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| 00:27.53 | lfh | rwp: the problem is that nothing at all can boot from a livemedia when the disk is plugged in (figuring out the disk was the problem was one of the issues). I was planning to wipe it and use something (debootstrap was suggested) to install from another computer, then plug it in, as others had previously recommended. |
| 00:28.28 | lfh | Anyone's allowed to see anything as a personal attack all they want, of course. Being offended over everything is very fashionable these days. |
| 00:28.50 | ShorTie | you just need to wipe it i'd guess |
| 00:33.38 | lfh | following rwp's suggestions I'll try doing SMART tests first, but that's the plan. Fingers crossed. |
| 00:33.43 | fsmithred | lfh, maybe the hd-media is what you need. Put these files on hard drive to install to hard drive: https://pkgmaster.devuan.org/devuan/dists/beowulf/main/installer-amd64/current/images/hd-media/ |
| 00:33.49 | fsmithred | yeah, test first |
| 00:34.06 | lfh | thanks |
| 00:34.15 | fsmithred | check debian docs for how to use hd-media. I don't recall the details. |
| 00:34.26 | lfh | will do |
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| 00:39.24 | neutral | can someone help me with the notification-daemon? |
| 00:57.45 | wizard1 | smart short test completed without any failure and the recorded data shows no logged errors as well. Time for full tests, then wipe and pray. Hopefully hd-media + debootstrap will do the thing. |
| 00:58.35 | fsmithred | I think the hd-media runs an installer |
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| 10:48.56 | VLetrmx | hi, is my best option for getting sound in firefox with ALSA rather than pulseaudio compiling ff with --enable-alsa? I'm asking in case there's some devuan specific thing already provided that I'm not aware of |
| 10:52.04 | VLetrmx | ah ignore me, I think you already compiled it with ALSA support, cool |
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| 13:43.23 | beagleburt | G'day from New Zealand folk! I am doing a fresh install of Beowulf 3.1.0 on a Lenovo B-40 Laptop which has a SSD 860 EVO SATA III 2.5 inch 250 GB MZ-76E250BW. I understand that I need to leave 10% of the SSD Unallocated, but I am wondering if it matters WHERE? End? Middle?..??? |
| 13:43.41 | buZz | beagleburt: you dont need to leave 10% of the ssd unallocated |
| 13:43.55 | buZz | beagleburt: tell whoever told you that to learn from newer sources ;) |
| 13:44.19 | buZz | ssd's already manage -all- that internally without a user needing to do anything |
| 13:44.52 | lts- | AFAIK it is still a good idea to leave some free space within the filesystem, but you can surely allocate all disk for the filesystem just fine |
| 13:45.23 | lts- | (Though I usually cut it a bit short, in case I want to RAID it later with a disk that may be slightly smaller) |
| 13:45.24 | buZz | a 250GB SSD will already be 300-350GB of flash |
| 13:45.38 | buZz | it will move around the '250GB FS' you made on it a lot , just to keep functional |
| 13:45.55 | buZz | if a 250GB SSD was actually 250GB , it would have dataloss within a month |
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| 13:46.52 | buZz | watch this talk ; https://hackaday.com/2013/12/29/hacking-sd-card-flash-memory-controllers/ |
| 13:46.57 | beagleburt | buZz, It is not a very new SSD...? |
| 13:46.59 | buZz | and never trust any flash storage ever again |
| 13:47.04 | buZz | beagleburt: yes, it is |
| 13:48.33 | beagleburt | buZz, Hmmm? I am sure that I've had it for quite a while ...1-2 years? |
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| 13:54.23 | buZz | beagleburt: the 'you must keep free space' on ssd's mantra applies to WAY older ssds |
| 13:54.45 | buZz | ever since ~2000 SSD firmwares handle all that themselves |
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| 14:02.12 | beagleburt | buZz, Oh? I did not realise that...thank you for updating me. :-) |
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| 17:34.17 | Akuli | after installing another linux distro for dual-boot, devuan boots about 30sec slower than before, it seems to be stuck at something before init starts |
| 17:35.01 | Akuli | replacing 'quiet' with 'text' in the linux line of grub, i get this: (sorry about picture of screen) https://i.imgur.com/FMzFejj.jpg |
| 17:38.58 | rwp | Hmm... That does look odd. I wonder why? |
| 17:39.53 | rwp | I see that /dev/sdb is removable storage. Same result without it plugged in? That's the only idea I have though. |
| 17:40.17 | Akuli | where do you see sdb? |
| 17:40.39 | rwp | Nine lines up from the bottom of your photo of the boot. |
| 17:40.54 | Akuli | hm |
| 17:41.32 | Akuli | i wonder what that is :D i don't have usb stick plugged in |
| 17:41.38 | Akuli | and sdb doesn't show up in lsblk |
| 17:41.40 | rwp | "If only I had time..." then I would like to pick apart the initramfs start scripts and understand them in detail. It would be useful. |
| 17:43.05 | rwp | For me there is always a pause at LVM start (waiting for lvmetad [lv meta d]) which is annoying. But happens with all Linux based distros. |
| 17:43.10 | Akuli | this might have something to do with the other distro using lvm |
| 17:43.21 | Akuli | afaik i didn't use lvm when installing devuan |
| 17:44.01 | rwp | Hmm... Regarding my comment... I always see it saying that it is waiting to contact the lvmetad. I don't see how the other distro using LVM would affect this one. |
| 17:45.49 | rwp | Is your photo the output with the "debug" kernel command line option? Did it write a log to /run/initramfs/initramfs.debug ?? |
| 17:46.24 | Akuli | the only thing i changed from whatever is default in devuan was replacing "quiet" with "text" in grub |
| 17:46.44 | Akuli | there are two files in /run/initrams.fs, fsck.log and fsck-root |
| 17:47.10 | Akuli | in /run/initramfs/, that is |
| 17:47.43 | rwp | Try adding "debug" to the kernel boot line and then booting and seeing if some clue shows up in the initramfs.debug file. https://wiki.debian.org/InitramfsDebug#Saving_debug_information |
| 17:48.25 | rwp | Also this reference suggests exactly what I would suggest: https://askubuntu.com/questions/469246/how-to-debug-initramfs-scripts |
| 17:48.54 | Akuli | do i add it to the same grub line as "text" or "quiet"? |
| 17:49.15 | Akuli | the line that says "linux ..." |
| 17:49.25 | rwp | Yes. In place of quiet would be good. You can do that as a one time on-the-fly thing by booting and editing the grub boot line. |
| 17:49.55 | rwp | If at the GRUB boot count down screen you hit a key the count down stops. |
| 17:50.31 | rwp | Then you can use the up and down arrows to position on the entry you want to use. Then 'e' to edit that entry. Change it as desired. |
| 17:50.34 | Akuli | right, i already did that for "text" parameter |
| 17:50.48 | rwp | Then I think it says at the bottom the funky to use to boot that entry. C-x??? I don't remember off the top of my head. |
| 17:50.54 | Akuli | yeah |
| 17:51.01 | Akuli | switching to different computer now |
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| 17:54.53 | rwp | To make permanent changes of course one can edit the /etc/default/grub file and then run update-grub to have it rebuild the /boot/grub/grub.cfg file for a persistent change. |
| 17:55.35 | rwp | I always get rid of "splash" because it annoys me that people turn these into black boxes. If something is failing at boot I want to know about it and fix it! |
| 17:56.01 | Akuli | content of initramfs.debug https://termbin.com/ao1n |
| 17:56.30 | Akuli | unfortunately no output between the repeating lines |
| 17:58.11 | rwp | And it is in there that the pause is happening? |
| 17:58.39 | Akuli | yes, it spends most of the time repeating those lines |
| 17:58.42 | rwp | In that case I would unpack the initramfs, review the scripts, insert debug, and work the problem that way. |
| 18:00.04 | Akuli | hm |
| 18:00.30 | Akuli | i deleted my swap partition while i installed the other distro |
| 18:00.41 | Akuli | i hadn't actually used it for a long time, i just commented it out in devuan fstab |
| 18:00.44 | rwp | However as I recall the right command to pack up an initramfs is "find . -print | cpio -R 0:0 -o -H newc | gzip > foo-initrd.gz" but my note says 2012 so that may have changed since then. |
| 18:00.54 | Akuli | :D |
| 18:01.12 | Akuli | my /etc/initramfs-tools/conf.d/resume contains the uuid of what used to be the swap partition |
| 18:01.17 | Akuli | and it no longer exists |
| 18:01.19 | rwp | Commenting out a swap partition in /etc/fstab should be okay as far as that goes. |
| 18:01.28 | rwp | Oh! |
| 18:01.37 | rwp | Yes. That could be it. |
| 18:01.49 | Akuli | i need to be afk for 30min or something like that, i'll continue when i'm back |
| 18:02.16 | rwp | TTYL! But I think your swap resume finding is very likely on the trail! |
| 18:02.35 | rwp | I had completely forgotten about that reference to swap for suspend and resume operation. |
| 18:03.22 | rwp | But for various reasons I think it is important and useful to have at least some amount of non-swapfile swap configured. |
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| 18:33.36 | Akuli | i disabled swap because oom handling becomes much better |
| 18:34.03 | Akuli | instead of freezing the world, the memory allocation will fail and the program that tried to allocate a huge amount of memory will crash |
| 18:38.23 | rwp | But, but, but... That's not actually how Linux memory overcommit works. |
| 18:39.11 | Akuli | :) |
| 18:39.38 | Akuli | it works in practice, at least in python programs |
| 18:39.50 | Akuli | the most common cause for my system freezing used to be me writing a stupid python program |
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| 18:40.34 | rwp | Well... I have no time to debate it in #devuan-offtopic at the moment but maybe later. :-) |
| 18:40.50 | Akuli | :) |
| 18:41.58 | Akuli | now it boots faster :D i set RESUME=none in /etc/initramfs-tools/conf.d/resume and then ran update-initramfs -u |
| 18:41.59 | Akuli | thanks! |
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| 20:02.11 | unixbsd | I managed to cure ubuntu, from systemd, and I made a devuan live also. here an example: "https://gitlab.com/openbsd98324/linux-ubuntu-groovy-standard/-/archive/master/linux-ubuntu-groovy-standard-master.zip" |
| 20:02.27 | unixbsd | I noticed that ubuntu with systemd, actually the systemd is such a pain |
| 20:02.40 | unixbsd | systemd makes sure that you can never get wifi working. |
| 20:03.10 | unixbsd | I was happy to use devuan, but still devuan s**cks for wifi/wireless like all the linux areas. |
| 20:03.26 | unixbsd | BSD rocks with wifi and networking x1000 times better than Linux. |
| 20:03.55 | unixbsd | Systemd and Linux managed to contribute to make Linux even worst - could it be possible? yep, they managed. |
| 20:06.10 | unixbsd | devuan managed with rose and all networking to have 3 to 10 times a single wpa connection, man, devuan is a real danger for routers. |
| 20:10.28 | unixbsd | cd /join #ubuntu |
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| 20:45.00 | sadsnork | Is it golinux_ that manages the dev1galaxy forums? If it is of any concern, the time on the host running the forums seems to be about 7 minutes fast. Just sayin'. :-) |
| 20:46.56 | golinux | sadsnork: rrq handles the mysteries of the forum's backend. |
| 20:48.01 | sadsnork | Awesome, thanks for highlighting him/her for me golinux! |
| 20:48.21 | golinux | He's just waking up about now . . . |
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| 23:26.37 | mason | sadsnork: I just corrected time on the forum server. Thank you for noting it. |
| 23:27.26 | sadsnork | Thanks mason! :-) |
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| 23:59.30 | Wafficus | hey there is Devuan capable of installing Flatpaks? |
| 23:59.35 | Wafficus | didn't know if this was systemd dependent |
| 23:59.57 | Wafficus | I see it present in 'apt' on Devuan, but wanted to confirm if this was ok to install |
