
| 20:29.51 | pinotree | mhb: like... uhm... the patched kpdf? |
| 20:30.00 | mhb | troy: right :o) I am certain there will be a lot of patches for KDE4 to send upstream once it comes out :o) |
| 20:30.33 | pinotree | mhb: i suggest you reading http://jucato.org/blog/my-first-intense-hacking-session-learning-a-few-lessons/ and its comments as well (sorry Jucato) |
| 20:30.35 | troy | I hope so :) |
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| 20:31.02 | mhb | pinotree: okay, I will read it later, thank you for the link. |
| 20:31.08 | troy | pinotree: jucato isn't even online... |
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| 20:31.20 | pinotree | mhb: even if the upstream seems "dead", that's not an excuse to blindly hide patches |
| 20:31.41 | pinotree | send them _first_, then apply locally if they are not applied for some reason |
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| 20:32.08 | mhb | pinotree: it (most likely) isnt. You are right. To be honest I was not the one who did the patch, but okay :o) |
| 20:32.12 | pinotree | that's not the other way round, eg you apply and let the upstream know after time, and time, and time, ... |
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| 20:33.43 | mhb | troy: okay, we should probably send as many patches upstream as possible, that is a good rule of thumb and I guess most people currently around Kubuntu understand that. |
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| 20:34.14 | pinotree | mhb: that "should" must be "must" |
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| 20:34.27 | troy | yeah - kubuntu isn't the worst offender, but it's a popular distro and one that is at least willing to talk to us: check out our arguments in the past with Red Flag Linux if you want some fun reading :) |
| 20:34.31 | mhb | troy: do you know about further problems with kubuntu that can be improved? |
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| 20:35.11 | troy | mhb: well, patches are my only problem right now :) I'd like to see them end up back in KDE when they are an improvement and not just sitting somewhere collecting dust |
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| 20:35.13 | mhb | pinotree: right. It is quite hard to force volunteers (like me), though. |
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| 20:35.40 | pinotree | mhb: then it's easier to blindly apply random patches, right? |
| 20:36.37 | troy | mhb: I don't mind patches that kubuntu applies to create branding and things like that - those are all fine and good - it's the ones that change functionality in some way that I'm worried about :) |
| 20:36.52 | mhb | pinotree: you are right. That is easier and that exactly is the reason why many patches are kept downstream. But it is not nice. |
| 20:37.10 | mhb | troy: ooh, I have got one interesting thing when it comes to patches |
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| 20:37.20 | pinotree | mhb: then try to stop that trend |
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| 20:38.13 | mhb | troy: some of the downstream (Kubuntu) translators want credit in the KDE "About" dialog. |
| 20:38.14 | Finswimmer | hey, i want to start KDM on :1. using gentoo. how can i do that? |
| 20:38.14 | troy | mhb: they send their translations upstream, and not only would they get credit in the kubuntu dialog, but for all KDE distros :P |
| 20:38.14 | mhb | troy: I dont like translating downstream much, but could we somehow integrate that upstream as well? |
| 20:38.29 | pinotree | mhb: then direct those translators to the kde translation teams |
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| 20:38.55 | pinotree | you put that way for them: no credits if you don't cooperate with the kde/gnome/whatever translation group |
| 20:39.04 | troy | mhb: depending on the specific app, some apps don't list all contributors, just a mailing list - but for the ones that have lists of authors, upstream would have no problems with that :) |
| 20:39.33 | troy | mhb: we'll give them SVN accounts and everything, if they want it |
| 20:39.54 | pinotree | troy: no, they must pass through the kde translation teams |
| 20:39.57 | mhb | troy: right, that sounds sensible. |
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| 20:40.25 | thiago_home | Finswimmer: you need to modify kdm's configuration |
| 20:40.29 | troy | pinotree: well, that depends on what they're translating - if it's pixmaps with hardcoded text, does that still live in i18n? |
| 20:41.00 | pinotree | troy: yes, just like translated data files for let's say khangman, klatin, ec |
| 20:41.03 | troy | (splash screens, for example) |
| 20:41.04 | Finswimmer | thiago_home: i have: StaticServes=:1 but it does not work |
| 20:41.04 | pinotree | *etc |
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| 20:41.24 | troy | pinotree: okay - I didn't know those sorts of things all went through the translation teams directly |
| 20:41.58 | pinotree | troy: (maybe for splash screens the application developer(s) is7are involved as well, but for sure the translation teams) |
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| 20:44.17 | mhb | troy: oh, and related to the "Canonical treats KDE not so well" (which is true) - do you know if GNOME is at least planning to take a look at APIs like Solid? Or is that KDE/Qt dependent? |
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| 20:44.45 | thiago_home | mhb: Solid is written using Qt. |
| 20:44.52 | thiago_home | but GNOME should take a look at it. |
| 20:45.20 | mhb | thiago_home: ah, great news. |
| 20:45.30 | thiago_home | what news? |
| 20:45.41 | thiago_home | that was an opinion: GNOME should take a look at it. |
| 20:45.48 | mhb | thiago_home: ah, I thought it was a fact |
| 20:46.15 | thiago_home | if it were a fact, I would have said "will take a look" or "has taken a look" |
| 20:46.56 | troy | no, Solid is a C++ library, dependant on Qt -- they should take a look at it since it's good code, but they would really object to linking against Qt for philosophical reasons and will likely end up reimplementing it at some point |
| 20:47.09 | troy | and Phonon too |
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| 20:48.21 | mhb | troy: ah. I asked because I think Ubuntu devs usually tend to write their stuff in a nice manner so that a backend can be shared with other toolkits. |
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| 20:49.06 | mhb | troy: so we cannot really make use of them in the backends, which is bad because they are quite nice (IMHO). |
| 20:49.23 | mhb | well, that is how it is. |
| 20:49.36 | troy | mhb: well, Solid is pretty much a higher level abstraction layer that lives above even HAL... |
| 20:49.54 | troy | mhb: so the underlying stuff is already shared, after a fashion |
| 20:50.22 | troy | mhb: and ditto for phonon, which is just a high level abstraction to multimedia engines (like xine, gstreamer, etc.) which is already shared after a fashion |
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| 20:52.05 | *** join/#kde bkw (n=bkw@h-235-0.A189.cust.bahnhof.se) |
| 20:52.34 | bkw | Doesn't support features such as converting incoming bytes to decimals? |
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| 20:53.02 | Sho_ | bkw: Doesn't _what_ support ...? |
| 20:53.32 | bkw | Sho_: you know what cutecom is and how to use it, right? |
| 20:53.55 | Sho_ | bkw: Perhaps, but your original question contained no mention of "cutecom" |
| 20:54.20 | mhb | troy: right. The problem is, APIs like phonon or solid are designed to provide data, which is (usually) what the backend should do. |
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| 20:54.29 | thiago_home | bkw: no. What's cutecom? |
| 20:54.32 | bkw | true, I guess I should been in bed a while ago. sorry about that. |
| 20:54.50 | Sho_ | thiago_home: It's a serial terminal app using Qt (not a KDE app) |
| 20:55.04 | litb | http://www.nuno-icons.com/images/estilo/rect4744.png looks sexy! |
| 20:55.06 | troy | mhb: well, they only really wrap the backend - it was a portability problem - the backend for playing sound is totally different on *nix vs. say Windows |
| 20:55.09 | bkw | written by a kde developer |
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| 20:55.16 | litb | i only hope that you can change the colors of it |
| 20:55.23 | shevy | to copy from linux to windows, is there a kde tool? (local network) |
| 20:55.33 | Sho_ | ah, Alexander wrote it |
| 20:55.41 | bkw | Are there any recommended kde terminal application for serial communication? |
| 20:55.53 | troy | litb: they plan to make all the applets accept themes to some extent - whether or not that works for 4.0, I have no clue :) |
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| 20:56.36 | troy | mhb: I think you misunderstand what phonon and solid are - they do no work themselves - they only provide a generic API that calls the appropriate backend functions |
| 20:56.48 | mhb | troy: yes, that I know. |
| 20:57.23 | runlevelten | The idea hardly flies in the face of sense. |
| 20:57.37 | troy | mhb: so making them toolkit independent is a non-issue, since they were designed to provide a KDE-like API for an already existing toolkit-agnostic backend |
| 20:58.34 | mhb | troy: but if you had a SimplePlayer app, which plays music and works in both KDE and GNOME, you can only share the xine/gstreamer backend, because all above has to be separate (say the KDE frontend uses Phonon and the GNOME one uses some GNOME-like gstreamer bindings). |
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| 20:59.19 | p3n1x420 | why when building kde3 from ports on freebsd 6.2, which needs koffice, why does koffice require mysql5 client...just outta curiosity? |
| 20:59.22 | troy | mhb: well, no, they could still use Phonon without bringing in all of KDE... |
| 20:59.29 | mhb | troy: although there is a level a bit higher where the apps do the same thing (one PlayTrack() function, one StopTrack() function etc.) |
| 20:59.32 | pinotree | p3n1x420: #koffice |
| 20:59.50 | p3n1x420 | lol thanks :) |
| 20:59.55 | troy | mhb: I mean, you'd be linking to Phonon, Qt, and a few other things - and you'd have to use C++, or some language with bindings (mostly higher level languages) |
| 21:00.16 | Sho_ | mhb: Well, in the end it's rather easy: xine and GStreamer are on a level where KDE and Gnome are willing to share code and APIs; Phonon and Solid aren't. You're going to have as hard a time convincing Gnome to use KDE C++/Qt APIs as KDE developers using something C/GObject-based. The common denominator is simply below Phonon and Solid. |
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| 21:00.51 | troy | mhb: the PlayTrack() and so forth (the high level API) is exactly what phonon provides... |
| 21:00.58 | PutHuhn | Sho_: qt uses the glib event loop |
| 21:01.07 | Sho_ | PutHuhn: Optionally, in Qt4 |
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| 21:01.16 | troy | PutHuhn: it only uses it as an option - by default it does not |
| 21:01.33 | Sho_ | PutHuhn: And the toolkit optionally using the glib main event loop is a far, far cry from having developers use Gnome APIs in KDE apps ;) |
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| 21:01.54 | PutHuhn | hmmm, if I look at backtraces from linux, there are always glib event loop functions in it |
| 21:02.10 | Sho_ | PutHuhn: You're confusing glib and glibc |
| 21:02.13 | troy | PutHuhn: glibc |
| 21:02.39 | Sho_ | PutHuhn: The former is a library that GTK+ and Gnome are built on, the latter is the GNU C library, which is a foundation of the GNU/Linux operating system |
| 21:02.54 | PutHuhn | I know |
| 21:03.12 | Sho_ | (although there are certainly other C libraries in use, such as ulibc) |
| 21:03.21 | troy | or FreeBSD's libc |
| 21:03.35 | Sho_ | well not so much in GNU/Linux |
| 21:03.35 | Sho_ | :) |
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| 21:03.39 | mhb | troy: and what we cannot really share with the GNOME counterpart, at least not yet. Well, perhaps in the far future :o) |
| 21:03.51 | litb | hm, but xine is in C too, and kde uses it |
| 21:04.02 | litb | i think, the common base is C, after all |
| 21:04.13 | troy | litb: KDE doesn't use xine directly in 4.0, it wraps it all into the Phonon C++ API |
| 21:04.21 | PutHuhn | but I mean glib |
| 21:04.26 | Sho_ | litb: But only on the library level, or at least that is the intent |
| 21:04.31 | troy | litb: previously, each KDE app that wanted to use xine had to do the wrapping themselves |
| 21:04.32 | mhb | troy: anyway, if there is anything in Kubuntu we can improve for you, just go to #kubuntu-devel and tell us, I think that is the easiest way to get things improved. |
| 21:04.34 | shevy | can you do something with phonon from "scripting" languages? |
| 21:04.38 | Sho_ | litb: In KDE 3, the xine API is wrapped by the aRTs API, in KDE 4 it's wrapped by Phonon |
| 21:04.53 | litb | hmm |
| 21:05.04 | litb | i always thought arts is on the same layer as xine? |
| 21:05.19 | litb | arts uses alsa or oss i thought until now o.o |
| 21:05.25 | troy | shevy: It should have autogenerated bindings for most of KDE's supported languages (ruby and python come to mind) |
| 21:05.31 | derek_ | Sho_: are you sure? arts is a media player in itself |
| 21:05.55 | troy | litb: arts is dead, but yeah, it would have been on the same level as libxine + a stream mixer |
| 21:06.09 | litb | ok, i was right o.o |
| 21:06.18 | litb | and Sho_ was wrong. appearently |
| 21:06.19 | litb | hehe |
| 21:06.49 | troy | litb: Sho_ is usually right, so we'll let one slip :) |
| 21:07.32 | Sho_ | litb, derek_: It's a fairly complicated netting of interdependencies. In some sense aRts is both the name for a software synthesizer and sound server, and KDE 3s official multimedia APIs, and in that context, xine is e.g. used to generate the video file thumbnails in Konqueror. If you build KDE with --disable-arts, you also use video thumbnailing. |
| 21:07.52 | mhb | troy: I wish you luck in the FOSScamp conference. I really hope you can convince someone in Canonical to support KDE more :o) |
| 21:07.54 | troy | litb: arts was actually really powerful - it did network transparency, mixing with dynamic effects, and a number of other things that an advanced mixer would need, but made simply multimedia apps too complex to code :) |
| 21:08.05 | Sho_ | So no, arts doesn't use xine to do sound, but xine does intrude into the arts ecosystem a bit ;) |
| 21:08.06 | troy | mhb: thanks :) |
| 21:08.53 | litb | and i'm awaiting the ever-so-good yaku2.8 =) |
| 21:09.02 | shevy | hehe |
| 21:09.09 | Sho_ | *you also lose video thumbnailing |
| 21:09.25 | mhb | troy: I have mailed to Mark S. about the state of Kubuntu vs. Ubuntu and it seems it will stay that way, unless Kubuntu starts earning a lot of support money, which is hard (for a distro that is free). |
| 21:09.26 | litb | Sho_: i see |
| 21:09.32 | litb | but there is that nice mplayer thumbnailer |
| 21:09.38 | litb | it works really well for me |
| 21:10.07 | Sho_ | troy: For what it does, i.e. being a software implementation of a synthesizer, it's still one of the most advanced implementations around, in fact |
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| 21:10.46 | troy | Sho_: oh, I don't dispute that at all :) |
| 21:10.54 | litb | what is that good for? much functions, but lame as hell? |
| 21:11.30 | troy | litb: have some respect for a great tool that was simply the wrong tool for the job :) |
| 21:11.33 | apokryphos | mhb: it's not like Ubuntu's earning money |
| 21:11.46 | mhb | apokryphos: I havent said that. |
| 21:12.15 | apokryphos | mhb: so you can't really hide the fact that "Kubuntu isn't earning" as the reason, because Ubuntu isn't too. It's a case of what Mark wants to support more |
| 21:12.17 | troy | mhb: Riddell told me that the country of Georgia was going to implement kubuntu in their entire school system - I guess Georgia is too poor to be paying the support contracts though :P |
| 21:12.18 | mhb | apokryphos: but Kubuntu is not earning either and it will stay a community version of Ubuntu unless it will |
| 21:12.21 | litb | troy: http://adrinael.net/youreright.jpg |
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| 21:12.42 | apokryphos | if you want a stronger KDE distribution then I'd just suggest using one, tbh |
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| 21:13.02 | litb | they could start using archlinux |
| 21:13.12 | xplode_me | what might be causing that once every now and then my knoqueror pops up the "medium inserted" menu? |
| 21:13.16 | Sho_ | litb: At the time that aRts was introduced in KDE, the Linux audio landscape looked quite different, namely not a lot of people hard sound hardware capable of doing mixing, or if they had, there weren't drivers for them. A software solution was required, and aRts, although not actually created for only that purpose, fit the bill. In hindsight it was mistake to tie the multimedia API of the app platform to that single backend, however, which is something that Phonon is |
| 21:13.16 | Sho_ | designed to correct by abstracting pluggable backends. |
| 21:13.18 | xplode_me | apparently for no reason |
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| 21:13.44 | mhb | troy: :o) I think they are rich enough, it is just the selling model that is not working, I am afraid :o) |
| 21:13.56 | apokryphos | mhb: like I said, it's purely down to what Mark wants to support (both projects are not self-sufficient). |
| 21:14.12 | Sho_ | But if you look at other operating systems, interestingly there's actually a trend to move audio back to a sophisticated software sound server that can create filter and effect chains, e.g. in Win Vista ... in some sense aRts was maybe ahead of its time ;) |
| 21:14.28 | litb | Sho_: and i hope phonon doesn't try todo software mixing |
| 21:14.43 | litb | because that gap is filled by alsa very well nowadays |
| 21:14.44 | mhb | apokryphos: right, it does. He would support Kubuntu more if it was selling itself, that is what I meant. |
| 21:14.50 | litb | with dmix |
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| 21:14.59 | troy | mark promised to make some time at this conference to sit down with me for an interview (for Ars), so I'll get a good chat with him -- I'll need a tape recorder though so I'm not distracting myself by madly scribbling :) |
| 21:15.03 | pinotree | litb: phonon does not do that - its backends do |
| 21:15.09 | pinotree | (are supposed to) |
| 21:15.41 | litb | i wonder. does phonon depend on kde libs? |
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| 21:15.54 | litb | i guess yes... |
| 21:15.58 | apokryphos | troy: not that I think him changing would even benefit KDE (there are much better KDE-supported distros IMO), but I wouldn't be too hopeful -- it's not like he hasn't talked to KDE guys before |
| 21:16.15 | apokryphos | last time he was asking KDE to revolve around Ubuntu's release schedule, hah :-) |
| 21:16.20 | Sho_ | litb: What aRts can do aside from primitive mixing is create complex chains of effects and filters, create waveforms via configurable oscillators, etc., which can all be presented in a node graph: http://www.arts-project.org/aol/pics/scr-0.3.3.jpg |
| 21:16.22 | pinotree | litb: nope, it's pure Qt |
| 21:16.27 | troy | apokryphos: no, but the press is a strangly powerful tool :) |
| 21:16.30 | mhb | troy: good luck with the interview! Too bad I cant attend the meeting, some of us (Kubuntu folks) are invited to the ubuntu desktop summit afterwards, but not the fosscamp (well, I am :o) |
| 21:17.02 | Sho_ | litb: That's more interesting to an audio professional than a regular desktop user, but technologically rather impressive |
| 21:17.12 | shevy | hey Sho_ that looks like an ancient shot |
| 21:17.14 | mhb | troy: which means there will be plenty of room to talk with Canonicals employees, I guess. |
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| 21:17.18 | troy | mhb: Riddell wanted me to go to the desktop summit portion to help play up KDE support, but we'll see :) |
| 21:17.42 | Sho_ | shevy: yeah it is :) |
| 21:17.54 | Sho_ | shevy: From '99 |
| 21:18.05 | apokryphos | as I said on the blog, Kubuntu just gets more people to GNOME (from KDE) than anything else |
| 21:18.14 | shevy | i think i have seen a similar audio app... with those moveable connections to boxes |
| 21:18.49 | benJIman | I like the way kubuntu claim to be a seperate distro when it's actually just a different package set, but still arn't free to have their own KDE oriented release schedule etc. |
| 21:19.06 | Sho_ | shevy: Node graphs are fairly popular in content creation apps. I'm a graphics rather than audio guy, and in that field you tend to see them in surface/material editors, composition graphs, etc. |
| 21:19.07 | mhb | apokryphos: so you think we are doing a bad job in maintaining Kubuntu or is that just because Ubuntu has more devs to polish it? |
| 21:19.22 | motac | what do u think about pardus ? |
| 21:19.22 | shevy | ah... "node graphs". gonna try to memorize the word :) |
| 21:19.31 | troy | benJIman: yeah - it may be that one day they declare total independence to get out of the shadow - I think that'll only happen if canonical's money runs out though |
| 21:19.49 | apokryphos | mhb: it's the Ubuntu community driving the hype that makes everyone use Ubuntu. Users who aren't "loyal" to a desktop environment will just use what they think is "more popular" and "better supported" |
| 21:20.11 | Sho_ | shevy: Here's an example shot from Blender, an open source 3D package: http://www.blender.org/typo3temp/pics/48305b0a13.jpg |
| 21:20.23 | shevy | cool |
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| 21:21.08 | apokryphos | Mark is very much "for" the unified release schedule, I'm sure he wouldn't ever allow Kubuntu to split off like that ;) |
| 21:21.10 | troy | mhb: I think it's the impression that kubuntu will always be second class while the current relationship to ubuntu stands... |
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| 21:21.52 | troy | mhb: and I'm not sure I disagree with that impression - however I can try to change that relationship :) |
| 21:21.57 | apokryphos | mhb: though Kubuntu has limited resources too, so it's hard for it to be as polished as other distros |
| 21:22.41 | apokryphos | though Ubuntu is mainly a packaging distro, so they don't need the same type of resources as some others (SUSE, Fedora) |
| 21:22.45 | mhb | troy: yes, I dislike that impression, which is probably a fact (community can hardly do as much work as professional devs do) |
| 21:23.09 | benJIman | apokryphos: Well they have like 15mb of patches to kernel, although no-one to maintain them. |
| 21:23.31 | apokryphos | benJIman: nearly all inherited from Debian though, right? |
| 21:23.40 | benJIman | Which I'm sure is a great way to convince enterprises that you can support the product. |
| 21:23.54 | troy | mhb: well, I was talking to Scott at the unix group meeting, and he talks about Canonical support LTSP, but only officially for ubuntu - this is the sort of thing that will always keep kubuntu down, and in turn KDE... |
| 21:23.55 | benJIman | apokryphos: I thought deb default kernel was pretty much vanilla. |
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| 21:25.05 | vbgunz | anyone know how to get kate to style line 2 here to look like a comment: http://rafb.net/p/WAkHzm28.html ? |
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| 21:25.28 | mhb | troy: oh, and I do not think that Fedora is any better in supporting KDE than us, but that is a highly personal opinion of a Kubuntu user :o) |
| 21:26.23 | troy | mhb: no, they aren't really, but at least they stopped treating it as a second class entity, after years of being considered exactly that |
| 21:27.05 | apokryphos | troy: you really think it isn't in Fedora still? :-) |
| 21:27.17 | troy | mhb: that particular problem is not at the developer level, it's at the management level |
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| 21:27.28 | benJIman | At least fedora arn't marketing KDE as second class really. |
| 21:27.44 | benJIman | Even if it is from developer resource. |
| 21:27.50 | troy | apokryphos: it's still there to some extent, but at least they're packaging install disks with KDE that don't appear to be a derivative or second class install |
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| 21:28.09 | apokryphos | All Fedora really do is package a quasi-vanilla KDE and recently created the 1-CD ISOs |
| 21:28.36 | troy | apokryphos: right - which for a (redhat) distro, is a freakin' huge step, historically speaking |
| 21:28.40 | apokryphos | even Mandriva's KDE following has significantly decreased over the last years |
| 21:28.51 | mhb | troy: same in Ubuntu :o) |
| 21:29.03 | apokryphos | openSUSE is really the only very usable distro with a strong KDE following (developers and userbase) |
| 21:29.06 | vbgunz | I think I have it |
| 21:29.11 | runlevelten | opensuse's KDE rocks. |
| 21:29.17 | runlevelten | It's lovely. |
| 21:29.18 | apokryphos | troy: huge step, but it's still obviously a second class citizen there. |
| 21:29.32 | troy | apokryphos: of course though, while the distro is quite good, some people stay away from novell for political reasons it seems |
| 21:29.47 | mhb | I wouldnt blame them. |
| 21:29.49 | apokryphos | troy: probably very bad/misguided Political reasons |
| 21:29.56 | runlevelten | mostly foetals and kids though. |
| 21:30.06 | troy | apokryphos: and there are other first-class KDE distros, they just don't have the user numbers of opensuse |
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| 21:30.33 | mhb | apokryphos: isnt opensuse also favouring GNOME a tiny bit? |
| 21:30.38 | apokryphos | mhb: I wouldn't stay away from Kubuntu because of Mark alone, even though he has done some pretty silly things in the past, but hey :) |
| 21:30.39 | benJIman | mhb: hahaha |
| 21:30.48 | benJIman | mhb: opensuse gnome barely even works |
| 21:30.51 | runlevelten | it's a community distro with roots that go back beyond debian's year dot. Let a slim minority of fotals associate it with the novell thing if they want. |
| 21:30.58 | runlevelten | Who cares. |
| 21:31.05 | apokryphos | troy: *popular distro |
| 21:31.07 | troy | look at distrowatch - their 'major distro' listing contains 10 linux distros (plus freebsd)... if you look at the screenshots, it's 7 KDE and 4 Gnome... unfortunately the gnome distro represents millions of users (ubuntu) |
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| 21:31.24 | apokryphos | mhb: no. openSUSE employ more KDE developers than any other distro |
| 21:31.29 | mhb | apokryphos: yeah, he did. I dont say it is a good reason to leave opensuse just because of novell. I understand it, though. |
| 21:31.32 | apokryphos | the userbase is something like 80% KDE, too |
| 21:31.47 | benJIman | 72% of survey respondants. |
| 21:31.54 | benJIman | 20% gnome |
| 21:31.59 | apokryphos | ah, right. |
| 21:32.12 | benJIman | Not quite as big a divide as the ubuntu kde/gnome |
| 21:32.20 | thiago_home | troy: fortunately, Mandriva is counting also many millions of users |
| 21:32.23 | troy | mhb: the reason opensuse gets a 'gnome flavour' is because they have certain people in high places are ex-Ximian types :) |
| 21:32.25 | runlevelten | The idea that a company can protect our community from patent litigation without having to cash in when times get hard... well that's just childish fallacy. |
| 21:32.26 | thiago_home | and all of those running KDE. |
| 21:32.38 | runlevelten | IBM will have to exploit theirs at some point too, I spect. |
| 21:32.59 | mhb | troy: heh, right :o) |
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| 21:33.03 | troy | thiago_home: I know - I talked to some of the mandriva execs to get some user numbers - I got some unofficial ones that I will use to help talk about KDE's total install base during the keynote :) |
| 21:33.05 | benJIman | thiago_home: I think mandriva are fairly split now too. |
| 21:33.24 | runlevelten | anyway, beddybyes for me. |
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| 21:33.40 | thiago_home | benJIman: no, not really. |
| 21:34.21 | benJIman | thiago_home: I've seen indication they have a higher percentage of gnome users than suse. |
| 21:34.47 | thiago_home | benJIman: which doesn't mean much to me |
| 21:34.52 | thiago_home | 5% is larger than 3% |
| 21:34.52 | apokryphos | I spoke to some Mandriva users a couple of months ago who said the GNOME-KDE percentage was nearing 50-50 |
| 21:35.04 | thiago_home | I don't know what % SUSE has. |
| 21:35.19 | apokryphos | which was quite different to, say, back in Mandrake 10.0 |
| 21:35.29 | benJIman | thiago_home: ~20% gnome as I said just now. |
| 21:35.34 | thiago_home | well, what I do know is that all of those cheap PCs sold in Brazil run KDE. 9 out of 10 I think. |
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| 21:39.16 | mhb | apokryphos: I think it couldnt be that hard to keep Kubuntu on an equal level to Ubuntu. All it would take is a decent graphic artist not overly busy with other projects and a paid developer whose task would be to code features for Kubuntu, instead of packaging, archiving and all the stuff our dear Riddell has to do |
| 21:39.45 | apokryphos | mhb: Kubuntu already has a pretty darn good artist: kwwii. It's not that at all. |
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| 21:40.20 | mhb | apokryphos: he is darn good, but he has no time for Kubuntu. |
| 21:40.44 | mhb | apokryphos: he is also taking care of all Ubuntu artwork, including lots of stuff for the Mobile platform, and dont forget Oxygen. |
| 21:40.47 | apokryphos | more developers could help, but what it really needs is all the marketing hype that Ubuntu gets |
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| 21:41.30 | apokryphos | I didn't realise he was doing Ubuntu artwork too :/ |
| 21:41.54 | troy | apokryphos: a man of many hats :) |
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| 21:42.05 | apokryphos | There's not that much wrong with the artwork except that it's not green ;) |
| 21:42.31 | apokryphos | I really dislike the dark boot-up screen, but as I recall they were quite fixed on that |
| 21:43.13 | apokryphos | troy: the only artist I wish KDE had was jimmac, tbh |
| 21:43.23 | apokryphos | that guy does some really beautiful stuff |
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| 21:45.44 | apokryphos | mmm https://forgesvn1.novell.com/svn/opensuse-art/trunk/yast-slideshow/pic/07_kde.png |
| 21:45.55 | troy | apokryphos: well, since all the oxygen stuff is SVG, changing colours using some XML parsing script might even be possible :) |
| 21:46.16 | apokryphos | troy: what's wrong with the colours? |
| 21:46.33 | troy | apokryphos: well, you can make it green that way :P |
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| 21:46.54 | pinotree | apokryphos: we have nuno pinheiro, david vignoni, kenneth wimer and riccardo iaconelli |
| 21:47.06 | apokryphos | all awesome artists :) |
| 21:47.26 | troy | pinotree: when riccardo isn't in rehab or something - that kid sure drank a lot at akademy :P |
| 21:47.40 | pinotree | lol |
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| 21:48.26 | Blissex | So there, I know how to set from a script via an escape sequence the title of a Konsole window. How to set the label of Konsole *tab* from a script inside the tab? |
| 21:48.33 | troy | he kept walking up to me when he was drunk wanting to give me a hug :P |
| 21:49.04 | troy | Blissex: in kde 3.5, I'm not sure if that's possible -- I think konsole in 4.x has that one solved |
| 21:49.09 | pinotree | troy: you know, new generations... ;) |
| 21:49.10 | thiago_home | Blissex: same thing with a different escape code. I don't remember which. |
| 21:49.39 | troy | thiago_home: oh, I didn't know 3.x could do that! :) |
| 21:49.42 | Blissex | thiago_home: troy: ah interesting. Where would the escape codes for Konsole be listed? Easier than source? :-) |
| 21:49.46 | thiago_home | Blissex: but dcop is better |
| 21:49.59 | thiago_home | Blissex: dcop $KONSOLE_DCOP_SESSION renameSession foo |
| 21:50.13 | Blissex | thiago_home: this is to set the tab name to a hostname for remotely logged in tabs... |
| 21:50.27 | thiago_home | ah |
| 21:50.31 | thiago_home | good point |
| 21:50.38 | thiago_home | I have no idea where the sequences are documented |
| 21:50.52 | troy | thiago_home: would an alias for ssh work, where it called the dcop command before passing control to ssh? |
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| 21:51.12 | Blissex | I got a simple 2 bit alias/script that I run in '.profile' to set the window title. Will set the tab instead if possible. |
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| 21:51.45 | troy | Blissex: if it's only two lines, paste it and let us see :) |
| 21:51.48 | Blissex | troy: I run 'hostname' on the target host, just to be sure... |
| 21:51.52 | thiago_home | troy: yes, but Blissex has a point: you can do it remotely if you use escape sequences |
| 21:52.05 | troy | thiago_home: okay, that would be better I guess |
| 21:52.35 | troy | in konsole 4, you can set tabs to automatically detect the hostname anyway - it's pretty slick - robertknight is a minor deity :) |
| 21:53.06 | Blissex | BTW, there used to be a window system that used *only* escape sequences, to draw windows etc. A pretty decent idea. It was even ported to GNU/Linux at some time, geek points to those who remember the name (hin: it was done at Bell Labs). |
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| 21:53.46 | litb | wasnt it the escape_wmanager ? |
| 21:55.05 | Blissex | litb: no, sorry, and it was not a window manager, but a full window system. |
| 21:55.13 | Blissex | that is, an alternative to X. |
| 21:55.47 | thiago_home | it could run under X |
| 21:55.57 | thiago_home | translate escape sequences to X11 primitives |
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| 21:56.49 | Blissex | my shell function to set a window title is at: http://pastebin.ca/696419 and it relies on two env variables ECHON and ECHOC to work around different shells using different methods to avoid printing the final newline. |
| 21:57.54 | Blissex | thiago_home: the one I have in mind probably could not run under X. But it was long ago... |
| 21:58.51 | thiago_home | Blissex: just like autoconf :-) |
| 21:59.01 | Blissex | heheheh. |
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| 22:01.27 | Blissex | http://citeseer.ist.psu.edu/context/686680/0 |
| 22:01.39 | Blissex | thats just about the only reference I could find online |
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| 22:03.59 | Blissex | ah no, there is still a Linux HOWTO for it: http://tldp.org/HOWTO/archived/MGR-HOWTO/MGR-HOWTO-2.html |
| 22:07.15 | sputnick | someone remerber my problem with my script with btdownloadcurses ? I have resolved it by set IFS=$'\n' :) |
| 22:07.21 | sputnick | *remember |
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| 22:17.52 | gkiagia | sputnick: I am curious, what is $IFS ?? |
| 22:18.57 | sputnick | gkiagia: IFS is a special variable from unix systems. by default, IFS is a space |
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| 22:20.42 | sputnick | gkiagia: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Internal_Field_Separator |
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| 22:21.22 | gkiagia | sputnick: thanks |
| 22:21.31 | gkiagia | I didn't know that |
| 22:21.35 | gkiagia | :) |
| 22:22.04 | sputnick | many scripts have problems when finding some space to parse. set IFS can resolve this problem |
| 22:22.41 | sputnick | ( in bash scripts ) |
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| 22:27.15 | litb | hmm, i just found setting IFS to / doesn't have any effect with bash3.2 |
| 22:28.42 | sputnick | litb: you can set many differents fields separators |
| 22:29.09 | litb | yes |
| 22:29.15 | litb | but stting it to / doesn't work here |
| 22:29.20 | litb | *setting |
| 22:29.23 | litb | sputnick: |
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| 22:35.22 | anthony | hi |
| 22:35.29 | anthony | how do I make my desktop roll |
| 22:35.33 | anthony | when i switch? |
| 22:35.39 | Blissex | as to my previous question on setting the tab label with an escape sequence, here is the description: http://meta.ath0.com/2006/05/24/unix-shell-games-with-kde |
| 22:35.55 | thiago_home | I don't think kwin has a roll effect for changing desktops |
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| 22:38.14 | level1 | hi, is there a way to get amarok to download podcasts rather than just buffer them? |
| 22:38.51 | level1 | amarok will sometimes lose the connection or something eles will happen and then I don't get to listen to the end of the podcast (or I have to start from the begining) |
| 22:39.10 | sputnick | this is my script with IFS setting : http://rafb.net/p/MixE2d52.html this is usefull to open a konsole from torrents downloads. Put this script in the PATH & set kde to open torrents files with this to work perfectly :) |
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| 23:18.49 | FrostByte | trying to turn on bluetooth, I disabled it like a dummy. can anyone help me? |
| 23:19.04 | judgen | is there an app for controlling different speaker settings |
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| 23:26.31 | level1 | hi, I can't seem to use google suggest anymore, theres just no popup |
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| 23:40.38 | judgen | what might i have done wrong if the switches tab in kmix dont show anything but two dropdowns. |
| 23:41.53 | level1 | judgen: well, you might find more help in #alsa |
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| 23:43.24 | dotCOMmie | anyone know of an CLI application that can parse out data from knotes |
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